His "obscene" materials resurrected 150 years later
March 21, 2023 11:55 PM Subscribe
Abortion pill mifepristone ruling in Texas case could hinge on 1873 Comstock Act - "A federal judge in Texas may try to invoke an obscure 19th-century law called the Comstock Act to roll back mail delivery of the abortion pill mifepristone." (previously)
Some GOP Legislators Are Trying To Show They're Pro-Life, Not Just Anti-Abortion - "These new proposals — which usually involve strengthening social safety net protections for low-income women — fly in the face of Republican orthodoxy about limited government."
Kavanaugh and Alito said judges would be out of the abortion equation. That's not the case - "A single federal judge – not a duly elected state legislature – is positioned to shut down access to an abortion drug and thwart women seeking to end pregnancies even in states where the procedure is still legal. Such an order could sweep nationwide, rather than be limited to one state."
Why We're Barreling Toward a Legal War Between the States - "Red states are passing laws to advance their culture war. Blue states are passing laws to stop it. The Supreme Court is going to have to decide, and there is no compromise position."
also btw, in other consequential court cases:
The Justice Department, in a legal opinion in December, said the Comstock Act does not ban mail delivery of mifepristone when the sender does not intend for the recipient to use the pill unlawfully. The opinion cited multiple federal court rulings dating as far back as 1915 that narrowed the scope of the Comstock Act’s provisions on abortion.Republican states say the FDA doesn't have the authority to override state abortion pill bans - "The 21 GOP attorneys general told a federal court in West Virginia on Monday [3/6] that it should dismiss a lawsuit filed by GenBioPro, one of the manufacturers of the abortion pill mifepristone. The company has asked the court to overturn West Virginia's abortion ban, arguing that it conflicts with how the FDA regulates mifepristone under federal law."
But Kacsmaryk pressed government lawyers on what he should make of the Justice Department opinion compared to the “fairly definitive reading” of the Comstock Act’s language.
The judge appeared sympathetic to 22 Republican attorneys general who filed a brief to the court arguing that the FDA’s actions on mifepristone violate the Comstock Act. He raised multiple times the argument of the GOP attorneys general that the FDA is undermining the states’ ability to regulate abortion.
Kacsmaryk did not mention a brief filed by 22 Democratic attorneys general, who said a ruling against the FDA would jeopardize abortion access in their states where the procedure is legal.
GenBioPro has argued that West Virginia’s abortion ban violates the supremacy and commerce clauses of the U.S. Constitution, which give the FDA the power to decide which drugs are sold nationwide.Abortion pill access threatened in Nevada amid legal uncertainty - "Drug distributor AmerisourceBergen, the sole supplier of the pills to all pharmacies, is accused of taking an approach that could limit access."
“Individual state regulation of mifepristone destroys the national common market and conflicts with the strong national interest in ensuring access to a federally approved medication to end a pregnancy, resulting in the kind of economic fracturing the Framers intended the Clause to preclude,” GenBioPro’s lawyers argued in the lawsuit.
“A State’s police power does not extend to functionally banning an article of interstate commerce — the Constitution leaves that to Congress,” the company’s lawyers wrote.
Walgreens, the nation’s second-largest pharmacy chain, confirmed to POLITICO earlier in March that it will not distribute the pills in 21 states where Republican attorneys general have threatened the company with legal action. Albertsons, Costco, CVS, Kroger, Rite Aid and Walmart have, so far, refused to reveal their distribution plans.The slippery slope of the mifepristone and the FDA - "If Judge Kacsmaryk rules in favor of the plaintiffs, this could open the door to drug regulatory chaos. Currently, the FDA's process for approving and withdrawing drugs is largely self-contained — their job is to evaluate evidence from clinical trials, convene advisory groups and hold hearings to discuss evidence, and eventually make decisions on whether or not a drug is effective and safe. Drugmakers, outside experts, and patient groups have many opportunities to give their input, but they cannot overrule the FDA's decision."
But since all U.S. retail pharmacies depend on AmerisourceBergen to stock the brand name version of the medication, the wholesaler’s interpretation of state laws may dictate access for millions of people going forward. Pharmacies may still be able to obtain and distribute generic versions of the abortion pill.
The mifepristone case could change all that. The decision could set a precedent for anyone to challenge an FDA approval based on the existence of any adverse events, even in drugs that are overwhelmingly more beneficial than harmful. This would essentially put every drug on the market at risk of withdrawal by a legal challenge — especially those that have become politicized such as hormone treatments or COVID-19 vaccines.The Plaintiffs Trying to Ban the Abortion Pill Admitted They Have No Case - "Without redressability, no one can come before a federal court and ask for relief."
This would also lead to big ripple effects within the drug development pipeline. Why would a pharma company bother to invest millions into research and development for a new drug for birth control or an HPV vaccine if they thought that it might be withdrawn later through a legal challenge?
If millions of patients and decades of research are not enough to support the FDA’s decision, what will be? While the morality of abortion can be debated, the safety of mifepristone is clear. If we start using personal morality to decide whether or not a drug can be on the market, we should all start hoping there’s nobody out there with a strong moral stance against other safe and effective drugs like ibuprofen.
- Wyoming bans mifepristone in a national first - "Wyoming outlawed nearly all abortions when it passed a 'trigger ban' after the Supreme Court overturned Roe v. Wade last summer, but the case is being challenged in court and a judge has halted its enforcement. Wyoming's new mifepristone law could be a model for other states looking for a workaround if other anti-abortion laws are overturned or paused."
- Wyoming banned the abortion pill. Some states are trying to go even further. - "With abortion access already limited, some states are trying to impose extreme penalties for the procedure."
- CA bill would protect doctors who mail abortion pills to other states - "For instance, an individual who travels to or lives in Texas could request and be prescribed abortion medication or contraception from a California medical provider, per [state Sen. Nancy Skinner]."
Some GOP Legislators Are Trying To Show They're Pro-Life, Not Just Anti-Abortion - "These new proposals — which usually involve strengthening social safety net protections for low-income women — fly in the face of Republican orthodoxy about limited government."
Kavanaugh and Alito said judges would be out of the abortion equation. That's not the case - "A single federal judge – not a duly elected state legislature – is positioned to shut down access to an abortion drug and thwart women seeking to end pregnancies even in states where the procedure is still legal. Such an order could sweep nationwide, rather than be limited to one state."
Why We're Barreling Toward a Legal War Between the States - "Red states are passing laws to advance their culture war. Blue states are passing laws to stop it. The Supreme Court is going to have to decide, and there is no compromise position."
also btw, in other consequential court cases:
- Supreme Court signals it could sidestep ruling in major elections case - "The independent state legislature argument hinges on language in the Constitution that says election rules 'shall be prescribed in each state by the legislature thereof.' Supporters of the theory, which has never been endorsed by the Supreme Court, say the language supports the notion that, when it comes to federal election rules, legislatures have ultimate power under state law, potentially irrespective of potential constraints imposed by state constitutions."
- North Carolina's top court hears redistricting case with national implications - "While a reversal would aid Republicans' quest to maintain their U.S. House majority, it could doom a separate Republican-backed effort to convince the U.S. Supreme Court to grant state legislatures sweeping new powers over federal elections."
- North Carolina Urges US Supreme Court to Toss Major Elections Case - "At the rehearing last week, several of its conservative members appeared sympathetic toward the Republicans, who control the state legislature and the map-drawing process. An outcome favoring them would boost the party's chances of maintaining its slim U.S. House majority next year. During the arguments in December, the U.S. Supreme Court's conservative majority appeared inclined to rule in favor of the Republicans and limit state judicial power to overrule voting policies crafted by state politicians..."
I'm familiar with the Comstock laws. For forty-two years, Anthony Comstock, Postal Inspector of the United States, used it to be the biggest censor in the land, working tirelessly to suppress birth control, women's suffrage, labor organizers, anarchists, pacifists, religious minorities (Jehovah's Witnesses and Pentecostals), and gynecology. J. Edgar Hoover's was a protege of Comstock, and much of Hoover's early rise was due to Comstock's patronage.
These laws were voided by Griswold v. Connecticut and Eisenstadt v. Baird.
This is it. They're coming after Griswold v. Connecticut.
At some point, much like with Dred Scott v. Sanford, one of these is going to start the civil war. That's the point. They want a civil war.
posted by LeRoienJaune at 12:45 AM on March 22, 2023 [60 favorites]
These laws were voided by Griswold v. Connecticut and Eisenstadt v. Baird.
This is it. They're coming after Griswold v. Connecticut.
At some point, much like with Dred Scott v. Sanford, one of these is going to start the civil war. That's the point. They want a civil war.
posted by LeRoienJaune at 12:45 AM on March 22, 2023 [60 favorites]
Underlying the opposition to contraception today, opposition framed in woman-protective terms, lies an aversion to sex for pleasure, sex undertaken for reasons other than procreation. This opposition to non procreative sex is remarkably regressive, extends to sex for pleasure within marriage, and unites the opposition against reproductive rights and same sex marriage. To counteract the forces opposing broad contraceptive access, we must examine the reasoning behind the opposition, look with skepticism at reasons that appeal to science and abortion bias, and demand that our decision-making bodies do the same. from Contraceptive Comstockery [PDF, 2015]
posted by chavenet at 2:08 AM on March 22, 2023 [6 favorites]
posted by chavenet at 2:08 AM on March 22, 2023 [6 favorites]
Everyone remember the "activist judges" phrase so commonly used on the right?
posted by nofundy at 4:01 AM on March 22, 2023 [18 favorites]
posted by nofundy at 4:01 AM on March 22, 2023 [18 favorites]
Wonderful post. The mifepristone case was on my radar, but I wasn't aware how broad the ramifications might be. Maybe the long arc of history does not always bend towards justice, and, more disturbingly, maybe it only takes a minority of awful people to turn it the wrong way.
posted by snofoam at 4:42 AM on March 22, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by snofoam at 4:42 AM on March 22, 2023 [4 favorites]
Maybe the long arc of history does not always bend towards justice, and, more disturbingly, maybe it only takes a minority of awful people to turn it the wrong way.
More like, that arc wobbles a lot. They don't have a big enough minority. Well, more like, they have what they think is just enough of a minority right now, but that minority is dying off remarkably quickly and being replaced by secular people: church attendance and religious belief are dropping like rocks in the USA. As we saw in the 2022 elections, young/secular people are really motivated to come out and vote against anti-choice politicians, and trying to fuck with birth control is going to make that worse. We're in for about 10 years of courts and state legislatures dominated by dying godbag boomers and pissing off everyone else, but not "a civil war".
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 4:49 AM on March 22, 2023 [7 favorites]
More like, that arc wobbles a lot. They don't have a big enough minority. Well, more like, they have what they think is just enough of a minority right now, but that minority is dying off remarkably quickly and being replaced by secular people: church attendance and religious belief are dropping like rocks in the USA. As we saw in the 2022 elections, young/secular people are really motivated to come out and vote against anti-choice politicians, and trying to fuck with birth control is going to make that worse. We're in for about 10 years of courts and state legislatures dominated by dying godbag boomers and pissing off everyone else, but not "a civil war".
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 4:49 AM on March 22, 2023 [7 favorites]
Meanwhile, it remains perfectly legal for companies like Hims to mail pills for limp dicks, because having erectile dysfunction ads on TV and everywhere else is completely not obscene and leads to exactly zero uncomfortable discussions with your kids.
I hate this timeline.
posted by caution live frogs at 4:55 AM on March 22, 2023 [31 favorites]
I hate this timeline.
posted by caution live frogs at 4:55 AM on March 22, 2023 [31 favorites]
Everyone remember the "activist judges" phrase so commonly used on the right?
I remember the term apparently proved effective with focus groups but was never, ever deployed as a good faith argument.
Everyone, including the so-called "liberal media" who quoted that term uncritically and especially the Republican base, understood the phrase to mean "judges who issued decisions we don't like."
posted by Gelatin at 5:06 AM on March 22, 2023 [7 favorites]
I remember the term apparently proved effective with focus groups but was never, ever deployed as a good faith argument.
Everyone, including the so-called "liberal media" who quoted that term uncritically and especially the Republican base, understood the phrase to mean "judges who issued decisions we don't like."
posted by Gelatin at 5:06 AM on March 22, 2023 [7 favorites]
We're in for about 10 years of courts and state legislatures dominated by dying godbag boomers and pissing off everyone else, but not "a civil war".
This is such blinkered bullshit. This “once the boomers die, all will be well” nonsense really needs to stop. It’s blinding you to the very real fact that, save for a small few people left at the top, the right-wing hate parade is overwhelmingly being led by far younger monsters. DeSantis? Cruz? MTG? Almost all of the Jan.6 rioters? Oath Keepers? Proud Boys? Most of the red state legislatures? Not boomers.
Waiting for boomers to die-off is akin to sticking your head in the sand and ignoring the goose-steppers within your own cohort.
posted by Thorzdad at 5:12 AM on March 22, 2023 [91 favorites]
This is such blinkered bullshit. This “once the boomers die, all will be well” nonsense really needs to stop. It’s blinding you to the very real fact that, save for a small few people left at the top, the right-wing hate parade is overwhelmingly being led by far younger monsters. DeSantis? Cruz? MTG? Almost all of the Jan.6 rioters? Oath Keepers? Proud Boys? Most of the red state legislatures? Not boomers.
Waiting for boomers to die-off is akin to sticking your head in the sand and ignoring the goose-steppers within your own cohort.
posted by Thorzdad at 5:12 AM on March 22, 2023 [91 favorites]
save for a small few people left at the top, the right-wing hate parade is overwhelmingly being led by far younger monsters. DeSantis? Cruz? MTG? Almost all of the Jan.6 rioters? Oath Keepers? Proud Boys? Most of the red state legislatures? Not boomers.
No, but their constituency is overwhelmingly older, and without voters Cruz, MTG, and their ilk have no power.
I recall reading that, while it was previously standard for people to become more conservative as they age, with Millennials and later generation, that shift isn't happening at all. And younger voters overwhelmingly reject the Republican position on abortion, LGBTQ hate, and "funnel the other half of the nation's wealth to the super-rich."
Republicans rejecting democracy doesn't rise from a position of strength. It's a position of weakness. There are more of us than there are of them, and that disparity is increasing all the time. They long since abandoned trying to persuade anyone not already a True Believer, so they're stuck with a diminishing cult. They've managed to use the counter-majoritarian aspects of our stupid system to hang onto power so far, but they should have won big in 2022 and they didn't. Gerrymandering and voter suppression are all they have now.
The trick is not so much to wait for the boomers to die off as to motivate Democratic constituencies, including younger citizens, to vote.
posted by Gelatin at 5:22 AM on March 22, 2023 [16 favorites]
No, but their constituency is overwhelmingly older, and without voters Cruz, MTG, and their ilk have no power.
I recall reading that, while it was previously standard for people to become more conservative as they age, with Millennials and later generation, that shift isn't happening at all. And younger voters overwhelmingly reject the Republican position on abortion, LGBTQ hate, and "funnel the other half of the nation's wealth to the super-rich."
Republicans rejecting democracy doesn't rise from a position of strength. It's a position of weakness. There are more of us than there are of them, and that disparity is increasing all the time. They long since abandoned trying to persuade anyone not already a True Believer, so they're stuck with a diminishing cult. They've managed to use the counter-majoritarian aspects of our stupid system to hang onto power so far, but they should have won big in 2022 and they didn't. Gerrymandering and voter suppression are all they have now.
The trick is not so much to wait for the boomers to die off as to motivate Democratic constituencies, including younger citizens, to vote.
posted by Gelatin at 5:22 AM on March 22, 2023 [16 favorites]
Lots of people were trash long before the Boomers came along, and lots of them will be trash long after they’re gone. It’s kind of the whole deal with humanity.
posted by The Card Cheat at 5:24 AM on March 22, 2023 [15 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 5:24 AM on March 22, 2023 [15 favorites]
I'm from Amarillo, TX, where the judge in this case resides. There is no "if" when it comes to his ruling. He will rule for the Republican position and against abortion, that's as guaranteed as tomorrow's sunrise. The only real question is what legal excuse will he conjure up to claim he used to reach the preordained decision, and how broadly his excuse can be used to tear down other parts of the government and oppress anyone who isn't a cis het white Christian man.
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if he goes for maximum damage and chaos. He's a member of the First Liberty Institute, one of the more nakedly theocratic organizations around, in addition to being (of course) part of the Federalist Society.
I can't see any way the Republicans on the Supreme Court will vote against him during the inevitable appeal.
I currently live in San Antonio, one of the cities where the prosecutors said they'd be deprioritizing enforcement of the various anti-abortion laws. San Antonio, like Austin, has been the target of the Lege's ire for a long time, quite simply the Texas Lege hates cities and takes action to hurt cities at every opportunity.
Direct quote from our Governor regarding Austin:
In the past San Antonio and Austin have been attacked by the Lege for refusing to cooperate with ICE, refusing to enforce drug laws, and so on. I think they're going to push harder now that they've overturned Roe.
It's also important to remember that this isn't "rural vs. urban". I mean, sure the actual rural areas suck ass and are full to the brim with MAGA cultists who hate anyone who isn't a cis het white Christian man, but they're so depopulated they mostly don't matter.
This is urban vs. suburban and exurban. The average Trump voter isn't a poor redneck hick, that's a classist delusion held by Democrats who don't want to look at reality. The average Trump voter is a suburban or exurban professional. Trump voters had an average income roughly $10,000/year HIGHER than Biden voters in the last election.
I dunno if they actually really want a civil war or not. I've been convinced for a while that the Republicans are slowly ratcheting things up by taking action that's just barely below the level that would kick off a civil war then letting that become the new normal before pushing again.
But maybe now they're impatient? Especially since they are on the wrong end of the demographic shift.
I'm pretty sure the real questions will be answered when we see just how broadly the Supreme Court sustains Kacsmaryk's decision. He seems to be going for the broadest, most damaging, way he can possibly ban abortion pills, whether the Court will back that or limit the ruling to just abortion pills rather than encouraging more is where we'll see how bad this is.
TL;DR: Kacsmaryk is guaranteed to rule against abortion, the real question is how much damage the Supreme Court will encourage when it sustains his decision.
posted by sotonohito at 5:25 AM on March 22, 2023 [52 favorites]
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if he goes for maximum damage and chaos. He's a member of the First Liberty Institute, one of the more nakedly theocratic organizations around, in addition to being (of course) part of the Federalist Society.
I can't see any way the Republicans on the Supreme Court will vote against him during the inevitable appeal.
I currently live in San Antonio, one of the cities where the prosecutors said they'd be deprioritizing enforcement of the various anti-abortion laws. San Antonio, like Austin, has been the target of the Lege's ire for a long time, quite simply the Texas Lege hates cities and takes action to hurt cities at every opportunity.
Direct quote from our Governor regarding Austin:
As you leave Austin and ... cross the Travis County line, it starts smelling different. And you know what that fragrance is? Freedom. It's the smell of freedom that does not exist in Austin, Texas.Yeah.
In the past San Antonio and Austin have been attacked by the Lege for refusing to cooperate with ICE, refusing to enforce drug laws, and so on. I think they're going to push harder now that they've overturned Roe.
It's also important to remember that this isn't "rural vs. urban". I mean, sure the actual rural areas suck ass and are full to the brim with MAGA cultists who hate anyone who isn't a cis het white Christian man, but they're so depopulated they mostly don't matter.
This is urban vs. suburban and exurban. The average Trump voter isn't a poor redneck hick, that's a classist delusion held by Democrats who don't want to look at reality. The average Trump voter is a suburban or exurban professional. Trump voters had an average income roughly $10,000/year HIGHER than Biden voters in the last election.
I dunno if they actually really want a civil war or not. I've been convinced for a while that the Republicans are slowly ratcheting things up by taking action that's just barely below the level that would kick off a civil war then letting that become the new normal before pushing again.
But maybe now they're impatient? Especially since they are on the wrong end of the demographic shift.
I'm pretty sure the real questions will be answered when we see just how broadly the Supreme Court sustains Kacsmaryk's decision. He seems to be going for the broadest, most damaging, way he can possibly ban abortion pills, whether the Court will back that or limit the ruling to just abortion pills rather than encouraging more is where we'll see how bad this is.
TL;DR: Kacsmaryk is guaranteed to rule against abortion, the real question is how much damage the Supreme Court will encourage when it sustains his decision.
posted by sotonohito at 5:25 AM on March 22, 2023 [52 favorites]
This case is the perfect place for the executive to pick up the club that is the Good Behavior clause. No standing, past statute of limitations, hail mary move to sidestep administrative avenues, and on and on. What form that takes? No idea! But we are IN THE CRISIS so something like proroguing a justice until Congress can evaluate their behavior should be a clear threat.
posted by Slackermagee at 5:28 AM on March 22, 2023 [7 favorites]
posted by Slackermagee at 5:28 AM on March 22, 2023 [7 favorites]
It’s blinding you to the very real fact that, save for a small few people left at the top, the right-wing hate parade is overwhelmingly being led by far younger monsters.
Sure, you're not wrong. But neither are demographics. While there are many Gen Xers who support theocracy, and they're just as rabid as the Boomers, there are way, way fewer of them then there are of theocratic Boomers. While there are some Millennials, and they're just as rabid, they're wildly outnumbered. While there are a very few Gen Zers, holy cow are they outnumbered.
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 5:44 AM on March 22, 2023 [5 favorites]
Sure, you're not wrong. But neither are demographics. While there are many Gen Xers who support theocracy, and they're just as rabid as the Boomers, there are way, way fewer of them then there are of theocratic Boomers. While there are some Millennials, and they're just as rabid, they're wildly outnumbered. While there are a very few Gen Zers, holy cow are they outnumbered.
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 5:44 AM on March 22, 2023 [5 favorites]
Which means they'd probably use the same contorted logic to come after HRT for trans people (but not the cis!) and PReP for sexually active people. States rights in the same way they view parental rights... only so long as it agrees with their regressive, prudish, fearful, and narrow views of the world.
posted by kokaku at 5:46 AM on March 22, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by kokaku at 5:46 AM on March 22, 2023 [4 favorites]
Sure, you're not wrong. But neither are demographics.
Demographics won't save us. Republicans are limiting access to voting, gerrymandering legislative districts, diminishing the power of statewide-elected officials in favor of legislatures, and a whole host of other things to guarantee the power of their minority. Whatever the demographic trends are, they've already been baked-in and won't have the same the impact they otherwise would and we would be foolish to rely on them.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 5:57 AM on March 22, 2023 [19 favorites]
Demographics won't save us. Republicans are limiting access to voting, gerrymandering legislative districts, diminishing the power of statewide-elected officials in favor of legislatures, and a whole host of other things to guarantee the power of their minority. Whatever the demographic trends are, they've already been baked-in and won't have the same the impact they otherwise would and we would be foolish to rely on them.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 5:57 AM on March 22, 2023 [19 favorites]
While there are many Gen Xers who support theocracy, and they're just as rabid as the Boomers, there are way, way fewer of them then there are of theocratic Boomers. While there are some Millennials, and they're just as rabid, they're wildly outnumbered. While there are a very few Gen Zers, holy cow are they outnumbered.
The rabid are never the outright majority; they are simply the loudest and cruelest.
But they never need an outright majority. They just need to be part of a coalition that has power (which is trivially easy in many places), to install their people in the right places to steer that coalition's actions, and to ride the shifting tides of culture war until the numbers are right to strike.
Joe R. Schmo in Texas may disapprove of outright theocratic behavior, but if the alternative is letting the dreaded THEM into power, with all that his Mirror Universe Media sources tell him that implies? He will vote for the representatives that will back the theocratic coalition 100 times out of 100.
posted by delfin at 6:01 AM on March 22, 2023 [19 favorites]
The rabid are never the outright majority; they are simply the loudest and cruelest.
But they never need an outright majority. They just need to be part of a coalition that has power (which is trivially easy in many places), to install their people in the right places to steer that coalition's actions, and to ride the shifting tides of culture war until the numbers are right to strike.
Joe R. Schmo in Texas may disapprove of outright theocratic behavior, but if the alternative is letting the dreaded THEM into power, with all that his Mirror Universe Media sources tell him that implies? He will vote for the representatives that will back the theocratic coalition 100 times out of 100.
posted by delfin at 6:01 AM on March 22, 2023 [19 favorites]
It’s blinding you to the very real fact that, save for a small few people left at the top, the right-wing hate parade is overwhelmingly being led by far younger monsters.
Sure, you're not wrong. But neither are demographics. While there are many Gen Xers who support theocracy, and they're just as rabid as the Boomers, there are way, way fewer of them then there are of theocratic Boomers. While there are some Millennials, and they're just as rabid, they're wildly outnumbered. While there are a very few Gen Zers, holy cow are they outnumbered.
I know there is a very obvious distribution of ideals, but we also see evidence of people becoming more conservative as they get older, when their ideals were liberal based on the standards of when they were younger. Maybe GenZ hasnt had life smack them in the face enough to retreat to a place of fear yet. They dont own enough property yet to see the police as enforcing their property rights. I actually dont have very much faith that "when the old people die off [insert whatever problem will get solved]", many people become more conservative as they get older, either through movement of what it means to be conservative or by reacting to life by retreating to fear.
I also will point to a comment I made last year that not everyone who doesn't vote is a democrat or liberal. Record turnout in 2022, Trump got 9M more votes, about the same % as he got in 2016 (actually increased from 46.1 to 46.8). Increasing voter turnout is not going to save us (I think it was the lack of 3rd party candidates in 2020 that made the difference). We really do need to convince people to change their ideals.
My ray of hope is what happens when they come after birth control. Abortions are something that happens rarely (even for the 1/3 of women who will or have had one, its generally a single point in time in your life), while birth control is used every single day. Even conservative women are incredibly independent compared to women of 60-70 years ago, and I dont know how many really want to go back there (vs are saying so to get in good with their conservative friends). Same as "the only moral abortion is my abortion", except just about every woman in America uses birth control.
posted by LizBoBiz at 6:14 AM on March 22, 2023 [7 favorites]
Sure, you're not wrong. But neither are demographics. While there are many Gen Xers who support theocracy, and they're just as rabid as the Boomers, there are way, way fewer of them then there are of theocratic Boomers. While there are some Millennials, and they're just as rabid, they're wildly outnumbered. While there are a very few Gen Zers, holy cow are they outnumbered.
I know there is a very obvious distribution of ideals, but we also see evidence of people becoming more conservative as they get older, when their ideals were liberal based on the standards of when they were younger. Maybe GenZ hasnt had life smack them in the face enough to retreat to a place of fear yet. They dont own enough property yet to see the police as enforcing their property rights. I actually dont have very much faith that "when the old people die off [insert whatever problem will get solved]", many people become more conservative as they get older, either through movement of what it means to be conservative or by reacting to life by retreating to fear.
I also will point to a comment I made last year that not everyone who doesn't vote is a democrat or liberal. Record turnout in 2022, Trump got 9M more votes, about the same % as he got in 2016 (actually increased from 46.1 to 46.8). Increasing voter turnout is not going to save us (I think it was the lack of 3rd party candidates in 2020 that made the difference). We really do need to convince people to change their ideals.
My ray of hope is what happens when they come after birth control. Abortions are something that happens rarely (even for the 1/3 of women who will or have had one, its generally a single point in time in your life), while birth control is used every single day. Even conservative women are incredibly independent compared to women of 60-70 years ago, and I dont know how many really want to go back there (vs are saying so to get in good with their conservative friends). Same as "the only moral abortion is my abortion", except just about every woman in America uses birth control.
posted by LizBoBiz at 6:14 AM on March 22, 2023 [7 favorites]
come after HRT for trans people
Ironically enough, my backup source for estradiol is in Texas. Had to figure that one out when there was a shortage a few months ago (part of the ongoing saga of terrible availability of trans health care).
posted by Flight Hardware, do not touch at 6:18 AM on March 22, 2023 [6 favorites]
Ironically enough, my backup source for estradiol is in Texas. Had to figure that one out when there was a shortage a few months ago (part of the ongoing saga of terrible availability of trans health care).
posted by Flight Hardware, do not touch at 6:18 AM on March 22, 2023 [6 favorites]
Which means they'd probably use the same contorted logic to come after HRT for trans people (but not the cis!) and PReP for sexually active people.
Oh, I can tell you I know a lot of trans people watching this case carefully. I get my HRT through a mail-order service (which includes blood tests and counseling, for which I am grateful), and it could be shut down hard if this schmendrick rules the way he’s expected to. There’s also people who go grey market who are more scared.
But as I said to my wife last night, who is scared about the nutcases coming after me: “I was one of the nerds who got beat up a lot, and I bet I still have a bunch of my old tricks.” And so are a lot of trans people. We need to teach those to the people stuck in place who need it, and a lot of those tricks are the kind of dirty trick the radical right should be scared of.
posted by mephron at 6:22 AM on March 22, 2023 [9 favorites]
Oh, I can tell you I know a lot of trans people watching this case carefully. I get my HRT through a mail-order service (which includes blood tests and counseling, for which I am grateful), and it could be shut down hard if this schmendrick rules the way he’s expected to. There’s also people who go grey market who are more scared.
But as I said to my wife last night, who is scared about the nutcases coming after me: “I was one of the nerds who got beat up a lot, and I bet I still have a bunch of my old tricks.” And so are a lot of trans people. We need to teach those to the people stuck in place who need it, and a lot of those tricks are the kind of dirty trick the radical right should be scared of.
posted by mephron at 6:22 AM on March 22, 2023 [9 favorites]
> "Record turnout in 2022, Trump got 9M more votes"
I do take your point, but he also lost. The vote share for the Democrats went up by 15M. And there was a Libertarian and a Green candidate just as there had been 4 years prior. Increasing vote turnout *alone* won't save us, but it does matter and there's a reason the Republicans prefer it when fewer people vote.
posted by kyrademon at 6:22 AM on March 22, 2023 [8 favorites]
I do take your point, but he also lost. The vote share for the Democrats went up by 15M. And there was a Libertarian and a Green candidate just as there had been 4 years prior. Increasing vote turnout *alone* won't save us, but it does matter and there's a reason the Republicans prefer it when fewer people vote.
posted by kyrademon at 6:22 AM on March 22, 2023 [8 favorites]
I know there is a very obvious distribution of ideals, but we also see evidence of people becoming more conservative as they get older
This has become untrue for anyone born after about 1980. There's very clear evidence that people have stopped becoming more conservative as they age.
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 6:26 AM on March 22, 2023 [14 favorites]
This has become untrue for anyone born after about 1980. There's very clear evidence that people have stopped becoming more conservative as they age.
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 6:26 AM on March 22, 2023 [14 favorites]
This is probably in one of the links above, but it bears repeating that mifepristone is not only an abortion bill. it can also help the body (along with misoprostol) pass a totally natural miscarriage. without it women can face infection, infertility or even death from a brief pregnancy. This is a ware on all women and anyone with a uterus.
I feel like I have already seen a bunch of stories with conversation women having to travel out of state because of complications with very wanted pregnancies. How many "I am now infertile because judges block access to routine medicine" do we need to add to that.
On the generation note, I unfortunate know a decent number of very conservative folks in their 30's, include one on the natural foods to anti-vax to qanon track.
posted by CostcoCultist at 6:31 AM on March 22, 2023 [17 favorites]
I feel like I have already seen a bunch of stories with conversation women having to travel out of state because of complications with very wanted pregnancies. How many "I am now infertile because judges block access to routine medicine" do we need to add to that.
On the generation note, I unfortunate know a decent number of very conservative folks in their 30's, include one on the natural foods to anti-vax to qanon track.
posted by CostcoCultist at 6:31 AM on March 22, 2023 [17 favorites]
Things Democratic Party leadership should have been doing in prep for the Supreme Court ruling and should be doing right now in prep for this ruling:
- Convene a meeting of progressive state governors to make a plan for a state-by-state abortion access compact
- Prepare a forceful, unequivocal public statement to release the day of the ruling outlining a joint plan to fight back, they should be obtaining co-signers/endorsers on this "Pledge to Protect Freedom" or whatever they call it, and shaming any nervous Dems who fail to sign on
- Be hitting the press circuit normalizing the concept of court packing
- Proactively passing our own laws protecting body autonomy, sharing legislative language state to state
- Directing federal and state agencies that are appointed by Dems to take the most abortion-forward interpretation of all policies
- Hosting town halls, press conferences, webinars and legislative hearings on the necessity of body autonomy and abortion access. Making the case to the public that having control over our bodies - from trans-affirming healthcare to abortion - is a basic American Freedom
Things they are doing: Sending fundraising emails.
posted by latkes at 6:47 AM on March 22, 2023 [36 favorites]
- Convene a meeting of progressive state governors to make a plan for a state-by-state abortion access compact
- Prepare a forceful, unequivocal public statement to release the day of the ruling outlining a joint plan to fight back, they should be obtaining co-signers/endorsers on this "Pledge to Protect Freedom" or whatever they call it, and shaming any nervous Dems who fail to sign on
- Be hitting the press circuit normalizing the concept of court packing
- Proactively passing our own laws protecting body autonomy, sharing legislative language state to state
- Directing federal and state agencies that are appointed by Dems to take the most abortion-forward interpretation of all policies
- Hosting town halls, press conferences, webinars and legislative hearings on the necessity of body autonomy and abortion access. Making the case to the public that having control over our bodies - from trans-affirming healthcare to abortion - is a basic American Freedom
Things they are doing: Sending fundraising emails.
posted by latkes at 6:47 AM on March 22, 2023 [36 favorites]
Really nice post by the way. You coulda just posted a single headline, instead you went deep.
posted by latkes at 6:47 AM on March 22, 2023 [12 favorites]
posted by latkes at 6:47 AM on March 22, 2023 [12 favorites]
This has become untrue for anyone born after about 1980. There's very clear evidence that people have stopped becoming more conservative as they age.
Which is nice, but also not as useful as it sounds.
These people don't need to evolve into raging archconservatives; they merely need to be just conservative enough to favor the party that happens to contain those, but which they perceive to serve their interests better, over the party that doesn't.
They need to register raging archconservatives and theocrats within their party as an active threat.
They need to recognize the ripple effect that a party containing those winning elections can have... such as, let's say, a single troglodyte theocrat judge in Texas potentially wielding veto power over women's health concerns nationwide.
They need to understand the stakes, in that theocracy doesn't need to maintain continuous dominance for decades to enact lasting harm; it only needs to win once at key points of the national framework, and that the party containing theocrats winning n 50%+1 battles at all levels is equivalent to theocrats winning those battles if the non-zealot representatives consistently vote with the zealots.
And they need to care more about that as they get older than, let's say, who might raise their property taxes or recognize the rights of other groups whom they don't personally admire all that much.
posted by delfin at 7:14 AM on March 22, 2023 [6 favorites]
Which is nice, but also not as useful as it sounds.
These people don't need to evolve into raging archconservatives; they merely need to be just conservative enough to favor the party that happens to contain those, but which they perceive to serve their interests better, over the party that doesn't.
They need to register raging archconservatives and theocrats within their party as an active threat.
They need to recognize the ripple effect that a party containing those winning elections can have... such as, let's say, a single troglodyte theocrat judge in Texas potentially wielding veto power over women's health concerns nationwide.
They need to understand the stakes, in that theocracy doesn't need to maintain continuous dominance for decades to enact lasting harm; it only needs to win once at key points of the national framework, and that the party containing theocrats winning n 50%+1 battles at all levels is equivalent to theocrats winning those battles if the non-zealot representatives consistently vote with the zealots.
And they need to care more about that as they get older than, let's say, who might raise their property taxes or recognize the rights of other groups whom they don't personally admire all that much.
posted by delfin at 7:14 AM on March 22, 2023 [6 favorites]
I have said before, and will say again, the GOP wants to return to antebellum America. Full stop. Re-engaging a law from 1873 brings them one step closer to their goal. Imagine governing like it was 1850. Why only try to destroy the New Deal, which is only 85 years old, when you can wipe the slate clean by removing 170 years of progress?
posted by zerobyproxy at 7:20 AM on March 22, 2023 [14 favorites]
posted by zerobyproxy at 7:20 AM on March 22, 2023 [14 favorites]
I'm kind of at the point where I wonder at how much these threads are useful. At least before the decision happens it feels like we go from hand-wringing to arguments we've had a million times before about demographics or whatever.
So instead I'm going to ask that we think about not just women and trans people but anyone you know who takes a drug someone horrible might object to. AIDS drugs. Drugs that used fetal cells lines. Drugs that counteract overdoses or help addicts. Drugs for sickle cell anemia. Drugs that combat mental illness. Vaccines of all types.
The ramifications of one actor or set of actors being able to overrule the FDA nationwide are huge. It's hard to wrap my head around.
posted by emjaybee at 7:57 AM on March 22, 2023 [27 favorites]
So instead I'm going to ask that we think about not just women and trans people but anyone you know who takes a drug someone horrible might object to. AIDS drugs. Drugs that used fetal cells lines. Drugs that counteract overdoses or help addicts. Drugs for sickle cell anemia. Drugs that combat mental illness. Vaccines of all types.
The ramifications of one actor or set of actors being able to overrule the FDA nationwide are huge. It's hard to wrap my head around.
posted by emjaybee at 7:57 AM on March 22, 2023 [27 favorites]
emjaybee I'd say it's all back to the core essence of right vs left thinking.
The right wants hierarchy and everything to be a matter of individual virtue. I'm confident that they don't see the possible threat to any of the medications you mentioned as a bad thing, but rather as a good thing because it will help weed out the people they see as weak, divergent, or deviant.
They want people to die from AIDS. They want people to commit suicide from untreated mental illness. They want addicts to die. And there's a reason why the anti-vax stuff has such a strong appeal to the Q types: becuse it buys into their Social Darwinism and their view that anyone "weak" should be culled. If you can't survive [insert disease here] they think that means you aren't worthy of life.
Not that the average Republican has thought it through or antyhing, they've just got a sort of vague gut feeling that wimpiness should be punished and strength revered.
But thought through or not, I don't see the Republicans having any reservations, hesitations, or regrets if their quest to criminalize abortion also opens the floodgates to limiting or ending medications of other sorts.
COVID showed us that even when they personally get sick they'll often prioritize their ideology over their own lives, so prioritizing their ideology over the lives of people they hate? That's easy.
posted by sotonohito at 8:23 AM on March 22, 2023 [11 favorites]
The right wants hierarchy and everything to be a matter of individual virtue. I'm confident that they don't see the possible threat to any of the medications you mentioned as a bad thing, but rather as a good thing because it will help weed out the people they see as weak, divergent, or deviant.
They want people to die from AIDS. They want people to commit suicide from untreated mental illness. They want addicts to die. And there's a reason why the anti-vax stuff has such a strong appeal to the Q types: becuse it buys into their Social Darwinism and their view that anyone "weak" should be culled. If you can't survive [insert disease here] they think that means you aren't worthy of life.
Not that the average Republican has thought it through or antyhing, they've just got a sort of vague gut feeling that wimpiness should be punished and strength revered.
But thought through or not, I don't see the Republicans having any reservations, hesitations, or regrets if their quest to criminalize abortion also opens the floodgates to limiting or ending medications of other sorts.
COVID showed us that even when they personally get sick they'll often prioritize their ideology over their own lives, so prioritizing their ideology over the lives of people they hate? That's easy.
posted by sotonohito at 8:23 AM on March 22, 2023 [11 favorites]
I'm familiar with the Comstock laws. For forty-two years, Anthony Comstock, Postal Inspector of the United States, used it to be the biggest censor in the land, working tirelessly to suppress birth control, women's suffrage, labor organizers, anarchists, pacifists, religious minorities (Jehovah's Witnesses and Pentecostals), and gynecology. J. Edgar Hoover's was a protege of Comstock, and much of Hoover's early rise was due to Comstock's patronage.
A few years after Anthony Comstock founded the New York Society for the Suppression of Vice (in 1873), he became the U.S. Post Office's special enforcer of a federal anti-obscenity law which he himself had created.posted by Servo5678 at 8:32 AM on March 22, 2023 [10 favorites]
"The problem," Uncle John explains in his Absolutely Absorbing Bathroom Reader, "was that Comstock seemed to think just about everything was obscene. He had Walt Whitman fired from the Department of the Interior for writing Leaves of Grass... He even arrested a woman for calling her husband a spitbub (rascal) on a postcard...
"Comstock eventually developed a reputation as a kook. In 1915, he hauled some department store window dressers into court for dressing their naked mannequins in full view of the shopping public..."
"Mr. Comstock," the judge was moved to exclaim at one point during the trial, "I think you're nuts!"
And the right learned from that experience. Put the judges in place first.
posted by Naberius at 8:48 AM on March 22, 2023 [9 favorites]
posted by Naberius at 8:48 AM on March 22, 2023 [9 favorites]
Dahlia Lithwick had a guest recently, Michael Podhorzer, who is trying to get people to focus on the system problems rather than the case-by-case, who won this round, horserace types of discussion. Talking about generations seems somewhat similar. This is a product of a system that allows this to happen, and will continue to happen, unless the systemic issues are dealt with.
From his writing:
"Yet for the most part, media coverage of SCOTUS continues to focus on the details of the individual cases on the docket: the arguments each side is putting forth, the likelihood that certain justices will find those arguments persuasive, and what a “win” for either side could look like. In the context of our current crisis, however, doing this is like narrating each segment of a bullet’s trajectory without naming the assassin or his target. "
posted by idb at 8:54 AM on March 22, 2023 [12 favorites]
From his writing:
"Yet for the most part, media coverage of SCOTUS continues to focus on the details of the individual cases on the docket: the arguments each side is putting forth, the likelihood that certain justices will find those arguments persuasive, and what a “win” for either side could look like. In the context of our current crisis, however, doing this is like narrating each segment of a bullet’s trajectory without naming the assassin or his target. "
posted by idb at 8:54 AM on March 22, 2023 [12 favorites]
I'm pretty uncomfortable with a Texas judge (federal or otherwise) being given the right to decide what medications I have access to outside of Texas. I hope others are similarly troubled.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 8:54 AM on March 22, 2023 [20 favorites]
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 8:54 AM on March 22, 2023 [20 favorites]
The downstream effects of this are myriad. Beyond the obvious effect on abortion access, if a single district court judge is able to reverse an FDA decision on substantive grounds, and if that decision is upheld by SCOTUS, that will do a lot of damage to the doctrine of deference to administrative expertise (i.e. Chevron deference).
We will creep ever closer to having no administrative state because nothing that the established bureaucracy determines will be respected in the courts.
And this is exactly what the Kochs and all their ilk want. They want to remove the ability of agencies like the Bureau of Land Management, the Forest Service, the FDA, and the EPA to enforce rules that affect their bottom line. The FDIC warned SVB 18 months ago that it was risking failure, but the bank refused to comply and only an emergency infusion of our money saved those wealthy depositors.
This is the system working as intended.
posted by suelac at 9:15 AM on March 22, 2023 [21 favorites]
We will creep ever closer to having no administrative state because nothing that the established bureaucracy determines will be respected in the courts.
And this is exactly what the Kochs and all their ilk want. They want to remove the ability of agencies like the Bureau of Land Management, the Forest Service, the FDA, and the EPA to enforce rules that affect their bottom line. The FDIC warned SVB 18 months ago that it was risking failure, but the bank refused to comply and only an emergency infusion of our money saved those wealthy depositors.
This is the system working as intended.
posted by suelac at 9:15 AM on March 22, 2023 [21 favorites]
But they never need an outright majority. They just need to be part of a coalition that has power (which is trivially easy in many places), to install their people in the right places to steer that coalition's actions, and to ride the shifting tides of culture war until the numbers are right to strike.
So what I'm figuring here is that if we care about something, we can make it better, too.
posted by aniola at 9:47 AM on March 22, 2023 [5 favorites]
So what I'm figuring here is that if we care about something, we can make it better, too.
posted by aniola at 9:47 AM on March 22, 2023 [5 favorites]
Anthony Comstock. If only he had been fragged by his fellow soldiers in the 1st Civil War.
posted by Aardvark Cheeselog at 10:04 AM on March 22, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by Aardvark Cheeselog at 10:04 AM on March 22, 2023 [3 favorites]
This is not about abortion, women's rights, gay rights or trans rights, this is about dismantling the United States as a regulatory agency. They don't care about abortion, just about removing regulation. If the FDA cannot regulate drugs then the EPA cannot regulate pollution, and more importantly, the SEC cannot regulate finances and the DOL cannot regulate labor.
They don't want to go after gays or trans people or women or white people or black people they want to remove all protections from all people to enshrine power in capital.
posted by kzin602 at 10:34 AM on March 22, 2023 [13 favorites]
They don't want to go after gays or trans people or women or white people or black people they want to remove all protections from all people to enshrine power in capital.
posted by kzin602 at 10:34 AM on March 22, 2023 [13 favorites]
There are cases where the primary goal is to stop regulation (such as West Virginia vs. EPA last year). This is not one of them--it will add a regulatory layers by letting judges and states pile on even after federal approval. It does nothing to limit the authority of the FDA to stop drug distribution, it just says that even if you convince the FDA any random judge can pull up any random law if he doesn't like it. There's no profit in this for big capital, in fact it's a nightmare from their point of view.
The misogyny, homophobia, transphobia, etc. are real and the motivating factor here.
posted by mark k at 11:05 AM on March 22, 2023 [14 favorites]
The misogyny, homophobia, transphobia, etc. are real and the motivating factor here.
posted by mark k at 11:05 AM on March 22, 2023 [14 favorites]
I'm gonna have to disagree, they really do want to go after gays and transfolk and any other minority. Dismantling democracy is just a nice benefit to them.
posted by Blienmeis at 11:51 AM on March 22, 2023 [7 favorites]
posted by Blienmeis at 11:51 AM on March 22, 2023 [7 favorites]
kzin602, this really is a why not both situation. It may have been true once upon a time that the business wing of the GOP ran things and regulations were the primary concern. But they made their deal with the devil evangelicals, and now it's pretty clear the hateful religious nutters are running the show over there and are primarily motivated by coming after anyone who deviates from their narrow view of normality.
posted by kokaku at 12:01 PM on March 22, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by kokaku at 12:01 PM on March 22, 2023 [5 favorites]
Post something you're doing to stop this stuff and let's count every +1 as a high five.
posted by pelvicsorcery at 12:46 PM on March 22, 2023
posted by pelvicsorcery at 12:46 PM on March 22, 2023
So what I'm figuring here is that if we care about something, we can make it better, too.
In sufficient numbers, with sufficient fury? Of course we can. We just have to clear one little hurdle, that being that vehemence counts as much as party registration.
People do things, including registering to vote and actually going out and voting, when they feel compelled by a reasonably strong motivation. As I like to put it, when they (or their family, or their friends, or their coworkers, or other people they happen to know, in decreasing order of impetus) are personally affected by something (either positively or negatively; in their daily life, in their wallet, in their job, in their personal freedoms, in their civil rights, etc.) and voting promises to be a meaningful step towards that (if the other guy gets in, my life is going to decline; if my guy gets in, it's going to improve in some way).
The other side? Their zealots are motivated because somewhere out there, they toss and turn and are unable to sleep at night knowing that an LGBT+ person walks free and is happy, or abortion remains legal, or they can't buy an M60 at their local grocery store, or someone they dislike is having a halfway-decent orgasm. The mere existence of those affronts to all that is good and pure infuriate them so much that they get out to vote to stop them without fail.
We need people on the left and in the center who feel just as motivated, even when they themselves aren't the ones in need of immediate assistance and relief.
posted by delfin at 12:52 PM on March 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
In sufficient numbers, with sufficient fury? Of course we can. We just have to clear one little hurdle, that being that vehemence counts as much as party registration.
People do things, including registering to vote and actually going out and voting, when they feel compelled by a reasonably strong motivation. As I like to put it, when they (or their family, or their friends, or their coworkers, or other people they happen to know, in decreasing order of impetus) are personally affected by something (either positively or negatively; in their daily life, in their wallet, in their job, in their personal freedoms, in their civil rights, etc.) and voting promises to be a meaningful step towards that (if the other guy gets in, my life is going to decline; if my guy gets in, it's going to improve in some way).
The other side? Their zealots are motivated because somewhere out there, they toss and turn and are unable to sleep at night knowing that an LGBT+ person walks free and is happy, or abortion remains legal, or they can't buy an M60 at their local grocery store, or someone they dislike is having a halfway-decent orgasm. The mere existence of those affronts to all that is good and pure infuriate them so much that they get out to vote to stop them without fail.
We need people on the left and in the center who feel just as motivated, even when they themselves aren't the ones in need of immediate assistance and relief.
posted by delfin at 12:52 PM on March 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
So what I'm figuring here is that if we care about something, we can make it better, too.
We can't really though. I mean, this one judge is about to set policy for the entire country. There are multiple cases where localities are ignoring state regulations, and others where the state government is dismantling worker protections, and others where the Feds are doing it.
It's far easier to do bad than it is to do good, and the evilest Republicans are richer, smarter, and more crafty than the average liberal.
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:28 PM on March 22, 2023 [5 favorites]
We can't really though. I mean, this one judge is about to set policy for the entire country. There are multiple cases where localities are ignoring state regulations, and others where the state government is dismantling worker protections, and others where the Feds are doing it.
It's far easier to do bad than it is to do good, and the evilest Republicans are richer, smarter, and more crafty than the average liberal.
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:28 PM on March 22, 2023 [5 favorites]
The trick is not so much to wait for the boomers to die off as to motivate Democratic constituencies, including younger citizens, to vote.
If I hear this one more time, I'm going to lose my mind.
People vote. People have been voting. A Republican candidate for president has not won the popular vote since 2004. If you take that election out of the equation, since 2000 was a stolen election, then you have to go back to 1988. People that were born in 1988 have been old enough to vote for 14 years.
The Senate is a completely dysfunctional institution that has not and probably will never reflect the preferences of a majority of voters.
The House is dependent on states not fucking with the electoral system, and since the Supreme Court ruled key parts of the Voting Rights Act unconstitutional in 2013, things have only gotten worse.
Wisconsin is no longer a functioning democracy.
The Supreme Court is acting as an unelected superjudiciary making wildly unpopular decisions that are literally killing people.
And now we have Republican AGs filing lawsuits to force their deeply unpopular laws on the rest of the country.
I don't think voting fixes any of this. I don't know what does.
I do know that the last time the states were pitted against each other to this degree, we had a literal war about it.
posted by rhymedirective at 2:07 PM on March 22, 2023 [20 favorites]
If I hear this one more time, I'm going to lose my mind.
People vote. People have been voting. A Republican candidate for president has not won the popular vote since 2004. If you take that election out of the equation, since 2000 was a stolen election, then you have to go back to 1988. People that were born in 1988 have been old enough to vote for 14 years.
The Senate is a completely dysfunctional institution that has not and probably will never reflect the preferences of a majority of voters.
The House is dependent on states not fucking with the electoral system, and since the Supreme Court ruled key parts of the Voting Rights Act unconstitutional in 2013, things have only gotten worse.
Wisconsin is no longer a functioning democracy.
The Supreme Court is acting as an unelected superjudiciary making wildly unpopular decisions that are literally killing people.
And now we have Republican AGs filing lawsuits to force their deeply unpopular laws on the rest of the country.
I don't think voting fixes any of this. I don't know what does.
I do know that the last time the states were pitted against each other to this degree, we had a literal war about it.
posted by rhymedirective at 2:07 PM on March 22, 2023 [20 favorites]
We can't really though. I mean, this one judge is about to set policy for the entire country.
In response, I cite this entire ask-me thread.
posted by aniola at 2:42 PM on March 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
In response, I cite this entire ask-me thread.
posted by aniola at 2:42 PM on March 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
I just want to follow up and acknowledge and remember the hard work of the generations of original abortion rights activists in the face of extensive opposition.
posted by aniola at 3:30 PM on March 22, 2023 [12 favorites]
posted by aniola at 3:30 PM on March 22, 2023 [12 favorites]
Does anybody know when a decision is expected?
posted by newdaddy at 5:18 PM on March 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by newdaddy at 5:18 PM on March 22, 2023 [1 favorite]
i'm guessing big pharma is speaking to kacsmaryk now. imagine a cage match between soulless drug-industry lobbyists and dominionists -- vampire squid vs. feudal theocracy...
posted by kliuless at 3:21 AM on March 23, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by kliuless at 3:21 AM on March 23, 2023 [3 favorites]
The US has several armed militias and a lot of extremists with a lot of guns. Pro-corporate, Hard Right conservatives dominate the Supreme Court. The Culture Wars are a hot mess successfully dividing the country. Trans and other LGBT folks are under attack. There's a concerted effort to ban books and attack teachers and librarians and public education is under attack. If you don't see it as civil war or the ramp-up to some sort or civil war, you are working hard at not paying attention.
posted by theora55 at 11:25 AM on March 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by theora55 at 11:25 AM on March 27, 2023 [2 favorites]
We officially have dueling orders from the TX and WA cases, both rescinding the FDA approval of mifepristone (TX) and barring the FDA from changing its status (WA). Happy Friday, enjoy those family Easter get togethers!
posted by the primroses were over at 4:22 PM on April 7, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by the primroses were over at 4:22 PM on April 7, 2023 [5 favorites]
‘A gamechanger’: this simple device could help fight the war on abortion rights in the US
posted by tiny frying pan at 10:24 AM on April 18, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by tiny frying pan at 10:24 AM on April 18, 2023 [1 favorite]
That's a really interesting article tiny frying pan, thanks for the link! Might be worth reposting in the newer abortion FPP or even as a new post, since this one pumpkins in a few days.
From the article:
posted by the primroses were over at 11:46 AM on April 18, 2023 [3 favorites]
From the article:
"Menstrual regulation”, as it came to be known – using the same manual aspiration technique that Fleischman now uses – became a sort of legal loophole, allowing safe abortions for early pregnancies.It's so interesting what does and doesn't count as an abortion, depending on who needs one and how vindictive the state wants to be.
By 1974, menstrual regulation was legal and by 1979, Bangladesh started providing the procedure through its national family planning program.
Now, one might walk through a busy street in Bangladesh and find a sign advertising menstrual regulation in a country where, at least officially, abortion is only allowed in life-threatening situations. A woman simply comes in and explains she has missed her period. She doesn’t take a pregnancy test before the procedure, and nobody asks her to. As long as she sees the clinician before 12 weeks, they will “restore her period” for her.
posted by the primroses were over at 11:46 AM on April 18, 2023 [3 favorites]
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This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
Red States Are Fighting Their Blue Cities - "Some of the biggest battles seem to be over LGBTQ rights and abortion, which fits a pattern, said Marissa Roy, head of the legal team at LSSC. She's seen such bills originate with organizations like American Legislative Exchange Council and other think tanks. But preemption laws are also inspired by whatever culture wars are raging." posted by kliuless at 12:12 AM on March 22, 2023 [2 favorites]