For Children of Gays, Marriage Brings Joy
March 19, 2004 9:09 AM Subscribe
It was so cool, I always accepted that "Yeah, they're my moms," but they were actually getting married. I felt thick inside with happiness. Just thick.
Gabriel Damast, 13
It is something I always wanted. I've always been around people saying, `Oh, my parents anniversary is this week.' It's always been the sight of two parents, married, with rings. And knowing I'd probably never experience it ever. The atmosphere was just springing with life, I just couldn't hold myself in. It was oh my god oh my god oh my god. I felt so happy I wanted to scream.
Alex Morris, 11
For Children of Gays, Marriage Brings Joy
Won't somebody PLEASE think about the children?!? from the children's point-of-view.
Gabriel Damast, 13
It is something I always wanted. I've always been around people saying, `Oh, my parents anniversary is this week.' It's always been the sight of two parents, married, with rings. And knowing I'd probably never experience it ever. The atmosphere was just springing with life, I just couldn't hold myself in. It was oh my god oh my god oh my god. I felt so happy I wanted to scream.
Alex Morris, 11
For Children of Gays, Marriage Brings Joy
Won't somebody PLEASE think about the children?!? from the children's point-of-view.
It's always been the sight of two parents, married, with rings. And knowing I'd probably never experience it ever.
If gay people are anything like straight people, he'll eventually know the joy of visiting one of his moms on the weekends while the other badmouths her over a half empty bottle of bourbon during the week.
I mean the gays do want the right to the same experiences as straight people, right?
posted by jonmc at 9:22 AM on March 19, 2004
If gay people are anything like straight people, he'll eventually know the joy of visiting one of his moms on the weekends while the other badmouths her over a half empty bottle of bourbon during the week.
I mean the gays do want the right to the same experiences as straight people, right?
posted by jonmc at 9:22 AM on March 19, 2004
I know. I just was struck by the kid saying "two parents." I wondered where this kid was living, since when I grew up at least half my freinds had either single parents, or step-parents or some kind of arrangemnet like that.
See, there's only one thing we can say for sure that gay marraige will lead to: gay divorce. Which of course leads to gay divorcees.
posted by jonmc at 9:35 AM on March 19, 2004
See, there's only one thing we can say for sure that gay marraige will lead to: gay divorce. Which of course leads to gay divorcees.
posted by jonmc at 9:35 AM on March 19, 2004
cynicism is so easy
posted by divrsional at 9:44 AM on March 19, 2004
posted by divrsional at 9:44 AM on March 19, 2004
but there's no stigma attached to single parents or stepparents, jon
posted by amberglow at 9:44 AM on March 19, 2004
posted by amberglow at 9:44 AM on March 19, 2004
In a sense, Alex Morris, a precocious 11-year-old who has dreams of becoming president, has an embarrassment of riches — two sets of doting parents. His biological mother, Paula Morris, 43, just married her partner of 16 years, Cory Pohley, 44. The pregnancy was planned cooperatively with their friend Tony Humber, 45, Alex's father, who lives with Harvey Yaw, 47, his partner of 23 years. They all share responsibilities for Alex, who travels between the houses every few days. They sometimes vacation together.
It takes a community to raise a child. Lucky little blighter!
posted by five fresh fish at 9:47 AM on March 19, 2004
It takes a community to raise a child. Lucky little blighter!
posted by five fresh fish at 9:47 AM on March 19, 2004
amerglow, divrsional: I know.
It was a joke. I think so little of the differences between gay people and myself that I'm going to mock them as mercilessly as I mock anyone else.
but there's no stigma attached to single parents or stepparents, jon
You weren't raised Catholic. or you've forgotten the Dan Quayle/Murphy Brown flap.
posted by jonmc at 9:48 AM on March 19, 2004
It was a joke. I think so little of the differences between gay people and myself that I'm going to mock them as mercilessly as I mock anyone else.
but there's no stigma attached to single parents or stepparents, jon
You weren't raised Catholic. or you've forgotten the Dan Quayle/Murphy Brown flap.
posted by jonmc at 9:48 AM on March 19, 2004
Won't somebody think of the children? - I think that the American religious right considers these kids acceptable casualties in the Great War Against Evil™
posted by troutfishing at 9:53 AM on March 19, 2004
posted by troutfishing at 9:53 AM on March 19, 2004
You weren't raised Catholic. or you've forgotten the Dan Quayle/Murphy Brown flap.
Our divorce rate has been around 50% for decades now--most children have not been teased, taunted, or worse because they had only one parent, or a new stepmom or dad, at least in public schools...if you were a parochial school kid, then i have other reasons to tease you, jon, and it explains a lot. ; >
posted by amberglow at 10:00 AM on March 19, 2004
Our divorce rate has been around 50% for decades now--most children have not been teased, taunted, or worse because they had only one parent, or a new stepmom or dad, at least in public schools...if you were a parochial school kid, then i have other reasons to tease you, jon, and it explains a lot. ; >
posted by amberglow at 10:00 AM on March 19, 2004
No parochial school, but I did do CCD and all that stuff. But the fundies, who are leading the anti-gay marraige charge, are very much anti-divorce and single parenting. And again the whole comment was mainly an excuse to use the "gay divorcees" quip, and an extrapolation along the lines of Dolly Parton's quote on gay marraige: "Why not? Why shouldn't gay people be as miserable as everyone else."
posted by jonmc at 10:04 AM on March 19, 2004
posted by jonmc at 10:04 AM on March 19, 2004
I hope puberty brings out the rock-throwing, beer-swilling, short-haired toughness that makes men men, because if these Nancy-boys are America's future, we're totally screwed.
Maybe their gay dads will take 'em to a leather bar. Trust me, they'll find plenty of that there.
posted by jonmc at 10:25 AM on March 19, 2004
Maybe their gay dads will take 'em to a leather bar. Trust me, they'll find plenty of that there.
posted by jonmc at 10:25 AM on March 19, 2004
I especially liked the kid talking about the "Hall of Marriages."
Kind of funny. Oh, and it's kind of a myth that 50 percent of marriages end in divorce. About 43 percent of first marraiges, based on a survey in 1998. Second marriages are stronger, generally. And while I don't want to be a sexist here, I bet marriages are a lot stronger without a penis in the mix.
posted by Slagman at 10:31 AM on March 19, 2004
Kind of funny. Oh, and it's kind of a myth that 50 percent of marriages end in divorce. About 43 percent of first marraiges, based on a survey in 1998. Second marriages are stronger, generally. And while I don't want to be a sexist here, I bet marriages are a lot stronger without a penis in the mix.
posted by Slagman at 10:31 AM on March 19, 2004
I think so little of the differences between gay people and myself that I'm going to mock them as mercilessly as I mock anyone else.
Because if there's one thing gay people need more of, it's merciless mockery. I honor your committment to equality.
posted by sudama at 10:37 AM on March 19, 2004
Because if there's one thing gay people need more of, it's merciless mockery. I honor your committment to equality.
posted by sudama at 10:37 AM on March 19, 2004
sudama, you never miss a chance to act holier-than-thou, do you?
Look, here's how it goes. On my planet, people bust eachother's chops. Out of affection. Over anything. It's a part of how people interact.
As far as I'm concerned, walking on eggshells around people because of their differences is equally prejudiced. Maybe, well-intentioned, but it's still prejudice. It's treating people like delicate flowers who can't live in the same world as the rest of us and thus need to be handled with kid gloves. That's insulting as far as I'm concerned.
And if you found the "gay divorcees," joke offensive, then I can only conclude that you are oversensitive to the point of neurosis. And if you consider me a homophobe, then I can only say that you do not know me at all.
posted by jonmc at 10:53 AM on March 19, 2004
Look, here's how it goes. On my planet, people bust eachother's chops. Out of affection. Over anything. It's a part of how people interact.
As far as I'm concerned, walking on eggshells around people because of their differences is equally prejudiced. Maybe, well-intentioned, but it's still prejudice. It's treating people like delicate flowers who can't live in the same world as the rest of us and thus need to be handled with kid gloves. That's insulting as far as I'm concerned.
And if you found the "gay divorcees," joke offensive, then I can only conclude that you are oversensitive to the point of neurosis. And if you consider me a homophobe, then I can only say that you do not know me at all.
posted by jonmc at 10:53 AM on March 19, 2004
I hope puberty brings out the rock-throwing, beer-swilling, short-haired toughness that makes men men
i agree with the short hair and the beer swilling, but the rock-throwing makes me think of this. no thanks.
posted by mrgrimm at 11:28 AM on March 19, 2004
i agree with the short hair and the beer swilling, but the rock-throwing makes me think of this. no thanks.
posted by mrgrimm at 11:28 AM on March 19, 2004
Well, funnily enough...
My best friends' 8 year old daughter is always saying that she is going to be a judge when she grows up so she can change the law to make it legal for my partner and I to get married. (Of course, I need to tell her that she has to be a legislator to do that...)
I am always flattered that an 8 year old can feel so passionately about a subject that affects me -- a family friend. It feels good to be loved for who you are...
posted by PigAlien at 11:54 AM on March 19, 2004
My best friends' 8 year old daughter is always saying that she is going to be a judge when she grows up so she can change the law to make it legal for my partner and I to get married. (Of course, I need to tell her that she has to be a legislator to do that...)
I am always flattered that an 8 year old can feel so passionately about a subject that affects me -- a family friend. It feels good to be loved for who you are...
posted by PigAlien at 11:54 AM on March 19, 2004
The 8-year old is already an activist judge? Damn gay agenda!
posted by Ignatius J. Reilly at 12:20 PM on March 19, 2004
posted by Ignatius J. Reilly at 12:20 PM on March 19, 2004
sudama, you never miss a chance to act holier-than-thou, do you?
pot/kettle + sudama does not post on topic of self several times a thread...
posted by y2karl at 1:00 PM on March 19, 2004
pot/kettle + sudama does not post on topic of self several times a thread...
posted by y2karl at 1:00 PM on March 19, 2004
just busting your self-absorbed chops out of affection ;)
posted by y2karl at 1:02 PM on March 19, 2004
posted by y2karl at 1:02 PM on March 19, 2004
Here's to hoping there's a lot more 8-year-olds like her. : >
posted by amberglow at 1:20 PM on March 19, 2004
posted by amberglow at 1:20 PM on March 19, 2004
See, there's only one thing we can say for sure that gay marraige will lead to: gay divorce.
It will be interesting to see the statistics (when they come in.)
But for the moment here is one statistic available: Roughly two-thirds of the gay couples obtaining marriage licenses in Portland are female, according to an Associated Press analysis.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:53 PM on March 19, 2004
It will be interesting to see the statistics (when they come in.)
But for the moment here is one statistic available: Roughly two-thirds of the gay couples obtaining marriage licenses in Portland are female, according to an Associated Press analysis.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:53 PM on March 19, 2004
Well, there should be some happy kids in Quebec soon, because it's the latest province in which homosexuals have the right to marry. Felicitations, Quebecois(es)!
On a less wholesome note: gay Quebec boys are hot. ;-)
posted by stonerose at 3:54 PM on March 19, 2004
On a less wholesome note: gay Quebec boys are hot. ;-)
posted by stonerose at 3:54 PM on March 19, 2004
gay Quebec boys
They're gay! They speak French! And they're right on our borders!
At least there's all that Yankee Country between them and Rhea County, TN. Whew!
posted by Ignatius J. Reilly at 4:21 PM on March 19, 2004
They're gay! They speak French! And they're right on our borders!
At least there's all that Yankee Country between them and Rhea County, TN. Whew!
posted by Ignatius J. Reilly at 4:21 PM on March 19, 2004
And if you found the "gay divorcees," joke offensive, then I can only conclude that you are oversensitive to the point of neurosis.
Or maybe she simply didn't get the reference to the Cole Porter musical / Astaire/Rogers film. Not everyone on MeFi is a musical theatre queen, y'know. :-)
posted by Asparagirl at 4:45 PM on March 19, 2004
Or maybe she simply didn't get the reference to the Cole Porter musical / Astaire/Rogers film. Not everyone on MeFi is a musical theatre queen, y'know. :-)
posted by Asparagirl at 4:45 PM on March 19, 2004
amberglow, with your military might and my Canadian passport, I'm sure we can set up a little Guantanamo of Love to hold all those Montreal guys. As long as it has a French sign out front, the gendarmerie won't care. ;-)
posted by stonerose at 5:01 PM on March 19, 2004
posted by stonerose at 5:01 PM on March 19, 2004
stonerose, the way things are going here, I may actually have to take you up on that. : <
(I could live in Montreal easily--TO seemed a little too midwestern for me)
posted by amberglow at 5:10 PM on March 19, 2004
(I could live in Montreal easily--TO seemed a little too midwestern for me)
posted by amberglow at 5:10 PM on March 19, 2004
pot/kettle + sudama does not post on topic of self several times a thread...
y2karl: there's no way to answer you without you accusing me of further self-absorption, but I'll try anway. Sudama's response was holier than thou, or just so obtuse that he missed my point which had nothing to do with me, but with the greater topic at hand, homophobia and prejudice, and yes, to add a little levity. But trying to make a point in my usual online points these days is like beating my head against a brick wall. I don't know whether is the audience's obtuseness or my inarticulateness, and at this point I don't really care. But it's the main reason I quit blogging.
posted by jonmc at 5:47 PM on March 19, 2004
y2karl: there's no way to answer you without you accusing me of further self-absorption, but I'll try anway. Sudama's response was holier than thou, or just so obtuse that he missed my point which had nothing to do with me, but with the greater topic at hand, homophobia and prejudice, and yes, to add a little levity. But trying to make a point in my usual online points these days is like beating my head against a brick wall. I don't know whether is the audience's obtuseness or my inarticulateness, and at this point I don't really care. But it's the main reason I quit blogging.
posted by jonmc at 5:47 PM on March 19, 2004
apples and oranges, methinks--eschew overwroughtness. it was meant to be a more grow some skin comment. nobody is trying to shut you up.
posted by y2karl at 6:12 PM on March 19, 2004
posted by y2karl at 6:12 PM on March 19, 2004
That kid is either very articulate or somewhat paraphrased :P
posted by abcde at 8:36 PM on March 19, 2004
posted by abcde at 8:36 PM on March 19, 2004
while I don't want to be a sexist here, I bet marriages are a lot stronger without a penis in the mix.
I'm almost tempted to agree, Slagman, but the committed relationships between gay males that I've seen are just as strong, and in the same loving, nesting way, as the lesbian ones. It's very hard to judge, though, because until now it's been hard to tell when a gay "marriage" actually begins. Basically, people who stayed together for 16 years could just as well be considered "married," but you'd only arrive at that realization if they really did stay together for 16 years. This resulted in the outward appearance that when 2 gay people decide to spend their lives together, they really mean it, man, and it lasts. But I think gay people shack up and break up probably as much as straight people. It will be interesting when gay marriage is a reality to see what the divorce patterns truly are. Not to be cynical, just curious.
posted by scarabic at 10:54 AM on March 20, 2004
I'm almost tempted to agree, Slagman, but the committed relationships between gay males that I've seen are just as strong, and in the same loving, nesting way, as the lesbian ones. It's very hard to judge, though, because until now it's been hard to tell when a gay "marriage" actually begins. Basically, people who stayed together for 16 years could just as well be considered "married," but you'd only arrive at that realization if they really did stay together for 16 years. This resulted in the outward appearance that when 2 gay people decide to spend their lives together, they really mean it, man, and it lasts. But I think gay people shack up and break up probably as much as straight people. It will be interesting when gay marriage is a reality to see what the divorce patterns truly are. Not to be cynical, just curious.
posted by scarabic at 10:54 AM on March 20, 2004
To all those who claim that the fundamentalists who are against gay marriage are also against divorce, you're misinformed. Some may be, but finding a Protestant who really thinks there's a problem with divorce is increasingly difficult.
I live in a conservative area and know a lot of evangelical fundamentalists and have ended up with them attempting to biblically justify divorce to me on numerous occasions... though never very well -- you can't claim that the Bible is the literal word of God when talking about evolution and gay marriage and then, when it comes to Jesus saying "Don't get divorced", say "Well, that only refers to a specific problem in this specific time and place and isn't really relevant any longer" especially when that problem still exists (the financial problem, which is still be a problem for many women who, due to their parental and domestic obligations, tend to lack good job experience).
posted by dagnyscott at 7:40 AM on March 22, 2004
I live in a conservative area and know a lot of evangelical fundamentalists and have ended up with them attempting to biblically justify divorce to me on numerous occasions... though never very well -- you can't claim that the Bible is the literal word of God when talking about evolution and gay marriage and then, when it comes to Jesus saying "Don't get divorced", say "Well, that only refers to a specific problem in this specific time and place and isn't really relevant any longer" especially when that problem still exists (the financial problem, which is still be a problem for many women who, due to their parental and domestic obligations, tend to lack good job experience).
posted by dagnyscott at 7:40 AM on March 22, 2004
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posted by amberglow at 9:17 AM on March 19, 2004