‘Suck It Up’
August 15, 2016 6:43 PM Subscribe
"With neighborhoods in Brooklyn along the L line — among the city’s busiest subway routes — in anguish over losing their train to Manhattan for 18 months, New Yorkers living in so-called subway deserts have a message: Welcome to the club."
The Impact of Brooklyn's L Train Shutdown, in 4 Maps
L train shutdown explained: Facts, figures, proposals and more
The Impact of Brooklyn's L Train Shutdown, in 4 Maps
L train shutdown explained: Facts, figures, proposals and more
if williamsburg wasn't so egregiously excessively gentrified there wouldn't even have been so many city-led meetings about the situation, just a "SRY FOR THE INCONVENIENCE LOL" sign up for 2 years.
posted by poffin boffin at 6:59 PM on August 15, 2016 [34 favorites]
posted by poffin boffin at 6:59 PM on August 15, 2016 [34 favorites]
"SRY FOR THE INCONVENIENCE LOL"
You've just triggered every memory I have of living on the R.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:03 PM on August 15, 2016 [12 favorites]
You've just triggered every memory I have of living on the R.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:03 PM on August 15, 2016 [12 favorites]
plus the added overwhelming aroma of steamy nutsack
posted by poffin boffin at 7:10 PM on August 15, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by poffin boffin at 7:10 PM on August 15, 2016 [3 favorites]
Welcome to life in what used to be known as a "Two Fare Zone." It's a pain in the ass.
(Before metrocards (also known as the Dark Ages,) there were no free transfers between buses and subways. Riders paid full fare for each.)
posted by zarq at 7:13 PM on August 15, 2016 [2 favorites]
(Before metrocards (also known as the Dark Ages,) there were no free transfers between buses and subways. Riders paid full fare for each.)
posted by zarq at 7:13 PM on August 15, 2016 [2 favorites]
If the Williamsburg Bridge was a shit show in terms of bike traffic now, then it's gonna be nuts when the L shuts. I used it to commute for a number of years, cycling to my office in East Williamsburg, and it was occasionally hectic going against the prevailing traffic. Right after Sandy, when the train was not working at all, the bridge was absolutely packed with pedestrians and cyclists.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 7:15 PM on August 15, 2016
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 7:15 PM on August 15, 2016
You say that like it's a bad thing.
posted by schmod at 7:25 PM on August 15, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by schmod at 7:25 PM on August 15, 2016 [4 favorites]
if williamsburg wasn't so egregiously excessively gentrified there wouldn't even have been so many city-led meetings about the situation, just a "SRY FOR THE INCONVENIENCE LOL" sign up for 2 years.
posted by poffin boffin at 6:59 PM on August 15 [5 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]
And this is why I laughed my ass off when it was announced. That, and fuck real estate developers, that's why.
posted by schadenfrau at 7:30 PM on August 15, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by poffin boffin at 6:59 PM on August 15 [5 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]
And this is why I laughed my ass off when it was announced. That, and fuck real estate developers, that's why.
posted by schadenfrau at 7:30 PM on August 15, 2016 [5 favorites]
Yup, it correctly identifies my block as being outside the walk-to-a-subway zone. But it overlooks the fact that the subway I AM closest to is the G and so it's effectively useless anyway.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:32 PM on August 15, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:32 PM on August 15, 2016 [2 favorites]
I miss a lot of things about the burg, but an L train shutdown is not one of them. When that train stops, the alternatives are hideous.
And a shutdown for as long as this?
Brutal.
posted by lampshade at 7:49 PM on August 15, 2016
And a shutdown for as long as this?
Brutal.
posted by lampshade at 7:49 PM on August 15, 2016
The Gothamist ran this article, talking to Williamsburg shop owners about the impact of the shutdown. The most interesting tidbit is the owner of the high-end jewelry shop who says that all her customers Uber in from Manhattan anyway. Perhaps the L Train shutdown will make Williamsburg even more of a playground for the wealthy?
EmpressCallipygos, I met up with a friend in Brooklyn this weekend and he was singing the praises of the G, on which he commutes to work. I just could not understand it.
posted by ejs at 8:00 PM on August 15, 2016
EmpressCallipygos, I met up with a friend in Brooklyn this weekend and he was singing the praises of the G, on which he commutes to work. I just could not understand it.
posted by ejs at 8:00 PM on August 15, 2016
If the Williamsburg Bridge was a shit show in terms of bike traffic now, then it's gonna be nuts when the L shuts.
Oh lord, I wasn't even thinking about this. It's going to be awful, especially since no pedestrian from north of the bridge will actually bother walking to the (pedestrian) south side of the bridge.
Guess I'll start going a few miles out of my way to take the Manhattan? At least that means going by Brooklyn Kolache every morning.
posted by thecaddy at 8:07 PM on August 15, 2016
Oh lord, I wasn't even thinking about this. It's going to be awful, especially since no pedestrian from north of the bridge will actually bother walking to the (pedestrian) south side of the bridge.
Guess I'll start going a few miles out of my way to take the Manhattan? At least that means going by Brooklyn Kolache every morning.
posted by thecaddy at 8:07 PM on August 15, 2016
Maybe while they're at it they can finally complete the Staten Island Tunnel, which was contracted at the same time as the Canarsie Tunnel (1904) but only made it 150 feet before being halted mostly because of corruption.
posted by 1adam12 at 8:15 PM on August 15, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by 1adam12 at 8:15 PM on August 15, 2016 [4 favorites]
schmod: you say that like it's a bad thing
Longtime city cyclist here who generally believes that more bikes is a good thing. But that bridge has a few bad pinch points, chicanes with horrible sight lines and a long ramp at either end. I suppose it's a miracle that I saw only a couple incidents in my over four years commuting to Brooklyn. I just assumed that some yahoo wearing earbuds was going to rocket thru the turn like he (or she, but let's face it, most times it was a guy) was there was nobody else around.
And possibly the city will actually clear the walkways of ice and snow? Like with plows and salt? That would be a nice change.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 8:17 PM on August 15, 2016 [5 favorites]
Longtime city cyclist here who generally believes that more bikes is a good thing. But that bridge has a few bad pinch points, chicanes with horrible sight lines and a long ramp at either end. I suppose it's a miracle that I saw only a couple incidents in my over four years commuting to Brooklyn. I just assumed that some yahoo wearing earbuds was going to rocket thru the turn like he (or she, but let's face it, most times it was a guy) was there was nobody else around.
And possibly the city will actually clear the walkways of ice and snow? Like with plows and salt? That would be a nice change.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 8:17 PM on August 15, 2016 [5 favorites]
On the plus side, the MTA says it's going to run full-sized G trains, and more often, and free transfers between Broadway and Lorimer while this is all happening.
posted by retrograde at 8:19 PM on August 15, 2016
posted by retrograde at 8:19 PM on August 15, 2016
(Before metrocards (also known as the Dark Ages,) there were no free transfers between buses and subways. Riders paid full fare for each.)
God, you just dragged up childhood memories of those little pink paper slips you could get when you got off the bus that let you transfer to another bus. I wonder how long it's been since I saw one of those?
posted by Itaxpica at 8:23 PM on August 15, 2016 [5 favorites]
God, you just dragged up childhood memories of those little pink paper slips you could get when you got off the bus that let you transfer to another bus. I wonder how long it's been since I saw one of those?
posted by Itaxpica at 8:23 PM on August 15, 2016 [5 favorites]
Aaaaaaand I just found a photo! Guess they had them until at least '04.
posted by Itaxpica at 8:25 PM on August 15, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by Itaxpica at 8:25 PM on August 15, 2016 [7 favorites]
Oh wow. Bus transfers! Neat find!
posted by zarq at 8:34 PM on August 15, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by zarq at 8:34 PM on August 15, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah, I still remember metrocards with their free bus-subway transfers coming along and being very confused about if they were used for bus-bus transfers too, or if you still used the paper slip.
posted by Itaxpica at 8:35 PM on August 15, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Itaxpica at 8:35 PM on August 15, 2016 [2 favorites]
Reminds me, I just saw a Combined Bus/Subway map posted the other day.
posted by fings at 9:01 PM on August 15, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by fings at 9:01 PM on August 15, 2016 [7 favorites]
EmpressCallipygos, I met up with a friend in Brooklyn this weekend and he was singing the praises of the G, on which he commutes to work. I just could not understand it.
posted by ejs at 8:00 PM on August 15 [+] [!]
That is the fevered delusion stage of denial.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:11 PM on August 15, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by ejs at 8:00 PM on August 15 [+] [!]
That is the fevered delusion stage of denial.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:11 PM on August 15, 2016 [5 favorites]
I like how New York this thread is so far.
posted by zutalors! at 9:16 PM on August 15, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by zutalors! at 9:16 PM on August 15, 2016 [3 favorites]
I bought a G hat at the Transit Museum when I lived in Clinton Hill back in 2011. Ever since then the G has been very, very good to me. It flabbergasts grumpybearbride.
posted by grumpybear69 at 9:17 PM on August 15, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by grumpybear69 at 9:17 PM on August 15, 2016 [7 favorites]
I too have a good attitude towards the G train.
posted by dame at 9:30 PM on August 15, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by dame at 9:30 PM on August 15, 2016 [9 favorites]
This might have changed recently, but I think you can still get bus transfers if you pay with coins and ask the driver for one. They're like the little paper one-trip cards they used to sell.
posted by coolname at 9:37 PM on August 15, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by coolname at 9:37 PM on August 15, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yesssssss the G train backlash backlash is beginning
I lived off the G for 5 years. I always liked it. Then I moved to Portland. Now I dream about the G train.
posted by Automocar at 9:37 PM on August 15, 2016 [12 favorites]
I lived off the G for 5 years. I always liked it. Then I moved to Portland. Now I dream about the G train.
posted by Automocar at 9:37 PM on August 15, 2016 [12 favorites]
Reminds me, I just saw a Combined Bus/Subway map posted the other day.
posted by fings at 9:01 PM on August 15
I wish this existed when I was in high school, navigating the city with a subway pass but little money. At the time I didn't even consider taking the bus, which seemed so random and mercurial compared to the subway and its fixed stops.
posted by ejs at 9:51 PM on August 15, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by fings at 9:01 PM on August 15
I wish this existed when I was in high school, navigating the city with a subway pass but little money. At the time I didn't even consider taking the bus, which seemed so random and mercurial compared to the subway and its fixed stops.
posted by ejs at 9:51 PM on August 15, 2016 [1 favorite]
My city has had crazy ass road closures for the last year and will continue for another year. They are doing everything at the same time so there is no sneaky way to cut through a neighborhood or go a few miles around while I laugh at all the less creative chuckleheads. Nope. All of the roads that ran in two directions are now one way only and if you try to be clever and find a shortcut you are forced to circle the whole city again in anger to follow their forced route. The supermarket nearest me used to be a 5 minute drive and now is 40 even without traffic. It is insane. Why in the fuck did the city do this all at the same time is beyond me.
Obviously I am not in nyc but transit repairs are a special kind of hell everywhere.
posted by futz at 10:15 PM on August 15, 2016
Obviously I am not in nyc but transit repairs are a special kind of hell everywhere.
posted by futz at 10:15 PM on August 15, 2016
futz: "Why in the fuck did the city do this all at the same time is beyond me. "
It's cheaper because you don't pay to mob/demob crews and equipment multiple times.
posted by Mitheral at 10:18 PM on August 15, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's cheaper because you don't pay to mob/demob crews and equipment multiple times.
posted by Mitheral at 10:18 PM on August 15, 2016 [1 favorite]
The MTA exhibiting lazy monopolist thinking. Going to be a lot of ridesharing, car sharing and valet (LOTS of people in Williamburg have cars, they just haven't had systems to drive them to Manhattan) private sector solutions that will come out of this and endure past the re-opening of the subway.
posted by MattD at 2:54 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by MattD at 2:54 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
Aaaaaaand I just found a photo! Guess they had them until at least '04.
New Yorkers always make me feel like I live in the past century; I use a transfer like that every time I ride the bus out here.
posted by octothorpe at 3:51 AM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
New Yorkers always make me feel like I live in the past century; I use a transfer like that every time I ride the bus out here.
posted by octothorpe at 3:51 AM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
I for one look forward to a Manhattan without so much Brooklyn, but what we're gonna do with all the extra mustache wax I just don't know.
posted by sexyrobot at 4:44 AM on August 16, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by sexyrobot at 4:44 AM on August 16, 2016 [3 favorites]
The MTA exhibiting lazy monopolist thinking. Going to be a lot of ridesharing, car sharing and valet (LOTS of people in Williamburg have cars, they just haven't had systems to drive them to Manhattan) private sector solutions that will come out of this and endure past the re-opening of the subway.
Man, fetishizers of the market really do have a lazy answer for everythjng
posted by MisantropicPainforest at 4:50 AM on August 16, 2016 [10 favorites]
I used to live in Philadelphia, specifically Northeast Philadelphia, where getting to school required a bus, a subway, and another bus. When I went to college in the Philly, I had to take a bus, the subway, and either the commuter rail, or the other subway.
Now I live a 10 minute walk from the F train.
Cry me a river, Williamsburgers. You got alternate options. If the F Train doesn't run here, I'm fucked.
posted by SansPoint at 5:16 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
Now I live a 10 minute walk from the F train.
Cry me a river, Williamsburgers. You got alternate options. If the F Train doesn't run here, I'm fucked.
posted by SansPoint at 5:16 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
There is no way private cars, even with ride sharing, are going to be an effective substitute for a rail line that was already over capacity during the peak commute. The congestion would be insane if even half of those people drove to work.
posted by en forme de poire at 5:35 AM on August 16, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by en forme de poire at 5:35 AM on August 16, 2016 [9 favorites]
Man, fetishizers of the market really do have a lazy answer for everythjng
Do you not think that's going to happen?
posted by indubitable at 5:41 AM on August 16, 2016
Do you not think that's going to happen?
posted by indubitable at 5:41 AM on August 16, 2016
I made the mistake of trying to take the G on a Saturday last month (lolsuburbanyokel). It did not end well.
posted by uncleozzy at 5:54 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by uncleozzy at 5:54 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
Man, fetishizers of the market really do have a lazy answer for everythjng
Do you not think that's going to happen?
It is, but there's no way the bridges could accommodate it if everyone switched to private-car-based transportation.
225K passengers cross the East River on the L each day (400K on the entire line).
Approximately 116K cars cross the Williamsburg Bridge each day and 88K over the Manhattan Bridge. If one assumes an average occupancy of 1.5 passengers/car (national numbers were 1.13 passengers/car for travel-to-work purposes in 2009, but we should adjust upward for NYC) and a 10% decrease in demand for cross-river travel (some people will move, find different jobs, etc.) that is a demand of about 202K cross-river passengers each day, which translates to an extra 135K cars if everyone switched to driving.
If we assume that that 80% of those cars would take the Williamsburg Bridge and 20% the Manhattan Bridge, that's a +108K or 93% increase in traffic on the Wburg Bridge and a +27K or 30% increase on the Manhattan Bridge. Now I don't drive in NYC and maybe these bridges are totally free-flowing in the morning, but it seems highly unlikely these bridges could take such a dramatic increase in traffic in such a short period.
(This doesn't take into account of course, the fact that many people in these neighborhoods don't have cars in the first place/afford to take cabs every single day to their jobs, and the fact that parking in Manhattan is neither easy to find nor affordable.)
posted by andrewesque at 6:02 AM on August 16, 2016 [4 favorites]
Do you not think that's going to happen?
It is, but there's no way the bridges could accommodate it if everyone switched to private-car-based transportation.
225K passengers cross the East River on the L each day (400K on the entire line).
Approximately 116K cars cross the Williamsburg Bridge each day and 88K over the Manhattan Bridge. If one assumes an average occupancy of 1.5 passengers/car (national numbers were 1.13 passengers/car for travel-to-work purposes in 2009, but we should adjust upward for NYC) and a 10% decrease in demand for cross-river travel (some people will move, find different jobs, etc.) that is a demand of about 202K cross-river passengers each day, which translates to an extra 135K cars if everyone switched to driving.
If we assume that that 80% of those cars would take the Williamsburg Bridge and 20% the Manhattan Bridge, that's a +108K or 93% increase in traffic on the Wburg Bridge and a +27K or 30% increase on the Manhattan Bridge. Now I don't drive in NYC and maybe these bridges are totally free-flowing in the morning, but it seems highly unlikely these bridges could take such a dramatic increase in traffic in such a short period.
(This doesn't take into account of course, the fact that many people in these neighborhoods don't have cars in the first place/afford to take cabs every single day to their jobs, and the fact that parking in Manhattan is neither easy to find nor affordable.)
posted by andrewesque at 6:02 AM on August 16, 2016 [4 favorites]
All this attention on the L train, and the M shutdown gets barely a mention. THAT is going to be a nightmare too. And unlike Williamburg, it's not the just wealthy and the hipsters out here. It's the working poor and struggling families. I'm lucky, all things considered. I have a 20 walk to the L when the M's down (which...will be a delight this winter). MANY MANY folks don't have that option; along either the M or the L. I predict lines of people winding around the block at the shuttle-bus stops ala after hurricane Sandy.
posted by UltraMorgnus at 6:11 AM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by UltraMorgnus at 6:11 AM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
The MTA exhibiting lazy monopolist thinking. Going to be a lot of ridesharing, car sharing and valet (LOTS of people in Williamburg have cars, they just haven't had systems to drive them to Manhattan) private sector solutions that will come out of this and endure past the re-opening of the subway.
I was living in Williamsburg during the transit strike in the early 00s and I have no idea why everyone there can't just do what I did at the time: walk, write off cab expenses in their job's ledger as 'cleaning supplies' and get a ride from a Ukranian family entering the W'burg bridge so they could use the HOV lane. Solutions like this will get people past the first few days of this and after that we'll all just ride the modified Big Dogs that Google will give away as Epic Mounts. Oh and drones, maybe there will be riding drones. Who even needs public transit, geez.
posted by griphus at 6:16 AM on August 16, 2016 [18 favorites]
I was living in Williamsburg during the transit strike in the early 00s and I have no idea why everyone there can't just do what I did at the time: walk, write off cab expenses in their job's ledger as 'cleaning supplies' and get a ride from a Ukranian family entering the W'burg bridge so they could use the HOV lane. Solutions like this will get people past the first few days of this and after that we'll all just ride the modified Big Dogs that Google will give away as Epic Mounts. Oh and drones, maybe there will be riding drones. Who even needs public transit, geez.
posted by griphus at 6:16 AM on August 16, 2016 [18 favorites]
A recent Slate article about the shutdown gave a stat I'd been wondering about: We'd need a full double-length bus entering Manhattan every 12 seconds to approximate the subway's carrying power.
Since the L train was automated in the early 2000's, it moves a LOT of riders during rush hour.
posted by Drab_Parts at 6:16 AM on August 16, 2016 [5 favorites]
Since the L train was automated in the early 2000's, it moves a LOT of riders during rush hour.
posted by Drab_Parts at 6:16 AM on August 16, 2016 [5 favorites]
Not everyone who lives on the L train is wealthy or able-bodied. Some of us are neither, and are barely hanging on. I'm trying to make changes to accommodate this, but it's really, really going to suck and I'm trying hard not to panic. Please try to keep in mind that not everyone has the resources to bear this burden casually before you bring the snark.
posted by rafaella gabriela sarsaparilla at 6:27 AM on August 16, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by rafaella gabriela sarsaparilla at 6:27 AM on August 16, 2016 [7 favorites]
I will literally shit a brick the day conversation on MetaFilter about the L train even casually mentions the neighborhood of Canarsie and that human beings actually live there.
posted by griphus at 6:35 AM on August 16, 2016 [13 favorites]
posted by griphus at 6:35 AM on August 16, 2016 [13 favorites]
rafaella gabriela sarsaparilla, is the Access A Ride an option for you?
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:02 AM on August 16, 2016
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:02 AM on August 16, 2016
Oh my god the J is going to be a total mess.
Also, count me in as another person who is extremely ashamed to have ever made a crack about the G train now that I live in San Francisco. G train, you can come to SF any day of the week. You can even do that weird thing where you make everyone transfer to a new train halfway to their destination. I won't judge!
posted by en forme de poire at 7:16 AM on August 16, 2016 [3 favorites]
Also, count me in as another person who is extremely ashamed to have ever made a crack about the G train now that I live in San Francisco. G train, you can come to SF any day of the week. You can even do that weird thing where you make everyone transfer to a new train halfway to their destination. I won't judge!
posted by en forme de poire at 7:16 AM on August 16, 2016 [3 favorites]
I will literally shit a brick the day conversation on MetaFilter about the L train even casually mentions the neighborhood of Canarsie and that human beings actually live there.
I'm holding out hope that the extra "M" (or brand 'em "K" again if you want) trains being extended to Broadway Junction will make use of the flyover and continue on to Canarsie. Out of everybody, Carnasie folks could have the least disruptive changes to their commute if the MTA does it right.
::Looks at service changes, notes that Canarsie hasn't had direct service to Manhattan on a weeknight or weekend in three weeks::
I mean, they won't, but they could.
posted by thecaddy at 7:34 AM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
I'm holding out hope that the extra "M" (or brand 'em "K" again if you want) trains being extended to Broadway Junction will make use of the flyover and continue on to Canarsie. Out of everybody, Carnasie folks could have the least disruptive changes to their commute if the MTA does it right.
::Looks at service changes, notes that Canarsie hasn't had direct service to Manhattan on a weeknight or weekend in three weeks::
I mean, they won't, but they could.
posted by thecaddy at 7:34 AM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
I didn't realize they were messing with the M also. And the J is going to be an absolute mess. It currently services 200,000 people daily and I can't see it taking the majority of L passengers without crowding that will make the 6 during rush hour look spacious.
Those living down in Canarsie will still be able to take the L to Broadway Junction and catch the A or the J. It will increase commute times (which sucks), but it's not like they're losing access, just and extra 30-45 minutes. And honestly, the people living in Williamsburg could always take the L further into Brooklyn and change there anyway. That's an even larger increase in commute time, but my sympathy for them is limited.
posted by Hactar at 8:22 AM on August 16, 2016
Those living down in Canarsie will still be able to take the L to Broadway Junction and catch the A or the J. It will increase commute times (which sucks), but it's not like they're losing access, just and extra 30-45 minutes. And honestly, the people living in Williamsburg could always take the L further into Brooklyn and change there anyway. That's an even larger increase in commute time, but my sympathy for them is limited.
posted by Hactar at 8:22 AM on August 16, 2016
The MTA exhibiting lazy monopolist thinking.
Yes, I'm sure real disruptors could figure out how to completely repair an underwater tunnel extensively damaged by one of the worst storms to ever hit the city...without closing it.
Oh, sorry, the actual private industry solution would be to do f-all about it--because long-term repairs cost short-term money--until the tunnel actually blew a leak and drowned people. Then they'd deny all responsibility and want the government to fix it. And demand tort reform because it's so unfair that the drowned people's families can sue them.
posted by praemunire at 8:38 AM on August 16, 2016 [16 favorites]
Yes, I'm sure real disruptors could figure out how to completely repair an underwater tunnel extensively damaged by one of the worst storms to ever hit the city...without closing it.
Oh, sorry, the actual private industry solution would be to do f-all about it--because long-term repairs cost short-term money--until the tunnel actually blew a leak and drowned people. Then they'd deny all responsibility and want the government to fix it. And demand tort reform because it's so unfair that the drowned people's families can sue them.
posted by praemunire at 8:38 AM on August 16, 2016 [16 favorites]
Those living down in Canarsie will still be able to take the L to Broadway Junction and catch the A or the J. It will increase commute times (which sucks), but it's not like they're losing access, just and extra 30-45 minutes.
At least according to my consultations of Google Maps over the years, depending on where you're going, it may be faster to change to the A at B'way Junction than to take the L all the way into Manhattan and transfer there, and from East New York that doesn't require a backtrack. The number of people regularly traveling direct from Canarsie (very poor residential) to the East or West Village (moderately to very wealthy residential) is probably pretty low, especially with St. Vincent's closed and Beth Israel semi-closing.
posted by praemunire at 8:46 AM on August 16, 2016
At least according to my consultations of Google Maps over the years, depending on where you're going, it may be faster to change to the A at B'way Junction than to take the L all the way into Manhattan and transfer there, and from East New York that doesn't require a backtrack. The number of people regularly traveling direct from Canarsie (very poor residential) to the East or West Village (moderately to very wealthy residential) is probably pretty low, especially with St. Vincent's closed and Beth Israel semi-closing.
posted by praemunire at 8:46 AM on August 16, 2016
uncleozzy: I made the mistake of trying to take the G on a Saturday last month (lolsuburbanyokel). It did not end well.
The LIRR has stopped running on the Ronkonkoma line after your station on some weekends, necessitating a ride to Mineola to take a mainline train. Beats waiting on Port Jeff, I suppose.
posted by dr_dank at 8:55 AM on August 16, 2016
The LIRR has stopped running on the Ronkonkoma line after your station on some weekends, necessitating a ride to Mineola to take a mainline train. Beats waiting on Port Jeff, I suppose.
posted by dr_dank at 8:55 AM on August 16, 2016
One of the great thrills of my life was learning to pronounce Ronkonkoma. It's so fun to say, it should be used for exclamations of joy, or maybe even the dirtiest of curse words.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:17 AM on August 16, 2016
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 9:17 AM on August 16, 2016
Those living down in Canarsie will still be able to take the L to Broadway Junction and catch the A or the J. It will increase commute times (which sucks), but it's not like they're losing access, just and extra 30-45 minutes.
Because adding almost an extra hour onto your daily commute, which is probably an hour long as it is, should be NO SWEAT for you to handle. Even if you have kids that you need to go pick up from day care or something, they'll probably just stick some Play-doh in your kids' hands and let 'em sit, they won't charge you for that extra hour, it'll be fiiiiiine....
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:24 AM on August 16, 2016
Because adding almost an extra hour onto your daily commute, which is probably an hour long as it is, should be NO SWEAT for you to handle. Even if you have kids that you need to go pick up from day care or something, they'll probably just stick some Play-doh in your kids' hands and let 'em sit, they won't charge you for that extra hour, it'll be fiiiiiine....
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:24 AM on August 16, 2016
So I live on the L, and while this isn't ideal, obviously, I am not sure what people want the MTA to do (other than dig redundant tunnels and while I think that would be aces, consider the tale of the Second Avenue subway*). They are fixing the M & the G, and will run more A, G, J, M, and C trains, probably Fs, too. If you've lived on the L long enough you survived the transit strike and the shuttle-bus-every-weekend robo-train extravaganza. It's 18 months. We can be strong. North Brooklyn survives. And the weak ones move to South Slope. It's win-win.
posted by dame at 9:34 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dame at 9:34 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
* I was watching one of those HGTV house hunting shows recently and there was totally a slimy broker promising an out of towner that the Second Ave. subway would be up and running soon, so he should totally buy this place way out on First in the 60s or 80s or something. It was an amazing lie.
posted by dame at 9:36 AM on August 16, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by dame at 9:36 AM on August 16, 2016 [3 favorites]
One of the great thrills of my life was learning to pronounce Ronkonkoma
One of toddlerozzy's newfound joys is watching the trains go by. We were sitting next to the station over the weekend, waiting to see one, and she started singing, "One train goes to the city, one train goes to Ronkonkoma" over and over again. I kvelled.
posted by uncleozzy at 9:39 AM on August 16, 2016 [3 favorites]
One of toddlerozzy's newfound joys is watching the trains go by. We were sitting next to the station over the weekend, waiting to see one, and she started singing, "One train goes to the city, one train goes to Ronkonkoma" over and over again. I kvelled.
posted by uncleozzy at 9:39 AM on August 16, 2016 [3 favorites]
Eh, the Second Ave subway is targeted to open later this year, and even though it's more likely to be 2017, that's pretty close from a 30-year mortgage perspective (that said, the new train has been priced in for at least half a decade now). I'd be surprised if that was even the third-biggest lie the agent told.
As for the M shutdown, it's going to start next summer (not that a 20 minute walk to the L is any more pleasant in August than it is in February) and last for roughly a year (scheduled through April 2018, though we'll see). After the first two months, there's going to be shuttle service running between Metropolitan Av and Myrtle/Wyckoff, so folks who hop on the train from Glendale won't have to walk all the way to the L or wait (and wait and wait) for the Q55 down Myrtle.
posted by thecaddy at 9:47 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
As for the M shutdown, it's going to start next summer (not that a 20 minute walk to the L is any more pleasant in August than it is in February) and last for roughly a year (scheduled through April 2018, though we'll see). After the first two months, there's going to be shuttle service running between Metropolitan Av and Myrtle/Wyckoff, so folks who hop on the train from Glendale won't have to walk all the way to the L or wait (and wait and wait) for the Q55 down Myrtle.
posted by thecaddy at 9:47 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's still not going anywhere useful. It is opening like 4 stations. Woo.
posted by dame at 9:50 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by dame at 9:50 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
"One of the great thrills of my life was learning to pronounce Ronkonkoma. It's so fun to say, it should be used for exclamations of joy, or maybe even the dirtiest of curse words."
Ronkonkoma-koma-koma-koma chameleon
posted by I-baLL at 10:17 AM on August 16, 2016
Ronkonkoma-koma-koma-koma chameleon
posted by I-baLL at 10:17 AM on August 16, 2016
the Second Ave subway is targeted to open later this year, and even though it's more likely to be 2017
lol lol lol lol lol
posted by poffin boffin at 11:34 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
lol lol lol lol lol
posted by poffin boffin at 11:34 AM on August 16, 2016 [1 favorite]
look I want to believe okay?
posted by thecaddy at 11:45 AM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by thecaddy at 11:45 AM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
Phase 1 of the Second Avenue Subway will definitely open, but I doubt they make the projected December 2016 date. The MTA is approving change orders for elevator cab design for chrissakes!
Will we ever see a full-length SAS? Maybe after your children are dead.
posted by Automocar at 12:00 PM on August 16, 2016
Will we ever see a full-length SAS? Maybe after your children are dead.
posted by Automocar at 12:00 PM on August 16, 2016
If you have enough children you could make an army of children to dig it and then maybe it would happen before other people's children die. Yours winding up embedded in the tunnel walls and all.
posted by dame at 12:28 PM on August 16, 2016
posted by dame at 12:28 PM on August 16, 2016
Just popping in to also proclaim my undying love for the G train.
posted by greta simone at 3:21 PM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by greta simone at 3:21 PM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
t I have no idea who goes to Manhattan from Williamsburg that doesn't work at Google.
...my boss and one of my coworkers do. And we ain't at Google.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:16 PM on August 16, 2016
...my boss and one of my coworkers do. And we ain't at Google.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:16 PM on August 16, 2016
The problem with the ferries is that once you get to the waterfront on Manhattan, you are nowhere near a train. (Nor are you on the Brooklyn side, but presumably the riders would be people who live down near the waterfront.) I think even if you debarked under the bridge, the walk to Delancey would be a good 15 minutes. Its a vestige of the rough, working waterfronts, but it is a real problem. I think the idea of a gondola like Roosevelt Islands is a little better because you can go inland more. Or trolleys.
posted by dame at 5:33 PM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by dame at 5:33 PM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
What they should really do is close the goddamn Williamsburg Bridge and goddamn Delancey and goddamn Allen and goddamn 1st and goddamn 14th from 1st to 8th to cars and run buses every 2 minutes in both directions. But this is New York, where it's vastly more important to make sure that 12,000 cars can clog our streets as opposed to making sure that 250,000 people can get to work and school and play.
posted by Automocar at 7:19 PM on August 16, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Automocar at 7:19 PM on August 16, 2016 [5 favorites]
"What they should really do is close the goddamn Williamsburg Bridge and goddamn Delancey and goddamn Allen and goddamn 1st and goddamn 14th from 1st to 8th to cars and run buses every 2 minutes in both directions. But this is New York, where it's vastly more important to make sure that 12,000 cars can clog our streets as opposed to making sure that 250,000 people can get to work and school and play."
It's one of the things being considered.
posted by I-baLL at 8:32 PM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
It's one of the things being considered.
posted by I-baLL at 8:32 PM on August 16, 2016 [2 favorites]
^ Okay the fact that this proposal was even suggested makes me super jealous. In my neighborhood, giving an actual rail line its own (painted, not even grade separated) lane is apparently politically untenable, never mind a bus.
posted by en forme de poire at 8:41 PM on August 16, 2016
posted by en forme de poire at 8:41 PM on August 16, 2016
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As far as everyone in Williamsburg is concerned there's gonna be a whole lot of "We're just technically homeless."
I realize I'm turning into one of them but while still can I will say to the affluent whites of the west Brooklyn L you made this bed, now you must do that one thing people must do.
Except honestly I think they'll be fine because money really does fix most problems.
Sigh. So many lessons to be left unlearned.
posted by an animate objects at 6:53 PM on August 15, 2016 [3 favorites]