Oasis lost.
May 24, 2015 9:05 PM Subscribe
The lost city of Ordos The Kangbashi district, planned to accommodate a population in excess of one million, is home to a lonely 20,000 people – leaving 98% of this 355-square kilometre site either under construction or abandoned altogether.
I missed this place too? Man, Inner Mongolia is a fascinating, fascinating place. Some day I hope to go back and really see the place- Shang Du, Gobi desert, the works.
posted by LeRoienJaune at 9:24 PM on May 24, 2015
posted by LeRoienJaune at 9:24 PM on May 24, 2015
Interesting blog, that's for sure, but there is also the whiff of voyeurism that is a little off-putting. Although I only read the first entry, it would have been more interesting if the author had actually had an in-depth conversation with locals, or Chinese-speaking sources.
posted by Nevin at 9:43 PM on May 24, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by Nevin at 9:43 PM on May 24, 2015 [2 favorites]
It's very BioShock somehow.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 9:44 PM on May 24, 2015
posted by Hairy Lobster at 9:44 PM on May 24, 2015
Reminds me of the stimulus debate in the US, is it better to pay people to dig a big ass hole and fill it back in (or build a city in the middle of nowhere) rather than have them unemployed and starving? Or more aptly in China's case, than give up the illusion of never ending exponential growth?
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:03 PM on May 24, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:03 PM on May 24, 2015 [1 favorite]
Plan centrally for healthcare and education, plan locally for housing and transport infrastructure.
Look after the people first, and they will come.
posted by Samuel Farrow at 10:25 PM on May 24, 2015 [1 favorite]
Look after the people first, and they will come.
posted by Samuel Farrow at 10:25 PM on May 24, 2015 [1 favorite]
After all what is the most important thing about a city?
It's he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
posted by Samuel Farrow at 10:27 PM on May 24, 2015 [3 favorites]
It's he tangata, he tangata, he tangata.
posted by Samuel Farrow at 10:27 PM on May 24, 2015 [3 favorites]
Reminds me of the stimulus debate in the US, is it better to pay people to dig a big ass hole and fill it back in (or build a city in the middle of nowhere) rather than have them unemployed and starving?
Since when is this the "stimulus debate" in the US? There's a lot of infrastructure work that actually needs to be done.
posted by JenMarie at 10:35 PM on May 24, 2015 [22 favorites]
Since when is this the "stimulus debate" in the US? There's a lot of infrastructure work that actually needs to be done.
posted by JenMarie at 10:35 PM on May 24, 2015 [22 favorites]
In a sense, it doesn't seem that different in concept (different in scale, though!) from a lot of the bubble suburbs that we built in the mid-2000's. I'm sure it was driven by the same kind of financial speculation.
posted by omredux at 11:18 PM on May 24, 2015
posted by omredux at 11:18 PM on May 24, 2015
Samuel Farrow: "It's he tangata, he tangata, he tangata."
!! We need more Māori proverbs on this website.
posted by barnacles at 11:43 PM on May 24, 2015 [3 favorites]
!! We need more Māori proverbs on this website.
posted by barnacles at 11:43 PM on May 24, 2015 [3 favorites]
Interesting blog, that's for sure, but there is also the whiff of voyeurism that is a little off-putting.
posted by XMLicious at 12:29 AM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]We took the elevator up to the top floor, where the doors opened to reveal a gaggle of giggling, school-age girls stood in a line to greet us. It looked much the same as the brothel we’d passed the night before, save that this time the girls were fully dressed.
Two gweilo in the ghost city.
Looks like a great place to film a post-apocalypse movie.
Could have used captions on those photos.
Also, I do not believe that quai is a unit of currency. It's used as something like the words units of -- a person says "400 units of [quai] money [yuan or renminbi]. My guess is that the author forgot the names for Chinese money.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 4:34 AM on May 25, 2015
Looks like a great place to film a post-apocalypse movie.
Could have used captions on those photos.
Also, I do not believe that quai is a unit of currency. It's used as something like the words units of -- a person says "400 units of [quai] money [yuan or renminbi]. My guess is that the author forgot the names for Chinese money.
posted by Kirth Gerson at 4:34 AM on May 25, 2015
In a sense, it doesn't seem that different in concept (different in scale, though!) from a lot of the bubble suburbs that we built in the mid-2000's.
I'm not sure I follow. In the mid-2000s, private real-estate developers built subdivisions and commercial office space on speculation. But creating a city, with hospitals, schools, bus-lines, murals, monuments -- maybe I missed it, but I don't think that happened in the US.
In fact, has something like this ever happened? Or are we at a strange point in history when a country not only has the resources to make a city built for a million people but also does so without forcibly moving people there? I'd love to hear more of the "why" behind this -- is there overpopulation in the cities around Ordos? Did the government build this while also recruiting people to the area for mining or drilling projects?
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 4:36 AM on May 25, 2015
I'm not sure I follow. In the mid-2000s, private real-estate developers built subdivisions and commercial office space on speculation. But creating a city, with hospitals, schools, bus-lines, murals, monuments -- maybe I missed it, but I don't think that happened in the US.
In fact, has something like this ever happened? Or are we at a strange point in history when a country not only has the resources to make a city built for a million people but also does so without forcibly moving people there? I'd love to hear more of the "why" behind this -- is there overpopulation in the cities around Ordos? Did the government build this while also recruiting people to the area for mining or drilling projects?
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 4:36 AM on May 25, 2015
I do not believe that quai is a unit of currency. It's used as something like the words units of -- a person says "400 units of [quai] money [yuan or renminbi]. My guess is that the author forgot the names for Chinese money.
Quai is commonly used in Taiwan as a unit of currency. I don't think the mainland Chinese use the word that way; perhaps the author picked it up from the Taiwanese living in China.
I'd love to hear more of the "why" behind this -- is there overpopulation in the cities around Ordos?
Not so much in the cities around Ordos - the vast majority of Chinese people have no interest to live in Inner Mongolia. The mega-cities, most of them in the coastal regions, are over-crowded with migrant workers from the countryside. The Chinese government has been trying to divert the flow of migrants to smaller and newly build cities throughout the country. It hasn't worked very well overall, as people apparently migrate toward jobs, not infrastructure.
posted by fatehunter at 5:08 AM on May 25, 2015 [2 favorites]
Quai is commonly used in Taiwan as a unit of currency. I don't think the mainland Chinese use the word that way; perhaps the author picked it up from the Taiwanese living in China.
I'd love to hear more of the "why" behind this -- is there overpopulation in the cities around Ordos?
Not so much in the cities around Ordos - the vast majority of Chinese people have no interest to live in Inner Mongolia. The mega-cities, most of them in the coastal regions, are over-crowded with migrant workers from the countryside. The Chinese government has been trying to divert the flow of migrants to smaller and newly build cities throughout the country. It hasn't worked very well overall, as people apparently migrate toward jobs, not infrastructure.
posted by fatehunter at 5:08 AM on May 25, 2015 [2 favorites]
"whisky, peanuts and gas masks"
posted by crazylegs at 6:00 AM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by crazylegs at 6:00 AM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
A comment in the Telegraph linked in the thread above.
"It was inevitable that China's investment bubble would lead to vast inventory of unsold property. The country produced more cement between 2011 and 2013 than the US in the 20th Century."
If you build it a “classic debt deflation spiral” will come as excess capacity holds down prices, but I guess anyone who had that dream has long since profited from it and left the field.
posted by three blind mice at 6:13 AM on May 25, 2015
"It was inevitable that China's investment bubble would lead to vast inventory of unsold property. The country produced more cement between 2011 and 2013 than the US in the 20th Century."
If you build it a “classic debt deflation spiral” will come as excess capacity holds down prices, but I guess anyone who had that dream has long since profited from it and left the field.
posted by three blind mice at 6:13 AM on May 25, 2015
The "Ordos as ghost city" story has been refuted, at least to some degree.
I do not believe that quai is a unit of currency. It's used as something like the words units of -- a person says "400 units of [quai] money [yuan or renminbi]. My guess is that the author forgot the names for Chinese money.
Quai is commonly used in Taiwan as a unit of currency. I don't think the mainland Chinese use the word that way; perhaps the author picked it up from the Taiwanese living in China.
Kuai is commonly used throughout mainland China to refer to a unit of currency (RMB).
posted by hawkeye at 7:05 AM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
I do not believe that quai is a unit of currency. It's used as something like the words units of -- a person says "400 units of [quai] money [yuan or renminbi]. My guess is that the author forgot the names for Chinese money.
Quai is commonly used in Taiwan as a unit of currency. I don't think the mainland Chinese use the word that way; perhaps the author picked it up from the Taiwanese living in China.
Kuai is commonly used throughout mainland China to refer to a unit of currency (RMB).
posted by hawkeye at 7:05 AM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
I know he's probably only showing the grand ridiculous architecture, but this looks like it'd be a terrible place to live even fully populated. The worst of 20th century American city planning writ large. Walking between any two things here looks exhausting, on bright white concrete under the blistering sun with no shade, bus and car trips are the only feasible way to get anywhere and then it just takes forever to do any two things because it's all so damned compartmentalized.
After the first week the grandness would get old and then it'd be "Why do I have to walk two miles past useless monuments just to buy some toilet paper?"
I'd like to see this scale of urban planning done in a way that takes the people living there into account instead of more sprawl. Plan a good urban center and not just a big one.
posted by mikesch at 8:45 AM on May 25, 2015
After the first week the grandness would get old and then it'd be "Why do I have to walk two miles past useless monuments just to buy some toilet paper?"
I'd like to see this scale of urban planning done in a way that takes the people living there into account instead of more sprawl. Plan a good urban center and not just a big one.
posted by mikesch at 8:45 AM on May 25, 2015
Not sure what it says about me--perhaps that I like a grand architectural gesture and loathe Brutalism--but I really like the buildings in Kangbashi. At the moment it's a bit Ozymandias but one can't help hoping that the optimism of the residents is borne out.
posted by librarylis at 8:55 AM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by librarylis at 8:55 AM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
We took the elevator up to the top floor, where the doors opened to reveal a gaggle of giggling, school-age girls stood in a line to greet us. It looked much the same as the brothel we’d passed the night before, save that this time the girls were fully dressed.
Whiff of voyeurism indeed. And this:
For working men, there were primal comforts aplenty – bars, snacks and brothels
One of these things is not like the other.
posted by jokeefe at 9:57 AM on May 25, 2015 [3 favorites]
Whiff of voyeurism indeed. And this:
For working men, there were primal comforts aplenty – bars, snacks and brothels
One of these things is not like the other.
posted by jokeefe at 9:57 AM on May 25, 2015 [3 favorites]
"By the time we got back to our hotel, to its luxuriously oversized beds and in-room bars that featured whisky, peanuts and gas masks...."
I presume the travel agent leaves that last item off the brochure.
On the other hand, the developers created some very cool mega-art featuring horses. Horses are to Mongolians what chocolate and marshmallows are to smores; all you need is some graham crackers, a stick, and a campfire*. You can see where this analogy is headed.
* whippersnappers may substitute "microwave" for "campfire" without substantially altering the concept.
posted by mule98J at 9:58 AM on May 25, 2015 [2 favorites]
I presume the travel agent leaves that last item off the brochure.
On the other hand, the developers created some very cool mega-art featuring horses. Horses are to Mongolians what chocolate and marshmallows are to smores; all you need is some graham crackers, a stick, and a campfire*. You can see where this analogy is headed.
* whippersnappers may substitute "microwave" for "campfire" without substantially altering the concept.
posted by mule98J at 9:58 AM on May 25, 2015 [2 favorites]
Kuai is commonly used throughout mainland China to refer to a unit of currency (RMB).
Yes, kuài 塊, the most literal translation of which is "block" or "piece," is most akin to the use of "buck" in the US. It's not the official name of the currency of either the PRC or Taiwan but is very commonly used in both places, just like the use of an expression like "20 bucks" is very common in the US.
posted by andrewesque at 10:04 AM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
Yes, kuài 塊, the most literal translation of which is "block" or "piece," is most akin to the use of "buck" in the US. It's not the official name of the currency of either the PRC or Taiwan but is very commonly used in both places, just like the use of an expression like "20 bucks" is very common in the US.
posted by andrewesque at 10:04 AM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
Whiskey, peanuts and gas - masks? Where do I sign up?
posted by Katjusa Roquette at 11:02 AM on May 25, 2015
posted by Katjusa Roquette at 11:02 AM on May 25, 2015
In fact, has something like this ever happened? Or are we at a strange point in history when a country not only has the resources to make a city built for a million people but also does so without forcibly moving people there?
Washington, D.C.?
posted by killdevil at 2:34 PM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
Washington, D.C.?
posted by killdevil at 2:34 PM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
Amazing. Did not know that DC was built before people decided to move there.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 2:38 PM on May 25, 2015
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 2:38 PM on May 25, 2015
China's far from the only place to build empty cities in recent years, but at least they did it with money they actually had.
posted by George_Spiggott at 4:42 PM on May 25, 2015
posted by George_Spiggott at 4:42 PM on May 25, 2015
Ordos' current population 500,000 and growing by 10%+ per year.
posted by humanfont at 4:55 PM on May 25, 2015
posted by humanfont at 4:55 PM on May 25, 2015
!! We need more Māori proverbs on this website.
Sure! Here you go.
posted by Sebmojo at 5:33 PM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
Sure! Here you go.
posted by Sebmojo at 5:33 PM on May 25, 2015 [1 favorite]
I don't find this voyeuristic, unless all tourism is voyeurism. My co-worker who is from Shanghai remarked on the blueness of the sky, but would have liked to see what the city looked like at night. He also pointed out that the 'police station' is actually a school (empty) with a checkpoint at the gate - China has had it's own school shooting tragedies, and this is the result.
posted by um at 6:39 PM on May 25, 2015
posted by um at 6:39 PM on May 25, 2015
Needs some CVSs and Chase Banks.
posted by The corpse in the library at 9:37 PM on May 25, 2015
posted by The corpse in the library at 9:37 PM on May 25, 2015
Are there opportunities for foreign speculators now? Prices of $1,100 dropping to $470 per square foot seem a little bit absurd. The upper end of that price range will buy you newly constructed condos in Brooklyn (i.e. VERY expensive real estate by most standards). >$400 per square foot is still crazy for most US cities.
posted by theorique at 4:01 AM on May 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by theorique at 4:01 AM on May 26, 2015 [1 favorite]
In fact, has something like this ever happened? Or are we at a strange point in history when a country not only has the resources to make a city built for a million people but also does so without forcibly moving people there?
Washington, D.C.?
Definitely. A number of capital cities were planned to a large extent before there is a population there -- Canberra, Quezon City, New Delhi, Brasilia, and Islamabad, also. I'm also thinking of all the planned suburban communities in the US such as Levittown on Long Island; the creepy Disney-planned Celebration, FL; much of the UAE, I believe, and it seems like I heard something recently about Iran currently building planned cities. Also, parts of Singapore?
posted by aught at 6:44 AM on May 26, 2015
Washington, D.C.?
Definitely. A number of capital cities were planned to a large extent before there is a population there -- Canberra, Quezon City, New Delhi, Brasilia, and Islamabad, also. I'm also thinking of all the planned suburban communities in the US such as Levittown on Long Island; the creepy Disney-planned Celebration, FL; much of the UAE, I believe, and it seems like I heard something recently about Iran currently building planned cities. Also, parts of Singapore?
posted by aught at 6:44 AM on May 26, 2015
The gas masks are common in Chinese hotels. They are supposed to be used in case of fire.
I'm not sure voyeuristic is the right word for this, but while the subject is interesting, the attitude the writer takes is just off somehow. Without context, perhaps? The writer seems to know very little about China. There also seem to be a lot of exaggerations.
posted by ssg at 6:47 AM on May 26, 2015
I'm not sure voyeuristic is the right word for this, but while the subject is interesting, the attitude the writer takes is just off somehow. Without context, perhaps? The writer seems to know very little about China. There also seem to be a lot of exaggerations.
posted by ssg at 6:47 AM on May 26, 2015
Also, the apartments being unfinished is normal in China. They are sold as empty shells, to be finished by the buyer.
posted by ssg at 6:48 AM on May 26, 2015
posted by ssg at 6:48 AM on May 26, 2015
Prices of $1,100 dropping to $470 per square foot seem a little bit absurd
Definitely. This is a propagation of a units error someone made back in 2012 so it's off by an order of magnitude. Chinese media put precrash prices in Ordos new districts at around 7000 yuan per sq.m. (i.e. ~$1100/㎡ ), dropping to 3,000 yuan post crash (~$470). Even the hyped-up numbers at the top end, 15,000-20,000 yuan per sq.m., were less than top-end property prices in Beijing at the time.
The photos are pretty interesting, but the descriptions of a decaying, abandoned Kangbashi aggressively ignore anything that would disagree with that narrative. The fact that the author even had a caretaker to guide him through the clearly-labelled Kangbashi New District #1 Elementary School and still portrayed it as a school-adjacent combination police station, municipal athletic field, and sports hall is really indefensible, and makes me skeptical of his accounts of the other interactions he had with locals.
posted by zhwj at 2:13 AM on May 27, 2015
Definitely. This is a propagation of a units error someone made back in 2012 so it's off by an order of magnitude. Chinese media put precrash prices in Ordos new districts at around 7000 yuan per sq.m. (i.e. ~$1100/㎡ ), dropping to 3,000 yuan post crash (~$470). Even the hyped-up numbers at the top end, 15,000-20,000 yuan per sq.m., were less than top-end property prices in Beijing at the time.
The photos are pretty interesting, but the descriptions of a decaying, abandoned Kangbashi aggressively ignore anything that would disagree with that narrative. The fact that the author even had a caretaker to guide him through the clearly-labelled Kangbashi New District #1 Elementary School and still portrayed it as a school-adjacent combination police station, municipal athletic field, and sports hall is really indefensible, and makes me skeptical of his accounts of the other interactions he had with locals.
posted by zhwj at 2:13 AM on May 27, 2015
This is a propagation of a units error someone made back in 2012 so it's off by an order of magnitude.
Oh, per square METER! That makes so much more sense. Thanks!
At those prices, it would be about 5-10% of "normal" luxury real estate in NYC, or around the price of a typical house in many parts of the USA (i.e. 1500 sq ft - $75K-150K).
posted by theorique at 4:08 AM on May 27, 2015
Oh, per square METER! That makes so much more sense. Thanks!
At those prices, it would be about 5-10% of "normal" luxury real estate in NYC, or around the price of a typical house in many parts of the USA (i.e. 1500 sq ft - $75K-150K).
posted by theorique at 4:08 AM on May 27, 2015
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posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 9:19 PM on May 24, 2015 [5 favorites]