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June 24, 2019 2:33 PM Subscribe
The making of Samurai Shodown [Polygon] “Known as Samurai Spirits in its native Japan, as it always has been, SNK’s latest is the first mainline Shodown game in more than a decade. Part prequel, part reboot, it’s an attempt to revitalize a series born nearly 26 years ago in the smoky arcades of the early ’90s. Fighting games have a sentimental relationship to the past; any significant degree of change, however innovative, is met with a certain mistrust. They work well in two dimensions, for the most part, and have since the heydey of two-player cabinets like Street Fighter 2 and Mortal Kombat. So maybe it’s not too surprising to see the new Shodown hewing to the traditions of its predecessors: 2D combat, manga-inspired art, a special emphasis on melee weapons, the 18th-century Japanese setting.” [YouTube][PAX East Panel][Gameplay Trailer]
• Samurai Shodown: A slice of nostalgia done right [Game Revolution]
• Samurai Shodown: A slice of nostalgia done right [Game Revolution]
“It makes sense to be skeptical whenever a company decides to bring back a dormant franchise. For every game that keeps the spirit of the original intact, there’s a Leisure Suit Larry: Wet Dreams Don’t Dry or the Commander Keen mobile game that are either pale imitations or disgraces to the name. Thankfully for fighting game fans, SNK’s new entry in the SAMURAI SHODOWN series is a triumph all-around as it offers up the dramatic gameplay of the original titles with a fresh coat of paint. It also manages to fill a niche since there simply isn’t another modern fighter quite like it. While many fighting games are built around combo attacks and rushing forward, that isn’t the case with Samurai Shodown. SNK has instead created a title that doesn’t rely on fatal, punishing combos. Since we’re dealing with swords rather than fists, nearly every attack is highly damaging if it lands cleanly.”• Samurai Shodown Is Slow And Deliberate In The Best Way Possible [Kotaku]
“ Although it’s unnumbered, this release represents the seventh mainline installment of the storied fighting franchise, bringing its unique brand of methodical swordplay to a generation already overrun with sequels, reboots, and resurrections. [...] Unlike its contemporaries, which focus on combos and mixups, this series is almost exclusively about spacing and predicting your opponent’s next move. The slow movement speed of the characters and the huge damage they can inflict with just a few well-placed attacks make every round a tense, deliberate affair, and it’s these key differences that continue to set the series apart even as fighting games have grown and expanded. In this way, Samurai Shodown feels more grounded compared to the rest of the genre, akin to the classic films of Akira Kurosawa rather than over-the-top anime or martial arts pictures from which most fighting games draw inspiration.”• Samurai Shodown is another return to form for SNK [Destructoid]
“As for how it plays, Samurai Shodown's mechanics feel like a mixture of Samurai Shodown II and V. The main goal for SNK when creating this new entry was to keep the same design mentality of the past. Samurai Shodown has never been about learning combo strings and repeating them, but getting into mind games with your opponents before landing a few crucial strikes. [...] Samurai Shodown perfectly encapsulates the old saying of, "Easy to learn, hard to master." While I was able to perform hit confirms and land special attacks, I was told of scenarios where players can disarm their opponent, but then the opponent will be able to clasp the rival's weapon and disarm them as well. You can even throw down your own weapon and fight barehanded to really rub it in someone's face. There are a lot of things going on despite the lack of combo strings.”• Samurai Shodown: A Slash From the Past [IGN]
“Samurai Shodown finds itself on the fighting game spectrum somewhere in between Street Fighter and Divekick, meaning it’s not about combos, juggles, block strings, frame traps, or other high-level fighting game techniques. Instead, it strips all of that away, leaving a game that is laser focused on careful positioning, reading your opponent, and brutally punishing their mistakes. This level of simplicity definitely has its appeal, and Samurai Shodown strikes a good balance between approachability and deeper mechanics that helps separate those who just mash special and heavy attacks from those who take the time to learn. Nuances like the best times to deflect, when to spot dodge, when to trigger rage explosions, when to use Lightning Blade attacks, and when to close your eyes, cross your fingers, and use a Darli Dagger punch to pull a victory out of thin air are all part of the mix.”
Both the Gameplay and Trailer videos are trailers.
posted by grumpybear69 at 2:49 PM on June 24, 2019
posted by grumpybear69 at 2:49 PM on June 24, 2019
Hey it's Tam Tam, the character who has a moves list written in Nahuatl (cool!), is described as being from "Green Hell, South America" (huh? That's not where people speak Nahuatl), and was turned into a chimpanzee named Paku Paku as divine punishment (!?!?!?!).
posted by thecjm at 3:42 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
posted by thecjm at 3:42 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
I’ve been playing the Japanese PSN demos for this and I’m super pumped that they made the game feel… correct, for lack of a better way to put it. It doesn’t play like other fighting games, in the proper way.
It’s been kind of funny seeing the Internet kind of fall over itself to go OH HEY YUP THAT IS DEFINITELY A GAME I REMEMBER… “““FONDLY””” despite the fact that practically no one in the English-speaking world played it, heh. Later this week, the Internet will be full of anime fighting game players who are upset that the game doesn’t have combos, and that they can’t do blockstring pressure without getting blown up immediately for it. On the other hand, your strongest punish is generally “just do hard slash,” which is likewise a huge change of pace from the norm.
I’m super glad to see another fighting game that isn’t built around trip-over-your-own-dick Giant Animu Comboz™ for a change — the only other contemporary game that goes in that direction is Fantasy Strike (on Steam and on consoles Soon™ and I constantly recommend it, especially since it’s also designed very deliberately to make beginners no longer be beginners as fast as possible) , and I guess Street Fighter, if you ignore a bunch of other stuff about Street Fighter.
Anyway, I’m super pumped about Samurai Shodown and can’t wait to spend all weekend playing it. I’d offer to share PSN names but word is that the netcode is delay-based, so the connection would be most heinous against anyone who isn’t also in Japan. : \
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:07 PM on June 24, 2019 [8 favorites]
It’s been kind of funny seeing the Internet kind of fall over itself to go OH HEY YUP THAT IS DEFINITELY A GAME I REMEMBER… “““FONDLY””” despite the fact that practically no one in the English-speaking world played it, heh. Later this week, the Internet will be full of anime fighting game players who are upset that the game doesn’t have combos, and that they can’t do blockstring pressure without getting blown up immediately for it. On the other hand, your strongest punish is generally “just do hard slash,” which is likewise a huge change of pace from the norm.
I’m super glad to see another fighting game that isn’t built around trip-over-your-own-dick Giant Animu Comboz™ for a change — the only other contemporary game that goes in that direction is Fantasy Strike (on Steam and on consoles Soon™ and I constantly recommend it, especially since it’s also designed very deliberately to make beginners no longer be beginners as fast as possible) , and I guess Street Fighter, if you ignore a bunch of other stuff about Street Fighter.
Anyway, I’m super pumped about Samurai Shodown and can’t wait to spend all weekend playing it. I’d offer to share PSN names but word is that the netcode is delay-based, so the connection would be most heinous against anyone who isn’t also in Japan. : \
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:07 PM on June 24, 2019 [8 favorites]
Also, for fighting game players who are new to Samurai Shodown, here is a great explanation of what makes the game feel so weird/different from what you’re used to. It cannot be overstated that the game has a decidedly unorthodox feel.
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:09 PM on June 24, 2019 [4 favorites]
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:09 PM on June 24, 2019 [4 favorites]
I’m super glad to see another fighting game that isn’t built around trip-over-your-own-dick Giant Animu Comboz™
BlazBlue Cross Tag Battle and Dragon Ball Fighter Z are both games that I find to be super accessible and less combo-heavy in the way that Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat, & Injustice. They're less hostile to newcomers and I appreciate that, because I just mash buttons and find things that work. It's how I've always played fighting games. Just smash and spam. I'm sure most people find this style of game super annoying but if it works...
posted by Fizz at 4:13 PM on June 24, 2019
BlazBlue Cross Tag Battle and Dragon Ball Fighter Z are both games that I find to be super accessible and less combo-heavy in the way that Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat, & Injustice. They're less hostile to newcomers and I appreciate that, because I just mash buttons and find things that work. It's how I've always played fighting games. Just smash and spam. I'm sure most people find this style of game super annoying but if it works...
posted by Fizz at 4:13 PM on June 24, 2019
I’ve had interesting conversations about this topic, because there are two different breeds of “accessible” when it comes to fighting games:
1. Make it easier for beginners to have fun playing with other beginners (bbtag, probably DBFZ, arguably Granblue Fantasy Versus)
2. Make it easier for beginners to stop being beginners (Fantasy Strike, maybe some other game some day?)
Which is to say, category 1 is designed around “make just mashing do an exciting-looking thing, easily” (and if you think bbtag isn’t combo-heavy, well, I don’t know what to tell you, heh), which is very different from “help beginners learn as fast as possible to play more deliberately, in order to get to the deeper game much faster.”
I think SamSho will fall into the latter category, if either, because the game is extremely mashing-unfriendly overall.
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:19 PM on June 24, 2019 [2 favorites]
1. Make it easier for beginners to have fun playing with other beginners (bbtag, probably DBFZ, arguably Granblue Fantasy Versus)
2. Make it easier for beginners to stop being beginners (Fantasy Strike, maybe some other game some day?)
Which is to say, category 1 is designed around “make just mashing do an exciting-looking thing, easily” (and if you think bbtag isn’t combo-heavy, well, I don’t know what to tell you, heh), which is very different from “help beginners learn as fast as possible to play more deliberately, in order to get to the deeper game much faster.”
I think SamSho will fall into the latter category, if either, because the game is extremely mashing-unfriendly overall.
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:19 PM on June 24, 2019 [2 favorites]
(and if you think bbtag isn’t combo-heavy, well, I don’t know what to tell you, heh),
Haha, it probably is. But I've found a way to make that work, or maybe I just do it a bit more on reflex after I learn "oooh this does that upper cut-thingy" or "down plus these two buttons and it makes the fireball".
I'm not good at these games but I fucking love playing them.
posted by Fizz at 4:34 PM on June 24, 2019
Haha, it probably is. But I've found a way to make that work, or maybe I just do it a bit more on reflex after I learn "oooh this does that upper cut-thingy" or "down plus these two buttons and it makes the fireball".
I'm not good at these games but I fucking love playing them.
posted by Fizz at 4:34 PM on June 24, 2019
Right, yeah, that's part of why I am constantly recommending Fantasy Strike to beginners especially, since it's designed to help people go from "not good at these games but love playing them" to "understand the game and love playing them even more" (mostly, admittedly, by removing special move motions and adding a lot of legibility to the game). Granted, I play it as someone who's been playing fighting games for twenty-some years now, but I guess that sort of stands as a testament to the fact that it's also a genuinely good game despite its accessibility to new players? Anyway, this is sort of a derail anyway.
On the upside, Samurai Shodown is kind of similar inasmuch as special moves aren't as important as in most games, so you can go a lot further against most opponents using just normal moves. This is good, because everyone has a super on "forward, half circle forward + CD"
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:38 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
On the upside, Samurai Shodown is kind of similar inasmuch as special moves aren't as important as in most games, so you can go a lot further against most opponents using just normal moves. This is good, because everyone has a super on "forward, half circle forward + CD"
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:38 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
I wish somebody had told me back in 1993 that this, this was the fighting game where you didn't have to land the stupid special joystick moves every time
nailing even nine out of ten shoryuken attempts wasn't any better than button-mashing IME
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:48 PM on June 24, 2019 [2 favorites]
nailing even nine out of ten shoryuken attempts wasn't any better than button-mashing IME
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:48 PM on June 24, 2019 [2 favorites]
I mean, don't get me wrong, SamSho does have joystick motions. It's just that your biggest damage is generally going to be from a normal move.
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:49 PM on June 24, 2019
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:49 PM on June 24, 2019
I LOVED this game. Everyone was all about Street Fighter in the 90s but this was my jam.
The developing character lore throughout the games was also engaging, especially with Ukyo and his tuberculosis.
posted by Young Kullervo at 6:01 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
The developing character lore throughout the games was also engaging, especially with Ukyo and his tuberculosis.
posted by Young Kullervo at 6:01 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
here is a great explanation of what makes the game feel so weird/different from what you’re used to.
And if you're wondering what half the words in this (very good) post mean, try this video.
posted by Reyturner at 6:22 PM on June 24, 2019 [2 favorites]
And if you're wondering what half the words in this (very good) post mean, try this video.
posted by Reyturner at 6:22 PM on June 24, 2019 [2 favorites]
despite the fact that practically no one in the English-speaking world played it
SamSho 2 seemed pretty prevalent on college campuses and arcades, and was my favorite fighting game, and a core activity of my college friends for awhile, we even got a NeoGeo console to play it. I never really transferred that love to any other fighting game, and not SS3 and SS4, which I never saw anywhere and stopped paying attention to fighting games after then anyway.
SS2 could be pretty welcoming to newbies if they played upper tier and better players played lower tier. (Which is another way to say the upper tier characters were way too good.) It's viscerally very satisfying to land a strong attack, and it makes a very clear lesson that you fucked up if you get hit by one, which I think speeds up learning to block and pick attacks.
The character designs got worse after SS2, IMO, uninspired-yet-taking-itself-too-seriously at the same time. Such as: blandly attractive 'ninja' brothers; one of whom dresses in red and has fire powers, while the other dresses in blue and has water powers. Imagine that crap consuming two character slots in a new version of a game you like, in a game that already had two and a half ninjas.
posted by fleacircus at 7:11 PM on June 24, 2019
SamSho 2 seemed pretty prevalent on college campuses and arcades, and was my favorite fighting game, and a core activity of my college friends for awhile, we even got a NeoGeo console to play it. I never really transferred that love to any other fighting game, and not SS3 and SS4, which I never saw anywhere and stopped paying attention to fighting games after then anyway.
SS2 could be pretty welcoming to newbies if they played upper tier and better players played lower tier. (Which is another way to say the upper tier characters were way too good.) It's viscerally very satisfying to land a strong attack, and it makes a very clear lesson that you fucked up if you get hit by one, which I think speeds up learning to block and pick attacks.
The character designs got worse after SS2, IMO, uninspired-yet-taking-itself-too-seriously at the same time. Such as: blandly attractive 'ninja' brothers; one of whom dresses in red and has fire powers, while the other dresses in blue and has water powers. Imagine that crap consuming two character slots in a new version of a game you like, in a game that already had two and a half ninjas.
posted by fleacircus at 7:11 PM on June 24, 2019
you shut your filthy mouth and take back what you just said about the Kazama brothers
my beautiful fire and water boys
posted by DoctorFedora at 7:29 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
my beautiful fire and water boys
posted by DoctorFedora at 7:29 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
at least Yashamaru plays kind of like Suija
posted by DoctorFedora at 7:31 PM on June 24, 2019
posted by DoctorFedora at 7:31 PM on June 24, 2019
I was always more of a Bushido Blade guy, really.
posted by tobascodagama at 8:31 PM on June 24, 2019 [4 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 8:31 PM on June 24, 2019 [4 favorites]
I will never take it back, because they suck. Reconsider your life... with my fists!
I was always more of a Bushido Blade guy, really.
Bushido Blade was fun too, and even more of an instant death kind of game, except when the fights involved arbitrary amounts of running around being unable to hit the other person, kinda like Spathi vs. Yehat.
posted by fleacircus at 9:02 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
I was always more of a Bushido Blade guy, really.
Bushido Blade was fun too, and even more of an instant death kind of game, except when the fights involved arbitrary amounts of running around being unable to hit the other person, kinda like Spathi vs. Yehat.
posted by fleacircus at 9:02 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
“A Classic Reborn! - Samurai Shodown Review”—Electric Playground, 24 June 2019
posted by ob1quixote at 10:04 PM on June 24, 2019
posted by ob1quixote at 10:04 PM on June 24, 2019
Just gonna leave this here.
RZA, Samurai Showdown. Raise your swords.
posted by rp at 10:27 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
RZA, Samurai Showdown. Raise your swords.
posted by rp at 10:27 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]
"GO, POPPY!" has been lodged in my brain since the bowling alley freshman year had a SNK machine in a way that I'm told older generations got the pac-man WAKA WAKA lodged.
posted by Pickman's Next Top Model at 10:39 PM on June 24, 2019 [4 favorites]
posted by Pickman's Next Top Model at 10:39 PM on June 24, 2019 [4 favorites]
It’s been kind of funny seeing the Internet kind of fall over itself to go OH HEY YUP THAT IS DEFINITELY A GAME I REMEMBER… “““FONDLY””” despite the fact that practically no one in the English-speaking world played it, heh
the pizza place in my 5000 person town in iowa had this so i'm surprised to read this assertion
posted by thedaniel at 6:54 AM on June 25, 2019
the pizza place in my 5000 person town in iowa had this so i'm surprised to read this assertion
posted by thedaniel at 6:54 AM on June 25, 2019
I managed to find SS1-3 in various arcades in Reno, NV at various points, so I'm gonna argue with the assertion that nobody in the English speaking world played it.
posted by fnerg at 9:44 AM on June 25, 2019
posted by fnerg at 9:44 AM on June 25, 2019
the pizza place in my 5000 person town in iowa had this so i'm surprised to read this assertion
Also my college arcade at Pacific Lutheran University circa 1994.
posted by Fleebnork at 10:08 AM on June 25, 2019
Also my college arcade at Pacific Lutheran University circa 1994.
posted by Fleebnork at 10:08 AM on June 25, 2019
guys I think he just meant there aren't like memes about it or anything, its cultural impact here was small
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:10 AM on June 25, 2019
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:10 AM on June 25, 2019
guys I think he just meant there aren't like memes about it or anything, its cultural impact here was small
INCOHERENT SS2-ERA GENJURO SCREAM!!!
posted by fnerg at 11:00 AM on June 25, 2019 [1 favorite]
Yeah, in the US SamSho was a game you saw at the bowling alley or at a pizza place, not a game people got seriously into and very competitive at
it was like a movie that shows up on cable tv a lot because nobody saw it in theaters
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:34 PM on June 25, 2019
it was like a movie that shows up on cable tv a lot because nobody saw it in theaters
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:34 PM on June 25, 2019
https://blog.us.playstation.com/2019/06/25/snk-kicks-off-samurai-shodown-with-launch-trailer-full-dlc-reveal/ Yessss at least one of the Kazama brothers
Now just give me my wet watery boy some day (but Yashamaru is at least Suija-ish enough for now)
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:41 PM on June 25, 2019
Now just give me my wet watery boy some day (but Yashamaru is at least Suija-ish enough for now)
posted by DoctorFedora at 4:41 PM on June 25, 2019
the game is out here now and I like it
or at least, like, I like the actual game part of the game, a lot
but holy moly all of the UI was ““designed”” by a programmer or something, because it is just hilariously awful, everywhere
posted by DoctorFedora at 10:33 PM on June 26, 2019
or at least, like, I like the actual game part of the game, a lot
but holy moly all of the UI was ““designed”” by a programmer or something, because it is just hilariously awful, everywhere
posted by DoctorFedora at 10:33 PM on June 26, 2019
I cannot express how much I love that the "online" indicator on load screens is a Chojugiga version of the Neo-Geo CD's load screen juggling monkey
Also the game itself is very fun
posted by DoctorFedora at 7:40 PM on June 27, 2019
Also the game itself is very fun
posted by DoctorFedora at 7:40 PM on June 27, 2019
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posted by Caduceus at 2:44 PM on June 24, 2019 [1 favorite]