How
March 1, 2002 3:44 AM Subscribe
The guy sort of involved with Oliver North?
posted by ParisParamus at 3:59 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by ParisParamus at 3:59 AM on March 1, 2002
I think I recently heard about him on the radio yesterday, or the day before.
posted by ParisParamus at 3:59 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by ParisParamus at 3:59 AM on March 1, 2002
Congrads on establishing the most obscure Mefi thread of the month (March).
posted by ParisParamus at 4:00 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by ParisParamus at 4:00 AM on March 1, 2002
Silly topic! I shouldn't be forced to think to understand what you're trying to say!
posted by Mach3avelli at 4:08 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by Mach3avelli at 4:08 AM on March 1, 2002
When will people stop making each word a link in obscure topics?
posted by Qubit at 5:06 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by Qubit at 5:06 AM on March 1, 2002
In general: You think you guys can click on one of the 6 links I offer and find out what I'm talking about instead of clicking on "comments", typing in a complaining comment, clicking to preview it and then clicking again to post it?
Qubit: sometimes the form is the message. The Poindexter story is so incredibly surreal (specially this last twist) that it is difficult to convey it with simple words and not sound like a biased liar.
posted by magullo at 5:14 AM on March 1, 2002
Qubit: sometimes the form is the message. The Poindexter story is so incredibly surreal (specially this last twist) that it is difficult to convey it with simple words and not sound like a biased liar.
posted by magullo at 5:14 AM on March 1, 2002
I didn't realize there was more than one link. All the same color: bad usability. Bad!
posted by ParisParamus at 5:17 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by ParisParamus at 5:17 AM on March 1, 2002
No Felix The Cat link....
posted by ParisParamus at 5:19 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by ParisParamus at 5:19 AM on March 1, 2002
Surreal? Have people not been expecting this sort of thing for a long time? And is it surprising coming from the Bush-Ashcroft duo?
posted by Qubit at 5:20 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by Qubit at 5:20 AM on March 1, 2002
Actually, I did immediately flash on Dr. John Poindexter of Iran/Contra fame rather than Buster Poindexter neé David Johansen of the New York Dolls. Which shows you where my head is usually at.
Rather than recount the whole thing, I'll refer you to this excellent summary in Grolier's online encyclopedia.
posted by alumshubby at 5:50 AM on March 1, 2002
Rather than recount the whole thing, I'll refer you to this excellent summary in Grolier's online encyclopedia.
posted by alumshubby at 5:50 AM on March 1, 2002
Fleischer - 'The president thinks that Adm. Poindexter has served our nation very well'
in case you were wondering, supplying arms to terrorists who supply illegal drugs to the us and lieing to congress are not questionable actions, they are laudable.
posted by asok at 6:06 AM on March 1, 2002
in case you were wondering, supplying arms to terrorists who supply illegal drugs to the us and lieing to congress are not questionable actions, they are laudable.
posted by asok at 6:06 AM on March 1, 2002
sometimes the form is the message.
If the message is I'm so clever and don't give a shit about the readers , perhaps.
Subtext aside, Magullo, this is interesting information: common courtesy would suggest you provide at least minimal introductory information. You did not and instead chose to use six unseparated links in one line. Unless you were intending to screen out most of the readers here, it's not merely a bad post but a craptacular one.
Talk about being more anxious to speak than be heard...
posted by y2karl at 6:08 AM on March 1, 2002
If the message is I'm so clever and don't give a shit about the readers , perhaps.
Subtext aside, Magullo, this is interesting information: common courtesy would suggest you provide at least minimal introductory information. You did not and instead chose to use six unseparated links in one line. Unless you were intending to screen out most of the readers here, it's not merely a bad post but a craptacular one.
Talk about being more anxious to speak than be heard...
posted by y2karl at 6:08 AM on March 1, 2002
*must concentrate on messenger, ignore message.*
if you all are so damn concerned about the way this ffp was presented why not take it to MeTa?
otherwise concentrate on the subject, not the poster.
posted by asok at 6:18 AM on March 1, 2002
if you all are so damn concerned about the way this ffp was presented why not take it to MeTa?
otherwise concentrate on the subject, not the poster.
posted by asok at 6:18 AM on March 1, 2002
y2Karl: I guess I'm really stupid. Why don't you write me a suitable intro on the theme "why is this not being talked about?". My point is not to recap on Poindexter's story, what I wanna know why nobody talks about it.
posted by magullo at 6:19 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by magullo at 6:19 AM on March 1, 2002
jeez. every day there's something scarier and scarier about this administration and its cohorts. i've been reading Libra by Don DeLillo and i keep thinking about how the world of international spies, double-agents, and disgruntled former CIA officials working on international plots to assassinate various world leaders in the 60s was so much simpler and friendlier than what's going on these days.
posted by fsck the police at 6:19 AM on March 1, 2002
so who wants to bet on who the rosenbergs of this decade will be?
posted by fsck the police at 6:19 AM on March 1, 2002
I'm just thinking (hoping) Bush screws up something major. Be it the nuclear bomb that goes off just outside of Iraq, the hundreds (or thousands) of Americans that die in North Korea (whose fathers remember watching their friends die there 50 years ago) or the virus outbreak that kills half or Oregon and the better part of Seattle.
And then we'll get another flaming liberal President in the next election and it'll be all happy land again.
Maybe Poindexter is The Right Man for Bush's mission, then.
posted by fnirt at 8:00 AM on March 1, 2002
And then we'll get another flaming liberal President in the next election and it'll be all happy land again.
Maybe Poindexter is The Right Man for Bush's mission, then.
posted by fnirt at 8:00 AM on March 1, 2002
The scary part of this thread is how few people seem to know or care about this story. Bush wins again. They impeached Clinton for lying to hide an affair, but Bush hires an Iran-Contra felon CONVICTED of perjury, obstruction of justice, and conspiracy, and it barely gets noticed by the news media or the public.
Pathetic.
posted by mattpusateri at 8:05 AM on March 1, 2002
Pathetic.
posted by mattpusateri at 8:05 AM on March 1, 2002
Just to help frame this in its most interesting context, I took the liberty of extracting a portion of the 25 Feb 2002 White House press briefing -- you'd get to it from the hyperlinked "?" in the FPP. I assume that's Helen Thomas sparring with Ari:
[Ari] That's a summary of the President's day. Helen.
Q Ari, why would this administration choose a man for couterterrorism who is so associated with the dark side of the Iran Contra scandal, Admiral Poindexter?
MR. FLEISCHER: When you say, choose him for counterterrorism, can you be more specific?
Q He's in the Pentagon, he's been appointed head of DARPA, which is a counterterrorist office, developing plans, demonstrations with information.
MR. FLEISCHER: I'm not aware of any appointment.
Q Yet.
MR. FLEISCHER: Let me just say about Admiral Poindexter, Admiral Poindexter is somebody who this administration thinks is an outstanding American and an outstanding citizen who has done a very good job in what he has done for our country, serving in the military.
Q How can you say that, when he told Colonel North to lie?
MR. FLEISCHER: Helen, I think your views on Iran Contra are well-known, but the President does believe that Admiral Poindexter served --
Q It isn't my view, this is the prosecutor for the United States.
MR. FLEISCHER: I understand. The President thinks that Admiral Poindexter has served our nation very well.
Q Really?
MR. FLEISCHER: That's the President's thoughts.
Q Do you know his record?
MR. FLEISCHER: I'm sure you will inform me.
Q I don't have to, all you have to do is look it up.
And then Ari moves on to whatever else.
posted by alumshubby at 8:14 AM on March 1, 2002
[Ari] That's a summary of the President's day. Helen.
Q Ari, why would this administration choose a man for couterterrorism who is so associated with the dark side of the Iran Contra scandal, Admiral Poindexter?
MR. FLEISCHER: When you say, choose him for counterterrorism, can you be more specific?
Q He's in the Pentagon, he's been appointed head of DARPA, which is a counterterrorist office, developing plans, demonstrations with information.
MR. FLEISCHER: I'm not aware of any appointment.
Q Yet.
MR. FLEISCHER: Let me just say about Admiral Poindexter, Admiral Poindexter is somebody who this administration thinks is an outstanding American and an outstanding citizen who has done a very good job in what he has done for our country, serving in the military.
Q How can you say that, when he told Colonel North to lie?
MR. FLEISCHER: Helen, I think your views on Iran Contra are well-known, but the President does believe that Admiral Poindexter served --
Q It isn't my view, this is the prosecutor for the United States.
MR. FLEISCHER: I understand. The President thinks that Admiral Poindexter has served our nation very well.
Q Really?
MR. FLEISCHER: That's the President's thoughts.
Q Do you know his record?
MR. FLEISCHER: I'm sure you will inform me.
Q I don't have to, all you have to do is look it up.
And then Ari moves on to whatever else.
posted by alumshubby at 8:14 AM on March 1, 2002
Ignore them, Magullo, this was a fascinating post. One click is all it took to understand what it was about.
posted by Hildago at 8:25 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by Hildago at 8:25 AM on March 1, 2002
Somewhere I read a theory that the "major" terrorist threat announced a few weeks ago may have been just to divert media attention away from Poindexter.
posted by jeblis at 8:45 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by jeblis at 8:45 AM on March 1, 2002
Fascinating backstory to the White House's current high-mindedness on terrorism, isn't it?
Poindexter and other Ronald Reaganites gave Muslim terrorists millions of dollars in high-tech weaponry (and a Bible) to score hostages and money to arm another set of terrorists in Nicaragua.
In violation of existing laws. Then repeatedly lied to everyone about the whole thing. Fortunately, the U.S. had not at the time declared itself the mortal enemy of countries that support terrorism, or we would have carpet-bombed 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
Let's play Iran-Contra trivia!
Next White House appointment: Eugene Hasenfus as undersecretary for air cargo safety.
posted by sacre_bleu at 8:48 AM on March 1, 2002
Poindexter and other Ronald Reaganites gave Muslim terrorists millions of dollars in high-tech weaponry (and a Bible) to score hostages and money to arm another set of terrorists in Nicaragua.
In violation of existing laws. Then repeatedly lied to everyone about the whole thing. Fortunately, the U.S. had not at the time declared itself the mortal enemy of countries that support terrorism, or we would have carpet-bombed 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
Let's play Iran-Contra trivia!
Next White House appointment: Eugene Hasenfus as undersecretary for air cargo safety.
posted by sacre_bleu at 8:48 AM on March 1, 2002
Of course its not just Poindexter, the mainstream press was relatively silent when convicted purgerer Elliot Abrams the state department liason with the Central American regimes that were making "communist" supporters "disappear." It is worth noting that Iran-Contra came about when congress started wondering why the anti-Communist crusade in central America required slaughtering Catholic preists and nuns in very public and messy ways.
One thing I will give for Poindexter, in his testamony to congress he admitted that the President only served to rubber-stamp whatever the NSC and the CIA recommended.
posted by KirkJobSluder at 9:06 AM on March 1, 2002
One thing I will give for Poindexter, in his testamony to congress he admitted that the President only served to rubber-stamp whatever the NSC and the CIA recommended.
posted by KirkJobSluder at 9:06 AM on March 1, 2002
Aw, geez! I got sick of the Contra, Fawn, and Ollie Show the first time around.
posted by scottymac at 11:13 AM on March 1, 2002
posted by scottymac at 11:13 AM on March 1, 2002
"One click is all it took to understand what it was about."
Provided you clicked the correct link.
posted by mischief at 11:55 AM on March 1, 2002
Provided you clicked the correct link.
posted by mischief at 11:55 AM on March 1, 2002
Aw, geez! I got sick of the Contra, Fawn, and Ollie Show the first time around.
Yeah, me too! For this they cancel Family Guy!?
posted by hincandenza at 2:30 PM on March 1, 2002
Yeah, me too! For this they cancel Family Guy!?
posted by hincandenza at 2:30 PM on March 1, 2002
mischief, swetie, the first one would be okay, why are you so twisted?
posted by magullo at 4:57 PM on March 1, 2002
posted by magullo at 4:57 PM on March 1, 2002
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posted by pracowity at 3:50 AM on March 1, 2002