L'etat, c'est Tesla
March 19, 2025 7:34 AM Subscribe
Federal charges filed against anti-Tesla protesters “The swarm of violent attacks on Tesla property is nothing short of domestic terrorism,” Bondi said in a press release. “The Department of Justice has already charged several perpetrators with that in mind, including in cases that involve charges with five-year mandatory minimum sentences.”
The lines between the US Government and the private industries of the world's richest man are becoming increasingly non-existent. See also White House wifi being run through Starlink.
The lines between the US Government and the private industries of the world's richest man are becoming increasingly non-existent. See also White House wifi being run through Starlink.
From the Verge article: We can even skip over the security implications pointed out by a cybersecurity expert in the Times piece.
Actually, no, we can't -- there is no doubt in my mind that this is violating any number of basic network and national security protocols and opening up W.H. internet traffic to numerous malicious actors (outside of the ones currently occupying the W.H. even). The "seurity implications" are the most egregious and blatantly obvious reasons not to do this.
posted by Pedantzilla at 7:45 AM on March 19 [34 favorites]
Actually, no, we can't -- there is no doubt in my mind that this is violating any number of basic network and national security protocols and opening up W.H. internet traffic to numerous malicious actors (outside of the ones currently occupying the W.H. even). The "seurity implications" are the most egregious and blatantly obvious reasons not to do this.
posted by Pedantzilla at 7:45 AM on March 19 [34 favorites]
All Tesla dealerships will be declared military facilities and fully garrisoned as such. You will be required to purchase at least one Tesla vehicle as proof of citizenship. Purchasers of 3 or more Tesla vehicles will receive military escorts and Diamond Plus Citizenship status.
posted by star gentle uterus at 7:54 AM on March 19 [20 favorites]
posted by star gentle uterus at 7:54 AM on March 19 [20 favorites]
These arrests to protect the Tesla brand are really going to trigger the Streisand Effect, as it only further cements the interrelationship between Musk and the president that sparked the protests in the first place.
posted by Atreides at 7:57 AM on March 19 [17 favorites]
posted by Atreides at 7:57 AM on March 19 [17 favorites]
I'm sure this will do great things for the stock price though /.
Up 2.5% so far today, unfortunately, amid a broad rise in prices, though Tesla is outperforming its index.
Anyway, more heavy-handed special treatment for those currently in the sultan's favor. And another sign that we have almost four more years of increasingly violent reprisals against his enemies.
posted by jedicus at 8:00 AM on March 19 [3 favorites]
Up 2.5% so far today, unfortunately, amid a broad rise in prices, though Tesla is outperforming its index.
Anyway, more heavy-handed special treatment for those currently in the sultan's favor. And another sign that we have almost four more years of increasingly violent reprisals against his enemies.
posted by jedicus at 8:00 AM on March 19 [3 favorites]
A Tesla--car or owner--has more rights than most American citizens these days.
posted by Kitteh at 8:01 AM on March 19 [10 favorites]
posted by Kitteh at 8:01 AM on March 19 [10 favorites]
Defining "malicious destruction of property" as "terrorism" is quite the move. It's a solid precedent to doing the same for any protestors or activists (excepting, of course, anyone involved in January 6th) as well as continuing the trend of valuing property over human life.
posted by slimepuppy at 8:18 AM on March 19 [21 favorites]
posted by slimepuppy at 8:18 AM on March 19 [21 favorites]
One of the things that always strikes me with this stuff: the more disproportionately punished or difficult you make something, the less leverage you have over the people you are trying to control. If it's terrorism to graffiti a Tesla and it's terrorism to [do something else] the incentive to stick to graffiti is substantially less. You may deter some people from the graffiti, but you raise some other risks. Similarly, the more you cut state funding, etc, the less incentive states have to cooperate. The more you cut university funding, the less incentive universities have to cooperate. You've got a great deal of leverage when you're threatening to do something, but after you've done it, that leverage dissipates. You can of course escalate your threats ("we're going to carpet bomb Portland unless you expel the two trans athletes in your state", etc) but that complicates things in its own way.
What worries me in this is that I think these people are stupid and reckless enough to actually proceed to, like, carpet bombing Portland. They won't win anything they actually want to win but they'll only realize that later.
Again, it's video game brain. They think that anyone Not Them is an NPC, and if they just do their One Weird Trick, everyone they want to control will just shut down instead of evolve different tactics and strategies.
posted by Frowner at 8:32 AM on March 19 [68 favorites]
What worries me in this is that I think these people are stupid and reckless enough to actually proceed to, like, carpet bombing Portland. They won't win anything they actually want to win but they'll only realize that later.
Again, it's video game brain. They think that anyone Not Them is an NPC, and if they just do their One Weird Trick, everyone they want to control will just shut down instead of evolve different tactics and strategies.
posted by Frowner at 8:32 AM on March 19 [68 favorites]
Frowner, question, don't you think that the more you beat down, cow, and destroy lives over these trivial non-harmful actions, the more likely that the majority of people and organizations will back down.
Witness, well, Columbia University, a wholly owned subsidiary of ICE and the Regime.
posted by WatTylerJr at 8:37 AM on March 19 [5 favorites]
Witness, well, Columbia University, a wholly owned subsidiary of ICE and the Regime.
posted by WatTylerJr at 8:37 AM on March 19 [5 favorites]
So I've been joining in with a group picketing outside a Tesla dealership on the weekends. No one goes inside, we just stand outside with signs and chant and shake rattles and stuff, and are gone in only a couple hours.
Should I consider not going? (I'm hoping the answer is "No" because FUCK THAT)
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:42 AM on March 19 [10 favorites]
Should I consider not going? (I'm hoping the answer is "No" because FUCK THAT)
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:42 AM on March 19 [10 favorites]
I'm sure it's a total coincidence that anti-Tesla protests are now turning violent, and protesters are hurling improvised explosives into dealership lots instead of just peaceably standing outside holding signs. Just showing up gets you prosecuted as a terrorist, so why not hurl bombs to justify the charge?
Enjoy the side-effects of brinksmanship, asshole.
posted by Mayor West at 8:48 AM on March 19 [14 favorites]
Enjoy the side-effects of brinksmanship, asshole.
posted by Mayor West at 8:48 AM on March 19 [14 favorites]
Jury nullification time.
posted by ocschwar at 8:49 AM on March 19 [11 favorites]
posted by ocschwar at 8:49 AM on March 19 [11 favorites]
Should I consider not going? (
Never get into trouble EXCEPT on purpose.
posted by ocschwar at 8:50 AM on March 19 [5 favorites]
Never get into trouble EXCEPT on purpose.
posted by ocschwar at 8:50 AM on March 19 [5 favorites]
Surely, having a heavy police presence suspiciously eyeing anyone who walks in will have positive effects on the amount of business a retail establishment receives. This strategy sounds foolproof and immune from unintended consequences.
posted by allegedly at 8:54 AM on March 19 [12 favorites]
posted by allegedly at 8:54 AM on March 19 [12 favorites]
don't you think that the more you beat down, cow, and destroy lives over these trivial non-harmful actions, the more likely that the majority of people and organizations will back down.
WatTylerJr, I was actually just going to reply to Frowner's comment as well. IMO, this creates a bifurcation point. Many people do fall in line. As per your example, those with more to lose, such as an Ivy League university, are more likely to toe the line. People who are outside the establishment face a choice. They either fall in line, or they sign up for deep end-of-the-pool action. The historical record of civil strife shows that there are plenty of people who will choose the latter option.
posted by Smedly, Butlerian jihadi at 8:54 AM on March 19 [12 favorites]
WatTylerJr, I was actually just going to reply to Frowner's comment as well. IMO, this creates a bifurcation point. Many people do fall in line. As per your example, those with more to lose, such as an Ivy League university, are more likely to toe the line. People who are outside the establishment face a choice. They either fall in line, or they sign up for deep end-of-the-pool action. The historical record of civil strife shows that there are plenty of people who will choose the latter option.
posted by Smedly, Butlerian jihadi at 8:54 AM on March 19 [12 favorites]
Tired: Rolling coal on Teslas with your Dodge Mega Cab RAM 3500
Wired: Thumbs Up for Tesla owners from your Dodge Mega Cab RAM 3500
posted by Rumple at 8:59 AM on March 19 [6 favorites]
Wired: Thumbs Up for Tesla owners from your Dodge Mega Cab RAM 3500
posted by Rumple at 8:59 AM on March 19 [6 favorites]
Should I consider not going? (I'm hoping the answer is "No" because FUCK THAT)
You should absolutely go. But memorize the landline number of a law firm / write it in sharpie on your arm in case you get arrested for bullshit reasons. You can't make collect calls to mobile phones, so don't depend on being able to call a friend or relative's cell phone. Don't answer questions, and explicitly invoke your rights to silence and the presence of an attorney. Know how to lock your cellphone so that it requires a PIN to unlock.
posted by jedicus at 9:01 AM on March 19 [25 favorites]
You should absolutely go. But memorize the landline number of a law firm / write it in sharpie on your arm in case you get arrested for bullshit reasons. You can't make collect calls to mobile phones, so don't depend on being able to call a friend or relative's cell phone. Don't answer questions, and explicitly invoke your rights to silence and the presence of an attorney. Know how to lock your cellphone so that it requires a PIN to unlock.
posted by jedicus at 9:01 AM on March 19 [25 favorites]
Fired: Everyone
posted by lalochezia at 9:02 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
posted by lalochezia at 9:02 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Starlink for WH is bad, but that one lady had a private email server!
posted by misterpatrick at 9:05 AM on March 19 [30 favorites]
posted by misterpatrick at 9:05 AM on March 19 [30 favorites]
Frowner, question, don't you think that the more you beat down, cow, and destroy lives over these trivial non-harmful actions, the more likely that the majority of people and organizations will back down.
Witness, well, Columbia University, a wholly owned subsidiary of ICE and the Regime.
See, the consequences of withholding federal funds will be, on the one hand, a disastrous blow to American research and employment, but on the other, in the medium long term, movement away from federal research support for universities. Universities may shrink, they may not do important research, etc, but they will not disappear and what remains will be harder to blackmail.
I'm not saying I think this is good - what would be good would be continuing and improving the strong research structures at American universities. It's just that it's not the end.
Also, right now everyone is under threat - Columbia is being told to grovel to get at least some of the funds restored, other universities are afraid of being treated the same way, etc. This is the moment of greatest federal strength, because all the institutions are so structured that they depend on federal funds.
But in ten years, when there is dramatically reduced federal funding/IDC, and there's been a massive brain drain, universities will have evolved some new strategies. I think those new strategies will be part of smaller universities that do less and can do less, and I think that's extremely bad, but those smaller universities will be more independent and resilient.
Trump et al act like we're all just going to fold up and die. We'll suffer, yes, and suffer needlessly and stupidly, and so will the world, all in order to give Musk and his scummy friends more tax breaks, but we won't just short out like broken toys.
I think that interdependence is worth it because it means you can do more. I don't think that an "independent" university is better just because it can better survive unjust political attacks. But Musk-brains are always thinking that if they just bury the seeds, they've won. Again, video game brain.
posted by Frowner at 9:06 AM on March 19 [40 favorites]
Witness, well, Columbia University, a wholly owned subsidiary of ICE and the Regime.
See, the consequences of withholding federal funds will be, on the one hand, a disastrous blow to American research and employment, but on the other, in the medium long term, movement away from federal research support for universities. Universities may shrink, they may not do important research, etc, but they will not disappear and what remains will be harder to blackmail.
I'm not saying I think this is good - what would be good would be continuing and improving the strong research structures at American universities. It's just that it's not the end.
Also, right now everyone is under threat - Columbia is being told to grovel to get at least some of the funds restored, other universities are afraid of being treated the same way, etc. This is the moment of greatest federal strength, because all the institutions are so structured that they depend on federal funds.
But in ten years, when there is dramatically reduced federal funding/IDC, and there's been a massive brain drain, universities will have evolved some new strategies. I think those new strategies will be part of smaller universities that do less and can do less, and I think that's extremely bad, but those smaller universities will be more independent and resilient.
Trump et al act like we're all just going to fold up and die. We'll suffer, yes, and suffer needlessly and stupidly, and so will the world, all in order to give Musk and his scummy friends more tax breaks, but we won't just short out like broken toys.
I think that interdependence is worth it because it means you can do more. I don't think that an "independent" university is better just because it can better survive unjust political attacks. But Musk-brains are always thinking that if they just bury the seeds, they've won. Again, video game brain.
posted by Frowner at 9:06 AM on March 19 [40 favorites]
dear god Frowner is posting semi-not catastrophic stuff, what is the world coming to
thank you Frowner, I appreciate your contributions every single time
posted by ginger.beef at 9:08 AM on March 19 [31 favorites]
thank you Frowner, I appreciate your contributions every single time
posted by ginger.beef at 9:08 AM on March 19 [31 favorites]
This is a very large country. It's not Hungary. It's governed from the center, sort of, up to a point, but a lot of stuff is handled by the states. There's a lot of scattered power. It will be very, very hard to BOTH starve the states AND exert substantial central control in the long term. One or the other, sure, but the more the states are starved, the more they will go their own ways because they will have to. This will mean an extremely, extremely uneven governance across the country, and again, I'm not saying it's good. It's just that if you want to be a strongman in a large, rich, developed country with lots of local centers of power, you have to give pretty consistently, not just take and threaten.
posted by Frowner at 9:09 AM on March 19 [31 favorites]
posted by Frowner at 9:09 AM on March 19 [31 favorites]
dear god Frowner is posting semi-not catastrophic stuff, what is the world coming to
I'm not saying it's not going to suck!!! This is all a terrible, stupid, utterly self-own disaster brought about by an entire lifetime's worth of political and cultural leaders eating the seed corn. I personally don't expect to live that much longer, certainly not a normal lifetime. But it is not the end. It is not the end.
posted by Frowner at 9:13 AM on March 19 [40 favorites]
I'm not saying it's not going to suck!!! This is all a terrible, stupid, utterly self-own disaster brought about by an entire lifetime's worth of political and cultural leaders eating the seed corn. I personally don't expect to live that much longer, certainly not a normal lifetime. But it is not the end. It is not the end.
posted by Frowner at 9:13 AM on March 19 [40 favorites]
All Tesla dealerships will be declared military facilities and fully garrisoned as such. You will be required to purchase at least one Tesla vehicle as proof of citizenship. Purchasers of 3 or more Tesla vehicles will receive military escorts and Diamond Plus Citizenship status.
Ridiculous.
You actually will be required to stake an XToken (XXX) using $DOGE or $TRUMP, which will act as proof of citizenship and let you get in or out of your mandatory Tesla. Duh!
(US government crypto can be bought with a paid subscriber X account in good standing. Note: If your Tesla cannot connect to your X account to verify your XXX or you get banned (e.g. making fun of Elon, repeated usage of slurs like 'cis'), the doors will cease to function. An OTA update to resolve the issue of people in being trapped in their cars in areas with spotty internet is expected to ship when full FSD is deployed.)
posted by wanderlost at 9:17 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Ridiculous.
You actually will be required to stake an XToken (XXX) using $DOGE or $TRUMP, which will act as proof of citizenship and let you get in or out of your mandatory Tesla. Duh!
(US government crypto can be bought with a paid subscriber X account in good standing. Note: If your Tesla cannot connect to your X account to verify your XXX or you get banned (e.g. making fun of Elon, repeated usage of slurs like 'cis'), the doors will cease to function. An OTA update to resolve the issue of people in being trapped in their cars in areas with spotty internet is expected to ship when full FSD is deployed.)
posted by wanderlost at 9:17 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Just when I think it can't get any worse -- as if! --- it gets Musk. Over and over and over. This is so Life imitates Philip K. Dick.
posted by y2karl at 9:17 AM on March 19 [11 favorites]
posted by y2karl at 9:17 AM on March 19 [11 favorites]
Can we all just go to Tesla dealerships, waste the time of the salesmen and women for two hours and buy nothing?
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:22 AM on March 19 [22 favorites]
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:22 AM on March 19 [22 favorites]
So I've been joining in with a group picketing outside a Tesla dealership on the weekends. No one goes inside, we just stand outside with signs and chant and shake rattles and stuff, and are gone in only a couple hours.
And forgive this additional comment, I only speak because I have experience.
One reason they're doing these terrorism charges is because they want to scare the Tesla Takedown people, because it is very hard to just arrest the Tesla Takedown people. It is hard even now to just, like, arrest your average person for holding a sign on the street. And also, if you have a hundred people, the cops don't want to (and aren't prepared to) work that hard.
I do not believe you will be in any danger at this protest. Further, I believe that UNLESS something very different happens at the federal level, like "protesting Tesla itself is terrorism", in a week or two people will forget all this and carry on. They will think, accurately, "we are not throwing molotov cocktails at Tesla, we're just holding signs, they have nothing to arrest us for".
Two thoughts:
1. If there is a very large and stroppy crowd and you think someone is going to break a window AND you don't want to get arrested, keep an eye on the crowd and hang well back from the stroppy part. I think this is unlikely to be the situation.
2. If the vibes are bad and there are a lot of cops, pay attention to how you leave the protest. This is not a march, so I think regular kettling concerns don't apply, but have in mind how you will get to transit and don't be the last to leave. Again, I think this is overkill given the situation.
Two more:
1. If things get really fluid, use your judgement. Sometimes the safest thing in a large protest situation is to be with a large group that is standing off the cops, for instance. Cops are not kaiju. They don't like to charge into big tight crowds. But again, and I stress this very much, I think that a Tesla Takedown is EXTREMELY unlikely to be this kind of situation. That would be is more of a 2020 situation.
2. I have been in a LOT of protests, including protests where there were a LOT of arrests, tear gas, etc. I have very seldom been in a situation where I was okay with getting arrested. I have not been arrested at a protest since the nineties. Mass arrests require pre-planning and a lot of work. Cops generally don't do that. Pay attention to the situation, avoid getting pinned in the crowd, keep an exit strategy, etc. I seldom think that if you are a white citizen you should skip a protest you want to attend out of security concerns.
One more:
I think that if things really, really change, it won't be in a "five hundred totally peaceful middle class citizens were arrested and brutalized on camera on a weekend morning at the Tesla dealership" way. Even Elon Musk is not dumb enough to think that's good for the brand.
posted by Frowner at 9:28 AM on March 19 [41 favorites]
And forgive this additional comment, I only speak because I have experience.
One reason they're doing these terrorism charges is because they want to scare the Tesla Takedown people, because it is very hard to just arrest the Tesla Takedown people. It is hard even now to just, like, arrest your average person for holding a sign on the street. And also, if you have a hundred people, the cops don't want to (and aren't prepared to) work that hard.
I do not believe you will be in any danger at this protest. Further, I believe that UNLESS something very different happens at the federal level, like "protesting Tesla itself is terrorism", in a week or two people will forget all this and carry on. They will think, accurately, "we are not throwing molotov cocktails at Tesla, we're just holding signs, they have nothing to arrest us for".
Two thoughts:
1. If there is a very large and stroppy crowd and you think someone is going to break a window AND you don't want to get arrested, keep an eye on the crowd and hang well back from the stroppy part. I think this is unlikely to be the situation.
2. If the vibes are bad and there are a lot of cops, pay attention to how you leave the protest. This is not a march, so I think regular kettling concerns don't apply, but have in mind how you will get to transit and don't be the last to leave. Again, I think this is overkill given the situation.
Two more:
1. If things get really fluid, use your judgement. Sometimes the safest thing in a large protest situation is to be with a large group that is standing off the cops, for instance. Cops are not kaiju. They don't like to charge into big tight crowds. But again, and I stress this very much, I think that a Tesla Takedown is EXTREMELY unlikely to be this kind of situation. That would be is more of a 2020 situation.
2. I have been in a LOT of protests, including protests where there were a LOT of arrests, tear gas, etc. I have very seldom been in a situation where I was okay with getting arrested. I have not been arrested at a protest since the nineties. Mass arrests require pre-planning and a lot of work. Cops generally don't do that. Pay attention to the situation, avoid getting pinned in the crowd, keep an exit strategy, etc. I seldom think that if you are a white citizen you should skip a protest you want to attend out of security concerns.
One more:
I think that if things really, really change, it won't be in a "five hundred totally peaceful middle class citizens were arrested and brutalized on camera on a weekend morning at the Tesla dealership" way. Even Elon Musk is not dumb enough to think that's good for the brand.
posted by Frowner at 9:28 AM on March 19 [41 favorites]
Can we all just go to Tesla dealerships, waste the time of the salesmen and women for two hours and buy nothing?
ABSOLUTELY.
There are plenty of great ideas to be found here, but I would include subtly guilt tripping and generally fucking with the heads of all the Tesla sales people, for sure!
posted by Smedly, Butlerian jihadi at 9:31 AM on March 19 [8 favorites]
ABSOLUTELY.
There are plenty of great ideas to be found here, but I would include subtly guilt tripping and generally fucking with the heads of all the Tesla sales people, for sure!
posted by Smedly, Butlerian jihadi at 9:31 AM on March 19 [8 favorites]
At the rate they're going, there will be a lot fewer dealerships to target soon.
posted by reedbird_hill at 9:34 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
posted by reedbird_hill at 9:34 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
so here is a story I, ahem, heard from last week's Tesla Takedown in Berkeley, CA:
after several weeks of peaceful protests, for the first time a pro-47 person was there, a young (non white) person on a bicycle with a loud boom box. at first people seemed to assume they were also a protester but then began to notice the t-shirt depicting 47 and that the songs were ALL about 47. (except for the one saying "fuck joe biden")
people started to confront this person, just verbally but also getting inside their space, blocking them from riding forward on their bike.
there were a few cops there, just hanging back, watching things. I hear some protesters went and talked to the cops, one of whom then went and talked to the counter-protester. they were wagging their finger in the kid's face and pointing. THE COP MADE THE COUNTER-PROTESTER LEAVE.
people were pretty impressed. I would be inclined to see it as a good sign, of sorts, except of course it's completely arbitrary that that particular cop chose to keep things chill by making the pro-47 person leave. the arbitrary-ness is the new normal, though. at borders, at traffic stops probably. it's not great.
Empress the answer is NO ;)
posted by supermedusa at 9:37 AM on March 19 [7 favorites]
after several weeks of peaceful protests, for the first time a pro-47 person was there, a young (non white) person on a bicycle with a loud boom box. at first people seemed to assume they were also a protester but then began to notice the t-shirt depicting 47 and that the songs were ALL about 47. (except for the one saying "fuck joe biden")
people started to confront this person, just verbally but also getting inside their space, blocking them from riding forward on their bike.
there were a few cops there, just hanging back, watching things. I hear some protesters went and talked to the cops, one of whom then went and talked to the counter-protester. they were wagging their finger in the kid's face and pointing. THE COP MADE THE COUNTER-PROTESTER LEAVE.
people were pretty impressed. I would be inclined to see it as a good sign, of sorts, except of course it's completely arbitrary that that particular cop chose to keep things chill by making the pro-47 person leave. the arbitrary-ness is the new normal, though. at borders, at traffic stops probably. it's not great.
Empress the answer is NO ;)
posted by supermedusa at 9:37 AM on March 19 [7 favorites]
What if I got a custom car magnet like this:
I DID NAZI
[Pic of Musk doing Nazi salute]
THIS COMING
And stuck it on people's Teslas? At this point Tesla owners are Nazi-adjacent at best.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:37 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
I DID NAZI
[Pic of Musk doing Nazi salute]
THIS COMING
And stuck it on people's Teslas? At this point Tesla owners are Nazi-adjacent at best.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:37 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
hmmm, sticker shock.
posted by clavdivs at 9:39 AM on March 19 [3 favorites]
posted by clavdivs at 9:39 AM on March 19 [3 favorites]
Can we all just go to Tesla dealerships, waste the time of the salesmen and women for two hours and buy nothing?
Or go in and leave pamphlets about how awesome Rivian and Lucid are. (Caveat: I know nothing about the politics of their owners.)
posted by nat at 9:43 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Or go in and leave pamphlets about how awesome Rivian and Lucid are. (Caveat: I know nothing about the politics of their owners.)
posted by nat at 9:43 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Defining "malicious destruction of property" as "terrorism" is quite the move. It's a solid precedent to doing the same for any protestors or activists (excepting, of course, anyone involved in January 6th) as well as continuing the trend of valuing property over human life.
Only some property. I'm sure nobody's catching a terrorism charge over throwing a cinderblock through our local gay bar's window.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 9:51 AM on March 19 [15 favorites]
Only some property. I'm sure nobody's catching a terrorism charge over throwing a cinderblock through our local gay bar's window.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 9:51 AM on March 19 [15 favorites]
Comparisons to the Pinto? Sites like: Tesla fires & Tesla deaths (note: I haven't personally verified either, grain of salt, etc.)
posted by wanderlost at 9:57 AM on March 19 [1 favorite]
posted by wanderlost at 9:57 AM on March 19 [1 favorite]
Or maybe showing up at a Tesla dealer as an enthusiast who acts like Kenneth Mars from The Producers. (Hitler never said, "Baby!")
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:58 AM on March 19
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:58 AM on March 19
Can we all just go to Tesla dealerships, waste the time of the salesmen and women for two hours and buy nothing?
Those of us with poor credit can!
posted by The_Vegetables at 10:02 AM on March 19 [7 favorites]
Those of us with poor credit can!
posted by The_Vegetables at 10:02 AM on March 19 [7 favorites]
Can we all just go to Tesla dealerships, waste the time of the salesmen and women for two hours and buy nothing?
I'd say to show up, seem all into it, and then be all, "But I don't want my car to be vandalized, nevermind" and run screaming out of the store.
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:15 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
I'd say to show up, seem all into it, and then be all, "But I don't want my car to be vandalized, nevermind" and run screaming out of the store.
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:15 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Tesla's been kicked out of the Vancouver car show.
It needs to be made non-street-legal in the EU.
And now that the Venezuelan asylum seekers are imprisoned at hard labor without trial, it's time for sanctions. EU citizens, contact your MEP.
posted by ocschwar at 10:25 AM on March 19 [8 favorites]
It needs to be made non-street-legal in the EU.
And now that the Venezuelan asylum seekers are imprisoned at hard labor without trial, it's time for sanctions. EU citizens, contact your MEP.
posted by ocschwar at 10:25 AM on March 19 [8 favorites]
FYI there's a a big TeslaTakedown online organizing call tonight at 8:30 PM (Eastern). I imagine they'll be addressing this bit of news and maybe have some guidance for people.
posted by martin q blank at 10:26 AM on March 19 [8 favorites]
posted by martin q blank at 10:26 AM on March 19 [8 favorites]
Also re Tesla, the more people go, the safer everyone is.
posted by Frowner at 10:30 AM on March 19 [9 favorites]
posted by Frowner at 10:30 AM on March 19 [9 favorites]
The more people who aren’t doing vandalism go, the harder it is for them to find people doing a vandalism. That’s why they are trying to scare people away.
posted by corb at 10:33 AM on March 19 [11 favorites]
posted by corb at 10:33 AM on March 19 [11 favorites]
the older, veteran protesters at the Berkeley TT have been doing the work of keeping things non-violent and respectfully legal. I don't always agree with 100% of their perspective, but I do think keeping things non-violent/non-destructive will enable the largest number of protesters to feel safe and keep coming out. the Berkeley showroom has been CLOSED on Saturday for the past 2 weeks due to the protest.
posted by supermedusa at 10:45 AM on March 19 [6 favorites]
posted by supermedusa at 10:45 AM on March 19 [6 favorites]
Can we all just go to Tesla dealerships, waste the time of the salesmen and women for two hours and buy nothing?
It wouldn't shock me if someone gets charged with fraud, or theft of services, or who knows what for organizing this at scale—or if a genuine potential customer, probably one who doesn't look like a tech bro, somehow gets swept up in corporate paranoia and at the very least banned from Tesla premises.
posted by smelendez at 11:09 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
It wouldn't shock me if someone gets charged with fraud, or theft of services, or who knows what for organizing this at scale—or if a genuine potential customer, probably one who doesn't look like a tech bro, somehow gets swept up in corporate paranoia and at the very least banned from Tesla premises.
posted by smelendez at 11:09 AM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Wow. Attack Congress, attempt to murder Capitol police officers, try to overturn a national election, etc. … Get called a hero.
But you destroy a Deplorean dumpster created by a Nazi son-of-a-bitch ...
posted by JustSayNoDawg at 11:10 AM on March 19 [16 favorites]
But you destroy a Deplorean dumpster created by a Nazi son-of-a-bitch ...
posted by JustSayNoDawg at 11:10 AM on March 19 [16 favorites]
Also, when conversations about nonviolence come up, I find it good to discuss it as a tactic. You might feel strongly that Tesla Takedowns should be nonviolent, up to the point of strongly discouraging any destructive interventions, for strategic reasons that you should be able to back up with real-world examples, and still feel that other situations might call for other tactics.
I think people often sort of gesture toward "nonviolence is good actually" as an excuse to just do "show up for a couple of hours and chant a little and go home" and nothing else - but this is a situation where clearly showing up and chanting for a couple of hours and going home is extremely effective!!!! Like, if that's working and isn't incurring the drawbacks of a more militant action, take the win!
Different situations call for different actions, and it is absolutely terrific that there is an effective way to mobilize people who are able to show up and chant and go home but not, eg, break into an arms factory by night and sabotage it.
posted by Frowner at 11:12 AM on March 19 [10 favorites]
I think people often sort of gesture toward "nonviolence is good actually" as an excuse to just do "show up for a couple of hours and chant a little and go home" and nothing else - but this is a situation where clearly showing up and chanting for a couple of hours and going home is extremely effective!!!! Like, if that's working and isn't incurring the drawbacks of a more militant action, take the win!
Different situations call for different actions, and it is absolutely terrific that there is an effective way to mobilize people who are able to show up and chant and go home but not, eg, break into an arms factory by night and sabotage it.
posted by Frowner at 11:12 AM on March 19 [10 favorites]
NYT: "For some, the deal-breaker came when Mr. Musk made a gesture that resembled a fascist salute while speaking at a rally celebrating President Trump’s inauguration in January." Oh, FFS, NYT.
posted by jenfullmoon at 11:17 AM on March 19 [9 favorites]
posted by jenfullmoon at 11:17 AM on March 19 [9 favorites]
Tesla dealerships were outlawed in my state..... by Republicans. I wonder if they're terrorists? So confusing these days.
posted by Gyre,Gimble,Wabe, Esq. at 11:30 AM on March 19 [4 favorites]
posted by Gyre,Gimble,Wabe, Esq. at 11:30 AM on March 19 [4 favorites]
Can we all just go to Tesla dealerships, waste the time of the salesmen and women for two hours and buy nothing?
You could, but I believe the majority of their sales come from online buys. The real reason to visit the dealership is for a road test or service. You could tie all their time on futile road tests, but if somebody really wants one they can go online, and they're so prevalent now that even if you can't get a road test you can probably find somebody who has one to try.
The buy the car at a fixed public price without having the bargain and lose your time at the dealership was one of the things I really liked about Tesla. I mean, I still like the idea, I'm just never buying a Tesla ever.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 11:37 AM on March 19 [4 favorites]
You could, but I believe the majority of their sales come from online buys. The real reason to visit the dealership is for a road test or service. You could tie all their time on futile road tests, but if somebody really wants one they can go online, and they're so prevalent now that even if you can't get a road test you can probably find somebody who has one to try.
The buy the car at a fixed public price without having the bargain and lose your time at the dealership was one of the things I really liked about Tesla. I mean, I still like the idea, I'm just never buying a Tesla ever.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 11:37 AM on March 19 [4 favorites]
Frowner, an extra-excellent comment in a thread of excellent comments - thank you!
The Tesla Takedown location I've been going to weekly has been overwhelmingly positive - cops only came one week because of a sketchy guy with an airhorn who was really not reading the vibe of the rest of us. He ditched his signs behind a shed in a pretty suspicious manner and we were all cool with the cops checking that out. He may have been an agent provocateur - who knows?
I think the biggest problem with all this noise right now is it might keep more people from joining the peaceful protests out of fear. My brother told me to not get shot (!), and yeah, I definitely have it scoped out where to run if someone jumps the curb in their Cybercuck, but we have been getting supportive honks from everyone. Last week we got honks/thumbs ups from at least one bus driver, an ambulance crew, and... uh... a car from the county coroner's office.
posted by queensissy at 11:52 AM on March 19 [6 favorites]
The Tesla Takedown location I've been going to weekly has been overwhelmingly positive - cops only came one week because of a sketchy guy with an airhorn who was really not reading the vibe of the rest of us. He ditched his signs behind a shed in a pretty suspicious manner and we were all cool with the cops checking that out. He may have been an agent provocateur - who knows?
I think the biggest problem with all this noise right now is it might keep more people from joining the peaceful protests out of fear. My brother told me to not get shot (!), and yeah, I definitely have it scoped out where to run if someone jumps the curb in their Cybercuck, but we have been getting supportive honks from everyone. Last week we got honks/thumbs ups from at least one bus driver, an ambulance crew, and... uh... a car from the county coroner's office.
posted by queensissy at 11:52 AM on March 19 [6 favorites]
if someone jumps the curb in their Cybercuck
Pretty sure they aren’t capable of jumping the curb, if all the videos of broken wheels are any indicator of strength.
posted by funkaspuck at 12:10 PM on March 19 [9 favorites]
Pretty sure they aren’t capable of jumping the curb, if all the videos of broken wheels are any indicator of strength.
posted by funkaspuck at 12:10 PM on March 19 [9 favorites]
sketchy guy with an airhorn who was really not reading the vibe of the rest of us. He ditched his signs behind a shed in a pretty suspicious manner and we were all cool with the cops checking that out.
Cops probably just making sure their coworker was ok.
posted by Iax at 12:44 PM on March 19 [14 favorites]
Cops probably just making sure their coworker was ok.
posted by Iax at 12:44 PM on March 19 [14 favorites]
Tesla dealership in Montreal got pink spray painted, by activists from 'Last Generation Canada'. And I guess they read the room and figured out that you can dunk on Tesla even from an environmental angle and while there's some dissonance there, it still works.
But I'm surprised, their primary stated motivation wasn't 'owner is a fucking nazi'.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 12:49 PM on March 19
But I'm surprised, their primary stated motivation wasn't 'owner is a fucking nazi'.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 12:49 PM on March 19
Also, when conversations about nonviolence come up, I find it good to discuss it as a tactic.
Also also, setting fire to swasticars and breaking dealership window is not violence. It is merely vandalism. Violence involves causing physical harm to actual people, something the ACABs do all the time, BTW, so whenever you see a news report or politician talking about "violent protests" assume it's the ACABs who are causing the problems.
Equating vandalism with violence is an authoritarian tactic and says more about you than it does about the demonstrators.
posted by Pedantzilla at 12:50 PM on March 19 [17 favorites]
Also also, setting fire to swasticars and breaking dealership window is not violence. It is merely vandalism. Violence involves causing physical harm to actual people, something the ACABs do all the time, BTW, so whenever you see a news report or politician talking about "violent protests" assume it's the ACABs who are causing the problems.
Equating vandalism with violence is an authoritarian tactic and says more about you than it does about the demonstrators.
posted by Pedantzilla at 12:50 PM on March 19 [17 favorites]
I was just thinking about how unhinged it was to have Trump do that press junket to plug Tesla, what sensible company would want that association? I wonder if perhaps the some of the Tesla execs have been quietly offloading their stock by selling it to the Trump family.
posted by Lanark at 1:44 PM on March 19 [2 favorites]
posted by Lanark at 1:44 PM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Also also, setting fire to swasticars and breaking dealership window is not violence. It is merely vandalism. Violence involves causing physical harm to actual people,
I don't really care if people damage Teslas, but I'm just not sure I agree with this. People have to deal with the outcomes of vandalism, there is no magic fairy that comes in to take care of things. Generally those people have other things to do that are their actual daily responsibility, often other expenses (less so for businesses) that predicate worry and stress over vandalism.
Putting out fires is also dangerous, as is cleaning up broken glass.
Fine, there are scales, it's worse to get cut by a knife than to get your window smashed, but it still induces stress, and if done purposefully, the purpose was on some scale of 'violence'. Sometimes violence is necessary, but let's not play semantic games.
posted by The_Vegetables at 3:23 PM on March 19 [1 favorite]
I don't really care if people damage Teslas, but I'm just not sure I agree with this. People have to deal with the outcomes of vandalism, there is no magic fairy that comes in to take care of things. Generally those people have other things to do that are their actual daily responsibility, often other expenses (less so for businesses) that predicate worry and stress over vandalism.
Putting out fires is also dangerous, as is cleaning up broken glass.
Fine, there are scales, it's worse to get cut by a knife than to get your window smashed, but it still induces stress, and if done purposefully, the purpose was on some scale of 'violence'. Sometimes violence is necessary, but let's not play semantic games.
posted by The_Vegetables at 3:23 PM on March 19 [1 favorite]
It took 50,000 gallons of water to put out Tesla fire. I'm not averse to wrecking swasticars, but a Telsa fire sounds pretty dangerous.
posted by SPrintF at 3:47 PM on March 19 [2 favorites]
posted by SPrintF at 3:47 PM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Fine, there are scales, it's worse to get cut by a knife than to get your window smashed, but it still induces stress, and if done purposefully, the purpose was on some scale of 'violence'. Sometimes violence is necessary, but let's not play semantic games.
Absolutely. And some of this could have been avoided if Musk wasn't such a bald-faced Nazi. You're right, sometimes violence is necessary, and the blame doesn't lie entirely on the protesters.
It took 50,000 gallons of water to put out Tesla fire. I'm not averse to wrecking swasticars, but a Telsa fire sounds pretty dangerous.
Maybe he shouldn't have made them such flammable death-traps? I refuse to believe that there's no conceivable way to mitigate some of these risks. I would believe Musk didn't want them done.
I wonder if perhaps the some of the Tesla execs have been quietly offloading their stock by selling it to the Trump family.
I don't know to who, but the board has offloaded at least 100 million in tesla stock recently.
posted by mrgoat at 4:05 PM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Absolutely. And some of this could have been avoided if Musk wasn't such a bald-faced Nazi. You're right, sometimes violence is necessary, and the blame doesn't lie entirely on the protesters.
It took 50,000 gallons of water to put out Tesla fire. I'm not averse to wrecking swasticars, but a Telsa fire sounds pretty dangerous.
Maybe he shouldn't have made them such flammable death-traps? I refuse to believe that there's no conceivable way to mitigate some of these risks. I would believe Musk didn't want them done.
I wonder if perhaps the some of the Tesla execs have been quietly offloading their stock by selling it to the Trump family.
I don't know to who, but the board has offloaded at least 100 million in tesla stock recently.
posted by mrgoat at 4:05 PM on March 19 [2 favorites]
I drove past the San Francisco swasticar dealer yesterday. There were two trucks parked there from a glass company, and some guys measuring and doing something else with the windows. Getting ready for the weekend?
posted by njohnson23 at 4:32 PM on March 19 [1 favorite]
posted by njohnson23 at 4:32 PM on March 19 [1 favorite]
Maybe he shouldn't have made them such flammable death-traps? I refuse to believe that there's no conceivable way to mitigate some of these risks. I would believe Musk didn't want them done.
Lithium ion batteries just burn like that. Bunch of my friends were into homemade quadcopters and they all used special pouches to charge their batteries in case they caught fire.
Back in the days there was a guy selling lithium ion batteries for dive xtra underwater scooters and to buy one you had to sign a waiver specifying you wouldn’t charge it on a dwelling where people lived.
Modern lithium ion batteries are much better at not catching fire while charging but once it starts burning , it burns.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 5:02 PM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Lithium ion batteries just burn like that. Bunch of my friends were into homemade quadcopters and they all used special pouches to charge their batteries in case they caught fire.
Back in the days there was a guy selling lithium ion batteries for dive xtra underwater scooters and to buy one you had to sign a waiver specifying you wouldn’t charge it on a dwelling where people lived.
Modern lithium ion batteries are much better at not catching fire while charging but once it starts burning , it burns.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 5:02 PM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Also, when conversations about nonviolence come up, I find it good to discuss it as a tactic.
Find online, printed, or in-person civil disobedience training.
posted by jgirl at 5:43 PM on March 19
Find online, printed, or in-person civil disobedience training.
posted by jgirl at 5:43 PM on March 19
I admit I hate Cybertrucks and I saw a Tesla today with the license plate MYSEXXY that I really wanted to egg.
But that said, them things are dangerous to ignite, so perhaps we should...not.
posted by jenfullmoon at 5:48 PM on March 19
But that said, them things are dangerous to ignite, so perhaps we should...not.
posted by jenfullmoon at 5:48 PM on March 19
Lithium ion batteries just burn like that. Bunch of my friends were into homemade quadcopters and they all used special pouches to charge their batteries in case they caught fire.
They certainly do. This makes me wonder if there's some technology tesla could have looked at working on that would help mitigate the risk, given how easily teslas seem to go up vs other EV cars. Maybe some kind of special pouch.
posted by mrgoat at 6:32 PM on March 19 [1 favorite]
They certainly do. This makes me wonder if there's some technology tesla could have looked at working on that would help mitigate the risk, given how easily teslas seem to go up vs other EV cars. Maybe some kind of special pouch.
posted by mrgoat at 6:32 PM on March 19 [1 favorite]
The pouch was for charging, admittedly this seems to be pretty much resolved, we don't hear of Teslas or other electric car combusting during charge.
And not to defend Tesla, but they don't all spontaneously combust when in an accident so I'm sure things were done to make this somewhat safe. Maybe other car makers have a more robust safety culture? Or maybe we just hear about Teslas in the news because it's Tesla...
If I owned a Tesla I'd desperately be shopping for stickers.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 7:22 PM on March 19 [1 favorite]
And not to defend Tesla, but they don't all spontaneously combust when in an accident so I'm sure things were done to make this somewhat safe. Maybe other car makers have a more robust safety culture? Or maybe we just hear about Teslas in the news because it's Tesla...
If I owned a Tesla I'd desperately be shopping for stickers.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 7:22 PM on March 19 [1 favorite]
Okay, sold, I will keep up with Operation Fuck Tesla. ( although I will probably leave the obnoxious Irish drum home from now on )
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:05 PM on March 19 [3 favorites]
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:05 PM on March 19 [3 favorites]
jedicus: Good news: the latest Tesla stock price bump is due to non-political reasons.
posted by BiggerJ at 10:18 PM on March 19 [2 favorites]
posted by BiggerJ at 10:18 PM on March 19 [2 favorites]
Btw fight club had the right idea about how to fuck around with car dealerships inventory… birds seeds and food :) Especially for cyber trucks the panels don’t do great with bird poop.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 3:28 AM on March 20 [5 favorites]
posted by WaterAndPixels at 3:28 AM on March 20 [5 favorites]
The issue is that (CNN link) offloading a used Tesla is not that easy these days. And it leaves people in a position of having trouble getting another car.
Even Fox Business (don't worry, not linking to Goebbels 2.0) had an article on this. The price has cratered. All used car prices are down, but Tesla's used car prices are abysmal.
posted by Hactar at 12:59 PM on March 20 [1 favorite]
Even Fox Business (don't worry, not linking to Goebbels 2.0) had an article on this. The price has cratered. All used car prices are down, but Tesla's used car prices are abysmal.
posted by Hactar at 12:59 PM on March 20 [1 favorite]
Tesla just closed its showroom in the DC suburb of Bethesda, MD, open since 2013. Hopefully its downtown location is next.
posted by reedbird_hill at 5:17 PM on March 20 [5 favorites]
posted by reedbird_hill at 5:17 PM on March 20 [5 favorites]
March 20, 2025: U.S. safety regulators on Thursday recalled virtually all Cybertrucks on the road, the eighth recall of the Tesla-made vehicles since deliveries to customers began just over a year ago. [ap]
posted by HearHere at 5:29 AM on March 21 [1 favorite]
posted by HearHere at 5:29 AM on March 21 [1 favorite]
Trump threatens to send American citizens to El Salvador prison for Tesla vandalism
Authorities in Ontario, Canada claimed to have found more than 80 Tesla vehicles vandalized in a showroom, later marking the incident the the largest vandalism instance in Canada against a US-based car dealership
Authorities in Ontario, Canada claimed to have found more than 80 Tesla vehicles vandalized in a showroom, later marking the incident the the largest vandalism instance in Canada against a US-based car dealership
US President Donald Trump threatened to send American citizens to a maximum security prison in El Salvador for vandalizing Tesla vehicles.posted by rambling wanderlust at 7:17 AM on March 21 [1 favorite]
The 47th US president described the vandals as "sick terrorist thugs" who should each get a 20-year prison sentence at minimum. "I look forward to watching the sick terrorist thugs get 20 year jail sentences for what they are doing to Elon Musk and Tesla. Perhaps they could serve them in the prisons of El Salvador, which have become so recently famous for such lovely conditions!" the president posted on Truth Social on Friday morning.
March 20, 2025: U.S. safety regulators on Thursday recalled virtually all Cybertrucks on the road, the eighth recall of the Tesla-made vehicles since deliveries to customers began just over a year ago. [ap]
I never thought I'd find myself yearning for the death of an electric car company, but here we are.
posted by reedbird_hill at 7:18 AM on March 21 [3 favorites]
I never thought I'd find myself yearning for the death of an electric car company, but here we are.
posted by reedbird_hill at 7:18 AM on March 21 [3 favorites]
Authorities in Ontario, Canada claimed to have found more than 80 Tesla vehicles vandalized in a showroom, later marking the incident the the largest vandalism instance in Canada against a US-based car dealership. US President Donald Trump threatened to send American citizens to a maximum security prison in El Salvador for vandalizing Tesla vehicles.
....Dude, Canada is not the 51st State and you have no jurisdiction.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:29 AM on March 21 [4 favorites]
....Dude, Canada is not the 51st State and you have no jurisdiction.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:29 AM on March 21 [4 favorites]
BTW, be wary of anti-Tesla protesters who recommend extreme tactics. History has shown that such persons are often infiltrators sent by the government to discredit others or provide justification to shut down all protest.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 12:31 PM on March 21 [4 favorites]
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 12:31 PM on March 21 [4 favorites]
Given the tanking resale value, I wouldn't be surprised if owners start trashing their own vehicles for the insurance money while blaming protestors.
posted by cheshyre at 6:00 PM on March 22 [1 favorite]
posted by cheshyre at 6:00 PM on March 22 [1 favorite]
Let's hope some do and get caught cause that's a big ole crime!
posted by tiny frying pan at 6:51 AM on March 23
posted by tiny frying pan at 6:51 AM on March 23
Given the tanking resale value, I wouldn't be surprised if owners start trashing their own vehicles for the insurance money while blaming protestors.
That's insurance fraud. They have to prove it but it's good way of ending with a trashed car and no money.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 6:42 AM on March 24
That's insurance fraud. They have to prove it but it's good way of ending with a trashed car and no money.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 6:42 AM on March 24
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I'm sure this will do great things for the stock price though /.
posted by mrgoat at 7:42 AM on March 19 [13 favorites]