the posh and parentally blessed

January 26, 2023 2:22 PM

[Vice] American Nepo Babies Have Nothing on the British Perhaps the British sequel to the ongoing (US-centric) nepo baby discourse, previously seen on the Blue here.
posted by cendawanita (26 comments total)

Shocked, shocked I am

That a country with a hereditary monarchy could have nepotism as a feature
posted by Barbara Spitzer at 2:50 PM on January 26, 2023 [31 favorites]

This seems to me genuinely a shift in meaning for 'nepotism', where it used to refer only to a corrupt or dishonest preference for family members in e.g. specific public offices. But isn't this just British class operating in the same way it has done for hundreds of years; just the older-definition of Privilege through old boy or public school networks?
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 3:36 PM on January 26, 2023 [20 favorites]

Even when it was normal, one could inquire if it was good; after the Great Compression, when we know there is an alternative, and we see it being rapidly re-normalized, we can ask why and what it will change.
posted by clew at 4:33 PM on January 26, 2023 [6 favorites]

From article: The framing is perhaps telling. Far from a “new trend” (as the Express suggested), nepotism is a driving force throughout British society – not least the media. There are, however, key differences."

American Nepotism.

Junius Brutus Booth. British born, "the son of Richard Booth, a lawyer and avid supporter of the American cause, and Jane Elizabeth Game. His paternal grandfather was John Booth, a silversmith, and his paternal grandmother, Elizabeth Wilkes, was a relative of the English radical and politician John Wilkes."

Friend of Andrew Jackson, Booth sent him a letter demanding the pardon of two pirates then threatened his life, later deemed a joke.

Booth had 12 children. 4 in the business.

Junius Brutus Booth Jr. He had two children who acted, Junius Brutus Booth III and Sydney Booth.

Edwin Booth has been considered one of the actors of his age had a daughter, Edwina (not to be confused with Edwina Booth) who had a son, the artist Edwin Booth Grossman.

Asia Booth Clarke, a writer, had two sons who acted. Creston Clarke and Wilford Clake who married Victory Bateman.

John Wilkes Booth.

The nepotism is Edwin saved Robert Lincoln from serious hurt or death on a train platform allowing protection and getting Wilkes remains released after bugging Johnson.
posted by clavdivs at 4:54 PM on January 26, 2023 [1 favorite]

I find it weird that the author poses this:

1. working class; 2. middle class; 3. upper middle class; 4. upper class;

... as "three tier". Why no upper-working class ? Or lower-upper class ?

The upper-middle class is just the bourgeoisie trying to make a stripe or two layers of labor vote out of their tax bracket of interest.

And it has worked for 40 years like a wave motion bogonator on the proletariat.
posted by NoThisIsPatrick at 5:12 PM on January 26, 2023 [3 favorites]

The infuriating thing is when apologists start popping up talking about people who "got in the door" through nepotism but then demonstrate competency. Getting in the door instead of unpaid internships is often how people have the time and space to develop skills and network for future paid jobs.
posted by BrotherCaine at 6:15 PM on January 26, 2023 [17 favorites]

There were things about this that made me really uneasy. In the U.K. not too long ago, you didn't have to go to the right school to get somewhere when it came to acting. And actors like Bob Hoskins loudly advocated for the working class. Now, all the actors go to the same posh schools, just like everyone else in power.

Also, learning that some actors I like went to Eton just makes me think about Eton and all the murder.
posted by rednikki at 7:28 PM on January 26, 2023 [25 favorites]

Because the difference between upper-middle class and upper class is the need to work for your money. Upper-working class is middle class. But there's a significant difference between, say, a successful lawyer and someone who has enough family money to never worry about money for things that most people would consider a possible expense.
posted by aspo at 10:04 PM on January 26, 2023 [9 favorites]

Agree with aspo, except I do think that a lower middle class category would make sense as well. Also worth noting that a lot of the better traditionally working class jobs actually pay a lot better than some traditionally middle class jobs. For some reason going into a trade is still seen as 'lesser' than getting a university degree, despite the former being economically much more advantageous.

As an immigrant having lived in the UK for 18 years: class is weird and stupid. Burn it down.
posted by Dysk at 11:05 PM on January 26, 2023 [5 favorites]

It's even more refined than class: it's really a handful of ultra elite schools for the lads that are producing male actors, and access to places like Eton is not just highly competitive but also often tied to having close family who've been going there for generations. And then, because these schools are nominally charities, they get huge tax breaks which adds to their ability to fund lavish thesthre programs in a way no state school could dream of even having a 10th of.
posted by lesbiassparrow at 12:40 AM on January 27, 2023 [3 favorites]

If people are interested in academic research on class and the heredity of occupations in modern Britain, there is a great book by Sam Friedman and Daniel Laurison - The Class Ceiling - on this. Guardian review here . And on the posh actors question specifically Dave O'Brien is doing really excellent research on what this means for the creative industries. Blog post here
posted by melisande at 1:39 AM on January 27, 2023 [6 favorites]

I just want to give a shout-out for local-to-me Television Workshop, which keeps on bringing in new Midlands talent to British screens. It's not much compared to the Eton-Oxford-posh pipeline, but it helps.
posted by Katemonkey at 4:43 AM on January 27, 2023 [5 favorites]

I suppose I have been surprised Michael Caine ever existed. But that was the 1970's? When was the exception allowed?
And what riot made it possible?

Any excuse to post UK Grim, which doesn't need 'actors'

What about footballers?

Or I guess wake me when we ve got a Nepo NBA in the USA because I had assumed all this, given the massive misogyny and racism in cultural production

In the USA, a Stanford Bain Capital asshole stole from Black Historians to write the NYTimes bestseller on the 1811 slave revolt, so, I dunno, it's a farce out there all around.

Thanks to the article for acknowledging the (obvious) exceptions, I suppose I wish the article had been about their success
posted by eustatic at 5:03 AM on January 27, 2023 [1 favorite]

Oh my goodness, this was written by Elle Hunt. She's just great. I've been following her stuff in the Guardian since she was in NZ during the pandemic. Definitely one to watch.
posted by rednikki at 6:07 AM on January 27, 2023

I suspect everyone complaining about nepotism would do the exact same thing in the same situation.
posted by GallonOfAlan at 6:50 AM on January 27, 2023

I suspect everyone complaining about nepotism would do the exact same thing in the same situation.

Of course, which is why it's important to focus on structures, rather than just calling out individual nepo babies, as satisfying as that may be. People take advantage of the opportunities available to them, so we need to make sure that opportunities are as fairly distributed as possible.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:52 AM on January 27, 2023 [22 favorites]

Were British drama schools free back in the day like the rest of higher education was? Acting has always been a family affair but I assume once you've been ripped off for tens of thousands of pounds to find that out you'll be more angry about nepotism.
posted by kingdead at 7:24 AM on January 27, 2023 [1 favorite]

Or I guess wake me when we've got a Nepo NBA in the USA because I had assumed all this, given the massive misogyny and racism in cultural production

There is a nepo NBA already. Steph Curry's dad played in the NBA.

But there's a significant difference between, say, a successful lawyer and someone who has enough family money to never worry about money for things that most people would consider a possible expense.

No there is really not, I mean assuming you mean a really successful lawyer, as opposed to a locally successful lawyer, which is actually why these types of class distinctions don't really exist in the US. Heck, Alan Derschowitz. Robert Kardashian ~ father of the endlessly wealthy Kardashians. Supreme Court lawyers, lots of members of Congress. The US doesn't have class distinctions in the same way as everything is filtered through having excess cash and you can easily buy your way into the upper classes.
posted by The_Vegetables at 7:49 AM on January 27, 2023

I disagree with aspo.

Middle class is defined by "owns the means of production." This hand-waving and creating micro-classes is all in for the elite and the bourgeoisie leaving the labor in imaginary classes with no force or power.

Spoken as an upper lumpenprole.
posted by NoThisIsPatrick at 8:30 AM on January 27, 2023 [1 favorite]

It seems to me that classes talk about two different things: economic buying power (upper, middle and lower classes, "working class" is either middle or lower depending on their buying power) and social class (working, middle and upper, where it matters if you know the right people or how to choose the right spoon in a fancy restaurant or whatever). Trying to combine them into one thing is relevant because people's lives are just one thing, but makes it confusing as well.

We could also talk about three classes:
1. doesn't have to work/money works for them
2. works for themselves
3. works for others
and that's loosely speaking what NoThisIsPatrick is talking about, although I think you can be bourgeosie and still work for others, so not exactly the same?
posted by joannemerriam at 8:43 AM on January 27, 2023 [3 favorites]

But that was the 1970's? When was the exception allowed?

Im pretty sure I’ve read David Bowie describing the post-Depression-and-WWII change in funding and ethos that allowed a generation of "exceptions", including him.

The LRB also had a review of The Class Ceiling, with the depressing point that the Great Compression worked partly because the distribution of SES places had changed; there were far more middle class careers per each working class career than there had been pre-war, so outsiders could get good jobs without changing the odds of insider’s kids getting one.
posted by clew at 10:44 AM on January 27, 2023 [5 favorites]

The article was really, really irritating on class. Both social and economic capital matter in defining or describing class in England but social capital is much more important. The privileged people described are often (but not always) wealthy, but that's not what matters, it's that they are well connected and are alike in important ways.

In addition, British class structure has more layers than they suggested. In the middle classes, I would say there are at least three culturally distinct groupings in the middle class - upper middle (UMC), middle middle and lower middle - and two to three in the working class.

If you want to understand how class works here, then first read the popular sociology book Watching the English by Kate Fox.

Social mobility in Britain has fallen quite a lot since it's mid-20th century peak. I am middle class because my dad was able to move, over his 20s from working class (son of a farm labourer) to lower middle class. He was able to do this because there were increasing job opportunities in junior professional roles in the 50s-70s for working class young adults to fill. Gen X and later generations have not had the same opportunities.

I also wanted to add that one of the arts that is not nearly as dominated by the upper middle classes is stand up comedy. There are successful comedians from a much broader range of class backgrounds than you would find in other arts. Many, many comedians have very ordinary working and lower middle class background, for example Rob Beckett, Tom Allen, Jimmy Carr, Peter Kay, Romesh Ranganathan, Sarah Millican, Angela Barnes, and Sara Pascoe. I don't know that comedians are completely representative but they are much less likely to be public school educated or UMC.
posted by plonkee at 11:31 AM on January 27, 2023 [8 favorites]

Were British drama schools free back in the day like the rest of higher education was? Acting has always been a family affair but I assume once you've been ripped off for tens of thousands of pounds to find that out you'll be more angry about nepotism.

It's a good question. Drama schools were not part of university and college higher education funding until fairly recently, and I believe funding and scholarships were patchy. The Poor School was set up to help address this.

It's still a bit of a mixed bag, there are funded places at vocational training schools for 16-23 year olds and some drama schools (including RADA) offer training in the form of a degree, for which you can get the usual student loans. And then other places where you need to pay.
posted by plonkee at 12:08 PM on January 27, 2023

W/r/t dynastism in sport, it’s long been common for the sons and daughters of athletes also to be athletes, and for good reason, the physical characteristics (height, strength, vision, stamina) that make good athletes are directly genetically inheritable. The early coordination and awareness that come with sporting parents (throwing a ball, kicking a football around in the park, knowing the rules and customs of a game) gives a huge advantage too.

That’s not what’s going on here though.
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 2:06 PM on January 27, 2023 [2 favorites]

Also, on reflection, I think there are two separate things going on.

There are a lot of acting dynasties, and theatrical families in Britain. This has been the case for a very, very long time - since at least the late 19th century. These people are the nepo babies, in the same way that Kate Hudson and Gwyneth Paltrow are nepo babies. Financially successful people in these families can afford to send their children to elite schools. There are lots of examples in the article so I'll just pull out Daniel Radcliffe whose mother is a casting agent and who attended elite London private schools before he started acting (ie his parents paid for it).

In addition to that, if you went to a socially elite British private school, you have access to better drama teaching at school and better networks including with the nepo babies. On top of that you have all the other confidence and privilege that many children attending these schools get. This applies regardless of whether your family is involved in the arts or not. Eddie Redmayne is someone in this category. Going to one of these schools is a strong indicator that you are upper class (ie aristocracy) or upper middle class.

Combining both of these together with the London-centric nature of the arts explains why the minority of wealthy posh people are massively over-represented.
posted by plonkee at 2:39 AM on January 28, 2023 [2 favorites]

I also wanted to add that one of the arts that is not nearly as dominated by the upper middle classes is stand up comedy.

This is true, but it's also becoming harder for non-rich people to get a start in comedy these days...

Arts Emergency is a charity started by a couple of comedians to support and mentor ordinary kids who want a creative career. They do some really good stuff.
posted by Shark Hat at 2:09 PM on January 28, 2023 [2 favorites]