Obsess Much?
October 22, 2004 2:21 PM Subscribe
Star Wars: The Changes compares screen shots of the original movies with the special edition releases and the new DVD.
This made me cry a little
Also, more changes here.
I especially like the way Darth Vader's eyebrows have been removed.
posted by ZippityBuddha at 3:16 PM on October 22, 2004
Also, more changes here.
I especially like the way Darth Vader's eyebrows have been removed.
posted by ZippityBuddha at 3:16 PM on October 22, 2004
God how I miss the monkey/man/woman Emperor in the old "Empire." The new one lacks all mystery. Remember how big, bleak and frightening the universe seemed at the end of Empire?
The only change I really applaud is a new Wampa in a suit, rather than some CGBS.
posted by inksyndicate at 3:24 PM on October 22, 2004
The only change I really applaud is a new Wampa in a suit, rather than some CGBS.
posted by inksyndicate at 3:24 PM on October 22, 2004
*shuts eyes tight, sticks fingers in ears, repeatedly chants han solo shot first, han solo shot first*
posted by t r a c y at 3:25 PM on October 22, 2004
posted by t r a c y at 3:25 PM on October 22, 2004
man that's depressing. George Lucas sure knows how to make, and subsequently fuck up, good movies.
posted by bob sarabia at 3:26 PM on October 22, 2004
posted by bob sarabia at 3:26 PM on October 22, 2004
Top 10 Other Things that Han Shot that Didn't Shoot at Him First
posted by t r a c y at 3:41 PM on October 22, 2004
posted by t r a c y at 3:41 PM on October 22, 2004
Evidence that Lucas perceived Han Solo very differently in 1977-1982 is seen in the NPR radio drama of Star Wars. Han's played by another actor who plays him real weasely and cutthroat.
By the time Empire came out and they decided to turn him into a romantic lead, the portrayal in the subsequent radio show was very different.
By Jedi, they turned Solo into a generic '80s action hero. It would have been so much better if he had to make some moral choices or something, like a real rogue.
posted by inksyndicate at 3:43 PM on October 22, 2004
By the time Empire came out and they decided to turn him into a romantic lead, the portrayal in the subsequent radio show was very different.
By Jedi, they turned Solo into a generic '80s action hero. It would have been so much better if he had to make some moral choices or something, like a real rogue.
posted by inksyndicate at 3:43 PM on October 22, 2004
I rented all three of the new DVDs a few weeks ago, and by the time I got through with ROTJ, I was outraged. I think it was the stoopid muppet song in Jabba's Palace that did it. I went online and bought the first Widescreen THX VHS version of the original, unfucked-with trilogy I could find.
As soon as it arrived in the mail, I put it in and fast forwarded to the Cantina scene and watched Han shoot Greedo first, about ten times.
In other news, I now have a reason to hold on to my VHS player.
posted by Ty Webb at 3:51 PM on October 22, 2004
As soon as it arrived in the mail, I put it in and fast forwarded to the Cantina scene and watched Han shoot Greedo first, about ten times.
In other news, I now have a reason to hold on to my VHS player.
posted by Ty Webb at 3:51 PM on October 22, 2004
This is pretty neat actually, it does border on obsessive behavior but it's striking to see things actually laid out side by side. I still haven't purchased the new DVDs, I'm trying to decide if I want to further enshrine the Special Editions. However, I still can't lay off playing my 80's originals and they are quickly deteoriating. Apparently you can find hacked DVDs of the original edition on eBay, but I should look into that.
Here's my favorite take on the "who shot first" question.
posted by nelleish at 3:57 PM on October 22, 2004
Here's my favorite take on the "who shot first" question.
posted by nelleish at 3:57 PM on October 22, 2004
Whoops, didn't realize my link was part of ZippityBuddha's link above. Sorry!
posted by nelleish at 4:02 PM on October 22, 2004
posted by nelleish at 4:02 PM on October 22, 2004
Lucas just doesnt get that what makes Star Wars so great is that it was all done with old-school models and camera tricks, and no cgi. Doing anything to the original is like surgically removing real breasts and then adding implants and bragging about how you don't see the scars.
posted by Peter H at 4:15 PM on October 22, 2004
posted by Peter H at 4:15 PM on October 22, 2004
Is there any talk of the original trilogy being re-released for showing in digitial theaters? I would love to see them on the big screen in their cleaned-up, color-corrected glory.
posted by DakotaPaul at 4:27 PM on October 22, 2004
posted by DakotaPaul at 4:27 PM on October 22, 2004
I thought my respect for Lucas had dropped to the floor - but he just lowered the bar further with this whole "Han shoots second" thing.
posted by quadog at 5:14 PM on October 22, 2004
posted by quadog at 5:14 PM on October 22, 2004
Think about the people that will only know the new versions of Star Wars. Think of the children!!! Han Shoots First!!
posted by graventy at 5:21 PM on October 22, 2004
posted by graventy at 5:21 PM on October 22, 2004
In other news, I now have a reason to hold on to my VHS player.
Nicely authored DVD transfers from the definitive ed. Laserdiscs are available though. They are posted regularly on a.b.starwars and you can find bittorrent seeds on suprnova.org, dvdr-core.org and the like.
Download without shame as Lucas stated publicly he has no intention to release the originals films again, ever, toextant indefinitely the copyrights and resell the same product ad nauseam improve on picture and plot clarity.
posted by kush at 5:44 PM on October 22, 2004
Nicely authored DVD transfers from the definitive ed. Laserdiscs are available though. They are posted regularly on a.b.starwars and you can find bittorrent seeds on suprnova.org, dvdr-core.org and the like.
Download without shame as Lucas stated publicly he has no intention to release the originals films again, ever, to
posted by kush at 5:44 PM on October 22, 2004
Is that screenshot page meant to be complete? It misses quite a lot of stuff. There were a number of effects shots in the final battle that were redone in 1997 that the author does not mention.
Also, a lot of the audio changes (like the "close the blast door" line) are just putting back things that were there in the 35mm mono sound mix all the way back in 1977, but were not there in the 70mm six-track mix (which most home video releases were made from). The final sound mix was not yet complete when the initial limited 70mm run began, but was complete when the wide release in 35mm was done (which had some prints with stereo and some with mono, depending on theatre equipment). Here is a very detailed list of all the differences in the various sound mixes of Star Wars.
Hundreds of years from now, film historians will hopefully still be able to find copies of all this stuff.
posted by Potsy at 6:03 PM on October 22, 2004
Also, a lot of the audio changes (like the "close the blast door" line) are just putting back things that were there in the 35mm mono sound mix all the way back in 1977, but were not there in the 70mm six-track mix (which most home video releases were made from). The final sound mix was not yet complete when the initial limited 70mm run began, but was complete when the wide release in 35mm was done (which had some prints with stereo and some with mono, depending on theatre equipment). Here is a very detailed list of all the differences in the various sound mixes of Star Wars.
Hundreds of years from now, film historians will hopefully still be able to find copies of all this stuff.
posted by Potsy at 6:03 PM on October 22, 2004
See, I think this is just retarded. If you compare the shots, it's obvious that they just took the alien-writing font and typed "POWER / TRACTOR BEAM" in. Match the glyphs. Not only is it a silly change, but it's poorly done.
Oh yeah, Han shot first, blah blah. I like that they took Luke's scream out, since that was the second most retarded addition to the Special Editions, IMO.
posted by neckro23 at 7:10 PM on October 22, 2004
Oh yeah, Han shot first, blah blah. I like that they took Luke's scream out, since that was the second most retarded addition to the Special Editions, IMO.
posted by neckro23 at 7:10 PM on October 22, 2004
This article argues that the new DVD release is Lucas taking advantage of the current DVD technology before a new kind of DVD comes out, so that he can futher make money off of Star Wars by re-re-re-releasing Star Wars in a couple of years. It has a clever title, too.
You may say: "The Weekly Standard? Of all places?" But it all makes sense if you read this article by the same author that makes the case that the Empire isn't really that bad--except for that little planet-destroying incident.
And this brings up one of my biggest problems with the "Special Edition" release: in the montage of planets celebrating the defeat of the Empire at the end of "Return of the Jedi", Mos Eisley is included. Why? Pirates and smugglers love oppressive governments; they make their money by cleverly operating outside of an existing system. If the Empire falls, who knows what could be next: legalized Spice?
posted by interrobang at 7:41 PM on October 22, 2004
You may say: "The Weekly Standard? Of all places?" But it all makes sense if you read this article by the same author that makes the case that the Empire isn't really that bad--except for that little planet-destroying incident.
And this brings up one of my biggest problems with the "Special Edition" release: in the montage of planets celebrating the defeat of the Empire at the end of "Return of the Jedi", Mos Eisley is included. Why? Pirates and smugglers love oppressive governments; they make their money by cleverly operating outside of an existing system. If the Empire falls, who knows what could be next: legalized Spice?
posted by interrobang at 7:41 PM on October 22, 2004
if you're looking for the good stuff, search for torrents with "pre se ld", meaning pre-special edition laserdisc.
posted by bob sarabia at 8:22 PM on October 22, 2004
posted by bob sarabia at 8:22 PM on October 22, 2004
History (and videogames) will show that the more computer effects improve, the more amazed and valuable the original Star Wars non-cgi special effects will seem.
His bullshit is like someone re-recording Exile in Main Street everytime there's a new synthesizer that does a better horn or guitar sound to rival the original.
Bozo.
posted by Peter H at 8:49 PM on October 22, 2004
His bullshit is like someone re-recording Exile in Main Street everytime there's a new synthesizer that does a better horn or guitar sound to rival the original.
Bozo.
posted by Peter H at 8:49 PM on October 22, 2004
To finish my point: the original Star Wars trilogy, in a best case scenario, will be seen as the finishing masterpiece of a sixty years of Hollywood's finest special effects prior to computers (1920-1980); in its worst (at the victim of its creator's ego) it will be viewed as a joke constantly re-updating itself in an attempt to be constantly up to date with the latest gaming software, or the whims of his children.
Leave the bluescreens and optical printing alone, Lucas, ya bozo! The real craft and beauty is in those optical effects.
posted by Peter H at 9:20 PM on October 22, 2004
Leave the bluescreens and optical printing alone, Lucas, ya bozo! The real craft and beauty is in those optical effects.
posted by Peter H at 9:20 PM on October 22, 2004
There certainly is no end to the crap surrounding this election. But then, I guess it is a semi-inevitable result fo a party that spent four years undermining the voters belief in the electoral system for political gain (DNC).
In any case, the Republicans are certainly not alone in this...
Erik Arneson, spokesman for Senate Republican leader David Brightbill of Lebanon, said Rendell's creation of the monitoring teams "was a clandestine process, concocted in secret meetings. [Administration officials] opened the process only after being forced to because the press and Republicans learned about it."
Of course, since this is MeFi the Republican action is born of evil Nazi's and the Democratic move will be given a pass.
posted by soulhuntre at 9:35 PM on October 22, 2004
In any case, the Republicans are certainly not alone in this...
Erik Arneson, spokesman for Senate Republican leader David Brightbill of Lebanon, said Rendell's creation of the monitoring teams "was a clandestine process, concocted in secret meetings. [Administration officials] opened the process only after being forced to because the press and Republicans learned about it."
Of course, since this is MeFi the Republican action is born of evil Nazi's and the Democratic move will be given a pass.
posted by soulhuntre at 9:35 PM on October 22, 2004
Star Wars is the Elvis of iconic sci-fi movies. Meaning both the young, hip-swivelling Elvis and the pathetic self-caricature doing Vegas. Thanks, George.
posted by soyjoy at 9:35 PM on October 22, 2004
posted by soyjoy at 9:35 PM on October 22, 2004
When you repost that into the correct thread, soulhuntre, you may want to remove the apostrophe from "Nazi's" at the end.
(And, good point, soyjoy.)
posted by interrobang at 9:41 PM on October 22, 2004
(And, good point, soyjoy.)
posted by interrobang at 9:41 PM on October 22, 2004
The real craft and beauty is in those optical effects.
No, the real craft is in the storytelling. SFX are always secondary, even in Star Wars. That's why I think it's foolish to condemn all the changes out of hand. I like that some of the backgrounds and establishing shots are beefed up. The Bespin interiors were always boring to look at, and now at least there's some stuff in the windows. It makes perfect sense that Lucas made certain tweaks to integrate the prequels better, like showing Hayden at the finale of VI. I don't really care one way or another about Greedo.
That said, the Jabba dance number is jarring and takes me out of the movie altogether, and the old Ewok song at the end is badly missed. So yeah, I think Lucas made some wrong choices--and I do love the old special effects, when they work--but it's not categorically wrong for Lucas to keep futzing with his own work. And for the historical record, there is always bit torrent....
posted by muckster at 9:51 PM on October 22, 2004
No, the real craft is in the storytelling. SFX are always secondary, even in Star Wars. That's why I think it's foolish to condemn all the changes out of hand. I like that some of the backgrounds and establishing shots are beefed up. The Bespin interiors were always boring to look at, and now at least there's some stuff in the windows. It makes perfect sense that Lucas made certain tweaks to integrate the prequels better, like showing Hayden at the finale of VI. I don't really care one way or another about Greedo.
That said, the Jabba dance number is jarring and takes me out of the movie altogether, and the old Ewok song at the end is badly missed. So yeah, I think Lucas made some wrong choices--and I do love the old special effects, when they work--but it's not categorically wrong for Lucas to keep futzing with his own work. And for the historical record, there is always bit torrent....
posted by muckster at 9:51 PM on October 22, 2004
I liked the old Bespin interiors. They made the city seem extremely closed.
But Star Wars has always been about the romance of corridors to me.
posted by interrobang at 10:00 PM on October 22, 2004
But Star Wars has always been about the romance of corridors to me.
posted by interrobang at 10:00 PM on October 22, 2004
My god, you all need to get so very drunk.
posted by dong_resin at 3:40 AM on October 23, 2004
posted by dong_resin at 3:40 AM on October 23, 2004
Lucas with Star Wars is like someone who has had too much plastic surgery and just doesn't know when to stop. They end up looking like a hideous characuture of their original self.
posted by Meridian at 5:21 AM on October 23, 2004
posted by Meridian at 5:21 AM on October 23, 2004
man, that "I take the empire" article was horrible, interrobang. what's next? little red riding hood deserved it?
posted by mr.marx at 6:00 AM on October 23, 2004
posted by mr.marx at 6:00 AM on October 23, 2004
Why does Lucas keep on doing this? Is he just insecure about his own work? Is he one of those people who just loves to tinker?
I think back to when Todd Rundgren started tinkering with digital formats on his albums to allow people to remix the tracks to suit their personal tastes, and I wish Lucas could create something similar in video technology so that he and anyone else could monkey around with the movies. I'd like to try making Han Solo's character a woman, for example.
posted by alumshubby at 7:09 AM on October 23, 2004
I think back to when Todd Rundgren started tinkering with digital formats on his albums to allow people to remix the tracks to suit their personal tastes, and I wish Lucas could create something similar in video technology so that he and anyone else could monkey around with the movies. I'd like to try making Han Solo's character a woman, for example.
posted by alumshubby at 7:09 AM on October 23, 2004
am I the only one that thinks the updates are pretty neat? this article made me really eager to watch the DVDs.
posted by mcsweetie at 9:20 AM on October 23, 2004
posted by mcsweetie at 9:20 AM on October 23, 2004
Lucas is a billionaire not content to sit on his laurels. Given what other billionaires have done to react to such imperative (such as that of George Soros in trying to elect John Kerry) I'm pleased with Lucas's choice.
posted by MattD at 9:30 AM on October 23, 2004
posted by MattD at 9:30 AM on October 23, 2004
I personally wouldn't mind if Lucas helped to elect Kerry. Maybe they could use some bits from THX 1138 in the tv ads.
posted by Utilitaritron at 10:42 AM on October 23, 2004
posted by Utilitaritron at 10:42 AM on October 23, 2004
I don't mind most of the changes. Even Greedo I can live with.
Now, I'm not a fan-boy, but there are two that stick in my craw:
1. Changing Boba Fett's voice. I don't care about continuity as much as I care about a good performance. The original readings were 100% better.
2. Substituting Hayden Christiansen into the ghost sequence with Yoda and Obi Wan. This change implies that Darth Vader never redeems himself, and his spirit must revert to a younger version to find goodness. NO. Darth Vader *does* find goodness in himself, and Annikan re-emerges before death. The change ruins the spirit on that sacrifice.
posted by o2b at 11:48 AM on October 23, 2004
Now, I'm not a fan-boy, but there are two that stick in my craw:
1. Changing Boba Fett's voice. I don't care about continuity as much as I care about a good performance. The original readings were 100% better.
2. Substituting Hayden Christiansen into the ghost sequence with Yoda and Obi Wan. This change implies that Darth Vader never redeems himself, and his spirit must revert to a younger version to find goodness. NO. Darth Vader *does* find goodness in himself, and Annikan re-emerges before death. The change ruins the spirit on that sacrifice.
posted by o2b at 11:48 AM on October 23, 2004
You know, I remember being incredibly impressed with Jabba's eyes as a model. The CGI doesn't seem to achieve this effect for me.
I'm dubbing the VHS versions onto DVD.
Screw it.
posted by Busithoth at 12:29 PM on October 23, 2004
I'm dubbing the VHS versions onto DVD.
Screw it.
posted by Busithoth at 12:29 PM on October 23, 2004
man, that "I take the empire" article was horrible, interrobang. what's next? little red riding hood deserved it?
Seems pretty well argued to me, mr. marx. What part do you disagree with?
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 9:04 PM on October 23, 2004
Seems pretty well argued to me, mr. marx. What part do you disagree with?
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 9:04 PM on October 23, 2004
Star Wars is the Elvis of iconic sci-fi movies. Meaning both the young, hip-swivelling Elvis and the pathetic self-caricature doing Vegas. Thanks, George.
Yeah, but which of those Elvis's is the more popular today?
posted by biffa at 3:57 AM on October 25, 2004
Yeah, but which of those Elvis's is the more popular today?
posted by biffa at 3:57 AM on October 25, 2004
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posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 2:46 PM on October 22, 2004