Underground psychedelic therapy
December 14, 2018 9:18 AM Subscribe
Welcome to the trip of your life: the rise of underground LSD guides. "Some Americans searching for alternative paths to healing have turned to psychedelics. But how does one forge a career as a guide when the substances are illegal?"
Steve has cops in his family, so he doesn’t tell many people about his work as an underground psychedelic guide. The work takes up a significant amount of his time – around once a week, he’ll meet a client in their home or in a rented home, dose them with MDMA or hallucinogenic psilocybin mushrooms, and sit with them while they trip for up to 10 hours – but he doesn’t tell his siblings, parents or roommates about it, nor his fellow psychology PhD students.Going Underground: The resurgence in clinical trials into the effectiveness of LSD, MDMA, and psilocybin in treating depression and trauma has received widespread publicity. But outside the labs, regular people are taking psychedelic therapy into their own hands.
They would probably never guess, either: Steve doesn’t display any signs of involvement with a stigmatized counterculture that many Americans still associate with its flamboyant 1960s figureheads. He’s a bespectacled, soft-spoken former business school student who plays in a brass band and works part-time as an over-the-phone mental health counselor. After one glass of wine, he says: “Whoa, I’m feeling a little drunk.”
But if you probe, he might tell you about the time he took psilocybin and a “snake god” entered his body and left him convulsing on the floor for an hour. (The snake god was benevolent, he says, and the convulsing was cathartic, “a tremendous discharge of anxious energy”.)
In early October, Steve attended a Manhattan conference called Horizons: Perspectives on Psychedelics, which bills itself as the world’s “largest and longest-running annual gathering of the psychedelic community”. I went with my 51-year-old cousin, Temple, a relatively mainstream psychotherapist. She had come to learn more about psychedelic-assisted psychotherapy, which underground guides like Steve facilitate illegally. She hopes to incorporate this type of therapy into her practice if and when substances such as psilocybin, MDMA, LSD and ayahuasca become legal.
Like many attendees, Temple had recently read How to Change Your Mind: What the New Science of Psychedelics Teaches Us About Consciousness, Dying, Addiction, Depression, and Transcendence, a bestselling 2018 book by Michael Pollan. [Previously] It convinced her that psychedelic-assisted psychotherapy “might really be the way of the future”.
The benefit of using a professional therapist is that they can safely guide the client toward a particular traumatic event, responding to whatever the client brings up. The therapist provides minimal intervention during the trip, because the hard work comes afterward. In the follow-up integration sessions—which are conducted without psychedelics—the client and therapist process what came up during the trip.The Psychedelic Resistance: We live our lives increasingly locked into screen time, distanced from nature and each other by modern capitalism and divisive politics. It’s no surprise that illegal use of psychedelics is on the rise.
But there are downsides for a patient seeking to use underground therapists. First, an individual needs to be well connected to even find one in the first place. Secondly, there’s the expense—picture a therapist’s hourly rate and apply that to an eight-hour session. It is also frowned upon by institutions. When I contacted the British Psychological Society and the American Psychological Association for their stance on DIY psychedelic use, the former commented that “the use of psychedelic drugs in psychological therapy is illegal,” while a spokesperson for the latter told me they “do not have an official stance on this.”
Many people, then, choose to go it alone, or with a friend as a kind of trip-sitter. They might get their information on doses and substances (or just read first-person accounts) from forums like Reddit, Bluelight, and Erowid, or from books such as Julian Vayne’s Getting Higher, Michael Pollan’s How to Change Your Mind, and Stanislav Grof’s Realms of the Human Unconscious.
That’s exactly what Cameron, a consultant in London, does when he suffers burnout or has some kind of emotional problem that won’t shift. The 30-year-old had read about clinical trials in the media; now he looks up doses on forums and sets an intention. Sometimes he goes solo, sometimes he drops a dose with a friend. He’s used LSD and mushrooms, but for a breakup that had been bothering him for 18 months, he took MDMA. “I don’t usually come to any conclusion during the trip, but it tends to crystallize afterwards,” he told me. “In this instance, I was able to understand why my ex-girlfriend did what she did, and to empathize. Afterwards, I went from having no contact with her to us being quite close friends.”
“There is this deep, fundamental alienation that is driving people to seek different ways to reconnect to the natural world and give them a sense of community,” the American author J.P. Harpignies, an eco-activist with a long-standing interest in psychedelics, told me. He believes young people’s sense of disengagement today is “exacerbated by living so much of their lives online, constantly prodded with push alerts and interacting with the world via social media platforms engineered to extract as much of their attention as possible.” He argues, like Amber, that people are using psychedelics as a response to modern life. “Psychedelics are one of the vectors that a certain subgroup of people experiment with… to try to achieve more of a sense of wholeness.”The Burgeoning Psychedelics Movement Still Excludes Women and People of Color
We may not want to admit it, but the human race is becoming detached from reality. Our digital social environments are closing us off from the truth, from each other, and from the natural world in which we have struck camp. We are a species trapped by a series of brightly lit screens. So it can be no surprise that a new kind of claustrophobic anxiety, particularly among the young, is on the rise, or that people are stepping into altered states in order to feel real.
According to Reed, only two principal investigators across all of the 14 Phase III MDMA trial sites throughout North America and overseas are women of color. She also shared data on the racial demographics of participants from the 2016/2017 trials. White participants were over-represented at 76 percent, while comprising only about 60 percent of the US population (Asian participants were also over-represented). Black and Latinx participants were under-represented, each comprising only about 3 percent of the study population.Related thread: FDA grants breakthrough therapy designation to psilocybin
Reed offered several explanations for these disparities. “Of course there is a terrible history of folks in clinical research using black, brown and yellow bodies to experiment with,” she said. “There is a war on black, brown and poor people disguised as a War on Drugs that does not have people of color lining up at the door to be screened for this study. And in communities of color there is still stigma for seeking help for mental health ailments.”
Oriana Mayorga, director of community engagement for Psymposia.com and a psychedelic activist, shared her thoughts on harmful attitudes within the field. “What I’ve learned on my journey in the psychedelic community is that it’s very privileged,” she said. Not everyone has access to these medicines or will when they become legalized. I’m motivated to stay vigilant to make sure that the folks with power will ensure access for all. It’s critical we also prioritize social justice work, and create safe spaces for marginalized people, women, and survivors of sexual abuse and violence.”
Mayorga described a series she helped create for her platform called Psychedelic Sisters in Arms. “My peers and I wanted to help create an avenue where other women could share their personal stories of sexual violence in this community,” she said, “to demonstrate that we are in fact many. Many of the women I reached out to are friends or close acquaintances because this is a tight-knit community. This series is very personal to me and I’m committed to bringing justice for these survivors, even if it means simply providing a space for them to publish their personal stories.”*
What those self-styled underground psychedlic guides need is a site where they're listed so that people can find them...too bad TripAdvisor is already taken.
posted by Greg_Ace at 9:36 AM on December 14, 2018 [16 favorites]
posted by Greg_Ace at 9:36 AM on December 14, 2018 [16 favorites]
As is TripsAdvisor.com - darn...
posted by PhineasGage at 10:05 AM on December 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by PhineasGage at 10:05 AM on December 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
I can't see myself ever trusting a stranger with my first experience on a new psychedelic, no matter how well-reviewed. A trusted therapist, or a very close friend, yes. A stranger? I would be so, so uncomfortable. No. My whole body is screaming No right now just at the thought.
Different strokes I guess, but this is very much not for me.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 10:13 AM on December 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
Different strokes I guess, but this is very much not for me.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 10:13 AM on December 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
Leary's Book of the Dead, naturally.
A sitter you know and trust.
And the right set (mind)
And right setting (place)
posted by symbioid at 10:29 AM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
A sitter you know and trust.
And the right set (mind)
And right setting (place)
posted by symbioid at 10:29 AM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
Seriously though, we do need to shift to a shamanic culture imo.
posted by symbioid at 10:43 AM on December 14, 2018 [7 favorites]
posted by symbioid at 10:43 AM on December 14, 2018 [7 favorites]
I can't see myself ever trusting a stranger with my first experience on a new psychedelic, no matter how well-reviewed.
Same, but also absolutely not with a therapist. I think my ideal would be something like a very mundane clinic atmosphere, like an urgent care except for trips. But wow, under no imaginable circumstances would I be like "sure, letting a strange man into my home to give me drugs whose contents cannot be verified outside of laboratory conditions sounds like a fun time," bc I'm not completely insane.
posted by poffin boffin at 10:50 AM on December 14, 2018 [7 favorites]
Same, but also absolutely not with a therapist. I think my ideal would be something like a very mundane clinic atmosphere, like an urgent care except for trips. But wow, under no imaginable circumstances would I be like "sure, letting a strange man into my home to give me drugs whose contents cannot be verified outside of laboratory conditions sounds like a fun time," bc I'm not completely insane.
posted by poffin boffin at 10:50 AM on December 14, 2018 [7 favorites]
I highly recommend Michael Pollan's book on the topic. I was introduced to a guide by a trusted friend whose own experience had been fully positive. The guide and I met in advance to assess each other (the guide's experience and trustworthiness, my mental and physical health), and I felt safe and cared for the entire time.
posted by PhineasGage at 11:46 AM on December 14, 2018 [5 favorites]
posted by PhineasGage at 11:46 AM on December 14, 2018 [5 favorites]
For myself, having done a few retreats, I think I'd be more comfortable in the setting of a meditation retreat than in a clinical setting:
The New Wave of Psychedelics in Buddhist Practice: Matteo Pistono takes a close look at how some Buddhist teachers are not only turning toward psychedelics in their practice, but also making it a part of their teaching.
Psychedelics’ Buddhist Revival: For some Buddhists, experiences of selflessness induced by hallucinogens are tools for practice. But others see distraction and even danger.
posted by homunculus at 11:53 AM on December 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
The New Wave of Psychedelics in Buddhist Practice: Matteo Pistono takes a close look at how some Buddhist teachers are not only turning toward psychedelics in their practice, but also making it a part of their teaching.
Psychedelics’ Buddhist Revival: For some Buddhists, experiences of selflessness induced by hallucinogens are tools for practice. But others see distraction and even danger.
posted by homunculus at 11:53 AM on December 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
I highly recommend taking 200mg it at your campsite in Shambhala in Salmo in BC, about 7pm so it hits you just as you enter the village are over whelmed by people in costumes and light. Then gently freak out but get it confirmed repeatedly by your friends that you're walking fine then release that all time is connected and you're able to access all your memories at the same time in parallel and then you get the whole flatland thing then understand that you can control matter and can make things manifest just by thinking about. Safe in the knowledge you're able to control the universe around you, go and dance for a few hour before returning to sit on your chair outside your tent intentionally flashing between important moments in your life as you doze and re-examine them with a fresh perspective, only to eventually be hit with a flash of clarity as to how they we all connected and how you can resolve them. Forget what it was. Have a banana and go to bed. Try it again the next day and discover you're serotonin has been ground down and the same amount just makes you very giggly.
posted by Damienmce at 11:54 AM on December 14, 2018 [10 favorites]
posted by Damienmce at 11:54 AM on December 14, 2018 [10 favorites]
This is one of those "I feel like I came from the wrong side of the tracks" moments. My friends just gave me three hits and left me alone with a Butthole Surfers album and a christmas tree. That was a thing.
posted by lumpenprole at 12:05 PM on December 14, 2018 [16 favorites]
posted by lumpenprole at 12:05 PM on December 14, 2018 [16 favorites]
Which album?
posted by homunculus at 12:08 PM on December 14, 2018 [8 favorites]
posted by homunculus at 12:08 PM on December 14, 2018 [8 favorites]
i can't actually remember the type, location, circumstances, or age of my first hallucinogen which i suppose is good advertising for whatever it was
posted by poffin boffin at 12:10 PM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by poffin boffin at 12:10 PM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
I think I'd be more comfortable in the setting of a meditation retreat than in a clinical setting:
I highly recommend taking 200mg it at your campsite in Shambhala in Salmo in BC, about 7pm so it hits you just as you enter the village are over whelmed by people in costumes and light.
alternately, you can just pile into a multi-colored bus with a bunch of weirdos and go angling off into the great wide whatever, or maybe grab a lightweight sound system and go get (sort of) lost in the nearest wild and beautiful place while listening to an eclectic mix of movie soundtrack music.
My point being that, in my direct psychedelic experience (and related research), I've found that there are very many ways to do it right psychedelically speaking, and perhaps just as many to do it wrong, with what's very wrong for some being very right for others. One key historical point that gets handled well in Tom Wolfe's Electric Koolaid Acid Test is that from the very beginning, there was a major divergence of opinion as to how "to do it right". Tim Leary and his crowd were angling for official religion status and setting up in a genteel mansion in the country, lots of calm and meditation. Ken Kesey and his crowd were the aforementioned maniacs on the bus, surfing the chaos. They certainly had the most fun, I think, which for me is an important consideration. The psychedelic experience can be immensely fun, hilarious, erupting with joy and dance, so it concerns me a bit when I see it being approached too seriously, too clinically.
The Long, Hard Road to a Science of Bad Drug Trips: If we’re going to use psychedelics for therapy, we’re going to have to figure out the proverbial bad trip.
I've already gone deep on this topic hereabouts ...
Doing psychedelics is like sightseeing in a beautiful place where you've heard rumors that there may be an unimaginably deep chasm somewhere nearby, but you're not sure because many of your companions insist it's just a rumor.
So at first, it's all pretty safe. You just don't go too close to where you think that edge might be. But over time, you get more brash. You keep looking for that edge, because the view is better there, of course. But it's a weird edge, enshrouded in mist. It takes very skilled, experienced footwork to actually find it.
Most of us don't really try to find. We just find a spot where the view is good enough. But some us don't. And, assuming youth, recklessness, lack of respect for the "reality" of the situation, that means we eventually go too far, we fall off, often without realizing ... because first we get caught in an updraft. We're flying, we think ... but then we fall.
And it can be a very long, incomprehensibly deep fall.
posted by philip-random at 12:23 PM on December 14, 2018 [6 favorites]
I highly recommend taking 200mg it at your campsite in Shambhala in Salmo in BC, about 7pm so it hits you just as you enter the village are over whelmed by people in costumes and light.
alternately, you can just pile into a multi-colored bus with a bunch of weirdos and go angling off into the great wide whatever, or maybe grab a lightweight sound system and go get (sort of) lost in the nearest wild and beautiful place while listening to an eclectic mix of movie soundtrack music.
My point being that, in my direct psychedelic experience (and related research), I've found that there are very many ways to do it right psychedelically speaking, and perhaps just as many to do it wrong, with what's very wrong for some being very right for others. One key historical point that gets handled well in Tom Wolfe's Electric Koolaid Acid Test is that from the very beginning, there was a major divergence of opinion as to how "to do it right". Tim Leary and his crowd were angling for official religion status and setting up in a genteel mansion in the country, lots of calm and meditation. Ken Kesey and his crowd were the aforementioned maniacs on the bus, surfing the chaos. They certainly had the most fun, I think, which for me is an important consideration. The psychedelic experience can be immensely fun, hilarious, erupting with joy and dance, so it concerns me a bit when I see it being approached too seriously, too clinically.
The Long, Hard Road to a Science of Bad Drug Trips: If we’re going to use psychedelics for therapy, we’re going to have to figure out the proverbial bad trip.
I've already gone deep on this topic hereabouts ...
Doing psychedelics is like sightseeing in a beautiful place where you've heard rumors that there may be an unimaginably deep chasm somewhere nearby, but you're not sure because many of your companions insist it's just a rumor.
So at first, it's all pretty safe. You just don't go too close to where you think that edge might be. But over time, you get more brash. You keep looking for that edge, because the view is better there, of course. But it's a weird edge, enshrouded in mist. It takes very skilled, experienced footwork to actually find it.
Most of us don't really try to find. We just find a spot where the view is good enough. But some us don't. And, assuming youth, recklessness, lack of respect for the "reality" of the situation, that means we eventually go too far, we fall off, often without realizing ... because first we get caught in an updraft. We're flying, we think ... but then we fall.
And it can be a very long, incomprehensibly deep fall.
posted by philip-random at 12:23 PM on December 14, 2018 [6 favorites]
Another option: find some nice natural hot springs (nsfw) and take it sometime after midday. Spend the rest of the day floating in the still part of the river naked on an inflatable raft (don't forget sunblock,) blissing at the touch of the water and sight of the rocks and sky. After dark, get in the hot pools and soak while watching the rocks shimmer and dance to the sound of the water. And when the full moon comes out... ahhh.
Maybe the best of both worlds is to take the guide to some hot springs for the session. I'd find it easier to open up when everyone involved is naked, wet and warm in a beautiful setting (assuming you luck out and no assholes show up.)
posted by homunculus at 12:33 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
Maybe the best of both worlds is to take the guide to some hot springs for the session. I'd find it easier to open up when everyone involved is naked, wet and warm in a beautiful setting (assuming you luck out and no assholes show up.)
posted by homunculus at 12:33 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
oh god i can't think of anything more horrifying that being trapped in the wilderness tripping with a bunch of tripping naked ppl, i'd rather be out in the sonoran being forced to dig my own grave by a bunch of narcos.
posted by poffin boffin at 12:55 PM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by poffin boffin at 12:55 PM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
i'd rather be out in the sonoran being forced to dig my own grave by a bunch of narcos.
That sounds like a terrible time to do drugs.
posted by Greg_Ace at 1:05 PM on December 14, 2018 [10 favorites]
That sounds like a terrible time to do drugs.
posted by Greg_Ace at 1:05 PM on December 14, 2018 [10 favorites]
The nice thing about hot springs is that people tend to be at their calmest and quietest there. That time it was me and one trip-friend, and the only other people at first were a couple of naked German guys, one of whom looked exactly like Ludwig Wittgenstein. They were almost completely quiet the whole time except for when Ludwig climbed onto some rocks and started crowing like a rooster. I'm pretty sure that really happened. Later a couple of drunk rednecks showed up, but fortunately they kept to themselves, except one of them would occasionally scream "rabbit! rabbit!" at the top of his lungs for no apparent reason (maybe he was making a statement to Wittgenstein.) Ultimately they all contributed to the ambiance.
posted by homunculus at 1:48 PM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by homunculus at 1:48 PM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
This man, full of tumors, grows psychedelic mushrooms for his pain. Legalization activists want you to meet him. He isn't so sure.
posted by homunculus at 2:10 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 2:10 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
Can ketamine therapy help depression? I experienced it to find out. I was a rocket blasting through dark tunnels of abstraction
posted by homunculus at 2:13 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 2:13 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
Which album?
Locust Abortion Technician. I still can't hear "Kuntz" without feeling a bit like I'm tripping.
posted by lumpenprole at 2:17 PM on December 14, 2018 [6 favorites]
Locust Abortion Technician. I still can't hear "Kuntz" without feeling a bit like I'm tripping.
posted by lumpenprole at 2:17 PM on December 14, 2018 [6 favorites]
Cherub from Psychic... Powerless... Another Man's Sac is the same for me.
posted by homunculus at 2:25 PM on December 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by homunculus at 2:25 PM on December 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
First time I tripped I saw Minut Bol playing basketball and whigged the fuck out for a while but it was all ok in the end. Outdoors is best (setting).
posted by parki at 2:31 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by parki at 2:31 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
Not to continue the derail, but the source material for Kuntz was found awhile back and it's a good song!
Beyond that I'll just say I remember my first psychedelic onset containing an episode of Welcome Back, Kotter. "Are you seeing this?" I asked my friend.
I've been thinking of mushrooms lately. I'd like to get the therapeutic effects and as I've grown older it's the source I think I prefer.
posted by rhizome at 2:31 PM on December 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
Beyond that I'll just say I remember my first psychedelic onset containing an episode of Welcome Back, Kotter. "Are you seeing this?" I asked my friend.
I've been thinking of mushrooms lately. I'd like to get the therapeutic effects and as I've grown older it's the source I think I prefer.
posted by rhizome at 2:31 PM on December 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
I've been curious for a while, but given that I'm weirdly sensitive to medication and get the oddest side effects off them, and that I'm already on 3 different meds as it is, I feel like it could end up being a disaster.
My grad school in the US was really into investigating the therapeutic potential of psychedelics - I did try to look into getting a session but couldn't figure out how. Now I'm in a different country and while I do have friends with connections I again have no idea whether it would be really good or really bad.
posted by divabat at 2:54 PM on December 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
My grad school in the US was really into investigating the therapeutic potential of psychedelics - I did try to look into getting a session but couldn't figure out how. Now I'm in a different country and while I do have friends with connections I again have no idea whether it would be really good or really bad.
posted by divabat at 2:54 PM on December 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
rhizome, I do mushrooms about once/twice a year if I can swing it. Once you figure out what works for you to combat the nausea (dramamine for me, but grapefruit works for some), it's a pretty great and manageable experience.
I find it works as a sort of reset for a lot of stuff I didn't know I was carrying around. But who knows, it's not like I'm doing it in conjunction with a therapist.
posted by lumpenprole at 3:11 PM on December 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
I find it works as a sort of reset for a lot of stuff I didn't know I was carrying around. But who knows, it's not like I'm doing it in conjunction with a therapist.
posted by lumpenprole at 3:11 PM on December 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
given that I'm weirdly sensitive to medication and get the oddest side effects off them, and that I'm already on 3 different meds as it is, I feel like it could end up being a disaster.
I think your caution is wise. At the very least you'd want to find out how your meds could interact with whatever you were considering taking before doing so.
posted by homunculus at 3:50 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
I think your caution is wise. At the very least you'd want to find out how your meds could interact with whatever you were considering taking before doing so.
posted by homunculus at 3:50 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
Yes, definitely research known interactions with your current meds; erowid will have everything.
IME tripping for therapy is different than tripping for fun. I prefer therapeutic tripping on my own, but that only became possible after doing a lot of meditation and developing associated skills. I think by far the most important thing, for anyone considering therapeutic tripping, is that you do it in a place where you feel safe. Or safest.
For a lot of people who need this therapy the most that’s gonna mean a quiet dark comfy room somewhere with maybe some music on and your eyes closed and blankets available, and that’s totally fine.
posted by schadenfrau at 3:55 PM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
IME tripping for therapy is different than tripping for fun. I prefer therapeutic tripping on my own, but that only became possible after doing a lot of meditation and developing associated skills. I think by far the most important thing, for anyone considering therapeutic tripping, is that you do it in a place where you feel safe. Or safest.
For a lot of people who need this therapy the most that’s gonna mean a quiet dark comfy room somewhere with maybe some music on and your eyes closed and blankets available, and that’s totally fine.
posted by schadenfrau at 3:55 PM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
Because of my complicated history, I'd far rather be able to do it in a doctor's office with medical staff standing by and substances precisely measured.
Since that's not currently available, these folks sound like they're trying to provide the next best thing. If I had the money and knew where to go, I think I'd probably try the guided therapy in it's present form in the hope that data gathered on my treatment could inform future research policy.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 7:34 PM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
Since that's not currently available, these folks sound like they're trying to provide the next best thing. If I had the money and knew where to go, I think I'd probably try the guided therapy in it's present form in the hope that data gathered on my treatment could inform future research policy.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 7:34 PM on December 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
given that I'm weirdly sensitive to medication and get the oddest side effects off them, and that I'm already on 3 different meds as it is, I feel like it could end up being a disaster.
Also, I think your sensitivity and tendency to have side effects in general merits taking a conservative approach with empathogens and/or hallucinogens.
My father often had unusual reactions to meds, and he never tried psychedelics because he'd been advised against it by a friend who did some early research on psychedelics at UCLA back in the late 60's. His friend felt that my dad was a potential candidate for a bad trip, partly because of his reactions to meds, partly because of his temperament, and partly because my dad was adept at self-hypnosis and could slow his heartbeat at will (to the surprise of doctors with EKGs.) Trifecta.
Maybe he would have been okay, but some people just react badly to some psychedelics, and we don't really know why. If I was like my dad I'd have still tried some of them, but I would have been more conservative. Instead of starting with acid, I'd have tried either MDMA or psilocybin first, but just a half dose. If that went well then I'd have tried a full dose another time, and if that went well then I'd have tried the other with the same approach. Only if I was able to do them both would I have then tried acid.
posted by homunculus at 7:45 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
Also, I think your sensitivity and tendency to have side effects in general merits taking a conservative approach with empathogens and/or hallucinogens.
My father often had unusual reactions to meds, and he never tried psychedelics because he'd been advised against it by a friend who did some early research on psychedelics at UCLA back in the late 60's. His friend felt that my dad was a potential candidate for a bad trip, partly because of his reactions to meds, partly because of his temperament, and partly because my dad was adept at self-hypnosis and could slow his heartbeat at will (to the surprise of doctors with EKGs.) Trifecta.
Maybe he would have been okay, but some people just react badly to some psychedelics, and we don't really know why. If I was like my dad I'd have still tried some of them, but I would have been more conservative. Instead of starting with acid, I'd have tried either MDMA or psilocybin first, but just a half dose. If that went well then I'd have tried a full dose another time, and if that went well then I'd have tried the other with the same approach. Only if I was able to do them both would I have then tried acid.
posted by homunculus at 7:45 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
Ambassadors to Hidden Territories: Set and Setting in Psychedelic-Assisted Psychotherapy
posted by homunculus at 8:20 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 8:20 PM on December 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
a delicate subject. on one hand, bad trips unprepared for can be bad. on the other hand, trusting some dude to guide you while you're vulnerable is kind of the story of how literally every society, religion, and culture abused its own people since the beginning of civilization.
posted by wibari at 10:12 PM on December 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by wibari at 10:12 PM on December 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
> We were drinking tea in Amber’s dad’s garden shed, which is kitted out with a sound system and floor-to-ceiling vintage vinyl.
Sometimes I wish I were British.
posted by heatherlogan at 5:46 AM on December 15, 2018
Sometimes I wish I were British.
posted by heatherlogan at 5:46 AM on December 15, 2018
Capitalism on Psychedelics: The Mainstreaming of an Underground
posted by homunculus at 8:12 AM on December 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 8:12 AM on December 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
Capitalism on Psychedelics: The Mainstreaming of an Underground
yeah, I feel I don't even need to follow the link. I am not one of those who cries SMASH CAPITALISM and dreams of grand revolution any time soon (if ever) but man, does this smell of The Wrong Fucking Way To Go. Just as turning grade school education into a business is about the dumbest thing a culture could do, also for profit health care (America, I'm looking at you, you're not the fucking world in spite of that awful song, you're just a big experiment that by design is supposed to get certain things WRONG, else they wouldn't have called it an experiment, right? And about the wrongest thing you've done is crank out millions of fundamentalist free market true believers blah blah blah) ...
So what do we do with psychedelics if we're not going to just jam them underground forever. I honestly do not know? And it's not as if I haven't discussed such at length over the decades with many others whom I've crossed paths with out there on perimeter where there are sometimes no stars. Or maybe I do have a few ideas but I just know they're too weird ... for rational discussion. Because they must be weird. Because psychedelics are fundamentally weird. There's a reason why, in the early days the term Storming Heaven often came up among users. Because, for lack of better words (and we really do need better words) we're talking about God here, and god, and gods, and all things metaphysical (many things anyway). We're talking high, high weirdness the like of which ... well just look at what happened the last time it hit suburbia, we're still trying to figure all that out.
I'd say we need a new religion, but who needs a new religion? So maybe just a guild, like the Spacing Guild in Dune, and their mutated guild navigators who " ... use the spice drug melange to successfully navigate folded space and safely guide enormous heighliner starships from planet to planet instantaneously." Except if you know your Dune, you know that the Guild itself was corrupted by the power that instantaneous travel in folded space affords one.
But seriously, if we (humanity that is) do have a future, I'm pretty sure that negotiating a long term "understanding" with the psychedelic realm is a significant part of it, because we do need its high, strange, accelerated knowledge/wisdom if we're ever going to transcend our currently nightmarish primate tendencies.
finally goes and actually reads the linked article and finds it, of course, fascinating, including stuff like:
This is not a comfortable stance for those of us who believe that, as Nickles later put it, today’s dominant culture is not a reality to be accommodated, but an existential threat to be resisted. Along these lines, Geoff Bathje followed up Doblin’s presentation by repeating arguments against capitalism familiar to anyone who has been paying wide-screen attention to the political landscape in recent years. His strongest points concerned the way that psychedelic therapy, applied as “solutions” to individual psychological problems rather than broader social conditions, risks simply feeding into the self-improvement logic that increasingly underscores capitalist subjectivity, and that has already shown a remarkable capacity to absorb, defang, and redirect potentially transformative practices like yoga and mindfulness meditation. In this way, psychedelics may—and already are—contributing to the cancer that Bathje calls “elite perfectibility.”
The future must be not just weirder than we imagine, or even weirder than we can imagine imagining, but weirder than we can imagine imagine imagining. But we already knew that. Right?
posted by philip-random at 9:16 AM on December 15, 2018 [2 favorites]
yeah, I feel I don't even need to follow the link. I am not one of those who cries SMASH CAPITALISM and dreams of grand revolution any time soon (if ever) but man, does this smell of The Wrong Fucking Way To Go. Just as turning grade school education into a business is about the dumbest thing a culture could do, also for profit health care (America, I'm looking at you, you're not the fucking world in spite of that awful song, you're just a big experiment that by design is supposed to get certain things WRONG, else they wouldn't have called it an experiment, right? And about the wrongest thing you've done is crank out millions of fundamentalist free market true believers blah blah blah) ...
So what do we do with psychedelics if we're not going to just jam them underground forever. I honestly do not know? And it's not as if I haven't discussed such at length over the decades with many others whom I've crossed paths with out there on perimeter where there are sometimes no stars. Or maybe I do have a few ideas but I just know they're too weird ... for rational discussion. Because they must be weird. Because psychedelics are fundamentally weird. There's a reason why, in the early days the term Storming Heaven often came up among users. Because, for lack of better words (and we really do need better words) we're talking about God here, and god, and gods, and all things metaphysical (many things anyway). We're talking high, high weirdness the like of which ... well just look at what happened the last time it hit suburbia, we're still trying to figure all that out.
I'd say we need a new religion, but who needs a new religion? So maybe just a guild, like the Spacing Guild in Dune, and their mutated guild navigators who " ... use the spice drug melange to successfully navigate folded space and safely guide enormous heighliner starships from planet to planet instantaneously." Except if you know your Dune, you know that the Guild itself was corrupted by the power that instantaneous travel in folded space affords one.
But seriously, if we (humanity that is) do have a future, I'm pretty sure that negotiating a long term "understanding" with the psychedelic realm is a significant part of it, because we do need its high, strange, accelerated knowledge/wisdom if we're ever going to transcend our currently nightmarish primate tendencies.
finally goes and actually reads the linked article and finds it, of course, fascinating, including stuff like:
This is not a comfortable stance for those of us who believe that, as Nickles later put it, today’s dominant culture is not a reality to be accommodated, but an existential threat to be resisted. Along these lines, Geoff Bathje followed up Doblin’s presentation by repeating arguments against capitalism familiar to anyone who has been paying wide-screen attention to the political landscape in recent years. His strongest points concerned the way that psychedelic therapy, applied as “solutions” to individual psychological problems rather than broader social conditions, risks simply feeding into the self-improvement logic that increasingly underscores capitalist subjectivity, and that has already shown a remarkable capacity to absorb, defang, and redirect potentially transformative practices like yoga and mindfulness meditation. In this way, psychedelics may—and already are—contributing to the cancer that Bathje calls “elite perfectibility.”
The future must be not just weirder than we imagine, or even weirder than we can imagine imagining, but weirder than we can imagine imagine imagining. But we already knew that. Right?
posted by philip-random at 9:16 AM on December 15, 2018 [2 favorites]
Psychedelics, Technology, and the Future of Meditation
What is the future of consciousness hacking? Organic molecules, blinky machines, good old fashioned meditation, or some combination of them all?posted by homunculus at 3:09 PM on December 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
In this episode, recorded live in San Francisco on October 24th 2018, Michael Taft of Deconstructing Yourself, Vincent Horn of Buddhist Geeks, and host Mikey Siegel of Consciousness Hacking discuss the possibilities, the challenges, and the many ways forward in the transformation of human consciousness.
Here's more on the history and recent efforts to meld Buddhist meditation with psychedelic experiences, which of course hasn't been without controversy. One of the Buddhist teachers quoted, Spring Washam, has helped found a, um, retreat center in Peru devoted to combining the two.
posted by PhineasGage at 5:24 PM on December 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by PhineasGage at 5:24 PM on December 15, 2018 [1 favorite]
The Decline of American Peyote: The small, bulbous peyote cactus is central to the religious rituals of the Native American Church, but poaching and unsustainable harvesting practices put it at risk of extinction in the United States.
posted by homunculus at 10:03 PM on December 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by homunculus at 10:03 PM on December 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
How to Safely Access Psychiatric Support in Times of Psychedelic Crisis
posted by homunculus at 7:44 PM on December 17, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 7:44 PM on December 17, 2018 [1 favorite]
If not for the crowds, this could be a fun place to trip. "Have you ever really looked at your hand, man... Holy shit!"
posted by homunculus at 11:00 AM on December 19, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 11:00 AM on December 19, 2018 [1 favorite]
Since the meditation thread is closed and this thread has touched on the subject, I'll leave this here:
Mindfulness Meditation is Buddhist Meditation
Mindfulness Meditation is Buddhist Meditation
Some people classify Buddhism as a religion. I tend to think of it as a meditation system with 2,500 years of research and development across multiple cultures and eras. Programs like Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction have a lot of work to do before they get to that point.posted by homunculus at 8:59 AM on December 22, 2018 [1 favorite]
Michael Pollan: How Does a Writer Put a Drug Trip Into Words?
posted by homunculus at 10:11 AM on December 24, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 10:11 AM on December 24, 2018 [1 favorite]
Towards a Science of Psychedelic Aesthetics by Ido Hartogsohn
posted by homunculus at 7:21 PM on December 29, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 7:21 PM on December 29, 2018 [1 favorite]
The Steady Rise of the Trippy Festival: Music festivals have always been the bedrock of psychedelic drug taking. Now psychedelic-themed festivals have reached a new high, as more people search for meaning away from their nine-to-five lives
posted by homunculus at 7:26 PM on December 29, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 7:26 PM on December 29, 2018 [1 favorite]
Special Issue of Neuropharmacology: Psychedelics: New Doors, Altered Perceptions
posted by homunculus at 10:29 PM on January 1, 2019 [1 favorite]
posted by homunculus at 10:29 PM on January 1, 2019 [1 favorite]
A Journey of the Mind and Soul: Author Daniel Pinchbeck discusses dharma, karma and entheogenic enlightenment with Zig Zag Zen author Allan Badiner.
posted by homunculus at 1:18 PM on January 13, 2019
posted by homunculus at 1:18 PM on January 13, 2019
The extraordinary therapeutic potential of psychedelic drugs, explained: I spent months talking to psychedelic guides and researchers. Here’s what I learned.
posted by homunculus at 1:21 PM on January 13, 2019
posted by homunculus at 1:21 PM on January 13, 2019
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posted by homunculus at 9:24 AM on December 14, 2018 [2 favorites]