NC Republican Senator Tom Tillis Tackles Germ Theory

February 3, 2015 5:40 PM

Never mind vaccinations, let's make washing your hands a matter of personal choice. Free markets will decide after we institute new regulations.
posted by Short Attention Sp (33 comments total)

I think everyone has noticed this already, but he wants to remove the regulation requiring food service personnel to wash their hands and replace it with a regulation requiring food service location to post signs regarding whether their employees are required to wash their hands.

Total change in number of gubmint regulations: 0
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:45 PM on February 3, 2015 [13 favorites]

Look at the money you will save in signs!
posted by clavdivs at 5:46 PM on February 3, 2015 [1 favorite]

They're just fucking with us now, right??
posted by briank at 5:51 PM on February 3, 2015 [8 favorites]

Why on earth would you want to give workers in your state the impression that you don't need to wash your hands to serve food? Must be a shill for big Food Poisoning.
posted by oceanjesse at 5:51 PM on February 3, 2015 [2 favorites]

So he's proposing people who are granted religious exemptions to vaccination schedules be forced to carry around a big sign labeling themselves a public health risk? I'm OK with this.
posted by sbutler at 5:52 PM on February 3, 2015 [6 favorites]

Well fuck- we've given up on vaccines! Might as well just say that disease is caused by bad smells emanating from the ground, and go around wearing big pointy masks full of rosemary and lavender!
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 5:54 PM on February 3, 2015 [5 favorites]

So he's proposing people who are granted religious exemptions to vaccination schedules be forced to carry around a big sign labeling themselves a public health risk? I'm OK with this.


Maybe a cowl and a bell, too.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 5:56 PM on February 3, 2015

That's right. I forgot about ADA requirements. Need some way to alert the blind.
posted by sbutler at 5:58 PM on February 3, 2015 [3 favorites]

he want to remove the regulation requiring food service personnel to wash their hands and replace it with a regulation requiring food service location to post signs regarding whether their employees are required to wash their hands.

I'm going to make an educated guess: the endgame here is state-level effective immunity for business owners against lawsuits brought by people harmed or injured on the premises. Gotta protect the business owners against those frivolous lawsuits.
posted by clockzero at 5:58 PM on February 3, 2015 [4 favorites]

So a restaurateur can decide their own hand-washing policy, but they have to put a sign up saying what the policy is? The only way that could possibly work at all is if the government did random inspections to make sure the employees are in compliance with their employer's policy.

If the free market thing DID work the way he imagined it, it would mean restaurants could save money by cutting corners on food safety, allowing them to serve cheaper, if less safe food, which is then attractive for people who don't have money and can't afford health care. Great!
posted by aubilenon at 5:58 PM on February 3, 2015 [2 favorites]

When I first saw the headlines I thought it was just a shitty offhand example* of how the market is ostensibly better than the regulatory state, and that it wasn't like a real thing he believed. A thought experiment, I guess.

Goddamnit it.

*Pun most certainly intended.
posted by Lemurrhea at 6:03 PM on February 3, 2015 [1 favorite]

What the fucking fuck is wrong with these fucking idiots?

(really, that *is* my reasoned response. You shoulda seen before I edited...)
posted by notsnot at 6:05 PM on February 3, 2015 [9 favorites]

of how the market is ostensibly better than the regulatory state, and that it wasn't like a real thing he believed. A thought experiment, I guess.

No, the Republican platform now is officially "all private business should be allowed to opt out of any laws, court rulings or regulations that they don't agree with"

Because Market Jesus Galt proclaimed it in the Book of Rand.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:05 PM on February 3, 2015 [2 favorites]

I like my freedom as relatively germ free as possible. In fact; liberty is the germ of dirty legislation.
posted by clavdivs at 6:06 PM on February 3, 2015

He needs proof of his bold leadership style for his speech at the Million Moron March this spring in DC.
posted by chance at 6:07 PM on February 3, 2015

He was making a point, rather ham-handedly, that few humans would go to a cafe or bistro or food eating place that posted a sign saying "WE TOUCH SHIT AND DO NOT WASH" but public health is important so people should just wash. Dilute! Dilute! OK!!
posted by vrakatar at 6:09 PM on February 3, 2015

With half of all jobs expected to disappear due to automation in the next 20 years, the GOP is developing a coherent strategy for population control without birth control. Totally pro-disease.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:10 PM on February 3, 2015 [3 favorites]

Total change in number of gubmint regulations: 0

I love that underlying his theory is an inherent admission that even for the free market to work, you need government regulation. He's just replacing a requirement for employees to wash their hands with a requirement that the business post a sign (and pay for advertisements?!) informing the public of their hand-washing policy.

What's more, he doesn't seem to realize that he's made this admission.
posted by mr_roboto at 6:10 PM on February 3, 2015 [6 favorites]

rather ham-handedly

Well, he could get that ham off his hands with a little soap and water.
posted by Joey Michaels at 6:11 PM on February 3, 2015 [9 favorites]

So by extension, it's fine for a guy to beat with a baseball bat anyone who comes within 20 feet of him on the sidewalk as long as he wears a big sign around his neck saying "anyone who comes within 20 feet shall be beaten." After all, disclosure cures all hazards and people can make the free market choice whether to approach.
posted by zachlipton at 6:12 PM on February 3, 2015 [2 favorites]

... when do we start flinging these people into their gulch?
posted by mordax at 6:12 PM on February 3, 2015 [2 favorites]

This is the "stop maintaining the aqueducts" phase of this civilization, isn't it.
posted by figurant at 6:12 PM on February 3, 2015 [22 favorites]

What is his stance on GMO labeling?
posted by asra at 6:12 PM on February 3, 2015 [1 favorite]

He was making a point, rather ham-handedly, that few humans would go to a cafe or bistro or food eating place that posted a sign saying "WE TOUCH SHIT AND DO NOT WASH" but public health is important so people should just wash

He was also making the point that the government has no business in regulating health or public safety, and indeed does not even have a right or a proper place is doing so.

Which is consistent with the Republican party platform.

Government's ONLY legitimate role is to kill brown people in the desert, or lock them up at home. Every other function of the modern state is illegitimate and must be rooted out, because the market will solve it all.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:13 PM on February 3, 2015 [3 favorites]

"Anybody reading this sign gives their now-informed consent to be placed on the free market guillotine."

Place as needed.
posted by solarion at 6:13 PM on February 3, 2015

This really is a not-that-well-thought-out rhetorical move that he made and not a specific policy suggestion.

Also note that Tillis came out pro-vaccination.
posted by wemayfreeze at 6:14 PM on February 3, 2015 [1 favorite]

wemayfreeze: This really is a not-that-well-thought-out rhetorical move that he made and not a specific policy suggestion.

A political gaffe is when a politician accidentally says what they really believe.
posted by tonycpsu at 6:17 PM on February 3, 2015 [1 favorite]

Perhaps Senator Tillis would like to give the Senate cafeteria this option…?
posted by adamrice at 6:17 PM on February 3, 2015 [1 favorite]

Give him a break. He thought that up on the spot without ALEC.
posted by srboisvert at 6:17 PM on February 3, 2015 [1 favorite]

This really is a not-that-well-thought-out rhetorical move that he made and not a specific policy suggestion.

Good thing he's not in a position to influence policy then!

oh wait
posted by RonButNotStupid at 6:17 PM on February 3, 2015 [1 favorite]

Also:

Updated at 5:30 p.m.: An Associated Press reporter caught up with Tillis on Capitol Hill, and the senator did not back down from his belief that businesses should “get to make that decision versus government.”

Dude had plenty of time to think about how stupid it was, but he doubled down.
posted by tonycpsu at 6:18 PM on February 3, 2015 [12 favorites]

And more seriously, the issue of disclosure vs regulation has been studied and disclosure doesn't always work so well, especially when a powerful, sophisticated party is doing the disclosing and normal people are the disclosees.

Take, for instance, the St John's Arbitration Study. Some people think that arbitration agreements in consumer contracts should be more tightly restricted. In this study, consumers were given typical credit card contracts with arbitration clauses in bold and ALL CAPS and asked questions about what rights they had signed away. The results:

The survey results suggest a profound lack of understanding about the existence and effect of arbitration agreements among consumers. While 43% of the respondents recognized that the sample contract included an arbitration clause, 61% of those believed that consumers would, nevertheless, have a right to have a court decide a dispute too large for a small claims court. Less than 9% realized both that the contract had an arbitration clause and that it would prevent consumers from proceeding in court. With respect to the class waiver, four times as many respondents thought the contract did not block them from participating in a class action as realized that it did, even though the class action waiver was printed twice in bold in the sample contract, including one time in italics and ALLCAPS. Overall, of the more than 5,000 answers we recorded to questions offering right and wrong answers, only a quarter were correct.

Turning to respondents’ own lives, the survey asked if they had ever entered into contracts with arbitration clauses. Of the 303 respondents who claimed never to have done so and who also answered a question asking whether they had accounts with certain companies that include arbitration clauses in their contracts, 264, or 87%, did indeed have at least one account subject to an arbitration clause.

In the incredibly basic example of food service workers washing their hands after using the restroom, market pressure would probably do the right thing in most cases if the signs were clear and visible. But in the actual real world, consumers often don't understand the disclosure or are powerless to do anything about it.

Anyway, we all know how the bathroom handwashing system would really work. There would be no giant "we don't wash our hands" signs on the doors. Rather, restaurants would be required to prepare a "food service hygiene operations manual," which would be available for public inspection during business hours on 48 hours notice, notice being given to the manager who's never around. Buried in the 450 page manual would be a hand hygiene report, and line item 6b would describe handwashing policies after using the restroom. Nobody would actually check whether those policies were followed, but you're welcome to try to sue for deceptive trade practices (good luck proving damages).
posted by zachlipton at 6:24 PM on February 3, 2015 [4 favorites]

I think it's also a good example of how regulation can sometimes be more efficient than the free market.

His argument is that every business would require that their employees wash their hands so we'd end up at the same place (complete with inspectors!). So why don't we just skip all the free market nonsense and just require employees to wash their hands.
posted by VTX at 6:25 PM on February 3, 2015 [1 favorite]