Brewing Bad
May 18, 2015 9:38 AM Subscribe
A genetically modified yeast strain capable of synthesizing opiates from glucose.
Synthetic biology isn't as straightforward as popular science journalism can make it sound (previously on MeFi), but as scientists tease apart and reconstruct individual biochemical pathways in their entirety, the bioethics issues surrounding the field have begun moving from theoretical to applied questions. Case in point: published papers by three research groups in the past few months describe all the steps necessary to engineer a genetically modified yeast capable of producing opiates from sugar.
Synthetic biology isn't as straightforward as popular science journalism can make it sound (previously on MeFi), but as scientists tease apart and reconstruct individual biochemical pathways in their entirety, the bioethics issues surrounding the field have begun moving from theoretical to applied questions. Case in point: published papers by three research groups in the past few months describe all the steps necessary to engineer a genetically modified yeast capable of producing opiates from sugar.
"In principle, anyone with access to the yeast strain and basic skills in fermentation would be able to grow morphine-producing yeast using a home-brew kit for beer-making. If the modified yeast strain produced 10 grams of morphine, users would need to drink only 1–2 millilitres of the liquid to obtain a standard prescribed dose.This Nature editorial lays out a few recommendations, and sketches out the limited groundwork already in place for effective biocontainment of genetically engineered yeast strains.
"...Yeast-based production of opiates could provide an alternative system for current criminal networks, particularly in North America and Europe, where the drugs are in high demand. Because yeast is easy to conceal, grow and transport, criminal syndicates and law-enforcement agencies would have difficulty controlling the distribution of an opiate-producing yeast strain. All told, decentralized and localized production would almost certainly reduce the cost and increase the availability of illegal opiates — substantially worsening a worldwide problem."
Might not be all bad…rather than being controlled by criminal or pharmaceutical syndicates, yeast-opium could likely be produced by the junkies, themselves…this could end the opiate economy, as we know it.
posted by littlejohnnyjewel at 9:56 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by littlejohnnyjewel at 9:56 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
Given that criminal networks, LEO and the prison industry all stand to lose a lot of money from this, my prediction is that those yeast strains somehow get destroyed and/or lost pretty quickly.
posted by grumpybear69 at 9:59 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by grumpybear69 at 9:59 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
I hope this engineered yeast has some safety mechanism such that it would fail to bud in the wild. It would be devastating to traditional users of yeast like bakers and brewers.
posted by King Sky Prawn at 10:05 AM on May 18, 2015 [7 favorites]
posted by King Sky Prawn at 10:05 AM on May 18, 2015 [7 favorites]
If basement-brewed synthetic alkaloids don't turn up as a plot point in William Gibson's next novel, I'll be very disappointed.
That said, it's fascinating to see the authors here jump immediately on the idea that manufacturing a fresh enforcement apparatus to fold this technology into the war on drugs is a necessity. Definitely some overlooked assumptions there.
posted by fifthrider at 10:06 AM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
That said, it's fascinating to see the authors here jump immediately on the idea that manufacturing a fresh enforcement apparatus to fold this technology into the war on drugs is a necessity. Definitely some overlooked assumptions there.
posted by fifthrider at 10:06 AM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
It's not like you even need fancy grow equipment or the space for a crop of anything, apartment dwellers have been brewing beer in their closets with off-the-shelf equipment for decades now.
Pot's not hard to grow and drug networks seem to do OK with that.
posted by maryr at 10:06 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
Pot's not hard to grow and drug networks seem to do OK with that.
posted by maryr at 10:06 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
Slap*Happy, I pretty much agree with your assessment, at least once there are multiple strains out there. The glucose -> morphine yeast strain doesn't exist yet (although strains doing pieces of the pathway do), but this work seems to make creating it straightforward (for trained biologists in a laboratory environment). Even if the research community does an excellent job of controlling the strain(s), I think it could slip out pretty quickly into organized crime, and from there, I don't think it will stay controlled by either legal or illegal power structures.
And maryr, pot's 'easy' to grow, but it's not like you go from seeds to crops in days. That's what we're talking about here (as long as you give it a warm room or waterbath, some agitation, and a nutrient broth).
posted by deludingmyself at 10:10 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
And maryr, pot's 'easy' to grow, but it's not like you go from seeds to crops in days. That's what we're talking about here (as long as you give it a warm room or waterbath, some agitation, and a nutrient broth).
posted by deludingmyself at 10:10 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Pot's not hard to grow and drug networks seem to do OK with that.
Yeah, but the extremely high-THC stuff that's become the gold standard of late is pretty high-maintenance; lots of fertilizers and sunlight (natural or otherwise). Think giant pumpkins, not back-garden basil.
I hope this engineered yeast has some safety mechanism such that it would fail to bud in the wild.
Now there's a nightmarish scenario that I'm surprised I didn't notice.
posted by fifthrider at 10:10 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
Yeah, but the extremely high-THC stuff that's become the gold standard of late is pretty high-maintenance; lots of fertilizers and sunlight (natural or otherwise). Think giant pumpkins, not back-garden basil.
I hope this engineered yeast has some safety mechanism such that it would fail to bud in the wild.
Now there's a nightmarish scenario that I'm surprised I didn't notice.
posted by fifthrider at 10:10 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
Pot stinks. Homebrewing using yeast that produced opiates instead of alcohol would look just like homebrewing beer, so would be more difficult to control. Not that I have a huge problem with that. Following a homebrewing recipie would provide a much more consistent dose than street heroin and therefore make ODs much less likely.
posted by wierdo at 10:11 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by wierdo at 10:11 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
I hope this engineered yeast has some safety mechanism such that it would fail to bud in the wild.
I think this is less of a nightmare scenario than you figure, just because a yeast strain spending a bunch of energy converting sugar into morphine is going to be less fit to compete with one spending all its energy making more yeast. There's no comment on viability in the article (because again: strain doesn't exist yet), but hypothetically I'd guess that if you dumped morphine-yeast and regular-yeast into a flask together, the regular yeast would probably win out.
posted by deludingmyself at 10:14 AM on May 18, 2015 [10 favorites]
I think this is less of a nightmare scenario than you figure, just because a yeast strain spending a bunch of energy converting sugar into morphine is going to be less fit to compete with one spending all its energy making more yeast. There's no comment on viability in the article (because again: strain doesn't exist yet), but hypothetically I'd guess that if you dumped morphine-yeast and regular-yeast into a flask together, the regular yeast would probably win out.
posted by deludingmyself at 10:14 AM on May 18, 2015 [10 favorites]
Pot's not hard to grow and drug networks seem to do OK with that.
In addition to the speed with which the yeast works, it requires minimal space, equipment, and energy. Growing marijuana requires either outdoor growing (risky) or indoor growing (lots of equipment, dedicated indoor space, and lots of electricity).
I hope this engineered yeast has some safety mechanism such that it would fail to bud in the wild. It would be devastating to traditional users of yeast like bakers and brewers.
The world is basically covered in wild yeasts of all sorts. Brewers and bakers have no trouble outcompeting them using modern brewing and baking yeast strains, even relatively slow ones such as ale yeast. In addition to overwhelming unwanted yeasts with sheer numbers (and thus outconsuming them before they can grow significantly), those strains are much better adapted to bread dough, wort, or must than wild yeasts. I would be very surprised if this yeast could outcompete your basic baking yeast much less something like Premier Cuvée.
posted by jedicus at 10:14 AM on May 18, 2015 [10 favorites]
In addition to the speed with which the yeast works, it requires minimal space, equipment, and energy. Growing marijuana requires either outdoor growing (risky) or indoor growing (lots of equipment, dedicated indoor space, and lots of electricity).
I hope this engineered yeast has some safety mechanism such that it would fail to bud in the wild. It would be devastating to traditional users of yeast like bakers and brewers.
The world is basically covered in wild yeasts of all sorts. Brewers and bakers have no trouble outcompeting them using modern brewing and baking yeast strains, even relatively slow ones such as ale yeast. In addition to overwhelming unwanted yeasts with sheer numbers (and thus outconsuming them before they can grow significantly), those strains are much better adapted to bread dough, wort, or must than wild yeasts. I would be very surprised if this yeast could outcompete your basic baking yeast much less something like Premier Cuvée.
posted by jedicus at 10:14 AM on May 18, 2015 [10 favorites]
I think this is less of a nightmare scenario than you figure, just because a yeast strain spending a bunch of energy converting sugar into morphine is going to be less fit to compete with one spending all its energy making more yeast.
This had occurred to me as well. My question is: is morphine toxic to yeast in any way? Because if it is, that could make morphine-adapted strains gain a competitive advantage.
posted by fifthrider at 10:19 AM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
This had occurred to me as well. My question is: is morphine toxic to yeast in any way? Because if it is, that could make morphine-adapted strains gain a competitive advantage.
posted by fifthrider at 10:19 AM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
The other difference between growing pot and this yeast is that the yeast would be producing morphine constantly. You need enough plants that one group or another is constantly ready for harvest. With this stuff, it's producing the drug constantly, you just need enough to keep up with demand (in whatever form that takes).
posted by VTX at 10:20 AM on May 18, 2015
posted by VTX at 10:20 AM on May 18, 2015
you just need enough to keep up with demand (in whatever form that takes)
The exact packaging of the product; yeah, that's a question. Somehow, I suspect that there isn't going to be much demand for drinking this stuff straight; opiates are generally pretty darn bitter, aren't they? But, then again, people ate opium.
posted by fifthrider at 10:23 AM on May 18, 2015
The exact packaging of the product; yeah, that's a question. Somehow, I suspect that there isn't going to be much demand for drinking this stuff straight; opiates are generally pretty darn bitter, aren't they? But, then again, people ate opium.
posted by fifthrider at 10:23 AM on May 18, 2015
Interesting article, but why does it start with a photo of a chicken on a bed?
posted by Ratio at 10:26 AM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by Ratio at 10:26 AM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
Opiate-producing yeast strains could also contain a marker, such as a DNA watermark, that makes them more readily identifiable to law-enforcement agencies.
Presumably, the same body of genetic engineering techniques used to transfer codeinone reductase genes from poppy plants to yeast could be used to sequence a morphine-making yeast genome, process sequencing reads and find locations where watermarks were added, and excise them with CRISPR or other approaches.
I imagine that, if you are in organized crime and have the resources to run and staff a bioreactor, such an approach would just be another part of rational quality control measures. You don't want any part of the genome in there that isn't making you money.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 10:28 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Presumably, the same body of genetic engineering techniques used to transfer codeinone reductase genes from poppy plants to yeast could be used to sequence a morphine-making yeast genome, process sequencing reads and find locations where watermarks were added, and excise them with CRISPR or other approaches.
I imagine that, if you are in organized crime and have the resources to run and staff a bioreactor, such an approach would just be another part of rational quality control measures. You don't want any part of the genome in there that isn't making you money.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 10:28 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Does this mean opiates could become the opiate of the masses?
posted by Foosnark at 10:29 AM on May 18, 2015 [18 favorites]
posted by Foosnark at 10:29 AM on May 18, 2015 [18 favorites]
Large drug cartels definitely have the means to pay (or coerce) researchers to do this. But I bet they wouldn't, when they have the whole supply chain locked up for poppies. I doubt this research will happen in academic labs anywhere.
So I'm wondering if there's any group with the skills, motivation, and laboratory access to make this happen.
posted by vogon_poet at 10:31 AM on May 18, 2015
So I'm wondering if there's any group with the skills, motivation, and laboratory access to make this happen.
posted by vogon_poet at 10:31 AM on May 18, 2015
Further, one could imagine organized crime with ties to agricultural and pharmaceutical businesses having an easy time dealing with processing spent yeast into livestock feed and vitamin B products. Not only does it clean up the "evidence", but it makes additional revenue.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 10:33 AM on May 18, 2015
posted by a lungful of dragon at 10:33 AM on May 18, 2015
I've been working on a yeast strain that can synthesize Metallica songs from glucose. Unfortunately 90% of the byproducts are Fleetwood Mac.
posted by DarkForest at 10:35 AM on May 18, 2015 [9 favorites]
posted by DarkForest at 10:35 AM on May 18, 2015 [9 favorites]
Interesting article, but why does it start with a photo of a chicken on a bed?
Presumably an establishing shot of Afghanistan or some other 'backwards' place that grows opium poppies right now, to implicitly contrast against the shiny new scientific approach. I agree; it clashes somewhat, given the thesis that seems to be buried in that choice of images.
posted by fifthrider at 10:38 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Presumably an establishing shot of Afghanistan or some other 'backwards' place that grows opium poppies right now, to implicitly contrast against the shiny new scientific approach. I agree; it clashes somewhat, given the thesis that seems to be buried in that choice of images.
posted by fifthrider at 10:38 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
A few weeks ago, I explained my job to my roommate--I work at a bioprocess development lab and have a background in cell culture and genetics. Afterwards he (jokingly) asked if I could steal stuff from my lab to convert our home into some kind of secret meth lab. I told him, no, for that you need to find a chemist with access to chemistry equipment.
But now I can tell him about this!
posted by picklenickle at 10:38 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
But now I can tell him about this!
posted by picklenickle at 10:38 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
There's multiple drug cartels out there, and they are all competing to capture market-share. The first one who can get this technology online and working will probably have a huge advantage, as they can suddenly cut costs, reduce risk, and increase production over their rivals. There's huge incentives for an established cartel to adopt this production method and bring it to market.
posted by rustcrumb at 10:41 AM on May 18, 2015
posted by rustcrumb at 10:41 AM on May 18, 2015
Drug cartels are the very people who should be most opposed to the development of this…they will be the first to suffer, if the yeast ever gets propagated outside of controlled labs.
posted by littlejohnnyjewel at 10:44 AM on May 18, 2015
posted by littlejohnnyjewel at 10:44 AM on May 18, 2015
Established drug cartels with control of opiates would be opposed. A drug cartel that isn't established with opiates might see this as an opportunity to extend their market share by disrupting outmoded business practices; or just a chance to fuck with a rival that does make a lot of money out of opiates by kicking the bottom out of the price of heroin.
posted by Grimgrin at 10:49 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by Grimgrin at 10:49 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
All I can say is that I am looking forward to the cocktails of the future.
posted by maxsparber at 10:51 AM on May 18, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by maxsparber at 10:51 AM on May 18, 2015 [4 favorites]
I demand that my laudanum custom blend be from the finest vintages, and aged in handblown sapphire glass.
posted by Dreidl at 10:54 AM on May 18, 2015 [7 favorites]
posted by Dreidl at 10:54 AM on May 18, 2015 [7 favorites]
Opiates as easy to brew as a craft beer would utterly destroy current criminal networks.
It's easy to brew your own beer, but most beer drinkers can't be bothered; I doubt the situation would be much different for junkies.
Besides, opiates are already ridiculously easy to produce; the only hard part is having enough real estate.
If anything, brewed opiates will drastically shorten the supply chain. International production and smuggling cartels will get screwed, but the local distribution networks will be absolutely rolling in it.
posted by Sys Rq at 10:55 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
It's easy to brew your own beer, but most beer drinkers can't be bothered; I doubt the situation would be much different for junkies.
Besides, opiates are already ridiculously easy to produce; the only hard part is having enough real estate.
If anything, brewed opiates will drastically shorten the supply chain. International production and smuggling cartels will get screwed, but the local distribution networks will be absolutely rolling in it.
posted by Sys Rq at 10:55 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Backyard meth labs haven't put organized dealers out of business (to my knowledge).
But I'm curious - it's not clear if the worry is that the yeast would get out into the wild, or the means of engineering the yeast would get out. (See also: the FBI talking to flu researchers about their paper on tweaking flu genes to produce a pandemic).
I'm guessing it's far cheaper and easier to grow the poppies and make opium that way. I assume there are ways to make opiates chemically as well, for the backyard chemist.
posted by k5.user at 10:58 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
But I'm curious - it's not clear if the worry is that the yeast would get out into the wild, or the means of engineering the yeast would get out. (See also: the FBI talking to flu researchers about their paper on tweaking flu genes to produce a pandemic).
I'm guessing it's far cheaper and easier to grow the poppies and make opium that way. I assume there are ways to make opiates chemically as well, for the backyard chemist.
posted by k5.user at 10:58 AM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Well, OK, so heroin addicts "could" brew their own smack, but how many of them do you think will have the patience to actually do so? (On preview: Jinx, Sys Rq! Buy me a Coke beer!)
I love me some craft beer, and have a fun little one-gallon kit for brewing at home -- but I still make a packy run every couple of weeks because I don't wait to wait twenty days for primary fermentation and bottle conditioning to complete.
Or is really any number of customers opting out of the drug economy enough to upend it?
posted by wenestvedt at 11:00 AM on May 18, 2015
I love me some craft beer, and have a fun little one-gallon kit for brewing at home -- but I still make a packy run every couple of weeks because I don't wait to wait twenty days for primary fermentation and bottle conditioning to complete.
Or is really any number of customers opting out of the drug economy enough to upend it?
posted by wenestvedt at 11:00 AM on May 18, 2015
I assume there are ways to make opiates chemically as well, for the backyard chemist.
Total synthesis of morphine.
posted by jedicus at 11:01 AM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
Total synthesis of morphine.
posted by jedicus at 11:01 AM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
Corrected: Does this mean opiates could become the opiate of the molasses?
posted by Gyan at 11:16 AM on May 18, 2015 [14 favorites]
posted by Gyan at 11:16 AM on May 18, 2015 [14 favorites]
Well fuck, this is going to screw not only home brewers but the entire brewpub and microbrewery scene.
Because suddenly your plant is dual-use, and everything is better when the BATF or their non-US equivalent get all squirrelly and start wondering if you're manufacturing beer or morphine.
And that's before the local gangsters get a sample of highly dodgy yeast and take your family hostage while you run off a brew for them.
The only way out of this is to engineer an S. Cervisiae strain that produces Naloxone or Naltrexone, and get it out there fast.
(PS: I published a novel about this sort of thing back in 2010 or thereabouts. I wasn't hoping it would come true, though ...)
posted by cstross at 11:33 AM on May 18, 2015 [14 favorites]
Because suddenly your plant is dual-use, and everything is better when the BATF or their non-US equivalent get all squirrelly and start wondering if you're manufacturing beer or morphine.
And that's before the local gangsters get a sample of highly dodgy yeast and take your family hostage while you run off a brew for them.
The only way out of this is to engineer an S. Cervisiae strain that produces Naloxone or Naltrexone, and get it out there fast.
(PS: I published a novel about this sort of thing back in 2010 or thereabouts. I wasn't hoping it would come true, though ...)
posted by cstross at 11:33 AM on May 18, 2015 [14 favorites]
The exact packaging of the product; yeah, that's a question. Somehow, I suspect that there isn't going to be much demand for drinking this stuff straight; opiates are generally pretty darn bitter, aren't they? But, then again, people ate opium.
I imagine the extraction would be very similar to DXM from cough syrup, which is ludicrously easy (ingredients: caustic soda, lighter fluid and distilled water).
posted by topynate at 11:48 AM on May 18, 2015
I imagine the extraction would be very similar to DXM from cough syrup, which is ludicrously easy (ingredients: caustic soda, lighter fluid and distilled water).
posted by topynate at 11:48 AM on May 18, 2015
Somehow, I suspect that there isn't going to be much demand for drinking this stuff straight
If you say so.
posted by Sys Rq at 11:51 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
If you say so.
posted by Sys Rq at 11:51 AM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
This is getting in to serious Burroughs territory…the next thing you know, there will be a morphine-producing strain of yeast, that infects the addicts themselves...
posted by littlejohnnyjewel at 12:43 PM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by littlejohnnyjewel at 12:43 PM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
Y'all know laudanum, Opium Tincture (Deodorized) USP, which is 10% powdered opium and 20% alcohol, is still available by prescription? The "deodorized" (also "denarcotized") bit means removing the nauseating noscapine while leaving morphine, codeine, papaverine and assorted other poppy alkaloids.
It's used for severe diarhhea and coughing that won't respond to anything else. It's also extremely dangerous; 2-3 teaspoonful can kill a child or sick adult. It has to be labelled POISON, and it is one. Tastes like poison, too; only tolerable (to me) diluted into at least 2 oz or more of water or sweet tea.
Its relatively easy to make from boiled, filtered, dried and powdered poppy latex plus brandy. The only effortful part is collecting the latex from the seed pods. But get your 1:100 measurements precise, boldly label it, and keep it very safely locked up. Two or three planter pots worth of poppies will yield more than enough latex for 50 drams of laudanum. I've only read about this, of course.
Fun fact: Tincture of Opium 10% USP is still packaged in 32 dram/4 oz./118ml bottles.
posted by Dreidl at 12:47 PM on May 18, 2015 [7 favorites]
It's used for severe diarhhea and coughing that won't respond to anything else. It's also extremely dangerous; 2-3 teaspoonful can kill a child or sick adult. It has to be labelled POISON, and it is one. Tastes like poison, too; only tolerable (to me) diluted into at least 2 oz or more of water or sweet tea.
Its relatively easy to make from boiled, filtered, dried and powdered poppy latex plus brandy. The only effortful part is collecting the latex from the seed pods. But get your 1:100 measurements precise, boldly label it, and keep it very safely locked up. Two or three planter pots worth of poppies will yield more than enough latex for 50 drams of laudanum. I've only read about this, of course.
Fun fact: Tincture of Opium 10% USP is still packaged in 32 dram/4 oz./118ml bottles.
posted by Dreidl at 12:47 PM on May 18, 2015 [7 favorites]
So this means I could drink while I'm taking my painkillers? Bring it on!
(j/k, sorta)
posted by fiercecupcake at 12:49 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
(j/k, sorta)
posted by fiercecupcake at 12:49 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
The exact packaging of the product; yeah, that's a question. Somehow, I suspect that there isn't going to be much demand for drinking this stuff straight; opiates are generally pretty darn bitter, aren't they? But, then again, people ate opium.
Morphine is very bitter, but it's not as bitter as the DXM found in cough syrup.
Large drug cartels definitely have the means to pay (or coerce) researchers to do this. But I bet they wouldn't, when they have the whole supply chain locked up for poppies.
My understanding is that the Mexican drug cartels purchase heroin from other organizations and then smuggle and distribute it themselves, so they have incentive to brew their own heroin.
They also have the resources, moral flexibility a wink-wink-nudge-nudge relationship with law enforcement that would allow them to murder anyone distributing large amounts of home-brewed morphine. A few smaller operations and users brewing morphine for themselves would slip through the cracks, but I think it's likely they could stabilize the market price.
posted by elsp at 12:54 PM on May 18, 2015
Morphine is very bitter, but it's not as bitter as the DXM found in cough syrup.
Large drug cartels definitely have the means to pay (or coerce) researchers to do this. But I bet they wouldn't, when they have the whole supply chain locked up for poppies.
My understanding is that the Mexican drug cartels purchase heroin from other organizations and then smuggle and distribute it themselves, so they have incentive to brew their own heroin.
They also have the resources, moral flexibility a wink-wink-nudge-nudge relationship with law enforcement that would allow them to murder anyone distributing large amounts of home-brewed morphine. A few smaller operations and users brewing morphine for themselves would slip through the cracks, but I think it's likely they could stabilize the market price.
posted by elsp at 12:54 PM on May 18, 2015
Yeah, but the extremely high-THC stuff that's become the gold standard of late is pretty high-maintenance; lots of fertilizers and sunlight (natural or otherwise).
I don't think that this will always be true though. I've often asserted that when recreational cannabis is finally legalized at the Federal level and the production gets industrialized, the most common form we'll see will be in BHO (or some other, hopefully safer extract product). If I understand the process correctly, the potency of the final product is determined by how saturated you can get the solvent rather than the potency of the individual plant. Then the cost is a matter of dollars per gram of THC rather than the percentage of THC in each plant.
So, if I've got room, I can grow some low potency plants, it will just mean that I need to use more plants to saturate the BHO.
posted by VTX at 12:57 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
I don't think that this will always be true though. I've often asserted that when recreational cannabis is finally legalized at the Federal level and the production gets industrialized, the most common form we'll see will be in BHO (or some other, hopefully safer extract product). If I understand the process correctly, the potency of the final product is determined by how saturated you can get the solvent rather than the potency of the individual plant. Then the cost is a matter of dollars per gram of THC rather than the percentage of THC in each plant.
So, if I've got room, I can grow some low potency plants, it will just mean that I need to use more plants to saturate the BHO.
posted by VTX at 12:57 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Mmm, brew-your-own opiates, plus newly-legal micro-distilleries and Cuban cigars? Sounds like a retrofuturistic golden age of biochemical pleasures.
But are they all-natural or from frankenyeasts?! Inquiring orthorexians want to know.
posted by Dreidl at 1:02 PM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
But are they all-natural or from frankenyeasts?! Inquiring orthorexians want to know.
posted by Dreidl at 1:02 PM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
My first extremely stupid thought upon being half awake and reading this was "if you got a yeast infection with this yeast, would you just overdose and die from the opiates produced?"
posted by emptythought at 1:07 PM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by emptythought at 1:07 PM on May 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
Brewers gut occurs when people accidentally ingest brewers yeast and it colonizes the gut. When the affected individual consumes sugar, the yeast makes alcohol in the gut and the individual can become drunk and get symptoms consistent with chronic alcoholism. Opiate producing yeast could cause a simiar disease, but worse because it is easier to overdose and die.
posted by humanfont at 1:17 PM on May 18, 2015 [6 favorites]
posted by humanfont at 1:17 PM on May 18, 2015 [6 favorites]
humanfont: nope, it'd be easily treatable as long as you don't die of it immediately. (1) Naloxone or another opiate antagonist i/v on first diagnosis (narcosis symptoms and respiratory depression), (2) diagnosis of year infection, followed by (3) treatment with systemic anti-fungals.
I'm more worried about what happens to the real ale scene when the War On Drug warriors realize that any damned brewery could be a Heroin Factory™ and go apeshit. Especially as I had my eye on a really cute German semi-automatic beer brewing machine that sells for around €1500 and can be programmed to produce just about any type of German bottom-fermented brew ...
posted by cstross at 1:34 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
I'm more worried about what happens to the real ale scene when the War On Drug warriors realize that any damned brewery could be a Heroin Factory™ and go apeshit. Especially as I had my eye on a really cute German semi-automatic beer brewing machine that sells for around €1500 and can be programmed to produce just about any type of German bottom-fermented brew ...
posted by cstross at 1:34 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Yeast infection == drug mule?
posted by wenestvedt at 1:36 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by wenestvedt at 1:36 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
I'm slightly drunk now and have Black Lace's 'Superman' playing over my headphones. A shot of morphine would complete the picture.
This how it ends.
posted by popcassady at 2:30 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
This how it ends.
posted by popcassady at 2:30 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Given that criminal networks, LEO and the prison industry all stand to lose a lot of money from this, my prediction is that those yeast strains somehow get destroyed and/or lost pretty quickly.
It'll be interesting. Since the yeast doesn't, itself, contain any narcotic element, it doesn't qualify as a Schedule 1 drug, much in the same way it's perfectly legal to buy the spores for growing Psilocybin mushrooms.
I really can't see any way to keep this yeast formula secret, either. One way or another, it's going to get out there.
My guess is you'll see a push to add precursors (i.e. the yeast, mushroom spores, etc.) to the controlled substances lists. Or, just add a new Schedule to the five already existing.
As one who has had two back surgeries and have to avail myself of an opiate every once in awhile, the idea of brewing my own is just...wow.
posted by Thorzdad at 2:32 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
It'll be interesting. Since the yeast doesn't, itself, contain any narcotic element, it doesn't qualify as a Schedule 1 drug, much in the same way it's perfectly legal to buy the spores for growing Psilocybin mushrooms.
I really can't see any way to keep this yeast formula secret, either. One way or another, it's going to get out there.
My guess is you'll see a push to add precursors (i.e. the yeast, mushroom spores, etc.) to the controlled substances lists. Or, just add a new Schedule to the five already existing.
As one who has had two back surgeries and have to avail myself of an opiate every once in awhile, the idea of brewing my own is just...wow.
posted by Thorzdad at 2:32 PM on May 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Everyone mark their BINGO cards for the meniton of CRISPR/Cas9 at the end of the article.
posted by maryr at 3:39 PM on May 18, 2015 [4 favorites]
posted by maryr at 3:39 PM on May 18, 2015 [4 favorites]
Whatever they say in the article, it is done. The creators just feel guilty and have given fair warning. Other medical scenario, lethal sudden onset pneumonia, and the patient doesn't even care they are dying. People with elevated blood sugars more prone to infection. Bad labs and yeast or spore contaminated product, addicts dead all over the country from yeast with newly acquired extremophile characteristics, that stand up to heat. Brain infection, because the brain is the organ of the body which uses the most glucose. The lifestyle of individuals who snort drugs, create lesions in the head that might allow contamination of central nervous system fluids. There are so many ways this will turn catastrophic. It is an irresistible pathway.
Plus you have to wonder if there aren't already pathogens that create mood as a part of their symbiotic relationship with us? Borna virus, a known depressant for example.
posted by Oyéah at 3:42 PM on May 18, 2015
Plus you have to wonder if there aren't already pathogens that create mood as a part of their symbiotic relationship with us? Borna virus, a known depressant for example.
posted by Oyéah at 3:42 PM on May 18, 2015
deludingmyself: " hypothetically I'd guess that if you dumped morphine-yeast and regular-yeast into a flask together, the regular yeast would probably win out."
Regular yeast,
regular yeast,
reproduces by a sugar feast.
Makes great bread,
and great beer.
Regular Yeast...
Morphine yeast,
morphine yeast.
Morphine yeast ends the drug war beast.
Brings relief to the fevered heat of a junkie thief.
Painkilling yeast.
Morphine yeast.
Brewed in a lab,
or in a home,
a concrete slab,
an underground dome.
Why'd they ever make
morphine yeast?
We'll never know.
Regular Yeast
regular yeast
Regular yeast hates morphine yeast.
They have a fight
Regular wins.
Regular yeast.
posted by symbioid at 9:22 PM on May 18, 2015 [12 favorites]
Regular yeast,
regular yeast,
reproduces by a sugar feast.
Makes great bread,
and great beer.
Regular Yeast...
Morphine yeast,
morphine yeast.
Morphine yeast ends the drug war beast.
Brings relief to the fevered heat of a junkie thief.
Painkilling yeast.
Morphine yeast.
Brewed in a lab,
or in a home,
a concrete slab,
an underground dome.
Why'd they ever make
morphine yeast?
We'll never know.
Regular Yeast
regular yeast
Regular yeast hates morphine yeast.
They have a fight
Regular wins.
Regular yeast.
posted by symbioid at 9:22 PM on May 18, 2015 [12 favorites]
OK, so the rhyming is off, and I should cut that "relief to the fevered heat bit" I think.
posted by symbioid at 9:29 PM on May 18, 2015
posted by symbioid at 9:29 PM on May 18, 2015
All those synthetic biology believers once employed in the bioethanol craze have to make ends meet somehow.
posted by benzenedream at 11:39 PM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by benzenedream at 11:39 PM on May 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
Humanfont: Brewers gut occurs when people accidentally ingest brewers yeast and it colonizes the gut.
Cstross: [...] German bottom-fermented brew
I don't see what the patient's nationality has to do with anything.
posted by Joe in Australia at 2:04 AM on May 19, 2015
Cstross: [...] German bottom-fermented brew
I don't see what the patient's nationality has to do with anything.
posted by Joe in Australia at 2:04 AM on May 19, 2015
Nightmarish really is the word to describe this. If a strain capable of creating opiates makes it out into the wild we can probably kiss spontaneous fermentation goodbye. Goodbye sourdough. Goodbye lambic, I'll miss you most of all.
posted by nulledge at 6:13 AM on May 19, 2015
posted by nulledge at 6:13 AM on May 19, 2015
Someone upthread said that wasn't a concern because it would be outcompeted by other yeasts.
posted by cjorgensen at 7:02 AM on May 19, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by cjorgensen at 7:02 AM on May 19, 2015 [2 favorites]
Metafilter: It is an irresistible pathway.
posted by sneebler at 7:04 AM on May 19, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by sneebler at 7:04 AM on May 19, 2015 [1 favorite]
My expertise was plant secondary metabolite pathways in grad school, I also know a fair bit about yeast fermentation.
These concerns about the wild yeasts getting out into the ecosystem are a bit overblown. The opiate pathway is long and extremely complicated, with many metabolically costly enzymes and byproducts that must be controlled in sync to produce any kind of product. This yeast has absolutely no competitive advantage compared to other yeasts. Freaking out about this yeast being out in the wild is a bit like freaking out about a farm chicken that someone has covered in chicken size plate armor with spines. It looks scary, but in reality it is not suited to survive in the wild with all that stuff added and will soon die.
With that said, genetically engineered yeast are very easy to grow in a bioreactor if you know what you're doing, so this will change up the drug marketplace for sure if it works. I'm actually incredibly impressed they were able to do this, as it's hard enough to engineer other plants to produce useful opiates, let alone an unrelated fungi that probably didn't have many opiate precursors to begin with.
posted by permiechickie at 7:48 AM on May 19, 2015 [3 favorites]
These concerns about the wild yeasts getting out into the ecosystem are a bit overblown. The opiate pathway is long and extremely complicated, with many metabolically costly enzymes and byproducts that must be controlled in sync to produce any kind of product. This yeast has absolutely no competitive advantage compared to other yeasts. Freaking out about this yeast being out in the wild is a bit like freaking out about a farm chicken that someone has covered in chicken size plate armor with spines. It looks scary, but in reality it is not suited to survive in the wild with all that stuff added and will soon die.
With that said, genetically engineered yeast are very easy to grow in a bioreactor if you know what you're doing, so this will change up the drug marketplace for sure if it works. I'm actually incredibly impressed they were able to do this, as it's hard enough to engineer other plants to produce useful opiates, let alone an unrelated fungi that probably didn't have many opiate precursors to begin with.
posted by permiechickie at 7:48 AM on May 19, 2015 [3 favorites]
I am not a chemist nor am I a microbiologist. I like wine making, especially in that, the wine I make is really good. If I liked drinking wine, I would then make a lot more of it. Sometimes the fruit is abundant it is a fun, but a time and space consuming pastime. I got rid of my fermentation vessels, as they were in the way. If I drank wine or had an alcohol addiction, then I'd be making a lot.
People with no understanding of chemistry, brew meth anyway because it is both their job, and their addiction. You can see empty lots, where their houses were taken out, down to a six feet deep hole in the ground. They come out of jail and start all over again, they know nothing about chemistry.
Heroin addiction becomes the executive function in humans. Many humans host yeast in their guts, those who are sickened by yeast byproducts have celiac sprue disease. Regardless of how complicated the process is, the heroin producers just went into high gear on this. There is plenty of info right here to get the industry booted up. They just never thought of this as a production means. It is just a matter of time before addicts have an either pleasant or lethal infection. The catch is everyone who gets the infection will be an addict.
The weapon potential is something else. This associate of mine was discussing micology and how there is a huge mycelium out on the the west side of the Oquirrh mountains. He said it covered this huge area of soccer fields and empty land to the west edge of the mountains. Then I ponder a fungus like this releasing spores after the rain, or watering. If only I hadn't read a dystopian sci fi book, called Sign of the Labrys when I was 12, that talked about life after the yeast plagues...
posted by Oyéah at 9:03 AM on May 19, 2015
People with no understanding of chemistry, brew meth anyway because it is both their job, and their addiction. You can see empty lots, where their houses were taken out, down to a six feet deep hole in the ground. They come out of jail and start all over again, they know nothing about chemistry.
Heroin addiction becomes the executive function in humans. Many humans host yeast in their guts, those who are sickened by yeast byproducts have celiac sprue disease. Regardless of how complicated the process is, the heroin producers just went into high gear on this. There is plenty of info right here to get the industry booted up. They just never thought of this as a production means. It is just a matter of time before addicts have an either pleasant or lethal infection. The catch is everyone who gets the infection will be an addict.
The weapon potential is something else. This associate of mine was discussing micology and how there is a huge mycelium out on the the west side of the Oquirrh mountains. He said it covered this huge area of soccer fields and empty land to the west edge of the mountains. Then I ponder a fungus like this releasing spores after the rain, or watering. If only I hadn't read a dystopian sci fi book, called Sign of the Labrys when I was 12, that talked about life after the yeast plagues...
posted by Oyéah at 9:03 AM on May 19, 2015
permiechickie, please make some opium yeast for me. will pay top dollar.
posted by cjorgensen at 9:15 AM on May 19, 2015
posted by cjorgensen at 9:15 AM on May 19, 2015
I don't enjoy opiates; I find the sensation of respiratory depression so distressing and distracting that I can't settle back into enjoying whatever it is that others seem to find so appealing.
Now, a nice robust low-maintenance yeast that pumped out LSD or psilocybin or 2CB? That would be something.
posted by flabdablet at 10:45 AM on May 19, 2015 [1 favorite]
Now, a nice robust low-maintenance yeast that pumped out LSD or psilocybin or 2CB? That would be something.
posted by flabdablet at 10:45 AM on May 19, 2015 [1 favorite]
More and more the discussion is turning to infectious cause of mental illness, that LSD producing yeast would be a doozy.
posted by Oyéah at 11:33 AM on May 19, 2015
posted by Oyéah at 11:33 AM on May 19, 2015
All those synthetic biology believers once employed in the bioethanol craze have to make ends meet somehow.
You have no idea.
posted by maryr at 11:44 AM on May 19, 2015 [1 favorite]
You have no idea.
posted by maryr at 11:44 AM on May 19, 2015 [1 favorite]
It's possible that some people already have yeasts or bacteria in their body that produce psychoactive chemicals and cause them to, e.g., spread the infection through blood or feces. It would be a lot less weird than some of the parasite-induced behavior we already know about. I wonder if anyone has looked for them?
posted by Joe in Australia at 3:56 PM on May 19, 2015
posted by Joe in Australia at 3:56 PM on May 19, 2015
Everyone mark their BINGO cards for the meniton of CRISPR/Cas9 at the end of the article.
fwiw, reading thru the comments on Don't Fear the CRISPR (pt.2) jtf remarks that the opiates from yeast process: "requires substantially more expertise than a meth lab... Neither are the organisms likely to be robust enough to work without a fully sterile environment due to their metabolically impaired nature (as is commonly the case with industrial biotechnology), so it's not nearly as robust as beer yeast... So, methamphetamine or beer brewing this is not."
posted by kliuless at 6:44 PM on May 19, 2015 [2 favorites]
fwiw, reading thru the comments on Don't Fear the CRISPR (pt.2) jtf remarks that the opiates from yeast process: "requires substantially more expertise than a meth lab... Neither are the organisms likely to be robust enough to work without a fully sterile environment due to their metabolically impaired nature (as is commonly the case with industrial biotechnology), so it's not nearly as robust as beer yeast... So, methamphetamine or beer brewing this is not."
posted by kliuless at 6:44 PM on May 19, 2015 [2 favorites]
Yeah, I still haven't had a chance to properly read that article, but in my experience, expressing proteins is rarely as simple as "oh, hey, it worked great in this paper!"
posted by maryr at 9:26 PM on May 19, 2015
posted by maryr at 9:26 PM on May 19, 2015
"Wait, 12 hour time course, sample every thirty minutes to optimize induction, nooooooooooooooooooooooo....."
posted by maryr at 9:29 PM on May 19, 2015
posted by maryr at 9:29 PM on May 19, 2015
Interesting article, but why does it start with a photo of a chicken on a bed?
The man in the mirror above the bed is shooting up, heroin I assume.
posted by space_cookie at 11:17 PM on May 19, 2015 [1 favorite]
The man in the mirror above the bed is shooting up, heroin I assume.
posted by space_cookie at 11:17 PM on May 19, 2015 [1 favorite]
Interesting article, but why does it start with a photo of a chicken on a bed?
Have you read Kafka's "Metamorphosis"? This stuff isn't super pure right out of the yeasts' butts, and there have been some *cough* side effects reported.
posted by wenestvedt at 6:38 AM on May 20, 2015
Have you read Kafka's "Metamorphosis"? This stuff isn't super pure right out of the yeasts' butts, and there have been some *cough* side effects reported.
posted by wenestvedt at 6:38 AM on May 20, 2015
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No. Opiates as easy to brew as a craft beer would utterly destroy current criminal networks. It's not like you even need fancy grow equipment or the space for a crop of anything, apartment dwellers have been brewing beer in their closets with off-the-shelf equipment for decades now. Once the yeast gets out there, that's pretty much the end of heroin and opiate prescription as a revenue center for organized crime.
posted by Slap*Happy at 9:55 AM on May 18, 2015 [27 favorites]