You had to be there.
December 17, 2006 12:16 AM Subscribe
The President bade the Secretary of State farewell. And almost immediately, the crowd got this:
'Don Rumsfeld has been at my side from the moment I took office. We've been through war together.'
I disagree. But he’s always toying around with this, isn’t he? After all this time, you'd think he'd leave it alone. Heck, you’d think by now that anyone who hadn’t actually been in combat would leave it alone, but on and on it goes. Sometimes, it’s flat-out evil. Serving during a time of war is serious sh*t: far from home, terrified, in combat, never the same. And heroic. Please, stop it, Mr. President, you make it trivial. [maybe some NSFW, YouTube reg req'd/flagged vids]
This post was deleted for the following reason: axegrindfilter - please save ranty screeds for your own blog and save your awesome weblinks for metafilter. Thank you and have a pleasant holiday season.
Why did you link to the Jesse Macbeth wikipedia article? The current version doesn't do much to support your thesis.
Jesse Adam Macbeth (born Jesse Adam Al-Zaid,[1] 1984) falsely claimed to be an Army Ranger and veteran of the Iraq War. He lied in alternative media interviews that he and his unit routinely committed war crimes in Iraq.[2][3] Macbeth began to attract significant attention after the release of a video containing his allegations;[4] transcripts of the video were made in English and Arabic.[5] According to the U.S. Army, there is no record of Macbeth being a Ranger,[6][7] or serving in a combat unit: he was discharged from the service after having been declared unfit or unsuitable for the Army, or both,[8] before he could complete basic training.[9]posted by delmoi at 12:33 AM on December 17, 2006
Lost you there. Still the guy that said he served and committed atrocities? Got immediately believed? Cast a shadow on those serving? Still the guy that lied? That is my point.
posted by toma at 12:43 AM on December 17, 2006
posted by toma at 12:43 AM on December 17, 2006
Oh, I see. So this is just a general post about people pretending to have military service?
posted by delmoi at 12:53 AM on December 17, 2006
posted by delmoi at 12:53 AM on December 17, 2006
The phrasing of this post is odd, as if English wasn't the poster's native language.
posted by Titania at 1:43 AM on December 17, 2006
posted by Titania at 1:43 AM on December 17, 2006
I disagree.
However much you disagree, it seems factually correct that Bush and Rumseld "went through war together" as Commander in Chief and Secretary of Defense.
What I've learned from this post seems to be that the commander-in-chief and the soldier-in-theatre experience war in slightly different ways. Someone call CNN.
posted by three blind mice at 1:56 AM on December 17, 2006
However much you disagree, it seems factually correct that Bush and Rumseld "went through war together" as Commander in Chief and Secretary of Defense.
What I've learned from this post seems to be that the commander-in-chief and the soldier-in-theatre experience war in slightly different ways. Someone call CNN.
posted by three blind mice at 1:56 AM on December 17, 2006
It's still here, hmm.
Well, after I utterly f'd the title, it's due for deletion. So, with the few minutes left: yeah, it's about the difference between people who do, and people who claim as much. Those claims distort perception.
War appears to be the most horrible, extreme experience, and I can't fathom how anyone would pretend or lie about it. Even its use as a metaphor while a war is going on is a little creepy. I certainly don't understand how a guy can start a war and then claim to 'have gone through it,' as if he were a passive player.
And tbm may disagree with me, but saying the architects and the soldiers 'experience war in slightly different ways' is what I'm talking about.
posted by toma at 3:19 AM on December 17, 2006
Well, after I utterly f'd the title, it's due for deletion. So, with the few minutes left: yeah, it's about the difference between people who do, and people who claim as much. Those claims distort perception.
War appears to be the most horrible, extreme experience, and I can't fathom how anyone would pretend or lie about it. Even its use as a metaphor while a war is going on is a little creepy. I certainly don't understand how a guy can start a war and then claim to 'have gone through it,' as if he were a passive player.
And tbm may disagree with me, but saying the architects and the soldiers 'experience war in slightly different ways' is what I'm talking about.
posted by toma at 3:19 AM on December 17, 2006
Yeah, I'd call what was going on in Iraq a war, though he does seem to be employing the confusion that might arise from the terminology to his advantage. Iraq... Vietnam... what's the difference?
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 3:21 AM on December 17, 2006
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 3:21 AM on December 17, 2006
The phrasing of this post is odd, as if English wasn't the poster's native language.
In and of itself, your comment is odd. What if English isn't the poster's native language? Is it of any importance what the poster's native language is?
posted by flapjax at midnite at 3:38 AM on December 17, 2006
In and of itself, your comment is odd. What if English isn't the poster's native language? Is it of any importance what the poster's native language is?
posted by flapjax at midnite at 3:38 AM on December 17, 2006
Oh, and will someone please construct a decent FPP on Cpl. Jason Dunham (the guy I tried to reference in the hero links)? That was an extraordinary soldier. 'Night.
posted by toma at 3:51 AM on December 17, 2006
posted by toma at 3:51 AM on December 17, 2006
War appears to be the most horrible, extreme experience, and I can't fathom how anyone would pretend or lie about it. Even its use as a metaphor while a war is going on is a little creepy. I certainly don't understand how a guy can start a war and then claim to 'have gone through it,' as if he were a passive player.
While I sympathize with your feelings, expressing feelings of disbelief at the world's injustice is not what MetaFilter is for. But you've probably figured that out by now.
posted by languagehat at 6:15 AM on December 17, 2006
While I sympathize with your feelings, expressing feelings of disbelief at the world's injustice is not what MetaFilter is for. But you've probably figured that out by now.
posted by languagehat at 6:15 AM on December 17, 2006
I hope this thread squeaks through. It's been a while since we had one like it, I've been missing the squabblin.
posted by DenOfSizer at 6:23 AM on December 17, 2006
posted by DenOfSizer at 6:23 AM on December 17, 2006
There's nothing noble or heroic about war, there's nothing to protect or uphold.
posted by signal at 6:30 AM on December 17, 2006
posted by signal at 6:30 AM on December 17, 2006
Buh-buh-buh-blog, buh-buh-buh-blog.
posted by Smart Dalek at 6:56 AM on December 17, 2006
posted by Smart Dalek at 6:56 AM on December 17, 2006
I liked the post, and I think you did a good job constructing it. But this isn't really the place to editorialize. OTOH, Devoter could use a few more active contributors.
posted by maryh at 7:12 AM on December 17, 2006
posted by maryh at 7:12 AM on December 17, 2006
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posted by chrominance at 12:19 AM on December 17, 2006