Summon all the courage you require, then count. (Day 1, 2, 3, FOUR) RNC
July 21, 2016 5:31 AM Subscribe

The morning after Trump's running mate, Mike Pence's big night, the headlines read, "Ted Cruz Dashes Hopes for Unity by Snubbing Donald Trump." Welcome to Day Four.

What to expect on Day 4 of the RNC

By grace of the mods there will be a new RNC thread each day for discussion and live-blogging.

posted by roomthreeseventeen (3670 comments total) 47 users marked this as a favorite

"Cruz upended the night’s narrative, changed his own political trajectory, and made himself an even more formidable candidate for upcoming elections. This feeling I am experiencing? It may be respect."
posted by box at 5:33 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I'm just imagining that Walker, after seeing Cruz's speech was like "We could do that?"
posted by drezdn at 5:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [76 favorites]

Ted Cruz is a despicable Debate Club Asshole, but damn if it isn't fun watching him turn that on people who deserve it.

All his life he's practiced disappointing so badly that people give him death threats, and last night he delivered a virtuoso performance. Now let's burn every debate team to the ground so Ted Cruz can never respawn, while the mobs are on our side.
posted by rorgy at 5:37 AM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

The Atlantic - It's Official: Hilary Clinton Is Running Against Vladimir Putin
posted by dry white toast at 5:37 AM on July 21, 2016 [34 favorites]

It's been astounding. I imagine they'd be outraged to no end about America.
posted by juiceCake at 5:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I was wondering, if it came to a Gore/Bush 2000 scenario, would Ruth Bader Ginsburg have to recuse herself for showing prior bias?

The darkest timeline.
posted by adept256 at 5:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

showbiz_liz, what are you talking about? I've seen relief that there hasn't been convention violence, and then horror/terror that the convention has become an extended call for Clinton's head amidst a pageantry of fear.
posted by schadenfrau at 5:41 AM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

Much applause for the most excellent (and fully fleshed out) title.
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:42 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

@showbiz_liz: For my part (although I haven't posted anything here about it) I am genuinely concerned that the hate-filled, violence-inciting rhetoric during the RNC is going to motivate someone to commit violence at the DNC, with their ultimate aim being killing Clinton.
posted by papercake at 5:42 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

I'm thinking given Trump's comments on NATO that people should follow him around in chicken costumes and waving The Red Flag.
posted by Francis at 5:42 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Yeaaaahhh I still can't respect Ted Cruz. He's still loathsome.

Also, from the last thread, A+ Monster of Venice cite, codacorolla. That book, aside from being a cracking true crime story, gave me a lot of insight into the conspiracy theory mindset.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:43 AM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

You know that thing yesterday where I said that Jafar would be better as an "advisor" running the country than Pence would?

I'm slightly unsettled by the idea that we could end up with a different 90s cartoon villain instead.

The notion of a president who doesn't want to be president seemed funny at first, and it's getting scarier by the minute.
posted by Sequence at 5:43 AM on July 21, 2016

The Atlantic - It's Official: Hilary Clinton Is Running Against Vladimir Putin

Wow. I'm not sure I've seen a Republican nominee for the presidency be convincingly red-baited before.
posted by Sonny Jim at 5:43 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

corb appreciation.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 5:44 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

@showbiz_liz: For my part (although I haven't posted anything here about it) I am genuinely concerned that the hate-filled, violence-inciting rhetoric during the RNC is going to motivate someone to commit violence at the DNC, with their ultimate aim being killing Clinton

This is basically the sentiment I shared in the last thread right before this one was created. I am hoping that years of taking care of Obama as well as Hillary (as First Lady, Senator, Secretary of State (my God how is Trump even a thing)) should have the security around this event be well prepared and on high alert.
posted by like_neon at 5:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

You guys who didn't stay up to watch really missed something. Christie cut off Cruz's hand with a sword, then Trump electrocuted Cruz, but with the flashes of lightning reflected in Christie's cold, dead eyes, suddenly a flicker of humanity reappeared and he picked Trump up and threw him down the reactor shaft.
posted by XMLicious at 5:46 AM on July 21, 2016 [143 favorites]

There's lots of good reading about the real Donald Trump on the New Yorker website right now. Here's Tony Schwartz's full mea culpa about having accidentally created Trump by ghost-writing The Art of The Deal for him. Here's news of Trump's characteristically thin-skinned legal action against Schwartz for speaking out against him. And here's Mark Singer's appalled NYer profile of Trump from 1997 (which the Guardian has just reviewed in its form as a newly-published book).
posted by Paul Slade at 5:46 AM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Conveniently for the RNC, this year's Gathering of the Juggalos is also being held in Ohio and runs from today through the weekend
posted by Flashman at 5:49 AM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

I listened to BBC Overnight on KUOW FM this morning just before Morning Edition on NPR came on. Trump on what if Russia invades the Baltics was a lead headline on the BBC. On NPR: nothing so far. I just can't even...
posted by y2karl at 5:50 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Wow. I'm not sure I've seen a Republican nominee for the presidency be convincingly red-baited before.

Putin is about as communist as Ted Cruz is.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

I'm worried there will be violence in Philly because parking in the middle of the street is going to be temporarily disallowed.
posted by Drinky Die at 5:54 AM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

The notion of a president who doesn't want to be president seemed funny at first, and it's getting scarier by the minute.

I feel like I'm being sucked into defending Trump totally against my will, but the idea that the president actually manages the executive bureaucracy while being a sort of philosopher-warrior-priest with sage knowledge about the world is just wrong. there's no decision that the US president could make that couldn't be better made by someone who actually knows something about it. what's more, that's what actually will happen.

what people are afraid of, with Trump, is that he will actually start making decisions on his own. Bush's invasion of Iraq didn't happen because he was the president. it happened, in part, because Cheney subverted the national security apparatus that our political elite relies on to make these sorts of decisions, and partly because the logic of our posture wrt Iraq and the middle east led to war one way or another. which is why no one was prosecuted, because the decision came out of the system, not one incompetent president who could barely manage a baseball team, much less the federal government.

point being that Trump's notion of president as "chairman of the board" or some such, really isn't wrong...
posted by ennui.bz at 5:55 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Those of us who rode the Bernie train to get here learned very quickly that NPR lack even the semblance of conviction, are not reliably impartial, give the wrongs kinds of attention in the most dangerously arbitrary of ways, and doggedly assert no truth, whatsoever. They are the unchecked white privilege of news.
posted by an animate objects at 5:56 AM on July 21, 2016 [61 favorites]

I just finally watched (as opposed to just listening to the audio) the final moments of Cruz's speech and Trump walking in. Never before in my life have I more wanted Thunderdome to be a thing. Put these two in a room full of pointy objects and lock the fucking door. They deserve each other.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:56 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

My respect for Cruz doubled after last night. But zero times two is still zero.
posted by entropicamericana at 5:57 AM on July 21, 2016 [252 favorites]

You can't deny Trump will have trolled his own supporters if he wins the presidency and then delegates everything to a career religious nut politician like Pence.
posted by Tarumba at 5:57 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Ok this makes me feel somewhat better re: security at the DNC

The convention is designated as a National Special Security Event, which means that ultimate authority over law enforcement goes to the Secret Service and Department of Homeland Security
posted by like_neon at 5:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Some of the comments in these threads about how 'omg there's gonna be widespread convention violence' have begun to seem like quasi-masturbatory wishful thinking in the guise of hand-wringing concern, and I wish people would cut it out.

Not just the comments from users, but from the media. Was watching NPR's coverage last night and the one commentator actually seemed dissappointed that there were only a handful of arrests made during the day. But then quickly followed it up with a: "And we hope it continues peacefully." to save some face after she realized how terribly offensive her tone was.
posted by Fizz at 5:59 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

~~NPR~~ American media coverage of international news is a disgrace.
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:01 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Cruz essentially said to the entire RNC, "I think Trump will lose to Hillary Clinton."

By not endorsing Trump, Cruz is toast if Trump actually wins. He'll be exiled to what ever the GOP version of Siberia is. On the other hand, if Trump does lose the election, Cruz comes back and says, I told you so. You need to pick a "real conservative" like me. Obviously that strategy could backfire, since telling people they made a stupid decision isn't going to win him many friends, but that's not the sort of thing that seems to bother him anyway.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 6:02 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Pregnant Women Asked To Leave Convention Hall During Ted Cruz Speech For Safety Of Developing Fetuses
posted by indubitable at 6:02 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

The Atlantic - It's Official: Hilary Clinton Is Running Against Vladimir Putin

I was making jokes about this many thread-hours ago, but I'm starting to wonder if Putin and Trump haven't made a secret pact. There may be an october surprise that tanks HRC, courtesy of the FSB. I mean this is just the teenage listener of Coast to Coast AM in me talking, and I've allegedly grown up into a rational human being, but I remember the Iran-Contra deal. Trump is slipperier than Nixon and Reagan combined.
posted by dis_integration at 6:04 AM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

I thought the party line was "Cruz speech is NBD"?
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:04 AM on July 21, 2016

Ok this makes me feel somewhat better re: security at the DNC

Keep in my that's the same Secret Service that kept letting people get way to close to Obama.
posted by drezdn at 6:04 AM on July 21, 2016

When is that June fundraising report due?
When are they going to hound trump's tax returns out of him?

Show me the money!
posted by Dashy at 6:05 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Oh my god, you guys...I was an hour away from home, waiting for my daughter's play practice to be over (SOOOOO LOOOOOONG) and my stupid phone died and I couldn't get any WiFi for my iPad and I had NO IDEA what was going on.

Just caught up with Corb's updates in the previous thread and I am slightly more than cautiously optimistic at this point. I never, ever thought I would say this non-sarcastically, but: Thanks, Ted Cruz!
posted by cooker girl at 6:06 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I (UK) decided to give NPR a spin over the past couple of weeks due to my interest in the US election. I must say that it comes across very weird. Getting most of my US news via Mefi and 538 I guess I may have a liberal/reality bias but it has been really striking how their attempts at even handedness means they are unable to be forthright in addressing issues .

Is this due to-
Fear of funding cuts if not seen as impartial to the point of blindness?
The presenters actually do think they are being even-handed?
US centre of political gravity being so far to the right of me that they are fair and balanced in their own, and in the public's mind?
The fact that the podcasts deal with rapidly emerging stories so by the time I get to hear their podcast the details they did not have at hand have informed my view so they seem so very cautious?
posted by Gratishades at 6:07 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

My favorite part about the Cruz thing is how Trump tweeted after the fact claiming how he saw the speech in advance, and it's no big deal.

Sure, Donald. Sure.
posted by tocts at 6:07 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Cruz is speaking at a breakfast for the Texas delegation right now (where he got a standing ovation upon entering) and confirmed that the Trump campaign saw his speech in advance and said "I would have gone home if they wanted me to."
posted by dry white toast at 6:10 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Here's the link to Trump's tweet about Cruz's speech, in case any of you haven't seen it yet.
posted by rorgy at 6:11 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

Damn, was hoping for a rickroll.
posted by Drinky Die at 6:13 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

But, surely, someone must have checked Cruz speech? Like, umm, Mr Cruz sir? just wanna make sure you're going to endorse Mr trump like you promised and no shenanigans this time? Mr Cruz, please stop giggling and look at me: No. Shenanigans. Ok?! Mr Cruz, I can see that you are crossing your fingers, sir!
posted by Foci for Analysis at 6:13 AM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

'omg there's gonna be widespread convention violence' have begun to seem like quasi-masturbatory wishful thinking in the guise of hand-wringing concern

Originally I was afraid violence might spill in from outside the convention, with some demagogue progressing from "Trump is the next Hitler!" to "It's time to tear apart the Republican Party! We need rocks and knives and guns!"

I'm still sure there are demagogues that extreme out there, but they must be as nonplussed as the rest of us. "It's time to tear apart the Republican Party! Or sit back and watch, I guess! We need popcorn!"
posted by roystgnr at 6:14 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Gratishades, mostly the second and third.

NPR gets very little funding from the government actually, it's about half individual contributions and half corporate sponsorships I believe.

I think their niche is probably closer to The Guardian than the BBC although not openly partisan But the demographic of their listeners is pretty much middle-class white urban center-left types.
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:14 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

What else is Trump going to say? "No! Nobody vote your conscience! That would be a disaster for me!"
posted by roystgnr at 6:14 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

"I think it was awful," Christie said. "And quite frankly, I think it was something selfish. And he signed a pledge. And it's his job to keep his word."

Trump, Trump über alles, über alles in der Welt.
posted by zarq at 6:15 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

But, surely, someone must have checked Cruz speech?

This is the campaign that invited the wrong person to speak at their own convention.
posted by PenDevil at 6:15 AM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Will the Cruz Non-Endorsement Really Change Any Votes in November?

But will it matter? The overwhelming majority of Republicans already say they're going to vote Trump -- he and Hillary Clinton have consolidated their party bases to approximately the same extent. Yes, there are GOP holdouts -- but is there anyone who would have voted Trump and now plans not to, emboldened by the Cruz speech? Does anyone actually like Ted Cruz that much?

I know he won a lot of votes in the primaries -- but he doesn't command personal loyalty the way Trump does. He just embodies a set of ideas many Republicans hold dear, after hearing them articulated every day for years on Fox and talk radio and religious-right broadcasts. It's not about him. How many divisions does Ted Cruz have? Who sees him as a leader?

If anything, we're hearing that Hillary Clinton thinks she can peel off some moderate Republicans. How many right-centrist Republican women in the Philadelphia suburbs are going to rally to the words of culture warrior Ted Cruz?

[...]

Meanwhile, what does this do to Ted Cruz? It's obvious that he thinks Trump will lose this year. It's obvious that he's positioning himself for 2020. But does this really help him win the next nomination? In the following exchange, I think Josh Barro has a point:
@LizMair .@jbarro Oh, that helps Cruz. Makes it extra certain he can run again-- and win, bc he was the guy who knew Trump was a dead duck-- in 2020

@jbarro @LizMair if trump loses by 12, this might work. if he loses by 4, Cruz will be pilloried for not "helping him over the top."

And I think, after all this bumbling, Trump will lose by 2, because there's so much anti-Hillary animosity out there, and because the GOP has, if anything, strengthened its Team White People brand in the Obama years, winning lots of non-presidential victories in the Midwest the way it's won them in the South in recent decades. If it's a narrow loss for Trump, Republicans are going to look for scapegoats -- they'll blame the media and "voter fraud" and probably George Soros and Saul Alinsky -- but they'll also blame Cruz. So I don't see how this helps him. I think the next GOP nominee will be either Tom Cotton or Donald Trump Jr.

posted by tonycpsu at 6:15 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I wanted to know what happened with this whole thing: Tsereteli and Trump had discussed erecting on the Hudson River a statue of Christopher Columbus that was six feet taller than the Statue of Liberty (from the 1997 New Yorker article), so I did some research and found out it got turned down by six cities and ended up getting chucked onto poor Puerto Rico. Story also from artnet.
posted by lauranesson at 6:15 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

The Strange Politics of Peter Thiel, Trump’s Most Unlikely Supporter
posted by Artw at 6:16 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"I think it was awful," Christie said. "And quite frankly, I think it was something selfish. And he signed a pledge. And it's his job to keep his word."

Christie proceeded to invoke Article 5 of the Trump Pledge.
posted by AndrewInDC at 6:16 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Originally I was afraid violence might spill in from outside the convention, with some demagogue progressing from "Trump is the next Hitler!" to "It's time to tear apart the Republican Party! We need rocks and knives and guns!"

Given the insanely creepy quasi-nazi-rally / witchhunt thing going on inside the convention, and the history of the people inside the convention with respects to views on guns and the use of violence as acceptable government policy, what exactly made you conclude that it was people outside the convention that would be a risk?
posted by tocts at 6:17 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

But, surely, someone must have checked Cruz speech?

Apparently every single word (other than his ad lib about the enthusiasm of the New York delegation) was reviewed and approved in advance.
posted by zarq at 6:18 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Thank you, MeFi, for watching this so I don't have to.
posted by the painkiller at 6:18 AM on July 21, 2016 [28 favorites]

Anyone who has ever thought that Ted Cruz does anything but act on his own behalf permanently loses the right to look surprised.

If Cruz walked by a burning orphanage, his first actions would be to get the orphans to sign loyalty oaths and iron out the payment plans for his bill.
posted by delfin at 6:18 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

By not endorsing Trump, Cruz is toast if Trump actually wins. He'll be exiled to what ever the GOP version of Siberia is. On the other hand, if Trump does lose the election, Cruz comes back and says, I told you so. You need to pick a "real conservative" like me.

Cruz may think about it that way but, what he's done, on national TV, is show, once again, that he will always put his own interests ahead of the party. Who could ever support him other than his own followers?
posted by ennui.bz at 6:19 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Donald Trump taking the time to read things when he could just wave them off doesn't seem very plausible TBH.
posted by Artw at 6:19 AM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

Cruz crafted a speech that on paper looked like it was in support of Trump but read out loud became a clear denunciation. Say what you will about the man, that is a serious rhetorical feat.
posted by EarBucket at 6:22 AM on July 21, 2016 [131 favorites]

Cruz may think about it that way but, what he's done, on national TV, is show, once again, that he will always put his own interests ahead of the party. Who could ever support him other than his own followers?

Assuming they align with his repugnant political positions, quite a few Republicans who think Donald Trump is a thin-skinned, lying racist blowhard who will singlehandedly destroy both the GOP and American supremacy. Probably.

People will respect Cruz for standing up for what he believes in, and for not cowing to a man who insulted him, his wife and made nasty insinuations about his family.
posted by zarq at 6:23 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Go read Daniel Dale's Twitter stream from the Texas delegation breakfast. Cruz is not just focusing on Trump (though he says he didn't actually say anything bad about him), he's going after the entire GOP message of attacking Clinton on her emails. Says the party should be talking about "freedom", whatever that means.

I don't think I've ever experienced so much schadenfreude.
posted by dry white toast at 6:24 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Cruz crafted a speech that on paper looked like it was in support of Trump but read out loud became a clear denunciation. Say what you will about the man, that is a serious rhetorical feat.

It was kind of amazing to watch it unfold. He kept pausing at key moments where it would have been natural for him to segue into a Trump endorsement. Until the last few minutes, I kept waiting for him to do it and wondering if he would.
posted by zarq at 6:25 AM on July 21, 2016 [25 favorites]

I either read it in the other thread or in an article but I believe the way it breaks down is:

- Trump reads Cruz's speech, sees that there is no full endorsement
- Decides to let Cruz talk anyway in case he pulls out an endorsement at the last minute
- Sees that there is no endorsement coming and whips up the crowd to boo Cruz in order to embarrass Cruz
- Is so narcissistic and inexperienced as a politician, does not realise this makes Trump and the Republican party look stupid, not Cruz
posted by like_neon at 6:25 AM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

If Cruz walked by a burning orphanage, his first actions would be to get the orphans to sign loyalty oaths and iron out the payment plans for his bill.

And yet, we love the Nevertrumps SO MUCH.
posted by malocchio at 6:25 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

This is the campaign that invited the wrong person to speak at their own convention.

Imagine if they'd accidentally invited both of the Brian's Cox! Now that would have been something.
posted by GenjiandProust at 6:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

RNC: Time to party like it's 1939.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 6:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Cruz may think about it that way but, what he's done, on national TV, is show, once again, that he will always put his own interests ahead of the party. Who could ever support him other than his own followers?

Yeah, Ted Cruz doesn't deserve respect be...huh. I had a specific reason in mind, but actually anything I might write after this would be irrelevant, wouldn't it? Okay, never mind
posted by Naberius at 6:26 AM on July 21, 2016

Ted Cruz: My pledge to support the nominee wasn't a blanket commitment to support someone who calls my wife ugly.

This is amazing.
posted by dry white toast at 6:28 AM on July 21, 2016 [34 favorites]

For the record, Republican elected officials did play an integral part in the passage of the Civil Rights Bill. That does not make them pro-racial equality now. But let's not re-write history

Cruz:

"We passed the Civil Rights Act, and fought to eliminate Jim Crow laws."

The "we" there was the rhetorical bullshit, since the GOP purged the liberals that were & are for civil rights, and has taken in the Dem conservatives that were against.
posted by Heywood Mogroot III at 6:28 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Daniel Dale ‏@ddale8
Ted Cruz: My pledge to support the nominee wasn't a blanket commitment to support someone who calls my wife ugly.

omg
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:28 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Actually, reading that twitter stream that dry white toast linked to is making me respect Cruz. His own delegates are shouting at him and he's standing firm.
posted by papercake at 6:29 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Ted Cruz kept smirking as if he was the smartest asshole in the room. Mind you, he always does that, but this time he was, so I guess yesterday was what Ted Cruz tells himself every day of his life is like?

It's really disappointing that he's a politician. He'd make for the perfect villain in The Princess Bride 2. Especially if they let him cowrite the script and attempt to trickster himself into winning. I'd watch that movie three times in theaters.
posted by rorgy at 6:29 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

www.tedcruz.com. That is all.
posted by scalefree at 6:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

Was there a sale on white hats in Texas? Why do they all have the same one?
posted by lauranesson at 6:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Ted Cruz is a despicable Debate Club Asshole, but damn if it isn't fun watching him turn that on people who deserve it.

It's also kinda fun speculating about whether Hitler had syphilis. That doesn't make the prospect of catching it any more appealing.
posted by howfar at 6:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

That's Photoshop. There population of Texas is actually just Ted Cruz.
posted by beerperson at 6:31 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

From the Daniel Dale Twitter stream:

Ted Cruz with not a memo but a mission statement: "This is not just a team sport...this is about principles and ideals."
posted by cooker girl at 6:31 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

26 minutes between standing ovation to castigation. Extraordinary.
posted by like_neon at 6:32 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Dale's whole stream right now is incredible.

Woman: I love you. I know Trump dissed your wife horribly. But this is not about you, it's about the United States!

A U-S-A chant erupts.

I feel like I'm having a fever dream.
posted by dry white toast at 6:32 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Is it possible that Cruz is simply taking the opportunity to give Trump some payback, rather than making some sort of bold political gamble? Occam's Razor and all...
posted by haiku warrior at 6:32 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

OMG I can't stop refreshing this stream.
Cruz: "Can anyone imagine our nominee standing in front of voters and answering questions like this?
posted by like_neon at 6:33 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I am loving Ted Cruz right now, and that makes me crazy. I think history is going look upon him favorably for this, no matter who gets elected.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 6:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

I say again: this is the perfect use case for Thunderdome. Let's do this, America.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I was wondering, if it came to a Gore/Bush 2000 scenario, would Ruth Bader Ginsburg have to recuse herself for showing prior bias?

1. Hillary is going to win, so no worries on that front. I'm betting it'll be declared by midnight on election night.

2. RBG would not have have recuse herself. Literally no one can force her to do anything, not by any known mechanism. Finally, it's up to each individual judge whether to recuse themselves and I can't see RBG doing that a Gore/Bush situation (which won't happen)
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

NPR = Nice Polite Republicans. If you're accustomed to BBC Radio 4 news coverage -- which has its own flaws, but in different areas -- the refusal of NPR to call a spade a shovel will never cease to irritate.
posted by holgate at 6:36 AM on July 21, 2016 [25 favorites]

The delegate breakfast is fascinating- so many angry, confused people and that twitter steam is amazing.

Ted Cruz's conclusion: I'm going to continue to tell the truth. Crowd responds with mix of cheers and death stares.

posted by Torosaurus at 6:36 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

When even my remarkably chill and together yoga teacher friend (who teaches "punk rock yoga" here in Cleveland, it's pretty spectacular) is worried about violence downtown today, I get a little worried. My magazine editor friend (@erin__obrien) has been reporting live from the scene and things definitely got way intense last night.
posted by bitter-girl.com at 6:37 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"In that speech last night I did not say one negative word about Donald Trump."

July 21, 2016

This is some comical shade.
posted by winna at 6:37 AM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

I'm searching the last thread and wondering if there was a way established to indeed buy corb a drink, and/or a charity to donate to on their behalf? :)
posted by Theta States at 6:38 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I wondered during Cruz's speech if the crowds were going to chant "Lock him up! Lock him up!" I had one hand ready to adjust my Despot Clock from 5-til-Midnight to 11:59 and the other holding the keys to my underground fallout shelter.

Tonight I'll be checking if Trump comes in sans eyebrows to the roar of the house band playing Pink Floyd's In the Flesh.
posted by about_time at 6:39 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

Someplace (maybe the Drudge Report) used the headline "Ted Wedding."
posted by drezdn at 6:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

Live footage of Cruz just now.

That pledge was not a blank commitment that, if you go and slander and attack Heidi, I am nonetheless gonna come like a servile puppy dog and say, "Thank you very much for maligning my wife and maligning my father."

posted by rorgy at 6:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [76 favorites]

Given the insanely creepy quasi-nazi-rally / witchhunt thing going on inside the convention

Laurie Penny: "The violence is where it always is at events like these: inside the hall. It’s on the stage. It’s inside all of us, including those who came here to bear witness, by dint of complicity."
posted by holgate at 6:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Yeah, somebody should really tell these guys that that album was supposed to be a metaphor.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 6:41 AM on July 21, 2016

I can 100% percent believe that Trump's crew read the speech ahead of time and that letting Cruz read it so they can whip the crowd into a frenzy to teach him a lesson was the entire plan, Trump's whipped crowds into violence before and the fascist bully play is the first one I'd expect from him. Fortunately they couldn't muster up a total brownshirt reaction and mainly just provoked boos, which seems impotent in the face of what Cruz did.
posted by jason_steakums at 6:41 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Josh Marshall: Making Sense of the Conflagration

One can debate whether it is wise or sensible for the United States to guarantee the independence of small states on the periphery of Russia which had for centuries been either within the Russian domain or inside its sphere of influence. But we have. In his comments to the Times, Trump treated the matter like a real estate goon shaking down a distressed landlord to make an easy buck.

Trump's mix of cocky ambiguity and predation could scarcely be better primed to trigger the kind of great power confrontation that could push the world from smoldering to fire. It is no exaggeration to say that were it not for the relative confidence that Trump will be defeated in November that interview alone could trigger a genuine international crisis.

Indeed, it still may.

Trump brings together aggression and narcissism with a kind of militant ignorance which can be harmless or even amusing in the make believe world of reality TV or New York real estate but becomes positively dangerous on a national and global stage, thrashing about like a hose spewing fire. As Will Saletan memorably put it, the GOP is a failed state and Trump is its warlord. On his own Trump is simply a bracing case study in abnormal psychology. But he didn't shoot to within reach of the most powerful office in the world by happenstance. He is the product of a political and cultural breakdown on the American right, a swaggering reductio ad absurdum of every breach and breakdown and violation of extra-statutory norms we've seen over the last two or three decades.

posted by zombieflanders at 6:41 AM on July 21, 2016 [51 favorites]

This convention would make Malcolm Tucker reach for cyanide capsules.
posted by dry white toast at 6:41 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Hell, I'll go downtown later and take corb a bottle of our finest if it's feasible. Or set up a credit at Happy Hour Collection, a delightful little booze accessories store adjacent to the convention security zone. No one should have to endure this sober, it's inhumane.
posted by bitter-girl.com at 6:42 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

I am loving Ted Cruz right now, and that makes me crazy. I think history is going look upon him favorably for this, no matter who gets elected.

Which is funny, because really his brand of uncompromising politics is a major part of what caused the party to be so dysfunctional Trump could win the primary in the first place. Trump is the result of a disease people like Cruz gave this party.
posted by Drinky Die at 6:42 AM on July 21, 2016 [44 favorites]

Theta States, I've just texted her to get her thoughts.
posted by cooker girl at 6:43 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Tonight I'll be checking if Trump comes in sans eyebrows to the roar of the house band playing Pink Floyd's In the Flesh.

Is it too late to pass the hat and get G. E. Smith to play this? Yes? No?
posted by the painkiller at 6:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Did anyone catch this interview with Falwell Jr on NPR this morning?

He actually said: "I've never seen any arrogance from Donald Trump".

He actually said that.

And Steve Inskeep didn't slap him in his face and ask him if he knew this was real life.
posted by dis_integration at 6:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [35 favorites]

Following @DDALE8 on twitter for coverage of Cruz this morning and hoooooly shit!
posted by Theta States at 6:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Also, Cruz's line about "not being a servile puppy dog" was probably a shot at Christie.
posted by dry white toast at 6:46 AM on July 21, 2016 [55 favorites]

I (UK) decided to give NPR a spin over the past couple of weeks due to my interest in the US election. I must say that it comes across very weird. Getting most of my US news via Mefi and 538 I guess I may have a liberal/reality bias but it has been really striking how their attempts at even handedness means they are unable to be forthright in addressing issues .

NPR has gotten a lot worse about the pseudo-balanced approach in the last few years. I have wondered it it was a response to some particularly intense criticisms of liberal bias, or an outcome of that huge donation they received a while back, but it is noticeable and offputting.

The funniest moment for me was the big headline in the NY Times yesterday calling it a "low energy" convention. The whole thing is such a shitshow that I am glad a few journalists are having some fun.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:46 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I am loving Ted Cruz right now, and that makes me crazy. I think history is going look upon him favorably for this, no matter who gets elected.

But he just humiliated every Republican pol who sucked it up to endorse Trump for the sake of the party. Remember that Trump is the nominee, in no small part, because losing with Trump was better than anything with Cruz.

Cruz will never be the Republican nominee for president.
posted by ennui.bz at 6:47 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

The Circular Firing Squad: Not just for Democrats any more!
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:47 AM on July 21, 2016 [99 favorites]

Cruz talked principle, principle, principle. And then, pushed and pushed by the Texans, he admitted this is personal.
posted by dry white toast at 6:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I find Ted Cruz completely loathsome like so many others.

But he's a very solid debater. If he wasn't completely devoid of charisma I'd be more afraid of him than virtually any other Republicans but I strongly suspect that the Republican masses will turn on him.

What would be awesome is if he were to suddenly try to go 3rd party and completely fuck over the Donald.
posted by vuron at 6:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Last night Gingrich subtly threatened to criminalize dissent. They want to imprison their political opponent. They want deport people who don't pass purity tests. The Republicans are saying these things because they are confident they can get away with it. They are winning. Meanwhile, the news media is engaging is an embarrassing exercise in wishful thinking. Talking about how the convention is in chaos, focusing on pointless and petty criticisms of speeches by Melania Trump, obsession over a meaningless diss byTed Cruz. They are totally missing the boat - as usual.
posted by spudsilo at 6:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [31 favorites]

Cruz will never be the Republican nominee for president.

I can see it now.... 2316, hit musical on Broadway about some patriot history forgot whose generally unpopularity and personal failings kept him from the presidency. DUN DUNADUNDUN DUN DUN DUN.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 6:50 AM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Cruz will never be the Republican nominee for president.

It's been said a million times before, but Trump got to the top by humiliating everyone in the GOP, and now they're all "yes master, your wish is my command, your grace". Cruz is already despised by his peers. But if he comes out of this in 2020 as the one-who-could've-won, they'll line up behind him just like they did behind Trump. Because they love power more than their own dignity.
posted by dis_integration at 6:50 AM on July 21, 2016 [46 favorites]

Amazing to see footage from the Cruz breakfast. It's hard to look away from this whole train wreck.
posted by knapah at 6:53 AM on July 21, 2016

I hereby award Ted Cruz the inaugural Kim Kardashian prize, given to the person who best understands that revenge is a dish best served cold, in a manner that both punishes those who hurt your family and benefits your professional endeavors. I'm in awe.
posted by sallybrown at 6:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [98 favorites]

I was wondering, if it came to a Gore/Bush 2000 scenario, would Ruth Bader Ginsburg have to recuse herself for showing prior bias?
If it ever comes to anything near that again, tell me you will join me rioting in the streets. One of the great miscarriages of justice. Think of that when you vote for President, Senator, Representative to Congress.
posted by theora55 at 6:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Remember how Republicans said Obama was unfit to lead because of his arrogance and elitism?
posted by mccarty.tim at 6:54 AM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

A politician actually SAYING "servile puppy dog" instead of it just being a line from an Onion story makes me think we really have switched to a new reality altogether
posted by yhbc at 6:54 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

I was wondering, if it came to a Gore/Bush 2000 scenario, would Ruth Bader Ginsburg have to recuse herself for showing prior bias?

Judicial recusal is totally optional for Supremes. She can do what she wants. If they don't like it the congress can impeach her.
posted by dis_integration at 6:55 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

This is the best Coen brothers movie in years
posted by beerperson at 6:55 AM on July 21, 2016 [50 favorites]

But he just humiliated every Republican pol who sucked it up to endorse Trump for the sake of the party. Remember that Trump is the nominee, in no small part, because losing with Trump was better than anything with Cruz.

If the stampede to Trump demonstrates anything, it's that there is no limit to politicians' willingness to whore themselves when faced with the prospect of being on the wrong side of power.
posted by dry white toast at 6:56 AM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

The Republicans are saying these things because they are confident they can get away with it. They are winning.

Confidence and desperation can look very similar if you're unaccustomed to seeing what genuine confidence looks like. Foaming at the mouth isn't confidence, no matter how assertive it might seem.
posted by rorgy at 6:56 AM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

Cruz attacking Trump for badmouthing his wife is some weirdly romantic Even Evil Has Loved Ones shit. In the eventual film adaptation made of this campaign, whichever actor plays Cruz in all his sympathetic sliminess is going to sweep the Oscar for Best Supporting Actor.
posted by nicebookrack at 6:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Conveniently for the RNC, this year's Gathering of the Juggalos is also being held in Ohio and runs from today through the weekend

RIP Ass Dan.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 6:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

"Years from today we will still wrestle with the meaning of Cruz for once leveraging the awesome power of his assholery in a righteous cause."
posted by exogenous at 6:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

Cruz: "what does it say when you stand up & say vote your conscience ... & supporters of our nominee begin screaming...

Once again, Ted Cruz is a loathsome human being, but people could learn something about giving absolutely no fucks from the man.
posted by dry white toast at 7:00 AM on July 21, 2016 [65 favorites]

whichever actor plays Cruz

Haley Joel Osment
posted by beerperson at 7:01 AM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

NPR is a disgrace.

I agree, but they did air one hilarious bit of reporting this morning (about the 1:40 mark) -- a delegate complained about Obama breaking promises, and Steve Inskeep basically said, "Name one?" and she couldn't.

(Her friend chimed in with "stop the war," as if the RNC didn't spend all Monday complaining about how feckless Obama is on defense.)
posted by Gelatin at 7:01 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

leveraging the awesome power of his assholery in a righteous cause."

If Ted Cruz is still wondering what should be written on his tombstone, look no further.
posted by Fizz at 7:02 AM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

"what does it say when you stand up & say vote your conscience ... & supporters of our nominee begin screaming..."

"I was just asking questions why are you sensitive"

Love it Ted. A+ trolling. Who's the channer now Donny?
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:03 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Potomac Avenue: I'll only say this once: Anyone who thinks this convention, or any recent news, is actually a sign that Trump or the GOP is strong and will win the presidency or seats in the Senate in November please Memail me to arrange a wager at very reasonable odds on their success. Minimum $100. Thank you.

Didn't you say this literally six months ago? I'm positive this isn't the first time you've tried to fleece suckers on here over Trump.
posted by rorgy at 7:04 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I love informative talking in my ears while I'm driving so I am kind of stuck with NPR for my drivetime, but I will say that the NPR ONE app is awesome for all other times (running, working around the house, etc) because I can skip all the news and go straight to the investigative stories and the podcasts.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:04 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I'll only say this once: Anyone who thinks this convention, or any recent news, is actually a sign that Trump or the GOP is strong and will win the presidency or seats in the Senate in November please Memail me to arrange a wager at very reasonable odds on their success. Minimum $100. Thank you.

And I'll only say this once. If you live in the US, it would be smart to take this offer up the way I considered betting on Brexit when the odds were good. If Trump loses then he lost so you win, and if he won you always have some money to make up for it.
posted by Francis at 7:05 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

What would be awesome is if he were to suddenly try to go 3rd party and completely fuck over the Donald.

Though which party would have him? I can't imagine the Libertarians doing so, given that his religious authoritarian streak being visible from outer space. The Greens and Socialists are right out for obvious reasons. Is the Reform Party still a viable organisation?
posted by acb at 7:05 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

a delegate complained about Obama breaking promises, and Steve Inskeep basically said, "Name one?" and she couldn't

He's been doing this all week, and it's been hilarious:

"Muslims are making us unsafe!" Have you ever had a bad encounter with a Muslim? "Oh, no, never!"

"Immigrants are taking our jobs!" Do you know anyone that lost their job to an immigrant? "Nope!"

Absolutely no shred of self reflection in any of the people he's interviewed.
posted by backseatpilot at 7:06 AM on July 21, 2016 [87 favorites]

it would be smart to take this offer

Thanks I'll send you a cut.

(Stop getting the floor wet rory.)
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:07 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Anybody who said Trump couldn't win the nomination was ignoring the polls. Anybody who says Trump is totally gonna win the general is also ignoring the polls. Which is not to say he CAN'T win, but it is absolutely not an equivalent situation.
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:10 AM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

Daniel Dale has seen a lot in his lifetime. Before he became the Washington correspondent for the Toronto Star, he was the Toronto city hall correspondent, which meant he spent several years covering Rob Ford.

Not just covering Ford; getting physically attacked by Ford while researching a piece of Conservation Authority land behind Ford's house that he was trying to buy, and then being accused of taking pictures of Ford's kids.

I don't think anyone was more prepared to cover Trump than Dale.
posted by dry white toast at 7:11 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

It's Official: Hillary Clinton is Running Against Vladimir Putin

"This is a lukewarm opinion that dozens of hacks have already published, but maybe this one could be good ... 'by Jeffrey Goldberg.' Ah. Never mind."
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 7:12 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Did anyone catch this interview with Falwell Jr on NPR this morning?

He actually said: "I've never seen any arrogance from Donald Trump".

He actually said that.

He also said that we're all sinners but he supports Trump because he's seen the way he treats people, and I was like uhhhhh you mean you like the way he uses vulgarity and insults to belittle everyone around him? Mkay.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:12 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Cruz attacking Trump for badmouthing his wife is some weirdly romantic Even Evil Has Loved Ones stuff.

or he realized he fucked up and is trying to hide behind his wife, passing it off as wounded masculinity.

as I said previously, this is professional wrestling.
posted by ennui.bz at 7:14 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Is it too late to pass the hat and get G. E. Smith to play [In the Flesh, at Trump main speech entrance tonight]? Yes? No?

You know, he did play on The Wall Live tour a couple of years ago...
posted by thelonius at 7:17 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I think it's interesting because Ryan and Cruz are playing opposite strategies to be in the running for 2020 and it'll be interesting to see which one pans out.
posted by zutalors! at 7:19 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

I'm not cheering for Cruz, but I am thoroughly enjoying my popcorn.
posted by like_neon at 7:21 AM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

Steve Inskeep basically said, "Name one?" and she couldn't.

(Her friend chimed in with "stop the war," as if the RNC didn't spend all Monday complaining about how feckless Obama is on defense.)

but it, uh, happens to be true. and he just upped the deployment in Afghanistan.

Steve Inskeep is a loathsome smarmy NPR toadie.
posted by ennui.bz at 7:21 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Cheering for Cruz now would be like, I don't know, giving Sauron a pat on the back for disobeying Melkor.

I think most people are cheering for the worst outcome for Trump, not cheering for Cruz. If an alien invasion happened in the middle of the Quicken Loans Arena and the aliens took Trump with them, I would be happy, but that doesn't mean I support alien invasions.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:23 AM on July 21, 2016 [45 favorites]

Well, it did take Wormtongue to finish Saruman

I'm ashamed of how easily Tolkien analogies are coming to me these days
posted by Countess Elena at 7:24 AM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

Nate Silver: Donald Trump’s Convention Is Flirting With Disaster

So from a Conventions 101 standpoint, what happened in Cleveland on Wednesday night was a potential disaster for Trump and the Republicans. Cruz, the second-place finisher in the primaries, conspicuously refused to endorse Trump, and left the stage to a chorus of boos. An unusually large number of Republicans have also declined to endorse Trump, including Ohio Gov. John Kasich, who isn’t appearing at the convention even though his state is hosting it. But those defections might be forgotten about for a few days, provided that the party put on its best face in Cleveland. Cruz’s refusal to endorse Trump, however, which he seemed to draw out for emphasis to embarrass Trump, took place at center stage. It was bad from both a uniting-the-party standpoint and from a showcasing-the-ticket standpoint. It was among the most dramatic events that we’ve seen at a convention in recent years.

posted by Gelatin at 7:25 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Countess Elena, that's nothing to be ashamed of.
posted by The Gaffer at 7:25 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Cheering for Cruz now would be like, I don't know, giving Sauron a pat on the back for disobeying Melkor.

Or like congratulating Nafridius for his treatment of the Slorroths of Vandis IV, amirite?
posted by beerperson at 7:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

But who is Tom Bombadil?
posted by beau jackson at 7:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Ted Cruz is not a hero. He embarrassed a terrible person for wholly self-serving reasons.

Cheering for Cruz now would be like, I don't know, giving Sauron a pat on the back for disobeying Melkor.

"Ted Cruz ~~Anonymous~~ is like the T-rex at the end of Jurassic Park: it's not heroic, and I wouldn't want it to ever notice me, but I cheered when it took down those fucking velociraptors."
posted by leotrotsky at 7:27 AM on July 21, 2016 [81 favorites]

First Lady Michelle Obama Carpool Karaoke, if you need some time off from the Republicans.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:29 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Have they checked under the hall for barrels of glowing green stuff?
posted by Artw at 7:29 AM on July 21, 2016 [27 favorites]

Meanwhile, the news media is engaging is an embarrassing exercise in wishful thinking. Talking about how the convention is in chaos, focusing on pointless and petty criticisms of speeches by Melania Trump, obsession over a meaningless diss byTed Cruz. They are totally missing the boat - as usual.

I dunno, this is a message I'm pretty OK with. Tell the average American that a stadium is full of people cheering for poorly-coded fascism and they'll either disbelieve or figure out a different interpretation, because none of them know what fascism looks like outside of the context of mid-20th-century history and there aren't actual swastikas on the stage decorations. Show them that the guy who claims to be capable of running the country is having difficulty orchestrating a four-day pageant without major gaffes, and that's a message than might sink in. People understand spectacle better than they get political theory, and this spectacle is pretty confidence-eroding. A plagiarized speech by a loyalist, and a speech let through vetting which is openly seditious? That's incompetence, and there are plenty of people who find that less acceptable than intolerance. I kindof wish the "wrong Chris Cox" story got picked up a bit more, because it'd fit well into the same narrative.

I mean, to me, that's the real way Cruz slipped a knife in Trump's back. Not by letting people uncomfortable with Trump vote against him; they were probably going to do that anyways. No, the real triumph is that the Trump camp neither prevented his speech nor responded effectually to it.
posted by jackbishop at 7:29 AM on July 21, 2016 [30 favorites]

But who is Tom Bombadil?

Diamond Joe Biden, obviously.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

Laura Ingraham has a Freudian slip then tries to disguise it as an awkward princess wave.
posted by Tarumba at 7:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

HABERMAN: What do you think people will take away from this convention? What are you hoping?

TRUMP: From the convention? The fact that I’m very well liked.

Yes, but is he very well liked in Hartford?

("I'm very well liked in Hartford. You know, the trouble is, Linda, people don't seem to take to me.")
posted by octobersurprise at 7:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Did anyone catch this interview with Falwell Jr on NPR this morning?

He actually said: "I've never seen any arrogance from Donald Trump".

He actually said that.

I came in in the middle of that interview, and thought Inskeep had just cornered some rando at the convention and was making a fool of him. I was actually feeling sorry for the poor, deluded sap. But then I found out it was Jerry Falwell Jr., and was relieved—just a GOP flack who was staying on-message.
posted by BrashTech at 7:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I know that many here enjoy watching Cruzerino getting a knock on Cheetoguy but I have also seen the words "respect" and "Cruz" together (not just here, mind) wayyyy too frequently.
posted by Tevin at 7:32 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Some thoughts from Craig Mazin on Cruz's performance:

-Ted Cruz, the scorpion to everyone's frog since 1970.

-What Ted Cruz imagined: show up at convention, talk directly to America, be brilliant, set up 2020 run.
What happened: he was Ted Cruz.

-Please don't give Ted Cruz "credit for standing up to Trump." When it was convenient, he LOVED Trump. Ted sticks up for one man. Ted Cruz.

-My favorite part of Ted Cruz's speech was when he plastered on his calculated grimace and waved in faux triumph to a booing crowd.

-Ted was willing to face a hostile environment in the hope that he could lie to the millions watching at home.

-I know Ted Cruz thinks that after Trump loses, he will become the presumptive standard bearer for the GOP. He won't. Ever. He's loathed.

posted by palindromic at 7:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Laura Ingraham has a Freudian slip then tries to disguise it as an awkward princess wave.

"Mein Führer! I-I-I m-mean Mr. President."
posted by leotrotsky at 7:35 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

I don't agree with the idea that Cruz is shooting himself in the foot here by undermining his own party. Either Trump is going to lose (the more likely scenario), or he is going to be a very, very bad president. Given these facts, the only thing that I find surprising is just how few people have done what Cruz seems to be doing, because in 2019, whether Clinton or Trump is president, he can step in and say "hey, know how Trump was/is a flaming disaster? I'm the opposite of him, vote for me!" Seems like the obvious thing to do.
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:36 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

I agree, he has nothing to lose. Trump already won the nomination and warmed up to the republican establishment and Cruz could use solidifying his image as anti-establishment.
posted by Tarumba at 7:38 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Laura Ingraham has a Freudian slip then tries to disguise it as an awkward princess wave.

This, more than anything, deserves to be the definitive image from the GOP convention.
posted by tommasz at 7:38 AM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

A few comments deleted. Maybe let's lay off the derail about which LotT character Cruz is, and the metaderail about whether that's a stupid derail or whatever, and if you don't like these threads or you don't like Mefites, just go ahead and skip it.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 7:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

So I heard snippets of Morning Joe* this morning and am now listening to the NPR politics podcast. Can confirm that both the right- and left-leaning sides of the establishment media are talking about Cruz and that this is a train wreck of a convention.

Also MEREDITH got a shout out on the podcast so that was good.

As mentioned upthread there is a danger that the false equivalency brigade will be doing their thing with any minor snafu at the DNC next week but I think the narrative of republican trashfire vs democratic competence is solidifying.

* I know I know. My husband likes it.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:42 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Transcript: Donald Trump on NATO, Turkey’s Coup Attempt and the World
posted by kirkaracha at 7:42 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

“He (Richard III) was my crowned King, and if the Parliamentary authority of England set the crown upon a stock, I will fight for that stock: And as I fought then for him, I will fight for you, when you are established by the said authority.” Thomas Howard, 2nd Duke of Norfolk explaining before the future Henry VII his reasons for siding with Richard III at Bosworth, August 22, 1485. Quoted in William Camden Remains Concerning Britain (1605).

So I guess Cruz is no Duke of Norfolk. But Thomas Howard never had a choice between a piece of vegetation and Donald Trump.
posted by TrishaU at 7:43 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The little clip of an interview with Cruz I just heard on NPR just now has him claiming that he literally told Trump he wasn't going to endorse on stage days ago. O_O
posted by R343L at 7:43 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Cruz Campaign Manager: Christie “Turned Over His Political Testicles Long Ago”
posted by Drinky Die at 7:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Cruz Campaign Manager: Christie “Turned Over His Political Testicles Long Ago”

gross.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:46 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

I don't think it'll really hurt Cruz, unless Trump somehow were to become the new Reagan. If Trump loses, or becomes president and does a terrible job, Cruz will be able to say he spoke out against him. Sort of like voting against the Iraq War is a feather in some Dem's caps.
posted by drezdn at 7:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I thought you're supposed to turn them over now and then.
posted by ian1977 at 7:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

he literally told Trump he wasn't going to endorse on stage days ago

And yet he was still allowed to speak. Utter idiocy and incompetence on the part of Team Trump.

brb buying Orville Redenbacher stocks
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:49 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

BREAKING NEWS: Antibiotic Resistant Bacteria names Radiation Poisoning as running mate.
posted by y2karl at 7:52 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Cruz Campaign Manager: Christie “Turned Over His Political Testicles Long Ago”

gross.

But not wrong. Christie vitiated any pretense of principles with his Trump endorsement. His unhinged speech about incarcerating Hillary reinforced that. The words coming out of his mouth have basically no meaning now.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:52 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Corb is very, very appreciative of the offer of an alcohol/burger/pizza/whatever fund, but she respectfully declines. If any MeFites want to buy her a round at the next meetup, though, she's all for it!

Personally, speaking only for myself here, I would love it if all you guys who said you would donate to a corb fund would take the money you were going to put there and put it to the Clinton campaign. Or volunteer some time to the Clinton campaign. I donated last night in corb's name (in my head, you can't actually give in someone's name as far as I know) because not only am I a die-hard Hillary supporter, corb has promised to volunteer her time to the campaign because of what she experienced at the convention. I think giving money and/or time to the Clinton campaign is very much in the spirit of honoring corb's contributions and tribulations.
posted by cooker girl at 7:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [134 favorites]

corb Meetup tour 2017.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [55 favorites]

Is trying to kiss the homophobe VP some kind of weird power play?
posted by Artw at 7:54 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Liberals a week ago: Hey Ted ... Zodiac Killer much?

Liberals today: Finally, a man of principle stands up to the orange dumpster fire,
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 7:55 AM on July 21, 2016 [25 favorites]

Cruz Campaign Manager: Christie “Turned Over His Political Testicles Long Ago”

gross.

But not wrong. Christie vitiated any pretense of principles with his Trump endorsement. His unhinged speech about incarcerating Hillary reinforced that. The words coming out of his mouth have basically no meaning now.

Then say something like "Christie Turned Over his Political Principles Long Ago." No 'cuckservative' emasculation-panic dogwhistling required!
posted by Existential Dread at 7:56 AM on July 21, 2016 [43 favorites]

As mentioned upthread there is a danger that the false equivalency brigade will be doing their thing with any minor snafu at the DNC next week but I think the narrative of republican trashfire vs democratic competence is solidifying.

It's honestly hard to imagine anything which will be serious grist for the scandal mill at the DNC. There'll probably be a minor BoB insurgency, from among the sort who have decided that Bernie's endorsement is a piece of 10-dimensional FDR-emulating moon-law chess, but it seems like Bernie's rank-and file have actually come around what with their chosen candidate actually endorsing. The Clinton campaign can probaby rustle up actual stars to speak instead of the C- and D-list celebrities who have infested the RNC lineup. Clinton has a fiercely competent campaign team, so I find it hard to imagine the kind of logistical fuck-ups (bad timing on events, the plagiarism thing, counter-programming themselves) that the RNC has had either.

Which is not to say that the mainstream media won't try, but I have high hopes for the DNC. I just hope they stay on a good message. "We're better than this" is a theme they've tried out, and I like it a lot: it's both positive and a direct counter to the Republican messages.
posted by jackbishop at 7:56 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Is trying to kiss the homophobe VP some kind of weird power play?

This is Trump. Everything is a weird power play.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 7:57 AM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

Liberals today: Finally, a man of principle stands up to the orange dumpster fire

Kindly point out where any liberal is calling Cruz "a man of principle." When a bad person does a good thing for bad reasons, a good thing has still been done.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

"OK fine, Cruz, I will grudgingly grant 10 points to Slytherin."
posted by merriment at 7:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [41 favorites]

I worry that the media will make a big deal about the speech of alleged shoe design thief Ivanka Trump, without talking about her history of shady business dealings and flammable scarves made in China.

I really don't get why the vulgar talking yam's oldest three children have gotten such a pass, when they are intimately involved in his fascist campaign. Seems like they are all as crooked as disgusting old dad.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 7:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

So for all I know, maybe Cruz has a shot at 2020, maybe Ryan, maybe it'll be a literal piglet with the American flag tattooed on its side, I obviously have no idea what sells with this crowd.

The Republican party is now all about dominance politics. Cruz is now the only viable candidate in the race this cycle to not back down to Trump when challenged. Everyone else bent the knee.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Liberals today: Finally, a man of principle stands up to the orange dumpster fire,

Ted Cruz has always been a man of strong convictions. Insane, authoritarian, fanatical, evil convictions, but strong nevertheless. While Trump is the champion of the dogwhistling opportunists who see the GOP as the biggest, easiest grifting target in the world, Cruz is the champion of the people who really truly deeply believe in the dogwhistles, and hate Trump for co-opting their beliefs for profit and personal aggrandizement. It makes total sense that he'd be the one to openly tell Trump to fuck right off.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 7:59 AM on July 21, 2016 [25 favorites]

Oh my god Pence is doing the same move as my cats when i try to kiss em on the cheek

You can love your pet....
posted by zarq at 7:59 AM on July 21, 2016

I know I'm not supposed to call Trump supporters dumb, but I have literally never heard an interview with one of them that didn't make them sound gullible and crazy. I'm not sure what other conclusion I'm supposed to draw here.

It's a difficult emotion to deal with. I don't think of my dad as dumb, but he's 100% bought into the Fox News narrative that Obama has weakened our nation. I've literally heard him say "Obama has brought this country to its knees."

I can't even discuss politics with him because he just repeats Fox News talking points or quotes Teddy Roosevelt SPEAK SOFTLY CARRY BIG STICK HURR DURR.

My dad was in the Army National Guard and spent time in the first Gulf War in Kuwait. There's a lot of macho posturing and belief in a strong military and NRA magazines swirling around in his mind.

All of this has gone so far beyond reasonable that I can't even.
posted by Fleebnork at 8:00 AM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

Kindly point out where any liberal is calling Cruz "a man of principle." When a bad person does a good thing for bad reasons, a good thing has still been done.

The man is a monstrous, ambitious theocrat who wants a special secret police division for Dearborn, Michigan. He's no better than Trump and will get no compliments from me.
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 8:00 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Hey Greg and corb, is that podcast still on the table, cause I'd donate money to THAT for sure
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:01 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Is there any way for the podcast to have puppets
posted by beerperson at 8:02 AM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

He's no better than Trump and will get no compliments from me.

Nobody's asking anyone to complement him, but I don't see the need for wildly inaccurate summaries of what unnamed "liberals" are saying about him.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:04 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

While you can interpret Cruz's comments about Trump dissing his wife as hiding behind Heidi, it also gives him an out for the disloyalty charge -- he can claim a higher loyalty, that is to his family. Whether it's true or not, he can certainly sell it that way.

I dunno, call me a reactionary but I'm willing to believe that Ted Cruz loves his wife and father. And I'll admit it, I enjoyed his performance at that shirtsleeves press conference afterwards. It was like watching that one dude from the game store who always wears a waistcoat LARP a homebrew House of Cards system. Doesn't mean I want to elect that guy and his pocketwatch mayor.
posted by No-sword at 8:05 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Is trying to kiss the homophobe VP some kind of weird power play?

Trump looks like a John K. cartoon character making kissy faces.
posted by backseatpilot at 8:05 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Kindly point out where any liberal is calling Cruz "a man of principle." When a bad person does a good thing for bad reasons, a good thing has still been done.

The guy is a monstrous, ambitious theocrat who wants a special secret police division for Dearborn, Michigan.

someone can be a man of principle even if every single one of their principles is abhorrent to you
posted by murphy slaw at 8:06 AM on July 21, 2016 [43 favorites]

Me too. My monthly donations to Hillary have been up and running for ages and I've got my merch and I'm keeping my ear to the ground for something I can do for the local campaign office that doesn't require me to be anything approaching an extrovert, so I'm already well covered on the "directing my energies toward her campaign" front. But I'd still like to throw some cash at that podcast.

In other news, catching up on overnight Twitter and Metafilter on my morning commute has been a wild ride these past few days thanks to the RNC dumpster fire. Thanks for keeping the bus ride lively, y'all.
posted by Stacey at 8:06 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Why Men Want to Marry Melanias and Raise Ivankas (NYT)

Men have often given their female offspring more opportunities than their female partners, perhaps seeing their children as extensions of themselves. Even today, many men find themselves newly appalled at sexism after having a girl, a reaction apparently not stoked by being born of a woman, married to a woman or simply seeing women as human. In our reluctantly feminist America, one question this election poses is whether we’ve evolved enough to value women as individuals instead of assessing them relationally, as an attractive wife supporting her husband or as a high-achieving daughter reflecting a flattering light back on her parents.

It’s a question Mr. Trump has addressed in his personal life. His answer isn’t very pretty.

posted by Salieri at 8:07 AM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

Fleebnork, I feel ya.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 8:07 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump looks like a John K. cartoon character making kissy faces.

i blame this on you
posted by Foci for Analysis at 8:07 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I don't like Cruz any more than I have all along, but recent months have made me think that Trump would actually be a much worse president than Cruz, which I never would have thought possible.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:08 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Cruz Campaign Manager: Christie “Turned Over His Political Testicles Long Ago”

I think that counts as not-quite-CanCon, via a medieval bestiary.

The beaver is hunted for its testicles, which are valued for making medicine. When the beaver sees that it cannot escape from the hunter, it bites off its testicles and throws them to the hunter, who then stops pursuing the beaver. If another hunter chases the beaver, it shows the hunter that it has already lost its testicles and so is spared.

posted by maudlin at 8:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

All in favour of sending beer to corb....but cant help but note how much it feels like we're in the districts sending a gift to help a renegade tribute.
posted by chapps at 8:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [58 favorites]

I saw the clip twice this morning where Christie is all upset that Cruz didn't adhere to the pledge to support the nominee. Giveth unto me a break. Does anyone actually believe the megalomaniacal Trump would've kept it if he'd lost to Cruz?
posted by dnash at 8:10 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I'm glad a terrible person did a thing to another terrible person, I'm not seeing the ethical paradox there
posted by penduluum at 8:11 AM on July 21, 2016 [28 favorites]

Is trying to kiss the homophobe VP some kind of weird power play?

It's only gay if you're the passive partner (the “bitch”).

See also: the T-penetrating-the-P-from-above logo.
posted by acb at 8:12 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Liberals a week ago: Hey Ted ... Zodiac Killer much? Liberals today: Finally, a man of principle stands up to the orange dumpster fire

Not only do I think you're being unfair to liberals here, I think you're being a little hard on Hannibal Lecter.
posted by octobersurprise at 8:13 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

A couple of things on the Corb-love pile-on.

Corb, I hope you make a big deal of the fact that you're a Republican Convention Delegate now volunteering for the Clinton campaign. It really drives home just how horrible and dangerous Trump is and how important putting partisanship aside is in making sure that he doesn't win.

Secondly, it continues to be my hope that the end result of all this insanity is that Trump loses and then the Republican party collapses and a new conservative party forms where people like Corb are about the most conservative members. Anyone more conservative than that just gets told, "Hush now, grown-ups are talking."

It's a long shot but when I see things like Cruz's speech, it makes me think the target moved just a bit closer.
posted by VTX at 8:15 AM on July 21, 2016 [47 favorites]

I guess I went over to the Dark Side years ago, because I do not give a shit at all about the morality of me enjoying this spectacle of Cruz's attack, enjoying it like that viral video dog inhaling a soft-serve ice cream cone.
posted by thelonius at 8:15 AM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

Why Men Want to Marry Melanias and Raise Ivankas (NYT)

This is an excellent essay.

One thing that's not addressed is that Trump seems to also think that one measurement of whether his daughters are successful is whether he would personally find them attractive, date them or worse. It's part of his misogyny, and shouldn't be ignored.

The qualities Mr. Trump seeks in his romantic partners are remarkably retro

Boasting about wanting to molest his daughter if she weren't one of his kids? Biblically retro.
posted by zarq at 8:16 AM on July 21, 2016 [40 favorites]

NPR is a disgrace.
posted by odinsdream at 8:51 AM on July 21 [18 favorites +] [!]

If you are a contributor to a member station, or even if you're not, TELL THEM you think so.
posted by aught at 8:18 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Pretty much knowing who the official Presidential candidates are has reminded me to get my absentee ballot. But did Georgia just make it a lot harder for me to vote that way since I no longer have a US license?
posted by Kitteh at 8:18 AM on July 21, 2016

I would like to offer zarq's post of Michelle Obama, James Corden, and Missy Elliott singing in a car as a palate cleanser for those of us who might need it this morning. Don't miss it.
posted by dismas at 8:19 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I really don't get why the vulgar talking yam's oldest three children have gotten such a pass

It taps into the failures of the institutional media: they're used to applying the template that 'candidates' kids didn't ask for this, are loyal to family, and therefore get a softer ride'. Clearly the Trumpkin are more intimately involved with Daddy's dodgy businesses than anyone who doesn't share his DNA, are competing for the best stake in the Trump Organisation's bid to create Trump USA, and planning their own political prospects.

It was mildly amusing to watch the Murdoch spawn re-enact King Lear; this isn't funny at all.
posted by holgate at 8:19 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

The lack of violence at the RNC is a good thing because you know the Trumpsters would have blamed it all on BLM or Clinton even if it were all Nazis waving TP banners bashing heads, and most of the 'liberal press' would let them. When the announcements of the lackluster speakers list (and the cancellation of many of the bigger names) came out, then the first day was semi-disastrous, I started considering the possibility that this could be the first Convention ever with a 'negative poll bounce'. But then I saw how the Media was reporting it to everyone who was watching something else on TV and realized that the Media NEEDS Trump too much to let it happen. But yesterday, the mask slipped too far to be conveniently ignored, even by MSNBC (a division of Comcast) and NPR (sponsored by Koch). It's all up to Demented Donald to make this right, which he is emotionally incapable of without five hours of time in the editing room by the Apprentice producers (and, you know, this is live). If corb and her friends do a visible walkout during the Drumpfspeech, he'll turn a shade of red we've never seen before and go from Nuremberg Rally Adolph to Downfall Meme Adolph in front of America. It's going to be painfully hard on any 'soft' Trump supporters and the 'Never Hillary' gang... and I hereby fearlessly (but with some loathing) predict an unprecedented 'negative poll bounce' that, by the time the DNC is over, will establish "Trump the Loser" as a solid meme among every Media entity that doesn't NEED a 'political horse race' for ratings or clickbait. But watch out for a Third Party/Gary Johnson > Perot narrative... I have long felt that Trump has no 'real' support among any but the 47% of Republican primary voters who supported him but a lot of soft support from anyone brainwashed by the GOP's 25 years campaign against Hillary. A lot of them are looking for an 'out' and Johnson looks like it. Of course, in the Electoral College, a split of conservative votes might make a few Red States artificially Blue...

Liberals a week ago: Hey Ted ... Zodiac Killer much?
Liberals today: Finally, a man of principle stands up to the orange dumpster fire,
Even "the Good Guys" need to play the game, and the game in politics include enough Spin to cause dizziness. The enemy of my enemy is a helpful short-term ally. Of course, Cruz may be over-optimistic at how much of the Republican Party remains for him after Deranged Donald's mix of incompetence before and vindictiveness after the defeat burns it to the ground.

Why Men Want to Marry Melanias and Raise Ivankas (NYT)
Subtitle: Why Trump is the embodiment of everything wrong with most Straight White Males. (I consider myself a "recovering SWM")
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:23 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I am angry at Trump for many reasons, but making me be on the same side as Cruz, even for a second, is definitely high up on the list.

I am not as sanguine as some of you about the Dem convention coverage, not because of any incompetence on display but because the Republicans will just make shit up about whatever the speakers do/don't do and the media won't call them on it/ignore them as they should.
posted by emjaybee at 8:23 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Whatever this has done for Cruz' future political career, it has almost certainly cranked up the interest in tonight's big acceptance speech.
posted by notyou at 8:23 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Ted Cruz talks about the Constitution but doesn't say that if the Dems win the Presidency, the new JUSTICES appointed will destroy us all!

its_happening.gif
posted by murphy slaw at 8:24 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Liberals a week ago: Hey Ted ... Zodiac Killer much?

The nugget is straight from /r/The_Donald.
posted by cmfletcher at 8:24 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I think that Cruz told Trump he'd never endorse him, but Trump convinced himself that since Lyin' Ted always lies, he would endorse because he was lying about not doing so.

The fact that Cruz was not wearing his shoes on his hands and gloves on his feet should have been a red flag to the Trump campaign.
posted by robocop is bleeding at 8:27 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

If it's a narrow loss for Trump, Republicans are going to look for scapegoats -- they'll blame the media and "voter fraud" and probably George Soros and Saul Alinsky -- but they'll also blame Cruz. So I don't see how this helps him. I think the next GOP nominee will be either Tom Cotton or Donald Trump Jr.

The question is, of course, which Republicans. Because from here in July 2016 it's clear that what the establishment thinks is about as relevant as a cow's opinion. The scariest thing about Cruz standing up and lashing out at Trump is that it might indicate he learned a few things about being appealing to the base.

Or maybe he'll have learned that being a republican running for president is a sucker's game now and stick with the Senate where he has real pull.

I find it entirely believable, by the way, that Cruz provided his speech and the Trump campaign half-assed looking at it just like they half-ass everything else. And just like every other incompetent slacker jerk boss, the lesson they'll take from this isn't that they should grow up and do the work; it's that they can't trust people and they'll get even more abusive, mistrustful, and nasty to people they need to be on their side.
posted by phearlez at 8:27 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

@realdonalddrumpf "if the Dems win the Presidency, the new JUSTICES appointed will destroy us all!"
#overlyoptimistic
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:29 AM on July 21, 2016

Arghhh guys stop posting so fast and furious! I have a compulsion to read through every last comment on these threads before I can do any work, and yesterday that meant not doing any work at all! I can't keep up like this...

Just kidding never stop
posted by aka burlap at 8:31 AM on July 21, 2016 [46 favorites]

holgate: It taps into the failures of the institutional media: they're used to applying the template that 'candidates' kids didn't ask for this, are loyal to family, and therefore get a softer ride'. Clearly the Trumpkin are more intimately involved with Daddy's dodgy businesses than anyone who doesn't share his DNA, are competing for the best stake in the Trump Organisation's bid to create Trump USA, and planning their own political prospects.

This massive media failure really gets my goat because the eldest Trump children's complicity and involvement in the shady business dealings and fascist orgy are all there for everyone to see! It'd be unfair to go after the youngest one who is a minor, but it is also unfair to the citizens of this country that the media refuse to investigate the eldest ones and hold them accountable for their actions.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I can't speak for people (liberals or whatever) who are being openly facile about Cruz, but I think a lot of us who've had to live in conservative climates understand that - probably on accident - he's given out food for thought to those who really don't want to vote for Trump, cannot possibly say it out loud, but will be alone in the voting booth.

Like, I don't know if it will tip off a conservative groundswell of people saying anything out loud, but I think it might set off a quiet subterranean hollowing of support from some quarters. Like a virus.

Ted Cruz might be the virus that sends you to the doctor so they catch the cancer early, is what I'm saying.
posted by Lyn Never at 8:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [55 favorites]

It's honestly hard to imagine anything which will be serious grist for the scandal mill at the DNC.

Have Kanye run the house band, interrupt speakers with zingers against Taylor Swift
posted by thelonius at 8:36 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Ted Cruz might be the virus that sends you to the doctor so they catch the cancer early, is what I'm saying.

YES THIS
posted by cooker girl at 8:36 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Maybe now Sansa will love him.

totes called it
posted by leotrotsky at 8:39 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

I'm trying to figure out a pattern here, and I think there might be one. Trump is more than just trolling

Kiss the homophobe (Pence)
Show the fundamentalist Christian as a Judas (Cruz)
Make the lap dog grovel (Christie)

Not sure about the rest, but it's like a revenge fantasy.
posted by yesster at 8:39 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Is there a way I can donate to Hillary as a Canadian?
If not, I'll paypal a friend and have them do it.
posted by Theta States at 8:40 AM on July 21, 2016

Theta States : You can't. It violates election laws. And having someone do it on your behalf would also AFAIK.
posted by dismas at 8:41 AM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

Theta, dismas is right and that would be illegal. "The Federal Election Campaign Act (FECA) prohibits any foreign national from contributing, donating or spending funds in connection with any federal, state, or local election in the United States, either directly or indirectly. It is also unlawful to help foreign nationals violate that ban or to solicit, receive or accept contributions or donations from them. Persons who knowingly and willfully engage in these activities may be subject to fines and/or imprisonment."
posted by Apoch at 8:42 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

OK, I will just buy my friend some drinks in the hopes that frees up their cashflow. Gotcha.
posted by Theta States at 8:44 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

just how few people have done what Cruz seems to be doing

What Cruz is probably doing, in the eyes of the political establishment, is showing that he continues to be willing to be a dick to anyone if he thinks it'll make him look clever. As it's the same kind of behavior that's made him loathed in the past, I don't think that's going to make him really any better-liked by them in the long run.

A principled stand would be not going to the convention. A principled stand would be going and actually telling people to vote for someone else. This? This was just more rules-lawyering, and nobody likes a rules lawyer. Especially not DMs.
posted by praemunire at 8:44 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Shorter Daniel Dale, as I imagine it: "Take the Washington bureau job, they said. Put the insanity of covering Rob Ford behind you, they said."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [42 favorites]

Mike Pence - Remembering that name will win you a pub trivia night in 2042.
posted by Keith Talent at 8:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [25 favorites]

Not sure about the rest, but it's like a revenge fantasy.

It's like a lesser Saw sequel.
posted by beerperson at 8:46 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Persons who knowingly and willfully engage in these activities may be subject to fines and/or imprisonment.
...and just look how quickly and forcefully the FEC is acting on Trump's very public solicitation of funds from foreigners.
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:47 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

If not, I'll paypal a friend and have them do it.

OK, I will just buy my friend some drinks in the hopes that frees up their cashflow. Gotcha.

Don't do this. Please don't do this. Don't wink wink, nudge nudge this.
posted by Talez at 8:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [32 favorites]

beerperson: Is there any way for the podcast to have puppets

Please, no. Why does everything have to have goddamned puppets these days? [disclaimer: I have a phobia. And also several friends who are puppeteers.]
posted by Superplin at 8:51 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The FEC will not go after Trump no matter how blatantly he breaks the law because it would be a "partisan witch-hunt" to prosecute public, willful violations by the Republicans while ignoring the Democrats' equally blatant violations on the fig-leaf of an excuse that they never happened and all evidence that they did is in Laura Ingraham's head.

You, however, are little people. Little people they will step on.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 8:51 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

There are many nonprofits in the US that will be happy to take your money and put it into a pot that is not for this election but rather for continuing to fight against theocracy and fascism in the US for the long term.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

Will the Cruz Non-Endorsement Really Change Any Votes in November?

What a candidate wants from a convention is simple: unity and cheer-leading, perhaps the opportunity to have a few barn burner speeches that get picked-up by the media and go viral, making free ads. They should come out with a good bump in the polls, their own faithful fully on side and fired up, a few undecideds getting interested: momentum.

What Trump has got so far is the opposite: it's messy, complicated and full of messages he has to fight against. There's no one particular blow here that's likely critical, even Cruz being Cruz, but this means that the full benefit of a potential bounce, which he badly needs, is lost.

Trump may be able to mitigate some of this lost opportunity with a really good speech, but so far we've had a look in his house and it's full of squalor and nasty family infighting. The message is that this is what a Trump government will be like. Not the best ad to have splashed all over everywhere. This is the first time I can recall that a convention might be a net negative for a party.
posted by bonehead at 8:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

It'd be unfair to go after the youngest one who is a minor

Or Tiffany, who by all accounts only sees her father a few days a year. Yes, she has a rich-kids-of-Instagram lifestyle (at least, she has a rich-kids-of-Instagram Instagram) but there's a certain hope-beyond-hope that projects from children with a parent who treats them as a reminder of time they want to forget, and that's what I saw in her.
posted by holgate at 8:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

I think you guys are listening to a different NPR than I am.
posted by biogeo at 8:55 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Sorry, I forgot that Donald J. Trump has never had to comply with the laws that the rest of us do. If he did, he'd be sharing a cell with Bernie Madoff.
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:55 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

In about 12 hours Trump will be fully eligible for those classified briefings.
posted by zombieflanders at 8:56 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

In about 12 hours Trump will be fully eligible for those classified briefings.

[continues drinking heavily]
posted by entropicamericana at 8:57 AM on July 21, 2016 [38 favorites]

Had a dream last night that Ivanka gave a rousing speech like "Some people say my father is a corrupt, self-serving, vicious man." (booooooo) "Others say he's weak, deluded, and incompetent." (boooooo) "They're all right. Sorry dad."

and then i had to wake up.
posted by you're a kitty! at 8:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Prior to the 2000 election, convention bumps averaged more than six points, but that has fallen to just over two points from 2000 to 2012. [...] What is probably most important here is holding the conventions on consecutive weeks, which means that the convention messages end up overlapping and may cancel out each other. Another potential explanation lies in the increased polarization of the electorate. It is possible that partisans are so much more committed to their candidates now than they were before and there is a much smaller persuadable electorate that can be influenced by events like the nominating conventions.

I'm obviously for anything that chips away at Trump's support, even by a percentage point or two, but I do think the impact of this is being oversold a bit.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:59 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Right, so there's a whole week that Trump will receive information that Hillary Clinton doesn't have? Can President Obama just like, leak those briefings to her, or something?
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:00 AM on July 21, 2016

In about 12 hours Trump will be fully eligible for those classified briefings.

Can't wait for him to start blurting out classified material on Twitter that makes Clinton's indiscretions look like a clerical error. The Valerie Plames of the world should be worried right about now.
posted by fifthrider at 9:01 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

In about 12 hours Trump will be fully eligible for those classified briefings.

Is there anything that says they have to give them to him? Maybe if they give him some blank looseleaf and say it's written in invisible ink that will buy us a few hours
posted by beerperson at 9:02 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

If they want to sandbag him, they should just give him the briefings in dull, written form.
posted by The Gaffer at 9:02 AM on July 21, 2016 [39 favorites]

I can't imagine that Clinton doesn't have the connections to get whatever info she wants. The security briefings that Donald will get are probably totally basic compared to the in depth info she has access too I'm guessing.
posted by ian1977 at 9:02 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Fleebnork's Dad: "Obama has brought this country to its knees."

I would see this as a good thing since it was on its face when he took over...
posted by jim in austin at 9:04 AM on July 21, 2016 [60 favorites]

I'm fairly certain ex-presidents get them, for example.
posted by waitingtoderail at 9:04 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Patheos' Libby Anne latest post Magical Wishful Thinking on the Family, 2016 Republican Party Platform Edition

Some choice quotes:

So first of all, I was right—this is about marriage. It’s not about strong family bonds at all. It’s about marriage. It’s not about fostering loving, caring relationships. Nope. It’s about getting people to sign a piece of paper. This should be obvious, but a piece of paper isn’t going to make kids any better off. And that’s the claim, isn’t it? If only kids’ parents all got married, child poverty would end! No wait. It wouldn’t. It turns out that the marriage rate and the child poverty rate don’t correlate—at all.

Anyone who has studied history at all knows that child poverty was significantly higher in the past, when marriage rates were far higher, than it is today. Do you know what tends to guard against poverty? Education and access to resources. Marriage doesn’t make poor people suddenly financially sound. [...]

Just as forcing couples to marry would not magically create money that does not already exist, even so forcing couples to marry would not magically create loving and stable family environments where they do not already exist. [...]

Marriage does not make poor couples middle class. Marriage does not impart education on people ill-prepared for today’s job market. Marriage does not create stable, loving relationships where they do not already exist. And if conservatives are so damn worried about marriage, they should be asking why people aren’t getting married. Because—frankly—that’s what social scientists actually do. Republicans, though? Republicans engage in magical wishful thinking. Apparently. And you know what? Magical wishful thinking is a terrible thing to base policy on.

Highly recommended reading that dismantles the Party of Trump's platform planks about family and marriage.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:05 AM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

In about 12 hours Trump will be fully eligible for those classified briefings.

"I can't reveal what they said, but believe me, it's worse than you can imagine. And it's all Obama's and Crooked Hillary's fault!" - @realDonaldTrump, regardless of what's in them or if he even pays attention
posted by theodolite at 9:06 AM on July 21, 2016 [27 favorites]

> Transcript: Donald Trump on NATO, Turkey’s Coup Attempt and the World

Heh: Transcript Refutes Aide’s Claim That NYT Misquoted Trump's NATO Comments

The first article: Donald Trump Sets Conditions for Defending NATO Allies Against Attack

Some reactions: Donald Trump Remarks on NATO Trigger Alarm Bells in Europe

NATO Chief Hits Back After Trump Says He Wouldn’t Automatically Defend Member Countries
posted by homunculus at 9:08 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Mike Pence - Remembering that name will win you a pub trivia night in 2042.

I think you mistakenly transposed those last two numbers.
posted by worldswalker at 9:08 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Right, so there's a whole week that Trump will receive information that Hillary Clinton doesn't have? Can President Obama just like, leak those briefings to her, or something?

Shit, he'll probably just palm them off on Pence and go back to making up whatever he feels like. After all, this is a guy who offered to let a VP candidate handle "foreign and domestic policy."
posted by Existential Dread at 9:08 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

If, after getting the briefings, we see a subdued and bewildered trump then we know that aliens are real and there is an imminent invasion.
posted by ian1977 at 9:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

What Trump has go so far is the opposite: it's messy, complicated and full of messages he has to fight against. There's no one particular blow here that's likely critical, even Cruz being Cruz, but this means that the full benefit of a potential bounce, which he badly needs, is lost.

Trump may be able to mitigate some of this lost opportunity with a really good speech, but so far we've had a look in his house and it's full of squalor and nasty family infighting. Not the best ad to have splashed all over everywhere. This is the first time I can recall that a convention might be a net negative for a party.

I hope you're right with all my heart.

But I'm worried because, if there's one thing the phenomenon of Rob Ford taught us, if nothing else, it's that it's entirely possible for someone running a shitshow to defy conventional political wisdom and still come out on top.

The power of emotionally potent oversimplifications (Rob Ford: "Respect for Taxpayers!" "End the war on the car!" "Stop the gravy train!" Trump: "Make America great again!" "Lock her up!") should never be underestimated. It's not about facts - it's about what people feel, even if they're basing those feelings on outright lies.

Gingrich's speech last night? It was about making people feel afraid. And that's all that matters.

Economic stats that show a significant recovery since 2008? Don't matter. People feel like things are in the shitter (and for a variety of reasons, they could be right about that, but maybe not for the reasons the GOP would have them believe).

And once Trump gets hold of those classified briefings, all bets are off, even if he doesn't even read them. It's entirely possible we'll see something like this:

"Did you know what I found out yesterday? Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton have put American's in danger by [insert thing here]!!!!"

The facts don't matter in this universe - feelings do. That's why I'm worried that he's going to win.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 9:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

And Marriage is a contract between a Man (the Boss) and a Woman (the Employee), right?
posted by oneswellfoop at 9:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

You leave Springsteen out of this
posted by beerperson at 9:11 AM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

Oh yay Trump is tweeting about Cruz some more.

Donald J. Trump ‏@realDonaldTrump 1 hour ago
Other than a small group of people who have suffered massive and embarrassing losses, the party is VERY united. Great love in the arena!

Donald J. Trump ‏@realDonaldTrump 2 hours ago
Ted Cruz talks about the Constitution but doesn't say that if the Dems win the Presidency, the new JUSTICES appointed will destroy us all!

posted by rorgy at 9:13 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Clearly the RNC has decided to let Trump have his run but without any real RNC support. The total amateur hour quality of the convention is proof of this, and it might actually have a bit of "surely this". The man is bringing on nakedly opportunistic con artists, the CEO's of pyramid schemes, has been actors, and literally every single Republican Senator who is facing serious challenge in their reelection campaign this year has chosen to stay home.

My guess is that the Republican elites are hoping that by letting Trump do what he wants and then watching him lose they'll be able to take back control of the Part in the aftermath. "Look bub, remember Trump? Remember how we let you say anything you wanted? Do anything you wanted? Remember what that got us? Now STFU about political correctness, put the racist talk back in dogwhistles, and let us get back to winning elections, k?"

Taking a tactical loss for a strategic gain is something the Republican elites are good at. They can afford it. They don't like it, who likes losing, but the cost won't be too much for them to pay and the potential long term benefits (another 20 to 30 years of control over the rubes) are appealing.

I remain cautiously optimistic about the election. Compared to the shitshow the Republicans put on the Democratic convention is going to be a masterwork of organization with A list people even if it's just mediocre (and I don't think it'll be mediocre). That sort of thing shows even with media coverage desperate to pretend that Trump isn't a clown.

Still, it'll be closer than it should be for one important reason:

A great many Republicans may not be too happy about voting for Trump, but virtually every Republican will vote for the Republican Presidential candidate.

Trump, taken in isolation, may repel most Republicans (though I'm doubtful how many he actually does repel), but that really doesn't matter. Because Trump doesn't exist in isolation anymore, he exists as the Republican Presidential candidate.

I'm a yellow dog Democrat when it comes to the Presidency. Clinton could be every bit as venial, corrupt, and personally awful as her detractors claim and I'd still vote for her, volunteer for her, and urge others to vote for her. Because stuff like the Supreme Court is simply too damn important.

I suspect most Republican voters are very similar in the opposite direction. Even if personally they hate Trump they will vote for him because they want Supreme Court nominees who have pledged to overturn Roe, and all the other policy stuff that comes from having the President be one of your party.

Which is why GOTV is essential and not letting our guard down is so essential. Trump is a threat. Not as Trump, but as the Republican candidate. Trump the man is much less relevant now than he's ever been.

Not totally irrelevant and I'm sure Clinton will do her utmost to convince some Republican voters to stay home on election day by highlighting just how much of an awful person Trump is.

**************

I also think one of the interesting things to track is just how completely false so many of the essential Republican narratives are.

Take immigration. By all actual measures illegal immigration has declined under Obama. By all measures illegal immigration tends to decline under Democrats and increase under Republicans. Yet the Republicans are, quite successfully, lying and getting their followers to agree with the lie. They say America doesn't have borders anymore. They say America is unique in the world in having no control of its borders. Both of those things are lies or based on lies, and yet since it plays to the prejudices and bigotries of the Republican base they've gotten a lot of people to believe it.

Then there's the ugly. Republicans often talk about America being humiliated on the world stage, complain about Obama humbling himself to foreign leaders, and most of us on the left are baffled because we don't see anything even remotely resembling that. Like illegal immigration it's a lie, but a lie based on emotion rather than a counterfactual narrative.

This, I argue, plays back into Trump's delight in humiliating powerful Republican leaders. He took Chris Christie, once a man widely popular, and has ceaselessly humiliated him. Why?

the answer, I argue, is that in addition to Trump's own perverse love of such things, it gives him face among Republicans. There's a lot of people (most of them Republican) who have a very binary view of the world when it comes to dominance. People who, at heart, don't actually believe that equality and mutual respect exist.

To these people there are only bullies and victims. If you aren't the bully then you must be the victim, there's no middle ground.

This view applies not just to interpersonal relations, but to international relations as well. So when they see the USA acting as an equal partner, acting with respect towards foreign nations, they believe this means the USA is the victim. To them it is only when America is doing to foreign nations what Trump did to Christie, to Pence, that they believe America is not being victimized.

We see Obama acting as an equal partner, acting with a degree of respect towards other nations. They see Obama not bullying the other nations and therefore conclude that they must be abusing America.

This is why Trump's personal awful behavior is, to a lot of Republican voters, a plus. The worse he is, the more abusive he is towards his defeated rivals, the more they will like him because this proves (to them) that he isn't the victim. And they'd rather back a bully, toady up to the bully, than risk being on the side of a victim.
posted by sotonohito at 9:13 AM on July 21, 2016 [62 favorites]

POTUS: If @presssec chose best day of his life, "I’m pretty sure he would say his wedding day and the birth of his son. But this is close."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:14 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

(FWIW, the Press Secretary's thing has to do with the Kansas City Royals, but it's fun to imagine he's talking about Cruz.)
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:15 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

And regarding Trump's NATO comments - he just needs to get people to feel like NATO are a bunch of deadbeats, even if the people feeling that can't properly define the purpose of NATO or find a single Baltic state on a map. And even if they can, they just need to feel like the US is getting somehow ripped off by NATO. It's just another part of the "establishment" for them to be angry about - and Trump's going to fix that. Somehow. Even if that wasn't a problem that actually existed, and even if people in Baltic states tend take their NATO membership pretty seriously because being under the bootheel of the Soviet Union is within living memory for anyone there who was born before the 1990s.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 9:17 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Well, I'm STILL not confident that the Democrats won't fuck this up.
posted by jeff-o-matic at 9:20 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Charles Pierce on Tailgunner Ted: Boo All You Want. Ted Cruz Will Leave Cleveland with Dignity. He's the only principled man to take the stage thus far.

Breakfast with Ted Cruz: I don't want to admire him as much as I do right now.
posted by homunculus at 9:22 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

How long before The Donald starts going off teleprompter tonight? I can't wait for that.
I don't know if he can hold on and focus on the pre-prepared texts for that long.
Oh please oh please
posted by Theta States at 9:23 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

White people feel like things are in the shitter.

This is a party of white grievance, white rage, white hot bigotry.

Elsewhere, and more recently, in the Atlantic and on Metafilter:

By a handful of indicators—unemployment rates, overall economic growth, even average hourly earnings—the U.S. economy isn’t doing so badly right now.

And yet, when it comes to the number of Americans who go hungry, it’s almost like the recovery never happened. The U.S. Department of Agriculture defines food security as "access by all people at all times to enough food for an active, healthy life,” and in 2006, the year before the housing market stumbled, the USDA estimated that fewer than 10.9 percent of American households were food insecure. By 2009, that figure had spiked to 14.7 percent. And now? As of 2014, the most recent year on record, 14 percent of all American households are not food secure. That’s approximately 17.4 million homes across the United States, populated with more than 48 million hungry people. By the time the USDA reports its 2016 figures in September 2017, new food-stamp restrictions could make that number higher.

Hunger remains persistent because millions of Americans are still struggling financially as a result of the crash. Post-recession wage growth, though real, has been wildly unequal. A recent analysis from the Economic Policy Institute found that "between 2000 and 2015, wages for the bottom 60 percent of male workers were flat or declined” and that wage gains have been largely concentrated among high earners.

posted by Rustic Etruscan at 9:24 AM on July 21, 2016 [31 favorites]

Ted Cruz played Donald Trump's reality TV game — and won
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:24 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

mandolin conspiracy: Economic stats that show a significant recovery since 2008? Don't matter. People feel like things are in the shitter (and for a variety of reasons, they could be right about that, but maybe not for the reasons the GOP would have them believe).

The rising rates of suicide and death in general among rural/poor whites are a real thing. They have been fucked over, and they have a reason to be angry. I think back to the article in which a National Review writer viciously attacked the weakest in the "white American underclass", and I think, yeah, of course those voters abandoned the Republican establishment.
posted by clawsoon at 9:25 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

To be clear, I agree that the GOP is the party of white reaction, but they're taking advantage of a really existing problem which they don't intend to solve.
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 9:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

But yesterday, the mask slipped too far to be conveniently ignored, even by … NPR (sponsored by Koch).

Can anyone give a source for this? All I could find was this article from Snopes which hasn't been updated from 2014. Has something more recent come to light?
posted by BrashTech at 9:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Economic stats that show a significant recovery since 2008?

Virtually all the gains have gone to the top 1%, with a heavy emphasis on the financial sector. That same sector is a big component of Hillary Clinton's campaign contributions, and she is personally, financially, and politically enmeshed in that world. The average Trump supporter may be an angry bigot, but he is also justifiably angry about the fact that since 2008, economic gains have increasingly been tilted toward the rich. Neither party speaks to that reality, which is why Trump's personal fascist-populist revolt must be attractive, and why you see some Bernie supporters (supposedly) following Trump.

Which is also why I don't think you can take anything for granted in this election until the votes are counted. Fascist movements don't tend to follow what happened in the past.
posted by cell divide at 9:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

Just heard a report on BBC radio 'I was standing twenty feet away from Trump during Cruz' speech, and he was absolutely livid - but he really enjoyed the booing'.
posted by Devonian at 9:28 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

It's not about facts - it's about what people feel

I don't think you're wrong, but the country is not currently divided into Trump diehards and Clinton diehards. There are still (amazingly) undecided voters, or people who haven't decided hard enough to determine whether they will bother going to the polls that day. Those are the feelings in play right now, and the Democrats still have a chance of influencing them. Paint the Trump campaign as a fiasco full of unctuous, lip-licking toadies, subtly but continually hammer the narrative that the campaign is being mismanaged and poorly staffed, and imply that real winners don't need to constantly talk about how much of a winner they are. Send the subliminal message that if you want to feel smug (because who doesn't enjoy feeling smug? I know I love it!) about backing the right horse on November 9, Trump is not the way to go. Democrats can do this, if they'e savvy. And honestly I've been impressed with Clinton's media team.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Not related to anything except that she just said it a couple minutes ago, my coworker just suggested we have an official National Women Stay Home day to give Trump and the dudes like him exactly what they want--women out of the workforce and in our "proper" place. See how effectively the country runs without us out here doing our jobs. How amazing would that be.
posted by phunniemee at 9:32 AM on July 21, 2016 [35 favorites]

Economic stats that show a significant recovery since 2008? Don't matter.

I saw something once that said after a major economic crash, usually the crime and other problems caused by it don't subside until ten years after it happened.
posted by drezdn at 9:32 AM on July 21, 2016

but he really enjoyed the booing

Ladies and gentleman, your Republican Party nominee, Tony Clifton
posted by beerperson at 9:32 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Devonian: Just heard a report on BBC radio 'I was standing twenty feet away from Trump during Cruz' speech, and he was absolutely livid - but he really enjoyed the booing'.

After watching a couple of the professional wrestling clips featuring Trump that people have posted, I'm beginning to think that he sees political success as being exactly the same as getting a WWE arena fired up. As long as there are outsized emotions, things are going well.
posted by clawsoon at 9:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

They have been fucked over, and they have a reason to be angry.
No. Not even close. Most Straight White Males have been living privileged coddled lives (including me) compared to the rest of the American Population and any reduction in that status, even if it's through others getting better not 'us' getting worse, is perceived as "getting fucked over". Much of My Tribe will never accept just "being equal" and Donald J. Born-Rich-And-Cheating-At-Everything Trump is their Alpha Dog.
posted by oneswellfoop at 9:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

National Women Stay Home day to give Trump and the dudes like him exactly what they want--women out of the workforce and in our "proper" place.

Iceland pulled this off to great success.

Iceland's men were barely coping. Most employers did not make a fuss of the women disappearing but rather tried to prepare for the influx of overexcited youngsters who would have to accompany their fathers to work. Some went out to buy sweets and gathered pencils and papers in a bid to keep the children occupied. Sausages, the favourite ready meal of the time, sold out in supermarkets and many husbands ended up bribing older children to look after their younger siblings. Schools, shops, nurseries, fish factories and other institutions had to shut down or run at half-capacity.

Edit: Ok sorry not to great success, but they did pull it off.
posted by like_neon at 9:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I'm convinced that Cruz believes that he's the Antichrist.
posted by sutt at 9:35 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

The average Trump supporter may be an angry bigot, but he is also justifiably angry about the fact that since 2008, economic gains have increasingly been tilted toward the rich.

The point is that "economic anxiety" does not track well with economic status, but tracks incredibly well with race. Working class minorities, who got the short end of the stick, have remained generally optimistic about the economy.

Which means that something else is fueling this.
posted by NoxAeternum at 9:35 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

I thought all the antichrist myths said that he would be charasmatic and charming?
posted by cmfletcher at 9:37 AM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

And Steve Inskeep didn't slap him in his face and ask him if he knew this was real life.

I wrote to NPR News yet again this morning with that example myself. Inskeep is of course one of the most egregious examples of what has gone wrong at NPR News.
posted by aught at 9:38 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The facts don't matter in this universe - feelings do. That's why I'm worried that he's going to win.

True: I saw the rise of the Fords not quite as closely as you had to endure it, but there's a real caution there.

On the other hand, what Trump needs to worry about here is disaffection. If enough Repubs get pissed off they're not going to vote for the Democrats, but they might well decide to stay home on election day, or leave a box unticked at the top of the ballot. That's part of what happened to Hudak in Ontario and Harper nationally, last times round.
posted by bonehead at 9:38 AM on July 21, 2016

Joke about Trump being rich, but he has a narrative that inspired his core group: he's been bankrupt and clawed his way back to the top.

Of course he still had his brand and privilege and connections to do that. But how many of his supporters have been foreclosed on? Declared Bankruptcy? They see in Trump the billionaire they could become if only The Government would get out of the way.
posted by mrzarquon at 9:39 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Why Men Want to Marry Melanias and Raise Ivankas

Ugh.
posted by Artw at 9:41 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

NPR (and most of the rest of the media) appears to be too busy reporting on the emotions, arguments, and window dressing of the convention to really assess the content, which is of course the more important and horrifying part. I mean, the Steve King racism scandal was just unbelievable, and went over with barely a fucking whisper of pushback.
posted by Existential Dread at 9:41 AM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

if there's one thing the phenomenon of Rob Ford taught us, if nothing else, it's that it's entirely possible for someone running a shitshow to defy conventional political wisdom and still come out on top.

Rob Ford was the product of a fairly distinct set of circumstances -- the history of the GTA, the relationship of Ebitocoke and Scarborough to the old City of Toronto, etc. -- which meant that his coalition was very different from any coalition the GOP might assemble under Trump.

It's not about facts - it's about what people feel, even if they're basing those feelings on outright lies.

We know how most African-Americans and Hispanic Americans and American Muslims feel about Trump: they're afraid and with good bloody reason. We know the demographic vote splits that led Romney to 47% and defeat in 2012. And so it comes down to the question of whether there's a combination of enough fearful white people, and enough voter suppression (active and passive) on the other side.

Having seen the Brexit vote, I'm obviously not going to rule it out, and the media will keep things competitive till the end because it's in their financial interest to do so, but the past three days have come across like a narrowing of the newly co-branded TrumpGOP, not a broadening.
posted by holgate at 9:43 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Well, my morning errands today include going to the dispensary to prepare for today's Trumpocalypse. There's no way I'm gonna make it through this sober.
posted by Gaz Errant at 9:43 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

The key to understanding the NATO business is that the one thing that arouses Trump's attention is the prospect of entering negotiations and screwing over the other party. The idea of doing this from his golden throne in the White House, using the full authority of the USA to make other nations grovel before him, gives him a hard-on.

Hence not the wall (which he doesn't care about) but making Mexico pay for it. His almost pornographic love for torture, including torturing families, is part of his lust for dominance.

Anything not related to directly humiliating a weaker party doesn't enter his attention, at least long enough to warrant a stable response.
posted by argybarg at 9:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

I guess they've never heard of Uber?

It's like Uber, but for heathens.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Is Hillary's Hashtag-Friendly Feminism All That Stands Between Us and the Apocalypse? (Village Voice)
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

This is doubtless small and wrong of me, and it is probably due to lagging polls or something, plus these national polls don't mean much when it all comes down to the key electoral states, but I was pleased as punch to see that Rasmussen (always rosy for Rs) last week said Trump had a 7 point national lead and now says it is 1 point. This is definitely not how it is supposed to go when the R convention is in the spotlight.
posted by bearwife at 9:46 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

The New York Times is reporting that the Trump campaign is furiously checking Trump's speech for plagiarism because nobody knows where he comes up with the stuff that comes out of his mouth.

Either the Times has been making a lot up out of whole cloth, or more likely, the Trump campaign leaks like a sieve. Every presidential campaign leaks strategically, but the degree to which stuff seems to pour out of the Trump camp, headed by a NDA-wielding lawsuit-crazed loyalty-obsessed oaf as it is, is interesting. I suppose that's what happens when you staff your campaign with people who don't know what they're doing.
posted by zachlipton at 9:47 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Why Men Want to Marry Melanias and Raise Ivankas

It must suck to be Tiffany Trump and know your dad hasn't thought about sleeping with you
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

uh did you miss the lifestyles of the rich and famous interview from when she was a baby
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:49 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Wasn't that Ivanka?
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 9:52 AM on July 21, 2016

oneswellfoop: No. Not even close. Most Straight White Males have been living privileged coddled lives (including me) compared to the rest of the American Population and any reduction in that status, even if it's through others getting better not 'us' getting worse, is perceived as "getting fucked over".

I'll respectfully disagree. I've been lucky to have privilege when it comes to jobs and, in general, playing life on easy mode, but a part of that was lucking into the academic success to get out of the small town I grew up in. Guys I grew up with - went hunting gophers and tramping through the woods and throwing the football around every day after school with - ended up struggling with alcoholism and addiction and lack of opportunity. Even though my family was probably poorer than theirs money-wise, I got some privileges that they didn't, and I'd be uncomfortable going down the road of, "I succeeded while playing life on Easy Mode, why didn't you? We share the same privilege, don't we?"
posted by clawsoon at 9:52 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

the Trump campaign is furiously checking Trump's speech for plagiarism

Everyone is waiting for what might possibly steal the headlines away from his self-celebration
posted by Theta States at 9:52 AM on July 21, 2016

Heh, Googled it and most NATO members are in fact falling short of their expected contributions. Of the Baltics, only Estonia is meeting them.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 9:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Rob Ford was the product of a fairly distinct set of circumstances... which meant that his coalition was very different from any coalition the GOP might assemble under Trump.

Politics is always individual, but I think there are some commonalities that do transfer. Rob Ford emerged as an anybody but them candidate in a race where both front runners were unlikable. Ford was a protest vote, and won, almost by default, because none of the other options on offer were attractive enough to get votes out.

That was Bush's problem, Rubio and Cruz's problem. None were even good candidates. However, the party also had lots of angry and uninformed out there who will follow the first shyster to promise them everything. No good alternatives+dissatisfied, low information voters+carnival huckster=Ford. That's been Trump's formula through the primaries too.

That points the way at Clinton's weakness too. If she can't get the vote out, she can lose. Obama would clean Trump's clock because he could get the his part of the electorate out to vote. Clinton has to do the same, and it's not clear she's really been than successful yet in igniting her own base support.
posted by bonehead at 9:55 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Heh, Googled it and most NATO members are in fact falling short of their expected contributions. Of the Baltics, only Estonia is.

Great. Does that allow the chief executive of a member state to unilaterally break the treaty on a whim?
posted by murphy slaw at 9:55 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

the Trump campaign is furiously checking Trump's speech for plagiarism

They should first pray that he sticks to the speech at all.
posted by like_neon at 9:56 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

The Washington delegation is in the RNC doghouse. They're not having our bus leave until right before convention showtime to keep us from talking to reporters.

I guess they've never heard of Uber?
posted by corb at 9:43 AM

Hell, rent your own damned bus. I think there'd be people here who'd help crowdfund that expense.
posted by yesster at 9:57 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

No. Not even close. Most Straight White Males have been living privileged coddled lives (including me) compared to the rest of the American Population and any reduction in that status, even if it's through others getting better not 'us' getting worse, is perceived as "getting fucked over". Much of My Tribe will never accept just "being equal" and Donald J. Born-Rich-And-Cheating-At-Everything Trump is their Alpha Dog.

Here's the difference.

The rural poor and white HAVE been fucked over, just like the urban poor and black, the suburban middle classes, and you and I have been fucked over. In exactly the same ways? Not entirely, because white privilege _is_ a thing and _is_ real. But compared to the 1% we're all part of the same pissed-upon underclass in this country.

The core of the Southern Strategy is simple: make rural poor and white believe, without a doubt, that those doing the fucking over are NOT the rich and elite but the other poor and downtrodden. That Good God-Fearing Rural White Folk are the only Real Americans and their place as the natural leaders of America and prosperity have been STOLEN. By THEM.

THEM varies by audience. But if you listen to a New Country song on the radio, and you hear the typical lyrics of I Got A Truck And I Got A Dawg And I Got A Beer And My Girl's Got Her Bare Feet Up On The Dashboard And I Got A Fishin Rod And I Got A Tire Swing And I Got Zero Sophistication And Don't Want None Anyway, the set of "everyone not mentioned in that song" fits into THEM somewhere.

And the theft is real to them. How can it not be? They read it in the newspaper and they hear it on TV and they hear it on radio and they read it on the Innernet. But they look at corporations dodging billions in taxes and sucking America dry, then look at a composite image of an inner city single mom getting government assistance, and the LATTER is who they blame for their situation because it's so easy these days to get caught up in an echo chamber where you're not hearing anything else.
posted by delfin at 9:57 AM on July 21, 2016 [85 favorites]

i'm an atheist but i'm praying like hell that whatever happened to the jumbotron last night during eric's speech happens to the teleprompters tonight during trump's
posted by murphy slaw at 9:57 AM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Heh, Googled it and most NATO members are in fact falling short of their expected contributions. Of the Baltics, only Estonia is meeting them.

Right, and I'm sure Donald Trump is morally outraged by someone's failure to pay a bill.

He loves humiliating weaker parties, and little goofy "countries" groveling before him amuses him.
posted by argybarg at 9:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

The total amateur hour quality of the convention is proof of this,

Unfortunately the general public, whose standards of quality have been lowered to the sub- sub- sub-basement by endless terrible reality tv, watching it through the slick overlay of cable news programming, won't see it that way.
posted by aught at 10:00 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

So I saw Megyn Kelly grilling some bewildered Republican woman on Fox on Tuesday about immigration and it has really stuck in my teeth. Megyn was being a good journalist and this woman was becoming increasingly dumbfounded by her questions. it finally occurred to me late last night that so many of these white people will deny hating brown people, but they don't understand why their neighbors don't look like them. All they want is for the woman next door to pick up her kids from soccer practice in a similarly priced wagon, to go to the same girl for their hair and for them to smell American burgers cooking on the barbecues. It doesn’t occur to them how white supremacist it makes them.
posted by Sophie1 at 10:00 AM on July 21, 2016 [34 favorites]

Compared to the shitshow the Republicans put on the Democratic convention is going to be a masterwork of organization with A list people even if it's just mediocre (and I don't think it'll be mediocre).

I know we're still in the midst of the Repub trainwreck, but I am already giddily fantasizing about the Dems pulling off an absolutely flawless convention. WHAT IF THEY GET BEYONCE TO SHOW UP??
posted by aka burlap at 10:00 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

One thing is certain...If Trump crashes monumentally and loses, you are guaranteed that, in 2020, you will Cruz ads extolling the fact that, of all the so-called conservatives, only Ted had the backbone/character to stand-up to the naked emperor. Or something like that. Dude shot a lot of footage for his future campaign last night.
posted by Thorzdad at 10:00 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Heh, Googled it and most NATO members are in fact falling short of their expected contributions. Of the Baltics, only Estonia is.

Great, let's utterly screw over Latvia over what, $100 million or so? That sounds fun and we've certainly got no higher priorities in world affairs so we've got all the time in the world for that.
posted by zachlipton at 10:01 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"I thought all the antichrist myths said that he would be charasmatic and charming?"

I didn't say that he was the Antichrist, but that he thinks he is the Antichrist. To Ted Cruz, Ted Cruz is the most charismatic person in the room.
posted by sutt at 10:01 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

They should first pray that he sticks to the speech at all.

I think that's like praying for NASA's budget to increase. You can do it all you want, but even within the normal bounds of faith, even the true believers will admit there's no connection between the prayer and the end result.
posted by zachlipton at 10:03 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Heh, Googled it and most NATO members are in fact falling short of their expected contributions. Of the Baltics, only Estonia is meeting them.

Yeah, it's true that the US has been carrying the heaviest NATO burden for decades. That's the price of being a superpower. Do we want free reign in the world to pursue our neo-imperialist global corporate agenda, or do we want Russia and China to divide the spoils of the world up between them? If you dismantle NATO, that's what you're getting. That and a reformed Warsaw pact only now with Kleptocrats instead of Communists.
posted by dis_integration at 10:04 AM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

Heh, Googled it and most NATO members are in fact falling short of their expected contributions.

Heh, just pull out of NATO, heh heh.

Is this a shakedown for money, or is it about no longer giving a fuck about the central US security policy of the last half-century? Or is it just for the fucking lulz?
posted by holgate at 10:04 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Norm Orenstein & Thomas Mann take a well-earned victory lap & continue to be Cassandras at Vox: “The Republicans waged a 3-decade war on government. They got Trump.”
posted by Going To Maine at 10:05 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I do not understand how Trump squares his American First isolationism with his desire to kill kill hill terrorists abroad. These two things would appear to be contradictory.
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:06 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Heh, just pull out of NATO, heh heh.

Speaking of pulling out...Have I missed it, or have none of the R candidates said anything about pulling out of the UN? That used to be a big applause line in hard-right politics. Is it over?
posted by Thorzdad at 10:06 AM on July 21, 2016

Great, let's utterly screw over Latvia over what, $100 million or so? That sounds fun and we've certainly got no higher priorities in world affairs so we've got all the time in the world for that.

Couldn't we just send Luke Cage over to ask Dr. Doom where's our money, honey?
posted by entropicamericana at 10:07 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I do not understand how Trump squares his American First isolationism with his desire to kill kill hill terrorists abroad. These two things would appear to be contradictory.

soren_lorensen, I believe the logic is, "Better to kill them over there then have them kill us over here".
posted by Apoch at 10:08 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Well, my morning errands today include going to the dispensary to prepare for today's Trumpocalypse. There's no way I'm gonna make it through this sober.

In the interest of your sanity and blood pressure, may I recommend sticking with an indica?
posted by bibliowench at 10:08 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

so Trump's foreign policy is basically global-scale MGTOW
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:08 AM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

The whole thing about "raising Ivankas", now that I've finally read this... there's all this stuff about her "professional success", but look at her. Look at any of Trump's kids. He's got tons and tons and tons of resources. Why aren't any of them notable for something other than being Trumps? Yeah, they've all had Trump-related careers. But he didn't raise Ivanka to someday be even more notable than he is. She could have been successful in a lot of fields, but everything she's done has involved trading on her father's name. He's made her to be nothing without him.

Ivanka isn't making any noticeable attempt to break out of that mold, and her dad doesn't have any intention of guiding her to doing her own thing. I hate the narrative of her "success". Ivanka's career is like Melania's speech. Anything she did herself, she did only by carbon-copying someone else. To quote her:

"I look at my brothers and myself and I’m, like, really proud of the fact that nobody’s ... a drug addict, nobody’s driving around chasing women, snorting coke."

This is the bar they had to live up to in order to be "successful in business". They just had to not actively screw it up. And the media seems to want to give them all kinds of accolades for that, and give Trump credit for raising adults of independent competence who don't actually exist. What's notable here is what a short leash Melania has even compared to Ivanka. If this is supposed to speak to how men see women generally, that's really disturbing. But I think it has less to do with men generally and more to do with the fact that Trump already tried having a wife with agency and decided that wouldn't do. If Ivanka actually went off and did her own thing and made a name for herself on her own, I don't think a hypothetical future daughter (or granddaughter) would get the opportunities that Ivanka got.
posted by Sequence at 10:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

Robert Faturechi at ProPublica: “What Newt Gingrich Really Thinks of Donald Trump”

In a private speech recorded in February, the onetime Speaker of the U.S. House, now reportedly on the shortlist to be Trump’s running mate, said Trump would lose in a landslide if he didn’t evolve to be more like Ronald Reagan than Barry Goldwater. He added that no one knows what a Trump presidency would be like — not even Trump.

posted by Going To Maine at 10:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Heh, Googled it and most NATO members are in fact falling short of their expected contributions. Of the Baltics, only Estonia is meeting them.

For want of a nail the shoe was lost.
For want of a shoe the horse was lost.
For want of a horse the rider was lost.
For want of a rider the message was lost.
For want of a message the battle was lost.
For want of a battle the kingdom was lost.
And all for the want of a horseshoe nail.

Isolationism during a far-away war can be an efficacious strategy, depending on the circumstances. But letting one's allies fall in battle over pride, unpaid dues and a preening desire to prove how valuable you are to them seems dangerously and stupidly shortsighted. We should be better than that.
posted by zarq at 10:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

How long before The Donald starts going off teleprompter tonight?

He sort of has to. When he's on the Teleprompter he's not a great reader plus he gets bored. So if he stays on it's going to be a snooze fest and he wouldn't allow that. So at some point it's pretty much guaranteed he'll go off script.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 10:11 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

CIA ought to brief him with fake but tantalizing info to see if he leaks it. Stuff like. "Hillary loves to sell red mercury on eBay. She doesn't even care how much it sells for. She just likes to see it in foreign hands."
posted by mccarty.tim at 10:11 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Is this a shakedown for money, or is it about no longer giving a fuck about the central US security policy of the last half-century? Or is it just for the fucking lulz?

I think it goes back to Trump personally signing a giant stack of checks and refusing to pay his vendors, going "nah, screw this guy," just because he can. He will take any opportunity to screw over the little guy to make himself look stronger, whether it's actually to his advantage or not. And that applies just the same whether the little guy is his tile supplier or the nation of Latvia.
posted by zachlipton at 10:14 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Who would Tom Bombadil bomb-badoo?
posted by blue_beetle at 10:14 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

CIA ought to brief him with fake but tantalizing info to see if he leaks it.

Quite honestly, they actually should do this to any candidate being given security briefings, on the off-chance they do talk about it while campaigning.
posted by Thorzdad at 10:14 AM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

I'm not cheering for Cruz, but I am thoroughly enjoying my popcorn.

I would like to share my popcorn making techniques for everyone so they can fully enjoy the remainder of the electoral season.

I use a microwave popcorn container like this one. It's okay but the lid warped pretty quickly and lots of kernels escape. I might upgrade someday but am in no rush. I used to use a hot air popper but it blew bits of popcorn debris all over my kitchen all the time and the popcorn was too dry for seasoning to stick.

I put a couple of teaspoons of olive oil in the container first. Then pour in some flavacol salt to get that movie theatre popcorn taste. Stir to dissolve salts. Then add popcorn kernels and stir again to coat the kernels.

I microwave on high for 3 minutes. Then I very carefully remove the container from the microwave (it gets some moisture buildup around the edges which can be very hot) and dump the popcorn into a large bowl. Then I add a seasoning salt - currently either cracked pepper and Asiago cheese or salt and vinegar (I'm out of ranch).

Then the radical part - I put the popcorn in rubbermaid containers and seal it up for the next day. Somehow day old popcorn tastes at least twice as good as just made popcorn. The salt is saltier the popcorn is a bit crunchier. But it has to be in a sealed container. Left exposed to air the popcorn becomes chewy and stale (I checked). THIS DISCOVERY SERIOUSLY ELEVATED MY POPCORN GAME. I fully expect to show up on Eater's next map of the best non-candied popcorn in Chicago.

Leftover unpopped kernels can be recooked - it works better if you do it nearly right away - I put these back in the just used container and nuke them for about 2 minutes and 20 seconds. You do get a slight burnt popcorn smell but they don't usually burn and the popcorn still tastes okay (but not as good as the initial batch). I deliberately under-time my initial and subsequent cook because I'd rather have lots of unpopped kernels than even one burnt one (The Worst!).

A fun science experiment/lesson is that a kernel alone in the microwave will not pop. You need a certain critical mass of kernels for popping - so the escaped kernels can sit in your microwave for a long time without popping while you nuke other stuff.
posted by srboisvert at 10:16 AM on July 21, 2016 [71 favorites]

Sequence: This is the bar they had to live up to in order to be "successful in business". They just had to not actively screw it up.

Considering how some of their friends turned out, given the temptations of private school, that might be a higher bar than you'd think.
posted by clawsoon at 10:18 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

All they want is for the woman next door to pick up her kids from soccer practice in a similarly priced wagon, to go to the same girl for their hair and for them to smell American burgers cooking on the barbecues. It doesn’t occur to them how white supremacist it makes them.

Either because they've been sold fear of the Other all their lives, or I have that backwards and this is why it's so easy to sell fear of the Other to them. Or both.
posted by Foosnark at 10:19 AM on July 21, 2016

🔮❌📉📌TRUMP📌📉❌🔮

—an emoji hex to take down Trump from the Tumblr witch thread
posted by nicebookrack at 10:19 AM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

While you can interpret Cruz's comments about Trump dissing his wife as hiding behind Heidi, it also gives him an out for the disloyalty charge -- he can claim a higher loyalty, that is to his family. Whether it's true or not, he can certainly sell it that way.

Oh, FFS, Mefites...

This thread is full of plausible reasons to deem Cruz's speech as career suicide. What is not even remotely plausible is to think Cruz didn't think of all those reasons himself, and still stepped forward and do it.

The guy took a vow to love and honor his wife. Last night he made good on it, in the face of a crowd that was a heartbeat away from tossing chairs at him.
posted by ocschwar at 10:19 AM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

The 31 Most Outrageous Shirts, Trucks, and Signs from the Republican Convention
posted by octothorpe at 10:21 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

heh, the subject line of my latest email from the Clinton campaign is just "Lucifer"
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:23 AM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

> This thread is full of plausible reasons to deem Cruz's speech as career suicide. What is not even remotely plausible is to think Cruz didn't think of all those reasons himself, and still stepped forward and do it.

The guy took a vow to love and honor his wife. Last night he made good on it, in the face of a crowd that was a heartbeat away from tossing chairs at him.

For reals though the man has watched Princess Bride literally thousands of times. He has memorized it. It is likely the frame through which he understands the entire world. And despite his obvious-to-everyone Humperdinckery, he is convinced that he's Westley.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [43 favorites]

heh, the subject line of my latest email from the Clinton campaign is just "Lucifer"

They, along with the social media team, are just killing it over there.

Somebody should make an "I'M WITH LucifHER" shirt, I think the irony would be lost.
posted by leotrotsky at 10:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

In about 12 hours Trump will be fully eligible for those classified briefings.

Given how overclassified things are in DC, that could literally just be NYT articles.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 10:27 AM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

prize bull, did you read it the email? It's not that the campaign is calling Trump Lucifer, they're talking about Ben Carson saying Hillary is connected with Lucifer.
posted by cooker girl at 10:27 AM on July 21, 2016

Michael Moore thinks Trump is going to win.
posted by yoga at 10:28 AM on July 21, 2016

They, along with the social media team, are just killing it over there.

they are taking "never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake" to a whole new level and it's delightful
posted by murphy slaw at 10:29 AM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

In about 12 hours Trump will be fully eligible for those classified briefings.

Given how overclassified things are in DC, that could literally just be NYT articles.

Nonetheless, we can fully anticipate every covert US agent around the world requesting immediate extrication and repatriation on Wednesday in November.
posted by ocschwar at 10:29 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Clearly the RNC has decided to let Trump have his run but without any real RNC support.

That doesn't seem to be the case. The Speaker of the House and Majority Leader of the Senate were there speaking on behalf of him, and the convention has clearly been trying to downplay internal disputes in the party.

If the RNC or institutional GOP more broadly were just letting him have his run, I think that what that would look like is: Ryan showing up to conduct business but not speaking on Trump's behalf and McConnell not showing up at all. The convention would have just allowed the votes that the nevertrumpers wanted and maybe even allowed the convention to weasel out of Trump, gambling that this would better preserve the longer-term affections of their volunteer corps.

To me anyway, what you're seeing looks like the institutional Republican Party trying as hard as it can to get Trump elected but in an environment where many individual politicians and donors either recognize that visibly supporting Trump is not in their longer-term interests or just plain can't stomach the doofus.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 10:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

@HillaryClinton
Now we know what Trump really thinks about us. Sad! http://trumpyourself.org #TrumpYourself
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Hillary and her team are basically Obama sitting back and telling Romney, "proceed" as Mitt goes on to embarrass himself over Benghazi in their last debate.

Please, by all means, Mr. Trump, proceed.
posted by wabbittwax at 10:33 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

“One of the things I’ve been concerned about this week is we’re all sitting in our bubble, having a good laugh at this total, as you said, shitshow, but the truth is that this plays to a lot of people that he has to win to become the next president,” [Michael] Moore said of the chaos that has unfolded at the Republican National Convention, like when the crowd starting screaming about locking up Hillary Clinton.

He has a point.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 10:36 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I think Maher's right. I think Trump has this one.

Trump is entertaining, he's charismatic, he's easy to understand. It's easy to yell in his favor, which isn't true for Hillary.

He's your bonkers uncle who you call on when you need a dispute resolved. He's the dumbass comedy who still makes you laugh every time. He's Andrew Jackson and Dirty Harry and the Joker and a lot of other unfortunate American archetypes. He's sex, power, shamelessness and TV all in one package.

I don't think even his voters really care about issues, and Trump certainly doesn't. They just like the spectacle of power and novelty, and it's gathering steam. The minor missteps are tiny compared the force of "lock her up" and the general feeling of kill-or-be-killed.

I think he has this one in the bag.
posted by argybarg at 10:36 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Please, by all means, Mr. Trump, proceed.

Yeah. If there's a debate, I think the best thing Hillary could do is to just let Donny wail and bluster and go deeper and deeper down the crazy hole, while she stands there with the well-practiced, empathetic-yet-mildly-amused face of a mother letting her toddler throw a tantrum until they're too tired to continue.
posted by Thorzdad at 10:39 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

yeah, I knew it was a reference to Carson, still funny just to see "From: Hillary Clinton, Subject: Lucifer" in my inbox

anyway. I was happy to have one more opportunity to make a Ted-Cruz-is-a-literal-monster joke last night but after his speech and his press conference this morning...fuck it, I wouldn't vote for him for assistant undersecretary to the vice-dogcatcher and all of his political beliefs completely infuriate me but god damn it after watching all these GOP tools trip all over each other to do Reek and Wormtongue cosplay for Donald fucking Trump it was refreshing as hell to see one guy get up there and deliver the best screwjob he could, damn the consequences, and I don't care if he did it for his wife or if he did it to set up his 2020 run, even if it was 100% for his own personal benefit it took some spine to do that that very, very few of his contemporaries have shown so you know what -- and this will likely be the nicest thing I ever say about him -- Ted Cruz, you're a real human being.
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [30 favorites]

I think he has this one in the bag.

Facile conclusion, but then Bill Maher and Michael Moore have both made careers out of dime-store "analysis."
posted by Celsius1414 at 10:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

I took a break from all of this last night, woke up very late this morning and catching up on everything is like eating two pizzas at once as fast as I can. OMG this photo of the Trump family during Cruz's speech! "No big deal" indeed!
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [28 favorites]

I would like to share my popcorn making techniques for everyone so they can fully enjoy the remainder of the electoral season.

I agree that popcorn is important, but I really have to argue for the whirleypop, and I am sad that srboisvert did not devote any attention to popcorn selection. Some of the kernels from Fireworks are pretty good -- their baby white is good, as is their "High Mountain Midnight," but most of the popcorns in their sampler packs are basically like Orville Redenbacher but more expensive. Right now we're going through some baby white from Hoosier Hill that's pretty darn good. Solid crunch, good flavor, nearly hull-less, very few unpopped kernels. Small puffs though as the name would imply.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 10:43 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Is it me or does Tiffany look like she's trying not to laugh?
posted by cooker girl at 10:43 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm not a fan of any electoral analysis that could include the words "masses" or "sheeple" in any accurate paraphrase
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:44 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

The Clinton campaign has a tool for you to "Trump yourself" - decorate your pictures with insulting Trump quotes.

Twitter pics
posted by Tarumba at 10:44 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

ok not to get all snopes on this but how could that family snapshot be from during Cruz's speech? didn't Trump enter at the end of it?
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:45 AM on July 21, 2016

I recognize that it took millions of Republican primary voters to bring America to this frightening moment, a moment in which a preposterous grifter of authoritarian bent whose mental health is the subject of pervasive and anxious speculation, has become a major-party nominee for president. But it was men like Christie who were indispensable in the creation of this moment. Donald J. Trump could have been stopped. I believe he could have been stopped early, by a concerted effort to unify the party behind a single, viable, non-fraudulent candidate; and he could have been stopped late, if Republicans like Christie had not crumpled before Trump. A handful of honorable men did, in fact, try to stop him. But they were too few in number, and too marginal to make a difference. Collectively, the most influential and smartest Republican elected officials—people who fall into the general category of Them That Knew Better—just might have been able to devise a way to prevent what is happening from happening. But abdication of responsibility and self-debasement in the pursuit of power were the order of the day.

Jeffrey Goldberg, "The Hollow Men".
posted by Halloween Jack at 10:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Thorzdad: Yeah. If there's a debate, I think the best thing Hillary could do is to just let Donny wail and bluster and go deeper and deeper down the crazy hole, while she stands there with the well-practiced, empathetic-yet-mildly-amused face of a mother letting her toddler throw a tantrum until they're too tired to continue.

I have no context for this clip, but is having Hillary walk out Steve Austin to give Trump a Stone Cold Stunner also a possibility?
posted by clawsoon at 10:45 AM on July 21, 2016

I don't think even his voters really care about issues, and Trump certainly doesn't. They just like the spectacle of power and novelty, and it's gathering steam. The minor missteps are tiny compared the force of "lock her up" and the general feeling of kill-or-be-killed.

I think he has this one in the bag.

How have you reached that conclusion? Same thing as I asked in the last thread, really. What makes you think that these things will persuade swing voters to vote Trump and sceptical Republicans to vote at all? He needs those votes. He can't do it simply on the basis of the votes that are his already. A Trump presidency is a possibility, and one that people should be terrified, but to declare it likely at this point requires something beyond your gut instinct about momentum.
posted by howfar at 10:46 AM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

Michael Moore thinks Trump is going to win.

As I said elsewhere, the translation of Moore's argument is "my demographic's relevant, dammit!" He's an old school leftist activist who cut his teeth on white working class lunchpail issues, and he's never been able to fully understand the demographic shifts of the past 30 years.
posted by NoxAeternum at 10:47 AM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

OMG this photo of the Trump family during Cruz's speech! "No big deal" indeed!

Maybe that's just his resting scowl?
posted by Artw at 10:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

If y'all really want to up your popcorn game, you should be using bacon fat. (You're welcome.)
posted by entropicamericana at 10:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

I think he has this one in the bag.

I don't think he has it in the bag, but if we don't take a serious look at what makes him appealing to so many and just laugh up his foibles, that improves his odds.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 10:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

FYI I have not yet received any memails re: Trumps chances being wagerable. Free money "in the bag" here folks.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 10:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The Writers of Idiocracy Are Planning Anti-Trump Ads Starring Terry Crews
posted by Mister Fabulous at 10:49 AM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

The "oh god how can we be here hillary is so FUCKED" contingent was around in 2012, too, telling us that Obama was utterly fucked, and in 2008 they told us that America was responding so primally to Sarah Palin that Obama was fucked then too.

Read the old threads while you're waiting for this one to pick up more comments. They're more like where we are now than these ones would make them seem. They're also much shorter, which is nice.
posted by rorgy at 10:49 AM on July 21, 2016 [32 favorites]

How have you reached that conclusion? Same thing as I asked above, really. What makes you think that these things will persuade swing voters to vote Trump and sceptical Republicans to vote at all? He needs those votes. He can't do it simply on the basis of the votes that are his already. A Trump presidency is a possibility, and one that people should be terrified, but to declare it likely at this point requires something beyond your gut instinct about momentum.

Seriously. He needs voters that neither McCain nor Romney was able to get, while losing none of the ones they already had. And he's polling worse than either of them were at this point in the cycle.

Just because you're scared he'll win doesn't mean he's omg totally going to win.
posted by showbiz_liz at 10:50 AM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

Card Cheat, that picture is amazing.

Room317, Hillary's social media team is unbelievably on point right now.

Bibliowench, tonight calls for a top-shelf Indica alternating with a high-CBD strain.

You know, when I was out protesting Bush in the early aughts I honestly believed we were at the low point, presidentially speaking. 2001 me's head would explode from 10 minutes of this convention.
posted by Gaz Errant at 10:50 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

I think he has this one in the bag.

I disagree. The steam is peaking now, the ugly-minded and nutjobs who have been waiting for something like this got real active weeks or months ago, the dem side is just getting fired up. Campaigns are more than message and candidate, they must react to curveballs and events. Trump is proving at this convention he and his people are real, real bad at that.

Could he win? Perhaps, if a double earthquake hits both coasts and no one in the big liberal cities can vote, just Texas and a bunch of other southern/conservative states. Or if somehow the other side makes several big mistakes. But he hardly has it in any kind of bag. The best he can hope for tonight is a slight righting of the ship, he's not going to unify the country with the most amazing speech of all time. Even money says he makes things worse. And the Cruz thing might not go away- Cruz drew media heat, he can do it again, he could function as a shadow third party candidate.
posted by vrakatar at 10:50 AM on July 21, 2016

Democracy has changed irrevocably because of social media. No idea how, but it's funny how all those people and websites who've been writing about celebrities and reality tv instead of politics for the past decade may have the most insight right now whereas the Washington Post is all 😕
posted by Potomac Avenue at 10:51 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

The Psychology of Why Americans Are Afraid of Historically Low Crime Levels
posted by cooker girl at 10:51 AM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

The Writers of Idiocracy Are Planning Anti-Trump Ads Starring Terry Crews

I take it back, apparently that's an old article and no longer true.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 10:52 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

So 538's election forecast has the likelihood of victory at 61% Clinton, 38.9% Trump today.

I realize a lot of things play into that and it'll change over time, but still. Ugh.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:52 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Okay, I'm guilty of overstating the case. Mea culpa, I'm a little on edge these days for some reason.

I am seeing Donald Trump unleash a naked, hateful fury of the kind I have never seen before in at least recent politics. He's inviting the American voter to join in on whipping that woman, and the weaklings she represents, and inviting them to indulge in authoritarian fantasies.

And I really don't know how they will respond. I don't know if the electorate has the backbone to firmly reject that force. I'll leave it at that.
posted by argybarg at 10:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

The "oh god how can we be here hillary is so FUCKED" contingent was around in 2012, too, telling us that Obama was utterly fucked, and in 2008 they told us that America was responding so primally to Sarah Palin that Obama was fucked then too.

I really think it's mostly leftover trauma from 2004. The combination of not understanding how anyone could re-elect Bush with the ascendant political blogosphere's publishing of exit polls that turned out to be wrong left a lot of scars on liberal brains that basically expect Democratic losses all the time, especially when things seem to be going well.
posted by Ragged Richard at 10:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

I take it back, apparently that's an old article and no longer true.

Say it ain't so! I was so looking forward to those. Where'd you see the news that it's not happening anymore?
posted by Gaz Errant at 10:54 AM on July 21, 2016

The "oh god how can we be here hillary is so FUCKED" contingent was around in 2012, too

Another parallel all of this has to the Rob Ford Saga is how the utter constant insanity of it and outrage fatigue contributed to an atmosphere where everything - and I mean EVERYTHING - that happened was spun by panicked lefties (including me) into a potential triumph for Ford. "He ran groin-first into a fire hydrant? What a humanizing moment! Voters will love it! Fancy-pants John Tory would never lower himself to running into a fire hydrant! WE'RE FUCKING DOOOOOOOMED!!!"
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:55 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

And regarding Trump's NATO comments - he just needs to get people to feel like NATO are a bunch of deadbeats, even if the people feeling that can't properly define the purpose of NATO or find a single Baltic state on a map. And even if they can, they just need to feel like the US is getting somehow ripped off by NATO. It's just another part of the "establishment" for them to be angry about - and Trump's going to fix that.

Yes, many people in America don't particularly care what NATO is or what it does, and the critical question for an American nativist is "yeah, well, what has NATO done for me lately?" Given an overall subsidence of the perceived threat of Soviet conquest, along with the fracturing of news sources into partisan echo chambers, NATO risks being cast as America's thankless and unnecessary entanglement with the outside world by some branches of the media.

Heh, Googled it and most NATO members are in fact falling short of their expected contributions. Of the Baltics, only Estonia is meeting them.

Yeah, let me respond to that by telling you what Newt Gingrich said this morning on CBS. First off, he had a couple of factual inaccuracies -- claiming, for instance, that only two countries in NATO have met their 2% GDP defense quota, when it's actually five as of 2015 (Poland, Greece, Estonia, USA, and UK). He also elided the fact that Estonia is one of those five countries, and he claimed that 40% of Estonia's population is ethnically Russian (no, it's about 25%). And here: "When pressed on whether Trump and the U.S. would come to the aid of countries like Estonia in the case of a Russian invasion, Gingrich said he too 'would think about it a great deal... Estonia is in the suburbs of St. Petersburg. The Russians aren't gonna necessarily come across the border militarily. The Russians are gonna do what they did in Ukraine,' he said. 'I'm not sure I would risk a nuclear war over some place which is the suburbs of St. Petersburg.' When asked whether he believed Trump meant to terminate the NATO agreement, Gingrich said he believed the GOP nominee wanted to have a 'very serious conversation about us being the people who defend people who won't defend themselves.' "

...Really, dude? Really? The Estonians are so freaked out by the possibility of a second iron curtain that they have compulsory military training for every able-bodied male adult. The training lasts eight to eleven months, and once you are trained you stay on the reserve defense force. Their total reserves are 219,000, over 16% of the population. And as of 2010, 94% of the population supported compulsory military training.

So the takeaway here is that for the Trump camp, even a country that DOES meet its military expenditure obligations and DOES satisfy Trump's stated demands can still be brushed into America's wastebin.
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 10:55 AM on July 21, 2016 [46 favorites]

I take it back, apparently that's an old article and no longer true.

Say it ain't so! I was so looking forward to those. Where'd you see the news that it's not happening anymore?

Terry Crews says there won't be any 'Idiocracy'-themed ads attacking Donald Trump after all
posted by Mister Fabulous at 10:56 AM on July 21, 2016

I really think it's mostly leftover trauma from 2004.

For those of us who were adults during the 2000 election that was also a massively scarring experience.
posted by winna at 10:56 AM on July 21, 2016 [25 favorites]

> So 538's election forecast has the likelihood of victory at 61% Clinton, 38.9% Trump today.

NYT also has a good forecast page (they currently have her at 75%) that also includes comparisons to several other forecasts (including 538). I can't say how much better/worse it is, but it is a different perspective.
posted by noneuclidean at 10:57 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Yes, many people in America don't particularly care what NATO is or what it does, and the critical question for an American nativist is "yeah, well, what has NATO done for me lately?

At which point you google the names of NATO soldiers who died in combat in Afghanistan.

There is plenty of fodder with which to chip away at Trump's support in America's military culture.
posted by ocschwar at 10:58 AM on July 21, 2016

The new standard for NATO and all treaties: What have you done for us lately?
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 10:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I have no context for this clip, but is having Hillary walk out Steve Austin to give Trump a Stone Cold Stunner also a possibility?

In the best of all reasonably-possible universes, Clinton will win and the Republicans will promptly impeach her for some bullshit.

Wait, I'm not done.

And in that best universe, the response of the White House will be to hire Joe Pesci as their "attorney," in full Vinny Gambini mode. And he will just sit there and do nothing through the entire prosecution, possibly picking his nose when the cameras are on him, and offer as the entirety of his defense "Everything that other guy said was bullshit." And she still won't be convicted of whatever.

On preview, I take that back. He should also call President Camacho as a witness for some reason.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 10:59 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

And I really don't know how they will respond. I don't know if the electorate has the backbone to firmly reject that force. I'll leave it at that.

Well, keep this in mind - a large part of that electorate, for one reason or another, can see themselves in her shoes in terms of the vitriol and abuse being leveled at her. How do you think they'll react?
posted by NoxAeternum at 10:59 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

> Just because you're scared he'll win doesn't mean he's omg totally going to win.

Yeah - I agree there isn't much room for complacency, but right now, I'm not so worried that Trump will win. The Electoral College, for all its stupid flaws, is a giant safety net for Clinton this time around. Just because it can happen in a simulation 25% or even 39% of the time doesn't mean it can happen in real life - the electorate doesn't behave like a set of independent weighted coin tosses.

What I'm much more worried about is what this means for the future of politics in the USA. When we're sort of locked into a two-party system, one of the major parties totally losing its sanity and going full-racist grievance politics is not something we can afford.

That, and the inevitable surge of "We wuz robbed" after the election results. At this point, I expect impeachment proceedings to start in the House the day after the Inauguration. They're already baying for blood, and they haven't even been handed a humiliating loss yet.
posted by RedOrGreen at 11:00 AM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Not to mention that a GOP Senate, if they hold onto it, might just decide that approving Supreme Court justices just isn't something they do anymore.
posted by argybarg at 11:01 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

ok not to get all snopes on this but how could that family snapshot be from during Cruz's speech? didn't Trump enter at the end of it?

This was more clear on TV. Cruz spoke and Trump entered toward the end of the speech, right about in time for the booing (presumably a bit of coordinated theater there). Then they showed a video "My Father, Donald Trump." The picture was taken during the video--that's why all the lighting is blue and weird. Then Eric Trump spoke, which MSNBC showed with a split-screen of Donald in the box the entire time watching, not looking very happy. After that, Trump left so he could get backstage.
posted by zachlipton at 11:02 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Re: citing the 538 page: I'm not terribly scared of Trump winning. No room for complacency, but in the end I think most Americans will heed their interest in personal survival if nothing else.

But it absolutely sucks that it's even this close. And I am sincerely concerned about what's going to happen once someone more competent than Trump comes along to take control of the ugliness he has gathered.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:02 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Not to mention that a GOP Senate, if they hold onto it, might just decide that approving Supreme Court justices just isn't something they do anymore.

We should take that as a given.
posted by Artw at 11:03 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

For those of us who were adults during the 2000 election that was also a massively scarring experience.

For sure - I turned 18 that year, so it was my introduction to American Democracy! For me, though, there was something so much worse about 2004. I think it was the difference between seeing people vote for the president Bush campaigned as versus seeing them vote for the president he actually was.
posted by Ragged Richard at 11:03 AM on July 21, 2016 [27 favorites]

I'm not really worried about November, but I am worried about the smarter, competent version of Trump that has learned exactly what they will be able to get away with, and knows precisely how to turn that into victory.

THAT worries me.
posted by Tevin at 11:04 AM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

It's pretty funny that, except for here in Indiana, Pence's speech hasn't made any news beyond some bullet-point recaps.
posted by Thorzdad at 11:04 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

2000 was my first election night as well. There's a whole generation of us.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:05 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

What I'm much more worried about is what this means for the future of politics in the USA. When we're sort of locked into a two-party system, one of the major parties totally losing its sanity and going full-racist grievance politics is not something we can afford.

This. Even if Trump doesn't get elected, the reveal that Republicans are totes okay with backing a fascist racist shitheel means that this sort of rhetoric might not go away ever. That every four years there's another kick at the can for getting someone like Trump in the White House. They are realizing that the majority of their voters like that sort of extreme thinking. So even if Clinton is elected this time out, we have by no means dodged a bullet. Just this one. They've plenty more.
posted by Kitteh at 11:06 AM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

zombieflanders pointed to a transcript of an interview with trump. And the point was supposed to be that Trump would not support NATO members if they didn't pay their bills. Side stepping all of that, and donald's lack of bill payment, one line kinda jumped out at me.

Trump: "I don't want to tell you what I'd do because I don't want Putin to know what I'd do. I have a serious chance of becoming president and I'm not like Obama, that every time they send some troops into Iraq or anyplace else, he has a news conference to announce it."

So he's just going to send the troops to various countries and hope that no one hears about it? In the context of Russia, is he going to move troops in and act as unlawful enemy combatants?
posted by nobeagle at 11:06 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Tonight I'll be checking if Trump comes in sans eyebrows to the roar of the house band playing Pink Floyd's In the Flesh.
Is it too late to pass the hat and get G. E. Smith to play this? Yes? No?

Well hrmph, I posted that a few days ago and it got deleted because of bad word but it's been running through my head nonstop...it just fits perfectly with this spectacle. Perhaps they'd theatrically build a wall during his speech like the live performances just to really push the message home.
posted by splen at 11:08 AM on July 21, 2016

It's pretty funny that, except for here in Indiana, Pence's speech hasn't made any news beyond some bullet-point recaps.

Something to keep in mind. Whatever counterbalance Pence was going to provide was largely lost before it was announced.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:08 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

National elections that go one for a while and run through the Electoral College tend to force candidates to at least rhetorically bow towards consensus. Recent presidents have had to temper their rhetoric to get the electoral votes, and they've tended to keep that tempering through their presidencies.

What concerns me is what happens when the tacit social contract gets broken. Trump has not just survived hundreds of gaffes that would have taken down other candidates — they fuel him. Other candidates dress their hatred and lust for dominance in tasteful clothing; Trump flaunts them nakedly.

That's why I wonder if an unprecedented election doesn't behave in unprecedented ways. Or perhaps it's a normal election and Trump's inability and unwillingness to observe how things work will be his downfall. Not sure.
posted by argybarg at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

The former supreme allied commander of NATO responds to Trump’s comments to the New York Times:
"The one thing we know for certain about the post-Cold War international order is that it is highly complex, utterly interwoven, and not receptive to a theory of the world that bounds along like a floppy-haired golden retriever carelessly knocking over everything in its path."
posted by Kabanos at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [93 favorites]

538's election forecast has the likelihood of victory at 61% Clinton, 38.9% Trump today.

But Nate Silver has made clear that the forecast is at its least forecast-y at this point in an election year. He could introduce an additional variable and try to model convention-season noise, but that just muddies things further. For aggregate polling, come back in August.

I'm also sure there are some Dems who follow state races, look at Martha Coakley, and worry that that's the precedent: a woman in Massachusetts who represented the institutional party and lost two elections thanks to a less-than-inspiring campaign and a large cohort of male WEEI-listening Massholes voting against her. I don't think that's the precedent.
posted by holgate at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

> So 538's election forecast has the likelihood of victory at 61% Clinton, 38.9% Trump today.

NYT also has a good forecast page (they currently have her at 75%) that also includes comparisons to several other forecasts (including 538). I can't say how much better/worse it is, but it is a different perspective.

Looks about 14% better
posted by DynamiteToast at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

~What I'm much more worried about is what this means for the future of politics in the USA. When we're sort of locked into a two-party system, one of the major parties totally losing its sanity and going full-racist grievance politics is not something we can afford.

~This. Even if Trump doesn't get elected, the reveal that Republicans are totes okay with backing a fascist racist shitheel means that this sort of rhetoric might not go away ever.

Worse yet, if Trump loses spectacularly, like, utterly crushed, it's pretty certain that the lesson Republicans will take from that isn't going to be "Wow. We went too far with that shit. We really need to dial it back." It will be "We were too soft on the message. We need to be much more conservative next time."
posted by Thorzdad at 11:10 AM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

"The one thing we know for certain about the post-Cold War international order is that it is highly complex, utterly interwoven, and not receptive to a theory of the world that bounds along like a floppy-haired golden retriever carelessly knocking over everything in its path."

That's not fair at all. Golden Retrievers are nice.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:11 AM on July 21, 2016 [45 favorites]

So watching the amazing trigger discipline in the "let's respond to Cruz" department, what's the over/under for Trump to go off whatever rails the speech writers have given him?
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 11:11 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

The "oh god how can we be here hillary is so FUCKED" contingent was around in 2012, too, telling us that Obama was utterly fucked, and in 2008 they told us that America was responding so primally to Sarah Palin that Obama was fucked then too.

The main takeaway from 2012 is that the election never really starts until after Labor Day. Obama had a terrible summer that year, but a combination of more enthusiasm on his part and some unforced errors on Romney's part meant that Obama was able to pull ahead. Obama also had better on-the-ground organization.

So the summer is just a prelude. If the Trump campaign cannot get its act together by the end of August (take a look at fundraising results released at the beginning of August and the beginning of September) then it's truly game over for Trump.

Trump needs to identify and persuade undecided voters to come out and vote, and needs to do a better job than HRC.

I really don't see that happening.
posted by My Dad at 11:11 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I don't think Republicans will learn one lesson; they'll learn a few conflicting ones. That inability to agree is what let Trump drive right through.
posted by argybarg at 11:12 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

So 538's election forecast has the likelihood of victory at 61% Clinton, 38.9% Trump today.

538 is notably more positive for Trump than anyone else doing analysis. The Upshot put it at 75% for Clinton, and Princeton Election Consortium 80%. There are some reasons to think that PEC's modeling may be better than 538's, but in the end they're all just models, and it's going to be another month before they are that predictive. I suspect that 538 may well continue to indicate that the race is close, even if it's not actually that close. Personally I don't think that would be a bad thing, politically, because people need to stay scared about Trump. A 1 in 5 chance (taking the most sanguine position) of President Trump is like a 1 in 5 chance of falling off a building, an utterly unacceptable level of risk given the consequences.

I realize a lot of things play into that and it'll change over time, but still. Ugh.

Remember that the models being used are already accounting for the possibility of a swing to Trump later in the race. Although I have to say that I'm pretty sceptical about how evenly matched 538 says an election today would be, given the state level polls.

One somewhat related question, does anyone know how 538 are predicting the states where there's no polling yet?
posted by howfar at 11:13 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The best cartoons ridiculing the GOP convention — and Melania Trump’s plagiarism
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:13 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

NYT also has a good forecast page (they currently have her at 75%) that also includes comparisons to several other forecasts (including 538). I can't say how much better/worse it is, but it is a different perspective.

Ooh, scroll down on this one. It lets you simulate the odds based on different swing states going in different directions, and gives you current per-state odds for that as well.

If Hillary wins any three of the four swing states that she's given 70%-or-higher odds to win, then she wins. Period. Even if she loses everything else.

And this is before she gets the bump next week.
posted by rorgy at 11:15 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"Donald Trump might also want to remember (since his memory of 9/11 is so crystal clear) that Article 5 has been invoked only once in the long history of the treaty: in defense of the United States just hours after the attack on New York and Washington, D.C."

mic drop
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 11:16 AM on July 21, 2016 [45 favorites]

I am seeing Donald Trump unleash a naked, hateful fury of the kind I have never seen before in at least recent politics. He's inviting the American voter to join in on whipping that woman, and the weaklings she represents, and inviting them to indulge in authoritarian fantasies.

And I really don't know how they will respond. I don't know if the electorate has the backbone to firmly reject that force. I'll leave it at that.

I believe that the people who respond very well to authoritarian fury and herrenvolk shrieking will come out in droves to vote for Trump. But how many of those are new voters, and how many are the base who'd have come out anyway and would vote for a lamppost over any Democrat?

Will this new Legion of Grar outnumber the Romney voters who look at Trump's freakshow and go "no way in hell," whether they stay home or swallow hard and vote for Hillary?

Consider geography as well. To win, Trump not only needs to get his vote out but get his vote out in _specific states_. If Trump's authoritarianism resonates strongly in Oklahoma and he wins it 85-15, that's great for his pride but he'd have won there anyway. Is wearing a spiked rhetorical helmet going to help him in northern Virginia, in Florida, in suburban Ohio, in Philadelphia and Pittsburgh, in Iowa?

Even if Trump doesn't get elected, the reveal that Republicans are totes okay with backing a fascist racist shitheel means that this sort of rhetoric might not go away ever. That every four years there's another kick at the can for getting someone like Trump in the White House. They are realizing that the majority of their voters like that sort of extreme thinking.

Frankly, look at the House. A rather large chunk of their voters _do_. While his head may contain one, Louie Gohmert does not exist in a vacuum.
posted by delfin at 11:16 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

WARNING ABOUT SMOKING TOO MUCH WEED DURING THE ELECTION

I've been in pain for like the last two days because of the stupid weather, so you can bet that any contribution of mine will be THC infused

because of someone's incredible generosity I have tickets to Hamilton in Chicago in January. Post-election, it will either be triumphant or elegiac. Mulling over the latter option, I had the thought, but will we be able to get to Chicago if there's martial law.

Like, that's the stupidest stoner thought ever.
posted by angrycat at 11:17 AM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Is it 1968? Not really — but past convention video clips show controversy
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:18 AM on July 21, 2016

> One somewhat related question, does anyone know how 538 are predicting the states where there's no polling yet?

I think I heard Harry Enten say they were using historical voting trends modeled against how other states were polling at the time so they could use other state's current polling as an indicator.
posted by noneuclidean at 11:19 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

argybarg: I don't think Republicans will learn one lesson; they'll learn a few conflicting ones.

Agreed. There's a fundamental division in the Republican Party between "illegal immigration is the problem" and "Hispanic voters are the solution". It's getting harder for them to paper it over.
posted by clawsoon at 11:19 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

“One of the things I’ve been concerned about this week is we’re all sitting in our bubble, having a good laugh at this total, as you said, shitshow, but the truth is that this plays to a lot of people that he has to win to become the next president,”

I don't think the Trump has even won over the hardcore Republicans yet, much less convince anyone else with this convention. I think he might have lost votes with the convention. And the mockery has just started in earnest.

There is a large uninformed segment that wants to vote for the winner. He has played to that up until now. He is not looking like a winner right now, and they will drop him in a second when he loses that.
posted by bongo_x at 11:20 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Even if Trump doesn't get elected, the reveal that Republicans are totes okay with backing a fascist racist shitheel means that this sort of rhetoric might not go away ever.

Crazy sexist anti LGBTQ racist rightists have been dominating R politics for over a decade now. They have primaried out their moderates, in state after state. And frankly, the D base has sat on their hands, for local elections, gubernatorial elections, Congressional elections . . . you know, Moore is right that complacency is killing us. The only way to keep the loons out of office is to work every single election. I am a lot less worried about HRC winning the Presidency than what the mid terms will look like and how down ballot races will go.
posted by bearwife at 11:21 AM on July 21, 2016 [25 favorites]

> The New York Times is reporting that the Trump campaign is furiously checking Trump's speech for plagiarism...

If Trump does plagiarize anyone's speech, I hope it's Jack Palance's at the 1991 Oscars:

"Ted Cruz, [laughs] I crap bigger than him."
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:21 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Cruz talked principle, principle, principle. And then, pushed and pushed by the Texans, he admitted this is personal.

Refusing to bend the knee to a man who has insulted your wife counts as a principle in my book.
posted by straight at 11:23 AM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

Y'all gotta start warning when it's a WaPo link, I've been out of articles with them for days and then I have to go refind your link and open in incognito mode.
posted by DynamiteToast at 11:24 AM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Trump's supporters don't care if he's telling them the truth or not, they support him because of what he stands for, which, once truth is discarded, means they support him because he's basically a funhouse mirror, and these people support anything that reflects their own images back to them. A loud, brash, famous, narcissistic bully makes them feel good about themselves. So the question of whether he will win or not has nothing to do with where he stands on the issues or how he does in debates or how past political races were won or lost. The question will be answered based on one and only one metric: how many voting Americans identify with or admire loud, brash, famous, narcissistic bullies.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 11:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Dude shot a lot of footage for his future campaign last night.

That's true, but he's still got that Ted Cruz face in all of it
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 11:26 AM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

for some semi-uplifting and unifying news: both parties agree that Supernatural is a pretty good show.
posted by numaner at 11:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

538's model methodology page is here, and is pretty thorough. How it handles state's with limited polling is mentioned about half way down in the "Step 3: Combine polls with other data" section.
posted by noneuclidean at 11:30 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Y'all gotta start warning when it's a WaPo link

I try to always include the headline. Googling that should work even if you're over your limit.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:31 AM on July 21, 2016

For contrast, this is from Mitt Romney's 2012 acceptance speech.

We are a nation of immigrants. We are the children and grandchildren and great-grandchildren of the ones who wanted a better life, the driven ones, the ones who woke up at night hearing that voice telling them that life in that place called America could be better. ...

When every new wave of immigrants looked up and saw the Statue of Liberty, or knelt down and kissed the shores of freedom just ninety miles from Castro's tyranny, these new Americans surely had many questions. But none doubted that here in America they could build a better life, that in America their children would be more blessed than they. ...

My dad had been born in Mexico and his family had to leave during the Mexican revolution. I grew up with stories of his family being fed by the US Government as war refugees.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 11:31 AM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

If Donald Trump gets elected, maybe subsequent administrations will be willing to finally fund mental-health care at an appropriate level. A gal can dream, right?

... the narcissist is like an alcoholic or a drug addict when it comes to attention. He is insatiable and seeks out attention as if it were his drug of choice. He does not get uncomfortable with it, no matter how much he gets (it is never enough) or whether it is positive or negative. Narcissists generally have no intrinsic or “built-in” sense of self-worth so they rely on other people, via attention or Narcissistic Supply, to re-affirm their greatness in order to feel good about themselves.

To elicit a steady stream of attention or Narcissistic Supply from others, the narcissist projects a False Self. The False Self is an imaginary façade or mask that he shows to the world that includes what the narcissist wants to be seen as: powerful, charming, intelligent, rich, or well-connected.

The narcissist then ‘collects’ reactions to this projected False Self from spouse, family, friends, colleagues, business partners and peers. If the expected Narcissistic Supply is not forthcoming- (adulation, admiration, attention, fear, respect, applause, or affirmation) – the narcissist demands them, or extorts them. Money, compliments, a media appearance, a sexual conquest are all simply various forms of the same thing to a narcissist--Narcissistic Supply.
posted by Bella Donna at 11:32 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Imagine if California had turned Okies back at the border.
posted by Talez at 11:34 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

What time does Trump go on tongiht?
posted by MisantropicPainforest at 11:34 AM on July 21, 2016

Trick question. Trump is always on.
posted by rorgy at 11:36 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

The latest Republican convention disaster shows Donald Trump is a terrible dealmaker

I understand the desire to vent. But recriminations against wayward Republicans do nothing to get Trump elected. They only make it harder for Trump to consolidate the votes he needs to win. This is not strategy — it's stupidity.

Trump could have urged his supporters to listen politely and magnanimously to what he knew would be a nonendorsement speech. Or, if the idea of a nonendorsement was too outrageous to bear, he could have denied Cruz a speaking slot. Having Cruz's name entered into nomination would have been less damaging than this mess.

I suspect that Trump and his advisers simply misread the situation: They thought being booed off the stage would be a humiliation for Cruz and did not sufficiently consider how the episode could damage Trump.
posted by bongo_x at 11:36 AM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

>What time does Trump go on tongiht?

11:59.59
posted by Tevin at 11:37 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Talez: Imagine if California had turned Okies back at the border.

It would've been a humanitarian disaster.
posted by clawsoon at 11:38 AM on July 21, 2016

So he's just going to send the troops to various countries and hope that no one hears about it?

And when any of those thousands of troops on the ground violate their nondisclosure agreements by being loudly blown up by a landmine, they're gonna get sued so hard!
posted by nicebookrack at 11:39 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

At this point, I would love it if the DNC got the word out that nobody may mention Trump all of next week. Make the entire Democratic Convention a positive event and hope people notice the contrast.
posted by zachlipton at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [30 favorites]

How popular is Trump with Hispanic voters?

. . .most other surveys have shown Mr. Trump eking out 10 to 12 percent among Latino voters.
(NYT)

This compares with the Stockholm Syndrome.

The findings revealed frequencies of occurrence ranging from approximately 10 percent for positive feelings by hostages toward their captors to 28 percent for hostage-takers’ positive feelings toward their captives. (cited in)

Mentally, I append every sentence Trump speaks with his proclamation: Hispanics love me. It sums up his arrogance, his self-delusion and his utter chutzpah in making every statement into the big lie.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

>What time does Trump go on tonight?

Two minutes to midnight.
posted by Groundhog Week at 11:42 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

That every four years there's another kick at the can for getting someone like Trump in the White House. They are realizing that the majority of their voters like that sort of extreme thinking. So even if Clinton is elected this time out, we have by no means dodged a bullet. Just this one. They've plenty more.

This is a worrying possibility. I would say, though, that there is at least a reasonable chance that this sort of bullet will get less accurate as time goes on. Complacency based on the idea of demographic shift is never a good idea, but with the current core group of Trump-style voters shrinking at every election, I think it's reasonable to think that, if it doesn't work this time, the GOP will probably need to make at least some modifications to its approach. Of course, if Trump loses due to poor organisation and lack of money, the modifications for 2020 could just be greater competence, so there's no way anyone can relax about your concerns in the coming years.
posted by howfar at 11:43 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

What time does Trump go on tongiht?

Speakers don't have (official) set times. The list is here. Donnie should be about 10pm EDT. I'd tune in an hour or so before that.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:45 AM on July 21, 2016

> I'm also sure there are some Dems who follow state races, look at Martha Coakley, and worry that that's the precedent: a woman in Massachusetts who represented the institutional party and lost two elections thanks to a less-than-inspiring campaign and a large cohort of male WEEI-listening Massholes voting against her. I don't think that's the precedent.

I mean if we're talking about recent-ish senate races in the Northeast, it seems like the clear precedent is Clinton/Lazio rather than Coakley/Brown.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:45 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Future would-be Trumps may (depending on who runs) not have the advantage of the inexplicable-but-real cult of personality he has built over a long time (just like the one Rob Ford had).
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:46 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The only thing that makes me feel better about "but what if they start being competent shitheels?" is that Republicans have decided that competence and expertise are their enemies and have driven people who cling to those ideals out of the party, so even if Cruz is ready to go in 2020, he's still going to have a shitty bench to pull from.

I mean, the general Republican posture right now is to ask a well-informed/skilled person "Who the hell do you think you are, some kind of elite? Fuck you I do what I want!"
posted by emjaybee at 11:48 AM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Future would-be Trumps may (depending on who runs) not have the advantage of the inexplicable-but-real cult of personality he has built over a long time (just like the one Rob Ford had).

Let's see then....perhaps one of the Duck Dynasty guys? Steven Seagal? oooh! Chuck Norris!
posted by Existential Dread at 11:48 AM on July 21, 2016

EVERYTHING - that happened was spun by panicked lefties (including me) into a potential triumph for Ford. "He ran groin-first into a fire hydrant? What a humanizing moment! Voters will love it!

Memories, light the corners of my mind. Misty water-colored memories of the way we were ...
posted by octobersurprise at 11:50 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

DNC speakers

Kaine and Booker are listed, Vilsack is not. Something to read between the lines there?
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:50 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The question will be answered based on one and only one metric: how many voting Americans identify with or admire loud, brash, famous, narcissistic bullies.
Yes, but the ones who aren't white will still be looking over their shoulders. That's why I can't forget Kanye West's promise/threat to run in 2020. Yeah, he could even do it as a Republican...
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:51 AM on July 21, 2016

With so much drama in the RNC it's kinda hard being T-R-U-M-P.
But I, somehow, some way keep comin up with unthinkable shit for every single news day
May I, kick a little something for the D's (yeah)
and, make a few racist remarks as (yeah!) I breeze, through
Ten in the evenin and the party's still jumpin cause Romney ain't home

I got delegates in the convention center gettin rules on
and, they ain't leavin til Friday mornin (Friday mornin)
So what you wanna do
I got a phone with Tinder and my closeted friends have Grindr too
So turn off the lights and close the doors
But (but what) we don't love them voters, yeah!
So we gonna do a line to this
Poll's up, D's down, while you motherfuckers cry to this

Rollin down the street arresting illegals and launching America's nukes!
posted by Talez at 11:52 AM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

The plot thickens: Democratic PAC Files FEC Complaint Over Melania Trump's RNC Speech

"McIver's involvement in the speechwriting is a violation of campaign finance law because she has received no compensation from the campaign but is an employee of the Trump Organization. "
posted by Tarumba at 11:53 AM on July 21, 2016 [32 favorites]

Re: Convention bounce:

convention messages end up overlapping and may cancel out each other. Another potential explanation lies in the increased polarization of the electorate. It is possible that partisans are so much more committed to their candidates now than they were before and there is a much smaller persuadable electorate

Or maybe enough people are getting news from the internet, and having conversations there in and finding new political commentary and analysis (both professional and amateur) much faster than tv/radio can provide it, that the post-convention "that speech was awesome" surge fades faster, because everyone has access to the detailed analysis of "that speech" - and comparisons of it to the last hundred years of political speeches.

Or it's just that we have access to the complete story now, so the initial bounce, carried by supporters who are interested and vocal, is quickly overshadowed by people who take longer to make up their mind (as in, longer than 4 hours), and have seen the rest of the speeches, not just the handful of soundbites that fit into a half-hour news show.

Thirty years ago, wed've only seen highlights of the convention, and maaaaaybe a transcript of one or two speeches. Ingraham's speech would be mentioned (and maybe the "nazi salute" would get a photo, but would quickly be dismissed as just a wave caught at the wrong moment); Van Etten's speech would be ignored, except for maybe a line about "ultimate ringmaster;" Cruz's speech would be mentioned as shocking, but a paragraph or two of "Freedom! Conscience! Freeeeedoooommm!" quotes wouldn't give the full impact of the snub. Pence's speech would get lots of attention, with selected bits being quoted all over the place to show how Trump's selected such an awesome VP who's going to shore up all his weak points.

(Of course, that'd only work in the campaign's favor until Trump saw those articles, and had to insist that he has no weak points.)

The feelgood followup of the rousing speeches is smaller and over quicker now, because we have plenty of other political news to follow it. Even people who don't draw their news from the internet are affected by it - their coworkers and family heard something on Facebook and they read an article about fact-checking some of the claims, and so on. Doesn't matter how much effort they spend tracking down new info; the afterglow fades quicker now.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 11:54 AM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

> The plot thickens: Democratic PAC Files FEC Complaint Over Melania Trump's RNC Speech

That story ends with "However, the ideologically divided FEC is often deadlocked on issues, rendering the oversight committee toothless."
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:54 AM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Classic Meredith
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:54 AM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

Michael Moore and Bill Maher (tentatively, more as an expressed fear) now join the group of Trump Victory Predictors led by NOTMeFi's Own Scott Adams and this guy in February.
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:54 AM on July 21, 2016

Like Elizabeth Warren, Vilsack would set off sirens in Trump's reptile brain. He's a quiet, doughy-looking beta male and Trump will long to humiliate him in front of the world. Again, how that will play will depend on whether you align with the bully or not.
posted by argybarg at 11:55 AM on July 21, 2016

vilsack, Perez, and Castro a re barred from speaking by the WH. (Presumably unless they're the VP nom). So don't read too much into that.
posted by dismas at 11:57 AM on July 21, 2016

Cruz: fairly complicated. He would not endorse because Trump insulted his wife. But he also implies that if Trump loses, he was there standing tall against the loser. But he is running for reelection to Senate and many in Texas pissed at his non endorsement. And there is now Rubio, again in the game, running for the Senate but he endorsed. Then there is the Trump son who might be interested in politics but like Bush now has soiled name should Trump lose and drag down fellow Republicans. In sum: a total mess and for once, odd as it seems, the Democrats seem to have a united and functioning party going into the election.
posted by Postroad at 11:58 AM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

by what metric is Vilsack a "beta male?"

vilsack and Perez are barred from speaking by the WH.

~~* the more I know!
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:59 AM on July 21, 2016

The plot thickens: Democratic PAC Files FEC Complaint Over Melania Trump's RNC Speech

The Trump campaign is basically The Birth of a Nation crossed with an episode of Chucklevision.
posted by howfar at 11:59 AM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The one thing with all the chortling (some of it from me) about the impossibility of the Republicans winning the presidency anytime soon is that eventually, I want another party to get elected. Not that I won't campaign the fuck out of trying to stop them. But the idea that a single party ends up controlling the whitehouse for the next hundred years disturbs me greatly. I want principled conservatives who I disagree with on many things, but who do not believe in tearing down the government. I want to see conservatives who laugh in the face of Grover Norquist and say that for a strong military, we do need money (even if I think that they money should be spent elsewhere).

I want a loyal opposition. I don't want a shit show that scares me greatly.
posted by Hactar at 11:59 AM on July 21, 2016 [35 favorites]

Hopefully not too much is made of that accidental Nazi salute. There is plenty in Donald Trump and his party to be wary of (and even scared of). This was just a stupid accident.
posted by beau jackson at 12:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

by what metric is Vilsack a "beta male?"

I'd go one step further and ask that we retire this type of rhetoric entirely, in honor of Milo's permaban from Twitter. It's an utterly meaningless and demeaning classification.
posted by Existential Dread at 12:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [58 favorites]

> The Strange Politics of Peter Thiel, Trump’s Most Unlikely Supporter

Forget Trump: Peter Thiel Is So Dangerous and Fascinating You Have to Watch Him Tonight
posted by homunculus at 12:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Is Christie maybe just trying to position himself for a pardon when the Bridgegate shit hits the fan?
posted by under_petticoat_rule at 12:03 PM on July 21, 2016

by what metric is Vilsack a "beta male?"

He has a reputation, at least, of being a quiet, un-flashy sort of Midwesterner, not a status-oriented individual and a bit of a policy nerd. The sort of person Donald Trump sees as a weakling.
posted by argybarg at 12:03 PM on July 21, 2016

And you're right, I should be very careful when projecting through Donald Trump's eyes. The little that I know of Vilsack, I like. But I like people who are reserved, thoughtful and self-effacing. And "beta male" is fine with me, I'm one. But I'm happy to retire that designation.
posted by argybarg at 12:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Almost nobody is still making up their mind imo. The rest of this election is about turnout. Can trump get evangelicals out of the house by scaring them into voting their lizard brain? Can he stop scaring Lations long enough to keep them home in Florida? Can Clinton (hopefully via a VP pick) get the Black vote out in those key swing states? The polls are just noise that self-fulfill to either depress or elevate certain demos (particularly among educated urban voters, who read 538).
posted by Potomac Avenue at 12:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Hopefully not too much is made of that accidental Nazi salute. There is plenty in Donald Trump and his party to be wary of (and even scared of). This was just a stupid accident.

It is actually sort of touching, the way she realises what she's done and then tries to make it look like she was pointing. Because we've all done that at some point in our lives. Just not normally on live TV. Or with a Nazi salute.
posted by howfar at 12:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

by what metric is Vilsack a "beta male?"

He's not constantly spewing racist and sexist garbage. Might have feelings.
posted by Lyn Never at 12:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

I reall don't think most people do reflexive Nazi salutes, really. It's quite strange.
posted by Artw at 12:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

Yeah, like, how many times in your life have you waved? And how many times did it accidentally turn into a Nazi salute?
posted by The Card Cheat at 12:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [30 favorites]

Hactar: But the idea that a single party ends up controlling the whitehouse for the next hundred years disturbs me greatly.

I wouldn't worry about that too much. There are plenty of divisions in the Democratic coalition. In this election, some of them are being brought into the coalition simply because of the awfulness of Trump. Bloomberg and Sanders are not natural bedmates; to a lesser degree, nor are suburban married white women and Black Lives Matter, or Hispanic Catholics and pro-choice supporters. Etc. The Democratic coalition is fragile enough, it's just not as starkly split as the Republicans are right now.
posted by clawsoon at 12:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Forget Trump: Peter Thiel Is So Dangerous and Fascinating You Have to Watch Him Tonight

Sam Biddle, formerly a writer at Gawker, which Thiel means to bankrupt, wrote this piece. I like it.

It’s a testament to Thiel’s contradictions that he’s so poorly understood even back home. In Silicon Valley, the tech sector was amazed when Thiel backed Trump as a party delegate — aberrant behavior in a community that sees itself as essentially open-minded and tolerant. How could a California futurist, who co-founded PayPal and beat every other VC in town to Facebook, support Stone Age politics? Thiel, who was born in West Germany, was a lifeline to startups founded by and employing people from a variety of ethnic backgrounds — and now supported a presidential candidate who’d like to make life considerably harder for many of those same people.

In truth, extreme ideology was old hat for Thiel by the time Trump’s 2016 campaign began; he’s been a strong donor for both Ted Cruz and Ron Paul. Thiel gave hundreds of thousands of dollars over multiple campaigns, going back to at least 2009, to support Cruz, the Texas senator who pledged to make his opposition to gay marriage “front and center” in his presidential campaign and proposed a constitutional amendment to preserve bans on the practice. During the 2012 campaign, Thiel donated over $2 million to a Paul-supporting Super PAC.

Thiel has also postured as a libertarian, and even as his ideology shifts toward something more nihilistic — The Economist now calls him a “corporate Nietzschean” — he continues to rail against government programs like Medicare and Social Security. Meanwhile, he is chairman and co-founder of Palantir Technologies, a mass-surveillance-software company that makes a good deal of its money selling to the government; Palantir’s clients reportedly include the Department of Defense (including the NSA and various military branches), the Department of Homeland Security, the FBI, and the CIA. Thiel is, inexplicably, pro-monopoly. And don’t forget that Peter Thiel believes death is nothing but a bug in the feature set of mankind, and one he can buy his way out of.

What, if not ideological incoherence, could make Thiel a better pairing for Trump, for whom free trade is bad, but corporate interests are good; military spending is good, but military intervention is bad; immigrants are bad, and he married one? Voters love Trump’s wealth and crazed chatter — Thiel is just one more “self-made man” with bombastic theories to drive them wild.

posted by Rustic Etruscan at 12:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [30 favorites]

Let's be fair, none of us have been in her position. If you were called up to speak the praises of a fascist strongman, you might reflexively nazi salute too
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

There is no way that American politics moves forward with just one party, none. Either the Republican party will change itself to be an actual competitor again, the Dems will fracture until two new parties emerge, one of the tertiary parties will grow to fill the void, or the remnants of the Republican party will reform into a new party of some kind.

It's because of they way our voting works. If the democrats were the only party that actually got people elected, it would mean that winning the nomination wins you the election. It wouldn't take long for some narrowly defeated challenger to realize that they might be able to beat them if they leave the party. There would be a lot of like minded 2nd place finishers from the primaries, and those folks would likely form the new opposition party.
posted by VTX at 12:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

That story ends with "However, the ideologically divided FEC is often deadlocked on issues, rendering the oversight committee toothless."

I just love that they are getting so caught up in their lies because clearly McIver did not have anything to do with the speech. She just took the heat because she is a loyal employee and possibly $$$

Even if nothing comes from that complaint, they are forcing them to do all kinds of mental gymnastics to cover up or justify their lies!
posted by Tarumba at 12:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

> Last night Gingrich subtly threatened to criminalize dissent.

Transcript. Closest thing I was able to find to what you're claiming is "Donald Trump will show zero tolerance for people calling to the death of police officers." He set himself up for saying what you're claiming, for instance

Pew Research finds that only 9 percent of Muslims in Pakistan view ISIS favorably.
Unfortunately, 9 percent is 16 million people, and that is just one country.

could have led to a call for ISIS-favorers in the US being deported or jailed, but did not.

You did say "subtly threatened", but with all the talk of the constitution and rule of law, it was awfully deep subtext if there at all. I realize who these people are and what they represent, but some of them are pretty careful about sounding like actual Americans.
posted by morganw at 12:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I think she probably did just mean to wave, but on the other hand, actual, swaztika-tat-bearing Nazis are loving Trump. This is the disadvantage of letting Nazis hang out in your party, you see, you suddenly have to be careful that everything you do might look like you, too, are a Nazi.
posted by emjaybee at 12:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

Another way to say it is that threat of the Republican party is the only thing keep the Democrats together in one party. And just to drive the point home I'll point out that the democrats aren't even a party here in Minnesota, they're the "Democratic Farmer Labor" party here. Functionally, it's a part of the same national Dem party as everything else but it is still kind of it's own thing and we don't talk about the democrats here, we talk about the "DFL".
posted by VTX at 12:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Oh my God that article on Peter Thiel is making me want to fight random people on the street. I am a San Franciscan and it is too much. I read the line about buying his way out of death and something deep in my psyche snapped and now I am a crazed animal filled with blood lust. I am going to have to start tormenting my Sims again to let off steam. First up against the wall: Ben Carson.
posted by sunset in snow country at 12:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Because we've all done that at some point in our lives. Just not normally on live TV. Or with a Nazi salute.

In a way, Ingraham and d'Souza were wingnut trolls for the pre-web era. Given the amount of hatred she's instigated, and the amount of money she's made doing so, she deserves to have that photo in her face for the rest of her life.

Speaking of trolls, here's Laurie Penny again, on the carnival of the shitlords and the way America feeds them.
posted by holgate at 12:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

> Last night Gingrich subtly threatened to criminalize dissent. They want to imprison their political opponent.

The Republican National Convention and the criminalization of politics

The second shocking element of the speech was the ease with which Christie essentially called for the criminalization of political disagreement. You can like or dislike the Iranian nuclear deal. But helping negotiate it, and supporting it, is not a crime. Doing that is participating in statecraft. Christie suggested that bad policy should put you before a jury ready and eager to condemn you for anything they deem mistakes.

posted by homunculus at 12:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

There's a fundamental division in the Republican Party between "illegal immigration is the problem" and "Hispanic voters are the solution".

Those are not innately at odds. I expect there are a lot of first-to-Nth generation Hispanic immigrants who also want there to be a rationally devised, evenly applied legal immigration path, and that oppose the actions of those who would circumvent it.

It's the Republican rhetoric that is based in naked racism that, I'm sure, turns many otherwise conservative Hispanic voters away from the party.
posted by chimaera at 12:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Well, if you'd like to see something from a GOOD convention, Comic-Con San Diego starts today and has a "Video-On-Demand" site (free but requiring registration until the Con ends and $5/month after) which is doing a "live feed" of interviews and floor-walking right now.
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:19 PM on July 21, 2016

Speaking of political parties, I think it is possible for the DNC to move further to the center and become the new conservative party, Bernie's new whatever movement to become the new left-wing party, and the GOP to ride off into the sun.

Not the sunset, but the literal actual sun, fueled by the endless furnace of their own hatred.
posted by Tevin at 12:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

I read the line about buying his way out of death and something deep in my psyche snapped and now I am a crazed animal filled with blood lust.

On the plus side, Thiel won't succeed, so envisioning his future disappointment is kind of soothing. He deserves nothing but scorn and ridicule for writing this kind of shite:

Since 1920, the vast increase in welfare beneficiaries and the extension of the franchise to women — two constituencies that are notoriously tough for libertarians — have rendered the notion of “capitalist democracy” into an oxymoron.

posted by Existential Dread at 12:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Kayleigh McEnany on CNN is really awful. They can't find any pro Trump people to comment that aren't so obnoxious? I swear she is going to make people vote against him.
posted by bongo_x at 12:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Thiel basically doesn't understand why being super-wealthy doesn't entitle him to be King so anybody who finds themselves making common cause with him is suspect to begin with.
posted by Pope Guilty at 12:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

If the democrats were the only party that actually got people elected, it would mean that winning the nomination wins you the election

I've lived my adult life in places where that was mostly the case. (I'm sure there are areas where the reverse is true.) It's not untenable, it just changes the priority election.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I swear she is going to make people vote against him.

And that's bad why?
posted by cooker girl at 12:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Seriously. He needs voters that neither McCain nor Romney was able to get, while losing none of the ones they already had. And he's polling worse than either of them were at this point in the cycle.

Romney got a lot of flack from the right for screwing it up or whatever--not going 'true conservative' enough--but It's quite possible that his campaign was the high-water mark of what the Republican Party can do in a national race now.

November will tell us a lot. But I think the idea that Romney's campaign was indeed the high-water mark of the Republican Party in the post-Bush era is perhaps the most likely way this era of politics will be summarized in history books 20 or 40 or 60 years from now.

If the Republican Party could change, it might be different. They seem capable of doubling down but not changing in the fundamental way that is needed. As long as they are still capable of capturing 47% of the national vote, they won't see much reason to change. But drop that down to 30% or 35% for a cycle or two and things will look a little different.
posted by flug at 12:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I'd tune in an hour or so before that.

Wow. All I know is, I am too old for this hate-watching shit.
posted by aught at 12:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Yeah, if I found myself at a point in my life where I was addressing the RNC (which, to be perfectly clear, could never ever EVER happen), and I was going to be on TV and everything in front of every-damn-body, and the newly-minted nominee had been on the receiving end of accusations of cozying up to white supremacists, I'm pretty sure that I would remind myself, "Self, just a note, when you're done talking, don't hold your hand in such a way that resembles Adolf Fucking Hitler."
posted by vverse23 at 12:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

I am too old for this hate-watching shit

Quoted for truth. I actively change the channel. I read accounts of this awfulness, because I refuse to experience it directly.
posted by bearwife at 12:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I've lived my adult life in places where that was mostly the case.

Me too. And yeah, it mostly works. The big danger is the endorsement of the local committee giving one of the candidates a pretty unfair advantage, but things can get interesting when the various unions endorse other candidates and then you get a legitimate battle.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

My son was watching the convention last night because he believes in knowing both sides of the story (and fully admits that Trump is crazypants and will be voting for Hillary; still, he needs to feel like he's giving each side a fair go) and I couldn't even be in the room for five minutes before I was raging.

Thank heavens these threads exist because otherwise I would ignore the whole thing because I just can't even.
posted by cooker girl at 12:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

don't hold your hand in such a way that resembles Adolf Fucking Hitler.

You really need to see it in motion to see how it's a full on, snappy Hitler salute. It's really not just her holding her hand that way for a moment, this is like an ingrained muscle memory coming to life.
posted by Artw at 12:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Uh oh. Hillary did a Nazi salute. She's literally Hitler now.

You guys are as deranged as 2008 Republicans.
posted by stavrogin at 12:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Thiel is an Alpha Asshole, but he makes money every time we use Facebook and PayPal, and the government pays his Palantir when we use the internet. It's not like Trump, who slaps his name on everything he does and I can avoid supporting (and have dedicated myself to since the 1980s). So he is totally capable of picking up the Alpha Asshole banner if/when Trump fails.

And in the mind of a speaker at the RNC, what they're really consciously trying to avoid is any gesture that may make them look like a Clinton or an Obama. Which is why I giggled like a schoolgirl at the explanation that said Melania "admired Michele Obama".
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump Has Faulted Staffer Who Took Blame For Melania Plagiarism Before

I wonder if the nameplate on her desk says "Meredith McIver, Chief Patsy."
posted by tonycpsu at 12:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Larry/Gerry/Terry/Gary McIver
posted by cmfletcher at 12:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Uh oh. Hillary did a Nazi salute. She's literally Hitler now.

Huh, does Hillary also have an extended history of racism and homophobia blared out to the masses from a long running radio show? I wasn't aware of that.
posted by Existential Dread at 12:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

Part of me thinks "Trump Chief Patsy" would have to be a very well-paying gig.
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:42 PM on July 21, 2016

How about this: if you don't want people conspiracy theorizing about your Hitler salute, maybe turn down that speaking request for a rally filled with crypto-fascists.

I mean, of course she didn't do it on purpose, but no one would have been talking about it had she not just said a bunch of quasi-Nazi horseshit before she did it.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

As long as they are still capable of capturing 47% of the national vote, they won't see much reason to change.

Not when they can pick off state governorships and win legislatures and rewrite district maps and inject model laws through the states. That's already diminished the Dem bench for years to come.

2020 is the year that the long-view institutional GOP salivates over: their ideal scenario would have been an institutional GOP president in that year; their Plan B is a Clinton win and four years of intransigency to undermine and then defeat her, accompanied by the kind of gerrymander that guards against demographic shifts for the best part of the decade. Their Plan C probably involves Trump getting bored (and/or impeached) and Pence taking over.
posted by holgate at 12:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

>I mean, of course she didn't do it on purpose, but no one would have been talking about it had she not just said a bunch of quasi-Nazi horseshit before she did it.

also if he didn't profess to reading LITERALLY HITLER at his bedside
posted by Tevin at 12:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Animated gif

Maybe only in private, maybe only ironically, but she totally Heils Hitler on the regs.
posted by Artw at 12:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

I'm loving how the Republican commentators are trying to spin this Cruz thing as being to Trump's advantage and unifying with the base, while not realizing that they're admitting they still don't even have the base on board. They're not even trying to pretend that the convention is bringing anyone else in.
posted by bongo_x at 12:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Vox: Donald Trump’s nomination is the first time American politics has left me truly afraid, Ezra Klein - "Back in February, I wrote that Trump is the most dangerous major candidate for president in memory. He pairs terrible ideas with an alarming temperament; he's a racist, a sexist, and a demagogue, but he's also a narcissist, a bully, and a dilettante. He lies so constantly and so fluently that it's hard to know if he even realizes he's lying. He delights in schoolyard taunts and luxuriates in backlash.

He has had plenty of time to prove me, and everyone else, wrong. But he hasn’t."

Crooked Timber: Check Your Amnesia, Dude: On the Vox Generation of Punditry, Corey Robin - " Instead, the pundits and experts were keen to establish the absolutely unprecedented nature of Trump’s irresponsibility: his recklessness when it came to NATO, his adventurism, his sheer reveling in being the Bad Boy of US Foreign Policy: this, it was agreed, was new."
posted by the man of twists and turns at 12:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

That was before a prominent white supremacist ended a speech with a Bellamy salute.
posted by Pope Guilty at 12:49 PM on July 21, 2016

Nobody told Team Trump, clearly.
posted by Artw at 12:49 PM on July 21, 2016

Stavrogin, do you really not see the difference in context? Like, the ideological differences in both parties?
posted by Tarumba at 12:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

by what metric is Vilsack a "beta male?"

Well, a beta particle is an electron moving at relativistic speed. Is Vilsack known for his negativity?

Carrying on with nuclear physics puns, Canadian PM Justin Trudeau is a gamma male, a highly energetic beam of sunshine.

Trump is an alpha male: carcinogenic helium.
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 12:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [28 favorites]

For Harriet's Kimberly Foster has an interview with Rev. Leah Daughtry, the DNC CEO. The positive focus has me optimistic about the DNC's ability to empower and mobilize the party's base in ways that don't resemble an angry mob.
posted by mixedmetaphors at 12:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Problem is, even Stravrogin does, the media will not.
posted by VTX at 12:52 PM on July 21, 2016

Wow, Artw, that gif.

Someone should splice that in with Peter Sellers in Dr. Strangelove.
posted by Existential Dread at 12:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

On the bright side, the Illinois Republican Party sent a delegate packing who literally used the handle 'whitepride.'
posted by zachlipton at 12:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Stavrogin is arguing the "salute" itself means nothing. And that's true. The thing is, the picture sums up the rest of what is going on -- the way Trump has been blatantly race baiting (as well as hateful to almost every other minority), demagogic, emitting one Big Lie after another, and signaling his affinity to every strong man dictator out there. He's a modern fascist, and he is energizing all the other modern fascists and haters. So, in this context, that picture conveys a whole hell of a lot, while HRC "saluting" conveys nothing other than that she waves at people.
posted by bearwife at 12:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Couple comments deleted. stavrogin, just cool it, you've made your objection, people disagree, fine. If you want to talk about moderation, bring it to the contact form or MeTa, not on the blue.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 12:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I hear you, I just think that when holocaust survivors are comparing Trump to Hitler themselves, this might be an exception to the rule.
posted by Tarumba at 12:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

From upthread: Forget Trump: Peter Thiel Is So Dangerous and Fascinating You Have to Watch Him Tonight

I haven't finished that Intercept piece that was linked, but searching it, it doesn't seem to mention this creepy organization that Thiel is scheduled to speak to in September, the "Property and Freedom Society." "But beyond the libertarian academics, economists, and business leaders from across Europe and the U.S. who attend and speak at its conferences, the Property and Freedom Society has welcomed white nationalists, including several of the most prominent white nationalists in America. "
posted by dnash at 12:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

This will surely win the election.

I'm sorry, are we not allowed to note a gesture that encapsulates the career of someone who has been a boil on the arse of American political life ever since she and d'Souza were fulminating about "campus sodomites" and outing members of the Gay-Straight Alliance at Dartmouth in the 80s?
posted by holgate at 12:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Watching the gif a few times, I kind of feel like she knows exactly what she's doing. Look at the expression on her face when she waves/salutes; kind of a pursed-lips "ain't I just a little stinker?" smirk.
posted by The Card Cheat at 12:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Crooked Timber: Check Your Amnesia, Dude: On the Vox Generation of Punditry, Corey Robin - " Instead, the pundits and experts were keen to establish the absolutely unprecedented nature of Trump’s irresponsibility: his recklessness when it came to NATO, his adventurism, his sheer reveling in being the Bad Boy of US Foreign Policy: this, it was agreed, was new."

Thank you for this, which took a thing I've been thinking through this election cycle and fed it some historical context which I'm too young to provide myself:

A lot of these pundits and reporters are younger, part of the Vox generation of journalism. Unlike the older generation of journalists, whose calling card was that they know how to pick up a phone and track down a lead, the signature of this younger crew is that they know their way around J-STOR.

Many of them have read the most up-to-date social science as well as the best history, from Ira Katznelson to Eric Foner and so on. Bouie, in particular, is among the most talented and learned of his generation. His articles, even when I disagree with them, are well-researched and grounded in the latest scholarship.

Yet so many of them seem to lack the most basic gut impulse of any historically minded person: if you think something is unprecedented, it’s probably not.

posted by rorgy at 12:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

The best part is the recovery "Heil er hello! I mean hello." Like everything else about the convention, the bumbling is way more damaging than the fascist content. Because fuck, if you're going to be a fascist that's kinda a prerequisite right, you have to at least be strong and effective otherwise you're less Il Duce and more Rufus T. Firefly.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 12:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

I'm reminded of the "Heil-- hail the Wehrmacht, I mean the Bundeswehr" line from Tom Lehrer's "MLF".
posted by tobascodagama at 1:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

A great quote from Tarumba's link:

One of the things people used to say about Hitler when he rose to power in the early 1930’s was that he was saying it like it is,” my dad told me over the phone from Tel Aviv. “They thought he was a bit of a clown, with his big speeches and over-the-top showmanship, but they also admired his ability to say what everyone thought, but didn’t dare say out loud.”
posted by bearwife at 1:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [35 favorites]

Not Rufus T Firefly but no less apt
posted by wabbittwax at 1:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Those are not innately at odds. I expect there are a lot of first-to-Nth generation Hispanic immigrants who also want there to be a rationally devised, evenly applied legal immigration path, and that oppose the actions of those who would circumvent it.

No, they're not innately at odds, but I hate the way that this gets weaponized: "All you LEGAL immigrants should resent people jumping the line!"

Because I'm a legal immigrant, and I find everything about the process of immigration frustrating and terrifying, and while in theory I MIGHT be able to get behind stronger/better/faster immigration procedures, eventually I always come back to feeling a sense of solidarity with immigrants no matter how they got to the US - and I know that I have a lot of privilege for an immigrant (being white and anglophone) I can't help feeling that blowback against illegal immigrants always ends up targeting legal ones too -- like how North Carolina passed that law that you had to have it marked on your driver's license if you're not a citizen!
posted by Jeanne at 1:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

bearwife: So, in this context, that picture conveys a whole hell of a lot, while HRC "saluting" conveys nothing other than that she waves at people.

To us. To the people who believe that the Nazis were leftist - they have "Socialist" right in their name! - it's Clinton's armwave that conveys that stormtroopers and concentration camps and etc. are right around the corner.

But seizing on either handwave is preaching to the choir; they're the only ones who won't roll their eyes. Steve King's comments on the "white race" strike me as much more useful if you want to point out the racism that happened at the RNC.
posted by clawsoon at 1:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Watching the gif a few times, I kind of feel like she knows exactly what she's doing.

Context of a wave is important, sure, but as noted, it is also about non-verbal communication to a significant number of audience members in the convention (and outside) who are sympathetic to white supremacist ideas. We see you, hear you and want to reach out to you.

When it come to Nazi salutes, it's the audience that damns the candidate, just as much as the candidate himself and his guest speakers.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 1:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Comic-Con San Diego starts today and has a "Video-On-Demand" site

I am going to have to start tormenting my Sims again to let off steam.

These are very good suggestions.

Some homework before Trump's speech that Chris Hayes just posted on twitter: convention speeches from GWB '04, Buchanan '92, and Nixon '68.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

The concept of "illegal" immigration was racist bullshit from the beginning:

See the Chinese Exclusion Act
posted by Zalzidrax at 1:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Jeanne: I can't help feeling that blowback against illegal immigrants always ends up targeting legal ones too

Yeah, somehow they never have a big push to round up illegal Canadian immigrants.
posted by clawsoon at 1:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

But seizing on either handwave is preaching to the choir; they're the only ones who won't roll their eyes.

I'd say it's comic relief. The spectacle of unbridled racism and hatred at the RNC is pretty hard to bear witness to, so when someone whose ideology fits in quite well with actual fascist beliefs unintentionally does a Hitler wave for a brief moment, there's value in capturing that moment and laughing at it. Yes, it's for the choir, but I don't see it as preaching -- more like giving them an air conditioner and some water so they can get through a long day of rehearsal.
posted by tonycpsu at 1:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

C'mon, guys. The only reason anyone is even blinking at Laura Ingraham's gesture is all the other batshit fascism and racism going on at this convention. You all make way too much out of silly things like context. Sheesh.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Just dropping in to mention that Paul Ryan fixed that intern picture and it's much better now.
posted by carsonb at 1:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Man, that wave. Yeah, the beginning looks like a Nazi salute. Doesn't look deliberate, especially since the rest looks like she realized what she had done and tried to cover.

Convention's been filled with fascistic speeches. This feels like a visual reminder of that. Not that we needed one.
posted by zarq at 1:14 PM on July 21, 2016

To the people who believe that the Nazis were leftist

I have to say, this is the kind of thing that makes me want to just give up, or at least punch a wall, whether it's because of the ignorami who don't know any better because they thought history class was stupid and uncool, or the cynical right-wing flaks who spread deliberate misinformation.
posted by aught at 1:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

So, in this context, that picture conveys a whole hell of a lot, while HRC "saluting" conveys nothing other than that she waves at people.

The still shot of Hillary with her arm out tells you nothing; that could be the middle of a princess wave, elbow locked, hand swishing. Ingraham's motion was very much like a Heil Hitler going out.

Does anyone have a video or GIF or Hillary's "Nazi salute"? The only sources there are Daily Caller and a parody site, so the perception does not seem to be widespread.
posted by msalt at 1:15 PM on July 21, 2016

Because I'm a legal immigrant, and I find everything about the process of immigration frustrating and terrifying, and while in theory I MIGHT be able to get behind stronger/better/faster immigration procedures, eventually I always come back to feeling a sense of solidarity with immigrants no matter how they got to the US

I'm in that position, because any conversation with Americans-from-birth citizens makes clear how little they know about their country's immigration system, even as they get to vote for the people who determine it. It's the one area of government where they're mostly pig ignorant. Oh, and all those 'are you a citizen or an illegal immigrant?' conversations, too.

But seizing on either handwave is preaching to the choir

Ingraham fancied herself to be the telegenic right-wing gobshite of choice for this election cycle. Now if she tries to broaden her range beyond her own radio show and Fox News, there's an animated GIF.
posted by holgate at 1:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"Self, just a note, when you're done talking, don't hold your hand in such a way that resembles Adolf Fucking Hitler."

"Don't make a Nazi salute, don't make a Nazi salute, don't make a--d'oh!"
posted by EarBucket at 1:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Eponysterical.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:16 PM on July 21, 2016

Yeah, somehow they never have a big push to round up illegal Canadian immigrants.

San Francisco is full of undocumented Chinese immigrants and also a lot of undocumented Irish. Even at the peak of Pete Wilson's immigrant bashing in the 90s, with Minutemen patrolling the desert, no one expressed the slightest concern about yellow or white "aliens."
posted by msalt at 1:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Ingraham is a shitpile in heels but yes, I do have a hard time believing that she is a card-carrying Stormfront member. Her speech bothered me more than her gesture.
posted by delfin at 1:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

corb,
The Washington delegation is in the RNC doghouse. They're not having our bus leave until right before convention showtime to keep us from talking to reporters.

Well, apparently our state's delegation lead was in full-blown true believer mode, anyway. Word is she had to be dragged away from Cruz after screaming at him that he was a traitor to the party.

Have you heard anything about this on the ground?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:19 PM on July 21, 2016

I'm in that position, because any conversation with Americans-from-birth citizens makes clear how little they know about their country's immigration system, even as they get to vote for the people who determine it. It's the one area of government where they're mostly pig ignorant.

This seems to be even true of politicians. They keep spouting off about "just go home and come back legally" as though illegal immigrants are just lazy people who couldn't be bothered to fill out some paperwork. Our legal immigration system is a mess.
posted by zachlipton at 1:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Bruce Bartlett (of the Reagan and Bush I administrations) on the current state of the Republican party.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Crooked Timber: Check Your Amnesia, Dude: On the Vox Generation of Punditry

I'm glad someone's pointing out the amnesia. Trump is a new thing in many ways, but the Dubya administration ended only 8 years ago and had a lot of the same elements. The Tea Party is even more recent and is clearly an evolutionary ancestor of Trumpiness. The fact that Trump can make Bush, and many of the teabaggers, look reasonable by comparison doesn't excuse the forgetfulness of what the GOP has done. I don't mind explaining to a clueless college student on Reddit why the Bush years were a very low point for the country, but the pros should know better and should be keeping all of this in perspective.
posted by honestcoyote at 1:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Lock and load, folks. Get your popcorn ready.
posted by delfin at 1:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I can't imagine why anyone would seize on the gesture to prove how much the Trump phenomenon is deeply racist and fascist. What proves that is what Trump has blatantly said, and how enthusiastic others of that ilk are about him. The gesture itself proves nothing, but it nicely summarizes what's going on.
posted by bearwife at 1:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Trump's waffling on NATO has prompted Lindsey Graham to declare that Vladimir Putin is a "very happy man" (via TPM).

While I disagree with Senator Graham on most everything, I've really respected that he has stood up to Trump in a way that Ryan, McConnell, et al. have been too cowardly to do. Ironic that the man who holds Strom Thurmond's seat is the one noting the racism and xenophobia of Republican nominee.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

bearwife, that's what's so frustrating about the whole thing. CNN (my office plays it on the wall across from me) keeps focusing on the ephemera, the gestures, the bluster, the gaffs, and says absolutely nothing about the actual substance of the event.
posted by rebent at 1:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

> Bruce Bartlett (of the Reagan and Bush I administrations) on the current state of the Republican party.

I really like that, contrary to a lot of "what's gone wrong with the GOP?" hand-wringing I've seen lately, he owns up to the fact that the party he is (was?) a part of has been driven by hate since at least the 1960s.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 1:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

In all honesty, I don't think Ingraham gave a Nazi salute.
This convention absolutely earned her plenty of mockery and ribbing for it, though. But, like Melania's plagiarism, it'd be nice if we didn't see any serious fixation on it when there are far more serious, awful things going on here.
(But she still totally deserves the mockery.)
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

(No disrespect intended to the minority of Republicans like corb who seem like reasonable folks.)
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 1:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

In all honesty, I don't think Ingraham gave a Nazi salute

I strongly dislike her but I tend to agree with you. I think she was going for either a wave or a point to the crowd and she ended up taking the worst element from each and it came off looking like that.
posted by splen at 1:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

> I really like that, contrary to a lot of "what's gone wrong with the GOP?" hand-wringing I've seen lately, he owns up to the fact that the party he is (was?) a part of has been driven by hate since at least the 1960s.

Yeah, but nothing about anything Reagan did to help the process along.
posted by The Card Cheat at 1:33 PM on July 21, 2016

November will tell us a lot. But I think the idea that Romney's campaign was indeed the high-water mark of the Republican Party in the post-Bush era is perhaps the most likely way this era of politics will be summarized in history books 20 or 40 or 60 years from now.

For some number of years the Republican party has been a coalition of factions held together by an "establishment" and relying on votes from the "base" (assumed to be more or less Christian, suburban-to-rural, and middle class at a minimum). It's assumed that the base will vote however the establishment says to vote, which frees up the establishment to make expedient deals with whatever faction is on the upswing (e.g. the Contract on, um, for America people in the 90s, the Tea Party Patriots in the last decade) in order to reach a majority.

Romney's failure was a sign the coalition itself was collapsing. The much-publicized post-mortem was an accurate analysis, but the establishment failed to do anything useful with it. This is worth probably a couple decades' worth of doctoral theses, but a few truths are obvious:

First, the base isn't as large or as healthy as it used to be, and demographics are changing in such a way that it's likely to both shrink in number and become even more geographically concentrated than it already is, reducing its power to affect national elections.

Second, the establishment is increasingly feckless. Part of playing to the base has always been selling a lie — establishment Republicans believe more in deregulation and big business than rank and file voters do, but they've always been able to get people to vote for that kind of platform. Part of that ability relied on the smoke filled rooms and pliable press that would have produced an establishment candidate with at least a chance of getting elected. Four years ago they produced Romney. Oops. This year they had Jeb, sort of a poster boy for fecklessness, and Rubio, sold as "popular" without any actual grassroots popularity, and who also proved himself an utterly non-viable candidate through a single policy reversal on immigration that left both minorities and the Tea Party furious. Neither candidate managed to amass any enthusiastic following, and there went the establishment's main and backup plans.

Third: while the postmortem spelled out a way back to a viable coalition, nobody actually did anything to beat back the thing that lost the last two elections: the idea that the problem wasn't growing the base, the problem was that they were just Not Conservative Enough. Not Conservative Enough is what booted Boehner. It's what caused the shutdown. It's what doomed McCain, and imperiled the party in 2012, leaving them with Romney as a last best (or least worst) choice because nobody else even wanted to risk it. Republicans are getting caught up in the lowest level battles for house seats (where Not Conservative Enough can actually change the outcome of a primary for a safe seat), and they're making the last, probably most crucial error:

They all assume their coalition is larger than it is. So, if you're Cruz you assume that there's really a large base of people who are ultra-conservative in both the religious and political senses; if you're Rubio you assume there's still a base that does what it's told to do; if you're Jeb you assume you have the same base your brother did. Some of it is epistemic closure at the upper levels of the party, but a lot of it is just "the lurkers are with me by email." And at the ground level it's really easy to live a life where you never encounter anybody unlike you, so people tend to assume that all the people they don't see on a daily basis have the same values they do.

To loop this back to what we saw last night: Cruz didn't just make one bet, he made two. Obviously he bet that Trump will lose. Less obviously, he bet that the fact the establishment hates him won't hurt him in four years. Why not? Well, (A) he can also see that they're increasingly feckless, and (2) he thinks Not Conservative Enough will be a viable in a Trump-style campaign that doesn't even try to appeal to the base. I think Cruz assumes that the next time around it will be every man for himself, and his campaign for that started last night.
posted by fedward at 1:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [32 favorites]

Since Ivanka is speaking tonight and looking to overturn stereotypical views of working women, CBS has given us a little flash back to her father's views oh so long ago, in 2008.

Also, though I doubt the RNC attendees care, Trump is getting plenty of criticism, including from McConnell, over his reckless NATO comments to the NYT.
posted by bearwife at 1:34 PM on July 21, 2016

There's a non-zero chance that Trump's security briefing will include a bit of "Hey, Don, we have very specific evidence of your back-door collusion with Putin. Don't make us use it."
posted by yesster at 1:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

>The plot thickens: Democratic PAC Files FEC Complaint Over Melania Trump's RNC Speech

>"McIver's involvement in the speechwriting is a violation of campaign finance law because she has received no compensation from the campaign but is an employee of the Trump Organization. "

I've pointed out before that one of Trump's "innovations" is using his own paid company staff, rather than hiring outside, dedicated, trained, experienced political staffers, as the backbone of his local campaign staff in various states across the U.S., and presumably as his national campaign staff, too. This has been routine throughout his campaign.

Presumably they have lawyers etc etc etc and have figured out a legal way to do this. Likely, all they have to do is have the staffers track time spent on the campaign and then bill that through to the campaign. Then the campaign reimburses the company for that time. Or they enter the amount as a donation from the company to the campaign. Or whatever. Point is, there should be some legal way to do this, if you work it right. In previous FEC disclosures, folks have been curious about why the campaign is paying Trump companies fairly large amounts of money. Arrangements like this are likely to be a big part of those amounts.

Of course, this is the Trump campaign and so literally anything is possible. Maybe Trump just hollers "Do this!" "Do that!" "Fetch me this!" "Slap some kind of a speech together for Melania - and hop to it!" and such out of his office door, and people just do it by reflex because that is what they always have, and nobody has thought it through further than that.
posted by flug at 1:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

I can only hope at this point tonight ends up like the end of The Wave where Ron Jones gets up in front of the assembly, displays a picture of Hitler and booms out "I am not your leader. HERE IS YOUR LEADER!"
posted by Talez at 1:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Ugh. You guys. Work is super busy, and I'm saying fuck it and going out drinking tonight, because I can't deal with the Donald. Did I miss anything? Is Big Bird going to be Hillary's running mate? Has anyone spontaneously combusted yet?
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 1:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Yeah, but nothing about anything Reagan did to help the process along.

Baby steps, I guess?
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

> Did I miss anything?
newt gingrich exploded into bats
posted by Tevin at 1:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [56 favorites]

Michael Moore thinks Trump is going to win.

I don't agree with Moore's conclusion, but I agree with his reasoning. Complacency is going to create an American Brexit. Maybe the EVs will prevent a Trump presidency, the system restrains the mob (what an ironic road we've tread since 2000!), but all of those voters and rally attenders will still be there tomorrow. They will be there throughout the Clinton presidency, and after.

Best people start planning for the long-term instead of going, "oh ho ho, demographic shifts will inevitably keep them out of the White House, all of those angry disaffected blue collar white people will gamely go back to what they were doing before."
posted by Apocryphon at 1:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Lock and load, folks. Get your popcorn ready.

snort. The Full Buchanan.

I always though the Dream GOP Ticket would be Pat Buchanan and Alan Keyes. Piss EVERYONE off.
posted by mikelieman at 1:49 PM on July 21, 2016

What Happened When a Muslim Tried to Explain Shariah at the RNC

Full disclosure: I made it about 20 seconds into the Christiansplaining before I had to turn it off in disgust. Maybe one of you lot will get further.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

From upthread someone mentioned that 30 years ago we would have only seen clips of these convention speeches, but I remember when the conventions were broadcast live all day on every channel and it was a big thing. I remember my parents crying while watching the Democratic convention in 1968, while we were on vacation. That was another rough year.

[The other 24-hour news extravaganzas I remember fondly from childhood were the Watergate hearings and Bobby Fischer/Boris Spassky chess championship - both broadcast live on PBS. We were weird kids.

(I was out of the country for the impeachment proceedings) .]
posted by maggiemaggie at 1:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

I'm sure Trump has every plan on still eking out as much money as he can from this presidential run. He said during the last election that he could run for president and turn a profit and he trying to do just that. He did get called on his 'self-financing' which were actually loans that I'm sure he planned on getting the best interest rate he could get legally. So now he's going to bill for use of his properties and his staff at the highest rates possible. And the lawsuits that will be engendered by any oversight in to his shenanigans will cost the government millions. He's planning on billing the campaign for any staff he sees fit to use as 'contractors'.

He is the just that kind of litigious asshole.

I noticed that in his tweets he always says 'if' I am elected while his children and other minions say 'when' he is elected. Interesting, I still think he is scamming with only a half-hearted interest in winning. Or win but still get to play billionaire on TV.
posted by readery at 1:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Again, if you wish to see GOOD convention content, the Comic-ConHQ site has a LIVE interview with Nichelle Nichols right now.
posted by oneswellfoop at 1:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

flug, I think that last statement is likely closer to the reality. It is also an egregious violation of all the rules that were put there for legitimately good reasons.
I'm friends with some folks who work in Bernie Sander's local Senate office and one thing I will say is that they are scrupulous about tracking time and activities and being abundantly clear about what they are doing as employees in that capacity versus on their own time or for any other entity. That is how it should be.
posted by meinvt at 1:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Presumably they have lawyers etc etc etc and have figured out a legal way to do this.

Based on what I've seen, I'd say that they didn't bother checking. This is amateur hour. I feel that anyone who wants a career in managing campaigns past this year is staying the hell away, and the Ringmaster is still under the delusion that he's in control, while in reality, it's the clowns.

Consider that their first instinct when the plagiarism thing came up was to blame Hillary Clinton for fabricating a non-existent controversy because Mrs. Trump is a woman -- or something.

I've seen this before. There's no real 'executive management team', and the people at the top

(1) Don't know what they're doing RUNNING A CAMPAIGN

and

(2) Don't have any seasoned pros to provide context and useful counsel ( "Don't do that." )
posted by mikelieman at 1:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Shit, sounds like any number of software sole-props and startups I know of...
posted by mikelieman at 1:55 PM on July 21, 2016

Moore's map has Trump winning every Romney state along with Michigan, Ohio, PA, and Wisconsin. Pulling that off would require a level of broad appeal and organisation that is completely absent from the Trump campaign right now.

I don't think Trump will win, but honestly, with this election, with the times we live in right now, I don't even think those things matter anymore. Certainly not organization- Trump has gotten this far by spending an unprecedented low amount of money and manpower.
posted by Apocryphon at 1:55 PM on July 21, 2016

I have story about hand gestures that look like Nazi salutes!

A few years back, we had a big assembly at my school. We had a new principal at the time.

Now, our school chaplain was a lovely, guile-less Unitarian who leaned hippie. He was everything you'd want a Christian to be - really lived "do unto others" every day of his life.

Well, at this assembly welcoming the new principal, he suggested everyone in attendance needed to send positive energy to the new principal. He suggested everyone raise their right hand and send positive thoughts and prayers to the principal. I gasped. I said to a fellow teacher "does this look like what I think it looks like?" He nodded, ashen-faced. We both spread our fingers open and half raised our arms hoping some of the people around us would get the hint.

A chunk of the student clearly understood the optics. There was a lot of uncomfortable tittering (and some obnoxious laughter) as the students complied with the instructions. The new principal looked mortified.

I noticed that our PR guy was taking pictures during the event and asked my fellow teacher "you don't think he's going to put pictures of kids making the Nazi salute online do you?"

Sure enough, 30 minutes later, there was a photo of six smiling children with their arms raised on the front page of our website. Wisely, the new principal had it taken down within ten minutes.

Our poor chaplain was appalled when he realized how it looked and did a months worth of chapels on antisemitism and loving people of all backgrounds. Really good guy, just didn't think through how that particular gesture looked out of context.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [34 favorites]

The old cassettes that explain Mike Pence: Donald Trump's running mate learned everything he needed to know about politics from behind a studio mic.

The Odd Couple: While Trump Openly Cheated on Ex-Wife, Pence Called for Criminalizing Adultery
posted by homunculus at 1:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I don't even think those things matter anymore. Certainly not organization- Trump has gotten this far by spending an unprecedented low amount of money and manpower.

All that tells you is it might not matter. And it really might not. But the general election is fundamentally different to the primaries, and it's also possible that all the accepted wisdom about how campaigns are won might reassert itself in this context.

I'm not downplaying the threat of Trump. There are a number of conceivable ways he could win. But I think it's easier to convince people of the threat he poses if we state it as accurately and precisely as possible.
posted by howfar at 2:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

For the record (and I don't know why this seems significant to me, but it seems on topic with some of the plagiarism jokes), four score and seven years ago (1929) was the stock market crash leading to the Great Depression.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 2:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Pre-release copies of Thiel's speech tonight indicate that he will openly talk about being gay and proud. And that he will be taking the stage right after Jerry Falwell.
posted by codacorolla at 2:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

In another unpleasant bit of counter-programming to the RNC, Roger Ailes just resigned as CEO of Fox News. Shock waves.
posted by RedOrGreen at 2:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

For the record (and I don't know why this seems significant to me, but it seems on topic with some of the plagiarism jokes), four score and seven years ago (1929) was the stock market crash leading to the Great Depression.

Are we... in the process of electing the anti-FDR?
posted by Apocryphon at 2:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Work program: Build a Wall! Social program: Intern the illegals!
posted by stolyarova at 2:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wait wait wait, Cruz gave a speech about voting your conscience and "voting up and down the ticket" to defend freedom before "giving your loved one a final kiss goodbye," and didn't say vote Trump? Isn't that implicitly endorsing Clinton?
posted by Kevin Street at 2:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Will Thiel talk openly about being a white supremacist and proud, or being a misogynist and proud? I hope the Log Cabin Republicans put out a statement in protest to Thiel. What a crap person. I wish he were straight so I had less in common with him.
posted by yesster at 2:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Stolen from a friend: Peter Thiel is the Log Mansion Republican
posted by tonycpsu at 2:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

I wish he were straight so I had less in common with him.

I think all carbon-based lifeforms have similar concerns.
posted by howfar at 2:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

Michael Moore thinks Trump is going to win.

For reasons which seem to be, basically, "I think he's going to win." I mean, I don't know if Trump's going to win or not and neither do you, Michael, but Jesus Christ, if you're going to make predictions try to back them up with something other than gut feelings.
posted by octobersurprise at 2:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Jesus Christ, if you're going to make predictions try to back them up with something other than gut feelings.

Why would you expect Michael Moore to make such a drastic reversal of approach at this point in his career?
posted by howfar at 2:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

You're right. It's obviously paid dividends in the past.
posted by octobersurprise at 2:18 PM on July 21, 2016

Moore's map has Trump winning every Romney state along with Michigan, Ohio, PA, and Wisconsin.

Just to drive home how ridiculous this is: the last time those four states all voted R in the same presidential election was 1984, in Reagan's landslide re-election year. That was also the last time WI voted R in a presidential race.

For MI and PA, the last presidential R win was 1988: Bush Sr. vs. Dukakis.

I see no indication of those trends changing.
posted by gimonca at 2:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Isn't that implicitly endorsing Clinton?

Cruz said in that press conference clip that he would definitely not be voting for Clinton. I suppose he will vote for Gary Johnson. Or write himself in.
posted by mrjohnmuller at 2:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I think Cruz will either write in his own name or end up voting for Trump anyway. He's not going to publicly endorse a candidate running as pro choice.
posted by Drinky Die at 2:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Cruz is voting 100% Batboy Ticket for 2016
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 2:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I'm not linking it, because Breitbart. But they currently have an article titled

***2016 LiveWire*** TX Delegates Confront Cruz: ‘Your Word Is Your Bond’

My irony meter is broken.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 2:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

So we already got the backlighting + dry ice, how the Orange One going to make his entrance tonight? Jetpack? Monster truck? What will the soundtrack be? I'm thinking "Also Sprach Zarathustra" but I could also see him using "Ride of the Valkyries." A slim chance he might use "O Fortuna," but I think he's going to keep the cryptofascist theme going.
posted by entropicamericana at 2:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Complacency is going to create an American Brexit.

From where? Perhaps from white liberals in filter bubbles who think minorities will do the heavy lifting (and endure the longest lines and most harassment and intimidation) as long as they themselves show up in November. But I don't see that from the Clinton campaign. And if there's anything likely to blow away those cobwebs, it's the candidate who'll be selling the darkest timeline tonight.
posted by holgate at 2:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

> What will the soundtrack be? I'm thinking "Also Sprach Zarathustra" but I could also see him using "Ride of the Valkyries."

Way too highbrow.
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

He's coming out to Jack White's High Ball Stepper
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 2:31 PM on July 21, 2016

People often seem to forget that a lot of perfectly legal immigrants are completely denied voting rights.
posted by srboisvert at 2:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He even gave a nod to gays and Muslims and atheists and honored the family of Alton Sterling (which was met with stunned silence by the crowd.)

Just read that about the Cruz speech. Huh. Yeah, I imagine that would've been met by silence.

What's next, Cruz follows corb's lead and volunteers for Clinton?
posted by clawsoon at 2:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I bet Trump comes out to Real American because this entire campaign is about being pissed off that Obama humiliated him.
posted by Drinky Die at 2:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Always. Be. Trumping.
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Donald Trump: Occasionally Right
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Today's theory: Trump wants to win so that he can pull a Sukarno. He'll get Russian intelligence to lure him into an orgy with spies disguised as flight attendants, and then he'll release the footage in order to prove his manhood.
posted by clawsoon at 2:40 PM on July 21, 2016

(Although with the NATO thing this may not be the time for a song with lines about how real Americans can't let it slide when someone hurts their friends.)
posted by Drinky Die at 2:41 PM on July 21, 2016

I want him to ride in on a Segway while "The Final Countdown" plays.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 2:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

Should totally be this
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 2:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

What will the soundtrack be? I'm thinking "Also Sprach Zarathustra" but I could also see him using "Ride of the Valkyries."

You may be kidding, but...
posted by Joey Buttafoucault at 2:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

What will the soundtrack be? I'm thinking "Also Sprach Zarathustra" but I could also see him using "Ride of the Valkyries."

Stranglehold and AR-15s.
posted by Celsius1414 at 2:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

How will he step on his dick today?
posted by kirkaracha at 2:46 PM on July 21, 2016

Goosestep, probably
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 2:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

I'm kinda wondering if it would be The Man In Black, just to continue the theme of wildly inappropriate musical selections.
posted by kalimac at 2:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Here's hoping Trump's entrance is a Ballmer.
posted by PenDevil at 2:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He smashes Eastwood's chair?
posted by Artw at 2:49 PM on July 21, 2016

I love how every time Trump fucks up, people like Mitch McConnell STILL have to tip-toe around him like he's a spoiled kid they're trying to placate so he won't throw a tantrum, rather than the Republican Party nominee for the Presidency.

"Oh, he threatened to leave NATO allies to their own devices in the event that they're attacked? Well, geez, that's just a rookie mistake anyone could make. Donald's a good boy, really he is, and I'm sure once he's our candidate he'll start eating his vegetables and doing his homework."
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

That first bit of Carmina Burana that gets played in movie trailers
posted by angrycat at 2:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

This plays while Christie stands behind him holding his newly made RNC championship belt
posted by cmfletcher at 2:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

What will the soundtrack be?

3 a.m. Eternal?
posted by mikelieman at 2:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

What will the soundtrack be? I'm thinking "Also Sprach Zarathustra" but I could also see him using "Ride of the Valkyries."

Perhaps a reworking of Digital Underground's "The Humpty Dance," only with Trump instead of Hump and lots of white people. "The Trumpty Dance."
posted by mosk at 2:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

What will the soundtrack be?

Who are we kidding, we all know what it must be.
posted by mikelieman at 2:55 PM on July 21, 2016

4'33"?
posted by AJaffe at 2:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Just to really fuck with us, he'll come out to an instrumental version of "Springtime for Hitler".

Or "We Are the Champions" again because he's mad that Brian May said he couldn't use it.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

New World Order by Ministry and he comes out riding George Herbert Bush like a pony.
posted by Artw at 2:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

At this point I'm half expecting a non-ironical use of Laibach's Birth of Nation.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 2:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

New World Order by Ministry and he comes out riding George Herbert Bush like a pony.

Or perhaps Just One Fix in a moment of clarity nod to his all-consuming need for public adulation.
posted by Existential Dread at 2:57 PM on July 21, 2016

At this point I'm half expecting a non-ironical use of Laibach's Birth of Nation.

...and he's wearing one of their Bavarian hunting uniforms.
posted by Artw at 2:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Let's Have a War?
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

> Perhaps a reworking of Digital Underground's "The Humpty Dance," only with Trump instead of Hump and lots of white people. "The Trumpty Dance."

All right!
Stop whatcha doin'
'cause I'm about to ruin
the image and the style that ya used to.
I look funny,
but yo I'm makin' money, see
so yo world I hope you're ready for me.
Now gather round
I'm the new fool in town
and my sound's laid down by the Underground.
I drink up all the Hennessey ya got on ya shelf
so just let me introduce myself
My name is Humpty, pronounced with a Umpty.
Yo ladies, oh how I like to hump thee.

Apart from the part about drinking all the Hennessey, he wouldn't have to change much so far...
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

You're So Vain

American Idiot

The Earth Died Screaming
posted by kyrademon at 2:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

That's DOCTOR Brian May, Commander of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire, to you!
posted by mikelieman at 2:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Michael Moore thinks Trump is going to win.

If Moore said, "I think Clinton is going to win," would that help Moore sell more books? Probably not.
posted by My Dad at 3:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I found video of the practice sessions for tonight
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He'll come out to a biblically wrathful earthquake that will shake the very foundation of the state, and which also will be mistaken by the faithful as a sign of Godly approval.

From the rubble, beasts emerge
posted by dng at 3:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Can you imagine the music if the Republicans didn't borrow from musicians who oppose them? One continuous loop of Cat Scratch Fever.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 3:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

That's DOCTOR Brian May, Commander of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire, to you!

Quite correct! Apologies to Dr. May.
posted by tobascodagama at 3:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump is one politician who could unironically use Randy Newman's Political Science
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

> Can you imagine the music if the Republicans didn't borrow from musicians who oppose them? One continuous loop of Cat Scratch Fever.

Also the Ramones, sadly.
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:03 PM on July 21, 2016

Yeah, but only the guitar. joey Ramone cowrote "Bonzo Goes to Bitburg", after all.
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Where is Ted Nugent, anyway? Seems like he would have been a perfect fit for this convention. Oh. I'm sorry I asked! (warning: first link goes to InfoWars)
posted by The Card Cheat at 3:04 PM on July 21, 2016

Warning: Both links contain batshit
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Ted Nugent on GOP: 'I pray to God they finally rediscover their scrotum'

Is it orange and wrinkly?
posted by Artw at 3:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

batshit*

*bullshit.
posted by howfar at 3:12 PM on July 21, 2016

Do we really have to make this whole thing more unpleasant with all of the moronic doomsaying? I can't tell if it's out of a desire to look knowing or a fundamental refusal to acknowledge the fact that a certain sort of dimwitted bluster is really all you need to sway huge swaths of the electorate and game the political process in the US, but in either case there's a party out there for you if trusting gut instinct over the available facts is your thing.
posted by invitapriore at 3:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Republican high school friend of mine is saying that if people walk out, they have alternates ready to fill seats. Like the Oscars!
posted by lauranesson at 3:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Dissent: Trump’s Nomination May Not Be the Worst of It, Jim Sleeper

Watching the Republican festival of hate and treacle in Cleveland, an outraged Democrat or Independent wouldn’t know that Republicans have locked down control of the House of Representatives for at least the coming decade, no matter what happens in November.
In Ratf**ked, a potentially game-changing account of electoral skullduggery, David Daley exposes how the GOP used a massive election-districting scam to steal Democrats’ electoral prospects. A savvy journalist who encourages Republican operatives to talk frankly, Daley tells the story of a perversely legal campaign that caught Democrats unaware, despite precedents set in the 1980s.

posted by the man of twists and turns at 3:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

I found video of the practice sessions for tonight

Springtime for Donald and 'Murica
Our land is happy (no gays)
We're all just chanting, "Lock her up"
Come on, Paul Ryan, pucker up
Springtime for Donald and 'Murica
Winter for logic and class
Springtime for Donald and 'Murica
C'mon Trumpers, let's go kick some ass.
posted by Gaz Errant at 3:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

STRAIGHT OUTTA AMERICA

Sounds good to me! But then someone else would get stuck with him, which doesn't seem fair.
posted by The Card Cheat at 3:16 PM on July 21, 2016

Republican high school friend of mine is saying that if people walk out, they have alternates ready to fill seats. Like the Oscars!

That's smart, if true. Grrrr.
posted by Bella Donna at 3:17 PM on July 21, 2016

@davidaxelrod: The theme for tonight? Making America One Again.
Among the leadoff speakers: Sheriff Joe Arpaio.
You can't make this stuff up!
#RNCinCLE
posted by Mister Fabulous at 3:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Making America One Again

One what?
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

The only appropriate music for the last night of the convention is Julius Fučík's "Entry of the Gladiators."
posted by dhens at 3:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Correction, it's "Make America One Again" which, I'm not knowledgeable enough about grammar to express why that's such an awkward phrase, but it is.
posted by soren_lorensen at 3:24 PM on July 21, 2016

Making America One Again

Screaming, incontinent, fed entirely from bottles.
posted by dng at 3:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [39 favorites]

A one that is cold, obviously. A one that is not cold is scarcely a one at all.
posted by stolyarova at 3:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Sheriff Joe is very popular among people who don't have to actually experience his policing.
posted by ckape at 3:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Making America One Again

The zen koan of political slogans.
posted by peeedro at 3:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

A one that is cold, obviously. A one that is not cold is scarcely a one at all.

Strongbad/Homsar 2016!
posted by dhens at 3:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

As far as entry songs go, to follow along with the Republican tradition of ignoring the bulk of the lyrics, I think Trump should enter to the sound of Kanye West sing/shouting "I Am A God ."
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:27 PM on July 21, 2016

Surely the most Trump song would be Laibach's "Geburt Einer Nation".
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:28 PM on July 21, 2016

> One what?

One people, one empire, one leader...
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 3:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Making America One Again

One what?

One great place to be rich, privileged, white, male and CIS, even if you are poorly educated, poorly read, none too hardworking, and eager to pal around with dictators.
posted by bearwife at 3:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

E pluribus unum.
posted by audi alteram partem at 3:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

One law
One life
When we need to feed
In the night
One blood
We get to drain it
Bleeds you baby if you
Don't eat enough
Garlic
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

On that note, Trump/Pence is Strongmad/Poopsmith 2016.
posted by stolyarova at 3:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I um.. didn't really remember Joe Arpaio.

Here are some controversies.
posted by narwhal at 3:30 PM on July 21, 2016

Republicans have locked down control of the House of Representatives for at least the coming decade, no matter what happens in November.

This is the thing that drives me batty about the left (both the party organization like the DCCC and the doom-and-gloom lefty left). Even safe House seats aren't really that safe. Dean ran a 50 state campaign. Obama ran a 50 state campaign. Hillary Clinton has her campaign machine. But there's no organized effort to identify and pick off House seats (it's what the DCCC is supposed to be doing, but Will Rogers' joke is still true). Sure, they won't get to the point of a safe Democratic majority in the House any time soon, but they could at least have launched a credible effort for any majority at all with viable candidates by now. Instead they're still mostly whining about how hard it is and how much of a disadvantage they've got.

Stop whining and start campaigning already. There shouldn't be a single ballot without a qualified Democrat on it.
posted by fedward at 3:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

Republican high school friend of mine is saying that if people walk out, they have alternates ready to fill seats. Like the Oscars!

That's smart, if true. Grrrr.

They can stand and turn their backs to him.
posted by tivalasvegas at 3:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I guess on the "one" theme he could enter to a different Queen song.
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:31 PM on July 21, 2016

Moody video game music pick for this afternoon: Bastion - Build That Wall, Zia's Theme.
posted by stolyarova at 3:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

E pluribus unum.

Yeah, pretty sure Ex uno unum* is how you get inbreeding.

Which could explain a lot of what's going on right now.

* Correct grammar not guaranteed.
posted by Celsius1414 at 3:32 PM on July 21, 2016

Jay Smooth's take on Melania Trump plagiarizing Michelle Obama's speech. Short, hilarious, and insightful.

Glad to see Jay back making videos after his recent personal difficulties.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 3:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Making America One Again

Obviously, then, he'll make an entrance to "One is the lonliest number."
posted by octobersurprise at 3:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Making America One Again

We do what we're told
We do what we're told
We do what we're told
Told to do

We do what we're told
We do what we're told
We do what we're told
Told to do

One doubt
One voice
One war
One truth
One dream
posted by a lungful of dragon at 3:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I guess on the "one" theme he could enter to a different Queen song. yt

Maybe I'm missing the joke but I've always thought of Geburt Einer Nation as Laibach going "You fuckers wouldn't find this song so charming if it were performed in German".
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

On the Making America One again, I also keep thinking of this (start at 1 minute mark).
posted by bearwife at 3:33 PM on July 21, 2016

Why does there have to be a song? Can't there just be torches and chanting?
posted by mochapickle at 3:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

If you need something cheerier to distract you from the proceedings, you could do what I'm doing and look through the surreal psychosexual horrorscapes of deceased Polish artist Zdzisław Beksiński.
posted by cortex at 3:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Pope Guilty - yeah that Queen song has the added benefit of being totally fascist.
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:35 PM on July 21, 2016

Can't there just be torches and chanting?

That's the really, really good old days.
posted by tivalasvegas at 3:35 PM on July 21, 2016

On the Making America One again, I also keep thinking of this yt (start at 1 minute mark).

One does not simply goosestep into Mordor.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

wow what if, at the end of the night, Cruz comes out and says that Trump has convinced him with the Best Convention Speech ever and then endorses him/hands over his soul/Trump sucks his essence from his eyes.

I mean, I don't think so given Cruz's talk today, but man, that would be good tv, and that's America baby!
posted by angrycat at 3:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

If Trump doesn't enter to Too Drunk To Fuck then time itself has no meaning and might as well stop.
posted by delfin at 3:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Trump will tell the nation tonight: "I am your voice."

Horrifying thought, but it will have political resonance with the disenfranchised (not the real disenfranchised, but the straight white males who feel their power slipping away).
posted by stolyarova at 3:38 PM on July 21, 2016

Or maybe the Circle Jerks' Wonderful?
posted by Fezboy! at 3:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Here's the speech
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I um.. didn't really remember Joe Arpaio.

All you need to know about Joe Arpaio is that he'll be the single worst human being in that entire arena tonight, and that's even if they fly in Charles Manson to make a special appearance.
posted by Atom Eyes at 3:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

Hey, can someone please add "election2016" and "rnc2016" to the tags?
posted by peeedro at 3:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

If rich asshole doesn't enter to Too Drunk To Fuck then time itself has no meaning and might as well stop.
posted by delfin at 17:36 on July 21

Or maybe the Circle Jerks' Wonderful?

...ah, crap...I suck at [edit]. Sorry.
posted by Fezboy! at 3:41 PM on July 21, 2016

I wonder who leaked it?
posted by stolyarova at 3:41 PM on July 21, 2016

I wonder who leaked it?

Dang it, Meredith!
posted by AndrewInDC at 3:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

Can we get some fact-checking going on on this speech? I'm thinking it's a pack of lies but evidence would be nice.
posted by stolyarova at 3:44 PM on July 21, 2016

If he sticks to those remarks, then that's a fucking snoozer of a speech.
posted by codacorolla at 3:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump will tell the nation tonight: "I am your voice."

Oh man, the opposition ad writes itself, though. That's great. The Clinton campaign had been hammering pretty hard on the theme that "this awful man does not speak for you, don't let him" and if he says exactly the this in his biggest speech, look out. That's a great GOTV motivator. And I'm betting Clinton's team already has the skeleton of this ad in the can and is just waiting for the footage of him saying it to splice in.
posted by soren_lorensen at 3:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

This speech isn't in his natural voice, like, at all. I'm curious to see how he'll present it.
posted by mochapickle at 3:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Regarding whether Cruz's non endorsement will make a difference come November, I view it as the antidote to Ryan. Ryan modeled coming to terms with Trump while holding onto core principles, and Cruz is modeling being principled about not supporting him. That's important given all the screaming about party unity.
posted by carmicha at 3:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wasn't "join me and we can bring order to the galaxy" Darth Vader's appeal to Luke?
posted by cmfletcher at 3:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

From Trump's speech:

"We cannot afford to be so politically correct anymore."

I'm having a hard time reconciling my pacifist tendencies with all these irrepressible daydreams about punching Trump in the face.

God, it would feel so fucking satisfying. Maybe I'd join a nunnery afterwards to make up for my bad behavior.
posted by angrycat at 3:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

This speech isn't in his natural voice, like, at all. I'm curious to see how he'll present it.

I really have a hard time thinking he'll stick to it for any length of time.
posted by dhens at 3:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I would be completely shocked if Trump stuck to the prepared text.
posted by dry white toast at 3:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Hey, can someone please add "election2016" and "rnc2016" to the tags?

Done!
posted by cortex at 3:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I AM YOUR VOICE.

nice use of sudden, ominous all-caps in the transcript
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Make America Deaf, Dumb, and Blind Quadruple Amputees Again
posted by ckape at 3:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump will almost certainly go off script at some point. But I think the intention here is to take advantage of low expectations. If he doesn't shit himself in the middle of the speech he is Presidential and saved the convention. The way things are going though, shitting himself seems likely.
posted by Drinky Die at 3:48 PM on July 21, 2016

Keith Olberman: Could Donald Trump Pass a Sanity Test?
posted by Thorzdad at 3:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Oh please let him have had the taco bowl for lunch.
posted by mochapickle at 3:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The real question is, could Donald Trump pass a Turing Test?
posted by My Dad at 3:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

I AM YOUR VOICE.

[Trump's mouth gapes impossibly wide, emits endless stream of luna moths]
posted by theodolite at 3:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

Oh man, the opposition ad writes itself, though.

Yeah, just add it to the start of this one.
posted by Drinky Die at 3:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Someone made the point that the principle message emerging from each night of the convention has been nothing close to the intended GOP message. Trump would probably agree, and is the sort who will chalk that up entirely to him having not been at the helm of the show. Now that it's his turn, he will see it as his job to save the convention and I doubt he'll find the prepared text adequate to the task.
posted by dry white toast at 3:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Trump will tell the nation tonight: "I am your voice."

Il Voce, then.
posted by Grangousier at 3:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

> I would be completely shocked if Trump stuck to the prepared text.

My hope is that is the planned speech and that Trump has somebody frantically writing up a brand new one as we type. Or that he'll just decide to wing it in full.

> If he doesn't shit himself in the middle of the speech he is Presidential and saved the convention.

It's a strange thing that whenever this standard is applied to someone in the American political realm, it's always a Republican.
posted by The Card Cheat at 3:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I AM YOUR VOICE
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I'm thinking at some point he is going to pause to explain how a treasonous attack by the treacherous Jedi left him orange and balding before he goes on to announce he is reorganizing the Republic into the first Trump Empire.
posted by entropicamericana at 3:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Trump will tell the nation tonight: I AM YOUR VOICE.
posted by leotrotsky at 3:55 PM on July 21, 2016

Cruz really does make for an excellent Starscream.
posted by Navelgazer at 3:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Can we get some fact-checking going on on this speech? I'm thinking it's a pack of lies but evidence would be nice.

An Advance Fact-Check of Trump’s Remarks (obviously partisan since it comes from trumplies.com, but still)
posted by dfan at 4:00 PM on July 21, 2016

"Not being politically correct" is just code for "acting like a douchebag without repercussions, " right?
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

Nobody knows the system better than me, which is why I alone can fix it. I have seen firsthand how the system is rigged against our citizens, just like it was rigged against Bernie Sanders – he never had a chance.

My cognitive dissonance meter shattered into a thousand small pieces upon reading this paragraph.
posted by dry white toast at 4:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Whatever he says, as long as it doesn't have a horrible improvised racial epithet in it, the nation's headlines will be "TRUMP: I AM YOUR VOICE" almost without variation. Someone who knows what they're doing wrote that one.
posted by argybarg at 4:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Obviously, he should enter to "Tomorrow Belongs to Me".
posted by tobascodagama at 4:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

New speech writer, apparently... not a single utterance of the word "unbelievable". I'm betting he'll fix that, though.
posted by skippyhacker at 4:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

And how many times did it accidentally turn into a Nazi salute?

I doubt anyone who accidently made a Nazi salute would even notice unless they had to be careful about such things.

That said, I can't wait for the goose stepping by mistake incident.
I wonder if Trump supporters wouldn't see the parody in Goose Step Momma.

Oh my God that article on Peter Thiel is making me want to fight random people on the street.

In Trump's America, Bruce Lee is still alive and people will be extra vigilant to find the now in his mid 70s Lee and prove their toughness against him by beating him senseless and getting the American born immigrant out of the country.

Sadly Bruce is not alive and sadly the rest of the scenario is all to believable.

Speaking of political parties, I think it is possible for the DNC to move further to the center...

Further to the center? We all have different metrics but I consider them easily to the right of center. It would be nice if they moved back toward the center, particularly in regard to the financial system.
posted by juiceCake at 4:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

If that speech were based on any semblance of truth it might have seen featured parts in a Social Democrat's stump speech. But honestly I can't see any Republican supporting a lot of the poverty and business/employment aspects of it. I heartily expect if there's complete Republican control that removing the federal minimum wage might be first on the chopping block.

If you believe Trump, I can see why it would ultimately appeal. You're in poverty. He's going to get you a job, throw out the Mexican doing it for $7.25/hr, and bring back an element of fairness that has been missing from the American employment bargain for forty years. But we all know they aren't going to do dick about it once push comes to shove.
posted by Talez at 4:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

It's...OK, I guess. I mean, it doesn't actually say anything new. Total policy: build wall, MuslimBanLite, cut taxes, amend 501(3)(c), no trade deals. So I guess it's fine as convention speeches go, but I was half expecting something new - one new wacky idea to catch attention. Maybe they really are trying to play it safe.
posted by howfar at 4:07 PM on July 21, 2016

A few notes from the text so far:

One such border-crosser was released and made his way to Nebraska. There, he ended the life of an innocent young girl named Sarah Root. She was 21 years-old, and was killed the day after graduating from college with a 4.0 Grade Point Average. Her killer was then released a second time, and he is now a fugitive from the law.

As far as I know, this was a drunk driving death. Obviously not in any way acceptable, but Trump makes it out to sound like he shot her in cold blood for sport or something.

I have seen firsthand how the system is rigged against our citizens, just like it was rigged against Bernie Sanders – he never had a chance.

Bernie better hit back against this hard on Monday. To the extent there was any thought in his mind about pulling a Cruz, I'd have to think that having Trump invoke his name twice during his acceptance speech would be enough to make him nope out of that plan in a hurry.

Only weeks ago, in Orlando, Florida, 49 wonderful Americans were savagely murdered by an Islamic terrorist. This time, the terrorist targeted our LGBT community. As your President, I will do everything in my power to protect our LGBT citizens from the violence and oppression of a hateful foreign ideology.

I'll protect you against foreign people, while I fan the fires of domestic hate and deny you the right to marry.

My opponent asks her supporters to recite a three-word loyalty pledge. It reads: “I’m With Her”. I choose to recite a different pledge.

My pledge reads: “I’M WITH YOU – THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.”

I've liked the "I'm with her" tag, but it has mainly served to set up this line.
posted by zachlipton at 4:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Telecast officially starting up, looks like.
posted by cortex at 4:10 PM on July 21, 2016

GERD your loins!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:12 PM on July 21, 2016

Ugh I have a sick bad feeling about this speech going over really well.
posted by stolyarova at 4:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Hey, remember how the President in the Marvel universe is always the same as the President in the real world so you don't have crazy stuff like electing Lex Luthor?

How's that working out, Marvel?
posted by ckape at 4:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

They're having a field day on twitter over in Clinton's campaign.
posted by Apoch at 4:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Keith Olberman: Could Donald Trump Pass a Sanity Test?

Never mind that, can he pass a drug test? It's amazing that you can't compete in the Olympics without passing a drug test but you can be elected to the highest, most powerful office in the world.

And while I'm on that topic we have two people around 70 years old who are running for office and we don't have their medical records. That's the first thing that is done when hiring a CEO-- you give them a complete physical. At their age I fully expect they are both on at least 2 or more medications (I think the average is now 7 prescriptions.) But why on earth should we be entitled to know that? We are just lowly citizens electing our leader. A leader, I will add, who will be doing a very stressful job that requires extreme attention and peak health. That is something every ex-President agrees on-- the job is much more stressful than you know before you are elected.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:12 PM on July 21, 2016

There's nothing in there about acknowledging fundamental Republican principles, the Constitution, etc. Ted Cruz (as much as I hate to say it) was exactly right this morning in saying that Trump needs to brush up on that to be more "presidential" and appeal to the other half of unhappy Republican voters/moderates who care about that. Right now, it's clear that Trump is flailing when it comes to policy/platform/fundamentals and even just a nod in that direction could help him immensely.
posted by mochapickle at 4:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Republican high school friend of mine is saying that if people walk out, they have alternates ready to fill seats. Like the Oscars!

I was thinking they should just turn their backs instead of walking out.
posted by bongo_x at 4:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I had the day off, got a haircut, stopped off at the beach, then the liquor store. Red five standing by.
posted by vrakatar at 4:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Got my popcorn, because this is going to be entertaining. (Got my special promo Winter Soldier popcorn, because I want Bucky and T'Challa with me in spirit while I watch this.) Got my tea, because "keep calm and drink tea" is definitely part of the evening's therapy plan. Got Twitch open in one window and metafilter in another.

Got a cute otome game loaded on the iphone for when I can't tolerate another minute of bigotry and lies. I am flirting with the handsome king of a rival nation, who rescued me from bandits.

I think I'm as ready as I can get.

Wait, THIS is the song they're opening with? Um. Obviously, my tea is not spiked enough.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Band now playing Rock the Casbah.
posted by cortex at 4:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I was thinking they should just turn their backs instead of walking out.

Or cover themselves with shrouds.
posted by mochapickle at 4:14 PM on July 21, 2016

rock the casbah
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 4:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Rock the Casbah? Really?
posted by stolyarova at 4:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

When Joe Strummer heard American bomber pilots were playing Rock the Casbah while they attacked Iraq, he wept. He'd be livid right now.
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

WEEEEE Don't Like It....
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He thinks it's not kosher.
posted by tonycpsu at 4:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I assume "rock" is code for "bomb" in this context?
posted by stolyarova at 4:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

God help me, I love Awkward Republican Dancing In Funny Hats. The camera guy is on our side.
posted by mochapickle at 4:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Oh, Neil Diamond would be ashamed.
posted by stolyarova at 4:18 PM on July 21, 2016

From his speech: I have a message for all of you: the crime and violence that today afflicts our nation will soon come to an end. Beginning on January 20th 2017, safety will be restored.

Fucking fucking fucking bullshit. He has no plans, no ideas, just empty words that come out of his conman's mouth. If the suckers believe this nonsense, then they will literally believe anything. Why not just tell them that you are going to give everyone a thousand bucks after you are in office? Just promise that there will be candy and roses in everyone's mailbox on every day that you are President?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

In 2009, pre-Hillary, ISIS was not even on the map.

ISIS was al Qaeda in Iraq and started under Bush.

In fact, her single greatest accomplishment may be committing such an egregious crime and getting away with it

OMG Hills is Keyser Söze.

We must abandon the failed policy of nation building and regime change that Hillary Clinton pushed in Iraq, Libya, Egypt and Syria.

Iraq was Bush's mess. Trump supported intervention in Libya.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

welp, if Trump had any supporters left at all here in Boston, he just lost 'em after this band started slaughtering "Sweet Caroline".
posted by Old Kentucky Shark at 4:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

It's not about facts - it's about what people feel

The Word: Trumpiness
posted by homunculus at 4:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

One of my favorite little memories from that great big meetup junket I did back in 2009 is of sitting in a bar in NYC with ocherdraco and a few other folks and spontaneously drunkenly breaking into a sway-and-sing-along to Sweet Caroline when it came on the bar's sound system.

The part of me that's always yearning to find some human connection even to people with whom I disagree profoundly has been doing a lot of arm-wrestling the last few days with the part of me that resents the shit out of having that happy memory associated with this convention.
posted by cortex at 4:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

My goodness, I think if I were independently wealthy, I'd absolutely learn to be a camera guy or a staffer and stealthily sabotage their efforts like that. "Yeah boss, totally, you should wave like this. Make it really snappy and keep your fingers together." "No, you look so cute dancing! Shake it, boss!"
posted by blnkfrnk at 4:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

nothing gets republican crones shakin' their booty like 'sweet caroline'.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 4:20 PM on July 21, 2016

I have entered my convention zone: MeFi, Twitter, and Comic-Con on the PC, MSNBC on the TV. Coffee with Bailey's. Peanut butter filled pretzels.

Also the aforementioned indica.
posted by Gaz Errant at 4:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I hate it when politicians use children as props.
posted by stolyarova at 4:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Why not just tell them that you are going to give everyone a thousand bucks after you are in office?

That... that would actually be sensible policy....
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Okay guys, I have my credentials and am heading down soon. Walkout or back turn?
posted by corb at 4:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [38 favorites]

Moon.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [31 favorites]

Back turn
posted by Windopaene at 4:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [25 favorites]

It's an effective speech. If he sticks to it, he'll come out on the plus side of the convention.
posted by argybarg at 4:22 PM on July 21, 2016

Back turn, corb. Then if they try to physically remove you it might make the news. Otherwise they'll just replace you with a Trumpmind warm body.
posted by stolyarova at 4:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

I can't see the dancing as I am on the train, unfortunately. But I have been to Episcopalian diocesan conventions where there were special guest rap artists so I know exactly the awkward horror of this
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Back turn, but don't get hurt!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Back turn (optionally, with double bird-finger held aloft.) Good luck! Stay strong! You can walk out if it gets too tough, but he needs to know you disapprove.
posted by blnkfrnk at 4:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Back turn, for sure. Good luck in there tonight.
posted by Gaz Errant at 4:24 PM on July 21, 2016

Based on the reports I saw, the Texas delegation was talking walkout if Trump blasts Cruz, but probably not otherwise. I'm incredibly curious to see what happens though.
posted by zachlipton at 4:24 PM on July 21, 2016

Back turn. Best to you this evening, Corb.
posted by jaruwaan at 4:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Let There Be Peace On Earth is a hell of an ironic choice for an opening song given the tone and content of the last several days. Little girl has pipes, though.
posted by cortex at 4:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Walkouts can be replaced. Backs turned can be skipped over by the cameras... maybe. Someone is going to want to catch that on film.

Also, walking out in unison in a crowd is hard to coordinate. Turning around isn't.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I literally bought special popcorn today. Putting my son to bed now. My loins are girded.
posted by soren_lorensen at 4:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Back turn, hung head.
posted by vrakatar at 4:25 PM on July 21, 2016

Is Cruz in the building?
posted by Drinky Die at 4:25 PM on July 21, 2016

A dead Earth is a peaceful Earth
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Family Research Council? Ew.
posted by stolyarova at 4:26 PM on July 21, 2016

That poor kid - don't they have laws against using kids in the adult entertainment industry?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Back turn, chin high.
posted by stolyarova at 4:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

crime and violence that today afflicts our nation will soon come to an end. Beginning on January 20th 2017, safety will be restored.

Philippines police boast of 30 drug killings since Duterte was sworn in on Thursday [theguardian]
posted by porpoise at 4:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Back turn -- if all of ya who object remind him of how much he's disliked, he'll be more likely to sabotage himself by going off script. Best of luck.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Apparently Correct the Record was who got ahold of the speech draft and leaked it

I'll vote for back turned as well, and corb, I admire the hell out of you and what you're doing there. Stay safe.

may the Force be with you
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

As a reminder, the Family Research Council is one of the biggest anti-LGBT groups out there. Anything in Trump's speech about protecting the LGBT community is utter crap when these are the people asked to lead the pledge of allegiance.
posted by zachlipton at 4:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

Back turn, ears covered.
posted by argybarg at 4:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

argy has it.
posted by vrakatar at 4:29 PM on July 21, 2016

An Advance Fact-Check of Trump’s Remarks
posted by kirkaracha at 4:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He doesn't lower his eyes when he prays? Oh, right; he's performing for the camera, not for God.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

After Judy Woodruff interviewed Mike Pence, they got some hot takes from the other panelists, and David Brooks said Mike Pence was like "Pepto-Bismol" and meant it as a compliment.

Dude.
Dude.
Duuuuuuuude.

This fucking election.
posted by mostly vowels at 4:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Back turn, chin held high, engrossed in reading a copy of the Constitution.
posted by spinifex23 at 4:30 PM on July 21, 2016

The first speech in history to be debunked prior to being delivered.
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Back turned, ears covered, head high - rejection, not shame.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

If the Trump Whips try to remove you, go totally limp.
posted by cooker girl at 4:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

He's personal friends with God. Gets to look 'em in the eye. Lowered eyes is just politically correct bullshit.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

So he's going Full Buchanan? You never go Full Buchanan.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 4:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He just said all lives matter.
posted by stolyarova at 4:32 PM on July 21, 2016

not a bad invocation
posted by OHenryPacey at 4:32 PM on July 21, 2016

Did he just quote Spiderman's uncle Ben? Great power, great responsibility...

"Give us grace; give us courage; give us compassion, and give us hope"... wait, what convention does he think he's attending?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Give us grace; give us courage; give us compassion, and give us hope"... wait, what convention does he think he's attending?

Those aren't requests - those are their ransom demands.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

He also asked for strength to fight racism and fix an unequal justice system. Pretty good.
posted by fitnr at 4:34 PM on July 21, 2016

Instead of leaving or turning your backs, how about singing "We Shall Overcome?"
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:34 PM on July 21, 2016

Since each of our lives is equally in jeopardy, that checks out. {/}
posted by tonycpsu at 4:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Under God" was added because of scumbag McCarthyist witch hunts.
posted by stolyarova at 4:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"I'm not Cruz, I'm a different evangelical asshole." Well, at least he acknowledges that "under God" wasn't added until the 50s.
posted by Rykey at 4:35 PM on July 21, 2016

Now Tony Perkins is telling us that the existential threat to America is as great as it was during the height of the Cold War. I might agree, but the threat is coming from inside the convention center...
posted by zachlipton at 4:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

So nice of him to give the history lesson so Trump fanatics aren't caught off guard when some liberals point out that "under God" was added in their lifetimes.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:36 PM on July 21, 2016

"Donald Trump has committed to upholding and protecting the first freedom and therefore our ability to as citizens to unite our nation under God."

Also there are more feeeemales than males in the Trump organization under the Grand Negus.
posted by winna at 4:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

that ad...
Trump certainly makes me want to work harder.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

omg, are all of these people his employees?

does nobody see the conflict of interest there? who the hell is gonna say anything other than wonderful things about their thin-skinned bully of a boss?
posted by indubitable at 4:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

It's an effective speech. If he sticks to it, he'll come out on the plus side of the convention.

Probably, yeah. It has broad appeal to the people who might consider voting for him, and some good lines for repeated broadcast. It's not particularly amazing though, so it will be interesting to see if he gets the convention bounce one would generally expect, given the rest of the convention. Probably, but it might feel a little anticlimactic after all the drama, so the quality of delivery is likely to play some part.
posted by howfar at 4:39 PM on July 21, 2016

More Trump employees talking about how great their boss is. Like an entire video of them. They're all women, even a black woman. And they're going to tell us that in case we didn't notice.

This is literally a video of people praising their boss, as if the endorsement of a marketing person at one of his golf courses is what matters here.
posted by zachlipton at 4:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

I'm not going to watch this speech unless someone can put one of those goofy Snapchat faces on Trump while he's talking. Is anyone doing this? Is there a livefeed that will let me do that?
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 4:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"He's come in ahead of schedule and under budget on all of his projects" ... except for the ones that he filed bankruptcy over. But hey, the debts were forgiven, so that means he stayed to budget, right?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

"Donald Trump has committed to reinstituting Prima Nocta."
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Trump found a binder full of women!
posted by zachlipton at 4:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

That poor woman with the long hair. Her eyes are so dead as she speaks. BLINK IF YOU NEED US TO GET YOU OUT, LADY
posted by winna at 4:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Pitch-perfect song to follow that pro-woman video.
posted by Rykey at 4:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

You Shook Me All Night Long? Really?
posted by mochapickle at 4:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

You (Shook Me All Night Long)!?!? Really?
posted by winna at 4:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Corb: even though we disagree on so much, you are making me proud to be an American again for the first time since this farce of an election started.

Strength.
posted by double block and bleed at 4:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

hmm, I think "You Shook Me All Night Long" might not be a great fit with that blatant pandering to women in the video.
posted by zachlipton at 4:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Lol jinx mochapickle
posted by winna at 4:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Oh wait is it Tony Perkins? Fred Clark, the internet's resident evangelical whisperer, has been requesting for some time that we call him The Liar Tony Perkins.
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Wow, Chris Matthews just called out Manafort for saying women will vote Trump because they are concerned that their husbands aren't making enough money to support them. When your campaign manager is saying things so caveman sexist even Chris Matthews can't take it...
posted by Drinky Die at 4:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

It sounds like AC/DC with Axl Rose on vocals is playing live at the convention... or it could just be a crappy cover band that sounds remarkably like Axl Rose.
posted by My Dad at 4:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

With the music, I'm mostly surprised at this point what a shallow playlist they have; it's a four night gig and they're only playing for a small chunk of each night, in fits and starts, and yet they've been recycling the same tunes every night and within a given night. You're doing covers, fellas, it's not like you've got to develop a big setlist from scratch.

Maybe G. E. just really likes soloing on this one.
posted by cortex at 4:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Here's the speech

MY NAME IS ~~BOB RUMSON~~ DONALD TRUMP, AND I'M RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT!
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Wow, bunch of gutterbrains in this thread. Obviously it was meant in the spirit of: You Shook (My Hand) All Night Long, doing absolutely great deals, for American workers.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 4:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Pitch-perfect song to follow that pro-woman video.

Thanks for the spit-take. Nearly covered my keyboard in coffee.
posted by Gaz Errant at 4:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

When Trumpism = Trump, what else is there to talk about besides Trump?

Sure makes for a long four days of watching and listening.

Here's a new word: Trumpeteers. Trump employees pressed into singing the great man's praises to fill out airtime.
posted by notyou at 4:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

To be fair, they put together the video with the women employees and the "You shook me all night long" bit before Roger Ailes quit.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Make American thighs great again!
posted by AndrewInDC at 4:44 PM on July 21, 2016

At least they didn't play "Giving The Dog A Bone"
posted by bongo_x at 4:44 PM on July 21, 2016

It was either that or Wang Dang Sweet Poontang by Ted Nugent.
posted by The Card Cheat at 4:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

G.E. Smith gets paid the same no matter how long his playlist is.
posted by zachlipton at 4:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

There is a person in a glittery jacket with giant shoulder pads dancing right now and I was not emotionally prepared to see that.
posted by winna at 4:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Cat Scratch Fever?
posted by notyou at 4:46 PM on July 21, 2016

Anyone think they might have a song that considers women as something other than objects of lust?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:46 PM on July 21, 2016

Assuming that leaked speech is legit, there's gotta be a huge struggle backstage right now to get Trump to stick to it rather than improvising.
And I do mean yuuuuuge.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:47 PM on July 21, 2016

Just caught a crowd shot of a woman swaying to good lord this terrible blues shuffle Eight Days A Week again why and she's holding a sign that read something very close to:

TRiUMPhant elaPENCE
You're hired!
posted by cortex at 4:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Well, to be fair to the band, a competently organized convention probably wouldn't require this much musical filler.
posted by ckape at 4:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Walkout or back turn?

Back turn, but remember that this is just one more day in your protracted campaign of skewering this dayglo pig bladder, and look after your safety first. There is worse you'll get to do him yet.
posted by howfar at 4:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Anyone think they might have a song that considers women as something other than objects of lust?

Say what?
posted by bongo_x at 4:47 PM on July 21, 2016

I get the feeling G.E. Smith has been subtly playing games with his song selection all week. But so subtly that neither the organizers nor the intended audience notice.
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Anyone think they might have a song that considers women as something other than objects of lust?

She's having my baby?
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Official badge for Trump inner circle is pink triangle: used by Nazis to identify homosexuals.
posted by waitingtoderail at 4:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Trump's speech should work perfectly for him, it's well written and exactly the kind of thing he does well.

One thing I found interesting was the specific play for Bernie voters. Someone must have done the math that those are some of the people Trump will need if he has any shot at this.
posted by cell divide at 4:48 PM on July 21, 2016

They're gonna do twelve more minutes of music, aren't they?
posted by mochapickle at 4:48 PM on July 21, 2016

Is it just me or is the camera very pointedly covering the very few minorities in this crowd?
posted by 0xFCAF at 4:49 PM on July 21, 2016

This convention has been one big teenaged older brother saying "Okay, okay, I'll let you get in the car this time, come on"—vrrOOOM! "Seriously, I'll let you in this time, for real, get in"—vrrOOOM! "I'm sorry, don't be mad, you can get in, I promise I won't drive off"—vrrOOM!...
posted by Rykey at 4:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

That band has anti-soul. They are actually decreasing the world supply of funk by performing.
posted by winna at 4:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

Official badge for Trump inner circle is pink triangle: used by Nazis to identify homosexuals.

I caught that too. It appears to be the Secret Service pin of the day, albeit one with interesting symbolism.
posted by zachlipton at 4:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

omg, are all of these people his employees?

We will have to wait for the FEC complaint before we can know for sure.
posted by srboisvert at 4:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

TBogg says: Tonight Trump will hold up Ted Cruz's still beating heart and proclaim "Where is your God now?" Then ballon drop and Sweet Caroline.
posted by JackFlash at 4:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Wait, Trump is calling for overturning the ban on letting churches politically organize? Has he learned nothing from Game of Thrones?
posted by Drinky Die at 4:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

I was unaware that fundamentalists considered Deism to be a strong faith.
posted by winna at 4:51 PM on July 21, 2016

Recap:
1) Ad showing women who work for Trump, saying what an awesome boss and mentor he is.
2) Musical interlude:
* You shook me all night long
* Eight days a week
* How sweet it is (to be loved by you)

Yeah, I'm now certain I understand how much Trump respects women, and how he values their contributions to America.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Wow, Falwell quoting a Deist like Jefferson?
posted by indubitable at 4:52 PM on July 21, 2016

Trump has the best binders full of women, you haven't seen anything like these women, they are outstanding
posted by thelonius at 4:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Virginian here, when someone brags that their family has lived in Virginia since the 1600's, it really means "we were slave owners."
posted by peeedro at 4:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [77 favorites]

I was thinking today- last night Cruz implied it is okay to split the ticket. Republicans could write in Clinton or Cruz, then vote straight GOP down the line.
posted by vrakatar at 4:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I haven't watched Falwell Jr. speak before. I'm getting Dystopian Future Ben Wyatt vibes.
posted by cortex at 4:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

"Most prosperous Christian university in the world" uh I guess Notre Dame doesn't count?
posted by winna at 4:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Wow, Falwell quoting a Deist like Jefferson?

He admired his business sense.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

G.E. Smith gets paid the same no matter how long his playlist is.

or how uninspired his solo is.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Has he learned nothing from Game of Thrones?

He's learned everything from Game of Thrones. That's the problem.
posted by howfar at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

I've surprisingly liked the CNN coverage better than MSNBC.
posted by bongo_x at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2016

Like if they cut the mic right when he's wrapping up his speech and starts to sneak in a plug for the new platinum collector's edition of Cones of Dunshire it'd feel just about spot-on.
posted by cortex at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I guess Notre Dame doesn't count?

PAPIST!
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

"Most prosperous Christian university in the world" uh I guess Notre Dame doesn't count?

A Christian University bragging about being the most prosperous = beyond parody.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 4:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [44 favorites]

"Most prosperous Christian university in the world"

True fact, Liberty University gets more money from the federal government than Planned Parenthood.
posted by peeedro at 4:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [31 favorites]

He's learned everything from Game of Thrones. That's the problem.

I dunno. I think he's watching WWE while Hillary is watching Game of Thrones.
posted by Drinky Die at 4:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

How's the food at Liberty?
posted by thelonius at 4:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Jerry Falwell Jr. did not get the speaker gene. He's amazing un-enthused, looks like he's reading his speech under duress.
posted by bongo_x at 4:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Yeah, I'm now certain I understand how much Trump respects women, and how he values their contributions to America.

"Yeah, I'm always on the lookout for a future ex-Mrs. Trump."
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:57 PM on July 21, 2016

MSNBC is really enjoying spiking on Ailes tonight.
posted by Drinky Die at 4:57 PM on July 21, 2016

Really glad this guy has the charisma of a garden slug.
posted by Rykey at 4:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

That's not how you do a yo momma joke.
posted by ckape at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2016

Holy shit, Arpaio is bonkers. Can't wait to hear what he's gonna say.
posted by Rykey at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2016

It's good Falwell said clearly "we must unite behind Donald Trump and Mike Pence," because mostly he's so lackluster I can barely stay awake enough to listen.

Aww, he made a joke! How cute!

Oh, wait, his scriptwriters ran into the wonky phrasing of tonight's theme. "The only way to make America great--and one--again, is to..."

Overall, that was delightful, in the sense that I could barely open my eyes enough to cringe.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

not a bad invocation

Yes, when I went to church I was a Methodist and I do believe they walk the walk.

Tony Perkins, on the other hand is a POS. Hey Tony? Would you hire Trump do represent your "Family Values" group? Yeah I didn't think so.

Boy Jerry Falwell's voice is comical. He sounds more like a muppet than a Charismatic Evangelic Preacher.

Osama, Obama, Yo Mama? Seriously? These are the greatest threats? Boy I would love to see him in a room full of black women and tell that "joke."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2016

Wow, the delivery on that Osama, Obama, Yo Mama bit was shockingly inept. I can't tell if Falwell was actively uncomfortable reading it, or just straight flubbed it that badly.

Anyway, here's the nation's worst sheriff so I'm braced to feel way worse about everything about five minutes from now.
posted by cortex at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Sheriff Joe is wearing a handgun-shaped tie tack. Classy.
posted by zachlipton at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Arpaio's got his pointin' finger on, I see.
posted by mynameisluka at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Tuned into a mainstream broadcast for the first time this week (CBS) causing me to remember why I have avoided these: The jokers posing as journalists did not acknowledge the shocking, rancid white supremacist rhetoric.

Also, Jerry Fallwell Jr. is a terrible speaker with an appalling message.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Of course Arpaio's tie pin is a handgun.
posted by egregious theorem at 4:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

there's gotta be a huge struggle backstage right now to get Trump to stick to it rather than improvising.

I cannot imagine a world in which he stays on the script for more than a few minutes. But who knows?

As for Falwell's speech: he just implied that Trump would somehow stop liberal universities from being "Democratic voter re-education camps" and then ended with a yo momma joke. Punchline "Tell Chelsea's momma she's fired." Gah.
posted by Gaz Errant at 4:59 PM on July 21, 2016

How's the food at Liberty?

Sorry, I'm not at Liberty to tell you.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [75 favorites]

or how uninspired his solo is.

That's not his fault -- after Cruz's speech, they're vetting everything more closely now, and Smith's contract now limits him to pentatonic scales in a two octave range.
posted by tonycpsu at 4:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

(HI GUYS! I am debating between ice cream and chips with horrible yet delicious dip.)
posted by mynameisluka at 4:59 PM on July 21, 2016

We need a speaker. who knows how to say. a full sentence at a time.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

i can't help but picture Arpio in a frilly pink tutu every time i see him
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Man Arpaio is a shit public speaker, too. Why isn't this guy fired up to support his White Nationalist bro, Trump?
posted by indubitable at 5:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Didn't Joe Arpiao say yesterday he hadn't been asked to speak? Are they totally winging this? Corb, get up there and speak!
posted by bongo_x at 5:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Joe Arpaio sounds like Frank from It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia
posted by birdheist at 5:00 PM on July 21, 2016

When does the Old Timey, Irascible Frontier Trapper speak?
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

CRIMINALS PENETRATING OUR WEAK BORDER SYSTEMS
posted by winna at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Arpaio's tie pin is an actual working handgun.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

I'm starting to think the teleprompter may be messed up. Two in a row can't suck this hard.
posted by Don Pepino at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2016

C'mon, folks, where are the Pokemon Go pictures of a pikachu on the podium?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

UGH, the cries of "build the wall" are terrifying.
posted by mynameisluka at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

there's gotta be a huge struggle backstage right now to get Trump to stick to it rather than improvising.

I cannot imagine a world in which he stays on the script for more than a few minutes. But who knows?

Yes, yes, but I want odds!
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2016

The crowd is chanting "build the wall" and I am scared.
posted by winna at 5:02 PM on July 21, 2016

He kinda sounds mildly drunk.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 5:02 PM on July 21, 2016

He looks like he's about to ask the convention floor if they're his children and when he can go home.
posted by howfar at 5:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

This crowd is unbelievably tepid for a nominating convention. Applause is not coming from the whole crowd consistently.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 5:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump and Arpiao were birther buddies together. How does that not disqualify you from speaking to any audience bigger than 50 people for the rest of your life?
posted by zachlipton at 5:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I heard Falwell interviewed on NPR this morning and my first thought was Jesus, someone get this guy a cup of coffee.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:03 PM on July 21, 2016

Is Arpaio always this clumsy of a speaker? It's pretty conspicuous, a lot of stumbles and false starts and pretty clearly doubling back to reread a line he's flubbing. Maybe pretty far from his usual speaking milieu.
posted by cortex at 5:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I could really use a Jonathan Haidt, former liberal himself, op-ed right now to explain to me how this conservative shit show is evidence of the greater breadth of conservative morality.
posted by srboisvert at 5:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Joe Arpaio sounds like Frank from It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia

I think he sounds more like the Mr Plinkett character that makes those Star Wars movie reviews.
posted by peeedro at 5:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"The Word: Trumpiness" -- what struck me with absolute horror was Colbert saying that he'd coined "truthiness" more than a decade ago.
posted by epersonae at 5:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The crowd is chanting "build the wall" and I am scared.

Mother, did it need to be so high?
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

This crowd is unbelievably tepid for a nominating convention. Applause is not coming from the whole crowd consistently.

But Trump has assured us the party is completely unified. And Trump is an honorable man.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Mark Burns is back and he's even louder. Who brings back a speaker for a second goaround?
posted by zachlipton at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Why is Big E from New Day there?
posted by vrakatar at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

In contrast: I was at the 2008 Democratic Convention for Obama's nomination acceptance speech and it was ELECTRIC. People would give a standing ovation to anything and by the time Obama came out, the entire completely full stadium went apeshit even though we had been waiting in 100-degree weather for something like 12 hours.
posted by mynameisluka at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

"He never forgot to call my wife" is not a sign that he respects women. We already knew he notices women. The issue is whether he thinks they're competent.

.... ohwow; speaker changed and Pastor Mark Burns is gonna wake up the audience.

By yelling at them.

A lot.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Next up: Mark Burns, who certainly isn't gonna keep up the sleepy/clumsy speaker streak, whatever else.
posted by cortex at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He kinda sounds mildly drunk.

Nah. Did you watch last night? Those people were drunk! The Sheriff sounds like he might have had a stroke. Or maybe he is just an old man up past his bedtime. Slurry, but not drunk slurry.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

What was that word before "Democrats"? It was just a noise.
posted by howfar at 5:05 PM on July 21, 2016

Maybe pretty far from his usual speaking miliau.

Someone should ask to see his papers.
posted by srboisvert at 5:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

> Mark Burns is back and he's even louder. Who brings back a speaker for a second goaround?

Somebody who couldn't even get Tim Tebow?
posted by The Card Cheat at 5:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

More Trump employees talking about how great their boss is. Like an entire video of them. They're all women, even a black woman. And they're going to tell us that in case we didn't notice.

I didn't see this, but in my mind I'm guessing it's like this Berlusconi campaign ad, which I still think is one of the most singularly creepy things I've ever seen.

(tl;dr: it's a video of women singing "President we are with you, Thank God Silvio exists!")
posted by dnash at 5:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

This was a mistake. They thought they were getting Monty Burns.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Did someone cancel? What's going on?
posted by bongo_x at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2016

Someone tell this dude it's not capslock day.
posted by winna at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

What was that word before "Democrats"? It was just a noise.

"Race baiting"? Or did he say that after?
posted by Drinky Die at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I mean, I know that was kind of a special circumstance, but still. Sigh. There was another bonus which was that there was nobody there screaming ALL LIVES MATTER.
posted by mynameisluka at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

holy fucking shit who is this large shouting man
posted by Old Kentucky Shark at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I think Cruz will either write in his own name or end up voting for Trump anyway.

#1 quidnunc kid?
posted by orrnyereg at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

CHANTING ALL LIVES MATTER
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2016

"He never forgot to call my wife..."...a word I can't use on television.
posted by AndrewInDC at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

What was that word before "Democrats"? It was just a noise.

"Race-baiting".
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 5:07 PM on July 21, 2016

Oh, the rousing crowd chants of "All lives matter"

In case there was any doubt.
posted by indubitable at 5:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

this burns guy is certifiably insane
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

WTF black dude???? rilly???
posted by OHenryPacey at 5:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Is Arpaio always this clumsy of a speaker?

To be fair, you don't get much time to practice your public speaking when you're running a gulag.
posted by Rykey at 5:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

So earlier, we heard about how churches are terrified of the IRS if they dare speak of politics and Trump is going to get rid of all that. Now this pastor is up here campaigning for the second time this week. Doesn't seem like he's cowering in fear of the IRS.
posted by zachlipton at 5:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Pastor Mark Burns: She's afraigh, she's afraigh. she's afraigh she will NEVAh become President of the United States. (yeah I doubt that, Burns. Something tells me you have never met the lady.)

This guy is hilarious. Now he is clapping his words. Yep. Wake up call.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:07 PM on July 21, 2016

It kinda sounds like "All lies matter".
posted by howfar at 5:07 PM on July 21, 2016

Crowd cheers for poverty and desperation
posted by indubitable at 5:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Wait I thought cops had good jobs. How will getting them good jobs stop them killing people?
posted by winna at 5:08 PM on July 21, 2016

Ugh, every Black person the GOP has recruited to speak at the RNC has been of the most obnoxious, shouty-asshole type that haunt the worst kind of Black megachurches. It's like if the NAACP decided to pack their annual meeting with trustafarians named Chad who are like, really, into Ayn Rand and men's rights.
posted by Panjandrum at 5:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Trump's guy on CNN brushing off stats showing crime is down because the FBI is suspect after the Clinton investigation.
posted by bongo_x at 5:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm out. Can't watch any more of these fools channelling their bloodthirsty god.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 5:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"She will never, ever, never-ever, NEVER NEVER..."
"We are MORE THAN EVER will solve the problem TOGETHER
SHOUT TOGETHER"

Pastor Burns is leading the convention in a game of Never Have I Ever.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

ALL LIVES MATTER! ALL LIVES MATTER! AT LEAST THREE FIFTHS! AT LEAST THREE FIFTHS!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

Someone tell this dude it's not capslock day.
posted by winna at 8:06 PM on July 21 [−] Favorite added!

Perfect. I am laughing so hard now.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

ALL AMERICANS WILL HAVE JOBS
posted by sporkwort at 5:09 PM on July 21, 2016

> I bet Trump comes out to Real American because this entire campaign is about being pissed off that Obama humiliated him. yt

Charlie Pierce agrees with you: For My Money, Donald Trump Has Never Gotten Over This Event From 5 Years Ago. Remember the White House Correspondents' Dinner? The bin Laden one?
posted by homunculus at 5:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Donald Trump is not going to pander to just one race...he'll pander to everyone who's convenient!
posted by mynameisluka at 5:09 PM on July 21, 2016

CNN cut away from Burns to interview someone and I thought Lil Jon was on the stage.
posted by The Hamms Bear at 5:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

In light of Charles Kinsey today, this is in even worse taste than normal. The man didn't need a good job, he was doing his damn job when he was shot by the police for no reason. Plenty of other black people shot by the police had perfectly fine jobs too. Claiming the real problem is jobs is BS.
posted by zachlipton at 5:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [41 favorites]

Full employment, here we come!
posted by Drinky Die at 5:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Hear the cries of (those we) disenfranchised....
posted by OHenryPacey at 5:10 PM on July 21, 2016

He man race? Oh no wait...he must have said Human Race (Or as Mark Burns would put it, "HUMAN RACE."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

just relax and go with the coronary thrombosis, dude.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

He's trying to walk a fine line here, this shouty guy. I give him a credit for trying.
posted by vrakatar at 5:11 PM on July 21, 2016

To be fair that was the only time this pitifully call and response impaired crowd was able to say something together.
posted by mynameisluka at 5:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

TRUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUMP
posted by Old Kentucky Shark at 5:11 PM on July 21, 2016

Terry Crews has really let himself go.
posted by peeedro at 5:12 PM on July 21, 2016

"Annihilated States of America" is what I thought he said, and it suits his vision.
posted by gladly at 5:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Had to mute it for a phone call.

It's actually more terrifying without sound.
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I am very worried this guy will seriously injure himself with this yelling.
posted by kiltedtaco at 5:12 PM on July 21, 2016

What he was trying to do there kinda fails when you have white in your flag but not black.
posted by Drinky Die at 5:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I was seriously worried he was going to blow a gasket onstage
posted by double block and bleed at 5:12 PM on July 21, 2016

What time is the Orange One going to speak?
posted by lazaruslong at 5:12 PM on July 21, 2016

I am vicariously humiliated for this guy.
posted by mynameisluka at 5:13 PM on July 21, 2016

I will now recite all the NFL teams.
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

"I'm not gonna bark tonight"

I mean, go ahead. I think it would fit in just fine after the last guy.
posted by thefoxgod at 5:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I will now recite all the NFL teams.

For people reading this after the fact, this is actually what was happening.
posted by winna at 5:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

Rachel Maddow says she feels an increase in core strength after listening to that speech.
posted by Drinky Die at 5:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I was kind of hoping what he had for the Packers fans was the bird.
posted by ckape at 5:14 PM on July 21, 2016

Every time they get some energy in the room, they manage to let it out immediately. We just went from caps-lock pastor man to 70-something man rambling about Vince Lombardi.
posted by zachlipton at 5:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I wonder if he still has any of those little IHOP NFL helmets
posted by thelonius at 5:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"What the hell is going on here"

Yes, good question.
posted by thefoxgod at 5:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Vince Lombardi was a pioneer in breaking the color bar in football. I don't think he'd be into the current Republican Party.
posted by winna at 5:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

"...mard in anger and feah"
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:15 PM on July 21, 2016

Does this make any sense if you know something about American football?
posted by howfar at 5:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"In 2015, the relative value of $12,500.00 from 1961 ranges from $77,700.00 to $398,000.00."
posted by mynameisluka at 5:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

ok, that's all I can take, headphones are off for now
posted by indubitable at 5:15 PM on July 21, 2016

The small business sector of the economy
posted by sporkwort at 5:15 PM on July 21, 2016

I'm sorry, I just fell asleep. Can somebody please catch me up on which century we're in?
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I am very worried this guy will seriously injure himself with this yelling.

He'll be fine. He's a mega-church televangelist. Histrionic shouting is literally his job, and well continue to be so long as he can shame and bamboozle people into giving him money.
posted by Panjandrum at 5:16 PM on July 21, 2016

When is ubermensch Thiel supposed to go on? That might be the most popcorn worthy. I'm trying to decide when to head to the kitchen.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:17 PM on July 21, 2016

What time is the Orange One going to speak?

About 2 hours from this post (CSPAN has a countdown)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I liked when he had to tell the Republican Whitey McWhitersons when to chant back in the call and responses.
posted by Justinian at 5:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Does this make any sense if you know something about American football?

No.
posted by zebra at 5:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Does this make any sense if you know something about American football?

nope
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 5:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Not only is the Osama/Obama/yo mama thing insanely juvenile, Jerry Falwell Sr. died a year before the 2008 primaries started.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 5:17 PM on July 21, 2016

Is there any place I can watch this on cable sans talking head idiocy?
posted by double block and bleed at 5:18 PM on July 21, 2016

Can somebody please catch me up on which century we're in?

4th and 10.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

I'm watching the stream on YouTube with no commenters.
posted by winna at 5:18 PM on July 21, 2016

This is especially bad. Why is this man speaking, again?
posted by codacorolla at 5:18 PM on July 21, 2016

I stepped away at the beginning of the Vince Lombardi story and when I just came back he was still talking about Lombardi. Was that anecdote the majority of his speech?
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:18 PM on July 21, 2016

call and response fails are one of the underappreciated subthemes of this shamvention
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Y'know, when I divide up the types of people who are usually democrats vs those who are usually republicans, I hadn't thought to put "good public speakers" in the democrat column. But wow, the Trump campaign has gone out of their way to find speakers who can flatten the energy in a large room.

"A leader gets stuff done."

Er. No. A leader convinces other people to get stuff done, and they're happy about it.

Now he says "Trump knows how to get the best out of people - he knows how to be a teammate."

*throws hands in air*

DUDE. Getting the best out of people = leader. Teammate is someone who works alongside you.

These people have a serious vocabulary problem.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I remind you that we were promised Tom Brady, denied Tim Tebow, and ended up with this guy. That should sum up what to expect from a Trump Administration.
posted by zachlipton at 5:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

Vince Lombardi famously told his team that if they didn't like playing with gay teammates, they knew where the door was. He'd LOVE these clowns, I'm sure.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 5:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

> Osama/Obama/yo mama thing

Wait wait what I was out catching Clefairies with my kids. Is this a thing that really happened?
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I don't know about TV, dbab, but I've been streaming a straight feed on twitch, here.
posted by cortex at 5:19 PM on July 21, 2016

http://www.dumpsterfire.tv/
no talking heads.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

High Taxes. Regulations. and practically no access to credit. Ummm one of these things is not like the others.

I can tell you what leaders do, A leader gets things done. Trump gets. things. done.

So that's a philosophy of sorts. Anyone who gets stuff done could be a great leader. Hey, I got plenty of stuff done today. Who wants me as their leader?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Gawker: What Does Peter Thiel Want?
posted by tonycpsu at 5:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

This thing is giving me strong mid-level sales conference vibes in terms of the speakers and production values.
posted by winna at 5:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Is there any place I can watch this on cable sans talking head idiocy?

Can you watch online? RNC feed
posted by mochapickle at 5:20 PM on July 21, 2016

"~~That~~The one percent was all I needed"
posted by mynameisluka at 5:20 PM on July 21, 2016

@double block and bleed

PBS NewsHour is just livestreaming, no commentary
https://youtu.be/YMCn4O4yZQQ

Not sure if a local PBS station would offer the same feed?
posted by narwhal at 5:20 PM on July 21, 2016

I don't know you, "motivational speaker," I'm sorry in the abstract that you had surgery but I don't really care, this is not motivating.
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:20 PM on July 21, 2016

Alex Isenstadt, Rachael Bade, and Andrew Restuccia: “Trump taunts GOP in private donor meeting”
Kenneth P. Vogel at Politico: “‘Republican source’ leaks Trump speech to Dems”
Julia Ioffe at Politico: “Scenes From the Cruz Underground”

We’re gonna need a bigger thread…
posted by Going To Maine at 5:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

It's amazing stubble though.
posted by howfar at 5:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

The C-SPAN livestream is a good option as well.
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:21 PM on July 21, 2016

"welcome to the 1% club"? Mind-boggling.
posted by Old Kentucky Shark at 5:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I don't understand how "I was in a horrible car accident and my father died" is supposed to make me want to join his religion. It feels like more of a threat: "this is what happens to people who worship this god."
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

I'm not sure talking about how you and Trump are both in the 1% is really the line you want to take.
posted by howfar at 5:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

When Trump is president everyone will... recover from car crashes? Why is this person speaking?
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

They ran out of patriotic pictures to put behind the speakers, so they're using a football field?

OMG they ran out of people to put on stage and they're bringing in video speakers.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:22 PM on July 21, 2016

Mark Burns is the same pastor who said that Bernie Sanders "Gotta Get Saved."

Also: Bobby Knight is a Trumpista? No surprise there.
posted by dhens at 5:22 PM on July 21, 2016

C-Span seems to be OK so far. I only get it in standard def, though.
posted by double block and bleed at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2016

Bobby Knight in via pre-recorded, incredibly brief video appearance. Cut to band.
posted by cortex at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

You know what else Gets. Things. Done? Rust. And rust never sleeps. RUST 2016!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

What is this horseshit?
posted by box at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

♫ "...better make the bonfire bigger..." ♫
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

A god who sees fit to let you get into a nearly fatal accident, then barely walk again, is a god worthy of praise, to be sure.
posted by Rykey at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Man, the crowd is really digging this. Literally swaying with excitement!
posted by codacorolla at 5:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Why is this person speaking?

To increase the Jesus content to mask the thrice-married philanderer-ness of Trump.
posted by dhens at 5:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

"As a coach my main objective was to win and I know Donald Trump will always have winning on his mind." -- Bobby Knight

A bit weak, no? Not that he will always win, but just that Trump will basically think about winning. Isn't thinking about winning kind of a given at any level above U-7 soccer teams, where there's a serious chance the players might be distracted by a bug or airplane or something?
posted by zachlipton at 5:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Speaking of Bobby Knight, here's a tremendous video which does a great job expressing Coach Knight's values!!
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 5:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

This song is about taunting people into drinking more than they want and staying out later? So peer pressure and bullying?
posted by winna at 5:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Meet the Republican Party's Makeup Artist (Who Is Voting Hillary)
posted by nicebookrack at 5:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Turns out I was wrong in yesterday's thread, Ingraham and D'Souza didn't write the Ebonics article I mentioned (which was called "Dis Sho Ain't No Jive, Bro"). But it was their paper, and they published it. As well as a later "lighthearted interview" with a former KKK head, accompanied by a staged photo of a black man, noose around neck, hanging from a tree. Even Jack Kemp was disgusted, and resigned his position on the Dartmouth Review advisory board. Their Dartmouth Review also infiltrated the gay student organization and published the names of its members; it was a huge shitstorm. She has a long history as a garbage person, and her "Mein Führer!" moment remains no surprise to me.
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

You could try to summarize the Trump convention with words, but why bother?
posted by waitingtoderail at 5:25 PM on July 21, 2016

A god who sees fit to let you get into a nearly fatal accident, then barely walk again, is a god worthy of praise, to be sure.

If all that you ask of your God is to do nothing about your suffering, I'm accepting offerings and the building of temples to my glory.
posted by Pope Guilty at 5:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I AM YOUR ID - VOTE QUIVERING FLESHBEAST 2016
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I don't know you, "motivational speaker," I'm sorry in the abstract that you had surgery but I don't really care, this is not motivating

Brock Mealer: God gave him the ability to walk again. Although I'm sure the doctors helped in their own, feeble way.

Where do you think he gives this motivational speech? I'm guessing in musty, damp church basements that smell of burnt coffee and insect spray. Probably has a slide show that he busts out on Family Night. "Bring the family and enjoy this inspirational story of young Brock who was paralyzed but by the grace of God walked again. Bring a hot dish and a dessert. We will provide the beverages."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Watching these people dance makes me feel less bad about being English.
posted by howfar at 5:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

This is the first time I've actually opened up a stream--I've been taking the metafilter pinhole camera approach up until now.

My word, that's a lot of crackers.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

> "In 2009, pre-Hillary, ISIS was not even on the map. "

ISIS was al Qaeda in Iraq and started under Bush.

"We must abandon the failed policy of nation building and regime change that Hillary Clinton pushed in Iraq, Libya, Egypt and Syria."

Iraq was Bush's mess. Trump supported intervention in Libya.

It drives me nuts how the media never points these facts out when Trump repeats his bullshit talking points.
posted by homunculus at 5:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I AM YOUR EGO - YOUR ID IS WEAK! VOTE EGO 2016, AND EVERY YEAR!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

(Though I love that G. E. Smith was like, 'you know what these songs need? Saxophone solos.')
posted by box at 5:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

i just caught myself swaying and tapping my foot to this song. i'm really glad this is the last night.
posted by sporkwort at 5:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Vince Lombardi famously told his team that if they didn't like playing with gay teammates, they knew where the door was. He'd LOVE these clowns, I'm sure.

Huh. Checks out.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

That couldn't've been "I'm with her" signs...
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:29 PM on July 21, 2016

Make America one what?
posted by howfar at 5:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

We have had enough divisive rhetoric! I agree.
posted by mynameisluka at 5:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Watching on Twitter?"
posted by mollweide at 5:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

MAKE AMERICA ONE WHAT??? I am so annoyed by this phrasing.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:30 PM on July 21, 2016

"Welcome to all of you who are watching at home on iPhones and on Twitter." Wow does that make her feel out of touch. Twitter is 10 years old and the iPhone is about 9.5 years old now. (and did she mean Twitch?)
posted by zachlipton at 5:30 PM on July 21, 2016

Attempt to appeal to techno-youth: Fail.

When was America "one" before?

"Enough rhetoric that only drives a wedge between us and our neighbor" ... like your democrat neighbors?

"Seen our shrinking 401(k)s"... erm, some of us remember when companies had actual retirement plans.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Did Trump pack the convention with bad speakers to make himself look better? (I know, I know. Nobody important wanted to speak.)
posted by double block and bleed at 5:30 PM on July 21, 2016

One of my aunts just posted this to facebook. sigh.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 5:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Larry the Cable Guy?
posted by mochapickle at 5:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Larry the Cable Guy reference, hot stuff!
posted by cell divide at 5:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Larry the Cable Guy reference! I have Bingo! I have Bingo!
posted by Spathe Cadet at 5:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

"Welcome to all of you who are watching at home on iPhones and on Twitter." Wow does that make her feel out of touch. Twitter is 10 years old and the iPhone is about 9.5 years old now.

Well still more relevant than her Larry the Cable Guy reference.
posted by winna at 5:31 PM on July 21, 2016

MAKE AMERICA ONE WHAT???

ONE PEOPLE
ONE NATION
ONE LEADER
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 5:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Marsha Blackburn She welcomed me! I'm watching on an iPhone! Oh I feel so welcome now.

Here is her bio: As a small business woman, author, mother, grandmother and Member of Congress, she has dedicated her service to making America a more prosperous place to live.

Marsha, Marsha, Marsha. How's that going for you honey? Are you making us more prosperous?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Leadership is a hard-fought verb and not a subject line in an email."

My eyebrows hurt from being raised so high. I need more tea.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Does it cost extra to have a non blonde woman speak?
posted by bongo_x at 5:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Donald Trump's Solution to His Woman Problem Might Be This Pro-Gun, Anti-Abortion Congresswoman: Rep. Marsha Blackburn of Tennessee also co-sponsored an Obama "birther" bill.
posted by homunculus at 5:32 PM on July 21, 2016

and did she mean Twitch?

I seriously doubt it.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:32 PM on July 21, 2016

Just like the words "freedom" and "patriotism" I've started hating Abraham Lincoln. Sorry guy.
posted by winna at 5:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"If all do not join now to join the one union ship of the voyage none will have a chance to pilot her"

guys

I haven't poured my wine yet
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

One of my aunts just posted this to facebook. sigh.

I will send you 30 dollars via PayPal if you just reply with "* you're."

I'm absolutely serious.
posted by infinitywaltz at 5:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

I was sure this lady was going to make a 'Steve Jobs, Johnny Cash, Bob Hope' joke.
posted by sporkwort at 5:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

She is teaching my children awful grammar. "Leadership is a verb"?
posted by nickmark at 5:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Every time I hear "Make America One Again".
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Who has seen something through from the beginning through bankruptcy!"
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Knows firsthand that rules [...] get in the way of greatness."

Hooooly shit
posted by winna at 5:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

The audience is not having this.
posted by mynameisluka at 5:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"He is living the American Dream." Yep because we all dream of being born to mulitmillionaires and just playing around all of our lives.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

One of my aunts just posted this to facebook. sigh.

i just posted that pic with the caption BECAUSE ALL THE BEST ILLITERATES ARE!
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

This is also my first time braving the actual video feed, vs. experiencing it through the Filter of Meta.

As someone who does a fair bit of public speaking, this is both painful and kind of reassuring. Even my worst days have been better than what this lady is selling.

Pedigree and hurt feelings are not qualifiers for leadership.
...okay?
posted by Superplin at 5:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

MAKE AMERICA ONE WHAT???

One People. One Empire. One Leader.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"hurt feelings are not a qualification for leadership" is pretty funny since Trump is mainly running because Obama burned him so bad at the correspondents' dinner.
posted by sporkwort at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

On a side note, I order a Clinton T-shirt last night while watching, and they shipped it today. Holy crap, I think it took a month to get my Obama shirt.
posted by bongo_x at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

A god who sees fit to let you get into a nearly fatal accident, then barely walk again, is a god worthy of praise, to be sure.

Well, what can you expect from a god who crucifies his own son?
posted by Thorzdad at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Does she know how badly she's bombing?
posted by howfar at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2016

What if my idea of freedom is gay marriage abortions while smoking weed?
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

Trumpence!
posted by Hairy Lobster at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

So this is what happened to Golgafrincham B Ark.
posted by drezdn at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

"America is on the edge of great and mighty things."

Do tell...Because up until now we have been a second rate backwater.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Another blonde
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Trumpence makes me giggle.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

That is the first time anyone has ever said or ever will say "Oklahoma loves New York"
posted by zachlipton at 5:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Remember when Republicans kept asking Dems "how's that hopey changey thing working for you?" This sounds like a very poor facsimile thereof.
posted by mynameisluka at 5:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

What is this obsession with football?
posted by winna at 5:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Holy crap, I think it took a month to get my Obama shirt.

If you want any more shirts, Scott Walker is still selling Walker for President shirts, but you can't tell him what size you want.
posted by drezdn at 5:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

> Do tell...

Well, for one thing, we're on the edge of electing our first woman president.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"Are you ready for change?"
"NO! THAT'S WHY WE KEEP VOTING REPUBLICAN!"
posted by uosuaq at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

> On a side note, I order a Clinton T-shirt last night while watching, and they shipped it today. Holy crap, I think it took a month to get my Obama shirt.

Whoa -- that's new, bongo_x. It took about a month for me to get mine, and that was pretty speedy according to word on the street.*

*where "street" means "Hillary Clinton fan page on Facebook"
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Ok, this is getting entertaining. I am looking forward to more speeches about "unity" from the people who keep talking about how the other side needs to be stomped down.

... did she just talk about people's "pedigrees?"

"Bound together by the desire for faith, family, freedom, hope and opportunity... need a president who believes you have the right to your version of the American dream."

Ooh yah, I want a president who supports my version of the American dream: polyamorous multi-gender marriages, Scandanavia's health coverage and safety net, and removal of harmless plants from the dangerous narcotics list.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

"Are you ready for change?"

Knope.
posted by howfar at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

What is this obsession with football?

More concussed brains == more people receptive to the GOP message.
posted by tonycpsu at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Fortunately my kids are well-fortified against these folks. The seven-year-old just said "he's tricking people into voting for him ... When he loses he's going to be such a crybaby about it". And the five-year-old did a hilarious crybaby face and said "wah wah wah you didn't vote for me!"
posted by nickmark at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [63 favorites]

Has he learned nothing from Game of Thrones?

He's learned everything from Game of Thrones. That's the problem.

I'm becoming more and more concerned that Trump's plan to make America great again is to sacrifice Hillary Clinton to R'hllor.
posted by homunculus at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

This speaker's (governor of Oklahoma) mother was a mayor. Did no one tell her that pedigree is no qualification for leadership?
posted by Superplin at 5:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Corb - back turned, you're a hero.
posted by Sophie1 at 5:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Another blonde

A nationalistic, xenophobic rally focused on One Nation and One People which has an obsession with blonde hair and blue eyes. Never heard of that before.
posted by Justinian at 5:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

One Party.
One CEO.

And, yes, the convention is being streamed somehow on Twitter, using the CBS feed on a CBSN account.
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

When I think of Oklahoma and race relations I think more of this.
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Appropriating civil rights leaders again. A recurring theme.
posted by Talez at 5:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

My video cut out. When she looked back on her childhood, what was up with her America?
posted by Bella Donna at 5:40 PM on July 21, 2016

What is this obsession with football?

It's the whole team sport thing. You gotta have a team. You gotta root for a team. Because it makes you a better person or some shit. Because it is AMERICAN
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I love the speakers who keep trying to insist that the Republicans have led on civil rights, and the crowd just stares at them. Yeah, that's what they came there to hear.
posted by bongo_x at 5:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Thanks, tivalasvegas. I thought there was an important piece of history she skipped past.
posted by Bella Donna at 5:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

> More concussed brains == more people receptive to the GOP message

Nah, people with mTBIs need medical insurance and a good social safety net. Guess how I know!
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

So... has the whole convention had this county fair-level of oratory and political engagement?
posted by Superplin at 5:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

One flesh
One bone
One true religion
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 5:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Very few have organized a mass mooning at a convention like this. I'm just saying.
posted by delfin at 5:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

This speech is not good, right? I feel like my calibration is just way off but this does not seem like a successful speech.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

folks, these convention threads have been a lifeline for my news-induced anxiety but tonight i just have to unplug, make some donations, and look away. please give all involved a thorough mocking for me.
posted by murphy slaw at 5:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

"We will stand with our allies, like Israel ~~and Estonia~~"
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

So... has the whole convention had this county fair-level of oratory and political engagement?

The first couple of nights were pretty amateurish in comparison.
posted by bongo_x at 5:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

bongo_x, it's either a tax on non-blonde women, or Palin's history has convinced them that brunette Republican women will doom the campaign.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Diamond encrusted crucifix around her neck. Totally what Jesus was about.
posted by Talez at 5:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

Ronald Reagan. Drink!!
posted by robstercraw at 5:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

So far, even though I haven't seen much yet, every time "Trump" and "values" are mentioned together, followed by a pause for applause, there is a, uh, tepid response at best.
posted by Superplin at 5:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

They're really running hard with the "all lives matter" idiocy. Which is weird, since it's so easily debunked if you give a single shit about facts. Maybe it's not weird.
posted by codacorolla at 5:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Again. Make America one again.
posted by SillyShepherd at 5:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

If the law enforcement folks keep us safe and free, then why was one day of the convention devoted to Making America Safe? I'm so confused.
posted by Bella Donna at 5:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"We will stand with our allies, like Israel and Estonia"

Once the check clears.
posted by drezdn at 5:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

I love the shocked silence in response to the notion that occasional disagreement is acceptable.
posted by nickmark at 5:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Even the Reagan quote fell flat.
posted by Superplin at 5:44 PM on July 21, 2016

I just realized the most accurate pop cultural analog to Trump... The King of Ooo from Adventure Time.
posted by drezdn at 5:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

This is like an X-Factor audition.
posted by howfar at 5:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Donald Trump will make America one again? Yeah, right. How many members of Korean-Americans for Trump do we suppose exist?
posted by Bella Donna at 5:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

What is this obsession with football?

Some old white men micromanage the shit out of minorities every week and twice a day in August. If they fail it's because everyone else lacks "heart"

It's their way of life
posted by cmfletcher at 5:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

"All Lives Matter": It's anti-abortion code.
posted by GrammarMoses at 5:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

"Where immigrants could live the American dream"

Now, let's elect Trump to fix that glitch!
posted by thefoxgod at 5:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wait, she used the I word, immigrants. Isn't that against the rules?
posted by Bella Donna at 5:46 PM on July 21, 2016

'To do and to be the unimaginable.'
posted by box at 5:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

So... has the whole convention had this county fair-level of oratory and political engagement?

Oh God you missed the mush-mouthed fracker from last night...Herbert...something. Nobody understood a word of what he said except that he picked cotton and when he left home (circa 1940) he was given "only" a truck, a co-signed loan, and a phone. Although to be fair he was so hard to understand he might have said a comb or a bomb or a bone.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

I just cleared a bunch of earwax from my ears, only to hear this kind of crap. Should've waited a day.
posted by SillyShepherd at 5:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

This speaker is from "The National Diversity Coalition for Trump".

they're not even trying anymore
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"Hillary Clinton is a direct threat to the American Dream."

Wow, even that didn't get them worked up. Tough crowd tonight.
posted by Superplin at 5:46 PM on July 21, 2016

Diamond encrusted crucifix around her neck. Totally what Jesus was about.
posted by tobascodagama at 5:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

She is trying to sound enraged but is only reaching petulant.
posted by winna at 5:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Well, the speaker is certainly doing and being the unimaginable as far as I'm concerned.
posted by Bella Donna at 5:47 PM on July 21, 2016

'To do and to be the unimaginable.'

like her, doing what she's doing, where she's doing it.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm sure she's trying to come off as strong in opposition, but it's really reading as irritated and petulant.
posted by penduluum at 5:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

HILLARY CLINTON IS NOT EVEN OUR REAL MOM
posted by winna at 5:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

Has she been promised the Surgeon General spot?
posted by mollweide at 5:48 PM on July 21, 2016

Secret Life of Gravy: Oh God you missed the mush-mouthed fracker from last night...Herbert...something.

I really enjoyed reading about that. I guess I just didn't have the imagination to envision what it would be like to watch him live.
posted by Superplin at 5:48 PM on July 21, 2016

What is this obsession with football?

In case it's not obvious, not only team sport, but all American, blue collar, vaguely conservative, one of the few cultural touchpoints Republicans share with significant numbers of African Americans, Midwest + Southern. Wildly popular.
posted by msalt at 5:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

DId she just roll the R on Trump or am I tripping?
posted by mynameisluka at 5:48 PM on July 21, 2016

"Hillary Clinton is a direct threat to the American Dream."

Wow, even that didn't get them worked up. Tough crowd tonight.

They're still trying to figure out how she got up there and if she's supposed to be there.
posted by bongo_x at 5:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

She had to have been a cheerleader with those crazy arm movements during the speech.
posted by gatorae at 5:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I am enjoying how irritated this speaker seems. Not really angry. Just insanely peeved.
posted by howfar at 5:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Wait a minute, if the speaker is concerned about people who have contempt for the rule of law, why is she supporting Trump? I mean, has she noticed he cuts corners?
posted by Bella Donna at 5:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Fun fact: That was the entire membership of Asians for Trump.
posted by Talez at 5:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Lisa has a weird petulant teen vibe going on.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:49 PM on July 21, 2016

What is this obsession with football?

It is a no-shit thing the last few years on the right that the revelation that American Football is super-damaging to athletes' brains, to the point of inducing early dementia, is a conspiracy by liberals against American vigor and manliness. It's super-fash, but that's the way the GOP is going.
posted by Pope Guilty at 5:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

'To do and to be the unimaginable.'

And always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom.
posted by tonycpsu at 5:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

RLI = MLM
posted by box at 5:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

This is like a local access cable show hosted by a life coach and preacher who owns the county's largest used Hyundai dealership.
posted by winna at 5:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

American Football is the sport with the strongest top-down management.
One Team.
One Quarterback.
One Coach.
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Just insanely peeved.

Yeah it was pretty much the tone of me grousing about that one coworker that always replies-all to all-staff emails....
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

It is a no-shit thing the last few years on the right that the revelation that American Football is super-damaging to athletes' brains, to the point of inducing early dementia, is a conspiracy by liberals against American vigor and manliness.

Whaaaaaaa? That's insane. Do you happen to have any links to articles about these nutjobs?

tonycpsu: Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:53 PM on July 21, 2016

"We've got cable, beer and Jesus" are the lyrics to this garbage song.

I have none of those am I banned.
posted by winna at 5:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

America's Socialist Sports League: The NFL
posted by Drinky Die at 5:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Apologies if it's a double: Trump's alleged prepared remarks.
posted by uosuaq at 5:54 PM on July 21, 2016

I hope Corb has protein-rich snacks. What a fricking ordeal.
posted by Bella Donna at 5:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

The singer altered the lyrics to be relevant to the current event! How fresh and fantastic!
posted by dhens at 5:54 PM on July 21, 2016

"As long as we got Trump girl, we got this"

Four people clap.
posted by howfar at 5:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Can they bring that D.A. band on instead to sing "ready and steady" cause this sucks even worse than that did.
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

They're really running hard with the "all lives matter" idiocy. Which is weird, since it's so easily debunked if you give a single shit about facts. Maybe it's not weird.

"All Lives Matter" may have started as a slightly clueless response to "Black Lives Matter" but it's been thoroughly co-opted by the racists. From where I'm sitting It might as well be "Go back to Africa".
posted by billyfleetwood at 5:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [37 favorites]

Is he trying to play Marty's guitar solo from Back to the Future?
posted by howfar at 5:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

For anyone who follows modern country, is this guy popular at all? Even by the low standards of the genre, he's not very good.
posted by codacorolla at 5:56 PM on July 21, 2016

It's been years since I've watched the RNC. Is there always so much/this music?
posted by mochapickle at 5:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Can they bring that D.A band on instead to sing "ready and steady" cause this sucks even worse than that did.

Half of that 'band' is dead and I'd still see it as a significant improvement.
posted by splen at 5:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The House is unlikely to rock anytime soon.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Given the notion of leak to the press and then surprise, I doubt his prepared remarks will be the same.

Also glad I don't have to watch this live.
posted by mrzarquon at 5:57 PM on July 21, 2016

Huh, according to the Politico schedule of events that last speaker, Dr. Lisa Shin, is actually from "Korean Americans for Trump". So I dunno if they rebranded or what.
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Whaaaaaaa? That's insane. Do you happen to have any links to articles about these nutjobs?

Here's one.
posted by Pope Guilty at 5:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I had a fantasy today that Ivanka has been trained by her mother for years a a character assassin, and she's gonna get up there and ditch the script and tell the world her father is a monster, and multiple fistfights break out. Be careful corb and anyone else in that hall.
posted by vrakatar at 5:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

I feel like the most urgent need in America is to bring true musical jams to my fellow white Americans because this music is only fit for hurling into the sea.
posted by winna at 5:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Watching this parade of women & minorities is just so stomach turning.

You don't prove your tolerance & respect for other races, genders, etc. by propping them up for a rah, rah Trump speech. You embrace them & employ them & listen to them & legislate policies that demonstrably help them. The pandering is just so pandery.

I imagine a thought bubble over every bleached blonde head & graying combover: "what a well-spoken black/Asian/woman/disabled person. How tolerant I am! Ah, I see the lily white person to my left & right are nodding in silent agreement. Yes, we are on the right side of history."
posted by narwhal at 5:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Watching this (directly! no more pinhole!) is getting me weirdly fired-up to vote for Hillary. Maybe a Pavolvian response to all the red/white/blue? It sure as hell isn't because any of the speakers are making coherent arguments for or against her.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 5:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Does anyone know who the singer (and tambourinist too, apparently) in the house band is? He looks familiar but I can't place him for some reason.
posted by noneuclidean at 5:59 PM on July 21, 2016

It's been years since I've watched the RNC. Is there always so much/this music?

I don't think so but I've never paid that close attention. They are obviously short of effective speakers. Think they are filling time.
posted by Drinky Die at 6:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Dr. Lisa Shin, is actually from "Korean Americans for Trump". So I dunno if they rebranded or what.

Looks like she founded Korean Americans For Trump and is also a member of the National Diversity Coalition.

Although:

"She faces an uphill battle. According to a survey of registered Asian-American voters released by nonpartisan advocacy groups in May, four out five respondents who identified as Korean had an unfavorable view of Trump — the highest number among all Asian-American ethnic groups."
posted by thefoxgod at 6:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Now there's just an ad for the RNC?
posted by winna at 6:01 PM on July 21, 2016

He looks familiar but I can't place him for some reason.

probably an excellent summary of his career.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 6:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

howfar: The solo you're referencing is a tribute/ripoff of Chuck Berry's Johnny B. Goode, which G.E. Smith was almost certainly channeling. Not Back to the Future.
posted by uninformative at 6:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Why will the speech work? Because it manages to frame the narrative – using false or misleading data – by making this a change election. He somehow spins every disconcerting piece of news at home and abroad into a compelling social imaginary of chaos, decline and frustration. He blames Obama for everything bad and gives no credit for anything good. If you know nothing but feel insecure, the picture he paints will be electrifyingly persuasive.

The thing about strongmen is that they are prepared to tell lies democratic politicians shrink from; they show no respect for the constitutional order or for enduring institutions; they lie purely to advance the most hyperbolic version of the truth and than cast themselves as magical solution-artists. The speech is a master-class in channeling resentment and anxiety.

If you wonder what it was like in the 1930s for ordinary people to flock to demagogues, tune in tonight. America has thrown up an extremely talented one. I fear that Hillary Clinton has no idea what is about to hit her.

Andrew Sullivan liveblogging tonight for NY Magazine.
posted by dnash at 6:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

what the hell kind of name is reince anyway?
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 6:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

four out five respondents who identified as Korean had an unfavorable view of Trump — the highest number among all Asian-American ethnic groups

I'm a quarter Korean, so I'm definitely going to be taking this as a point of pride from now on.
posted by tobascodagama at 6:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Is Priebus accepting an award?
posted by penduluum at 6:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

If anyone on the docket tonight starts talking about "law and order," and "blue lives matter," keep in mind that today, another white cop shot an unarmed black man, who was lying on his back, with his hands in the air, while explaining to police what was happening with the handicapped white guy he was trying to protect.

According to NBC, the cop's union is stating that he thought he was "protecting" Mr Kinsey when he shot him.

I think their excuse is that they were trying to shoot his unarmed client, even though Mr Kinsey was loudly and clearly letting them know his client was unharmed.

Jesus suffering fuck.
posted by howfar at 6:03 PM on July 21, 2016

Brief, hard fantasy that Preibus is fucked up and about to go WAY off message.
posted by mynameisluka at 6:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Subeirp Ecnier!
posted by dhens at 6:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Looks like she founded Korean Americans For Trump and is also a member of the National Diversity Coalition.

Yeah, it's more like she is a delegate in the Model Trump UN.

My favorite representative or whatever they are in the National Diversity Coalition so far is "Derrick Jackson – South African American for Trump".
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"We've got cable, beer and Jesus" are the lyrics to this garbage song.

What? They're ripping off Mojo Nixon now?

(I am not watching this debacle. I have been drinking peach/ginger infused bourbon and I am just about to hear the click.)
posted by octobersurprise at 6:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I'm sad to say Sullivan has nailed it. Really terrifying. The U.S. yielding to fascism could actually extinguish a lot more than just the U.S. itself.
posted by argybarg at 6:04 PM on July 21, 2016

hint he is not black
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"We are the party of the open door!"

Unspoken:
"Don't let it smack you in the ass on the way out!"
posted by double block and bleed at 6:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

what the hell kind of name is reince anyway?

Slate's got you.
posted by zakur at 6:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Brief, hard fantasy that Preibus is fucked up and about to go WAY off message.

Please do go on.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:05 PM on July 21, 2016

Remove priebus

Huh. Slightly surprising, but acceptable, autocorrect.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:05 PM on July 21, 2016

Um, I'm pretty sure that racist elitism is a fairly old idea, Priebus.
posted by experiencing a significant gravitas shortfall at 6:05 PM on July 21, 2016

How dare he actually reference Birmingham and Selma given the platform of his party.
posted by winna at 6:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Awww, look what the Republicans are selling.
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

hint he is not black
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:04 PM on July 21 [+] [!]

Way to fucking ruin it, tiva!
posted by OmieWise at 6:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The five-year-old in response to one of the API ads talking about energy and the environment: "We need a president that will help the environment and that is NOT Donald Trump! That is Hillary Clinton!"
posted by nickmark at 6:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Reince Priebus: "[...] ever since we won our freedom two centuries ago."

Two centuries ago? What do you mean "we"?

jk we all know what he means by "we"
posted by mhum at 6:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

I had a fantasy today that Ivanka has been trained by her mother for years a a character assassin, and she's gonna get up there and ditch the script and tell the world her father is a monster, and multiple fistfights break out

What? and be written out of Daddy's will? It'll never happen.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:06 PM on July 21, 2016

Every time I hear "Chairman Priebus" my brain autocorrects to "General Grievous".
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

In case it's not obvious, not only team sport, but all American, blue collar, vaguely conservative, one of the few cultural touchpoints Republicans share with significant numbers of African Americans, Midwest + Southern. Wildly popular.

Shall we remember that Donald Trump owned a team in an American football league that went out of business because of decisions made by owners including Donald Trump?
posted by holgate at 6:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The solo you're referencing is a tribute/ripoff of Chuck Berry's Johnny B. Goode, which G.E. Smith was almost certainly channeling. Not Back to the Future.

"Johnny B. Goode" was used in Back to the Future as the song that Marty brought back to 1955 in a kind of causal time-loop.
posted by dhens at 6:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I will give Reince that, this is definitely not a normal convention.
posted by ckape at 6:06 PM on July 21, 2016

Has anyone ever responded to that "Blue lives matter" schtick with "ALL lives matter"? How'd that work out?
posted by nicebookrack at 6:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Wow even the boos for having gun rights taken away by Hilary are weak. Lots of people having second thoughts?
posted by AlexiaSky at 6:08 PM on July 21, 2016

OMFG, he brings up the Battle of Normandy while endorsing a candidate whose vision for American is one where citizens, and their kids and grandkids, have to worry about whether they're unregistered Muslims.

I've been an atheist my whole life but I will be registering as a Muslim if Trump wins and he gets his government registry going.
posted by XMLicious at 6:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

LOCK HER UP
posted by Gaz Errant at 6:08 PM on July 21, 2016

LOCK UP HER ELECTORAL COLLEGE VICTORY!
posted by vrakatar at 6:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"You can kiss your gun rights way if she ever finds her way into office."

Still going with that? Huh. Cuz that never gets old.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

DemocRATS want a bunch of bureaucRATS telling your doctors what drugs may or may not be safe to prescribe! We want the doctor you can't afford to see to be able to do whatever they want!
posted by uosuaq at 6:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

So since Jerry Falwell Jr. already spoke, is this going to just roll right into Peter Thiel?
posted by penduluum at 6:08 PM on July 21, 2016

Holy shit, there they go with the "Lock Her Up!" chant.
Chilling.
posted by Superplin at 6:09 PM on July 21, 2016

Time for the two minutes hate
posted by gatorae at 6:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

They love saying "Lock her up". That's actually the only thing they like doing.
posted by howfar at 6:09 PM on July 21, 2016

I left to get more popcorn and tea. Did I miss anything?

Lemme rephrase: did I miss anything I'm going to feel sorry about not seeing, or did I just skip another ~15 minutes of mumbling and jokes falling flat?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 6:09 PM on July 21, 2016

He's giving this speech with all the passion of someone trying to sell you a timeshare in Tulsa.
posted by winna at 6:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

The thing is, aside from the whole hating on Democrats, the things that Priebus talk about would be the same thing Democrats want. But when we look at the reddest states these things have vanished. We want better schools? Republican governors across the country basically slash school budgets under the guise of controlling spending. I don't even know what to begin to say to that.
posted by Talez at 6:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

DemocRATS want a bunch of bureaucRATS telling your doctors what drugs may or may not be safe to prescribe! We want the doctor you can't afford to see to be able to do whatever they want!

Every time they say things like this they are actually endorsing single-payer
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Sullivan has hated the Clintons -- and women in politics apart from Thatcher -- for 20+ years. So, there's that filter.
posted by holgate at 6:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Molly Ball ‏@mollyesque 3m3 minutes ago
Molly Ball Retweeted Ramesh Ponnuru
If crime rates are as alarming as Trump says, leaving your door open seems like a bad idea.
posted by OmieWise at 6:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Shall we remember that Donald Trump owned a team in an American football league that went out of business because of decisions made by owners including Donald Trump?

According to the documentary on it, the leagues folding was largely because of Trump.
posted by drezdn at 6:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

He sounds so...whiny and apologetic. Does he always sound this way?
posted by mynameisluka at 6:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Even the crowd seems like they're getting tired of EMAIL, EMAIL, EMAIL. This is not an enthusiastic crowd.
posted by bongo_x at 6:10 PM on July 21, 2016

I love all the political financial gain talk, ignoring how much Trump is funneling to his own companies.
posted by mochapickle at 6:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

ErisLordFreedom: nope, just more boring.
posted by penduluum at 6:10 PM on July 21, 2016

This is rich. Clinton is the one who sees the Oval Office as a cash cow? When Trump himself bragged he could run for president and turn a profit?

I'm not sure I can take this all night. You people who've been actually watching this live all week are warriors. And corb, man.
posted by Superplin at 6:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Does it strike anyone else as super funny every time someone gets angry about A SECRET EMAIL SERVER?
posted by kiltedtaco at 6:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

The solo you're referencing is a tribute/ripoff of Chuck Berry's Johnny B. Goode, which G.E. Smith was almost certainly channeling. Not Back to the Future.

I think he was directly ripping off Tim May's version from the movie.
posted by howfar at 6:11 PM on July 21, 2016

He sounds like a grown-up Morty, of Rick & Morty.
posted by defenestration at 6:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

nicebookrack: "Has anyone ever responded to that "Blue lives matter" schtick with "ALL lives matter"? How'd that work out?"

I got you: When the irony is cooked just right. (twitter)
posted by mhum at 6:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

I suspect you have 20 minutes. Theil is the only interesting one left.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:11 PM on July 21, 2016

Now imagine Rodney Dangerfield reading this speech.
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

So how do the neverTrumps like Reince?
posted by malocchio at 6:12 PM on July 21, 2016

I've heard of terrorists taking us down… but us taking terrorists down?
posted by glhaynes at 6:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"No more negotiating with terrorists" - what does this even mean? Apart from "persecuting Muslims".
posted by howfar at 6:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Corb and other NeverTrumpers invaded media row for an impromptu press conference!
posted by cooker girl at 6:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [43 favorites]

What? They're ripping off Mojo Nixon now?

I think The Whelk might have some choice words about that nonsense.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 6:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

The gleeful hate towards Hillary is so, so disturbing. They don't just want to keep her from getting elected. They want to debase and humiliate her. It reminds me of nothing so much as Cersei's "shaming" on GOT.
posted by nakedmolerats at 6:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

"Johnny B. Goode" was used in Back to the Future as the song that Marty brought back to 1955 in a kind of causal time-loop.

To complete the referential loop, for anyone who hasn't seen the sequels, the whole plot of Back to the Future 2 was about preventing Biff from becoming Donald Trump.
posted by tobascodagama at 6:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

Does it strike anyone else as super funny every time someone gets angry about A SECRET EMAIL SERVER?

Every single time.

He sounds like a grown-up Morty, of Rick & Morty.

Oh my god you are right and I cannot unhear it.
posted by Gaz Errant at 6:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Give the guy a break. He's got a long list of bullshit to get through in a short time.
posted by double block and bleed at 6:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"GE, It's your cousin Marvin, Marvin Smith. You've got to hear this..." *He holds the phone up to the TV playing "Back to the Future"
posted by drezdn at 6:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

How can we see that?!
posted by lauranesson at 6:13 PM on July 21, 2016

A SECRET EMAIL SERVER

Someone, probably on Metafilter, suggested that the best way to shut these people up is to ask them, "Hey, what IS a server?"
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [39 favorites]

This from earlier in Sullivan's liveblog about the speech also reflects the mood that feels like it's been building this whole campaign:

It’s a remarkable piece of oratory, cannily crafted, framed by massive lies and distortions, crammed with incoherence, and yet, I’m afraid to say, scarily potent. It invents a reality – that the U.S. is in a state of chaos, lawlessness and soaring crime; that the world is careening toward catastrophe – and then makes a classic argument for a strongman to set things straight.

This is a very new departure for politics in a liberal democracy. We’ve never heard an appeal from a major party platform to junk traditional democratic norms, and cede power to a new tyrant, whose magical powers will somehow cause almost every problem in the country to disappear.
posted by dry white toast at 6:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Let's start a beer fund for Mr. Reibus.

One of us! I like him.
posted by malocchio at 6:14 PM on July 21, 2016

He sounds like a grown-up Morty, of Rick & Morty.

...and Rick and Morty is inspired by Back to the Future. It all comes full circle.

Quick, someone rig a cable to the clock tower and connect it to the TelePrompTer by 10:04pm!
posted by tonycpsu at 6:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

howfar: Interesting. Wasn't Donald Trump the inspiration for the president in Back to the Future 2? G.E. Smith may be a next-level political genius troll...
posted by uninformative at 6:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Has anyone done "Lather, Reince, Repeat" yet?
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

He sounds like a grown-up Morty, of Rick & Morty.

He doesn't really sound like a grown-up to me. He sounds like a very young man, like 18ish, young and unsure of himself. Almost Forest Gump. Certainly not the longest serving chairman of the RNC. I'm guessing he doesn't do a lot of public speaking, it's all strong-arm tactics in boardrooms among a few of the inner circle.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:15 PM on July 21, 2016

There seems to be some stirring to life now... so I guess we'll stomp it back down with some bad insurance company hold music.
posted by Superplin at 6:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Corb and other NeverTrumpers invaded media row for an impromptu press conference!

Is any channel covering it?
posted by Talez at 6:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Someone told the band they'd only be playing one set. Oops.
posted by bongo_x at 6:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Vermin Supreme Knows He Won't Be President, But Still Happy with Cleveland Love

Satirical candidate Vermin Supreme seeks presidential nomination — and condemns police state — at RNC

Smoking weed with Vermin Supreme at the RNC
posted by homunculus at 6:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

"well, i take whatever i want..."
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 6:15 PM on July 21, 2016

From SomethingAwful user "Quest For Glory II":

Aw geez Rick, don't you, don't you wanna make America great again?

Cmon morty we gotta stop all the *burp* r-radical islamist.. terrical..terrorists morty. we gotta stop them before they get to space morty. they're already on mars and they have WMDs

aw geez
posted by Guy Smiley at 6:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Is the tambourine guy Scott Stapp?
posted by sporkwort at 6:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He sounds like a grown-up Morty, of Rick & Morty.

Nobody exists on purpose, nobody belongs anywhere, everybody's gonna die. Come watch TV.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I fear that Hillary Clinton has no idea what is about to hit her.

What I like about Sullivan is that he's able to perfectly articulate whatever's he's feeling at the moment in the moment. He was born to live-blog. The downside of that is that he often doesn't think beyond the moment. I expect that Clinton is more than cognizant of what is about to "hit her." She's been doing this shit for 30 years. Now it might not help her, ultimately, but none of this is going to come as a surprise.
posted by octobersurprise at 6:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [39 favorites]

Someone, probably on Metafilter, suggested that the best way to shut these people up is to ask them, "Hey, what IS a server?"

It's a series of tubes. Tubes full of BENGHAZI.
posted by delfin at 6:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

Wasn't Donald Trump the inspiration for the president in Back to the Future 2?

Not the President, just Biff Tannen running all of Hill Valley from his giant casino.
posted by dry white toast at 6:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

democrat party

Every time I hear someone use the word democrat as an adjective instead of a noun, I want to break things.
posted by chaoticgood at 6:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Do the younger Republicans understand the Hillary hate? Or does it seem weird to them?

The younger Dems don't seem to understand the way she was attacked from the first moment, and therefore the loyalty some of the older women have for her.
posted by zennie at 6:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

The band members keep looking off to the left with fear and uncertainty in their eyes, as if they're thinking "Yep, still being held hostage at gunpoint."
posted by defenestration at 6:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

"Now let me tell you a story about a great man, a man who worked his ass off for $1 a year..."

Riiight. Like the Pyramid scheme con artist whose mom worked all her life and wore the same coat for 40 years. That's the real problem with us shiftless Democrats-- we discard our coats every 10 or 20 years. Although, to be fair, those Made in China coats do tend to fall apart faster.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

ultimately, but none of this is going to come as a surprise.
posted by octobersurprise

Do I even need to say the word?
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

and gary richrath rolls over in his grave.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 6:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Donald and Melania arriving. Boy do they look unhappy. Especially her.
posted by bongo_x at 6:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I love the band. All of them. All the time.
posted by OmieWise at 6:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Hillary et al are well-adapted to normal politics. This is not normal.
posted by argybarg at 6:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I remember Sullivan telling us all that Obama could never beat Romney after the first debate. He was convinced of it.
posted by howfar at 6:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Every time I hear someone use the word democrat as an adjective instead of a noun, I want to break things.

It's an early-warning idiot alert. Like how when someone goes between subway cars you know they are up to no good
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Tubes full of BENGHAZI.

Oh great. Now I'm going to have Benghazi and Bengay mixed up in my mind. Honey, could you pick me up some Benghazi for my sore knee?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The band members keep looking off to the left with fear and uncertainty in their eyes, as if they're thinking "Yep, still being held hostage by gunpoint."

they have crypt keeper on lead guitar what can go wrong
"hey boys and ghouls its me your one memory of staying up too late on saturday nights
you might remember me as
g e smith
but now i bring good things to
DEATH"
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Wow Melania really likes white dresses with big sleeves. I had to google to make sure she wasn't wearing the exact same dress as on Monday (its not). Weird choice to do a visual callback to the last time we saw her.
posted by gatorae at 6:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

That was an amazing bit of projection on Priebus's part. Really well-done. Four stars.
posted by RakDaddy at 6:20 PM on July 21, 2016

So torn. Thiel is the guy who destroyed Gawker, but now he's speaking at the RNC. It's like when Eileen Collins was talking.
posted by Justinian at 6:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

How much coke did Peter Thiel take?
posted by procrastination at 6:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

GET HYPE
RAISE YOUR DONGERS
posted by penduluum at 6:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Holy adderall.
posted by defenestration at 6:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Oh, that's how you pronounce "Thiel."
posted by Spathe Cadet at 6:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Tubes full of BENGHAZI.

For some reason, I can't get Tool's Sober video out of my mind now.
posted by tonycpsu at 6:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Is he a robot?
posted by OmieWise at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm not a politician and neither is Donald trump.
posted by AlexiaSky at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2016

Ouch. You know what the hardest thing abou... TIMING... t comedy is?

Peter Thiel does not.
posted by Justinian at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I wish I was that cranked to the gills on whatever Thiel is.
posted by mollweide at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Here comes Thiel. He speaks. In staccato. As if. He is. Sending a. Telegram.
posted by winna at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Did I actually get RT'ed by the RNC house band on twitter hahahaha.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

Lots of mentions of Clinton, but the crowd response isn't as rabid as I expected--except when they were chanting "Lock Her Up!"
posted by Superplin at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Oh, that's how you pronounce "Thiel."

Considering how well they've run everything else so far, maybe not.
posted by ckape at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Never seen video of Thiel before...hard to estimate how many lines he's done.
posted by uosuaq at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He's such a cartoon Nazi.
posted by howfar at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2016

Is he a robot?

MARCO?!?!?!?
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016

They want to debase and humiliate her.

The Yulia Tymoshenko treatment.
posted by holgate at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Thiel has had his top, front teeth bleached and bonded together for better brushing efficiency.
posted by defenestration at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Don't besmirch the reputation of cocaine in such a manner.
posted by yesster at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Donald and Melania arriving. Boy do they look unhappy. Especially her.

Especially their son, who looks like every 11-year boy who has been forced to put on a suit and sit through a long, boring thing.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I AM. SPEAKING. ABOUT. THE FUTURE.
posted by RakDaddy at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

This strangely Germanic robot who smiles awkwardly is quite convincing. Nice try, Stanford engineering students, you crazy kids!
posted by AndrewInDC at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

NOBODY ROCKS LIKE... CLEVELAND!!!
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016

Government was once high-tech.

GEE, I WONDER WHAT HAPPENED.
posted by zennie at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Man, I can't believe I was looking forward to/kind of afraid of this. He's a fucking disaster. He looks like somebody offstage is pointing at him and holding a detonator.
posted by penduluum at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

STOP
posted by mynameisluka at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016

Hillary et al are well-adapted to normal politics. This is not normal.

True, but the Clinton team has all the playbooks from the Obama teams, I reckon, they are not exactly terrible at this new social media battlefield, and they will bring all the important tactics and lessons from the traditional playbook. Hillary Clinton has been in big time politics since the 90's. She can beat this ham and egger.
posted by vrakatar at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016

Peter Theil: "You weak ass embarrassed millionaires, You can do it if you work hard like me! Look at me!"
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

thiel to begin karate pronounced karate routine soon
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Referring to two technological projects strongly associated with Democratic politicians. Interesting.
posted by howfar at 6:24 PM on July 21, 2016

I'm watching with the sound off (because sanity) and he just looks so, so angry. Like he's about to hulk out.
posted by une_heure_pleine at 6:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

How is this man supposed to be appealing?
posted by mochapickle at 6:24 PM on July 21, 2016

Thiel looks terrified, and this speech is fucking terrible.
posted by codacorolla at 6:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Sorry they don't know if it's going to run.
posted by cooker girl at 6:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wait, Hillary Clinton invaded the Middle East?
posted by thefoxgod at 6:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He is like the evil person in a SF movie that you know is a robot because they eschew contractions.
posted by winna at 6:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"In 1968, all of America was high-tech"... er, in in 1980, I lived in a house in Arkansas with no indoor plumbing and no electricity. He's got a weird definition of "high-tech."
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 6:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

So few of these speakers are familiar with the legacy of George W. Bush.
posted by ckape at 6:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Woooooow. This is terrible.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:25 PM on July 21, 2016

is he botoxed from his upper lip upwards?
posted by futz at 6:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

uh...end the era of stupid wars? THAT THE GOP STARTED WHAT?
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Wait, invading the Middle East is Hillary Clinton's fault?
posted by waitingtoderail at 6:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Gay Man Throws Trans People Under Bus, Film at Eleven.
posted by Justinian at 6:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

Did I actually get RT'ed by the RNC house band on twitter hahahaha.

I'm sorry but there was no real reason for your tweet. I get that you might not like it but they're up there, they're doing their thing, and they're happy. It's really shitty to shit on someone who's doing that.
posted by Talez at 6:25 PM on July 21, 2016

Man, I can't believe I was looking forward to/kind of afraid of this. He's a fucking disaster. He looks like somebody offstage is pointing at him and holding a detonator.

Right down to the dry mouth.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:25 PM on July 21, 2016

Exactly! Who cares which bathroom someone uses!! Oh, wait...
posted by Gaz Errant at 6:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"Now we are told the great debate is about who gets to use which bathroom"

??? Y'all Republicans are the ones who brought it up
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

I didn't know what Peter Thiel looks like and just tuned in and would have sworn this was some fill-in dude that runs Trump Steaks or whatever
posted by theodolite at 6:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Really? Theil is really just going to repeat what everyone else said?
posted by bongo_x at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2016

Did Thiel just come out of the closet?
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Weird techsnobbery from Thiel. Sometimes new tech isn't better tech. Core memory is super useful in space, e.g.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Invading the middle east is a huge mistake, so vote for the guy who wants Congress to formally declare war on ISIS!
posted by gatorae at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

FUCK HIM

The bathroom bills issue -- he said WHO CARES?

YOUR FUCKING PARTY CARES. YOUR PARTY STARTED THIS.

FUCK YOU.
posted by yesster at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [67 favorites]

Fact checking the Trump speech
posted by zarq at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2016

MSNBC came in late, was Thiel blaming Hillary for the B-2 bombers having issues flying the rain?
posted by sideshow at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm on a big corporate commuter bus heading home after a day of privilege as a well-paid white professional. But it's still easy to see problems with America in Silicon Valley. Who is driving the bus? A black woman. Who works in the corporate kitchens on campus? Brown men and women. Every single day during my commute I ponder race and class. So sorry, Thiel, you folks in the 1% don't have a fucking clue about Silicon Valley in its entirety nor what the US needs as a whole. Fuck you, fuck your tribe, may you rot in hell. Not that I have feels about this guy or anything.
posted by Bella Donna at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [38 favorites]

"In 1968, all of America was high-tech"

Bonkers.
posted by glhaynes at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Thiel is about to explain what was great about the album "Sports" by Huey Lewis.
posted by drezdn at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

Weird techsnobbery from Thiel.

It's singularity or bust for that fucker.
posted by holgate at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

There you go: back to the Future.
posted by OmieWise at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016

Did Thiel just come out of the closet?

He's pretty openly gay.
posted by dis_integration at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016

Hey Thiel, if you're so proud to be gay why the fuck are you suing Gawker for daring to mention it?
posted by dnash at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"Who cares what bathroom you use?" Where were you when the GOP was passing laws about who gets to use which bathrooms? You know the GOP? The people you are talking to right now, trying to fire up?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Did Thiel just come out of the closet?

He wasn't in the closet. Gawker outed him, that's why he made it his life's work to destroy them.
posted by Justinian at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

they're doing they're thing, and they're happy. It's really shitty to shit on someone who's doing that.

please feel free to shit all over g.e. smith, the pandering little whore.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016

stupid wars need the most attention
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016

Literally says Trump is taking us back to the future.
posted by Drinky Die at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Thiel is running for mayor of cleveland right?
posted by OHenryPacey at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016

I'm not sure Debussy was the right choice
posted by theodolite at 6:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

his eyeballs are pinballing all over the place. a medic should check him for a TBI when his speech is over.
posted by futz at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Hillary et al are well-adapted to normal politics. This is not normal.

No, on this scale, in the US, it isn't normal. But is it "not normal" Trump casts a spell over 51% and wins or is it "not normal" and 51% (or more) say what the fuck and he loses? I don't think anyone knows at this point.
posted by octobersurprise at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016

Hey Thiel, if you're so proud to be gay why the fuck are you suing Gawker for daring to mention it?

Because it's the gay person's right to determine who they come out to and when.
posted by Talez at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

That's it? I was led to believe there would be something interesting. Oh well, on to the main event. Good luck, all.
posted by Gaz Errant at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I was worried that Thiel would bring elevator speech ninjitsu.

Turns out he's just some spoiled rich ratfucker that fell upward.
posted by Yowser at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I just want Thiel to tell us to consider an animal and then have his assistant bring that animal out.
posted by drezdn at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

> He's pretty openly gay

I thought he'd been outed by Gawker but hadn't acknowledged in public that he was gay.
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016

Thiel is so reprehensible he MUST be planning to pick up the torch if/when Trump fails.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016

Kicking myself for not having bought some buildings in NYC when I was a kid.
posted by glhaynes at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [27 favorites]

Oh good. More glowing endorsements from Trump offspring. I was starting to go through withdrawal, it's been so long.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

This is a perfectly good time for a commercial for real estate, I guess

Not like there's anything else going on
posted by penduluum at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

David Brooks: "Good to see an actual billionaire speaking at this convention."
posted by AndrewInDC at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [27 favorites]

Proud to be gay? Well I guess destroying Gawker was a waste of time and money, then.
posted by ckape at 6:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Did Maddow just say that Thiel opposes women having the vote?
posted by chapps at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Why are they running this 33 rpm speech at 45rpm?
posted by iamabot at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Did I actually get RT'ed by the RNC house band on twitter hahahaha.

It's GE Smith! Of the Saturday Night Live band!
posted by wondermouse at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2016

Wow, what a scummy, scummy speech.
posted by codacorolla at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I wish I was that cranked to the gills on whatever Thiel is.

Billions of dollars? Me too!
posted by paper chromatographologist at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The Trump girl on CNN has a constant look like she's terrified something or someone is about to jump out from behind the stage and attack her.
posted by splen at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

YOUR FUCKING PARTY CARES. YOUR PARTY STARTED THIS.

To be fair, he wadded that up and threw it back at them.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump learned by osmosis? That explains so much ...
posted by Bella Donna at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2016

The 'outing' was 2007... he was pretty open at the time just not to potential business partners who might not like it.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2016

Yeah I guess uh, I didn't even tag them or anything, like, how did they find that on my small ass meaningless twitter account and retweet it?
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Donald Trump Jr.: So few people get the opportunity to work alongside their kids. Um, what?
posted by dhens at 6:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Was that from The Great Gatsby?
posted by glhaynes at 6:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

EWWWWWWWW.
posted by howfar at 6:31 PM on July 21, 2016

what
posted by OmieWise at 6:31 PM on July 21, 2016

Did Maddow just say that Thiel opposes women having the vote?

He said that it was a setback for the libertarian cause. He believes all kinds of weird mechatechaAynRand shit.
posted by holgate at 6:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Did Maddow just say that Thiel opposes women having the vote?

Yep. He's got some real, real special views. He's less of a republican and more of a post-Objectivist Nietzschean.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

Hey, it's some random rich asshole!
posted by box at 6:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I guess the libertarian part of being a gay libertarian means that you don't care how your party treats your fellow LGBTQ citizens, so long as you're rich enough to avoid the externalities.
posted by codacorolla at 6:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [32 favorites]

For a brief instant I was sure he was just going to walk straight across the stage and off the other side.
posted by penduluum at 6:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Grandfather lived long enough to see the roots of his success. WTF?
posted by Bella Donna at 6:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Did Maddow just say that Thiel opposes women having the vote?

Probably because he actually believes that women's suffrage is an affront to democracy.
posted by zombieflanders at 6:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [31 favorites]

"No more negotiating with terrorists" - what does this even mean? Apart from "persecuting Muslims".

Whatever it means, I'm sure it doesn't mean he'll refrain from doing the kinds of things Reagan did: after Iraq had been removed from the State Department list of State Sponsors of Terrorism sell Saddam arms and anthrax and chemical weapon precursors.
posted by XMLicious at 6:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"here's some cocaine"
posted by double block and bleed at 6:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Yike!
posted by chapps at 6:32 PM on July 21, 2016

how did they find that on my small ass meaningless twitter account and retweet it?

Something to do while the speeches are on, other than count their money.
posted by holgate at 6:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I just want Thiel to tell us to consider an animal and then have his assistant bring that animal out.

I was thinking the exact same thing the whole time he was speaking!
posted by Superplin at 6:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I guess I need to work on better subtweeting.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

But I thought negotiating was Trump's whole thing.
posted by ckape at 6:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"You're just like the deceased at an Irish wake" .... what, he's supposed to allow people to be morose and drink a lot and randomly start dancing or fighting, and then go back to being miserable?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 6:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Why, oh why, can't they be chanting Barrack, Barrack, Barrack for this guy...
posted by OHenryPacey at 6:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"He's good enough, he's smart enough, and gosh darn it, people like him!"
posted by dhens at 6:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

there was no real reason for your tweet.

I don't think you understand Twitter.
posted by nom de poop at 6:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Why are they running this 33 rpm speech at 45rpm?
For giggles and if you are watching on youtube, go to settings, rewind and play Fran Tarkenton's speech at .5 speed.
posted by yertledaturtle at 6:34 PM on July 21, 2016

Women Will Vote for Trump Because Their Husbands Can't Pay the Bills, Trump Adviser Says:

MANAFORT: Many women in this country feel they can’t afford their lives. Their husbands can’t afford paying for the family bills...
MATTHEWS: You know what you just said, however. You said women are concerned about their husbands’ income.
MANAFORT: I can speak personally to that.
MATTHEWS: Is that the 21st century talking? That’s their big concern?

posted by kirkaracha at 6:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

Tom Barrack, CEO of Colony Capital: real estate investor and the Founder and Executive Chairman of Colony Capital. Prior to starting his own business, Barrack served in the Reagan administration as Deputy Undersecretary of the Department of the Interior. Barrack and Donald Trump have worked together on many real estate deals during their time in business. They have developed a mutual admiration and respect, leading Barrack to support Trump’s bid to be President of the United States.

Got a big cheer for saying "I have nothing negative to say about Hillary Clinton only good things to say about Donald."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

who is this guy
is this harry shearer
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

uh...end the era of stupid wars? THAT THE GOP STARTED WHAT?

Obama's done enough massacring and destruction all on his own initiative. 160 civilians in Syria yesterday, FUCK YEAH DEMOCRAT PARTY WOO USA.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 6:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

But I don't have a wife.
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"an easy place to find [Trump] is in his children."

Are we still doing "phrasing?"
posted by Spathe Cadet at 6:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

This person is like a gross sexist cliche machine.
posted by gatorae at 6:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The Trump girl on CNN has a constant look like she's terrified something or someone is about to jump out from behind the stage and attack her.

I just flipped to cnn and saw that. she is a deer with constipation in the headlights of an oncoming truck with a hunter zeroed in from across the road.
posted by futz at 6:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I can't get over the Sully thing about Clinton not knowing what's coming. Of course she knows what's coming, she's had people doing oppo research on this orange dipshit ever since it became clear he actually had a chance of getting the nom, because she's a goddamned professional.

Trump is not magic, he doesn't have mind control powers, he's just a garden variety bully in a country that happens to really like bullies.
posted by tobascodagama at 6:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [42 favorites]

"Colony Capital"
What an appropriate name.
posted by yertledaturtle at 6:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"wives"
posted by howfar at 6:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

This guy's tribute to Melania sounded like it was cribbed off of a Liz Taylor White Diamonds perfume commercial.
posted by mynameisluka at 6:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

This sounds like a best man toast.
posted by sonmi at 6:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

Hillary is going to wipe the floor with Trump.
posted by mochapickle at 6:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Play him off, GE Smith.
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

They found a Real Estate investor who had good experience with Trump? Rarer than a Black convention delegate!
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Someone in the Twitch chat: Buying hotels is something we can all relate to.
posted by dhens at 6:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Is this guy hoping for a threesome later? Yikes!
posted by Bella Donna at 6:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Isn't it a mistake to have Trump speak so late? My parents have gone to bed by now.
posted by bluecore at 6:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Elect Trump: He Shows Up On Time.
posted by Justinian at 6:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

This guy's speech is just a string of Dad Jokes falling flat.
posted by chaoticgood at 6:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

This guy gives me Sydney Pollack in Eyes Wide Shut vibes.
posted by glhaynes at 6:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Punctuality!
posted by hal9k at 6:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

lol cheering at punctuality
posted by defenestration at 6:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

What the fuck is he talking about? "Tell me the things I should know". And something about fixing a hotel?

"He befriends the bewildered" - probably after you've talked to them, mate.
posted by howfar at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

These are pity laughs.
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016

This is an infomercial for his fucking resorts!
posted by cmfletcher at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The discipline of an animal in the jungle.
posted by monospace at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

But maybe The Donald decided not to screw him over because he had Republican Party connections he could use later.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016

Why is the gazelle a she and the lion a he?
posted by mudpuppie at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

rofl "he does things with the discipline of an animal in the jungle." you mean like, he has no use for a cerebral cortex so he just uses his stupid animal instincts? Sounds awesome for a president.
posted by gatorae at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

Lionesses do the hunting.
posted by RakDaddy at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Wait, Donald is the gazelle? The lion? Some sort of gazelle-lion hybrid cooked up in a lab? I'm confused now.
posted by thefoxgod at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Nice wildlife gendering. Thanks.
posted by lauranesson at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Politifact:
"The lion has to run faster than the fastest gazelle".

FALSE
The lioness hunts not the lion.
posted by Talez at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [41 favorites]

Is anybody listening to this guy? Frankly I'm glad to have a moment to go back and read the posts I missed. I'm glad I have something to do while he's talking because I'm guessing most people (not named Donald Trump) are bored out of their ever lovin minds.

Oh good. More anecdotes.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I will say that this is the first person who seems like an actual human comfortable speaking in front of this crowd. I mean, I defy him and all of his works, but he's in a different league from the others so far tonight.

"[Trump] befriends the bewildered."
?
posted by Superplin at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Ah yes, the well-known discipline of an animal in the jungle.
posted by penduluum at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Especially you girls.
posted by box at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

This guy couldn't be more boring.
posted by defenestration at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

WTF you girls weren't alive then? !
posted by AlexiaSky at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Jesus what is this speech. Does trump want to win or what? Get this guy off the stage I feel bad for them lol.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Predominately black Atlantic City is a zoo.
posted by MisantropicPainforest at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2016

Manafort sounds like he's come right out of central casting for Mad Men.

Is the modern Republican party really just wistfully remembering the good old days when 3 martini lunches and smoking in your office all day was the norm?

Can't they just discover cosplay conventions?
posted by vuron at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"He befriends the bewildered." Guess that explains the speaker lineup.
posted by Bella Donna at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

What if the lion's running from the gazelles?
posted by kirkaracha at 6:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Every single person in the Q is simultaneously checking their phones
posted by theodolite at 6:40 PM on July 21, 2016

wait
wait
i remember this guy
he used to be the hype man
for house of pain
danny boy was a smart get
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Wait, did he just say there were no girls in 1989?
posted by sonmi at 6:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Politifact:
"The lion has to run faster than the fastest gazelle".

FALSE
The lioness hunts not the lion.

The lioness only has to run faster than the slowest gazelle.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 6:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

He's going to talk all night, isn't he. I think he's going to talk all night. All. Night.
posted by mudpuppie at 6:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"on time" matters ... but you know, it is the thing you put on your resume for your first job after babysitting because you don't have other things to put there yet.
posted by chapps at 6:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

this speech is a total wtf
posted by defenestration at 6:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

This is the dullest anecdote I have ever heard and I used to have a coworker who would tell me about her bowling tournaments.
posted by winna at 6:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

MANAFORT: I can speak personally to that.

Is he on a contingency deal where if Clinton wins he gets nothing but if Trump's elected, he gets Alaska's oil revenues? I can see why that might upset Mrs Manafort.
posted by holgate at 6:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

OK, this guy started off sounding like a sane person, which was a novelty, but now I can't figure out what he's doing there.
posted by bongo_x at 6:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"And that was when Donald Trump carried Mike Tyson."
posted by mudpuppie at 6:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

'The littlest guy in the shop, Donald Trump"
posted by glhaynes at 6:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The important thing is that, lion or gazelle, scorpion or frog, you still gotta wake up in the morning and get ready for work.
posted by nom de poop at 6:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"[Trump] befriends the bewildered."
Bewilderbeast...
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Well, I guess I was wrong about Trump being a bad person. I'm glad this guy straightened me out about that. {/}
posted by double block and bleed at 6:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I feel like I'm at a party and I have to think of an excuse to get out of this conversation.
posted by bongo_x at 6:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Lions don't hunt by speed anyway. They are not fast animals. They stalk their prey and take them by surprise or spawn camp watering holes and the like.

tl;dr f*ckn' campers.
posted by Justinian at 6:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

"What's the difference between relevancy and mortality?" Yes, a question I often have.
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

this is a shaggy dog story isn't it
posted by defenestration at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

You know how in novels, they omit all of the going to the bathroom, clearing of the throat, saying hi and bye? This guy is all of those parts that you're supposed to cut out.
posted by mynameisluka at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Wake is right.
posted by notyou at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

If this guy was familiar with jokes, or at least just the bear joke specifically, he'd know both the lioness and the gazelle both only have to be faster than the slowest gazelle.
posted by ckape at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Watching this guy speak reminds me of whenever I bartend a VIP event and one of the old, rich, white donors decides to tell me an asinine ten minute story while I'm trying to serve other customers.
posted by codacorolla at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

(note: fast by comparison to their prey. They are faster than I am.)
posted by Justinian at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016

yeah, I feel embarrassed for everyone who was a part of making this moment happen.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"in the jungle, the quiet jungle. the lion sleeps tonight..."
posted by futz at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

'The agony that you have with your father?' TF?
posted by box at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"I'm not the greatest man, you are! No you. No you. I know you are but what am I?"

"Now what kind of guy does blah blah blah?" I don't know, Barrack. Tell me what kind of kid thinks Donald Trump is the Greatest Guy in the World?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016

I don't know about you guys, I'm putting all my money into this guy's line of herbal viagra.
posted by uosuaq at 6:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

"What's the difference between relevancy and mortality?"

Is he talking about him and Trump getting stoned?
posted by howfar at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I have an idea of something he could polish
posted by futz at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2016

"necklace of globalism"
posted by AndrewInDC at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Professional lip reader reveals what Trump said to Ivanka during Cruz's speech: 'Do you think I made a mistake?'
posted by zakur at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

You guys are wrong, this guy is good and people will like him and think, "hey, Trump has this nice friend, look how earnest, look how normal."
posted by zennie at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

This needs more vaudeville hooks.
posted by phphph at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2016

he's definitely saying some words, yup
posted by sonmi at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The necklace of prosperity.
posted by monospace at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Yes, Donald Trump is the littlest guy in the shop, although that's not what the guy meant to say. We have found agreement. AT LAST!
posted by Bella Donna at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

His great-uncle was right with the first bit of advice.
posted by lauranesson at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016

"potentially"? That's not how you speak at a party convention.
posted by ckape at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016

this is a shaggy dog story isn't it

He forgot the punchline! "Pardon me Roy, is that the cat that chewed your new shoes?"
posted by bongo_x at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

oh yes mouse rat cover band
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Jesus okay the band's not so bad compared to that speech. Sorry Talez, you're right my tweet was shitty. Oh my freaking god.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016

This guy is from the ,"baffle them with bullshit", line of salesmen.
posted by yertledaturtle at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Anchovy, Irish wake, gazelle, Mike Tyson, 82nd and Madison, Michener tale. Is this guy doing an improv bit? Like, he pulled a bunch a words and phrases out of a hat and had to work all of them into his speech?
posted by mhum at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

He's a Lebanese-American Catholic billionaire who worked for Reagan, the Saudis, and Nixon, lives in a Castle in the South of France and a ranch near Santa Barbara, financed Annie Leibowitz and Michael Jackson, and these are his best stories?
posted by cell divide at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [46 favorites]

Sure, a Michener reference. That'll bring in that valuable 18-24 demo.
posted by penduluum at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

WAIT I FIGURED IT OUT

By the time Trump takes the stage, the audience will be so stupefied and numb that all Trump has to do is smile and deliver a few lines that aren't overtly offensive (like, "America should be great again!") and they'll be so filled with the enthusiasm that has been suppressed all day, that they'll leap up cheering.

Trump didn't want them to waste their enthusiasm on lesser speakers! That stuff is precious, you know; you only get so much per day, so much per year. You can't just be waving it around, dripping it all over the floor at any ol' speaker. Need to save it for the important celebrities.

It was okay for people to get all riled up yesterday and the day before, all evening, because Trump wasn't going to lose out on the Special Enthusiasm Mana that's so rare and limited.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

little tiny jeweler's hands
posted by nom de poop at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The important part of this guy's story is that he had an onion tied to his belt, which was the style at the time.
posted by dry white toast at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

Jebus, this singer. It's like John Ashcroft put through a Nashville filter.
posted by RakDaddy at 6:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

what a great and relevant song guys
posted by the turtle's teeth at 6:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

My brain went sideways due to that speech.
posted by AlexiaSky at 6:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wow, "It's like a Michener tale..." James Michener? The writer from the 70's? Geez dud, when was the last time you read a book?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

So many musical interludes.
posted by box at 6:45 PM on July 21, 2016

Opening chording vamp on this song before it revealed itself to be a thematic thing was awfully close to Keep On Rockin' In The Free World and I was wondering if they were going to actually go that fucking far.
posted by cortex at 6:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

This song sounds like they're making it up as they go along. Kind of like the whole campaign...
posted by mochapickle at 6:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Anyone else thinking "we need a montage" to this song?
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

This song has at least three chords that I can identify!
posted by mudpuppie at 6:46 PM on July 21, 2016

You guys are wrong, this guy is good and people will like him and think, "hey, Trump has this nice friend, look how earnest, look how normal."

I dunno, conservatives get bored too.
posted by penduluum at 6:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

this song sucks.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 6:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I really wish I were stoned right now.
posted by RakDaddy at 6:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Watching the YouTube feed and these people can't even dance to a country song.
posted by octothorpe at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016

Man the dems could like cut their convention budget in half and still have a better show next week.
posted by vrakatar at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

weird al wads up a scrap of paper with
make america grape again
written on it

theyre not ready al
he whispers
not ready

ubu sits
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Did Thiel say, "I no longer believe that freedom and democracy are compatible"?
posted by Navelgazer at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The necklace of prosperity.

Oh, now we're back to double entendre lyrics?
posted by bongo_x at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I really did think they were going to try to whip the crowd up into a lather before Trump speaks. These speakers have been unbelievably boring.
posted by double block and bleed at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

This would be a lot more fun if they just turned it into a comedy roast and invited a whole bunch of comedians like Norm MacDonald to throw shade at the Trumpster.

Honestly it would probably be more useful to his election chances than this fiasco as well
posted by vuron at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Did the singer just end by shouting "Mahalo!"?
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I would like to thank each and every one of you for reporting on this so that I can avoid it entirely. I look forward to reading more of this thread tomorrow when I sober up.
posted by jabo at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

of course Donald has a special golden podium.
posted by gatorae at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016

The dancing is the best part!
posted by mochapickle at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Between Tom Barrack and Fran Tarkenton there are some terrible fucking anecdotes on that stage tonight. This is making long for the days of the tasty tangerine lady.
posted by sporkwort at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Come visit RakDaddy we're packing the binger machine as I type.
posted by vrakatar at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

This song has at least three chords that I can identify!

and not one single wasted extra chord. sounds amazingly like a neal young 'composition'.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Why's that man wearing a boater? Is that a thing?
posted by howfar at 6:48 PM on July 21, 2016

If I think of this band as the soundtrack band to "Team America: World Police" it starts to make more sense what happening on stage tonight.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Did the singer just end by shouting "Mahalo!"?

"Ohio!"
posted by cortex at 6:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Fucking "Stay With Me"?!?
posted by bongo_x at 6:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

How can the major media cover this with seriousness and still feel good about their profession?

(rhetorical, paycheck)
posted by futz at 6:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Pray with Me
posted by hal9k at 6:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I can just imagine in the control room "Let's go to the White People Dancing Cam™ #2... Yeah... That's some good white people dancing... White People Dancing Cam™ #3 get ready and....... ok there's more white people dancing"
posted by Talez at 6:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Did Thiel say, "I no longer believe that freedom and democracy are compatible"?

I would imagine that he realized freedom and democracy are compatible if you get voted for rather than just do the voting, or if you're in good with the guy who gets voted for.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 6:49 PM on July 21, 2016

> Ohio

No, I like my version more.

*pours more wine*
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I keep waiting for "Masters of War", but so far, no joy.
posted by uosuaq at 6:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Could one of you masochists post a list of the speakers you've been forcing yourself to listen to tonight? The official program doesn't match your comments (unless i mis-googled it), and I don't have enough alcohol in my house to do my own watching.

Thanks.
posted by ocschwar at 6:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Latinos para Trump" sign. Huh.
posted by dhens at 6:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Oh man I've been completely forgetting to keep an eye out for Hydra lapel pins.
posted by ckape at 6:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Why's that man wearing a boater? Is that a thing?

Kind of a weird American political tradition, yeah. You don't see them as much anymore, but they showed up at conventions decades after people stopped wearing them in regular life.
posted by penduluum at 6:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Heh, they just showed a shot of an audience member holding a sign that, with letters blocked out by other audience members' heads, said FAMILIES FOR RUM.
posted by mudpuppie at 6:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

Can someone slip the band some sheet music to an I. Ron Butterfly composition, like in that Simpsons episode?
posted by AndrewInDC at 6:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

the current speaker is the ghost of rock and roll
i mean
g e smith
and the thursday night

...wait for it...

BLAND
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Did Thiel say, "I no longer believe that freedom and democracy are compatible"?

He's one of those libertarian assholes who redefine "freedom" to mean "a total absence of restraints on property owners" and then insists that everybody else is a goddamned totalitarian.
posted by Pope Guilty at 6:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

"Latinos para Trump" sign. Huh.

All being held by white people.
posted by Talez at 6:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I just switched from the cspan stream to the twitch one. Cspan was lagging like crazy but twitch's feed is rock solid so far.
posted by double block and bleed at 6:51 PM on July 21, 2016

Not a young Garrison Keillor, but an incredibly lifelike simulacra!
posted by penduluum at 6:51 PM on July 21, 2016

bongo_x: "Fucking "Stay With Me"?!?"

It's kind of fun watching them (try to) dance to a song about a one night hook-up.
posted by octothorpe at 6:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I'm still confused about being the anchovy on Ivanka's Caesar salad. Who's eating the salad? Is she the salad? Is she eating the salad? Are we all eating the salad? Does the eater not want anchovy? Is this a rich-person reference that I'm too salt-of-the-earth to get?
posted by lauranesson at 6:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

A. My net access is lagging so I'm behind you all which doesn't matter because B. I will shortly be collecting my bike from a train station and riding home, thus missing Mister D's big moment. I will be checking back here so please, please, please keep the snark going. It's all I have to look forward to this evening.
posted by Bella Donna at 6:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Another song?
posted by howfar at 6:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He's one of those libertarian assholes who redefine "freedom" to mean "a total absence of restraints on property owners" and then insists that everybody else is a goddamned totalitarian.

"TAXATION IS THEFT!"
posted by infinitywaltz at 6:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

anchovy on Ivanka's Caesar salad

Oh my god, I'm so glad you typed that. I thought he said "a vodka Caesar salad" and have been puzzling over it for half an hour.
posted by mudpuppie at 6:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

You asked for it and we're giving it to you! AN UNPRECEDENTED THIRD STRAIGHT SONG

DANCE TO THIS HAMMOND ORGAN, WHITE FOLKS

I DARE YOU TO TRY
posted by penduluum at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

I'm still confused about being the anchovy on Ivanka's Caesar salad. Who's eating the salad? Is she the salad? Is she eating the salad? Are we all eating the salad? Does the eater not want anchovy? Is this a rich-person reference that I'm too salt-of-the-earth to get?

If he's the anchovy on her salad it might be his only chance to be inside of her.
posted by Talez at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

ok are they just playing music? Y'alls talking about rince but the youtube rnc live stream [official] is just music. And Cspan wouldn't load. Help me out someone?
posted by rebent at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2016

I'm still confused about being the anchovy on Ivanka's Caesar salad. Who's eating the salad? Is she the salad? Is she eating the salad? Are we all eating the salad? Does the eater not want anchovy? Is this a rich-person reference that I'm too salt-of-the-earth to get?

In fairness, the guy did resemble an anchovy.
posted by carrienation at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2016

It's kind of fun watching them (try to) dance to a song about a one night hook-up.

A hookup and "get the hell out when we're done".
posted by bongo_x at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

WHAT THE HELL ANCHOVY WHAT DID I MISS?
posted by vrakatar at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2016

I feel like I am in the lounge of a Ramada Inn.
posted by yertledaturtle at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Jon Voight. I'm boycotting all of your films from now til forever.
posted by yesster at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2016

"TAXATION IS THEFT!"

Ah, the slogans of my childhood.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Hey, a video narrated by Jon Voight. Holding out for a Ray Donovan plug.
posted by cortex at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2016

"As you know, he's running for President of the United States."

WHAT?
posted by AndrewInDC at 6:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

hey, isn't that the guy who used to own george costanza's le baron?
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 6:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

Trump's toupee finally killed itself from shame of having to go outside. They're bringing in the understudy.
posted by mrzarquon at 6:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

hello i am jon voight
and this is my third grade report
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

#TrumpIsWithYou is going to be such an easy hashtag to take the piss out of. Some many photoshop opportunities.
posted by howfar at 6:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I find it hilarious that they're bringing in several speakers by video, and that they couldn't find anyone worthy and willing to actually standing on the stage to introduce Trump.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 6:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Hi Jon. Yeah, okay yeah dude.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:55 PM on July 21, 2016

"Fucking "Stay With Me"?!?"

Once again, Tom Petty feels a disturbance in the force.
posted by tonycpsu at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Joe Buck: Uh, well, sir, I ain't a f'real cowboy. But I am one helluva stud!
posted by carmicha at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

hey, isn't that the guy who used to own george costanza's le baron?

The bite marks in the pencil prove it.
posted by mudpuppie at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Is this a rich-person reference that I'm too salt-of-the-earth to get?

And how does this expression relate to the fact that anchovies are salty?
posted by nickmark at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

It's interesting how gung-ho they are about NYC; Republicans usually hate New York as being too... well... you know. We've all seen that West Wing episode.
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

ok legit tho as a fashion nerd I love these history shots
posted by rebent at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Queens is part of NYC, YOU IDIOT.
posted by zarq at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

ok are they just playing music? Y'alls talking about rince but the youtube rnc live stream [official] is just music. And Cspan wouldn't load. Help me out someone?

Does your stream have LIVE with the little red dot next to it next to the volume? Sometimes lagging will get you behind but if you click LIVE you can catch up
posted by mochapickle at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Donald Trump saved New York?!! Wah?
posted by octothorpe at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

This is really the limit of star power that Trump was able to bring to bear?

Where are the a-class celebs and musicians willing to rock out with Trump?

I mean you just know that Clinton will have a shit ton of relevant celebs like Beyonce, Jay-Z, Katy Perry, like 98% of Hollywood, etc showing up the Democratic convention and complete wastes of time like Thiel are the best he can get?

I'm just waiting for Springsteen to put Chris Christie on a blacklist for any concerts so that he can never ever attend another concert without having to put on a diabolical disguise.
posted by vuron at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

It's kind of fun watching them (try to) dance to a song about a one night hook-up.

"Just call me Fuhrer of the morning, baby..."
posted by Pope Guilty at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Anyone getting Back to the Future 2 flashbacks with this John Voigt promo? Art imitates life imitates art.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4m848bh1iY

We have achieved peak hyperreality.
posted by Room 101 at 6:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I'm back whatd I miss. Just kidding I'll figure it out.

I went to my local bar, where the bartenders have a reputation for being standoffish but great. I sat at the bar and (gently) elbowed a girl next to me who didn't notice the bartender holding her drink calling her name multiple times, and the bartender came back and gave me a free drink for that. So my night's going well.
posted by DynamiteToast at 6:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Can't we just make Trump the Secretary of Skating Rinks and call it a day?
posted by Bella Donna at 6:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

We've gone from Romney bragging about saving an entire Winter Olympics to Trump bragging about saving one rink.
posted by Drinky Die at 6:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Man they couldn't even get Ted Nugent?
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

As a native son of Los Angeles: whoooooo caaaaares. Honestly, couldn't give a shit about places I have barely heard of in NYC.
posted by sideshow at 6:57 PM on July 21, 2016

Thank glob I bought more gin. Of course, I'm almost out again.
posted by mollweide at 6:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I really wish I were stoned right now.

Hasn't helped me so far, sadly.

So I just came back from a few minutes of shutting off all my screens, putting on headphones and listening to Hamilton, because I really needed a dose of optimism about America. After listening to a few tracks, I turned the TV back on, and looking at that mass of red, white and blue, it hit me that there's a pretty good chance that more than half of the people at that convention would consider Hamilton "liberal propaganda".

So much for the optimism.
posted by Gaz Errant at 6:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Ha donald is like the new yorker even new yorkers hate.
posted by vrakatar at 6:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Seeing so many mentions of the band, I realize the same band should be hired to play the DNC, where they magically will stop phoning it in and reveal they know more than ten songs. "Those are just the ones the RNC was willing to pay the mechanical license for."
posted by fedward at 6:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

This is the same basic narrative they gave Don Jr. in the other video. Did they just decide to keep both takes? Or no, I guess they probably just couldn't find enough speakers to fill the time. That's wonderful.
posted by penduluum at 6:57 PM on July 21, 2016

Did they accidentally splice in a real estate commercial? Donald, you may have some wonderful properties, but they're on the wrong side of the country for me to do a timeshare with.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 6:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

When you need advertisement for a event that is all about you, because there is so so little to say.
posted by AlexiaSky at 6:58 PM on July 21, 2016

I kind of get the feeling that as far as Trump is concerned, his children are Ivanka, Donald Jr, and Misc.
posted by Justinian at 6:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

"Everyone in this arena keeps all 9 of their CDs in a tower in the living room." True.
posted by winna at 6:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

They need a shot of him signing the front of a gigantic ass check.
posted by nom de poop at 6:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump created thousands of jobs. Many of them for women. So put that in your pipe and smoke it, ladies.
posted by sporkwort at 6:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Donald Trump saved New York?!! Wah?

Did you miss the Godzilla part?
posted by bongo_x at 6:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

My entire family just stood up and yelled "look!" and ran with excitement and enthusiasm... to watch the grey cat and the orange cat walk along our fence.
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [35 favorites]

Do a shot every time a current or former Trump employee talks favorably about their boss.... and you'll be dead before the video is over.
posted by zarq at 6:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

It's not so much a career of doing things others said couldn't be done, but more things they said shouldn't be done.
posted by nickmark at 6:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Is the commercial break over yet?
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:59 PM on July 21, 2016

excuse me mister taxi driver
where do i press to make the
new york video stop playing

i need to save my brain cells for jeckyl and hydes
that place is dope
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

did it say "it's donald's mission to help others"?

did it say that
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:00 PM on July 21, 2016

My entire family just stood up and yelled "look!" and ran with excitement and enthusiasm... to watch the grey cat and the orange cat walk along our fence.

Did you get pictures?
posted by infinitywaltz at 7:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

RUDY CAN REMEMBER A TEACHER!
posted by vrakatar at 7:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I kind of get the feeling that as far as Trump is concerned, his children are Ivanka, Donald Jr, and Misc.

You're absolutely right. I feel sorry for Misc.
I kind of feel sorry for all of them, but Misc. is more of an afterthought than Peggy.
posted by Superplin at 7:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

I watched my buddy's wedding video last night. The production value was 10x higher than this thing and it cost $1.3k. A couple dudes from the local film school could have done better than this.
posted by sideshow at 7:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

So I just came back from a few minutes of shutting off all my screens, putting on headphones and listening to Hamilton, because I really needed a dose of optimism about America.

I have three tabs open - CSPAN, this one, and Michelle Obama's carpool karaoke video.
posted by une_heure_pleine at 7:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I wonder if Trump will brag about making lots of jobs for undocumented workers at his hotels
posted by vuron at 7:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

> So much for the optimism.

For me, the line on whether this would be a good or bad convention was whether or not there would be fatalities, so I'm feeling pretty positive about America so far.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

"He can make us feel like what we should feel like."

Trumpiness!
posted by stolyarova at 7:01 PM on July 21, 2016

If he can turn a garbage dump into a beautiful golf course, imagine what he can do with a national park!
posted by double block and bleed at 7:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

There is weird creepy lightning here in Chicago btw. It is very Shakespeare.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"We're exceptionally lucky people, living in this country."

Not according to Trump.
posted by AndrewInDC at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

RUDY CAN REMEMBER A TEACHER

I think that's the longest he's talked without mentioning 9 and 11
posted by splen at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Donald Trump promoted a conspiracy theory that the United States' first black president was born in Kenya.
posted by glhaynes at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

GAG.
posted by wallabear at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016

> Did you get pictures

No, I was too surprised; the orange cat and the grey cat have never been seen together before. Hey guys let's ignore Trump and talk about the cats of our neighborhoods.
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

Is it still Voight doing the voiceover?
posted by vrakatar at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016

This infomercial music is the same music they use for baseball movies.
posted by mochapickle at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

This history of Trump as told by Jon Voight video is making me feel like I just pushed a button in a museum.
posted by item at 9:57 PM on July 21 [−] Favorite added

Oh God you nailed it!

And for the person who wanted the schedule of speakers here is my crib

Ivanka is the next speaker and then her dad will be the last (hopefully)
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

HERE COMES THE SUN?!
posted by stolyarova at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

A couple dudes from the local film school could have done better than this.

There was a Republican commercial earlier and I swear I thought they were trying to get me to sue for mesothelioma.
posted by bongo_x at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

He'll stand up for our soldiers, unless they're POWs.
posted by zarq at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Here Comes The .... Daughter
posted by hal9k at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

IVANKA'S ENTRANCE MUSIC NO
posted by donatella at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016

Came for the band and the despair. Is this the same band? Not feeling the love from Tuesday.
The despair walks on stage in seven minutes, give or take a few.
Meanwhile, the husband is channel-surfing everything but the convention. My headphones are plugged in so he doesn't have to hear what's on Twitch (thanks!) so it's just waiting for the next shoe to drop.

And I'm on board with the theory, "He goes in one door, takes the oath, walks out the other and hands in his resignation." This is about face time and becoming caught on a runaway train. And having a president in-name-only is a scary situation.
I'd rather Clinton wins. I'd much rather not guess who is the person with his hand on the wheel.
posted by TrishaU at 7:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

All of the footage they're using is from his campaign. It's hilarious. They don't have any other video of him looking like a leader, talking to people ... they might not have any other video of him at all that they wouldn't have to license from The Apprentice.
posted by penduluum at 7:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Man Jon, that was such a crappy SNL skit, can we get the band back on?
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:03 PM on July 21, 2016

George Harrison must be yogic flying in his grave.
posted by howfar at 7:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

They keep talking about making America great "again" but don't mention when it was great before.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 7:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Apropos of nothing in particular, I have a buddy who's a camera dude here in New York and he had to shoot Trump last year. He said the lights had weird gels on them that they'd never use and Trump insisted they turn a monitor in his direction. Later, the woman whom he brought to do makeup tried to drop hints to my buddy that she actually could do her job; he just genuinely wanted to be orange.
posted by lauranesson at 7:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [27 favorites]

Donald always gave to New York . . . anonymously.
posted by cmfletcher at 7:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Very talented. Very.
posted by futz at 7:03 PM on July 21, 2016

Oh, yes, such a sacrifice for Donald Trump to be the most powerful man in the world.
posted by stolyarova at 7:03 PM on July 21, 2016

NO! CENA IS THE PEOPLE"S CHAMP!
posted by vrakatar at 7:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Fuck. This is really happening.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:03 PM on July 21, 2016

THERE IS FAKE WIND BLOWING HER BLONDE HAIR
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

there's this brown cat in my apartment complex who walks with a limp and hides in the storm sewer drains

it's super sad
posted by indubitable at 7:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Do people think trade agreements are like "OK, China. We'll trade you six thousand Oldsmobiles and a Ken Griffrey Jr. rookie card for two hundred iPhones and seventy thousand t-shirts"?
posted by mhum at 7:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

That was a really weird "not a Republican" line. They didn't like it.
posted by howfar at 7:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Here Comes the Son introduces Ivanka.

*boggle*
posted by petebest at 7:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Hello fellow millenials
posted by sporkwort at 7:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

"The People's nominee" just like the People's Princess but more American and more testicular.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:04 PM on July 21, 2016

Way to tell the convention you're not really a Republican.
posted by bongo_x at 7:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

They keep talking about making America great "again" but don't mention when it was great before.

Before the 60s. 1960s, 1860s, take your pick.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

They keep talking about making America great "again" but don't mention when it was great before.

hint: black president.
posted by futz at 7:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

OMG
Frm Broadroom Judge on The Apprentice is actually listed as one of her accomplishments.
posted by chaoticgood at 7:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

She just said she's not a Republican.
At the RNC.

I mean.
posted by Superplin at 7:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Pretty sure Ivanka just plagiarized Daft Punk.
posted by cortex at 7:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I like that they keep harping on the "16 qualified competitors" line, so as not to have to say "Trump was the last man standing in a clown car demolition derby."
posted by Panjandrum at 7:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

You tube has a live feed that seems to be working well for me.
posted by AlexiaSky at 7:05 PM on July 21, 2016

Did she just copy something from Kanye West?
posted by Stynxno at 7:05 PM on July 21, 2016

They keep talking about making America great "again" but don't mention when it was great before.

Good strategy. Everyone can fill in their own time and make it work.

At this point I'm thinking 1491.
posted by thefoxgod at 7:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

NO! CENA IS THE PEOPLE"S CHAMP

This would be a great time for Rubio, or anyone, to cash in Money in the Bank
posted by splen at 7:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

She's seen her dad fight lawsuits, thousands of them, but that didn't make the speech.
posted by Bella Donna at 7:05 PM on July 21, 2016

Ivanka's doing a good job.
posted by DynamiteToast at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm done here. Can't stomach any more. "Little darling." from the groper to his daughter
posted by yesster at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

TRUMP/GALT 2016!
posted by vrakatar at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2016

Or daft punk featuring Kanye.....darn you cortex.
posted by Stynxno at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2016

Unfortunate pause after the word "marry" there. I was like... whhaaaaa? Oh.
posted by Justinian at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I hope they leave the fan on. Please let them leave the fan on.
posted by howfar at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

He is figniting for the country?! Go ahead and patronize the entire military.
posted by AlexiaSky at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2016

I'd pay so much money right now for the lights to go out during Trump's speech and the the Undertaker's music to come on and the have the lights go on and have Taker do a choke slam to Trump with Jim Ross going "Buh Gawd I think he's dead"

Would make up for all the mean things I've said about Trump.
posted by vuron at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

if you marry vision with passion and an enuring work ethic aren't you a polygamist
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Hello fellow millenials

How do you do, fellow kids?
posted by dhens at 7:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

> wow, that is so not what I need right now

The orange cat and grey cat both seem really healthy and well-fed. They like to sit under the window and taunt my two cats, who are both indoor cats (and also well-fed, no matter what they tell you).
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

"His signature black felt-tip pen".
posted by howfar at 7:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

as a millennial i am here to tell you
donald trump knows where
moltres spawns
maybe even zapdos
but not articuno
because articuno has a private pokemon server
and is taking all the pikachus
...
also i played with an erector set so i guess i grew up poor or something because when the fuck would a rich person under forty even see a goddamn erector set
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

Why aren't any of these random people Trump has helped with his "expensive network" coming forward?
posted by carmicha at 7:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

All those old white guys look super uninterested in anything she has to say.
posted by stolyarova at 7:07 PM on July 21, 2016

Ivanka, you're 34. You are not a Millennial. You (and I) are in that awkward gap between generations. But whatever, pander away. I'm sure and hordes of disaffected 20 somethings can bond over shared experiences. They can talk about their favorite 90s Nick at Nite cartoons and you can tell them how you used to drink imported xenon water from gold goblets.
posted by Panjandrum at 7:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

SMOKE BREAK
posted by vrakatar at 7:08 PM on July 21, 2016

The newspaper stories thing is a good anecdote.
posted by Superplin at 7:08 PM on July 21, 2016

If trump was clipping people out of the paper and doing a Bruce Wayne business to help them, why can not one of those people be found to speak about it.

MYSTERY
posted by winna at 7:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Love all these stories about all the people Trump personally helped. Interesting that none of them have come forward before now.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"...every conviction he's hold."
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 7:08 PM on July 21, 2016

When run properly...
posted by futz at 7:08 PM on July 21, 2016

I've worked with people who worked in "the family business"

it's certainly an experience.
posted by rebent at 7:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"He taught us there is nothing we cannot accomplish if we marry..................vision" and something else I didn't catch because I thought she was going to say "marry well."

I sure would love to meet this empathetic, inspiring guy they keep talking about. Unfortunately we got his evil twin-- the petty, vengeful tyrant with the tiny hands.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Is this a thing? Being introduced by a family member instead of someone who's actually got experience in the field he's running in? Because I've never watched one of these things before, and I'm really kinda baffled at (1) the string of skinny blonde women (I shouldn't be; I've seen country videos) and (2) that he's being introduced, not by his wife, not by any experienced politician OR business person, but by his daughter?

Does anyone expect Chelsea to introduce Hillary?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Essnississies?
posted by stolyarova at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Incompetence is impossible to hide."

Let's hope.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

"He would call them to his office in Trump Tower.. He would help them... They would leave his office happy and empowered.."

Is there a name for this tense? Past shitthatdidn'thappen imperfect?
posted by nom de poop at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Where is Trump's sister-in-law?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016

You also saw women!
posted by mudpuppie at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

There are some very angry faces in this hall.
posted by howfar at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"His signature black felt-tip pen".
posted by gatorae at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"Colorblind" is a word with a real meaning
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016

Maybe he really is just planning to invite all Americans to Trump Tower.
I mean, they'll have to pay their own way, but think of the experience!
posted by Superplin at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The house on the end of our block has a feral cat colony in the yard (they put out food, water, and provide shelter, and the cats all appear to have the clipped ears signaling TNR). I always say hello, except to the tough cat that wants to kill me. There are a couple really cute tabbies, but: feral. Sigh.
posted by fedward at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Dysfunctional Family Circus.
posted by holgate at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016

"He is colorblind and gender-neutral."
posted by lauranesson at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wonder which of Trump's kids will launch a political career first.

Ivanka is doing well. They need her to humanize him, and she's doing a better job than the rest of the Trump family has so far.
posted by joedan at 7:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

People left her father's office and then thought life could be good again.
posted by bongo_x at 7:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The scary thing is that she's the best spoken person at this convention.
posted by Talez at 7:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I'd pay so much money right now for the lights to go out during Trump's speech and the the Undertaker's music to come on and the have the lights go on and have Taker do a choke slam to Trump with Jim Ross going "Buh Gawd I think he's dead"

Would make up for all the mean things I've said about Trump.

Needs revenge for Trump stealing his entrance the other night.
posted by Drinky Die at 7:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wow. This is all twisted fiction. Lies lies lies. And the people eat it up....
posted by sevenofspades at 7:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

So...he's a micromanager?
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I think the real base of the GOP is baseless assertions.
posted by Panjandrum at 7:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

What about all the people he has stiffed?
posted by futz at 7:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

This 11th hour push to humanize the shit out of Trump as a super nice, generous, helpful, caring guy is predictable enough, but it's so directly at odds with not just a generic problematic coldness in the candidate but with his actual overt tough guy brand that it's hard to know what to make of it.

I mean, it's dotting i's and crossing t's, but it's a literal 180 in this case.
posted by cortex at 7:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

So

She didn't write this, right? She's really belting it out! Better than I could, that's for sure. belt belt belt. hmm. belt belt belt, hmm. belt belt hmm.

She just claimed women get maternity support. Any fact check on that?
posted by rebent at 7:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Ivanka could be Girl Hitler For President in a few years.
posted by stolyarova at 7:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Chelsea Clinton will be introducing her mother.
posted by carmicha at 7:11 PM on July 21, 2016

"Women are paid equally for the work they do"... so, Trump would be in favor of an equal pay amendment, right? Since it's a practice he already considers fair and reasonable?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

so where are the people from the melting pot from all walks of life that trump asked for their opinions
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016

Is she going to endorse Hillary at the end of this because that would totally steal Cruz's thunder from last night.

"Fuck you Cruz with your vote your conscience bullshit, I'm crashing this plane with no survivors"
posted by vuron at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

This is disgusting. Your dad is a pig. And your base doesn't believe in the wage gap.
posted by futz at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

Wait wtf is this promise?
posted by stolyarova at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016

He talks to the electricians and painters, and then refuses to pay their bill.
posted by zachlipton at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

wow that was a VERY close lightning, just now
posted by theodolite at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Wow the wage gap talk is going over like a lead balloon.
posted by winna at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

wait....

isn't this the DNC platform?
posted by rebent at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

This is insanely tone-deaf and pandering.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

We heard some cat yowling last night, switched on the porch light, and next door's cat (aka Intruder Cat because she thinks our garden is her territory) scampered past, turned around to look down the drive, and started hissing at cats unknown. Senior Cat (our cats stay indoors) looked on from the windowsill with his usual nonchalance.
posted by holgate at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Goodness, I had no idea he was such a feminist.
posted by vverse23 at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Ah. gee. I get where they are going now. It's not gender it's bio-essentialist motherhood that they are gonna use to support the "right" kind of woman. Jesus.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

She's saying the wrong things.
posted by bongo_x at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016

"He is colorblind and gender-neutral."

Was she referring to red-green color blindness? She must have, right?
posted by Talez at 7:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

oh shit i think pence just got demoted
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The delegates are confused.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Wait, motherhood is the single biggest reason for gender-based income disparity... but women must be forced to carry children to term because abortion = baby murder?
posted by mudpuppie at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

He's in Real Estate. Huh. Wasn't Washington in Real Estate? And look at him! Top notch presidents. The best.
posted by petebest at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2016

She's doing a great job selling it, but I'm having a hard time buying Trump as the pro-women candidate in this race.
posted by joedan at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I don't know about Trump's other businesses, but his campaign pays women less than men.
posted by stolyarova at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

carmicha, thanks. I have no idea how these things usually run.

It's kinda creepy to hear Ivanka talk about Donald Trump as if he were some stranger rather than the guy who's (hopefully) cleaned mashed banana out of her hair at some point.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

And here I thought paid maternity leave was a democratic thing.
posted by AlexiaSky at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Trump has never mentioned child care while it's a central part of Clinton's campaign. Did she just announce policy?
posted by zachlipton at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

This is not the campaign I've been witnessing this past year. Is she introducing the wrong candidate? Did I have too much wine?
posted by Superplin at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

This is truly insane.
posted by mollweide at 7:14 PM on July 21, 2016

"Real people are hired to do real work."

I mean I unfortunately know what they mean by real but it just sounds ridiculous.
posted by yellowbinder at 7:14 PM on July 21, 2016

wow that was a VERY close lightning, just now

Yeah we were watching WTTW but had to switch back to MSNBC because the storm is fucking with the broadcast.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

It's benevolent sexism. Want equal pay? Then be the right kind of Baby Maker.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Size references.
posted by SillyShepherd at 7:14 PM on July 21, 2016

"You're going to be thinking anyway" Ohoho that naughty little girl having THOUGHTS
posted by stolyarova at 7:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"If you're going to be thinking anyway..." ???
posted by wallabear at 7:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Ah. gee. I get where they are going now. It's not gender it's bio-essentialist motherhood that they are gonna use to support the "right" kind of woman. Jesus.

Exactly. That bit about Trump changing laws made when women were not fairly paid and focusing on fair family policies is horrifying.
posted by winna at 7:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Equal pay for equal work

Trump flipflops on this issue:

The New York businessman has flip-flopped on the issue of equal pay. Trump said last August that men and women deserve “equal pay for equal work,” but just a few months later, he dismissed the idea of a gender pay gap.

“You’re gonna make the same if you do as good a job,” Trump told an audience member during a Manchester, N.H. event in October.

Perhaps more telling, a former staffer sued Trump in January for gender discrimination, claiming the Republican presidential candidate’s campaign paid male staffers more women in the same role.

posted by beagle at 7:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Trump is apparently all in for equal wages and paid child care. Who knew?
posted by bongo_x at 7:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Dagny is amazing tonight!
posted by armacy at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Aww, she got permission to think.
posted by futz at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

His daughter referenced his size. Ew.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Ivanka, if you're going to be thinking anyway, you might as well think big." Like her thinking was exhausting.
posted by lauranesson at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I wonder if her calm, measured competence is going to presage a new Donald Trump when he comes out to speak, if that bland nothing in his prepared remarks is actually what he's going to deliver.
posted by penduluum at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016

So he's never gonna give us up? Never gonna let us down?
posted by vverse23 at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

We have a running gag with our littlest inside cat, Hope, about the boy cat from two doors' down being her boyfriend, and her getting mad about it, like, "He's not my boyfriend, he's just a boy that's...that I hate." Anyway, one day he left a present at our front door, and we were like, "You're boyfriend brought you a present," and she was like, "He's not my boyfriend, he's just a...what'd he bring me?" "Half of a dead rat." "Oh...which half?" "The bottom half, sweetie." "Oh...he LIKES me!"
posted by infinitywaltz at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [31 favorites]

My cat is a fat grey tabby — he got outside once and we found him having a fight with another fat grey tabby. Basically the same cat. Like they were instantly drawn to each other because there can only be one fat grey tabby ruling the neighbourhood. We had to break it up and it was a genuine "Ah but which of us is the REAL Chancellor, and which is the Impostor?" moment.

We did get the right one back inside. I think.
posted by saturday_morning at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [31 favorites]

Oh man. Ivanka's gonna run in 2020 just to fuck Cruz's shit up.
posted by mhum at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

"When my father says he's building a building... real people get real jobs."

Just, not all of them get paid. And the investors often end up suing.
posted by dnash at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

It's now officially the Everything-To-Everyone campaign.
posted by mochapickle at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Should I unmute my TV now?
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016

Donald Trump is going to take us all to that big rock candy mountain.
posted by codacorolla at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Some of the guys in the audience are openly ogling Ivanka.
posted by carmicha at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016

Kitten therapy for those who need it.
posted by maggieb at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I seriously wonder if she dropped the child care and equal pay stuff in without talking to anyone just because.
posted by zachlipton at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Trump has never mentioned child care while it's a central part of Clinton's campaign. Did she just announce policy?

The media had better ask for a policy statement on this.
posted by cmfletcher at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

If he's colorblind, how did he know that his African-American was in the audience?
posted by glhaynes at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

WTF Clinton has been fighting for women's rights for DECADES
posted by stolyarova at 7:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Does anyone else think she's just making shit up to embarrass dad?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Republicans don't have a problem with paid maternity leave per se...they just think it should be up to the benevolence of rich people and corporations to provide at their whim.
posted by dry white toast at 7:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Remember, we're just getting to the worst part.
posted by uosuaq at 7:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

This is not the campaign I've been witnessing this past year. Is she introducing the wrong candidate? Did I have too much wine?

Betting on the shortness of the American attention span is a safer bet than it should be.
posted by joedan at 7:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

abject impermanence

that's their strategy for this attempt at a 180 — as if we are incapable of remembering how fucking awful he is

as if he won't remind us by the time you can say 'bullshit'
posted by defenestration at 7:16 PM on July 21, 2016

Every other creepy things about this circus being equal, am I the only one completely creeped out by these little hummed laughs she let's out every other pause?
posted by phphph at 7:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Wait, when did we stop being able to hope and dream?
posted by Gaz Errant at 7:17 PM on July 21, 2016

Equal pay for equal work

Trump campaign pays women less than men.
posted by beagle at 7:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

> I seriously wonder if she dropped the child care and equal pay stuff in without talking to anyone just because

None of this bullshit is legally binding. She can say whatever she wants.
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I
posted by MaritaCov at 7:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

To be fair maybe Trump asked Romney for all those binders full of women...
posted by vuron at 7:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

All things will be possible again?
posted by octothorpe at 7:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Come January 17, all things will be possible again!"

Oh good, the crazy is coming back.
posted by penduluum at 7:17 PM on July 21, 2016

Glob save her. She seems like she believes it
posted by mollweide at 7:17 PM on July 21, 2016

It's now officially the Everything-To-Everyone campaign.

This whole convention has been one person saying "we love X" and then the next one saying "we hate X"
posted by bongo_x at 7:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

wait
i thought divergent was the one going to tv
not hunger games
is that why elizabeth banks is not wearing her purple wig
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

What is this music? Some kind of film score?
posted by zachlipton at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

OMG, the "Air Force One" theme is his entrance music?
posted by QuantumMeruit at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Did they get John Williams to do the score tonight?
posted by Room 101 at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016

SO MANY FLAGS
posted by stolyarova at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Make the font size big again!
posted by goHermGO at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016

/me waves at trump
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

EWWWWWWWWWWWW!!
posted by howfar at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016

What movie theme is this?
posted by zarq at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016

Ew that butt pat
posted by stolyarova at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Ah, when a father tenderly touches his daughter's hips.
posted by glhaynes at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Oh no its happening this is real life
posted by thefoxgod at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

And there's his name in the biggest gold letters possible.
posted by stopgap at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He just patted her butt. HE JUST PATTED HER BUTT.
posted by mudpuppie at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

Trump trying to look dignified. He doesn't quite get it.
posted by bongo_x at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

She just claimed women get maternity support.

The US is the only OECD nation that doesn't provide statutory paid maternity leave or benefits. There are scattered state provisions, but nothing federal. The FMLA provides unpaid leave, so, you know, you can't get fired for breeding. (Except you probably can in at-will states.)

It's not gender it's bio-essentialist motherhood that they are gonna use to support the "right" kind of woman.

Oh, that suddenly reminds me of how a certain European leader gave out medals in the late 1930s to women who gave birth to many children of a certain heritage.
posted by holgate at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

uh am I imagining things or is this the orchestral music from Armageddon?
posted by gatorae at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I truly hate this man.
posted by defenestration at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

The music. It's a MOMENT people.
posted by futz at 7:18 PM on July 21, 2016

Did he just pat her on the ass? The NPR feed cut off right at her hip...????
posted by PorcineWithMe at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016

Here we go.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016

WHAT IS THAT GOLD BACKGROUND HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016

dd he just touch her butt? did i imagine that?
posted by sporkwort at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I am not ready for this jelly.
posted by winna at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016

Oh boy, here we go. Kisses on the cheek and a pat on her hip. Fanfare from the Act III upswing in a Bruckheimer film. TRUMP in big gold 3D letters.
posted by cortex at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

All things will be possible again?

He's gone beyond the possible, beyond the impossible to the possimpible.
posted by Talez at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Is it normal for the nominee to walk onstage clapping for themself
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

MORE CRUD FOR THE CRUD GOD
MORE TIRES FOR THE TIRE FIRE
posted by ckape at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [27 favorites]

Is this where he says this has all been a massive joke?
posted by vverse23 at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"Come January 17, all things will be possible again!"
Donald will summon Cthulhu...
posted by oneswellfoop at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Judge him by his results"... do you mean the bankruptcies or the divorces?

(from a Facebook friend.)
posted by dnash at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

But what about the clutch on my Volvo?! He'll fix that, right?
posted by petebest at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Donald Trump can't bear the injustice of college graduates mired in debt? Has she not heard of Trump University?
posted by homunculus at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Who are the men standing on either side of the stage? Security?
posted by mochapickle at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016

Did he just touch her ass?!
posted by double block and bleed at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"JEWISH FOR DONALD TRUP" sign
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016

It's kinda creepy to hear Ivanka talk about Donald Trump as if he were some stranger rather than the guy who's (hopefully) cleaned mashed banana out of her hair at some point.

Don't be silly. He has said a number of times that he leaves the child rearing to the mothers.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

my kittens have spontaneously started fighting

the storm is still brewing

trump has come
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

"build a wall vote trump"
posted by rebent at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016

Kind of a half-hearted ass-grab there? I mean, it wasn't not an ass-grab.
posted by penduluum at 7:19 PM on July 21, 2016

You have to admit, getting the RNC to cheer for the "equal pay for equal work" is pretty good trollin'.
posted by dry white toast at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

so what were you thinking
what inspired you
when you wrote the
donald trump theme

i was thinking
west wing
meets
traffic jam
with no plagiarized notes
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Pardon the ramble, I have fish to fry. But tonight at dinner, I remarked to Grandsire Spatula that "it's arrived, but it's only wrapped in the flag, it's not carrying the Cross" and now upon reflection it occurs that we are seeing exactly the pure simian 'tribalness,' bare of any theological fig leaf, in just the same way honor killings are cultural, vs. Islamic, what is on display in Cleveland is cultural, not Christian. It's the pure impulse to close ranks against It.

Some people are afraid, it they go too far / They'll never get back / To where the rest of them are.
posted by Rat Spatula at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

There is a Dr Seuss character that he reminds me of when he makes that stupid little grin.
posted by futz at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Exactly Ivanka could say that if elected her dad will buy everyone a unicorn and a puppy dog and it means absolutely nothing in terms of what the campaign will actually deliver.

Basically it's like the campaign is running on the same rules as junior high elections.

"If elected I promise to have Pizza in the cafeteria every day and no homework!"
posted by vuron at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

"Come January 17 ALL things will be possible again! We can HOPE and DREAM and THINK BIG again!"

This makes me want to laugh or barf. Or both.
posted by joedan at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016

I see some non-cheering delegates...
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016

He stuck to his script for one sentence anyway.
posted by Justinian at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

in keeping with the Hamilton theme here

Oh mah god, tear this dude apart
posted by cmfletcher at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I feel scared.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016

dd he just touch her butt?

Yup.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016

I need a drink! Screw that! I need 2!!
posted by ramix at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2016

He's already off-script.
posted by box at 7:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I found the one jpg I'm going to email to 1996 when gmail puts that in
posted by theodolite at 7:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

The next 4 months are gonna be that part of the novel where either a disaster is avoided or shit gets really real.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Could he look more smug?
posted by octothorpe at 7:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He's gone beyond the possible, beyond the impossible to the possimpible.

That video has been going through my head since Ivanka started talking.
posted by Superplin at 7:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He's off the script.
posted by howfar at 7:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Yeah I was trying to pin it down to a specific movie but gave up. It sounded a little "Right Stuff." Anyone tuning in might think they were watching the Oscars.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

If he sticks to the script, he'll get the nice post-convention bump in popularity. If he decides to go after Cruz, he'll manage to strangle all the goodwill Ivanka just built up.

... oh, there's the ad-libbing already. ("USA! USA!") Yeah, this'll be.... interesting.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 7:21 PM on July 21, 2016

What are these numbers
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

One sentence in and Trump is already off of his prepared remarks.
posted by DynamiteToast at 7:21 PM on July 21, 2016

"One time my father and I were walking down 47th street and we came upon an old man weeping in the street. My father touched his shoulder and asked, 'What is your trouble, friend?' The man looked down and responded, 'I miss my old glasses, for with them I could watch the birds sing.' My father reached right into his camelhair coat and from inside the lapel pocket produced a single white dove. With his free hand, he reached into his pants pockets and pulled out a roll of tape. 'Take your rest on me, my friend', he said as he taped that beautiful dove to the man's face, tirelessly winding lengths of tape around the man's head to secure the bird in place, so that the man never had to live a life of regret ever again."
— Ivanka Trump, "My Father, My Struggle"
posted by Senor Cardgage at 7:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [87 favorites]

I wonder how many unique words he uses.
posted by futz at 7:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

LAW and ORDER.

DUN DUN.
posted by mudpuppie at 7:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

I think the music was from Air Force One?
posted by Uncle Ira at 7:22 PM on July 21, 2016

Here's where the fear comes in!
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

We will be a country of generosity and warmth...unless you are that fucking Estonia.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Not enough Democrats turned out for the 2012 primaries!
posted by nickmark at 7:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

One of the comedy shows, I think Colbert, said, "...because like Harrison Ford in Air Force One he is a man pretending to be the President."
posted by Drinky Die at 7:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Still desperately on script. He's starting to twitch.
posted by petebest at 7:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He's running for Batman?
posted by vrakatar at 7:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Crime is at a record low.
posted by defenestration at 7:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

So many people in the audience are not cheering or smiling.
posted by zarq at 7:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump's going to end crime and violence. Neat.
posted by mhum at 7:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Is his suit too big? It fits oddly.
posted by readery at 7:24 PM on July 21, 2016

"The most basic duty of government, is to protect the lives of its" [WHITE] "citizens."
posted by mudpuppie at 7:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

HEY WE DID GREAT YUUUGE NUMBERS OF VOTES BETTER THAN THE DEMOCRATS!!!

FEAR FEAR FEAR FEAR FEAR FEAR.
posted by soundguy99 at 7:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I hereby declare "Godwin" no longer cromulent. Go right ahead, everybody.
posted by uosuaq at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

"I will present the facts plainly and honestly", declares giant void in the fabric of reality.
posted by cortex at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [37 favorites]

Jumps right into playing into white people's fears. Solved by his magic wand of course.
posted by futz at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

This seriously sounds like a ~~promise~~ threat to instate martial law.
posted by Superplin at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

These are the carefully-crafted lies, you filthy sea sponge.
posted by stolyarova at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016

I hate these lies and this fear-mongering and blind ignorance. I hate it so much.
posted by sevenofspades at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"We cannot afford to respect other people anymore."
posted by snofoam at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Is corb ok? Can anyone see back-turners in the audience?
posted by tobascodagama at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I cannot believe the Republican nominee for president just discredited the entire media and said that the truth would only be found in him.
posted by Gaz Errant at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016

Boy, his delivery is awful. Is it just me?
posted by waitingtoderail at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"We cannot afford to be Politically Correct anymore" got the biggest cheer of the night.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016

When does the "no lies" portion of the convention begin?
posted by Justinian at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Any feed showing any backturns?
posted by dry white toast at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016

Anyone turning their backs?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016

Oh that'll be a .gif
posted by cmfletcher at 7:25 PM on July 21, 2016

This is pretty much 100% off script, right?
posted by codacorolla at 7:26 PM on July 21, 2016

They cheered over "we cannot afford to be so politically correct anymore."

They're not sure they buy all this stuff about safety and they don't know what's up with that pay-for-women thing, but they damn well want the right to use whatever slurs they want when they're complaining about the people they don't like.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 7:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Everybody loves the permission to abolish political correctness. Ugh.
posted by Superplin at 7:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"Crime, boy I don't know." That's his crime plan.
posted by zachlipton at 7:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Who could possibly like this guy
posted by penduluum at 7:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Trump will provide Americans with the best truth, wherever it has to be sourced from.
posted by XMLicious at 7:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

So I guess I should leave my TV muted.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:26 PM on July 21, 2016

Since when does the federal government fight neighborhood crime? Huh?
posted by njohnson23 at 7:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Wow he even rehearsed. That's how bad he wants to win.
posted by petebest at 7:26 PM on July 21, 2016

these figures fly in the face of reality
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 7:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

changed 3600 killings to 4000
posted by rebent at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016

This is pretty much 100% off script, right?

No. I'm tracking it, it's pretty good so far.
posted by Talez at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016

Wow, that's a lotta gun violence, Donnie!
posted by indubitable at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016

Roaming.
posted by vrakatar at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Trump's suit probably has to accommodate a bulletproof vest. Melania's expression is always so inscutable.
posted by carmicha at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016

Right on script.
posted by mochapickle at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016

Yup, this is what is in the huff post version.
posted by winna at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016

Changed "Over 3,600" to "Nearly 4,000."
posted by waitingtoderail at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016

His hands really are small. I didn't notice as much at the debates because the camera was so far back to get them all on screen.
posted by Drinky Die at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Boy, his delivery is awful. Is it just me?

Yeah, I don't think it's very good. I think the speech is better than he is.
posted by howfar at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016

My brain hurts trying to understand how the architects of this shitty reality we live in are suddenly telling us that they are going to fix it with the same actions that made the reality shitty in the first place.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS THREATEN AMERICAN CITIZENS THEY ARE ALL MURDERBOTS AND OBAMA HAS THE REMOTE CONTROL AND THE ORDER FORMS FOR MORE
posted by stolyarova at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

This is pretty much 100% off script, right?

This is almost 100% on script so far, besides a small aside at the beginning.
posted by DynamiteToast at 7:27 PM on July 21, 2016

I can't stop staring at his tiny right hand.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Woman in the audience looks scared like a illegal immigrant is coming for her right now in the middle of the convention.
posted by zachlipton at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

What does trump have anything to do with chicago violence?

And most of the violence is from Americans, not immigrants going and shooting eachother.
posted by AlexiaSky at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

FALSE
The lioness hunts not the lion.

This is incorrect. Only the dominant male lion that heads a pride gets to skip the hunting duty. There are plenty of rogue male lions that hunt.

So maybe Trump isn't a dominant lion with a pride?
posted by srboisvert at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

changed 3600 killings to 4000

Trump has some kind of bizarre Oliver Sacks disease where he inflates every number he utters by somewhere between 10 and 75%
posted by theodolite at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Oh no. It was already horrible. Now they're chanting "build the wall."
posted by WordCannon at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I don't often feel actual, literal hatred, but I'm feeling it right now.

Guess this is what it feels like to be one of them. :(
posted by mudpuppie at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

He was driving drunk! Trump makes it sound like he shot her dead.
posted by zachlipton at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

So when he makes himself a military officer in order to wear a uniform do you think he'll go with general or admiral?

I think he'd probably go with a naval dress uniform with an obnoxious number of fake medals for heroism.
posted by vuron at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Why did I somehow come to live in a shitty late nineties scifi thriller.
posted by winna at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

He is painting a dire and terrifying picture. Right on message for the party.
posted by Superplin at 7:29 PM on July 21, 2016

This is almost 100% on script so far, besides a small aside at the beginning.

Yeah, that threw me. He's back onto the leaked script now.
posted by codacorolla at 7:29 PM on July 21, 2016

He's losing the room. He's terrible at this.
posted by vrakatar at 7:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Let's try "woman" not "girl"
posted by goHermGO at 7:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Fuck this guy.
posted by bongo_x at 7:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

MORE JOBS FOR KIDS! MAKE THEM WORK!
posted by rebent at 7:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

This is incorrect. Only the dominant male lion that heads a pride gets to skip the hunting duty. There are plenty of rogue male lions that hunt.

That's an excellent FactCheck-Check. I rate it True.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Omg guys Willie Horton's back. And on an election year, even!
posted by petebest at 7:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I'm okay with being pretty dang angry about a drunk driver killing an innocent person. The issue is that it has nothing to do with his immigration status.
posted by Justinian at 7:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

The script really isn't him. It's awkward.
posted by mochapickle at 7:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I thought the main reason he got this far was how charismatic he was. I am not feeling this.
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:30 PM on July 21, 2016

I hate the way that he pronounces "latino".
posted by octothorpe at 7:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

WE'RE GONNA STOP BUYING STUFF YOU CAN AFFORD!
posted by rebent at 7:30 PM on July 21, 2016

He fucked up the "at an all time high" bit on trade deficit. The actual point of the sentence.
posted by howfar at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016

I don't often feel actual, literal hatred, but I'm feeling it right now.

I'm kind of panicky. I think my hands are shaking.
posted by dis_integration at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Is this speech a Burrough-esque cut-and-paste of conservative facebook memes?
posted by Panjandrum at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Only the GOP really cares about infrastructure. Huh.
posted by homunculus at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

None of Trumps buildings would be be built without immigrant labor.

News Flash: you are not running against President Obama.
posted by futz at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

One humiliation after another.... Oh wait...
posted by PorcineWithMe at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016

This is terrifying. It's an unending stream of lies and fearmongering
posted by zarq at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

He's losing the room. He's terrible at this.

It just not what they wanted, what they expected. They wanted blood, viscera, his characteristic hate-humor. He's giving them ... a campaign speech. And yeah, he's totally terrible at campaign speeches.
posted by penduluum at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

America gets to have a trade deficit because of its status as the reserve currency of the world you nitwit. If America didn't have a trade deficit the USD would skyrocket and America's exports would collapse.
posted by Talez at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

BORING
posted by MisantropicPainforest at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Reminder: it's okay to stop watching.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Our airports are "third-world condition"? Someone only flies in to LaGuardia...
posted by DynamiteToast at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

He's right about the airports, though; have you been to LaGuardia lately?
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Why did he just run through the end of a paragraph?
posted by howfar at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016

I can't bear to listen to him speak or look at his stupid face. Trump's only tolerable via a Metafilter-filter anymore. Sorry for all of you who have to watch.
posted by downtohisturtles at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I am concerned about failing infrastructure! So I should vote... Republican?
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He's trying to present the image of a statesman.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016

Oh sure Justinian. I'm not defending drunk driving. People should be in jail for that. But like you say it's not relevant to immigration status.
posted by zachlipton at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016

laTEENO
posted by stolyarova at 7:31 PM on July 21, 2016

hey donny? just fuck off.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I hate his squinty scowl so, so much.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

One of my sisters just made a pro-Trump FB post. I think I'm going to cry.
posted by Lyme Drop at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

LaGuardia is an insult to third world airports.
posted by Justinian at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Yeah he is reciting a lot of numbers and figures...trying to make them sound interesting and excitement but the crowd came for red meat and this isn't it. Plus everything out of his mouth is EMPHASIZED and YELLED so that it is all on one level. It's hard to follow a speech when the speaker only has one level of speaking.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I thought the main reason he got this far was how charismatic he was. I am not feeling this.

It's because he's sticking to the script, which is not at all his style.
posted by Superplin at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Ah, the airing of humiliations
posted by indubitable at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"national humiliations"

This is what fascism looks like.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [45 favorites]

It feels like the energy is leaking out of the room. Too many booing sections, not enough cheering sections.
posted by mhum at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Not that I find his usual speeches in any way charismatic, but I'm guessing having to actually stick to a script really deadens his energy.
posted by dry white toast at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

People don't want on-message Trump, they want crazy unpredictable guy.

Basically everyone want the Charlie from Always Sunny version of Trump. The kind of Trump that would cut the brake lines and then jump out of the van yelling "Wildcard Bitches"

On message Trump is boring as shit.
posted by vuron at 7:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

What are they chanting?
posted by homunculus at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016

I thought the main reason he got this far was how charismatic he was. I am not feeling this.

Charismatic in a way that appeals to a certain kind of alpha-worshipper. As soon as he stops being alpha and tries to be "presidential", he loses that charisma.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Okay he's starting to eye the edges of the script . . he may make a break for it soon. His speech people are much less word-good than him.
posted by petebest at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

More "lock her up." Ugh.
posted by dhens at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016

They're really going to fuck this up if they keep shouting "Lock her up".
posted by howfar at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016

"Lock her up"
posted by waitingtoderail at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016

What a letdown Trump, you've been tweaking us for a fucking year and this is the shitty nomination speech you give us? I demand better.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I remember that Obama took office just as our economy was on the verge of total collapse - and I knew that republicans would blame him for not managing to pull the whole nation into 100% employed, 100% educated, 100% of businesses not going bankrupt.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

homunculus: "Lock her up"
posted by dhens at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Hey! Mike Pence was able to get a ticket!
posted by tonycpsu at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Should we take heart that even this audience isn't reacting enthusiastically?
posted by carmicha at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"Illegal immigrants roaming the streets" like "illegal" isn't dehumanizing enough, he also makes them sound like dogs.
posted by areaperson at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

"When OBAMA put Hillary in charge of security."

Hey, bub, that's President Obama and Secretary Clinton to you.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

Melania looks furious and isn't standing up.
posted by zachlipton at 7:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Mock trial redux!
posted by vrakatar at 7:34 PM on July 21, 2016

There he goes with the first weaponization of Sanders. Sigh.
posted by Superplin at 7:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Hillary Clinton is a middle eastern dictator?
posted by MisantropicPainforest at 7:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

LOW ENERGY TRUMP

Everyone give him your power now when he really needs it!
posted by vuron at 7:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I remember that Obama took office just as our economy was on the verge of total collapse - and I knew that republicans would blame him for not managing to pull the whole nation into 100% employed, 100% educated, 100% of businesses not going bankrupt.

Even if he had, they would have found something else to blame him for.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

These chants are all off. I'm guessing that's because he's pausing for chant lines without actually giving them and then the whips have to start the chants during his awkward pauses.
posted by ckape at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Remember, the goal here is to paint America as being in ruins to make the case for himself as a strongman.
posted by dry white toast at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Does this crowd care about the Syrian refugee crisis?
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016

no wonder nobody has record players anymore
if every time someone said
lets review the record
you ended up with unintelligible shouting
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Hillary has superpowers according to trump.
posted by AlexiaSky at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Weakness being the worst sin of all, of course.
posted by homunculus at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Way to pump up ISIS.
posted by The Hamms Bear at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016

STOP BLAMING CLINTON FOR DUBYA'S FUCKUPS
posted by zarq at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

MOHAMED BOUAZIZI DIDN'T SELF IMMOLATE! HILLARY LIT MOHAMED BOUAZIZI ON FIRE HERSELF! THIS IS THE LEGACY OF HILLARY CLINTON!
posted by Talez at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

This is starting to dangerously resemble our Thanksgiving dinner table.
posted by hal9k at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

I think I got a bingo on my Ur-Fascism card.
posted by phphph at 7:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The crowd really only seems to tune back in when he says "Islam" and "Hillary"
posted by Senor Cardgage at 7:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I haven't watched him 'speak' before- does he always yell?
posted by PorcineWithMe at 7:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

So I don't know whats up with the monitor mix but everyone seems to feel the need to yell as loud as possble. THEY CAN HEAR YOU. YOU ARE VERY VERY LOUD.
posted by petebest at 7:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Trump loves hate.
posted by double block and bleed at 7:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Someone in my Twitter feed has a thread going about which small Canadian towns people will move to after the election. Flin Flon is popular thus far.
posted by dry white toast at 7:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm starting to think that yes, this may be too many specifics for the crowd in the house. Names of countries and so forth...could use more pure hatred, I guess.
posted by uosuaq at 7:36 PM on July 21, 2016

Honestly most Republicans have been perfectly willing to just blame Obama for being black. They just want to hide it behind something polite when they aren't around other Republicans.
posted by vuron at 7:36 PM on July 21, 2016

"This is the legacy of Hillary Clinton: death, destruction, terrorism, and weakness."

Added in the terrorism word.
posted by Superplin at 7:36 PM on July 21, 2016

I haven't watched him 'speak' before- does he always yell?

He seemed somewhat agreeable in those Pizza Hut commercials.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

> LOW ENERGY TRUMP

Transfer him to the Professor and get the candy
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Oh sure, it may now sound lackluster now, but wait until the media pundits and "reporters" weigh in on it, they'll make it sound like the best speech ever made.
posted by entropicamericana at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

watching his mouth move is like watching one of those stop animation shorts. What am I thinking of? Where a human mouth is put on a vegetable or something...?
posted by futz at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

For someone who believes America is the greatest nation in the world, he sure thinks it sucks.
posted by zachlipton at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

Reminder: it's okay to stop watching.

But it's not OK to stop watching this thread.
posted by infinitywaltz at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'd forgotten we control every country on earth. Sloppy to let the locals make such a mess.
posted by wallabear at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016

America First again. Come on people, at least pretend not to be bootlicking neofascists.
posted by Justinian at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I got a bingo on my Ur-Fascism card

my ur-fascism card spontaneously combusted
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

If you have read the speech he doesn't really outline any plans. Just the same old BS.
posted by njohnson23 at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016

LaGuardia is an insult to third world airports.

It's also a bit of a distraction. Americans fly a lot, cheaply, to get from Peoria to Duluth or Colorado Springs to Spokane; the people flying through the uuuuuuge incredible airports in (mostly) repressive states are spending thousands of dollars to go around the world.
posted by holgate at 7:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I hate the way that he pronounces 'latino'.

Be gentle. It's his first time.
posted by kirkaracha at 7:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Saw some crossed arms in the crowd but no turned backs.
posted by mhum at 7:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Americanism not Globalism" would be a valuable sting line coming out of the mouth of someone that believed it.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 7:38 PM on July 21, 2016

I don't understand WHY you'd go with "America First". It's so easy to attack.
posted by howfar at 7:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Why am I in the last 6 months hearing 'globalism' all the time? Back in the Battle of Seattle days there was a lot of chatter about globalization. Is globalism the icky right-wing version of talking about this, or can someone clue me in...
posted by mostly vowels at 7:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Americanism?
posted by MrVisible at 7:38 PM on July 21, 2016

Then show it and release your tax returns.
posted by cmfletcher at 7:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He always yells. But he does seem to be yelling a lot.
posted by zarq at 7:38 PM on July 21, 2016

America will once again take our place in the sun and build a wall with Mexico to give us room to breathe!
posted by Justinian at 7:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm looking at places in Mexico. It's OK if I can't get back in.
posted by bongo_x at 7:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm starting to think that yes, this may be too many specifics for the crowd in the house. Names of countries and so forth...could use more pure hatred, I guess.

Yeah, it's too many specifics in the fear-mongering, but of course zero specifics in the "plan" department.
posted by Superplin at 7:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

watching his mouth move is like watching one of those stop animation shorts. What am I thinking of? Where a human mouth is put on a vegetable or something...?

It's not a "mouth" it's a "face sphincter."
posted by Lyme Drop at 7:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

~~old~~ orange man yelling at ~~clouds~~ clods.
posted by Chrischris at 7:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

This guy is fucking bombing it hahahahahaha
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:39 PM on July 21, 2016

A plan! But "the most important difference between our plan and our opponent's is that we will put America first" is pretty weak sauce.
posted by carmicha at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Bernie Sanders ‏@BernieSanders 10m
Those who voted for me will not support Trump who has made bigotry and divisiveness the cornerstone of his campaign. #RNCwithBernie
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [66 favorites]

quote ultron
quote ultron
quote ultron
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

These anti-Semitic dog whistles are deafening and terrifying.
posted by winna at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Donald Trump: FEAR AND CHANGE
posted by AndrewInDC at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

The vaguer he is, the more they like him.
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

He just got a Republican audience to boo their favorite special interests including big business.
posted by zarq at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

People seem confused about when to cheer and when to boo
posted by alleycat01 at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"Why am I in the last 6 months hearing 'globalism' all the time? Back in the Battle of Seattle days there was a lot of chatter about globalization. Is globalism the icky right-wing version of talking about this, or can someone clue me in..."

Because all the people that have been politically aware for like 7 months now (on both sides) learned that word and "neoliberal" and are now peppering them into every single conversation regardless of whether they make sense or not.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

For someone who believes America is the greatest nation in the world, he sure thinks it sucks.

The Republicans think it's the greatest nation in the world. Trump says it needs to be great again. This was always part of the distance between him and the party.
posted by dry white toast at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The line about how America deserves respect it isn't getting feels like the thermal exhaust port of Donald's projection of his personal sense of injury onto this whole charade. The world will no longer be permitted to disrespect Donald Trump. Donald Trump will not go get his shine box.
posted by cortex at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

The GOP: the Party of Change.
posted by defenestration at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016

Has he promised to make anime real yet? I'm going to be really angry if /pol/ has been lying to me.
posted by vuron at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

The crowd doesn't seem very loud or is it just the way he is mic'd or mixed by cnn?
posted by futz at 7:40 PM on July 21, 2016

watching his mouth move is like watching one of those stop animation shorts. What am I thinking of? Where a human mouth is put on a vegetable or something...?

Clutch Cargo?
posted by glhaynes at 7:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Watching him just now, it's striking to me how much this guy looks like Darrell Hammond.
posted by mudpuppie at 7:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

good lord... he's like 10% into the speech. I don't know if I can take this whole thing
posted by rebent at 7:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I'm looking at Dublin. Sincerely, make your plans. There's a reason why Utah is lukewarm to Trump, because Mormons make plans.
posted by holgate at 7:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Remember that bit in the Lord of the Rings when the Saruman manages to bring down the Deeping Wall and his uruk-hai assault the Hornburg and Glittering Caves and everything seems lost? But then the huorns march in behind them by morning, and Gandalf charges with Erkenbrand's army to break the siege?

LotR is a pretty good coping mechanism for this horseshit, is what I'm saying.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

IT IS BLOOD WHICH MOVES THE WHEELS OF HISTORY!

Right, Trump?
posted by Talez at 7:41 PM on July 21, 2016

I'm only one bourbon in, but this guy can't be president. Right? Please tell me this can't happen.
posted by festivus at 7:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"Hillary is an evil mastermind puppet!"
posted by nickmark at 7:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I love the idea that next week get the Obamas, Bill Clinton, and Uncle Joe Biden as presenters of Hope and Things Are Getting Better but there is much more we have to do as the lead up to Hillary's speech.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I AM YOUR VOICE!

God, I don't sound like that, do I?
posted by bongo_x at 7:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Total policy in the speech is: build wall, MuslimBanLite, cut taxes, amend 501(3)(c), no transnational trade deals.
posted by howfar at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2016

dang, this crowd is TERRIBLE at chanting.
posted by Old Kentucky Shark at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He looks pissed at being interrupted by USA USA USA
posted by nom de poop at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

He's doing his Sam the American Eagle pose
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

stop hugging those crying mothers trump
and start looking for those damn kids
dufrane search party of two
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

He's pissed off with them for yelling.
posted by howfar at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2016

Bernie Sanders ‏@BernieSanders
9:28 PM - 21 Jul 2016
Those who voted for me will not support Trump who has made bigotry and divisiveness the cornerstone of his campaign. #RNCwithBernie
posted by zakur at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

go code pink
posted by vrakatar at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Code Pink!
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

CODE PINK IN THE HOUSE
posted by dis_integration at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Never Trump?
posted by howfar at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I turned it off and that was a good call. Still reading y'all.
posted by lauranesson at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016

did he just have a TIA?
posted by futz at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

So help me, I liked the awful covers and dancing better.
posted by mochapickle at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Did his teleprompter just glitch?
posted by MrVisible at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

what did the sign say
posted by triggerfinger at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016

how great are the police???? they stopped a lady holding up a 'no racism no hate' sign! what the fucking fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck
posted by gatorae at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

please please please another protest please
posted by defenestration at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I FUCKING TOLD YOU ABOUT GANDALF AND ERKENBRAND.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Because all the people that have been politically aware for like 7 months now (on both sides) learned that word and "neoliberal" and are now peppering them into every single conversation regardless of whether they make sense or not.

Neoliberal is to politics what Dubstep is to electronic music.
posted by bongo_x at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Trump Fact Check: No, Crime Is Not Getting Worse in the United States
Fact Check: Trump Again Claims US Among Highest Taxed Nations in World
posted by kirkaracha at 7:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Email server! Drink!
posted by soundguy99 at 7:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

And a Code Pink protestor is forcibly removed to wild applause.

I guess that whole "free speech" thing is only important when its about y'all using the n-word or making gay jokes right?
posted by Senor Cardgage at 7:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Will you call for an investigation on the matter of gwb43.com?
posted by cmfletcher at 7:44 PM on July 21, 2016

uh by no patience for justice
he meant
no patients for
dr justice md
hes a muscly chiropractor he likes to help out
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Oh, not the emails again.
posted by octothorpe at 7:45 PM on July 21, 2016

Oh boy I can hardly wait. He has plans for millions of jobs and trillions of dollars!

But wait...he isn't going to tell us now because the system is rigged and Hillary and big Media is going to make fun of his plans.

Every morning he wakes up and makes plans to make America better. What a thoughtful soul he is.

He has embraced crying women who have lost their children because politicians put their agendas first...or something. I know the politicians were responsibility for all those childrens deaths. Those faceless, merciless politicians. I think they are probably friends of Hillary. Or related to her somehow.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I think Bernie's people are having a communication breakdown--everything is getting tweeted twice but with slightly different phrasing.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:45 PM on July 21, 2016

To do and to be the unimaginable.

What was it Wilde said about foxhunting? "The unspeakable in pursuit of the uneatable."
posted by emjaybee at 7:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

We've got four more pages of this.
posted by zachlipton at 7:45 PM on July 21, 2016

Protestors probably just helping Trump by adding life to this boring ass speech that's very much a politician's speech.

The fact that Andrew Sullivan thought it was a good speech should have hinted to them that they should scrap it.
posted by nom de poop at 7:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I am now legitimately frightened of what's coming regardless of who wins in November.
posted by Gaz Errant at 7:45 PM on July 21, 2016

I'd play Buck Trump but I'm pretty sure I'd go bankrupt.
posted by Talez at 7:45 PM on July 21, 2016

Gotta say, I really envy you people who can work flexibly enough to be able to seriously contemplate a move out of the US to another country.
posted by penduluum at 7:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

"Corruption like never ever before in our country." Um...Remember Nixon? The guy who resigned?
posted by Room 101 at 7:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

There's such a heaviness in my heart, a literal feeling of weight on my chest as I watch this. I laughed when he announced his candidacy. I laughed! I just can't even process that this is happening.
posted by PorcineWithMe at 7:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

We've got four more pages of this.

I can't. Turning it off.
posted by mochapickle at 7:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Hillary just sent a donation email and I didn't think twice about clicking the donate button.
posted by DynamiteToast at 7:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"Hillary has gotten away with it, when others have paid so dearly" Like um. You mean Chelsea Manning, right? Surely.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

(hope corb is okay)
posted by futz at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

When he says "I have no patience for injustice" he simply means he prefers to get it out of the way upfront.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

He is going on and on and on and on about the emails & the crowd is not really all that interested.
posted by soundguy99 at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"I alone can fix it"
posted by beagle at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

no fucking way! "i alone can fix it"
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I can't. Turning it off.

Ditto.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He looks really tired?
posted by mochapickle at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

So Hillary isn't being prosecuted because James Comey is corrupt. Classy.
posted by homunculus at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016

Yeah, the reaction in the room is weird as fuck.
posted by howfar at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

He wants to go where the people dance he wants ACTION.
posted by vrakatar at 7:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Why am i watching this? I'm going to go play some music
posted by theodolite at 7:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

COME ON, BERNIE FANS. See through this.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

How about you keep Bernie's name out of your god-damn mouth.
posted by penduluum at 7:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

"I have cheated and schemed my way to riches! Trust me to stop doing that now!"
posted by Panjandrum at 7:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Tomorrow's headline: "Trump Successfully Pronounces 'Millions'"
posted by knuckle tattoos at 7:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Can we get the band back on?
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Jesus he's only like 30% of the way through this is interminable
posted by alleycat01 at 7:48 PM on July 21, 2016

Speaking of incompetence running a convention... the woman that the PBS/NPR coverage just showed being escorted out of the venue was on yesterday morning's Democracy Now! (alt link) dumping piles of tennis balls outside the convention center with her fellow protestors and being arrested, because tennis balls are forbidden while open carry of firearms is not.
posted by XMLicious at 7:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

If the faithful in the crowd are bored by this shit why would anyone think that the average American will tune in and go, yeah that's the guy I want for President?
posted by vuron at 7:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He looks like he needs to take a wicked shit.
posted by wallabear at 7:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He thinks Bernie supporters are going to join him?

Ooh! I WANT WHAT HE'S BEEN SMOKING. That's the good stuff.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 7:49 PM on July 21, 2016

Pence gets a shout out; gives Trump a little finger point, a little wave, a salute, clearly waiting for that moment to end.
posted by cortex at 7:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"I alone can fix it"

Again, he's writing the opposition ads for them. Next Hillary spot: "All of us coming together can solve our problems better than one hateful man."
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I've got this guy Mike Pence. He's gonna tell me policy, because I don't have any. And he's gonna fix everything! And he's gonna do it in just one week!
posted by Mister Fabulous at 7:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Damn that clever Clinton, sending me fundraising emails while he's speaking. Of course I'll donate again, do you hear this guy?
posted by bongo_x at 7:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

I think Trump himself is wondering how long this speech is.
posted by AndrewInDC at 7:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I am so embarrassed that this thing is a candidate for the highest office in the US.
posted by futz at 7:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

He just skipped a significant paragraph.
posted by howfar at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016

Wait, that wasn't Sanders biggest issue.

In fact, I think the quickest way to alienate die-hard Sanders voters is to tell them what they think and then expect them to fall in line. So good job fucking that one up, you repugnant orange shitstain.
posted by Panjandrum at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

That Mike Pence shot. He's got that "I've made a huge mistake" look on his face.
posted by Talez at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

I bet he is really confused

I'm sure he was promised this was the best, biggest, speech he could deliver, and therefore must. Stay. On. Script.

And it's imploding in they not getting that southern preacher revival audience reaction he's used to but he's only rehearsed this.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

OK, I muted it. It is so peaceful now.
posted by mochapickle at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I never turned the convention on, but I did successfully google how to do some DIY Hillary Clinton nail art. Now I can have Hillary-logo Hs on my big toes. Pretty sure this was more productive than actually watching the speech.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Ya, Donald sure ought not do this again. No timing, no cadence, no theme. Gaspy noises.
posted by vrakatar at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016

Trump: “I alone can fix this.”
Is this guy running for president or dictator? #RNCwithBernie
posted by waitingtoderail at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

Gotta say, I really envy you people who can work flexibly enough to be able to seriously contemplate a move out of the US to another country.

In sincerity: I had the choice this year to renew my permanent residency or take US citizenship, and I felt like I wasn't ready to be a US citizen. (Weirdly, it was David Bowie living in the US for a long time and not becoming a citizen that helped seal it.) Getting the fuck out would be a burden in ways I can't even contemplate -- though I'm still high up the privilege ladder compared to the Syrians who got the fuck out of their country -- but sometimes you have to make plans.
posted by holgate at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He wants to go where the people dance he wants ACTION.

cult of action for action's sake
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He skipped: "On the economy, I will outline reforms to add millions of new jobs and trillions in new wealth that can be used to rebuild America. A number of these reforms that I will outline tonight will be opposed by some of our nation’s most powerful special interests."
posted by howfar at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Man, Bill Clinton can't even get by with a speech this long and he's a phenomenal speaker.

Can't Trump just deliver his trademark sound bite word pasta and call it a night?
posted by vuron at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Damn that clever Clinton, sending me fundraising emails while he's speaking. Of course I'll donate again, do you hear this guy?

She emailed again to say I'd get a magnet if I donated again and I almost replied to say "Give Donald 10 more minutes and I'm sure I will."
posted by DynamiteToast at 7:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Favorite tweet of the night
posted by chaoticgood at 7:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

He looks like he needs to take a wicked shit.

that's exactly what he's doing.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 7:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [40 favorites]

More crazy coming soon. He's about to protect LGBT people. But not, you know, their rights.
posted by zachlipton at 7:51 PM on July 21, 2016

He's calling for martial law, he really is.
posted by vrakatar at 7:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

ed 209 plan for a robocop world
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Is this speech from V For Vendetta?
posted by bongo_x at 7:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"We will bring the same economic success to America that Mike brought to Indiana."

Crowd: "um, does Indiana have a good economy? I dunno, I don't live there. I guess I should kinda applaud, maybe?"
posted by soundguy99 at 7:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

He came here to Law & Order, but he's all out of wolf.
posted by defenestration at 7:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"I am the law and order candidate!"
posted by homunculus at 7:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I will work with, and appoint, the best prosecutors and law enforcement officials in the country to get the job done.

Goodbye petite policy. We hardly knew ye.
posted by Talez at 7:52 PM on July 21, 2016

I've got this guy Mike Pence.

he had to mention him before he forgot to.
posted by futz at 7:52 PM on July 21, 2016

He keeps making a nasty inhaling noise, you guys hear that? Hear this lame pitch to urban voters?
posted by vrakatar at 7:53 PM on July 21, 2016

I'm ready for balloons! That's what I'm here for.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Imagine trump attacking someone for irresponsible rhetoric.
posted by sporkwort at 7:53 PM on July 21, 2016

So my doctor asked if I was suffering any post concussion symptoms and I said "How the hell can I tell?"
posted by srboisvert at 7:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

the reaction in the room is weird as fuck.

As Josh Marshall said, on-script reading Trump is different from off-on-a-tangent Trump.

The Juggalo comparison made here has a lot going for it. There's scripted transgression, and then there's off-script transgression.
posted by holgate at 7:53 PM on July 21, 2016

When he's reading his prepared remarks his delivery is stilted and uneven.

He's peppering in the adlibs throughout. The crowd is reacting a lot better him off script than on.
posted by joedan at 7:53 PM on July 21, 2016

I AM THE LAW!
posted by bongo_x at 7:53 PM on July 21, 2016

He's starting to meander off script a little here and there. I think his patience is waning.
posted by stolyarova at 7:54 PM on July 21, 2016

I'm pretty sure lalex is actually melania commenting on the blue with her smartphone.
posted by vuron at 7:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

He seems to be confusing Bernie's main campaign issue with the plot of The Phantom Menace
posted by Senor Cardgage at 7:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

He wants to go where the people dance he wants ACTION.

Where there's music and there's people and they're young and alive...
posted by dry white toast at 7:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

They want the crazy.
posted by Artw at 7:54 PM on July 21, 2016

He's barely focused.
posted by vrakatar at 7:54 PM on July 21, 2016

I closed the tab, but then I heard that he was going to tell me how he's going to protect me as a gay person so here I am!
posted by mudpuppie at 7:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Actual LOL at Chris Christie pulling out his hands for a slow clap to the ISIS line.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

haha christie looks totally like he wishes he was ANYWHERE else
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 7:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I actually think this is the best speech Trump was capable of giving and that it's very effective.

It's alright. It will get him some decent coverage. But at this point in the campaign, it looks like it needs to be pretty special, and it's not. It's just...OK.
posted by howfar at 7:55 PM on July 21, 2016

Do you really want to point folks to Indiana? Their HIV epidemic thanks to Pence? Do you want folks seeing if it really is a rebounded economy?
posted by mrzarquon at 7:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

lg... b... tq... community

HAHAHAHA
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [31 favorites]

He's just saying the same things over and over. This is as boring as it is scary.
posted by octothorpe at 7:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Interesting. The text said LGBT. He said LGBTQ.
posted by zachlipton at 7:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Oh, he's going to protect me by killing Muslims. Shit.
posted by mudpuppie at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Oh god, kill me now
posted by futz at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

LG

B T Q
posted by howfar at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"l...g..uhhh....b...can someone give me a hint?"
posted by gatorae at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

HAHAHAHAHAHA what. LG BT Q They don't give a fuck about us, Trump! HAVE YOU READ THE FUCKING PLATFORM.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

I know, we hate hateful ideology!
posted by bongo_x at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016

But no promises to protect LGBTQ community from hateful *domestic* ideology
posted by birdheist at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [21 favorites]

so LGBTQ folks are only under attack from foreign bad guys? fucking really?
posted by Old Kentucky Shark at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Of course he'll protect you, the gays love Donald, he's like really tight with the gays.
posted by vuron at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

So he can't say 5 letters in a row without a pause, got it, great.
posted by penduluum at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016

What about the hateful domestic ideology against LGBTQ community?
posted by danapiper at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

what was the crowd chanting?
posted by futz at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016

Hasn't this crowd booed every other mention of LGBTQ? Now they're cheering? And their party platform includes "conversion therapy", right?
posted by bluecore at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

"As your President, I will do everything in my power to protect our LGBTQ citizens from the violence and oppression of a hateful foreign ideology."

It's distracting from the hateful domestic ideology!
posted by donatella at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Can someone protect the LBGTQ community from the violence and oppression of a hateful republican ideology?
posted by nathan_teske at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Chris Christie can't wait to get back to his hotel room to strip off his suit, put on that nice terry cloth robe and lay waste to the minibar.
posted by carmicha at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

He should have rehearsed the "LGBTQ" a few more times, that sounded hella awkward.
posted by the turtle's teeth at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I just saw a sign that said "Trump: America's Great Ball Of Fire"
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The Q wasn't in the released transcript.
posted by chimaera at 7:57 PM on July 21, 2016

Trump waving the bloodied rainbow shirt may be the most odious thing at this convention so far, but it's a tough competition.
posted by Panjandrum at 7:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Wow could it be any clearer he has never spoken that acronym before in his life. Also note that he's fine with domestic hateful ideology, just not foreign hateful ideology.
posted by winna at 7:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

He's gonna protect LGBTQ people from hateful foreign ideologies - only local home-grown hate for us! No imports!
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 7:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

They need LGBTQ people alive so they can be fed to the conversion centers.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 7:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

what is that trisyllabic chant they're doing? It's for once not "USA!"
posted by Don Pepino at 7:57 PM on July 21, 2016

There's a problem. We're gonna stop it. We're gonna fix it. We're gonna prevent it.

How? We'll fill in the details never.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 7:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"LGBT...Q.... and I'll take an A, Pat"
posted by nathan_teske at 7:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

L...G...BT...Q. phew! he got it right twice!
posted by futz at 7:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Whether you think the speech is good or bad (in terms of delivery), the important thing is it's an outlier. Will he have to give another prepared speech before election night?
posted by dry white toast at 7:57 PM on July 21, 2016

It must be fun to be a modern day republican, because it means that you've apparently forgotten the Bush administration.
posted by codacorolla at 7:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I will do everything in my power to protect our LGBT citizens from the violence and oppression of a hateful foreign ideology

While ignoring hateful domestic fundamentalist ideologies.
posted by zarq at 7:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I just saw a sign that said "Trump: America's Great Ball Of Fire"

Trump: America's Dumpster Fire
posted by k8bot at 7:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

we re going to win now we re going to win quickly
you with those bedroom eyes
posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:58 PM on July 21, 2016

Is it just me, or does this not really sound like a Donald Trump speech? I've seen people describe his usual voice as "word salad", which is not inaccurate but doesn't really capture his appeal; "stream-of-consciousness", "conversational", and "largely phatic" seem better. This is not that: I just heard him alliterate "damage and devastation", and I want to say he followed up with some nice anaphora. Every so often he'll repeat something for emphasis, maybe with a "believe me" in front, and it sounds more like his usual style---but that's rare.

I mean, I guess this is the difference between a speechwriter's speech and his usual off-the-cuff, ah, remarks, but it's odd---and I think fails to capture part of his appeal. This is a perfectly fine politician's speech, but it's starting to sound like a poor speech for Trump.
posted by golwengaud at 7:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

It *can* happen here.
posted by uosuaq at 7:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Holy fuck.
posted by glhaynes at 7:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The speech has got nothing catchy, no catchphrase, no theme, it's not building to anything.

"You know problem #341325 that you care about? It's B. A. D. So bad! I will also magically solve it too. I will do it! Okay, on to problem #341326..." Over and over.
posted by nom de poop at 7:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

backtracking on NATO
posted by futz at 7:59 PM on July 21, 2016

Divide and Canker.
posted by holgate at 7:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Do you really think Trump wants the presidency or did he just want to show all those 16 other pissants who talked shit about him in the primary that he could beat them?
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

He has just jumped the train with this NATO talk!
posted by winna at 7:59 PM on July 21, 2016

This is a laughable speech. The room is cold, cold cold.
posted by vrakatar at 7:59 PM on July 21, 2016

I've got it on mute but is it normal for the delegates that are being cut to during applause lines to look so bored?
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Hasn't he been going on for the past hour that the USA has been "compromised by terrorism"?
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

jesus this is a long fucking speech
posted by triggerfinger at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"WE DON'T WANT THEM IN OUR COUNTRY" ad-libbed.
posted by stolyarova at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016

"any nation that has been compromised by terrorism"

Including the US?
posted by thefoxgod at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

That was pretty nimble backtracking on a major fuck-up.
posted by howfar at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016

uh oh

refugee hate time
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016

He's just saying the same things over and over. This is as boring as it is scary.

Effective propaganda always uses repetition. Most people will not see the speech, so the repetitive parts of the speech will be condensed to soundbites which our corporate media will dutifully replay without context.
posted by yertledaturtle at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Trump 2016: This is not believable but this is what's happening.
posted by AndrewInDC at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Will he have to give another prepared speech before election night?

Opening and closing statements to debates, maybe.
posted by holgate at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016

Proven vetting mechanisms? What, you're going to make them take a loyalty oath or something?
posted by penduluum at 8:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Just joined the can't-watch-this squad. It's the MetaFilter filter (MeFiFi?) the rest of the way for me.
posted by Lyme Drop at 8:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Does he really think that a bunch of LGBTQ voters are undecided at this point in time?

This is a base election and trying to do outreach to the LGBTQ community isn't a great base GOTV strategy for Republicans.

He'd actually probably do better just queerbashing like most of the other hatemongers.

I wonder what the intent with this is? A bit of remorse?
posted by vuron at 8:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

This is waaaaaaaaay too long! Come on, balloons already!!!
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 8:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Update: Hatred not abated.
posted by mudpuppie at 8:01 PM on July 21, 2016

The speech has got nothing catchy, no catchphrase, no theme, it's not building to anything.

The catchphrase is "I am Your Voice," and that is transparently meant to be the new slogan. It totally cratered when he tried it a few minutes ago.
posted by codacorolla at 8:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"This is not what's believable, but this is what's happening." sums up everything you've done in your life you orange asshole
posted by andruwjones26 at 8:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

We've reached the anti-Muslim portion of his rant....
posted by PorcineWithMe at 8:01 PM on July 21, 2016

So... Are you all going to hide during the purge, leave the country during the purge, or try to take a couple of people out during the purge?
posted by Talez at 8:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

The US took in 1,736 Syrian refugees in the first 4 months of this year. "Massive".
posted by thefoxgod at 8:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I WILL GIVE TRUMP ALL MY MONEY IF HE CAN TELL ME WHAT THE Q IN LGBTQ STANDS FOR
posted by dry white toast at 8:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

Wait...DONALD TRUMP IS GOING TO DEPORT HIMSELF?!
posted by mynameisluka at 8:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Can't wait to see the polls.
posted by bongo_x at 8:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

If you're getting bored try snapchat filtering Donald's face, some of them work pretty hilariously.
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:02 PM on July 21, 2016

Earlier MSNBC said that the goal time to drop balloons was 10:53pm Eastern. 9 minutes over already.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 8:02 PM on July 21, 2016

"Anyone who endorses violence, hatred or oppression is not welcome in our country and never, ever will be. "

That's such a lovely sentiment, and I look forward to pundits throwing it back at him over and over.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

All you need to know.
posted by triggerfinger at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Hard pitches to gays and blacks, so lame.
posted by vrakatar at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Just joined the can't-watch-this squad. It's the MetaFilter filter (MeFiFi?) the rest of the way for me.

Come down here and go on mute with me, Beautiful! It's so dark!
posted by mochapickle at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I just saw a sign that said "Trump: America's Great Ball Of Fire"

You know who else had one ball and ended up on fire... Just sayin...
posted by Chrischris at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I just saw a sign that said "Trump: America's Great Ball Of Fire"

Trump: It's Like America's Balls are on Fire
posted by emjaybee at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Just panned to a black woman!
posted by futz at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016

DONALD TRUMP IS GOING TO DEPORT HIMSELF

Doubling down on the self-deportation policy from 2012
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016

So yo all have hiding places in your houses, right? You may want to sweep them out. Add a little color, it'll be a long time to be looking at drab gray walls.
posted by waitingtoderail at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

what a massive fuckstick
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Re: the LGBTQ community, it's not their votes he's chasing... it's their parents and redneck relatives who want to feel ok about voting for the orange yam but feel like they're betraying people they love.
posted by carmicha at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [42 favorites]

Why did he shout that touching bit where he was pretending to care about dead kids?
posted by howfar at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016

Oh my fuck, we're only a little over halfway through!
posted by codacorolla at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016

Mr. Trump: BUILD. UP. THAT. WALL.
posted by mudpuppie at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm out. If anything exciting happens I'm sure I will read about it tomorrow. But he is really starting to bore me to tears. It's all empty Trumpisms and standard GOP talking points. He loves to say, "We are going to have...." and then he makes up some pie in the sky shit that is never going to happen. It's tiring and after hearing it over and over I just don't want to listen anymore.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Fuck Donald Trump.
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Full Oompa Loompa look tonight too. Must have fought with the makeup people.
posted by bongo_x at 8:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

SANCTUARY CITIES ARE FROM THE BIBLE

THE OLD TESTAMENT

AN IRON AGE CIVILIZATION HAD THOSE THINGS
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Does he really think that a bunch of LGBTQ voters are undecided at this point in time?

I suspect there are a fair number of rich, white, gay men like Peter Thiel who just want an excuse to pull the lever for an R. Whether this is enough for them compared to the conversion therapy shit, and whether there are enough of them to matter (though probably a lot of them are voting in Florida, which is an important swing state), I couldn't say.
posted by tobascodagama at 8:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I think it's dawning on Trump that he is only now entering the real campaign. He thought once he won the primary, the republican hate machine that so embodied his base would let him coast to the presidency. His echo chamber boardroom mentality has reinforced that.

He's gonna look like shit now that he has to convince not republicans to like him. Let alone actually debate in a situation where it's not a game of who can hate Hillary more, because half the country, or more, actually kind of likes her and/or her policies, for the most part.
posted by mrzarquon at 8:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

You know who else had one ball and ended up on fire... Just sayin...

Denethor?
posted by Celsius1414 at 8:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Oh my fuck, we're only a little over halfway through!

WHAT
posted by yasaman at 8:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

wait, we're only HALFWAY through?

F this, I'm done.
posted by Old Kentucky Shark at 8:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Where the hell are the singing cats?
posted by delfin at 8:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Man, sometimes I forget that this is the party of Lincoln and it takes me someone really great like Trump to remind me of the legacy of principled Republican leadership.

Thank you Trump for opening my eyes.
posted by vuron at 8:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

It's past my bedtime and my laptop battery is almost dead. I'm out, too.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:05 PM on July 21, 2016

So, like, I have muted a lot of the last 20 minutes or so - but it seems like he's delivered this whole thing by yelling at the top of his lungs? That's like Public Speaking 101 bad. When you deliver the whole thing like it's all top importance, then nothing really is top importance.

Also, it makes him sound even more like the Hitler clips I've seen.
posted by dnash at 8:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Wall time.
posted by cortex at 8:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

It's after 11 here in Eastern Time, do you think that any of his supporters are still awake this late?
posted by octothorpe at 8:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

So if NATO needs to be an anti-"terrorism" organization, and we shouldn't criticize anything Erdogan does in Turkey and Trump thinks he could really get along with Erdogan and have a "potentially very successful relationship with Turkey", and Turkey is a NATO member, does that mean we're going to stop aiding the Kurds in Iraq because they're affiliated with groups of Turkish Kurds that Erdogan opposes as terrorists?
posted by XMLicious at 8:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"Anyone who endorses violence, hatred or oppression is not welcome in our country and never, ever will be. "

Can't believe he'd alienate the base like that.
posted by nickmark at 8:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

Only half over?

I'd pay to just watch crowd reactions c-span style.
posted by futz at 8:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He keeps flirting with seriously diverging from the script, the big one has to be coming!
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

It's after 11 here in Eastern Time, do you think that any of his supporters are still awake this late?

The meth addicts, yes.
posted by Lyme Drop at 8:07 PM on July 21, 2016

Funny, but I don't believe him.
posted by RakDaddy at 8:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Yeah. The best bit was just a minute ago on the "Not alone any longer" bit, where he actually dropped his tone a bit.
posted by howfar at 8:07 PM on July 21, 2016

I had to turn off the audio, too. I really need my news carefully distilled.
He is somehow managing to be simultaneously dull as dirt and terrifying. I guess that's a skill, of sorts.
posted by Superplin at 8:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I just matched all of my prior Bernie donations with a donation to Hillary. It made me feel slightly less sick.
posted by gatorae at 8:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

This is the most topics Donald has ever had to keep in his head for more than an hour in his whole life.
posted by vrakatar at 8:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

How can anyone believe someone who keeps saying "Believe me!"
posted by msalt at 8:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

You know who else had one ball and ended up on fire... Just sayin...

Denethor?

One palantir, yep. That is a type of ball, this checks out.
posted by saturday_morning at 8:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Gotta "love" how, during the Ivanka butt-pat moment, Donald suddenly realizes he went a little too low and... moves up like 3/4 of an inch, but still well within the ass-al region.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:08 PM on July 21, 2016

Honestly who let this speech through the filter? It's awful. It doesn't play to any of Trump's strengths, it's all over the place for anybody he's trying to convince from afar, it's mad boring for the crowd he's actually physically speaking to, and it is WAY TOO LONG
posted by alleycat01 at 8:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Apparently the same people who are "tired of politicians lying" are very excited about a man saying that, come January 20th, crime will end
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

all people are equal but some are more equal than others USA USA USA
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:08 PM on July 21, 2016

"We are going to be considerate and compassionate to everyone. " This is a hilarious line to be delivered at the top of his lungs.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I'm in both the "had to turn it off" and "now donating to Hillary" squads.
posted by antinomia at 8:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Drumpfland über Alles!
posted by njohnson23 at 8:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Is this where he goes off the rails and reveals to the world his lizard face?
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The problem: there's a big chunk of the GOP base that's been fed toxic shit for so long that this all scans to them. This is their truth
posted by dry white toast at 8:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Did Hillary really propose "mass lawlessness"? That's seems like a reckless proposal.
posted by msalt at 8:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [27 favorites]

Can you tear down my favorite limit, Mr. Trump? Can you?!?
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Seriously, though, does anyone know if corb is ok?
posted by tobascodagama at 8:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

This is the most topics Donald has ever had to keep in his head for more than an hour in his whole life.

This is all the topics Donald has had to keep in his head, spewed forth haphazardly all at once.

I mean, except for all the dick stuff.
posted by Panjandrum at 8:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He kind of seems exhausted. I've been waiting for that to start showing on him in the campaign, maybe now is the time. He seems very tired, working very hard to keep it together. Sweaty, licking lips, staccato speech in a way that makes it seem like he's panting.
posted by penduluum at 8:10 PM on July 21, 2016

I like it when he does the little Alan Partridge flourishes "(which is what we have now)".
posted by howfar at 8:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I pasted the leaked transcript into notepad. There are ~105 paragraph breaks, and we're at about 70 right now. The later paragraphs are longer.
posted by codacorolla at 8:10 PM on July 21, 2016

Did Hillary really propose "mass lawlessness"? That's seems like a reckless proposal.

And a free pony for everyone. Wait that's Vermin Supreme nvm.
posted by dis_integration at 8:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

BAH GAWD THAT'S MARLA MAPLES'S MUSIC!
posted by delfin at 8:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Oh goody, we're gonna be rich!
posted by wallabear at 8:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

oh shit he's gonna turn bad into good – impressive!
posted by defenestration at 8:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"I am the Law and Order candidate"

I am The Law, and that is an Order!

posted by Herodios at 8:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Well the person I've been watching this with, who had been fading in and out of sleep through Trump's speech, has given up and gone to bed.
posted by XMLicious at 8:11 PM on July 21, 2016

uh he's gonna make the richest nation in the history of the human known universe rich "again"? Tell me again how this makes sense?
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Wait a minute, how is he going to make America "rich" again if we have the best businessmen already? Have the businessmen been SELLING US OUT all this time?!?
posted by J.K. Seazer at 8:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

I was actually really frightened that they were trying to make Trump a better, less crazy candidate in the tribute lead up, and especially when Ivanka was speaking.

But he's back to being regular fascist Trump, so I feel better. But not that much better.
posted by zennie at 8:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

he meant reich
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

You know, the rest of the convention was a lot funnier than this. Not funny.
posted by bongo_x at 8:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I turned my back with 2 others, we gor mobbed by the heavy security they put on WA/UT. We walked out, pushing our way through. There was intimidation but no violence. I can't take this speech without vomiting.
posted by corb at 8:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [159 favorites]

If you elect me as Metafilter president I promise to remove these penurious favorite limits. Everyone will have unlimited favorites to give out everyday so that you don't have to save your favorites for one of the really funny posters you can give them to those people that just make you grin in amusement.
posted by vuron at 8:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [35 favorites]

You know, at some point, self-respect has to win out. I'm just going to go put on my hairshirt. Kinder form of torture. Buh-bye, Donald.
posted by mudpuppie at 8:13 PM on July 21, 2016

and I am not going to let companies move to other countries, firing their employees along the way, without consequences.

Says the guy who made his career on firing people.
posted by zachlipton at 8:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Hey how crazy was Arpaio earlier?
posted by msalt at 8:13 PM on July 21, 2016

Yeah, he's only a little over halfway through the prepared remarks, and he keeps adding more to it. This is going to go on for a while still.

His delivery is getting worse.
posted by joedan at 8:13 PM on July 21, 2016

Glad to know you're okay, corb. Thanks for checking in!
posted by zebra at 8:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

STOP SAYING AMERICA FIRST. JESUS WEPT.
posted by Justinian at 8:13 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

And a wall to keep those damned Redditors out.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

So this is it, this is the first of several steps that leads to the end of the GOP as we know it. It might take a while. That room is silent. He's all over the place. See you at the pub in NOV.
posted by vrakatar at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

,the trump kids just got up so the end must be near
posted by PorcineWithMe at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Looks like the Von Trump Family is on the move.
posted by wallabear at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"I care so much about American workers that I have all my Trump-brand merchandise manufactured overseas so American workers will have more time to spend with their families."
posted by Senor Cardgage at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Will this speech even be over by election day?
posted by mixedmetaphors at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

"AMERICA FIRST AGAIN! AMERICA FIRST!" ad-libbed.

Also does he not realize that trade deals are complicated (and therefore long) for a reason?
posted by stolyarova at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

If you elect me as Metafilter president I promise to remove these penurious favorite limits. Everyone will have unlimited favorites to give out everyday so that you don't have to save your favorites for one of the really funny posters you can give them to those people that just make you grin in amusement.

ME-TA-FIL-ter! ME-TA-FIL-ter! ME-TA-FIL-ter!
posted by Talez at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

This speech makes me wish the house band was playing Layla right now.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

so very glad you are ok, corb! a Silkwood shower and a glass of wine is just the thing.
posted by mochapickle at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Trump: [China] is the greatest that ever came about.
posted by sideshow at 8:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Jesus, he's still going?

Isn't it usually the Repubs who are all like, "LOL CHAVEZ/CASTRO WITH THEIR 12 HOUR SPEECHES"?
posted by indubitable at 8:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

THE-GREAT-EST-CUR-REN-CY-MA-NI-PU-LA-TORS-THEY-ARE-THE-WORST-CUR-REN-CY-MA-NI-PU-LA-TORS-EVEEERRRRRR!!!
posted by J.K. Seazer at 8:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Corb: I turned my back with 2 others, we gor mobbed by the heavy security they put on WA/UT. We walked out, pushing our way through. There was intimidation but no violence. I can't take this speech without vomiting.

Good for you! Seriously, they mobbed you for turning around? I hope it got some TV play.
posted by msalt at 8:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

We were somewhere around a hundred paragraphs to go when the drugs began to take hold.

Wait 'til he sees those fuckin' bats.
posted by delfin at 8:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

He's not proposing BREXIT, it's GLOBEXIT.
posted by cmfletcher at 8:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Cut a deal like you cut with Cruz! That one was epic.
posted by sporkwort at 8:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

We still have about twenty paragraphs to go.
posted by winna at 8:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

If you elect me as Metafilter president I promise to remove these penurious favorite limits. Everyone will have unlimited favorites to give out everyday so that you don't have to save your favorites for one of the really funny posters you can give them to those people that just make you grin in amusement.

Let's dispel once and for all with the fiction that Josh Millard doesn't know what he is doing. he knows exactly what he is doing
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Seriously, somebody thought "you know what we should have Trump talk about in his acceptance speech? Chinese IP violations and currency manipulation."

"Of course! But he shouldn't do it until he's already been talking for a fucking HOUR."
posted by penduluum at 8:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

Holy hell, this is the Berlin Alexanderplatz of campaign speeches.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 8:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

I am outside with the #NeverTrump cabal. We are making America drunk again.
posted by corb at 8:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [199 favorites]

Oh my stars it is like a fifth grader speaking.
posted by vrakatar at 8:17 PM on July 21, 2016

Friends, I've gone from happy drunk to scared out of my mind drunk.
posted by RakDaddy at 8:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

This speech really is too long. I mean, Hitler did long speeches, but he was a genuinely talented orator. This is just confusing. Keeps going around in circles.
posted by howfar at 8:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

quickly fastly fastly quikly
posted by vrakatar at 8:17 PM on July 21, 2016

I turned my back with 2 others, we gor mobbed by the heavy security they put on WA/UT.

Yeah, I suspected they'd be on the look out for any signs of dissent. But I'm glad you made it out of there safely.
posted by tobascodagama at 8:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Believe me, it'll happen, and it'll happen fast."

It's an economic plan, and a floor wax! No soapy residue!
posted by AndrewInDC at 8:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Good on you Corb. I'm glad to know you are okay. Kudos for your commitment to your own principles.
posted by jaruwaan at 8:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

corb, you're going to miss the big climactic moment when Trump sheds his human skin and breathes dryer lint.
posted by delfin at 8:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Oh hey voodoo economics is his economic plan what a surprise
posted by soundguy99 at 8:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I think he's really overestimated how many stupid people there are. This is pandering and insulting to the stupid racist far Right.
posted by bongo_x at 8:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

winna: "We still have about twenty paragraphs to go."

Christ, I don't know if I can survive that. This is worse than Vogon poetry.
posted by octothorpe at 8:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tt1W0F0yObg
posted by iamabot at 8:18 PM on July 21, 2016

Friends, I've gone from happy drunk to scared out of my mind drunk.

He is scary. But he's eminently beatable.
posted by howfar at 8:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

"My opponent has supported every one of these job-killing trade deals. Sorry, did I say my opponent, I meant my vice-presidential nominee"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

We still have about twenty paragraphs to go.

I haven't read ahead. Which paragraph starts "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn?"
posted by Panjandrum at 8:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Seriously, somebody thought "you know what we should have Trump talk about in his acceptance speech? Chinese IP violations and currency manipulation."

We joke, but also somebody actually sat down and wrote out all this stuff about how scary the world is and how Trump is the one man to keep America safe with the idea that voters would eat it up.
posted by dry white toast at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

We are making America drunk again.

Bravo!
posted by wallabear at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I gotta say that I've been on the fence but tonight Trump has finally convinced me to...
go out and campaign for Clinton!
posted by ramix at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

I didn't know I could be horrified and bored simultaneously. Is this ever going to end?
posted by gatorae at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

How will we build all this infrastructure without taxes?
posted by winna at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Oh my stars it is like a fifth grader speaking.

He scared the 4th graders so he upped his game.
posted by maggieb at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Apparently God really fucked up when he created everything that is not America.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Did he just propose a massive public works program? How will we pay for that if we also have the largest tax cuts in history?
posted by dis_integration at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

again with the single-payer
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016

oh shit he's gonna turn bad into good – impressive!

I'm just a part time electrician…bad is good, baby! Down with government!
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Is there a German word for Boring / Sickening / and Incoherent all at the same time?
posted by codacorolla at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Oh no wait he said we would build roads and bridges and tunnels and railways so he must be raising taxes to pay for this . . . .
posted by soundguy99 at 8:19 PM on July 21, 2016

"We will rescue children from failing schools by sending them to a high quality school of their choice."

Sidwell Friends School.
Me, too!
Me, too!
Us, too!
posted by msalt at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

It sure would be nice if the people who say we will repeal and replace Obamacare would say what they will replace it with. My working theory is they will replace it with "fuck you, that's my name."
posted by Justinian at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

This is a Bob the Builder speech. Whatever's wrong, I will fix it. Don't ask how.
posted by zachlipton at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

"We will rescue kids from failing schools by helping their parents send them to a safe school of their choice. "

Not: We will make schools safer. Um. If you help ALL parents move their kids out of unsafe schools, what will make the new schools safe?

I guess if the safety you're talking about is lead poisoning, that'll work?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

We will cut taxes to the bone and then create jobs by building infrastructure: roads, bridges, airports and the railways of tomorrow. Right.
posted by carmicha at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

O freddled gruntbuggly, thy micturations are to me …
posted by fedward at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

╔══════════════════════════╗

║            vuron              ║

║             4                  ║

║           mefi               ║

║            prez              ║

╚══════════════════════════╝

posted by Talez at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Can you imagine this guy having to deliver State of the Union Addresses? It would be beyond awful.
posted by vuron at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

I'm just a part time electrician…bad is good, baby! Down with government!

AN OBJECT AT REST CANNOT BE STOPPED
posted by delfin at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

USA chants because he pointed out the TSA sucks?
posted by Drinky Die at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

TSA! omg
posted by alleycat01 at 8:21 PM on July 21, 2016

Crowd: USA!
Trump: Thank you.
posted by glhaynes at 8:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I should not have left out the bottle of bourbon on the kitchen counter.
posted by holgate at 8:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Guys I flew from San Francisco to Portland, and this speech is still going.
posted by mrzarquon at 8:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [69 favorites]

"We will completely rebuild our depleted military!" says the noted anti-war candidate
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 8:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

DOMESTIC OR FOREIGN STAY ON TOPIC ORANGE CLOWN!
posted by vrakatar at 8:21 PM on July 21, 2016

So, I'm not watching this debacle, but I need to know...has he mentioned annexing the Sudetenland yet?
posted by Thorzdad at 8:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

> If you help ALL parents move their kids out of unsafe schools, what will make the new schools safe

The poor kids don't get to come. It's how vouchers work.
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

He's not really going off-script, he's just ... singing melisma from time to time.
posted by penduluum at 8:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

You can choose your own doctor again. Your choice might be limited to the free clinic somewhere because that's all you can afford, but choice! Glorious choice!
posted by zachlipton at 8:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

His insistence on suffering through this entire speech made me afraid that he was totally going to turn into a really big snake at the end.
posted by Superplin at 8:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I should have left the bourbon on the counter!
posted by PorcineWithMe at 8:22 PM on July 21, 2016

Trump indicated that crime is rising, but it has been falling for quite a while.
posted by maurreen at 8:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Now Trump will reveal his master plan, which is to carve his name onto the moon with a giant laser.
posted by delfin at 8:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

You rebuild the military, get out of wars, and send the idle soldiers to work in coal mines and steel mills. QED.
posted by cortex at 8:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I should/should not have left the bourbon so far from the IV drip!
posted by Artw at 8:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Martin Shkreli - "Trump has my unmitigated endorsement. It was hard won and I was skeptical. The entire Trump family convinced me."
posted by Guy Smiley at 8:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

lol Yes You Will very original
posted by defenestration at 8:23 PM on July 21, 2016

he's so shouty
posted by chaoticgood at 8:23 PM on July 21, 2016

the trump kids just got up so the end must be near

He's got a few paragraphs to go, but yeah the apocalypse is nigh.
posted by zarq at 8:23 PM on July 21, 2016

TRUMP: [backstage, before speech] L-G-B-T-Q?
IVANKA: ya, lgbtq
TRUMP: what does the Q stand for?
IVANKA: just say it
posted by yertledaturtle at 8:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [28 favorites]

I should've gotten bourbon, these coronas are not cutting it.
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:23 PM on July 21, 2016

i'm running out of bourbon
posted by mostly vowels at 8:23 PM on July 21, 2016

I never turned the convention on, but I did successfully google how to do some DIY Hillary Clinton nail art. Now I can have Hillary-logo Hs on my big toes.

Share link please?
posted by jackbishop at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

The chanting was "Yes you will."
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

jinx tivalasvegas!!
posted by mostly vowels at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

This is such an embarrassing shitshow.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

╔════╗
║ vuron ║
║ 4 ║
║ mefi ║
║ prez ║
╚════╝
posted by Talez at 10:20 PM on July 21 [3 favorites −]

no one tell quidnunc
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

That chant from the crowd of "YES YOU WILL" (as contrasted to "yes we can") is terrifying.

A true Triumph of Trump's Will, this.
posted by stolyarova at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Such utter, utter bullshit. I mean, c'mon.
posted by wallabear at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016

There are 4486 words in the prepared remarks and he still has over 1,000 words to go.
posted by joedan at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016

Bring it around to guns. Gun it up. Guns guns guns.
posted by cortex at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

He really is going long for such a boring speaker.
posted by vrakatar at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016

fell asleep and woke up on the couch and he's still talking
posted by chapps at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016

Has he mentioned Congress once? They suck, but checks and balances...
posted by girlmightlive at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016

The entire Trump family convinced me

What if The Sound of Music but actually okay with the whole Hitler deal.
posted by Artw at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

USA chants because he pointed out the TSA sucks?

I'm paraphrasing Adam Savage from his podcast, but it's the closest to a micro-aggression a white man will receive.
posted by cmfletcher at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

i'm running out of bourbon

I had to switch to gin, and I hate gin. But this is bigger than my hatred for gin.
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Now Trump will reveal his master plan, which is to carve his name onto the moon with a giant laser.

C H A
posted by the painkiller at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Is he done yet?
posted by rorgy at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016

We wouldn't go to war for stupid reasons like humanitarian goals it would be about Lebensraum for the glorious American Reich.

I mean Canada is barely even using any of their landmass, think of all the casinos we could build there if there were no pesky Canadians.
posted by vuron at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"I'm not sure I totally deserve it"

Moment of clarity?
posted by thefoxgod at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

"I, on the other hand, received the early and strong endorsement of the National Rifle Association and will protect the right of all Americans to keep their families safe."

Does that include Black Americans in Oakland who need to keep their families safe from cops?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

He's pandering to the evangelicals now.
posted by winna at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016

Others would have willingly taken that gin, you hoarder.
posted by Artw at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

> fell asleep and woke up on the couch and he's still talking

It's January, he won, sorry
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

1000 words is like 6-7 more minutes for his cadence.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016

no one tell quidnunc

VURON WILL DEPORT THESE ILLEGAL ACCOUNT HOLDERS THAT COPY AND PASTE ASCII ART WITHOUT <CODE> TAGS!
posted by Talez at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

I'm pretty sure he realized the whole convention was a disaster and felt like he had to go over the top to rescue the whole thing.
posted by bongo_x at 8:25 PM on July 21, 2016

Wow.
posted by The Hamms Bear at 8:26 PM on July 21, 2016

2008: Yes we can.
2016 RNC: Yes you will.
Trump: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
posted by phphph at 8:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Martin Shkreli is the Millennial Trump. Only one bankruptcy as far as I can tell, but give him time.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

so the second amendment and religious freedom are getting the biggest cheers so far, eh
posted by mostly vowels at 8:26 PM on July 21, 2016

What time did this shit start? I feel like I've listened to my racist great uncle for an entire family picnic.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 8:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

I've mentioned this here before, in the context of blowhard politicians, but as a public service, I do want to remind everyone that schadenfreude is the Nutella of emotions. It is so sweet, and so delicious, but you do not want anyone to find you eating it straight from the jar with a serving spoon.
posted by Multicellular Exothermic at 8:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [26 favorites]

Trump wants to repeal the Johnson Amendment. There it is.
But amendments are sacred I thought.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

As always, I worry not so much about the speech as about the media saying he was coherent and capable despite all evidence to the contrary.
posted by emjaybee at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Hurray for unregulated tax deductions for political activity!
posted by zachlipton at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2016

Wait I thought we had to be engreatened again?
posted by defenestration at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2016

But this is bigger than my hatred for gin.

spoken like a true patriot
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

He's applauding himself now. I...just....
posted by PorcineWithMe at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wish every goober at this whole convention would realize how stupid they look when they clap into the mic.
posted by Room 101 at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Rehashing my predictive joke from twitter earlier this week: Man, just ascend already.
posted by Lyn Never at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

This is the worst acid trip ever.
posted by kinnakeet at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

He's STILL going? I've done the dishes, gotten my kid ready for bed (including reading a long story and singing "Beautiful Boy" (yeah, the John Lennon song, it's his favorite)), chatted with my wife and installed myself on the back deck with an IPA. When I finally opened my laptop I thought I'd catch up on the post mortem. And he's still blathering. But just the greatest blathering, really, the best blathering you'll ever hear, there's no blathering greater than this blathering.
posted by vverse23 at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Did they do a job?
posted by vrakatar at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

his makeup is starting to sweat off.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

It's been going for about an hour now right? I think Ivanka started near 9 (central)
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016

Yeah, remind us of what Melania did!
posted by howfar at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Goddamnit this is really a terrible speech. There's no structure, no rhythm, no passion, and it's taking fucking forever. I gotta work an after-party and the longer he goes on the later the thing is gonna start. This bullshit is fucking with my bedtime.
posted by soundguy99 at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Wait, did he forget Marla? He meant to say Marla the second time, right?
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016

"Not like this, Donnie..." "Not like this..."
posted by birdheist at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm old enough to remember when this speech started.
posted by octothorpe at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

I guess the Johnson Amendment thing is the best they could come up with to try to flip the people Cruz turned around last night? Or has repealing it always been in his platform and I haven't been paying attention (because I haven't been).
posted by penduluum at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Adam Savage has a podcast?! This night is not an unmitigated cesspit of despair.
posted by stolyarova at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

For the record, he's talking about repealing the Johnson Amendment, (1954, named after then-Senator Lyndon Johnson) which prohibits tax-exempt organizations like churches from endorsing or opposing political candidates.
posted by zarq at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

"Melania and Ivanka. Did they do a job"

And the rest of your family? Three other kids spoke. This guy won't stop playing favorites with his family.
posted by zachlipton at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Damn. He can't even sound sincere when appealing to his dead father.
posted by mhum at 8:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Singling out Melania and Ivanka's speeches has got to hurt the feelings of Tiffany, Eric and Donald, Jr.
posted by carmicha at 8:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Wait, I was confused; I thought he was shouting out his exes.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 8:29 PM on July 21, 2016

I had to switch to gin, and I hate gin. But this is bigger than my hatred for gin.

I am drinking all my bourbon because I know how Kentucky will vote.
posted by holgate at 8:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Did they do a job?

Believe me. They did a job.
posted by dis_integration at 8:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Script: I wonder sometimes what he’d say if he were here to see this tonight.

What he actually said: I wonder sometimes what he’d say if he were here to see this and to see me tonight.

Gotta keep the focus on the important things.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

When der fuehrer says we is de master race
We heil (thpht) heil (thpht) right in der fueher's face
posted by dnash at 8:29 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Trump: "All we need to do is show that America is bigger and better and stronger than ever before."

Well.

You are the world's largest economy.

You spend more on your military than the next 7 countries in the world combined.

You want better? Well, that's subjective. Let's talk about that.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

Has he got around to the sinister LGBTQ threat yet?
posted by Artw at 8:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Bumper sticker:
We don't win any more. But we are going to start winning again.

Bonus:
Covers whole bumper with ONE sticker.
posted by chapps at 8:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"Break free from the petty politics of the past"

And move to the petty politics of the future!
posted by thefoxgod at 8:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I really picked the wrong century to quit drinking.
posted by howfar at 8:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Now we're off script.
posted by Talez at 8:31 PM on July 21, 2016

‏@CarrieNBCNews: Per CSPAN, longest acceptance speech since 1972 was Bill (natch) in '96 at 64:44.

Trump has now surpassed that.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 8:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

OMG how the fuck is he still talking
posted by rabbitrabbit at 8:31 PM on July 21, 2016

I put on a long-ass movie and assumed the hour I'd spend catching up with this thread would put us well past closing time.

This is like that time I watched the two-hour live season finale to the third season of The Apprentice. Come to think of it, pretty sure it was the same guy too.
posted by rorgy at 8:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Has he got around to the sinister LGBTQ threat yet?

lg... b... tq you mean? no he will now protect us from the muslims just as soon as he learns our tricksy acronyms
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Sinister LGBT stuff was approximately four elections ago, at least that's what it feels like.
posted by zachlipton at 8:31 PM on July 21, 2016

No more of these censors, cynics, and critics! Now get that protestor outta here.
posted by cortex at 8:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Trump has now passed the longest acceptance speech in 40 years, currently held by Clinton in 96 at 64:44.
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Yep, that's what this whole thing is about. Defeating the people who said Trump would never be the candidate. It's fucking nauseating, it's humiliating.
posted by penduluum at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

History has it eyes... on... you......
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

And we're back on script.
posted by Talez at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016

Make the Affiliates Late Again
posted by tonycpsu at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

Damn. He can't even sound sincere when appealing to his dead father.

He's shown himself to be incapable of sounding sincere when delivering prepared remarks. Big problem for this particular moment, but expectations were low going into this anyhow. If he is going to shine at any particular moment in this campaign it will be during the debates.
posted by joedan at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016

Wanna be tax exempt? You gotta shut up.

I wonder if we can actually expand that. We'd never have to hear from the moon law crowd again.

Expand the Johnson amendment to citizens and corporations: NO TAX NO SPEECH!
posted by chimaera at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016

Rigged system bad.
Guess the GOP will now give up on Voter ID laws, gerrymandering, obstructionism...
posted by zarq at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

He's going for the berniependent vote with words like rigged.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016

zachlipton: "Melania and Ivanka. Did they do a job" And the rest of your family? Three other kids spoke. This guy won't stop playing favorites with his family.

OMG, how did it take me so long to realize this is the white remake of Empire?
Melania is no Cookie, that's for sure. (I named my cat for #TeamCookie. Melanie's hashtag is a whole other vibe.)
posted by Superplin at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump is proposing Juche. Knew I recognized this political philosophy from somewhere.
posted by stolyarova at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

Has he got around to the sinister LGBTQ threat yet?

Shockingly, and cravenly, he vowed to defend LGBTQ rights.
posted by msalt at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

'I'm With Her' is not a "loyalty pledge" for fuck's sake.
posted by zarq at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

People in the audience actually look pretty bored now.
posted by Torosaurus at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016

"History is watching"

Oh Donald, you really don't want to bring that up...
posted by bongo_x at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Maybe he's recording footage for future campaign commercials.
posted by ZeusHumms at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016

I'm With Yes You Will Again!
posted by hal9k at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

He's getting a touch sweaty
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016

I could have watched like 20 episodes of Steven Universe during this time.
posted by chaoticgood at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

A predge? That must be sinister, because I don't even know what a predge is.

Also the way he says it "I'm with you" kinda sounds like "I'm with stupid".
posted by howfar at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016

I give the nominee a d+
posted by vrakatar at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016

>THE-GREAT-EST-CUR-REN-CY-MA-NI-PU-LA-TORS

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/EXCHUS

Is actually kinda interesting if you haven't seen it, the yuan being weakened 50% twice between 1990 and 1994.

Cheap imports have been a bad deal, in that we've taken the savings we've gotten and just bid up the cost of housing with it, since the neither the Chinese or Mexicans can manufacture land for us.
posted by Heywood Mogroot III at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Is there a German word for Boring / Sickening / and Incoherent all at the same time?

Yes.

Trumpenfraude
posted by New Frontier at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Yeah I'm pretty sure that repealing the Johnson amendment was the deal he made with Evangelical Leadership (two of whom were speaking tonight) when they pretended he was born again and announced he had their support.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Ohh so Trump is going to filibuster his way to the election?

"hrmm campaigns typically get a poll bump during a convention"
"what if the convention never ends"
"what if I never stop talking and I get endless free media time?"
posted by vuron at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

"i am your voice."
no. you are my farts.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Oh god he's my voice.

I'll fuck up the letters L GB T Q for the rest of my life now.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

When Trump starts talking about all the stuff in his first hundred days, I imagine that suddenly "Tough Enough" will start playing and everyone will roll up their sleeves and do that thing in movies where like ten times the amount of things can get done in the same time so long as the music is playing which is always just enough time to get the job done.
posted by Ogre Lawless at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Has he got around to the sinister LGBTQ threat yet?

Shockingly, and cravenly, he vowed to defend LGBTQ rights.

Yeah, but that was at the other end of the speech.
posted by Artw at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump is proposing Juche.

Well they did the Kinder, Küche, Kirche part earlier.
posted by winna at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

his Hitler 'stache is made of sweat
posted by defenestration at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

AMERICA NEVER STOPPED BEING GREAT YOU UGLY ORANGE FUCK
posted by Gaz Errant at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

The crowd looks miserable.
posted by gatorae at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016

I thought Trump's anti-"I'm with her" slogan was going to be "I think she stinks." He has been about that mature all night.
posted by puddledork at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

They are clapping because it's over.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:34 PM on July 21, 2016

What a weird, weird fucking song to go out on.
posted by codacorolla at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

The end of the speech party must have canceled. Everybody looks frozen.
posted by njohnson23 at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

God bless you and good night. I love you.

*commences Vincent Vega-ing*
posted by cortex at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

OK. I'll give him that one (about turning Hillary's "I'm With Her" around into "I'm With You"). It's a pretty solid burn.
posted by mhum at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016

I’ve heard this sort of speech a lot in the last 15 years and trust me, it doesn’t sound any better in Russian.
— Garry Kasparov
posted by joedan at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [76 favorites]

For anyone reading this after the fact, the speech has officially ended. Largely on script.
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Gotta hand it to him, I'm not going to be able to scream for ninety minutes straight when I am 70
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Ahahaha. All Night Long. Fantastic music choice.
posted by Go Banana at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

*"All Right Now" by Free plays as Trump ends his speech*
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016

Earlier a dude on MSNBC said (facetiously) the whole election depends on whether or not they fuck up the ballons, let's see what happens.
posted by sideshow at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Closing music is "All Right Now," which is perfect. Tired, corporate rock and roll with not a speck of wit, heart or inspiration.
posted by msalt at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Look at the youngling! Look how pissed off he is!
posted by howfar at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

They're playing "It's all right now" BECAUSE THAT FUCKING SPEECH IS FINALLY OVER.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

what, they can't afford balloons?
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Whew, we can all take a bathroom break and start watching the beginning of the DNC in a few minutes.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Where are the BALLOONS!?!!!
posted by ramix at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Has anyone named that preening fake-serious/proud squinty eagle face he does when he takes pauses? Like "Blue Steel" only more ego and less clue.
posted by zarq at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

I just lip read Rudy Gulliani saying "where the fuck are the balloons?"
posted by vrakatar at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Please let the balloons come soon

And let them be gold

Golden balloons, you've never seen such balloons
posted by miles per flower at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

I was promised balloons, but no balloons are dropping.
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Skipped the Pence kiss this time.
posted by cortex at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

MSNBC just cut to Giuliani mouthing, "Where are the balloons?"
posted by nathan_teske at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

...And may God rest your soul.
posted by Artw at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016

Barron looks incredibly nervous and won't make eye contact with (or even really look at) Donald. Isn't that kind of weird?
posted by stolyarova at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016

OH GAWD! Bass SOLO!!!!
posted by hal9k at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

> Earlier a dude on MSNBC said (facetiously) the whole election depends on whether or not they fuck up the ballons, let's see what happens

oh shit
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Shockingly, and cravenly, he vowed to defend LGBTQ rights.

From Muslims. Americans are free to harm gay people.
posted by zachlipton at 8:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Barron seems like a nice kid.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Balloons didn't trigger immediately... and it doesn't look like they all triggered. The confetti cannons seem to be working though.
posted by zarq at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016

Judy Woodruff: I think we're about to see fireworks
Gwen Ifill: I think electronic fireworks is what they're called

....NOT ENOUGH BOURBON....
posted by mostly vowels at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Did the balloon budget bust?
posted by Torosaurus at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016

Weird, though. The place doesn't seem to be exploding in excitement.

Some balloons seem to descend from the ceiling.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Well something is falling but it sure looks lackluster to me.
posted by winna at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Weak balloons, dude.
posted by penduluum at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

OK. I'll give him that one (about turning Hillary's "I'm With Her" around into "I'm With You"). It's a pretty solid burn.

If he's saying it, yeah. If he's expecting the crowds to shout it, not so much.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

> Barron looks incredibly nervous and won't make eye contact with (or even really look at) Donald. Isn't that kind of weird

Nah, he's 10 years old and it's way past his bedtime and he's on national TV. Let's leave him alone.
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [27 favorites]

He finally landed that kiss on Pence.
posted by mynameisluka at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Nobody on that stage looks happy to be there. They look like when you're taking a family portrait of a dysfunctional family and everyone's pretending to be happy.
posted by dnash at 8:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Wow those are some sad balloons.
posted by winna at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Watching NPR coverage. Gwen Ifill is more excited about the balloons than any other part of this speech.
posted by k8bot at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Theeeere's the balloons. Coming in flurries now. Fireworks in Cleveland, outside. Eerybody still on stage, clapping.
posted by cortex at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

The YouTube feed just popped up, "The feed is now over, bye" and quit.
posted by octothorpe at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016

Gotta hand it to him, I'm not going to be able to scream for ninety minutes straight when I am 70

Well, not with that attitude you won't.
posted by azpenguin at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Should've paid those ballon wranglers more money Donald
posted by vuron at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016

Trump is pissed about balloons.
posted by vrakatar at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016

Barron looks miserable. His childhood must have lasted all of 10 seconds, and he's had to make do with Ivanka's hand-me-down Erector set.
posted by vverse23 at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

yeah the balloons are sort of clustering

not the best
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016

No, there are actual fireworks outside.

They're. . . . . . Ok . . . .
posted by soundguy99 at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

All Right Now is cracking me the fuck up
posted by wallabear at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016

He finally landed that kiss on Pence.

Mouth?
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I'm waiting for the live Daily Show to start, but they're waiting for this damn speech to be done. While they're waiting comedy central is showing that episode of South Park where Canada built a wall to keep Americans it because a Canadian Drumpf became president.
posted by numaner at 8:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The kid looks like he's confused but wants to play with the balloons. Yeah, leave him alone.
posted by zennie at 8:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

It's so low energy in there, you'd think Jeb! Bush was the nominee.
posted by LynnDee at 8:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Charlotte Pence is a straight up QT3.14.

All Right Now is cracking me the fuck up

So close to Highway to Hell but not quite.
posted by Talez at 8:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Balloons are dribbling from two spots in the ceiling at parsimonious intervals. It is like watching someone pour the last of the maple syrup on their pancakes.
posted by winna at 8:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

The balloons take 127 minutes to all fall down.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Maybe the balloon people will be fired like dogs tomorrow
posted by vuron at 8:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

OMG THEY ARE PLAYING YOU CAN'T ALWAYS GET WHAT YOU WANT.
posted by mostly vowels at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [55 favorites]

Did they really fuck up the balloons? The ONE thing you don't fuck up in a convention, and they fucked it up? TELL me they didn't fuck up the balloons!
posted by yhbc at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

David Brooks has been slamming Trump the last couple of days. "Hillary Trump is going to drive a truck through this speech next week."

Now, "Can't Always Get What You Want." WTF
posted by msalt at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

*You Can't Always Get What You Want plays*
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

You Can't Always Get What You Want? SERIOUSLY?
posted by Gaz Errant at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

You can't always get what you want?!!
posted by octothorpe at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

YOU CAN'T ALWAYS GET WHAT YOU WANT!
posted by hal9k at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

That looks like a lot of balloons..

And "you can't always get what you want?" WHAT?
posted by chapps at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

What? Why the fuck? This song makes NO sense.
posted by howfar at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

They're playing You Can't Always Get What You Want again. Are these people insane?
posted by zachlipton at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

lol
posted by defenestration at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

YOU CAN'T ALWAYS GET WHAT YOU WANT

ok, fine, they were trolling. They win.
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

Oh wow "you can't always get what you want" really gop?
posted by vrakatar at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016

I feel like Trump is eyeing the microphone like he's not sure he's done with it just yet.

Stones, You Can't Always Get What You Want, which remains such an absurd choice of messaging.
posted by cortex at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016

...are they really playing "you can't always get what you want "?
posted by Torosaurus at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Mouth?

You didn't see the part where they started making out?
posted by mynameisluka at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016

They're playing the Rolling Stones? They're gonna get sued.
posted by zarq at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

uhh...why are they playing "you can't always get what you want"?
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

In my defense, my browser is running really really slowly.
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016

No fucking way are they playing this.
posted by DynamiteToast at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Playing "You Can't Always Get What You Want" has to be trolling. Come on.
posted by zennie at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

I do feel like I Can't get what I want these days. I am not really thinking people will get what they need from Trumppence, and that for darn sure.
posted by chapps at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016

Heh, MSNBC revisited their earlier "ballon situation will be an omen" conversation.
posted by sideshow at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

So is the convention just stuck here? Do we need to restart it to try to get it to proceed?
posted by glhaynes at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016

What an unmitigated disaster of a speech. Low energy, rambling, internally inconsistent, and Trump looked sweaty and constipated through the whole thing.
posted by codacorolla at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

they should have saved this one for the concession speech
posted by defenestration at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

That was not a great speech. All he needed to do was shouting a few times and it would have edited down ok, but he barely used a normal tone all the way through.
posted by howfar at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016

Well, there goes the record. This is now officially the longest, most drawn-out balloon drop in campaign history, beating out Taft in 1908 when they just ran an air hose through a bladder made of hippo skin and yo-yoed it off the ceiling a couple thousand times
posted by penduluum at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [50 favorites]

They are seriously playing "you can't always get what you want".

Nothing can be sarcastic any more. This is peak sarcasm.
posted by winna at 8:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

Could someone please give Barron a ballon already? Every kid deserves a balloon!
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Virginian here, when someone brags that their family has lived in Virginia since the 1600's, it really means "we were slave owners."

this was hours ago but my favourite response to smug douchebags proud of their slave owning heritage is to inform them that actually MY ancestors came to the US 12000 years ago over the bering land bridge

it's very satisfying
posted by poffin boffin at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [60 favorites]

Cut a deal like you cut with Cruz! That one was epic.

This is such a great point, because Cruz is basically a figure straight up out of The Scorpion and The Frog fable: stings to death the guy he's tagging along with and then says "it's my nature; you should have known I would do this from the beginning." And yet Trump's RNC and Trump's campaign still couldn't get ahead of it.

If Trump is indeed good at any sort of negotiation, it's the ones where he already has a massive and overwhelming advantage, whether in resources or information asymmetry: when he's hoodwinking the other shareholders of a company while lying about what he's doing behind the scenes, or as a millionaire with an army of lawyers getting the better of employees or small construction companies.

But Cruz shows what happens when he has to negotiate with someone on the same level who knows what's going on because they have an intelligence apparatus too and can pull all the same shit Trump can. As President, he'd be eaten alive by other nations and the dictators whose asses he's been kissing; it's the American people as a captured audience he would have massive success in ripping off.
posted by XMLicious at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Dammit people confetti trashes video encoders. STOP USING IT!
posted by Talez at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

Ok. Bourbon #2. Can I get verification that they are triumphantly playing "You can't always get what what you want"?
posted by festivus at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

TELL me they didn't fuck up the balloons!

I wouldn't call it fucking it up but it was decidedly lackluster
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I'm starting to think GE Smith is a master troll.
posted by Lyn Never at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

You just know, somewhere in the bowels of the Clinton campaign HQ, a person is opening a spreadsheet titled "convention Balloon budget forecast 2016" and adding several zeros to an already impressively large number.
posted by Chrischris at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [23 favorites]

In case y'all're not watching, they are playing "You can't Always Get What You Want". I'm not sure that was clear in the comments.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [36 favorites]

You can't always get what you want?

Way to miss the message again, GOP. Did you forget the Ted Cruz Green Eggs and Ham incident???
posted by k8bot at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016

Barron seems like a nice kid.

Some day in the future, the poor kid is probably going to pick up his prom date via helicopter and his old man is going to bust through the door and dominate the conversation about this very night. He's going to insist he pin the corsage with MAGA style. I hope his date's father grabs Don and takes him down to the rec room to show off his man cave.
posted by cmfletcher at 8:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

corb

corb

corb

RESCUE BARRON
posted by howfar at 8:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [66 favorites]

This is weird.

No, look. This looks like how you'd handle a concession speech outro. Even if I were a Trump voter, I'd be like "WHAT ARE YOU DOING???"
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:43 PM on July 21, 2016

You can't always get what you want at a victory rally. That is the shittiest messaging EVER!>
posted by Sophie1 at 8:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

*"All Right Now" by Free plays as Trump ends his speech*

You are fucking with me. Paul Rodgers grew up one street away from my dad. They played football in the streets together. He now lives in Canada. He would not fucking vote for fucking Trump.
posted by holgate at 8:43 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I'm gonna pour a fresh drink, smoke a joint, and hit my fave limit!
posted by vrakatar at 8:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

No Queen Music?

No We Are the Champions?

No Trump, aaaaah Savior of the Universe?

Sad guys, I wanted something more than Melania's plagarism of Michelle to give me hope that this whole thing has been one elaborate stunt.
posted by vuron at 8:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"i went down to the demonstration to get my fair share of abuse"

to be fair I think I remember when Trump spoke just outside of Cincinnati a couple weeks ago, local reports said they played the song there then too
posted by mostly vowels at 8:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Chris Matthews sounds almost worshipful. Shut up Chris.
posted by zarq at 8:44 PM on July 21, 2016

Barron seems like a nice kid.

FREE BARRON!
posted by SisterHavana at 8:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Next song prediction: REM, it's the end of the world as we know it
posted by skewed at 8:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

Reporter says balloons were waist deep.

Translation: People are trapped in the balloons and cannot leave.
posted by chapps at 8:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

well that was unpmpressive mediocre shouty bloviation mixed in with some red meat
hopefully the former will outweigh the latter with the undecideds
posted by lalochezia at 8:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Well, it's over folks. Guess we just go home now, and forget this whole Donald Trump thing ever happened.
posted by glhaynes at 8:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I'm starting to think GE Smith is a master troll.

Well it could also be read as in-your-face to the non-=Trump backers
posted by thelonius at 8:45 PM on July 21, 2016

Chris Matthews just said word for word, "the balloons dropped brilliantly, as they say every thing that ends well ends well"

ok
posted by futz at 8:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

#midnightinamerica
posted by Drinky Die at 8:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Wow . . . I'm sitting seven miles away from the Q and I hear fireworks.

I hope that's fireworks.

Last night it was fighter jets on maneouvers.

posted by Herodios at 8:45 PM on July 21, 2016

Rolling Stone's Can't always get what you want makes about as much sense as Stairway to Heaven here.
posted by dis_integration at 8:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

That was just a world of pain.
posted by Sophie1 at 8:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I saw him today at the Convention
With a pair of very small hands
I knew he wanted to win the election
Saying "Make America Great Again"

posted by tonycpsu at 8:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [29 favorites]

Haha... the YouTube stream cut out right after "You just might find", so it never got to "you get what you need!" How apt.
posted by defenestration at 8:46 PM on July 21, 2016

Gwen Ifill is pointing out that Ivanka's statements about equal pay are not in the platform.
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Trump is going to put forth an evil plan to block out the sun (with so! many! balloons!) in blue states.
posted by mochapickle at 8:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

"My Dad, Fred Trump, was the smartest and hardest working man I ever knew. I wonder sometimes what he’d say if he were here to see this tonight. It’s because of him that I learned, from my youngest age, to respect the dignity of work and the dignity of working people."

It turns out Donald Trump's father was the racist landlord Woody Guthrie hated
posted by homunculus at 8:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [55 favorites]

Think about what a different universe the DNC will be. Wear a neck brace.
posted by dry white toast at 8:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Next song: "I'm Still Standing" - by Elton John. I just can't...
posted by SisterHavana at 8:47 PM on July 21, 2016

I want to give Cleveland a big hug. Y'all deserve better than this bullshit.

Love,
A Cincinnatian (Desperate Times Call for Desperate Measures)
posted by mostly vowels at 8:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

FDR: "We have nothing to fear but fear itself."

Donald J. Trump: "Nothing but fear, folks. Believe me. Fear." [Weird grimace]
posted by New Frontier at 8:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

I'm starting to think GE Smith is a master troll.

is he in charge of the unauthorized pre-recorded music as well as the lackluster house band?
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 8:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Who's the little girl in the glitter bow? Save her, too.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Translation: People are trapped in the balloons and cannot leave.

in trumpist america, balloon holds you
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Ironically, few people are still standing, they're mostly walking as quickly as they can.
posted by howfar at 8:48 PM on July 21, 2016

Whew, I managed to miss the whole thing. I hope this state of blissful ignorance can last until tomorrow.
posted by y2karl at 8:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I'm not eligible to donate. But if I were, I'd donate $100 to Hillary's campaign if her convention ending song is anything off of Beyonce's Lemonade album.
posted by mhum at 8:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Oh hey, it's Paul Ryan! Cool!
posted by wallabear at 8:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Uh oh. Paul Ryan's back to introduce the AUXILIARY bishop.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

( i might have left a word or two out of Matthews quote...like "just" or something minor)

but a total WTF that these media twits are acting like this is a success. i give up and hate everyone.
posted by futz at 8:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

The bishop is delayed!
posted by howfar at 8:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

That's what happens when you worship punctuality.
posted by defenestration at 8:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Would be kind of cool if Hillary just does a simple short acceptance speech and pretty much just goes I look forward to serving you and this great nation in January.

And then mike drops and walks away.

Trump is the big draw for the Republicans and he flubbed it. Clinton has basically a full slate of people pushing her over the top, she can just be relaxed and chill and confident.

Because the public like winners and she can capture the undecided just by looking completely confident in being the winner.
posted by vuron at 8:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Anti-facist dance break!
posted by vrakatar at 8:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Anti-facist dance break!

I love you.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

... did he just... he did... quote the statue of liberty after that speech.

I'm so glad my ironymeter is in the shop; it would've shattered tonight.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:52 PM on July 21, 2016

@Lowenaffchen:

Trump needed to expand his base here. Why did he specifically promise tax cuts for McDonalds franchise owners who have erectile dysfunction

posted by Rustic Etruscan at 8:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

PBS have cut off the Auxiliary Bishop. Well I suppose I should go to bed, it's nearly 5. Thank you for allowing me to be a part of this shit-show observation.
posted by howfar at 8:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I love you also, stringed instrument complicated story.
posted by vrakatar at 8:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Gonna go over to Hillary's site to donate now. Hope the servers are holding up :)
posted by wallabear at 8:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

AUXILIARY BISHOP: "The courage and strength to bring the pro-life platform to life."

Fuck you.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

In 2029, Barron Trump will lead the Resistance against his father, who has usurped all power in the Empire & rules with the force of terror
posted by stolyarova at 8:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

David Duke via twitter: >Great Trump Speech, America First! Stop Wars! Defeat the Corrupt elites! Protect our Borders!, Fair Trade! Couldn't have said it better!
posted by Sophie1 at 8:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

Chris Matthews never met a boot he wouldn't lick, I guess.
posted by tobascodagama at 8:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I'm not gonna let myself feel what I feel right now because the stakes are really high, but if I were to say how I feel, it would be something like "trump just blew it and hillary is going to crush him like a kid jumping on a coke can".
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:54 PM on July 21, 2016 [17 favorites]

Gavel worked this time.
posted by cmfletcher at 8:55 PM on July 21, 2016

All Right Now AGAIN
posted by wallabear at 8:55 PM on July 21, 2016

@HillaryClinton

We are better than this.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

It has been an honor to serve with every one of you
posted by thelonius at 8:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [46 favorites]

My wife said she was going to donate $10 to the Clinton campaign and I told her to make it divisible by four. Then I had to explain. She donated $32.

I am not a crackpot.
posted by fedward at 8:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

All Right Now AGAIN

I guess they want to be...Free?
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Are they totally incapable of finding American bands with songs that fit their super-nationalist party?

... Or is it just that US bands have a better chance of successfully suing them in a US court?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

More David Brooks: "Trump is stoking fear, the classic demagogic move for everyone from Aaron Burr to Cleon."

Clearly Trump decided to pivot from the economy to primal safety fears due to terrorist attacks and shootings of police. That's nimble and topical but confusing to his long-standing economic message.

He also doesn't really have any proposals for these things.
posted by msalt at 8:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

In 2029, Barron Trump will lead the Resistance against his father, who has usurped all power in the Empire & rules with the force of terror

This is verbatim the plot of Starcraft II's campaign.
posted by Talez at 8:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

In 2029, Barron Trump will lead the Resistance against his father, who has usurped all power in the Empire & rules with the force of terror

This is verbatim the plot of Starcraft II's campaign.

Uh.

Star wars.
posted by dis_integration at 8:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Balloons?

Were they something they needed a probably Union theatre / event team to coordinate happening? Who uh, maybe didn't setup everything right? Or did they bring in outside contractors for a lower bid.

Did that speechwriter hire them / write the instructions for them?
posted by mrzarquon at 8:59 PM on July 21, 2016

Think about what a different universe the DNC will be.

I feel like they have a major opportunity to make a massive difference here. I want a full-on Beyonce production number. I want a new campaign song penned by Linn-Manuel Miranda. I want the best Obama speech since the night he won in 2008 and spoke in Gran Park, Chicago.
posted by dnash at 8:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

Star wars

What wars?
posted by Lord_Pall at 8:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Uh.

Star Wars.

Darth Vader didn't usurp all power in the Empire. He was a pawn of the Emperor.
posted by Talez at 8:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump Wars
The Farce Awakens
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:59 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Let's remember that Free also made songs called 'Mr Big' and 'The Stealer'.

And that Jemima Kirke is in 'Girls'.
posted by holgate at 9:00 PM on July 21, 2016

Kylo Barron.
posted by oneswellfoop at 9:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I want a new campaign song penned by Linn-Manuel Miranda.

nnnoooo
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 9:00 PM on July 21, 2016

I want a new campaign song penned by Linn-Manuel Miranda.

Sit down Don you fat mother fucker! . . .
posted by cmfletcher at 9:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

The spice must flow!
posted by Artw at 9:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Barron is trending on Twitter. I seriously hope they leave that kid alone.
posted by zennie at 9:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The Q wasn't in the released transcript.

The Q being in this universe is what's going to be the problem here and-Oh wait you mean Queer, shit. Yes, that wasn't what he was supposed to end that awkward bumbling bullshit with at the time, no.
posted by Slackermagee at 9:02 PM on July 21, 2016

dnash just uncovered why Linn-Manuel Miranda stepped down as Hamilton:

He's touring with Hillary now.
posted by mrzarquon at 9:02 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Well, this has been the most frightening night of my life, politics-wise. I'm turning it off and playing some video games. It's been as much of a pleasure as it could possibly be. Good night, folks.
posted by Gaz Errant at 9:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Barron seems like a nice kid.

Some day in the future, the poor kid is probably going to pick up his prom date via helicopter and his old man is going to bust through the door and

Oh yeah, I've been meaning to point this out since yesterday.

Yesterday, Trump arrived via helicopter to be greeted by Mike Pence at the Great Lakes Science Center.

He'd earlier buzzed Ted Cruz's rally as his jet landed a Burke Lakefront Airport.

So he rode a helicopter from Burke to the GLSC.

That's half a mile.

posted by Herodios at 9:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

I was a young adult of the early '00s, which means that I was raised to believe that the Republicans always had a Plan. (*)

So I am reading all of this as careful foreshadowing to the moment when Trump is pulled off stage and Cruz (probably) replaces him, maybe in October or so?

"You Can't Aways Get What You Want" plays into my theory perfectly.

(*) Like the Cylons, natch. Who didn't have a plan either.
posted by steady-state strawberry at 9:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

dnash just uncovered why Linn-Manuel Miranda stepped down as Hamilton:

He's touring with Hillary now.

Like, actually?
posted by dry white toast at 9:06 PM on July 21, 2016

You know how in 2012 the Obama organization was pretty much confident the whole time and even when he kind of messed up in debate 1 there was a pretty confident response of "relax I got this" and sure enough he had this.

That's basically been Clinton the entire time. Even when stuff was a little close for comfort around the New Hampshire primaries. Just non-stop confidence and competence.

The reality is that she's got this on lock.

The odds that Trump will somehow win will go down each week unless something significant changes the direction of the campaign. Right now the variability that we are seeing in the prognostication sites is almost exclusively due to the long time horizon between now and the election. Each week that there isn't a major shift in the median polling data diminishes Trump's chances.

Yes he'll probably get a small bump post convention which is almost always cancelled out by the other convention and then we will get a return to the remarkably consistent trend line. The simple fact of the matter is that Trump only closes the gap when he's got a good week and she's got a bad week but even then she maintains a lead.

That's indicative that the pollsters are tracking that the Hillary base voter pool is simply larger than the Trump base voter pool and if undecideds tend to break more or less evenly there isn't a whole lot of room for Trump to make up ground.

Basically it's all about Hillary increasing voter turnout and Trump somehow keeping a highly motivated Republican turnout but somehow decreasing Democratic voter turnout.

And that's before you even factor in a possible shift in terms of Latino voter turnout. If Latinos increase their voter turnout percentage even marginally the resulting landslide in the Electoral congress is going to be devastating to Republicans.
posted by vuron at 9:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

dnash just uncovered why Linn-Manuel Miranda stepped down as Hamilton:

He's touring with Hillary now.

Linn-Manuel Miranda for VP!
posted by Talez at 9:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

So he rode a helicopter from Burke to the GLSC.
That's half a mile.

The gross thing is that the news networks carried it live, as if a bit of blatant stagecraft was breaking news.
posted by fitnr at 9:07 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Like, actually?

We can only hope.
posted by stolyarova at 9:08 PM on July 21, 2016

I've been watching conventions since...1984? 88? and only Dukakis had a colder room. Donald failed, period.
posted by vrakatar at 9:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

In His Own Words: Trump On "Violence, Hatred, Or Oppression"
posted by defenestration at 9:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Lin-Manuel (1 N) is on vacation.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:09 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The DNC can rev up a full court press on the issues with their most on point footing holding the clutch while Hillary and Obama deliver speeches that take the convention right to the peak of determination and excitement, then peel the tires through all five gears in the polls after the convention is done and force the GOP to play catch up all the way to the finish line.

That's what I'd like to see lol.
posted by Annika Cicada at 9:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Obama got a Whitehouse photographer, why not throw in a Bard with Hillary.
posted by mrzarquon at 9:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I quoted Andrew Sullivan above, hours ago, who was feeling pretty dire after merely reading Trump's speech as written. In the end he feels the delivery killed it:

"I have to say I’m relieved. This was a terrible presentation of what read like a powerful speech. It seems screechy, unmodulated, and yet also plodding. Mussolini never had a Teleprompter."
posted by dnash at 9:11 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

My take-away from tonight - Donald Trump is possibly a humanoid who still hasn't figured out basic homo sapien behavior.

Also, Ivanka could potentially make an excellent democratic representative. To make a Hawaii specific reference, she's like Tulsa Gabbard- decent democrat, horrible father.

Also, are we going to stick with this as the election thread through the start of the DNC?
posted by Joey Michaels at 9:12 PM on July 21, 2016

(Seriously, Pete Souza is amazing and I hope this practice and openness continues with future presidents.)
posted by mrzarquon at 9:12 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Lin-Manuel (1 N)

(Sorry! My bad. I was typing without verifying. Also, this thread is so crazy Safari on my IMac is choking on it so I can barely type comments!)
posted by dnash at 9:14 PM on July 21, 2016

Has anyone named that preening fake-serious/proud squinty eagle face he does when he takes pauses? Like "Blue Steel" only more ego and less clue.

How about "Orange Crush"?
posted by New Frontier at 9:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [19 favorites]

MSNBC commentator just made my Batman reference and Madow said she'd steal it I WAZ ROBBED
posted by vrakatar at 9:14 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Paul Rodgers: "Permission to use "All Right Now" was never sought for or granted by me. My lawyer is dealing with this matter. - Paul"
posted by holgate at 9:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [37 favorites]

Mods, can we get a fresh election thread tomorrow morning to take us through to the beginning of the DNC? I know it's a lot of threads, but I need to get this nasty acrid orange taste out of my mouth.
posted by stolyarova at 9:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

I miss R.T. Rybak*

*former mayor of Minneapolis
posted by triggerfinger at 9:15 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

HEY MAN, IS THAT FREEDOM ROCK?

TURN IT -- [gets served with papers]... uh... off.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

The Clinton organization at this moment is basically the best and brightest from Clinton '08, Obama for America '08 and '12, and a lot of Sanders '16 talent.

It's basically the best and brightest and it's backed by an incredibly talented data analytics operation that allows micro-targeting to the nth degree.

I really can't imagine that the DNC won't be precise like German engineering. In fact they might want to schedule in some gaffes so as to look less precise and mechanical.

Long story short they are going to go so hard on Trump for the remainder of this election that people's heads are going to spin.

I almost think they've treated him with kid gloves to this point because they didn't want the RNC to have an excuse to replace him.
posted by vuron at 9:16 PM on July 21, 2016 [51 favorites]

Has anyone named that preening fake-serious/proud squinty eagle face he does when he takes pauses? Like "Blue Steel" only more ego and less clue.

How about "Orange Crush"?

Flashing Trumpkins
posted by Sys Rq at 9:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I miss R.T. Rybak*

RT needs to run so he can crowd surf after giving his acceptance speech.
posted by nathan_teske at 9:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

BTW, my wife and I are watching the Full Frontal "Road to Cleveland" special tonight, and I just want to say... #NotAllPennsylvanians
posted by tonycpsu at 9:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Went to go buy some Hillary swag (why doesn't she have an Oregon for Hillary Hoodie?) and just noticed this:

Union Made, American Made

That's a whole counter protest to Trump, unless his hats aren't made in Mexico anymore.
posted by mrzarquon at 9:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Mods, can we get a fresh election thread tomorrow morning to take us through to the beginning of the DNC? I know it's a lot of threads, but I need to get this nasty acrid orange taste out of my mouth.

Honestly, I think we could all use a break from a fresh breakneck Next Thread, so I think just lumping along in here for a few days is the better plan.
posted by cortex at 9:19 PM on July 21, 2016 [24 favorites]

So what is the typical payout for using a song without permission during a political event?

I'm hoping the RNC put aside some rainy day funds to cover all of the unapproved music
posted by vuron at 9:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Fair enough. We can hang in there.
posted by stolyarova at 9:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

After this, I don't even want to watch the dem convention, Trump lost, it is over.
posted by vrakatar at 9:20 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Did they really fuck up the balloons? The ONE thing you don't fuck up in a convention, and they fucked it up? TELL me they didn't fuck up the balloons!

They definitely fucked up the balloons.

00:00 - Trump says "We will make America great again. God bless you and I love you."
02:08 - Confetti begins to trickle down from the ceiling over half of the arena, stage right. By this time all of Trump and Pence's families have walked out onstage, greeted each other, and started standing around awkwardly.
02:20 - The first wave of balloons comes down stage right. Pence looks up with childlike glee. Trump looks like he's about to punch someone.
02:30 - Balloons now starting to come down on the other side of the arena, stage left.
02:48 - Second wave of balloons starts falling, scattered throughout the arena
03:12 - Another wave over stage right.
03:30 - Another wave stage left.
03:52 - Balloons now coming down across the entire arena but continue falling in discrete, successive waves, making it seem less a balloon drop and more a balloon dribble.
04:18 - Balloons continue dribbling. The poor soul running RNC feed has figured out that this is embarrassing and cuts to an extended shot of the fireworks outside.
04:30 - Cut back inside. Barron's expression is the very picture of ennui. Cut back to the fireworks
05:12 - Trump looks over at Pence and, deciding the balloons are finally all done, says "C'mon." They walk to the front of the stage together to shake hands and wave at the crowd.
06:16 - Nope, a dozen more balloons slowly trickle down from stage right.
posted by joedan at 9:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [61 favorites]

(Seriously, Pete Souza is amazing and I hope this practice and openness continues with future presidents.)

He is amazing, but this practice is actually something journalists have been pretty upset about, because it means the only photos that get released of many important occasions are "official" ones that tell the story the White House wants to tell. News agencies have policies against using the official photos except under certain circumstances for this reason. This has been a point of contention for years:

AP’s White House staff: Press losing presidential access as Obama officials close doors

Limit on Access Stirs Tensions Between White House Photographer and Press Corps
posted by zachlipton at 9:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

After this, I don't even want to watch the dem convention, Trump lost, it is over.

That attitude is gonna get Trump elected. We were not the audience for this event.
posted by Justinian at 9:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [65 favorites]

The fact that Obama will finally be speaking out and the decision by the GOP to allow Trump to go first (so the Democrats can rebut everything Trump said to a wide audience. Any Trump response will be as mishandled and confusing as the rest of them have been) the Republicans might as well have canceled the big public campaign ad the conventions usually are. They would have been better off quietly getting this over with in private like the old backroom smokehall days and taking their lumps in November. Instead their internal dissent and harshly strict platforms were broadcast on multiple channels for everyone to see (and live forever on the internet). Such is modern media politics, but that can't be good for Republicans much longer.
posted by downtohisturtles at 9:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

So what is the typical payout for using a song without permission during a political event?

The venue has an ASCAP license, so they can use pretty much anything during the convention free of charge. Ads and other appearances are another matter.
posted by murphy slaw at 9:22 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Timing that whole thing out like that has given me a new appreciation for how challenging it must be to coordinate a good balloon drop.
posted by joedan at 9:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

So what is the typical payout for using a song without permission during a political event?

Nothing. The venue will have an ASCAP licence (or license, since it's America) so the best that artists can do is say that permission was neither sought nor granted. Unless they want to pull their ASCAP licen[c|s]e which would mean you can't play that song anywhere public.
posted by holgate at 9:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Can't wait to see Secretary Clinton debate Trump. He won't know what hit him.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

What's the phrase?

Win the battle, lose the war?
posted by mrzarquon at 9:24 PM on July 21, 2016

Lawrence O'Donnell: Trump is the first politician in history to claim that crime will end. Also the crime rate is lower and the number of police officers killed in the line of duty keeps going down.
posted by zachlipton at 9:25 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

um, did he mention abortion/the unborn/life at all?
posted by zachlipton at 9:26 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Data Point: The CNN "undecided" focus group had more than half of the undecideds say that Trump's speech makes them more likely to vote for him.
posted by Justinian at 9:27 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I don't think so zach but I've been drinking.
posted by vrakatar at 9:28 PM on July 21, 2016

seriously? even this crowd was getting sick of the speech and we are certifiably insane political junkies
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:28 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Don't see abortion or unborn in the transcript. I think the closest he got was talking about the Scalia replacement being "similar views and principles."
posted by fitnr at 9:30 PM on July 21, 2016

joedan, you might get a kick out of watching the fiasco unfold from below—check out the 360° video and pan up.
posted by nagemi at 9:30 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Ask the undecideds again next week.

If they just believed everything trump said, then they'd believe his answers as correct.

See: uninformed voters don't know when someone is lying
posted by mrzarquon at 9:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I have FIGURED THIS OUT!

Donald Trump once appeared (as himself) on The Jeffersons. That means that all of this is a fever dream and part of the Tommy Westphall Universe.

Somewhere an autistic boy is staring into his snowglobe and then smashing his own skull on the edge of a porcelain sink.
posted by delfin at 9:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [37 favorites]

That's not a data point unless you have something to compare it to. I wouldn't be surprised if that's low for this kind of focus group--shouldn't a speech about how great you are have have a better than 50% success rate in at least improving your favorability?
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I am also really concerned about the LGBT-ok-Trump-said-it-so-I-guess-I-will-too-Q references and the "I'll take care of the black kids in Chicago and Ferguson" stuff. It seems to give a lot of cover to the "I'm not *-IST but I won't talk to those people and actually ask them what actually think and want" crowd. Obviously, anybody who cares about these issues can look at the platform and know it's total nonsense, but plenty of people will look at that speech and go "see, he's not bigoted," and that gives cover for all kinds of hate.
posted by zachlipton at 9:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I agree with all of that, I was mostly responding to vrakatar's "this is over and Trump has lost, let's all go home" outlook.
posted by Justinian at 9:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

holgate: Paul Rodgers: "Permission to use "All Right Now" was never sought for or granted by me. My lawyer is dealing with this matter. - Paul"

That's the great thing about one-off parties - you do what ever the fuck you want, and brush off the consequences. Not getting permission for music is nothing new, and it won't stop until ASCAP starts storming into public events after three notes are played that haven't been cleared.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The venue has an ASCAP license, so they can use pretty much anything during the convention free of charge. Ads and other appearances are another matter.

I am looking forward to the "WKRP in syndication" version of convention audio rebroadcast:

BigGuy: So that's the ~~Pink Floyd~~ RNC . . . d-do I hear a dog barking in there?
Fever: ~~I do~~ Nah. Dog whistle mebbe.

posted by Herodios at 9:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Fortunately a focus group has basically almost no external validity to the larger population. Not that CNN can be trusted to report on basic science but be very very careful when you choose to listen to any sort of focus group research related to elections.
posted by vuron at 9:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The best thing I could say about Trump is that while he absolutely will sell out peoples personal freedoms to fundies and homophobe nutters I don't think it's something he's really got his heart set on doing, he just doesn't give a fuck.
posted by Artw at 9:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

That attitude is gonna get Trump elected. We were not the audience for this event.

My feeling is that trump just gave Hillary the opening to win this big...

BUT:

Over the next few weeks it's a good time to donate to send the message of support so when the candidates file their campaign donation reports at the end of August they can show who had the permanent post-campaign bump in donations (and thus support).

By September/October it will be the phone banking and GOTV effort that wins the election.
posted by Annika Cicada at 9:34 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

"I didn't know we were living in Gotham City." -- Mike Murphy on Trump's speech.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

Regarding BalloonDropGate, I hope the students from Garfield High's band and chorus, a largely black group, don't get blamed for this somehow. They were only paid by the contractor to inflate the balloons.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:35 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Virulent racism, now that's something he's passionate about.
posted by Artw at 9:36 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"I didn't know we were living in Gotham City."

It's easy to be the Protector The ~~City~~ Country Needs when you make up the threat, then like magic, you tell everyone the threat disappeared under your watch. Mission accomplished!
posted by filthy light thief at 9:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I wonder if we've seen peak Trump and it's all down hill from here. His best asset was his ability to shock and maybe he can't shock us anymore. He has no policies and no plans so all he can offer is empty promises. Now that he is starting to repeat himself it's clear how little substance there is. I, for one, got bored hearing him tell us all about this terrible problem America has and how badly Obama and Clinton have handled the situation but on January 20 it will be fixed...by magic. Over and over. Different problems, same source, same solution.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 9:37 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Can't wait to see Secretary Clinton debate Trump. He won't know what hit him.

I'm worried we're going to have a serious Expectations problem with a debate.

EXPECTATIONS FOR CLINTON: Singlehandedly prove that women are as good as men in all aspects of politics. Be 100% accurate and honest and speak brilliantly. Dominate Trump in every way. Solve all of the country's problems.

EXPECTATIONS FOR TRUMP: Speak English. Don't shout "nah nah nah". Don't cry like a baby. Don't set the podium on fire.
posted by mmoncur at 9:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [62 favorites]

And by Mission Accomplished, I mean "let's hang a banner that says that, even when we'l still be mired in the same conflicts for years to come." In case that wasn't clear.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:38 PM on July 21, 2016

Yeah don't get me wrong, I'm voting, encouraging everyone to vote, donating, and arguing when it comes up. Selling "vote against the crazy man" can work. We just gotta get the people to the polls. AND THE GOTHAM THING WUZ MINE.
posted by vrakatar at 9:39 PM on July 21, 2016

Also, I stand by my earlier prediction that Trump won't show up for the debates.
posted by mmoncur at 9:39 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

I actually may know the balloon cause! If Cracked doesn't have a story about it tomorrow, I'll tell you, otherwise I will post it. I don't want to scoop his story, he was nice.
posted by corb at 9:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [87 favorites]

Clinton has "fix citizens United" as one of her campaign policies. That's my lever to push for a viable third party ever. Until that shits gone, and broader reforms happen, it won't matter.

And fucking vote in 2018.
posted by mrzarquon at 9:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I love corb and want to have a yearly corb day here at Mefi.
posted by vrakatar at 9:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [22 favorites]

Trump will show; the expectations game is so in his favor for debates that all he has to do is not reveal his swastika tattoo and scream profane racial slurs directly into the microphone and the media will say he did well.
posted by Justinian at 9:42 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

joedan, you might get a kick out of watching the fiasco unfold from below—check out the 360° video and pan up.

Oh wow, that makes the fuckup really obvious. It's the same perspective Trump had on it. No wonder he was pissed.
posted by joedan at 9:42 PM on July 21, 2016

And I'll say again that a ceaseless avalanche of "DONALD TRUMP'S A CHICKEN" and "BAWK BAWK BAWK" would ensue if Trump failed to show for debates, and Trump could not handle that. Just could not.
posted by yasaman at 9:42 PM on July 21, 2016

mmoncur: I'm worried we're going to have a serious Expectations problem with a debate.

That's the beauty of setting your own bar for accomplishments so low - it's really easy to excel. It's like taking a bowling class and getting all gutter balls the first day. From there, the only way is up.

Unless you set the bowling alley on fire.

mmoncur: Also, I stand by my earlier prediction that Trump won't show up for the debates.

Nah, he'll show up, then get confused about how to get on stage. Once the debate gets going and someone asks him to just answer the fooking questions instead of blustering his way through the third question, storms off in a huff.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:44 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Unless the cracked reporter says that that Donald's speech was so low energy that even the balloons felt depressed and bored then I'm going to stick with my time cube explanation.
posted by vuron at 9:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

I really want to hear trump pronounce LGBTQ but I also really don't want to skim through his speech.
posted by you're a kitty! at 9:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Next order of biz: Clinton names whooooo whooooo whoooo as her VP? I say Booker!
posted by vrakatar at 9:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

“I alone can fix this.”

Oh, When Trump said that, did anyone else say this?
posted by Joey Michaels at 9:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

OMG. Jon Stewart on Colbert's show just now. Amazing. Look for clips online tomorrow if you missed it.
posted by dnash at 9:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

CNN snap poll: 57% very positive reaction, 28% somewhat positive, 24% negative reaction. 56% more likely to vote Trump, 10% less likely, 32% not much effect.

So we'll see how the polls compare after Clinton's speech.
posted by Justinian at 9:47 PM on July 21, 2016

Once again, Chris Matthews is picking up on the dog whistles: school vouchers are to get kids out of the "unsafe schools" and support the Christian Academies, not give everyone better educations; the Johnson Amendment was explicitly all tied up in the Civil Rights Movement.

When Chris Matthews seems, er, woke, you've managed to say something pretty horribly wrong.
posted by zachlipton at 9:47 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Now that corb is switching affiliation, is she just going to get on the plane straight to Philadelphia and be our insider at the DNC?

I kid. Mostly.
posted by chimaera at 9:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

Trump can't say no to a debate where he will be on TV. His stupid Melania tweet about all press being good press is all you need to know.
posted by gatorae at 9:48 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I really want to hear trump pronounce LGBTQ but I also really don't want to skim through his speech.

Slate has you covered so you only need to watch 20 seconds or so.
posted by zachlipton at 9:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Yeah but he might be busy that day or something.
posted by Artw at 9:50 PM on July 21, 2016

Yeah the reaction in the CNN scientific poll of viewers is overwhelmingly positive to Trump's speech. Do keep in mind a disproportionately Republican audience was watching.
posted by Drinky Die at 9:50 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

(thank you!)
posted by you're a kitty! at 9:51 PM on July 21, 2016

Hurm, MSNBC is casting the speech as angry, sad, dark, and a failure.
posted by vrakatar at 9:52 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

CNN snap poll: 57% very positive reaction, 28% somewhat positive, 24% negative reaction. 56% more likely to vote Trump, 10% less likely, 32% not much effect.

CNN poll from 2012 after the RNC, 36% of voters said the convention made them more likely to vote for Romney, which resulted in a 1% bump in the polls overall. That's not a snap poll right after Romney's speech, but best I could find.
posted by one_bean at 9:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

The 2016 CNN snap poll was of convention watchers (who are probably likely to skew Republican given it is the Republican convention) while the 2012 poll is of registered voters whether or not they watched the speeches. So unless we see a poll of all registered voters we can't really be sure how this compares.
posted by Justinian at 9:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

One more angry question:

Why are the "liberal media" asshats talking as though this convention was a rousing success? They could be saying a lot of things between the lines but no, they are actually covering the convention as though it was a triumph?
posted by futz at 9:56 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

The CNN "undecided" focus group had more than half of the undecideds say that Trump's speech makes them more likely to vote for him.

Once more with feeling: the 'undecideds' will decide their vote based upon what they have for breakfast on election day. This fucking election is about making sure that every fucking decided voter shows up, doesn't have to wait eight hours in line, and votes without some fucking election observer asking for their inside leg measurement.
posted by holgate at 9:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [18 favorites]

Clinton and Obama don't say "L" "G" "B" "T" "Q" they actually say out, in long form what the initials represent.

Another speech writer trolled the Trumps.

Pro-forma "tolerance" backed by a divisive party platform.

Everybody who actually cares will notice.
posted by yesster at 9:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Why are the "liberal media" asshats talking as though this convention was a rousing success?

Because their wages depend on it being a contest until November.
posted by holgate at 9:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

Why are the "liberal media" asshats talking as though this convention was a rousing success?

Expectations again. Even people here were saying the RNC would turn into a huge riot and people would die. Compared to that it WAS a rousing success.
posted by mmoncur at 9:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

CNN snap poll

Based on what sample size, and using what sampling method? This stuff matters, or it's as good as made up.
posted by filthy light thief at 10:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

Jon Stewart on those Republicans holding Blue Lives Matter signs who voted against the 9/11 health care reauthorization. "I see you and I see your bullshit. "
posted by Sophie1 at 10:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [54 favorites]

Why are the "liberal media" asshats talking as though this convention was a rousing success?

nobody died
posted by murphy slaw at 10:00 PM on July 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Yeah, the Cleveland PD deserves a nod. They were on it.
posted by vrakatar at 10:01 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

If you are convinced that the world is a hellscape and that undocumented ISIS soldiers are going to jump out of the bushes and kill you in Iowa, then it was probably a very good speech. If not, it just comes across as completely bizarre. I don't know what world he is even describing, but I'm really scared that there are a lot of weird people in that first group.
posted by gatorae at 10:03 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

Just donated to Hillary, and there's a watch party in my little town next Thursday.

This week has been exhausting. So glad you are all here to get exhausted with.
posted by wallabear at 10:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

LOL, Chris Matthews interviewing Paul Manafort and Miller on MSNBC just now: after they go through all of the talking points about how it's really Clinton who is all about invading places and nation-building (Syria among that list; yeah, no, it's Trump's beloved Putin doing that in Syria) Matthews asks "So then maybe we agree on something: is Hillary Clinton a hawk?" ...aaand cue the trademark Trump campaign hemming and hawing and dissembling and backpedaling, because of course Trump has to be the true, best Warrior Prez.
posted by XMLicious at 10:04 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

yesster: Clinton and Obama don't say "L" "G" "B" "T" "Q" they actually say out, in long form what the initials represent... Everybody who actually cares will notice.

The problem is there are plenty of people who don't actually care but want to seem like they care. It's like how some people care more about being called a racist than about actually being a racist. The LGBTQ head-fake lets them feel like they're being open minded without actually having to be open minded. "I did my part, I voted for someone who said the letters LGBTQ, now go sit the corner quietly and don't bother us anymore. Also, have you read this pamphlet on conversion therapy?"
posted by bluecore at 10:05 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

Well, I gotta work in the morning, peace out you fabulous people, never despair, we won't get fooled again.
posted by vrakatar at 10:06 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

When Chris Matthews seems, er, woke, you've managed to say something pretty horribly wrong.

Chris Matthews represents a very specific era. His parents grew up with the cultural memory of Al Smith being anti-papisted out of the presidency in 1928. He was a child of the boom (born 1945) so his parents had saints and Saint JFK on their mantle. He's weird in many ways, but he taps into 'white ethnic' -- a terrible phrase, but a useful one in American politics -- in a way that ought to be taken seriously. That's to say, he understands an era when white Irish Catholics were sub-American and occasionally, occasionally twigs that white Irish Catholics were granted American-ness before the descendents of slaves who'd been hauled over to America before the Irish considered getting on westbound boats.
posted by holgate at 10:08 PM on July 21, 2016 [15 favorites]

Fuck you CNN: "A gay Silicon Valley billionaire just made GOP history at the RNC"

It's historic because an openly gay man made people cheer at the RNC, but in quoting Thiel

He warned the party against fighting on social issues and encouraged Republicans to let transgender people use whichever bathroom they want to use.

"This is a distraction from our real problems. Who cares?" Thiel said. "I don't pretend to agree with every plank of our party platform."

they completely skipped over what the Log Cabin Republicans pointed out days ago, in a USA Today ad and on their website:

the Republican Party passed the most anti-LGBT Platform in the Party’s 162-year history.

Wait, CNN actually dialed back their exciting title in the article: "Thiel became the first openly gay speaker at a Republican convention since then-Rep. Jim Kolbe, R-Arizona, in 2000. But Kolbe didn't address his sexuality in his remarks." Emphasis mine. Thiel shrugged off the GOP's extremely anti-LGBTQ platform like it didn't matter, but it does. So fuck your hyperbole , CNN.
posted by filthy light thief at 10:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

TPM reminds us Yuuuge Conservative Issues Are Missing From Donald Trump’s RNC Speech

No abortion, no God, no "Mexico will pay for the wall," no "traditional marriage," no "religious liberty," and almost no Constitution stuff. The Cruz supporters have to be going nuts.
posted by zachlipton at 10:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

The 2016 CNN snap poll was of convention watchers (who are probably likely to skew Republican given it is the Republican convention) while the 2012 poll is of registered voters whether or not they watched the speeches. So unless we see a poll of all registered voters we can't really be sure how this compares.

I'm just trying to figure out what, if anything, can be made of a snap poll of viewers from CNN. Since you shared it, maybe you could provide some insight?
posted by one_bean at 10:11 PM on July 21, 2016

It's not a snap poll of CNN viewers, it was a scientific poll of people who watched the convention.
posted by Justinian at 10:12 PM on July 21, 2016

Peter Thiel represents the height of privilege here. Nobody is sending him to conversion therapy and nobody is threatening to lock him up for going to the bathroom. And his job is to sit around and spend his limited partners' money, so if people want to be bigoted against him, he can just find another startup to fund, while people in most red states who aren't billionaires have to worry about being fired for their sexual orientation.
posted by zachlipton at 10:17 PM on July 21, 2016 [41 favorites]

His volcano base probably has a ton of bathrooms.
posted by Artw at 10:18 PM on July 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

It's not a snap poll of CNN viewers, it was a scientific poll of people who watched the convention.

I apologize for my dangling modifier. What's your takeaway from the poll?
posted by one_bean at 10:18 PM on July 21, 2016

Thank you everyone who watched the convention and functioned as my slightly parted fingers over my eyes at a horror movie. I swore off live conventions after 2000 after some PBS commentator said (paraphrased from my terrible memory) "They sure put the party in the Grand Old Party. Look at all those balloons!" and broke my faith in publicly funded media.
posted by spamandkimchi at 10:21 PM on July 21, 2016 [16 favorites]

Why are the "liberal media" asshats talking as though this convention was a rousing success? They could be saying a lot of things between the lines but no, they are actually covering the convention as though it was a triumph?

The reason is the reason I bought 300 shares of Trump earlier: regardless of the factual situation, having a decent plot requires that at least one point in time the narrative will present Trump as likely to win, just like sometimes Voldemort nearly defeats Harry Potter. And then I dump my Trump, unless it really is looking like he'll win in reality. (Of course ideally the market would be immune to such nonsense, but in practice as I remember from last time 'round they moderate but do not ignore it.)
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 10:23 PM on July 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

I apologize for my dangling modifier. What's your takeaway from the poll?

People who watched the convention and Trump's speech in particular came away generally quite positive about it and him, and are somewhat more likely to vote for him.

But until the numbers for Clinton's speech come in that doesn't really mean anything. More Republicans watch the Republican convention and more Democrats watch the Democratic convention. So people who watched Trump's speech were a sample more inclined to be favorable to it than the population as a whole. So we need to know whether Democrats are similarly enthusiastic about Clinton and the DNC.

That's my objective takeaway. My subjective one is goddamit the Republicans are a bunch of bigoted pseudofascist bedwetters if that speech made them happy.
posted by Justinian at 10:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

I swore off live conventions after 2000 after some PBS commentator said (paraphrased from my terrible memory) "They sure put the party in the Grand Old Party. Look at all those balloons!" and broke my faith in publicly funded media.

That's why I'm thankful for modern technologies. C-SPAN's stream that watched on day 2 was mostly free of commentary. And the *shudders* official RNC YouTube stream had no commentary at all, but maybe clean out your history after or use an incognito window.
posted by numaner at 10:33 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

One thing that is really, really important to note is that a LOT of delegates weren't on the floor for that speech; they got replaced by ringers. There's no way to film "delegate who went hiking froths at the mouth when the name Trump is mentioned."
posted by corb at 10:38 PM on July 21, 2016 [52 favorites]

And then I dump my Trump, unless it really is looking like he'll win in reality.

makes me wonder how much this kind of arbitrage distorts the prediction markets? [IANAEconomist]
posted by murphy slaw at 10:39 PM on July 21, 2016

David Brooks doesn't sound impressed:

Such has been the argument of nearly every demagogue since the dawn of time. Aaron Burr claimed Spain threatened the U.S in 1806. A. Mitchell Palmer exaggerated the Red Scare in 1919 and Joe McCarthy did it in 1950.

And such was Donald Trump’s law-and-order argument in Cleveland on Thursday night. This was a compelling text that turned into more than an hour of humorless shouting. It was a dystopian message that found an audience and then pummeled them to exhaustion.
...
There’s no actual agenda being put in its place, just nostalgic spasms that, as David Frum has put it, are part George Wallace and part Henry Wallace. Trump’s policy agenda, such as it is, is mostly a series of vague and defensive recoils: build a wall, ban Muslims, withdraw from the world.

This is less a party than a personality cult. Law and order is a strange theme for a candidate who radiates conflict and disorder. Some rich children are careless that way; they break things and other people have to clean up the mess.

Also, "This was the most shambolically mis-run convention in memory."
posted by zachlipton at 10:41 PM on July 21, 2016 [14 favorites]

I forgot about this, but a year ago I made a bet on PredictIt for Trump to get the nomination — based on my dim view of the GOP primary electorate — that should now be paying out better than 5:1. If there's a silver lining, I guess I've got some much-needed drinking money.
posted by stopgap at 10:45 PM on July 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

So for people like me, who live in $solidbluestate, and are wondering "what can I do to help make sure trump never gets into office?" I'm sure somewhere this exists, but isn't collected all in one place:

Swing states
Swing states voter registration process
Senate and House seats up for reelection that could use support
State level senate, house, and governor seats up for re-election in those swing states with those horribly discriminatory voter registration laws (I'm looking at you, North Carolina)
And who is up for election in 2018

Because if you want this last week to be an aberration, a footnote in history as the last gasping convulsions of the republican party, the following needs to happen:
Hillary wins by a landslide (Popular and Electoral votes) to prevent a contested election
For 2016 but probably not until 2018, the Senate and the House have more than tea party obstructionists in office
State level bullshit around voter access can be repealed and specifically, the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact can get enough support at the state level, effectively ending the Electoral College farce that makes Ohio and Florida the center of focus for presidential campaign policy

What that gets us is: Possibility for third party candidates (hopefully with support, Citizens United is overturned, real campaign reform happens), more access to voting allows for said third parties to get state and local representation, so its not just left wing mouthpieces going for whatever big ticket national liberal scare item gets attention (vaccines! gmos!) or libertarian issues (taxes!), but instead experienced politicians who can support truly progressive movements locally and nationally and not have to sign onto the D or R ticket as the only way to get elected.

And most importantly getting the NPVIC passed counters the impact of gerrymandering. It doesn't matter anymore which county or state district has a majority of votes, which then influence if the state is Red or Blue, and that then influence where those EC votes go. It won't undo the state level crap around county seats and governors, hence the "gotta get the shitbags out" also policy.

But this is the game the Koch brothers and co have been playing since 2008, so its what is going to be needed to undo it also. And that list is the todo list of which states to help, orgs to find to sponsor, and campaigns to figure out how to help from afar - cause that has been what the GOP playback has been, and the Democrats as a party haven't been united in undoing that.
posted by mrzarquon at 10:51 PM on July 21, 2016 [20 favorites]

The DNC had some bad balloon trouble in 2004, too. The audio is even funnier than I remembered.

I bet this won't happen next week.
posted by Tuba Toothpaste at 10:53 PM on July 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

It won't undo the state level crap around county seats and governors, hence the "gotta get the shitbags out" also policy.

That's more insidious than anything NPVIC deals with. Remember, census year = redistricting = gerrymander, and the mapping shit that the GOP uses to fit districts to voters basically works for 6-8 years of a decade. I'm looking at the headlines about the NBA All-Star Game being moved from Charlotte on account of HB2, and the leaders of the NC legislature in their Bumfuck County districts are all 'well, whatever.' State-level crap has to matter in 2016, 2018, and especially 2020.
posted by holgate at 10:58 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

> Remember, census year = redistricting = gerrymander,

I am related, remotely, to the person it was named after: Elbridge Gerry. My childhood pride of being related to a signer of the declaration of independence came crashing down when I realized that other part of his legacy. That may influence some of my motivation for finding ways of unfucking the local districting practices.
posted by mrzarquon at 11:10 PM on July 21, 2016 [11 favorites]

you're a kitty!, here you go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GaFCeT38qnA#t=3h09m48s

Only weeks ago, in Orlando, Florida, 49 wonderful Americans were savagely murdered by an Islamic terrorist. This time, the terrorist targeted our LGBTQ community. No good, and we're gonna stop it. (Applause, cheering) As your President, I will do everything in my power to protect our LGBTQ citizens from the violence and oppression of a hateful foreign ideology. Believe me.

posted by ErisLordFreedom at 11:16 PM on July 21, 2016

Damn, Clinton's website doesn't take Paypal. Take that, speaker-dude. I'll have to actually get up and get my credit card. (I sell stuff online, I have $ in my Paypal.)
posted by threeturtles at 11:24 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Was nice to see Ivanka Trump come out in support of the Democrats.

My read on her is that she's too smart for a lot of her father's BS, and this is her way of announcing "I have to tow the party line for the sake of my personal life, but here are the values I actually support. If my dad wasn't involved in all this stupidity guess how I'd be voting and who I'd be supporting."

Giveaways:

5:56, where she notes that "incompetence in the construction industry is impossible to hide. Yes it is. Like 6 bankruptcies obvious you mean?

11:42, where she quotes the stupid thinking-anyway-think-big line and the gives the biggest eyebrow raise I've ever seen. I'm not a woman nor the child of wealthy parents but to me that screams irony.

The other thing is that when parents are accustomed to putting on a front to the rest of the world, their children are usually the best people at seeing through the bullshit (after their spouse, perhaps).

Of course, I want to believe all that, and don't want to believe that she's actually brainwashed enough to make that speech in full sincerity. I think the part about Donnie actually being progressive in hiring women is partly correct - IIRC he hired a female office manager or somesuch when it wasn't the done thing. But I don't believe all Donald's misogyny is lost on Ivanka either.
posted by iffthen at 11:31 PM on July 21, 2016 [9 favorites]

I loved how Hillary's donation buttons went $5, $10, $15, $27, $50 etc :)
posted by wallabear at 11:32 PM on July 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

I must admit it was satisfying to me when one of the CNN post-speech talking heads pointed out that Trump's "presidential" response to more calls to jail Hillary was stolen right out of Obama's playbook. Whenever Obama would encounter negativity in the crowd he would say, "No, no, no.. Don't boo. VOTE." Trump held up his hands and said, "Defeat her." The Dem analysts wouldn't even give the elephants that little bit of room to crow. Good times.
posted by xyzzy at 11:40 PM on July 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Jon Stewart Takes Over Colbert's Late Show Desk. Some stories, like the ouster of Fox News chairman Roger Ailes, are too big for one late night host to tackle alone.
posted by homunculus at 11:46 PM on July 21, 2016 [33 favorites]

It's really disturbing watching a bunch of Trump supporters party down to music written & originally performed by black people. (I'm working an RNC after-party.)
posted by soundguy99 at 11:49 PM on July 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

Hours Before Hillary Clinton’s VP Decision, Likely Pick Tim Kaine Praises the TPP

FFS.
posted by homunculus at 11:55 PM on July 21, 2016 [10 favorites]

I’ve heard this sort of speech a lot in the last 15 years and trust me, it doesn’t sound any better in Russian.
— Garry Kasparov

now im upset that no one attacked trump with a flying dong
posted by poffin boffin at 11:57 PM on July 21, 2016 [8 favorites]

No sir. I didn't like it.
posted by mazola at 12:11 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Kaine on the TPP:

"I see much in it to like. I think it’s an upgrade of labor standards. I think it’s an upgrade of environmental standards, I think it’s an upgrade in intellectual property protections,” he explained. “I do see at least right now that there is one element that I do have some very significant concerns about. And that is the dispute resolution mechanism. And I’ve got a lot of concerns about that."

I'll admit it, that's about where I am, I guess. Do you have a good, reasonably objective reader on the TPP so I can know more than just that Bernie is against it?
posted by argybarg at 12:21 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Come to the Jon Stewart segment for the righteous indignation, stay for the Hamilton love.
posted by zachlipton at 12:22 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Thanks Jon and Stephen, I needed that.
posted by Drinky Die at 12:25 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

What scares me about Trump is the musicality of his voice. I know, I know, I hate that fucking orange monkey and all he stands for, but there's something about his voice that is noteworthy, I don't have the language to articulate it.

Holy shit could you predict presidential races based on some weird vocal analysis
posted by angrycat at 1:13 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

I feel like I was kidnapped for attempted brainwashing by some sort of cult for a week.
posted by Drinky Die at 1:17 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

There is an actor I know that I've been trying to get to join here; I've quoted him three times and everyone here has dug it and he'd be an interesting addition.

He just made an incredibly eloquent post about the time he was a kid and visited Trump Tower with his designer father, and suddenly noticed how...crappy and cheap everything looked, and his father warned him about how that reflexts on Trump himself as well.

I have urged him to get a membership and post it here. If he says "naw" I will.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:27 AM on July 22, 2016 [17 favorites]

My experience with Fascist building is mostly in Italy and Spain, and can be summed up as "Expensive materials indifferently assembled" - lots of marble and mahogany, but nothing quite fits, and there are rough gaps between the marble slabs. Is that the sort of thing you mean?
posted by Grangousier at 1:34 AM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

Josh Marshall: Who Was This Angry Man Yelling At Me?
posted by ltl at 1:35 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Grangousier, that is indeed eerily close to being the kind of thing he saw. Although the lesson drawn from it in his case was more about fraud than Fascism.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:38 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Holy shit could you predict presidential races based on some weird vocal analysis

The Dean Scream lends credence to that maybe? Also I saw some research years ago (which I now can't find) that one of the main factors in selecting a spouse is perception of their voice.
posted by iffthen at 2:17 AM on July 22, 2016

Although the lesson drawn from it in his case was more about fraud than Fascism.

I suspect Fascism is a kind of fraud. After finally getting to write that down (rather than trot it out in the pub), I was able to move to the next stage, which is: What this suggests is an interest in signalling wealth while having no interest in the craftsmanship necessary to support it. Which is why a lot of us outside the illusion-bubble can go "hold on, that doesn't even make sense",* because we're looking for pragmatic strategies which the architects of the illusion are deliberately avoiding (because to acknowledge that they exist at all would undermine the illusion itself).**

I found Jonathan Meades' recent programme on Fascism and architecture very interesting, and fun if you like Meades' style; a companion piece to previous programmes on Naziism and Stalinism. They may even contradict what I just said.

In this case the nature of the fraud seems to be that in practical terms there's no such thing as a Trump presidency, and that he's intending to subcontract to Pence. So in fact, Trumps candidacy is a Trojan horse for a Pence presidency, something no one has voted for anywhere.

This is very similar to what's happened in the UK over the last six years, actually, but this thread's so long, and the subject so far removed from it, I can't really go into it.

*And other defamatory epithets.

**c.f. Brexit.
posted by Grangousier at 2:23 AM on July 22, 2016 [28 favorites]

Kate Andrews of Republicans Overseas UK (also Head of Communications and Research Fellow at the Adam Smith Institute?) interviewed on BBC World News said that she won't be voting for Trump unless he were to retract some of the offensive things he said to minorities, which seems unlikely; that Trump had probably ruined most of the progress the party has made in attracting minorities; and that she wouldn't be voting for Clinton because Clinton is actually more hawkish than Trump.

Andrews also evidently participated in a discussion on BBC Radio 4 on Wednesday, though I haven't listened to it.
posted by XMLicious at 2:33 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

If Trump had delivered that speech in the cadence and manner he uses for extemporaneous speaking it would have been very effective. It would have been quicker and insidiously worrying. As it was, it wasn't terrible, but he did a mediocre-to-bad job of delivering all that button-pushing demagoguery. It will probably generate some bounce, but not as much as it could have done. Trump's problem is that he's an OK speaker in his own vein, but a poor orator who lacks the self insight to do anything to change that.
posted by howfar at 3:26 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I'm actually relieved the new thread was deleted, because I've been spending hours reading these various RNC threads. It's fascinating-- it really is!-- but all these threads! I CAN'T EVEN
posted by suburbanbeatnik at 3:34 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

DNC themes I would like to see:
A. Friar's Club Roast in absentia
B. Witch Trial (book by Lin-Manuel Miranda)
C. Hoodslam
D. Liz Warren open mic nights
E. Mystery Political Theater 3000 (in which the Democratic nominees have been selected to blah blah blah Republican speeches you know what I mean)
F. Literally anything involving Beyoncé
G. Santa Claus pelted by batteries
H. Trump cameo
posted by clorox at 3:36 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

I promise there will be Trump cameos, they'll just be on networks that aren't hosting the DNC.

Also, oh jeez, while I'd like this to be the election thread for a while, if Clinton selects her running mate tomorrow, is that significant enough to warrant a new post?

My head says yes but my heart says please no .
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:42 AM on July 22, 2016

I think it's good to only have the election threads occasionally. The fact that you can't really comment on any mobile device, once the threads got over a few thousand comments, currently seems to me more a feature than a bug, forcing us to go and talk about other things, if not actually engage with our families and loved-ones.
posted by howfar at 3:47 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

The balloons at the RNC were blown up by inner-city high school students who worked for a donation to their school.
posted by zombieflanders at 3:51 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

The big head-scratcher of the RNC: Where was Kushner?

For many months during the campaign, Jared Kushner has acted as the key component of the "family" faction of the Trump campaign, and has been seen as guaranteed a high-level placement in Trump's presidential administration. There was talk that he'd be picked as Chief of Staff. Kushner's newspaper and its website have benefited from free media publicity, and, as his goal is to increase circulation, it makes sense that Kushner would continue to want to remain in the spotlight. Kushner is Trump's primary apologist for the odious anti-semitic re-tweets, and is Trump's outreach person for the Jewish community. A natural progression of speeches last night would have been Kushner -> Ivanka -> Trump.

One can speculate that, since Ivanka and Kushner's rabbi has backed out of appearing at the RNC, Kushner may have decided to separate himself from the campaign, and from his father-in-law. The fact that Cristie, who jailed Kushner's father, continues as a Trump ally may be part of this. Kushner's printed apologia for Trump's antisemitism sounded like a regretful buyer of a Ford Aztec attempting to convince himself of the wisdom of his decision.

If Kushner truly has backed out of the Trump campaign, this bodes ill. Trump will have lost a voice of rationality--and a brake on his unhinged anti-semitism.
posted by Gordion Knott at 4:00 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

I think there's a lot of reaching there to decide that Kushner is out. He was never on any official list of speakers and isn't generally known as that kind of campaigner.
posted by cell divide at 4:03 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

The balloons at the RNC were blown up by inner-city high school students who worked for a donation to their school.

Yeah they ain't seeing a penny of that money after the balloon debacle. Mr Trump does not pay when he hasn't had value.
posted by howfar at 4:07 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

>He was never on any official list of speakers and isn't generally known as that kind of campaigner.

Well, there really wasn't an "official list of speakers," if you think about it. There was a fluctuating, random list of names that changed daily.

Dana White is on. Pyramid marketing scheme person is on. But not Jared Kushner, the key person in handling the campaign's Jewish outreach and anti-semitism issue? It doesn't make sense.

He may not spend hours at the podium but he's a seasoned public speaker.
posted by Gordion Knott at 4:36 AM on July 22, 2016

Mr Trump does not pay ~~when he hasn't had value~~.
posted by mmoncur at 4:37 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

The Guardian's been running a regular round-up of "The Lies Trump Told This Week.". Today's edition has the convention special.
posted by Paul Slade at 4:54 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

because Clinton is actually more hawkish than Trump.

I had an article thrown in my face about this yesterday... It was the most BIG LIE thing I have every read. Blaming the Clintons for events that started prior to Bill even getting elected, bitching about every US intervention in the past 30 years, and then, in the middle of things, blaming Bill Clinton for not pulling the trigger that would have killed Bin Laden (and linking to an article where Bill himself said the reason he didn't is that there would have been a lot of innocent civilian casualties to support that claim).

At the time I thought it was written to persuade Bernie supporters but I guess not.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 5:25 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Dude, Gordion Knott, I enjoy composing mental Trump-family fanfiction just as much as the next person, but this little fantasy you've got going on about Jared Kushner doesn't make a lot of sense, and it's kinda weird and gross. I would give it a rest.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 5:27 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

The Guardian's been running a regular round-up of "The Lies Trump Told This Week.". Today's edition has the convention special.

Along the same lines is James Fallows' ongoing Trump Timecapsule wherein he chronicles the ways Trump has, as he puts it, "broken the norms that applied to previous major-party candidates."
posted by peeedro at 5:37 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

I hadn't seen the Trump Time Capsule but that's terrific. It's nice to have documentation of his batshittiness on hand for easy reference.
posted by Tevin at 5:44 AM on July 22, 2016

After this, I don't even want to watch the dem convention, Trump lost, it is over.

So, this is an odd comparison, but I see a similar thing happen in the team-based, online video game I play (Mechwarrior Online). My team plays well and halfway through, it's clear that we're going to win. There are still going to be plenty of opportunities to fuck it up, but as long as we don't, the match is in the bag. I've finally gotten the guys I play with to understand that when I say, "Guys, you can calm down, we've got this." They know to mentally add, "as long as we keep our heads on straight and don't fuck up."

We don't the rest of the match any differently, we're just less tense about it. I hope that this election is like that for the Hillary campaign and I think it is after this convention.

So, going forward here on Metafilter, I'm just going to assume that's what people mean when they say, "Trump lost" or "Clinton has this in the bag". She still has to bring her A-game, but before the convention, the outcome was still really uncertain.

Personally, I'll feel a lot better when we're getting that kind of message from Fivethirtyeight.com but I feel better about it now than I did a few days ago.
posted by VTX at 5:49 AM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

Wow, that story about the balloons almost makes me more angry than anything else I've read this election season, so far. And that's saying something.
posted by jet_pack_in_a_can at 6:00 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

So, just to sum up the various Trumps speeches from last night:

Tax cuts = public works programs
Anti-war = Eliminating ISIS abroad and having an even bigger military
Black = White
Up = Down

And everyone gets a pony.

Did I get that right?
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:08 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Did I get that right?

Also, I alone!

And, law and order = no more crime. He promised to end crime.

AND, he's gonna do it all not the day after inauguration, but the day of. We're going to wake up on the day of to a better america. So he won't even have taken the oath of office yet and he, trump'll have solved all of our problems.
posted by dis_integration at 6:13 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

I was with some friends last night, and their teen age kids, watching another show, and we briefly watched the beginning of Trump's speech together. Every time that Trump said, "law and order", the teenagers would break into the Law & Order theme song. HIGHLY preferable way to watch.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:17 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

I'm dying to know what social conservatives in the party are thinking right now. They worked so hard to make their platform as hateful and backwards as possible and then Ivanka's up there talking about free childcare and Trump is like YOU GET A PONY AND YOU GET A PONY I ALONE WILL GIVE EVERYONE A PONY please don't ask me where I'm going to get all these ponies.

Like, who is falling for this? I'm baffled. No more wars, but also let's bomb the shit out of some people!
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:18 AM on July 22, 2016 [24 favorites]

SNL plays 'Trumpémon Go' at the RNC
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:19 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Like, one of those statements can be something that happens. They can't both be. Please someone point me to a media source that has noticed and is reporting on the inherent contradictions here.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:19 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Blah. Woke up to Mara Liasson on NPR saying that everything went fine, even the balloon drop.
posted by ZeusHumms at 6:25 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

i love how people are like "but his platform doesn't even make sense" when there are plenty of people out there like this. he knows his audience.
posted by entropicamericana at 6:29 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

The balloons at the RNC were blown up by inner-city high school students who worked for a donation to their school.

I hope they got that donation in advance, otherwise they're going to be pretty disappointed when they go to collect and Trump sues them.
posted by leotrotsky at 6:40 AM on July 22, 2016 [14 favorites]

If nothing else the level of managerial incompetence at the RNC has explained why Donald Trump has gone bankrupt so often.

The coverage has also demonstrated that the media is really devoted to not talking about the racism involved, and that for some bizarre reason the Democrats are helping them avoid that too. NPR had an official Democrat on to talk about things and he had the blandest, safest, least honest response I've heard.

He talked about how Trump was connecting to "working class" (I think he meant "white working class") people about the economy, then said that while he thought the problem was real Trump's prescription was wrong and that he hoped that going forward Trump would talk more about specifics of his economic plan instead of just sweeping platitudes.

W.T.F.?

He couldn't even bring himself to point out that Trump's "prescription" was nothing more than blaming the economic problems of poor whites on poor Latinx people? That all Trump was doing was stirring up racial resentment?

He could even have put in a swipe at how baldly managed the convention was and he didn't.

Feh.

Trump has handed the Democrats the way to turn his biggest strength against him, and they seem to be dedicated to leaving it alone.

Here's the message: Donald Trump says he has the business skills and experience to run America, but he can't even run a convention. AND/OR (take your pick) After seeing his management skills on display at the convention it's easy to understand why he went bankrupt four times.

Simple, true, effective, and attacking his strength. His whole campaign, when it isn't about naked racism, xenophobia, and bigotry, is all about how he's a successful businessman not an (icky) politician.

The democrats need to be doing their best to paint him as the failure that he really is, they need to be digging up every person Trump screwed and having them film ads explain how they were small businessmen trying to make ends meet and when they got a contract to do work for Trump they believed he would live up to his deals. But then he stole their goods and services and left their company either ruined or damaged. "Donald Trump, bad for business, bad for America".

Instead we get this mealymouthed crap about how they hope Trump will be more concrete in the future. I really hope that's just NPR picking the worst possible Democrat to give a response, and not an indication of how Clinton intends to run her campaign.
posted by sotonohito at 6:55 AM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

NPR had an official Democrat on to talk about things and he had the blandest, safest, least honest response I've heard.

I heard that this morning too, I think and I was like, really dude? Do you need some coffee? He basically said, "I guess what Trump said was fine and everything, but we're better." UGH NO STOP WHAT NOTHING HE SAID WAS FINE, NOTHING IS FINE, EVERYTHING IS TERRIBLE
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:57 AM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

The democrats need to be doing their best to paint him as the failure that he really is, they need to be digging up every person Trump screwed and having them film ads explain how they were small businessmen trying to make ends meet and when they got a contract to do work for Trump they believed he would live up to his deals. But then he stole their goods and services and left their company either ruined or damaged. "Donald Trump, bad for business, bad for America".

I mean, the Clinton campaign is running ads that do exactly this.
posted by dismas at 6:58 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Clinton is going to have to bring her A game, and she is going to have to get lucky, too. The odds remain in her favor, but a few more terrorist attacks or shootings of police or some more of the email scandal, and the election could easily go to Trump regardless of how well she runs her campaign.

Hard work and no complacency ahead.
posted by haiku warrior at 6:58 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Maybe it's time to just start telling your social circles that NPR is only good for the chat shows and fluffy Americana, but otherwise not really to be trusted? It might be a harder sell to a lot of older liberals, but if you make the case that they're running the same false equivalency game that many of them are already sick of, they'll get the picture.
posted by zombieflanders at 6:59 AM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

The balloons at the RNC were blown up by inner-city high school students who worked for a donation to their school.

Inflated. Please.

Are you trying to get those kids shot by police?
posted by srboisvert at 7:00 AM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

I really wish the Clinton campaign would get back to me about how to volunteer instead of just constantly asking me for money (which I give, but I'd also like to do something).
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:00 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

He talked about how Trump was connecting to "working class" (I think he meant "white working class")...

That is what most people are saying when they say "working class," whether they intend it or not. Part of the way racism is baked into every part of our society is this assumption of whiteness as the default state.
posted by dersins at 7:03 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Male escorts are making crazy money at the RNC

The surprise here probably being that there haven't been more Grindr screenshots floating around. This seems odd though:

When contacted by The Post, females for hire said they’re making much less money than normal.

Do non-closeted republicans cheat less? Or are they all doing it with each other?
posted by Artw at 7:03 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

EmpressCallipygos: He just made an incredibly eloquent post about the time he was a kid and visited Trump Tower with his designer father, and suddenly noticed how...crappy and cheap everything looked, and his father warned him about how that reflexts on Trump himself as well.

In that general theme: Donald Trump gave Charlie Sheen fake platinum cufflinks as a belated wedding gift to Charlie, to the wedding that Trump wasn't invited to attend. But it doesn't stop there - Trump has been giving out fake diamond cuff links for years.

"Here, take my platinum diamond Harry Winston cufflinks," says Trump. But take them to an appraiser, and you'll hear ‘In their finest moment, this is cheap pewter and bad zirconias.’ And they’re stamped ‘Trump.’”

Which says a lot about Trump.

...NPR saying that everything went fine...

*endless screaming*

Well, there wasn't a riot, no one died, and the balloons eventually came down, right? That's a good night in my books.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:08 AM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

Soren, you have to go to her website and search for events by your zipcode. That's the only way I've been able to figure out how to actually find places that do things for the campaign.
posted by Tevin at 7:09 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Clinton 'Likely' to Announce Virginia Senator Tim Kaine as VP Pick
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:10 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Male escorts are making crazy money at the RNC

The surprise here probably being that there haven't been more Grindr screenshots floating around.

Because RNC is smart and provides everyone with some good boilerplate NDAs for their ... extracurricular activities.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:10 AM on July 22, 2016

I really wish the Clinton campaign would get back to me about how to volunteer instead of just constantly asking me for money (which I give, but I'd also like to do something).

I'm hoping that's a sign there's just a FLOOD of people signing up to volunteer.
posted by sallybrown at 7:10 AM on July 22, 2016

I really wish the Clinton campaign would get back to me about how to volunteer instead of just constantly asking me for money (which I give, but I'd also like to do something).

By all accounts they're running a tight ship but you'd think they'd be better at finding vaguely affirming makework for people to do just to keep them enthusiastic.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 7:14 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

I don't know anyone who has gotten a response to the Clinton campaign when they requested to volunteer, and I know people who signed up a year ago. They seem to just need money.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:16 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Good to hear that the delegates are maintaining a wide stance in the men's room; it is traditional.
posted by thelonius at 7:17 AM on July 22, 2016

I actually had the same experience with the Obama campaign. The link Tevin provided showed lots of voter registration events and some convention watch parties. I might sign up for some registration drives. I'd also really like to volunteer to drive people to vote in November.

There were also phonebanking events but uuggghhhhhh
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:17 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm reading through all your comments from last night. A bunch of you were drunk, weren't you?
posted by clawsoon at 7:19 AM on July 22, 2016 [17 favorites]

NPR had an official Democrat on to talk about things and he had the blandest, safest, least honest response I've heard.

I heard that this morning too, I think and I was like, really dude? Do you need some coffee? He basically said, "I guess what Trump said was fine and everything, but we're better." UGH NO STOP WHAT NOTHING HE SAID WAS FINE, NOTHING IS FINE, EVERYTHING IS TERRIBLE

"So at today's convention, one of the more exciting speeches of the day had Moloch calling for the sacrifice of all first-born children, specifically saying "Blood for the Blood God." Thoughts, Antonio Chen-Karlsson?"

"That Moloch, what a character! I'm having much fun here! So it's true that some are arguing that calling for the blood of the innocent is going too far, but others here at the convention are saying that democrats have long 'sacrificed their children' on the alter of income redistribution, and that this is really just the same thing."

"I actually spoke to a delegate from Massachusetts, a Black Philip..."

"See, who says there's no diversity here!"

"...and he said, essentially, who hasn't invited the Forces of Darkness to bestow their infernal power upon us? Both sides do it. What do you think, Lucien Azikiwe-Riley?"

"Who could possible say? Who could ever divine fact from opinion or truth from fiction from the words of others? What kind of occupation could ever elucidate meaning or narrative from the chaotic maelstrom that is human existence? Hey, look! Balloons! Closing Thoughts, عالية 张-Smith?

"Exactly right, I think the last speaker summed it up when he said, and I'm paraphrasing, "Ol sonuf vorsag goho Satan lonsh Calz od vors caosgo; sobra zol Ror i ta nazps od graa Ta malprg."

"Who the fuck knows? This is NPR."
posted by leotrotsky at 7:20 AM on July 22, 2016 [57 favorites]

A huge turnout would something really great, to defeat Trumpism soundly with a real repudiation, and move the country forward in a positive way.

Unfortunately so far it seems hard for Clinton to generate much enthusiasm. So many people seem to really dislike her, from all walks of life. Being part of the Government for such a long time seems to have that effect but especially right now.
posted by cell divide at 7:20 AM on July 22, 2016

Clinton 'Likely' to Announce Virginia Senator Tim Kaine as VP Pick

Given that Kaine's not going to be in the same state as Clinton (he's been confirmed at events in the NE today), I'm thinking this is more wishful thinking than reporting.
posted by NoxAeternum at 7:21 AM on July 22, 2016

I'm reading through all your comments from last night. A bunch of you were drunk, weren't you?

You say that like it would have been possible to watch that sober.
posted by dersins at 7:22 AM on July 22, 2016 [24 favorites]

"Some rich children are careless that way; they break things and other people have to clean up the mess."

Fist-bump, Brooksie, that's one of my favorite lines from The Great Gatsby, too.

("They were careless people, Tom and Daisy—they smashed up things and creatures and then retreated back into their money or their vast carelessness or whatever it was that kept them together, and let other people clean up the mess they had made.")

posted by octobersurprise at 7:22 AM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

Clinton 'Likely' to Announce Virginia Senator Tim Kaine as VP Pick

Boring, safe (last month Charlie Pierce said that any hypothetical skeletons in the closet "[are] likely wearing old comfy cardigans and Hush Puppies"), not going to excite anybody, likes the TPP. It could be a fake-out (I'm hoping for Tom Perez), but it's a very Clinton-esque pick, especially since Governor McAuliffe is a former Clinton staffer and campaigner. On the upside, the dude has been a lot less centrist than many expected, and if McAuliffe appoints a decently left-leaning guy like Tom Perriello, it would make me feel a bit better about it.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:24 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

If Leni Riefenstahl were alive, Trump would hire her to film this speech. Then not pay her.

— Norman Ornstein (@NormOrnstein) July 22, 2016

posted by tonycpsu at 7:26 AM on July 22, 2016 [33 favorites]

It could be a fake-out (I'm hoping for Tom Perez)

Right there with you, crossing my fingers.
posted by sallybrown at 7:26 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

I'm still confused about being the anchovy on Ivanka's Caesar salad.

Speaking as someone who has taught creative writing and once thought he might make his living as a poet (yeah, haha) - an extended metaphor in the wrong hands is a dangerous thing.
posted by aught at 7:26 AM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

Fist-bump, Brooksie

The opening paragraph to that article is great:

Welcome to a world without rules. (I want you to read this paragraph in your super-scary movie trailer voice.) Welcome to a world in which families are mowed down by illegal immigrants, in which cops die in the streets, in which Muslims rampage the innocents and threaten our very way of life, in which the fear of violent death lurks in every human heart.

Replying with facts to counter the fear-mongering won't work, but responding with humor helps (at least, it's helping me).
posted by filthy light thief at 7:26 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

He's No One's Idea of a Liberal Hero, But Tim Kaine Is a Natural Fit for Clinton: Behind the Virginia senator's moderate reputation is a history of quiet progressive activism. (Mother Jones)

full disclosure: pat caldwell, the author of this piece, once shot me with a nerf gun
posted by dismas at 7:26 AM on July 22, 2016 [20 favorites]

Make America Hate Again (Timothy Egan, NY Times Op-Ed / warning: DOUBLE TRUMP FACE PHOTO)

They didn’t riot in the streets of Cleveland, as Donald Trump said his supporters would do had things not gone his way. But you saw the raw essence of a riot, the madness and loss of reason, on display in four days of chaos at the Republican National Convention.

For a campaign now devoted to “law and order,” the launch was mob rule: in spirit, in tone, in words. Long after we’ve forgotten Trump’s closing speech — that paean to self, that nightmare portrait of an America where the lights have gone out — we will remember the savagery just below the surface.

posted by filthy light thief at 7:29 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

If you are a contributor to a member station [for NPR], or even if you're not, TELL THEM you think [they dropped the ball].

I just did this, threatening to pull my membership. They've been getting an automatic five-dollar pledge from me once a month for about 4 years now, and I threatened to make it go bye-bye. Will report if I get an email back.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:29 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

I don't know anyone who has gotten a response to the Clinton campaign when they requested to volunteer, and I know people who signed up a year ago. They seem to just need money.

My guess would be they'll use the convention as a kickoff of sorts for the general election ground game. Look for an "official" (has the little blue "H" flag next to it) convention watch party in your area, and attend that, if you can.
posted by dersins at 7:31 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

There's going to be so much pressure on Clinton that there wasn't on Trump. If she doesn't cure cancer and reverse global warming with her speech we're going to see pundits shaking their heads about an "enthusiasm gap."
posted by emjaybee at 7:31 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

FOR PEOPLE WHO WANT TO VOLUNTEER:

The best way to do so is to contact your county/city Democratic party headquarters. If anyone needs help finding out where their local Dem headquarters is, I'm more than happy to help!
posted by cooker girl at 7:32 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

I tried that, cooker girl, by signing up through their volunteer and didn't get a response. Any ideas on how to better get in touch? I'm interested in volunteering beyond this election, too, so that's where I started...
posted by Tevin at 7:36 AM on July 22, 2016

Also consider volunteering for downballot candidates as well!
posted by dismas at 7:37 AM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

Tevin, through which volunteer page? Your local Dem headquarters?
posted by cooker girl at 7:39 AM on July 22, 2016

Cooker girl can I send you a memail instead of clogging up the comments?
posted by Tevin at 7:44 AM on July 22, 2016

Definitely!
posted by cooker girl at 7:44 AM on July 22, 2016

"Here, take my platinum diamond Harry Winston cufflinks," says Trump. But take them to an appraiser, and you'll hear ‘In their finest moment, this is cheap pewter and bad zirconias.’ And they’re stamped ‘Trump.’”

It suddenly occurred to me that people may not know there is a useful if archaic word which is applicable!

trumpery -
noun (plural trumperies)
1: Attractive articles of little value or use.
1.1: Practices or beliefs that are superficially or visually appealing but have little real value or worth.

adjective
1: Showy but worthless: trumpery jewelry
1.1: Delusive or shallow: that trumpery hope which lets us dupe ourselves
Late Middle English (denoting trickery): from Old French tromperie, from tromper 'deceive'.

posted by winna at 7:45 AM on July 22, 2016 [65 favorites]

and if McAuliffe appoints a decently left-leaning guy like Tom Perriello, it would make me feel a bit better about it.

Whoever McAuliffe appoints will only sit a year out of that term; VA law says you need to run an election for the position at the next major election, which will be the 2017 governor race.

Strategically I doubt they'd pick anyone all that off from the Warner/Kaine/Webb(turn head and spit) breed of dem, since they'll want them to not only serve a year but also use that incumbent advantage to keep the seat.
posted by phearlez at 7:45 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Friday fun: Busted! State Department spokesman John Kirby catches a reporter playing Pokemon Go during a briefing (video)
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:48 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Also consider volunteering for downballot candidates as well!

Speaking of which, does anybody have a good list of D candidates who are either vulnerable to Republican challengers or who are challenging vulnerable R incumbents? After last night, I'm feeling a little spendy...
posted by tobascodagama at 7:50 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Wikipedia has a list of competitive districts for House races, that's at least a starting point.

Right off the top of my head, OH, PA and NH are worthwhile Senate campaigns to support, but that's not a comprehensive list, just the ones that come to mind.
posted by gimonca at 7:55 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

So... if I live in NYC, and I won't be able to take time off work to go to another state, is there much point in me volunteering?
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:57 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Guys! Guys! I have a completely unexpected amount of tree hats from disaffected delegates who don't want to remember this shitshow. Who wants Republican tree hats? Now, not just for CookerGirl! Price: must commit to helping defeat Trump.
posted by corb at 7:58 AM on July 22, 2016 [55 favorites]

winna: that trumpery hope which lets us dupe ourselves

Another fine example of the term in use: "His usual conversation is pure trumpery."

Salon caught on, too -- Trump really does stand for B.S.: “Trumpery,” an old-fashioned word that’s proving useful today
posted by filthy light thief at 7:58 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

At this moment, Donald is claiming again that the man in the picture with Lee Harvey Oswald ("having breakfast") is Ted Cruz's father. Dammit, why couldn't he do this last night?
posted by sallybrown at 8:00 AM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

showbiz_liz: YES YES YES!!! When Dems show up to the polls, Democratic candidates win. The problem is getting them to show up. Phone calls (I know, UGH) are fantastic for getting Dems to show up on election day.
posted by cooker girl at 8:00 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

corb: Guys! Guys! I have a completely unexpected amount of tree hats from disaffected delegates who don't want to remember this shitshow. Who wants Republican tree hats? Now, not just for CookerGirl! Price: must commit to helping defeat Trump.

If I had one, I'd keep it with my Cleganebowl foam hands.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:01 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

FOR PEOPLE WHO WANT TO VOLUNTEER:

Also check out Voteriders.org.
posted by octobersurprise at 8:02 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wikipedia has a list of competitive districts for House races, that's at least a starting point.

That'll do!
posted by tobascodagama at 8:03 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Guys! Guys! I have a completely unexpected amount of tree hats from disaffected delegates who don't want to remember this shitshow. Who wants Republican tree hats? Now, not just for CookerGirl! Price: must commit to helping defeat Trump.

MMEEEE! ME ME ME!

favorite corb if you want a hat!
posted by leotrotsky at 8:03 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

So, my take-home from all this nonsense.

The Republican National Convention was in part a bizarre, anger-fueled hatefest that exposed the naked rage at the heart of Trumpist Republicanism and in part a complete catastrophuckup that makes Trump and his cronies look like incompetent nincompoops. In a normal year this would be a campaign-ending disaster, but in the apocalyptic SF novel that is 2016, it instead has both pluses and minuses for both sides.

I'll start with the worst news -- in some ways, this actually played to Trump's strengths, because it kept him in the news. The style of his whole campaign has been to reap billions of dollars' worth of free advertisement by stirring up controversy, saying baffling and oftentimes internally contradictory bullshit, and constantly feeding the maw of the 24-hour news cycle. If the important thing is for Trump to be the candidate everyone is talking about, then it literally does not matter if the news is for or against, only that it is news. And there's an argument to be made that this is true -- if the narrative in November is that the election is TRUMP vs. (Trump's opponent), then Trump might very well walk away with this thing. This means that what seems to be the obvious things for Clinton to do -- pick a safe VP with relatively broad appeal, and run a competent, normal convention with strong policy messaging -- is in some ways actually dangerous, because if it fails to kick Trump out of the news cycle and make news on its own, it might as well not happen.

The good news, on the other hand, is that the all-news-is-good-news-even-if-the-news-is-that-you're-a-bunch-of-rabid-incompetents game most likely has limited appeal outside Trump's base. If Clinton *can* break the new-cycle stranglehold without appearing incompetent herself, Trumps campaign stands a chance of dissolving into dust like a Buffy vampire exposed to sunlight. How to do this with sane and positive messaging is a bit tricky, but a combination of star power, electrifyin' speechifyin' if it can be gotten, and looking good in comparison (e.g., Sanders vs. Cruz) could turn the trick.

So, I wouldn't say the prognosis is perfect, and Trump is playing a newish game which makes the results hard to predict. But I think there's a good chance that Clinton can turn it around on him.
posted by kyrademon at 8:04 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

The Cook Political Report has a list of potentially competitive senate races.

One of them is Richard Burr's seat in North Carolina - Hamilton fans, don't you want to spend all your money to defeat a distant relative of Aaron Burr? (N.B. I dislike the guy because he's anti-gay, anti-abortion, anti-environment, pro-gun, and pro-PATRIOT-act-government-surveillance. You can also spend your money for that reason!)
posted by Jeanne at 8:05 AM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

Memail me with address, and when I get back I will begin The Great En-Hattening.
posted by corb at 8:08 AM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

One of them is Richard Burr's seat in North Carolina - Hamilton fans, don't you want to spend all your money to defeat a distant relative of Aaron Burr? (N.B. I dislike the guy because he's anti-gay, anti-abortion, anti-environment, pro-gun, and pro-PATRIOT-act-government-surveillance. You can also spend your money for that reason!)

I grew up in this guy's district, and I remember my parents liking him when I was a kid, though they are both lifelong liberals. He apparently was very responsive to local concerns - if you called his office he'd help you out.

I don't know if he's always been as shitty as he is now - either he changed, or the world changed around him, or it just used to matter less when there were more moderate Republicans around to keep the other ones in check. But any goodwill I and my family had toward this guy is long gone. It's time for him to go.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:08 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Trump questions why the @NatEnquirer never got a Pulitzer Prize, while discussing Ted Cruz’s father
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:08 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Probably another good thing to do, considering how badly most national media bungle political coverage, is to throw money at independent outlets. I like TWiBNation, other people can probably recommend their own favourites.
posted by tobascodagama at 8:09 AM on July 22, 2016

dersins: I'm reading through all your comments from last night. A bunch of you were drunk, weren't you?

I wasn't, but my browser was.

I want a hat! Weirdly, the only Clinton event listed in the next several weeks is LGBTQ For Hillary. I need to find a watch party for the convention. Time to get the boots on the ground, so to speak. (Although I'll be away for a week in early August.)
I've also been quietly pushing back on Facebook when, say, someone posts their fear of Trump, and their conservative and/or Bernie deadender friends and family start filling their comments with conspiracy theories and propaganda.
It's exhausting, but I resolve not to let unsubstantiated crap sit there unchallenged. Based on research, I have little hope of changing the conspiracy-posting people's minds, but I may well give observers pause.

Is that enough to qualify for a hat, corb?
posted by Superplin at 8:10 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump questions why the @NatEnquirer never got a Pulitzer Prize, while discussing Ted Cruz’s father

for the love of god, this is like the fable of the scorpion and the frog except there's no frog and the scorpion stings himself
posted by murphy slaw at 8:11 AM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

Trump questions why the @NatEnquirer never got a Pulitzer Prize, while discussing Ted Cruz’s father

The look on Pence's face behind him is kind of priceless.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:14 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

I feel as if I'm washing off tarry mud. What a load of ugly lies and how horribly reminiscent of almost all of Hitler rhetoric that awful speech was. Happy to read this in my inbox from HRC campaign :

It’s been a long week in Cleveland -- four straight days of anger, and Trump’s speech last night doubled down on it all.

Some people may be feeling discouraged about what the Republican convention showed us about our country.

Don'the be, [bearwife].

On Monday, our own convention begins, where we’ll reveal our values. We’ve built the most progressive Democratic platform in history, which calls for affordable health care, affordable college, a fair wage, strengthening LGBT, labor, and reproductive rights, criminal justice reform, and the explicit acknowledgment that black lives do matter.

Be proud, [bearwife]. It’s going to be inspiring, unifying, and by this time next week, you may just have recovered from what happened in Cleveland.
posted by bearwife at 8:16 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

How comes we never see Pence smoking?
posted by Artw at 8:17 AM on July 22, 2016

Trump questions why the @NatEnquirer never got a Pulitzer Prize, while discussing Ted Cruz’s father

That is just unbelievable.
posted by mazola at 8:17 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Why? You saw this last week, right?
posted by NoxAeternum at 8:19 AM on July 22, 2016

How comes we never see Pence smoking?

you mean out his ears
posted by murphy slaw at 8:19 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I hop Sanders' speech on Monday is enough to sway the fence-sitters. There are still a few people on my Facebook feed imagining a convention coup, "just like FDR."
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:19 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Diseased as in dis-eased is how I am feeling.
posted by y2karl at 8:20 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trump questions why the @NatEnquirer never got a Pulitzer Prize, while discussing Ted Cruz’s father

Proving that Trump can never go more than 12 hours of getting decent news before he steps, Sideshow Bob-style, onto a series of rakes (each of these is an individual tweet/article):

CLEVELAND — Trump, standing next to his VP Mike Pence: “If I don’t win, I’m going to blame Mike. We have to blame Mike."

Trump on Cruz endorsement: “If he gives it, I will not accept it.”

Trump: "I didn't insult the wife"

Trump right now is going back to Cruz's father and Lee Harvey Oswald. "Has anybody ever denied that was his father" with Oswald?

Trump now bringing up Dan Scavino, who was behind the Star of David image tweet, to the stage.

Trump on Cruz: "Maybe I’ll set up a super PAC if he decides to run. Are you allowed to set up a super PAC Mike as president?"

Trump reiterating that he wants to demand cash tribute from Japan in exchange for military protection.

Donald Trump cancels campaign stop in Akron and struggles to find donors in Ohio
posted by zombieflanders at 8:20 AM on July 22, 2016 [23 favorites]

BTW if anyone wants to contact the NPR ombudsman, here you go (bottom right button): http://help.npr.org/customer/portal/emails/new
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:20 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

After the convention speech, I feel like I'm watching that scene in The Office where Michael Scott is trying desperately not to make an idiot of himself, and the rest of the office keeps on offering up double entendres until he just blurts out "THATSWHATSHESAID! That's what she said!"
posted by zombieflanders at 8:22 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Noahpinion: Trump happened because conservatism failed - "Add all this up, and what do you get? A massive, total failure of all three pillars of modern conservatism within a 15-year period. It's little wonder, therefore, that Trump voters were unwilling to vote for Republicans who offered them only more of the same - the same economic policies that seemed to cost them their jobs and businesses and wages, the same foreign policies that embarrassed their country, the same social policies that had done nothing to save their families. Even when the conservative ideology was offered with maximum fire and vitriol, in the person of Ted Cruz, they weren't willing to bite. So they looked around for something else, and Trump was there."

Hilzoy: How The Republicans Got Donald Trump - " in world w/o trust, gestures are everything. In world in which GOP leaders have lost trust, they can't give those gestures. ... Who is going to tell voters that Trump's ideas are nuts, *and be believed?* The MSM? Experts?"

Ian Welsh: Trump’s Speech: Not Insane - "I don’t support Trump, nor do I support Clinton, but the demonization of Trump is off the scale. I very much doubt he is Hiter reborn. He actually seems less likely to start a nuclear war than his opponent. Some of his policies I despise, but some of what he is proposing is not in the least nuts, it is just not acceptable to the guardians of the neoliberal status quo."

Politico EU: Republican insiders: Trump nailed it

The Hill: GOP Pundit Weigh In On Speech

Vox: Trump supporters thought his speech about an America plagued by crime and terror was uplifting

The Week: Elizabeth Warren on Donald Trump's convention speech: 'He sounded like some two-bit dictator'

Buzzfeed: Latino And Immigration Groups React To Nominee Trump: The Pivot Is Dead

Slate: Donald Trump’s Speech Was Just Another Scam, Jamelle Bouie

DESPERATE TIMES, DESPERATE MEASURES

Gawker: Former KKK Grand Wizard on Trump's RNC Speech: "Couldn't Have Said It Better"

NY Mag: Donald Trump Is Bidding to Transform the GOP Into a White-Identity-Politics Party, Jon Chait

more at OMNIVORE
posted by the man of twists and turns at 8:23 AM on July 22, 2016 [28 favorites]

> "Speaking of which, does anybody have a good list of D candidates who are either vulnerable to Republican challengers or who are challenging vulnerable R incumbents?"

I tend to just contribute to the DSCC and the DCCC, which are generally pretty good about funneling money to the races that need it most.

If you prefer to donate to individual campaigns, important ones for the Senate include:

LIKELY TO BE EXTREMELY CLOSE RACES:

Catherine Cortez-Masto in Nevada. This one is likely to come down to the wire, and the Republicans likely consider it their best chance for a pick-up.

Ann Kirkpatrick in Nevada. The best chance the Democrats have had in decades to finally take a Nevada seat.

Tammy Duckworth in Illinois. Republican Mark Kirk is running from Trump as fast as he can; it might not save his seat.

Maggie Hassan in New Hampshire. Likely to be a neck-and-neck race.

Ted Strickland in Ohio. A real toss-up.

Katie McGinty in Pennsylvania. Going to be a bruising battle.

CURRENTLY SLIGHT EDGE TO REPUBLICANS:

Jason Kander in Missouri. A better pick-up opportunity for the Democrats than you might think.

Deborah Ross in North Carolina. Another one the Democrats have a better chance of pulling out than you might imagine.

Either Patrick Murphy or Alan Grayson in Florida (the primary hasn't happened yet). A chance to get rid of Marco Rubio.

Patty Judge in Iowa. If the people are going to make their opinion about the Supreme Court blocking known, this race (against Chuck Grassley, chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee) is where it will happen.

CURRENTLY SLIGHT EDGE TO DEMOCRATS:

Russ Feingold in Wisconsin. He could crush Ron Johnson in the grudge rematch.

Evan Bayh in Illinois. Bayh's entry into the race could turn this seat Democratic again.

Michael Bennet in Colorado. He likely has the advantage here, but Republicans will be targeting this one as a potential pick-up.

I'VE GOT NO IDEA HOW THIS IS GOING TO END UP:

Independent Margaret Stock in Alaska might agree to caucus with Democrats and might have a chance? This is a weird one.

I don't have as good handle/sources on the key House races. Anyone?
posted by kyrademon at 8:26 AM on July 22, 2016 [28 favorites]

One thing that I hope/expect to see happen is more of Trump's past hoving into view as things crank up. He must have skeletons the size of Brontosaurii in his closet - why no tax returns, Don? - and if every organ of repute doesn't have their best heat-seaking reptiles on the case I am sore disappoint.
posted by Devonian at 8:26 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Ann Kirkpatrick in Nevada. The best chance the Democrats have had in decades to finally take a Nevada seat.

Arizona, you mean. If this is a bad year for the GOP in down-ticket races, she'll be unseating McCain.
posted by zombieflanders at 8:28 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

I hop Sanders' speech on Monday is enough to sway the fence-sitters. There are still a few people on my Facebook feed imagining a convention coup, "just like FDR."

The responses to Sanders' tweet last night urging his supporters not to vote for Trump gave me literal nightmares. And I spent most of the non-nightmare hours of the night trying to debunk ridiculous allegations against Clinton. Ugh.
posted by Superplin at 8:29 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Katie McGinty in Pennsylvania. Going to be a bruising battle.

I got the push poll to end all push polls from Toomey the other day. Like, just horrible ridiculous brazen awful. He's a shitstain of the highest order.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:31 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Has it ever occurred to you that the psychic chaos we're all going through is exactly what Trump feeds on?

This campaign resembles an abusive, dysfunctional marriage so much. But stay strong.
posted by argybarg at 8:31 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

> "Arizona, you mean."

Whoops, sorry, yes. Bad fingers, they type stupid sometimes.
posted by kyrademon at 8:33 AM on July 22, 2016

The responses to Sanders' tweet last night urging his supporters not to vote for Trump gave me literal nightmares. And I spent most of the non-nightmare hours of the night trying to debunk ridiculous allegations against Clinton. Ugh.

I would save yourself the agony and direct your energy elsewhere. When you've got Sanders folks who won't even listen to their own candidate, a Twitter argument is not going to budge them out of their delusion.
posted by murphy slaw at 8:33 AM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

iffthen: Was nice to see Ivanka Trump come out in support of the Democrats.

My read on her is that she's too smart for a lot of her father's BS, and this is her way of announcing "I have to tow the party line for the sake of my personal life, but here are the values I actually support. If my dad wasn't involved in all this stupidity guess how I'd be voting and who I'd be supporting."

This type of response to Ivanka Trump's speech is exactly what I was worried about when I posted this.

First, even if she's going all with her father's campaign, she is still fine with riding a wave of Islamophobia, Latinxphobia, homophobia, transphobia, and outright lies to preserve peace in her personal life, no matter whom it hurts.

Second, she's in a much better position to stand up to her odious father than anyone else in the world. She's married to a very wealthy man, and she could easily make money with say, a tell all book about her father's horrible behaviour in private. She's so much more likeable than Donald that she'd likely win the war of public opinion.

It is my strong belief that Ms. Trump is essentially a grifter like her father and cares little about others whom his terrible rhetoric harms. She has so, so much work to do if she actually wants to make up for the damage she and her father have wrought.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:33 AM on July 22, 2016 [56 favorites]

but it's important to pick a message, right?

I think it's been shown that it's actually not at all important. Say something that Group A wants to hear on Monday, then say the total opposite, which Group B wants to hear on Tuesday, and everyone just nods along.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:34 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

With Christie's hostage face, I felt *why did you sell your soul man* and I imagined him going home and staring into space. With Pence's, it's more like I hope he's going to break and stride angrily off the stage and then go into a parking lot and start breaking car windows.
posted by angrycat at 8:35 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

zombieflanders: Ann Kirkpatrick in Nevada. The best chance the Democrats have had in decades to finally take a Nevada seat. Arizona, you mean. If this is a bad year for the GOP in down-ticket races, she'll be unseating McCain.

Yes. This is the second time I've ever contributed directly to a Senate race rather than general party funds. (The first time was to try to keep Flake out, but he's not as vile as McCain.)
posted by Superplin at 8:35 AM on July 22, 2016

I can't decide if the worse look for Trump's ridiculous NATO statements is that he's setting the US up as an empire demanding tribute, a protection racket threatening to kneecap anybody who doesn't pay up, or a mercenary army selling muscle to anybody who cuts us a check.

But the "Great Again" America does all three. We would overthrow Democratic governments for later tribute. We would "protect" the world from Communism in exchange for being able to reneg on Bretton Woods and subsequently gorge ourselves on cheap imports and energy. We would try to topple countries that didn't submit.
posted by Talez at 8:36 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

It is my strong belief that Ms. Trump is essentially a grifter like her father and cares little about others whom his terrible rhetoric harms.

Yeah, she's hawking the dress she wore last night on Twitter now. She just wants a piece of the action.
posted by murphy slaw at 8:38 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke has announced that he plans to run for U.S. Senate in Louisiana.
posted by zombieflanders at 8:38 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Any advice on which organisations a non-citizen living in the US (who cannot legally donate to campaigns) might think about supporting to facilitate some of these D candidates winning? I'm presuming Planned Parenthood, but who else?

I'd actually recommend something smaller than PP. Your money will go farther in smaller orgs with less name recognition. Off the top of my head I don't know what to suggest, but there's a constant problem in nonprofits of the most recognizable 5% of the orgs collecting 90% of the available individual donations (numbers pulled from ass, but the general point stands)
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:38 AM on July 22, 2016

The responses to Sanders' tweet last night urging his supporters not to vote for Trump gave me literal nightmares. And I spent most of the non-nightmare hours of the night trying to debunk ridiculous allegations against Clinton. Ugh.

If it's any comfort, Bernie Sanders's mentions are not the election.
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 8:40 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

From the estate of George Harrison (twitter):

The unauthorized use of #HereComestheSun at the #RNCinCLE is offensive & against the wishes of the George Harrison estate.

If it had been Beware of Darkness, then we MAY have approved it! #TrumpYourself
posted by Tarumba at 8:44 AM on July 22, 2016 [35 favorites]

I hop[e] Sanders' speech on Monday is enough to sway the fence-sitters.

As do I, and I think it needs to do more than just sway. He needs to build the first foundations for the case that Hillary Clinton is one of the most patriotic, effective, honest, knowledgeable and principled people ever to be nominated for President. Which, I truly believe she is, and I believe he can speak to. No one spends decades in public service and politics without making some missteps, some poor choices and some decisions that would have been made differently with the new information that becomes available later. Bernie Sanders has experienced this and I am hoping that it lets him speak to her lifetime of consistent leadership and dedication to making America and the world a better place.
posted by meinvt at 8:46 AM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

Dem Veepstakes Shell Game:

Kaine: in Boston, MA
Vilsack: in Columbus, MO
Warren: in Orlando, FL
Perez: location unknown
posted by NoxAeternum at 8:48 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

I'm beginning to hope we are being trolled, and Kaine isn't the pick. Twitter/Facebook is super negative about him.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:48 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

I'll admit I couldn't watch the RNC, but I'll be tuning into the DNC. I imagine it will make me feel less sick.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:48 AM on July 22, 2016

The American Conservative: Trump: Tribune Of Poor White People, Rod Dreher interviews J.D. Vance

This is where, to me, there’s a lot of ignorance around “Teflon Don.” No one seems to understand why conventional blunders do nothing to Trump. But in a lot of ways, what elites see as blunders people back home see as someone who–finally–conducts themselves in a relatable way. He shoots from the hip; he’s not constantly afraid of offending someone; he’ll get angry about politics; he’ll call someone a liar or a fraud. This is how a lot of people in the white working class actually talk about politics, and even many elites recognize how refreshing and entertaining it can be! So it’s not really a blunder as much as it is a rich, privileged Wharton grad connecting to people back home through style and tone. Viewed like this, all the talk about “political correctness” isn’t about any specific substantive point, as much as it is a way of expanding the scope of acceptable behavior. People don’t want to believe they have to speak like Obama or Clinton to participate meaningfully in politics, because most of us don’t speak like Obama or Clinton.

posted by the man of twists and turns at 8:48 AM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

murphy slaw: Yeah, she's hawking the dress she wore last night on Twitter now. She just wants a piece of the action.

It will be a huge travesty if Ivanka Trump--and her adult siblings--somehow escape(s) this election without the stain of her (their) role(s) in Donald Trump's hatefest. The Trump family are existential threat to the world.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:48 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I'm beginning to hope we are being trolled, and Kaine isn't the pick.

I bought shares in Becerra at 10:1 odds. STILL CROSSIN' MY FINGERS!
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:48 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Twitter/Facebook will be super negative about literally any choice of running mate Clinton chooses.
posted by defenestration at 8:50 AM on July 22, 2016 [23 favorites]

I got the push poll to end all push polls from Toomey the other day. Like, just horrible ridiculous brazen awful. He's a shitstain of the highest order.

Gonorrhea has a higher approval rating than Toomey in PA. A smiling blow up doll with the letter 'D' imprinted on its chest would be in the lead against him and yet here we are with McGinty who is as dynamic as a stale piece of white bread. It's going to be really, really interesting to see how each of them works with (or avoids) their respective presidential candidates.

I thank God my HOA bans political signs otherwise I'd be driving by 'Trump' for the next 3 1/2 months.
posted by splen at 8:50 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Is this 3000 post thread also going to be the dem vp thread for the weekend?
posted by skewed at 8:50 AM on July 22, 2016

I'm beginning to hope we are being trolled, and Kaine isn't the pick.

It's not so much trolling as it's the Village looking for what they consider "normalcy".
posted by NoxAeternum at 8:51 AM on July 22, 2016

If Clinton had gone with Lin-Manuel, #vp4ham would have been pretty non-stop.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:52 AM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

Next song prediction: REM, it's the end of the world as we know it

I think even the RNC's inept organizers know better than to go there.

As far as the other unhappy songwriters whose songs have been used this week (The Turtles, Queen, George Harrison's estate, The O'Jays: those are the public complains I have seen reported on), based on past precedent, lawsuits would probably not be successful. The Consumerist says the RNC obtained an ASCAP/BMI "blanket" license, which allows their own house band to play licensed songs, so long as standard royalties are paid to each song's writers (in other words, they wouldn't be able to get away with playing the original recordings, but they have rights to have a band cover the songs).
posted by aught at 8:52 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

but a total WTF that these media twits are acting like this is a success.

Cable news has been easily wowed by spectacle for some time now. (One of my recent "cranky older guy" complaints to NPR recently pointed out that NPR commentators have increasingly been falling prey to the same thing, getting caught up in the hoopla and losing all critical perspective. Lookin' at you, Mara Liasson. Not that I realistically think my letters to the NPR shows' editors will ever have any effect. I mean, they sure haven't so far. Even though I have been a contributing member of various stations for approx. a million years.)
posted by aught at 8:58 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Ian Welsh: Trump’s Speech: Not Insane -

I doubt the sanity of anyone who could watch that speech and not find it insane. Just the words "I alone can fix it!" would be insane coming out of anyone's mouth. But Welsh comforts himself by choosing to believe that Trump hates the same things he does, in this case, "neoliberalism" and "the American Empire."

That's the core of Trump's appeal; the promise to hate the same people or groups or ideas you hate and a promise to hurt them worse than you think they've hurt you. And what's most frightening is how many people on the right—and the left—seem perfectly happy to let the world burn as long as they can believe that someone else is going to burn with them.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:07 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

Here is the problem with NPR.
posted by ThreeCatsBob at 9:09 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

I know we were told to use this thread until the DNC but I think somebody should go rogue and make a new post for Clinton's VP selection when it happens
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:09 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

I don't understand this impulse to only elect leaders who are exactly like yourself. Yo, I sit in front of a computer all day and help people with Blackboard. If you want tech support for your learning management system, I am your gal. If you want someone to negotiate complex international military treaties, I am not qualified for that shit. Why would I want someone like me to have that responsibility? Why would anyone think that's a grand idea? People can be different than you, have different areas of expertise (don't call Barack when Turnitin is acting up, he won't know what to do, just fyi) and still be okay human people who you can let do things in the world. I literally actually do not understand.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:11 AM on July 22, 2016 [26 favorites]

Charles Pierce: Donald Trump Sold Us Fear. Next Comes the Wrath. A heavy cloud hangs over Cleveland this morning.
posted by homunculus at 9:11 AM on July 22, 2016

Cable news has been easily wowed by spectacle for some time now.

Yeah, but here's the thing. Having followed all these threads (though admittedly having watched only about ~20 actual seconds of video), the impression I have is one of not remotely competent spectacle. This seemed like more of a Store-Brand-Imitation Convention, or Convention-as-Outsider-Art...the Tim & Eric version.

Many of us MeFites who remember the '80s have conjectured about going back in time to confer with our younger selves w/r/t the Trump candidacy. I think in my case, I would've been most worried that Trump would appeal, in every facet of his campaign but especially in the convention, to the American weakness for glitz and glamour. Substance would be absent, of course, but the presentation would at least be slick, and that would hurt the more traditionally-presented politicians on the anti-Trump side. Instead, that looks like it's not going to happen, which does fill me with some hope.

I don't think it's so much that cable news needs spectacle as it is that cable news needs the horserace to remain seemingly close, and will contort all of its reporting to support that objective. If I could bet money, not on how it'll actually turn out, but on how the media will present the odds themselves prior to November, I would bet on hearing a lot of "too close to call" even if it's actually not.
posted by CheesesOfBrazil at 9:12 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

OK guys. Convince me on this whole donating money thing.

I'm 100% behind Clinton. Have been all along, really. She'll win my district and state regardless (I'm in Seattle, so it's kind of a given). And as others have pointed out, it sounds like volunteering isn't what the campaign wants so much as money.

But that's the point where I step back. I know everyone talks about the impact of money on elections and all, but there's this nagging thought in the back of my head that it's not like any presidential nominee has trouble getting the message out. And between Jeb!'s meltdown and Trump's rise, I'm less convinced than ever that The One With The Biggest War Chest Wins. Obviously, I dearly want Clinton to win (like battle-for-civilization-itself want this). That said, donating to the campaign seems like throwing money down a bottomless pit for no real benefit.

My first and only political donation ever was me kicking in for corb's crowdfunding to get to the RNC. Tell me why I should go bigger than that?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 9:12 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Any advice on which organisations a non-citizen living in the US (who cannot legally donate to campaigns) might think about supporting to facilitate some of these D candidates winning?

Perhaps Voto Latino?
posted by RichardP at 9:13 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

in other words, they wouldn't be able to get away with playing the original recordings, but they have rights to have a band cover the songs).

They played the original for You Can't Always Get What You Want during balloon time...
posted by mochapickle at 9:14 AM on July 22, 2016

God help me, I really wish ONE of these fucking hot takes about how "common people"/"people [back|down] home"/"the [white] working class" see Donald Trump as some kind of relatable, regular, shoot-from-the-hip normal dude was written with the subject "I" instead of trying to just insist that's it's the case.

I am willing to grant that theoretically that might be what's happening, I just want to hear somebody say that's what they think with their own damn mouth. Otherwise it sounds like a trite just-so story.
posted by penduluum at 9:14 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

scaryblackdeath, why not focus your money on a House race that needs it? The House result will make a big difference in whether a progressive agenda can make any headway.
posted by clawsoon at 9:14 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Woke up to Mara Liasson on NPR saying that everything went fine

Huh. I should go back and listen to the recording on the web site. I was listening to her on NPR while I ate breakfast and was struck by her more critical attitude compared to the last several days' of her coverage, which I frequently find admiring and over-credulous. I thought I remembered her describing the speeches as dark and the reaction of much of the crowd as subdued. (The transcripts don't go up the same day, unfortunately.) Or maybe I was still asleep and that was the coverage I only dreamed I would get.

Also, for what it's worth, here is NPR's annotated (lightly fact checked - they could have commented on every sentence, honestly) copy of Trump's speech. Here are FactCheck.org's fact checks, the NYT's fact checks, Washington Post's, and the Chicago Tribune's for those who want material when arguing with right-wingers at the watercooler or family reunions in coming days and weeks.
posted by aught at 9:18 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Kaine: in Boston, MA
Vilsack: in Columbus, MO
Warren: in Orlando, FL
Perez: location unknown

Someone just spotted Perez at the White House (Obama and the President of Mexico are holding a press conference).
posted by sallybrown at 9:18 AM on July 22, 2016

The dems should line up the Stones and every other living artist who's been complaining about their stuff getting ASCAPed by Trump to be part of an enormous house band and turn the convention into a huge Live Aid-type deal. Bill Clinton can do a sax solo. All money earmarked for making sure the speeches are good is wasted; they don't need to be good, they just need to be better than the crap we all just sat through for forty days or however long that was--so basically, is the speechgiver 1. sober enough to pronounce words? 2. able not to throw a salute to Hitler in at the end? 3. not wearing a cape and selling timeshares? Awesome, we win on speeches! Throw all the money at the balloondrop and play all the same songs Trump did, except with permission and the heartfelt blessings of the musicians.
posted by Don Pepino at 9:20 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Adam Johnson in Alternet: U.S. Media Blames Putin Conspiracy for Homegrown Trump Phenomenon

With regard to Putin, this trope has been taken one step further. Not only is Trump similar to Putin, he is now secretly plotting with him. This innuendo-laden take reached new lows with a Slate piece earlier this month by Franklin Foer, a fellow at the U.S. State Department-funded (see, guilt-by-association is fun) New America Foundation.
Putin’s Puppet: If the Russian president could design a candidate to undermine American interests—and advance his own—he’d look a lot like Donald Trump.
The entire premise of the piece relies on the paranoid assumption that Putin wants to "destroy the West":
Vladimir Putin has a plan for destroying the West—and that plan looks a lot like Donald Trump.
Wait, what? Putin may want to undermine the West. He may want to curb the expansion of NATO, but destroy it? Is he Magneto? This is the type of unhinged, over-the-top language that goes unchallenged when discussing the U.S.' favorite Eastern menace.

[...]

Is it possible that Putin prefers Trump? Of course, it is. But the gap between other countries leaders liking a candidate and secretly controlling them is light years wide. On Monday, liberal hawk Jon Chait of New York Magazine took it one step further, asking the positively Alex Jones-esque question: “Is Donald Trump Working for Russia?”

The article went on to do what any YouTube conspiracy theory video does: make a lot of innuendo, show a few links and use a “hey, I’m just asking questions” framing. Chait doesn’t actually think Trump is working for Russia, but it doesn’t matter. Donald Trump wanted to take some bellicose language out of the RNC platform aimed at Russia and this is a gesture that can only be done by someone who is a secret FSB agent. Never mind that by removing support for lethal aid to the pro-U.S. Ukrainian government the RNC’s position is now exactly that of President Obama’s. Chait had Cold War paranoia to sow and a candidate to mock.

posted by Rustic Etruscan at 9:22 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

One of the reasons I donate money to Clinton is that I have never, ever, ever been polled in my life. My vote, and those of most other women and people of color are uninteresting and unanticipated and will come as such a shock that it will be considered fraud. So, while I don't have a lot of money to donate, I give at least a little bit when I can to make my presence known.
posted by Lyn Never at 9:23 AM on July 22, 2016 [21 favorites]

Interior of a dark bedroom, bed perfectly made, big red phone with no dial is ringing. And ringing. And ringing. Camera zooms out slowly, the bedroom is empty, there is no one to answer the phone.

Cut to exterior of the White House, possibly with "TRUMP" emblazoned on it in tacky gold letters, phone continues to ring.

Voice over: "During *his* convention Donald Trump got bored and left. If he won't be there for his Party he won't be there for America"
posted by sotonohito at 9:24 AM on July 22, 2016 [21 favorites]

All money earmarked for making sure the speeches are good is wasted; they don't need to be good, they just need to be better than the crap we all just sat through for forty days or however long that was.

I'm seeing Gabrielle Giffords on the early speakers lists for the DNC that are floating around. I'm thinking that's going to be quite something.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 9:24 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Adam Johnson in Alternet: U.S. Media Blames Putin Conspiracy for Homegrown Trump Phenomenon

I keep reading things like this and I can't tell if the authors are offended on behalf of Trump or on behalf of Putin.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:25 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

One of the "bonuses" of living in a swing state is that I get polled All. The. Damned. Time. My landline and my cell phone are ALWAYS ringing during election seasons. I can tell the Republican polls pretty quickly when I get like two questions in and they say, "Okay, thanks!" and hang up. Usually it's about reproductive rights.
posted by cooker girl at 9:25 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Politico: For weeks, Clinton/VP speculation held that she'd announce Friday morning to step on Trump's bounce. Now this feels like tactical silence.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:26 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

I keep reading things like this and I can't tell if the authors are offended on behalf of Trump or on behalf of Putin.

It’s important to be clear because this point will be lost on many: none of this is to defend Flynn or Putin or Trump because this trope isn’t really about any of them. It’s about policing foreign policy consensus and piling on anyone who comes close to deviating from it. Russia is an enemy of the U.S. and must be uniformly seen as such or those making gestures of rapprochement must be stooges or spooks.

Again, conspiracy theories that would never pass editorial muster are entirely routine when written about Official U.S. Enemies. One theory, casually repeated in a New York Times op-ed in September of last year, that the 1999 Moscow attacks were FSB false-flag attacks so Putin could have a pretext to invade Chechnya, sounds strangely similar to popular conspiracy theory stateside that would have one blackballed from proper company. American editorial standards when it comes to bashing Russia, it seems, are in direct proportion to the tensions between our two countries.

It bears repeating once more, for those who will invariably (and likely deliberately) misread this piece, this is not at all a defense of Putin, nor is it a defense of Trump, who is indeed a xenophobic, sexist, racist demagogue. But a secret plot by Russia is not needed for an American leader to possess such qualities. And the assumption that it is, just as with those who blamed Putin for Brexit, displays an arrogance and denialism on the part of Western media about their own countries’ faults. Certainly our otherwise tolerant and liberal political discourse could never breed such an extremist, right? No, clearly it must be a foreign influence.

posted by Rustic Etruscan at 9:27 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

But that's the point where I step back. I know everyone talks about the impact of money on elections and all, but there's this nagging thought in the back of my head that it's not like any presidential nominee has trouble getting the message out. And between Jeb!'s meltdown and Trump's rise, I'm less convinced than ever that The One With The Biggest War Chest Wins. Obviously, I dearly want Clinton to win (like battle-for-civilization-itself want this). That said, donating to the campaign seems like throwing money down a bottomless pit for no real benefit.

I guess it depends on what you're thinking of in terms of "getting the message out." That money goes to ads, sure, but also to pay field organizers who organize volunteers who phone bank and go door to door and register new voters and get people to the polls. My feeling from talking to people I know who have worked for campaigns is that's the stuff that matters for turnout and ultimately winning elections.

And, seriously, if you feel like Clinton's got the money, you can donate to downballot candidates who may need it to do the same thing.
posted by dismas at 9:28 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Wikileaks has their DNC email archive up.

They're trying to make mountains out of molehills on the Twitter feed. For instance, their link to creating an "anti-Bernie narrative" was a staffer complaining about the Bernie campaign (truthfully) not getting their shit together on basic campaign things and standing committee members.
posted by Talez at 9:28 AM on July 22, 2016

I felt deeply unenthusiastic for Biden as Obama's VP pick eight years ago and I have never been more wrong about anything in my ENTIRE LIFE. I trust Clinton to pick a good VP, even if it's not immediately apparent to me why she might have gone the way she did. She's done her research, she's done tons of vetting, she's going to make a good choice.
posted by kate blank at 9:29 AM on July 22, 2016 [27 favorites]

WHERES BOOKER
WHERES BERNIE

shoutout to my fellow GOMI hamcats if you get the reference
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:29 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

For weeks, Clinton/VP speculation held that she'd announce Friday morning to step on Trump's bounce. Now this feels like tactical silence.

Ugh this just gives me more time to get my hopes up that it's Warren because they're both in Florida.
posted by sallybrown at 9:29 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

A brief and frank reminder of campaign financing rules screwup is listed as "Did http://HillaryClinton.com asked DNC to commit an FEC violation"

Like holy shit I'm all for sunshine on politics but this presentation is a fucking embarassment.
posted by Talez at 9:31 AM on July 22, 2016

Warren has pretty much said it isn't her.

:(
posted by Tarumba at 9:31 AM on July 22, 2016

I was already not on board with the purity testing nonsense of the Bernie or Busters but we just sat through a four-day fascist rally. Straight up revanchist, racist, theocratic, fascism. Anybody who looks at that and says "Okay but Hillary Clinton is worse" had better make the argument that they're not capable of basic reasoning or else be regarded as fascist sympathizers at best.

People on FB have been like "so hypocritical of Clinton supporters to insist that Sanders endorse her, and then praise Cruz for not endorsing Trump!" As if this were all about the abstract concept of whether a defeated rival should or shouldn't endorse his opponent, and not very specifically about beating Donald Trump. Either they have no concept of the fact that there are actual consequences to this election, or they don't care.
posted by showbiz_liz at 9:33 AM on July 22, 2016 [30 favorites]

Warren has pretty much said it isn't her.

:(

That's a good thing. Warren can do far more as a Senator than as a VP.
posted by Talez at 9:33 AM on July 22, 2016 [52 favorites]

Warren has better things to do.
posted by showbiz_liz at 9:34 AM on July 22, 2016 [27 favorites]

Warren has been pretty adamant about staying where she is. It's important that we all listen to what she's telling us, and what a lot of people who know the Senate (including Clinton herself) say about how effective she is there.
posted by zombieflanders at 9:35 AM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

Warren is far more useful and potent in the Senate.
posted by Pope Guilty at 9:35 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

:)
posted by Tarumba at 9:36 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Wait, I thought the Presidency was going to be just a figurehead position and the Vice President was going to do all that policy stuff.

rassum frassum missing memos
posted by delfin at 9:36 AM on July 22, 2016

For weeks, Clinton/VP speculation held that she'd announce Friday morning to step on Trump's bounce. Now this feels like tactical silence.

"Should we announce today?"
"The Donald is speaking extemporaneously again, let's give him some room."
posted by murphy slaw at 9:38 AM on July 22, 2016 [26 favorites]

A lot of the news reports have been saying the text with the VP's identity will go out late afternoon today. Not sure why...seems like lots of people aren't going to be following politics on a Friday night. Friday morning when everyone is antsy at work...there's the ticket.
posted by sallybrown at 9:40 AM on July 22, 2016

A bunch of you were drunk, weren't you?

Hoooooo, yes.
posted by sandettie light vessel automatic at 9:40 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

> "My first and only political donation ever was me kicking in for corb's crowdfunding to get to the RNC. Tell me why I should go bigger than that?"

I'm giving because whoever gains control of the narrative has a much better chance of winning the election, and I've seen at least two campaigns that were to my mind demonstrably crushed at least in part because they lost control of the narrative in the summer due to a difference in money raised -- Kerry's campaign and (believe it or not) Romney's campaign. While Clinton is winning the money race, Trump has an unprecedented advantage in the amount of free media he is getting for the asking all the time, and I believe that unless Clinton gets an insanely outsized amount of monetary contributions to counter that, anything she says is going to get buried under a sea of Trump. So, I'm contributing, for the second time in my life.
posted by kyrademon at 9:40 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

At Trump’s Coronation, Alex Jones Is King - "Stone and several other speakers on Monday tipped their hats to Jones, sometimes effusively. But it was the offhand comment of a man from Veterans for Trump that stopped me. “Alex Jones,” he said, “is the voice of this whole thing.”

Video of Alex Jones and disgraced Trump advisor Roger Stone barging onto the set of a Young Turks broadcast at the RNC last night and causing a commotion, almost coming to blows with the hosts. Watch Jones's manic, grinning demeanor throughout the interaction—dude is definitely whacked out of his gord on something, whether its pills, cocaine, or just the white hot endorphin rush of exercising his fascistic muscles.
posted by Atom Eyes at 9:40 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

I've heard arguments before against Clinton picking a woman for her VP as a tactical move to avoid alienating people with an extremely precise amount of misogyny, but it seems a little bit like shithead kremlinology*, which rarely revelatory.

*kremlinology of shitheads, not by. I'm all ears if anyone has a good name for the phenomenon.
posted by The Gaffer at 9:42 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

"...I really wish ONE of these fucking hot takes about how "common people"/"people [back|down] home"/"the [white] working class" see Donald Trump as some kind of relatable, regular, shoot-from-the-hip normal dude was written with the subject "I"..."

See the Dreher/Vance piece linked above. Vance has hillybilly cred, Dreher make some claims to it also. If you're still lacking empathy for the "people down home", you might find a lot of the essays Wendell Berry wrote in the 90's map remarkably well to some of the current discussion of poor/rural whites.
posted by klarck at 9:42 AM on July 22, 2016

... those making gestures of rapprochement must be stooges or spooks.

I must say, offering up the Baltics is a hell of gesture of rapproachement. But, see, this is the same as Walsh. It's scary to think that Trump would happily sell out Europe to Putin—or maybe not so scary if you believe that Russia is threatened by the "American Empire"—better to choose to believe, as this author does, that Trump is really just wants peace and that any one who points out Trump's fondness for Putin and his ways is merely a stooge or a spook.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:43 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

This has been a big worry all along, and happened back in the Bush/Kerry debates too; the media's been conditioned to expect an utter failure from Trump, so as long as he doesn't, like, actively sling feces onstage, there's gonna be a huge contingent who are like, "oh, hey, he wasn't that bad!" And even then, he could probably throw a little bit of feces, as long as it only landed on the first couple rows of the audience. "Hey, he didn't go all the way to row three! That's a lot of restraint! What gravitas"

I like Welsh, but I don't see the consistency in Trump's bluster that he does. Trump's "good" ideas are buried under an Everest of bad ones, and his inconsistencies suggest he probably doesn't mean them sincerely anyway. I respect Welsh's decision not to get caught up in the press's overheated publicity for Trump, but that speech was a loud, incoherent mess by a loud, incoherent candidate, and Welsh treats it as though it were a policy paper.
posted by Rustic Etruscan at 9:44 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Ahahahahaha and all the news outlets are back to reporting Trump shitting on Cruz as their top story. His speech didn't even make it to the afternoon.

The man can't help himself.
posted by rorgy at 9:45 AM on July 22, 2016 [27 favorites]

You guys...I signed up to get a text from the HRC campaign to be notified when she's going to announce the VP pick, which includes the name of said pick.

I'll let y'all know when I know.

Unless the Twitter beats me to it.
posted by cooker girl at 9:54 AM on July 22, 2016

If you're still lacking empathy for the "people down home",

Thanks for the link. I'm not lacking empathy for them; I live among them; they're my friends and family. But I'm not hearing from them what everybody in the media sphere keeps insisting they're saying and thinking.
posted by penduluum at 9:54 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Bill Clinton is fond of saying (trying to find a link...) that picking a VP is the only choice of consequence a presidential candidate will make. Everything else is narrative and promises, but the veep pick is an action. I think that's an interesting frame for the act, especially because the minute after the inauguration it's pretty much the least consequential thing the president will have done. But it also likely contextualizes Hillary Clinton's pick - not so much for what the pick can do for the campaign (as it's usually framed, e.g. what swing state they're from), but what the pick says about Clinton's decision making ability.

Kind of helps interpret the Pence pick, too - it signals pretty clearly to the Republican base that Trump doesn't give a shit about governing, and he'll outsource it to anybody who cares.
posted by one_bean at 9:54 AM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

I'm not going to critique Ivanka's clothes, because honestly nobody should care, but I do think it's fair game to point out that she turned the RNC into the Home Shopping Network and is tweeting out links to buy "Ivanka Trump" from Macys, a company her father (as noted by someone on Twitter) kept attacking and boycotting.
posted by zachlipton at 9:55 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

The Mother Jones profile of Tim Kaine looks interesting but honestly he bores me so much I'm just leaving the tab up til the announcement in case we get surprised by someone else so I don't waste my time.
posted by DynamiteToast at 9:55 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

scaryblackdeath: but there's this nagging thought in the back of my head that it's not like any presidential nominee has trouble getting the message out.

To you, who are, kinda simply by virtue of being in this thread, a relatively "high-information voter" - you're interested enough in the whole thing (and have the time and energy) to be aware of messages months and months before the actual election. There are thousands and thousands of potential Clinton voters (many of them POC) who simply haven't had the time or energy to pay much, if any, attention to the election yet. They're not "undecided" in the sense that they're not sure if they prefer Trump or Hillary, they're "undecided" about whether they should bother to vote at all. Money doesn't just go to primetime mid-America TV commercials, it buys ads in Spanish language newspapers, it puts on events in Asian-American communities, it lets people working three jobs know that they can vote by mail and here's how you get your ballot. Might not make a difference in Seattle, but this is part of the "ground game/GOTV" people talk about, and it can make a big difference in swing states and districts.
posted by soundguy99 at 9:55 AM on July 22, 2016 [20 favorites]

Clinton roundtable in Orlando, 1:15 ET
posted by argybarg at 9:55 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Bread and Circuses in Believeland Roads and Kingdoms send a Canadian and a photographer to Cleveland.
posted by infini at 9:56 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Any advice on which organisations a non-citizen living in the US (who cannot legally donate to campaigns) might think about supporting to facilitate some of these D candidates winning? I'm presuming Planned Parenthood, but who else?

I support the Planned Parenthood Action Fund, which is not a nonprofit org - so they're free to do all the politicking they want. I called to confirm that people outside the US are free to support them, as they're not getting the no-political-action tax breaks and they're not officially tied to any election efforts.

I know no specific details about the Black Lives Matter organization; they'd be another one that can use all the support they can get.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 9:56 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

Unfortunately so far it seems hard for Clinton to generate much enthusiasm. So many people seem to really dislike her, from all walks of life. Being part of the Government for such a long time seems to have that effect but especially right now.

I just don't understand how this narrative persists. More people voted for her her in the primaries than any other candidate. She won the nomination decisively. She has her party unified behind her. Her fundraising hasn't lagged, And she remains ahead in the polls.

Sounds to me like a lot of people like her and want her to be President. You know who people dislike? The candidates who are watching this from home just like the rest of us.
posted by billyfleetwood at 9:56 AM on July 22, 2016 [22 favorites]

Given Trump's unforced error bringing up the Cruz conspiracy theory stuff today, I wonder if Clinton will hold off on a VP announcement. Why direct everyone's attention away from the trainwreck?
posted by zachlipton at 9:58 AM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

@nicktheanderson has done some snooping on wikipedia, to compare the edit history of the VP contenders recently. He presents it in screenshots if you click through to the tweet, but basically Vilsack, Booker, and Perez have little activity recently and Kaine has a flurry of activity this morning.
posted by DynamiteToast at 9:59 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

> "Given Trump's unforced error bringing up the Cruz conspiracy theory stuff today, I wonder if Clinton will hold off on a VP announcement. Why direct everyone's attention away from the trainwreck?"

That implicitly assumes there will be sometime in the future when there will not be a trainwreck to watch. I mean, she has to announce at some point.
posted by kyrademon at 10:00 AM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

Given Trump's unforced error bringing up the Cruz conspiracy theory stuff today, I wonder if Clinton will hold off on a VP announcement. Why direct everyone's attention away from the trainwreck?

Well, it'd be weird to announce it over the weekend and weirder not to announce before the DNC, which starts Monday. That pretty much leaves today.
posted by showbiz_liz at 10:00 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

There's been a mass shooting in Munich, which is the kind of thing that makes most campaigns twitchy about making big announcements.
posted by zombieflanders at 10:02 AM on July 22, 2016

I'm beginning to hope we are being trolled, and Kaine isn't the pick. Twitter/Facebook is super negative about him.

As I always like to remind people in these scenarios, Twitter/Facebook isn't really anything about anyone. It's the people you choose to follow and the people you choose to become friends with that fill your feed, and so are a fairly poor barometer for judging the overall mood of a nation, unless your friends happen to be remarkably representative.
posted by modernnomad at 10:02 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Just stopping in to agree with Excommunicated Cardinal. Ivanka Trump isn't admirable, she's a hate-supporting coward.
posted by Lyme Drop at 10:03 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Andrea Mitchell confirming that the VP pick will be announced this afternoon, the staff will discuss it at a meeting in Brooklyn, and Hillary will address it at her Tampa rally.
posted by sallybrown at 10:03 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

If any U.S. MeFites are looking for a downballot campaign to help out, the only thing I ever want for Christmas in 6n election years is for Chuck Grassley to be voted out as Iowa Senator. I don't know whether Patty Judge realistically has a shot (though at least one poll had her within 1 point; Iowans are at least somewhat mad about Grassley holding up the Supreme Court nominee), but if anybody could make Senator Judge happen,

1) we'd have great "who's-on-first" style jokes about "senator judge" for at least six years, and
2) I would be so, so, so, so, so happy.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 10:04 AM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

This is such a great point, because Cruz is basically a figure straight up out of The Scorpion and The Frog fable: stings to death the guy he's tagging along with and then says "it's my nature; you should have known I would do this from the beginning." And yet Trump's RNC and Trump's campaign still couldn't get ahead of it.

I think in this case, given Cruz's ambitions, the variant line "I can swim." could be used
posted by Slackermagee at 10:07 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

If any U.S. MeFites are looking for a downballot campaign to help out, the only thing I ever want for Christmas in 6n election years is for Chuck Grassley to be voted out as Iowa Senator. I don't know whether Patty Judge realistically has a shot (though at least one poll had her within 1 point; Iowans are at least somewhat mad about Grassley holding up the Supreme Court nominee), but if anybody could make Senator Judge happen,

1) we'd have great "who's-on-first" style jokes about "senator judge" for at least six years, and
2) I would be so, so, so, so, so happy.

3) Grassley is one of the main people holding back Merrick Garlands Hearing/Approval to the SCOTUS
posted by DynamiteToast at 10:08 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

If any U.S. MeFites are looking for a downballot campaign to help out, the only thing I ever want for Christmas in 6n election years is for Chuck Grassley to be voted out as Iowa Senator.

If we can send Steve King packing with him, that'd be fantastic.
posted by jason_steakums at 10:13 AM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

How do I sign up for the VP announcement text? I'm already signed up for the Hillary for America text list, is that the same one?
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 10:23 AM on July 22, 2016

Wow, Trump is a sore winner. He can't go 12 hours after being coronated as the Republican candidate for president without having a public tantrum about Cruz. Dude, you won. Despite his hurting your feelings the only thing you should show in public is optimism about the general election. What a small, petty man.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:25 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Text VP to 47246
posted by Tarumba at 10:26 AM on July 22, 2016

I think so, ThePinkSuperHero. I got an email and I'm a sucker for "the inside scoop" so I jumped all over it. I was also getting texts from the campaign during the RNC.
posted by cooker girl at 10:26 AM on July 22, 2016

Awesome, I am in!
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 10:27 AM on July 22, 2016

scaryblackdeath, why not focus your money on a House race that needs it? The House result will make a big difference in whether a progressive agenda can make any headway.

I'm also counting on the idea that good campaigning from downticket candidates could get some folks to the ballet box who are feeling otherwise tepid on Clinton herself.

Saw the DSCC and DCCC mentioned a little upthread. While I don't know much about the DSCC, everything I've seen from the DCCC has left me pretty cold. I just feel like my money would be better spent on donations directly to candidates.
posted by tobascodagama at 10:30 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

James Fallows, via twitter:

1) At little local airport, to fly back from CLE, two delegs from South talking: 'Why did they have that Thiel speak? Just inappropriate'

2) They were referring to Thiel's 'proud to be gay'
posted by bluecore at 10:30 AM on July 22, 2016 [24 favorites]

Another good person to support is whoever's running against David Duke.
posted by tobascodagama at 10:32 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

I got the same email offering a vp text but I really only want one text, not six every day like I get emails. Also I have developed a habit of donating $8 every time they send a request within 20 minutes of me seeing something awful from trump, and I'm gonna go bankrupt if they have another vector to soothe my rage via donation.
posted by skewed at 10:32 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

From Bread and Circuses in Believeland:

“Food Not Bombs doesn’t support any party or candidate. We’re an explicitly anarchist organization. Both candidates are racist. Both candidates are pro-war. And I’m not real thrilled with the idea of either of them running the country.”

This false equivalence bullshit is one of the biggest problems we're going to be facing all the way till November.
posted by Gaz Errant at 10:34 AM on July 22, 2016 [37 favorites]

I had the option to get just a few texts, a moderate amount, and then all the updates. I chose all of them. I can also opt out at any time. Plus I don't get charged data or messaging rates or whatever, so it's no skin off my nose.
posted by cooker girl at 10:35 AM on July 22, 2016

I'm scouring twitter for the potential VPs' locations with the intensity of a Pokemon GO fanatic.
posted by sallybrown at 10:35 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

Sounds to me like a lot of people like her and want her to be President. You know who people dislike? The candidates who are watching this from home just like the rest of us.

There is literally only one presidential candidate American dislike more than Hilary Clinton, and that is Donald Trump. If the GOP weren't in the midst of self-immolation she would be losing this race. Yes, she definitely has supporters, many of them fervent. And the policies she esposes have even more favor than herself. But she's been a divisive figure since she came to nationl attention back in 1992. I'm not saying it's rational, and I'm not saying it's right, but it simply a fact that many many people do not like her. To the point that there are people actively on the fence about whether to vote for her over a man who combines all the worst qualities of George W. Bush, Mussolini, and Narcissus.
posted by maggiepolitt at 10:36 AM on July 22, 2016 [16 favorites]

(Actually, it seems like the only person running against David Duke in LA1 is Steve Scalise (R), so uh... use your judgement there.)
posted by tobascodagama at 10:38 AM on July 22, 2016

There is literally only one presidential candidate American dislike more than Hilary Clinton, and that is Donald Trump.

How many of those people are already Republican voters? It's an honest question. In most years, nobody knows enough about either candidate to really, really dislike them. This year is different on both sides.
posted by showbiz_liz at 10:39 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Awww, all this "who will be the Dem VP nom" stuff takes me back to the night before my wedding, when my now-wife and me were out on the Las Vegas Strip with my family, being driven around by a limo hired by my best man, and my mother got a text from the Obama campaign super-late and said "Yay! It's Biden! He'll be great."
posted by infinitewindow at 10:42 AM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

“Food Not Bombs doesn’t support any party or candidate. We’re an explicitly anarchist organization. Both candidates are racist. Both candidates are pro-war. And I’m not real thrilled with the idea of either of them running the country.”

Okay but ONE OF THEM FUCKING WILL BE and whether you or I want that or not is not relevant to that fact.

Like, ideally nobody would be addicted to heroin but in reality people are and I'd bet you a lot of money that this person thinks needle exchange is a great idea.
posted by Pope Guilty at 10:42 AM on July 22, 2016 [28 favorites]

This false equivalence bullshit is one of the biggest problems we're going to be facing all the way till November.

You can say you're unhappy with both candidates without drawing a false equivalence. I'd prefer neither Clinton nor Trump. I'm here for full space communism (PRESIDENT COSMONAUT LENIN). But that doesn't mean I don't acknowledge that we must do everything we can to elect Clinton, and that there's a world of difference between the two.
posted by dis_integration at 10:42 AM on July 22, 2016 [21 favorites]

CBC did a pretty good fact check of the trump speech. You're welcome, eh.

UPDATE: It is an AP story reprint. And I am revealed as smug. But it is still pretty good.
posted by chapps at 10:43 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

After pondering it for a bit, I became the change I wanted to see in the world and sent a little money to Patty Judge. Maybe 2016 will be my best Christmas ever.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 10:43 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

#notallindependents
posted by Gaz Errant at 10:44 AM on July 22, 2016

Also donate to other down-ballot candidates in other districts and states.

I was raised in a pro-life family. My mother would donate money to pro-life assembly and congressional candidates across the country. This is the norm for their tribe. They are not afraid to shift money across state lines to get their people in. And it works.
posted by goalyeehah at 10:44 AM on July 22, 2016 [16 favorites]

I'm surprised that Clinton would announce a VP candidate on a Friday afternoon. If I learned nothing else from watching the West Wing, it's that Fridays are for news you want to bury.
posted by peppermind at 10:45 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Interestingly, David Duke can't even vote for himself because he's a convicted felon.
posted by zachlipton at 10:46 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

I'm surprised that Clinton would announce a VP candidate on a Friday afternoon.

Today is the only weekday between the end of the RNC and the beginning of the DNC, so she doesn't have a lot of wiggle room.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 10:46 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Why not announce at the convention, tho?
posted by saturday_morning at 10:48 AM on July 22, 2016

"Yay! It's Biden! He'll be great."

Hillary should just keep Biden, at the very least to keep the Onion writers happy.
posted by drezdn at 10:49 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

Then you lose the press weekend.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:49 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

I'm surprised that Clinton would announce a VP candidate on a Friday afternoon. If I learned nothing else from watching the West Wing, it's that Fridays are for news you want to bury.

Is this still the case with social media news distribution? If anything I'm on facebook and twitter more on saturday mornings because I have nothing better to do, and that's how a lot of this news travels.
posted by dis_integration at 10:49 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Awww, all this "who will be the Dem VP nom" stuff takes me back to the night before my wedding,

I got this far into the comment and immediately started mentally constructing a narrative throughline that was way less plausible and way more outlandish than your actual anecdote. I blame the electoral climate.
posted by cortex at 10:49 AM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

I, too, remembering trying to decide whether on the following day I would marry Elizabeth Warren, Tim Kaine, Tom Vilsack, or Sherrod Brown.
posted by kyrademon at 10:53 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Let's Take The House is a national organization supporting Democratic candidates in competitive races against Republican incumbents (shoutout to my own Josh Gottheimer)
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 10:54 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

I have been enjoying the sweet and abundant schadenfreude provided by Erick Erickson's Twitter feed, including such gems as:

-I think I may have to move to Colorado to become a pot farmer and eat at Arby’s because nothing matters.

-Cheeto Jesus Really Stinks at the Whole Party Unity Thing

-Shorter Donald Trump: Everything is terrible. Everyone is going to die. Vote for me.

-Trump’s speech sounded better in the original German.

-The GOP that complained they lost 2012 because Romney went Democrat-lite with no principle is now cheering full Cheeto Democrat.

-#TrumpIsWithYou sounds very cult like. Maybe Hale Bopp will return.

and most promising of all:

-It is time for a real third party.

Bonus reminder from Russell Moore of the Southern Baptist Convention:

For years, secular progressives have said that evangelical social action in America is not about religious conviction but all about power. They have implied that the goal of the Religious Right is to cynically use the “moral” to get to the “majority,” not the other way around.

This year, a group of high-profile old-guard evangelicals has proven these critics right.

posted by palindromic at 10:54 AM on July 22, 2016 [17 favorites]

Evan Bayh in ~~Illinois~~ Indiana. Bayh's entry into the race could turn this seat Democratic again.

And then red Indiana would have two Democratic senators, which would warm this Hoosier's heart. Our current (D) senator, Joe Donnelly, won in 2012 after popular incumbent Dick Lugar lost in the primaries to an odious Tea Party candidate.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 10:54 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

In fairness to Food Not Bombs: aren't they kind of a radical organization, making the statement a bit different from lazy mainstream "both sides do it" false equivalencies? I suspect anyone who isn't 50 points or so to the left of Jill Stein is going to be insufficiently liberal for them.
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 10:56 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

More updates on Trump's love of Russia

Carter Page, Trump's Russia advisor, would personally benefit from a rollback of sanctions against Russia, has ties to Gazprom, etc.
posted by dis_integration at 10:57 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

One of my interns told me her whole family are super conservative Indiana natives and even they despise Pence to the point of sending around mean memes about him
posted by showbiz_liz at 10:57 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Also donate to other down-ballot candidates in other districts and states.

Governors' races matter, especially in states with gerrymandered and locked-down GOP legislative majorities. Roy Cooper is probably not many liberal MeFites' ideal Dem, but he's the best possible candidate to face McCrory in NC, and the best bulwark against the legislators who dumped HB2 on the state and probably cost Charlotte $70m from the cancelled NBA All-Star Game.

The lean pickings for Dems in state-level races since 2010 is already starting to thin out options for bigger races.
posted by holgate at 10:57 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

> "Evan Bayh in ... Indiana. "

My god I am bad at typing things.
posted by kyrademon at 10:58 AM on July 22, 2016

My god I am bad at typing things.

Meredith!
posted by zachlipton at 10:59 AM on July 22, 2016 [47 favorites]

PHILADELPHIA (AP) – More than 60 current and past office holders from across the country were announced Thursday as speakers at the Democratic National Convention in Philadelphia next week.

They include Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren, Virginia Sen. Tim Kaine, Colorado Gov. John Hickenlooper, Flint, Michigan, Mayor Karen Weaver, former U.S. Rep. Gabby Giffords, Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada and House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, of California.

More speakers were to be announced in the coming days.

Democrats are making the argument that they are uniting behind Hillary Clinton following a bruising primary against Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders. He is among the keynote speakers who were previously announced for the convention that begins Monday and runs through Thursday. President Barack Obama and his wife Michelle, Bill Clinton and his daughter Chelsea and Astrid Silva, a so-called Dreamer who was brought to the U.S. as an undocumented child immigrant, had all been announced earlier.

Senate members:

— Minority Leader Harry Reid
— Cory Booker, of New Jersey
— Barbara Boxer, of California
— Sherrod Brown, of Ohio
— Bob Casey, of Pennsylvania
— Al Franken, of Minnesota
— Kirsten Gillibrand, of New York
— Tim Kaine, of Virginia
— Amy Klobuchar, of Minnesota
— Chris Murphy, of Connecticut
— Chuck Schumer, of New York
— Jeanne Shaheen, of New Hampshire
— Elizabeth Warren, of Massachusetts

House members:
— Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi
— Joyce Beatty, of Ohio
— Xavier Becerra, of California
— Brendan Boyle, of Pennsylvania
— Bob Brady, of Pennsylvania
— Joaquin Castro, of Texas
— James Clyburn, of South Carolina
— Joseph Crowley, of New York
— Michelle Lujan Grisham, of New Mexico
— Ruben Gallego, of Arizona
— Luis Gutierrez, of Illinois
— Sheila Jackson Lee, of Texas
— Ted Lieu, of California
— Nita Lowey, of New York
— Gwen Moore, of Wisconsin
— Eleanor Holmes Norton, of Washington, D.C.
— Adam Schiff, of California
— Maxine Waters, of California

State and local officials:
— Tennessee state Rep. Raumesh Akbari
— Columbia, South Carolina, Mayor Steve Benjamin
— California Gov. Jerry Brown
— New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo
— Minnesota Gov. Mark Dayton
— New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio
— Detroit Mayor Mike Duggan
— Colorado state Rep. Crisanta Duran
— Chillicothe, Ohio, Mayor Luke Feeney
— Minnesota state Rep. Peggy Flanagan
— Los Angeles Mayor Eric Garcetti
— Tallahassee, Florida, Mayor Andrew Gillum
— South Carolina Democratic Party Chairman Jaime Harrison
— Colorado Gov. John Hickenlooper
— Philadelphia Mayor Jim Kenney
— Nevada state Sen. Ruben Kihuen
— Kentucky Secretary of State Alison Lundergan Grimes
— Virginia Gov. Terry McAuliffe
— California Lt. Gov. Gavin Newsom
— Atlanta Mayor Kasim Reed
— Nevada state Sen. Pat Spearman
— Boston Mayor Marty Walsh
— Flint, Michigan, Mayor Karen Weaver
— Pennsylvania Gov. Tom Wolf

Past office holders:
— Former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean
— Former U.S. Rep. Gabby Giffords and Captain Mark Kelly, both of Arizona
— Former Michigan Gov. Jennifer Granholm
— Former Iowa Sen. Tom Harkin
— Former Maryland Gov. Martin O’Malley
— Former South Carolina state Rep. Bakari Sellers
— Former Los Angeles Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa

posted by zarq at 11:01 AM on July 22, 2016 [17 favorites]

"Yay! It's Biden! He'll be great."

Read your whole comment too quickly and thought Biden was a last-minute Best Man at your Vegas wedding.

Like when the Elvis impersonator marriage officiant asks for the ring, you turn to your best man, but Biden is standing in his place.

He smiles: "No one will ever believe you."
posted by Kabanos at 11:04 AM on July 22, 2016 [37 favorites]

The mayor of Chillicothe, Ohio must be quite the speaker.
posted by box at 11:04 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

I got $10 on Schumer mentioning his beloved Chobani yogurt while on stage.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 11:05 AM on July 22, 2016

I have been enjoying the sweet and abundant schadenfreude provided by Erick Erickson's Twitter feed, including such gems as:

Did he get a lobotomy or something?

-Trump’s speech sounded better in the original German.

He stole that line from the late, great Molly Ivins. After Pat Buchanan's rabid speech at the 1992 Republican convention, it was Ivins who quipped, "It probably sounded better in its original German."
posted by zarq at 11:05 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

I don't understand this impulse to only elect leaders who are exactly like yourself.

My 1st day of an intro to Anthropology class the prof said something like, "I don't understand why a politician being 'elite' is a bad thing. President is the single most important job in the country and arguably the world. Why would you look to anyone but the smartest, most well educated, most elite MF'er you can find?"

It's a representative democracy, the whole idea is to hire people who understand this stuff at a deeper level than I ever could or want to so that I can leave those decisions to them. In theory, I should be able to elect someone and not care if they are in favor of the TPP. I don't even want to hear about it because I simply don't have access to all the details nor would I understand them all if I did. But I can trust in my elected representative to consult with experts and make a considered, nuanced decision.

Much like I'd hire soren_lorensen to build out my Blackboard solution. I don't know or care how it works, I trust Soren's expertise so that I can focus on whatever I'm an expert in.
posted by VTX at 11:06 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Hillary should just keep Biden, at the very least to keep the Onion writers happy.

I'd wager Anita Hill would prefer Kaine.

I wish all of you on with this blah blah Kaine is boring stuff would shut it. You wish the ticket was less paste-colored, yeah, I'm totally with you. But boring? From his position as a Virginia senator he still made statements about issues regarding fair housing litigation. He was part of revealing a ton of racist lending on the part of Nationwide Mutual, who only managed to later skate on the judgment based on a bullshit standing decision.

Kaine is boring the way Clinton is boring: as a progressive who gets shit done.
posted by phearlez at 11:06 AM on July 22, 2016 [43 favorites]

Oh my Lord, the Onion actually annotated the entire 60+ minutes of his speech.
posted by vverse23 at 11:06 AM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

More than 60 current and past office holders from across the country were announced Thursday as speakers at the Democratic National Convention in Philadelphia next week.

feeling pretty secure about the whole "face of the establishment" thing, i guess.
posted by andrewcooke at 11:08 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

The mayor of Chillicothe, Ohio must be quite the speaker.

I mean, if you're trying to reach out to poor, rural white voters who've been struggling with opioid addiction and crime in their communities, then, yes?
posted by damayanti at 11:09 AM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

> Why would you look to anyone but the smartest, most well educated, most elite MF'er you can find?

Because our society isn't really a meritocracy. Being a member of the social elite does not make you smart, and being smart does not make you a member of the social elite.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 11:09 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

I'm grumpy about Kaine because I find him squishy on abortion and capital punishment. I don't think it's fair to describe him as generally progressive when he feels the need to explain his personal disapproval of abortion and oversaw 11 executions as Governor. He comes off as calculating (like a lot of other Virginia Democrats).
posted by sallybrown at 11:11 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

feeling pretty secure about the whole "face of the establishment" thing, i guess.

Didn't we spend the last four days laugh-crying about how the Republicans could barely scrape together anyone of relevance at all for their convention?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:11 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

The RNC's failure doesn't mean the DNC can't fail, too, in a different way.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:12 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

The unauthorized use of #HereComestheSun at the #RNCinCLE is offensive & against the wishes of the George Harrison estate. If it had been Beware of Darkness, then we MAY have approved it!

Reason 682 why George is, was, and will always be my favorite Beatle.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:13 AM on July 22, 2016 [16 favorites]

The mayor of Chillicothe, Ohio must be quite the speaker.

I'm going to take a charitable read and decide that this isn't a slam against Chillicothe or Ohio or the "flyover states" because it sure does read like that but we should be unified, right?

Anyway, Chillicothe is traditionally a very blue-collar, Republican area of Ohio, and Luke Feeney was elected mayor with 50% of the vote. So that's pretty great.

Mayor Feeney was also a part of the Main Street Initiative launched by the Ohio Democratic Party.

I find it really, really tiresome to have to defend the Midwest in general and my state in particular. Clearly we contain multitudes as we are a swing state.
posted by cooker girl at 11:13 AM on July 22, 2016 [42 favorites]

Oh my Lord, the Onion actually annotated the entire 60+ minutes of his speech.

While I'm certainly not going to listen to it again, I'm going to keep coming back to this on mute to entertain myself today.
posted by Gaz Errant at 11:13 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Yeah, Kaine's definitely boring, but also competent and good-hearted. It's not a pick that would make my heart sing, but he's very much a safe pair of hands. And Virginians know that, and it's almost impossible for Trump to win if he can't take Virginia.
posted by tavella at 11:13 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Because our society isn't really a meritocracy. Being a member of the social elite does not make you smart, and being smart does not make you a member of the social elite.

I wasn't referring to electing people who are part of the social elite (which, like, isn't Donald Trump's picture in the dictionary under that?) but electing people who have greater depth of experience and more education about the salient issues in foreign and domestic affairs. There's this thing in some parts of the American electorate where knowing what the fuck you are doing is seen as a bad thing, because I wouldn't know what the fuck I'm doing as President and I need to elect someone who, like me, does not know what the fuck they are doing.

The world grows more and more complex each year. No one can be an expert in all of it but I'd like to see my leaders at least try.
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:13 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

“People use labels all the time,” Kaine explained in a recent interview on NBC’s “Meet the Press,” an exchange emblematic of the challenge he faces in talking about a politically volatile topic where his religion conflicts with his policy stance. “I’m kind of a traditional Catholic. Personally, I’m opposed to abortion, and personally, I’m opposed to the death penalty.”

So at least he's consistent, but not very progressive.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:15 AM on July 22, 2016

I, too, remembering trying to decide whether on the following day I would marry Elizabeth Warren, Tim Kaine, Tom Vilsack, or Sherrod Brown.

I had this dream all night, tossing and turning. Elizabeth and I will be very happy not going to the White House.
posted by bongo_x at 11:16 AM on July 22, 2016

Impressive of Clinton to find all of those speakers for her convention, considering she lacks the deep field of children from past marriages and corporate employees to choose from.
posted by ckape at 11:17 AM on July 22, 2016 [62 favorites]

phearlez: I wish all of you on with this blah blah Kaine is boring stuff would shut it. You wish the ticket was less paste-colored, yeah, I'm totally with you.

Yes, to clarify, my disappointment with his dullness is primarily due to his middle-aged-white-guyness. I expect Clinton to pick someone highly competent and who supports her priorities, which I also share (well, mostly). There's definitely a risk of letting the perfect be the enemy of the good, though, so I genuinely appreciate the reality check.
posted by Superplin at 11:18 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

The mayor of Chillicothe, Ohio must be quite the speaker.

Chillicothe is considered a "bellwether" for the parts of Ohio that aren't major cities - leans slightly Republican by registration, but is willing to vote Dem; Strickland for Governor, Sherrod Brown for Senate, various State reps & local politicians. Obama opened his first Ohio field office there for his re-election campaign. Do well in Chillicothe, you're likely to carry the state.

Plus, he's probably not gonna show up drunk, unlike most of the TrumpFest speakers . . . .
posted by soundguy99 at 11:19 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Why would you look to anyone but the smartest, most well educated, most elite MF'er you can find?

Current China is a technocracy. It's run by a very well educated, highly competent elite that pretty ruthlessly selects the best like-mined it can from the younger generations, while regularly purging the less ideologically pure (which mutates as time goes on, of course).

It's well run, if you look at it in its on terms. It's a living horror if you have different values or a dissenting point of view.
posted by bonehead at 11:19 AM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

I do not believe is is un-progressive to be personally opposed to abortion but conistently believe that abortion should be guaranteed legal. Isn't that the point?
posted by argybarg at 11:20 AM on July 22, 2016 [36 favorites]

The mayor of Chillicothe, Ohio must be quite the speaker.

I'm going to take a charitable read and decide that this isn't a slam against Chillicothe or Ohio or the "flyover states"

I'm not. I'm gonna go right ahead and feel insulted.

CHILLICOTHE - Councilman Josh Cartee announced at the June 27 council meeting his intent, in conjunction with Mayor Luke Feeney, to bring a committee request to Council President Bruce Arnold for legislation that would address a gap in federal and state anti-discrimination efforts in municipalities and that would include sexual orientation and gender identity among determinations of protected classes.
[. . . ]
The legislation addresses discrimination "based on age, ancestry, color, familial status, gender, gender identity or expression, handicap, marital status, national origin, race, sexual orientation or veteran/military status." It would cover any discriminatory practices within city limits in employment, housing, public accommodations and educational institutions, and would also be binding on any contractors interested in doing business with the city.

posted by Herodios at 11:20 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

I'm surprised that Clinton would announce a VP candidate on a Friday afternoon. If I learned nothing else from watching the West Wing, it's that Fridays are for news you want to bury.

I'm guessing it was originally aimed at stepping on any strong showing from the convention. Of course, the convention was part shitshow, part post-Reichstag demagoguery, followed by Trump's moonbat morning today. I totally wouldn't blame them if they waited until tomorrow, just to see what else Trump says or does.

My god I am bad at typing things.

Don't be too hard on yourself, kyrademon, I don't think any of us have been immune to the ol' brain fart considering what's going on.
posted by zombieflanders at 11:20 AM on July 22, 2016

Even Krugman is on the Putin thing.
posted by angrycat at 11:22 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

I do not believe is is un-progressive to be personally opposed to abortion but conistently believe that abortion should be guaranteed legal. Isn't that the point?

I'm not talking about the fact that he holds that personal belief. I'm talking about how he frequently mentions that as an out to signal and appeal to anti-choice voters in Virginia that he's one of them.
posted by sallybrown at 11:22 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

He stole that line from the late, great Molly Ivins. After Pat Buchanan's rabid speech at the 1992 Republican convention, it was Ivins who quipped, "It probably sounded better in its original German."

Thanks for the cite. I've been wondering where it came from, after seeing people rip it off here and there without attribution.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 11:23 AM on July 22, 2016

Rumor on the Twitters is that Jeb Bush might endorse Gary Johnson. I doubt it's true, but just the image of it tickles me.
posted by zombieflanders at 11:23 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Another list of competitive House races is at Ballotpedia for your convenience. Races listings are linked to Ballotpedia pages with more detail for each individual race.

In my area, both Minnesota-2 and Minnesota-8 will be tight races this year. Since we don't have Senate or Governor contests this year, and Minnesota will almost certainly vote for Clinton for President, I expect both local television and geo-targeted Internet ads will be swarming with spots for these races.
posted by gimonca at 11:23 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

How many of those people are already Republican voters? It's an honest question. In most years, nobody knows enough about either candidate to really, really dislike them. This year is different on both sides.

Some, but some of them have got to be Dems, or Dem-leaning independants. I'm not quite sucked into the malestorm enough to quote 538 verbatim off the top of my head, but all the polls have the race at something like 43-39, or 46-42. Meaning a fairly big chunk of the electorate is remains undecided. Neither candidate has quite consolidated their base yet. Of course, you might not have expected them too this early.

Trump scares the shit out of me. And part of the reason he does is that I worry he's still got a chance at this, and the reason I worry is that I'm not sure Hilary can do anything to sway those people that are against her. It's too bitter, there's too much distrust, too many conspiracy theories, and rather like the Red Queen, Trump makes it a habit to say six unthinkable things before breakfast. The rock-ribbed Republican head of the FBI comes out and says her email thing was careless but not criminal, and Trump et al insinuate that the FBI is corrupt and in the bag for Clinton, and nobody blinks. My feeling is that the way things are in the country right now a lot of people will just nod at that and think "of course." That's how high the level of distrust is, that there's a lot of people who think it more plausible that there's some vast conspiracy to get Hilary out of trouble at the FBI rather than that they just didn't have the goods, because their starting premise is that she's criminal. This is known, as the Dothraki would say. And while I think that the Republican base believes that for sure, I think it goes deeper and wider than the base, and that's the reason for that big chunk of undecideds.

My hope is that they can use this convention to pull it out a bit just by not being crazy. But I don't know how much facts matter, anymore; there's a fever in the body politic....
posted by maggiepolitt at 11:25 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

I don't think it's fair to describe him as generally progressive when he feels the need to explain his personal disapproval of abortion

but this is the position of most of the country AND the winning formula that Clinton I struck upon - 'safe, legal, rare'... You can make the argument to pro-choice that you want to ensure that access to abortion is available to all and without pointless hoops designed only to make it harder to obtain, but still make the argument to pro-lifers that you want to reduce its frequency overall, which in turn you can do through (back to the liberal side) policies that increased projects like safe sex education, funding for planned parenthood, etc.

In my view this is entirely consistent with being progressive, if the end result is any woman who wants an abortion can obtain one in a safe and timely manner.

Clinton II i assume is hoping to strip away a segment of the moderate republicans, and so a pick that has 'moderate' positions on divisive issues like abortion is a pretty smart play.
posted by modernnomad at 11:25 AM on July 22, 2016 [16 favorites]

(I have nothing against Chillicothe or Ohio. The joke, such as it was, was that the mayor of a small city has a lower profile than some of the other people on the speaker list. Bad joke didn't land well--I apologize. I appreciate the additional information about Feeney and Chillicothe.)
posted by box at 11:27 AM on July 22, 2016 [16 favorites]

From the Chillicothe Gazette:

Feeney wasn't at liberty to discuss the topic of his speech or even what day he will be speaking, but the 36-year-old mayor said the call to speak came as a complete shock to him.

"I got a call last week from members of Secretary Clinton's team in Ohio, who also represent the (Democratic National Convention Committee)," he said. "I honestly thought they were calling to ask me to host a watch party during the convention."

Instead, the call came to ask him to attend and speak at the gathering.

"They were looking for someone to speak from a small town in the Midwest, and my name came up. Obviously, I jumped at the chance," he said.

He's kind of adorable by the way.
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:27 AM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

a pick that has 'moderate' positions on divisive issues like abortion is a pretty smart play.

I'm not saying that makes him a bad person or politician, just that my bar for a "progressive" candidate is higher than that. YMMV.
posted by sallybrown at 11:27 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

TIM KAINE WOULD NOT BE A BORING VICE PRESIDENT, Newsweek.

(sorry for the shouting, it's their shitty house headline style)

He harkens back to the experience regularly, including on Thursday. Speaking at a community college in Northern Virginia with Clinton looking on, Kaine recounted, “When I lived in Honduras, the best compliment you could make to someone…was to say that they were ‘listo,’ to say that they were ready”—a reference to the Clinton campaign slogan “Ready for Hillary.” Showing off his fluent Spanish, he explained, “What ready means is more than just on time, it means well-prepared, it means they’re ready to get on the ballot!” The crowd roared.

Vamos a pasar, Kaine.
posted by phearlez at 11:27 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Thanks, box, I appreciate the clarification. It's kind of a knee-jerk thing to assume people are saying the worst when they talk about the Midwest.
posted by cooker girl at 11:28 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Why would you look to anyone but the smartest, most well educated, most elite MF'er you can find?"

Elite MetaFilterer? Someone who is #1, you say?
posted by Kabanos at 11:29 AM on July 22, 2016 [17 favorites]

JUSTINIAN FOR EMPEROR 2016
posted by stolyarova at 11:30 AM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

I've made a post over in Fanfare talk to gauge interest in some political podcasts, including 538 Elections for anyone who might be inclined to have a narrower discussion focused on those.
posted by the_querulous_night at 11:30 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

As far as Kaine's position on abortion, I'm fine with it. Because it means that he personally doesn't like abortion but he's also not going to stop anyone else from obtaining a medical procedure that is legal.
posted by cooker girl at 11:31 AM on July 22, 2016 [14 favorites]

I wasn't referring to electing people who are part of the social elite (which, like, isn't Donald Trump's picture in the dictionary under that?)

He's of the economic elite, but socially somewhat lower class. I see more criticism directed at this (hair, skintone, diction, etc.) than at his vile proposed policies. Sad!
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 11:32 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

From the Onion Recap

"About Donald J. Trump: If elected, he would be the last president."

Ah-ha ha ha ha oh help us Jesus.
posted by angrycat at 11:32 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

So at least he's consistent, but not very progressive.

Well, he's not exactly consistent, if by that you mean has held the same position on certain issues over time. Kaine is similar to Clinton, in that many of the positions he takes on some left wing issues have evolved. LGBT rights (including the right to adopt). Abortion. Gun rights. (Kaine was mostly for gun rights up until the Virginia Tech Massacre. Prior to that he signed the Brady bill, but (I think) otherwise supported the Second Amendment, which he now says he supports with some restrictions. The NRA punished him for the change after Virginia Tech giving him an "F" rating and advertising throughout Virginia that they did not support him during his 2012 Senatorial election run against former Senator and Governor George Allen. He won by about 6 percentage points. )

He was more vocally against abortion as governor when Bush was in office, and previously voted for late-term abortion bans. He now says he strongly supports a woman's right to choose.
posted by zarq at 11:32 AM on July 22, 2016

> "— Kentucky Secretary of State Alison Lundergan Grimes"

A name I recognize primarily because Mitch McConnell accused her of ... being a mime, I think? ... in a weird rhyming attack ad.

I think he must have accidentally raised her profile *so much*, if I still remember that.
posted by kyrademon at 11:33 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

For more Ohio perspective, Brent Larkin, editorial director of the the Plain Dealer (the major Cleveland newspaper) from '91 to '09, and the very picture of "establishment republican", was horrified by the vulgar talking yam: "Cleveland's finest hour was Donald Trump's darkest."
posted by soundguy99 at 11:36 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Does anybody know if Wendy Davis going to be speaking at the convention?
posted by zombieflanders at 11:36 AM on July 22, 2016

Looks like Donald came out a LOSER in terms of television viewership for his convention.
posted by sallybrown at 11:37 AM on July 22, 2016

Chillicothe stinks, or it used to.

Theres's an annual 200 mile bike ride that passes through town twice. Chilly town hosts the mid-ride 'lunch' food stop. They've always been most hospitable to the 2000 to 6000 cyclists passing through town twice the same weekend (Mother's Day).

However, until a few years ago the lunch stop was in the shadow of the very tall 'smokestack' at the Mead Paper Co. plant there. I'm told the heavy urea-like aroma that used to hang over the place came from a 'digester' that is part of the paper-making process. Now the stack is gone, the plant does something else and lunch is at a different park on the other end of town.

Chillicothe is also the nearest town of any size to a recent incident (in nearby Pike Co.) in which 8 family members were murdered in their sleep. Still unsolved and no drug connection proven, tho' in that part of the state (another nearby small city is pretty well known as a drug hub) you have to wonder.

Pretty area for a bike ride, though.

posted by Herodios at 11:37 AM on July 22, 2016

a lungful of dragon: Thanks for the cite. I've been wondering where it came from, after seeing people rip it off here and there without attribution.

You're welcome! (I'm probably one of those people! It's one of my favorite Ivins lines!)
posted by zarq at 11:37 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

man the Onion tricked me into watching a lot more of that speech than was good for me
posted by angrycat at 11:37 AM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I don't think Kaine's position on late-term/partial birth abortion has really changed. There's more on the link below. I'd rather he was more progressive on this and anyone against PB/LT always worries me that they're going to get sucked into the compromises that are just slow creeps towards full bans. But from a statistical standpoint they're rare and would be even rarer if we had more successful fights against efforts to deny women services in their first 16 weeks.

So I don't love it, but if it's the price to get us a Jesuit with a strong commitment to other equality issues? I don't think it's a bridge too far. Even on PB/LT Kaine supported exemptions for the woman's health.

Kaine on the issues, abortion.

Don't weaken or subvert the basic holding of Roe v. Wade

I strongly support the right of women to make their own health and reproductive decisions and, for that reason, will oppose efforts to weaken or subvert the basic holding of Roe v. Wade. We all share the goal of reducing unwanted pregnancies and abortions. The right way to do this is through education and access to health care and contraception rather than criminalizing women's reproductive decisions.

Source: 2012 Senate campaign website, kaineforva.com , Oct 9, 2012

Personally opposed to abortion, but it shouldn't be outlawed

Kaine, a Roman Catholic who worked as a missionary in Honduras reiterated his personal opposition to abortion, but maintained the practice should not be outlawed.
When asked if he'd like to see the Supreme Court overturn Roe the Governor answered, "I don't think the Supreme Court should." He continued, "Roe vs. Wade is ultimately about saying that there is a realm of personal liberty for people to make this decision."
Source: ABC News: Politics Blog , Jul 31, 2008

posted by phearlez at 11:37 AM on July 22, 2016 [14 favorites]

Does anybody know if Wendy Davis going to be speaking at the convention?

I haven't seen anything official (and I've been watching!). She is scheduled to attend a special breakfast reception, so she'll definitely be there...
posted by everybody had matching towels at 11:40 AM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Eric extends a limp, misshapen palm, and we shake hands. My god, that familiar feeling! Like a Ziploc bag filled with beef stew and stale bread! I’ve known that feeling my whole life!

I gesture at his hand with my left.

“Do you also suffer from Anatolian Carpal Bone Stew Syndrome?” I ask, cautiously yet enthusiastically.

“Oh yes! In fact, Gamel, the Eric Trump Foundation has provided millions in research and awareness campaigns for the disease. We’re actually responsible for the ‘No, My Hand Isn’t Broken’ ads from a few years ago!” he says. “C’mon, take a load off!”

Carl Diggler interviews Eric Trump and discussed their many inbreeding-related disorders.
posted by My Dad at 11:40 AM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

I strongly support the right of women to make their own health and reproductive decisions and, for that reason, will oppose efforts to weaken or subvert the basic holding of Roe v. Wade. We all share the goal of reducing unwanted pregnancies and abortions. The right way to do this is through education and access to health care and contraception rather than criminalizing women's reproductive decisions.
Thanks for linking to this, phearlez.
posted by zarq at 11:42 AM on July 22, 2016

So while I see lots of folks worry "Kaine isn't liberal enough", I think "Clinton is actually already pretty liberal by many Americans' standards". The dems I know like to tout that it's a big tent and that we're not trying to drive out anyone who isn't always perfectly progressive along a range of litmus test policies - that's what republicans do. So I'm pretty okay with Kaine not being perfectly progressive along every line - that's good signaling about the culture the democrats want.
posted by R343L at 11:45 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

I keep misreading "Kaine" as "Kanye" as I scan through articles. It's going to be a long, disorienting election season for me if he's the VP pick.
posted by Servo5678 at 11:49 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

From the Newsweek article:

During his 2005 run for governor, Kaine was hit repeatedly by his Republican foe over his opposition to the death penalty in a state where the vast majority of voters support it. Kaine pledged to respect state laws and the will of the public, and executions took place on his watch. “Absolutely, it weighed on him as governor,” says Wolf. “But he also recognizes that it is not appropriate for a leader to impose his views on the electorate, to supplant the law with his own personal views.”

posted by kirkaracha at 11:49 AM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Actually let's drop the On The Issues for all the theoretical contenders:

Kaine.

Vilsack.

Perez.

and for comparison purposes, Warren.
posted by phearlez at 11:49 AM on July 22, 2016

So I'm genuinely curious why the child rape case against Trump has never come into play, not even above a whisper. Is it off the farm, credibility-wise? Is it because Bill Clinton also winds up in the same setting?

p.s. I believe it.
posted by argybarg at 11:50 AM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

Why would you look to anyone but the smartest, most well educated, most elite MF'er you can find?"

Elite MetaFilterer? Someone who is #1, you say?

Yeah, it's about time Melon Farmers got some representation.

posted by Herodios at 11:51 AM on July 22, 2016

As a woman whose #1 issue is abortion access, it would please me to see Kaine as VP because it means that he won't be in the conversation for more policy-driven positions. A VP doesn't have really any official responsibilities other than breaking ties in the Senate, and if we somehow get a tie vote on abortion I feel confident, based on his statements, that he'd do the right thing.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 11:51 AM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

So I'm genuinely curious why the child rape case against Trump has never come into play, not even above a whisper. Is it off the farm, credibility-wise? Is it because Bill Clinton also winds up in the same setting?

I've read that it's because the source of it is suuuuuper shady.
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:53 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

So while I see lots of folks worry "Kaine isn't liberal enough", I think "Clinton is actually already pretty liberal by many Americans' standards".

I have stopped many people (tedious cousins at family functions usually) in their tracks, when they complain about Obama and Clinton, by quietly adding I have problems with them myself... because they are too conservative.
posted by aught at 11:54 AM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

A VP doesn't have really any official responsibilities other than breaking ties in the Senate

Officially, although Biden for sure has had a huge influence on the policies of the Obama administration. Certainly that's not an issue with Clinton and abortion, though.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:55 AM on July 22, 2016

I've read that it's because the source of it is suuuuuper shady.

The source remains anonymous even in her filings in New York. But the connections between Epstein and Trump are there, as a matter of public record (as are the connections between Slick Willy and Epstein). Who knows. It's strange that not more has come of it.
posted by dis_integration at 11:55 AM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Let's not suggest that people who are personally opposed to abortion but pro choice are being disingenuous. Some people are personally opposed to abortion but pro choice.
posted by bongo_x at 11:55 AM on July 22, 2016 [25 favorites]

My understanding was that there was a super reliable witness, I also expected it to blow up.
posted by Tarumba at 11:56 AM on July 22, 2016

I keep misreading "Kaine" as "Kanye" as I scan through articles.

Flagged for now you've got me fucking doing it.

-_-
posted by howfar at 11:56 AM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

I don't think Kaine's position on late-term/partial birth abortion has really changed. There's more on the link below. I'd rather he was more progressive on this and anyone against PB/LT always worries me that they're going to get sucked into the compromises that are just slow creeps towards full bans. But from a statistical standpoint they're rare and would be even rarer if we had more successful fights against efforts to deny women services in their first 16 weeks.

He actually sounds very progressive on the issue of abortion. Hillary Clinton came out in favor of a constitutional amendment banning late term abortions and she received an unprecedented Planned Parenthood endorsement while the primaries were still competitive, so that should pretty much be the gold standard, right? Anyway, they sound like they would work well as a team on the issue.
posted by indubitable at 12:03 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

I do think the Pence v. Kaine debate will probably be the lowest rated there's ever been, in some time. Which is good or bad. I don't know.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:03 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

If she knows Kaine and likes him and wants to work with him, then fine. He's in the ballpark for me.
posted by argybarg at 12:04 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Officially, although Biden for sure has had a huge influence on the policies of the Obama administration.

Yeah, I know. I don't think Kaine would play the same role for Clinton, though. Biden has always been a bit of an affable loose cannon, it's part of how he presents himself. I don't see that in Kaine, and I am very familiar with his time in office.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 12:06 PM on July 22, 2016

The source remains anonymous even in her filings in New York. But the connections between Epstein and Trump are there, as a matter of public record (as are the connections between Slick Willy and Epstein). Who knows. It's strange that not more has come of it.

I don't think so. It's already a radical act to simply believe a woman when she says someone assaulted her. Someone famous you need a dozen and even then people rally to support the celeb. One anonymous report? I think almost anyone willing to support Trump, with the legion of reports and captured examples of misogynist actions, is beyond reaching with this sort of thing.

I guess part of that is that the Trump machine will deny things - like the plagiarism - that are incontrovertibly true. Getting into a discussion about a pile of inconclusive things that add up to a reasonable belief? That's their wheelhouse. Media has a concrete libel defense when it comes to citing government documents and court filings, but they still need to do so in pretty definite language. From the Digital Media Law Project:

Your source is an official public document or statement by a public official on a matter of public concern;

You properly attribute the information to that source; and

You fairly and accurately portray the information from the document or statement

So reporting on this case would be pretty restricted on the "this is what is alleged" side. On the other you have Trump people Trumping the Trump.

So I'm not surprised it's not gotten much play.
posted by phearlez at 12:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

I wasn't thinking about the victim, I was thinking about this story: http://jezebel.com/the-source-pushing-the-trump-rape-lawsuits-may-not-be-w-1783270283
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:08 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Someone started to joke with me about "Maybe Hillary will select Joe Lieberm--" and I cut him off with a loud hiss and a plastic spork to his throat.
posted by delfin at 12:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [28 favorites]

So I'm at the airport talking to delegates from all over and hearing reports via FB, Twitter, and text. Apparently the ringer replacement issue was bigger than I knew. It looks like fully 1/3 to 1/2 the delegates were not on the floor, and they were not replaced by alternates, either, but guests.
posted by corb at 12:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [68 favorites]

More than 60 current and past office holders from across the country were announced Thursday as speakers at the Democratic National Convention in Philadelphia next week.

That list looks funny... where are the out-of-work actors? Where are pyramid marketing business owners? Where are the law enforcement officials? The football stars? My gods, those speakers combined have barely a handful of defendants in the whole lot; how can they be qualified to speak about what makes a good president if they haven't seen the legal system from the inside?

It's like the Democrats think that elected officials know what it takes to be a good elected official. Please, get these people an iPhone and a twitter account before they ruin America with their foolish "structure" and "plans" and "experience" and whatever other clutter they're allowing to get in the way of Making America Safe Work First One Again.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 12:16 PM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

So I'm at the airport talking to delegates from all over and hearing reports via FB, Twitter, and text. Apparently the ringer replacement issue was bigger than I knew. It looks like fully 1/3 to 1/2 the delegates were not on the floor, and they were not replaced by alternates, either, but guests.

Well, he does know how to fill a room.
posted by leotrotsky at 12:19 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

It's like the Democrats think that elected officials know what it takes to be a good elected official.

There are plenty of entertainment "figures" coming to the Dem convention also. (WHY is Star Jones speaking? Can't the genius behind the Hillary twitter account pick the celeb guests?)
posted by sallybrown at 12:20 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Biggest get from this first batch of DNC email leaks is probably Debbie Wasserman Schultz setting up a meeting with the president of MSNBC to get Mika Brzezinski to apologise for saying that she should step down for being unfair to Sanders. Pretty sordid and grimy.
posted by nicolas léonard sadi carnot at 12:21 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

So Corb, when will you feel safe spilling the beans about the balloon drop? I keep going back and forth between Cracked, here, and the 360° video that nagem linked looking for clues. (But I totally understand you not wanting to scoop Cracked with their own story.)
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 12:21 PM on July 22, 2016

Oh FFS. My Bernie Bro nephew (who is now basically a Burn it Down Bro) asked for reasons to support Clinton, without using scare tactics or mentioning Trump. So I said this:

Pro-choice, supports paid maternal/paternal leave, supports equal pay, wants an amendment to repeal Citizen's United to abolish Corporate Personhood, wants to end the era of mass incarceration for low-level drug offenders (putting the emphasis on rehabilitation and treatment and getting rid of mandatory sentencing), she's for more autism support and Alzheimer's research, wants to end campus assault on women, actually believes in climate change (I know, science, right??), she acknowledges that there is an implicit bias in policing and wants to change it (including ending racial profiling), is in favor of universal preschool, free tution at community colleges, by 2021, families with income up to $125,000 will pay no tuition at in-state four-year public colleges and universities, from the beginning, every student from a family making $85,000 a year or less will be able to go to an in-state four-year public college or university without paying tuition. Shall I go on?

His response?

Basically, he said that she was his Senator (yes he's from NY) and he saw all the lies she told then and doesn't believe any of these things will be true once she's elected.

I'm just like over here facepalming so hard I'm giving myself a headache. Blinding rage. Thank God he's in a blue state. I'm going to have to block him on Facebook at this point.
posted by cooker girl at 12:23 PM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

Does he think, like Trump seems to, that when you get elected President all the things you want to do just get done by the end of the first day?
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:25 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

On the plus side, 'Clinton Kaine' sounds like a badass hardboiled detective, whereas 'Trump Pence' just sounds like some old Victorian biddy hawking bags of birdseed.
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:26 PM on July 22, 2016 [45 favorites]

Basically, he said that she was his Senator (yes he's from NY) and he saw all the lies she told then and doesn't believe any of these things will be true once she's elected.

So he's trolling. Nothing you could have said would have changed his mind.
posted by zarq at 12:27 PM on July 22, 2016 [23 favorites]

I am Kaine. I will help you.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 12:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Also I'm ashamed that my first reaction to Vilsack was to imagine all the "nutsack" vandalism to come.
posted by argybarg at 12:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Like I'm seriously crying at work because I'm just so, so tired of fighting.
posted by cooker girl at 12:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

another reason to pick Kaine is that it's always good to have a dragoon in the party
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:29 PM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

One more for the "this election season is terrible for me" files - I just realized that there was a stupid mix up in a list I shared with some collaborators, so that everything was off by a couple of lines, and I yelled "MEREDITH!" :(
posted by RedOrGreen at 12:29 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Like I'm seriously crying at work because I'm just so, so tired of fighting.

It's early yet! Take care of yourself. "Stay low and build" as DeRay Mckesson says.
posted by sallybrown at 12:31 PM on July 22, 2016 [14 favorites]

Now he's got a friend chiming in saying the only possible way Trump doesn't get elected is if the Democratic party runs a unity ticket of Sanders/Warren.
posted by cooker girl at 12:32 PM on July 22, 2016

Now he's got a friend chiming in saying the only possible way Trump doesn't get elected is if the Democratic party runs a unity ticket of Sanders/Warren.

That's Ivanka.
posted by bongo_x at 12:33 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

I really want to unfriend my nephew but my relationship with his mother (my husband's brother's wife) is tenuous at best and I really like my brother-in-law.

I blame Trump.
posted by cooker girl at 12:34 PM on July 22, 2016

I am sorry, cooker girl! Hugs if you want them!

His mind is made up. He is not interested in actual, reasoned debate. He sounds pretty immature, to be honest. He might consider what you have said with time, but for now just let it go and take care of yourself.

Also, if you have the heart, tell him to STFU and stop keeping you posted on his unrelenting lack of rationality.
posted by Tarumba at 12:36 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

It's probably not worth arguing, cooker girl, but Politifact has a chart showing Hillary lies less than most politicians, including edging out even Bernie.
posted by misskaz at 12:37 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

cooker girl: Now he's got a friend chiming in saying the only possible way Trump doesn't get elected is if the Democratic party runs a unity ticket of Sanders/Warren.

And that's why they both have a responsibility to vote for Clinton, so that the disaster of Trump doesn't happen.

Does he have the article about how Democrats govern further left when they get more votes? Even if he's in true-blue New York, his vote matters if he wants policies that end up being more like Sanders' and Warren's. If Clinton (and his local representatives) win in a squeaker, they'll be more likely to govern from the scared center instead of being confidently progressive.

You want me to talk to this kid? :->
posted by clawsoon at 12:38 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

You don't need to unfriend, just unfollow.
posted by zakur at 12:39 PM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

And if you are interested, for anyone tempted to attempt to convince the Bernie or Bust crowd:

The backfire effect: When your deepest convictions are challenged by contradictory evidence, your beliefs get stronger.
posted by Tarumba at 12:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

"At the lunchtime event at the University of Massachusetts Club on Beacon Street, Kaine told both the crowd and individuals privately that he had no idea whether he would be Clinton’s pick."
posted by sallybrown at 12:40 PM on July 22, 2016

Is there a debunker out there yet for Hillary's America? I've got a FB friend posting about it. I'd like the facts before engaging.

Edit: All I'm finding on Google is movie reviews, no factual analysis.
posted by Gaz Errant at 12:40 PM on July 22, 2016

Will it be Mondo Kaine?

Triumph of the Vilsack?

Warren Peace, perhaps?

posted by Herodios at 12:43 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Tarumba: The backfire effect: When your deepest convictions are challenged by contradictory evidence, your beliefs get stronger.

He's flipping between Sanders and Trump. He doesn't have beliefs yet; he's at that tender time in life that we call the Age of Trolling. His beliefs will probably end up being determined by who he maintains relationships with and who maintains relationships with him.
posted by clawsoon at 12:44 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Now he's got a friend chiming in saying the only possible way Trump doesn't get elected is if the Democratic party runs a unity ticket of Sanders/Warren.

That's just plain stoopit talk. Disengage with a non-committal comment and move on. As they say, you can't reason someone out of a position they didn't arrive at by reason.
posted by aught at 12:45 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

Thanks guys. I just needed to vent because I can't say anything out loud at work. I work for a Catholic organization and truly, I work with wonderful, wonderful people who show me (an atheist) God's love every day. Can't talk politics with them; haven't tried, don't want to. I need this job.

So thank you for letting me vent. It was my fault; I do have him on my unfollow list...but I still get notifications that he's posted something (can't change that) and I stupidly clicked on that post.

He's a smart guy, in his late 20s, early 30s, the product of an incredibly over-indulged childhood, and he's never, ever lived in a red state. Oh, also: he's a white man. So there's that.
posted by cooker girl at 12:46 PM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

Oh, also: he's a white man.

nothatshocked.gif
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:47 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

Cracked's hard-hitting balloon journalism.
posted by corb at 12:51 PM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

Actually in all seriousness, Cracked's coverage of the convention has been surprisingly good.
posted by corb at 12:52 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

re: young men from New York on Hillary

In the early 00s, an Internet "friend" of mine (this one) from New York HATED Hillary. HATED. He would go on and on about how terrible it was that his state had elected her senator. I was like 15 and not really into politics and for all I knew there were legitimate, non-misogynistic reasons to hate Hillary, so I didn't question this, but as time went on it became very clear that he was an early-prototype MRA. As I started to discover my nascent feminism, he thought it was funny to troll me by declaring "war on women" because they got all the perks and ruined everything or whatever it was that MRAs believe, idk. Like this dude followed me into various LiveJournal communities to harass me with this shit, and I ignored him up until a black male columnist wrote a very timely and on-point article on the "global war on women" (i.e., you know, actual things like rape as a tool of war and forced pregnancy and other terrible forms of systemic oppression). I posted it on his Myspace with a message saying "LOOK, YOUR PLAN IS WORKING!! GOOD JOB!!!" and he blocked me. (I still laugh thinking about this.)

Anyway I've been thinking about him and his insane Hillary hate a lot this election cycle and I don't know who it was earlier in the thread who compared schadenfreude to eating nutella from the jar with a spoon but basically I am swan-diving into the nutella butt-ass naked and wriggling through it on the floor and rubbing it all over myself
posted by sunset in snow country at 12:52 PM on July 22, 2016 [21 favorites]

Is there a debunker out there yet for Hillary's America?

Is that the D'Souza film? I would think you could just point to how off "2016" was.
posted by drezdn at 12:53 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

So I'm at the airport talking to delegates from all over and hearing reports via FB, Twitter, and text. Apparently the ringer replacement issue was bigger than I knew. It looks like fully 1/3 to 1/2 the delegates were not on the floor, and they were not replaced by alternates, either, but guests.

I trust you Corb, but has this been reported anywhere? I'm not even really finding tweets. Seems significant but I haven't seen it picked up.
posted by zachlipton at 12:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Why don't you just say this:
All right, nephew, I won't use scare tactics, I'll use love. If you love Bernie Sanders, you should believe him and you should honor his request that you vote for Clinton. After the terrifying low-rent Goebbels theatrics we just witnessed, to doubt that he--sincerely and personally--endorses your voting for Clinton so that her opponent does not become leader of the free world is evidence of either profound ignorance or dementia.

White guys! Always surprised to find out that some of the other people are not white guys!
posted by Don Pepino at 12:56 PM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

Politico noticed the Trump whips taking off their hats and sitting in the WA delegation in one of the articles linked above, but I don't think anyone checked during the nomination speech. They weren't even interested in the walk-outs.
posted by corb at 12:57 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Rep. Sean Duffy (R-WI):

“There’s a viewpoint that says, ‘I can fight for minorities, and I can fight for women,’ and if you get that, you make up a vast majority of the voting block and you win. And white males have been left aside a little bit in the politics of who speaks to them.”

(Ref.)
posted by Spathe Cadet at 1:13 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Oh my god! It just occurred to me! The Bernie Bros's idea of a "compromise" gives them EXACTLY what they want (Bernie as President) and gives Clinton supporters exactly NONE of what they want (Warren as VP, which is great, but it's not even Clinton as VP)!!!!!!

GAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!
posted by cooker girl at 1:13 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

I think jscalzi is watching ...
posted by Tevin at 1:17 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

"There's a viewpoint that says, 'I'm too unimaginative to understand that fighting for minorities and fighting for women is also fighting for white males.'" This is not a zero-sum game; maybe that right there is the essence of the difference between the Dems and the GOP. Zero-sum game? y/n
posted by kokaku at 1:18 PM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

Well, Trump's ghostwriter said quite adamantly that Trump's worldview quite explicitly only allows for winners and loser. Either you're the winningest winner that ever won or you're a contemptible loser. No middle ground. So zero sum: y.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:22 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Scalzi didn't get out ahead of Atom Eyes on this one, assuming it was independently struck upon.
posted by chimaera at 1:24 PM on July 22, 2016

Washington Post comes out hard against Trump, excoriating him as a candidate and announcing they will not endorse him this fall. The whole thing is golden but I particularly liked:

The lack of experience might be overcome if Mr. Trump saw it as a handicap worth overcoming. But he displays no curiosity, reads no books and appears to believe he needs no advice. In fact, what makes Mr. Trump so unusual is his combination of extreme neediness and unbridled arrogance. He is desperate for affirmation but contemptuous of other views. He also is contemptuous of fact. Throughout the campaign, he has unspooled one lie after another — that Muslims in New Jersey celebrated after 9/11, that his tax-cut plan would not worsen the deficit, that he opposed the Iraq War before it started — and when confronted with contrary evidence, he simply repeats the lie. It is impossible to know whether he convinces himself of his own untruths or knows that he is wrong and does not care. It is also difficult to know which trait would be more frightening in a commander in chief.

posted by sallybrown at 1:27 PM on July 22, 2016 [43 favorites]

Trump is never going to let the thing with Cruz go and it's going to make him look weak as hell.
posted by Tevin at 1:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

The Washington Post editorial board calls Donald Trump a threat to American democracy.
posted by waitingtoderail at 1:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

another reason to pick Kaine is that it's always good to have a dragoon in the party

Yeah, but I swear he's always in the goddamn air every time Cure 3 hits.
posted by biogeo at 1:30 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

Scalzi didn't get out ahead of Atom Eyes on this one, assuming it was independently struck upon.

The concept that Scalzi invented the English language is absurd.
posted by peeedro at 1:31 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

The Washington Post editorial board calls Donald Trump a threat to American democracy.

Protip reminder: open WP paywall links (if you've exceeded your limit) in a private browser window.
posted by aught at 1:32 PM on July 22, 2016

>>Like I'm seriously crying at work because I'm just so, so tired of fighting.
>It's early yet! Take care of yourself. "Stay low and build" as DeRay Mckesson says.

Don’t engage, strike by night
Remain relentless ‘til their troops take flight
Outrun. Outlast. Hit 'em quick, get out fast.
Stay alive ‘til this horror show is past
posted by msalt at 1:32 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

Like I'm seriously crying at work because I'm just so, so tired of fighting.

I'm so sorry.

You may already know the following, but Facebook has a couple of tools that you can take advantage of, to filter out friends and family.

My favorite are friend lists. These are filters. You can make sure certain people are allowed to see and comment on your posts, and restrict others.

You can also use friend lists restrict your own view of your facebook feed through a filter you have created, to screen out anything posted by people not on a list.

You can block content from appearing on your feed that comes from a particular source, such as any and all articles from one website.

And you can unfollow people you can't unfriend.

All of these options are only visible to you, and not the person whose access or visibility you are restricting.
posted by zarq at 1:33 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Trump is never going to let the thing with Cruz go and it's going to make him look weak as hell.

right now Cruz is the bad guy in every 80s cartoon when they had to team up with the good guys to fight some amoral existential threat like Drugs or Pollution or whatever

next week we'll be back to blasting his robot minions, but just this once, we have to work together!
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:35 PM on July 22, 2016 [21 favorites]

Actually in all seriousness, Cracked's coverage of the convention has been surprisingly good.

I'm sorry to criticize Corb but it's been talked about again and again here on the blue. Cracked is full of good journalists that write good articles that are also funny. You can stop apologizing and/or being surprised by this when you post a link to a Cracked article.
posted by VTX at 1:35 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Trump is never going to let the thing with Cruz go and it's going to make him look weak as hell.

There have been other people in history who have said that they're not mad, they're laughing because it's funny to them that other people think they're mad, but now we see that they were all pale reflections of Trump's Not Mad At All But Laughing Really Hard At You.
posted by Copronymus at 1:38 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Alex Seitz-Wald reporting that Clinton staffers went into 3 PM meeting expecting to hear the VP pick but were instead told they'd have to wait until an "undisclosed time."
posted by sallybrown at 1:41 PM on July 22, 2016

Alex Seitz-Wald reporting that Clinton staffers went into 3 PM meeting expecting to hear the VP pick but were instead told they'd have to wait until an "undisclosed time."

DEMOCRATS IN DISARRAY! EXCELLENT NEWS FOR DONALD TRUMP!
posted by tonycpsu at 1:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

The concept that Scalzi invented the English language is absurd.

Hater.
posted by bongo_x at 1:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

another reason to pick Kaine is that it's always good to have a dragoon in the party

But DRGs are basically walking floor rugs...
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:43 PM on July 22, 2016

man it is a bummer that donald trump is an existential threat to the republic because otherwise he would be one of the funniest accounts in weird twitter
posted by murphy slaw at 1:45 PM on July 22, 2016 [21 favorites]

I wish him a long and fruitful career as a twitter crank.
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:47 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

I'm trying hard to not check what my auntie, a woman who showed me much love but is a Trump supporter and who is so angry that there is a CBC but not a Cong White Caucus, is saying on Facebook.

In part because my brother texted me last night that Trump has the eyes of a chicken and I really want to let my auntie know. Not that he's an existential threat to the human race, which he is, but that he has the eyes of a chicken.

Because Trump does. Look at those chicken eyes.
posted by angrycat at 1:49 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

Hillary Clinton Makes Unannounced Visit to Pulse Nightclub to Pay Respects

"Clinton's BK HQ staff went into 3:00 meeting expecting to hear VP pick, but told will have to wait until "undisclosed time," per source."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 1:50 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Cracked is full of good journalists that write good articles that are also funny.
Cracked has good journalists but a couple of seriously awful editors who try to put everything into the format of a two-page listicle or photoshop contest. And if you check the wording on most articles' links, you'll find titles that are generally less link-baity than what's on top of the page.

As for the Washington Post, they have been far better than the New York Times for covering the Threat of Trump from the beginning, which is why they were one of the first Press Entities to get blacklisted by the Drumpfter's Machine. I'd call their editorial "courageous", but they know already that a President Trump would use his power, legitimate and not, to put The Post and Jeff Bezos' Amazon out of business.... or at least force him to sell the Post to his friends at the National Enquirer and Amazon to Peter Thiel.
posted by oneswellfoop at 1:52 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Hillary Clinton Makes Unannounced Visit to Pulse Nightclub to Pay Respects

Wow. Makes me cry to think about that choice compared to what we heard last night.
posted by sallybrown at 1:52 PM on July 22, 2016 [20 favorites]

Is there anything to the DNC leaks thing? So far it looks like ordinary stuff except for some inadvisable chatter.
posted by zennie at 1:54 PM on July 22, 2016

wut

ClintonKaine.com
ClintonBiden.com
ClintonBooker.com

via /r/hillaryclinton
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

prize bull octorok, there was a link in a different thread about someone who is squatting those websites.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 1:55 PM on July 22, 2016

ClintonKaine.com: Your One-Stop Shop For Election-Themed Harry Potter Fan Fiction
posted by peeedro at 1:57 PM on July 22, 2016

From roomthreeseventeen's link:
Clinton then spent the next hour holding a roundtable discussion with community leaders, including members of Equality Florida, and, as one reporter noted, "listening."

Listening? LISTENING?!?! HA! What a girl. You'll never catch Trump listening.
posted by msalt at 1:57 PM on July 22, 2016 [14 favorites]

Hypothetical Q: Any chance Warren has a shot at the Supreme Court if RBG retires?
posted by PenDevil at 1:58 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

So after looking at ClintonKaine.com, I can't stop imagining a Potter Puppet Pals that starts with "Trump, Trump, President Trump" and later has Pence going "Pence, Pence, Mike Pen-CE" in the most boring flat tone imaginable. Can this be a thing?
posted by zachlipton at 2:02 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

MSNBC says no announcement at the rally. It'll be announced by text message late this evening.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:04 PM on July 22, 2016

Hypothetical Q: Any chance Warren has a shot at the Supreme Court if RBG retires?

No, she's far too old.
posted by Justinian at 2:14 PM on July 22, 2016

Regarding the long list of elected officials speaking at the DNC, with all due respect*, in the current state of Congress, Democratic Party Representatives and Senators are have some of the LEAST authority and influence of all current elected officials. In fact, I'd say that the mayor of Chillicothe, Ohio RIGHT NOW has more power in America than Former Speaker Nancy Pelosi. And there are a lot of people outside of government today who hold more power than our elected officials. Most of Trump's speakers were absurd disgraces, but Peter Thiel is dangerously powerful. I would suggest that if Clinton & Company with to counter the Thielmonster, they should have speeches from his two most famous partners, Facebook founder Mark Zuckerberg and PayPal founder Elon Musk. Now THAT is how to upstage a Reality TV Star.

*a phrase I almost never use because its common usage means "to give someone LESS respect than they think they deserve".
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I think jscalzi is watching ...

Any of you IANAL types know how a fellow might go about finding a good copyright attorney?
posted by Atom Eyes at 2:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Scalzi will just blame Meredith, so there's no real point...
posted by zachlipton at 2:18 PM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

Whoever the VP pick is hasn't leaked yet, so score one in the campaign discipline column.
posted by billyfleetwood at 2:19 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Still hoping for a longshot John Cena, personally.

(Not really, I just love John Cena.)
posted by stolyarova at 2:22 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Yes, I'm very impressed, but PUT ME OUT OF MY VEEPSTAKES-INDUCED SUSPENSE, CLINTON CAMPAIGN. Setting myself up for disappointment here, I know. It's going to be Kaine and it'll just feel like an anticlimax. (Sorry Kaine, I know you're competent and a good pick.)
posted by yasaman at 2:26 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

I know I'm a little late to the donate discussion (sorry, I was working!), but here's my opinion on it:

Everyone who is able should at least throw Hillary 5 or 10 bucks. This is solely to raise her numbers of individual donors and to make her look good on the national stage. Allows her to promote the enthusiasm and populist narrative. (A narrative Trump in particular is trying to steal.)

In addition to donating to your Governor, State Senators, and Congressional races as suggested, go even further down the ballot:

Democrats/liberals have been getting killed in their state legislative bodies. This is why we've seen states do some truly awful and regressive stuff that is having to be federally challenged. I just looked up most of the "swing" states for 2016 and every single one of their legislative branches was firmly in control of Republicans. A lot of them with 2/3s of the seats.

Even further down, local school boards. These are the people banning books and trying to teach creationism in schools.

Going this far down ballet you may even be able to vote your favourite third party. I know locally we have someone running as an independent social democrat for City Council.

If your district is firmly locked up in your favour, donate to that bedroom community just north of you that has a competitive race - your donation could make the difference.
posted by mayonnaises at 2:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

This is all just a head-fake to lower expectations and then surprise everyone with the announcement that it's Michelle Obama, at which point the nation explodes into an ear-splitting roar that lasts until Election Day, drowning out anything Trump or the stupid media windbags are saying.
posted by tonycpsu at 2:30 PM on July 22, 2016 [22 favorites]

I really wish Clinton accepted Paypal donations.
posted by stolyarova at 2:33 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

This is all just a head-fake to lower expectations and then surprise everyone with the announcement that it's Michelle Obama

Thanks. Your temporary pandering to my hitherto unknown wildest hopes means that even the second coming of Jesus* in a surprising VP run will be a let down.

*nice to see a PoC choice.
posted by jaduncan at 2:33 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

This is all just a head-fake to lower expectations and then surprise everyone with the announcement that it's Michelle Obama, at which point the nation explodes into an ear-splitting roar that lasts until Election Day, drowning out anything Trump or the stupid media windbags are saying.

Now that's 11-dimensional chess I can believe in.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:34 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

stolyarova, can you PayPal a friend and have them donate your money?
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:35 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

This is all just a head-fake to lower expectations and then surprise everyone with the announcement that it's Michelle Obama, at which point the nation explodes into an ear-splitting roar that lasts until Election Day, drowning out anything Trump or the stupid media windbags are saying.

Michelle Obama wakes up from nightmare. Takes a deep breath and exhales. "181 days, only 181 more days."
posted by sallybrown at 2:38 PM on July 22, 2016 [17 favorites]

Good idea, r317. Will look into it.
posted by stolyarova at 2:38 PM on July 22, 2016

I really wish Clinton accepted Paypal donations.
But doesn't a part of every PayPal fee go into Peter Thiel's pocket?
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:38 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

For those looking for good news in the wake of the Nuremberg Rally we all just went through, yet another voter suppression law has been struck down, in Michigan this time.

Are there any anti-voter suppression orgs out there? (Specifically, not just GOTV orgs.) If so, I assume they could use some support to monitor polls and ensure nobody tries to enforce these laws that are being struck down.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

In addition to donating to your Governor, State Senators, and Congressional races as suggested, go even further down the ballot:

And of course it doesn't have to be the elections in your district. Aside from President, basically every office I can vote on this fall is guaranteed to go Democrat. In fact, our Senatorial race will be Democrat vs Democrat, so its literally impossible for any other party to win.

But while my local rep and state reps are also solidly Democratic and will win re-election trivially, there are plenty of swing elections around the country I can donate to (which I plan on getting around to researching... soon).
posted by thefoxgod at 2:43 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

TPM: New Media Guru Clay Shirky Drops 'Stop Trump' Tweetstorm On White Liberals.

A good summary of the "do not be complacent" position.
posted by RedOrGreen at 2:45 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

But doesn't a part of every PayPal fee go into Peter Thiel's pocket?

Sort of? As far as I know he is not affiliated with PayPal in any direct way anymore. But presumably he owns stock in some way (complicated since PayPal was acquired by eBay and then later spun off), so in some vague sense supporting PayPal could help him. I don't use PayPal for lots of other reasons already.
posted by thefoxgod at 2:47 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

If anybody needs a palate cleanser, #MakeAmericaFluffyAgain is trending on Twitter and is super delightful.
posted by stolyarova at 2:49 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

"Something is terribly wrong when a speaker says "Vote your conscience" and gets boooed. I never thought I would say these words, but Ted Cruz was right.: -- HRC, just now.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:50 PM on July 22, 2016 [34 favorites]

A Donald Trump fronted Presidency would #MakeAmericaGrateAgain.
posted by jaduncan at 2:52 PM on July 22, 2016

The opposite of "I alone can fix it" is E Pluribus Unum.
posted by stolyarova at 2:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [27 favorites]

MAKE AMERICA GROUT AGAIN
posted by kirkaracha at 2:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Clinton has a great riff on Trump's "I can fix it alone," comparing it to the teamwork by the police and first responders in Orlando, and then comparing that attitude to King George III.
posted by sallybrown at 2:57 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

"As I recall, we had a revolution to make sure we didn't have someone who said "I can fix it alone!""

NICE.
posted by stolyarova at 2:58 PM on July 22, 2016 [23 favorites]

'kay, my friend's post is going viral on Facebook now, and he's a little overwhelmed. So I'll share it here instead of trying to wheedle him into joining himself (although I have been still wheedling him into joining anyway, so this way if he does his reputation will proceed him). It's on a public Facebook post.

OK, Trump is speaking right now, and has accepted the Republican nomination. Today would have been my dad's 66th birthday. I feel like today is the time to talk of the moment that Trump and my dad crossed paths. Not literally, but for me. Here's the story....
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 2:58 PM on July 22, 2016 [54 favorites]

YESSSS

I couldn't find it on my phone, but there is a Hillary Hoodie, I just decided to order a green Oregon for Hillary shirt also to go with it.
posted by mrzarquon at 2:59 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

and then comparing that attitude to King George III.

missing the da-da-da-da-da response though.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:01 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I have no fear for Clinton's performance at the Convention. She is just on fire in her speeches recently.
posted by sallybrown at 3:02 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Speaking of, she's speaking in Tampa right now, with quotes simulcast to Twitter.
posted by tobascodagama at 3:03 PM on July 22, 2016

"As I recall, we had a revolution to make sure we didn't have someone who said, 'I can fix it alone.'" —Hillary
posted by tobascodagama at 3:03 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I'm not worried about the delayed VP announcement, either. It makes sense to wait as the German situation plays out. Saturday will do fine.
posted by bearwife at 3:04 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

I have no fear for Clinton's performance at the Convention. She is just on fire in her speeches recently.

It's one part righteous fury, one part realizing she no longer has to hold back.
posted by NoxAeternum at 3:04 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Donald Trump’s story is broken
posted by the man of twists and turns at 3:05 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

I mean, she spent the day talking to Pulse survivors. I imagine this is coming from there, and I hope it comes from there all week.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

I really wish the Clinton campaign would get back to me about how to volunteer instead of just constantly asking me for money (which I give, but I'd also like to do something)

You'd probably have better luck contacting your local democratic party headquarters. That's where the actual phone-banks and leafleting takes place from my experience (both things I've done.) But it's also possible that it's simply too early for there to be a real need for volunteers. Most of the real GOTV stuff happens much closer to voting day. But I know my local dems are positively RAVENOUS for more local members. I got on their mailing list after being a local delegate and they called me twice a month to come to meetings until I changed my number.
posted by threeturtles at 3:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

What if Clinton announces Jill Stein as VP? I mean, she won't, but it would be hilarious. I think it's the only possible choice that could troll the BernieBros even harder than Sanders himself. (The worst ones have turned on him since his endorsement anyway.)
posted by tobascodagama at 3:09 PM on July 22, 2016

If she picked Jill Stein I'd laugh, but I'd lose a little respect for the Clinton campaign's strategy machine, too. Stein is a trainwreck.
posted by stolyarova at 3:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

What if Clinton announces Jill Stein as VP? I mean, she won't, but it would be hilarious.

My god Jill Stein must have slipped Hillary the most powerful essential oil remedies known to man!
posted by sallybrown at 3:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [24 favorites]

Tampa stream, for those so inclined. Mix of a lot of optimistic, aspirational stuff with chunks of eye-rolling shade tossed in Trump's general direction.
posted by cortex at 3:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

What if Clinton announces Jill Stein as VP?

Clinton naming Stein as a running mate is about as likely as her naming Ted Cruz---

Wait a minute....

Nah.
posted by dersins at 3:13 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Er, the last two minutes of the Tampa event, that is. Timing!
posted by cortex at 3:14 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Out of curiosity I went to Trump's twitter feed and saw his cover photo. It is like junior grade photoshop, or a cover of a Chuck Tingle novel.
posted by mrzarquon at 3:22 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Texas GOP ‘lifer’ resigns from party over Trump: ‘No redemption in being one of the good Nazis’:

“Thousands of Republican figures that loathe Donald Trump, understand the danger he represents, and privately hope he loses, are publicly declaring their support for him. In Illinois our local and state GOP organizations, faced with a choice, have decided on complicity.”

“Evasion and cowardice has prevailed over conscience. We are now, and shall indefinitely remain, the Party of Donald Trump,” he continued. “I will not contribute my name, my work, or my character to an utterly indefensible cause. No sensible adult demands moral purity from a political party, but conscience is meaningless without constraints.”

posted by palindromic at 3:23 PM on July 22, 2016 [56 favorites]

Trumped in the Butt by Trump.
posted by infinitywaltz at 3:24 PM on July 22, 2016

Is Chuck Tingle a real thing? Are there actual books? I kind of thought he was just a MeFi in-joke.
posted by stolyarova at 3:25 PM on July 22, 2016

Mix of a lot of optimistic, aspirational stuff with chunks of eye-rolling shade tossed in Trump's general direction.

This is the perfect mix to contrast with Trump's doom-and-gloom and I hope this persists through the convention (and campaign).
posted by kirkaracha at 3:27 PM on July 22, 2016

...is everything!
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Trumped in the Butt by the concept of being Trumped in the Butt introduced in my book Trumped in the Butt by Trump
posted by Gaz Errant at 3:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Yeah, her speech writing team is earning their keep being on point just a day after Trump's speech
posted by OHenryPacey at 3:29 PM on July 22, 2016

> Is Chuck Tingle a real thing?

It's ultimately all a joke, but there are real books. He's a parodist/troll.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 3:29 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Anyone on this thread in Seattle? Corb? Because HRC campaign will convention watch next week here:

WHAT: The Comet Tavern Convention Watch Party
WHEN: Thursday, July 28th
05:30 pm - 07:30 pm
WHERE: 922 E Pike St
Seattle, WA 98122
posted by bearwife at 3:32 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

not sure if this deserves its own FPP (previously), but that Virginia voting rights restoration, an executive order by Gov. McAuliffe, was struck down by the VA Supreme Court in a 6-3 decision after VA house speaker and other Republican leaders sued to overturn it.
posted by numaner at 3:36 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

I should add, from the previous FPP, this would add 200,000 African Americans to the voter pool. Obviously now they can't vote in November in a swing state.
posted by numaner at 3:38 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

I've got to say, I don't care who they'd vote for, it always struck me as wrong to disenfranchise felons. Why should punishment continue past the sentence? How does the cause of prison reform progress if those most affected by the problems cannot vote? How much harder is it for an unjust law to change if those who are condemned by it cannot vote for those who might change it?
posted by kyrademon at 3:44 PM on July 22, 2016 [30 favorites]

The article ends with a good note, though:

During a visit to WTOP last month, McAuliffe said if he lost in court, he would issue individual pardons.

“I will sign 206,000 orders. They will have their rights back that day,” he said.

posted by ErisLordFreedom at 3:46 PM on July 22, 2016 [50 favorites]

> Is Chuck Tingle a real thing?

It's ultimately all a joke, but there are real books. He's a parodist/troll.

Not so much.

Chuck Tingle previously on MetaFilter.
posted by soundguy99 at 3:47 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Thank the great Atheismo, ErisLordFreedom I was getting really bummed out.
posted by Tarumba at 3:48 PM on July 22, 2016

I will sign 206,000 orders.

Fewer than twelve thousand felons have registered.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:50 PM on July 22, 2016

“I will sign 206,000 orders. They will have their rights back that day,” he said.

That's ~1908 signatures a day until Nov 8th. I'm sure that's doable... right?
posted by numaner at 3:51 PM on July 22, 2016

Pretty sure they'd have a signature stamp.
posted by R343L at 3:51 PM on July 22, 2016

If he uses a signature stamp and a fleet of interns, sure.
posted by stolyarova at 3:52 PM on July 22, 2016

Surely they don't need to formally request a pardon? Normally governors are too busy to seek out specific convicts to return their rights, but I'd expect it's legal for the governor to find a prisoner, hear the story, and say, "nope, this is wrong; I'm pardoning this person and giving back full citizen rights."

There's that ~2k signatures/day issue, but maybe governors are allowed to use a stamp, or even assign an intern to use a stamp. The issue with signatures isn't that they be done by the actual person, but that the person "signing" is held accountable. Technically, he could drag a pen straight-line across the papers as long as he's willing to say in court, "Yes, I signed that."
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 3:53 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

If you work with a talented assistant, you can sign 150 purchase orders in five minutes.

CITE: my aching wrist.
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

Elected officials use an autopen.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:55 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

There is, however, the matter of approximately 60 hours of printing, if those pardons are one-page affairs, plus however long it takes to set up the mailmerge to get the data into the form letter. Better get on that quick.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 3:55 PM on July 22, 2016

whoa I want an autopen! that thing is neat!
posted by numaner at 3:59 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

McCain Tops Trump in GOP Convention Ratings

That final tally could be called an underwhelming performance from a candidate who prides himself on his ability to draw attention. On Friday morning, for instance, Trump took to Twitter to champion his "Big T.V. ratings!"

For comparison's sake, about 30.3 million viewers across 11 networks tuned in to watch the final night of the 2012 Republican National Convention in Tampa, Florida, when former GOP nominee Mitt Romney delivered his acceptance speech, according to Nielsen. Trump called that event "the single most boring convention I've ever seen" in an April interview with The Washington Post. His own event appears to have eclipsed Romney's by only about 2 million viewers.

Looking at the charts it is remarkable how far the viewership for the last two days of McCain's convention stand out. I wonder how much of that was due to Palin? And as for Romney's event being the single most boring convention, I've got news for Trump. For anyone whose name is not Donald J. Trump this most recent convention was absurdly low energy and filled with gaffes. Trump's speech was so tedious I had to turn it off. In fact that is the figure I would like to see: the number of people who tuned out and turned off during his acceptance speech.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:06 PM on July 22, 2016

Fewer than twelve thousand felons have registered.

Your point?
posted by NoxAeternum at 4:07 PM on July 22, 2016

I love how Clinton's voice lately sounds like that of a grandmother who is having a pretty good time even though she is dealing with major bullshit
posted by angrycat at 4:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

The vulgar talking yam does have the maturity of a toddler. . . . .
posted by soundguy99 at 4:10 PM on July 22, 2016

Have to think the VP announcement isn't going to come until tomorrow at the earliest. Friday night is pretty much the worst time to make any major announcement unless it's a story you don't want anyone to notice.
posted by dry white toast at 4:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

McCain Tops Trump in GOP Convention Ratings

I wouldn't read too much into those numbers--those numbers are viewers on actual TV.

Anyone in this thread watch the thing on actual TV? I know all the convention viewing I did was streaming.
posted by dersins at 4:14 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Why Donald Trump’s convention speech was so frightening

In 1984, one of Ronald Reagan’s more memorable campaign lines invoked “Morning in America.” Trump seems to think it’s two minutes to midnight, and the Doomsday Clock is ticking. His is a calculated political gamble that fear will deliver him the presidency.

Despite pushback Friday from President Barack Obama, who said America is not “on the verge of collapse,” Trump’s message may resonate past the GOP convention. Friday brought a shooting spree in a Munich mall, and with any attack or ambush on American soil, Trump’s rhetoric will ramp up.

At 75 minutes, Trump’s convention speech was the longest by any presidential nominee since 1972. He wasn’t exactly preaching to the choir. Trump secured 1,725 delegates of the 2,472 at stake in the party; at just under 70 percent, that’s the lowest percentage of the delegate total to support the nominee since 1976 and the second-lowest in a century, according to The Washington Post.

He remade the Republican Party by dividing it. And by frightening it. That should scare everyone.

I didn't realize his delegate percentage was so low-- he so often boasts about getting the most votes cast in a primary. Haven't seen him tweet about how he had the second lowest percentage of delegates in a century.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

a story you don't want anyone to notice.

So you're saying it's Vilsack?
posted by dersins at 4:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Eh, I think major party Vice Presidential nominations are pretty much immune to the Friday night news dump effect.
posted by tonycpsu at 4:16 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Yep, Biden was announced on a Friday.
posted by infinitewindow at 4:19 PM on July 22, 2016

Another juicy DNCleaks:

From:MARSHALL@dnc.org
To: MirandaL@dnc.org, PaustenbachM@dnc.org, DaceyA@dnc.org
Date: 2016-05-05 03:31
Subject: No shit

It might may no difference, but for KY and WVA can we get someone to ask his belief. Does he believe in a God. He had skated on saying he has a Jewish heritage. I think I read he is an atheist. This could make several points difference with my peeps. My Southern Baptist peeps would draw a big difference between a Jew and an atheist.

Party boss Brad Marshall provides a weak defence:

“I do not recall this. I can say it would not have been Sanders. It would probably be about a surrogate.”

Probably a lie - sounds like Bernie, and was there any possibly-secular Jewish Bernie surrogate for it to be about?
It's like the cop who says he meant to shoot the harmless autistic guy instead of the harmless Black guy - OK, Marshall, you just wanted to use religious bigotry on some other secular Jew?
Not addressed is that the DNC ain't supposed to be taking sides in the primary in the first place.

posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 4:22 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Russia and Wikileaks have definitely teamed up against Hillary and the DNC. With Bonus Content: thousands of donor CC#s and other personal info. Maybe the timing isn't going to let this take over the news cycle, but it will be totally unsurprising if some lifelong Demo donors suddenly get a Trump Contribution on their AmEx bill.
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:25 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

“Trump clearly laid out a plan:” Wisconsin Republicans react to Donald Trump’s RNC speech

"They wanted to know Donald Trump had a plan and I think the biggest takeaway is Donald Trump clearly laid out a plan for how, as he says it, he's going to make American great again," said [Governor Scott] Walker

"I am not going to let companies move to other countries, firing their employees along the way without consequence -- not going to happen anymore," said Trump.

Critics say Trump failed to explain how he'd carry out his plan.

UW-Milwaukee Professor Mordecai Lee says among average voters that may not matter.

When I saw the headline I was curious to know what plan they are talking about because I didn't hear about any concrete plans. I guess this is one more way I differ from Republicans because a plan is not just an empty promise without details or direction such as, "I am going to bring back millions of jobs and create trillions of dollars and make America rich again." To be honest I don't know why Republican voters who are not in the 1% keep falling for the old VooDoo economics. I guess the Republican voters believe in magic
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:26 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Another juicy DNCleaks:

Keep grinding that axe. I'm sure it'll get sharp enough one of these days.
posted by dersins at 4:31 PM on July 22, 2016 [22 favorites]

This veep text message is turning into a Friday night booty call style situation. Is it going to come at 11:59? The press corps is begging for mercy.
posted by sallybrown at 4:35 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

What the fuck is wikileaks trying to accomplish? I mean I would not feel good if I found myself on the same side as Putin.
posted by Tarumba at 4:36 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Wikileaks is also using their platform to take Twitter to task for booting nero permanently so not sure they care about coherent positions.
posted by R343L at 4:37 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

It seems like it's not just corb that's finally had enough. Here's hoping we see more of this ...
Chris Ladd's resignation letter
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 4:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

So let me get this straight: There is an anti-Hillary book by a former Secret Service Agent on the Best Sellers List. There is an entire anti-Hillary movie out in theaters. Congress has asked the FBI to investigate her for lying under oath. The Russians are out to get her. And come November this woman has to take on the man who will destroy America? Damn it. I don't want to live in a Netflix series.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:41 PM on July 22, 2016 [35 favorites]

that's someone at the DNC saying they should try to discredit bernie based on his jewish heritage.

No it isn't. Read it again. The suggestion is that he is [semi-secretly] an atheist, which would discredit him with Southern Baptists in a way that his Jewishness would not.

It's arguable whether that's any better, but what you suggested is an objectively incorrect reading.
posted by dersins at 4:41 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

I mean, it's Assange's org, so backing another vile misogynist seems pretty consistent?

Probably not germane to this thread, though.
posted by tobascodagama at 4:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

i wouldn't call it "juicy" but i wouldn't call it axe-grinding either - that's someone at the DNC saying they should try to discredit bernie based on his jewish heritage. however you want to slice it, that's pretty gross.

The timeline doesn't make a ton of sense to me. The timestamp on that email is May 5th. Sanders already was asked about his faith at a debate back in March and discussed his faith then (as did Clinton). That discussion about religion was, in fact, one of the most memorable parts of the debate.
posted by zachlipton at 4:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wikileaks is also using their platform to take Twitter to task for booting nero permanently so not sure they care about coherent positions.

Oh come on, like it's any shock Wikileakers are Bernie or Busters.
posted by Pope Guilty at 4:43 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Reading through the news on this, it seems that Assange has a personal vendetta against Hillary. Something beyond her policies. It seems almost petulant, Trumpish.

OR This
I mean, it's Assange's org, so backing another vile misogynist seems pretty consistent?
posted by ThreeCatsBob at 4:43 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

And unless the allegation is that Hillary herself was directly involved in something particularly shady with the DNC, why does it matter what some DNC staffers did? I mean, it might matter in a "we should reform the DNC" sense, but it wouldn't be relevant to the election at this point.

(And even in the ridiculously unlikely situation where Hillary was having explicit meetings with the DNC with the agenda line "Let's Destroy Bernie Sanders", people should vote for her over Donald Fucking Trump anyways...)
posted by thefoxgod at 4:45 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Jeff Zeleny: ".@HillaryClinton vice presidential is coming soon. John Podesta is calling some potential candidates to inform them of decision."

It could still be Warren.
posted by maudlin at 4:47 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Well it does sound like we should reform how the DNC stores unencrypted credit card numbers, but that's not an excuse for publishing them.
posted by zachlipton at 4:48 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I want Warren because she's awesome.

I don't want Warren because it will make her less effective.
posted by emjaybee at 4:49 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

It's Kaine guys. Kaaaaaine.
posted by Justinian at 4:50 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Hasn't she straight-up said she doesn't want it? I don't think she can be pressganged into it.
posted by rifflesby at 4:51 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

This is a reminder that Wikileaks is an alt-right, pro-rape Organization that appears to be bankrolled by Russia. Anything they release should be considered compromised.
posted by Yowser at 4:51 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

Wait - another source that these are NO calls going out. Real VP choice may know already. Dan Merica: "John Podesta is currently making calls to VP candidates/their aides & informing them they have not been selected, per a Dem w knowledge."

So if Warren wasn't contacted earlier, and there has been a flurry of edits on Kaine's Wiki page ...
posted by maudlin at 4:51 PM on July 22, 2016

I want Warren as a cabinet member. And someone good but boring as VP.
posted by gofargogo at 4:52 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Incidentally I am 100% stoked for Al Franken's speech.
posted by rifflesby at 4:52 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

I'm willing to bet it's Kaine based on the wikipedia edits.
posted by joedan at 4:52 PM on July 22, 2016

OMG maybe it's Franken ...
posted by maudlin at 4:53 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

DC's Mayor Muriel Bowser on local tv news tonight defending her efforts to fight crime after DC's murder rate was called out by Trump. She was talking to reporters in front of the Old Post Office Pavilion, which is now a Trump real estate project. It was a serious facepalm moment to see her giving a presser in front of a sign that said TRUMP in ten foot tall letters.
posted by peeedro at 4:53 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

They aren't even telling the "no" people who the pick is - that's a tight ship!
posted by sallybrown at 4:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

GAH! OK, if he's slated for a speech, Franken's not VP. Sad!
posted by maudlin at 4:54 PM on July 22, 2016

"Trump drew an estimated 32.2 million viewers across 10 networks " - I bet twitch.tv wasn't counted as one of them. Neilsen ratings don't measure online streaming viewers; we don't have a remotely accurate measure of how many people were watching the RNC multi-channel miniseries.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 4:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

At this point I just want it to be non-Kaine because the news anchors have been pushing Kaine all day...give me a surprise!
posted by sallybrown at 4:57 PM on July 22, 2016

Neilsen ratings don't measure online streaming viewers; we don't have a remotely accurate measure of how many people were watching the RNC multi-channel miniseries.

The first part is mostly true, the second is less true but you would need to get data from comScore and others and aggregate that. Certainly the streaming providers know (and provide some data on how many viewers a stream had publicly). But there were soooo many different streams it would take a fair amount of work and depends on what data is public.
posted by thefoxgod at 4:58 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Releasing credit card and donor info doesn't exactly win them a lot of credibility or good will. Indeed, if anything, fuck those guys.
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:58 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

I read there were passport numbers also. It's like he's nuking the entire DNC.
posted by ThreeCatsBob at 5:00 PM on July 22, 2016

He's flipping between Sanders and Trump. He doesn't have beliefs yet; he's at that tender time in life that we call the Age of Trolling.

You need to get him a copy of "Illuminatus" before someone hands him a copy of "Atlas Shrugged".
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 5:01 PM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

Yeah, if you go to the site and search for like "Mastercard" you'll see a ton of contribution emails with full donor info. Ugh.
posted by thefoxgod at 5:02 PM on July 22, 2016

It's like he's nuking the entire DNC.

Maybe he's just a huge asshole.
posted by dersins at 5:02 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

And yep, a search for passport reveals passport numbers, etc.
posted by thefoxgod at 5:03 PM on July 22, 2016

And speaking of Chuck Tingle -- he's on the job already.
posted by McCoy Pauley at 5:04 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

Felix Biederman (Twitter's @ByYourLogic) annotates Donald Trump's acceptance speech on Genius. Money quote:

OK, we’re gonna stick a flag in this one. Trump has been more than happy to imply his base is white working class, which has been granted to him by pundits because, among other reasons, they get to blame poor people. It’s just not true. Trump voters do make less than the average Republican voter (Among Republicans, Trump supporters have slightly lower incomes. But what really differentiates them?) but above the median. They have higher levels of education (Trump voters earn more and are better educated than the typical American). I could go on, about how Trump won post-graduate degree holders overall in MA, but you get it. This is fueled by middle class anxiety, not that, as your shithead pundit will tell you, poor people love racism. While I understand how much fun professional lanyard wearers have demeaning poor people whenever they can, they just don’t vote at the rates that higher income holders do (Why Are the Poor and Minorities Less Likely to Vote?). Sorry, I guess you guys can shit on them for something else

posted by Rustic Etruscan at 5:04 PM on July 22, 2016 [20 favorites]

Chris Matthews insight - you don't want a "Debbie Downer type" for VP. Thanks for that.
posted by sallybrown at 5:04 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Assange is trying to do something big enough to own the news cycle, I think, and if so the splashy nature of the data makes sense. Leaked emails as a news story, that's one thing. "Have the DNC lost your credit card and passport number" is quite another.
posted by jaduncan at 5:05 PM on July 22, 2016

Wikileaks WAS a hope for something good before Assange completely took over. On a list of "good movements" gone bad, it's well up in the Top 10 with a bullet... but can it challenge the the French and Russian Revolutions?
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:07 PM on July 22, 2016

New York magazine: "Clinton is expected to appear with her running mate at a rally in Miami on Saturday."
posted by kirkaracha at 5:07 PM on July 22, 2016

Maybe he's just a huge asshole.

Yeah, I've always had deeply mixed emotions about Snowden and Manning (mixed by the "probably never gonna know the truth because the waters have been deliberately muddied" of it all), but Assange seems like a different animal entirely. His "leak everything and make a huge deal out of it" approach doesn't really strike me as an act of conscience. More like a grandstanding asshole who thinks he's got the moral high ground for some reason.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 5:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

KAAAAAAAINE
posted by maudlin at 5:08 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

The rally tomorrow is scheduled for noon Eastern.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:09 PM on July 22, 2016

This has been an utterly exasperating wait for a boring (yet fine) choice most people predicted long ago.
posted by zachlipton at 5:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Wow, Kanye got it.
posted by Servo5678 at 5:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Kaine? What?! SHOCKING. A COMPLETE SURPRISE.
posted by Justinian at 5:11 PM on July 22, 2016

OK, Grey Lady if you're allergic to Twitter.

Hillary Clinton Selects Tim Kaine, a Centrist Senator From a Swing State, as Running Mate
By AMY CHOZICKJULY 22, 2016

Hillary Clinton named Senator Tim Kaine of Virginia to be her running mate Friday, according to a senior campaign official, selecting a battleground state politician with working-class roots and a fluency in Spanish, traits that she believes can bolster her chances to defeat Donald J. Trump in November.

Mrs. Clinton’s choice came after her advisers spent months poring over potential vice-presidential candidates who could lift the Democratic ticket in an unpredictable race against Mr. Trump.

In the end, Mrs. Clinton decided Mr. Kaine, 58, a former governor of Virginia who sits on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and speaks fluent Spanish, had the qualifications and background and the personal chemistry with her to make the ticket a success.

Mrs. Clinton had entertained more daring choices. ...

(Right click the link or Google the headline if you're over your NYT quota this month).
posted by maudlin at 5:11 PM on July 22, 2016

They need William Shatner introducing him with a "KHAAAAN"-like scream.
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:11 PM on July 22, 2016

sigh
posted by sallybrown at 5:12 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

"Donald Trump: I wouldn't accept Ted Cruz's endorsement"

Well, I didn't even want your endorsement anyway Ted! So there!

"At one point in his remarks, Trump even suggested forming his own PAC to oppose Cruz if the senator runs again in four years"

I don't even care! But, also I will destroy you. But I don't care.
posted by thefoxgod at 5:12 PM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

Eh.
posted by tobascodagama at 5:13 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Text says Tim...

Dammit!
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:13 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Clinton's Facebook post
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 5:14 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

From the source: "I'm thrilled to announce my running mate, @TimKaine, a man who's devoted his life to fighting for others. -H"
posted by maudlin at 5:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

that's someone at the DNC saying they should try to discredit bernie based on his jewish heritage.

No. It's not. It's someone saying they could try to discredit based on him being an atheist. The point about "Jewish heritage" is that he's "skated" on it - i.e. used it as a way to avoid talking about being an atheist.
posted by howfar at 5:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Just got the text. Ah, well, she could have done way worse. And y'know: I did vote for him twice with no reservations whatsoever.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

I think Kaine is an interesting match up for Pence in the VP debate. Kaine was certainly more popular in VA than Pence in IN, at least based on my anecdotal exposure to both states.
posted by feloniousmonk at 5:16 PM on July 22, 2016

Keane?

NOT ME!
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:16 PM on July 22, 2016

Huh. Look, I'm like, fairly hooked into politics here in the USA, but I honestly had to google this dude to find out who the hell he was. Is this a good thing? Is he cool?
posted by lazaruslong at 5:16 PM on July 22, 2016

So who's looking forward to the rip-roaring super-super-exciting KAINE-PENCE debate?
posted by waitingtoderail at 5:17 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

The fistbump picture on her Facebook is great.
posted by peeedro at 5:18 PM on July 22, 2016

I've been binge listening to Keepin' It 1600 this last week as an antidote to what I was watching all day, and they mentioned Kaine in last weeks podcast as always being the bridesmaid (considered for Kerry & Obama's VP) and how that was too bad because he is a really great pick and a very good guy.
posted by gofargogo at 5:19 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Lazaruslong, lots of discussion upthread but tl;dr he's safe.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:19 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Is this a good thing? Is he cool?

I think if you're fine with Clinton you'd be fine with Kaine. He's maybe a bit to her right but a Generic Democrat basically.
posted by thefoxgod at 5:19 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Andrea Mitchell: Clinton had binders, binders of candidates.
posted by nathan_teske at 5:20 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Works for me.
posted by lazaruslong at 5:20 PM on July 22, 2016

Tim Kaine is a Spanish speaking version of Joe Biden without the plagiarism and Anita Hill disgrace.
posted by one_bean at 5:20 PM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Well, I'm hoping she puts Tom Perez in as Attorney General...
posted by sallybrown at 5:21 PM on July 22, 2016

You need to get him a copy of "Illuminatus" before someone hands him a copy of "Atlas Shrugged".

... wow. I just realized that I did, in fact, read them in that order. And while I found a lot of useful lessons in Rand, they didn't manage to override the joyful absurdity that I'd already picked up from other places, which meant it was easy to spot the gaps in her plan. (It took me many, many years to figure out that there were people who thought Atlas Shrugged was a plan, rather than intriguing science fiction with some interesting philosophies bouncing around.)
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:22 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Most of the stuff I've seen from the Wikileaks dump is pretty weak - the party doesn't like it when MSNBC challenges their narrative, DWS and others didn't really like Bernie (duh), etc. - but the emails about damaging Bernie by bringing up his religion are fucking gross.

To me it doesn't seem all that different from leaking the photo of Obama in traditional indonesian dress at the same time there were rumors about him secretly being a Muslim, which was shitty 8 years ago, just like this is shitty now. Only that time, it was coming from his opponent's campaign, not the DNC itself.

Keep grinding that axe. I'm sure it'll get sharp enough one of these days.

Kind of hard to parse this cute response - do you think it's appropriate for DNC employees to plot about ways to scare Kentucky and West Virginia primary voters away from one of the Democratic candidates using a whisper campaign about his religious beliefs?

This is a reminder that Wikileaks is an alt-right, pro-rape Organization that appears to be bankrolled by Russia. Anything they release should be considered compromised.

Well, whatever the personal politics of the people who run Wikileaks (or their Twitter account), everybody involved seems to agree the leak is legit. If it weren't, the people involved could just say so, which they haven't. And they're actively saying that the donor credit card numbers/SSNs/etc. are real.

Even shady-ass Marshall's response wasn't "that email is fake," it was "I don't recall and/or I was saying a surrogate might be a secret Jew atheist, not Sanders, which is better because of reasons"
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 5:22 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

A sensible if not thrilling choice. He is smart and nice and very qualified. Just wish he wasn't also white CIS Xian and male.
posted by bearwife at 5:22 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

Personally, I'm only disappointed that it's a white dude and not a POC and/or another woman. As far as Kaine himself, I have nothing against the guy.
posted by threeturtles at 5:24 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Tim Kaine is a Spanish speaking version of Joe Biden without the plagiarism and Anita Hill disgrace.

Right. If you are fine with Joe Biden, you should be more than fine with Tim Kaine.
posted by Justinian at 5:24 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

This is a reminder that Wikileaks is an alt-right, pro-rape Organization that appears to be bankrolled by Russia. Anything they release should be considered compromised.

WIKILEAKS ARE LYING LIARS WHO ARE COMPLETELY MAKING THIS UP

ALSO, HOW DARE THEY RELEASE DONOR INFO
posted by indubitable at 5:25 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

I'm really wondering if Clinton's short list of braver choices (read: people of color) came up with vulnerabilities during the vetting process that they're not gonna tell the public about. And I totally agree about Warren being more valuable where she is. The optics would've been great, I'd be absolutely behind it, but once the election is over it would be kind of a waste.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 5:25 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

He was floated as Obama's pick in '08, so it's not like he has hasn't been in the national spotlight, at least amongst people who follow these sorta things.

I think he's a fine pick. And everyone who is going to react negatively has already been doing so for the last couple days. It'll blow over soon.
posted by defenestration at 5:25 PM on July 22, 2016

Kaine was the obvious choice. No big negatives, speaks fluent Spanish, and is from Virginia (a state Trump almost certainly cannot win without).
posted by Justinian at 5:26 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

Very smooth rollout - you can buy Clinton Kaine merchandise immediately.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 5:26 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

And as I said upthread, there is literally not a single pick Clinton could have made that wouldn't have recieved a negative response. Not a single one.
posted by defenestration at 5:27 PM on July 22, 2016 [16 favorites]

NyMag link

But the senator's greatest liability may be his relationship to the party's grassroots left. Kaine has alienated advocates for reproductive choice by promoting abstinence-focused education and laws making parental consent a prerequisite for abortion access. He's frustrated environmentalists by supporting offshore drilling in the Atlantic and expanding construction of natural-gas terminals (that said, the rest of his environmental record is fairly strong and includes opposition to the Keystone XL pipeline and support for the Clean Power Plan). And he bucked the will of most Senate Democrats — including progressive leaders Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders — by voting to give the White House fast-track authority to negotiate the Trans-Pacific Partnership. (The senator has not taken an official position on the final draft of the deal).*

This week, Kaine provided left Democrats with two fresh reasons to see his selection as a repudiation of their agenda. On Monday, the senator added his name to two letters urging the federal government to scale back regulations on community and regional banks.

In a letter co-signed by 15 other Senate Democrats — and every Senate Republican — Kaine asked the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau to exempt community banks and credit unions from many of its regulatory requirements. In justifying these exemptions, the letter suggests that these regulations would make it more difficult for these small banks to continue "spurring economic growth" and that such rules are unnecessary, anyhow, since community banks "were not the primary cause of the financial crisis."
posted by yertledaturtle at 5:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Zoids! The text message assured me I'd be the first to know and here you all are discussing Kaine. So betrayed.
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

The current banner image of hillaryclinton.com is Clinton and Kaine sharing a stage somewhere. It's been changed now to a convention shot but the previous banner image for donaldjtrump.com was a weirdly photoshopped composite of Trump and Pence together. They probably could have posed somewhere or something but I guess they didn't.
posted by mhum at 5:29 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

But would I ever find Tim Kaine shirtless on the White House driveway, washing a Trans Am?
posted by ckape at 5:29 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

fun fact: text messages for events like these usually arrive slower than broadband stuff, like emails and FB notifications, even if they were all pressed "sent" at once
posted by numaner at 5:30 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

ALSO, HOW DARE THEY RELEASE DONOR INFO

Well, yes. Releasing people's credit card numbers, SSNs, and passport numbers is an incredibly shitty thing to do. Is there a reason not to be outraged about that?
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:31 PM on July 22, 2016 [30 favorites]

a weirdly photoshopped composite of Trump and Pence together

Clinton's campaign definitely has the social media stuff way more prepared than they did.
posted by numaner at 5:32 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Kaine? We're fucked. Castro or Booker or even Warren, we'd steamroll in November. This is the horeseshit the DNC keeps screwing us over with in the midterms. DIVERSITY GETS PEOPLE TO THE POLLS. Kaine is too white, too male and too old - his demographic is voting Trump regardless of whatever the hell the Dems do.

I mean, I suppose we could rely on Trump fucking up... but this was a sure thing now turned into a maybe thing.
posted by Slap*Happy at 5:33 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Is it too late for Trump to pick Kane? Watch your back, Pence!
posted by box at 5:33 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Kaine? We're fucked.

o_o

I guess defenstration is right. No matter how boring your pick, people will say it is a disaster.
posted by Justinian at 5:36 PM on July 22, 2016 [41 favorites]

Welp. An underwhelming, milquetoast party loyal who is friendly to Wall Street and loves free trade and the NAFTA disaster. I really get the sense the Dems have no idea what's going on to make Trump appealing to so many: lower and especially middle class whites have had the bottom drop out from under them, economically, so they're primed to look to someone like him confirming their anxieties. He just has to continue preying on their suspicions and prejudices, and he can take the presidency. And for all the BS, Trump is smart enough to absolutely CRUSH Clinton and Kaine on Wall Street and free trade - two sources of lower and middle class anger that can be powerfully stoked - and simultaneously raise valid points on the perpetually destabilizing mess unfolding overseas that he will rake them over the coals over. He doesn't have much to show for any of this himself, mind you, but he knows to pounce on their weak points and the failures of their neoliberalism to provide answers to people (this is also why he mentioned Sanders twice in his speech - he's perceptive enough to understand the anger and financial instability fueling both sides of the political spectrum). This is all pretty serious, and it's going to play out over the next few months like a horrorshow. Kaine just seems like another nail in the coffin from this angle.

The safe, reliable pick is a disastrous one and it doesn't seem like the party has grasped that at all.
posted by naju at 5:37 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

Kaine? We're fucked.

Do we have to do this for the next three and a half months?

this was a sure thing now turned into a maybe thing.

It was never a sure thing.
posted by howfar at 5:37 PM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

Lol what. There's 0 evidence that VP picks matter to the degree that it could turn a "sure thing" into a "maybe thing", especially in a year where you're talking about Clinton v Trump. There are a million other things that matter more.
posted by thefoxgod at 5:37 PM on July 22, 2016 [34 favorites]

Well, yes. Releasing people's credit card numbers, SSNs, and passport numbers is an incredibly shitty thing to do. Is there a reason not to be outraged about that?

Because it's obviously made up, so no big deal right?
posted by indubitable at 5:37 PM on July 22, 2016

The Veep pick has been proven to not make much difference in most elections, so the main criteria is competence/won't embarrass the Prez. Kaine is fine on that. Plenty of Cabinet seats that I have hopes will be filled by women/POC.
posted by emjaybee at 5:38 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

What are you even talking about?
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:39 PM on July 22, 2016

Kaine? We're fucked.

please don't do this
posted by murphy slaw at 5:39 PM on July 22, 2016 [41 favorites]

She had a tough race with a leftist and she picks right of center running mate?
posted by yertledaturtle at 5:39 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

If people are voting for Trump based on being anti-free-trade, I can't imagine they'd say "Well, I disagree with Clinton on free trade but her [insert-anti-free-trade-VP] pick made me change my mind! After all, the VP is in charge of trade policy, right?"
posted by thefoxgod at 5:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

What are you even talking about?

Go back and read my comment that you selectively quoted.
posted by indubitable at 5:40 PM on July 22, 2016

Just got the text. They're right--I'm one of the first to know :|
posted by box at 5:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Kaine seems to be a fine choice but some folks are never going to be happy.
posted by octothorpe at 5:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Huh. Pence is 57, Kaine is 58. They're both white guys with white hair. They have similar sounding names. I can imagine people not paying close attention could get them mixed up.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:40 PM on July 22, 2016

Is it too late for Trump to pick Kane? Watch your back, Pence!

Well he did rip off Undertaker's entrance this week so it's a possibility.
posted by sporkwort at 5:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

DIVERSITY GETS PEOPLE TO THE POLLS.

Clinton is a woman. That's the largest group that can claim to be adding diversity.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [25 favorites]

Here's a question about the email leaks: The sheer volume of emails lends credence to their veracity, right? Who would spend months writing nineteen thousand emails?

But.

That volume only vouches for the likelihood that a huge volume of those emails are real. Individual emails? Well, who knows?

So what are the odds that a technically savvy ratfucker with access to huge archive of emails and a political agenda could resist the temptation to insert some emails that say what the ratfucker wants the authors of the email archive to have said? How can we believe that any individual email from the leak is real, and not the creation of the leakers?
posted by Pope Guilty at 5:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Good choice. Very loyal to Clinton with no major downsides and some decent upside. Boring VP is fine, like Biden as everybody is saying.

I don't know how the hell Pence is supposed to debate well when he is saddled with all the indefensible shit Trump has said.
posted by Drinky Die at 5:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Clinton is a woman. That's the largest group that can claim to be adding diversity.

Exactly. Do people think Obama made a mistake picking a white guy too? Because somehow that wasn't enough diversity? And he was even running against the one non-double-white-guy GOP ticket.
posted by thefoxgod at 5:44 PM on July 22, 2016 [22 favorites]

He's qualified and dull. I don't think he's going to make a difference either way.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 5:45 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

How can we believe that any individual email from the leak is real, and not the creation of the leakers?

The Gonzales-esque "I do not recall" non-denial from Marshall is a good start.
posted by indubitable at 5:45 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I mean, I would have totally been down for a POC on the ticket, but I don't buy that it will make a difference in the outcome (which arguably would have been a reason to do it, if it wouldn't affect the outcome then its a nice thing to do, but its not going to cost her the election).
posted by thefoxgod at 5:46 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

How can we believe that any individual email from the leak is real, and not the creation of the leakers?

When The Intercept Underscore gets in touch with the purported author of the individual email and that author's response implies it is legit.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 5:46 PM on July 22, 2016

The sky is apalling.
posted by defenestration at 5:46 PM on July 22, 2016

Go back and read my comment that you selectively quoted.

Oh, I see now. You were responding to several different comments by several different people as if they were all said by the same person. Carry on.
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:49 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

I just did a lookup of events near my zip code on Clinton's website are there are hundreds listed and I can't find any such listing on Trump's site. She's just going to organize circles around him.
posted by octothorpe at 5:50 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

For me, its time to run. When you play pickup ball you got the guys that were waiting to play next. You got your squad, you get on the court, and you play the other team. There's no whining, no complaining. If their players are taller, then youre faster. If they have a great team and you have one good player you can still win playing team ball. I've been on teams where a guy had one skill. Couldnt dribble worth anything, couldnt guard a sloth. But we won. Now you now who your team is and what your strengths are. The game has begun. Time to go win.
posted by cashman at 5:51 PM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

Watching his video appearances, since honestly this is the first I've really thought of Kaine:

If Trump is the big tent end of days apocalypse preacher, Kaine is the calming respected highschool principal. He is boring, but his voice is the right one to hear after you've been told to fear your neighbor. I'd love to see him debate Pence.

If TrumPence is End of days is Nigh, standing on a soapbox and with a bucket on your head and everything; Clinton Kaine is "things are getting better, but when things are tough, we can get through this, remember what how far we've come?"
posted by mrzarquon at 5:52 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

Tim Kaine's grades from various interest groups:

Planned Parenthood: 100% (0% from pro-life groups)
Defenders of Wildlife: 91%
NRA: 7% (Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence: 100%)
ACLU: 75% in 2015, 93% in 2014

He's not exactly a conservative.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 5:52 PM on July 22, 2016 [67 favorites]

I was going to start arguing Kaine/not-Kaine but then I hit page up for too long and got to the part in the thread where the republicans nominated a fascist
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:53 PM on July 22, 2016 [35 favorites]

He's qualified and dull. I don't think he's going to make a difference either way.

He's also from Virginia and speaks fluent Spanish, both of which should be pluses.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:53 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

unsurprisingly, twitter is a shitstorm of leftists proclaiming total equivalence between a center-left ticket and the closest thing we've had to Il Duce in living memory
posted by murphy slaw at 5:53 PM on July 22, 2016 [31 favorites]

Yeah the usual suspects are usually suspect. This is not exception.

Guy with a 100% Planned Parenthood rating and 7% rating from the NRA = TRUMP LITE. Sigh.
posted by Justinian at 5:58 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

Franken would've been so rad, tho.
posted by saul wright at 5:59 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

For me, its time to run. When you play pickup ball you got the guys that were waiting to play next. You got your squad, you get on the court, and you play the other team. There's no whining, no complaining. If their players are taller, then youre faster. If they have a great team and you have one good player you can still win playing team ball. I've been on teams where a guy had one skill. Couldnt dribble worth anything, couldnt guard a sloth. But we won. Now you now who your team is and what your strengths are. The game has begun. Time to go win.

I'm having flashbacks to Fran Tarkenton speaking last night.
posted by howfar at 5:59 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Last I checked, it was possible to dislike Tim Kaine as a VP pick without being a Trump supporter?
posted by tobascodagama at 6:00 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

Castro or Booker or even Warren, we'd steamroll in November

Castro: currently under investigation for violating the Hatch Act, how's that going to help the "Crooked Hillary" narrative?
Booker: extremely tight with Wall Street and education privatization, from New Jersey
Warren: can only tell you so many times she doesn't want the fucking job, is a powerful force in the Senate, MA Dem Party has a horrible track record in the last several elections

Now, I would have chosen Perez myself, but I can only assume there's something disqualifying there. And, of course, Maryland isn't exactly a swing state.
posted by zombieflanders at 6:01 PM on July 22, 2016 [23 favorites]

I mean, obviously this is sacrilege, but I wasn't that excited when Obama picked Biden, either. Yet I somehow still avoided voting for McCain.
posted by tobascodagama at 6:01 PM on July 22, 2016 [26 favorites]

This is not directed to anyone in this thread, but more the media/Twitter that's been hyping this quality of Kaine's - it seems unlikely to me that Latino/Latina/Hispanic Americans will care particularly that the white guy picked for VP speaks fluent Spanish. It's certainly a plus, but it's nowhere near the level of excitement that a Hispanic-American VP candidate would have brought. And the way some people have been talking about it ("The rally is in Miami so Kaine can SPEAK SPANISH TO THEM") just feels kind of gross.
posted by sallybrown at 6:02 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

a shitstorm of leftists proclaiming total equivalence between a center-left ticket and the closest thing we've had to Il Duce in living memory

Ahaha, speaking of equivalence. These people want Trump to lose. They're mad that the Dems keep throwing wrenches in that goal.
posted by naju at 6:02 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

I kind of like the image, first with Obama & Biden and now with Clinton & Kaine, of the competent minority/woman lead with a supportive white male sidekick. They subvert the usual media trope by example, *in real life*.
posted by cdefgfeadgagfe at 6:02 PM on July 22, 2016 [16 favorites]

He's also from Virginia and speaks fluent Spanish, both of which should be pluses.

Yeah. Given amount of bullshit that Trump is going to try to pull with the Hispanic community during this campaign (because he basically can't win if he can't con at least some of them, as far as I can see) I think that a Spanish speaking VP pick is a more significant tactical advantage than in most elections.
posted by howfar at 6:02 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Kaine will help lock in Virginia and quite possibly North Carolina which definitely puts Trump on the defensive.

If Pence was designed to help Trump in the Midwest (Indiana is safely Republic baring an epic blowout) then Kaine is designed to help Clinton in the Mid-Atlantic coast. I also probably won't hurt in regards to the Roman Catholic voters in Florida.

Keep in mind that even if Clinton loses in Ohio (and maybe even Pennsylvania - which would be extremely unlikely based upon present polling and past tendencies) she can basically negate that loss with Virginia and NC.

Kaine isn't a stellar pick but most evidence is that even good VP picks have only marginal impacts in modern elections. The people at the top of the ticket are what matters.
posted by vuron at 6:03 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I've said before that I have no problem with Kaine being VP. However, this really makes me wonder about Planned Parenthood:

*Tim Kaine's grades from various interest groups:

Planned Parenthood: 100% (0% from pro-life groups)

Given this:

*Kaine has alienated advocates for reproductive choice by promoting abstinence-focused education and laws making parental consent a prerequisite for abortion access.

100%? Really? Not maybe 90% or 95%? Or less?
posted by indubitable at 6:05 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

Exciting VP picks are where you go if you think you're going to lose; see Palin, Sarah. Boring not particularly noteworthy picks are where you go if you think you're going to win. That Clinton picked Kaine is a sign that they are confident, which reassures me.

If she had picked Castro or Booker I'd be sweating bullets. Not because they are bad but because it meant the Clinton internal polling was not looking all that great.
posted by Justinian at 6:06 PM on July 22, 2016 [25 favorites]

Yeah, Clinton should have picked someone to the far Left to face the crazy man causing millions of centrists Republicans to leave the party. Because we know the far Left can't be beaten in an election. These genius Twitter political strategists are thinking so far ahead you can't even keep up.
posted by bongo_x at 6:06 PM on July 22, 2016 [41 favorites]

Kaine seems like a nice guy. Really. He has a gentle, Jesuitical quality. He's worked hard, uphill and down, and done well in a lot of different settings. Unless you're bent on purity, he's clearly a mainstream Democrat. My feeling is if that they win we'll look on him with great fondness, as we do Biden.
posted by argybarg at 6:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [14 favorites]

Kaine is somebody I'd be comfortable with as president. Don't get me wrong, the only politician I'm currently excited about is Warren, but Kaine seems like a steady, consistent democrat who strongly leans progressive. I'd take that any day of the week over shadow-VP Pence.
posted by Joey Michaels at 6:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [14 favorites]

You can see Planned Parenthood's analysis of Kaine's votes here.
posted by Justinian at 6:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

There's plenty of time for people to vote for the Dem ticket in November. This news JUST came out - surely we can have a minute of disappointment before moving on?

Trump has been running with a rigged-system, anti-big banks, anti-trade agreement narrative for some time now, the GOP added a platform plank to revive Glass-Steagall, etc., and the next day the Democrats announce a VP that's pro-TPP and against mild bank regulations to avoid systemic risk. Not a good look.

Not to mention, wasn't everyone here up in arms literally one month ago about Sanders supporting Marcy Kaptur because she opposed stem cell research and partial birth abortions? Kaine says he doesn't think his personal pro-life views have any place in policy decisions but coincidentally he also opposed those exact same issues. Ran on a partial-birth abortion ban in 2005.

Plus yes, like people have said, boring mayo white man.

Grumble grumble, okay, it's out of my system. Now go fucking destroy Trump and Pence and win in November.
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:08 PM on July 22, 2016 [20 favorites]

I looked at YouTube, my #1 resource for speechifying, to find out how Kaine is likely to face off against Pence in debates. I've decided I like Kaine.

Kaine speaks at colleges in low-tech, low-ego settings, and explains government to kids in plain language, enough so they get a hint of how complex it is and also how the issues are relevant to them personally - without pushing his specific agenda on them.

He can do the Politician Speaks To Press schtick and get his message across without being hateful. In both of those, he talks about the importance of collaboration, of working with people to accomplish things.

He gave an immigration speech in Spanish in the Senate - my Spanish is not strong enough to follow what he's saying (families are important; talented workers; nation something history... I can catch buzzwords but not meaning) but I can tell he's speaking respectfully about people who are in the US without citizenship.

He smiles. He talks to connect with his audience. He's obviously aware that he's being soundbited, and making sure that he at least hints at the complexity of an issue before stating where he stands on it. A quick look at his record says he's not radical enough to be my first choice, but hell, Bernie was barely radical enough to be my first choice. He's been a lawyer, mayor, governor, and senator - he knows how to work with people at all levels of government.

He's got my firm "Not A Disaster; Might Even Be A Great Choice" evaluation.

On the flip side, I went looking for videos of Pence. Then I went looking for videos of Pence that predate this week. Then I went looking for videos of Pence that predate Trump's announcement of him as VP choice.

Someone let me know if you find any, mmkay?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 6:08 PM on July 22, 2016 [37 favorites]

That Clinton picked Kaine is a sign that they are confident, which reassures me.

Anyone being confident right now scares the shit out of me, frankly.
posted by naju at 6:09 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

wasn't everyone here up in arms

Almost certainly not? Clearly there is nothing everyone here agrees on (except that Trump is bad, I guess, I haven't seen a single pro-Trump person in a long time).

I admit I'm probably more pro-Kaine since I'm more of a DNC/centrist at heart (I'm pro-TPP myself, but happily voting for Clinton even though she is against it).
posted by thefoxgod at 6:09 PM on July 22, 2016

Kaine has alienated advocates for reproductive choice by promoting abstinence-focused education and laws making parental consent a prerequisite for abortion access.

Kaine actually cut off funding for abstinence-only education as governor.
posted by zombieflanders at 6:10 PM on July 22, 2016 [32 favorites]

I'm pro-TPP myself, but happily voting for Clinton even though she is against it

I've got some good news for you!
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Right, he has made a few comments which people point to but his actual voting and administrative record is impeccable on abortion.
posted by Justinian at 6:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [17 favorites]

For perspective: Seth Meyers on the other VP candidate
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Ahaha, speaking of equivalence. These people want Trump to lose. They're mad that the Dems keep throwing wrenches in that goal.

i'm not talking about the people who are expressing disappointment. i'm not jumping for joy myself.

i'm talking about the people who are proclaiming that this choice means that this election now doesn't matter.

anyway, twitters gonna twit.
posted by murphy slaw at 6:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

Eh, I must be following vastly different people, because I haven't seen a single person say the election now doesn't matter. *shrug*
posted by naju at 6:14 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Ahaha, speaking of equivalence. These people want Trump to lose. They're mad that the Dems keep throwing wrenches in that goal.

My frustration with this assumption is that you're more likely to win national elections by going further left.

The fact of the matter is that while a Latino or black candidate might have brought more Latino or black people out to vote for the Democrats, it may just as easily have brought more racists out to vote for the Republicans.

We can debate which is the more likely scenario all we like, but I have a hunch that the people whose entire careers are about winning elections are also not not idiots and have researched both possibilities.
posted by pocketfullofrye at 6:14 PM on July 22, 2016 [14 favorites]

If people are looking for a party to make bold statements, but not actually win elections or, you know, ever do anything except make bold statements and then feel good about fighting the good fight, there are a lot to choose from.

I'm looking for competent people to govern, not send a message to all those assholes who are so wrong. I can do that.
posted by bongo_x at 6:14 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

...and the next day the Democrats announce a VP that's pro-TPP and against mild bank regulations to avoid systemic risk. Not a good look.

There's also plenty of time for us to understand Kaine's actual record before having a knee jerk negative reaction. Kaine voted for fast track negotiations on TPP, something every president gets on every international trade deal. He has not said he supports TPP, and has expressed reservations about it in its current form.

He has requested that the FEC relax some regulations on regional banks like your local credit union so that (1) credit unions and other regional banks can be more competitive and (2) the FEC doesn't have to spend resources making sure regional banks aren't too big to fail (since we know they aren't) and can spend more time policing the big ones. It's fine to oppose that, but let's not conflate it with being in bed with Wall Street.
posted by one_bean at 6:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Kaine is fundamentally a do no harm pick. Witness the fact that it was scheduled for Friday. Helps end the Republican circle jerk.

This is the sort of pick that is made by a team that is quietly confident of their chances for November. He's not a game changer because frankly Clinton is already the game changer and this is a olive branch to those moderate Republicans that are afraid of Trump but uncertain of a female hand on the tiller without a calm male presence backing her up.

Yeah fundamentally there is something kind of disquieting about how the conventional wisdom seeks to moderate the other (Obama as a Black Male, Clinton as a White Female) with something bland but predictable like a good old-fashioned white male.

The Clinton campaign could probably create a chance for a bigger win with another female or a minority VP but she doesn't need to take any risks because 270 is enough and you don't get extra points for running up the score.
posted by vuron at 6:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [14 favorites]

Eh, I must be following vastly different people, because I haven't seen a single person say the election now doesn't matter. *shrug*

Everybody's following vastly different people from everybody else, which I assume is why the mods periodically encourage people not to bring in quotes from the looniest people they've seen on Facebook, Twitter, Reddit, whatever, but people are determined to keep doing it anyway
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:18 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

but she doesn't need to take any risks because 270 is enough and you don't get extra points for running up the score.

right, Kaine is a way to hedge the downside not increase the upside. Clinton's team has clearly concluded that her ceiling is already higher than Trump's.
posted by Justinian at 6:18 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Cecile Richards (President of Planned Parenthood) is on Maddow and says she is very enthusiastic about Kaine as the pick and that this is the strongest ticket we've ever had on reproductive rights, fwiw.
posted by Justinian at 6:20 PM on July 22, 2016 [36 favorites]

Cory Booker and Elizabeth Warren are both Senators in states with Republican Governors. Doesn't that mean the Governor gets to choose the replacement or does that rule differ by state? If the senate ends up being close, which Democrat wants a Christie appointment in there for three years?
posted by Gary at 6:22 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

From an election-prediction standpoint, it's a pretty big thing that Kaine is well-liked in Virginia. Virginia already looked pretty good for the Democrats, but this is a good safety play to push it further into their corner. Assuming that the non-battleground states go the way they usually do (a reasonable assumption most years, but 2016 is so weird), Trump has very few ways to win without Virginia. He has to get, like, Florida and Pennsylvania and Ohio and not slip up anywhere where he's favored. Those are OK odds. Not the definitive certainty of a trouncing which would keep me from waking up in terror every night for the next 4 months, but definitely good enough that the wailing and gnashing of teeth is very misplaced.
posted by jackbishop at 6:22 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

It feels as if the Democrats are playing the VP as the balance to a strong narratives against a candidate:

Obama was black and and inexperienced in foreign politics and the senate, Biden is the white guy who knows everything about DC and statesmanship.

Hillary is a woman who is a liar and a woman, Kaine is a humble honest catholic white Man (can’t not emphasize the Man part, unfortunately, which sucks)

It is all about theatrics at this point with the Dem VP, who is the person that the undecided centrist leaning republicans can feel more comfortable with, the conservative christians. Hillary may be a crook, but Kaine well keep her from going ‘crazy’ with power and kill all the babies now.

The scarier thing is Trump is pretty much giving Pence the whitehouse to run as his own, since he just wants the title. And I assume is expecting he’ll be able to spend most of his nights in Trump Tower once he gets elected.

I just really hope Kaine likes ice cream as much as Biden does. Maybe its a mid atlantic thing.
posted by mrzarquon at 6:23 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

I barely know who Kaine is. I know who Clinton is. I'm sure she picked someone she thinks works well for her. She's been doing this a while and knows something about it. If she can't be trusted with this then shouldn't get my vote (McCain). I don't see anything so far that says she made an egregious mistake. I think I'll trust her on this.
posted by bongo_x at 6:24 PM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Everybody's following vastly different people from everybody else, which I assume is why the mods periodically encourage people not to bring in quotes from the looniest people they've seen on Facebook, Twitter, Reddit, whatever, but people are determined to keep doing it anyway

this is 100% correct and i've flagged my comments as derail. sorry folks.
posted by murphy slaw at 6:25 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Trump has very few ways to win without Virginia. He has to get, like, Florida and Pennsylvania and Ohio and not slip up anywhere where he's favored.

This is the only map I can see that gets him there.

(all of the red states + one of [CO, NV].)
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:26 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Anyone being confident right now scares the shit out of me, frankly.

There is a difference between confident and arrogant.

Clinton is a Democrat running against a fucking loon who just got through four days of throwing raw red meat at the people who were voting for him already. She doesn't _need_ a risk-taking Veep choice. This isn't the time to look at poll numbers and say "fuck it, let's pick some fringe fruitloop and roll the dice, you betcha." Competent, quiet and steady will do nicely.

Trump is not pulling Pennsylvania unless Clinton blows up a bus of orphans on live TV or Muslim Mexican homosexual activists blow up half of Pittsburgh in October.
posted by delfin at 6:27 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

So what's the line on the Fictional Tim Kaine persona ala Diamond Joe Biden?

I'm going for a secret judo master in a latter day Steven Seagal mode.
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

I was still holding out hope that it would actually be Biden.
posted by VTX at 6:28 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

i legit love the rainbow rave effect that Kaine's tie is doing in that spanish-language speech. If I were on TV regularly I'd wear a whole outfit made of it.
posted by you're a kitty! at 6:29 PM on July 22, 2016

Trump is not pulling Pennsylvania unless Clinton blows up a bus of orphans on live TV or Muslim Mexican homosexual activists blow up half of Pittsburgh in October.

Please don't give him any ideas. If this happens I'll be giving you a stern look.
posted by bongo_x at 6:29 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

because 270 is enough and you don't get extra points for running up the score.

Eh. Down ticket candidates may disagree there.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:30 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

Yeah Clinton is clearly playing a solid 3rd quarter defensive strategy with a solid 2 touchdown lead. There is a lot of football left to play but the name of the game right now is to run down the clock with long slow drives on offense while playing solidly on defense.

Be willing to give up some yardage against the run game but avoid giving Trump any substantial momentum.

The DNC will negate any Trump polling bump (which frankly I haven't seen any real evidence of) and let's be perfectly honest Pence did absolutely nothing for Trump. Hell Cruz plunging the knife into his back might've been the biggest long term impact of the RNC. You are already seeing more and more people giving cover to Republican voters to abstain or "vote their conscience".

Clinton knows she has the headwind and while she can't go completely passive with a prevent defense the major part of her game with be about being absolutely flawless in avoiding gaffes and then pouncing on the inevitable Trump fuckups.

Because that's the other key factor. Clinton isn't running against an experienced politician, Trump is someone who disdains expert advice and is completely willing to call audibles. Yeah it can result in some potential for Brett Farve style comebacks but let's be honest Brett Farve also produced a ton of losses while also having some epic 4th quarter comebacks.

And I don't think Trump is anywhere near as talented as Farve was as a QB.
posted by vuron at 6:30 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Yeah, Kaine is fine. He's more centrist, which is appropriate for the general and for the VP. Don't forget that the point is for Clinton to win, not for Clinton's ticket to get covered in everyone's joy juice.
posted by OmieWise at 6:31 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

DIVERSITY GETS PEOPLE TO THE POLLS.

Shouty-shouty. You really think women / PoC need additional reasons to show up?

Virginia's become a bellwether. It's Appalachia and it's also Fairfax County, one of the most diverse parts of the US. If Virginia gets locked down, it removes a lot of options on the other side to get to 270. And NC is a tie right now that Trump will have to spend time and energy contesting, given how the state legislature and governor have given those on the left plenty of reason to show up.
posted by holgate at 6:31 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

Fictional Tim Kaine wears a cardigan and is a bit of a Mister Rogers type. Probably not funny, but neither is fictional Obama.
posted by argybarg at 6:31 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Jennifer Granholm just tweeted:

.@timkaine is as decent, honorable, selfless soul as you will ever meet. A man with the heart of a servant, who is "woke". @HillaryClinton

that's...not...no
posted by sallybrown at 6:32 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

in that spanish-language speech

What's our consensus on Kaine's Spanish? To my ear his accent is decent -- better than most white politicians -- but he seems to be reading the words like he doesn't know what they mean.

I mean I understand that he's known to be fluent, I just think his phrasing seems off -- pauses and emphasis in the wrong places.
posted by pocketfullofrye at 6:32 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Fictional Tim Kaine is exactly like actual Tim Kaine, just with a mustache.
posted by fedward at 6:34 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Cory Booker tweeted:

KAINE IS ABLE!!!

lol
posted by sallybrown at 6:34 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

Y'all. #YesWeKaine
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:35 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

I mean I understand that he's known to be fluent, I just think his phrasing seems off -- pauses and emphasis in the wrong places.

I'd be willing to bet few Spanish speakers are bothered by it.
posted by bongo_x at 6:35 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Onion Tim Kaine is either going to be a serial killer or the second coming of Onion Tim Duncan.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 6:35 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Jennifer Granholm just tweeted:

oh honey
posted by murphy slaw at 6:36 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Here's something I didn't know about Kaine and like a lot, from a legal website:

Clinton VP Pick Tim Kaine Took On Insurers Over ‘Redlining’ as Young Lawyer
Hillary Clinton’s choice for presidential running mate, Virginia Sen. Tim Kaine, is a Harvard Law grad who cut his teeth as a young lawyer fighting for fair housing issues, winning a $100 million jury verdict against Nationwide Insurance over allegedly discriminatory lending practices
posted by bearwife at 6:37 PM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

I'm still in the process of learning about Kaine - I pretty much had just heard his name thrown around as the "boring" possible VP pick - but so far I'm liking what I'm seeing. Not a flashy guy, seemingly, but has some good progressive bones. I'm pretty optimistic with this, actually. I think he could be a good asset to the ticket.

I barely know who Kaine is. I know who Clinton is. I'm sure she picked someone she thinks works well for her. She's been doing this a while and knows something about it. If she can't be trusted with this then shouldn't get my vote (McCain). I don't see anything so far that says she made an egregious mistake. I think I'll trust her on this.

Pretty much this. One of Clinton's big selling points is her seriousness and competence and experience. If I'm trusting her to do the job as head executive of the country, I should be able to trust that she's picking the best people for the job. And it seems like Kaine has been someone that multiple people in the party have had their eye on for a while, so it's not like she picked Random Generic White Guy in some kind of Trump-induced panic. I want her to pick someone who she thinks will fit in with her style and complement her ticket.

I can't wait to see what her cabinet will look like. (Knock on wood.)
posted by Salieri at 6:37 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

What's our consensus on Kaine's Spanish?

I can't judge, but he did missionary work in Honduras, so there may be a regional thing going on. It also may be that he's dealing with political jargon he didn't deal with earlier.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:37 PM on July 22, 2016

I haven't heard him speak Spanish a whole lot (there were some snippets on the radio this morning) but his accent seemed to me to be basically like a better version of mine -- technically fine but stilted enough to be noticeably non-native. (He's definitely more fluent than me, though.)
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:37 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

I'm having trouble with Onion Tim Kaine because Kaine every so slightly resembles Jerry from Parks & Rec, so that's all I can imagine now.
posted by sallybrown at 6:37 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

In other news, Judge Curiel signaled in court today that he won't dismiss the Trump University lawsuit.
posted by sallybrown at 6:39 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

With Virginia basically a lock for Clinton now (let's be honest it was basically already at 80% already) the only real path to victory for Trump now is to somehow turn Pennsylvania Red.

Nevada is basically already a given for Clinton and I think Colorado is not that far behind so tivalasvegas's map is probably still a Clinton victory albeit a very close one.

And let's be honest I think Florida is closer to being a likely Clinton state than Pennsylvania is going to be a realistic target.

Oh to be a TV station owner in Ohio and Pennsylvania this fall, those sweet sweet advertising buys are going to be glorious.

For residents of those TV markets I pity you, maybe we can chip in and buy everyone a netflix subscription.
posted by vuron at 6:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

My take on Kaine is that he's a strong choice, not so much for who he is personally, but because choosing him sends the message that the Clinton campaign does not need to shore up their base by choosing a progressive media rock star darling like Franken or Warren.

The main thing about Pence that gives me pause -- aside from his politics, of course -- is the fact that he's a choice whose only purpose is to appeal to the Republican base (he can't even win a battleground state for Trump). Choosing Pence sends the message that Trump can't be confident that confirmed diehard Republicans will vote for him.

I would have felt similarly if Clinton had chosen someone like Elizabeth Warren. She'd basically be saying "I don't think you guys will really vote for me, so I have to pick a Bernie Sanders proxy with good name recognition from a blue state who would represent a poor choice from a strategic standpoint."

But because Clinton has registered Democratic likely voters on lock, she can choose a moderate from a swing state who'll appeal to swing voters and a demgraphic she doesn't already have in her back pocket.

I don't love Tim Kaine, but I love that Hillary can choose him. I love the things he will most likely bring to the ticket, and the fact that he represents the campaign's vision for a landslide victory.

(I say all of this despite the fact that I'm a progressive who personally would have preferred a good bonafide progressive on the ticket, ideally a person of color.)
posted by Sara C. at 6:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [27 favorites]

Tim Kaine might not cost Democrats the election and it might be great political calculus to tap the guy from Virginia and mild republicans might really appreciate a white guy on the blue ticket to pull the party treason lever but literally ugh. I hate everything about this election and I see no light at the end of this neoliberal centrist Willy Wonka tunnel to hell.
posted by an animate objects at 6:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

There's also plenty of time for us to understand Kaine's actual record before having a knee jerk negative reaction.

A+ condescension, but many of us understand his record and still don't like it.

Kaine voted for fast track negotiations on TPP, something every president gets on every international trade deal. He has not said he supports TPP, and has expressed reservations about it in its current form.

Sure, it's a hallowed institution that dates all the way back to the mid-70s. I'm sure it makes it easier for Presidents to negotiate deals that are likely to be bad for their constituents if the legislature has to vote a simple up/down approval once the terms are finalized with no opportunity to amend, but we're under no obligation to defend that just out of tradition.

BTW, if he has reservations about it in its current form, he probably shouldn't have voted for fast-track authority, since it ensures that he will have no opportunity to change its current form! J/s

He has requested that the FEC relax some regulations on regional banks like your local credit union so that (1) credit unions and other regional banks can be more competitive and (2) the FEC doesn't have to spend resources making sure regional banks aren't too big to fail (since we know they aren't) and can spend more time policing the big ones. It's fine to oppose that, but let's not conflate it with being in bed with Wall Street.

Yeah, that's one of the two anti-bank regulation letters he signed onto. The other letter was urging the Fed to loosen the risk calculation and reporting requirements for ALL banks but the biggest six considered "systematically important" from daily to monthly. We know that many of these banks are in fact big enough to fail, given how much we had to spend to bail them out after 2008, so this has the appearance of demanding that the Fed be less well-informed about risk in the banking industry so that the banks can save a comparatively tiny amount of money on reporting costs. Not one of my top priorities TBH!
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:41 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

I was still holding out hope that it would actually be Biden.

I know Laura Olin wants VP-for-Life Uncle Joe, but hasn't he earned the right to drive his ~~Trans Am~~ Corvette again?
posted by holgate at 6:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Tim Kaine: I'll have the house white with the tilapia.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:44 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

So, it's not going to be Tom Vilsack, but oh, I wish it were, if only because I went to university in the quad cities in the late nineties when he was running for re-election as governor of Iowa. There was an absurd ongoing legal battle about nude dancing at the time. There were people trying to ban it, and the final outcome was essentially that it was a form of live modeling, requiring any and all nude dancing establishments to furnish, upon request, pencil and paper for any customer who might wish to "sketch" the models.

It was entirely absurd, and Vilsack had little to no patience for it. At one point, the republican candidate tried to seize on Vilsack not outright condemning the moral scourge of totally nude dancing, releasing an attack ad that, essentially, just kept saying "Tom Vilsack is for TOTALLY NUDE DANCING." Finally, Vilsack was forced to respond, and his response,mid I recall, was something along the lines of "I have more important things to deal with than this nonsense."

And then his opponent released another ad, which, if I recall, actually said "Don't believe governor Tom Vilsack! No matter what he says, he's for TOTALLY NUDE DANCING!"

Vilsack won in a landslide.
posted by Ghidorah at 6:44 PM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

Anyway like I said, he's going to be fine, lefties like me will get the disappointment out of our system. But we aren't bummed out over nothing.
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:45 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

> I hate everything about this election and I see no light at the end of this neoliberal centrist Willy Wonka tunnel to hell.

Show up in midterm elections

Help undo voter ID laws

Make sure Hillary wins by a landslide so more of her and the DNC platforms (ie Citizens United and Campaign Reform ) can a remote chance of FUCKING HAPPENING

If you thought a single election was all you needed to do for social change, I got some news for you.
posted by mrzarquon at 6:45 PM on July 22, 2016 [36 favorites]

Some e-mails from Kaine's term as VA governor. He wasn't my favorite, but I think he's a solid choice.
posted by ilicet at 6:45 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Any chance that the VP debate could have Telemundo anchor María Celeste Arrarás as moderator because I definitely would love to have a Telemundo anchor as moderator and the chances of Trump actually being willing to have a female Latina be the moderator for one of his debates are zero.
posted by vuron at 6:47 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

You know that drive for 100% ideological purity? The one that just cut the GOP to ribbons from the inside and let Trump walk through? Let's leave that to the Tea Party.

Seriously, Kaine has a very solid progressive record and he gets stuff done. He's also very genuine and thoughtful -- not slick at all -- but a good speaker. So I'm happy.
posted by argybarg at 6:48 PM on July 22, 2016 [35 favorites]

Anyway like I said, he's going to be fine, lefties like me will get the disappointment out of our system. But we aren't bummed out over nothing.

Unless I'm completely mistaken, the left generally doesn't vote, making the withholding of our votes not particularly threatening.
posted by Pope Guilty at 6:49 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Hillary Clinton’s choice for presidential running mate, Virginia Sen. Tim Kaine, is a Harvard Law grad who cut his teeth as a young lawyer fighting for fair housing issues, winning a $100 million jury verdict against Nationwide Insurance over allegedly discriminatory lending practices

That's pretty nice.
posted by tobascodagama at 6:52 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

So, it's not going to be Tom Vilsack

He was the last hope of having a native Pittsburgher on the ticket after Santorum, Rand Paul and Kasich dropped out.
posted by octothorpe at 6:52 PM on July 22, 2016

I don't think it would help to re-litigate how difficult it is to engage with the Democratic party from the left but if ya'll would like some background please refer to earlier threads.

The "effectiveness" of Clinton and the DNC as a political machine is the same effectiveness that resists influence from pesky grassroots activists and newcomers and idealists, etc.

Voting for centrists doesn't put me any closer to getting the chance to vote for a lefty. It doesn't send any sort of message to anyone. It just reinforces the centralized power of the DNC.

The left is damned if it does and damned if it doesn't, and it's never welcome.

And we do vote, but because we vote it's assumed that we're not really leftists or something.
posted by an animate objects at 6:53 PM on July 22, 2016 [14 favorites]

Yeah, that's one of the two anti-bank regulation letters he signed onto. The other letter was urging the Fed to loosen the risk calculation and reporting requirements for ALL banks but the biggest six considered "systematically important" from daily to monthly. We know that many of these banks are in fact big enough to fail, given how much we had to spend to bail them out after 2008, so this has the appearance of demanding that the Fed be less well-informed about risk in the banking industry so that the banks can save a comparatively tiny amount of money on reporting costs. Not one of my top priorities TBH!

This post is so much better than your first one because you're actually providing details instead of whatever the opposite of platitudes is.

My sympathies and regrets to everyone who was hoping to vote for a Vice President who wants daily instead of monthly reporting requirements from not the six biggest, most likely to fail banks. This must truly be a bitter pill to swallow.
posted by one_bean at 6:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

The number one goal for avoiding neo-liberal hell is to make sure it's Clinton (or preferably Obama because wtf Republicans) putting up a liberal SCOTUS jurist.

5-4 (or even 6-3 because Kennedy will want to be one the right side of history) SCOTUS decisions are how we claw back democracy from Citizen's United.

The SCOTUS is the first step. If picking a moderate milquetoast Democrat achieves that then I'm sorry I'll do that all day every day.

Yeah I'd like to have a completely diverse ticket but you know what having a liberal female SCOTUS justice put on the robe and replace the human dumpster fire that was Scalia will be awesome as will drinking those salty salty conservative tears.
posted by vuron at 6:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [29 favorites]

And we do vote, but because we vote it's assumed that we're not really leftists or something.

Yeah, I'm never popular with my political fellows because I'm a total sellout apparently.
posted by Pope Guilty at 6:55 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Maybe The Onion will have Diamond Joe as the houseguest who will never leave and they can get kind of an Odd Couple thing going.
posted by ckape at 6:56 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

The "effectiveness" of Clinton and the DNC as a political machine is the same effectiveness that resists influence from pesky grassroots activists and newcomers and idealists, etc.

Atheists who might not play well in West Virginia.
posted by Drinky Die at 6:56 PM on July 22, 2016

I hate everything about this election and I see no light at the end of this neoliberal centrist Willy Wonka tunnel to hell.

I'm with you there. We did have a viable democrat socialist have a heck of a run in the primary, and now we just gotta deal with the actual fascist demagogue who wants to destroy humanity with his tiny, tiny hands on the nuclear button. Priorities.
posted by Celsius1414 at 6:56 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Once Hillary gets elected, she'll have opportunities to put some diversity and ethnicity in her cabinet. Maybe she will, maybe she won't. Being disappointed by Democrats is the natural state of a liberal like myself.

But I'd rather scream at President Clinton to try to make her make good choices than scream because John Bolton is now Secretary of State and John Woo is Attorney General and we just sent 40,000 troops into Syria because someone there Tweeted that Trump has a small penis.
posted by delfin at 6:57 PM on July 22, 2016 [50 favorites]

I get it, in my perfect world the party would be full of people who think just like me and we'd all live in a Socialist Equality Utopia. But I feel like the country is full of people who just want to make a point, to piss off their mom, uncle Dave, or the faceless really wrong people they see on the internet. The real world and it's consequences, running country, not letting things fall apart, etc. seems to be taking a back seat to Statements for way too many people. The Right seems to be 99% this at this point.

I'm tired. You know what I really want right now? Some fucking competent adults who can run the fucking country and I don't have to worry about them all the God Damn time like I'm their fucking babysitter. When we get that I'll be glad to give suggestions about the way forward.
posted by bongo_x at 6:59 PM on July 22, 2016 [32 favorites]

Can this please be a safer space for people who are enthusiastically voting for Clinton because it's the right thing to do but don't like her or the party or the direction of politics in general and feel like we desperately need accelerated change in a direction opposite fascism?
posted by an animate objects at 6:59 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

Is it unsafe right now? A few people being disappointed because they want a more liberal party is unsafe?
posted by tobascodagama at 7:01 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

I understand the desire to have a liberal as VP but the US government isn't like running the Enterprise and the VP doesn't get to do all the cool stuff that Riker got to do. Basically Kaine will get to babysit the Senate and while it's quite possible he could be the deciding vote in a 50-50 split that isn't exactly the most fun position and his previous experience makes him a solid person for that role.

Progressives need to have a voice in the Clinton administration but I would push for a ton of Secretary positions because that's where progressives can do a ton of really positive work. Witness all the really solid stuff Perez has done with Labor.

Push for a liberal in charge of State, Treasury and Defense and I would be ecstatic.
posted by vuron at 7:01 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Voting for centrists doesn't put me any closer to getting the chance to vote for a lefty. It doesn't send any sort of message to anyone. It just reinforces the centralized power of the DNC.

To that, I'd say - why is Clinton's platform more liberal now, in 2016, than it was in 2008? The Democratic electorate is getting more liberal, and therefore so is her platform.

Maybe you think that's because she's conservative but opportunistic, or conservative but a realist about the electorate, or a long-time progressive who came up in the 80s and 90s and had to make compromises, or if you genuinely think she's changed her mind on these issues - any of those ways, it seems like liberal activism is having some sort of actual effect.
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:02 PM on July 22, 2016 [29 favorites]

Basically Kaine will get to babysit the Senate and while it's quite possible he could be the deciding vote in a 50-50 split that isn't exactly the most fun position and his previous experience makes him a solid person for that role.

It's a whole lot less likely he'll make that vote when his seat will be up for a special election in an off year and a credible Republican governor running in Virginia and the Dems defending 24 seats to 8 in 2018. It's a colossal mistake to tap ANY Democratic Senator for VP.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:05 PM on July 22, 2016

Not only is the SCOTUS the first step, but there are two important things about having Democrats in power, even centrist ones.

1. It is soooooo much easier to organize from the left and actually accomplish things if you are fighting against an establishment that is actually somewhat on your side of things. It was incredibly frustrating being an activist in the Bush administration, because we knew that no matter what we did, we wouldn't win. We didn't have a chance, because the people we needed to convince were not ideologically on the same planet as us. Also, we were constantly playing far-right whack-a-mole preventing rollbacks to victories that had already been won, so we couldn't actually fight for new progressive policies at all.

2. The alternative to a centrist Clinton/Kaine administration isn't leftist utopia, it's actual fascism. I don't understand how anyone who claims to be politically to the left of Mussolini could have heard Trump's speech last night and come away with anything beyond HE MUST BE DEFEATED. I would have loved a Sanders/Klobuchar ticket, or a Clinton/Booker ticket, but voting for Jill Stein or staying home isn't going to result in that, it's going to result in possibly the end of the American democracy.
posted by Sara C. at 7:05 PM on July 22, 2016 [46 favorites]

Clinton is to the left of Obama, she might not be a card carrying Marxist but she's actually pretty liberal. To the right she's basically Che and Castro threatening to turn the US into a communist hell and to the left she's apparently willing to sell the left into bondage at the first possible opportunity.

Hillary is not Bill, this isn't the 90s, and the alternative is a person that would not look out of place running a third world dictatorship and we are still going to do this? Based upon something that is ultimately as inconsequential as VP?

Yes Darth Cheney had tremendous power and Uncle Biden had a ton of influence but most VPs tend to be more like the Dan Quayle types, completely inconsequential.
posted by vuron at 7:09 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

People were not happy about Biden, either.
posted by one_bean at 7:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

To that, I'd say - why is Clinton's platform more liberal now, in 2016, than it was in 2008? The Democratic electorate is getting more liberal, and therefore so is her platform.

I am beginning to believe that she does listen and will continue to make changes to her platform for the better. I welcome disagreements in light of responsive leadership, because democracy works well when leaders listen.

I imagine Clinton's presidency might present a healthy climate for the reconstruction of liberal politics against the blood bath opposite. I don't think she herself will turn leftists away or ask them to be silent.

But I must continue to express dissent against the power structures that be and perpetual acquiescence to political expedience that continually serves fewer and fewer Americans' best interests.

Trump is not just riding White Supremacy into the election this fall. He's riding a tidal wave of economic injustice, too. And the DNC needs to prove they care more about that than their donor database.
posted by an animate objects at 7:13 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

(Lot of people in that thread who were hoping for Bill Richardson, which... Thank god Metafilter doesn't pick VPs).
posted by one_bean at 7:13 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

To the right she's basically Che and Castro threatening to turn the US into a communist hell...

It's funny though, I heard a lot more about how she's corrupt and incompetent than that she's a radical leftist at the convention. I think Sanders may have actually given her some cover there.
posted by Drinky Die at 7:14 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

When Al Gore picked Joe Lieberman, he was distancing himself from Bill Clinton as hard as he possibly could've. He picked a smug twatwaffle who loudly echoed the Republicans' moral condemnations of the outgoing President, proudly waved the Wash America Clean Of Filthy Dirty Perversion banner that Gore's wife had famously held high, and waxed eloquently on the campaign trail about how Americans are ALL children of God and there is no freedom FROM religion. His choice said "not only am I not engaging my left flank at all, I'm wholeheartedly rub-and-tugging my right."

THAT kind of hippie-punching is how you properly piss off the left. This is weak sauce by comparison.
posted by delfin at 7:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [30 favorites]

a credible Republican governor running in Virginia

Who?
posted by indubitable at 7:16 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Tim Kaine, is a Harvard Law grad who cut his teeth as a young lawyer fighting for fair housing issues
He was probably too young to get involved in a case directly against Dishonest Donald's racist landlord father, but if he ever quoted a case against Daddy Trump in one of his arguments, it MUST be made public and disseminated widely. Not so much for reassuring the Social Justice voters but just to further upset Trump and get him a little closer to full "head asplode".
posted by oneswellfoop at 7:17 PM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

It's funny though, I heard a lot more about how she's corrupt and incompetent than that she's a radical leftist at the convention. I think Sanders may have actually given her some cover there.

That's a good point, nobody actually bothered attacking her policies at all, they just kept repeating that lock-her-up line. We probably do have Sanders to thank for that, since he proved that an actual, unapologetic socialist candidate can actually be kind of popular.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:18 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

I mean, it's not like a Right Wing populist movement ever took hold because the Left was too busy arguing among themselves about the details of who was less wrong, but there's a first time for everything.
posted by bongo_x at 7:21 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

Trump has unveiled Kaine's nickname: Corrupt Kaine. (Swing and a miss, imo)
posted by sallybrown at 7:24 PM on July 22, 2016

I am encouraged by Kaine's Spanish. He speaks it very well and that speech he is giving doesn't just sound like a translated version.
posted by cobain_angel at 7:25 PM on July 22, 2016

Trump doesn't know many words.
posted by futz at 7:27 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

Re: Kaine - Now that I've finally looked at some actual pictures of the guy...I don't know, this is shallow, but he just has a nice-looking face. His smile looks like a real, goofy, crinkle-eyed smile, which is such a nice contrast to the Trumpian Smirk and Pence's weird plastic demeanor.

Clinton/Kaine! The ticket that is 1000% less punchable than the other guys!
posted by Salieri at 7:27 PM on July 22, 2016 [25 favorites]

Booker would have electrified the ticket, but too much east coast. But man he'd have crushed Pence in the debate.
posted by vrakatar at 7:30 PM on July 22, 2016

You don't need many words when you already have the best ones.
posted by meinvt at 7:30 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

Trump is not just riding White Supremacy into the election this fall. He's riding a tidal wave of economic injustice, too.

True, though white supremacy is pretty much the underpinning of every other issue that his campaign is built on, including economic injustice. Trump supporters only cared about economic injustice when they saw that mostly non-white foreigners and minorities were not worse off than they were.
posted by FJT at 7:30 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Trump doesn't know many words.

That's because he only has the best words. No need for all those other sad, loser words.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:30 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

This is the only map I can see that gets him there.

OK, but in that scenario, if Trump wins NV and Clinton wins CO & NH, the Electoral College is a tie. The race would then go to the Republican dominated house, which would side with Trump because this election has never been about facts. Since this is the most likely outcome, I recommend rioting in the streets right now.

Seriously though, the Electoral College is bullshit.
posted by Panjandrum at 7:31 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Gotta admit, I wasn't terribly enthused, but after reading up on his record and bio, I am going to thoroughly enjoy the cognative dissonance my Trump-supporting, Extremely-Catholic relatives in the Rust Belt are going to have to work through. Because from what I can tell, Kaine is the Good Man In Governance archetype all good Catholic boys-and-girls are taught to aspire to be. And I really wonder how this is going to play out in those Rust Belt states, because some of those mental gymnastics are going to be epic.
posted by ultranos at 7:33 PM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

You don't need many words when you already have the best ones.

It's kind of cute. Are we certain that he's not a toddler with that aging disease?
posted by futz at 7:33 PM on July 22, 2016

What's really interesting is that if she was really pandering to the disaffected Republicans she could've picked someone even more objectionable to the left.

Kaine is pretty centrist in the big scheme of things although way to the left of most Republicans.

Clinton picking him is basically saying she doesn't need to tack to the right or the left because the fundamentals are ultimately in her favor.

Trump was the one that needed to bring in some sort of rockstar as VP in order to change the momentum but he chickened out or he couldn't stomach the competition so instead he got a non-entity.

Despite all the rhetoric about this being the year of the outsider the reality is that this is ultimately going to be a base election and I feel a lot better about Clinton's ability to GotV than Trump's ability to do GotV when he seems barely interested in doing the basics of campaigning and he's hemorhaging moderate Republican support.

Corb might be outspoken but I definitely don't think she's unique. Ultimately the Republican brand is more important than a single election. Scalia's death and the reality of a liberal SCOTUS majority has gotten some on the right willing to hold their nose but there are plenty of Republicans that are going to say "oh well at least we can win back some of the losses in 2018 and there might be a chance that we can win in 2020 as long as Trump doesn't seize control of the party".

Trump is ascendant and relatively untouchable now but the purge in November with a Trump is going to be epic.
posted by vuron at 7:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

I have come to feel like the way to deal with my disappointment when the Democrats don't do the liberal things I want is to think big picture---pushing this country leftward is a decades-long project. It will not happen in one election. And we are fighting a wealthy and entrenched and sometimes vicious set of opponents to boot.

The only answer is "keep pushing." Commit to the long haul.
posted by emjaybee at 7:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [37 favorites]

The only answer is "keep pushing." Commit to the long haul.

Long haul? But I want my social democracy nowwwwwwwwwww!
posted by Talez at 7:44 PM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Half my delegation isn't even voting for Trump. I'm not that unique, just fightier about it. If you're in a battleground state, vote Clinton/Kaine.
posted by corb at 7:46 PM on July 22, 2016 [41 favorites]

it seems unlikely to me that Latino/Latina/Hispanic Americans will care particularly that the white guy picked for VP speaks fluent Spanish.

Take it from someone who grew up in a bilingual country. People care whether you can speak to them in their language. People care that you try. People like to know that you see them and consider them. (For things other than jail or deportation in this particular case)

It will matter.
posted by srboisvert at 7:49 PM on July 22, 2016 [31 favorites]

Well you can blame the electoral college on slavery because even though a national plebiscite was preferred the 3/5ths compromise made doing a direct plebiscite challenging and substitution of the electors in the place of a plebiscite was a reasonable compromise.

It should've been replaced when the 3/5th compromise was removed via the 13th and 14th amendment but it's kinda like a vestigal limb.

Yet another reason why Madison and Jefferson were terrible people and we needed a Hamiltonian presidency ;)
posted by vuron at 7:50 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Kaine's Spanish is a hell of a lot better than Bloomberg's, and people loved when he tried.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:51 PM on July 22, 2016

Tim Kaine for me is kind of meh. It's like, yeah, he's safe, non-threatening, bankable, generic. There's nothing extremely wrong with him but he doesn't really excite me. He's like the Tom Hanks of the political world.

I can't complain but what I really wanted was a political equivalent of Idris Elba.
posted by Talez at 7:53 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Wow. My friends in Virginia are going APESHIT. Like, jumping up and down, waving their hands, happy dance, high-fivin', tears of joy apeshit.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:55 PM on July 22, 2016 [24 favorites]

I know people are saying vote Hillary for swing states, but I'd like to see Trump lose by 50 points, if possible. Fascism doesn't need to be defeated, it needs to be squashed.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 7:56 PM on July 22, 2016 [25 favorites]

  .----------------.  .----------------.  .----------------.  .----------------. 
| .--------------. || .--------------. || .--------------. || .--------------. |
| |  _________   | || |  ____  ____  | || |     _____    | || |    _______   | |
| | |  _   _  |  | || | |_   ||   _| | || |    |_   _|   | || |   /  ___  |  | |
| | |_/ | | \_|  | || |   | |__| |   | || |      | |     | || |  |  (__ \_|  | |
| |     | |      | || |   |  __  |   | || |      | |     | || |   '.___`-.   | |
| |    _| |_     | || |  _| |  | |_  | || |     _| |_    | || |  |`\____) |  | |
| |   |_____|    | || | |____||____| | || |    |_____|   | || |  |_______.'  | |
| |              | || |              | || |              | || |              | |
| '--------------' || '--------------' || '--------------' || '--------------' |
 '----------------'  '----------------'  '----------------'  '----------------'

posted by leotrotsky at 7:56 PM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

He's like the Tom Hanks of the political world.

I can't complain but what I really wanted was a political equivalent of Idris Elba.

Let's hope your analogy is correct, because Tom Hanks is beloved and Idris Elba is a prestige pick. (Also, to continue the analogy, Tom Hanks has been in some very good movies, and a few that get under my skin. Not a bad track record.)
posted by argybarg at 7:56 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

It's a whole lot less likely he'll make that vote when his seat will be up for a special election in an off year and a credible Republican governor running in Virginia

Who's going to be that candidate, though? Is Eric Cantor going to make a comeback? Ed Gillespie? Bill Bolling? Dave Brat? VA's state-level Republicans have moved pretty far right in recent years -- with the in-fighting over the 2013 gubernatorial nomination as testament -- which is fine if you're representing a deep red district in the mountains or the white-flight burbs, but Dems have been able to eke and squeak out victories in odd-year and mid-term statewide races even when other blue-state elections have gone to the GOP.
posted by holgate at 7:57 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

It should've been replaced when the 3/5th compromise was removed via the 13th and 14th amendment but it's kinda like a vestigal limb.

We're never going to get rid of it because it's the only thing that allows the Republicans to hang on to any hope of getting the presidency. They've won the popular vote for president once in past twenty five years. There's a reason why all of the NPVIC states vote deep blue.
posted by Talez at 7:58 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

I'm in southwest Virginia. There are a lot of things to not like about Tim Kaine but, in this area, he's well-known for walking his faith. Like, he's the sort of person who seems to take the whole "comfort the afflicted" and "for I was hungry and you gave me something to eat" thing really seriously. He used his Harvard law degree to handle housing discrimination cases. Not the sort of thing you'll ever make it rich doing.

So even though people around here disagree with some of his politics he's widely seen as someone who takes the whole "WWJD?" thing to heart. And that earns him a lot of respect (and maybe a few votes, too).
posted by introp at 7:59 PM on July 22, 2016 [26 favorites]

The SCOTUS is the first step. If picking a moderate milquetoast Democrat achieves that then I'm sorry I'll do that all day every day.

This is how we nominated Kerry, a modern milquetoast Democrat who inspired approximately no one. So forgive me if I squint at this logic.
posted by naju at 7:59 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Kaine's Spanish is a hell of a lot better than Bloomberg's, and people loved when he tried.

What's the Tim Kaine equivalent to El Bloombito? (not really fair, as his Spanish is far better, but still)
posted by zachlipton at 8:00 PM on July 22, 2016

Kaine talking about his Roman Catholic faith in Spanish on Telemundo will seem like pandering but it will also be incredibly effective pandering.

He doesn't even need to say "Vote for Clinton/Kaine" he just needs to get out there and say to the Latino community that every voice needs to be heard.

Increasing turnout especially among the Latino demographic is basically like guaranteeing a Clinton victory because Latino demographics heavily favor Democrats in general and Latino voters are incredibly important in a large number of battleground states like Florida and Virginia and North Carolina.

The electoral coalition of liberal educated whites, Latinos, African-Americans, Asian-Americans, Labor, Females, the LGBT community, Progressives, etc is an incredibly powerful one and it's going to dominate national politics as long as we can avoid the politics of division.

Nobody in that coalition is going to get 100% of what they want especially because of gerrymandering in the House but together we are sooo much stronger than we are divided. And quite frankly I like being on the right side of history. If checking my privilege is what I need to do to make things better for everyone I'll be the first to sign on the dotted line.
posted by vuron at 8:01 PM on July 22, 2016 [26 favorites]

I was an Angry Young Liberal once. I looked at Gore/Lieberman and said "fuck this, I'm voting for Ralph." And I do not regret that vote, even with hindsight.

But I was in a very blue state -- Gore beat Nader and Dubya combined in my state -- and thus I had leeway. I voted all Democratic on the down-ticket, so yay me. And while Dubya's supporting cast was not what anyone would call PROMISING, they were Up With People compared to what Trump promises.

If you're angry and feel ignored by a moderate/moderate D ticket, stay angry. Keep yelling. Keep fighting. But stay practical angry, not stupid angry. Fight for the small gains to work towards the big ones.

jesus i feel so goddamn old
posted by delfin at 8:04 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

Females

You mean women?

(/ferengi)
posted by Justinian at 8:04 PM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

> I know people are saying vote Hillary for swing states, but I'd like to see Trump lose by 50 points, if possible. Fascism doesn't need to be defeated, it needs to be squashed.

Yes. Every single point possible needs to go to her. A larger spread and it sends a message to the Republican party that we don't tolerate this shit -- where as if it's a close election, then Trump just wasn't facist enough

I say this as a former Sanders supporter who really isn't enthralled with the Democratic ticket in a state that will most definitely be blue - The Democratic ticket is getting my vote as they need and deserve our support.
posted by MysticMCJ at 8:06 PM on July 22, 2016 [19 favorites]

Ohh so Kaine is basically Edwards if Edwards hadn't secretly been a horrible person?

I can definitely live with that. I understand people who are deeply motivated by faith can be problematic for a lot of Mefites especially those with a more secular world view but on the other hand people like Gandhi and MLK were deeply motivated by their faith and they turned out pretty okay.

Plus the Jesus of the Gospels seems like a pretty progressive chap TBH, I could definitely see him being a very solid Democratic leader and I'm not completely scared about people trying to emulate him.
posted by vuron at 8:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

it seems unlikely to me that Latino/Latina/Hispanic Americans will care particularly that the white guy picked for VP speaks fluent Spanish

I am Latina and a recent immigrant, and when politicians (and people in general) make an effort to not just speak Spanish but speak it well, making an effort to not sound like whatever they said just came out of Google Translate...that shows that the person is interested in communicating with me and making sure he is understood and that he can understand me too, even if we both speak English. It's deliberately giving me the upper hand in something as delicate as language! Too many people either don't care to learn or they learn just enough to barely communicate, which is fine, but going above and beyond is well appreciated.
posted by cobain_angel at 8:09 PM on July 22, 2016 [49 favorites]

Kaine's record relating to religion is amazing - he's very clear that he's Catholic, he's devout, he is not in favor of abortion or the death penalty - but he has supported legislature for both those and oversaw 11 executions as governor.

He's got a very solid history of being able to tell the difference between a sin and a crime - and leaving the sins to God to deal with.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [22 favorites]

I'm still pulling the Democratic lever with great enthusiasm this November because we have the chance to have decades of a more progressive Supreme Court. Even if Garland ends up being the next Justice, we have the chance to improve things for decades.

Vote your conscience in the primaries, vote Supreme Court in the general.
posted by Joey Michaels at 8:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Nobody in that coalition is going to get 100% of what they want especially because of gerrymandering in the House but together we are sooo much stronger than we are divided. And quite frankly I like being on the right side of history. If checking my privilege is what I need to do to make things better for everyone I'll be the first to sign on the dotted line.

YES. I don't want to bash anyone, really, but living in a stable Democracy, centrist or not, is the pinnacle of privilege. I don't want to be a romantic figure in a tragic story. I want boring, steady change where less people die and go to prison.

If you're angry and feel ignored by a moderate/moderate D ticket, stay angry.

Yes, and "I'm part of this party and here's where I think we should go" is approximately 1000% more effective than "I'm not a part of this party and hate you, but here's what you're doing wrong".
posted by bongo_x at 8:12 PM on July 22, 2016 [16 favorites]

People care whether you can speak to them in their language. People care that you try.

I did give W. credit for trying to speak good English.
posted by peeedro at 8:14 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

Females

You mean women?

(/ferengi)

That's the totally voice in my head when I read internet comments like that.

"FEEE-males"
posted by leotrotsky at 8:15 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

Well English definitely didn't seem like it was Dubya's native tongue.

It seems like Trumpster Fire also has the same issue.

I guess some might find that annoying but I think it gives them "authenticity"
posted by vuron at 8:18 PM on July 22, 2016

To those unsatisfied with the choice of Tim Kaine, I refer you to last night's music selection.
posted by zachlipton at 8:27 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

So for those who the selection of Kaine is seen as "meh" who do you want to see in Clinton's cabinet?

State- Kerry seems like he's doing a good job and is involved in like about a dozen sensitive negotiations

Treasury - Anat Admati for the bank heart attacks

Defense - Michele Flournoy

Attorney General - Lynch definitely because of the Republican howls otherwise Klobuchar

Interior - Maybe Merkley?

Agriculture - Vilsack definitely
posted by vuron at 8:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

"Vet" is an interesting search in the DNCleaks, as in vetting donors/event attendees... not damning, but interesting to see - there's the legal compliance stuff one'd expect like checking if they dun goofed and solicited from a Frenchman, but it's also a background check and full Internet Detective Work to make judgment calls based on: if you're a felon, a Bernie delegate, know Blagojevich, have an old marijuana possession charge and want to meet known former marijuana possessor Obama...
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 8:44 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

No wonder he never responds to my letters asking to have a beer with him.
posted by Drinky Die at 8:47 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

Not a fan of the "he'll speak Spanish - box ticked! Latino bloc in the pocket!" stuff in this discussion. It's incredibly dehumanizing to talk about real people in this way. I hate when pundits do it, and I hate it here.

Ok, so listen to me and the other Latinxs in this thread:

One of the most important roles a VP candidate plays is as a campaign surrogate, and I cannot overstate what what's HUGE deal it is that Kaine will be able to directly speak to to the Spanish speakers in in our community.

I eagerly await his his first interview with Jorge Ramos.
posted by joedan at 8:48 PM on July 22, 2016 [38 favorites]

Hillary Clinton’s VP pick is a well-regarded senior Democrat, but he has split with labor on the TPP, banking regulation and even “right-to-work” laws.
posted by saul wright at 8:50 PM on July 22, 2016

No wonder he never responds to my letters asking to have a beer with him.
posted by Drinky Die

You know Blago? How's the hair color these days?
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:51 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

VP picks don't really matter stop catastrophizing y'all. And stop marching around declaring things are good or bad for Hillary without any data other than twitter. There's enough bullshit in the actual media without adding to it by pretending to be a pundit.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:02 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

VP picks don't really matter

You betcha.
posted by Drinky Die at 9:06 PM on July 22, 2016 [29 favorites]

Clinton Has 69-Point Lead Over Trump in Latest Latino Vote Tracking Poll.
posted by peeedro at 9:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

2010: here are my weird funny Hp Lovecraft jokes
2013: I'm clinically depressed and just ate a suicidal amount of Cheetos this is not a joke help
2016: seriously? Hating trump is just as problematic as liking him, ugh

(All of these are me btw😲)
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

As a Richmonder who lives on the same side of town as the Kaine family, I suppose I'm going to have to get used to not seeing him out and about much anymore.
posted by emelenjr at 9:09 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

You betcha.

Precisely. The downside matters, the upside doesn't.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

For the people who feel like it's just the same old DNC centrist third-way shit that goes back to Bill Clinton, I agree. It is.

But if you're feeling like *really* irritated because you're thinking about having to vote for another damn wall street politician in the hands of the milquetoast DNC, please remember this:

I am voting in this election to prevent a political party from getting a lock on this nation that will eliminate transgender children and criminalize my existence.

So I get that you're dismayed, I really do. I just would like to ask you to put yourself in my shoes and factor that in to how you view *this* the 2016 election, in this world. And decide based on the tactical moment.

I want a more socially progressive nation too. I'm willing to do the mid-year work to make that happen. But right now I've only got one choice to ensure that transgender children are secured the right to become who they are and prevent a nationwide HB-2 style law being passed that forces trans people out of the public sphere and back into the secret shadows.

And like, fuck no, much to my chagrin that choice is not Howard Dean. Is he still available to raise some hell? Where'd he go?
posted by Annika Cicada at 9:12 PM on July 22, 2016 [31 favorites]

Kaine doesn't cost the Dems anything in the Senate, and he's capable of fulfilling the office of President (god forbid). Don't know of anyone else who checks both those boxes. I'm happy.
posted by saturday_morning at 9:12 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

stop catastrophizing y'all

If anyone's got an underground bunker, let me in! I've seen 10 Cloverfield Lane so I know what to expect.
posted by naju at 9:14 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

I don't think anybody can reasonably say that this is some kind of huge gotcha, but even as a non-Catholic Mexican-American, it's just... incredibly hard to look at American politics and see people who represent your experience. Yes, sometimes you see Spanish names. I'm not sure that I am inclined to think that a Cuban, say, represents people like my family any more than I'd think Kaine represents people like my family, and yet people talked constantly about how Cruz or Rubio would influence the Hispanic vote. Spanish surnames aren't the beginning and end of how Mexican-Americans try to relate to politics.

"I think it is appropriate that I spend a few minutes explaining the bill in Spanish, a language that has been spoken in this country since Spanish missionaries founded St. Augustine, Florida, in 1565."

Someone who is willing to put himself out there as not just speaking Spanish but specifically advocating that Spanish should still be spoken in the United States? I think that helps, yes. I think the fact that his volunteer work in Honduras involved a vocational school is the sort of thing that fits in very nicely with the way my low-income family wants help, where they have a hideously hard time accepting what they think of as "handouts".

He's not my ideal VP pick, but I think he's pretty okay, and I think if Nevada and Arizona are in play, I think strategically he seems like a good guy to be campaigning there.
posted by Sequence at 9:18 PM on July 22, 2016 [23 favorites]

Just spit balling here, but what if Kaine's first national TV interview as VP nom was with Jorge Ramos? Sure, it could be considered pandering. But it could also be seen as a gesture to indicate the campaign's seriousness about outreach.
posted by mhum at 9:26 PM on July 22, 2016

Hey, I'm a Nuyorican who thinks that Hillary selecting a Spanish-speaking VP doesn't nearly make up for having Latinx lives as a literal input for her political career, but don't let that dissuade you from speaking for an entire ethnic bloc.
posted by invitapriore at 9:27 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

If I were a Democratic strategist and I was looking at polling numbers relating to Latinx preferences and seeing a 81-11% split I would be absolutely beside myself with excitement.

Keep in mind the Latinx community is heavily weighted towards the younger end of the age spectrum. 1/3rd of the Latinx community is 18 years or younger, 25% are ages 18-33.

Also keep in mind research has consistently shown that the party that you vote for in your first elections heavily influences your future behavior.

The simple fact of the matter is that a massive percentage of the Latinx electorate is first time voters and they are overwhelmingly view Trump negatively and also associate Trump with the Republican party in general. That means is 80% or more of likely voters within the Latinx community vote with Clinton this election it could be a game changer in terms of future elections.

Furthermore there are a large number of people within the latinx community that are currently too young but are almost certainly going to be influenced by this election. If you are 10 and you are watching the Angry Orange Man villify your community on television time after time you are going to be way less likely to vote Republican when you are eligible to vote.

The African-American community has been critical to the success of both the Clinton and Obama campaigns in the past and if the Latinx community can deliver votes in similar quantities a huge number of states could shift from being reliably Republican to reliably Democratic with massive changes in public policy. This is a very exciting time because the long anticipated demographic advantages for Democrats are starting to arrive in force with former battleground states like New Mexico going to Democratic strongholds and formerly solid Republican states like Arizona looking increasingly vulnerable.

On the other hand if I was a Republican Strategist I am pretty sure I would be looking for a liver transplant right about now because this was all plain to see in the wake of 2012 and all of the advice from strategists was ignored and they went full nativist.
posted by vuron at 9:29 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

ok but porque no estamos luchando en espanol instead
posted by poffin boffin at 9:33 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Vuron: I feel bad for the slowly sinking GOP, we tried to warn them the boat anchor was going to be heavy but they kept asking for it.
posted by Annika Cicada at 9:35 PM on July 22, 2016

The phrase you are looking for, dear reader, is "Whistling past the Graveyard."

Trump picked a regressive, revanchist Movement Republican as his running mate, after giving a speech somewhere to the right of Ghengis Khan, and Clinton is all, "I know, I want to run to the center! Those R-leaning Inds have always had our back at the mid-terms!"

If she was up against anyone but the Trumpster-fire, she'd be toast. She is making decisions that do not help, as a lot of us feared. (Bernie who? Remember Draft Warren? Why did we want to draft her? Crap like this.)

Don't get me wrong... I'll be GOTV like mad crazy as a local operator, it's just that this makes it really, really hard. I have down-ballot races involving the library and FD, and the side that wants to simply erase them has a blank check from the Kochs.

(You know who else is fluent in Spanish and immensely qualified? Julian Castro. I could get the entire north side of town to turn out for him without having to canvass.)
posted by Slap*Happy at 9:37 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

> much to my chagrin that choice is not Howard Dean. Is he still available to raise some hell? Where'd he go?

Boy howdy do I have bad news for you. :(
posted by RedOrGreen at 9:38 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

> You know who else is fluent in Spanish and immensely qualified? Julian Castro.

Yeah, he was far and away my favorite among the names in contention, but...

LAT: This is not great timing for Julian Castro, who is on Hillary Clinton’s short list of potential running mates. The charismatic political rising star serving as President Obama’s secretary of Housing and Urban Development has gotten himself into trouble for mixing politics with his government job. An investigation by the Office of Special Counsel, which oversees the rules governing politicking by federal employees, found Castro recently had violated the Hatch Act.

You can see how that's a big fat pitch down the middle for the "crooked Dems" narrative. It's just too bad.
posted by RedOrGreen at 9:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

I'm not mad about Kaine but I still don't understand what he brings to the table that Perez doesn't. I guess Virginia?

And maybe the calculus was that there had to be at least one moderateish white guy on the ticket, which, ugh, but I trust the Clinton campaign to do that distasteful math as well as they can, just like the Obama campaign did in '08.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:42 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Point is I might not like their solutions and I may even quibble with the arithmetic, but at least I know they're doing math as opposed to the Republicans who are busy denouncing the communist numbers plot.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:44 PM on July 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

Is it possible Clinton likes Tim Kaine and wants to work with him? Couldn't that be part of the process here?
posted by argybarg at 9:45 PM on July 22, 2016 [33 favorites]

No girls aren't allowed to make important decisions like that smh tbh fam
posted by stolyarova at 9:46 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

at least I know they're doing math as opposed to the Republicans

That is an immensely bad mistake to make. May I remind you Nate Silver is a Republican, or was before the Trumpster-fire? The bad guys know math, too.

No girls aren't allowed to make important decisions like that

Knock it off. Warren or Sibelius would not have made that decision.
posted by Slap*Happy at 9:49 PM on July 22, 2016 [1 favorite]

I don't feel particularly bad for the GOP, they decided to go all in on the awful identity politics mastered by Rove. They've known that clinging to the white male vote was a dangerous strategy because the white male voting block is becoming a smaller and smaller percentage of the overall electorate.

But it's an incredibly reliable one in a whole host of elections and while Presidential election years are increasingly unfavorable to Republicans off cycle elections still tend to favor Republicans. Factor in incumbency bias and the Republicans have a sweet gig going.

However it's one that is increasingly under threat and the resistance to adapt new strategies is really dooming the party.

On the other hand I honestly don't mind if people weigh the options and decide that the conservative world view fits their wants and needs. It's not the world view I would want to have but I respect people who come to their belief structures honestly and choose to vote their conscience although I am losing patience with people who want to maintain coercive systems where some people are valued over others. It does not seem in keeping with old school Republican values.

So I actually feel sorry for certain Republicans but I also feel a certain sense of satisfaction that the Republican party basically tried to swallow the old Dixiecrat movement of Southern Democrats and in doing so got effectively transformed from the inside so that the traditional focus of Republicans (small government, business focus, etc) has become overwhelmed by reactionaries.
posted by vuron at 9:49 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

That's a good point argybarg, I was remembering today that someone wrote a thing about VP nods being August candidates (aimed at party unification), November candidates (chosen to help build a winning electoral coalition) and January candidates (selected because they will complement the governing team). Ideally you would have two or all of those boxes checked by a single person, of course.

When we look at Pence, he's clearly an August candidate, with maybe a bit of November if Trump's campaign thinks* he can project calmness/steadiness to moderate voters, but there's no particular evidence that any thought at all has been given to how he might - be equipped to be a high-ranking government official (the highest really if Trump is going to like sit around eating bonbons and flying back and forth between New York and Cleveland for the four years of his presidency).

I see some obvious upsides to the Kaine pick as a November candidate. What I have really no idea about because I don't really know anything about the guy is the January candidate thing. But I bet the Clinton campaign does.

*not quite the right word but I'm not sure what fits better
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

...just like the Obama campaign did in '08.

And look how that distasteful math worked out. What a horror show right ? But then again, sarcasm aside, I seem to recall Obama quoted to the effect that picking Biden to be his Vice President was the best political decision he ever made.
posted by y2karl at 9:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

May I remind you Nate Silver is a Republican, or was before the Trumpster-fire? The bad guys know math, too.

How do you square that with the fact that he started out blogging at DailyKos and openly voted for Obama?
posted by one_bean at 9:56 PM on July 22, 2016 [15 favorites]

For people who believe in these things, here are some DW-Nominate scores for some of more discussed VP possibilities. (Rank is shown in parentheses, but as I've said before, this is an actual scale, so the numbers themselves matter, and it's also important that the standard deviation is about 0.1.)

SANDERS: -0.717 (1)
WARREN: -0.701 (2)
BROWN: -0.490 (9)
BOOKER: -0.472 (14)
FRANKEN: -0.466 (17)
CLINTON: -0.403 (15)*
OBAMA: -0.391 (18)*
MEAN: -0.381 (28)
KAINE: -0.307 (41)
WARNER: -0.250 (51)
BAYH: -0.153 (50)*

So on the one hand, Kaine is well to the right of some of the other possible picks and Clinton herself; on the other hand, he's not as far to the right as Warner or Bayh, and he's under 1 standard deviation from the mean. On the other other hand, if you believe this stuff, then Sanders and Warren really are quite to the left of everyone else, at 3 standard deviations from the mean -- not that anyone really thought either of them had much of a shot at being picked.

[* Score and rank from 110th Congress.]
posted by chortly at 9:59 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

Put two together.....Kaine speaks Spanish and is Catholic. Nice play by Hillary. This will pull more voters from the Latin community.

I can see Pope Francis smiling.

I also like that Kaine is "loose" as he speaks. He uses his arms freely. No stiffness or rigidly. This is another nice counterpoint to Hillary. He's a guy I would want to get into a debate with knowing we would come out of friends and probably with more respect for each other than we went in. He is a guy I would want to rise to and meet.

This might be because of Catholic upbringing. I also like how he has come to terms with the abortion issue. I was raised in a strong pro-life family. It is not an easy thing to make peace with. Lay-catholics may initially have an issue with him as Jesuit-taught means that he is highly educated and liberal. I think the "nice face" will cancel some of that out as he does seem to be what every Catholic mother wants her son to be.
posted by goalyeehah at 10:00 PM on July 22, 2016 [10 favorites]

Silver did start as Poblano on Daily Kos but has said that he leans towards Liberal-Libertarian on a lot of issues.

So I guess pro-business but also left-libertarian in some form.
posted by vuron at 10:01 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Kaine may be broadcasting his personal beliefs on abortion as a dog-whistle, or he may be trying to connect to people who need that bridge on the abortion issue. I don't know the man well enough to say.

I think very much that it's the latter. One of my closest friends, and the smartest person I know, if a liberal Catholic running his own race right now (which I'm not going to presume to speak for, hence my not naming him) and I know that, for him, abortion is very much against his personal morals and religious views, but he knows it needs to be protected, just as he wouldn't condemn one of his friends for having one, because his religious and personal views are not going to be shared by everyone, and that distinction is important.

And that is, I would argue, an entirely reasonable view to hold. It's not expressed often in the political sphere and this is an issue which is screaming for that kind of middle-ground nuanced position. That Kaine follows it up by saying - very truthfully - that the correct approach is to lower the rate of unwanted pregnancies through education and access to social services, makes me even more hopeful about this.

---

Warren will never be named to SCOTUS. If you want the equivalent of Warren who could in a million years possibly be put up for that position (though the senate Republicans did everything to block her for the D.C. Circuit) it's Nina Pillard.
posted by Navelgazer at 10:02 PM on July 22, 2016 [13 favorites]

Knock it off. Warren or Sibelius would not have made that decision.

I would think a woman who's been in public service long enough to rise to that level has a good idea of how much misogyny exists in the world, and would be quite happy to have a Generic White Guy on the ticket with her if she feels it increases her chance of winning. What evidence do you have to the contrary?
posted by tonycpsu at 10:03 PM on July 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

Silver described his partisan orientation as follows in the FAQ on his website: "My state [Illinois] has non-partisan registration, so I am not registered as anything. I vote for Democratic candidates the majority of the time (though by no means always). This year, I have been a supporter of Barack Obama"

posted by murphy slaw at 10:06 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

speaking for an entire ethnic bloc

Look, I spent that entire comment trying to frame things explicitly as talking about how this relates to how specifically Mexican-American people in or from specific parts of the country might take this. My whole point is people acting like non-Mexican Hispanic options should automatically go over better with all Hispanic voters, but that Mexicans from the Southwest are not actually culturally identical to, say, Dominicans from upstate New York, so a lot of what Perez would have shared with that community is covered by "Spanish-speaking Catholic". I don't know how I can any less be trying to speak for everybody of Hispanic heritage when trying to point out that we aren't all interchangeable. I'm only trying to generalize here from my experience of Mexicans from southern Texas to Mexicans in Nevada, and I'm happy to hear if anybody knows reasons why the two groups might differ.
posted by Sequence at 10:07 PM on July 22, 2016 [18 favorites]

tivalasvegas: I'm not mad about Kaine but I still don't understand what he brings to the table that Perez doesn't. I guess Virginia?

Well, he is also more experienced as a legislator, since he serves on the Senate's Foreign Relations and Armed Services committees.
posted by Superplin at 10:11 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

don't know how I can any less be trying to speak for everybody of Hispanic heritage when trying to point out that we aren't all interchangeable.

Understood. I was referring mostly to joedan's comment, which I thought went way further in implying a general Latinx Stamp of Approval re Kaine, which is and remains nonsense.
posted by invitapriore at 10:16 PM on July 22, 2016

Trump's favorite bands really don't like Trump

Here are a few of the bands and musicians that have complained about their music featuring in the Trump campaign

- Neil Young,
- Free singer Paul Rodgers,
- the Rolling Stones,
- George Harrison's estate,
- Queen,
- Pavarotti's widow,
- The O'Jays,
- Adele,
- Twisted Sister,
- Steven Tyler,
- Elton John,
- The Turtles,
- Everlast, who called Trump a "piece of shit," and
- R.E.M.
posted by filthy light thief at 10:16 PM on July 22, 2016 [11 favorites]

I'm not mad about Kaine but I still don't understand what he brings to the table that Perez doesn't. I guess Virginia?

He brings nothing to the table, he just doesn't take anything off of it, and that's all the VP is supposed to do. Creative, daring VP picks are for losers. A strong presidential candidate will pick a VP who might plausibly have become the presidential candidate herself, if she had the name recognition/charisma/luck to have done so. You just want someone that will give you a couple of good news cycles and will not raise any eyebrows (e.g., Biden, Gore, Kemp, Bush the elder, Mondale). Trying to hit it out of the park, or even shake things up a bit isn't necessarily a death sentence, but it hasn't worked out well in the modern era (e.g., Quayle, Palin, Lieberman).
posted by skewed at 10:22 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

My complaint with Hillary Clinton has never been that she's not liberal enough, but that she tries too hard to be whatever her focus groups and micropolls tell her to be. But I think she's done much better this election -- she was unbearable in 2008, but has been pretty on point so far.

I think Tim Kaine really is someone she likes and would like to work with. I think she also thinks he fits the ticket; I'm sure there is some calculation there. I would rather she pick her VP for her ticket than try to pander to Bernie voters. She should be who she is, because in the long run people respect that.
posted by argybarg at 10:29 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

What I have really no idea about because I don't really know anything about the guy is the January candidate thing. But I bet the Clinton campaign does.

This article makes a case that he's a January candidate more than anything else.
posted by saturday_morning at 10:33 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

a credible Republican governor running in Virginia

Who?

Mark Warner damn near lost to Ed Gillespie, and Ken Fucking Cuccinelli only trailed by 2.5% in the 2013 VA Gov race, which is far too close for comfort when he's the VA state level equivalent of Ted Cruz. VA is far more purple than some Democrats like to pretend, and it's a pretty fucking stupid move to steal a sitting Democratic Senator from a state that is anything but assured to reelect another Democrat, regardless of how many centrist credentials or DNC checkboxes he hits.

The Democrats need every. last. fucking. Senator. to even retake it with a Clinton win, much less hold it in 2018. And if they don't get that, nothing Clinton does including her SCOTUS pick(s) will matter at all, because none of it will get past 4 more years of Republican obstruction.

The Kaine pick is an unforced gunshot in the forehead.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:38 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

I would rather she pick her VP for her ticket than try to pander to Bernie voters. She should be who she is, because in the long run people respect that.

That's putting the cart before the horse. There needs to be a long run before she can be respected in it. Choosing Guy With Huge Following over Guy Nobody Has Heard Of is a good way to ensure the former.
posted by Sys Rq at 10:42 PM on July 22, 2016

He brings nothing to the table

I disagree. He brings a progressive, pro-woman's health legislative history - combined with a strong Christian faith. This is something that the evangelical community that's unhappy with Trump desperately needs to see. They may not become convinced, but there's a point of potential outreach; they'll be able to look back at Cruz's speech, and may decide that "vote your conscience" doesn't have to mean abdicating their religious principles.

He brings a history of work against systemic racism and ableism, at the individual scale that Hillary doesn't have. Hillary's against redlining, against discrimination, but doesn't have almost two decades of experience fighting against it in ways that everyone can comprehend and support.

He brings, as mentioned, the ability to outreach to the Latinx communities; he doesn't have any automatic "win", but he has the ability to say, "I'm ready to listen to you, and I'll explain our plans in the hopes that you can understand them and agree" - and that's something the T/P campaign doesn't have at all. (Hell, they don't have that for English-speaking voters.)

He brings a friendly face. He looks like a nice guy. He looks like someone who's pleasant to talk with, someone who enjoys just being around other people. In many elections, this wouldn't be a notable feature, but in this one... Trump can't tolerate anyone else having the limelight; Pence was selected for his ability to stand in Trump's shadow, and Hillary's constantly accused of being "cold." I don't believe she is - but any female candidate needs emotional armor, and relaxing it runs the risk of being perceived like Palin: a "folksy" woman who's too emotional and hasn't got the brains for real politics.

Those aren't major bonuses, but they're not supposed to be. They're minor positives, with no major negatives. The key aspects: He reinforces her progressive goals from a different angle, and he can do outreach with people she can't.

And I'm really, really looking forward to seeing him debate Pence.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 10:44 PM on July 22, 2016 [44 favorites]

Plus he really does come off as very calm and genuine. I hate to say something as trite as "good face and good vibes" but honestly, in an election year that kind of stuff can have a real impact. I watched Hillary's tampa speech tonight and then Kaine's interview, and honestly it felt good.
posted by you're a kitty! at 10:49 PM on July 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

I just wanted to provide some more context for the NY Dems who hate Hillary discussion further upthread. I am one of those NY Dems who cackled with glee at the "GO HOME HILLARY" signs posted around NY when she and Bill moved here after his Presidency was concluded. None of the dedicated NY Dems I know ever thought that Hillary's Senate career as a NY Dem was anything more than a box that needed to be checked before she ran for the office that she actually wanted. I never felt that she was particularly interested in NY, cared about the future of this state in particular, or had any long term plans to remain involved in NY politics for any length of time. I felt that she and Bill looked at a map, found a place where she could run for Senate and reliably win, then set up camp here. I still feel that way and I know quite a few bitter NYers who are annoyed at being used as a stepping stone for political expediency.

HOWEVER, I will be checking her box in November, no questions asked. My vote doesn't mean jack in a blue state, but obviously a Trump presidency can never be allowed to occur, and I would never let my personal distaste for Hillary get in the way of my desire to live in a Democracy run by a person with at least as many IQ points as I have. I have never doubted Hillary's sincerity when it comes to the Presidency--just her level of interest in my home state. All the other crap--the emails, the sniper fire statements, even the Whitewater mess--I don't give a shit about any of that. Most politicians are smooth operators, and it is Trump's inability to actually be politic that scares me more than anything else.

As for Kaine, I like him at first blush. My favorite thing about him is that he's a Catholic with internally consistent convictions who was visibly affected by the Pope's visit to Congress and yet he can somehow recognize the value of Roe vs. Wade and do his duty to the people even when he personally disagrees with something due to his religious convictions. As an atheist he's the kind of religious guy I can get behind wholeheartedly. I don't demand that my leaders agree with me on all points. I just want them to uphold the Constitution that supposedly guarantees freedom OF and FROM religion.
posted by xyzzy at 10:54 PM on July 22, 2016 [17 favorites]

VA is far more purple than some Democrats like to pretend

Given that pretty much every Dem statewide election victory in VA has been a squeaker, typically coming down to the last few precincts in Fairfax County, I don't see any complacency there. I do see narrow victories in years where Dems lost races in much bluer states.

What are the options here? Dem Senators who can be easily replaced are thin on the ground. Dem governors are thin on the ground. Castro has the Hatch Act investigation; Perez is a relative unknown whose last winning election campaign was for a county council seat for the DC burbs in 2002.

Seriously, a lot of the 2008 primary was all about Clinton Drama vs No-Drama Obama. Clinton has run a mostly no-drama campaign (no Mark fucking Penn, no Lanny fucking Davis) and is set to run a no-drama campaign against Crazy Guy and now you're kind of thirsting for drama?
posted by holgate at 10:57 PM on July 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

Filthy light thief - let's also give an * to Third Eye Blind who refused to play their hits at a concert in Cleveland during the RNC.
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:05 PM on July 22, 2016 [7 favorites]

Cmon people, lets work together, if for no other reason than RBG can finally retire. Think of how pissed she's going to be at you if we blow it.
posted by bongo_x at 11:10 PM on July 22, 2016 [20 favorites]

Damn, I grudgingly gave Cruz a tiny nod of respect and now Third Eye Blind? Nothing makes sense any more.
posted by bongo_x at 11:14 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

Oh! Talk of bands rejecting Trump reminds me. I could be wrong here, but some of the bands and songwriters may have grounds to sue. My understanding is that ASCAP licenses cover venue rights but don't cover broadcast rights.

Copyright law is a complex, byzantine set of agreements and there are different rights depending on how, when and where the song or the recording of the song are used. I think you need to have purchased "grand rights" to have the right to use the song in multiple media (live, on television and recorded) and to play the song in such a way that the intent is altered (like playing "What A Wonderful World" during a gun fight scene in a Nicolas Cage movie).

It's been my experience that very few people outside of copyright law really grasp all the ins and outs (I surely don't) and that many people routinely violate those laws even when they're warned not to.

I could be totally wrong. Short version - don't assume you can use Won't Get Fooled Again at your political rally and think you're safe from a lawsuit without checking with a copyright lawyer.
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:20 PM on July 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

Bongo_x - at thy end of the day, the only musician one can always be sure deserves some hate is the Beach Boys' Mike Love.
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:21 PM on July 22, 2016 [9 favorites]

(Other musicians have done much worse things, but Love wins for longevity)
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:24 PM on July 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

Short version - don't assume you can use Won't Get Fooled Again at your political rally and think you're safe from a lawsuit without checking with a copyright lawyer.

And not just a copyright lawyer, but one with experience in the music industry. A copyright lawyer whose skills are focused on publishing contracts or video game assets (or an IP lawyer who knows trademarks but not copyright at all) may make the wrong call - copyright law and the contracts attached to it are a mess, as in "steaming pile of entrails leaving streaks of you-hope-that's-blood on everything they touch," and even the really good, really experienced lawyers are occasionally caught off guard by odd judicial rulings.

There's no consistency in copyright rulings, because the law's never been updated to deal with modern tech. Copyright law was created to deal with corporate scams in an era where copy-and-share technology could only be purchased and managed by corporations, and it has not aged well.

tl;dr version: If those songwriters/performers have the right lawyer, they may have grounds for a solid case.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 11:40 PM on July 22, 2016 [4 favorites]

Hillary went to Twitter and told people to vote their conscience. I will and I urge everybody to do the same.
posted by Drinky Die at 12:06 AM on July 23, 2016 [3 favorites]

If someone feels their conscience permits them to cast a vote that has the potential to contribute even slightly to the remote possibility that Donald Trump might be elected President of the United States, then, well, I'm not 100% convinced that person understands what "vote your conscience" means.
posted by dersins at 12:13 AM on July 23, 2016 [13 favorites]

It's been my experience that very few people outside of copyright law really grasp all the ins and outs (I surely don't) and that many people routinely violate those laws even when they're warned not to.

Not entirely the same topic and from 2007, but:

Overly-broad copyright law has made USA a “nation of infringers”

posted by XMLicious at 12:14 AM on July 23, 2016 [1 favorite]

A couple of comments deleted. Let's not start again with another huge fight about Iraq, which we've been over a million times. Also, please, please, please, please, please don't start up again with all the personal attacks.
posted by taz (staff) at 12:45 AM on July 23, 2016 [2 favorites]

One last comment before I turn in... as a lefty lapsed Catholic, I'm pretty excited about the pick of Jesuit-educated Kaine. Also-- and I know this sounds pretty shallow (but I think it might be important nonetheless), Clinton/Kaine sounds pretty BOSS. Trump/Pence... does not.

Or, as Atom Eyes said earlier: On the plus side, 'Clinton Kaine' sounds like a badass hardboiled detective, whereas 'Trump Pence' just sounds like some old Victorian biddy hawking bags of birdseed.
posted by suburbanbeatnik at 12:50 AM on July 23, 2016 [4 favorites]

many people routinely violate those laws even when they're warned not to.

Kind of like... government email policy?
posted by Sara C. at 12:50 AM on July 23, 2016 [5 favorites]

Sara C - that's actually a really good analogy. Part of the reason I think both are ignored is because they're burdensome, inefficient and annoying to many people. Another reason is that they're both easy to violate repeatedly without getting caught so the offenders stop thinking it's a serious thing. The laws are there for good reasons but they often feel like annoyances.

I don't endorse breaking either set of laws and err on the side of being extra cautious in my own life but it's very tempting sometimes to want to throw caution to the wind and record a song or use an unsecured server. Sweet Freedom!
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:03 AM on July 23, 2016

I really just meant it as a joke. Trump picking songs for his stump speeches amounts to the same level of illegality as the Clinton email scandal. And yet.
posted by Sara C. at 1:16 AM on July 23, 2016 [3 favorites]

I will give myself 2 minutes to grieve that the pick was not Booker. I knew Warren was never going to be the pick and those that thought it was are not being at all realistic or listened to Warren herself.
The moment of Kaine vs Booker or Warren or Vilsack is over. Kaine is the pick. It's about Clinton/Kaine vs Trump/Pence now.
posted by like_neon at 1:17 AM on July 23, 2016 [3 favorites]

I was an Angry Young Liberal once. I looked at Gore/Lieberman and said "fuck this, I'm voting for Ralph."

Yup, me too. Except I was in a deep red state. But you know what? I did regret my vote. I regretted it when I watched Bush lead us to a pointless war and so, so many deaths. Would my vote have changed anything? Probably not. But the votes of ALL the angry young liberals who voted for Nader? Almost definitely would have.
posted by threeturtles at 1:24 AM on July 23, 2016 [23 favorites]

So my first late-night reactions after skimming through are, 1)If White Guy Speaking Spanish were really so helpful (as opposed to, say, Latinx person), maybe Jeb! would've fared better? ; 2)It gets really, really, really tiring for some Mefites to keep acting as if the disappointed progressives in this here thread don't also fucking vote in the midterm elections and work, year round, at improving voter turnout/fighting anti-voting legislation, etc. Stop with the fucking condesceding "try showing up for more than the presidential elections and whining" stuff, please.
posted by TwoStride at 1:39 AM on July 23, 2016 [3 favorites]

1)If White Guy Speaking Spanish were really so helpful (as opposed to, say, Latinx person), maybe Jeb! would've fared better?

I have no idea how much it will help Kaine (can't hurt though) but this doesn't follow; there aren't very many Spanish-as-first-language speakers in the Republican primary.
posted by Justinian at 1:45 AM on July 23, 2016 [6 favorites]

'Trump Pence' just sounds like some old Victorian biddy hawking bags of birdseed.

I thought Trump Pence were the small fines Victorian constables levied on people who farted in the street?
posted by Paul Slade at 2:07 AM on July 23, 2016 [9 favorites]

I enjoyed reading* Trump's comments at a post-convention rally about Cruz:

"Somebody got booed the hell out of a place by thousands and thousands of people," Trump said. "There wasn't one person in the room -- not one. And then they said there may not be unity. Unity? There wasn't one person in the room, including the Texas delegation, right? Honestly, he may have ruined his political career. I feel so badly. I feel so badly."
...
"You know, he'll come and endorse over the next little while," he said. "He'll — because he has no choice. But I don't want his endorsement. What difference does it make? And I don't want his endorsement. I have such great -- I don't want his endorsement. Just -- Ted, stay home, relax, enjoy yourself."

"Again, I don't want his endorsement," he said. "If he gives it, I will not accept it. Just so you understand. If he gives it -- I will not accept it."

Does this help Trump, even with his base? He's running against Cruz instead of Clinton, just like we hoped he would.

Also, in what way is that English? He sounds like a drunk at a bar talking about his girlfriend who dumped him eight hours ago.

* I read it instead of watching the video because I can't stand to hear his voice and I don't want to punch innocent people nearby in the face.
posted by mmoncur at 2:25 AM on July 23, 2016 [21 favorites]

And, on review, another comment deleted. As always, please don't mix up a bunch of complaints about Metafilter/Mefi users in comments here. Also, article-length comments get really difficult to handle, especially in monster threads, so consider saving the realllly long commentary for a more personal publishing space, and editing it down a little for discussion threads.
posted by taz (staff) at 2:25 AM on July 23, 2016 [6 favorites]

Trump has unveiled Kaine's nickname: Corrupt Kaine. (Swing and a miss, imo)

The Washington Post has some reporting on the personal gifts he has accepted and legally reported. It's pretty much a non-issue, there's never been an accusation of impropriety or exchange of official action for these gifts:

During his eight years as Virginia’s lieutenant governor and then governor, Kaine disclosed that he accepted $201,600 in personal gifts, according to data compiled from the Virginia Public Access Project, a nonpartisan tracker of money in state politics.

The majority of those gifts came in the form of air travel, including from the 2008 campaign of President Obama, which paid to fly Kaine across the country as a campaign surrogate. Under murky Virginia law, the proper way to disclose such political travel has been unclear; other politicians have disclosed it as a campaign contribution to their political action committee, rather than a personal gift, as did Kaine.

More than $32,000 of Kaine’s gifts were travel expenses paid by the state’s economic development agency during trade missions he took in his official role as governor.

But some of Kaine’s other gifts were more tangible. Stuart C. Siegel, chairman of S&K Famous Brands Menswear, gave Kaine a total of $5,500 in clothing in 2003 and 2005. Siegel is a close friend of Kaine’s; Kaine introduced Siegel to his wife and presided at their wedding. Siegel did not return a call for comment.

In 2006, Teva Pharmaceuticals paid $12,000 to fly Kaine to the annual meeting of the Democratic Governors Association. Two years later, the company received a $900,000 economic incentive to expand its Virginia operations. The company has donated to campaigns of both Democrats and Republicans in Virginia.

Other gifts Kaine reported included $850 worth of Washington Wizards basketball tickets from a Virginia businessman who had contributed $10,000 to Kaine’s 2005 campaign; eight tickets to a Dave Matthews concert from the University of Virginia; and a 3-by-5-foot prayer rug from then-Afghan president Hamid Karzai.

posted by peeedro at 3:06 AM on July 23, 2016 [3 favorites]

How do you square that with the fact that he started out blogging at DailyKos and openly voted for Obama?

I know this sounds amazing to the good people of Metafilter, but the Clintons have succeeded in creating a political party which is friendly to big business, believes financial innovation on Wall Street is crucial to the US economy and an engine of growth, that LBJ's "Great Society" program was a mistake and government welfare holds people back, that the best solutions to social problems involve using market forces, that "free trade" is always good, that enviromental concerns need to be balanced by economic costs, that the federal government needs to mandate tough sentences for certain crimes, that federal aid to law enforcement is crucial to controlling crime, and finally, that the US needs a gigantic military and that military is a useful tool to advance the interests of the US across the globe. Also, this party is tolerant of minority social groups and believes women should have access to abortion even though it's distasteful.

With the pick of Kaine, Clinton has confirmed that her politics really haven't changed that much and that she doesn't need the support of people to the left of her. She's making an open appeal to Republicans who hate Trump and, just based on her political views, I don't see why many Republicans wouldn't feel comfortable in the Clinton's Democratic party.
posted by ennui.bz at 3:58 AM on July 23, 2016 [8 favorites]

Surely the Trump Pence was an infamous one penny stamp that featured Queen Victoria in full length profile. Due to an unfortunate error in judgment there appears to be be wafts of air emanating from her bustle.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:59 AM on July 23, 2016 [3 favorites]

She's making an open appeal to Republicans who hate Trump and, just based on her political views, I don't see why many Republicans wouldn't feel comfortable in the Clinton's Democratic party.

Probably because the majority of her views, particularly on social issues, are the opposite of the views of the Republican party. That her views on trade align with centrist Republicans (and centrist Democrats) isn't particularly noteworthy; views are centrist when they are widely held, by definition. But you're grossly overstating her similarities with Republicans and understating her similarities with the progressive left. She was, after all, the 14th most liberal Senator when she was in the Senate. 85% of the Senate are not basically Republicans.
posted by Justinian at 4:17 AM on July 23, 2016 [24 favorites]

New Thread!
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 4:23 AM on July 23, 2016 [3 favorites]

Tim Kaine is an awesome human being. I'm excited about this pick.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 4:26 AM on July 23, 2016 [4 favorites]

Not super related but Kaine's Spanish is impressively good. Like near native good.

I feel like Kaine and Jeb Bush have the best non native Spanish I have ever heard since moving to the US. I am super impressed with them.
posted by Tarumba at 6:05 AM on July 23, 2016 [6 favorites]

Over at National Review, they're still pushing the "not our party" line, as though "principled conservatives" had nothing to do with Trump's rise. They're even putting some of the blame on GWB, who they were worshipping as a god 15 years ago.
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:40 AM on July 23, 2016 [2 favorites]

Interesting Vox article by a corb-like person (@unknowndelegate) who opposed Trump at the convention.
posted by lauranesson at 6:56 AM on July 23, 2016 [1 favorite]

There are a lot of Republicans that don't want to vote for Clinton, there are a lot of Republicans that don't want to vote for Trump.

If Kaine is the trigger that gets those Republicans that are on the fence to go "Man I really don't want to vote for Clinton but there is no moral defense of being a 'Good' Nazi" and then hold their nose and vote for Clinton in November then more power too him.

One of the criticism of Hillary is that she's an opportunist and doesn't live her principles even though all evidence is that her faith and principles are very important to her. Kaine is counterprogramming to that narrative because he comes across as moderate but also extremely principled. His faith tells him abortion is morally objectionable but he also respects that Roe v Wade is settled legal ground and that his personal faith shouldn't dictate public policy.

Render onto Caesar what is Caesar type stuff.

Honestly if more politicians that espouse Christian value actually lived their faith more like Tim Kaine I think a lot of humanists and atheists would be a lot more comfortable with the direction this country is headed.
posted by vuron at 7:29 AM on July 23, 2016 [26 favorites]

. "There wasn't one person in the room -- not one. And then they said there may not be unity. Unity? There wasn't one person in the room, including the Texas delegation,

Was he at the same convention I was? The one where there was nearly fist fights in the back of the hall?
posted by corb at 8:19 AM on July 23, 2016 [15 favorites]

Matt Taibbi: Trump's Appetite for Destruction: How Disastrous Convention Doomed GOP. Republican National Convention made a joke of American democracy
posted by homunculus at 10:10 AM on July 23, 2016 [3 favorites]

Probably because the majority of her views, particularly on social issues, are the opposite of the views of the Republican party.

And yet Ivanka Trump's speech could have been plagiarized from a Clinton stump speech on women's issues, and was met with WILD cheers from the convention audience.
posted by Sara C. at 10:19 AM on July 23, 2016 [1 favorite]

Perhaps that was the applause of ha ha it thinks it's people.
posted by phearlez at 10:30 AM on July 23, 2016 [3 favorites]

This is good.
posted by you're a kitty! at 10:38 AM on July 23, 2016

Kaine is a longtime and stalwart supporter of public education. In that respect he has it all over Booker, who has been super gung ho about corporatized charter schools. Strong public education is so fundamental to equality, social justice, economic justice, and a healthy democracy, and I think it's been a real weakness on the left (including Sanders). For that reason alone, I'm excited about Kaine.

Diane Ravitch: Tim Kaine Loves Public Schools. So Does His Wife Anne, Who is Virginia’s Secretary of Education
posted by Salamandrous at 10:52 AM on July 23, 2016 [9 favorites]

New Thread!
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:23 on July 23

I came back to this thread and I was SO EXCITED at how few comments there were to catch up on and then I saw this.

:(
posted by Anonymous at 11:03 AM on July 23, 2016

Trump's Appetite for Destruction: How Disastrous Convention Doomed GOP. Republican National Convention made a joke of American democracy

Taibbi takes a long time to go nowhere with this one, while getting in a few digs against liberal targets along the.
posted by codacorolla at 12:35 PM on July 23, 2016 [1 favorite]

Par for the course for him, really.
posted by dersins at 1:29 PM on July 23, 2016 [2 favorites]

Well, this really captured how I felt:

It wasn't what we expected. We thought Donald Trump's version of the Republican National Convention would be a brilliantly bawdy exercise in Nazistic excess. ... What happened instead was just sad and weird, very weird.

I'm relieved.
posted by RedOrGreen at 9:06 PM on July 23, 2016 [2 favorites]

At the Convention Center in Philly, there were a lot of things including:
1) A couple of TV screens with Trump's bloated orange squinty face and
2) The car JFK was in when he was assassinated

I was like this is not happy fun times
posted by angrycat at 3:26 AM on July 24, 2016 [2 favorites]

“History tells us what will happen next with Brexit & Trump,” Tobias Stone, Medium, 23 July 2016
posted by ob1quixote at 7:58 AM on July 24, 2016 [7 favorites]

The particularly insidious thing is that, if the warnings are actually headed and calamity avoided, everyone says, "See, you guys were worried over nothing."
posted by VTX at 9:08 AM on July 24, 2016 [14 favorites]

The Y2K effect.
posted by Artw at 9:12 AM on July 24, 2016 [7 favorites]

"See, you guys were worried over nothing."

I don't think that's true. Trump will never admit to being a loser. He will be leading the "electoral fraud" witch hunt and Twitter garbage spew for years and years. You will always have something to read and remember why you didn't vote for him.
posted by Gary at 9:18 AM on July 24, 2016 [1 favorite]

Which Game of Thrones Characters Would Be Republicans, According to Delegates at the RNC
posted by homunculus at 6:51 PM on July 24, 2016 [1 favorite]

How Donald Trump Broke The Conservative Movement (And My Heart)

Nearly absent from this speech — Trump’s coronation before millions of people — were many of the issues that have defined and dominated the Republican Party in recent years (abortion, Israel, soluble entitlements) at the exclusion of one (immigration). More to the point: Trump is all about government. He is for a government that takes care of you. He is disinterested in talk of democratic principles. He is concerned with the inactivity of the state, not the tyranny of power. The idea that you don’t want government in your life, the premise of movement conservatism for six decades, is gone.

And nobody seems to mind that much.

posted by the man of twists and turns at 9:52 PM on July 24, 2016 [3 favorites]

Samuel Freedman, The Forward: How Republicans Tried To Flip the Jewish Vote — and Created Donald Trump
posted by the man of twists and turns at 5:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]

How Republicans Tried To Flip the Jewish Vote — and Created Donald Trump

What a remarkably stupid and unfocused article. I suppose he did fulfill the promise of the headline, technically:

1) Republicans want Jews to vote Republican;
2) Republicans created Trump.

But, you'd think that the premise of the article is that 1) implies 2), and he never gets around to demonstrating it.
posted by Joe in Australia at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]

David Auerbach, Donald Trump: Moosbrugger for President - "There is a void at the heart of Donald Trump." Links inside.

Low Dollar, Same Grift, Josh Marshall

The Trump Movement and the Left-Behinds (and Il Duce too), James Fallows
posted by the man of twists and turns at 7:50 AM on July 26, 2016

> He will be leading the "electoral fraud" witch hunt
Esp. if someone shoots up an east coast polling place 1st thing election day morning and scares people away from the polls.
posted by morganw at 11:54 PM on July 26, 2016

How Donald Trump Broke The Conservative Movement (And My Heart)

It's a bit weird to read a history of the Republican party that doesn't mention the Southern Strategy, compare and contrast:

How the Southern Strategy Made Donald Trump Possible
posted by sebastienbailard at 2:27 AM on July 27, 2016 [6 favorites]

tl;dr version: If those songwriters/performers have the right lawyer, they may have grounds for a solid case.

I know this thread is basically "over", but i just wanted to chime in on this and say that i heard from the inside track-side, via a relative of someone in the band, that a memorable 80s rock group you still hear from occasionally successfully sued the McCain campaign on this one.

They settled out of court in the mid five figures. McCain's nuclear powered lawyers apparently said "this isn't worth fighting, this shit could go either way".

The end of the anecdote was that they didn't really get much money out of it after having to pay their own lawyers, but that they 100% did it on principal.

This is absolutely 100% not just the venue having an ASCAP license. There's no way in hell they would have settled if it was.
posted by emptythought at 4:54 AM on July 28, 2016

Would a venue's ASCAP license even cover a televised broadcast? (Or a YouTube clip? I mean, heck, copyright holders -- publishers, record labels, whatever -- could probably erase Trump's whole campaign from YouTube with copyright strikes.)
posted by Sys Rq at 11:32 AM on July 28, 2016

Donald Trump is Making America Crazy Again - "Is civilised society breaking down? Or does it just seem like that from the Republican convention?"
posted by the man of twists and turns at 4:26 PM on July 28, 2016

Ethics in journalism: @yuenok turned down a $200,000 bribe seeking to remove three points from her story.

When the Trump kids went to war. (LOL GOP version)
posted by jeffburdges at 6:33 AM on August 4, 2016

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Summon all the courage you require, then count. (Day 1, 2, 3, FOUR) RNC July 21, 2016 5:31 AM Subscribe

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Summon all the courage you require, then count. (Day 1, 2, 3, FOUR) RNC
July 21, 2016 5:31 AM Subscribe