Harriet Tubman will replace Andrew Jackson on the $20
April 20, 2016 9:58 AM Subscribe

Secretary of the Treasury Jack Lew announced that Harriet Tubman, a black woman who helped to free slaves via the Underground Railroad, will replace Andrew Jackson on the front of the US $20 bill. This is a change from earlier plans to replace Alexander Hamilton on the $10 with a woman. The new bill designs “should be ready by 2020.”
posted by Rangi (225 comments total) 63 users marked this as a favorite

It hasn't been officially announced yet, just "reported." Pretty dang awesome if true, however.
posted by Celsius1414 at 10:00 AM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

I feel a great disturbance in the Force, as if millions of racist and sexist voices suddenly cried out in terror and are going to continue to gibber on about it for the next 5-10 years.
posted by entropicamericana at 10:00 AM on April 20, 2016 [121 favorites]

Four years? Four years, huh? That'll take four years.
posted by Caduceus at 10:01 AM on April 20, 2016 [6 favorites]

I'm glad Lew deferred to the wisdom of the crowd here, because the crowd-sourced ideas were just better than the Treasury's this time around.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 10:01 AM on April 20, 2016 [11 favorites]

Nice!
posted by Diablevert at 10:01 AM on April 20, 2016

This is actually double-cool to me.

1. Because Herriet Tubman is a boss.

2. It always struck me as really disrespectful to Jackson and his ideals to have his face on currency printed by the Federal Reserve. Yeah, Jackson was a nutjob in many ways, but the war against the banks was his baby, so what better way to represent that by removing him from money he would be disgusted by?
posted by deadaluspark at 10:02 AM on April 20, 2016 [17 favorites]

CNN has previously said new bills won't be ready until 2030.
posted by dnash at 10:03 AM on April 20, 2016

It's nice that they can finally have both a woman and a non-white person on a bill, while also eliminating an ongoing kick-in-the-teeth to the Native American population in the same stroke.
posted by 256 at 10:04 AM on April 20, 2016 [57 favorites]

Hurrah! Also, Andrew Jackson was an utter creep and I am as delighted to see him go as by the choice of Tubman to replace him. I am also pleased Hamilton is hanging out on the front of the $10. Thanks, Broadway!
posted by bearwife at 10:04 AM on April 20, 2016 [12 favorites]

"Four years? Four years, huh? That'll take four years."

I was reading about it over the weekend and it said the design cycle for a new bill is around 15 years, which is part of why US bills are hard to counterfeit (i.e., a lot of that 15 years goes into anticounterfeiting measures). So 2020 is madly expedited. The $20 SHOULD have a new bill in 2030, so this'll be ten years early.

I think that's why Lew initially wanted to put a woman on the $10 -- it was next up and the design cycle is very slow, and he didn't want to tell people, "Wait until 2030 for the $20."
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 10:04 AM on April 20, 2016 [20 favorites]

Happy with this.
posted by widdershins at 10:05 AM on April 20, 2016

This is something that genuinely gives me the "America, you great unfinished symphony" feeling and I 100% admit to crying at my desk when I heard the news. I know it's a long road. I know this is a tiny thing. I know we have so much more work to do. But I love to see positive changes and this is certainly one.
posted by kate blank at 10:07 AM on April 20, 2016 [43 favorites]

Question though: Is this not something that a theoretical Trump-appointed Secretary of the Treasury could easily put the kibosh on?
posted by 256 at 10:08 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

It always struck me as really disrespectful to Jackson and his ideals to have his face on currency printed by the Federal Reserve

prolly more disrespectful to the descendants of all the native americans his policies slaughtered but really how could we ever know whether a single dead man's feelings are more important than the feelings of hundreds of thousands of alive people
posted by poffin boffin at 10:08 AM on April 20, 2016 [55 favorites]

Yeah, at least this means the change will be set in motion.... still slow, for those of us not privy to the behind-the-scenes work that has to be done, but at least we'll know it is finally coming.

And yay for Harriet Tubman! If not her, I'd have gone with Eleanor Roosevelt.
posted by easily confused at 10:08 AM on April 20, 2016

This is fantastic. Up here, we're finally putting women (other than, y'know, The Boss) on our bills too. The RCM is deciding who it'll be. I truly hope it's a First Nations woman.
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 10:09 AM on April 20, 2016 [5 favorites]

I'm looking forward to calling these $20s "Tubbies", like how the the $20s on the other side in Fringe with MLK Jr on them were called "Juniors". This is also another fine example of political correctness run amok in the US.
posted by Rob Rockets at 10:10 AM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

A fine choice! And I'm glad they realized that later or not, taking Jackson off rather than Hamilton was the way to go (though I wouldn't have been sad if they had dropped both of them for women.)
posted by tavella at 10:10 AM on April 20, 2016

Seems like a good place for the Drunk History episode on Harriet Tubman, one of my favorite installments.
posted by Miko at 10:10 AM on April 20, 2016 [15 favorites]

I like the idea of switching the Hamilton, too.
posted by jeather at 10:11 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

This is so cool. I got a little frisson when i read the news.
posted by notsnot at 10:11 AM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

This is also another fine example of political correctness run amok in the US.

say what now
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 10:12 AM on April 20, 2016 [29 favorites]

For a certain segment of the population, this is probably another reason why we should hurry up and switch everything to bitcoin and I couldn't be happier bathing in their hypothetical rage.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 10:12 AM on April 20, 2016 [5 favorites]

I am both extremely delighted by getting a black woman on the 20 dollar bill, no less.

But could not help thinking of this.
posted by [insert clever name here] at 10:13 AM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

Yay! Looking forward to the official announcement. And the delicious racistsexist tears.
posted by sparklemotion at 10:13 AM on April 20, 2016 [3 favorites]

This is great but I am a little sad; with Jackson gone, my hairstyle is no longer reflected on US currency.
posted by selfnoise at 10:14 AM on April 20, 2016 [3 favorites]

This will make her the second African-American portrayed on United States currency -- the first being Duke Ellington on the District of Columbia quarter.
posted by y2karl at 10:15 AM on April 20, 2016 [19 favorites]

American currency needs a comprehensive restructuring and new designs across the board, (and the US Mint needs the power to issue commemorative coins of arbitrary denomination and composition on its own,) but any change is good.
posted by Small Dollar at 10:16 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

For a certain segment of the population, this is probably another reason why we should hurry up and switch everything to bitcoin and I couldn't be happier bathing in their hypothetical rage.

someday rare pepes will be a valid form of currency everywhere and they won't have to touch your dirty SJW money!
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:16 AM on April 20, 2016 [12 favorites]

This is a wonderful Wednesday surprise and I am pleased to no end.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 10:18 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

So if they keep Jackson on the back of a Tubman $20, think of all the teeth-gnashing he'll be spending his afterlife doing... him on Federal money (which yeah: he'd hate), sharing that bill with a black woman on the front? Works for me!
posted by easily confused at 10:18 AM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

Even beyond Jackson's horribleness, It's extra appropriate for Tubman to appear on the $20.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 10:18 AM on April 20, 2016 [31 favorites]

hippybear: "Oh, and the $1. Sacajawea would be my choice."

Sacagawea is already on the $1!
posted by scrump at 10:20 AM on April 20, 2016 [10 favorites]

Progress is possible.
posted by Mei's lost sandal at 10:22 AM on April 20, 2016

So far all bellyaching I've seen has been about (a) why do things have to chaaaange; or (b) don't associate this awesome hero with our eeeeevil capitalist system. I've seen no comments so far about Jackson deserving to be on the bill on his own merits or Tubman not earning a place on it. Everyone seems to agree who the Awesome American is here.

it was complete idiocy to try and do this with the $10 instead of the $20 and I hope a number of people called Lew up and told him so, because he deserved to be called out for it, as did anyone else involved with that decision. the campaign to get a woman on the $20 had little to nothing to do with expediency and convenience for Treasury. this is small potatoes now but it symbolizes to me how goddamn blind otherwise "smart" people (ahem, at least one subset of people) can be about issues like this.
posted by sallybrown at 10:24 AM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

It's funny how they buried an important detail here – but to repeat what cjelli pointed out above, here's an important line from the article:

"Also, Jackson isn’t getting completely booted off the $20 bill. He’s likely to remain on the back."

So, yeah. Andrew Jackson will still be on the $20. We'll just have Harriet Tubman on the other side. Which is actually a bit gross to me, like we're trying to strike a balance between choosing to honor the contributions of people who don't happen to be white supremacists on the one hand and holding onto that white supremacist legacy on the other.
posted by koeselitz at 10:26 AM on April 20, 2016 [10 favorites]

Question though: Is this not something that a theoretical Trump-appointed Secretary of the Treasury could easily put the kibosh on?

Damn, that's right, he probably will. Although I do think it's unlikely that Trump will be appointing a Secretary of the Treasury - being such a skilled money manager he'll probably appoint himself to the position, after he gives it a more alpha-sounding title.
posted by Flashman at 10:26 AM on April 20, 2016

Good choice.
posted by kyrademon at 10:28 AM on April 20, 2016

If we're choosing women for other currency, I'd add Fannie Lou Hamer, Wilma Mankiller, Abigail Adams, Dorothy Day, Yuri Kochiyama, and Ruth Bader Ginsburg to the list.
posted by sallybrown at 10:28 AM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

We've got a perfectly fine Queen you yanks could borrow if you need more women on your currency.
posted by blue_beetle at 10:28 AM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

That Tubman Drunk History is so good. Call LMM and get that character into the Hamilton production.
posted by Mei's lost sandal at 10:28 AM on April 20, 2016

If we'd just stop printing one-dollar fucking bills Sacagawea could claim her due on US currency.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 10:30 AM on April 20, 2016 [10 favorites]

They'll also finally be debuting a tactile feature on the new US currency.
posted by jeather at 10:30 AM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

There's a certain delicious irony to the possibility that Jackson would be all 'back of the bill' while Tubman sits up front.
posted by Mooski at 10:31 AM on April 20, 2016 [5 favorites]

Using time travel.
posted by Mei's lost sandal at 10:34 AM on April 20, 2016

I'd love to hear the reasoning behind keeping Jackson on the back of the bill because right now I don't get it.

Anyway I love this. This is important. Representation is important. Who we choose to honor and lift up and put on currency is important, despite (or maybe even because of) the fact that in a lot of ways the faces on bills are just background noise - I want more women of color to be in that background noise.
posted by sunset in snow country at 10:34 AM on April 20, 2016 [3 favorites]

This isn't my original thought but it's the one that I keep coming back to – Americans possibly being reminded of slavery every time they spend or receive a twenty-dollar bill is one of those things that feels so important to acknowledging our history and our sins.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 10:35 AM on April 20, 2016 [34 favorites]

Until vending machines across the country will accept dollar coins, they will never be widely accepted.

If they stopped printing dollar bills, vending machines would suddenly start accepting dollar coins. Maybe it's unnecessary to switch over for the US, but the only way to actually make a switch happen is to stop printing bills. Doing both is worst of both worlds.
posted by jeather at 10:36 AM on April 20, 2016

Actually, the first African-American to appear as themselves on a circulating US coin was York, William Clark's personal slave who accompanied him on the expedition, on the Missouri state quarter.

The first African-American to appear on any US coin was Hettie Anderson, the model for Liberty on Augustus Saint-Gaudens' classic and widely beloved double eagle.
posted by Small Dollar at 10:36 AM on April 20, 2016 [14 favorites]

Put Sacajawea on the front of the $2 bill and Lewis and Clark on the back and they'd still be able to give them out at Monticello.
posted by thecaddy at 10:36 AM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

You gotta keep Sacajeawea on any money with Lewis and Clark on it because otherwise, it would always be getting lost.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 10:37 AM on April 20, 2016 [83 favorites]

I don't get why there has to be one person on all bills of a denomination. The portrait is not a security feature and nobody looks at the face to figure out the denomination, they look at the big number for that. Other than development costs for new plates, why don't we have a bunch of different people on our bills much like we did with the backs of the state quarters.

I don't think this is right. Bills are all the same size, and your eye is drawn towards its center, not its periphery. You need them to be quickly readable by people handling money. Coins are different, because they have unique sizing. Having non-standard faces for bills definitely seems like it'd cause confusion.

That being said, the back isn't far enough for Jackson. Hopefully they reconsider even giving him that.
posted by codacorolla at 10:40 AM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

Although I do think it's unlikely that Trump will be appointing a Secretary of the Treasury - being such a skilled money manager he'll probably appoint himself to the position, after he gives it a more alpha-sounding title.

MONEY BOSS

I'd love to hear the reasoning behind keeping Jackson on the back of the bill because right now I don't get it.

Other than a sop to racists, sexists, racist sexists, and cretins who disingenuously advocate "respect for tradition," there is no fathomable reason to keep Jackson on the $20 in any form, and the space on the back should be given to esoteric illuminati symbols or neoclassical architecture instead. If they end up putting him there, when my grandchildren ask me who the guy on the back of the $20 is, I'll just tell them it's Rick Sanchez, a pioneering scientist of the early 21st century.
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:42 AM on April 20, 2016 [19 favorites]

Also there were commemorative coins with African-Americans before the Washington DC quarter, including one with Booker T. Washington and one with Washington and George Washington Carver, and others with Jackie Robinson, Crispus Attucks, and the Little Rock Nine.
posted by Small Dollar at 10:43 AM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

Let me use this moment to state that I am also happy Hamilton seems to have displaced Bloody Bloody Andrew Jackson as the musical all the musical nerds talk about all the fucking time.
posted by maxsparber at 10:43 AM on April 20, 2016 [6 favorites]

The second most interesting thing about Tubman on the $20 is that I believe she will be the first person represented on US currency with a photograph rather than a portrait. That's right, isn't it?
posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:44 AM on April 20, 2016

NPR: ""We'll note that Tubman's appearance on the $20 bill would have a special historical resonance: That's the same amount she eventually received from the U.S. government as her monthly pension for her service as a nurse, scout, cook and spy during the Civil War, as well as for her status as the widow of a veteran."
posted by mr. digits at 10:45 AM on April 20, 2016 [7 favorites]

If they stopped printing dollar bills, vending machines would suddenly start accepting dollar coins. Maybe it's unnecessary to switch over for the US, but the only way to actually make a switch happen is to stop printing bills. Doing both is worst of both worlds.

Not coincidentally, the lobbying in favor of keeping the $1 bill comes largely from the vending machine lobby.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 10:45 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Many vending machines accept dollar coins because Sacajawea is close enough to Susan B. Anthony.
posted by Monochrome at 10:46 AM on April 20, 2016

Hamilton saved Hamilton.
posted by jamjam at 10:48 AM on April 20, 2016 [9 favorites]

Like three days ago, my roommate and I were wondering which woman they'd choose for the $20. I said "aside from the fact that she totally deserves it, it would be the ultimate troll on racist conservative reactionaries to pick Harriet Tubman, but they'll never go for that in a million years."
posted by showbiz_liz at 10:49 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Which would be awesome if it was something like that: "What, you can't see him? Look closer, he's between the third and fourth pillars of that building. It helps to squint."

a dramatic death triptych of him being trod upon by a majestic herd of buffalo

in the third and final panel a buffalo poops on him
posted by poffin boffin at 10:49 AM on April 20, 2016 [37 favorites]

Just leaving this here preemptively: Harriet Tubman never said "I could have saved thousands - if only I’d been able to convince them they were slaves" (and the "unwitting slave" narrative is frequently used in support of paternalistic policy).

Thanks for posting this, as it makes me feel doubly fortunate. First, because I hadn't previously heard this false quote attributed to Tubman, and I am happy to have been spared it up until the point I learned it wasn't true.. Second, because I was also ignorant of the website you linked providing the debunking, and I'm glad to have been pointed to it. I read the Tubman entry, then the linked post about Frederick Douglass, and then just went to the front page of W. Caleb McDaniel's website and flagged three more pieces for future reference.
posted by layceepee at 10:49 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Andrew Jackson owned hundreds of slaves. They fucking better not dare not put him on the same bill as Tubman.
posted by Nelson at 10:52 AM on April 20, 2016 [6 favorites]

She's just non stop.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:53 AM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

The first African-American to appear on any US coin was Hettie Anderson, the model for Liberty on Augustus Saint-Gaudens' classic and widely beloved double eagle.

What! I LOVE THIS TOO. LOVE IT. I am learning all this stuff from this thread and from looking up Harriet Tubman and I am just so geekily happy right now
posted by sunset in snow country at 10:53 AM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

I love this, especially his bitter bitterness that he didn't get to replace Hams because of all of us musical nerds complaining endlessly.
posted by corb at 10:54 AM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

I'd love to hear the reasoning behind keeping Jackson on the back of the bill because right now I don't get it.

It seems like it would be fitting to first "generously" remove him to a place that nobody powerful cares about, promise that he can at least stay there forever, then when somebody does start caring about it we can "organically" kick him off of there too. The sooner the better, so to speak.
posted by roystgnr at 10:55 AM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

A Harriet Tubman musical but with screamo instead of rapping.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 10:56 AM on April 20, 2016 [7 favorites]

first person represented on US currency with a photograph rather than a portrait

Source of Abe's likeness on the 5
posted by cmfletcher at 10:56 AM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

I'd love to hear the reasoning behind keeping Jackson on the back of the bill because right now I don't get it.

It's an insecurity feature.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 10:57 AM on April 20, 2016 [29 favorites]

I will admit that I'd rather have Tubman replace Hamilton instead, but only so that Jackson could be replaced by, say, Sequoyah. Because fuck you, Andy.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 10:59 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

If he wanted to be on money he shouldn't have done all those genocides.
posted by Artw at 11:00 AM on April 20, 2016 [22 favorites]

Really Mr. Maitre D? You say you have no tables available? My friend Miss Harriet might say otherwise.
posted by mikeburg at 11:04 AM on April 20, 2016 [22 favorites]

More Tubman myths and facts.

"I had reasoned this out in my mind; there was one of two things I had a right to, liberty, or death; if I could not have one, I would have the other; for no man should take me alive; I should fight for my liberty as long as my strength lasted, and when the time came for me to go, the Lord would let them take me." Harriet Tubman to Sarah Bradford in Harriet, The Moses of Her People 1886
posted by Potomac Avenue at 11:05 AM on April 20, 2016 [6 favorites]

Isn't the twenty the most often counterfeited bill? That may be a very old datum. Anyway, that might explain why this may take awhile. I went and read the wiki first thing-what a badass!
posted by Bee'sWing at 11:08 AM on April 20, 2016

Got a big goofy smile on my face and said "whoa!" aloud when I read this news. Totally unexpected, totally delightful.
posted by town of cats at 11:10 AM on April 20, 2016

Well, I stand happily corrected as to who was the first African-American to appear on a coin as either Liberty or their actual self.

On a sidenote, I first saw the Duke Ellington quarter as change at Roy St. Coffee, whereupon I said, 'Wow, look at that that -- Duke Ellington on a quarter!'

To which the GenZmillenial barista asked, 'Who's Duke Ellington ?'
posted by y2karl at 11:12 AM on April 20, 2016 [7 favorites]

I'd love to hear the reasoning behind keeping Jackson on the back of the bill because right now I don't get it.

An attempt to keep the whining crybaby response to a manageable level.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:13 AM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

*presses lips tight together*

*clenches fists*

*sweats profusely*

HARRIET TUBMAN, SAME AS IN TOWN
posted by cortex at 11:17 AM on April 20, 2016 [111 favorites]

HARRIET TUBMAN, SAME AS IN TOWN

Wow, it was sitting RIGHT THERE and we all whiffed. Now we know why cortex was chosen to helm the Good Ship MeFi.
posted by tonycpsu at 11:19 AM on April 20, 2016 [31 favorites]

Before Abe was put on the penny in 1909, all US coins either had a woman or Native American on them. None of them were real women or Native Americans, though...
posted by clorox at 11:20 AM on April 20, 2016 [3 favorites]

I thought the $100 was the most-counterfeited bill? That was what they told me in retail, anyway. Our most frequent issue was people buying stuff with a fake $100 just to get change back.

I'm a huge fan of Harriet Tubman and this whole thing is just wonderful and I can't even wait for 2030. I'm also really excited about the tactile addition to the bills, which will solve a problem for a lot of people (either who have a visual impairment or who like knowing how much money they have without having to look.)
posted by blnkfrnk at 11:22 AM on April 20, 2016

Before Abe was put on the penny in 1909, all US coins either had a woman or Native American on them. None of them were real women or Native Americans, though...

I would hope not. It would be like looking at Han Solo trapped in carbonite but in coin form in your pocket or change holder.
posted by juiceCake at 11:23 AM on April 20, 2016 [5 favorites]

How about each state gets to pick which president appears on their dollar coin?
posted by Artw at 11:25 AM on April 20, 2016

How about each state gets to pick which president appears on their dollar coin?

Because you know some dipshit governor is going to make a fuss about Jefferson Davis.
posted by clorox at 11:29 AM on April 20, 2016 [9 favorites]

Hey I know posting dumb offensive things that people say about this will be a bad thing for this thread so when people see them can you just DM them to me on twitter so I can eat hot salty crybaby tears for breakfast lunch and dinner?
posted by Potomac Avenue at 11:31 AM on April 20, 2016 [7 favorites]

Are we living in the 21st century, for real?
posted by Halloween Jack at 11:33 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Because you know some dipshit governor is going to make a fuss about Jefferson Davis.

put sorrell booke on instead.
posted by poffin boffin at 11:33 AM on April 20, 2016 [3 favorites]

My only regret here (aside from this not having happened decades ago) is that they missed the opportunity to put Samuel L. Jackson on the $20, so we could keep colloquially referring to them as "Jacksons"

Also he'd have to be dead for that and that would be sad & unlikely, but hey so far in 2016 the famous folk are dropping like flies so it could still happen

(please don't let it happen)
posted by caution live frogs at 11:34 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

How about each state gets to pick which president appears on their dollar coin?

Nebraska would almost certainly try to argue that Herbie Husker was some sort of president.
posted by maxsparber at 11:39 AM on April 20, 2016 [3 favorites]

MJ Is still dead.
posted by Artw at 11:43 AM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Also: King of Pop - that's kind of a head of state.
posted by Artw at 11:46 AM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

Technically speaking, Nelson Muntz is not alive.
posted by y2karl at 11:58 AM on April 20, 2016

Oh, shit, the $50... um... any suggestions?

Shirley Chisholm?
posted by Itaxpica at 12:01 PM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

Everyone seems to agree who the Awesome American is here.

Except Some Dude on a friend's FB post who says we need to have more respect for our "founding fathers." Umm, dude? I have bad news for you about Jackson. He didn't found shit.
posted by threeturtles at 12:05 PM on April 20, 2016 [14 favorites]

Heh. Another one you'll probably hear is "B-b-but Harriet Tubman was never president! We're only supposed to put presidents on our bills!"
Then politely ask them to describe the chief accomplishments while-in-office of President Franklin and President Hamilton.
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:14 PM on April 20, 2016 [15 favorites]

So I did a search of my history because I knew we had discussed our secret desire that Jackson would be switched out for a woman and that Hamilton would remain in a Hamilton thread and sure enough, here it is and here's protocoach suggesting

Good candidates to replace genocidal racist Andrew Jackson: Ida Wells, Susan Anthony, Harriet Tubman.

My reason for pointing this out is just in case we do have the ear of somebody making decisions about paper currency, I think Eliza Hamilton should b eon the back of the $10 bill . She founded the first private orphanage in New York City, you know. Perhaps you've heard me talk about this before. Wait, wait, come back...
posted by MCMikeNamara at 12:14 PM on April 20, 2016 [8 favorites]

I was so, so thrilled to hear this. Beyond thrilled. I kind of can't believe an entity as big as the Treasury/Mint managed to change course so quickly and end up with the right solution.
posted by LobsterMitten at 12:17 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

I've also been enjoying turning over the phrase "war hero Harriet Tubman."
posted by LobsterMitten at 12:18 PM on April 20, 2016 [22 favorites]

"The Federal Reserve began taking high-denomination currency out of circulation (destroying large bills received by banks) in 1969, after an executive order by President Nixon...

As of May 30, 2009, only 336 $10,000 bills were known to exist; 342 remaining $5,000 bills; and 165,372 remaining $1,000 bills."

Talk about forshadowing.
posted by clavdivs at 12:23 PM on April 20, 2016

finally be debuting a tactile feature on the new US currency

Sarcasm? If no, US bills have actually had a tactile feature for quite a while now. The threads on everyone's lapels are raised.
posted by aspersioncast at 12:24 PM on April 20, 2016

As in, it looks like they are indeed adding some tactile features, but it's not a debut exactly.
posted by aspersioncast at 12:28 PM on April 20, 2016

the $50... um... any suggestions?

Frances Perkins. Suffrage, non-evil economics, labor rights, the New Deal generally.
posted by clew at 12:33 PM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

Also forgot to say this is a great choice and Jackson sucked.
posted by aspersioncast at 12:35 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Jackson is spinning in his grave fast enough to power a small metropolis, and that's the world i want to live in.
posted by you're a kitty! at 12:36 PM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

Other than development costs for new plates, why don't we have a bunch of different people on our bills much like we did with the backs of the state quarters.

US currency is printed with an intaglio process. The original master is hand engraved and the actual plates/cylinders used for printing are reproduced off the master. The engraver is literally an artist.
posted by nathan_teske at 12:37 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

Sarcasm? If no, US bills have actually had a tactile feature for quite a while now. The threads on everyone's lapels are raised.

No, tactile feature = way for people to know which bill they have without having to see, usually some combination of different bill sizes, intaglio, perforations or other sorts of raised marks that are clearly distinguishable between the different amounts.
posted by jeather at 12:43 PM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

A couple comments deleted. If you don't care about this, please just skip the thread.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 12:46 PM on April 20, 2016 [5 favorites]

Well, this is good news. Harriet Tubman was astonishing, and I'm thrilled to see a woman of color be represented on US currency.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 12:47 PM on April 20, 2016

I wonder if the delay to 2030 or thereabouts will be when the US currency switches to polymer instead of paper?
posted by stannate at 12:51 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

How Your Right-Wing Uncle is Going to React to Harriet Tubman on the $20 Bill

But will they respond exclusively with racist bile? Oh, no -- some of them will pretend that their objections are fact-based.

[...]

Which of these lines of attack is your uncle going to choose? Probably all of them at various times -- recall that Martin Luther King, to the right, is both a commie sex addict and a conservative Republican who would hate any modern movement for racial justice. So steel yourself for this nonsense.

posted by tonycpsu at 12:51 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Americans possibly being reminded of slavery every time they spend or receive a twenty-dollar bill is one of those things that feels so important to acknowledging our history and our sins.

Seems like every ATM I get cash from doesn't dispense anything lower than a $20 bill. I don't know if it's an industry default but if it is, I imagine between now and 2030 a big market for $10 bill-dispensing ATMs will develop in many if not most of the former Confederate states of the U.S. It'll be telling what places outside of the South they pop up in too.
posted by fuse theorem at 12:56 PM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

Small Dollar: "American currency needs a comprehensive restructuring and new designs across the board,"

Ya, time to join the cool kids and move to plastic bills.

Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish: "Not coincidentally, the lobbying in favor of keeping the $1 bill comes largely from the vending machine lobby."

That's actually not true. The lobbying dollars pro paper comes from the paper lobby and the lobbying pro coin from the copper miners.
posted by Mitheral at 12:59 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

$20 is the standard ATM dish-out here in Canada too. RBC used to have $5 bills in their ATMS (which was super useful when I was young and... wait I'm still poor, bring it back.)
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 12:59 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

From tonycpsu's link:
DOOCY: If that is the standard, next thing you know, folks, we're going to have cats on money.

Yes, please.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 1:00 PM on April 20, 2016 [6 favorites]

This is fantastic. Is there an official announcement yet?
posted by cashman at 1:02 PM on April 20, 2016

Preferably a press release with a photo and Obama is standing behind Lew like Ghostface on the cover of Only Built 4 Cuban Linx.
posted by cashman at 1:04 PM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

Recent scholarly work on H. Tubman.

cats on money.
posted by IndigoJones at 1:09 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

"Surely I'm not the only person to note that Jackson was forcibly removed from his longtime location and made to go to another by order of the United States government."
posted by homunculus at 1:37 PM on April 20, 2016 [6 favorites]

$20 is the only bill only in rich neighborhoods. In poor neighborhoods we have often had the ability to get $10 and $5 bills. Assuming that only racists will have those machines is seriously flawed.
posted by corb at 1:40 PM on April 20, 2016

Tiny little detail missing from the original reports: Jackson is sticking around.

Absolute trash. Get that genocidal dick off our money. Forcing Tubman to share a bill with him is just insulting.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:42 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

the fuck?
posted by tonycpsu at 1:43 PM on April 20, 2016 [3 favorites]

Forcing Tubman to share a bill with him is just insulting.

She’ll always be sharing the currency with at least one slave holder, because Washington isn’t going anywhere. Perhaps better to consider it an epitomization of America in one note, rather than several. Jackson wasn’t always so hated, and the wheel will spin around on him again as well. Not completely, but it’ll surely spin.
posted by Going To Maine at 2:04 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm sorry Mr Jackson (ooo) but get off our bills
We are not fans of your genocide
Harriet Tubman is much more fly
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:05 PM on April 20, 2016 [19 favorites]

She’ll always be sharing the currency with at least one slave holder, because Washington isn’t going anywhere.

I don't mean "share" as in "also on some denomination of currency". In this case, I mean "share" as in "literally on the same bill as".
posted by tobascodagama at 2:08 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

WAIT, GUYS, we're also getting women's suffrage fighters on the $10 plus MLK Jr, Marian Anderson and Eleanor Roosevelt on the $5! IS EVERYONE CRYING OR JUST ME.
posted by kate blank at 2:20 PM on April 20, 2016 [31 favorites]

Amazing!!!! I am so excited!!!
posted by agregoli at 2:23 PM on April 20, 2016

fuse theorem: "Seems like every ATM I get cash from doesn't dispense anything lower than a $20 bill. I don't know if it's an industry default but if it is, I imagine between now and 2030 a big market for $10 bill-dispensing ATMs will develop in many if not most of the former Confederate states of the U.S. It'll be telling what places outside of the South they pop up in too."

ATMs near me go down to $5 bills.
posted by boo_radley at 2:27 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

I really really really hope the new set of notes will take design inspiration from the Educational Series.
posted by clorox at 2:28 PM on April 20, 2016

There are $5 and $10 dispensing ATMs in probably every part of the US I've ever been in that was outside a huge metro area.
posted by poffin boffin at 2:32 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

OMG!

I like the thematic ties: Hamilton gets images of the suffrage march to the Treasury on the back, Lincoln gets historic events at the Lincoln Memorial. This still, of course, leaves me wondering WTF is going on with the $20. But still, this is so awesome!
posted by sunset in snow country at 2:35 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

cortex: "*presses lips tight together*

*clenches fists*

*sweats profusely*

HARRIET TUBMAN, SAME AS IN TOWN"

FPP posted: April 20, 2016 9:58
Time of joke: April 20, 2016 11:17

I would like to propose 159 minutes (2:39) as the "cortex threshold". The cortex threshold indicates the point in a thread after which it's acceptable to make a "Metafilter:" tagline joke or MetaFilter-in-joke-related pun.

Violations are punishable by having a tiny clown hat appear next to your name for three days, with all content of your comments or posts replaced with clown-horn onomatopoeia.
posted by scrump at 2:36 PM on April 20, 2016 [18 favorites]

Just a tiny, quick whisper of advice from me to you: do not get over-excited about these new developments and enthusiastically tell someone that "THERE'S GOING TO BE FUCKING WOMEN ON THE FIVE, THE TEN AND THE TWENTY" because that is actually something completely different that is not happening right now.

(Seriously though THIS IS SO GREAT.)
posted by kate blank at 2:58 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

This fantastic news. Even better, a friend of mine at the US Treasury Department tells me that they just signed a deal to have Zoe Saldana model for the new artwork!
posted by snofoam at 3:05 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

I imagine between now and 2030 a big market for $10 bill-dispensing ATMs will develop in many if not most of the former Confederate states of the U.S.

The South shall ~~rise~~ withdraw again!
posted by a lungful of dragon at 3:07 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Metafilter: clown-horn onomatopoeia.
posted by Earthtopus at 3:11 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Something else I like about these picks for the bills - Tubman and Truth and Stanton and Mott and Anthony were all older by the time they were getting their official portraits that we know them by. And being 19th century women, and because we have photos, they looked their age. So there are (fingers crossed) gonna be images of old craggy serious-looking women on these bills. It won't be just young pretty women (e.g. Alice Paul, who was young during the main suffrage campaigns, or Sacagawea). Not taking anything away from the latter whose public images are of them as younger women, but I think we don't have enough representations of visibly-older women leaders in our general public life, and it'll be nice to have more.
posted by LobsterMitten at 3:12 PM on April 20, 2016 [25 favorites]

I vote we have tiiiiiiny portraits of all the presidents up to Grant/founding fathers crammed onto the one-dollar bill. That will be our White Dude currency.

Everything else is people of color, native Americans, and/or women.

How about as a subtle watermark tessellated across the whole thing that only shows up under blacklight, or at an obtuse angle. Like the eagle and stuff on the US passport.

It would be really really challenging to counterfeit if it was properly high resolution, and then we can just jam whoever we want on all the money.

Personally i'm rooting for more native americans than just on a dollar coin but yea.
posted by emptythought at 3:13 PM on April 20, 2016

I feel a great disturbance in the Force, as if millions of racist and sexist voices suddenly cried out in terror and are going to continue to gibber on about it for the next 5-10 years.

I've been groaning internally since earlier imagining the experiences i had working food service where people wouldn't accept $2's or whatever, but with people who refuse to accept a $20 as change because it has a black woman on it and throw a huge shitfit. There will totally be people who flat out refuse to use these for anything and just use 10s and 50s. I bet there will even be businesses that proudly refuse to pick them up as change from the bank.

It's coming. Ugh.
posted by emptythought at 3:15 PM on April 20, 2016 [3 favorites]

I've been groaning internally since earlier imagining the experiences i had working food service where people wouldn't accept $2's or whatever, but with people who refuse to accept a $20 as change because it has a black woman on it and throw a huge shitfit. There will totally be people who flat out refuse to use these for anything and just use 10s and 50s

The $10 is going to have Sojourner Truth, along with other women's suffragists on it and the $5 will have MLK Jr, so, YOUR MOVE, racists.
posted by kate blank at 3:23 PM on April 20, 2016 [10 favorites]

Grace Jones on the $50
Aretha Franklin on the $100

let's do this
posted by speicus at 3:25 PM on April 20, 2016 [6 favorites]

Just a tiny, quick whisper of advice from me to you: do not get over-excited about these new developments and enthusiastically tell someone that "THERE'S GOING TO BE FUCKING WOMEN ON THE FIVE, THE TEN AND THE TWENTY" because that is actually something completely different that is not happening right now.

I'm glad, because that would be some seriously lewd currency.
posted by agregoli at 3:26 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

It can't be official yet: I took the tour at the Bureau of Engraving & Printing today, and the wincing by the young African American woman at the puns she was forced to deliver make me very confident she would have been delighted to have new material
posted by wenestvedt at 3:43 PM on April 20, 2016

HOLY SHIT FUCK YES UNBELIEVABLE OH MY GOD!!!!!!!$$$%%#@#!!!&~!!!!!
posted by latkes at 4:26 PM on April 20, 2016

The first African-American to appear on any US coin was Hettie Anderson, the model for Liberty on Augustus Saint-Gaudens' classic and widely beloved double eagle.

Interesting. I found this essay by William Hagans, a distant relative of Anderson's. He pieces together correspondence and other documentation showing Anderson's work with Saint-Gaudens, including as model for the figure of Victory in his monument to General Sherman. Hagans also explains how Saint-Gaudens' family, after he passed away, did their best to write Anderson out of the history of Saint-Gaudens' work.
posted by audi alteram partem at 4:28 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Oh man I just heard they're keeping hoary old Jackson on the back. Sad.
posted by latkes at 4:30 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm really glad Tubman gets at least the front of a bill to herself. Sure, there are no lone heroes who change the world. Individuals are parts in larger movements and all the unsung people make the world go round. But Tubman comes very high on a short list of people who in real and symbolic terms changed the course of American history, for good. She is one of the greatest Americans - with bravery beyond measure.
posted by latkes at 4:33 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

How Your Right-Wing Uncle is Going to React to Harriet Tubman on the $20 Bill

Sadly, the bulk of the Twidiot response is about how Tubman is "ugly".

Which is sadly appropriate - when has a woman ever done something powerful without a whole lot of damn people ignoring it and focusing on how she looks instead?
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:40 PM on April 20, 2016 [4 favorites]

On the bright side, though, ColdChef just retweeted this gem:

"I feel so bad for Andrew Jackson, being forced to relocate by the federal government."
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:43 PM on April 20, 2016 [25 favorites]

Sadly, the bulk of the Twidiot response is about how Tubman is "ugly".

I'm not up to date on Twitter algorithms so it might have just figured me out and be sorting shit accordingly but I'm seeing more backlash at that link than anything.

Anyway I like it. MORE UGLY WOMEN IN POSITIONS OF PROMINENCE!!! Henceforth this shall be my rallying cry.
posted by sunset in snow country at 4:47 PM on April 20, 2016 [7 favorites]

Imagine if the back of the $20 keeps Jackson, but shows him in the distant background, with a scene from the Trail of Tears in the foreground.
posted by LobsterMitten at 4:50 PM on April 20, 2016 [10 favorites]

MORE UGLY WOMEN IN POSITIONS OF PROMINENCE!!!

This x1000.
posted by LobsterMitten at 4:50 PM on April 20, 2016

I've seen a lot of design ideas circulating today. This is my favorite so far.
posted by Jacqueline at 5:08 PM on April 20, 2016 [3 favorites]

Sadly, the bulk of the Twidiot response is about how Tubman is "ugly".

Harriet Tubman at 90
posted by Going To Maine at 5:11 PM on April 20, 2016 [3 favorites]

Metafilter: HONK HONK HONK HONK HONK HONK HONK AROOOOOGA!
posted by Cookiebastard at 5:15 PM on April 20, 2016

I kind of wish they'd gone all the way on this and actually taken him off entirely.

I hear it's a security feature. You hold the bill up to the light and you see a slave owner kissing Harriet Tubman's arse.
posted by Joe in Australia at 5:21 PM on April 20, 2016 [9 favorites]

$20 is the only bill only in rich neighborhoods.

I can assure you that isn't true.

The $10 is going to have Sojourner Truth, along with other women's suffragists on it and the $5 will have MLK Jr, so, YOUR MOVE, racists.

We'll start seeing even more development and increasing use of digital forms of currency and payment. We're already at a point where pretty much everything can be bought with a credit or debit card. There's likely nothing particularly racist driving such changes but they'll offer a solution for the ~~poor babies~~ sad and unfortunate people who'll be loath to use currency with Black faces on it.
posted by fuse theorem at 5:22 PM on April 20, 2016

To be honest, having Andrew Jackson on the obverse of the $20 may be appropriate. After all, he always was an asshole.
posted by scrump at 5:34 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

So, if black women earn $0.64 for every $1 a white man earns, will the $20 now be worth $12.80?
posted by Dashy at 6:05 PM on April 20, 2016

reverse, scrump
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 6:07 PM on April 20, 2016

I can only hope racists at ATMs will show their displeasure by burning their money.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 6:50 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

if they really have to keep Jackson on the back, it would be cool if every time they minted a new batch of bills, Tubman's hand in her portrait was drawn subtly longer and longer and longer, until eventually she reaches around to the back and strangles that fucker
posted by threeants at 6:57 PM on April 20, 2016 [8 favorites]

As a technical writer, I pride myself on choosing PRECISELY the wrong word. Oy.
posted by scrump at 6:59 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

Jacqueline's design is beautiful, but sadly probably won't happen because we don't get to have things that nice. But hey, haters, solves the "ugly" problem!
posted by corb at 10:50 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

To clarify, I think that's bullshit, but think the very last thing the people saying that want is a young, beautiful Harriet Tubman leading people to freedom.
posted by corb at 10:56 PM on April 20, 2016 [2 favorites]

> We'll start seeing even more development and increasing use of digital forms of currency and payment. We're already at a point where pretty much everything can be bought with a credit or debit card.

Depends on what you're buying and where you are. You might be surprised at the amount of cash-only businesses (plus creditcard-use-discouraged businesses) especially in small towns and large cities.

Also, the ubiquity of ATMs (both bank-owned and the stand-alone vendor type) rather undermines the idea that cash is an outmoded form of currency, no?
posted by desuetude at 10:58 PM on April 20, 2016 [1 favorite]

Also, the ubiquity of ATMs (both bank-owned and the stand-alone vendor type) rather undermines the idea that cash is an outmoded form of currency, no?

I’d love to see aggregate data on ATM locations; I imagine that they’re more concentrated in lower income areas.
posted by Going To Maine at 11:25 PM on April 20, 2016

ATM Placement and Transaction Analysis – Where should I put my next ATM?

Visualize data such as transaction volume patterns, ATM competitor proximity, population density, customer vs. non-customer usage and queuing patterns for each ATM location. Use this one-stop, data blending dashboard to improve your ATM placement and consumer banking engagement strategies.

Too bad the data don't seem to be immediately public. Would be an interesting visualization to plot the ratio of ATM density to median income per US county, but companies seem to make money off of packaging these sorts of analyses.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 12:41 AM on April 21, 2016

Too bad the data don't seem to be immediately public.

Anybody got $260 to spend?
posted by Going To Maine at 1:11 AM on April 21, 2016

It seems that this version of the bill is now getting some attention in black circles on Twitter.

There's the usual mix of "Hell yeah!" and racist idiocy, along with some criticisms of the Dillons' choice of firearm in the original illustration (anachronistic? Possibly: I'm certainly no expert!), but my favourite thing is that the trend seems to be that everyone sees the Terminator 2 angle.
posted by rum-soaked space hobo at 2:48 AM on April 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

This just in- “ATM” now stands for Automated Tubman Machine
posted by exogenous at 3:46 AM on April 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Harriet Tubman is about the least polarizing figure I can imagine. Her story is taught in every elementary school in the country as a placeholder for "black history," while most schools gloss like crazy over MLK JR, and give him a reading of "he had a dream" that everybody would just get along and hold hands.

While I tend to be a pessimist about people, and I do think our country is polarizing, I do not think this will be a factor except to some of the most virulent racists, who are paltry in number.
posted by RedEmma at 5:07 AM on April 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

If ATMs are only in low-income areas, I guess all of Chicago is low income? I don't understand that reasoning, it's clearly not true. There are also tons of cash-only businesses, some of them high-end.
posted by agregoli at 5:18 AM on April 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

It is pretty wild that someone who fought to destroy the money of the United States, by liberating americans who were being mutilated into items of exchange, will now be on the money of the United States.
posted by eustatic at 5:51 AM on April 21, 2016

Slightly late delete of an offensive comment; if your comment is substantially "I'm not racist, but ..." it's probably not going to fly. Deleted several excellent comments responding to that comment, sorry about that.
posted by Eyebrows McGee (staff) at 7:35 AM on April 21, 2016 [6 favorites]

atms are in huge mega churches and inside most grocery stores, no matter what income level they serve, and attached to every bank. the only difference i see in my town from higher income areas & lower income areas is the atms look a lot sketchier in my lower income neighborhood.
posted by nadawi at 7:42 AM on April 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Political correctness is such an odd term. To me, this is such a straightforward example of an obvious good. It's not corporate doublespeak, it's not avoiding certain terms, it's not scolding people on Twitter. It's lifting up a person, and by extension an entire category of people, who have not received their due.

Earlier in the thread someone briefly, probably a bit facetiously, suggested a woman of my ethnicity as a possibility for future currency, and my heart soared at the thought that someone thought that the contributions of my people to American life and culture were worth recognizing in that way. Not to be brought out when you need to make a point about the internment. Not to provide a comfortable non-black image of diversity in TV commercials. To be on money. I couldn't even imagine it.

So in this, as always, remember that it's not just about white people arguing. There are actual people of color who this affects deeply.
posted by sunset in snow country at 7:44 AM on April 21, 2016 [13 favorites]

Even the right is getting on board - to quote a hard-core Tea Party acquaintance on Facebook:

'Harriet Tubman was a liberty-minded, pro-gun, Republican, enemy of the state and now the face of the $20 bill. I'm getting behind this change more and more.'
posted by Itaxpica at 8:48 AM on April 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

"Are there things for sale there? Do megachurches have stores?"

Yes! Sometimes even Starbuckses!

But really they're there for your donating convenience. There's a big debate, among Evangelical megachurches in particular, about whether it's okay for people to use their credit cards to donate, but then they theoretically pay interest on the donation and usury is bad, mmmkay, but people like the convenience. Anyway, having an ATM handy sort-of splits the difference -- gives people the convenience, avoids the theologically-problematic charging of interest.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:49 AM on April 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

> but my favourite thing is that the trend seems to be that everyone sees the Terminator 2 angle.

I saw this on there and involuntarily went "YEAH!" kind of loudly in my office. Love it!
posted by rtha at 8:53 AM on April 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Harriet Tubman On The $20 Is, Officially, The Blackest Thing That Will Ever Happen
posted by oakroom at 9:13 AM on April 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

There's a big debate, among Evangelical megachurches in particular, about whether it's okay for people to use their credit cards to donate

heh, yep, except the atms i've seen in churches charge fees like the rest of them, so i never understood how it actually solved that problem...
posted by nadawi at 9:15 AM on April 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

Boggs drew Harriet Tubman on a hundred years ago.
posted by scruss at 9:36 AM on April 21, 2016

I'm annoyed at the "oh, it was just white fangirls who blocked a woman from the $10" narrative. The original goal of the movement was to remove Jackson, the Hamilton/$10 was a diversion by the treasury. I'd certainly be fine with swapping out more, but Jackson was a real stain and leaving him on while removing Hamilton would have been bad.

All the candidates were good, but I thought Tubman was the best. She represents so many strands of America -- a slave who liberated herself and others, a Union veteran, a suffragette, her later social work. She even faced severe disability issues.
posted by tavella at 9:53 AM on April 21, 2016 [7 favorites]

But really they're there for your donating convenience. There's a big debate, among Evangelical megachurches in particular, about whether it's okay for people to use their credit cards to donate, but then they theoretically pay interest on the donation and usury is bad, mmmkay, but people like the convenience. Anyway, having an ATM handy sort-of splits the difference -- gives people the convenience, avoids the theologically-problematic charging of interest.

That's fascinating.
posted by zarq at 10:14 AM on April 21, 2016

$20 is the only bill only in rich neighborhoods.

What

this is dumb

what.

Go in to any bodega or franchised gas station in any poor neighborhood and tell me you find an ATM that isn't some sketchy fisher price looking plastic affair from 2002 that only dispenses one bill. That bill will be a $20.

I've only seen a couple of the fancy multi-bill ATMs in Seattle anywhere. One was in the downtown business district, and was replaced after not even six months with a simpler one that only spat out 20s. The other one was on the side of a bank in capitol hill(since reconfigured as 20-only), which is now one of the most expensive neighborhoods in the entire city. I've never seen one anywhere else. All the ones in poorer areas are just the most basic 20-spitters or fairly beat up older models.

I've actually searched around for these before out of curiosity. I pretty much always push custom amount on ATMs unless i'm in a huge hurry just to see what it'll offer me. It's always just "In multiples of $20".

I'm not surprised this is different in other cities, but it always made sense to me. Single bill ATMs are cheaper and simpler.(although some are just potentially multiple bill units configured with all storage boxes/magazines the same)
posted by emptythought at 10:18 AM on April 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

How did Andrew Jackson end up on our moneys in the first place? What ever led people to love him so much he ended up on the 20? I feel ignorant in this regard, but all I know about him is about how completely horrible he is.
posted by meese at 11:00 AM on April 21, 2016

Wikipedia has a history of the US $20 bill. Jackson first appeared on the $20 bill in 1928. Although it coincides with the 100th anniversary of Jackson's election as president, it is not clear the reason the bill was switched from Grover Cleveland to Andrew Jackson. According to the U.S. Treasury, "Treasury Department records do not reveal the reason that portraits of these particular statesmen were chosen in preference to those of other persons of equal importance and prominence."
posted by zarq at 11:07 AM on April 21, 2016 [1 favorite]

I'm going to assume it was a Vigo the Carpathian situation but a lot more low key, with some early 20th C. Peter McNichols equivalent in the thrall of Jackson's angry ghost after the Treasury acquired a particularly brooding portrait of the latter from a haunted plantation archive.
posted by cortex at 11:13 AM on April 21, 2016 [5 favorites]

According to the U.S. Treasury, "Treasury Department records do not reveal the reason that portraits of these particular statesmen were chosen in preference to those of other persons of equal importance and prominence."

It is so hard to believe there's not documentation of this somewhere. A cursory tour around Google Books and Historical Newspapers hasn't helped.
posted by Miko at 12:19 PM on April 21, 2016

On this ATM talk: I always just go to whatever the first ATM I see first is (yay ATM reimbursement) and I'm in all kinds of neighborhoods and I've only been to one ATM in my life that gave out $5s - it was a fancy high-end Chase one that looked like a giant iPad. Where should I be looking for these magic small-bill ATMS?

Of course, when the Tubman 20s go into circulation, I'll be marginally less annoyed when $20 is my only option :).

Also, to circle back: according to JoeZydeco's excellent comment in an earlier thread, the "vending machine lobby blocked the dollar coin" rumor is false, and the lobby would actually be thrilled wider use of dollar coins.
posted by R a c h e l at 1:57 PM on April 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Jackson was a general in the war of 1812, so I wonder if centennial-of-1812 stuff had brought him freshly to mind in the 19-teens?
posted by LobsterMitten at 2:20 PM on April 21, 2016 [3 favorites]

Yes, the Jackson centennial is very likely a major factor, but I'd really like to read the rhetoric of the time about why he was being venerated - particularly at that super-nativist moment in American history.
posted by Miko at 3:08 PM on April 21, 2016

cjelli, keep at it. I'm depending on you to win a facebook comments argument.
posted by numaner at 3:34 PM on April 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

Vox: Andrew Jackson was a slaver, ethnic cleanser, and tyrant. He deserves no place on our money.
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:41 PM on April 21, 2016 [2 favorites]

My family is in the middle of transferring land back to the Eastern Band of the Cherokee; it's a lot on the Little Tennessee River that that is the last remainder of a grant for military service, as I recall. And even back then, America was busy lying to itself; the original deed calls it "of the lands late abandoned by the Cherokee Nation." Abandoned.
posted by tavella at 4:53 PM on April 21, 2016 [12 favorites]

One comment deleted. MikeWarot, leave this topic alone.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 6:05 PM on April 21, 2016 [4 favorites]

" Things happened, get over it, and look at the good."

you guys, I'm pretty tipsy, and this dude is literally saying this and I can't even and I'm too mad to respond.
posted by numaner at 9:59 PM on April 21, 2016

Jackson was a general in the war of 1812, so I wonder if centennial-of-1812 stuff had brought him freshly to mind in the 19-teens?

Not to mention that the 19-teens seem to have been the time in the United States for confederate "Lost Cause" triumphalism. US white supremacists were at a kind of crest in their movement to revoke all rights for black people won during the civil war--to reconstitute the foundational caste system.

Suppression of the black vote and black education that the Reconstruction governments had established was pretty complete. Sheriffs had been established as the labor-brokers of black bodies-- slavery re-established through the criminal justice system. Gone was the era of mass riot against black people, and here was the era of regular lynching of black people.

Jim Crow made it back into the US military under the Wilson presidency. Wilson built a confederate monument in Arlington.

Lost Cause-controlled cities and states were erecting statues to their dads who fought in the streets against Reconstruction, and their grandads who fought for slavery, and proclaiming ahistorical fetishes "history." Robert E Lee's command to put the goddamn Battle Flag "in the attic" was defied.

So Jackson, the man who unified a violent anti-Native sentiment with a violent anti-Haiti, anti-black sentiment in the United States, was a natural hero to the white people in power. I imagine he was the Ronald Reagan of his day.

Cleveland, who paid to get out of the draft, and allowed New Orleans to wallow in racial violence, might have been the George W Bush.
posted by eustatic at 8:57 AM on April 22, 2016 [5 favorites]

* of this day, 1910's.
posted by eustatic at 9:03 AM on April 22, 2016

It's nice to know that in addition to all of his legitimately horrific crimes I can also blame Andrew Jackson for Florida as a whole.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:11 AM on April 22, 2016 [8 favorites]

Florida Man was mean old Mr. Jackson all along!
posted by Going To Maine at 11:28 AM on April 22, 2016 [3 favorites]

To put Harriet Tubman on the $20 bill would be an insult to her legacy: I don’t want to see the abolitionist commodified with a price, as she once was as a slave

Honor or Insult?: A Debate on the Significance of Harriet Tubman on the New $20 Bill
posted by homunculus at 4:15 PM on April 22, 2016

I can't "oh please" that clickbaity sentiment enough frankly. Here's something women and black people have been waiting for forever, but since it involves money it is actually an evil capitalist ploy and we should feel terrible about it instead.
posted by showbiz_liz at 4:24 PM on April 22, 2016 [12 favorites]

Physical currency is both money and public art. Money is incredibly complex but it isn't inherently immoral, and the public art component is important and can generate a lot of dialogue (#content) that wouldn't exist otherwise.
posted by Small Dollar at 4:32 PM on April 22, 2016 [6 favorites]

The main thing that pops out to me in terms of how he's remembered in 1910-1916 is that his role in the Seminole Wars keeps coming up, again and again.

It's interesting in that that's the period just after the NAACP was founded, Birth of a Nation came out, eugenics was peaking, and overall it was the nadir of race relations, and Seminoles are a tribe formed relatively recently from a variety of Southeastern bands and absorbed hundreds of African-American runaway and former slaves. Like a lot in American history, you can ask "is this racial?" and find that yeah, that probably has a non-zero amount to do with it. I find it interesting that Seminoles would loom larger at that time than Cherokees.
posted by Miko at 6:19 PM on April 22, 2016 [2 favorites]

Here's a perspective on "The General" that digs into some wonderful primary sources and talks about her role as a "nurse" in the Battle for Beaufort. Beaufort is always fascinating, and this is a favorite herstory of mine.
posted by eustatic at 9:36 PM on April 22, 2016

My neighborhood has several atms, mostly inside bodegas and Chinese American take out places, that advertise $10 atms. It is gentrifying but these predate the recent and current transformation. They also have lower fees. The lowest I've seen lately is around $1).
posted by Salamandrous at 9:11 AM on April 23, 2016 [1 favorite]

The History Channel has a theory in this video (no, it's not "aliens") - it's that Jackson was kind of known as a "people's President" during his administration, and some of that populism may have also come into play when he was tapped for the bill.

---

In other "WTFery" - there's a meme I saw on Facebook where someone reposted this total screed against Tubman being selected for the honor, because she was an escaped slave - and at the time she was alive, being an escaped slave was a crime, and therefore she was a criminal, and therefore she should not be honored. Fortunately the people I saw posting it had a "get a load of THIS here idiot" attitude.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:02 PM on April 23, 2016 [3 favorites]

clorox: "Before Abe was put on the penny in 1909, all US coins either had a woman or Native American on them. None of them were real women or Native Americans, though..."

Frequently true, but not universally so. See, for example, the Flying Eagle cent and the Shield nickel.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:00 PM on April 23, 2016

Former Senator Jim Webb (D-VA): We can celebrate Harriet Tubman without disparaging Andrew Jackson (WaPo)
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:02 PM on April 24, 2016

The masterful planning that went into putting Harriet Tubman on the $20, by Randall Munroe
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 6:07 AM on April 25, 2016 [3 favorites]

I lived in Virginia in 2006, and was very pleased with Jim Webb's defeat of George Allen. Sadly, that remains the high point of my regard for him.
posted by Chrysostom at 6:54 AM on April 25, 2016

Honestly, I don't think it's possible to disparage Andrew Jackson enough.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:41 AM on April 25, 2016 [8 favorites]

> To put Harriet Tubman on the $20 bill would be an insult to her legacy: I don’t want to see the abolitionist commodified with a price, as she once was as a slave

I think it's worth thinking carefully about who is chosen to be represented on currency and why, and what we mean when we honor figures in this way. Hell, thinking a little more carefully about this in the first place might have led to some common-sense decisions about NOT featuring Jackson on the face of a financial system to which he objected.*

Ultimately, I find Thrasher's argument against Tubman being the face of the $20 to be perhaps "the perfect as the enemy of the good," but I think he raises very valid points for the larger discussion.

And I agree that the NPR justification cited below is uncomfortably sentimentalist, especially given the subject:

NPR pointed out that putting Tubman on the $20 bill would be poetic because of “a special historical resonance: that’s the same amount she eventually received from the US government as her monthly pension for her service as a nurse, scout, cook and spy during the Civil War, as well as for her status as the widow of a veteran.”

* I'm definitely part of the faction who would knock down the "heroic" legacy of Jackson specifically based on his war crimes and genocide anyway.
posted by desuetude at 7:42 AM on April 25, 2016 [1 favorite]

and at the time she was alive, being an escaped slave was a crime, and therefore she was a criminal, and therefore she should not be honored.

Very much unlike Franklin, Washington, and Hamilton, who were all totally authorized rebels.
posted by corb at 11:03 AM on April 25, 2016 [9 favorites]

I just found this on a friend's Facebook feed... and I could definitely get behind an image like this of Harriet Tubman on the $20.

Moving beyond the standard portrait, it shows her, right hand outstretched, offering help, with a pistol in the right hand and fierce gaze looking right at you.

Way cool... which means it'll never happen... 8(
posted by MikeWarot at 7:55 PM on April 25, 2016 [1 favorite]

The last thing this country needs is a handgun on its currency.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 6:27 AM on April 26, 2016 [5 favorites]

Hey, something for conservatives to be happy about!
posted by Artw at 7:00 AM on April 26, 2016 [1 favorite]

I kinda like it. Less "in God we trust," more "COME WITH ME IF YOU WANT TO LIVE."
posted by prize bull octorok at 7:27 AM on April 26, 2016 [4 favorites]

The new dime should be:
Franklin Roosevelt on the front
Roosevelt Franklin on the back
posted by wrnealis at 12:20 PM on April 26, 2016 [4 favorites]

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