"What does sound sound like when no music is happening?"
October 15, 2014 8:22 PM Subscribe
Tuning '77 - a seamless audio supercut of an entire year of the Grateful Dead tuning their instruments, live on stage. Chronologically sequenced, this remix incorporates every publicly available recording from 1977, examining the divide between audience expectation and performance anxiety.
If your favorite part of every concert is the part where the musicians stand around and fiddle with their instruments furtively before actually beginning to play, then you're in luck; there is an hour and a half of material here, all cut together for your convenience.
Tuning '77 is an art project by photographer Michael David Murphy – and note there the video of him discussing it on the local television news program "Good Day Sacramento." Here's a written interview where he discusses it further, along with other topics.
If your favorite part of every concert is the part where the musicians stand around and fiddle with their instruments furtively before actually beginning to play, then you're in luck; there is an hour and a half of material here, all cut together for your convenience.
Tuning '77 is an art project by photographer Michael David Murphy – and note there the video of him discussing it on the local television news program "Good Day Sacramento." Here's a written interview where he discusses it further, along with other topics.
when I first read the post, I mistakenly thought that it was a YouTube video whose running time was one year, not that the videos contained therein were shot over the course of one calendar year.
However, it did not strike me as odd that there was 8760 hours worth of footage of the Dead fiddling around with their instruments.
posted by Dr. Twist at 8:34 PM on October 15, 2014 [16 favorites]
However, it did not strike me as odd that there was 8760 hours worth of footage of the Dead fiddling around with their instruments.
posted by Dr. Twist at 8:34 PM on October 15, 2014 [16 favorites]
"just exactly perfect"
posted by stinkfoot at 8:36 PM on October 15, 2014 [4 favorites]
posted by stinkfoot at 8:36 PM on October 15, 2014 [4 favorites]
This is actually quite entertaining! Thanks!
posted by freakazoid at 8:37 PM on October 15, 2014
posted by freakazoid at 8:37 PM on October 15, 2014
I found it entertaining, too. I somehow feel like I should be embarrassed by the fact that I enjoyed listening to this.
posted by koeselitz at 8:39 PM on October 15, 2014 [4 favorites]
posted by koeselitz at 8:39 PM on October 15, 2014 [4 favorites]
I'm a bit embarrassed to admit I could probably identify many of the shows these snippets are pulled from.
posted by jacobian at 8:40 PM on October 15, 2014 [8 favorites]
posted by jacobian at 8:40 PM on October 15, 2014 [8 favorites]
I'm a bit embarrassed to admit I could probably identify which song they are about to play a lot of the time.
posted by freakazoid at 8:45 PM on October 15, 2014 [8 favorites]
posted by freakazoid at 8:45 PM on October 15, 2014 [8 favorites]
OK this is really cool- I love that feeling when your mind's trying to decipher the next song- plus 1977 was so great. Thanks! Reminds me of Grayfolded which is worth checking out.
posted by wmoskowi at 8:57 PM on October 15, 2014 [3 favorites]
posted by wmoskowi at 8:57 PM on October 15, 2014 [3 favorites]
I love that this exists. It sounds like every band practice I've ever been to.
Also, along with dial phones and the absence of the Internet, this is something no generation after ours will understand. I only just now realized that electronic tuning pedals eliminated breaks for on stage tuning.
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 9:02 PM on October 15, 2014
Also, along with dial phones and the absence of the Internet, this is something no generation after ours will understand. I only just now realized that electronic tuning pedals eliminated breaks for on stage tuning.
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 9:02 PM on October 15, 2014
I have just worked waaaaaaaay too many gigs that sounded pretty much like this. I didn't last 10 seconds.
posted by soundguy99 at 9:02 PM on October 15, 2014 [6 favorites]
posted by soundguy99 at 9:02 PM on October 15, 2014 [6 favorites]
Reminds me of Grayfolded which is worth checking out.
Grayfolded is the opposite of this. Grayfolded is pulling the gold out of a pile of slurry. It's probably my favorite Grateful Dead release. Which is not to say that I hate the Grateful Dead, that I think their stuff is mostly just slurry. In fact I own more than half a dozen of their albums. But there comes a time when a guy's got to say, holy shit people, this just sounds like a bunch of stoned hippies tuning their instruments. Forever. Your ears deserve better than this.
sorry to crash the party, but ...... well, I said what I think already
posted by philip-random at 9:08 PM on October 15, 2014 [5 favorites]
Grayfolded is the opposite of this. Grayfolded is pulling the gold out of a pile of slurry. It's probably my favorite Grateful Dead release. Which is not to say that I hate the Grateful Dead, that I think their stuff is mostly just slurry. In fact I own more than half a dozen of their albums. But there comes a time when a guy's got to say, holy shit people, this just sounds like a bunch of stoned hippies tuning their instruments. Forever. Your ears deserve better than this.
sorry to crash the party, but ...... well, I said what I think already
posted by philip-random at 9:08 PM on October 15, 2014 [5 favorites]
There's also Neil Young's ARC, which for some reason I can't dig up on YouTube.
posted by gwint at 9:11 PM on October 15, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by gwint at 9:11 PM on October 15, 2014 [1 favorite]
soundguy99, I'm with you. I got to a minute.
People who've never worked gigs: this is with the audience in. Imagine this, but with a crap band during soundcheck. Or rehearsal.
posted by deadwax at 9:22 PM on October 15, 2014 [2 favorites]
People who've never worked gigs: this is with the audience in. Imagine this, but with a crap band during soundcheck. Or rehearsal.
posted by deadwax at 9:22 PM on October 15, 2014 [2 favorites]
This is kind of hilarious.
For me, it's heartening to know that 'legendary' bands also have that problem with band-members full-on launching into playing some song while the poor person trying to tune is all GUYS PLEASE I CAN'T HEAR...HANG ON FOR A MINUTE, I I HAVE TO TUNE just like the rest of us normal people who don't know what the fuck we're doing.
posted by chococat at 9:27 PM on October 15, 2014 [9 favorites]
For me, it's heartening to know that 'legendary' bands also have that problem with band-members full-on launching into playing some song while the poor person trying to tune is all GUYS PLEASE I CAN'T HEAR...HANG ON FOR A MINUTE, I I HAVE TO TUNE just like the rest of us normal people who don't know what the fuck we're doing.
posted by chococat at 9:27 PM on October 15, 2014 [9 favorites]
In 1977 there was a band that played around the Boston area called "The Constant Tuners."
posted by StickyCarpet at 9:39 PM on October 15, 2014 [4 favorites]
posted by StickyCarpet at 9:39 PM on October 15, 2014 [4 favorites]
It is bizarre how natural it is to just leave this running. I have to remind myself every couple minutes that I'm listening to something weird on purpose. That I just got back from band practice probably is part of it, but I think it's more just the years of accumulated exposure.
posted by cortex at 9:43 PM on October 15, 2014 [4 favorites]
posted by cortex at 9:43 PM on October 15, 2014 [4 favorites]
terrific understatement: "...1977 was so great..."
the tuning from '77 is better than most first-sets from '87.
posted by j_curiouser at 9:44 PM on October 15, 2014 [2 favorites]
the tuning from '77 is better than most first-sets from '87.
posted by j_curiouser at 9:44 PM on October 15, 2014 [2 favorites]
Yeah, they tuned up often...but I never heard another band with their sound.
I was a radio DJ for 15 years and attended concerts all over for decades...and to this day, I never heard a sound system like the Dead had in the 70s...it was just...stunning; the clarity, the power, the mix were just amazing.
I'm still not a Dead Head to this day, but in concert...OMG!
posted by CrowGoat at 10:23 PM on October 15, 2014 [3 favorites]
I was a radio DJ for 15 years and attended concerts all over for decades...and to this day, I never heard a sound system like the Dead had in the 70s...it was just...stunning; the clarity, the power, the mix were just amazing.
I'm still not a Dead Head to this day, but in concert...OMG!
posted by CrowGoat at 10:23 PM on October 15, 2014 [3 favorites]
I was a radio DJ for 15 years and attended concerts all over for decades...and to this day, I never heard a sound system like the Dead had in the 70s...it was just...stunning; the clarity, the power, the mix were just amazing.
In the 80's Dan Healy, Meyer and Ultrasound really dialled it in. IIRC "The Absolute Sound", a HiFi magazine at the time used the ideal "Straight Wire, with Gain" to describe it. Their PA *ruined me* for Audiophile gear. When it costs a million dollars and needs an arena and 20,000 people to really come together, there's no reason to spend 10k at home trying, and just bought used PA gear like crown amps, and JBL Control 10s...
posted by mikelieman at 10:44 PM on October 15, 2014 [1 favorite]
In the 80's Dan Healy, Meyer and Ultrasound really dialled it in. IIRC "The Absolute Sound", a HiFi magazine at the time used the ideal "Straight Wire, with Gain" to describe it. Their PA *ruined me* for Audiophile gear. When it costs a million dollars and needs an arena and 20,000 people to really come together, there's no reason to spend 10k at home trying, and just bought used PA gear like crown amps, and JBL Control 10s...
posted by mikelieman at 10:44 PM on October 15, 2014 [1 favorite]
This is like Derrida writing a book on the Nietzsche scrap "I forgot my umbrella".
posted by bukvich at 10:57 PM on October 15, 2014 [3 favorites]
posted by bukvich at 10:57 PM on October 15, 2014 [3 favorites]
Wish someone would do this for Hendrix. The chronological progression through his brief career would be fascinating.
posted by epo at 11:02 PM on October 15, 2014
posted by epo at 11:02 PM on October 15, 2014
Since I never saw them in concert, and mostly listen to various Dark Stars, the tuning up is just part of the song to me. Just put on a new-to-me 43:28 minute version from '73, and it was communicated by a few notes around 1 minute in that this was gonna be a dark star, but at 4 minutes in, it's all haphazard, a recognizable song hasn't started yet, they could still be tuning or they could be playing with the audience expectations. Beats me.
posted by joeyh at 11:38 PM on October 15, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by joeyh at 11:38 PM on October 15, 2014 [2 favorites]
This combines really well with the ambient sounds from yesterday's post. Crickets, plus the odd peal of thunder. Perfect.
posted by nomis at 11:41 PM on October 15, 2014
posted by nomis at 11:41 PM on October 15, 2014
Except that you can tell just by the tone what band it is, it sounds like a band tuning up. Thanks though, I have friends who will probably burn one and sit and listen to the whole thing.
posted by ob1quixote at 11:57 PM on October 15, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by ob1quixote at 11:57 PM on October 15, 2014 [2 favorites]
Isn't there a moment in "Concert For Bangladesh" where the audience applauds Ravi Shankar at the first pause in his set, and he says, thank you, if you liked us tuning up so much, you are going to love the rest?
posted by thelonius at 3:11 AM on October 16, 2014 [4 favorites]
posted by thelonius at 3:11 AM on October 16, 2014 [4 favorites]
I was a radio DJ for 15 years and attended concerts all over for decades...and to this day, I never heard a sound system like the Dead had in the 70s...it was just...stunning; the clarity, the power, the mix were just amazing.
That would be the Wall of SOUND. A quick look will show you why bands don't tour with rigs like this anymore, though many of the principals of the WoS are used today. In particular, line array speakers and dedicated amps/speakers for each input.
posted by eriko at 5:22 AM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
That would be the Wall of SOUND. A quick look will show you why bands don't tour with rigs like this anymore, though many of the principals of the WoS are used today. In particular, line array speakers and dedicated amps/speakers for each input.
posted by eriko at 5:22 AM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
Thank goodness it's available in FLAC format, I wouldn't want any distortion or compression getting in the way!
posted by blue_beetle at 5:41 AM on October 16, 2014 [3 favorites]
posted by blue_beetle at 5:41 AM on October 16, 2014 [3 favorites]
Can somebody explain why bands need to tune up like this onstage? Why the Dead in particular? Can't the guitars be tuned ahead of time and then just placed on stage for the band? And I get how things might get out of tune a skoosh from song to song, but how much of this is really just really high musicians with OCD in front of an audience with low expectations?
posted by stupidsexyFlanders at 7:05 AM on October 16, 2014
posted by stupidsexyFlanders at 7:05 AM on October 16, 2014
I actually own an album called Favorite Intermissions: Music Before and Between Beethoven, Stravinsky, Holst which captures the noodling around and then tuning up of a symphony orchestra. I love it and find it soothing, that charged moment before the music when everyone is working out the kinks before beginning.
"Can somebody explain why bands need to tune up like this onstage? Why the Dead in particular? Can't the guitars be tuned ahead of time and then just placed on stage for the band?"
For one thing, if you change rooms or room temperature (which happens when an audience comes in), strings tend fall out of tune. Stringed instruments are very sensitive to temperature and humidity. It also depends on how long and hard you play; symphonies sometimes tune between movements if it's very strenuous music (like Wagner demands you play so hard, it tends to put you a bit out of tune). It also depends on the type of music; if you're using a lot of harmonics on a guitar or bass, you're going to need to tune pretty frequently or they won't work properly, whereas in a marching band setting, out in the open air with 100 brass instruments, one person out of tune isn't as noticeable. Every time you pull on a string, with your fingers or pick or a bow, they're stretching ever so slightly out of tune, so just the act of playing is going to drop you flat eventually. (This is true of woodwinds and brass as well; blowing warm moist human air through them relaxes the metal and changes the pitch.)
Fretted guitars and basses are also considerably harder to "tune" while you play, since the fret wants to give you the note; you can't creep up or down like you can with a violin or an upright (or fretless) bass to tune the note as you play. (You can a little, but not much.) You really have to have it right before you start, because you can't really adjust while you're going. Also just from experience as a bassist, it's easier to take advantage of a tiny break in the music to adjust an upright bass especially with a bow because you can cheat a really quiet note and crank the peg really quick; that's harder to manage with an electric bass. You're playing pizzicatto, it's a more awkward movement to get to the pegs really fast, and you're amplified so it's harder to cheat a note just for you to tune.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 7:37 AM on October 16, 2014 [8 favorites]
"Can somebody explain why bands need to tune up like this onstage? Why the Dead in particular? Can't the guitars be tuned ahead of time and then just placed on stage for the band?"
For one thing, if you change rooms or room temperature (which happens when an audience comes in), strings tend fall out of tune. Stringed instruments are very sensitive to temperature and humidity. It also depends on how long and hard you play; symphonies sometimes tune between movements if it's very strenuous music (like Wagner demands you play so hard, it tends to put you a bit out of tune). It also depends on the type of music; if you're using a lot of harmonics on a guitar or bass, you're going to need to tune pretty frequently or they won't work properly, whereas in a marching band setting, out in the open air with 100 brass instruments, one person out of tune isn't as noticeable. Every time you pull on a string, with your fingers or pick or a bow, they're stretching ever so slightly out of tune, so just the act of playing is going to drop you flat eventually. (This is true of woodwinds and brass as well; blowing warm moist human air through them relaxes the metal and changes the pitch.)
Fretted guitars and basses are also considerably harder to "tune" while you play, since the fret wants to give you the note; you can't creep up or down like you can with a violin or an upright (or fretless) bass to tune the note as you play. (You can a little, but not much.) You really have to have it right before you start, because you can't really adjust while you're going. Also just from experience as a bassist, it's easier to take advantage of a tiny break in the music to adjust an upright bass especially with a bow because you can cheat a really quiet note and crank the peg really quick; that's harder to manage with an electric bass. You're playing pizzicatto, it's a more awkward movement to get to the pegs really fast, and you're amplified so it's harder to cheat a note just for you to tune.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 7:37 AM on October 16, 2014 [8 favorites]
Man I miss The Dead.
posted by OHenryPacey at 8:14 AM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by OHenryPacey at 8:14 AM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
Eyebrows McGee - Everything you say is true. But you did not once mention the drugs. Which in this case, is probably 80% of the thing.
posted by Danf at 8:52 AM on October 16, 2014
posted by Danf at 8:52 AM on October 16, 2014
Isn't there a moment in "Concert For Bangladesh" where the audience applauds Ravi Shankar at the first pause in his set, and he says, thank you, if you liked us tuning up so much, you are going to love the rest?
I always thought Ravi Shankar was being a little needlessly oversensitive there. I think the audience, by and large, knows perfectly well that the band is just tuning up--I think the applause is just "hey, they're about to start playing--ain't that cool" applause.
posted by yoink at 8:55 AM on October 16, 2014
I always thought Ravi Shankar was being a little needlessly oversensitive there. I think the audience, by and large, knows perfectly well that the band is just tuning up--I think the applause is just "hey, they're about to start playing--ain't that cool" applause.
posted by yoink at 8:55 AM on October 16, 2014
Just listened to the entire thing. I loved it, but then again I have been to over 100 shows one of which is on this compilation. My first show ever. All I listen to in my car is Sirrius 23 and my teenage kids can now guess the song during the tuning. For the right years, first set, they know the Jerry, Bob, Jerry, Bob etc routine. It is great when my daughter says, "Time for a Bob cowboy song, dad." Or, when my son says, "Jeez dad, Jerry sounds awful. Is this when he went into a coma?"
I love the songs, but I also love certain transitions. The China Cat --> Rider is a favorite as well as the Scarlet --> Fire from 77. Listening to a particularly soulful 23 minute version of Morning Dew also gets me.
My kids want me to do a Head Set on Sirrius. One of the "songs" I would pick would actually be a tuning moment, when Jerry says in his nasal voice, "Bobby's got a broken string, so we're gonna spend some time and fix it that's what we're going to do." I think it is from Englishtown.
When Bobby tells his hard to follow jokes is great too. I was at a show in Baltimore in the early 80s when the band came out of drums into some serious space. Phil had obviously had a good time during the break, as he kept saying, "More nitrous" and something about the Raven and nevermore I guess because it was Baltimore and Poe, etc.
Miss the band, miss Jerry and hope Bob gets his stuff together enough to get back out there. Some of the Thursday night live streams from the TRI Studios in Marin are terrific. Lots of great musicians stop by to play with Bob, and Parrish will sometimes tell stories. Once he had some great stories about playing the pyramids in Egypt.
posted by 724A at 9:09 AM on October 16, 2014 [4 favorites]
I love the songs, but I also love certain transitions. The China Cat --> Rider is a favorite as well as the Scarlet --> Fire from 77. Listening to a particularly soulful 23 minute version of Morning Dew also gets me.
My kids want me to do a Head Set on Sirrius. One of the "songs" I would pick would actually be a tuning moment, when Jerry says in his nasal voice, "Bobby's got a broken string, so we're gonna spend some time and fix it that's what we're going to do." I think it is from Englishtown.
When Bobby tells his hard to follow jokes is great too. I was at a show in Baltimore in the early 80s when the band came out of drums into some serious space. Phil had obviously had a good time during the break, as he kept saying, "More nitrous" and something about the Raven and nevermore I guess because it was Baltimore and Poe, etc.
Miss the band, miss Jerry and hope Bob gets his stuff together enough to get back out there. Some of the Thursday night live streams from the TRI Studios in Marin are terrific. Lots of great musicians stop by to play with Bob, and Parrish will sometimes tell stories. Once he had some great stories about playing the pyramids in Egypt.
posted by 724A at 9:09 AM on October 16, 2014 [4 favorites]
Oh, almost forgot, today is Bob Weir's 67th birthday! Here is compilation from JamBase of him playing with ten different bands.
posted by 724A at 9:11 AM on October 16, 2014 [3 favorites]
posted by 724A at 9:11 AM on October 16, 2014 [3 favorites]
This is remarkably soothing, despite the occasional wild, stoned yelling from the crowd.
posted by wenestvedt at 9:52 AM on October 16, 2014
posted by wenestvedt at 9:52 AM on October 16, 2014
Playing it over again. This is so frustrating while also being relaxing. They come THIS CLOSE to playing the song and then on to the next tuning bit. The Tennessee Jed teaser at 1:03:49 is a killer. Or Terrapin at 1:06:04.
Best white noise ever.
posted by 724A at 9:55 AM on October 16, 2014 [2 favorites]
Best white noise ever.
posted by 724A at 9:55 AM on October 16, 2014 [2 favorites]
Can somebody explain why bands need to tune up like this onstage? Why the Dead in particular?
Well, this does tend to happen less often these days, thanks to electronic tuners, some of which are actually guitar pedals that can mute the signal to the guitar amp while the player tunes. But I'm pretty sure these didn't exist back in 1977, so doing it by ear was the only way to go.
Can't the guitars be tuned ahead of time and then just placed on stage for the band? And I get how things might get out of tune a skoosh from song to song
You are underestimating how much an instrument can go out of tune during a song, or even in the transition from the dark and cool side of the stage to the hot and humid performance area. Eyebrows McGee is exactly right above.
Adding to the fun, things like Hammond organs, acoustic pianos, and some electric pianos that use small metal bars to generate the notes are also subject to some of the same effects of temperature and humidity, and those really can't be easily tuned on the fly, so even if the guitar & bass players have electronic tuners, they've gotta check their tuning against those other instruments.
Fretted guitars and basses are also considerably harder to "tune" while you play, since the fret wants to give you the note; you can't creep up or down like you can with a violin or an upright (or fretless) bass to tune the note as you play. (You can a little, but not much.)
Expanding on Eyebrows' point above, we had a discussion about tuning compensations for fretted instruments a couple of years ago over in Music Talk, which included a link to the Guitar Tuning Nightmares article by the producer/engineer Jack Endino. The section titled "More Math: There Will Be A Quiz In The Morning" is especially interesting.
Basically, the catch is that using frets on an instrument is itself a sort of tuning compromise, and so even the little bit you can "cheat" your tuning on a fretted instrument as you play can actually have a noticeable effect where chord #1 in one position is in tune, but chord #2 in a different position is not, or a note played on one fret on one string is not 110% "in tune" with the same note played on a different fret & different string. So players tend to develop a personal "feel" for how they compensate for these quirks, and since every player is slightly different, it's still common for a player to double-check the tuning even on a guitar freshly tuned offstage by their guitar tech, because their guitar tech doesn't 100% have the player's personal "feel".
posted by soundguy99 at 10:00 AM on October 16, 2014 [4 favorites]
Well, this does tend to happen less often these days, thanks to electronic tuners, some of which are actually guitar pedals that can mute the signal to the guitar amp while the player tunes. But I'm pretty sure these didn't exist back in 1977, so doing it by ear was the only way to go.
Can't the guitars be tuned ahead of time and then just placed on stage for the band? And I get how things might get out of tune a skoosh from song to song
You are underestimating how much an instrument can go out of tune during a song, or even in the transition from the dark and cool side of the stage to the hot and humid performance area. Eyebrows McGee is exactly right above.
Adding to the fun, things like Hammond organs, acoustic pianos, and some electric pianos that use small metal bars to generate the notes are also subject to some of the same effects of temperature and humidity, and those really can't be easily tuned on the fly, so even if the guitar & bass players have electronic tuners, they've gotta check their tuning against those other instruments.
Fretted guitars and basses are also considerably harder to "tune" while you play, since the fret wants to give you the note; you can't creep up or down like you can with a violin or an upright (or fretless) bass to tune the note as you play. (You can a little, but not much.)
Expanding on Eyebrows' point above, we had a discussion about tuning compensations for fretted instruments a couple of years ago over in Music Talk, which included a link to the Guitar Tuning Nightmares article by the producer/engineer Jack Endino. The section titled "More Math: There Will Be A Quiz In The Morning" is especially interesting.
Basically, the catch is that using frets on an instrument is itself a sort of tuning compromise, and so even the little bit you can "cheat" your tuning on a fretted instrument as you play can actually have a noticeable effect where chord #1 in one position is in tune, but chord #2 in a different position is not, or a note played on one fret on one string is not 110% "in tune" with the same note played on a different fret & different string. So players tend to develop a personal "feel" for how they compensate for these quirks, and since every player is slightly different, it's still common for a player to double-check the tuning even on a guitar freshly tuned offstage by their guitar tech, because their guitar tech doesn't 100% have the player's personal "feel".
posted by soundguy99 at 10:00 AM on October 16, 2014 [4 favorites]
To chime in on the "why so much tuning?" – a couple more things: first, the Dead played sixty different shows in 1977, so that means they're tuning up, on average, about three minutes per show, not quite as much as it may seem from an hour and a half of listening to them. Second, well, this is just part of how the Dead function in a lot of ways. They aren't like most bands in that they don't have setlists at all; they never planned out what songs they were going to play and when. So the process of picking up the instrument, fiddling with it a little, getting it tuned up and then trying out a familiar riff is exactly how they begin everything. Even songs with a distinct count-in, like say "New Minglewood Blues," usually just happened because somebody stomps or tries out that syncopated guitar riff and everybody else just comes around to it. So the process of feeling their way into the tune is an important one in a way that it really isn't for bands that know exactly what they're going to do before they hit the stage. Having everything pre-tuned wouldn't help them much; they'd still have to go through that process.
Also, when you know ahead of time that your audience expects more than three hours of you being up there, it's pretty much guaranteed that they can be patient for three minutes.
posted by koeselitz at 10:10 AM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
Also, when you know ahead of time that your audience expects more than three hours of you being up there, it's pretty much guaranteed that they can be patient for three minutes.
posted by koeselitz at 10:10 AM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
Playing it over again. This is so frustrating while also being relaxing. They come THIS CLOSE to playing the song and then on to the next tuning bit. The Tennessee Jed teaser at 1:03:49 is a killer. Or Terrapin at 1:06:04.
Waiting for the drop killed me...
posted by mikelieman at 10:36 AM on October 16, 2014
And here's my new ringtone...
posted by wellvis at 10:41 AM on October 16, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by wellvis at 10:41 AM on October 16, 2014 [2 favorites]
This was nice background noise to work to last night.
posted by me3dia at 10:55 AM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by me3dia at 10:55 AM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
Could somebody overdub Andy Kindler's Pigpen impression for the whole thing?
posted by Beardman at 11:38 AM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by Beardman at 11:38 AM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
> But you did not once mention the drugs. Which in this case, is probably 80% of the thing.
OK, I just gotta say...this is a tired trope. Yes, the Dead were high...uh, probably about all the time, especially in '77. And so were their audiences. And yet a HUGE reason for their success, going back to their Acid Test days and earlier, is that their experience wasn't about "just" getting high, it was about getting high and then doing something with it. Lots of musicians got (and get) high, and then embarrass themselves when they're on stage. One of the Dead's great charms, bless them, is that they got high and then somehow managed to play their asses off despite being attacked by invisible rabid clowns and aliens from the 11th dimension. You don't have to sample too many 1977 shows to see that this was true.
Were they high when they tuned for 3-5 minutes before a song? Undoubtedly some of them were. Did they ever tune for 30 minutes straight, or wander off stage, or otherwise lose focus and forget where they were? Not that I can recall. Their ability to function at their "jobs" while higher than kites is both astounding and well documented. That sort of skill set doesn't qualify them to be trauma surgeons, but it does qualify them to be improvisational rock musicians, a job they were pretty good at.
posted by mosk at 12:29 PM on October 16, 2014 [2 favorites]
OK, I just gotta say...this is a tired trope. Yes, the Dead were high...uh, probably about all the time, especially in '77. And so were their audiences. And yet a HUGE reason for their success, going back to their Acid Test days and earlier, is that their experience wasn't about "just" getting high, it was about getting high and then doing something with it. Lots of musicians got (and get) high, and then embarrass themselves when they're on stage. One of the Dead's great charms, bless them, is that they got high and then somehow managed to play their asses off despite being attacked by invisible rabid clowns and aliens from the 11th dimension. You don't have to sample too many 1977 shows to see that this was true.
Were they high when they tuned for 3-5 minutes before a song? Undoubtedly some of them were. Did they ever tune for 30 minutes straight, or wander off stage, or otherwise lose focus and forget where they were? Not that I can recall. Their ability to function at their "jobs" while higher than kites is both astounding and well documented. That sort of skill set doesn't qualify them to be trauma surgeons, but it does qualify them to be improvisational rock musicians, a job they were pretty good at.
posted by mosk at 12:29 PM on October 16, 2014 [2 favorites]
My first Dead concerts were during the wall of sound era, and it spoiled me for large concerts -- there has never been anything like it since that I know of, probably because of the expense of traveling with that much equipment. The microphone setup was especially cool, as described in eriko's link. Two matched microphones placed a couple of inches apart, with the musicians singing into one of them. A differential amplifier amplified only the sound that came through one microphone that didn't go through the other. So even though the wall of sound was behind the musicians only the voices were amplified by those amps.
posted by Killick at 1:53 PM on October 16, 2014
posted by Killick at 1:53 PM on October 16, 2014
Danf: “Eyebrows McGee - Everything you say is true. But you did not once mention the drugs. Which in this case, is probably 80% of the thing.”
mosk: “OK, I just gotta say...this is a tired trope. Yes, the Dead were high...uh, probably about all the time, especially in '77. And so were their audiences. And yet a HUGE reason for their success, going back to their Acid Test days and earlier, is that their experience wasn't about ‘just’ getting high, it was about getting high and then doing something with it.”
Well, and let's be clear: Danf is pretty much flatly wrong (sorry, Danf, I only speak the truth.) The Grateful Dead (almost?) completely stopped doing the hallucinogens-while-performing thing in the 1960s, and while that was an interesting inspirational thing early on, they quickly left acid, mushrooms, and the rest of the psychedelics behind. A number of early-seventies shows are pretty clearly fueled instead by boisterous youth combined with weed and booze.
By the mid-1970s, and especially 1977, their drug of choice that kept them fueled through sixty and seventy gigs per year was cocaine. This wasn't something that worked out well for them long-term, and of course by 1980 Jerry was at the breaking point because of it, but it drove them forward during this most creative period. Thankfully they got off the coke and slowed down before it completely destroyed them, although I still think it burned them out immensely and narrowed their best years a good deal. I often wonder what it would have been like if they'd cut it down to thirty or forty shows a year and eased up on the powder; maybe then 1985 shows would have shown the same vim and vigor that mid-1978 shows do. Probably.
Anyway – lest it need to be said – if "drugs" were "80% of the thing," then the Grateful Dead would have been off and playing the minute they stepped onstage. They certainly had the chemical energy to do so. The fact that they didn't wasn't down to the drugs at all, but was in spite of them – it was a naturally contemplative approach that, when counterbalanced against their energy, led to some amazing things.
In short: the idea that the Grateful Dead were a bunch of crazy, slack-jawed stoners tripped out of their mind on psychedelic pixie stardust and hallucinating rose-eyed skulls and flying terrapins is the worst kind of misconception: the misconception that every band is exactly like their fans.
posted by koeselitz at 2:24 PM on October 16, 2014 [4 favorites]
mosk: “OK, I just gotta say...this is a tired trope. Yes, the Dead were high...uh, probably about all the time, especially in '77. And so were their audiences. And yet a HUGE reason for their success, going back to their Acid Test days and earlier, is that their experience wasn't about ‘just’ getting high, it was about getting high and then doing something with it.”
Well, and let's be clear: Danf is pretty much flatly wrong (sorry, Danf, I only speak the truth.) The Grateful Dead (almost?) completely stopped doing the hallucinogens-while-performing thing in the 1960s, and while that was an interesting inspirational thing early on, they quickly left acid, mushrooms, and the rest of the psychedelics behind. A number of early-seventies shows are pretty clearly fueled instead by boisterous youth combined with weed and booze.
By the mid-1970s, and especially 1977, their drug of choice that kept them fueled through sixty and seventy gigs per year was cocaine. This wasn't something that worked out well for them long-term, and of course by 1980 Jerry was at the breaking point because of it, but it drove them forward during this most creative period. Thankfully they got off the coke and slowed down before it completely destroyed them, although I still think it burned them out immensely and narrowed their best years a good deal. I often wonder what it would have been like if they'd cut it down to thirty or forty shows a year and eased up on the powder; maybe then 1985 shows would have shown the same vim and vigor that mid-1978 shows do. Probably.
Anyway – lest it need to be said – if "drugs" were "80% of the thing," then the Grateful Dead would have been off and playing the minute they stepped onstage. They certainly had the chemical energy to do so. The fact that they didn't wasn't down to the drugs at all, but was in spite of them – it was a naturally contemplative approach that, when counterbalanced against their energy, led to some amazing things.
In short: the idea that the Grateful Dead were a bunch of crazy, slack-jawed stoners tripped out of their mind on psychedelic pixie stardust and hallucinating rose-eyed skulls and flying terrapins is the worst kind of misconception: the misconception that every band is exactly like their fans.
posted by koeselitz at 2:24 PM on October 16, 2014 [4 favorites]
I can't remember the year exactly but I remember reading part of a guy's memoir (Inside the Dead or whatever -- he was a drug dealer that had at least some level of inner access). Anyway, he was hanging out by the soundboard one gig and noticed that when the band was playing Terrapin Station, all the insiders were singing along, but they weren't chanting "Terrapin", they were chanting "Heroin" ... like it was some cool inside joke.
He didn't laugh.
posted by philip-random at 3:09 PM on October 16, 2014
He didn't laugh.
posted by philip-random at 3:09 PM on October 16, 2014
Anyway – lest it need to be said – if "drugs" were "80% of the thing," then the Grateful Dead would have been off and playing the minute they stepped onstage. They certainly had the chemical energy to do so. The fact that they didn't wasn't down to the drugs at all, but was in spite of them – it was a naturally contemplative approach that, when counterbalanced against their energy, led to some amazing things.
Well put.
posted by stinkfoot at 4:36 PM on October 16, 2014
Well put.
posted by stinkfoot at 4:36 PM on October 16, 2014
So even though the wall of sound was behind the musicians only the voices were amplified by those amps.
And the fact that most of the speakers were well above the band prevented them from being blown into the audience every time Phil started into "The Other One".
This mix of 1977 tuning came out a while ago, as I recall, and I remember it being one more reason to mourn the loss the one friend I used to listen to bootlegs with. I would have loved to burn it to CD, take it over to his house, tell him how much he was going to love this show, press play, and then see how long I could distract him with conversation before he realized nothing was happening. It would have been such fun.
posted by uosuaq at 5:05 PM on October 16, 2014 [4 favorites]
And the fact that most of the speakers were well above the band prevented them from being blown into the audience every time Phil started into "The Other One".
This mix of 1977 tuning came out a while ago, as I recall, and I remember it being one more reason to mourn the loss the one friend I used to listen to bootlegs with. I would have loved to burn it to CD, take it over to his house, tell him how much he was going to love this show, press play, and then see how long I could distract him with conversation before he realized nothing was happening. It would have been such fun.
posted by uosuaq at 5:05 PM on October 16, 2014 [4 favorites]
Small tuners or pedal tuners may not have existed then, but strobotuners certainly did (http://www.petersontuners.com/index.cfm?category=26). I've played tons of gigs in all sorts of weather (on bass) and have never had to spend more than a few seconds tuning up before a set. Guitars go out of tune easier than basses, but all the guitarists I've ever played with (with a couple exceptions) have only taken a little longer than me. The ones who did take a long time led me to the conclusion that some people are just bad at tuning and/or are obsessing over it. Tuning isn't hard, and unless you've got a guitar that's got some issues (or was built with cheap tuners), if it takes you more than 60 seconds to tune a guitar, you're doing something wrong.
posted by jonathanhughes at 7:25 PM on October 16, 2014
posted by jonathanhughes at 7:25 PM on October 16, 2014
If only you'd been around to teach Jerry how to do it, jonathanhughes!
posted by uosuaq at 7:59 PM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by uosuaq at 7:59 PM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
I am not a musician so don't know about tuning a guitar or how long it should take, but as a fan, a life long Deadhead, one who listens to shows everyday, I think the tuning parts, the stage banter is one of the great things about live recordings of the band.
The tuning makes you feel like you are at a show when you are listening. When they do the marching polka "time to play everyone's favorite game, take a giant step back. Take another step back." thing and Jerry twines, "Hey the folks up here are getting crushed" that brings me back to the shows when I got to the front of the stage. I was one of those bug eyed folks getting crushed. The water given to me by the security guy helped, but the plea to move back really was great. Hearing it again, maybe from a different show, floods the memory banks.
Standing at a show trying to guess the next song by the noodling was a great time. Now, instead of doing it with a bunch of folks near you at a show, I do it with my kids in the car. Some of the tuning teasers they play are great too. They will noodle in a Beatles song and then slip back into a second set jam.
A lot of it is called tuning, but some of it is just noodling while they decide what to play next. I think it also has to be appreciated that Jerry suffered from terrible stage fright all his life. He talks about it a lot in interviews, and maybe idle noodling helps him up there. Bob and his short shorts obviously didn't have that issue, and Phil would calmly belt out his Phil bombs and well all was well.
I have to add that if you go to a Furthur show (if they play again) or to a Phil and Friends show or Ratdog, the new arrangements for some of the songs are terrific.
posted by 724A at 9:58 PM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
The tuning makes you feel like you are at a show when you are listening. When they do the marching polka "time to play everyone's favorite game, take a giant step back. Take another step back." thing and Jerry twines, "Hey the folks up here are getting crushed" that brings me back to the shows when I got to the front of the stage. I was one of those bug eyed folks getting crushed. The water given to me by the security guy helped, but the plea to move back really was great. Hearing it again, maybe from a different show, floods the memory banks.
Standing at a show trying to guess the next song by the noodling was a great time. Now, instead of doing it with a bunch of folks near you at a show, I do it with my kids in the car. Some of the tuning teasers they play are great too. They will noodle in a Beatles song and then slip back into a second set jam.
A lot of it is called tuning, but some of it is just noodling while they decide what to play next. I think it also has to be appreciated that Jerry suffered from terrible stage fright all his life. He talks about it a lot in interviews, and maybe idle noodling helps him up there. Bob and his short shorts obviously didn't have that issue, and Phil would calmly belt out his Phil bombs and well all was well.
I have to add that if you go to a Furthur show (if they play again) or to a Phil and Friends show or Ratdog, the new arrangements for some of the songs are terrific.
posted by 724A at 9:58 PM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
I read an interview with John Paul Jones a few years ago. He said both that little band he played bass for and the Who loved to share the bill with American bands, especially SF bands who'd spend the opening minutes tuning up. Those two British monsters would come onstage with axes already tuned and then grab the audience immediately by the throat.
posted by Ber at 10:16 PM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by Ber at 10:16 PM on October 16, 2014 [1 favorite]
Ber: "I read an interview with John Paul Jones a few years ago. He said both that little band he played bass for and the Who loved to share the bill with American bands, especially SF bands who'd spend the opening minutes tuning up. Those two British monsters would come onstage with axes already tuned and then grab the audience immediately by the throat."
I love when Pete Townsend tunes his guitar by smashing it into his amp.
posted by 724A at 7:32 AM on October 17, 2014 [1 favorite]
I love when Pete Townsend tunes his guitar by smashing it into his amp.
posted by 724A at 7:32 AM on October 17, 2014 [1 favorite]
I know plenty of people (especially acoustic musicians -- fiddlers and the like) who prefer to tune by ear than by a digital tuner.
You know what they say; there's only one thing worse than spending too much time tuning on stage -- not spending enough.
posted by transient at 8:05 AM on October 17, 2014 [1 favorite]
You know what they say; there's only one thing worse than spending too much time tuning on stage -- not spending enough.
posted by transient at 8:05 AM on October 17, 2014 [1 favorite]
I'll take my tuning with some Funiculi Funicula, Tico Tico, and Hideaway, thankyouverymuch.
posted by ssmug at 8:06 AM on October 17, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by ssmug at 8:06 AM on October 17, 2014 [1 favorite]
I've really enjoyed watching this thread this week and appreciate the post -- glad to see something weird & nichey like this could find such a wide audience. Thanks, koeselitz & MF'ers.
posted by whileseated at 8:46 AM on October 18, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by whileseated at 8:46 AM on October 18, 2014 [1 favorite]
I love threads like these. They remind me that I am still surrounded by my people.
posted by terrapin at 4:01 PM on November 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by terrapin at 4:01 PM on November 4, 2014 [2 favorites]
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