“Nicole Shanahan isn’t even pretending to be a serious VP candidate.”
August 20, 2024 2:41 PM   Subscribe

 
What a fucking clown. You know if the press just stopped talking about him, he'd go away entirely.

Last week: RFK Jr. reached out to Harris campaign about administration role in exchange for endorsement. Shanahan sort of denies it in this Reuters phone call but there's enough ambiguity both statements could be true. (The Harris folks didn't waste their time even having a chat.)
posted by Nelson at 2:44 PM on August 20, 2024 [18 favorites]


brainworms, brainworms everywhere.
posted by lalochezia at 2:46 PM on August 20, 2024 [24 favorites]


This is my shocked brainworms face.

Did anyone ever consider him a serious candidate? Does he have any actual positions?
posted by wenestvedt at 2:48 PM on August 20, 2024 [5 favorites]


He's anti-vax of course, and anti-woke...think that's about it?
posted by ishmael at 2:51 PM on August 20, 2024 [7 favorites]


Does he have any actual positions?

Roadkill Bears For the Environment
posted by djseafood at 2:52 PM on August 20, 2024 [17 favorites]


Does he have any actual positions?

plank
posted by phunniemee at 2:52 PM on August 20, 2024 [17 favorites]


He only ever had his surname and a bunch of far-right plutocrat money. He never was able to credibly pretend to have policy positions (other than "bring back polio" - I wonder who paid for that), lacked any relevant experience or credentials, and was as personable and appealing as getting cryptosporidiosis on vacation. He's one of the few people who on a moral level is as vile as Trump and I'm glad Harris' team wouldn't even give him the time of day.

Go away forever, failson creep and free-with-purchase social climbing cocaine hoover.
posted by Inspector.Gadget at 2:53 PM on August 20, 2024 [46 favorites]


And pro-picking-up-a-bear-off-the-side-of-the-road-then-dumping-it-framing-bicyclists-then-blaming-it-on-some-rando-woman-and-your-drunk-friends
posted by ishmael at 2:56 PM on August 20, 2024 [11 favorites]


Weird.
posted by mazola at 2:58 PM on August 20, 2024 [5 favorites]


It seems possible that this election will be decided by the relative sizes of Joe Rogan's vs Taylor Swift's fan bases. Have we tried turning it off and on again?
posted by credulous at 3:00 PM on August 20, 2024 [36 favorites]


Weird with a side of brain worms.
posted by whatevernot at 3:00 PM on August 20, 2024 [4 favorites]


Wonder how Cheryl’s doing through all this…
posted by flamk at 3:00 PM on August 20, 2024 [8 favorites]


"It is not enough to understand, or to see clearly. The future will be shaped in the arena of human activity, by those willing to commit their minds and their bodies to the task."

-Robert Kennedy
posted by clavdivs at 3:02 PM on August 20, 2024 [6 favorites]


I'm lightly annoyed that his clownishness has made me 100% unable to watch his wife in anything. Either she's part of it, or she's too stupid to get out.
posted by BlahLaLa at 3:02 PM on August 20, 2024 [13 favorites]


The Kennedys were a mistake
posted by Going To Maine at 3:03 PM on August 20, 2024 [20 favorites]


According to Behind the Bastards, he's generally pro-animal carcasses, pro-raptors, and pro-drugs.
posted by GenjiandProust at 3:06 PM on August 20, 2024 [8 favorites]


A couple of weeks ago I was returning home from our local summer festival and I was carrying a bag that had a few yard signs in it that I had picked up from the booth being operated by volunteers for an upcoming political campaign. Walking back up the hill, I stopped at a microbrewery to talk to the owner, a friend, and wound up getting pulled into a conversation by one of his customers who saw my signs and decided it was an open invitation to share her views on why Robert Kennedy, Jr., was the only candidate whose ideas really made sense.

For my friend's sake I didn't feel like I could be completely frank in my response, but the doctors assure me that my bitten tongue and severely rolled eyes should heal, given time. I plan to stay away from other Kennedy voters, if possible, so as to avoid re-injury.
posted by Nerd of the North at 3:08 PM on August 20, 2024 [26 favorites]


It makes a lot more sense to want a position with Trump’s administration than Harris’s. I mean, how could he even thought for a second she would take him seriously? Trump will want his base and he needs all of the help he can get.
posted by waving at 3:10 PM on August 20, 2024


He's antivax and pretends to be vaguely kind of liberal. Or rather non-Conservative. (Never mind some of his other statements/positions). That's pretty much it. I have a few acquaintainces who are Kennedy supporters (or at least still consider him a serious candidate for their vote): anti-vax or anti-medical-establishment; think homeopathy, reiki, etc. If they were a bit more in touch with reality they would otherwise be reliable Democratic party voters. Would backing Trump bring them over to be Trump voters? Some of them, sadly, yes.
posted by thefool at 3:12 PM on August 20, 2024 [6 favorites]


There were articles the other day about how Kennedy had reached out to the Harris team, offering to drop his candidacy in exchange for a role in her administration. They turned him down flat, so now of course he's cozying up to the fascists like the brainworm-ridden opportunist he is.

Kennedy has also been accused of sexual assault, so he should fit right in with the pussy-grabber's crew. (Note that while Kennedy says the incident occurred during his "rambunctious youth," he was actually in his 40s at the time.)
posted by Ursula Hitler at 3:27 PM on August 20, 2024 [17 favorites]


Don't threaten me with a good time.
posted by East14thTaco at 3:50 PM on August 20, 2024


Can anyone help me out here - RFK Jr in the race only hurt Trump, yes? Like, he's not peeling voters from Harris, is he? Which means the gains Harris has made will be erased if he drops/joins with Trump.

I just don't know how much more of this fucking roller coaster I can take.
posted by tzikeh at 3:50 PM on August 20, 2024 [9 favorites]


I live in a town that used to be hippie-central but has gentrified to the point that it's more goop-woo. Which means more Kennedy voters than most places. Also measles outbreaks. But if it wasn't him it'd be Jill Stein or Marianne Williamson or Ralph Nader or Ron Paul. Some people just have to be contrarian, and I don't so much mind them wasting their votes, because they don't have a lick of sense, and I don't want the Democrats to have to pander to them.
posted by rikschell at 3:53 PM on August 20, 2024 [16 favorites]


Can anyone help me out here - RFK Jr in the race only hurt Trump, yes? Like, he's not peeling voters from Harris, is he? Which means the gains Harris has made will be erased if he drops/joins with Trump.

Part of RFKjr's appeal is not being Trump or Harris. If he throws in with Trump, maybe his voters stay home or vote for another third-party candidate.

In my wilder fantasies, maybe when Trump cozies up to RFKjr he loses some persuadables to Harris.
posted by gurple at 4:00 PM on August 20, 2024 [3 favorites]


I really cannot recommend the Behind the Bastards four-part RFK jr. series highly enough, it gives a lot of context about the kennedys as american oligarchy, and enough lurid details to paint a picture of why American oligarchy is really, really bad.
posted by Jon_Evil at 4:01 PM on August 20, 2024 [31 favorites]


Isn't he just a real-life Connor Roy ?
posted by soundslikeobiwan at 4:08 PM on August 20, 2024 [11 favorites]


But if it wasn't him it'd be Jill Stein or Marianne Williamson or Ralph Nader or Ron Paul. Some people just have to be contrarian,

There can occasionally be pragmatic reasons to vote for a third party candidate. There is never a good reason to vote for Kennedy or either Paul.
posted by pattern juggler at 4:27 PM on August 20, 2024 [6 favorites]


This fundraiser social media post was making the rounds last week, and if it's real, the words "star-studded" were doing A LOT of heavy lifting.
posted by Kitteh at 4:34 PM on August 20, 2024 [4 favorites]


Maybe Trump will offer Cornel West post to piss on.
posted by 2N2222 at 4:35 PM on August 20, 2024


Which means the gains Harris has made will be erased if he drops/joins with Trump.

Based on The Hill, which is the first site I found with this data, RFK Jr. dropping out doesn’t erase the national lead. Though thanks to the Electoral College, what we really need is to see the polling changes for individual swing states.

Harris vs. Trump polls
Harris has a 3.0% lead based on 126 polls.
Aug 20, 2024
Harris: 49.4%
Trump: 46.4%


Harris vs. Trump vs. RFK Jr. polls
Harris has a 4.1% lead based on 56 polls.
Aug 20, 2024
Harris 47.9%
Trump 43.8%
Kennedy 3.2%
posted by ejs at 4:36 PM on August 20, 2024 [5 favorites]


I'm still sad about Cheryl. Such is.
posted by atomicstone at 4:40 PM on August 20, 2024 [9 favorites]


Bear meat no mind.
posted by y2karl at 4:51 PM on August 20, 2024 [1 favorite]


ejs: Though thanks to the Electoral College, what we really need is to see the polling changes for individual swing states.

Good point. I wonder how RFK Jr dropping out/joining Trump changes things in the battleground states.
posted by tzikeh at 4:54 PM on August 20, 2024 [3 favorites]


When knocking doors, I have talked to RFK supporters. They are the kind of boomer who has spent half a century applauding themselves for being anti-establishment. His primary policy plan is not being Harris or Trump. They have generally been very cool people whom I don't want voting.
posted by tofu_crouton at 4:57 PM on August 20, 2024 [28 favorites]


Putin is doing a facepalm right now. "No, that's not how I said to do it!".

His primary asset as a vote spoiling fringe candidate is his general unelectability. You don't turn around and contaminate your own campaign with the political elevator fart.
posted by CynicalKnight at 5:00 PM on August 20, 2024 [3 favorites]


He's kind of like Connor Roy from Succession, but with starving brainworms in his head and even less credibility.
posted by nikoniko at 5:03 PM on August 20, 2024 [2 favorites]


Parasitic/Brainworm 2024: This Time, Why Not The Wormst?
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 5:05 PM on August 20, 2024 [5 favorites]


Guess what?! The parasitic brainworms, they sucked his brains out!
posted by nikoniko at 5:07 PM on August 20, 2024 [6 favorites]


Most PA polls on 538 don't show a significant difference with or without third parties, but the ones that do all favor Trump. There's the caveat that third-party voters could choose a different third party candidate (or write in RFK Jr).

(Another worrying trend is the polls in general moving back towards Trump for the past week or so)
posted by dirigibleman at 5:08 PM on August 20, 2024 [3 favorites]


In SFO I saw a Tesla with a "Don't Tread on Me" sticker and a RFK Jr. sticker. I think that sums it up.
posted by credulous at 5:16 PM on August 20, 2024 [10 favorites]


Maintenance Phase also did a two-part ep. From that and from things that I've read, generally it seems that Jr. went through a serious addict phase as a young and not-so-young man, was a serious environmentalist for a while, and then took a swan dive into the woo and has been immersed in it ever since. And he's always been pretty shitty about women.
posted by Halloween Jack at 5:17 PM on August 20, 2024 [4 favorites]


this is why we choose the bear
posted by Aya Hirano on the Astral Plane at 5:17 PM on August 20, 2024 [43 favorites]


Maybe I'm overthinking it, but it seems pretty clear to me the last couple of weeks or so of his campaign have been "I'll throw the support of my dozens, dozens of loyal followers to whomever will throw me a bone post election".
posted by kjs3 at 5:19 PM on August 20, 2024 [2 favorites]


I read about Kennedy approaching Harris for a cabinet position, which is the most I've paid attention to him. It led me to look up his campaign manager, who is also a his daughter-in-law, and also a former CIA agent. Could you imagine the conspiracy theories he'd embrace if Harris's campaign was run by a spook?

I looked up the campaign manager because she said various things, including that the Democrats were stupid for not embracing "any possible path to victory," and I thought rejecting kooks seemed like one possible path to victory. The on-the-record quote seemed to pretty much confirm the overtures were real, FWIW.
posted by mark k at 5:28 PM on August 20, 2024 [5 favorites]


Why wouldn't antivaxer Brainworm Jr have gotten on the Trump train from the start? Is there much of a bargaining chip when Trump already promised to inject everyone with bleach last time we had a pandemic? Or was it the horse dewormer treatments that scared off the nematodic candidate?
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 5:32 PM on August 20, 2024 [3 favorites]


I mean, from what I understand, bear-worms are some of the worst kind of worms. Why risk it? Why eat things that give you worms? Such bad judgment. So oblivious to consequences.
posted by ishmael at 5:32 PM on August 20, 2024 [2 favorites]


I think Trump has been trying to court him ever since he figured out that Kennedy attracting the lunatic conspiracy theorists meant stealing votes from him. With all the other stuff in the past month, it's easy to forget the Kennedy/Trump call where Trump is on a long monologue about how dangerous vaccines are, and talking about being shot. It was "leaked" because Kennedy had a videographer at his house, and didn't think to tell him to stop recording or go to another room when Trump called.
posted by netowl at 5:41 PM on August 20, 2024 [3 favorites]


Does he have any actual positions?

The following is all copied directly from his site. Based only on this, I think he'd win quite a few MeFi votes. People often pay attention to only what they want to see.

Raise the minimum wage to $15, which is the equivalent to its 1967 level.
Prosecute union-busting corporations so that labor can organize and negotiate fair wages.
Expand free childcare to millions of families with programs like that pioneered by the state of New Mexico. ...we will pay 100% of care for the three million children under five who live beneath our poverty line. And we will cap the cost at 10% of family income for everyone else.
Rein in military spending and use the resources to fund infrastructure, health care, higher education, child care, and domestic prosperity.
Make student debt dischargeable in bankruptcy and cut interest rates on student loans to zero.
Shut the revolving door by executive order with a five year ban on administration officials lobbying their former government agency.
Encourage municipalities to change zoning laws to allow ancillary dwelling units (granny flats) on more properties, to make housing available, bring families together, and provide homeowners with rental income.
We will end the proxy wars, bombing campaigns, covert operations, coups, paramilitaries, and everything else that has become so normal most people don’t know it’s happening.
We have to fully fund courts, services, and border agencies to allow lawful immigration in accordance with U.S. law and deny non-compliant access, and appoint more judges to handle asylum cases.
He will get corporate influence out of the USDA, FDA, and EPA. He will lobby Congress to change the system of agricultural subsidies so that they no longer favor the biggest corporate producers.
Increased funding for mental health professionals accompanying police to help de-escalate citizens in nonviolent mental health crises.
Expand reintroduction to the community for non-violent offenders and dismantle the school-to-prison pipeline by ending suspensions being added to criminal records.
We will also take special care to ensure the civil liberties of minorities and the poor. We will end the failed War on Drugs and grant amnesty to nonviolent drug offenders. We will shut the school-to-prison pipeline, and transition prisons away from a punishment paradigm to a rehabilitation paradigm.
Kennedy’s plan to achieve tax fairness will:
- Double the child tax credit
- Restore the personal exemption of $5000
- Increase the standard deduction
- Eliminate the carried interest loophole
Mr. Kennedy will defend these worker’s rights:
The right to organize.
The right to collective bargaining.
The right to strike.
The right to meaningful wages and benefits, which includes a significant increase to the minimum wage .
The right to a healthy and safe workplace with appropriate working conditions.
The right to compensation if injured on the job.
The right to a dignified and secure retirement.
posted by Mr.Know-it-some at 5:42 PM on August 20, 2024 [17 favorites]


dirigibleman: Most PA polls on 538 don't show a significant difference with or without third parties, but the ones that do all favor Trump. There's the caveat that third-party voters could choose a different third party candidate (or write in RFK Jr).

(Another worrying trend is the polls in general moving back towards Trump for the past week or so)


This fucking campaign.

It's been a mere 30 days since Biden dropped out of the race.

I'd like to be able to order up a medically induced coma until December (I'll vote by mail first)
posted by tzikeh at 5:47 PM on August 20, 2024 [12 favorites]


He's just that desperate for anyone to take him seriously.m
posted by JustSayNoDawg at 6:03 PM on August 20, 2024


That Kennedy name counts so much for our celebrity-addled and boomer-bestraddled culture.

"They are the kind of boomer who has spent half a century applauding themselves for being anti-establishment." -tofu_crouton
posted by doctornemo at 6:23 PM on August 20, 2024 [5 favorites]


There's the caveat that third-party voters could choose a different third party candidate (or write in RFK Jr).

Or, they could stay home. I don't think the majority of poll responses from people saying they'd vote for RFK Jr were serious. In the last 24 years, the most any third-party Presidential candidate has gotten in the popular vote is about 3.5%, which was Gary Johnson, the Libertarian, in 2016. Polls saying that RFK would get 12% of the vote have had no basis in reality.

(In 1992, Ross Perot got 19%...and got zero electoral votes for his trouble. RFK Jr., however, is no Ross Perot.)
posted by gimonca at 6:27 PM on August 20, 2024 [4 favorites]


From the Politico (AKA TBOTP if you read Charlie Pierce, and you should) link:

Nicole Shanahan, Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s running mate who has invested millions of dollars of her fortune into the independent bid, said she recognized that their long-shot ticket was unlikely to win the White House this November.

I wonder what her first clue was.

We wanted to win. We wanted a fair shot. The DNC made that impossible for us.”

I had no idea the DNC was so powerful; they should do the same for Trump!
posted by TedW at 6:47 PM on August 20, 2024 [7 favorites]


Based only on this, I think he'd win quite a few MeFi votes

It's kind of odd to leave out a small but very important policy detail, especially after a global pandemic. I mean, I don't want to guess at motivations, but it's just odd, you know? Odd. Weird.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 7:07 PM on August 20, 2024 [23 favorites]


Actual position?
Raise the minimum wage to $15...

...a dignified and secure retirement.


Pretty sure he cribbed that off somebody's desk when he was slithering around pretending to be a Democrat. One of his brighter minions thought it sounded good, so they stuck it up. Bet you if a reporter cornered him and asked him to name three items on that list he couldn't do it. Brainworms.
They'll get you every time.

Maybe that whole 'eat the bear' thing was about finding another congenial cranial companion.
posted by BlueHorse at 7:40 PM on August 20, 2024 [9 favorites]


Based only on this, I think he'd win quite a few MeFi votes.

“He’s got all these great left-liberal positions, why don’t liberals like him?” coming from RFK fans is a common enough bit that I have a sincere answer for them - it doesn’t work like that. If you’re going to be an outsider candidate, it helps to have a clear brand, and his is all over the place. Yeah, he’s got an environmental platform. He’s also got a cryptocurrency platform! He’s got a bunch of “radical centrist” takes on issues like immigration or trans healthcare that will please few because people don’t actually just sit in the middle of the spectrum on those kinds of issues. The one thing that’s really indelibly associated with him is the medical crankery, which cuts across party lines but is not actually terribly popular, and his choice of running mate leans into it. If he wanted to be a Democrat he should have picked the environment as his issue. As it stands he’s only the first choice candidate of confused populists and podcasters.
posted by atoxyl at 7:50 PM on August 20, 2024 [41 favorites]


Isn't he just a real-life Connor Roy ?


RFK Jr. was interested in politics from a very young age.
posted by mmoncur at 7:56 PM on August 20, 2024


If he even considers teaming up with Trump his positions are moot; he may as well redirect to Heritage.org. It'll be like Comcast acquiring Chive TV.
posted by credulous at 8:00 PM on August 20, 2024 [4 favorites]


Cheryl

Ahh, fuck her.
posted by stevil at 8:01 PM on August 20, 2024 [2 favorites]


On my commute home tonight in a mid-sized California city, there were about three people with an enormous Kennedy poster on the overpass, waving to freeway traffic. Nobody was honking or cheering them. Funny choice of day to be out there waving the flag. I wonder who paid for the big banner?
posted by agentofselection at 8:15 PM on August 20, 2024 [3 favorites]


There can occasionally be pragmatic reasons to vote for a third party candidate.

I'm really trying hard, here, and in any standard non-ranked-choice American election, I honestly can't think of one. You're always already making it easier for your least favorite of the two major candidates to win, so any vote for a third-party candidate is pretty much the opposite of pragmatic. I mean, sometimes you'll see the argument that "getting a third party to 5% will guarantee them... something", so wasting your vote in a state where the outcome is a foregone conclusion isn't necessarily making things worse, but the minute the election starts to become even vaguely close, all the pragmatic people are going to switch away from that third party.
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 8:41 PM on August 20, 2024 [9 favorites]


Maybe that whole 'eat the bear' thing was about finding another congenial cranial companion.

MetaFilter: It was about finding another congenial cranial companion.
posted by lukemeister at 9:07 PM on August 20, 2024 [1 favorite]


When I was in Dallas for the eclipse I stopped by the Denton Free Play arcade location (I went to 'em all!).

At the NE corner of the courthouse square were some college kids with hammer & sickle flags –the local marxist cadre I assume – debating something with a random member of the public (I stayed on the opposite side of the street).

On the SE corner some middle-age dude had a Kennedy table set up. I remained on the other side of the street for that, too.
posted by torokunai at 9:12 PM on August 20, 2024 [4 favorites]


I hate the whole entitled, privileged idea of political dynasty. RFK, Jr. is a hot mess of ill-formed ideas that are trendy but not well-reasoned. If the policies on his site are really his, great. But he does not have the ability to present coherent cohesive policies and get them implemented. Nope. Nopity-Nope-Nope-Nope.

RFK's running mate suggests they can't win in November She, at least, has a firm grasp of the blindingly obvious.
posted by theora55 at 9:58 PM on August 20, 2024 [2 favorites]


Can anyone help me out here - RFK Jr in the race only hurt Trump, yes? Like, he's not peeling voters from Harris, is he?

I'm sure the reason Bannon encouraged him to run was that the Kennedy name would attract Dems. However, i think the antivax craziness was attracting more of the Trump crowd, so it kind of backfired.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 10:19 PM on August 20, 2024 [15 favorites]


There can occasionally be pragmatic reasons to vote for a third party candidate.

I'm really trying hard, here, and in any standard non-ranked-choice American election, I honestly can't think of one. You're always already making it easier for your least favorite of the two major candidates to win, so any vote for a third-party candidate is pretty much the opposite of pragmatic.


I never understood the idea that voting for 3rd party candidates is throwing away your vote. By the same token, voting for Harris in Montana is throwing away your vote because there's no chance that anybody but Trump will win that state. In fact any vote in Montana is a wasted vote because while "every vote matters", most votes don't change things. If you prefer Trump, whether you vote or not, he's going to win that state. If you prefer Harris, whether you vote or not, she's going to lose that state. It's unlikely that enough people will vote for any 3rd party candidate to send a message to anybody, but it seems more likely that will happen than that your preference of the two dominant candidates will make any difference in most states.

If you're in a swing state, sure, be pragmatic and pick the one you prefer of the two likely options, but in most places in this country it seems perfectly rational to me to vote for the candidate you'd most like to see win whether they have a shot of winning or not. Hopefully your preferred candidate isn't an anti-vax tool, but if your hot button issue is making measles great again, and you're sitting in California or Montana then I say vote for your preferred candidate.
posted by willnot at 10:56 PM on August 20, 2024 [6 favorites]


Based only on this, I think he'd win quite a few MeFi votes

Like, do you really think a policy sheet overcomes a number of other serious matters, like an antivax stance? I'm not a parasitic worm or anything, I'm just saying. Like, what is the end goal here with that? It'd be like Nazis having a policy statement on train schedules, you know what I mean?
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 11:35 PM on August 20, 2024 [12 favorites]


in most places in this country it seems perfectly rational to me to vote for the candidate you'd most like to see win whether they have a shot of winning or not

Even in many states we normally consider to be relatively safe they could actually be in play if people bother to turn out. I was fucking shocked when Biden won in Arizona and Georgia in 2020, for example.

Moreover, in this one particular instance we all have a duty, no matter what state we're in, to repudiate the idea that someone can orchestrate a coup attempt and get away with it. The best way to ensure that happens is for anyone who gives the least bit of a shit about the basic idea of democracy (of republicanism if you want to be all hurf durf about it) is to vote for Harris no matter where you live, no matter how bleak her chances of carrying your state.

It doesn't matter if you like her. It doesn't matter if you like her policies. If you would like to continue to live in a country where votes actually mean something, however little, and not one where people get to seize power through literal, not metaphorical, violence, the only rational choice is to run up the fucking score for the only person even remotely in a position to win over Trump. A narrow Harris win will be great, but only the most lopsided popular vote we've seen in decades can make it clear that we will not tolerate people who resort to extralegal means to overturn the results of our elections.

Our electoral system is pretty fucked, but given enough effort it can be changed. That won't be possible if we let people ignore the results of elections like Trump tried to do. If he succeeds in his quest to regain power we ain't coming back from that. Even if he does leave in 2029 or dies before then, we will have shown that we can't be bothered to give enough of a shit and there will be another demagogue coming shortly behind. This is how nations fall into autocracy.
posted by wierdo at 12:29 AM on August 21, 2024 [31 favorites]


the most lopsided popular vote we've seen in decades can make it clear that we will not tolerate people who resort to extralegal means to overturn the results of our elections

impressive work finding a less meaningful symbolic gesture than voting third party
posted by atoxyl at 12:52 AM on August 21, 2024 [3 favorites]



The following is all copied directly from his site. Based only on this, I think he'd win quite a few MeFi votes. People often pay attention to only what they want to see.


i mean, like other people pointed out, he's anti-trans and anti-vax.

actually, on second thought, you're right. he'd win at least 12 mefi votes.
posted by i used to be someone else at 1:02 AM on August 21, 2024 [8 favorites]


> I never understood the idea that voting for 3rd party candidates is throwing away your vote.

> Our electoral system is pretty fucked, but given enough effort it can be changed

As someone on the outside (Australia) looking in, it'd be real interesting to see what would happen to the US political system with preferential voting. Maybe you'd end up with both major parties never winning enough seats to govern independently, they'd have to form coalitions with a weird and wacky mix of minor parties or independents. If RFK Jr held the balance of power, maybe every piece of legislation passed would contain some strange pro- (animal-carcass / raptor / drug) concessions.

But, like many desirable things, how would you get to preferential voting from where you are now? It's a change that's arguably in the interest of all citizens -- it'd make it easier for citizens to elect independent / minor party representatives into houses of government -- who might better represent their interests, but switching to preferential voting is a change that's not in the interests of the two incumbent major parties who get to vote on legislation -- they'd be ceding electoral power to independents/minor parties.
posted by are-coral-made at 2:14 AM on August 21, 2024 [1 favorite]


If the policies on his site are really his,

If the policies on his site were really his, and he really cared about them, he would not allow his campaign to help Trump's in any way. ("Allow his campaign" because who even knows if he and his VP - who is herself a piece of work - and the rest of his campaign staff are even on the same page, or who's leading the show in practice or what the dynamics there are.)
posted by trig at 2:18 AM on August 21, 2024 [7 favorites]


Since no one else has said it: Christ, what an asshole!
posted by tommasz at 3:28 AM on August 21, 2024 [17 favorites]


Voting 3rd party or 'independent' is throwing away your vote.....until it isn't.

I'll try to review the Minnesota experience here without going into too much detail. In the 1998 governor's race, Jesse Ventura was elected governor with about 37% of the vote. He was able to get ballot access by filing as a candidate for the Reform Party, which was organized around Ross Perot's presidential campaigns in 1992 and 1996. Under Minnesota law, parties that get 5% or more of the vote in a statewide election automatically get ballot access in the next election.

The voting in 1998 split three ways, Ventura/Reform vs Republican vs DFL, which allowed Ventura to win with 37%.

As governor, Ventura was, really, just fine. Social liberal, fiscal conservative, made a lot of quasi-libertarian noises, didn't break anything, hired competent people to work in his administration. Didn't lean into any serious ideological weirdnesses while in office. Didn't run for a second term, said he was sick of dealing with the media.

Were there any problems with the "third party" aspect of the Ventura phenomenon? Maybe two concerns. One: it did show that a "populist" candidate could win a first-past-the-post election with more than two candidates, with not much more than a third of the vote. Maybe we were lucky that Ventura was a moderately decent guy at heart, a Trump-style candidate or similar extremist could leverage a three-way race to get into power and do real damage.

Two: After Ventura left, the Reform Party remained with major party status, which meant they got automatic ballot access. They never got a candidate with Ventura's popularity again, but Reform Party candidates continued to run and act as spoilers for at least a decade afterwards, usually taking votes away from the DFL to benefit Republicans.
posted by gimonca at 4:30 AM on August 21, 2024 [11 favorites]


Based only on this, I think he'd win quite a few MeFi votes

Like, do you really think a policy sheet overcomes a number of other serious matters


Maybe I should have bolded based only on this. For anyone who's paying attention, he's clearly a nutcase. But some of his supporters may simply have tunnel vision and pay attention only to the policies they agree with.
posted by Mr.Know-it-some at 4:30 AM on August 21, 2024 [5 favorites]


Did anyone ever consider him a serious candidate? Does he have any actual positions?

At least when he's talking its not 'no one has ever had bigger crowds than me' as a position speech. RFK jr/Biden/Trump/West/Stein are all past the USA retirement age and if you have an issue with the gerontocracy things up until Joe handed off the ticket there was only 1 candidate on multi state ballots who was under 65.

He's more serious about the possible job than Trump. Not sure why the 'I don't want to vote for Trump or Harris' crowd who'd pick RFK jr would decide to follow an endorsement of RFK jr for either Harris/Trump or why RFK jr thinks Trump would make good on a endorsement for a job promise but here we are.

it'd be real interesting to see what would happen to the US political system with preferential voting. Maybe you'd end up with both major parties never winning enough seats to govern independently

You say that like it's a bad thing. Paraphrasing Micheal Badnarik - Me being president and the House/Senate held by the other parties just means I can veto bad bills and the only things that will get through will be bills that are so popular the votes will be there to override the veto.

Joe Biden started at a time where the 2 main parties worked together VS the present legacy of tears established by Newt Gingrich. Going back towards working together wouldn't be a bad thing.
posted by rough ashlar at 4:45 AM on August 21, 2024 [1 favorite]


“ We wanted to win. We wanted a fair shot. The DNC made that impossible for us.”

I’m interpreting that as meaning the RNC helped out Kennedy-Shanahan; the DNC refused to give them the time of day.
posted by coldhotel at 4:45 AM on August 21, 2024 [3 favorites]


RFK assassinated himself
posted by hortense at 6:34 AM on August 21, 2024 [2 favorites]


Jr.
posted by hortense at 6:36 AM on August 21, 2024 [1 favorite]


His head(worm) just did that.
posted by pattern juggler at 6:39 AM on August 21, 2024


There can occasionally be pragmatic reasons to vote for a third party candidate.

I'm really trying hard, here, and in any standard non-ranked-choice American election, I honestly can't think of one. You're always already making it easier for your least favorite of the two major candidates to win, so any vote for a third-party candidate is pretty much the opposite of pragmatic.


Philadelphia City Council is required by law to give 2 out of its 7 at-large seats to a minority party which in effect guarantees Republican say on city matters regardless of vote share.

Working Families won both in 2023
posted by wanderlost at 8:31 AM on August 21, 2024 [12 favorites]


Based only on this, I think he'd win quite a few MeFi votes

Like, do you really think a policy sheet overcomes a number of other serious matters

He's more serious about the possible job than Trump.


As someone pointed out in the mega-thread, this is probably why Steve Bannon urged him to run.

For anyone not really paying attention, RFK Jr. is kinda Progressive-shaped. He kinda looks Democratic. For people that don't really want to engage in politics, but want to perceive of themselves as independent thinkers, his candidacy gives an alternative because "both sides are equally bad".

But then you got to ask yourself why he keeps associating with eldritch-horror machiavellian grifters like Steve Fucking Bannon and Roger Stone and Alex Jones. Of course Joe Rogan wants to vote for him, he's done his own research. Hey, let's give this Trump guy a fair shake.
posted by ishmael at 8:41 AM on August 21, 2024 [11 favorites]


the only rational choice is to run up the fucking score for the only person even remotely in a position to win over Trump
“The idea of a fair election — of a peaceful transition of power — is not a Democratic value. It’s not a Republican value. It, literally, is an American value. I volunteered with 7th and 8th graders a couple of months ago and we talked about the peaceful transition of power, and those kids understood it,” said Rebecca DeHart, executive director of the Democratic Party of Georgia. “It’s crazy to me that a candidate for President of the United States doesn’t. So the only way we can stamp this out is to have incredible turnout, and let it die in a corner.”

“The larger the margin, the less relevant Trump and the Trump philosophy will be post-election,” added former South Carolina governor Jim Hodges, a Clinton ally.
Clinton aims to run up the score - Politico, 10/24/2016
posted by wanderlost at 8:41 AM on August 21, 2024 [3 favorites]




Metafilter: Some people just have to be contrarian.
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 8:46 AM on August 21, 2024 [5 favorites]


Metafilter: Some people just have to be contrarian.

No they don't.
posted by Faint of Butt at 8:46 AM on August 21, 2024 [26 favorites]


As governor, Ventura was, really, just fine.

One of our greatest national tragedies is Carl Weathers passing before he could complete the Predator-stars-turned-governor trifecta.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:22 AM on August 21, 2024 [12 favorites]


I'd like to be able to order up a medically induced coma until December

I'm doing that, but with scotch.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:22 AM on August 21, 2024 [2 favorites]


RFKs support stems from the double recessive pundit square
posted by DeepSeaHaggis at 10:32 AM on August 21, 2024 [3 favorites]


I guess this is as good a place as any to plug Garry Wills' book "The Kennedy Imprisonment: A Meditation on Power." Like all Wills' books, it's great, and it also kinda makes RFK Jr. make a little more sense. The apple didn't fall that far from the tree. It just had a (brain)worm.
posted by kensington314 at 10:43 AM on August 21, 2024 [4 favorites]


really cannot recommend the Behind the Bastards four-part RFK jr. series highly enough, it gives a lot of context about the kennedys as american oligarchy

I'm still laughing about the the "ITS A KENNEDY MIRACLE!" prank story
posted by Jarcat at 12:02 PM on August 21, 2024 [2 favorites]


According to Behind the Bastards, he's generally pro-animal carcasses, pro-raptors, and pro-drugs.

I really cannot recommend the Behind the Bastards four-part RFK jr. series highly enough, it gives a lot of context about the kennedys as american oligarchy, and enough lurid details to paint a picture of why American oligarchy is really, really bad.

The great, overarching story of that podcast is that RFK Jr, between assassinations, scandals, media frenzy, and copious amounts of drugs, never had any chance of develop any proper sense of reality.
posted by Eikonaut at 12:50 PM on August 21, 2024 [6 favorites]




Now that RFK is endorsing Trump, I wonder: how many unrefrigerated cooler chests of exotic roadkill did Team Trump have to pay Bobby for his endorsement? Looks like somebody's got their bush meat fix for the month ahead.
posted by LeRoienJaune at 3:28 PM on August 21, 2024


> soundslikeobiwan: "Isn't he just a real-life Connor Roy ?"

Kind of but he's also like a character from out of It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. If anything, he's sort of a mix of Frank and Charlie (e.g.: brain worms, bear incident) and maybe a little of Mac in there too (e.g: probably juicing).
posted by mhum at 3:30 PM on August 21, 2024 [2 favorites]


Does this help Trump even a little? Seems like it might a tiny bit just because I think most of RFK JR's potential voters will switch to Trump. But were there many of them to begin with?
posted by chaz at 3:32 PM on August 21, 2024


To the surprise of absolutely nobody

RFK Jr's money comes from Putin and the Russian mob, albeit indirectly through third-party extremists like the Mellons, who seek to destabilize the United States and other democracies to their own ends. His "endorsement" should come as no surprise at all to anyone familiar with those who fund these cretins.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 3:56 PM on August 21, 2024 [5 favorites]


Does this help Trump even a little?

I think it does, by hurting him less. RFKjr was supposed to bleed votes from the Dems, but his deliberate whackadoodle unelectability proved more of a barrier to attracting unattached Dems than expected. The much lower bar of plausibility required to attract unattached Republicans meant RFKjr was now backfiring, so he needed to be absorbed by the Drumpf Reich to stem that bleed.
posted by CynicalKnight at 4:16 PM on August 21, 2024 [3 favorites]


There can occasionally be pragmatic reasons to vote for a third party candidate.

I agree there are loads of pragmatic reasons to vote for a third party candidate in local, municipal elections, especially in deep blue cities where Republicans camouflage themselves as centrist Democrats. But there are very few pragmatic reasons to vote for a third party candidate at the national level.

When you vote for a third party candidate as President, you don't vote for the Platonic ideal of a third-party candidate. You have to vote for an actually existing third party candidate. And a lot of actually existing third party candidates at the Presidential level are amateurs, flakes, and grifters.

There's Jill Stein who raised $4 million from both Greens and Democrats to pay for a last-ditch recount in 2016 but kept the money for herself, supported Syrian dictator Bashar al-Assad, and sat down to dinner with Vladimir Putin and Trump's National Security Advisor Michael Flynn.

Or there's Cornel West who burned through $15 million in earnings to leave himself with a net worth of zero, owed the US government about a half-million in taxes, referred to his donor Harlan Crow as a "staunch anti-Trump Republican", and praised Governor Ron DeSantis for his "revolutionary defense of the classics".

And don't get me started on Ralph Nader's history of antiunion treatment of his own employees or his dismissal of gay rights and reproductive rights as "gonadal politics."
posted by jonp72 at 4:42 PM on August 21, 2024 [19 favorites]


If it hurts anyone it's probably Trump, yes, but the net effect is likely minimal. It could matter if the tipping point states are decided by a quarter point or something but we really need to make sure it doesn't come to that even apart from the RFK effect. It's much harder to steal an election if you lose the tipping point states by 80,000 votes than it is if you lose 'em by 8000 votes.
posted by Justinian at 4:43 PM on August 21, 2024 [3 favorites]


The only surprising thing is that it's taken so long for RFK Jr to openly admit he's planning to try to help Trump win.
posted by sotonohito at 5:01 PM on August 21, 2024 [7 favorites]


Does this help Trump even a little?

According to this poll, it’s a 2 pt spread for Harris over Trump nationally with or without RFKjr in the race.
posted by waving at 5:07 PM on August 21, 2024


Wow I was wondering what happened to Cornel West’s campaign. He would not have benefited from additional coverage.
posted by Selena777 at 6:35 PM on August 21, 2024 [5 favorites]


> It's much harder to steal an election if you lose the tipping point states by 80,000 votes than it is if you lose 'em by 8000 votes

"What I want to do is this. I just want to find, uh, 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have, because we won the state."
posted by torokunai at 8:52 PM on August 21, 2024 [1 favorite]


I've been tracking poll numbers since January as a side hobby. I haven't been including polls that mention RFK Jr, because I assume that they don't reflect how people will really vote in November.

Honestly, if you try to squint and see if RFK Jr is (or was) pulling more support away from Trump or from Biden/Harris, it looks like a wash to me. Statistical noise, I don't think it has made much difference in one direction or the other.
posted by gimonca at 4:14 AM on August 22, 2024 [4 favorites]


he's generally pro-animal carcasses

He says he had a plan to butcher and eat the bear cub, and apparently drives around in a van that collects roadkill of opportunity. If playing entitled gotcha games with the cops is his idea of a prank, a sign of criminal psychopathy, they should again investigate anyone who went missing along one of his routes.
posted by Brian B. at 10:27 AM on August 22, 2024


it’s a 2 pt spread for Harris over Trump nationally

It's better than it was, but that's still horrifying. It's hard to be optimistic for my county when half the population embraces someone like Trump even after seeing him in action for years.
posted by tavella at 11:00 AM on August 22, 2024 [7 favorites]


I'm listening to the RFK Jr Behind the Bastards and just got to the part where RFK Jr EATS RAT EYES.

No fucking wonder he got brain worms, he's obsessed with corpses, and eating them, and I'm afraid to ask whatall else might be potentially involved.

And yet a guy like this can get married.
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:41 PM on August 22, 2024 [5 favorites]


To Cheryl Hines. Still can't get over that.
posted by ishmael at 11:14 PM on August 22, 2024 [5 favorites]


If your husband is that wackadoo, why did you marry him and why do you stay? Is she also wackadoo?
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:36 AM on August 23, 2024 [3 favorites]


I am not going to judge anybody for who there spouse is. My wife is a great person, and she's married to an idiot.

The heart has its reasons which reason knows nothing of, and all that.
posted by pattern juggler at 6:40 AM on August 23, 2024 [6 favorites]


Heh, I'm trying to train myself out of saying "the heart wants what it wants".

Dang, I used to love Woody Allen movies.
posted by ishmael at 8:32 AM on August 23, 2024 [1 favorite]


Robert F. Kennedy Jr. says he’s suspending his presidential bid and backing Donald Trump
Robert F. Kennedy said Friday he is suspending his independent presidential bid and is backing Donald Trump.

Kennedy said his internal polls had showed that his presence in the race would hurt Trump and help Democratic nominee Kamala Harris. He cited free speech, the war in Ukraine and “a war on our children” as among the reasons to try to remove his name from the ballot in battleground states.

“These are the principal causes that persuaded me to leave the Democratic Party and run as an independent and now to throw my support to President Trump,” Kennedy said.
posted by Nerd of the North at 1:00 PM on August 23, 2024 [1 favorite]


fuck that woo-peddling shitweasel
posted by lalochezia at 1:01 PM on August 23, 2024 [8 favorites]


Indeed. I look forward, though, to him realizing just how irrelevant he will turn out to be.
posted by Nerd of the North at 1:02 PM on August 23, 2024 [2 favorites]


Today, on As the Worldm Turns...
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 1:12 PM on August 23, 2024 [2 favorites]


Maybe it's not too late to replace Vance with a dead brainworm? Stranger things have happened in politics.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 5:55 PM on August 23, 2024


Maybe it's not too late to replace Vance with a dead brainworm?

I think that Monday Homunculous is doing a better job of ensuring democracy right where he is.
posted by CynicalKnight at 6:54 PM on August 23, 2024


RFK Jr. Was My Drug Dealer
posted by TedW at 4:58 AM on August 24, 2024 [2 favorites]


RFK Jr. suspends presidential campaign, but will remain on Michigan ballot this fall:

Kennedy's name will appear on the Nov. 5 general election ballot in Michigan as the Natural Law Party nominee after the third party picked him at its state convention in April, according to Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson's office. "Minor party candidates cannot withdraw, so his name will remain on the ballot."

Robert F Kennedy to remain on North Carolina ballot for now:

A spokesperson for NCSBE says the We The People Party has not informed the State Board of any changes to its nomination...Even if RFK requests to be removed, it is not a guarantee. NCSBE starts mailing out absentee ballots in two weeks and almost a third of NC counties have already started printing ballots.

RFK Jr. still likely to appear on Nevada ballot despite suspending campaign:

Kennedy would have had to withdraw by Tuesday, Aug. 20, to get off the ballot. The secretary of state’s office said Thursday that it had not received any such request from Kennedy’s campaign. A still-pending lawsuit from the Nevada Democratic Party to kick Kennedy off the ballot would presumably be the only way he would be removed from the ballot...District Court Judge James Russell asked the parties whether the case should be rendered moot given Kennedy’s campaign suspension.

CBS has a brief roundup of various polls with evidence that seems generally inconclusive about which major candidate RFK Jr.'s name would pull the most votes from:

Democrats saw a bump after swapping their nominee from President Biden to Harris, largely coming from voters who had previously expressed support for Kennedy, according to a Pew Research Center poll. Polling from Marquette Law School found that when independent candidates were included on the ballot question, Trump had a slightly larger drop in support than Harris. In an Emerson College poll, Harris' and Trump's support evenly decreased by two points with third-party candidates on the ballot. Kennedy's support dropped in recent months in both polls.

It'll be interesting to see if Nevada Dems withdraw their lawsuit there, although CBS says "a judge could issue a court order to remove him" regardless. Kennedy has asked a court to remove him in Pennsylvania. I read somewhere that Wisconsin's Election Commission is apparently meeting next week about whether his name will appear on the ballot but also read that there's no process for removing a name from the ballot in Wisconsin except for death [law prof on Twitter]. (in related news, WI Dems are pulling some technicalities out of their ass to ask the state Supreme Court to keep the Green Party off the ballot there).

The fact that Trump wants Kennedy off ballots is pretty good evidence that he hurts Trump more than Harris, although the conventional wisdom just a few months ago was the opposite. I'm not sure anyone can really know at this point.
posted by mediareport at 9:08 AM on August 24, 2024 [2 favorites]


Third party candidates poll higher than they receive in votes (Pew Research Center)
posted by Brian B. at 3:33 PM on August 24, 2024 [2 favorites]


That... makes sense. I didn't know how to phrase it when discussing it with someone who was inclined that way without being discouraging, so I asked them if they had downballot concerns.
posted by Selena777 at 4:47 PM on August 25, 2024 [1 favorite]


“Every time we accelerated on the highway, whale juice would pour into the windows of the car, and it was the rankest thing on the planet,” Kick recalls. “We all had plastic bags over our heads with mouth holes cut out, and people on the highway were giving us the finger, but that was just normal day-to-day stuff for us.”
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:57 AM on August 26, 2024 [5 favorites]


I mean, what are they not going to cut off the head of a beached whale by the side of the highway with their spare-car-chainsaw and drive 5 hours back home with it strapped to the top of the car?
posted by ishmael at 10:22 AM on August 26, 2024 [4 favorites]


Feel like RFK2 has been marionetted cordiceps-style by some hidden critter for a while now.
posted by ishmael at 10:24 AM on August 26, 2024 [2 favorites]


In other unsurprising Trump endorsement news: Tulsi Gabbard
“This administration has us facing multiple wars on multiple fronts in regions around the world, and closer to the brink of nuclear war than we ever have been before. This is one of the main reasons why I am committed to doing all that I can to send President Trump back to the White House, where he can once again serve us as our commander-in-chief.” (The Hill)
While that's... definitely a take, here's another:
“A re-elected Trump would put nuclear weapons programs on steroids, trash what remains of the global arms control regime, and likely trigger new nuclear weapons programs in more other nations than we have seen at any time since the early 1960s.” (Bulletin of the Atomic Scientists)
(See also 'Milley acted to prevent Trump from misusing nuclear weapons,' 'Trump bragged about new nuclear weapons,' 'Trump proposed first nuclear test explosion in decades,' 'Trump's nuclear obsession,' etc., etc.)
posted by box at 11:57 AM on August 26, 2024 [2 favorites]


I mean, what are they not going to cut off the head of a beached whale by the side of the highway with their spare-car-chainsaw and drive 5 hours back home with it strapped to the top of the car?
posted by ishmael

now that's eponysterical
posted by rifflesby at 8:29 PM on August 26, 2024 [8 favorites]


Trump plans to put RFK Jr. and Gabbard on transition team
It’s unclear what exactly she and Mr. Kennedy will do in their transition roles, but they will join Mr. Trump’s sons, Donald Trump Jr. and Eric Trump, as well as his running mate, Senator JD Vance, as honorary chairs of the transition team.
posted by box at 9:19 AM on August 27, 2024 [1 favorite]


It’s unclear what exactly she and Mr. Kennedy will do in their transition roles, but they will join Mr. Trump’s sons, Donald Trump Jr. and Eric Trump, as well as his running mate, Senator JD Vance, as honorary chairs of the transition team.

Unshocking and unsurprising that RFK Jr and Gabbard jumped aboard for undefined and imaginary job titles/roles.
When Trump (fingers crossed) loses is the main job of this transition team to explain how he's mentally incompetent and therefore can't possibly be held accountable in various courts, can't pay fines, and can't go to jail/prison?
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 9:51 AM on August 27, 2024 [2 favorites]


If picking a presidential transition team of JD Vance, RFK Jr., Tulsi Gabbard, Eric, and Don Jr. doesn’t demonstrate mental incompetence, what more proof do you need?
posted by box at 12:01 PM on August 27, 2024 [2 favorites]


I can't remember did previous candidates have a "transistion team" this early in the election cycle? It seems kinda premature and weird for Trump to be talking transition before he's even had his second debate.
posted by sotonohito at 2:45 PM on August 27, 2024 [1 favorite]


The actual government funds for the transition are released around this time by statue. The timing is depends on being an "eligible" candidate:
The GSA gives to “eligible” campaigns, defined as “a candidate of a major party [as defined in 26 U.S.C. §9002(6)] for President or Vice-President of the United States; and … any other candidate who has been determined by the Administrator to be among the principal contenders for the general election to such offices.”
Being the official nominee of a major political party which only happens after the conventions is the big reason why these stories pop up around this time. With that said, in 2016. Donald Trump named Chris Christie as transition chair in May of that year.
posted by mmascolino at 7:05 PM on August 27, 2024


RFK: “I think we need to have a president who can give an interview, who can articulate a vision, who can put together an English sentence.”
posted by box at 8:26 AM on September 4, 2024


'How the Media Sanitizes Trump's Incoherency' (MeFi favorite Parker Molloy writing for The New Republic)
This won’t remain just a Trump problem. As other politicians observe the media’s willingness to soften and reframe inflammatory statements, we risk further degradation of political discourse. The bar for what’s considered acceptable rhetoric continues to lower, while the public’s ability to discern fact from fiction erodes.

To combat this, we need a paradigm shift in political reporting. Instead of contorting themselves to find rationality in incoherence, journalists should simply present politicians’ words and actions plainly, complete with fact-checks. This might mean rethinking traditional notions of “objectivity” that often lead to false equivalencies and misrepresentation.

Readers, too, have a role to play. We must seek out primary sources, demand more comprehensive reporting, and support news outlets that prioritize accuracy over access or the appearance of “balance.”
posted by box at 1:23 PM on September 4, 2024 [5 favorites]


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