Chase the Clouds Away
July 25, 2016 12:34 PM Subscribe
The Democratic National Convention in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, starts today.
On the schedule, day one:
AAPI (Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders) Caucus. "The Congressional Asian Pacific American Caucus (CAPAC) is comprised of Members of Congress of Asian and Pacific Islander descent and members who have a strong dedication to promoting the well-being of the Asian American and Pacific Islander (AAPI) community. Currently chaired by Congresswoman Judy Chu, CAPAC has been addressing the needs of the AAPI community in all areas of American life since it was founded in 1994. CAPAC is non-partisan and bi-cameral."
Native American Council Caucus. "NCAI was established in 1944 in response to the termination and assimilation policies the US government forced upon tribal governments in contradiction of their treaty rights and status as sovereign nations. To this day, protecting these inherent and legal rights remains the primary focus of NCAI."
Black Caucus. "Since its establishment in 1971, Members of the Congressional Black Caucus (CBC) have joined together to empower America’s neglected citizens and address their legislative concerns."
Hispanic Caucus. "The CHC aims to address national and international issues and the impact these policies have on the Hispanic community. The function of the Caucus is to serve as a forum for the Hispanic Members of Congress to coalesce around a collective legislative agenda. The Caucus is dedicated to voicing and advancing, through the legislative process, issues affecting Hispanics in the United States, Puerto Rico, and the Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana Islands."
Ethnic Council. "The NDECC reaches across all ethnic, racial, national origin, and religious identifications to the common heritage that America’s diverse constituencies share as immigrants to a pluralistic nation, committed to democracy, human rights, peace, opportunity, fairness, and freedom."
Disability Council. "NCD is an independent federal agency charged with advising the President, Congress, and other federal agencies regarding policies, programs, practices, and procedures that affect people with disabilities."
Small Business Owners Council.
Veterans and Military Families Council.
Labor Council.
After the 'gavel in' at 4:00 pm Eastern/Standard Time (US), speakers will be:
Pam Livengood. Pam and her husband Jon acquired legal guardianship of their grandson because of his parents' addictions to drugs.
Karla and Francisca Ortiz. "Karla is an American citizen but her parents, including mother Francisca, are undocumented and live in fear of deportation. Karla met Hillary Clinton in Nevada and was featured in the ad, 'Brave.' "
Anastasia Somoza. "Anastasia was born and raised in New York City, is fluent in both English and Spanish, and has been a disability rights advocate and human rights defender since the age of nine."
Astrid Silva. "They said no when I wanted to be a cheerleader. They said no when I wanted to attend a magnet school. They kept saying no. In my teen angsty way, I was annoyed. I thought they were being unfair," Silva wrote about her parents in a 2014 opinion piece in USA Today. "As I grew up, I started to understand that they weren't being unfair, they were afraid. They were afraid they'd have to show papers and people would discover we were undocumented."
Senator Bernie Sanders.
First Lady of the United States Michelle Obama.
On the schedule, day one:
AAPI (Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders) Caucus. "The Congressional Asian Pacific American Caucus (CAPAC) is comprised of Members of Congress of Asian and Pacific Islander descent and members who have a strong dedication to promoting the well-being of the Asian American and Pacific Islander (AAPI) community. Currently chaired by Congresswoman Judy Chu, CAPAC has been addressing the needs of the AAPI community in all areas of American life since it was founded in 1994. CAPAC is non-partisan and bi-cameral."
Native American Council Caucus. "NCAI was established in 1944 in response to the termination and assimilation policies the US government forced upon tribal governments in contradiction of their treaty rights and status as sovereign nations. To this day, protecting these inherent and legal rights remains the primary focus of NCAI."
Black Caucus. "Since its establishment in 1971, Members of the Congressional Black Caucus (CBC) have joined together to empower America’s neglected citizens and address their legislative concerns."
Hispanic Caucus. "The CHC aims to address national and international issues and the impact these policies have on the Hispanic community. The function of the Caucus is to serve as a forum for the Hispanic Members of Congress to coalesce around a collective legislative agenda. The Caucus is dedicated to voicing and advancing, through the legislative process, issues affecting Hispanics in the United States, Puerto Rico, and the Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana Islands."
Ethnic Council. "The NDECC reaches across all ethnic, racial, national origin, and religious identifications to the common heritage that America’s diverse constituencies share as immigrants to a pluralistic nation, committed to democracy, human rights, peace, opportunity, fairness, and freedom."
Disability Council. "NCD is an independent federal agency charged with advising the President, Congress, and other federal agencies regarding policies, programs, practices, and procedures that affect people with disabilities."
Small Business Owners Council.
Veterans and Military Families Council.
Labor Council.
After the 'gavel in' at 4:00 pm Eastern/Standard Time (US), speakers will be:
Pam Livengood. Pam and her husband Jon acquired legal guardianship of their grandson because of his parents' addictions to drugs.
Karla and Francisca Ortiz. "Karla is an American citizen but her parents, including mother Francisca, are undocumented and live in fear of deportation. Karla met Hillary Clinton in Nevada and was featured in the ad, 'Brave.' "
Anastasia Somoza. "Anastasia was born and raised in New York City, is fluent in both English and Spanish, and has been a disability rights advocate and human rights defender since the age of nine."
Astrid Silva. "They said no when I wanted to be a cheerleader. They said no when I wanted to attend a magnet school. They kept saying no. In my teen angsty way, I was annoyed. I thought they were being unfair," Silva wrote about her parents in a 2014 opinion piece in USA Today. "As I grew up, I started to understand that they weren't being unfair, they were afraid. They were afraid they'd have to show papers and people would discover we were undocumented."
Senator Bernie Sanders.
First Lady of the United States Michelle Obama.
Thanks everyone for being generally excellent in these megathreads. You are a wonderful community.
posted by aspersioncast at 12:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [45 favorites]
posted by aspersioncast at 12:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [45 favorites]
Additional live streams (the DNC homepage will apparently have one as well):
- twitch
- youtube
posted by cortex at 12:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
- twitch
- youtube
posted by cortex at 12:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
(This FPP is posted with cooker girl's permission, btw. Not trying to steal the thunder of her earlier deleted, excellent, but just a tad too-early thread.)
posted by misskaz at 12:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by misskaz at 12:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
There was an article linked in the last thread that I thought was very good and worth posting again – The Hillary Haters.
This passage in particular stood out to me as something that I feel like I’m seeing a lot:
Rosner also makes a fairly standard progressive case against Clinton. “I don’t like her support for the Iraq war,” she says. “She didn’t support same-sex marriage until it became a popular issue. Her email stuff—she is the only one that would not testify, and I think that’s bullshit. I don’t like her friendship with Netanyahu. I think they’ve destroyed the Middle East with Iraq. I don’t like that she takes money from big banks. She doesn’t support universal health care. For all those reasons. I think she’s more a Republican than a Democrat, and I refuse to vote for Republicans, ever.”
All the same, Rosner says she would happily vote for Joe Biden, who also voted for the Iraq war. In the Senate, Biden was known for his deep ties to the credit card industry, and as a presidential candidate, he didn’t support universal health insurance. “Yeah, Biden does not have all the positions I would like, but he has a certain kind of humanity that touches me,” she says.
Great post – thank you.
posted by triggerfinger at 12:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [53 favorites]
This passage in particular stood out to me as something that I feel like I’m seeing a lot:
Rosner also makes a fairly standard progressive case against Clinton. “I don’t like her support for the Iraq war,” she says. “She didn’t support same-sex marriage until it became a popular issue. Her email stuff—she is the only one that would not testify, and I think that’s bullshit. I don’t like her friendship with Netanyahu. I think they’ve destroyed the Middle East with Iraq. I don’t like that she takes money from big banks. She doesn’t support universal health care. For all those reasons. I think she’s more a Republican than a Democrat, and I refuse to vote for Republicans, ever.”
All the same, Rosner says she would happily vote for Joe Biden, who also voted for the Iraq war. In the Senate, Biden was known for his deep ties to the credit card industry, and as a presidential candidate, he didn’t support universal health insurance. “Yeah, Biden does not have all the positions I would like, but he has a certain kind of humanity that touches me,” she says.
Great post – thank you.
posted by triggerfinger at 12:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [53 favorites]
If this isn't too off-topic, is there a way folks have been able to look after their emotional health in the midst of all of this? I keep diving in, hoping that I'll find the political news that will ease the anxiety.
"Unplug" hasn't helped as advice. Or at least advice on how to unplug would be helpful. I can't make it to November this way.
posted by argybarg at 12:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
"Unplug" hasn't helped as advice. Or at least advice on how to unplug would be helpful. I can't make it to November this way.
posted by argybarg at 12:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
Strap in, it's going to be a bumpy thread.
I find that I'm having to remind myself constantly that the election is not until November, and we will have debates, and more people will realize how horrible Trump is/would be, and the #NeverHillary crowd will realize that present massive crises should be prioritized over ideological disputes, and everyone will get a puppy, and rainbows will be in the sky every day...
Right? Right?
posted by Gaz Errant at 12:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I find that I'm having to remind myself constantly that the election is not until November, and we will have debates, and more people will realize how horrible Trump is/would be, and the #NeverHillary crowd will realize that present massive crises should be prioritized over ideological disputes, and everyone will get a puppy, and rainbows will be in the sky every day...
Right? Right?
posted by Gaz Errant at 12:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
angry hiss
posted by poffin boffin at 12:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by poffin boffin at 12:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
“No naps for Trump! I don’t take naps!” - Donald Trump
"Do all the good you can—measure your life by the positive effect you can have on other people’s lives." —@TimKaine
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
"Do all the good you can—measure your life by the positive effect you can have on other people’s lives." —@TimKaine
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
(Another million thanks to cortex and taz for being overwhelmingly excellent and for suggesting I ask someone else to post, and to misskaz for agreeing to do so. This would have been my first FPP, fyi.)
posted by cooker girl at 12:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [74 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 12:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [74 favorites]
Trump's speech just now;
Clinton is a backstabber for throwing DWS under the bus, Sanders is weak because he got boo'd, some rambling craziness about Clinton taking naps.
That really worked out well.
posted by bongo_x at 12:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Clinton is a backstabber for throwing DWS under the bus, Sanders is weak because he got boo'd, some rambling craziness about Clinton taking naps.
That really worked out well.
posted by bongo_x at 12:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I also heard that Elizabeth Warren is speaking tonight, but I can't seem to find a schedule with actual times.
posted by k8bot at 12:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by k8bot at 12:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Ugh, I was going to vote Trump but I can't get behind a candidate who is anti-nap.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 12:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [111 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 12:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [111 favorites]
argybarg, I re-watch a lot of the Clinton speeches and especially any of Tim Kaine's recent ones. I look at the diversity represented at the DNC. I also snuggle my kitties a lot and roughhouse with the dog.
posted by cooker girl at 12:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 12:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I live here in Philly. I work a lot but I'm off on Wednesday. If anyone has any ideas on stuff I could do to support Secretary Clinton, that'd be cool.
posted by lazaruslong at 12:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by lazaruslong at 12:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
ROANOKE, Va. — As Pence speaks here about Hillary Clinton... among chants of “Lock her up!”… someone shouts out, “Kill her!”
posted by zombieflanders at 12:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 12:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I am having a really hard time with the anti-Hillary booing, the selfish obstructionism, and Bernie Sanders' response (or lack thereof). Like emotionally, I'm just having a really hard time with the idea that there are this many people who hate Hillary more than they hate the specter of white supremacist fascism. This is the most frightened I've been, because I remember Nader.
So I just wanted to say that I'm really grateful for these threads and this community. This might be what keeps me sane today.
posted by schadenfrau at 12:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [133 favorites]
So I just wanted to say that I'm really grateful for these threads and this community. This might be what keeps me sane today.
posted by schadenfrau at 12:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [133 favorites]
By all means let's make naps a partisan fulcrum. I'm fucking #teamnaps till they put me in the ground.
posted by penduluum at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
If you take a nap in the afternoon, you'll be better rested for that 3am phone call everyone is always talking about in politics.
I'm pro-nap.*
*In theory. In reality, I can't seem to take naps - if I sleep it'll be for at least 5 hours.
posted by el io at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I'm pro-nap.*
*In theory. In reality, I can't seem to take naps - if I sleep it'll be for at least 5 hours.
posted by el io at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Right there with you, schadenfrau. Sending hugs and good vibes.
posted by stolyarova at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Ugh, I was going to vote Trump but I can't get behind a candidate who is anti-nap.
Giant Orange Toddler Refuses Nap
this shit just writes itself
posted by Existential Dread at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [119 favorites]
Giant Orange Toddler Refuses Nap
this shit just writes itself
posted by Existential Dread at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [119 favorites]
Another cheer for MetaFilter, and especially these daily threads. You're doing a great job of meta-filtering all the noise on FB and Twitter.
posted by monospace at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by monospace at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Sam Wang, Princeton Election Consortium: The polls are always bouncing to the left and to the right
posted by the man of twists and turns at 12:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by the man of twists and turns at 12:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Ugh, I was going to vote Trump but I can't get behind a candidate who is anti-nap.
As a parent of a four year old, I say we need more naps, the best naps, YUGE naps!
posted by Fleebnork at 12:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
As a parent of a four year old, I say we need more naps, the best naps, YUGE naps!
posted by Fleebnork at 12:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
Really hoping that this convention is gonna turn out okay. The last few days -- Trump's giant gurning face leering over his own shoulder at the acceptance speech, the DNC email debacle, the poll numbers, the implacability of the Bernie-or-Busters, the alarming number of people in my facebook feed saying they are done with the Democratic Party -- has got me legit worried.
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 12:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 12:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Apparently Warren will speak after Michelle Obama. Hmmm. The DNC really ought to update its schedule.
posted by cooker girl at 12:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 12:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Check out how diverse that line up is. This. This is what gives me hope.
Actual diversity in the form of whole entire caucuses and councils, not just cherry-picked tokens.
"Unplug" hasn't helped as advice. Or at least advice on how to unplug would be helpful.
Unplugging for unplugging's sake is basically never going to get you any where. They key is to unplug and go do something. See Ghostbusters or Star Trek, since I'm hearing good stuff about both. Weather allowing, go play some Pokemon GO. Grab a book you've been meaning to read, or binge a Netflix show you've been meaning to watch (Stranger Things is great).
posted by tobascodagama at 12:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Actual diversity in the form of whole entire caucuses and councils, not just cherry-picked tokens.
"Unplug" hasn't helped as advice. Or at least advice on how to unplug would be helpful.
Unplugging for unplugging's sake is basically never going to get you any where. They key is to unplug and go do something. See Ghostbusters or Star Trek, since I'm hearing good stuff about both. Weather allowing, go play some Pokemon GO. Grab a book you've been meaning to read, or binge a Netflix show you've been meaning to watch (Stranger Things is great).
posted by tobascodagama at 12:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
What are all the caucuses actually doing today?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I'm really anticipating an excellent convention here people. This is a great lineup.
posted by aspersioncast at 12:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by aspersioncast at 12:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
is there a way folks have been able to look after their emotional health in the midst of all of this?
I spent Saturday building a wooden stool for my basement workbench. I then had a few celebratory cocktails seated on that bench.
Don't just unplug, find something where you won't think about any of this for a few hours.
posted by cmfletcher at 12:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I spent Saturday building a wooden stool for my basement workbench. I then had a few celebratory cocktails seated on that bench.
Don't just unplug, find something where you won't think about any of this for a few hours.
posted by cmfletcher at 12:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
The DNC convention site's schedule lists just the speakers in the FPP (great fpp btw, well done cooker girl and misskaz), but this article has more names, then this one has some different people. I just want an accurate listing of who is speaking when! Why is that so hard!
posted by everybody had matching towels at 12:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by everybody had matching towels at 12:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm happy to put in a vote for Stranger Things! Stranger Things for president! (Also saved me 6+ hours of political head-banging.)
posted by argybarg at 12:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 12:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
the Stranger Things opening credits for president 2016
posted by burgerrr at 12:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
posted by burgerrr at 12:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
You know who naps? Sleeper cells. Very sad.
posted by Kabanos at 12:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by Kabanos at 12:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Debates? There will be debates?
Look, if Trump says he's not going to release his tax releases, there is nothing preventing him from saying he won't debate Clinton. He's very comfortable breaking from established tradition in his race to win.
posted by el io at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Look, if Trump says he's not going to release his tax releases, there is nothing preventing him from saying he won't debate Clinton. He's very comfortable breaking from established tradition in his race to win.
posted by el io at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
One thing is for sure, there will be a lot of MeFites with engorged livers after November. And possibly beyond.
posted by Kitteh at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by Kitteh at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
“No naps for Trump! I don’t take naps!” - Donald Trump
Donald Trump's crazy
He always smokes dust
He's got his own room
At the back of the bus
posted by Sys Rq at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Donald Trump's crazy
He always smokes dust
He's got his own room
At the back of the bus
posted by Sys Rq at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I think, scadenfrau, we've got a pretty big plurality of people who "hate" Clinton (or at least find her unpalatably corrupt/dishonest) and also fear Trump, and all those things you mention.
The "good" news is that fear usually wins out over dislike, so I don't think there's anything to worry about, in that way.
The bad news is, fear-vs-dislike is a long way from hope and change, so there's no way this election season is ever going to be positive or happy or full of exciting energy, even if and when we get the very likely (and clearly preferable) result.
So I guess I'm saying... be content and don't fret over the lack of joy. Resigned sad votes count just as much as passionate ones, anyway.
Content is good enough when you're dodging bullets.
posted by rokusan at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
The "good" news is that fear usually wins out over dislike, so I don't think there's anything to worry about, in that way.
The bad news is, fear-vs-dislike is a long way from hope and change, so there's no way this election season is ever going to be positive or happy or full of exciting energy, even if and when we get the very likely (and clearly preferable) result.
So I guess I'm saying... be content and don't fret over the lack of joy. Resigned sad votes count just as much as passionate ones, anyway.
Content is good enough when you're dodging bullets.
posted by rokusan at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I work right next to City Hall. Bernie supporters have been protesting non-stop literally all day long... in 98-degree heat.
I'm thinking Hillary doesn't have the support she thought she did.
Once the RNC was over, I looked at that shit typhoon and said to myself, "All the democrats have to do is not fuck this up."
The next morning I got up and read about a Wikileaks release and just shook my head. I'm still going to vote, but I'm also going to start getting used to the idea of a President Trump, because the democrats seem to be great at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
posted by prepmonkey at 12:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
I'm thinking Hillary doesn't have the support she thought she did.
Once the RNC was over, I looked at that shit typhoon and said to myself, "All the democrats have to do is not fuck this up."
The next morning I got up and read about a Wikileaks release and just shook my head. I'm still going to vote, but I'm also going to start getting used to the idea of a President Trump, because the democrats seem to be great at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
posted by prepmonkey at 12:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
the Stranger Things opening credits for president 2016
I'll see you and raise you John Carpenter's Lost Themes. Carpenter/Thing 2016!
posted by Existential Dread at 12:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I'll see you and raise you John Carpenter's Lost Themes. Carpenter/Thing 2016!
posted by Existential Dread at 12:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
If this isn't too off-topic, is there a way folks have been able to look after their emotional health in the midst of all of this?I'm sure that I'll have good ideas later on, but right now I'm just succumbing to the rage blackout. There may be some angry cleaning tonight. At least the kitchen floor will be spotless.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 12:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
After last week I actually have a severe desire to just ignore the convention and unplug from political coverage completely for a while. This is warring with a need to hear some optimism from the DNC speeches. What looks like a war between StillBernies and the rest of the Democrats is definitely making me lean towards the unplug option.
posted by Gaz Errant at 12:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Gaz Errant at 12:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
At least for this week realize a rowdy convention is not going to lose Hillary the election.
The #NeverHillary folks are a minority even among Bernie supporters, and many of them will probably come around if Clinton can avoid doing anything to pointlessly antagonise them (like, I dunno, hire DWS back right after she resigns over stupid shit she said in the DNC leaks emails) for a while and Kaine gets a chance to talk up his anti-redlining work.
posted by tobascodagama at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
The #NeverHillary folks are a minority even among Bernie supporters, and many of them will probably come around if Clinton can avoid doing anything to pointlessly antagonise them (like, I dunno, hire DWS back right after she resigns over stupid shit she said in the DNC leaks emails) for a while and Kaine gets a chance to talk up his anti-redlining work.
posted by tobascodagama at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
"Unplug" hasn't helped as advice. Or at least advice on how to unplug would be helpful. I can't make it to November this way.
I have a dictionary-length Twitter keyword blocklist and also I spend a lot of time reflecting on how there is literally nothing that will get me to change my vote so paying any solid attention to the shitshow is just going to make me less enthusiastic about either my vote (DNC) or human civilization (RNC).
posted by griphus at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I have a dictionary-length Twitter keyword blocklist and also I spend a lot of time reflecting on how there is literally nothing that will get me to change my vote so paying any solid attention to the shitshow is just going to make me less enthusiastic about either my vote (DNC) or human civilization (RNC).
posted by griphus at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I'll see you and raise you John Carpenter's Lost Themes yt . Carpenter/Thing 2016!
the stranger things soundtrack is sooo john carpenter. i saw him live a month or two ago and it was wonderful. i fully support carpenter/things 2016
also: getting out into nature like going to a river or lake or something where you can float around and drink beers and not look at the internet/politics is going to be key for the next few months
posted by burgerrr at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
the stranger things soundtrack is sooo john carpenter. i saw him live a month or two ago and it was wonderful. i fully support carpenter/things 2016
also: getting out into nature like going to a river or lake or something where you can float around and drink beers and not look at the internet/politics is going to be key for the next few months
posted by burgerrr at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
My picks for unplugging the past couple weekends/weeknights: Stranger Things, reading a book (Becky Chambers' A Long Way to a Small Angry Planet was my pick on Saturday, which was some good old fashioned space opera), and playing Starbound.
posted by yasaman at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I need a paper bag to breathe into, a stiff drink, and a lot of Netflix. I'm prone to subclinical generalized anxiety but it's been going full-on clinical because of this. I can't stop thinking about the world my little boy is growing up in to.
On a practical tip: we just bought a new house and it needs a new kitchen pretty desperately, but I'm going to put that off until November because I'm a Canadian dual citizen and I might need that money to flee the country with my family. Totally not joking.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
On a practical tip: we just bought a new house and it needs a new kitchen pretty desperately, but I'm going to put that off until November because I'm a Canadian dual citizen and I might need that money to flee the country with my family. Totally not joking.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
"She worked very hard to rig the system little did know that China Russia one of our many many friends hacked the hell out of us." - Trump
That's some interesting phrasing there.
posted by zombieflanders at 12:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
That's some interesting phrasing there.
posted by zombieflanders at 12:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
There's been buzz that the Clinton camp is also uninterested in debates, el io.
The thinking being that she has a comfortable lead now and won't win over any new converts anyway (and doesn't need them) while the wild randomness Trump can introduce could tip over the cart in so many unpredictable ways. It's better to stay in control, etc.
(Not sure how I feel about that, other than modern debates are always far too staged anyway. I'd love the League of Women Voters, or some other independent group, back in charge, but that'll never happen again. Again, too much wild randomness. Better to stay in control.)
posted by rokusan at 12:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The thinking being that she has a comfortable lead now and won't win over any new converts anyway (and doesn't need them) while the wild randomness Trump can introduce could tip over the cart in so many unpredictable ways. It's better to stay in control, etc.
(Not sure how I feel about that, other than modern debates are always far too staged anyway. I'd love the League of Women Voters, or some other independent group, back in charge, but that'll never happen again. Again, too much wild randomness. Better to stay in control.)
posted by rokusan at 12:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Mod note: Reminder to anyone currently unmoored in time: there's been threads all throughout the primary season that you can go back and reread if where you are right now is wanting to experience mid-primary-season arguments. Re-litigating all of that in here is not going to make this a more useful or interesting thread.
posted by cortex (staff) at 12:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [46 favorites]
posted by cortex (staff) at 12:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [46 favorites]
Kaine gets a chance to talk up his anti-redlining work.
Uh no offense but if you think the people in Philly holding "Hillary for Prison" signs are going to start supporting the ticket because Kaine's progressive policy wins...
I mean that's just not going to happen.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 12:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Uh no offense but if you think the people in Philly holding "Hillary for Prison" signs are going to start supporting the ticket because Kaine's progressive policy wins...
I mean that's just not going to happen.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 12:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
So, where are folks on the "Who Gives a Shit" scale regarding the wikileaks thing? I see a lot of facebook noise about it, but is it something people are really up in arms about?
Personally, I'm not thinking it's a "surely this" moment. Looks like a few DNC staffers were assholes, but not like a concerted, organization-wide effort to bring down Sanders. But I haven't read all 90 kajillion emails, just the out-of-context quotes from the most damning 5 or 6 that have been publicized.
posted by Cookiebastard at 12:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Personally, I'm not thinking it's a "surely this" moment. Looks like a few DNC staffers were assholes, but not like a concerted, organization-wide effort to bring down Sanders. But I haven't read all 90 kajillion emails, just the out-of-context quotes from the most damning 5 or 6 that have been publicized.
posted by Cookiebastard at 12:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
What are all the caucuses actually doing today?
They basically get together and talk about the issues that affect them and how the party platform is going to address those issues.
Also, Donna Brazile took it upon herself to apologize on behalf of the DNC about the leaked emails at the Black and Hispanic Caucuses.
posted by cooker girl at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
They basically get together and talk about the issues that affect them and how the party platform is going to address those issues.
Also, Donna Brazile took it upon herself to apologize on behalf of the DNC about the leaked emails at the Black and Hispanic Caucuses.
posted by cooker girl at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
It is, in fact, hot as hell in Philadelphia.
posted by jedicus at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by jedicus at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
If this isn't too off-topic, is there a way folks have been able to look after their emotional health in the midst of all of this? I keep diving in, hoping that I'll find the political news that will ease the anxiety.
"Unplug" hasn't helped as advice. Or at least advice on how to unplug would be helpful. I can't make it to November this way.
Back in 2008 People on the Internet thought Palin was a masterstroke and the RNC was the death knell of Barack Obama.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
"Unplug" hasn't helped as advice. Or at least advice on how to unplug would be helpful. I can't make it to November this way.
Back in 2008 People on the Internet thought Palin was a masterstroke and the RNC was the death knell of Barack Obama.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
"Let's Go Crazy" is not a good music choice to be starting this off with.
posted by zachlipton at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Yeah, I'm just pretending that none of this is happening (with the exception of popping into threads about it on Metafilter). I'm voting for Hillary Clinton. There's no question. Nothing anyone says is going to change that. So I just ... don't need the anger and the negativity and the outrage. There's enough terrible and serious stuff happening in the world that I would rather devote my limited capacity for being outraged and serious to. We don't need to follow, dissect, thinkpiece, and argue about every blow in this protracted and terrible torment of an election.
posted by ChuraChura at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
posted by ChuraChura at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
The feed is live, for those who want to watch.
Bah, I was hoping for the Condiment Cam.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Bah, I was hoping for the Condiment Cam.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Self-care: Stranger Things and pro wrestling. Having a partner who doesn't want to watch convention coverage so all I can do is read Metafilter (and he looks askance if I've been online for too long so I eventually have to close the laptop.) Writing my feelings in a google doc essay that I intend to post to Facebook eventually but may not. Hiding posts on Facebook that get me riled up.
posted by misskaz at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by misskaz at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"Unplug" hasn't helped as advice. Or at least advice on how to unplug would be helpful. I can't make it to November this way.
I've enjoyed watching Crazy Ex-Girlfriend and Ghostbusters and re-watching Hell On Wheels and Black Sails.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I've enjoyed watching Crazy Ex-Girlfriend and Ghostbusters and re-watching Hell On Wheels and Black Sails.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Prince is always a good music choice to be starting a thing off with.
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
cortex: Re-litigating all of that in here is not going to make this a more useful or interesting thread.
But... but... re-litigating is how I deal with my anxiety. It's easier on the liver!
posted by clawsoon at 12:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
But... but... re-litigating is how I deal with my anxiety. It's easier on the liver!
posted by clawsoon at 12:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I was a Bernie supporter that reluctantly but with certainty moved to support Hillary. If you were a Bernie supporter, you probably have like minded friends are Bernie supporters. You probably know some that haven't moved their support to Hillary yet. You are in the best position to change their minds (more so than folks that have supported Hillary from the start, anyways). Use that influence, if they are going to listen to anyone is a like-minded person who is a friend.
I did that, I converted a least one person who was going to either not-vote or to vote 3rd party (in a contested state) from a Bernie-or-bust to a reluctant Hillary supporter.
It is through efforts like this that Hillary will overcome; if we fall prey to apathy or resignation the worst may occur.
posted by el io at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [44 favorites]
I did that, I converted a least one person who was going to either not-vote or to vote 3rd party (in a contested state) from a Bernie-or-bust to a reluctant Hillary supporter.
It is through efforts like this that Hillary will overcome; if we fall prey to apathy or resignation the worst may occur.
posted by el io at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [44 favorites]
As they said in a recent French election, "vote for the crook, not the fascist"
posted by acb at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [54 favorites]
posted by acb at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [54 favorites]
Look, at least it wasn't Darling Nikki.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
China Russia. The worst kind of Russia.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
Say, does MeFi have a person there this time? Having corb's insights from the room where it happened was great last week.
posted by dnash at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by dnash at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
So, where are folks on the "Who Gives a Shit" scale regarding the wikileaks thing?
Like the email server "scandal" I'm betting not a lot of people give a shit. OF COURSE people talk smack in what they think is private email, everyone does that. OF COURSE they tried to short circuit Sanders, he was their rival.
At this point, while I'm not a huge fan of Hillary, the world is shaping up to be back alley knife fight and I think she's the best choice for that sort of world. Though I would have happily voted Bernie.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 1:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Like the email server "scandal" I'm betting not a lot of people give a shit. OF COURSE people talk smack in what they think is private email, everyone does that. OF COURSE they tried to short circuit Sanders, he was their rival.
At this point, while I'm not a huge fan of Hillary, the world is shaping up to be back alley knife fight and I think she's the best choice for that sort of world. Though I would have happily voted Bernie.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 1:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Hey so a few months back, I was looking into helping with voter registration drives in Alabama after the law change. I got a response from the ACLU's Alabama branch recentlythat is like to share:
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
We actually are working on a state wide voter know your rights program specific to Alabama. We developed a toolkit and we are training people to register voters with an eye to getting into rural communities. Our interns this summer are hosting taring sessions under the direction of our public advocacy director. http://aclualabama.org/wp/take-action/voting-rights-toolkit/Many people have been asking how they can help this cycle. I encourage you to look into supporting voter registration/information drives in your community.
We are working with many grassroots organizations for example the Montgomery Pride and Alabama Coalition for Immigrant Justice. If you have any questions please ask.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
For anybody who wants a calm voice and some good old-fashioned journalism, Dan Rather is a steady ship.
posted by stolyarova at 1:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [37 favorites]
Anybody who has ever sat in the stands of a baseball game knows a few boos can cut through a chorus of cheers. And from someone who has worked a lifetime in television, I can tell you that the camera will always find a pocket of discord in a sea of agreement.He's covering the DNC this week as he covered the RNC last week, and he uses Facebook Live!
These are the real fears among Democratic party leaders as they gather for their convention. Already we have seen Bernie Sanders supporters boo, not only Hillary Clinton partisans, but Sanders himself when he called for unity. For those around with memories of the 2000 election and the role that Ralph Nader's campaign played in handing the White House to George W. Bush, this is terrifying. They worry that even if the vast majority of Sanders supporters come to Clinton with their votes, vocal holdouts could undermine all the work on unity and prove fatal in the fall.
Make no mistake, Donald Trump can win this. and Democratic leaders are pulling their hair out wonder why, in their words, the prospect of a Trump administration isn't enough to scare people straight. They want to shout at the Sanders supporters, imagine Trump in charge of the power of FBI investigations, the courts, foreign policy. But for some reason this is not resonating as broadly as they hoped, at least at the present. Bernie Sanders is now playing the role of good soldier, but that may no longer be enough. Maybe people just want a moment to vent. Maybe the waters run much deeper. Will there be disruptions among the delegates during the prestige prime-time speeches? We will know soon.
posted by stolyarova at 1:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [37 favorites]
> Back in 2008 People on the Internet thought Palin was a masterstroke and the RNC was the death knell of Barack Obama.
Really? Because I remember her as a Hail Mary pass from an already embattled candidate. Maybe for one shining moment it looked like the RNC picked a VP from an underserved demographic they needed and this could mean something, but then she talked.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Really? Because I remember her as a Hail Mary pass from an already embattled candidate. Maybe for one shining moment it looked like the RNC picked a VP from an underserved demographic they needed and this could mean something, but then she talked.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
One thing I’ll be watching for in this convention is a solid, salient, redefinition of the anger underpinning the misinformed classes that make-up some of Trumps world, then a solid redirect with Dem values and vision.
posted by uraniumwilly at 1:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by uraniumwilly at 1:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
is there a way folks have been able to look after their emotional health in the midst of all of this?
I am really sorry, I feel like in my fear and pessimism I have brought others down in the previous thread.
I wanted to give you a list of tools that help me whenever I feel overwhelmed. I hope they can help you as well.
The thoughts room (this is one of my personal favorites)
Audio sessions for relaxation, self care and meditation
Calm.com meditation
Anxiety and self care apps
Living life to the full (there is a panic button I have used, and there are other sessions you can use as needed)
Stress Analyst and other resources from the same website
posted by Tarumba at 1:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [62 favorites]
I am really sorry, I feel like in my fear and pessimism I have brought others down in the previous thread.
I wanted to give you a list of tools that help me whenever I feel overwhelmed. I hope they can help you as well.
The thoughts room (this is one of my personal favorites)
Audio sessions for relaxation, self care and meditation
Calm.com meditation
Anxiety and self care apps
Living life to the full (there is a panic button I have used, and there are other sessions you can use as needed)
Stress Analyst and other resources from the same website
posted by Tarumba at 1:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [62 favorites]
So, where are folks on the "Who Gives a Shit" scale regarding the wikileaks thing?
The lower end. There have not as yet been any smoking guns or really troubling emails. We see the ugly reality of kissing donor asses. We see that some members of the DNC preferred Hillary, but we haven't seen any evidence that this was translated into organization action. It all just seems like the kind of things people in a large organization say privately to each other despite maintaining a united public face.
To me the most troubling aspect of the email leak has been the evidence that suggests that this was done by Russia. If that's true it's fairly disturbing.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
The lower end. There have not as yet been any smoking guns or really troubling emails. We see the ugly reality of kissing donor asses. We see that some members of the DNC preferred Hillary, but we haven't seen any evidence that this was translated into organization action. It all just seems like the kind of things people in a large organization say privately to each other despite maintaining a united public face.
To me the most troubling aspect of the email leak has been the evidence that suggests that this was done by Russia. If that's true it's fairly disturbing.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
So if Trump were to win I wonder how Mexico will respond to the massive influx of immigrants?
posted by bongo_x at 1:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 1:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
YOUTUBE HAVE 360 DEGREE VIDEO!
We're living in the future here, people!
posted by Talez at 1:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
We're living in the future here, people!
posted by Talez at 1:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
As a parent of a four year old, I say we need more naps, the best naps, YUGE naps!
“this nation should commit itself to achieving the goal, before the decade is out, of napping before noon, and awaking nicely refreshed.”
posted by zamboni at 1:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
“this nation should commit itself to achieving the goal, before the decade is out, of napping before noon, and awaking nicely refreshed.”
posted by zamboni at 1:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
As they said in a recent French election, "vote for the crook, not the fascist"
They took that one from us - when David Duke came within arms reach of winning the Louisiana governorship.
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
They took that one from us - when David Duke came within arms reach of winning the Louisiana governorship.
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I am really sorry, I feel like in my fear and pessimism I have brought others down in the previous thread.
I think people need to understand the real effects this has on people, though. I wouldn't be sorry. (That said, you're of course not obligated to participate).
posted by zutalors! at 1:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I think people need to understand the real effects this has on people, though. I wouldn't be sorry. (That said, you're of course not obligated to participate).
posted by zutalors! at 1:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I'll see you and raise you John Carpenter's Lost Themes yt . Carpenter/Thing 2016!
Oh hey those are my friends in the band S U R V I V E!
BAD ASS group to see live. BAD ASS.
posted by Annika Cicada at 1:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Oh hey those are my friends in the band S U R V I V E!
BAD ASS group to see live. BAD ASS.
posted by Annika Cicada at 1:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
So if Trump were to win I wonder how Mexico will respond to the massive influx of immigrants?
They have a strategy for this: they'll haveTrump US Taxpayers build a wall, and convince them it's to keep Mexicans out.
posted by el io at 1:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
They have a strategy for this: they'll have
posted by el io at 1:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
To me the most troubling aspect of the email leak has been the evidence that suggests that this was done by Russia.
And what else do they have? I mean is this basically it (the DNC leaks) or is this election in jeopardy?
posted by futz at 1:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
And what else do they have? I mean is this basically it (the DNC leaks) or is this election in jeopardy?
posted by futz at 1:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Looks like a few DNC staffers were assholes, but not like a concerted, organization-wide effort to bring down Sanders.
Well, of those released so far (WikiLeaks says there will be further dumps in the days to come), any that I've read mentioning Sanders at all do so in a negative way, while those mentioning Hillary tend to be about supporting her, helping her, coordinating with her team, or otherwise giving her positive support.
No smoking guns, of course, but since a lot of us assumed all along that the establishment-types pre-chose Hillary before she even declared, and the whole veil of neutrality was a silly lie anyway, it's no shock. Some people are outraged by this, a lot are faux-outraged, most seem to be "well, duh". I'm a duh-camper; of course she was going to be the candidate, and if that's the best we got, then fine, it's still better than the alternative and I hope her baggage isn't so heavy it derails her. I have trouble getting angry about it, though. It's like the NSA spying in the years before Snowden confirmed it: of course they were.
But like you, I have not read all of the e-mails. So many are just typical office noise about scheduling and info-seeking that it's easy to zone out. Maybe there are some in there that discuss positively impacting other candidates.
posted by rokusan at 1:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Well, of those released so far (WikiLeaks says there will be further dumps in the days to come), any that I've read mentioning Sanders at all do so in a negative way, while those mentioning Hillary tend to be about supporting her, helping her, coordinating with her team, or otherwise giving her positive support.
No smoking guns, of course, but since a lot of us assumed all along that the establishment-types pre-chose Hillary before she even declared, and the whole veil of neutrality was a silly lie anyway, it's no shock. Some people are outraged by this, a lot are faux-outraged, most seem to be "well, duh". I'm a duh-camper; of course she was going to be the candidate, and if that's the best we got, then fine, it's still better than the alternative and I hope her baggage isn't so heavy it derails her. I have trouble getting angry about it, though. It's like the NSA spying in the years before Snowden confirmed it: of course they were.
But like you, I have not read all of the e-mails. So many are just typical office noise about scheduling and info-seeking that it's easy to zone out. Maybe there are some in there that discuss positively impacting other candidates.
posted by rokusan at 1:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Back in 2008 People on the Internet thought Palin was a masterstroke
Palin was (quite properly) called out as ridiculous from the moment she was announced.
posted by rokusan at 1:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Palin was (quite properly) called out as ridiculous from the moment she was announced.
posted by rokusan at 1:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
So, where are folks on the "Who Gives a Shit" scale regarding the wikileaks thing?
DWS was forced to resign, Donna Brazile was forced to resign right after being given the chair and DWS will not be allowed to speak at the convention. Seems like a pretty big deal.
I'm curious how far back the emails go. They only released emails after Sanders wasn't competitive any longer, but if the emails from the start were just as bad or worse it could really blow up in their faces.
posted by stavrogin at 1:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
DWS was forced to resign, Donna Brazile was forced to resign right after being given the chair and DWS will not be allowed to speak at the convention. Seems like a pretty big deal.
I'm curious how far back the emails go. They only released emails after Sanders wasn't competitive any longer, but if the emails from the start were just as bad or worse it could really blow up in their faces.
posted by stavrogin at 1:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I work right next to City Hall. Bernie supporters have been protesting non-stop literally all day long... in 98-degree heat.
I'm thinking Hillary doesn't have the support she thought she did.
It's easy to thinking Hillary doesn't have much support when you're surrounded by angry protestors, but keep in mind the people who support Hillary (whether they originally voted for Bernie or not) are mostly not going to be the ones out protesting anything this week. We're going to be quietly going about our daily routine at home and at work, and hoping the speeches at the DNC are as inspiring as we hope they'll be.
If I've learned anything about Hillary supporters throughout this election season, it's that they're a relatively quiet but steady bunch. She managed to win the primary while it seemed like everyone was shouting at or about her from all sides. Clearly she has a good amount of support. Hopefully it'll be enough, and hopefully she'll gain more this week if they're able to get the "damn emails" stuff out of the way and focus on their message.
The people I know personally who voted for Bernie have told me, without my even asking them, that they're voting for Hillary and they're okay with that. I certainly don't know everyone and I know that doesn't apply to every single Bernie voter, but I try to keep them in mind when I feel myself sliding into doom and gloom.
posted by wondermouse at 1:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [42 favorites]
I'm thinking Hillary doesn't have the support she thought she did.
It's easy to thinking Hillary doesn't have much support when you're surrounded by angry protestors, but keep in mind the people who support Hillary (whether they originally voted for Bernie or not) are mostly not going to be the ones out protesting anything this week. We're going to be quietly going about our daily routine at home and at work, and hoping the speeches at the DNC are as inspiring as we hope they'll be.
If I've learned anything about Hillary supporters throughout this election season, it's that they're a relatively quiet but steady bunch. She managed to win the primary while it seemed like everyone was shouting at or about her from all sides. Clearly she has a good amount of support. Hopefully it'll be enough, and hopefully she'll gain more this week if they're able to get the "damn emails" stuff out of the way and focus on their message.
The people I know personally who voted for Bernie have told me, without my even asking them, that they're voting for Hillary and they're okay with that. I certainly don't know everyone and I know that doesn't apply to every single Bernie voter, but I try to keep them in mind when I feel myself sliding into doom and gloom.
posted by wondermouse at 1:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [42 favorites]
> OF COURSE they tried to short circuit Sanders, he was their rival.
He wasn't supposed to be the DNC's rival. The DNC had an obligation to remain impartial.
> To me the most troubling aspect of the email leak has been the evidence that suggests that this was done by Russia. If that's true it's fairly disturbing.
That's the kicker for me, but in the exact opposite way. Notice no one is challenging the veracity of the emails, just the source. This is literally shoot the messenger sort of stuff, no one likes a tattletale, so we should disregard the contents?
Also, I don't buy the Russians. But even if true, all that does is show Democrats suck at securing servers. Harboring Snowden, revealing backend shenanigans…if it is the Russians someone owes Putin a bottle of something good. He's done more for US transparency than Clinton or Obama.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
He wasn't supposed to be the DNC's rival. The DNC had an obligation to remain impartial.
> To me the most troubling aspect of the email leak has been the evidence that suggests that this was done by Russia. If that's true it's fairly disturbing.
That's the kicker for me, but in the exact opposite way. Notice no one is challenging the veracity of the emails, just the source. This is literally shoot the messenger sort of stuff, no one likes a tattletale, so we should disregard the contents?
Also, I don't buy the Russians. But even if true, all that does is show Democrats suck at securing servers. Harboring Snowden, revealing backend shenanigans…if it is the Russians someone owes Putin a bottle of something good. He's done more for US transparency than Clinton or Obama.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
And what else do they have? I mean is this basically it (the DNC leaks) or is this election in jeopardy?
This is probably the most frightening thing about the leaks. If it actually is Russian-backed, and if there IS a smoking gun, it's quite possible it's just being held for an October surprise.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
This is probably the most frightening thing about the leaks. If it actually is Russian-backed, and if there IS a smoking gun, it's quite possible it's just being held for an October surprise.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
To me the most troubling aspect of the email leak has been the evidence that suggests that this was done by Russia.
Is there any evidence of this? I've only seen claims, and those claims have some pretty questionable motives behind them.
Generally speaking, foreign powers don't hack servers and then dump the results on WikiLeaks. Does that seriously sound like Russia? That's what renegade kids do.
Foreign powers take what they learn and silently use it in the future. That's intelligence.
posted by rokusan at 1:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Is there any evidence of this? I've only seen claims, and those claims have some pretty questionable motives behind them.
Generally speaking, foreign powers don't hack servers and then dump the results on WikiLeaks. Does that seriously sound like Russia? That's what renegade kids do.
Foreign powers take what they learn and silently use it in the future. That's intelligence.
posted by rokusan at 1:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
The polls are always bouncing to the left and to the right
It's my belief that my big polls should be held every night.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
I don't even know how to talk to people anymore. It's like I live in a fundamentally different reality. If somebody thinks that Trump isn't so bad and it's just being overblown by the media, or that Clinton stole the election from Sanders, or that Clinton is the most corrupt candidate since Nixon... what the fuck am I supposed to do with that? I've tried. It doesn't work. People don't listen. It makes me feel like maybe I'm the crazy one. I just don't know how to even cope with this anymore.
posted by showbiz_liz at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [79 favorites]
posted by showbiz_liz at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [79 favorites]
Whee! Flying Liberty Bell! (video)
posted by zachlipton at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zachlipton at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2016
To be fair, the e-mail from the guy saying people were mocking the DNC for having bad cyber-security gloating about having excellent cyber-security is hilarious.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I think the email leak is a massive mistake for Trump in the long term. The emails themselves are extremely underwhelming and the vast majority of people just don't care; but how the leak happened opens up the issue of Russian interference in an American election and, more broadly, Trump's relationship with the Russian sphere of influence and his dependency on Russian capital.
His big sell is "I can't be bought," and now journalists are digging in and finding that in fact he's essentially owned by Russian oligarch creditors. The only policy he cared about in the RNC platform was the Crimea plank. There are scores of other concerning connections.
The influence of a foreign autocratic party on American politics is a huge fucking story. The influence of a foreign power on an actual major candidate for President is literally the stuff of Hollywood nightmares. THAT has legs.
posted by schadenfrau at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [87 favorites]
His big sell is "I can't be bought," and now journalists are digging in and finding that in fact he's essentially owned by Russian oligarch creditors. The only policy he cared about in the RNC platform was the Crimea plank. There are scores of other concerning connections.
The influence of a foreign autocratic party on American politics is a huge fucking story. The influence of a foreign power on an actual major candidate for President is literally the stuff of Hollywood nightmares. THAT has legs.
posted by schadenfrau at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [87 favorites]
the #NeverHillary folks are a minority even among Bernie supporters, and many of them will probably come around if Clinton can avoid doing anything to pointlessly antagonise them (like, I dunno, hire DWS back right after she resigns over stupid shit she said in the DNC leaks emails)...
Just to nip this in the bud (b/c God knows no one was doing this in my facebook feed), Hillary has apparently given DWS the same position that Obama gave Eva Longoria in 2012.
posted by sparklemotion at 1:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
Just to nip this in the bud (b/c God knows no one was doing this in my facebook feed), Hillary has apparently given DWS the same position that Obama gave Eva Longoria in 2012.
posted by sparklemotion at 1:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
"My eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord"?
Nice apocalypse prediction.
posted by stolyarova at 1:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Nice apocalypse prediction.
posted by stolyarova at 1:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
This is literally shoot the messenger sort of stuff, no one likes a tattletale, so we should disregard the contents?
Also, I don't buy the Russians. But even if true, all that does is show Democrats suck at securing servers. Harboring Snowden, revealing backend shenanigans…if it is the Russians someone owes Putin a bottle of something good. He's done more for US transparency than Clinton or Obama.
cjorgensen
I...you really don't see the problem with foreign governments interfering with a Presidential elections?
Generally speaking, foreign powers don't hack servers and then dump the results on WikiLeaks.
They do if they calculate it could influence an ongoing election in favor of a candidate who has gone on record saying things like he might pull out of NATO and might not defend countries in case of Russian aggression.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [37 favorites]
Also, I don't buy the Russians. But even if true, all that does is show Democrats suck at securing servers. Harboring Snowden, revealing backend shenanigans…if it is the Russians someone owes Putin a bottle of something good. He's done more for US transparency than Clinton or Obama.
cjorgensen
I...you really don't see the problem with foreign governments interfering with a Presidential elections?
Generally speaking, foreign powers don't hack servers and then dump the results on WikiLeaks.
They do if they calculate it could influence an ongoing election in favor of a candidate who has gone on record saying things like he might pull out of NATO and might not defend countries in case of Russian aggression.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [37 favorites]
To be fair, the e-mail from the guy saying people were mocking the DNC for having bad cyber-security gloating about having excellent cyber-security is hilarious.
And the email about using someone's lack of religion against him? That's something I would expect from the GOP.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
And the email about using someone's lack of religion against him? That's something I would expect from the GOP.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Is there any evidence of this? I've only seen claims, and those claims have some pretty questionable motives behind them.
A brief guide to the evidence.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
A brief guide to the evidence.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
The 360 degree livestream seems glitchy.
posted by waitingtoderail at 1:13 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by waitingtoderail at 1:13 PM on July 25, 2016
The FBI is now officially acknowledging its investigation into a massive breach of the Democratic National Committee's computers, which sources and experts say was likely the work of government hackers in Russia.
That's not the FBI specifically saying Russia just yet, but this appears to be the general inclination of the people the FBI will look to for assistance.
posted by Lyn Never at 1:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
That's not the FBI specifically saying Russia just yet, but this appears to be the general inclination of the people the FBI will look to for assistance.
posted by Lyn Never at 1:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
The 360 livestream is fine here with the exception that they have comments open right now.
posted by cmfletcher at 1:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by cmfletcher at 1:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Notice no one is challenging the veracity of the emails, just the source.
Except that they have been challenging the veracity of the emails, especially when evidence that some had been altered by Russian language PCs was found.
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Except that they have been challenging the veracity of the emails, especially when evidence that some had been altered by Russian language PCs was found.
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Trump on Elizabeth Warren: "She’s got a fresh mouth. Other than that, she’s got nothing going."
The normalization of avenging one's grievances against "uppity" women continues unchecked.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [78 favorites]
The normalization of avenging one's grievances against "uppity" women continues unchecked.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [78 favorites]
It's also useful to keep in mind that the conventions are hyper focused. The race for the election hasn't really started yet, I'd wait until August to see how things are going.
The debates should be pretty interesting this time around though. I'll watch'em just to see what Trump says.
And the email about using someone's lack of religion against him? That's something I would expect from the GOP.
Meh, pretty much all politics is dirty and at least dips its toe in whatever pool is the dirtiest.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 1:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The debates should be pretty interesting this time around though. I'll watch'em just to see what Trump says.
And the email about using someone's lack of religion against him? That's something I would expect from the GOP.
Meh, pretty much all politics is dirty and at least dips its toe in whatever pool is the dirtiest.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 1:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The emails themselves are extremely underwhelming and the vast majority of people just don't care; but how the leak happened opens up the issue of Russian interference in an American election and, more broadly, Trump's relationship with the Russian sphere of influence and his dependency on Russian capital.
Yuge. Very yuge.
David Frum, no leftist (it was he who came up with W's "Axis of Evil" speech), said this:
Even the biggest news inside the DNC emails is about one/one-zillionth as big as Russian interference in US elections …
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 1:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Yuge. Very yuge.
David Frum, no leftist (it was he who came up with W's "Axis of Evil" speech), said this:
Even the biggest news inside the DNC emails is about one/one-zillionth as big as Russian interference in US elections …
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 1:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
I have to say, this choir is giving me literal chills. Absolutely beautiful and seeing the little old lady on the floor singing along has made me feel a lot better.
posted by hollygoheavy at 1:15 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by hollygoheavy at 1:15 PM on July 25, 2016
And the email about using someone's lack of religion against him? That's something I would expect from the GOP.
Oh, I think it's terrible and unquestionably evidence of corruption but I'm assured that the DNC e-mail leaks are a nothingburger.
At the very least, with the removal of DWS we finally get to see a chair being thrown.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 1:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Oh, I think it's terrible and unquestionably evidence of corruption but I'm assured that the DNC e-mail leaks are a nothingburger.
At the very least, with the removal of DWS we finally get to see a chair being thrown.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 1:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Twitch works if the 360 stream isn't doing it for you.
posted by zachlipton at 1:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 1:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Digging this slow-burn baton-swapping arrangement of Battle Hymn. Great build, way to use a choir.
posted by cortex at 1:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by cortex at 1:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
And the email about using someone's lack of religion against him? That's something I would expect from the GOP.To be clear: someone suggested that they do it, but they didn't actually do it, right? So people are ok with electing the dude who literally wants to block Muslims from the country because someone suggested, but didn't go through with, pointing out that a candidate is an atheist?
And yeah, the Republicans 100% would have run with it, which is part of the thing that concerned people who pointed out that Bernie had never faced a really nasty campaign.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
This is literally shoot the messenger sort of stuff, no one likes a tattletale, so we should disregard the contents?
Yeah, but it's not some impartial messenger. If it were they'd release everything - including the opposition files on Trump that were accessed. Given those aren't being released (who knows, maybe they'll be released in the future, but I doubt it) the messenger is a highly partisan actor with a desired outcome in mind - that's not some objective source by any means.
Also, I don't buy the Russians. But even if true, all that does is show Democrats suck at securing servers. Harboring Snowden, revealing backend shenanigans…if it is the Russians someone owes Putin a bottle of something good. He's done more for US transparency than Clinton or Obama.
Respected security firms were pointing fingers that way before the contents were leaked. I'm not sure what drives your skepticism, or who you think may be responsible, but it seems a pretty likely scenario to me. They are harboring Snowden (which I appreciate) because it pisses off the US and the US intelligence community - not out of altruism or a desire for transparency in American politics.
As far as the Democrats sucking at securing servers... If that were true hundreds of folks would have hacked them, not just Russian intelligence. It's not a trivial matter to secure computers against a well-funded highly skilled adversary that is persistent in their attacks. Organizations that spend tens of millions of dollars a year on cyber security fail in this.
posted by el io at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
Yeah, but it's not some impartial messenger. If it were they'd release everything - including the opposition files on Trump that were accessed. Given those aren't being released (who knows, maybe they'll be released in the future, but I doubt it) the messenger is a highly partisan actor with a desired outcome in mind - that's not some objective source by any means.
Also, I don't buy the Russians. But even if true, all that does is show Democrats suck at securing servers. Harboring Snowden, revealing backend shenanigans…if it is the Russians someone owes Putin a bottle of something good. He's done more for US transparency than Clinton or Obama.
Respected security firms were pointing fingers that way before the contents were leaked. I'm not sure what drives your skepticism, or who you think may be responsible, but it seems a pretty likely scenario to me. They are harboring Snowden (which I appreciate) because it pisses off the US and the US intelligence community - not out of altruism or a desire for transparency in American politics.
As far as the Democrats sucking at securing servers... If that were true hundreds of folks would have hacked them, not just Russian intelligence. It's not a trivial matter to secure computers against a well-funded highly skilled adversary that is persistent in their attacks. Organizations that spend tens of millions of dollars a year on cyber security fail in this.
posted by el io at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
DWS was forced to resign, Donna Brazile was forced to resign right after being given the chair and DWS will not be allowed to speak at the convention. Seems like a pretty big deal.
Cite for Brazile's resignation? I haven't seen anything about this. 6 hours ago, she tweeted: As I transition, grateful for the opportunity. CNN, ABC cut ties with Donna Brazile, freeing her up for DNC job, and nothing except Convention pics since.
posted by palindromic at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Cite for Brazile's resignation? I haven't seen anything about this. 6 hours ago, she tweeted: As I transition, grateful for the opportunity. CNN, ABC cut ties with Donna Brazile, freeing her up for DNC job, and nothing except Convention pics since.
posted by palindromic at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Oh, I think it's terrible and unquestionably evidence of corruption
How? It was an idea never acted on. It's no secret people working for the DNC liked Clinton more, but it's not wrong to have personal opinions. Did they ever act on them? Is there anything showing they ever actually treated Sanders unfairly or withheld support from him?
posted by Sangermaine at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
How? It was an idea never acted on. It's no secret people working for the DNC liked Clinton more, but it's not wrong to have personal opinions. Did they ever act on them? Is there anything showing they ever actually treated Sanders unfairly or withheld support from him?
posted by Sangermaine at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Also, I don't buy the Russians. But even if true, all that does is show Democrats suck at securing servers. Harboring Snowden, revealing backend shenanigans…if it is the Russians someone owes Putin a bottle of something good. He's done more for US transparency than Clinton or Obama.
You're more concerned about "transparency*," which I guarantee is not even on Putin's list, than you are about Russia attempting to influence the US election in support of a man who wants to scrap NATO, and whose campaign manager is basically THE media relations guy for former Soviet states' dictators? That boggles my mind.
*in this case of private emails
posted by OmieWise at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
You're more concerned about "transparency*," which I guarantee is not even on Putin's list, than you are about Russia attempting to influence the US election in support of a man who wants to scrap NATO, and whose campaign manager is basically THE media relations guy for former Soviet states' dictators? That boggles my mind.
*in this case of private emails
posted by OmieWise at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
YouTube regular, non-360 stream. Chat and comments disabled.
posted by dnash at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dnash at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
This weekend I was appalled but not surprised to discover that my Bernie-lovin' friend is also a #NeverHillary who said, and I quote "They'll never let Trump do anything bad, they'll control him."
I didn't gasp in shock because I've seen this online too, but in the few months we have left, I'm going to keep working on him. He's old enough to remember the Cold War, smart enough to understand building on what you have instead of burning shit down. I've just gotta find a persuasive argument. Part of the problem is that his wife is even more into the Clinton-hating camp and he is very loyal.
posted by emjaybee at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I didn't gasp in shock because I've seen this online too, but in the few months we have left, I'm going to keep working on him. He's old enough to remember the Cold War, smart enough to understand building on what you have instead of burning shit down. I've just gotta find a persuasive argument. Part of the problem is that his wife is even more into the Clinton-hating camp and he is very loyal.
posted by emjaybee at 1:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Donald Trump is hosting a Reddit AMA during the Democratic National Convention.
posted by waitingtoderail at 1:18 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by waitingtoderail at 1:18 PM on July 25, 2016
At the very least, with the removal of DWS we finally get to see a chair being thrown.
SLOW CLAP.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
SLOW CLAP.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
> At the very least, with the removal of DWS we finally get to see a chair being thrown.
She was given a different job, so she went from unofficially working for Hillary to officially working for her. A Clinton always pays her debts.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
She was given a different job, so she went from unofficially working for Hillary to officially working for her. A Clinton always pays her debts.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I remain dubious, Gaz. If the argument is that this "in a Russian time zone" group also hacked the State Department, the White House and the Joint Chiefs (!), and their goal was to hurt Clinton or disrupt this election for some reason, I suspect there'd be something a little more damaging in one of those other targets than they'd ever find in the piddly DNC server.
Since the FBI is (finally?) investigating, I suppose we'll have some sort of answer in 8-10 months. Until then, I guess we have to wait and see if anything truly shocking comes down the pipe in the next week or two. But based on WikiLeak's history of overhype and underdelivery, I don't expect much.
posted by rokusan at 1:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Since the FBI is (finally?) investigating, I suppose we'll have some sort of answer in 8-10 months. Until then, I guess we have to wait and see if anything truly shocking comes down the pipe in the next week or two. But based on WikiLeak's history of overhype and underdelivery, I don't expect much.
posted by rokusan at 1:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
SHE MISSED THE GAVEL! IT'S A DISASTER! PACK IT UP PEOPLE!
posted by Talez at 1:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Talez at 1:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Baltimore Mayor Stephanie Rawlings-Blake calls the convention to order, walks off the stage, realizes she forgot to bang the gavel, runs back.
posted by zachlipton at 1:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 1:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Twitch works if the 360 stream isn't doing it for you.
but turn the chat off, yo. gear icon on the bottom right
posted by murphy slaw at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
but turn the chat off, yo. gear icon on the bottom right
posted by murphy slaw at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
That gavel moment was adorable.
posted by acidic at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by acidic at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Uh no offense but if you think the people in Philly holding "Hillary for Prison" signs are going to start supporting the ticket because Kaine's progressive policy wins...
Sure, of course some people are going to be a complete lost cause. But they're a minority of a minority of a minority and not really worth thinking about, electorally-speaking. (I feel bad for anybody who actually knows one of them personally or professionally, though.)
There are likely a lot more folks who want to vote Clinton but have reservations about her, personally, and my hope is that Kaine can win them over.
So, where are folks on the "Who Gives a Shit" scale regarding the wikileaks thing?
Me, I'm at like negative a thousand shits. I'm not gonna dig through however many terabytes of e-mails, and so far the bits people are picking out to toss around haven't struck me as particularly interesting.
Most importantly, none of these people who were privately backing Clinton seem to have done anything to affect the actual primary elections, so as far as I'm concerned Sanders still lost fair and square.
Though I would have happily voted Bernie.
Same. Would have preferring to vote for him, even. But I'll be even happier if he uses his base of support to pressure the Dems from the left and maybe get some more like-minded democratic-socialists into Congress starting with the next midterms.
DWS was forced to resign, Donna Brazile was forced to resign right after being given the chair and DWS will not be allowed to speak at the convention.
Sorry, what's this about Donna Brazile resigning? She's resigned from her media positions at CNN and ABC, which seems entirely fair and is a total non-issue. She hasn't, as far as I know, resigned from her position as interim DNC chair.
Just to nip this in the bud (b/c God knows no one was doing this in my facebook feed), Hillary has apparently given DWS the same position that Obama gave Eva Longoria in 2012.
What her role actually is doesn't matter. It's the optics of giving her a position right after she resigned the chairship in disgrace.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Sure, of course some people are going to be a complete lost cause. But they're a minority of a minority of a minority and not really worth thinking about, electorally-speaking. (I feel bad for anybody who actually knows one of them personally or professionally, though.)
There are likely a lot more folks who want to vote Clinton but have reservations about her, personally, and my hope is that Kaine can win them over.
So, where are folks on the "Who Gives a Shit" scale regarding the wikileaks thing?
Me, I'm at like negative a thousand shits. I'm not gonna dig through however many terabytes of e-mails, and so far the bits people are picking out to toss around haven't struck me as particularly interesting.
Most importantly, none of these people who were privately backing Clinton seem to have done anything to affect the actual primary elections, so as far as I'm concerned Sanders still lost fair and square.
Though I would have happily voted Bernie.
Same. Would have preferring to vote for him, even. But I'll be even happier if he uses his base of support to pressure the Dems from the left and maybe get some more like-minded democratic-socialists into Congress starting with the next midterms.
DWS was forced to resign, Donna Brazile was forced to resign right after being given the chair and DWS will not be allowed to speak at the convention.
Sorry, what's this about Donna Brazile resigning? She's resigned from her media positions at CNN and ABC, which seems entirely fair and is a total non-issue. She hasn't, as far as I know, resigned from her position as interim DNC chair.
Just to nip this in the bud (b/c God knows no one was doing this in my facebook feed), Hillary has apparently given DWS the same position that Obama gave Eva Longoria in 2012.
What her role actually is doesn't matter. It's the optics of giving her a position right after she resigned the chairship in disgrace.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
As a sidenote, in about five minutes, we have already seen more black women on stage in this convention than all last week.
posted by zachlipton at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [40 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [40 favorites]
I think what cjorgensen is saying is that the job itself doesn't matter, it's the appearance of reward for what many people see as corrupt behavior. The way it looks. The "optics" of it.*
It's a big fancy package with a bow on it. The value of the contents inside doesn't matter much; the message has been sent already.
* I hate this term so much.
posted by rokusan at 1:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
It's a big fancy package with a bow on it. The value of the contents inside doesn't matter much; the message has been sent already.
* I hate this term so much.
posted by rokusan at 1:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Look, at least it wasn't Darling Nikki.
Don't be silly. Nobody buys magazines anymore.
posted by phearlez at 1:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Don't be silly. Nobody buys magazines anymore.
posted by phearlez at 1:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
I've just gotta find a persuasive argument.
I've been thinking about this a lot, and I keep coming back to, "what will you say to [insert minority] when Trump [does terrible thing he's promised to do]?"
At it's core, are your feelings more important than someone else's life?
posted by schadenfrau at 1:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I've been thinking about this a lot, and I keep coming back to, "what will you say to [insert minority] when Trump [does terrible thing he's promised to do]?"
At it's core, are your feelings more important than someone else's life?
posted by schadenfrau at 1:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I'm getting warm fuzzies. THIS IS WHAT I WANTED after last week's terror. Warm fuzzies for all! #MakeAmericaFuzzyAgain <3
posted by stolyarova at 1:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by stolyarova at 1:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I remain dubious, Gaz.
Your prerogative. Just pointing out the evidence, and also the fact that many prominent commentators on both sides of the aisle are not as dismissive.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Your prerogative. Just pointing out the evidence, and also the fact that many prominent commentators on both sides of the aisle are not as dismissive.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Twitch can be hilarious so imma check that feed
posted by Foci for Analysis at 1:23 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 1:23 PM on July 25, 2016
It wasn't just the DNC servers, hackers were also targeting the personal e-mail accounts, and possibly cellphones of DNC staffers, for no other reason than they were researching Trump's campaign manager. Who, in what is seeming less and less like a coincidence, has worked on pro-Putin campaigns.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [44 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 1:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [44 favorites]
Boyz II Men!
posted by palindromic at 1:24 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by palindromic at 1:24 PM on July 25, 2016
BOYZ II MEN!
posted by Talez at 1:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Talez at 1:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Okay if they had to open with a Christian-y thing (which they didn't of course but if they felt they had to) I support the choice of an AME church choir singing the Battle Hymn of the Republic instead of some shouty prayer. The signature marching song of Union soldiers? Repurposed by the suffragettes and the civil rights movement? Sung by an all-black choir? Yes. Let's do this.
posted by BlueJae at 1:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
posted by BlueJae at 1:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
They're REALLY trying to remind everyone how good the 1990s really were.
posted by Talez at 1:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by Talez at 1:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
MOTOWNPHILLY OH YEAH!
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
What's infuriating here is that if hacks showed that Trump's actual campaign team tossed around filthy language about their opponents and voters and media figures and everyone else Trump would issue one incoherent email ending in "Sad!" and the whole thing would be over.
posted by argybarg at 1:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 1:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
It is, in fact, hot as hell in Philadelphia.
Someone oughta open up a window...
posted by Aznable at 1:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Someone oughta open up a window...
posted by Aznable at 1:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
As a sidenote, in about five minutes, we have already seen more black women on stage in this convention than all last week.
"Only 18 African-Americans served at the GOP gathering, a turnout that reportedly marked a historic low for the last century."
posted by kirkaracha at 1:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
As a Detroiter who came of age in the 1990s, this performance is basically a pop culture madeleine.
posted by palindromic at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
It wasn't just the DNC servers, hackers were also targeting the personal e-mail accounts, and possibly cellphones of DNC staffers, for no other reason than they were researching Trump's campaign manager.
Wait, wasn't there a thing called Watergate? Today people would just shrug.
posted by bongo_x at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Wait, wasn't there a thing called Watergate? Today people would just shrug.
posted by bongo_x at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
And the email about using someone's lack of religion against him? That's something I would expect from the GOP.
Seriously? Where were you when everyone (including both Sanders and Clinton supporters) were making fun of Trump for "Two Corinthians"?
posted by FJT at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Seriously? Where were you when everyone (including both Sanders and Clinton supporters) were making fun of Trump for "Two Corinthians"?
posted by FJT at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
They're REALLY trying to remind everyone how good the 1990s really were.
Clinton spends the next few hours inviting people to the stage to play GoldenEye and Mario Kart 64 on a vintage console with her.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
Clinton spends the next few hours inviting people to the stage to play GoldenEye and Mario Kart 64 on a vintage console with her.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
Seriously, there's enough actual terrifying Trump stuff to be frightened of. We don't need to start saying he's a Russian asset.
Craziness like that just delegitimizes the actual horrifying bits.
posted by rokusan at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Craziness like that just delegitimizes the actual horrifying bits.
posted by rokusan at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Glad to see the RNC didn't corner the market on white people dancing awkwardly.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
It makes me sad that I'm approvingly linking to David Frum of all people, but I did a literal spit take on this one:
"Once, candidates hired Americans to break into their opponents’ communications. Now those good jobs have been outsourced."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [67 favorites]
"Once, candidates hired Americans to break into their opponents’ communications. Now those good jobs have been outsourced."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [67 favorites]
Heh. Call and response bit when the audience isn't in the mix is a little bit silly.
posted by cortex at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by cortex at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2016
Trump on Elizabeth Warren: "She’s got a fresh mouth. Other than that, she’s got nothing going."
Sort of tangentially related, but watching Scott Brown's slide from "reasonable Republican that Blue State Massachusetts could elect to Congress" to simpering Trump toady has been kind of disgusting. He seems especially bitter towards Warren, who defeated him for the Senate seat barely a year after he was elected. He's been going after her about her Native American claims, among other things ("show the birth certificate" kind of bullshit). It's been pretty filthy, but good riddance I guess.
posted by backseatpilot at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Sort of tangentially related, but watching Scott Brown's slide from "reasonable Republican that Blue State Massachusetts could elect to Congress" to simpering Trump toady has been kind of disgusting. He seems especially bitter towards Warren, who defeated him for the Senate seat barely a year after he was elected. He's been going after her about her Native American claims, among other things ("show the birth certificate" kind of bullshit). It's been pretty filthy, but good riddance I guess.
posted by backseatpilot at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Jiminy jeepers, the contrast to the RNC's Saturday Night Live cover band last week is YUGE.
posted by stolyarova at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by stolyarova at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
There are much better dancers in the crowd at the DNC than there were at the RNC.
posted by jessssse at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by jessssse at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2016
"Only 18 African-Americans served at the GOP gathering, a turnout that reportedly marked a historic low for the last century."
I'd imagine plenty more than that served the convention, but as usual they don't get counted...
posted by jammer at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I'd imagine plenty more than that served the convention, but as usual they don't get counted...
posted by jammer at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I was thinking that two things would help galvanize a lot of people who would probably vote Democrat this year if they had the time and resources to do so:
1. Emphasize the Use of Absentee Ballots: Use billboards and mailings to inform people about their right to use an absentee ballot to vote. So many people cannot make it to polling places for a variety of reasons and have no idea that they are eligible to become a permanent absentee ballot voter (or how to make it happen). If the Dems used their campaign resources to make sure as many people as possible know they can vote from home, this could dramatically increase the number of informed voters this year.
2. Pokemon Go: Vote Edition. Use Pokemon Go to encourage people to come vote and attend gatherings to learn more about the Democratic platform. It could be a huge selling point, and give the Dems a new way to engage younger voters who might otherwise bow out of the process this year.
The first thing in particular is making me so on edge that I am seriously considering the possibility of using the little savings I have left to put up some billboards along the 5 freeway in SoCal to let people know they have more options than they realize. Contacting Hillary's social media teams is also on my list -- imagine the impact they'd have with a boosted post, tweet, and ad connecting all their followers with the resources they need to register for permanent absentee status.
We gotta get agile here if we're gonna dump Trump. But honestly? With all the stuff that Michael Moore's been saying about how Trump stands a better chance than ever to win? I'm gonna be scared as hell until late November when all of this is hopefully over, or beyond terrified if Trump wins and all my friends and family begin to suffer for it.
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
1. Emphasize the Use of Absentee Ballots: Use billboards and mailings to inform people about their right to use an absentee ballot to vote. So many people cannot make it to polling places for a variety of reasons and have no idea that they are eligible to become a permanent absentee ballot voter (or how to make it happen). If the Dems used their campaign resources to make sure as many people as possible know they can vote from home, this could dramatically increase the number of informed voters this year.
2. Pokemon Go: Vote Edition. Use Pokemon Go to encourage people to come vote and attend gatherings to learn more about the Democratic platform. It could be a huge selling point, and give the Dems a new way to engage younger voters who might otherwise bow out of the process this year.
The first thing in particular is making me so on edge that I am seriously considering the possibility of using the little savings I have left to put up some billboards along the 5 freeway in SoCal to let people know they have more options than they realize. Contacting Hillary's social media teams is also on my list -- imagine the impact they'd have with a boosted post, tweet, and ad connecting all their followers with the resources they need to register for permanent absentee status.
We gotta get agile here if we're gonna dump Trump. But honestly? With all the stuff that Michael Moore's been saying about how Trump stands a better chance than ever to win? I'm gonna be scared as hell until late November when all of this is hopefully over, or beyond terrified if Trump wins and all my friends and family begin to suffer for it.
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Again, thank you Metafilter for being my awesome election home. I've already given waaaay to much of my mental brain space to all of the conspiracies and noise of the last week, and I need to find my chill. (I also need to get some actual work done, and the nonstop PANIC! PANIC! crap isn't helping.)
So rather than rage at the short-sighted, booing dead-enders, I'm going to try to focus on the awesomely diverse lineup of people scheduled to speak and perform over the next few nights.
This is America, people.
posted by Salieri at 1:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
So rather than rage at the short-sighted, booing dead-enders, I'm going to try to focus on the awesomely diverse lineup of people scheduled to speak and perform over the next few nights.
This is America, people.
posted by Salieri at 1:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
CNN's Tapper called the B2M performance "a rare note of harmony" lol
posted by Noisy Pink Bubbles at 1:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Noisy Pink Bubbles at 1:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I love how CNN cut off the commentator "Hang on, Boyz II Men are on stage!"
posted by bongo_x at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Seriously, there's enough actual terrifying Trump stuff to be frightened of. We don't need to start saying he's a Russian asset.
Craziness like that just delegitimizes the actual horrifying bits.
rokusan
The problem is that it isn't "craziness". There is legitimate reason to suspect something is going on, that's been talked about since the hack, and has warranted an FBI investigation. This isn't "jet fuel can't melt steel beams" shit.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [48 favorites]
Craziness like that just delegitimizes the actual horrifying bits.
rokusan
The problem is that it isn't "craziness". There is legitimate reason to suspect something is going on, that's been talked about since the hack, and has warranted an FBI investigation. This isn't "jet fuel can't melt steel beams" shit.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [48 favorites]
They're REALLY trying to remind everyone how good the 1990s really were.
If it means she can stumble into another Internet economic boom, I'm all for the 90's.
I'll even let her take credit for it.
posted by rokusan at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
If it means she can stumble into another Internet economic boom, I'm all for the 90's.
I'll even let her take credit for it.
posted by rokusan at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Pffff if they can't get the surviving members of NKOTB they've lost my vote.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
this benediction is about the furthest thing from last week's
posted by murphy slaw at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by murphy slaw at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The contrast between this invocation and the one at the RNC could not be more pronounced.
posted by vverse23 at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by vverse23 at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2016
"Once, candidates hired Americans to break into their opponents’ communications. Now those good jobs have been outsourced."
That's a pretty good line.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
That's a pretty good line.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I have a lot of booze left over from my RNC drinking game. (If you see a person of color, drink!)
posted by kirkaracha at 1:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by kirkaracha at 1:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Cheers barely outweighing the boos at the mention of Clinton's name. :'(
posted by Talez at 1:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Talez at 1:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Are... are they booing the pastor?
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Mix of cheers and boos at the mention of HRC. The crowd is roaring at itself.
posted by stolyarova at 1:30 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by stolyarova at 1:30 PM on July 25, 2016
Clinton spends the next few hours inviting people to the stage to play GoldenEye and Mario Kart 64 on a vintage console with her.
Can't wait to see the secret service guys rush onstage to blow dust off the cartridge.
posted by rokusan at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Can't wait to see the secret service guys rush onstage to blow dust off the cartridge.
posted by rokusan at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
uh is she supposed to call out the nomination already?
posted by numaner at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by numaner at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Where were you when everyone (including both Sanders and Clinton supporters) were making fun of Trump for "Two Corinthians"?
Myself, I was laughing right along at Trump's pathetic attempt to pretend he is an Evangelical.
then a bunch of evangelicals jumped on the bandwagon and I choked on my popcorn a little bit
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Myself, I was laughing right along at Trump's pathetic attempt to pretend he is an Evangelical.
then a bunch of evangelicals jumped on the bandwagon and I choked on my popcorn a little bit
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Chants of "Bernie". Wow. They are trying to be so insurgent.
posted by Talez at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Talez at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016
It's 1968 all over again!!!
"Prologue, August 29, 1968 / Someday (August 29, 1968)" - Chicago Transit Authority
The Whole World Is Watching!
Where Were You in Chicago? / William Butler Yeats Visits Lincoln Park and Escapes Unscathed -- Phil Ochs
I didn't see you there . . .
"Chicago Policeman" -- Harry Burgess
A sort of "Ballad of the Green Beret" for Chicago's rioting cops.
"Chicago" -- Graham Nash
The line "So your brother's bound and gagged, and they've chained him to a chair . . . " refers to Bobby Seale, one of the Chicago Eight, accused and tried for inciting a riot, etc. following the protests/police riot at the 1968 Democratic National Convention in Chicago. The trial judge notoriously ordered that Seale be gagged and shackled during his trial.
"Illegal Smile" -- John Prine
The song is well know, but the connection has become obscure. The last verse:EightSeven. The trial and especially Hoffman's handling of it were widely seen as unfair and all the defendants eventually were successful in appealing their convictions.
posted by Herodios at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"Prologue, August 29, 1968 / Someday (August 29, 1968)" - Chicago Transit Authority
The Whole World Is Watching!
Where Were You in Chicago? / William Butler Yeats Visits Lincoln Park and Escapes Unscathed -- Phil Ochs
I didn't see you there . . .
"Chicago Policeman" -- Harry Burgess
A sort of "Ballad of the Green Beret" for Chicago's rioting cops.
"Chicago" -- Graham Nash
The line "So your brother's bound and gagged, and they've chained him to a chair . . . " refers to Bobby Seale, one of the Chicago Eight, accused and tried for inciting a riot, etc. following the protests/police riot at the 1968 Democratic National Convention in Chicago. The trial judge notoriously ordered that Seale be gagged and shackled during his trial.
"Illegal Smile" -- John Prine
The song is well know, but the connection has become obscure. The last verse:
I sat down in my closet with all my overallsJulius Hoffman was the judge at the trial of the Chicago
Trying to get away from all the ears inside my walls
I dreamed the police heard everything I thought, what then
Well I went to court and the judge's name wa-a-as "Hoffman" . . .
posted by Herodios at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
This is literally shoot the messenger sort of stuff, no one likes a tattletale, so we should disregard the contents?
I don't think that's the general tenor of people talking about the Russian connection. Few if any have said, "Just ignore the e-mails because they were stolen by Russians." Many people just aren't that interested in the e-mails because the "scandals" they've revealed so far are weak tea. But everybody should be interested in Putin trying to butt in on our election, especially given that Trump is doubling down on his insistence that we won't interfere with Russian attacks on its neighbors, even those in NATO.
Seriously, there's enough actual terrifying Trump stuff to be frightened of. We don't need to start saying he's a Russian asset.
He may not be a Russian asset, but Putin's eager embrace of and support for his candidacy should be a matter of concern. Russia is easily the scariest global actor and our foreign policy should help contain them, not encourage them to destabilize their neighbors.
posted by vathek at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
I don't think that's the general tenor of people talking about the Russian connection. Few if any have said, "Just ignore the e-mails because they were stolen by Russians." Many people just aren't that interested in the e-mails because the "scandals" they've revealed so far are weak tea. But everybody should be interested in Putin trying to butt in on our election, especially given that Trump is doubling down on his insistence that we won't interfere with Russian attacks on its neighbors, even those in NATO.
Seriously, there's enough actual terrifying Trump stuff to be frightened of. We don't need to start saying he's a Russian asset.
He may not be a Russian asset, but Putin's eager embrace of and support for his candidacy should be a matter of concern. Russia is easily the scariest global actor and our foreign policy should help contain them, not encourage them to destabilize their neighbors.
posted by vathek at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
That lady was all grace and poise.
posted by stolyarova at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by stolyarova at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
oh ffs shut up during the prayer you graceless trolls
posted by murphy slaw at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
BREAKING NEWS: Tangerine Coprolite names Infected Anal Butt Hair as running mate.
posted by y2karl at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by y2karl at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Jesus fucking christ they're chanting Bernie during the invocation.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Oh, kirkaracha, you are going to be TOASTED.
posted by cooker girl at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by cooker girl at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The chanting was "Bernie! Bernie! Bernie!", apparently. I thought the pastor handled it well.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tobascodagama at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The influence of a foreign autocratic party on American politics is a huge fucking story. The influence of a foreign power on an actual major candidate for President is literally the stuff of Hollywood nightmares. THAT has legs.
Um ...
posted by ZenMasterThis at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Um ...
posted by ZenMasterThis at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Oh jeez. The invocation included a note about "nominating Hillary Rodham Clinton" (which is really inappropriate in a prayer, but here we are). Mostly cheers, but then the Bernie! Bernie! crowd won't shut up while she finished the prayer.
posted by zachlipton at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Ok, first mention of Hillary's name from the stage - audience reaction sounded mostly positive, until as it started to subside a "Bernie, Bernie" chant could be heard.
So that's how this week's gonna go? Ugh.
posted by dnash at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016
So that's how this week's gonna go? Ugh.
posted by dnash at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016
Trump isn't a Russian asset, he's a useful idiot.
posted by Artw at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by Artw at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Oh this little old lady is ADORABLE.
posted by stolyarova at 1:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by stolyarova at 1:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"Where's the flag?" was absolutely adorable.
posted by zachlipton at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zachlipton at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016
I think Trump is a Russian asset in a similar way that Ulfric Stormcloak was an asset for the Thalmor. More happy coincidence than anything.
posted by charred husk at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by charred husk at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Oh oh I switched to CNN for a bit because MSNBC seemed to be having sound issues and Jake Tapper's anti-Black Lives Matter schtick-- asking whether Democrats were going to look like they were on the "wrong side" of the "law and order debate"-- got me so mad I had to switch back so I wouldn't actually throw something at the television. Ugh.
posted by BlueJae at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by BlueJae at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I do wish we had somebody reporting from the ground. I'd love to hear first-hand reports on how the whips and security folks are handling the Bernie delegates.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Tangerine Coprolite
You leave my new noise band out of this!
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
You leave my new noise band out of this!
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
God's notably a republican anyway so I hardly think it matters.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I still don't like children being used at conventions, but this kid looks like he's 14+. I'll give him a pass. His voice is beautiful.
posted by stolyarova at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by stolyarova at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2016
Manny from Modern Family singing the national anthem.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:34 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by kirkaracha at 1:34 PM on July 25, 2016
Say, does MeFi have a person there this time? Having corb's insights from the room where it happened was great last week.
My dad is there working right now. We haven't talked since this morning when he said he was near Dan Rather and Wyclef Jean. My sister and I demanded a selfie with Wyclef. No further updates.
posted by teponaztli at 1:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
My dad is there working right now. We haven't talked since this morning when he said he was near Dan Rather and Wyclef Jean. My sister and I demanded a selfie with Wyclef. No further updates.
posted by teponaztli at 1:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
They're gonna chant over everyone, folks. Including Bernie and Michelle Obama. It's a temper tantrum.
posted by argybarg at 1:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 1:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
It's 1968 all over again!!!
Thankfully it's nowhere near as bad as that. This is just the small, bitter remnants of the Bernie or Bust crowd letting off steam and embarrassing themselves in the process.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Thankfully it's nowhere near as bad as that. This is just the small, bitter remnants of the Bernie or Bust crowd letting off steam and embarrassing themselves in the process.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Okay this adorable and awesome kid singing the national anthem is totally making me feel better after my brief CNN-based freakout, phew.
posted by BlueJae at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by BlueJae at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
that kid just broke my windows with that high note. impressive
posted by dis_integration at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dis_integration at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
That kid killed it.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
For what it's worth wikileaks shrugged off the idea of the leaks coming from Russians. I also have a hard time buying this idea because someone already's taken credit (Gruccifer 2.0), so either he's lying, he's a Russian state actor, or someone else was responsible. Add to this, but I'm really not going to give credibility to the Clinton camp on anything tech related. Lest you forget, this is the woman that wants a "Manhattan-like Project to break encryption," and doesn't understand what wiping a hard drive means. Maybe someone smarter has briefed her, but even if true, this sound ridiculous. Blame the Russians!
posted by cjorgensen at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by cjorgensen at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
damn, laddie annihilated that high note in the anthem, i am humbled
posted by murphy slaw at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by murphy slaw at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
No, Trump is Baigan and Russia is the Lunarians
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
And the camera was there to make sure we see the national anthem kid get a hug from his presumed mom. That's how you produce a convention people.
posted by zachlipton at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Oh oh I switched to CNN for a bit because MSNBC
I did last week. MSNBC has been terrible. Sad.
posted by bongo_x at 1:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I did last week. MSNBC has been terrible. Sad.
posted by bongo_x at 1:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah kind of lame to boo and chant during a prayer but is it normal for the prayer to morph into a quasi-speech in the middle?
posted by beau jackson at 1:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by beau jackson at 1:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Are... are they booing the pastor?
If this is the "dissent" talked about towards the end of the last thread, it's a fucking awful way of showing it.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:36 PM on July 25, 2016
If this is the "dissent" talked about towards the end of the last thread, it's a fucking awful way of showing it.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:36 PM on July 25, 2016
Seriously, and hearing everyone sing along with him, oh man. Instant tears.
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:36 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:36 PM on July 25, 2016
I can't help but wonder if the people who are all fed up about the emails are just looking for reasons to be angry, and/or have never used email for professional purposes. Email isn't action, it's communication, and given that a lot of the context is removed it's not even complete communication.
At my work, for instance, someone proposed something that was a really bad idea in an email. And it was shot down, but in a later meeting. There's no email evidence that we didn't do the thing. Why would there be? We're not tailoring our communication in such a way that someone who steals it gets the whole picture.
posted by quillbreaker at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [37 favorites]
At my work, for instance, someone proposed something that was a really bad idea in an email. And it was shot down, but in a later meeting. There's no email evidence that we didn't do the thing. Why would there be? We're not tailoring our communication in such a way that someone who steals it gets the whole picture.
posted by quillbreaker at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [37 favorites]
Yeah kind of lame to boo and chant during a prayer but is it normal for the prayer to morph into a quasi-speech in the middle?
RNC moved the overton window on that one significantly when they asked god to defeat clinton
posted by murphy slaw at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
RNC moved the overton window on that one significantly when they asked god to defeat clinton
posted by murphy slaw at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Sangermaine, perhaps don't use "has warranted an FBI investigation" as your criteria for wrongdoing.
I maintain that "Trump is a Secret Russian Spy", which is all over FaceBook, is a huge distraction from his many (let's be generous and call them) shortcomings as a potential leader.
Even if it's somehow true*, making this argument sucks the air out of everything else, and will only convince millions that Democrats are flat-out making shit up now, delegitimizing everything else awful about Trump and what he represents.
* and get serious, it's not. But even if.
posted by rokusan at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I maintain that "Trump is a Secret Russian Spy", which is all over FaceBook, is a huge distraction from his many (let's be generous and call them) shortcomings as a potential leader.
Even if it's somehow true*, making this argument sucks the air out of everything else, and will only convince millions that Democrats are flat-out making shit up now, delegitimizing everything else awful about Trump and what he represents.
* and get serious, it's not. But even if.
posted by rokusan at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
For what it's worth wikileaks shrugged off the idea of the leaks coming from Russians.
Given the credibility hits they've taken of late I wouldn't take that at face value.
posted by Artw at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Given the credibility hits they've taken of late I wouldn't take that at face value.
posted by Artw at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Thanks everyone for being generally excellent in these megathreads. You are a wonderful community.
please allow me to introduce myself...
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
please allow me to introduce myself...
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
She was given a different job, so she went from unofficially working for Hillary to officially working for her. A Clinton always pays her debts.
For the last time, she's an HONORARY chairperson, which gives her as much power on the Hillary campaign as you or me. That and $3 gets you a latte.
DWS is essentially getting exiled to Florida for the rest of this campaign, and she'll probably be primaried out later this summer. This isn't a promotion. This is getting a year's supply of Rice-A-Roni and other lovely parting gifts while they're quietly pushing her and her cardboard box out the back door.
posted by dw at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
For the last time, she's an HONORARY chairperson, which gives her as much power on the Hillary campaign as you or me. That and $3 gets you a latte.
DWS is essentially getting exiled to Florida for the rest of this campaign, and she'll probably be primaried out later this summer. This isn't a promotion. This is getting a year's supply of Rice-A-Roni and other lovely parting gifts while they're quietly pushing her and her cardboard box out the back door.
posted by dw at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
Yeah kind of lame to boo and chant during a prayer but is it normal for the prayer to morph into a quasi-speech in the middle?
My sense of what is normal for a prayer during a convention is radically warped after CAPS-LOCK MAN PASTOR MARK BURNS last week.
posted by zachlipton at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
My sense of what is normal for a prayer during a convention is radically warped after CAPS-LOCK MAN PASTOR MARK BURNS last week.
posted by zachlipton at 1:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Is anyone is looking for evidence or information about the origin of the DNC intrusion, here's the Crowdstrike Analysis
For now I'd say let the ITsec analysts give you the details and and theories at this point, no one is just willy nilly making shit up in that field and then publishing it. It's like, the essence of "cite please" culture.
posted by Annika Cicada at 1:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
For now I'd say let the ITsec analysts give you the details and and theories at this point, no one is just willy nilly making shit up in that field and then publishing it. It's like, the essence of "cite please" culture.
posted by Annika Cicada at 1:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
Really? Because I remember her as a Hail Mary pass from an already embattled candidate. Maybe for one shining moment it looked like the RNC picked a VP from an underserved demographic they needed and this could mean something, but then she talked.
The RNC was in September that year, and I remember early on the consensus being she (Palin) was great. As the month wore on, she bombed spectacularly. That's how I remember it. I'll look and see if i'm deluded.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 1:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
The RNC was in September that year, and I remember early on the consensus being she (Palin) was great. As the month wore on, she bombed spectacularly. That's how I remember it. I'll look and see if i'm deluded.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 1:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Even if it's somehow true*
rokusan, I really don't get why you think it's completely impossible that Putin both wants to and has the power to influence our election.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
rokusan, I really don't get why you think it's completely impossible that Putin both wants to and has the power to influence our election.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
This Vice article goes into the evidence that Russian Intelligence is Guccifer 2.0. It's pretty damning and you really shouldn't dismiss the idea without actually, you know, reading about the forensic evidence.
If you're just assuming that the ties to Russia are the DNC flailing, well, read things for fuck's sake.
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [42 favorites]
If you're just assuming that the ties to Russia are the DNC flailing, well, read things for fuck's sake.
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [42 favorites]
"Bernie Sanders sends text to delegates: 'I ask you as a personal courtesy to me to not engage in any kind of protest on the floor.'"
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [111 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [111 favorites]
just looking for reasons to be angry, and/or have never used email for professional purposes
uh, both. Painfully, obviously, blindingly, both.
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
uh, both. Painfully, obviously, blindingly, both.
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I trust the (non-partisan) security experts who identify Guccifer 2.0 as probably Russian, but there's also this interview with someone (claiming to be) Guccifer 2.0, who claims to be Romanian but apparently doesn't speak Romanian.
I can't help but wonder if the people who are all fed up about the emails are just looking for reasons to be angry, and/or have never used email for professional purposes.
This is so obviously the case that it hardly needs stating.
Anyway, back on the convention, I liked the line about making sure the convention looks like America.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I can't help but wonder if the people who are all fed up about the emails are just looking for reasons to be angry, and/or have never used email for professional purposes.
This is so obviously the case that it hardly needs stating.
Anyway, back on the convention, I liked the line about making sure the convention looks like America.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The Mayor forgot the gavel again!
But I think that was just an audible sigh of relief that there were only a handful of nays for the credentials committee vote.
posted by zachlipton at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
But I think that was just an audible sigh of relief that there were only a handful of nays for the credentials committee vote.
posted by zachlipton at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
> This isn't a promotion. This is getting a year's supply of Rice-A-Roni and other lovely parting gifts while they're quietly pushing her and her cardboard box out the back door.
Did I call it a promotion? That won't come until after the election.
I'm saying it looks horrible.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Did I call it a promotion? That won't come until after the election.
I'm saying it looks horrible.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Nice of her to give that long pause for the nay voters to speak up.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The sigh from the chair on that Credentials Committee voice vote going right was very noticeable.
posted by dw at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by dw at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh also, this also happened this morning, but we all agreed we were sort of more excited about Wyclef than Dan Rather, and I said "more like Dan Rather Not, amirite?" No further updates.
posted by teponaztli at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by teponaztli at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
For what it's worth wikileaks shrugged off the idea of the leaks coming from Russians.
No, they are shrugging of an accusation that I haven't seen thusfar - that Wikileaks themselves are Russian agents (or responsible for the hack). No one thinks that (nor has accused) Wikileaks is responsible for the hacks themselves - that's not what they do; they release material that other parties have given them.
Add to this, but I'm really not going to give credibility to the Clinton camp on anything tech related.
The hacked emails came from the DNC, not the Clinton campaign. The DNC has competent people working for them (but again, good luck protecting against a well funded well skilled adversary that is fixated on their target).
I'm not comfortable with Clinton's stated tech policy at the moment either, I support her despite a number of misgivings on a number of her policies. Thankfully she's shown that she's willing to embrace new policies and discard problematic ones (see gay rights).
posted by el io at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Are they booing Barney Frank?
Jesus Christ.
posted by Talez at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Jesus Christ.
posted by Talez at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Barney Frank: "Thank you or not, as the case may be."
posted by palindromic at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [47 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [47 favorites]
"Thank you or not, as the case may be", say Barney Frank, who does not give a fuck about that noise.
posted by cortex at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [68 favorites]
posted by cortex at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [68 favorites]
The RN"C was in September that year, and I remember early on the consensus being she (Palin) was great. As the month wore on, she bombed spectacularly. That's how I remember it. I'll look and see if i'm deluded
I was working amidst a bunch of Republicans when Palin was announced as the pick. She got a standing ovation in the middle of the brokerage floor.
I don't think that reaction was entirely political, because of all the actually hoots (not kidding), but it was definitely jubilant.
posted by schadenfrau at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I was working amidst a bunch of Republicans when Palin was announced as the pick. She got a standing ovation in the middle of the brokerage floor.
I don't think that reaction was entirely political, because of all the actually hoots (not kidding), but it was definitely jubilant.
posted by schadenfrau at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Add to this, but I'm really not going to give credibility to the Clinton camp on anything tech related.
Always love to see the contortions and twisting done to turn this into a way blame Hillary Clinton again, but the FBI is investigating this and suspects Russian sources as well.
posted by FJT at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Always love to see the contortions and twisting done to turn this into a way blame Hillary Clinton again, but the FBI is investigating this and suspects Russian sources as well.
posted by FJT at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
while they're quietly pushing her and her cardboard box out the back door
This is 100% how I read it, too. Announcing the honorary chair position in the statement was not a great move but it sounds to me like "honorary chair" is just allowing DWS to save face a bit while being directed away from any real power.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
This is 100% how I read it, too. Announcing the honorary chair position in the statement was not a great move but it sounds to me like "honorary chair" is just allowing DWS to save face a bit while being directed away from any real power.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
The RN"C was in September that year, and I remember early on the consensus being she (Palin) was great. As the month wore on, she bombed spectacularly. That's how I remember it. I'll look and see if i'm deluded.
That's my recollection as well. Lots of "this is a game-changer" hot takes and then lots of "oh, it's THAT kind of game-changer" after a few days once it became clear that she was totally out of her depth.
I seem to remember a certain Saturday Night Live skit, as well.
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
That's my recollection as well. Lots of "this is a game-changer" hot takes and then lots of "oh, it's THAT kind of game-changer" after a few days once it became clear that she was totally out of her depth.
I seem to remember a certain Saturday Night Live skit, as well.
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Why in the NAME OF GOD would anyone boo Barney Frank
posted by argybarg at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
man i miss barney frank's jowly voice talking mad shit on tv news
posted by murphy slaw at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Did Barney Frank just say "thank you or not as the case may be?" That's great.
posted by zachlipton at 1:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 1:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"Bernie Sanders sends text to delegates: 'I ask you as a personal courtesy to me to not engage in any kind of protest on the floor.'"
They're not going to be courteous, dude. They just booed a pastor. If the kid that sang had mentioned Clinton, he'd have been booed, too.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
They're not going to be courteous, dude. They just booed a pastor. If the kid that sang had mentioned Clinton, he'd have been booed, too.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
How self-involved and privileged would you have to be to not recognize the incredible debt all justice-minded people owe that man?!
posted by argybarg at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Jesus, what's with all of the "no's" about the rules committee chairs??
posted by Salieri at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Salieri at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2016
Why in the NAME OF GOD would anyone boo Barney Frank
Because he's gay
posted by Melismata at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2016
Because he's gay
posted by Melismata at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2016
Why in the NAME OF GOD would anyone boo Barney Frank
Because he is not impressed by Bernie Sanders.
posted by palindromic at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Because he is not impressed by Bernie Sanders.
posted by palindromic at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Barney Frank has been out of fucks to give for a while and has made literally no effort to hide his contempt for Bernie Sanders. I'd have been super surprised if they hadn't booed him.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Why in the NAME OF GOD would anyone boo Barney Frank
He had the nerve to tell Sanders supporters to be pragmatic right at the beginning of the campaign.
posted by Talez at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
He had the nerve to tell Sanders supporters to be pragmatic right at the beginning of the campaign.
posted by Talez at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"Thank you or not, as the case may be", say Barney Frank, who does not give a fuck about that noise.
Frank's all like "Really? Is that all you got? I know Dick Armey. You, folks, are no Dick Armey."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Frank's all like "Really? Is that all you got? I know Dick Armey. You, folks, are no Dick Armey."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Oh also, this also happened this morning, but we all agreed we were sort of more excited about Wyclef than Dan Rather, and I said "more like Dan Rather Not, amirite?" No further updates.
I thought my dad was the only one who made that joke . . .
posted by chainsofreedom at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016
I thought my dad was the only one who made that joke . . .
posted by chainsofreedom at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016
Damn, my DNC feed from C-Span keeps freezing. Annoying as hell.
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016
Jesus, what's with all of the "no's" about the rules committee chairs??
I believe that the Hillary haters are determined to reenact the Nevada caucus.
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016
I believe that the Hillary haters are determined to reenact the Nevada caucus.
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016
Always love to see the contortions and twisting done to turn this into a way blame Hillary Clinton again, but the FBI is investigating this and suspects Russian sources as well.
Who is blaming Clinton? I am saying that her camp coming out and saying Russians! looks like a deflection from the contents of the messages themselves. Let someone else make that accusation. Someone that has a bit more credibility when it comes to technology.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Who is blaming Clinton? I am saying that her camp coming out and saying Russians! looks like a deflection from the contents of the messages themselves. Let someone else make that accusation. Someone that has a bit more credibility when it comes to technology.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I can no longer distinguish between the ayes and the boos
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I maintain that "Trump is a Secret Russian Spy", which is all over FaceBook
rokusan
I don't know what you've read on Facebook, but no one here has suggested that and I think you may, purposefully or not, be characterizing what has been said in absurd terms to downplay discussion.
What has been said is that there is reason to believe the email leak was done by Russia as a means of influencing the election towards what Russia sees as a more favorable candidate. Trump isn't a spy, but he's clearly the candidate more friendly to Russia.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
rokusan
I don't know what you've read on Facebook, but no one here has suggested that and I think you may, purposefully or not, be characterizing what has been said in absurd terms to downplay discussion.
What has been said is that there is reason to believe the email leak was done by Russia as a means of influencing the election towards what Russia sees as a more favorable candidate. Trump isn't a spy, but he's clearly the candidate more friendly to Russia.
posted by Sangermaine at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Ugh, this is going to be the entire week. Every single mention of HRC is going to devolve into her supporters trying to cheer loud enough to drown out the boos and chants.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
while they're quietly pushing her and her cardboard box out the back door
Worth noting that neither Clinton nor Obama have particularly warm and fuzzy feelings for DWS, especially after her attempt to quietly jump on the winning horse during the closing weeks of the '08 primary. The surprising bit to me, really, is that it took Clinton this long to cut her loose, given that both her competency and loyalty were compromised.
posted by fifthrider at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2016
Worth noting that neither Clinton nor Obama have particularly warm and fuzzy feelings for DWS, especially after her attempt to quietly jump on the winning horse during the closing weeks of the '08 primary. The surprising bit to me, really, is that it took Clinton this long to cut her loose, given that both her competency and loyalty were compromised.
posted by fifthrider at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2016
I'm having good luck with the livestream from the Democratic Convention site.
posted by palindromic at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by palindromic at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016
Jesus, what's with all of the "no's" about the rules committee chairs??
Like, do they have a legitimate grievance, or are they just being shitty?
(Don't answer.)
Jesus, what's with all of the "no's" about the rules committee chairs??
Twitch's stream is pretty good. Just remember to hide the chat.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016
Like, do they have a legitimate grievance, or are they just being shitty?
(Don't answer.)
Jesus, what's with all of the "no's" about the rules committee chairs??
Twitch's stream is pretty good. Just remember to hide the chat.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016
CNN reporting DNC offers "deep and sincere" apology to Sanders
(as chants of "Bernie" are heard in the background...)
posted by Noisy Pink Bubbles at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
(as chants of "Bernie" are heard in the background...)
posted by Noisy Pink Bubbles at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Why in the NAME OF GOD would anyone boo Barney Frank
Frank is charming but he's worked pretty hard to stop reform of the banking industry and he's been pretty undiplomatic in his attitude toward Sanders supporters.
posted by dis_integration at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Frank is charming but he's worked pretty hard to stop reform of the banking industry and he's been pretty undiplomatic in his attitude toward Sanders supporters.
posted by dis_integration at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
> Holy god the boos. Fucking shut the fuck up.
I am not hearing them on my feed.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016
I am not hearing them on my feed.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016
Marcia Fudge has a 10,000-watt smile.
posted by stolyarova at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Welp, NONE of these people will still have their voices by the time prime time rolls around.
posted by acidic at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by acidic at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Sanders himself is getting booed by his supporters.
posted by sandettie light vessel automatic at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by sandettie light vessel automatic at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Jesus jumped-up Christ on a sidecar, they won't even listen to the guy they say they support.
posted by Mooski at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Mooski at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Like, do they have a legitimate grievance, or are they just being shitty?
Obstructive twits.
posted by Talez at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Obstructive twits.
posted by Talez at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
How many women spoke for Trump that weren't related to him or employed by him?
posted by kirkaracha at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Who is blaming Clinton? I am saying that her camp coming out and saying Russians! looks like a deflection from the contents of the messages themselves. Let someone else make that accusation. Someone that has a bit more credibility when it comes to technology.
How about the three forensic security teams who've had access to the DNC servers? Do they count?
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
How about the three forensic security teams who've had access to the DNC servers? Do they count?
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
Because he's gay
Frank has gotten an enormous amount of gross shit over the years for being an openly gay man in Congress, but the floor of the DNC in 2016 thankfully isn't really a place where that, at least, is likely to be the driver for booing. This is as folks have noted pure primary friction being played out, same as the rest of the booing and such.
posted by cortex at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Frank has gotten an enormous amount of gross shit over the years for being an openly gay man in Congress, but the floor of the DNC in 2016 thankfully isn't really a place where that, at least, is likely to be the driver for booing. This is as folks have noted pure primary friction being played out, same as the rest of the booing and such.
posted by cortex at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Never underestimate the left's ability to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
posted by Talez at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by Talez at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Sandettie, that article is so disheartening
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2016
I'm walking over to the protests now to check them out.
posted by lazaruslong at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by lazaruslong at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
They are booing someone who is criticizing income inequality. They are not listening
posted by Tarumba at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Yeah, I'm watching the Twitch stream because I was really hoping for something uplifting, but this is just fucking depressing. These assholes won't even let the chair speak.
posted by Salieri at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Salieri at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016
Now we're booing Marcia Fudge while she talks about respecting "every race, religion, and sexual orientation." I'm throwing things here.
posted by zachlipton at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Trump is watching this with a huge shit eating grin on his face.
posted by Talez at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Talez at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Christ, I wanted to believe I was being too pessimistic. This is, in fact, going to be a nightmare.
posted by argybarg at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Nope, I can't take this. Shutting it off. I might come back in here to see what's happening, but I can't watch this implosion happening live.
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
If they were republicans, half would be chanting USA - USA!
posted by peeedro at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by peeedro at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
How many women spoke for Trump that weren't related to him or employed by him?
I think Ann Coulter may be a supporter.
posted by el io at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I think Ann Coulter may be a supporter.
posted by el io at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This disrespectful booing of the current speaker is fucking awful. UGH.
posted by dnash at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by dnash at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Watching a bunch of White people boo and shout down Black speakers.
posted by bongo_x at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Oh my god we are better than this, do not turn the DNC into the same horror show that was the RNC
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
The booing is yet another example of how Bernie Sanders completely fucked up his campaign.
posted by Annika Cicada at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [69 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [69 favorites]
Given the narrative of why Sanders lost the primary, it's not a great look for the Sanders fans to try to shout over and boo speakers of color.
posted by palindromic at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [37 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [37 favorites]
They are booing someone who is criticizing income inequality. They are not listening
They're not booing fixing income inequality. They're booing the idea that Clinton is making it part of her standard.
posted by Talez at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
They're not booing fixing income inequality. They're booing the idea that Clinton is making it part of her standard.
posted by Talez at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Sanders owns this. He owns the mob he created. This will be his legacy.
posted by schadenfrau at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
sheesh enough with the boos, we know you're cranky.
posted by Theta States at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Theta States at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Marcia Fudge looks like she's going to go down there and crack some skulls.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
> How about the three forensic security teams who've had access to the DNC servers? Do they count?
Yes they do, so let them make the case. It's a no win for the Clinton camp.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016
Yes they do, so let them make the case. It's a no win for the Clinton camp.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2016
I just hope none of the speakers let the boos rattle them. As long as they can keep up a calm, composed appearance on stage, this shit will get tamped down.
posted by penduluum at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Goddamn Ms. Fudge you DEMAND the respect you're owed.
Good for her.
posted by Salieri at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Good for her.
posted by Salieri at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Frank has gotten an enormous amount of gross shit over the years for being an openly gay man in Congress, but the floor of the DNC in 2016 thankfully isn't really a place where that, at least, is likely to be the driver for booing.
Well, yes, but:
Now we're booing Marcia Fudge while she talks about respecting "every race, religion, and sexual orientation." I'm throwing things here.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
posted by tobascodagama at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Well, yes, but:
Now we're booing Marcia Fudge while she talks about respecting "every race, religion, and sexual orientation." I'm throwing things here.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
posted by tobascodagama at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"I respect you, and I want you to respect me!"
"We're all Democrats and we need to act like it! Lets do it!"
You tell 'em Marcia!
posted by snuffleupagus at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
"We're all Democrats and we need to act like it! Lets do it!"
You tell 'em Marcia!
posted by snuffleupagus at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
I like Marcia Fudge. She wants no part of this shit.
posted by dw at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by dw at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
PREACH MARCIA FUDGE
posted by penduluum at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
"We are all Democrats, and we need to act like it! Let's do it!"
Oh hell yes!!!!!!!
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Oh hell yes!!!!!!!
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
"I am going to be respectful of you, and I want you to be respectful of me. We are all Democrats and we need to act like it. Let's do it!" Marcia Fudge is handling this like a champ.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by everybody had matching towels at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
I want Marcia Fudge to be my representative. She has that "I am not putting up with your foolishness" look on her face while she's speaking. Then demands respect because she's giving you respect. I love her and I've never heard of her until about 5 minutes ago.
posted by hollygoheavy at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
posted by hollygoheavy at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
Don't mess with Marcia Fudge.
posted by vverse23 at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by vverse23 at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The thing is, there was more opposition within the republican party towards Trump, even among the delegates themselves. But the Republicans have more party discipline and work tactically to defeat their enemy.
posted by el io at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by el io at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I mean they're being insufferable, but we knew they'd do that. The real trick is if they feel like they've been heard or if they keep being annoying throughout the night. No one expected that the Bernie people wouldn't be a little annoying.
posted by DynamiteToast at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by DynamiteToast at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I can't watch right now. How much booing is going on? Whole contingents or random people?
posted by futz at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by futz at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016
sheesh enough with the boos, we know you're cranky.
Naps for everyone! Except Trump.
posted by Existential Dread at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Naps for everyone! Except Trump.
posted by Existential Dread at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Yes they do, so let them make the case. It's a no win for the Clinton camp.
Only if you're already inclined to dismiss anything they say as a lie.
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Only if you're already inclined to dismiss anything they say as a lie.
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
what the fuck are they chanting now
posted by murphy slaw at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by murphy slaw at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Again, I live among these people. They're probably 1% of the Democratic voters, but absolutely nothing will stop them from shitting over this entire process for their own purposes.
posted by argybarg at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
What is being chanted right now?
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2016
My rep Sheila gettin in there of course.
posted by DynamiteToast at 1:53 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by DynamiteToast at 1:53 PM on July 25, 2016
what the fuck are they chanting now
Sounds like "we're dumb fools!"
I'm just going to go with that.
posted by snuffleupagus at 1:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Sounds like "we're dumb fools!"
I'm just going to go with that.
posted by snuffleupagus at 1:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I am heartened by the way the cheerers are attempting to mitigate the booers.
posted by palindromic at 1:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by palindromic at 1:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I take back the comment about not hearing the boos.
posted by cjorgensen at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by cjorgensen at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Booing pastors asking for social justice, LGBT people for talking about their lives, and PoC speaking to them about policies they agree with.
This is indefensible. How long until they start chanting "LOCK HER UP"?
posted by zombieflanders at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
This is indefensible. How long until they start chanting "LOCK HER UP"?
posted by zombieflanders at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Oh god I'm so embarrassed and disheartened by these Bernie supporters willing to burn everything down because their guy lost.
posted by Theta States at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by Theta States at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Sanders himself is getting booed by his supporters.
"And heeeere come the pretzels!"
"And Senator Bernie Sanders now on the field pleading with the crowd for some kind of sanity."
posted by FJT at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
"And heeeere come the pretzels!"
"And Senator Bernie Sanders now on the field pleading with the crowd for some kind of sanity."
posted by FJT at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I am seriously embarrassed to be a Californian right now.
posted by acidic at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by acidic at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
For those not watching, generally when Clinton/Kaine get mentioned, there is an immediate uproar. The cheers outweigh the boos, though you can tell some people are booing, and then when the cheers die out the boos continue for about half as long as the cheering went. So it sounds like there are more non-bernie people, but the bernie people are determined to be loud.
posted by DynamiteToast at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by DynamiteToast at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I can't watch right now. How much booing is going on? Whole contingents or random people?
The stream I'm watching isn't showing the crowd, but it sounds like a single group of people. The cheers are easily drowning them out, but the booing and chants are generally not coming on cheer lines, so they're audible on the stream anyway.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The stream I'm watching isn't showing the crowd, but it sounds like a single group of people. The cheers are easily drowning them out, but the booing and chants are generally not coming on cheer lines, so they're audible on the stream anyway.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
As long as they can keep up a calm, composed appearance on stage, this shit will get tamped down.Who is going to tamp them down, though? Bernie sent them all a text begging them to be respectful of the speakers, and they don't care. Bernie is clearly a weak and ineffective leader, and his supporters are a mob. This is bad for the Democrats, but it's a disaster for the left. Why would anyone try to work with folks like this?
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
Barnie Frank doesn't have time for teleprompters either.
posted by zachlipton at 1:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 1:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
oh god, it was "lock her up"
posted by murphy slaw at 1:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 1:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I am of the opinion that any attempts to refight the primaries is profoundly unhelpful and at this point basically an attempt to throw things for Trump.
Sanders owns this. He owns the mob he created. This will be his legacy
I would include crap like this, TBH.
posted by Artw at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Sanders owns this. He owns the mob he created. This will be his legacy
I would include crap like this, TBH.
posted by Artw at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Will never understand the point of voice votes.
posted by palindromic at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I also have a hard time buying this idea because someone already's taken credit (Gruccifer 2.0), so either he's lying, he's a Russian state actor, or someone else was responsible.
You mean the Twitter account that appeared literally 24 hours after the CrowdStrike analysis came out, who claims to be Romanian but can't speak the language well?
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
You mean the Twitter account that appeared literally 24 hours after the CrowdStrike analysis came out, who claims to be Romanian but can't speak the language well?
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I think a fair portion of the "left" secretly, maybe unconsciously, wants Trump to win so they can prove how right they were about Americans being stupid and terrible
posted by theodolite at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Why would anyone try to work with folks like this?
Because they're voting Americans?
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Because they're voting Americans?
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
That chant is repulsive
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
What the fuck is going to happen when Hillary speaks??!
posted by Tarumba at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Tarumba at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016
Every woman on the stage looks like she is about to knock some heads together. Though a pacifist, I gotta say I support them in this.
posted by kalimac at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by kalimac at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
My forlorn hope is that this show of booing will expose this fringe of Democrats as being the irresponsible gadflies they are and consolidate the base.
posted by peacheater at 1:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by peacheater at 1:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The behavior of the Sander's supporters is just baffling. How can they not see that they are coming off as completely unreasonable asshats?
posted by JakeEXTREME at 1:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by JakeEXTREME at 1:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Oh come on, booing the adoption of the Rules Committee?? That's just being an asshole to be an asshole. Why are you even there.
posted by dnash at 1:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by dnash at 1:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'm hoping these folks will be all booed out by Thursday, and that there will only be some residual traces of the chants when she starts speaking.
posted by palindromic at 1:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 1:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Will never understand the point of voice votes.
They're procedural rubber stamping votes. They're not supposed to be serious votes. It's sort of like unanimous consent. They don't actually vote on every single motion, they assume that everyone wants to go home at the end of the day and the guy who doesn't is just being a cockweasel.
posted by Talez at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
They're procedural rubber stamping votes. They're not supposed to be serious votes. It's sort of like unanimous consent. They don't actually vote on every single motion, they assume that everyone wants to go home at the end of the day and the guy who doesn't is just being a cockweasel.
posted by Talez at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Go Leticia, talking about her grandmother becoming a citizen! I hate that these speakers feel like they have to shout over these jerks.
posted by Salieri at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
oh god, it was "lock her up"
Please be joking
Please be joking
Please be joking
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Please be joking
Please be joking
Please be joking
posted by Gaz Errant at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Can someone explain Sanders supporters booing Sanders himself? I didn't think he had been on stage yet.
posted by noneuclidean at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by noneuclidean at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
How long until they start chanting "LOCK HER UP"?
Looks like the answer was "as I was typing those words": Bernie delegates from CA chant "Lock her up"
This is disgusting.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Looks like the answer was "as I was typing those words": Bernie delegates from CA chant "Lock her up"
This is disgusting.
posted by zombieflanders at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Hopefully by the time HRC takes the stage, they've managed these intellectual balls of fire back into their playpens.
posted by Mooski at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Mooski at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016
Jesus fucking christ they're chanting Bernie during the invocation. . . Why in the NAME OF GOD would anyone boo Barney Frank . . . they just booed a pastor. If the kid that sang had mentioned Clinton, he'd have been booed, too. . . . are they booing the pastor? . . . Sanders himself is getting booed by his supporters. . . .Like, do they have a legitimate grievance, or are they just being shitty? . . . They are booing someone who is criticizing income inequality. They are not listening . . . Now we're booing Marcia Fudge while she talks about respecting "every race, religion, and sexual orientation." . . . This disrespectful booing of the current speaker is fucking awful. UGH. . . .
At some point -- at some point -- this stops being what they think it is and becomes something else. It's not going to do what they want it to do, and it's not going to get them what they think they want. They are a minority and they aren't winning any converts. They are going to tire and the rest of the convention is going to move on without them.
They want to be the thunderstorm at the picnic; it's going to turn out that they are merely the ants.
posted by Herodios at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
At some point -- at some point -- this stops being what they think it is and becomes something else. It's not going to do what they want it to do, and it's not going to get them what they think they want. They are a minority and they aren't winning any converts. They are going to tire and the rest of the convention is going to move on without them.
They want to be the thunderstorm at the picnic; it's going to turn out that they are merely the ants.
posted by Herodios at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Is there anywhere I can sign up to conspire against the chanting Bernie Bros?
posted by vathek at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by vathek at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Wait, what is the California delegation doing?
posted by persona au gratin at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016
What the fuck is going to happen when Hillary speaks??!
I hear she's backstage getting lasers fixed to her eyeballs and Marcia Fudge is about to go back there and give her pointers on how to give the crowd a good staredown.
posted by phunniemee at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I hear she's backstage getting lasers fixed to her eyeballs and Marcia Fudge is about to go back there and give her pointers on how to give the crowd a good staredown.
posted by phunniemee at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
The radical left is cooked.
Occupy this, assholes.
posted by Annika Cicada at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Occupy this, assholes.
posted by Annika Cicada at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
I think a fair portion of the "left" secretly, maybe unconsciously, wants Trump to win so they can prove how right they were about Americans being stupid and terrible
That's not a joke. A huge part of the Left doesn't want to win, they want to be the tragic underdog.
posted by bongo_x at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [53 favorites]
That's not a joke. A huge part of the Left doesn't want to win, they want to be the tragic underdog.
posted by bongo_x at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [53 favorites]
Because they're voting Americans?So are the Tea Party, but trying to compromise with them is a lost cause. You can't work with them. You can only defeat them.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I'm listening to the YouTube feed and not hearing any chanting at all.
posted by octothorpe at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by octothorpe at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016
Ugg. Shame on them.
posted by persona au gratin at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016
I admire every person up on stage dealing with the boos right now. They are so fucking strong to withstand all this right now
"Grassroots always has a seat at the table"
Make it so!
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"Grassroots always has a seat at the table"
Make it so!
posted by Hermione Granger at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
If they were chanting against Padilla, it was "count the votes."
posted by dw at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by dw at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016
The thing is, they don't even want anything. They're not asking for anything coherent. There's no bargaining.
They just want to shit on everything.
posted by schadenfrau at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
They just want to shit on everything.
posted by schadenfrau at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
Can someone explain Sanders supporters booing Sanders himself? I didn't think he had been on stage yet.
There were various delegate meetings and events earlier in the day, not part of the main public scheduled convention event we're watching now.
posted by cortex at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
There were various delegate meetings and events earlier in the day, not part of the main public scheduled convention event we're watching now.
posted by cortex at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
What the fuck do the boo-ers want? What demands do they have? Do they have some representative they can speak through? Is it Bernie? If it's Bernie, he's pretty much made it clear what he wants and it doesn't sound to me like it's supposed to be this. If it's not Bernie, then who is it? If there's no representative, do they expect the DNC to negotiate with them as an unstructured, amorphous mass of chants and heckles? What is going on with these people?
posted by mhum at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by mhum at 1:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
The radical left is cooking itself with the intent of taking down the Democratic Party with it.
posted by argybarg at 2:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 2:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"As you may have heard, there already seem to be many more protests from the left around the Democratic convention than there were around the Republican convention. If it seems strange to you that leftists would be protesting not the candidate who wants to deport 11 million people, ban Muslims from entering the country and roll back civil rights gains for gay Americans, but the candidate who wants to increase the minimum wage to $15 an hour, expand Social Security and enact universal child care, well, that would only mean that you’re unfamiliar with leftist politics."I lol'd.
— Despite what you’ve heard, Democrats aren’t in disarray. Their party is under attack from the outside.
posted by octobersurprise at 2:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
I think a fair portion of the "left" secretly, maybe unconsciously, wants Trump to win so they can prove how right they were about Americans being stupid and terrible
For those of us who live next door, can you please run this experiment in another time/space continuum?
Hugs and kisses,
Canada
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
For those of us who live next door, can you please run this experiment in another time/space continuum?
Hugs and kisses,
Canada
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
What the fuck do the boo-ers want? What demands do they have? Do they have some representative they can speak through? Is it Bernie? If it's Bernie, he's pretty much made it clear what he wants and it doesn't sound to me like it's supposed to be this. If it's not Bernie, then who is it? If there's no representative, do they expect the DNC to negotiate with them as an unstructured, amorphous mass of chants and heckles? What is going on with these people?
The key phrase is "Bern it Down". You do the math.
posted by Talez at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
The key phrase is "Bern it Down". You do the math.
posted by Talez at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Artw: I would include crap like this, TBH.
He encouraged his followers in the delusion that his losses were caused by cheating and not by the majority of primary voters going for someone else. When his supporters behaved abominably in the Nevada convention, he didn't shut them down but whined about both sides do it. He owns this.
I was willing to give him a certain amount of cooling down time -- it always hurts to lose -- but here's the difference between him and Hillary Clinton: she got over her bitter moments and enthusiastically and fully supported Obama, down to nominating him from the floor. It's the difference between a mature adult and a sullen child.
posted by tavella at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [51 favorites]
He encouraged his followers in the delusion that his losses were caused by cheating and not by the majority of primary voters going for someone else. When his supporters behaved abominably in the Nevada convention, he didn't shut them down but whined about both sides do it. He owns this.
I was willing to give him a certain amount of cooling down time -- it always hurts to lose -- but here's the difference between him and Hillary Clinton: she got over her bitter moments and enthusiastically and fully supported Obama, down to nominating him from the floor. It's the difference between a mature adult and a sullen child.
posted by tavella at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [51 favorites]
What exactly is the point of the YouTube chat stream? It flies by at about 50 comments a second, who could ever follow that?
posted by octothorpe at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by octothorpe at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
They're narcissistic, entitled assholes. That's Occam's Razor on this one.
posted by argybarg at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
The behavior of the Sander's supporters is just baffling. How can they not see that they are coming off as completely unreasonable asshats?
"Welcome to the 2016 election" -- a whole lot of Hillary supporters
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
"Welcome to the 2016 election" -- a whole lot of Hillary supporters
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
This is what accelerationism looks like.
posted by Annika Cicada at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 2:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Huh, not booing Webb so much for describing himself as a longtime supporter of Hillary Clinton. I don't want to say it's cuz he's a dude, but...
posted by palindromic at 2:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 2:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
The die hard Sanders supporters are gonna throw the country to the wolves and feel triumphant for it?
God help us, we are such a fractured people
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
God help us, we are such a fractured people
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
What exactly is the point of the YouTube chat stream? It flies by at about 50 comments a second, who could ever follow that?
Sometimes you just really, really want to drink out of a firehose.
posted by cortex at 2:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Sometimes you just really, really want to drink out of a firehose.
posted by cortex at 2:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
This is literally why we can't have nice things.
posted by bongo_x at 2:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 2:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
What exactly is the point of the YouTube chat stream? It flies by at about 50 comments a second, who could ever follow that?
Memes.
posted by Talez at 2:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Memes.
posted by Talez at 2:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
At city hall. So far not a lot to see. A metric fuckton of cops. Handful of "never Hilary" people, all women oddly enough. A lot of voter registration people. One pretty crazy looking shaman dude with a stop binary thinking setup in the style of timecube.
posted by lazaruslong at 2:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by lazaruslong at 2:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Boos seem to have calmed down in general since Padilla spoke.
posted by chainsofreedom at 2:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by chainsofreedom at 2:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Parade of people marching about Puerto Rico. Chanting Puerto Rico is not for sale.
posted by lazaruslong at 2:04 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by lazaruslong at 2:04 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh, Wellington Webb. You are missed.
posted by dw at 2:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dw at 2:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
@JenGriffinFNC - Breaking: Dem source: in last hour, Sanders camp urgently reached out to Clinton camp, worried their delegates plan to disrupt tonight.
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
They both deserve our cheers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Oh man I'd totally vote Timecube 2016
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 2:04 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 2:04 PM on July 25, 2016
Fuck yeah Wellington Webb. "They both deserve our cheers."
posted by tonycpsu at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I masochistically just peeked into the Sanders for president subreddit. Apparently, what they want is for 'unelectable' Hillary to step down and let Bernie take the lead.
For realsies, that's what they're posting about.
They're praying for wikileaks to 'drop a bomb' today and urging anyone in the area to show up and protest.
As someone who supported Sanders early on, it's embarrassing. I hope Bernie comes out and tells people to put on their damned big kid pants and stop whining.
posted by lovecrafty at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
For realsies, that's what they're posting about.
They're praying for wikileaks to 'drop a bomb' today and urging anyone in the area to show up and protest.
As someone who supported Sanders early on, it's embarrassing. I hope Bernie comes out and tells people to put on their damned big kid pants and stop whining.
posted by lovecrafty at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Someone on Facebook is really pissed off about the voter registration people at City Hall, lazaruslong. Apparently it's some kind of Hillary conspiracy? To get people to vote, I guess? I don't get it.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"Just as we watched Lebron James and Steph Curry shake hands after a well fought final..." This is a heck of a pitch for unity.
"Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders are our champions. They both deserve our cheers." (followed by Bernie cheers of course)
posted by zachlipton at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
"Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders are our champions. They both deserve our cheers." (followed by Bernie cheers of course)
posted by zachlipton at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
"Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders are our champions. They both deserve our cheers." - Wellington Webb is also handling this like a champ.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by everybody had matching towels at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I'm so furious and disgusted right now. If Bernie doesn't do everything he can to rebuke and chastise them for this nonsense during his speech, he's enabling them and not doing a damn thing to defeat Trump. He better come out fucking furious tonight. He asked them to be goddamn polite, and I guess none of them listened.
posted by yasaman at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Well I thought I was done donating $ to Clinton for this pay period but I just sent over some more. I can't even watch the DNC stream right now but certainly, the Bern It Down people have, uh, moved me. I'm probably not alone.
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The radical left is cooked.
Occupy this, assholes
There's a lot more to the radical left than a bunch of people booing at the DNC.
posted by teponaztli at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
Occupy this, assholes
There's a lot more to the radical left than a bunch of people booing at the DNC.
posted by teponaztli at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
I totally understand why people are watching this and panicking a little, but I actually feel reassured, because there was more leadership on display in Marcia Fudge's speech, calming the crowd, than at any point during the entirety of the RNC. This is the key difference: one side has a lot of people who have scraped and scratched their way into leadership positions throughout the country, who have earned it in ways we can't fully appreciate, and they're highlighting that, while the other side held a bookless book burning.
posted by feloniousmonk at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by feloniousmonk at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Man, Webb is being so incredibly gracious about "they both deserve cheers", especially with the "Bernie" chants in the background.
You shouldn't have to instruct the delegates to cheer nicely for each other like you're addressing a kindergarten class, but...there we are, I guess.
posted by Salieri at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
You shouldn't have to instruct the delegates to cheer nicely for each other like you're addressing a kindergarten class, but...there we are, I guess.
posted by Salieri at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I have seen about 25 people with voter registration setups. None of them have had any Hilary stuff on or mentioned her.
posted by lazaruslong at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by lazaruslong at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016
Someone on Facebook is really pissed off about the voter registration people at City Hall, lazaruslong. Apparently it's some kind of Hillary conspiracy? To get people to vote, I guess? I don't get it.
The only legitimate outcome is the one they want. Zero respect for democracy.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
The only legitimate outcome is the one they want. Zero respect for democracy.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Marcia Fudge is about to go back there and give her pointers on how to give the crowd a good staredown.
I was surprised to find that Ms. Fudge is single. Those definitely looked like some mom- and grandma-staredowns. But then she has to deal with fools in Congress.
posted by kirkaracha at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Lots of young black families playing in the water fountain thingy. Adorable. Bands playing. Seems pretty chill and enjoyable overall to be honest.
posted by lazaruslong at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by lazaruslong at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
For what it's worth, I see no sign at all that Bernie wants his people to disrupt the convention. He just can't control them.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Look, Bernie spent a great deal of time making the case that the entire system is corrupt, and that Hillary is part of that system. Goldman Sachs speeches, SuperPacs, etc. The takeaway is that she's as corrupt as anyone else in the system. Of course, because Bernie doesn't care to do nuance, he never (until recently) pointed out that "corruption" isn't a binary feature. Politicians with SuperPacs can do real good for the nation (viz. Obama).
I jumped ship on Bernie when I started to feel that he was selling cynicism. Come on, Bernie. You created this. Do the right thing and tamp it down.
posted by persona au gratin at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
I jumped ship on Bernie when I started to feel that he was selling cynicism. Come on, Bernie. You created this. Do the right thing and tamp it down.
posted by persona au gratin at 2:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
My god people walking to the podium are brave AF
posted by Tarumba at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Given that DWS's thing is supposed to be that she raises funds like nobody else, I understand not wanting to kick her in the face instead of ease her out. Don't want to piss off the donors that probably like her.
And honestly, I don't like what she's done, but there's a weird sort of glee in the way people go after her that's kind of uncomfortable. It's hard not to wonder if a man in that position would excite people's bloodlust quite so much. Maybe he would, but...like I said, it sets off my Spidey sense. Much like the way some people are just a little too into hating Clinton, as opposed to just saying "eh, I don't support her."
posted by emjaybee at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
And honestly, I don't like what she's done, but there's a weird sort of glee in the way people go after her that's kind of uncomfortable. It's hard not to wonder if a man in that position would excite people's bloodlust quite so much. Maybe he would, but...like I said, it sets off my Spidey sense. Much like the way some people are just a little too into hating Clinton, as opposed to just saying "eh, I don't support her."
posted by emjaybee at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Seriously though. That behavior. That's not new behavior. That's typical of what people have been experiencing since last fall.
posted by Annika Cicada at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
BERNIE BERNIE BERNIE
posted by Foci for Analysis at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016
I cannot believe I just watched Wellington Webb have to scold a roomful of delegates like he's a school principal.
(A friend of mine is working inside the convention -- he's said that it's worse than what they're showing, but I'm genuinely afraid to ask for details.)
posted by kalimac at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
(A friend of mine is working inside the convention -- he's said that it's worse than what they're showing, but I'm genuinely afraid to ask for details.)
posted by kalimac at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Without moving goalpoasts, the notion I find ludicrous is the suggestion that Trump and the Kremlin are actively working together, that Trump is a Russian asset or somehow controlled by Putin. It's all over Facebook and other such places, and I find it very hard to swallow and counterproductive.
As for capacity? Yes, I think should Russia (or China, or Germany, or whoever) wish to influence our election through technology, they'd be more than capable of doing more than hacking into a poorly-secured e-mail server being used in a pre-election nomination runup in order to... I'm not even sure what... make Clinton's employees look dishonest? That's the best they could do? What's the goal, there?
I also have trouble with motive. If the goal was to elect Trump, and all the polling says Sanders would defeat Trump more soundly than Hillary, why on earth harm Hillary? I also don't believe Putin is foolish enough to think a random-factor like Trump is a good thing to arm with a nuclear stockpile, no matter what NATO nonsense he sputters this week or next.
Also, just mentally reviewing every hack I've seen or read about in the last thirty years or so... stealing e-mails from a poorly-protected server and dumping them on WikiLeaks is something annoying hacker kids do, not state actors. It's so amateurish and pointless, compared to what they probably could do.
But maybe this is a dumb digression that is doing exactly what I feared it would do in our microcosm here: distract us from actual problems. It definitely doesn't have much to do with the convention, so apologies for my part in derailing.
posted by rokusan at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016
As for capacity? Yes, I think should Russia (or China, or Germany, or whoever) wish to influence our election through technology, they'd be more than capable of doing more than hacking into a poorly-secured e-mail server being used in a pre-election nomination runup in order to... I'm not even sure what... make Clinton's employees look dishonest? That's the best they could do? What's the goal, there?
I also have trouble with motive. If the goal was to elect Trump, and all the polling says Sanders would defeat Trump more soundly than Hillary, why on earth harm Hillary? I also don't believe Putin is foolish enough to think a random-factor like Trump is a good thing to arm with a nuclear stockpile, no matter what NATO nonsense he sputters this week or next.
Also, just mentally reviewing every hack I've seen or read about in the last thirty years or so... stealing e-mails from a poorly-protected server and dumping them on WikiLeaks is something annoying hacker kids do, not state actors. It's so amateurish and pointless, compared to what they probably could do.
But maybe this is a dumb digression that is doing exactly what I feared it would do in our microcosm here: distract us from actual problems. It definitely doesn't have much to do with the convention, so apologies for my part in derailing.
posted by rokusan at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016
There's a lot more to the radical left than a bunch of people booing at the DNC.
I am so fucking angry at these assholes. Thanks for validating every idiot liberal stereotype of the left and giving piles of ammunition to the center-right, guys!
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
I am so fucking angry at these assholes. Thanks for validating every idiot liberal stereotype of the left and giving piles of ammunition to the center-right, guys!
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
Maine delegate giving the Bernie crowd an outlet for their chants, talking about superdelegate reform. Hopefully this will calm the jackwagons down.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tobascodagama at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
DUMBLEDORE REFERENCE
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
No boos for the Sanders delegate? Astonishing!
posted by palindromic at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by palindromic at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Without moving goalpoasts, the notion I find ludicrous is the suggestion that Trump and the Kremlin are actively working together, that Trump is a Russian asset or somehow controlled by Putin. It's all over Facebook and other such places, and I find it very hard to swallow and counterproductive.
Nobody seriously thinks Trump is directly working for/with Russia.
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Nobody seriously thinks Trump is directly working for/with Russia.
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
"Dumbledore from Harry Potter once said..."
posted by joedan at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by joedan at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Maybe this Diane Russel person can placate the dead-enders.
posted by snuffleupagus at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by snuffleupagus at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"family disagreement"
posted by Foci for Analysis at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"Dumbledore from Harry Potter once said"
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yayyy Dumbledore
posted by Tarumba at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Tarumba at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
@JenGriffinFNC - Breaking: Dem source: in last hour, Sanders camp urgently reached out to Clinton camp, worried their delegates plan to disrupt tonight.
You idiots.
posted by zarq at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
You idiots.
posted by zarq at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
DUMBLEDORE VOTES DEMOCRAT
I am LIVING
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
I am LIVING
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
Jesus Christ so many cops. Lost count somewhere north of 80.
posted by lazaruslong at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by lazaruslong at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I was once at a concert where people were super not into the opening act and Trent Reznor had to come out and tell the crowd to settle down and stop being assholes.
It is time for Bernie's Trent Reznor moment.
posted by Lyn Never at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
It is time for Bernie's Trent Reznor moment.
posted by Lyn Never at 2:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
Ugh, so late to the party, but I must improve on this:
posted by rouftop at 2:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
Ugh, I was going to vote Trump but I can't get behind a candidate who is anti-nap.Trump in Hot Water for Resisting a Rest
Giant Orange Toddler Refuses Nap
posted by rouftop at 2:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
No amendment to address the problems with the caucus system?
posted by ilicet at 2:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ilicet at 2:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
It is time for Bernie's Trent Reznor moment.
The BoBs regard him as a sellout traitor. He doesn't have any power over them anymore.
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
The BoBs regard him as a sellout traitor. He doesn't have any power over them anymore.
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I have seen about 25 people with voter registration setups. None of them have had any Hilary stuff on or mentioned her.
The voter reg people have been working it all summer -- I'm in center city fairly often, and I get stopped by them to check that I'm registered probably 50% of the time. Next time I wanna offer to get them an iced coffee or something.
posted by kalimac at 2:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The voter reg people have been working it all summer -- I'm in center city fairly often, and I get stopped by them to check that I'm registered probably 50% of the time. Next time I wanna offer to get them an iced coffee or something.
posted by kalimac at 2:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Come on, Bernie. You created this. Do the right thing and tamp it down.
I don't think he could anything more than what he's done already. His supporters don't care.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I don't think he could anything more than what he's done already. His supporters don't care.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Oh wow. Someone is driving a big truck with a huge TV on the side playing grainy black and whit footage of Hilary interviews with time stamps and "lie #1" and "lie #2" underneath. Just circling city hall. No one seems to really be reacting or caring though.
posted by lazaruslong at 2:10 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by lazaruslong at 2:10 PM on July 25, 2016
I am so fucking angry at these assholes. Thanks for validating every idiot liberal stereotype of the left and giving piles of ammunition to the center-right, guys!
Yeah, it looks like we're not going need to worry about the plans for moving the Left forward.
posted by bongo_x at 2:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Yeah, it looks like we're not going need to worry about the plans for moving the Left forward.
posted by bongo_x at 2:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Theory: is the whole "crazy far-left Bernouts at the convention" just Hillary's Sista Soulja moment? Does this firmly plant her as the sensible moderate candidate?
Fuuuuu no this is probably just as bad as it feels.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 2:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Fuuuuu no this is probably just as bad as it feels.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 2:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Apparently, Bernie has sent out a text message asking everyone not to do disrupt or protest on the floor.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Are people in the audience wearing green Robin Hood hats or Peter Pan ones?
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm really curious to see whether Trump agrees to debate Clinton. I imagine that he'd really prefer not to, but will he actually refuse to participate in an event that's seen as the most significant test of a Presidential campaign? And if he does participate, what the hell is that gonna look like? Political debates get messy even when the participants have a modicum of expertise and good faith – and with Trump involved, I can imagine no outcome other than a grotesque shitshow. Trump knows nothing about policy and governance, and he's at his worst when he's backed into a corner or being questioned. And I'm sure he sees Clinton as a prime target for his vile misogyny. It's gonna an ugly spectacle. I just hope that Clinton is able to take the high ground, stick to policy, and demonstrate the vast difference in experience and temperament between her and Trump.
(Of course, if the campaign so far is any guide, Trump's proponents won't care, and will probably eat it up.)
posted by escape from the potato planet at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
(Of course, if the campaign so far is any guide, Trump's proponents won't care, and will probably eat it up.)
posted by escape from the potato planet at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Putin almost certainly wants Trump to win.
Here is a bit from Kevin Drum on the relationship between Putin and Trump.
posted by persona au gratin at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Here is a bit from Kevin Drum on the relationship between Putin and Trump.
posted by persona au gratin at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
A friend of mine is working inside the convention -- he's said that it's worse than what they're showing, but I'm genuinely afraid to ask for details.
Ask! Is it one group of delegates? More?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Ask! Is it one group of delegates? More?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
If the BoB's don't want Bernie, what in the hell do they want?
posted by snuffleupagus at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by snuffleupagus at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Fair number of feel the bern merch booths. No one in line.
posted by lazaruslong at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by lazaruslong at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I totally understand why people are watching this and panicking a little, but I actually feel reassured, because there was more leadership on display in Marcia Fudge's speech, calming the crowd, than at any point during the entirety of the RNC.
I agree. This unity committee pitch is great. The RNC tried to pretend nothing happened. The DNC is putting an incredibly excited and happy Sanders delegate on stage and saying "let's do this." I doubt it will stop the boos entirely, but it's an actual display of leadership rather than last week's approach of pretending everything was fine.
posted by zachlipton at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I agree. This unity committee pitch is great. The RNC tried to pretend nothing happened. The DNC is putting an incredibly excited and happy Sanders delegate on stage and saying "let's do this." I doubt it will stop the boos entirely, but it's an actual display of leadership rather than last week's approach of pretending everything was fine.
posted by zachlipton at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I don't think he could anything more than what he's done already. His supporters don't care.
That's not an excuse not to try. He could easily speak to his supporters from the podium for a moment and ask them to be respectful, rather than make a plea by text message.
posted by zarq at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
That's not an excuse not to try. He could easily speak to his supporters from the podium for a moment and ask them to be respectful, rather than make a plea by text message.
posted by zarq at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I just hope Michelle opens with a joke and says "Thank you very much. Thank you. You have all been very kind to Donald and me, to our young son Barron, and to our whole family. It's a very nice welcome and we're excited to be with you at this historic convention."
posted by Nanukthedog at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [50 favorites]
posted by Nanukthedog at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [50 favorites]
His supporters don't care.
Oh come the fuck on. The overwhelming majority of his supporters will vote for Hillary, as confirmed by every single poll on the question.
posted by enn at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Oh come the fuck on. The overwhelming majority of his supporters will vote for Hillary, as confirmed by every single poll on the question.
posted by enn at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
This is great - I love that the DNC is giving a state representative this platform. State legislatures are so important, and she's a really engaging, enthusiastic speaker. I hope we see more of Diane Russell on a national stage.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by everybody had matching towels at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
If the BoB's don't want Bernie, what in the hell do they want?
Bust
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [41 favorites]
Bust
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [41 favorites]
Lol at the guy who had a sign that said simply "Yes!" I mean that is a multi purpose sign if I ever saw one.
posted by Tarumba at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [46 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [46 favorites]
Remember the halcyon days in which we gleefully looked forward to a brokered Republican convention
posted by beerperson at 2:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by beerperson at 2:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Cheering about superdelegates. Superdelegates didn't fuck you, idiots. Losing by over three million votes fucked you. Next time come with four million more votes.
posted by Talez at 2:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
posted by Talez at 2:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
wasn't really listening then the Bernie delegate started yelling "WE WON THIS." ok.
posted by acidic at 2:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by acidic at 2:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
This is "Bust," folks. You're watching it.
posted by argybarg at 2:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 2:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Oh come the fuck on. The overwhelming majority of his supporters will vote for Hillary, as confirmed by every single poll on the question.
I'm talking about what's happening on the floor right now.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'm talking about what's happening on the floor right now.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Who is this? She needs to go.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
You mean the same superdelegates you wanted to use to take the nomination from Hillary?
posted by persona au gratin at 2:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 2:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Oh good, let's get fired up about super delegates. Jesus.
posted by bongo_x at 2:13 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by bongo_x at 2:13 PM on July 25, 2016
Maybe this is what they want -- the final scene of El Cid.*
-----------------------------
* In case you don't know the story or haven't seen the movie, El Cid (Charlton Heston) is leading his army with a serious case of already being dead and nailed to his horse.
posted by Herodios at 2:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Oh come the fuck on. The overwhelming majority of his supporters will vote for Hillary, as confirmed by every single poll on the question.
On the FiveThirtyEight podcast this morning, they estimated that a third of Sanders supporters - 1.5 million voters - hadn't moved to Clinton yet.
posted by fitnr at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
On the FiveThirtyEight podcast this morning, they estimated that a third of Sanders supporters - 1.5 million voters - hadn't moved to Clinton yet.
posted by fitnr at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Oh come the fuck on. The overwhelming majority of his supporters will vote for Hillary, as confirmed by every single poll on the question.
In November. And in the meantime, their efforts to try to delegitimize her to the country are proceeding apace on national television.
posted by zarq at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
In November. And in the meantime, their efforts to try to delegitimize her to the country are proceeding apace on national television.
posted by zarq at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
This is great - I love that the DNC is giving a state representative this platform. State legislatures are so important, and she's a really engaging, enthusiastic speaker. I hope we see more of Diane Russell on a national stage.
Yes, I legitimately love this. And as much as the BoB line about being fucked by superdelegates is bullshit, I still don't like how the superdelegate system works. The reform seems like a genuinely good idea to me.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Yes, I legitimately love this. And as much as the BoB line about being fucked by superdelegates is bullshit, I still don't like how the superdelegate system works. The reform seems like a genuinely good idea to me.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Why would anyone try to work with folks like this?
You priced bristol board lately? I ain't made of signs here
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
You priced bristol board lately? I ain't made of signs here
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
This is so fucking stupid and embarrassing.
posted by Talez at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by Talez at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
If the BoB's don't want Bernie, what in the hell do they want?
To feel strong and full of agency and to impose their will on people. This is a tantrum, and it's being thrown for the same reason every tantrum is thrown- overwhelming entitled frustration.
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
To feel strong and full of agency and to impose their will on people. This is a tantrum, and it's being thrown for the same reason every tantrum is thrown- overwhelming entitled frustration.
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
wasn't really listening then the Bernie delegate started yelling "WE WON THIS." ok.
She was referring to the compromise that will reform the superdelegate system. That reform is what she means they won.
posted by dnash at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
She was referring to the compromise that will reform the superdelegate system. That reform is what she means they won.
posted by dnash at 2:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
mortifying
posted by murphy slaw at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by murphy slaw at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016
Superdelegates are the adults in the room. They make sure Trump doesn't try to run as a Democrat next time.
posted by Talez at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Talez at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The Clinton campaign pretty much had to pull DWS in. The last thing they need her for her to feel kicked to the curb, and decide that a cable news payday sounds like a good kiss-off.
posted by GameDesignerBen at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by GameDesignerBen at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I have to say, if the purpose of the convention is to coalesce support for Hillary, it's working with me. I'm ready to get to work! Thanks BoBs.
posted by persona au gratin at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
Yeah, I hate the BoB crowd, but I have no issues with this speaker.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Which this, Talez?
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016
Who is this? She needs to go.
Aw, I like her. Good energy, trying to get people hyped about rules committee changes, trying to make Sanders supporters happy with the changes that were made, even if they didn't get their candidate.
posted by palindromic at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Aw, I like her. Good energy, trying to get people hyped about rules committee changes, trying to make Sanders supporters happy with the changes that were made, even if they didn't get their candidate.
posted by palindromic at 2:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
The reform seems like a genuinely good idea to me.
A counter argument.
posted by zarq at 2:16 PM on July 25, 2016
A counter argument.
posted by zarq at 2:16 PM on July 25, 2016
On the FiveThirtyEight podcast this morning, they estimated that a third of Sanders supporters - 1.5 million voters - hadn't moved to Clinton yet.
66 million people voted for Obama in 2012. Clinton will get fewer votes than that — but 1.5 million who haven't moved to her yet is not an existential concern in the last week of July.
posted by penduluum at 2:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
66 million people voted for Obama in 2012. Clinton will get fewer votes than that — but 1.5 million who haven't moved to her yet is not an existential concern in the last week of July.
posted by penduluum at 2:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
She's being boo'd by the BoB's anyway.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 2:16 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by JakeEXTREME at 2:16 PM on July 25, 2016
democracy looks a bit embarrassed
posted by Foci for Analysis at 2:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 2:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
She's not doing a BoB thing, as much as the BoB folks in the back want her to be. She's working the crowd and giving them something to go home feeling good about.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 2:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Who is this? She needs to go.
Eh, this pitch is alright, but I don't think it's going to quiet the waters.
And what the hell was that just now?
posted by snuffleupagus at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016
Eh, this pitch is alright, but I don't think it's going to quiet the waters.
And what the hell was that just now?
posted by snuffleupagus at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016
Yeah city hall is quiet. Reckon everyone is down at the thing. Gonna stand in front of these never Hilary people for a few then get a beer.
posted by lazaruslong at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by lazaruslong at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016
In November. And in the meantime, their efforts to try to delegitimize her to the country are proceeding apace on national television.
A tiny fraction, yes, just like the PUMAs in 2008. Remember them? Maybe not, because they turned out to be a few nutjobs blown up by the media into something more important than they were.
Hillary is doing a great job of losing this election all by herself; it's giving the boo-ers far more credit than they deserve to pretend they're the ones who are going to cost her the win.
posted by enn at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
A tiny fraction, yes, just like the PUMAs in 2008. Remember them? Maybe not, because they turned out to be a few nutjobs blown up by the media into something more important than they were.
Hillary is doing a great job of losing this election all by herself; it's giving the boo-ers far more credit than they deserve to pretend they're the ones who are going to cost her the win.
posted by enn at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
She's playing exactly the way they need to be played. Now the unity report will steamroll right on through. Great job, Rep. Russell.
posted by dw at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by dw at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"I STAND WITH MY DEMOCAROTIC FAMILY"
posted by acidic at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by acidic at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I mean, "Paul LePage is my governor, I do not need to see anyone like him become the President of the United States." That's a good line.
posted by palindromic at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Yeah, I appreciate what they're trying here, but she's a woman so they don't care what she says and they won't do what this speech was supposed to get them to do.
posted by Lyn Never at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Aw, I like her. Good energy, trying to get people hyped about rules committee changes, trying to make Sanders supporters happy with the changes that were made.
Yes. But she could've wrapped up a couple minutes ago.
But she's trying to bring both sides together, and that's good. It sounds like it might be working, a little.
posted by dnash at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Yes. But she could've wrapped up a couple minutes ago.
But she's trying to bring both sides together, and that's good. It sounds like it might be working, a little.
posted by dnash at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
And she drops a "Clinton administration" reference and they cheer. Cancel Bernie tonight; throw her up there.
posted by dw at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by dw at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
66 million people voted for Obama in 2012. Clinton will get fewer votes than that — but 1.5 million who haven't moved to her yet is not an existential concern in the last week of July.
That all depends on where they live. We can't assume they won't simply stay home, or vote for another candidate.
I agree that we shouldn't freak out. But right now we don't know what those voters will do, or how many of them there really are.
posted by zarq at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016
That all depends on where they live. We can't assume they won't simply stay home, or vote for another candidate.
I agree that we shouldn't freak out. But right now we don't know what those voters will do, or how many of them there really are.
posted by zarq at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016
cool great job boo-ers, you're really just giving fodder to everyone who wants to punch left for the rest of election season and eternity. love it
posted by burgerrr at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by burgerrr at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Her whole speech comes down to making changes at the local level. It's what a lot of folks who feel disillusioned after their candidate lost need to hear, I think.
I thought she wasn't going to mention Hillary Clinton at all, but "We will all have a voice in the Clinton administration!" is very powerful.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
I thought she wasn't going to mention Hillary Clinton at all, but "We will all have a voice in the Clinton administration!" is very powerful.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
Aw, I like her. Good energy, trying to get people hyped about rules committee changes, trying to make Sanders supporters happy with the changes that were made.
And she just said she's doing to do everything she can do to elect Hillary. She's not part of the problem here.
posted by tonycpsu at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
And she just said she's doing to do everything she can do to elect Hillary. She's not part of the problem here.
posted by tonycpsu at 2:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Bernie, bernie Bernie...chanted OVER SOMEONE TRYING TO CLOSE A PRAYER TO GOD!?~?
Obviously confirming the claim that he's a closet atheist, right?
As I suggested before, put some Trump signs in the hands of BernieBusters. (They're the same color as the Bernie signs). They'll neither notice nor care.
And call me cynical, but there are people on the floor who are DEFINITELY on Trump's payroll. Or Putin's. Check for Trump properties in California and you'll find the Cal Bernie Delegation.
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Obviously confirming the claim that he's a closet atheist, right?
As I suggested before, put some Trump signs in the hands of BernieBusters. (They're the same color as the Bernie signs). They'll neither notice nor care.
And call me cynical, but there are people on the floor who are DEFINITELY on Trump's payroll. Or Putin's. Check for Trump properties in California and you'll find the Cal Bernie Delegation.
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Aw, I like her. Good energy, trying to get people hyped about rules committee changes, trying to make Sanders supporters happy with the changes that were made.
There's a definite message of "Hillary supporters on the rules committee didn't want to have a truly democratic system, but we prevailed against all odds." She switched it up a bit after but I find that message divisive and also a bit absurd. It's not about legitimate disagreements, it's about one side that can be bought and one side that can't be.
posted by vathek at 2:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
There's a definite message of "Hillary supporters on the rules committee didn't want to have a truly democratic system, but we prevailed against all odds." She switched it up a bit after but I find that message divisive and also a bit absurd. It's not about legitimate disagreements, it's about one side that can be bought and one side that can't be.
posted by vathek at 2:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Were PUMAs shouting at the DNC in 08? I can't remember.
posted by persona au gratin at 2:19 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 2:19 PM on July 25, 2016
This woman did well enough to maybe, in four years time, become a superdele-- oh wait.
posted by acidic at 2:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by acidic at 2:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Who is this? She needs to go.
She's my local house of representatives rep, here in Portland, Maine. Somewhat surprised to see her when I turned on the Twitch feed. She just lost a primary fight for to run as the Dem for State Senate, by quite a lot (Portland elections are often Dem, Progressive, and Green). She's termed out of her house seat. I didn't realize she had such a high standing with the DNC.
posted by anastasiav at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
She's my local house of representatives rep, here in Portland, Maine. Somewhat surprised to see her when I turned on the Twitch feed. She just lost a primary fight for to run as the Dem for State Senate, by quite a lot (Portland elections are often Dem, Progressive, and Green). She's termed out of her house seat. I didn't realize she had such a high standing with the DNC.
posted by anastasiav at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Hillary is doing a great job of losing this election all by herself; it's giving the boo-ers far more credit than they deserve to pretend they're the ones who are going to cost her the win.
How is Clinton losing by herself, exactly?
posted by OmieWise at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
How is Clinton losing by herself, exactly?
posted by OmieWise at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Her whole speech comes down to making changes at the local level. It's what a lot of folks who feel disillusioned after their candidate lost need to hear, I think.
I agree, the focus on process was perfect. I don't think it's really going to placate the hardcore BoBs, but it's a nice dose of sanity from the Sanders side of the floor.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I agree, the focus on process was perfect. I don't think it's really going to placate the hardcore BoBs, but it's a nice dose of sanity from the Sanders side of the floor.
posted by tobascodagama at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Can Marcia Fudge adopt me and run my life for me? I promise I won't be too much trouble for her.
posted by Salieri at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
66 million people voted for Obama in 2012. Clinton will get fewer votes than that — but 1.5 million who haven't moved to her yet is not an existential concern in the last week of July.
Yeah, and 61 million voted for the other guy. A third of the 2012 margin is an non-negligable number. The convention is the traditional time that the party unifies, so this is exactly the time to be interested who that's going.
posted by fitnr at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Yeah, and 61 million voted for the other guy. A third of the 2012 margin is an non-negligable number. The convention is the traditional time that the party unifies, so this is exactly the time to be interested who that's going.
posted by fitnr at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Bundling the Unity Report with the rest of the Rules is a damn screwed tactical move.
posted by zachlipton at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zachlipton at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2016
Ironically, Russell was recently ousted after an really heated (and wanky) primary. And got fined by Maine's electoral commission for her temerity.
Maine is really a model for the nation in the way that its Democratic party is a thousand squirrels biting each other on a shoddy raft in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.
posted by selfnoise at 2:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Maine is really a model for the nation in the way that its Democratic party is a thousand squirrels biting each other on a shoddy raft in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.
posted by selfnoise at 2:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
How is Clinton losing by herself, exactly?
Not being Sanders, apparently.
posted by vathek at 2:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Not being Sanders, apparently.
posted by vathek at 2:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
It feels so weird to see an old white guy now. I like that feeling.
posted by stolyarova at 2:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 2:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
Seeing so many women speaking at the DNC is giving me feels I didn't know I wanted so badly
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
To clarify, I like that it's weird.
posted by stolyarova at 2:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 2:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Maybe I'm naive, but I can't see any of this mattering in the slightest 3.5 months from now. No amount of people commenting their despair/anger/fear for the millionth time is going to change things. Relax, folks. Deep breaths.
posted by downtohisturtles at 2:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by downtohisturtles at 2:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
There's a definite message of "Hillary supporters on the rules committee didn't want to have a truly democratic system, but we prevailed against all odds." She switched it up a bit after but I find that message divisive and also a bit absurd. It's not about legitimate disagreements, it's about one side that can be bought and one side that can't be.
I hear what you're saying, but I feel like one should flatter their audience a little if one is seeking to persuade. One can't just go up there and be like 'You Bernie dead-enders are a pack of mouth-breathing assholes who want Trump to be POTUS!' I think she struck the right tone of 'We already accomplished so much by sticking to our values' and 'Now there is work to be done.'
posted by palindromic at 2:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I hear what you're saying, but I feel like one should flatter their audience a little if one is seeking to persuade. One can't just go up there and be like 'You Bernie dead-enders are a pack of mouth-breathing assholes who want Trump to be POTUS!' I think she struck the right tone of 'We already accomplished so much by sticking to our values' and 'Now there is work to be done.'
posted by palindromic at 2:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Don't be daft.
Considering the ongoing tepid response to Trump from GOP party elders, had superdelegates existed on the Republican side it is likely they would have prevented him from winning the nomination. Also, if the Republicans had had a primary delegate system similar to the Democrats, Trump would have been easily stopped during the primaries.
No nomination, no chance at the Presidency. This could have been a very different election if the Republicans had played by the Democrats' rules.
posted by zarq at 2:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Considering the ongoing tepid response to Trump from GOP party elders, had superdelegates existed on the Republican side it is likely they would have prevented him from winning the nomination. Also, if the Republicans had had a primary delegate system similar to the Democrats, Trump would have been easily stopped during the primaries.
No nomination, no chance at the Presidency. This could have been a very different election if the Republicans had played by the Democrats' rules.
posted by zarq at 2:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I kinda wish someone would just say "Hillary won the nomination for Democratic candidate for president by 3 million votes!" then wait 30 seconds for the booing, then say it again. Do this for about 10 minutes until all the Bernie folk are just plum tuckered out.
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
Turns out Mallory Ortberg is the only DNC coverage I need.
posted by ChuraChura at 2:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
posted by ChuraChura at 2:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
cool great job boo-ers, you're really just giving fodder to everyone who wants to punch left for the rest of election season and eternity. love it
i should note that i voted bernie in the primaries and live in a blue enough area to have the luxury to vote third party, should i so choose, and i am not at all sold on HRC due to serious policy disagreements. i just freaking want the left-punching to stop and booing every single person at the DNC isn't going to help that cause at all ughhhh
posted by burgerrr at 2:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
i should note that i voted bernie in the primaries and live in a blue enough area to have the luxury to vote third party, should i so choose, and i am not at all sold on HRC due to serious policy disagreements. i just freaking want the left-punching to stop and booing every single person at the DNC isn't going to help that cause at all ughhhh
posted by burgerrr at 2:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I think the message was a good one, but when the crowd was chanting back at her "this is not what democracy looks like" that it is clear that some people just don't want to be persuaded.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 2:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by JakeEXTREME at 2:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Webb's done the best job so far at trying to pull the Clinton-Sanders rift a little closer together. Nice to see, since pretty much nobody has done that very well.
It occurs to me, months late, that in Sanders and Clinton, we had two candidates not very good at bringing disagreeing people together. They have their camps, each in their own way, and you're either with them or against them. And it hasn't really changed all year.
So if this is a fracture that won't heal (and I don't think it is, not yet), then I think they both played a part. Each camp blaming the other, completely, is part of the problem.
posted by rokusan at 2:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
It occurs to me, months late, that in Sanders and Clinton, we had two candidates not very good at bringing disagreeing people together. They have their camps, each in their own way, and you're either with them or against them. And it hasn't really changed all year.
So if this is a fracture that won't heal (and I don't think it is, not yet), then I think they both played a part. Each camp blaming the other, completely, is part of the problem.
posted by rokusan at 2:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I'm just hoping these people get it out of their systems in a day or two. Because hearing the uproar whenever Hillary is mentioned and then complete crickets when the speaker is talking about Republican obstructionism is depressing.
posted by Salieri at 2:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 2:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Turns out Mallory Ortberg is the only DNC coverage I need.
She's not live-blogging though - now I too feel the urge to boo!
posted by palindromic at 2:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
She's not live-blogging though - now I too feel the urge to boo!
posted by palindromic at 2:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
@daveweigel - Only a handful of boos for the compromise "unity commission" on superdelegates. Very well managed by campaigns.
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I really hope Hillary wins in the fall, but every boo today warms my heart.
posted by ethansr at 2:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by ethansr at 2:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
the crowd was chanting back at her "this is not what democracy looks like"
For a group criticized for disorganization, a chant that complex shows some impressive orchestration.
(It's hard enough getting 30 people to say "Heck, No!" on the same beat.)
posted by rokusan at 2:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
For a group criticized for disorganization, a chant that complex shows some impressive orchestration.
(It's hard enough getting 30 people to say "Heck, No!" on the same beat.)
posted by rokusan at 2:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
We're all in this together
And we know if we stand
Hand in hand
We can make it
We're all in this together!
-- Democratic National Convention Musical
it was too easy, sorry
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
And we know if we stand
Hand in hand
We can make it
We're all in this together!
-- Democratic National Convention Musical
it was too easy, sorry
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Well you should just be nice and roasty toasty for four straight days then.
posted by argybarg at 2:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by argybarg at 2:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Hey we get a shout out to O'Malley. That's nice. (No shout outs for Jim Webb, and I wouldn't hold your breath.)
posted by zachlipton at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
HERE WE GO. ELIJAH CUMMINGS GONNA BITCHSLAP YOU.
posted by Talez at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Talez at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The lever I see Trump and the Right pushing now is that "Hillary Didn't Actually Win The Primary" as the new Birther conspiracy, to devalue her as a valid candidate / her administration if she wins.
posted by mrzarquon at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
O'Malley shoutout (from fellow Marylander Steny Hoyer)! I almost forgot about him! Is he there? Does he get to speak?
posted by everybody had matching towels at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by everybody had matching towels at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I really hope Hillary wins in the fall, but every boo today warms my heart.
If you truly hope that, than it really shouldn't.
posted by peacheater at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [55 favorites]
If you truly hope that, than it really shouldn't.
posted by peacheater at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [55 favorites]
Maybe I'm naive, but I can't see any of this mattering in the slightest 3.5 months from now.
For the election, not much. For the Left having power in the Democratic party? Self defeating.
posted by bongo_x at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
For the election, not much. For the Left having power in the Democratic party? Self defeating.
posted by bongo_x at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I don't really do drunk Amazon shopping or whatever but damned if I am going to make it through today without accidentally ordering some HRC shot glasses
posted by sunset in snow country at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by sunset in snow country at 2:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Jim Webb is literally the worst person in the world, and I would boo a shout-out to him.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I really hope Hillary wins in the fall, but every boo today warms my heart.
Every one of those boos is every non-lefty in the room gaining just a little bit more justification for continuing and worsening the marginalization of the left in American politics. What are you so heartened by?
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
Every one of those boos is every non-lefty in the room gaining just a little bit more justification for continuing and worsening the marginalization of the left in American politics. What are you so heartened by?
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
Really, ethansr? You like women and minorities having to shout to be heard? You like progressive goals being booed? That's what fucking warms your heart?
posted by tavella at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [78 favorites]
posted by tavella at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [78 favorites]
Nobody seriously thinks Trump is directly working for/with Russia. -- Pope Guilty
Forgiveness, Pontiff. You're right. Nobody here said that. This whole season has made me forget, at times, that MetaFilter is not the Internet at large. I'll try to remember that and leave the outside baggage outside the blue door.
posted by rokusan at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Forgiveness, Pontiff. You're right. Nobody here said that. This whole season has made me forget, at times, that MetaFilter is not the Internet at large. I'll try to remember that and leave the outside baggage outside the blue door.
posted by rokusan at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I really hope Hillary wins in the fall, but every boo today warms my heart.
Wait, what?
posted by Mooski at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Wait, what?
posted by Mooski at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I really hope Hillary wins in the fall, but every boo today warms my heart.
People right now are talking about values important to me and many others and some complete jerks are fucking booing what even
posted by zutalors! at 2:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [47 favorites]
Does anyone know where Bernie is right now? Like, physically? Could he walk the floor and talk to the boo-ers himself? Would that be possible?
posted by mhum at 2:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by mhum at 2:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Prediction: There is some sort of street-theater thing being planned, possibly involving giant puppets (they love their puppets). My guess is they have smuggled some way of depicting Hillary, a pile of dirty cash, and/or leg irons. Probably during the delegate count.
posted by argybarg at 2:31 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by argybarg at 2:31 PM on July 25, 2016
Black lives matter!
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
LOUD cheer for Black Lives Matter.
That is awesome.
posted by Salieri at 2:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
That is awesome.
posted by Salieri at 2:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
I don't know that it would be helpful. It might even seem desperate.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:31 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:31 PM on July 25, 2016
Black lives matter!
posted by chapps at 2:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by chapps at 2:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Prediction: There is some sort of street-theater thing being planned, possibly involving giant puppets (they love their puppets). My guess is they have smuggled some way of depicting Hillary, a pile of dirty cash, and/or leg irons. Probably during the delegate count.
Don't forget the six pointed Star of David sun!
posted by Talez at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Don't forget the six pointed Star of David sun!
posted by Talez at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Cheers for BLM on the floor, and I heard no boos at that one.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
My guess is they have smuggled some way of depicting Hillary, a pile of dirty cash, and/or leg irons. Probably during the delegate count.
With a sheriff's star?
posted by bongo_x at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
With a sheriff's star?
posted by bongo_x at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Cummings: "Our party knows that diversity is not our problem, but our promise!"
posted by palindromic at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
What are they chanting now?
posted by stolyarova at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by stolyarova at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016
I really hope Hillary wins in the fall, but every boo today warms my heart.
As an actual socialist who loves Sanders, I can tell you I despise the behavior of the booers. They are letting pride Trump equality and civil rights. They are making it impossible for anyone to take us seriously in a long time.
posted by Tarumba at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [40 favorites]
As an actual socialist who loves Sanders, I can tell you I despise the behavior of the booers. They are letting pride Trump equality and civil rights. They are making it impossible for anyone to take us seriously in a long time.
posted by Tarumba at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [40 favorites]
Loud chant for "No TPP" edging on overpowering Rep Cummings right now...
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:32 PM on July 25, 2016
Notice they won't even let the people they agree with speak. It's all about them.
posted by argybarg at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
"I was shouting Boo-urnie [Sanders]."
posted by infinitywaltz at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by infinitywaltz at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
"No TPP"
posted by malphigian at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by malphigian at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016
These guys are mic checking Elijah Cummings discussing civil rights and Black Lives Matter to shout "no TPP." Have they no sense of decency?
posted by zachlipton at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [56 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [56 favorites]
ugh mic check
posted by OverlappingElvis at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by OverlappingElvis at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016
"No TPP"
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016
Chanters: DOWN WITH TPP
posted by palindromic at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by palindromic at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016
What are they chanting?
posted by mochapickle at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by mochapickle at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016
Jesus fucking christ, these people are garbage.
posted by Lyn Never at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Oh my God, my face is going to spontaneously burst into flame if they keep talking over him SHUT UP jesus
posted by kalimac at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by kalimac at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Who the hell is doing a Mic check / Stop TPP over *this* speech.
posted by mrzarquon at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
These fucking idiots, Jesus Christ
posted by penduluum at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Good heavens. Cummings is fantastic and they need to pipe down.
posted by mochapickle at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mochapickle at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Let's interrupt the defense of black lives matter to bring up the TPP!
posted by Tarumba at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 2:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Who is being booed?
So far....
A woman pastor
Older white dude
Women of color
A gay man.
Men of color.
The Bernie or Busters should be ashamed of themselves. Except for the non-gay (I assume?) white guy, they've managed to try to shout down a bunch of minority voices.
posted by zarq at 2:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [44 favorites]
So far....
A woman pastor
Older white dude
Women of color
A gay man.
Men of color.
The Bernie or Busters should be ashamed of themselves. Except for the non-gay (I assume?) white guy, they've managed to try to shout down a bunch of minority voices.
posted by zarq at 2:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [44 favorites]
How many of these chanters cared about TPP a week ago?
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
FFS people, let the man speak.
posted by teleri025 at 2:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by teleri025 at 2:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
With all the stuff that Michael Moore's been saying about how Trump stands a better chance than ever to win? -- Hermione Granger
Jesus, that article. I want to shrug it off, too, but Moore was one of the few people who called the Trump candidacy so early on, and back then I thought there was no way in hell the Republicans would ever let that happen, so....
I need to rethink my life. And buy more whisky.
posted by rokusan at 2:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Jesus, that article. I want to shrug it off, too, but Moore was one of the few people who called the Trump candidacy so early on, and back then I thought there was no way in hell the Republicans would ever let that happen, so....
I need to rethink my life. And buy more whisky.
posted by rokusan at 2:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
A couple days ago I saw a pic (which unfortunately I can't find again) of someone wearing a button version of Tony Puryear's poster for Hillary 2008, but I can't find one for sale anywhere. Has anyone seen it?
posted by rifflesby at 2:34 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by rifflesby at 2:34 PM on July 25, 2016
Thanks for the practical demonstration of erasure, fucking Berners.
posted by stolyarova at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Wait, what does TPP stand for? I thought it meant "Trump/Pence"
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh my GOD I can't even enjoy one of the most engaging speakers so far talking about his father.
SHUT UP ASSHOLES
posted by Salieri at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
SHUT UP ASSHOLES
posted by Salieri at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
The chant almost kind of sounds like "Long Live the Queen" if you sort of squint your ears a little
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Not only are they assholes, they won't take yes for an answer.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
STFU about the TPP, oh my god
posted by palindromic at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
zachlipton: These guys are mic checking Elijah Cummings discussing civil rights and Black Lives Matter to shout "no TPP." Have they no sense of decency?
But someone's heart is being warmed! That's the important thing!
posted by tavella at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
But someone's heart is being warmed! That's the important thing!
posted by tavella at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Again, this is the "Bust" in "Bernie or Bust." No one will be heard.
posted by argybarg at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by argybarg at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
This is a damn fine speech. I wish I could have heard it better.
posted by stolyarova at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Wait, what does TPP stand for? I thought it meant "Trump/Pence"
Trans-Pacific Partnership.
posted by Talez at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Trans-Pacific Partnership.
posted by Talez at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
This speech deserves a better crowd.
posted by mochapickle at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by mochapickle at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Bernie or Busters blithely chanting "Stop TPP" over the black congressman demanding progress on civil rights is a microcosm of the worst aspects of the Sanders campaign.
posted by Rhaomi at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [138 favorites]
posted by Rhaomi at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [138 favorites]
Jesus, they are trying to shout him down talking about his sharecropper father.
posted by acidic at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
posted by acidic at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
Wait how did we get onto TPP?
(Yes, it sucks. And yes, every candidate in this election will pass and support it anyway, no matter what they say now. It cannot be changed. Okay, everyone got that? Great, let's move on.)
posted by rokusan at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
(Yes, it sucks. And yes, every candidate in this election will pass and support it anyway, no matter what they say now. It cannot be changed. Okay, everyone got that? Great, let's move on.)
posted by rokusan at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Never mind, don't answer my question. I am mortified that I didn't know what that meant
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2016
At first I thought they were saying "LGBT" but damn, I'm so sorry to be wrong.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by JakeEXTREME at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
At this rate they will burn themselves out before Bernie hits the stage.
posted by dw at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by dw at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2016
The thread is moving so fast it's hard to keep up and I know this is 90 minutes old at this point which is an eternity in these threads but
There's been buzz that the Clinton camp is also uninterested in debates, el io.
The thinking being that she has a comfortable lead now and won't win over any new converts anyway (and doesn't need them) while the wild randomness Trump can introduce could tip over the cart in so many unpredictable ways. It's better to stay in control, etc.
oh god please no
This is exactly what happened during the primaries, when Clinton was confident in her lead over Sanders and thought more debates would only lead to negatives, until Sanders started gaining a lot of ground and all of a sudden the Clinton campaign was scrambling to get the DNC to schedule more debates! This was mere months ago, please tell me the lesson hasn't already been forgotten
Not only that, but honestly I think it's just bad strategy anyway. Clinton is smart and actually knows things and has plans and can answer questions with more than just "oh I'm gonna get rid of it" or "I'm gonna have the best people look into it" and can call out wrong information and stupid ideas on the fly and Trump has literally none of that. And maybe it didn't matter that Trump had none of that when his fiercest debate opponents were a low energy failson, a debate squad blobfish that nobody has ever liked, a man simultaneously suffering from and whose voice induces narcolepsy, etc., etc., but put him up against Clinton and he's going to look like the know nothing dipshit blowhard he is. Which yes, admittedly, isn't going to sway EVERYONE, but I think it would be powerful for some of the wishy washy types who have swung Republican in the past week.
Not to mention that of course Trump isn't going to want to agree to the debates, so as long as he doesn't the entire Democratic and further left establishments can relentlessly mock his cowardice and point out how afraid he is of a woman, since his dumbass hubris and his umbrage at any kind of confrontation with an assertive woman are incredibly well known weak points at this stage in the game
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 2:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
There's been buzz that the Clinton camp is also uninterested in debates, el io.
The thinking being that she has a comfortable lead now and won't win over any new converts anyway (and doesn't need them) while the wild randomness Trump can introduce could tip over the cart in so many unpredictable ways. It's better to stay in control, etc.
oh god please no
This is exactly what happened during the primaries, when Clinton was confident in her lead over Sanders and thought more debates would only lead to negatives, until Sanders started gaining a lot of ground and all of a sudden the Clinton campaign was scrambling to get the DNC to schedule more debates! This was mere months ago, please tell me the lesson hasn't already been forgotten
Not only that, but honestly I think it's just bad strategy anyway. Clinton is smart and actually knows things and has plans and can answer questions with more than just "oh I'm gonna get rid of it" or "I'm gonna have the best people look into it" and can call out wrong information and stupid ideas on the fly and Trump has literally none of that. And maybe it didn't matter that Trump had none of that when his fiercest debate opponents were a low energy failson, a debate squad blobfish that nobody has ever liked, a man simultaneously suffering from and whose voice induces narcolepsy, etc., etc., but put him up against Clinton and he's going to look like the know nothing dipshit blowhard he is. Which yes, admittedly, isn't going to sway EVERYONE, but I think it would be powerful for some of the wishy washy types who have swung Republican in the past week.
Not to mention that of course Trump isn't going to want to agree to the debates, so as long as he doesn't the entire Democratic and further left establishments can relentlessly mock his cowardice and point out how afraid he is of a woman, since his dumbass hubris and his umbrage at any kind of confrontation with an assertive woman are incredibly well known weak points at this stage in the game
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 2:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Well, the future of the Democratic Party has made its voice heard. The Democratic Party is fucked.
posted by Optamystic at 2:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Optamystic at 2:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
thank you Talez <3
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:37 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Hermione Granger at 2:37 PM on July 25, 2016
I am all for protesting but this is beyond the pale.
posted by futz at 2:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by futz at 2:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Hillary is not a values candidate, rallying around Hillary is not about values, and Hillary certainly has no monopoly on minority support. A vote for Hillary is about saving our country from catastrophe, nothing more. Look at her VP pick then talk to me about values. The boos are for the rotten choice America has been given, not for the speakers, not for your values.
posted by ethansr at 2:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by ethansr at 2:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Wow, there is a really gross element in this audience.
posted by biogeo at 2:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 2:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Jesus, they are trying to shout him down talking about his sharecropper father.
That's impressively tone deaf. I hope someone finds some of these people and plays back their footage for them.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 2:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
That's impressively tone deaf. I hope someone finds some of these people and plays back their footage for them.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 2:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Wait how did we get onto TPP?
(Yes, it sucks. And yes, every candidate in this election will pass and support it anyway, no matter what they say now. It cannot be changed. Okay, everyone got that? Great, let's move on.)
Most shots from the stage since the beginning have shown a smattering (at least 10-20) of anti-TPP signs in the audience, more when the BoB folks are riled up.
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:38 PM on July 25, 2016
(Yes, it sucks. And yes, every candidate in this election will pass and support it anyway, no matter what they say now. It cannot be changed. Okay, everyone got that? Great, let's move on.)
Most shots from the stage since the beginning have shown a smattering (at least 10-20) of anti-TPP signs in the audience, more when the BoB folks are riled up.
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:38 PM on July 25, 2016
Are you fucking kidding me. Elijah Cummings is talking about Black Lives Matter and racial justice and they're chanting NO TPP?! I'm so fucking furious. You want to know why so many people of color are furious with Bernie, you want to know why he didn't have support from the majority of the POC community? Because his supporters pull shit like this. They are literally shouting down a black man talking about racial justice for their pet issue.
posted by yasaman at 2:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [114 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 2:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [114 favorites]
I hope the people who heard a black congressman speak about black rights and chose to drown him out with "NO TPP" are fucking proud of themselves.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Wait how did we get onto TPP?
Elijah Cummings is the chairman of the Democratic Party Platform Committee which refused to include a no-TPP provision as a nod to Obama's work so far on the treaty.
posted by Talez at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Elijah Cummings is the chairman of the Democratic Party Platform Committee which refused to include a no-TPP provision as a nod to Obama's work so far on the treaty.
posted by Talez at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Hillary is not a values candidate, rallying around Hillary is not about values
She shares a ton of my values, and screw you for erasing my, and her millions of other supporters', existence.
posted by showbiz_liz at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [138 favorites]
She shares a ton of my values, and screw you for erasing my, and her millions of other supporters', existence.
posted by showbiz_liz at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [138 favorites]
I think Tim Kaine has hella values and I think he'd make a great VP and I'm excited to vote for the Clinton/Kaine ticket.
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [53 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [53 favorites]
Look at her VP pick then talk to me about values.
Yeah, that fucking asshole civil rights lawyer who's deeply religious but refuses to push his religion on others I mean hang on what were we talking about again?
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [113 favorites]
Yeah, that fucking asshole civil rights lawyer who's deeply religious but refuses to push his religion on others I mean hang on what were we talking about again?
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [113 favorites]
There's been buzz that the Clinton camp is also uninterested in debates, el io.
The Democrats have committed to three debates. She's not going to pass them up. This is a ridiculous rumor.
posted by dw at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
The Democrats have committed to three debates. She's not going to pass them up. This is a ridiculous rumor.
posted by dw at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Wow, I am completely stunned at how much they are fucking this up. Their own cause I mean.
posted by bongo_x at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by bongo_x at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Hillary is not a values candidate, rallying around Hillary is not about values, and Hillary certainly has no monopoly on minority support. A vote for Hillary is about saving our country from catastrophe, nothing more. Look at her VP pick then talk to me about values. The boos are for the rotten choice America has been given, not for the speakers, not for your values.
I have different opinions than you. And yes, I have values, and they don't involve loving minorities being booed.
posted by zutalors! at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [62 favorites]
I have different opinions than you. And yes, I have values, and they don't involve loving minorities being booed.
posted by zutalors! at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [62 favorites]
Hillary is not a values candidate, rallying around Hillary is not about values
Speak for yourself. She speaks for many, many of my values.
posted by Salieri at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [57 favorites]
Speak for yourself. She speaks for many, many of my values.
posted by Salieri at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [57 favorites]
doo doo doo... It's the funky platform committee!
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Who is being booed?In fairness to the boo'ers, the speakers thusfar have been largely PoC and women... White straight men are a minority (and have there even been any young white straight men on stage yet?). The boo'ing pisses me off, but I don't think it's racist or misogynist; the Democratic Party is just filled with diversity (woot!).
So far....
A woman pastor
Older white dude
Women of color
A gay man.
Men of color.
The Bernie or Busters should be ashamed of themselves. Except for the non-gay (I assume?) white guy, they've managed to try to shout down a bunch of minority voices.
posted by el io at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The boos are for the rotten choice America has been given, not for the speakers, not for your values.
You know what, I'm pretty damn happy with Clinton, on the whole. She's not perfect but she pretty much does align with my values. These are boos for my values.
posted by biogeo at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [58 favorites]
You know what, I'm pretty damn happy with Clinton, on the whole. She's not perfect but she pretty much does align with my values. These are boos for my values.
posted by biogeo at 2:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [58 favorites]
Hillary is not a values candidate, rallying around Hillary is not about values, and Hillary certainly has no monopoly on minority support. A vote for Hillary is about saving our country from catastrophe, nothing more. Look at her VP pick then talk to me about values. The boos are for the rotten choice America has been given, not for the speakers, not for your values.
Whatever helps you sleep at night. Because from where I'm sitting, erasing the voices of minorities and women because you didn't succeed at convincing people of your position is anathema to progressive values.
posted by NoxAeternum at 2:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [70 favorites]
Whatever helps you sleep at night. Because from where I'm sitting, erasing the voices of minorities and women because you didn't succeed at convincing people of your position is anathema to progressive values.
posted by NoxAeternum at 2:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [70 favorites]
Oh, I agree, Cobra. She should debate, as often as possible, since she's the adult in the room. But you can almost hear the number-crunching advisors warning her it's unnecessarily risky, in that more-to-lose-than-gain way, the same way they kept her largely silent and away from the press and debates through the second half of the primaries so she could "coast" to victory without surprises. It got narrow, but it worked, so those people probably have more cred now.
It's funny to think both camps might be afraid of debates, anyway. If that's how it plays out, we'll see some interesting games of reverse chicken.
posted by rokusan at 2:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's funny to think both camps might be afraid of debates, anyway. If that's how it plays out, we'll see some interesting games of reverse chicken.
posted by rokusan at 2:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Speak for yourself. She speaks for many, many of my values.
Same here. I'm With Her, dammit.
posted by Existential Dread at 2:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
Same here. I'm With Her, dammit.
posted by Existential Dread at 2:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
Bernie or Bust 2016: By all means, let the perfect be the enemy of the good
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 2:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 2:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Among my values is the belief that members of marginalized and oppressed communities should be able to speak without being shouted down by people who believe that trade deals are more important than their ideas and experiences. That is one of my values.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [65 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [65 favorites]
The thing I'm most looking forward to in the next few months is Clinton wiping the floor with debating Trump.
posted by lovecrafty at 2:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by lovecrafty at 2:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
so i thought maybe this would be the convention i could watch without flinching so hard that i got muscle spasms but apparently not
the good news is that the schedule for this week just opened way up
posted by murphy slaw at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
the good news is that the schedule for this week just opened way up
posted by murphy slaw at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It may or may not be racist and misogynist, fine fine. At the very least it shows a severe lack of awareness about how their aggressive silencing of women and people of color would look. I can't see their intentions, but I can see the real world effects of their actions.
posted by palindromic at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
YES BARBARA JORDAN NAMECHECK YESSSSSSSS
(ps my friend on the floor said that the boo-ing is everyone, going back and forth between Hillary and Bernie supporters.)
posted by kalimac at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
(ps my friend on the floor said that the boo-ing is everyone, going back and forth between Hillary and Bernie supporters.)
posted by kalimac at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
My values are on display on this stage and the ones representing them are sure as hell not the ones chanting over Elijah Cummings.
posted by Stacey at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
posted by Stacey at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
I need to hit a MetaStop and collect some more favorites to give out cause I know I'm gonna be out way before this thread winds down for the night
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Speaker: "We've heard your voices! Please welcome our next guest!"
Boo from Monsters Inc. enters the stage.
Crowd: "Booo! Boo! Boo.... wait no. what."
posted by Kabanos at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
Boo from Monsters Inc. enters the stage.
Crowd: "Booo! Boo! Boo.... wait no. what."
posted by Kabanos at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
alternately,
Bernie or Bust 2016: Bern it all down
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Bernie or Bust 2016: Bern it all down
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 2:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The boos are for the rotten choice America has been given, not for the speakers, not for your values.
The boos are actively damaging hopes of pushing the Democratic party leftward by making the left look like entitled children. The boos are a bunch of (primarily) white men disrespecting speakers who are women and POC, speakers who are discussing real issues that affect them. The boos are ugly and we need less ugly right now.
posted by Gaz Errant at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [55 favorites]
The boos are actively damaging hopes of pushing the Democratic party leftward by making the left look like entitled children. The boos are a bunch of (primarily) white men disrespecting speakers who are women and POC, speakers who are discussing real issues that affect them. The boos are ugly and we need less ugly right now.
posted by Gaz Errant at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [55 favorites]
I guess the boo'ers may unite the party after all. No one will give a fuck what they think from now on though.
posted by bongo_x at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
As a Bernie supporter, eff these people.
posted by waitingtoderail at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by waitingtoderail at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I did not drink during the RNC and I think I'm gonna have to hit the liquor store on the way home today. I already have a headache from watching this shit.
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by DynamiteToast at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Please keep the updates coming, kalimac....
posted by mochapickle at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by mochapickle at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Hillary is not a values candidate, rallying around Hillary is not about values
Maybe not for you, but for a lot of us she is. Many many people voted for her because they liked what she had to say and what she advocates for. If you're not one of them, that's fine, but its ridiculous to assert no one is.
posted by thefoxgod at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Maybe not for you, but for a lot of us she is. Many many people voted for her because they liked what she had to say and what she advocates for. If you're not one of them, that's fine, but its ridiculous to assert no one is.
posted by thefoxgod at 2:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Look at her VP pick then talk to me about values.
Oh crap, I never thought that her picking a civil rights lawyer shows that she's a crass, emotionless husk of a human being before. You sure showed me.
posted by chimaera at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [49 favorites]
Oh crap, I never thought that her picking a civil rights lawyer shows that she's a crass, emotionless husk of a human being before. You sure showed me.
posted by chimaera at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [49 favorites]
The boos are for the rotten choice America has been given, not for the speakers, not for your values.
No, those boos are for the lulz, and having Trumpism come to America for the lulz would be the Trumpiest way for it to happen. Growing the fuck up is also a choice.
posted by holgate at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
No, those boos are for the lulz, and having Trumpism come to America for the lulz would be the Trumpiest way for it to happen. Growing the fuck up is also a choice.
posted by holgate at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
The thing I'm most looking forward to in the next few months is Clinton wiping the floor with debating Trump.
The thing I'm most scared of in the next few months is her debating Trump, actually. Not that I don't think she'll slaughter him on substance, but because I'm pretty sure that it won't matter: TV is his comfort zone, and low-information voters care about uglier things than nuance and reason.
posted by fifthrider at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
The thing I'm most scared of in the next few months is her debating Trump, actually. Not that I don't think she'll slaughter him on substance, but because I'm pretty sure that it won't matter: TV is his comfort zone, and low-information voters care about uglier things than nuance and reason.
posted by fifthrider at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Ah yes, let's get Daniel Malloy onstage. He's got -- what -- 20% approval in CT?
posted by birdheist at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by birdheist at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016
STOP SUPPORTING TRUMP YOU LOUDMOUTHED ASSHOLES.
Every BOO at the DNC is a cheer for Trump.
STOP SUPPORTING TRUMP.
posted by yesster at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Every BOO at the DNC is a cheer for Trump.
STOP SUPPORTING TRUMP.
posted by yesster at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Oh dear, here we go. Getting the platform through is the biggest test so far.
posted by dw at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by dw at 2:44 PM on July 25, 2016
This voice vote will be a shitshow and shame chants coming from Berners and cheering coming from Clinton supporters.
posted by Talez at 2:45 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Talez at 2:45 PM on July 25, 2016
I need to hit a MetaStop and collect some more favorites to give out cause I know I'm gonna be out way before this thread winds down for the night
Hope you can find your way back through all these low CP BoBs.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 2:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Hope you can find your way back through all these low CP BoBs.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 2:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Mod note: Folks, this is a hell of a weird start to the DNC and I know it's somewhat inseparable from the charged-as-hell primary season that led up to it, but let's please make an effort to keep it a little bit cooler in here.
posted by cortex (staff) at 2:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
posted by cortex (staff) at 2:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Isn't this guy a bit underdressed to be a speaker?
posted by sideshow at 2:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by sideshow at 2:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I did not cry at the republican convention. But the total disrespect of a black man talking about black lives matter breaks my heart, and it made me cry.
Bernie or bust people, I have no idea what you are, but you are not the left. I am embarrassed I ever supported the same candidate you did. In my heart I hope Bernie is embarrassed of you as well.
posted by Tarumba at 2:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [78 favorites]
Bernie or bust people, I have no idea what you are, but you are not the left. I am embarrassed I ever supported the same candidate you did. In my heart I hope Bernie is embarrassed of you as well.
posted by Tarumba at 2:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [78 favorites]
My cousin is a hardcore Bernie person who lives in California, and as of a week ago, many of her FB friends still were convinced that they could get Bernie nominated at the convention, "just like FDR." That's what these people probably think they're doing. The fact that their reality does not resemble the reality most of us live in has not penetrated whatever bubble they're in. They really think this is gonna work and everyone will thank them for it.
posted by showbiz_liz at 2:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by showbiz_liz at 2:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I'm not generally in favour of buying a huge roll of bubble-wrap, plucking people from the floor of a convention, wrapping them up in it securely with duct tape and throwing them in a cellar for four days.
But I would be hard-pressed to argue against it at the moment.
posted by Devonian at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
But I would be hard-pressed to argue against it at the moment.
posted by Devonian at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
ethansr: Hillary is not a values candidate, rallying around Hillary is not about values, and Hillary certainly has no monopoly on minority support. A vote for Hillary is about saving our country from catastrophe, nothing more. Look at her VP pick then talk to me about values. The boos are for the rotten choice America has been given, not for the speakers, not for your values.
I'll fucking talk to you about values. I'll talk to you about a guy who decided to go work in Central America helping poor kids. I'll talk to you about a guy who took his Harvard Law degree and decided to use it as a legal aid lawyer helping minority plaintiffs sue over redlining, instead of making bucks at a huge law firm. I'll talk to you about a guy who chose to move into a integrated neighborhood, go to an integrated church (often not that easy to find in the South), send his kids to majority-AA public schools -- and that sure as hell isn't typical even for liberals in the South. Who was a good mayor and a good governor and a good man.
Behold the Bernie or Buster: that good man is a 'rotten choice'.
posted by tavella at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [116 favorites]
I'll fucking talk to you about values. I'll talk to you about a guy who decided to go work in Central America helping poor kids. I'll talk to you about a guy who took his Harvard Law degree and decided to use it as a legal aid lawyer helping minority plaintiffs sue over redlining, instead of making bucks at a huge law firm. I'll talk to you about a guy who chose to move into a integrated neighborhood, go to an integrated church (often not that easy to find in the South), send his kids to majority-AA public schools -- and that sure as hell isn't typical even for liberals in the South. Who was a good mayor and a good governor and a good man.
Behold the Bernie or Buster: that good man is a 'rotten choice'.
posted by tavella at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [116 favorites]
When all of these dissenters go to their hotels tonight they will be looking at social media and be so happy that they got a mention but I feel it will be completely lost on them at what cost.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by JakeEXTREME at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The fact that their reality does not resemble the reality most of us live in has not penetrated whatever bubble they're in.
Epistemic closure: not just for reactionaries anymore!
posted by chimaera at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Epistemic closure: not just for reactionaries anymore!
posted by chimaera at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Okay now I'm beginning to understand how America ended up with George W. Bush twice.
posted by vanar sena at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
posted by vanar sena at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Isn't this guy a bit underdressed to be a speaker?
He's with AFCSME. Some people in the union movement refuse to wear suits.
posted by fitnr at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
He's with AFCSME. Some people in the union movement refuse to wear suits.
posted by fitnr at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Oh god here they go again.
posted by biogeo at 2:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by biogeo at 2:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Not to be a jerk but did this guy win a raffle to read this speech?
posted by birdheist at 2:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by birdheist at 2:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
So a white dude talks about trade and they say nothing?
posted by teleri025 at 2:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by teleri025 at 2:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
You know what this room needs?
John Lewis.
The man with resting protest face™.
posted by Herodios at 2:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
John Lewis.
The man with resting protest face™.
posted by Herodios at 2:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Hillary is not a values candidate, rallying around Hillary is not about values
Well, let's see.
She's:
Pro gun control
Pro choice
Pro LGBTQ rights
Against discrimination
Supports campaign finance reform
Supports criminal justice reform
Supports immigration reform
Supports unions
Supports expanding veterans benefits and fixing veterans' institutions like the VA
Supports early childhood and K-12 education and debt-free college educations
Supports universal, affordable health care.
Supports paid family and medical leave
Wants to expand rights for disabled Americans
Believes in climate change
Supports clean energy
Those are some of my values, and why I'm voting for her.
posted by zarq at 2:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [123 favorites]
Well, let's see.
She's:
Pro gun control
Pro choice
Pro LGBTQ rights
Against discrimination
Supports campaign finance reform
Supports criminal justice reform
Supports immigration reform
Supports unions
Supports expanding veterans benefits and fixing veterans' institutions like the VA
Supports early childhood and K-12 education and debt-free college educations
Supports universal, affordable health care.
Supports paid family and medical leave
Wants to expand rights for disabled Americans
Believes in climate change
Supports clean energy
Those are some of my values, and why I'm voting for her.
posted by zarq at 2:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [123 favorites]
For the past couple of hours, and I guess longer, like all day from watching Twitter, I've been trying to figure out what I've been primarily feeling in the face of the renewed Bernie-or-Bust crowd and their protests and chants. I certainly feel some anger, which I have been trying to keep in check, because what I mostly feel is sadness.
I'm sad because this (and the subsequent days) should be Clinton's time. This is an historic moment, the first woman to be nominated by a major party to run for President! I am so so happy about that. Like choked up, verklempt happy. And I'm so happy that it's Hillary Clinton! I really really like her. I think she does a great job, that she represents the best of America, not least for putting up with such an onslaught of hatred for so many years and being willing to still be right where she is, being right. She is no reluctant choice for me, she is my choice. She was not my choice when Obama ran, but she is my choice now, and I'm thrilled that she is going to be the nominee.
So I'm sad that in the face of this a bunch of people who are, in many way, functionally indistinguishable from members of the GOP in their specific and specious criticisms are being rotten about the whole thing. I'm sad that even in this, nomination for the DEMOCRATIC candidate for President, it seems that women get paid less than men, because how else do you understand the notion that the woman with 3 million more votes is not entitled to the nomination if it means besting a man?
I'm also sad, honestly, that there are people, described in this thread or the last, as young women of color who are involved in Black Lives Matter, who cannot see a difference between Trump and Clinton. I take that at face value, and it says horrible things about where we are as a country.
So, I am scared, because I'm genuinely scared about anything that I think puts Trump closer to the Whitehouse, but mostly I'm really sad. I cannot imagine what it must feel like to be Hillary Clinton listening to people boo you at your own convention.
I'm with her!
posted by OmieWise at 2:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [88 favorites]
I'm sad because this (and the subsequent days) should be Clinton's time. This is an historic moment, the first woman to be nominated by a major party to run for President! I am so so happy about that. Like choked up, verklempt happy. And I'm so happy that it's Hillary Clinton! I really really like her. I think she does a great job, that she represents the best of America, not least for putting up with such an onslaught of hatred for so many years and being willing to still be right where she is, being right. She is no reluctant choice for me, she is my choice. She was not my choice when Obama ran, but she is my choice now, and I'm thrilled that she is going to be the nominee.
So I'm sad that in the face of this a bunch of people who are, in many way, functionally indistinguishable from members of the GOP in their specific and specious criticisms are being rotten about the whole thing. I'm sad that even in this, nomination for the DEMOCRATIC candidate for President, it seems that women get paid less than men, because how else do you understand the notion that the woman with 3 million more votes is not entitled to the nomination if it means besting a man?
I'm also sad, honestly, that there are people, described in this thread or the last, as young women of color who are involved in Black Lives Matter, who cannot see a difference between Trump and Clinton. I take that at face value, and it says horrible things about where we are as a country.
So, I am scared, because I'm genuinely scared about anything that I think puts Trump closer to the Whitehouse, but mostly I'm really sad. I cannot imagine what it must feel like to be Hillary Clinton listening to people boo you at your own convention.
I'm with her!
posted by OmieWise at 2:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [88 favorites]
i just hope that after all this people and pundits will be able to separate legitimate critiques of neoliberal policy from the unhelpful and rude booing from these dumbasses. because it's not a healthy democracy if there's no room for constructive criticism even from within, and i just have a sinking feeling that folks are going to conflate these two
posted by burgerrr at 2:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by burgerrr at 2:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Saw a NYT headline earlier about how 99% of Sanders supporters now back Clinton, or will.
Something deeply ironic about Sanders having trouble with his own 1%.
In other news, I'm kinda ready to vomit on the first person who tries to defend the bullshit that was just flung at Elijah Cummings right now.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 2:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Something deeply ironic about Sanders having trouble with his own 1%.
In other news, I'm kinda ready to vomit on the first person who tries to defend the bullshit that was just flung at Elijah Cummings right now.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 2:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
My cousin is a hardcore Bernie person who lives in California, and as of a week ago, many of her FB friends still were convinced that they could get Bernie nominated at the convention, "just like FDR." That's what these people probably think they're doing.
Then this is Bernie's responsibility.
posted by schadenfrau at 2:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Then this is Bernie's responsibility.
posted by schadenfrau at 2:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
All things considered, this has gone better than day one in Cleveland. At least, so far.
posted by dw at 2:49 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by dw at 2:49 PM on July 25, 2016
Those chanters are like the worst commenters on every web site ever. Hush, the grownups are talking about something else now.
posted by fedward at 2:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by fedward at 2:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I don't know who among Marcia Fudge or Ben Jealous wins in the Awesome Name contest so far.
posted by Salieri at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I think the thing for upcoming speakers to notice is that any mention of Hillary's name turns into a "Bernie" chant. So get busy revising speeches to keep them focused on issues and less about her.
posted by dnash at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by dnash at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Bernie needs to haul these people into a room and give them a serious face-to-face. Obviously a text message isn't cutting it, and it was foolish of him to think it would.
posted by rifflesby at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by rifflesby at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
i just hope that after all this people and pundits will be able to separate legitimate critiques of neoliberal policy from the unhelpful and rude booing from these dumbasses. because it's not a healthy democracy if there's no room for constructive criticism even from within, and i just have a sinking feeling that folks are going to conflate these two
You just watched that moment pass. Wave goodbye.
posted by bongo_x at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
You just watched that moment pass. Wave goodbye.
posted by bongo_x at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
You want substantial change. I support a lot of your agenda. Guess how much progress you're going to make by being assholes? Be smart Take over the party and make it support your agenda. That's what the Radical Right did to the Republic party.
The Democratic Party does stand for most of what I believe in. The problem is that we get nowhere unless we are as tough as the intransigent Right. We can't make progress being complacent, and we can't make progress being fractured and bickering.
posted by theora55 at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
The Democratic Party does stand for most of what I believe in. The problem is that we get nowhere unless we are as tough as the intransigent Right. We can't make progress being complacent, and we can't make progress being fractured and bickering.
posted by theora55 at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Welp, the chanting morons just prompted this former Bernie supporter to donate to Hillary and buy a bumper sticker.
posted by lovecrafty at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [58 favorites]
posted by lovecrafty at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [58 favorites]
Please let them listen to Jealous.
posted by mochapickle at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by mochapickle at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016
And yes, every candidate in this election will pass and support it anyway, no matter what they say now.
This is probably true and it pisses me the fuck off. Don't say something (lie) to get my vote and then support and pass TPP later. The only surprise I want is actually sticking to your word by not supporting TPP after elected. Not holding my breath. YES I will vote for her but it's things like this that make it very hard.
Please prove me wrong Hillary!
posted by futz at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
This is probably true and it pisses me the fuck off. Don't say something (lie) to get my vote and then support and pass TPP later. The only surprise I want is actually sticking to your word by not supporting TPP after elected. Not holding my breath. YES I will vote for her but it's things like this that make it very hard.
Please prove me wrong Hillary!
posted by futz at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I just looked in again and immediately regretted it. Beating-heart anxiety present now.
Keith Olbermann to Bernie Sanders: "you'd better fix this or you personally will have set back the progressive cause in this country for years"
posted by Gaz Errant at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
Keith Olbermann to Bernie Sanders: "you'd better fix this or you personally will have set back the progressive cause in this country for years"
posted by Gaz Errant at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
He's with AFCSME. Some people in the union movement refuse to wear suits.
Like, because suits are what management wears? Huh, never really thought of it, but it makes sense that the dudes running unions don't want to wear the "uniform" of the people on the other side of the table.
posted by sideshow at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Like, because suits are what management wears? Huh, never really thought of it, but it makes sense that the dudes running unions don't want to wear the "uniform" of the people on the other side of the table.
posted by sideshow at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Bernie needs to haul these people into a room and give them a serious face-to-face. Obviously a text message isn't cutting it, and it was foolish of him to think it would.
He tried that this morning. They booed him, too.
posted by anastasiav at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
He tried that this morning. They booed him, too.
posted by anastasiav at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
My cousin is a hardcore Bernie person who lives in California, and as of a week ago, many of her FB friends still were convinced that they could get Bernie nominated at the convention, "just like FDR." That's what these people probably think they're doing.
Then this is Bernie's responsibility.
He already told them no, at his delegate meeting this morning, and the crowd BOOED and chanted back "We want Bernie!"
They chanted that they wanted the guy who was standing directly in front of them, telling them what he thought was best for his party. Because they didn't agree with what he himself had just said.
Explain that circular logic, please, and also how Bernie is supposed to corral this?
posted by chainsofreedom at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Then this is Bernie's responsibility.
He already told them no, at his delegate meeting this morning, and the crowd BOOED and chanted back "We want Bernie!"
They chanted that they wanted the guy who was standing directly in front of them, telling them what he thought was best for his party. Because they didn't agree with what he himself had just said.
Explain that circular logic, please, and also how Bernie is supposed to corral this?
posted by chainsofreedom at 2:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
dnash: I think the thing for upcoming speakers to notice is that any mention of Hillary's name turns into a "Bernie" chant. So get busy revising speeches to keep them focused on issues and less about her.
Ah, the gamergater gambit. Disappear women from discourse because a bunch of bros hate them and we don't want to be 'controversial'.
Fuck that.
posted by tavella at 2:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [84 favorites]
Ah, the gamergater gambit. Disappear women from discourse because a bunch of bros hate them and we don't want to be 'controversial'.
Fuck that.
posted by tavella at 2:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [84 favorites]
Bernie needs to have an open meeting with protestors right fucking now.
posted by Yowser at 2:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Yowser at 2:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Not all those who don't love Hillary are BernieBros or BernieBots or ObamaBoys or BoBs or whatever term we're using this week, guys.
She was about my third choice, for example (or sixth if I count those who didn't run like Warren) but she's still better than Trump and better than bust, and it's not even close, no matter what future scandals or e-mails or investigations come up, because the alternative(s) are so bad. And I think this is a common belief.
It's completely possible to not love her, to think she's a bad or weak or corrupt or whatever candidate, but still vote for her because it's the best choice we have left... and she needs those votes. Don't confuse the hundreds of people acting like jerks at the convention with everyone who doesn't love Clinton.
Weak support is still support, and sometimes it seems like that's being thrown under the bridge.
As for the convention: someone desperately needs to make some jokes, soon. Good ones. It's way too tense in there.
posted by rokusan at 2:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
She was about my third choice, for example (or sixth if I count those who didn't run like Warren) but she's still better than Trump and better than bust, and it's not even close, no matter what future scandals or e-mails or investigations come up, because the alternative(s) are so bad. And I think this is a common belief.
It's completely possible to not love her, to think she's a bad or weak or corrupt or whatever candidate, but still vote for her because it's the best choice we have left... and she needs those votes. Don't confuse the hundreds of people acting like jerks at the convention with everyone who doesn't love Clinton.
Weak support is still support, and sometimes it seems like that's being thrown under the bridge.
As for the convention: someone desperately needs to make some jokes, soon. Good ones. It's way too tense in there.
posted by rokusan at 2:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
Olbermann isn't wrong. I don't know if Sanders needs to come out shouting or give a sad disappointed dad face to the Busters or what but he'd better get the fuck on it.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 2:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by scaryblackdeath at 2:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Ah, the gamergater gambit. Disappear women from discourse because a bunch of bros hate them and we don't want to be 'controversial'.
Not really what I meant at all. But whatever.
posted by dnash at 2:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Not really what I meant at all. But whatever.
posted by dnash at 2:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
This dude is blowing out his throat shouting. Someone tell him he has a microphone.
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 2:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 2:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Also, just mentally reviewing every hack I've seen or read about in the last thirty years or so... stealing e-mails from a poorly-protected server and dumping them on WikiLeaks is something annoying hacker kids do, not state actors. It's so amateurish and pointless, compared to what they probably could do.
Firstly it's not pointless if it sows disunity and helps Trump. Secondly both China and Russia have lots of paid hackers and paid trolls who work social media.
posted by sebastienbailard at 2:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Firstly it's not pointless if it sows disunity and helps Trump. Secondly both China and Russia have lots of paid hackers and paid trolls who work social media.
posted by sebastienbailard at 2:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Not all those who don't love Hillary are BernieBros or BernieBots or ObamaBoys [?!?] or BoBs or whatever term we're using this week, guys.
Absolutely. Are any of the other people who are lukewarm about Clinton booing at the convention?
posted by OmieWise at 2:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Absolutely. Are any of the other people who are lukewarm about Clinton booing at the convention?
posted by OmieWise at 2:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Bernie is losing power by the second.
posted by Ironmouth at 2:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Ironmouth at 2:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Bernie can't just undo with one meeting the months he spent telling his supporters that Clinton and the Democratic Party were incurably corrupt and that the only solution was "revolution."
posted by theodolite at 2:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 2:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
Marcia Fudge may be my new favorite American.
posted by palindromic at 2:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 2:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"A motion has been made that you assholes shut the fuck up. Is there a second?"
posted by kirkaracha at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
Bernie needs to have an open meeting with protestors right fucking now.
It's not going to matter. They were "promised" a contested convention and view the e-mail leaks as proof that the system was rigged against them, though there's no hard proof of that yet.
They're angry at Sanders for backing Clinton when they believe he was her victim. They want him to stand up and fight.
Won't happen, of course, but that's why they can be mad at Sanders and want him at the same time.
posted by rokusan at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
It's not going to matter. They were "promised" a contested convention and view the e-mail leaks as proof that the system was rigged against them, though there's no hard proof of that yet.
They're angry at Sanders for backing Clinton when they believe he was her victim. They want him to stand up and fight.
Won't happen, of course, but that's why they can be mad at Sanders and want him at the same time.
posted by rokusan at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Explain that circular logic, please, and also how Bernie is supposed to corral this?
I have no idea. They are his supporters. He whipped them into this over a period of months. That he doesn't know what to do about this situation now does nothing to lessen his responsibility for causing it.
posted by schadenfrau at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I have no idea. They are his supporters. He whipped them into this over a period of months. That he doesn't know what to do about this situation now does nothing to lessen his responsibility for causing it.
posted by schadenfrau at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I LOVE YOU, MS FUDGE.
posted by dw at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by dw at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
You just watched that moment pass. Wave goodbye.
see, this is exactly what i'm saying. some idiots booing does NOT de-legitimize actual critiques further down the road. sorry. these aren't the folks that are going to be making those kinds of critiques anyway
posted by burgerrr at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
see, this is exactly what i'm saying. some idiots booing does NOT de-legitimize actual critiques further down the road. sorry. these aren't the folks that are going to be making those kinds of critiques anyway
posted by burgerrr at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
How many noses will be cut for face spiting? I can't listen to this.
posted by mrzarquon at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mrzarquon at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
That was a resounding AYE.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by JakeEXTREME at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
That was a roar of an AYE. That makes me feel better.
posted by yasaman at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 2:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
"All those in favor say 'aye' [WINK]"
[THUNDEROUS, SUSTAINED AYE]
posted by fedward at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
[THUNDEROUS, SUSTAINED AYE]
posted by fedward at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Bernie or bust people, I have no idea what you are, but you are not the left.
THANK YOU! Most of the Busters aren't the people who supported Bernie for his political positions. We're already onboard with Clinton at this point. They're the "Anyone But Hillary" crowd and whoever the other candidate running against her was would have attracted the same thing. Could he have done some things differently? Of course. But it's tiring to see concern trolling about "Oh no! Now the left has no future in the Democratic party!" over and over with a slight bit of glee in their words.
posted by downtohisturtles at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
THANK YOU! Most of the Busters aren't the people who supported Bernie for his political positions. We're already onboard with Clinton at this point. They're the "Anyone But Hillary" crowd and whoever the other candidate running against her was would have attracted the same thing. Could he have done some things differently? Of course. But it's tiring to see concern trolling about "Oh no! Now the left has no future in the Democratic party!" over and over with a slight bit of glee in their words.
posted by downtohisturtles at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
Yes, the definite AYE that went on and on was definitely a relief. Yay!
posted by Salieri at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The equivalent RNC rules vote was way closer, noise-wise.
posted by sideshow at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by sideshow at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016
Okay, I guess they sometimes can shut up and take a win.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016
They finally figured out that shouting "Hillary" over "Bernie" makes it all sound like "Hillary".
posted by bongo_x at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Take that, GE Smith.
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
some idiots booing does NOT de-legitimize actual critiques further down the road.
It shouldn't, but it probably will.
posted by straight at 3:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
It shouldn't, but it probably will.
posted by straight at 3:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Secondly both China and Russia have lots of paid hackers and paid trolls who work social media.
Right... as does the DNC and Hillary's campaign, and presumably the RNC and Trump's... I must be missing your point. How does this relate to the DNC hack?
posted by rokusan at 3:00 PM on July 25, 2016
Right... as does the DNC and Hillary's campaign, and presumably the RNC and Trump's... I must be missing your point. How does this relate to the DNC hack?
posted by rokusan at 3:00 PM on July 25, 2016
see, this is exactly what i'm saying. some idiots booing does NOT de-legitimize actual critiques further down the road.
I didn't say it was right, I said that's what just happened.
posted by bongo_x at 3:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I didn't say it was right, I said that's what just happened.
posted by bongo_x at 3:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Ms. Fudge has the best most expressive eyebrows.
posted by winna at 3:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 3:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I am glad the DNC appears to be letting the Bernie people voice their opinions. No one is telling them to shut up. THAT is Democracy.
posted by cooker girl at 3:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 3:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Does anyone know what the DNC is likely to actually do about this (if anything)?
posted by schadenfrau at 3:01 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by schadenfrau at 3:01 PM on July 25, 2016
Seems like the defining star-making factor this week will be the ability to withstand/rise above boos. Which doesn't really seem like the #1 reason why someone should become a party leader or candidate for higher office, but whatever.
posted by acidic at 3:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by acidic at 3:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Take that, GE Smith.
Although, based on song choice, GE Smith may have been running his own subversive campaign.
posted by sideshow at 3:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Although, based on song choice, GE Smith may have been running his own subversive campaign.
posted by sideshow at 3:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I really uh ... hate ... those Love Trumps Hate signs. Because they read both ways, and its driving me crazy.
Love overcomes hate
or, I love Trump's hate
posted by anastasiav at 3:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Love overcomes hate
or, I love Trump's hate
posted by anastasiav at 3:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Also if you're on YouTube to watch the LiveStream News feed is the cspan feed.
posted by winna at 3:02 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 3:02 PM on July 25, 2016
Nate Silver: Big cheers for adopting party platform. This convention may be a shitshow -- most gatherings of Democrats are -- but not yet a clusterfuck.
posted by saturday_morning at 3:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by saturday_morning at 3:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
I am dreading the state counts when a lot of these people will get the mike. What night is that? I may need to fortify my spirits supply.
This is why people wanted Bernie to concede earlier. It would have given people time to work out some of their 5 stages of grief. This just sucks, no matter how many rational arguments I am using on myself, I have a visceral bad feeling. And I am so angry and sad that the first serious woman candidate is so disrespected in her own party.
posted by madamjujujive at 3:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
This is why people wanted Bernie to concede earlier. It would have given people time to work out some of their 5 stages of grief. This just sucks, no matter how many rational arguments I am using on myself, I have a visceral bad feeling. And I am so angry and sad that the first serious woman candidate is so disrespected in her own party.
posted by madamjujujive at 3:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
Bernie can't just undo with one meeting the months he spent telling his supporters that Clinton and the Democratic Party were incurably corrupt and that the only solution was "revolution."
Yes and that definitely proved to be a total fantasy. These people have no material cause for their anger! Hey, anybody seen Debbie Wasserman Schultz? She was supposed to be here I thought?
posted by Nomiconic at 3:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Yes and that definitely proved to be a total fantasy. These people have no material cause for their anger! Hey, anybody seen Debbie Wasserman Schultz? She was supposed to be here I thought?
posted by Nomiconic at 3:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I like how organized the video displays are. The speaker's name stays on right and center, with a helpful catchphrase for the current speaker like "Rules Committee" or "Putting Families First" is displayed above the podium. It's as if someone thought about the speakers and what they would say as opposed to last week, where assorted real estate developers and avocado farmers were randomly intermingled.
posted by zachlipton at 3:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 3:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Congressman Brady has the super most Philly accent.
posted by winna at 3:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by winna at 3:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
DWS got hounded at the Florida breakfast this morning. Maybe she bowed out?
posted by mochapickle at 3:03 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by mochapickle at 3:03 PM on July 25, 2016
Does anyone know what the DNC is likely to actually do about this (if anything)?
The smartest thing to do would be to just let them tucker themselves out and wait to welcome them into the fold, while saying anodyne things like, 'We welcome robust debate in the Democratic Party!'
It is the Democratic Party though, so who knows!
posted by palindromic at 3:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
The smartest thing to do would be to just let them tucker themselves out and wait to welcome them into the fold, while saying anodyne things like, 'We welcome robust debate in the Democratic Party!'
It is the Democratic Party though, so who knows!
posted by palindromic at 3:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Thank God they didn't ruin the POW/MIA moment of silence.
posted by cooker girl at 3:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 3:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
As for the convention: someone desperately needs to make some jokes, soon. Good ones. It's way too tense in there.
All things considered, this has gone better than day one in Cleveland. At least, so far.
All things considered, this has gone better than day one in Cleveland. At least, so far.
"Relax! Let's have some fun out here! This game's fun, OK? Fun goddamnit. And don't hold the ball so hard, OK? It's an egg. Hold it like an egg. "posted by Herodios at 3:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
-- Crash Davis
“So keep fighting for freedom and justice, beloveds, but don't forget to have fun doin' it. Be outrageous. . . And when you get through celebrating the sheer joy of a good fight, be sure to tell those who come after how much fun it was!
-- Molly Ivins
At least they managed to shut up for the moment of silence.
posted by biogeo at 3:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by biogeo at 3:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
dnash: Not really what I meant at all. But whatever.
It may not be what you meant, but it's sure as hell what you said. That speakers should erase the name of the nominee -- the first woman nominee -- from their speeches because a pack of rabid haters have decided to neg any mention of her. That's exactly the technique the gamergaters use to try to drive women out of public discourse.
posted by tavella at 3:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
It may not be what you meant, but it's sure as hell what you said. That speakers should erase the name of the nominee -- the first woman nominee -- from their speeches because a pack of rabid haters have decided to neg any mention of her. That's exactly the technique the gamergaters use to try to drive women out of public discourse.
posted by tavella at 3:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
...those Love Trumps Hate signs. Because they read both ways, and its driving me crazy.
Oh, come on. I am sure Trump voters, as a group, are smart enough to understand apostrop---
Um. Never mind.
posted by rokusan at 3:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Oh, come on. I am sure Trump voters, as a group, are smart enough to understand apostrop---
Um. Never mind.
posted by rokusan at 3:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Ok so I just posted this on FB and will repost here for if anyone is considering doing something similar. I'm just pissed off and I felt like I had to say SOMETHING.
I'm sick and tired of feeling like I need to equivocate my support for Hillary Clinton. I'll go ahead and toss one more equivocation out - I voted for Sanders in the primary. I support most of the same values he supports. This Sanders voter is with Hillary Clinton all the way, and if you ever supported him, at least consider listening to the man now when he tells you he has thrown his support behind Clinton.
Look at the platform. It's the most progressive major party platform in decades. Look beyond the decades of petty mud-slinging and Republican nonsense and look at what Clinton says she is going to try to do for this country.
I haven't posted anything this forceful before because, frankly, I figured a bunch of people would come and start fights on my wall about it, and I didn't want to deal with it. But maybe that was the wrong decision.
posted by showbiz_liz at 3:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [54 favorites]
I'm sick and tired of feeling like I need to equivocate my support for Hillary Clinton. I'll go ahead and toss one more equivocation out - I voted for Sanders in the primary. I support most of the same values he supports. This Sanders voter is with Hillary Clinton all the way, and if you ever supported him, at least consider listening to the man now when he tells you he has thrown his support behind Clinton.
Look at the platform. It's the most progressive major party platform in decades. Look beyond the decades of petty mud-slinging and Republican nonsense and look at what Clinton says she is going to try to do for this country.
I haven't posted anything this forceful before because, frankly, I figured a bunch of people would come and start fights on my wall about it, and I didn't want to deal with it. But maybe that was the wrong decision.
posted by showbiz_liz at 3:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [54 favorites]
Does anyone know what the DNC is likely to actually do about this (if anything)?
Presumably, they could have security escort the dead-enders out. But, to their credit, they have not done so and likely won't unless the assholes get physical.
posted by tobascodagama at 3:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Presumably, they could have security escort the dead-enders out. But, to their credit, they have not done so and likely won't unless the assholes get physical.
posted by tobascodagama at 3:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Especially after all I heard about speakers at the RNC not actually mentioning Trump's name, I am glad to hear so many speakers say Clinton's.
posted by palindromic at 3:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 3:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I need someone to photoshop a needle meter that goes from "Love-in" to "shitshow" and then "clusterfuck"
posted by GuyZero at 3:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by GuyZero at 3:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
At least they managed to shut up for the moment of silence.
Because it was called for by a straight white man, presumably?
(I'm sure it's because they're reading Twitter actually, but still.)
posted by Lyn Never at 3:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Because it was called for by a straight white man, presumably?
(I'm sure it's because they're reading Twitter actually, but still.)
posted by Lyn Never at 3:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Clinton's campaign has been predicated, in part, on listening. The current booing rump contingent has been demonstrating, anong other things, that they are anti-listening.
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
as opposed to last week, where assorted real estate developers and avocado farmers were randomly intermingled.
Or broadcasted tweets of a white supremacist!
posted by futz at 3:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Or broadcasted tweets of a white supremacist!
posted by futz at 3:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Iowa delegate @chris_laursen: “Bernie basically fed us a bunch of Mountain Dew and now he wants us to go to bed. It’s not going to happen.”
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
The silence when Donald Trump is mentioned, followed by the lusty chaos when Hillary is mentioned, is really terrible.
posted by argybarg at 3:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 3:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
umm, ok, did the speech end or did he just walk away...
posted by Foci for Analysis at 3:08 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 3:08 PM on July 25, 2016
So he's admitting he's a petulant child.
posted by yesster at 3:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by yesster at 3:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
> @chris_laursen: “Bernie basically fed us a bunch of Mountain Dew and now he wants us to go to bed. It’s not going to happen.”
Wow, literally going with the spoiled brat analogy there.
Hopefully they tucker themselves out soon from jumping up and down on the bed.
posted by mrzarquon at 3:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Wow, literally going with the spoiled brat analogy there.
Hopefully they tucker themselves out soon from jumping up and down on the bed.
posted by mrzarquon at 3:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Iowa delegate @chris_laursen: “Bernie basically fed us a bunch of Mountain Dew and now he wants us to go to bed. It’s not going to happen.”
Talk about locus of control issues.
posted by bluecore at 3:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Talk about locus of control issues.
posted by bluecore at 3:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Will be very interested to see the breakdown of time spent booing/chanting during speeches by sex, race, etc, of the speaker.
posted by palindromic at 3:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by palindromic at 3:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Somebody needs to explain that "the boo is an American sign of respect.".
(Well, it is Philadelphia.)
posted by Huffy Puffy at 3:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
(Well, it is Philadelphia.)
posted by Huffy Puffy at 3:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Iowa delegate @chris_laursen: “Bernie basically fed us a bunch of Mountain Dew and now he wants us to go to bed. It’s not going to happen.”
So they're just admitting that they're cranky babies throwing a fit?
posted by lovecrafty at 3:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
So they're just admitting that they're cranky babies throwing a fit?
posted by lovecrafty at 3:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Yay, I just got my Woman Cards!
One for me, even though I'm a cis man.
One for my wife, who is never online.
One for my Aunt who can't afford to donate.
One for my 1.5 year old daughter, because of course!
posted by OmieWise at 3:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
One for me, even though I'm a cis man.
One for my wife, who is never online.
One for my Aunt who can't afford to donate.
One for my 1.5 year old daughter, because of course!
posted by OmieWise at 3:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Nate Silver: Big cheers for adopting party platform. This convention may be a shitshow -- most gatherings of Democrats are -- but not yet a clusterfuck.
As much as this whole thing is raising my blood pressure, I have to agree. This is one of the less-fun parts of a big tent party. The shouting over minorities and women is completely disrespectful, but the people running this show seem to have everything in hand and are handling it with aplomb.
And it seems like people have calmed down a little bit with the booing, which is nice.
oh god i just jinxed it didn't i
posted by Salieri at 3:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
As much as this whole thing is raising my blood pressure, I have to agree. This is one of the less-fun parts of a big tent party. The shouting over minorities and women is completely disrespectful, but the people running this show seem to have everything in hand and are handling it with aplomb.
And it seems like people have calmed down a little bit with the booing, which is nice.
oh god i just jinxed it didn't i
posted by Salieri at 3:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
They seem a bit quieter now. I wonder if the folks on the floor realized just how fucking terrible their chanting over Elijah Cummings looked.
posted by biogeo at 3:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by biogeo at 3:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
We have moved into the funky guitar lick portion of the evening I see
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 3:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 3:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The booing just now for Congressman Grijalva when he mentioned Clinton was very noticeable and gross.
posted by winna at 3:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by winna at 3:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The BoB crew is basically that guy who comes to a boardgame meetup, fixates on one person who they think slighted them, and then does everything they can to make that person lose. They don't care if they personally don't win a damned thing, they just want to take down their target with them.
Except, y'know, in this case their target is the only viable option to keep our country from slipping into outright fascism.
I feel like whatever the outcome, nothing good is going to be written in the history books about a whole lot of the righteously angry from this time period.
(This election is such a fucking crazy thing for me. I am not a Hillary supporter, but holy shit people, anyone working against her at this point is basically working to elect Trump. That is not playing with fire, that is playing with nuclear fucking weapons.)
posted by tocts at 3:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
Except, y'know, in this case their target is the only viable option to keep our country from slipping into outright fascism.
I feel like whatever the outcome, nothing good is going to be written in the history books about a whole lot of the righteously angry from this time period.
(This election is such a fucking crazy thing for me. I am not a Hillary supporter, but holy shit people, anyone working against her at this point is basically working to elect Trump. That is not playing with fire, that is playing with nuclear fucking weapons.)
posted by tocts at 3:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
The motion before us is that we pause in the business of the convention so that the crankier delegates in the room can get a much needed nap. All in favor?
posted by chimaera at 3:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by chimaera at 3:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I heard the Clinton and Sanders whips were teaming up to quiet things down.
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Maybe they finally checked their phones and saw the Bernie message.
posted by saturday_morning at 3:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by saturday_morning at 3:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Enh, I can't handle the booing. I'll try again tomorrow.
posted by mochapickle at 3:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mochapickle at 3:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The booing just now for Congressman Grijalva when he mentioned Clinton was very noticeable and gross.
Way to show your Leftist credentials.
posted by bongo_x at 3:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Way to show your Leftist credentials.
posted by bongo_x at 3:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Read a bit on the scandal (from non-mainstream media sites)
Such as? Serious question. I'm not inclined to trust a site just because it's non-mainstream.
posted by showbiz_liz at 3:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Such as? Serious question. I'm not inclined to trust a site just because it's non-mainstream.
posted by showbiz_liz at 3:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yes and that definitely proved to be a total fantasy. These people have no material cause for their anger!
Nomiconic
It was, and they don't.
Nothing in the leaked emails confirmed even a single one of the endless paranoid conspiracies of election fraud or media manipulation. They're embarrassing and look bad which is why DWS was forced out, but nothing has validated a single fantasy emanating from the Sanders camp.
Sanders lost because he failed to get more votes than Clinton, plain and simple, and if you have a shred of evidence showing otherwise please share it with us.
posted by Sangermaine at 3:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
Nomiconic
It was, and they don't.
Nothing in the leaked emails confirmed even a single one of the endless paranoid conspiracies of election fraud or media manipulation. They're embarrassing and look bad which is why DWS was forced out, but nothing has validated a single fantasy emanating from the Sanders camp.
Sanders lost because he failed to get more votes than Clinton, plain and simple, and if you have a shred of evidence showing otherwise please share it with us.
posted by Sangermaine at 3:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
I've noticed any post remotely critiquing the DNC and their role in the Wikileaks scandal is getting deleted, including the article I posted offering a simple layman's explanation. At this point, I'd be surprised if this post wasn't deleted as well.
We've had a lengthy discussion about the DNC and the emails in the last thread over the past few days.
posted by zachlipton at 3:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
We've had a lengthy discussion about the DNC and the emails in the last thread over the past few days.
posted by zachlipton at 3:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I voted for Bernie without hesitation in the primaries.
But, you know, the more people talk about how bad or corrupt Hillary is, and the more it turns out to be overhyped, petty things, the more I'm convinced she must be the most scrupulous person on the damned planet.
What I can say is that if my emails were searched by the FBI and dumped to a public who would go through them with a fine toothed comb, I could only pray I came out looking half as good.
posted by Zalzidrax at 3:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [56 favorites]
But, you know, the more people talk about how bad or corrupt Hillary is, and the more it turns out to be overhyped, petty things, the more I'm convinced she must be the most scrupulous person on the damned planet.
What I can say is that if my emails were searched by the FBI and dumped to a public who would go through them with a fine toothed comb, I could only pray I came out looking half as good.
posted by Zalzidrax at 3:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [56 favorites]
Mod note: One comment deleted; as always bring moderation questions to the contact form not on the blue, and in this case check that your link hasn't already been posted in the two giant threads already covering the email thing.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 3:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 3:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
They're booing the candidate they support and everyone else. They aren't thinking, they're just angry. The DNC email thing, over which DWS was pushed out, may not be a big thing to you folks in particular but to the people shouting on the floor? It's the latest bullshit thing in a series of bullshit things that they're angry about. And the angry people aren't going to suddenly sit down and think, "Oh gee, was I wrong?"
So maybe brainstorm a way to channel, ablate, or dissipate that anger on the floor because your's and the party's disdain of it hasn't done very much thus far. So maybe something sneaky, or something cathartic to get these pissed off people out of the spotlight but FFS make it something that isn't another fucking own-goal.
And if the reaction on the ground is, like here, "They're spoiled brats, what could go wrong, they'l wear themselves out." then Jesus Tapdancing Christ who is in charge down there?
posted by Slackermagee at 3:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
So maybe brainstorm a way to channel, ablate, or dissipate that anger on the floor because your's and the party's disdain of it hasn't done very much thus far. So maybe something sneaky, or something cathartic to get these pissed off people out of the spotlight but FFS make it something that isn't another fucking own-goal.
And if the reaction on the ground is, like here, "They're spoiled brats, what could go wrong, they'l wear themselves out." then Jesus Tapdancing Christ who is in charge down there?
posted by Slackermagee at 3:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Yeah, I think I jinxed it.
What a nice speech from Nita Lowey specifically discussing Hillary and her feminist credentials. I got a shiver at the "sister" President remark.
posted by Salieri at 3:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
What a nice speech from Nita Lowey specifically discussing Hillary and her feminist credentials. I got a shiver at the "sister" President remark.
posted by Salieri at 3:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Bernie just apparently sent an email to all his delegates saying that their credibility as a movement is being damaged by booing and other protests. He said that booing is "what the corporate media wants." Hope it works; not optimistic.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 3:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 3:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
I respect that Nita Lowey came out and gave that speech the way she was going to give it, irrespective of the crowd noise - no change in tone, facial expression, pacing.
posted by palindromic at 3:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 3:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Yes, Lowey is making a lovely speech about the importance of this election for women. It's a pity it's almost hard to hear her.
posted by winna at 3:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by winna at 3:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
"You take that, Donald Trump!" LOL.
posted by biogeo at 3:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 3:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I'm sorry, I had to answer the door and I missed some stuff. There's a group of people on stage now - who are they?
posted by everybody had matching towels at 3:19 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by everybody had matching towels at 3:19 PM on July 25, 2016
I think she said "Hillary" about 50 times which was great.
posted by bongo_x at 3:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 3:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The group on stage is the NY delegation.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 3:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 3:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Adriano Espaillat on being first formerly undocumented immigrant to reach the US Congress: "Take that, Donald Trump!"
posted by palindromic at 3:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 3:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
"Any democrats in the house?" I had to laugh at that snark from our first Dominican-American congressman, Adriano Espaillat.
posted by winna at 3:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by winna at 3:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I'm sorry, I had to answer the door and I missed some stuff. There's a group of people on stage now - who are they?
The entire New York democratic congressional delegation, and other New York democrats.
posted by fitnr at 3:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The entire New York democratic congressional delegation, and other New York democrats.
posted by fitnr at 3:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
New York representatives, AFAIK. This Espaillat guy is awesome.
posted by stolyarova at 3:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 3:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
And I'll add, the people upthread trying to paint this as "both sides are to blame" are simply wrong.
The Sanders camp spent the entire primary campaign painting their opponents and irredeemably corrupt, and fomented or allowed to foment endless conspiracies decrying every loss as fraudulent. The Clinton camp wasn't all angels, but there simply wasn't an equivalent faction.
The rift on display tonight is entirely, 100% one-sided. Sanders chose to try to harness the mob, and now it's out of his control. He should have clamped down on this months ago, not let it fester.
posted by Sangermaine at 3:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [47 favorites]
The Sanders camp spent the entire primary campaign painting their opponents and irredeemably corrupt, and fomented or allowed to foment endless conspiracies decrying every loss as fraudulent. The Clinton camp wasn't all angels, but there simply wasn't an equivalent faction.
The rift on display tonight is entirely, 100% one-sided. Sanders chose to try to harness the mob, and now it's out of his control. He should have clamped down on this months ago, not let it fester.
posted by Sangermaine at 3:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [47 favorites]
Thanks, everyone!
posted by everybody had matching towels at 3:21 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by everybody had matching towels at 3:21 PM on July 25, 2016
"Se puede!" There's a good crowd response finally.
posted by biogeo at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Not going to shout about trade deals over the guy speaking Spanish? They missed one there.
posted by bongo_x at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by bongo_x at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"You take that, Donald Trump!" LOL.
YASSSSSSSSSSSSS
posted by en forme de poire at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
YASSSSSSSSSSSSS
posted by en forme de poire at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Espaillat is giving his speech over again in Spanish!
posted by winna at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by winna at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Photobooth time.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016
Nothing in the leaked emails confirmed even a single one of the endless paranoid conspiracies of election fraud or media manipulation.
The CFO of the ostensibly neutral DNC wrote:
“It might may (sic) no difference, but for KY and WVA can we get someone to ask his belief. Does he believe in a God. [...] This could make several points difference with my peeps. My Southern Baptist peeps would draw a big difference between a Jew and an atheist,”
So, like, what does that mean to you, exactly?
posted by Nomiconic at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
The CFO of the ostensibly neutral DNC wrote:
“It might may (sic) no difference, but for KY and WVA can we get someone to ask his belief. Does he believe in a God. [...] This could make several points difference with my peeps. My Southern Baptist peeps would draw a big difference between a Jew and an atheist,”
So, like, what does that mean to you, exactly?
posted by Nomiconic at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Wonkette: STOP YELLING OVER ELIJAH CUMMINGS AND SHOW SOME GODDAMNED RESPECT
posted by homunculus at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by homunculus at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Adriano Espaillat - a previously undocumented Dominican in elected office in NY - that is awesome, he should have gotten a better reaction from the crowd, imo. Well done, sir!
posted by madamjujujive at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by madamjujujive at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
So, like, what does that mean to you, exactly?
Nothing. Did they actually do that, or is there just an email bringing it up?
I want evidence that something actually happened. Otherwise it's just people talking.
posted by Sangermaine at 3:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Nothing. Did they actually do that, or is there just an email bringing it up?
I want evidence that something actually happened. Otherwise it's just people talking.
posted by Sangermaine at 3:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Mod note: Folks maybe we can separate the streams here, and folks who want to talk about the email leaks can go over here where there's already a discussion on that, whereas people who want to talk about the convention happening now can do that here.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 3:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 3:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
The guy taking the picture sounds so cute. He's gently scolding everyone for moving.
posted by winna at 3:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 3:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I am very sad that a small portion of the left, a small portion of the only group I am confident that I belong to, has, in your country and mine, decided that emotional gratification is more important than implementing policy. It's so fucking embarrassing.
posted by howfar at 3:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [50 favorites]
posted by howfar at 3:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [50 favorites]
At least they're not booing Spanish. Yet.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 3:26 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 3:26 PM on July 25, 2016
prompter fail :/
posted by Foci for Analysis at 3:26 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 3:26 PM on July 25, 2016
I follow a pretty fervent Bernie supporter on twitter, a dude who has claimed multiple times that BernieBros are a fiction created by the Clinton campaign. He was tweeting pretty regularly before the convention started but it's been pretty much radio silence since it started.
posted by PenDevil at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by PenDevil at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2016
The teleprompter has been a bit off all day. Want to bet Trump has something to say about that?
posted by zachlipton at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zachlipton at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2016
Current texts from Bernie asking folks to stfu.
posted by mrzarquon at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
They're cheering lesbianism. Progress.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Fuck yeah Tina Kotek!
posted by OverlappingElvis at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by OverlappingElvis at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2016
We now have Tina Kotek from Oregon. We have the same glasses! The prompter is still messed up.
posted by winna at 3:28 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 3:28 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh man, Tina Kotek, that's my district rep, and the target of a simultaneously amateurishly-doomed and yet super shitty bit of hyperlocal ratfuckery during the last election here. They say all politics is local but when it's on the sign of the gas station near your house that's really putting a fine point on it.
posted by cortex at 3:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by cortex at 3:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I just realized that a bunch of (presumably) Sanders delegates chanting "No TPP" over Elijah Cummings' heartfelt speech about his sharecropper father and the diversity of the Democratic coalition could be seen as a real-life metaphor for the Sanders campaign's less-than-stellar ability to connect with a certain subset of African-American voters.
posted by mhum at 3:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
posted by mhum at 3:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Jesus Christ, another Rattata?!
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 3:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 3:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Current texts from Bernie asking folks to stfu.
Yeah that was the text that went out a couple of hours ago before the session started. The noise you're hearing now is from people who ignored that message.
posted by zachlipton at 3:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah that was the text that went out a couple of hours ago before the session started. The noise you're hearing now is from people who ignored that message.
posted by zachlipton at 3:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
time for a name change: DemocratsThe Monarchy.
dws? I'm betting an Honorary Chairperson collects a fair check.
posted by j_curiouser at 3:30 PM on July 25, 2016
dws? I'm betting an Honorary Chairperson collects a fair check.
posted by j_curiouser at 3:30 PM on July 25, 2016
A FOAF on Facebook suggests that the DNC chose civil rights speakers to go on the first day when the Bernie fans would be loud and disruptive, to make the Bernie fans look bad.
I... I'll just scroll away.
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I... I'll just scroll away.
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I think it is definitely quieting down as time goes on. It was like an extinction burst to kick off the convention.
posted by palindromic at 3:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 3:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Oh my god I hope so.
posted by Tarumba at 3:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 3:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
A FOAF on Facebook suggests that the DNC chose civil rights speakers to go on the first day when the Bernie fans would be loud and disruptive, to make the Bernie fans look bad.
Whaaaaat?! That's completely ridiculous, clearly it was the Russians who planned that.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 3:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Whaaaaat?! That's completely ridiculous, clearly it was the Russians who planned that.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 3:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
That old camera for the official photo was kind of cool!
posted by chapps at 3:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by chapps at 3:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
If Bernie doesn't lock this down the left is fucking cooked for another 25 years. Even if Clinton squeaks a win without a Convention bump all the mainstream Dems like me who might be persuaded to swing to another Bernie type candidate will remember is this useless petulant Boo in our faces.
In short. Wow.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 3:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
In short. Wow.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 3:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I was in the kitchen making (literal) popcorn and missed something. Is the crowd quieter, or did C-SPAN's sound levels changed?
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:32 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:32 PM on July 25, 2016
I wonder if the boo'ers are proud of themselves?
Like enthusiastically patting each other on the back saying "we sure showed them didn't we!"
posted by Annika Cicada at 3:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Like enthusiastically patting each other on the back saying "we sure showed them didn't we!"
posted by Annika Cicada at 3:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I was going to wait until after Sanders spoke tonight but I took my Bernie sign down earlier today to symbolically stand with his call for unity. And the more of Sanders' positions that Clinton adopts as president (except drone strikes), the happier I will become with this choice.
posted by Radiophonic Oddity at 3:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Radiophonic Oddity at 3:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
A FOAF on Facebook suggests that the DNC chose civil rights speakers to go on the first day when the Bernie fans would be loud and disruptive, to make the Bernie fans look bad.
God, if only the team who supports my values was so ingeniously ruthless. Like I fucking wish.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 3:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
God, if only the team who supports my values was so ingeniously ruthless. Like I fucking wish.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 3:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
"Democrats don't alienate, isolate, exclude, or demonize." Well...
posted by biogeo at 3:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by biogeo at 3:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Kevin de Leon from California is speaking movingly right now about progressive policies being linked to success and "this is how democrats govern".
posted by winna at 3:34 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 3:34 PM on July 25, 2016
> Whaaaaat?! That's completely ridiculous, clearly it was the Russians who planned that
OK, I looked again. He didn't name names. I took the DNC as being implied, but maybe it was the Kremlin.
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
OK, I looked again. He didn't name names. I took the DNC as being implied, but maybe it was the Kremlin.
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Stacey Abrams (GA) speaking now. "The strongest among us did not rise up alone."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
The BoBs probably finally got around to see what Twitter thought of them and are not STFU-ing
posted by sideshow at 3:35 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by sideshow at 3:35 PM on July 25, 2016
Did the RNC have any policy presentations at all? Kind of fascinating to me how much policy has featured at DNC vs. the RNC.
posted by chapps at 3:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by chapps at 3:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Was going to pull the same quote, roomthreeseventeen. Great line.
posted by biogeo at 3:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by biogeo at 3:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
de Leon's closer: "Our economy works better when we all work together. Friends, we're all democrats, and more importantly we're all Americans. I have a message for Donald Trump. (In Spanish, then English) We don't build walls here, we tear them down!"
posted by winna at 3:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by winna at 3:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Regardless of the chaos, it is so amazing to see speakers representing so many of the states. Living in a red state, it's easy to forget that we have our own Democratic leaders here because their voices are so often drowned out. Go Georgia and Texas and all of the rest of us!
posted by Salieri at 3:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 3:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Abrams: "The Democratic party is the party of civil rights, and human rights, of space flight and moonshots."
posted by biogeo at 3:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 3:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
There was a marked lack of boos at Stacey Abrams' Hillary endorsement.
Is it... is it possible that a night of high-minded rhetoric is changing minds? I have a friend who is a rhetoric professor, and he would be delighted to see such a thing.
posted by palindromic at 3:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Is it... is it possible that a night of high-minded rhetoric is changing minds? I have a friend who is a rhetoric professor, and he would be delighted to see such a thing.
posted by palindromic at 3:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Stacey Abrams is a powerful speaker.
posted by winna at 3:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by winna at 3:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I loved "I have a message for Donald Trump! [SPEAKS SPANISH AT TRUMP]"
(which admittedly my TV didn't display but I'm sure that was an oversight on C-SPAN's part)
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
(which admittedly my TV didn't display but I'm sure that was an oversight on C-SPAN's part)
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I'm interpreting this is as close to a disaster as we can get, the only thing that could make it worse is a protest vote of some kind (even though the RNC walkouts are getting half as much coverage as the DNC booing has drawn). Whenever I hesitate to self identify as a centrist, I'll think of the toddlers screaming on the floor of DNC and draw strength. Anything looks good in comparison to them right now.
I'm following coverage elsewhere and the BoB crowd is largely saying "See, this is what happens when Sanders goes against everything he stands for". What?! He got almost every single thing he wanted into the platform! I'm at a loss - if this is how we lose I will be inconsolable.
posted by the_querulous_night at 3:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I'm following coverage elsewhere and the BoB crowd is largely saying "See, this is what happens when Sanders goes against everything he stands for". What?! He got almost every single thing he wanted into the platform! I'm at a loss - if this is how we lose I will be inconsolable.
posted by the_querulous_night at 3:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Is the booing still going on? I just turned on a stream and don't really hear it but I'm not sure if that's just an issue with the sound my stream is picking up.
posted by Copronymus at 3:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Copronymus at 3:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Something has changed in the mood of the crowd. "First woman president of the United States" actually got a decent applause.
posted by biogeo at 3:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 3:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
the booing has pretty much ended
posted by Foci for Analysis at 3:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 3:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Sanders chose to try to harness the mob, and now it's out of his control.
Bernie has actually done a pretty great job of locking down his supporters for Clinton. From that link, 85% of them are in the tank for Clinton, compared with only 69% of Clinton's at the same point in '08. The people chanting over speeches are being unreasonable assholes but they are a tiny if vocal minority, and Sanders supporters have on the whole pivoted more completely to supporting Clinton than her supporters did for the Obama campaign.
posted by en forme de poire at 3:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [48 favorites]
Bernie has actually done a pretty great job of locking down his supporters for Clinton. From that link, 85% of them are in the tank for Clinton, compared with only 69% of Clinton's at the same point in '08. The people chanting over speeches are being unreasonable assholes but they are a tiny if vocal minority, and Sanders supporters have on the whole pivoted more completely to supporting Clinton than her supporters did for the Obama campaign.
posted by en forme de poire at 3:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [48 favorites]
I'm hearing weird chanting at intervals but I can't figure out what they're chanting.
posted by winna at 3:40 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 3:40 PM on July 25, 2016
"Meaningful change never happens all at once; you have to fight for it." - Mayor of Philadelphia
Good message. Revolution rarely accomplishes its stated goals.
posted by Superplin at 3:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Good message. Revolution rarely accomplishes its stated goals.
posted by Superplin at 3:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Jim Kenney, the mayor of Philly, is pointing out the history of the Know Nothings and anti-Irish prejudice! History nerds unite!
posted by winna at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by winna at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I really hope that the armchair leftists who support "direct action" and "Occupy _______" or "No Platform for _______!!!" realize that this is what it looks like when those "direct action" and "Occupy" tactics are used against you.
When you say that "We should be able to shout down the bad guys and occupy their halls of power to deny them voice and legitimacy" you don't mind, because the people you're fighting are powerful: monied elites, the patriarchy, whatever.
Yet, if you govern, and if you wish to govern, then you too will be powerful one day. One day, you and your lefty beliefs will be The Man. You should also assume that, eventually, somebody even more angry and even more righteous will do exactly the same thing to you.
I think it's safe to say that we all share -- at least a little bit -- of the blame for this. We all thought it was cool when a bunch of lefty types shouted down The Man, and we went along with it, because we assumed that we would always be the underdog, and that all the cool people would always agree with us.
posted by Tyrant King Porn Dragon at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
When you say that "We should be able to shout down the bad guys and occupy their halls of power to deny them voice and legitimacy" you don't mind, because the people you're fighting are powerful: monied elites, the patriarchy, whatever.
Yet, if you govern, and if you wish to govern, then you too will be powerful one day. One day, you and your lefty beliefs will be The Man. You should also assume that, eventually, somebody even more angry and even more righteous will do exactly the same thing to you.
I think it's safe to say that we all share -- at least a little bit -- of the blame for this. We all thought it was cool when a bunch of lefty types shouted down The Man, and we went along with it, because we assumed that we would always be the underdog, and that all the cool people would always agree with us.
posted by Tyrant King Porn Dragon at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
I just heard chants of "Bernie! Bernie! Bernie!" before that video about Trump started to play
posted by schadenfrau at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by schadenfrau at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Here's my best attempt at an optimistic reading of this debacle: These are people previously completely disaffected from the Democratic Party. Maybe now if they show up, yell, behave boorishly, wave embarrassing signs — but Hillary wins anyway, and they now identify in some way with the party process, perhaps some of them will begin to see politics as a meaningful venue.
Also, maybe the centrists (I'm one) feel some extra conviction. We piss on the democratic (and Democratic) process so much, maybe we needed to know what we stand for.
posted by argybarg at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Also, maybe the centrists (I'm one) feel some extra conviction. We piss on the democratic (and Democratic) process so much, maybe we needed to know what we stand for.
posted by argybarg at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Just checked out twitter and it calmed me down. Most people aren't watching this so w/e. Boo away kids.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016
Ok the crowd did not know what to do with that Trump clip at all.
posted by zachlipton at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 3:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm detecting an anti-zipcode motif among the speakers so far.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by paper chromatographologist at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The Sanders camp spent the entire primary campaign painting their opponents and irredeemably corrupt... The Clinton camp wasn't all angels, but there simply wasn't an equivalent faction.
Sangermaine, that's untrue and unfair. While there are definitely hardline Sanders supporters who exaggerated Clinton's warts, and there's no denying the annoying rudeness of the contingent on TV right now, there are also parts of the Clinton camp that insulted, denigrated and name-called Sanders supporters relentlessly from the moment he rose as a viable threat. Even here on MeFi, a relative bastion of civility that's usually pretty liberal, the vitriol for Sanders and his supporters is very, very well represented. And that's a left-wing candidate we're bashing.
In a party hurting like this, there's blame enough to share. If infighting is bad, it's bad for everyone who participates in it, right?
Short-term, it'll pass soon, I guess, since we have the least-liked Republican candidate in modern history coming up soon enough to help heal and unify things. But longer-term, it would be nice for everyone to stop infighting, not just "them", and it'd be best if the Democrats did not lose the *left*, don't you think?
Like, we could be better than all this finger-pointery.
posted by rokusan at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
Sangermaine, that's untrue and unfair. While there are definitely hardline Sanders supporters who exaggerated Clinton's warts, and there's no denying the annoying rudeness of the contingent on TV right now, there are also parts of the Clinton camp that insulted, denigrated and name-called Sanders supporters relentlessly from the moment he rose as a viable threat. Even here on MeFi, a relative bastion of civility that's usually pretty liberal, the vitriol for Sanders and his supporters is very, very well represented. And that's a left-wing candidate we're bashing.
In a party hurting like this, there's blame enough to share. If infighting is bad, it's bad for everyone who participates in it, right?
Short-term, it'll pass soon, I guess, since we have the least-liked Republican candidate in modern history coming up soon enough to help heal and unify things. But longer-term, it would be nice for everyone to stop infighting, not just "them", and it'd be best if the Democrats did not lose the *left*, don't you think?
Like, we could be better than all this finger-pointery.
posted by rokusan at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
Wow, that little clip of Trump was hilariously presented.
posted by biogeo at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by biogeo at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Fucking accelerationists...
posted by acb at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by acb at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
yeah no
posted by MCMikeNamara at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by MCMikeNamara at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016
To a certain segment of the Left, ego and ideological purity will always be more cherished than results. I suspect this is because this cohort is already so privileged and insulated from outcomes, that to them elections are sport, rather than survival.
So yeah, fuck those people and their lily white politics. Life is compromise.
posted by mrjohnmuller at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
So yeah, fuck those people and their lily white politics. Life is compromise.
posted by mrjohnmuller at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
Kenney's speech was a callout to the xenophobic shit the irish/polish/italian catholic communities of the city had to face when their ancestors settled here.
posted by cmfletcher at 3:43 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by cmfletcher at 3:43 PM on July 25, 2016
Regarding whether the boos are getting louder or quieter, I would like to point out that in a weird way, we probably can't know. I was listening to XM Radio on my way home, and even within the one audio feed, there were marked differences between different segments (jumping back and forth between host commentary and listening to speakers) as far as the level of the speakers vs. the audience.
This is not to say there is no booing, or there is only booing; this is just to say that in a way, the level of booing you're hearing is an artistic/editorial decision of whoever is running the feed you're listening to.
posted by tocts at 3:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
This is not to say there is no booing, or there is only booing; this is just to say that in a way, the level of booing you're hearing is an artistic/editorial decision of whoever is running the feed you're listening to.
posted by tocts at 3:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I really hope that the armchair leftists who support "direct action" and "Occupy _______" or "No Platform for _______!!!" realize that this is what it looks like when those "direct action" and "Occupy" tactics are used against you.
Yeah, and when you said it was okay to hit somebody in self-defense, I bet you didn't realize that somebody might hit you not in self-defense!
Decontextualizing things: basically always results in nonsense.
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Yeah, and when you said it was okay to hit somebody in self-defense, I bet you didn't realize that somebody might hit you not in self-defense!
Decontextualizing things: basically always results in nonsense.
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Gov Malloy's speech makes me miss the chanters.
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:43 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by The corpse in the library at 3:43 PM on July 25, 2016
Wow the cspan YouTube feed is really very far behind the live feed. I'm just now through the Trump clip and the very disappointing Bernie chanting.
posted by winna at 3:44 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 3:44 PM on July 25, 2016
The Clinton campaign has always included people with disabilities, broadly defined, as part of its civil rights agenda, and that's really wonderful to see.
posted by zachlipton at 3:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 3:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
The booing is pretty tame on my C-Span feed, too. It's fine for the meeting to be a bit raucus on the first day when Party members are fired up. Better that than everyone sitting quietly and cheering on cue.
posted by notyou at 3:44 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by notyou at 3:44 PM on July 25, 2016
Is it... is it possible that a night of high-minded rhetoric is changing minds?
Both the Sanders and Clinton campaigns have also been working together to stop the booing so that is also probably a factor. But I'm happy with the rhetoric that's been on display here, for sure.
posted by en forme de poire at 3:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Both the Sanders and Clinton campaigns have also been working together to stop the booing so that is also probably a factor. But I'm happy with the rhetoric that's been on display here, for sure.
posted by en forme de poire at 3:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"We must ignore the shouts and taunts of the bullies amongst us."
Bit of a double edge there aimed at both Trump and the booers on the floor.
posted by Justinian at 3:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Bit of a double edge there aimed at both Trump and the booers on the floor.
posted by Justinian at 3:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
> if you govern, and if you wish to govern, then you too will be powerful one day. One day, you and your lefty beliefs will be The Man. You should also assume that, eventually, somebody even more angry and even more righteous will do exactly the same thing to you.
Okay for reals though, you say this like it's a bad thing.
This would be wonderful. This would be a utopia. The world we all want to live in is a world where the powerful are always humbled by the weak, no matter who the powerful are.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 3:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
Okay for reals though, you say this like it's a bad thing.
This would be wonderful. This would be a utopia. The world we all want to live in is a world where the powerful are always humbled by the weak, no matter who the powerful are.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 3:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
To a certain segment of the Left, ego and ideological purity will always be more cherished than results. I suspect this is because this cohort is already so privileged and insulated from outcomes, that to them elections are sport, rather than survival.
This is true generally, I think, not just of the Left. I had the displeasure of watching the 2004 election results in a mixed-politics crowd, and it was very, very clear to me that a lot of the Republicans I was watching with were basically cheering for a team, not real political outcomes.
posted by biogeo at 3:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This is true generally, I think, not just of the Left. I had the displeasure of watching the 2004 election results in a mixed-politics crowd, and it was very, very clear to me that a lot of the Republicans I was watching with were basically cheering for a team, not real political outcomes.
posted by biogeo at 3:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Okay, the Trump thing was funny? Funny-ish?
kind of a weird move to lionize a soda tax that uses diet-based puritanism to grab a higher proportion of poor people's budgets than rich people's
ehhh, okay, this has been a HUGE thing in Philadelphia recently and I'm honestly happy to chat about it on MeMail if, like, you have a dying need to know the ins and outs (and I do not blame you if you don't), but while I was hinky about the diet-based puritanism, in theory the tax will occur at the manufacturer level, and how much that will trickle down to on-shelf pricing is yet to be determined. (I think. I don't want this to be a derail, though...)
posted by kalimac at 3:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
kind of a weird move to lionize a soda tax that uses diet-based puritanism to grab a higher proportion of poor people's budgets than rich people's
ehhh, okay, this has been a HUGE thing in Philadelphia recently and I'm honestly happy to chat about it on MeMail if, like, you have a dying need to know the ins and outs (and I do not blame you if you don't), but while I was hinky about the diet-based puritanism, in theory the tax will occur at the manufacturer level, and how much that will trickle down to on-shelf pricing is yet to be determined. (I think. I don't want this to be a derail, though...)
posted by kalimac at 3:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Real World/Husker Du
People talk about anarchy
And taking up a fight
Well I'm afraid of things like that
I lock my doors at night
I don't rape, and I don't pillage
Other peoples' lives
I don't practice what you preach
And I won't see through your eyes
You want to change the world
By breaking rules and laws
People don't do things like that
In the real world at all
You're not a cop, or a politician
You're a person too
You can sing any song you want
But you're still the same
I can't think of anything
That makes me more upset
People talk all this rhetoric
Forgive but not forget
I don't rape, and I don't pillage
Other peoples' lives
I don't practice what you preach
And I won't see through your eyes
posted by AJaffe at 3:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
People talk about anarchy
And taking up a fight
Well I'm afraid of things like that
I lock my doors at night
I don't rape, and I don't pillage
Other peoples' lives
I don't practice what you preach
And I won't see through your eyes
You want to change the world
By breaking rules and laws
People don't do things like that
In the real world at all
You're not a cop, or a politician
You're a person too
You can sing any song you want
But you're still the same
I can't think of anything
That makes me more upset
People talk all this rhetoric
Forgive but not forget
I don't rape, and I don't pillage
Other peoples' lives
I don't practice what you preach
And I won't see through your eyes
posted by AJaffe at 3:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
While there are definitely hardline Sanders supporters who exaggerated Clinton's warts, and there's no denying the annoying rudeness of the contingent on TV right now, there are also parts of the Clinton camp that insulted, denigrated and name-called Sanders supporters relentlessly from the moment he rose as a viable threat.
So, you can point out where Clinton supporters sent death threats to a state party chair and did their level best to get them fired from their day job, right? After all, you said both sides are the same.
posted by NoxAeternum at 3:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
So, you can point out where Clinton supporters sent death threats to a state party chair and did their level best to get them fired from their day job, right? After all, you said both sides are the same.
posted by NoxAeternum at 3:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
This is not to say there is no booing, or there is only booing; this is just to say that in a way, the level of booing you're hearing is an artistic/editorial decision of whoever is running the feed you're listening to.
That's true, but also: I can hear the cheering, I could hear the 'Bernie!' chant in the last break. Speakers are not being compelled to stop speaking because of the volume of chants/booing. I think it is genuinely occurring less frequently/loudly. I am watching the feed through the Democratic Convention site.
posted by palindromic at 3:47 PM on July 25, 2016
That's true, but also: I can hear the cheering, I could hear the 'Bernie!' chant in the last break. Speakers are not being compelled to stop speaking because of the volume of chants/booing. I think it is genuinely occurring less frequently/loudly. I am watching the feed through the Democratic Convention site.
posted by palindromic at 3:47 PM on July 25, 2016
As a resident of Connecticut, I'm not excited by this speech.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 3:47 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by JakeEXTREME at 3:47 PM on July 25, 2016
To a certain segment of the Left, ego and ideological purity will always be more cherished than results. I suspect this is because this cohort is already so privileged and insulated from outcomes, that to them elections are sport, rather than survival.
Charitably - I think that segment of the Left really does think they can win and usher in their utopia, and that the one and only way to achieve it is through ideological purity. I think those people are wrong as fuck, and I think their privilege plays into their wrongness, in the sense that they don't actually understand the possible consequences.
But I don't think they see it as sport. They're just operating under a completely different reality than I am. I don't know how to reach them, but I do take them at their word that they really believe this stuff.
posted by showbiz_liz at 3:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Charitably - I think that segment of the Left really does think they can win and usher in their utopia, and that the one and only way to achieve it is through ideological purity. I think those people are wrong as fuck, and I think their privilege plays into their wrongness, in the sense that they don't actually understand the possible consequences.
But I don't think they see it as sport. They're just operating under a completely different reality than I am. I don't know how to reach them, but I do take them at their word that they really believe this stuff.
posted by showbiz_liz at 3:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I really hope that the armchair leftists who support "direct action" and "Occupy _______" or "No Platform for _______!!!" realize that this is what it looks like when those "direct action" and "Occupy" tactics are used against you.
See now, that's just silly. It's like saying "don't boycott [evil regime] because what if someone boycotted a good regime!!!!" "Don't block streets for Black Lives Matter because what if the bad guys block a street!!!"
The point is to use a little bit of common sense in deploying big tactics rather than deploying them because you're pissed off and unwilling to think.
For every radical who doesn't like Hillary who is going to hold their nose and vote (yes, hello!), there should be a centrist who takes a moment to distinguish between stupid displays of pseudo-radicalism and the many, many principled acts of militancy that have made real change in this country.
posted by Frowner at 3:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
Yeah, and when you said it was okay to hit somebody in self-defense, I bet you didn't realize that somebody might hit you not in self-defense!
Decontextualizing things: basically always results in nonsense.
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:43 PM on July 25 [2 favorites +] [!]
Everyone - literally everyone - who has ever lashed out believes themselves to be acting in self-defense, or at least self-interest. Everybody believes in their own right to do whatever they want.
That's why smart pacifists want to outlaw war, rather than just "outlawing war except for noble and righteous war in which the good guys are fighting in self defense" -- because those words are meaningless.
posted by Tyrant King Porn Dragon at 3:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Decontextualizing things: basically always results in nonsense.
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:43 PM on July 25 [2 favorites +] [!]
Everyone - literally everyone - who has ever lashed out believes themselves to be acting in self-defense, or at least self-interest. Everybody believes in their own right to do whatever they want.
That's why smart pacifists want to outlaw war, rather than just "outlawing war except for noble and righteous war in which the good guys are fighting in self defense" -- because those words are meaningless.
posted by Tyrant King Porn Dragon at 3:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
In a party hurting like this, there's blame enough to share. If infighting is bad, it's bad for everyone who participates in it, right?
No. Hillary supporters were literally driven into secret groups because of harassment. I was one of them. The Bernie campaign and Bernie himself validated these tactics by frequenting the goddamn subreddit where a lot of it originated; they helped to normalize harassment of women in Democratic politics. Again, Bernie himself validated this bullshit behavior with his response to Nevada.
Do not play that "both sides" bullshit when one campaign had an actual culture of harassment.
posted by schadenfrau at 3:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [60 favorites]
No. Hillary supporters were literally driven into secret groups because of harassment. I was one of them. The Bernie campaign and Bernie himself validated these tactics by frequenting the goddamn subreddit where a lot of it originated; they helped to normalize harassment of women in Democratic politics. Again, Bernie himself validated this bullshit behavior with his response to Nevada.
Do not play that "both sides" bullshit when one campaign had an actual culture of harassment.
posted by schadenfrau at 3:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [60 favorites]
Now they have a thing to properly boo for.
posted by mrzarquon at 3:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mrzarquon at 3:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Ooooh, boos for Pence. I love it.
MORE OF THOSE BOOS.
posted by Salieri at 3:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
MORE OF THOSE BOOS.
posted by Salieri at 3:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
As a nation, we began by declaring that 'all men are created equal.' We now practically read it 'all men are created equal, except negroes.' When the Know-Nothings get control, it will read 'all men are created equal, except negroes, and foreigners, and Catholics.' When it comes to this I should prefer emigrating to some country where they make no pretense of loving liberty – to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be taken pure, and without the base alloy of hypocrisy.-- Abraham Lincoln
posted by kirkaracha at 3:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
Lincoln confirmed as communist infiltrator.
posted by rokusan at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Everyone - literally everyone - who has ever lashed out believes themselves to be acting in self-defense, or at least self-interest. Everybody believes in their own right to do whatever they want.
That's why smart pacifists want to outlaw war, rather than just "outlawing war except for noble and righteous war in which the good guys are fighting in self defense" -- because those words are meaningless.
Fortunately, as somebody who isn't a moral relativist, I believe we can evaluate individual situations instead of relying on half-baked Kantian nonsense.
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
That's why smart pacifists want to outlaw war, rather than just "outlawing war except for noble and righteous war in which the good guys are fighting in self defense" -- because those words are meaningless.
Fortunately, as somebody who isn't a moral relativist, I believe we can evaluate individual situations instead of relying on half-baked Kantian nonsense.
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Just dropped down the rabbit hole (859 comments already!) to say -- thank you, Metafilter! You made last week bearable, and I look forward to the fireworks as the DNC unfolds. The comments and the Twitch live broadcast meant that I could keep up without dominating the TV or arguing with family.
Let the games begin.
posted by TrishaU at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2016
Let the games begin.
posted by TrishaU at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2016
First of all, rokusan never said they were the same. Second of all, as the mods repeatedly remind us, it's not helpful to pull in shit that's happening off MeFi to the discussion we're having here. That being said, I could absolutely show you countless examples of threatening language and attempts to get Sanders supporters fired, by vocal Clinton supporters, as well as lots of racism, antisemitism, and other trash. But third of all, that would make this whole thread worse. Is there any reason you'd rather hold onto a fiction that this primary wasn't contentious on both sides than agree with a call to come together? Seems counterproductive to me.
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
See now, that's just silly. It's like saying "don't boycott [evil regime] because what if someone boycotted a good regime!!!!" "Don't block streets for Black Lives Matter because what if the bad guys block a street!!!"
what if Occupy, but too much
Lincoln confirmed as communist infiltrator.
You are Harry Turtledove and I claim my $5.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
what if Occupy, but too much
Lincoln confirmed as communist infiltrator.
You are Harry Turtledove and I claim my $5.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The Republicans rigged the system and by god we learned a thing or two from them!
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 3:52 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 3:52 PM on July 25, 2016
See now, that's just silly. It's like saying "don't boycott [evil regime] because what if someone boycotted a good regime!!!!" "Don't block streets for Black Lives Matter because what if the bad guys block a street!!!"
Actually, it makes tons of sense to carefully consider one's tactics.
The point here is that being on the right side of something does not, in itself, sanctify tactics. I feel like you probably believe - at least to some extent - that the ends justify the means, so long as the "end" is Fully Automated Luxury Communism or whatever. That's your choice.
I'm just pointing out that once you break out the "Direct Action" and (eventually) the molotov cocktails, you are no longer in control of what is happening. You break out the "direct action" in the hopes that it empowers the people, but in reality, you have no idea who it's going to empower.
It might empower somebody you don't want to empower.
posted by Tyrant King Porn Dragon at 3:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Actually, it makes tons of sense to carefully consider one's tactics.
The point here is that being on the right side of something does not, in itself, sanctify tactics. I feel like you probably believe - at least to some extent - that the ends justify the means, so long as the "end" is Fully Automated Luxury Communism or whatever. That's your choice.
I'm just pointing out that once you break out the "Direct Action" and (eventually) the molotov cocktails, you are no longer in control of what is happening. You break out the "direct action" in the hopes that it empowers the people, but in reality, you have no idea who it's going to empower.
It might empower somebody you don't want to empower.
posted by Tyrant King Porn Dragon at 3:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Seriously starting to wonder if the Bernie chanters are Republican plants, not actual Dems
posted by Hermione Granger at 3:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 3:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
like okay for reals it's a good thing, always, when the powerful are humbled by the weak, and a bad thing, always, when the weak are humiliated by the powerful.
I maintain a respectful silence about the merits and demerits of Hillary Clinton as a candidate. She has many of both. She is the Democratic Party nominee. Because math and Arrow's Theorum and first past the post, the next president is going to be either the Democratic Party nominee or the Republican Party nominee. I hope Hillary Clinton becomes president.
I also think a raucous convention is a good thing. A democratic process that's not raucous probably isn't democratic, either. We saw in Cleveland what it looks like when a party tries to squelch raucous expressions of dissent. Hopefully in Philadelphia we'll see a party embracing raucous dissent, and maybe even (who knows!) building a space for a genuine loyal opposition to form.
note: "in a basement, wrapped in bubble wrap" is not where you build space for a loyal opposition, at least not if you're interested in it being loyal.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
I maintain a respectful silence about the merits and demerits of Hillary Clinton as a candidate. She has many of both. She is the Democratic Party nominee. Because math and Arrow's Theorum and first past the post, the next president is going to be either the Democratic Party nominee or the Republican Party nominee. I hope Hillary Clinton becomes president.
I also think a raucous convention is a good thing. A democratic process that's not raucous probably isn't democratic, either. We saw in Cleveland what it looks like when a party tries to squelch raucous expressions of dissent. Hopefully in Philadelphia we'll see a party embracing raucous dissent, and maybe even (who knows!) building a space for a genuine loyal opposition to form.
note: "in a basement, wrapped in bubble wrap" is not where you build space for a loyal opposition, at least not if you're interested in it being loyal.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
As a resident of Connecticut, I'm not excited by this speech.
Yeah, but we're not exactly known for our excitability, not unless the Dunkin Donuts line is moving too slow.
posted by Kinbote at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Yeah, but we're not exactly known for our excitability, not unless the Dunkin Donuts line is moving too slow.
posted by Kinbote at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Seriously starting to wonder if the Bernie chanters are Republican plants, not actual Dems
That's not a helpful line of thinking.
posted by showbiz_liz at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
That's not a helpful line of thinking.
posted by showbiz_liz at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Hey, I'm in Michigan, I can definitely say that I have opinions about the importance of electing even problematic Democratic gubernatorial candidates over their seemingly moderate Republican competitors!
posted by palindromic at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Here's the website they just advertised to see who is each state's governor and when the next election is.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Seriously starting to wonder if the Bernie chanters are Republican plants, not actual Dems
always these conspiracies...
posted by Foci for Analysis at 3:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
always these conspiracies...
posted by Foci for Analysis at 3:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
> Yeah, but we're not exactly known for our excitability, not unless the Dunkin Donuts line is moving too slow.
Yeah, I mean have you seen i-95?
(We are known for our cunning, wanna buy a nutmeg?)
posted by mrzarquon at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Yeah, I mean have you seen i-95?
(We are known for our cunning, wanna buy a nutmeg?)
posted by mrzarquon at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Former Sanders Spox Goes Off On Twitter: 'NO ONE STOLE THIS ELECTION!': "But let me be clear - NO ONE STOLE THIS ELECTION! Team Sanders we did AMAZING WORK. But we lost. It's a hard reality for some."
posted by zachlipton at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Leah Daughtry: "You don't have to be just like me, to be just like me."
posted by biogeo at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by biogeo at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm just pointing out that once you break out the "Direct Action" and (eventually) the molotov cocktails, you are no longer in control of what is happening. You break out the "direct action" in the hopes that it empowers the people, but in reality, you have no idea who it's going to empower.
are you seriously equating some booing with people throwing Molotov cocktails.
posted by winna at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
are you seriously equating some booing with people throwing Molotov cocktails.
posted by winna at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Dude even our B and C list speakers are incredible
posted by schadenfrau at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
My brother just texted me that they've bumped Booker from the network telecast so that Sanders can speak to the public at 10p.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Seriously starting to wonder if the Bernie chanters are Republican plants, not actual Dems
This is the same 'false flag' hogwash that the right desperately flogs every time they're caught being exactly as shitty as they actually are. Don't fall in that hole.
posted by FatherDagon at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
This is the same 'false flag' hogwash that the right desperately flogs every time they're caught being exactly as shitty as they actually are. Don't fall in that hole.
posted by FatherDagon at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Another former Bernie supporter here. This booing shit disgusts me... I don't even know what to do I'm so mad, things rumbling around my head like LISTEN UP FOLKS I'VE GOT A LITTER OF KITTENS HERE AND I WILL DECLAW EVERYONE OF THEM CLAW BY CLAW UNTIL YOU SHUT UP BLHARRNTOHEUSTNH
ended up donating to Hillary, $27, SAIT.
posted by localhuman at 3:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
ended up donating to Hillary, $27, SAIT.
posted by localhuman at 3:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
I'm just pointing out that once you break out the "Direct Action" and (eventually) the molotov cocktails, you are no longer in control of what is happening. You break out the "direct action" in the hopes that it empowers the people, but in reality, you have no idea who it's going to empower.
"Direct action" is not a synonym for "break shit and yell at people", no matter how many people with a political analysis that would embarrass a grasshopper use it that way.
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
"Direct action" is not a synonym for "break shit and yell at people", no matter how many people with a political analysis that would embarrass a grasshopper use it that way.
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
I am very excited to learn about Unrig The Map
posted by mrzarquon at 3:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 3:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"Our founding fathers and mothers..." I'm crying.
posted by dinofuzz at 3:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by dinofuzz at 3:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I hope Bernie comes out, gets some real cheers and starts the speech with "Do you think we have a chance of our ideas becoming reality with that ass clown?"
His writers are free to substitute ass clown with any noun of their choice.
posted by cmfletcher at 3:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
His writers are free to substitute ass clown with any noun of their choice.
posted by cmfletcher at 3:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Lots of love for Tommy Tutone.
posted by kirkaracha at 3:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 3:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"Democrats don't alienate, isolate, exclude, or demonize."
Then again, Bernie did bring new voters to the Democratic Primaries and Caucuses. Who knew that many of the people he'd bring in were just fine with alienating, isolating, excluding and demonizing...
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Then again, Bernie did bring new voters to the Democratic Primaries and Caucuses. Who knew that many of the people he'd bring in were just fine with alienating, isolating, excluding and demonizing...
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Is there any reason you'd rather hold onto a fiction that this primary wasn't contentious on both sides than agree with a call to come together? Seems counterproductive to me.
It's not that we should pretend that this primary wasn't contentious on both sides. Of course it was.
It's that only one side engaged and even encouraged conspiracies and persecution paranoia to the point that there is a significant faction of that side that is absolutely convinced that the election was stolen from them, that every victory of the other side was a result of fraud, and that the other candidate is the living embodiment of corruption. They've whipped themselves into a blind fury, and what we're seeing now is just part of that.
That's why this South Park-ish "both sides were bad" fiction needs to be dispelled. Rather than admitting that maybe they shouldn't have let their people engage in that kind of conspiracy-mongering and frenzy, now it's "Hey guys, let's not play the blame game, we're all at fault."
You want to talk about healing the "rift"? What do we do with all these people who the Sanders campaign has allowed to convince themselves that their loss was really a victory and everything is rigged against them?
posted by Sangermaine at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
It's not that we should pretend that this primary wasn't contentious on both sides. Of course it was.
It's that only one side engaged and even encouraged conspiracies and persecution paranoia to the point that there is a significant faction of that side that is absolutely convinced that the election was stolen from them, that every victory of the other side was a result of fraud, and that the other candidate is the living embodiment of corruption. They've whipped themselves into a blind fury, and what we're seeing now is just part of that.
That's why this South Park-ish "both sides were bad" fiction needs to be dispelled. Rather than admitting that maybe they shouldn't have let their people engage in that kind of conspiracy-mongering and frenzy, now it's "Hey guys, let's not play the blame game, we're all at fault."
You want to talk about healing the "rift"? What do we do with all these people who the Sanders campaign has allowed to convince themselves that their loss was really a victory and everything is rigged against them?
posted by Sangermaine at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Booo, they bumped Booker? Is he still speaking tonight? Is there an updated schedule anywhere?
posted by yasaman at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by yasaman at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016
~Dance Break~
867-5309
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
867-5309
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Trying to think of a joke about 867-5309 and number of comments but I gotta be honest I'm kinda on fumes at this point already.
posted by cortex at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by cortex at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
867-5309: gawd that awful crappy fuzz-tone pedal, dude can't you HEAR yourself?
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
It's very impressive how the speakers are all thematically consistent in speaking to "we are all stronger together".
posted by winna at 3:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 3:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I don't buy soda, actually! But the low-income parents of the public-school kindergarteners I used to teach in West Philly would frequently buy soda pop for their families.
Maybe they did that because it was cheaper than water, and now that water is cheaper than soda, they won't. I literally don't know if that is true, but that seems to be the intent, yeah?
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 3:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Maybe they did that because it was cheaper than water, and now that water is cheaper than soda, they won't. I literally don't know if that is true, but that seems to be the intent, yeah?
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 3:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Seriously starting to wonder if the Bernie chanters are Republican plants, not actual Dems
That's the path to the dark side. People can disagree with you, even passionately, and even dislike your candidate without being some kind of nefarious plants. Let's not, um, demonize or exclude them.
They're not the devil. They're Democrats who dislike the candidate and believe she cheated and/or was installed before the primary process even began. Right or wrong, they're still lefty Democrats that she could probably use on-side, sooner or later. Even if she doesn't need them this election, the Democrats could definitely use them in the future.
posted by rokusan at 3:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
That's the path to the dark side. People can disagree with you, even passionately, and even dislike your candidate without being some kind of nefarious plants. Let's not, um, demonize or exclude them.
They're not the devil. They're Democrats who dislike the candidate and believe she cheated and/or was installed before the primary process even began. Right or wrong, they're still lefty Democrats that she could probably use on-side, sooner or later. Even if she doesn't need them this election, the Democrats could definitely use them in the future.
posted by rokusan at 3:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Isn't it true that the taxes on cigarettes and alcohol also disproportionately penalize poorer people?
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
8675309: Number of minutes of sleep the mods are going to need after this election season.
posted by biogeo at 4:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 4:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
867-5309... Now Jenny is a woman candidate we can ALL support...
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I'm not a centrist, I'm a leftist. But what this year's displays of petulant, performative radicalism have produced, in me, is a personal conviction that the only way we will achieve our goals is through compromise, stealth and hard-headed pragmatism. And it's people like me who are political campaigners for the long haul, not the next few months. It's people like me, people like many of us here, who will shape progressive politics for the next 30 or 40 years. It seems to me that the best strategy is to ally with moderates, play the long game and work for evolutionary change.
TL;DR, this petulant bullshit has exactly the opposite effect to that intended.
posted by howfar at 4:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [56 favorites]
TL;DR, this petulant bullshit has exactly the opposite effect to that intended.
posted by howfar at 4:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [56 favorites]
Hopefully people are willing to recognize that BoBs do not speak for the Progressive movement and actually seem pretty reactionary tbh.
Still shit like this just reminds me that White Male privilege is a fucking disease. It's treatable, generally not fatal but it's a disease nonetheless.
posted by vuron at 4:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Still shit like this just reminds me that White Male privilege is a fucking disease. It's treatable, generally not fatal but it's a disease nonetheless.
posted by vuron at 4:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Trying to think of a joke about 867-5309 and number of comments
WE HAVE A GOAL TO MEET NOW, PEOPLE
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
WE HAVE A GOAL TO MEET NOW, PEOPLE
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
rokusan, fine. I would be all in favor of a rowdy convention with people from both sides clamoring for their issues. But what if, as it seems clear, there is a certain number of people who are there to shut this down?
posted by argybarg at 4:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 4:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I can't watch where I am, but I hope the Texas contingent is wearing the mandated cowboy hats. We can't let the RNC Texans outshine us, ya'll.
posted by emjaybee at 4:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by emjaybee at 4:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I think Podesta meant to say erratic but it definitely sounds like he just called Trump "erotic."
posted by everybody had matching towels at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by everybody had matching towels at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Nice lauding of Sanders by Clinton's campaign manager. Very gracious and sincere.
posted by Superplin at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Superplin at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2016
Isn't it true that the taxes on cigarettes and alcohol also disproportionately penalize poorer people?
It's pretty obvious that if you have less money, you will be affected more by sales tax. On the other hand, in Canada, at least, lower-income families receive sales-tax rebate cheques. So they can buy all the booze, cigs and other luxuries they want without paying extra tax.
I say this as someone who has a monthly booze budget in order to be able to save money.
posted by My Dad at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2016
It's pretty obvious that if you have less money, you will be affected more by sales tax. On the other hand, in Canada, at least, lower-income families receive sales-tax rebate cheques. So they can buy all the booze, cigs and other luxuries they want without paying extra tax.
I say this as someone who has a monthly booze budget in order to be able to save money.
posted by My Dad at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2016
Now those parents have a financial incentive to buy milk or water instead.
Sweet, sweet paternalism!
posted by Pope Guilty at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Sweet, sweet paternalism!
posted by Pope Guilty at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Soda Buying As Revolutionary Praxis
posted by ethansr at 4:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by ethansr at 4:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
In the US, "sin taxes" are absolutely crazy regressive and I would hope most liberals and progressives wouldn't support them...
posted by thefoxgod at 4:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by thefoxgod at 4:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Still shit like this just reminds me that White Male privilege is a fucking disease. It's treatable, generally not fatal but it's a disease nonetheless.
Oh, it's frequently fatal alright, just not to the carriers.
posted by OmieWise at 4:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Oh, it's frequently fatal alright, just not to the carriers.
posted by OmieWise at 4:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Still livid about shouting down the black man trying to talk about BLM. I don't think I can take this, even metafiltered. Checking out for now, see y'all next thread.
posted by tobascodagama at 4:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 4:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
The little Trump quote snippets are fun but I'm not sure they're appropriate?
posted by winna at 4:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 4:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Somebody needs to explain that "the boo is an American sign of respect.".
(Well, it is Philadelphia.)
That's kinda true. Before Philly got a MLS team, soccer fans in Philly would charter busses to DC and NYC to watch the games there and boo both sides.
posted by peeedro at 4:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
(Well, it is Philadelphia.)
That's kinda true. Before Philly got a MLS team, soccer fans in Philly would charter busses to DC and NYC to watch the games there and boo both sides.
posted by peeedro at 4:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Isn't it true that the taxes on cigarettes and alcohol also disproportionately penalize poorer people?
But doesn't the consumption of those goods also disproportionately affect poor people as well?
I mean, if this tax could be extended to frappucinos, hand churned gelato, and tiramisu, I would be all for it as well.
posted by FJT at 4:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
But doesn't the consumption of those goods also disproportionately affect poor people as well?
I mean, if this tax could be extended to frappucinos, hand churned gelato, and tiramisu, I would be all for it as well.
posted by FJT at 4:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I'm still angry about the treatment of Elijah Cummings by Sanders delegates when he spoke. Ironically, he voted against fast-tracking the TPP, but they blatantly disrespected him as he talked about his family and how black lives matter (they fucking matter! don't you dare talk over him).
posted by ilicet at 4:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by ilicet at 4:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Still shit like this just reminds me that White Male privilege is a fucking disease. It's treatable, generally not fatal but it's a disease nonetheless.
Oh, it's frequently fatal alright, just not to the carriers.
Well, the Privileged males still do die earlier than females...
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:09 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh, it's frequently fatal alright, just not to the carriers.
Well, the Privileged males still do die earlier than females...
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:09 PM on July 25, 2016
Deep breaths everyone. Get in formation.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 4:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 4:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Well, argybarg, the only counter-suggestion I'm hearing is to shut those people down. You can see the problem, I hope.
It's sort of the worst of the primary campaign all over again: competing conspiracy theories, insults and various versions of "those people aren't the REAL Democrats/liberals." And of course both camps spinning whatever minor nonsense they hear into a grave misdeed.
Did nobody plan any healing-type moves, here? A few speakers noting a few small ways in which the Sanders campaign moved the platform left would go a long way. It could even lead into some sort of (gasp) cooperation! Insulting an angry crowd is not a good strategy, and couldn't they have seen it coming?
posted by rokusan at 4:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
It's sort of the worst of the primary campaign all over again: competing conspiracy theories, insults and various versions of "those people aren't the REAL Democrats/liberals." And of course both camps spinning whatever minor nonsense they hear into a grave misdeed.
Did nobody plan any healing-type moves, here? A few speakers noting a few small ways in which the Sanders campaign moved the platform left would go a long way. It could even lead into some sort of (gasp) cooperation! Insulting an angry crowd is not a good strategy, and couldn't they have seen it coming?
posted by rokusan at 4:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Seriously, the smug condescension (and the desire by partisans to expand the assholes' behavior as if it represents everyone) needs to stop. It's everywhere in this thread and MeFi is better than this. I would have thought it'd be out of our system by now.
I agree with all of you about what's going on and the eventual necessary outcome. I'm just tired of being called an asshole for supporting a candidate (and I didn't even end up voting for him in the end!). But you're not helping the whole unity thing. I'm sure it makes some of you feel good about yourselves, but that says more about you than anything else. If you have nothing to add to the discussion beyond "They sure suck! Don't they suck?" just don't say anything.
posted by downtohisturtles at 4:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
I agree with all of you about what's going on and the eventual necessary outcome. I'm just tired of being called an asshole for supporting a candidate (and I didn't even end up voting for him in the end!). But you're not helping the whole unity thing. I'm sure it makes some of you feel good about yourselves, but that says more about you than anything else. If you have nothing to add to the discussion beyond "They sure suck! Don't they suck?" just don't say anything.
posted by downtohisturtles at 4:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
I think Podesta meant to say erratic but it definitely sounds like he just called Trump "erotic."
The mental image caused by what I thought was Podesta referring to Trump as "erotic and divisive" just made me want to crawl under my couch and die.
posted by triggerfinger at 4:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The mental image caused by what I thought was Podesta referring to Trump as "erotic and divisive" just made me want to crawl under my couch and die.
posted by triggerfinger at 4:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm still angry about the treatment of Elijah Cummings by Sanders delegates when he spoke.
Yeah, that was unforgivable. And some of these assholes are still booing.
posted by biogeo at 4:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah, that was unforgivable. And some of these assholes are still booing.
posted by biogeo at 4:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Did nobody plan any healing-type moves, here?
Surely at least somebody there must have a Clefairy or something, right?
posted by thefoxgod at 4:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Surely at least somebody there must have a Clefairy or something, right?
posted by thefoxgod at 4:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
ah, sweet, they are sisters?!
posted by Foci for Analysis at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I know the restrooms at the convention are officially Gender Neutral, but is there away the "No TPP" chanters can all be directed to the restrooms with No TP?
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
See now, that's just silly. It's like saying "don't boycott [evil regime] because what if someone boycotted a good regime!!!!" "Don't block streets for Black Lives Matter because what if the bad guys block a street!!!"
I do think there's a difference, though. Many liberal ideas are ones which require a higher level of organization and cooperation than right-wing ideas. To have universal healthcare, you need to convince everyone to participate, and you need a complicated, functioning system. "Pay for yourself and nevermind the poor" doesn't. Likewise, gun control and just policing requires organization whereas "everyone just carries guns everywhere" doesn't. Mass transit, welfare, etc...
If it's possible for any organization (whether a political party or a city) to be paralyzed by a relatively small number of dissenters, it doesn't just advance the cause of the dissenters-- it also advances the cause of those who believe that the organizations themselves are illegitimate, and empowers those who want to tear down organizations entirely, or those who would build organizations that do not respond to criticism at all.
posted by alexei at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I do think there's a difference, though. Many liberal ideas are ones which require a higher level of organization and cooperation than right-wing ideas. To have universal healthcare, you need to convince everyone to participate, and you need a complicated, functioning system. "Pay for yourself and nevermind the poor" doesn't. Likewise, gun control and just policing requires organization whereas "everyone just carries guns everywhere" doesn't. Mass transit, welfare, etc...
If it's possible for any organization (whether a political party or a city) to be paralyzed by a relatively small number of dissenters, it doesn't just advance the cause of the dissenters-- it also advances the cause of those who believe that the organizations themselves are illegitimate, and empowers those who want to tear down organizations entirely, or those who would build organizations that do not respond to criticism at all.
posted by alexei at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Really tight shot on the speaker as her sister came in stage left, and I was like IS SHE GONNA GET SPEECHBOMBED
posted by cortex at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by cortex at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Sorry for that THE LEFT IS DOOMED outburst earlier. We may be fine.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Well, the Privileged males still do die earlier than females...
Front of the line again!
posted by rokusan at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Front of the line again!
posted by rokusan at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
oh, that was a wonderful line just now about the parents sending two daughters to Congress.
posted by acidic at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by acidic at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Help. I just got through checking in with some of...well...the only two liberal friends I have in town, and they uh are going third party and the conversation got weird and I'm supposed to go hang out with them Friday night and I think they're Busters and this is so not cool existential crisis help.
posted by sara is disenchanted at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by sara is disenchanted at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Maybe don't take it personally. I actually did vote for Bernie and feel no guilt because the behavior of these assholes is not my responsibility. I mean even Bernie is unhappy with their behavior.
posted by Tarumba at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
You want to talk about healing the "rift"? What do we do with all these people who the Sanders campaign has allowed to convince themselves that their loss was really a victory and everything is rigged against them?
What did we do with the PUMAs in 2008? I don't know what the party did, but I think most of us laughed them off and let them waste their energy whining irrelevantly as their numbers dwindled and threw our enthusiastic support behind the nominee, right? Let's do that again. They're fucking idiots, and they're also a tiny number of people who get a disproportionate amount of coverage and concern. By all means get Sanders and the people in his operation to tell people that it wasn't rigged, and encourage them to be respectful and support Clinton, as they have been doing. But if that can't stop absolutely every crank on Twitter or at the convention from squealing about some kind of nonsense fantasy, so what? There's a bunch of Republicans crying about how Trump is a secret Clintonite plant, you don't see them losing sleep over it.
There are a lot of people on both sides trying to come together and it doesn't help that process when the people on the winning side are like "No! People on Reddit who like your candidate are saying crazy shit so we can't reconcile yet!"
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 4:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
What did we do with the PUMAs in 2008? I don't know what the party did, but I think most of us laughed them off and let them waste their energy whining irrelevantly as their numbers dwindled and threw our enthusiastic support behind the nominee, right? Let's do that again. They're fucking idiots, and they're also a tiny number of people who get a disproportionate amount of coverage and concern. By all means get Sanders and the people in his operation to tell people that it wasn't rigged, and encourage them to be respectful and support Clinton, as they have been doing. But if that can't stop absolutely every crank on Twitter or at the convention from squealing about some kind of nonsense fantasy, so what? There's a bunch of Republicans crying about how Trump is a secret Clintonite plant, you don't see them losing sleep over it.
There are a lot of people on both sides trying to come together and it doesn't help that process when the people on the winning side are like "No! People on Reddit who like your candidate are saying crazy shit so we can't reconcile yet!"
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 4:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
So am I. I just don't think people should treat other people like garbage. From any persepective.
posted by downtohisturtles at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by downtohisturtles at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2016
People, please. Stop calling names. I am an enthusiastic Hillary supporter. And I think it's okay for Sanders supporters to be upset today. Let them express themselves. It's Democracy. We were totally fine with it when it was the #NeverTrumpers.
Hopefully Sanders will be able to reach them tonight and we can all move on. Together.
posted by cooker girl at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
Hopefully Sanders will be able to reach them tonight and we can all move on. Together.
posted by cooker girl at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
I have a "Feel the Bern" magnet on my car but I may plaster a picture of Hillary right in the middle so people can see I've moved on.
posted by Biblio at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by Biblio at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Go Rep. Sanchez!
posted by persona au gratin at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2016
I wish they weren't doing those little Trump videos. I understand the reasoning behind them, but I saw enough of him at his own convention. The attack ads can wait til after the convention.
The message of being stronger together that comes up throughout these speeches is great, and a wonderful contrast to what was presented last week.
posted by airish at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The message of being stronger together that comes up throughout these speeches is great, and a wonderful contrast to what was presented last week.
posted by airish at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The PUMAs didn't attempt a heckler's veto of the 2008 DNC.
posted by Pope Guilty at 4:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by Pope Guilty at 4:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
We were totally fine with it when it was the #NeverTrumpers.
Yeah, cause we want the Republicans to lose. It wasn't, like, a universal moral stance.
posted by showbiz_liz at 4:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Yeah, cause we want the Republicans to lose. It wasn't, like, a universal moral stance.
posted by showbiz_liz at 4:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Clark DeLeon, former feature columnist for the Philadelphia Inquirer, once theorized that the Philadelphia Boo was a blending of two facets of Philly culture -- the Quaker upbringing, dedicated to equality and humility, and the blue-collar working class WHO ARE JUST AS GOOD AS THAT MILLION DOLLAR BUM OUT DERE, YA HEAR? It blends itself into some crossed signals -- "Yo, pal, thou knowest what thou speakest of, asshole. So fuck thee."
That said, I am willing to theorize that the DNC, being a 50-state organization open to credentialed guests only, is not as much of a pure Philadelphia crowd as, say, the Iggles stinkin' up the Linc.
posted by delfin at 4:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
That said, I am willing to theorize that the DNC, being a 50-state organization open to credentialed guests only, is not as much of a pure Philadelphia crowd as, say, the Iggles stinkin' up the Linc.
posted by delfin at 4:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
In the US, "sin taxes" are absolutely crazy regressive and I would hope most liberals and progressives wouldn't support them...
Cigarette taxes seem to have made a significant dent in smoking rates, which almost certainly has saved (and/or will save) a lot of people from unnecessary suffering and premature death. And they were crazy regressive. It's a tough question.
posted by straight at 4:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Cigarette taxes seem to have made a significant dent in smoking rates, which almost certainly has saved (and/or will save) a lot of people from unnecessary suffering and premature death. And they were crazy regressive. It's a tough question.
posted by straight at 4:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Very inspiring!
posted by persona au gratin at 4:16 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 4:16 PM on July 25, 2016
I have a friend who is swearing he will not vote, and though I have made it a point to tell him that I thought better of him as a citizen, we still mostly talk about comics and music and stuff. Every so often, politics comes up in conversation, as it does, so I shoot him my best side-eye. It is my compromise position.
posted by palindromic at 4:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by palindromic at 4:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"Hillary Clinton is badass and ready to lead."
I like this woman.
posted by Superplin at 4:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I like this woman.
posted by Superplin at 4:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I'm not feeling smug, I'm feeling terrified. In any other year, if be much more sanguine but I'm sorry if I actually literally think the choice here is Clinton or economic collapse and/or nuclear war, it's kinda of coloring this whole experience for me.
(In case I need to show my credentials: I donated to Bernie the day he announced his candidacy and voted for him in the primary.)
posted by soren_lorensen at 4:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
(In case I need to show my credentials: I donated to Bernie the day he announced his candidacy and voted for him in the primary.)
posted by soren_lorensen at 4:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Mart-eeeeee
posted by waitingtoderail at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by waitingtoderail at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh hey it's the voice of that guy I hear every time I walk on the travelators telling me how good Boston is when I'm at Boston Logan!
posted by Talez at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Talez at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Mahty Walsh!
posted by dersins at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dersins at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
MAAAHHHHHTY!
posted by cooker girl at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
He sounds like a real southie boy. Go Marty.
posted by dis_integration at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by dis_integration at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Bold. Boston Mayor Marty Walsh starting out with "I'm Marty Walsh and I'm an alcoholic." Talking about hitting rock bottom and how the labor community got him help.
posted by zachlipton at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Loved the sisters, but that "That's why we are the envy of the world" stuff belongs on Republican lie-reels.
Ladies, sorry, but we're really not. Not anymore, at least.
posted by rokusan at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Ladies, sorry, but we're really not. Not anymore, at least.
posted by rokusan at 4:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Man, this guy is really making clear that about every movie Boston accent is total garbage.
posted by sideshow at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by sideshow at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
rokusan: Did nobody plan any healing-type moves, here? A few speakers noting a few small ways in which the Sanders campaign moved the platform left would go a long way. It could even lead into some sort of (gasp) cooperation! Insulting an angry crowd is not a good strategy, and couldn't they have seen it coming?
I've heard a number of speakers specifically state that Sanders' campaign had made valuable contributions to the party and the platform, including one Sanders delegate who spoke at some length. I'm not sure what more they could do.
posted by Superplin at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I've heard a number of speakers specifically state that Sanders' campaign had made valuable contributions to the party and the platform, including one Sanders delegate who spoke at some length. I'm not sure what more they could do.
posted by Superplin at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
This isn't "Those people" these are my people. I am a white beardo with a good job who's out here on twitter for full socialism on my twitter account. I'm embarrassed, because this makes me look bad. I regret voting for Bernie. And yes, I want them to be quiet. Because this disruption isn't doing anything positive for the changes I want. So I will continue to pray that they stop disrupting. They can continue to post dank memes and do lit podcasts.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
I wish they weren't doing those little Trump videos.
Agreed! I honestly think it would be best for them to awknowledge the orange menace as little as possible. Keep the message positive and progressive, rather than climing down into the mud to pigwrestle.
posted by mrjohnmuller at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016
Agreed! I honestly think it would be best for them to awknowledge the orange menace as little as possible. Keep the message positive and progressive, rather than climing down into the mud to pigwrestle.
posted by mrjohnmuller at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016
This guy's Boston accent has a Boston accent. I love it.
I'm getting a kick out of all the regional accents, in fact. (Insert soppy "yay America!" comment here.)
posted by Salieri at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I'm getting a kick out of all the regional accents, in fact. (Insert soppy "yay America!" comment here.)
posted by Salieri at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I seriously think Marty Walsh might be persuasive to some of my persistent Sanders-supporting friends. They know from blue collar labor.
posted by palindromic at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 4:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I just got an EBS flash flood warning in my area. I'm 2 miles upriver from the convention.
posted by cmfletcher at 4:19 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by cmfletcher at 4:19 PM on July 25, 2016
I actually literally think the choice here is Clinton or economic collapse and/or nuclear war
I'm close to that, but I think the choice this election might better be described as between nuclear and expanded conventional war. (We're getting another collapse either way.)
posted by rokusan at 4:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'm close to that, but I think the choice this election might better be described as between nuclear and expanded conventional war. (We're getting another collapse either way.)
posted by rokusan at 4:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I hope the Bahstahn accent never goes extinct. I love it.
posted by biogeo at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by biogeo at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2016
"...and i am an alcoholic"
that's one helluva opening
posted by Foci for Analysis at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
that's one helluva opening
posted by Foci for Analysis at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Boston airport voice has a face!
posted by rokusan at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by rokusan at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
My thing with soda tax is that at somepoint you have to make sure impoverished Americans are getting enough calories. Yeah, there are many of us who do have way more and it doesn't take much income to get way more calories than you need but when the 2 liter bottle of pop is helping a kid meet target weight abs making up for the lack of calories from other sources we have a problem. And it's a problem that should be answered by tax free food, but America is just not there is many places.
posted by AlexiaSky at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by AlexiaSky at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It was never polled that I can find, but I think the votes for Bernie were divided between people who actually LIKED Bernie and those who HATED Hillary but had nobody else to vote for. No idea the relative numbers, but I'll bet many of the Hillary Haters are NOT very leftist or in any way politically aligned with Bernie, and many of them are so single-issued on "Economic Justice" that Donald's bigotry goes straight over their heads... (The big banks hate Donald! Yes, because he's such a crook they can't trust him. But I digress.)
The Burners, Busters and Booers are obviously mostly from that part of Sanders' supporters.
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The Burners, Busters and Booers are obviously mostly from that part of Sanders' supporters.
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yeah, cause we want the Republicans to lose. It wasn't, like, a universal moral stance.
A thousand times this. Liberal democracy involves the belief that all views are permitted, not that they're all equivalent.
posted by howfar at 4:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
A thousand times this. Liberal democracy involves the belief that all views are permitted, not that they're all equivalent.
posted by howfar at 4:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
That was a solid fuckin' pitch by Walsh.
Next up: Lee Saunders interrupts the intro and gets right down to it.
posted by cortex at 4:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Next up: Lee Saunders interrupts the intro and gets right down to it.
posted by cortex at 4:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yay Labor!
posted by biogeo at 4:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 4:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I've been doing lots of silent 'yay Americas' too over here.
posted by persona au gratin at 4:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 4:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Oh God, Marty. The guy who just gave city-owned Long Island, the homeless shelter and farm, to a for-profit corporation to develop.
posted by Melismata at 4:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Melismata at 4:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"I'm Marty Walsh and I'm an alcoholic." God damn, that took guts.
It's a common theme for him: "I don’t really care who knows I’m an alcoholic, because if it helps somebody else knowing that I’m an alcoholic, then they’ll ask me for help if they need it,"
posted by zachlipton at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
It's a common theme for him: "I don’t really care who knows I’m an alcoholic, because if it helps somebody else knowing that I’m an alcoholic, then they’ll ask me for help if they need it,"
posted by zachlipton at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
It's pretty clear that the speakers, or the organizers at least, were aware that there was going to be a divisive element at the convention, and they have been prepared to mostly be on point with the unity message.
It's early yet in the convention, the protesters are testing their legs, and the organizers will get a gauge for how firmly they have to shut it down. I think it's fine to acknowledge that there are many voices in the party, even loud obnoxious ones, and wait for the momentum build as the days go on.
posted by OHenryPacey at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
It's early yet in the convention, the protesters are testing their legs, and the organizers will get a gauge for how firmly they have to shut it down. I think it's fine to acknowledge that there are many voices in the party, even loud obnoxious ones, and wait for the momentum build as the days go on.
posted by OHenryPacey at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I hope the Bahstahn accent never goes extinct. I love it.
My love of every other regional accent helped me stop worrying and learn to love the Northern Cities Vowel Shift.
/Michigander
posted by palindromic at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
My love of every other regional accent helped me stop worrying and learn to love the Northern Cities Vowel Shift.
/Michigander
posted by palindromic at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
This kind sounds a bit like Lewis Black.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2016
Shout out to Marty Walsh he's a good shit
posted by Potomac Avenue at 4:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 4:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
DAAAAAYUM! "You keep saying you like making deals, Donald! How about making a deal with the housekeepers in your hotels" (paraphrase)
posted by biogeo at 4:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 4:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
AFSCME guy is on fire.
posted by dersins at 4:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by dersins at 4:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
palindromic I don't know your friends, but it's hard not to note that Marty Walsh is not just a man, but a particular type of manly man. I mean. It's just really hard not to notice that.
I'm just so disheartened. Because this is what it's going to be like the whole time, isn't it? People who hate her, who are furious -- they'll always find some scandal, some thing to latch onto to give their hatred shape. But it will persist, even as scandal after scandal is debunked, even after she continues to move this country left. It will always persist, because it doesn't come from a place of reality.
They just fucking hate her.
posted by schadenfrau at 4:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I'm just so disheartened. Because this is what it's going to be like the whole time, isn't it? People who hate her, who are furious -- they'll always find some scandal, some thing to latch onto to give their hatred shape. But it will persist, even as scandal after scandal is debunked, even after she continues to move this country left. It will always persist, because it doesn't come from a place of reality.
They just fucking hate her.
posted by schadenfrau at 4:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
If the DNC hadn't cheated, these people wouldn't be here booing like this.
posted by polymodus at 4:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by polymodus at 4:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
And it's a problem that should be answered by tax free food
Yeah, if the problem is you want people eating healthier, make healthy food cheap or free, don't punish people for their choices.
Doubly so for cigarettes --- fund things that help people quit if they want, etc. But punishing those who fail to quit one of the most addictive drugs is not helping them.
posted by thefoxgod at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Yeah, if the problem is you want people eating healthier, make healthy food cheap or free, don't punish people for their choices.
Doubly so for cigarettes --- fund things that help people quit if they want, etc. But punishing those who fail to quit one of the most addictive drugs is not helping them.
posted by thefoxgod at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
For some reason, I now want all of these guys to introduce themselves with "...and I'm an alcoholic."
Yes I am a bad person.
posted by rokusan at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Yes I am a bad person.
posted by rokusan at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I didn't know Ditka was head of the AFL/CIO
posted by dersins at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by dersins at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Daaaam, Lee Saunders! Would've dropped that mic so hard if it wasn't on a stand.
posted by lovecrafty at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by lovecrafty at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
AFL-CIO president is showing how to put forth the 'No TPP' argument at the convention.
posted by palindromic at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
AFLCIO guy pulls a Bentsen. "I know tough guys, I worked with tough guys..."
posted by cortex at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by cortex at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
(We're getting another collapse either way.)
But the Hillary collapse is much much slower and more potentially reversible (you WILL have to get anti-collapsitarian majorities in Congress).
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
But the Hillary collapse is much much slower and more potentially reversible (you WILL have to get anti-collapsitarian majorities in Congress).
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Dis guy looks like Ditka
posted by OHenryPacey at 4:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by OHenryPacey at 4:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
AFL-CIO rep: "Donald says he's a tough guy. Well, I worked in the mines with tough guys. And Donald, you're no tough guy."
posted by biogeo at 4:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 4:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
Lincoln confirmed as communist infiltrator.
We've been trying to get a mole into that organization for a long time.
posted by Herodios at 4:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
If the DNC hadn't cheated, these people wouldn't be here booing like this.
We'd just be hearing about superdelegates or some shit instead.
posted by sideshow at 4:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
We'd just be hearing about superdelegates or some shit instead.
posted by sideshow at 4:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
The Burners, Busters and Booers are obviously mostly from that part of Sanders' supporters.
The part that you just admitted that you have no evidence for? Can we please just stop making shit up?
posted by futz at 4:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The part that you just admitted that you have no evidence for? Can we please just stop making shit up?
posted by futz at 4:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
(you WILL have to get anti-collapsitarian majorities in Congress)
Right click, add to future sockpuppet name list.
posted by rokusan at 4:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Right click, add to future sockpuppet name list.
posted by rokusan at 4:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Huh. I'm watching the DNC feed, and I'm not hearing a lot of boos. Some, but not overwhelming. Maybe they're fiddling with the recording somehow?
Anyway, if this is the level of protest, I can live with it.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 4:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Anyway, if this is the level of protest, I can live with it.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 4:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Fuck yeah, NEA!
posted by cmfletcher at 4:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by cmfletcher at 4:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
What deal did Lily Eskelsen García do with the devil to look that good at 61? She's near Christie Brinkley status.
posted by Talez at 4:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Talez at 4:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Boos seem to have slacked way back compared to the first couple hours, which were more of a conspicuous shitshow on that front.
posted by cortex at 4:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by cortex at 4:27 PM on July 25, 2016
Trumka just said Clinton opposes TPP.
posted by winna at 4:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 4:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Huh. I'm watching the DNC feed, and I'm not hearing a lot of boos. Some, but not overwhelming. Maybe they're fiddling with the recording somehow?
The Hillary and Bernie whips have been working together to get the delegates back in line.
posted by Talez at 4:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
The Hillary and Bernie whips have been working together to get the delegates back in line.
posted by Talez at 4:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Huh. I'm watching the DNC feed, and I'm not hearing a lot of boos. Some, but not overwhelming. Maybe they're fiddling with the recording somehow?
Current boo level and general assholary is about 1% of what it was the first 60 mins.
posted by sideshow at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Current boo level and general assholary is about 1% of what it was the first 60 mins.
posted by sideshow at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
She's 61?!
posted by stolyarova at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by stolyarova at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
note: "in a basement, wrapped in bubble wrap" is not where you build space for a loyal opposition, at least not if you're interested in it being loyal.
Oh, I couldn't agree more. I am, as I said, against that sort of thing. And democracy (and the Dems) can cope with a few arseholes. An expression of frustration and steam-blowing-off, not a call to action.
posted by Devonian at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Oh, I couldn't agree more. I am, as I said, against that sort of thing. And democracy (and the Dems) can cope with a few arseholes. An expression of frustration and steam-blowing-off, not a call to action.
posted by Devonian at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
She's really good
posted by birdheist at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by birdheist at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Latinamerican skin, Talez!
Also probably sun block.
Wear sun block people!
posted by Tarumba at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Also probably sun block.
Wear sun block people!
posted by Tarumba at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
When the Union's inspiration through the worker's blood shall run,
there will be no power greater anywhere beneath the sun
For what force on Earth is weaker than the lonely strength of one?
But the Union makes us strong!
Solidarity forever!
Solidarity forever!
Solidarity forever!
The Union makes us strong!
posted by biogeo at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
there will be no power greater anywhere beneath the sun
For what force on Earth is weaker than the lonely strength of one?
But the Union makes us strong!
Solidarity forever!
Solidarity forever!
Solidarity forever!
The Union makes us strong!
posted by biogeo at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Mod note: One deleted. For real, let's not re-litigate the whole primary season in here. polymodus, cool it.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Woo, SEIU!
posted by mrzarquon at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 4:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Can I just say how nice it is that so many of the speakers are using Spanish as an integral part of their speeches?
posted by winna at 4:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
posted by winna at 4:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Huh. I'm watching the DNC feed, and I'm not hearing a lot of boos. Some, but not overwhelming. Maybe they're fiddling with the recording somehow?
It's gotten a heck of a lot better over the past hour or so. There's been talk that people have been working the floor to get it to stop, but whatever happened, it's working.
posted by zachlipton at 4:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
It's gotten a heck of a lot better over the past hour or so. There's been talk that people have been working the floor to get it to stop, but whatever happened, it's working.
posted by zachlipton at 4:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I'm an AFL-CIO dues-paying member, my sister is dues-paying union nurse, and my dad is a proud manager of a union shop. These union speakers are making me so damn proud.
posted by palindromic at 4:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 4:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
Amen, winna!
posted by persona au gratin at 4:30 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 4:30 PM on July 25, 2016
Well, that's good, because I imagine that a lot more people are watching now than were watching during the work day, and I'm ok with people seeing what I'm seeing now.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 4:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 4:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Motherfucking solidarity. I'm feeling it, union speakers.
posted by yasaman at 4:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 4:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
The one thing the Convention needs to feature is a group of real people The Donald has cheated out of money (there are thousands of them, and he hasn't made ALL of them sign Non-Disclosure Agreements) briefly telling their stories. And in Prime Time.
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Did the republic convention have this many blue collar representatives?
posted by Foci for Analysis at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2016
Glenn Beck is on the stage posing as a union leader? Does he have a secret double life?
posted by Talez at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Talez at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2016
That lady knows how to start a chant. <3
posted by Tarumba at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I believe that we can win!
That's what I'm talking about.
posted by Superplin at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
That's what I'm talking about.
posted by Superplin at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Love the union people! "I believe that we can win!"
posted by madamjujujive at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by madamjujujive at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Trumka just said Clinton opposes TPP.
Did she put little finger-quotes around "opposes?"
posted by rokusan at 4:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Did she put little finger-quotes around "opposes?"
posted by rokusan at 4:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
damn, lady knows how to give a speech
posted by Foci for Analysis at 4:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 4:33 PM on July 25, 2016
Man union leaders are so charismatic, I love them. How can you be so energetic and cheerful when your message is so potentially depressing?
posted by Tarumba at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
You've got a mic, you don't have to yell everything.
posted by fedward at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by fedward at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The camera is weirdly close to the teleprompter on NBC, so it looks like everyone's bad at looking down the camera. Disconcerting.
posted by lauranesson at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by lauranesson at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016
Where's the returns Donald.
posted by ThreeCatsBob at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by ThreeCatsBob at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
In one of the camera pans, I saw a group of berniers with tape over their mouths. I can get behind that kind of protest ;-)
posted by madamjujujive at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by madamjujujive at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
YOU HAVE A MICROPHONE
posted by The corpse in the library at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by The corpse in the library at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2016
Did the republic convention have this many blue collar representatives?
ftfy
posted by murphy slaw at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
ftfy
posted by murphy slaw at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
This is definitely the teacher unions representative.
posted by mrzarquon at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mrzarquon at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
These union people are awesome. It's a tight, disciplined message that's strongly pro-Clinton and anti-Trump from the workers of America. Plus, a mention of Trump University from the AFT lady! Eeeee!
(Also I don't know how many favorites I have left but I fear it's not enough to get me through the rest of the day.)
posted by Salieri at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
(Also I don't know how many favorites I have left but I fear it's not enough to get me through the rest of the day.)
posted by Salieri at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Twitch chat and metafilter just synced up with regard to yelling.
posted by ethansr at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by ethansr at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Protip to Randi Weingarten: You don't need to yell. The microphone does that for you.
She's just all fired up!
posted by dis_integration at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
She's just all fired up!
posted by dis_integration at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Damn, Labor nailed it.
posted by biogeo at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 4:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Maybe it's the third beer talking - in fact, I'm pretty sure it is - but I'm kind of like "YELL IT, GIRL! WOOOO!"
posted by palindromic at 4:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 4:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Yeah, there's yelling because you can't hear yourself in the monitor, but there's also yelling because your delivery is yelling. That was definitely rhetorical hollerin'.
posted by cortex at 4:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by cortex at 4:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Twitch chat and metafilter just synced up with regard to yelling.
WutFace MIC MUTED! WutFace
posted by Talez at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
WutFace MIC MUTED! WutFace
posted by Talez at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The politics of sin taxes are too complicated to talk about in absolutes. It's a shitty way to raise revenue, but it's often a last resort when other sources of revenue are totally ruled out by political circumstances. There are probably cases where liberals are too eager to use sin taxes to avoid having to raise other more progressive taxes that affect people with more political power, but there are also many cases where there's no appetite for higher taxes, but people still want the programs. Something's got to give there, and sometimes policymakers try to square that circle in problematic ways. In conclusion, sin taxes are a etc.
posted by tonycpsu at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
You've got a mic, you don't have to yell everything.
I'm paraphrasing my mother but if you'd shut up and listen I'll stop raising my voice.
posted by cmfletcher at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I'm paraphrasing my mother but if you'd shut up and listen I'll stop raising my voice.
posted by cmfletcher at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Holy crap. Talking about drug addiction as a medical condition.
posted by mrzarquon at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
It is so important for schools to focus more on creativity and less on testing and I do not believe that Hillary Clinton can actually achieve it but I am really glad that Randi Weingarten said it. (I like Obama a lot but I think that Common Core is a mistake.)
posted by Jeanne at 4:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Jeanne at 4:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Shit something in my eye again
posted by Tarumba at 4:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Tarumba at 4:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Talking about drug addiction as a medical condition.
Holy crap, this is amazing to have featured as a major point in the DNC. What an incredible message.
posted by biogeo at 4:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
Holy crap, this is amazing to have featured as a major point in the DNC. What an incredible message.
posted by biogeo at 4:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
I'm paraphrasing my mother but if you'd shut up and listen I'll stop raising my voice.
I haven't said anything in at least five minutes, mom.
posted by fedward at 4:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I haven't said anything in at least five minutes, mom.
posted by fedward at 4:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah, I am stunned with this whole piece on addiction. I'm a little bit happy-crying, which is a nice alternative to my eyes bulging out of my head earlier.
posted by Lyn Never at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Uhhh, "Sell out"? That was a weird choice for walk-on music.
posted by sideshow at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by sideshow at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2016
Was that... "The Impression that I Get" by the Mighty Mighty Bosstones?
posted by palindromic at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'm 51 and have graying hair and a four-year-old but she's my child, not my grandchild.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by kirkaracha at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2016
Just started listening to the livestream, did everyone else get a ska-tastic intro or just Jeanne Shaheen?
posted by JauntyFedora at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by JauntyFedora at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Was that... "The Impression that I Get" by the Mighty Mighty Bosstones?
Yes.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Talking about drug addiction as a medical condition.
I understand why inspirational speeches do not directly lead to actionable policy because that's American democracy, but as a "fantasy world" they make me remember why I support this party over all the others. The convention is the ideal you want to see.
The idea that there's so many people who saw last week's convention as the same is fucking terrifying.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 4:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I understand why inspirational speeches do not directly lead to actionable policy because that's American democracy, but as a "fantasy world" they make me remember why I support this party over all the others. The convention is the ideal you want to see.
The idea that there's so many people who saw last week's convention as the same is fucking terrifying.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 4:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
What did Jeanne Shaheen do to the music programmer to get introduced by Sell Out?
posted by Copronymus at 4:43 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Copronymus at 4:43 PM on July 25, 2016
OK I'm hearing Sell Out over The Impression That I Get from my other sources and I need somebody to conclusively resolve this plz
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:45 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:45 PM on July 25, 2016
i had to do some actual work and when I came back here it says 564 new comments, show
i do not know if i dare to click 'show'
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
i do not know if i dare to click 'show'
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Belts worn with suspenders
Sometimes it's the only way to be sure!
posted by LobsterMitten at 4:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Sometimes it's the only way to be sure!
posted by LobsterMitten at 4:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The Impression That I Get would certainly be a lot more apropos than Sell Out:
Have you ever been close to tragedyposted by en forme de poire at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Or been close to folks who have?
Have you ever felt a pain so powerful
So heavy you collapse? No?
Well I've never had to knock on wood
But I know someone who has
Which makes me wonder if I could
It was only like 5 seconds and it's been 10 years since I listened to both songs all the way through, but I'm pretty sure that was Reel Big Fish
posted by Copronymus at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Copronymus at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016
1: Cell phones worn on belts
2: Belts worn with suspenders
Well with these new phablets you need a little extra support when you've got one on your belt, hence the suspenders.
posted by dis_integration at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
2: Belts worn with suspenders
Well with these new phablets you need a little extra support when you've got one on your belt, hence the suspenders.
posted by dis_integration at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
too late you posted they already loaded now you have to read them all
posted by biogeo at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
The DNC is now cool for the summer.
posted by Talez at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Talez at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Was that... "The Impression that I Get" by the Mighty Mighty Bosstones?
Doh, guess my "first 3-4 bars of popular Ska songs" knowledge ain't what it used to be.
posted by sideshow at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Doh, guess my "first 3-4 bars of popular Ska songs" knowledge ain't what it used to be.
posted by sideshow at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The Impression That I Get would certainly be a lot more apropos than Sell Out:
And it reminds us how good ska was in 1997 and how good the country was.
posted by Talez at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
And it reminds us how good ska was in 1997 and how good the country was.
posted by Talez at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Now a speaker talking about destigmatization of and resources for treating mental illness.
posted by cortex at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by cortex at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
So Philadelphia apparently recently decriminalized disorderly conduct specifically for the convention, so that protesters are getting ticketed rather than arrested. This seems really smart, but it does lead to the question of why they ever made disorderly conduct a crime in the first place.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Following addiction coverage with mental illness coverage? Thank you, DNC. This is beautiful.
posted by Gaz Errant at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by Gaz Errant at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
ok demi lovato on her mental health issue == win
posted by Foci for Analysis at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Mental health care as a central message?! Holy shit.
posted by biogeo at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Holy shit, mental health too. I'm in actual tears now.
posted by Lyn Never at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
i do not know if i dare to click 'show'
*skims*
oh good nothing much really happened
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016
*skims*
oh good nothing much really happened
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2016
but it does lead to the question of why they ever made disorderly conduct a crime in the first place.
Racism?
posted by dis_integration at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Racism?
posted by dis_integration at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Rubbing actual celebrities in Trump's face. Hilarious.
posted by rokusan at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I knew Demi Lovato was going to be there, but I wasn't expecting this: an acknowledgement that she was fortunate enough to have access to top-notch mental healthcare and a plea to ensure it is available to everyone. That's good stuff.
posted by zachlipton at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
Mental illness advocate!
Wow. I'm feeling SO much better about this convention now. Man. Labor, education, addiction, mental health... Good reminders of why I put myself through this torture. These things are worth it.
posted by Superplin at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Wow. I'm feeling SO much better about this convention now. Man. Labor, education, addiction, mental health... Good reminders of why I put myself through this torture. These things are worth it.
posted by Superplin at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Damn Demi Lovato really turns the sultry on like a switch, doesn't she. Did not expect that.
posted by dis_integration at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by dis_integration at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Wow. They're actually talking about real issues that people have.
posted by octothorpe at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The Impression That I Get would certainly be a lot more apropos than Sell Out:
I would award the DNC one billion PBO-points if they'd play Let's Face It
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I would award the DNC one billion PBO-points if they'd play Let's Face It
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
> This seems really smart, but it does lead to the question of why they ever made disorderly conduct a crime in the first place.
This is Philadelphia we are talking about.
posted by mrzarquon at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016
This is Philadelphia we are talking about.
posted by mrzarquon at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2016
The fact that there are still people chanting "Bernie" every time someone calls for Clinton's election after another incredibly powerful speech is starting to sound kind of pathetic.
posted by biogeo at 4:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 4:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Well this is sort of whiplash inducing. Demi Lovato speaking movingly on the importance of mental health care and now she's performing??? what a time to be alive
posted by yasaman at 4:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 4:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Still a lot of recurring BERNIE! BERNIE! chants at lulls at the tail ends of speeches, though not at the same volume as the earlier stuff.
posted by cortex at 4:50 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by cortex at 4:50 PM on July 25, 2016
I feel pretty strongly it was 'The Impression that I Get' based on New England proximity and weirdness of picking 'Sell-Out.'
posted by palindromic at 4:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by palindromic at 4:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I think I just developed a crush on Demi Lovato? What?
posted by schadenfrau at 4:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 4:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I know I've been poking fun at the musical breaks but this Demi Lovato bit is the way to do it, especially with the important mental health message.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Thank God I didn't turn away before the Demi Lovato performance. (I'm serious.)
She's the real deal when it comes to working on mental health issues, and I'm really glad somebody organizing this thing made that choice.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
She's the real deal when it comes to working on mental health issues, and I'm really glad somebody organizing this thing made that choice.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Rubbing actual celebrities in Trump's face. Hilarious.
Now see here. Scott Baio has been on CNN on at least three occasions defending his shitty tweets. A pseduo-celebrity would only get one Larry King appearance.
posted by Talez at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Now see here. Scott Baio has been on CNN on at least three occasions defending his shitty tweets. A pseduo-celebrity would only get one Larry King appearance.
posted by Talez at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
But they had an extra from Happy Days, rokusan how can you say this is better?
posted by Tarumba at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Tarumba at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"What's wrong with being confident?"
great song choice.
posted by mrzarquon at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
great song choice.
posted by mrzarquon at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Please turn this into a policy position on mental health and addiction. Own the m@#fking national discussion!
posted by cmfletcher at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by cmfletcher at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Wait, I retract my earlier statement. I just listened to both songs, and that was definitely Sell Out. It was the part right after the 8 bar intro.
posted by sideshow at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by sideshow at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Nothing can unite us quite like coming together and, regardless of race or age, dancing like total fucking dorks.
posted by Salieri at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Salieri at 4:51 PM on July 25, 2016
> I think I just developed a crush on Demi Lovato? What
The DNC made me GAY
posted by The corpse in the library at 4:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
The DNC made me GAY
posted by The corpse in the library at 4:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I didn't even remember his name haha, Scott Baio, that's who I was talking about.
posted by Tarumba at 4:52 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Tarumba at 4:52 PM on July 25, 2016
CLIMATE CHANGE!!
God, I LOVE this party.
posted by cooker girl at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
God, I LOVE this party.
posted by cooker girl at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I am so not tuned into pop music so I don't even really know who Demi Lovato is, but I'm a fan now.
posted by biogeo at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by biogeo at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2016
Hello, I voted for Bernie in the primary, was a pledged delegate for him at the county level and will be voting for Hillary in the fall. For people who are wondering how he's managing communications, I'd like to share something his campaign sent out today. This is a small excerpt, but his message was one that thanked his supporters while also explaining the case for supporting Hillary and the Democratic party in the election.
posted by boo_radley at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [43 favorites]
Because of our tireless work the Democratic Party has just passed the most progressive platform, by far, in the history of the party. Secretary Clinton now says that she will oppose the disastrous Trans Pacific Partnership trade deal. She has also embraced parts of our plan to make college tuition free – and if her new plan passes, it could revolutionize the way higher education is funded in our country. Secretary Clinton has also embraced the public option for health insurance, and now supports significantly increased funding for community health centers. She adopted these positions because of you and your organizing.There's a lot of "I/you" in his email, but it's clear that he's pivoting his support in a material way to Clinton, and finding the rhetorical means to let his most ideological supporters to get comfortable with making the same pivot.
It is critically important that we do not let up in our fight for a political revolution. Tonight at the Democratic National Convention I will address the future of Our Revolution, and I hope you will both tune in to watch, and join our effort after.
posted by boo_radley at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [43 favorites]
That was superb
posted by persona au gratin at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by persona au gratin at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The DNC made me GAY
Oh no I was waaaaaaay gay before this, but I try to be more age appropriate
(Oh God please tell me she's at least in her twenties)
posted by schadenfrau at 4:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Oh no I was waaaaaaay gay before this, but I try to be more age appropriate
(Oh God please tell me she's at least in her twenties)
posted by schadenfrau at 4:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Oregon represent!
posted by Gaz Errant at 4:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Gaz Errant at 4:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The DNC made me GAY
DONALD TRUMP WARNED US ABOUT THIS!
posted by Talez at 4:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
DONALD TRUMP WARNED US ABOUT THIS!
posted by Talez at 4:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
(Oh God please tell me she's at least in her twenties)
23 even! Which means I can now start my Demi Lovato for President 2028 campaign today.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 4:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
23 even! Which means I can now start my Demi Lovato for President 2028 campaign today.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 4:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
So I came here to talk about mental illness but as long as I'm here, I'll belt out a song for you all.
posted by octothorpe at 4:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 4:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Merkley was a vocal Sanders supporter, so it'll be interesting to see how this goes.
posted by dersins at 4:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dersins at 4:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
He was the one senate endorsement he got.
posted by persona au gratin at 4:57 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 4:57 PM on July 25, 2016
Jeff Merkley just compared Trump to a lion [facepalm.gif].
Why not say "Trump isn't an advocate for workers any more than a rat is an advocate for cheese"?
posted by fitnr at 4:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Why not say "Trump isn't an advocate for workers any more than a rat is an advocate for cheese"?
posted by fitnr at 4:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
He seems a little nervous.
If you aren't Nick Jonas, I imagine following Demi Lovato is fairly nerve-wracking.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 4:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
If you aren't Nick Jonas, I imagine following Demi Lovato is fairly nerve-wracking.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 4:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Hey You NoTPP Fucking Assholes: Way to look like even more petty assholes.
posted by mrzarquon at 4:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mrzarquon at 4:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
He emphasized that the most progressive platform ever was the result of Sanders and Clinton working together, and that what comes next will involve working together.
It was lovely until the boos.
posted by Superplin at 4:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
It was lovely until the boos.
posted by Superplin at 4:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I didn't know who Demi Lovato was so it was a little disconcerting to see her go from talking about her mental health issues to bursting into song. And it was a kickass song.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 4:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
They needed to overrepresent Bernie with praise like this earlier to contain the angry. Not only did it reduce the booing, it helped pivot.
"Bernie and Hillary together forged this platform..." is exactly the sort of thing they needed to be saying 300 times today. He might not be the VP, but I think it's very smart to speak about him as if he is early on in the convention. It's a much better way to get people on board early, before gradually reducing mentions of Sanders as the thing goes on.
posted by rokusan at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
"Bernie and Hillary together forged this platform..." is exactly the sort of thing they needed to be saying 300 times today. He might not be the VP, but I think it's very smart to speak about him as if he is early on in the convention. It's a much better way to get people on board early, before gradually reducing mentions of Sanders as the thing goes on.
posted by rokusan at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Okay then now they can bring out the black lives matter people since they got the TPP shout out.
Harrumph
posted by Tarumba at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2016
Harrumph
posted by Tarumba at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2016
Interesting that Merkley keeps putting Sanders' name before Clinton's. Possibly canny, but feels kinda gross.
posted by dersins at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dersins at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Go Merkley! Try to heal that divide.
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'll belt out a song for you all.
Belt it but don't suspend(er) it.
I'll see myself out.
posted by datawrangler at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Belt it but don't suspend(er) it.
I'll see myself out.
posted by datawrangler at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
git up off ah dat thang?
posted by dis_integration at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by dis_integration at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016
I think it's a little annoying that Merkley keeps saying "Bernie and Hillary". I understand why, but it's still annoying phrasing.
posted by winna at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
NO TIPI
HOW DARE YOU! TIPI HEDREN IS AN AMERICAN ICON AND A LIVING LEGEND!
posted by Talez at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
HOW DARE YOU! TIPI HEDREN IS AN AMERICAN ICON AND A LIVING LEGEND!
posted by Talez at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
no bernie and no TPP makes delegates something something
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016
Seems a little more thought-through than "Sex Machine" was, if you're gonna roll out some James Brown.
posted by cortex at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by cortex at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I wish C-SPAN would show the band. They certainly did with the RNC.
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
LOL @ "DNC waitin' on ya" in this extended band vamp.
posted by JauntyFedora at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by JauntyFedora at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Sarah Silverman was a big Bernie supporter (and I'm a big Sarah Silverman supporter) so her speech will get my attention, anyway.
posted by rokusan at 5:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by rokusan at 5:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Jamelle Bouie: Democrats Aren't in Disarray. A Minority of Bernie Supporters Are in a Snit. What do the Sanders dead-enders want, exactly?
posted by homunculus at 5:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by homunculus at 5:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
please everybody just assume that I am continuing to shower you with the favorites that I have somehow already run out of
posted by kelborel at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by kelborel at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Seems a little more thought-through than "Sex Machine" was, if you're gonna roll out some James Brown.
I'll allow it.
posted by Soulfather at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'll allow it.
posted by Soulfather at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I don't care whether he says "Bernie and Hillary" or "Hillary and Bernie" or "my left-wing crush and the pragmatist I'm voting for." It was a good message and I think it's what the Bernie-or-busters in the crowd need to hear.
posted by biogeo at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Not sure the band is actually being heard in the center - the singer mentioned it more than once in that last bit.
posted by soundguy99 at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by soundguy99 at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016
All those people who were in despair earlier today need to be watching this!
posted by ThreeCatsBob at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by ThreeCatsBob at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"Let me do the worrying."
Oh God, my heart.
posted by Salieri at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Oh God, my heart.
posted by Salieri at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Fuck fuck now cutting onions I guess
posted by Tarumba at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The DNC made me cry.
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Ok, they're showing a video from an old event of Clinton saying "let me do the worrying" to a little girl who said she's afraid her parents will be deported and ALL THE FEELS.
posted by zachlipton at 5:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 5:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Oh my god that clip. I'm crying in a coffee shop right now.
posted by biogeo at 5:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 5:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
And now the girl is on stage. This may be theater, but it's damn good theater.
posted by zachlipton at 5:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 5:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Oh noooooo a small adorable child, my emotions, MY EMOTIONS
posted by yasaman at 5:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 5:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I think it's a little annoying that Merkley keeps saying "Bernie and Hillary"
I think that's how they should have done it all along. Start out day one with Bernie and Hillary everything. Day two: Hillary and Bernie. Day three and thereafter: Hillary and Tim.
posted by rokusan at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I think that's how they should have done it all along. Start out day one with Bernie and Hillary everything. Day two: Hillary and Bernie. Day three and thereafter: Hillary and Tim.
posted by rokusan at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
OH GOD THE ONIONS
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
motherfuckin' feels right there, fuck
posted by cortex at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by cortex at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Merkley definitely hit all the right notes there.
posted by en forme de poire at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by en forme de poire at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016
"Soy Americana."
posted by biogeo at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
AND NOW THE GIRL SPEAKING I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW I HAD ALLERGIES
posted by dersins at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by dersins at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
This convention so far can be summed up as: "Yep, we're definitely trying to win Arizona and Georgia, and we're making a run at Texas, you dipshit."
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 5:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 5:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
OK we found out who the Bernie fans won't chant over
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
oh my god I want to help her do science experiments on her desert rocks
posted by biogeo at 5:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 5:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
WATCH OU! (battery clonks the girl on the head)
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:06 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:06 PM on July 25, 2016
I basically never cry. And I'm not even American though I live there.
My eyes sure are weirdly wet right now.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 5:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
My eyes sure are weirdly wet right now.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 5:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
that girl is legit amazing
posted by Foci for Analysis at 5:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 5:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Seriously tho someone find that video please.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:07 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:07 PM on July 25, 2016
I think this little girl just became the 2026 frontrunner
posted by billyfleetwood at 5:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by billyfleetwood at 5:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
That precious little girl.
"I want to grow up to be a lawyer so I can help other families like us."
posted by winna at 5:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
"I want to grow up to be a lawyer so I can help other families like us."
posted by winna at 5:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I think the path is virginia + north carolina + florida + the usual suspects, 'cause I think ohio is out of reach and Pennsylvania looks dicey. Hell the whole industrial midwest makes me nervous.
The wildcard is if Kasich decides to shiv Trump's ground game in Ohio.
posted by Justinian at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The wildcard is if Kasich decides to shiv Trump's ground game in Ohio.
posted by Justinian at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
***update*** we resumed conversation and my friends explained they (crunchy granola eaters that they are, are voting Stein. So. I am not pleased, but not as disappointed as I was worried I was going to be? Also, they promised me s'mores, so.
posted by sara is disenchanted at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by sara is disenchanted at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Where are y'all seeing this? I got MSNBC streaming and its nothing like y'all are talking about
posted by Senor Cardgage at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Senor Cardgage at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016
Little girl is amazing. Didn't love the photo-op video (always seems fake/awkward to me) but she nailed the speech.
posted by birdheist at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by birdheist at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016
The thought of families being split up just breaks my heart.
posted by persona au gratin at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
How brave do you have to be to stand up there and give a speech when your immigration status isn't settled?
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
Si se puede!
posted by en forme de poire at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by en forme de poire at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
OMG I can't even tell you these are people who ran from South America, because they are treated like shit. Mom can barely read. They were discriminated against all their life.
I just can't tell you how good it feels to see them have a voice, when they didn't even in their own country.
I am bawling
posted by Tarumba at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I just can't tell you how good it feels to see them have a voice, when they didn't even in their own country.
I am bawling
posted by Tarumba at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
This convention so far can be summed up as: "Yep, we're definitely trying to win Arizona and Georgia, and we're making a run at Texas, you dipshit."
Oh my god the very idea of making the GOP fight for Texas makes me so happy.
posted by Pope Guilty at 5:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Oh my god the very idea of making the GOP fight for Texas makes me so happy.
posted by Pope Guilty at 5:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Video: Let me do the worrying (campaign ad from February)
posted by zachlipton at 5:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 5:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I just can't with this little girl right now. She reminds me so much of my little Girl Scouts. They worry so much about their parents. When she was reading along with her mom, man. I see that all the time with my girls. I'm so glad there's so much Latina representation on this stage today.
posted by phunniemee at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by phunniemee at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
The wildcard is if Kasich decides to shiv Trump's ground game in Ohio.
I think he will, for House of Cards reasons. It gives him an entry point in 2020, instead of waiting eight years for his next shot.
Okay maybe I hope he will. But I have feelings, is what I am saying.
posted by rokusan at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I think he will, for House of Cards reasons. It gives him an entry point in 2020, instead of waiting eight years for his next shot.
Okay maybe I hope he will. But I have feelings, is what I am saying.
posted by rokusan at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I think the path is virginia + north carolina + florida + the usual suspects, 'cause I think ohio is out of reach
Wait, what? No it isn't.
posted by showbiz_liz at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Wait, what? No it isn't.
posted by showbiz_liz at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Where are y'all seeing this? I got MSNBC streaming and its nothing like y'all are talking about
Networks don't show the good stuff because they talk over it. Try Twitch or YouTube for the raw feed.
posted by zachlipton at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Networks don't show the good stuff because they talk over it. Try Twitch or YouTube for the raw feed.
posted by zachlipton at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah the Trump-attacky spots don't seem to mesh well at all with the feel-good stuff they're trying to communicate. Maybe save the war drums for the final day?
posted by rokusan at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by rokusan at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Just turn over the whole convention to 11 year olds, booing problem solved.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 5:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
The last time politics made me cry was election night 2008.
posted by biogeo at 5:11 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by biogeo at 5:11 PM on July 25, 2016
Yeah, just watching the feed. I don't need a network commentator to explain to me what i just saw.
posted by octothorpe at 5:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 5:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
They are putting faces to Trump's words.
Trump has been talking about the cultural other, the stranger.
The DNC are giving them a voice, a face, a heart.
posted by mrzarquon at 5:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
Trump has been talking about the cultural other, the stranger.
The DNC are giving them a voice, a face, a heart.
posted by mrzarquon at 5:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
Update: my 2028 ticket is now Astrid Silva/Demi Lovato. Get on the train before it leaves the station.
(Yeah, I'm gonna amend the constitution before then.)
posted by MCMikeNamara at 5:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
(Yeah, I'm gonna amend the constitution before then.)
posted by MCMikeNamara at 5:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The Twitch stream seems to be a bit more up to date
posted by Foci for Analysis at 5:12 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 5:12 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh, man, what is this feeling I'm getting, this esperanza? This pride in what my country is supposed to be about? Is this... patriotism?
posted by lauranesson at 5:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by lauranesson at 5:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I think putting the contrast between the DNC and RNC front and center, contrasting w/ words from actual immigrants, is a smart choice. It really heightens the disparity.
posted by en forme de poire at 5:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by en forme de poire at 5:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Preach it, Luis!
posted by persona au gratin at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by persona au gratin at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm putting my daughter to bed and just hugged her real good even tho we're probably not going to get deported. End cynicism tonight we can do it.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
If you want decent commentary turn off CNN and watch Monday Night RAW.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by JakeEXTREME at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016
They're in Puerto Rico. Why would they need a Winter Coat?
posted by newgrl at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by newgrl at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016
Rep. Gutierrez is ON FIRE
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Holy shit, Luis Gutierrez is tearing it up.
posted by boo_radley at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by boo_radley at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I am sobbing after that sweet smart little girl.
I hope these amazing stories might filter through and soften the hearts of the Bernie delegates. Real people with real problems. I hope it makes them see the human faces that will be affected if we don't unify against Trump.
By the way, many many deep hugs to all you Bernie supporters who have made the switch. Thank you. And thank you for sharing the stories about how when you dug in to get to know Hillary better, you found much more substance than you realized and came to recognize many of the lies. She's not perfect, no politician is. What el lio said earlier is true - Bernie supporters are the ones who can change minds.
posted by madamjujujive at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I hope these amazing stories might filter through and soften the hearts of the Bernie delegates. Real people with real problems. I hope it makes them see the human faces that will be affected if we don't unify against Trump.
By the way, many many deep hugs to all you Bernie supporters who have made the switch. Thank you. And thank you for sharing the stories about how when you dug in to get to know Hillary better, you found much more substance than you realized and came to recognize many of the lies. She's not perfect, no politician is. What el lio said earlier is true - Bernie supporters are the ones who can change minds.
posted by madamjujujive at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Schedule update: after some initial confusion, Sanders will get the prime speaking slot at the end of the night, after Warren and Michelle Obama.
posted by zachlipton at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zachlipton at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016
Translation, somebody? I haven't cried enough yet.
It was along the lines of "We need to reform the immigration system to keep families together so they can pursue the American Dream."
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
It was along the lines of "We need to reform the immigration system to keep families together so they can pursue the American Dream."
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Fuck yeah, Luis!
posted by zombieflanders at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zombieflanders at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016
'cause I think ohio is out of reach
I think you're underestimating the Dem/PoC vote in Ohio, plus I think Kaine's gonna solidify a lot of support.
The wildcard is if Kasich decides to shiv Trump's ground game in Ohio.
Oh, he will. By all accounts he's a mean sonofabitch.
posted by soundguy99 at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I think you're underestimating the Dem/PoC vote in Ohio, plus I think Kaine's gonna solidify a lot of support.
The wildcard is if Kasich decides to shiv Trump's ground game in Ohio.
Oh, he will. By all accounts he's a mean sonofabitch.
posted by soundguy99 at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
If you want decent commentary turn off CNN and watch Monday Night RAW.
Especially with Corey Graves now on commentary!
posted by misskaz at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Especially with Corey Graves now on commentary!
posted by misskaz at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
> They're in Puerto Rico. Why would they need a Winter Coat?
they moved to Chicago.
posted by mrzarquon at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
they moved to Chicago.
posted by mrzarquon at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Please have some Muslim people next!
Also did you hear that voice scream TELL THEM, LUIS!? heh
posted by Tarumba at 5:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Also did you hear that voice scream TELL THEM, LUIS!? heh
posted by Tarumba at 5:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I needed these speeches so much.
posted by biogeo at 5:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 5:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"My parents when they came here from Puerto Rico weren't the only ones to face discrimination. Immigrants contribute to our communities and make America a great nation!"
posted by winna at 5:15 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 5:15 PM on July 25, 2016
The contrast between the positivity of the speeches so far and the mean-spirited apocalyptic appeals to fear and distrust of others that filled the RNC speaking schedule could not be more stark. Yes, the Dems are running clips of Trump on the screen, but if running clips of you saying stuff scares people, that's kind of on you, not your opposition.
To make Democrats seem scary, RNC speakers had to stretch the truth, inflate numbers, and simply make things up. To make a Trump presidency scary, the Democrats had to give him free air time during their convention.
posted by tonycpsu at 5:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
To make Democrats seem scary, RNC speakers had to stretch the truth, inflate numbers, and simply make things up. To make a Trump presidency scary, the Democrats had to give him free air time during their convention.
posted by tonycpsu at 5:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
What's this guy doing in 2024?
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Gaz Errant at 5:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"A fair immigration system is better for all America!"
"It is a sick and hateful fantasy [that immigrants will be rounded up and deported]."
posted by winna at 5:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"It is a sick and hateful fantasy [that immigrants will be rounded up and deported]."
posted by winna at 5:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Luis Guiterrez just now: "Its a fantasy that we are going to round up 11 million people and deport them. It's a sick and hateful fantasy."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Medgar Evers!
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
The problem is that giving Trump free airtime hasn't worked out for anyone yet.
It seems like it should work... but... somehow doesn't.
posted by rokusan at 5:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It seems like it should work... but... somehow doesn't.
posted by rokusan at 5:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I hope some of the feeds are taping this for rewatch, because I have class when Michelle and Bernie will be speaking, this class involves intricate and involved group work, and I want to watch this at home whilst sipping on a fine Scotch.
posted by spinifex23 at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by spinifex23 at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Planned Parenthood! Marriage equality! Who is this man, I love him.
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"Congress has to keep its hands off Planned Parenthood."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Nice shout-out to all the civil rights movements.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Hmmm How old is Gutierrez? (Sneaks off to start superPAC)
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
What's this guy doing in 2024?
Being 70, unfortunately.
posted by dersins at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Being 70, unfortunately.
posted by dersins at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"We will take out the NRA"
posted by mrzarquon at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
What's this guy doing in 2024?
Still sucking on lozenges.
posted by rokusan at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Still sucking on lozenges.
posted by rokusan at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Luis Gutierrez is saying great things, but I can't help but think he's Fred Armisen with some aging makeup on. They're even both from Chicago.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 5:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Diggin this Gutierrez dude's scene
posted by Senor Cardgage at 5:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Senor Cardgage at 5:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
seriously this is such a great speech.
posted by winna at 5:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 5:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
SI SE PUEDE
posted by winna at 5:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by winna at 5:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Thank you, Luis Gutierrez, THIS is what I want to see four nights of!
Chicago represent!
(and it sounds to me - at least on MSNBC's feed - that the crowd has calmed down? I'm not hearing boos or opposition at the moment.)
posted by dnash at 5:20 PM on July 25, 2016
Chicago represent!
(and it sounds to me - at least on MSNBC's feed - that the crowd has calmed down? I'm not hearing boos or opposition at the moment.)
posted by dnash at 5:20 PM on July 25, 2016
Luis Gutierrez was fighting for immigrant rights long before it was cool. He was there from the beginning. He's legit.
posted by persona au gratin at 5:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 5:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
He is a future President, the deities be willing.
posted by madamjujujive at 5:20 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by madamjujujive at 5:20 PM on July 25, 2016
yayyyyy the Collins twins!!!
posted by acidic at 5:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by acidic at 5:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The Collins brothers are a blatant call-out to Silicon Valley ;)
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:20 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:20 PM on July 25, 2016
this is what democracy looks like
posted by Sebmojo at 5:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Sebmojo at 5:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
People are booing at gun control?
That's... interesting.
posted by Artw at 5:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
That's... interesting.
posted by Artw at 5:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
i give guitar lessons to a 12 year old black orphan from africa who was adopted by our pastor's family. the kid is being scared shitless by kids at school telling him Trump is going to send him back where he came from. i've told him not to worry but he does. what kind of parents are putting that poison in their kids minds. it makes me livid.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [58 favorites]
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [58 favorites]
"what are you going to tell your kids if the president reduces women to their physical appearance."
posted by winna at 5:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 5:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
down tempo maybe but on point
posted by Hairy Lobster at 5:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Hairy Lobster at 5:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
(keep muttering that to yourself regardless how you feel about what's happening at any given moment, btw, it's extremely true)
posted by Sebmojo at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Sebmojo at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016
My daughter is a little Latina. Most of her friends are little Latinos and Latinas and other children of immigrants.
We the parents always almost never talk about our fears of deportation (even if one is fully documented, we have precedent of natural born us citizens being deported or worse becaus of their ancestry (can see a former ceconcentration camp for Japanese people from my office window in sunny silicon valley)) we all know, we've all had the sleepless nights.
You have no idea how much this thing that just happened means to me.
posted by Doroteo Arango II at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [46 favorites]
We the parents always almost never talk about our fears of deportation (even if one is fully documented, we have precedent of natural born us citizens being deported or worse becaus of their ancestry (can see a former ceconcentration camp for Japanese people from my office window in sunny silicon valley)) we all know, we've all had the sleepless nights.
You have no idea how much this thing that just happened means to me.
posted by Doroteo Arango II at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [46 favorites]
lmao @ "my less attractive twin brother"
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"My less-handsome twin brother..."
Hilariously, I was just thinking, "Wow, this guy is really handsome." The brother is too.
posted by biogeo at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Hilariously, I was just thinking, "Wow, this guy is really handsome." The brother is too.
posted by biogeo at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"Donald Trump reduces women to their physical appearance."
So many men speaking strongly for women's reproductive health and just general right to dignity. Should be a low bar, but holy hell we know it isn't. I am now loving this convention and the assholes can't ruin it for me (although I'll never forgive them for drowning out Black Lives Matter).
posted by Superplin at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
So many men speaking strongly for women's reproductive health and just general right to dignity. Should be a low bar, but holy hell we know it isn't. I am now loving this convention and the assholes can't ruin it for me (although I'll never forgive them for drowning out Black Lives Matter).
posted by Superplin at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Down tempo is not bad! Varying the levels is good!
posted by winna at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 5:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
good work bringing up the UN resolution!
posted by en forme de poire at 5:23 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by en forme de poire at 5:23 PM on July 25, 2016
How old is Gutierrez? (Sneaks off to start superPAC)
NOPE HE IS MY CONGRESSMAN AND YOU CAN'T HAVE HIM
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
NOPE HE IS MY CONGRESSMAN AND YOU CAN'T HAVE HIM
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Oh tech bro time.
posted by mrzarquon at 5:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 5:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Did nobody tell him that t-shirt was a terrible choice?
posted by fedward at 5:24 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by fedward at 5:24 PM on July 25, 2016
0 channels showing whoever this is besides Cspan btw my wife just reported from my living room.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016
Lipson as the anti-Thiel?
posted by zombieflanders at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zombieflanders at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"Nothing scares away investors like hate."
posted by winna at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by winna at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
"Donald, it's clear you don't understand something about business. Nothing scares away investment like hate."
posted by biogeo at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Tech guy says: "Donald, you build skyscrapers; I build in the cloud." Ugh.
But he goes on to say "nothing scares away investment like hate" and talks about hateful laws in NC killing investment, so I'll forgive him.
posted by zachlipton at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
But he goes on to say "nothing scares away investment like hate" and talks about hateful laws in NC killing investment, so I'll forgive him.
posted by zachlipton at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'm not comfortable with this guy's hair situation
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"Republicans may think they're telling you which bathroom to go into, but they're really telling you which market to stay out of" - nice
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 5:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 5:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
"Republicans may think they're telling people which bathroom to go into, but they're telling investors what markets to stay out of."
posted by winna at 5:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by winna at 5:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Jesse Lipson looks a little more corporate in his Citrix photo.
posted by mrzarquon at 5:26 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by mrzarquon at 5:26 PM on July 25, 2016
I think that's one of the official Hillary t-shirts, all of which, I'm sad to say, are kind of terrible.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 5:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 5:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
A Reality-Check On The Mood In The Convention
posted by Artw at 5:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by Artw at 5:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
> Did nobody tell him that t-shirt was a terrible choice
It's a Hillary shirt.
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016
It's a Hillary shirt.
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016
wooooo, cut taxes and regulations!
posted by indubitable at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by indubitable at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm over tech bros but this is pretty good and I think is going to resonate with the sizable Economist-esque centrist but pluralistic faction of Ds.
Also my heart is growing at boos for Pence, and that was a pretty good sick burn.
posted by en forme de poire at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Also my heart is growing at boos for Pence, and that was a pretty good sick burn.
posted by en forme de poire at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Wait are they not booing this guy? My wife reports he's wearing a blazer over a graphic t and has slicked back hair. I'm back to THE LEFT IS DOOMED if they boo BLM and not this actual capitalist.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
This guy is not really targeted at me, but we use Citrix at my giant company, and I could see this playing very well with some of their higher-ups.
posted by peacheater at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by peacheater at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016
wake me up when it's time to go vote
i can't possibly keep up with this
posted by pyramid termite at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
i can't possibly keep up with this
posted by pyramid termite at 5:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Gay men jumping the broom!
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
A Reality-Check On The Mood In The Convention
Yeah, by 5:00 the mood had definitely changed for the better.
posted by biogeo at 5:28 PM on July 25, 2016
Yeah, by 5:00 the mood had definitely changed for the better.
posted by biogeo at 5:28 PM on July 25, 2016
I don't love the whole framing of "oh look business gets mad about discrimination so see we shouldn't do it"
it's like saying "don't poo on the floor because someone might step on it"
which, yes, but also just don't poo on the floor
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
it's like saying "don't poo on the floor because someone might step on it"
which, yes, but also just don't poo on the floor
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Okay so 360-degree video is the coolest tech thing I've seen this year but I'm not getting the point of it here, when it's in the crowd, far away from anything cool
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 5:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 5:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I love the brisk pace they've got going on here. Way to keep the energy up.
posted by Salieri at 5:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 5:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
The 360 feed seems to be lower res even when in HD too.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 5:30 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by JakeEXTREME at 5:30 PM on July 25, 2016
Damn it only took me 1.5 hours to get home in austin traffic. FINALLY watching. Sheesh.
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm seeing a lot of delegates fanning themselves with their programs on the floor. Just how hot is it in there?
posted by zachlipton at 5:30 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zachlipton at 5:30 PM on July 25, 2016
There hasn't been a white person on stage in like 45 minutes. This is amazing.
posted by billyfleetwood at 5:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by billyfleetwood at 5:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
yeah the 360 degree video mostly just cuts down the resolution so I can't see the speakers
posted by indubitable at 5:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by indubitable at 5:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"[Trump's] worst attack on us was his vice presidential pick."
posted by winna at 5:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 5:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
> I don't love the whole framing of "oh look business gets mad about discrimination so see we shouldn't do it"
This is going for the "Republicans are business focused" plank - they are pushing the hypocrisy angle hard.
posted by mrzarquon at 5:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
This is going for the "Republicans are business focused" plank - they are pushing the hypocrisy angle hard.
posted by mrzarquon at 5:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Y'all it's weird as hell to hear "transgender" in a convention.
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
I'm liking the fact that Pence is also getting both barrels from the speakers. It's important that he doesn't get away with being the "nice" or "moderate" or "sane" one.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 5:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
OW OW OW OW my eyes that is a terrible shirt.
posted by 3urypteris at 5:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by 3urypteris at 5:33 PM on July 25, 2016
Wow, she was incredible.
posted by biogeo at 5:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 5:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
HIllary plans to mislead the nation with thousands of dazzle-camouflage t-shirts
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 5:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 5:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
My biased perception tells me nobody could disagree with these speeches.
Did republicans feel the same way at the RNC?
posted by Tarumba at 5:34 PM on July 25, 2016
Did republicans feel the same way at the RNC?
posted by Tarumba at 5:34 PM on July 25, 2016
Now we've got a video with Ken Jeong and Austan Goolsbee forming an unlikely duo to make fun of Trump products made overseas.
Trump barware made in Slovenia: "Holy Melania!"
posted by zachlipton at 5:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Trump barware made in Slovenia: "Holy Melania!"
posted by zachlipton at 5:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
BTW I had some unpleasant conversations with insurance people about transgender stuff, because the thing is, the push for equality there has kind of been a top-down thing, directly from the Obama administration. So I'm extremely heartened and thrilled to hear it being mentioned here so very very often. Like a hundred Loretta Lynches making eye contact with me all at once and saying "We see you."
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 5:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 5:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
A man is squeaking about trump vodka being made in the Netherlands and I'm so confused.
posted by winna at 5:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 5:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Going after Racists, focusing on Mental Health and Addiction, 11 year old kids, ska punk, this is starting to pop off.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Did republicans feel the same way at the RNC?
I've been spending time in r/asktrumpsupporters. The answer is: yes.
posted by the_querulous_night at 5:36 PM on July 25, 2016
I've been spending time in r/asktrumpsupporters. The answer is: yes.
posted by the_querulous_night at 5:36 PM on July 25, 2016
Now we've got a video with Ken Jeong and Austan Goolsbee forming an unlikely duo to make fun of Trump products made overseas.
That was... surprisingly entertaining.
posted by biogeo at 5:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
That was... surprisingly entertaining.
posted by biogeo at 5:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
i'm so glad he didn't say unquote
posted by lazaruslong at 5:36 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by lazaruslong at 5:36 PM on July 25, 2016
and again
posted by lazaruslong at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by lazaruslong at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2016
Way to kill the momentum, Bob Casey.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zombieflanders at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
My biased perception tells me nobody could disagree with these speeches.
Content of the speeches aside, it helps that the speakers roster is not a parade of Prosperity Gospel hucksters, MLM pyramid schemers and Scott Baio.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Content of the speeches aside, it helps that the speakers roster is not a parade of Prosperity Gospel hucksters, MLM pyramid schemers and Scott Baio.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
ugh yes the protections for trans folks is getting better as a result of the ACA but still pretty awful
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Is Bob Casey always this awkward a speaker?
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Those ugly shirts are Made in America and Union Prited though, which is great. Just, maybe don't make the HRC campaign logo into one of those optical illusions that make the walls slide back and forth you when you look away.
posted by 3urypteris at 5:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by 3urypteris at 5:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Casey: "outsourcing is... not... always a terrible thing"
Crowd: "????? ??? ? ?? ????"
posted by boo_radley at 5:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Crowd: "????? ??? ? ?? ????"
posted by boo_radley at 5:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Bob Casey is one fake phone call away from this turning into a Bob Newhart skit.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 5:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 5:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I've only really been watching since like 6:30 but so far EVERY SINGLE SPEECH has been better just as a speech than the vulgar talking yam's acceptance speech.
posted by soundguy99 at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by soundguy99 at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
>.> duuuuuuuude
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016
Is Bob Casey always this awkward a speaker?
More so. This is his "A" game.
They can't all be barn-burners, folks.
posted by tonycpsu at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
More so. This is his "A" game.
They can't all be barn-burners, folks.
posted by tonycpsu at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
the spots they keep running are like a cheap infomercial made by college students. they are terrible and embarrassing.
posted by rr at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by rr at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"Donald Trump has never made anything in his life"
("Bobby Newport's never had a REAL job in his LIFE")
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
("Bobby Newport's never had a REAL job in his LIFE")
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Is Bob Casey always this awkward a speaker?
I think he may be the scheduled bathroom break. 'swhat I did.
posted by Mooski at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016
I think he may be the scheduled bathroom break. 'swhat I did.
posted by Mooski at 5:39 PM on July 25, 2016
Y'all I have a yes we can shirt from 08 shit was printed on cardboard in comic sans let's not get silly.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Oh I have such a soft spot for dorks and Bob Casey is endearing himself to me so much right now. Bless his heart his terrible 76’s joke was such cute and he clearly thought it was HILARIOUS.
posted by winna at 5:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by winna at 5:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Bob Casey's speech would probably read really well.
posted by argybarg at 5:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by argybarg at 5:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
ok, but that backs of the working class was a pretty good line
posted by boo_radley at 5:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by boo_radley at 5:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Also, Bob Casey is kinda charmingly dorky - he's awkward because he's totally Dadding it up.
posted by soundguy99 at 5:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by soundguy99 at 5:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Luke Feeney is a cutie.
posted by stolyarova at 5:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 5:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I take that back. He's not bad. He's got a good vibe and his words are solid.
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:41 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:41 PM on July 25, 2016
Ohio represent!
posted by soundguy99 at 5:41 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by soundguy99 at 5:41 PM on July 25, 2016
("Bobby Newport's never had a REAL job in his LIFE")
I'd vote for Bobby Newport over Donald Trump any day.
posted by lovecrafty at 5:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'd vote for Bobby Newport over Donald Trump any day.
posted by lovecrafty at 5:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Guy walks on to Zeppelin. Sets the bar high.
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/7/25/1552080/-Unity-Bernie-will-turn-over-all-his-delegates-tomorrow-night-during-roll-call-All-states-to-vote
posted by Senor Cardgage at 5:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Senor Cardgage at 5:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Chillicothe is on the rise, in great lines few people have ever felt moved to say ever.
/not Chillicothe-ist
posted by winna at 5:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
/not Chillicothe-ist
posted by winna at 5:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
jimmy page never needed a Boss MetalZone though.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Just looked at the schedule. Paul Simon is playing tonight?! Yessssssssss.
posted by stolyarova at 5:43 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by stolyarova at 5:43 PM on July 25, 2016
Doesn't Bob Casey know the Sixers have a backlog of big men?
posted by enjoymoreradio at 5:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by enjoymoreradio at 5:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I was particularly attuned as I literally learned to play that song today.
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I hear a smallish chant of "No trust no unity" now.
posted by zachlipton at 5:44 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zachlipton at 5:44 PM on July 25, 2016
Luke Feeney is a cutie.
He is! And thus my dirty feelings over finding the NJ delegate Christie offspring cute are washed away.
But wow, he can't be more than twelve. Right? Who are all these Democratic leaders with the secret of eternal youth? There have got to be a bunch of paintings in attics somewhere.
posted by Salieri at 5:44 PM on July 25, 2016
He is! And thus my dirty feelings over finding the NJ delegate Christie offspring cute are washed away.
But wow, he can't be more than twelve. Right? Who are all these Democratic leaders with the secret of eternal youth? There have got to be a bunch of paintings in attics somewhere.
posted by Salieri at 5:44 PM on July 25, 2016
Just looked at the schedule.
What's the link? I was wondering who the next speakers are. Thank you!
posted by cashman at 5:44 PM on July 25, 2016
What's the link? I was wondering who the next speakers are. Thank you!
posted by cashman at 5:44 PM on July 25, 2016
Let us not speak of the Process.
posted by palindromic at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
That mayor was adorable!
posted by argybarg at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by argybarg at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
jimmy page never needed a Boss MetalZone though.
That tone was set way high hahahahahahaha
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
That tone was set way high hahahahahahaha
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Oooh we're still chanting in the background I see, no justice no peace now.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016
Feeney is genuinely like 26.
posted by soundguy99 at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by soundguy99 at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh noes my new favorite Ohio mayor is speaking and I'm stuck in Aldi
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016
Someone is chanting "No Unity"
Seriously?
posted by mrzarquon at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Seriously?
posted by mrzarquon at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Here's the schedule for anybody who needs it!
posted by stolyarova at 5:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 5:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I hear a smallish chant of "No trust no unity"
It was literally like two dudes.
posted by dersins at 5:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
It was literally like two dudes.
posted by dersins at 5:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
The guy with too much botox was a good speaker. very inspirational. time for another infomercial segment.
posted by rr at 5:47 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by rr at 5:47 PM on July 25, 2016
Good news is it sounded like ten people chanting, so tiny minority
posted by Tarumba at 5:47 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Tarumba at 5:47 PM on July 25, 2016
Just turned on MSNBC, Rachel Maddow has a BIG SMILE
posted by zutalors! at 5:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 5:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Two moms or two dads. Fuck yeah.
posted by Mooski at 5:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Mooski at 5:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"We are the only industrialized nation that doesn't guarantee workers paid family leave."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
The guy with too much botox
Nice try, dude. See my above comment.
posted by soundguy99 at 5:48 PM on July 25, 2016
Nice try, dude. See my above comment.
posted by soundguy99 at 5:48 PM on July 25, 2016
No botox, he's just young and has never spoken at this level before. He's the mayor of a small town.
posted by Tarumba at 5:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Tarumba at 5:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's "Jillibrand" and not "Gillibrand?" This is like the GIF nightmare all over again.
posted by fedward at 5:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by fedward at 5:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
It's "jif" obvs
posted by stolyarova at 5:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 5:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
a smallish chant... It was literally like two dudes.
"Two man gang? That's a pretty small gang. Technically, the smallest gang possible."
posted by rokusan at 5:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"Two man gang? That's a pretty small gang. Technically, the smallest gang possible."
posted by rokusan at 5:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I'm finally watching! Not super good this speech but she keeps saying Hillary and nobodies booing her. :)
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:51 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:51 PM on July 25, 2016
GIF nightmare
flagged for please God not here not now
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
flagged for please God not here not now
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Coming up later:
The Honorable Al Franken
United States Senator, Minnesota
Performance
Paul Simon
American musician, singer-songwriter and actor.
If G.E. Smith had played the DNC instead of the RNC, you could almost make an SNL episode out of this.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
The Honorable Al Franken
United States Senator, Minnesota
Performance
Paul Simon
American musician, singer-songwriter and actor.
If G.E. Smith had played the DNC instead of the RNC, you could almost make an SNL episode out of this.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Quiet guys, my senator Al is on!
posted by triggerfinger at 5:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by triggerfinger at 5:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah Chillicothe has less than 25,000 people. It is a nice little town!
posted by winna at 5:52 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 5:52 PM on July 25, 2016
enjoymoreradio: It's "jif" obvs Pistols at dawn.
I'll be Stolyarova's second.
posted by Superplin at 5:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'll be Stolyarova's second.
posted by Superplin at 5:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Draw the map, Al Franken. Draw the map.
posted by rokusan at 5:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 5:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
This speaking to the heart of so many families though. I mean, I'm at home with my kids right now and this right on the point.
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I will drink a shot of tequila if he does Stuart Smiley.
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2016
"I got my Doctorate in Megolamaniacs from Trump University."
posted by zombieflanders at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
It's "jif" obvs Pistols at dawn.
Ima just gonna turn around so I can have deniability.
posted by rokusan at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Ima just gonna turn around so I can have deniability.
posted by rokusan at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"I got my Doctorate in Megalomania Studies at Trump University." Oh yes, Mr. Franken. That's the way to play it.
(bonus "misunderestimating" for us olds)
posted by Superplin at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
(bonus "misunderestimating" for us olds)
posted by Superplin at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Actually, it's pronounced "sequel".
posted by [expletive deleted] at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by [expletive deleted] at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"World renown expert on megalomanic"
"I got my doctorate in megalomania at trump university. I had to clean out my 401k and get a reverse mortgage to pay for it, but as a proud alumni I think we may have misunderestimated him."
posted by winna at 5:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"I got my doctorate in megalomania at trump university. I had to clean out my 401k and get a reverse mortgage to pay for it, but as a proud alumni I think we may have misunderestimated him."
posted by winna at 5:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Lolllll a Trump roast
posted by Tarumba at 5:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 5:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Franken: "Trump University's School of Ripping People Off is ranked second in the nation - right behind Bernie Madoff University."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 5:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Franken wears the same glasses that he wore on SNL.
posted by octothorpe at 5:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 5:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Finally one of these folks is drunk COME ON AL WE LIGHTING THIS CRACKER UP
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Franken is straight KILLING IT.
posted by tonycpsu at 5:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 5:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Hah, Al got a correction from the crowd on mispronouncing "yuge".
posted by sideshow at 5:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by sideshow at 5:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Sorry, I love Al Franken, but this is some stale shit. A lot of these jokes are landing with a thud.
posted by the bricabrac man at 5:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by the bricabrac man at 5:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Franken's "I can't wait to call her Madam President," to big cheers.
LOVE
posted by Salieri at 5:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
LOVE
posted by Salieri at 5:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"I am proud to call Hillary Clinton my friend and I can't wait to call her Madam President."
posted by peacheater at 5:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by peacheater at 5:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
That brings up a question - IS it Madame President?
posted by Mooski at 5:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Mooski at 5:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
That was a really weak joke part of the speech and a really great serious part.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:57 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:57 PM on July 25, 2016
Why does hillaryclinton.com have "Hillary Y'all" buttons but no bumper stickers with that message? This Texan wants one. Imma hafta wait and consult my husband on what sticker we want on our car, since he drives it most.
posted by threeturtles at 5:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by threeturtles at 5:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Christ there's still 102 days (from Friday)? Oh to have a cave to live in.
posted by janell at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by janell at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Franken is what a really passionate supporter looks like. We'll be seeing a lot of that. It's just a fact that her fellow Democratic politicians really love her. That's saying something to me.
posted by zutalors! at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Madoff was a democratic donor and a clinton donor, that was a little awkward but funny. But al is wonderful.
posted by rr at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by rr at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016
"Hirrily, Hillary Clinton"
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yeah, bad sketch is bad. Cue the sandman.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016
Tons of applause at the Wellstone(!) name-drop.
posted by schmod at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by schmod at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Yay we got our first drunk speaker!
posted by Tarumba at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I ask that 'cause I wanna be able to do it right on Day One.
posted by Mooski at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Mooski at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016
His pacing is weak all through.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016
Ahh damnit Al... bringing up Paul still makes me tear up 14 years later.
posted by nathan_teske at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by nathan_teske at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Nice to hear cheers for Paul Wellstone.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 5:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Brings to mind Anthony Jeselnik's roast of Trump:
Donald, I'm not sure if you're even aware of this, but the only difference between you and Michael Douglas from the movie, Wall Street, is that no one's going to be sad when you get cancer.posted by palindromic at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
Oh noes my new favorite Ohio mayor is speaking and I'm stuck in Aldi
That's what you get for going to Aldi. #NeverAldi.
Was out enjoying the lake tonight. Checking Mefi to see if I dare venture into watching the convention now!
posted by NorthernLite at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016
That's what you get for going to Aldi. #NeverAldi.
Was out enjoying the lake tonight. Checking Mefi to see if I dare venture into watching the convention now!
posted by NorthernLite at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016
That brings up a question - IS it Madame President?
As much as I wish we went the Star Trek route and used "Mister" for her, yes, it is Madam.
posted by rokusan at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
As much as I wish we went the Star Trek route and used "Mister" for her, yes, it is Madam.
posted by rokusan at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Friday, we start to work, until then, let's get drunk.
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Annika Cicada at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016
Go out and campaign! Leave your kids at home alone! They know how to use a microwave!
posted by triggerfinger at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by triggerfinger at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Why does hillaryclinton.com have "Hillary Y'all" buttons but no bumper stickers with that message?
Needs to be fixed. I just took down my "Obama Y'all" sign a few weeks ago.
posted by bongo_x at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016
Needs to be fixed. I just took down my "Obama Y'all" sign a few weeks ago.
posted by bongo_x at 5:59 PM on July 25, 2016
The "Listen, kids love it when their parents aren't home," bit was good.
posted by Salieri at 6:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 6:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Yay we got our first drunk speaker!
Hopefully Sarah is lit right up.
posted by rokusan at 6:00 PM on July 25, 2016
Hopefully Sarah is lit right up.
posted by rokusan at 6:00 PM on July 25, 2016
IS it Madame President?
Mrs./Ms. I presume.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Mrs./Ms. I presume.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's gonna take months for Hillary signs/stickers to outnumber Sanders ones in my city... if they even ever do. It's still not even close.
posted by rokusan at 6:01 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by rokusan at 6:01 PM on July 25, 2016
So the convention is when I get to put a face to the people who are constantly emailing me for money.
posted by bongo_x at 6:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 6:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Democrats dance in their seats so much better than Republicans.
posted by octothorpe at 6:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 6:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
You know factionalism is bad but our convention has way better awkward dancers.
posted by winna at 6:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 6:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"Stronger together" signs being passed out in the hall. Someone knew what they were doing here: start with "love trumps hate" signs that everyone should be able to get behind, try to build some unity, then cash in on it with new signs.
posted by zachlipton at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Al Franken is a national treasure.
posted by mgar at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by mgar at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Franken was so great, glad I was able to caught his speech just now. I had no idea he was going to be speaking tonight.
The official schedule leaves out a lot of details about who is speaking in what order on what day, just a long list of officials to appear this week. Is there another place where I can find that out?
posted by numaner at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016
The official schedule leaves out a lot of details about who is speaking in what order on what day, just a long list of officials to appear this week. Is there another place where I can find that out?
posted by numaner at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016
Yes, MADAME President, not Mrs. President or Ms. President or Sugar Tits President or Honeybunch President or Majestic Toes President or Sweety Pie President or Lady Bits President or She Ra President.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Was that Rosie Perez?
posted by zombieflanders at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zombieflanders at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016
You can't deny we're much better dancers than the Republicans
posted by Tarumba at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 6:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Secret Life of Gravy I for one would be super stoked if it were She Ra President.
posted by winna at 6:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by winna at 6:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Al FRanken has been in politics for so long that when I hear his name I mentally picture Lewis Black.
posted by Yowser at 6:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Yowser at 6:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
One thing is clear: if this was an audience dance competition the DNC would have already won by a huge margin.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 6:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Hairy Lobster at 6:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
That brings up a question - IS it Madame President?
One assumes; it is Madame Speaker in the House.
But presumably she will have some influence over the title and might request to be called the Ayatollah of Rock-And-Rollah or Her Splendiferousness.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 6:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
One assumes; it is Madame Speaker in the House.
But presumably she will have some influence over the title and might request to be called the Ayatollah of Rock-And-Rollah or Her Splendiferousness.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 6:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Chris Christie quote.
posted by mrzarquon at 6:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mrzarquon at 6:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Aren't we feeling better, guys? Whew. I was hiding sharp object earlier tonight.
Smart that they moved Bernie to last - I am not sure you could quiet his people down again after he speaks.
posted by madamjujujive at 6:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Smart that they moved Bernie to last - I am not sure you could quiet his people down again after he speaks.
posted by madamjujujive at 6:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Fuck why they got to make me cry.
posted by Mooski at 6:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Mooski at 6:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Take it up with Clinton, winna. I figure since she is the first, she gets to choose.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's much easier to dance when you're happy than when you're scared and angry.
posted by palindromic at 6:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 6:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I manage to avoid all the ugly Trumpism in everyday life, I didn't need it to chase down the happy seat-dancing
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Well this young woman is just wonderful.
posted by WordCannon at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by WordCannon at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Seriously. Totally making me cry right now.
posted by fedward at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by fedward at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"Hillary Clinton sees me."
posted by NorthernLite at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by NorthernLite at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Ugh. Using that video of Trump doing his "disabled" at is pretty ham-fisted. Just let Somosa come out on her own and talk
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016
I'm so glad I stopped in on this thread, the comments overall have been great.
posted by Quiplash at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Quiplash at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Oh man, the segue from Trump mocking the reporter to Anastasia Somoza's speech is a brutal juxtaposition.
posted by gatorae at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
:_: this is the world I want.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
Every day of my life has become centered around helping kids with disabilities. It is straight up wonderful to see this woman on the DNC stage.
posted by vverse23 at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by vverse23 at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
"Donald Trump has shown everyone who he is, and I honestly feel bad for anyone with that much hate in their heart."
I'm bawling.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [30 favorites]
I'm bawling.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [30 favorites]
"I honestly feel bad for anyone with that much hate in their heart."
posted by fedward at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by fedward at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"I feel bad for someone with so much hate in their heart"
I could die of feelings right now
posted by Tarumba at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I could die of feelings right now
posted by Tarumba at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Guys the onions are back.
I am so happy right now to see a disabled person up on the stage in prime time at the DNC.
posted by Gaz Errant at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I am so happy right now to see a disabled person up on the stage in prime time at the DNC.
posted by Gaz Errant at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
"Donald Trump doesn't hear me, doesn't see me, and he doesn't speak for me."
posted by winna at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by winna at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
You guys, I did not stock nearly enough wine and tissues for this, I was not ready
posted by Andrhia at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Andrhia at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Hell of a speech. Glad the boos have stopped.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I just remembered that Bush I passed the Americans with Disabilities act. Can you imagine the Republicans doing anything that compassionate now?
posted by octothorpe at 6:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 6:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
That was truly powerful.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 6:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Hairy Lobster at 6:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I dunno, this looks like blatant pandering for the Irish-Nicaraguan-American vote. {/}
posted by zombieflanders at 6:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 6:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
It sure is better to cry from this feeling than how I was crying last week.
posted by mollweide at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by mollweide at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Goddamnit my allergies are acting up and someone is cutting onions and i don't know anymore...
posted by ramix at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ramix at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
That was good.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016
I'm crying alone in my living room. That woman has more courage than I'll ever have.
posted by bluecore at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by bluecore at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Damn. Ms. Somoza following that ad about Trump mocking the reporter with the disability was a gut punch. Fuck that guy so hard.
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
You wouldn't think the actual process of inclusion would be so revolutionary in this day and age but sure enough it is.
Inclusion matter, visibility matters.
posted by vuron at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [30 favorites]
Inclusion matter, visibility matters.
posted by vuron at 6:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [30 favorites]
By the way, for an interesting perspective, I was on Periscope and there were several live feeds from people on the convention floor in Philadephia. Totally grassroots media, unfiltered.
posted by Quiplash at 6:10 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Quiplash at 6:10 PM on July 25, 2016
Coming up, someone who's never made fun of the disabled: Sarah Silverman!
posted by paper chromatographologist at 6:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by paper chromatographologist at 6:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Regarding "Madame President," I think "Ms. President" would be a good analogue to "Mr." Presumably Hillary could choose her own style, since we are in uncharted territory here.
posted by Pallas Athena at 6:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Pallas Athena at 6:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Are they putting band risers up or something?
posted by sideshow at 6:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by sideshow at 6:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Whoever mentioned or suggested changing to CSPAN, thank you.
posted by cashman at 6:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by cashman at 6:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I think she would pick Madame President. Although Ms. President is good, too. It's all so good.
posted by zutalors! at 6:11 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zutalors! at 6:11 PM on July 25, 2016
I have heard Hillary surrogates say that she really helps people, she really listens, she follows up -- but it is so powerful to have the actual people testify to that in their own words. It is really showing me a side of her I did not know. Makes me even madder and more disgusted with how maligned she is.
posted by madamjujujive at 6:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by madamjujujive at 6:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Anastasia Somoza has an SNL connection as well - she took on Amy Poehler over her portrayal of people with CP.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 6:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 6:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Are they putting band risers up or something?
Paul Simon's coming up, methinks.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 6:12 PM on July 25, 2016
Paul Simon's coming up, methinks.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 6:12 PM on July 25, 2016
I've actually got a really nice feed (even over wireless!) coming from www.democonvention.com/live
posted by Mooski at 6:13 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Mooski at 6:13 PM on July 25, 2016
You wouldn't think the actual process of inclusion would be so revolutionary in this day and age but sure enough it is.
Inclusion matter, visibility matters.
As the dad of a kid with Down syndrome who will be entering the third grade this fall, inclusion is EVERYTHING. When he was able to get health insurance thanks to Obamacare when he was an infant, that was everything. Now that I'm watching him keep up with his classmates in school, inclusion is everything. Was the word uttered even once at the RNC?
posted by vverse23 at 6:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
Inclusion matter, visibility matters.
As the dad of a kid with Down syndrome who will be entering the third grade this fall, inclusion is EVERYTHING. When he was able to get health insurance thanks to Obamacare when he was an infant, that was everything. Now that I'm watching him keep up with his classmates in school, inclusion is everything. Was the word uttered even once at the RNC?
posted by vverse23 at 6:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
Isn't Mrs./Missus a contraction of Mistress? I'd go for Madame, myself.
You wouldn't think the actual process of inclusion would be so revolutionary in this day and age but sure enough it is.
Inclusion matter, visibility matters.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:13 PM on July 25, 2016
You wouldn't think the actual process of inclusion would be so revolutionary in this day and age but sure enough it is.
Inclusion matter, visibility matters.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:13 PM on July 25, 2016
What's wrong with "Madame President"? It's not like it's "Dame President" now that would be inappropriate.
posted by Ndwright at 6:13 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Ndwright at 6:13 PM on July 25, 2016
You wouldn't think the actual process of inclusion would be so revolutionary in this day and age but sure enough it is.
Inclusion matter, visibility matters.
Yes, so very much. That is why all the talk of HRC "pandering" is nonsense. She does listen and she does reach out and she does try to be inclusive. This is why the RNC was such a joke. Oh they tried their best to appear like they were diverse and inclusive but having a gay man up on the stage while the party platform is anit-LGBTQ is perverse.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Inclusion matter, visibility matters.
Yes, so very much. That is why all the talk of HRC "pandering" is nonsense. She does listen and she does reach out and she does try to be inclusive. This is why the RNC was such a joke. Oh they tried their best to appear like they were diverse and inclusive but having a gay man up on the stage while the party platform is anit-LGBTQ is perverse.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I have heard Hillary surrogates say that she really helps people, she really listens, she follows up -- but it is so powerful to have the actual people testify to that in their own words. It is really showing me a side of her I did not know. Makes me even madder and more disgusted with how maligned she is.
She's had a LOT of campaign videos that are just someone telling her their story one on one while she nods along and gives them encouragement to keep going, to keep telling, because she hears them and sees them.
I know it's not the sexy stuff of campaigning but listening is really her wheelhouse.
posted by zutalors! at 6:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
putting ableism on notice like that. "sees me" echoing Loretta Lynch. This is what it is, this is what we're getting and it's pretty fucking amazing. I hope the frustrated bernie delegates are able to understand why this is an historic and defining moment.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
(Obviously Clinton could pick something else, but I believe "Madam" is the title generally used in English for heads of state from other countries.)
posted by Lyn Never at 6:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Lyn Never at 6:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
What's wrong with "Madame President"?
I look forward to many years of debate on the Frenchness of that e.
posted by rokusan at 6:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I look forward to many years of debate on the Frenchness of that e.
posted by rokusan at 6:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Marcia Fudge's interview on PBS is weirdly trying to play both sides to Hillary/Sanders supporters.
"Sure, we all want free tuition, but there's got to be a way to pay for it."
If that's the case, add a plank to the platform to investigate the matter more thoroughly, and come up with proposals for 2020.
The DNC is inexplicably reluctant to acknowledge that it adopted about 80% of what Sanders wanted into its platform (and, for a group of politicians, they aren't doing a great job dodging other 20% -- "We'll look into it" is a much more effective dodge than "Well, isn't that special").
As I've mentioned before, I'm incredibly happy with how the platform is turning out. I genuinely do not understand why the party officials are so bad at delivering the message.
The speakers seem to be doing a great job of tying together a cohesive message in spite of the DNC, not because of it. Thank God they're getting the stage time.
posted by schmod at 6:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"Sure, we all want free tuition, but there's got to be a way to pay for it."
If that's the case, add a plank to the platform to investigate the matter more thoroughly, and come up with proposals for 2020.
The DNC is inexplicably reluctant to acknowledge that it adopted about 80% of what Sanders wanted into its platform (and, for a group of politicians, they aren't doing a great job dodging other 20% -- "We'll look into it" is a much more effective dodge than "Well, isn't that special").
As I've mentioned before, I'm incredibly happy with how the platform is turning out. I genuinely do not understand why the party officials are so bad at delivering the message.
The speakers seem to be doing a great job of tying together a cohesive message in spite of the DNC, not because of it. Thank God they're getting the stage time.
posted by schmod at 6:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Mrs/Miss refers to a state of matrimony. Ms is an attempt to cut through that but I've never liked the sound, it's very informal. Madame is far more dignified.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Isn't Mrs./Missus a contraction of Mistress? I'd go for Madame, myself.
Ms. would be an obvious homegrown alternative.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Ms. would be an obvious homegrown alternative.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I hope the frustrated bernie delegates are able to understand why this is an historic and defining moment.
It might get a little dicey when Elizabeth Warren speaks, since a lot of people (including this one) were hoping for a better female candidate... but they'll get over it, and she'll do.
posted by rokusan at 6:17 PM on July 25, 2016
It might get a little dicey when Elizabeth Warren speaks, since a lot of people (including this one) were hoping for a better female candidate... but they'll get over it, and she'll do.
posted by rokusan at 6:17 PM on July 25, 2016
Who would have thought Sarah Silverman would unify the party truly what did 2016 smoke?
posted by Tarumba at 6:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 6:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
HRM Hillary Clinton obviously guys none of this Madam nonsense
posted by vuron at 6:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by vuron at 6:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This is good. I LIKE this.
posted by Mooski at 6:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Mooski at 6:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"All it takes is everyone" is a nice line.
posted by dersins at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dersins at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
oh damn burnnnnnnn
posted by Foci for Analysis at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016
Good "it takes a village line" from Sarah Silverman.
posted by zombieflanders at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Well, Silverman just lost Hillary the third grader vote.
posted by tonycpsu at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Sarah Silverman...She's gonna shred everyone in the room dry and wry and leave no one unscathed.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
BURN
posted by zombieflanders at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zombieflanders at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016
God damn it kind of chaps my ass that the country has been around nearly 250 years and we'll only be settling the proper form of honorific for a woman as the head of state now.
Could always go with "Mx President". Merriam-Webster even put it in the dictionary. But I expect it will be "Madame".
posted by R343L at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Could always go with "Mx President". Merriam-Webster even put it in the dictionary. But I expect it will be "Madame".
posted by R343L at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
MAYBE DON'T BOO.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I've never cared for Silverman's comedy but I'm a big fan right now.
posted by gatorae at 6:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 6:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
This makes me really happy. I'd been sort of afraid Silverman would go Full BoB.
posted by Lyn Never at 6:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 6:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
What about non gender binary people though, what do we title them
or maybe there is no need for gendering our honorifics
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
or maybe there is no need for gendering our honorifics
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"The only person to be over qualified for the job As President"
posted by mrzarquon at 6:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 6:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
"Hillary heard the passions of the people behind Bernie and brought them into the platform and that is the process of democracy at its best, and it's very good to see. Hillary is our Democratic nominee and I will PROUDLY vote for her." - never thought it would be Sarah Silverman giving a powerful coming together plea, but she's nailing it.
"I will proudly vote for Hillary as I continue to be moved by and inspired by Bernie"
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
"I will proudly vote for Hillary as I continue to be moved by and inspired by Bernie"
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
"The only person to be over qualified for the job As President"
Yes! That is actually true, and indeed required for women.
posted by zutalors! at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Ho lee shit
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I was under the impression that Ms. denoted marriage status too, that it was for unmarried adult women.
Speaking of, I have this weird mental stumble about typing e.g. "Mrs. Gillibrand" or "Mrs. Clinton", with women in positions of authority and power. Same thing with fictional characters. I derailed a very long essay wondering about Ms or Mrs. or Dr. Annalise Keating.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
Speaking of, I have this weird mental stumble about typing e.g. "Mrs. Gillibrand" or "Mrs. Clinton", with women in positions of authority and power. Same thing with fictional characters. I derailed a very long essay wondering about Ms or Mrs. or Dr. Annalise Keating.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
MetaFilter: Boo-yah, Baba Booey.
posted by tonycpsu at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tonycpsu at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"A few years ago she was just a secretary and now she's going to be president."
posted by fedward at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by fedward at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"To the Bernie or Bust people, you are being ridiculous."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [75 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [75 favorites]
Hah!
posted by prize bull octorok at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by prize bull octorok at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
oh shit "Can I just say to the Bernie or Bust people - you're being ridiculous." HUGE APPLAUSE
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Silverman: "To the Bernie or Bust people: you're being ridiculous"
posted by zachlipton at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Yay Sarah!
posted by homunculus at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by homunculus at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
Holy shit.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by JakeEXTREME at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
yessssss
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
Silverman just won the convention with "you're being ridiculous"
posted by dersins at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by dersins at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
FUCK YEAH
posted by zombieflanders at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
OH NO SHE DIDN'T!
posted by tonycpsu at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
MAYBE DON'T BOO.
If I were there I'd wear my face out counter cheering.
posted by zutalors! at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
Bernie or Bust people - you're being ridiculous! <3
posted by triggerfinger at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by triggerfinger at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Calling out the Bernie or Bust people.
posted by mrzarquon at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Go Sarah!
posted by maggiemaggie at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by maggiemaggie at 6:21 PM on July 25, 2016
Thank you, Sarah Silverman.
posted by Gaz Errant at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Gaz Errant at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016
I LOVE SARAH SILVERMAN FOREVER
posted by vverse23 at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by vverse23 at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
OMG
I can't believe Sarah Silverman just went there. "Bernie or Bust people, you're being ridiculous."
posted by Superplin at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I can't believe Sarah Silverman just went there. "Bernie or Bust people, you're being ridiculous."
posted by Superplin at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Holy shit Sarah Silverman, that was awesome.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Oh, snap.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016
Thank God they can fix this in post.
posted by klarck at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by klarck at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
This wasn't in the script.
posted by zachlipton at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The cheers after "Bernie-or-bust people are being ridiculous" seriously put the volume levels in perspective.
posted by schmod at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by schmod at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
I mean, Sarah Silverman will fuck you up just with a look.
SHE DID IT.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
SHE DID IT.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Wow, Sarah Silverman just went ahead and said it. Awesome.
posted by defenestration at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by defenestration at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Silverman: "Thank god they can fix this in post."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"Thank god they can fix this in post"
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"They made me cut my speech and now we have to stretch."
posted by fedward at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by fedward at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
What was that Trump shade - "instead of human touch and coping skills"?
posted by NorthernLite at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by NorthernLite at 6:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Holy fuck I love Sarah Silverman so gd much right now
posted by schadenfrau at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Shit man I love it but I feel like that just shattered the goodwill she built up with that speech :(
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016
SS: "We probably can fix this in post"
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I don't get second hand embarrassment like ever, and I'm dying inside right now.
posted by cashman at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by cashman at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Dammit mandolin!
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016
BEST DAD JOKE BAND INTRO EVER!!
posted by soundguy99 at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by soundguy99 at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Thank God Paul Simon came out.
posted by cashman at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by cashman at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Did I just hear "bullshit" chants?
posted by waitingtoderail at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by waitingtoderail at 6:23 PM on July 25, 2016
I'm shocked that they couldn't do a bit better at the improv time-killing bit though. They were sort of dying out there.
posted by tonycpsu at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
also I forgot I had that huge crush on Sarah Silverman
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"To the Bernie or bust people - you're being ridiculous. They told us to stretch so I figured I'd add that." - Sarah Silverman.
LOVE.
posted by dnash at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
LOVE.
posted by dnash at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
This is the Dad Pun of intro songs.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016
The DNC is inexplicably reluctant to acknowledge that it adopted about 80% of what Sanders wanted into its platform... I genuinely do not understand why the party officials are so bad at delivering the message.
Platforms get ignored too often for me to place much faith there, but it's sure nice that it's at least nominally recognized.
I agree they should have spent all day thanking/crediting Sanders for that, before gradually transitioning all attention to Clinton over the next few days. It would have been more gracious and more graceful all at once.
posted by rokusan at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Platforms get ignored too often for me to place much faith there, but it's sure nice that it's at least nominally recognized.
I agree they should have spent all day thanking/crediting Sanders for that, before gradually transitioning all attention to Clinton over the next few days. It would have been more gracious and more graceful all at once.
posted by rokusan at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I blame Paul Simon for all of that chaos.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Sarah Silverman is gonna go vape so hard right now. Loved her sass posture after dropping that "Ridiculous" bomb.
posted by JauntyFedora at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by JauntyFedora at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
That fucking owned.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
For those who don't know, Sarah was was in the ICU at Cedars fighting for her life something like 3 weeks ago.
posted by sideshow at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
posted by sideshow at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
If the message is unity, where's Art Garfunkel?
posted by fedward at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
posted by fedward at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
Is somebody telling the audio operator "Hey, turn up the crowd mics so we can hear the boos more clearly"
posted by schmod at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by schmod at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016
Jeez, he's no Garfunkel.
posted by Scram at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Scram at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Goddamn, I cannot get a zinger off first tonight.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Sarah Silverman is awesome, but I am so ready for all the conventions to just be over.
posted by omredux at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by omredux at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016
hahah, good song choice paul.
posted by mrjohnmuller at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by mrjohnmuller at 6:25 PM on July 25, 2016
Presumably a Gore cameo is coming up if he starts into "Call Me Al"
posted by snofoam at 6:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by snofoam at 6:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I hope that Sarah is well enough now to have a drink.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:26 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:26 PM on July 25, 2016
At first I was thinking Paul Simon-D Illinois but then remembered he died also.
posted by hal9k at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by hal9k at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016
Jesus, techs, throw some reverb on the guy - his voice ain't what it used to be, don't let it just sit out there naked.
posted by soundguy99 at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by soundguy99 at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Her social media is going to look like hell on earth.
posted by argybarg at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I don't get the NEED to pander so hard to the Burners. I keep hearing about how there should be repeated capitulations to that particular camp, is that really a thing that has ever happened before in the history of Presidential nominations?
posted by JakeEXTREME at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by JakeEXTREME at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
My husband just pointed out that Paul Simon isn't wearing an in-ear monitor, which given the obviously cruddy floor monitor situation all day is a pretty baller move. He can hear the piano acoustically but damn, still.
posted by Lyn Never at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
wait, wha, why was Sarah Silverman in the ICU??
posted by Don Pepino at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Don Pepino at 6:27 PM on July 25, 2016
Well after a rocky dare I say typically Democratic start to the convention we seem to be getting things on track.
Hopefully this will put to bed the idea that the BoB contingent are a major component.
They are loud and vocal but they are a small minority. I just wish they could transfer all that passion into building something new and dynamic rather than trying to tear everything down.
posted by vuron at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Hopefully this will put to bed the idea that the BoB contingent are a major component.
They are loud and vocal but they are a small minority. I just wish they could transfer all that passion into building something new and dynamic rather than trying to tear everything down.
posted by vuron at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Shoulda done something from his new album.
posted by the bricabrac man at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by the bricabrac man at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016
one person chanting Hillary and another chanting Unity great headlines asshole
Now Paul's croaking out a song off key about peace that is like custom built to piss off non baby boomers. Fuck.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Now Paul's croaking out a song off key about peace that is like custom built to piss off non baby boomers. Fuck.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Don Pepino, she had a really rare infection.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016
he doesn't have the range
posted by DynamiteToast at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by DynamiteToast at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
and now, the entirety of Rhythm of the Saints
posted by theodolite at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I just checked his pitch on my piano and he's busting out non-falsetto F sharps with no problem. Respect.
posted by Pallas Athena at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Pallas Athena at 6:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Is somebody telling the audio operator "Hey, turn up the crowd mics so we can hear the boos more clearly"
Someone was saying on Twitter that some of the networks are set up right next to the California delegation which contains some of the most vocal boo-ers, so they get a disproportionate amount of sound from them. I missed the reaction to Sarah Silverman, but I've been watching on the YouTube stream and have barely heard anything in terms of boos since I tuned in a couple hours ago.
posted by Copronymus at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Someone was saying on Twitter that some of the networks are set up right next to the California delegation which contains some of the most vocal boo-ers, so they get a disproportionate amount of sound from them. I missed the reaction to Sarah Silverman, but I've been watching on the YouTube stream and have barely heard anything in terms of boos since I tuned in a couple hours ago.
posted by Copronymus at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
While we are listening to Bridge Over Troubled Waters let me add this to the M___ President discussion. In the South you still hear the honorific Miss (first name) for older ladies that you know (so I am Miss Laura to you youngens) but it is pronounced Miz. This means it sounds just like Ms. Maybe that's why I feel it is a bit informal.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Her social media is going to look like hell on earth.
Yeah just went over to her Facebook and the comments on her post about tonight.... ugh.
posted by thefoxgod at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Never heckle a comedian, dumbasses. You almost never come out of it looking like the better person (or people in this case).
posted by zombieflanders at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I hate to say it but: keming.
Sarah Sil Verman
ah god. Sorry I'm afflicted with that.
But beyond typography issues: HOLY SHIT. I know that I was prone to emotionality before I was a dad. But this stage, tonight, however choreographed, has been one of the most amazing, inclusive, encouraging, heartening things I've seen in my lifetime. And that includes works of fiction. Which this, as much as we portray it to be, is not. This is actually real. And happening. People championing people.
Imagine that.
posted by rp at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Sarah Sil Verman
ah god. Sorry I'm afflicted with that.
But beyond typography issues: HOLY SHIT. I know that I was prone to emotionality before I was a dad. But this stage, tonight, however choreographed, has been one of the most amazing, inclusive, encouraging, heartening things I've seen in my lifetime. And that includes works of fiction. Which this, as much as we portray it to be, is not. This is actually real. And happening. People championing people.
Imagine that.
posted by rp at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
And a G. Go Paul!
posted by Pallas Athena at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Pallas Athena at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Thank you, Mr. Simon.
posted by TrishaU at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by TrishaU at 6:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Senator Franken tried to force a "Bridge Over Troubled Water" joke, when "Call Me Al" was just sitting there.
posted by enjoymoreradio at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by enjoymoreradio at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Don Pepino: wait, wha, why was Sarah Silverman in the ICU??
Sudden episode of epiglottis, I think.
posted by bluecore at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Sudden episode of epiglottis, I think.
posted by bluecore at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Just remember: Sarah Silverman will fuck you up.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2016
Sarah Silverman Says Freak Case of Epiglottis Almost Killed Her
posted by palindromic at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by palindromic at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2016
Don Pepino: http://variety.com/2016/biz/news/sarah-silverman-icu-epiglottitis-almost-killed-her-1201809623/
posted by sideshow at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by sideshow at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2016
Could somebody say what songs Paul Simon is playing, for a fan who can't watch live?
posted by Pope Guilty at 6:31 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Pope Guilty at 6:31 PM on July 25, 2016
Paul's croaking out a song off key about peace that is like custom built to piss off non baby boomers. Fuck.
WUT?
I'm not a Boomer.
I thought he nailed it.
posted by Cookiebastard at 6:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
WUT?
I'm not a Boomer.
I thought he nailed it.
posted by Cookiebastard at 6:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Just Bridge Over Troubled Waters, and it was pretty rough, to be honest.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Cuomo said all these things? Christ, I've lived in a bubble, Internet or no.
posted by Mooski at 6:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Mooski at 6:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I don't get the NEED to pander so hard to the Burners. I keep hearing about how there should be repeated capitulations to that particular camp, is that really a thing that has ever happened before in the history of Presidential nominations?
I don't see it as pandering to the BoB people in particular, but to the broader group of enthusiastic, generally young, Bernie supporters who are going to be voting for Clinton but are unexcited by it.
A whole lotta young, previously politically disengaged voters got really excited by a more liberal candidate this year, and ignoring that and going on with the status quo risks losing a lot of enthusiasm the dems can tie to themselves in the future.
posted by neonrev at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
I don't see it as pandering to the BoB people in particular, but to the broader group of enthusiastic, generally young, Bernie supporters who are going to be voting for Clinton but are unexcited by it.
A whole lotta young, previously politically disengaged voters got really excited by a more liberal candidate this year, and ignoring that and going on with the status quo risks losing a lot of enthusiasm the dems can tie to themselves in the future.
posted by neonrev at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
A Mario Cuomo retrospective now.
posted by winna at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah, I had no idea about Cuomo. Crying again.
posted by Lyn Never at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Lyn Never at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
He sang Bridge Over Troubled Water, and it made me wish Art was there.
posted by enjoymoreradio at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by enjoymoreradio at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I guess I never heard Cuomo speak, did he grow up on the same street as Al Pacino or something?
posted by sideshow at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by sideshow at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016
Bridge Over Troubled Water
posted by peacheater at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by peacheater at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I miss that Cuomo.
posted by octothorpe at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 6:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
As a naturalized citizen I had never heard Cuomo before. What a lovely man and how ahead of the times he was!
posted by Tarumba at 6:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 6:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Haha I wonder if Simons song sounded worse on CSPAN like they just threw a room mic on it and called it a day.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:34 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:34 PM on July 25, 2016
Eva Longoria: "I'm ninth generation American. My family never crossed a border; the border crossed us."
posted by winna at 6:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [46 favorites]
posted by winna at 6:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [46 favorites]
I wouldn't have picked Sarah Silverman as the one doing the job -- though I expected it would be one of the women on stage tonight -- but she's definitely dealt with worse hecklers in her time.
posted by holgate at 6:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by holgate at 6:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
here's hoping trump ends up being "a walnut in the batter of eternity"
posted by murphy slaw at 6:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 6:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Actors > Comedians
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:35 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:35 PM on July 25, 2016
You know, if all the Hillary people would just start chanting "Hillary" every time the Bernie people chanted "Bernie," they could take the chant over.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 6:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Spathe Cadet at 6:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I was under the impression that Ms. denoted marriage status too, that it was for unmarried adult women.
Nope. MS. was formulated as a specifically non-man dependent honorific for women. Hence Ms. Magazine.
posted by OmieWise at 6:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Nope. MS. was formulated as a specifically non-man dependent honorific for women. Hence Ms. Magazine.
posted by OmieWise at 6:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Aren't these people booing loudly and drowning out speakers like, ashamed of themselves? I'm trying to imagine myself at a convention watching someone I don't like get nominated, and I think I'd just sit there grumpily silently harumphing.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 6:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 6:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"It turns out America is pretty great already."
posted by winna at 6:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by winna at 6:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
"Guess what Donald, America is pretty great already."
Thank you, Eva Longoria. Sit on it, Donald.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Thank you, Eva Longoria. Sit on it, Donald.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I don't get the NEED to pander so hard to the Burners. I keep hearing about how there should be repeated capitulations to that particular camp, is that really a thing that has ever happened before in the history of Presidential nominations?
I don't see it as pandering to the BoB people in particular, but to the broader group of enthusiastic, generally young, Bernie supporters who are going to be voting for Clinton but are unexcited by it.
I'm skeptical about this supposedly super liberal great young contingent that's our future. They've grown up saturated in anti Hillary propaganda - some of them were born in the Bill administration. I think they have a warped idea of who she is and have barely looked into her policies.
posted by zutalors! at 6:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Oh shit this is gonna be something Bookers on one I can tell.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Simon should have gone with "Late in the Evening"
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 6:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 6:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
F yeah, Eva!
posted by areaperson at 6:37 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by areaperson at 6:37 PM on July 25, 2016
The bicentennial was forty years ago? I thought for sure his math was wrong, but, nope, I'm just old.
posted by mollweide at 6:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by mollweide at 6:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I'm honestly kind of surprised that the actor is the one killing it with the speech. Longoria's delivery was incredibly natural, but she doesn't do public speaking on the level of the politicians and comedians the preceded her and kind of scraped by.
posted by indubitable at 6:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by indubitable at 6:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Reading this long list of prominent Republicans endorsing Clinton, I'm struck by the absence of women. I only see one woman on the whole thing, which is shocking to me.
posted by NortonDC at 6:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by NortonDC at 6:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"Our founding fathers put forth founding documents that were indeed genius. But they weren't genius because they were perfect."
posted by winna at 6:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by winna at 6:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Cory does this well.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:38 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:38 PM on July 25, 2016
Booing again while talking about black civil rights.
This is terrible
posted by Tarumba at 6:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
This is terrible
posted by Tarumba at 6:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
Did I hear Paul Simon throw in a "troubled wooder" for Philly?
posted by knuckle tattoos at 6:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by knuckle tattoos at 6:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"Every generation has successfully labored to make us a more perfect union. Generations of heroic Americans have made our nation more inclusive, more expansive and more just."
posted by winna at 6:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 6:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
For anyone who didn't sit though the RNC one of the biggest differences is the speakers are coming out sober and happy. Most of the non-political speakers at the RNC came out sounding drunk and angry.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Seriously, is that Randy Jackson sitting with Bill Clinton?
posted by Rykey at 6:39 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Rykey at 6:39 PM on July 25, 2016
Yeah at this point the boo-ers are simply establishing themselves as members of the Asshole Party, nothing else.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 6:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 6:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I had no idea about Cuomo. Crying again.
I saw Mario Cuomo speak at a stupid hour (UK time) for the 1992 convention, when I was completely new to American election politics, and particularly the rah-rah of conventions -- this was just after Labour's defeat in an election that many people expected them to win, an election where I knocked on a lot of doors -- and it was remarkable to watch.
posted by holgate at 6:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I saw Mario Cuomo speak at a stupid hour (UK time) for the 1992 convention, when I was completely new to American election politics, and particularly the rah-rah of conventions -- this was just after Labour's defeat in an election that many people expected them to win, an election where I knocked on a lot of doors -- and it was remarkable to watch.
posted by holgate at 6:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Zutalors, you don't need propaganda or misinformation or any warping to rationalize why young people tend to prefer Sanders to Clinton. The younger generations are much more liberal than the Clintons and those who elected/support them. I mean, they invented triangulation and center-right neoliberalism, and none of that is in fashion anymore.
Being young... well, they're also not particularly patient. It's easy to understand.
If the party and country is going to move left, it'll be those young people, not the Clintons, who drag it there.
(Hopefully with less booing.)
posted by rokusan at 6:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Being young... well, they're also not particularly patient. It's easy to understand.
If the party and country is going to move left, it'll be those young people, not the Clintons, who drag it there.
(Hopefully with less booing.)
posted by rokusan at 6:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Cory Booker is the baddest-ass politician in the country. The BoB's showed him not respect and that's no cool at all.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
"Rugged individualism didn't defeat the British, get us to the moon, map the human genome... we did that together" - Cory Booker
posted by the turtle's teeth at 6:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
posted by the turtle's teeth at 6:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
"You can't love your country without loving your countrymen and countrywomen."
posted by tonycpsu at 6:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 6:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Invoking 'a more perfect union' is a little on the nose for me. It's like quoting the Gettysburg Address for me at this point.
posted by the_querulous_night at 6:41 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by the_querulous_night at 6:41 PM on July 25, 2016
"This is the high call of patriotism. Patriotism is the love of country, but you can't love your country without loving your fellow countryman and countrywomen."
posted by winna at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by winna at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
> Reading this long list of prominent Republicans endorsing Clinton, I'm struck by the absence of women. I only see one woman on the whole thing, which is shocking to me
How many prominent female Republicans are there?
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
How many prominent female Republicans are there?
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Zutalors, you don't need propaganda or misinformation or any warping to rationalize why young people tend to prefer Sanders to Clinton. The younger generations are much more liberal than the Clintons, who invented center-right neoliberalism.
I actually disagree that Sanders was some super progressive candidate with original ideas.
posted by zutalors! at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
"You can't love your country without loving your countrymen, and your countrywomen." Preach it, Mr. Booker.
posted by Superplin at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Superplin at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Reading this long list of prominent Republicans endorsing Clinton, I'm struck by the absence of women. I only see one woman on the whole thing, which is shocking to me.
Have you not been paying attention to how badly women who publicly express support for Hillary have been treated? It's one thing for men to express apostasy "just this once", but when women do it it's a whole other level of sexism, misogyny, and abuse.
posted by fedward at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Have you not been paying attention to how badly women who publicly express support for Hillary have been treated? It's one thing for men to express apostasy "just this once", but when women do it it's a whole other level of sexism, misogyny, and abuse.
posted by fedward at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Wow, interesting contrast on "love" vs. "tolerance" from Booker. This is cool.
posted by Salieri at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 6:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
They've grown up saturated in anti Hillary propaganda - some of them were born in the Bill administration. I think they have a warped idea of who she is and have barely looked into her policies.
Oh, that's definitely true, but those kids aren't going to be voting for Clinton forever, and it's better for the party to draw them in by at least acknowledging their presence. For a lot of them, they've never had cause to be excited by a platform more than a person, and encouraging the younger democrats to be more liberal rather than more cautious is what gives me hope for my future.
posted by neonrev at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Oh, that's definitely true, but those kids aren't going to be voting for Clinton forever, and it's better for the party to draw them in by at least acknowledging their presence. For a lot of them, they've never had cause to be excited by a platform more than a person, and encouraging the younger democrats to be more liberal rather than more cautious is what gives me hope for my future.
posted by neonrev at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I've seen Booker speak before and he is not doing so well tonight-- he is a bit shouty. Maybe he is wound up with excitement? I just want him to take a few deep breathes and relax a bit. Bring it down a notch before raising the roof.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"Every American has worth and value. Love recognizes that we need each other."
posted by winna at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"Love recognizes that we need each other. That we as a nation are better together. That when we are divided we are weak. That when we are together we are strong. That when we are indivisible, we are invincible."
posted by tonycpsu at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Booker would have been a great VP pick, but he's got a long future ahead of him.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Cory Booker: "We are invincible."
posted by rp at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by rp at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
librarina suggests that we're going to be seeing this guy again in, oh, eight years or so.
posted by stet at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by stet at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Maybe just give Booker his own mic and let him hang out on stage all week. On a couch or something.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Senor Cardgage at 6:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"If you want to go fast, go alone. If you want to go far, go together."
posted by hal9k at 6:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
posted by hal9k at 6:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
Also, I don't care how old or young you are, if you keep hawking a progressive message about only economics, not intersectional/identity politics, you will lose. Especially if we're talking about young people and the future, which will be majority minority.
posted by zutalors! at 6:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 6:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I've had some issues with Booker but he's being awesome tonight.
posted by octothorpe at 6:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 6:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"If you want to go fast, go alone. If you want to go far, go together."
(Crap, too slow. A line so awesome it needed to be said twice.)
posted by Salieri at 6:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
(Crap, too slow. A line so awesome it needed to be said twice.)
posted by Salieri at 6:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I suspect the speakers are raising their voices because what they hear is different than what we hear. We talk louder so we can hear ourselves.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by JakeEXTREME at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016
Reading this long list of prominent Republicans endorsing Clinton
The long list of establishment Republicans defecting to Clinton is both a striking testament to how much of a terrifying agent of chaos Donald Trump is, and a stark reminder that at the end of the day Clinton's chief stakeholders will still include the finance industry, the defense industry, and the energy industry.
posted by threeants at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
The long list of establishment Republicans defecting to Clinton is both a striking testament to how much of a terrifying agent of chaos Donald Trump is, and a stark reminder that at the end of the day Clinton's chief stakeholders will still include the finance industry, the defense industry, and the energy industry.
posted by threeants at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
DNC 2016: This Is What America Looks Like, And It's Pretty Swell
posted by mcdoublewide at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by mcdoublewide at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
librarina suggests that we're going to be seeing this guy again in, oh, eight years or so.
If we do, I hope he gets woke on public education between now and then.
posted by dersins at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
If we do, I hope he gets woke on public education between now and then.
posted by dersins at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Can they please fire the sound mixer after tonight? I mean I'm watching the feed straight from the DNC. Why are they keeping the levels from the floor so high? It's super distracting, even without any booing.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"We are not called to be a nation of tolerance. We are called to be a nation of love."
Fuck yeah. The contrast with that RNC shitshow couldn't be more stark.
posted by Cookiebastard at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Fuck yeah. The contrast with that RNC shitshow couldn't be more stark.
posted by Cookiebastard at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Also, big room. When you speak to a big room, you instinctively try and fill it, no matter how miked you are.
posted by Pallas Athena at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Pallas Athena at 6:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Booker has issues around the Newark schools that pisses off school advocates. But he's young and has time to learn from those mistakes.
posted by dw at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by dw at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"I'm from Jersey" ok get the mop it's about to be curtains son
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I'm from Jersey too, Cory!
posted by mollweide at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by mollweide at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Well, I'm from Jersey....
posted by anastasiav at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by anastasiav at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016
Seriously where are the Muslim speakers?
posted by Tarumba at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"I'm from Jersey and from the great garden state and we'd seen how he did things at Atlantic City."
posted by winna at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 6:46 PM on July 25, 2016
Jersey represent.
posted by defenestration at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by defenestration at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016
Someone was saying on Twitter that some of the networks are set up right next to the California delegation which contains some of the most vocal boo-ers, so they get a disproportionate amount of sound from them.
For what it's worth, I texted my dad about the booing and he said he must have missed it. I think he's the only person I know who's there right now, so I can't get other perspectives. At least from where he is I guess it's not noticeable.
posted by teponaztli at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016
For what it's worth, I texted my dad about the booing and he said he must have missed it. I think he's the only person I know who's there right now, so I can't get other perspectives. At least from where he is I guess it's not noticeable.
posted by teponaztli at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016
"in times of crisis, we don't abandon our values, we double down on them"
posted by misskaz at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by misskaz at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
threeants: The long list of establishment Republicans defecting to Clinton is both a striking testament to how much of a terrifying agent of chaos Donald Trump is, and a stark reminder that at the end of the day Clinton's chief stakeholders will still include the finance industry, the defense industry, and the energy industry.
I don't think you can count Republicans voting across party lines among her "chief stakeholders."
posted by Superplin at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I don't think you can count Republicans voting across party lines among her "chief stakeholders."
posted by Superplin at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"In times of crisis we don't abandon our values, we double down on them."
posted by winna at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by winna at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"In times of crisis, we don't abandon our values, we double down on them."
posted by biogeo at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 6:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Jersey girl here.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016
c'mon, time to wrap it up
posted by Foci for Analysis at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016
Also, big room. When you see a big room, you instinctively try and fill it, no matter how miked you are
Nah, I trust the professionals not to make me look like an idiot. Didn't work in this case.
posted by futz at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016
Nah, I trust the professionals not to make me look like an idiot. Didn't work in this case.
posted by futz at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016
Yay, Jersey!
posted by octothorpe at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by octothorpe at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016
"Our blessings sprang from ordinary Americans who gave extraordinary acts of kindness and love. I was told we can't pay those Americans back for their colossal acts of service, but we have an obligation to pay them forward."
posted by winna at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"War hawk" chants. Shut up.
posted by Salieri at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 6:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I've had my issues with Booker in the past, particularly over education, but I agree with dw that he's got time to learn.
posted by mollweide at 6:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mollweide at 6:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Shouts of "war hawk"
posted by zombieflanders at 6:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zombieflanders at 6:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
So did they use the Wu Tang music from Luke Cage for Cory Booker because damn he's kinda a superhero.
posted by vuron at 6:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by vuron at 6:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Seriously where are the Muslim speakers?
The schedule doesn't seem complete so there might be more but I see Khizr Khan scheduled for Thursday.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 6:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The schedule doesn't seem complete so there might be more but I see Khizr Khan scheduled for Thursday.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 6:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
On YouTube I'm hearing a small loud band chanting WAR HAWK WAR HAWK.
posted by anastasiav at 6:49 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by anastasiav at 6:49 PM on July 25, 2016
I suspect the speakers are raising their voices because what they hear is different than what we hear. We talk louder so we can hear ourselves.
Politicians are professional speakers-- or they should be. They need to know how to play the audience. Slowing it down, connecting, reading the audience to gauge response. He has a good speech and he should let it out but his voice is already getting raspy because he has been screaming it out. I don't know. Maybe the acoustics are bad in that place, yet Sarah Silverman seemed to have no problem sounding natural.
I realize there is booing, there will be booing in politics. He needs to learn to deal with it.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Politicians are professional speakers-- or they should be. They need to know how to play the audience. Slowing it down, connecting, reading the audience to gauge response. He has a good speech and he should let it out but his voice is already getting raspy because he has been screaming it out. I don't know. Maybe the acoustics are bad in that place, yet Sarah Silverman seemed to have no problem sounding natural.
I realize there is booing, there will be booing in politics. He needs to learn to deal with it.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Hm. So basically they talk over the black people. Got it.
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 6:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
Where's the button to favorite what Cory's preaching?
posted by Mooski at 6:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Mooski at 6:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
It's so satisfying hearing the chanting assholes give up.
posted by penduluum at 6:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 6:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I think the cracking yelling about love is a nice contrast to growly shouting about keeping out brown folks.
posted by ftm at 6:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ftm at 6:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Someone fill us in what the context of "war hawk" is. For me at least it's nonsensical.
posted by mcstayinskool at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by mcstayinskool at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016
You guys must be watching a different episode of The Bachelorette than I'm currently watching because I'm not following any of this commentary.
posted by bologna on wry at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by bologna on wry at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Hm. So basically they talk over the black people. Got it.
Yep. So liberal!
posted by zutalors! at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Yep. So liberal!
posted by zutalors! at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Jersey high five! I mean I realize these are feel-good platitudes but I like these platitudes and they make me feel good.
Agreed with Secret Life of Gravy about the acoustics.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016
Agreed with Secret Life of Gravy about the acoustics.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016
Can anyone hear what those people are chanting?
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016
who is chanting black lives matter right now and why is it happening
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's so satisfying hearing the chanting assholes give up.
Well, it would be.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016
Well, it would be.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016
Someone is chanting "Black Lives Matter" over Cory?
posted by mrzarquon at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Chants of Black Lives Matter
posted by peacheater at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by peacheater at 6:51 PM on July 25, 2016
I'm going to say it now. Those chanters chanting now are plants or Trump people or whatever. No group of people who support Black Lives Matter is going to fucking chant over Corey Booker.
posted by cashman at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by cashman at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Hm. So basically they talk over the black people. Got it.
Well, the shouters are chanting "Black Lives Matter" now, so, it's complicated
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Well, the shouters are chanting "Black Lives Matter" now, so, it's complicated
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"Black lives matter" chant. Actually appropriate chant finally.
posted by biogeo at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by biogeo at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Being young... well, they're also not particularly patient. It's easy to understand.
People who aren't old enough to have seen optimistic revolutions go terribly bad tend to be more positive about the language of revolution, too. Incrementalism isn't something that seems obvious from the get-go. Speaking personally.
posted by you're a kitty! at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
People who aren't old enough to have seen optimistic revolutions go terribly bad tend to be more positive about the language of revolution, too. Incrementalism isn't something that seems obvious from the get-go. Speaking personally.
posted by you're a kitty! at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I don't think you can count Republicans voting across party lines among her "chief stakeholders."
The interests they represent-- certainly. They're not leaving Trump because the Republican Party all of a sudden got too bigoted for them (lol), they're leaving because Trump is insane, and Clinton is extremely smart and competent, and will do a better, more predictable job making sure the interests of their sector and of wealthy Americans continue to be pursued.
posted by threeants at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The interests they represent-- certainly. They're not leaving Trump because the Republican Party all of a sudden got too bigoted for them (lol), they're leaving because Trump is insane, and Clinton is extremely smart and competent, and will do a better, more predictable job making sure the interests of their sector and of wealthy Americans continue to be pursued.
posted by threeants at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Black lives matter chants.
posted by yertledaturtle at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by yertledaturtle at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016
Not over, in support I think
posted by Tarumba at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Idk, the chants from the floor, good and bad, to me, make it feel really exciting.
I'm glad it's not an infomercial. It's full of rowdy and passionate people. I'm liking this.
posted by maggiemaggie at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
I'm glad it's not an infomercial. It's full of rowdy and passionate people. I'm liking this.
posted by maggiemaggie at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Booker pointed at where I think the chanters are and said something about regarding young protesters with empathy. Ha!
posted by winna at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by winna at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Black Lives were apparently less important when Elijah Cummings was on stage.
posted by palindromic at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Damn Cory finish up your voice, think of your voice.
posted by dis_integration at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dis_integration at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Where were the shouters in Cleveland?
Onstage
posted by hal9k at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
Onstage
posted by hal9k at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
Yeah let's mic check the black guy with a "black lives matter" chant. It's sealioning as ideological alignment
posted by penduluum at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 6:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
He's picked up the Obama "lemme tell yah"
posted by mrzarquon at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mrzarquon at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Not over, in support I think
I disagree. Chanting over me isn't supporting me.
posted by cashman at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I disagree. Chanting over me isn't supporting me.
posted by cashman at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I read the BLM chant more as with what he was saying rather than over or against it. Maybe I'm too optimistic.
posted by biogeo at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by biogeo at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016
In 2004 when Barack Obama spoke at the DNC I looked at my wife and said "Why isn't this guy running?"
When he ran, I worked my ass off to help get him elected and re-elected.
Watching Booker, I just turned to Mrs. Bastard and said "Why isn't this guy running?"
posted by Cookiebastard at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
When he ran, I worked my ass off to help get him elected and re-elected.
Watching Booker, I just turned to Mrs. Bastard and said "Why isn't this guy running?"
posted by Cookiebastard at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
Well I guess some of the BoBs are just frustrated that the PoC are low information voters. If they hadn't been so ignorant maybe they would've voted for the right candidate.
Because honestly the aggressiveness that I'm getting from the BoBs is what I would expect from a party full of drunk frat bros.
posted by vuron at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Because honestly the aggressiveness that I'm getting from the BoBs is what I would expect from a party full of drunk frat bros.
posted by vuron at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I like a crowd that can recite poetry along with the speaker
posted by rmless at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by rmless at 6:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
No group of people who support Black Lives Matter is going to fucking chant over Corey Booker.
I disagree.
posted by Rykey at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I disagree.
posted by Rykey at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Wow, Booker is on fire.
posted by homunculus at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Occasionally I wander from the computer where I'm streaming demconvention.com into the kitchen, where I've just got NPR on the radio (and beers in the fridge), and, okay, the NPR feed is definitely a bit ahead of the video, no problem. But then suddenly they go all Clippy on this shit, like "Hi! It looks like you're trying to listen to Cory Booker! Can I help you decide what to think about that?" JUST THE AUDIO WOULD BE FINE, THANKS.
posted by uosuaq at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by uosuaq at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I love this speech. Cory Booker is on point.
Twitch isn't picking up the chanting enough to bother me. I do not consider the booing multitude. That is giving them value.
posted by TrishaU at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Twitch isn't picking up the chanting enough to bother me. I do not consider the booing multitude. That is giving them value.
posted by TrishaU at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I actually disagree that Sanders was some super progressive candidate with original ideas.
I... don't remember saying any of that?
Myself, I think he was kind of a quirky odd candidate who got surprisingly far, mainly by coming across as plain and honest. None of his ideas were special, but there's no doubt he's further left than Hillary by just about any measure, and that's what I was speaking to. Younger generations are further left, and would prefer the Democratic party to be much further left, than the Clinton-era DNC-types seem to realize.
posted by rokusan at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I... don't remember saying any of that?
Myself, I think he was kind of a quirky odd candidate who got surprisingly far, mainly by coming across as plain and honest. None of his ideas were special, but there's no doubt he's further left than Hillary by just about any measure, and that's what I was speaking to. Younger generations are further left, and would prefer the Democratic party to be much further left, than the Clinton-era DNC-types seem to realize.
posted by rokusan at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I ran out of favorites
I did not know that was a thing
I HAVE SO MANY MORE FAVORITES LEFT TO GIVE
posted by schadenfrau at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
I did not know that was a thing
I HAVE SO MANY MORE FAVORITES LEFT TO GIVE
posted by schadenfrau at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
I've not left the office because I can't stop listening to the speeches.
posted by mrzarquon at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Also, where can I vote for Cory Booker for something
I'll take anything
Prom King?
posted by schadenfrau at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I'll take anything
Prom King?
posted by schadenfrau at 6:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Corey Booker, to no surprise, reminding everyone why he should have been the VP candidate.
Next time, I guess.
posted by rokusan at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Next time, I guess.
posted by rokusan at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I'm stunned that people are enjoying people screaming over Elijah Cummings Cory Booker. Can minorities ever get their fucking moment? Seriously. White people had their thing last week.
posted by zutalors! at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
We Will Rise
posted by lazaruslong at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by lazaruslong at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
That's right, think of Kennedy. Think of MLK. Now think of me.
(I love Cory, don't get me wrong.)
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
(I love Cory, don't get me wrong.)
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
BRB, going outside to sculpt a Corey Booker statue out of marble.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by Senor Cardgage at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I'm glad Corey yelled enough to drown out whoever these people are that are getting picked up by the mic.
posted by cashman at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by cashman at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm lukewarm on Booker, but this speech has been great.
posted by DynamiteToast at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by DynamiteToast at 6:55 PM on July 25, 2016
The floor is packed with people. Booker's Booker is uplifting and inspiring. What a fantastic palate changer.
posted by zarq at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zarq at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016
"Cynicism is a refuge for cowards, and this nation is, and must always be, the home of the brave" nice
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
"Cynicism is a refuge for cowards." Goddamn yes, Cory Booker.
posted by Superplin at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by Superplin at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Seriously where are the Muslim speakers?
Keith Ellison is on tonight!
posted by triggerfinger at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Keith Ellison is on tonight!
posted by triggerfinger at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
If you want to know about Corey Booker, watch Street Fight
posted by lalochezia at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by lalochezia at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016
"Cynicism is a refuge for cowards." FUCK YES
posted by biogeo at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Told y'all this some Hamilton junx rn
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
MSNBC showing Bill Clinton and Bernie Sanders, both realizing they are watching a future President.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
"My fellow Americans, we can no longer feel indifference about this election because the only thing that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing."
posted by winna at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by winna at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
> I've not left the office because I can't stop listening to the speeches
I let my children have popcorn and apple sauce and ice cream for dinner because I'm glued to the TV.
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
I let my children have popcorn and apple sauce and ice cream for dinner because I'm glued to the TV.
posted by The corpse in the library at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Bernie's face like a wet weekend
posted by triggerfinger at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by triggerfinger at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The "We Will Rise" speech that will be talked about for some time.
posted by cashman at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by cashman at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I'm stunned that people are enjoying people screaming over Elijah Cummings Cory Booker. Can minorities ever get their fucking moment? Seriously. White people had their thing last week.
Can you see the race of the people chanting?
posted by yertledaturtle at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016
Can you see the race of the people chanting?
posted by yertledaturtle at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016
Are Busters chanting over black people because they still hold a grudge about BLM taking the stage in the middle of that one Bernie speech?
posted by knuckle tattoos at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by knuckle tattoos at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016
Fantastic speech.
posted by defenestration at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by defenestration at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016
Myself, I think he was kind of a quirky odd candidate who got surprisingly far, mainly by coming across as plain and honest. None of his ideas were special, but there's no doubt he's further left than Hillary by just about any measure, and that's what I was speaking to. Younger generations are further left, and would prefer the Democratic party to be much further left, than the Clinton-era DNC-types seem to realize.
I disagree with this. I don't think he was that left, and I don't think it says anything about how younger people will engage with the process and vote. i think he's a tiny bit left of Hillary by a few measures.
posted by zutalors! at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
mrzarquon, I only just got home from work for the same reason
posted by zarq at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zarq at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016
Jesus christ Booker's glistening like he's sweating rhinestones
I wonder if politicians are used to places that might not be well miked, like outdoor rallies and football stadiums and shit. Sarah Silverman is used to talking to a camera.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I wonder if politicians are used to places that might not be well miked, like outdoor rallies and football stadiums and shit. Sarah Silverman is used to talking to a camera.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
When Booker runs for President I will knock doors until my knuckles are bloody.
posted by Cookiebastard at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by Cookiebastard at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I let my children have popcorn and apple sauce and ice cream for dinner because I'm glued to the TV.
"Mom, can we set fire to the—"
"Just do it quietly."
posted by cortex at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [48 favorites]
"Mom, can we set fire to the—"
"Just do it quietly."
posted by cortex at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [48 favorites]
Following Al Franken's advice already, I see.
posted by yasaman at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Cnn saying that might as well have been the keynote speech. Glad I saw it live, it was great.
posted by rmless at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by rmless at 6:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I would say somebody get this guy in front of a crowd but, well, we're already there.
posted by stet at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by stet at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
What are they chanting? No unity, no... what?
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016
The ones shouting "no unity" right now over a dead serviceman sure sound like white dudes.
posted by Lyn Never at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
That chant started as "No unity; no trust", not "No trust; no unity." Sorta sums it up.
posted by defenestration at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by defenestration at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
As I've mentioned here before, Booker's chumminess with Shmuely Boteach (which goes back to his Oxford days in the mid-90s) is a bit of a drag, but he was going places even back then, and still has places further to go.
(He's good in the Senate. Senators can do good things by staying in the Senate. NJ has Chris Christie as governor, though Senator replacement law in NJ is weird.)
posted by holgate at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
(He's good in the Senate. Senators can do good things by staying in the Senate. NJ has Chris Christie as governor, though Senator replacement law in NJ is weird.)
posted by holgate at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I feel like I just watched history.
posted by octothorpe at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 6:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
They've grown up saturated in anti Hillary propaganda - some of them were born in the Bill administration. I think they have a warped idea of who she is and have barely looked into her policies.
Freaking seriously, and let me tell you, they are not receptive to arguments that maybe they have absorbed a bunch of Republican propaganda.
posted by showbiz_liz at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
Freaking seriously, and let me tell you, they are not receptive to arguments that maybe they have absorbed a bunch of Republican propaganda.
posted by showbiz_liz at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
I love everyone in this bar- I mean thread.
Also, John Oliver in the Trump University video! Well played
posted by Torosaurus at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Also, John Oliver in the Trump University video! Well played
posted by Torosaurus at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
(I always thought Zarq and mrzarquon were related)
posted by Tarumba at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Tarumba at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Definitely his 2004 DNC speech.
posted by penduluum at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by penduluum at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Maaaaybe we can get through this election before we start electing another dude to the White House, however great he may be?
posted by winna at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by winna at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Chanting over the story of a scammed widow of a combat veteran? Go fuck yourselves, seriously.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 6:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
c-span says michelle is next
please let them chant at her
where my popcorn at
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
please let them chant at her
where my popcorn at
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Oh shit. Cheating out a war widow.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mrzarquon at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It seems like they should focus more on Hillary and less on Trump. They have the rest of the election to talk about Trump every day, but this is supposed to be her convention.
posted by stavrogin at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by stavrogin at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016
I feel like I just watched history.
I think we watched the future.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I think we watched the future.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
AC/DC getting a shot at the DNC too. But in any case I like that they're bringing out this Trump U thing.
posted by cortex at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by cortex at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh damn, first person testimony from a war widow who got scammed by Trump University. I wanna see this getting replayed on the news for a long time
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Oh no CNN caught Bernie sitting there anticipating his turn, pulled out some notes (his speech I'm guessing) and he drops it! They cut away right as soon as he was asking people in front of him to pouch it up for him.
They were trying to show the reactions between him and Bill Clinton, quite a contrast. But I don't think there is much to read into more than he preparing himself for his speech.
posted by numaner at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
They were trying to show the reactions between him and Bill Clinton, quite a contrast. But I don't think there is much to read into more than he preparing himself for his speech.
posted by numaner at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This is gross.
posted by johnpowell at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by johnpowell at 7:00 PM on July 25, 2016
Ok... so... the former theater/speech student in me says Cory Booker is a diamond that needs some cutting and polishing. The writing in that speech was FLAWLESS - his delivery, I could give pointers. But that's from a perfectionist perspective - I mean, I LOVED it, my eyes started watering, but I just had this "oh man, if he just paused a tiny bit more here and there..."
So for me this wasn't quite the slam dunk that Obama's famous convention speech was. But damn, damn close, and I'm looking forward to more from Mr. Booker.
posted by dnash at 7:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
So for me this wasn't quite the slam dunk that Obama's famous convention speech was. But damn, damn close, and I'm looking forward to more from Mr. Booker.
posted by dnash at 7:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
So the loud people booing are Bernie delegates? Does Bernie have any power to strip them of that? I mean, Jesus, I bet even Bernie is red-faced with embarrassment.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:01 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:01 PM on July 25, 2016
Before anyone says these protests were "white privilege," I was right in front. It was led by black and brown people #DNCinPHL #DemsInPhilly
posted by yertledaturtle at 7:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by yertledaturtle at 7:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Can't these people keep quiet and let her speak?
posted by peacheater at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by peacheater at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016
> I always thought Zarq and mrzarquon were related
Nope, just dorks.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Nope, just dorks.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"What kind of man does that?"
posted by biogeo at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
i didn't expect to burst into tears at the stonewall mention
posted by you're a kitty! at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by you're a kitty! at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
A source close to Sanders camp says his people are worried the senator will be booed tonight by his own people.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
We can barely hear the chanting on the C-SPAN feed. MuddDude thought they were chanting "End White Power!"
Cheryl Lankford is a seriously brave woman. Thank you for sharing your difficult story.
posted by muddgirl at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Cheryl Lankford is a seriously brave woman. Thank you for sharing your difficult story.
posted by muddgirl at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
They could quit now and this would have been a more impressive lineup than the entire RNC by an order of magnitude. But they're just getting warmed up.
posted by uosuaq at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by uosuaq at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I'm sorry, they are for sure booing louder over minorities. Disgusting.
posted by zutalors! at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
"it's about someone who helps ordinary people, no matter what it takes, versus someone who helps himself, no matter who it hurts" ETHERED
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Where's the chanting now when she says "what kind of man does that"? Where's the booing? Seriously, if you're chanting over a guy quoting Maya Angelou and then you're silent when Trump is mentioned, you've got your shit on all wrong.
posted by cashman at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by cashman at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
They don't have to be white to be assholes
posted by schadenfrau at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 7:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Love the shot of Bill Clinton leaning over and saying, "I like this guy."
posted by mgar at 7:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mgar at 7:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I wonder if politicians are used to places that might not be well miked, like outdoor rallies and football stadiums and shit. Sarah Silverman is used to talking to a camera.
Yes there must be something in that because the next speaker, who is a non-professional speaker-- is doing very well. She is speaking naturally and passionately without shouting.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yes there must be something in that because the next speaker, who is a non-professional speaker-- is doing very well. She is speaking naturally and passionately without shouting.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I just dare these morons to make one peep of noise while Michelle is talking.
I will burn this place to the ground.
posted by Salieri at 7:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I will burn this place to the ground.
posted by Salieri at 7:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Cheryl Lankford is hella killing it up there.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The production values on these videos are about 1,000 times better than those at the RNC. It's astonishing.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I was born with a hearing disability. It's REALLY REALLY hard to stay focused on the speakers with background noise like chanting. I don't expect people to give a shit about my problems but the protest chanting is really messing with my ability to track what the speakers are saying. Just another data point.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
A source close to Sanders camp says his people are worried the senator will be booed tonight by his own people.
They're not his people anymore.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
They're not his people anymore.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
Oh boyoboyoboy Michelle is coming!
posted by biogeo at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
A source close to Sanders camp says his people are worried the senator will be booed tonight by his own people.
Who was the source? Was it literally any person who's been paying attention for the past few months?
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Who was the source? Was it literally any person who's been paying attention for the past few months?
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Oh man, I helped build Apple Music and I just stopped hearing that Pharrell song in my dreams like last week. Thanks (Mrs.) Obama.
posted by sideshow at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by sideshow at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
this is the montage to end all montages
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
> If you also gave them old fish and toenails during the RNC I think this could be a solid strategy for creating a new generation of leftists
My daughter just said "Oooh, Michele Obama!" and put down her comic book to watch her, so, yeah, plan working.
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
My daughter just said "Oooh, Michele Obama!" and put down her comic book to watch her, so, yeah, plan working.
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
FWIW, I'm watching the PBS feed and I wouldn't know there was significant dissent on Booker and the woman that followed him if I wasn't reading this thread.
posted by mcstayinskool at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mcstayinskool at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Michelle is my favorite person.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Man this is impressive, Michelle will be the first person to speak at both the DNC and the RNC.
posted by numaner at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [93 favorites]
posted by numaner at 7:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [93 favorites]
Prince is always a good music choice to be starting a thing off with.
32 years ago right now, Purple Rain was in the top 10 at the box office (along with Ghostbusters and Star Trek III. Plus ça change.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
32 years ago right now, Purple Rain was in the top 10 at the box office (along with Ghostbusters and Star Trek III. Plus ça change.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I was born with a hearing disability. It's REALLY REALLY hard to stay focused on the speakers with background noise like chanting.
Me too- I'm deaf in my right ear and I am so slewed around to the left in my chair I am not even looking at the screen.
posted by winna at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016
Me too- I'm deaf in my right ear and I am so slewed around to the left in my chair I am not even looking at the screen.
posted by winna at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016
flotus time people!
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016
The dream: Beyonce comes out singing "Freedom" to introduce Michelle.
posted by palindromic at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Who is after Michelle Obama? I'm looking at the schedule; seems she is last.
posted by polymodus at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by polymodus at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016
What's the huge chunk that isn't holding up Michelle signs?
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:05 PM on July 25, 2016
Michellllllllleee!!!
posted by lovecrafty at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by lovecrafty at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The production values on these videos are about 1,000 times better than those at the RNC.
The whole Republican... everything... this year is a clown show. They look like amateurs while the Democrats, even with all their usual infighting and nonsense, seem like the new version for the well-oiled and moneyed machine.
posted by rokusan at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016
The whole Republican... everything... this year is a clown show. They look like amateurs while the Democrats, even with all their usual infighting and nonsense, seem like the new version for the well-oiled and moneyed machine.
posted by rokusan at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016
A large percentage of the crowd has purple sticks with MICHELLE on them.
posted by winna at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016
Are Missy and Bey going to come out as part of Michelle's squad?
posted by vuron at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by vuron at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Ughhhhh I WANT TO BE HER
posted by mynameisluka at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Also, wait a minute, why are there Michelle signs anyway?
(I mean I like her well enough and all, but... first lady signs?)
posted by rokusan at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016
(I mean I like her well enough and all, but... first lady signs?)
posted by rokusan at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016
Michelle will be followed by Warren and Sanders.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I am watching the youtube feed and can barely hear most of the chanting you guys are talking about.
posted by zug at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zug at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016
The dream: Beyonce comes out singing "Freedom" to introduce Michelle.
I'm punching the air at how epic that would have been, holy crap.
posted by cashman at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'm punching the air at how epic that would have been, holy crap.
posted by cashman at 7:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Hot damn DNC, Locato, Booker, Michelle and the whole thing tonight...just here on a student visa but sure wouldn't mind becoming American and Democrat just about now.
posted by phphph at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by phphph at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Zug, it is really, really loud on the TV feed
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016
Whoever is in charge of handing out crowd signs gets an A+
posted by Torosaurus at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Torosaurus at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Rumor is Elizabeth warren is after Michelle
My husband has a big grin. "What's going on, you just like Michelle?" "Yup!"
posted by rmless at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
My husband has a big grin. "What's going on, you just like Michelle?" "Yup!"
posted by rmless at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
If these dirtbags heckle and interrupt Michelle, I'm cancelling the election swear to god
posted by EatTheWeek at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by EatTheWeek at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Goddamn I'm going to miss the Obamas
posted by schadenfrau at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
For what it's worth, because I sure as shit do feel like this is a serious erasure problem; almost all of the POC and queer/trans people I know were Bernie supporters. Tellingly, they are all also under the age of 30. For fucking real, we are not all white men.
posted by neonrev at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
posted by neonrev at 7:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
I'm gonna miss her something fierce.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Are Busters chanting over black people because they still hold a grudge about BLM taking the stage in the middle of that one Bernie speech?
These guys? Probably.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016
These guys? Probably.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016
Worth noting for Seattleites: City Council Member Kshama Sawant is apparently among those calling on Bernie supporters to vote for Jill Stein.
Sigh.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Sigh.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I am watching the youtube feed and heard it just fine.
I think the center front section is sans signs because of camera angles.
posted by Lyn Never at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016
I think the center front section is sans signs because of camera angles.
posted by Lyn Never at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016
Twitch is almost chant-free. I have a hearing loss and all is good here.
Yeah, Michelle!
posted by TrishaU at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016
Yeah, Michelle!
posted by TrishaU at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016
I am watching the youtube feed and can barely hear most of the chanting you guys are talking about.
As someone upthread noted, the networks seem to have put FX mics near the delegations with the BoB chanters. Hmm.
posted by holgate at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
As someone upthread noted, the networks seem to have put FX mics near the delegations with the BoB chanters. Hmm.
posted by holgate at 7:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Michelle 2024
posted by theodolite at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Hot damn DNC, Locato, Booker, Michelle and the whole thing tonight...just here on a student visa but sure wouldn't mind becoming American and Democrat just about now.
Yeah 95% of the time US patriotism is kind of awkward and/or awful but that other five percent though....
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yeah 95% of the time US patriotism is kind of awkward and/or awful but that other five percent though....
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Reminder: Trump is a Russian sleeper agent
In a shift, Republican platform doesn't call for arming Ukraine against Russia
posted by chrchr at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
In a shift, Republican platform doesn't call for arming Ukraine against Russia
posted by chrchr at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
It's interesting: Michelle is talking about the impact of the negative media attention on her kids and by extension all children.
posted by winna at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"... my little girls on their way to the first day of school, getting into those black limousines, with all the big men with guns, and I thought, What have we done?"
These are not laugh lines, people :(
I hope she sees these signs and knows just how treasured she is.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
These are not laugh lines, people :(
I hope she sees these signs and knows just how treasured she is.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
She sounds kind of teary.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by mynameisluka at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016
For those folks having difficulty hearing the speakers over the crowd, I was rather surprised to find the captions on the official YouTube stream are considerably less terrible than I've come to expect from YouTube captions
posted by aranyx at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by aranyx at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Worth noting for Seattleites: City Council Member Kshama Sawant is apparently among those calling on Bernie supporters to vote for Jill Stein.
Leftier-than-thou-ism is a hell of a drug.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Leftier-than-thou-ism is a hell of a drug.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
FUCK YEAH MICHELLE OBAMA.
posted by rp at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by rp at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Goddamn I'm going to miss the Obamas
The Clintons are going to be in their mid- and late-seventies, so yeah... that's one way this will be a big change from the Obama years.
posted by rokusan at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The Clintons are going to be in their mid- and late-seventies, so yeah... that's one way this will be a big change from the Obama years.
posted by rokusan at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
> Also, wait a minute, why are there Michelle signs anyway?
Public demand!
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Public demand!
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
She gets it. She really gets it. And damn, as a parent that's such a powerful statement.
posted by zarq at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zarq at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
@neonrev nodding. In my queer/trans circles that's been the case too.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016
Who is sitting next to Bill Clinton?
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016
how did they get all those Michelle signs out so fast?! Suddenly they are everywhere
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016
My favourite Eva Longoria fact is she co-produced John Wick.
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Huh, just saw that [Cook County Board President] Toni Preckwinkle is sitting right next to Bill Clinton. Weird data point.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:10 PM on July 25, 2016
LOUD cheers for Hillary when Michelle says it. Phew.
posted by zutalors! at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Shit, now I'M getting teary, realizing that Hillary Clinton is actually going to be the nominee. As a woman and a women's historian, I cannot overemphasize how immense, overwhelming and powerful this feels.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [57 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [57 favorites]
Oh hey, Bill!
Did anyone else see Spielburg in the audience earlier? I'm still trying to find the clip to see if it was him that I saw
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016
Did anyone else see Spielburg in the audience earlier? I'm still trying to find the clip to see if it was him that I saw
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016
I adore this woman.
posted by futz at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by futz at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
#imwithHER
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
FLOTUS IS BRINGING IT
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Michelle talking about Hillary Clinton's work to make a better world for children.
posted by winna at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by winna at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
rokusan, Chelsea has a toddler and a newborn. Maybe we'll see them around.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Ooooo calling out Bernie Bros!!
posted by numaner at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by numaner at 7:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
She didn't get angry....hint hint Bernie bros
posted by rmless at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by rmless at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I know a lot of queer and brown people under thirty who supported Bernie, and they also all universally seemed to believe the most noxious and misogynist lies and misrepresentations about Hillary. I didn't know a single one who didn't lead with the Hillary hate, tbh. Like there was no "they're both good candidates, but..."
Obviously that is a whole lotta anecdata, so I assume YMMV
posted by schadenfrau at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Obviously that is a whole lotta anecdata, so I assume YMMV
posted by schadenfrau at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Oh Snap.
She didn't get angry or disillusioned.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
She didn't get angry or disillusioned.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
"Didn't get angry or disillusioned"
BBEEEERRRRRNNNNNN!
posted by stet at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
BBEEEERRRRRNNNNNN!
posted by stet at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
WOWWWWW callback to Hillary of eight years ago doing the right thing, with big cheers from the crowd.
Outstanding. And so powerful, coming from Michelle.
posted by Salieri at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Outstanding. And so powerful, coming from Michelle.
posted by Salieri at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Michelle Obama: ‘Well, There Are 8 Years Of My Life I’ll Never Get Back’
posted by Cookiebastard at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Cookiebastard at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Hot damn DNC, Locato, Booker, Michelle and the whole thing tonight...just here on a student visa but sure wouldn't mind becoming American and Democrat just about now.
I invite you to become an America and join the Democratic party. We would be glad to have you.
posted by Ironmouth at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
I invite you to become an America and join the Democratic party. We would be glad to have you.
posted by Ironmouth at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
mynameisluka: I was thinking about that earlier- how strange and amazing it is to hear feminine pronouns in a speech about a nominee for president.
Representation matters.
posted by winna at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Representation matters.
posted by winna at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Anywhere I can get clips of Silverman and Franken?
posted by kirkaracha at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by kirkaracha at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016
I need one of those Michelle signs really, really bad
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
This is how u turn out that damn vote. This this this.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Legacy candidates aren't my favorite thing, but if we have to have them, Michelle wouldn't be a bad choice.
posted by mollweide at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by mollweide at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
become an America
Each of us a nation unto ourselves.
posted by dis_integration at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Each of us a nation unto ourselves.
posted by dis_integration at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
For what it's worth, because I sure as shit do feel like this is a serious erasure problem; almost all of the POC and queer/trans people I know were Bernie supporters. Tellingly, they are all also under the age of 30. For fucking real, we are not all white.
No one thinks they're all white. Lots of people think the campaign had an issue with minority outreach. I think this is why they weren't ultimately successful. The screaming over minority speakers is just another symptom of that.
"We're not all white" is a weird distraction from that very serious problem, and i'm saying that as someone who would be open to someone like Sanders, but was really turned off that they felt like they could just wait on minority outreach. No.
posted by zutalors! at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Damn that was some beautiful Twitter shade.
posted by stolyarova at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I can't remember a more dynamic, more beloved First Lady in my lifetime. Sure I was alive during Jackie Kennedy's day but while she was stylish and cultured she was not one to do anything other than wear beautiful clothes and hostess state dinners. Rosalind Carter was pretty quiet and so was Pat Nixon. Laura Bush was as dull as could be.
We place such huge demands on First Ladies-- unpaid but mean to be perfect hostesses. Well dressed but not too ostentatious. Not allowed to be too involved in the political process (see: Hillary Hatred) but almost required to have some sort of little project such as Nancy Reagan's Just Say 'No" campaign. Michelle in my estimation has walked the perfect tightrope and done it gracefully and with an appreciative audience.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
We place such huge demands on First Ladies-- unpaid but mean to be perfect hostesses. Well dressed but not too ostentatious. Not allowed to be too involved in the political process (see: Hillary Hatred) but almost required to have some sort of little project such as Nancy Reagan's Just Say 'No" campaign. Michelle in my estimation has walked the perfect tightrope and done it gracefully and with an appreciative audience.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
Bill Clinton looks so happy and proud.
posted by Torosaurus at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by Torosaurus at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Michelle Obama is amazing. I admire her so much.
posted by defenestration at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by defenestration at 7:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
ohh SHIT she's throwing some serious shade.
posted by Mooski at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Mooski at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Huh, just saw that [Cook County Board President] Toni Preckwinkle is sitting right next to Bill Clinton.Toni Preckwinkle's husband is named Zeus Preckwinkle, which is pretty much my favorite thing in the world.
Sorry. That is in no way relevant to the present discussion, but it is still my favorite thing in the world.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
there has been lots of great speakers tonight but michelle obama's has to be one of the absolute best
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"When she didn't win the nomination eight years ago she didn't get angry or disillusioned... This is so much bigger than her own desires and disappointments."
Goddamn right
posted by numaner at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
Goddamn right
posted by numaner at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
> Legacy candidates aren't my favorite thing, but if we have to have them, Michelle wouldn't be a bad choice.
Obama/Booker 2024 isn't too bad.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Obama/Booker 2024 isn't too bad.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Bill is just getting his life up there in the balcony
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:14 PM on July 25, 2016
For what it's worth, because I sure as shit do feel like this is a serious erasure problem; almost all of the POC and queer/trans people I know were Bernie supporters. Tellingly, they are all also under the age of 30. For fucking real, we are not all white. -- neonrev
Ditto. Literally every single LGBTQ person I know was a Bernie supporter. Most, being rational types, are settling on Hillary (the others will stay home).
But the whole "Bernie Boys" or whatever nonsense, trying to say anyone who didn't back Hillary must be racist/sexist or whatever the argument was, has been poisonous, and I doubt it'll be forgotten. I wasn't accustomed to seeing Democrats be as narrow and petty as Republicans, but, yeah. It's been a little bit wow.
posted by rokusan at 7:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
Ditto. Literally every single LGBTQ person I know was a Bernie supporter. Most, being rational types, are settling on Hillary (the others will stay home).
But the whole "Bernie Boys" or whatever nonsense, trying to say anyone who didn't back Hillary must be racist/sexist or whatever the argument was, has been poisonous, and I doubt it'll be forgotten. I wasn't accustomed to seeing Democrats be as narrow and petty as Republicans, but, yeah. It's been a little bit wow.
posted by rokusan at 7:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
"I want a president who will teach our children that everyone in our country matters."
posted by winna at 7:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Michelle is brilliant because she's referring to Trump without using his name and has a marvelous message.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 7:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 7:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
Michelle 2024
Every time I listen to Michelle Obama I wonder what we did to deserve her. Because we so obviously don't. She is the best.
posted by octobersurprise at 7:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [43 favorites]
Every time I listen to Michelle Obama I wonder what we did to deserve her. Because we so obviously don't. She is the best.
posted by octobersurprise at 7:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [43 favorites]
She might tell us otherwise, but America hasn't done enough to earn Michelle Obama, but I hope some day we do.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 7:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by MCMikeNamara at 7:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I was a Bernie supporter in the primary who had hesitantly pivoted to Hilary for the general election. After all these speakers and how much Michelle is KILLING IT, I am hesitant no longer. Genuinely excited to cast my vote (my first for a president - and for a FEMALE president no less!!!) come November.
posted by that silly white dress at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
posted by that silly white dress at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
This convention is about healing the rift. I'm done talking smack about the Bernie delegates. I got y'all. I promise.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
In a pleasant turn, I'm pretty sure I just heard 2-3 guys yell "WE LOVE YOU MICHELLE"
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Booker's speech was good, but damn, he should take some delivery lessons from FLOTUS. She is nailing it. Hell yeah I'm gonna miss her.
posted by soundguy99 at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by soundguy99 at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Damn, she was underutilised.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
My secret private fantasy is a two-Obama SCOTUS, but honestly I also kind of hope the two of them just go full on private sector Bill And Melinda Gates and just go work on fixing whatever the fuck they decide to take on.
posted by Lyn Never at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
She's such a natural speaker. It's truly refreshing.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Michelle Obama and Cory Booker with the best speeches of the night, for sure.
Too bad neither is running yet.
posted by rokusan at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Too bad neither is running yet.
posted by rokusan at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
But the whole "Bernie Boys" or whatever nonsense, trying to say anyone who didn't back Hillary must be racist/sexist or whatever the argument was, has been poisonous, and I doubt it'll be forgotten. I wasn't accustomed to seeing Democrats be as narrow and petty as Republicans, but, yeah. It's been a little bit wow.
I too know a ton of Sanders supporters who weren't 'Bernie Bros.' But the vast majority of those people aren't STILL pulling for Sanders to win. That's the difference here.
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I too know a ton of Sanders supporters who weren't 'Bernie Bros.' But the vast majority of those people aren't STILL pulling for Sanders to win. That's the difference here.
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Great, crying again.
posted by Mooski at 7:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Mooski at 7:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Oh god, the waterworks just turned on full blast @ Housten and Orlando mentions
Michelle don't leave us
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Michelle don't leave us
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"I wake up in a house every morning that was built by slaves."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [71 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [71 favorites]
house of slaves!
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:17 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:17 PM on July 25, 2016
Clinton looks like he's gonna cry up there
I definitely heard something yell something, but I can't tell if it was negative, it might have been "WE LOVE YOU MICHELLE"
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:17 PM on July 25, 2016
I definitely heard something yell something, but I can't tell if it was negative, it might have been "WE LOVE YOU MICHELLE"
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:17 PM on July 25, 2016
Okay, ugly sobbing now. God bless Michelle Obama.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I really hope Michelle goes on the campaign trail. She might even be a better surrogate than Barack.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
How is she not bawling.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"I wake up every morning in a house that was built by slaves." I started crying again.
posted by biogeo at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Oh my God, that crack in her voice. A WOMAN CAN BE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [42 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [42 favorites]
Don't go no
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
To me it seems like the majority of the crowd has worked out that if they cheer loudly and often, they're pretty much drowning out the boos before the can get going.
posted by une_heure_pleine at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by une_heure_pleine at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Goddamn I'm gonna run out of favorites both here and in my head
posted by rp at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by rp at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
is Jesse Jackson alive? someone check him
posted by bologna on wry at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by bologna on wry at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Fucking allergies!! anyone got some Claritin for this black woman coz i'm dying here!!
posted by ramix at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by ramix at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Oh god Jesse Jackson in tears after Michelle talks about her girls playing with their dogs on the White House lawn.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Her voice is cracking from the emotion. Beautiful.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zombieflanders at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016
"Every morning I wake up in a house that was built by slaves" I got goosebumps and tears at the same time.
posted by hollygoheavy at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by hollygoheavy at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Shit, I think Michelle is literally crying right now!!
"... that I would grow up to live in a house that was built by slaves, and watch my daughters, two beautiful strong Black young women, playing on the White House lawn!"
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
"... that I would grow up to live in a house that was built by slaves, and watch my daughters, two beautiful strong Black young women, playing on the White House lawn!"
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
Yep, tears.
posted by lazaruslong at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by lazaruslong at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Pretty sure it was 'we love you Michelle'
posted by JakeEXTREME at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by JakeEXTREME at 7:18 PM on July 25, 2016
"Don't let anyone tell you that this country isn't great".
I don't think there's a dry eye in the house after this amazing speech. There certainly isn't a dry eye in our living room.
posted by Torosaurus at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I don't think there's a dry eye in the house after this amazing speech. There certainly isn't a dry eye in our living room.
posted by Torosaurus at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
But the whole "Bernie Boys" or whatever nonsense, trying to say anyone who didn't back Hillary must be racist/sexist or whatever the argument was, has been poisonous, and I doubt it'll be forgotten. I wasn't accustomed to seeing Democrats be as narrow and petty as Republicans, but, yeah. It's been a little bit wow.
I think you're misunderstanding. Misogyny and racism can be and frequently are internalized. And the ways that racism and sexism affect your life aren't immediately obvious; you never stop learning new ways they fuck you over. It's a constant, never ending layer cake of flavors of bullshit. Just bullshit all the way down. And sometimes you have to get older before you can see some of it.
Personally I know a shit ton of young feminists who revealed some ugly, ugly shit in their opposition to Clinton / support for Bernie, and should probably look inwards and wonder why it was so gd easy for them to -- at best -- dismiss the words of older women.
posted by schadenfrau at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
I think you're misunderstanding. Misogyny and racism can be and frequently are internalized. And the ways that racism and sexism affect your life aren't immediately obvious; you never stop learning new ways they fuck you over. It's a constant, never ending layer cake of flavors of bullshit. Just bullshit all the way down. And sometimes you have to get older before you can see some of it.
Personally I know a shit ton of young feminists who revealed some ugly, ugly shit in their opposition to Clinton / support for Bernie, and should probably look inwards and wonder why it was so gd easy for them to -- at best -- dismiss the words of older women.
posted by schadenfrau at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
"playing with their dogs on the White House lawn"
Somehow that one really got me.
posted by uosuaq at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Somehow that one really got me.
posted by uosuaq at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
The "Bernie Bros" thing was about the people who are now Bernie or Busters. I think most of us know lots of Bernie supporters who will vote Hillary and were all over the map demographically (PoC, LGBTQ, etc). And most people have no problem with them.
The BoB people, who are booing and chanting over speakers today, are the ones people are upset about. And I almost hope they are mostly privileged, because I can at least vaguely understand how a privileged person could be willing to see the world burn and assume they will be OK. I tend to assume those who know they will be targets under a Trump presidency would not make the same mistake.
posted by thefoxgod at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
The BoB people, who are booing and chanting over speakers today, are the ones people are upset about. And I almost hope they are mostly privileged, because I can at least vaguely understand how a privileged person could be willing to see the world burn and assume they will be OK. I tend to assume those who know they will be targets under a Trump presidency would not make the same mistake.
posted by thefoxgod at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
we'll eat you up, we love you so
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
"This right now is the Greatest Country on Earth."
Oh wow. 20 years ago that would have been the Republican message.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Oh wow. 20 years ago that would have been the Republican message.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I love her so much. And I am so fucking proud to be a Democrat.
posted by schadenfrau at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 7:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Can we have Michelle as President
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"we cannot afford to be tired or frustrated or cynical"
"we need to knock on every door"
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"we need to knock on every door"
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"We cannot afford to be tired or frustrated or cynical."
posted by winna at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Every last woman in that room is wiping away tears. This is amazing.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
HEAR ME.
posted by Mooski at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Mooski at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
This speech is undeniably moving. Definitely tearing up over here.
posted by defenestration at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by defenestration at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Can I get a YAS QUEEN?
posted by enjoymoreradio at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by enjoymoreradio at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Possibly the best speech I've ever heard at one of these things. The only other one that comes to mind is Barack in 2004.
posted by mcstayinskool at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by mcstayinskool at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
But the vast majority of those people aren't STILL pulling for Sanders to win.
I know it's easy to find a few stray examples online, but we really don't know if that's what those people were doing tonight. I think it's more likely that they just feel cheated or wronged, especially in the wake of the DNC e-mails, and they're just generally angry.
Hopefully Michelle just raised the level of discourse a notch or six, and it won't matter. And it's a good thing, because Hillary won't be able to match that speech.
posted by rokusan at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016
I know it's easy to find a few stray examples online, but we really don't know if that's what those people were doing tonight. I think it's more likely that they just feel cheated or wronged, especially in the wake of the DNC e-mails, and they're just generally angry.
Hopefully Michelle just raised the level of discourse a notch or six, and it won't matter. And it's a good thing, because Hillary won't be able to match that speech.
posted by rokusan at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016
HEAR ME
posted by zombieflanders at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zombieflanders at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016
Let's get to work
posted by stet at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by stet at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
What's all this water in my eyes??
posted by numaner at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by numaner at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
@dweinberger This ain’t no - pardon the expression - wifey FLOTUS speech. This is one of the best political speeches I’ve ever heard.
posted by waitingtoderail at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
posted by waitingtoderail at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
One of the undercurrents of this election is the idea that facts bounce off feelings. So hey, have some damn feelings backed up with facts. And use them.
posted by holgate at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by holgate at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
They should have saved her for last tonight. Nobody can top that.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
This Kennedy is SUPER cute.
posted by stolyarova at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Poor Joe Kennedy III, having to follow FLOTUS.
posted by zakur at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zakur at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"When she didn't win the nomination eight years ago she didn't get angry or disillusioned... This is so much bigger than her own desires and disappointments."
This is nice speechifying but I don't really thing this is *completely* true. Also, I am sorry to say but the FLOTUS's speech (and others tonight) really put an exclamation point on how sorely lacking Hillary is in the inspiration department.
posted by futz at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
This is nice speechifying but I don't really thing this is *completely* true. Also, I am sorry to say but the FLOTUS's speech (and others tonight) really put an exclamation point on how sorely lacking Hillary is in the inspiration department.
posted by futz at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
OMG I love her so much. I wish she was interested in the job in 2024.
posted by lovecrafty at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by lovecrafty at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Well, that's got to be a tough act to follow.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This poor Kennedy schmuck.
posted by palindromic at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by palindromic at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016
"Cali Berners just tried to bust out a Bernie chant and got *hushed* with a quickness."
(During FLOTUS speech)
posted by Yowser at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
(During FLOTUS speech)
posted by Yowser at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Anywhere I can get clips of Silverman and Franken?
Maybe I should've checked YouTube.
Watch Sen. Al Franken’s full speech at the 2016 DNC
Sarah Silverman Democratic National Convention FULL Speech
posted by kirkaracha at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Shit luck having to follow YASS QUEEN though.
posted by stolyarova at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by stolyarova at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016
Those Kennedy genes are strong.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
We Kennedys aren't accustomed to tragedy
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Kennedy is doing the staccato thing all the republican speakers were doing.
posted by winna at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016
Personally I know a shit ton of young feminists who revealed some ugly, ugly shit in their opposition to Clinton / support for Bernie, and should probably look inwards and wonder why it was so gd easy for them to -- at best -- dismiss the words of older women
I don't know your people, but most in my circles would happily take Elizabeth Warren or even Michelle Obama over Hillary, so I don't think it's a sexist thing. I think it's just a Hillary thing.
posted by rokusan at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I don't know your people, but most in my circles would happily take Elizabeth Warren or even Michelle Obama over Hillary, so I don't think it's a sexist thing. I think it's just a Hillary thing.
posted by rokusan at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Also, I am sorry to say but the FLOTUS's speech (and others tonight) really put an exclamation point on how sorely lacking Hillary is in the inspiration department.
*eye roll*
posted by longdaysjourney at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
*eye roll*
posted by longdaysjourney at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [39 favorites]
Wow! I was getting despondent after the convention started earlier, but now I'm all fired up. Michelle was amazing!
posted by homunculus at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by homunculus at 7:22 PM on July 25, 2016
Please let this be a short intro for Warren because man that's a rough transition.
posted by cortex at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by cortex at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Ahhhh JK III is introducing Warren!!! Love that he was willing to tell that story about her schooling him.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I was happy to send money but no WAY was I phone banking or door knocking. I'm just too fucking shy. At this moment, I'm ready to go knock on my next door neighbors door and talk about HRC. Like, right now at 10:30 at night, let's have a talk.
posted by hollygoheavy at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
posted by hollygoheavy at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
Okay look I may be really biased towards redheads with freckles
But damn, Joe Kennedy, HMU
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
But damn, Joe Kennedy, HMU
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
This Kennedy is SUPER cute.
Yeah. That's what they do.
posted by rokusan at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
Yeah. That's what they do.
posted by rokusan at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
"My daughters can take it for granted that A WOMAN CAN BE PRESIDENT."
YES. This is what I want for my daughter too. It makes me cry every time too, Michelle.
posted by areaperson at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
YES. This is what I want for my daughter too. It makes me cry every time too, Michelle.
posted by areaperson at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
He makes way more sense as a Warren hype man.
posted by palindromic at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by palindromic at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016
Michelle could be president but she's already Michelle Obama.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [49 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [49 favorites]
"This right now is the Greatest Country on Earth."
Speech was great but nope, not the greatest, hardly. I can list a million reasons but 2 million people in prison for starters. I get the rhetoric, the anti-Trump positioning, but this country has megaprobz.
posted by dis_integration at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Speech was great but nope, not the greatest, hardly. I can list a million reasons but 2 million people in prison for starters. I get the rhetoric, the anti-Trump positioning, but this country has megaprobz.
posted by dis_integration at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
> most in my circles would happily take Elizabeth Warren or even Michelle Obama over Hillary, so I don't think it's a sexist thing
They would take a hypothetical female candidate but not the woman who they can actually vote for. Got it.
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
They would take a hypothetical female candidate but not the woman who they can actually vote for. Got it.
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
Booker already got under Trump's skin tonight. And now Warren's coming up. This is gonna be good.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I don't know your people, but most in my circles would happily take Elizabeth Warren or even Michelle Obama over Hillary, so I don't think it's a sexist thing. I think it's just a Hillary thing.I think it's a "I'm comfortable with hypothetical female candidates but not actual ones" thing.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [52 favorites]
Michelle's speech was terrific. I feel like printing it out and sticking it on my wall to read and memorize every morning.
posted by polymodus at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by polymodus at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yeah. That's what they do.
yeah
uh
yep.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
yeah
uh
yep.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Buckle in
posted by hal9k at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by hal9k at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Liz is my bae <3
posted by stolyarova at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Hillary was very popular as Secretary of State.
Michelle Obama was least popular when her husband was trying to be President.
Elizabeth Warren had a very nasty senate fight.
When women step up and ask for a place at the table, or for a position of power, they are always disliked. It's never about all women, it's always about that particular woman who is unlikable.
This is basically a misogynistic pattern.
posted by peacheater at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [146 favorites]
Michelle Obama was least popular when her husband was trying to be President.
Elizabeth Warren had a very nasty senate fight.
When women step up and ask for a place at the table, or for a position of power, they are always disliked. It's never about all women, it's always about that particular woman who is unlikable.
This is basically a misogynistic pattern.
posted by peacheater at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [146 favorites]
Speech was great but nope, not the greatest, hardly. I can list a million reasons but 2 million people in prison for starters. I get the rhetoric, the anti-Trump positioning, but this country has megaprobz.
Yeah what the fuck is up with Michelle Obama saying America is great
posted by theodolite at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Yeah what the fuck is up with Michelle Obama saying America is great
posted by theodolite at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
omg another super natural speaker incoming hggggggnnn
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yep. Crying after Michelle's speech. (I'm a little behind.)
posted by persona au gratin at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by persona au gratin at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I don't know your people, but most in my circles would happily take Elizabeth Warren or even Michelle Obama over Hillary, so I don't think it's a sexist thing. I think it's just a Hillary thing.
Yeah no it's a sexist thing. No woman has been in the public eye for as long as HRC. If Michelle Obama had been campaigning since 2000 for this people would hate her too.
posted by zutalors! at 7:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
"We're not all white" is a weird distraction from that very serious problem, and i'm saying that as someone who would be open to someone like Sanders, but was really turned off that they felt like they could just wait on minority outreach. No.
No, I think it's a very valid complaint, which is that the Bernie camp was called out for not appealing enough to POC in particular, which matches not at all with my experience, and every time "Bernie Supporter" is said it is assumed to be a straight white man, and then the entire movement can be decried for being sexist and racist (or at least not engaged in that conversation).
I'm saying, people feel ignored, they are the ones who would know if they are being ignored in favor of a more appealing narrative, namely white dudes who hate Clinton because propaganda. Black voters I know are not pleased to have their concerns over past rhetoric regarding crime go ignored, and neither are Latinx regarding SA, and neither are some Arabs regarding Mid East policy. They do not like having their objections paved over with being called Bernie Bros, a generic white dude who's mostly just sexist.
posted by neonrev at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
No, I think it's a very valid complaint, which is that the Bernie camp was called out for not appealing enough to POC in particular, which matches not at all with my experience, and every time "Bernie Supporter" is said it is assumed to be a straight white man, and then the entire movement can be decried for being sexist and racist (or at least not engaged in that conversation).
I'm saying, people feel ignored, they are the ones who would know if they are being ignored in favor of a more appealing narrative, namely white dudes who hate Clinton because propaganda. Black voters I know are not pleased to have their concerns over past rhetoric regarding crime go ignored, and neither are Latinx regarding SA, and neither are some Arabs regarding Mid East policy. They do not like having their objections paved over with being called Bernie Bros, a generic white dude who's mostly just sexist.
posted by neonrev at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Yeah, there has been lots of hate towards Warren from the BoBs recently.
I mean, there's been lots of hate towards _Bernie_ from the BoBs today...
posted by thefoxgod at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016
I mean, there's been lots of hate towards _Bernie_ from the BoBs today...
posted by thefoxgod at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016
I was just thinking yesterday about John Kennedy, Jr.'s tragic end and I got sad all over again. In my dreams he just decided he didn't want to have anything to do with politics so he and his wife just slipped off into the unknown because if your name is Kennedy you almost have to go into the family business.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Brevity is the soul of having to be between Michelle Obama and Elizabeth Warren. Good job there.
posted by Cookiebastard at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by Cookiebastard at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I really want a Hercules Mulligan track about Hillary now.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Yeah what the fuck is up with Michelle Obama saying that America is great
Yeah I actually think that the reflex of regarding America as the greatest country on earth is pretty caustic and unhelpful and dangerous to progress so yeah wtf.
posted by dis_integration at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Yeah I actually think that the reflex of regarding America as the greatest country on earth is pretty caustic and unhelpful and dangerous to progress so yeah wtf.
posted by dis_integration at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"If Michelle Obama had been campaigning since 2000 for this people would hate her too."
No, they'd hate her worse. :(
posted by FritoKAL at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
No, they'd hate her worse. :(
posted by FritoKAL at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
"We trusted you"
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:26 PM on July 25, 2016
"We trusted you," say the hecklers.
posted by stolyarova at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by stolyarova at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
@POTUS: Incredible speech by an incredible woman. Couldn't be more proud & our country has been blessed to have her as FLOTUS. I love you, Michelle.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [63 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [63 favorites]
Chest fist to the Bern Man
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
If Michelle had said "This is as good as we've ever been," that I would agree with.
There was definitely some yelling while Kennedy was speaking, and some more with Warren, but it sounds generally positive.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
There was definitely some yelling while Kennedy was speaking, and some more with Warren, but it sounds generally positive.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
Dickasses chanting "we trusted you!"
posted by cortex at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by cortex at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I'm sorry, now I'm just laughing at these pathetic little chanters. "We trusted you." What are you, five?
posted by Salieri at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
White Boys Chorus now singing "we trusted you".
/marge noise
posted by Lyn Never at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
/marge noise
posted by Lyn Never at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Kennedy is doing the staccato thing all the republican speakers were doing
to be fair, his family may not have invented it but they certainly brought it mainstream.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
to be fair, his family may not have invented it but they certainly brought it mainstream.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Can someone shut those three dudes up?
posted by palindromic at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
ah, nope, i was behind, now it's "We trusted you."
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
What are they yelling now?
posted by octothorpe at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by octothorpe at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh come the fuck on. Are they going to chant "We trusted you" over Bernie too?
posted by yasaman at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by yasaman at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Am I imagining Warren is distracted or something by the chants?
posted by JakeEXTREME at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by JakeEXTREME at 7:27 PM on July 25, 2016
the 'we trusted you' group finally got shouted down.
posted by mrzarquon at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mrzarquon at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Dudes chanting over a woman. Great look there, fellas!
posted by zombieflanders at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Warren has this sprightly quality, a lightness among her seriousness, that I really appreciate.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
The pan to Bill Clinton and his reaction. He of all people has to know the weirdness of HRC's path. In another universe - a more just one - she would have been the one to run for office first. Maybe she would or wouldn't have gotten to this point. But they must have made many hard decisions together especially early on in their lives and he must sometimes consider the "might have beens".
posted by R343L at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by R343L at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Fifty dollars a semester wouldn't pay for a third of a single one of my textbooks. Dang.
posted by winna at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
FLOTUS crush renewed.
posted by kirkaracha at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Someone yelled SHUT UP and they did!
posted by cooker girl at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 7:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
Chanting during Warren's speech?!!
posted by persona au gratin at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016
I should say might have been the one to run first. But hopefully you all get my point about those alternate histories.
posted by R343L at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by R343L at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016
I don't think he was that left
I have to say I think this is just totally incorrect. Any attempt to collapse people's voting records down to a single axis is of course going to be flawed, but independent analyses repeatedly name Sanders among the absolute most left-wing national legislators. When Clinton and Sanders were both legislators, analysis from Govtrack put Sanders in first place. The same DW-NOMINATE analysis that suggested that HRC was the 11th most liberal Senator also put Sanders first, and not only that, scored Sanders as far left from her as Clinton herself was from Salazar -- nearly as far left as Clinton was from Lieberman. Whatever flaws you ascribe to Sanders as a candidate, he is absolutely "that left" by the standards of mainstream American politics. That's why I was happy to vote for him and why I'm excited that he influenced the platform and is going to be working with Clinton this election season.
posted by en forme de poire at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
I have to say I think this is just totally incorrect. Any attempt to collapse people's voting records down to a single axis is of course going to be flawed, but independent analyses repeatedly name Sanders among the absolute most left-wing national legislators. When Clinton and Sanders were both legislators, analysis from Govtrack put Sanders in first place. The same DW-NOMINATE analysis that suggested that HRC was the 11th most liberal Senator also put Sanders first, and not only that, scored Sanders as far left from her as Clinton herself was from Salazar -- nearly as far left as Clinton was from Lieberman. Whatever flaws you ascribe to Sanders as a candidate, he is absolutely "that left" by the standards of mainstream American politics. That's why I was happy to vote for him and why I'm excited that he influenced the platform and is going to be working with Clinton this election season.
posted by en forme de poire at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [24 favorites]
My partner just got home from work and sat down to watch with me, asking "What? Why are they heckling Warren?"
Oh you poor sweet soul.
posted by palindromic at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Oh you poor sweet soul.
posted by palindromic at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Am I imagining Warren is distracted or something by the chants?
She was for a bit, but it's basically impossible not to be. Even in a room that large, a handful of jackholes screaming while you're trying to speak is very hard to overcome, even for a pro like Sen. Warren.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016
She was for a bit, but it's basically impossible not to be. Even in a room that large, a handful of jackholes screaming while you're trying to speak is very hard to overcome, even for a pro like Sen. Warren.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016
I thought it was "we want you" which also makes no sense
I'm sorry, now I'm just laughing at these pathetic little chanters. "We trusted you." What are you, five?
"Cook-ies now! Cook-ies now!"
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I'm sorry, now I'm just laughing at these pathetic little chanters. "We trusted you." What are you, five?
"Cook-ies now! Cook-ies now!"
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
For the record, for when we look back at this thread, the we trusted you chanters sounded like 3 guys. Earlier chants sounded like more people. They need to shut up regardless, but at least at this point that latest chant was three or four dumb asses.
posted by cashman at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by cashman at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I don't know your people, but most in my circles would happily take Elizabeth Warren or even Michelle Obama over Hillary, so I don't think it's a sexist thing. I think it's just a Hillary thing.
...
Yeah no it's a sexist thing.
Well, you definitely know rokusan's friends better than they do
Yeah, this whole election though has been people saying what their friends think which is totally not racist or sexist at all, because in this hypothetical world where Michelle has never run a campaign, she'd win! The circle of friends said!
posted by zutalors! at 7:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I'm having flashbacks to the Orbital at Glastonbury live set and the jackass blowing a whistle during the Doctor ? and I'm hating whistle dude all over again.
posted by winna at 7:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Those were definitely dudes trying to shout over Senator Elizabeth Warren
"We trusted you?" Fucking petulant children
posted by schadenfrau at 7:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
"We trusted you?" Fucking petulant children
posted by schadenfrau at 7:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Mod note: Friendly reminder, really still not re-litigating the primaries in here.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 7:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 7:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Thanks Obama!
posted by stet at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by stet at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
#THANKSOBAMA
posted by biogeo at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
For a minute there I thought they were shouting "We trust the Jew!"
posted by OverlappingElvis at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by OverlappingElvis at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I love Warren but she sounds flat after Booker and FLOTUS.
posted by une_heure_pleine at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by une_heure_pleine at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Apparently I shouldn't have taken Franken's advice seriously because my 8 year old son covered himself in lipstick while I was watching Michelle.
posted by vverse23 at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
posted by vverse23 at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Warren has such a different tone, and always has. She's very friendly, upbeat and relatable. Like everyone's favorite aunt or cousin.
posted by zarq at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by zarq at 7:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Mom can I have a cookie? Mom can I have a cookie? Mom can I have a cookie? Mom can I have a cookie?
posted by kirkaracha at 7:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 7:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
As someone who doesn't know how the sausage is made, what preparation goes into these speeches? Are they prepared well in advance and reviewed by their peers, rehearsed, etc? How much does the speaker write, versus input from others, etc?
posted by polymodus at 7:32 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by polymodus at 7:32 PM on July 25, 2016
une_heure_pleine, the order was switched around to move Bernie to the last broadcast speech.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:32 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:32 PM on July 25, 2016
"I'm not one to think Republicans are always wrong and Democrats are always right"
That's true, Democrats aren't always right. [end of post]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 7:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
That's true, Democrats aren't always right. [end of post]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 7:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"The American people are coming for you. Yeah. That's right."
posted by schadenfrau at 7:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 7:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
WHAT WITH THE SHOUTING. STOPPPP.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I love Warren but she sounds flat after Booker and FLOTUS.
I don't know, that "Republicans - This November, the American people are coming for you", complete with Uncle Sam™ point, was pretty dope.
posted by cashman at 7:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I don't know, that "Republicans - This November, the American people are coming for you", complete with Uncle Sam™ point, was pretty dope.
posted by cashman at 7:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
This has been amazing.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 7:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 7:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
It might be a white New Englander thing but I love Warren's demeanor. She's just understandably outshined by FLOTUS. She's not trying to imitate Michelle; she's doing what she does. She's not yelling like hte rest of 'em, either.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
theyre going to boo the shit out of bernie arent they
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
She seems to have leveled up on her Attack Dog proficiency lately.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 7:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Yes. THAT'S what you should be booing, not your fellow Democrats!
posted by stolyarova at 7:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by stolyarova at 7:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
(I mean I like her well enough and all, but... first lady signs?)
Get out. I will cut you.
In a pleasant turn, I'm pretty sure I just heard 2-3 guys yell "WE LOVE YOU MICHELLE"
That was me, in my house.
posted by bongo_x at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
Get out. I will cut you.
In a pleasant turn, I'm pretty sure I just heard 2-3 guys yell "WE LOVE YOU MICHELLE"
That was me, in my house.
posted by bongo_x at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
Yes, the booing for Bernie is going to be loud and intensely embarrassing.
posted by mcstayinskool at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mcstayinskool at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Speech was great but nope, not the greatest, hardly. I can list a million reasons but 2 million people in prison for starters. I get the rhetoric, the anti-Trump positioning, but this country has megaprobz.
And yet I remember when Michelle made some remark during her husband's campaign like "I've fallen back in love with America" and boy did the Republicans come down on her like a ton of bricks. How dare she say anything hinting that America was not perfect? How dare she think that America is not Great?! This is what is so weird to me about this election season-- normally the Republican line is America is #1 and the most wonderful place on Earth. Yet here they are claiming that America is a sinkhole and a shadow of what it used to be.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
And yet I remember when Michelle made some remark during her husband's campaign like "I've fallen back in love with America" and boy did the Republicans come down on her like a ton of bricks. How dare she say anything hinting that America was not perfect? How dare she think that America is not Great?! This is what is so weird to me about this election season-- normally the Republican line is America is #1 and the most wonderful place on Earth. Yet here they are claiming that America is a sinkhole and a shadow of what it used to be.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Liz Warren could definitely beat Donald Trump in a physical fight.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Going straight for his manhood...nice.
posted by uosuaq at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by uosuaq at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
She said it
She said it
Paint it in the sky
"A man who must NEVER be president of the United States!"
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
She said it
She said it
Paint it in the sky
"A man who must NEVER be president of the United States!"
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Oh fuck they're booing Warren now.
posted by stolyarova at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by stolyarova at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016
lots of booing now
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016
Who on earth is still booing? Ugh
posted by Torosaurus at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Torosaurus at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Mod note: Another deleted - rokusan, you've made the point that you would rather not have had Clinton be the nominee, that's fine, but the point's been made a bunch of times now and you can stop.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
"What kind of a man... what kind of a man.... a man...."
She's calling out and very subtly queering the traditional idea of masculinity.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
She's calling out and very subtly queering the traditional idea of masculinity.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
The emphasis on man as both questioning his manhood and in contrast to Clinton is subtle, but detectable.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Meanwhile: "Trump, in NC, on gender gap: "50% of our country is men. We’re doing very well. The women, I don’t know what’s going on w/the women here""
Apparently he's never thought fit to ask any women "what's going on" either.
posted by zachlipton at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Apparently he's never thought fit to ask any women "what's going on" either.
posted by zachlipton at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Oh, it's going to be a nightmare when Sanders comes out.
posted by Lyn Never at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Lyn Never at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016
This has been such an embarrassment of riches tonight; any one of the speeches has been better than all of the RNC speeches put together.
posted by octothorpe at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [23 favorites]
Cracking up at how much better the basic call and response game is within this crowd.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I hope I get to vote Elizabeth Warren into the office of president someday
posted by Golem XIV at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Golem XIV at 7:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Warren has them now. Go attack woman!!
posted by bearwife at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by bearwife at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Stupid walls need the most love :(
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
She is busting all over Trump. If only she were a mic drop kind of lady it would be mic drop time!
posted by winna at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016
I'm furious with these people who keep heckling. Flames, flames on the side if my face ...
posted by EatTheWeek at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by EatTheWeek at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I am so interested to see how Bernie responds when he comes out and is booed. This really isn't what anyone expected until today.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by mynameisluka at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016
It might be a white New Englander thing but I love Warren's demeanor.
She's a sort of rationalist communicator; sort of, the appeal to logos versus pathos. That's sort of why Michelle Obama and Warren are such a great sequence.
posted by polymodus at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
She's a sort of rationalist communicator; sort of, the appeal to logos versus pathos. That's sort of why Michelle Obama and Warren are such a great sequence.
posted by polymodus at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I hope I get to vote Elizabeth Warren into the office of president somedayThat's not going to happen. She's too old, unfortunately. I'm holding out for Secretary of the Treasury.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
stolyarova: "Oh fuck they're booing Warren now."
Not sure if you're behind, but they're booing her references to Trump's various evils.
posted by Rhaomi at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Not sure if you're behind, but they're booing her references to Trump's various evils.
posted by Rhaomi at 7:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"And for one low low price, he'll even throw in a goofy hat."
Ha!
posted by Torosaurus at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Ha!
posted by Torosaurus at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"A man who must NEVER be president of the United States!"
I feel like Warren, Michelle Obama, and maybe Sarah Silverman should have all been onstage together and struck a Schuyler Sisters pose at that.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I feel like Warren, Michelle Obama, and maybe Sarah Silverman should have all been onstage together and struck a Schuyler Sisters pose at that.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
GOOFY HAT!!!
posted by stet at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by stet at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"Trump's entire campaign is just one more late night infomercial."
posted by winna at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
This really isn't what anyone expected until today.
I expected it? I feel like anybody who has been paying attention to the Bernie deadenders knew they were out to be spoilers and not much else.
posted by Justinian at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I expected it? I feel like anybody who has been paying attention to the Bernie deadenders knew they were out to be spoilers and not much else.
posted by Justinian at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
After she said "Hillary Clinton and Tim Kaine!" and some of the crowd booed longer than the cheers, she's pulled a public school teacher trick... she let her voice get quieter to get the class to settle down.
posted by LynnDee at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [30 favorites]
posted by LynnDee at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [30 favorites]
I love how this is a chorus of liberals who are totally not used to booing people and I really think I heard a "yay!, I mean boo!"
posted by Tarumba at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I know it is sort of low-brow, but I hope she squeezes in a 'small hands' reference somewhere.
posted by lampshade at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by lampshade at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
FEEL THE BOOOO-ERN.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 7:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
It's almost 10:45 Eastern time... shouldn't they have gotten Sanders out there by now?
posted by Justinian at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Justinian at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016
Yikes, and here I was trying to be unifying and all by pointing out it's possible to be fine with Clinton without hating the Sanders supporters. Rarefied air in here.
Warren is definitely coming across as an adult in her speech while focusing all the emotions in a useful (non-inward) way, which is nice. I can't imagine how they'll treat Sanders at this point. Seems like a crapshoot, but at least it'll be interesting.
posted by rokusan at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Warren is definitely coming across as an adult in her speech while focusing all the emotions in a useful (non-inward) way, which is nice. I can't imagine how they'll treat Sanders at this point. Seems like a crapshoot, but at least it'll be interesting.
posted by rokusan at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"the Great Trump Hot Air Machine will reveal all the answers. And for one low, low price he'll even throw in a goofy hat!"
posted by bologna on wry at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by bologna on wry at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016
Great job calling out Trump's divisiveness and his big con at the same time.
posted by bearwife at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by bearwife at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Fuck, at this point I can't wait to see MY emotional reaction when Bernie gets booed
I genuinely have no idea what I'm gonna feel seeing him speak
IT HAS BEEN A ROLLERCOASTER
posted by schadenfrau at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I genuinely have no idea what I'm gonna feel seeing him speak
IT HAS BEEN A ROLLERCOASTER
posted by schadenfrau at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Donald did say she has a "fresh mouth." She's wielding that sharp tongue like an epée. No holding back.
Kaine is the compassionate choir boy, and Warren is the warrior. There's a whole squad of superheroes forming, and I'm loving it.
posted by Superplin at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Kaine is the compassionate choir boy, and Warren is the warrior. There's a whole squad of superheroes forming, and I'm loving it.
posted by Superplin at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Not sure if you're behind, but they're booing her references to Trump's various evils.
They were very definitely booing at length at her mention of Clinton and Kaine, too, unfortunately.
Bernie's speech is gonna make for a weird closer basically no matter what, here.
posted by cortex at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
They were very definitely booing at length at her mention of Clinton and Kaine, too, unfortunately.
Bernie's speech is gonna make for a weird closer basically no matter what, here.
posted by cortex at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Elizabeth Warren has the room around the rug on the pillows now. It's history time.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I feel like Warren, Michelle Obama, and maybe Sarah Silverman should have all been onstage together and struck a Schuyler Sisters pose
Hm. Who's Peggy?
posted by rokusan at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Hm. Who's Peggy?
posted by rokusan at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
This really isn't what anyone expected until today.
I expected it? I feel like anybody who has been paying attention to the Bernie deadenders knew they were out to be spoilers and not much else
I didn't expect it only because the Bernie people I know in real life are all for Hillary by now. Like enthusiastically, not anti Trump.
posted by zutalors! at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
That's what it is! Warren reminds me a hell of a lot of my great-aunt, also a professor from New England.
The crowd is eating it up big-time. I wonder if she's targeting Bernie or Busters here - for the rest of the base, it doesn't seem necessary to slam The Donald quite this hard.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The crowd is eating it up big-time. I wonder if she's targeting Bernie or Busters here - for the rest of the base, it doesn't seem necessary to slam The Donald quite this hard.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
If you wonder what those five disruptive people kept chanting, it's "I am a douche, I am a douche."
posted by NorthernLite at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
posted by NorthernLite at 7:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
"Racial hatred was part of keeping the powerful on top." YES
posted by biogeo at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Sigh. Coulda beena contenda.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's almost 10:45 Eastern time... shouldn't they have gotten Sanders out there by now?
"Ladies and Gentlemen, Day 1 of the convention is over. Senator Sanders has gone to bed."
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"Ladies and Gentlemen, Day 1 of the convention is over. Senator Sanders has gone to bed."
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
"Goofy" is designed to troll Trump, given how he uses it towards her in his 200-word vocabulary. Expect him to be tweeting away all night.
posted by holgate at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by holgate at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I really want Bernie to go full on pissed off dad/grandpa. Like, the look you would get that would freeze you right in your tracks.
posted by cooker girl at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
It's not Trump (yet), but his spokesperson is already pulling the "Pocohantas" shtick.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zombieflanders at 7:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"When we turn on each other, we can't fight together to defeat a rigged system."
posted by winna at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Bernie better have a hell of a speech up his sleeve
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"Trump, in NC, on gender gap: "50% of our country is men. We’re doing very well. The women, I don’t know what’s going on w/the women here""
Apparently he's never thought fit to ask any women "what's going on" either.
I'm in NC. I'm a woman. Guess who I am supporting with my time, my money, and my vote? I know that the fact that I have a uterus is so confusing and it makes me such a weird, unnatural creature but trust me, I'm not changing my mind.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Apparently he's never thought fit to ask any women "what's going on" either.
I'm in NC. I'm a woman. Guess who I am supporting with my time, my money, and my vote? I know that the fact that I have a uterus is so confusing and it makes me such a weird, unnatural creature but trust me, I'm not changing my mind.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Will there be a Dylan goes electric "Judas" moment?
posted by snofoam at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by snofoam at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This is like the assembling the team sequence in an Avengers movie
posted by schadenfrau at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
Do not adjust your set. The image has clouded up a bit because of the hot, steaming bowl of truth that Warren is ladling out.
posted by uosuaq at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by uosuaq at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I want somebody to address Trump directly. Look straight in the camera, say "liar", "coward", "con artist", "clown", "thief", "hatemonger", "miserable fool". I want to watch him react. I want him to be asked about it on camera, over and over. Fuck yes it's time for name-calling, let's call things by their names. Call him a joke, and keep doing it, over and over until something bursts in him.
posted by penduluum at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
"No one who works full time should live in poverty."
Well, no one who doesn't work full time should live in poverty either, but... hey, it's a start.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Well, no one who doesn't work full time should live in poverty either, but... hey, it's a start.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Expect [Trump] to be tweeting away all night.
It's a brilliant strategy. Deprive him of sleep.
posted by rokusan at 7:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
It's a brilliant strategy. Deprive him of sleep.
posted by rokusan at 7:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Ooooh, thank you, snofoam - I know what I'm listening to tonight.
posted by stolyarova at 7:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by stolyarova at 7:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I want him to acknowledge the hurt and disappointment and give his die-hard supporters the right to grieve and heal and the path forward to a whole and trusting heart again.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
How can warren pin Wallstreet on Trump with a straight face?
posted by rr at 7:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by rr at 7:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Bernie better have a hell of a speech up his sleeve
Bernie released his prepared speech.
posted by gladly at 7:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Bernie released his prepared speech.
posted by gladly at 7:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
That's not going to happen. She's too old, unfortunately.
She'd be a fantastic chair of the Senate Finance Committee. Seriously, I'm not even an American, and I'm fine with senior Senators having quite a lot of power.
posted by holgate at 7:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
She'd be a fantastic chair of the Senate Finance Committee. Seriously, I'm not even an American, and I'm fine with senior Senators having quite a lot of power.
posted by holgate at 7:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I'm worried Bernie's speech is going to get a bad reaction and THAT is going to be the story in the morning even though so much of the evening has been good.
posted by zennie at 7:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by zennie at 7:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"When big banks get too risky, break 'em up!"
posted by biogeo at 7:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 7:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yeah, she's definitely targeting the Bernie supporters. It sounds like she's walking through Bernie's planks with a side-dish of equality talk.
Do you think this will get out beyond the convention
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Do you think this will get out beyond the convention
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Expect [Trump] to be tweeting away all night.
It's a brilliant strategy. Deprive him of sleep.
He just tweeted some mouthbargle that ended with "I know more about Cory than he knows about himself." so I dunno?
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:44 PM on July 25, 2016
It's a brilliant strategy. Deprive him of sleep.
He just tweeted some mouthbargle that ended with "I know more about Cory than he knows about himself." so I dunno?
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:44 PM on July 25, 2016
I feel like Warren, Michelle Obama, and maybe Sarah Silverman should have all been onstage together and struck a Schuyler Sisters pose at that.
WORK!
posted by Joey Michaels at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
WORK!
posted by Joey Michaels at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I feel like Warren isn't so much describing Clinton's intentions as doing a sort of "don't make a liar out of me" thing. When banks get too big, break 'em up? I hope so, Senator. I hope so.
posted by indubitable at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by indubitable at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I think you're misunderstanding. Misogyny and racism can be and frequently are internalized.
I've been lukewarm on Sanders and wish I could say I had no qualms whatsoever about voting Clinton, but to be honest, this whole "bernie bros" middleschool caliber social trickery is pretty much the worst kind of identity politics, that along with the little quips about how awkwards Bernie is, etc.
I'm loudly and proudly supporting Clinton, but I bet I won't be the only one who wishes there were some way to be sure *those supporters* of Clinton will get the memo that I and a lot of others are going to be doing it because we're mature enough to do the right things even when others' sense of smug self righteousness makes the right choice seem harder to swallow than it should.
Thanks for watching these things for those of us who are either too busy, burnt out, or both. Go Hillary Clinton! Don't anybody dare let the psycho in the orange wig anywhere near the codes! We're way overdue for giving the other half of the species a shot at this job nobody in their right mind could want. I honestly wish my life weren't in such crappy shape right now so I could bring more energy to this moment. I remember thinking Ferraro's vice presidential bid was a huge deal and rooting for that ticket as a kid. This is even bigger! Huge! If you've got it in you to celebrate, do it up right.
posted by saulgoodman at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I've been lukewarm on Sanders and wish I could say I had no qualms whatsoever about voting Clinton, but to be honest, this whole "bernie bros" middleschool caliber social trickery is pretty much the worst kind of identity politics, that along with the little quips about how awkwards Bernie is, etc.
I'm loudly and proudly supporting Clinton, but I bet I won't be the only one who wishes there were some way to be sure *those supporters* of Clinton will get the memo that I and a lot of others are going to be doing it because we're mature enough to do the right things even when others' sense of smug self righteousness makes the right choice seem harder to swallow than it should.
Thanks for watching these things for those of us who are either too busy, burnt out, or both. Go Hillary Clinton! Don't anybody dare let the psycho in the orange wig anywhere near the codes! We're way overdue for giving the other half of the species a shot at this job nobody in their right mind could want. I honestly wish my life weren't in such crappy shape right now so I could bring more energy to this moment. I remember thinking Ferraro's vice presidential bid was a huge deal and rooting for that ticket as a kid. This is even bigger! Huge! If you've got it in you to celebrate, do it up right.
posted by saulgoodman at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Hell, I'm going to sleep. I'd hate to have to give a speech this late.
posted by A Bad Catholic at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by A Bad Catholic at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016
"I can't belive that I have to say this in 2016."
-Elizabeth Warren
Thank you. To quote you: "let's work our hearts out."
posted by rp at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
-Elizabeth Warren
Thank you. To quote you: "let's work our hearts out."
posted by rp at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Everyone (except for the angry shouting folk) actually seems glad to be here, not embarrassed to be there. It's such a contrast.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Hillary really can't pass TPP after all the mentions tonight. There is going to be hell to pay if she does.
posted by futz at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by futz at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Keith Ellison is....the warrior!
posted by snofoam at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by snofoam at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm in NC. I'm a woman. Guess who I am supporting with my time, my money, and my vote?
I've honestly never understood how any woman since about 1940 could be a Republican. Maybe that makes me small-minded.
posted by rokusan at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I've honestly never understood how any woman since about 1940 could be a Republican. Maybe that makes me small-minded.
posted by rokusan at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Keith Ellison is VERY EXCITED.
posted by winna at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"the most progressive platform in the history of the Democratic Party" -- from Bernie's speech
posted by thetruthisjustalie at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by thetruthisjustalie at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Shit. It's my bed time. Will listen to Bernie's speech tomorrow.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016
It'll pass under Obama, Futz. And Hillary will shrug and be "unable" to fix it.
posted by rokusan at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I want Keith Ellison to run for President.
Republicans: "But... he's a Muslim!"
Democrats: "Yep."
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Republicans: "But... he's a Muslim!"
Democrats: "Yep."
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
And now tonight also includes a Muslim. What a palate cleanser from last week.
posted by palindromic at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
i hope when bernie comes out for his speech, every time the booers start booing the sound system just cuts to the loudest possible blasting of The 900 Number while bernie does the ed lover dance at them til they shut the fuck up
posted by poffin boffin at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by poffin boffin at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Wow. Elizabeth Warren destroyed Trump.
posted by persona au gratin at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 7:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
No, ArbitraryAndCapricious. Stay with us. I made nachos.
posted by rokusan at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
"Not voting is not a protest, it is a surrender."
Noice.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
Noice.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
It's going to take Mark Antony's eulogy for Caesar to turn the BoB's around tonight. I'm not confident Saunders is up to that.
posted by klarck at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by klarck at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Damn, Keith Ellison's coming out strong!
posted by zombieflanders at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zombieflanders at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016
He just tweeted some mouthbargle that ended with "I know more about Cory than he knows about himself." so I dunno?
He's announced he has a Gestapo that reports everything about his regional political enemies to him, personally, with that one. Explains why Chris Christie was the first of them to fall in line.
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
He's announced he has a Gestapo that reports everything about his regional political enemies to him, personally, with that one. Explains why Chris Christie was the first of them to fall in line.
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
That's a pretty decent Bernie speech based on a skim. It's not the usual stump, it's a positive endorsement. We'll see how the hall responds.
posted by holgate at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by holgate at 7:47 PM on July 25, 2016
Definitely targeting Bernie supporters again. "Not-voting is not a protest, it's a surrrender."
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
You bring some of those nachos soup's way
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 7:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
The size of banks isn't the issue. Warren and Clinton both know this.
posted by persona au gratin at 7:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by persona au gratin at 7:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
What Bernie should do is talk about downticket candidates and future local races and how the change his supporters, even the angry ones, all want is still out there, and will take many baby steps to reach. He probably won't, because it'd be off the narrative tonight and ruin the momentum, but turning all that empty rage into something constructive is an excellent long-term goal. Maybe at some later date.
posted by rokusan at 7:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 7:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
sanders incoming
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:49 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:49 PM on July 25, 2016
If Bernie's movement isn't about Bernie, why aren't they happy getting so much of their platform through?
posted by zutalors! at 7:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 7:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
ok bernie, you're up. get out there and unfuck yourself.
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 7:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 7:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
Sanders coming in on a parachute accompanied by fighter-jet flyover.
posted by rokusan at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This election cycle has been so deeply weird, guys. It's like I distrust anything even semi-positive.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Simon & Garfunkel's America is an excellent choice for Sanders.
posted by nathan_teske at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by nathan_teske at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Nice montage of many smiley Americans and puppers.
posted by winna at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
A great, respectful montage for Sanders.
posted by defenestration at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by defenestration at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Maybe I've missed this discussion of the TPP, but I always understood that it's primary goal wasn't actually as a trade deal -- it's a diplomacy play that's mean to box out China and Russia, right?
So while it is terrible for many reasons, it always seems like the discussion is missing this fairly important reason for its existence, and therefore it just becomes "they're in the bag for the corporations!" instead of getting us to ask why we have to give corporations these unbelievable goodies in exchange for strategic whathaveyous.
I dunno, maybe I've missed it.
posted by schadenfrau at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
So while it is terrible for many reasons, it always seems like the discussion is missing this fairly important reason for its existence, and therefore it just becomes "they're in the bag for the corporations!" instead of getting us to ask why we have to give corporations these unbelievable goodies in exchange for strategic whathaveyous.
I dunno, maybe I've missed it.
posted by schadenfrau at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
If Bernie's movement isn't about Bernie, why aren't they happy getting so much of their platform through?
The vast majority of us are. You can tell us apart because we're the ones cheering and not the assholes booing people.
posted by en forme de poire at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [59 favorites]
The vast majority of us are. You can tell us apart because we're the ones cheering and not the assholes booing people.
posted by en forme de poire at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [59 favorites]
Did Obama show video of Clinton rallies in 2008? This seems new to me.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zombieflanders at 7:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Totally right, zutalors. That's why I liked the (few) times they pointed that out, and wish they'd hammered it hard early on to get the hardline Bernie people to realize they'd won something.
posted by rokusan at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
sniff sniff what coulda been had he been more intersectional....
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
This is going to be huge.
posted by uosuaq at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by uosuaq at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Where's the bird? I was promised a bird landing on the podium!
posted by zakur at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by zakur at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
This crowd knows the difference between Sanders and the "burn it down" folks.
posted by biogeo at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
It's like I distrust anything even semi-positive.
Welcome to the Democratic Party
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
Welcome to the Democratic Party
posted by showbiz_liz at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
MY TIVO CRASHED
WHAT IS HAPPENING
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
WHAT IS HAPPENING
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
A great, respectful montage for Sanders.
It's one of his own commercials.
posted by waitingtoderail at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
It's one of his own commercials.
posted by waitingtoderail at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Sanders' applause percentage is through the roof right now
posted by birdheist at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by birdheist at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
For what it's worth, because I sure as shit do feel like this is a serious erasure problem; almost all of the POC and queer/trans people I know were Bernie supporters. Tellingly, they are all also under the age of 30.
I'm female and Latina. I would have been a Sanders supporter in my 20s too. Because it took me until my mid-thirties to finally twig to all the racism and sexism around me.
Yeah yeah I'm sure that sounds condescending and no, no, I'm not claiming that Sanders supporters are oblivious to racism and sexism.
But there really are some things you just don't get until you've reached a certain age.
posted by pocketfullofrye at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I'm female and Latina. I would have been a Sanders supporter in my 20s too. Because it took me until my mid-thirties to finally twig to all the racism and sexism around me.
Yeah yeah I'm sure that sounds condescending and no, no, I'm not claiming that Sanders supporters are oblivious to racism and sexism.
But there really are some things you just don't get until you've reached a certain age.
posted by pocketfullofrye at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
ok I'm back never mind sorry
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Ohhhhhh I melt every time I hear "They've all come to look for America." Always preferred that to Bridge.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
"so much of their platform through" is a relative statement
posted by R.F.Simpson at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by R.F.Simpson at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016
wow, longest ovations ever
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
<3 YOU BERNIE
posted by entropicamericana at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 7:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Thanks you x 1000
Aaaand goodnight?
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Aaaand goodnight?
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
defenestration: "A great, respectful montage for Sanders."
Originally a Sanders ad.
posted by Rhaomi at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Originally a Sanders ad.
posted by Rhaomi at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
This is brilliant handing out Bernie signs to the whole crowd. Let people hold both, whatever.
posted by zachlipton at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Is that a vuvuzela?
posted by mynameisluka at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Lord, give this night a closer we will remember for good reasons, not bad
Give us Bernie's best in all the right ways
And please, let it help us move further and further away from madness and more towards a future that does not involve the world dissolving into flames the color of Donald Trump's fake tan
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Give us Bernie's best in all the right ways
And please, let it help us move further and further away from madness and more towards a future that does not involve the world dissolving into flames the color of Donald Trump's fake tan
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Guess all those tweets of "they wouldn't let us bring in our Bernie signs!" were bullshit. Unless the DNC just handed them all out right now.
posted by sideshow at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by sideshow at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016
Could the tone of this be any different from the RNC?
posted by Lyme Drop at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Lyme Drop at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Damn I was really into him too. He let me down pretty fucking hard. I'm disappointed for sure. The feelings I'm having are surprising right now. I thought I had processed all this shit months ago...
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
what if this speech is just Sanders saying thank you for an hour
posted by defenestration at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
posted by defenestration at 7:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
The trade parts of the deal are indeed about an end-run around China, schadenfrau, but it's the other parts of the deal that have little to do with trade -- copyright and IP changes worldwide, labor standards -- that are more problematic, and make up more of the "corporate giveaways" category.
posted by rokusan at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
ahhhh please let him talk finally
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016
Yo Bernie use the gavel, quick. I can't deal with this anymore.
posted by dis_integration at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by dis_integration at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016
Now we just need him to give the speech of his life no big deal
posted by EatTheWeek at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by EatTheWeek at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
jesus people let your own guy speak
posted by echo target at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by echo target at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This actually reminds me a lot of Hillary's reception at Obama's nomination (when I was very much for Obama btw)
posted by zutalors! at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zutalors! at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
WHERES BIRDIE
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Well that's sure not booing. Longest ovation of the night by about 4x.
Now stay classy, people.
posted by rokusan at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Now stay classy, people.
posted by rokusan at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
For god's sake, just start speaking.
posted by peacheater at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by peacheater at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
really put an exclamation point on how sorely lacking Hillary is in the inspiration department.
I like a good speech as much as the next person, and I appreciate that it makes it easier to win elections, but in terms of Clinton's value as President, I am inspired by her competence, her graciousness, and her apparent ability to withstand decades-long shitstorms with equanimity. I am in awe of her. I literally don't know how she does it. I for sure don't think there's many people in the world that could have withstood that much constant, hostile, logic-free scrutiny of themselves from all sides and kept going.
I don't care if her speeches are as dull as dirt. I don't care if she's unhip and awkward and wears the Presidential equivalent of mom jeans and has unexciting personal style. None of that shit matters. She is the only thing between us and an actual no-joke nightmare. If she happens to be boring and wonky then by God that's fine by me. Better than fine. It's awesome.
I want her brain, and her belief in the Constitution and our laws, and her empathy and compassion. Lots of assholes can make great speeches. I need her to be a great President. I need her to keep us from plunging into a new Dark Age. She is not perfect, but she is pretty damn good at what she does and a lot of the people carping at her all the time would curl up and cry like little babies under the same pressure she deals with on a daily basis.
posted by emjaybee at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [136 favorites]
I like a good speech as much as the next person, and I appreciate that it makes it easier to win elections, but in terms of Clinton's value as President, I am inspired by her competence, her graciousness, and her apparent ability to withstand decades-long shitstorms with equanimity. I am in awe of her. I literally don't know how she does it. I for sure don't think there's many people in the world that could have withstood that much constant, hostile, logic-free scrutiny of themselves from all sides and kept going.
I don't care if her speeches are as dull as dirt. I don't care if she's unhip and awkward and wears the Presidential equivalent of mom jeans and has unexciting personal style. None of that shit matters. She is the only thing between us and an actual no-joke nightmare. If she happens to be boring and wonky then by God that's fine by me. Better than fine. It's awesome.
I want her brain, and her belief in the Constitution and our laws, and her empathy and compassion. Lots of assholes can make great speeches. I need her to be a great President. I need her to keep us from plunging into a new Dark Age. She is not perfect, but she is pretty damn good at what she does and a lot of the people carping at her all the time would curl up and cry like little babies under the same pressure she deals with on a daily basis.
posted by emjaybee at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [136 favorites]
Jesus people shut up and let him say something already
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016
Unless the DNC just handed them all out right now.
According to Nate Silver, that's exactly what they did.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
According to Nate Silver, that's exactly what they did.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
The volume and vociferousness of the ovation for Sanders here absolutely dwarfs that of any of the booing and heckling and chanting previously, which is heartening. Still on edge for what happens when he starts talking party unity and stumping for Hillary.
posted by cortex at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by cortex at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Definitely targeting Bernie supporters again. "Not-voting is not a protest, it's a surrrender."
Stein supporters. Sanders supporters were incensed by the final indignity of the email leaks, they demonstrated their outrage, they were permitted to, they were called out, and they either recanted or continued, and allowed to continue...
...and mainstream Sanders voters (Hi!) were on board with Clinton before Clinton voters were on board with Obama. Hard polling numbers.
Stein voters and Johnson voters are folks who never met an off-year (or off-month) municipal election they didn't vote in.
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Stein supporters. Sanders supporters were incensed by the final indignity of the email leaks, they demonstrated their outrage, they were permitted to, they were called out, and they either recanted or continued, and allowed to continue...
...and mainstream Sanders voters (Hi!) were on board with Clinton before Clinton voters were on board with Obama. Hard polling numbers.
Stein voters and Johnson voters are folks who never met an off-year (or off-month) municipal election they didn't vote in.
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
MY TIVO CRASHED
WHAT IS HAPPENING
They played Bernie's ad, the one with Simon's America. Now the crowd is still going on. Just insane. He has said "It's an honor" several times waiting for the applause to die down.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016
WHAT IS HAPPENING
They played Bernie's ad, the one with Simon's America. Now the crowd is still going on. Just insane. He has said "It's an honor" several times waiting for the applause to die down.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:53 PM on July 25, 2016
Thank you very much please SHUT UP I WANNA GO TO BED
posted by charred husk at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by charred husk at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
It was mostly his 'America' ad except for the end, where it showed him and Clinton together above the caption "STRONGER TOGETHER - BUILDING A FUTURE WE CAN BELIEVE IN'.
posted by Radiophonic Oddity at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Radiophonic Oddity at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
ENDORSE AGAIN MOTHERFUCKER!
posted by stet at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by stet at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Belated question: anyone know where I can get a Michelle sign?
posted by filthy light thief at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by filthy light thief at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Is that a vuvuzela?
According to the Gawker people that are there, yes. It is a vuvuzela.
posted by clorox at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
According to the Gawker people that are there, yes. It is a vuvuzela.
posted by clorox at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I want my money back, Bernie.
posted by persona au gratin at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 7:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Am I the only one who has always thought that "America" is a pretty depressing song about disillusionment against a vast, bleak American landscape?
posted by telegraph at 7:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by telegraph at 7:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Filthy Light Thief, if we find one I will share it with you
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
This is not about you, Bernie.
posted by stet at 7:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by stet at 7:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Guy, we're not here for you to talk about how great your campaign was.
posted by winna at 7:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I'm sure this is very personally significant for Bernie—he needs this moment of public mourning as much as the delegates who fought for him.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Poor Bernie lady crying. ;_;
posted by dis_integration at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dis_integration at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
He's not releasing the delegates?
posted by persona au gratin at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016
Oh shit.
posted by Torosaurus at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Torosaurus at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016
WAT
posted by charred husk at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by charred husk at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016
If he's going to rein them in, he has to coddle them first.
posted by uosuaq at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by uosuaq at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016
WTF is this? He's sounding like he's still full on campaigning.
posted by hollygoheavy at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by hollygoheavy at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
You guys are really salty about Bernie for some reason
posted by R.F.Simpson at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
posted by R.F.Simpson at 7:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
There had better be one hell of an endorsement coming in here. So far it's been nothing but me, me, me...
posted by adamp88 at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by adamp88 at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Haven't heard Hillary's name yet, Bernie.
posted by Gaz Errant at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Gaz Errant at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016
wait for it gang
posted by cmfletcher at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by cmfletcher at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I really liked Bernie a lot. I wish he'd done a better job. I'm not bitter, I'm disappointed and fuck it really does hurt to let this go.
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Oh God, BERNIE.....
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Bernie said he looks forward to their votes tomorrow night in reference to his delegates.
posted by winna at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Is he pulling a Ted Cruz?
posted by zakur at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zakur at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Am I the only one who has always thought that "America" is a pretty depressing song about disconnection and disillusionment against a vast, bleak American landscape?
I fell in love with that song in college so it seemed perfect for Bernie college supporters to me. I'm young enough that it was a weird vintage relic even at that time though (Chelsea Clinton's age)
posted by zutalors! at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I fell in love with that song in college so it seemed perfect for Bernie college supporters to me. I'm young enough that it was a weird vintage relic even at that time though (Chelsea Clinton's age)
posted by zutalors! at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
adamp88: here's the prepared speech, it's got an endorsement right there
posted by hleehowon at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by hleehowon at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Am I the only one who has always thought that "America" is a pretty depressing song about disillusionment against a vast, bleak American landscape?
It's my favorite Simon & Garfunkel song, but yeah it's not exactly uplifting.
posted by dirigibleman at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
It's my favorite Simon & Garfunkel song, but yeah it's not exactly uplifting.
posted by dirigibleman at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I feel vindicated in not voting for Sanders in WA's pointless primary election post-caucus.
posted by stet at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by stet at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I can not and will not begrudge Bernie this chance to thank --
Ooh... Mmm... You know what...
Oh okay he recovered, still super awkward
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016
Ooh... Mmm... You know what...
Oh okay he recovered, still super awkward
posted by Hermione Granger at 7:57 PM on July 25, 2016
So many people shouting "we love you Bernie". I'm starting to think this isn't about policy.
posted by biogeo at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This is a solid setup for a NOW WE DO THE NEXT THING, AND ELECT HILLARY. Whether folks bite, I dunno, but it's sensible judo.
posted by cortex at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by cortex at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
The endorsement is coming. At least if he sticks to his own text, and his campaign released it, so I assume he will.
posted by zachlipton at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Dudes. He already released his speech. Don't worry.
posted by cooker girl at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Heh he does have a proto comb-over. I never realized before!
Good luck, Bernie. Tough job to get those crazies under control!
posted by Tarumba at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016
Good luck, Bernie. Tough job to get those crazies under control!
posted by Tarumba at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016
As noted above, the speech has been released.
Spoiler: he ends it with an endorsement.
posted by mhz at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Spoiler: he ends it with an endorsement.
posted by mhz at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
antici.....
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 7:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Only if he goes there, cortex.
posted by mynameisluka at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by mynameisluka at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016
I will kindly inform my young friends that they are too young to have noticed that America is racist and sexist, and that we should just wait to speak our minds.
Maybe they'll avoid going to protests for a decade until they've REALLY absorbed what racism feels like, they've been working off such an ignorant sense of being afraid of being shot.
Thank you, 234,641st person to tell me I'm too young to 'get' it this election. I'd almost forgotten.
posted by neonrev at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
Maybe they'll avoid going to protests for a decade until they've REALLY absorbed what racism feels like, they've been working off such an ignorant sense of being afraid of being shot.
Thank you, 234,641st person to tell me I'm too young to 'get' it this election. I'd almost forgotten.
posted by neonrev at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
He's following his prepared speech so far. The first half is mainly about him, but the second half is a full-throated endorsement.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by zombieflanders at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016
TIMING!
posted by tonycpsu at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tonycpsu at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Having heard him and Elizabeth Warren back-to-back... man, I wish she had run instead of him.
posted by dw at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by dw at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Relax, kids. Of course he ends with an endorsement. He's got a lot to wrap up first.
posted by rokusan at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I don't think releasing the delegates is a good move at this point, because you don't want to give the Bernie dead-enders a voice. Having them vote for Bernie as a pledged delegates doesn't mean anything.
posted by skewed at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by skewed at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
stet: "This is not about you, Bernie."
Eh, give him his moment here. He earned it.
posted by octothorpe at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
Eh, give him his moment here. He earned it.
posted by octothorpe at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
I hate to break it to you, Bernie...this election is about polls. VOTES ARE POLLS, DUDE
posted by mynameisluka at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mynameisluka at 7:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I have to say I think this is just totally incorrect. Any attempt to collapse people's voting records down to a single axis is of course going to be flawed, but independent analyses repeatedly name Sanders among the absolute most left-wing national legislators.
Uh, I looked this up earlier this week in response to a discussion on Facebook. Sanders comes in at about #10 left to right. Two of the nine senators further left than him were up on stage tonight.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 8:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Uh, I looked this up earlier this week in response to a discussion on Facebook. Sanders comes in at about #10 left to right. Two of the nine senators further left than him were up on stage tonight.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 8:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
This election is not about.....(a lot of people and things) things that the media spends so much time discussing. I really thought he was going to say this election is not about me but he isn't ready to say that yet.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"This election is not about all the things that the media spends so much time discussing." YES
posted by biogeo at 8:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 8:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Guy, we're not here for you to talk about how great your campaign was.
We kinda are though. If you want to bring people into the fold you have to allow he and his supporters a moment in the sun.
posted by futz at 8:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [40 favorites]
We kinda are though. If you want to bring people into the fold you have to allow he and his supporters a moment in the sun.
posted by futz at 8:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [40 favorites]
Love the dude holding up his Bernie sign like he's John Cusack with the boombox in Say Anything
He's been doing that since something like 1pm PDT.
posted by sideshow at 8:01 PM on July 25, 2016
He's been doing that since something like 1pm PDT.
posted by sideshow at 8:01 PM on July 25, 2016
I confess I will miss Bernie's speeches, especially the beginning where he breaks out his campaign spreadsheet. How will I live without knowing exactly how many people donated to him?
posted by muddgirl at 8:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by muddgirl at 8:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
"I know a lot of people are disappointed about the results of the nominating process; I think it's fair to say that no one is more disappointed than me.
Election days come and go, but the struggle of the people to build a government that represents all of its people and not just the one percent ... a government based on the principles of economic, social, racial, and environmental justice; that struggle continues. And i look forward to being part of that struggle with you.
Let me be as clear as I can be. This election is not about - has never been about - Hillary Clinton or Donal dTrump or Bernie Sanders or any of the other candidates who sought the presidency ... not about political gossip, not about polls, ... not about all the things the media spends so much time discussing. This election is about and must be about the needs of the American people and the kind of future we create for our children and our grandchildren."
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
Election days come and go, but the struggle of the people to build a government that represents all of its people and not just the one percent ... a government based on the principles of economic, social, racial, and environmental justice; that struggle continues. And i look forward to being part of that struggle with you.
Let me be as clear as I can be. This election is not about - has never been about - Hillary Clinton or Donal dTrump or Bernie Sanders or any of the other candidates who sought the presidency ... not about political gossip, not about polls, ... not about all the things the media spends so much time discussing. This election is about and must be about the needs of the American people and the kind of future we create for our children and our grandchildren."
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
I can't make fun of the crying kids with the signs. This isn't college football they actually have a reason to care about this shit. Good for you caring so deeply. Now go vote.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [54 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [54 favorites]
Note: in the quoted bit from his speech he omitted Hillary Clinton's name from the list of people the election has not been about.
posted by winna at 8:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by winna at 8:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Jesus, you guys know how a fucking speech works?
He's hooking the attention of his supporters by speaking directly to them and lauding their accomplishments, introducing the themes of his campaign, then explaining why you should vote for Hillary because she's on the same page. If he jumped straight to step 3 it wouldn't be as effective, especially to the dead-enders.
You know where he's going. Let him lay the groundwork to get there for the people who need to get dragged along.
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 8:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [73 favorites]
He's hooking the attention of his supporters by speaking directly to them and lauding their accomplishments, introducing the themes of his campaign, then explaining why you should vote for Hillary because she's on the same page. If he jumped straight to step 3 it wouldn't be as effective, especially to the dead-enders.
You know where he's going. Let him lay the groundwork to get there for the people who need to get dragged along.
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 8:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [73 favorites]
He's pivoting. Give it time.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Shit if any Republicans are watching past their bedtime they will think we're all commies
posted by Tarumba at 8:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Tarumba at 8:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
My twitter feed is suddenly full of pictures of people sobbing at Bernie's speech. WTF is he saying?
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
When can we stop talking about class?
never.
posted by futz at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [64 favorites]
never.
posted by futz at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [64 favorites]
God, I just really hope this does it for some of the more vocal supporters in the hall. I'm all for giving him his due, but starting tomorrow I'd like to begin moving *forward*.
posted by Salieri at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Ok when is he going to turn this towards Hillary!? I am ready for the pivot, I don't need all the campaigning again.
posted by rmless at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by rmless at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016
When can we stop talking about class?
When the rich stop waging the class war?
posted by Lyme Drop at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [65 favorites]
When the rich stop waging the class war?
posted by Lyme Drop at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [65 favorites]
When can we stop talking about class?
Once the Sasha Administation defeats it.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
Once the Sasha Administation defeats it.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
Well, they're in favor of fascism, so
this was in response to Tarumba
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
this was in response to Tarumba
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
This speech is live, and these ideas are the plank of the DNC.
posted by mrzarquon at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Stop talking about class? wtf?
posted by R.F.Simpson at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by R.F.Simpson at 8:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Thank you, 234,641st person to tell me I'm too young to 'get' it this election. I'd almost forgotten.
I mean. Of course experience matters. This isn't...news? And I guess it's not news for Youths to be all "Shut up, you don't get it, you don't understand us!" either, but, you know. You do learn as you get older (if you're not completely fucking up).
Just because you feel slighted doesn't mean there isn't an element of youthful ignorance at play in this election. That's...literally what youth is. Having lived less.
posted by schadenfrau at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I mean. Of course experience matters. This isn't...news? And I guess it's not news for Youths to be all "Shut up, you don't get it, you don't understand us!" either, but, you know. You do learn as you get older (if you're not completely fucking up).
Just because you feel slighted doesn't mean there isn't an element of youthful ignorance at play in this election. That's...literally what youth is. Having lived less.
posted by schadenfrau at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Ok when is he going to turn this towards Hillary!?
Like three people linked the text of the speech.
posted by waitingtoderail at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Like three people linked the text of the speech.
posted by waitingtoderail at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
When can we stop talking about class?
Considering the behavior of some on the floor, not yet.
posted by stet at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Considering the behavior of some on the floor, not yet.
posted by stet at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Here we go.
posted by lovecrafty at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by lovecrafty at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
awww, those sobbing kids... :(
posted by Foci for Analysis at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Chill, folks. If the speech goes as written, in about 30 secs, he'll say
By these measures, any objective observer will conclude that – based on her ideas and her leadership – Hillary Clinton must become the next president of the United States. The choice is not even close.posted by zombieflanders at 8:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
When can we stop talking about class?
I think the relevant question is "when can Americans start talking about class?" because 2016 isn't a class divide election, it's about the deep and sometimes noxious things that prevent that conversation.
posted by holgate at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
I think the relevant question is "when can Americans start talking about class?" because 2016 isn't a class divide election, it's about the deep and sometimes noxious things that prevent that conversation.
posted by holgate at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
When can we stop talking about class?
When the American dream is more than a bedtime story?
posted by rokusan at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
When the American dream is more than a bedtime story?
posted by rokusan at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Here it comes.
posted by waitingtoderail at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by waitingtoderail at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016
I was just surprised by the delegate thing. I see where he's going now.
posted by charred husk at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by charred husk at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Boom goes the dynamite.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Okay, okay, but I'm getting impatient already. When will he say it again?
posted by skewed at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by skewed at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
And there it is - "Hillary Clinton MUST become the next President of the United States."
posted by zakur at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by zakur at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
There it is. Can yall stop for a minute and let some people hurt. Jesus.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [40 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [40 favorites]
When can we stop talking about class?
Only when everyone feels like we need to START talking about it.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Only when everyone feels like we need to START talking about it.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Uh, I looked this up earlier this week in response to a discussion on Facebook.
I linked two sources to back up what I was saying, DW-NOMINATE and GovTrack. If you have another source I'd be curious to see it.
posted by en forme de poire at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I linked two sources to back up what I was saying, DW-NOMINATE and GovTrack. If you have another source I'd be curious to see it.
posted by en forme de poire at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Okay, he just endorsed and the crowd sounds pretty on board to me.
posted by winna at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by winna at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016
Aw, poor Bernie. This can't have been easy for him, either.
posted by Andrhia at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by Andrhia at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
See? We all got there together!
posted by hal9k at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by hal9k at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Way more cheers than boos, though there's some Bernie Bernie chanters.
posted by lovecrafty at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by lovecrafty at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Nicely done.
posted by octothorpe at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by octothorpe at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016
Does Bil Clinton have tears in his eyes? again? or is that just me
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016
"This election, this election, is about a single--"
I swear I thought he was going to say "this election is about a single motherfucker" and it would have been the truest, best goddamn thing ever said.
posted by skewed at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [55 favorites]
I swear I thought he was going to say "this election is about a single motherfucker" and it would have been the truest, best goddamn thing ever said.
posted by skewed at 8:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [55 favorites]
Hey all, remember back in the day when BernieBros were a thing?
posted by tonycpsu at 8:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 8:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
they are still booing clinton but damn do they love sanders
posted by Foci for Analysis at 8:07 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Foci for Analysis at 8:07 PM on July 25, 2016
MSNBC is showing people holding their Bernie signs and StrongerTogether signs in the same hand, which is all my dreams
posted by zutalors! at 8:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 8:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [21 favorites]
Enough fighting. Let's destroy the yamfaced bigot.
posted by Lyme Drop at 8:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [55 favorites]
posted by Lyme Drop at 8:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [55 favorites]
Most outside of his camp knew in their minds that BernieBros are a minority of Sanders supporters, but now, with these images- they finally know.
posted by Apocryphon at 8:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Apocryphon at 8:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Boos mid-sentence with a mention of Clinton, but applause at the end. Chanting following through into the next couple sentences. It's a weird melange of getting there and not getting there.
posted by cortex at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by cortex at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Why shouldn't Sen. Sanders have acknowledged and shown his appreciation for his delegates and why shouldn't he want his pledged delegate total memorialized in the historical record? Of course he was going to endorse Sec. Clinton. He did it weeks ago.
posted by enjoymoreradio at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by enjoymoreradio at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Yuuuuuge
posted by SillyShepherd at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by SillyShepherd at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yuuuuuge tax breaks
posted by rmless at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by rmless at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Lol, "yuuuuuge tax breaks."
posted by lovecrafty at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by lovecrafty at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Bernie is going to be a hell of a fucking attack dog surrogate in the election. Holy Shit.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [30 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [30 favorites]
I can't watch because I get too worked up but if someone starts a big group hug on the convention floor, let me know, okay?
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I love it when candidates mention wastewater plants
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
This is...working?
posted by schadenfrau at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
No mention of rail in the infrastructure bit. Sad.
posted by clorox at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by clorox at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Yamfaced!
I will never be able to look at a sweet potato in the same way after this
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I will never be able to look at a sweet potato in the same way after this
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This is going exactly as it should. Well done so far. A devastating attack on Trump.
posted by bearwife at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by bearwife at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Boos mid-sentence with a mention of Clinton, but applause at the end. Chanting following through into the next couple sentences. It's a weird melange of getting there and not getting there.
This is like a kind of public therapeutic intervention for Bernie's activists. Part of getting them on board, connecting to change, while respecting their dignity and concerns. Without using snark, for example.
The getting there but not has a name: liminality.
posted by polymodus at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
This is like a kind of public therapeutic intervention for Bernie's activists. Part of getting them on board, connecting to change, while respecting their dignity and concerns. Without using snark, for example.
The getting there but not has a name: liminality.
posted by polymodus at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
It's an old truth: the old were once young but the young have not yet been old. True fact, I was 19 once and hated the old. I hated Laurence Whelk and old men who were confused by long hair and the old ladies who were so worried about young women in the workforce because their husbands might be tempted by the hussies. I hated the squares. I hated the Vietnam War and I hated Nixon and the so-called "Silent Majority" who were a bunch of moral prudes. So I remember clearly thinking that once the old fogies died off everything and everyone would be so much better. Didn't work.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [63 favorites]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [63 favorites]
Booing the Kochs warms my heart.
posted by lovecrafty at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by lovecrafty at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
"Brothers and sisters, this election is about overturning Citizens United."
posted by winna at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by winna at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
This is great, reminds me why I supported him. I hope he makes things a little more explicit, something along the lines of "If you are not doing everything you can to keep Trump out of office, then you do not understand what we have been fighting for."
posted by skewed at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by skewed at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
I've run out of favorites, so let me say: <3 y'all.
posted by introp at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by introp at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I appreciated the special shoutout to wastewater plants.
posted by The Nutmeg of Consolation at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by The Nutmeg of Consolation at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
I'm cool with the speech, I got a little frustrated at times by his reticence to admit the nomination math was largely hopeless after Super Tuesday but he did a good job tonight.
I hope that the bad feelings of the nomination process can get put to bed because OMG Democrats might bicker like cats and dogs over all sorts of shit but the Orange Manbaby is the number one threat.
posted by vuron at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I hope that the bad feelings of the nomination process can get put to bed because OMG Democrats might bicker like cats and dogs over all sorts of shit but the Orange Manbaby is the number one threat.
posted by vuron at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I hit my favorites limit again! This election is breaking me.
I have no problem giving Sanders time to do his supporters justice. He has important messages for the party and the country. I ended up (to my surprise) not voting for him, but I'm really glad he's there.
As someone said about, this convention is about healing. Time to stop the petty sniping at each other and work our asses off to make sure this election goes the way it needs to--and after November, that we hold the administration's feet to the fire and keep pushing for more progressive measures.
posted by Superplin at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I have no problem giving Sanders time to do his supporters justice. He has important messages for the party and the country. I ended up (to my surprise) not voting for him, but I'm really glad he's there.
As someone said about, this convention is about healing. Time to stop the petty sniping at each other and work our asses off to make sure this election goes the way it needs to--and after November, that we hold the administration's feet to the fire and keep pushing for more progressive measures.
posted by Superplin at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Seriously, Avengers assembled. They are going to stomp the shit out of that fascist bastard.
posted by schadenfrau at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
OH ADMIT IT, YOU GUYS ARE GOING TO MISS HIM
posted by teponaztli at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
posted by teponaztli at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
Is Sanders the first to mention the Supreme Court vacancy tonight? I figured that would be a bigger talking point.
posted by Rhaomi at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by Rhaomi at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
SUPREME COURT YES
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Oooh, awesome mention of Supreme Court justices from Bernie - and on multiple axes, including LGBT rights and women's right along with economic issues. Well done.
posted by Salieri at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 8:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I think it's working, I mean all those who kept saying Hillary's agenda is way different from Bernies are being directly contradicted.
posted by Tarumba at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
See, Dems don't stumble over "LGBT," or worry the crowd will boo it.
posted by NorthernLite at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by NorthernLite at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"Brothers and sisters, this election is about overturning Citizens United."
Cut to: Bill Clinton standing up and applauding.
posted by Guy Smiley at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Cut to: Bill Clinton standing up and applauding.
posted by Guy Smiley at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
SHUT THEM DOWN, BERNIE. SHUT. THEM. DOWN.
posted by dw at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by dw at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Of course he got "yuge" right. He's from Brooklyn. That's how we talk.
posted by adamg at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by adamg at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"If you don't believe that this election is important, [...] think about the Supreme Court justices Donald Trump would nominate."
posted by winna at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by winna at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Yes. Think about SCOTUS. Think about consequences. Well done, Bernie.
posted by homunculus at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by homunculus at 8:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Just because you feel slighted doesn't mean there isn't an element of youthful ignorance at play in this election. That's...literally what youth is. Having lived less.
To people I know, being young means have much more at stake, our entire lives in front of us. As silly as it might look on the other side of a decade in stagnant politics, we have some threats facing us (global warming, income inequality, systemic racism and identity-based violence.) that feel a whole hell of a lot more pressing when we're just starting out to build a life, and that seems basically impossible.
I have less experience than a 30 year old, yes, but I'm also far less jaded and convinced that things must come slowly and deeply flawed by default. I want to live in a decent country, and I don't want to wait until I'm old enough to be convinced that shit will always suck to have my voice heard.
(I'm leaving this topic here, I've said enough on it. I'm incredibly used to being wrong by way of having been born later than other people. I can't wait to be old enough to 'understand' things.)
posted by neonrev at 8:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [40 favorites]
To people I know, being young means have much more at stake, our entire lives in front of us. As silly as it might look on the other side of a decade in stagnant politics, we have some threats facing us (global warming, income inequality, systemic racism and identity-based violence.) that feel a whole hell of a lot more pressing when we're just starting out to build a life, and that seems basically impossible.
I have less experience than a 30 year old, yes, but I'm also far less jaded and convinced that things must come slowly and deeply flawed by default. I want to live in a decent country, and I don't want to wait until I'm old enough to be convinced that shit will always suck to have my voice heard.
(I'm leaving this topic here, I've said enough on it. I'm incredibly used to being wrong by way of having been born later than other people. I can't wait to be old enough to 'understand' things.)
posted by neonrev at 8:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [40 favorites]
Bernie is going to be a hell of a fucking attack dog surrogate in the election. Holy Shit.
Still a question of whether he wants to be. He ought to be, and probably needs to be. And he's going to say at the end "I am going to do everything I can to make that happen." So let's give him a bit of time to recuperate, and see what he wants to do.
posted by holgate at 8:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Still a question of whether he wants to be. He ought to be, and probably needs to be. And he's going to say at the end "I am going to do everything I can to make that happen." So let's give him a bit of time to recuperate, and see what he wants to do.
posted by holgate at 8:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
"This election is about the thousands of young people who I have met -" big cheers, that's really sweet
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Guys. Policies. With Numbers.
posted by mrzarquon at 8:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 8:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Bernie supporters need to cry. Hell I just did. Caught me off guard.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Not just mentioning Supremes, specifically telling his people that they can't sit out this election because the stakes of SCOTUS noms are too high.
posted by penduluum at 8:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 8:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Gosh y'all he's really selling the fuck out of this platform I hope to Jesus it's working.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Oh, poor sweet summer children sobbing in the stands. I get it, I voted for Perot. I thought I was doing something nobody else had thought about before too.
posted by Lyn Never at 8:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 8:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
So Trump is Larfleeze with the Orange Greed Ring and the Democrats are basically assembling a Justice League + Avengers team up to handle this.
Seems kind of overkill but I guess there is always the chance after beating Trump they can team up and beat up WHITE NATIONALISM
posted by vuron at 8:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Seems kind of overkill but I guess there is always the chance after beating Trump they can team up and beat up WHITE NATIONALISM
posted by vuron at 8:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I was worried Clinton did not have a plan to unite the party already in place, especially as the convention floor was going nuts with the booing and chants. She and Bernie clearly did have a plan, didn't let the unprecedented scope of the intra-party division get to them, and executed on it. Awesome.
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
Science, motherfuckers!
posted by SillyShepherd at 8:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by SillyShepherd at 8:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
This is the speech I wanted to hear from the Bernie I voted for. Nodding along almost constantly now.
posted by zombieflanders at 8:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 8:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
"Hillary Clinton listens to the scientists."
YES
And I'm loving the "Hillary listens" theme coming from so many speakers.
posted by Salieri at 8:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [54 favorites]
YES
And I'm loving the "Hillary listens" theme coming from so many speakers.
posted by Salieri at 8:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [54 favorites]
Yeah.
It was a comment based on hope. I want "class" to mean the school/year people graduated from. I want "class" to mean what you have learned because you know it. I want education to mean real, physical work. Not the money you come from.
I want that for everyone. I want all of us to know what 'work' means. I want 'class' to mean compassion for and courtesy to the people around you.
posted by rp at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It was a comment based on hope. I want "class" to mean the school/year people graduated from. I want "class" to mean what you have learned because you know it. I want education to mean real, physical work. Not the money you come from.
I want that for everyone. I want all of us to know what 'work' means. I want 'class' to mean compassion for and courtesy to the people around you.
posted by rp at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Great job! Finally, finally, I am feeling the Bern. And I really like the direction this solid speech is sending the D campaign.
posted by bearwife at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by bearwife at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
To people I know, being young means have much more at stake,
My youngest is 12 years old and I'm fighting like hell for him and the next 6 generations. This isn't about "me getting mine" at all. For real, I'm not forgetting you.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
My youngest is 12 years old and I'm fighting like hell for him and the next 6 generations. This isn't about "me getting mine" at all. For real, I'm not forgetting you.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [35 favorites]
Bernie is killing it. He is doing exactly what needs doing. All bad feelings wiped away - what a mensch.
posted by palindromic at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
They are going to stomp the shit out of that fascist bastard.
Alternative background music.
posted by kewb at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016
Alternative background music.
posted by kewb at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016
"Hillary Clinton understands that a president's job is to worry about future generations, not the profits of energy companies."
posted by winna at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by winna at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Mental health counseling! Please! Please! Oh my god please
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
This is very good. This is the Sanders that I struggled with deciding whether to vote for last winter.
posted by biogeo at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
To people I know, being young means have much more at stake, our entire lives in front of us.
I still have my entire life ahead of me too. As do my children. Please don't dismiss the fact that those of us in our 40s, 50s and 60s and beyond have learned some hard painful lessons that we'd like to keep the next generation from having to learn the way we did.
posted by hollygoheavy at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [53 favorites]
I still have my entire life ahead of me too. As do my children. Please don't dismiss the fact that those of us in our 40s, 50s and 60s and beyond have learned some hard painful lessons that we'd like to keep the next generation from having to learn the way we did.
posted by hollygoheavy at 8:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [53 favorites]
I.e., I feel hope. A lot of hope. This is an excellent Bern.
posted by bearwife at 8:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by bearwife at 8:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"...and all we need to do all of this is put all of the Republicans into a spaceship and send them to the moon."
I think he improvised that bit, as it's not in the prepared speech.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I think he improvised that bit, as it's not in the prepared speech.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Hey I was A Youth who supported Howard Dean, we've all been there and thought we invented idealism. I'm not saying old people know more, just that we could all stand to learn from each other.
posted by zutalors! at 8:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 8:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
> Seems kind of overkill but I guess there is always the chance after beating Trump they can team up and beat up WHITE NATIONALISM
There is no such thing as overkill for handling Trump. His policies and ideas have to be scorched from the earth, then salted.
posted by mrzarquon at 8:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
There is no such thing as overkill for handling Trump. His policies and ideas have to be scorched from the earth, then salted.
posted by mrzarquon at 8:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"This election is about the thousands of young people who I have met"
Obama in 2008 made total sense. He was young and hip and cool.
But once we get some distance from this and look back on it without all the loaded emotions, think about how remarkable and improbable it will be to remember that it was this tiny little 74yo wizard man that won the hearts of young voters in America.
posted by rokusan at 8:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [45 favorites]
Obama in 2008 made total sense. He was young and hip and cool.
But once we get some distance from this and look back on it without all the loaded emotions, think about how remarkable and improbable it will be to remember that it was this tiny little 74yo wizard man that won the hearts of young voters in America.
posted by rokusan at 8:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [45 favorites]
This is fucking heroic, thank you Senator
posted by EatTheWeek at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by EatTheWeek at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
If only Killer Mike were standing behind him, arms crossed, mean mugging, I could die happy.
I want this to be the Shook Ones pt 2 of convention speeches, I'm saying.
posted by penduluum at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
I want this to be the Shook Ones pt 2 of convention speeches, I'm saying.
posted by penduluum at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Tomorrow morning might be a doozy:
posted by zombieflanders at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Elizabeth Warren, often referred to as Pocahontas, just misrepresented me and spoke glowingly about Crooked Hillary, who she always hated!popcorn.gif
posted by zombieflanders at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Jesus. Lay off the younger folks. Let people have their moment. They are a fuckload smarter and tuned in than trumps supporters. Mocking them is only exacerbating the divide.
posted by futz at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
posted by futz at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
let's not argue who cares more about the future generations
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Nader seemed reasonable to me! We've all been there!
(note: my vote was in a state that was not in contest and so thankfully I don't have to hate myself forever.)
posted by winna at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
(note: my vote was in a state that was not in contest and so thankfully I don't have to hate myself forever.)
posted by winna at 8:17 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I didn't vote for Bernie expecting him to win the nomination, I voted for him hoping he'd light it up at the convention just like this.
posted by klarck at 8:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [51 favorites]
posted by klarck at 8:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [51 favorites]
He's killing it. I'm not hearing any boos when he says "Hillary" anymore.
posted by lovecrafty at 8:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by lovecrafty at 8:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
They are a fuckload smarter and more politically tuned in than we were, and we seldom give them any credit for that.
posted by rokusan at 8:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 8:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Mod note: One comment deleted, let's ease back on the weird young vs old thing in here?
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 8:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 8:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
OK, Bernie, bring it home.
posted by dw at 8:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by dw at 8:18 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I get it, I voted for Perot.
I voted for Carter my 1st Prez election, then think I voted for John Anderson in '80. (I'm afraid to google and review now what his platform really was.) But yeah, I get being young and wanting something different/ outsiderish.
I think Sanders is doing a pretty good job transitioning the crowd. And he *is* speaking to a Hillary woman like me.
posted by NorthernLite at 8:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I voted for Carter my 1st Prez election, then think I voted for John Anderson in '80. (I'm afraid to google and review now what his platform really was.) But yeah, I get being young and wanting something different/ outsiderish.
I think Sanders is doing a pretty good job transitioning the crowd. And he *is* speaking to a Hillary woman like me.
posted by NorthernLite at 8:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
You know what, us embattled old veterans need to have compassion for the younger, newer folks. We need them, and we used to be them and there is no shame in caring about things with your whole heart.
I am happy to argue about candidates all day long, but I am not going to shit on people or mock them for being younger than me.
posted by emjaybee at 8:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
I am happy to argue about candidates all day long, but I am not going to shit on people or mock them for being younger than me.
posted by emjaybee at 8:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
popcorn.gif
YHBT on primetime TV HTH (tiny) HAND(s)
posted by holgate at 8:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
YHBT on primetime TV HTH (tiny) HAND(s)
posted by holgate at 8:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Did anyone else mention/acknowledge Native Americans tonight aside from Bernie?
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Toastie Twitter: "The only thing he's saying about hilary is "Hilary understands" followed by his own opinion."
posted by stet at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by stet at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
GREAT speech. As a diehard HRC supporter this year, I am so impressed and so glad to have Bernie as an ally. An awesome ally. I am solidly impressed with his supporters' work on the platform too
posted by bearwife at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by bearwife at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Bush v. Gore happened when I was 24 , so I empathize with y'all youngins. I do. Sincerely.
But my little boy is 4 years old. He has no idea all this is happening around him and I want so badly for him to grow up and not hear about this weird fascist blip in our country until he's in high school history class. I don't want him growing up in Trump's America. I voted for Bernie in the primary but the primary is over and right now the choice is Hillary or fascism. For my boy, I'm choosing the not-fascist option, and I'm choosing it hard.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
But my little boy is 4 years old. He has no idea all this is happening around him and I want so badly for him to grow up and not hear about this weird fascist blip in our country until he's in high school history class. I don't want him growing up in Trump's America. I voted for Bernie in the primary but the primary is over and right now the choice is Hillary or fascism. For my boy, I'm choosing the not-fascist option, and I'm choosing it hard.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [34 favorites]
SAY WEED BERNIE JUST SAY DANK WEED AND ALL IS FORGIVEN
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
I like that it's not just a rhetorical nudging to bring his supporters around -- he's actually putting the ideas first, as he always has. X is good, we stand for X, Hillary stands for X, vote for Hillary. It's an actual argument for doing it, not just an elaborate segue to "I'm with her." Plus it reinforces those ideas that build and strengthen the left in the long term.
posted by chortly at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
posted by chortly at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
This is beautiful. Thank you Bernie.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
"That's what DEMOCRACY is for."
Yes! Strong differences of opinion are a feature of the system, not a bug. This is the messy, painful process of making the sausage.
posted by Superplin at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Yes! Strong differences of opinion are a feature of the system, not a bug. This is the messy, painful process of making the sausage.
posted by Superplin at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
No TP - someone didn't replace the roll
posted by bologna on wry at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by bologna on wry at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Pew: 90% of 'consistent' Sanders voters will vote for Clinton
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
"It is no secret that Hillary and I disagree on a number of issues. That is what this campaign has been about, that is what democracy about!
I'm happy to tell you that at the democratic platform comittee there was a significant coming together of the two campaigns and together we produced the most progressive platform in the history of the Democratic party."
Kinda feels like Bernie's last campaign speech, but that's appropriate enough.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I'm happy to tell you that at the democratic platform comittee there was a significant coming together of the two campaigns and together we produced the most progressive platform in the history of the Democratic party."
Kinda feels like Bernie's last campaign speech, but that's appropriate enough.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I was kind of worried about Bernies age and I feel like if he were my dad a part of me would be secretly happy he didn't win the nomination.
posted by Tarumba at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I am so happy that Bernie is pulling this off. I was so worried.
posted by Bella Donna at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Bella Donna at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Now all of you highfaluting Sanders supporters know what it feels like to be a Lessig voter.
posted by Apocryphon at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Apocryphon at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
stupid sexy sanders...
posted by Foci for Analysis at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
SAY WEED BERNIE JUST SAY DANK WEED AND ALL IS FORGIVEN
[+1]
TAKE THAT FAVORITE LIMIT.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
[+1]
TAKE THAT FAVORITE LIMIT.
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
That TPP remark wasn't in prepared speech.
posted by sideshow at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by sideshow at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
"It is no secret that Hillary and I disagree on a number of issues. .... That is what democracy is about."
posted by biogeo at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 8:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
The bit about stopping TPP in the lame duck wasn't in his prepared speech.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Oh here's the Bernie I fell in love with and voted for!
posted by hollygoheavy at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by hollygoheavy at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
So, wait. "No TPP" is already part of the Democratic platform? Then, why were those people chanting that over Elijah Cummings' speech?
posted by mhum at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by mhum at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Bernie Sanders is delivering. Thank you, Bernie.
posted by defenestration at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by defenestration at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Man, so great that he mentioned her role in trying to get universal health care as First Lady.
posted by Salieri at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by Salieri at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Aww I hit my favorite limit
How else can I tell you all how much I love and am grateful for you during this, my first DNC?
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
How else can I tell you all how much I love and am grateful for you during this, my first DNC?
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Bernie is a mensch.
posted by octobersurprise at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by octobersurprise at 8:22 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Takin it to the streets ?
posted by persona au gratin at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
That was a good speech, thanks Bernie.
posted by Justinian at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
well done bernie, well done. *clap*
posted by bologna on wry at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by bologna on wry at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Bernie, that was spectacular. Thank you!
posted by mochapickle at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mochapickle at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Sanders is making a great case for a Clinton presidency. The contrast between this and Ted Cruz' sore-loser non-endorsement of Trump couldn't be more stark. This is what party unity looks like. I'm glad I voted Sanders in the primary, and I'm gladly following his recommendation to vote Clinton in November.
posted by Cookiebastard at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [42 favorites]
posted by Cookiebastard at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [42 favorites]
So...are they down with TPP?
posted by Huffy Puffy at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by Huffy Puffy at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
That goofy grin at the "no TPP" signs and shouters was pretty endearing.
posted by biogeo at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by biogeo at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
A-FUCKING-MEN
posted by zombieflanders at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zombieflanders at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Great speech!!
posted by zutalors! at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zutalors! at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Who is sitting next to Bill?
posted by R.F.Simpson at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by R.F.Simpson at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
mhum, while Clinton has come out against it (after being in favor of it previously), it's not in the official platform—mostly due to party politics, as far as I have read.
posted by defenestration at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by defenestration at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I *wish* I'd gotten a speech like this from Perot. He just sort of wandered off, cackling to himself.
posted by Lyn Never at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 8:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Hey Bernie Bros, a tip - DO NOT BOO THE LADY RABBI
posted by zakur at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by zakur at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Next to Bill Clinton -- is that Cecille Richards of Planned Parenthood?
posted by penduluum at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by penduluum at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Those last-minute inserts about not passing the TPP in a lame duck session are... really interesting. Sounds like Sanders is prepared to keep fighting to make sure promises are kept.
posted by rokusan at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Bill Clinton just said something like he was moved / impressed or something. And the man knows public speaking.
posted by mrzarquon at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mrzarquon at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
So, wait. "No TPP" is already part of the Democratic platform? Then, why were those people chanting that over Elijah Cummings' speech?
Because those are the idiots who care more about a cult of personality (or anti-personality) than actually advancing their supposed beliefs.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Because those are the idiots who care more about a cult of personality (or anti-personality) than actually advancing their supposed beliefs.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
So, wait. "No TPP" is already part of the Democratic platform? Then, why were those people chanting that over Elijah Cummings' speech?
It isn't. Clinton surrogates kept it out, even though Clinton has flipped over to publicly opposing it. Kaine is for the thing. Needless to say, those of us for whom it's a priority are somewhat concerned about her commitment on that point.
posted by fifthrider at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
It isn't. Clinton surrogates kept it out, even though Clinton has flipped over to publicly opposing it. Kaine is for the thing. Needless to say, those of us for whom it's a priority are somewhat concerned about her commitment on that point.
posted by fifthrider at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
In the end, Bernie was always too radical for the presidency. A small consolation is that it appears he's pushed Clinton further to the left than a Bernie-less primary would have. Well done indeed!
posted by iamck at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by iamck at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
@JanieVelencia:
1st night of DNC,
Cory Booker
Michelle Obama
Joe Kennedy
Liz Warren
Bernie Sanders
1st night of RNC
Duck Dynasty guy
Rick Perry
Scott Baio
posted by emjaybee at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [87 favorites]
1st night of DNC,
Cory Booker
Michelle Obama
Joe Kennedy
Liz Warren
Bernie Sanders
1st night of RNC
Duck Dynasty guy
Rick Perry
Scott Baio
posted by emjaybee at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [87 favorites]
Penduluum, I keep thinking it's Claire Underwood.
posted by rokusan at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
it is now 5:23 am and i've been up all night following this convention. Thank you everyone for your sweet sweet company. goodnight
posted by Foci for Analysis at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by Foci for Analysis at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Just gotta say, it's not really that inexplicable why young people respond to Sanders. You could, like. Ask.
Just off the top of my head, he's utterly sincere, and he talks to the voters like they will actually understand the issues he's talking about.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
Just off the top of my head, he's utterly sincere, and he talks to the voters like they will actually understand the issues he's talking about.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
why were those people chanting that over Elijah Cummings' speech?
Because they're idiots. Chanting like that was so rude.
posted by numaner at 8:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Because they're idiots. Chanting like that was so rude.
posted by numaner at 8:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Judging by his Twitter feed, Trump must really think Sanders supporters are stupid and willing to let themselves be transparently manipulated.
posted by Superplin at 8:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Superplin at 8:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
His campaign has also brought a level of political literacy into the discourse that I greatly appreciate. I like that people know what Glass-Steagall is, for example.
posted by palindromic at 8:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by palindromic at 8:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Sheesh, I'm an agnostic/atheist and I think it's rude to hear all the talking during this rabbi's benediciton.
posted by NorthernLite at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by NorthernLite at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I am wrung. out. and it's only day 1. Don't know if I'll make it to the end of week. Thank you to all of you wonderful Mefites for sharing this evening with me. Can't think of a finer group of people to spend it with.
posted by longdaysjourney at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by longdaysjourney at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
do we get an fsm prayer next? unite pastafarians
posted by bologna on wry at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by bologna on wry at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Never in my life would I think, cynically, things like the campaign policies promised tonight could all be achievable or even part of a national platform. My first political rally was Nader in 2000, and I swore it was great ideas but I'd never see it at a democratic convention.
posted by mrzarquon at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Good lord, this thread is an emotional rollercoaster
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Yeah, like. Sanders is like that one high school teacher who was the first grownup to also treat you like a grownup.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [30 favorites]
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [30 favorites]
...pation!
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Thank you, DNC and fellow Metafites, it's time for dinner. See you at the same safe space tomorrow. Sweet dreams.
posted by TrishaU at 8:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by TrishaU at 8:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Seems kind of unfair to line up 4 days of this guys. I mean the DNC could've basically called it quits about halfway through the evening and had more solid performances than 4 days of Doom and Gloom.
If we have 3 more evenings of this people will just start giving Trump sympathy votes because it'll just look two one-sided.
posted by vuron at 8:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
If we have 3 more evenings of this people will just start giving Trump sympathy votes because it'll just look two one-sided.
posted by vuron at 8:27 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Clinton surrogates kept it out, even though Clinton has flipped over to publicly opposing it. Kaine is for the thing.
I thought he'd changed his stance on it?
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:27 PM on July 25, 2016
I thought he'd changed his stance on it?
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:27 PM on July 25, 2016
Marcia Fudge is magnificent, as fresh at the end of the day as the beginning.
posted by stolyarova at 8:27 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by stolyarova at 8:27 PM on July 25, 2016
That's it, I'm putting the Funko Pop I have of Bernie Sanders on my desk tomorrow. Forever.
posted by Phyltre at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Phyltre at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
lol that like 3 people voted "nay" for the nightly recess
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by cobra_high_tigers at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
recess! I CALL THE FOUR SQUARE COURT
posted by bologna on wry at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by bologna on wry at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Judging by his Twitter feed, Trump must really think Sanders supporters are stupid and willing to let themselves be transparently manipulated.
It's nice that he's so incapable of being subtle. He could try to be all sly and ratfucky about it but naaaaah let's just assume these people are stupid. That'll get me votes! Yeah!
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
It's nice that he's so incapable of being subtle. He could try to be all sly and ratfucky about it but naaaaah let's just assume these people are stupid. That'll get me votes! Yeah!
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
DON'T FORGET THE GAVEL
posted by arcolz at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by arcolz at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Good night, Miss Fudge!
posted by mochapickle at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by mochapickle at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016
GAVELGATE
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
LMAO
WHERE IS IT
God bless America, that was the best
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
WHERE IS IT
God bless America, that was the best
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Good lord, this thread is an emotional rollercoaster
See you in 105 days!
posted by jeremias at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
See you in 105 days!
posted by jeremias at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Heh. Forgotten gavel callback.
posted by cortex at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by cortex at 8:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
No YOU hang up first.
posted by hal9k at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by hal9k at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
The Eagle has landed.
Great speech. Hope he stays in the party.
posted by Ironmouth at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Great speech. Hope he stays in the party.
posted by Ironmouth at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
That damn gavel. I'm voting on a strict anti-gavel platform.
posted by phunniemee at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by phunniemee at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Wait a second, does that gavel have a gold fringe?
posted by tonycpsu at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Pretty good show tonight. Hope we can get 6 seasons and a movie out of it.
posted by klarck at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by klarck at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Judging by his Twitter feed, Trump must really think Sanders supporters are stupid and willing to let themselves be transparently manipulated.
Because he only pays attention to fox news and his twitter. He doesn't have any objective bearings.
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Because he only pays attention to fox news and his twitter. He doesn't have any objective bearings.
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I want someone to write fanfic from the point of view of the gavels used (or not used, or used improperly) at the DNC and RNC conventions.
Like, they can get together afterward for drinks and talk about whether Paul Ryan moisturizes his hands, or how firm Marcia Fudge's grip is.
posted by Salieri at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Like, they can get together afterward for drinks and talk about whether Paul Ryan moisturizes his hands, or how firm Marcia Fudge's grip is.
posted by Salieri at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Though he frequently oversimplifies things. Glass-Steagall is beside the point. So is breaking up the banks. Most advanced health care systems aren't single payer.
But he's illustrated there is a huge social democratic element in the US, which will pay dividends for years to come.
posted by persona au gratin at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
But he's illustrated there is a huge social democratic element in the US, which will pay dividends for years to come.
posted by persona au gratin at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Chris Hayes just interviewed one of the crying Sanders delegates. She insisted that she could not accept what Sanders said about Clinton being the best choice and that she would leave the Democratic party and vote for Jill Stein. But, hey, I guess you'll never reach everybody.
posted by Justinian at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Blank Space playing is kind of brilliant.
posted by Torosaurus at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Torosaurus at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
It's almost midnight remember to go back and favorite all the comment s I made that you missed earlier.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
MSNBC just interviewed a CA delegate who is going to vote for Jill Stein and doesn't believe Bernie.
posted by zutalors! at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zutalors! at 8:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I thought he'd changed his stance on it?
He doesn't like the dispute settlement and resolution section: the bit where corporations can sue nation-states, which is definitely the most problematic part.
posted by holgate at 8:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
He doesn't like the dispute settlement and resolution section: the bit where corporations can sue nation-states, which is definitely the most problematic part.
posted by holgate at 8:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
I sure hope Bernie Bros don't come back tomorrow as if nothing happened today. They better tone it down.
posted by Tarumba at 8:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 8:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Yep - Kaine comes out against Trans-Pacific Partnership trade deal. Kaine had never taken a formal position on the pact, but as recently as Thursday told reporters he saw much in the agreement that he liked, while continuing to express concerns about other provisions, including the handling of investment disputes. His decision to oppose the agreement deals another blow to President Barack Obama's hopes of winning approval of the deal from Congress this year... Kaine was just one of 13 Senate Democrats who voted last year for fast track authority.
It actually sort of sounds like expressing a lack of support for TPP was a condition of his being selected as VP.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
It actually sort of sounds like expressing a lack of support for TPP was a condition of his being selected as VP.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
I'm hopeful that together we can get 50+ senators in January and maybe start passing some of Bernie's ideas.
Keep that in mind, the campaign might've ended but the mission is ongoing and it's going to require a bunch of votes in Congress.
posted by vuron at 8:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Keep that in mind, the campaign might've ended but the mission is ongoing and it's going to require a bunch of votes in Congress.
posted by vuron at 8:31 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
He's a big fan of the IP and labor parts, however... which are also very problematic.
posted by rokusan at 8:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by rokusan at 8:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I want someone to write fanfic from the point of view of the gavels used (or not used, or used improperly) at the DNC and RNC conventions.
Careful what you wish for. You don't want to know where those gavels would wind up.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Careful what you wish for. You don't want to know where those gavels would wind up.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
And Bernie Sanders just emailed everyone on his mailing list asking that they join a new revolutionary party, Our Revolution. I'm in, man.
posted by Scram at 8:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Scram at 8:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
MSNBC just interviewed a CA delegate who is going to vote for Jill Stein and doesn't believe Bernie.
Let me guess: it's a SF perma-activist who thinks Nancy Pelosi is a corporate shill and deserves to be primaried every two years?
posted by holgate at 8:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Let me guess: it's a SF perma-activist who thinks Nancy Pelosi is a corporate shill and deserves to be primaried every two years?
posted by holgate at 8:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'd like to hear Obama give an extended defense of TPP. Maybe he has and I haven't heard it.
posted by persona au gratin at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yep, Bernie did mention the House and Senate, if you missed it.
I wasn't going to tune in, but I'm so glad I caught Michelle Obama's speech.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I wasn't going to tune in, but I'm so glad I caught Michelle Obama's speech.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I can't sleep, too hyped up now.
posted by Tarumba at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Heh, Scram, seeing "05401" as the default ZIP code there gave me chills.
posted by en forme de poire at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by en forme de poire at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016
God, these 2 Bernie people MSNBC has interviewed are just lost.
posted by cashman at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by cashman at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Did the networks go find the #nevertrump delegates and ask who they were going to vote for?
posted by skewed at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by skewed at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
You don't want to know where those gavels would wind up.
If no one wanted to know that, Chuck Tingle would be out of a job.
posted by zombieflanders at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
If no one wanted to know that, Chuck Tingle would be out of a job.
posted by zombieflanders at 8:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
Up next Kim endorses Taylor
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016
They're interviewing another person who hates Hillary on MSNBC and wants her to come over "just a little bit"
REALLY
posted by zutalors! at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
REALLY
posted by zutalors! at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Careful what you wish for. You don't want to know where those gavels would wind up.
My years in fandom have left me completely calloused. Rule 34 of the internet, baby.
posted by Salieri at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
My years in fandom have left me completely calloused. Rule 34 of the internet, baby.
posted by Salieri at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I'd love it if we could do better than the media here and focus on the 90+% of Sanders supporters who enthusiastically support Hillary, and not devote yet another thousand posts to the fraction of a fraction of Democrats who are jerks.
posted by chortly at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
posted by chortly at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
Nancy Pelosi belongs on our currency.
posted by persona au gratin at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by persona au gratin at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Salieri: I want someone to write fanfic from the point of view of the gavels used (or not used, or used improperly) at the DNC and RNC conventions. Like, they can get together afterward for drinks and talk about whether Paul Ryan moisturizes his hands, or how firm Marcia Fudge's grip is.
Yuletide!
posted by Superplin at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Yuletide!
posted by Superplin at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Ok, for the record, here's the section of the DNC platform (pdf) relating to TPP:
posted by mhum at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
On the Trans Pacific Partnership (TPP), there are a diversity of views in the party. Many Democrats are on record stating that the agreement does not meet the standards set out in this platform; other Democrats have expressed support for the agreement. But all Democrats believe that any trade agreement must protect workers and the environment and not undermine access to critically-needed prescription drugs.So, not exactly "No TPP" but also not "Yay TPP". It seems to me like a pretty normal, balanced position for a platform document trying to unite differing factions.
posted by mhum at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Why is MSNBC interviewing these BoBs? They seem so unreasonable.
posted by numaner at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by numaner at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Judging by his Twitter feed, Trump must really think Sanders supporters are stupid and willing to let themselves be transparently manipulated.
It's nice that he's so incapable of being subtle. He could try to be all sly and ratfucky about it but naaaaah let's just assume these people are stupid.
The harder Bernie folks work to defeat Trump, the more their policies will be favored. Its a huge indicator of faction strength.
Plus the bigger the Dem majorities the more enlarged the left wing will be. All these folks need to be running in elections at every level.
posted by Ironmouth at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
It's nice that he's so incapable of being subtle. He could try to be all sly and ratfucky about it but naaaaah let's just assume these people are stupid.
The harder Bernie folks work to defeat Trump, the more their policies will be favored. Its a huge indicator of faction strength.
Plus the bigger the Dem majorities the more enlarged the left wing will be. All these folks need to be running in elections at every level.
posted by Ironmouth at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
The "in its current form" caveat means that they're planning on making some cosmetic changes and declaring it all better. No doubt the IP bits will survive the revisions, if only because Disney has much better lobbyists than Doctors Without Borders.
posted by fifthrider at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by fifthrider at 8:34 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
remember to go back and favorite all the comment s I made
I ran out already. I'll have to go back tomorrow. Blame Quonsar, they took most of them from me today. Guess you betta up yer comment game!
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I ran out already. I'll have to go back tomorrow. Blame Quonsar, they took most of them from me today. Guess you betta up yer comment game!
posted by Annika Cicada at 8:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Next to Bill Clinton -- is that Cecille Richards of Planned Parenthood?
Yes
posted by madamjujujive at 8:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Yes
posted by madamjujujive at 8:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Are we really sure that Bernie actually gave that speech? Maybe DWS kidnapped him and used one of those Mission Impossible masks to falsely endorse Clinton.
posted by vuron at 8:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by vuron at 8:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
If Hillary does not win after tonight...
It's easy to lose track with all this internecine drama, but at the end of the day Clinton is still running against one of the least popular figures in American political history.
She'll win, and she'll win in a landslide. A ham sandwich could beat Donald Trump.
(Says the guy who was certain Trump would never get this far, yeah. I can't be that wrong twice, dammit.)
posted by rokusan at 8:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
It's easy to lose track with all this internecine drama, but at the end of the day Clinton is still running against one of the least popular figures in American political history.
She'll win, and she'll win in a landslide. A ham sandwich could beat Donald Trump.
(Says the guy who was certain Trump would never get this far, yeah. I can't be that wrong twice, dammit.)
posted by rokusan at 8:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Yeah, that young Bernie delegate just seemed like someone who was really uncomfortable with changing a stance. Like it's an identity thing.
Now they're trying to find out what exactly it is they don't like about Hillary -- "I don't trust her."
yeah, that second one was just rambling. "I don't trust her, she needs to work on our relationship"
posted by zutalors! at 8:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Now they're trying to find out what exactly it is they don't like about Hillary -- "I don't trust her."
yeah, that second one was just rambling. "I don't trust her, she needs to work on our relationship"
posted by zutalors! at 8:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I was 17 and a senior in high school for Bush/Gore, and I remember being devastated at not only the outcome of the election, but that I felt I couldn't even make my voice heard as I was on the cusp of entering adulthood and starting university and working a "real" job and paying taxes. I've been left leaning since '88 and watched every single Dem convention since. Had a t shirt with Socks playing the saxophone that I wore for the '96 Election Day, and always accompanied my parents to the polls as they explained it was part of being a good citizen. My mom working for the Kennedy campaign in '60 (in small-town western NC, no less) at the age of 14 probably helped shape my political views. I worked for DFA and campaigned for Kerry and Obama. I'd have loved to run for office but the number of skeletons in my closet makes it hard to close sometimes.
I was a Bernie supporter, but when I realized that Hillary was going to take the nom and hopefully extinguish the Trumpster Fire, I got on board. As a public servant, I don't have a lot of money to give, but I try to talk up our candidates and get younger people that I work with more politically engaged.
I'm a straight cis white woman and a liberal (but unaffiliated because I'm honestly a democratic socialist) and I have friends who are both like me and different from me, but we're all facing some similar economic and social challenges, and we have to do what we can to support a healthy America for our futures and those of the people coming after us. This election isn't about us; this is about our kids and our nieces and nephews and our friends' kids and their future children. We have to make the future better. I'm proud of Bernie and I'm proud of Liz and Cory and I'm honestly kind of pumped about Kaine. Everyone did great tonight and I'm looking forward to tomorrow night. Also, total girlcrush on Michelle STILL because she's such an amazing woman.
posted by sara is disenchanted at 8:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
I was a Bernie supporter, but when I realized that Hillary was going to take the nom and hopefully extinguish the Trumpster Fire, I got on board. As a public servant, I don't have a lot of money to give, but I try to talk up our candidates and get younger people that I work with more politically engaged.
I'm a straight cis white woman and a liberal (but unaffiliated because I'm honestly a democratic socialist) and I have friends who are both like me and different from me, but we're all facing some similar economic and social challenges, and we have to do what we can to support a healthy America for our futures and those of the people coming after us. This election isn't about us; this is about our kids and our nieces and nephews and our friends' kids and their future children. We have to make the future better. I'm proud of Bernie and I'm proud of Liz and Cory and I'm honestly kind of pumped about Kaine. Everyone did great tonight and I'm looking forward to tomorrow night. Also, total girlcrush on Michelle STILL because she's such an amazing woman.
posted by sara is disenchanted at 8:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [32 favorites]
So I know nothing of the ActBlue website, except it is the fundraising tool behind both the Our Revolution website and the Un Rig The Map.
I may wait for the Our Revolution people to post something before I agree to give them money?
posted by mrzarquon at 8:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I may wait for the Our Revolution people to post something before I agree to give them money?
posted by mrzarquon at 8:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
MSNBC has their third Bernie delegate who won't change their vote.
One of them: "I'll probably vote with my heart, not my bra-- er, whatever."
posted by bluecore at 8:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
One of them: "I'll probably vote with my heart, not my bra-- er, whatever."
posted by bluecore at 8:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
The current delegate they are interviewing says that Clinton's voting record does not match her policy statements.
I respectfully submit that she doesn't know what the hell she's talking about.
posted by Justinian at 8:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
I respectfully submit that she doesn't know what the hell she's talking about.
posted by Justinian at 8:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
The second lady said she was going to vote for the democratic candidate.
This third delegate is by far the most insufferable.
posted by skewed at 8:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This third delegate is by far the most insufferable.
posted by skewed at 8:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
At least the second Bernie person MSNBC interviewed said she would ultimately vote for the democratic ticket. I just feel like some of these people are just completely ignorant of history. Like they live in some pseudo utopia where they can sit and ponder this shit like people's lives aren't at stake. Like it's a playhouse and they want a PBJ and just refuse to have Mac and Cheese for lunch. Now they've interviewed a third and she's like the first, saying she wouldn't vote for Hillary.
I get it - MSNBC is going to ask somebody what they think, and if they say "Yep, gonna vote Hillary now" the interviewer moves on to someone more controversial. But really there just should be none of these people.
posted by cashman at 8:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I get it - MSNBC is going to ask somebody what they think, and if they say "Yep, gonna vote Hillary now" the interviewer moves on to someone more controversial. But really there just should be none of these people.
posted by cashman at 8:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
the 90+% of Sanders supporters who enthusiastically support Hillary
I'd even be kind of surprised if it's not more than that by tonight, let alone the end of the convention.
posted by en forme de poire at 8:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I'd even be kind of surprised if it's not more than that by tonight, let alone the end of the convention.
posted by en forme de poire at 8:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
BoB on msnbc: "I think that unity has not been displayed in this convention today."
uhhhh
posted by bologna on wry at 8:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
uhhhh
posted by bologna on wry at 8:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Sky's starting to get light here in London. Something something dawn metaphor something.
So many great speeches tonight. Hoping for more as the week goes on-- and hoping the Busters learn from tonight and wise up.
But, you know. Having read corb's news of Trump whips actively threatening delegates who refused to fall in line behind Trump at the RNC-- I hope Hillary's cadre conduct themselves better than that. Dems can tolerate dissent. A little booing is worth it in order to have a Democratic National Convention worth the name.
posted by Pallas Athena at 8:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
So many great speeches tonight. Hoping for more as the week goes on-- and hoping the Busters learn from tonight and wise up.
But, you know. Having read corb's news of Trump whips actively threatening delegates who refused to fall in line behind Trump at the RNC-- I hope Hillary's cadre conduct themselves better than that. Dems can tolerate dissent. A little booing is worth it in order to have a Democratic National Convention worth the name.
posted by Pallas Athena at 8:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
I think Clinton lent Sanders her social media people tonight.
posted by zombieflanders at 8:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 8:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
Why is MSNBC interviewing these BoBs? They seem so unreasonable.
Choosing nutcases furthers the narrative that not getting in line is the same as being a crazy person.
It's a lonstanding mass-media narrative that extends a lot further than Democratic politics, or politics in general. It's a placating technique.
posted by rokusan at 8:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Choosing nutcases furthers the narrative that not getting in line is the same as being a crazy person.
It's a lonstanding mass-media narrative that extends a lot further than Democratic politics, or politics in general. It's a placating technique.
posted by rokusan at 8:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
All three of those Bernie delegates seemed primarily educated by memes.
posted by schadenfrau at 8:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 8:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [19 favorites]
BoB on msnbc: "I think that unity has not been displayed in this convention today."
Right, she said that she was offended that Sanders wasn't represented at the convention tonight. And that making him go last was a major snub. WHAT?
Going last is the big honor!
Some (wo)men you just can't reach.
posted by Justinian at 8:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Right, she said that she was offended that Sanders wasn't represented at the convention tonight. And that making him go last was a major snub. WHAT?
Going last is the big honor!
Some (wo)men you just can't reach.
posted by Justinian at 8:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Seriously, they have to be screening to find the most ludicrous delegates. The last one complained that Sanders was forced to go last. I mean, for the love of God, how did you end up as a delegate?
posted by skewed at 8:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
posted by skewed at 8:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [36 favorites]
Why is MSNBC interviewing these BoBs? They seem so unreasonable.
I feel like they're basically making fun of them. Which isn't cool, but they're also not representing themselves well.
posted by zutalors! at 8:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Why are yall watching TV still, instead of just letting Michelle Obama's speech repeat over and over again in your brain like a normal person?
posted by penduluum at 8:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [49 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 8:41 PM on July 25, 2016 [49 favorites]
Give these supporters time. They all need to learn lots more about HRC and they are in the right place for that to start to happen.
posted by bearwife at 8:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by bearwife at 8:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Well, I'm glad the moment of unity has passed and we can all get back to taking about irrelevant Bernie supporters who won't give up. Thanks, MSNBC.
posted by teponaztli at 8:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by teponaztli at 8:42 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
I've not been near tears this many times in one day than when i decided to do a Pixar marathon.
posted by mrzarquon at 8:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 8:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Young Turks Network: we report, you decide.
posted by fitnr at 8:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by fitnr at 8:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
As a note to how well this convention is being run:
Anderson Copper on CNN mentioned that the Bernie signs people were waving were actually handed out by the DNC staff. So some of us were right that the contention was planned and part of the unity narrative.
posted by numaner at 8:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Anderson Copper on CNN mentioned that the Bernie signs people were waving were actually handed out by the DNC staff. So some of us were right that the contention was planned and part of the unity narrative.
posted by numaner at 8:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Why are yall watching TV still, instead of just letting Michelle Obama's speech repeat over and over again in your brain like a normal person?
Because I'm watching the 11 year old girl from Las Vegas tell us Hillary is going to do the worrying for her over and over again.
posted by zachlipton at 8:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Because I'm watching the 11 year old girl from Las Vegas tell us Hillary is going to do the worrying for her over and over again.
posted by zachlipton at 8:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Bernie spent the campaign selling overly simplistic answers to complex issues and a general cynicism about getting anything positive done in the current system. (Contrast that with President Obama, who tempers criticism with appeals to not give in to cynicism.) So I totally get the BoBers. I hope they come around.
posted by persona au gratin at 8:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 8:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
vuron: "Are we really sure that Bernie actually gave that speech? Maybe DWS kidnapped him and used one of those Mission Impossible masks to falsely endorse Clinton."
The Onion: Voice Coming From DNC Sound System During Sanders Address Clearly Hillary Clinton’s
Other DNC headlines:
Supporters Aggravated Bernie Sanders Didn’t Use DNC Speech To Get Voters To Act Against Their Own Self-Interest
‘Fear Not—She Means You No Harm,’ Says Elizabeth Warren, Revealing Docile Hillary Clinton To Crowd
Michelle Obama: ‘Well, There Are 8 Years Of My Life I’ll Never Get Back’
CNN Producer On Hunt For Saddest-Looking Fuck With Convention Button Collection
posted by Rhaomi at 8:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
The Onion: Voice Coming From DNC Sound System During Sanders Address Clearly Hillary Clinton’s
Other DNC headlines:
Supporters Aggravated Bernie Sanders Didn’t Use DNC Speech To Get Voters To Act Against Their Own Self-Interest
‘Fear Not—She Means You No Harm,’ Says Elizabeth Warren, Revealing Docile Hillary Clinton To Crowd
Michelle Obama: ‘Well, There Are 8 Years Of My Life I’ll Never Get Back’
CNN Producer On Hunt For Saddest-Looking Fuck With Convention Button Collection
posted by Rhaomi at 8:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Why are yall watching TV still, instead of just letting Michelle Obama's speech repeat over and over again in your brain like a normal person?
Why in your brain? It's already on youtube, folks!
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 8:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Why in your brain? It's already on youtube, folks!
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 8:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Choosing nutcases furthers the narrative that not getting in line is the same as being a crazy person.
It's a lonstanding mass-media narrative that extends a lot further than Democratic politics, or politics in general. It's a placating technique.
I appreciate your contributions to this thread but this is dead wrong. They are delighting in conflict and spectacle. Nobody feels placated by this the media as Bernie just pointed out, is stirring up the bullshit for views.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
It's a lonstanding mass-media narrative that extends a lot further than Democratic politics, or politics in general. It's a placating technique.
I appreciate your contributions to this thread but this is dead wrong. They are delighting in conflict and spectacle. Nobody feels placated by this the media as Bernie just pointed out, is stirring up the bullshit for views.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
I think that the Sanders delegates are almost by definition the diehard supporters and not a cross section of the people who voted for him. The true followers.
I agree with all who heard the MSNBC Bernie people being interviewed. Charitably, I would say naive : "She's like the poster child for corporate greed" "We had to sit through the Clinton love fest, they made Bernie go last" "Our voices are not being heard" They trust Bernie on everything but they don't believe him on her.
"Lost" is a good word for it. How could they hear all those people tonight and not have perhaps a little change of heart? Do they think all these dozens are lying about her?
posted by madamjujujive at 8:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I agree with all who heard the MSNBC Bernie people being interviewed. Charitably, I would say naive : "She's like the poster child for corporate greed" "We had to sit through the Clinton love fest, they made Bernie go last" "Our voices are not being heard" They trust Bernie on everything but they don't believe him on her.
"Lost" is a good word for it. How could they hear all those people tonight and not have perhaps a little change of heart? Do they think all these dozens are lying about her?
posted by madamjujujive at 8:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I'm female, over 50, and voted for Bernie, and I will work to get Hillary elected, and I am in absolute love with the kids so vested in a political campaign that they have feels when our candidate has to concede. Bernie did us proud.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 8:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 8:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [31 favorites]
I'm surprised that nobody's pointed out that if the abyss opens and Trump is elected, he's still going to be tweeting dumb shit all day against anyone who calls him a short-fingered vulgarian instead of doing actual president stuff.
posted by holgate at 8:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by holgate at 8:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
The story that has brought me to this stage tonight. The story of generations of people who felt the lash of bondage, the shame of servitude, the sting of segregation, but who kept on striving and hoping and doing what needed to be done so that today, I wake up every morning in a house that was built by slaves. And I watch my daughters, two beautiful, intelligent, black young women, playing with their dogs on the White House lawn. And because of Hillary Clinton, my daughters and all our sons and daughters now take for granted that a woman can be president of the United States.
posted by you're a kitty! at 8:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [49 favorites]
posted by you're a kitty! at 8:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [49 favorites]
To be fair Corb did get a nice platform on MSNBC to talk about NeverTrump during the RNC... wait that never happened? Oh you sneaky devils at MSNBC trying to pretend you are being objective.
posted by vuron at 8:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by vuron at 8:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [14 favorites]
The only political victories are partial victories. The only real victory is that history only goes in one direction.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
To be fair Corb did get a nice platform on MSNBC to talk about NeverTrump during the RNC... wait that never happened? Oh you sneaky devils at MSNBC trying to pretend you are being objective.
To be fair it probably wouldn't be safe for Corb or any other NeverTrumper to go on national tv.
posted by nathan_teske at 8:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
To be fair it probably wouldn't be safe for Corb or any other NeverTrumper to go on national tv.
posted by nathan_teske at 8:49 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
BTW, I loved the Mario Cuomo clip - it would be great to bring in other past Democratic champions ' words via clips- Anne Richards, Barbara Jordan. Bobby Kennedy - to show the history that these are values and themes that Democrats have stood for over time.
posted by madamjujujive at 8:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by madamjujujive at 8:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Holgate, he might spend his presidency dicking around on Twitter, but his cronies will be systematically eating the nation alive in his absence (and at his bequest, too)
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Hermione Granger at 8:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
It isn't. Clinton surrogates kept it out, even though Clinton has flipped over to publicly opposing it. Kaine is for the thing.
Smart politicking there-- the Clinton campaign gets its kumbaya moment, the plutocrats get their TPP, "everybody" wins.
posted by threeants at 8:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Smart politicking there-- the Clinton campaign gets its kumbaya moment, the plutocrats get their TPP, "everybody" wins.
posted by threeants at 8:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Supporters Aggravated Bernie Sanders Didn’t Use DNC Speech To Get Voters To Act Against Their Own Self-Interest
posted by bologna on wry at 8:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
"I just don’t understand why he didn’t go up there, be honest about everything that’s wrong with this election, and tell us all to take an action that would inflict deep and lasting harm on ourselves by reversing the policies and values we’ve been pushing so hard to expand,” said Kyle Jorgenson, echoing the sentiment of numerous angry supporters who hoped, especially after the recent leak of emails revealing the Democratic National Committee’s bias against Sanders, that the candidate would urge them to approach this year’s election in a way that would result in the immediate erosion of so much of what they believe in and hold dear.God bless the Onion
posted by bologna on wry at 8:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
Jesus, if they play some Ann Richards I will collapse into a shattered puddle of What Could Have Been.
posted by Lyn Never at 8:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Lyn Never at 8:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
So was it mostly the California berners or what?
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:53 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:53 PM on July 25, 2016
Man Sarah Silverman is being so ... off on CNN right now. Although it's probably the same kind of sardonic aloofness that I would adopt on TV because those fuckers take themselves too seriously.
posted by dis_integration at 8:53 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by dis_integration at 8:53 PM on July 25, 2016
In a stunning display of consistency and staying the course, Kaine has come out tonight against TPP. Not kidding.
posted by Justinian at 8:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 8:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Our fucking MONDAY clobbered your THURSDAY you fascist chimps.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 8:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [49 favorites]
posted by Senor Cardgage at 8:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [49 favorites]
I...Im sorry. I don't know what came over me.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 8:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by Senor Cardgage at 8:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Welp, there goes my favorites limit for the day. Guess I just squeaked through. No more convention news for me tomorrow, I got things to do. But I am feeling so much better after the first day of the DNC. The RNC was rough, and I didn't even watch any of it.
posted by biogeo at 8:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 8:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Just a friendly to Mefite, listening to NPR tomorrow morning as Mara Liasson no doubt interviews Republican strategists about how bad the DNC is going might want to have a fallback plan.
I strongly suggest making a mix tape with speeches from tonight interspersed with songs from Hamilton.
posted by vuron at 8:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
I strongly suggest making a mix tape with speeches from tonight interspersed with songs from Hamilton.
posted by vuron at 8:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
> Kaine has come out tonight against TPP
Must've been that accordion-folded sign that swayed him.
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Must've been that accordion-folded sign that swayed him.
posted by The corpse in the library at 8:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Who is sitting next to Bill?
There were at least a half-dozen different people sitting next to Bill, new people kept rotating in.
posted by mgar at 8:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
There were at least a half-dozen different people sitting next to Bill, new people kept rotating in.
posted by mgar at 8:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah Booker was next to him during Warren's speech
posted by numaner at 8:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by numaner at 8:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Can I go back to the fact that Cory Booker makes me proud to be born in NJ?
posted by cmfletcher at 8:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by cmfletcher at 8:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
I mean, Brian Williams was saying that the BoBers probably thought TPP was something Charmin invented.
Also, they should fire Brian Williams.
posted by zutalors! at 8:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Also, they should fire Brian Williams.
posted by zutalors! at 8:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Fifty dollars a semester wouldn't pay for a third of a single one of my textbooks. Dang.
Not sure why she referred to the University of Houston as a "community college" since it wasn't one when she went there. Exaggerating for effect or throwing a little shade at her alma mater? Good speech overall though.
Borowitz is on it again: Democrats Schedule Three Straight Hours of Booing to Get It Out of System
posted by fuse theorem at 8:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Not sure why she referred to the University of Houston as a "community college" since it wasn't one when she went there. Exaggerating for effect or throwing a little shade at her alma mater? Good speech overall though.
Borowitz is on it again: Democrats Schedule Three Straight Hours of Booing to Get It Out of System
posted by fuse theorem at 8:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Most people can only handle short periods of time sitting next to Bill.
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
@fuse theorem - pretty sure that she called it a commuter college, not a community college
posted by birdheist at 9:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by birdheist at 9:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
I was 17 and a senior in high school for Bush/Gore, and I remember being devastated ...
1984 was the first presidential election I could vote in and the first convention I watched. I remember watching it and being so disappointed when Mondale was nominated over Hart. And, you know, I watched part of that convention on C-Span just a couple of weeks ago and I was startled again by just how bad a speaker Mondale was (Tho I met Lucy Mondale that year and she was awesome, RIP.)
(I am also sorry that I sound like your dad or your boring uncle.)
posted by octobersurprise at 9:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
1984 was the first presidential election I could vote in and the first convention I watched. I remember watching it and being so disappointed when Mondale was nominated over Hart. And, you know, I watched part of that convention on C-Span just a couple of weeks ago and I was startled again by just how bad a speaker Mondale was (Tho I met Lucy Mondale that year and she was awesome, RIP.)
(I am also sorry that I sound like your dad or your boring uncle.)
posted by octobersurprise at 9:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
For those of you that haven't been present in the previous threads my campaign promise as future Mefi President for Life includes unlimited favorites. Don't let Cortex fool you, he's sitting on a vault of unused favorites and he's anticipating being able to sell them at a profit as the USian elections continue.
Beware when they roll out a special plan with double favorites for the low low price of $25 extra a month.
He does not have your back, he seeks only to profit on the hardworking posters of Metafilter as we mine in the fields of the blue for meager supplies of favorites.
posted by vuron at 9:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
Beware when they roll out a special plan with double favorites for the low low price of $25 extra a month.
He does not have your back, he seeks only to profit on the hardworking posters of Metafilter as we mine in the fields of the blue for meager supplies of favorites.
posted by vuron at 9:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
I like Brian Williams in spite of his Brian Williamsness
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
fuse theorem: Not sure why she referred to the University of Houston as a "community college" since it wasn't one when she went there. Exaggerating for effect or throwing a little shade at her alma mater? Good speech overall though.
I heard it as "commuter college," which seems to fit pretty well based on my experience with the campus.
posted by Superplin at 9:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I heard it as "commuter college," which seems to fit pretty well based on my experience with the campus.
posted by Superplin at 9:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
I was afraid I was going to have to pull off my Bernie bumper sticker in shame for all the shenanigans tonight but that speech was perfect. Now to send off that $27 for a Hillary sticker to go beside it.
Bernie or Bust can bite me.
posted by jabo at 9:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
Bernie or Bust can bite me.
posted by jabo at 9:02 PM on July 25, 2016 [22 favorites]
cmfletcher, agreed! Us Jersey folk get a lot of jokes thrown our way, but there's so many people I'm proud to share a home state with, Booker included.
posted by defenestration at 9:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by defenestration at 9:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
VU RON VU RON VU RON VU RON
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:03 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
(And fuck it, some of the jokes are funny.)
posted by defenestration at 9:04 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by defenestration at 9:04 PM on July 25, 2016
the fuck does this even mean:
Outside #DemConvention floor Bernie Sanders supporters chant, "A vote for her is a vote for Trump" #DemsInPhillyposted by murphy slaw at 9:04 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
[a few comments deleted, let's cool it with the booing ok guys? -Taz]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Ive been solemnly pragmatic about all this so far but as of tonight I am PSYCHED
posted by Senor Cardgage at 9:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Senor Cardgage at 9:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
It means they are chanting themselves into irrelevance.
posted by defenestration at 9:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by defenestration at 9:05 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
The vuron/quidnunc kid debates are gonna be the highlight of this election season.
posted by oneswellfoop at 9:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by oneswellfoop at 9:06 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Thinking again about how unbelievably great Michelle Obama's speech was tonight. Beautiful and moving.
posted by defenestration at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by defenestration at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Outside #DemConvention floor Bernie Sanders supporters chant, "A vote for her is a vote for Trump" #DemsInPhilly
Oh okay they are beyond reason then.
posted by Tarumba at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Oh okay they are beyond reason then.
posted by Tarumba at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Outside #DemConvention floor Bernie Sanders supporters chant, "A vote for her is a vote for Trump" #DemsInPhilly
that makes no sense
posted by zutalors! at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Bernie Sanders supporters chant, "A vote for her is a vote for Trump" #DemsInPhilly
Well, if "her" refers to Jill Stein, they're being perfectly accurate.
posted by oneswellfoop at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [44 favorites]
Well, if "her" refers to Jill Stein, they're being perfectly accurate.
posted by oneswellfoop at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [44 favorites]
the fuck does this even mean:
Presumably that Clinton has too many negatives and is about the weakest candidate the Democrats could have fielded in the current political climate. Of course, it's a little late to try to fix that, so for the moment it's up to us to hold off on the circular firing squad until mid-November.
posted by fifthrider at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Presumably that Clinton has too many negatives and is about the weakest candidate the Democrats could have fielded in the current political climate. Of course, it's a little late to try to fix that, so for the moment it's up to us to hold off on the circular firing squad until mid-November.
posted by fifthrider at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I mean, Brian Williams was saying that the BoBers probably thought TPP was something Charmin invented.
Also, they should fire Brian Williams.
My dad met Brian Williams at the funeral of one of his high school friends of a group of 5 going to Loyola. But his friend got word he was appointed to go to West Point, so he became a famous general. Williams knew him too. So my dad's a nice guy people like and they end up knocking a few back with one another.
The Brian Williams told him that same story that got him into trouble a few years later.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Also, they should fire Brian Williams.
My dad met Brian Williams at the funeral of one of his high school friends of a group of 5 going to Loyola. But his friend got word he was appointed to go to West Point, so he became a famous general. Williams knew him too. So my dad's a nice guy people like and they end up knocking a few back with one another.
The Brian Williams told him that same story that got him into trouble a few years later.
posted by Ironmouth at 9:07 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Really fantastic. Wonderful speeches from Booker, Obama, Warren, Sanders and many of the less well known speakers. Heartfelt, powerful stories from everyday people. If there truly are "American values" I hope that they are exactly the ideas and messages that we heard over and over again tonight.
posted by snofoam at 9:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by snofoam at 9:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Not sure why she referred to the University of Houston as a "community college" since it wasn't one when she went there.
IIRC, she said "commuter college". As opposed to a residential college.
posted by indubitable at 9:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
IIRC, she said "commuter college". As opposed to a residential college.
posted by indubitable at 9:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
A vote for her is a vote for Trump
how but
why what
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
how but
why what
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:08 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I have a bad feeling that even with the great speeches tonight, the media takeaway for tomorrow will be on the lack of unity and infighting inside and outside the convention.
posted by FJT at 9:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by FJT at 9:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Clinton has too many negatives and is about the weakest candidate the Democrats could have fielded in the current political climate
I respectfully disagree. As did the many primary voters who landed her the nomination.
posted by defenestration at 9:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
I respectfully disagree. As did the many primary voters who landed her the nomination.
posted by defenestration at 9:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [29 favorites]
A vote for her is a vote for Trump
how but
why what
I mean, when was the last time you saw them both in the same room?
posted by dis_integration at 9:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
how but
why what
I mean, when was the last time you saw them both in the same room?
posted by dis_integration at 9:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
As did the many primary voters who landed her the nomination.
See, that's the thing about primaries; they don't always produce viable general election candidates. This is the first time in a while that both parties have screwed it up simultaneously, though.
posted by fifthrider at 9:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
See, that's the thing about primaries; they don't always produce viable general election candidates. This is the first time in a while that both parties have screwed it up simultaneously, though.
posted by fifthrider at 9:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Tomorrow's going to be really interesting. With Bernie releasing his delegates, how many will bolt Bernie and vote for Jill Stein?
posted by dw at 9:11 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by dw at 9:11 PM on July 25, 2016
I have a bad feeling that even with the great speeches tonight, the media takeaway for tomorrow will be on the lack of unity and infighting inside and outside the convention.
On Fox probably, but that was a forgone conclusion.
The other nets seem to be good about pointing out that the dead enders are a small minority.
posted by Justinian at 9:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
On Fox probably, but that was a forgone conclusion.
The other nets seem to be good about pointing out that the dead enders are a small minority.
posted by Justinian at 9:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
And, for the sake of completeness, here's a section from Clinton's website about TPP:
posted by mhum at 9:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Prevent countries like China from abusing global trade rules, and reject trade agreements, like the TPP, that don’t meet high standards. [...] She will say no to trade deals, like the Trans-Pacific Partnership, that do not meet her high standard of raising wages, creating good-paying jobs, and enhancing our national security.So, congrats NoTPP folks. Your chanting has caused Hillary to change her platform. Or it was there all along and you were being uninformed dicks for no reason. Whatevs, right?
posted by mhum at 9:11 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
the media takeaway for tomorrow will be on the lack of unity and infighting inside and outside the convention
I'm sure there will be some of that but in the end, the contrast between Bernie's speech and Cruz's has got to be too juicy to resist.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:11 PM on July 25, 2016
I'm sure there will be some of that but in the end, the contrast between Bernie's speech and Cruz's has got to be too juicy to resist.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:11 PM on July 25, 2016
Any Franken fans still reading might want to turn on MSNBC. He's hanging out with the MSNBC anchors talking about the evening and ragging on Trump.
posted by nathan_teske at 9:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by nathan_teske at 9:12 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
She will say no to trade deals, like the Trans-Pacific Partnership, that do not meet her high standard of raising wages, creating good-paying jobs, and enhancing our national security.
That pointedly doesn't say a darn thing about intellectual property or ISDS, though.
posted by fifthrider at 9:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
That pointedly doesn't say a darn thing about intellectual property or ISDS, though.
posted by fifthrider at 9:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
And Fox? They can say what the like, the more skewed the better. I wouldn't be surprised if Trump put California on that potential pickups list from last month or whatever in response to some Fox segment about angry Orange County tea partiers.
Let him choke on his own incuriousness.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Let him choke on his own incuriousness.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
This is of questionable taste, but the sync is actually really good
posted by Apocryphon at 9:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Apocryphon at 9:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Via the Guardian liveblog:
Top 5 trending questions on all of Google in the U.S.posted by dersins at 9:15 PM on July 25, 2016 [42 favorites]
1. What is Citizens United?
2. Who built the White House?
3. Did slaves build the White House?
4. How old is Bernie Sanders?
5. What is TPP?
I mean, when was the last time you saw them both in the same room?
When they both show up on the debate stage which one do you think is wearing the mask and which is the real one?
posted by numaner at 9:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
When they both show up on the debate stage which one do you think is wearing the mask and which is the real one?
posted by numaner at 9:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
> I mean, when was the last time you saw them both in the same room?
posted by dis_integration at 9:10 PM on July 25 [+] [!]
June 2000, I think.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by dis_integration at 9:10 PM on July 25 [+] [!]
June 2000, I think.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Okay, "Light of the Seven" syncs up even better, but that's of even poorer taste.
posted by Apocryphon at 9:18 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Apocryphon at 9:18 PM on July 25, 2016
Michelle Obama correct that the White House was built by slaves
posted by lisa g at 9:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by lisa g at 9:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
2. Who built the White House?
3. Did slaves build the White House?
It totally freaked me out when I realized that my first college dorm building had been built by slaves. (The school has a monument to those slaves, which, though somewhat overshadowed by the big-ass statue of a Confederate soldier nearby, is how I found out about it)
posted by showbiz_liz at 9:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
3. Did slaves build the White House?
It totally freaked me out when I realized that my first college dorm building had been built by slaves. (The school has a monument to those slaves, which, though somewhat overshadowed by the big-ass statue of a Confederate soldier nearby, is how I found out about it)
posted by showbiz_liz at 9:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
> I mean, when was the last time you saw them both in the same room?
posted by dis_integration at 9:10 PM on July 25 [+] [!]
June 2000, I think.
I'm calling it now. Trump died in 9/11 and Clinton had been disguising as him to ensure she'll win this election.
posted by numaner at 9:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by dis_integration at 9:10 PM on July 25 [+] [!]
June 2000, I think.
I'm calling it now. Trump died in 9/11 and Clinton had been disguising as him to ensure she'll win this election.
posted by numaner at 9:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Tomorrow's going to be really interesting. With Bernie releasing his delegates, how many will bolt Bernie and vote for Jill Stein?
In 2008, they got to New York State, and then-Senator Clinton proposed that they nominate Barack Obama by acclamation, with the caveat that all the delegate votes would be counted (presumably off in a room somewhere, quietly). It was a good moment for her, and I would assume that a similar good moment for Bernie is on the plan.
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 9:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
In 2008, they got to New York State, and then-Senator Clinton proposed that they nominate Barack Obama by acclamation, with the caveat that all the delegate votes would be counted (presumably off in a room somewhere, quietly). It was a good moment for her, and I would assume that a similar good moment for Bernie is on the plan.
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 9:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Michelle Obama DESTROYED it.
Incredible.
This was a speech for the ages.
posted by rp at 9:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Incredible.
This was a speech for the ages.
posted by rp at 9:19 PM on July 25, 2016 [13 favorites]
Top 5 trending questions on all of Google in the U.S.
Oh good, those are at least slightly less embarrassing than "What is the EU?" after brexit.
posted by biogeo at 9:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
Oh good, those are at least slightly less embarrassing than "What is the EU?" after brexit.
posted by biogeo at 9:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [20 favorites]
With Bernie releasing his delegates, how many will bolt Bernie and vote for Jill Stein?
Bernie's not releasing his delegates.
posted by Sophie1 at 9:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Bernie's not releasing his delegates.
posted by Sophie1 at 9:20 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
slightly less embarrassing than "What is the EU?"
yeah that was my thought too
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:21 PM on July 25, 2016
yeah that was my thought too
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:21 PM on July 25, 2016
> I mean, when was the last time you saw them both in the same room?
posted by dis_integration at 9:10 PM on July 25 [+] [!]
June 2000, I think.
I'm calling it now. Trump died in 9/11 and Clinton had been disguising as him to ensure she'll win this election.
THE SYSTEM IS RIGGED!
posted by dis_integration at 9:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dis_integration at 9:10 PM on July 25 [+] [!]
June 2000, I think.
I'm calling it now. Trump died in 9/11 and Clinton had been disguising as him to ensure she'll win this election.
THE SYSTEM IS RIGGED!
posted by dis_integration at 9:21 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Also pretty sure they wouldn't vote for Stein, that would make zero sense.
posted by Tarumba at 9:22 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Tarumba at 9:22 PM on July 25, 2016
Michelle Obama DESTROYED it.
Incredible.
This was a speech for the ages.
If I recall correctly, when Barack wanted to run, she gave him two conditions. The first was that he quit smoking, and the second was that she wouldn't have to give any speeches. It's kind of funny that the person who didn't want to give any speeches has now delivered a classic of American oratory. Seriously -- high school US history textbooks about the 2016 election are going to have a section with the heading "I wake up every morning in a house that was built by slaves" fifty years from now.
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 9:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [73 favorites]
Incredible.
This was a speech for the ages.
If I recall correctly, when Barack wanted to run, she gave him two conditions. The first was that he quit smoking, and the second was that she wouldn't have to give any speeches. It's kind of funny that the person who didn't want to give any speeches has now delivered a classic of American oratory. Seriously -- high school US history textbooks about the 2016 election are going to have a section with the heading "I wake up every morning in a house that was built by slaves" fifty years from now.
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 9:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [73 favorites]
I always look at the CNN webpage at the end of each day of this stuff because it's a good way to understand the message the non-news-obsessed masses are getting.
Tonight: "Sanders: 'I am proud to stand with her'"
Also Michelle Obama, Warren, etc. get mentions. All very positive and little mention of Trump.
Maybe there's hope.
posted by mmoncur at 9:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
Tonight: "Sanders: 'I am proud to stand with her'"
Also Michelle Obama, Warren, etc. get mentions. All very positive and little mention of Trump.
Maybe there's hope.
posted by mmoncur at 9:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [8 favorites]
It's kind of funny that the person who didn't want to give any speeches has now delivered a classic of American oratory.
Dammit, I reflexively clicked and got reminded again I'm out of favorites.
posted by biogeo at 9:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Dammit, I reflexively clicked and got reminded again I'm out of favorites.
posted by biogeo at 9:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Next to Bill Clinton -- is that Cecille Richards of Planned Parenthood?
I wish her mother was here to see this election year, and Molly Ivins too, and so so many others.
posted by sallybrown at 9:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
I wish her mother was here to see this election year, and Molly Ivins too, and so so many others.
posted by sallybrown at 9:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [15 favorites]
MSNBC: Michelle Obama gave an "emotional endorsement" to Hillary...
oh Chris Matthews, you do you.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:26 PM on July 25, 2016
oh Chris Matthews, you do you.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:26 PM on July 25, 2016
Since we're telling "my first elections:" I turned 18 right in time to vote for Bill Clinton in '92, and I did.
And ever since then I've been hearing trash and lies about Hillary Clinton. I've said this before: people have been trying to prove Hillary Clinton is a werewolf for literally my entire adult life.
They have failed. Every. Single. Time. No matter how much money or time or words were wasted. They've failed. At this point, I'm completely comfortable with her even if she really is a werewolf.
I'm starting to see people ask what's inspiring about her, and I want to say: She's survived against a massive political hate-machine for 24 years and done good work in spite of that. What have you done?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 9:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [111 favorites]
And ever since then I've been hearing trash and lies about Hillary Clinton. I've said this before: people have been trying to prove Hillary Clinton is a werewolf for literally my entire adult life.
They have failed. Every. Single. Time. No matter how much money or time or words were wasted. They've failed. At this point, I'm completely comfortable with her even if she really is a werewolf.
I'm starting to see people ask what's inspiring about her, and I want to say: She's survived against a massive political hate-machine for 24 years and done good work in spite of that. What have you done?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 9:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [111 favorites]
I think Bernie could have and should have done more -- been more direct, more explicit, more positive about Hillary, and cut down his speech by about half. But imo he has always had trouble reining in his ego.
Michelle, on the other hand...she was perfect, as always.
posted by sallybrown at 9:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Michelle, on the other hand...she was perfect, as always.
posted by sallybrown at 9:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Did slaves build the White House?
Ding ding ding. We have a new late answer to Steve King's question about what non-white people ever did. They built the goddamn White House.
posted by zachlipton at 9:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [59 favorites]
Ding ding ding. We have a new late answer to Steve King's question about what non-white people ever did. They built the goddamn White House.
posted by zachlipton at 9:28 PM on July 25, 2016 [59 favorites]
I hope that people in the thread are right and that the Bernie people will have gotten it out of their system, but I'm not particularly convinced that people who were trying to drown out a military widow talking about how she was ripped off by Trump have any sanity or dignity. I cannot believe that at one point I was actually happy that Sanders was running.
I mean, look at this damn picture. Michelle Obama is speaking. The first black FLOTUS, talking about living in a house built by slaves and watching her kids play on the lawn, and what that meant to her. And you are fucking sitting there like sullen babies? And about 95 percent white -- and I can't help but notice they have carefully performed the Republican maneuver of putting their handful of PoC members at the front for photos.
posted by tavella at 9:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
I mean, look at this damn picture. Michelle Obama is speaking. The first black FLOTUS, talking about living in a house built by slaves and watching her kids play on the lawn, and what that meant to her. And you are fucking sitting there like sullen babies? And about 95 percent white -- and I can't help but notice they have carefully performed the Republican maneuver of putting their handful of PoC members at the front for photos.
posted by tavella at 9:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [16 favorites]
They have failed. Every. Single. Time. No matter how much money or time or words were wasted. They've failed. At this point, I'm completely comfortable with her even if she really is a werewolf.
Whenever I see the Republican conspiracy theory that Huma Abedin is her lesbian lover, I'm like... honestly that kind of would make me even more jazzed about her?
posted by showbiz_liz at 9:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
Whenever I see the Republican conspiracy theory that Huma Abedin is her lesbian lover, I'm like... honestly that kind of would make me even more jazzed about her?
posted by showbiz_liz at 9:29 PM on July 25, 2016 [27 favorites]
In a way, I think it's better that we had our first black president first. Especially one with a name like Barack Hussein Obama. You do that, and the ceiling is is gone.
If Hillary had won in 2008, we might still be stuck back in "is America ready for a black president?"
I am in no way saying that womens' struggle is somewhere lower on the totem pole, just that in the wake of Obama we can go anywhere. A woman. A Latino person. A gay person. We elected someone named Barack Hussein Obama. Twice. And he was the shit! We can go anywhere from there.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 9:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
If Hillary had won in 2008, we might still be stuck back in "is America ready for a black president?"
I am in no way saying that womens' struggle is somewhere lower on the totem pole, just that in the wake of Obama we can go anywhere. A woman. A Latino person. A gay person. We elected someone named Barack Hussein Obama. Twice. And he was the shit! We can go anywhere from there.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 9:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
I mean, look at this damn picture. Michelle Obama is speaking.
This picture is indefensible. Ugh.
posted by Justinian at 9:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
This picture is indefensible. Ugh.
posted by Justinian at 9:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Michelle, on the other hand...she was perfect, as always.
She was max perfect. I just watched it again.
posted by zutalors! at 9:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Colbert as Caesar Flickerman crashing the DNC stage. at least they didn't have the podium and mic up.
posted by numaner at 9:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by numaner at 9:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Video of closing gavelgate, which is quite hilarious. "Where is it?"
posted by zachlipton at 9:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 9:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Trump: "Bernie Sanders totally sold out to Crooked Hillary Clinton. All of that work, energy and money, and nothing to show for it! Waste of time."
OK. I don't know how to say this but. This genuinely makes me feel sorry for Donald Trump.
He looks at a person who worked their heart out, built a real movement (especially of young people), earnestly and genuinely saw their message as vital to the country...
and: "Waste of time." because Sanders didn't win. He has "nothing to show for it!" because he didn't make money on it.
That guy has no center. No sense of anything beyond his own ego and status and bank account. It's pathetic in several senses.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [54 favorites]
OK. I don't know how to say this but. This genuinely makes me feel sorry for Donald Trump.
He looks at a person who worked their heart out, built a real movement (especially of young people), earnestly and genuinely saw their message as vital to the country...
and: "Waste of time." because Sanders didn't win. He has "nothing to show for it!" because he didn't make money on it.
That guy has no center. No sense of anything beyond his own ego and status and bank account. It's pathetic in several senses.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:36 PM on July 25, 2016 [54 favorites]
The only thing that ever made me feel genuinely sorry for Donald Trump is that his brother died of alcoholism. That is genuinely terrible. The rest...urgh.
posted by zutalors! at 9:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 9:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
History. We're all in it.
Here's how I learned about the Holocaust. I was less than 10 years old, so approx 1966-67ish.
The neighborhood Moms used to set up a table and play scrabble while watching over all the kids in the neighborhood. And there were lots of us running around. One day I was flitting around the Moms and I noticed something. So I walked over and said, "Mrs. S____, why do you have those numbers on your arm?"
I took her by surprise so she freaked out. Ran screaming and crying back to her apartment. Me, I'm crying too because I haven't a clue as to what I did that was so bad to provoke such a reaction. My mother gently led me back into our apartment and then proceeded to explain to young me just what the Holocaust was and that Mrs. S___ and her cousin were the only two survivors from her extended family.
Of course, I didn't truly understand the depth of the depravity then, but it was an important moment in my childhood which did a lot to shape later me. You get older, you learn more--and for something of this nature, if you are any kind of a human being, then not only one's mind, but also one's heart is in play. But back then, except for a few sanitized details, I never really knew much about Mrs. S___'s personal experience. Over the years I have often thought about her and other survivors I met that lived in my ethnically diverse neighborhood.
Not long ago I found an oral history she gave in 2010. Lord, did I cry. But this time from a more adult, more informed perspective. After almost 50 years of mystery, I heard her voice again, offering details I didn't need to know, but which struck me hard. History can be abstract but people in history are real as real can be. It's that sensuous connection among and between people that animates history.
So here, we are, in 2016, and there has been a lot of talk about resurgent fascism, etc... . And some of it is hyperbole. But it would be hard to deny that the seeds of fascism are present. Hell, I've been arguing for years now that we are already living a form of soft-fascism from an economic perspective. And it could get a lot worse. Horrifyingly worse. A a child, things were pretty hunky-dory for Mrs. S____. Until they weren't. Nobody wanted to get within spitting distance of Josef Mengele and we sure don't need any modern day equivalents. (I'm talking at you, you mental health professionals who helped intellectually sanction torture during this so-called War on Terror.)
Sanders hit it out of the park tonight. Trust the process. Understand that the most practical kind of person to be is to be an idealist. And if you are like me, perhaps still a little skeptical about what Clinton may or may not do as President, we all know that a Trump presidency would be much, much worse.
And if you are young and idealist (yeah!) then do all you can to keep that baby healthy as your future experience splashes you with a lot of bath water. Be practical as events require but be practical for the right reasons.
posted by CincyBlues at 9:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [62 favorites]
Here's how I learned about the Holocaust. I was less than 10 years old, so approx 1966-67ish.
The neighborhood Moms used to set up a table and play scrabble while watching over all the kids in the neighborhood. And there were lots of us running around. One day I was flitting around the Moms and I noticed something. So I walked over and said, "Mrs. S____, why do you have those numbers on your arm?"
I took her by surprise so she freaked out. Ran screaming and crying back to her apartment. Me, I'm crying too because I haven't a clue as to what I did that was so bad to provoke such a reaction. My mother gently led me back into our apartment and then proceeded to explain to young me just what the Holocaust was and that Mrs. S___ and her cousin were the only two survivors from her extended family.
Of course, I didn't truly understand the depth of the depravity then, but it was an important moment in my childhood which did a lot to shape later me. You get older, you learn more--and for something of this nature, if you are any kind of a human being, then not only one's mind, but also one's heart is in play. But back then, except for a few sanitized details, I never really knew much about Mrs. S___'s personal experience. Over the years I have often thought about her and other survivors I met that lived in my ethnically diverse neighborhood.
Not long ago I found an oral history she gave in 2010. Lord, did I cry. But this time from a more adult, more informed perspective. After almost 50 years of mystery, I heard her voice again, offering details I didn't need to know, but which struck me hard. History can be abstract but people in history are real as real can be. It's that sensuous connection among and between people that animates history.
So here, we are, in 2016, and there has been a lot of talk about resurgent fascism, etc... . And some of it is hyperbole. But it would be hard to deny that the seeds of fascism are present. Hell, I've been arguing for years now that we are already living a form of soft-fascism from an economic perspective. And it could get a lot worse. Horrifyingly worse. A a child, things were pretty hunky-dory for Mrs. S____. Until they weren't. Nobody wanted to get within spitting distance of Josef Mengele and we sure don't need any modern day equivalents. (I'm talking at you, you mental health professionals who helped intellectually sanction torture during this so-called War on Terror.)
Sanders hit it out of the park tonight. Trust the process. Understand that the most practical kind of person to be is to be an idealist. And if you are like me, perhaps still a little skeptical about what Clinton may or may not do as President, we all know that a Trump presidency would be much, much worse.
And if you are young and idealist (yeah!) then do all you can to keep that baby healthy as your future experience splashes you with a lot of bath water. Be practical as events require but be practical for the right reasons.
posted by CincyBlues at 9:38 PM on July 25, 2016 [62 favorites]
Dammit, I reflexively clicked and got reminded again I'm out of favorites.
maybe try moving your time zone in your Mefi location across the date line?
posted by Annika Cicada at 9:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
maybe try moving your time zone in your Mefi location across the date line?
posted by Annika Cicada at 9:39 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
maybe try moving your time zone in your Mefi location across the date line?
Now that's corruption.
LOVE YOU BERNIE, GOODNIGHT. GOODNIGHT HILLARY. GOODNIGHT MICHELLE. GOODNIGHT LIZ. GOODNIGHT PODIUM. GOODNIGHT BOOS. GOODNIGHT SIGNS. GOODNIGHT MUSIC. GOODNIGHT FEAR. GOODNIGHT HOPE. GOODNIGHT MOON. SEE YOU AGAIN SOON.
posted by an animate objects at 9:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
Now that's corruption.
LOVE YOU BERNIE, GOODNIGHT. GOODNIGHT HILLARY. GOODNIGHT MICHELLE. GOODNIGHT LIZ. GOODNIGHT PODIUM. GOODNIGHT BOOS. GOODNIGHT SIGNS. GOODNIGHT MUSIC. GOODNIGHT FEAR. GOODNIGHT HOPE. GOODNIGHT MOON. SEE YOU AGAIN SOON.
posted by an animate objects at 9:44 PM on July 25, 2016 [17 favorites]
biogeo: Top 5 trending questions on all of Google in the U.S.
Oh good, those are at least slightly less embarrassing than "What is the EU?" after brexit.
With the exception of question 4, now is the appropriate to ask all of those questions. I'm very pleased that Day 1 has prompted so many looking into issues of elections law, trade, and racism in our country's history.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
Oh good, those are at least slightly less embarrassing than "What is the EU?" after brexit.
With the exception of question 4, now is the appropriate to ask all of those questions. I'm very pleased that Day 1 has prompted so many looking into issues of elections law, trade, and racism in our country's history.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
And he was the shit!
shhhhh no one tell him what calling someone the shit actually means maybe he wont notice
posted by an animate objects at 9:46 PM on July 25, 2016
shhhhh no one tell him what calling someone the shit actually means maybe he wont notice
posted by an animate objects at 9:46 PM on July 25, 2016
My first election, God help me, was Dukakis vs Bush. All these years later and I've still not made sense of that.
My main take-away from today is that the best thing about living in Hawaii is knowing Michelle Obama will visit here again and I might bump into her one day and be rendered speechless with awe forever. Maybe she'll bring her husband too, who I understand is almost as good a speaker as she is.
Also, I mentioned earlier that the rump end of the party - the ones booing - are against the concept of listening. The fact that the ones who appeared on MSNBC (and chanted outside the convention after) pretty much missed everything everyone said including Sanders, I think, proves my point.
posted by Joey Michaels at 9:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
My main take-away from today is that the best thing about living in Hawaii is knowing Michelle Obama will visit here again and I might bump into her one day and be rendered speechless with awe forever. Maybe she'll bring her husband too, who I understand is almost as good a speaker as she is.
Also, I mentioned earlier that the rump end of the party - the ones booing - are against the concept of listening. The fact that the ones who appeared on MSNBC (and chanted outside the convention after) pretty much missed everything everyone said including Sanders, I think, proves my point.
posted by Joey Michaels at 9:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
LOVE YOU BERNIE, GOODNIGHT. GOODNIGHT HILLARY. GOODNIGHT MICHELLE. GOODNIGHT LIZ. GOODNIGHT PODIUM. GOODNIGHT BOOS. GOODNIGHT SIGNS. GOODNIGHT MUSIC. GOODNIGHT FEAR. GOODNIGHT HOPE. GOODNIGHT MOON. SEE YOU AGAIN SOON.
huh, the sequel got surprisingly political
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
huh, the sequel got surprisingly political
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I missed whatever happened with the gavel (but saw a clip of Baltimore Mayor forgetting to gavel in the convention), but zachlipton I don't know what I'm supposed to see in the video where you linked it at.
posted by numaner at 9:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by numaner at 9:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I don't know your people, but most in my circles would happily take Elizabeth Warren or even Michelle Obama over Hillary, so I don't think it's a sexist thing. I think it's just a Hillary thing.
One of the most interesting graphs I ever saw was about Hillary's popularity, and how it's gutted when she seeks power and rises once she has power. The degree to which people have latched onto Warren, who has explicitly and repeatedly said she's not running for president, has always bothered me - it's a weird over-riding of her stated desires which makes me very uncomfortable; it feels a lot like wanting Warren to serve other people before she serves herself. Likewise, while Obama supported her husband and is a skilled speaker, she has not yet sought office - holding her up as an alternative to someone who is seeking office seems like more of this weird dislike of women who seek power while liking women who have it.
I also think you can't underestimate the amount of hatred Republicans and the media in general have had for Clinton and how that shapes how everyone views her. 84% of her coverage was negative, almost twice Trumps coverage during the same period of time. Add in how the pervasive narrative is she's always about to lose, she should think about Bernie's support and step aside, no one is actually enthusiastic about her, etc... all of this seeps into peoples' heads far more effectively than the actual facts that Clinton started liberal and has tacked to the left sharply even before Sanders started to challenge her - and tacked further left in response to him before selecting a Civil Rights Lawyer as her white man second.
I started out midling on both Clinton and Sanders. I've become enthusiastically pro-Clinton. She, and the campaign she ran, and the breadth of inclusiveness she created is what I want in a president.
posted by Deoridhe at 9:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [79 favorites]
One of the most interesting graphs I ever saw was about Hillary's popularity, and how it's gutted when she seeks power and rises once she has power. The degree to which people have latched onto Warren, who has explicitly and repeatedly said she's not running for president, has always bothered me - it's a weird over-riding of her stated desires which makes me very uncomfortable; it feels a lot like wanting Warren to serve other people before she serves herself. Likewise, while Obama supported her husband and is a skilled speaker, she has not yet sought office - holding her up as an alternative to someone who is seeking office seems like more of this weird dislike of women who seek power while liking women who have it.
I also think you can't underestimate the amount of hatred Republicans and the media in general have had for Clinton and how that shapes how everyone views her. 84% of her coverage was negative, almost twice Trumps coverage during the same period of time. Add in how the pervasive narrative is she's always about to lose, she should think about Bernie's support and step aside, no one is actually enthusiastic about her, etc... all of this seeps into peoples' heads far more effectively than the actual facts that Clinton started liberal and has tacked to the left sharply even before Sanders started to challenge her - and tacked further left in response to him before selecting a Civil Rights Lawyer as her white man second.
I started out midling on both Clinton and Sanders. I've become enthusiastically pro-Clinton. She, and the campaign she ran, and the breadth of inclusiveness she created is what I want in a president.
posted by Deoridhe at 9:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [79 favorites]
I'm flipping between CNN, PBS, and MSNBC. All of the commentators are so much more light-hearted than they were last week. There is no doom and gloom and fear.
posted by yesster at 9:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by yesster at 9:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Let me just say that I am very glad all you lovely MeFites are here helping each other get through this. Not sure what I'd be doing without a sane place to vent. Likely wandering the streets yelling at passersby.
posted by Gaz Errant at 9:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Gaz Errant at 9:48 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Not sure what I'd be doing without a sane place to vent. Likely wandering the streets yelling at passersby.
it's okay you can do both still
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
it's okay you can do both still
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
I missed whatever happened with the gavel (but saw a clip of Baltimore Mayor forgetting to gavel in the convention), but zachlipton I don't know what I'm supposed to see in the video where you linked it at.
With the link for me (at 3:57:56), Fudge says "We are in recess," walks off, is reminded by Stephanie Rawlings-Blake about the gavel (3:58:05) (with a very cute gavel gesture, and Rawlings-Blake should know all about forgetting to gavel after this afternoon), walks back while making a little "have to remember to gavel" gesture, has the spotlight put back on her, looks around for the gavel, says "where is it," finds the gavel, and gavels.
If anybody is hiring gavel-related play-by-play commentators, I am available.
posted by zachlipton at 9:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
With the link for me (at 3:57:56), Fudge says "We are in recess," walks off, is reminded by Stephanie Rawlings-Blake about the gavel (3:58:05) (with a very cute gavel gesture, and Rawlings-Blake should know all about forgetting to gavel after this afternoon), walks back while making a little "have to remember to gavel" gesture, has the spotlight put back on her, looks around for the gavel, says "where is it," finds the gavel, and gavels.
If anybody is hiring gavel-related play-by-play commentators, I am available.
posted by zachlipton at 9:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [28 favorites]
it's okay you can do both still
god knows I sure do
posted by an animate objects at 9:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
god knows I sure do
posted by an animate objects at 9:52 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
as I said in the last thread, the movement precedes and supersedes Sanders
i will always yell at passersby
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
i will always yell at passersby
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:58 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
That pointedly doesn't say a darn thing about intellectual property or ISDS, though.
Yes, that's true but this is part of the labor rights section of her website. And if the NoTPPers felt the need to chant over speakers due to their deeply heartfelt positions on intellectual property and international trade dispute settlement procedures, then so be it. I guess you gotta do what you gotta do.
I mean, of all the things they could have chanted (eg "No more drones"), NoTPP just seems like the one of the dumbest considering where the DNC platform and the candidate herself landed.
posted by mhum at 9:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Yes, that's true but this is part of the labor rights section of her website. And if the NoTPPers felt the need to chant over speakers due to their deeply heartfelt positions on intellectual property and international trade dispute settlement procedures, then so be it. I guess you gotta do what you gotta do.
I mean, of all the things they could have chanted (eg "No more drones"), NoTPP just seems like the one of the dumbest considering where the DNC platform and the candidate herself landed.
posted by mhum at 9:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
If anybody is hiring gavel-related play-by-play commentators, I am available.
Thanks! I just realized that if I opened the link in a browser it goes right to where you said, but if i open with the YouTube app it's a totally different spot.
posted by numaner at 9:59 PM on July 25, 2016
Thanks! I just realized that if I opened the link in a browser it goes right to where you said, but if i open with the YouTube app it's a totally different spot.
posted by numaner at 9:59 PM on July 25, 2016
Bernie Sanders whispering "hush"
ok love him but that is creepy AF
going to bed before that image seeps into my unconscious
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
ok love him but that is creepy AF
going to bed before that image seeps into my unconscious
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:00 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
With the exception of question 4, now is the appropriate to ask all of those questions.
Oh, I actually basically agree. (Though the "did slaves build the White House" thing is something we covered in grade school. But I know why people need to ask it: my embarrassment at seeing these questions on the list is how it reflects the whitewashing of American history that most Americans get in their schooling. But them being in the top 5 searches means that people actually paid attention and were engaged in what Michelle Obama was saying, so that's cause for hope.) But regarding the TPP and Citizens United, I'm glad people are trying to learn about it before the election.
posted by biogeo at 10:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Oh, I actually basically agree. (Though the "did slaves build the White House" thing is something we covered in grade school. But I know why people need to ask it: my embarrassment at seeing these questions on the list is how it reflects the whitewashing of American history that most Americans get in their schooling. But them being in the top 5 searches means that people actually paid attention and were engaged in what Michelle Obama was saying, so that's cause for hope.) But regarding the TPP and Citizens United, I'm glad people are trying to learn about it before the election.
posted by biogeo at 10:01 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
You guys realize day 1 was also day 1 of market testing the Anti-Trump ads?
Like all those clips we saw, the good ones field tested and played in swing states (sorry swing states).
So far is like to point out all the Super PAC ads for Trump I've seen don't feature his voice or image, and just reference "Make America Great Again"
posted by mrzarquon at 10:01 PM on July 25, 2016
Like all those clips we saw, the good ones field tested and played in swing states (sorry swing states).
So far is like to point out all the Super PAC ads for Trump I've seen don't feature his voice or image, and just reference "Make America Great Again"
posted by mrzarquon at 10:01 PM on July 25, 2016
I 've a WaPo subscription on my kindle, which gets pushed content updates. The current cover is DEMOCRATS IN TURMOIL BEFORE THE CONVENTION, with unflattering pics of both HRC and Bernie.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 10:05 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 10:05 PM on July 25, 2016
Why are yall watching TV still, instead of just letting Michelle Obama's speech repeat over and over again in your brain like a normal person?
I recorded it and watched it twice.
Jesus, if they play some Ann Richards I will collapse into a shattered puddle of What Could Have Been.
You need to watch some more C-SPAN. I think she was on last night.
posted by bongo_x at 10:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I recorded it and watched it twice.
Jesus, if they play some Ann Richards I will collapse into a shattered puddle of What Could Have Been.
You need to watch some more C-SPAN. I think she was on last night.
posted by bongo_x at 10:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I mean, of all the things they could have chanted (eg "No more drones"), NoTPP just seems like the one of the dumbest considering where the DNC platform and the candidate herself landed.
Well, Bernie supports drones
posted by zutalors! at 10:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Well, Bernie supports drones
posted by zutalors! at 10:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
For what it's worth, CBC had headlines about the DNC being off to a rocky start all day. Now the headlines are about the great speeches from Michelle Obama and Bernie Sanders.
posted by peppermind at 10:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by peppermind at 10:10 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
NY Times, as well. That Obama-Warren-Sanders finishing act really saved the day.
posted by rokusan at 10:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 10:13 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Well, Bernie supports drones
All the more reason. You're supposed to angrily chant for things you want but don't have, not things you have but didn't get in exactly the way you wanted.
I guess we'll see tomorrow if these folks got what they needed today or if they're going to double down and go even bigger.
posted by mhum at 10:22 PM on July 25, 2016
All the more reason. You're supposed to angrily chant for things you want but don't have, not things you have but didn't get in exactly the way you wanted.
I guess we'll see tomorrow if these folks got what they needed today or if they're going to double down and go even bigger.
posted by mhum at 10:22 PM on July 25, 2016
Watching Bernie's speech with his most vocal delegates: While we were talking, his fellow Sanders delegates around him began to boo, and Enriquez, barely a vocal cord left, got up to boo with them. I asked him what Elizabeth Warren had said. He thought about it, but looked lost. “It’s been a long night.”
posted by acidic at 10:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by acidic at 10:23 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
In retrospect, I think the booing was handled well. I think it will continue for the rest of the convention, including during Clinton's speech, but I think it will be handled cannily.
It will be annoying—and disrespectful—but I'm starting to think it won't be a big problem. I hope I'm not wrong.
posted by defenestration at 10:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
It will be annoying—and disrespectful—but I'm starting to think it won't be a big problem. I hope I'm not wrong.
posted by defenestration at 10:33 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
Headlines:
Democrats’ opening day of discord ends on a high note Washington Post
A Rocky Start, but Democrats Find a Common Target: Trump NYT
Convention opens to boos but Democrats salvage the night LA Times
Planned or not, the striking thing about this convention is that while conflict between wings of the party was on full display, in watching it unfold one sees the gradual synthesis of a *stronger* party.
That party is one which has successfully absorbed an insurgency. There is a fundamental competence required to do this that the Republicans have shown they lack. As salty as people have been here about the boos and the chants, would the party really have been better off with a polite anodyne convention and a platform that featured the Fight for 12.50 and lukewarm praise for the TPP? You couldn't play Mario Cuomo's Two Cities speech with a straight face at that convention.
Instead, the whole party was not just on display this afternoon, but on fire. The day progressed from the nadir of Elijah Cummings nearly choking with emotion as people chanted over his speech, through thunderous defiance by labor, acute plucking of the heartstrings, and finally apexed with the one two three four lineup of Cory, Michelle, Elizabeth and Bernie.
The party which Stands With Her is so much more vital and full of so many more genuinely passionate people than the hollow RNC that we saw last week. The ability to assemble such a varied and engaged base is something that Bernie was not able to accomplish, and is unthinkable for Trump. The best he collaboration he could manage was a WWE stunt with Cruz as a heel.
Symbolically, I would say that this convention is coming off as a masterwork. This morning, Hillary's narrative was mired in the inevitable ruminations of scandal and likeability, tonight she is the one that United the most forward looking party in American history.
posted by ethansr at 10:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [73 favorites]
Democrats’ opening day of discord ends on a high note Washington Post
A Rocky Start, but Democrats Find a Common Target: Trump NYT
Convention opens to boos but Democrats salvage the night LA Times
Planned or not, the striking thing about this convention is that while conflict between wings of the party was on full display, in watching it unfold one sees the gradual synthesis of a *stronger* party.
That party is one which has successfully absorbed an insurgency. There is a fundamental competence required to do this that the Republicans have shown they lack. As salty as people have been here about the boos and the chants, would the party really have been better off with a polite anodyne convention and a platform that featured the Fight for 12.50 and lukewarm praise for the TPP? You couldn't play Mario Cuomo's Two Cities speech with a straight face at that convention.
Instead, the whole party was not just on display this afternoon, but on fire. The day progressed from the nadir of Elijah Cummings nearly choking with emotion as people chanted over his speech, through thunderous defiance by labor, acute plucking of the heartstrings, and finally apexed with the one two three four lineup of Cory, Michelle, Elizabeth and Bernie.
The party which Stands With Her is so much more vital and full of so many more genuinely passionate people than the hollow RNC that we saw last week. The ability to assemble such a varied and engaged base is something that Bernie was not able to accomplish, and is unthinkable for Trump. The best he collaboration he could manage was a WWE stunt with Cruz as a heel.
Symbolically, I would say that this convention is coming off as a masterwork. This morning, Hillary's narrative was mired in the inevitable ruminations of scandal and likeability, tonight she is the one that United the most forward looking party in American history.
posted by ethansr at 10:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [73 favorites]
Holy crap, I hit my favorite limit. I laughed when people said that before.
posted by bongo_x at 10:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 10:40 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
@realDonaldTrump: "Bernie Sanders totally sold out to Crooked Hillary Clinton. All of that work, energy and money, and nothing to show for it! Waste of time."
@BernieSanders: "Never tweet."
posted by DaDaDaDave at 10:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [37 favorites]
@BernieSanders: "Never tweet."
posted by DaDaDaDave at 10:43 PM on July 25, 2016 [37 favorites]
In retrospect, I think the booing was handled well. I think it will continue for the rest of the convention, including during Clinton's speech, but I think it will be handled cannily.
It did seem like, by the end, the booing was isolated in small pockets and was often drowned out by cheers. I expect it'll continue to diminish until we clear roll call.
posted by dw at 10:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It did seem like, by the end, the booing was isolated in small pockets and was often drowned out by cheers. I expect it'll continue to diminish until we clear roll call.
posted by dw at 10:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
That moment when everything realigns and you feel the weight of the room shift.
It's forward from here.
We don't need you and we don't care, Busters. Enjoy irrelevance.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 10:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
It's forward from here.
We don't need you and we don't care, Busters. Enjoy irrelevance.
posted by Senor Cardgage at 10:47 PM on July 25, 2016 [9 favorites]
Busters. I like that. Let's leave Bernie out of it from here on out.
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:50 PM on July 25, 2016 [33 favorites]
This is the most outrage in a thread I think I've read on this site since I joined a decade ago. Some of the comments, frankly, are just as over the top and ridiculous as the most ridiculous of the Bernie Bros' rantings. (Bernie is personally responsible and will rot in jail and then hell, it seems.) I was a Bernie supporter but of course I support Hillary now, and because I live in a (sort of) swing state, my vote actually matters! So vote for Hillary, no question.
Understand something, though, fanatic supporters of Hillary: that doesn't mean I like her policies, they're just light years ahead of the dumpster fire in (somewhat) human form in Trump. I thought, and still think, that Bernie is a much, much, much better direction for this country to head in. And it's about Bernie and not about Bernie; I challenge anyone to find another politician at that level of influence with as much moral integrity in terms of staying true to his beliefs and voting his conscience. And if you think Hillary has just as much integrity, you're fooling yourself.
And ultimately this gets into a talk about the status of the middle class and poor folks and minorities all over the country--that is, folks other than, say, the top 20%. People are hurting. The middle class is indeed shrinking, and the kind of New Deal governance that Sanders espouses is the best plan going forward. Bernie or Bust people will claim we actually need Trump elected to "wake people up" and shift the pendulum back to the left, but this is asinine for a number of reasons. The point is that the status quo--of relatively unchecked capitalism, of the rich getting richer, etc.--will simply continue with Clinton. Maybe four years, maybe eight, and in that time she will likely shift the argument on a number of issues back to the left. And I don't know where my faith in that ends and my wishful thinking about that begins. With Sanders, I have little to no doubt; he might not be successful, but at least I know what he believes in. With Hillary....um, maybe? Probably? I hope?
Anyhoo, as for the jackasses at the convention. Yes, they're assholes, but come on, is it really that bad? There's division in the Democratic party, and among the left in general. Is the mainstream, centrist position of Hillary the only one allowed? I thought the Dems had a big tent and all that.
posted by zardoz at 10:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Understand something, though, fanatic supporters of Hillary: that doesn't mean I like her policies, they're just light years ahead of the dumpster fire in (somewhat) human form in Trump. I thought, and still think, that Bernie is a much, much, much better direction for this country to head in. And it's about Bernie and not about Bernie; I challenge anyone to find another politician at that level of influence with as much moral integrity in terms of staying true to his beliefs and voting his conscience. And if you think Hillary has just as much integrity, you're fooling yourself.
And ultimately this gets into a talk about the status of the middle class and poor folks and minorities all over the country--that is, folks other than, say, the top 20%. People are hurting. The middle class is indeed shrinking, and the kind of New Deal governance that Sanders espouses is the best plan going forward. Bernie or Bust people will claim we actually need Trump elected to "wake people up" and shift the pendulum back to the left, but this is asinine for a number of reasons. The point is that the status quo--of relatively unchecked capitalism, of the rich getting richer, etc.--will simply continue with Clinton. Maybe four years, maybe eight, and in that time she will likely shift the argument on a number of issues back to the left. And I don't know where my faith in that ends and my wishful thinking about that begins. With Sanders, I have little to no doubt; he might not be successful, but at least I know what he believes in. With Hillary....um, maybe? Probably? I hope?
Anyhoo, as for the jackasses at the convention. Yes, they're assholes, but come on, is it really that bad? There's division in the Democratic party, and among the left in general. Is the mainstream, centrist position of Hillary the only one allowed? I thought the Dems had a big tent and all that.
posted by zardoz at 10:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Symbolically, I would say that this convention is coming off as a masterwork. This morning, Hillary's narrative was mired in the inevitable ruminations of scandal and likeability, tonight she is the one that United the most forward looking party in American history.
This seems like a pretty optimistic narrative to draw. I mean, I think the Clinton campaign reeks of competence, and I don't think anyone else could have dealt with everything that she's had to. But while she has mostly unified the party, there was annoying chanting and scattered booing for most of the night. It detracts from the message, and it makes everything they're working for easy to ignore. I think it really hurts the effectiveness of the convention. So yeah, I think Clinton and the democratic party would be better off without all the obnoxious dissent. Had the dissent been more along the lines of what the Clinton supporters did in 2008, I'd agree that the unifying narrative would be really strong.
(In retrospect, by the way, I really have to admire how Clinton really was a gracious loser in 2008 and super competent in organizing her followers to get behind Obama, despite having been through what was actually a nastier, and far, far closer campaign. Or maybe the BoB are just more petulant and entitled than the PUMAs were.)
posted by skewed at 10:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
This seems like a pretty optimistic narrative to draw. I mean, I think the Clinton campaign reeks of competence, and I don't think anyone else could have dealt with everything that she's had to. But while she has mostly unified the party, there was annoying chanting and scattered booing for most of the night. It detracts from the message, and it makes everything they're working for easy to ignore. I think it really hurts the effectiveness of the convention. So yeah, I think Clinton and the democratic party would be better off without all the obnoxious dissent. Had the dissent been more along the lines of what the Clinton supporters did in 2008, I'd agree that the unifying narrative would be really strong.
(In retrospect, by the way, I really have to admire how Clinton really was a gracious loser in 2008 and super competent in organizing her followers to get behind Obama, despite having been through what was actually a nastier, and far, far closer campaign. Or maybe the BoB are just more petulant and entitled than the PUMAs were.)
posted by skewed at 10:53 PM on July 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
I know I'm so, so late on this, but I'm trying to catch up on the speeches AND the thread and I had to take some time earlier to go sew and listen to Beyonce so I didn't get too murderous about the booing. Anyway:
Personally I know a shit ton of young feminists who revealed some ugly, ugly shit in their opposition to Clinton / support for Bernie, and should probably look inwards and wonder why it was so gd easy for them to -- at best -- dismiss the words of older women.
Yes, THIS. I continue to see, even THIS VERY EVENING women posting seriously hateful things about Hillary, using language that I can't repeat. Like, if you find yourself attacking your female political opponents using words that start with B and C, I think you need to think about calling yourself a feminist. It's the ugliness of the increasing misogyny I've seen among vocal Bernie supporters that has turned me from a Bernie voter and enthusiastic supporter to feeling ill every time he's mentioned. Including that turned against my female friends who had to hide their support for Clinton for MONTHS rather than risk harassment and abuse online.
posted by threeturtles at 10:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
Personally I know a shit ton of young feminists who revealed some ugly, ugly shit in their opposition to Clinton / support for Bernie, and should probably look inwards and wonder why it was so gd easy for them to -- at best -- dismiss the words of older women.
Yes, THIS. I continue to see, even THIS VERY EVENING women posting seriously hateful things about Hillary, using language that I can't repeat. Like, if you find yourself attacking your female political opponents using words that start with B and C, I think you need to think about calling yourself a feminist. It's the ugliness of the increasing misogyny I've seen among vocal Bernie supporters that has turned me from a Bernie voter and enthusiastic supporter to feeling ill every time he's mentioned. Including that turned against my female friends who had to hide their support for Clinton for MONTHS rather than risk harassment and abuse online.
posted by threeturtles at 10:59 PM on July 25, 2016 [38 favorites]
It did seem like, by the end, the booing was isolated in small pockets and was often drowned out by cheers. I expect it'll continue to diminish until we clear roll call.
I really wish I thought it would diminish after the roll call, but I can't really see why it would.
posted by skewed at 11:00 PM on July 25, 2016
I really wish I thought it would diminish after the roll call, but I can't really see why it would.
posted by skewed at 11:00 PM on July 25, 2016
> Anyhoo, as for the jackasses at the convention. Yes, they're assholes, but come on, is it really that bad?
When they are chanting about a trade agreement that will be settled *before the fucking election* over the voice of a senator who:
Voted against fast tracking it
Was speaking about his father, a share cropper
And speaking about Black Lives Matter
Yeah, it was pretty bad. It was Tone Deaf. You can have division, you can have protests, but if you want to be heard, you shouldn't be shouting over those who are fighting along with you.
posted by mrzarquon at 11:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [59 favorites]
When they are chanting about a trade agreement that will be settled *before the fucking election* over the voice of a senator who:
Voted against fast tracking it
Was speaking about his father, a share cropper
And speaking about Black Lives Matter
Yeah, it was pretty bad. It was Tone Deaf. You can have division, you can have protests, but if you want to be heard, you shouldn't be shouting over those who are fighting along with you.
posted by mrzarquon at 11:09 PM on July 25, 2016 [59 favorites]
wow, the mods of /r/sandersforpresident just shut it down, based on the fact that Bernie lost and the subreddit is a shitshow.
posted by skewed at 11:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
posted by skewed at 11:14 PM on July 25, 2016 [18 favorites]
It was Tone Deaf.
It was worse than tone deaf. It was a group of mostly white people trying to erase the voice of a person of color talking about his and his family's lived experience, so that they could jerk themselves off about a fucking trade bill. Sorry but that's fucking racist, whether it was "intended" that way or not.
posted by dersins at 11:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [62 favorites]
It was worse than tone deaf. It was a group of mostly white people trying to erase the voice of a person of color talking about his and his family's lived experience, so that they could jerk themselves off about a fucking trade bill. Sorry but that's fucking racist, whether it was "intended" that way or not.
posted by dersins at 11:16 PM on July 25, 2016 [62 favorites]
This is an interesting way of gauging twitter sentiment about the candidates. Not sure how useful/accurate it is.
Kantar US Election Pulse
Track Twitter buzz by and about the presidential candidates in real time. Represents all English-language tweets globally.
posted by yertledaturtle at 11:17 PM on July 25, 2016
Kantar US Election Pulse
Track Twitter buzz by and about the presidential candidates in real time. Represents all English-language tweets globally.
posted by yertledaturtle at 11:17 PM on July 25, 2016
Busters. I like that.
But the Ghostbusters won't. Especially Holtzmann.
I've been voting for President for 40 years, and was never quite enamored with any of the people I've voted for. And the only one I ended up liking MORE after taking office was the first, James Earl Carter. I was extremely skeptical when people said that Bernie Sanders would change the paradigm (mostly from people half of my age and well less than half of Bernie's). He did push Clinton and the party farther to the left than any previous status-quo challenger. Good for him, but if he really wanted to accomplish more with the Democratic Party, he should have engaged more with it before he started running to win its biggest prize. It reminded me of a millionaire buying a block of stock in a company and immediately attempting a Hostile Takeover. As much as I may agree with his stands on most issues, to me his method stunk.
Kantar US Election Pulse
Track Twitter buzz
Of course the Trumpster Fire will dominate the "Twitter buzz". It's his kind of forum... a putrid sh!tpile.
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
But the Ghostbusters won't. Especially Holtzmann.
I've been voting for President for 40 years, and was never quite enamored with any of the people I've voted for. And the only one I ended up liking MORE after taking office was the first, James Earl Carter. I was extremely skeptical when people said that Bernie Sanders would change the paradigm (mostly from people half of my age and well less than half of Bernie's). He did push Clinton and the party farther to the left than any previous status-quo challenger. Good for him, but if he really wanted to accomplish more with the Democratic Party, he should have engaged more with it before he started running to win its biggest prize. It reminded me of a millionaire buying a block of stock in a company and immediately attempting a Hostile Takeover. As much as I may agree with his stands on most issues, to me his method stunk.
Kantar US Election Pulse
Track Twitter buzz
Of course the Trumpster Fire will dominate the "Twitter buzz". It's his kind of forum... a putrid sh!tpile.
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:24 PM on July 25, 2016 [4 favorites]
I will say this
It was very werid to hear the slogans and ideas I slapped onto protest posters in 08 on the prime time main stage of the DNC
Especially remembering how many people kept saying how pointless and useless and sabotaging all that was.
posted by The Whelk at 11:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
It was very werid to hear the slogans and ideas I slapped onto protest posters in 08 on the prime time main stage of the DNC
Especially remembering how many people kept saying how pointless and useless and sabotaging all that was.
posted by The Whelk at 11:25 PM on July 25, 2016 [25 favorites]
skewed: "wow, the mods of /r/sandersforpresident just shut it down"
Huh. But wouldn't the natural next step be for that subreddit to become the main on-line hub for Sanders supporters who are going to carry out his vision for a democratic socialist revolution by organizing and fund-raising for down-ticket races and maybe even running for local and state offices themselves? Why would they... [browses subreddit] ...oh, right.
posted by mhum at 11:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Huh. But wouldn't the natural next step be for that subreddit to become the main on-line hub for Sanders supporters who are going to carry out his vision for a democratic socialist revolution by organizing and fund-raising for down-ticket races and maybe even running for local and state offices themselves? Why would they... [browses subreddit] ...oh, right.
posted by mhum at 11:26 PM on July 25, 2016 [7 favorites]
Of course the Trumpster Fire will dominate the "Twitter buzz". It's his kind of forum... a putrid sh!tpile.
He represents a greater volume of tweets which are, last I looked at 61% negative to 24% positive and Hillary is at 49% negative to 35% positive.
posted by yertledaturtle at 11:27 PM on July 25, 2016
He represents a greater volume of tweets which are, last I looked at 61% negative to 24% positive and Hillary is at 49% negative to 35% positive.
posted by yertledaturtle at 11:27 PM on July 25, 2016
Negative/positive is one way of looking at it.
Others might be:
Juvenile/mature
Idiotic/Intelligent
word salad/coherent
posted by yesster at 11:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
Others might be:
Juvenile/mature
Idiotic/Intelligent
word salad/coherent
posted by yesster at 11:30 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
And if you think Hillary has just as much integrity, you're fooling yourself.
Seriously, sometimes it seems there are people specifically going out of their way to diminish Hillary Clinton, her character, her accomplishments, and her supporters. I really don't understand how one can call out Clinton supporters for not giving Sanders enough credit, and then turn around and pretty much do the same to Hillary Clinton, over and over again. Especially since they're not polar opposites and there are plenty of people who like them both.
Though it's understandable to see it happening since we're all people with different perspectives and experiences, it's also very frustrating and really is probably one of the reasons why people dig in and start up the same primary fights again.
posted by FJT at 11:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
Seriously, sometimes it seems there are people specifically going out of their way to diminish Hillary Clinton, her character, her accomplishments, and her supporters. I really don't understand how one can call out Clinton supporters for not giving Sanders enough credit, and then turn around and pretty much do the same to Hillary Clinton, over and over again. Especially since they're not polar opposites and there are plenty of people who like them both.
Though it's understandable to see it happening since we're all people with different perspectives and experiences, it's also very frustrating and really is probably one of the reasons why people dig in and start up the same primary fights again.
posted by FJT at 11:32 PM on July 25, 2016 [26 favorites]
mhum, they spun what you're talking about off into a separate subreddit. I have no idea if it's a shitshow or not.
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:33 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:33 PM on July 25, 2016
> And if you think Hillary has just as much integrity, you're fooling yourself.
Also nice gaslighting there.
posted by mrzarquon at 11:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Also nice gaslighting there.
posted by mrzarquon at 11:35 PM on July 25, 2016 [12 favorites]
Not a tweet from DWS. Her last tweet is pretty ironic considering what has happened since.
Is she commenting anywhere?
posted by futz at 11:42 PM on July 25, 2016
Is she commenting anywhere?
posted by futz at 11:42 PM on July 25, 2016
For the good of the DNC, I hope she's not.
posted by yesster at 11:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by yesster at 11:45 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
Uh, sanders4president looks up to me? Why do people think it was shut down?
posted by Justinian at 11:45 PM on July 25, 2016
posted by Justinian at 11:45 PM on July 25, 2016
Ohhh, they shut it down to new posts, not new comments. I do not know reddit very well so I missed that.
posted by Justinian at 11:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Justinian at 11:46 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I was really moved by the speeches tonight. We have a great country made up of great people. Let's make sure we keep it that way by electing Clinton.
posted by persona au gratin at 11:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 11:51 PM on July 25, 2016 [10 favorites]
And you want to talk integrity?
Hillary invited her most vocal critics into her campaign, worked with them to compromise on a strategy and left them feeling confident enough to deliver those speeches they did today. That is someone who listens and who adapts and who pushes for the greater good, even if it means changing her original positions to do so.
That is who I want leading. I always hoped for Sanders policies and Hillarys ability to get shit done. I didn't think that would become true.
You don't think Hillary knows she'll have to make good on those policies or move towards them? That house and senate democrats know they'll have to support them, in 2018 and 2020?
You want to hold them to their word? Show them the support they get by following through - crush trump in a landslide, make it so catering to the republicans and towing the centrist line isn't required to win the whitehouse. That progressive policies and agendas pay off.
You want to see lack of integrity? That was last week, you missed it I guess: the forced congratulations by folks trump ridiculed (which I'm sure he loved witnessing, seeing his former opponents bent to his will).
Again you think someone without integrity could get Sanders and Warren that passionate about supporting them?
posted by mrzarquon at 11:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [84 favorites]
Hillary invited her most vocal critics into her campaign, worked with them to compromise on a strategy and left them feeling confident enough to deliver those speeches they did today. That is someone who listens and who adapts and who pushes for the greater good, even if it means changing her original positions to do so.
That is who I want leading. I always hoped for Sanders policies and Hillarys ability to get shit done. I didn't think that would become true.
You don't think Hillary knows she'll have to make good on those policies or move towards them? That house and senate democrats know they'll have to support them, in 2018 and 2020?
You want to hold them to their word? Show them the support they get by following through - crush trump in a landslide, make it so catering to the republicans and towing the centrist line isn't required to win the whitehouse. That progressive policies and agendas pay off.
You want to see lack of integrity? That was last week, you missed it I guess: the forced congratulations by folks trump ridiculed (which I'm sure he loved witnessing, seeing his former opponents bent to his will).
Again you think someone without integrity could get Sanders and Warren that passionate about supporting them?
posted by mrzarquon at 11:54 PM on July 25, 2016 [84 favorites]
prize bull octorok: "mhum, they spun what you're talking about off into a separate subreddit. I have no idea if it's a shitshow or not."
I think the spin-off is /r/Political_Revolution. It's rather smaller than r/sfp (30k vs. 226k subscribers) which seems a bit of a waste if it was meant to harness the power of Sanders' on-line momentum. And shitshow or not, there doesn't really seem to be very much organizing going on (even after sorting posts by top all-time to mitigate the recency effect of DNC-related stuff). It appears to me mostly like a scaled-down version of r/sfp. So, good job everyone for keeping the dream alive.
posted by mhum at 11:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
I think the spin-off is /r/Political_Revolution. It's rather smaller than r/sfp (30k vs. 226k subscribers) which seems a bit of a waste if it was meant to harness the power of Sanders' on-line momentum. And shitshow or not, there doesn't really seem to be very much organizing going on (even after sorting posts by top all-time to mitigate the recency effect of DNC-related stuff). It appears to me mostly like a scaled-down version of r/sfp. So, good job everyone for keeping the dream alive.
posted by mhum at 11:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's very clear what Hillary believes. Which is why I know she'd support something very like TPP. And a public option. Etc.
posted by persona au gratin at 11:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 11:55 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
For the good of the DNC, I hope she's not.
She is the DNC. Getting rid of her doesn't instantly fix the culture that she has allowed to fester.
posted by futz at 11:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
She is the DNC. Getting rid of her doesn't instantly fix the culture that she has allowed to fester.
posted by futz at 11:56 PM on July 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
I think people think Hillary's domestic policy=her husband's c. 1995.
Which is absurd.
posted by persona au gratin at 11:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Which is absurd.
posted by persona au gratin at 11:57 PM on July 25, 2016 [11 favorites]
Curious observation.
The more I see people posting about how bad Hillary is, the less I see any reasons of why she is so bad.
When I have tried to find the answers, almost every link on social media or in the news is either some crank "news" outlet (meaning, more clickbait, more "heat than light", more emotional barely disguised misogynistic ranting) or simply someone stating "but she's so dishonest", or "she's a corporate stooge."
Really? That's your evidence? That's what you want to hang your own reputation on? You want to take the words of trolls and right-wing talking points, filtered through a few steps of link-baited web "hot-take" articles and decide that she is "the big bad"?
I am really starting to think the jokes from Futurama about how the internet nearly destroyed the world aren't really jokes anymore. I mean, after reading this Laurie Penny article from last week (warning, involves Milo and other internet trolls IRL, including Roosh V), I swear we are through the looking glass of the power of mass media being in the hands of idiots and sociopaths.
I would love to find any journalistic output that actually has something of substance on anything truly "bad" about Hillary Clinton. So far, everything comes up with these obtuse appeals to emotion that are just badly disguised misogyny, or worse, just plain lies repeated over and over for the past 25+ years that have no basis in reality.
It is so horribly true:
A lie can get half-way around the world before the truth gets it's shoes on.
Something was said to me at a work function last week that bears repeating. There are two modes of thinking: fast and slow. Fast is "gut reaction", instant snap decisions, often colored by emotions and very susceptible to our internal unconscious biases. Slow is more reasoned, and allows you to take a more thoughtful and meaningful look at your own processes for making the decision you make.
If you find yourself saying, "well, I just don't like her", you REALLY REALLY REALLY need to ask yourself one simple question. WHY? Really slow down and think what are you processing to come to that conclusion? Is it just a "gut feeling"? Just some strange emotional thing you can't place words to? That's fast thinking. That's a snap judgement. If you can't come up with a verifiable and intellectual reason, as uncolored by emotion as possible, you have failed at even knowing your own mind. Be very careful when people push you to only think with your "gut instinct". They are likely either selling you something, or trying to manipulate you into believing something that with a little thought, a little effort, you would outright reject given any real choice.
It is important to recognize when a thought is your own, and when it is back-chatter from the society and media we are surrounded by.
Anyway, just an observation. I really liked the Democratic Convention today. I am actually relieved. They know what they are doing. And this was just day one. Wait until next week. You are going to see something magical (I hope).
posted by daq at 12:03 AM on July 26, 2016 [56 favorites]
The more I see people posting about how bad Hillary is, the less I see any reasons of why she is so bad.
When I have tried to find the answers, almost every link on social media or in the news is either some crank "news" outlet (meaning, more clickbait, more "heat than light", more emotional barely disguised misogynistic ranting) or simply someone stating "but she's so dishonest", or "she's a corporate stooge."
Really? That's your evidence? That's what you want to hang your own reputation on? You want to take the words of trolls and right-wing talking points, filtered through a few steps of link-baited web "hot-take" articles and decide that she is "the big bad"?
I am really starting to think the jokes from Futurama about how the internet nearly destroyed the world aren't really jokes anymore. I mean, after reading this Laurie Penny article from last week (warning, involves Milo and other internet trolls IRL, including Roosh V), I swear we are through the looking glass of the power of mass media being in the hands of idiots and sociopaths.
I would love to find any journalistic output that actually has something of substance on anything truly "bad" about Hillary Clinton. So far, everything comes up with these obtuse appeals to emotion that are just badly disguised misogyny, or worse, just plain lies repeated over and over for the past 25+ years that have no basis in reality.
It is so horribly true:
A lie can get half-way around the world before the truth gets it's shoes on.
Something was said to me at a work function last week that bears repeating. There are two modes of thinking: fast and slow. Fast is "gut reaction", instant snap decisions, often colored by emotions and very susceptible to our internal unconscious biases. Slow is more reasoned, and allows you to take a more thoughtful and meaningful look at your own processes for making the decision you make.
If you find yourself saying, "well, I just don't like her", you REALLY REALLY REALLY need to ask yourself one simple question. WHY? Really slow down and think what are you processing to come to that conclusion? Is it just a "gut feeling"? Just some strange emotional thing you can't place words to? That's fast thinking. That's a snap judgement. If you can't come up with a verifiable and intellectual reason, as uncolored by emotion as possible, you have failed at even knowing your own mind. Be very careful when people push you to only think with your "gut instinct". They are likely either selling you something, or trying to manipulate you into believing something that with a little thought, a little effort, you would outright reject given any real choice.
It is important to recognize when a thought is your own, and when it is back-chatter from the society and media we are surrounded by.
Anyway, just an observation. I really liked the Democratic Convention today. I am actually relieved. They know what they are doing. And this was just day one. Wait until next week. You are going to see something magical (I hope).
posted by daq at 12:03 AM on July 26, 2016 [56 favorites]
I think people think Hillary's domestic policy=her husband's c. 1995.
What are you basing this on? I am just one person who isn't thrilled by her but Bill never really enters my mind unless he shows up at a polling station or puts his foot in his unmuzzled mouth. Looks like the campaign has him on a choke chain for the time being though.
posted by futz at 12:05 AM on July 26, 2016
What are you basing this on? I am just one person who isn't thrilled by her but Bill never really enters my mind unless he shows up at a polling station or puts his foot in his unmuzzled mouth. Looks like the campaign has him on a choke chain for the time being though.
posted by futz at 12:05 AM on July 26, 2016
Advice to Hillary Clinton from 8 women cartoonists
Nice variety, but then creative women are better at variety than creative men.
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Nice variety, but then creative women are better at variety than creative men.
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
I've heard many people hang NAFTA, the 1994 crime bill (which Bernie voted for in the House), and welfare reform on her. This fits into the corporate stooge narrative people have about her.
All the evidence I see (votes, statements over the years) has her very much like Obama domestically. And both Bernie and Clinton, would be, I suspect, more hawkish than Obama is now in terms of foreign affairs.
She's not Joe Lieberman.
posted by persona au gratin at 12:14 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
All the evidence I see (votes, statements over the years) has her very much like Obama domestically. And both Bernie and Clinton, would be, I suspect, more hawkish than Obama is now in terms of foreign affairs.
She's not Joe Lieberman.
posted by persona au gratin at 12:14 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
I don't know what compelled me to do so, but I spent a brief bit searching Twitter for the anti-Semitic hate I assumed Sarah Silverman was receiving right now (no links, because ugh). Hard to tell what's coming from the right vs the left vs the troll party, but yeah there's some nasty stuff there.
posted by zachlipton at 12:18 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by zachlipton at 12:18 AM on July 26, 2016
Looks like the campaign has him on a choke chain for the time being though.
I know Bill is speaking tomorrow, but I think his role tonight was perfect for him and he should stick with it. Sit there in a box with a great big smile and have a rotating cast of luminaries sitting next to him, with different people somehow there every time the camera goes to him. It works for him.
posted by zachlipton at 12:20 AM on July 26, 2016 [18 favorites]
I know Bill is speaking tomorrow, but I think his role tonight was perfect for him and he should stick with it. Sit there in a box with a great big smile and have a rotating cast of luminaries sitting next to him, with different people somehow there every time the camera goes to him. It works for him.
posted by zachlipton at 12:20 AM on July 26, 2016 [18 favorites]
Well, that was a very nice little birthday present.
And yes, I got my Scotch, and drank it during that wonderful Bernie speech.
posted by spinifex23 at 12:22 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
And yes, I got my Scotch, and drank it during that wonderful Bernie speech.
posted by spinifex23 at 12:22 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Oh man I was so focused on the convention and this thread I forgot the drinking.
Tomorrow is MARGARITA DAY.
posted by Justinian at 12:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Tomorrow is MARGARITA DAY.
posted by Justinian at 12:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
You don't think Hillary knows she'll have to make good on those policies or move towards them?
I hate stomping on hope, truly, but when you have a stiff drink at hand, read over the old 2008 Democratic Platform. It's got a few things you can read charitably and check off as "delivered", like the ACA, maybe, but also a whole lot of promises that amounted to nothing at all. (If you're short on time, just scan for phrases like "we will pass" or "we will enact." It's a lot of sadface.)
Platforms aren't binding in any way, and we don't seem to punish elected officials who ignore them.
posted by rokusan at 12:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
I hate stomping on hope, truly, but when you have a stiff drink at hand, read over the old 2008 Democratic Platform. It's got a few things you can read charitably and check off as "delivered", like the ACA, maybe, but also a whole lot of promises that amounted to nothing at all. (If you're short on time, just scan for phrases like "we will pass" or "we will enact." It's a lot of sadface.)
Platforms aren't binding in any way, and we don't seem to punish elected officials who ignore them.
posted by rokusan at 12:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
Read over the 2016 Republican Platform. Have another drink.
posted by yesster at 12:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by yesster at 12:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
I spent a brief bit searching Twitter for the anti-Semitic hate I assumed Sarah Silverman was receiving right now
She can take it. She done good.
posted by rokusan at 12:29 AM on July 26, 2016
She can take it. She done good.
posted by rokusan at 12:29 AM on July 26, 2016
I hate stomping on hope, truly, but when you have a stiff drink at hand, read over the old 2008 Democratic Platform. It's got a few things you can read charitably and check off as "delivered", like the ACA, maybe, but also a whole lot of promises that amounted to nothing at all. (If you're short on time, just scan for phrases like "we will pass" or "we will enact." It's a lot of sadface.)
Sure. Platforms are always wishlists, and we absolutely need to push to ensure that our priorities remain their priorities. President Obama has let me down on plenty of issues, especially around the excesses of the national security state and the NSA where there is more he could have done on his own initiative. But it's also hard to fairly consider the 2008 Democratic platform without acknowledging a Republican Congress that set its #1 goal to be the obstruction and defeat of President Obama and the outcome of the 2010 midterms. And despite all that, there's a lot of happyface to take away from the last seven and a half years too: from the Lilly Ledbetter act to the ACA to gay marriage to ongoing efforts to secure some immigration protections and some protections for transgender people by executive order, among many others.
posted by zachlipton at 12:41 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
Sure. Platforms are always wishlists, and we absolutely need to push to ensure that our priorities remain their priorities. President Obama has let me down on plenty of issues, especially around the excesses of the national security state and the NSA where there is more he could have done on his own initiative. But it's also hard to fairly consider the 2008 Democratic platform without acknowledging a Republican Congress that set its #1 goal to be the obstruction and defeat of President Obama and the outcome of the 2010 midterms. And despite all that, there's a lot of happyface to take away from the last seven and a half years too: from the Lilly Ledbetter act to the ACA to gay marriage to ongoing efforts to secure some immigration protections and some protections for transgender people by executive order, among many others.
posted by zachlipton at 12:41 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
Say what you will about Susan Sarandon, but she's no Randy Quaid.
posted by peeedro at 12:41 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by peeedro at 12:41 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
(super screamy turn-down-your-volume-or-else-your-peacefully-resting-dog-or-child-or-boss-is-not-going-to-be-happy-with-you-at-all alert on the Randy Quaid link)
posted by taz at 12:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by taz at 12:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Randy Quaid needs help
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 1:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 1:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
My point was only that platforms don't mean squat, and there's certainly no reason to believe any elected official will "have to make good on those policies", since they historically do not.
posted by rokusan at 1:15 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by rokusan at 1:15 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Kevin Drum articulating better than I did why it's not surprising there are BoBers.
posted by persona au gratin at 1:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 1:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I have to say. Bill's speech in 2012 was so marvelous. I can't wait to see what he has to say tomorrow. Then back to the box.
posted by persona au gratin at 1:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by persona au gratin at 1:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
rokusan: but most of that stuff was stuff Obama would pass if he could. E.g. If he were a PM.
posted by persona au gratin at 1:30 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 1:30 AM on July 26, 2016
I woke up this morning to BBC Radio4 like usual and their take away from Day 1 was "Fissures in the Democratic party" mentioning how Hillary's name was constantly booed with clips of said booing. I woke up with a sad face.
I'm grateful for this thread as I think it gives me a more hopeful (and hopefully more accurate?) version of how it went down. The radio did acknowledge Michelle Obama's speech was the highlight but man, they did not do it justice. I only listened to a 2 minute clip and I was in tears. What a woman!
I am disheartened by the response of (some) of the Bernie supporters but I know that my disappointment is no match to theirs. I think it's a real testament to democracy that they were allowed to voice their dissent, unlike the RNC where the NeverTrumpers were basically gagged and replaced with ringers. The DNC needs to be mindful of setting an example of what real democracy looks like. I'm really looking forward to hearing Hillary speak. The repeated theme seems to be Hillary Listens - I'm hoping she will have a direct message to the Bernie supporters that this includes them too.
posted by like_neon at 1:32 AM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
I'm grateful for this thread as I think it gives me a more hopeful (and hopefully more accurate?) version of how it went down. The radio did acknowledge Michelle Obama's speech was the highlight but man, they did not do it justice. I only listened to a 2 minute clip and I was in tears. What a woman!
I am disheartened by the response of (some) of the Bernie supporters but I know that my disappointment is no match to theirs. I think it's a real testament to democracy that they were allowed to voice their dissent, unlike the RNC where the NeverTrumpers were basically gagged and replaced with ringers. The DNC needs to be mindful of setting an example of what real democracy looks like. I'm really looking forward to hearing Hillary speak. The repeated theme seems to be Hillary Listens - I'm hoping she will have a direct message to the Bernie supporters that this includes them too.
posted by like_neon at 1:32 AM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
zachlipton: Obama's presidency has indeed been remarkable. Both for what got done, and for what got done in spite of the death cult that is the modern GOP. And for a general dearth of major fuckups which characterized the incompetent Bushies. He did much less stupid shit, as Obama would put it.
posted by persona au gratin at 1:32 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by persona au gratin at 1:32 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
like_neon
I was crying during her speech, too. The entire last 4-5 hours were great this evening. Warren's speech was very good. As was the spectrum of people talking. It really looked like America.
posted by persona au gratin at 1:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I was crying during her speech, too. The entire last 4-5 hours were great this evening. Warren's speech was very good. As was the spectrum of people talking. It really looked like America.
posted by persona au gratin at 1:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
If you find yourself saying, "well, I just don't like her", you REALLY REALLY REALLY need to ask yourself one simple question. WHY? Really slow down and think what are you processing to come to that conclusion?
Yes, this. I was in that place several months ago. I would say exactly that, or something along the lines of "I think she is fake." But more and more, thanks partly to some feminist friends of mine who started advocating for her after Super Tuesday and taking apart some of the misogyny leveled at her, I realized that I had absolutely no REASON to dislike her. I was judging her based on a lot of gut reactions and repetition of things I'd heard said about her.
When I actually started listening to what she was saying, and giving her the benefit of believing she was telling the truth absent any evidence to the contrary, I came around. And with the addition of Tim Kaine, I feel downright enthusiastic about the ticket. (I've liked him for a while.)
posted by threeturtles at 2:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
Yes, this. I was in that place several months ago. I would say exactly that, or something along the lines of "I think she is fake." But more and more, thanks partly to some feminist friends of mine who started advocating for her after Super Tuesday and taking apart some of the misogyny leveled at her, I realized that I had absolutely no REASON to dislike her. I was judging her based on a lot of gut reactions and repetition of things I'd heard said about her.
When I actually started listening to what she was saying, and giving her the benefit of believing she was telling the truth absent any evidence to the contrary, I came around. And with the addition of Tim Kaine, I feel downright enthusiastic about the ticket. (I've liked him for a while.)
posted by threeturtles at 2:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
My main takeaway from what I saw of last night was how politically, morally and intellectually bankrupt the GOP is compared to the Dems. They couldn't field a single speaker over four days who could match just about anyone you'd care to pick from last night. They couldn't articulate a single platform idea you'd be comfortable talking to your children about. They are a party of one man, but when I looked at the floor of the Democratic convention and heard the speakers, I saw America.
If the Dems can keep that up for rest of the week - and the next hundred days - it won't be anything like a fair fight.
posted by Devonian at 2:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
If the Dems can keep that up for rest of the week - and the next hundred days - it won't be anything like a fair fight.
posted by Devonian at 2:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
Just a friendly to Mefite, listening to NPR tomorrow morning as Mara Liasson no doubt interviews Republican strategists about how bad the DNC is going might want to have a fallback plan.
She didn't even have to do that, as last night NPR had David Brooks, of all people, offering commentary.
The network, in its eternal quest to find equivalence, however false, in the pursuit of phony "balance," has been going all out to push the old favorite "Dems in Disarray" and "Both Sides Do It" narratives, interviewing every Bernie or Buster they can find (while ignoring the cheers for Clinton resounding in the background!).
posted by Gelatin at 4:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
She didn't even have to do that, as last night NPR had David Brooks, of all people, offering commentary.
The network, in its eternal quest to find equivalence, however false, in the pursuit of phony "balance," has been going all out to push the old favorite "Dems in Disarray" and "Both Sides Do It" narratives, interviewing every Bernie or Buster they can find (while ignoring the cheers for Clinton resounding in the background!).
posted by Gelatin at 4:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I'm happy to be wrong about some of the chants during Booker's speech.
posted by cashman at 4:35 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by cashman at 4:35 AM on July 26, 2016
I know Michelle Obama kind of stole the show going shortly afterwards, but can we talk about Cory Booker? Remember when Sotonohito said Dems needed a narrative to fight "Our country was great once, but then those people stole it from us" coming from Trump?
Booker's speech:
I was talking with my husband afterward. He generally votes Democratic on the grounds that the Dems don't, like, hate science and facts, and tend to have actual plans beyond "cut taxes and hope for the best". But he wasn't as inspired by that speech as I was. "Why do we need to rise? Who's oppressing us?" It was a weird moment because I was like... Oh honey... You don't really need to rise. You're right. No one is oppressing you. You're a white man with a professional degree. But he's not talking to you.
(Though I like that it started out with the story of American colonists overthrowing the oppression of a distant empire... I wonder what "Tea Party" people make of Booker putting that revolution in this context...)
Of course, then I had to admit that no one was really oppressing me either, even though I'm a woman. Because I've been pretty lucky and am white and straight and solidly middle class and suburban. But there are a lot of women who are oppressed, and my husband was willing to admit that.
Also I was getting the feels from having all these powerful and charismatic people standing on this huge stage and telling the nation about how great this woman was. I have literally never seen that before, people praising a woman like that. (I mean I've seen people talking about how beautiful a woman is, at a beauty pageant or an award show red carpet. This was different.) It felt strange. It made me feel weirdly self-conscious on Hillary Clinton's behalf. Like how does she take this much praise without feeling the urge to apologize and stop monopolizing the attention? Without feeling bad, like she's doing something unpardonably rude? And so even though I'm not really oppressed, I am weirdly aware of how I have been socialized as a woman to step out of the limelight. And it means something to me to see a woman standing in that limelight and not stepping aside.
We talked about something related in the context of the undocumented immigrants who spoke too. He was like "Aren't they committing a crime just by being here? Right up there on stage, doing something illegal? Is that really something the Democrats want to endorse? What they should do instead is talk about all the great things immigrants have accomplished, all the immigrants who come over here and get their degrees and end up as doctors and researchers..." and I was like "Yeah, they're not talking to you. They're talking to Latinos in Colorado and Nevada and Arizona. They don't have to sell the message 'immigrants are great' to get white people's votes. They can get citizens who are worried about the illegal immigrants in their own families to vote." He was like... "Huh. Touché."
So anyway, "Our country was great until they stole it from us," might indeed resonate more with white men. But that's a pretty small "us". I think the "we" is much bigger in "We were oppressed and fought for our freedom. But the fight isn't over yet. We will rise."
Just thinking about it is getting me kind of choked up again. I think the Democrats have their narrative.
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:42 AM on July 26, 2016 [110 favorites]
Booker's speech:
This too captures our history: 240 years ago, an English King said he would crush our rebellion, but Americans from around our nation joined the fight. From Bunker Hill to the Battle of Trenton, they stood, and so many fell giving their lives in support of our daring declaration that: America, we will rise.That is the narrative. A story of progress, the progressive narrative... "We were oppressed and fought for our rights. But the fight isn't over yet. We will rise." It gives me chills.
This is our history: escaped slaves, knowing that liberty is not secure for some until it’s secure for all, sometimes hungry, often hunted, in dark woods and deep swamps, they looked up to the North Star and said with a determined whisper, America, we will rise.
Immigrants, risking their lives in a time of sweatshops and child labor, organized labor unions devoted to lifting the tired, and poor and huddled masses – with the fiercest grit, they shouted so all could hear: America, we will rise.
King pointed to a mountain top, Kennedy pointed to the moon – from Seneca Falls to the Stonewall Inn, giants stood and said in a chorus of conviction that America, we will rise.
I was talking with my husband afterward. He generally votes Democratic on the grounds that the Dems don't, like, hate science and facts, and tend to have actual plans beyond "cut taxes and hope for the best". But he wasn't as inspired by that speech as I was. "Why do we need to rise? Who's oppressing us?" It was a weird moment because I was like... Oh honey... You don't really need to rise. You're right. No one is oppressing you. You're a white man with a professional degree. But he's not talking to you.
(Though I like that it started out with the story of American colonists overthrowing the oppression of a distant empire... I wonder what "Tea Party" people make of Booker putting that revolution in this context...)
Of course, then I had to admit that no one was really oppressing me either, even though I'm a woman. Because I've been pretty lucky and am white and straight and solidly middle class and suburban. But there are a lot of women who are oppressed, and my husband was willing to admit that.
Also I was getting the feels from having all these powerful and charismatic people standing on this huge stage and telling the nation about how great this woman was. I have literally never seen that before, people praising a woman like that. (I mean I've seen people talking about how beautiful a woman is, at a beauty pageant or an award show red carpet. This was different.) It felt strange. It made me feel weirdly self-conscious on Hillary Clinton's behalf. Like how does she take this much praise without feeling the urge to apologize and stop monopolizing the attention? Without feeling bad, like she's doing something unpardonably rude? And so even though I'm not really oppressed, I am weirdly aware of how I have been socialized as a woman to step out of the limelight. And it means something to me to see a woman standing in that limelight and not stepping aside.
We talked about something related in the context of the undocumented immigrants who spoke too. He was like "Aren't they committing a crime just by being here? Right up there on stage, doing something illegal? Is that really something the Democrats want to endorse? What they should do instead is talk about all the great things immigrants have accomplished, all the immigrants who come over here and get their degrees and end up as doctors and researchers..." and I was like "Yeah, they're not talking to you. They're talking to Latinos in Colorado and Nevada and Arizona. They don't have to sell the message 'immigrants are great' to get white people's votes. They can get citizens who are worried about the illegal immigrants in their own families to vote." He was like... "Huh. Touché."
So anyway, "Our country was great until they stole it from us," might indeed resonate more with white men. But that's a pretty small "us". I think the "we" is much bigger in "We were oppressed and fought for our freedom. But the fight isn't over yet. We will rise."
Just thinking about it is getting me kind of choked up again. I think the Democrats have their narrative.
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:42 AM on July 26, 2016 [110 favorites]
On reflection this morning, thee is only one bad taste left in my mouth - the ill treatment of Elijah Cummings. I wish there is some way we could get him back on the program for a redo. Sort of a weak gesture, but I just left him a thank you on Twitter to let him know he is appreciated - here is his account if you want to too.
posted by madamjujujive at 4:55 AM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
posted by madamjujujive at 4:55 AM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
They couldn't field a single speaker over four days who could match just about anyone you'd care to pick from last night.
The GOP over four days couldn't field a single speaker who could match the quality of speech given by the person doing the musical interlude. It's that level of difference. (And of course that's another difference between the two conventions. The Democratic Convention had a musician who was there to give a compelling speech before the performance - the Republican Convention had musicians who were there to troll).
posted by Francis at 5:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
The GOP over four days couldn't field a single speaker who could match the quality of speech given by the person doing the musical interlude. It's that level of difference. (And of course that's another difference between the two conventions. The Democratic Convention had a musician who was there to give a compelling speech before the performance - the Republican Convention had musicians who were there to troll).
posted by Francis at 5:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Seriously, sometimes it seems there are people specifically going out of their way to diminish Hillary Clinton, her character, her accomplishments, and her supporters.
No. Hillary Clinton has a sterling list of accomplishments and espouses a centrist, pro-Wall Street, pro-military foreign policy, pro-status quo. There's no cognitive dissonance here; both aspects can be true at the same time. She's qualified, highly intelligent and capable. I just wonder where we're going with her.
Comments like this make Hillary bulletproof: no matter what policy position you have grievance with, it all comes down to accusations of ad homenim attacks. Read my post and highlight where I did this. Her integrity is absolutely something that's on the table for discussion. Remember, she's applying for a job, and the American people are the employers. We get to ask the tough questions.
I get the whole party unity thing, and I badly want her to win over Trump. But no need to silence legitimate criticism, YES of your own candidate thank you very much.
posted by zardoz at 5:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
No. Hillary Clinton has a sterling list of accomplishments and espouses a centrist, pro-Wall Street, pro-military foreign policy, pro-status quo. There's no cognitive dissonance here; both aspects can be true at the same time. She's qualified, highly intelligent and capable. I just wonder where we're going with her.
Comments like this make Hillary bulletproof: no matter what policy position you have grievance with, it all comes down to accusations of ad homenim attacks. Read my post and highlight where I did this. Her integrity is absolutely something that's on the table for discussion. Remember, she's applying for a job, and the American people are the employers. We get to ask the tough questions.
I get the whole party unity thing, and I badly want her to win over Trump. But no need to silence legitimate criticism, YES of your own candidate thank you very much.
posted by zardoz at 5:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
Thank you, madamjujujive! I also felt terrible about it still, and I just sent him a tweet saying that I did listen to him, and his speech was important to us.
posted by Tarumba at 5:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Tarumba at 5:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Watched last night on CSPAN- should have done that for the RNC, too; did not miss the talking heads AT ALL.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 5:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 5:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
Whether the parallel is accurate or not, keep in mind that no president ever got elected with total unity from the left.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:26 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:26 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
The far left (in Britain where I actually know members) seems to be about as unified as the Judean People's Front - or do I mean the Peoples' Front of Judea?
posted by Francis at 5:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Francis at 5:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
They also did a much better job with the stagecraft of last night. The coordination of the signs with the speeches - the "Michelle" signs, the "Rise Together" signs with Booker's "we will rise" refrain. The speeches all worked together. The RNC was supposed to have "themes" each night but the speeches never reflected them, and I don't remember any good visuals like the sea of signs last night.
posted by dnash at 5:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by dnash at 5:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
"The GOP over four days couldn't field a single speaker who could match the quality of speech given by the person doing the musical interlude. It's that level of difference."
That is only true to those on the left, the GOP is telling themselves a different story, which is more true than the above, at least to them.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
That is only true to those on the left, the GOP is telling themselves a different story, which is more true than the above, at least to them.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 5:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Hillary Clinton has a sterling list of accomplishments and espouses a centrist, pro-Wall Street, pro-military foreign policy, pro-status quo. There's no cognitive dissonance here; both aspects can be true at the same time. She's qualified, highly intelligent and capable. I just wonder where we're going with her.
Comments like this make Hillary bulletproof: no matter what policy position you have grievance with, it all comes down to accusations of ad homenim attacks.
I disagree, because I think Clinton's purported "centrist" policy positions are routinely misrepresented. Clinton, on her own, has a voting record to the left of most of the Democratic party. Fivethirtyeight:
Of course it is possible to have a policy debate, as well as an integrity debate, about Hillary Clinton. But it is not the fault of Clinton supporters that she has been tarred with a sexist brush for literally 25 years, all without serious consideration of her actual accomplishments or positions. Current critics, even on the Left, use the same talking points, many already well past debunked. Your criticisms of Clinton may not be ad hominem, but, frankly, given the treatment of Clinton as a person and a politician, it's up to the good faith commenter to prove their lack of malice, listeners who extend good faith to anti-Clinton comments are, given the history, likely to be disappointed.
posted by OmieWise at 5:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [57 favorites]
Comments like this make Hillary bulletproof: no matter what policy position you have grievance with, it all comes down to accusations of ad homenim attacks.
I disagree, because I think Clinton's purported "centrist" policy positions are routinely misrepresented. Clinton, on her own, has a voting record to the left of most of the Democratic party. Fivethirtyeight:
"Clinton was one of the most liberal members during her time in the Senate. According to an analysis of roll call votes by Voteview, Clinton’s record was more liberal than 70 percent of Democrats in her final term in the Senate. She was more liberal than 85 percent of all members. Her 2008 rival in the Democratic presidential primary, Barack Obama, was nearby with a record more liberal than 82 percent of all members — he was not more liberal than Clinton."Bill Clinton was significantly more centrist than Hillary Clinton is, and I think that people equate the two unfairly. What's more, the country has shifted left in the past two decades since Bill Clinton was President, and Hillary Clinton has shifted with it. She is hawkish on defense, both internal and external. But, then, Sanders supports the drone program and not many people seem to criticize him for it.
Of course it is possible to have a policy debate, as well as an integrity debate, about Hillary Clinton. But it is not the fault of Clinton supporters that she has been tarred with a sexist brush for literally 25 years, all without serious consideration of her actual accomplishments or positions. Current critics, even on the Left, use the same talking points, many already well past debunked. Your criticisms of Clinton may not be ad hominem, but, frankly, given the treatment of Clinton as a person and a politician, it's up to the good faith commenter to prove their lack of malice, listeners who extend good faith to anti-Clinton comments are, given the history, likely to be disappointed.
posted by OmieWise at 5:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [57 favorites]
Part of the problem with this whole discussion is that during the primary silencing dissent was in fact an unpleasant tactic used by the front runners campaign. But now that the primary is over, dissenters who claim to support the winner, or at least oppose the other party, are in fact hurting their own interests by continuing the same arguments.
We lament this tendency on the right for voters to work against their own interests--but this is almost more absurd because even the worst accusations of Clinton only claim to disagree with like 30% of her possible activities as a president.
The time for dissent is done, for now. I'm biting my tongue about my misgivings about a Clinton White House and so should you.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
We lament this tendency on the right for voters to work against their own interests--but this is almost more absurd because even the worst accusations of Clinton only claim to disagree with like 30% of her possible activities as a president.
The time for dissent is done, for now. I'm biting my tongue about my misgivings about a Clinton White House and so should you.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
I am proud to be a Democrat today after last night. Yes we are messy, argumentative and shouty. Yes we are imperfect and promise far more than we deliver. Yes we have warts, bumps, bruises, fuckups and leaked emails. But last night, my heart soared -- all the Latinos and the beauty of the Spanish language! All the people of color and gays! All the women! People with disabilities! Labor unions! Michelle Obama, force of nature!
We contain multitudes. It's inevitable that when you get that many people in one tent, there will be fights. But the trajectory is forward, hope, light, aspiration, striving. Such a balm to my soul after last week. I hope those poor sad Bernie folks can get relief.
posted by madamjujujive at 5:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [29 favorites]
We contain multitudes. It's inevitable that when you get that many people in one tent, there will be fights. But the trajectory is forward, hope, light, aspiration, striving. Such a balm to my soul after last week. I hope those poor sad Bernie folks can get relief.
posted by madamjujujive at 5:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [29 favorites]
platforms don't mean squat, and there's certainly no reason to believe any elected official will "have to make good on those policies", since they historically do not.
They don't historically, partially because single-party control is fleeting. Elect a democratic House and Senate and use them to pressure Pres. Clinton to adopt the platform. Some dude from Vermont last night said this:
Our job now is to see that platform implemented by a Democratic Senate, a Democratic House and a Hillary Clinton presidency – and I am going to do everything I can to make that happen.
posted by fitnr at 5:37 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
They don't historically, partially because single-party control is fleeting. Elect a democratic House and Senate and use them to pressure Pres. Clinton to adopt the platform. Some dude from Vermont last night said this:
Our job now is to see that platform implemented by a Democratic Senate, a Democratic House and a Hillary Clinton presidency – and I am going to do everything I can to make that happen.
posted by fitnr at 5:37 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
The RNC was supposed to have "themes" each night but the speeches never reflected them
Did the GOP Invite the Wrong Chris Cox to Their Convention?
posted by like_neon at 5:40 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Did the GOP Invite the Wrong Chris Cox to Their Convention?
posted by like_neon at 5:40 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Last night felt really cathartic and good and I 'm going to step away from the convention and get some work done now.
Way upthread people were talking about their earliest involvement in politics... so someone on my facebook feed posted the 1972 Democratic Party Platform, the first campaign I volunteered for. I was a freshman in high school, calling people in Westchester County to find out if they were voting for McGovern!!! I had no idea!!! Some of my friends' fathers told me that if McGovern won my way of life would be changed forever, and I had no idea what they were talking about ( I understand now, but I still would not have cared). On election night I was at a school function and we kept sneaking away to watch the election returns, and another father of a friend was amazed that I thought McGovern would win.
The first presidential election I voted in was 1980. I voted for Gus Hall, the Communist Party candidate. This was in Illinois, and I was sure Carter would win. It was a truly horrifying moment when I realized Reagan won. I know my vote didn't make the difference, but I have never been able to protest vote since then.
All this is certainly not to say that young people don't get it, just to add some anecdotal history to your store of knowledge. Life is bumpy. Also not all boomers...
posted by maggiemaggie at 5:42 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
Way upthread people were talking about their earliest involvement in politics... so someone on my facebook feed posted the 1972 Democratic Party Platform, the first campaign I volunteered for. I was a freshman in high school, calling people in Westchester County to find out if they were voting for McGovern!!! I had no idea!!! Some of my friends' fathers told me that if McGovern won my way of life would be changed forever, and I had no idea what they were talking about ( I understand now, but I still would not have cared). On election night I was at a school function and we kept sneaking away to watch the election returns, and another father of a friend was amazed that I thought McGovern would win.
The first presidential election I voted in was 1980. I voted for Gus Hall, the Communist Party candidate. This was in Illinois, and I was sure Carter would win. It was a truly horrifying moment when I realized Reagan won. I know my vote didn't make the difference, but I have never been able to protest vote since then.
All this is certainly not to say that young people don't get it, just to add some anecdotal history to your store of knowledge. Life is bumpy. Also not all boomers...
posted by maggiemaggie at 5:42 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
This is a very minor point, but I'm personally going to be trying to avoid the term "leaked emails." "Leaked" implies that a principled whistle-blower released these emails to the press in protest. These emails were actually hacked, stolen, and made public by a foreign intelligence service for reasons that I'm pretty sure have nothing to do with respect for the sanctity of the American electoral process.
posted by ourobouros at 5:47 AM on July 26, 2016 [21 favorites]
posted by ourobouros at 5:47 AM on July 26, 2016 [21 favorites]
zardoz, I agree with you about the job application, tough questions and legitimate criticism, in general. But part of it is in the timing.
And truth be told, I am particularly defensive and protective about Hillary. There's a part of this that is personal to me. It's partly the 25 years of abuse and lies she's weathered. It's partly that so many critiques are ones that I have suffered as a woman in business. Great as Bernie's speech was, part of me bristled, sort of a "stop with the mansplaining" reaction. I was refraining in my head as he went through his wishlist, yes Hillary was for that; yes Hillary wanted that too. I feel as though even if she gets elected and is president and highly successful, it will be "oh those were someone else's ideas." I feel like she rarely gets credit for the good she's done. Even the "not genuine" criticisms emanate from her caution, which is a reasonable reaction to decades of abuse, imo.
These are familiar themes to many women.
posted by madamjujujive at 5:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [63 favorites]
And truth be told, I am particularly defensive and protective about Hillary. There's a part of this that is personal to me. It's partly the 25 years of abuse and lies she's weathered. It's partly that so many critiques are ones that I have suffered as a woman in business. Great as Bernie's speech was, part of me bristled, sort of a "stop with the mansplaining" reaction. I was refraining in my head as he went through his wishlist, yes Hillary was for that; yes Hillary wanted that too. I feel as though even if she gets elected and is president and highly successful, it will be "oh those were someone else's ideas." I feel like she rarely gets credit for the good she's done. Even the "not genuine" criticisms emanate from her caution, which is a reasonable reaction to decades of abuse, imo.
These are familiar themes to many women.
posted by madamjujujive at 5:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [63 favorites]
As an aside only thinly related to the election:
I've just realized how influenced I've become by Metafilter.
I turned on the TV this morning and didn't see anything I wanted to watch and checked the guide. I decided to watch Married With Children since I used to watch it as a kid. Al Bundy was telling Bud to never miss out on a chance to take revenge on a woman.
My first thought was, "is Trump using this as his campaign guideline".
And then I thought a little more on it and realized that I very well could have become just like Trump. I used to love Married w/ Children. I was pro Iraq war. I was trying to justify torture. I look back to some of my earlier thoughts and things I've posted here and I am disappointed in them.
I am glad that nearly 15 years of Metafilter has helped make me a more compassionate person. I'm now less reactionary and more critical. By no means am I perfect but thank you Metafilter for helping a lost, angry kid become a better adult.
If only Donald Trump had someone show him Metafilter 15 years ago.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 5:55 AM on July 26, 2016 [102 favorites]
I've just realized how influenced I've become by Metafilter.
I turned on the TV this morning and didn't see anything I wanted to watch and checked the guide. I decided to watch Married With Children since I used to watch it as a kid. Al Bundy was telling Bud to never miss out on a chance to take revenge on a woman.
My first thought was, "is Trump using this as his campaign guideline".
And then I thought a little more on it and realized that I very well could have become just like Trump. I used to love Married w/ Children. I was pro Iraq war. I was trying to justify torture. I look back to some of my earlier thoughts and things I've posted here and I am disappointed in them.
I am glad that nearly 15 years of Metafilter has helped make me a more compassionate person. I'm now less reactionary and more critical. By no means am I perfect but thank you Metafilter for helping a lost, angry kid become a better adult.
If only Donald Trump had someone show him Metafilter 15 years ago.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 5:55 AM on July 26, 2016 [102 favorites]
Did the GOP Invite the Wrong Chris Cox to Their Convention?
i love this so much. it's like the GOP for this entire election cycle in microcosm
posted by murphy slaw at 6:00 AM on July 26, 2016
i love this so much. it's like the GOP for this entire election cycle in microcosm
posted by murphy slaw at 6:00 AM on July 26, 2016
The far left (in Britain where I actually know members) seems to be about as unified as the Judean People's Front - or do I mean the Peoples' Front of Judea?
The far left is what it is. Do not make the mistake of assuming political conflict is all about left vs. right -- there is left vs. right, there is left vs. center, there is establishment vs. insurgent, there is pragmatist vs. fundamentalist, there is single-issue versus big-picture, there is incremental vs. sweeping change, there is what-I-feel vs. what-I-know, there is the passion of youth vs. the cynicism of experience. None of those sides are inherently correct on all issues.
There are otherwise well-meaning leftist people that Hillary, for various reasons, will simply not be able to reach. That's a given. (Not to be confused with this, which is a gibbon.) The juggling act is making them feel that at least they are not being ignored, of which day one appears to have been as successful as possible.
posted by delfin at 6:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
The far left is what it is. Do not make the mistake of assuming political conflict is all about left vs. right -- there is left vs. right, there is left vs. center, there is establishment vs. insurgent, there is pragmatist vs. fundamentalist, there is single-issue versus big-picture, there is incremental vs. sweeping change, there is what-I-feel vs. what-I-know, there is the passion of youth vs. the cynicism of experience. None of those sides are inherently correct on all issues.
There are otherwise well-meaning leftist people that Hillary, for various reasons, will simply not be able to reach. That's a given. (Not to be confused with this, which is a gibbon.) The juggling act is making them feel that at least they are not being ignored, of which day one appears to have been as successful as possible.
posted by delfin at 6:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
If only Donald Trump had someone show him Metafilter 15 years ago.
Crooked Cortex couldn't even get MeFi to show up on Google. Must be because Jibbering Jessamyn left for another site. Sad!
posted by threeants at 6:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [50 favorites]
Crooked Cortex couldn't even get MeFi to show up on Google. Must be because Jibbering Jessamyn left for another site. Sad!
posted by threeants at 6:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [50 favorites]
"That guy wants to party and have someone else do the pukin' for him"
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 6:03 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 6:03 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
There was an overabundance of riches to draw from last night.
Booker
Warren
Sanders
Michelle Obama
all could've easily been highlights on 4 different nights. That's how star studded the oratory has been.
Hell there were speeches way way way out of primetime that were incredibly solid.
But yeah if you need a narrative Booker gave a very nice one about how a bunch of colonists demanded more rights 240 or so years ago (yes this is somewhat reductive) and while progress hasn't been consistent the slow steady march towards freedom and equality for all has continued.
1776 Declaration of Independence
1790 Final Ratification of the Constitution
1863 Emancipation Proclaimation
1865 13th Amendment
1919 19th Amendment
1961 23rd Amendment
1964 24th Amendment
1972 26th Amendment
and so on. The road has not always been smooth and many have lost their lives in the struggle but everyday people continue to rise up and demand that they be treated equal.
White Males like myself are so removed from the time period in which White Males actually had to fight for their rights that so many of us forget that no there is still unfinished work left to be done.
posted by vuron at 6:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
Booker
Warren
Sanders
Michelle Obama
all could've easily been highlights on 4 different nights. That's how star studded the oratory has been.
Hell there were speeches way way way out of primetime that were incredibly solid.
But yeah if you need a narrative Booker gave a very nice one about how a bunch of colonists demanded more rights 240 or so years ago (yes this is somewhat reductive) and while progress hasn't been consistent the slow steady march towards freedom and equality for all has continued.
1776 Declaration of Independence
1790 Final Ratification of the Constitution
1863 Emancipation Proclaimation
1865 13th Amendment
1919 19th Amendment
1961 23rd Amendment
1964 24th Amendment
1972 26th Amendment
and so on. The road has not always been smooth and many have lost their lives in the struggle but everyday people continue to rise up and demand that they be treated equal.
White Males like myself are so removed from the time period in which White Males actually had to fight for their rights that so many of us forget that no there is still unfinished work left to be done.
posted by vuron at 6:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
Crooked Cortex couldn't even get MeFi to show up on Google. Must be because Jibbering Jessamyn left for another site. Sad!
Nice impression, but you give too much credit to Trump by using alliteration. He's not even that clever. Crooked Hillary, Goofy Warren, Lyin' Ted Cruz... Also, "Jibbering" has one too many syllables.
posted by Roommate at 6:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
Nice impression, but you give too much credit to Trump by using alliteration. He's not even that clever. Crooked Hillary, Goofy Warren, Lyin' Ted Cruz... Also, "Jibbering" has one too many syllables.
posted by Roommate at 6:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
Yeah, I just want to say how much it has meant to me to be able to follow this torturous election process through the filter of Metafilter. Even at our most shouty, it has remained one of the most rational, civil places on the Internet. Last evening, I was honestly at a low point. This election had really gotten to me; Trump's poll numbers were up, I was feeling genuinely scared for my future in this country. I read this thread, first in despair, as it seemed the booing was bad. Then as you all told me the booing had died down and the water was fine, I tuned into C-SPAN. Watching those glorious speeches with you all was exactly what I needed last night.
posted by peacheater at 6:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by peacheater at 6:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
On the other hand if Trump discovered Metafilter maybe he would've found scarabic's infamous comment and instead of firing people like dogs he'd be disposing the bodies in a much grislier way.
posted by vuron at 6:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by vuron at 6:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
It felt strange. It made me feel weirdly self-conscious on Hillary Clinton's behalf. Like how does she take this much praise without feeling the urge to apologize and stop monopolizing the attention? Without feeling bad, like she's doing something unpardonably rude? And so even though I'm not really oppressed, I am weirdly aware of how I have been socialized as a woman to step out of the limelight. And it means something to me to see a woman standing in that limelight and not stepping aside.
Oh wow, YES. So well put, thank you. This really does feel unnatural somehow, doesn't it? I know exactly the kind of socialization you're talking about.
And for people who haven't examined that socialization aspect, I wouldn't be at all surprised that it underlies so much of the "she doesn't know her place," dislike. Which is exactly why we need to see more women in this position!
posted by Salieri at 6:15 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
Oh wow, YES. So well put, thank you. This really does feel unnatural somehow, doesn't it? I know exactly the kind of socialization you're talking about.
And for people who haven't examined that socialization aspect, I wouldn't be at all surprised that it underlies so much of the "she doesn't know her place," dislike. Which is exactly why we need to see more women in this position!
posted by Salieri at 6:15 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
I listened to a bit of this on the radio this morning. I have almost no view on US politics but only one thing came to mind - are you saying "boo" or "boo-ernie"?
I am reminded of the story that Tom Petty tells about playing the MUSE concerts. He was scheduled to play just before Bruce Springsteen, and Jackson Browne warned him that if it sounds like the crowd is booing, they're not, they just yelling, "Bruuuce!" and Petty replied, "What's the difference?"
posted by ogooglebar at 6:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
I am reminded of the story that Tom Petty tells about playing the MUSE concerts. He was scheduled to play just before Bruce Springsteen, and Jackson Browne warned him that if it sounds like the crowd is booing, they're not, they just yelling, "Bruuuce!" and Petty replied, "What's the difference?"
posted by ogooglebar at 6:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
The point is that the status quo--of relatively unchecked capitalism, of the rich getting richer, etc.--will simply continue with Clinton.
Work to get the most progressive people elected at every level of public office. That will probably involve more dull meetings in badly furnished and badly-lit rooms. Again, I'm just a legal alien surreptitiously living among you, but Americans have a fuckton of elections for positions where other countries don't have elections, and devolve a lot of power well past the reach of the president. Unchecked capitalism is when small cities fight among themselves to offer tax incentives to low-paying retail because the retailer can move but cities cannot; unchecked capitalism is where low-paying retail bosses fund elections. Unchecked capitalism is when Uber or AirBnB moves in, violates a bunch of laws, then sends in its lobbyists to rewrite those laws to suit its specific needs.
Anyway, I think it's a testament to Clinton's capabilities as a politician (and frankly, to Sanders's limits) that she was able to wind things down and limit the influence of the PUMA fringe in 2008. And that's not a snipe at Bernie: he's earned all his primary votes. But he's also drawn pretty tight boundaries around himself his entire political career in order to succeed within that space.
posted by holgate at 6:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [27 favorites]
Work to get the most progressive people elected at every level of public office. That will probably involve more dull meetings in badly furnished and badly-lit rooms. Again, I'm just a legal alien surreptitiously living among you, but Americans have a fuckton of elections for positions where other countries don't have elections, and devolve a lot of power well past the reach of the president. Unchecked capitalism is when small cities fight among themselves to offer tax incentives to low-paying retail because the retailer can move but cities cannot; unchecked capitalism is where low-paying retail bosses fund elections. Unchecked capitalism is when Uber or AirBnB moves in, violates a bunch of laws, then sends in its lobbyists to rewrite those laws to suit its specific needs.
Anyway, I think it's a testament to Clinton's capabilities as a politician (and frankly, to Sanders's limits) that she was able to wind things down and limit the influence of the PUMA fringe in 2008. And that's not a snipe at Bernie: he's earned all his primary votes. But he's also drawn pretty tight boundaries around himself his entire political career in order to succeed within that space.
posted by holgate at 6:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [27 favorites]
On the good news front it looks like Georgia is extremely competitive with Trump's lead in Georgia showing a 1-2 point lead. And that's post RNC polling.
If Clinton wins Georgia and North Carolina I would be overjoyed. A bit sad that Texas is being so intransigent on turning purple but seriously overjoyed. Maybe Republicans can go back to being principled partners in governing instead of whatever weird Frankenstein monster of Dixiecrats and Theocrats and Neoliberals current dominates their caucus.
If Eisenhower and Rockefeller were the models of Republicanism going forward I would be seriously overjoyed and I think there are a lot of Republicans that would probably agree.
posted by vuron at 6:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
If Clinton wins Georgia and North Carolina I would be overjoyed. A bit sad that Texas is being so intransigent on turning purple but seriously overjoyed. Maybe Republicans can go back to being principled partners in governing instead of whatever weird Frankenstein monster of Dixiecrats and Theocrats and Neoliberals current dominates their caucus.
If Eisenhower and Rockefeller were the models of Republicanism going forward I would be seriously overjoyed and I think there are a lot of Republicans that would probably agree.
posted by vuron at 6:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Work to get the most progressive people elected at every level of public office. That will probably involve more dull meetings in badly furnished and badly-lit rooms. Again, I'm just a legal alien surreptitiously living among you, but Americans have a fuckton of elections for positions where other countries don't have elections, and devolve a lot of power well past the reach of the president.
^This.^
I said in an earlier election thread that the Obama elections at least taught me that I can't forget about all the less high profile elections that happen throughout my region. I mean, it will be great if we get the first woman president but it won't mean as much if, like Obama did, she has a Congress that actively blocks her. So it's great that people are fired up and ready to cast their ballot, but don't forget that change also begins locally and in your state/district. Don't forget about those elections after November.
posted by Kitteh at 6:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
^This.^
I said in an earlier election thread that the Obama elections at least taught me that I can't forget about all the less high profile elections that happen throughout my region. I mean, it will be great if we get the first woman president but it won't mean as much if, like Obama did, she has a Congress that actively blocks her. So it's great that people are fired up and ready to cast their ballot, but don't forget that change also begins locally and in your state/district. Don't forget about those elections after November.
posted by Kitteh at 6:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
Some dickhead on Facebook this morning posted on one of my Berner relative's post:
Will it be funny if Bennie voters dont vote and Trump is president?
My reply:
posted by Talez at 6:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [66 favorites]
Will it be funny if Bennie voters dont vote and Trump is president?
My reply:
It'll be absolutely hilarious!Because shit like that can't go unanswered anymore. These people need to pull their fucking heads in. He may live in California and who gives a shit about his vote but my Berner relative lives in Colorado and that's going to be on a knife edge.
The families that will be broken apart by a new generation of extreme immigration enforcement, the violence perpetrated on minorities emboldened by an electorate that rejects tolerance and empathy, the LGBTQ that are going to face a second Obergefell with a new hostile SCOTUS, the people in southern states who will be paid peanuts when minimum wage laws are removed, the millions who will lose insurance when the ACA is repealed. ALL ABSOLUTELY HILARIOUS!
But then again I'm a straight, white male who lives in a liberal state so the Trump presidency won't affect me one iota. Isn't that so funny, [name]? What up my patriarchal dawg! How's our hegemony hanging?
/s
posted by Talez at 6:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [66 favorites]
The point is that the status quo--of relatively unchecked capitalism, of the rich getting richer, etc.--will simply continue with Clinton.
The status quo -- of relatively unchecked capitalism, of the rich getting richer, etc. -- would simply continue under Bernie. Or under anyone else.
Because the House of Representatives is firmly Republican, nothing of any substance is getting through there, and it's not shifting any time soon. Because a potential Democratic Senate will not get anything major done either, as even if they reach 52 or 53 there are still flies in the ointment like Chuck Schumer and Dianne Feinstein and Bob Casey Jr. and Joe Manchin who vote, how you say, not in lockstep with progressive desires. And even if they did agree, there's the filibuster. And even if the filibuster was nuked, see point 1 about the House.
Because Congress and politicians in general function largely because of and on behalf of moneyed interests -- the military-industrial complex, the corporations, the lobbyists, the donors, the rivers of cash that flow into every election. Those were there before Citizens United and they'll be there after it's gone. And yes, they're not ENTIRELY mustache-twirling Snidely Whiplashes spouting Gordon Gekko lines -- there ARE things that are good for all of us around corporate success and greasing the wheels a bit to keep it happening. There are also terrible things around that and we're not going to eliminate those and turn America into a Talking Heads song overnight.
Because if the court systems are tilted right, not much else matters. And if Congress is tilted right, that's not changing. And if we don't vote for the best candidates that we can get into these offices to get reasonable judges on the benches, that's also not changing.
posted by delfin at 6:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [15 favorites]
The status quo -- of relatively unchecked capitalism, of the rich getting richer, etc. -- would simply continue under Bernie. Or under anyone else.
Because the House of Representatives is firmly Republican, nothing of any substance is getting through there, and it's not shifting any time soon. Because a potential Democratic Senate will not get anything major done either, as even if they reach 52 or 53 there are still flies in the ointment like Chuck Schumer and Dianne Feinstein and Bob Casey Jr. and Joe Manchin who vote, how you say, not in lockstep with progressive desires. And even if they did agree, there's the filibuster. And even if the filibuster was nuked, see point 1 about the House.
Because Congress and politicians in general function largely because of and on behalf of moneyed interests -- the military-industrial complex, the corporations, the lobbyists, the donors, the rivers of cash that flow into every election. Those were there before Citizens United and they'll be there after it's gone. And yes, they're not ENTIRELY mustache-twirling Snidely Whiplashes spouting Gordon Gekko lines -- there ARE things that are good for all of us around corporate success and greasing the wheels a bit to keep it happening. There are also terrible things around that and we're not going to eliminate those and turn America into a Talking Heads song overnight.
Because if the court systems are tilted right, not much else matters. And if Congress is tilted right, that's not changing. And if we don't vote for the best candidates that we can get into these offices to get reasonable judges on the benches, that's also not changing.
posted by delfin at 6:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [15 favorites]
Having heard [Sanders] and Elizabeth Warren back-to-back... man, I wish she had run instead of him.
I like to think he set up Warren to win in 4 to 8 years (depending on Trump or Hillary getting in this time). Shifting of the Overton window and all that.
Salieri: I'm loving the "Hillary listens" theme coming from so many speakers.
From Ezra Klein's longform piece on Vox -- Understanding Hillary: The Clinton America sees isn’t the Clinton colleagues know. Why are they so different?
posted by filthy light thief at 6:42 AM on July 26, 2016 [81 favorites]
I like to think he set up Warren to win in 4 to 8 years (depending on Trump or Hillary getting in this time). Shifting of the Overton window and all that.
Salieri: I'm loving the "Hillary listens" theme coming from so many speakers.
From Ezra Klein's longform piece on Vox -- Understanding Hillary: The Clinton America sees isn’t the Clinton colleagues know. Why are they so different?
How a listener campaignsListening matters, but it's not visible. And you can't tout yourself as a good listener, because then you're talking and not listening. It has to come from other people.
“I love Bill Clinton,” says Tom Harkin, who served as senator from Iowa from 1985 to 2015. “But every time you talk to Bill, you’re just trying to get a word in edgewise. With Hillary, you’re in a meeting with her, and she really listens to you.”
The first few times I heard someone praise Clinton’s listening, I discounted it. After hearing it five, six, seven times, I got annoyed by it. What a gendered compliment: “She listens.” It sounds like a caricature of what we would say about a female politician.
But after hearing it 11, 12, 15 times, I began to take it seriously, ask more questions about it. And as I did, the Gap began to make more sense.
Modern presidential campaigns are built to reward people who are really, really good at talking. So imagine what a campaign feels like if you’re not entirely natural in front of big crowds. Imagine that you are constantly compared to your husband, one of the greatest campaign orators of all time; that you’ve been burned again and again after saying the wrong thing in public; that you’ve been told, for decades, that you come across as calculated and inauthentic on the stump. What would you do?
When Hillary Clinton ran for the Senate in 2000, she tried to do something very strange: She tried to campaign by listening. It was called her “listening tour,” and the press did not like it. “Mrs. Clinton brings to her public appearances a great deal of poise and seriousness of purpose which, more than anything she actually says, is what the events tend to be about,” reported the New Yorker, in a piece representative of much of the coverage I found from that time. “This was the singular insight of the First Lady’s unprecedented ‘listening tour,’ during which she tried to elevate nodding into a kind of political philosophy.”
...
It turned out that Clinton, in her travels, stuffed notes from her conversations and her reading into suitcases, and every few months she dumped the stray paper on the floor of her Senate office and picked through it with her staff. The card tables were for categorization: scraps of paper related to the environment went here, crumpled clippings related to military families there. These notes, Rubiner recalls, really did lead to legislation. Clinton took seriously the things she was told, the things she read, the things she saw. She made her team follow up.
posted by filthy light thief at 6:42 AM on July 26, 2016 [81 favorites]
On reflection this morning, thee is only one bad taste left in my mouth - the ill treatment of Elijah Cummings. I wish there is some way we could get him back on the program for a redo. Sort of a weak gesture, but I just left him a thank you on Twitter to let him know he is appreciated - here is his account if you want to too.
The more I think about this, the more upset I get. He is a treasure and was treated like trash by a bunch of fools. I'm sure he's seen worse but at some point he must just think, "STILL?!"
posted by sallybrown at 6:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
The more I think about this, the more upset I get. He is a treasure and was treated like trash by a bunch of fools. I'm sure he's seen worse but at some point he must just think, "STILL?!"
posted by sallybrown at 6:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
It turned out that Clinton, in her travels, stuffed notes from her conversations and her reading into suitcases, and every few months she dumped the stray paper on the floor of her Senate office and picked through it with her staff. The card tables were for categorization: scraps of paper related to the environment went here, crumpled clippings related to military families there. These notes, Rubiner recalls, really did lead to legislation. Clinton took seriously the things she was told, the things she read, the things she saw. She made her team follow up.Cool. Reminds me of the card sorting exercise that information architects use to uncover the organization of a website.
posted by ZeusHumms at 6:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
MSNBC covered last night's DNC events to start the hour. They covered what you might expect - Michelle Obama's speech, Sanders events, Warren's speech, and so on. Then they said Trump would be speaking at a VFW event, and as it started, they began to cover it live. Trump said basically nothing, then turned it over to Pence. Pence talked for a minute or two, and then MSNBC left coverage and went back to covering the DNC. It's about time they started doing this.
A moment ago, they said again that Trump is speaking and they're going to go to it. They showed literally 7 seconds of him speaking, and then went to the current commercials they're in. It's about damn time they started talking over him like they do everybody else.
posted by cashman at 6:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
A moment ago, they said again that Trump is speaking and they're going to go to it. They showed literally 7 seconds of him speaking, and then went to the current commercials they're in. It's about damn time they started talking over him like they do everybody else.
posted by cashman at 6:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
it probably wouldn't be safe for Corb or any other NeverTrumper to go on national tv.
Maybe, but not for lack of our trying! But I actually think showcasing sad Bernie supporters crying and such is a sound political move, making people feel like they aren't being shut out. I wonder if the media has instructions accordingly.
posted by corb at 6:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
Maybe, but not for lack of our trying! But I actually think showcasing sad Bernie supporters crying and such is a sound political move, making people feel like they aren't being shut out. I wonder if the media has instructions accordingly.
posted by corb at 6:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
sallybrown: "The more I think about this, the more upset I get. He is a treasure and was treated like trash by a bunch of fools."
Looking ahead to tonight's schedule, they're going to have the Mothers of the Movement on. If the boo-ers act up during their segment, so help me...
posted by mhum at 7:05 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Looking ahead to tonight's schedule, they're going to have the Mothers of the Movement on. If the boo-ers act up during their segment, so help me...
posted by mhum at 7:05 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Looks like Bernie is already fed up with the CA delegation's immature temper-tantrums:
posted by zombieflanders at 7:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
It is easy to boo, but it is harder to look your kids in the face who would be living under a Donald Trump presidencyLet's hope they listen to him this time.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
Bernie Sanders tells @bpolitics breakfast w/reporters he'll return to the Senate as an Independent, not a Dem: 'I was elected as an Ind.'
posted by PenDevil at 7:14 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by PenDevil at 7:14 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Listening matters, but it's not visible. And you can't tout yourself as a good listener, because then you're talking and not listening. It has to come from other people.
Don't discount the network effect, I saw a brief interview of the Mothers of The Movement and appreciation of Hil listening seemed to have a profound impact on them. Multiplicative authenticity makes for a lotta votes.
posted by sammyo at 7:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Don't discount the network effect, I saw a brief interview of the Mothers of The Movement and appreciation of Hil listening seemed to have a profound impact on them. Multiplicative authenticity makes for a lotta votes.
posted by sammyo at 7:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Don't discount the network effect,
I don't. In fact, as a Hillary supporter, I see her "network" as an asset and as evidence that she'd be a good leader and President. I mean, there's a reason why so many Senators, Representatives, state Party officials, etc. endorsed and supported her -- she's a team player, she supports others, she gets people involved, she listens and tries to help. They see what she does behind the scenes and they know she'd do a great job as President.
The frustrating thing is that to people who hate Hillary, such facts are clear evidence of cronyism and corruption. Even her greatest strengths are used against her.
EDIT: I probably misread the comment I'm quoting; I don't really know what the network effect is.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
I don't. In fact, as a Hillary supporter, I see her "network" as an asset and as evidence that she'd be a good leader and President. I mean, there's a reason why so many Senators, Representatives, state Party officials, etc. endorsed and supported her -- she's a team player, she supports others, she gets people involved, she listens and tries to help. They see what she does behind the scenes and they know she'd do a great job as President.
The frustrating thing is that to people who hate Hillary, such facts are clear evidence of cronyism and corruption. Even her greatest strengths are used against her.
EDIT: I probably misread the comment I'm quoting; I don't really know what the network effect is.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
His big sell is "I can't be bought," and now journalists are digging in and finding that in fact he's essentially owned by Russian oligarch creditors. The only policy he cared about in the RNC platform was the Crimea plank. There are scores of other concerning connections.
I can remember back to when Republicans liked to imply Democrats were controlled by Moscow.
posted by Gelatin at 7:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
I can remember back to when Republicans liked to imply Democrats were controlled by Moscow.
posted by Gelatin at 7:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
Let's hope they listen to him this time.
From the responses already to that, I have my doubts. Lots of freshman-year political science theory being pushed as more important than the real-world consequences of a Trump administration. "Sure, Trump could lead us to war, the strengthening of white supremacy as an overt political force, trampling of civil liberties, etc, but, but, THEORETICAL POLITICAL IMPLICATION FROM MY UNDERGRADE DEBATE CLUB!"
posted by tocts at 7:31 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
From the responses already to that, I have my doubts. Lots of freshman-year political science theory being pushed as more important than the real-world consequences of a Trump administration. "Sure, Trump could lead us to war, the strengthening of white supremacy as an overt political force, trampling of civil liberties, etc, but, but, THEORETICAL POLITICAL IMPLICATION FROM MY UNDERGRADE DEBATE CLUB!"
posted by tocts at 7:31 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I am going to take some of this urging to get involved locally to heart. I could get behind a Green party in a serious way, but not a Jill Stein party. Let's get reasonable people to go Green.
posted by angrycat at 7:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by angrycat at 7:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Dave Weigel: Sanders warns his supporters against choosing a third party
posted by zombieflanders at 7:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
"I don't know the leadership of the Green Party, but I respect what they're trying to do," Sanders said, at a breakfast sponsored by Bloomberg Politics. "They're focusing on very, very important issues. But I think right now — what is it, three, four months before an election — you're gonna end up having a choice. Either Hillary Clinton is going to become president, or Donald Trump."Not that it'll keep Stein from pushing her accelerationist horseshit, but at least it'll give some of his supporters pause.
The Green Party, which has never again reached the heights of its 2000 performance under Ralph Nader, has held a series of Philadelphia events since the weekend aimed at convincing Sanders voters to make a "DemExit." Jill Stein, the party's likely nominee, has spoken even as rainstorms shut down meetings, repeatedly calling on Sanders to quit the Democrats and talk to her; Cornel West, a Sanders supporter who was one of his five appointees to the party's platform drafting committee, has appeared at Stein events and canceled at least one Democratic event around the convention.
Sanders, meanwhile, has declined to meet with the Greens, and urged his supporters to stay and change the Democrats.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
The network effect is when the value of a thing is proportional to the connections between units rather than the number of units themselves. The canonical example of this is a telephony network: the value of having a telephone isn't proportional to the number of telephone users (call it N), but to the number of connections between users (which varies as the square of N). This also applies to social networks, etc.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 7:37 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 7:37 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Let's hope they listen to him this time.
I think the problem is that they HAVE been listening to him, for months. During the primaries he said that she didn't have the judgment to be President, implied that she was in the pocket of Wall Street, that she is a corrupt, machine politician beholden to special interests, that she is simply more of the same status quo. As much as I want the protesters to be quiet and fall in line, they were sold a bill of goods by Bernie and they are right to question his motives today.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:37 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
I think the problem is that they HAVE been listening to him, for months. During the primaries he said that she didn't have the judgment to be President, implied that she was in the pocket of Wall Street, that she is a corrupt, machine politician beholden to special interests, that she is simply more of the same status quo. As much as I want the protesters to be quiet and fall in line, they were sold a bill of goods by Bernie and they are right to question his motives today.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:37 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
"I don't know the leadership of the Green Party, but I respect what they're trying to do," Sanders said, at a breakfast sponsored by Bloomberg Politics.
He couldn't say "I respect what the Green Party stands for but I've looked into Dr. Stein's stances and I don't agree with many of them. If you support my revolution, Clinton is a better fit and will be more effective."?
The way this is going, Clinton shouldn't send him onto the trail to stump for her, because he's pretty bad at it.
posted by sallybrown at 7:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
He couldn't say "I respect what the Green Party stands for but I've looked into Dr. Stein's stances and I don't agree with many of them. If you support my revolution, Clinton is a better fit and will be more effective."?
The way this is going, Clinton shouldn't send him onto the trail to stump for her, because he's pretty bad at it.
posted by sallybrown at 7:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
Booker responds to Trump: 'I love you'
“I love you, Donald. I pray for you. I hope that you find some kindness in your heart, that you’re not going to be somebody that spews out insults to your political opposition, that you’re going to start finding some ways to love,” Booker said. “I’m going to elevate him. I love you, I just don't want you to be my president. I don't want to you have the White House to be spewing that kind of mean-spirited hate that doesn’t even belong on a playground sandbox.”posted by dfan at 7:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [53 favorites]
Any Franken fans still reading might want to turn on MSNBC.
fans stitched together from the remnants of dead fans
damn MSNBC that is metal
posted by indubitable at 7:41 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
fans stitched together from the remnants of dead fans
damn MSNBC that is metal
posted by indubitable at 7:41 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
They couldn't field a single speaker over four days who could match just about anyone you'd care to pick from last night.
The GOP over four days couldn't field a single speaker who could match the quality of speech given by the person doing the musical interlude. It's that level of difference.
Fine words, alas, butter no parsnips, and some well-timed jackassery from Trump could end up prevailing, sweeping him to power on a tide of inchoate resentment.
All these assumptions that the Democrats have won with the sheer virtue of their ideas and quality of speech: it's almost as if nobody has read Shakespeare's Julius Caesar...
posted by acb at 7:44 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
The GOP over four days couldn't field a single speaker who could match the quality of speech given by the person doing the musical interlude. It's that level of difference.
Fine words, alas, butter no parsnips, and some well-timed jackassery from Trump could end up prevailing, sweeping him to power on a tide of inchoate resentment.
All these assumptions that the Democrats have won with the sheer virtue of their ideas and quality of speech: it's almost as if nobody has read Shakespeare's Julius Caesar...
posted by acb at 7:44 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
He couldn't say "I respect what the Green Party stands for but I've looked into Dr. Stein's stances and I don't agree with many of them. If you support my revolution, Clinton is a better fit and will be more effective."?
Given what we've seen from the die-hard Sanders supporters at the DNC, they might have thrown something at him. I'm not sure there's any convincing them that Clinton is anything better than a demon in human skin that they can make common cause with.
I would have liked to see Sanders deliver a more direct call to action for his supporters last night, in terms of the ongoing challenges of electing a Congress that's not 60% dickheads. "Our job now is to see that platform implemented by a Democratic Senate, a Democratic House and a Hillary Clinton presidency – and I am going to do everything I can to make that happen" is a good sentiment, but distinctly lacking in a plan of attack for the people who gave money and time to him.
If I were a speechwriter, he'd have ended with something along the lines of, "the way to continue our revolution is for everyone who voted for me to find progressive candidates for the House, for the Senate, for governor, for your state legislature, for city council, and help them get elected -- and if you cannot find a candidate to support, consider becoming that candidate yourself." Something to use that national TV spot to encourage his supporters to stick around and stay politically active, because that's what's killed the Democratic Party for basically my whole life.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 7:48 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Given what we've seen from the die-hard Sanders supporters at the DNC, they might have thrown something at him. I'm not sure there's any convincing them that Clinton is anything better than a demon in human skin that they can make common cause with.
I would have liked to see Sanders deliver a more direct call to action for his supporters last night, in terms of the ongoing challenges of electing a Congress that's not 60% dickheads. "Our job now is to see that platform implemented by a Democratic Senate, a Democratic House and a Hillary Clinton presidency – and I am going to do everything I can to make that happen" is a good sentiment, but distinctly lacking in a plan of attack for the people who gave money and time to him.
If I were a speechwriter, he'd have ended with something along the lines of, "the way to continue our revolution is for everyone who voted for me to find progressive candidates for the House, for the Senate, for governor, for your state legislature, for city council, and help them get elected -- and if you cannot find a candidate to support, consider becoming that candidate yourself." Something to use that national TV spot to encourage his supporters to stick around and stay politically active, because that's what's killed the Democratic Party for basically my whole life.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 7:48 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Booker responds to Trump: 'I love you'
So... Booker is in favor of legalization then?
posted by schmod at 7:48 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
So... Booker is in favor of legalization then?
posted by schmod at 7:48 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Bit of a pickle developing: who is going to officially put Hillary Clinton's name in nomination?
- "NBC News has learned negotiations are underway to have Bernie Sanders officially nominate Hillary Clinton at the end of tonight's roll call."
- ".@SenatorBarb tells Md. delegation that she and @repjohnlewis will formally submit Clinton's name for nomination tonight."
On the one hand, gives Bernie another chance to more explicitly encourage his Busters to support Hillary. On the other hand, Bernie has had PLENTY of time, why continue to pander to the kind of idiots who would shout down Rep. Cummings, Mikulski and Lewis (in addition to being in my personal pantheon of gods) have been stalwart Clinton supporters, and this would put this focus back where it belongs - on Hillary. (Frankly, Mikulski deserves to be lauded to the max as she retires this year - one of the most underrated people in politics - and I wish she had a larger speaking role this week. She is one of the giants (hee) whose shoulders Hillary is standing on.)
What's the right strategic move, here?
posted by sallybrown at 7:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
- "NBC News has learned negotiations are underway to have Bernie Sanders officially nominate Hillary Clinton at the end of tonight's roll call."
- ".@SenatorBarb tells Md. delegation that she and @repjohnlewis will formally submit Clinton's name for nomination tonight."
On the one hand, gives Bernie another chance to more explicitly encourage his Busters to support Hillary. On the other hand, Bernie has had PLENTY of time, why continue to pander to the kind of idiots who would shout down Rep. Cummings, Mikulski and Lewis (in addition to being in my personal pantheon of gods) have been stalwart Clinton supporters, and this would put this focus back where it belongs - on Hillary. (Frankly, Mikulski deserves to be lauded to the max as she retires this year - one of the most underrated people in politics - and I wish she had a larger speaking role this week. She is one of the giants (hee) whose shoulders Hillary is standing on.)
What's the right strategic move, here?
posted by sallybrown at 7:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
(Tho I met Lucy Mondale that year and she was awesome, RIP.)
Because I'm anal about things like this even at the end of a multi-thousand comment internet thread, I'll note that after I checked my memories against the google, I was reminded that it was Eleanor, Walter Mondale's daughter, who died in 2011 and Lucy, Mondale's niece, who was campaigning for him that year. Lucy is AFAICT still among us.
posted by octobersurprise at 7:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Because I'm anal about things like this even at the end of a multi-thousand comment internet thread, I'll note that after I checked my memories against the google, I was reminded that it was Eleanor, Walter Mondale's daughter, who died in 2011 and Lucy, Mondale's niece, who was campaigning for him that year. Lucy is AFAICT still among us.
posted by octobersurprise at 7:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
“I love you, Donald. I pray for you."
The master class don't-try-it-at-home ninja shade version of "bless your heart."
posted by sallybrown at 7:51 AM on July 26, 2016 [60 favorites]
The master class don't-try-it-at-home ninja shade version of "bless your heart."
posted by sallybrown at 7:51 AM on July 26, 2016 [60 favorites]
I am going to take some of this urging to get involved locally to heart. I could get behind a Green party in a serious way, but not a Jill Stein party. Let's get reasonable people to go Green.
I honestly think the Green Party is too much of a mess to really be worth trying to save from the anti-vaccination people and accelerationists who currently seem to be running it, inasmuch as running a no-hope presidential campaign every four years and doing almost nothing else is running a political party. If people want to get involved with a left-wing third party, I've heard good things about the Democratic Socialists of America and the Party for Socialism and Liberation, although I can't vouch for either personally. I do think either would be a better choice for leftist efforts at political change than the Green Party.
posted by Copronymus at 7:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
I honestly think the Green Party is too much of a mess to really be worth trying to save from the anti-vaccination people and accelerationists who currently seem to be running it, inasmuch as running a no-hope presidential campaign every four years and doing almost nothing else is running a political party. If people want to get involved with a left-wing third party, I've heard good things about the Democratic Socialists of America and the Party for Socialism and Liberation, although I can't vouch for either personally. I do think either would be a better choice for leftist efforts at political change than the Green Party.
posted by Copronymus at 7:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
That Booker quote is an excellent example of noncomplementarity behavior! (If that word makes me sound smart it's because I listen to Invisibilia)
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:55 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 7:55 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
As much as I want the protesters to be quiet and fall in line, they were sold a bill of goods by Bernie and they are right to question his motives today.
Welcome to elective politics.
The way this is going, Clinton shouldn't send [Sanders] onto the trail to stump for her, because he's pretty bad at it.
Hmm. Well he's already reverted to not-a-democrat. Maybe if they write him a script and he sticks to it. Sanders just barely did what he needed to do last night. If he truly doesn't want Trump to be president he has a lot of work to do, but there's little reason for the Dems to trust him without supervision. And he has little reason to accept that (apart from genuine revulsion at the prospect of a Trump presidency) .
If the polls begin to show her winning handily, I'd expect to hear less and less from Sanders as an official Hillary spokesman.
posted by Herodios at 7:56 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Welcome to elective politics.
The way this is going, Clinton shouldn't send [Sanders] onto the trail to stump for her, because he's pretty bad at it.
Hmm. Well he's already reverted to not-a-democrat. Maybe if they write him a script and he sticks to it. Sanders just barely did what he needed to do last night. If he truly doesn't want Trump to be president he has a lot of work to do, but there's little reason for the Dems to trust him without supervision. And he has little reason to accept that (apart from genuine revulsion at the prospect of a Trump presidency) .
If the polls begin to show her winning handily, I'd expect to hear less and less from Sanders as an official Hillary spokesman.
posted by Herodios at 7:56 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Greg Nog, where did that quote come from?
posted by cooker girl at 7:56 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by cooker girl at 7:56 AM on July 26, 2016
I kind of don't expect him to be stumping for her at all. I can see him campaigning for down ticket races though, especially in areas that are his turf or nearby.
I just don't really see their messages as very compatible (Strength through Unity versus Revolution) and the more he tries to marry the two the more sort of weak it sounds. He did what he needed to last night, and that's great! Now let's let Clinton and Kaine take their message to the people.
posted by lazaruslong at 7:58 AM on July 26, 2016
I just don't really see their messages as very compatible (Strength through Unity versus Revolution) and the more he tries to marry the two the more sort of weak it sounds. He did what he needed to last night, and that's great! Now let's let Clinton and Kaine take their message to the people.
posted by lazaruslong at 7:58 AM on July 26, 2016
Dan Casey: Trump melts down in the Hotel Roanoke, literally
Memo to Donald Trump: It gets hot in Virginia in July, buster. Suck it up. There’s nothing you can do about that. Deal with itposted by zombieflanders at 8:02 AM on July 26, 2016 [44 favorites]
[...]
[I]n the biggest room in the finest hotel in Roanoke, along with at least 1,600 chanting and cheering Trumpeteers, the candidate trained his attention-deficit-disordered thoughts on a purely apolitical topic: The room was too hot.
He whined and whined about The Hotel Roanoke’s air conditioning. No kidding.
“I think this ballroom and the people who run this hotel should be ashamed,” Trump told the crowd. “I think it’s actually cooler outside than it is in this damn ballroom.” (It wasn’t.)
He boasted there were 1,000 people standing outside on the Wells Avenue side in 104-degree heat, listening to him on loudspeakers. (There weren’t; there were at most 50, according to a city firefighter who was outside, and the temperature never hit 100.)
Perhaps jokingly, Trump suggested he wouldn’t pay the bill — after his campaign apparatus commandeered a large chunk of the hotel for most of the day. Trump’s a tough guy, see. Nobody takes advantage of him. Especially, whoever runs the thermostat.
“I feel like I’m in a sauna. I don’t know what hotel this is,” Trump went on. “You let people suffer and don’t turn on the air conditioning. This is ridiculous.”
It was ridiculous, but not in the way Trump intended. The ridiculous part was him standing there wailing about it.
He suggested the hotel turned off the AC to save money. (It didn’t. The main ballroom’s air conditioning was set at 63 degrees. “We did have it set as low as it could possibly go,” said Michael Quonce, the hotel’s public relations manager. “It was running at 99 percent efficiency.”)
Trump’s comments were chintzy, low-rent, third-rate and wholly unbecoming for a major party presidential nominee. But they are pure Trump, full of narcissistic bullying, worrying about his own comfort, picking on an entity that can’t pick back.
To Bernie Bros and Republicans, there is absolutely nothing anyone (Clinton or Sanders) can say to make them wake up.
I remember when Obama got elected and here in Virginia sore losers got disgusting, racist, homophobic anti-Obama bumper stickers. After the election these people actually wanted to country to fall apart if only to prove their point. I was secretly giddy thinking well, reality will prove them wrong! I was even naïve to think maybe their next candidate will not win the primaries by saying incredibly alienating stuff to women and minorities.
Then Obama is almost done, the world didn't end, and watching the RNC I realized republicans don't actually think reality proved them wrong. They are convinced the country is in shambles. Their new candidate is even nuttier than the nuttiest career politician.
I don't entertain the same illusions I had in 2008 about them waking up after Hillary is president and doesn't eat the children/kill the troops/burn the flag. The next election, when we are closer to universal health care and tuition free public schools than ever before, they will come with an even more deluded perception of reality, and maybe with an even crazier candidate (if that is possible).
My only hope is that more and more people will see the lunacy on their own accord and defect. Maybe to start a new fiscally conservative / socially liberal party. But honestly nothing that comes from the Democratic party or the "liberal media" will convince them.
posted by Tarumba at 8:04 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I remember when Obama got elected and here in Virginia sore losers got disgusting, racist, homophobic anti-Obama bumper stickers. After the election these people actually wanted to country to fall apart if only to prove their point. I was secretly giddy thinking well, reality will prove them wrong! I was even naïve to think maybe their next candidate will not win the primaries by saying incredibly alienating stuff to women and minorities.
Then Obama is almost done, the world didn't end, and watching the RNC I realized republicans don't actually think reality proved them wrong. They are convinced the country is in shambles. Their new candidate is even nuttier than the nuttiest career politician.
I don't entertain the same illusions I had in 2008 about them waking up after Hillary is president and doesn't eat the children/kill the troops/burn the flag. The next election, when we are closer to universal health care and tuition free public schools than ever before, they will come with an even more deluded perception of reality, and maybe with an even crazier candidate (if that is possible).
My only hope is that more and more people will see the lunacy on their own accord and defect. Maybe to start a new fiscally conservative / socially liberal party. But honestly nothing that comes from the Democratic party or the "liberal media" will convince them.
posted by Tarumba at 8:04 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Greg Nog, where did that quote come from?
I'm not Greg Nog. I don't even like nutmeg. But I found it on Vox along with the transcript of Ezra Klein's interview.
"It turned out that Clinton, in her travels, stuffed notes from her conversations . . . " [Hillary listens]
This is maybe the single most sellable thing I've heard that I can bring up when I'm campaigning for Clinton.
When I took adult education (that is, education of adults) they stressed 'listening'. One instructor said a teacher should spend 30% of their time talking and 70% listening. What about really hard subjects? Listen more.
This is good advice for any profession: teacher, clergy, politician, auto mechanic, software programmer . . .
This is good contrast with Trump and the GOP.
Trumps says he will . . . / We listened to you and you told us you want . . .
Trumps says he has . . . / We listened to you and you told us you need . . .
Trump says he thinks . . . / We listened to you and you told us you think . . .
Trump gave his opinion . . . / We heard your opinion . . .
etc.
Just a thought.
posted by Herodios at 8:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
I'm not Greg Nog. I don't even like nutmeg. But I found it on Vox along with the transcript of Ezra Klein's interview.
"It turned out that Clinton, in her travels, stuffed notes from her conversations . . . " [Hillary listens]
This is maybe the single most sellable thing I've heard that I can bring up when I'm campaigning for Clinton.
When I took adult education (that is, education of adults) they stressed 'listening'. One instructor said a teacher should spend 30% of their time talking and 70% listening. What about really hard subjects? Listen more.
This is good advice for any profession: teacher, clergy, politician, auto mechanic, software programmer . . .
This is good contrast with Trump and the GOP.
Trumps says he will . . . / We listened to you and you told us you want . . .
Trumps says he has . . . / We listened to you and you told us you need . . .
Trump says he thinks . . . / We listened to you and you told us you think . . .
Trump gave his opinion . . . / We heard your opinion . . .
etc.
Just a thought.
posted by Herodios at 8:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
Thanks! I knew it had to be one of the linked articles, just didn't know which one.
posted by cooker girl at 8:12 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by cooker girl at 8:12 AM on July 26, 2016
What's the right strategic move, here?
It's to pull a Pelosi - make sure the fractious and divided and acrimonious elements of the party are in unified lockstep in the face of existential danger to the nation. The Democratic wing of the House was a goddamn rock during the Debt Ceiling crisis. There was talk about her regaining the Speaker title when Boehner was about to be ousted the first time, because not only could she command all of her own party's votes, she might have the pull to get some moderate R's to vote her in.
Hillary is showing she has her ducks lined up in a row, and despite the noise, when the rubber meets the road, everyone who matters in the party is lined up and ready to do their part. Even if they're going to go back to being Socialist Democrats after the election.
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:15 AM on July 26, 2016
It's to pull a Pelosi - make sure the fractious and divided and acrimonious elements of the party are in unified lockstep in the face of existential danger to the nation. The Democratic wing of the House was a goddamn rock during the Debt Ceiling crisis. There was talk about her regaining the Speaker title when Boehner was about to be ousted the first time, because not only could she command all of her own party's votes, she might have the pull to get some moderate R's to vote her in.
Hillary is showing she has her ducks lined up in a row, and despite the noise, when the rubber meets the road, everyone who matters in the party is lined up and ready to do their part. Even if they're going to go back to being Socialist Democrats after the election.
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:15 AM on July 26, 2016
I think there are narcissists on both ends. Politics draws them in. I do some advocacy work in liberal causes (climate change, mostly) and every meeting involves two or three clinically self-involved people who give endless slow speeches and cry and make fists and talk about how the people are asleep and rakka rakka.
It's always best to keep a minimal eye on those people and then keep them out of decision making, because they will always and forever act out their emotional deficits through politics.
They've accreted in Bernie's campaign. They'll never get along for very long because narcissists cannot get along. But for this brief moment, there they are, chanting over Elijah Cummings and sitting down in a huff for Michelle Obama. In the end, they don't matter, they aren't persuadable anyway.
Just steadily rise above. Michelle Obama is a leader this way: That was a perfect, authentic representaion of grace and steady conviction. They go down, we go up.
posted by argybarg at 8:18 AM on July 26, 2016 [30 favorites]
It's always best to keep a minimal eye on those people and then keep them out of decision making, because they will always and forever act out their emotional deficits through politics.
They've accreted in Bernie's campaign. They'll never get along for very long because narcissists cannot get along. But for this brief moment, there they are, chanting over Elijah Cummings and sitting down in a huff for Michelle Obama. In the end, they don't matter, they aren't persuadable anyway.
Just steadily rise above. Michelle Obama is a leader this way: That was a perfect, authentic representaion of grace and steady conviction. They go down, we go up.
posted by argybarg at 8:18 AM on July 26, 2016 [30 favorites]
Sanders just barely did what he needed to do last night.
This thread sometimes feels like the #NeverBernie bizarro inverse of the Bernie or Bust crowd. Apparently the only thing Bernie could do to satisfy some people is go back in time and never have run in the first place. He gave a full-throated, unqualified endorsement, and asked his supporters to please listen. He's not a magician, and they have minds of their own. He could've pulled a Ted Cruz, but he didn't. He did the right thing. Give him some credit.
posted by dis_integration at 8:20 AM on July 26, 2016 [72 favorites]
This thread sometimes feels like the #NeverBernie bizarro inverse of the Bernie or Bust crowd. Apparently the only thing Bernie could do to satisfy some people is go back in time and never have run in the first place. He gave a full-throated, unqualified endorsement, and asked his supporters to please listen. He's not a magician, and they have minds of their own. He could've pulled a Ted Cruz, but he didn't. He did the right thing. Give him some credit.
posted by dis_integration at 8:20 AM on July 26, 2016 [72 favorites]
Yes, I really think this relatively small portion of his supporters are beyond his own reach. All of the others have moved on and will vote Hillary.
posted by Tarumba at 8:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Tarumba at 8:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
He certainly did the right thing, but super belatedly. The texts to stop disrupting should have been more frequent and forceful. He should have said something very similar to what Sarah Silverman said.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Then Obama is almost done, the world didn't end, and watching the RNC I realized republicans don't actually think reality proved them wrong. They are convinced the country is in shambles.
That's because they turn on their radio stations and are told that THEIR COUNTRY has been stolen and is dying. They turn on Fox News and are told that. They open their newspaper and the editorials and columnists say the same. They get online and their Facebook feeds and blogs reinforce it. They talk to other conservatives and they're hearing the same things. Why would they believe any differently?
What they don't get is that they're in an echo chamber. My nickname for it is the Mirror Universe Media, and it is a very deliberate creation by right-wing think tanks over many decades, a perfect storm of deregulation and spending power and tuned messaging. They use "Mainstream Media" as a pejorative because it's HORRIBLY BIASED and ULTRA LEFT WING because it doesn't jive with what they believe, and are aggressively uninterested in comparing notes to see which one is more accurate.
How do you turn people like these around? By letting them see for themselves that some of what they're told is horrible bullshit, and that said bullshit AFFECTS THEM. People do not think about their politics unless issues of the day DIRECTLY hit their jobs, their wallets, their families or their friends. Gays marrying? HORRIBLE HORRIBLE AGAINST GOD'S WILL HORRIBLE oh wait, there's a couple down the block from me and one I work with and Cousin Abbie just came out and THEY'RE all nice people and normal... *sound of brain engaging a wee bit* Bombing the shit out of the Middle East? Sounds great to me! Hey, Johnny down the block just came back with PTSD and one leg and now they want to send my son over there. *sound of brain jumpstarting*
Sometimes that sinks in. Sometimes it doesn't, or they rationalize it differently for themselves (c.f. MY abortion was a hard choice and my own business, YOURS is against God's will you horrible welfare cheat). Macroeconomics is a harder sell because there's always some conservative screaming HIGHER TAXES AFFECT YOU and it takes patience to realize that slashed social programs, depleted schools, decaying infrastructure and such ALSO affect you.
posted by delfin at 8:22 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
That's because they turn on their radio stations and are told that THEIR COUNTRY has been stolen and is dying. They turn on Fox News and are told that. They open their newspaper and the editorials and columnists say the same. They get online and their Facebook feeds and blogs reinforce it. They talk to other conservatives and they're hearing the same things. Why would they believe any differently?
What they don't get is that they're in an echo chamber. My nickname for it is the Mirror Universe Media, and it is a very deliberate creation by right-wing think tanks over many decades, a perfect storm of deregulation and spending power and tuned messaging. They use "Mainstream Media" as a pejorative because it's HORRIBLY BIASED and ULTRA LEFT WING because it doesn't jive with what they believe, and are aggressively uninterested in comparing notes to see which one is more accurate.
How do you turn people like these around? By letting them see for themselves that some of what they're told is horrible bullshit, and that said bullshit AFFECTS THEM. People do not think about their politics unless issues of the day DIRECTLY hit their jobs, their wallets, their families or their friends. Gays marrying? HORRIBLE HORRIBLE AGAINST GOD'S WILL HORRIBLE oh wait, there's a couple down the block from me and one I work with and Cousin Abbie just came out and THEY'RE all nice people and normal... *sound of brain engaging a wee bit* Bombing the shit out of the Middle East? Sounds great to me! Hey, Johnny down the block just came back with PTSD and one leg and now they want to send my son over there. *sound of brain jumpstarting*
Sometimes that sinks in. Sometimes it doesn't, or they rationalize it differently for themselves (c.f. MY abortion was a hard choice and my own business, YOURS is against God's will you horrible welfare cheat). Macroeconomics is a harder sell because there's always some conservative screaming HIGHER TAXES AFFECT YOU and it takes patience to realize that slashed social programs, depleted schools, decaying infrastructure and such ALSO affect you.
posted by delfin at 8:22 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
Actually, I think Bernie understands his followers and knows he could have alienated them forever and we'd have worse chaos. He did well, I think.
posted by argybarg at 8:23 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 8:23 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
maybe with an even crazier candidate (if that is possible)
Gohmert - Bachmann 2020!
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:23 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Gohmert - Bachmann 2020!
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:23 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Mikulski and Lewis (in addition to being in my personal pantheon of gods) have been stalwart Clinton supporters, and this would put this focus back where it belongs - on Hillary. (Frankly, Mikulski deserves to be lauded to the max as she retires this year - one of the most underrated people in politics - and I wish she had a larger speaking role this week. She is one of the giants (hee) whose shoulders Hillary is standing on.)
This is sort of the way I'm leaning. I was definitely a fan of the pro-unity message last night, even when I chafed a bit at some of the more Bernie-and-Hillary instead of Hillary-and-Bernie stuff. Necessary, maybe, but it reminded me a bit too much of the way that women don't get credit for their ideas until those ideas are spoken by a man. I much preferred the people who spoke of the two teams coming together to construct the most progressive platform ever, because it hits back against the meme that Hillary has no true progressive beliefs of her own and has to be "dragged" leftward, kicking and screaming.
(Incidentally, I can't tell you how happy I'll be when I don't have to hear about Hillary Clinton being "dragged" anywhere again.)
But it's time to move forward, and it's time to celebrate and honor other long-time Democratic women leaders like Mikulski. Any remaining Bernie dead-enders aren't going to come around at this point - or, if they are, they'll need more than a day or two. I hope it doesn't take them longer than the next few months, at any rate, but we can't wait for them any longer. Bernie has spoken and endorsed and was warmly received by the entire crowd, and I don't want the rest of the convention held hostage to a minority of disgruntled people who wouldn't be satisfied by anything less than having the nomination snatched away from Hillary entirely.
posted by Salieri at 8:23 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
This is sort of the way I'm leaning. I was definitely a fan of the pro-unity message last night, even when I chafed a bit at some of the more Bernie-and-Hillary instead of Hillary-and-Bernie stuff. Necessary, maybe, but it reminded me a bit too much of the way that women don't get credit for their ideas until those ideas are spoken by a man. I much preferred the people who spoke of the two teams coming together to construct the most progressive platform ever, because it hits back against the meme that Hillary has no true progressive beliefs of her own and has to be "dragged" leftward, kicking and screaming.
(Incidentally, I can't tell you how happy I'll be when I don't have to hear about Hillary Clinton being "dragged" anywhere again.)
But it's time to move forward, and it's time to celebrate and honor other long-time Democratic women leaders like Mikulski. Any remaining Bernie dead-enders aren't going to come around at this point - or, if they are, they'll need more than a day or two. I hope it doesn't take them longer than the next few months, at any rate, but we can't wait for them any longer. Bernie has spoken and endorsed and was warmly received by the entire crowd, and I don't want the rest of the convention held hostage to a minority of disgruntled people who wouldn't be satisfied by anything less than having the nomination snatched away from Hillary entirely.
posted by Salieri at 8:23 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
Bachmann-Gohmert Overdrive
progressive rock band name claimed
posted by delfin at 8:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
progressive rock band name claimed
posted by delfin at 8:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
If people want to get involved with a left-wing third party, I've heard good things about the Democratic Socialists of America and the Party for Socialism and Liberation, although I can't vouch for either personally. I do think either would be a better choice for leftist efforts at political change than the Green Party.
DSA and PSL have the disadvantage of barely existing, though — I don't think DSA runs candidates for anything, and most of the time when PSL tries to run people they end up running on the ballot lines for other small parties (most often the Green Party).
I used to think Socialist Alternative was decent, based almost entirely on their success in Seattle with Kshama Sawant, but despite that success — and Sawant really has meaningfully, positively changed the Seattle city council — the national/international organization has decided for whatever reason that the important thing to do this year is not to focus on municipal elections, but instead to play silly bomb-lobbing games at the fringes of the presidential election. shruggie.
protip: Maybe the simplest way to sort out meaningful left political formations from zany revolution LARPers is to talk to their organizers and see whether or not they try to sell you newspapers. If they seem otherwise reasonable but are nevertheless dead set on trying to get you to buy a newsletter that no one reads about the Importance! Of! Their! Exact! Type! Of! Socialism!, you have every right to back away slowly.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
DSA and PSL have the disadvantage of barely existing, though — I don't think DSA runs candidates for anything, and most of the time when PSL tries to run people they end up running on the ballot lines for other small parties (most often the Green Party).
I used to think Socialist Alternative was decent, based almost entirely on their success in Seattle with Kshama Sawant, but despite that success — and Sawant really has meaningfully, positively changed the Seattle city council — the national/international organization has decided for whatever reason that the important thing to do this year is not to focus on municipal elections, but instead to play silly bomb-lobbing games at the fringes of the presidential election. shruggie.
protip: Maybe the simplest way to sort out meaningful left political formations from zany revolution LARPers is to talk to their organizers and see whether or not they try to sell you newspapers. If they seem otherwise reasonable but are nevertheless dead set on trying to get you to buy a newsletter that no one reads about the Importance! Of! Their! Exact! Type! Of! Socialism!, you have every right to back away slowly.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
To Bernie Bros and Republicans, there is absolutely nothing anyone (Clinton or Sanders) can say to make them wake up.
It's gotten to where I don't even challenge the arguments of my Republican family members on Facebook. "Hillary is a perjurer!" Just because the House wants to start yet another investigation into . . . ugh, never mind. "Trump's protestors are paid by George Soros!" Look, I found an article that shows that this is . . . why even post it? Do you ever listen? Posting documented proof of Trump's racism, from 1973, upon request didn't work on you. What could?
I want to yell at my intransigent lefty friends more, because I respect them more, but I don't, not yet. It's not even August; I'd get hoarse. We really are all in this together, even the Trump voters, if they only knew it.
posted by Countess Elena at 8:26 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
It's gotten to where I don't even challenge the arguments of my Republican family members on Facebook. "Hillary is a perjurer!" Just because the House wants to start yet another investigation into . . . ugh, never mind. "Trump's protestors are paid by George Soros!" Look, I found an article that shows that this is . . . why even post it? Do you ever listen? Posting documented proof of Trump's racism, from 1973, upon request didn't work on you. What could?
I want to yell at my intransigent lefty friends more, because I respect them more, but I don't, not yet. It's not even August; I'd get hoarse. We really are all in this together, even the Trump voters, if they only knew it.
posted by Countess Elena at 8:26 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
I wish Bernie had told his supporters to stop being so goddamn rude. I'm still mad about Elijah Cummings being chanted over.
posted by yasaman at 8:26 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 8:26 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
protip: Maybe the simplest way to sort out meaningful left political formations from zany revolution LARPers is to talk to their organizers and see whether or not they try to sell you newspapers. If they seem otherwise reasonable but are nevertheless dead set on trying to get you to buy a newsletter that no one reads about the Importance! Of! Their! Exact! Type! Of! Socialism!, you have every right to back away slowly.
What, you mean you don't subscribe to the ALL HAIL BOB AVAKIAN daily?
posted by dis_integration at 8:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
What, you mean you don't subscribe to the ALL HAIL BOB AVAKIAN daily?
posted by dis_integration at 8:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Bernie did great last night. The problem is that he called her dishonest and untrustworthy for pretty much the entirety of his campaign, and you can't just tell people to forget those words. Either he meant them then and he's capitulating now, or he never meant them and he was lying to get votes. I certainly don't want to go back in time and prevent him from running; I like that the platform is further to the left than it's been in a long time. Truth be told, I'm pretty much a socialist AND I'm a fervent Clinton supporter. I contain multitudes!
It doesn't matter in the end which it was. The damage has been done and the BoBs won't come around. I'm hopeful, though, that most of Sanders' supporters do come around, or have come around.
posted by cooker girl at 8:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [24 favorites]
It doesn't matter in the end which it was. The damage has been done and the BoBs won't come around. I'm hopeful, though, that most of Sanders' supporters do come around, or have come around.
posted by cooker girl at 8:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [24 favorites]
> What, you mean you don't subscribe to the ALL HAIL BOB AVAKIAN daily?
look man everyone knows that if you sell enough copies of Socialist Worker the revolution happens. It's magic.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
look man everyone knows that if you sell enough copies of Socialist Worker the revolution happens. It's magic.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
I kind of don't expect him to be stumping for her at all. I can see him campaigning for down ticket races though, especially in areas that are his turf or nearby.
That's why I hedged my bets upthread. Sanders has always been most comfortable as a party of one, because he doesn't have to respond to other candidates diverging from his message, and he also potentially puts others on the spot if he makes claims or proposals that they haven't made. Yes to fundraising and directing people to volunteer (down the ballot, for sure) but I think there'll be a pause while he decompresses from the campaign, and long discussions about where he can be useful.
zombieflanders: it may be interesting when Trump has to go to more small cities and his uncontrollable control-freakism and love of excess pours out. Roanoke has a lot of civic pride -- the city just nabbed Deschutes's eastern brewery after a big campaign -- and if the small-town paper is treating him like a vulgar visitor, that might be a pattern we see repeated. We already know that he flies back to one of his homes every night, that he doesn't shake hands, that his three oldest kids are his main filter: while there have been many populists who don't really like people, the general election campaign demands a willingness to tolerate them.
posted by holgate at 8:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
That's why I hedged my bets upthread. Sanders has always been most comfortable as a party of one, because he doesn't have to respond to other candidates diverging from his message, and he also potentially puts others on the spot if he makes claims or proposals that they haven't made. Yes to fundraising and directing people to volunteer (down the ballot, for sure) but I think there'll be a pause while he decompresses from the campaign, and long discussions about where he can be useful.
zombieflanders: it may be interesting when Trump has to go to more small cities and his uncontrollable control-freakism and love of excess pours out. Roanoke has a lot of civic pride -- the city just nabbed Deschutes's eastern brewery after a big campaign -- and if the small-town paper is treating him like a vulgar visitor, that might be a pattern we see repeated. We already know that he flies back to one of his homes every night, that he doesn't shake hands, that his three oldest kids are his main filter: while there have been many populists who don't really like people, the general election campaign demands a willingness to tolerate them.
posted by holgate at 8:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Day 2 of RNC had Rudy Giuliani.
Day 2 of DNC includes Joe Sweeney, an NYPD detective who spent time digging for survivors on 9/11, and Lauren Manning, an executive at Cantor Fitzgerald who was burned on more of 82% of her body on 9/11.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:32 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Day 2 of DNC includes Joe Sweeney, an NYPD detective who spent time digging for survivors on 9/11, and Lauren Manning, an executive at Cantor Fitzgerald who was burned on more of 82% of her body on 9/11.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:32 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Well put, Hall and Oates.
posted by persona au gratin at 8:34 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by persona au gratin at 8:34 AM on July 26, 2016
This is maybe the single most sellable thing I've heard that I can bring up when I'm campaigning for Clinton.
They're actually missing a key point.
I mentioned this in a thread during the primaries: During those listening tours, Clinton took the time to visit every single New York county (all 62) to learn as much as she could about the state and what mattered to the people who lived here. She did that every year she was a Senator. The idea was originally suggested to Clinton by a former aide to Daniel Patrick Moynihan, Mandy Grunwald, who is now Clinton's senior communications advisor. Moynihan himself used to visit every New York county annually and that was one of the reasons for his popularity.
As the vox piece notes, it wasn't for show. She learned from that tour. The people she met spoke to her about their wants and needs and dreams -- and shockingly, she really was listening and learning and paying attention. So when it came time to talk about legislation she wanted to introduce, or bills she could co-sponsor, what they had told her was taken into consideration. We know this because of the kinds of bills she sponsored and co-sponsored, and because the speeches she gave often cited people she had spoken to.
Her popularity soared. So now, Chuck Schumer and Kirsten Gillibrand make it their business to visit every single New York county at least once a year, to meet with their constituents. It makes them better Senators.
If you listen to her speak and read her books, it quickly becomes very clear that Clinton views public service as a way for her to help people, and she not only takes that responsibility very seriously, but also cares very deeply about it. It's also not mentioned much in the media, but while Clinton was a Senator she worked with Republicans pretty extensively on ways to improve quality of life for veterans. Healthcare. Financial aid. Education grants and opportunities. She was also one of the Senators who called for an investigation into armor quality and availability for soldiers stationed in Iraq. She worked with people like Tom Delay, who tried to get her husband impeached. Why? Helping people was more important than carrying a grudge.
I am so very tired of the endless string of non-scandals that the Republicans have tried to pin on her for decades. She's got a good record on many issues, and that deserves to be mentioned -- especially since she's up against someone with no record of public service.
posted by zarq at 8:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [124 favorites]
They're actually missing a key point.
I mentioned this in a thread during the primaries: During those listening tours, Clinton took the time to visit every single New York county (all 62) to learn as much as she could about the state and what mattered to the people who lived here. She did that every year she was a Senator. The idea was originally suggested to Clinton by a former aide to Daniel Patrick Moynihan, Mandy Grunwald, who is now Clinton's senior communications advisor. Moynihan himself used to visit every New York county annually and that was one of the reasons for his popularity.
As the vox piece notes, it wasn't for show. She learned from that tour. The people she met spoke to her about their wants and needs and dreams -- and shockingly, she really was listening and learning and paying attention. So when it came time to talk about legislation she wanted to introduce, or bills she could co-sponsor, what they had told her was taken into consideration. We know this because of the kinds of bills she sponsored and co-sponsored, and because the speeches she gave often cited people she had spoken to.
Her popularity soared. So now, Chuck Schumer and Kirsten Gillibrand make it their business to visit every single New York county at least once a year, to meet with their constituents. It makes them better Senators.
If you listen to her speak and read her books, it quickly becomes very clear that Clinton views public service as a way for her to help people, and she not only takes that responsibility very seriously, but also cares very deeply about it. It's also not mentioned much in the media, but while Clinton was a Senator she worked with Republicans pretty extensively on ways to improve quality of life for veterans. Healthcare. Financial aid. Education grants and opportunities. She was also one of the Senators who called for an investigation into armor quality and availability for soldiers stationed in Iraq. She worked with people like Tom Delay, who tried to get her husband impeached. Why? Helping people was more important than carrying a grudge.
I am so very tired of the endless string of non-scandals that the Republicans have tried to pin on her for decades. She's got a good record on many issues, and that deserves to be mentioned -- especially since she's up against someone with no record of public service.
posted by zarq at 8:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [124 favorites]
> I wish Bernie had told his supporters to stop being so goddamn rude. I'm still mad about Elijah Cummings being chanted over.
posted by yasaman at 8:26 AM on July 26 [2 favorites +] [!]
okay so on the one hand I feel you re: chanting over Cummings. That was a bad look.
But on the other hand, avoiding rudeness absolutely positively cannot be a primary goal of a political organization. Like, okay, "polite" and "political" may seem like similar words, but they're not etymologically related at all. In a lot of ways, "polite" and "political" are antonyms.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:37 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 8:26 AM on July 26 [2 favorites +] [!]
okay so on the one hand I feel you re: chanting over Cummings. That was a bad look.
But on the other hand, avoiding rudeness absolutely positively cannot be a primary goal of a political organization. Like, okay, "polite" and "political" may seem like similar words, but they're not etymologically related at all. In a lot of ways, "polite" and "political" are antonyms.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:37 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Let Me Remind You Fuckers Who I Am by "Hillary Clinton"
(Sorry if this has been posted already. I didn't see it with a search for "fucker" and doing a search on "fuck" was too overwhelming to try - which seems about right honestly)
posted by MCMikeNamara at 8:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [36 favorites]
(Sorry if this has been posted already. I didn't see it with a search for "fucker" and doing a search on "fuck" was too overwhelming to try - which seems about right honestly)
posted by MCMikeNamara at 8:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [36 favorites]
Clinton took the time to visit every single New York county (all 62) to learn as much as she could about the state and what mattered to the people who lived here. She did that every year she was a Senator.
On one hand, it is cool that she did this, but the other hand it's pretty fucking sad that this is an unusual practice worthy of comment.
posted by entropicamericana at 8:41 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
On one hand, it is cool that she did this, but the other hand it's pretty fucking sad that this is an unusual practice worthy of comment.
posted by entropicamericana at 8:41 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
On one hand, it is cool that she did this, but the other hand it's pretty fucking sad that this is an unusual practice worthy of comment.
Agreed.
posted by zarq at 8:45 AM on July 26, 2016
Agreed.
posted by zarq at 8:45 AM on July 26, 2016
Is it? 62 counties a year while also needing to be in DC? That's a pretty big accomplishment to me.
posted by zutalors! at 8:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zutalors! at 8:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I think there are narcissists on both ends. Politics draws them in. I do some advocacy work in liberal causes (climate change, mostly) and every meeting involves two or three clinically self-involved people who give endless slow speeches and cry and make fists and talk about how the people are asleep and rakka rakka. . . .
to sort out meaningful left political formations from zany revolution LARPers . . . see whether or not they try to sell you newspapers. If they seem otherwise reasonable but are nevertheless dead set on trying to get you to buy a newsletter that no one reads about the Importance! Of! Their! Exact! Type! Of! Socialism!, you have every right to back away slowly.
Oh man, some SYL schmuck'd always show up and start a counter-speech during Q&A. We'd give 'em about three fullsome paragraphs before we start chanting "What's your question? Question! Question! Question!"
It's actually better these days.
PS: Do radicals really still hawk printed 'newspapers'?
posted by Herodios at 8:47 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
to sort out meaningful left political formations from zany revolution LARPers . . . see whether or not they try to sell you newspapers. If they seem otherwise reasonable but are nevertheless dead set on trying to get you to buy a newsletter that no one reads about the Importance! Of! Their! Exact! Type! Of! Socialism!, you have every right to back away slowly.
Oh man, some SYL schmuck'd always show up and start a counter-speech during Q&A. We'd give 'em about three fullsome paragraphs before we start chanting "What's your question? Question! Question! Question!"
It's actually better these days.
PS: Do radicals really still hawk printed 'newspapers'?
posted by Herodios at 8:47 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
If people want to get involved with a left-wing third party, I've heard good things about the Democratic Socialists of America and the Party for Socialism and Liberation, although I can't vouch for either personally. I do think either would be a better choice for leftist efforts at political change than the Green Party.
Or you could follow Bernie's lead and get involved in the Democratic Party with the intent of pushing it to the left.
posted by octothorpe at 8:49 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
Or you could follow Bernie's lead and get involved in the Democratic Party with the intent of pushing it to the left.
posted by octothorpe at 8:49 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
"Let Me Remind You Fuckers Who I Am by "Hillary Clinton"
Oh my God that is so right on. Yes. This is why the people who love her, love her, and this is why the people who hate her, hate her. Do I dare share it on social media? Do I dare? Or will my evangelical family faint at the sight of the word "fuck" while the Libertarians tell me again about e-mails? Or will their heads just explode? I've been so good and nice and reasonable talking politics with these people who I really do love. Can I bring myself to explode their heads? Because I want so much to explode their heads.
posted by OnceUponATime at 8:49 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
Oh my God that is so right on. Yes. This is why the people who love her, love her, and this is why the people who hate her, hate her. Do I dare share it on social media? Do I dare? Or will my evangelical family faint at the sight of the word "fuck" while the Libertarians tell me again about e-mails? Or will their heads just explode? I've been so good and nice and reasonable talking politics with these people who I really do love. Can I bring myself to explode their heads? Because I want so much to explode their heads.
posted by OnceUponATime at 8:49 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
> Is it? 62 counties a year while also needing to be in DC? That's a pretty big accomplishment to me.
posted by zutalors! at 8:46 AM on July 26 [+] [!]
It strikes me as the sort of thing that would be much easier to do for people who don't work a job that requires long days in a call center hitting up rich people for campaign donations.
That is one very key way that the system is in fact rigged; electeds simply don't have time to talk to anyone who's not rich, not unless they have a preternatural knack for living without sleep. Or maybe a serious methamphetamine habit.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 8:46 AM on July 26 [+] [!]
It strikes me as the sort of thing that would be much easier to do for people who don't work a job that requires long days in a call center hitting up rich people for campaign donations.
That is one very key way that the system is in fact rigged; electeds simply don't have time to talk to anyone who's not rich, not unless they have a preternatural knack for living without sleep. Or maybe a serious methamphetamine habit.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
Speaking of reddit events...
skewed and Justinian upthread posted about the /r/sandersforpresident sub getting put into stasis.
I have been following the r/enoughsandersspam sub. Going there this morning I was faced with a black screen and a link in 80 point type titled "This sub has been seized;proceed to:r/EnoughKissingerSpam".
Interestingly enough, yesterday there was a major post titled "S4P is unaware they're LITERALLY being trolled by Russia right now : enoughsandersspam".
It had dozens of links on the wikileaks/Russia connection.
It seems there is something fishy going on.
posted by dougzilla at 8:50 AM on July 26, 2016
skewed and Justinian upthread posted about the /r/sandersforpresident sub getting put into stasis.
I have been following the r/enoughsandersspam sub. Going there this morning I was faced with a black screen and a link in 80 point type titled "This sub has been seized;proceed to:r/EnoughKissingerSpam".
Interestingly enough, yesterday there was a major post titled "S4P is unaware they're LITERALLY being trolled by Russia right now : enoughsandersspam".
It had dozens of links on the wikileaks/Russia connection.
It seems there is something fishy going on.
posted by dougzilla at 8:50 AM on July 26, 2016
It's gotten to where I don't even challenge the arguments of my Republican family members on Facebook.
With respect, there's never been a better time to do so, because this is the year that conservative outlets are criticizing the nominee, so there are people to speak for you, and a chance of them listening. Don't give up.
posted by corb at 8:52 AM on July 26, 2016 [27 favorites]
With respect, there's never been a better time to do so, because this is the year that conservative outlets are criticizing the nominee, so there are people to speak for you, and a chance of them listening. Don't give up.
posted by corb at 8:52 AM on July 26, 2016 [27 favorites]
There's some stuff that I could have done without in that Medium piece, even though I understand the sentiment. I guess I didn't think the contempt part played well, and I do wish that people would stop using "bitches" as an insult, especially when it seems to trade on tropes of femininity.
But I liked this:
"I’ve spent my life clawing my way into a system that’s terrified of change. A system that just wants to let rich white dudes be rich white dudes. And holy shit, you guys, I could not have picked a better opponent for my final boss battle."
posted by OmieWise at 8:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
But I liked this:
"I’ve spent my life clawing my way into a system that’s terrified of change. A system that just wants to let rich white dudes be rich white dudes. And holy shit, you guys, I could not have picked a better opponent for my final boss battle."
posted by OmieWise at 8:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
That Vox article is really something. There's so much to read and watch about this election that I know people can't get to everything, here's another excerpt I think is really important:
posted by sallybrown at 8:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [88 favorites]
Bob Greenstein is the president of the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities. He has devoted his life to understanding and improving policy that affects the poor. He is among the people in Washington whom I respect most. And when I asked him about Clinton, about what she’s actually gotten done, he gets very specific. “I can give you three personal examples,” he says immediately. The stories he told me are wonky, to say the least. I include all three here because I think the way they echo one another is important.This is EXACTLY what I want in my president. I want people who know what they're talking about to be able to access those with the power, and for those with the power to be responsive. This is how effective change gets made.
The first came in 1988, when Clinton was the first lady of Arkansas. The 1986 federal tax reform law created a windfall for state governments, and Greenstein’s organization wanted to see it used to exempt families below the poverty line from paying state income taxes. Arkansas was a particularly bad offender on this front — it began collecting income tax at about half the poverty line.
Greenstein’s group wrote a report. The plan was to release it at a press conference and hope for the best. Then an old friend suggested Greenstein call Hillary Clinton. So he did. He called her at her law firm, and she called him right back and asked for a copy of the report. She read it overnight and called him back again, asking how he intended to release the report. His plan for a press conference didn’t impress her much.
“I don’t think you’ll get the attention you’re seeking,” Greenstein remembers her saying. “Let me get back to you.” Two days later, she called him back again. Her husband would convene a special session of the state tax commission; Greenstein would be invited to unveil his report there, in front of the press corps, after being introduced by the governor. His recommendations passed.
Example two. Bill Clinton was four weeks into his presidency. He had promised that if you worked full time, you wouldn’t have to raise your kids in poverty. His first budget tried to make good on that promise with a boost in the earned income tax credit. But when Greenstein’s team ran the numbers, the policy didn’t fulfill the promise.
Again, Greenstein wrote a paper. Again, he sent it to Hillary Clinton. He remembers sending it at 2 pm. At 9 am the next morning, he was summoned to the White House. They changed the policy.
Example three. It’s now 1999, and Greenstein is trying to get administrative changes made to welfare reform to ensure families don’t lose their food stamps when they return to work. He keeps hitting dead ends. Then he asks for a meeting with Clinton. She peppers him with questions for 30 minutes and then says he’s right, she agrees. The changes get made.
In each case, Clinton is contacted by somebody who’s smart and credible but doesn’t have a ton of political clout. In each case, the message is that the policy her husband is either administering or making is flawed in some very technical way. And rather than ignore that message, or become defensive about it, she listens. She dives into the details — details that would numb many professional policy staffers, to say nothing of most politicians.
posted by sallybrown at 8:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [88 favorites]
Bernie: I endorse Hillary. I want you to do the same.
Standers: Fuck you Bernie! We want Bernie! Bernie!
Bernie: [emoji]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Standers: Fuck you Bernie! We want Bernie! Bernie!
Bernie: [emoji]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Is it? 62 counties a year while also needing to be in DC? That's a pretty big accomplishment to me.
My point being that all senators should be doing this.
(As an aside, the most the Senate has been in session since 1996 was 191 days out of 365 and the median seems to be around 150-160. I think all the senators should be able to squeeze this in their busy fundraising schedules. (So, in conclusion, yay Hillary and maybe lean on the rest of your party to do the same because lord knows I have a thing or two I'd like to say to Feinstein.))
posted by entropicamericana at 8:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
My point being that all senators should be doing this.
(As an aside, the most the Senate has been in session since 1996 was 191 days out of 365 and the median seems to be around 150-160. I think all the senators should be able to squeeze this in their busy fundraising schedules. (So, in conclusion, yay Hillary and maybe lean on the rest of your party to do the same because lord knows I have a thing or two I'd like to say to Feinstein.))
posted by entropicamericana at 8:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Is it? 62 counties a year while also needing to be in DC? That's a pretty big accomplishment to me.
I think they're saying it should be standard operating procedure for Senators (and Congresspeople) but it isn't.
posted by cooker girl at 8:55 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I think they're saying it should be standard operating procedure for Senators (and Congresspeople) but it isn't.
posted by cooker girl at 8:55 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
But on the other hand, avoiding rudeness absolutely positively cannot be a primary goal of a political organization.I would use the word "disrespectful," rather than rude. And I do, in fact, think that sort of disrespectful behavior is a problem, and the fact that there's a pattern of it is going to limit the viability of the movement that Bernie is trying to build. You can't have a real left in the US without people of color. You can't have a real left in the US without people of color who are older than 30.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
“I love Bill Clinton,” says Tom Harkin, who served as senator from Iowa from 1985 to 2015. “But every time you talk to Bill, you’re just trying to get a word in edgewise. With Hillary, you’re in a meeting with her, and she really listens to you.”
It's why they work, he talks and she listens, every day.
posted by numaner at 8:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's why they work, he talks and she listens, every day.
posted by numaner at 8:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
dis_integration: "He gave a full-throated, unqualified endorsement, and asked his supporters to please listen. He's not a magician, and they have minds of their own."
Yes, he did. But only after withholding it long enough to get his issues onto the platform. And, even within the big speech, the first actual endorsement of Clinton comes in around halfway in (around 14:30 in this video). Compare that with Clinton's speech at the 2008 DNC which begins with:
In any case, if Sanders has any hope to make progress on his other goal -- sparking a democratic socialist revolution in the down-ticket races -- he's going to have to figure out a way to harness and direct his supporters' energy one way or another. Maybe these vocal hold-outs really are a tiny minority and are ultimately a non-issue and the Sanders train will continue to steam along. Or maybe they're a sign that Sanders has certain weaknesses in his organizing game that will prevent him from achieving his ultimate objectives. We'll probably know soon enough in the months (and years?) to come.
posted by mhum at 8:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yes, he did. But only after withholding it long enough to get his issues onto the platform. And, even within the big speech, the first actual endorsement of Clinton comes in around halfway in (around 14:30 in this video). Compare that with Clinton's speech at the 2008 DNC which begins with:
I'm here today as a proud mother, a proud Democrat, as a proud senator from New York, a proud American, and a proud supporter of Barack Obama.Now, this is not necessarily to fault Sanders, per se. He had a particular goal (moving the platform) and a strategy to achieve it. That part seems to have mostly worked out. But let's also give him enough credit to recognize that this (probably minor overall but definitely vocal) delegate discord was going to be a largely foreseeable by-product of that strategy. I mean, Sanders himself got boo-ed by his own delegates in their pre-convention meeting yesterday. To me, this shows that either Sanders didn't care about preparing the ground for his eventual endorsement or maybe simply underestimated the amount of acrimony that's been floating around and thought that a simple declaration would be enough to sway his supporters.
In any case, if Sanders has any hope to make progress on his other goal -- sparking a democratic socialist revolution in the down-ticket races -- he's going to have to figure out a way to harness and direct his supporters' energy one way or another. Maybe these vocal hold-outs really are a tiny minority and are ultimately a non-issue and the Sanders train will continue to steam along. Or maybe they're a sign that Sanders has certain weaknesses in his organizing game that will prevent him from achieving his ultimate objectives. We'll probably know soon enough in the months (and years?) to come.
posted by mhum at 8:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
It's easy enough to do 3 counties in a day, four if they are laid out for efficient travel time.
because this is the year that conservative outlets are criticizing the nominee, so there are people to speak for you, and a chance of them listening.
My tack very much has been to share articles from respected voices, particularly in the Evangelical space as well as conservative news outlets. There *are* good smart people thinking and writing about these things. And not pointedly sharing these things at anybody, just putting it out there. It does catch people's attention, and remember: all that matters in the end is what box they tick in the privacy of the booth. It'd be great to have some big showy conversions but the vote is still the vote, and the quiet conversation with a friend - even if unheard by their entire social network - can do good work.
posted by Lyn Never at 9:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
because this is the year that conservative outlets are criticizing the nominee, so there are people to speak for you, and a chance of them listening.
My tack very much has been to share articles from respected voices, particularly in the Evangelical space as well as conservative news outlets. There *are* good smart people thinking and writing about these things. And not pointedly sharing these things at anybody, just putting it out there. It does catch people's attention, and remember: all that matters in the end is what box they tick in the privacy of the booth. It'd be great to have some big showy conversions but the vote is still the vote, and the quiet conversation with a friend - even if unheard by their entire social network - can do good work.
posted by Lyn Never at 9:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Mod note: Couple comments deleted; again really not re-litigating the "lesser of two evils is evil" vs "Nader 2000" thing, both points have been made really really extensively.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 9:02 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 9:02 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
electeds simply don't have time to talk to anyone who's not rich
I do not "agreed", unless you can show that talking to rich people takes less time than talking to poor people.
A truer statement is that they have time for only a limited number of direct conversations with constituents, regardless of their power, influence, or wealth. There are other ways to select who gets heard.
There are two ways to mitigate this. a) Send trusted advisors to do some of, or the first round of, the direct listening; 2. Citizens can select representatives to voice the concerns of like-minded citizens. That's the difference between a mob and a labor negotiation. Then add a reliable and responsive feedback loop.
All it takes is to start doing it. Sounds corny, but real democracy is corny.
posted by Herodios at 9:04 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I do not "agreed", unless you can show that talking to rich people takes less time than talking to poor people.
A truer statement is that they have time for only a limited number of direct conversations with constituents, regardless of their power, influence, or wealth. There are other ways to select who gets heard.
There are two ways to mitigate this. a) Send trusted advisors to do some of, or the first round of, the direct listening; 2. Citizens can select representatives to voice the concerns of like-minded citizens. That's the difference between a mob and a labor negotiation. Then add a reliable and responsive feedback loop.
All it takes is to start doing it. Sounds corny, but real democracy is corny.
posted by Herodios at 9:04 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
cooker girl: Truth be told, I'm pretty much a socialist AND I'm a fervent Clinton supporter. I contain multitudes!
The other day I said I was Vuron. Now it seems I am also Cooker Girl.
I contain multitudes of Mefites!
posted by Superplin at 9:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
The other day I said I was Vuron. Now it seems I am also Cooker Girl.
I contain multitudes of Mefites!
posted by Superplin at 9:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
I like to think he set up Warren to win in 4 to 8 years.
She's 67 and will be 75 in 2024. This year was her last/best shot, but like so many others, she decided to stay in the Senate where she's guaranteed-effective rather than run against Clinton, who in hindsight, she could have probably beaten.
(Of course, it didn't seem that way a year ago.)
posted by rokusan at 9:09 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
She's 67 and will be 75 in 2024. This year was her last/best shot, but like so many others, she decided to stay in the Senate where she's guaranteed-effective rather than run against Clinton, who in hindsight, she could have probably beaten.
(Of course, it didn't seem that way a year ago.)
posted by rokusan at 9:09 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
She's 67 and will be 75 in 2020.
.....that's some crazy aging.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
.....that's some crazy aging.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
It's easy enough to do 3 counties in a day, four if they are laid out for efficient travel time.
"Easy enough"? This problem is NP-hard!
posted by biogeo at 9:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
"Easy enough"? This problem is NP-hard!
posted by biogeo at 9:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
> PS: Do radicals really still hawk printed 'newspapers'?
posted by Herodios at 8:47 AM on July 26 [+] [!]
Yes, and it's HILARIOUS. I have no clear sense of why they still do it. My best guesses are:
posted by Herodios at 8:47 AM on July 26 [+] [!]
Yes, and it's HILARIOUS. I have no clear sense of why they still do it. My best guesses are:
- Fetishization of the tactics used by the Bolshevik revolutionaries, without concern for how the world has changed since 1917. Lenin sold newspapers? Trotsky sold newspapers? Then we sell newspapers! Never mind that the media landscape is completely different, and that printed newspapers sold individually is maybe the least effective means of communication possible today.
- Hazing ritual; the waste of time and mild humiliation involved in trying to sell a newsletter no one reads makes you feel like you've got to stay with the group to recoup your sunk costs.
- Sheer inertia.
You can't beat me, I'M FULL OF TINIER MEFITES!
posted by delfin at 9:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by delfin at 9:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
"[Sanders] gave a full-throated, unqualified endorsement..."
It probably doesn't count as a qualification, but that little wink about not passing the TPP was a cute surprise. That wasn't in the printed speech.
posted by rokusan at 9:11 AM on July 26, 2016
It probably doesn't count as a qualification, but that little wink about not passing the TPP was a cute surprise. That wasn't in the printed speech.
posted by rokusan at 9:11 AM on July 26, 2016
Sanders supporters chant 'lock her up' at Philadelphia rally
I think it might be about time to stop calling people who are doing the exact opposite of what Bernie Sanders recommends "Sanders supporters."
posted by Cookiebastard at 9:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [60 favorites]
I think it might be about time to stop calling people who are doing the exact opposite of what Bernie Sanders recommends "Sanders supporters."
posted by Cookiebastard at 9:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [60 favorites]
Fixed, 317. I really really need coffee.
posted by rokusan at 9:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by rokusan at 9:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
For Jeebus sake, stop making her dab on Ellen and let her work! Obama loves a little slow jam. Great for him! Bill enjoyed blowing the horn, fabulous. That's who they were. Hillary is empress of wonks and she just wants to get down to business. Could we just let her?
posted by Sophie1 at 9:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by Sophie1 at 9:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Or you could follow Bernie's lead and get involved in the Democratic Party with the intent of pushing it to the left.
This, a thousand times, this. The progressive shift that Bernie's managed to create from within the Democratic host organism in the last year is far greater than the sum total of anything that's ever been done by independents or third parties at the national level. Perhaps the best part of this is that nobody can take away his increased stature on the left (unless he squanders it himself) which means he can keep doing this long after the election is over.
The Democratic party has always been happy to have Bernie voting with them on most issues, but it now looks like they will now have to listen to him if he decides to throw his newfound political weight around from outside the party apparatus. That's a good thing for progressives, and a good thing for the party if they can learn from his example that there's a lot of untapped energy out there.
I think it might be about time to stop calling people who are doing the exact opposite of what Bernie Sanders recommends "Sanders supporters."
"Busters" was suggested above, and I think it's perfect. It's not going to be Bernie, so busters gonna bust.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:16 AM on July 26, 2016 [16 favorites]
This, a thousand times, this. The progressive shift that Bernie's managed to create from within the Democratic host organism in the last year is far greater than the sum total of anything that's ever been done by independents or third parties at the national level. Perhaps the best part of this is that nobody can take away his increased stature on the left (unless he squanders it himself) which means he can keep doing this long after the election is over.
The Democratic party has always been happy to have Bernie voting with them on most issues, but it now looks like they will now have to listen to him if he decides to throw his newfound political weight around from outside the party apparatus. That's a good thing for progressives, and a good thing for the party if they can learn from his example that there's a lot of untapped energy out there.
I think it might be about time to stop calling people who are doing the exact opposite of what Bernie Sanders recommends "Sanders supporters."
"Busters" was suggested above, and I think it's perfect. It's not going to be Bernie, so busters gonna bust.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:16 AM on July 26, 2016 [16 favorites]
62 counties a year while also needing to be in DC? That's a pretty big accomplishment to me.
One thing that members of Congress complain about, regardless of party, is that they spend massive amounts of their time raising re-election funds: it starts even before they take their seats. Getting big money out of politics wouldn't simply level the playing field against kajillionaires: it would free up a massive amount of time for every single elected official to spend on listening to constituents and learning about policies instead of skimming the surface. Hillary Clinton had the advantage of a fundraising network that goes back decades, but a first-term House member or part-time state legislator does not.
posted by holgate at 9:16 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
One thing that members of Congress complain about, regardless of party, is that they spend massive amounts of their time raising re-election funds: it starts even before they take their seats. Getting big money out of politics wouldn't simply level the playing field against kajillionaires: it would free up a massive amount of time for every single elected official to spend on listening to constituents and learning about policies instead of skimming the surface. Hillary Clinton had the advantage of a fundraising network that goes back decades, but a first-term House member or part-time state legislator does not.
posted by holgate at 9:16 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
I think it might be about time to stop calling people who are doing the exact opposite of what Bernie Sanders recommends "Sanders supporter
Bernie: I endorse Hillary. I want you to do the same.
Standers: Fuck you Bernie! We want Bernie! Bernie!
Toldja. Some of these kids want to follow dead-and-nailed-to-his-horse El Cid into glorious battle against the infidels.
posted by Herodios at 9:18 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Bernie: I endorse Hillary. I want you to do the same.
Standers: Fuck you Bernie! We want Bernie! Bernie!
Toldja. Some of these kids want to follow dead-and-nailed-to-his-horse El Cid into glorious battle against the infidels.
posted by Herodios at 9:18 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I think it might be about time to stop calling people who are doing the exact opposite of what Bernie Sanders recommends "Sanders supporters."
I've been calling them 'Bernie Truthers' because of the tone they tend to take.
posted by dinty_moore at 9:18 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
I've been calling them 'Bernie Truthers' because of the tone they tend to take.
posted by dinty_moore at 9:18 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Fetishization of the tactics used by the Bolshevik revolutionaries
A sincere devotion to Russian avant-garde graphic design?
posted by octobersurprise at 9:20 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
A sincere devotion to Russian avant-garde graphic design?
posted by octobersurprise at 9:20 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
'Bernie Truthers'
Bern-uthers?
Ber-thers?
nah
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Bern-uthers?
Ber-thers?
nah
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
"Lock her up" is a creepy chant, I have to say. For one thing, shouldn't it be, at the very least, "put her on trial"? As I say, I am not even remotely a Hillary enthusiast, but "let's put our political opponents away without trial, and let's emphasize the locking-up part" does not give me a lot of confidence that everyone is thinking clearly. I don't do chants that support the prison-industrial complex. I stay silent on them at BLM matter protests, I don't take part in "ha ha he's going to jail" rhetoric about evil-doers, etc. Our prison system (and our legal system) are a shameful mess, and even if I think someone is a horrible person who deserves bad consequences, I do not relish thinking about people going to prison.
It's creepy, and it ill-befits radicals.
(People who haven't considered the prison-industrial complex, well, it bothers me less when they say it because I don't expect them to be up on the issue.)
posted by Frowner at 9:22 AM on July 26, 2016 [28 favorites]
It's creepy, and it ill-befits radicals.
(People who haven't considered the prison-industrial complex, well, it bothers me less when they say it because I don't expect them to be up on the issue.)
posted by Frowner at 9:22 AM on July 26, 2016 [28 favorites]
Is it? 62 counties a year while also needing to be in DC? That's a pretty big accomplishment to me.This has always been the stated reason for retaining the long August recess. Some Senators do it -- many don't. (This is one of those weird places where "campaigning" and "doing your job" has a lot of overlap politicians – meeting your constituents is generally pretty good PR)
Obviously, this is lot more difficult in larger states, and I'm genuinely impressed that she managed to pull this off in New York of all places. There are other large states, but New York is big, diverse (in multiple aspects), and doesn't have any huge unpopulated areas. I can't even think of another state where it would be remotely as difficult to accomplish this goal.
posted by schmod at 9:22 AM on July 26, 2016
Agreed with Frowner. No one who is progressive should be down with the prison-industrial complex.
posted by Kitteh at 9:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Kitteh at 9:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
The first time Hillary Rodham made the news, the articles led with her hair color. (Excellent Twitter thread)
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I can see room for a broad range of principled objections to Hillary Clinton but I don't really think I'm open-minded enough to buy that anyone participating in a "lock her up" chant is motivated by anything other than gross old capital-M misogyny or, at the very least, a total willingness to carry water for it.
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [16 favorites]
one last thing about Trotskyist newspaper sales: the argument that socialist newspaper vendors give for selling newspapers is that it serves as a useful way to strike up conversations about socialism and to convince people to get involved in the organization. Never mind that most reasonable people respond to the sales pitch by being like "dude, we were having a useful conversation about socialism, and I was interested in your organization... until you made everything weird by trying to sell a newsletter!"
Which leads me to my last hypothesis for why ISO, SA, and so forth still sell newspapers:
Which leads me to my last hypothesis for why ISO, SA, and so forth still sell newspapers:
- It's a way of selecting for people who are very passionate about having an organization to follow, and who are so passionate that they're willing to do very, very silly things for that organization, without regard for whether or not those silly things are effective. This type of supporter is quite useful, if all you want to do is sustain a small fringe organization forever.
"Lock her up" doesn't mean "I want justice," though. It means "I'm signaling my visceral hatred of this woman."
posted by sallybrown at 9:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
posted by sallybrown at 9:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
> PS: Do radicals really still hawk printed 'newspapers'?
I've got several issues of The New People around the house that we put down when my son wants to paint.
My husband is an armchair radical (nobody's perfect) and he frequently brings home radical papers. They all meet the same fate: keeping paint off the dining room table.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
.I just don't really see their messages as very compatible (Strength through Unity versus Revolution) and the more he tries to marry the two the more sort of weak it sounds. He did what he needed to last night, and that's great! Now let's let Clinton and Kaine take their message to the people.
Uhhhr? I think "Strength Through Unity" is the Trump tagline, no?
What I hear from Clinton is "Diversity Our Strength", which in the wrong hands is kind of anodyne but in this Democratic Party against this Republican party is fucking dynamite.
It's sad that celebrating diversity is a revolutionary sentiment these days... but it is.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Uhhhr? I think "Strength Through Unity" is the Trump tagline, no?
What I hear from Clinton is "Diversity Our Strength", which in the wrong hands is kind of anodyne but in this Democratic Party against this Republican party is fucking dynamite.
It's sad that celebrating diversity is a revolutionary sentiment these days... but it is.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
busters gonna bust.
posted by Herodios at 9:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
Dear Abby, dear AbbyApologies and a tip of the goofy hat to John Prine
My Candidate lost
But I'll stay with Bernie no matter the cost
The Democrats tell me I'm no friend at all
Won't you write me a letter, won't you give me a call
Signed, 'Busted'
Dear Busted, Dear Busted
You have no complaint
You are what your are and you ain't what you ain't
So listen up Buster, and listen up good
Stop wishing for bad luck and knocking on wood
Si-i-i-i-gned Dear Abby . . .
posted by Herodios at 9:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
Hillary's slogan is "stronger together." Trump's is more like "I will use the might of the state to punch out the people you don't like."
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 9:31 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 9:31 AM on July 26, 2016
I can't even think of another state where it would be remotely as difficult to accomplish this goal.
California is freaking ridiculous. 58 counties spread over 163,696 square miles. With San Francisco County at 46 sq mi, to San Bernardino with 20,000 sq mi. From L.A. with 10 million people and Alpine county with 1159 people total, California is nuts.
posted by Sophie1 at 9:31 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
California is freaking ridiculous. 58 counties spread over 163,696 square miles. With San Francisco County at 46 sq mi, to San Bernardino with 20,000 sq mi. From L.A. with 10 million people and Alpine county with 1159 people total, California is nuts.
posted by Sophie1 at 9:31 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
> A sincere devotion to Russian avant-garde graphic design?
posted by octobersurprise at 9:20 AM on July 26 [2 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]
To be fair, early 20th century Russian graphic design really was pretty great.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:31 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
posted by octobersurprise at 9:20 AM on July 26 [2 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]
To be fair, early 20th century Russian graphic design really was pretty great.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:31 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
> My husband is an armchair radical (nobody's perfect) and he frequently brings home radical papers. They all meet the same fate: keeping paint off the dining room table.
The people! United! Can keep paint off the dining room table!
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:33 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
The people! United! Can keep paint off the dining room table!
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:33 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
Bernie did great last night. The problem is that he called her dishonest and untrustworthy for pretty much the entirety of his campaign, and you can't just tell people to forget those words.
Yuuuuup. This and the normalization and tacit endorsement of harassment of women cannot be undone.
I think a bare minimum would include an active campaign to counter and correct the many lies about Hillary that his campaign encouraged and helped to spread. but I'm not hopeful.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
Yuuuuup. This and the normalization and tacit endorsement of harassment of women cannot be undone.
I think a bare minimum would include an active campaign to counter and correct the many lies about Hillary that his campaign encouraged and helped to spread. but I'm not hopeful.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
I can't even think of another state where it would be remotely as difficult to accomplish this goal.
Texas and its 254 counties surely?
posted by zachlipton at 9:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Texas and its 254 counties surely?
posted by zachlipton at 9:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
"Lock her up" doesn't mean "I want justice," though. It means "I'm signaling my visceral hatred of this woman."
Yes, and if you're so caught up in your visceral hatred that you can't even pause to think about what literal words are coming out of your mouth, that is hella creepy. And again, not befitting a radical.
(This reminds me of my dad, who is a weirdo, and who impressed me very much when I was a child by saying that he refused to sing the hymns in the "church militant" [about evangelizing and winning converts, not literally about fighting] part of the hymnal (which I liked because they were fast and fun to sing) because he felt that they glorified temporal victory and that was not fitting for Christians.)
posted by Frowner at 9:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
Yes, and if you're so caught up in your visceral hatred that you can't even pause to think about what literal words are coming out of your mouth, that is hella creepy. And again, not befitting a radical.
(This reminds me of my dad, who is a weirdo, and who impressed me very much when I was a child by saying that he refused to sing the hymns in the "church militant" [about evangelizing and winning converts, not literally about fighting] part of the hymnal (which I liked because they were fast and fun to sing) because he felt that they glorified temporal victory and that was not fitting for Christians.)
posted by Frowner at 9:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
I can't even think of another state where it would be remotely as difficult to accomplish this goal.
California is freaking ridiculous. 58 counties spread over 163,696 square miles. With San Francisco County at 46 sq mi, to San Bernardino with 20,000 sq mi. From L.A. with 10 million people and Alpine county with 1159 people total, California is nuts.
It has what, 40 million people? *googles* OK, 38.8M.
Still bigger than Canada.
break that shit up
give us four more Democratic senators while you're at it
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
California is freaking ridiculous. 58 counties spread over 163,696 square miles. With San Francisco County at 46 sq mi, to San Bernardino with 20,000 sq mi. From L.A. with 10 million people and Alpine county with 1159 people total, California is nuts.
It has what, 40 million people? *googles* OK, 38.8M.
Still bigger than Canada.
break that shit up
give us four more Democratic senators while you're at it
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
"Lock her up" is a creepy chant, I have to say
This is my problem with that faction.
The assholes chanting "lock her up" aren't pushing some kind of progressive agenda. They're not talking about strengthening protections for workers, or criminal justice reform. They just want to punish Clinton, hurt her, and they don't care that she hasnt actually committed any crimes. (If you believe, after the tens of millions of dollars spent trying to pin some crime on Clinton by her bitterest political enemies, that she somehow hasnt been charged with anything because she's guilty but has the magical power of justice-evasion, well you're in legit birther/truther delusion territory. You also can't want to "punish" her for vote on Iraq unless you also chant "lock him up" at Biden everytime he appears, which nobody does).
And chanting "No TPP" over a congressmen who is black while he speaks about his sharecropper childhood and calls for progress in Civil Rights isn't "progressive" either. Economic justice is important, and if you want to shut down a freeway in protest for it because it's more important than people's smooth commutes home, I fully support you. But it doesnt trump racial justice and nobody who thinks it does deserves to be called progressive.
That's why I have no sympathy for these jerks and their disappointment. They're not the left. They're not pushing anyone leftward. They're selfish, brainwashed children, and they're in no way a shining beacon of hope in our political future.
posted by pocketfullofrye at 9:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [34 favorites]
This is my problem with that faction.
The assholes chanting "lock her up" aren't pushing some kind of progressive agenda. They're not talking about strengthening protections for workers, or criminal justice reform. They just want to punish Clinton, hurt her, and they don't care that she hasnt actually committed any crimes. (If you believe, after the tens of millions of dollars spent trying to pin some crime on Clinton by her bitterest political enemies, that she somehow hasnt been charged with anything because she's guilty but has the magical power of justice-evasion, well you're in legit birther/truther delusion territory. You also can't want to "punish" her for vote on Iraq unless you also chant "lock him up" at Biden everytime he appears, which nobody does).
And chanting "No TPP" over a congressmen who is black while he speaks about his sharecropper childhood and calls for progress in Civil Rights isn't "progressive" either. Economic justice is important, and if you want to shut down a freeway in protest for it because it's more important than people's smooth commutes home, I fully support you. But it doesnt trump racial justice and nobody who thinks it does deserves to be called progressive.
That's why I have no sympathy for these jerks and their disappointment. They're not the left. They're not pushing anyone leftward. They're selfish, brainwashed children, and they're in no way a shining beacon of hope in our political future.
posted by pocketfullofrye at 9:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [34 favorites]
Alpine county with 1159 people total
Wow, lifelong Californian and TIL.
posted by entropicamericana at 9:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Wow, lifelong Californian and TIL.
posted by entropicamericana at 9:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Fun fact about California's counties. They were drawn up based on the population at statehood. So all those tiny counties in the sierras? Based on gold rush populations. The giant counties had roughly the same populations as the tiny ones back then.
posted by gofargogo at 9:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by gofargogo at 9:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
From roomthreeseventeen's link:
"Five years ago blonde Hillary Rodham was a 'Goldwater girl' in suburban Park Ridge with, as she says now, 'a very limited social perspective.' Five days ago she was just another uncommonly pretty girl in the ranks of this year's legion of college graduates. [...] Today she is being quoted from coast to coast and on network television. To her great amusement, she has been editorially spanked."
Eww.
posted by biogeo at 9:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [21 favorites]
"Five years ago blonde Hillary Rodham was a 'Goldwater girl' in suburban Park Ridge with, as she says now, 'a very limited social perspective.' Five days ago she was just another uncommonly pretty girl in the ranks of this year's legion of college graduates. [...] Today she is being quoted from coast to coast and on network television. To her great amusement, she has been editorially spanked."
Eww.
posted by biogeo at 9:38 AM on July 26, 2016 [21 favorites]
An old friend of mine used to tell the story of going to an environmentalist rally and, bored by speeches he'd heard and given a hundred times, deciding to amuse himself by talking to the various socialist parties hawking newspapers. He'd approach each one and ask, "What makes your socialist party different from every other newspaper?"
"Well," they'd say, "we've got this newspaper. Would you like to buy a copy?"
Finally he makes his way around to the Revolutionary Communist Party table, and asks his question, and is told "Only the RCP supports the immediate armed overthrow of the United States Government."
Ah hah, he thinks. Now we're getting somewhere. "And how do you propose to do that?"
"Well," says the RCP member, "we've got this newspaper..."
posted by Pope Guilty at 9:39 AM on July 26, 2016 [50 favorites]
"Well," they'd say, "we've got this newspaper. Would you like to buy a copy?"
Finally he makes his way around to the Revolutionary Communist Party table, and asks his question, and is told "Only the RCP supports the immediate armed overthrow of the United States Government."
Ah hah, he thinks. Now we're getting somewhere. "And how do you propose to do that?"
"Well," says the RCP member, "we've got this newspaper..."
posted by Pope Guilty at 9:39 AM on July 26, 2016 [50 favorites]
>"Lock her up" is a creepy chant, I have to say
This is my problem with that faction.
The assholes chanting "lock her up" aren't pushing some kind of progressive agenda.
It might be that my calibration is a bit off (who's isn't after the last six months) but this "Lock her up" chant seems an order of magnitude more squicky than even the "Hillary For Prison" and "Crooked Hillary"-type discourse.
I hear in it an emphasis on the physicality, a focus not even on the state-of-being-in-jail but on the action of taking a despised woman's body and capturing it, holding it, restraining it.
Someone a few threads back compared this to the walk-of-shame scene in Game of Thrones. Yeah. That.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:42 AM on July 26, 2016 [37 favorites]
This is my problem with that faction.
The assholes chanting "lock her up" aren't pushing some kind of progressive agenda.
It might be that my calibration is a bit off (who's isn't after the last six months) but this "Lock her up" chant seems an order of magnitude more squicky than even the "Hillary For Prison" and "Crooked Hillary"-type discourse.
I hear in it an emphasis on the physicality, a focus not even on the state-of-being-in-jail but on the action of taking a despised woman's body and capturing it, holding it, restraining it.
Someone a few threads back compared this to the walk-of-shame scene in Game of Thrones. Yeah. That.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:42 AM on July 26, 2016 [37 favorites]
Now, this is not necessarily to fault Sanders, per se. He had a particular goal (moving the platform) and a strategy to achieve it. That part seems to have mostly worked out. But let's also give him enough credit to recognize that this (probably minor overall but definitely vocal) delegate discord was going to be a largely foreseeable by-product of that strategy.
Well, by that logic the Clinton camp should have also foreseen it and accommodated his goal earlier.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 9:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Well, by that logic the Clinton camp should have also foreseen it and accommodated his goal earlier.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 9:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm continually surprised that anyone can say with a straight face, "I'm voting for Jill Stein." Looking at you, Cornel West and Kshama Sawant. As if a platform of homeopathy and pandering to anti-vaxxers is somehow a rational alternative to the Dems. And tilting at the windmill of the presidency every four years rather than starting from the ground up ain't exactly a winning strategy.
posted by Existential Dread at 9:45 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by Existential Dread at 9:45 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
Someone a few threads back compared this to the walk-of-shame scene in Game of Thrones. Yeah. That.
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:42 AM on July 26 [+] [!]
to steal someone else's shtick from earlier....
[+1]
HERE IS MY BLACK MARKET FAVORITE TIVALASVEGAS
posted by schadenfrau at 9:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:42 AM on July 26 [+] [!]
to steal someone else's shtick from earlier....
[+1]
HERE IS MY BLACK MARKET FAVORITE TIVALASVEGAS
posted by schadenfrau at 9:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Status vs Rapport
Sanders wanted the status and recognition. In some ways that the progressive movement mattered, but also that he mattered - I won't deny him that he enjoyed that attention, look at his face during the speech last night.
While he was doing that, how much do you think Hillary was trying to build the rapport, do the research, make sure that she could accept parts of his platform without splitting away from her original base?
posted by mrzarquon at 9:48 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Sanders wanted the status and recognition. In some ways that the progressive movement mattered, but also that he mattered - I won't deny him that he enjoyed that attention, look at his face during the speech last night.
While he was doing that, how much do you think Hillary was trying to build the rapport, do the research, make sure that she could accept parts of his platform without splitting away from her original base?
posted by mrzarquon at 9:48 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
It's nice that we have a handy "Sanders wing of the Democratic Party" appellation. (Even if he's returning to independent status himself.)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 9:49 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 9:49 AM on July 26, 2016
Bit of a pickle developing: who is going to officially put Hillary Clinton's name in nomination?
Why not Michelle Obama? Or, if she's busy, her husband might be able to cover for her.
posted by msalt at 9:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Why not Michelle Obama? Or, if she's busy, her husband might be able to cover for her.
posted by msalt at 9:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
my dad, who is a weirdo, and who impressed me very much when I was a child by saying that he refused to sing the hymns in the "church militant" [about evangelizing and winning converts, not literally about fighting] part of the hymnal (which I liked because they were fast and fun to sing) because he felt that they glorified temporal victory and that was not fitting for Christians.)
heh I still do this. Last month on Independence Day the final hymn was "God bless our native land" which is mostly okay (although I would have preferred "Lift ev'ry voice and sing" obvs or maybe "O day of peace that dimly shines") but then the second verse ends "to thee [God] aloud we cry, "God save the state" and I noped right out which sucked because it's not a bad tenor part
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:51 AM on July 26, 2016
heh I still do this. Last month on Independence Day the final hymn was "God bless our native land" which is mostly okay (although I would have preferred "Lift ev'ry voice and sing" obvs or maybe "O day of peace that dimly shines") but then the second verse ends "to thee [God] aloud we cry, "God save the state" and I noped right out which sucked because it's not a bad tenor part
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:51 AM on July 26, 2016
Still bigger than Canada.
break that shit up
give us four more Democratic senators while you're at it
You...uh, mean California, right? :)
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 9:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
break that shit up
give us four more Democratic senators while you're at it
You...uh, mean California, right? :)
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 9:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
> I'm continually surprised that anyone can say with a straight face, "I'm voting for Jill Stein." Looking at you, Cornel West and Kshama Sawant. As if a platform of homeopathy and pandering to anti-vaxxers is somehow a rational alternative to the Dems. And tilting at the windmill of the presidency every four years rather than starting from the ground up ain't exactly a winning strategy.
Cornel West is a crazy person. I mean, love him to death, but he's a crazy person. He does very strange things sometimes — most notably, lending his good name to Bob Avakian. I don't think he's ever met an outsider he didn't like. Supporting Stein is pretty par for the course for him.
Kshama Sawant is a member of a centralist organization that decided to capitalize on their success in getting her elected and in winning the 15 dollar minimum wage in Seattle by focusing on trying to get Sanders to run as an independent as a means to destabilize the Democratic Party and thereby clear space for a left party to replace it.1 Bless their hearts...
Samantha Bee had an interview with Gary Johnson where she noted that she agreed strongly with half of the things he was saying, and thought that the other half was completely nuts. With Sawant the mix is closer to 70% totally smart and 30% totally barmy, maybe. On the bright side, the smart stuff is all stuff that she can do as a city councillor, and the barmy part is all stuff that a city councillor has no influence over.
1: oh, and also newspaper sales. they very much want to increase their newspaper sales.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:56 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Cornel West is a crazy person. I mean, love him to death, but he's a crazy person. He does very strange things sometimes — most notably, lending his good name to Bob Avakian. I don't think he's ever met an outsider he didn't like. Supporting Stein is pretty par for the course for him.
Kshama Sawant is a member of a centralist organization that decided to capitalize on their success in getting her elected and in winning the 15 dollar minimum wage in Seattle by focusing on trying to get Sanders to run as an independent as a means to destabilize the Democratic Party and thereby clear space for a left party to replace it.1 Bless their hearts...
Samantha Bee had an interview with Gary Johnson where she noted that she agreed strongly with half of the things he was saying, and thought that the other half was completely nuts. With Sawant the mix is closer to 70% totally smart and 30% totally barmy, maybe. On the bright side, the smart stuff is all stuff that she can do as a city councillor, and the barmy part is all stuff that a city councillor has no influence over.
1: oh, and also newspaper sales. they very much want to increase their newspaper sales.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:56 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Has "lock her up" ever been used as an anti-woman sort of insult toward any other female public figure?
Because it really just sounds like a (somewhat rude) accusation of criminality to me, without any extra nuanced or misogynist meanings needed on top. I think we're projecting a bit by adding that in, here. I mean, this is the same thing, word for word, that was yelled over and over again at Bush and his ilk ten years ago.
So while I believe Clinton gets more than enough misogynist jeering from scary and crazy types (like all those "bitch" epithets), I don't hear it in that particular shout.
posted by rokusan at 9:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Because it really just sounds like a (somewhat rude) accusation of criminality to me, without any extra nuanced or misogynist meanings needed on top. I think we're projecting a bit by adding that in, here. I mean, this is the same thing, word for word, that was yelled over and over again at Bush and his ilk ten years ago.
So while I believe Clinton gets more than enough misogynist jeering from scary and crazy types (like all those "bitch" epithets), I don't hear it in that particular shout.
posted by rokusan at 9:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
... and now "barmy" has been added to my personal private cranky-word-of-the-day calendar. Thanks, Buick.
posted by rokusan at 9:59 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by rokusan at 9:59 AM on July 26, 2016
You...uh, mean California, right? :)
yes
although, it's an auspicious time for a Canadian invasion....
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:59 AM on July 26, 2016
yes
although, it's an auspicious time for a Canadian invasion....
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:59 AM on July 26, 2016
The comments on the Medium article are... interesting*. Some of them seem to think they're responding to the actual HRC.
*Not interesting enough for anyone to read, mind you, and are exactly what you'd expect.
posted by GhostintheMachine at 9:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
*Not interesting enough for anyone to read, mind you, and are exactly what you'd expect.
posted by GhostintheMachine at 9:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I mean, this is the same thing, word for word, that was yelled over and over again at Bush and his ilk ten years ago.
Tried to Google this myself, and, hmmmm... citation needed.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 9:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Tried to Google this myself, and, hmmmm... citation needed.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 9:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm continually surprised that anyone can say with a straight face, "I'm voting for Jill Stein."
Yep. I didn't know much about her, but I mentioned to a Facebook friend that since I'm in a solidly blue state, I guess I can vote third-party if I want, and I was gonna check out Jill Stein. My friend was like "huh; I'll check her out too".
I immediately ran into the homeopathy / antivax / general woo stuff, and noped right outta there.
My Facebook friend, however (a Bernie-or-buster who seems to be reluctantly coming around to voting tactically for Clinton) is big into alternative medicine. She lives in a swing state where the latest polls are very close. I'm not gonna say anything, of course, and it's none of my business who she votes for – but I kinda wish I hadn't mentioned Stein to her. The sort of people who believe Bernie conspiracy theories are often the same people who believe the wacky alt-med stuff. Antiscience is by no means exclusive to the political right; the left just has different pet issues.
Point being: if it surprises you that a significant number of people would vote for a proponent of medical pseudoscience, then you are less cynical than me.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 10:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Yep. I didn't know much about her, but I mentioned to a Facebook friend that since I'm in a solidly blue state, I guess I can vote third-party if I want, and I was gonna check out Jill Stein. My friend was like "huh; I'll check her out too".
I immediately ran into the homeopathy / antivax / general woo stuff, and noped right outta there.
My Facebook friend, however (a Bernie-or-buster who seems to be reluctantly coming around to voting tactically for Clinton) is big into alternative medicine. She lives in a swing state where the latest polls are very close. I'm not gonna say anything, of course, and it's none of my business who she votes for – but I kinda wish I hadn't mentioned Stein to her. The sort of people who believe Bernie conspiracy theories are often the same people who believe the wacky alt-med stuff. Antiscience is by no means exclusive to the political right; the left just has different pet issues.
Point being: if it surprises you that a significant number of people would vote for a proponent of medical pseudoscience, then you are less cynical than me.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 10:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
If someone comes near saying to me "well, trump would make everything fail faster I can't vote for Hillary" my literal response will be "then you need to get the fuck out of the democratic party, I'm done making this all about you."
Then asking them how their dog is doing or some other better waste of my precious remaining life.
You don't have to engage accelerationists. You can tell them to fuck off. It's okay.
posted by Annika Cicada at 10:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
Then asking them how their dog is doing or some other better waste of my precious remaining life.
You don't have to engage accelerationists. You can tell them to fuck off. It's okay.
posted by Annika Cicada at 10:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
Samantha Bee had an interview with Gary Johnson where she noted that she agreed strongly with half of the things he was saying, and thought that the other half were completely nuts.
That is exactly my understanding of Libertarianism.
posted by mcstayinskool at 10:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [16 favorites]
That is exactly my understanding of Libertarianism.
posted by mcstayinskool at 10:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [16 favorites]
I don't really think I'm open-minded enough to buy that anyone participating in a "lock her up" chant is motivated by anything other than gross old capital-M misogyny or, at the very least, a total willingness to carry water for it.
Without denying that misogyny figures prominently into the equation for most people chanting this, it seems more directly motivated by a total contempt for the rule of law. I mean, there was literally a prime time show trial at the RNC. It's one step away from directly advocating mob justice over Hillary's supposed crimes. As so often, when "law and order" is evoked, it's code for increasing one's power to suppress and punish ideological enemies. There's no coincidence that the antidemocratic factions in each party have latched on to the idea.
posted by vathek at 10:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Without denying that misogyny figures prominently into the equation for most people chanting this, it seems more directly motivated by a total contempt for the rule of law. I mean, there was literally a prime time show trial at the RNC. It's one step away from directly advocating mob justice over Hillary's supposed crimes. As so often, when "law and order" is evoked, it's code for increasing one's power to suppress and punish ideological enemies. There's no coincidence that the antidemocratic factions in each party have latched on to the idea.
posted by vathek at 10:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Elizabeth Warren Had Some Arena-Size Burns for Donald Trump. And who were those bros chanting "Goldman Sachs" at her?
posted by homunculus at 10:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by homunculus at 10:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
That is exactly my understanding of Libertarianism.
My parents are libertarians. Can confirm. As soon as anything economics-related comes up, I nope out of the conversation. It's not reality-based.
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:03 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
My parents are libertarians. Can confirm. As soon as anything economics-related comes up, I nope out of the conversation. It's not reality-based.
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:03 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
In which Sean Hannity gets kicked out of a Wawa in Philadelphia.
posted by Pope Guilty at 10:03 AM on July 26, 2016 [28 favorites]
posted by Pope Guilty at 10:03 AM on July 26, 2016 [28 favorites]
Steve Kornacki:
This will be the 10th straight Dem convention Bill Clinton has addressed. Here's his 1984 tribute to Harry Truman
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:04 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
This will be the 10th straight Dem convention Bill Clinton has addressed. Here's his 1984 tribute to Harry Truman
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:04 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Kevin Drum articulating better than I did why it's not surprising there are BoBers.
Indeed:
Indeed:
Hillary is no saint. But her reputation as dishonest and untrustworthy is about 90 percent invention. Republicans have been throwing mud against the wall forever in an attempt to smear her, and the press has played along eagerly the entire time. When Bernie went down that road, he was taking advantage of decades of Republican lies in the hopes of winning an unwinnable battle. He was also playing directly into Donald Trump's hands...posted by y2karl at 10:04 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
So while I believe Clinton gets more than enough misogynist jeering from scary and crazy types (like all those "bitch" epithets), I don't hear it in that particular shout.
It's a difficult thing to nail down, which is why I equivocated in my initial comment. But as a cis man I feel a responsibility to err on the side of assuming anti-woman undertones if I even suspect one.
Being cismale, I keep having to learn, is like being mostly deaf in terms of identifying casual misogyny -- so if I kinda maybe think I'm hearing something, it's probably there and pretty damn loud to boot
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:05 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
It's a difficult thing to nail down, which is why I equivocated in my initial comment. But as a cis man I feel a responsibility to err on the side of assuming anti-woman undertones if I even suspect one.
Being cismale, I keep having to learn, is like being mostly deaf in terms of identifying casual misogyny -- so if I kinda maybe think I'm hearing something, it's probably there and pretty damn loud to boot
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:05 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
#BernieorBust Dead-Enders Are Not Representative of Sanders or his Supporters
Even though they’re over-represented at the convention and MSNBC seemed determined to track down and interview each and every one of them, #BernieorBusters are a small, shrinking, figuratively and sometimes literally flatulent minority of Sanders supporters. People indifferent to the outcome of the election, or who (like Jill Stein*) are actively working to throw the election for Trump aren’t representative supporters and definitely aren’t representative of “The Left,” as much as they’d like you to think otherwise.posted by tonycpsu at 10:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
I mean, this is the same thing, word for word, that was yelled over and over again at Bush and his ilk ten years ago.
Some people wanted to prosecute Bush for war crimes related to the invasion of Iraq. It's really not the same as chanting to lock op Hillary for no particular reason.
posted by snofoam at 10:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
Some people wanted to prosecute Bush for war crimes related to the invasion of Iraq. It's really not the same as chanting to lock op Hillary for no particular reason.
posted by snofoam at 10:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
In which Sean Hannity gets kicked out of a Wawa in Philadelphia.
Two things to bear in mind re: that story:
1) Wawa uses a touchscreen for ordering, so you don't actually interact with the staff until they hand you your food (unless something goes wrong and needs addressing). So as soon as he walked up to the counter and started telling somebody what to do he was out of line.
2) Cheesesteak hoagies are a crime against God and man.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 10:07 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Two things to bear in mind re: that story:
1) Wawa uses a touchscreen for ordering, so you don't actually interact with the staff until they hand you your food (unless something goes wrong and needs addressing). So as soon as he walked up to the counter and started telling somebody what to do he was out of line.
2) Cheesesteak hoagies are a crime against God and man.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 10:07 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
I mean, this is the same thing, word for word, that was yelled over and over again at Bush and his ilk ten years ago.
Was it, though? 'Blood on your hands'? Yes. 'War criminal'? Yes. 'Send him to the Hague'? Yes. (And that presumes a trial.) But not word-for-word.
Is The Crucible still taught in schools?
posted by holgate at 10:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Was it, though? 'Blood on your hands'? Yes. 'War criminal'? Yes. 'Send him to the Hague'? Yes. (And that presumes a trial.) But not word-for-word.
Is The Crucible still taught in schools?
posted by holgate at 10:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Heed the words of Kurt Vonnegut on totalitarianism in his book Mother Knight:
"The dismaying thing about classic totalitarian mind is that any given gear, thought mutilated, will have at its circumference unbroken sequences of teeth that are immaculately maintained, that are exquisitely machined."
*that* is libertarianism.
posted by Annika Cicada at 10:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
"The dismaying thing about classic totalitarian mind is that any given gear, thought mutilated, will have at its circumference unbroken sequences of teeth that are immaculately maintained, that are exquisitely machined."
*that* is libertarianism.
posted by Annika Cicada at 10:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
what people did or didn't yell at Bush, for whatever reason, has no bearing on whether calling for Clinton to be locked up plays into some seriously fucked up notions about shutting up, restraining, confining, and depriving women of rights and freedoms under the flimsiest of pretexts
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:09 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:09 AM on July 26, 2016 [17 favorites]
If you don't hear misogyny in "lock her up," fine. It's still a contemptible thing to have chanted at the RNC and elsewhere. But I absolutely do hear a sick, violent hatred in it, especially at the RNC, and I hear a lustful pleasure in the idea of trapping that bitch and punishing her. YMMV.
posted by argybarg at 10:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 10:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
It might be that my calibration is a bit off (who's isn't after the last six months) but this "Lock her up" chant seems an order of magnitude more squicky than even the "Hillary For Prison" and "Crooked Hillary"-type discourse.
I hear in it an emphasis on the physicality, a focus not even on the state-of-being-in-jail but on the action of taking a despised woman's body and capturing it, holding it, restraining it.
...
so if I kinda maybe think I'm hearing something, it's probably there and pretty damn loud to boot
As a probably-sexism-deaf redditor of eight years- it's totally there. You hit the nail on the head with your original comment.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 10:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I hear in it an emphasis on the physicality, a focus not even on the state-of-being-in-jail but on the action of taking a despised woman's body and capturing it, holding it, restraining it.
...
so if I kinda maybe think I'm hearing something, it's probably there and pretty damn loud to boot
As a probably-sexism-deaf redditor of eight years- it's totally there. You hit the nail on the head with your original comment.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 10:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
He was also playing directly into Donald Trump's hands...I think a lot of the resistance to Bernie from the Democratic establishment is wrapped up in the fear that his Revolution is the Democratic Party's own Tea Party. Before running for President, Bernie was an Independent caucusing with Democrats and he apparently plans to return to the Senate as an Independent. Ultimately I think his actions were great for the party and the platform, but I'm not going to point any fingers at establishment Democrats flicking Bernie the side-eye for giving their establishment candidate a black eye for the duration of the prolonged and bitterly fought primary campaign, often using rhetoric borrowed from Republican politicians and media analysts. I was greatly heartened by shots of the crowd last night during his speech, where some people were holding Bernie and "I'm With Her" signs pushed together to read "Bernie With Her." I think he did a fantastic job starting to heal the rift he created in the party without sacrificing his ideals or integrity.
posted by xyzzy at 10:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
In medieval England, women were invariably burned alive for crimes that merited a range of various punishments when committed by men.
posted by theodolite at 10:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 10:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
This is getting me a little riled up. Okay so you don't *hear* misogyny in this one example. You don't hear it in this other super specific example over here. You don't hear in this other example. You "well, actually" the hell out of it in this other example. Come on. Look at them all together. You had an entire convention hall screaming for a woman to be locked up for what? Not for any crime she committed; she didn't commit a crime. It sure sounded like she should be locked up for the audacity of trying to be President. There were the Benghazi hearings. The calls for her to answer Bill's daliances. The anger at her wardrobe. Everything, individually, is always just some super-specific and super not misogynistic justification to shame and humiliate her. She *must* be humiliated and shamed. Great, so you don't hear it in one example. Take a step back and look at all the pieces at once, then.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 10:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [78 favorites]
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 10:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [78 favorites]
They probably would have caved and made his sammich at a Sheetz.
I kid. I kid.
posted by cmfletcher at 10:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I kid. I kid.
posted by cmfletcher at 10:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
This is maybe the single most sellable thing I've heard that I can bring up when I'm campaigning for Clinton.
Back when I was in training to sell cars for a living, they told me, "You have two ears and one mouth for a reason, that's the ratio you want to stick to. Listening sells cars." All of my experience in the car business backs that up. It makes sense. You spend a lot of your time asking the customer questions about what they like and what they want and they'll basically tell you how to sell them a car.
Clinton is selling herself as the next President which is a bit more important so you can scale up the importance of listening accordingly.
posted by VTX at 10:14 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Back when I was in training to sell cars for a living, they told me, "You have two ears and one mouth for a reason, that's the ratio you want to stick to. Listening sells cars." All of my experience in the car business backs that up. It makes sense. You spend a lot of your time asking the customer questions about what they like and what they want and they'll basically tell you how to sell them a car.
Clinton is selling herself as the next President which is a bit more important so you can scale up the importance of listening accordingly.
posted by VTX at 10:14 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Sigh. I'm just assuming when someone yells "lock him/her up" they're probably suggesting something criminal, not something sexist or squicky, unless there's evidence to the contrary. Occam's razor is sometimes just a cigar, and all that.
I also think that when this particular crowd gets misogynist, it's generally a lot more obvious. This one just sounds like "She's a crook." to me.
I'll accept that it's possible I am deaf to this, and maybe it's used in some way other than I've always heard it or thought of it. And it's certainly true that most of what is yelled at and about her is predicated on a mess of dislike and discord. But I now have no idea what to think when someone says "lock him up" about a man, however. It's a really common thing said (well, yelled) about anyone you're trying to say is a crook.
I'll shut up now, and try to figure this out quietly. (You're welcome!)
posted by rokusan at 10:16 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I also think that when this particular crowd gets misogynist, it's generally a lot more obvious. This one just sounds like "She's a crook." to me.
I'll accept that it's possible I am deaf to this, and maybe it's used in some way other than I've always heard it or thought of it. And it's certainly true that most of what is yelled at and about her is predicated on a mess of dislike and discord. But I now have no idea what to think when someone says "lock him up" about a man, however. It's a really common thing said (well, yelled) about anyone you're trying to say is a crook.
I'll shut up now, and try to figure this out quietly. (You're welcome!)
posted by rokusan at 10:16 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Oh god that Hannity WaWa story is so fucking good. Sounds like the one on Broad and Walnut. I woulda paid 10 bucks to see that.
posted by lazaruslong at 10:18 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by lazaruslong at 10:18 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
...7. Here's where it gets more interesting. This is one of a handful of developments that tipped me from seeing all this as just a part of Trump's larger shadiness to something more specific and ominous about the relationship between Putin and Trump. As TPM's Tierney Sneed explained in this article, one of the most enduring dynamics of GOP conventions (there's a comparable dynamic on the Dem side) is more mainstream nominees battling conservative activists over the party platform, with activists trying to check all the hardline ideological boxes and the nominees trying to soften most or all of those edges. This is one thing that made the Trump convention very different. The Trump Camp was totally indifferent to the platform. So party activists were able to write one of the most conservative platforms in history. Not with Trump's backing but because he simply didn't care. With one big exception: Trump's team mobilized the nominee's traditional mix of cajoling and strong-arming on one point: changing the party platform on assistance to Ukraine against Russian military operations in eastern Ukraine. For what it's worth (and it's not worth much) I am quite skeptical of most Republicans call for aggressively arming Ukraine to resist Russian aggression. But the single-mindedness of this focus on this one issue - in the context of total indifference to everything else in the platform - speaks volumes.TPM: Trump & Putin. Yes, It's Really a Thing
posted by y2karl at 10:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
Great, so you don't hear it in one example. Take a step back and look at all the pieces at once, then.
After walking past enough trees you really do have to be like "ok we might be in a forest here"
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [24 favorites]
After walking past enough trees you really do have to be like "ok we might be in a forest here"
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [24 favorites]
Look, I just haven't seen enough trees to be sure it's not a really big copse.
posted by biogeo at 10:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 10:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
I hear in it an emphasis on the physicality, a focus not even on the state-of-being-in-jail but on the action of taking a despised woman's body and capturing it, holding it, restraining it.
Biopolitics.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:22 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Biopolitics.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:22 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
rokusan, even though I'm sure you're in earnest, some of your participation in this thread has been indistinguishable from concern trolling. Trump's connection to Russia can be terrifying without assuming he's literally a sleeper agent. The chant can be misogynistic without being purely misogynistic.
posted by vathek at 10:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [28 favorites]
posted by vathek at 10:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [28 favorites]
Look, I just haven't seen enough trees to be sure it's not a really big copse.
well you know like saint ronnie said, if you've seen one tree...
posted by entropicamericana at 10:24 AM on July 26, 2016
well you know like saint ronnie said, if you've seen one tree...
posted by entropicamericana at 10:24 AM on July 26, 2016
I'll accept that it's possible I am deaf to this, and maybe it's used in some way other than I've always heard it or thought of it. And it's certainly true that most of what is yelled at and about her is predicated on a mess of dislike and discord. But I now have no idea what to think when someone says "lock him up" about a man, however. It's a really common thing said (well, yelled) about anyone you're trying to say is a crook.
I think the Harvard study about attitudes toward women seeking political power is particularly illuminating here. One of their key findings was:
When female politicians were described as power-seeking, participants experienced feelings of moral outrage (i.e., contempt, anger, and/or disgust) towards them."
The sheer outrage vented at Clinton is all out of proportion to any of her actions that anyone might disagree with. More tellingly, men who have done the exact same things don't get anywhere near the level of vitriol she does.
posted by pocketfullofrye at 10:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [39 favorites]
I think the Harvard study about attitudes toward women seeking political power is particularly illuminating here. One of their key findings was:
When female politicians were described as power-seeking, participants experienced feelings of moral outrage (i.e., contempt, anger, and/or disgust) towards them."
The sheer outrage vented at Clinton is all out of proportion to any of her actions that anyone might disagree with. More tellingly, men who have done the exact same things don't get anywhere near the level of vitriol she does.
posted by pocketfullofrye at 10:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [39 favorites]
Is there another source on that Hannity Wawa story? It's kind of hard to believe on its face, and if that was going down surely someone would've whipped out a cell phone and started recording... also, the guy's Twitter bio ends with #SATIRE. So as amusing as it is, I'd take it with a yuuuge grain of salt.
posted by Roommate at 10:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Roommate at 10:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
But I now have no idea what to think when someone says "lock him up" about a man, however. It's a really common thing said (well, yelled) about anyone you're trying to say is a crook.
I'll shut up now, and try to figure this out quietly. (You're welcome!)
I'm not mad (at you) and I don't think anyone else in the thread is either. It would be really fucking great if misogyny and homophobia and racism and xenophobia and classism and all the other bullshit came with handy stickers saying "this is X-ism" but they don't.
Obviously it is possible for people to play the "X-ism card" unfairly. I've seen it done and it's infuriating, if only because it's a form of wolf-crying that just makes it that much more difficult to deal with legitimate critiques.
So, how do we adjudicate these claims? Who determines the "legitimacy" of critiques? I suggest that the best arbiter is the collective judgement of the community of persons who are learning together to listen to each others' stories.
Metafilter is, at its best, one such community. There are others. There can be even more.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
I'll shut up now, and try to figure this out quietly. (You're welcome!)
I'm not mad (at you) and I don't think anyone else in the thread is either. It would be really fucking great if misogyny and homophobia and racism and xenophobia and classism and all the other bullshit came with handy stickers saying "this is X-ism" but they don't.
Obviously it is possible for people to play the "X-ism card" unfairly. I've seen it done and it's infuriating, if only because it's a form of wolf-crying that just makes it that much more difficult to deal with legitimate critiques.
So, how do we adjudicate these claims? Who determines the "legitimacy" of critiques? I suggest that the best arbiter is the collective judgement of the community of persons who are learning together to listen to each others' stories.
Metafilter is, at its best, one such community. There are others. There can be even more.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
The tangent here against hard-copy newspapers is weird. Like yeah, newsflash, wacky Trotskyist newspapers are wacky and Trotskyist, but there are lots of popular street newspapers out there with a variety of orientations. One is sitting on my desk right now! Every medium reaches a different audience in different ways, and while this one might not be the "best", it does occupy its own important niche.
posted by threeants at 10:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by threeants at 10:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
well you know like saint ronnie said...
Mr. Trump, Don't Build That Wall.
posted by y2karl at 10:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Mr. Trump, Don't Build That Wall.
posted by y2karl at 10:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Sigh. I'm just assuming when someone yells "lock him/her up" they're probably suggesting something criminal, not something sexist or squicky, unless there's evidence to the contrary. Occam's razor is sometimes just a cigar, and all that.
You seem to think we're saying "they secretly and knowingly and specifically want to stop A Woman from being president." But that level of self-awareness is not required for something to qualify as sexist. If they have unwittingly absorbed decades of sexist propaganda, it doesn't matter if they sincerely think they're really all just in this for economic justice.
posted by showbiz_liz at 10:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
You seem to think we're saying "they secretly and knowingly and specifically want to stop A Woman from being president." But that level of self-awareness is not required for something to qualify as sexist. If they have unwittingly absorbed decades of sexist propaganda, it doesn't matter if they sincerely think they're really all just in this for economic justice.
posted by showbiz_liz at 10:29 AM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
He was at the Wawa on broad ordering a sandwich. No idea what actually happened.
posted by cmfletcher at 10:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by cmfletcher at 10:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Bernie Sanders tells @bpolitics breakfast w/reporters he'll return to the Senate as an Independent, not a Dem: 'I was elected as an Ind.'
Sanders parachutes into the Democratic Party, calls everyone corrupt and liars, and a few months later parachutes back out and whines "Why don't I get any respect from the DNC?" Is it any surprise that some DNC officials didn't particularly trust Sanders?
Respect is earned from both directions. Sanders has always demonstrated that he is doesn't really want to be associated with the Democratic Party, at least by name. He just temporarily wanted to use its apparatus as a convenience to serve his political purposes.
posted by JackFlash at 10:31 AM on July 26, 2016 [32 favorites]
Sanders parachutes into the Democratic Party, calls everyone corrupt and liars, and a few months later parachutes back out and whines "Why don't I get any respect from the DNC?" Is it any surprise that some DNC officials didn't particularly trust Sanders?
Respect is earned from both directions. Sanders has always demonstrated that he is doesn't really want to be associated with the Democratic Party, at least by name. He just temporarily wanted to use its apparatus as a convenience to serve his political purposes.
posted by JackFlash at 10:31 AM on July 26, 2016 [32 favorites]
I'm not planning to vote for Jill Stein in 2016, but I am deeply interested in getting citations for these purported pro-homeopathy, anti-vaccine positions some here ascribe to her and the Green Party. I see no mention of either topic on her site; when I looked at their platform it only mentioned allowing homeopathy 'as appropriate' and all I could find about vaccines was to expand clinical trials and to research vaccines more.
Yet I see it taken as undisputed fact that she is pro-homeopathy and anti-vaccine. Cite?
posted by Radiophonic Oddity at 10:33 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yet I see it taken as undisputed fact that she is pro-homeopathy and anti-vaccine. Cite?
posted by Radiophonic Oddity at 10:33 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
when I looked at their platform it only mentioned allowing homeopathy 'as appropriate'
It's never appropriate.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 10:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
It's never appropriate.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 10:35 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
It's not hard to find stupid vaccination and homeopathy quotes from Jill Stein.
posted by agregoli at 10:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by agregoli at 10:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
For homeopathy, just because something is untested doesn't mean it's safe. By the same token, being "tested" and "reviewed" by agencies tied to big pharma and the chemical industry is also problematic.
posted by tofu_crouton at 10:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by tofu_crouton at 10:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Biopolitics.
Sigh, I know Foucault is brilliant and I'm probably a Foucauldian all things considered but damn those French postwar philosophers needed some editors
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Sigh, I know Foucault is brilliant and I'm probably a Foucauldian all things considered but damn those French postwar philosophers needed some editors
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Stein, on reddit: I don’t know if we have an “official” stance, but I can tell you my personal stance at this point. According to the most recent review of vaccination policies across the globe, mandatory vaccination that doesn’t allow for medical exemptions is practically unheard of. In most countries, people trust their regulatory agencies and have very high rates of vaccination through voluntary programs. In the US, however, regulatory agencies are routinely packed with corporate lobbyists and CEOs. So the foxes are guarding the chicken coop as usual in the US. So who wouldn’t be skeptical? I think dropping vaccinations rates that can and must be fixed in order to get at the vaccination issue: the widespread distrust of the medical-indsutrial (sic) complex.
Vaccines in general have made a huge contribution to public health. Reducing or eliminating devastating diseases like small pox and polio. In Canada, where I happen to have some numbers, hundreds of annual death from measles and whooping cough were eliminated after vaccines were introduced. Still, vaccines should be treated like any medical procedure–each one needs to be tested and regulated by parties that do not have a financial interest in them. In an age when industry lobbyists and CEOs are routinely appointed to key regulatory positions through the notorious revolving door, its no wonder many Americans don’t trust the FDA to be an unbiased source of sound advice. A Monsanto lobbyists and CEO like Michael Taylor, former high-ranking DEA official, should not decide what food is safe for you to eat. Same goes for vaccines and pharmaceuticals. We need to take the corporate influence out of government so people will trust our health authorities, and the rest of the government for that matter. End the revolving door. Appoint qualified professionals without a financial interest in the product being regulated. Create public funding of elections to stop the buying of elections by corporations and the super-rich.
For homeopathy, just because something is untested doesn’t mean it’s safe. By the same token, being “tested” and “reviewed” by agencies tied to big pharma and the chemical industry is also problematic. There’s a lot of snake-oil in this system. We need research and licensing boards that are protected from conflicts of interest. They should not be limited by arbitrary definitions of what is “natural” or not.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Vaccines in general have made a huge contribution to public health. Reducing or eliminating devastating diseases like small pox and polio. In Canada, where I happen to have some numbers, hundreds of annual death from measles and whooping cough were eliminated after vaccines were introduced. Still, vaccines should be treated like any medical procedure–each one needs to be tested and regulated by parties that do not have a financial interest in them. In an age when industry lobbyists and CEOs are routinely appointed to key regulatory positions through the notorious revolving door, its no wonder many Americans don’t trust the FDA to be an unbiased source of sound advice. A Monsanto lobbyists and CEO like Michael Taylor, former high-ranking DEA official, should not decide what food is safe for you to eat. Same goes for vaccines and pharmaceuticals. We need to take the corporate influence out of government so people will trust our health authorities, and the rest of the government for that matter. End the revolving door. Appoint qualified professionals without a financial interest in the product being regulated. Create public funding of elections to stop the buying of elections by corporations and the super-rich.
For homeopathy, just because something is untested doesn’t mean it’s safe. By the same token, being “tested” and “reviewed” by agencies tied to big pharma and the chemical industry is also problematic. There’s a lot of snake-oil in this system. We need research and licensing boards that are protected from conflicts of interest. They should not be limited by arbitrary definitions of what is “natural” or not.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Pocahontas bombed last night! Sad to watch.
...or not: Democratic National Convention Night One Draws Bigger Early Ratings Than RNC
Warren has taken up permanent residence in his head, and it's showing. I bet she's laughing her ass off right now.
posted by zombieflanders at 10:37 AM on July 26, 2016 [29 favorites]
...or not: Democratic National Convention Night One Draws Bigger Early Ratings Than RNC
Warren has taken up permanent residence in his head, and it's showing. I bet she's laughing her ass off right now.
posted by zombieflanders at 10:37 AM on July 26, 2016 [29 favorites]
Apologies if it comes across as concern trolling, vathek. In my mind, I'm just trying to hold up an occasional "let's be reasonable" sign or be a little charitable, because I'd hate to see things in this generally rational and healthy community go off the deep-end into the kinds of one-sided broad brush discourse one traditionally only finds on nutjob websites. (Too, this has always been a pretty safe place to disagree and argue politely without being shouted down, especially when everyone participating is like 97% in agreement, and I hope it remains so.)
Maybe it's a microcosm of this election season, where 3% differences get argued like life and death sometimes. Not sure.
(And yeah, I was sincere when I said I'd shut up and listen about that other thing. I'm puzzled, but genuinely so, and will continue trying to figure it out without derailing things here.)
posted by rokusan at 10:37 AM on July 26, 2016
Maybe it's a microcosm of this election season, where 3% differences get argued like life and death sometimes. Not sure.
(And yeah, I was sincere when I said I'd shut up and listen about that other thing. I'm puzzled, but genuinely so, and will continue trying to figure it out without derailing things here.)
posted by rokusan at 10:37 AM on July 26, 2016
> The tangent here against hard-copy newspapers is weird. Like yeah, newsflash, wacky Trotskyist newspapers are wacky and Trotskyist, but there are lots of popular street newspapers out there with a variety of orientations. One is sitting on my desk right now! Every medium reaches a different audience in different ways, and while this one might not be the "best", it does occupy its own important niche.
posted by threeants at 10:27 AM on July 26 [+] [!]
Oh, word — there are in fact street newspapers that are worthwhile / report usefully on things. Like, I read Real Change on the regular when I lived in Seattle. Party newspapers, though, are... um... something different...
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:38 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by threeants at 10:27 AM on July 26 [+] [!]
Oh, word — there are in fact street newspapers that are worthwhile / report usefully on things. Like, I read Real Change on the regular when I lived in Seattle. Party newspapers, though, are... um... something different...
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:38 AM on July 26, 2016
Sorry about my botched NYC / Texas comparison.
My point was more that New York's population is spread pretty evenly, so the New York Senators basically need to visit each county to visit a representative portion of the state.
Obviously, this would be impractical in Texas, particularly given the large number of sparsely-populated areas.
If you exclude the Texas counties with fewer than 25,000 people (Texas has 154; NY has 2), you'd only need to visit 100 counties. If you expanded that threshold further to 50,000 people, you'd only need to visit 45 counties in NY or TX.
This is also ignoring the fact that Texas has 15 million more people than NY. If your goal is to visit the counties that comprise 90% of the population, you'd probably need to visit more counties in NY than TX.
posted by schmod at 10:40 AM on July 26, 2016
My point was more that New York's population is spread pretty evenly, so the New York Senators basically need to visit each county to visit a representative portion of the state.
Obviously, this would be impractical in Texas, particularly given the large number of sparsely-populated areas.
If you exclude the Texas counties with fewer than 25,000 people (Texas has 154; NY has 2), you'd only need to visit 100 counties. If you expanded that threshold further to 50,000 people, you'd only need to visit 45 counties in NY or TX.
This is also ignoring the fact that Texas has 15 million more people than NY. If your goal is to visit the counties that comprise 90% of the population, you'd probably need to visit more counties in NY than TX.
posted by schmod at 10:40 AM on July 26, 2016
It's never appropriate.
Taken in sufficient doses it will cure a thirst.
posted by howfar at 10:40 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
Taken in sufficient doses it will cure a thirst.
posted by howfar at 10:40 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
Thanks. I don't see homeopathy as being distinguishable from the placebo effect, so I think it would be appropriate wherever a placebo is efficacious. And nothing cited has any stink of anti-vaccine to me, just increased safety and a process that engenders the public trust.
Personally I think that if this is all she's said, it's unfair to paint her as pro-homeopathy, anti-vaccine.
posted by Radiophonic Oddity at 10:40 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Personally I think that if this is all she's said, it's unfair to paint her as pro-homeopathy, anti-vaccine.
posted by Radiophonic Oddity at 10:40 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Stein's waffling on homeopathy is cringeworthy indeed. I imagine it's some political calculation about not wanting to alienate the crazier contingents who support the Green Party, but any sort of anti-science definitely closes off the party to those who might give them a shot otherwise, and that's a much bigger group of voters, I think.
In my brief time in these parts, the Greens in America have always seemed like a good idea that lacked organization or adult supervision, with a platform one part sensible and one part completely-nuts. It's funny how that sort of makes them the mirror image of the Libertarians.
posted by rokusan at 10:42 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
In my brief time in these parts, the Greens in America have always seemed like a good idea that lacked organization or adult supervision, with a platform one part sensible and one part completely-nuts. It's funny how that sort of makes them the mirror image of the Libertarians.
posted by rokusan at 10:42 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
From the Green Party's website: "We support the teaching, funding and practice of holistic health approaches and, as appropriate, the use of complementary and alternative therapies such as herbal medicines, homeopathy, naturopathy, traditional Chinese medicine and other healing approaches."
If you don't want people saying that you support the use of homeopathic remedies, don't put it in your platform.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 10:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [28 favorites]
If you don't want people saying that you support the use of homeopathic remedies, don't put it in your platform.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 10:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [28 favorites]
From homunculus's link re: Warren:
posted by Salieri at 10:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
The Senator Professor went on uninterrupted, and she came straight out of that very lovely vacation cottage she's rented beneath the shade of the ferret that festoons the Republican candidate's head. She seems quite happy there, and not predisposed to move out of his head any time soon.Charles P. Pierce's descriptions are a national treasure.
posted by Salieri at 10:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
When I hear people chanting "lock her up" about Hillary Clinton, it instantly makes me think of those Victorian postcards about suffragettes, like being dragged off by police, or force-feeding them in prison, or strapping them to a chair and putting their heads in a vice to shut them up, or literally locking their mouths shut.
It's not new, the fevered desire to lock women away for daring to think they should have an equal voice in public speech.
posted by current resident at 10:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [50 favorites]
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It's not new, the fevered desire to lock women away for daring to think they should have an equal voice in public speech.
posted by current resident at 10:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [50 favorites]
We need new words that mean "unwittingly sexist" and "unwittingly racist." Because SOOO many people hear "racist" and "sexist" and think it means conscious discrimination. And then they're like "I don't even know anyone who's okay with that." And they probably don't. That battle is pretty much won.
But it turns out human beings' behaviors come from more than just our conscious minds. And unconscious racism and sexism are responsible for the majority of the difference in outcomes that women and people of color still experience.
I guess "Implicit bias" is getting at the concept I'm talking about, but I'm not sure many people know what that means yet. I think at least 75% of what the Black Lives Matter movement is protesting is the result of implicit bias, for instance, but All Lives Matter and Blue Lives Matter people think cops are being accused of explicit, conscious desire to kill black people, like they woke up that day and thought "Hey, I want to find a black person to kill." But that's not it. It's more like the hairs on the back of their neck rise when there's a black man around, and their trigger fingers get itchy. Sympathetic nervous system stuff, not conscious desire to harm.
I think the sexism that Hillary Clinton faces is much the same. People don't don't like her, and they can't say exactly why. They don't even realize that some of it's because she's a woman inhabiting a social role which is not normally inhabited by women... Something about her just feels "off" to them. It's not conscious misogyny, mostly. It's implicit bias, at a level of the brain which isn't accessible to the conscious mind, and isn't easy to control.
posted by OnceUponATime at 10:45 AM on July 26, 2016 [35 favorites]
But it turns out human beings' behaviors come from more than just our conscious minds. And unconscious racism and sexism are responsible for the majority of the difference in outcomes that women and people of color still experience.
I guess "Implicit bias" is getting at the concept I'm talking about, but I'm not sure many people know what that means yet. I think at least 75% of what the Black Lives Matter movement is protesting is the result of implicit bias, for instance, but All Lives Matter and Blue Lives Matter people think cops are being accused of explicit, conscious desire to kill black people, like they woke up that day and thought "Hey, I want to find a black person to kill." But that's not it. It's more like the hairs on the back of their neck rise when there's a black man around, and their trigger fingers get itchy. Sympathetic nervous system stuff, not conscious desire to harm.
I think the sexism that Hillary Clinton faces is much the same. People don't don't like her, and they can't say exactly why. They don't even realize that some of it's because she's a woman inhabiting a social role which is not normally inhabited by women... Something about her just feels "off" to them. It's not conscious misogyny, mostly. It's implicit bias, at a level of the brain which isn't accessible to the conscious mind, and isn't easy to control.
posted by OnceUponATime at 10:45 AM on July 26, 2016 [35 favorites]
Is there another source on that Hannity Wawa story? It's kind of hard to believe on its face
Yeah, it ticks off far too many stereotypes of the conservative racist -- "you people", misnaming an African-American woman -- all at once. Hannity's an oaf, but really?
posted by holgate at 10:45 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yeah, it ticks off far too many stereotypes of the conservative racist -- "you people", misnaming an African-American woman -- all at once. Hannity's an oaf, but really?
posted by holgate at 10:45 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
For me, there's a difference between calling someone a crook and the chanting of "Lock her up!". Calling someone a crook is an accusation, one that the accused can still defend against. "Lock her up!" goes further and allows people to imagine Hillary Clinton behind prison walls and in an orange jumpsuit. It shifts from saying someone has done something wrong and is untrustworthy like calling someone a crook is, and shifts it to focus on how humiliating it would be for Hillary Clinton to be seen in a jumpsuit and behind bars. And humiliating women is a common theme for misogynists.
posted by FJT at 10:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by FJT at 10:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
My point was more that New York's population is spread pretty evenly,
It's pretty heavily tilted toward the City. (Although the boroughs are counties in their own right.)
Connecticut might be a better example. They don't have official counties anymore (except as historical references) it's all just cities and a ton of towns (and various overlapping administrative organizations.)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 10:47 AM on July 26, 2016
It's pretty heavily tilted toward the City. (Although the boroughs are counties in their own right.)
Connecticut might be a better example. They don't have official counties anymore (except as historical references) it's all just cities and a ton of towns (and various overlapping administrative organizations.)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 10:47 AM on July 26, 2016
y2karl: So party activists were able to write one of the most conservative platforms in history.
Some interesting bits got slipped in there, though, including the restoration of Glass-Steagall. In the official Republican Party platform. It has caused a few double-takes in conservative circles.
posted by clawsoon at 10:48 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Some interesting bits got slipped in there, though, including the restoration of Glass-Steagall. In the official Republican Party platform. It has caused a few double-takes in conservative circles.
posted by clawsoon at 10:48 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Rep. Steve Lynch: Some of Sanders’ backers ‘not dealing with reality’: “This is the process: If you have enough votes to get the nomination, then you win. If you don’t have enough votes and come in second you lose. That’s how it goes.”
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:48 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:48 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
There are still people literally trying to get Bernie the nomination.
The convention will be done, everyone will be out on the campaign trail, and some BoBs will still be trying to get Bernie the nomination.
posted by Talez at 10:49 AM on July 26, 2016
The convention will be done, everyone will be out on the campaign trail, and some BoBs will still be trying to get Bernie the nomination.
posted by Talez at 10:49 AM on July 26, 2016
When I hear people chanting "lock her up" about Hillary Clinton, it instantly makes me think of those Victorian postcards about suffragettes, like being dragged off by police, or force-feeding them in prison, or strapping them to a chair and putting their heads in a vice to shut them up, or literally locking their mouths shut.
exactly, current resident.
Women died from force feeding when as suffrage protesters they went on hunger strikes. The Cat and Mouse Act was a thing.
If you zoom in super close to one specific act and ignore everything else that points to structural misogyny in our political system that doesn't make it go away.
posted by winna at 10:49 AM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
exactly, current resident.
Women died from force feeding when as suffrage protesters they went on hunger strikes. The Cat and Mouse Act was a thing.
If you zoom in super close to one specific act and ignore everything else that points to structural misogyny in our political system that doesn't make it go away.
posted by winna at 10:49 AM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
I'm just trying to hold up an occasional
Yeah, it's way more than occasional at this point.
"let's be reasonable" sign or be a little charitable
If I'm reading the room right, most people who think the chant is misogynistic have acknowledged in some way or another that it's reasonable to disagree, and that they don't have an unassailable empirical case that it is. They're just saying that the chant comes off that way to them. You seem to be the one pushing hard to change their minds in ways that go way beyond merely asking people to be reasonable and charitable.
because I'd hate to see things in this generally rational and healthy community go off the deep-end into the kinds of one-sided broad brush discourse one traditionally only finds on nutjob websites.
Somehow I don't think the question of whether a chant strikes some other members as misogynistic is the leading tip of the spear that will transform MetaFilter into a poorly-moderated subreddit.
posted by tonycpsu at 10:49 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
Yeah, it's way more than occasional at this point.
"let's be reasonable" sign or be a little charitable
If I'm reading the room right, most people who think the chant is misogynistic have acknowledged in some way or another that it's reasonable to disagree, and that they don't have an unassailable empirical case that it is. They're just saying that the chant comes off that way to them. You seem to be the one pushing hard to change their minds in ways that go way beyond merely asking people to be reasonable and charitable.
because I'd hate to see things in this generally rational and healthy community go off the deep-end into the kinds of one-sided broad brush discourse one traditionally only finds on nutjob websites.
Somehow I don't think the question of whether a chant strikes some other members as misogynistic is the leading tip of the spear that will transform MetaFilter into a poorly-moderated subreddit.
posted by tonycpsu at 10:49 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
For what it's worth, my friend in Philly said she's been in a bunch of street protests and has not heard "lock her up."
posted by argybarg at 10:50 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by argybarg at 10:50 AM on July 26, 2016
Is there another source on that Hannity Wawa story?
There is photographic evidence of Hannity in WaWa looking confused, though the Tweeter says he left before Hannity made his order.
Make sure you read the whole string of tweets to get the whole story. I had to click "Show More" at least twice. It starts with Hannity cutting everybody in line and demanding someone make him a sandwich, and ends with these two tweets:
posted by msalt at 10:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
There is photographic evidence of Hannity in WaWa looking confused, though the Tweeter says he left before Hannity made his order.
Make sure you read the whole string of tweets to get the whole story. I had to click "Show More" at least twice. It starts with Hannity cutting everybody in line and demanding someone make him a sandwich, and ends with these two tweets:
E. Mo Black @EmoNegro1 2 hours ago
My source says the manager gave Hannity a look like "You Tried It!" and hustled him out of the door!
E. Mo Black @EmoNegro1 2 hours ago
And that's the story of how Sean Hannity got ran up out of the Wawa in downtown Philly!
posted by msalt at 10:50 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Personally I think that if this is all she's said, it's unfair to paint her as pro-homeopathy, anti-vaccine.
Her vaccine comments are nothing more than implied corruption and textbook ad hominem, though. She impugns the entire FDA apparatus, when it's never been demonstrated that there have been issues related to for-profit companies developing the vaccines that keep us from getting measles and smallpox. In fact, the entire suspicion of vaccines stems from manufactured horseshit spewed by Wakefield and his ilk.
So yeah, she's pretty much textbook "teach the controversy!" antivax. There are no two sides here.
Also, homeopathy is not the same as the placebo effect, and homeopathy is straight up bullshit. It has no place in the platform of a modern political party.
posted by Existential Dread at 10:51 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
Her vaccine comments are nothing more than implied corruption and textbook ad hominem, though. She impugns the entire FDA apparatus, when it's never been demonstrated that there have been issues related to for-profit companies developing the vaccines that keep us from getting measles and smallpox. In fact, the entire suspicion of vaccines stems from manufactured horseshit spewed by Wakefield and his ilk.
So yeah, she's pretty much textbook "teach the controversy!" antivax. There are no two sides here.
Also, homeopathy is not the same as the placebo effect, and homeopathy is straight up bullshit. It has no place in the platform of a modern political party.
posted by Existential Dread at 10:51 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
Stein's waffling on homeopathy
Mmmm. Homeopathic waffles.
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:51 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Mmmm. Homeopathic waffles.
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:51 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Mmmm. Homeopathic waffles.
Wouldn't that just be pure maple syrup, then?
posted by Existential Dread at 10:52 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Wouldn't that just be pure maple syrup, then?
posted by Existential Dread at 10:52 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Mmmm. Homeopathic waffles.
That's just a plate that had waffles on it at some point.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 10:52 AM on July 26, 2016 [35 favorites]
That's just a plate that had waffles on it at some point.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 10:52 AM on July 26, 2016 [35 favorites]
There seem to be a number of sources that he either got thrown out or booed out, and cutting in line would be a more logical cause of that than people just taking offense to him being Hannity. Even if that would be understandable.
posted by tavella at 10:53 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by tavella at 10:53 AM on July 26, 2016
I once sat beside a guy at an NDP election-night gathering who kept shouting, "Harper to the slammer!" I'm just sayin' that this seems to be a thing within a certain segment of political activists. It's not at all attractive, and really degrades the entire political discussion. I didn't say anything to the guy, but maybe peer-to-peer intervention would be helpful.
posted by No Robots at 10:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by No Robots at 10:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Calling out the sexism that Clinton deals with and then being like "but Jill Stein is totally a crazy homeopathy lady, amirite" is not a good look.
posted by threeants at 10:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by threeants at 10:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Sanders sources tell @KellyO—No plan for him to personally nominate Clinton tonight; expectation is VT goes last, asks for unanimous consent (cite)
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
That's just a plate that had waffles on it at some point.
No, no, if you put the waffles ON the plate you might leave physical waffle material on it. You're just looking for the sympathetic molecular vibrations! I recommend gently wafting the air from a cooking waffle toward the plate, no closer than 5 meters.
posted by Gaz Errant at 10:56 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
No, no, if you put the waffles ON the plate you might leave physical waffle material on it. You're just looking for the sympathetic molecular vibrations! I recommend gently wafting the air from a cooking waffle toward the plate, no closer than 5 meters.
posted by Gaz Errant at 10:56 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
The convention will be done, everyone will be out on the campaign trail, and some BoBs will still be trying to get Bernie the nomination.
It's the Left's version of the "Sovereign Citizen" thing. There is no arguing with them. We can only let them fail and, hopefully, learn from the experience.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 10:56 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's the Left's version of the "Sovereign Citizen" thing. There is no arguing with them. We can only let them fail and, hopefully, learn from the experience.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 10:56 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yes, he did. But only after withholding it long enough to get his issues onto the platform.
You say this like it's a bad thing. Realistically, it's probably the best Sanders could have hoped for, his ultimate goal to begin with, and a good thing for the democratic party and the United States. We've gone 36 years with the word "liberal" being some kind of scarlet letter. That hasn't worked out so well for the average American.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
You say this like it's a bad thing. Realistically, it's probably the best Sanders could have hoped for, his ultimate goal to begin with, and a good thing for the democratic party and the United States. We've gone 36 years with the word "liberal" being some kind of scarlet letter. That hasn't worked out so well for the average American.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Not sure most of you care but I'm excited about Pittsburgh's police chief speaking at the convention tonight. He's an interesting guy who's valiantly trying to drag the entrenched police here into the 21st century.
posted by octothorpe at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
We need new words that mean "unwittingly sexist" and "unwittingly racist." Because SOOO many people hear "racist" and "sexist" and think it means conscious discrimination. And then they're like "I don't even know anyone who's okay with that." And they probably don't. That battle is pretty much won.
I think the "privilege" discourse, McIntosh's "invisible knapsack" and so on was an attempt at this at one point? But now people get all pissy when you call them privileged, too, so it's sort of a moving target. The new words are inevitably tarred with the connotations of the old words, in much the same way as how every 10-ish years we have to come up with new vocabulary for persons with developmental disabilities because they eventually transition to playground insults.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I think the "privilege" discourse, McIntosh's "invisible knapsack" and so on was an attempt at this at one point? But now people get all pissy when you call them privileged, too, so it's sort of a moving target. The new words are inevitably tarred with the connotations of the old words, in much the same way as how every 10-ish years we have to come up with new vocabulary for persons with developmental disabilities because they eventually transition to playground insults.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Calling out the sexism that Clinton deals with and then being like "but Jill Stein is totally a crazy homeopathy lady, amirite" is not a good look.
Idk, talking about positions that Stein herself as taken and criticizing her for them is not on the same plane as "Lock Her Up" imo
posted by Existential Dread at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
Idk, talking about positions that Stein herself as taken and criticizing her for them is not on the same plane as "Lock Her Up" imo
posted by Existential Dread at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
How is Trump still allowed to call Warren "Pocahontas"?!?? This man is running for PRESIDENT! I don't understand how he keeps getting a pass on this??
posted by like_neon at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by like_neon at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
expectation is VT goes last, asks for unanimous consent
I know I'm gonna slap my forehead so hard in a minute, but who or what is "VT"?
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016
I know I'm gonna slap my forehead so hard in a minute, but who or what is "VT"?
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016
Make sure you read the whole string of tweets to get the whole story.
Yeah, I did. I don't doubt that Hannity was at Wawa (certainly photographic evidence of that), and he probably got some boos. I just don't think that elaborate story from his "source" is true.
Taking a rumor or tidbit and running with it seems like it might be his schtick
posted by Roommate at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah, I did. I don't doubt that Hannity was at Wawa (certainly photographic evidence of that), and he probably got some boos. I just don't think that elaborate story from his "source" is true.
Taking a rumor or tidbit and running with it seems like it might be his schtick
posted by Roommate at 10:57 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Vermont
posted by cmfletcher at 10:58 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by cmfletcher at 10:58 AM on July 26, 2016
VT is Vermont.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:58 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:58 AM on July 26, 2016
Calling out the sexism that Clinton deals with and then being like "but Jill Stein is totally a crazy homeopathy lady, amirite" is not a good look.
You're 100% right and I apologize. People, from now on, Jill Stein is totally a crazy, homeopathy PERSON.
posted by Talez at 10:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [18 favorites]
You're 100% right and I apologize. People, from now on, Jill Stein is totally a crazy, homeopathy PERSON.
posted by Talez at 10:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [18 favorites]
Vermont. (You can forego the slap.)
posted by yhbc at 10:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by yhbc at 10:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I don't understand how he keeps getting a pass on this??
A pass from who? His supporters are totes okay with blatant racism.
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
A pass from who? His supporters are totes okay with blatant racism.
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
How is Trump still allowed to call Warren "Pocahontas"?!?? This man is running for PRESIDENT! I don't understand how he keeps getting a pass on this??
Welp, a nice* fringe benefit of having a mostly sexist and racist base of support is that you get to say sexist and racist things all day long with no apparent blowback.
*replace with your adjective of choice
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Welp, a nice* fringe benefit of having a mostly sexist and racist base of support is that you get to say sexist and racist things all day long with no apparent blowback.
*replace with your adjective of choice
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
*slap*
Vermont. (You can forego the slap.)
too late
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Vermont. (You can forego the slap.)
too late
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
How is Trump still allowed to call Warren "Pocahontas"?!?
What does that even mean?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
What does that even mean?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:00 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I don't understand how he keeps getting a pass on this??
i blame the liberal media
posted by entropicamericana at 11:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
i blame the liberal media
posted by entropicamericana at 11:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Green Party platform:
Greens support a wide range of health care services, not just traditional medicine, which too often emphasizes "a medical arms race" that relies upon high-tech intervention, surgical techniques and costly pharmaceuticals. Chronic conditions are often best cured by alternative medicine. We support the teaching, funding and practice of holistic health approaches and, as appropriate, the use of complementary and alternative therapies such as herbal medicines, homeopathy, naturopathy, traditional Chinese medicine and other healing approaches.posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
We need new words that mean "unwittingly sexist" and "unwittingly racist."
You've seen this, right?
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 11:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
You've seen this, right?
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 11:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
How is Trump still allowed to call Warren "Pocahontas"?!??
Double trouble: both misogyny and racism are Totally 100% A-OK in the GOP. It's not a character flaw, it's fun!
And as long as there's no internal pushback, there will be nobody taking advantage of the power fluctuation to leverage him out for their own advancement. I'm not even sure that person/faction exists! I think that might be the entire problem here.
posted by Lyn Never at 11:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Double trouble: both misogyny and racism are Totally 100% A-OK in the GOP. It's not a character flaw, it's fun!
And as long as there's no internal pushback, there will be nobody taking advantage of the power fluctuation to leverage him out for their own advancement. I'm not even sure that person/faction exists! I think that might be the entire problem here.
posted by Lyn Never at 11:01 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish, that's where I drew the 'as appropriate' ... 'homeopathy' quote that I mentioned earlier.
posted by Radiophonic Oddity at 11:03 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by Radiophonic Oddity at 11:03 AM on July 26, 2016
What does that even mean?
Oh it's a whole sad sordid thing. Don't even bother clicking the link, it's a waste of your time.
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:03 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Oh it's a whole sad sordid thing. Don't even bother clicking the link, it's a waste of your time.
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:03 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Calling out the sexism that Clinton deals with and then being like "but Jill Stein is totally a crazy homeopathy lady, amirite" is not a good look.
This is a sincere question: Can you point to an example of what you mean? I don't see any criticisms of her / her party's position on homeopathy here that seem particularly gendered to me, so I would like to see what you're seeing.
posted by biogeo at 11:04 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
This is a sincere question: Can you point to an example of what you mean? I don't see any criticisms of her / her party's position on homeopathy here that seem particularly gendered to me, so I would like to see what you're seeing.
posted by biogeo at 11:04 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I hope Hannity was at the Wawa at Broad and Walnut. Cut in line there and you take your life in your hands. That is probably the busiest Wawa I've ever seen, especially at lunch time when every office building in Center City empties out and gets lunch, so you can probably envision the crowd. They are fantastic people that work there and the place runs like a well-oiled machine, so if you order using the kiosk, your sandwich is almost ready by the time you're done paying. You just wait for the number on your ticket to get called. In the year and a half that I've worked in the city, I've never seen anyone not figure out how to order food.
What a douche.
posted by prepmonkey at 11:05 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
What a douche.
posted by prepmonkey at 11:05 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I like how the Democrats are allowed to pander to the defense, energy, and finance industries all the live-long day, and when the Green Party panders slightly to its own kooky fringe it’s the end of the world. Which nonsense hurt more people—homeopathy or the Iraq War?
posted by threeants at 11:05 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by threeants at 11:05 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Homeopathy and vaccines aside, how about the fact that Jill Stein is seemingly fine with Trump winning because at least maybe the Green Party will be slightly more powerful? It's a perfectly valid position to not like Hillary Clinton's policies or even to think Clinton and Trump aren't different enough in some areas, but only one candidate in this race wants to deport 11 million people, only one candidate in this race wants to ban billions of people on the basis of their religion, and only one candidate in this race has his own name used racist taunt on the schoolyard to make children cry. If Stein can't see a difference there that directly impacts the lives and futures of millions of Americans, that says something.
posted by zachlipton at 11:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 11:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [19 favorites]
Greens support a wide range of health care services, not just traditional medicine, which too often emphasizes "a medical arms race" that relies upon high-tech intervention, surgical techniques and costly pharmaceuticals. Chronic conditions are often best cured by alternative medicine. We support the teaching, funding and practice of holistic health approaches and, as appropriate, the use of complementary and alternative therapies such as herbal medicines, homeopathy, naturopathy, traditional Chinese medicine and other healing approaches.
See... I can totally get down with the first sentence of this paragraph. A lot of modern medicine is shitty because it's not based on the evidence of what is best for people - it's outdated, or based on what makes the most money, or just poorly-organized. Much of it needs to be rethought - just ask anyone who works in end-of-life care, or the mental health field.
But then, for me, it immediately veers off into "don't buy into the manipulative money-grubbing based on outdated ideas that characterizes much of modern medicine - go for a DIFFERENT kind of manipulative money-grubbing based on outdated ideas!"
posted by showbiz_liz at 11:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
See... I can totally get down with the first sentence of this paragraph. A lot of modern medicine is shitty because it's not based on the evidence of what is best for people - it's outdated, or based on what makes the most money, or just poorly-organized. Much of it needs to be rethought - just ask anyone who works in end-of-life care, or the mental health field.
But then, for me, it immediately veers off into "don't buy into the manipulative money-grubbing based on outdated ideas that characterizes much of modern medicine - go for a DIFFERENT kind of manipulative money-grubbing based on outdated ideas!"
posted by showbiz_liz at 11:06 AM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
This is a sincere question: Can you point to an example of what you mean? I don't see any criticisms of her / her party's position on homeopathy here that seem particularly gendered to me, so I would like to see what you're seeing.
It's a totally dismissive attack on a smart, competent woman based on a bad policy position (of which Clinton has had a number as well).
posted by threeants at 11:07 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's a totally dismissive attack on a smart, competent woman based on a bad policy position (of which Clinton has had a number as well).
posted by threeants at 11:07 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Don't even bother clicking the link, it's a waste of your time.
Disagree. Thanks for that.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Disagree. Thanks for that.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Which nonsense hurt more people—homeopathy or the Iraq War?
Fuck. That's a really good point.
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
Fuck. That's a really good point.
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
It also plays into the "kooky hippy lady" trope that attaches to Stein in the same way that "Lock her up" is subtly, rather than facially, sexist.
posted by threeants at 11:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by threeants at 11:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Greens support a wide range of health care services, not just traditional medicine, which too often emphasizes "a medical arms race" that relies upon high-tech intervention, surgical techniques and costly pharmaceuticals. Chronic conditions are often best cured by alternative medicine. We support the teaching, funding and practice of holistic health approaches and, as appropriate, the use of complementary and alternative therapies such as herbal medicines, homeopathy, naturopathy, traditional Chinese medicine and other healing approaches.
This is as anti-science and anti-intellectual as climate change denial. There is no way on this browning earth that I would vote for a platform that was this anti-science.
posted by Sophie1 at 11:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [21 favorites]
This is as anti-science and anti-intellectual as climate change denial. There is no way on this browning earth that I would vote for a platform that was this anti-science.
posted by Sophie1 at 11:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [21 favorites]
Meanwhile, the "USA Freedom Kids" -- yes, *those* USA Freedom Kids -- are planning to sue Trump over broken promises.
Because of course they are. Because this entire year is a bizarre fever dream.
posted by kyrademon at 11:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
Because of course they are. Because this entire year is a bizarre fever dream.
posted by kyrademon at 11:08 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
Trump campaign threatens to cut off access to [NYT reporter Maggie Haberman] over question on David Duke
posted by zombieflanders at 11:09 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 11:09 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
When dealing with Trump, always demand to see the money first.
posted by NoxAeternum at 11:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by NoxAeternum at 11:10 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
PolitiFact: RNC is right that no Democratic speaker mentioned ISIS on convention's first night
This is all you need to know about Politi"Fact". They are simply whoring for the Republicans on every stupid accusation the Republicans can throw out. Republicans make accusation, Fox puts it out there, "Mainstream media" runs with it.
posted by JackFlash at 11:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
This is all you need to know about Politi"Fact". They are simply whoring for the Republicans on every stupid accusation the Republicans can throw out. Republicans make accusation, Fox puts it out there, "Mainstream media" runs with it.
posted by JackFlash at 11:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
when the Green Party panders slightly to its own kooky fringe it’s the end of the world
If it's only "slightly" to a kooky fringe, then they could and should easily drop it.
posted by FJT at 11:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
If it's only "slightly" to a kooky fringe, then they could and should easily drop it.
posted by FJT at 11:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
On the Hannity/WaWa story, Kyle Scott at Crossing Broad -- a sports-oriented tabloidy Philly website that I have written for -- has yet to find evidence, but he's on the case.
The guy has a good track record of uncovering things like this -- he's the one who first published the video of Eagles wide receiver Riley Cooper yelling drunken racial slurs at a Kenny Chesney concert.
posted by msalt at 11:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
The guy has a good track record of uncovering things like this -- he's the one who first published the video of Eagles wide receiver Riley Cooper yelling drunken racial slurs at a Kenny Chesney concert.
posted by msalt at 11:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
the "USA Freedom Kids" -- yes, *those* USA Freedom Kids -- are planning to sue Trump
It's amazing how deft he is at these shell games really given his hands
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
It's amazing how deft he is at these shell games really given his hands
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:11 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
I think Stein absolutely deserves criticism for taking homeopathy the least bit seriously. Anyone who makes it to med school should be able to see through it immediately. The fact that she must know better but doesn't repudiate it means that she's willfully engaging in bullshit.
And don't pretend there's no pushback against Dem involvement in defense, energy, or finance. Do you honestly think that a few critical comments here towards Stein compare to the intra-party disagreements Dems have had about those involvements?
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 11:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [21 favorites]
And don't pretend there's no pushback against Dem involvement in defense, energy, or finance. Do you honestly think that a few critical comments here towards Stein compare to the intra-party disagreements Dems have had about those involvements?
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 11:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [21 favorites]
Meanwhile, the "USA Freedom Kids" -- yes, *those* USA Freedom Kids yt -- are planning to sue Trump over broken promises.
Can we kickstart an ad?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Can we kickstart an ad?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
For me personally, the alternative medicine stuff bothers me because it's emblematic of a broader problem with the Greens, namely that they're too prone to magical thinking.
posted by showbiz_liz at 11:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
posted by showbiz_liz at 11:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
The First Day Of The DNC As Told By Bill Clinton’s Facial Expressions
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:12 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Which nonsense hurt more people—homeopathy or the Iraq War?
Very likely, homeopathy/alternative medicine.
posted by Sophie1 at 11:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [23 favorites]
Very likely, homeopathy/alternative medicine.
posted by Sophie1 at 11:13 AM on July 26, 2016 [23 favorites]
Can we kickstart an ad [about the Freedom Kids suing Trump]?
Great minds think alike. I was just thinking that holy shit, the Dems could do so much about the fact that Trump was a meanie to some little girls in star-spangled skirts.
even if the song they did made me itch
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:16 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Great minds think alike. I was just thinking that holy shit, the Dems could do so much about the fact that Trump was a meanie to some little girls in star-spangled skirts.
even if the song they did made me itch
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:16 AM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
uh uh uh uh let's not have this fight......
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:16 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:16 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Stein's anti-science position on medicine, and her party's position on homeopathy, are legitimately in the domain of quackery. Saying that we can't criticize her for that because it looks similar to illegitimate sexist attacks is exactly the kind of behavior that motivates Trump and his ilk to say that "political correctness" is a stifling attack on political speech.
We shouldn't decry calling a spade a spade just because some rakes got incorrectly called spades before.
posted by 0xFCAF at 11:17 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
We shouldn't decry calling a spade a spade just because some rakes got incorrectly called spades before.
posted by 0xFCAF at 11:17 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
Oh wow, I thought What's The Harm went offline years ago. Nice to be wrong!
posted by Pope Guilty at 11:18 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Pope Guilty at 11:18 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Hm. Okay, thanks. I see the tree, and I see the forest. I'm not entirely sure that this tree is in the forest, but there isn't really an objective answer there. Suffice to say, I think a physician endorsing homeopathy is a problem regardless of her gender, and a politician advocating military force is (usually) a problem regardless of her gender, and Jill Stein is someone I respected as a marginal third-party politician up until her recent rhetoric equating Clinton and Trump.
posted by biogeo at 11:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 11:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
George Will, of all people, linked Trump's refusal to release his tax returns to possible financial links to Russian oligarchs.
posted by msalt at 11:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by msalt at 11:19 AM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
The Green Party's explicit endorsement of homeopathy was recently removed, for what it's worth.
posted by Mapes at 11:20 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Mapes at 11:20 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Pocahontas bombed last night! Sad to watch.
The WashPo has a story today about how Trump's race baiting against Native Americans is nothing new:
The WashPo has a story today about how Trump's race baiting against Native Americans is nothing new:
Donald Trump claimed that Indian reservations had fallen under mob control. He secretly paid for more than $1 million in ads that portrayed members of a tribe in Upstate New York as cocaine traffickers and career criminals. And he suggested in testimony and in media appearances that dark-skinned Native Americans in Connecticut were faking their ancestry.posted by peeedro at 11:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
“I think I might have more Indian blood than a lot of the so-called Indians that are trying to open up the reservations,” Trump said during a 1993 radio interview with shock jock Don Imus.
Democracy Now! (alt link) from Philadelphia this morning, covering the first day of the convention.
posted by XMLicious at 11:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by XMLicious at 11:21 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
a sports-oriented tabloidy Philly website
Major "never read the comments" warning for Crossing Broad, BTW. And pretty much don't read any of the stories either unless you absolutely must find out about gossipy sports stories in the ten minute window between when Twitter breaks them and when a less-tacky sports blog runs them.
posted by tonycpsu at 11:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Major "never read the comments" warning for Crossing Broad, BTW. And pretty much don't read any of the stories either unless you absolutely must find out about gossipy sports stories in the ten minute window between when Twitter breaks them and when a less-tacky sports blog runs them.
posted by tonycpsu at 11:24 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I can agree not to call Jill Stein "crazy," but the Iraq War is no Chewbacca Defense in favor of homeopathy
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
For me personally, the alternative medicine stuff bothers me because it's emblematic of a broader problem with the Greens, namely that they're too prone to magical thinking.
There is an entire para-healthcare sector that has thrived for too long in the US because of cost barriers to conventional medicine. If something works for you, and nobody gets hurt, then pay for it yourself, but supplement hawkers and woo-peddlers and anti-vaxxers are part of a continuum that hurts people. Come up with policies that address the needs of people in rural Virginia who now line up at 5am one day a year to get their teeth pulled, and then you can talk about homeopathy.
This is up there with the Tangy Tangerine person.
posted by holgate at 11:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
There is an entire para-healthcare sector that has thrived for too long in the US because of cost barriers to conventional medicine. If something works for you, and nobody gets hurt, then pay for it yourself, but supplement hawkers and woo-peddlers and anti-vaxxers are part of a continuum that hurts people. Come up with policies that address the needs of people in rural Virginia who now line up at 5am one day a year to get their teeth pulled, and then you can talk about homeopathy.
This is up there with the Tangy Tangerine person.
posted by holgate at 11:25 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
gilrain: Too many parallel discussions to keep straight. I was responding to threeants' criticism it is hypocritical to call out Jill Stein on her position on homeopathy while talking about the sexism Clinton deals with.
posted by biogeo at 11:26 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by biogeo at 11:26 AM on July 26, 2016
RNC Brings Omarosa To Philly To Respond To Clinton On Foreign Policy
i swear that is not The Onion
posted by indubitable at 11:26 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
i swear that is not The Onion
posted by indubitable at 11:26 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
I would call Stein crazy. Anyone else willing to risk a Trump presidency, I'd include in that.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
The Green Party's explicit endorsement of homeopathy was recently removed, for what it's worth.
Yeah, the key word there is explicit. They still endorse alternative medicine, but are just no longer listing homeopathy as an example.
posted by zarq at 11:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Yeah, the key word there is explicit. They still endorse alternative medicine, but are just no longer listing homeopathy as an example.
posted by zarq at 11:27 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Treating an admittedly wrongheaded misstep on science policy like it’s magnitudes worse than the constant concessions Democrats have historically made on so many fronts is essentially respectability politics, and it exhausts me.
I recognize that leftists who decide to vote for Clinton are making the best decision they can based on the intersection of their values and the information available to them, and I really, achingly wish they would extend the same respect to others who make a different choice. That’s my plea, and I’ll stop hitting this point in this thread since I’m clearly in the minority.
posted by threeants at 11:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
I recognize that leftists who decide to vote for Clinton are making the best decision they can based on the intersection of their values and the information available to them, and I really, achingly wish they would extend the same respect to others who make a different choice. That’s my plea, and I’ll stop hitting this point in this thread since I’m clearly in the minority.
posted by threeants at 11:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
> “I think I might have more Indian blood than a lot of the so-called Indians that are trying to open up the reservations,” Trump said during a 1993 radio interview with shock jock Don Imus.
So I've got like at least six different things to say about how obnoxious this is, but really maybe the most bothersome thing of all is that it's 2016 and we all still have to care about what Donald Trump thinks.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
So I've got like at least six different things to say about how obnoxious this is, but really maybe the most bothersome thing of all is that it's 2016 and we all still have to care about what Donald Trump thinks.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
It's amazing how deft he is at these shell games really given his hands
I'd hope that voters would reject Trump without him having to stiff or swindle them personally, but this general election campaign provides him with lots of opportunities to up the count.
posted by holgate at 11:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'd hope that voters would reject Trump without him having to stiff or swindle them personally, but this general election campaign provides him with lots of opportunities to up the count.
posted by holgate at 11:28 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
My only issue voting for a third party this year is that Trump needs to be resoundingly, overwhelmingly defeated. Anything else makes it look like an awful lot of people in the country are okay with what he says.
posted by cooker girl at 11:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [19 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 11:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [19 favorites]
I find Stein's wishy-washy talk on vaccines to be more harmful than "alternative medicine." That and wanting Ed Snowden in the cabinet, which, look, nothing against him, but what experience does he have that qualifies him for the cabinet?
posted by dw at 11:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by dw at 11:30 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
RNC Brings Omarosa To Philly To Respond To Clinton On Foreign Policy
i swear that is not The Onion
Poe's Law is getting a workout this year.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:31 AM on July 26, 2016
i swear that is not The Onion
Poe's Law is getting a workout this year.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:31 AM on July 26, 2016
Major "never read the comments" warning for Crossing Broad, BTW.
Good point on the comments, they are HORRIBLE which is one reason I'm not writing there any more. Working the sharp edge between 8chan trolling and sincere racism/homophobia/antiSemitism.
And pretty much don't read any of the stories either unless you absolutely must find out about gossipy sports stories in the ten minute window between when Twitter breaks them and when a less-tacky sports blog runs them.
Well, my columns recapping Eagles games were excellent. /s
They've broken some big stories and yet are appropriately skeptical in general. I think it's best described as a Millenial tabloid, for better and worse.
posted by msalt at 11:31 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Good point on the comments, they are HORRIBLE which is one reason I'm not writing there any more. Working the sharp edge between 8chan trolling and sincere racism/homophobia/antiSemitism.
And pretty much don't read any of the stories either unless you absolutely must find out about gossipy sports stories in the ten minute window between when Twitter breaks them and when a less-tacky sports blog runs them.
Well, my columns recapping Eagles games were excellent. /s
They've broken some big stories and yet are appropriately skeptical in general. I think it's best described as a Millenial tabloid, for better and worse.
posted by msalt at 11:31 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
But on the other hand, avoiding rudeness absolutely positively cannot be a primary goal of a political organization. Like, okay, "polite" and "political" may seem like similar words, but they're not etymologically related at all. In a lot of ways, "polite" and "political" are antonyms.
Coming back to this some 150 comments later, omg this fast moving thread, but yeah, I didn't mean to make some sort of tone argument, rudeness maybe isn't the right word. Per ArbitraryAndCapricious, "disrespectful" is probably a better word choice. I think it's tremendously disrespectful to chant over speakers like Elijah Cummings, and that as a party and as citizens, we owe each other more respect than literally trying to shout each other down. Like, if you're in a one-on-one conversation in good faith, I think we can all agree that literally screaming over the other person is neither respectful nor productive.
Stuff obviously gets complicated in a political organization or context. The chanters probably feel this is a legitimate avenue for expressing their grievances. I think it gets perilously close to silencing, and that it's not fostering any substantive discussion or doing any real work for the cause. If you've ever been in a meeting where everyone's shouting, you know that no actual work is being done. And that's not even getting to my main problem with the majority of the chanting yesterday, which was that it was done over women and POC talking about important issues. To shout over that is disrespectful to those of us who do care about those issues and want to hear our representatives and party members speak about them. It's emblematic of the campaign-long issues a lot of us have had with Bernie and Bernie supporters who have been pushing economic issues and reform above other issues important to POC voters.
posted by yasaman at 11:32 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Coming back to this some 150 comments later, omg this fast moving thread, but yeah, I didn't mean to make some sort of tone argument, rudeness maybe isn't the right word. Per ArbitraryAndCapricious, "disrespectful" is probably a better word choice. I think it's tremendously disrespectful to chant over speakers like Elijah Cummings, and that as a party and as citizens, we owe each other more respect than literally trying to shout each other down. Like, if you're in a one-on-one conversation in good faith, I think we can all agree that literally screaming over the other person is neither respectful nor productive.
Stuff obviously gets complicated in a political organization or context. The chanters probably feel this is a legitimate avenue for expressing their grievances. I think it gets perilously close to silencing, and that it's not fostering any substantive discussion or doing any real work for the cause. If you've ever been in a meeting where everyone's shouting, you know that no actual work is being done. And that's not even getting to my main problem with the majority of the chanting yesterday, which was that it was done over women and POC talking about important issues. To shout over that is disrespectful to those of us who do care about those issues and want to hear our representatives and party members speak about them. It's emblematic of the campaign-long issues a lot of us have had with Bernie and Bernie supporters who have been pushing economic issues and reform above other issues important to POC voters.
posted by yasaman at 11:32 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Kid Charlemagne: "You say this like it's a bad thing."
I realized that it could come off that way and tried to mitigate it further down when I said "Now, this is not necessarily to fault Sanders, per se." and credited that his delay in offering the endorsement was probably necessary to get his issues accepted onto the DNC platform. But, that cake was baked almost a month ago. Between the time of the platform vote and the convention, I think the main remaining points of contention were the issues of superdelegates and Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, both essentially internal DNC stuff. If Sanders didn't think to start corralling his folks in the weeks in between, I don't know what that says about his leadership and organizational abilities.
Because here's the thing: I'm rooting for Bernie, or at least his general ideals. And I recognize that he's definitely tapped into a genuine wellspring of popular support. But I worry that all this enthusiasm and energy he's generated will dissipate like a fart in the wind in the next few months (or weeks) and the best chance in many years for progressive movement in down-ticket races will be wasted. And, so far, I have not been super impressed with Sanders' ability to direct his supporters. I mean if this is how they (or at least a vocal minority) are reacting to what, imho, amounts to significant policy wins by a primary loser, how are they going to deal with the dry, unglamorous, and often failure-laden work of organizing for state and local elections -- especially the long-shot, 50-state-strategy stuff?
posted by mhum at 11:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
I realized that it could come off that way and tried to mitigate it further down when I said "Now, this is not necessarily to fault Sanders, per se." and credited that his delay in offering the endorsement was probably necessary to get his issues accepted onto the DNC platform. But, that cake was baked almost a month ago. Between the time of the platform vote and the convention, I think the main remaining points of contention were the issues of superdelegates and Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, both essentially internal DNC stuff. If Sanders didn't think to start corralling his folks in the weeks in between, I don't know what that says about his leadership and organizational abilities.
Because here's the thing: I'm rooting for Bernie, or at least his general ideals. And I recognize that he's definitely tapped into a genuine wellspring of popular support. But I worry that all this enthusiasm and energy he's generated will dissipate like a fart in the wind in the next few months (or weeks) and the best chance in many years for progressive movement in down-ticket races will be wasted. And, so far, I have not been super impressed with Sanders' ability to direct his supporters. I mean if this is how they (or at least a vocal minority) are reacting to what, imho, amounts to significant policy wins by a primary loser, how are they going to deal with the dry, unglamorous, and often failure-laden work of organizing for state and local elections -- especially the long-shot, 50-state-strategy stuff?
posted by mhum at 11:34 AM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
That and wanting Ed Snowden in the cabinet, which, look, nothing against him, but what experience does he have that qualifies him for the cabinet?
Arguably the same question can be asked of Stein and the presidency...
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 11:34 AM on July 26, 2016
Arguably the same question can be asked of Stein and the presidency...
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 11:34 AM on July 26, 2016
I do get the "but THIS guy" attitude, tho. I think my entire voting career, save maybe 1992, has been with the drumbeat of "but if you don't vote for our guy, THEIR guy will do unspeakable things!" The Dems have cried wolf, and now Trump comes along and people aren't as willing to sound the alarm.
Yes, the GOP has been getting worse and worse with their nominees and leaders. And there's no way to say "look, he's a nice person, but..." without having "nice" stuck in the listener's head.
But here we are, with a woman running for President against a fascist. And people are reticent because they've heard it all before. Sigh.
posted by dw at 11:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
Yes, the GOP has been getting worse and worse with their nominees and leaders. And there's no way to say "look, he's a nice person, but..." without having "nice" stuck in the listener's head.
But here we are, with a woman running for President against a fascist. And people are reticent because they've heard it all before. Sigh.
posted by dw at 11:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
"Casual" is the word you probably are asking for.
"Casual Racism"
"Casual Sexism"
"Casual Misogyny"
...etc...
posted by Annika Cicada at 11:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
"Casual Racism"
"Casual Sexism"
"Casual Misogyny"
...etc...
posted by Annika Cicada at 11:36 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
He secretly paid for more than $1 million in ads that portrayed members of a tribe in Upstate New York as cocaine traffickers and career criminals.Ugh, that is incredibly infuriating. I live quite close to the CNY reservation land and it took far too many years to get a billboard spraypainted with anti-Native American racist graffiti fixed. IIRC, the graffiti implied that entering Native American land exposed you to a culture of rapists and criminals and to beware. It was disgusting.
posted by xyzzy at 11:40 AM on July 26, 2016
I don't think they they parallel each other at all, actually, because of how many people have a set of gendered assumptions about what it means to look and be tough.
That is 100% true. What's also very interesting to me about the "Hillary voted for Iraq" issue is how it's put forth as a proxy for "Hillary is a warmonger."
But the measure that Clinton voted for explicitly stated that force was to be used only as a last resort, pending confirmation that Iraq was a legitimate military threat, and pending the absolute failure of diplomacy in resolving that threat.
If Bush had not lied about those conditions, we never would have gone to war in Iraq. Hillary did not actually vote for invading Iraq on a flimsy pretext -- she did not vote in favor of what ended up happening.
(And while the idea of anybody being a legitimate military threat may seem paranoid to many of us now, this was less than a year after an attack on American soil that killed thousands of civilians)
posted by pocketfullofrye at 11:40 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
That is 100% true. What's also very interesting to me about the "Hillary voted for Iraq" issue is how it's put forth as a proxy for "Hillary is a warmonger."
But the measure that Clinton voted for explicitly stated that force was to be used only as a last resort, pending confirmation that Iraq was a legitimate military threat, and pending the absolute failure of diplomacy in resolving that threat.
If Bush had not lied about those conditions, we never would have gone to war in Iraq. Hillary did not actually vote for invading Iraq on a flimsy pretext -- she did not vote in favor of what ended up happening.
(And while the idea of anybody being a legitimate military threat may seem paranoid to many of us now, this was less than a year after an attack on American soil that killed thousands of civilians)
posted by pocketfullofrye at 11:40 AM on July 26, 2016 [10 favorites]
George Will, of all people, linked Trump's refusal to release his tax returns to possible financial links to Russian oligarchs.
There must be many, many people in the GOP foreign policy establishment who are asking themselves "How deep is this shit?" Because while it's one thing to think you can get your domestic legislation of preference from a Trump vote, it's another thing to wonder if you're putting the country in hock to Putin.
posted by octobersurprise at 11:40 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
There must be many, many people in the GOP foreign policy establishment who are asking themselves "How deep is this shit?" Because while it's one thing to think you can get your domestic legislation of preference from a Trump vote, it's another thing to wonder if you're putting the country in hock to Putin.
posted by octobersurprise at 11:40 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
The chanters probably feel this is a legitimate avenue for expressing their grievances.
One of the few they have left, so likely. Both Clinton and Sanders whips have been working on them, so hopefully reason will prevail.
Between the time of the platform vote and the convention, I think the main remaining points of contention were the issues of superdelegates and Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, both essentially internal DNC stuff. If Sanders didn't think to start corralling his folks in the weeks in between, I don't know what that says about his leadership and organizational abilities
There was very little in-between time. If they wanted this over they could have concede earlier.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:40 AM on July 26, 2016
One of the few they have left, so likely. Both Clinton and Sanders whips have been working on them, so hopefully reason will prevail.
Between the time of the platform vote and the convention, I think the main remaining points of contention were the issues of superdelegates and Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, both essentially internal DNC stuff. If Sanders didn't think to start corralling his folks in the weeks in between, I don't know what that says about his leadership and organizational abilities
There was very little in-between time. If they wanted this over they could have concede earlier.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:40 AM on July 26, 2016
Meanwhile, the "USA Freedom Kids" -- yes, *those* USA Freedom Kids yt -- are planning to sue Trump over broken promises.
I guess with a schedule chock full of D-list celebs, crackpots, racists, and multi-level marketers, there just wasn't room on the RNC schedule for five measly minutes of good old-fashioned homegrown American corn pone. I suppose the cuteness and positivity of those kids would have been too much of a distraction from the constant spew of fear and hate.
posted by Atom Eyes at 11:41 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I guess with a schedule chock full of D-list celebs, crackpots, racists, and multi-level marketers, there just wasn't room on the RNC schedule for five measly minutes of good old-fashioned homegrown American corn pone. I suppose the cuteness and positivity of those kids would have been too much of a distraction from the constant spew of fear and hate.
posted by Atom Eyes at 11:41 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
but if you don't vote for our guy, THEIR guy will do unspeakable things!" The Dems have cried wolf
when has this ever been untrue, what are you saying? "Cried wolf" means they lied and there was no wolf. Bush and McCain and Romney were made up? Nothing bad happened, it wasn't real?
posted by queenofbithynia at 11:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [18 favorites]
when has this ever been untrue, what are you saying? "Cried wolf" means they lied and there was no wolf. Bush and McCain and Romney were made up? Nothing bad happened, it wasn't real?
posted by queenofbithynia at 11:43 AM on July 26, 2016 [18 favorites]
Treating an admittedly wrongheaded misstep on science policy like it’s magnitudes worse than the constant concessions Democrats have historically made on so many fronts is essentially respectability politics, and it exhausts me.
Comparing the Greens and the Democrats is really comparing apples and oranges. One represents a political movement behind a fairly coherent ideology, which has (in America at least) never actually had any significant governing responsibility, and the other is a governing political party formed around a coalition of incredibly diverse interests (as we saw yesterday). Of course the worst mistakes of the Democrats have orders of magnitude worse consequences for real people. That's what having political power means: the stakes really are higher. If the Greens ever actually manage to become a real governing force in American politics, you can bet that their mistakes will screw up thousands or millions of lives too.
As a fringe party with almost no real governing track record, the American Greens basically have nothing other than their ideas on which to judge them. The luxury of ideological purity means we have the luxury of comparatively black-or-white decisions in assessing them. So yeah, if some of Jill Stein's ideas are bad, I'm much more ready to dismiss her and her party than I am to dismiss Hillary Clinton and the Democrats for having some bad decisions that made people's lives worse. Because Hillary Clinton and the Democrats also have made many, many decisions that have also made people's lives better. And good ideas are easy to come by, but a track record of real political accomplishments is not.
posted by biogeo at 11:44 AM on July 26, 2016 [53 favorites]
Comparing the Greens and the Democrats is really comparing apples and oranges. One represents a political movement behind a fairly coherent ideology, which has (in America at least) never actually had any significant governing responsibility, and the other is a governing political party formed around a coalition of incredibly diverse interests (as we saw yesterday). Of course the worst mistakes of the Democrats have orders of magnitude worse consequences for real people. That's what having political power means: the stakes really are higher. If the Greens ever actually manage to become a real governing force in American politics, you can bet that their mistakes will screw up thousands or millions of lives too.
As a fringe party with almost no real governing track record, the American Greens basically have nothing other than their ideas on which to judge them. The luxury of ideological purity means we have the luxury of comparatively black-or-white decisions in assessing them. So yeah, if some of Jill Stein's ideas are bad, I'm much more ready to dismiss her and her party than I am to dismiss Hillary Clinton and the Democrats for having some bad decisions that made people's lives worse. Because Hillary Clinton and the Democrats also have made many, many decisions that have also made people's lives better. And good ideas are easy to come by, but a track record of real political accomplishments is not.
posted by biogeo at 11:44 AM on July 26, 2016 [53 favorites]
I've heard good things about the Democratic Socialists of America and the Party for Socialism and Liberation, although I can't vouch for either personally.
I'm no expert, but I follow the DSA and get their newsletters. They talk reasonably. They don't try to run for president, they try to get people to run for local office as Socialists, not necessarily DSA candidates. They endorse voting for Democrats and have essays about the arguments for various candidates and positions.
They seem to be the opposite of burn it down.
I vote Democrat, but looked for years at third parties and have come to the conclusion, especially this year, that I need to stop screwing around and just be a Democrat. But I like the DSA's approach, and it's the only one of those organizations that I still pay attention to. I can be both, there's no "bust".
posted by bongo_x at 11:45 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
I'm no expert, but I follow the DSA and get their newsletters. They talk reasonably. They don't try to run for president, they try to get people to run for local office as Socialists, not necessarily DSA candidates. They endorse voting for Democrats and have essays about the arguments for various candidates and positions.
They seem to be the opposite of burn it down.
I vote Democrat, but looked for years at third parties and have come to the conclusion, especially this year, that I need to stop screwing around and just be a Democrat. But I like the DSA's approach, and it's the only one of those organizations that I still pay attention to. I can be both, there's no "bust".
posted by bongo_x at 11:45 AM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
Until the green party becomes important enough that corporations actually try to buy them, they can stop bragging about not being bought by corporations.
They have never fucked up politically because they have never actually had a chance. It's like saying a 6 month old is better qualified than the grown ups to run the household because they have never made mistakes.
Jill Stein and her party need to prove their worth by doing local and state government first, but they keep trying to eat at the grown up table without actually growing up.
posted by Tarumba at 11:45 AM on July 26, 2016 [23 favorites]
They have never fucked up politically because they have never actually had a chance. It's like saying a 6 month old is better qualified than the grown ups to run the household because they have never made mistakes.
Jill Stein and her party need to prove their worth by doing local and state government first, but they keep trying to eat at the grown up table without actually growing up.
posted by Tarumba at 11:45 AM on July 26, 2016 [23 favorites]
but if you don't vote for our guy, THEIR guy will do unspeakable things!" The Dems have cried wolf
In this case, almost all of the unspeakable things we say Trump and the RNC will do are things they've actually said they will do. Most are in their platform.
To whit, it's OK to cry "wolf" if there's an actual wolf at your door.
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [18 favorites]
In this case, almost all of the unspeakable things we say Trump and the RNC will do are things they've actually said they will do. Most are in their platform.
To whit, it's OK to cry "wolf" if there's an actual wolf at your door.
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [18 favorites]
And, so far, I have not been super impressed with Sanders' ability to direct his supporters. I mean if this is how they (or at least a vocal minority) are reacting to what, imho, amounts to significant policy wins by a primary loser, how are they going to deal with the dry, unglamorous, and often failure-laden work of organizing for state and local elections -- especially the long-shot, 50-state-strategy stuff?
mhum, are you familiar with the other long-term projects that Sanders is starting up? As you said, there is a vocal minority that is pursuing alternative tactics, but there are many other supporters who are closely following what's next (for example I've been following his downticket endorsements very closely). His OurRevolution site doesn't look like it's ready for primetime yet, but you can sign up to stay in the loop..
Here is a USA Today article that talks about what he has planned for the future:
mhum, are you familiar with the other long-term projects that Sanders is starting up? As you said, there is a vocal minority that is pursuing alternative tactics, but there are many other supporters who are closely following what's next (for example I've been following his downticket endorsements very closely). His OurRevolution site doesn't look like it's ready for primetime yet, but you can sign up to stay in the loop..
Here is a USA Today article that talks about what he has planned for the future:
In an exclusive interview with USA TODAY, the Vermont senator detailed plans to launch educational and political organizations within the next few weeks to keep his progressive movement alive. The Sanders Institute will help raise awareness of "enormous crises” facing Americans. The Our Revolution political organization will help recruit, train and fund progressive candidates' campaigns. And a third political organization may play a more direct role in campaign advertising.posted by kyp at 11:46 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Sanders plans to support at least 100 candidates running for a wide range of public offices — from local school boards to Congress — at least through the 2016 elections. And he’ll continue to raise funds for candidates while campaigning for them all over the country. He said he probably will campaign for Tim Canova, a progressive primary challenger to Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz of Florida, who chairs the Democratic National Committee.
[...]
Nearly 24,000 people have signed up on Sanders' website for information about running for office or helping people run for office in response to a June 16 video address in which Sanders urged his supporters to take action. At subsequent events, Sanders met privately with groups of those people, talking with them in “professorial mode” about why he originally ran for office, said Shannon Jackson, who will head Our Revolution.
The Democrats have been saying over and over in every election that this is the most important one ever and be afraid of the bad scary republican. And they're not wrong! But eventually it does just start to sound like noise to some people. Regardless of the fact that it may be true and you should be scared.
posted by downtohisturtles at 11:47 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by downtohisturtles at 11:47 AM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
I'm explaining the "cry wolf" thing.
posted by downtohisturtles at 11:49 AM on July 26, 2016
posted by downtohisturtles at 11:49 AM on July 26, 2016
The Democrats have been saying over and over in every election that this is the most important one ever and be afraid of the bad scary republican. And they're not wrong!
If only the Republicans would stop managing to scrape even deeper down in the barrel they've been getting their candidates from every election we could finally have an election that was just nbd guys.
posted by biogeo at 11:52 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
If only the Republicans would stop managing to scrape even deeper down in the barrel they've been getting their candidates from every election we could finally have an election that was just nbd guys.
posted by biogeo at 11:52 AM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I think the reason Stein is so frustrating is that we have friends saying "can't vote Hillary because principles!!" (and I agree with some of their concerns!) but then are willing to vote for Stein even though there are a number of cases where she supports what we would both call bad positions and has shown herself to also not have basic competence (e.g. Snowden for cabinet, Brexit confusion) plus she is willing to say sexist things about Hillary (calling her not a real mother a couple months ago). So it's on the one hand, they can't possibly vote for Hillary, even to stop Trump, because of principles but are perfectly willing to sign on to all the things that Stein gets or says that are also wrong. It smacks of just finding a reason to not vote for Hillary and look principled while doing it even though no one with any sense would claim a presidential vote could possibly be anything but a personal moral compromise. Any (good) candidate for president has a long political career where they've had to make all kinds of choices (which change over time!!) and they have to appeal to at least a majority of voters. So picking a president is always going to be about some balance of effectiveness, policy positions and relative personal prioritization of them. But those I'm seeing pushing Stein now don't seem to think that if their candidate had any chance at all, she'd be as "compromised" as Hillary, even though Stein has already said things that would be deal breakers for some voters (not all).
posted by R343L at 11:52 AM on July 26, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by R343L at 11:52 AM on July 26, 2016 [20 favorites]
"But eventually it does just start to sound like noise to some people."
Eh, it's not that it sounds like noise. It's just that when the message of repeated campaigns is "The other guy is way worse" then you start to wish that you didn't have to vote for the lesser evil and had the ability to vote for someone who represents your own views.
posted by I-baLL at 11:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Eh, it's not that it sounds like noise. It's just that when the message of repeated campaigns is "The other guy is way worse" then you start to wish that you didn't have to vote for the lesser evil and had the ability to vote for someone who represents your own views.
posted by I-baLL at 11:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I personally can't understand the hatred towards Hillary without accepting that it is partially driven by sexism and to me it is very analogous to not being able to understand birtherism without accepting that it was driven by racism. I don't see anything about Hillary's actions, character or policy that are so different from male politicians that are treated with much more respect.
posted by snofoam at 11:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
posted by snofoam at 11:53 AM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
NYT: Trump team warns me that if I continue to "waste our time" on Duke q's, they will allocate "resources" elsewhere
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
It's more like if the boy came and was like "wolf!" and the people all came over to look, and there HAD been a wolf, but it only killed one sheep, so they were like "well, shit, but what are you gonna do," and then that just kept happening, and then the tenth or twelfth time the boy was like "ok you guys I'm serious this time, there are like fifty wolves and they all have rabies" and people were like "nah, with wolves it's usually just the one, whatever, we're used to it"
posted by showbiz_liz at 11:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [32 favorites]
posted by showbiz_liz at 11:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [32 favorites]
I would call Stein crazy.
Stein on Brexit: "The vote in Britain to exit the European Union (EU) is a victory for those who believe in the right of self-determination and who reject the pro-corporate, austerity policies of the political elites in EU. The vote says no to the EU’s vision of a world run by and for big business. It is also a rejection of the European political elite and their contempt for ordinary people"
Stein on Brexit, after someone pointed out that UK Greens/Labour are for EU: "Before the Brexit vote I agreed with Jeremy Corbyn, Caroline Lucas and the UK Greens who supported staying in the EU but working to fix it, because the EU has many problems. They also recalled the problems that existed before the EU between European nations. The EU was created to fix those problems."
(note that it's the same link)
posted by effbot at 11:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [19 favorites]
Stein on Brexit: "The vote in Britain to exit the European Union (EU) is a victory for those who believe in the right of self-determination and who reject the pro-corporate, austerity policies of the political elites in EU. The vote says no to the EU’s vision of a world run by and for big business. It is also a rejection of the European political elite and their contempt for ordinary people"
Stein on Brexit, after someone pointed out that UK Greens/Labour are for EU: "Before the Brexit vote I agreed with Jeremy Corbyn, Caroline Lucas and the UK Greens who supported staying in the EU but working to fix it, because the EU has many problems. They also recalled the problems that existed before the EU between European nations. The EU was created to fix those problems."
(note that it's the same link)
posted by effbot at 11:54 AM on July 26, 2016 [19 favorites]
We all understand the "cry wolf" thing, it's not that hard a concept. What larger point are you trying to make? What is anyone supposed to do about this?
(p.s., the wolves were wolves. This one is rabid.)
posted by argybarg at 11:55 AM on July 26, 2016
(p.s., the wolves were wolves. This one is rabid.)
posted by argybarg at 11:55 AM on July 26, 2016
Until the green party becomes important enough that corporations actually try to buy them, they can stop bragging about not being bought by corporations.
Not to toot my own horn, but I've personally never lost a tennis match to Pete Sampras.
Can the same be said of Andre Agassi??
(My references are totes current.)
posted by Atom Eyes at 11:55 AM on July 26, 2016 [27 favorites]
Not to toot my own horn, but I've personally never lost a tennis match to Pete Sampras.
Can the same be said of Andre Agassi??
(My references are totes current.)
posted by Atom Eyes at 11:55 AM on July 26, 2016 [27 favorites]
I just think it's a bad tactic. It's not effective on some people. Give people a reason to vote. Not vote against. Feel free to disagree if you want.
posted by downtohisturtles at 11:56 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by downtohisturtles at 11:56 AM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
They can vote FOR my safety as an immigrant, socialist, atheist Hispanic immigrant married to a Muslim refugee.
posted by Tarumba at 11:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [34 favorites]
posted by Tarumba at 11:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [34 favorites]
Treating an admittedly wrongheaded misstep on science policy like it’s magnitudes worse than the constant concessions Democrats have historically made on so many fronts is essentially respectability politics, and it exhausts me.
A wrongheaded misstep on science policy is allowing the potato chip lobby to weigh in on nutrition policy. Pseudoscience among political leadership leads to HIV epidemics throughout the African continent. Happy to provide more links if needed.
posted by Sophie1 at 11:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
A wrongheaded misstep on science policy is allowing the potato chip lobby to weigh in on nutrition policy. Pseudoscience among political leadership leads to HIV epidemics throughout the African continent. Happy to provide more links if needed.
posted by Sophie1 at 11:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [14 favorites]
Donald Trump claimed that Indian reservations had fallen under mob control.
I'm adding this to my long and growing list of "things Republicans say that can be explained as psychological projection".
posted by gimonca at 11:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
I'm adding this to my long and growing list of "things Republicans say that can be explained as psychological projection".
posted by gimonca at 11:58 AM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
X: "You need to turn left here because if you turn right, you'll drive off a cliff and die"
Y: "Give me a reason to turn left! I'm tired of just hearing reasons to not turn right!"
posted by 0xFCAF at 11:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [50 favorites]
Y: "Give me a reason to turn left! I'm tired of just hearing reasons to not turn right!"
posted by 0xFCAF at 11:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [50 favorites]
It's more like if the boy came and was like "wolf!" and the people all came over to look, and there HAD been a wolf, but it only killed one sheep, so they were like "well, shit, but what are you gonna do," and then that just kept happening, and then the tenth or twelfth time the boy was like "ok you guys I'm serious this time, there are like fifty wolves and they all have rabies" and people were like "nah, with wolves it's usually just the one, whatever, we're used to it"
People in history were hardcore
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 11:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
People in history were hardcore
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 11:59 AM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
A wrongheaded misstep on science policy is allowing the potato chip lobby to weigh in on nutrition policy. Pseudoscience among political leadership leads to HIV epidemics throughout the African continent. Happy to provide more links if needed.
I totally agree but the equivalence here is illustrating my point. The Democrats already do let the potato chip lobby weigh in on nutrition policy. Literally!
posted by threeants at 12:03 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I totally agree but the equivalence here is illustrating my point. The Democrats already do let the potato chip lobby weigh in on nutrition policy. Literally!
posted by threeants at 12:03 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Regardless of policies and candidates, third-party votes are a useful way of finding out what percentage of the electorate doesn't understand how the electoral system works. (Aside from the overlooked possibility of Gary Johnson becoming president.)
posted by snofoam at 12:07 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by snofoam at 12:07 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
>Donald Trump claimed that Indian reservations had fallen under mob control.
I'm adding this to my long and growing list of "things Republicans say that can be explained as psychological projection".
Yeah he's not wrong....
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:07 PM on July 26, 2016
I'm adding this to my long and growing list of "things Republicans say that can be explained as psychological projection".
Yeah he's not wrong....
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:07 PM on July 26, 2016
Mmmm. Homeopathic waffles.
That's just a plate that had waffles on it at some point.
I believe I detect a tincture of sarcasm.
posted by Herodios at 12:08 PM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
That's just a plate that had waffles on it at some point.
I believe I detect a tincture of sarcasm.
posted by Herodios at 12:08 PM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
Trump team warns me that if I continue to "waste our time" on Duke q's, they will allocate "resources" elsewhere
Meanwhile: The Trump Campaign Invited a Notorious White Supremacist Radio Host to the GOP Convention (emphasis in original)
Meanwhile: The Trump Campaign Invited a Notorious White Supremacist Radio Host to the GOP Convention (emphasis in original)
Trump and many of his staff have rather long histories of retweeting white supremacists and promoting them, both on Twitter and elsewhere; for example, at one point the campaign selected a very well-known white nationalist leader to be a California delegate, and in March the campaign gave press credentials to another notorious white supremacist, James Edwards, host of the long-running racist and antisemitic radio show The Political Cesspool, after Donald Trump Jr. was interviewed on his show.posted by zombieflanders at 12:08 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
That’s right — the son of the GOP presidential candidate granted an interview to an openly white supremacist radio host in Tennessee.
If that isn’t enough evidence of Trump Jr.’s unsavory connections to antisemites and white supremacists, though, we’ve now learned that the campaign didn’t only invite James Edwards to attend a rally and give him a press pass, and they didn’t distance themselves from him after this was exposed.
In April, shortly after James Edwards interviewed Trump Jr. and got press credentials from the campaign, the Trump campaign actually invited this white supremacist to attend the Republican Convention in Cleveland.
I think part of the point is that if there's always a nightmare running on the right, saying so necessarily loses value as a distinct rhetorical message, without regard to how truthful it may be.
It's not that there's something someone is supposed to do about it, it's just how humans interpret threats in their environment. We're very good at taking things for granted, especially advancements. Here and many times in the past we have lamented why Trump is able to get so far, and why so many people in the middle aren't willing to do just about anything to ensure he doesn't get elected. Well, the answer is, rhetorically speaking, he's just the status quo of ever-escalating nightmares emerging from the right. The contingent of forces at the northern Wall of Westeros shrank not because there were no longer savage Wildlings in the North, but because that threat had been present for thousands of years and the glory had long since faded from championing that cause--the defense of the North had become taken for granted.
But now there's a real Trump winter coming and we're not sending everyone to the Wall, because we've been telling (true!) bedtime stories to voters for decades about the (real!) dangers of the Right... North... um, Trump Wall? Except this time there's giants and stuff coming down too. "But it's nothing we haven't defeated before, right?" we think to ourselves.
posted by Phyltre at 12:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
It's not that there's something someone is supposed to do about it, it's just how humans interpret threats in their environment. We're very good at taking things for granted, especially advancements. Here and many times in the past we have lamented why Trump is able to get so far, and why so many people in the middle aren't willing to do just about anything to ensure he doesn't get elected. Well, the answer is, rhetorically speaking, he's just the status quo of ever-escalating nightmares emerging from the right. The contingent of forces at the northern Wall of Westeros shrank not because there were no longer savage Wildlings in the North, but because that threat had been present for thousands of years and the glory had long since faded from championing that cause--the defense of the North had become taken for granted.
But now there's a real Trump winter coming and we're not sending everyone to the Wall, because we've been telling (true!) bedtime stories to voters for decades about the (real!) dangers of the Right... North... um, Trump Wall? Except this time there's giants and stuff coming down too. "But it's nothing we haven't defeated before, right?" we think to ourselves.
posted by Phyltre at 12:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
X: "You need to turn left here because if you turn right, you'll drive off a cliff and die"
Y: "Give me a reason to turn left! I'm tired of just hearing reasons to not turn right!"
For some people -- straight, cis, white people, people not on food stamps, people who don't depend on government housing, people who are not Muslims, people who don't know or love anybody undocumented, people who can't get accidentally pregnant, people whose children can attend decent public schools, people who don't care about a future Earth devastated by global warming --
this is not so much about "you'll drive off a cliff and die," it's about "others will go off the cliff and die."
And that's not a good enough reason for them.
posted by pocketfullofrye at 12:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [20 favorites]
Y: "Give me a reason to turn left! I'm tired of just hearing reasons to not turn right!"
For some people -- straight, cis, white people, people not on food stamps, people who don't depend on government housing, people who are not Muslims, people who don't know or love anybody undocumented, people who can't get accidentally pregnant, people whose children can attend decent public schools, people who don't care about a future Earth devastated by global warming --
this is not so much about "you'll drive off a cliff and die," it's about "others will go off the cliff and die."
And that's not a good enough reason for them.
posted by pocketfullofrye at 12:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [20 favorites]
I believe I detect a tincture of sarcasm.
Stop diluting the thread.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:10 PM on July 26, 2016 [19 favorites]
Stop diluting the thread.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:10 PM on July 26, 2016 [19 favorites]
kyp: "mhum, are you familiar with the other long-term projects that Sanders is starting up? "
Those things are precisely where I want Sanders to succeed and take his movement to the next level and that's exactly where I am most concerned about Sanders' organizational ability. I hope I'm wrong but I worry Sanders' revolution will go the same way as Ron Paul's revolution, some combination of fizzle out and mutate into something else. I mean, Sanders has spent (as far as I know) the bulk of his political career as an outsider, separated from the usual political machinery. His main track record has been as an agitator, a protestor, a voice in the wild. Will he be able to use that experience to produce door-to-door canvassers and phone-bankers and fund-raisers for mayors and city councillors and state senators? I guess we'll see. My pessimism is likely excessive and unwarranted and due to reading far too much into recent events.
posted by mhum at 12:10 PM on July 26, 2016
Those things are precisely where I want Sanders to succeed and take his movement to the next level and that's exactly where I am most concerned about Sanders' organizational ability. I hope I'm wrong but I worry Sanders' revolution will go the same way as Ron Paul's revolution, some combination of fizzle out and mutate into something else. I mean, Sanders has spent (as far as I know) the bulk of his political career as an outsider, separated from the usual political machinery. His main track record has been as an agitator, a protestor, a voice in the wild. Will he be able to use that experience to produce door-to-door canvassers and phone-bankers and fund-raisers for mayors and city councillors and state senators? I guess we'll see. My pessimism is likely excessive and unwarranted and due to reading far too much into recent events.
posted by mhum at 12:10 PM on July 26, 2016
straight, cis, white people, people not on food stamps, people who don't depend on government housing
The mortgage interest deduction, have they heard of it?
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:11 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
The mortgage interest deduction, have they heard of it?
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:11 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
And that's not a good enough reason for them.
I know the "one in twenty-five people is a sociopath!" thing is just kind of a made up stat but... I have a hard time not believing it.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:13 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I know the "one in twenty-five people is a sociopath!" thing is just kind of a made up stat but... I have a hard time not believing it.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:13 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Bernie Blocs, Green Partiers, and Real-Live Diversity: Getting a Feel for Philly During the DNC
posted by Kabanos at 12:16 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by Kabanos at 12:16 PM on July 26, 2016
In other news: what time do things start popping off today?
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:16 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:16 PM on July 26, 2016
Mmmm. Homeopathic waffles.
Wouldn't that just be pure maple syrup, then?
Only if you poured a cup of it into the Pacific Ocean and then scooped up a cup of the resulting admixture.
posted by y2karl at 12:17 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Wouldn't that just be pure maple syrup, then?
Only if you poured a cup of it into the Pacific Ocean and then scooped up a cup of the resulting admixture.
posted by y2karl at 12:17 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
soren_lorensen, gavel in about 40 minutes.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:19 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:19 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
> Well, the answer is, rhetorically speaking, he's just the status quo of ever-escalating nightmares emerging from the right. The contingent of forces at the northern Wall of Westeros shrank not because there were no longer savage Wildlings in the North, but because that threat had been present for thousands of years and the glory had long since faded from championing that cause--the defense of the North had become taken for granted.
say what you will about vaccines and homeopathy and everything, but, man, this blatant misrepresentation of history will not stand. The wall was not built to keep wildlings out! It was built to keep the Others out! The Others! You've been listening to kneeler propaganda against the Free Folk, you have.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:19 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
say what you will about vaccines and homeopathy and everything, but, man, this blatant misrepresentation of history will not stand. The wall was not built to keep wildlings out! It was built to keep the Others out! The Others! You've been listening to kneeler propaganda against the Free Folk, you have.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:19 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
The mortgage interest deduction, have they heard of it?
Well, that's just letting me keep my money. Totally different.
Are we still doing hamburger?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:20 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Well, that's just letting me keep my money. Totally different.
Are we still doing hamburger?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:20 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Shaun King: To stop Donald Trump, I’ll be voting for Hillary Clinton
Getting in formation.
posted by dw at 12:20 PM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
Getting in formation.
posted by dw at 12:20 PM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
I believe I detect a tincture of sarcasm.
Stop diluting the thread.
Look, I have nothing against the homeopathic, personally.
I mean, I'm straight but I'm not narrow.
I know the "one in twenty-five people is a sociopath!" thing is just kind of a made up stat but... I have a hard time not believing it.
I think all right-thinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary decent people in this country are fed up with being sick and tired.
I certainly am not.
And I'm sick and tired of being told that I am.
posted by Herodios at 12:20 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Stop diluting the thread.
Look, I have nothing against the homeopathic, personally.
I mean, I'm straight but I'm not narrow.
I know the "one in twenty-five people is a sociopath!" thing is just kind of a made up stat but... I have a hard time not believing it.
I think all right-thinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary decent people in this country are fed up with being sick and tired.
I certainly am not.
And I'm sick and tired of being told that I am.
posted by Herodios at 12:20 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
be the change you wish to see in the world
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:22 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:22 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'm explaining the "cry wolf" thing.
WOLVES VS.SHEEP ... DEER ... SKINS ... POKEMON ... HUNTERS WITH GUNS 2016
posted by zarq at 12:22 PM on July 26, 2016
WOLVES VS.
posted by zarq at 12:22 PM on July 26, 2016
I totally agree but the equivalence here is illustrating my point. The Democrats already do let the potato chip lobby weigh in on nutrition policy. Literally!
Ok, I'm going to stop at this comment, but the equivalency is not there. Yes, dems do stupid things that are in the interest of their campaign funds (like potato chip exemptions). It's stupid, but causes very little if any harm (I am not going into childhood diabetes here. The pyramid has nothing to do with it and that's a thread we can get to some other day). Thabo Mbeki nearly killed a generation of South Africans with pseudoscience. South Africa has yet to recover from his presidency and it has been nearly a decade.
Voting for someone who believes in pseudoscience could easily destroy a nation. That is a hill I am willing to die upon.
posted by Sophie1 at 12:23 PM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
Ok, I'm going to stop at this comment, but the equivalency is not there. Yes, dems do stupid things that are in the interest of their campaign funds (like potato chip exemptions). It's stupid, but causes very little if any harm (I am not going into childhood diabetes here. The pyramid has nothing to do with it and that's a thread we can get to some other day). Thabo Mbeki nearly killed a generation of South Africans with pseudoscience. South Africa has yet to recover from his presidency and it has been nearly a decade.
Voting for someone who believes in pseudoscience could easily destroy a nation. That is a hill I am willing to die upon.
posted by Sophie1 at 12:23 PM on July 26, 2016 [22 favorites]
Does the roll call of states begin right at 4 pm?
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 12:25 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 12:25 PM on July 26, 2016
Anyone looking for a better speaking schedule should check C-SPAN. They actually have a chronological speaker list
https://www.c-span.org/convention/?party=dnc
posted by nathan_teske at 12:25 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
https://www.c-span.org/convention/?party=dnc
posted by nathan_teske at 12:25 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I think last week the roll call began about 5pm.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:26 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:26 PM on July 26, 2016
We need new words that mean "unwittingly sexist" and "unwittingly racist."
We actually do have words for that. Those words are, respectively, "sexist" and "racist."
posted by dersins at 12:29 PM on July 26, 2016 [21 favorites]
We actually do have words for that. Those words are, respectively, "sexist" and "racist."
posted by dersins at 12:29 PM on July 26, 2016 [21 favorites]
I finally realized who Jill Stein reminds me of: President Coin from the Hunger Games
posted by leotrotsky at 12:29 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by leotrotsky at 12:29 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I totally agree but the equivalence here is illustrating my point.
This is what I personally find frustrating about the handful of Stein voters I know.
I say: "I am voting for Hillary even though I do not agree with some of her policies, I wish she was more progressive, and I worry that whatever led her to vote for the Iraq war will propel her to make a similarly bad choice in the future."
They say: "I agree with your concerns, so I am voting for Jill Stein because I would rather vote third party than compromise my principles. I am not willing to hold my nose and vote for someone I don't agree with."
I say: "But what about Jill Stein and the Green Party's stance on Brexit, homeopathy, vaccines, [on and on, because there's frankly a lot to object to] - I know you and I know that stuff is against your principles."
They say: "...Well, she's not as bad as Hillary."
So they ARE compromising their principles, and helping elect Trump in the process:
Nobody walks out of a voting booth in this country without getting their hands at least a little bit dirty, and without some element of compromise. But some of us are going to be able to say some day that we walked out of the voting booth trying to save our country from fascism, and it won't be the Stein voters.
posted by sallybrown at 12:31 PM on July 26, 2016 [49 favorites]
This is what I personally find frustrating about the handful of Stein voters I know.
I say: "I am voting for Hillary even though I do not agree with some of her policies, I wish she was more progressive, and I worry that whatever led her to vote for the Iraq war will propel her to make a similarly bad choice in the future."
They say: "I agree with your concerns, so I am voting for Jill Stein because I would rather vote third party than compromise my principles. I am not willing to hold my nose and vote for someone I don't agree with."
I say: "But what about Jill Stein and the Green Party's stance on Brexit, homeopathy, vaccines, [on and on, because there's frankly a lot to object to] - I know you and I know that stuff is against your principles."
They say: "...Well, she's not as bad as Hillary."
So they ARE compromising their principles, and helping elect Trump in the process:
Vote for Clinton = compromise principles + save the world from TrumpThere's also usually an element of magical thinking akin to "I believe Clinton is lying when she says she won't do the things I dislike, but I believe Stein is lying when she will says she will do the things I dislike / I believe she will not be able to accomplish these things."
Vote for Stein = compromise principles + help elect Trump
Nobody walks out of a voting booth in this country without getting their hands at least a little bit dirty, and without some element of compromise. But some of us are going to be able to say some day that we walked out of the voting booth trying to save our country from fascism, and it won't be the Stein voters.
posted by sallybrown at 12:31 PM on July 26, 2016 [49 favorites]
but if you don't vote for our guy, THEIR guy will do unspeakable things!" The Dems have cried wolf...
Remember the Y2K bug? Remember how people talked about it for years and it was all over the place in 1999? Then remember when nothing happened and people were like, "What was all the fuss about?" A lot of people made a fuss, took the problem seriously, and worked hard so that none of the doom and gloom came to pass.
Same thing applies here. The other guy got elected and started trying to do unspeakable things but the Dems went to work preventing them from happening or mitigating the impact.
In short, it only seems like they're crying wolf because you don't see them chase/kill the wolf.
posted by VTX at 12:32 PM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
Remember the Y2K bug? Remember how people talked about it for years and it was all over the place in 1999? Then remember when nothing happened and people were like, "What was all the fuss about?" A lot of people made a fuss, took the problem seriously, and worked hard so that none of the doom and gloom came to pass.
Same thing applies here. The other guy got elected and started trying to do unspeakable things but the Dems went to work preventing them from happening or mitigating the impact.
In short, it only seems like they're crying wolf because you don't see them chase/kill the wolf.
posted by VTX at 12:32 PM on July 26, 2016 [25 favorites]
Alternatively, most people aren't sysadmins/don't own sheep/aren't LGBT, Muslim or a racial minority and thus can write off the previous wolf attacks as not really doing any damage in the first place.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:36 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:36 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
The Dems have cried wolf
Three Supreme Court vacancies
The most sexist, racist, white supremacist linked candidate any major party has ever nominated in the U.S. ever.
Utter willingness to tear up our treaties
A love affair with dictators and with torture
Absolutely no tolerance for the first amendment
A YUGE wolf is here
posted by bearwife at 12:38 PM on July 26, 2016 [29 favorites]
Three Supreme Court vacancies
The most sexist, racist, white supremacist linked candidate any major party has ever nominated in the U.S. ever.
Utter willingness to tear up our treaties
A love affair with dictators and with torture
Absolutely no tolerance for the first amendment
A YUGE wolf is here
posted by bearwife at 12:38 PM on July 26, 2016 [29 favorites]
Shaun King: To stop Donald Trump, I’ll be voting for Hillary Clinton
Well, that's a very "Jefferson has beliefs, Burr has none" opinion piece, but every little bit counts. Welcome on board, Mr. King. You are extremely welcome here and we'll all work to make sure you don't regret this.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:38 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Well, that's a very "Jefferson has beliefs, Burr has none" opinion piece, but every little bit counts. Welcome on board, Mr. King. You are extremely welcome here and we'll all work to make sure you don't regret this.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:38 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
most people aren't sysadmins/don't own sheep/aren't LGBT, Muslim or a racial minority
As a cis het white person, I look forward to the very near future in which cis het white people will in fact be in the minority.
posted by dersins at 12:39 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
As a cis het white person, I look forward to the very near future in which cis het white people will in fact be in the minority.
posted by dersins at 12:39 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Trump Wall? Except this time there's giants and stuff coming down too. "But it's nothing we haven't defeated before, right?" we think to ourselves.
Several days ago in this thread someone cited a journalist saying that the hardest thing about covering the Trump campaign is "staying shocked". We acclimate to new situations rather quickly and we stop paying attention when the novelty wears off.
posted by puddledork at 12:41 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Several days ago in this thread someone cited a journalist saying that the hardest thing about covering the Trump campaign is "staying shocked". We acclimate to new situations rather quickly and we stop paying attention when the novelty wears off.
posted by puddledork at 12:41 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Laurie Penny: Bad Moon Rising: Here we are in the desert of moderate liberalism. The storm has hit, and nobody was prepared.
posted by homunculus at 12:42 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by homunculus at 12:42 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
This is what I personally find frustrating about the handful of Stein voters I know....
Well as someone who voted for Jill Stein in the past, my thinking in '08 and '12 wasn't so much "I agree 100% with the Green Party" or even, necessarily, "I agree more with the Greens than the Democrats" (although that may or may not be true depending on how I weight the various issues), but "well, I'm in a deep blue state where my federal vote doesn't particularly matter, so I'd prefer the symbolism of getting the Green vote percentage up as high as possible to show the Illinois Democratic Party that there's room for them to move left as well as right. I also was involved in various crunchy-type community organizations as well as a local state rep race that was Green vs. machine Democrat where no Republican bothered to run, so that also colored my partisan leanings.
The reason the calculus has changed this year for me is partly because the Greens seem to have gotten progressively more woo over the last 4-8 years, but mostly because I think the more important symbol in this particular year is to run up the Democratic presidential vote as much as possible. It's a tactical judgement, not an ideological one really.
I dunno if that line of reasoning might be a more sympathetic one for your Green friends?
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:43 PM on July 26, 2016 [19 favorites]
Well as someone who voted for Jill Stein in the past, my thinking in '08 and '12 wasn't so much "I agree 100% with the Green Party" or even, necessarily, "I agree more with the Greens than the Democrats" (although that may or may not be true depending on how I weight the various issues), but "well, I'm in a deep blue state where my federal vote doesn't particularly matter, so I'd prefer the symbolism of getting the Green vote percentage up as high as possible to show the Illinois Democratic Party that there's room for them to move left as well as right. I also was involved in various crunchy-type community organizations as well as a local state rep race that was Green vs. machine Democrat where no Republican bothered to run, so that also colored my partisan leanings.
The reason the calculus has changed this year for me is partly because the Greens seem to have gotten progressively more woo over the last 4-8 years, but mostly because I think the more important symbol in this particular year is to run up the Democratic presidential vote as much as possible. It's a tactical judgement, not an ideological one really.
I dunno if that line of reasoning might be a more sympathetic one for your Green friends?
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:43 PM on July 26, 2016 [19 favorites]
15 minutes to go. Is someone doing a new thread?
posted by zachlipton at 12:44 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 12:44 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
bearwife: The most sexist, racist, white supremacist linked candidate any major party has ever nominated in the U.S. ever.
Umm... about that. Some previous presidents owned slaves.
We are living in a short, delicate bubble of relative tolerance. Many of Trump's opinions were standard and unremarkable as recently as a couple of generations ago.
posted by clawsoon at 12:45 PM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
Umm... about that. Some previous presidents owned slaves.
We are living in a short, delicate bubble of relative tolerance. Many of Trump's opinions were standard and unremarkable as recently as a couple of generations ago.
posted by clawsoon at 12:45 PM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
quick everyone take a big step backwards
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:45 PM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:45 PM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
How is it so hard to take a moment, just a singular moment, to listen to what Hillary is saying, and not just immediately assume it is all lies?
I was prone to this line of thinking also. That she was willing to do anything to become President, she must be willing to lie, cheat, mislead, and misconstrue to get things she needs to amass power - she must be power hungry, and wants to control the world. But for someone with those skills and that passion for power, the Presidency kind of a crap job for it. All that public scrutiny, all that established laws. She could have easily reached Koch Brothers level of power via pursuing business leadership, her ability to network, implement, and build a power base among a group of people would make her amazing in the business world. If it was power she truly craved, she could have taken a lot safer, a lot easier, and a lot more profitable paths to accomplish it.
The more I read, the more I follow her history, the more I check my own internal sexism, I want to rewrite that last paragraph:
Hillary is willing to sacrifice so much to become President, the highest civil servant position in the country: she gave up her privacy, her safety, countless nights traveling and working. She has been the subject of countless investigations and singled out for prosecution over things the Old Boys club did every day. She might not have accomplished everything, or have a perfect record. She genuinely wants to serve this country, wants to make everyones lives better in meaningful ways. That means sometimes compromising. For her it has meant a countless level of sacrifices - she could have just retired and done speaking tours with Bill after the Presidency. She could have just been a grandmother.
So maybe, just maybe, listen to what she has to say without assuming she is lying. Maybe view it outside of the media narrative that believes a successful woman has to conform to a specific standard, maybe unpack some of your own baggage before you watch her speak.
Just because you feel something doesn’t make it true. Maybe just because you somehow feel that Hillary is lying may have something to do with your bias, not hers. The facts prove her to be honest, exceptionally honest. If you want to support the feels = facts ticket, I believe that was last weeks convention.
posted by mrzarquon at 12:45 PM on July 26, 2016 [51 favorites]
I was prone to this line of thinking also. That she was willing to do anything to become President, she must be willing to lie, cheat, mislead, and misconstrue to get things she needs to amass power - she must be power hungry, and wants to control the world. But for someone with those skills and that passion for power, the Presidency kind of a crap job for it. All that public scrutiny, all that established laws. She could have easily reached Koch Brothers level of power via pursuing business leadership, her ability to network, implement, and build a power base among a group of people would make her amazing in the business world. If it was power she truly craved, she could have taken a lot safer, a lot easier, and a lot more profitable paths to accomplish it.
The more I read, the more I follow her history, the more I check my own internal sexism, I want to rewrite that last paragraph:
Hillary is willing to sacrifice so much to become President, the highest civil servant position in the country: she gave up her privacy, her safety, countless nights traveling and working. She has been the subject of countless investigations and singled out for prosecution over things the Old Boys club did every day. She might not have accomplished everything, or have a perfect record. She genuinely wants to serve this country, wants to make everyones lives better in meaningful ways. That means sometimes compromising. For her it has meant a countless level of sacrifices - she could have just retired and done speaking tours with Bill after the Presidency. She could have just been a grandmother.
So maybe, just maybe, listen to what she has to say without assuming she is lying. Maybe view it outside of the media narrative that believes a successful woman has to conform to a specific standard, maybe unpack some of your own baggage before you watch her speak.
Just because you feel something doesn’t make it true. Maybe just because you somehow feel that Hillary is lying may have something to do with your bias, not hers. The facts prove her to be honest, exceptionally honest. If you want to support the feels = facts ticket, I believe that was last weeks convention.
posted by mrzarquon at 12:45 PM on July 26, 2016 [51 favorites]
I got about two lines into the Penny piece, got to this:
that parts of the Democratic National Committee were scheming against Bernie Sanders from the get-go
sighed and said 'no, you got fed some emails by Russian hackers, from a carefully selected period after Sanders had already lost and was refusing to acknowledge it'. And decided there were better uses of my time.
posted by tavella at 12:47 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
that parts of the Democratic National Committee were scheming against Bernie Sanders from the get-go
sighed and said 'no, you got fed some emails by Russian hackers, from a carefully selected period after Sanders had already lost and was refusing to acknowledge it'. And decided there were better uses of my time.
posted by tavella at 12:47 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Umm... about that. Some previous presidents owned slaves.
We are living in a short, delicate bubble of relative tolerance. Many of Trump's opinions were standard and unremarkable as recently as a couple of generations ago.
I think if we amend it to "The most sexist, racist, white supremacist linked candidate any major party has ever nominated in the U.S. ever relative to contemporaneous societal norms" it might be accurate.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:47 PM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
We are living in a short, delicate bubble of relative tolerance. Many of Trump's opinions were standard and unremarkable as recently as a couple of generations ago.
I think if we amend it to "The most sexist, racist, white supremacist linked candidate any major party has ever nominated in the U.S. ever relative to contemporaneous societal norms" it might be accurate.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:47 PM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
Westboro Baptist just got into town. They started off over at the Mazzoni Center, an LGBTQ heath center. I headed over to counter protest and 300 of my very awesome neighbors were already there. The band your hearing is the West Philadelphia Orchestra.
posted by cmfletcher at 12:49 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by cmfletcher at 12:49 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Opening gavel delayed to 4:30 per CSPAN currently live on the floor.
posted by maggieb at 12:49 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by maggieb at 12:49 PM on July 26, 2016
Clinton is inarguably competent. Unfortunately, the American people don’t want competence. They want to be saved.
That pretty much sums up anyone who is not voting for Hilary. It feels weird and scary when this election boils down to: Vote Facts or Vote Feelings.
posted by Kitteh at 12:50 PM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
That pretty much sums up anyone who is not voting for Hilary. It feels weird and scary when this election boils down to: Vote Facts or Vote Feelings.
posted by Kitteh at 12:50 PM on July 26, 2016 [13 favorites]
I dunno if that line of reasoning might be a more sympathetic one for your Green friends?
I think it is more...these are all fairly young people who, for lack of a better word, haven't experienced a lot of having to suck it up and not being able to project the ideal version of themselves at all times. It comes down to the fact that they just do. not. like. Hillary. And they refuse to do anything that might give others the notion that they're ok with her. The older people in my life -- my parents, for example -- strongly dislike Hillary also, but they have spent decades getting used to dealing with saying ok to people they dislike: working for horrible bosses, making friends in playgroup with odious parents whose children happen to be friends with theirs, watching old friends and siblings change over the years in yuck ways...they've made their peace with other people viewing them as the kind of people who give in and compromise.
posted by sallybrown at 12:50 PM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
I think it is more...these are all fairly young people who, for lack of a better word, haven't experienced a lot of having to suck it up and not being able to project the ideal version of themselves at all times. It comes down to the fact that they just do. not. like. Hillary. And they refuse to do anything that might give others the notion that they're ok with her. The older people in my life -- my parents, for example -- strongly dislike Hillary also, but they have spent decades getting used to dealing with saying ok to people they dislike: working for horrible bosses, making friends in playgroup with odious parents whose children happen to be friends with theirs, watching old friends and siblings change over the years in yuck ways...they've made their peace with other people viewing them as the kind of people who give in and compromise.
posted by sallybrown at 12:50 PM on July 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
Oh! I almost forgot this. As this thread winds down...
I've read both here and in other places (including on my Facebook wall) that one of the complaints of the Busters is that yesterday wasn't inclusive, and this speaks to the listening theme I brought up a few times in this discussion.
The Clinton campaign listened to the Sanders campaign. They adopted many of his platforms (and reiterated many that the two campaigns already have long shared), many of the speakers paid tribute to the Sanders campaign and he was given the prime speaking slot in the evening. They handed out Sanders signs. They played his campaign ad. In fact, they worked very hard to be inclusive towards Sanders and his supporters.
The complaining Busters (a minority of a minority who are getting an inordinate amount of air time on the major media outlets) were too busy booing and shouting things to even notice when olive branches were being thrown their way. If you're busy talking, you can't be actively listening.
So I understand why they left not thinking the day was inclusive. They would not listen long enough to recognize that every effort was being made to invite them in.
The booing, mic checking and cat calling was ultimately self defeating. You can't have a conversation if you won't be quiet long enough to hear the other person talk. The convention hasn't been inclusive for them because they refuse to allow themselves to be included. The constant noise sounds like protest, but its also an adult version of sticking one's fingers in one's ears and singing "lolly lolly lolly I can't hear you."
This is in no way to say that dissent isn't a good thing or that the DNC shouldn't try to listen to all views. It is to say that this particular rump wing of the party doesn't want to offer the same kind of respect that they demand everyone else offer them (as Marcia Fudge stated at the very start of Day 1).
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:51 PM on July 26, 2016 [29 favorites]
I've read both here and in other places (including on my Facebook wall) that one of the complaints of the Busters is that yesterday wasn't inclusive, and this speaks to the listening theme I brought up a few times in this discussion.
The Clinton campaign listened to the Sanders campaign. They adopted many of his platforms (and reiterated many that the two campaigns already have long shared), many of the speakers paid tribute to the Sanders campaign and he was given the prime speaking slot in the evening. They handed out Sanders signs. They played his campaign ad. In fact, they worked very hard to be inclusive towards Sanders and his supporters.
The complaining Busters (a minority of a minority who are getting an inordinate amount of air time on the major media outlets) were too busy booing and shouting things to even notice when olive branches were being thrown their way. If you're busy talking, you can't be actively listening.
So I understand why they left not thinking the day was inclusive. They would not listen long enough to recognize that every effort was being made to invite them in.
The booing, mic checking and cat calling was ultimately self defeating. You can't have a conversation if you won't be quiet long enough to hear the other person talk. The convention hasn't been inclusive for them because they refuse to allow themselves to be included. The constant noise sounds like protest, but its also an adult version of sticking one's fingers in one's ears and singing "lolly lolly lolly I can't hear you."
This is in no way to say that dissent isn't a good thing or that the DNC shouldn't try to listen to all views. It is to say that this particular rump wing of the party doesn't want to offer the same kind of respect that they demand everyone else offer them (as Marcia Fudge stated at the very start of Day 1).
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:51 PM on July 26, 2016 [29 favorites]
15 minutes to go. Is someone doing a new thread?
I guess not. I'll do one shortly.
posted by zachlipton at 12:51 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I guess not. I'll do one shortly.
posted by zachlipton at 12:51 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Laurie Penny: Bad Moon Rising: Here we are in the desert of moderate liberalism. The storm has hit, and nobody was prepared.
Fortunately, we throw out your lowest graded paper before averaging the others for your final grade.
posted by Herodios at 12:51 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Fortunately, we throw out your lowest graded paper before averaging the others for your final grade.
posted by Herodios at 12:51 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
That Laurie Penny piece is total horseshit.
posted by argybarg at 12:52 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by argybarg at 12:52 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Kitteh: It feels weird and scary when this election boils down to: Vote Facts or Vote Feelings.
Hulk Hogan vs. Steve Urkel.
posted by clawsoon at 12:52 PM on July 26, 2016
Hulk Hogan vs. Steve Urkel.
posted by clawsoon at 12:52 PM on July 26, 2016
quick everyone take a big step backwards
Why? Are the killer gastropods on the loose?
posted by Herodios at 12:53 PM on July 26, 2016
Why? Are the killer gastropods on the loose?
posted by Herodios at 12:53 PM on July 26, 2016
Hey, that Mazzoni Center has an awesome page on protestors' rights with focus on Philly-specific rules and special considerations for people who are LGB and especially T. Cool.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:54 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:54 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
mhum: "Will he be able to use that experience to produce door-to-door canvassers and phone-bankers and fund-raisers for mayors and city councillors and state senators? I guess we'll see. My pessimism is likely excessive and unwarranted and due to reading far too much into recent events."
I'm very optimistic. I see the fundraising and phonebanking records his campaign have set, and that seems like good evidence to me that there are many, many people hungry for change that are willing to carry the torch onwards, whether that's with their dollars or with volunteer hours. I definitely don't think comparisons with Nader are apt, given the huge gulf in their efforts and results.
posted by kyp at 12:55 PM on July 26, 2016
I'm very optimistic. I see the fundraising and phonebanking records his campaign have set, and that seems like good evidence to me that there are many, many people hungry for change that are willing to carry the torch onwards, whether that's with their dollars or with volunteer hours. I definitely don't think comparisons with Nader are apt, given the huge gulf in their efforts and results.
posted by kyp at 12:55 PM on July 26, 2016
My experience as an early Bernie donator is that the Sanders text-banking game is strong. Sooooo many multi-part text messages.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:57 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:57 PM on July 26, 2016
Why? Are the killer gastropods on the loose?
its 2016 be prepared for everything
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:58 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
its 2016 be prepared for everything
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:58 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
It feels weird and scary when this election boils down to: Vote Facts or Vote Feelings.
i feel there's a disconnect here. you seem to be saying this as though you can't understand how people could vote feelings. yet in the same sentence you're saying how you feel, because feelings are important...
(sorry if i'm misreading. i guess it's obvious from my occasional comments that i feel these threads generally show the same lack of empathy for anyone who doesn't belong in the "right" group. i understand why that happens, but i also feel it's unhealthy and likely making things worse)
posted by andrewcooke at 12:59 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
i feel there's a disconnect here. you seem to be saying this as though you can't understand how people could vote feelings. yet in the same sentence you're saying how you feel, because feelings are important...
(sorry if i'm misreading. i guess it's obvious from my occasional comments that i feel these threads generally show the same lack of empathy for anyone who doesn't belong in the "right" group. i understand why that happens, but i also feel it's unhealthy and likely making things worse)
posted by andrewcooke at 12:59 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I've got an e-mail from Tim Kaine* that says:
But do I like it more than doing right? Is it true that you have to chose between being right and doing right? And can you just choose to be an optimist? Because I think I would like to choose that... Dang it, Tim Kaine, you've really got inside my head! I can't let this one go...
*(I also have e-mails "from" Barack and Michelle Obama, Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders, Joe Biden, and of course Hillary Clinton. That is what happens when you put your name on Hillary's fundraising e-mail list.)
posted by OnceUponATime at 1:00 PM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
My parents taught me the lessons that have guided my entire life -- my mom once told me: "Tim, you have to decide if you want to be right or do right. If you want to be right, be a pessimist. If you want to do right, be an optimist."Seems sort of relevant to "vote facts or vote feelings." Because I mean, I like facts, and really like being right.
Mary, I've been an optimist ever since.
But do I like it more than doing right? Is it true that you have to chose between being right and doing right? And can you just choose to be an optimist? Because I think I would like to choose that... Dang it, Tim Kaine, you've really got inside my head! I can't let this one go...
*(I also have e-mails "from" Barack and Michelle Obama, Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders, Joe Biden, and of course Hillary Clinton. That is what happens when you put your name on Hillary's fundraising e-mail list.)
posted by OnceUponATime at 1:00 PM on July 26, 2016 [11 favorites]
I've been getting emails from my good friends Barack and Michelle for years. It puts a smile on my face every time even though I know they're from some communications team in some basement office somewhere.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:03 PM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:03 PM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
The feelings idea is a direct response to the RNC talk track of “it feels unsafe” “it feels like violence is increasing” “it feels like you should be afraid.” When in fact those things are objectively false.
John Oliver's summary of the RNC puts it in stark contrast, Gringrich's part of mental gymnastics is apparently the party platform.
posted by mrzarquon at 1:05 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
John Oliver's summary of the RNC puts it in stark contrast, Gringrich's part of mental gymnastics is apparently the party platform.
posted by mrzarquon at 1:05 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
That Laurie Penny piece is total horseshit.
posted by argybarg 10 minutes ago [2 favorites +] [!]
Any advance on that reasoning/assertion? I'd actually be interested to hear a good quality counterargument.
posted by jaduncan at 1:05 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by argybarg 10 minutes ago [2 favorites +] [!]
Any advance on that reasoning/assertion? I'd actually be interested to hear a good quality counterargument.
posted by jaduncan at 1:05 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
Just signed up for a Clinton/Kaine rally in Pittsburgh on Saturday. No other details available yet.
posted by octothorpe at 1:06 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 1:06 PM on July 26, 2016 [4 favorites]
Meryl Streep checks out where she'll speak tonight & presumably then win an award (📷 : Getty) #DemsInPhilly
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 1:07 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 1:07 PM on July 26, 2016
BERNIE WOULD HAVE GOTTEN THE CORNERS AND MOVED THE TABLE
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:07 PM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:07 PM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
As the household vacuumer... that is not okay with me.
MAKE VACUUMING GREAT AGAIN!
posted by Floydd at 1:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
MAKE VACUUMING GREAT AGAIN!
posted by Floydd at 1:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
10%ers!
posted by mrzarquon at 1:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mrzarquon at 1:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Oh SWEET Octothorpe! Signing up now. I was just about to buy a bunch of swag off the website, but I'll hold off to buy in person.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:09 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:09 PM on July 26, 2016
I've been getting emails from my good friends Barack and Michelle for years
I'm such a sucker for those that I have emails from Barack (and quite a few from HRC) tucked into special folders bearing their names, and I sometimes go back and read some of them over again. Living history, right there in my mailbox.
posted by bearwife at 1:12 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I'm such a sucker for those that I have emails from Barack (and quite a few from HRC) tucked into special folders bearing their names, and I sometimes go back and read some of them over again. Living history, right there in my mailbox.
posted by bearwife at 1:12 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I was about to assemble a new thread, this one is crashing my browser.
posted by Anonymous at 1:14 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by Anonymous at 1:14 PM on July 26, 2016
pan pan
pan pan
pan pan... all users, all users, all users ...
... this is an alert from the MeFi Comment Forecast System...
all users are advised to move commenting activities to the new thread.
remaining in this thread may result in having nobody to talk to.
for liveblogging, commiseration, cheering, chatter and more, go to thread at 161219: IT'S HOT AS HELL IN PHILADELPHIA
pan pan
pan pan
pan panposted by the man of twists and turns at 1:15 PM on July 26, 2016 [15 favorites]
BERNIE WOULD HAVE GOTTEN THE CORNERS AND MOVED THE TABLE
TOO LITTLE TOO LATE
IF HE WERE SERIOUS HE WOULD'VE VACUUMED IN A COOL CROSSHATCH PATTERN LIKE A BASEBALL FIELD
posted by indubitable at 1:16 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
TOO LITTLE TOO LATE
IF HE WERE SERIOUS HE WOULD'VE VACUUMED IN A COOL CROSSHATCH PATTERN LIKE A BASEBALL FIELD
posted by indubitable at 1:16 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
It pained me deeply not to use a Hamilton quote for the thread title, but since Hamilton quotes 1776, I think I'll be able to work through it.
posted by zachlipton at 1:17 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 1:17 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm such a sucker for those that I have emails from Barack (and quite a few from HRC) tucked into special folders bearing their names.
I still have the Sept 2012 email from Beyonce. "[amarynth], I don't usually email you..." You're right, B, we don't email enough!
posted by amarynth at 1:18 PM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
I still have the Sept 2012 email from Beyonce. "[amarynth], I don't usually email you..." You're right, B, we don't email enough!
posted by amarynth at 1:18 PM on July 26, 2016 [9 favorites]
Any advance on that reasoning/assertion? I'd actually be interested to hear a good quality counterargument.
I have frequently loved Laurie Penny's columns. My two main grimaces at her latest column is that Bernie supporters weren't expected to adjust to defeat "instantly", they were expected to do the math and recognize defeat in May or June. I'm in California, and polling never suggested that Bernie could draw the huge percentage of the vote he would have needed to catch up.
Second point. Even though when I compared candidates and preferred Bernie's positions (particularly on war and surveillance), I thought HRC was the stronger candidate because the Repubs have been punching her for many years and they can't put her down. I never thought Bernie could win in the general election. Not for a minute. He looked extremely vulnerable to negative attacks to me. I can easily imagine the negative crap that would have been run in ads against Bernie and taken him down. Heck when Hillary was trying to set up universal health care in the 90s the words "socialized medicine" were so potent that often people just said the words to end an argument.
posted by puddledork at 1:25 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I have frequently loved Laurie Penny's columns. My two main grimaces at her latest column is that Bernie supporters weren't expected to adjust to defeat "instantly", they were expected to do the math and recognize defeat in May or June. I'm in California, and polling never suggested that Bernie could draw the huge percentage of the vote he would have needed to catch up.
Second point. Even though when I compared candidates and preferred Bernie's positions (particularly on war and surveillance), I thought HRC was the stronger candidate because the Repubs have been punching her for many years and they can't put her down. I never thought Bernie could win in the general election. Not for a minute. He looked extremely vulnerable to negative attacks to me. I can easily imagine the negative crap that would have been run in ads against Bernie and taken him down. Heck when Hillary was trying to set up universal health care in the 90s the words "socialized medicine" were so potent that often people just said the words to end an argument.
posted by puddledork at 1:25 PM on July 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
She didn't even have to do that, as last night NPR had David Brooks, of all people, offering commentary.
Brooks clearly dislikes Trump, for whatever that's worth. Listening to him speak recently on the PBS Newshour, I have come to the conclusion he'll be voting for Clinton.
The network, in its eternal quest to find equivalence, however false, in the pursuit of phony "balance," has been going all out to push the old favorite "Dems in Disarray" and "Both Sides Do It" narratives, interviewing every Bernie or Buster they can find (while ignoring the cheer for Clinton resounding in the background!).
This was true at the beginning (or at least when I started watching at 7 ET) , but at the end even Liasson was going along with the general "Wow, they kind of pulled it all together" vibe on the panel.
posted by aught at 1:27 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Brooks clearly dislikes Trump, for whatever that's worth. Listening to him speak recently on the PBS Newshour, I have come to the conclusion he'll be voting for Clinton.
The network, in its eternal quest to find equivalence, however false, in the pursuit of phony "balance," has been going all out to push the old favorite "Dems in Disarray" and "Both Sides Do It" narratives, interviewing every Bernie or Buster they can find (while ignoring the cheer for Clinton resounding in the background!).
This was true at the beginning (or at least when I started watching at 7 ET) , but at the end even Liasson was going along with the general "Wow, they kind of pulled it all together" vibe on the panel.
posted by aught at 1:27 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Listening to the 538 podcast, they mention that there were a few pockets with boos, but elsewhere in the arena you didn't even know there was booing going on.
posted by zutalors! at 1:38 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zutalors! at 1:38 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
That Laurie Penny piece is total horseshit.
There's at least one sharp observation in it, tho:
Shaun King: To stop Donald Trump, I’ll be voting for Hillary Clinton
There's at least one sharp observation in it, tho:
"Clinton is inarguably competent. Unfortunately, the American people don’t want competence. They want to be saved."She's right. And that's exactly the problem, IMO. Because if you want salvation, get religion. Politics is about trying to make things work.
Shaun King: To stop Donald Trump, I’ll be voting for Hillary Clinton
"Like millions of supporters of Bernie Sanders, I have not quite gotten over his loss to Hillary Clinton. I didn't expect it to sting this bad, but for me, Bernie wasn't just another politician or candidate, but a rare leader who means what he says, keeps his word and takes bold risks. I feel like Bernie was a game changer."I feel for King and for Donna Smith who said "I couldn’t stop crying ... It was was a feeling of a moment in history past that I may not see again in my lifetime ...," I really do. I would recommend that they read Ted Kennedy's 1980 concession speech.
"There were some -- There were some who said we should be silent about our differences on issues during this convention, but the heritage of the Democratic Party has been a history of democracy. We fight hard because we care deeply about our principles and purposes. We did not flee this struggle ...posted by octobersurprise at 1:53 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
Women hold their rightful place at our convention, and women must have their rightful place in the Constitution of the United States. On this issue we will not yield; we will not equivocate; we will not rationalize, explain, or excuse. We will stand for E.R.A. and for the recognition at long last that our nation was made up of founding mothers as well as founding fathers ...
... For me, a few hours ago, this campaign came to an end.
For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
but if you don't vote for our guy, THEIR guy will do unspeakable things!" The Dems have cried wolf
In this case, almost all of the unspeakable things we say Trump and the RNC will do are things they've actually said they will do.
I'm literally in a conversation right now on FaceBook with a guy whose position is literally that bringing up things that are actually in the republican platform is irresponsible fear mongering on the part of the democrats.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 1:57 PM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
In this case, almost all of the unspeakable things we say Trump and the RNC will do are things they've actually said they will do.
I'm literally in a conversation right now on FaceBook with a guy whose position is literally that bringing up things that are actually in the republican platform is irresponsible fear mongering on the part of the democrats.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 1:57 PM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
I just want to be clear that promoting anti-vaxx arguments harms real people. It harms people like my husband, who has an autoimmune disorder and if he catches a virus, ends up in the ICU. It harms people with autism who have to deal with the stigma and myths promoted by anti-vaxxers. It harms children who get measles and whooping cough and other diseases we thought we had eliminated.
Homeopathy doesn't kill people directly. But it's a con, that takes people's money and preys on those who can't afford conventional healthcare, and anyone who supports con artists probably shouldn't be in charge of the country.
posted by threeturtles at 2:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
Homeopathy doesn't kill people directly. But it's a con, that takes people's money and preys on those who can't afford conventional healthcare, and anyone who supports con artists probably shouldn't be in charge of the country.
posted by threeturtles at 2:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [12 favorites]
How is Trump still allowed to call Warren "Pocahontas"?!?? This man is running for PRESIDENT! I don't understand how he keeps getting a pass on this??
man are you vastly overestimating how much the average american cares about native americans and racism towards them. not even talking about racist trump supporters, i mean people who consider themselves to be good decent liberal folks who Care About Minorities. it is the most painful herculean effort to get people to even pay the most token lip service to stuff like native representation in the arts, in film and books and tv, in governments from local to national.
posted by poffin boffin at 2:22 PM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
man are you vastly overestimating how much the average american cares about native americans and racism towards them. not even talking about racist trump supporters, i mean people who consider themselves to be good decent liberal folks who Care About Minorities. it is the most painful herculean effort to get people to even pay the most token lip service to stuff like native representation in the arts, in film and books and tv, in governments from local to national.
posted by poffin boffin at 2:22 PM on July 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
Brooks clearly dislikes Trump, for whatever that's worth. Listening to him speak recently on the PBS Newshour, I have come to the conclusion he'll be voting for Clinton.
I would never make that assumption about lifelong Republicans. You have no idea what they will do in the privacy of the voting booth. Generally rich Republicans like Brooks will hold their nose and vote for Trump because when it comes down to it, they don't really care about the racism. What they care about is tax cuts for the rich.
posted by JackFlash at 2:23 PM on July 26, 2016
I would never make that assumption about lifelong Republicans. You have no idea what they will do in the privacy of the voting booth. Generally rich Republicans like Brooks will hold their nose and vote for Trump because when it comes down to it, they don't really care about the racism. What they care about is tax cuts for the rich.
posted by JackFlash at 2:23 PM on July 26, 2016
roomthreeseventeen posted the exact quote which is fairly intelligent and lucidly stated. Even though I do favor mandatory vaccination (if you're sending your kids to public school) much more strongly than she appears to, characterizing her as "anti-vaccine" - on the basis of that anyway - is dishonest.
posted by atoxyl at 2:26 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by atoxyl at 2:26 PM on July 26, 2016
Second point. Even though when I compared candidates and preferred Bernie's positions (particularly on war and surveillance), I thought HRC was the stronger candidate because the Repubs have been punching her for many years and they can't put her down. I never thought Bernie could win in the general election. Not for a minute. He looked extremely vulnerable to negative attacks to me. I can easily imagine the negative crap that would have been run in ads against Bernie and taken him down. Heck when Hillary was trying to set up universal health care in the 90s the words "socialized medicine" were so potent that often people just said the words to end an argument.
If I could summarize my concerns about HRC's campaign in five words I would say:
this is not the 90s
posted by atoxyl at 2:35 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
If I could summarize my concerns about HRC's campaign in five words I would say:
this is not the 90s
posted by atoxyl at 2:35 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
(which is not to say that her policy platform is strictly stuck in the 90s but her image and the conception of political branding in this county which you just articulated)
posted by atoxyl at 2:54 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by atoxyl at 2:54 PM on July 26, 2016
No, not really. You may not like her for other unstated reasons, but no one paying attention can reasonably say Clinton is running a campaign rooted in the past. If anything, it's people who keep bringing up this worry who aren't being honest about the vast amount she has done since then.
posted by OmieWise at 3:00 PM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by OmieWise at 3:00 PM on July 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
Not gonna lie, all this talk about the Broad and Walnut Wawa has me seriously anxious. I work two blocks from there, go in all the time, and am probably a terrible Wawa patron. How many MeFites have unknowningly judged me for my casually oblivious ways?
posted by rorgy at 3:00 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by rorgy at 3:00 PM on July 26, 2016
Along the way, we ran into a man handing out water wearing suspenders, a V for Vendentta Anonymous mask on the back of his head, and a tiny black hat with red streamers coming out (most commonly seen on teenagers in jazz-dance performances).
I just have do ask: How does water keep its little suspenders up, anyway?
posted by Bella Donna at 3:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
I just have do ask: How does water keep its little suspenders up, anyway?
posted by Bella Donna at 3:09 PM on July 26, 2016 [5 favorites]
>Brooks clearly dislikes Trump, for whatever that's worth. Listening to him speak recently on the PBS Newshour, I have come to the conclusion he'll be voting for Clinton.
I would never make that assumption about lifelong Republicans. You have no idea what they will do in the privacy of the voting booth. Generally rich Republicans like Brooks will hold their nose and vote for Trump because when it comes down to it, they don't really care about the racism. What they care about is tax cuts for the rich.
YUP. Particularly as the right honorable coward has not, to my knowledge* ever actually said "I'm holding my nose and voting for Clinton".
It's not hard David! You can do it!!!
*and I've been on Brooks Watch for months
posted by tivalasvegas at 3:36 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I would never make that assumption about lifelong Republicans. You have no idea what they will do in the privacy of the voting booth. Generally rich Republicans like Brooks will hold their nose and vote for Trump because when it comes down to it, they don't really care about the racism. What they care about is tax cuts for the rich.
YUP. Particularly as the right honorable coward has not, to my knowledge* ever actually said "I'm holding my nose and voting for Clinton".
It's not hard David! You can do it!!!
*and I've been on Brooks Watch for months
posted by tivalasvegas at 3:36 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I'm literally in a conversation right now on FaceBook with a guy whose position is literally that bringing up things that are actually in the republican platform is irresponsible fear mongering on the part of the democrats.
That sounds like a variation on (what is it called?) the backlash effect. Presenting them with facts that contradict their belief is only serving to reinforce their belief.
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:13 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
That sounds like a variation on (what is it called?) the backlash effect. Presenting them with facts that contradict their belief is only serving to reinforce their belief.
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:13 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
What I was trying to clarify with my second comment is that I'm not talking about what she's done or what she proposes to do. I'm talking about her brand. Can you reassure me that one beats Donald Trump on accomplishments, of all things?
But I mean the truest thing anybody said in this thread is that at this stage we are all - all - in our own little bubbles politically. So I can't say I have any objective idea what's going to work in this election. I think the Bernie side seriously underestimated Clinton's success in building alliances with diverse constituencies. I think the Clinton side underestimates the degree to which old assumptions about political alignment are not that stable now, the number of voters who want something different even if they don't know what the hell they want. I don't think there's a widespread understanding of... well, me - why a certain kind of younger left-wing voter who was genuinely excited about Obama in 2008 (and was pretty cool with HRC too) doesn't feel anymore like the Democrats cut it for the future. I just worry about shit, okay?
posted by atoxyl at 4:18 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
But I mean the truest thing anybody said in this thread is that at this stage we are all - all - in our own little bubbles politically. So I can't say I have any objective idea what's going to work in this election. I think the Bernie side seriously underestimated Clinton's success in building alliances with diverse constituencies. I think the Clinton side underestimates the degree to which old assumptions about political alignment are not that stable now, the number of voters who want something different even if they don't know what the hell they want. I don't think there's a widespread understanding of... well, me - why a certain kind of younger left-wing voter who was genuinely excited about Obama in 2008 (and was pretty cool with HRC too) doesn't feel anymore like the Democrats cut it for the future. I just worry about shit, okay?
posted by atoxyl at 4:18 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
I would never make that assumption about lifelong Republicans. You have no idea what they will do in the privacy of the voting booth. Generally rich Republicans like Brooks will hold their nose and vote for Trump because when it comes down to it, they don't really care about the racism. What they care about is tax cuts for the rich.
One single data point: I have a friend who comes from a wealthy family. Probably not 1%, but let's say 10% for context. I'm close with the family -- his parents are self-made and the whole family is kind and generous. So for more context, not total assholes. Dad is an R for (for tax cuts, but especially for estate taxes) but for local issues votes the way my friend's D mom tells him to. My friend told me that this is the first time his father will not be casting a vote for president. He couldn't even consider voting for Trump. I'm really hoping a lot of those rich Republicans are going to do the same because Trump creates uncertainty and uncertainty is bad for business. At least with Hillary you can plot a course and hope for help from the R side of Congress.
I'm really clinging to this for hope :/
posted by Room 641-A at 4:49 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
One single data point: I have a friend who comes from a wealthy family. Probably not 1%, but let's say 10% for context. I'm close with the family -- his parents are self-made and the whole family is kind and generous. So for more context, not total assholes. Dad is an R for (for tax cuts, but especially for estate taxes) but for local issues votes the way my friend's D mom tells him to. My friend told me that this is the first time his father will not be casting a vote for president. He couldn't even consider voting for Trump. I'm really hoping a lot of those rich Republicans are going to do the same because Trump creates uncertainty and uncertainty is bad for business. At least with Hillary you can plot a course and hope for help from the R side of Congress.
I'm really clinging to this for hope :/
posted by Room 641-A at 4:49 PM on July 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
CNN ditches video feature in favor of crowd shot of subdued Busters milling around outside the convention?
posted by snuffleupagus at 5:05 PM on July 26, 2016
posted by snuffleupagus at 5:05 PM on July 26, 2016
Oops, I'm living in the past. :P
posted by snuffleupagus at 5:06 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by snuffleupagus at 5:06 PM on July 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
I just have do ask: How does water keep its little suspenders up, anyway?
On its shoalders.
posted by maxsparber at 9:24 AM on July 27, 2016 [10 favorites]
On its shoalders.
posted by maxsparber at 9:24 AM on July 27, 2016 [10 favorites]
Groan.
posted by biogeo at 12:45 PM on July 29, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by biogeo at 12:45 PM on July 29, 2016 [1 favorite]
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posted by cooker girl at 12:37 PM on July 25, 2016 [41 favorites]