88 Lines About The 45th President
July 20, 2017 6:44 AM Subscribe
Democratic lawmakers have filed a "no-confidence" resolution against Donald Trump, listing 88 reasons why he's not fit to be President. Speaking to the New York Times, Trump provides many additional reasons. And speaking of things that no one likes that refuse to go away, Senate Republicans are back to work on a putative health care bill.
I am never going to be productive again, am I?
(Fantastic thread title BTW)
posted by rabbitrabbit at 6:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [31 favorites]
(Fantastic thread title BTW)
posted by rabbitrabbit at 6:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [31 favorites]
Senate Republicans are back to work on a putative health care bill.
Putative or punitive, you decide!
posted by lydhre at 6:51 AM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
Putative or punitive, you decide!
posted by lydhre at 6:51 AM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
New day, new thread, new lows for Trump to reach.
posted by azpenguin at 6:52 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by azpenguin at 6:52 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
88?
posted by Artw at 6:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Artw at 6:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Only 88?
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Adding or subtracting one might have been a good idea, this will just make nazis like him more.
posted by Artw at 6:57 AM on July 20, 2017 [35 favorites]
posted by Artw at 6:57 AM on July 20, 2017 [35 favorites]
There's an amendment that adds 14 more.
posted by [expletive deleted] at 6:57 AM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by [expletive deleted] at 6:57 AM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
So these aren't articles of impeachment, right? What does a no confidence motion achieve? I thought that was more of a Westminster thing?
posted by pompomtom at 6:59 AM on July 20, 2017
posted by pompomtom at 6:59 AM on July 20, 2017
88?
Maybe Democrats are just really big on Li'l Dale?
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 7:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Maybe Democrats are just really big on Li'l Dale?
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 7:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
They've got 88 points, but cloture won't come.
posted by snuffleupagus at 7:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by snuffleupagus at 7:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
(sorry, 'resolution'... force of habit...)
posted by pompomtom at 7:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by pompomtom at 7:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
"Here's an itemized list of [what feels like] thirty years of disagreements."
posted by Westringia F. at 7:01 AM on July 20, 2017 [25 favorites]
posted by Westringia F. at 7:01 AM on July 20, 2017 [25 favorites]
So these aren't articles of impeachment, right? What does a no confidence motion achieve? I thought that was more of a Westminster thing?
It's purely symbolic. With Ryan as speaker, the chance of this even going to committee is roughly nil.
posted by murphy slaw at 7:01 AM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
It's purely symbolic. With Ryan as speaker, the chance of this even going to committee is roughly nil.
posted by murphy slaw at 7:01 AM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
So these aren't articles of impeachment, right? What does a no confidence motion achieve? I thought that was more of a Westminster thing?
It's a kind of toothless censure intended to provoke Trump into more histrionics and put GOP reps in a difficult position of denying the enumerated points, or finding some other reason not to vote for it. It's fodder for talk shows and the midterms, and pretty decent fodder too.
posted by snuffleupagus at 7:02 AM on July 20, 2017 [62 favorites]
It's a kind of toothless censure intended to provoke Trump into more histrionics and put GOP reps in a difficult position of denying the enumerated points, or finding some other reason not to vote for it. It's fodder for talk shows and the midterms, and pretty decent fodder too.
posted by snuffleupagus at 7:02 AM on July 20, 2017 [62 favorites]
My favorite was in that NYTimes interview where he impersonates his granddaughter and Chinese President Xi Jinping speaking to each other and LITERALLY does the whole stereotypical "ching chong ching" shit. Unfuckingbelieveable, this guy.
posted by nushustu at 7:02 AM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by nushustu at 7:02 AM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Senate Republicans are back to work on a putative health care bill.
Putative or punitive, you decide!
Putrative.
posted by snuffleupagus at 7:04 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
Putative or punitive, you decide!
Putrative.
posted by snuffleupagus at 7:04 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
My favorite was in that NYTimes interview where he impersonates his granddaughter and Chinese President Xi Jinping speaking to each other and LITERALLY does the whole stereotypical "ching chong ching" shit. Unfuckingbelieveable, this guy.
uh, am i reading a different interview? because in the one i read his granddaughter arabella came in and actually said a few words in simple chinese, which the times transliterated.
posted by murphy slaw at 7:07 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
uh, am i reading a different interview? because in the one i read his granddaughter arabella came in and actually said a few words in simple chinese, which the times transliterated.
posted by murphy slaw at 7:07 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
So regarding his comments on paying $15 per month (or per year, whatever lol) for health insurance, there's terrible and plausible speculation that he's just parroting these Alex Trebek "rate lock" life insurance ads that run regularly on Fox News.
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:08 AM on July 20, 2017 [41 favorites]
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:08 AM on July 20, 2017 [41 favorites]
Politico: Republicans lament an agenda in 'quicksand': GOP lawmakers’ mood is darkening as the August recess approaches and they’ve made little progress on their priorities.
Some lawmakers are even starting to blame Trump for his handling of the Russia probe, Twitter feuds and attacks on the media.posted by chris24 at 7:08 AM on July 20, 2017 [45 favorites]
"I don't even pay any attention to what is going on with the administration because I don't care. They're a distraction. The family is a distraction, the president is a distraction," complained Rep. Mike Simpson (R-Idaho). "At first, it was 'Well yeah, this is the guy we elected. He'll learn, he'll learn.' And you just don't see that happening."
A couple tweets from the NeverTrump crowd re: the Times interview and Mueller threat.
@TheRickWilson
His attacks on Mueller tell me a lot. He KNOWS how bad it is. His "warning" to Mueller tells me finally understands how bad it is.
@MaxBoot
The fact that he is willing to risk consequences of firing Mueller tells you how bad underlying offenses are.
posted by chris24 at 7:11 AM on July 20, 2017 [96 favorites]
@TheRickWilson
His attacks on Mueller tell me a lot. He KNOWS how bad it is. His "warning" to Mueller tells me finally understands how bad it is.
@MaxBoot
The fact that he is willing to risk consequences of firing Mueller tells you how bad underlying offenses are.
posted by chris24 at 7:11 AM on July 20, 2017 [96 favorites]
I haven't seen this brought up previously, but it seems a large reason the Obamacare repeal is going so poorly is states ravaged by the opioid epidemic can do the math - $45 billion for opioid treatment is no substitute for taking away $800 billion from Medicade, a good portion of which goes towards opioid-related care to mllions.
nbcnews
And then, even the $45 billion proffered was taken off the table with more-recent "Repeal and Replace" attempt.
dailybeast; nytimes, (June 20th)
posted by fragmede at 7:11 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
nbcnews
And then, even the $45 billion proffered was taken off the table with more-recent "Repeal and Replace" attempt.
dailybeast; nytimes, (June 20th)
posted by fragmede at 7:11 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
I believe that this is supposed to be a sentence showing how far things have progressed: Some lawmakers are even starting to blame Trump for his handling of the Russia probe, Twitter feuds and attacks on the media.
But it's actually incredibly depression. "Some"?!? "Starting"?!?
I get he's their guy, and I'm pretty guilty of thinking about politics in a "team" based sort of way, but christ! If you can't see Trump as a problem then your head is way too far up your own ass.
posted by OmieWise at 7:12 AM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
But it's actually incredibly depression. "Some"?!? "Starting"?!?
I get he's their guy, and I'm pretty guilty of thinking about politics in a "team" based sort of way, but christ! If you can't see Trump as a problem then your head is way too far up your own ass.
posted by OmieWise at 7:12 AM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
Putative or punitive, you decide!
Putative, from the Spanish.
posted by acb at 7:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [84 favorites]
Putative, from the Spanish.
posted by acb at 7:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [84 favorites]
From the previous thread:
Bob Menendez's corruption trial starts in September. If he's convicted and ousted from the Senate, Chris effing Christie can appoint a Republican replacement.
Can he appoint himself? Because that seems like the sort of thing that would happen now. With his disapproval rating I don't think he has a lot of other options for his career path.
(A (in normal times unlikely) plot twist would be then switching to the Democratic party just to get revenge on Trump.)
posted by mikepop at 7:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Bob Menendez's corruption trial starts in September. If he's convicted and ousted from the Senate, Chris effing Christie can appoint a Republican replacement.
Can he appoint himself? Because that seems like the sort of thing that would happen now. With his disapproval rating I don't think he has a lot of other options for his career path.
(A (in normal times unlikely) plot twist would be then switching to the Democratic party just to get revenge on Trump.)
posted by mikepop at 7:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
My favorite was in that NYTimes interview where he impersonates his granddaughter and Chinese President Xi Jinping speaking to each other and LITERALLY does the whole stereotypical "ching chong ching" shit. Unfuckingbelieveable, this guy.
Unbelievably, inconcievably, there's even more than that. From the piece:
ARABELLA KUSHNER: [enters room] Hi, Grandpa.
TRUMP: My granddaughter Arabella, who speaks — say hello to them in Chinese.
KUSHNER: Ni hao.
[laughter]
TRUMP: This is Ivanka. You know Ivanka.
IVANKA TRUMP: [from doorway] Hi, how are you? See you later, just wanted to come say hi.
TRUMP: She’s great. She speaks fluent Chinese. She’s amazing.
BAKER: That’s very impressive.
TRUMP: She spoke with President Xi [Jinping of China]. Honey? Can you say a few words in Chinese? Say, like, “I love you, Grandpa” —
KUSHNER: Wo ai ni, Grandpa.
BAKER: That’s great.
TRUMP: She’s unbelievable, huh?
[crosstalk]
TRUMP: Good, smart genes.
My emphasis. He can't even give his fucking granddaughter credit for learning to speak Chinese. No, it's her "good, smart genes." The success is, at its heart, still his. This guy is truly one of the all-time assholes.
posted by penduluum at 7:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [198 favorites]
Unbelievably, inconcievably, there's even more than that. From the piece:
ARABELLA KUSHNER: [enters room] Hi, Grandpa.
TRUMP: My granddaughter Arabella, who speaks — say hello to them in Chinese.
KUSHNER: Ni hao.
[laughter]
TRUMP: This is Ivanka. You know Ivanka.
IVANKA TRUMP: [from doorway] Hi, how are you? See you later, just wanted to come say hi.
TRUMP: She’s great. She speaks fluent Chinese. She’s amazing.
BAKER: That’s very impressive.
TRUMP: She spoke with President Xi [Jinping of China]. Honey? Can you say a few words in Chinese? Say, like, “I love you, Grandpa” —
KUSHNER: Wo ai ni, Grandpa.
BAKER: That’s great.
TRUMP: She’s unbelievable, huh?
[crosstalk]
TRUMP: Good, smart genes.
My emphasis. He can't even give his fucking granddaughter credit for learning to speak Chinese. No, it's her "good, smart genes." The success is, at its heart, still his. This guy is truly one of the all-time assholes.
posted by penduluum at 7:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [198 favorites]
Putative, from the Spanish.
A picture from the Puto National Golf Club.
posted by peeedro at 7:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
A picture from the Puto National Golf Club.
posted by peeedro at 7:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
uh, am i reading a different interview? because in the one i read his granddaughter arabella came in and actually said a few words in simple chinese, which the times transliterated.
I heard audio of the interview this morning, which includes some stuff not transcribed. It was in the Daily, which I think is part of the NYTimes' app.
posted by nushustu at 7:18 AM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
I heard audio of the interview this morning, which includes some stuff not transcribed. It was in the Daily, which I think is part of the NYTimes' app.
posted by nushustu at 7:18 AM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
It's purely symbolic. With Ryan as speaker, the chance of this even going to committee is roughly nil.
Ultimately useless as it is, it's still meaningful and cathartic for me. It's on the record, unambiguous, and out there for the public (here and around the world) to see that at least somebody on Capitol Hill is saying the Emperor wears no clothes.
posted by Rykey at 7:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
Ultimately useless as it is, it's still meaningful and cathartic for me. It's on the record, unambiguous, and out there for the public (here and around the world) to see that at least somebody on Capitol Hill is saying the Emperor wears no clothes.
posted by Rykey at 7:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
I haven't seen this brought up previously, but it seems a large reason the Obamacare repeal is going so poorly is states ravaged by the opioid epidemic can do the math - $45 billion for opioid treatment is no substitute for taking away $800 billion from Medicade, a good portion of which goes towards opioid-related care to mllions.
Yup, and it's worth remembering that the current opioid epidemic is affecting more Whites than minorities.
posted by OmieWise at 7:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
Yup, and it's worth remembering that the current opioid epidemic is affecting more Whites than minorities.
posted by OmieWise at 7:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
From Benjamin Wittes over at Lawfare: The President vs. Federal Law Enforcement: Trump Attacks Everyone.
"President Trump yesterday issued a stunning vote of no-confidence in basically everyone currently in a leadership position in the Justice Department, the FBI, or the special counsel’s office—in other words, not just some federal law enforcement, but all of it. The President’s rebuke comes in a lengthy interview with the New York Times yesterday, and it reaches everyone from the attorney general to staff attorneys hired by Robert Mueller—whose investigation he pointedly did not promise not to terminate. His complaint? They’re all, in different ways, not serving him. And serving him, he makes clear, is their real job."
posted by MonkeyToes at 7:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [60 favorites]
"President Trump yesterday issued a stunning vote of no-confidence in basically everyone currently in a leadership position in the Justice Department, the FBI, or the special counsel’s office—in other words, not just some federal law enforcement, but all of it. The President’s rebuke comes in a lengthy interview with the New York Times yesterday, and it reaches everyone from the attorney general to staff attorneys hired by Robert Mueller—whose investigation he pointedly did not promise not to terminate. His complaint? They’re all, in different ways, not serving him. And serving him, he makes clear, is their real job."
posted by MonkeyToes at 7:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [60 favorites]
He reminds me so much of my asshole, narcissist father that it gives me flashbacks sometimes. All my accomplishments were because of him and all my failures were because of me, defying him.
Fun times.
posted by lydhre at 7:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [111 favorites]
Fun times.
posted by lydhre at 7:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [111 favorites]
He reminds me so much of my asshole, narcissist father
Mother in my case but yeah, I think having a parent with that axis of personality disorder is the best inoculation to prevent one from falling for this shit. That's presuming that you haven't had your own personhood destroyed in the process, of course.
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [70 favorites]
Mother in my case but yeah, I think having a parent with that axis of personality disorder is the best inoculation to prevent one from falling for this shit. That's presuming that you haven't had your own personhood destroyed in the process, of course.
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [70 favorites]
I heard audio of the interview this morning, which includes some stuff not transcribed. It was in the Daily, which I think is part of the NYTimes' app.
NYT Daily: Trump Interview Excerpts. Trump & Arabella talk at around 15:30. Trump makes some kind of noises relating the Jinping anecdote that sound like they're meant to approximate the cadence of Chinese but it's not exactly 'ching-chong'. And the interviewers reward him with laughter.
posted by snuffleupagus at 7:26 AM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
NYT Daily: Trump Interview Excerpts. Trump & Arabella talk at around 15:30. Trump makes some kind of noises relating the Jinping anecdote that sound like they're meant to approximate the cadence of Chinese but it's not exactly 'ching-chong'. And the interviewers reward him with laughter.
posted by snuffleupagus at 7:26 AM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
Putative or punitive, you decide!
Putative, from the Spanish.
Putintive, surely.
posted by Superplin at 7:31 AM on July 20, 2017 [63 favorites]
Putative, from the Spanish.
Putintive, surely.
posted by Superplin at 7:31 AM on July 20, 2017 [63 favorites]
The fact that he is willing to risk consequences of firing Mueller tells you how bad underlying offenses are.
Thus far, the evidence shows that he's probably right about that risk assessment.
posted by Candleman at 7:32 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Thus far, the evidence shows that he's probably right about that risk assessment.
posted by Candleman at 7:32 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
chris24: "At first, it was 'Well yeah, this is the guy we elected. He'll learn, he'll learn.' And you just don't see that happening."
Wait a moment, you have to back up a few months. It's not just "we elected this guy," it's "we backed this guy, or didn't do enough to punch his candidacy full of holes when he ran, and then when it was him vs Hillary, we smeared Hillary and McConnell didn't want Obama to publicize the fact we knew Trump was working with the Russians in some capacity, because we thought we could get our way, or at least make everyone hate Hillary when she became president. But then Donny won, and we were fucking ecstatic, because we had the House, Senate and White House, and he seems like the right kind of rube for us to mold and guide, but then oh shit, the asshole who was fond of making media waves instead of talking about policies and plans was still fond of making media waves instead of promoting policies or plans."
Fuck you, GOP, fuck you. You bought the sheets, ordered the bed, shit on the other bed so no one would want to go near it, then made your own bed. Fuck you, you didn't just happen to elect Donald J. Trump.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:35 AM on July 20, 2017 [202 favorites]
Wait a moment, you have to back up a few months. It's not just "we elected this guy," it's "we backed this guy, or didn't do enough to punch his candidacy full of holes when he ran, and then when it was him vs Hillary, we smeared Hillary and McConnell didn't want Obama to publicize the fact we knew Trump was working with the Russians in some capacity, because we thought we could get our way, or at least make everyone hate Hillary when she became president. But then Donny won, and we were fucking ecstatic, because we had the House, Senate and White House, and he seems like the right kind of rube for us to mold and guide, but then oh shit, the asshole who was fond of making media waves instead of talking about policies and plans was still fond of making media waves instead of promoting policies or plans."
Fuck you, GOP, fuck you. You bought the sheets, ordered the bed, shit on the other bed so no one would want to go near it, then made your own bed. Fuck you, you didn't just happen to elect Donald J. Trump.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:35 AM on July 20, 2017 [202 favorites]
Thus far, the evidence shows that he's probably right about that risk assessment.
Even a stopped clock, &c.
posted by OmieWise at 7:35 AM on July 20, 2017
Even a stopped clock, &c.
posted by OmieWise at 7:35 AM on July 20, 2017
[garbled] [garbled] [garbled]
posted by sutureselves at 7:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [33 favorites]
posted by sutureselves at 7:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [33 favorites]
Sessions/Rosenstein press conference:
Reporter: AG Sessions, how do you feel like you can effectively serve from here on out if you don't have the confidence of the president?posted by pjenks at 7:37 AM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
AG Sessions: [walks back to microphone, stalling for time, frantically searching for the perfect response] We're serving right now!
(Dammit, you guys, I'm almost at the end of my vacation, and reading a MeFi politics thread is NOT how I should spend my last full day!)
posted by wenestvedt at 7:38 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by wenestvedt at 7:38 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Sessions/Rosenstein press conference:
[real] ?!?!
posted by Twain Device at 7:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
[real] ?!?!
posted by Twain Device at 7:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
This part stood out to me:
TRUMP: He’s a great guy. Smart. Strong. Loves holding my hand.
HABERMAN: I’ve noticed.
TRUMP: People don’t realize he loves holding my hand. And that’s good, as far as that goes.
_________
TRUMP: I mean, really. He’s a very good person. And a tough guy, but look, he has to be. I think he is going to be a terrific president of France. But he does love holding my hand.
posted by cottoncandybeard at 7:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
TRUMP: He’s a great guy. Smart. Strong. Loves holding my hand.
HABERMAN: I’ve noticed.
TRUMP: People don’t realize he loves holding my hand. And that’s good, as far as that goes.
_________
TRUMP: I mean, really. He’s a very good person. And a tough guy, but look, he has to be. I think he is going to be a terrific president of France. But he does love holding my hand.
posted by cottoncandybeard at 7:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
Steve Goldstein, Market Watch: Exxon fined $2 million for violating Russia sanctions when Tillerson ran company
(The story is still breaking, this is the full text of link.)
posted by Room 641-A at 7:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [50 favorites]
Exxon Mobil XOM, +0.40% was fined $2 million by the Treasury Department for violating Ukraine-related sanctions - when the company's CEO was Rex Tillerson, now the U.S. secretary of state. The Office of Foreign Assets Control said the presidents of its U.S. subsidaries signed legal contracts with Igor Sechin, the president of Rosneft.Emphasis mine, and hopefully, Mueller's.
(The story is still breaking, this is the full text of link.)
posted by Room 641-A at 7:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [50 favorites]
Trump has repeatedly made it clear that EVEN NOW, he doesn't know the difference between health insurance and life insurance, and he thinks you can get health insurance for $12 a year. What if he really thought he could solve healthcare by just doing whatever those $12 a year guys are doing, cos they've got it figured out.
posted by bakerybob at 7:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by bakerybob at 7:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions
This article doesn't contain a lot of revelations about the kinds of things Mueller would investigate, but I'm curious about the timing. It's sourced to "a person familiar with the probe," and I don't know that we've gotten leaks from Mueller yet. I wonder if the leak is intentional to provoke Trump into firing Mueller?
posted by gladly at 7:45 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
This article doesn't contain a lot of revelations about the kinds of things Mueller would investigate, but I'm curious about the timing. It's sourced to "a person familiar with the probe," and I don't know that we've gotten leaks from Mueller yet. I wonder if the leak is intentional to provoke Trump into firing Mueller?
posted by gladly at 7:45 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
"She spoke with Xi Jinping...she went up to him, and (imitating her but sounding like The Penguin) wenh, wenh, wenh, wenh"
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:45 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:45 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
People don’t realize he loves holding my hand.
he's just making sure you don't pick his pockets or grab his wife
posted by pyramid termite at 7:46 AM on July 20, 2017 [33 favorites]
he's just making sure you don't pick his pockets or grab his wife
posted by pyramid termite at 7:46 AM on July 20, 2017 [33 favorites]
[real] ?!?!
It's real. Including the repeated use of the royal We.
However, J. Beauregard is incorrect. In fact, We got Served.
posted by snuffleupagus at 7:47 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
It's real. Including the repeated use of the royal We.
However, J. Beauregard is incorrect. In fact, We got Served.
posted by snuffleupagus at 7:47 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
You can tell he went through his talking points very quickly at the beginning of that Times interview. He starts out sounding very reasonable, articulate and calm. He was defensive, but considering that initial topic (health care) and the person that's to be expected. His answers sound exactly as you'd expect someone who had been coached, trained or otherwise prepared in advance to go.
And then the interview just rambles on. Places he visited. Conversations he's had. Events he's attended. Tiny historical facts. All brought up to make himself and his administration look impressive. And then he gets into Russia (in all its twists and turns) and he sounds angry and petulant. Angry, defensive Presidents are dangerous.
The 'we beat Harry Truman in terms of accomplishments in our first few months in office' schtick is unreal. Truman was fighting World War II.
Trump would be smart to study Truman, though. Upon FDR's death, Truman was thrust into an office that he never wanted. His allies (Churchill in particular) disliked and distrusted him. His party thought he was a lightweight. His opponents disparaged him as corrupt and claimed he would never have succeeded without the Pendergast political machine in Kansas City. The media saw a shitkicking farmer succeed an urbane, well-educated politician they respected and wanted no part of him. However, once elected Truman took on the Presidency with humility and devotion. He worked his ass off, and spoke so plainly that the public didn't take him for a typical, lying politician.
If he ever bothered to read up on our 33rd President, Trump would probably be able to make a lot of comparisons to himself. A populist. Despised by the media and his opponents. Low approval ratings. Plainspoken. Saddled with a major conflict (and an aggressive North Korea!). Truman even had an executive order voided by the Supreme Court -- his attempted takeover of the steel industry during the Korean War.
And if he did read up on Truman, he'd learn why 33 was successful. Truman never stopped working. He treated the Presidency as a gift, not an entitlement. He studied hard and learned as much as he could, so he could function. He treated the press corps with respect. He understood why separation of powers was important. He was kind and friendly to his staff. He trusted his advisors and appointees -- often to a fault. And he had deep respect for the military and an innate understanding of that sacrifice, drawn from a soldier's experience during WWI.
When Truman left office, the media and the public gave him low approval ratings. Eisenhower took most of the states during the election. But hindsight allows a clearer perspective and Truman was a much more successful President than people gave him credit for at the time.
"I heard that Harry Truman was first, and then we beat him." The Presidency isn't a competition. It's not like running a company or a race. You don't lead the country by breaking records or trying to outdo your predecessors in numbers of EO's or anything else. Truman knew this. What's more, he had the utmost respect for his predecessors, even if he disagreed with their politics.
Trump is a raging narcissist who, for all our sakes, sorely needs to learn humility.
posted by zarq at 7:47 AM on July 20, 2017 [154 favorites]
And then the interview just rambles on. Places he visited. Conversations he's had. Events he's attended. Tiny historical facts. All brought up to make himself and his administration look impressive. And then he gets into Russia (in all its twists and turns) and he sounds angry and petulant. Angry, defensive Presidents are dangerous.
The 'we beat Harry Truman in terms of accomplishments in our first few months in office' schtick is unreal. Truman was fighting World War II.
Trump would be smart to study Truman, though. Upon FDR's death, Truman was thrust into an office that he never wanted. His allies (Churchill in particular) disliked and distrusted him. His party thought he was a lightweight. His opponents disparaged him as corrupt and claimed he would never have succeeded without the Pendergast political machine in Kansas City. The media saw a shitkicking farmer succeed an urbane, well-educated politician they respected and wanted no part of him. However, once elected Truman took on the Presidency with humility and devotion. He worked his ass off, and spoke so plainly that the public didn't take him for a typical, lying politician.
If he ever bothered to read up on our 33rd President, Trump would probably be able to make a lot of comparisons to himself. A populist. Despised by the media and his opponents. Low approval ratings. Plainspoken. Saddled with a major conflict (and an aggressive North Korea!). Truman even had an executive order voided by the Supreme Court -- his attempted takeover of the steel industry during the Korean War.
And if he did read up on Truman, he'd learn why 33 was successful. Truman never stopped working. He treated the Presidency as a gift, not an entitlement. He studied hard and learned as much as he could, so he could function. He treated the press corps with respect. He understood why separation of powers was important. He was kind and friendly to his staff. He trusted his advisors and appointees -- often to a fault. And he had deep respect for the military and an innate understanding of that sacrifice, drawn from a soldier's experience during WWI.
When Truman left office, the media and the public gave him low approval ratings. Eisenhower took most of the states during the election. But hindsight allows a clearer perspective and Truman was a much more successful President than people gave him credit for at the time.
"I heard that Harry Truman was first, and then we beat him." The Presidency isn't a competition. It's not like running a company or a race. You don't lead the country by breaking records or trying to outdo your predecessors in numbers of EO's or anything else. Truman knew this. What's more, he had the utmost respect for his predecessors, even if he disagreed with their politics.
Trump is a raging narcissist who, for all our sakes, sorely needs to learn humility.
posted by zarq at 7:47 AM on July 20, 2017 [154 favorites]
Today is going to be one of those days, isn't it?
posted by diogenes at 7:47 AM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 7:47 AM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
This part stood out to me:
TRUMP: He’s a great guy. Smart. Strong. Loves holding my hand.
HABERMAN: I’ve noticed.
TRUMP: People don’t realize he loves holding my hand. And that’s good, as far as that goes.
I have always thought that the way Trump behaves around Putin is a lot like "a pre-teen girl with a crush".
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
TRUMP: He’s a great guy. Smart. Strong. Loves holding my hand.
HABERMAN: I’ve noticed.
TRUMP: People don’t realize he loves holding my hand. And that’s good, as far as that goes.
I have always thought that the way Trump behaves around Putin is a lot like "a pre-teen girl with a crush".
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Today is going to be one of those days, isn't it?
posted by diogenes at 7:47 AM
Your turn in the barrel....
posted by thelonius at 7:50 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 7:47 AM
Your turn in the barrel....
posted by thelonius at 7:50 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
Lemon, it's only Wednesday.
posted by Artw at 7:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by Artw at 7:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
In other news, as civilian deaths at record high in the 16-year war in Afghanistan, according to the UN, with reporting by Sune Engel Rasmussen in Kabul for the Guardian (Monday 17 July 2017), and Trump's promise of a new strategy and new troop levels needed to execute a more aggressive role in fighting the Taliban, which he told Congress would likely be ready by mid-July, is not done (so how's that plan to defeat ISIS in 30 days going, proud Trump supporters?) Trump aides recruited businessmen to devise options for Afghanistan (Mark Landler, Eric Schmitt and Michael R. Gordon for the New York Times, posted on July 10, 2017):
Good news: Blackwater has experience in the Middle East. Bad news: Under Prince's watch, Blackwater military contractors opened fire in a city square in Baghdad, killing 17 civilians in one of the worst episodes of the Iraq war, a point made in The 'Blackwater 2.0' Plan for Afghanistan by Sean McFate for The Atlantic (July 17, 2017), also titled "Why Mercenaries Aren't Answer for Afghanistan."
posted by filthy light thief at 7:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
President Trump’s advisers recruited two businessmen who profited from military contracting to devise alternatives to the Pentagon’s plan to send thousands of additional troops to Afghanistan, reflecting the Trump administration’s struggle to define its strategy for dealing with a war now 16 years old.As summarized on NPR this morning (audio only at the moment, transcript up later today), the benefits would be to cut costs and reduce the public attention on dead Americans returning in body bags in their military outfits, but the impacts would be war profiteering (not a phrase they used, but I did shout that at the radio while I drove to work, FWIW) and a lack of accountability. Oh, except Prince says the mercs would be held to account ... by President Trump (Erik D. Prince Op-Ed in WSJ, titled "The MacArthur Model for Afghanistan", paywalled).
Erik D. Prince, a founder of the private security firm Blackwater Worldwide, and Stephen A. Feinberg, a billionaire financier who owns the giant military contractor DynCorp International, have developed proposals to rely on contractors instead of American troops in Afghanistan at the behest of Stephen K. Bannon, Mr. Trump’s chief strategist, and Jared Kushner, his senior adviser and son-in-law, according to people briefed on the conversations.
Good news: Blackwater has experience in the Middle East. Bad news: Under Prince's watch, Blackwater military contractors opened fire in a city square in Baghdad, killing 17 civilians in one of the worst episodes of the Iraq war, a point made in The 'Blackwater 2.0' Plan for Afghanistan by Sean McFate for The Atlantic (July 17, 2017), also titled "Why Mercenaries Aren't Answer for Afghanistan."
posted by filthy light thief at 7:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
Today is going to be one of those days, isn't it?
'This must be Thursday,' said Arthur to himself, sinking low over his beer. 'I never could get the hang of Thursdays.'
I suspect that today's Hitchhiker's Guide would begin with "OK, PANIC A LITTLE"
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [59 favorites]
'This must be Thursday,' said Arthur to himself, sinking low over his beer. 'I never could get the hang of Thursdays.'
I suspect that today's Hitchhiker's Guide would begin with "OK, PANIC A LITTLE"
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [59 favorites]
TRUMP: I mean, really. He’s a very good person. And a tough guy, but look, he has to be. I think he is going to be a terrific president of France. But he does love holding my hand.
We'll never know if he does or doesn't until you let go of it.
posted by scalefree at 7:55 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
We'll never know if he does or doesn't until you let go of it.
posted by scalefree at 7:55 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
What if he really thought he could solve healthcare by just doing whatever those $12 a year guys are doing, cos they've got it figured out.
Yeah, uhh... what if?
posted by tehgubner at 7:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Yeah, uhh... what if?
posted by tehgubner at 7:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Rust Moranis: I suspect that today's Hitchhiker's Guide would begin with "OK, PANIC A LITTLE"
I can imagine a tear-off-the-page daily calendar where that's the message every day being accurate for most, if not all of, 2017.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
I can imagine a tear-off-the-page daily calendar where that's the message every day being accurate for most, if not all of, 2017.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Lemon, it's only Wednesday.
For once, I have good news.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 7:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [33 favorites]
For once, I have good news.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 7:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [33 favorites]
He reminds me so much of my asshole, narcissist father that it gives me flashbacks sometimes. All my accomplishments were because of him and all my failures were because of me, defying him.
There's a line from the Chvrches song Leave A Trace that runs through my head a lot, a pitch-perfect deadpan condemnation of a narcissist's posturing about blame and credit etc:
Somehow I have got away with everything
Everything you ever did was strictly by design
posted by cortex at 8:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
There's a line from the Chvrches song Leave A Trace that runs through my head a lot, a pitch-perfect deadpan condemnation of a narcissist's posturing about blame and credit etc:
Somehow I have got away with everything
Everything you ever did was strictly by design
posted by cortex at 8:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
My panic level has been indistinguishable from pheochromocytoma for six months now.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
But happier news from Afghanistan (because we all need happy news, even/especially if it's not 100% on current politics): Afghanistan's Sesame Street brings in new puppet to teach respect of women (Associated Press in Kabul via The Guardian, July 15, 2017)
posted by filthy light thief at 8:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [48 favorites]
Last year, Afghanistan’s version of Sesame Street introduced a young, female character aimed at inspiring girls in the deeply conservative Muslim nation. Now a new puppet is joining the cast: her brother, who will show boys the importance of respecting women.Thank you, Sesame Street/Garden, for making me tear up and have hope for humanity. I wish we didn't need to have a puppet to remind kids (and adults) to respect women, but I'm glad we have the long legacy of Jim Hensen to teach that message.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [48 favorites]
Today is going to be one of those days, isn't it?
There's been so much breaking news in the last few days I have to binge-watch it.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:01 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
There's been so much breaking news in the last few days I have to binge-watch it.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:01 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Bob Menendez's corruption trial starts in September. If he's convicted and ousted from the Senate, Chris effing Christie can appoint a Republican replacement.
Just to note that convicted and expelled are two different things and expulsion is not automatic. Even if he's convicted, he would still need to be expelled by a 2/3 vote of the Senate.
It seems unlikely to me that a corruption trial starting in September will be over with before there's a new governor on 16 January. Even more, it seems unlikely that it would be over with before 7 November when we'll know who the next governor is, and at that point all that 15 Democrats have to to is insist that Murphy should get to appoint the new Senator.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:02 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
Just to note that convicted and expelled are two different things and expulsion is not automatic. Even if he's convicted, he would still need to be expelled by a 2/3 vote of the Senate.
It seems unlikely to me that a corruption trial starting in September will be over with before there's a new governor on 16 January. Even more, it seems unlikely that it would be over with before 7 November when we'll know who the next governor is, and at that point all that 15 Democrats have to to is insist that Murphy should get to appoint the new Senator.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:02 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
88 Lines About The 45th President
This resolution doesn't even rhyme, this is bullshit, fuck, now I'm going to spend my afternoon trying to write a song parody aren't I? DAMMIT.
posted by maryr at 8:11 AM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
This resolution doesn't even rhyme, this is bullshit, fuck, now I'm going to spend my afternoon trying to write a song parody aren't I? DAMMIT.
posted by maryr at 8:11 AM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
I think, though, there is another way to read his comments on recusal and Sessions. I read it this way: "If I had known that Sessions would have to recuse himself, I would not have appointed him". I think the reading that Sessions following the rules is the problem is not fair; what Trump hates is the outcome, and if he had known the outcome, he would have selected differently. I actually think that is kinda fair. I mean, you put the guy in and he has to recuse himself right away because he has a conflict. Gotta piss you off.
OTOH, its what you get for putting a fucking asshole in the position (I mean sessions)
posted by Bovine Love at 8:12 AM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
OTOH, its what you get for putting a fucking asshole in the position (I mean sessions)
posted by Bovine Love at 8:12 AM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
CNN: President Trump's First Six Months: By the Numbers
posted by Doktor Zed at 8:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [42 favorites]
• 38.3% job approval in recent polls, down from 50% in counties Trump won in 2016Also, his re-election campaign and fundraising committees have raised $25.9 million—but have doubled spending on legal fees.
• 5 campaign-style rallies, 1 news conference
• 42 bills signed into law, 0 pieces of major legislation
• 59 seconds total time shaking hands with French President Emmanuel Macron
• 991 tweets, including 46 tweets mentioning jobs, 22 tweets mentioning Hillary Clinton, 82 tweets mentioning fake news/fake media/fake stories
• 40 days total spent at Trump golf properties, 21 out of the first 26 weekend spent at Trump properties
posted by Doktor Zed at 8:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [42 favorites]
The success is, at its heart, still his. This guy is truly one of the all-time assholes.
I'm not going to be happy until Trump's dead and buried and his tombstone has THIS FUCKING GUY engraved on it and Americans visit it to throw garbage on the Tomb of the Fucking Guy.
posted by octobersurprise at 8:15 AM on July 20, 2017 [103 favorites]
I'm not going to be happy until Trump's dead and buried and his tombstone has THIS FUCKING GUY engraved on it and Americans visit it to throw garbage on the Tomb of the Fucking Guy.
posted by octobersurprise at 8:15 AM on July 20, 2017 [103 favorites]
So... the woman referred to in this comment from the last thread has a blogspot chronicling her life with her husband after the cancer diagnosis. It's fucking heartbreaking. She directly calls out arizona republicans in this post from 2010. Whatever else Mccain is, at least he's a consistent asshole. Fuck him.
I'm not trying to invade her privacy here, so feel free to delete this if it appears too personal, but this is what the republican healthcare system looks like for a lot of people.
posted by logicpunk at 8:16 AM on July 20, 2017 [34 favorites]
I'm not trying to invade her privacy here, so feel free to delete this if it appears too personal, but this is what the republican healthcare system looks like for a lot of people.
posted by logicpunk at 8:16 AM on July 20, 2017 [34 favorites]
38.3% job approval in recent polls, down from 50% in counties Trump won in 2016
It's simultaneously 38.3% in the country as a whole, and 50% if you ask just people in counties he won.
I mention it because Breitbart made this same mistake (though in their case it was totally intentional) in reverse in one of their headlines. They claimed his approval was "up" to 50%
posted by OnceUponATime at 8:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
It's simultaneously 38.3% in the country as a whole, and 50% if you ask just people in counties he won.
I mention it because Breitbart made this same mistake (though in their case it was totally intentional) in reverse in one of their headlines. They claimed his approval was "up" to 50%
posted by OnceUponATime at 8:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
I have always thought that the way Trump behaves around Putin is a lot like "a pre-teen girl with a crush".
You know what's weird? Lately Trump has been talking about himself like he's catnip to men, e.g., the President of France wants to hold his hand and the President of Omaha Steaks just wants to kiss him so much. He repeated both phrases several times. Huh.
posted by carmicha at 8:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [39 favorites]
Oh goddammit, my reading comprehension is clearly eroding under the strain of keeping up with the Trump news cycle.
posted by Doktor Zed at 8:20 AM on July 20, 2017
posted by Doktor Zed at 8:20 AM on July 20, 2017
I think the reading that Sessions following the rules is the problem is not fair
I disagree. Trump has made it abundantly, explicitly clear what kind of person he is and what he wants from the people working for him, namely unquestioning, unconditional loyalty. A reading that Trump cares anything about what kind of job Sessions is able to do beyond his acting to defend Trump's interests is in direct contradiction with literally everything Trump has said and done over the last year.
posted by biogeo at 8:20 AM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
I disagree. Trump has made it abundantly, explicitly clear what kind of person he is and what he wants from the people working for him, namely unquestioning, unconditional loyalty. A reading that Trump cares anything about what kind of job Sessions is able to do beyond his acting to defend Trump's interests is in direct contradiction with literally everything Trump has said and done over the last year.
posted by biogeo at 8:20 AM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
President of Omaha Steaks has been on Trump's wagon a loooong time.
posted by tilde at 8:21 AM on July 20, 2017
posted by tilde at 8:21 AM on July 20, 2017
I feel like the Sessions kerfuffle is pretty straightforward.
Trump made Sessions AG because Sessions is complicit and Trump assumed that meant he could protect him. Now he's annoyed that it isn't working that way.
posted by diogenes at 8:21 AM on July 20, 2017 [53 favorites]
Trump made Sessions AG because Sessions is complicit and Trump assumed that meant he could protect him. Now he's annoyed that it isn't working that way.
posted by diogenes at 8:21 AM on July 20, 2017 [53 favorites]
There's a line from the Chvrches song Leave A Trace that runs through my head a lot, a pitch-perfect deadpan condemnation of a narcissist's posturing about blame and credit:
Yeah, there's a lot of lines from Leave a Trace that apply to this.
And you had best believe
That you cannot build what I don't need
And I know I need to feel relief
And I know you'll never fold
But I believe nothing that I'm told
And I know I need to feel relief
I know I need to feel released
Take care to tell it just as it was
Take care to tell on me for the cause
I know I need to feel released
Take care to bury all that you can
Take care to leave a trace of a man
The thing that's getting me through the day is the possibility that Mueller might be the real deal, that he and his team are just behind Trump and they do intend to make him pay for his crime. (Thankfully, all I have to deal with is merely my own terrible government, not America's disastrous government.)
posted by Merus at 8:24 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Yeah, there's a lot of lines from Leave a Trace that apply to this.
And you had best believe
That you cannot build what I don't need
And I know I need to feel relief
And I know you'll never fold
But I believe nothing that I'm told
And I know I need to feel relief
I know I need to feel released
Take care to tell it just as it was
Take care to tell on me for the cause
I know I need to feel released
Take care to bury all that you can
Take care to leave a trace of a man
The thing that's getting me through the day is the possibility that Mueller might be the real deal, that he and his team are just behind Trump and they do intend to make him pay for his crime. (Thankfully, all I have to deal with is merely my own terrible government, not America's disastrous government.)
posted by Merus at 8:24 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Fact Check: Trump's Confusing Remarks To Senate Republicans On Health Care (NPR, July 20, 2017)
Or this could have been accurately re-titled "Trump's mostly false, often confusing remarks." Still, helpful to have his lies and trickery called out, point by point.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:26 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Or this could have been accurately re-titled "Trump's mostly false, often confusing remarks." Still, helpful to have his lies and trickery called out, point by point.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:26 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Bad news: Under Prince's watch, Blackwater military contractors opened fire in a city square in Baghdad, killing 17 civilians in one of the worst episodes of the Iraq war
And that was when they were providing diplomatic security, which is an explicitly defensive role. Imagine how well things will work out if they're tasked to perform large-scale offensive maneuvers.
posted by Etrigan at 8:28 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
And that was when they were providing diplomatic security, which is an explicitly defensive role. Imagine how well things will work out if they're tasked to perform large-scale offensive maneuvers.
posted by Etrigan at 8:28 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Even more, it seems unlikely that it would be over with before 7 November when we'll know who the next governor is, and at that point all that 15 Democrats have to to is insist that Murphy should get to appoint the new Senator.
They should also explicitly cite McConnell stealing Obama's SCOTUS pick as precedent.
posted by Gelatin at 8:29 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
They should also explicitly cite McConnell stealing Obama's SCOTUS pick as precedent.
posted by Gelatin at 8:29 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
Daily Dana Watch Update: A Top Rohrabacher Aide Is Ousted After Russia Revelations
Paul Behrends, a top aide to Representative Dana Rohrabacher, has been ousted from his role as staff director for the House Foreign Affairs subcommittee that Rohrabacher chairs, after stories appeared in the press highlighting his relationships with pro-Russia lobbyists.posted by notyou at 8:30 AM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
“Paul Behrends no longer works at the committee,” a House Foreign Affairs Committee spokesperson said on Wednesday evening.
Behrends accompanied Rohrabacher on a 2016 trip to Moscow in which Rohrabacher said he received anti-Magnitsky Act materials from prosecutors. The Magnitsky Act is a 2012 bill that imposes sanctions on Russian officials associated with the 2009 death in prison of lawyer Sergei Magnitsky, who had been investigating tax fraud. Natalia Veselnitskaya, the Russian attorney and lobbyist who met with Donald Trump Jr. at Trump Tower last year, reportedly brought up the Magintsky Act during the meeting.
(I guess Watching Dana Rohrabacher is my new hobby now.)
posted by notyou at 8:31 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by notyou at 8:31 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
Mueller Expands Probe to Trump Business Transactions
It might look like Mueller shining a spotlight is a reaction to Trump warning him not to go there, but it's probably the other way around -- Trump may have learned that Mueller's team was looking thru his personal finances.
I hope he feels like a rat in a trap.
posted by Gelatin at 8:34 AM on July 20, 2017 [43 favorites]
It might look like Mueller shining a spotlight is a reaction to Trump warning him not to go there, but it's probably the other way around -- Trump may have learned that Mueller's team was looking thru his personal finances.
I hope he feels like a rat in a trap.
posted by Gelatin at 8:34 AM on July 20, 2017 [43 favorites]
I hope he is fucking miserable, but I fear that he is incapable of feeling normal human emotions and is thus immune to misery. (Or he's been miserable his entire adult life and it's just the temperature of his water.)
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:37 AM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:37 AM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
I hope he feels like a rat in a trap.
The world is a vampire, sent to drain
Secret destroyers, hold you up to the flames
And what do I get, for my pain?
Betrayed desires, and a piece of the game
Napoleon finished a little bit bad
His one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night
Because he had extracurricular activities
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:38 AM on July 20, 2017 [19 favorites]
The world is a vampire, sent to drain
Secret destroyers, hold you up to the flames
And what do I get, for my pain?
Betrayed desires, and a piece of the game
Napoleon finished a little bit bad
His one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night
Because he had extracurricular activities
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:38 AM on July 20, 2017 [19 favorites]
He reminds me so much of my asshole[...]
Let me stop you right there.
posted by greermahoney at 8:40 AM on July 20, 2017 [73 favorites]
Let me stop you right there.
posted by greermahoney at 8:40 AM on July 20, 2017 [73 favorites]
I read the NYT transcript. I really shouldn't have, for the sake of my already frail wellbeing. Caudillo Trumpo gives me a mixture of panic attack and nausea, and I'm not even American.
This small, vicious, greedy guy has all the symptoms of a dysfunctional monarch, aided and abetted by the Monarchist Republicans controlling the rotten boroughs. Oh I mean gerrymandered districts.
The 88 Theses are cute. Maybe the Dems can pin it to the gate of Trump Tower. Meanwhile they better bave a plan of capturing those seats real fast. Otherwise this America thingy is over.
posted by runcifex at 8:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
This small, vicious, greedy guy has all the symptoms of a dysfunctional monarch, aided and abetted by the Monarchist Republicans controlling the rotten boroughs. Oh I mean gerrymandered districts.
The 88 Theses are cute. Maybe the Dems can pin it to the gate of Trump Tower. Meanwhile they better bave a plan of capturing those seats real fast. Otherwise this America thingy is over.
posted by runcifex at 8:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
I hope he is fucking miserable, but I fear that he is incapable of feeling normal human emotions and is thus immune to misery. (Or he's been miserable his entire adult life and it's just the temperature of his water.)
Between the many stories of him yelling at the unceasing tide of bad news on TV, his unhinged tweets, and his obvious appreciation of the momentary distraction of pretending to drive a big truck, I don't doubt Trump is not having a good time here. Good.
posted by Gelatin at 8:42 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Between the many stories of him yelling at the unceasing tide of bad news on TV, his unhinged tweets, and his obvious appreciation of the momentary distraction of pretending to drive a big truck, I don't doubt Trump is not having a good time here. Good.
posted by Gelatin at 8:42 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
I hope he is fucking miserable, but I fear that he is incapable of feeling normal human emotions and is thus immune to misery.
People with Narcissistic Personality Disorder are frequently miserable. I'm not diagnosing Trump from afar, but I wouldn't confuse bluster and grandiosity as lack of emotion. Now, lack of remorse, that's a different thing.
posted by OmieWise at 8:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
People with Narcissistic Personality Disorder are frequently miserable. I'm not diagnosing Trump from afar, but I wouldn't confuse bluster and grandiosity as lack of emotion. Now, lack of remorse, that's a different thing.
posted by OmieWise at 8:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
The world is a vampire, sent to drain
Though besmirched and malaised, King Rat still gilds his cage.
--Cicero Corgan
posted by snuffleupagus at 8:45 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
Though besmirched and malaised, King Rat still gilds his cage.
--Cicero Corgan
posted by snuffleupagus at 8:45 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
People with Narcissistic Personality Disorder are frequently miserable.
My mother got no joy out of making everyone around her miserable, I concur. But she also didn't care if we were, because she was a narcissist. Our emotions were secondary to her fear, anxiety, and paranoia.
Which appears to be the situation here. 45 doesn't care if he scares the whole world with his bluster and ignorance: what's important is how he feels, and whether he's getting enough praise.
posted by suelac at 8:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [36 favorites]
My mother got no joy out of making everyone around her miserable, I concur. But she also didn't care if we were, because she was a narcissist. Our emotions were secondary to her fear, anxiety, and paranoia.
Which appears to be the situation here. 45 doesn't care if he scares the whole world with his bluster and ignorance: what's important is how he feels, and whether he's getting enough praise.
posted by suelac at 8:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [36 favorites]
I hope he is fucking miserable ...
Well, Junior is miserable, reportedly:
Well, Junior is miserable, reportedly:
Donald Trump Jr. is reportedly "miserable" and can't wait for the next four years to end.posted by octobersurprise at 8:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [36 favorites]
A friend of President Trump's two adult sons told People that Trump Jr. and Eric Trump "never wanted this."
“Don can’t do any deals, because he’ll be overly scrutinized. He just goes to work every day and is miserable," a source in their circle added.
"Don can’t do any deals, because he’ll be overly scrutinized."
TRANSLATION: Donny Junior can't do any deals because he's incapable of completing any transaction which abides by regulatory law
posted by mightygodking at 8:51 AM on July 20, 2017 [143 favorites]
TRANSLATION: Donny Junior can't do any deals because he's incapable of completing any transaction which abides by regulatory law
posted by mightygodking at 8:51 AM on July 20, 2017 [143 favorites]
Donald Trump Jr. is reportedly "miserable" and can't wait for the next four years to end.
I don't like that another person's misery gives me some pleasure. The stain of this presidency poisons everything.
posted by biogeo at 8:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [50 favorites]
I don't like that another person's misery gives me some pleasure. The stain of this presidency poisons everything.
posted by biogeo at 8:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [50 favorites]
Don can't do deals requires the sub-submolecular violin. Don can't do deals! How impoverished the world is now a not-too-bright shady fucker is having a hard time being shady.
posted by Artw at 8:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [34 favorites]
posted by Artw at 8:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [34 favorites]
I hope nobody takes their eyes off these shits once their dad is dead/in prison/out of office/whatever.
posted by Artw at 8:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by Artw at 8:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
As it's a new thread, I'm going to make a plea many have asked for. Please search the thread (and the last, since it's new) for your link or news to share. I see each OMG-worthy story posted multiple times. Case in point, the Donny Jr being miserable thing has been posted probably 5 times now.
Please make these threads last longer and make our browser refreshing not so unbearable by using ctrl-f to be sure your news is actually new.
posted by greermahoney at 8:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [27 favorites]
Please make these threads last longer and make our browser refreshing not so unbearable by using ctrl-f to be sure your news is actually new.
posted by greermahoney at 8:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [27 favorites]
Don can't do deals requires the sub-submolecular violin.
It uses Planck-length strings!
posted by cortex at 8:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
It uses Planck-length strings!
posted by cortex at 8:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
"Don can’t do any deals, because he’ll be overly scrutinized."
Translation: The majority of the Trump Org's business was basically tied up in deals with Russian oligarchs since 2003 or so, and now serving as a vehicle for money laundering for foreign mobsters has become very problematic, what with this Russia thing and all. What's a boy to do?
posted by dis_integration at 8:57 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
Translation: The majority of the Trump Org's business was basically tied up in deals with Russian oligarchs since 2003 or so, and now serving as a vehicle for money laundering for foreign mobsters has become very problematic, what with this Russia thing and all. What's a boy to do?
posted by dis_integration at 8:57 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
If there were ever a time to pass along an old ballad--
Buonaparte is afar from his wars and his fighting;
He has gone to the place he can take no delight in.
He may sit there and tell of the stories he's seen of
While forlorn he doth mourn on the Isle of Saint Helena.
Nevermore in St. Cloud he'll be seen in such splendor,
Or go on with his wars like the great Alexander,
He looks on his victories and how fleeting they all were
They have caused him to die on the Isle of Saint Helena.
Louisa doth mourn for her husband's departing
She dreams when she sleeps and she wakes broken-hearted.
Not a friend to console her, in the past there were so many
But she mourns when she thinks on the Isle of Saint Helena.
Come all ye that have wealth, pray beware of ambition
For a small twist of fate it might change your condition
Be steadfast in time, for what's to come you know not
For your race it may end on the Isle of Saint Helena
posted by Richard Saunders at 8:57 AM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
Buonaparte is afar from his wars and his fighting;
He has gone to the place he can take no delight in.
He may sit there and tell of the stories he's seen of
While forlorn he doth mourn on the Isle of Saint Helena.
Nevermore in St. Cloud he'll be seen in such splendor,
Or go on with his wars like the great Alexander,
He looks on his victories and how fleeting they all were
They have caused him to die on the Isle of Saint Helena.
Louisa doth mourn for her husband's departing
She dreams when she sleeps and she wakes broken-hearted.
Not a friend to console her, in the past there were so many
But she mourns when she thinks on the Isle of Saint Helena.
Come all ye that have wealth, pray beware of ambition
For a small twist of fate it might change your condition
Be steadfast in time, for what's to come you know not
For your race it may end on the Isle of Saint Helena
posted by Richard Saunders at 8:57 AM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
I read a few days ago that, when investigating Enron, part of Mueller's opening salvo was charging the wife of Enron's CFO. Now I'm fantasizing that this time the first person charged is Ivanka, as a way of telling Muprt that he is Not. Fucking. Around.
posted by um at 8:58 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by um at 8:58 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
They should also explicitly cite McConnell stealing Obama's SCOTUS pick as precedent.
Since Trump filed for re-election on Inauguration Day, we're already in the 2020 campaign, so longstanding precedence would prevent him from appointing any Supreme Court justices until January 2021.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:59 AM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
I'm going to spend my afternoon trying to write a song parody aren't I? DAMMIT.
Wait. No. I can't do this. 88 Lines About 44 Women is twice as many lines as women, but 88 Lines About 45 would be one line per complaint and they're short lines and I don't think I can condense Whereas, on March 15, 2017, U.S. District Court Judge Derrick Watson in the state of Hawaii blocked implementation of President Trump’s revised executive order, noting that when Mr. Trump was asked during the presidential campaign if he was pulling back from a ‘‘Muslim ban,’’ Mr. Trump said, ‘‘I don’t think it’s a rollback. In fact, you could say it’s an expansion. I‘m looking now at territories. People were so upset when I used the word Muslim. Oh, you can’t use the word Muslim. Remember this. And I’m okay with that, because I’m talking about territory instead of Muslim.’’; into one 7-8 syllable line oh god I'm going to try anyway aren't I? somone please give me actual work to do.
posted by maryr at 9:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Wait. No. I can't do this. 88 Lines About 44 Women is twice as many lines as women, but 88 Lines About 45 would be one line per complaint and they're short lines and I don't think I can condense Whereas, on March 15, 2017, U.S. District Court Judge Derrick Watson in the state of Hawaii blocked implementation of President Trump’s revised executive order, noting that when Mr. Trump was asked during the presidential campaign if he was pulling back from a ‘‘Muslim ban,’’ Mr. Trump said, ‘‘I don’t think it’s a rollback. In fact, you could say it’s an expansion. I‘m looking now at territories. People were so upset when I used the word Muslim. Oh, you can’t use the word Muslim. Remember this. And I’m okay with that, because I’m talking about territory instead of Muslim.’’; into one 7-8 syllable line oh god I'm going to try anyway aren't I? somone please give me actual work to do.
posted by maryr at 9:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
It uses Planck-length strings!
Fitting music for a p-brane.
posted by biogeo at 9:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Fitting music for a p-brane.
posted by biogeo at 9:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Yeah, so you know Trump saying that he was sitting next to two people who didn't speak English? One of them was Shinzo Abe's wife, and well, she definitely speaks English.
Spoiler alert, to save you the click: 10+ minute long video clip of Akie Abe delivering a keynote address in English to a conference on disaster response.
(Pedantry: yeah, yeah, I know, being able to deliver a prepared speech in English is not the same as being able to have a conversation in English fluently in a setting where a misunderstanding could cause an international incident, so she may have opted not to speak English, but STILL.
As an Asian-American woman who has clear, bitter memories of flinching whenever well-meaning Americans from a non-immigrant background complimented me on my English, I'm fucking CACKLING at the possibility that Trump's stereotypes about East Asians being used against him, so that she could stare at the wallpaper and poke her banquet steak in peace. How many times do you think she signalled for more wine?)
posted by joyceanmachine at 9:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [102 favorites]
Spoiler alert, to save you the click: 10+ minute long video clip of Akie Abe delivering a keynote address in English to a conference on disaster response.
(Pedantry: yeah, yeah, I know, being able to deliver a prepared speech in English is not the same as being able to have a conversation in English fluently in a setting where a misunderstanding could cause an international incident, so she may have opted not to speak English, but STILL.
As an Asian-American woman who has clear, bitter memories of flinching whenever well-meaning Americans from a non-immigrant background complimented me on my English, I'm fucking CACKLING at the possibility that Trump's stereotypes about East Asians being used against him, so that she could stare at the wallpaper and poke her banquet steak in peace. How many times do you think she signalled for more wine?)
posted by joyceanmachine at 9:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [102 favorites]
Yesterday:
posted by pjenks at 9:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
SCHMIDT: Last thing, if Mueller was looking at your finances and your family finances, unrelated to Russia — is that a red line?Today: Bloomburg reports (linked above, see also the articles in the NYTimes and The Guardian, yesterday) that Trump's Deutsche Bank loans are being investigated by Mueller, and that:
HABERMAN: Would that be a breach of what his actual charge is?
TRUMP: I would say yeah. I would say yes. By the way, I would say, I don’t — I don’t — I mean, it’s possible there’s a condo or something, so, you know, I sell a lot of condo units, and somebody from Russia buys a condo, who knows? I don’t make money from Russia. In fact, I put out a letter saying that I don’t make — from one of the most highly respected law firms, accounting firms. I don’t have buildings in Russia. They said I own buildings in Russia. I don’t. They said I made money from Russia. I don’t. It’s not my thing. I don’t, I don’t do that. Over the years, I’ve looked at maybe doing a deal in Russia, but I never did one. Other than I held the Miss Universe pageant there eight, nine years...
SCHMIDT: But if he was outside that lane, would that mean he’d have to go?
TRUMP: No, I think that’s a violation. Look, this is about Russia. So I think if he wants to go, my finances are extremely good, my company is an unbelievably successful company. And actually, when I do my filings, peoples say, “Man.” People have no idea how successful this is. It’s a great company. But I don’t even think about the company anymore. I think about this. ’Cause one thing, when you do this, companies seem very trivial. O.K.? I really mean that. They seem very trivial. But I have no income from Russia. I don’t do business with Russia. The gentleman that you mentioned, with his son, two nice people. But basically, they brought the Miss Universe pageant to Russia to open up, you know, one of their jobs. Perhaps the convention center where it was held. It was a nice evening, and I left. I left, you know, I left Moscow. It wasn’t Moscow, it was outside of Moscow.
HABERMAN: Would you fire Mueller if he went outside of certain parameters of what his charge is?
TRUMP: I can't, I can't answer that question because I don’t think it's going to happen.
The roots of Mueller’s follow-the-money investigation lie in a wide-ranging money laundering probe launched by then-Manhattan U.S. Attorney Preet Bharara last year, according to the person.Potentially useful background information on the Preet Bharara probe from Rachel Maddow's March 13th show, just after Bharara was fired (transcript).
...
The Bharara probe was consolidated into Mueller’s inquiry, showing that the special counsel is taking an overarching approach to his mandated investigation of Russian interference in the 2016 presidential election.
posted by pjenks at 9:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
Can someone take a powerful laser to Chicago and realize my protest art concept? Thanks
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:03 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:03 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
It's also very telling in the NYT interview that Trump consistently uses the word "reviews" when he talks about how others are talking about him. He may literally know that this President thing is not a show, but essentially for him there is not much difference.
posted by anothermug at 9:10 AM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
posted by anothermug at 9:10 AM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
what is the deal with these cretins and "doing deals" as the standard unit of business activity, sounds like fucking Vincent Adultman. do you even know what you fucking do for a so called living you absolute dumbfuck
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [99 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [99 favorites]
Can someone take a powerful laser to Chicago and realize my protest art concept? Thanks
The one plus from Trump's horrible mismangement of gov't that is likely to occur in the next 10-20 years is that the Trump name will become so anathema that the removal of the TRUMP logo from that already-ugly building in Chicago is inevitable, so one day it will no longer terrorize the citizens of Chicago as they ride the El from Wabash to Lake.
One day.
posted by dis_integration at 9:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
The one plus from Trump's horrible mismangement of gov't that is likely to occur in the next 10-20 years is that the Trump name will become so anathema that the removal of the TRUMP logo from that already-ugly building in Chicago is inevitable, so one day it will no longer terrorize the citizens of Chicago as they ride the El from Wabash to Lake.
One day.
posted by dis_integration at 9:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
he does in fact not know what he does for a living.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
As an Asian-American woman who has clear, bitter memories of flinching whenever well-meaning Americans from a non-immigrant background complimented me on my English
Weird, that's the kind of uncouth behavior I usually expect to see from Americans of European immigrant background, not from people of Amerindian descent.
(To be clear, my remark is intended to support, not attack, your point about cultural assumptions of Whiteness being the American "default".)
posted by biogeo at 9:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Weird, that's the kind of uncouth behavior I usually expect to see from Americans of European immigrant background, not from people of Amerindian descent.
(To be clear, my remark is intended to support, not attack, your point about cultural assumptions of Whiteness being the American "default".)
posted by biogeo at 9:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
But the City of Chicago did a great job selecting some public art for the opposite side of the river
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:15 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:15 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
guys guys guys i just realized this is not the first time that trump and the abe's have met
HE HOSTED THEM AT MAR-A-LAGO, FOR, LIKE, AN ENTIRE WEEKEND.
akie abe started pretending not to speak english then
continued the whole weekend
kept it up at the g-20
glad to know that east asian ladies, regardless of national origin or social class, take the same tactic employed by an auntie when, like, barbara pong makes the same dish as them for the third potluck in a row
posted by joyceanmachine at 9:15 AM on July 20, 2017 [86 favorites]
HE HOSTED THEM AT MAR-A-LAGO, FOR, LIKE, AN ENTIRE WEEKEND.
akie abe started pretending not to speak english then
continued the whole weekend
kept it up at the g-20
glad to know that east asian ladies, regardless of national origin or social class, take the same tactic employed by an auntie when, like, barbara pong makes the same dish as them for the third potluck in a row
posted by joyceanmachine at 9:15 AM on July 20, 2017 [86 favorites]
He doesn't do anything for a living. He has a living a thousand times over, with no effort, from birth. That's a fundamental aspect of the self-defining delusions of many very wealthy people; not all, there are certainly hella rich folks who whatever else aside are both aware that they don't lead normal lives and interested in pursuing some sort of meaningful beyond-themselves use of their time.
But if you fantasize that you deserve your wealth, you prop up that fantasy by telling yourself that you're working for it, that you're earning it, that you have to try too. You mumble lies to yourself around the silver spoon, you chase down a self-image where the fundamental defining aspect of your character is e.g. The Deals You Do rather than the fact that you were born into outrageous wealth. And because you were born into outrageous wealth, it's deeply unlikely that you'll ever fuck up so bad that you'll be forced to understand how full of shit your personal narrative is.
posted by cortex at 9:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [69 favorites]
But if you fantasize that you deserve your wealth, you prop up that fantasy by telling yourself that you're working for it, that you're earning it, that you have to try too. You mumble lies to yourself around the silver spoon, you chase down a self-image where the fundamental defining aspect of your character is e.g. The Deals You Do rather than the fact that you were born into outrageous wealth. And because you were born into outrageous wealth, it's deeply unlikely that you'll ever fuck up so bad that you'll be forced to understand how full of shit your personal narrative is.
posted by cortex at 9:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [69 favorites]
Yeah, so you know Trump saying that he was sitting next to two people who didn't speak English?
Well, I can't find it now* but I'm positive someone on MSNBC said the reason Trump didn't use a Russian translator with Putin is because he (the US) brought a Japanese translator to the meeting (apparently indicating the plan was to spend significant time with Abe.)
*If you google the Japanese translator you get flooded with a viral story about how Trumo was oggling the translator's breasts.
posted by Room 641-A at 9:20 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Well, I can't find it now* but I'm positive someone on MSNBC said the reason Trump didn't use a Russian translator with Putin is because he (the US) brought a Japanese translator to the meeting (apparently indicating the plan was to spend significant time with Abe.)
*If you google the Japanese translator you get flooded with a viral story about how Trumo was oggling the translator's breasts.
posted by Room 641-A at 9:20 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Michael Wolff at the Hollywood Reporter: It was Ailes' tacit support of Trump that, in part, made his removal from Fox all the more urgent for the Murdochs. And it was not just the liberal sons who were agitated by Ailes' regard for Trump, but also the father, whose tabloid, the New York Post, helped create Trump, but who found him now, with great snobbery, not of "our" conservative class. ("When is Donald Trump going to stop embarrassing his friends, let alone the whole country?" Murdoch senior tweeted the day after Trump officially declared himself a candidate.) Murdoch instructed Ailes to tilt to anyone but Trump, Ailes confided to me before he was fired, even Hillary. (Ailes, for his part, characterized Murdoch's periodic efforts at interference as similar to Nixon's instructions to bomb this or that country — best ignored.)
Alas, if only Rupert Murdoch had more influence over American politics
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:22 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
Alas, if only Rupert Murdoch had more influence over American politics
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:22 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
If Trump fries Mueller, could the Whistleblower Law protect him? Ditto Rosenstein, or even God Forbid Sessions?
posted by msalt at 9:22 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by msalt at 9:22 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Rod Rosenstein or his replacement can fire Mueller (setting aside possible obstruction of justice). It's profoundly unlikely that Trump can legally fire Mueller. If he did so, it's possible Mueller would just continue doing his job until the courts decide his fate.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
I just want to say OMG that title.
posted by hilaryjade at 9:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by hilaryjade at 9:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
From a bit upthread, but:
I get he's their guy, and I'm pretty guilty of thinking about politics in a "team" based sort of way, but christ! If you can't see Trump as a problem then your head is way too far up your own ass.
Thing is, even with a complete moron like Trump in the White House, in theory a party holding a majority in both houses of Congress should be able to get shit done. The media will let the GOP get away with blaming Trump for their failures in Congress, but really, it shouldn't be such a factor.
They're theoretically all adults. They have staffers who know how to write laws. They had seven years to come up with an alternative to the ACA (hell, longer, if you consider they never bothered to put up an alternative while the ACA was going through Congress).
The exposure of incompetence and plain stupidity goes far beyond "Oh we have a moron in the White House."
posted by scaryblackdeath at 9:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [43 favorites]
I get he's their guy, and I'm pretty guilty of thinking about politics in a "team" based sort of way, but christ! If you can't see Trump as a problem then your head is way too far up your own ass.
Thing is, even with a complete moron like Trump in the White House, in theory a party holding a majority in both houses of Congress should be able to get shit done. The media will let the GOP get away with blaming Trump for their failures in Congress, but really, it shouldn't be such a factor.
They're theoretically all adults. They have staffers who know how to write laws. They had seven years to come up with an alternative to the ACA (hell, longer, if you consider they never bothered to put up an alternative while the ACA was going through Congress).
The exposure of incompetence and plain stupidity goes far beyond "Oh we have a moron in the White House."
posted by scaryblackdeath at 9:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [43 favorites]
Well, I can't find it now* but I'm positive someone on MSNBC said the reason Trump didn't use a Russian translator with Putin is because he (the US) brought a Japanese translator to the meeting (apparently indicating the plan was to spend significant time with Abe.)
Because, of course, the US can only bring one translator to an international summit of major world leaders. That's an excuse not even one's own grandmother would believe. Sheesh.
posted by Gelatin at 9:26 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Because, of course, the US can only bring one translator to an international summit of major world leaders. That's an excuse not even one's own grandmother would believe. Sheesh.
posted by Gelatin at 9:26 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
The media will let the GOP get away with blaming Trump for their failures in Congress anything
Fixed.
posted by Gelatin at 9:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
Fixed.
posted by Gelatin at 9:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
I just realized that if the popular vote was called the general vote Trump probably wouldn't care about it.
posted by Room 641-A at 9:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
posted by Room 641-A at 9:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
If Trump fries Mueller, could the Whistleblower Law protect him?
This assumes laws are actually going to be relevant at that point, of course. I'm still not seeing much evidence that this regime will care -- including the majority in Congress.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 9:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
This assumes laws are actually going to be relevant at that point, of course. I'm still not seeing much evidence that this regime will care -- including the majority in Congress.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 9:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Rod Rosenstein or his replacement can fire Mueller (setting aside possible obstruction of justice).
Only with cause. And in his testimony in front of Congress Rosenstein said that he had no reason to have cause at that time. Obviously Trump will try to get them to have the investigation of his finances as out of scope as the cause but it's pretty clear from the scope of the the SC mandate that Mueller has the right to investigate his finances, even if possible money laundering ties to Russia wasn't a compromat on its own.
posted by chris24 at 9:28 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Only with cause. And in his testimony in front of Congress Rosenstein said that he had no reason to have cause at that time. Obviously Trump will try to get them to have the investigation of his finances as out of scope as the cause but it's pretty clear from the scope of the the SC mandate that Mueller has the right to investigate his finances, even if possible money laundering ties to Russia wasn't a compromat on its own.
posted by chris24 at 9:28 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Donald Trump Jr. is reportedly "miserable" and can't wait for the next four years to end.
To de-stress, he works outat world-class level.
posted by anothermug at 9:29 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
To de-stress, he works out
posted by anothermug at 9:29 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Why Canada Is Able to Do Things Better (they pay taxes). After reading first the Atlantic article about what the Republican congress are thinking, and then the NPR fact-check of the health-care lunch, I realized that so much of what is going on in the US only makes sense when you have a huge part of the population imagining that a functioning society can be sustained for free because of market magic. I'm not going to post it, but just this morning I read a Douthat column arguing for unfinanced tax relief. It was so stupid I scared my dog by laughing out loud.
What I realize, from reading these endless discussions, is that in the US it is really controversial to contest this absurdity. Single payer in California? But the taxes!!!! Functioning infrastructure? But the taxes!!!! Schools that educate children all week? But the taxes!!!!
This whole framing has been a huge succes for the Republican party, since Reagan. One might argue that it necessitates both the racism and the drift towards ever more ignorant leaders. The racism because in the beginning the framing was about not paying for "others", like (non-existent) welfare queens. The ignorance because the collapse of government effects more and more parts of society. The opiate epidemic is one thing, but even billionaires need functioning roads, airfields and universities. You need to pretend ignorance or to be ignorant to not acknowledge that this is not working.
Also (as indicated in the article), the myth of a society without taxes needs the myth of American exceptionalism. Any other nation might notice that the most expensive healthcare system with the highest infant mortality rate in the world cannot be "the best". Not so in America, where the religion of America trumps any and all contradicting facts. Any other nation would notice that other countries, even developing countries, have excellent public transportation, smart grids, new airports etc.
(Usual disclaimer: your political system and weird beliefs are putting the whole world in danger, not least my personal peaceful corner. There is a huge munitions depot less than a kilometer from here, and I expect that all my prudence regarding future climate developments will be brought to nothing if WWIII breaks out. I let out my despair and anger here because POTUS may get my entire country flattened out completely through his ignorance and narcissism, and he was elected after decades of Republican cynical manipulation and I hope some of you will do what you can to influence the American electorate).
posted by mumimor at 9:32 AM on July 20, 2017 [47 favorites]
What I realize, from reading these endless discussions, is that in the US it is really controversial to contest this absurdity. Single payer in California? But the taxes!!!! Functioning infrastructure? But the taxes!!!! Schools that educate children all week? But the taxes!!!!
This whole framing has been a huge succes for the Republican party, since Reagan. One might argue that it necessitates both the racism and the drift towards ever more ignorant leaders. The racism because in the beginning the framing was about not paying for "others", like (non-existent) welfare queens. The ignorance because the collapse of government effects more and more parts of society. The opiate epidemic is one thing, but even billionaires need functioning roads, airfields and universities. You need to pretend ignorance or to be ignorant to not acknowledge that this is not working.
Also (as indicated in the article), the myth of a society without taxes needs the myth of American exceptionalism. Any other nation might notice that the most expensive healthcare system with the highest infant mortality rate in the world cannot be "the best". Not so in America, where the religion of America trumps any and all contradicting facts. Any other nation would notice that other countries, even developing countries, have excellent public transportation, smart grids, new airports etc.
(Usual disclaimer: your political system and weird beliefs are putting the whole world in danger, not least my personal peaceful corner. There is a huge munitions depot less than a kilometer from here, and I expect that all my prudence regarding future climate developments will be brought to nothing if WWIII breaks out. I let out my despair and anger here because POTUS may get my entire country flattened out completely through his ignorance and narcissism, and he was elected after decades of Republican cynical manipulation and I hope some of you will do what you can to influence the American electorate).
posted by mumimor at 9:32 AM on July 20, 2017 [47 favorites]
If he did so, it's possible Mueller would just continue doing his job until the courts decide his fate.
Yeah, if Mueller's team of lawyers is half as good as they sound, they're prepping a package to file roughly 15 seconds after Trump formally tries to fire Mueller, including a request for a court to stay the firing and allow Mueller to continue doing his job.
Not even close to a litigator, but my God, that's a spicy drafting assignment.
posted by joyceanmachine at 9:32 AM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
Yeah, if Mueller's team of lawyers is half as good as they sound, they're prepping a package to file roughly 15 seconds after Trump formally tries to fire Mueller, including a request for a court to stay the firing and allow Mueller to continue doing his job.
Not even close to a litigator, but my God, that's a spicy drafting assignment.
posted by joyceanmachine at 9:32 AM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
The CBO scored the most recent version of the BCRA (sans Cruz Amendment). +22 million uninsured. In short, they spent $120B more than the last version, but it still covers the same number of people, so some really great work being done here. Quality stuff.
posted by zachlipton at 9:33 AM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 9:33 AM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
And because you were born into outrageous wealth, it's deeply unlikely that you'll ever fuck up so bad that you'll be forced to understand how full of shit your personal narrative is.
so what you're saying is, he'll never fail like common people, he'll never watch his life slide out of view
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:34 AM on July 20, 2017 [55 favorites]
so what you're saying is, he'll never fail like common people, he'll never watch his life slide out of view
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:34 AM on July 20, 2017 [55 favorites]
Because, of course, the US can only bring one translator to an international summit of major world leaders. That's an excuse not even one's own grandmother would believe. Sheesh.
Oh! A CNN story I found earlier that wasn't specifically about this mentions that each country is allowed one translator: The White House, in a statement acknowledging the meeting, contended it was "brief" and said Trump spoke with Putin through Russia's translator. The US translator at the dinner -- each country was only allowed only one -- spoke Japanese, the White House said.
posted by Room 641-A at 9:34 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Oh! A CNN story I found earlier that wasn't specifically about this mentions that each country is allowed one translator: The White House, in a statement acknowledging the meeting, contended it was "brief" and said Trump spoke with Putin through Russia's translator. The US translator at the dinner -- each country was only allowed only one -- spoke Japanese, the White House said.
posted by Room 641-A at 9:34 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
On the translator issue: if CNN is to be believed, each country was only allowed to bring in one translator. That sounds plausible to me, as organizers likely would want to keep auxiliary staff to a minimum at a dinner of the principals. And if the Mango Mussolini was seated with the Japanese PM, then having a Japanese speaking translator would make sense (but it certainly indicates that his sauntering over to Putin was not a planned act (or not planned/shared with DJT's staff, at least).
posted by AwkwardPause at 9:35 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by AwkwardPause at 9:35 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Jinx!
posted by AwkwardPause at 9:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by AwkwardPause at 9:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Don can't do deals requires the sub-submolecular violin.
Well I've got a Planck Bass, baby
And it's such a shame
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Well I've got a Planck Bass, baby
And it's such a shame
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
what is the deal with these cretins and "doing deals" as the standard unit of business activity, sounds like fucking Vincent Adultman.
I was recently on vacation with a friend who had to make some work related calls. It amused me to no end to ask if he just "did a business deal."
posted by diogenes at 9:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
I was recently on vacation with a friend who had to make some work related calls. It amused me to no end to ask if he just "did a business deal."
posted by diogenes at 9:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
I realized that so much of what is going on in the US only makes sense when you have a huge part of the population imagining that a functioning society can be sustained for free because of market magic. I'm not going to post it, but just this morning I read a Douthat column arguing for unfinanced tax relief.
It's long past time for Democrats to refer to those who want the benefits of government without paying taxes as deadbeats, moochers, and free-riders.
posted by Gelatin at 9:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [57 favorites]
It's long past time for Democrats to refer to those who want the benefits of government without paying taxes as deadbeats, moochers, and free-riders.
posted by Gelatin at 9:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [57 favorites]
After the NYT story about Sessions and Mueller I have a feeling tomorrow/ this weekend could end up being the shit show we've all been waiting for. Especially considering Trump is headed off to play golf for the next two weeks.
I've stopped trying to make sense of the situation. The Buchanan post and the over-riding ideology at work in this country has made it crystal clear to me that the political process in this country is irretrievably broken and the democratic party doesn't have an answer.
posted by photoslob at 9:38 AM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
I've stopped trying to make sense of the situation. The Buchanan post and the over-riding ideology at work in this country has made it crystal clear to me that the political process in this country is irretrievably broken and the democratic party doesn't have an answer.
posted by photoslob at 9:38 AM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Yeah, if Mueller's team of lawyers is half as good as they sound, they're prepping a package to file roughly 15 seconds after Trump formally tries to fire Mueller, including a request for a court to stay the firing and allow Mueller to continue doing his job.
If they're ACTUALLY as good as they sound, their plan for how to deal with this eventuality has been in place since the very beginning--as in it quite possibly was complete before he actually took the job. I don't think he would have agreed to do this if he thought there was a legal way for the President to kill it.
posted by Sequence at 9:43 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
If they're ACTUALLY as good as they sound, their plan for how to deal with this eventuality has been in place since the very beginning--as in it quite possibly was complete before he actually took the job. I don't think he would have agreed to do this if he thought there was a legal way for the President to kill it.
posted by Sequence at 9:43 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
I'm curious, now living in this reality: What can be done when the government simply ignores the law or selectively enforces it? I mean, that's essentially a coup, isn't it? Practically, I mean.
posted by maxwelton at 9:52 AM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by maxwelton at 9:52 AM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
I assume that if Mueller believes he can only be legally fired by the Deputy AG, he'll continue doing his work until a court issues a TRO or injunction ordering him to stop. If Trump doesn't have the legal power to fire Mueller directly, then it's the same legal effect as a random person off the street trying to fire Mueller.
posted by melissasaurus at 9:52 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by melissasaurus at 9:52 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
I just realized that if the popular vote was called the general vote Trump probably wouldn't care about it.
I'm 100% sure that it kills him he lost the popular vote, and I love it.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:55 AM on July 20, 2017 [19 favorites]
I assume that if Mueller believes he can only be legally fired by the Deputy AG, he'll continue doing his work until a court issues a TRO or injunction ordering him to stop.
Mueller is wealthy, and could certainly afford to work for free, but investigations are expensive, and many of his junior staff probably needs the salary to pay the rent. I don't know how his investigation is being funded, but cutting off the funding stream seems the only way of stopping him if he didn't want to be stopped.
posted by Gelatin at 9:55 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Mueller is wealthy, and could certainly afford to work for free, but investigations are expensive, and many of his junior staff probably needs the salary to pay the rent. I don't know how his investigation is being funded, but cutting off the funding stream seems the only way of stopping him if he didn't want to be stopped.
posted by Gelatin at 9:55 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
I assume that if Mueller believes he can only be legally fired by the Deputy AG, he'll continue doing his work until a court issues a TRO or injunction ordering him to stop
It leads to a Saturday Night Massacre scenario, in which Trump has to throw off all pretense of respect for the rule of law and fire Deputy AGs serially until one is willing to fire Mueller. We've already seen a dress rehearsal for that with the Yates firing over the immigration ban.
Which, given Bork's involvement as the patsy actually doing the firing and the later reprisal in his attempted SCOTUS confirmation, is weirdly a direct antecedent of today's situation.
posted by snuffleupagus at 9:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
It leads to a Saturday Night Massacre scenario, in which Trump has to throw off all pretense of respect for the rule of law and fire Deputy AGs serially until one is willing to fire Mueller. We've already seen a dress rehearsal for that with the Yates firing over the immigration ban.
Which, given Bork's involvement as the patsy actually doing the firing and the later reprisal in his attempted SCOTUS confirmation, is weirdly a direct antecedent of today's situation.
posted by snuffleupagus at 9:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
it's the same legal effect as a random person off the street trying to fire Mueller.
YOU FIRED!
posted by murphy slaw at 9:56 AM on July 20, 2017
YOU FIRED!
posted by murphy slaw at 9:56 AM on July 20, 2017
I'm curious, now living in this reality: What can be done when the government simply ignores the law or selectively enforces it? I mean, that's essentially a coup, isn't it? Practically, I mean.
I guess the affected party/parties could ask the courts to force the government to act (IANAL). I can imagine this happening if the Administration follows through on its "maybe we will, maybe we won't" threats not to make the cost-sharing reduction payments to insurers, which are mandated by the ACA.
I said this in January and I'll say it again: at some point, the courts are going to tell Trump that he can't do something he really wants to do (or has to do something he doesn't want to do, in this case), and he'll do (not do) it anyway.
And then, what happens?
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:57 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
I guess the affected party/parties could ask the courts to force the government to act (IANAL). I can imagine this happening if the Administration follows through on its "maybe we will, maybe we won't" threats not to make the cost-sharing reduction payments to insurers, which are mandated by the ACA.
I said this in January and I'll say it again: at some point, the courts are going to tell Trump that he can't do something he really wants to do (or has to do something he doesn't want to do, in this case), and he'll do (not do) it anyway.
And then, what happens?
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:57 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
I'm 100% sure that Trump's perfect world would be one in which he won the popular vote but lost the electoral college, and he got to spend the following four years bullshitting on Fox News about how much more popular he was than Hillary and how much better he'd be doing if not for the very corrupt, very unfair politics that kept him out, and then taking the afternoon to cheat at golf without anyone bothering him with obnoxious things like "governance."
posted by biogeo at 9:59 AM on July 20, 2017 [109 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 9:59 AM on July 20, 2017 [109 favorites]
at some point, the courts are going to tell Trump that he can't do something he really wants to do (or has to do something he doesn't want to do, in this case), and he'll do (not do) it anyway.
Fortunately he doesn't know how to do anything.
posted by rc3spencer at 9:59 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Fortunately he doesn't know how to do anything.
posted by rc3spencer at 9:59 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
> If Trump fries Mueller, could the Whistleblower Law protect him? Ditto Rosenstein, or even God Forbid Sessions?
I don't think he'll fry him. I mean, I'm sure he'll try to kill him if he can't fire him, but likely the methodology's going to involve polonium rather than fire or electricity.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:11 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
I don't think he'll fry him. I mean, I'm sure he'll try to kill him if he can't fire him, but likely the methodology's going to involve polonium rather than fire or electricity.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:11 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
For laffs...
One year ago today on Metafilter - RNC Part II: Return of the Nominee (probably)
1708 comments about Donald Trump as Republican nominee for president.
posted by Caxton1476 at 10:12 AM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
One year ago today on Metafilter - RNC Part II: Return of the Nominee (probably)
1708 comments about Donald Trump as Republican nominee for president.
posted by Caxton1476 at 10:12 AM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
For recalibration purposes, Wapo has a cute editorial imagining how a normal president with a basic grasp of ethics and governance would have replied to the Times's interview questions.
posted by theodolite at 10:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 10:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
On the translator issue: if CNN is to be believed, each country was only allowed to bring in one translator. That sounds plausible to me, as organizers likely would want to keep auxiliary staff to a minimum at a dinner of the principals. And if the Mango Mussolini was seated with the Japanese PM, then having a Japanese speaking translator would make sense (but it certainly indicates that his sauntering over to Putin was not a planned act (or not planned/shared with DJT's staff, at least).
Actually, as far as I can read diplomatic styleguides, Trump was supposed to be having a conversation with the Argentine first lady, who definitely speaks English and several other languages. From my not-healthy hour-long scrutiny of the images and videos of the dinner, it seems that Ms. Abe was left alone by the Indonesian president on her right. So one might imagine Trump tried to do the polite thing (nah, probably not). It's more likely that the Argentine first lady was a bit too much for him and he felt lost. In a way, some of this falls back on the German organizers. Who'd imagine an Indonesian president would be all cool about entertaining a Japanese first lady all night? And who'd imagine Trump would be able to deal with any smart politically alert women for several hours? It seems Lagarde could have handled it, because Trump is clearly fascinated by her, but Merkel probably didn't want to ruin Lagarde's evening.
Regarding Melania Trump's conversation with Putin, it's clear from the images that the "translator" is taking notes.
posted by mumimor at 10:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Actually, as far as I can read diplomatic styleguides, Trump was supposed to be having a conversation with the Argentine first lady, who definitely speaks English and several other languages. From my not-healthy hour-long scrutiny of the images and videos of the dinner, it seems that Ms. Abe was left alone by the Indonesian president on her right. So one might imagine Trump tried to do the polite thing (nah, probably not). It's more likely that the Argentine first lady was a bit too much for him and he felt lost. In a way, some of this falls back on the German organizers. Who'd imagine an Indonesian president would be all cool about entertaining a Japanese first lady all night? And who'd imagine Trump would be able to deal with any smart politically alert women for several hours? It seems Lagarde could have handled it, because Trump is clearly fascinated by her, but Merkel probably didn't want to ruin Lagarde's evening.
Regarding Melania Trump's conversation with Putin, it's clear from the images that the "translator" is taking notes.
posted by mumimor at 10:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Thread title shout-out to this 1981 hit: 88 Lines About 44 Women
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:16 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:16 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
I assume that if Mueller believes he can only be legally fired by the Deputy AG, he'll continue doing his work until a court issues a TRO or injunction ordering him to stop.
Mueller is wealthy, and could certainly afford to work for free, but investigations are expensive, and many of his junior staff probably needs the salary to pay the rent. I don't know how his investigation is being funded, but cutting off the funding stream seems the only way of stopping him if he didn't want to be stopped.
Oh god, being forced to GoFundMe these assholes out of power is so over-the-top that now I'm pretty sure it's exactly what we'll have to do.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 10:16 AM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
Mueller is wealthy, and could certainly afford to work for free, but investigations are expensive, and many of his junior staff probably needs the salary to pay the rent. I don't know how his investigation is being funded, but cutting off the funding stream seems the only way of stopping him if he didn't want to be stopped.
Oh god, being forced to GoFundMe these assholes out of power is so over-the-top that now I'm pretty sure it's exactly what we'll have to do.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 10:16 AM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
Thread title shout-out to this 1981 hit: 88 Lines About 44 Women
I was riffing on that a decade ago!
posted by cortex at 10:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
I was riffing on that a decade ago!
posted by cortex at 10:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
From my not-healthy hour-long scrutiny of the images and videos of the dinner, it seems that Ms. Abe was left alone by the Indonesian president on her right. So one might imagine Trump tried to do the polite thing (nah, probably not).
Looks like Japan's First Lady pretended not to speak English for two hours to avoid talking to Trump
posted by sunset in snow country at 10:20 AM on July 20, 2017 [41 favorites]
Looks like Japan's First Lady pretended not to speak English for two hours to avoid talking to Trump
posted by sunset in snow country at 10:20 AM on July 20, 2017 [41 favorites]
I just feel sad that Ms. Abe will no longer be able to use her brilliant dodge to get out of talking to Trump.
posted by emjaybee at 10:22 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by emjaybee at 10:22 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
I just feel sad that Ms. Abe will no longer be able to use her brilliant dodge to get out of talking to Trump.
For this trick to not work again in the future would require Trump to learn things, an ability which he has yet to demonstrate.
posted by Faint of Butt at 10:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [88 favorites]
For this trick to not work again in the future would require Trump to learn things, an ability which he has yet to demonstrate.
posted by Faint of Butt at 10:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [88 favorites]
I've been thinking about this in terms of a successful coup myself; a minority takes control in a country where income inequality makes the republic dangerously susceptible to a demagogue, while voter disenfranchisement/lack of civic engagement makes the system as a whole undemocratic.
Thinking of it as a coup helps me understand the people who want to drink liberal tears and are willing to overlook, say, pussy grabbing. Yeah, this is a Cold War, and Trump supporters are wiling to go with a flawed advocate for their interests because they have little empathy for their enemy and a great desire to obtain the power they've seen out of reach during their lifetimes.
It helps me understand how fuckers like Price like, fucking exist, let alone are heads of cabinets. It helps explain why Trump thinks that wandering over to Putin for a talk during a dinner of the G-20 is like, fine, because he is God Emperor Trump, holder of power, and his win proves to him in a narcissistic way that everything Obama signed off on needs to be destroyed as part of said coup.
And he's doing what he can to consolidate his power by appointing truly awful people to courts and exert his considerable control over matters related to immigration.
I mean, I guess this is totally naive and readers of this comment might be wondering how stoned angrycat is right now but it just strikes me how this is how winners of a coup behave. Not trying to work with the other side, of course not. But making the other side as miserable as possible.
ETA: people who THINK power has been outside of their reach because of Fox News or whateverthefuck
posted by angrycat at 10:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [25 favorites]
Thinking of it as a coup helps me understand the people who want to drink liberal tears and are willing to overlook, say, pussy grabbing. Yeah, this is a Cold War, and Trump supporters are wiling to go with a flawed advocate for their interests because they have little empathy for their enemy and a great desire to obtain the power they've seen out of reach during their lifetimes.
It helps me understand how fuckers like Price like, fucking exist, let alone are heads of cabinets. It helps explain why Trump thinks that wandering over to Putin for a talk during a dinner of the G-20 is like, fine, because he is God Emperor Trump, holder of power, and his win proves to him in a narcissistic way that everything Obama signed off on needs to be destroyed as part of said coup.
And he's doing what he can to consolidate his power by appointing truly awful people to courts and exert his considerable control over matters related to immigration.
I mean, I guess this is totally naive and readers of this comment might be wondering how stoned angrycat is right now but it just strikes me how this is how winners of a coup behave. Not trying to work with the other side, of course not. But making the other side as miserable as possible.
ETA: people who THINK power has been outside of their reach because of Fox News or whateverthefuck
posted by angrycat at 10:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [25 favorites]
After reading that interview, I don't see how anyone, regardless of their level of fluency, could not honestly argue that they may speak English, but they are unable to understand anything Donald Trump is saying.
posted by zachlipton at 10:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [24 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 10:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [24 favorites]
Trump supporters are wiling to go with a flawed advocate for their interests
so flawed that he fails to actually advocate for their interests
posted by murphy slaw at 10:30 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
so flawed that he fails to actually advocate for their interests
posted by murphy slaw at 10:30 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
So regarding his comments on paying $15 per month (or per year, whatever lol) for health insurance, there's terrible and plausible speculation that he's just parroting these Alex Trebek "rate lock" life insurance ads that run regularly on Fox News.
Trebek is a Canadian deep cover agent sowing uncertainty via mandatory uptalk on Jeopardy.
posted by srboisvert at 10:32 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Trebek is a Canadian deep cover agent sowing uncertainty via mandatory uptalk on Jeopardy.
posted by srboisvert at 10:32 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
deeply confused here: are the Dems attempting to tie Trump to white nationalists with the 88 thing? Are we riffing on neonazi signaling or an obscure tune from the 80s? Both? please halp
posted by Existential Dread at 10:34 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by Existential Dread at 10:34 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
He's already done a bang-up job of tying himself to white nationalists.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 10:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
I'm seriously unable to get my head around this - he has actually said he wouldn't have appointed Sessions if he knew Sessions wouldn't be able to control an investigation into him?
posted by MattWPBS at 10:38 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by MattWPBS at 10:38 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
88 Lines About 44 Women, for anybody wanting to know the 80s reference.
posted by joyceanmachine at 10:38 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by joyceanmachine at 10:38 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
It seems impossible to read that NYT transcript and not come to the conclusion that Trump is suffering from serious cognitive deficits. He sounds like a Markov chain primed with whatever was on Fox and Friends yesterday plus a light retelling of his most recent vacation.
I wish the NYT had lobbed some softballs at him so we could experience the whiff of pure ignorance that would result. Why not just ask Trump: How will your plan cover more people for less money? How much should states pay for Medicaid versus the federal government? How do you feel about interest rates right now?
posted by 0xFCAF at 10:40 AM on July 20, 2017 [39 favorites]
I wish the NYT had lobbed some softballs at him so we could experience the whiff of pure ignorance that would result. Why not just ask Trump: How will your plan cover more people for less money? How much should states pay for Medicaid versus the federal government? How do you feel about interest rates right now?
posted by 0xFCAF at 10:40 AM on July 20, 2017 [39 favorites]
And threatened the man investigating him...? I mean, how is that even vaguely acceptable, even in Trump's head?
posted by MattWPBS at 10:40 AM on July 20, 2017
posted by MattWPBS at 10:40 AM on July 20, 2017
Don't feel bad, Existential Dread: I thought the post title was some kind of Martin Luther reference.
posted by orrnyereg at 10:40 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by orrnyereg at 10:40 AM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
> I'm seriously unable to get my head around this - he has actually said he wouldn't have appointed Sessions if he knew Sessions wouldn't be able to control an investigation into him?
If I take into account everything President Trump has said about the AG, I genuinely believe that Trump believes that the AG is a presidential attorney whose primary job is to represent the needs and interest of the President.
posted by Tevin at 10:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [70 favorites]
If I take into account everything President Trump has said about the AG, I genuinely believe that Trump believes that the AG is a presidential attorney whose primary job is to represent the needs and interest of the President.
posted by Tevin at 10:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [70 favorites]
TRUMP: I mean, really. He’s a very good person. And a tough guy, but look, he has to be. I think he is going to be a terrific president of France. But he does love holding my hand.
Jesus Christ, the only thing missing is "NOT THAT THERE'S ANYTHING WRONG WITH THAT."
posted by FelliniBlank at 10:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
Jesus Christ, the only thing missing is "NOT THAT THERE'S ANYTHING WRONG WITH THAT."
posted by FelliniBlank at 10:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
carmicha: Lately Trump has been talking about himself like he's catnip to men
I think it's his alpha male dominance bullshit, and it also reminds me of this study about men who "girlwatch" (pp. 394-395): "'Patriarchy is as much about relations between man and man as it is about relations between men and women.' . . . heterosexual men . . . establish intimacy among themselves [with, eg, a repeated] dramatic performance played to other men . . . "
I see it as his way of creating (what his abyssal black hole of a consciousness perceives as) adulatory "intimacy," directed at himself, from the only people who, in his view, count -- other male business or government leaders.
posted by cybercoitus interruptus at 10:48 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
I think it's his alpha male dominance bullshit, and it also reminds me of this study about men who "girlwatch" (pp. 394-395): "'Patriarchy is as much about relations between man and man as it is about relations between men and women.' . . . heterosexual men . . . establish intimacy among themselves [with, eg, a repeated] dramatic performance played to other men . . . "
I see it as his way of creating (what his abyssal black hole of a consciousness perceives as) adulatory "intimacy," directed at himself, from the only people who, in his view, count -- other male business or government leaders.
posted by cybercoitus interruptus at 10:48 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
45 doesn't care if he scares the whole world with his bluster and ignorance: what's important is how he feels, and whether he's getting enough praise.
So, what's important is his inner three-year old.
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:48 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
So, what's important is his inner three-year old.
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:48 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
TRUMP: I mean, really. He’s a very good person. And a tough guy, but look, he has to be. I think he is going to be a terrific president of France. But he does love holding my hand.
He's learned that Macron clued into his handshake dominance thing & was ready for it so he's trying to turn it back around to "Macron's handshake counter-tactic proves that he's gay for me."
posted by scalefree at 10:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [45 favorites]
He's learned that Macron clued into his handshake dominance thing & was ready for it so he's trying to turn it back around to "Macron's handshake counter-tactic proves that he's gay for me."
posted by scalefree at 10:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [45 favorites]
From Jeff Stein of Vox: A member of Congress told me Democrats big 2018 slogan, which is set to be released Monday. It's: "Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages"
Well, that's ... terrible? It's terrible.
posted by penduluum at 11:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [38 favorites]
Well, that's ... terrible? It's terrible.
posted by penduluum at 11:00 AM on July 20, 2017 [38 favorites]
I'm going to refuse to believe Jeff Stein for as long as humanly possible. Better skills indeed, Jesus.
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:02 AM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:02 AM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
i am not a member of any organized political party. i am a democrat.
posted by entropicamericana at 11:04 AM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 11:04 AM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
After the NYT interview that again brought up the "adoption" thing, I wanted to share an episode of the Planet Money podcast. I don't doubt that the Magnitsky Act has been discussed in these threads before, but for some reason listening to all of the pieces with human voices in an unexpected place (planet money?!) has kinda haunted me. It was more information on the human rights abuses and the ecomomic weight, and now I wince a little bit every time I hear them discuss "adoption" in such a sanitized way.
posted by monkeystronghold at 11:05 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by monkeystronghold at 11:05 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
I thought the new Dem brand was "A Better Deal"
I must just be an unsophisticated Old because every time people start screaming about how terribad some PR the Dems do I'm like *shrug* that seems fine?
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:05 AM on July 20, 2017 [24 favorites]
I must just be an unsophisticated Old because every time people start screaming about how terribad some PR the Dems do I'm like *shrug* that seems fine?
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:05 AM on July 20, 2017 [24 favorites]
From Jeff Stein of Vox: A member of Congress told me Democrats big 2018 slogan, which is set to be released Monday. It's: "Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages"
Well, that's ... terrible? It's terrible.
If it makes you feel any better, I can't remember where I saw it (google news?) but I saw a story that said "A Better Deal: Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages". Which isn't so far off from what was being proposed right here a thread or two ago.
posted by ArgentCorvid at 11:08 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Well, that's ... terrible? It's terrible.
If it makes you feel any better, I can't remember where I saw it (google news?) but I saw a story that said "A Better Deal: Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages". Which isn't so far off from what was being proposed right here a thread or two ago.
posted by ArgentCorvid at 11:08 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
He's learned that Macron clued into his handshakedominance thing & was ready for it so he's trying to turn it back around to "Macron's handshake counter-tactic proves that he's gay for me."
That's 100% plausible. I think you might have solved the mystery of what the fuck he was on about there.
posted by Mocata at 11:09 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
That's 100% plausible. I think you might have solved the mystery of what the fuck he was on about there.
posted by Mocata at 11:09 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
"A Better Deal" would have been one zillion jillion times better than "Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages" and I'm hoping that the latter will be its secondary title or some shit like AgentCorvid says. People aren't going to crowd the streets shouting "Better skills!" in unison.
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:10 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:10 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
"Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages"
This wasn't supposed to be taken as political advice....
posted by thelonius at 11:11 AM on July 20, 2017
This wasn't supposed to be taken as political advice....
posted by thelonius at 11:11 AM on July 20, 2017
Why is the word better everywhere? Can't we make implied comparisons?
A Better Deal:
Vote Democrat for Skills, Jobs and Wages!
Then campaign on how Republicans / Donald Trump take those things away.
posted by Glibpaxman at 11:12 AM on July 20, 2017
A Better Deal:
Vote Democrat for Skills, Jobs and Wages!
Then campaign on how Republicans / Donald Trump take those things away.
posted by Glibpaxman at 11:12 AM on July 20, 2017
I'm 90% sure "Better Skills" was Napolean's campaign slogan for Pedro.
posted by BeginAgain at 11:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by BeginAgain at 11:13 AM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
vote democratic for nunchuk skills
posted by murphy slaw at 11:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 11:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
frankly I'd really go for ACCOUNTABILITY FOR EVERY ONE OF THE FUCKERS at this point
posted by angrycat at 11:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 11:14 AM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
Breaking: new MeFi brand is "Better Beans, Better Plates"
posted by Barack Spinoza at 11:15 AM on July 20, 2017 [50 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 11:15 AM on July 20, 2017 [50 favorites]
Fuck "skills," that's some Third-Way, Bootstraps Lite BS. We can't "skills' our way out of this mess. The solutions must be systemic, not individual.
I want healthcare. I want to be able to retire without starving to death. I want my kid to be able to get an education.
A Better Deal: Healthcare, Education and Jobs would be workable.
posted by emjaybee at 11:16 AM on July 20, 2017 [119 favorites]
I want healthcare. I want to be able to retire without starving to death. I want my kid to be able to get an education.
A Better Deal: Healthcare, Education and Jobs would be workable.
posted by emjaybee at 11:16 AM on July 20, 2017 [119 favorites]
angrycat, I absolutely think of this as a coup. We're being "governed" such as it is by a hostile minority group intent on destroying the democratic state. And I am definitely not high.
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
I think LOCK THEM UP is catchy.
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Oh cool so they want to loose another 20 seats then cool
posted by The Whelk at 11:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by The Whelk at 11:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
If your slogan or the title of your thesis has a colon in it, throw it straight in the garbage.
posted by goHermGO at 11:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
posted by goHermGO at 11:17 AM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
So, like, the focus here is on economic issues which is what everyone has been screaming about since apparently "stronger together" was not compelling enough to white people. Giving things to people who don't "deserve" it is what convinced a bunch of people who could really use some healthcare, education and jobs to vote R. Promising those things without the appropriate American overlay of "but we'll teach you to fish, not give you a fish" is what everyone has been freaking out about the Dems doing and thus losing the vaunted white working class.
So, which is it?
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:18 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
So, which is it?
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:18 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Not to be screaming about anything, but: I guess it's not too bad if you assume that anybody a slogan would actually reach isn't already a solid Dem voter. Solid Dem voters, we're gonna pull the lever for whoever. The slogan doesn't matter.
But underlying that: PR matters. There's a historical moment here where Dems can reconfirm themselves as the party of equality, of the future, of taking care of each other. This is a time where people will reward (and history will recognize) making aggressive, risky moves to move the ball forward. They can be inspiring, organized, and they can take advantage of the huge amount of collective work we're all out in the streets doing on their behalf. "Better Jobs" is so fucking small. "Better Jobs" sounds terrible with 33 million uninsured people. "Better Jobs" sounds terrible when the earth gets hotter every fucking summer. "Better Jobs" is, like, a summary of a single party plank, not a slogan. Not a brand.
This could be the brand. This could be the brand. This could be the brand. And they're choosing some deep-capitalist third-way bullshit that immediately reads as insincere bullshit.
Like for real: people aren't their fucking JOBS. This shit out here matters more than WAGES. Fucking open your eyes and look around ... and okay I guess now I'm screaming so I'll stop.
posted by penduluum at 11:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [102 favorites]
But underlying that: PR matters. There's a historical moment here where Dems can reconfirm themselves as the party of equality, of the future, of taking care of each other. This is a time where people will reward (and history will recognize) making aggressive, risky moves to move the ball forward. They can be inspiring, organized, and they can take advantage of the huge amount of collective work we're all out in the streets doing on their behalf. "Better Jobs" is so fucking small. "Better Jobs" sounds terrible with 33 million uninsured people. "Better Jobs" sounds terrible when the earth gets hotter every fucking summer. "Better Jobs" is, like, a summary of a single party plank, not a slogan. Not a brand.
This could be the brand. This could be the brand. This could be the brand. And they're choosing some deep-capitalist third-way bullshit that immediately reads as insincere bullshit.
Like for real: people aren't their fucking JOBS. This shit out here matters more than WAGES. Fucking open your eyes and look around ... and okay I guess now I'm screaming so I'll stop.
posted by penduluum at 11:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [102 favorites]
Also, also: anybody who has managed to stay alive in this cruel system who isn't wealthy? Has lots of skills already. We have reached the limits of what having skills can do for you. At some point you have to stop telling people to be economic and career ninjas and ask why the fuck the country we live in is a deathtrap that requires ninja skills to survive and punishes the smallest misstake or bad luck.
posted by emjaybee at 11:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [67 favorites]
posted by emjaybee at 11:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [67 favorites]
"skills" is a dogwhistle; it alludes to discredited ideas about what's driving unemployment. the implication is that unemployment happens because potential employees don't have the right skills and need to go back to school for them; in reality, structural unemployment is a tool used by the wealthy classes to keep wages down.
It's a bad slogan because people at the pointy end of this arrangement understand what's up, and reject the condescending patronization (not to say gaslighting) involved in blaming them as individuals for a structural phenomenon deliberately maintained by the folks who give big money to both major parties.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [120 favorites]
It's a bad slogan because people at the pointy end of this arrangement understand what's up, and reject the condescending patronization (not to say gaslighting) involved in blaming them as individuals for a structural phenomenon deliberately maintained by the folks who give big money to both major parties.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:19 AM on July 20, 2017 [120 favorites]
"Hmm healthcare as been at the forefront of massive political action and upheavals and every poll says it's extremely popular with members of all political affiliations so better to not mention it at all"
I swear if a single national democratic made even a basic motion to honor some of the new deal or great society promises they'd never leave office. Who the hell are these banker ghouls we have running?
posted by The Whelk at 11:21 AM on July 20, 2017 [52 favorites]
I swear if a single national democratic made even a basic motion to honor some of the new deal or great society promises they'd never leave office. Who the hell are these banker ghouls we have running?
posted by The Whelk at 11:21 AM on July 20, 2017 [52 favorites]
This was a bit upstream (these threads move FAST when I have to actually do things) but I can't believe that nobody mentioned this bit from the interview:
> And actually, when I do my filings, people say, “Man.”
I think this may actually be a truth that snuck in here.
posted by MysticMCJ at 11:21 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
> And actually, when I do my filings, people say, “Man.”
I think this may actually be a truth that snuck in here.
posted by MysticMCJ at 11:21 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
"democrats: we'll impeach the motherfucker twice, just to be sure"
posted by murphy slaw at 11:21 AM on July 20, 2017 [27 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 11:21 AM on July 20, 2017 [27 favorites]
"Better Deal" sounds broad and all-encompassing. "Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages" sounds like they're going to raise the minimum wage and send some people to learn how to be diesel mechanics. And those things are swell, even life-changing for some people, but I was hoping for more of a bigger vision, one that includes health care, the safety net, civil rights, voting rights, etc...
posted by zachlipton at 11:22 AM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 11:22 AM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
But the new slogan will convince the 37 remaining coal miners in this country, and that's what's important.
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:22 AM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:22 AM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
I don't ever want to hear the word "deal" in a political context ever again tbh
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:23 AM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:23 AM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
There are like 600 people in the United States who don't recognize that Dems need to redefine themselves in 21st century terms, and 598 of them are apparently employed by the Democratic party
posted by penduluum at 11:24 AM on July 20, 2017 [45 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 11:24 AM on July 20, 2017 [45 favorites]
I don't ever want to hear the word "deal" in a political context ever again tbh
This I can cosign.
Actually I am kind of over slogans and mottos just generally
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:25 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Maybe this is a trial balloon slogan? Can we all tweet @thedemocrats our slogan ideas to fix it?
I don't know how anything works.
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:26 AM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
I don't know how anything works.
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:26 AM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Democrats 2018: Let's Train You For A Slightly Better Job That Doesn't Actually Exist While Civilization Breathes Its Last, You Little Asshole
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [98 favorites]
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:27 AM on July 20, 2017 [98 favorites]
this bike shed needs to be fucking perfect or we will never win an election again
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:28 AM on July 20, 2017 [74 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:28 AM on July 20, 2017 [74 favorites]
Someone saw the reaction on Twitter to the slogan stickers and decided to Cunningham's Law this round.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 11:29 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by the man of twists and turns at 11:29 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
It's an extremely disappointing bike shed.
posted by penduluum at 11:29 AM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by penduluum at 11:29 AM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Anybody else happy that Dems are explicitly branding themselves as the party of higher wages? Just me? Okay then.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:30 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:30 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
It's from much further up the thread, but all of our discussions about taxes and other nations' decisions to devote them to things we deem impossible luxuries, like health care and mass transit, need to look seriously at how much we spend on defense. There's the tax side--the military is over half of our discretionary (non-entitlement) spending--but there's also the economic impact of it: the extent to which we rely on defense spending (direct, indirect and induced to use economic impact nomenclature) for jobs, wages, taxes, etc. We fetishize the military, assume we have to be the world's policeman and blather about the need to "keep us safe," but we don't have realistic or nuanced national conversations about what our defense spending actually costs us and what we could have instead.
posted by carmicha at 11:31 AM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by carmicha at 11:31 AM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
Slogans I would actually get behind:
Eat the Rich, Workers Unite!, Healthcare For All Now, Women Rise! Tax Weed Everywhere, Socialist Benefits for All, Not Just the Military, Democracia Real Ya! etc.
I know they won't happen, just putting them out there.
posted by rc3spencer at 11:32 AM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
Eat the Rich, Workers Unite!, Healthcare For All Now, Women Rise! Tax Weed Everywhere, Socialist Benefits for All, Not Just the Military, Democracia Real Ya! etc.
I know they won't happen, just putting them out there.
posted by rc3spencer at 11:32 AM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
"Hmm healthcare as been at the forefront of massive political action and upheavals and every poll says it's extremely popular with members of all political affiliations so better to not mention it at all"
I fully expect the Democrats to respond to criticism about the exclusion of healthcare from their mission statement by eventually making a big announcement about their new-and-improved slogan:
Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages, Better Wellness Training
posted by Atom Eyes at 11:34 AM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
I fully expect the Democrats to respond to criticism about the exclusion of healthcare from their mission statement by eventually making a big announcement about their new-and-improved slogan:
Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages, Better Wellness Training
posted by Atom Eyes at 11:34 AM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
I don't need a slogan to vote Democrat. The slogan is for the people who will be impacted by a slogan, and much as I can roll my eyes, I also know that they're persuaded by different things than I am, or they'd already be unwilling to even vaguely consider a Republican. I don't know that I have a ton of confidence in this, but I've heard a lot worse, too.
posted by Sequence at 11:35 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by Sequence at 11:35 AM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
how about this for a slogan?
democrats 2018: i bet neoliberalism sounds pretty fucking good to you now, doesn't it, you little shits?
posted by entropicamericana at 11:35 AM on July 20, 2017 [73 favorites]
democrats 2018: i bet neoliberalism sounds pretty fucking good to you now, doesn't it, you little shits?
posted by entropicamericana at 11:35 AM on July 20, 2017 [73 favorites]
Democrats 2018: Discarded Pizza Boxes Are An Inexpensive Source Of Cheese
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [54 favorites]
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:36 AM on July 20, 2017 [54 favorites]
So, the dems, by & large get authors, poets, musicians, comedians, directors, actors, dancers; artists. The repubs get marketers. Seems like a fine state of affairs. Maybe, we could, I dunno.. use some tiny portion of our budget & hire an actual marketing firm to workshop a damn slogan for real? I'm as much against sloganeering as anyone else, but these things matter to some people & we need their votes, too.
If we're going to play the game, let's play the game. I hate watching my party do the "oh, my nephew is good with [x], let's get him to do it" thing when we agree it's lame & lambast our opponents for it. Mote, beam, eye, etc.
posted by narwhal at 11:37 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
If we're going to play the game, let's play the game. I hate watching my party do the "oh, my nephew is good with [x], let's get him to do it" thing when we agree it's lame & lambast our opponents for it. Mote, beam, eye, etc.
posted by narwhal at 11:37 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Maybe they keep hiring Republican marketers.
posted by LarsC at 11:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by LarsC at 11:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
KUSHNER: Ni hao.
....
Honey? Can you say a few words in Chinese? Say, like, “I love you, Grandpa” —
KUSHNER: Wo ai ni, Grandpa.
Is anybody else getting the vibe this whole interaction is staged? Like, the most powerful man in the country is giving an interview, which given his obsession with wanting positive coverage you think he would make a BIG DEAL. Wouldn't he have someone outside his office to say to anyone (including his family) "I'm sorry, the president is busy right now and would prefer not to be interrupted" so he wouldn't risk anyone else coming in? And of course it was Ivanka and her 'beautiful' daughter speaking Chinese (how smart!), not lunch meat Bannon or can-he-even-speak Kushner. I want to use Trump's razor and believe that since this easy to plan thing made them look positive, this incident was staged.
This administration has me making a conspiracy out of everything, and granted it's small beans, but this is the sort of thing that shows he really thinks it's only about PR.
posted by andruwjones26 at 11:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [30 favorites]
....
Honey? Can you say a few words in Chinese? Say, like, “I love you, Grandpa” —
KUSHNER: Wo ai ni, Grandpa.
Is anybody else getting the vibe this whole interaction is staged? Like, the most powerful man in the country is giving an interview, which given his obsession with wanting positive coverage you think he would make a BIG DEAL. Wouldn't he have someone outside his office to say to anyone (including his family) "I'm sorry, the president is busy right now and would prefer not to be interrupted" so he wouldn't risk anyone else coming in? And of course it was Ivanka and her 'beautiful' daughter speaking Chinese (how smart!), not lunch meat Bannon or can-he-even-speak Kushner. I want to use Trump's razor and believe that since this easy to plan thing made them look positive, this incident was staged.
This administration has me making a conspiracy out of everything, and granted it's small beans, but this is the sort of thing that shows he really thinks it's only about PR.
posted by andruwjones26 at 11:41 AM on July 20, 2017 [30 favorites]
Is anybody else getting the vibe this whole interaction is staged?
I never thought otherwise. Also, Trump ordering his granddaughter to tell him that she loves him.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:43 AM on July 20, 2017 [70 favorites]
I never thought otherwise. Also, Trump ordering his granddaughter to tell him that she loves him.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:43 AM on July 20, 2017 [70 favorites]
Hmm. "With Liberty And Justice For All" strikes the right tone for me, and seems to cover the bases, but the sentiment is a little extreme these days, I grant you.
posted by darkstar at 11:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
posted by darkstar at 11:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
folks, all of us here are the kind of people whose favorite thing to do on the internet is hang out on a community weblog designed in the late nineties where image posting is disabled. if the Democrats come up with a slogan that we like, that is probably the worst slogan for them to use.
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [260 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [260 favorites]
Is anybody else getting the vibe this whole interaction is staged?
I'd think it was staged under just about any circumstances; happenstance humanizing slice-of-life moment in the President's day during an interview is pretty meat and potatoes stuff. The remarkable thing is Trump et al being such impressively shady fuckadoos that even this sort of bland fluff would get that kind of scrutiny.
posted by cortex at 11:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
I'd think it was staged under just about any circumstances; happenstance humanizing slice-of-life moment in the President's day during an interview is pretty meat and potatoes stuff. The remarkable thing is Trump et al being such impressively shady fuckadoos that even this sort of bland fluff would get that kind of scrutiny.
posted by cortex at 11:44 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
We were all boggling over the Trump interview here in the gamera household and my son said that his bit about health insurance sounded like the output of a neural net that's just trying to relate words to each other without any clue about their actual meaning.
posted by gamera at 11:45 AM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
posted by gamera at 11:45 AM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
Concsues all over social media is that The Slogan Is Bad
posted by The Whelk at 11:46 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by The Whelk at 11:46 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Always with the negative waves, prize bull octorok, always with the negative waves.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 11:46 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 11:46 AM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
metafilter: all of us here are the kind of people whose favorite thing to do on the internet is hang out on a community weblog designed in the late nineties
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:48 AM on July 20, 2017 [51 favorites]
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:48 AM on July 20, 2017 [51 favorites]
Vote For Us Or The Slogans Will Keep Coming
posted by uosuaq at 11:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [34 favorites]
posted by uosuaq at 11:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [34 favorites]
WITH IMAGE POSTING DISABLED
posted by Melismata at 11:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
posted by Melismata at 11:49 AM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
I agree, cortex: this is the kind of thing that the D's probably use all the time to humanize their candidates (Tipper/Al Gore's 10 second kiss comes to mind.) It just feels more evil in the Trump white house, cause EVERYTHING is about deception. In a normal administration, I would accept this as meat-and-potatoes, but because this WH is about trying to control and alter every narrative while in fact being powerless, this feels more sinister.
posted by andruwjones26 at 11:50 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by andruwjones26 at 11:50 AM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
No matter what the wonks come up with, this will be always the modern Democratic Party slogan:
Democrats: Unexciting Center-Right Policies with a Dash of Milquetoast Center-Left Posturing (but only when it doesn't have a chance of passing)
Rolls off the tongue, plus everyone already knows it by heart.
posted by FakeFreyja at 11:50 AM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Democrats: Unexciting Center-Right Policies with a Dash of Milquetoast Center-Left Posturing (but only when it doesn't have a chance of passing)
Rolls off the tongue, plus everyone already knows it by heart.
posted by FakeFreyja at 11:50 AM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Metafilter: If your slogan or the title of your thesis has a colon in it, throw it straight in the garbage.
posted by emelenjr at 11:51 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by emelenjr at 11:51 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Derail? Possibly. But I want to counterpoint the idea that if "we" like a slogan, it's terrible. I think it's possible that a slogan can be 1) effective with its target audience (slogan liking/influenced people) & 2) recognized as a decent slogan by people outside of that target audience (of whom, we be a slice). This list of slogans supports my thesis. I'm not a slogan guy, but I agree that many of these slogans "work." I'd like to see the DNC adopt a slogan that strives for this kind of appeal, rather than settling for mealy-mouthed mediocrity.
posted by narwhal at 11:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by narwhal at 11:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages = A Better Deal
Long form and short summary. It could work. Ever since a Better Deal was mentioned in the last thread it has stuck with me. It's a slogan that works on multiple levels.
One it is an overall summary of what Dems can stand for. 'Better'. It's simple and it's catchy.
Two it subverts and builds upon the opponents messaging. It's the same process that the Right does all of the time with it's messaging. The whole subversion and claiming of 'fake news' is the latest example of something that has worked really well for them.
Steal and subvert and change the power dynamic that these sorts of airy fairy ideas have.
It also works because it's taking a message and word that is already out there, that your opponent has put tons of time and energy to infiltrate the political culture and minds of people and builds on that work. There is no need to spend the time getting the 'new' words and phrase in. It co-opts and use that work to your advantage.
It also put the main messaging of your opponent into a more defensive position. 'You say you do good deals for America? Guess what our's is better.' Opponent then has to defend that position as being the 'better' which opens up a myriad of avenues to counter their messaging.
Better Deal is an emotionally based phrase. It means little until the details are talked about and that's okay. MAGA is a prime example of an emotionally based slogan that worked really well (unfortunately) because people got to decide what it meant for them. It ended up meaning horrible things of course but it's success was based on people own ideas of what it meant.
The whole of life is not about jobs, wages and skills. Seriously. Again MAGA worked like it did because it didn't focus on these specific areas. People may say in polls that these matter a lot and the do but there is more to political decisions then just those things.
I could say more but I'll stop now. Wages, skills, and jobs on it's own is stupid.
posted by Jalliah at 11:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Oh. My. God. It's 2017 and the president is selling the US to Russia while his bad hombre buddies loot the place, but let's everyone stop to watch OJ Simpson for a while.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by Room 641-A at 11:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
Metafilter: If your slogan or the title of your thesis has a colon in it, throw it straight in the garbage.
I threw my colon in the garbage once and wouldn't recommend it.
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
I threw my colon in the garbage once and wouldn't recommend it.
posted by Rust Moranis at 11:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
I would be perfectly happy to argue about how whoever they're running in 2020 is also extremely disappointing but ultimately will still get my support and vote (sorry mods, j/k, I'll wait), but they're not putting a press release out about that on Monday. This is just the shitty disappointing thing they're doing right now.
posted by penduluum at 11:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by penduluum at 11:53 AM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
workshopping the slogan may be bikeshedding; recognizing that the slogan reflects ideas that are both discredited and unpopular is not bikeshedding.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:54 AM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
Doktor Zed: CNN: President Trump's First Six Months: By the Numbers
...
* 5 campaign-style rallies, 1 news conference
Listen, CNN: those weren't "campaign-style rallies," those were re-election rallies. Why is this distinction important? This widely and deeply hated president kicked off the first month of his first term a re-election rally in Florida, with Air Force One as a backdrop, and by April, Mr. Trump’s campaign brought in $7.1 million during the first three months of 2017, on top of over $23 million raised with the Republican Party. CNBC reported on June 29 Trump rakes in $10 million at first re-election fundraiser, which is only different from prior re-election rallies in that he charged the limited audience of up to 300 guests $35,000 per head.
Why does it matter that he's trying to sheer his sheep this early? 1) He should be doing his damned job, not surrounding himself with rabid fans to raise his spirits and fill his coffers, 2) his "private" rallies allow him gather supporter contact information, control access the events and further boost his distorted message and tout his lies, and 3) the funding he raises now is being used as general purpose slush funds for things like paying Donald Jr's attorney fees.
posted by filthy light thief at 11:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [35 favorites]
...
* 5 campaign-style rallies, 1 news conference
Listen, CNN: those weren't "campaign-style rallies," those were re-election rallies. Why is this distinction important? This widely and deeply hated president kicked off the first month of his first term a re-election rally in Florida, with Air Force One as a backdrop, and by April, Mr. Trump’s campaign brought in $7.1 million during the first three months of 2017, on top of over $23 million raised with the Republican Party. CNBC reported on June 29 Trump rakes in $10 million at first re-election fundraiser, which is only different from prior re-election rallies in that he charged the limited audience of up to 300 guests $35,000 per head.
Why does it matter that he's trying to sheer his sheep this early? 1) He should be doing his damned job, not surrounding himself with rabid fans to raise his spirits and fill his coffers, 2) his "private" rallies allow him gather supporter contact information, control access the events and further boost his distorted message and tout his lies, and 3) the funding he raises now is being used as general purpose slush funds for things like paying Donald Jr's attorney fees.
posted by filthy light thief at 11:56 AM on July 20, 2017 [35 favorites]
I was surprised to see people referring to Blackwater, because I remembered them changing their name to Xe. I looked it up, and it seems they've changed it once again, to Academi.
I am, of course, very much in favor of continuing to refer to them as Blackwater, because shitty companies shouldn't be allowed to obscure their history by changing names. But I'm also in favor of mentioning the current name as well for the sake of clarity.
posted by shponglespore at 11:59 AM on July 20, 2017 [19 favorites]
I am, of course, very much in favor of continuing to refer to them as Blackwater, because shitty companies shouldn't be allowed to obscure their history by changing names. But I'm also in favor of mentioning the current name as well for the sake of clarity.
posted by shponglespore at 11:59 AM on July 20, 2017 [19 favorites]
The one plus from Trump's horrible mismangement of gov't that is likely to occur in the next 10-20 years is that the Trump name will become so anathema that the removal of the TRUMP logo from that already-ugly building in Chicago is inevitable, so one day it will no longer terrorize the citizens of Chicago as they ride the El from Wabash to Lake.
That's not enough. Once it all comes crashing down and the full extend of the metastasis is finally fully exposed, I want his name to become a common handle for things (and people) venal, corrupt, vile, and stupid. I want it to become so commonly recognized for that purpose that we cease to capitalize it, like quisling. More than that, I want it to become offensive; I want its use to be shunned in polite discourse. I want history classes to send home a note to parents warning that they're going to be teaching about the 45th president and some disturbing terms will be encountered, like my high school English classes did before we read Huckleberry Finn.I want bridge players to have to find a new term to avoid accidentally provoking discomfort among others. I want people who use the word to have to defend its use - "It's not a slur! It has a completely different etymology!" - and be unable to use it without at least the awareness that the very sound of that disgusting monosyllable makes their listeners squirm. I want referring to someone as "a t-word" to be as viscerally offensive and beyond the pale as it would be to call someone "a c-word."
Because I already get that gut-shock every time I hear that disgusting word - it feels like the radio announcer is referring to President Swearword - and I want my kids, and all students of history, to understand intuitively just how awful and dangerous he and the things that he stands for really are. His name is going to be burned into our history and, like slavery or the internment of Japanese-Americans, will be a source of enduring shame for generations. May future generations recoil instinctively from all that he represents, and let his mention at least serve as a warning, as a reminder that yes, it can happen here.
posted by nickmark at 11:59 AM on July 20, 2017 [88 favorites]
That's not enough. Once it all comes crashing down and the full extend of the metastasis is finally fully exposed, I want his name to become a common handle for things (and people) venal, corrupt, vile, and stupid. I want it to become so commonly recognized for that purpose that we cease to capitalize it, like quisling. More than that, I want it to become offensive; I want its use to be shunned in polite discourse. I want history classes to send home a note to parents warning that they're going to be teaching about the 45th president and some disturbing terms will be encountered, like my high school English classes did before we read Huckleberry Finn.I want bridge players to have to find a new term to avoid accidentally provoking discomfort among others. I want people who use the word to have to defend its use - "It's not a slur! It has a completely different etymology!" - and be unable to use it without at least the awareness that the very sound of that disgusting monosyllable makes their listeners squirm. I want referring to someone as "a t-word" to be as viscerally offensive and beyond the pale as it would be to call someone "a c-word."
Because I already get that gut-shock every time I hear that disgusting word - it feels like the radio announcer is referring to President Swearword - and I want my kids, and all students of history, to understand intuitively just how awful and dangerous he and the things that he stands for really are. His name is going to be burned into our history and, like slavery or the internment of Japanese-Americans, will be a source of enduring shame for generations. May future generations recoil instinctively from all that he represents, and let his mention at least serve as a warning, as a reminder that yes, it can happen here.
posted by nickmark at 11:59 AM on July 20, 2017 [88 favorites]
Democrats: Unexciting Center-Right Policies
Stahp! The Democrats are not center-right. I'm sooooo tired of this. Just no.
posted by Justinian at 12:01 PM on July 20, 2017 [30 favorites]
Stahp! The Democrats are not center-right. I'm sooooo tired of this. Just no.
posted by Justinian at 12:01 PM on July 20, 2017 [30 favorites]
We're going to need new vocabulary for card games.
posted by Faint of Butt at 12:01 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Faint of Butt at 12:01 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
I threw my colon in the garbage once and wouldn't recommend it.
I threw out my back once, but this sounds more serious.
posted by anothermug at 12:02 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
I threw out my back once, but this sounds more serious.
posted by anothermug at 12:02 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
Orientation on a bipolar scale kind of depends on where you yourself are sitting. Though my experience here is that people do tend to forget that people do in fact sit in different places (or even multiple places simultaneously).
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:03 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:03 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
DEMOCRATS 2018: TOGETHER WE CAN CLOSE THE BARN DOOR
posted by ian1977 at 12:05 PM on July 20, 2017 [57 favorites]
posted by ian1977 at 12:05 PM on July 20, 2017 [57 favorites]
Though my experience here is that people do tend to forget that people do in fact sit in different places (or even multiple places simultaneously).
posted by soren_lorensen
Well sure, if they're the kwisatz haderach.
posted by the phlegmatic king at 12:06 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen
Well sure, if they're the kwisatz haderach.
posted by the phlegmatic king at 12:06 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
We're all kwisatz haderachs down here
(kwisatzes haderch?)
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:08 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
(kwisatzes haderch?)
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:08 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Democrats 2018: a thing for cattle or making love or playing the baliset
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
Holy crap. So this slogan is apparently falling under an overarching slogan. - A Better Deal, according to Politico.
posted by Jalliah at 12:10 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Eric, we have Priebus-sign the likes of which God has never seen!
posted by Rust Moranis at 12:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by Rust Moranis at 12:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
Democrats: Don't get your hopes up
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages
Papa John's
posted by dirigibleman at 12:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [70 favorites]
Papa John's
posted by dirigibleman at 12:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [70 favorites]
I am, of course, very much in favor of continuing to refer to them as Blackwater, because shitty companies shouldn't be allowed to obscure their history by changing names.
Also Blackwater = possibility of Game of Thrones jokes.
Or Doobie Brothers.
posted by elsietheeel at 12:12 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Also Blackwater = possibility of Game of Thrones jokes.
Or Doobie Brothers.
posted by elsietheeel at 12:12 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
I was going for KEEP EARTH HABITABLE because that one's high on my priority list, but apparently half the country just doesn't give a fuck about it.
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:13 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:13 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
Democrats: We won't kill you!
I mean, you'd think that would be sufficient compared to the Republicans but obviously it isn't.
posted by Justinian at 12:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
I mean, you'd think that would be sufficient compared to the Republicans but obviously it isn't.
posted by Justinian at 12:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
Trying to find the link but I'm reading on twitter that the Better Skills...etc is the tagline. That the big slogan IS 'A Better Deal.'
posted by Jalliah at 12:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
DEMOCRATS 2018: IMPEACHAPALOOZA/CATHARSIS
posted by saysthis at 12:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by saysthis at 12:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Stahp! The Democrats are not center-right. I'm sooooo tired of this. Just no.
Sorry, maybe that slogan would go better with a new logo. Here's a quick and dirty sketchup.
posted by FakeFreyja at 12:15 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Sorry, maybe that slogan would go better with a new logo. Here's a quick and dirty sketchup.
posted by FakeFreyja at 12:15 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
People aren't going to crowd the streets shouting "Better skills!" in unison.
"Two, four, six, eight, Trump's crime was very great! Great meaning large or immense, we use it in the pejorative sense!"
posted by obscure simpsons reference at 12:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [116 favorites]
"Two, four, six, eight, Trump's crime was very great! Great meaning large or immense, we use it in the pejorative sense!"
posted by obscure simpsons reference at 12:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [116 favorites]
Let's play What If: Is Vladimir Putin’s big collapse coming soon? (Salon video with some text) Author Richard Lourie talks about how Putin's failure to wean Russia off oil will destroy the nation's economy.
A fooking brilliant reply to Russia hacking elections, as suggested by Lourie, is for everyone to push hard away from oil and gas, thus starving a large portion of the Russian economy. But Lourie phrases it like switching off of petrol is only a threat to Putin, but not a net benefit for the whole fooking planet. For an idea of how heavily Russia relies on oil and gas, petroleum products, natural gas and crude oil made up 68% of total exports in 2013. We don't have to suddenly switch off the pipelines, but decreasing demand for those products will stress Russia.
posted by filthy light thief at 12:17 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
A fooking brilliant reply to Russia hacking elections, as suggested by Lourie, is for everyone to push hard away from oil and gas, thus starving a large portion of the Russian economy. But Lourie phrases it like switching off of petrol is only a threat to Putin, but not a net benefit for the whole fooking planet. For an idea of how heavily Russia relies on oil and gas, petroleum products, natural gas and crude oil made up 68% of total exports in 2013. We don't have to suddenly switch off the pipelines, but decreasing demand for those products will stress Russia.
posted by filthy light thief at 12:17 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Leftism 2017: Stop Talking About How Bad The Other Guy Is And Focus On Class Issues. No, Not Like That. What About Healthcare? Why Aren't You Attacking Capitalism Directly?
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:18 PM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:18 PM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
No one's going to mention that they released some nonsense called MAGAnomics?
posted by Yowser at 12:18 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Yowser at 12:18 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Meanwhile, over in HUD where no one is watching: "Under Trump Party Planner, HUD Abruptly Ends Obama's Battle Against Segregation in Westchester", (Slate, 7/19):
For eight years, Rob Astorino has led Westchester County, New York in its refusal to comply with the terms of a federal consent degree to hasten the integration of New York City’s racially stratified wealthy northern suburbs.Also, further down in the article there's this bit that's just so... well it's a lot:
[...]
In April, a few weeks after HUD deemed the county’s latest effort “unacceptable," a federal appeals panel declared that Westchester—the swath of small towns and cities between the Hudson River and the Long Island Sound—was “engaging in total obstructionism” by failing to comply with the 2009 settlement. That agreement, signed by Astorino’s predecessor, was the result of a U.S. District Court ruling that Westchester had “utterly failed” to comply with the Fair Housing Act. The Anti-Discrimination Center sued Westchester in 2006 after the county accepted $52 million in HUD grants but falsely certified in the paperwork that it had conducted a proper fair housing analysis.
Then came Lynne Patton, Trump family party planner turned HUD administrator. In June, Patton took office as the head of HUD Region II, which includes New York and New Jersey.
In a 2015 editorial that his later statements on housing have convinced me he did not actually write, HUD Secretary Ben Carson called Obama HUD Secretary Julian Castro’s policies a “government-engineered attempt to legislate racial equality.”posted by mhum at 12:19 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Why Aren't You Attacking Capitalism Directly?
From verything I've seen from the left about the slogan, I don't think they could be satisfied with anything the Democratic party could come up with besides a rousing version of the Internationale.
posted by zabuni at 12:22 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
From verything I've seen from the left about the slogan, I don't think they could be satisfied with anything the Democratic party could come up with besides a rousing version of the Internationale.
posted by zabuni at 12:22 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Leftism 2017: Stop Talking About How Bad The Other Guy Is And Focus On Class Issues. No, Not Like That. What About Healthcare? Why Aren't You Attacking Capitalism Directly?
I mean... if you think people wanting Democrats to put healthcare at the forefront of what the party should stand for is tantamount to Bernie-broism, then I really don't know what to tell you.
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:23 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
I mean... if you think people wanting Democrats to put healthcare at the forefront of what the party should stand for is tantamount to Bernie-broism, then I really don't know what to tell you.
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:23 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
I consider it impossible-to-please-ism when it's coming from the same people who have been lambasting mainstream Dems for not talking about the wage gap (correctly, in my opinion!) for years.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:24 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:24 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
He's learned that Macron clued into his handshake dominance thing & was ready for it so he's trying to turn it back around to "Macron's handshake counter-tactic proves that he's gay for me."
Now I am trying to imagine a gay subculture in France were suave Frenchmen lust after style-less chubby American schlubs. [it probably exists].
posted by srboisvert at 12:24 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Now I am trying to imagine a gay subculture in France were suave Frenchmen lust after style-less chubby American schlubs. [it probably exists].
posted by srboisvert at 12:24 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Canada needs to let Trump ‘declare victory’ on NAFTA, ambassador to U.S. says:
Canada needs to allow U.S. President Donald Trump to “declare victory” on the North American Free Trade Agreement, Canadian Ambassador David MacNaughton said Thursday.
MacNaughton, taking questions alongside his Mexican counterpart at an event in Washington, said Canada is optimistic that the revised deal can be, as Vice-President Mike Pence said last week, a “win-win-win” for all three countries.
But asked if Canada can allow Trump to sell the revised deal to his base, MacNaughton said Canada must let the president tout the outcome as his own triumph.
“This was such a big part of the president’s campaign last year, and I think for any of us to think that we can sort of just ignore that would be crazy. We have to find ways where he can declare victory without it being seen in either Mexico or Canada as being a loss,” MacNaughton said.
So I guess North American trade discussions at this particular juncture consist of Trump in a high chair smearing mashed potatoes on himself while the adults at the dinner table sip their coffee and say "Pay no mind. Let him wear himself out."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 12:26 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Canada needs to allow U.S. President Donald Trump to “declare victory” on the North American Free Trade Agreement, Canadian Ambassador David MacNaughton said Thursday.
MacNaughton, taking questions alongside his Mexican counterpart at an event in Washington, said Canada is optimistic that the revised deal can be, as Vice-President Mike Pence said last week, a “win-win-win” for all three countries.
But asked if Canada can allow Trump to sell the revised deal to his base, MacNaughton said Canada must let the president tout the outcome as his own triumph.
“This was such a big part of the president’s campaign last year, and I think for any of us to think that we can sort of just ignore that would be crazy. We have to find ways where he can declare victory without it being seen in either Mexico or Canada as being a loss,” MacNaughton said.
So I guess North American trade discussions at this particular juncture consist of Trump in a high chair smearing mashed potatoes on himself while the adults at the dinner table sip their coffee and say "Pay no mind. Let him wear himself out."
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 12:26 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Democrats 2018: This Land is Our Land...Motherfuckers
posted by ian1977 at 12:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [30 favorites]
posted by ian1977 at 12:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [30 favorites]
Got a few links on the role of the rest of the Republican Party in The Russia Stuff.
James Kirchick for Politico: How the GOP Became the Party of Putin
Ryan Goodman for the academic blog Just Security: Did Trump Campaign Collude with Russia to Defeat Republican Opponents in GOP Primary?
James Kirchick for Politico: How the GOP Became the Party of Putin
It would be a mistake to attribute this shift solely to Trump and his odd solicitousness toward Moscow. Russia has been targeting the American right since at least 2013, the year Putin enacted a law targeting pro-gay rights organizing and delivered a state-of-the-nation address extolling Russia’s “traditional values” and assailing the West’s “genderless and infertile” liberalism. That same year, a Kremlin-connected think tank released a report entitled, “Putin: World Conservativism’s New Leader.” In 2015, Russia hosted a delegation from the National Rifle Association, one of America’s most influential conservative lobby groups, which included David Keene, then-president of the NRA and now editor of the Washington Times editorial page, which regularly features voices calling for a friendlier relationship with Moscow. (It should be noted here that Russia, a country run by its security services where the leader recently created a 400,000-strong praetorian guard, doesn’t exactly embrace the individual right to bear arms.) A recent investigation by Politico Magazine, meanwhile, revealed how Russian intelligence services have been using the internet and social networks to target another redoubt of American conservativism: the military community.(This is a good companion piece to the Dec. 2016 piece by Peter Beinart in the Atlantic: Why Trump’s Republican Party Is Embracing Russia)
Ryan Goodman for the academic blog Just Security: Did Trump Campaign Collude with Russia to Defeat Republican Opponents in GOP Primary?
During a March 30, 2017 Senate Intelligence Committee hearing, Watts testified about how the Russian operation took shape once the primary got underway:posted by OnceUponATime at 12:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
“Through the end of 2015 and start of 2016, the Russian influence system began pushing themes and messages seeking to influence the outcome of the U.S. presidential election. Russian’s overt media outlets and covert trolls sought to sideline opponents on both sides of the political spectrum with adversarial views towards the Kremlin. They were in full swing during both the Republican and Democratic primary season that may have helped sink the hopes of candidates more hostile to Russian interests long before the field narrowed.”
...
An important line in the U.S. intelligence report reads, “Russian intelligence services collected [information] against the US primary campaigns … they viewed as likely to shape future US policies.” In October 2016, NBC reported that Russian efforts to steal emails and other data got underway in 2015 and included “top Republicans and staffers for Republican candidates for president.”
America is a revolutionary country. It's baked into our national history and mythology. Why can't the Democrats come up with a slogan that makes voting sound like a revolutionary act?
posted by Faint of Butt at 12:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by Faint of Butt at 12:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
Guys, Zombie AHCA/BCRA/RAGFY is baaaaack!
TPM: Key Trumpcare Holdout Says He’s A Yes If Guaranteed A Vote On His Amendment
[KY Senator and noted ass Rand Paul] said he would relent and support a motion to proceed if GOP leaders guaranteed him a vote on an amendment that would swap in the 2015 Obamacare repeal bill.
(To be clear, that's the Repeal and GFY bill. And once it's Yes on a motion to proceed and they're actually debating repeal, I have to believe the moderates will cave as usual.)
posted by RedOrGreen at 12:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
TPM: Key Trumpcare Holdout Says He’s A Yes If Guaranteed A Vote On His Amendment
[KY Senator and noted ass Rand Paul] said he would relent and support a motion to proceed if GOP leaders guaranteed him a vote on an amendment that would swap in the 2015 Obamacare repeal bill.
(To be clear, that's the Repeal and GFY bill. And once it's Yes on a motion to proceed and they're actually debating repeal, I have to believe the moderates will cave as usual.)
posted by RedOrGreen at 12:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
my son said that his bit about health insurance sounded like the output of a neural net that's just trying to relate words to each other without any clue about their actual meaning.
The difference being that neural nets learn...
Now wondering if http://www.iflscience.com/technology/ai-trying-to-design-inspirational-posters-goes-horribly-and-hilariously-wrong/ may actually be an AI that's become sentient trying to learn how to talk Trump down to prevent the apocalypse.
posted by Buntix at 12:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
The difference being that neural nets learn...
Now wondering if http://www.iflscience.com/technology/ai-trying-to-design-inspirational-posters-goes-horribly-and-hilariously-wrong/ may actually be an AI that's become sentient trying to learn how to talk Trump down to prevent the apocalypse.
posted by Buntix at 12:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
I mean the problem with the slogan is that it is completely anodyne and forgettable and you can tell it's been workshopped to death between the various centers of power in the party leadership.
The value of the New Deal, as a slogan or a logo, is that if you were a New Dealer you could point to several legitimately transformational policies that were a result of a transformational philosophy to the massive problems that faced society in the early twentieth century.
Raise your hand if you think any Dem politicians will even remember "A Better Deal" a year from now.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
The value of the New Deal, as a slogan or a logo, is that if you were a New Dealer you could point to several legitimately transformational policies that were a result of a transformational philosophy to the massive problems that faced society in the early twentieth century.
Raise your hand if you think any Dem politicians will even remember "A Better Deal" a year from now.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
No one's going to mention that they released some nonsense called MAGAnomics?
All I could find was a paywalled WSJ editorial by Mick Mulvaney. It looks like it was reposted on some blog so I skimmed it.
I saw no details beyond boilerplate conservative rhetoric. I could've written it myself with a few minutes of googling and a strong clothespin for my nose.
I went to the OMB site and saw nothing
I went to whitehouse.gov and found the aforementioned editorial excerpted.
So I guess, they released a plan, for certain definitions of 'released' and 'plan'...?
Seriously I probably did more work in researching MAGAnomics for this comment than anyone above the level of 'intern' did in producing it.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
All I could find was a paywalled WSJ editorial by Mick Mulvaney. It looks like it was reposted on some blog so I skimmed it.
I saw no details beyond boilerplate conservative rhetoric. I could've written it myself with a few minutes of googling and a strong clothespin for my nose.
I went to the OMB site and saw nothing
I went to whitehouse.gov and found the aforementioned editorial excerpted.
So I guess, they released a plan, for certain definitions of 'released' and 'plan'...?
Seriously I probably did more work in researching MAGAnomics for this comment than anyone above the level of 'intern' did in producing it.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
I really really liked the slogan STRONGER TOGETHER but apparently people still voted for Jill fucking Stein in droves so what do I know?
If A BETTER DEAL gives those assholes cover to vote for a Democrat then hallelujah but I strongly suspect their issue with Democrats was less about mottos and more about their own, how to put this kindly, idiocy.
As far as I can tell, all the responsible people I know would vote D even if their slogan was STINKY FISH FOR CONGRESS or WE LIKE PINA COLADAS.
posted by lydhre at 12:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [47 favorites]
If A BETTER DEAL gives those assholes cover to vote for a Democrat then hallelujah but I strongly suspect their issue with Democrats was less about mottos and more about their own, how to put this kindly, idiocy.
As far as I can tell, all the responsible people I know would vote D even if their slogan was STINKY FISH FOR CONGRESS or WE LIKE PINA COLADAS.
posted by lydhre at 12:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [47 favorites]
The Democrats:
One coupon for 10¢ off chicken in every pot; One coupon for a free car wash in every garage
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
One coupon for 10¢ off chicken in every pot; One coupon for a free car wash in every garage
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
WE LIKE PINA COLADAS
Actually "We're Not Into Healthfood" might win a few votes.
posted by uncleozzy at 12:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
Actually "We're Not Into Healthfood" might win a few votes.
posted by uncleozzy at 12:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
I hope they find links between Stein and Russia. That would be hilarious and drive Glenn Greenwald insane.
posted by Justinian at 12:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [25 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 12:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [25 favorites]
I seriously don't feel like "be aware of the zeitgeist and strive to inspire" is an unrealistically high bar for a slogan to clear. In fact it kind of seems like it should be the first bullet point on the white board.
You can have a good slogan and still lose. Stronger Together is a pretty good one, actually. Change We Can Believe In was kind of eh. Yes We Can is fantastic. Nobody's saying it's the invincible silver bullet for victory, but it is important. "It's fine" shouldn't be the aim.
posted by penduluum at 12:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
You can have a good slogan and still lose. Stronger Together is a pretty good one, actually. Change We Can Believe In was kind of eh. Yes We Can is fantastic. Nobody's saying it's the invincible silver bullet for victory, but it is important. "It's fine" shouldn't be the aim.
posted by penduluum at 12:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
America is a revolutionary country. It's baked into our national history and mythology. Why can't the Democrats come up with a slogan that makes voting sound like a revolutionary act?
Paging Lin-Manuel Miranda...
posted by nakedmolerats at 12:36 PM on July 20, 2017 [31 favorites]
Paging Lin-Manuel Miranda...
posted by nakedmolerats at 12:36 PM on July 20, 2017 [31 favorites]
Is it too much to repeat the plea to call/fax/email/visit your senators to ask them to stop this healthcare insanity? It's exhausting and frustrating to keep fighting this damn thing, but please keep it up.
posted by mcduff at 12:36 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by mcduff at 12:36 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Inspirobot is bananas and came up with this gem that fits nicely into the bad slogans:
All you need to destroy democracy is a woman.
posted by jclarkin at 12:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
All you need to destroy democracy is a woman.
posted by jclarkin at 12:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Actually "We're Not Into Healthfood" might win a few votes.
Like this guy's: Liberals can win again if they stop being so annoying and fix their 'hamburger problem'
Like this guy's: Liberals can win again if they stop being so annoying and fix their 'hamburger problem'
This combination of facts has me thinking a lot about what I call "the hamburger problem." As I see it, Democrats' problem isn't that they're on the wrong side of policy issues. It's that they're too ready to bother too many ordinary people about too many of their personal choices, all the way down to the hamburgers they eat.posted by OnceUponATime at 12:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
They don't always want to prohibit those choices. But they have become smug and condescending toward anyone who does not match the personal lifestyle choices of liberal elites. Why would the voters on the receiving end of that smug condescension trust such a movement to operate the government in their best interest?
The nice thing about the hamburger problem is that Democrats can fix it without moving substantially on policy. They just have to become less annoying.
Stronger Together is a pretty good one, actually. Change We Can Believe In was kind of eh. Yes We Can is fantastic. Nobody's saying it's the invincible silver bullet for victory, but it is important. "It's fine" shouldn't be the aim
Point of order: those are all presidential campaign slogans. This is not.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:38 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Point of order: those are all presidential campaign slogans. This is not.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:38 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
DemSlogan single-payer suggestion, "FREE DRUGS".
DemSlogan earned benefits suggestion, "FREE MONEY".
DemSlogan impeach Trump suggestion, "FREE TRUMP".
DemSlogan net neutrality suggestion, "FREE PORN".
DemSlogan climate change suggestion, "FREE AIR CONDITIONING".
DemSlogan immigration reform suggestion, "FREE TRAVEL".
I'm not wrong.
posted by saysthis at 12:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
DemSlogan earned benefits suggestion, "FREE MONEY".
DemSlogan impeach Trump suggestion, "FREE TRUMP".
DemSlogan net neutrality suggestion, "FREE PORN".
DemSlogan climate change suggestion, "FREE AIR CONDITIONING".
DemSlogan immigration reform suggestion, "FREE TRAVEL".
I'm not wrong.
posted by saysthis at 12:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
Believe in Better
Would be a slight at the religious right which I could go for.
posted by AlexiaSky at 12:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
Would be a slight at the religious right which I could go for.
posted by AlexiaSky at 12:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
It's that they're too ready to bother too many ordinary people about too many of their personal choices, all the way down to the hamburgers they eat.
There goes my last even. There's just no way to bridge the divide between "I'm mad that liberals tell me not to eat meat" and "yeah but women and people of color are literally dying though."
posted by nakedmolerats at 12:46 PM on July 20, 2017 [36 favorites]
There goes my last even. There's just no way to bridge the divide between "I'm mad that liberals tell me not to eat meat" and "yeah but women and people of color are literally dying though."
posted by nakedmolerats at 12:46 PM on July 20, 2017 [36 favorites]
Democrats 2018: be aware of the zeitgeist and strive to inspire!
They don't always want to prohibit those choices. But they have become smug and condescending toward anyone who does not match the personal lifestyle choices of liberal elites. Why would the voters on the receiving end of that smug condescension trust such a movement to operate the government in their best interest?
Ah, one of those A Liberal Was Mean To Me So I'm Voting To Destroy The Earth For My Generation And All Those To Come voters. Plenty of those on the right and the left.
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:47 PM on July 20, 2017 [49 favorites]
They don't always want to prohibit those choices. But they have become smug and condescending toward anyone who does not match the personal lifestyle choices of liberal elites. Why would the voters on the receiving end of that smug condescension trust such a movement to operate the government in their best interest?
Ah, one of those A Liberal Was Mean To Me So I'm Voting To Destroy The Earth For My Generation And All Those To Come voters. Plenty of those on the right and the left.
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:47 PM on July 20, 2017 [49 favorites]
WE LIKE PINA COLADAS
"IF YOU HAVE HALF A BRAIN."
posted by octobersurprise at 12:47 PM on July 20, 2017 [30 favorites]
"IF YOU HAVE HALF A BRAIN."
posted by octobersurprise at 12:47 PM on July 20, 2017 [30 favorites]
let's make this work
posted by mumimor at 12:48 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by mumimor at 12:48 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
My slogan suggestion:
You were sick, but now you're well again, and there's work to do.
Kurt Vonnegut Jr., Timequake
posted by night_train at 12:48 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
You were sick, but now you're well again, and there's work to do.
Kurt Vonnegut Jr., Timequake
posted by night_train at 12:48 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
Oh god is that hamburger problem piece fucking obnoxious. It's yet another "the problem with the left is they want to outlaw fun" bit of intellectual wankery.
posted by NoxAeternum at 12:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by NoxAeternum at 12:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [19 favorites]
I've long thought we could have this net neutrality debate licked if someone just started a rumor that Comcast wants to charge $100/mb for porn.
posted by zachlipton at 12:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 12:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
There goes my last even. There's just no way to bridge the divide between "I'm mad that liberals tell me not to eat meat" and "yeah but women and people of color are literally dying though."
Welfare reform/minority poverty & nutrition programs = FREE MEAT
posted by saysthis at 12:50 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Welfare reform/minority poverty & nutrition programs = FREE MEAT
posted by saysthis at 12:50 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Also, the author of that piece is all about hamburger shaming.
posted by NoxAeternum at 12:51 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by NoxAeternum at 12:51 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
I think a common Democratic problem is overthinking how they present to the public. With that in mind, "Better Skills, Better Jobs, Better Wages" should be fine. It doesn't appeal to me, personally, but it does give me an easy "in" to briefly explain to an undecided why a vote for a Democrat is a vote for their economic self interest.
posted by Tevin at 12:51 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by Tevin at 12:51 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
"I'm mad that liberals tell me not to eat meat"
As a vegetarian who has never told anyone else to not eat meat, you don't know "smug and condescending" until you've been a vegetarian around a bunch of conservatives. They can dish this shit out like whoa but have zero ability to take it.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:51 PM on July 20, 2017 [113 favorites]
As a vegetarian who has never told anyone else to not eat meat, you don't know "smug and condescending" until you've been a vegetarian around a bunch of conservatives. They can dish this shit out like whoa but have zero ability to take it.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:51 PM on July 20, 2017 [113 favorites]
"Why won't Democrats promise to stop doing this thing that I made up five years ago so I could justify being mad at them?"
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:52 PM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:52 PM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
I can't even find the 2014 slogan on the web, so I guess it's not that important. Maybe they could just lift one from a Coen brothers movie, like "I'LL SHOW YOU THE LIFE OF THE MIND!" or "Dude, at least it's an ethos."
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 12:53 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 12:53 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Oh oh oh and slash military budgets to get all our money for free stuff which means military surplus gun auctions! Which means... FREE GUNS
posted by saysthis at 12:54 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by saysthis at 12:54 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Maybe they could just lift one from a Coen brothers movie
Democrats: When you fuck a stranger in the ass
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:55 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Democrats: When you fuck a stranger in the ass
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:55 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Like this guy's: Liberals can win again if they stop being so annoying and fix their 'hamburger problem'
Oh, please. "Smug and condescending" is a conservative trademark. It's just that they're losing the war of ideas, so don't really have an intellectual foundation for it.
But Barro is too busy implying that liberals mostly want to ban practices of which they disapprove -- they "don't always," he concedes -- and complaining to pay address his apparent annoyance that liberals are actually right about most of their issues, and have the data to prove it. He just doesn't like being told to eat his vegetables, or imagines that's the problem, even as he tacitly concedes they really are good for you.
Anyway, Republicans want to reinstate anti-sodomy laws and ban contraception, so I doubt "people don't like being told what to do" is really a thing that distinguishes the two sides.
posted by Gelatin at 12:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
Oh, please. "Smug and condescending" is a conservative trademark. It's just that they're losing the war of ideas, so don't really have an intellectual foundation for it.
But Barro is too busy implying that liberals mostly want to ban practices of which they disapprove -- they "don't always," he concedes -- and complaining to pay address his apparent annoyance that liberals are actually right about most of their issues, and have the data to prove it. He just doesn't like being told to eat his vegetables, or imagines that's the problem, even as he tacitly concedes they really are good for you.
Anyway, Republicans want to reinstate anti-sodomy laws and ban contraception, so I doubt "people don't like being told what to do" is really a thing that distinguishes the two sides.
posted by Gelatin at 12:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
Free guns, free meat, you won't die impoverished in the street.
posted by aspersioncast at 12:57 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by aspersioncast at 12:57 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
they would milquetoast it down to '2018: When you find a stranger in the Alps.'
posted by ian1977 at 12:58 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by ian1977 at 12:58 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
They don't always want to prohibit those choices. But they have become smug and condescending toward anyone who does not match the personal lifestyle choices of liberal elites. Why would the voters on the receiving end of that smug condescension trust such a movement to operate the government in their best interest?
I used to be completely perplexed by how much "smugness" and "elitism" come up as reasons people on the right give for their hatred of the left, but now think that this is at least in part a US-specific cultural issue that also relates to our anti-intellectualism. Simply put: there's a large proportion of americans who believe on a very deep level that the insult of being called wrong is worse than the harm done by being wrong, just as it's worse to be called a racist than to be a racist.
posted by Rust Moranis at 12:58 PM on July 20, 2017 [87 favorites]
I used to be completely perplexed by how much "smugness" and "elitism" come up as reasons people on the right give for their hatred of the left, but now think that this is at least in part a US-specific cultural issue that also relates to our anti-intellectualism. Simply put: there's a large proportion of americans who believe on a very deep level that the insult of being called wrong is worse than the harm done by being wrong, just as it's worse to be called a racist than to be a racist.
posted by Rust Moranis at 12:58 PM on July 20, 2017 [87 favorites]
You people have any idea how much mental energy I've wasted praying this thread would just ignore Barro's stupid hamburger problem article? Weren't you happier living in blissful ignorance?
posted by zachlipton at 12:59 PM on July 20, 2017 [46 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 12:59 PM on July 20, 2017 [46 favorites]
Anyway, Republicans want to reinstate anti-sodomy laws and ban contraception,
FREE ASS
I'm drunk and I'm done now.
posted by saysthis at 12:59 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
FREE ASS
I'm drunk and I'm done now.
posted by saysthis at 12:59 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
Josh Barro is to liberal punditry as Matt Walsh is to conservative punditry.
That's probably one of the meanest things I could say about anyone, tbh.
posted by Tevin at 1:02 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
That's probably one of the meanest things I could say about anyone, tbh.
posted by Tevin at 1:02 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Being able to say 'hello' and 'I love you' /= 'speaking' Chinese or any language.
Except for Morrisonian.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:02 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
ASS, CASH, AND GRASS
Everyone gets them for free!
posted by kirkaracha at 1:03 PM on July 20, 2017 [35 favorites]
Everyone gets them for free!
posted by kirkaracha at 1:03 PM on July 20, 2017 [35 favorites]
It's that they're too ready to bother too many ordinary people about too many of their personal choices, all the way down to the hamburgers they eat.
Okay, rant time. What the fuck is Josh Barro talking about?
What? The fuck? Is Josh Barro talking about?
His cited example of this phenomenon is this:
I hear all the time about vegans who are trying to shame people for eating meat, cyclists who are trying to ban cars, atheists who are shouting down churchgoers, liberals who want to make people feel bad for living outside the gay downtown. As far as I can tell these are all just fictional. Josh Barro just sort of believes these things do happen and links to articles that don't even describe the supposed behavior as evidence.
If I had $10 for every vegan who frowned at me eating a hamburger and -$1 for every time I heard about how much vegetarians like to shun meat eaters, I would be broke. This idea that liberals are always poo-pooing middle America behavior is just some bullshit meme that the right invented to shut down rational discourse. I normally think Barro smart enough to not fall for the obvious sham, so it's pretty disappointing to hear him take this hook, line, and sinker.
Once you start thinking liberals are being "smug" and "elitist" you can find evidence for it in the most milquetoast statements of fact. Oh, Obama said that individual choices matter, but what he meant was that you should whip yourself every time you eat anything but raw lentils. See, liberals are so smug! Boo!
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [66 favorites]
Okay, rant time. What the fuck is Josh Barro talking about?
What? The fuck? Is Josh Barro talking about?
His cited example of this phenomenon is this:
Liberals want you to know that you should eat less meat so as to contribute less to global warming.It's a link to an article where Obama said this:
When we think about issues like food security or climate change, ultimately politicians can help guide policy, but the energy to bring about change is going to come from what people do every day. It's going to come from parents who are concerned about the impact climate change may have on their child, from business people who say how we can use less energy or waste less resources in making our products. It's millions of decisions made individually that have the ability to make changes.Literally, all Obama is saying is, choices have consequences. Choices have consequences. Isn't the idea of taking responsibility for the results of your actions supposedly the bedrock of conservative philosophy? We're just supposed to not mention that meat has terrible environmental consequences because that mere statement of fact will make people feel bad? I guess conservatives need a safe space where they don't hear about the consequences of their choices.
[...] Because food is so close to us and is part of our family and is part of what we do every single day, people, I think, are more resistant to the idea of government or bureaucrats telling them what to eat, how to eat and what to grow.
I hear all the time about vegans who are trying to shame people for eating meat, cyclists who are trying to ban cars, atheists who are shouting down churchgoers, liberals who want to make people feel bad for living outside the gay downtown. As far as I can tell these are all just fictional. Josh Barro just sort of believes these things do happen and links to articles that don't even describe the supposed behavior as evidence.
If I had $10 for every vegan who frowned at me eating a hamburger and -$1 for every time I heard about how much vegetarians like to shun meat eaters, I would be broke. This idea that liberals are always poo-pooing middle America behavior is just some bullshit meme that the right invented to shut down rational discourse. I normally think Barro smart enough to not fall for the obvious sham, so it's pretty disappointing to hear him take this hook, line, and sinker.
Once you start thinking liberals are being "smug" and "elitist" you can find evidence for it in the most milquetoast statements of fact. Oh, Obama said that individual choices matter, but what he meant was that you should whip yourself every time you eat anything but raw lentils. See, liberals are so smug! Boo!
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [66 favorites]
There goes my last even.
You must construct additional evens
posted by Jon Mitchell at 1:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [33 favorites]
You must construct additional evens
posted by Jon Mitchell at 1:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [33 favorites]
Buntix: Now wondering if AI Trying To Design Inspirational Posters Goes Horribly And Hilariously Wrong may actually be an AI that's become sentient trying to learn how to talk Trump down to prevent the apocalypse.
If nothing else, it produced this very topical pairing of text and image.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
If nothing else, it produced this very topical pairing of text and image.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
ASS, CASH, AND GRASS
Everyone gets them for free!
posted by kirkaracha at 5:03 AM on July 21 [1 favorite −] Favorite added! [!]
YOU HAVE MY VOTE.
posted by saysthis at 1:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
Everyone gets them for free!
posted by kirkaracha at 5:03 AM on July 21 [1 favorite −] Favorite added! [!]
YOU HAVE MY VOTE.
posted by saysthis at 1:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
I still don't see how the BCRA passes but it sure sounds like they're going to get it to the floor.
posted by Justinian at 1:05 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Justinian at 1:05 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Literally, all Obama is saying is, choices have consequences.
Which is another thing that it's apparently A-OK for conservatives to say when they justify taking away health care from someone who maybe ate a donut once.
posted by Gelatin at 1:06 PM on July 20, 2017 [27 favorites]
Which is another thing that it's apparently A-OK for conservatives to say when they justify taking away health care from someone who maybe ate a donut once.
posted by Gelatin at 1:06 PM on July 20, 2017 [27 favorites]
Democrats '18: More Evens
posted by notyou at 1:06 PM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by notyou at 1:06 PM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
ASS, CASH, AND GRASS
Everyone gets them for free!
posted by kirkaracha
Listen, pal, in this country we respect the Law of Conservation of Ass, Cash, and Grass
posted by the phlegmatic king at 1:07 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Everyone gets them for free!
posted by kirkaracha
Listen, pal, in this country we respect the Law of Conservation of Ass, Cash, and Grass
posted by the phlegmatic king at 1:07 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
I like AlexiaSky's "Believe in Better." A lot. Both powerful words. Hopeful, idealistic, and kind of abstract, but also universally intimate and relevant—everybody knows what "believe" and "better" feel like, even if they're not always concrete. Cherry on top: it wrests Trump's stupid "Believe me!" away from him, and says no, believe in *better* than him.
As others have mentioned, motivated Ds are going to pull the lever for Ds no matter what the slogan, and motivated anti-Ds are gonna do the same for non-D candidates. Out of the people left over, the number of people who "believe in believing," or who want "better" after the current shitstorm, seems like an awful lot. And the slogan itself is an invitation: to believe, obvs, but to hitch that belief to another action (voting D).
I'm far from the target audience, and slogans are ultimately just slogans in a lot of ways, but yeah, I like this one. Maybe I just want to feel happy about something in American politics, and I'll take what I can get.
posted by Rykey at 1:08 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
As others have mentioned, motivated Ds are going to pull the lever for Ds no matter what the slogan, and motivated anti-Ds are gonna do the same for non-D candidates. Out of the people left over, the number of people who "believe in believing," or who want "better" after the current shitstorm, seems like an awful lot. And the slogan itself is an invitation: to believe, obvs, but to hitch that belief to another action (voting D).
I'm far from the target audience, and slogans are ultimately just slogans in a lot of ways, but yeah, I like this one. Maybe I just want to feel happy about something in American politics, and I'll take what I can get.
posted by Rykey at 1:08 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
A Better Deal
Better Healthcare, Better Jobs, Better Wages
I mean, I just don't understand how Democrats can't market the fact that Republicans wanted to fuck over the entire nation and we stopped (and continue to stop) them. We should be marketing the shit out of that. Fuck better skills. That's just lame.
posted by Bella Donna at 1:08 PM on July 20, 2017 [33 favorites]
Better Healthcare, Better Jobs, Better Wages
I mean, I just don't understand how Democrats can't market the fact that Republicans wanted to fuck over the entire nation and we stopped (and continue to stop) them. We should be marketing the shit out of that. Fuck better skills. That's just lame.
posted by Bella Donna at 1:08 PM on July 20, 2017 [33 favorites]
As much as I'm enjoying this barrage of brilliant sloganeering, maybe we should cool it down for the sake of the mods and 3K+ comment threads being a real monster to load and navigate?
posted by Tevin at 1:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by Tevin at 1:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
This idea that liberals are always poo-pooing middle America behavior is just some bullshit meme that the right invented to shut down rational discourse. I normally think Barro smart enough to not fall for the obvious sham, so it's pretty disappointing to hear him take this hook, line, and sinker.
I wouldn't want the national media to completely shun conservative websites, as it's sometimes useful to get an idea of what slogans they're passing around, but one really ought to check oneself when one thinks "say, these people have a point!"
(Though still, if I ran a newsroom, catching someone reading the Drudge Report would still be a firing offense.)
posted by Gelatin at 1:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
I wouldn't want the national media to completely shun conservative websites, as it's sometimes useful to get an idea of what slogans they're passing around, but one really ought to check oneself when one thinks "say, these people have a point!"
(Though still, if I ran a newsroom, catching someone reading the Drudge Report would still be a firing offense.)
posted by Gelatin at 1:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Justinian: I still don't see how the BCRA passes but it sure sounds like they're going to get it to the floor.
To lower the McDuff panic level, can you spell out how it doesn't pass, please?
posted by mcduff at 1:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
To lower the McDuff panic level, can you spell out how it doesn't pass, please?
posted by mcduff at 1:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Literally, all Obama is saying is, choices have consequences.
Those people's choices have consequences. My choices have all either been perfectly rational, or totally understandable mistakes that I should immediately be forgiven for and get help rectifying.
(AKA IOKIYAR)
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:10 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Those people's choices have consequences. My choices have all either been perfectly rational, or totally understandable mistakes that I should immediately be forgiven for and get help rectifying.
(AKA IOKIYAR)
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:10 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
I still don't see how the BCRA passes but it sure sounds like they're going to get it to the floor.
Maybe they're planning to talk less, smile more?
(I don't think the MTP will succeed, but if it does, I am sure the moderates -- save for two golden tickets -- will find an excuse to cave. Keep those calls and letters coming, folks!)
posted by Gelatin at 1:10 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Maybe they're planning to talk less, smile more?
(I don't think the MTP will succeed, but if it does, I am sure the moderates -- save for two golden tickets -- will find an excuse to cave. Keep those calls and letters coming, folks!)
posted by Gelatin at 1:10 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Susan Collins is a hard no. And Rand Paul's backpedaling was only about the Motion to Proceed, not the actual bill. So he is still currently a no. That's enough to kill the bill without McCain or replacement there.
posted by Justinian at 1:10 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Justinian at 1:10 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
I still don't see how the BCRA passes but it sure sounds like they're going to get it to the floor.
They're going to get something to the floor and then arm twist and amendment that into some kind of OmniShamble Care they can send to the House for a quick wind up. (They want to bypass conference because they are in a hurry to murder progressivity in the tax code, too.)
posted by notyou at 1:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
They're going to get something to the floor and then arm twist and amendment that into some kind of OmniShamble Care they can send to the House for a quick wind up. (They want to bypass conference because they are in a hurry to murder progressivity in the tax code, too.)
posted by notyou at 1:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Democrats 2018: Wolverines!
posted by misterpatrick at 1:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by misterpatrick at 1:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
$45 billion for opioid treatment is no substitute for taking away $800 billion from Medicaid
When the crack epidemic affected urban African Americans, Republicans were all "Lock 'em up!"
When the opioid epidemic affects rural whites, Republicans stumble all over themselves in a scramble to throw billions of dollars at them.
The rural white affinity for Republicans? It ain't economic anxiety.
posted by JackFlash at 1:12 PM on July 20, 2017 [48 favorites]
When the crack epidemic affected urban African Americans, Republicans were all "Lock 'em up!"
When the opioid epidemic affects rural whites, Republicans stumble all over themselves in a scramble to throw billions of dollars at them.
The rural white affinity for Republicans? It ain't economic anxiety.
posted by JackFlash at 1:12 PM on July 20, 2017 [48 favorites]
"Liberty and Justice for All" works just fine in my opinion. Then the Republicans can use a picture of Trump captioned "UNDER GOD".
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
IOKIYAR
It's 2017 and I swear sometime this year or next year a Republican will run an actual campaign with this slogan. To the letter. I guarantee it.
Now I'm really real super done.
posted by saysthis at 1:15 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
It's 2017 and I swear sometime this year or next year a Republican will run an actual campaign with this slogan. To the letter. I guarantee it.
Now I'm really real super done.
posted by saysthis at 1:15 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Believe in Better
Great suggestion alexiasky. One, it gets the same alliterative punch that Make aMerica Great aGain does with the stress syllables. But more importantly, "believe in better" shifts the focus away from bothsidesism arguments over whether or not democrats are better than republicans and to an aspirational dream that we can have a better democracy. Which is exactly why "yes, we can" worked.
posted by Glibpaxman at 1:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
Great suggestion alexiasky. One, it gets the same alliterative punch that Make aMerica Great aGain does with the stress syllables. But more importantly, "believe in better" shifts the focus away from bothsidesism arguments over whether or not democrats are better than republicans and to an aspirational dream that we can have a better democracy. Which is exactly why "yes, we can" worked.
posted by Glibpaxman at 1:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
I hear all the time about vegans who are trying to shame people for eating meat, cyclists who are trying to ban cars, atheists who are shouting down churchgoers, liberals who want to make people feel bad for living outside the gay downtown. As far as I can tell these are all just fictional.
Ehhh, they're there. Americans could cut X amount of greenhouse gas emissions if they would only bike/walk to work, despite most of the country being designed in a way that makes it impossible. Californians could solve the drought if only they (not me) would stop showering and flushing the toilet so often, despite 80% of water going toward multibillion-dollar agriculture operations growing food outside its habitat. Plebs would have better jobs if only they would move to cities, despite it being a damn-near impossible undertaking for anyone without significant savings and no need for a support system. And yes, you should eat less meat despite living in a food desert where fast food and shelf-stable bodega groceries are your only option without a trip.
I wouldn't say "elitist" but rather "out of touch". To me it is understandable that such messaging sticks in a person's craw.
posted by FakeFreyja at 1:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
Ehhh, they're there. Americans could cut X amount of greenhouse gas emissions if they would only bike/walk to work, despite most of the country being designed in a way that makes it impossible. Californians could solve the drought if only they (not me) would stop showering and flushing the toilet so often, despite 80% of water going toward multibillion-dollar agriculture operations growing food outside its habitat. Plebs would have better jobs if only they would move to cities, despite it being a damn-near impossible undertaking for anyone without significant savings and no need for a support system. And yes, you should eat less meat despite living in a food desert where fast food and shelf-stable bodega groceries are your only option without a trip.
I wouldn't say "elitist" but rather "out of touch". To me it is understandable that such messaging sticks in a person's craw.
posted by FakeFreyja at 1:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
Obnoxious, sanctimonious people exist in the world. That's not new news, and liberals are just as likely to point out the inherent stupidity of lecturing people in a food desert about eating more vegetables. But they are not in any way confined to a single political party, and there's really not that many of them.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:20 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:20 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
More to the point, the issue is more this:
People resent being told they are stupid, and that their long-held values are silly and wrong.
There are a huge number of people in this country, in all parts but certainly more heavily concentrated in the middle, that believe in “traditional American values.” This is set of views that has gone largely unchallenged for most of their lives, and upon which they honestly believe this country is based. The key tenet is being “normal”:
-Christianity is normal, and so is quiet agnosticism. All the different kinds of Muslims (Muslim Muslims, Hindu Muslims, Sikh Muslims) are not normal and are maybe violent. Jews are not normal, but are smart and non-threatening, although you need to watch them. They have never actually met a Muslim or a Jew.
-They don’t believe they are racist at all. They judge people by how they act, not how they look. If all blacks dressed and acted like the ones in the Olive Garden commercials, they would be totally fine with them. But the saggy pants and all the jewelry and bright colors and filthy rap music and whatnot – that isn’t normal. If they want to be accepted, why don’t they just act normal? They don’t know any black people, beyond maybe someone they say “hi” to at work.
-They know some people are gay, but it isn’t normal. It’s fine if they want to do that, but they shouldn’t flaunt it in public and make everyone uncomfortable. And they shouldn’t be putting it on tv or movies like it is normal and just as good as regular relationships, because it isn’t. They know some gays, but they aren’t invited to the bbq this weekend because there are going to be kids there.
-They think the whole trans “debate” is the silliest thing they have ever heard. What, boys are girls now, or vice versa, or whatever they want? And that’s supposed to be normal? And my daughter is going to see some weirdo’s dick waggling out in the bathroom because he feels like he is a girl? Not normal. Not fucking ok.
Especially over the past decade or so, these people have increasingly been told that their deeply-held views are not only wrong, but make them bad people. And, being humans, their reaction isn’t to rethink their lifelong worldview and change their attitude, but rather to dig in and say “fuck you.” They know they are “supposed to say” that they are ok with gay marriage, and black lives matter, and all that, because if they don’t they are going to be called stupid, redneck racists by people on TV and in print media. So they have changed what they’ll say out loud, or at least to whom they will say it, but haven’t changed their beliefs. And Hillary and the democrats are exactly the kind of people that would judge them harshly for their views, and Donald Trump and the republicans are the kind of people who don’t. So they are voting republican, no matter how big of a clown Trump is, because at least those people don’t piss all over my fundamental sense of self.
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:23 PM on July 20, 2017 [106 favorites]
People resent being told they are stupid, and that their long-held values are silly and wrong.
There are a huge number of people in this country, in all parts but certainly more heavily concentrated in the middle, that believe in “traditional American values.” This is set of views that has gone largely unchallenged for most of their lives, and upon which they honestly believe this country is based. The key tenet is being “normal”:
-Christianity is normal, and so is quiet agnosticism. All the different kinds of Muslims (Muslim Muslims, Hindu Muslims, Sikh Muslims) are not normal and are maybe violent. Jews are not normal, but are smart and non-threatening, although you need to watch them. They have never actually met a Muslim or a Jew.
-They don’t believe they are racist at all. They judge people by how they act, not how they look. If all blacks dressed and acted like the ones in the Olive Garden commercials, they would be totally fine with them. But the saggy pants and all the jewelry and bright colors and filthy rap music and whatnot – that isn’t normal. If they want to be accepted, why don’t they just act normal? They don’t know any black people, beyond maybe someone they say “hi” to at work.
-They know some people are gay, but it isn’t normal. It’s fine if they want to do that, but they shouldn’t flaunt it in public and make everyone uncomfortable. And they shouldn’t be putting it on tv or movies like it is normal and just as good as regular relationships, because it isn’t. They know some gays, but they aren’t invited to the bbq this weekend because there are going to be kids there.
-They think the whole trans “debate” is the silliest thing they have ever heard. What, boys are girls now, or vice versa, or whatever they want? And that’s supposed to be normal? And my daughter is going to see some weirdo’s dick waggling out in the bathroom because he feels like he is a girl? Not normal. Not fucking ok.
Especially over the past decade or so, these people have increasingly been told that their deeply-held views are not only wrong, but make them bad people. And, being humans, their reaction isn’t to rethink their lifelong worldview and change their attitude, but rather to dig in and say “fuck you.” They know they are “supposed to say” that they are ok with gay marriage, and black lives matter, and all that, because if they don’t they are going to be called stupid, redneck racists by people on TV and in print media. So they have changed what they’ll say out loud, or at least to whom they will say it, but haven’t changed their beliefs. And Hillary and the democrats are exactly the kind of people that would judge them harshly for their views, and Donald Trump and the republicans are the kind of people who don’t. So they are voting republican, no matter how big of a clown Trump is, because at least those people don’t piss all over my fundamental sense of self.
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:23 PM on July 20, 2017 [106 favorites]
To lower the McDuff panic level, can you spell out how it doesn't pass, please?
BCRA is gone, we now have the Obamacare Repeal and Reconciliation Act, which is in fact a partial repeal due to the Byrd Rule. I know there's a rule that the Republican "moderates" always cave, but it's now impossible for them to vote for a bill that repeals Obamacare without replacement and throws millions of people off the health insurance rolls, after condemning the concept dozens of times, without doing irreparable damage to their careers. The idea that a replacement will be found in an orderly fashion after repeal doesn't work as a carrot because the Act itself would swiftly lead the individual markets into a death spiral, and the Republicans would be blamed. Enacting this bill after rejecting the previous one would be the greatest self-inflicted wound in modern politics.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:24 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
BCRA is gone, we now have the Obamacare Repeal and Reconciliation Act, which is in fact a partial repeal due to the Byrd Rule. I know there's a rule that the Republican "moderates" always cave, but it's now impossible for them to vote for a bill that repeals Obamacare without replacement and throws millions of people off the health insurance rolls, after condemning the concept dozens of times, without doing irreparable damage to their careers. The idea that a replacement will be found in an orderly fashion after repeal doesn't work as a carrot because the Act itself would swiftly lead the individual markets into a death spiral, and the Republicans would be blamed. Enacting this bill after rejecting the previous one would be the greatest self-inflicted wound in modern politics.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:24 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
DemSlogan net neutrality suggestion, "FREE PORN".
If Democrats ran on "Faster Porn Downloads! Privacy Protected!" the majority of Republican men would mock and shame them like crazy and then vote Democrat down the line as soon as they were in the privacy of the voting booth. Then they'd act completely shocked that Democrats won and just be all aghast about it in church the following Sunday and shame everyone else for it while claiming they're "not into that shit."
Please let's not talk about what else they might do in that voting booth.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:25 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
If Democrats ran on "Faster Porn Downloads! Privacy Protected!" the majority of Republican men would mock and shame them like crazy and then vote Democrat down the line as soon as they were in the privacy of the voting booth. Then they'd act completely shocked that Democrats won and just be all aghast about it in church the following Sunday and shame everyone else for it while claiming they're "not into that shit."
Please let's not talk about what else they might do in that voting booth.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:25 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
Enacting this bill after rejecting the previous one would be the greatest self-inflicted wound in modern politics
Here, hold their beer.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 1:26 PM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
Here, hold their beer.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 1:26 PM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
I know we joke but I do think slogans are important, even if everyone with any sense would vote Dem. Not everyone is refreshing a politics megathread at work - some people aren't paying that much attention. Latching onto something they feel good about, as part of a larger campaign that centers their issues, is important when it comes to GOTV efforts.
Plus they're a way for us to relate to each other and reflect our shared values.
How many of us have said #sheresisted, for example? Stronger together and Yes we can meant a lot to me.
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Plus they're a way for us to relate to each other and reflect our shared values.
How many of us have said #sheresisted, for example? Stronger together and Yes we can meant a lot to me.
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
people could save money on straw if they stopped constructing strawmen, etc
posted by entropicamericana at 1:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 1:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
To me the sanctimonious vegetarian / cyclist / liberal is simply at the level of self-reinforcing shared delusion.
It's like if it were just common knowledge that squirrels like to run off with your gas cap while you're fueling your car. I mean, I'm sure it's happened at least once, and I can easily imagine what that would look like, and I've seen squirrels steal other stuff, but I've never really seen this specific thing happen first-hand or know anyone it's happened to.
But every time you pull up to the gas station the guy next to you is like "You gotta watch out for those squirrels! Always trying to take gas caps dontcha know." and you're like "Yeah I know right? They're such thieves. Good thing they make that little plastic cord now so they don't run off with them so easily".
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:29 PM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
It's like if it were just common knowledge that squirrels like to run off with your gas cap while you're fueling your car. I mean, I'm sure it's happened at least once, and I can easily imagine what that would look like, and I've seen squirrels steal other stuff, but I've never really seen this specific thing happen first-hand or know anyone it's happened to.
But every time you pull up to the gas station the guy next to you is like "You gotta watch out for those squirrels! Always trying to take gas caps dontcha know." and you're like "Yeah I know right? They're such thieves. Good thing they make that little plastic cord now so they don't run off with them so easily".
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:29 PM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
Liberals can win again if they stop being so annoying and fix their 'hamburger problem'
Motherfucker, I'm as liberal as they come and I just bought a griddle insert for my gas grill so I can make as many goddamn smashburgers as I can fit in my stomach. And I'm gonna do it while watching football when the season starts.
This fucking guy, seriously.
posted by schoolgirl report at 1:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
Motherfucker, I'm as liberal as they come and I just bought a griddle insert for my gas grill so I can make as many goddamn smashburgers as I can fit in my stomach. And I'm gonna do it while watching football when the season starts.
This fucking guy, seriously.
posted by schoolgirl report at 1:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [20 favorites]
Come to think of it, any of these Dem races in 2018 are probably going to do better just by virtue of not including Clinton. She was the magnet for opposition. So . . no slogan needed?
posted by rc3spencer at 1:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by rc3spencer at 1:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Liberals can win again if they stop being so annoying and fix their 'hamburger problem'
The picture in this article is of Trump pretending to eat McDonald's on plates on his motherfucking private airplane and we're the out-of-touch elitists?
posted by kirkaracha at 1:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [82 favorites]
are these threads an appropriate venue to discuss mistakes made by the Democratic Party leadership, or is that outside of the scope of discussion?
I can see cases for both sides of this question. It seems like most of the grar present on these threads concerns differing views on this question (though most often this grar erupts in the form of angry shouting about two people who I will not name, both of whom have little to do with the future of the Democratic Party).
It would be preferable if the decision on whether or not discussion of mistakes made by elected Democrats is admissible be made organically by the group as a whole, but a clear and unambiguous ruling on this question from the moderators would also work.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
I can see cases for both sides of this question. It seems like most of the grar present on these threads concerns differing views on this question (though most often this grar erupts in the form of angry shouting about two people who I will not name, both of whom have little to do with the future of the Democratic Party).
It would be preferable if the decision on whether or not discussion of mistakes made by elected Democrats is admissible be made organically by the group as a whole, but a clear and unambiguous ruling on this question from the moderators would also work.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Remember Trump's tweet about forming an "impenetrable Cyber Security unit" with Russia? Well, Reuters is reporting that today Moscow is in talks with U.S. to create cyber security working group - RIA report
posted by Doktor Zed at 1:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
Moscow and Washington are in talks to create a joint cyber security working group, Russia's RIA news agency reported on Thursday, citing Andrey Krutskikh, a special presidential envoy on cyber security.And that news follows Tillerson's announced plans to shut the State Department's Office of the Coordinator for Cyber Issues. Once again, Team Trump is making plans to align the US closer to Russia on an issue while withdrawing from the rest of the world.
"The talks are underway ... different proposals are being exchanged, nobody denies the necessity of holding the talks and of having such contacts," Krutskikh said, according to RIA.{...}
However, intelligence and security officials in the U.S. and Europe told Reuters on Thursday they were not participating in the talks, which they said were confined to mid-level political officials.
One of the officials, who, like the others, spoke on condition of anonymity, said cooperation on cybersecurity was a "pipe dream" while Russia continues to deny that it hacked last year's U.S. presidential election, as three U.S. intelligence agencies concluded publicly in January.
posted by Doktor Zed at 1:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
"From verything I've seen from the left about the slogan, I don't think they could be satisfied with anything the Democratic party could come up with besides a rousing version of the Internationale."
I just read the lyrics of that song and it's beautiful, why can't it be our song?
posted by Tarumba at 1:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
I just read the lyrics of that song and it's beautiful, why can't it be our song?
posted by Tarumba at 1:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Trump proves that its not really about a politician being out of touch for Republicans. It's just tribalism, they WON'T vote for a Democrat no matter who the fuck they are or what they say or brand themselves. The only hope is to have a secret moderate like Bloomberg or someone run as a Republican.
posted by Liquidwolf at 1:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Liquidwolf at 1:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
I would also accept Bread and Roses.
posted by zachlipton at 1:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 1:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
Trump pretending to eat McDonald's on plates on his motherfucking private airplane
I'm pretty sure his cult calls that 'living the dream'. Portions of this country are def out of touch with each other.
But then, they always have been. These divisions are what winners manipulate.
posted by rc3spencer at 1:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
I'm pretty sure his cult calls that 'living the dream'. Portions of this country are def out of touch with each other.
But then, they always have been. These divisions are what winners manipulate.
posted by rc3spencer at 1:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
rump pretending to eat McDonald's on plates on his motherfucking private airplane and we're the out-of-touch elitists?
Yep. Because we give him a hard time for eating nothing but fast food. We do. Because we think it's ridiculous. Why would you eat crap when you could afford something better, healthier, tastier?
But a lot of people like fast food and resent being told it is crap. For them, Trump eating McDonalds on a private plane sends the message "McDonalds is good enough for classy rich people like Trump. There is nothing wrong with you liking McDonalds."
posted by OnceUponATime at 1:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
Yep. Because we give him a hard time for eating nothing but fast food. We do. Because we think it's ridiculous. Why would you eat crap when you could afford something better, healthier, tastier?
But a lot of people like fast food and resent being told it is crap. For them, Trump eating McDonalds on a private plane sends the message "McDonalds is good enough for classy rich people like Trump. There is nothing wrong with you liking McDonalds."
posted by OnceUponATime at 1:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
not including Clinton. She was the magnet for opposition.
She was a goddamned cottage industry. Devil's Bargain reads like The Perfect Storm. Might have been easier to elect her in 2008. Hell, I went to a confererence adjacent to that cottage industry (long story) weeks before the 2016 election and they highlighted all of the URLs and books they had ready to release once she got elected about how she was destroying the economy.
posted by tilde at 1:39 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
She was a goddamned cottage industry. Devil's Bargain reads like The Perfect Storm. Might have been easier to elect her in 2008. Hell, I went to a confererence adjacent to that cottage industry (long story) weeks before the 2016 election and they highlighted all of the URLs and books they had ready to release once she got elected about how she was destroying the economy.
posted by tilde at 1:39 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
I've been annoyed by sanctimonious cyclists online. There's always one, you know? They're easily defeated by just ignoring them. I know my life, I know what is and is not feasible for getting myself to where I need to go, this rando's opinion is not that important to me. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
But let me tell you about bike lanes in this city. They have become this bizarre proxy war on progressivism that I do not understand even remotely. It's like a whole bunch of people ran into one obnoxious bike commuter (probably the same one, given this is Pittsburgh and everyone knows everyone) and their take-away from the encounter wasn't "huh, well, that guy was a dick" but "FUCK BIKES, FUCK PEOPLE WHO RIDE BIKES, FUCK THE GROUND THAT BIKES TRAVEL UPON, RID THE EARTH OF ALL BICYCLISTS, REQUIRE ALL CITIZENS TO PURCHASE A HUMMER IN ORDER TO PLACATE MY ANNOYANCE AT THIS SINGLE HUMAN".
Like, a little nuance up in here? Anyone?
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:40 PM on July 20, 2017 [46 favorites]
But let me tell you about bike lanes in this city. They have become this bizarre proxy war on progressivism that I do not understand even remotely. It's like a whole bunch of people ran into one obnoxious bike commuter (probably the same one, given this is Pittsburgh and everyone knows everyone) and their take-away from the encounter wasn't "huh, well, that guy was a dick" but "FUCK BIKES, FUCK PEOPLE WHO RIDE BIKES, FUCK THE GROUND THAT BIKES TRAVEL UPON, RID THE EARTH OF ALL BICYCLISTS, REQUIRE ALL CITIZENS TO PURCHASE A HUMMER IN ORDER TO PLACATE MY ANNOYANCE AT THIS SINGLE HUMAN".
Like, a little nuance up in here? Anyone?
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:40 PM on July 20, 2017 [46 favorites]
I like AlexiaSky's "Believe in Better." A lot. Both powerful words. Hopeful, idealistic, and kind of abstract, but also universally intimate and relevant—everybody knows what "believe" and "better" feel like, even if they're not always concrete. Cherry on top: it wrests Trump's stupid "Believe me!" away from him, and says no, believe in *better* than him.
If the new Dem slogan is A Better Deal, then it's easy enough for anyone working with that slogan to add on 'Believe in Better'. This is one of the reasons that I do thing 'A Better Deal' isn't horrible. Because it's so overarching it means it's can be easily used and molded to fit so many different contexts. It can mean what you want.
It is also very 21st social media friendly and I'm sure that is part of what went into the decision making process. How ideas, form, change and are used in that world has to be taken into consideration. There is tons of messaging that goes on in that context. I mentioned the subversion of 'fake news' that happened this past year. A large part of that subversion happened through social media and then Trump latched onto it and the subversion was finalized.
As much as it might bother people political discourse and the movement of ideas through the populace happens in spaces like twitter and FB. It still blows me away how fast it can happen.
Slogans need to be hashtag friendly because they aren't just something that sit at the top of some webpage or pamphlet anymore. In social media they are tools and even part of people's group identities. As much as I hate it I've spent months watching online discourse and how people use MAGA this way.
'Clinton emails, blarg blah' #MAGA. 'Trump is awesome' #MAGA. 'Get over it you lost. #MAGA' This is one of the reasons it became so powerful and stuck beyond Trump saying it all the time. A far as slogans go it has been very successful this way.
#Better, #betterdeal, #makeitbetter, #believeinbetter, #betterhealth,#b-deal, #betterbill, #betterfuture, #betterchoice, #betterbetter. There are so many ways that messaging based on
'we're the group that does things better' could happen.
Another thing I've been racking my brain over is how this type of slogan could be subverted by the right and Trump in particular. So far I'm not coming up with much that doesn't sound dumb and is catchy. #reallybetterdeal #noimthebetterdeal #trumpbetterdeal #nodealdems.
The only one that I think is a real risk is #baddeal. There's #worsedeal, but that doesn't sound catchy, isn't chant friendly and is weaker sounding.
In this day and age looking at what you're opponents can do with your messaging is vital because the right has shown over and over that they will do this and are pretty decent at doing it.
posted by Jalliah at 1:42 PM on July 20, 2017 [22 favorites]
If the new Dem slogan is A Better Deal, then it's easy enough for anyone working with that slogan to add on 'Believe in Better'. This is one of the reasons that I do thing 'A Better Deal' isn't horrible. Because it's so overarching it means it's can be easily used and molded to fit so many different contexts. It can mean what you want.
It is also very 21st social media friendly and I'm sure that is part of what went into the decision making process. How ideas, form, change and are used in that world has to be taken into consideration. There is tons of messaging that goes on in that context. I mentioned the subversion of 'fake news' that happened this past year. A large part of that subversion happened through social media and then Trump latched onto it and the subversion was finalized.
As much as it might bother people political discourse and the movement of ideas through the populace happens in spaces like twitter and FB. It still blows me away how fast it can happen.
Slogans need to be hashtag friendly because they aren't just something that sit at the top of some webpage or pamphlet anymore. In social media they are tools and even part of people's group identities. As much as I hate it I've spent months watching online discourse and how people use MAGA this way.
'Clinton emails, blarg blah' #MAGA. 'Trump is awesome' #MAGA. 'Get over it you lost. #MAGA' This is one of the reasons it became so powerful and stuck beyond Trump saying it all the time. A far as slogans go it has been very successful this way.
#Better, #betterdeal, #makeitbetter, #believeinbetter, #betterhealth,#b-deal, #betterbill, #betterfuture, #betterchoice, #betterbetter. There are so many ways that messaging based on
'we're the group that does things better' could happen.
Another thing I've been racking my brain over is how this type of slogan could be subverted by the right and Trump in particular. So far I'm not coming up with much that doesn't sound dumb and is catchy. #reallybetterdeal #noimthebetterdeal #trumpbetterdeal #nodealdems.
The only one that I think is a real risk is #baddeal. There's #worsedeal, but that doesn't sound catchy, isn't chant friendly and is weaker sounding.
In this day and age looking at what you're opponents can do with your messaging is vital because the right has shown over and over that they will do this and are pretty decent at doing it.
posted by Jalliah at 1:42 PM on July 20, 2017 [22 favorites]
>To lower the McDuff panic level, can you spell out how it doesn't pass, please?
>BCRA is gone, we now have the Obamacare Repeal and Reconciliation Act, which is in fact a partial repeal due to the Byrd Rule. I know there's a rule that the Republican "moderates" always cave, but it's now impossible for them to vote for a bill that repeals Obamacare
McConnell knows the rules better than anyone. Once he slips past the hurdle of a motion to proceed (Rand Paul now seems to be okay with it) then the doors are wide open. There can be unlimited amendments. So that means they can slap together literally anything, with buy offs to individual senators and bribes to individual states, to get something to pass. This battle is a long way from over and anyone who thinks so is in for a rude shock.
posted by JackFlash at 1:43 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
>BCRA is gone, we now have the Obamacare Repeal and Reconciliation Act, which is in fact a partial repeal due to the Byrd Rule. I know there's a rule that the Republican "moderates" always cave, but it's now impossible for them to vote for a bill that repeals Obamacare
McConnell knows the rules better than anyone. Once he slips past the hurdle of a motion to proceed (Rand Paul now seems to be okay with it) then the doors are wide open. There can be unlimited amendments. So that means they can slap together literally anything, with buy offs to individual senators and bribes to individual states, to get something to pass. This battle is a long way from over and anyone who thinks so is in for a rude shock.
posted by JackFlash at 1:43 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Come to think of it, any of these Dem races in 2018 are probably going to do better just by virtue of not including Clinton. She was the magnet for opposition. So . . no slogan needed?
They were never going to stop at Clinton. Pelosi is said to be poisonous to our brand. Kamala Harris apparently didn't behave right at a hearing. Elizabeth Warren has this coming at her in 2018.
Republicans should never get to define who is and is not an acceptable Democrat. If you accept "well they just hated Hillary for reason X" pretty soon you find out every woman everywhere has their own Reason X. And every progressive champion. People were saying shit about John Lewis!
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [91 favorites]
They were never going to stop at Clinton. Pelosi is said to be poisonous to our brand. Kamala Harris apparently didn't behave right at a hearing. Elizabeth Warren has this coming at her in 2018.
Republicans should never get to define who is and is not an acceptable Democrat. If you accept "well they just hated Hillary for reason X" pretty soon you find out every woman everywhere has their own Reason X. And every progressive champion. People were saying shit about John Lewis!
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [91 favorites]
But a lot of people like fast food and resent being told it is crap. For them, Trump eating McDonalds on a private plane sends the message "McDonalds is good enough for classy rich people like Trump. There is nothing wrong with you liking McDonalds."
Which is how "please stop killing yourselves and taking the whole rest of the world with you" became a political third rail.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Which is how "please stop killing yourselves and taking the whole rest of the world with you" became a political third rail.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
And I don't think most of the lifestyle shaming conservatives complain about happens in person or comes from politicians. I think they are reacting to stuff in the media. Social media and local news stories about how you should eat less meat or whatever. Which is not something the DNC has any control over.
posted by OnceUponATime at 1:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by OnceUponATime at 1:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
pretty soon you find out every woman everywhere has their own Reason X.
iseewhatyoudidthere.jpg
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
iseewhatyoudidthere.jpg
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
DEMOCRATS 2018: NEOLIBERALISM TODAY, NEOLIBERALISM FOREVER
DEMOCRATS 2018: NO SUDDEN MOVES
DEMOCRATS 2018: YOU'VE TRIED THE REST, NOW TRY US ALSO
posted by Existential Dread at 1:46 PM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
DEMOCRATS 2018: NO SUDDEN MOVES
DEMOCRATS 2018: YOU'VE TRIED THE REST, NOW TRY US ALSO
posted by Existential Dread at 1:46 PM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
But a lot of people like fast food and resent being told it is crap. For them, Trump eating McDonalds on a private plane sends the message "McDonalds is good enough for class rich people like Trump. There is nothing wrong with you liking McDonalds."
Y'know, this is kind of true, I mean the people who like McDonalds, but it's also really not. I've known a lot of different kinds of people in my day, from lots of different cultures and races, and I've met very few who thought of fast food as the pinnacle, as their absolute favorite food. I've been to a lot of different celebrations at different economic levels, and even when fast food made up a substantial portion of the table, it wasn't because it was some specific brand of fried chicken or mayonnaise salad, it was because it was that food and the other options (homemade, some better brand) were unaffordable. I actually think the "Americans like fast food" narrative is manufactured, it's an advertisement version of America. In my experience, once people are out of puberty, they eat fast food because it is fast and because it is good, but the foods they eat are ones they would rather eat in a different way if given the choice. People grill burgers, or pan fry them. They congregate with friends and relatives. I'm not sure people are as offended as all that.
posted by OmieWise at 1:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Y'know, this is kind of true, I mean the people who like McDonalds, but it's also really not. I've known a lot of different kinds of people in my day, from lots of different cultures and races, and I've met very few who thought of fast food as the pinnacle, as their absolute favorite food. I've been to a lot of different celebrations at different economic levels, and even when fast food made up a substantial portion of the table, it wasn't because it was some specific brand of fried chicken or mayonnaise salad, it was because it was that food and the other options (homemade, some better brand) were unaffordable. I actually think the "Americans like fast food" narrative is manufactured, it's an advertisement version of America. In my experience, once people are out of puberty, they eat fast food because it is fast and because it is good, but the foods they eat are ones they would rather eat in a different way if given the choice. People grill burgers, or pan fry them. They congregate with friends and relatives. I'm not sure people are as offended as all that.
posted by OmieWise at 1:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
iseewhatyoudidthere.jpg
Holy Zarquon, it wasn't purposeful. What did I do?
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:52 PM on July 20, 2017
Holy Zarquon, it wasn't purposeful. What did I do?
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:52 PM on July 20, 2017
It will turn out that "Reason X" is the lack of a Y chromosome (where cis women are concerned).
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:54 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:54 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
Listen, pal, in this country we respect the Law of Conservation of Ass, Cash, and Grass
posted by the phlegmatic king at 4:07 PM on July 20 [2 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]
TANSTAFACG!
posted by Cookiebastard at 1:57 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by the phlegmatic king at 4:07 PM on July 20 [2 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]
TANSTAFACG!
posted by Cookiebastard at 1:57 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
#takeasadsongandmakeitbetter
posted by kirkaracha at 1:57 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by kirkaracha at 1:57 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Mod note: A few comments removed, please reload if need be; the use and cultural load of "white trash" as an in-group vs. out-group cultural signifier in the US is at best complicated as fuck and didn't enter the thread in a careful and clear enough way to make a discussion of it here and now make sense, please let it be.
posted by cortex (staff) at 1:59 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by cortex (staff) at 1:59 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
I just read the lyrics of that song and it's beautiful, why can't it be our song?
Much like the hammer and sickle, the track record of those who have used the song is not great. Seriously, fetishizing the symbols of a state capitalist totalitarian state that killed millions is not a good look. It didn't start out as the symbol, but the men with the jackboots had the symbol on their shoulders and the song on their lips.
A lot of the discussion we've had about the slogan for the Democratic party is about the message it sends to Americans. Like it or not, that song sends a pretty bad signal to a large portion of America.
posted by zabuni at 2:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Much like the hammer and sickle, the track record of those who have used the song is not great. Seriously, fetishizing the symbols of a state capitalist totalitarian state that killed millions is not a good look. It didn't start out as the symbol, but the men with the jackboots had the symbol on their shoulders and the song on their lips.
A lot of the discussion we've had about the slogan for the Democratic party is about the message it sends to Americans. Like it or not, that song sends a pretty bad signal to a large portion of America.
posted by zabuni at 2:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
I think if I ever make a picket sign for Democrats, something like "FREE DENTAL" would probably get the message to more people than anything within the traditional discourse of the US Left.
posted by rhizome at 2:22 PM on July 20, 2017 [22 favorites]
posted by rhizome at 2:22 PM on July 20, 2017 [22 favorites]
"Lisa needs braces!"
posted by Barack Spinoza at 2:26 PM on July 20, 2017 [34 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 2:26 PM on July 20, 2017 [34 favorites]
BCRA is gone
I wouldn't say BCRA is gone. Here's what happens next procedurally. There's a vote on a motion to proceed (MTP). If that passes, with a simple majority, the Senate takes up the House bill (AHCA). That then starts a vote-a-rama in which anyone can offer amendments. An amendment can be anything from "add $37.72 to the HHS office supplies budget" to "delete the entire text of the bill and replace it with this," where 'this' can be anything, including the 2015 repeal-lite.
So at this point, McConnell's plan is to essentially promise everything to everyone by asking them to vote to proceed. People like Paul can vote for it because they think they're getting the 2015 repeal, while moderates can vote for it because they think they're getting, I don't know, they always cave so whatever. Then they start offering amendments that wipe out each other's bills. Is it blindingly irresponsible to vote to open debate on a bill when you have truly no idea what the bill is? Of course, but blinding irresponsibility has never stopped them before. Sen. Cornyn says it's a "luxury we don't have" to know what the bill is before the motion to proceed. Sen. Paul, who may have sort of been joking but sort of not, apparently suggested deciding the order of bills to vote on at random. That's how screwed up this is right now.
In short, if they can't agree on anything, try to get a vote to see if they agree on nothing, and then magic, maybe, happens from there. And apart from all the obvious reasons this is dumb and stupid, the real problem at the heart of this is that nationwide health care policy is not a menu you can pick and choose from; the individual pieces have to make sense together. You can't just throw out things you don't like, say the individual mandate, without something changing at the other end. There's a chance that McConnell's free-for-all will result in passage of a bill, but there's no chance that this mess of a process will result in a policy, or even something mathematically possible. We're to the point where they haven't just given up on having a good plan; they've given up on having a plan at all, because why make policy when a bunch of people with no clue about what they're doing can just grab a piece of humpty dumpty and hurl it at the wall?
Anyhoo, here's a fun Made In America Week story from Fahrenthold (with credit to BuzzFeed for noticing the applications first): During ‘Made in America Week,’ President Trump’s Mar-a-Lago Club applies to hire 70 foreign workers
posted by zachlipton at 2:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [39 favorites]
I wouldn't say BCRA is gone. Here's what happens next procedurally. There's a vote on a motion to proceed (MTP). If that passes, with a simple majority, the Senate takes up the House bill (AHCA). That then starts a vote-a-rama in which anyone can offer amendments. An amendment can be anything from "add $37.72 to the HHS office supplies budget" to "delete the entire text of the bill and replace it with this," where 'this' can be anything, including the 2015 repeal-lite.
So at this point, McConnell's plan is to essentially promise everything to everyone by asking them to vote to proceed. People like Paul can vote for it because they think they're getting the 2015 repeal, while moderates can vote for it because they think they're getting, I don't know, they always cave so whatever. Then they start offering amendments that wipe out each other's bills. Is it blindingly irresponsible to vote to open debate on a bill when you have truly no idea what the bill is? Of course, but blinding irresponsibility has never stopped them before. Sen. Cornyn says it's a "luxury we don't have" to know what the bill is before the motion to proceed. Sen. Paul, who may have sort of been joking but sort of not, apparently suggested deciding the order of bills to vote on at random. That's how screwed up this is right now.
In short, if they can't agree on anything, try to get a vote to see if they agree on nothing, and then magic, maybe, happens from there. And apart from all the obvious reasons this is dumb and stupid, the real problem at the heart of this is that nationwide health care policy is not a menu you can pick and choose from; the individual pieces have to make sense together. You can't just throw out things you don't like, say the individual mandate, without something changing at the other end. There's a chance that McConnell's free-for-all will result in passage of a bill, but there's no chance that this mess of a process will result in a policy, or even something mathematically possible. We're to the point where they haven't just given up on having a good plan; they've given up on having a plan at all, because why make policy when a bunch of people with no clue about what they're doing can just grab a piece of humpty dumpty and hurl it at the wall?
Anyhoo, here's a fun Made In America Week story from Fahrenthold (with credit to BuzzFeed for noticing the applications first): During ‘Made in America Week,’ President Trump’s Mar-a-Lago Club applies to hire 70 foreign workers
posted by zachlipton at 2:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [39 favorites]
OK, I got through the first 32 paragraphs of the Democrats' "no-confidence" resolution and set it to the tune of 88 Lines for 44 Women, but now the work day is done so I'm going home. It would totally kill this thread in length, so I'll just link to a picture on Twitter, because I don't think anyone but me actually cares. (If anyone does care, encourage me and I'll keep going.)
Here's the start:
posted by maryr at 2:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [42 favorites]
Here's the start:
1. January Trump became
The brand new US President
2. Constitution tells us that
He can’t *take* an emolument
3. Trump refuses to divest,
won’t let go of old arrears
4. And we haven’t seen his taxes
disregarding 40 years
posted by maryr at 2:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [42 favorites]
The zombie bill that will never die. Is the entire next congressional season going to be occupied with seeing how close they can get to any vote, again and again and again and again, tiring us out (I'm tired, for one), and then seeing what they can eventually slip by in November after the 47th re-vote?
So, so frustrating. I guess it's better than whatever other harm they were going to do, but.
posted by Dashy at 2:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
So, so frustrating. I guess it's better than whatever other harm they were going to do, but.
posted by Dashy at 2:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
I actually think the "Americans like fast food" narrative is manufactured, it's an advertisement version of America.
I don't think Americans love fast food. I think Americans are, in large part, too tired to cook tonight, or at least several nights a week, and McDonald's is there. Americans know that the sugar isn't really good for them but also know that they feel slightly less worn out after drinking the Coke that came with the value meal. I'm fine with fast food as an in-moderation thing, but I think that culturally we eat fast food because we're exhausted and it's not super pleasing but it's the highest ratio of pleasure-to-dollars-and-time that you're going to manage on your commute home.
The bulk of the Trump voters I know are just totally disinterested in anything bigger than "social change is bad because I'm basically fine, but only barely, and any improvement of things for any other group will probably make me worse off". It's not that they overtly like McDonald's or that they overtly hate immigrants, but foreign people are not a regular part of their daily lives and McDonald's is and the status quo must persist because the biggest thing they feel capable of handling is their ongoing struggles with work deadlines and the neighbor's overly aggressive use of weed killer. I don't now how you convince those people they should care about other human beings if they just... don't. I think social change will happen either way, but in terms of politics, it will all happen faster if some of these people can be convinced that social change will be good for them personally and that nobody is going to force them to try to fix their problems with kale. Not that anybody HAS been trying to fix their problems with kale, but that doesn't mean they aren't kind of convinced that's a thing.
It's not about love for McDonald's, it's about the fact that capitalism gave us a very fragile middle class--both economically and in terms of people who lack the resilience to deal with their personal problems AND empathize with others. I think both of these states were created with some degree of intention by the rich, because a stable and compassionate middle class would be overtly dangerous to them.
posted by Sequence at 2:42 PM on July 20, 2017 [45 favorites]
I don't think Americans love fast food. I think Americans are, in large part, too tired to cook tonight, or at least several nights a week, and McDonald's is there. Americans know that the sugar isn't really good for them but also know that they feel slightly less worn out after drinking the Coke that came with the value meal. I'm fine with fast food as an in-moderation thing, but I think that culturally we eat fast food because we're exhausted and it's not super pleasing but it's the highest ratio of pleasure-to-dollars-and-time that you're going to manage on your commute home.
The bulk of the Trump voters I know are just totally disinterested in anything bigger than "social change is bad because I'm basically fine, but only barely, and any improvement of things for any other group will probably make me worse off". It's not that they overtly like McDonald's or that they overtly hate immigrants, but foreign people are not a regular part of their daily lives and McDonald's is and the status quo must persist because the biggest thing they feel capable of handling is their ongoing struggles with work deadlines and the neighbor's overly aggressive use of weed killer. I don't now how you convince those people they should care about other human beings if they just... don't. I think social change will happen either way, but in terms of politics, it will all happen faster if some of these people can be convinced that social change will be good for them personally and that nobody is going to force them to try to fix their problems with kale. Not that anybody HAS been trying to fix their problems with kale, but that doesn't mean they aren't kind of convinced that's a thing.
It's not about love for McDonald's, it's about the fact that capitalism gave us a very fragile middle class--both economically and in terms of people who lack the resilience to deal with their personal problems AND empathize with others. I think both of these states were created with some degree of intention by the rich, because a stable and compassionate middle class would be overtly dangerous to them.
posted by Sequence at 2:42 PM on July 20, 2017 [45 favorites]
Metafilter: if they can't agree on anything, try to get a vote to see if they agree on nothing, and then magic, maybe, happens from there.
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
> I just read the lyrics of that song and it's beautiful, why can't it be our song?
> Much like the hammer and sickle, the track record of those who have used the song is not great. Seriously, fetishizing the symbols of a state capitalist totalitarian state that killed millions is not a good look. It didn't start out as the symbol, but the men with the jackboots had the symbol on their shoulders and the song on their lips.
The original Bolsheviks were not great; however, the Internationale was not the anthem of the Soviet Union during its state capitalist totalitarian phase — Stalin, as part of his retreat from internationalist revolutionary socialism to nationalist "socialism in one state," replaced the Internationale with the (nationalistic) State Anthem of the Soviet Union. (lyrics available at the wikipedia page.)
Also, though, if you're reading the lyrics of the Internationale in English you must take note that there are wildly varying translations. This is an effect of the original translation being perfectly wretched, full of archaic words and grammatical structures and nearly impossible to sing.
There's a good chance that you were reading the lyrics of the Billy Bragg version, which steps back from the militancy of the original, possibly too much. This is my second-favorite version of the song and the one that gets stuck in my head most often, but I don't admit that around legit commies cause they don't like how much he watered it down (and, to be fair, there's good reason to not like how much he watered it down). Here's Billy Bragg's version; here's Bragg explaining the story of how he ended up writing a translation of the Internationale.
My favorite version is Pete Seeger's: he sings each verse in French and then (seemingly on the fly) comes up with a witty, singable English gloss for the lyrics. Skip forward to 1:30 or so in that video to get to where he starts giving it in English, though you owe it to yourself to hear him singing the French.
L'Internationale is decidedly not a song of the "men with the jackboots" that you're referring to; it was a song that the jackboot boys distanced themselves from as quickly as they possibly could.
I agree that no version of the song is fitting for the Democratic Party as currently constituted, since the Democratic Party is (as Pelosi has reminded us) a capitalist party, and all versions of L'Internationale are at their heart anti-capitalist. Hopefully The Whelk and his DSA comrades are successful in making the Democratic Party over into an organization that could use L'Internationale... but, well, even in the best-case scenario that's going to take some time.
sidebar: The current Russian national anthem is a reworked version of the Stalin-era State Anthem; there's been a couple of controversies about Putin standing up in respect for performances of Stalin's version of the State Anthem. I would wager that Putin would never stand up for L'Internationale, not in a million years.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [35 favorites]
> Much like the hammer and sickle, the track record of those who have used the song is not great. Seriously, fetishizing the symbols of a state capitalist totalitarian state that killed millions is not a good look. It didn't start out as the symbol, but the men with the jackboots had the symbol on their shoulders and the song on their lips.
The original Bolsheviks were not great; however, the Internationale was not the anthem of the Soviet Union during its state capitalist totalitarian phase — Stalin, as part of his retreat from internationalist revolutionary socialism to nationalist "socialism in one state," replaced the Internationale with the (nationalistic) State Anthem of the Soviet Union. (lyrics available at the wikipedia page.)
Also, though, if you're reading the lyrics of the Internationale in English you must take note that there are wildly varying translations. This is an effect of the original translation being perfectly wretched, full of archaic words and grammatical structures and nearly impossible to sing.
There's a good chance that you were reading the lyrics of the Billy Bragg version, which steps back from the militancy of the original, possibly too much. This is my second-favorite version of the song and the one that gets stuck in my head most often, but I don't admit that around legit commies cause they don't like how much he watered it down (and, to be fair, there's good reason to not like how much he watered it down). Here's Billy Bragg's version; here's Bragg explaining the story of how he ended up writing a translation of the Internationale.
My favorite version is Pete Seeger's: he sings each verse in French and then (seemingly on the fly) comes up with a witty, singable English gloss for the lyrics. Skip forward to 1:30 or so in that video to get to where he starts giving it in English, though you owe it to yourself to hear him singing the French.
L'Internationale is decidedly not a song of the "men with the jackboots" that you're referring to; it was a song that the jackboot boys distanced themselves from as quickly as they possibly could.
I agree that no version of the song is fitting for the Democratic Party as currently constituted, since the Democratic Party is (as Pelosi has reminded us) a capitalist party, and all versions of L'Internationale are at their heart anti-capitalist. Hopefully The Whelk and his DSA comrades are successful in making the Democratic Party over into an organization that could use L'Internationale... but, well, even in the best-case scenario that's going to take some time.
sidebar: The current Russian national anthem is a reworked version of the Stalin-era State Anthem; there's been a couple of controversies about Putin standing up in respect for performances of Stalin's version of the State Anthem. I would wager that Putin would never stand up for L'Internationale, not in a million years.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [35 favorites]
Much like the hammer and sickle, the track record of those who have used the song is not great. Seriously, fetishizing the symbols of a state capitalist totalitarian state that killed millions is not a good look. It didn't start out as the symbol, but the men with the jackboots had the symbol on their shoulders and the song on their lips.
Republicans are allowed to fetishize, emulate and cosplay Nazis and Confederates, but God forbid a Democrat do anything that even resembles something a Communist might have done.
I post Jim's Big Ego's "International" on Facebook every May 1.
posted by Faint of Butt at 2:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Republicans are allowed to fetishize, emulate and cosplay Nazis and Confederates, but God forbid a Democrat do anything that even resembles something a Communist might have done.
I post Jim's Big Ego's "International" on Facebook every May 1.
posted by Faint of Butt at 2:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Republicans are allowed to fetishize, emulate and cosplay Nazis
Uh I don't think that's a thing that is accepted anywhere.
posted by FakeFreyja at 2:48 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Uh I don't think that's a thing that is accepted anywhere.
posted by FakeFreyja at 2:48 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Jim's Big Ego's
Christ, that's a name I don't see around often. Saw 'em in college, probably hasn't been a month in the last 18 years that I don't get Ahead of the Curve or She's Dead stuck in my head.
posted by cortex at 2:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Christ, that's a name I don't see around often. Saw 'em in college, probably hasn't been a month in the last 18 years that I don't get Ahead of the Curve or She's Dead stuck in my head.
posted by cortex at 2:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Nazism has been championed by Republicans currently in the goddamn White House. It most certainly is accepted by many.
posted by agregoli at 2:52 PM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
posted by agregoli at 2:52 PM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
Uh I don't think that's a thing that is accepted anywhere.
I'm not sure what else you'd call this, then.
Jim's Big Ego is one of my favorite bands. It started with "Stress" and "The Ballad of Barry Allen" and just went on from there.
posted by Faint of Butt at 2:53 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
I'm not sure what else you'd call this, then.
Jim's Big Ego is one of my favorite bands. It started with "Stress" and "The Ballad of Barry Allen" and just went on from there.
posted by Faint of Butt at 2:53 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Also, Trump ordering his granddaughter to tell him that she loves him.
What would be really neat is if you were the person in charge of teaching his granddaughter Chinese and you said to her "Okay now, '[Fuck You, in Chinese]' is how you say 'I love you, Grandpa.' Let me hear you say it." Granddaughter: "[Fuck You in Chinese], Grandpa!" "That's great! You're great! Now go tell Grandpa that you love him. Don't mind the reporters."
That's what would be really neat.
posted by mudpuppie at 2:55 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
What would be really neat is if you were the person in charge of teaching his granddaughter Chinese and you said to her "Okay now, '[Fuck You, in Chinese]' is how you say 'I love you, Grandpa.' Let me hear you say it." Granddaughter: "[Fuck You in Chinese], Grandpa!" "That's great! You're great! Now go tell Grandpa that you love him. Don't mind the reporters."
That's what would be really neat.
posted by mudpuppie at 2:55 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
MOM WHY CAN'T WE SING THE INTERNATIONALE
DICKY SPENCER'S MOM LET HIM HAVE A REICHSKRIEGSFLAGGE
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [35 favorites]
DICKY SPENCER'S MOM LET HIM HAVE A REICHSKRIEGSFLAGGE
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [35 favorites]
This is my second-favorite version of the song and the one that gets stuck in my head most often, but I don't admit that around legit commies
I want to go to this place where YCTAB is considered vaguely right-wing
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
I want to go to this place where YCTAB is considered vaguely right-wing
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
I know that it's impolite to refer humorously to Dignified Ill White Men and the thread looks down upon most single-tweet links
But this is too fucking good.
Carry on
posted by delfin at 2:58 PM on July 20, 2017 [43 favorites]
But this is too fucking good.
Carry on
posted by delfin at 2:58 PM on July 20, 2017 [43 favorites]
> I want to go to this place where YCTAB is considered vaguely right-wing
Oakland's the best :)
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:59 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
Oakland's the best :)
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:59 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
Ashley "send her the pee tape first, she's earned it" Feinberg: Trump's 2020 Campaign Has Already Paid Out $600K—to Trump
Even though Trump is, in fact, the current president, he only stopped running for a brief few hours on Inauguration Day. As soon as Trump filed for re-election, at 5:11 pm on January 20, his campaign officially sprang back into action. That means Trump can legally continue to funnel funds from donors back into his own businesses. According to the Trump campaign's self-reported FEC filings, this has amounted to about $600,000 spent at Trump-owned properties in just the first six months of his presidency.posted by zachlipton at 3:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [49 favorites]
Nearly $400,000 of that campaign money went to rent at Trump Tower, with $90,000 going to the The Trump Corporation for "legal consulting," nearly $60,000 to the Trump International Golf Club, $15,000 to the Trump International Hotel in DC, and about $1,700 to Trump-brand bottled water, among various payments. And that's just the money that went to businesses in which Trump has a personal role. The Trump campaign has spent a total of $10 million in the last six months; any shell companies and subsidiaries of other Trump-owned businesses that may have gotten a piece of that don't have to be disclosed.
Leverage:
WSJ: Special Counsel Investigating Possible Money Laundering by Paul ManafortThat's about all the news in there, but they reference two previous stories, with these key points:
- The inquiry into the issue by Mr. Mueller and his team began several weeks ago.
- NYS Attorney General and Manhattan District Attorney are also investigating Manafort's real-estate transactions.
- The Manhattan district attorney's office has already subpoenaed records relating to $16 million in loans made to Manafort (after he resigned as campaign manager) by a bank run by a Trump advisor.
Republicans are allowed to fetishize, emulate and cosplay Nazis
Uh I don't think that's a thing that is accepted anywhere.
They fucking seig heiled on stage at their convention.
posted by Artw at 3:12 PM on July 20, 2017 [41 favorites]
Uh I don't think that's a thing that is accepted anywhere.
They fucking seig heiled on stage at their convention.
posted by Artw at 3:12 PM on July 20, 2017 [41 favorites]
Did someone say cosplay Nazis?
Presenting, the Gorka.
posted by rc3spencer at 3:20 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Presenting, the Gorka.
posted by rc3spencer at 3:20 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
And Hillary and the democrats are exactly the kind of people that would judge them harshly for their views, and Donald Trump and the republicans are the kind of people who don’t. So they are voting republican, no matter how big of a clown Trump is, because at least those people don’t piss all over my fundamental sense of self.
and of course, it's not a judgement of any kind when someone says someone else is going to hell for what they don't believe or who they sleep with or what they want to become, and it's no attack on a fundamental sense of self to tell someone they're communist dupes who hate our country and want to destroy it, or call them nasty names when it's just us "normal" folks around and they can't hear
no, it's those liberals that are the intolerant ones
what a bullshit place america is becoming
posted by pyramid termite at 3:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [69 favorites]
and of course, it's not a judgement of any kind when someone says someone else is going to hell for what they don't believe or who they sleep with or what they want to become, and it's no attack on a fundamental sense of self to tell someone they're communist dupes who hate our country and want to destroy it, or call them nasty names when it's just us "normal" folks around and they can't hear
no, it's those liberals that are the intolerant ones
what a bullshit place america is becoming
posted by pyramid termite at 3:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [69 favorites]
What would be really neat is if you were the person in charge of teaching his granddaughter Chinese and you said to her "Okay now, '[Fuck You, in Chinese]' is how you say 'I love you, Grandpa.' Let me hear you say it." Granddaughter: "[Fuck You in Chinese], Grandpa!" "That's great! You're great! Now go tell Grandpa that you love him. Don't mind the reporters."
That's what would be really neat.
posted by mudpuppie at 6:55 AM on July 21 [3 favorites +] [!]
Fun fact - "fuck you" in Chinese takes on various shades of relatives, you never say "肏你/cao ni", you say, “肏你妈/cao ni ma/fuck your mother” is most common, or if you want to make it really nasty, it's "肏你大爷/肏你老爷/肏你爷爷/cao ni daye/laoye/yeye/fuck your [relational marker] grandfather". "Fuck you" is kinda inseparable from a relative in Chinese.
"总之，肏她各种祖宗/Anyway, fuck all her ancestors".
posted by saysthis at 3:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [67 favorites]
That's what would be really neat.
posted by mudpuppie at 6:55 AM on July 21 [3 favorites +] [!]
Fun fact - "fuck you" in Chinese takes on various shades of relatives, you never say "肏你/cao ni", you say, “肏你妈/cao ni ma/fuck your mother” is most common, or if you want to make it really nasty, it's "肏你大爷/肏你老爷/肏你爷爷/cao ni daye/laoye/yeye/fuck your [relational marker] grandfather". "Fuck you" is kinda inseparable from a relative in Chinese.
"总之，肏她各种祖宗/Anyway, fuck all her ancestors".
posted by saysthis at 3:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [67 favorites]
Steve King, who is still a Republican, still a sitting Representative, and still goes on TV to speak for the Republicans, literally paraphrased the fourteen words on Twitter, happily linking to Geert Wilders.
He also had a confederate flag on his desk despite the fact the state he represents fought for the Union...
posted by PenDevil at 3:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
He also had a confederate flag on his desk despite the fact the state he represents fought for the Union...
posted by PenDevil at 3:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [23 favorites]
You learn the darndest things on Metafilter
posted by Fleebnork at 3:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
posted by Fleebnork at 3:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
I hear all the time about vegans who are trying to shame people for eating meat, cyclists who are trying to ban cars, atheists who are shouting down churchgoers, liberals who want to make people feel bad for living outside the gay downtown. As far as I can tell these are all just fictional.
This made me laugh really loudly, thanks.
I can't speak to the gay downtown example but at least two of the other three (cyclists calling out cars as super eeeeeeevil and atheists arguing with churchgoers) have been a part of a few of the worst arguments this site has ever had. People literally have left in a huff over 'em.
Also, my vegetarian mom once got banned from ever again attending a relative's Passover Seder for loudly proclaiming in a really disgusted voice: "I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU CAN EAT THAT FLESH!" during the main course. That side of the family still grouses about it.
posted by zarq at 3:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
This made me laugh really loudly, thanks.
I can't speak to the gay downtown example but at least two of the other three (cyclists calling out cars as super eeeeeeevil and atheists arguing with churchgoers) have been a part of a few of the worst arguments this site has ever had. People literally have left in a huff over 'em.
Also, my vegetarian mom once got banned from ever again attending a relative's Passover Seder for loudly proclaiming in a really disgusted voice: "I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU CAN EAT THAT FLESH!" during the main course. That side of the family still grouses about it.
posted by zarq at 3:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Hey so I know it's all the rage to compare Trump to supervillains. Personally I think that's pretty lame considering most supervillains are at least good at something. But just in case it ever comes up in your fantasy geek circles: No. Trump definitively could not hack it among the drow.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 3:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by scaryblackdeath at 3:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
"I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU CAN EAT THAT FLESH!"
That kind of thing is what really cracked me up about the Tucker Carlson rant about "Gypsies" beheading chickens. Straight from the PETA playbook, you take a perfectly normal activity like butchering a chicken but you describe it in the most loaded and revolting language possible. You'd think conservatives would celebrate self sufficiency, but they're immigrants so it's easier to play the role of radical reactionary.
posted by peeedro at 3:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
That kind of thing is what really cracked me up about the Tucker Carlson rant about "Gypsies" beheading chickens. Straight from the PETA playbook, you take a perfectly normal activity like butchering a chicken but you describe it in the most loaded and revolting language possible. You'd think conservatives would celebrate self sufficiency, but they're immigrants so it's easier to play the role of radical reactionary.
posted by peeedro at 3:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
Only in America: "How dare you wear a hammer&sickle or sing The Internationale?" screech several million people whose beloved political idol is an idiotic servile Renfield currently pimping out their nation to a veteran lieutenant colonel of the KGB.
posted by FelliniBlank at 4:01 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 4:01 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
How the Left Can Win in the South by Paul Blest for The Nation
This is what my South is like. Come join us. Amazing things are happening.
posted by hydropsyche at 4:15 PM on July 20, 2017 [44 favorites]
This is what my South is like. Come join us. Amazing things are happening.
posted by hydropsyche at 4:15 PM on July 20, 2017 [44 favorites]
Straight from the PETA playbook, you take a perfectly normal activity like butchering a chicken but you describe it in the most loaded and revolting language possible.
When the Viet Cong carried away their dead during the Vietnam War, they did it to hide their losses and confuse American forces.
When Americans carried away their dead, it was because they wouldn't abandon their brothers on the battlefield.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:18 PM on July 20, 2017 [44 favorites]
When the Viet Cong carried away their dead during the Vietnam War, they did it to hide their losses and confuse American forces.
When Americans carried away their dead, it was because they wouldn't abandon their brothers on the battlefield.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:18 PM on July 20, 2017 [44 favorites]
The Post dug deep on Akie Abe's knowledge of English and concluded it probably wasn't a snub of Trump so much as that she doesn't appear to be particularly comfortable with the language and likely didn't want to misspeak. She certainly doesn't speak absolutely no English as claimed during the interview though.
posted by zachlipton at 4:20 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 4:20 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
I was raised by a narcissist and it is totally in character that Trump demands his granddaughter say "I love you, grandpa" in Chinese during the NYT interview. That performative display of "affection" on demand just makes my skin crawl.
posted by mcduff at 4:31 PM on July 20, 2017 [30 favorites]
posted by mcduff at 4:31 PM on July 20, 2017 [30 favorites]
National Treasure Alexandra Petri, WaPo: Napoleon’s Extracurricular Activities (A Comprehensive List) (in its entirety).
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 4:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [36 favorites]
French
Coding
Horseback Riding
Model Government
Modeling
Chess Club
Urban Designers (The Street Grid The Way They Work You Know The Spokes)
So Many Things Even Beyond
Height Is Nothing But A Number Club
Future Leaders
Mountain Climbing
Adopt A Highway By Force If Necessary
Semester Abroad
Euro Challenge
Egyptian Antiquities Club
Mathletes
Senior Retreat Leader
That performative display of "affection" on demand just makes my skin crawl.
Absolutely. Remember, to a malignant narcissist one's family members are literal extensions or members of one's body. It's why he doesn't see anything wrong with saying that if Ivanka weren't his daughter he'd date her; in his mind it's no grosser than joking "I'd do me." It's also the reason why if he feels betrayed or threatened by one of his children he will not hesitate to lop them off like a gangrenous finger and discard them.
posted by Rust Moranis at 4:38 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
Absolutely. Remember, to a malignant narcissist one's family members are literal extensions or members of one's body. It's why he doesn't see anything wrong with saying that if Ivanka weren't his daughter he'd date her; in his mind it's no grosser than joking "I'd do me." It's also the reason why if he feels betrayed or threatened by one of his children he will not hesitate to lop them off like a gangrenous finger and discard them.
posted by Rust Moranis at 4:38 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
I hate watching my party do the "oh, my nephew is good with [x], let's get him to do it" thing when we agree it's lame & lambast our opponents for it.
Well, we do have this guy. He's excellent at framing and Democrats need to pay attention to what he says. We have to stop talking to ourselves and widen our message by casting it in terms of the values of the voters we need to attract.
posted by Mental Wimp at 4:39 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Well, we do have this guy. He's excellent at framing and Democrats need to pay attention to what he says. We have to stop talking to ourselves and widen our message by casting it in terms of the values of the voters we need to attract.
posted by Mental Wimp at 4:39 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
loquacious: TURNIP FOR PRESIDENT 2020
Can a swede run for president?
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 4:47 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Can a swede run for president?
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 4:47 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
As far as living in the gay downtown goes - I'd love to, but I can't afford it. I don't think anyone - gay or not - can afford it these days unless they consist of two six-figure-income earners. LOL at the thought of the poors or even the middles affording the gay downtown.
I'm not convinced that the perfect slogan is going to make or break the Democratic party. Swing voters? What swing voters? They've pretty much ceased to exist. The parties are severely polarized.
If there's going to be a slogan, it should be "Vote, Dammit, Vote!" Democrats' problem isn't that they can't kiss the asses of the mythical Swing Voters skillfully enough. It's that Democrats, and potential Democrats, don't fucking vote. They especially don't vote in midterm and local elections.
I'd rather the Dem leadership hire community organizers and ask that donations be placed toward get-out-the-vote efforts, especially in communities of color. Do you vote? If no, what would induce you to vote? How can we help you vote? (Transportation? Child care? Someone to watch Grandma for an hour? Help with navigating the process? Information on mail-in voting? Etc.)
If the Democratic party leadership thinks that "all we need is the Bestest Slogan EVAH! And people will vote in droves!" then maybe we need new leadership.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 4:50 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
I'm not convinced that the perfect slogan is going to make or break the Democratic party. Swing voters? What swing voters? They've pretty much ceased to exist. The parties are severely polarized.
If there's going to be a slogan, it should be "Vote, Dammit, Vote!" Democrats' problem isn't that they can't kiss the asses of the mythical Swing Voters skillfully enough. It's that Democrats, and potential Democrats, don't fucking vote. They especially don't vote in midterm and local elections.
I'd rather the Dem leadership hire community organizers and ask that donations be placed toward get-out-the-vote efforts, especially in communities of color. Do you vote? If no, what would induce you to vote? How can we help you vote? (Transportation? Child care? Someone to watch Grandma for an hour? Help with navigating the process? Information on mail-in voting? Etc.)
If the Democratic party leadership thinks that "all we need is the Bestest Slogan EVAH! And people will vote in droves!" then maybe we need new leadership.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 4:50 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
More tales of the intolerant left: noted ignorant racist bigot, PA state rep. Daryl Metcalfe is upset that a fellow legislator called him an ignorant racist bigot.
posted by octothorpe at 5:03 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 5:03 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
News Channel 5 White County Inmates Given Reduced Jail Time If They Get A Vasectomy
Daily Beast Congress Warns Donald Trump That It Will Be Toxic If He Fires Bob Mueller
I do not believe that anyone in congress is going to convince Trump of anything because he is under the mistaken impression that the US Gov't is his personal business and all government officials work for him. I know he is going to fire Mueller sooner or later because he has little impulse control and may eventually figure out that facing congress' "wrath" is nothing compared to the legal jeopardy that Mueller threatens.
I just hope that Mueller and his team have a back-up plan.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [27 favorites]
nmates in White County, Tennessee have been given credit for their jail time if they voluntarily agree to have a vasectomy or birth control implant, a popular new program that is being called “unconstitutional” by the ACLU.Hey here's an idea. Why not set up a clinic that gives away free birth control and don't try to attach it to the criminal justice system.
On May 15, 2017 General Sessions Judge Sam Benningfield signed a standing order that allows inmates to receive 30 days credit toward jail time if they undergo a birth control procedure.
Women who volunteer to participate in the program are given a free Nexplanon implant in their arm, the implant helps prevent pregnancies for up to four years. Men who volunteer to participate are given a vasectomy, free of charge, by the Tennessee Department of Health.
Daily Beast Congress Warns Donald Trump That It Will Be Toxic If He Fires Bob Mueller
“I think that maybe we could have a tweet-storm—a tweet-storm directed at the president that all of us, Democrats and Republicans, would tweet the same message to 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. and say: Mr. President, don’t you dare,” Carper said with a laugh.A tweetstorm. Yeah that'll do it.
Mueller enjoys bipartisan support on the Hill, where lawmakers expressed continued confidence in his ability to oversee the investigation. But as Heinrich noted, that investigation remains under the purview of the executive branch, which leaves it vulnerable to Trump’s whims. And that’s not a particularly secure place to be.
I do not believe that anyone in congress is going to convince Trump of anything because he is under the mistaken impression that the US Gov't is his personal business and all government officials work for him. I know he is going to fire Mueller sooner or later because he has little impulse control and may eventually figure out that facing congress' "wrath" is nothing compared to the legal jeopardy that Mueller threatens.
I just hope that Mueller and his team have a back-up plan.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [27 favorites]
I think a commitment to impeach if Mueller is sacked without cause would be a better bet than a tweetstorm, somehow.
posted by Devonian at 5:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by Devonian at 5:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
As long as the tweets are sternly-worded I think they'd do the trick.
Or used poop emojis.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Or used poop emojis.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
my grandfather had a farm with chickens - guess what he used to do when they needed a good sunday chicken dinner?
i swear, do people think their chicken mcnuggets are magically shat out by ronald mcdonald?
my uncles used to stick the head in my mother's face and it would try to go bwalk bwalk and stare at her for a bit while the rest of the chicken ran around
farm life in the 30s ...
and now we're upset that roma behead chickens? how the hell else do you kill them?
we've lost a lot as a country ...
posted by pyramid termite at 5:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
i swear, do people think their chicken mcnuggets are magically shat out by ronald mcdonald?
my uncles used to stick the head in my mother's face and it would try to go bwalk bwalk and stare at her for a bit while the rest of the chicken ran around
farm life in the 30s ...
and now we're upset that roma behead chickens? how the hell else do you kill them?
we've lost a lot as a country ...
posted by pyramid termite at 5:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
i swear, do people think their chicken mcnuggets are magically shat out by ronald mcdonald?
No. They're obviously Grimace's.
posted by Talez at 5:15 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
No. They're obviously Grimace's.
posted by Talez at 5:15 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
I thought 30 years of experience with panic disorder meant I'd be better equipped than most to manage my emotional response to this presidency. I just read that NYT interview from yesterday and it turns out that I was wrong.
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:19 PM on July 20, 2017 [38 favorites]
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:19 PM on July 20, 2017 [38 favorites]
Not really a slogan guy, but I think 'A New Deal,' in 2018, would be pretty good.
You could probably borrow a good chunk of FDR's stuff: banking reform, emergency relief, fair labor, infrastructure, jobs, expanding Social Security, civilian conservation... they want to take it back to the '30s, let's take it back to the goddamn '30s. MAGA.
posted by box at 5:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [52 favorites]
You could probably borrow a good chunk of FDR's stuff: banking reform, emergency relief, fair labor, infrastructure, jobs, expanding Social Security, civilian conservation... they want to take it back to the '30s, let's take it back to the goddamn '30s. MAGA.
posted by box at 5:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [52 favorites]
I thought 30 years of experience with panic disorder meant I'd be better equipped than most to manage my emotional response to this presidency. I just read that NYT interview from yesterday and it turns out that I was wrong.
posted by Talez at 5:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
You know, he can talk tough all he wants, in the meantime he talked tough to North Korea. And he didn’t actually. He didn’t talk tough to North Korea. You know, we have a big problem with North Korea. Big. Big, big. You look at all of the things, you look at the line in the sand. The red line in the sand in Syria. He didn’t do the shot. I did the shot. Had he done that shot, he wouldn’t have had — had he done something dramatic, because if you remember, they had a tremendous gas attack after he made that statement. Much bigger than the one they had with me.I have 34 years of experience with the English language and I can't even parse that word salad.
posted by Talez at 5:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
Dems 2018: NOT TRUMP
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Honestly, the Democrats should come up with a slogan that essentially says "We're the party of effective government." Appeals to the middle, true, and a stark contrast to the shenanigans going on now.
posted by Ostara at 5:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Ostara at 5:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Effective? Try Functional.
posted by leotrotsky at 5:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by leotrotsky at 5:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
'A New Deal for a New Century'
posted by leotrotsky at 5:36 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by leotrotsky at 5:36 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
this discussion about slogans is not about slogans; probably it would be best for everyone's sanity if we either explicitly turned to discussing the ideas behind the proposed slogans (rather than the slogans themselves), or else just returned to discussing the events of the day.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:36 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:36 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Did you say "the events of the day? *taps mike* Politico: Sessions won't resign for now, but gets Trump's message
posted by zachlipton at 5:43 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
One person close to Sessions said he has no interest in resigning, although he previously offered to do so in late May, following several outbursts by Trump over his recusal.At press time, it was unconfirmed whether the demand to submit a resignation letter came with a side of meatloaf.
While the resignation attempt was previously reported, this person told POLITICO that Trump had demanded that Sessions submit a resignation letter. By the time Sessions did so the following day, Trump had cooled down and rejected the offer.
posted by zachlipton at 5:43 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
A New New Deal, just so we can have #NUNU instead of #MAGA. It's much more fun to say.
posted by mcdoublewide at 5:43 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by mcdoublewide at 5:43 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
What if it's like, "A Nude Eel" and then there's just a picture of an eel because ALL EELS ARE ALREADY NUDE but you never thought of that so mind = blown and you're like "I'm totally voting for these people, they have the dankest memes"?
Does anyone read the slogans down here?
posted by uosuaq at 5:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [38 favorites]
Does anyone read the slogans down here?
posted by uosuaq at 5:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [38 favorites]
A New New Deal, just so we can have #NUNU instead of #MAGA. It's much more fun to say.
The yeti knows the way.
posted by Talez at 5:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
The yeti knows the way.
posted by Talez at 5:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
To eliminate any confusion, we should just go with #ANUSTART
posted by Freon at 5:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [74 favorites]
posted by Freon at 5:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [74 favorites]
I've thought for years that a massive New Deal style investment in infrastructure and education would be a great way to help ease the transition into a more automated economy, and keep people employed while we figure out how it's going to work when we just don't need full employment to keep everyone fed and comfortable. The fact that we have a shit president who touts himself as a dealmaker just makes the language that much more resonant. We tried his deal, it's an awful deal.
posted by contraption at 5:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by contraption at 5:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
If there's going to be a slogan, it should be "Vote, Dammit, Vote!" Democrats' problem isn't that they can't kiss the asses of the mythical Swing Voters skillfully enough. It's that Democrats, and potential Democrats, don't fucking vote. They especially don't vote in midterm and local elections.
Good point. In a lot of ways, increasing political participation for the Democratic Party is much less about hearts-and-minds and content/ideology and more of a community behavioral/compliance project, like achieving a high rate of seatbelt use, etc. Which is partly why a lot of traditional canvassing/GOTV techniques should be scrapped, particularly the ones using old, annoying, and avoidable technologies.
There are hordes of people who are vaguely OK with and naturally drawn to Democratic views (especially when presented without that branding), and then there's the somewhat smaller group who are inherently hostile to those views and probably always will be. All you really have to do is to get that first group up off their asses using methods that don't make them say "FUCK YOU; leave me alone" in the process.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Good point. In a lot of ways, increasing political participation for the Democratic Party is much less about hearts-and-minds and content/ideology and more of a community behavioral/compliance project, like achieving a high rate of seatbelt use, etc. Which is partly why a lot of traditional canvassing/GOTV techniques should be scrapped, particularly the ones using old, annoying, and avoidable technologies.
There are hordes of people who are vaguely OK with and naturally drawn to Democratic views (especially when presented without that branding), and then there's the somewhat smaller group who are inherently hostile to those views and probably always will be. All you really have to do is to get that first group up off their asses using methods that don't make them say "FUCK YOU; leave me alone" in the process.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Oh, don't sell yourself short Tales. You can do it!
"Thatblack Obama, he doesn't know what it means to be a Real Man. Bad guys like North Korea could never take him seriously. Plus he blinked in Syria, the pansy. I would've done it better. No one'll fuck with us now that white men real Americans are in charge again.
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
"That
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Hopefully The Whelk and his DSA comrades are successful in making the Democratic Party over into an organization that could use L'Internationale... but, well, even in the best-case scenario that's going to take some time.
24,000 national members as of yesterday.
*shines red pin*
posted by The Whelk at 5:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
24,000 national members as of yesterday.
*shines red pin*
posted by The Whelk at 5:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
I've thought for years that a massive New Deal style investment in infrastructure and education would be a great way to help ease the transition into a more automated economy
So did Obama. So did Clinton. The Republicans won't do it.
posted by Justinian at 5:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
So did Obama. So did Clinton. The Republicans won't do it.
posted by Justinian at 5:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [26 favorites]
All you really have to do is to get that first group up off their asses using methods that don't make them say "FUCK YOU; leave me alone" in the process.
Which, along with gross bigotry, is a big reason why the GOP is all about suppression and barriers to access.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:52 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Which, along with gross bigotry, is a big reason why the GOP is all about suppression and barriers to access.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:52 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
I actually think the "Americans like fast food" narrative is manufactured, it's an advertisement version of America. In my experience, once people are out of puberty, they eat fast food because it is fast and because it is good, but the foods they eat are ones they would rather eat in a different way if given the choice.
Yeah, I might have agreed with you from my place growing up middle class-upper middle class. I grew up with a lot of fast food, because my mom was working and getting her PhD.
But then I see my husband's working class white family, where fast food is a splurge, what you get when you "eat out." I honestly never, ever saw them go out to a sit-down restaurant once. It was "tonight is cheap large pizza night" or "two for 1 burgers at Sonic" or whatever. That was the weekly treat.
It was even more the case in the poor families of color I worked with as a social worker. A bucket of fried chicken or a pizza was a HUGE deal for the family, a major Occasion. The kids would react like it was Christmas.
So when we talk about fast food being cheap, I think you have to understand that for a lot of people, it ISN'T. Food in general has been going up and up in price while wages stay the same. And no matter what, you can find a way to feed a family at home that's cheaper than pretty much any fast food.
So yeah, when you sneer at people for liking fast food, talking about how much better a good steak or organically raised salad is, yeah it feels like a slap in the face. Because why don't you just suggest they drive a solid gold helicopter to work to avoid traffic, already.
posted by threeturtles at 5:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [75 favorites]
Yeah, I might have agreed with you from my place growing up middle class-upper middle class. I grew up with a lot of fast food, because my mom was working and getting her PhD.
But then I see my husband's working class white family, where fast food is a splurge, what you get when you "eat out." I honestly never, ever saw them go out to a sit-down restaurant once. It was "tonight is cheap large pizza night" or "two for 1 burgers at Sonic" or whatever. That was the weekly treat.
It was even more the case in the poor families of color I worked with as a social worker. A bucket of fried chicken or a pizza was a HUGE deal for the family, a major Occasion. The kids would react like it was Christmas.
So when we talk about fast food being cheap, I think you have to understand that for a lot of people, it ISN'T. Food in general has been going up and up in price while wages stay the same. And no matter what, you can find a way to feed a family at home that's cheaper than pretty much any fast food.
So yeah, when you sneer at people for liking fast food, talking about how much better a good steak or organically raised salad is, yeah it feels like a slap in the face. Because why don't you just suggest they drive a solid gold helicopter to work to avoid traffic, already.
posted by threeturtles at 5:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [75 favorites]
The Hill: DeVos tells ALEC that protests against her are "a badge of honor". Let us hope she receives many additional plaudits in future.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
"Healthcare. You deserve better."
"Job Security. You deserve better."
"Leadership. You deserve better."
"You deserve better. Vote Democrat."
posted by CCBC at 6:05 PM on July 20, 2017 [42 favorites]
"Job Security. You deserve better."
"Leadership. You deserve better."
"You deserve better. Vote Democrat."
posted by CCBC at 6:05 PM on July 20, 2017 [42 favorites]
"You Deserve Better. Believe in Better. Vote for a Better Deal. Vote for ____."
posted by Mental Wimp at 6:08 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by Mental Wimp at 6:08 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Hey here's an idea. Why not set up a clinic that gives away free birth control and don't try to attach it to the criminal justice system
That is not "birth control", that's eugenics. "Keep the unfit from breeding." Theodore Roosevelt would approve: "I wish very much that the wrong people could be prevented entirely from breeding; and when the evil nature of these people is sufficiently flagrant, this should be done. Criminals should be sterilised and feeble-minded persons forbidden to leave offspring behind them".
It's certainly much worse than unconstitutional.
posted by Pseudonymous Cognomen at 6:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
That is not "birth control", that's eugenics. "Keep the unfit from breeding." Theodore Roosevelt would approve: "I wish very much that the wrong people could be prevented entirely from breeding; and when the evil nature of these people is sufficiently flagrant, this should be done. Criminals should be sterilised and feeble-minded persons forbidden to leave offspring behind them".
It's certainly much worse than unconstitutional.
posted by Pseudonymous Cognomen at 6:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
"Healthcare. You deserve better."
"Job Security. You deserve better."
"Leadership. You deserve better."
"You deserve better. Vote Democrat."
The last you should become a We
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 6:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
"Job Security. You deserve better."
"Leadership. You deserve better."
"You deserve better. Vote Democrat."
The last you should become a We
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 6:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Michael S. Schmidt, Maggie Haberman and Matt Apuzzo, NYT; Trump Aides, Seeking Leverage, Investigate Mueller’s Investigators
President Trump’s lawyers and aides are scouring the professional and political backgrounds of investigators hired by the special counsel Robert S. Mueller III, looking for conflicts of interest they could use to discredit the investigation — or even build a case to fire Mr. Mueller or get some members of his team recused, according to three people with knowledge of the research effort.posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 6:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
The search for potential conflicts is wide-ranging. It includes scrutinizing donations to Democratic candidates, investigators’ past clients and Mr. Mueller’s relationship with James B. Comey, whose firing as F.B.I. director is part of the special counsel’s investigation.
I 'm already visualizing the ad.
You deserve better healthcare.
You deserve better job opportunities.
You deserve better leadership.
Believe in Better. Vote Democrat.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
You deserve better healthcare.
You deserve better job opportunities.
You deserve better leadership.
Believe in Better. Vote Democrat.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
The good thing about all these slogans is that we can use our favorite ones ourselves, even if the DNC picks a lousy one.
Use them in conversations with your family. Get together with your Indivisible friends and rent a billboard off your local highway exit. Go into the comments on viral Facebook posts and use your slogan there. Make a meme and post it all over reddit. Make a sign or a T shirt with your slogan on it and go to a march.
"The Democrats" are us. We can do whatever we want.
posted by OnceUponATime at 6:23 PM on July 20, 2017 [73 favorites]
Use them in conversations with your family. Get together with your Indivisible friends and rent a billboard off your local highway exit. Go into the comments on viral Facebook posts and use your slogan there. Make a meme and post it all over reddit. Make a sign or a T shirt with your slogan on it and go to a march.
"The Democrats" are us. We can do whatever we want.
posted by OnceUponATime at 6:23 PM on July 20, 2017 [73 favorites]
I hope Trump starts pardoning people. People who are pardoned can no longer plead the Fifth when subpoenaed, and (barring executive privilege) must tell the whole truth or perjure themselves. (Or else be pardoned again.) (Which would hopefully speed up any looming possibility of impeachment.)
I care relatively little whether people go to jail. I care about having the truth revealed, and most of all I care about Trump leaving office as soon as possible.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
I care relatively little whether people go to jail. I care about having the truth revealed, and most of all I care about Trump leaving office as soon as possible.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:28 PM on July 20, 2017 [18 favorites]
Everyone hold onto your underpants, Trump is about to take the bull in a china shop approach to make the investigation go away.
Please proceed!
posted by lydhre at 6:30 PM on July 20, 2017
Please proceed!
posted by lydhre at 6:30 PM on July 20, 2017
But a lot of people like fast food and resent being told it is crap. For them, Trump eating McDonalds on a private plane sends the message "McDonalds is good enough for class rich people like Trump. There is nothing wrong with you liking McDonalds."
I think the issue with this argument and with all these arguments is that while I'm sure a huge number of conservatives feel that their food choices or their language or their dress or their weight or whatever has been dumped on by liberals, that is categorically not the case.
It might be that hipsters in Brooklyn do have strong feelings about Iowans eating at McDonalds. But they don't go to Iowa and express them.
What actually happens is that Fox News and Rush Limbaugh spend a great deal of time talking to conservatives who've never seen a hipster from Brooklyn about how much hipsters from Brooklyn and college professors and the contestants on RuPaul's Drag Race like to sit around making fun of conservative yokels.
There's literally no amount of accomodating you could do for steak-ketchupers or Big Mac mackers that would actually reach them. Because you weren't making fun of them in a way that they could see anyway (unless DJT's hanging out in these threads looking for our commentary on his condiments).
posted by TheProfessor at 6:31 PM on July 20, 2017 [31 favorites]
I think the issue with this argument and with all these arguments is that while I'm sure a huge number of conservatives feel that their food choices or their language or their dress or their weight or whatever has been dumped on by liberals, that is categorically not the case.
It might be that hipsters in Brooklyn do have strong feelings about Iowans eating at McDonalds. But they don't go to Iowa and express them.
What actually happens is that Fox News and Rush Limbaugh spend a great deal of time talking to conservatives who've never seen a hipster from Brooklyn about how much hipsters from Brooklyn and college professors and the contestants on RuPaul's Drag Race like to sit around making fun of conservative yokels.
There's literally no amount of accomodating you could do for steak-ketchupers or Big Mac mackers that would actually reach them. Because you weren't making fun of them in a way that they could see anyway (unless DJT's hanging out in these threads looking for our commentary on his condiments).
posted by TheProfessor at 6:31 PM on July 20, 2017 [31 favorites]
But one adviser said the president has simply expressed a curiosity in understanding the reach of his pardoning authority,
Asking for a friend.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [44 favorites]
Asking for a friend.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [44 favorites]
Six months to the day. He made it six months before having to inquire into the extent of his pardon powers (possibly relating to family members and/or himself).
Just. Six. Months.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 6:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [56 favorites]
Just. Six. Months.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 6:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [56 favorites]
I wonder if a presidential pardon for an alleged federal crime can serve as probable cause for an investigation of a related state crime...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
It just occurred to me that Mad Max Fury Road was merely a peek, from the innocent days of 2015, into the near future. Way too near, as it turns out. Hopefully we'll get the happy ending.
posted by maxwelton at 6:39 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by maxwelton at 6:39 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Just. Six. Months.
I would've been asking about my pardon powers on day one if I were him. (But also if I weren't him. You get a pardon, you get a pardon, everybody gets a pardon! would basically be my campaign platform)
posted by dis_integration at 6:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
I would've been asking about my pardon powers on day one if I were him. (But also if I weren't him. You get a pardon, you get a pardon, everybody gets a pardon! would basically be my campaign platform)
posted by dis_integration at 6:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Getting a blowjob and working with a foreign adversarial government are totally the same, people!
posted by Talez at 6:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [37 favorites]
posted by Talez at 6:49 PM on July 20, 2017 [37 favorites]
Is the blue at the point where one can say:
88 lines? Surely this.....
Or does the blue have to wait till midterms are over?
posted by rough ashlar at 6:55 PM on July 20, 2017
88 lines? Surely this.....
Or does the blue have to wait till midterms are over?
posted by rough ashlar at 6:55 PM on July 20, 2017
I hope Trump starts pardoning people. People who are pardoned can no longer plead the Fifth when subpoenaed, and (barring executive privilege) must tell the whole truth or perjure themselves. (Or else be pardoned again.) (Which would hopefully speed up any looming possibility of impeachment.)
Again, Republicans will never impeach Trump. Never. Ever. Ever. The only way to get impeachment is to win back the House. That's it. Maybe a big enough Democratic wave would instill enough fear in Senate Republicans to consider a removal vote in the Senate, but I have my doubts even still. But the only way it's even concieveable is if Democrats have the House. Nearly every Republican would applaud him pardoning the entire administration, and the few that didn't would have "some concerns".
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:07 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Again, Republicans will never impeach Trump. Never. Ever. Ever. The only way to get impeachment is to win back the House. That's it. Maybe a big enough Democratic wave would instill enough fear in Senate Republicans to consider a removal vote in the Senate, but I have my doubts even still. But the only way it's even concieveable is if Democrats have the House. Nearly every Republican would applaud him pardoning the entire administration, and the few that didn't would have "some concerns".
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:07 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Noah Schachtman loves making people watch prestige TV shows he's already seen and telling them this next part is just so crazy
posted by theodolite at 7:07 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 7:07 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
I'm not surprised at all the Trump et al have had discussions about his pardon powers. I would be shocked if they didn't. I'm surprised that people who know about these discussions decided to let the outside world know about them. By now I shouldn't be surprised because people have consistently been blabbing about what is going inside to such an extent that it's almost a base assumption that we're going to find out these things. It is not normal though.
Thankfully this is set of norms that this admin has decided to stomp all over that ends up being a good thing in the end.
So thanks Trump I guess...
posted by Jalliah at 7:10 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Noah Schachtman loves making people watch prestige TV shows he's already seen and telling them this next part is just so crazy
@DylanDevenyi
Replying to @NoahShachtman
What do you know you tick tick ticking codswallop
posted by Celsius1414 at 7:12 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
@DylanDevenyi
Replying to @NoahShachtman
What do you know you tick tick ticking codswallop
posted by Celsius1414 at 7:12 PM on July 20, 2017 [16 favorites]
I think it might be this one, lalex...
Damian Paletta and Carol Morello, WaPo; The strange legal battle that is pitting Trump’s secretaries of the Treasury and State against each other
Damian Paletta and Carol Morello, WaPo; The strange legal battle that is pitting Trump’s secretaries of the Treasury and State against each other
Two of President Trump’s most senior cabinet members became embroiled Thursday in an unusual legal battle over whether ExxonMobil under Secretary of State Rex Tillerson’s leadership violated U.S. sanctions against Russia.posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 7:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Treasury officials fined ExxonMobil $2 million Thursday morning for signing eight business agreements in 2014 with Igor Sechin, the chief executive of Rosneft, an energy giant partially owned by the Russian government. The business agreements came less than a month after the United States banned companies from doing business with him.
Come on guys I'm sure the Republican congresspeople will say tomorrow that they are "concerned" and "troubled" about these reports.
posted by gatorae at 7:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 7:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
No, it's this article about Microsoft using the courts to shut down Russian hacker urls. Not exactly the Red Wedding, Noah
posted by theodolite at 7:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 7:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
The only way to get impeachment is to win back the House. That's it.
Just wait. 2018 will come around, and the Dems will eke out a narrow margin in one of the branches of Congress, and they'll be all "Well, we CAN'T do anything that might JEOPARDIZE 2020!"
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 7:17 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Just wait. 2018 will come around, and the Dems will eke out a narrow margin in one of the branches of Congress, and they'll be all "Well, we CAN'T do anything that might JEOPARDIZE 2020!"
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 7:17 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Trump is aiming to turn the federal government into a much more militaristic and paramilitary policing organization.
No major news organization has reported on the three-page directive from Mick Mulvaney, Trump’s director of the White House Office of Management and Budget (OMB).
posted by adamvasco at 7:18 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
No major news organization has reported on the three-page directive from Mick Mulvaney, Trump’s director of the White House Office of Management and Budget (OMB).
posted by adamvasco at 7:18 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
But a lot of people like fast food and resent being told it is crap. For them, Trump eating McDonalds on a private plane sends the message "McDonalds is good enough for class rich people like Trump. There is nothing wrong with you liking McDonalds."
Also don't forget how Obama's smoking completely shielded him from the criticism. Almost like a super power.
posted by srboisvert at 7:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Also don't forget how Obama's smoking completely shielded him from the criticism. Almost like a super power.
posted by srboisvert at 7:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
If Trump fries Mueller, could the Whistleblower Law protect him?
Why would a "law" no one seems to care about and a class of people no one cares about suddenly become relevant?
posted by rough ashlar at 7:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Why would a "law" no one seems to care about and a class of people no one cares about suddenly become relevant?
posted by rough ashlar at 7:21 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Honestly, the Democrats should come up with a slogan that essentially says "We're the party of effective elected government." Appeals to the middle, true, and a stark contrast to the shenanigans going on now.
FTFY.
posted by nickmark at 7:23 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
FTFY.
posted by nickmark at 7:23 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
We... already spend a huge chunk of our budget on military and paramilitary operations?
But yeah, I'm sure it's going to get worse
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:24 PM on July 20, 2017
But yeah, I'm sure it's going to get worse
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:24 PM on July 20, 2017
The Microsoft story is pretty interesting though.
posted by triggerfinger at 7:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [53 favorites]
Since August, Microsoft has used the lawsuit to wrest control of 70 different command-and-control points from Fancy Bear. The company’s approach is indirect, but effective. Rather than getting physical custody of the servers, which Fancy Bear rents from data centers around the world, Microsoft has been taking over the Internet domain names that route to them. These are addresses like “livemicrosoft[.]net” or “rsshotmail[.]com” that Fancy Bear registers under aliases for about $10 each. Once under Microsoft’s control, the domains get redirected from Russia’s servers to the company’s, cutting off the hackers from their victims, and giving Microsoft a omniscient view of that servers’ network of automated spies.Save us...Microsoft?
“In other words,” Microsoft outside counsel Sten Jenson explained in a court filing last year, “any time an infected computer attempts to contact a command-and-control server through one of the domains, it will instead be connected to a Microsoft-controlled, secure server.”
posted by triggerfinger at 7:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [53 favorites]
There are multiple reports that Mark Corallo, spokesman for Trump’s legal team, has resigned after two months. According to Josh Dawsey writing in Politico:
posted by vac2003 at 7:29 PM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
Mark Corallo, the spokesman, had grown frustrated with the operation and the warring factions and lawyers, these people said. Corallo also was concerned about whether he was being told the truth about various matters, one of these people said.Why anyone would sign up to work for Trump is utterly beyond me.
...
Corallo had told an associate that the dynamics in the White House were untenable and that there was "too much fighting all the time," in the words of one person who spoke to him.
posted by vac2003 at 7:29 PM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
Mother Jones: Trump is curious about his pardoning power
It quotes a few different news agencies but I'm having a hard time copying and pasting with my phone rn
posted by gucci mane at 7:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
It quotes a few different news agencies but I'm having a hard time copying and pasting with my phone rn
posted by gucci mane at 7:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Responding to a very old comment:
Trump is a raging narcissist who, for all our sakes, sorely needs to learn humility.
I see comments like this all the time. And articles. "WHAT TRUMP NEEDS TO LEARN."
It's important to remember something here: Raging Narcissists DO NOT LEARN THINGS. They already think they know everything, they're smarter than everyone else, and there is no human being on earth who can teach them anything.
Trump might "discover" something every now and then ("Nobody knew healthcare was so complicated.") but he's not going to learn humility. He's not going to learn to be polite, or to be presidential, or to listen to advisors.
STOP TRYING TO TEACH TRUMP TO BE A HUMAN BEING and just get him out of there.
posted by mmoncur at 7:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [63 favorites]
Trump is a raging narcissist who, for all our sakes, sorely needs to learn humility.
I see comments like this all the time. And articles. "WHAT TRUMP NEEDS TO LEARN."
It's important to remember something here: Raging Narcissists DO NOT LEARN THINGS. They already think they know everything, they're smarter than everyone else, and there is no human being on earth who can teach them anything.
Trump might "discover" something every now and then ("Nobody knew healthcare was so complicated.") but he's not going to learn humility. He's not going to learn to be polite, or to be presidential, or to listen to advisors.
STOP TRYING TO TEACH TRUMP TO BE A HUMAN BEING and just get him out of there.
posted by mmoncur at 7:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [63 favorites]
No major news organization has reported on the three-page directive from Mick Mulvaney, Trump’s director of the White House Office of Management and Budget (OMB).
[Googles "mulvaney july budget memo"]
AP story on 7/7: "Trump’s next budget hopes to eliminate some federal agencies"
This is why I don't get my news from AlterNet.
posted by neroli at 7:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
[Googles "mulvaney july budget memo"]
AP story on 7/7: "Trump’s next budget hopes to eliminate some federal agencies"
This is why I don't get my news from AlterNet.
posted by neroli at 7:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Corallo also was concerned about whether he was being told the truth about various matters
Ron Howard: He wasn't.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
Ron Howard: He wasn't.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [21 favorites]
The time for any Republicans who haven't sold their souls to speak is now. One of the leakers is almost certainly Trump himself, if anything we know about him holds true to form. He's probing the response to preemptive pardons. He wants to see how far he can really go. Silence from Repunlcisns signals their assent and agreement. If we see no push back tomorrow and this weekend (stop laughing), just mortgage your house and everything you own, fly to Vegas and put it all on Trump firing Mueller and pardoning everyone including himself.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Honestly, the Democrats should come up with a slogan that essentially says "We're the party of effective government."
How about "Government that Works" or "Government that works for you"?
I still think "America Deserves Better" is the winner here though.
posted by mmoncur at 7:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
How about "Government that Works" or "Government that works for you"?
I still think "America Deserves Better" is the winner here though.
posted by mmoncur at 7:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
From the post article about he pardoning:
Some Republicans in frequent touch with the White House said they viewed the president’s decision to publicly air his disappointment with Sessions as a warning sign that the attorney general’s days were numbered. Several senior aides were described as “stunned” when Sessions announced Thursday morning he would stay on at the Justice Department.
Translation: We sent Trump to the interview knowing he was going to do this because we want the guy to resign and we can't fire him right now cause of how it will look. Fuck it didn't work. *grumble grumble* And we're talking all sneaky like to the press now about how we are 'stunned' in order to really let Sessions (and whoever is part of his faction) know that this faction is out to get him and more importantly that at this particular point in time we're the one that has Trump's ear.
- signed B, S and/or K, possibly a lawyer or lawyer spox.
Result:
Sessions comes back with a fuck you. I know how this works, you think I don't know how this guy works? I helped make him run you dipshits. I am calling your bluff. Screw off.
Hey Mister President can we have a chat?
Trump after this convo: I lurvs you Jeff of course i need you to stick around.
A while later after the 'stunned' people chat with Trump.
'Fuck you Jeff I hate you'.
Rinse and repeat.
posted by Jalliah at 7:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Some Republicans in frequent touch with the White House said they viewed the president’s decision to publicly air his disappointment with Sessions as a warning sign that the attorney general’s days were numbered. Several senior aides were described as “stunned” when Sessions announced Thursday morning he would stay on at the Justice Department.
Translation: We sent Trump to the interview knowing he was going to do this because we want the guy to resign and we can't fire him right now cause of how it will look. Fuck it didn't work. *grumble grumble* And we're talking all sneaky like to the press now about how we are 'stunned' in order to really let Sessions (and whoever is part of his faction) know that this faction is out to get him and more importantly that at this particular point in time we're the one that has Trump's ear.
- signed B, S and/or K, possibly a lawyer or lawyer spox.
Result:
Sessions comes back with a fuck you. I know how this works, you think I don't know how this guy works? I helped make him run you dipshits. I am calling your bluff. Screw off.
Hey Mister President can we have a chat?
Trump after this convo: I lurvs you Jeff of course i need you to stick around.
A while later after the 'stunned' people chat with Trump.
'Fuck you Jeff I hate you'.
Rinse and repeat.
posted by Jalliah at 7:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
Anyone?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:36 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:36 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
I still think "America Deserves Better" is the winner here though.
I guess the talk of the l'internationale is over but I'm sticking with "arise ye wretched of the earth" for 2020
posted by dis_integration at 7:38 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
I guess the talk of the l'internationale is over but I'm sticking with "arise ye wretched of the earth" for 2020
posted by dis_integration at 7:38 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
"skills" is a dogwhistle;
I've met many members of humanity. Some of 'em are as dumb as a wet rock and "skills" are not something they are able to have. The job they have is the best they are ever gonna get.
Tech may replace half of all low-skilled jobs in the U.S.. Lets say for the sake of argument that you can "better skill" every one of these 'displaced' workers. Doesn't that mean the proxy for 'low skill' is, say, $8 an hour workers will suddenly be an option for the, say $25 an hour higher skilled person? This influx of 'better skills' - what is that gonna do to the rate paid for a 'higher skilled' person? Won't that push the $25 an hour job down?
Automation/AI is gonna be a bloodbath. This "better skills" idea is just gonna translate to 4 years of "the donald". Perhaps 8. Better start getting comfortable in that ever warming handbasket.
posted by rough ashlar at 7:39 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
I've met many members of humanity. Some of 'em are as dumb as a wet rock and "skills" are not something they are able to have. The job they have is the best they are ever gonna get.
Tech may replace half of all low-skilled jobs in the U.S.. Lets say for the sake of argument that you can "better skill" every one of these 'displaced' workers. Doesn't that mean the proxy for 'low skill' is, say, $8 an hour workers will suddenly be an option for the, say $25 an hour higher skilled person? This influx of 'better skills' - what is that gonna do to the rate paid for a 'higher skilled' person? Won't that push the $25 an hour job down?
Automation/AI is gonna be a bloodbath. This "better skills" idea is just gonna translate to 4 years of "the donald". Perhaps 8. Better start getting comfortable in that ever warming handbasket.
posted by rough ashlar at 7:39 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
I guess the talk of the l'internationale is over but I'm sticking with "arise ye wretched of the earth" for 2020
How about "ye are many, they are few"?
posted by Frowner at 7:39 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
How about "ye are many, they are few"?
posted by Frowner at 7:39 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Rise like lions after slumber, shake your chains to earth like dew
That in sleep had fallen on you - ye are many, they are few!
Like beautiful maggots inside rotten apples, spitting out the juices of Kings and big-arsed Barons...Take from the rich and give to the poor, take from the rich and give to the poor
posted by Frowner at 7:43 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
That in sleep had fallen on you - ye are many, they are few!
Like beautiful maggots inside rotten apples, spitting out the juices of Kings and big-arsed Barons...Take from the rich and give to the poor, take from the rich and give to the poor
posted by Frowner at 7:43 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Question for those that know US history and constitutional wonkery more than I do. Why was/is the position of the President, and other positions like a governor, given the power to pardon without what looks to me like a whole lot of checks on it being used for nefarious reasons.
Where did this idea come from?
posted by Jalliah at 7:46 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
18th century monarchism
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:47 PM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:47 PM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
Oh great. @maggienyt: Scaramucci expected to be named comms director in coming days - open question whether Priebus tries to stop it.
Reports of fandango are unconfirmed.
posted by zachlipton at 7:48 PM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
Reports of fandango are unconfirmed.
posted by zachlipton at 7:48 PM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
We clearly need to prepare ourselves for the eventuality that Trump fires Mueller AND pardons himself and everyone else and Republicans in Congress do absolutely nothing about it. Nothing at all. Sigh of relief. Move past it. Get back to "leading" and "America" or whatever.
Seriously, we're going to have South Korea-style protests where nobody leaves the streets until shit actually changes, right?
Right?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 7:52 PM on July 20, 2017 [39 favorites]
Seriously, we're going to have South Korea-style protests where nobody leaves the streets until shit actually changes, right?
Right?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 7:52 PM on July 20, 2017 [39 favorites]
How long is it going to take to clear all this shit up?
Trump Nominates Climate-Denying, Conservative Talk Show Host as USDA's Top Scientist.
Clovis appears to have no published scientific or academic work to his name.
posted by adamvasco at 7:52 PM on July 20, 2017 [34 favorites]
Trump Nominates Climate-Denying, Conservative Talk Show Host as USDA's Top Scientist.
Clovis appears to have no published scientific or academic work to his name.
posted by adamvasco at 7:52 PM on July 20, 2017 [34 favorites]
Putin's failure to wean Russia off oil will destroy the nation's economy.
Oil isn't somehow important? Or won't be? Is that why theoildrum.com closed years ago?
Lets say oil doesn't matter. Russia has alot of land. Energy and processed goods via energy will still be of value and Russia controls a whole lotta surface to gather solar to convert to electricity and food. The not-lit-up-by-the-sun parts translate into goods once processed.
How much of the Russian economy relies of the Ruble being the international means of exchange? What happens if your "money" stops being the way trading between nations gets settled?
posted by rough ashlar at 7:53 PM on July 20, 2017
Oil isn't somehow important? Or won't be? Is that why theoildrum.com closed years ago?
Lets say oil doesn't matter. Russia has alot of land. Energy and processed goods via energy will still be of value and Russia controls a whole lotta surface to gather solar to convert to electricity and food. The not-lit-up-by-the-sun parts translate into goods once processed.
How much of the Russian economy relies of the Ruble being the international means of exchange? What happens if your "money" stops being the way trading between nations gets settled?
posted by rough ashlar at 7:53 PM on July 20, 2017
If we protest in the streets then we'll probably be charged with terrorism and then have our assets taken away by Sessions in civil forfeiture.
posted by gatorae at 7:58 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 7:58 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
In case your rage wasn't white-hot and mouth-foaming enough already, Team Trump plans to start their big beautiful wall by plowing through the "crown jewel of the national wildlife refuge system."
excellent work by Melissa del Bosque of the terrific Texas Observer.
posted by martin q blank at 7:58 PM on July 20, 2017 [40 favorites]
excellent work by Melissa del Bosque of the terrific Texas Observer.
posted by martin q blank at 7:58 PM on July 20, 2017 [40 favorites]
We’re on the Brink of an Authoritarian Crisis
Republicans have given every indication over the course of the past several months that no malfeasance, no matter how naked and severe, will impel them to rein in Trump or impeach him. ...
If this crisis unfolds as depicted here, the country’s final hope for avoiding a terminal slide into authoritarianism would be the midterm election, contesting control of a historically gerrymandered House of Representatives. That election is 16 months away. Over that time, Trump’s DOJ and his sham election-integrity commission will seek to disenfranchise as many Democratic voters as possible, while the president himself beseeches further foreign interference aimed at Democratic candidates. Absent the necessary sweep, everything Trump will have done to degrade our system for his own enrichment and protection will have been ratified, and a point of no return will have been crossed.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
Republicans have given every indication over the course of the past several months that no malfeasance, no matter how naked and severe, will impel them to rein in Trump or impeach him. ...
If this crisis unfolds as depicted here, the country’s final hope for avoiding a terminal slide into authoritarianism would be the midterm election, contesting control of a historically gerrymandered House of Representatives. That election is 16 months away. Over that time, Trump’s DOJ and his sham election-integrity commission will seek to disenfranchise as many Democratic voters as possible, while the president himself beseeches further foreign interference aimed at Democratic candidates. Absent the necessary sweep, everything Trump will have done to degrade our system for his own enrichment and protection will have been ratified, and a point of no return will have been crossed.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:16 PM on July 20, 2017 [32 favorites]
Question for those that know US history and constitutional wonkery more than I do. Why was/is the position of the President, and other positions like a governor, given the power to pardon without what looks to me like a whole lot of checks on it being used for nefarious reasons.
It derives from the Royal Prerogative.
The way I see the current constitutional framework is that each coequal branch of government has certain powers which are legally unquestionable. The executive branch has the unquestioned ability to pardon federal crimes. The legislative branch has the unquestioned ability to impeach and remove federal officials, including the President or Chief Justice. And the judicial branch has the unquestioned ability to interpret the law. In this sense, any abusive actions by one branch can in theory be fixed by the unquestionable powers of another branch. In theory.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:22 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
It derives from the Royal Prerogative.
The way I see the current constitutional framework is that each coequal branch of government has certain powers which are legally unquestionable. The executive branch has the unquestioned ability to pardon federal crimes. The legislative branch has the unquestioned ability to impeach and remove federal officials, including the President or Chief Justice. And the judicial branch has the unquestioned ability to interpret the law. In this sense, any abusive actions by one branch can in theory be fixed by the unquestionable powers of another branch. In theory.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:22 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
dis_integration: Trouble is people who are already upset at being called "Deplorable" are unlikely to cotton to being "Wretched". And they are currently opposed to "the wretched refuse" that yearns to be free, so...
Meanwhile, Tucker Carlson and chickens: "What's this? Some bow-tie pencil-neck telling me that he won't eat chicken? He doesn't eat the nuggets with the head on, does he? Maybe he's a Vegemite or something. You know, maybe he thinks people should eat McDonald's off a plate!"
posted by CCBC at 8:24 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
Meanwhile, Tucker Carlson and chickens: "What's this? Some bow-tie pencil-neck telling me that he won't eat chicken? He doesn't eat the nuggets with the head on, does he? Maybe he's a Vegemite or something. You know, maybe he thinks people should eat McDonald's off a plate!"
posted by CCBC at 8:24 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
I'm glad he's keeping Sekulow. There is no odious manifestly self-contradictory charity-fraudster piece of shit more appropriate to represent our President.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
Come on guys I'm sure the Republican congresspeople will say tomorrow that they are "concerned" and "troubled" about these reports.
Concerned and troubled about the reports getting into the news, that is...
posted by SisterHavana at 8:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Concerned and troubled about the reports getting into the news, that is...
posted by SisterHavana at 8:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Any bets on how long Cobb will last? He told the Monster from the Id on Monday in no uncertain terms to shut his fucking piehole because it's time to impose some strict discipline, yata yata, so Trump trots right out and does the polar opposite with the NYT yesterday.
posted by FelliniBlank at 8:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 8:34 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
A lot of Ok-to-great sloganeering above, but really, stop pulling your punches. And if you're doing the [Title]: [Subtitle] thing, you can and should cycle through multiple variations.
Democrats 2018:
- A Better Deal: Hospitals, Schools, Roads
- A Better Deal: Education, Jobs, Retirement
- A Better Deal: Food, Water, Shelter
- A Better Deal: Community, Equality, Democracy
- A Better Deal: Mom, America, Apple Pie
- A Better Deal: Honor, Dignity, Respect
- A Better Deal: Impeachment, Indictment, Incarceration
Stop thinking so hard about it. It's just "Democrats: Stuff You Like." And that's not even dishonest, because that's what the party's trying to do.
I guess there's also "Democrats: A bunch of wonkish technocratic bikeshedding," which is an important thing to get out there for the narrow but influential demographic that cares about it, and also important in the sense that you'll need more than a sentence fragment to implement a successful policy. Still, not what you lead with.
Side note... The problem with "skills, jobs, wages" is definitely the "skills" bit, as it highlights the idea that people without jobs are somehow inadequate, and need step up their game if they're to expect a place in society. This is both true and unfair, which is the worst possible combination. It's a "take your medicine" thing, which is another thing you don't lead with.
posted by dirge at 8:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
Democrats 2018:
- A Better Deal: Hospitals, Schools, Roads
- A Better Deal: Education, Jobs, Retirement
- A Better Deal: Food, Water, Shelter
- A Better Deal: Community, Equality, Democracy
- A Better Deal: Mom, America, Apple Pie
- A Better Deal: Honor, Dignity, Respect
- A Better Deal: Impeachment, Indictment, Incarceration
Stop thinking so hard about it. It's just "Democrats: Stuff You Like." And that's not even dishonest, because that's what the party's trying to do.
I guess there's also "Democrats: A bunch of wonkish technocratic bikeshedding," which is an important thing to get out there for the narrow but influential demographic that cares about it, and also important in the sense that you'll need more than a sentence fragment to implement a successful policy. Still, not what you lead with.
Side note... The problem with "skills, jobs, wages" is definitely the "skills" bit, as it highlights the idea that people without jobs are somehow inadequate, and need step up their game if they're to expect a place in society. This is both true and unfair, which is the worst possible combination. It's a "take your medicine" thing, which is another thing you don't lead with.
posted by dirge at 8:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [29 favorites]
I've long thought we could have this net neutrality debate licked if someone just started a rumor that Comcast wants to charge $100/mb for porn.
If we're starting rumors, I like "civil forfeiture is how the government plans to take your guns"
posted by ctmf at 8:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [65 favorites]
If we're starting rumors, I like "civil forfeiture is how the government plans to take your guns"
posted by ctmf at 8:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [65 favorites]
the real problem at the heart of this is that nationwide health care policy is not a menu you can pick and choose from;
When I was young you could not get a price quote from a car repair place. "Oh we don't know how much this will cost".
Yet, somehow, today when I ask for a quote to fix a problem on a car I can get a 'costs this much' quote. How did that happen? Oh yea, a law was passed that ordered fixed price quoting.
But hey, if you are worried about your health care costs go ahead....ask for a quote before the "labor" is done on your healthcare. I can't seem to get a fixed quote in my market - how about you? (how are you gonna get that iPhone eh?)
Hell, that contract they want you to sign where you agree to pay the rate per the 'quotebook' (or whatever the hell they call it) ASK TO SEE THAT BOOK the day you are ask to sign it. I know damned well when I asked it was not provided. And I know damned well when I went to record the interaction for "proof" I was told I could not because "HIPPA".
posted by rough ashlar at 8:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
When I was young you could not get a price quote from a car repair place. "Oh we don't know how much this will cost".
Yet, somehow, today when I ask for a quote to fix a problem on a car I can get a 'costs this much' quote. How did that happen? Oh yea, a law was passed that ordered fixed price quoting.
But hey, if you are worried about your health care costs go ahead....ask for a quote before the "labor" is done on your healthcare. I can't seem to get a fixed quote in my market - how about you? (how are you gonna get that iPhone eh?)
Hell, that contract they want you to sign where you agree to pay the rate per the 'quotebook' (or whatever the hell they call it) ASK TO SEE THAT BOOK the day you are ask to sign it. I know damned well when I asked it was not provided. And I know damned well when I went to record the interaction for "proof" I was told I could not because "HIPPA".
posted by rough ashlar at 8:37 PM on July 20, 2017 [12 favorites]
I feel like you could trim down "A Better Deal" to "Better".
Democrats 2018: Better.
And then you use it to describe every one of your policies: the Republicans say they have a great healthcare deal. We have a better one. Obamacare's not working, they say? We'll make it better.
Also kind of difficult for Republicans to attack because either they have to define 'better than what', which they won't do because that would involve substance, or it can be turned around to say 'well better than Reagan, look how bad he was at this'.
May not help the perception of Democrats as being smug but compared to the Republicans how could you not be
posted by Merus at 8:38 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Democrats 2018: Better.
And then you use it to describe every one of your policies: the Republicans say they have a great healthcare deal. We have a better one. Obamacare's not working, they say? We'll make it better.
Also kind of difficult for Republicans to attack because either they have to define 'better than what', which they won't do because that would involve substance, or it can be turned around to say 'well better than Reagan, look how bad he was at this'.
May not help the perception of Democrats as being smug but compared to the Republicans how could you not be
posted by Merus at 8:38 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
From way upthread, but THIS rankles and hard. We, white straight men, are dying in greater numbers and in greater proportion than gay men during the AIDS crisis, and Republican leaders don't care in similar proportion, as the dying are working or middle class. The hell of it is it's not a simple thing like "Don't do drugs!" - people who have never touched a drop or an ounce or a pill are still suiciding at an epidemic rate. No one cares. Not the Allies we've been fighting for on the left. Not the Kommisars we've been voting for in lockstep on the right. We deserve to die as we are worthless is the message we're getting, and believe me, it's come in loud and clear.
The first one to fix this wins. Empathy is not a zero sum game. It's the opposite.
Yup, and it's worth remembering that the current opioid epidemic is affecting more Whites than minorities.
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:40 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
The first one to fix this wins. Empathy is not a zero sum game. It's the opposite.
Yup, and it's worth remembering that the current opioid epidemic is affecting more Whites than minorities.
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:40 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Some Republicans in frequent touch with the White House said they viewed the president’s decision to publicly air his disappointment with Sessions as a warning sign that the attorney general’s days were numbered.
Why does anyone still think this? Trump doesn't humiliate and trash his minions to get rid of them or as a prelude to canning them, necessarily. It's just part of every Trump employee's job description: to be publicly debased anytime he's in the mood or feels the need to unload randomly on someone. Just ask Spicey. Nixon meatloaf is the White House blue plate special every day.
posted by FelliniBlank at 8:42 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Why does anyone still think this? Trump doesn't humiliate and trash his minions to get rid of them or as a prelude to canning them, necessarily. It's just part of every Trump employee's job description: to be publicly debased anytime he's in the mood or feels the need to unload randomly on someone. Just ask Spicey. Nixon meatloaf is the White House blue plate special every day.
posted by FelliniBlank at 8:42 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Wow, Kasowitz is out.
We won't see you. We promise. Bro.
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:43 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
We won't see you. We promise. Bro.
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:43 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Wow, Kasowitz is out.
So Sessions gets fired and it's Kasowitz for new AG?
Kidding. Sort of.
posted by Jalliah at 8:44 PM on July 20, 2017 [2 favorites]
I've thought for years that a massive New Deal style investment in infrastructure .... The Republicans won't do it.
The version of "why vote for Trump" from Trump-supports was he was gonna work to get the infrastructure up to snuff? That was why these supporters thought Webster Tarpley and his infrastructure upgrade position was all wrong about the donald.
posted by rough ashlar at 8:53 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
The version of "why vote for Trump" from Trump-supports was he was gonna work to get the infrastructure up to snuff? That was why these supporters thought Webster Tarpley and his infrastructure upgrade position was all wrong about the donald.
posted by rough ashlar at 8:53 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
I've long thought we could have this net neutrality debate licked if someone just started a rumor that Comcast wants to charge $100/mb for porn.
If we're starting rumors, I like "civil forfeiture is how the government plans to take your guns"
Lot of folks who have never cared about Dr. Who before are suddenly very concerned. Maybe we should announce that climate change is a woman.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 8:59 PM on July 20, 2017 [36 favorites]
If we're starting rumors, I like "civil forfeiture is how the government plans to take your guns"
Lot of folks who have never cared about Dr. Who before are suddenly very concerned. Maybe we should announce that climate change is a woman.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 8:59 PM on July 20, 2017 [36 favorites]
They were like "Doctor who???"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:01 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:01 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
The hell of it is it's not a simple thing like "Don't do drugs!" - people who have never touched a drop or an ounce or a pill are still suiciding at an epidemic rate. No one cares. Not the Allies we've been fighting for on the left. Not the Kommisars we've been voting for in lockstep on the right. We deserve to die as we are worthless is the message we're getting, and believe me, it's come in loud and clear.
What are you talking about?
posted by runcibleshaw at 9:05 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
What are you talking about?
posted by runcibleshaw at 9:05 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
AMERICA DESERVES BETTER
Does it?
Does it deserve better because no human should be subjected to such? (and somehow this other choice will be beyond-measurement better)
Does it deserve better because the nation has been such a force for good overall that the present situation is unworthy of the overall greatness?
posted by rough ashlar at 9:07 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Does it?
Does it deserve better because no human should be subjected to such? (and somehow this other choice will be beyond-measurement better)
Does it deserve better because the nation has been such a force for good overall that the present situation is unworthy of the overall greatness?
posted by rough ashlar at 9:07 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Well, if we're still doing sloganeering:
Democrats 2018: That government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.
Democrats 2018: America is better than this.
Democrats 2018: If you like your Obamacare, you can keep it!
Democrats 2018: Somos todos Americanos!
posted by biogeo at 9:07 PM on July 20, 2017
Democrats 2018: That government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.
Democrats 2018: America is better than this.
Democrats 2018: If you like your Obamacare, you can keep it!
Democrats 2018: Somos todos Americanos!
posted by biogeo at 9:07 PM on July 20, 2017
I love the armchair campaign-crafting, but instead of talking about what the Democrats should do, please just do it. We are the Democrats (to the extent we have any hope of electoral victory) and rather than wait and wish for them to get things right, just make some photomemes and hashtags and start using them. Let it bubble up from below - that's how everything good starts anyway.
Heck, that's how Yes We Can started. It didn't come out of the Democrats. It came out of the individual agitators in the United Farm Workers.
Don't sit back and hope the official party notices and adopts the good ideas. We have to be the ones we've been waiting for. Get designing!
posted by Miko at 9:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [75 favorites]
Heck, that's how Yes We Can started. It didn't come out of the Democrats. It came out of the individual agitators in the United Farm Workers.
Don't sit back and hope the official party notices and adopts the good ideas. We have to be the ones we've been waiting for. Get designing!
posted by Miko at 9:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [75 favorites]
We, white straight men, are dying in greater numbers and in greater proportion than gay men during the AIDS crisis,
Citation?
posted by Miko at 9:13 PM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
Citation?
posted by Miko at 9:13 PM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
And yet, he persisted:
Drew Griffin, CNN: Exclusive: Jared Kushner's White House connection still being used to lure Chinese investors (emphasis mine)
posted by Room 641-A at 9:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
Drew Griffin, CNN: Exclusive: Jared Kushner's White House connection still being used to lure Chinese investors (emphasis mine)
Jared Kushner's status as a top aide to President Donald Trump was used to lure Chinese investors to his family's New Jersey development, even after his family's company apologized for mentioning his name during a sales pitch in May, CNN has found.(Years ago Drew Griffin was one of the more serious local anchors here in L.A. Good for him!)
References to Kushner are part of online promotions by two businesses that are working with Kushner Companies to find Chinese investors willing to invest in the 1 Journal Square development in exchange for a US visa.
The promotions are posted in Chinese and refer to Kushner Companies as "real estate heavyweights," going on to mention "the celebrity of the family is 30-something 'Mr. Perfect' Jared Kushner, who once served as CEO of Kushner Companies."
posted by Room 641-A at 9:27 PM on July 20, 2017 [10 favorites]
I know a lot about health care. [garbled]
this could be a good Trump quote for a memorial plaque
posted by salix at 9:29 PM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
this could be a good Trump quote for a memorial plaque
posted by salix at 9:29 PM on July 20, 2017 [17 favorites]
Good grief, people, this thread has 513 new comments. How am I going to get any sleep?
Also, if Trump and co. implode or otherwise are removed from office will Pence be tainted, too?
*crosses fingers*
Of course I wish this to happen after Democrats re-take the house in '18. Although that means at least two full years of this insanity.
*sigh*
posted by Gadgetenvy at 9:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Also, if Trump and co. implode or otherwise are removed from office will Pence be tainted, too?
*crosses fingers*
Of course I wish this to happen after Democrats re-take the house in '18. Although that means at least two full years of this insanity.
*sigh*
posted by Gadgetenvy at 9:30 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
the celebrity of the family is 30-something 'Mr. Perfect' Jared Kushner
Is "Mr. Perfect" the shitty masked vigilante alter-ego that he dons to go to parties where Ozymandias refuses to look him in the eye and he ends up having to talking to Rorschach about how nice guys always end up friendzoned
posted by Rust Moranis at 9:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Is "Mr. Perfect" the shitty masked vigilante alter-ego that he dons to go to parties where Ozymandias refuses to look him in the eye and he ends up having to talking to Rorschach about how nice guys always end up friendzoned
posted by Rust Moranis at 9:32 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
Good grief, people, this thread has 513 new comments. How am I going to get any sleep?
It's mostly just arguing about slogans.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [22 favorites]
It's mostly just arguing about slogans.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:33 PM on July 20, 2017 [22 favorites]
New York Times list of falsehoods in Trump NYT interview
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:35 PM on July 20, 2017 [14 favorites]
"They don't always want to prohibit those choices. But they have become smug and condescending toward anyone who does not match the personal lifestyle choices of liberal elites. Why would the voters on the receiving end of that smug condescension trust such a movement to operate the government in their best interest?"
You know what's so much better? Billionaire Republicans pretending to be just regular folk, because that's not condescending at all! You know what I fucking love? I fucking love it when my billionaire Republican governor from fucking DEERFIELD who went to fucking DARTMOUTH comes downstate and and starts droppin' the letter G and talkin' all folksy when he uses perfectly standard and correct English in Chicago and the suburbs because as everyone knows we're all dumb fucking hicks downstate and also have no TVs or radios because that electricity hasn't gotten to us down here so clearly we have no idea he talks proper when he talks to his wealthy white peers in Chicago and he pretends like his mother wouldn't have washed his mouth out with fucking soap for dropping his Gs in fucking Deerfield.
I'm pretty clear on which party is condescending to me, and it's not that one where people are like "oooh, I love Brie, can we serve it at the campaign dinner?" It's definitely the one where they're like, "I may have a billion dollars but I wear Carhartts for my manly manual labor that I totally definitely do, and definitely have never heard of Brie, what do you mean there are photos of me eating Brie while mocking poor people?"
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 9:41 PM on July 20, 2017 [103 favorites]
You know what's so much better? Billionaire Republicans pretending to be just regular folk, because that's not condescending at all! You know what I fucking love? I fucking love it when my billionaire Republican governor from fucking DEERFIELD who went to fucking DARTMOUTH comes downstate and and starts droppin' the letter G and talkin' all folksy when he uses perfectly standard and correct English in Chicago and the suburbs because as everyone knows we're all dumb fucking hicks downstate and also have no TVs or radios because that electricity hasn't gotten to us down here so clearly we have no idea he talks proper when he talks to his wealthy white peers in Chicago and he pretends like his mother wouldn't have washed his mouth out with fucking soap for dropping his Gs in fucking Deerfield.
I'm pretty clear on which party is condescending to me, and it's not that one where people are like "oooh, I love Brie, can we serve it at the campaign dinner?" It's definitely the one where they're like, "I may have a billion dollars but I wear Carhartts for my manly manual labor that I totally definitely do, and definitely have never heard of Brie, what do you mean there are photos of me eating Brie while mocking poor people?"
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 9:41 PM on July 20, 2017 [103 favorites]
Does anyone know when Mueller is ready to present his rock solid case against Trump, who-how-where does he present it and how-who does anything about it?
posted by perhapses at 9:47 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by perhapses at 9:47 PM on July 20, 2017 [4 favorites]
Even Bostonians who absolutely loathe Howie Carr need to watch this car wreck of an interview with Shiva Ayyadurai, the guy who says he invented e-mail when he was 14 and who has taken to calling himself the "real Indian" who will take down Elizabeth Warren next year. Ayyadurai learns why maybe you shouldn't talk trash about Carr (like calling him a Never Trumper) if you have a domestic A&B arrest on your record, because, of course, Carr is going to dig up the records. Basically goes south at 2:00 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySAKR1CRFPA
posted by adamg at 9:54 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by adamg at 9:54 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
Metafilter: It's mostly just arguing about slogans.
posted by rifflesby at 9:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by rifflesby at 9:56 PM on July 20, 2017 [6 favorites]
Does anyone know when Mueller is ready to present his rock solid case against Trump, who-how-where does he present it and how-who does anything about it?
The Special Counsel has the full power of a US Attorney within the scope of the appointment. So Mueller himself can bring indictments against anyone relating to the Russia investigation, with the likely exception of Trump himself, but that's deeply in the constitutional disputed territory, no one really knows. In all likelihood Mueller cannot directly prosecute Trump, that would have to be the Republican Congress (stop laughing), but can exercise the full authority of the Justice Department against anyone else. There shouldn't be a "Mueller Report" released to anyone, it should be criminal indictments, or an all clear.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:03 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
The Special Counsel has the full power of a US Attorney within the scope of the appointment. So Mueller himself can bring indictments against anyone relating to the Russia investigation, with the likely exception of Trump himself, but that's deeply in the constitutional disputed territory, no one really knows. In all likelihood Mueller cannot directly prosecute Trump, that would have to be the Republican Congress (stop laughing), but can exercise the full authority of the Justice Department against anyone else. There shouldn't be a "Mueller Report" released to anyone, it should be criminal indictments, or an all clear.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:03 PM on July 20, 2017 [15 favorites]
Although thinking it through, if Mueller wanted to indict Trump, and decided he could not for constitutional reasons, we could see a "Mueller Report", either pubicly or to Congress, or both, which would essentially be laying out the case for impeachment because Mueller felt he could not act alone. But that would be in addition to criminal actions against whoever else caught up in Russiagate, not the only result of the investigation.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:07 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:07 PM on July 20, 2017 [7 favorites]
I'm 100% sure that Trump's perfect world would be one in which he won the popular vote but lost the electoral college...
So from Trump's perspective, Hillary won. Maybe that's why he just can't quit her.
posted by carmicha at 10:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
So from Trump's perspective, Hillary won. Maybe that's why he just can't quit her.
posted by carmicha at 10:11 PM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]
Was this the Trumpbot requesting new seed data during the interview?
"I mean, how do you think that? But when you say that — and think about this for a second. I don’t think — you could give me a whole string of new information. I don’t think I could really have — there’s only so much. You know, you can only say many things. After that it gets boring, O.K.?"
posted by salix at 10:13 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
"I mean, how do you think that? But when you say that — and think about this for a second. I don’t think — you could give me a whole string of new information. I don’t think I could really have — there’s only so much. You know, you can only say many things. After that it gets boring, O.K.?"
posted by salix at 10:13 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
Thanks, T.D. Strange. I just can't imagine how that will unfold when it is time.
posted by perhapses at 10:13 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by perhapses at 10:13 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Even Bostonians who absolutely loathe Howie Carr need to watch this car wreck of an interview with Shiva Ayyadurai, the guy who says he invented e-mail when he was 14 and who has taken to calling himself the "real Indian" who will take down Elizabeth Warren next year.
Why does it seem like every Indian-American Republican politician in this country (as well as those running for office as a Republican) is a self-hating, pathological basket case — in other words, typical Republican, but turned up to 11 — while the Indian-American Democrats/left-leaning independents (which are the majority of Indian-American politicians in the US, thankfully) are, like . . . your average, everyday neighbor? And why are the Republican ones so goddamn outspoken, so as to pull more attention to themselves and make the rest of us look bad?
(Hi. Indian-American here, should anyone be wondering.)
I'm 42, so I'm more or less around the same age as the majority of the Indian-American politicians in office today. Meaning I grew up in the same generation, among other Indian-Americans who were children of immigrants (and it's safe to say some 90-ish percent of the Indians in American politics are US-born, but children of immigrants — as am I). So I feel like I personally know each of these personality types, and more specifically, how each of these personality types were when they were children and teenagers.
Suffice it to say that the well-adjusted, just-happen-to-be-left-leaning ones seemed fairly well adjusted in their childhood and teen years, while the ones who turned out to be Republicans had serious self-hatred complexes. I'm reminded of a guy from high school who actually said to his white friends that he felt Indian people are "puny" and "weak" and downplayed his "otherness" at every turn.
He embraced Republican politics. And thanks to Facebook, I now know he's a cosmetic surgeon in the Miami area. And probably still a Republican. I'm just waiting for him to run for office.
Ugh. Not that this should surprise me, but clearly, we're just as fucked up as everyone else.
posted by CommonSense at 10:24 PM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
Why does it seem like every Indian-American Republican politician in this country (as well as those running for office as a Republican) is a self-hating, pathological basket case — in other words, typical Republican, but turned up to 11 — while the Indian-American Democrats/left-leaning independents (which are the majority of Indian-American politicians in the US, thankfully) are, like . . . your average, everyday neighbor? And why are the Republican ones so goddamn outspoken, so as to pull more attention to themselves and make the rest of us look bad?
(Hi. Indian-American here, should anyone be wondering.)
I'm 42, so I'm more or less around the same age as the majority of the Indian-American politicians in office today. Meaning I grew up in the same generation, among other Indian-Americans who were children of immigrants (and it's safe to say some 90-ish percent of the Indians in American politics are US-born, but children of immigrants — as am I). So I feel like I personally know each of these personality types, and more specifically, how each of these personality types were when they were children and teenagers.
Suffice it to say that the well-adjusted, just-happen-to-be-left-leaning ones seemed fairly well adjusted in their childhood and teen years, while the ones who turned out to be Republicans had serious self-hatred complexes. I'm reminded of a guy from high school who actually said to his white friends that he felt Indian people are "puny" and "weak" and downplayed his "otherness" at every turn.
He embraced Republican politics. And thanks to Facebook, I now know he's a cosmetic surgeon in the Miami area. And probably still a Republican. I'm just waiting for him to run for office.
Ugh. Not that this should surprise me, but clearly, we're just as fucked up as everyone else.
posted by CommonSense at 10:24 PM on July 20, 2017 [28 favorites]
Josh Marshall: The President at War [with the rule of law]
We are far, far past the point where there is any credible reason to doubt that President Trump is hiding major and broad-ranging wrongdoing. No mix of ego, inexperience, embarrassment or anything else can explain his behavior. It just can’t. He’s hiding bad acts. And the country is likely heading toward a major constitutional and political crisis because Trump is signaling that he will not allow the normal course of the law to apply to him – a challenge which puts the entire edifice of democratic government under threat.
And this point is key, Trump is firing Mueller. Laws won't stop him and neither will the ostensible presence of Rosenstein, who is at best a wet noodle and at worst a lickspittle. It's going to happen. Today was an overt omission and they've been comically inept and heavy handed in trying to lay the groundwork:
3. Relatedly, the President and his legal team are attempting to prescribe a narrow ambit for Mueller’s probe. Basically anything outside the four walls of the 2016 election is off limits, according to Trump, including his family’s business operations, perhaps even during the 2016 election. This isn’t remotely how these kinds of investigations work. In this specific case, Rod Rosenstein gave Mueller a broad mandate to go where the facts lead him. This is not an argument that would convince any lawyer or judge. It is a political argument which lays the groundwork for Mueller’s dismissal.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:29 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
We are far, far past the point where there is any credible reason to doubt that President Trump is hiding major and broad-ranging wrongdoing. No mix of ego, inexperience, embarrassment or anything else can explain his behavior. It just can’t. He’s hiding bad acts. And the country is likely heading toward a major constitutional and political crisis because Trump is signaling that he will not allow the normal course of the law to apply to him – a challenge which puts the entire edifice of democratic government under threat.
And this point is key, Trump is firing Mueller. Laws won't stop him and neither will the ostensible presence of Rosenstein, who is at best a wet noodle and at worst a lickspittle. It's going to happen. Today was an overt omission and they've been comically inept and heavy handed in trying to lay the groundwork:
3. Relatedly, the President and his legal team are attempting to prescribe a narrow ambit for Mueller’s probe. Basically anything outside the four walls of the 2016 election is off limits, according to Trump, including his family’s business operations, perhaps even during the 2016 election. This isn’t remotely how these kinds of investigations work. In this specific case, Rod Rosenstein gave Mueller a broad mandate to go where the facts lead him. This is not an argument that would convince any lawyer or judge. It is a political argument which lays the groundwork for Mueller’s dismissal.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:29 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
I love the armchair campaign-crafting, but instead of talking about what the Democrats should do, please just do it
This is good political advice. We, the people, do not need permissom to fight for what we want.
posted by The Whelk at 10:29 PM on July 20, 2017 [38 favorites]
This is good political advice. We, the people, do not need permissom to fight for what we want.
posted by The Whelk at 10:29 PM on July 20, 2017 [38 favorites]
> This is what AI looks like when it loses ground truth and begs for intervention. In the movie version of this timeline, this is followed by a cut to black and then the credits.
In the midst of all the horrible awfulness, terror, fear, and despair, the thing my brain has decided to really fixate on is how much I miss Obama and (Bill) Clinton in the White House because of their ability to speak clearly about complex issues, completely off-the-cuff - no notes, no teleprompter, no memorized bullet points.
posted by rtha at 10:53 PM on July 20, 2017 [22 favorites]
In the midst of all the horrible awfulness, terror, fear, and despair, the thing my brain has decided to really fixate on is how much I miss Obama and (Bill) Clinton in the White House because of their ability to speak clearly about complex issues, completely off-the-cuff - no notes, no teleprompter, no memorized bullet points.
posted by rtha at 10:53 PM on July 20, 2017 [22 favorites]
Can Trump Pardon Himself?
1) Pardons cover criminal offenses; impeachment is a political issue. So issuing pardons wouldn't prevent him from being impeached.
2) If someone is pardoned they can't claim the 5th Amendment right to refuse to testify, since they would be immune from consequences of the offenses they've been pardoned for.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:57 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
So what would happen if Trump attempted a self-pardon? First, some pardon fundamentals: Article II, Section 2, Clause 1 of the U.S. Constitution gives the president the power to “grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offences against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment.” Pardons thus can only cover federal criminal offenses and cannot thwart an impeachment (which technically is not a criminal prosecution anyway).Could Trump issue himself a pardon?
...
There are two questions on the table. First, might Trump pardon himself? It is far too early to speculate about him facing criminal liability, but he certainly acts like someone who wouldn’t hesitate to deliver himself such a plum.
Second, if Trump did it, what would happen? This question is easier to answer. If he weren’t already on his way out of office, a self-pardon would bring nearer that day. Any prosecutor who was already pursuing him would not roll over and assume that the self-pardon was valid. Instead, the prosecutor would press forward and force the courts — and surely the Supreme Court, eventually — to decide the issue. The court could potentially rule either way. But one would hope it would rule in favor of justice and the rule of law and not in favor of unaccountable presidential plunder.
The short answer is that no one really knows. The longer answer is that the reasons he might want to are more complex than we might usually assume.Two other points:
...
If Trump were to pardon himself, and if the courts were to sign off — ultimately meaning the Supreme Court, most likely — there’s not anything anyone could do about it. He’d be pardoned from prosecution for federal crimes under whatever limits he applied to his pardon, up until the point at which the pardon was granted.
1) Pardons cover criminal offenses; impeachment is a political issue. So issuing pardons wouldn't prevent him from being impeached.
2) If someone is pardoned they can't claim the 5th Amendment right to refuse to testify, since they would be immune from consequences of the offenses they've been pardoned for.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:57 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
Sure they could refuse to testify. They'd be held in contempt and Trump would pardon them for contempt.
posted by Justinian at 11:00 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 11:00 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
The Big-Boy President Is Big and Strong
posted by kirkaracha at 11:00 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 11:00 PM on July 20, 2017 [3 favorites]
Alternatively they could lie their asses off and Trump could pardon them for perjury.
The possibilities are endless. There is simply no remedy for a lawless presidency save impeachment. Institutions won't save us.
posted by Justinian at 11:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
The possibilities are endless. There is simply no remedy for a lawless presidency save impeachment. Institutions won't save us.
posted by Justinian at 11:04 PM on July 20, 2017 [11 favorites]
Democrats 2018: vote #1 quidnunc kid!
posted by ActingTheGoat at 11:05 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by ActingTheGoat at 11:05 PM on July 20, 2017 [13 favorites]
Pardons cover criminal offensesSpecifically, Presidential pardons cover federal criminal offenses. NYS could still technically throw his ass in jail after he's impeached or leaves office for other reasons. (Preferably after losing the next election, but baby steps.)
Sure they could refuse to testify. They'd be held in contempt and Trump would pardon them for contempt.There's some interesting opining on this question by former Supreme Court Justice (and President) Howard Taft, who proclaimed that Contempt of Congress is separate from judicial (criminal) contempt and its own civil power, and therefore is not covered by Presidential pardoning power.
posted by xyzzy at 11:09 PM on July 20, 2017 [9 favorites]
I'm so glad we have a Presidency that may end up testing all sorts of stuff that has never been tested in court.
posted by Justinian at 11:12 PM on July 20, 2017 [24 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 11:12 PM on July 20, 2017 [24 favorites]
white straight men, are dying in greater numbers and in greater proportion than gay men during the AIDS crisis,
I'd like to see a source for this. From the CDC mortality data, the mortality rate from AIDS in 1990, near the peak of the crisis, was about 18.5 per 100,000 per year in men. I can't find a direct source for the mortality rate among gay men, but about 80% of HIV/AIDS cases in men were from men who have sex with men. Since this group makes up only about 5% of the male population, this would suggest a group-specific mortality rate of approximately 18.5 × .80 ÷ .05 ≈ 260 per 100,000 per year.
In comparison, the mortality rate due to drug overdose among white men was 23.3 per 100,000 per year in 2015, and the suicide rate for white men was 23.6 per 100,000 per year, totaling about 50 per 100,000 per year for those two causes. It is definitely noteworthy that white men seem to be at greater risk for death by either drug overdose or suicide than any other group, but other groups have their own unique risks. Black men, for instance, have a death rate by homicide at 35.4 per 100,000 per year, a number that dwarfs all other groups for that category.
So by my best estimate, it's not even close to being true that white straight men are dying due to suicide and drug overdose in greater proportion than gay men during the AIDS crisis, at least according to this dataset. Perhaps factoring low socioeconomic status would change these calculations, but probably not by a factor of 5. Which isn't to say that it isn't a problem that white men are at elevated risk for suicide and drug overdose. Of course it is! But I don't think hyperbole helps anyone. If you've got a source showing my understanding of these figures is wrong, I'm interested to see it.
The implication that no one on the left cares about these health risks in white men is also just patently false. Reforming drug policy to address the opioid epidemic was a major plank in the Democratic platform last year, including a specific commitment to the idea that drug addiction is a medical, not criminal, matter. Expanding access to mental health resources was also a major plank in the platform. These are ideas that were endorsed and fought for by our non-white, non-straight, and non-male allies on the left within the party.
posted by biogeo at 11:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [116 favorites]
I'd like to see a source for this. From the CDC mortality data, the mortality rate from AIDS in 1990, near the peak of the crisis, was about 18.5 per 100,000 per year in men. I can't find a direct source for the mortality rate among gay men, but about 80% of HIV/AIDS cases in men were from men who have sex with men. Since this group makes up only about 5% of the male population, this would suggest a group-specific mortality rate of approximately 18.5 × .80 ÷ .05 ≈ 260 per 100,000 per year.
In comparison, the mortality rate due to drug overdose among white men was 23.3 per 100,000 per year in 2015, and the suicide rate for white men was 23.6 per 100,000 per year, totaling about 50 per 100,000 per year for those two causes. It is definitely noteworthy that white men seem to be at greater risk for death by either drug overdose or suicide than any other group, but other groups have their own unique risks. Black men, for instance, have a death rate by homicide at 35.4 per 100,000 per year, a number that dwarfs all other groups for that category.
So by my best estimate, it's not even close to being true that white straight men are dying due to suicide and drug overdose in greater proportion than gay men during the AIDS crisis, at least according to this dataset. Perhaps factoring low socioeconomic status would change these calculations, but probably not by a factor of 5. Which isn't to say that it isn't a problem that white men are at elevated risk for suicide and drug overdose. Of course it is! But I don't think hyperbole helps anyone. If you've got a source showing my understanding of these figures is wrong, I'm interested to see it.
The implication that no one on the left cares about these health risks in white men is also just patently false. Reforming drug policy to address the opioid epidemic was a major plank in the Democratic platform last year, including a specific commitment to the idea that drug addiction is a medical, not criminal, matter. Expanding access to mental health resources was also a major plank in the platform. These are ideas that were endorsed and fought for by our non-white, non-straight, and non-male allies on the left within the party.
posted by biogeo at 11:14 PM on July 20, 2017 [116 favorites]
On The 11th Hour, Chris Collins informed the world that no one in his district (NY 27th, 59.7% Trump) is at all upset by anything going on with the Trump administration. They're just thrilled to death with his extremely competent Cabinet choices, are eagerly awaiting the impending repeal of Obamacare, are thoroughly enjoying the massive economic gains due to Trump's ascendance to the throne, and are just tickled pink that Trump has signed more bills in his Presidency than either Obama or Bush did in their first six months! He knows everyone is this thrilled Because Magic, since he refuses to hold town halls.
Zero pushback on the "signed more bills" statement, which is patently false. Williams teased him a little over not holding town halls, but at the end of the interview he delivered his usual fawning praise while thanking him for his appearance.
posted by xyzzy at 11:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Zero pushback on the "signed more bills" statement, which is patently false. Williams teased him a little over not holding town halls, but at the end of the interview he delivered his usual fawning praise while thanking him for his appearance.
posted by xyzzy at 11:45 PM on July 20, 2017 [5 favorites]
Couple of election slogan thoughts:
GOP 2016 - Hold Our Beer!
RNC 2020 - Pass The Joint
posted by Gadgetenvy at 11:53 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
GOP 2016 - Hold Our Beer!
RNC 2020 - Pass The Joint
posted by Gadgetenvy at 11:53 PM on July 20, 2017 [1 favorite]
Some tangentially relevant developments:
- US senators Kamala Harris (D-CA) and Rand Paul (R-KY) are proposing a bipartisan bill to reform excessive bail. This could be as wide as you can get across the political spectrum in the Senate...
- The Polish right-wing majority party, "Law and Order", has passed its bill to render the judiciary dependent on the executive in the lower chamber, awaiting the senate reading and enaction by President Andrzej Duda. The Law and Order party has seen Trump's visit and speech as a boost to its agenda, while Donald Tusk, president of the EU council from Poland, expresses his worries of "bleak outcomes".
posted by runcifex at 1:07 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
- US senators Kamala Harris (D-CA) and Rand Paul (R-KY) are proposing a bipartisan bill to reform excessive bail. This could be as wide as you can get across the political spectrum in the Senate...
- The Polish right-wing majority party, "Law and Order", has passed its bill to render the judiciary dependent on the executive in the lower chamber, awaiting the senate reading and enaction by President Andrzej Duda. The Law and Order party has seen Trump's visit and speech as a boost to its agenda, while Donald Tusk, president of the EU council from Poland, expresses his worries of "bleak outcomes".
posted by runcifex at 1:07 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
We, the people, do not need permissom to fight for what we want.
With the exception of a few states you can not approach a Grand Jury with your criminal charges per the code AND how they have decided to operate Grand Juries in that state. Claims are made some citizens have been able to submit directly in Texas and California. (Claims are also made Grand Juries just are not held in other states to avoid a direct submission issue.)
And my understanding is one used to be able to do this on a federal level 'till a policy rewrite in 1946.
By 1946 vets who had time in the returning ships to talk with others. About how crappy things were gonna be when they got back home. And some of the fellow vets mentioned how you have rights and a way to enforce them - write up the complaint to the Grand Jury and submit it. My gut tells me after a few people did this some were "inspired" to make a policy change. In the same way there became "inspiration" about gun control laws because a few people walked around with rifles in public while Regan was governor of California.
posted by rough ashlar at 2:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
With the exception of a few states you can not approach a Grand Jury with your criminal charges per the code AND how they have decided to operate Grand Juries in that state. Claims are made some citizens have been able to submit directly in Texas and California. (Claims are also made Grand Juries just are not held in other states to avoid a direct submission issue.)
And my understanding is one used to be able to do this on a federal level 'till a policy rewrite in 1946.
By 1946 vets who had time in the returning ships to talk with others. About how crappy things were gonna be when they got back home. And some of the fellow vets mentioned how you have rights and a way to enforce them - write up the complaint to the Grand Jury and submit it. My gut tells me after a few people did this some were "inspired" to make a policy change. In the same way there became "inspiration" about gun control laws because a few people walked around with rifles in public while Regan was governor of California.
posted by rough ashlar at 2:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
I just can't believe these fuckers are going after health care again. I mean, I believe it but it's just getting surreal.
There were ADAPT folks in front of Senator Toomey's Philly office from 5:30 AM on last Tuesday, most if not all in wheelchairs, in the heat and growing humidity, some of whom got arrested. You have to really be fucking invested in a cause to be doing that.
It makes me so angry. I receive Medicare so I'm not in as much near-term danger as those on Medicaid, but if I'd just broke my back before rather than after I worked some, I'd be receiving Medicaid. If my insurance lapsed the first thing to go would be my anti-seizure medication, and I'd have to go to the hospital.
People are not in disgusting Philly weather getting arrested because it's romantic, Jesus.
posted by angrycat at 2:37 AM on July 21, 2017 [42 favorites]
There were ADAPT folks in front of Senator Toomey's Philly office from 5:30 AM on last Tuesday, most if not all in wheelchairs, in the heat and growing humidity, some of whom got arrested. You have to really be fucking invested in a cause to be doing that.
It makes me so angry. I receive Medicare so I'm not in as much near-term danger as those on Medicaid, but if I'd just broke my back before rather than after I worked some, I'd be receiving Medicaid. If my insurance lapsed the first thing to go would be my anti-seizure medication, and I'd have to go to the hospital.
People are not in disgusting Philly weather getting arrested because it's romantic, Jesus.
posted by angrycat at 2:37 AM on July 21, 2017 [42 favorites]
Paul Krugman about GOP sabotage of health care if you were tired of feeling briefly victorious about the failure of the BHCA
posted by angrycat at 4:02 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 4:02 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
In the same way there became "inspiration" about gun control laws because a few people walked around with rifles in public while Regan was governor of California.
The Black Panthers were not merely "a few people."
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:12 AM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
The Black Panthers were not merely "a few people."
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:12 AM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
And the Federal Grand Jury lost its civil investigative function not due to some shadowy conspiracy but because the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure were instituted in 1946.
Previously the Federal Grand Jury had theoretical autonomous civil investigative powers that would have permitted it watchdog governmental corruption on its own initiative, but practically speaking it hadn't really served that purpose since the closure of the frontier and the establishment of state governments in the west (vastly reducing the areas locally administered by Federal officials). So that function had fallen into disuse and was simply left out when the rules were codified.
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:23 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Previously the Federal Grand Jury had theoretical autonomous civil investigative powers that would have permitted it watchdog governmental corruption on its own initiative, but practically speaking it hadn't really served that purpose since the closure of the frontier and the establishment of state governments in the west (vastly reducing the areas locally administered by Federal officials). So that function had fallen into disuse and was simply left out when the rules were codified.
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:23 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
The Black Panthers were not merely "a few people."
But what part of the group inspired the change in the law? Militancy with long guns? Males with long guns? A political party with long guns?
posted by rough ashlar at 4:23 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
But what part of the group inspired the change in the law? Militancy with long guns? Males with long guns? A political party with long guns?
posted by rough ashlar at 4:23 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
I'm going to hazard a guess that it was the Black part.
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:24 AM on July 21, 2017 [40 favorites]
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:24 AM on July 21, 2017 [40 favorites]
In case anyone wanted confirmation that pardoned individuals can be compelled to testify, Laurence Tribe who argued Bush v Gore. etc.:
@tribelaw
Memo to Trump: Anyone you pardon can be compelled to testify without any grant of immunity, and that testimony could undo you.
posted by chris24 at 4:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [32 favorites]
@tribelaw
Memo to Trump: Anyone you pardon can be compelled to testify without any grant of immunity, and that testimony could undo you.
posted by chris24 at 4:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [32 favorites]
Lavrov's straight-up trolling us.
Trump and Putin May Have Met More Times Says Russia's Sergei Lavrov
“They might have met even much more than just three times,” he told NBC News’ Keir Simmons in an exclusive interview, dismissing speculation about the leaders' meetings. Asked whether the two presidents had other conversations or met in the corridors of the G-20 meeting, Lavrov used the analogy of children mingling at a kindergarten.
“When you are bought by your parents to a kindergarten do you mix with the people who are waiting in the same room to start going to a classroom?” he asked. He added: "I remember when I was in that position I did spend five or ten minutes in the kindergarten before they brought us to the classroom.”
posted by Rust Moranis at 4:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Trump and Putin May Have Met More Times Says Russia's Sergei Lavrov
“They might have met even much more than just three times,” he told NBC News’ Keir Simmons in an exclusive interview, dismissing speculation about the leaders' meetings. Asked whether the two presidents had other conversations or met in the corridors of the G-20 meeting, Lavrov used the analogy of children mingling at a kindergarten.
“When you are bought by your parents to a kindergarten do you mix with the people who are waiting in the same room to start going to a classroom?” he asked. He added: "I remember when I was in that position I did spend five or ten minutes in the kindergarten before they brought us to the classroom.”
posted by Rust Moranis at 4:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Previously the Federal Grand Jury had theoretical autonomous civil investigative powers
The only references I've spotted in the 'founding' documents are along the lines of 'yup, gonna have these' with no guidance on how one gets papers in front of 'em. Someone's has to have done a dissertation on use of a federal grand jury before 1946 by citizens and I'd guess if such existed a different one would exist outlining racial differences in how the law is applied. If there was an upswing even after adjustment for population - could that be correlated to the rise of mass-media radio and one of the 'preachers' of the day mentioning it to their listeners?
If citizens could approach a federal grand jury with papers and a ham sandwich or 2 - would that "solve" the "Trump problem" or just be the latest version of "solving" the "Obama/Bush/Clinton/Bush/Regan/Carter/...." problem? If one can't 'go after' a sitting president or public official - doesn't that just prove Nixon right?
posted by rough ashlar at 4:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
The only references I've spotted in the 'founding' documents are along the lines of 'yup, gonna have these' with no guidance on how one gets papers in front of 'em. Someone's has to have done a dissertation on use of a federal grand jury before 1946 by citizens and I'd guess if such existed a different one would exist outlining racial differences in how the law is applied. If there was an upswing even after adjustment for population - could that be correlated to the rise of mass-media radio and one of the 'preachers' of the day mentioning it to their listeners?
If citizens could approach a federal grand jury with papers and a ham sandwich or 2 - would that "solve" the "Trump problem" or just be the latest version of "solving" the "Obama/Bush/Clinton/Bush/Regan/Carter/...." problem? If one can't 'go after' a sitting president or public official - doesn't that just prove Nixon right?
posted by rough ashlar at 4:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
If there was an upswing even after adjustment for population - could that be correlated to the rise of mass-media radio and one of the 'preachers' of the day mentioning it to their listeners?
Those sorts of questions are interesting, but are sort of historical curiosities. Historiography of that sort isn't all that popular in legal scholarship (at least not currently) -- it might be of more interest to government/pol sci types. My guess is that the kinds of social changes you're pointing to might have encouraged the retirement of Federal grand juries as governmental watchdogs had they still been in use for that purpose then (as happened with state grand juries), but the evidence suggests that the function was already mostly abandoned in the late 1800s.
If one can't 'go after' a sitting president or public official - doesn't that just prove Nixon right?
Nixon left office in disgrace and his name remains anathema. If Nixon is proven right it won't be by a failure of law but by a failure of political will to hew to and enforce the law. Which, arguably, we are seeing right now.
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:57 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Those sorts of questions are interesting, but are sort of historical curiosities. Historiography of that sort isn't all that popular in legal scholarship (at least not currently) -- it might be of more interest to government/pol sci types. My guess is that the kinds of social changes you're pointing to might have encouraged the retirement of Federal grand juries as governmental watchdogs had they still been in use for that purpose then (as happened with state grand juries), but the evidence suggests that the function was already mostly abandoned in the late 1800s.
If one can't 'go after' a sitting president or public official - doesn't that just prove Nixon right?
Nixon left office in disgrace and his name remains anathema. If Nixon is proven right it won't be by a failure of law but by a failure of political will to hew to and enforce the law. Which, arguably, we are seeing right now.
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:57 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
"I mean, how do you think that? But when you say that — and think about this for a second. I don’t think — you could give me a whole string of new information. I don’t think I could really have — there’s only so much. You know, you can only say many things. After that it gets boring, O.K.?"
Samuel Beckett, Endgame (1957)
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:57 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
Samuel Beckett, Endgame (1957)
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:57 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
Man now I have to make one of those online quizzes
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:58 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:58 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
@tribelaw
Memo to Trump: Anyone you pardon can be compelled to testify without any grant of immunity, and that testimony could undo you.
They'll just fucking lie! Why does everybody act like Trump pardoning his cronies thereby forcing them to be compelled to testify is some "oh ho ho you fell into our brilliantly conceived trap" shit? Compel those people to testify and they'll just keep fucking lying. Bring them up on perjury and they'll just get pardoned again. They don't think the law applies to them, and up to now they've been right. They're not going to have some road-to-Damascus conversion where they suddenly believe that some law does apply to them, that this specific lie is just too much. Like Justinian said: there is no remedy for a lawless presidency within our political and legal framework.
It's like an old cowboy movie where if the bank robbers reach the border of the next state over, they're free. We're sheriffs standing on this side of the border, shouting out at them, "don't you know bank robbing is illegal?" Turning to each other and tutting, "I can't wait until they ride back over here so we can arrest them!"
posted by penduluum at 5:09 AM on July 21, 2017 [63 favorites]
Memo to Trump: Anyone you pardon can be compelled to testify without any grant of immunity, and that testimony could undo you.
They'll just fucking lie! Why does everybody act like Trump pardoning his cronies thereby forcing them to be compelled to testify is some "oh ho ho you fell into our brilliantly conceived trap" shit? Compel those people to testify and they'll just keep fucking lying. Bring them up on perjury and they'll just get pardoned again. They don't think the law applies to them, and up to now they've been right. They're not going to have some road-to-Damascus conversion where they suddenly believe that some law does apply to them, that this specific lie is just too much. Like Justinian said: there is no remedy for a lawless presidency within our political and legal framework.
It's like an old cowboy movie where if the bank robbers reach the border of the next state over, they're free. We're sheriffs standing on this side of the border, shouting out at them, "don't you know bank robbing is illegal?" Turning to each other and tutting, "I can't wait until they ride back over here so we can arrest them!"
posted by penduluum at 5:09 AM on July 21, 2017 [63 favorites]
there is no remedy for a lawless presidency within our political and legal framework.
There is -- impeachment. There's no remedy for a lawless presidency when the intended remedy is withheld by an equally corrupt or merely spineless Congressional majority.
posted by snuffleupagus at 5:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
There is -- impeachment. There's no remedy for a lawless presidency when the intended remedy is withheld by an equally corrupt or merely spineless Congressional majority.
posted by snuffleupagus at 5:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
thomas jefferson disagrees
posted by entropicamericana at 5:20 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 5:20 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
But impeachment also exists outside the legal framework. Congress can decide to begin impeachment proceedings whether or not he pardons anybody, whether or not anybody is compelled to testify, what they do once they're compelled to testify ... none of that is relevant. All that matters to impeachment is the calculus of whether Congress, taken in aggregate at any instant in time, likes the President enough to hold back. Today, impeachment is impossible with a Republican majority, mandatory (one hopes) with a Democratic majority, so the facts that bring it about don't matter.
The only reason Trump would care about being impeached is if it makes him feel unpopular, and the operating word there isn't "unpopular," it's "feel." He doesn't care about actually passing legislation. He doesn't care about damaging his party's reputation. He doesn't care about actually having the job. And he's already spent decades building up an approval apparatus that gives him the praise and adulation he needs without reference to the real, outside world. He likes being powerful, not because he wants to necessarily do anything with that power, but because he needs to be worshipped. Impeachment assumes powerful individuals want to wield that power. Impeachment is no threat to somebody who doesn't care whether he's president.
posted by penduluum at 5:27 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
The only reason Trump would care about being impeached is if it makes him feel unpopular, and the operating word there isn't "unpopular," it's "feel." He doesn't care about actually passing legislation. He doesn't care about damaging his party's reputation. He doesn't care about actually having the job. And he's already spent decades building up an approval apparatus that gives him the praise and adulation he needs without reference to the real, outside world. He likes being powerful, not because he wants to necessarily do anything with that power, but because he needs to be worshipped. Impeachment assumes powerful individuals want to wield that power. Impeachment is no threat to somebody who doesn't care whether he's president.
posted by penduluum at 5:27 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Mueller has a remit to investigate Trump's business transactions with Russia. But these transactions are likely conducted through baroque shell companies. How does Mueller know whether they are connected to Russia? He investigates them. If he finds criminal activity unrelated to Russia, does he ignore it? No. It becomes part of the investigation. It is ＣＯＮＳＵＭＥＤ ＢＹ ＯＭＮＩＧＡＴＥ.
Mueller will be looking through many years of Trump's tax returns and financial dealings. He could find federal crimes. He will present his evidence. The President could be pardoned. But the evidence could also point to related state crimes. Those can only pardoned by the state governors.
And this is why Trump is going to end up living in Gorky Park.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [25 favorites]
Mueller will be looking through many years of Trump's tax returns and financial dealings. He could find federal crimes. He will present his evidence. The President could be pardoned. But the evidence could also point to related state crimes. Those can only pardoned by the state governors.
And this is why Trump is going to end up living in Gorky Park.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [25 favorites]
how's that "gropey ragey" thing workin' out for ya?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:00 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:00 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
The Post dug deep on Akie Abe's knowledge of English and concluded it probably wasn't a snub of Trump so much as that she doesn't appear to be particularly comfortable with the language and likely didn't want to misspeak.
Stuff and nonsense. I traveled to Japan a month or so ago, and nearly everyone I met could at least say "hello," "goodbye," and "thank you;" she may not have been comfortable with fluent conversation, but she could have at least given Trump a greeting and then apologized for her poor English -- it would, incidentally, be the polite thing to do -- and yet according to Trump himself, she didn't address him in English at all, to the point where he thought she didn't speak the language. Even I, who know barely a dozen phrases of Japanese, did my best to use them when I could. "Not speaking the language well" != "not speaking it at all."
I realize it's embarrassing for people close to world leaders to entirely snub the sitting US president, but there's also no reason at all to flail about for excuses, especially such feeble ones.
posted by Gelatin at 6:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Stuff and nonsense. I traveled to Japan a month or so ago, and nearly everyone I met could at least say "hello," "goodbye," and "thank you;" she may not have been comfortable with fluent conversation, but she could have at least given Trump a greeting and then apologized for her poor English -- it would, incidentally, be the polite thing to do -- and yet according to Trump himself, she didn't address him in English at all, to the point where he thought she didn't speak the language. Even I, who know barely a dozen phrases of Japanese, did my best to use them when I could. "Not speaking the language well" != "not speaking it at all."
I realize it's embarrassing for people close to world leaders to entirely snub the sitting US president, but there's also no reason at all to flail about for excuses, especially such feeble ones.
posted by Gelatin at 6:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Impeachment is no threat to somebody who doesn't care whether he's president.
Great! Sounds like a plan. The world can be rid of President Trump and he can pretend not to give a shit.
posted by snuffleupagus at 6:24 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Great! Sounds like a plan. The world can be rid of President Trump and he can pretend not to give a shit.
posted by snuffleupagus at 6:24 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
according to Trump himself
I think I see the problem here.
posted by Etrigan at 6:26 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
I think I see the problem here.
posted by Etrigan at 6:26 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Kate Zernike and Abby Goodnough, NYT, These Americans Hated the Health Law. Until the Idea of Repeal Sank In.
posted by joyceanmachine at 6:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [65 favorites]
"If I had to pay a penalty, it’s still less than I have to pay for having health care all year,” Ms. McMahon said. At 52, she has diabetes and says the strips to test her blood sugar are so expensive that sometimes she tests once a month rather than daily. She has not looked into whether she might qualify for the Medicaid expansion; she was not aware Pennsylvania had expanded the program*MUFFLED SCREAMING*
posted by joyceanmachine at 6:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [65 favorites]
>She has not looked into whether she might qualify for the Medicaid
My Mother Who Voted for Donald Trump Even Though She Believes He is the Literal Anti-Christ uses Ohio Medicaid but goes out of her way to talk about the health care she receives (and likes!) as a secret company she discovered and not a public service she's entitled to access.
posted by Tevin at 6:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [54 favorites]
My Mother Who Voted for Donald Trump Even Though She Believes He is the Literal Anti-Christ uses Ohio Medicaid but goes out of her way to talk about the health care she receives (and likes!) as a secret company she discovered and not a public service she's entitled to access.
posted by Tevin at 6:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [54 favorites]
Even I, who know barely a dozen phrases of Japanese, did my best to use them when I could. "Not speaking the language well" != "not speaking it at all."
The problem is though, when someone is at Trump's level of incoherence, were even we go "Did he just say that?" regularly, parsing what he says is just too damned hard, and being an idiot, it's not worth the effort.
posted by mikelieman at 6:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
The problem is though, when someone is at Trump's level of incoherence, were even we go "Did he just say that?" regularly, parsing what he says is just too damned hard, and being an idiot, it's not worth the effort.
posted by mikelieman at 6:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
If new amendments are applied to the Obamacare Repeal and Reconciliation Act, will a new CBO score be issued before a final vote?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:39 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:39 AM on July 21, 2017
I'm pretty clear on which party is condescending to me, and it's not that one where people are like "oooh, I love Brie, can we serve it at the campaign dinner?" It's definitely the one where they're like, "I may have a billion dollars but I wear Carhartts for my manly manual labor that I totally definitely do, and definitely have never heard of Brie, what do you mean there are photos of me eating Brie while mocking poor people?"
Brie being the symbol of elite status is one of the saddest declarations of Americain provincialism possible.
posted by srboisvert at 6:41 AM on July 21, 2017 [31 favorites]
Brie being the symbol of elite status is one of the saddest declarations of Americain provincialism possible.
posted by srboisvert at 6:41 AM on July 21, 2017 [31 favorites]
No, they're not even going to score the Cruz amendment before a vote next week. McConnell is trying to buy off enough holdouts as possible with promises to get past the motion to proceed, at which point they will have no clue what the final bill will actually contain, but apparently will be voting on it anyway. No scores, no hearings, nothing.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Just so long as they can kill people they're happy.
posted by Artw at 6:46 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by Artw at 6:46 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
As for the BCRA, or Obamacare Repeal Act or whatever they're calling it this week, I still remain convinced that they'll pass something and it will be awful.
They're really stuck, and they need to focus on the short term or they're doubly fucked.
Coming out of the 2016 elections the Republicans were feeling very good, the Democrats had gotten a serious drubbing, not only did they not retake the House or Senate, but the creeping Republican takeover of state governments continued apace and they got the extra bonus of a Republican President.
It's barely 8 months later and they're not feeling so good anymore because it turns out that actually doing something is exposing the significant rifts in their Party and putting serious strain on their deserved fame for Party unity. So far its holding together, but as we get closer and closer to a 2018 election where Trump is a massive penalty and individual Republican congresspeople are seeing looming electoral defeat the leadership knows that their Party unity will eventually break under the pressure.
So they have to repeal Obamacare. Yes, they look like schmucks for fucking up three times in a row now, but McConnel and Ryan aren't total idiots even if they aren't as smart as they think they are, and they know they absolutely **MUST** deliver an Obamacare repeal or they'll pay a huge price in 2018.
Repealing Obamacare has been the keystone of the Republican Party since it passed. Repealing Obamacare is a bigger deal than overturning Roe or re-criminalizing abortion. It is fair to say that repealing Obamacare is the current core of the Republican Party. A failure to do so when they have all the power is going to result in massive electoral consequences.
McConnell is going to burn every scrap of political capital he has to get his Obamacare Repeal Act out of committee and to the floor, and then I think he's going to make it a very generic repeal plus whatever bribes he has to come up with bill. And the key feature is that it won't actually enact a repeal until 2019 or even 2021.
Kicking the can down the road serves several critical functions:
First, and most important, it puts off all the messy, ugly, Party splitting, debate over what exactly to replace Obamacare with. Instead it lets them claim a quick victory on their key policy position and strut, and brag, and crow about how that evil Obamacare that was hurting you so much is now a thing of the past thanks to the Bold White Republicans!
Second, the delay will normalize the supposed "absence" of Obamacare to people. They'll brag about the repeal, FOX will endlessly talk about the repeal, and a huge number of Americans will notice that everything is still working ok and the sky didn't fall, and decide that the Democrats were just fear mongering about the consequences of repealing Obamacare. Trump's "maybe we'll pay, maybe we won't" act will vanish and the Republicans will be very careful to never, ever, bring up the fact that the reason the sky hasn't fallen is because Obamacare is still in place and there's a massive, looming, healthcare crisis coming due as soon as their repeal really kicks in.
Naturally whatever bribes they paid out to get the Obamacare repeal passed will kick in instantly, not in 2019 or 2021 or whatever they chose for the real date of Obamacare repeal
Thirdly, it buys time that is obviously needed for some serious backroom deal making and horse trading to figure out WTF to actually replace Obamacare with. There may not be anything they can work out, but McConnell and Ryan probably have a high enough opinion of themselves as political organizers that they believe they can work something out provided they've got enough time, a lack of pressure, and not so much public scrutiny of what they're doing.
And finally, most importantly, it will provide a big boost for them in 2018. Yes, the Democrats will try to run attack ads about how once the ACA really is gone people will die, but the R's will paint that as crying wolf and fold it into their ads about delicious liberal tears from repealing Obamacare.
It's nice to think that a repeal without a replacement will hurt them electorally, and if it was an instant repeal it would. But if they kick the can down the road (as I am 100% sure they will) Democratic warnings about future danger versus their ability for instant bragging seems like a net gain for the Republicans. It's all about the 2018 elections right now.
I just finished a cake, but I'll bake a new one if I'm wrong. I do firmly expect that the "clean" (ignoring all the bribes the bill includes) Obamacare repeal set to not actually take effect for 2 to 4 years will go through.
posted by sotonohito at 6:48 AM on July 21, 2017 [43 favorites]
They're really stuck, and they need to focus on the short term or they're doubly fucked.
Coming out of the 2016 elections the Republicans were feeling very good, the Democrats had gotten a serious drubbing, not only did they not retake the House or Senate, but the creeping Republican takeover of state governments continued apace and they got the extra bonus of a Republican President.
It's barely 8 months later and they're not feeling so good anymore because it turns out that actually doing something is exposing the significant rifts in their Party and putting serious strain on their deserved fame for Party unity. So far its holding together, but as we get closer and closer to a 2018 election where Trump is a massive penalty and individual Republican congresspeople are seeing looming electoral defeat the leadership knows that their Party unity will eventually break under the pressure.
So they have to repeal Obamacare. Yes, they look like schmucks for fucking up three times in a row now, but McConnel and Ryan aren't total idiots even if they aren't as smart as they think they are, and they know they absolutely **MUST** deliver an Obamacare repeal or they'll pay a huge price in 2018.
Repealing Obamacare has been the keystone of the Republican Party since it passed. Repealing Obamacare is a bigger deal than overturning Roe or re-criminalizing abortion. It is fair to say that repealing Obamacare is the current core of the Republican Party. A failure to do so when they have all the power is going to result in massive electoral consequences.
McConnell is going to burn every scrap of political capital he has to get his Obamacare Repeal Act out of committee and to the floor, and then I think he's going to make it a very generic repeal plus whatever bribes he has to come up with bill. And the key feature is that it won't actually enact a repeal until 2019 or even 2021.
Kicking the can down the road serves several critical functions:
First, and most important, it puts off all the messy, ugly, Party splitting, debate over what exactly to replace Obamacare with. Instead it lets them claim a quick victory on their key policy position and strut, and brag, and crow about how that evil Obamacare that was hurting you so much is now a thing of the past thanks to the Bold White Republicans!
Second, the delay will normalize the supposed "absence" of Obamacare to people. They'll brag about the repeal, FOX will endlessly talk about the repeal, and a huge number of Americans will notice that everything is still working ok and the sky didn't fall, and decide that the Democrats were just fear mongering about the consequences of repealing Obamacare. Trump's "maybe we'll pay, maybe we won't" act will vanish and the Republicans will be very careful to never, ever, bring up the fact that the reason the sky hasn't fallen is because Obamacare is still in place and there's a massive, looming, healthcare crisis coming due as soon as their repeal really kicks in.
Naturally whatever bribes they paid out to get the Obamacare repeal passed will kick in instantly, not in 2019 or 2021 or whatever they chose for the real date of Obamacare repeal
Thirdly, it buys time that is obviously needed for some serious backroom deal making and horse trading to figure out WTF to actually replace Obamacare with. There may not be anything they can work out, but McConnell and Ryan probably have a high enough opinion of themselves as political organizers that they believe they can work something out provided they've got enough time, a lack of pressure, and not so much public scrutiny of what they're doing.
And finally, most importantly, it will provide a big boost for them in 2018. Yes, the Democrats will try to run attack ads about how once the ACA really is gone people will die, but the R's will paint that as crying wolf and fold it into their ads about delicious liberal tears from repealing Obamacare.
It's nice to think that a repeal without a replacement will hurt them electorally, and if it was an instant repeal it would. But if they kick the can down the road (as I am 100% sure they will) Democratic warnings about future danger versus their ability for instant bragging seems like a net gain for the Republicans. It's all about the 2018 elections right now.
I just finished a cake, but I'll bake a new one if I'm wrong. I do firmly expect that the "clean" (ignoring all the bribes the bill includes) Obamacare repeal set to not actually take effect for 2 to 4 years will go through.
posted by sotonohito at 6:48 AM on July 21, 2017 [43 favorites]
In the interview, Trump was using the claim that Ms Abe didn't speak English as an excuse for moving over to Melania and Putin. He didn't mention the multi-lingual Arab, Muslim (and very glamorous) Argentine first lady on his left hand whom he was actually supposed to be talking with.
The more we know, the more it seems he was just plain lying about Ms. Abe, probably figuring the Japanese government wouldn't call him out on it. All in all, it's a typical example of the way he does his BS - always constructing a little half-lie that frames the bigger lie and distracts from the huge untruth. It's like the friend he has who used to go to Paris, or the one with the plant in Mexico. Or the claim that he is a successful businessman. All lies covering bullshit covering fraud and worse.
posted by mumimor at 6:50 AM on July 21, 2017 [32 favorites]
The more we know, the more it seems he was just plain lying about Ms. Abe, probably figuring the Japanese government wouldn't call him out on it. All in all, it's a typical example of the way he does his BS - always constructing a little half-lie that frames the bigger lie and distracts from the huge untruth. It's like the friend he has who used to go to Paris, or the one with the plant in Mexico. Or the claim that he is a successful businessman. All lies covering bullshit covering fraud and worse.
posted by mumimor at 6:50 AM on July 21, 2017 [32 favorites]
I went to see what was on Fox & Friends this morning, just to know what Trump is (notably) not tweeting out this morning1, and saw this from KellyAnn Conway (1:35)
But I guess that's the job: Repeat, verbatim, the lies and you can hide behind the quotation marks.
1 - I imagine him holding it all in for a late afternoon storm that will have far-reaching consequences.
posted by pjenks at 6:51 AM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
The President said to the New York Times less than two days ago: We don't make money in Russia. We don't have hotels in Russia. He had the Miss Universe Pageant there 8 or 9 years ago.She's right, that is what he said to the NYTimes. But the Miss Universe Pageant was in November 2013! That's 3.7 years ago, for the mathematicians.
But I guess that's the job: Repeat, verbatim, the lies and you can hide behind the quotation marks.
1 - I imagine him holding it all in for a late afternoon storm that will have far-reaching consequences.
posted by pjenks at 6:51 AM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
The only problem is a repeal and delay will instantly destroy the individual insurance markets too. The CBO score for repeal and delay has premiums doubling overnight, plus 18 million people losing coverage *before* 2018. I agree they're going to pass something, then put it off long enough to try another round of blaming the Democrats for the consequences of Republican actions, but insurance companies have a longer time horizon than 18 months, and they won't be fooled.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [35 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [35 favorites]
This is a line of thought trodden again and again, but you don't win on the manifesto of "we're not them" or "the other guy is failing."
The Dems need to look at Britain's Labour party. They didn't win the majority, but they did win enough seats to dispel the myth of Tory invincibility and sending them into disarray. Labour winning Canterbury is like Dems snatching a dyed in the wool red Georgia district and there will be shock and awe. They did this by laying on the table a manifesto unseen in more than a decade. They did this by not merely being non-Tory but by stopping pretending that they're better Tories than the Tories. Their manifesto is apocalyptic in the literal sense, "uncovering." Their approach is evangelical in the literal sense, "good-news-heralding." This is how you make a last stand. You don't make a last stand by planning to get away with it.
Stop mucking with this "Better Deal" cutie thingy. Be more like Franklin Badass Delano Roosevelt and Abraham Asskicker Lincoln (yes I know he was a Republican). It's either a new birth of freedom or the cruel torture and death of everything as you know it. Stop being ashamed and in denial of yourself!
posted by runcifex at 6:57 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
The Dems need to look at Britain's Labour party. They didn't win the majority, but they did win enough seats to dispel the myth of Tory invincibility and sending them into disarray. Labour winning Canterbury is like Dems snatching a dyed in the wool red Georgia district and there will be shock and awe. They did this by laying on the table a manifesto unseen in more than a decade. They did this by not merely being non-Tory but by stopping pretending that they're better Tories than the Tories. Their manifesto is apocalyptic in the literal sense, "uncovering." Their approach is evangelical in the literal sense, "good-news-heralding." This is how you make a last stand. You don't make a last stand by planning to get away with it.
Stop mucking with this "Better Deal" cutie thingy. Be more like Franklin Badass Delano Roosevelt and Abraham Asskicker Lincoln (yes I know he was a Republican). It's either a new birth of freedom or the cruel torture and death of everything as you know it. Stop being ashamed and in denial of yourself!
posted by runcifex at 6:57 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
The only problem is a repeal and delay will instantly destroy the individual insurance markets too.
Especially since they have to use reconciliation to do it and can only repeal the budget related Obamacare items, but not things like pre existing conditions, staying on parents coverage, or defining what insurance is. Insurance companies have been screaming at full volume about how this will absolutely destroy the individual market as soon as it passes. No insurance company is gonna wait around for armageddon. They'll leave ASAP.
This is probably how the US ends up with single payer.
posted by Glibpaxman at 6:58 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Especially since they have to use reconciliation to do it and can only repeal the budget related Obamacare items, but not things like pre existing conditions, staying on parents coverage, or defining what insurance is. Insurance companies have been screaming at full volume about how this will absolutely destroy the individual market as soon as it passes. No insurance company is gonna wait around for armageddon. They'll leave ASAP.
This is probably how the US ends up with single payer.
posted by Glibpaxman at 6:58 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
This is a line of thought trodden again and again, but you don't win on the manifesto of "we're not them" or "the other guy is failing."
That's funny, I thought Trump won using exactly those lines.
posted by mmoncur at 7:07 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
That's funny, I thought Trump won using exactly those lines.
posted by mmoncur at 7:07 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
The Daily Dana: Ed Royce stopped Dana Rohrabacher from going to Russia last spring
Rep. Dana Rohrabacher has made several trips to Moscow during his 15 terms in Congress.posted by notyou at 7:13 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
But the chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Subcommittee on Europe, Eurasia and Emerging Threats canceled a publicly announced trip to meet with the Russian parliament last spring with little notice.
Rohrabacher (R-Costa Mesa) told the Times on Wednesday that he decided not to go because he was worried the national focus on Russia would make it difficult to have serious conversations with Russian officials.
"In the middle of a chaotic, public brouhaha, you're not going to be able to get the serious job done that you need to get done," he said.
But a senior House GOP aide who asked not to be identified because he was not authorized to speak to reporters said Thursday it was House Foreign Affairs Committee Chairman Ed Royce (R-Fullerton) who declined Rohrabacher’s request to travel to Moscow shortly after President Trump's inauguration. The aide said such a trip would have been inappropriate.
At the time, Congress was just beginning its investigations into Russian attempts to interfere in the 2016 election.
My mother, who brought a MAGA drink cozy to her son-in-law's funeral, reacted like she had been shot at when I mentioned that a change of employment meant that my next health insurance would come via the ACA exchanges. She literally yelled "OH, GOD, NO!"
No more than five minutes later in the same conversation, we discussed her husband's recovery from early-stage cancer and she remarked how pleasantly surprised she was at how well Medicare had covered his expenses and provided comprehensive coverage.
It is considered rude to smack your mother in the mouth, especially at a family Xmas gathering, but the impulse was difficult to suppress.
posted by delfin at 7:16 AM on July 21, 2017 [84 favorites]
No more than five minutes later in the same conversation, we discussed her husband's recovery from early-stage cancer and she remarked how pleasantly surprised she was at how well Medicare had covered his expenses and provided comprehensive coverage.
It is considered rude to smack your mother in the mouth, especially at a family Xmas gathering, but the impulse was difficult to suppress.
posted by delfin at 7:16 AM on July 21, 2017 [84 favorites]
Anyway. How lucky is Rex Tillerson? As head of Exxon he flouted the Magnitsky Act's prohibition against dealing with certain Russian individuals and companies which in any other consensus reality environment would be a blockbuster, but in Trumpland it's a flicker across the screen: Wait? Was that? Musta been my imagination.
posted by notyou at 7:20 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by notyou at 7:20 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
The Dem "liberal elites" are nothing but. Elite means the chosen ones, those chosen to do the impossible and die fulfilling this obligation that binds one to another. I hate aristocracy as much as the next guy but now the Dems, or Opposition, or whatever, can benefit from a dose of nobility. Really you don't win by being nice. You win by calling everybody to arms.
How do you get this armed crowd? Trump won because he had the temerity to say they're going to build a wall and expel all Muslims and grab pussy. It's possible to appeal to the most irresponsible emotions and wildest dreams, especially with a lot of "help" from your "friends". It's also possible to do the opposite. To stake the honour and credibility on the front line and getting ready to die trying. This is nobility. This is how you gain loyalty.
posted by runcifex at 7:22 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
How do you get this armed crowd? Trump won because he had the temerity to say they're going to build a wall and expel all Muslims and grab pussy. It's possible to appeal to the most irresponsible emotions and wildest dreams, especially with a lot of "help" from your "friends". It's also possible to do the opposite. To stake the honour and credibility on the front line and getting ready to die trying. This is nobility. This is how you gain loyalty.
posted by runcifex at 7:22 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
That's funny, I thought Trump won using exactly those lines.
Exactly those lines, plus racism, plus some pseudo-socialist populist claptrap about spending and building and jobs and infrastructure, all of which are never going to happen.
Actually popular actually socialist policies that actually help people and build things seem like they would be a good counter to this.
posted by Artw at 7:23 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Exactly those lines, plus racism, plus some pseudo-socialist populist claptrap about spending and building and jobs and infrastructure, all of which are never going to happen.
Actually popular actually socialist policies that actually help people and build things seem like they would be a good counter to this.
posted by Artw at 7:23 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
angrycat: I just can't believe these fuckers are going after health care again. I mean, I believe it but it's just getting surreal.
It's because healthcare isn't just about healthcare: GOP lawmakers fear that the failure of the Obamacare repeal measures makes it more difficult to push tax reform on the scale that they hoped because of the fiscal arithmetic involved. (Joseph Lawler, Washington Examiner, March 24, 2017)
posted by filthy light thief at 7:24 AM on July 21, 2017 [26 favorites]
It's because healthcare isn't just about healthcare: GOP lawmakers fear that the failure of the Obamacare repeal measures makes it more difficult to push tax reform on the scale that they hoped because of the fiscal arithmetic involved. (Joseph Lawler, Washington Examiner, March 24, 2017)
"Yes, this does make tax reform more difficult," House Speaker Paul Ryan acknowledged in a press conference Friday. "But it doesn't in any way make it impossible."Emphasis mine. The GOP only cares about healthcare because it's a major expense that they're more than happy to slash and hack. For 2016, Medicare was $588 billion, Medicaid was $368 billion, while Defense was $584 billion. Instead of "right-sizing" the military, Trump wanted to increase the Pentagon’s base budget by roughly 10% (New York Times team reporting on the The Key Spending Cuts and Increases in Trump’s Budget, May 22, 2017).
The key consideration is that the Obamacare replacement measure would have cut tax revenues by roughly $1 trillion over 10 years. Lowering the baseline for tax revenues would mean that Republicans, seeking to cut tax rates without adding to the deficit, would have to cut fewer tax breaks to make up the lost revenue.
"This was really important, especially for setting up tax reform," Rep. Andy Barr, R-Ky., said in the moments after the healthcare bill was pulled. "Remember, this would have lowered the baseline for tax reform by a trillion dollars." The bill's failure, he said, "makes tax reform harder."
posted by filthy light thief at 7:24 AM on July 21, 2017 [26 favorites]
Trump has asked his advisers about his power to pardon aides, family members and even himself in connection with the probe, according to one of those people. A second person said Trump’s lawyers have been discussing the president’s pardoning powers among themselves.
Of course, Trump's power to pardon does not extend to state charges -- say, in his native New York.
What it does do is prevent those he pardons from taking the Fifth.
posted by Gelatin at 7:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Of course, Trump's power to pardon does not extend to state charges -- say, in his native New York.
What it does do is prevent those he pardons from taking the Fifth.
posted by Gelatin at 7:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
She's right, that is what he said to the NYTimes. But the Miss Universe Pageant was in November 2013! That's 3.7 years ago, for the mathematicians.
Hmmm... I wonder what DID happen "8 or 9 years ago"? Muller... Muller... Muller...
posted by mikelieman at 7:30 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Hmmm... I wonder what DID happen "8 or 9 years ago"? Muller... Muller... Muller...
posted by mikelieman at 7:30 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
National Treasure Alexandra Petri, WaPo: The summer bucket list of a 75-year-old Senate majority leader
This was discovered all the way across town from the Senate, crumpled up under a big stack of visual aids (?) used for off-camera briefings (?!?!). With apologies to the Hip Teen whose bucket list was discovered, and the 35-year-old.posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:30 AM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
Mitch McConnell’s summer bucket list:
Deny one person health-care coverage.
Meet a crab.
Rose Garden Bud Light party to celebrate bill signing!!!
Repeal something, doesn’t matter what.
Deny 32 million people health-care coverage.
Remember just for a few seconds what joy is.
Get someone to call him a “master tactician,” but they’re being sincere and not cruel or ironic.
Get a filibuster-proof majority on something, anything.
Seersucker Thursday!
Go one night without having the nightmare.
[…]
WikiPenis says... "In 2007, Drinks Americas signed a deal to export 50,000 cases of Trump Vodka annually to Russia..."
posted by mikelieman at 7:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by mikelieman at 7:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Rep. Dana Rohrabacher has made several trips to Moscow during his 15 terms in Congress... But the chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Subcommittee on Europe, Eurasia and Emerging Threats...
That's not what Rohrabacher calls it. Fun times on Samantha Bee. Rohrbacher at 45 sec, but pls stick around for Louie Gohmert saying people enter the military so they can have their sex organs cut off and replaced for free. And so much more. (probably NSFW, lots of naughty words.)
(Fun bonus flashback: Remember Rohrabacher is one of the two people on Putin's payroll. )
posted by martin q blank at 7:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
That's not what Rohrabacher calls it. Fun times on Samantha Bee. Rohrbacher at 45 sec, but pls stick around for Louie Gohmert saying people enter the military so they can have their sex organs cut off and replaced for free. And so much more. (probably NSFW, lots of naughty words.)
(Fun bonus flashback: Remember Rohrabacher is one of the two people on Putin's payroll. )
posted by martin q blank at 7:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
Donald thought that graft was simple,
turn it on and turn it off.
Manafort was complicated,
like some Russian film-maker's plot.
KellyAnne was the perfect lady,
always kept her falsehoods straight.
Jared was a rich daddy's boy,
silver spoon and a Senate date.
posted by Sophie1 at 7:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [28 favorites]
turn it on and turn it off.
Manafort was complicated,
like some Russian film-maker's plot.
KellyAnne was the perfect lady,
always kept her falsehoods straight.
Jared was a rich daddy's boy,
silver spoon and a Senate date.
posted by Sophie1 at 7:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [28 favorites]
That Samantha Bee segment... Jee-hee-hee-zuss. I've seen those guys deliver some zingers, but that needs to go on the Greatest Hits playlist.
TFW you want to know what kind of people live in the districts that look at Gohmert and King and say "Yeah, they seem legit"... and yet you *don't* want to know.
posted by Rykey at 7:54 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
TFW you want to know what kind of people live in the districts that look at Gohmert and King and say "Yeah, they seem legit"... and yet you *don't* want to know.
posted by Rykey at 7:54 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Stopped Clock Jennifer Rubin, WaPo, leads this morning's Two Minutes Hate: Don’t waste your sympathy on Sessions
Republicans are rallying around Sessions, whispering that he has been humiliated and suggesting that Trump is undeserving of such a loyal adviser. Sorry, but this is a pair who deserve one another. Sessions knew exactly what he was getting into when he teamed up with a candidate who insulted Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) and POWs and attacked a federal court judge on the grounds that his ethnicity prevented him from doing his job. Sessions apparently didn’t think anything was amiss when Trump invited the Russians to hack Hillary Clinton’s emails. Session was willing to stick by him after the “Access Hollywood” tape revelation. Once in office, Sessions did not flinch when Trump impugned our intelligence services, gave code-word classified information to the Russian foreign minister and fired the FBI director. Sessions violated the broad language of his recusal to participate in James B. Comey’s firing and incorporated by reference Deputy Attorney General Rod J. Rosenstein’s absurd, pretextual memo saying that Comey treated Clinton unfairly. Sessions isn’t motivated to quit or sound the alarm bell when Trump threatens Comey, lies about tapes or attempts to intimidate the special counsel.posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [48 favorites]
STOP TRYING TO TEACH TRUMP TO BE A HUMAN BEING
I was comparing two Presidents, not teaching Trump anything.
....and just get him out of there.
Man, wouldn't it be nice if it were that easy.
Trump's not getting impeached in the next two years. Republicans won't vote to impeach him.
The Republicans have spent decades putting party over country. Decades. This will not change in the near future. They have an agenda and would pretty much only impeach a President from their own party if he did everything in his power to stop them from fulfilling it. And let's face it, they probably wouldn't impeach even then. He'd have to nuke New Jersey or something. Their party now has a majority in all three branches of federal government and has a firm grip on a large number of state governments, (legislative, courts and governorships.) They are in power, and impeaching Trump would jeopardize that. Besides, his approval rating within their base is very high.
Judging by the utter disarray and incompetence of the Democratic Party as well as their obvious disdain for Progressives, I have difficulty believing they'll re-take all of Congress in '18. It's possible, tho. The party of the President usually loses votes in the House during midterms when a President's approval rating dips below 50% close to election day. Trump's is currently in the high 30's. But those midterms are still over a year away.
Currently, there is no realistic way to "just get him out of there". I wish there were.
But even if we did, the next names on the line of succession are Pence, Ryan and Orrin Hatch.
Since getting "him out of there" is not an immediate option, in my not-so-humble opinion the most important things we can do now are:
1) Mitigate the damage he and Congress are doing
2) Work to support Congressional candidates who are likely to win against Republican incumbents
3) Educate people about their rights and what Trump and Congress are doing.
4) Support GOTV efforts.
posted by zarq at 8:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [28 favorites]
I was comparing two Presidents, not teaching Trump anything.
....and just get him out of there.
Man, wouldn't it be nice if it were that easy.
Trump's not getting impeached in the next two years. Republicans won't vote to impeach him.
The Republicans have spent decades putting party over country. Decades. This will not change in the near future. They have an agenda and would pretty much only impeach a President from their own party if he did everything in his power to stop them from fulfilling it. And let's face it, they probably wouldn't impeach even then. He'd have to nuke New Jersey or something. Their party now has a majority in all three branches of federal government and has a firm grip on a large number of state governments, (legislative, courts and governorships.) They are in power, and impeaching Trump would jeopardize that. Besides, his approval rating within their base is very high.
Judging by the utter disarray and incompetence of the Democratic Party as well as their obvious disdain for Progressives, I have difficulty believing they'll re-take all of Congress in '18. It's possible, tho. The party of the President usually loses votes in the House during midterms when a President's approval rating dips below 50% close to election day. Trump's is currently in the high 30's. But those midterms are still over a year away.
Currently, there is no realistic way to "just get him out of there". I wish there were.
But even if we did, the next names on the line of succession are Pence, Ryan and Orrin Hatch.
Since getting "him out of there" is not an immediate option, in my not-so-humble opinion the most important things we can do now are:
1) Mitigate the damage he and Congress are doing
2) Work to support Congressional candidates who are likely to win against Republican incumbents
3) Educate people about their rights and what Trump and Congress are doing.
4) Support GOTV efforts.
posted by zarq at 8:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [28 favorites]
Are we still doing 2018 campaign slogans?
Vote Democratic: It's Time for Leadership.
posted by Rykey at 8:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Vote Democratic: It's Time for Leadership.
posted by Rykey at 8:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
And to zarq's eminently sensible list, add:
5) Keep faxing, calling, etcetera'ing Congress to keep up the pressure.
posted by Doktor Zed at 8:22 AM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
5) Keep faxing, calling, etcetera'ing Congress to keep up the pressure.
posted by Doktor Zed at 8:22 AM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
From the Washington Post's editorial board:
posted by zarq at 8:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
“There is a danger that Americans become so inured to President Trump’s indifference to rule of law that they forget how a president who respected public service and the Constitution — and had nothing to hide — would speak and behave. In the interest of jogging memories, we have matched a few of Mr. Trump’s Wednesday comments to The New York Times with imagined quotations of what an ethical president might say.
posted by zarq at 8:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
mmoncur That's funny, I thought Trump won using exactly those lines.
You're justified in thinking that, but it's wrong.
Yes, Trump talked a lot about the horrors of the Democrats and how much better he was than they are.
But, and more importantly, he spent a lot of time talking (lying) about all the stuff he was going to do. If you listen to his stump speeches they're filled with his promises of improving things (for a Trumpian value of improving). Build the wall. Renegotiate trade deals. Save American jobs. Make America Christian again. Fix the inner cities. End terrorism in 30 days. Repair and undo all the horrible, horrible, harm the Democrats had inflicted on America. Deport 30 million illegal aliens. Bring back manufacturing from China. Give everyone super great paying jobs that Mexico stole. Make Mexico pay for the wall. Deport all the Muslims. Shut down immigration by Muslims until we "figure out what's going on". Make Europe pay for NATO. End all foreign aid. Get rid of Obamacare and get everyone (understood in this context to mean everyone who deserves it) cheap healthcare. Cut taxes! Spend more on the military!
Trump had a huge, constantly changing, utterly incoherent, agenda filled with promises to do just about everything his base wanted, often changing radically from audience to audience as something that played well with one didn't play so well with another.
He didn't shy away from going negative, but he did offer a program (incoherent, random, bullshit, lies) of his own. To think that Trump's entire campaign was just him saying he wasn't Hillary is to deeply misunderstand what he did.
posted by sotonohito at 8:27 AM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
You're justified in thinking that, but it's wrong.
Yes, Trump talked a lot about the horrors of the Democrats and how much better he was than they are.
But, and more importantly, he spent a lot of time talking (lying) about all the stuff he was going to do. If you listen to his stump speeches they're filled with his promises of improving things (for a Trumpian value of improving). Build the wall. Renegotiate trade deals. Save American jobs. Make America Christian again. Fix the inner cities. End terrorism in 30 days. Repair and undo all the horrible, horrible, harm the Democrats had inflicted on America. Deport 30 million illegal aliens. Bring back manufacturing from China. Give everyone super great paying jobs that Mexico stole. Make Mexico pay for the wall. Deport all the Muslims. Shut down immigration by Muslims until we "figure out what's going on". Make Europe pay for NATO. End all foreign aid. Get rid of Obamacare and get everyone (understood in this context to mean everyone who deserves it) cheap healthcare. Cut taxes! Spend more on the military!
Trump had a huge, constantly changing, utterly incoherent, agenda filled with promises to do just about everything his base wanted, often changing radically from audience to audience as something that played well with one didn't play so well with another.
He didn't shy away from going negative, but he did offer a program (incoherent, random, bullshit, lies) of his own. To think that Trump's entire campaign was just him saying he wasn't Hillary is to deeply misunderstand what he did.
posted by sotonohito at 8:27 AM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
Rubin's catalog of Trump's offenses is one of many such, and I find them all compelling, especially when they're attached to a specific person's endorsement of Trump, whether implicit or explicit.
A Trumpist can be:
1. Fine with all those acts on their own merits (but really only when committed by someone in the right demographic)
2. Fine with them because they get something in exchange (whether it's something they actively want or simply staying out of Trump and his followers' crosshairs)
3. Both (e.g. Sessions)
The only way, ever, that a Trumpist will rescind endorsement is if Trump, personally and unambiguously, acts to deny them whatever they hoped for in that exchange. Which of course he will do. But in most cases the blame will fall on some other party.
My dumb slogan:
Democrats 2018: Honor, Community, Strength
posted by Caxton1476 at 8:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
A Trumpist can be:
1. Fine with all those acts on their own merits (but really only when committed by someone in the right demographic)
2. Fine with them because they get something in exchange (whether it's something they actively want or simply staying out of Trump and his followers' crosshairs)
3. Both (e.g. Sessions)
The only way, ever, that a Trumpist will rescind endorsement is if Trump, personally and unambiguously, acts to deny them whatever they hoped for in that exchange. Which of course he will do. But in most cases the blame will fall on some other party.
My dumb slogan:
Democrats 2018: Honor, Community, Strength
posted by Caxton1476 at 8:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Perhaps you'll recall Rick Perry ordering a study of the US electrical grid, with the goal of demonstrating that policies favoring renewables are eroding needed coal plants. Well, a draft finally leaked, demonstrating that the culprit is actually natural gas (surprise, surprise!) and weak demand, undermining Perry's stated political goals.
"Costly environmental regulations and subsidized renewable generation have exacerbated base-load power plant retirements," the draft says. "However, those factors played minor roles compared to the long-standing drop in electricity demand relative to previous expectation and years of low electric prices driven by high natural gas availability."posted by Existential Dread at 8:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
A separate, six-page draft outline prepared by Energy Department staff in May and also obtained by Bloomberg says that the aging coal and nuclear fleet is under stress from competitive electricity markets, weak demand and rising maintenance costs.
Democrats 2018: Had Enough of This Shit Yet?
posted by snuffleupagus at 8:30 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by snuffleupagus at 8:30 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Democrats 2018: Honesty. Loyalty. Kindness. Generosity. Laughter. Magic!
posted by SPrintF at 8:32 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by SPrintF at 8:32 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
a draft finally leaked, demonstrating that the culprit is actually natural gas (surprise, surprise!) and weak demand, undermining Perry's stated political goals.
Guess he got fracked on that one.
'Oops.'
posted by snuffleupagus at 8:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Guess he got fracked on that one.
'Oops.'
posted by snuffleupagus at 8:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Josh Marshall at Talking Points Memo: Sorry. Trump’s Attacks Aren’t Remotely Like Clinton and Starr
President Trump through the totality of his actions, demands and threats has made it crystal clear that he will not accept any investigation of himself, his campaign or his family. He won’t even let it start. No President, not even Nixon, ever suggested such a thing.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
President Trump through the totality of his actions, demands and threats has made it crystal clear that he will not accept any investigation of himself, his campaign or his family. He won’t even let it start. No President, not even Nixon, ever suggested such a thing.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
Josh Marshall at Talking Points Memo: Sorry. Trump’s Attacks Aren’t Remotely Like Clinton and Starr
Someone tell Maggie Haberman
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Someone tell Maggie Haberman
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
I can't resist participating.
Democrats 2018: because your health matters.
Democrats 2018: because your rights matter.
Democrats 2018: because your education matters.
Democrats 2018: because character matters.
etc.
posted by prefpara at 8:37 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
Democrats 2018: because your health matters.
Democrats 2018: because your rights matter.
Democrats 2018: because your education matters.
Democrats 2018: because character matters.
etc.
posted by prefpara at 8:37 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
In all seriousness how about
Democrats 2018: Liberty, equality, justice.
posted by sotonohito at 8:39 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
Democrats 2018: Liberty, equality, justice.
posted by sotonohito at 8:39 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
Exclusive: Mueller asks WH staff to preserve all documents relating to June 2016 meeting (Dana Bash, CNN)
Special counsel Robert Mueller has asked the White House to preserve all documents relating to the June 2016 meeting at Trump Tower that Donald Trump Jr., Jared Kushner and Paul Manafort had with a Russian lawyer and others, according to a source who has seen the letter.
Mueller sent a notice, called a document preservation request, asking White House staff to save "any subjects discussed in the course of the June 2016 meeting" and also "any decisions made regarding the recent disclosures about the June 2016 meeting," according to the source, who read portions of the letter to CNN.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
Special counsel Robert Mueller has asked the White House to preserve all documents relating to the June 2016 meeting at Trump Tower that Donald Trump Jr., Jared Kushner and Paul Manafort had with a Russian lawyer and others, according to a source who has seen the letter.
Mueller sent a notice, called a document preservation request, asking White House staff to save "any subjects discussed in the course of the June 2016 meeting" and also "any decisions made regarding the recent disclosures about the June 2016 meeting," according to the source, who read portions of the letter to CNN.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
Democrats 2018: To your health!
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Special counsel Robert Mueller has asked the White House to preserve all documents relating to the June 2016 meeting at Trump Tower...
So the black smoke rising from the White House just means a new Pope hasn't been chosen yet, right?
posted by jammer at 8:42 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
So the black smoke rising from the White House just means a new Pope hasn't been chosen yet, right?
posted by jammer at 8:42 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
Democrats 2018: Liberty, equality, justice.Why stop there?
posted by pxe2000 at 8:42 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Does anybody else think the slogan conversation has run its course?
posted by diogenes at 8:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [71 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 8:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [71 favorites]
Democrats 2018: To your health!
Democrats 2018: Skål!
posted by Existential Dread at 8:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Democrats 2018: Skål!
posted by Existential Dread at 8:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Mueller asks WH staff to preserve all documents relating to June 2016 meeting
Presumably Manafort and the Trump Organization will be getting the same request?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Presumably Manafort and the Trump Organization will be getting the same request?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Metafilter: Does anybody else think the slogan conversation has run its course?
posted by nubs at 8:46 AM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by nubs at 8:46 AM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
Metafilter: Too Good to Need a Slogan!
posted by SPrintF at 8:48 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by SPrintF at 8:48 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Metafilter: Does anybody else think the slogan conversation has run its course?
That's a paddlin'!
posted by diogenes at 8:49 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
That's a paddlin'!
posted by diogenes at 8:49 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Democrats 2018: because elections matter.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:50 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:50 AM on July 21, 2017
Democrats 2018: That's a paddlin'!
posted by Faint of Butt at 8:50 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Faint of Butt at 8:50 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Democrats 2018: utterly utopian full gay space communism fantasy.
but yes probably
posted by aspersioncast at 8:52 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
but yes probably
posted by aspersioncast at 8:52 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Sean Hannity will no longer receive the Media Research Center’s William F. Buckley Jr. Award for Media Excellence at the group’s September gala.
Oh, snap!
posted by zakur at 8:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
Sources familiar with the situation said it is because Buckley’s son, Christopher Buckley, was unhappy with the decision and expressed his views to MRC head Brent Bozell, who is also Buckley’s nephew. But Hannity and the MRC are claiming it’s a “scheduling conflict.”A source familiar with the situation tells CNN that Christopher Buckley said of the concocted scheduling excuse: "perhaps Mr. Hannity has been offered the Ronald Reagan Great Communicator Award on the same evening and had decided to leverage upwards."
Oh, snap!
posted by zakur at 8:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
Watching Season 4 of Arrested Development. "This may be something more treason-adjacent."
"This is the story of one nation whose healthcare was canceled slowly and painfully, and how one Pinnocchio President had to try to keep his grift together for the sake of the poor healthcare companies and medical-loan organizations."
Have we nothing on Pence yet?
I'm going to have to step out of the madness and just start daily faxing my representatives. Rubio and Nelson. Bat-boy governor Scott is also toying with challenging Nelson ... sigh. How did we not elect Alex Sink?
posted by tilde at 8:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
"This is the story of one nation whose healthcare was canceled slowly and painfully, and how one Pinnocchio President had to try to keep his grift together for the sake of the poor healthcare companies and medical-loan organizations."
Have we nothing on Pence yet?
I'm going to have to step out of the madness and just start daily faxing my representatives. Rubio and Nelson. Bat-boy governor Scott is also toying with challenging Nelson ... sigh. How did we not elect Alex Sink?
posted by tilde at 8:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
> My mother, who brought a MAGA drink cozy to her son-in-law's funeral, reacted like she had been shot at when I mentioned that a change of employment meant that my next health insurance would come via the ACA exchanges. She literally yelled "OH, GOD, NO!"
I'm not sure I understand the problem here. It's not inherently contradictory to hold the views that, a) Obamacare exchange plans are bad health plans, but b) Medicare is good. Between the constant stream of news that Aetna or Blue Cross or whoever are exiting state marketplaces here and there, and the occasional horror stories about high-premium plans that don't cover much of anything, it's not an unreasonable position, even though it might be an uninformed one.
If anything, that sounds like an opening to get your mother on board with Medicare for All, regardless of party affiliation.
posted by creampuff at 8:54 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
I'm not sure I understand the problem here. It's not inherently contradictory to hold the views that, a) Obamacare exchange plans are bad health plans, but b) Medicare is good. Between the constant stream of news that Aetna or Blue Cross or whoever are exiting state marketplaces here and there, and the occasional horror stories about high-premium plans that don't cover much of anything, it's not an unreasonable position, even though it might be an uninformed one.
If anything, that sounds like an opening to get your mother on board with Medicare for All, regardless of party affiliation.
posted by creampuff at 8:54 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
I'll never forget the time I had to not win a Nobel Prize because I had a dentist appointment.
posted by cortex at 8:54 AM on July 21, 2017 [43 favorites]
posted by cortex at 8:54 AM on July 21, 2017 [43 favorites]
Democrats 2018: utterly utopian full gay space communism fantasy
Paddlin' for all!
posted by nubs at 8:55 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Paddlin' for all!
posted by nubs at 8:55 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
If anything, that sounds like an opening to get your mother on board with Medicare for All, regardless of party affiliation.
This was exactly how my Australian friend presented their healthcare system to my in-laws, who were struggling with the idea of a robust social safety net.
"Medicare for all" is a totally appealing policy position, and it's fucking absurd that an entire political party managed to create the current levels of resistance to it.
posted by aspersioncast at 8:58 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
This was exactly how my Australian friend presented their healthcare system to my in-laws, who were struggling with the idea of a robust social safety net.
"Medicare for all" is a totally appealing policy position, and it's fucking absurd that an entire political party managed to create the current levels of resistance to it.
posted by aspersioncast at 8:58 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
ed: What he said ^^
posted by Buntix at 8:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Buntix at 8:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
NYTimes just alerted me that Spicey is OUT. Totally resigned.
posted by Brainy at 8:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Brainy at 8:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Cue Simon and Garfunkel, "America".
posted by jferg at 8:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by jferg at 8:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
The Spice Must Flounce
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:00 AM on July 21, 2017 [28 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:00 AM on July 21, 2017 [28 favorites]
Few more updates from WaPo:
* Are we heading toward a constitutional crisis? (Greg Sargent)
* Lawyer who meet with Trump Jr. had Russian intelligence connections (Andrew Roth)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:01 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
* Are we heading toward a constitutional crisis? (Greg Sargent)
* Lawyer who meet with Trump Jr. had Russian intelligence connections (Andrew Roth)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:01 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
There goes the internet...
posted by Melismata at 9:01 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Melismata at 9:01 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Spicey resigned!
Look, I know we're all worried, but Melissa McCarthy is an incredibly talented actress, I'm sure she'll keep getting work.
posted by mrgoat at 9:02 AM on July 21, 2017 [118 favorites]
Look, I know we're all worried, but Melissa McCarthy is an incredibly talented actress, I'm sure she'll keep getting work.
posted by mrgoat at 9:02 AM on July 21, 2017 [118 favorites]
Spicer should set up a tour of medium-size venues across the country. In each location he can just stand on stage and let people laugh at him. He'll make a million dollars.
posted by Lyme Drop at 9:03 AM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by Lyme Drop at 9:03 AM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
The stories are saying that Spicer resigned because he "vigorously disagrees with the appointment of Anthony Scaramucci as communications director."
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:03 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:03 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
Spicey resigning doesn't seem like that big of a deal. Huckabee Sanders was always the more polished liar.
posted by diogenes at 9:04 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 9:04 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Sean Spicer, the White House press secretary, resigned on Friday morning, telling President Trump he vehemently disagreed with the appointment of the New York financier Anthony Scaramucci as communications director.
Mr. Trump offered Mr. Scaramucci the job at 10 a.m. The president requested that Mr. Spicer stay on, but Mr. Spicer told Mr. Trump that he believed the appointment was a major mistake, according to person with direct knowledge of the exchange.
"Scaramucci? Scaramucci? I must do the fandango..."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:04 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
Mr. Trump offered Mr. Scaramucci the job at 10 a.m. The president requested that Mr. Spicer stay on, but Mr. Spicer told Mr. Trump that he believed the appointment was a major mistake, according to person with direct knowledge of the exchange.
"Scaramucci? Scaramucci? I must do the fandango..."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:04 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
if you're worried about how Spicey is going to pay the bills, don't worry: he has a hedge fund
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:05 AM on July 21, 2017 [42 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:05 AM on July 21, 2017 [42 favorites]
So is he going to actually tell us anything useful now?
posted by Artw at 9:05 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Artw at 9:05 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Spicey's gotta go bye-bye right now.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:06 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by octobersurprise at 9:06 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
So is he going to actually tell us anything useful now?
I'm excited to learn if he signed an NDA, which he should be able to tell us, unless it's in the NDA
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:07 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
I'm excited to learn if he signed an NDA, which he should be able to tell us, unless it's in the NDA
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:07 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
I guess I'll miss the comic relief of Spicey, but it sounds like the Mooch comes with his own fun baggage (twitter thread by Tim Miller, former Jeb! staffer)
posted by gladly at 9:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by gladly at 9:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
This is only one rat getting off the ship, but I get the sense the captain (a) foolishly thinks he can navigate around -- i.e., through -- the Mueller iceberg and (b) just appointed a crewmate so dangerous to the mission that even Spicer decided it was time to hit the lifeboats.
Interesting.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Interesting.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
He'll always have his delicious chocolate eggs.
posted by Yowser at 9:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Yowser at 9:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Spicer was fine with all the lawlessness, the attacks on democracy, the treason, the war on the very idea of American government, but a demotion in the communications hierarchy was too much for him.
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:12 AM on July 21, 2017 [41 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:12 AM on July 21, 2017 [41 favorites]
Spicer now departing in his Buick, all other seats occupied by pallets of cinnamon gum
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:12 AM on July 21, 2017 [23 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:12 AM on July 21, 2017 [23 favorites]
Mr. Spicer told Mr. Trump that he believed the appointment was a major mistake
Well, if Spicey told you something, anything... would you believe him?
posted by azpenguin at 9:13 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Well, if Spicey told you something, anything... would you believe him?
posted by azpenguin at 9:13 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
So is he going to actually tell us anything useful now?
@morninggloria: "Can't wait to read Sean Spicer's tell all book, 500 pages of blank tear stained paper"
Could make for an interesting early AM session from the poop-tweeter in chief...
posted by Buntix at 9:13 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
@morninggloria: "Can't wait to read Sean Spicer's tell all book, 500 pages of blank tear stained paper"
Could make for an interesting early AM session from the poop-tweeter in chief...
posted by Buntix at 9:13 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
but a demotion in the communications hierarchy was too much for him.
Except, he was demoted before without (apparent) incident. This is either personal beef with Scaramucci and/or Spicer reading the wall-writing writ large.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Except, he was demoted before without (apparent) incident. This is either personal beef with Scaramucci and/or Spicer reading the wall-writing writ large.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
"Mr Spicer, I looked over your resume and I'm wondering about the gap in your employment history for this year?"
"I think the resume speaks for itself."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [50 favorites]
"I think the resume speaks for itself."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [50 favorites]
Lee Drutman, Vox: Congressional Republicans are at the World's Worst Dinner Party
posted by Glibpaxman at 9:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
If you’ve ever been at a dinner party, you’ll understand the following dynamic: It’s late. The conversation is deadly dull. Dessert still hasn’t been served. You’re bored and exhausted and want nothing more than to go home and go to bed. But you don’t want to be the first person to leave.Sean Spicer just decided it was time to leave the party. Sessions offered to leave in May. Trump has been treating everyone around him like dog shit with very little to show for it other than a Mueller led investigation. How long until everyone suddenly gets up and leaves, en masse?
Eventually, somebody decides it’s grown late enough. She makes an excuse to leave. Now there’s safety in numbers. You can leave because other people are leaving. And the dinner party ends. Suddenly.
posted by Glibpaxman at 9:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
(I get and share your point, though, T.D. Strange)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:15 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:15 AM on July 21, 2017
That's face it, at that level, you don't resign, you're resigfired.
posted by Yowser at 9:16 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Yowser at 9:16 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Man, just as I'm about to go up into a place where I probably won't be getting Internet or cell reception!
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:17 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:17 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Thomas Frank, Guardian: The media's war on Trump is destined to fail. Why can't it see that?
The truth is that the unanimous anti-Trumpness of the respectable press is just one facet of a larger homogeneity. As it happens, the surviving press in this country is unanimous about all sorts of things.posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:17 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
There are their views on trade. Or their views on what they call “populism”. Or their views on what they call “bipartisanship”. Or their views on just about anything having to do with the decline of manufacturing (sad but inevitable) and the rise of the “creative” white-collar professions (the smart ones, so meritorious).
This is one of the factors that explains the many monstrous journalism failures of the last few decades: the dot-com bubble, which was actively cheered on by the business press; the Iraq war, which was abetted by journalism’s greatest sages; the almost complete failure to notice the epidemic of professional misconduct that made possible the 2008 financial crisis and the rise of Donald Trump, which (despite the media’s morbid fascination with the man) caught nearly everyone flatfooted.
Everything they do, they do as a herd – even when it’s running headlong over a cliff.
I like to think this morning's convo went something like this:
Spicey: I'll tell you what I want, what I really really want.
Donnie: So tell me what you want, what you really really want?
Spicey: I don't wanna, wanna, don't wanna, wanna, really really really don't wanna Scaramucci.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:20 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
Spicey: I'll tell you what I want, what I really really want.
Donnie: So tell me what you want, what you really really want?
Spicey: I don't wanna, wanna, don't wanna, wanna, really really really don't wanna Scaramucci.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:20 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
Spicey wasn't forced out, he's leaving to spend more time with his gum bezoar
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:22 AM on July 21, 2017 [39 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:22 AM on July 21, 2017 [39 favorites]
God, it's so fucking hard to keep track of everything that I honestly thought Spicer quit a while back, or that he'd been replaced by Sarah Huckabee Sanders but kept on just so Trump could heap abuse on him as part of his daily routine.
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:23 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:23 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
It's a high-stress job with, historically, a decent amount of turnover; Spicer was most likely going to leave sometime, even if everything was going well (perhaps especially then), for some other position with better hours or better pay.
Sean Spicer’s tenure as White House press secretary was historically short
The 30 press secretaries who preceded Spicer served an average of 1,062 days — almost three years.
As can be seen from the chart below, Spicer is an extreme outlier, especially when you consider that the cause of his departure is not the end of a presidency, an assassination attempt or Watergate.
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:26 AM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
Sean Spicer’s tenure as White House press secretary was historically short
The 30 press secretaries who preceded Spicer served an average of 1,062 days — almost three years.
As can be seen from the chart below, Spicer is an extreme outlier, especially when you consider that the cause of his departure is not the end of a presidency, an assassination attempt or Watergate.
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:26 AM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
Scaramucci Scaramucci, can you do the fandango?
Spicey bolts and lying, very very trying, whee!
posted by aspersioncast at 9:30 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
Spicey bolts and lying, very very trying, whee!
posted by aspersioncast at 9:30 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
Spicey: I'll tell you what I want, what I really really want.
Of course, I can only hear the Weird Al polka version which makes it even better.
Also: it has been _0_ days since the last Trump disaster.
posted by Melismata at 9:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Of course, I can only hear the Weird Al polka version which makes it even better.
Also: it has been _0_ days since the last Trump disaster.
posted by Melismata at 9:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
They'll just fucking lie!
And what is the actual downside risk of lying in a court? There is a theoretical downside, but how often does that downside actually happen?
ABA (American Bar Association) of 1986 - The Lies Have It points out that perjury is seldom prosecuted.
Do any of the 'professional' class tied to law/lawmaking ACT like lying has a consequence?
posted by rough ashlar at 9:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
And what is the actual downside risk of lying in a court? There is a theoretical downside, but how often does that downside actually happen?
ABA (American Bar Association) of 1986 - The Lies Have It points out that perjury is seldom prosecuted.
Do any of the 'professional' class tied to law/lawmaking ACT like lying has a consequence?
posted by rough ashlar at 9:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Is there anything out there about why so many people in the White House are flipping out over Scaramucci's appointment? Is it just that his only qualification for the job is that he's been a Trump surrogate on the news or is there more to it?
posted by vathek at 9:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by vathek at 9:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Fareed Zakaria, WaPo: Donald Trump’s lost opportunity is notable only for the mention of American Affairs, a journal run by seemingly non-insane Trumpists. Their policy agenda is interesting.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Perjury is more likely to be prosecuted if there comes a time when half the country and more than half of Congress are demanding that it be prosecuted.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
I'm not sure I understand the problem here. It's not inherently contradictory to hold the views that, a) Obamacare exchange plans are bad health plans, but b) Medicare is good. Between the constant stream of news that Aetna or Blue Cross or whoever are exiting state marketplaces here and there, and the occasional horror stories about high-premium plans that don't cover much of anything, it's not an unreasonable position, even though it might be an uninformed one.
To clarify, her major objections to Obamacare revolved around (a) anything connected with Big Government fails and is inherently bad, (b) anything Democratic doubly so, and (c) the free market is obviously the only valid choice. Like a fabled cat, her internal monologue is always in all caps.
She also asked me if I thought the then-Preznit Obama would pardon Hillary for her crimes before leaving office. I asked if he wouldn't want to, y'know, find some actual crimes that she had committed first and received an uncomprehending stare back.
posted by delfin at 9:37 AM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
To clarify, her major objections to Obamacare revolved around (a) anything connected with Big Government fails and is inherently bad, (b) anything Democratic doubly so, and (c) the free market is obviously the only valid choice. Like a fabled cat, her internal monologue is always in all caps.
She also asked me if I thought the then-Preznit Obama would pardon Hillary for her crimes before leaving office. I asked if he wouldn't want to, y'know, find some actual crimes that she had committed first and received an uncomprehending stare back.
posted by delfin at 9:37 AM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
The President obviously dislikes and distrusts Priebus. I sincerely doubt the President feels that Priebus has delivered good results for him over the course of this year. Is he going to keep Priebus around?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:43 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:43 AM on July 21, 2017
The President obviously dislikes and distrusts almost everyone on Earth.
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
I'm going to have to step out of the madness and just start daily faxing my representatives. Rubio and Nelson. Bat-boy governor Scott is also toying with challenging Nelson ... sigh. How did we not elect Alex Sink?
I mean, Florida seems to have been a HUGE target of the Russian active measures campaign. It's hard to believe it had no effect. (Edit- Wikipedia tells me Alex Sink lost to Scott in 2010, so I'm not sure the hacking stuff is as relevant as I had thought to the question you actually asked. Still I think it is interesting seeing these links together)...
Alexandra Berzon and Rob Barry for WSJ:
I mean, Florida seems to have been a HUGE target of the Russian active measures campaign. It's hard to believe it had no effect. (Edit- Wikipedia tells me Alex Sink lost to Scott in 2010, so I'm not sure the hacking stuff is as relevant as I had thought to the question you actually asked. Still I think it is interesting seeing these links together)...
Alexandra Berzon and Rob Barry for WSJ:
DCCC documents sent to [Republican operative] Mr. Nevins [by Guccifer2.0] analyzed specific Florida districts, showing how many people were dependable Democratic voters, how many were likely Democratic voters but needed a nudge, how many were frequent voters but not committed, and how many were core Republican voters—the kind of data strategists use in planning ad buys and other tactics.Eric Lipton and Scott Shane for NYT:
South Florida has long been a laboratory for some of the nation’s roughest politics, with techniques like phantom candidates created by political rivals to siphon off votes from their opponents, or so-called boleteras hired to illegally fill out stacks of absentee ballots on behalf of elderly or disabled voters.Peter W. Stevenson for the Independent
But there was never anything quite like the 2016 election campaign, when a handful of Democratic House candidates became targets of a Russian influence operation that made thousands of pages of documents stolen by hackers from the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee in Washington available to Florida reporters and bloggers.
Senator Marco Rubio (Republican-Florida) just revealed that hackers targeted his presidential campaign staffers in July, just as he was announcing his bid for reelection to the Senate — and yesterday, too.posted by OnceUponATime at 9:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
...
“In July of 2016, shortly after I announced that I would seek reelection to the United States Senate, former members of my presidential campaign team, who had access to the internal information of my presidential campaign, were targeted by IP addresses with an unknown location within Russia. That effort was unsuccessful.”
...
“I'd also inform the committee,” the Intelligence Committee member went on, “that within the last 24 hours, at 10:45am yesterday, a second attempt was made, again against former members of my presidential campaign team, who had access to our internal information, again targeted from an IP address from an unknown location in Russia, and that effort was also unsuccessful.”
Two thoughts on scaramucci (or one thought and an observation): what is the appeal to the president*? he was a fundraiser for Obama, feeds the narrative of hiring Goldman Sachs alums, initially endorsed scott walker and then Jeb! like, seriously for a guy who seems to value loyalty, he sure didn't pick a true believer.
separately - someone is having fun with his Wikipedia page - a fb friend posted a screenshot from a few minutes ago with the opening line "Anthony Scaramucci (born J 6, 1964) is an American entrepreneur, financier, creepy guy, political figure . . . "
someone then changed "guy" in the above to "Turkeydiddler" though it now seems to have been entirely removed . ..
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 9:45 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
separately - someone is having fun with his Wikipedia page - a fb friend posted a screenshot from a few minutes ago with the opening line "Anthony Scaramucci (born J 6, 1964) is an American entrepreneur, financier, creepy guy, political figure . . . "
someone then changed "guy" in the above to "Turkeydiddler" though it now seems to have been entirely removed . ..
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 9:45 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
She has not looked into whether she might qualify for the Medicaid expansion; she was not aware Pennsylvania had expanded the program *MUFFLED SCREAMING*
As I understand medicaid is they feature a clawback. So if your parents died and left you something medicaid can ask for that something to be used to recover the cost of the medicaid services. Or you won that $200 Million powerball.
Medicare does not have a clawback. Nor does regular health insurance.
posted by rough ashlar at 9:46 AM on July 21, 2017
As I understand medicaid is they feature a clawback. So if your parents died and left you something medicaid can ask for that something to be used to recover the cost of the medicaid services. Or you won that $200 Million powerball.
Medicare does not have a clawback. Nor does regular health insurance.
posted by rough ashlar at 9:46 AM on July 21, 2017
I saw one WH reporter say explicitly that Spicer had declared explicitly he would not work with Scaramucci .
posted by sammyo at 9:49 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by sammyo at 9:49 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
I mean, Florida seems to have been a HUGE target of the Russian active measures campaign. It's hard to believe it had no effect.
Yep. Intense strange activity, effort on a handful of counties in Florida last election. I feel this will come back into the press eventually.
posted by rc3spencer at 9:50 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Yep. Intense strange activity, effort on a handful of counties in Florida last election. I feel this will come back into the press eventually.
posted by rc3spencer at 9:50 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
scaramucci - what is the appeal to the president*?
Scaramucci has appeared on TV defending Trump, frequently. Trump must have watched him and liked the performance. That is the beginning and the end of his required qualifications, because we have a TV president.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:52 AM on July 21, 2017 [23 favorites]
Scaramucci has appeared on TV defending Trump, frequently. Trump must have watched him and liked the performance. That is the beginning and the end of his required qualifications, because we have a TV president.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:52 AM on July 21, 2017 [23 favorites]
As I understand medicaid is they feature a clawback. So if your parents died and left you something medicaid can ask for that something to be used to recover the cost of the medicaid services. Or you won that $200 Million powerball.
Only some states, only when you're 55 or older and almost exclusively when you enter long term care.
posted by zrail at 9:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Only some states, only when you're 55 or older and almost exclusively when you enter long term care.
posted by zrail at 9:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Kasowitz's departure from the Trump legal team seems to have been rephrased to "Marc Kasowitz, who has been the lead lawyer on the Russia investigation, will see his role recede."
posted by XMLicious at 9:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by XMLicious at 9:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
In related news, the Library of Congress will now be managed by the President's Tivo.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
If Spicer had the nerve he should practice all summer and lobby for a SNL skit set in Stars Hollow where he does a huge Sookie in the kitchen fixing a special soup for the surprise visit by POTUS. Hilarity ensues.
posted by sammyo at 9:54 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by sammyo at 9:54 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
Thomas Frank, Guardian: The media's war on Trump is destined to fail. Why can't it see that?
Thomas Frank has been recycling the same article for at least the last year. Why can't the media see that?
I mean, it's probably true that communication between cultural/political groups is important for changing the discourse, but all Frank does is bang the "liberal elites, cosmopolitan fops, ivory tower academics" drum. He shows no genuine interest in analysing the problem as a whole, or offering solutions to it; he seems more interested in castigating liberals.
posted by howfar at 9:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Thomas Frank has been recycling the same article for at least the last year. Why can't the media see that?
I mean, it's probably true that communication between cultural/political groups is important for changing the discourse, but all Frank does is bang the "liberal elites, cosmopolitan fops, ivory tower academics" drum. He shows no genuine interest in analysing the problem as a whole, or offering solutions to it; he seems more interested in castigating liberals.
posted by howfar at 9:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Scaramucci has appeared on TV defending Trump, frequently. Trump must have watched him and liked the performance. That is the beginning and the end of his required qualifications, because we have a TV president.
Scaramucci will be able to make any mistake he wants so long as he's forceful and doesn't ever question the president.
Spicer seems to have a sense of shame, that's why things like reporters bringing up logical points on how this shit don't add up got to him.
Scaramucci will probably go in with that sarcastic Brooklyn accent and imply the reporter's mental faculties are challenged.
posted by Talez at 9:58 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Scaramucci will be able to make any mistake he wants so long as he's forceful and doesn't ever question the president.
Spicer seems to have a sense of shame, that's why things like reporters bringing up logical points on how this shit don't add up got to him.
Scaramucci will probably go in with that sarcastic Brooklyn accent and imply the reporter's mental faculties are challenged.
posted by Talez at 9:58 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Today's press conference will be without cameras, or audio; a group of blind monks will carve their reminiscences of the conference into a series of haiku on the antler of a stag; reporters will be permitted to describe the musty odor of said antler
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:58 AM on July 21, 2017 [99 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:58 AM on July 21, 2017 [99 favorites]
Thomas Frank, Guardian: The media's war on Trump is destined to fail. Why can't it see that?
The nut of Frank's argument is the final few graphs:
The nut of Frank's argument is the final few graphs:
These things seem innocent and fun, of course. But there is an unwritten purpose to these daily honor rolls of journo/political friendship and that is to define the limits of what is acceptable.posted by scalefree at 10:00 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Like the guestlist at Lally Weymouth’s party in the Hamptons, which was described so salaciously in Playbook a little while ago, a tiny handful of people and publications and ideas are in; everyone else is out.
It’s about legitimacy, of course, and what’s left of the respectable press is utterly captivated by the theme. It completely defines their war on Trump, for example. They know what a politician is supposed to look like and act like and sound like; they know that Trump does not conform to those rules; and they react to him as a kind of foreign object jammed rudely into their creamy world, a Rodney Dangerfield defiling the fancy country club.
I believe that the news media needs to win its war with Trump, and urgently so. But as long as they understand that war as a crusade to reestablish the old rules of legitimacy, they are going to continue to fail. Until the day they get it right, the world will burn while the in-crowd parties obliviously on.
Today's press conference will be on camera, for a change.
posted by creampuff at 10:01 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by creampuff at 10:01 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Thanks for the correction @creampuff
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:01 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:01 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
If only he wasn't a complete stiff with likely terrible comedic instincts, I'd say Spicer should host the premier of the next season of SNL, (although by then we'll all be dead). He should definitely make a cameo appearance with Melissa McCarthy. It's the only thing that would work to improve his image besides a legit tell-all book about how terrible everything was and how he regrets it all and it was the biggest mistake of his life, etc.
Man I am gonna miss Spicey-Time, though.
posted by dis_integration at 10:03 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Man I am gonna miss Spicey-Time, though.
posted by dis_integration at 10:03 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Today's briefing will be a Fathom Events simulcast in IMAX 3D available in AMC theaters nationwide
posted by theodolite at 10:04 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 10:04 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Although I would definitely prefer the antler-blind-monk-haiku-chanting scenario, or the Fathom event, tbh! Huckabee is just going to do that "I will check and get back to you" thing she's been relying on more and more often lately.
posted by creampuff at 10:05 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by creampuff at 10:05 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Like the guestlist at Lally Weymouth’s party in the Hamptons, which was described so salaciously in Playbook a little while ago
You can make a cultural reference like that and then accuse other people of elitism?!
posted by Faint of Butt at 10:06 AM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
You can make a cultural reference like that and then accuse other people of elitism?!
posted by Faint of Butt at 10:06 AM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
In related news, the Library of Congress will now be managed by the President's Tivo.
I work there, please please don't joke about that because it might become true oh gods
posted by numaner at 10:07 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
I work there, please please don't joke about that because it might become true oh gods
posted by numaner at 10:07 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
The Daily Show remembers Spicer's On-Camera Press Briefings
posted by numaner at 10:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by numaner at 10:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Love the TMZ headline: "Spicer BAILS on Trump!" heh, that's one way of putting it...
posted by Melismata at 10:09 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by Melismata at 10:09 AM on July 21, 2017
Spicer is not resigning by citing a need to spend more time with his family; he's resigning by loudly, publicly condeming a staffing decision by the President.
The President must be livid with fury.
Who knows how he will unleash that anger in coming hours and days?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:12 AM on July 21, 2017 [38 favorites]
The President must be livid with fury.
Who knows how he will unleash that anger in coming hours and days?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:12 AM on July 21, 2017 [38 favorites]
Today (well, yesterday) in "look at how intolerant liberals are, this is a real problem that we should be talking about":
Nearly half of liberals can't even stand to be around Trump supporters.
Well, fucking DUH.
posted by Gaz Errant at 10:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [52 favorites]
Nearly half of liberals can't even stand to be around Trump supporters.
Well, fucking DUH.
posted by Gaz Errant at 10:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [52 favorites]
Thomas Frank, Guardian: The media's war on Trump is destined to fail. Why can't it see that?
What most unhelpful about these kinds of pieces is the way the authors get so wrapped up in their own metaphors that it's nearly impossible to grasp any point other than that they are against something. In this case, while I can see the outlines of an argument, I don't even know what the "media's war on Trump" is; what "failure" or "victory" would be; or why such a thing is "destined."
More matter; less wit.
posted by octobersurprise at 10:15 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
What most unhelpful about these kinds of pieces is the way the authors get so wrapped up in their own metaphors that it's nearly impossible to grasp any point other than that they are against something. In this case, while I can see the outlines of an argument, I don't even know what the "media's war on Trump" is; what "failure" or "victory" would be; or why such a thing is "destined."
More matter; less wit.
posted by octobersurprise at 10:15 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
The saddest thing about this whole affair is that Spicer never had a chance to ask the President whether he believed in anthropogenic climate change...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:15 AM on July 21, 2017 [78 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:15 AM on July 21, 2017 [78 favorites]
Politico: Spicer resigns as White House press secretary
Daily Beast having fun with headlines: Spicey Bails, White House Flails, As Mooch Prevails
Oh, and if you want a really good reason to hate Scaramucci, he said Jared Kushner was "like Alexander Hamilton" a few months back. He's the worst.
Meanwhile, back at the ranch—@byrdinator: "Lisa Murkowski says she's meeting with CMS to go over Alaska-specific numbers on health care later today." So call your Senators, please.
posted by zachlipton at 10:16 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
Scaramucci's expected appointment has caused great upheaval in the West Wing, with chief of staff Reince Priebus and chief strategist Steve Bannon — along with Spicer — expressing opposition to him getting the high-profile job.An unusual twist on Politico's normal stream of "Jared and Ivanka are the good guys" leaks.
"This was a murdering of Reince and Bannon. They said Anthony would get this job over their dead bodies," said one top White House official.
The official added that Scaramucci had the backing of Trump son-in-law and top adviser Jared Kushner, Ivanka Trump, National Economic Council Director Gary Cohn, and Deputy National Security Adviser Dina Powell.
...
"Just hiring Anthony is telling Reince beat it, go find another job," said the source, who cited the tense relationship between the two.
Daily Beast having fun with headlines: Spicey Bails, White House Flails, As Mooch Prevails
Two White House officials confirmed the news to The Daily Beast, with one bluntly noting that they were “surprised it took this long.”With Scaramucci showing up, CNN really needs to say more about the Scaramucci-Russia hedge fund story they retracted. They never said it was untrue, but said it "did not meet CNN's editorial standards" and the reporters, three prominent investigative journalists, apologized and resigned. Which would all be an interesting footnote, and there are reports that Trump hired the guy in part because he managed to get a retraction from CNN, but if he's going to be Communications Director, we actually need to know if the Senate Intelligence Committee is really investigating him or not.
...
According to three senior officials with knowledge of the situation, they and other top aides worried that the Scaramucci hiring would perpetuate the notion of “amateur hour” in the West Wing. White House officials who opposed Scaramucci’s planned rise in Trump’s ranks have referred to the incoming new addition as a “joke” and as a Trump-world “hanger-on” who isn’t qualified for the job and is unprepared to handle the near-constant communications crisis dogging President Trump, senior White House aides noted.
...
Spicer did not answer calls seeking comment on Friday. His cell phone rang once, then went to voicemail.
Oh, and if you want a really good reason to hate Scaramucci, he said Jared Kushner was "like Alexander Hamilton" a few months back. He's the worst.
Meanwhile, back at the ranch—@byrdinator: "Lisa Murkowski says she's meeting with CMS to go over Alaska-specific numbers on health care later today." So call your Senators, please.
posted by zachlipton at 10:16 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
For the plebs among us who don't get Frank's totally non-elitist references, Lally Weymouth. Per Wiki, she's a writer, but also y'know, the daughter of the guy who bought the Washington Post after stepping down as the Chairman of the Federal Reserve, and whose brother and daughter each did stints as the publisher of the Washington Post.
Apparently, her annual summer party is a fixture of Hamptons life!
/hamburger
posted by joyceanmachine at 10:16 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Apparently, her annual summer party is a fixture of Hamptons life!
/hamburger
posted by joyceanmachine at 10:16 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Spicer is not resigning by citing a need to spend more time with his family; he's resigning by loudly, publicly condeming a staffing decision by the President.
Has Spicer actually been quoted with this? Gone on camera to say it? If not, there's still room to cry "fake news" and deny it all.
Granted, if he actually told Trump all this to his face, Trump would know the truth of it, but Trump is vastly more concerned with the appearances and what is said in public than the truth. If those words don't come out of Spicer's mouth in some direct, "yes I own what I said" way, Trump will care fairly little.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:18 AM on July 21, 2017
Has Spicer actually been quoted with this? Gone on camera to say it? If not, there's still room to cry "fake news" and deny it all.
Granted, if he actually told Trump all this to his face, Trump would know the truth of it, but Trump is vastly more concerned with the appearances and what is said in public than the truth. If those words don't come out of Spicer's mouth in some direct, "yes I own what I said" way, Trump will care fairly little.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:18 AM on July 21, 2017
Sean "Spicey" Spicer, always the press secretary of our hearts!
posted by Talez at 10:18 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Talez at 10:18 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Spicer was not the only one opposed to Scaramucci’s hiring. His deputy, Sarah Huckabee Sanders, was as well. So, too, was chief of staff Reince Priebus and chief strategist Steve Bannon, who vocally opposed Trump’s decision, two senior Trump administration officials told The Daily Beast.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 10:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by TWinbrook8 at 10:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
I suppose the slogan talk is stale and I'm sorry to be late. But it strikes me that a slogan is first and foremost a symbol to rally behind. That is to say, a slogan gets its meaning from the way people rally behind it as much as the other way around. It's not the lyrics that matter, but the belting out together.
posted by dmh at 10:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by dmh at 10:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
This was a murdering of Reince and Bannon. They said Anthony would get this job over their dead bodies," said one top White House official.
*Salacious Crumb cackle*
posted by dephlogisticated at 10:21 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
*Salacious Crumb cackle*
posted by dephlogisticated at 10:21 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
Erg, I made a mistake in my Tillerson comment. Tillerson and Exxon Mobil didn't run afoul of Magnitsky Act sanctions. They flouted sanctions associated with Russia's incursion/annexation of Ukraine/Crimea .
posted by notyou at 10:22 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by notyou at 10:22 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
The President obviously dislikes and distrusts almost everyone on Earth.
It's mutual.
posted by Foosnark at 10:22 AM on July 21, 2017 [61 favorites]
It's mutual.
posted by Foosnark at 10:22 AM on July 21, 2017 [61 favorites]
For brevity's sake, Lally Wentworth is the daughter of (the late) Katherine Graham.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 10:24 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by TWinbrook8 at 10:24 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
The Daily Beast article says "Spicer has, for months, been on the White House chopping block, with the president consistently displeased with his now former press secretary’s performance." Such decisive leadership from President "You're Fired!"
posted by kirkaracha at 10:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by kirkaracha at 10:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Reince Priebus and Steve Bannon: less self respect than Sean Spicer.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 10:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 10:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
Tillerson and Exxon Mobil didn't run afoul of Magnitsky Act sanctions. They flouted sanctions associated with Russia's incursion/annexation of Ukraine/Crimea .
In any normal administration, Tillerson would already have been forced to resign. Now it seems beyond hope that congressional Republicans will even express disapproval. But we still have to ask them...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:26 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
In any normal administration, Tillerson would already have been forced to resign. Now it seems beyond hope that congressional Republicans will even express disapproval. But we still have to ask them...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:26 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
>"The truth is that the unanimous anti-Trumpness of the respectable press is just one facet of a larger homogeneity. As it happens, the surviving press in this country is unanimous about all sorts of things."
Note that where people generally agree with Republicans, it's a "mandate", and not a failure of Our Media Institutions.
If you ask people if it's a good idea to run back into a burning building to retrieve your favorite sweater, you will pretty unanimously be told 'no'. This does not reflect bias or a lack of fairness in reporting. It's just clearly a stupid thing to do, and trying to make the opposing viewpoint sound equally reasonable in the name of 'balance' is also stupid.
If everybody thinks you're an asshole, it's not necessarily a problem with the press. You might just be an asshole.
posted by Sing Or Swim at 10:26 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
Note that where people generally agree with Republicans, it's a "mandate", and not a failure of Our Media Institutions.
If you ask people if it's a good idea to run back into a burning building to retrieve your favorite sweater, you will pretty unanimously be told 'no'. This does not reflect bias or a lack of fairness in reporting. It's just clearly a stupid thing to do, and trying to make the opposing viewpoint sound equally reasonable in the name of 'balance' is also stupid.
If everybody thinks you're an asshole, it's not necessarily a problem with the press. You might just be an asshole.
posted by Sing Or Swim at 10:26 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
Per Wiki, she's a writer, but also y'know, the daughter of the guy who bought the Washington Post after stepping down as the Chairman of the Federal Reserve, and whose brother and daughter each did stints as the publisher of the Washington Post.
And Talking Head Tina Weymouth's ex-sister-in-law.
CNBC's Eamon Javers tweets:
posted by octobersurprise at 10:26 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
And Talking Head Tina Weymouth's ex-sister-in-law.
CNBC's Eamon Javers tweets:
A source close to the WH press office just emailed me: "This is a joke. Trump wanted Scaramucchi on television as a surrogate."One wonders if the "source" is Spicey.
posted by octobersurprise at 10:26 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
I'm not finished. I'm on a roll. If any of the speakers want to invoke the cloture they can and I'll follow the procedures.
But I'm not going to be sloganeering. I really want to go to your country and help you but I can't. If I do that it's election fraud.
The Dems, or Opposition, look like they've been hoarding the good stuff, the one weird trick, the nuclear option, and not willing to use them too early. Saving for a rainy day. Now is a rainy day. It's raining big league, tremendously. A storm is raging. You're not heading to a constitutional crisis, you're drowning in it.
The Opposition can survive this and it's not just about surviving. There must be a shining beacon into the posterity testifying what humans can achieve. At this hour, if you don't aim this high, you will likely end up falling low.
The Dems are not weak. They must find their strength. America is full of it and I can see it and hear it from afar. This strength is not just powerful but also therapeutic. Find it, wield it, and stop pretending. Stop saying "we're just like this, you see, but please vote for us anyway." Say "This is who we are and what we are. We're proud of ourselves and we're proud of you." Start standing for the things that cannot be killed and forgotten even if you fail. Stop waiting for Trump to implode, because what comes next may be even worse. You people deserve better and you can get it. You people have many allies, living or dead.
To win a majority is first and foremost a battle of hearts and ideas. To do this you need to combine reason, emotion, and character. It says something about this "character" stuff when you lose to Trump, but we all make terrible mistakes. We're all flawed beings. Character, ethos, is about having some goal worthy of all your reasons and emotions. It's about the ability to bring out our good, kindness, strength, wisdom, and justice that can never be separated from us inside, no matter how little there is, just as we can't totally dispensed with our weaknesses and dark sides. Trumps & co. can exploit the latter and you can totally appeal to the former.
Maybe it's tempting to say you've already tried all that and everything. Wrong. Not even close.
posted by runcifex at 10:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
But I'm not going to be sloganeering. I really want to go to your country and help you but I can't. If I do that it's election fraud.
The Dems, or Opposition, look like they've been hoarding the good stuff, the one weird trick, the nuclear option, and not willing to use them too early. Saving for a rainy day. Now is a rainy day. It's raining big league, tremendously. A storm is raging. You're not heading to a constitutional crisis, you're drowning in it.
The Opposition can survive this and it's not just about surviving. There must be a shining beacon into the posterity testifying what humans can achieve. At this hour, if you don't aim this high, you will likely end up falling low.
The Dems are not weak. They must find their strength. America is full of it and I can see it and hear it from afar. This strength is not just powerful but also therapeutic. Find it, wield it, and stop pretending. Stop saying "we're just like this, you see, but please vote for us anyway." Say "This is who we are and what we are. We're proud of ourselves and we're proud of you." Start standing for the things that cannot be killed and forgotten even if you fail. Stop waiting for Trump to implode, because what comes next may be even worse. You people deserve better and you can get it. You people have many allies, living or dead.
To win a majority is first and foremost a battle of hearts and ideas. To do this you need to combine reason, emotion, and character. It says something about this "character" stuff when you lose to Trump, but we all make terrible mistakes. We're all flawed beings. Character, ethos, is about having some goal worthy of all your reasons and emotions. It's about the ability to bring out our good, kindness, strength, wisdom, and justice that can never be separated from us inside, no matter how little there is, just as we can't totally dispensed with our weaknesses and dark sides. Trumps & co. can exploit the latter and you can totally appeal to the former.
Maybe it's tempting to say you've already tried all that and everything. Wrong. Not even close.
posted by runcifex at 10:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
> The prevalent belief on the left that Trump isn't just a bad president or person, but is also racist, xenophobic and misogynistic is undoubtedly at play here too.
Yeah, that miiiiiight have something to do with it. I've got friends up here in Canada who are significantly more conservative than I am, and we talk about politics and have our disagreements about things, which is all well and good...but there are certainly lines they could cross past which I would have a hard time maintaining my respect for them, and support for Donald Trump and his policies would be one of them.
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [37 favorites]
Yeah, that miiiiiight have something to do with it. I've got friends up here in Canada who are significantly more conservative than I am, and we talk about politics and have our disagreements about things, which is all well and good...but there are certainly lines they could cross past which I would have a hard time maintaining my respect for them, and support for Donald Trump and his policies would be one of them.
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [37 favorites]
Today (well, yesterday) in "look at how intolerant liberals are, this is a real problem that we should be talking about":
Nearly half of liberals can't even stand to be around Trump supporters.
Well, fucking DUH.
posted by Gaz Errant at 10:14 AM on July 21 [2 favorites +] [!]
Yes, it truly is shocking that knowing that a person would willingly support someone who has destroyed my chance at a PhD, threatens to severely impact my retired parents' health care and pensions, and possibly would love to deport my mother regardless of her actual citizenship would put a strain on my interactions with them. But somehow as a liberal I'm the one with a problem. Do these people even listen to the words coming out of their mouth?
Actually, the most shocking thing in there was the number of non-white responses saying there would be no strain. I can only surmise a lack of friendships there to begin with.
posted by ultranos at 10:29 AM on July 21, 2017 [85 favorites]
Nearly half of liberals can't even stand to be around Trump supporters.
Well, fucking DUH.
posted by Gaz Errant at 10:14 AM on July 21 [2 favorites +] [!]
Yes, it truly is shocking that knowing that a person would willingly support someone who has destroyed my chance at a PhD, threatens to severely impact my retired parents' health care and pensions, and possibly would love to deport my mother regardless of her actual citizenship would put a strain on my interactions with them. But somehow as a liberal I'm the one with a problem. Do these people even listen to the words coming out of their mouth?
Actually, the most shocking thing in there was the number of non-white responses saying there would be no strain. I can only surmise a lack of friendships there to begin with.
posted by ultranos at 10:29 AM on July 21, 2017 [85 favorites]
Joseph Goebbels resigned today, expressing anger at the Führer's decision to promote Reichstag outsider Leni Riefenstahl
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:30 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:30 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Yeah, that miiiiiight have something to do with it. I've got friends up here in Canada who are significantly more conservative than I am, and we talk about politics and have our disagreements about things, which is all well and good...but there are certainly lines they could cross past which I would have a hard time maintaining my respect for them, and support for Donald Trump and his policies would be one of them.
I'm pretty sure if I had supported Donald Trump during the election I would be a divorcé right now.
Never has being a lifelong supporter of social liberalism (and by extension, finding Trump abhorrent) been worth more to me.
posted by Talez at 10:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
I'm pretty sure if I had supported Donald Trump during the election I would be a divorcé right now.
Never has being a lifelong supporter of social liberalism (and by extension, finding Trump abhorrent) been worth more to me.
posted by Talez at 10:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
Frank is hit-or-miss with me, and this piece didn't resonate. I mean, I agree that the mainstream press is ultimately beholden to—and shares the elitist values of—many of the same business interests as the people they criticize. But I can understand that and still appreciate when they get something right—and going after Trump is a no-brainer. You could even say he's so bad even the mainstream news isn't compromising their own interests by allowing its staff to go after him.
To put it another way: the mainstream press does a shitty job handling a lot of issues (like the ones Frank cites), often because of class loyalties—but how does it necessarily follow that their "obsessive" coverage of Trump is doomed to fail (whatever that means)? Would we want them not reporting on it, however imperfectly?
Like octobersurprise, I just didn't grasp Frank's point in this article. I'd be interested in a different takeaway if anybody has one.
posted by Rykey at 10:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
To put it another way: the mainstream press does a shitty job handling a lot of issues (like the ones Frank cites), often because of class loyalties—but how does it necessarily follow that their "obsessive" coverage of Trump is doomed to fail (whatever that means)? Would we want them not reporting on it, however imperfectly?
Like octobersurprise, I just didn't grasp Frank's point in this article. I'd be interested in a different takeaway if anybody has one.
posted by Rykey at 10:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
More will be revealed! FOX News reporting that Spicer is on tonight's Hannity!
posted by Mister Bijou at 10:32 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Mister Bijou at 10:32 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
"This was a murdering of Reince and Bannon. They said Anthony would get this job over their dead bodies," said one top White House official.
The official added that Scaramucci had the backing of Trump son-in-law and top adviser Jared Kushner, Ivanka Trump, National Economic Council Director Gary Cohn, and Deputy National Security Adviser Dina Powell.
...
"Just hiring Anthony is telling Reince beat it, go find another job," said the source, who cited the tense relationship between the two.
It's going to be pretty funny if it turns out that the one thing that saves this country is everyone in Trump's administration working in their own enlightened self-interest.
posted by middleclasstool at 10:33 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
The official added that Scaramucci had the backing of Trump son-in-law and top adviser Jared Kushner, Ivanka Trump, National Economic Council Director Gary Cohn, and Deputy National Security Adviser Dina Powell.
...
"Just hiring Anthony is telling Reince beat it, go find another job," said the source, who cited the tense relationship between the two.
It's going to be pretty funny if it turns out that the one thing that saves this country is everyone in Trump's administration working in their own enlightened self-interest.
posted by middleclasstool at 10:33 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Nearly half of liberals can't even stand to be around Trump supporters.
He bragged about sexual assault. He doesn't pay his workers and he doesn't give a fuck about understanding anything. He mocked a disabled reporter for his disability. He talks like a tough guy when it's other people's lives on the line after dodging the draft (repeatedly). He explicitly wants to ban people from entering the US based on their religion. He literally campaigned on war crimes. And oh, yes, he clearly sold us out to Putin.
Yes. I can't stand being around people who think any of that is okay. And by the definition of "liberal" by a lot of other "liberals," I'm probably not very liberal myself.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:33 AM on July 21, 2017 [100 favorites]
He bragged about sexual assault. He doesn't pay his workers and he doesn't give a fuck about understanding anything. He mocked a disabled reporter for his disability. He talks like a tough guy when it's other people's lives on the line after dodging the draft (repeatedly). He explicitly wants to ban people from entering the US based on their religion. He literally campaigned on war crimes. And oh, yes, he clearly sold us out to Putin.
Yes. I can't stand being around people who think any of that is okay. And by the definition of "liberal" by a lot of other "liberals," I'm probably not very liberal myself.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:33 AM on July 21, 2017 [100 favorites]
It's completely typical and also really funny that the only thing about his presidency that Trump has any actual opinions about is that his press secretary look and act a certain way. Has he actively fought for anything else over the objections of his staff?
I swear, Trump is completely ripe for a Salazar-style coup where you tell him that he's totally still in power and making Very Important Decisions that no one follows if you just set up a fake TV network for him where he can watch his press secretary call reporters idiots. As long as said press secretary is a white guy with a big tie and a full head of hair, I can't imagine anything would make Trump happier. You'd maybe also want to rope the Fox & Friends people into doing a second daily show about how wonderful President Trump is. That's kind of it, though. It's not like he knows or cares about anything that's actually happening.
posted by Copronymus at 10:33 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
I swear, Trump is completely ripe for a Salazar-style coup where you tell him that he's totally still in power and making Very Important Decisions that no one follows if you just set up a fake TV network for him where he can watch his press secretary call reporters idiots. As long as said press secretary is a white guy with a big tie and a full head of hair, I can't imagine anything would make Trump happier. You'd maybe also want to rope the Fox & Friends people into doing a second daily show about how wonderful President Trump is. That's kind of it, though. It's not like he knows or cares about anything that's actually happening.
posted by Copronymus at 10:33 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Eamonn Javers' following tweets certainly support the theory that Mystery Guest Close To Press Office is, indeed, Spicer.
Surprising to me someone close to White House is calling this a "joke" + "there was simply no understanding by the president of this job, that the communications director title comes with lots of responsibilities, not just going on television
posted by Devonian at 10:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Surprising to me someone close to White House is calling this a "joke" + "there was simply no understanding by the president of this job, that the communications director title comes with lots of responsibilities, not just going on television
posted by Devonian at 10:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Is he still close to the Press Office? Traffic must be bad.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
I just didn't grasp Frank's point in this article. I'd be interested in a different takeaway if anybody has one.
My takeaway is he wrote the article because he didn't get invited to a party in the Hamptons.
posted by rocket88 at 10:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [21 favorites]
My takeaway is he wrote the article because he didn't get invited to a party in the Hamptons.
posted by rocket88 at 10:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [21 favorites]
"This is a joke. Trump wanted Scaramucchi on television as a surrogate."
Can someone explain this one to me? What do they mean by "joke" in this context? Has Trump not wanted Spicey and Huckabee-Sanders to also be surrogates (and for that matter, have either of them resisted that role?)
posted by R a c h e l at 10:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Can someone explain this one to me? What do they mean by "joke" in this context? Has Trump not wanted Spicey and Huckabee-Sanders to also be surrogates (and for that matter, have either of them resisted that role?)
posted by R a c h e l at 10:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
zachlipton: According to three senior officials with knowledge of the situation, they and other top aides worried that the Scaramucci hiring would perpetuate the notion of “amateur hour” in the West Wing.
Unfortunately, to shake "the of 'amateur hour' in the West Wing," they'd have to hire a ton of compitent people, and that ain't gonna happen as long as Trump demands loyalty and gives none back (Seth Meyers's closer look: Trump Turns on Sessions Amid Russia Probe). When key positions of your administration are staffed by your family, you're not fit to be President of the United States. Maybe president of a local chapter of the Emperor Norton fan club is more your speed.
posted by filthy light thief at 10:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Unfortunately, to shake "the of 'amateur hour' in the West Wing," they'd have to hire a ton of compitent people, and that ain't gonna happen as long as Trump demands loyalty and gives none back (Seth Meyers's closer look: Trump Turns on Sessions Amid Russia Probe). When key positions of your administration are staffed by your family, you're not fit to be President of the United States. Maybe president of a local chapter of the Emperor Norton fan club is more your speed.
posted by filthy light thief at 10:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
The "joke" is that the job of White House Communications Director is vastly more complex and demanding than being a talking head spouting talking points on Fox News.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:37 AM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:37 AM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
Ok, I think I get it. I guess I wasn't thinking much about the role of the press secretary outside of the daily briefings (shame on me, I've seen my West Wing...)
posted by R a c h e l at 10:37 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by R a c h e l at 10:37 AM on July 21, 2017
Boycott Sean Spicer
now that he’s resigned, he shouldn’t be allowed to escape his identity as Trump’s most loyal propagandist: a man who saw it as his job to mistreat the press and lie to the public, in service of the president’s efforts to enrich himself and impoverish the country.
Working in the Trump administration should be a career ender. No network other than FOX should book Spicer. No law firm should ever hire Rosenstein. Whenever this is over, agreeing to serve as a Trump appointee has to mark the end of your professional career.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [47 favorites]
now that he’s resigned, he shouldn’t be allowed to escape his identity as Trump’s most loyal propagandist: a man who saw it as his job to mistreat the press and lie to the public, in service of the president’s efforts to enrich himself and impoverish the country.
Working in the Trump administration should be a career ender. No network other than FOX should book Spicer. No law firm should ever hire Rosenstein. Whenever this is over, agreeing to serve as a Trump appointee has to mark the end of your professional career.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [47 favorites]
Sorry, jinx, yep. I guess I just thought that was already obviously what Trump wanted so not a revelation in any way.
posted by R a c h e l at 10:38 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by R a c h e l at 10:38 AM on July 21, 2017
Can someone explain this one to me? What do they mean by "joke" in this context?
I'm reading it as a contemptuous declaration that Scaramucci is an unserious candidate for the complex and demanding role of Press Sec. Unlike, y'know, a seasoned pro like Sean Spicer.
posted by cortex at 10:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'm reading it as a contemptuous declaration that Scaramucci is an unserious candidate for the complex and demanding role of Press Sec. Unlike, y'know, a seasoned pro like Sean Spicer.
posted by cortex at 10:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Ben Terris, who wrote the definitive profile on Spicer, says he just talked to him and that Spicer is going to be "sticking around for a couple of weeks" and after that will "continue to advance the president's agenda." Also: "It's been an unbelievable honor and privilege," Spicer said. "This is something you dream of. I can't thank the president enough."
Blech.
Brian Beutler notes that all should Boycott Sean Spicer. He'll get wingnut welfare of course, but anyone legitimate should stay far, far away:
Blech.
Brian Beutler notes that all should Boycott Sean Spicer. He'll get wingnut welfare of course, but anyone legitimate should stay far, far away:
To be clear, not wanting to work under Anthony Scaramucci is the most human thing Spicer has done since getting sad that Trump denied him an audience with the Pope. But it is also one of the least elevated justifications Spicer could have cited for his decision to quit. Spicer could have left the White House for any number of high-minded reasons, and he could have used this occasion as an opportunity to make it harder for Trump to do something bad, like smear or fire Special Counsel Robert Mueller.posted by zachlipton at 10:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
He went with naked careerism instead. Even in quitting he owned himself.
Press Secretary and Communications Director are normally two different people. Sean Spicer was doing both because the old Communications Director quit in June.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Republicans Won't Prevent a Constitutional Crisis Because They Don't Think It'll be a Crisis
The problem isn't that Republicans lack the imagination to foresee an all-out Trump attack on the rule of law. It's that they can't imagine what would be so terrible about that -- it wouldn't have an obvious direct impact on them. It wouldn't take money out of the pockets of their donors. Their voters would cheer. [...]posted by tonycpsu at 10:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [41 favorites]
Elected Republicans seem incapable of taking seriously any concern that doesn't personally touch them, their donors, or their base. Torture? The only Republican who seems at all troubled by it is John McCain -- because he was tortured. Same-sex marriage? Rob Portman is a rare Republican who came around on this issue -- because his son is gay.
So how can we expect them to care about the rule of law? Will its erosion hurt them personally? Will it hurt the Koch brothers? Will it hurt the retirees in the diner in their district who still wear their Make America Great Again hats? No? Then none of it matters.
Press Secretary and Communications Director are normally two different people. Sean Spicer was doing both because the old Communications Director quit in June.
It was May (though the second to last day of May).
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 10:42 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
It was May (though the second to last day of May).
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 10:42 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
casual reminder that in the midst of this whole fucking shitshow, the republicans are still planning to meet and vote on stripping health care from roughly 20 million americans on Tuesday.
call your senators.
just now, toomey's philly office sent me on, like, a five minute loop of having my call forwarded and forwarded again and being told multiple times that senator toomey cares about my message before being asked to leave a voicemail.
office numbers for good ol' coward pat.
posted by joyceanmachine at 10:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
call your senators.
just now, toomey's philly office sent me on, like, a five minute loop of having my call forwarded and forwarded again and being told multiple times that senator toomey cares about my message before being asked to leave a voicemail.
office numbers for good ol' coward pat.
posted by joyceanmachine at 10:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
SCARAMUCCI FANDAGOS PRESS SECY
Spicer: "I'm just a poor boy, nobody likes me"
posted by snuffleupagus at 10:45 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Spicer: "I'm just a poor boy, nobody likes me"
posted by snuffleupagus at 10:45 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
HE'S JUST A POOR BOY FROM A RICH FAMILY
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:47 AM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:47 AM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
Today's press conference will be on camera, for a change.
We should live stream it just to be sure the "official" one released matches reality*.
Yeah, South Florida, man. It's a right mess down here, and I've worked as a poll judge (I know that's not the right term but it's been a loooong time ... the guy who is the ref on people making decisions as I'm usually registered NPA).
Another reason to tie voter registration and selective service registration for everyone at age 18 (and at 27 the selective service part drops off). Heck, the Selective Service name even still works.
andheck yeah, boycott Spicer. He shouldn't be on TV unless it's clips from C-Span testimony and never as a talking head. I'll take perp walks too (hahahahahahaaaahhhh).
*reality: subjective
posted by tilde at 10:48 AM on July 21, 2017
We should live stream it just to be sure the "official" one released matches reality*.
Yeah, South Florida, man. It's a right mess down here, and I've worked as a poll judge (I know that's not the right term but it's been a loooong time ... the guy who is the ref on people making decisions as I'm usually registered NPA).
Another reason to tie voter registration and selective service registration for everyone at age 18 (and at 27 the selective service part drops off). Heck, the Selective Service name even still works.
andheck yeah, boycott Spicer. He shouldn't be on TV unless it's clips from C-Span testimony and never as a talking head. I'll take perp walks too (hahahahahahaaaahhhh).
*reality: subjective
posted by tilde at 10:48 AM on July 21, 2017
It's completely typical and also really funny that the only thing about his presidency that Trump has any actual opinions about is that his press secretary look and act a certain way.
It's the same reason that Jay Sekulow will be the face of the Trump legal team now. If Trump only consumes news through the TV, he'll only care about who looks good and sounds good on TV. Spicey was a disaster and Sanders is unexciting. Sekulow contradicts himself in the same interview, but he sounds confident doing it, so Trump loves him.
posted by gladly at 10:52 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
It's the same reason that Jay Sekulow will be the face of the Trump legal team now. If Trump only consumes news through the TV, he'll only care about who looks good and sounds good on TV. Spicey was a disaster and Sanders is unexciting. Sekulow contradicts himself in the same interview, but he sounds confident doing it, so Trump loves him.
posted by gladly at 10:52 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
A work colleague added the (anecdotal) report that Spicer is a very devout Catholic who was almost deliberately excluded from being part of the entourage when Trump met Pope Francis and may have also been bitter about that. This may be a last-straw situation.
Also, I'm surprised that no one playing with the slogan has done this yet -
Also, I'm surprised that no one playing with the slogan has done this yet -
DEMOCRATS 2018: Metafilterposted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:53 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
It's going to be pretty funny if it turns out that the one thing that saves this country is everyone in Trump's administration working in their own enlightened self-interest.
I was counting on that but I would have thought that would have kicked in a while ago. So now I am skeptical.
I just called Al Franken's office to thank him for supporting the ACA and I tacked on "and I hope he's doing everything in his power to remove Trump from office". His staffer paused a moment like he was surprised and then emphatically said "Yes ma'am I can guarantee that he is."
posted by Emmy Rae at 10:54 AM on July 21, 2017 [46 favorites]
I was counting on that but I would have thought that would have kicked in a while ago. So now I am skeptical.
I just called Al Franken's office to thank him for supporting the ACA and I tacked on "and I hope he's doing everything in his power to remove Trump from office". His staffer paused a moment like he was surprised and then emphatically said "Yes ma'am I can guarantee that he is."
posted by Emmy Rae at 10:54 AM on July 21, 2017 [46 favorites]
Spicer now says he's sticking around through August. I mean how is that possible? How can you publicly say you're quitting rather than work for someone, then just decide you'll stick around for over a month? I mean, obviously the office is already awkward as hell, but does everyone just stop talking and stare at you when you go to get a cup of coffee from now until August?
posted by zachlipton at 10:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 10:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
@PressSec: It's been an honor & a privilege to serve @POTUS @realDonaldTrump & this amazing country. I will continue my service through August
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Spicer now says he's sticking around through August. I mean how is that possible? How can you publicly say you're quitting rather than work for someone, then just decide you'll stick around for over a month? I mean, obviously the office is already awkward as hell, but does everyone just stop talking and stare at you when you go to get a cup of coffee from now until August?
My boss at my last job gave a "one-month notice" when he quit instead of two weeks. Maybe this is the same thing.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
My boss at my last job gave a "one-month notice" when he quit instead of two weeks. Maybe this is the same thing.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
@PressSec: It's been an honor & a privilege to serve @POTUS @realDonaldTrump & this amazing country. I will continue my service through August
You don't have to stay, Sean. Losing your health insurance by quitting your job counts as a "qualifying event" so you can get coverage through the exchange or on your spouse's insurance plan, even if it isn't open enrollment.
posted by tilde at 10:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [48 favorites]
You don't have to stay, Sean. Losing your health insurance by quitting your job counts as a "qualifying event" so you can get coverage through the exchange or on your spouse's insurance plan, even if it isn't open enrollment.
posted by tilde at 10:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [48 favorites]
I mean how is that possible? How can you publicly say you're quitting rather than work for someone, then just decide you'll stick around for over a month?
He's going to pull a Constanza and pretend it never happened on Monday.
posted by Slap*Happy at 10:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
He's going to pull a Constanza and pretend it never happened on Monday.
posted by Slap*Happy at 10:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
C-SPAN: White House Press Briefing. Stream is live and it's scheduled to start now, but who the heck knows when she'll actually bother to show up.
posted by zachlipton at 11:00 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by zachlipton at 11:00 AM on July 21, 2017
@PressSec: It's been an honor & a privilege to serve @POTUS @realDonaldTrump & this amazing country. I will continue my service through August
Which amazing country will he be serving after August?
Heh.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 11:00 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Which amazing country will he be serving after August?
Heh.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 11:00 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
A work colleague added the (anecdotal) report that Spicer is a very devout Catholic who was almost deliberately excluded from being part of the entourage when Trump met Pope Francis
He wanted to be told he was going to hell in person.
posted by Artw at 11:01 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
He wanted to be told he was going to hell in person.
posted by Artw at 11:01 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Which country will he be serving after August?
It's actually a typo, should be @realDonaldTrump and his amazing country. That one never changes.
posted by Artw at 11:03 AM on July 21, 2017
It's actually a typo, should be @realDonaldTrump and his amazing country. That one never changes.
posted by Artw at 11:03 AM on July 21, 2017
When Spicer becomes a private citizen, maybe he can expand the small group of people who know exactly what "covfefe" means
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:03 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:03 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
One of my fave go-tos to keep things in perspective.
Did not vote was the true vox populi, again. More voters were disgusted, apathetic, suppressed, barred or miscellaneous-ly deterred (life) about even expressing a choice last year.
posted by rc3spencer at 11:06 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Did not vote was the true vox populi, again. More voters were disgusted, apathetic, suppressed, barred or miscellaneous-ly deterred (life) about even expressing a choice last year.
posted by rc3spencer at 11:06 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
National Treasure @JohnDingell:
Wishing Sean Spicer the best of luck in all future endeavors.
We'll always have those six months of you lying to us every single day.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [58 favorites]
Wishing Sean Spicer the best of luck in all future endeavors.
We'll always have those six months of you lying to us every single day.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [58 favorites]
Regarding Gaz Errant's link to the Nearly half of liberals don’t even like to be around Trump supporters piece, all I have to say is: No Fuckin' Shit.
One of the subtexts of this article seemed to be: zomg guys, look how intolerant liberals are, all the while discounting the context of what might lead someone to feel that way.
Consider this passage:
For someone's morality to be so degenerate as to vote for Donald Trump is an absolute affront to anything good that this country has ever done. If I'm paid, I'll deal with you courteously, professionally, and distantly, and fulfill any legal obligations that I have to you. However, I will not be party to such relationships in my personal life, where I'm asked to treat someone's dehumanization of my existence as some milquetoast difference of opinion. We cannot be friends; we cannot be family. Why? Because you have failed the easiest civics test ever to exist and do not value the lives of marginalized people at all. Maybe if you work to undo the horrible damage you have done and we don't all die in a nuclear holocaust, I might be able to some day forgive you.
So yeah, fuck the precious hand-wringing about why a whole bunch of us find the idea of friendship with the Deplorables simple unacceptable.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [204 favorites]
One of the subtexts of this article seemed to be: zomg guys, look how intolerant liberals are, all the while discounting the context of what might lead someone to feel that way.
Consider this passage:
Despite that, it's noteworthy just how many people think supporting the nominee of a major American political party reflects poorly upon the people they know. Fully 46 percent of Americans who voted for president chose Trump, and that isn't really an acceptable position for a friend to take for half of liberal Democrats.This observation completely ignores the history of the so-called Republican Party since approximately 1964. Since the passage of the Civil Rights and Voting Rights Acts of the mid-1960s, this party has:
- Openly and gleefully welcomed racist Confederates like Strom Thurmond and opportunistic racists like Ronald Reagan with wide-open arms.
- Has actively worked to embrace the Lee Atwater strategy of dogwhistle racism as a campaign practice.
- Actively worked to poison the well of public discourse by embrace radical media personalities like Rush Limbaugh, Anne Coulter, Michael Savage, and Fox News, who all spread lies and bullshit with reckless abandon.
- Actively supported voter suppression of marginalized communities.
- Actively engaged in a war on women's freedom.
- Viciously attempted to suppress the recognition of LGBTQ+ rights.
- Worked to gut every possible environmental protection or social safety net program.
- Undermined public perceptions of the scientific method, resulting in mass delusion about species-endangering effects of anthropogenic climate change.
- The list goes on and on and on.
- Started two unwinnable, destabalizing wars in the Middle East.
- Has obviously colluded with a hostile foreign power to interfere in our electoral process.
- Has openly admitted to obstructing justice in investigations about his dealings, by firing the FBI director.
- Betrayed some of the most secret intelligence the United States has to a hostile foreign nation.
- Actively worked to drum up hate against immigrants and refugees.
- Supported a horrible, racist conspiracy theory about the last legitimate President's birth.
- Openly condoned politically motivated violence against peaceful protesters.
- Encouraged "2nd amendment people" to shoot/kill the Presidential candidate of the other major political party.
- Suggested that a federal judge from Indiana could not fairly adjudicate a case about his ridiculous wall because of his Mexican heritage.
- Has stocked his executive branch with open antisemites, racists, charlatans, ignorami, and hate group members.
- Admitted to sexually assaulting women.
- Actively worked to undermine any efforts at addressing climate change.
- Trashed a multitude of long-standing alliances and diplomatic relationships.
- Allowed his pet Confederate trash the limited protections LGBTQ+ people achieved during the last administration.
- Allowed said pet Confederate work to suppress minority voting rights and investigations into police homicides.
- Openly worked to undermine faith in our democratic institutions.
- Repeatedly expressed admiration for some of the most appalling autocrats around the world.
- Abandoned even the pretense of promoting universal human rights around the globe.
- And this this list goes on to 2,340,384.
For someone's morality to be so degenerate as to vote for Donald Trump is an absolute affront to anything good that this country has ever done. If I'm paid, I'll deal with you courteously, professionally, and distantly, and fulfill any legal obligations that I have to you. However, I will not be party to such relationships in my personal life, where I'm asked to treat someone's dehumanization of my existence as some milquetoast difference of opinion. We cannot be friends; we cannot be family. Why? Because you have failed the easiest civics test ever to exist and do not value the lives of marginalized people at all. Maybe if you work to undo the horrible damage you have done and we don't all die in a nuclear holocaust, I might be able to some day forgive you.
So yeah, fuck the precious hand-wringing about why a whole bunch of us find the idea of friendship with the Deplorables simple unacceptable.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:08 AM on July 21, 2017 [204 favorites]
I just didn't grasp Frank's point in this article. I'd be interested in a different takeaway if anybody has one.
Not sure it's his point but it's at least tangential to it. The Trump/Russia campaign exploited vulnerabilities in our (new) social media but also in the already broken & failing (old) traditional media. If we want to stop the bleeding of our democracy that's resulted & prevent such things happening again we need to fix both sets of vulnerabilities.
posted by scalefree at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2017
Not sure it's his point but it's at least tangential to it. The Trump/Russia campaign exploited vulnerabilities in our (new) social media but also in the already broken & failing (old) traditional media. If we want to stop the bleeding of our democracy that's resulted & prevent such things happening again we need to fix both sets of vulnerabilities.
posted by scalefree at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2017
Spicer now says he's sticking around through August. I mean how is that possible?
He got to Washington Circle and decided he didn't want to run away after all?
posted by octobersurprise at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
He got to Washington Circle and decided he didn't want to run away after all?
posted by octobersurprise at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
I've only spoken to two Trump supporters so far, thankfully, and I felt very, extremely uncomfortable both times. One was an Uber driver and another was a friend of a friend. I'm very non-confrontational and I can't imagine finding the right words to tell a person that they're insane and irrational and unethical. Where does a conversation go from there? I could absolutely argue and even enjoy arguing with a McCain, Palin, or Romney supporter, but I'm really at a loss with a Trump guy or gal.
posted by rainy at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by rainy at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Rick Wilson on CNN: "There is no-one on this planet who can say with a straight face that the White House Communications Office is working well."
False. There are several people, and they all work for the White House Communications Office.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
False. There are several people, and they all work for the White House Communications Office.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:09 AM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
Sean Spicer's first post-resignation interview airing on Fox News, "According to a Fox News producer, the interview will also include White House chief of staff Reince Preibus and newly hired White House Communications Director Anthony Scaramucci. The exclusive interview will air at 10 p.m. Spicer's first interview about his resignation is highly anticipated because reports indicate he criticized President Trump's decision to hire Scaramucci."
I think Spicey's had a nice plateful of meatloaf, and he'll exit just how the administration tells him to. Maybe he's getting the Ireland ambassador post after all.
posted by gladly at 11:10 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
I think Spicey's had a nice plateful of meatloaf, and he'll exit just how the administration tells him to. Maybe he's getting the Ireland ambassador post after all.
posted by gladly at 11:10 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Mooch better get to deletin':
@Scaramucci: You can take steps to combat climate change without crippling the economy. The fact many people still believe CC is a hoax is disheartening
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:11 AM on July 21, 2017 [46 favorites]
@Scaramucci: You can take steps to combat climate change without crippling the economy. The fact many people still believe CC is a hoax is disheartening
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:11 AM on July 21, 2017 [46 favorites]
MeFites might be interested in this idea...
posted by OnceUponATime at 11:13 AM on July 21, 2017 [46 favorites]
Host a Mueller Firing Rapid Response EventYou're supposed to identify a congressional office or a court house in your area, put together a list of people you can ask to show up on short notice, and a list of press outlets you can contact to get greater visibility for the protest. Then be ready to show up at the designated rally times on the day Trump fires Mueller. (If Trump fires Mueller prior to 2 p.m. Eastern, rallies will occur at 5 p.m. local time that day; If Trump fires Mueller after 2 p.m. Eastern Time, rallies will occur at Noon local time the following day.)
New revelations of Russia's meddling in our elections are increasing the odds that Donald Trump will try to block the investigation of his Administration's potential collusion with Russia and obstruction of justice.
Experts believe that there is a good possibility that Trump will fire Special Counsel Robert Mueller.
If Trump fires Mueller, we want to be ready to take the streets to protest within hours - to demand that Congress respond quickly and forcefully – to protect our democracy and justice system.
posted by OnceUponATime at 11:13 AM on July 21, 2017 [46 favorites]
Maybe he's getting the Ireland ambassador post after all.
US Embassy relocated to a pair of bushes at the end of the rainbow
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:13 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
US Embassy relocated to a pair of bushes at the end of the rainbow
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:13 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Spicer is despised on the left, he can't afford to also be despised on the right so he'll make it look like amicable departure, he also may be hoping Scaramucci falls on his face so hard and so often within a month that Trump will come crawling back on his knees, smearing tears over his face and ask him to be the new new Comms director.
posted by rainy at 11:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by rainy at 11:14 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
John McCain experiencing some kind of nearness-of-death induced spine growth?
posted by Artw at 11:15 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Artw at 11:15 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
One of my fave go-tos to keep things in perspective.
FTA: Only 8 states + Washington DC, had high enough voter turnouts where one of the actual candidates won more votes than people who did not bother to vote. Iowa and Wisconsin for Trump and Colorado, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New Hampshire and DC for Clinton.
Yet Delaware is blue and DC is brown. I'm wary of any "Brilliant Maps" that confuse DC and DE (this is not a dig at you, rc3spencer! That's just a pretty significant mistake for that person to make).
posted by everybody had matching towels at 11:15 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
FTA: Only 8 states + Washington DC, had high enough voter turnouts where one of the actual candidates won more votes than people who did not bother to vote. Iowa and Wisconsin for Trump and Colorado, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New Hampshire and DC for Clinton.
Yet Delaware is blue and DC is brown. I'm wary of any "Brilliant Maps" that confuse DC and DE (this is not a dig at you, rc3spencer! That's just a pretty significant mistake for that person to make).
posted by everybody had matching towels at 11:15 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Here’s the new WH comms director talking about what a shitty president Trump would be
Also, I read an article earlier today about Scaramucci that had a quote from a "WH source" that was something along the lines of "Scaramucci will be great. He's a comms guy. It's what he does."
Followed by an Arrested Developmentesque statement from the reporter - "Scaramucci doesn't appear to have any professional communications experience."
posted by zakur at 11:16 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
Also, I read an article earlier today about Scaramucci that had a quote from a "WH source" that was something along the lines of "Scaramucci will be great. He's a comms guy. It's what he does."
Followed by an Arrested Developmentesque statement from the reporter - "Scaramucci doesn't appear to have any professional communications experience."
posted by zakur at 11:16 AM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
John McCain experiencing some kind of nearness-of-death induced spine growth?
Doubtful. He's just troubled. Concerned. Asking questions with a furrowed brow. Don't expect him to actually do anything about it.
posted by Roommate at 11:17 AM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
Doubtful. He's just troubled. Concerned. Asking questions with a furrowed brow. Don't expect him to actually do anything about it.
posted by Roommate at 11:17 AM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
Anthony Scaramucci rails against Donald Trump, August 2015
I'll tell you who he's gonna be president of,--you can tell Donald I said this--the Queens County Bullies Association. You gotta cut it out now, stop spinning all this crazy rhetoric.posted by kirkaracha at 11:18 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
...
Are you a Democratic plan for Hillary Clinton and Elizabeth Warren?
...
This nonsense is gonna end and I predict it's gonna end before Thanksgiving.
To build on joyceanmachine said earlier:
Today is my birthday. I'm asking everyone I know to give me the gift of calling their senators to oppose Trumpcare today.
posted by mcduff at 11:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
Today is my birthday. I'm asking everyone I know to give me the gift of calling their senators to oppose Trumpcare today.
posted by mcduff at 11:19 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
John McCain experiencing some kind of nearness-of-death induced spine growth?
Cancer has a clarifying power. Maybe he'll use his remaining days to leave the world a better place like he sometimes seem to want to do.
posted by dis_integration at 11:20 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Cancer has a clarifying power. Maybe he'll use his remaining days to leave the world a better place like he sometimes seem to want to do.
posted by dis_integration at 11:20 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
During ‘Made in America Week,’ President Trump’s Mar-a-Lago Club applies to hire 70 foreign workers
I'll bet they get some really qualified candidates! "So, Mr. Zhang, it says here you graduated top of your class with a Bachelor's in International Relations from PLA National Defense University, then got a Master's researching Signal Processing from PLA Information Engineering University and were just last week awarded the Second Class Order of Heroic Exemplar medal for your skill in housekeeping. I think we can definitely find a spot for you on the team. Oh, good, I see you speak fluent Russian as well, that'll help you communicate with your supervisor, Sergei. He also said marksmanship was his hobby; you'll get along great!"
posted by Homeboy Trouble at 11:21 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
President Trump's Mar-a-Lago Club in Florida has asked permission to hire 70 foreign workers this fall, attesting — in the middle of the White House's “Made in America Week” — that it cannot find qualified Americans to serve as cooks, waiters and housekeepers.
I'll bet they get some really qualified candidates! "So, Mr. Zhang, it says here you graduated top of your class with a Bachelor's in International Relations from PLA National Defense University, then got a Master's researching Signal Processing from PLA Information Engineering University and were just last week awarded the Second Class Order of Heroic Exemplar medal for your skill in housekeeping. I think we can definitely find a spot for you on the team. Oh, good, I see you speak fluent Russian as well, that'll help you communicate with your supervisor, Sergei. He also said marksmanship was his hobby; you'll get along great!"
posted by Homeboy Trouble at 11:21 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
Started Pulitzer winning David Cay Johnston's The Making of Donald Trump last night.
Juicy af.
Within the first two chapters, his characterization of T as a PT Barnum meets Scrooge rings pretty true. His grandfather who rolled various brothels and realty scams across the Pacific Northwest while escaping enlistment in Germany's turn of the century army campaigns, his father who ripped off the FHA for millions (and got caught) in Eisenhower's era with shoddy military housing, and NY low quality real estate, into Trump's own dis-inheritance scams on his cerebral-palsied nephew, while said nephew was an infant and depending on finances for support to even live.
I mean I kind of knew, but . . but obv I didn't know. A true monster.
posted by rc3spencer at 11:21 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
Juicy af.
Within the first two chapters, his characterization of T as a PT Barnum meets Scrooge rings pretty true. His grandfather who rolled various brothels and realty scams across the Pacific Northwest while escaping enlistment in Germany's turn of the century army campaigns, his father who ripped off the FHA for millions (and got caught) in Eisenhower's era with shoddy military housing, and NY low quality real estate, into Trump's own dis-inheritance scams on his cerebral-palsied nephew, while said nephew was an infant and depending on finances for support to even live.
I mean I kind of knew, but . . but obv I didn't know. A true monster.
posted by rc3spencer at 11:21 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
SPICEY, WE HARDLY KNEW YE!
Wow, if this was an actual resignation rather than a forcing-out, fleeing that vipers' nest makes Spicer the smartest person in the White House. Go fucking figure.
Gosh, remember when he came out that first time in his godawful suit looking like an uber-hostile type-A Tweety Bird, yellin' at all the reporters, with visual aids!, lying through his teeth, and making things generally worse for Trump? Little did we know this would be a metaphor for the entire administration.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:23 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Wow, if this was an actual resignation rather than a forcing-out, fleeing that vipers' nest makes Spicer the smartest person in the White House. Go fucking figure.
Gosh, remember when he came out that first time in his godawful suit looking like an uber-hostile type-A Tweety Bird, yellin' at all the reporters, with visual aids!, lying through his teeth, and making things generally worse for Trump? Little did we know this would be a metaphor for the entire administration.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:23 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Thomas Frank: [The media] know what a politician is supposed to look like and act like and sound like; they know that Trump does not conform to those rules; and they react to him as a kind of foreign object jammed rudely into their creamy world, a Rodney Dangerfield defiling the fancy country club.
Frank just described the media's reaction to Bill and Hillary Clinton, and all we got out of that was a phony impeachment and a media vendetta that helped Hillary lose the election.
The media is entirely correct to recognize not just that Trump is illegitimate but document the ways in which he is so. That's a much more worthwhile pastime than parroting conservative sterotypes of liberals.
posted by Gelatin at 11:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Frank just described the media's reaction to Bill and Hillary Clinton, and all we got out of that was a phony impeachment and a media vendetta that helped Hillary lose the election.
The media is entirely correct to recognize not just that Trump is illegitimate but document the ways in which he is so. That's a much more worthwhile pastime than parroting conservative sterotypes of liberals.
posted by Gelatin at 11:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Sarah Sanders starts with a "slow news day" crack. The complete lack of laughter warms my heart. Then she reminds us this is the last day of Made In America Week, and I must say, the White House has really been on message with this.
posted by zachlipton at 11:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 11:25 AM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
Scaramucci thanking his predecessor, Spicer: "and I hope he makes a lot of money."
Fuck this guy.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 11:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
Fuck this guy.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 11:28 AM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
about 8 claps for the announcement that sarah Huckabee sanders is taking over as press sec . . . which is maybe 8 too many.
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 11:29 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 11:29 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Sarah Sanders to be press secretary, Trump's statement about Spicer's resignation cites his "great television ratings," while Scaramucci hopes Spicer "makes a tremendous amount of money."
These people are odious.
posted by zachlipton at 11:29 AM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
These people are odious.
posted by zachlipton at 11:29 AM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
Oh great. We get Sarah Sanders now.
posted by all about eevee at 11:29 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by all about eevee at 11:29 AM on July 21, 2017
She's just as incompetent as Spicer.
They could have hired someone competent, but instead went with the nepotism again.
BREAK OUT THE CHAMPAGNE!
posted by Yowser at 11:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
They could have hired someone competent, but instead went with the nepotism again.
BREAK OUT THE CHAMPAGNE!
posted by Yowser at 11:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
And Talking Head Tina Weymouth's ex-sister-in-law.For a split second I thought Tina had divorced Chris. DON'T DO THAT TO ME.
posted by pxe2000 at 11:31 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Scaramucci seems like the sort of guy who has a collection of human skulls... that he hunted.
posted by Yowser at 11:32 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Yowser at 11:32 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Oh brother, even by Trumpian Horseshit standards, this is some impressively happy horseshit. Everyone but the press loves our Dear Leader. He's succeeding like crazy; it's just not reported.
But the fun part is Scaramucci's vow that he intends to let Trump be himself and "express the full range of his personality and character." Not like those mean, mean lawyers who keep harshing his mellow by telling him not to act like a fucking corrupt conscienceless felon and traitor.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:33 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
But the fun part is Scaramucci's vow that he intends to let Trump be himself and "express the full range of his personality and character." Not like those mean, mean lawyers who keep harshing his mellow by telling him not to act like a fucking corrupt conscienceless felon and traitor.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:33 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
"Scaramucci? Scaramucci? I must do the fandango..."
when i made an almost identical comment a few threads back it was immediately deleted. i'll just be over there in the corner pouting.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 11:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
when i made an almost identical comment a few threads back it was immediately deleted. i'll just be over there in the corner pouting.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 11:34 AM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
How the hell is Scaramucci's hair so black at age 53? Coloring? Special rich TV guy laser hair treatment?
posted by raysmj at 11:35 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by raysmj at 11:35 AM on July 21, 2017
Reuters is live streaming the outside of Spicey's house. It's just a house. The media's war against Spicey's house is destined to fail. And this is why.
posted by octobersurprise at 11:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by octobersurprise at 11:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Real gallop of chatter from Scaramucci; obvious contrast in his motormouth comfort with Spicer and Huckabee Sanders there. A couple odd bits that I've caught: he regrets not being able to serve in the military, a thing he could have just...chosen to do at any time without being drafted. He also notes that he's willing to get rid of his assets in order to serve in the admin because he loves his country, which seems like a needless contrast to throw out there regarding your boss.
posted by cortex at 11:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by cortex at 11:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
He has said he loves the President like 27 times in the past 10 minutes. It's creeping me out.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:35 AM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
Yeah, Scar is bullshitting his way though everything. He's perfect for the job.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 11:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 11:36 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
"The President has really good karma".
posted by rc3spencer at 11:37 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by rc3spencer at 11:37 AM on July 21, 2017
"He is a genuinely wonderful human being."
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:37 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:37 AM on July 21, 2017
did he just say Trump has good karma?
posted by angrycat at 11:37 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 11:37 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
"..the best president in history, maybe ever"
posted by sammyo at 11:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by sammyo at 11:38 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Why does he start every other sentence with "as an entrepreneur" or "I'm a business person" and talk about "opportunity cost?" He can't turn the hedge fund bro talk off.
Someone should ask him about the inauguration crowd size. That's how we started the relationship with Spicer and we should know where our new Communications Director stands.
posted by zachlipton at 11:39 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
Someone should ask him about the inauguration crowd size. That's how we started the relationship with Spicer and we should know where our new Communications Director stands.
posted by zachlipton at 11:39 AM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
Reuters is live streaming the outside of Spicey's house.
I'm just going to sit here and imagine Spicey walking into a Penzeys, taking off his coat, crawling into a little jar, being placed in a rack, and sitting there untouched for several months until he becomes all caked up and unusable
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:39 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
I'm just going to sit here and imagine Spicey walking into a Penzeys, taking off his coat, crawling into a little jar, being placed in a rack, and sitting there untouched for several months until he becomes all caked up and unusable
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:39 AM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
That was one extremely unexpected Dave Eggers ref
posted by theodolite at 11:39 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 11:39 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Spicer is not resigning by citing a need to spend more time with his family; he's resigning by loudly, publicly condeming a staffing decision by the President.
The President must be livid with fury.
And Spicer would know perfectly well, and in advance, that'd be his reaction, too.
posted by Gelatin at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
The President must be livid with fury.
And Spicer would know perfectly well, and in advance, that'd be his reaction, too.
posted by Gelatin at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
"..the best president in history, maybe ever"
Please don't forget your [real] or [fake] for those of us who can't watch!
posted by gladly at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Please don't forget your [real] or [fake] for those of us who can't watch!
posted by gladly at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Is there a more sophisticated concept of karma where he doesn't have barely enough to maybe come back as a genital wart?
posted by Artw at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Artw at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Man, Scaramucci is like who Don Jr. would be if Don Jr. weren't an incompetent idiot but equally sleazy and amoral.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Oh, great. Now we get to learn and obsess over all the little manic verbal ticks of a new briefer lying to us every day instead of the fact that they're still lying to us every day.
posted by T.D. Strange at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 11:40 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
In case we haven't taken down that puerile Aaron Blake hot take enough yet, these lines:
"liberals tend to live in more homogeneous places and don't even associate with conservatives"
"Democrats tend to be more insulated from dissenting political voices"
Fill me with much annoyance. Motherfucking excuse me?
posted by aspersioncast at 11:41 AM on July 21, 2017 [33 favorites]
"liberals tend to live in more homogeneous places and don't even associate with conservatives"
"Democrats tend to be more insulated from dissenting political voices"
Fill me with much annoyance. Motherfucking excuse me?
posted by aspersioncast at 11:41 AM on July 21, 2017 [33 favorites]
I was half-listening -- did this dude just make some kind of creepy North-Korean-esque assertion that Trump is some supernaturally great athlete?
posted by Rhaomi at 11:42 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by Rhaomi at 11:42 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Nah, I think Huckabee Sanders will still be doing the briefings.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:42 AM on July 21, 2017
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:42 AM on July 21, 2017
However, I will not be party to such relationships in my personal life, where I'm asked to treat someone's dehumanization of my existence as some milquetoast difference of opinion. We cannot be friends; we cannot be family. Why? Because you have failed the easiest civics test ever to exist and do not value the lives of marginalized people at all. Maybe if you work to undo the horrible damage you have done and we don't all die in a nuclear holocaust, I might be able to some day forgive you.
This is exactly where I am. I said as much publicly (on FB, before I left) the day after the election: that I might someday be able to forgive a Trump voter, but that I would never forget. To be honest, regarding someone who's still supporting Trump NOW? I don't know if I'll ever even be able to forgive.
My wife's stepmother is a Trumpist (she was posting Infowars to FB a couple weeks ago), and she is raising my wife's half-brother as a wee little Trumpist, and it is KILLING both of us. To have to stand by and watch the corruption of an innocent mind into that is a horror that is hard to put into words.
posted by Gaz Errant at 11:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [25 favorites]
This is exactly where I am. I said as much publicly (on FB, before I left) the day after the election: that I might someday be able to forgive a Trump voter, but that I would never forget. To be honest, regarding someone who's still supporting Trump NOW? I don't know if I'll ever even be able to forgive.
My wife's stepmother is a Trumpist (she was posting Infowars to FB a couple weeks ago), and she is raising my wife's half-brother as a wee little Trumpist, and it is KILLING both of us. To have to stand by and watch the corruption of an innocent mind into that is a horror that is hard to put into words.
posted by Gaz Errant at 11:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [25 favorites]
Whatever else you could say about this, Scaramucci is giving a really good press conference to the specific TV audience of Donald J. Trump. Loves him. Respects him. Is loyal to him. Awed by his athletic prowess. Convinced he's not capable of being under siege. Believes Trump's a winner.
posted by cortex at 11:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
posted by cortex at 11:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
Scaramucci on Trump: "He sinks three-foot puts" and he throws "a dead spiral through a tire."
This guy is the new CEO who talks all smooth when he greets the staff and then goes off and announces a new policy where the only key to the bathroom will be chained to a milk crate kept at his desk.
posted by zachlipton at 11:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [39 favorites]
This guy is the new CEO who talks all smooth when he greets the staff and then goes off and announces a new policy where the only key to the bathroom will be chained to a milk crate kept at his desk.
posted by zachlipton at 11:43 AM on July 21, 2017 [39 favorites]
Why does he start every other sentence with "as an entrepreneur" or "I'm a business person" ...
Hi there! What do we have to do to get you into a President today?
posted by octobersurprise at 11:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Hi there! What do we have to do to get you into a President today?
posted by octobersurprise at 11:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
I was half-listening -- did this dude just make some kind of creepy North-Korean-esque assertion that Trump is some supernaturally great athlete?
Yes, yes he did. It's praise-porn. Trump's fave.
posted by rc3spencer at 11:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Yes, yes he did. It's praise-porn. Trump's fave.
posted by rc3spencer at 11:44 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Wow this guy is a lot better at this than Sean Spicer. And by "this" I mean thoroughly debasing himself while looking like he believes every word and considers it a privilege.
posted by gatorae at 11:46 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 11:46 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
"I look forward to serving him."
I guess we know he isn't going to be serving any of us. How can I place a small side bet on Scaramucci getting tied in to the Russian financial scandal portion of the Mar-a-Russia? I'm convinced the CNN story was true, and he's got $10B of shady dealings.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 11:46 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
I guess we know he isn't going to be serving any of us. How can I place a small side bet on Scaramucci getting tied in to the Russian financial scandal portion of the Mar-a-Russia? I'm convinced the CNN story was true, and he's got $10B of shady dealings.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 11:46 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Man this guy is already a front runner for Dead-Eyed Wall Street Fuck of the Year
posted by theodolite at 11:46 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 11:46 AM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
"liberals tend to live in more homogeneous places and don't even associate with conservatives"
"Democrats tend to be more insulated from dissenting political voices"
Fill me with much annoyance. Motherfucking excuse me?
I think that's true, actually. You'll find more liberals in rural areas than you'll find conservatives in dense urban areas of a similar population. It's a problem, because the fact that Democrats are crammed together more densely means that more of them are sharing a single House rep amongst themselves, while there are a bunch of Republican representatives to represent the same number of Republicans -- because those Republicans are spread out over more districts.
It's like a naturally occuring form of gerrymandering, and it's the reason we need multi-member districts.
posted by OnceUponATime at 11:47 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
"Democrats tend to be more insulated from dissenting political voices"
Fill me with much annoyance. Motherfucking excuse me?
I think that's true, actually. You'll find more liberals in rural areas than you'll find conservatives in dense urban areas of a similar population. It's a problem, because the fact that Democrats are crammed together more densely means that more of them are sharing a single House rep amongst themselves, while there are a bunch of Republican representatives to represent the same number of Republicans -- because those Republicans are spread out over more districts.
It's like a naturally occuring form of gerrymandering, and it's the reason we need multi-member districts.
posted by OnceUponATime at 11:47 AM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
How can I place a small side bet on Scaramucci getting tied in to the Russian financial scandal portion of the Mar-a-Russia?
Trump probably can not stop Mueller but I bet he's asking if they can relocate the investigators offices to Guantanamo Bay. There's openings.
posted by sammyo at 11:49 AM on July 21, 2017
Trump probably can not stop Mueller but I bet he's asking if they can relocate the investigators offices to Guantanamo Bay. There's openings.
posted by sammyo at 11:49 AM on July 21, 2017
This guy is extremely smooth at two things: praising his audience of one and praising himself. I have no reason to believe he knows how to do anything else whatsoever, but I'm also not convinced he needs to.
posted by zachlipton at 11:49 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 11:49 AM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Just received an email from Think Progress of Spicey's top 5 moments entitled, "Sean, but not forgotten."
posted by Sophie1 at 11:50 AM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by Sophie1 at 11:50 AM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
Scaramucci looks like he just came down from Central Casting in response to an ad for "generic mob lawyer".
posted by Justinian at 11:51 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 11:51 AM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
Other notes:
- Calls Trump, in passing, "a great communicator", which feels like a reference that won't even land with Trump but it doesn't matter since as just basic praise it still does the job.
- Refuses to answer a question about whether he'd be willing to tell Trump he's wrong if (a) WH puts out a careful message in the evening and then (b) Trump tweets something that contradicts it in the morning. Because it's totally hypothetical. Law school taught him not to answer such questions, but, look, the Pres is great at social media and Scaramucci loves him.
- Nobody works for Scaramucci; people work with him. Including Reince with whom everybody's gonna be shocked and please with the closeness of their relationship.
- If the Pres says he didn't lose the popular vote, let me do some research on that because maybe there's some truth to it.
posted by cortex at 11:51 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
- Calls Trump, in passing, "a great communicator", which feels like a reference that won't even land with Trump but it doesn't matter since as just basic praise it still does the job.
- Refuses to answer a question about whether he'd be willing to tell Trump he's wrong if (a) WH puts out a careful message in the evening and then (b) Trump tweets something that contradicts it in the morning. Because it's totally hypothetical. Law school taught him not to answer such questions, but, look, the Pres is great at social media and Scaramucci loves him.
- Nobody works for Scaramucci; people work with him. Including Reince with whom everybody's gonna be shocked and please with the closeness of their relationship.
- If the Pres says he didn't lose the popular vote, let me do some research on that because maybe there's some truth to it.
posted by cortex at 11:51 AM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
You see, the definition of "no-quit competitive guy" is having the dedication to practice one small part of an overall skill set (the part that is the least effort)—compare mastering the game of football versus throwing a spiral—and then convincing yourself that you would be great at all the rest of the skills, too, then walking away and calling yourself master of the universe. These guys live in a world of fantasy and rentier capitalism supports their cognitive models, as their passive money flows convince them that they're doing something right while the rest of the world isn't.
posted by sylvanshine at 11:51 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by sylvanshine at 11:51 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
I thought this was Made in America Week, but it has clearly morphed into Mooch and Donnie, Sittin' in a Tree Week.
"I love the President. I love his firm yet silken thighs, his encyclopedic knowledge of birdcalls, and his affinity for cake. I want him to adopt me and change my name to Tony Trump. I would crawl a mile over broken glass and shit just to drink his dirty bathwater and masturbate in his shadow." [fake]
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:51 AM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
"I love the President. I love his firm yet silken thighs, his encyclopedic knowledge of birdcalls, and his affinity for cake. I want him to adopt me and change my name to Tony Trump. I would crawl a mile over broken glass and shit just to drink his dirty bathwater and masturbate in his shadow." [fake]
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:51 AM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
"The President has really good karma"
He's probably talking about the kind on reddit
/u/the-realDonaldTrump
24,674 post karma
32,326 comment karma
posted by metaphorever at 11:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
He's probably talking about the kind on reddit
/u/the-realDonaldTrump
24,674 post karma
32,326 comment karma
posted by metaphorever at 11:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Nobody works for Scaramucci; people work with him. Including Reince with whom everybody's gonna be shocked and please with the closeness of their relationship.
And maybe I misheard, but wasn't the "people don't work for me, they work with me" in answer to a reporter asking if Scaramucci reported to Reince or 45 directly?
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 11:56 AM on July 21, 2017
And maybe I misheard, but wasn't the "people don't work for me, they work with me" in answer to a reporter asking if Scaramucci reported to Reince or 45 directly?
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 11:56 AM on July 21, 2017
Polls are wrong, Trump is loved by the American people. [real]
posted by gatorae at 11:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 11:56 AM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
And oh, yes, he clearly sold us out to Putin.
I wonder if "He sold us out to Putin" would resonate more with Trump's supporters than "collusion with the Russians," as they amount to the same thing.
posted by Gelatin at 11:57 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
I wonder if "He sold us out to Putin" would resonate more with Trump's supporters than "collusion with the Russians," as they amount to the same thing.
posted by Gelatin at 11:57 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
- Nobody works for Scaramucci; people work with him. Including Reince with whom everybody's gonna be shocked and please with the closeness of their relationship.
This is what you say about someone who you plan to ignore and go over their head at every possible opportunity. It's a total humiliation for Reince.
The people who pull the "nobody works for me" gambit always seem to change their tune when they're firing people though.
posted by zachlipton at 11:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
This is what you say about someone who you plan to ignore and go over their head at every possible opportunity. It's a total humiliation for Reince.
The people who pull the "nobody works for me" gambit always seem to change their tune when they're firing people though.
posted by zachlipton at 11:59 AM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
"I'm not going to speak on behalf of the president." um isn't that literally your job
posted by gatorae at 12:01 PM on July 21, 2017 [50 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 12:01 PM on July 21, 2017 [50 favorites]
Wow. That Scaramucci speech was dripping with toxic masculinity.
How he and Reince Priebus pick at each other because they're "like brothers" and brothers pick at each other and that's totally fine and normal. The "boys will be boys" type mentality.
Then, how amazing the president is. How he's a "winner" because he's supposedly good at sports ball? Can make baskets, toss a football, and hit a golf ball? Therefore the idea that (supposedly) good at sports = good as a human and without an ability to be bad at anything or to anyone. It's the same rhetoric as the (unfortunately) cliche football player accused of rape or violence who faces no consequences. He has more value because of some sort of physical skill.
Not to mention the "president has great karma" bit. The whole idea that he may be the best president in history. The smartest political mind. Etc.
Does anyone have a count on how many times he said "I love the president"?
posted by Crystalinne at 12:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
How he and Reince Priebus pick at each other because they're "like brothers" and brothers pick at each other and that's totally fine and normal. The "boys will be boys" type mentality.
Then, how amazing the president is. How he's a "winner" because he's supposedly good at sports ball? Can make baskets, toss a football, and hit a golf ball? Therefore the idea that (supposedly) good at sports = good as a human and without an ability to be bad at anything or to anyone. It's the same rhetoric as the (unfortunately) cliche football player accused of rape or violence who faces no consequences. He has more value because of some sort of physical skill.
Not to mention the "president has great karma" bit. The whole idea that he may be the best president in history. The smartest political mind. Etc.
Does anyone have a count on how many times he said "I love the president"?
posted by Crystalinne at 12:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
He also notes that he's willing to get rid of his assets in order to serve in the admin because he loves his country.
He's not giving up his assets. He is the beneficiary of a tax loophole allowing him to diversify and keep his new assets tax-free.
Guys like Scaramucci often have risky, undiversified portfolios consisting primarily of their own company stock. Think Enron and the risk of losing it all. They would like to cash out and invest in a less risky diversified portfolio but would have to pay hefty capital gains taxes to do so.
Serving a few months in government is a tax-free way to diversify using the ethics loophole that allows them to sell assets without paying taxes. Although they may eventually have to pay the taxes if they later sell their newly safe and diversified assets, that could be decades in the future or even after they die.
The loophole is a wonderful perk, quite contrary to the lying spin Scaramucci puts on it implying a sacrifice. Hey, lying on his first day on the job. What else would you expect?
posted by JackFlash at 12:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [61 favorites]
He's not giving up his assets. He is the beneficiary of a tax loophole allowing him to diversify and keep his new assets tax-free.
Guys like Scaramucci often have risky, undiversified portfolios consisting primarily of their own company stock. Think Enron and the risk of losing it all. They would like to cash out and invest in a less risky diversified portfolio but would have to pay hefty capital gains taxes to do so.
Serving a few months in government is a tax-free way to diversify using the ethics loophole that allows them to sell assets without paying taxes. Although they may eventually have to pay the taxes if they later sell their newly safe and diversified assets, that could be decades in the future or even after they die.
The loophole is a wonderful perk, quite contrary to the lying spin Scaramucci puts on it implying a sacrifice. Hey, lying on his first day on the job. What else would you expect?
posted by JackFlash at 12:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [61 favorites]
His karma is good, his chakras are giving off positive energy, and the color of his aura is orange.
posted by raysmj at 12:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by raysmj at 12:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Whoa, Sanders suddenly seems charming and genuine by contrast
posted by theodolite at 12:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 12:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
I feel like Scaramucci probably idolizes Martin Shkreli, just based on appearances alone.
posted by jferg at 12:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by jferg at 12:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Reuters is live streaming the outside of Spicey's house.
i can't stop watching this. it was difficult to change tabs so i could post this. i should stay away, but the blood of spicer compels me...
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 12:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
i can't stop watching this. it was difficult to change tabs so i could post this. i should stay away, but the blood of spicer compels me...
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 12:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
After hearing Scaramucci repeat that phrase "I love the President" so many times, I have an Eddie Rabbitt earworm now.
posted by rc3spencer at 12:05 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by rc3spencer at 12:05 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Takeaways: He's a smooth-talking hedge fund bro who sure knows how to make the President's heart swell while promoting himself, and he'll put that ahead of any semblance of honesty and integrity every single time. But he'll be praised for speaking in complete sentences and not rambling on about "Holocaust centers." Reince is screwed and was just completely undermined on national TV by someone who just walked in the door.
posted by zachlipton at 12:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 12:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
What inspires a person to become such an unctuous toady, lickspittle, or wormtongue
Is there a tiny prick of humiliation with each debasement, soothed over by the promise of filthy lucre?
posted by Existential Dread at 12:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Is there a tiny prick of humiliation with each debasement, soothed over by the promise of filthy lucre?
posted by Existential Dread at 12:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
I thought this was Made in America Week,
made man in America week?
rimshotjustarimshot
posted by sammyo at 12:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
made man in America week?
rimshotjustarimshot
posted by sammyo at 12:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
I was half expecting him to use the word "bubee," like Ellis from "Die Hard."
posted by raysmj at 12:10 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by raysmj at 12:10 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
So Trump is gonna replace his entire staff with hedge fund bros, isn't he?
posted by Glibpaxman at 12:12 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Glibpaxman at 12:12 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Scaramucci looks like he just came down from Central Casting in response to an ad for "generic mob lawyer".
That's Tony the Smooch. One half Ron Ziegler; one half Smoove B.
posted by octobersurprise at 12:12 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
That's Tony the Smooch. One half Ron Ziegler; one half Smoove B.
posted by octobersurprise at 12:12 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Wow. That Scaramucci speech was dripping with toxic masculinity.
The whole Trump thing has basically just been Toxic Masculinity: The Movie from the very beginning.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:13 PM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
The whole Trump thing has basically just been Toxic Masculinity: The Movie from the very beginning.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:13 PM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
There's not a lot of room from that press conference to referring to Trump as the Dear Leader.
posted by T.D. Strange at 12:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 12:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
There's not a lot of room from that press conference to referring to Trump as the Dear Leader.
Or talking about the time he golfed an 18 and then invented the Super Bowl.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:15 PM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
Or talking about the time he golfed an 18 and then invented the Super Bowl.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:15 PM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
I might someday be able to forgive a Trump voter, but that I would never forget.
Same. And if they want to get anywhere close to forgiveness, they better be calling THEIR senators and representatives every day to beg for crumbs, just like I am. Guess what? They're not. They're not even fucking trying. At least the ones in my life.
Mar-a-Russia
I thought it was Russialago.
posted by Emmy Rae at 12:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Same. And if they want to get anywhere close to forgiveness, they better be calling THEIR senators and representatives every day to beg for crumbs, just like I am. Guess what? They're not. They're not even fucking trying. At least the ones in my life.
Mar-a-Russia
I thought it was Russialago.
posted by Emmy Rae at 12:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
So nobody had July in the Spicey Finally Resigns pool, right? I mean, I thought that since it hadn't happened months ago Spicer actually enjoyed the humiliation and would stick around until the WH had to pry him off of their collective shoe like used cinnamon gum.
posted by lydhre at 12:19 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by lydhre at 12:19 PM on July 21, 2017
His whole thing about dodging some of the reporter's questions because it's "speculation" and his law school trial advocacy class taught him to never speculate on the witness stand... dude, you aren't on fucking trial. (YET.) Completely absurd. He spent half the time touting his education, business, etc. experience to make himself sound impressive. Probably trying to counter the alleged reason for Spicer quitting, i.e. that he is utterly unqualified.
posted by gatorae at 12:20 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by gatorae at 12:20 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
The Southern Kremlin
posted by cmfletcher at 12:20 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by cmfletcher at 12:20 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
Frankly, there was precisely two questions in that entire briefing that served a useful function, which was getting him to completely undermine Reince's authority and asking Scaramucci about claims of 3-5 million illegal votes. The response: "If the president says it … probably some level of truth." And that tells you really everything you need to know about that guy.
If the hit rate is going to be that low, hard to even see the point of pushing for televised briefings.
posted by zachlipton at 12:22 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
If the hit rate is going to be that low, hard to even see the point of pushing for televised briefings.
posted by zachlipton at 12:22 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
Grrrrr. Press conferences like that make me wish I was still a reporter. Here's what I would have asked:
In August 2015, on Fox, you called Donald Trump a "hack politician" who was probably going to "make Elizabeth Warren his vice presidential nominee." You said "I don't like the way he talks about women and I don't like the way he talks about our friend Megan Kelly," and you suggested he was a "Democratic plant." So my question is, were you lying then, or are you lying now, and in either case, why should anyone believe you?
probably the last time I'd ever get called on, but so what. time to call out these SOBs.
(thanks kirkaracha for the link. that's the sort of homework reporters should do (but rarely do) before any interview.)
posted by martin q blank at 12:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [76 favorites]
In August 2015, on Fox, you called Donald Trump a "hack politician" who was probably going to "make Elizabeth Warren his vice presidential nominee." You said "I don't like the way he talks about women and I don't like the way he talks about our friend Megan Kelly," and you suggested he was a "Democratic plant." So my question is, were you lying then, or are you lying now, and in either case, why should anyone believe you?
probably the last time I'd ever get called on, but so what. time to call out these SOBs.
(thanks kirkaracha for the link. that's the sort of homework reporters should do (but rarely do) before any interview.)
posted by martin q blank at 12:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [76 favorites]
I'm struggling to find it on playback, but I believe Scaramucci was asked whether he could assure us that there would be no further major resignations, and his response was that he can't answer that but that he "respects General McMaster greatly". Anyone help? Because... that is... significant...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
How about "Government that Works" or "Government that works for you"?
I like the latter. Repunctuate to
"Government that Works...For YOU!"
posted by Mental Wimp at 12:26 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
I like the latter. Repunctuate to
"Government that Works...For YOU!"
posted by Mental Wimp at 12:26 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
I like how Scaramucci said he regrets that he didn't serve in the military because of his generation, even though he signed up for Selective Service and everything. Poor angel.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:35 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:35 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
The McMaster question is a little less dramatic than I thought, but still, promising:
Q: There have been reports about General McMaster having disagreements on policy over Russia. Can you say that there will be no other high profile resignations or exits from the White House staff?
Scaramucci: OK, again another hypothetical; I honestly cannot answer that one way or the other, although I have an enormous amount of respect for General McMaster, I just don't know the situation. I'm not going to answer it because I don't know.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:36 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Q: There have been reports about General McMaster having disagreements on policy over Russia. Can you say that there will be no other high profile resignations or exits from the White House staff?
Scaramucci: OK, again another hypothetical; I honestly cannot answer that one way or the other, although I have an enormous amount of respect for General McMaster, I just don't know the situation. I'm not going to answer it because I don't know.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:36 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
What really grinds my gears about Sarah Huckabee Sanders is that you know if she were a Democrat she would catch all kinds of shit about being a big ol' Feminist using her maiden name in any capacity still. But since her daddy is a famous Republican..... girl power, or something.
posted by nakedmolerats at 12:37 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by nakedmolerats at 12:37 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Scaramucci's conference had a target audience of one. He's currently doing a great job as the White House Internal Communications Director.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
If you are touched by Scaramucci, you must receive a Cure Disease spell from a 12th or higher level cleric within 6 turns or be transformed into an ooze elemental.
posted by delfin at 12:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [28 favorites]
posted by delfin at 12:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [28 favorites]
Farewell, Sean Spicer, we hardly knew what the hell ye were doing
Sean Spicer, who for months delighted audiences as the bumbling comic foil of Donald Trump’s White House, resigned today, according to the Associated Press, a decision that comes as a disappointment to all who have appreciated the way his bungling antics animated the bureaucratic banality of evil.Remembering Sean Spicer as a guy who didn’t do words good
...with Spicer’s time in the spotlight coming to a close and his myriad gaffes still fresh in our minds, let’s remember Sean Spicer for who he really was: A guy who couldn’t talk good despite that being his entire job.posted by kirkaracha at 12:40 PM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
Burr continues to at least appear to side with the good guys..
Allegra Kirkland, TPM: Senate Intel Chair: ‘The Unmasking Thing Was All Created By Devin Nunes’
Senate Intelligence Committee chairman Richard Burr (R-NC) on Friday accused his counterpart in the House, Rep. Devin Nunes (R- [nocturnal human-opossum-hybrid] CA), of creating a false narrative about Obama administration national security adviser Susan Rice.
Speaking to CNN after Rice was interviewed by the panel in closed session, Burr said he asked no questions about whether she improperly requested and revealed the identities of U.S. individuals swept up in intelligence reports—an accusation Nunes has made repeatedly.
posted by Rust Moranis at 12:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
Allegra Kirkland, TPM: Senate Intel Chair: ‘The Unmasking Thing Was All Created By Devin Nunes’
Senate Intelligence Committee chairman Richard Burr (R-NC) on Friday accused his counterpart in the House, Rep. Devin Nunes (R- [nocturnal human-opossum-hybrid] CA), of creating a false narrative about Obama administration national security adviser Susan Rice.
Speaking to CNN after Rice was interviewed by the panel in closed session, Burr said he asked no questions about whether she improperly requested and revealed the identities of U.S. individuals swept up in intelligence reports—an accusation Nunes has made repeatedly.
posted by Rust Moranis at 12:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
How did you enjoy the season one finale? Season two preview coming soon.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Meanwhile Alex Jones is on it—reporting that Spicey was actually an agent of the Deep State.
If you are touched by Scaramucci, you must receive a Cure Disease spell from a 12th or higher level cleric within 6 turns or be transformed into an ooze elemental.
The much sought after Hand of Smooch provides a +4 CHA but only against Bugbears and Beltway journalists.
posted by octobersurprise at 12:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
If you are touched by Scaramucci, you must receive a Cure Disease spell from a 12th or higher level cleric within 6 turns or be transformed into an ooze elemental.
The much sought after Hand of Smooch provides a +4 CHA but only against Bugbears and Beltway journalists.
posted by octobersurprise at 12:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
I wonder what Ty Cobb, Trump's new discipline lawyer, thinks about Scaramucci wanting to unleash Trump to let him more fully express himself. (Obligatory).
When I'm president I want Stephanie Rhule to be my press secretary.
posted by Room 641-A at 12:49 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
When I'm president I want Stephanie Rhule to be my press secretary.
posted by Room 641-A at 12:49 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Margaret Sullivan: Don’t cry for Spicer. His tenure was a disaster from Day One and he should have quit immediately, in which she does not let the inauguration lies go. And she shouldn't, because those lies set the stage for every lie that came out of the White House.
As the lights go out on Sean Spicer’s unforgettably awful tenure, we can only wish — for his sake — that he had seen this moment coming and saved himself months of humiliation.Daniel Dale: Relentless liar Sean Spicer was the perfect spokesman for Donald Trump: Analysis
Instead, likable as he is said to be, Spicer goes down in history as a joke: The president’s spokesman who couldn’t speak for the president.
In truth, Spicer was always an odd fit for Trump: stammering for a president who cherishes smooth, rumpled where the president prefers suave, a loyal party man for an outsider president suspicious of his party.Alexandra Petri: Sean Spicer is free!
What he did have was a willingness to lie. About virtually everything.
...
“The Navy SEALs will tell you,” Scaramucci said in pledging progress, “that if you want to eat an elephant you gotta eat it one bite at a time.”
Everybody in the room was confused for a moment, and it was like Sean Spicer never left.
Certainly you do not expect me to believe he stayed there of his own free will, and it was the appointment of a man named Anthony Scaramucci as communications director that pushed him over the edge? That Trump’s apparent total disregard for facts, precedents and democratic norms were not enough to do it, but bringing on a man named “Mooch” would be the deciding factor?posted by zachlipton at 12:50 PM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
Never! He would not have stayed there all that time and said all those things if he could at any time have gotten up and walked away. Especially not looking so miserable. He has more character than that.
He did not bring this suffering on himself. How could he have? Who would do such a thing? It is far more likely that it was an enchantment, and therefore we should pity him.
No, congratulations to Sean Spicer for finally breaking the enchantment.
There can be no other explanation for why he remained.
@phranqueigh: I feel like every time a Trump employee quits, Oompa Loompas should appear & sing a song to teach us about the perils of gluttony & greed.
posted by numaner at 12:51 PM on July 21, 2017 [134 favorites]
posted by numaner at 12:51 PM on July 21, 2017 [134 favorites]
Meanwhile Alex Jones is on it—reporting that Spicey was actually an agent of the Deep State.
It's....? Crikey. Does that guy only see the world through false flag glasses?
We're falling deeper and deeper into Thomas Pynchon's door-stop novel of the post-Obama era, I just know it.
posted by notyou at 12:53 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
It's....? Crikey. Does that guy only see the world through false flag glasses?
We're falling deeper and deeper into Thomas Pynchon's door-stop novel of the post-Obama era, I just know it.
posted by notyou at 12:53 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Trump would never sing a song like that.
posted by Room 641-A at 12:53 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Room 641-A at 12:53 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
To quote myself from five months ago,
The only thing that I look forward to about the Trump administration is watching a hapless procession of press secretaries being destroyed before our eyes, one by one.
posted by MrVisible at 12:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
The only thing that I look forward to about the Trump administration is watching a hapless procession of press secretaries being destroyed before our eyes, one by one.
posted by MrVisible at 12:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Burr continues to at least appear to side with the good guys.
Yeah, I doubt Burr is leading the Senate Intelligence Committee's investigation with passion and vigor, but there's no indication that he's actively trying to undermine it. That might make him the most noble Republican in Congress (a very low bar to wiggle under).
posted by diogenes at 12:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Yeah, I doubt Burr is leading the Senate Intelligence Committee's investigation with passion and vigor, but there's no indication that he's actively trying to undermine it. That might make him the most noble Republican in Congress (a very low bar to wiggle under).
posted by diogenes at 12:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Trumpa Lumpa doopity doo
Here's an important message for you
Trumpa Lumpa doopity dee
Stop telling lies when you go on TV
posted by Faint of Butt at 1:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [84 favorites]
Here's an important message for you
Trumpa Lumpa doopity dee
Stop telling lies when you go on TV
posted by Faint of Butt at 1:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [84 favorites]
I like how Scaramucci said he regrets that he didn't serve in the military because of his generation, even though he signed up for Selective Service and everything.
He makes notice of the fact that he signed up for the Selective Service? He deserves brownie points for minimally complying with federal law the same as every other male in the U.S? That's the low bar the Trump administration has set for ethics.
posted by JackFlash at 1:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [26 favorites]
He makes notice of the fact that he signed up for the Selective Service? He deserves brownie points for minimally complying with federal law the same as every other male in the U.S? That's the low bar the Trump administration has set for ethics.
posted by JackFlash at 1:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [26 favorites]
Excommunicated Cardinal: So yeah, fuck the precious hand-wringing about why a whole bunch of us find the idea of friendship with the Deplorables simple unacceptable.
Fixed that for me - the idea that you personally celebrate being or supporting racism, sexism, xenophobia, and homophobia to the point that you are throwing DeploraBalls and celebrating your hatred of others is enough to make me not want to talk to you in most circumstances.
Part of me wants to sit down and talk with you why you think it's OK to publicly proclaim your hatred of others (just as part of me wants to ask the jackass with the bumper sticker "those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't" if they really mean that they'd prefer to be thugs who force others to work for them at sword-point, because they can't work for themselves, or if they're really that scared of the world), but another part of me wants to shout "Fuck Your Hate!" .... which wouldn't make anything better.
So back to saying nothing and just silently scowling at people and their hats, shirts and bumper stickers that proclaim their fear of and hatred for others.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
Fixed that for me - the idea that you personally celebrate being or supporting racism, sexism, xenophobia, and homophobia to the point that you are throwing DeploraBalls and celebrating your hatred of others is enough to make me not want to talk to you in most circumstances.
Part of me wants to sit down and talk with you why you think it's OK to publicly proclaim your hatred of others (just as part of me wants to ask the jackass with the bumper sticker "those who beat their swords into plowshares will plow for those who don't" if they really mean that they'd prefer to be thugs who force others to work for them at sword-point, because they can't work for themselves, or if they're really that scared of the world), but another part of me wants to shout "Fuck Your Hate!" .... which wouldn't make anything better.
So back to saying nothing and just silently scowling at people and their hats, shirts and bumper stickers that proclaim their fear of and hatred for others.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
Oompa Loompa Trumpety Doo
I've got another hot tip for you
Oompa Loompa Trumpety Dee
If you are smart you'll stay out of DC.
posted by Sophie1 at 1:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
I've got another hot tip for you
Oompa Loompa Trumpety Dee
If you are smart you'll stay out of DC.
posted by Sophie1 at 1:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
“The Navy SEALs will tell you,” Scaramucci said in pledging progress, “that if you want to eat an elephant you gotta eat it one bite at a time.”
I think from now on I'm going to credit every nugget of inane folk wisdom I repeat to the Navy SEALs, in order to convey to people what a manly badass I am
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:07 PM on July 21, 2017 [72 favorites]
I think from now on I'm going to credit every nugget of inane folk wisdom I repeat to the Navy SEALs, in order to convey to people what a manly badass I am
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:07 PM on July 21, 2017 [72 favorites]
He makes notice of the fact that he signed up for the Selective Service? He deserves brownie points for minimally complying with federal law the same as every other male in the U.S? That's the low bar the Trump administration has set for ethics.
When the POTUS said that dating and the possibility of getting STDs was "like Vietnam, sort of. It is my personal Vietnam. I feel like a great and very brave solider," he ripped out all the bars that were set to measure decency and started digging a fucking hole.
The sad and shocking thing was that he didn't actually bury himself in that hole, but made it his new base of operations. Behold, our subterranean overlord.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:07 PM on July 21, 2017 [27 favorites]
When the POTUS said that dating and the possibility of getting STDs was "like Vietnam, sort of. It is my personal Vietnam. I feel like a great and very brave solider," he ripped out all the bars that were set to measure decency and started digging a fucking hole.
The sad and shocking thing was that he didn't actually bury himself in that hole, but made it his new base of operations. Behold, our subterranean overlord.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:07 PM on July 21, 2017 [27 favorites]
The Navy SEALs will tell you: a dollar makes me holler.
posted by cortex at 1:08 PM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
posted by cortex at 1:08 PM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
To quote myself from five months ago,
The only thing that I look forward to about the Trump administration is watching a hapless procession of press secretaries being destroyed before our eyes, one by one.
Yup, there was never any doubt that Trump would burn through press secretaries. I'm finding it hard to muster any interest in the process. What difference does it make who they trot out to evade questions and lie to the press corps?
posted by diogenes at 1:08 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
The only thing that I look forward to about the Trump administration is watching a hapless procession of press secretaries being destroyed before our eyes, one by one.
Yup, there was never any doubt that Trump would burn through press secretaries. I'm finding it hard to muster any interest in the process. What difference does it make who they trot out to evade questions and lie to the press corps?
posted by diogenes at 1:08 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
From the end of Sorry. Trump’s Attacks Aren’t Remotely Like Clinton and Starr (Josh Marshall/TPM):
Let me add one final point. The major papers are leading the charge on the Trump probe, week after week and day after day, publishing critical new information. Still though there is sometimes the desire to suggest symmetries and equations where they simply do not exist. Superficial structural similarities are not substantive similarities, it can be easy to pretend that they are when discussing them with people who do not know the details. We rely on the news media to recognize these distinctions even when it requires them to grant that some things simply are not the same, even as the desire for balance might make us wish that they were.posted by ZeusHumms at 1:08 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
The Navy SEALs will tell you: don't teach your grandmother to suck eggs.
posted by Existential Dread at 1:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Existential Dread at 1:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
@phranqueigh: I feel like every time a Trump employee quits, Oompa Loompas should appear & sing a song to teach us about the perils of gluttony & greed
Except instead of seeing Violet turn violet and get rolled away, Spicey just stepped back into the bushes and went about getting paid for ... something, I guess. It's like the Oompa Loompas pretended he wasn't there, which is probably just how he'd like it.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Except instead of seeing Violet turn violet and get rolled away, Spicey just stepped back into the bushes and went about getting paid for ... something, I guess. It's like the Oompa Loompas pretended he wasn't there, which is probably just how he'd like it.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
What do you do when you estimate crowds?
Try to not shout obvious falsehoods out loud.
What do you say when your boss makes typos?
Try to not claim it's a secret code.
(Please stop lying all the time...)
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [27 favorites]
Try to not shout obvious falsehoods out loud.
What do you say when your boss makes typos?
Try to not claim it's a secret code.
(Please stop lying all the time...)
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [27 favorites]
The Navy SEALs will tell you: Never go south of the the river when the Old Kent Road’s in a mess.
posted by Bloxworth Snout at 1:10 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by Bloxworth Snout at 1:10 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Spicer made a Faustian bargain when he signed up to lie morning, noon and night for Trump. The Devil called in his debt and gave Spicer's soul to Melissa McCarthy. She will forever own him; no-one will ever think of Spicer without also thinking of her.
posted by vac2003 at 1:11 PM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by vac2003 at 1:11 PM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Oompa Loompa Trumpety Doo
It was like being the brave and the few.
Oompa Loompa Trumpety Dee
Trump's Vietnam was an STD!
posted by Sophie1 at 1:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
It was like being the brave and the few.
Oompa Loompa Trumpety Dee
Trump's Vietnam was an STD!
posted by Sophie1 at 1:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
Metafilter: The Navy SEALs will tell you: Democrats 2018
posted by mazola at 1:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [39 favorites]
posted by mazola at 1:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [39 favorites]
The box for the VHS tape of Navy SEALs will tell you: "Charlie Sheen, Michael Biehn, and Bill Paxton team up as three of America's finest Naval commandoes in this pulse-pounding adventure that brings out the heavy artillery for explosive action and breathtaking suspense."
posted by Strange Interlude at 1:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by Strange Interlude at 1:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
We're going to need separate threads for the Oompa-Loompa lyrics and the Navy Seals jokes, I'm afraid.
posted by yhbc at 1:15 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by yhbc at 1:15 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
He doesn't just credit inane folk wisdom to Navy SEALS, he credits all kinds of folk wisdom to the wrong people. @nycsouthpaw has been doing some fine twitter searching on this.
Here he attributes the same quote to Lincoln and Churchill in different tweets. He claims Mark Twain said "Dance like no one is watching. Sing like no one is listening. Love like you've never been hurt and live like its heaven on earth." which doesn't even sound like anything Twain could have possibly written. And does "The best way to predict the future is to create it" possibly sound like something Lincoln said?
Is there a page-a-day calendar full of inspirational quotes for the hedge fund set he gets these from?
He also voted for Bill Clinton and Obama, and in 2012, wanted Hillary Clinton to be President (he's going on a tweet deleting spree), so yeah.
posted by zachlipton at 1:15 PM on July 21, 2017 [33 favorites]
Here he attributes the same quote to Lincoln and Churchill in different tweets. He claims Mark Twain said "Dance like no one is watching. Sing like no one is listening. Love like you've never been hurt and live like its heaven on earth." which doesn't even sound like anything Twain could have possibly written. And does "The best way to predict the future is to create it" possibly sound like something Lincoln said?
Is there a page-a-day calendar full of inspirational quotes for the hedge fund set he gets these from?
He also voted for Bill Clinton and Obama, and in 2012, wanted Hillary Clinton to be President (he's going on a tweet deleting spree), so yeah.
posted by zachlipton at 1:15 PM on July 21, 2017 [33 favorites]
"liberals tend to live in more homogeneous places and don't even associate with conservatives"
"Democrats tend to be more insulated from dissenting political voices"
I think that's true, actually
I don't think that's remotely true, because liberals don't isolate themselves in rural areas and get 100% of their information from a church pulpit, deliberately avoiding places of learning and higher education in general specifically because it contradicts their pre-determined viewpoint, deliberately lauding ignorance and homogeneity as superior to integrating themselves with other religions, genders and races.
Conservatives insulate themselves from reality, and in fact their current political agenda is about systematically denying and destroying reality.
posted by Autumnheart at 1:18 PM on July 21, 2017 [42 favorites]
"Democrats tend to be more insulated from dissenting political voices"
I think that's true, actually
I don't think that's remotely true, because liberals don't isolate themselves in rural areas and get 100% of their information from a church pulpit, deliberately avoiding places of learning and higher education in general specifically because it contradicts their pre-determined viewpoint, deliberately lauding ignorance and homogeneity as superior to integrating themselves with other religions, genders and races.
Conservatives insulate themselves from reality, and in fact their current political agenda is about systematically denying and destroying reality.
posted by Autumnheart at 1:18 PM on July 21, 2017 [42 favorites]
I don't think that's remotely true, because liberals don't isolate themselves in rural areas and get 100% of their information from a church pulpit, deliberately avoiding places of learning and higher education in general specifically because it contradicts their pre-determined viewpoint, deliberately lauding ignorance and homogeneity as superior to integrating themselves with other religions, genders and races.
Most conservatives don't live in rural places either, they live in suburbs built and maintained by white supremacy.
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:21 PM on July 21, 2017 [49 favorites]
Most conservatives don't live in rural places either, they live in suburbs built and maintained by white supremacy.
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:21 PM on July 21, 2017 [49 favorites]
my opinion of non-military garbage people who name check the Navy SEALs just to give the impression that they're totally in the same headspace as Navy SEALs and therefore are more Navy SEALsesque than soft-handed effete betas who don't constantly make gratuitous references to the Navy SEALs has no bearing on my opinion of actual Navy SEALs
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:22 PM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:22 PM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
As the Navy Seals say, he who smelt it, dealt it
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 1:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 1:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
Most conservatives don't live in rural places either, they live in suburbs built and maintained by white supremacy.
Thiiiis. I don't know how often people need to point this out before it sinks in. There aren't enough people in truly rural areas to significantly swing a vote. This call is coming from juuuust outside the house.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:24 PM on July 21, 2017 [54 favorites]
Thiiiis. I don't know how often people need to point this out before it sinks in. There aren't enough people in truly rural areas to significantly swing a vote. This call is coming from juuuust outside the house.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:24 PM on July 21, 2017 [54 favorites]
From WSJ:
Oh, and the Mooch thinks the Entourage movie should be considered a classic, if you needed another reason to find him a ridiculous human.
posted by zachlipton at 1:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Mr. Scaramucci leaned in to hug Mr. Spicer, who awkwardly put his arms around Mr. Scaramucci without touching him, said two people who witnessed the exchange. Messrs. Scaramucci and Priebus also shared a handshake, the people said.And from Politico:
Two sources with direct knowledge of the situation said that Scaramucci is being primed to eventually take on the position of chief of staff.Meanwhile, elsewhere in Trump Administration communications: BuzzFeed–At Least Sean Spicer Held Briefings. His Pentagon Counterpart Hasn't:
One person close to White House said there is potential for mass exodus in press office.
Priebus has told people he is determined to stay with the job for one year, mainly to prove the naysayers wrong, but it looks increasingly difficult. That person said that Priebus has been concerned about his reputation and thinks leaving any time short of a year would be seen as a failure.
The Pentagon press secretary has yet to hold an official briefing, three months after Defense Secretary Jim Mattis’ assistant for public affairs, Dana W. White, was sworn in. Mattis and Marine Gen. Joseph Dunford, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs, have held only two on-camera briefings in the six months of the Trump administration; their predecessors in previous administrations regularly provided public briefings. Top commanders of the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, weekly on-camera briefers in previous administrations, no longer regularly appear behind the Pentagon’s once-familiar wooden podium with its light blue curtain and building logo background; they’ve dispatched their spokesmen instead.Looks like the Mooch is bailing on Hannity tonight: just Spicey and Reince.
Oh, and the Mooch thinks the Entourage movie should be considered a classic, if you needed another reason to find him a ridiculous human.
posted by zachlipton at 1:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
As the Navy SEALs say: when you can balance a tack hammer on your head, you will head off your foes with a balanced attack.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 1:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by Huffy Puffy at 1:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
"liberals tend to live in more homogeneous places and don't even associate with conservatives"
"Democrats tend to be more insulated from dissenting political voices"
I'll make sure to let all my Fox-news watching republican friends know that when I see them on a 60 mile bike ride in the morning. If ONLY I didn't know any republicans....
posted by photoslob at 1:27 PM on July 21, 2017
"Democrats tend to be more insulated from dissenting political voices"
I'll make sure to let all my Fox-news watching republican friends know that when I see them on a 60 mile bike ride in the morning. If ONLY I didn't know any republicans....
posted by photoslob at 1:27 PM on July 21, 2017
ClickHole scoop: Heartbreaking: Steve Bannon Is The Only One Who Signed Sean Spicer’s Goodbye Card And He Pretty Clearly Thought It Was The Lunch Order
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
As the Navy SEALs say: when you can balance a tack hammer on your head, you will head off your foes with a balanced attack.
Can somebody ask the Navy SEALs why I'm wearing watermelons on my feet?
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:30 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Can somebody ask the Navy SEALs why I'm wearing watermelons on my feet?
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:30 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Priebus has told people he is determined to stay with the job for one year, mainly to prove the naysayers wrong, but it looks increasingly difficult. That person said that Priebus has been concerned about his reputation and thinks leaving any time short of a year would be seen as a failure.
ha ha delightful, this is like the guy crying and covered in his own vomit at the hot dog eating contest he has already lost insisting that if he doesn't choke down six more hot dogs, he will be seen as a failure
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:31 PM on July 21, 2017 [33 favorites]
ha ha delightful, this is like the guy crying and covered in his own vomit at the hot dog eating contest he has already lost insisting that if he doesn't choke down six more hot dogs, he will be seen as a failure
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:31 PM on July 21, 2017 [33 favorites]
Priebus has told people he is determined to stay with the job for one year, mainly to prove the naysayers wrong, but it looks increasingly difficult. That person said that Priebus has been concerned about his reputation and thinks leaving any time short of a year would be seen as a failure.
Like haven't these people learned that they are dignity wraiths and that the first step to restoring their reputations is to quit and spill tea? Even other republicans won't respect these people later. How could they?
posted by dis_integration at 1:31 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Like haven't these people learned that they are dignity wraiths and that the first step to restoring their reputations is to quit and spill tea? Even other republicans won't respect these people later. How could they?
posted by dis_integration at 1:31 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
I think that's true, actually. You'll find more liberals in rural areas than you'll find conservatives in dense urban areas of a similar population.
Per capita, really? Does that count cities like Indianapolis and Colorado Springs?
But dude provided no evidence or nuance to back up either claim. Homogeneous how exactly? "More insulated from dissenting political voices" how?
Anecdotally, I know more conservatives here in Washington DC than I do back in CO or WY (although I don't think I met a single admitted Republican the whole time I lived in Oakland).
I was born in what was once the most diverse city in the West, and my overall impression of cities outside the Bay Area is that diversity of cultures creates a diversity of politics that break down along complicated, not always predictable lines. Purely anecdata, I know.
posted by aspersioncast at 1:32 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Per capita, really? Does that count cities like Indianapolis and Colorado Springs?
But dude provided no evidence or nuance to back up either claim. Homogeneous how exactly? "More insulated from dissenting political voices" how?
Anecdotally, I know more conservatives here in Washington DC than I do back in CO or WY (although I don't think I met a single admitted Republican the whole time I lived in Oakland).
I was born in what was once the most diverse city in the West, and my overall impression of cities outside the Bay Area is that diversity of cultures creates a diversity of politics that break down along complicated, not always predictable lines. Purely anecdata, I know.
posted by aspersioncast at 1:32 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
No-one knows what the future holds for Sean Spicer. But I have faith in one thing: he will not sink to using chemical weapons
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
As the Navy Seals say, keep your friends close, and your enemies closer; and shoot them.
posted by rainy at 1:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by rainy at 1:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
I apologize profusely for contributing to yet another "city mouse / country mouse / white suburbanites are the true Trumpkins" derail.
posted by aspersioncast at 1:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by aspersioncast at 1:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Daniel Nexon writes at Lawyers, Guns and Money: Reflections on the Current Crisis
posted by the man of twists and turns at 1:35 PM on July 21, 2017 [30 favorites]
What does this all mean? It means that the crises of American institutions is grave indeed. It’s been here for some time, and it came to an immediate head with the election of a demagogue. Trump is weaponizing partisanship—and the underlying loss of faith in democratic institutions—in the service of his narrow interests: status, wealth, and, it seems increasingly clear, avoiding criminal and civil culpability for his business practices. I say “weaponizing” because the right-wing feedback loop ensures that each norm he breaks and each line his crosses is instantly rendered legitimate to 30-40% of the American electorate. It becomes evidence that he’s a fighter, that he doesn’t pull his punches, that the establishment is out to get him. The GOP, whose interest in voter disenfranchisement as a partisan power play dates way back, is, as Damon Linker notes, at risk of going full authoritarian.I appreciate that he namechecks specific, identifiable Republican politicians and correctly identifies how their actions to increase their own political support has helped get us all into this mess.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 1:35 PM on July 21, 2017 [30 favorites]
Dunno who decided to do it when they did, but someone on the Trump team has a few brains anyway.
They dropped the Spicy bomb perfectly so innane BS about the change up in Trump's court will dominate the weekend news cycle and Russia, Trump's threats to fire the investigators, Trump's threat to the investigators that they'd better stay away from his shady business dealings, will be swept aside and forgotten for a time.
It's evil, but I do have to say that either it was masterful timing or an incredible piece of luck for the courtiers at Trump's palace.
posted by sotonohito at 1:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
They dropped the Spicy bomb perfectly so innane BS about the change up in Trump's court will dominate the weekend news cycle and Russia, Trump's threats to fire the investigators, Trump's threat to the investigators that they'd better stay away from his shady business dealings, will be swept aside and forgotten for a time.
It's evil, but I do have to say that either it was masterful timing or an incredible piece of luck for the courtiers at Trump's palace.
posted by sotonohito at 1:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
I wouldn't assume there won't be another scandal supplanting it in the next 24 hours.
posted by Artw at 1:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by Artw at 1:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
I do have to say that either it was masterful timing or an incredible piece of luck
I feel like there are new Omnigate revelations every other day; it would be notable if this debacle didn't overlap with some of them...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
I feel like there are new Omnigate revelations every other day; it would be notable if this debacle didn't overlap with some of them...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
15 minutes left on a Friday afternoon. Mueller fired yet?
posted by ocschwar at 1:44 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by ocschwar at 1:44 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
If Scaramucci manages to raise his profile with Trump and forces Priebus and Bannon out, then the core of the executive will be comprised of Mooch, Ivanka, Jared, and Donny himself...all of whom were either registered or self-identified as Democrats as recently as the last ten years.
I'm surprised this isn't more of an issue with longtime Republicans.
posted by rocket88 at 1:50 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
I'm surprised this isn't more of an issue with longtime Republicans.
posted by rocket88 at 1:50 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
It's okay, they are all thoroughly compromised self serving garbage who don't care if we live or die, they can all hang out under a big tent together.
posted by Artw at 1:55 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Artw at 1:55 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Has anyone asked the White House whether the President believes he has the legal authority to fire Mueller himself?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:58 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:58 PM on July 21, 2017
I believe their position is that he does. But I can't provide a link for it offhand.
posted by Justinian at 2:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Justinian at 2:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
From Murphy's Laws: Professionals are predictable, it's the amateurs that are dangerous.
If you're looking for a military aphorism which sums up the current administration.
posted by honestcoyote at 2:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
If you're looking for a military aphorism which sums up the current administration.
posted by honestcoyote at 2:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Also, I'm surprised that no one playing with the slogan has done this yet -
DEMOCRATS 2018: Metafilter
Why do you hate the mods so?
(The hate that would attract....You think the POTUS threads are long now?)
posted by rough ashlar at 2:01 PM on July 21, 2017
DEMOCRATS 2018: Metafilter
Why do you hate the mods so?
(The hate that would attract....You think the POTUS threads are long now?)
posted by rough ashlar at 2:01 PM on July 21, 2017
Can somebody ask the Navy SEALs why I'm wearing watermelons on my feet?
The Navy SEALs don't recall asking you to do that.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 2:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
The Navy SEALs don't recall asking you to do that.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 2:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Casey Tolan(Politics reporter for @MercNews/@EastBayTimes) @caseytolan
Just asked Nancy Pelosi about Spicer resignation. "I don't even care," she says.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 2:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [79 favorites]
Just asked Nancy Pelosi about Spicer resignation. "I don't even care," she says.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 2:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [79 favorites]
If Scaramucci manages to raise his profile with Trump and forces Priebus and Bannon out, then the core of the executive will be comprised of Mooch, Ivanka, Jared, and Donny himself...all of whom were either registered or self-identified as Democrats as recently as the last ten years.
I'm surprised this isn't more of an issue with longtime Republicans.
You mean Alex Jones has fingered the wrong guy (Spicer) as the Deep State mole?
posted by notyou at 2:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
I'm surprised this isn't more of an issue with longtime Republicans.
You mean Alex Jones has fingered the wrong guy (Spicer) as the Deep State mole?
posted by notyou at 2:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Spicer from June 20th:
Q: Following on that, last week Sarah told us that the President has no intention of firing Rosenstein as the Deputy Attorney General, but he has the right to do so. Rosenstein testified that only — I'm sorry, right to fire Rob Mueller, the special counsel. Rosenstein testified that the regulations give him that power. So how is the White House concluding that the President has the right to fire the special counsel?
MR. SPICER: I mean, I think the broader point here is that everyone who serves the President serves at the pleasure of the President. It may take — I get there may be a technicality as to whom reports to whom. But the bottom line is, is that everybody who is in a status of that serves at the pleasure of the President of the United States.
Q: Even though the regulation says that —
MR. SPICER: Again, I understand your question that, on an org. chart, the FBI goes to the Deputy Attorney General. But at the end of the day, that person then reports to the President. So, ultimately, everybody who is a political appointee of some sort reports to the President, right?
Q: Sure. I'm just wondering if you think that the regulation enjoins the President —
MR. SPICER: Again, I'm not here to argue the HR component of this. I do know that, again, if you look at the org. chart, the Deputy Attorney General, who is appointed by the President, the FBI director reports to him.
Q: The special counsel.
MR. SPICER: The special counsel — I apologize. So yeah — so, I mean, that's how —
So I think he's not saying anything particularly specific there; he's saying that either Trump can fire Mueller or he can get Rosenstein or his umpteenth replacement to fire Mueller, it matters not.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Q: Following on that, last week Sarah told us that the President has no intention of firing Rosenstein as the Deputy Attorney General, but he has the right to do so. Rosenstein testified that only — I'm sorry, right to fire Rob Mueller, the special counsel. Rosenstein testified that the regulations give him that power. So how is the White House concluding that the President has the right to fire the special counsel?
MR. SPICER: I mean, I think the broader point here is that everyone who serves the President serves at the pleasure of the President. It may take — I get there may be a technicality as to whom reports to whom. But the bottom line is, is that everybody who is in a status of that serves at the pleasure of the President of the United States.
Q: Even though the regulation says that —
MR. SPICER: Again, I understand your question that, on an org. chart, the FBI goes to the Deputy Attorney General. But at the end of the day, that person then reports to the President. So, ultimately, everybody who is a political appointee of some sort reports to the President, right?
Q: Sure. I'm just wondering if you think that the regulation enjoins the President —
MR. SPICER: Again, I'm not here to argue the HR component of this. I do know that, again, if you look at the org. chart, the Deputy Attorney General, who is appointed by the President, the FBI director reports to him.
Q: The special counsel.
MR. SPICER: The special counsel — I apologize. So yeah — so, I mean, that's how —
So I think he's not saying anything particularly specific there; he's saying that either Trump can fire Mueller or he can get Rosenstein or his umpteenth replacement to fire Mueller, it matters not.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Democrats '18: Twenty dollars, same as in town.
Vote D and Move On?
posted by notyou at 2:06 PM on July 21, 2017
Vote D and Move On?
posted by notyou at 2:06 PM on July 21, 2017
What actor does Scaramucci look like? It's on the tip of my brain and driving me crazy.
posted by HotToddy at 2:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by HotToddy at 2:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
His picture here has kind of a Jack Nicholson in the Shining vibe.
posted by diogenes at 2:08 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by diogenes at 2:08 PM on July 21, 2017
Michael Imperioli?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:09 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:09 PM on July 21, 2017
Scaramucci is Ferris Bueller and Charlie Sheen's character in Ferris Bueller somehow having a terrible baby together and they put him in a reed basket and it floats downriver where Gordon Gekko discovers it and raises him and eventually he escapes the world of the movies to enter our world and become a real boy, a real shitty boy
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:12 PM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:12 PM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
Mark Wahlberg?
posted by mazola at 2:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by mazola at 2:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
The good thing about all these slogans is that we can use our favorite ones ourselves, even if the DNC picks a lousy one.
"The Democrats" are us. We can do whatever we want.
I love the armchair campaign-crafting, but instead of talking about what the Democrats should do, please just do it.
It's all consumer culture now. Your job is to sit back and judge what's being sold with a critical eye and decide if it's worthy of your participation. The irony being the jackass faction of the far Left doing it the most. If everything is not to your liking about the product take your business elsewhere and refuse to pay. That will show them. The customer is always right.
After all that has happened if a slogan makes any difference in people voting for Dem's, as a great lady once said, "then we're stupid and we'll die".
posted by bongo_x at 2:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
"The Democrats" are us. We can do whatever we want.
I love the armchair campaign-crafting, but instead of talking about what the Democrats should do, please just do it.
It's all consumer culture now. Your job is to sit back and judge what's being sold with a critical eye and decide if it's worthy of your participation. The irony being the jackass faction of the far Left doing it the most. If everything is not to your liking about the product take your business elsewhere and refuse to pay. That will show them. The customer is always right.
After all that has happened if a slogan makes any difference in people voting for Dem's, as a great lady once said, "then we're stupid and we'll die".
posted by bongo_x at 2:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
The closest I can come is Benjamin Bratt but that's not it. It's some Hispanic guy in a cop role. Harder face than Bratt. I don't even know who Chris Kattan is but that's a pretty hilarious resemblance!
posted by HotToddy at 2:27 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by HotToddy at 2:27 PM on July 21, 2017
Two sources with direct knowledge of the situation said that Scaramucci is being primed to eventually take on the position of chief of staff.
Oh sweet Jesus, please let this happen because it will be a glorious trainwreck. I mean, even now, this guy is unbelievably, monumentally unqualified for the position he's being hired for. WH Comms Director was Toby Ziegler's job, for god's sake. This walking example of an aging Ax body spray ad character is not being hired to to develop, coordinate, and implement WH messaging strategy in conjunction with the folks developing policy positions and initiatives; manage and deploy spokespeople; hire and direct the activities of writers, photographers, etc.
He got hired so that Trump can produce and watch his very own in-house version of Fox and Friends starring his favorite foxy friend. The guy just swore a personal loyalty oath on live TV.
Which means WH communications will be even more chaotic, disjointed, self-contradictory and incoherent than they already have been. The only person in that office with any background in this area at all was Spicer, and he was pretty piss-poor at it, especially since nobody can control Trump and Trump uses language solely for purposes of attention acquisition, self-aggrandizement, and deflection of blame. He doesn't live in a world where words impart information or mean things that persist beyond a moment.
posted by FelliniBlank at 2:28 PM on July 21, 2017 [32 favorites]
Oh sweet Jesus, please let this happen because it will be a glorious trainwreck. I mean, even now, this guy is unbelievably, monumentally unqualified for the position he's being hired for. WH Comms Director was Toby Ziegler's job, for god's sake. This walking example of an aging Ax body spray ad character is not being hired to to develop, coordinate, and implement WH messaging strategy in conjunction with the folks developing policy positions and initiatives; manage and deploy spokespeople; hire and direct the activities of writers, photographers, etc.
He got hired so that Trump can produce and watch his very own in-house version of Fox and Friends starring his favorite foxy friend. The guy just swore a personal loyalty oath on live TV.
Which means WH communications will be even more chaotic, disjointed, self-contradictory and incoherent than they already have been. The only person in that office with any background in this area at all was Spicer, and he was pretty piss-poor at it, especially since nobody can control Trump and Trump uses language solely for purposes of attention acquisition, self-aggrandizement, and deflection of blame. He doesn't live in a world where words impart information or mean things that persist beyond a moment.
posted by FelliniBlank at 2:28 PM on July 21, 2017 [32 favorites]
The Navy SEALs will tell you:
Hooyah!
I compare you to a kiss from arrows on the sea
Ooh, the more I get of you, the stranger it feels, yeah
Now that arrows is in boom
A light hits the gloom on the sea
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 2:29 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
Hooyah!
I compare you to a kiss from arrows on the sea
Ooh, the more I get of you, the stranger it feels, yeah
Now that arrows is in boom
A light hits the gloom on the sea
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 2:29 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
What actor does Scaramucci look like? It's on the tip of my brain and driving me crazy.
Adrian Pasdar after getting hit by the ugly stick
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 2:30 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Adrian Pasdar after getting hit by the ugly stick
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 2:30 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
as a great lady once said, "then we're stupid and we'll die".
actually, I believe it was the Navy SEALs who said that
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:30 PM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
actually, I believe it was the Navy SEALs who said that
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:30 PM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
What actor does Scaramucci look like? It's on the tip of my brain and driving me crazy.
I'm really old, so he reminds me of Thomas Calabro, who played the cheating asshole doctor on Melrose Place.
posted by FelliniBlank at 2:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
I'm really old, so he reminds me of Thomas Calabro, who played the cheating asshole doctor on Melrose Place.
posted by FelliniBlank at 2:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Spicer should totally bring everything from his White House stint together in one tent and set it up at Burning Man.
posted by ocschwar at 2:37 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by ocschwar at 2:37 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
I suppose this means Spicer's going be on the next Dancing with the Stars?
posted by orrnyereg at 2:39 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by orrnyereg at 2:39 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
The Senate Parliamentarian has determined, unsurprisingly enough, that various BCRA provisions violate the Byrd Rule and would require 60 votes to be enacted. These include defunding Planned Parenthood and the abortion restrictions, the six month waiting period for noncontinuous coverage, and the removal of the essential health benefits for Medicaid.
posted by zachlipton at 2:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [61 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 2:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [61 favorites]
In case anyone was wondering whether the articles of impeachment will come up for a vote: Representative Brad Sherman (D-CA) chose not to introduce it as a "privileged" motion regarding the dignity of the House, so Speaker Paul Ryan (R-WI) was able to refer the bill to the Judiciary Committee, where Chairman Bob Goodlatte (R-VA) will undoubtedly sit on the bill until hell freezes over.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:49 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:49 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
So, what happens when the Senate continues anyway, in spite of the Parliamentarian?
posted by yesster at 2:51 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by yesster at 2:51 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Sean Spicer
Sarah Huckabee Sanders
Anthony Scaramucci
Ted Nugent
Alex Jones
"Mr. Shadow"
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:52 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Sarah Huckabee Sanders
Anthony Scaramucci
Ted Nugent
Alex Jones
"Mr. Shadow"
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:52 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
If Pence/McConnell overrules the parliamentarian and a Senate majority votes in agreement, it will set a precedent ending the Byrd Rule and allowing any legislation to be passed under reconciliation with 51 votes; in other words, an effective end to the legislative filibuster. All indications I've seen are that the majority of the Senate is unwilling to do this, because of the immense power the legislative filibuster provides to each individual senator.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:55 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:55 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
The whole Trump thing has basically just been Toxic Masculinity: The Movie from the very beginning.
It's worse even than that, Trump is trying to make the US the Men Going Their Own Way of countries.
posted by Jon Mitchell at 3:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
It's worse even than that, Trump is trying to make the US the Men Going Their Own Way of countries.
posted by Jon Mitchell at 3:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
Absolutely. It's really hard for me to see how a majority of the House and Senate vote for a bill without the abortion restrictions though. Or how insurance companies offer individual coverage without a mandate or a lockout period or any kind of continuous coverage requirement at all (I'm actually slightly less convinced of the complete and total unworkability here, as opposed to just somewhat higher costs, since you still only have open enrollment once a year, but they think it makes a difference, and that matters more than my gut feelings).
posted by zachlipton at 3:05 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 3:05 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
The closest I can come is Benjamin Bratt but that's not it. It's some Hispanic guy in a cop role. Harder face than Bratt. I don't even know who Chris Kattan is but that's a pretty hilarious resemblance!
Danny Pino?
posted by FelliniBlank at 3:10 PM on July 21, 2017
Danny Pino?
posted by FelliniBlank at 3:10 PM on July 21, 2017
What actor does Scaramucci look like? It's on the tip of my brain and driving me crazy.
Adrian Pasdar after getting hit by the ugly stick
-posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon
Scaramucci is Ferris Bueller and Charlie Sheen's character in Ferris Bueller somehow having a terrible baby together and they put him in a reed basket and it floats downriver where Gordon Gekko discovers it and raises him and eventually he escapes the world of the movies to enter our world and become a real boy, a real shitty boy
-posted by prize bull octorok
Sorry to break it to you, but they already made this show
posted by runcibleshaw at 3:11 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Adrian Pasdar after getting hit by the ugly stick
-posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon
Scaramucci is Ferris Bueller and Charlie Sheen's character in Ferris Bueller somehow having a terrible baby together and they put him in a reed basket and it floats downriver where Gordon Gekko discovers it and raises him and eventually he escapes the world of the movies to enter our world and become a real boy, a real shitty boy
-posted by prize bull octorok
Sorry to break it to you, but they already made this show
posted by runcibleshaw at 3:11 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
I mean, Florida seems to have been a HUGE target of the Russian active measures campaign. It's hard to believe it had no effect.
Yep. Intense strange activity, effort on a handful of counties in Florida last election. I feel this will come back into the press eventually.
I'd really like to know more details about this. I just installed a security plugin on my site from Russian IP address and I see dozens of login attempts a day. I'd be interested to know exactly how these hacks into political offices compares to the number of attacks your average blog sees on a daily basis. How targeted are they?
posted by runcibleshaw at 3:21 PM on July 21, 2017
Priebus has been concerned about his reputation
guy was head of RNC. what the fuck kinda reputation could be worse?
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 3:31 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
guy was head of RNC. what the fuck kinda reputation could be worse?
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 3:31 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Miami Herald on Florida counties hacking
posted by rc3spencer at 3:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by rc3spencer at 3:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
I've got this hazy idea of a site. Simple. Data driven as much as possible. "What the GOP costs you".
Options like health insurance. Medicare. Medicaid. Jobs. Clean water. Busted bridges.
You type in your zip code and your age. You see decrepit infrastructure near you. You see polluted sites or corporate welfare sites (Walmart) near you. If you drill to insurance you can see the changes from ACA and the likely effect The shit vote of the week will get you.
How funding coal shit instead of green energy increases pollution and the likely hood you and yours get sick.
It's fuzzy. I've been noodling it since that pro publica story about dead mothers. Esp the heart failure lady who just gave up and died because her Medicaid coverage was going away (FU rick Scott for turning down Medicaid expansion )
posted by tilde at 3:37 PM on July 21, 2017 [56 favorites]
Options like health insurance. Medicare. Medicaid. Jobs. Clean water. Busted bridges.
You type in your zip code and your age. You see decrepit infrastructure near you. You see polluted sites or corporate welfare sites (Walmart) near you. If you drill to insurance you can see the changes from ACA and the likely effect The shit vote of the week will get you.
How funding coal shit instead of green energy increases pollution and the likely hood you and yours get sick.
It's fuzzy. I've been noodling it since that pro publica story about dead mothers. Esp the heart failure lady who just gave up and died because her Medicaid coverage was going away (FU rick Scott for turning down Medicaid expansion )
posted by tilde at 3:37 PM on July 21, 2017 [56 favorites]
At least 5 Florida counties baited by Russian election hack
It turned out to be unnecessary... or totally successful in other counties...
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:40 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
It turned out to be unnecessary... or totally successful in other counties...
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:40 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
"What the GOP costs you".
Increased fees for services such as vehicle registration, as States cut taxes and turn to fees, and penalties to make up some of the difference. Increased public university tuition as funding is cut.
posted by thelonius at 3:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
Increased fees for services such as vehicle registration, as States cut taxes and turn to fees, and penalties to make up some of the difference. Increased public university tuition as funding is cut.
posted by thelonius at 3:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
epic year for legislative dick-tripping
posted by murphy slaw at 3:45 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by murphy slaw at 3:45 PM on July 21, 2017
[Scaramucci] claims Mark Twain said "Dance like no one is watching. Sing like no one is listening. Love like you've never been hurt and live like its heaven on earth."
omfg i cannot imagine any sequence of words that Mark Twain would be less likely to say
YOU PICKED THE LEAST POSSIBLE THING HE COULD EVER SAY
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 3:46 PM on July 21, 2017 [91 favorites]
omfg i cannot imagine any sequence of words that Mark Twain would be less likely to say
YOU PICKED THE LEAST POSSIBLE THING HE COULD EVER SAY
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 3:46 PM on July 21, 2017 [91 favorites]
"What the GOP costs you"
And toggles for expanding Medicaid for all or a $15 minimum wage, and the jobs created fixing that infrastructure...
posted by tilde at 3:46 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
And toggles for expanding Medicaid for all or a $15 minimum wage, and the jobs created fixing that infrastructure...
posted by tilde at 3:46 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
"Eat. Pray. Love." - Friedrich Nietzsche
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [100 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [100 favorites]
"I do not like this Anthony Scaramucci guy. I mean, he even loved the Entourage movie. Who does that?" --Mark Twain [fake]
posted by zachlipton at 3:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 3:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
Ashley Feinberg: Trump’s New Comms Director Hates Most of Trump's Policies. A detailed tweet-by-tweet exploration.
posted by zachlipton at 3:51 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 3:51 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
People talk as if somebody joining Team Trump after having mocked him should be disqualifying. I've come to understand what Josh Marshall means by "dignity wraiths": someone who's proven their loyalty by directly contradicting their previous attacks. It's a dominance ritual where they publicly submit to him in exchange for access to his power, much like Tolkein's Ring Wraiths, 9 mortal men doomed to die & serve Sauron in death.
posted by scalefree at 3:52 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by scalefree at 3:52 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
"Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company, Arby's for the meats." - Mark Twain
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:55 PM on July 21, 2017 [37 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:55 PM on July 21, 2017 [37 favorites]
Has anyone created Russia hacking memes using Boris from Goldeneye? Bc I think I'm onto something
posted by gucci mane at 3:55 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by gucci mane at 3:55 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
It's Scoop o'Clock!
The Washington Post: Sessions discussed Trump campaign-related matters with Russian ambassador, U.S. intelligence intercepts show
Russia’s ambassador to Washington told his superiors in Moscow that he discussed campaign-related matters, including policy issues important to Moscow, with Jeff Sessions during the 2016 presidential race, contrary to public assertions by the embattled attorney general, according to current and former U.S. officials.
Ambassador Sergey Kislyak’s accounts of two conversations with Sessions — then a top foreign policy adviser to Republican candidate Donald Trump — were intercepted by U.S. spy agencies, which monitor the communications of senior Russian officials both in the United States and in Russia. Sessions initially failed to disclose his contacts with Kislyak and then said that the meetings were not about the Trump campaign.
One U.S. official said that Sessions — who testified that he has no recollection of the April encounter — has provided “misleading” statements that are “contradicted by other evidence.” A former official said that the intelligence indicates that Sessions and Kislyak had “substantive” discussions on matters including Trump’s positions on Russia-related issues and prospects for U.S.-Russia relations in a Trump administration.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:57 PM on July 21, 2017 [69 favorites]
The Washington Post: Sessions discussed Trump campaign-related matters with Russian ambassador, U.S. intelligence intercepts show
Russia’s ambassador to Washington told his superiors in Moscow that he discussed campaign-related matters, including policy issues important to Moscow, with Jeff Sessions during the 2016 presidential race, contrary to public assertions by the embattled attorney general, according to current and former U.S. officials.
Ambassador Sergey Kislyak’s accounts of two conversations with Sessions — then a top foreign policy adviser to Republican candidate Donald Trump — were intercepted by U.S. spy agencies, which monitor the communications of senior Russian officials both in the United States and in Russia. Sessions initially failed to disclose his contacts with Kislyak and then said that the meetings were not about the Trump campaign.
One U.S. official said that Sessions — who testified that he has no recollection of the April encounter — has provided “misleading” statements that are “contradicted by other evidence.” A former official said that the intelligence indicates that Sessions and Kislyak had “substantive” discussions on matters including Trump’s positions on Russia-related issues and prospects for U.S.-Russia relations in a Trump administration.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:57 PM on July 21, 2017 [69 favorites]
In all the excitement about Scaramucci's First Class Ass Kissing skillz, you guys missed another great moment in the North Koreanization of America:
FOX Nation Varney: Six Months In and Trump Already Made America $4 Trillion Richer
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:57 PM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
FOX Nation Varney: Six Months In and Trump Already Made America $4 Trillion Richer
Look at this: since his election win, the Trump rally has added $4.1 trillion to the nation's wealth. Anyone with a 401k, an IRA, college savings, retirement savings, mutual funds. Anyone with a dime in the market has taken a piece of that $4 trillion.Just think, those tiny little start-ups were just the twinkle in Donnie's eye in December 2016 and with hard work and a lot of golf only 6 months into his presidency they are now great companies! Known round the world. So take a bow, Donald J. Trump, you are amazing.
Also, during this presidency, 5 American companies have emerged as global technology leaders. You know their names: Apple, Amazon, Alphabet, Microsoft and Facebook. It’s a technology world, and American companies have seized the future.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:57 PM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
One might imagine it hard to defend an Attorney General after his own President claims he should never have been appointed, but who knows...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
So we have to trust anonymous US intelligence officials, Jeff Sessions, or Sergey Kislyak. This timeline sucks.
posted by zachlipton at 4:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 4:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
Since this is based only on Kislyak's intercepted claims, we might have to give Sessions the benefit of the doubt... were he not to have repeatedly denied the existence of any meetings, including in sworn testimony.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
The Atlantic The Fox-Newsification of the White House
Spicer’s fall and Scaramuccci’s rise are the latest—and perhaps most significant—signs that the Trump White House has abandoned whatever vision it once had of trying to shape press coverage through diplomacy and dealmaking, and has chosen instead to go all in with its made-for-cable-news culture war against the Fourth Estate.posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Spicer’s brief tenure as press secretary will probably be remembered for his most spectacular, high-profile humiliations—the inaugural lie about the Inauguration crowd size; the “holocaust centers” meltdown—and for Melissa McCarthy’s withering impression of him. But the core failures of the Spicer-era communications shop were shaped by Trump himself.
Because the president demanded North Korean levels of message discipline, Spicer was frequently forced to make easily debunked, sky-is-green statements during White House press briefings, and then fiercely defend them against a barrage of Are you serious? pushback from reporters. The press corps expects a certain degree of spin and misdirection from press secretaries, of course—but this Orwellian display was so outlandish that Spicer’s credibility couldn’t survive it. Having lost the press corps’ trust, Spicer’s briefings became largely irrelevant beyond providing fodder for Twitter ridicule.
"A Republican source on seeing the story wondered aloud if Trump WH purposely confirmed the story to get at Sessions."
Maybe after the Comey thing, Trump assumes he'll get in trouble for firing Sessions? Mr President, you will not get in trouble for firing Sessions. Not this time. I promise.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:04 PM on July 21, 2017
Maybe after the Comey thing, Trump assumes he'll get in trouble for firing Sessions? Mr President, you will not get in trouble for firing Sessions. Not this time. I promise.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:04 PM on July 21, 2017
Guys, firing Sessions is a double-edged sword.
Sessions' replacement would not be recused from the Russia investigation and thus could fire Mueller instead of Rosenstein. Of course he or she would have to be confirmed through the Senate. Imagine the battle over that nomination!
posted by Justinian at 4:05 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Sessions' replacement would not be recused from the Russia investigation and thus could fire Mueller instead of Rosenstein. Of course he or she would have to be confirmed through the Senate. Imagine the battle over that nomination!
posted by Justinian at 4:05 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
That wouldn't be much of a game changer: I see no indication that Trump would be unwilling to fire Rosenstein or any of his successors if he wanted to have Mueller removed.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:09 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
"A Republican source on seeing the story wondered aloud if Trump WH purposely confirmed the story to get at Sessions."
Seems totally plausible, but only if the rift between Trump and Sessions is legit and not, as has been suggested, a smokescreen. It's not like Trump has fired any of these people he has "splits" with.
My thought was somebody was sitting on this waiting for a potential rift between Trump & Sessions, and put it out now in hopes it would push Sessions toward flipping on Trump.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:10 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Seems totally plausible, but only if the rift between Trump and Sessions is legit and not, as has been suggested, a smokescreen. It's not like Trump has fired any of these people he has "splits" with.
My thought was somebody was sitting on this waiting for a potential rift between Trump & Sessions, and put it out now in hopes it would push Sessions toward flipping on Trump.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:10 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Everybody they fire from investigating them just makes it that much easier to show obstruction of justice, while also serving as continuing mounting evidence to the GOP that there is no reciprocity for loyalty to Trump.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Byrd Bath for the repeal.
The parliamentarian fucked the Republicans pretty hard.
posted by Justinian at 4:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
The parliamentarian fucked the Republicans pretty hard.
posted by Justinian at 4:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Remember how Senator Ron Wyden really laid into the Confederate Jefferson Sessions during his pathetic testimony in front of the Intelligence Committee (video)?
As a refresher, Wyden wanted to know what matters were problematic in terms of Sessions leading an investigation into the collusion of the Trump/Pence Campaign and the Russian government to influence the election. Sessions defensively and angrily replied, "There are none, Senator Wyden! There are none!"
I got the distinct impression that Wyden had some very specific stuff in mind, and I think we just found out about why the good Senator noted that the Confederate's answer "did not pass the smell test".
Sessions is party to this entire rotten enterprise.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [53 favorites]
As a refresher, Wyden wanted to know what matters were problematic in terms of Sessions leading an investigation into the collusion of the Trump/Pence Campaign and the Russian government to influence the election. Sessions defensively and angrily replied, "There are none, Senator Wyden! There are none!"
I got the distinct impression that Wyden had some very specific stuff in mind, and I think we just found out about why the good Senator noted that the Confederate's answer "did not pass the smell test".
Sessions is party to this entire rotten enterprise.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [53 favorites]
"There are tapes of Russian Ambassador bragging about his collusion with the campaign" is a hell of a first day for the Mooch.
posted by zachlipton at 4:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [30 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 4:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [30 favorites]
I see Zach posted that link earlier today. Sorry! So fast moving.
posted by Justinian at 4:18 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by Justinian at 4:18 PM on July 21, 2017
Let's hear 'em!
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 4:18 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 4:18 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Let's hear 'em!
*cough* narc *cough*
posted by Barack Spinoza at 4:20 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
*cough* narc *cough*
posted by Barack Spinoza at 4:20 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Mooch looks a bit like Gary Graham from the short-lived Alien Nation TV series to me. My better half says he looks like Lou Reed's evil younger brother.
posted by jocelmeow at 4:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by jocelmeow at 4:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
WTF is happening with this latest Sessions business?
posted by Barack Spinoza at 4:23 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by Barack Spinoza at 4:23 PM on July 21, 2017
I realize this pales in comparison to treason, but Michael Bender has a Sean Spicer story:
Less than a month into his new job, White House press secretary Sean Spicer needed to keep his food and drink cold. He wanted a mini-fridge.posted by zachlipton at 4:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [35 favorites]
He dispatched a top aide to a nearby executive office building where junior research employees are crammed into a room, surviving on Lean Cuisine frozen lunches. Mr. Spicer wants your icebox, the aide said, according to people familiar with the incident. They refused to give it up.
So Mr. Spicer waited until sundown—after his young staffers had left—to take matters into his own hands. He was spotted by a fellow White House official lugging the icebox down the White House driveway after 8 p.m.
From the very start, Mr. Spicer faced myriad challenges in his role as President Donald Trump’s chief spokesman, a job he quit on Friday. And each obstacle—from defending a president who often contradicted him, to securing a fridge for his own office—seemed to be a struggle.
He was spotted by a fellow White House official lugging the icebox down the White House driveway after 8 p.m.
My dude has his own fucking hedge fund, and he has to steal a decrepit old minifridge from junior research staff?
posted by Existential Dread at 4:26 PM on July 21, 2017 [49 favorites]
My dude has his own fucking hedge fund, and he has to steal a decrepit old minifridge from junior research staff?
posted by Existential Dread at 4:26 PM on July 21, 2017 [49 favorites]
Oh, so he's your dude.
posted by bongo_x at 4:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 4:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Guys, firing Sessions is a double-edged sword.
No. Getting that racist, sexist, xenophobic, authoritarian shitfuck out of the office of the nation's head prosecutor is only a net gain for The Republic.
posted by Talez at 4:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [31 favorites]
No. Getting that racist, sexist, xenophobic, authoritarian shitfuck out of the office of the nation's head prosecutor is only a net gain for The Republic.
posted by Talez at 4:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [31 favorites]
And that's Made in America Week! Good job everyone
posted by theodolite at 4:29 PM on July 21, 2017 [68 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 4:29 PM on July 21, 2017 [68 favorites]
No. Getting that racist, sexist, xenophobic, authoritarian shitfuck out of the office of the nation's head prosecutor is only a net gain for The Republic.
That depends on who replaces him, doesn't it? Can you really not imagine Trump installing someone even worse?
posted by Justinian at 4:30 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
That depends on who replaces him, doesn't it? Can you really not imagine Trump installing someone even worse?
posted by Justinian at 4:30 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
No. Getting that racist, sexist, xenophobic, authoritarian shitfuck out of the office of the nation's head prosecutor is only a net gain for The Republic.
Out of the AG's office and out of the Senate! Win fucking win!
posted by Existential Dread at 4:31 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
Out of the AG's office and out of the Senate! Win fucking win!
posted by Existential Dread at 4:31 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
So Mr. Spicer waited until sundown—after his young staffers had left—to take matters into his own hands. He was spotted by a fellow White House official lugging the icebox down the White House driveway after 8 p.m.
If you've been horrified by Spicer's tenure as press secretary, let me remind you all this dude is also a Commander in the Navy Reserve. That's five steps up on the officer ladder. Next step up is Captain, and then Admiral.
This dude steals a mini-fridge from underpaid junior staffers stuck in a tiny office rather than buying his own fucking icebox. He steals it after they've gone home, knowing full well they will know he did that. And you've seen his press briefings. You've seen him suck up to this regime.
Think about that. Now think about how many poor souls have salute this dude and call him "sir" and follow his orders because he's a fucking officer.
Fuck HP Lovecraft. That right there is horror.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:32 PM on July 21, 2017 [93 favorites]
If you've been horrified by Spicer's tenure as press secretary, let me remind you all this dude is also a Commander in the Navy Reserve. That's five steps up on the officer ladder. Next step up is Captain, and then Admiral.
This dude steals a mini-fridge from underpaid junior staffers stuck in a tiny office rather than buying his own fucking icebox. He steals it after they've gone home, knowing full well they will know he did that. And you've seen his press briefings. You've seen him suck up to this regime.
Think about that. Now think about how many poor souls have salute this dude and call him "sir" and follow his orders because he's a fucking officer.
Fuck HP Lovecraft. That right there is horror.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:32 PM on July 21, 2017 [93 favorites]
One last proffer, the newscaster on Murphy Brown, Charles Kimbrough (only younger).
posted by TWinbrook8 at 4:33 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by TWinbrook8 at 4:33 PM on July 21, 2017
Sessions is party to this entire rotten enterprise.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 7:17 PM on July 21
According to the author of the Devil's Bargain it was Bannon and Sessions working together who put Trump in the Oval Office so not only is he party to this rotten enterprise, he is a co-founder of this rotten enterprise.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 7:17 PM on July 21
According to the author of the Devil's Bargain it was Bannon and Sessions working together who put Trump in the Oval Office so not only is he party to this rotten enterprise, he is a co-founder of this rotten enterprise.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
Can you really not imagine Trump installing someone even worse?
Sure, it can always get worse. But you've still got to fucking cut bait with the devil you know, over and over again, as many times as it takes, or the devil wins every goddamned time.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Sure, it can always get worse. But you've still got to fucking cut bait with the devil you know, over and over again, as many times as it takes, or the devil wins every goddamned time.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
That depends on who replaces him, doesn't it? Can you really not imagine Trump installing someone even worse?
Who else among NYC's corrupt real estate/entrepreneur/banking B team does he know?
posted by notyou at 4:34 PM on July 21, 2017
Who else among NYC's corrupt real estate/entrepreneur/banking B team does he know?
posted by notyou at 4:34 PM on July 21, 2017
Oh, so he's your dude.
Get with the kid speak. "My dude" is like... "Hey idiot."
posted by greermahoney at 4:35 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Get with the kid speak. "My dude" is like... "Hey idiot."
posted by greermahoney at 4:35 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
This dude steals a mini-fridge from underpaid junior staffers stuck in a tiny office rather than buying his own fucking icebox. He steals it after they've gone home, knowing full well they will know he did that.
Christ, what an asshole.
posted by jferg at 4:37 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
Oh look, another story: Jared Kushner Discloses Dozens More Assets in Revised Financial Filing
posted by zachlipton at 4:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
Jared Kushner, President Donald Trump’s son-in-law and a senior White House adviser, on Friday released a revised version of his personal financial disclosure showing his initial filing omitted dozens of assets, including commercial real estate, bonds issued by the New York water and sewer authority, a personal art collection and a New Jersey liquor license.This is also an important detail:
According to the disclosure, 77 assets were “inadvertently omitted” from Mr. Kushner’s earlier form and were added during what the form’s footnotes describe as the “ordinary review” process with the government ethics office. The updated form also provides additional information about 77 other assets, offering more detail about the structure of Mr. Kushner’s real estate assets. Mr. Kushner’s initial disclosure, released in March, hadn’t then been certified by the Office of Government Ethics.
Ms. Trump received $2.5 million in “salary and severance” from her father’s business operations, according to Friday’s disclosure. She also received a $787,500 advance for her book, “Women Who Work.”Trump paid her severance? WTF? And she still gets paid annual payments from Trump businesses?
According to the form, she is at least a part owner of T International Realty LLC, TTT Consulting LLC and TTTT Venture LLC, assets she valued at between $11 million and $55 million in total. Those entities are affiliated with the Trump Organization through which Ms. Trump and her siblings receive consulting and management fees, the lawyer said.
Instead of getting those fees, Ms. Trump now has an agreement with those entities to get guaranteed annual payments totaling $1.5 million, which means that the income is tied less directly to the success of the family business.
posted by zachlipton at 4:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
Can you really not imagine Trump installing someone even worse?
By that metric why try to get rid of any of them?
Even though the wise Navy SEAL says better the devil you know, this particular devil can't slither back into the darkness fast enough. Get fucked, Jefferson.
posted by lydhre at 4:39 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
By that metric why try to get rid of any of them?
Even though the wise Navy SEAL says better the devil you know, this particular devil can't slither back into the darkness fast enough. Get fucked, Jefferson.
posted by lydhre at 4:39 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Joke's on him. That's the fridge I was keeping my "samples" in.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:39 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:39 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
How did a guy with such a terrible memory and shitty attention to detail get the nickname Mr. Perfect, anyhow?
posted by FelliniBlank at 4:39 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by FelliniBlank at 4:39 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
77 assets worth over... 100 million dollars. /Doctor Evil
posted by chris24 at 4:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by chris24 at 4:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
That depends on who replaces him, doesn't it? Can you really not imagine Trump installing someone even worse?
There's not many people who would be that much worse than Sessions and I'm pretty sure the list of people willing to show up for this administration are shrinking by the day.
Maybe Paxton fresh off beating his felony charges? Kobach might earn a promotion? Jeff Landry is both in the pocket of the oil and gas industries and is willing to crawl over broken glass to stab his own gay brother in the front.
I mean they all have shades of Sessions but they're all the "I can't believe it's not Sessions" brand of shitheel.
posted by Talez at 4:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
There's not many people who would be that much worse than Sessions and I'm pretty sure the list of people willing to show up for this administration are shrinking by the day.
Maybe Paxton fresh off beating his felony charges? Kobach might earn a promotion? Jeff Landry is both in the pocket of the oil and gas industries and is willing to crawl over broken glass to stab his own gay brother in the front.
I mean they all have shades of Sessions but they're all the "I can't believe it's not Sessions" brand of shitheel.
posted by Talez at 4:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Reality shows are based on made-up conflicts to promote drama and increase ratings.
Trump's white house is based on made-up conflicts to promote drama and increase ratings.
Trump learned everything he knows about being President from starring on The Apprentice. But being unable to bring Mark Burnett in as Chief of Staff severely disabled him.
No. Getting that racist, sexist, xenophobic, authoritarian shitfuck out of the office of the nation's head prosecutor is only a net gain for The Republic.
Can you really not imagine Trump installing someone even worse?
Every indication is that there IS nobody even worse. Putting Sessions' so-far successful campaign to transform the Federal Judiciary into a Confederate Star Chamber on hold for a few months then bringing in someone who may be less dedicated to turning American history back a few decades would be an improvement. Someone "among NYC's corrupt real estate/entrepreneur/banking B team" would indeed be better.
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:44 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
Trump's white house is based on made-up conflicts to promote drama and increase ratings.
Trump learned everything he knows about being President from starring on The Apprentice. But being unable to bring Mark Burnett in as Chief of Staff severely disabled him.
No. Getting that racist, sexist, xenophobic, authoritarian shitfuck out of the office of the nation's head prosecutor is only a net gain for The Republic.
Can you really not imagine Trump installing someone even worse?
Every indication is that there IS nobody even worse. Putting Sessions' so-far successful campaign to transform the Federal Judiciary into a Confederate Star Chamber on hold for a few months then bringing in someone who may be less dedicated to turning American history back a few decades would be an improvement. Someone "among NYC's corrupt real estate/entrepreneur/banking B team" would indeed be better.
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:44 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
If Trump replaced Sessions at this point, I feel he'd prioritize a candidate's willingness to shut down any investigations of Trump over all of Sessions' racist pet priorities like voter disenfranchisement, the drug war, civil asset forfeiture... Trump has no ideology more important than "what's best for Trump" so that will be the deciding factor. Probably someone picked on his legal team's advice, this is like a dream come true scenario for his team - hey, the cops are onto our client, but we can replace the top cop! Too good of an opportunity to pass up for them.
So while we may come out of a Sessions firing better on balance, it will be kind of an out of the frying pan, into the fire situation.
posted by jason_steakums at 4:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
So while we may come out of a Sessions firing better on balance, it will be kind of an out of the frying pan, into the fire situation.
posted by jason_steakums at 4:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
OK YOU HAVE CONVINCED ME.
I think Sessions is toast.
posted by Justinian at 4:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
I think Sessions is toast.
posted by Justinian at 4:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
He should just save us all time and replace Sessions with Sergey Ivanovich Kislyak.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:48 PM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:48 PM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
This is pretty big, makes the hurdle for passage much higher as they'd have to replace the parliamentarian to have a shot at changing her decision, which would be very big move. Senate parliamentarian finds major parts of GOP health bill require 60 votes, including defunding Planned Parenthood.
posted by scalefree at 4:48 PM on July 21, 2017 [32 favorites]
posted by scalefree at 4:48 PM on July 21, 2017 [32 favorites]
Out of the AG's office and out of the Senate!
And Joe Manchin gets a do-over.
T International Realty LLC, TTT Consulting LLC and TTTT Venture LLC,
The lack of imagination and ability to look past themselves is staggering.
Scott Wolf
Michael Ian Black
posted by Room 641-A at 4:49 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
And Joe Manchin gets a do-over.
T International Realty LLC, TTT Consulting LLC and TTTT Venture LLC,
The lack of imagination and ability to look past themselves is staggering.
Scott Wolf
Michael Ian Black
posted by Room 641-A at 4:49 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Hugh Hewitt just dropped J. Michael Luttig's name three times as who could be a good AG, so I guess they decided he's up for America's Next Top AG?
posted by armacy at 4:50 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by armacy at 4:50 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
According to Twitter, dumping Sessions gives them a window to fire Mueller. I think otherwise they'd keep Sessions, because he's utterly loyal and all in for the goals of the regime (such as they can be identified: shaft the poor, minorities, disabled, immigrants, etc.). But they're more afraid of what Mueller's going to find than anything else, so Sessions has to go so they can get someone to fire Mueller.
That's the read, anyway. I buy it.
My real fear is that 45 will fire Mueller and... nothing will happen. No consequences, because there's nobody to hold him accountable.
posted by suelac at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
That's the read, anyway. I buy it.
My real fear is that 45 will fire Mueller and... nothing will happen. No consequences, because there's nobody to hold him accountable.
posted by suelac at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
That depends on who replaces him, doesn't it? Can you really not imagine Trump installing someone even worse?
I doubt- short of choosing a serial murderer- you could find anyone more evil but there are plenty that would be less suitable: Eric Trump, Judge Jeanine, Sarah Palin, Alex Jones.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
I doubt- short of choosing a serial murderer- you could find anyone more evil but there are plenty that would be less suitable: Eric Trump, Judge Jeanine, Sarah Palin, Alex Jones.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:54 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Another possible upside to Sessions getting the boot would be another round of terrible publicity for the regime and very nasty confirmation hearing. Given all the fuckery around The Douche Canoe, the open admissions of obstruction of justice, and the fury among the constituents of many Democratic Senators, I can't believe that the regime would be too eager for another one. There would be many very pointed, uncomfortable questions.
It's been a righteous pain-in-the-ass to fill positions needing confirmation and having to replace an AG 6 months into the term would be a terrible, terrible look--not that any of them would give a fuck.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:56 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
It's been a righteous pain-in-the-ass to fill positions needing confirmation and having to replace an AG 6 months into the term would be a terrible, terrible look--not that any of them would give a fuck.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:56 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
This is just to say
I have stolen
the icebox
that contained
your plums
and which
you were clearly
using
for storage.
Forgive me
if you don't want
to be out
of a job
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:57 PM on July 21, 2017 [78 favorites]
I have stolen
the icebox
that contained
your plums
and which
you were clearly
using
for storage.
Forgive me
if you don't want
to be out
of a job
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:57 PM on July 21, 2017 [78 favorites]
Rudy, Rudy, Rudy.
Chris Wray may put a word in for his old boss, too.
posted by notyou at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Chris Wray may put a word in for his old boss, too.
posted by notyou at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Firing Sessions would be an implicit acceptance of the scandal, which has NOT been Trump's strategy so far. Ironically the more guilty someone looks, the more job security they have in Trumpland. It gives El Twittler the chance to scream fake news to his adoring fans.
posted by Glibpaxman at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Glibpaxman at 4:58 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
I would hope that the Dems would ask:
-- What will you say to DJT if he asks you to pledge your loyalty to him?
-- Do you pledge to leave Mueller's Investigation alone?
-- Have you ever had any interactions, meetings, or ties including financial with Russians?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
-- What will you say to DJT if he asks you to pledge your loyalty to him?
-- Do you pledge to leave Mueller's Investigation alone?
-- Have you ever had any interactions, meetings, or ties including financial with Russians?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
-- Do you have your own mini fridge?
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2017 [40 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2017 [40 favorites]
According to Twitter, dumping Sessions gives them a window to fire Mueller.
I don't get this. Rachel Maddow was talking last night (?) about how that's the grand plan: (a) Fire Sessions, (b) Appoint stooge (c) Get stooge to fire Mueller.
But (b) would be a long drawn out shitshow in the Senate, right? If they want to fire Mueller, why don't they just do it. Chop heads until you reach someone who wants to keep their head (and a fancy new title of DAG).
posted by pjenks at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2017
I don't get this. Rachel Maddow was talking last night (?) about how that's the grand plan: (a) Fire Sessions, (b) Appoint stooge (c) Get stooge to fire Mueller.
But (b) would be a long drawn out shitshow in the Senate, right? If they want to fire Mueller, why don't they just do it. Chop heads until you reach someone who wants to keep their head (and a fancy new title of DAG).
posted by pjenks at 5:01 PM on July 21, 2017
I remember thinking Alberto Gonzalez was about as bad as the AG could get. I admire the optimism that no one worse than Seasions could be installed, but I'm convinced that history is a nightmare factory with no bottom to the ghouls it manufactures.
posted by milarepa at 5:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
posted by milarepa at 5:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
Yeah, maybe Harriet Miers is around to take the job?
posted by pjenks at 5:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by pjenks at 5:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
I still have enough faith in the basic self-interest of the members of the United States Senate that, now a Special Counsel has been appointed, they will not find 51 votes to confirm someone likely to fire the Special Counsel without cause.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Ali Watkins:
posted by zachlipton at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
Coats, at #AspenSecurity: We have to keep coming back to main points during intel briefings because Trump won't focus.I still can't get over how often senior officials talk about the President like he's a poorly behaved toddler. I mean, here you have the Director of National Intelligence, who briefs the President most days, openly announcing on the record that the President can't focus on important topics. It seems like Daily Beast has a story pretty much daily where anonymous senior officials are talking about how he's yelling at the TV or they arrange events to try to distract him.
Said they're often good questions but briefings run way, way long because he interrupts and asks questions or asks for info on other topics
posted by zachlipton at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [22 favorites]
I don't. These are Republicans we're talking about.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
According to that WaPo article: "Kushner's financial disclosure has been updated 39 times since his first filing in March."
This is IN-FUCKIN-Sane. There are no consequences for these people.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [78 favorites]
This is IN-FUCKIN-Sane. There are no consequences for these people.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [78 favorites]
As stupid and shortsighted as the WH is, I don't believe they leaked it. Replacing the AG at the six month mark just to put someone in place, who first has to go through the confirmation process, in time to fire Mueller before his investigation's dirt comes out is just... crazy. This is an IC leak. And if Sessions is fired, he will squeal like a pig.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by TWinbrook8 at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
I can't remember who it was, but a recent guest on Pod Save America seemed to think there was a strong chance that Trump Saturday Night Massacreing Mueller would just lead to Congress setting up an independent commission legislatively, and choosing Robert Mueller to head it. Typing that out it seems to reek of misplaced optimism, but maybe it could happen?
posted by contraption at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by contraption at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Also Trump can count on Manchin and Donnelly's votes again, at the minimum. We just saw total Democratic abdication over Wray. He doesn't even need 51 Republicans.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Actor David James Elliott, JAG-Scaramucci. I think that is the resemblance, that is complimenting Mooch.
posted by Oyéah at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Oyéah at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
I don't see Sessions going anywhere. Trump's not going to fire him because that would indicate that he believes the report and disapproves of cozying up to Russia. Sessions ain't going to quit because he's fucking shameless. He's gonna give a smirky little smile and say, "I don't recall what we talked about but I'm certain it wasn't the campaign, y'all" and act all offended that anyone would say otherwise.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
So, every time Kushner submits his updated form, someone has to read it and judge whether it should impact his security clearance. Do we know who that person is? Do we know what their recommendations have been? Do we know if they have been overruled, and by whom?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [10 favorites]
But (b) would be a long drawn out shitshow in the Senate, right?
Two words; recess appointment.
posted by Justinian at 5:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Two words; recess appointment.
posted by Justinian at 5:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
I finally figured out which actor Scaramucci resembles: Trump's hand-picked replacement for the role of Obsequious Firstbornson.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Sorry, what do the meatloaf references in this thread refer to? I checked the Election Thread Reference FAQ and the meatloaf hasn't been documented there yet.
posted by ejs at 5:16 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by ejs at 5:16 PM on July 21, 2017
I don't get this. Rachel Maddow was talking last night (?) about how that's the grand plan: (a) Fire Sessions, (b) Appoint stooge (c) Get stooge to fire Mueller.
The thing is, they don't need to get a fucking stooge in order to fire Mueller. First, they already have a semi-stooge in Rosenstein. Trump can order him to fire Mueller. If he refuses, Trump can fire him and go on to the next in line, and the next, if necessary, Watergate-style. Shouldn't take him too long to get to someone craven or sycophantic enough to do it. All while he gets to keep Sessions. There's no sign the GOP Congress would be inclined to stop him.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
The thing is, they don't need to get a fucking stooge in order to fire Mueller. First, they already have a semi-stooge in Rosenstein. Trump can order him to fire Mueller. If he refuses, Trump can fire him and go on to the next in line, and the next, if necessary, Watergate-style. Shouldn't take him too long to get to someone craven or sycophantic enough to do it. All while he gets to keep Sessions. There's no sign the GOP Congress would be inclined to stop him.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
So every time Kushner submits his updated form
After committing perjury 38 times, I am certain that this one is truthful!
posted by mikelieman at 5:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [27 favorites]
After committing perjury 38 times, I am certain that this one is truthful!
posted by mikelieman at 5:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [27 favorites]
It's not perjury if you mean for me to believe it when you say it.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:21 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:21 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
Look, if he wants to fire Mueller he's going to fire Mueller. Firing Sessions to fire Mueller just screams RUSSIA RUSSIA RUSSIA, which may or may not stop him, but certainly bolsters the investigation's narrative further.
I don't think Mueller is in any more jeopardy than he was 5 hours ago. This is not a cunning way to do it, anymore than firing Rosenstein et eventual underlings would be. If he fires Sessions I'll rejoice because there's one fewer asshole fucking us over and keep on worrying about Mueller as usual.
posted by lydhre at 5:22 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
I don't think Mueller is in any more jeopardy than he was 5 hours ago. This is not a cunning way to do it, anymore than firing Rosenstein et eventual underlings would be. If he fires Sessions I'll rejoice because there's one fewer asshole fucking us over and keep on worrying about Mueller as usual.
posted by lydhre at 5:22 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
National security twitter thinks Trump leaked this about Sessions and compromised sources and methods to do it.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:22 PM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:22 PM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
So, every time Kushner submits his updated form, someone has to read it and judge whether it should impact his security clearance. Do we know who that person is? Do we know what their recommendations have been? Do we know if they have been overruled, and by whom?
Just to clarify, THIS form he lied on 364 times is his financial disclosure form, which goes to the ethics office people. The security clearance app is the OTHER form he completely inadvertently left 100+ foreign contacts off of and had to revise four times, so far.
I just hope Forgetful Jared isn't the guy the WH staff sends out to the drive-thru with everybody's lunch orders, because that really wouldn't end well.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
Just to clarify, THIS form he lied on 364 times is his financial disclosure form, which goes to the ethics office people. The security clearance app is the OTHER form he completely inadvertently left 100+ foreign contacts off of and had to revise four times, so far.
I just hope Forgetful Jared isn't the guy the WH staff sends out to the drive-thru with everybody's lunch orders, because that really wouldn't end well.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
ejs: It's from a story when Chris Christie had lunch with Trump.
posted by rhizome at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by rhizome at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
It's not perjury if you mean for me to believe it when you say it.
Fine. 38 counts of 18 USC 1001 then!
posted by mikelieman at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2017
Fine. 38 counts of 18 USC 1001 then!
posted by mikelieman at 5:23 PM on July 21, 2017
Sorry, what do the meatloaf references in this thread refer to? I checked the Election Thread Reference FAQ and the meatloaf hasn't been documented there yet.
Yeah we kind of stopped updating that after the election, which is probably a mistake. It's refering to this incident, in which Trump made Chris Christie order meatloaf to eat. Thereafter known as Trump's humiliation meatloaf, the food of choice for dignity wraiths.
posted by zachlipton at 5:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Yeah we kind of stopped updating that after the election, which is probably a mistake. It's refering to this incident, in which Trump made Chris Christie order meatloaf to eat. Thereafter known as Trump's humiliation meatloaf, the food of choice for dignity wraiths.
posted by zachlipton at 5:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
We just saw total Democratic abdication over Wray.Are Democrats supposed to oppose just for the sake of opposition? I didn't see anything particularly objectionable about Wray. He was Chris Christie's lawyer, had a couple of Russian clients, but acquitted himself respectably during his confirmation hearing and I didn't see any indication that he'd bent the knee. What'd I miss?
posted by xyzzy at 5:27 PM on July 21, 2017
Not JUST meatloaf. Nixon's Submission Meatloaf!
(Pat Nixon's recipe. You can Google it)
posted by mikelieman at 5:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
(Pat Nixon's recipe. You can Google it)
posted by mikelieman at 5:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Also, Trump called the meatloaf "fabulous," and there were stories about how Richard Nixon also loved meatloaf when he was President and how no one is sure whether the White House still uses Pat Nixon's recipe.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:28 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:28 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Yeah we kind of stopped updating that after the election, which is probably a mistake.
What?
So many lost bon mots, like tears in rain.
bons mot?
posted by notyou at 5:28 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
What?
So many lost bon mots, like tears in rain.
bons mot?
posted by notyou at 5:28 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Whose demented Friday-night newsdump of a birthday cake is this?!?
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:31 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:31 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
also dying to know how much Trump, Inc. paid Ivanka in comparison to dumb and dumber her brothers.
79%, same as in the rest of 'Merica.
posted by tilde at 5:32 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
79%, same as in the rest of 'Merica.
posted by tilde at 5:32 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
I wouldn't assume there won't be another scandal supplanting it in the next 24 hours.
Do I need to eat a cake or something?
posted by Artw at 5:32 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Do I need to eat a cake or something?
posted by Artw at 5:32 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Charles Pierce: It Was Always About the Money. Russia and the Trumps: A Grift Story.
There Is No One Trump Won't Throw Under the Bus: He will fire Robert Mueller—it's clear from what he said to The New York Times.
Trump's Warning to Mueller Proves, Again, That It's All About the Money. It always has been.
posted by homunculus at 5:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
There Is No One Trump Won't Throw Under the Bus: He will fire Robert Mueller—it's clear from what he said to The New York Times.
Trump's Warning to Mueller Proves, Again, That It's All About the Money. It always has been.
posted by homunculus at 5:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
Whose demented Friday-night newsdump of a birthday cake is this?!?
It's my birthday! Is this all for me?! Yay!
posted by mcduff at 5:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
It's my birthday! Is this all for me?! Yay!
posted by mcduff at 5:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [24 favorites]
Are Democrats supposed to oppose just for the sake of opposition? I didn't see anything particularly objectionable about Wray.
Yes. Wray was nominated by an illegitimate president and was therefore an illegitimate candidate.
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
Yes. Wray was nominated by an illegitimate president and was therefore an illegitimate candidate.
posted by Lyme Drop at 5:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
But (b) would be a long drawn out shitshow in the Senate, right?
Two words; recess appointment.
I thought they had to stay and fix Healthcare during Donnies hols?
posted by Artw at 5:35 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Two words; recess appointment.
I thought they had to stay and fix Healthcare during Donnies hols?
posted by Artw at 5:35 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Happy Birthday to you
Happy Birthday to you
Sessions looks like a monkey
And the White House is a zoo
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
Happy Birthday to you
Sessions looks like a monkey
And the White House is a zoo
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
also dying to know how much Trump, Inc. paid Ivanka in comparison to dumb and dumber her brothers.
Oh my god, I bet DonToo and Eric are hearing about Ivanka's $2.5 mil "salary and severance" for the first time today, ha ha ha ha. Yep, boys, just another humiliating public reminder that you're not Daddy's Best Girl.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
Oh my god, I bet DonToo and Eric are hearing about Ivanka's $2.5 mil "salary and severance" for the first time today, ha ha ha ha. Yep, boys, just another humiliating public reminder that you're not Daddy's Best Girl.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:36 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
Man, this being at the core a good old money laundering case where Trump provided real estate to sink dirty Russian cash means to me, it's pretty much all over but filling the indictments...
posted by mikelieman at 5:37 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by mikelieman at 5:37 PM on July 21, 2017
Kushner is also the person 45 says can broker a new peace deal in the Middle East.
How's that going, Jared?
Hope his data updating skills extend to adding 'intifada' to his phone's spellcheck.
posted by Devonian at 5:37 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
How's that going, Jared?
Hope his data updating skills extend to adding 'intifada' to his phone's spellcheck.
posted by Devonian at 5:37 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Yes. Wray was nominated by an illegitimate president and was therefore an illegitimate candidate.Yeah, I'm not going to push for pure obstructionism just because it's technically moral. Republicans are the party of "no." I'd like to be in the party of "get shit done for the people."
posted by xyzzy at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
Just to clarify, THIS form he lied on 364 times is his financial disclosure form, which goes to the ethics office people. The security clearance app is the OTHER form he completely inadvertently left 100+ foreign contacts off of and had to revise four times, so far.
I'm sure these are handled by totally different offices and I know the OPM hack caused a lot of upheavals and delays, but I can't help but feel miffed at this shit since my PR is more than a year overdue now and one of my references has literally died in the interim.
posted by Hal Mumkin at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2017
I'm sure these are handled by totally different offices and I know the OPM hack caused a lot of upheavals and delays, but I can't help but feel miffed at this shit since my PR is more than a year overdue now and one of my references has literally died in the interim.
posted by Hal Mumkin at 5:38 PM on July 21, 2017
Don't hold your breath Mikelieman.
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:39 PM on July 21, 2017
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:39 PM on July 21, 2017
haha if I were the writer of this insane movie I'd script it so Sessions leaked this info to make it impossible for Trump to fire him.
I love that this 24-style, mid-season plot twist is totally believable at this point, and by love I, of course, mean weep gently in the bathroom as I mourn the death of reality.
posted by milarepa at 5:39 PM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
I love that this 24-style, mid-season plot twist is totally believable at this point, and by love I, of course, mean weep gently in the bathroom as I mourn the death of reality.
posted by milarepa at 5:39 PM on July 21, 2017 [14 favorites]
Are Democrats supposed to oppose just for the sake of opposition? I didn't see anything particularly objectionable about Wray. He was Chris Christie's lawyer, had a couple of Russian clients, but acquitted himself respectably during his confirmation hearing and I didn't see any indication that he'd bent the knee. What'd I miss?
Fucking yes they are. You missed that Trump fired Comey to obstruct the Russia treason investigation. NO Democratic vote for a Trump nominated successor is acceptable, PERIOD. HE OBSTRUCTED JUSTICE.
Democrats are acting like this is just a normal president doing normal president things, not the fucking survival of democracy.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:40 PM on July 21, 2017 [58 favorites]
Fucking yes they are. You missed that Trump fired Comey to obstruct the Russia treason investigation. NO Democratic vote for a Trump nominated successor is acceptable, PERIOD. HE OBSTRUCTED JUSTICE.
Democrats are acting like this is just a normal president doing normal president things, not the fucking survival of democracy.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:40 PM on July 21, 2017 [58 favorites]
So Jr. and Manafort aren't testifying next week.
On account of how they are too obviously guilty or something?
posted by Artw at 5:40 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
On account of how they are too obviously guilty or something?
posted by Artw at 5:40 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Step one of Get Shit Done for the People is to resist this illegitimate, incompetent, corrupt, white-nationalist government.
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:40 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:40 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
HE OBSTRUCTED JUSTICE.Ah, yes. We should abolish the EPA immediately, then. Nixon did do criminal things while President, therefore no executive action he undertook is valid.
posted by xyzzy at 5:43 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
The only acceptable nomination was Andrew McCabe, who was there for the entire investigation along side Comey. They should've insisted on McCabe staying, or a nominee picked a bipartisan panel of Senators. Anyone else nominated by Trump is irretrievably tainted just from the fact of being Trump's choice. It's the fruit of the poisonous tree, and Democrats gobbled it up and said "Thank you Mr. Trump may we please have another?"
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:44 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:44 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
The thing about money laundering for Russian oligarchs for 20 years is that there is concrete, objective evidence of it out there. This is not going to be about opinions. This is not going to be about feelings. This is not going to be about who said what at a meeting. This is not going to be about treason which, as we know, the Republicans are currently okay with. All those things matter, and all those things should be screamed from the rooftops, but this investigation is going to be about one single thing.
This is going to be about a pile of dirty fucking money.
posted by lydhre at 5:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [48 favorites]
This is going to be about a pile of dirty fucking money.
posted by lydhre at 5:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [48 favorites]
We should abolish the EPA immediately, then. Nixon did do criminal things while President, therefore no executive action he undertook is valid.
No appointee he could've picked after firing Elliot Richardson would have been valid. Come the fuck on.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
No appointee he could've picked after firing Elliot Richardson would have been valid. Come the fuck on.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Also Trump can count on Manchin and Donnelly's votes again, at the minimum. We just saw total Democratic abdication over Wray. He doesn't even need 51 Republicans.
The bar on large parts of the bill just got a lot higher, 60 votes. So says the Senate Parliamentarian. Being a Senate Democrat just became a lot more valuable to them. Not hard since it was 0 until now, but it'll be interesting to see their offers. And responses.
posted by scalefree at 5:46 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
The bar on large parts of the bill just got a lot higher, 60 votes. So says the Senate Parliamentarian. Being a Senate Democrat just became a lot more valuable to them. Not hard since it was 0 until now, but it'll be interesting to see their offers. And responses.
posted by scalefree at 5:46 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
So a coupla quick personal notes.
I sent off my postcards this morning to my Senators, Congressman, Speaker of the House, and Senate Majority Leader asking them to think about what they will do when Trump scatters pardons around like confetti and fires Mueller. Then I begged them to preserve the Justice system and the Rule of Law adding that I loved my country and was fearful of the coming days.
I left my White House Postcard blank. It is still sitting here on my desk. I just....
Also I happened to have recent conversations with two Trump voting family members. Responding to my question on their feelings about Trump now, they both responded the same way, "I don't watch the news. So I don't really know what's going on."
Now I can forgive my nearly 80 year old mother who finds the news stressful but my SIL the nurse? The one with the Heroin addict son who needs rehab? I wanted to shake her by the shoulders until her eyeballs rattled. I asked what they were saying at the hospital about the Obamacare replacement and she said the topic never comes up. I explained as concisely as possible what was on the line with the Senate proposals and she said, "Oh they wouldn't do that. That are not going to take people's Medicare away. That doesn't make sense."
I try not to think too much about all of those Trump/Republican voters who aren't fans and who can't be bothered to know what is going on.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
I sent off my postcards this morning to my Senators, Congressman, Speaker of the House, and Senate Majority Leader asking them to think about what they will do when Trump scatters pardons around like confetti and fires Mueller. Then I begged them to preserve the Justice system and the Rule of Law adding that I loved my country and was fearful of the coming days.
I left my White House Postcard blank. It is still sitting here on my desk. I just....
Also I happened to have recent conversations with two Trump voting family members. Responding to my question on their feelings about Trump now, they both responded the same way, "I don't watch the news. So I don't really know what's going on."
Now I can forgive my nearly 80 year old mother who finds the news stressful but my SIL the nurse? The one with the Heroin addict son who needs rehab? I wanted to shake her by the shoulders until her eyeballs rattled. I asked what they were saying at the hospital about the Obamacare replacement and she said the topic never comes up. I explained as concisely as possible what was on the line with the Senate proposals and she said, "Oh they wouldn't do that. That are not going to take people's Medicare away. That doesn't make sense."
I try not to think too much about all of those Trump/Republican voters who aren't fans and who can't be bothered to know what is going on.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [29 favorites]
I thought they had to stay and fix Healthcare during Donnies hols?
I would love to see what would happen if the Senators really did cancel their August plans to stay and work on this bill while the President blithely went away for two weeks to golf. There's got to be some resentment building up already that he has been so useless yet so pushy.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:50 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
I would love to see what would happen if the Senators really did cancel their August plans to stay and work on this bill while the President blithely went away for two weeks to golf. There's got to be some resentment building up already that he has been so useless yet so pushy.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:50 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
The bar on large parts of the bill just got a lot higher, 60 votes. So says the Senate Parliamentarian. Being a Senate Democrat just became a lot more valuable to them. Not hard since it was 0 until now, but it'll be interesting to see their offers. And responses.
Manchin and Donnelly voted to confirm Sessions, that was what I was referring to, and after the Wray performance I expect him to get somewhere north of 65 or 70 votes. I highly doubt Democrats would present an effective opposition to a Sessions replacement.
It is good news on the health care front though to have the Senate parlimentarian ruling. Although Republicans have fired parlimentarians before to get around reconciliation rulings, and we're talking about Mitch McConnell. They can still overruling this and break the Senate still further.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:56 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Manchin and Donnelly voted to confirm Sessions, that was what I was referring to, and after the Wray performance I expect him to get somewhere north of 65 or 70 votes. I highly doubt Democrats would present an effective opposition to a Sessions replacement.
It is good news on the health care front though to have the Senate parlimentarian ruling. Although Republicans have fired parlimentarians before to get around reconciliation rulings, and we're talking about Mitch McConnell. They can still overruling this and break the Senate still further.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:56 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
For those of us outside the bubble: National Enquirer cover-
"Hillary Framed Trump Family" (seen today)
posted by wittgenstein at 5:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
"Hillary Framed Trump Family" (seen today)
posted by wittgenstein at 5:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Come the fuck on.Trust me. I get the anger. I get the desire to see Democrats do SOMETHING, ANYTHING, to resist Twitler. My friends are also on the side of pure obstructionism and resistance to anything suggested by a Republican, most especially the President himself. But I don't think it's reasonable or wise to object to ideas just because of who suggested them. I'm open to objections to Wray as an FBI director, but the idea of just not having an FBI director for 3+ years because the President probably illegally fired the last one just doesn't sit well with me. Bannon and Trump are already drastically reducing the size of government by avoiding designating new appointees and converting the remainder to loyal devotees through attrition; I am not interested in furthering this plan to decimate the machinery to serve some apocalyptic vision of the future.
I'll see myself out.
posted by xyzzy at 6:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
I have a little more faith in the Democrats, T.D. Strange, if nothing else because Sessions will be fired explicitly for one of two stated reasons: for failing to help Trump obstruct justice with regards to the Russian investigation OR because the WH believes that Sessions had incriminating conversations with the Russians on behalf of the campaign.
posted by lydhre at 6:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by lydhre at 6:02 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Trump is not going to nominate anyone for any role who is not likewise a criminal.
posted by Artw at 6:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Artw at 6:04 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
My theory for a while now has been that Putin wanted to undermine democracy by promoting anti-government forces and separatists in rhe US as he does in the countries. So he asked his colleague Paul Manafort, who said "Sure, one of my old buddies is a leader of the Ersatz Confederacy." Then he said "Hey Jeff, you know how white people are soon going to be a minority and democracy will then destroy white hegemony? What if we could help you with that democracy problem?"
Sessions said "I love it." He recruited a core team which included Bannon. They brought Trump in as the perfect figurehead (celebrity "businessman" who had a long history of looking the other way from Russian money laundering) but were careful not to tell him too much. Because he is an idiot who cannot keep his mouth shut. They told him it was totally normal to meet with Russian lawyers and anyone in Washington would have taken that meeting. Trump believed them.
Now it is all blowing up. Sessions got him into this mess. Sessions told him it would be great. Sessions says "make me AG. No one will be able to touch you."
Then he recuses himself??? Sessions told him to fire Comey! Now Trump is the one being blamed for "obstruction of justice"?
He keeps getting in trouble for doing stuff Sessions told him to do. Not fair!
So yeah, I can see him leaking this to be like "See? Sessions is the colluder, not me. Sessions made me do it!"
posted by OnceUponATime at 6:08 PM on July 21, 2017 [28 favorites]
Sessions said "I love it." He recruited a core team which included Bannon. They brought Trump in as the perfect figurehead (celebrity "businessman" who had a long history of looking the other way from Russian money laundering) but were careful not to tell him too much. Because he is an idiot who cannot keep his mouth shut. They told him it was totally normal to meet with Russian lawyers and anyone in Washington would have taken that meeting. Trump believed them.
Now it is all blowing up. Sessions got him into this mess. Sessions told him it would be great. Sessions says "make me AG. No one will be able to touch you."
Then he recuses himself??? Sessions told him to fire Comey! Now Trump is the one being blamed for "obstruction of justice"?
He keeps getting in trouble for doing stuff Sessions told him to do. Not fair!
So yeah, I can see him leaking this to be like "See? Sessions is the colluder, not me. Sessions made me do it!"
posted by OnceUponATime at 6:08 PM on July 21, 2017 [28 favorites]
The thing about money laundering for Russian oligarchs for 20 years is that there is concrete, objective evidence of it out there.
Which NOBODY, no State AG and no Federal Dept. of Justice under a Democratic President ever bothered to investigate, let alone prosecute. And before the Russians, he was laundering money for Good Old American mobsters. Isn't it obvious why he believes he is Above The Law? He is the Living Embodiment of the Failure of American Justice (not to mention our economic system). Which, I guess makes him a Prefect President.
National Enquirer cover- "Hillary Framed Trump Family" (seen today)
Another "American Institution" that should have been prosecuted and/or sued out of existence years before it could have had an influence on American politics. Is there nobody organizing a BOYCOTT EVERY ENQUIRER ADVERTISER AND EVERY STORE SELLING IT campaign?
America is reaping the harvest of a long history of tolerating absolute evil. Am I an intolerant Liberal? Hell, yeah.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:12 PM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
Which NOBODY, no State AG and no Federal Dept. of Justice under a Democratic President ever bothered to investigate, let alone prosecute. And before the Russians, he was laundering money for Good Old American mobsters. Isn't it obvious why he believes he is Above The Law? He is the Living Embodiment of the Failure of American Justice (not to mention our economic system). Which, I guess makes him a Prefect President.
National Enquirer cover- "Hillary Framed Trump Family" (seen today)
Another "American Institution" that should have been prosecuted and/or sued out of existence years before it could have had an influence on American politics. Is there nobody organizing a BOYCOTT EVERY ENQUIRER ADVERTISER AND EVERY STORE SELLING IT campaign?
America is reaping the harvest of a long history of tolerating absolute evil. Am I an intolerant Liberal? Hell, yeah.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:12 PM on July 21, 2017 [18 favorites]
Politico's Josh Dawsey: Inside the 24 hours that broke Sean Spicer
posted by zachlipton at 6:13 PM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
The president had watched Scaramucci act as a surrogate for him on TV and heaped lavish praise on him to advisers. Two people who spoke to Trump said he particularly relished that Scaramucci forced CNN to issue a retraction on a story about the businessman's Russian ties — and considered him almost a "white knight" for it, one of these people said. When Scaramucci visited the Oval Office two weeks ago, Trump reminded others repeatedly of the retraction, one senior official said.When you put it this way, it's a little more clear why Spicer viewed this as a personal humiliation as opposed to his previous ongoing debasement for Trump. This is the equivalent of stepping aside from your job to do your bosses job, then walking in one day and being asked by reporters if you'll be reporting to some hedge fund bro with no experience. He hasn't briefed the press in a month, so what the hell would his job possibly be if he's not doing briefings and not Communications Director?
...
Spicer was soon being bombarded Thursday evening with media reports that he was getting a new boss in title — even though he didn't know exactly what to say. There were efforts from Priebus and Bannon to slow or block the move. Administration officials and advisers said they had various reasons for their opposition, including fears that Scaramucci lacked the political or communications experience necessary for the high-profile job, and personal tensions between Priebus and Scaramucci.
After he found out about Scaramucci’s appointment, Bannon had a very "aggressive" confrontation with Trump that some in the West Wing viewed as remarkable, people with direct knowledge of the encounter said. Another person familiar with the encounter said Bannon's behavior was "embarrassing."
...
Spicer saw it as a personal affront to work for Scaramucci and told the president that it couldn't work. Spicer had expected to evolve into more of a full-time communications director role because he was essentially no longer the public-facing press secretary, having turned over the podium.
posted by zachlipton at 6:13 PM on July 21, 2017 [20 favorites]
Good.
posted by Artw at 6:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by Artw at 6:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Meanwhile: Trump Assigns White House Team to Target Iran Nuclear Deal, Sidelining State Department (FP)
After a contentious meeting with Secretary of State Rex Tillerson this week, President Donald Trump instructed a group of trusted White House staffers to make the potential case for withholding certification of Iran at the next 90-day review of the nuclear deal. The goal was to give Trump what he felt the State Department had failed to do: the option to declare that Tehran was not in compliance with the contentious agreement.posted by Barack Spinoza at 6:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
“The president assigned White House staffers with the task of preparing for the possibility of decertification for the 90-day review period that ends in October — a task he had previously given to Secretary Tillerson and the State Department,” a source close to the White House told Foreign Policy.
Which NOBODY, no State AG and no Federal Dept. of Justice under a Democratic President ever bothered to investigate, let alone prosecute.
Preet Bharara did, and he got fired for it, then Sessions settled the case for pennies...
The civil forfeiture case was filed in 2013 by Preet Bharara, the former U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York — who was fired by Trump in March. The case alleged that 11 companies were involved in a tax fraud in Russia and then laundered a portion of the $230 million they got into Manhattan real estate.
posted by mikelieman at 6:19 PM on July 21, 2017 [53 favorites]
Preet Bharara did, and he got fired for it, then Sessions settled the case for pennies...
The civil forfeiture case was filed in 2013 by Preet Bharara, the former U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York — who was fired by Trump in March. The case alleged that 11 companies were involved in a tax fraud in Russia and then laundered a portion of the $230 million they got into Manhattan real estate.
posted by mikelieman at 6:19 PM on July 21, 2017 [53 favorites]
We wouldn't have not had an FBI director. Wray would've been confirmed with Republican votes. Democrats could've acknowledged the serious irregularity and criminality of the situation and withheld support for anything other than a compromise nominee, or the man already in place. They didn't. Instead they gave Trump a patheticly deferential confirmation hearing after he obstructed justice, and alleged Democratic leader like Feinstein immediately signaled they would ratify his obstruction. This is not what effective opposition looks like. It's what complicity looks like.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:22 PM on July 21, 2017 [12 favorites]
Preet Bharara did...
Weak sauce. Should have prosecuted Donnie personally. Didn't Jared's father go to jail for less? Oh yeah, he's Jewish.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Weak sauce. Should have prosecuted Donnie personally. Didn't Jared's father go to jail for less? Oh yeah, he's Jewish.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Have you been watching the health care votes? The Democrats are the only thing standing between us and hundreds of thousands of dead Americans. They are not complicit, they're fighting the good fight, and I'm proud of them.
posted by Justinian at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2017 [60 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 6:26 PM on July 21, 2017 [60 favorites]
To that I would add that a bunch of anonymous budget committee staffers fighting quietly for abortion rights with the Senate Parliamentarian isn't sexy work, but it's damn important work, and Democrats deserve credit for it.
posted by zachlipton at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2017 [50 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 6:29 PM on July 21, 2017 [50 favorites]
i wouldn't trust them on that if they weren't getting a barrage calls just the same as the Repubs. Fuckers will bipartisan over anything and require constant watching.
posted by Artw at 6:30 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by Artw at 6:30 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
i wouldn't trust them on that if they weren't getting a barrage calls just the same as the Repubs. Fuckers will bipartisan over anything and require constant watching.
This. The only thing stopping them from agreeing to repeal Medicaid is activism. I wish we could mobilize similar levels for Omnigate, and Democratic performance during the Wray hearings is proof of the difference pressure makes.
Remember when Democrats started off by voting nearly unanimously for Trump's nominees until the grassroots lost their minds? We did that. We deserve credit. They don't deserve shit until we beat them into voting the minimally acceptable way, because if we don't, they won't. If the calls and pressure lets up for a week, they'll roll over on everything. Never forget these are the same people that tried time and time again to sell out the safety net in Obama's myriad "grand bargains". That's what they want to do, the only thing making them doing anything different is us.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [27 favorites]
This. The only thing stopping them from agreeing to repeal Medicaid is activism. I wish we could mobilize similar levels for Omnigate, and Democratic performance during the Wray hearings is proof of the difference pressure makes.
Remember when Democrats started off by voting nearly unanimously for Trump's nominees until the grassroots lost their minds? We did that. We deserve credit. They don't deserve shit until we beat them into voting the minimally acceptable way, because if we don't, they won't. If the calls and pressure lets up for a week, they'll roll over on everything. Never forget these are the same people that tried time and time again to sell out the safety net in Obama's myriad "grand bargains". That's what they want to do, the only thing making them doing anything different is us.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [27 favorites]
So yeah, I can see him leaking this to be like "See? Sessions is the colluder, not me. Sessions made me do it!"
Do we believe that Trump, on his own, is capable of successfully leaking anything without leaving a massive trail?
posted by Artw at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2017
Do we believe that Trump, on his own, is capable of successfully leaking anything without leaving a massive trail?
posted by Artw at 6:39 PM on July 21, 2017
Do we believe that Trump, on his own, is capable
The only person Trump has even been associated with who I would describe as "capable" is Putin. He doesn't even know how to hire capable.
posted by ctmf at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
The only person Trump has even been associated with who I would describe as "capable" is Putin. He doesn't even know how to hire capable.
posted by ctmf at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Weak sauce. Should have prosecuted Donnie personally. Didn't Jared's father go to jail for less? Oh yeah, he's Jewish.
I imagine that Preet Bharara has had to walk a fine line. On one hand, IF he had an actual case at the time against Trump, I'm sure he would have. I think the real tell here is when Trump left him in the gig after his inauguration was a carrot. Then when Trump tried to reach out to him to see if he could be counted on as loyal, and found out that he wasn't playing ball, fired him. And then of course, Sessions settled the case involving the lawyer in the June meeting....
I have this image of Preet sending Bob a USB drive full of evidence that he didn't drill down into, but when Muller does, it's going to need another edition of "The Laundrymen"
posted by mikelieman at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
I imagine that Preet Bharara has had to walk a fine line. On one hand, IF he had an actual case at the time against Trump, I'm sure he would have. I think the real tell here is when Trump left him in the gig after his inauguration was a carrot. Then when Trump tried to reach out to him to see if he could be counted on as loyal, and found out that he wasn't playing ball, fired him. And then of course, Sessions settled the case involving the lawyer in the June meeting....
I have this image of Preet sending Bob a USB drive full of evidence that he didn't drill down into, but when Muller does, it's going to need another edition of "The Laundrymen"
posted by mikelieman at 6:43 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
The Democrats are the only thing standing between us and hundreds of thousands of dead Americans. They are not complicit, they're fighting the good fight, and I'm proud of them.
DEMOCRATS 2018: What Jesus WOULD DO!
posted by mikelieman at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
DEMOCRATS 2018: What Jesus WOULD DO!
posted by mikelieman at 6:44 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Jesus had skillz.
posted by Artw at 6:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Artw at 6:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Did we already cover that the Kislyak/Sessions leak probably came from the White House?
posted by scalefree at 6:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by scalefree at 6:45 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
He hasn't briefed the press in a month, so what the hell would his job possibly be if he's not doing briefings and not Communications Director?
Doing all the actual work of a communications director (or as close as one would get in the Trump White House) while Scaramucci gets the title and really is just #1 Suck-up Surrogate on tv.
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
Doing all the actual work of a communications director (or as close as one would get in the Trump White House) while Scaramucci gets the title and really is just #1 Suck-up Surrogate on tv.
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:47 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
I know nothing makes any sense anymore, but the White House leaking that the campaign collided with Russia really makes no sense whatsoever.
posted by zachlipton at 6:51 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 6:51 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
Oh, and a Post reporter said they've known about the story since June, which throws a lot of cold water on the "the White House leaked it" theory.
posted by zachlipton at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 6:54 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Why can't we just fricking add election do overs to the constantly growing list of extraconstitutional political practices we tolerate (like the party system and lobbying) and just be done with this unholy clown show already?
posted by saulgoodman at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by saulgoodman at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Oh, and a Post reporter said they've known about the story since June, which throws a lot of cold water on the "the White House leaked it" theory.
I agree, but I'd note that "the White House" doesn't seem to be a singular noun of unified motive at the moment.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
I agree, but I'd note that "the White House" doesn't seem to be a singular noun of unified motive at the moment.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 7:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
the White House leaking that the campaign collided with Russia really makes no sense whatsoever.
Unless we are in that phase where the criminals know the gig is up and all start pointing fingers at each other. I would like to believe we are already there, but maybe that is just wishful thinking still.
posted by OnceUponATime at 7:07 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
Unless we are in that phase where the criminals know the gig is up and all start pointing fingers at each other. I would like to believe we are already there, but maybe that is just wishful thinking still.
posted by OnceUponATime at 7:07 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
WTF I'm watching CNN they got Sessions dead to rights? I should be freaked out and happy big time at the same time? HIVE MIND SUMMARIZE THE LAST 12 HOURS FOR ME PLEEZE.
posted by vrakatar at 7:11 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by vrakatar at 7:11 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
To temper our mutual engorgement at the idea that Preet had the raw data on the dirty money trail that led to 45, and all Mueller has to do is write the right spreadsheet, these sort of cases are phenomenally hard to prove to jury standards, Even when a regulator, investigator or in fact everyone just knows that massive shenanigans have taken place, the paper trail can be extraordinarily hard to connect between points A and B.
Where millions or billions are involved, then it becomes a question of whether the best minds and resources that the criminals can deploy can better the best minds and resources that the state can muster, and the dice is loaded for the former - presumption of innocence, financial dealings that are hard for the highly trained to follow, let alone the jury, and global financial systems that are symbiotic with money and antagonistic to regulation and oversight.
Which is why Mueller is assembling a phalanx of very good domain lawyers and taking his time - not because there's any doubt about what happened, but because demonstrating it well enough to win a case is extremely hard. I doubt there's anyone on the planet who's able to read and cares to actively look who doesn't believe that 45 is an habitual financial criminal and who is currently engaged in the biggest scam of his life. Of course he is, and the stakes really couldn't be higher - no Bond movie ever dared to posit that the evil mastermind had taken over two of the four estates, and was busily working on the others. But proving it? Both of the remaining estates are trying very hard: it's a helluva fight.
The one thing that gives me hope, and it is quite a good hope, is that the evil genius is actually a petulant manchild who is quite possibly falling apart by the day. Imagine a chimera of 45's populism and Obama's acuity - then we'd be reporting to the re-education amps for the crime of having metafilter.com in our browser histories.
But it's just 45, and he's losing it. Which is very bad, yet imagine him on the stand and... well, may it come quickly, but no quicker than it should.
posted by Devonian at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2017 [31 favorites]
Where millions or billions are involved, then it becomes a question of whether the best minds and resources that the criminals can deploy can better the best minds and resources that the state can muster, and the dice is loaded for the former - presumption of innocence, financial dealings that are hard for the highly trained to follow, let alone the jury, and global financial systems that are symbiotic with money and antagonistic to regulation and oversight.
Which is why Mueller is assembling a phalanx of very good domain lawyers and taking his time - not because there's any doubt about what happened, but because demonstrating it well enough to win a case is extremely hard. I doubt there's anyone on the planet who's able to read and cares to actively look who doesn't believe that 45 is an habitual financial criminal and who is currently engaged in the biggest scam of his life. Of course he is, and the stakes really couldn't be higher - no Bond movie ever dared to posit that the evil mastermind had taken over two of the four estates, and was busily working on the others. But proving it? Both of the remaining estates are trying very hard: it's a helluva fight.
The one thing that gives me hope, and it is quite a good hope, is that the evil genius is actually a petulant manchild who is quite possibly falling apart by the day. Imagine a chimera of 45's populism and Obama's acuity - then we'd be reporting to the re-education amps for the crime of having metafilter.com in our browser histories.
But it's just 45, and he's losing it. Which is very bad, yet imagine him on the stand and... well, may it come quickly, but no quicker than it should.
posted by Devonian at 7:13 PM on July 21, 2017 [31 favorites]
I know nothing makes any sense anymore, but the White House leaking that the campaign collided with Russia really makes no sense whatsoever.
They want Sessions to resign so they can appoint a successor to fire Mueller.
Yes, they're actually that stupid/desperate.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
They want Sessions to resign so they can appoint a successor to fire Mueller.
Yes, they're actually that stupid/desperate.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:20 PM on July 21, 2017 [15 favorites]
What actor does Scaramucci look like?
Maybe not a match, but a resemblance.
posted by rochrobbb at 7:22 PM on July 21, 2017
Maybe not a match, but a resemblance.
posted by rochrobbb at 7:22 PM on July 21, 2017
There's no strategy, there's only satisfying urges & grudges. This is who he is.
posted by scalefree at 7:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by scalefree at 7:23 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
The only person in that clowncar of fuckups with the capability to strategize is maaaaybe Bannon. Whenever anyone's Big Unifying Theory of Omnishamblesgate involves Trump employing any kind of forethought, strategy, intelligence or understanding of the anything beyond the howling Lovecraftian void inside his own skull, I know I can immediately file it away in the Louise Mensch pile.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:28 PM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
David Brooks, on NPR, actually fronted the Dementia excuse today. THIS is the toadie who would fawn over Dubbya's every move... actual quote: "This President is capable of many things, guile is not one of them." Then he went on to note the Trump of today is not the trump of fifteen years ago, in terms of his speech patterns.
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:34 PM on July 21, 2017 [4 favorites]
David brooks can go jump in a lake. Anything to absolve the GOP.
posted by tilde at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by tilde at 7:42 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Twitter partisans of all hues are writhing over the Sessions story. Nobody knows whether to defend or decry him.
Nothing is true, and everything is possible.
posted by Devonian at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Nothing is true, and everything is possible.
posted by Devonian at 7:50 PM on July 21, 2017 [6 favorites]
Never forget these are the same people that tried time and time again to sell out the safety net in Obama's myriad "grand bargains". That's what they want to do, the only thing making them doing anything different is us.
Funny, my memory is that when Barack Obama was elected, he said something like
It's almost like he was trying to tell us that elected Democrats really need the political pressure of normal citizens calling them with their support and leftward pressure in order to have sufficient political capital to make effective change. Almost.
posted by biogeo at 7:52 PM on July 21, 2017 [79 favorites]
Funny, my memory is that when Barack Obama was elected, he said something like
There will be setbacks and false starts. There are many who won't agree with every decision or policy I make as President. And we know the government can't solve every problem. But I will always be honest with you about the challenges we face. I will listen to you, especially when we disagree. And, above all, I will ask you to join in the work of remaking this nation, the only way it's been done in America for 221 years -- block by block, brick by brick, calloused hand by calloused hand. What began 21 months ago in the depths of winter cannot end on this autumn night.and then the Americans who voted him into office went home and stopped agitating for change, and didn't keep up pressure to reform and improve the social safety net, and didn't bother to show up to the polls in 2010, and so the Democrats never quite managed to get the political capital and support they needed to continue pushing after the painful work of recovering from the Great Recession and passing the ACA before the Republicans took over state houses across the country and used their power to redraw electoral maps to make a naked power grab that ultimately gave them all three branches of federal government, forcing the Dems to fight a constant rearguard action to preserve the gains they'd made.
This victory alone is not the change we seek. It is only the chance for us to make that change. And that cannot happen if we go back to the way things were. It can't happen without you, without a new spirit of service, a new spirit of sacrifice. So let us summon a new spirit of patriotism, of responsibility, where each of us resolves to pitch in and work harder and look after not only ourselves but each other.
It's almost like he was trying to tell us that elected Democrats really need the political pressure of normal citizens calling them with their support and leftward pressure in order to have sufficient political capital to make effective change. Almost.
posted by biogeo at 7:52 PM on July 21, 2017 [79 favorites]
and this is the 423rd time I have thought to myself "Trump is fucked now".
posted by yhbc at 7:53 PM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by yhbc at 7:53 PM on July 21, 2017 [17 favorites]
A little bit of an update from the front: I went to a small protest march about the woman who was shot by a cop last weekend in Minneapolis. It took place on short notice in a very white part of town, and was overwhelmingly white and middle class, although called by New North, CAIR, BLM and other POC-led groups. What I noticed was that pretty much every one of those people cheered when one of the speakers said that the problem was the capitalist system which created cops to protect the rich and divide POC from whites. The level of speech-making was also really high. I've been going to these things for literally twenty years at this point, and this was different.
You know what? I think that they - the rich, the right, the Trumps and the blue dogs - have overplayed their hand. I think they think we're beat down, and today I really felt strongly that they're wrong. I'm seeing a lot of little things I've never seen before among liberals and center leftists, and I'm seeing a lot of move to the left. I really think there's blood in the water and all those rich rightists had better watch out - a change is gonna come, I am sure of it.
posted by Frowner at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [111 favorites]
You know what? I think that they - the rich, the right, the Trumps and the blue dogs - have overplayed their hand. I think they think we're beat down, and today I really felt strongly that they're wrong. I'm seeing a lot of little things I've never seen before among liberals and center leftists, and I'm seeing a lot of move to the left. I really think there's blood in the water and all those rich rightists had better watch out - a change is gonna come, I am sure of it.
posted by Frowner at 8:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [111 favorites]
I say this everyday, and everyday I also say I won't say this again, but today was fuckin' bonkers.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [27 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:06 PM on July 21, 2017 [27 favorites]
the Trump of today is not the trump of fifteen years ago, in terms of his speech patterns.
Where the hell do people get this notion? I've been listening to the asshat bloviate for nearly 40 years, and he sounded the same then as he does now, with the added dismissiveness of 15 years' more unquestioned power and the sense that he's some sort of patriarch. He doesn't need to care any more, and he doesn't curry favor. But nothing about his speech is different.
posted by Miko at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
Where the hell do people get this notion? I've been listening to the asshat bloviate for nearly 40 years, and he sounded the same then as he does now, with the added dismissiveness of 15 years' more unquestioned power and the sense that he's some sort of patriarch. He doesn't need to care any more, and he doesn't curry favor. But nothing about his speech is different.
posted by Miko at 8:14 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
WAY outside the edit window but I need to broaden this
Watching Season 4 of Arrested Development. "This may be something more treason-adjacent."posted by tilde at 8:16 PM on July 21, 2017
"This is the story of one nation whose democratic republic of laws and society were ground to dust slowly and bloodily, and how one Pinnocchio President had to try to keep his grift together for the sake of the poor healthcare insurance companies, oil companies, banks, and his best buddy Vladimir."
Have we nothing on Pence yet?
If only there was a former Republican Secretary of State who was an expert on Russia who could go to Capitol hill and knock some sense into a few key people. They could even send a memo: "Putin determined to strike in US"
posted by Room 641-A at 8:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by Room 641-A at 8:17 PM on July 21, 2017 [8 favorites]
Have we nothing on Pence yet?
There's always Mother in the Banana Stand!
posted by Celsius1414 at 8:18 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
There's always Mother in the Banana Stand!
posted by Celsius1414 at 8:18 PM on July 21, 2017 [16 favorites]
It's almost like he was trying to tell us that elected Democrats really need the political pressure of normal citizens calling them with their support and leftward pressure in order to have sufficient political capital to make effective change. Almost.
Almost. But not clear enough. Too wordy. Too calm. So easy to take as "okay, we can relax now; our guy's in charge". But things were so much more complicated and, ironically, needed to be more simplified to motivate the masses. If Obama had been more of a fire-breathing orator, he might have scared too many (white) people to get elected. But ironically, that fire-breathing was what he lacked, and needed, to build upon his personal victory. (And what made Keegan Michael-Kay's 'Obama's Anger Translator' the most perfect bit of satire of his presidency)
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
Almost. But not clear enough. Too wordy. Too calm. So easy to take as "okay, we can relax now; our guy's in charge". But things were so much more complicated and, ironically, needed to be more simplified to motivate the masses. If Obama had been more of a fire-breathing orator, he might have scared too many (white) people to get elected. But ironically, that fire-breathing was what he lacked, and needed, to build upon his personal victory. (And what made Keegan Michael-Kay's 'Obama's Anger Translator' the most perfect bit of satire of his presidency)
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:20 PM on July 21, 2017 [9 favorites]
I'm just woefully ignorant of the workings of journalism, clearly, but why does this stuff always come out eod Friday?
(Seriously, the best part of my week is always, always, a stress-inducing nightmare now.)
posted by greermahoney at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2017
(Seriously, the best part of my week is always, always, a stress-inducing nightmare now.)
posted by greermahoney at 8:24 PM on July 21, 2017
why does this stuff always come out eod Friday?
It really didn't used to.. Friday was "Take out the trash day".. News dump day. The day you release things you want people to forget about.
Now? Now it's stuff you want to control the news cycle for the entire weekend.
Up is down.
Black is white.
Freedom is slavery.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
It really didn't used to.. Friday was "Take out the trash day".. News dump day. The day you release things you want people to forget about.
Now? Now it's stuff you want to control the news cycle for the entire weekend.
Up is down.
Black is white.
Freedom is slavery.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 8:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [7 favorites]
Foundations of Geopolitics by Aleksandr Dugin
We're going right down the list, bullet point by bullet point
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
We're going right down the list, bullet point by bullet point
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:32 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
T International Realty LLC, TTT Consulting LLC and TTTT Venture LLC ... The lack of imagination and ability to look past themselves is staggering.
This is because they arrange their businesses as as collection of independent grifts. Donald has over 500 separate LLCs. Ivanka and Jared have dozens of LLCs. They have so many, they just run out of names.
This allows them to squeeze as many dollars as they can out of each grift and they don't care if the business fails, goes bankrupt, they get sued or their contractors go unpaid for services. They simply walk away and never look back, and legally can't be touched.
This is not the way "normal" billionaires arrange their business affairs. They may have some LLCs but not hundreds. This is the classic operating procedure for professional grifters.
posted by JackFlash at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2017 [54 favorites]
This is because they arrange their businesses as as collection of independent grifts. Donald has over 500 separate LLCs. Ivanka and Jared have dozens of LLCs. They have so many, they just run out of names.
This allows them to squeeze as many dollars as they can out of each grift and they don't care if the business fails, goes bankrupt, they get sued or their contractors go unpaid for services. They simply walk away and never look back, and legally can't be touched.
This is not the way "normal" billionaires arrange their business affairs. They may have some LLCs but not hundreds. This is the classic operating procedure for professional grifters.
posted by JackFlash at 8:35 PM on July 21, 2017 [54 favorites]
Have we nothing on Pence yet?
First, we're not going to know anything about what evidence Mueller has until he announces, at the end of the investigation.
Second, my Pence theory -- and I'm not a scholar -- is that the Pence-Flynn lie about Flynn's Turkey work was a harbinger, and put him (Pence) on the radar early on.
posted by rhizome at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
First, we're not going to know anything about what evidence Mueller has until he announces, at the end of the investigation.
Second, my Pence theory -- and I'm not a scholar -- is that the Pence-Flynn lie about Flynn's Turkey work was a harbinger, and put him (Pence) on the radar early on.
posted by rhizome at 8:38 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
I can't believe this but, I'm so lost as to what happened today and in what order, I think I need to go back to the top of the thread and start over. Damn work, getting in the way of my mefi-reading.
posted by greermahoney at 8:51 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by greermahoney at 8:51 PM on July 21, 2017 [1 favorite]
STATUS REPORT
METHOD OF GOVERNMENT: FEDERAL CONSTITUTIONAL DEMOCRACY
JUDICIAL BRANCH STATUS: UNKNOWN
LEGISLATIVE BRANCH STATUS: UNKNOWN
EXECUTIVE BRANCH STATUS: SOME DICKHOLE
THE FOURTH ESTATE FT SPECIAL COUNSEL MUELLER: ONLINE
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:55 PM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
METHOD OF GOVERNMENT: FEDERAL CONSTITUTIONAL DEMOCRACY
JUDICIAL BRANCH STATUS: UNKNOWN
LEGISLATIVE BRANCH STATUS: UNKNOWN
EXECUTIVE BRANCH STATUS: SOME DICKHOLE
THE FOURTH ESTATE FT SPECIAL COUNSEL MUELLER: ONLINE
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:55 PM on July 21, 2017 [19 favorites]
The people replying to @Scaramucci 's old tweets are doing the lord's work.
posted by chaoticgood at 8:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [34 favorites]
posted by chaoticgood at 8:59 PM on July 21, 2017 [34 favorites]
Biff Tannen has dumped the Nerd Henchman and hired the Jock Henchman
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:00 PM on July 21, 2017 [5 favorites]
whatthefuckjusthappenedtoday is a good way to get caught up, though if I had to to pick just one story from today that concerns me the most for the long-term, it's actually the one about Trump doing an end run around the State Department to kill the Iran nuclear deal. The whole point of the deal is that the State Department is supposed to be certifying Iran's compliance with the conditions. Ordering White House officials to come up with a reason Iran isn't complying feels an awful lot like ordering intelligence agencies to come up with reasons there are WMDs in Iraq.
posted by zachlipton at 9:05 PM on July 21, 2017 [67 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 9:05 PM on July 21, 2017 [67 favorites]
I've been stewing in my rage today trying to figure out what would piss off Trump voters the most in 2020. I think I have it.
Keith Ellison / Laverne Cox 2020.
Let's make it happen.
posted by Justinian at 9:11 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
Keith Ellison / Laverne Cox 2020.
Let's make it happen.
posted by Justinian at 9:11 PM on July 21, 2017 [11 favorites]
> I've been stewing in my rage today trying to figure out what would piss off Trump voters the most in 2020. I think I have it.
Keith Ellison / Laverne Cox 2020.
That's quite good, but to avoid confusion, I would list the President's name first.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:15 PM on July 21, 2017 [46 favorites]
Keith Ellison / Laverne Cox 2020.
That's quite good, but to avoid confusion, I would list the President's name first.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:15 PM on July 21, 2017 [46 favorites]
Something I don't understand. Sessions would totally fire Mueller, right? He's recused himself, sure, but when do consequences matter. What if he does it to get back in Trump's good graces. Session says whoops needed to be done. Trump says hey it was that guy, not me, let's move on. Republicans are vaguely concerned. We are outraged. Another week passes.
posted by hapaxes.legomenon at 9:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by hapaxes.legomenon at 9:16 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
the Trump of today is not the trump of fifteen years ago, in terms of his speech patterns.
Where the hell do people get this notion? I've been listening to the asshat bloviate for nearly 40 years, and he sounded the same then as he does now
I mean, as someone who was trained to spot this stuff professionally, if you can't see a difference I have to ask what you think speech patterns means. Because from what I can tell there's a marked difference in number of different words used, length and complexity of words used, ability to complete a sentence, grammatical structure, topic shifts...
But don't take my word for it. STAT therefore asked experts in neurolinguistics and cognitive assessment, as well as psychologists and psychiatrists, to compare Trump’s speech from decades ago to that in 2017; they all agreed there had been a deterioration, and some said it could reflect changes in the health of Trump’s brain.
posted by threeturtles at 9:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [61 favorites]
Where the hell do people get this notion? I've been listening to the asshat bloviate for nearly 40 years, and he sounded the same then as he does now
I mean, as someone who was trained to spot this stuff professionally, if you can't see a difference I have to ask what you think speech patterns means. Because from what I can tell there's a marked difference in number of different words used, length and complexity of words used, ability to complete a sentence, grammatical structure, topic shifts...
But don't take my word for it. STAT therefore asked experts in neurolinguistics and cognitive assessment, as well as psychologists and psychiatrists, to compare Trump’s speech from decades ago to that in 2017; they all agreed there had been a deterioration, and some said it could reflect changes in the health of Trump’s brain.
posted by threeturtles at 9:25 PM on July 21, 2017 [61 favorites]
Ugh. I hate to rain on the mockery parade, but please think about maybe not making fun of people's names? Not because these people aren't complete asshats who entirely deserve all the derision we can muster, but because it normalizes making fun of unusual or foreign-sounding names, which is unfair to all the lovely non-asshats not ruining our country who have unusual or foreign-sounding names. It's an othering technique I cringe to see us continue in our wonderful community. Pretty please?
posted by greermahoney at 10:01 PM on July 21, 2017 [39 favorites]
posted by greermahoney at 10:01 PM on July 21, 2017 [39 favorites]
Thank you, zachlipton. That story was the one I'd given the least time to, so thanks for pointing out its importance.
posted by greermahoney at 10:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by greermahoney at 10:03 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
today is so fucked up that both Talking Points Memo and whatthefuckjusthappenedtoday are completely full of the day's events and neither of them has yet said a peep about the Sessions bombshell
posted by murphy slaw at 10:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 10:27 PM on July 21, 2017 [3 favorites]
It's been pretty clear for some time that Trump really doesn't have an agenda and is just fulfilling wishes of his circle of deplorables. A lot of what he does is driven by Bannon, some by Putin or his minions, and some by his various evil cabinet. He just reacts to the last person he listens to.
posted by Mental Wimp at 10:36 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by Mental Wimp at 10:36 PM on July 21, 2017 [13 favorites]
Eww
why does it have to be the butthole
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 11:29 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
why does it have to be the butthole
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 11:29 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
With 2nd/3rd Generation Rich Guys like The Donald, it's ALWAYS the butthole.
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:33 PM on July 21, 2017 [2 favorites]
Heh, Adam Schiff is trying to overturn Citizen's United again. I like that guy. He's tenacious.
posted by xyzzy at 11:36 PM on July 21, 2017 [33 favorites]
posted by xyzzy at 11:36 PM on July 21, 2017 [33 favorites]
...some day all this is going to make for a hell of a chapter. Sitting in it is fucking crazy though.
More than anything I want one clear voice to guide us to the way out.
Sessions' meeting has made the German media now and denying Russian involvement seems more and more and more untenable - yet I'm sure they'll try... and throughout if just one voice could consistently find purchase and say, aloud, "this ain't right..." maybe we'd finally start swaying people back to the land of rational thinking
posted by From Bklyn at 12:17 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
More than anything I want one clear voice to guide us to the way out.
Sessions' meeting has made the German media now and denying Russian involvement seems more and more and more untenable - yet I'm sure they'll try... and throughout if just one voice could consistently find purchase and say, aloud, "this ain't right..." maybe we'd finally start swaying people back to the land of rational thinking
posted by From Bklyn at 12:17 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
Asked what he plans to do when he leaves the presidency, Vladimir Putin paused and smiled. “But I haven’t decided yet if I will leave the presidency,” the Russian leader replied.
posted by runcifex at 12:31 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by runcifex at 12:31 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
Which actor does Anthony Scaramucci resemble?
Now I've never seen the Mooch in full motion, but to me the answer is obvious.
posted by adamgreenfield at 2:34 AM on July 22, 2017
Now I've never seen the Mooch in full motion, but to me the answer is obvious.
posted by adamgreenfield at 2:34 AM on July 22, 2017
Elections have consequences: tens of thousands gathered for a candle-lit vigil against the Polish government's judiciary "reform" (read: undermining) bill, as the Senate passed its reading and sent the bill to the President for signing into law. According to a TV poll, 55% supports President Duda vetoing the bill, while 29% supports its enactment. The President is expected to toe the party line.
posted by runcifex at 2:42 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
"The United States, Poland's most important ally in NATO, issued a statement urging Poland to ensure any changes respect the constitution."
[dry_cough.gif]posted by runcifex at 2:42 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
God that Mark Twain "quote." It is so hilarible that if I hadn't seen the God of DudeBros proclaim his love for POTUS like 76 times on live TV that I would suspect him of having a somewhat admirable sense of irony.
posted by angrycat at 2:48 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 2:48 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
Actually maybe he loves the POTUS ironically too. Maybe it's levels of irony down to a black nihilistic core
posted by angrycat at 3:26 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 3:26 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Donny's awake and angry and explicitly accusing the Times of being a fifth column actively working to undermine our national security. This is fine. (And apparently confirming the Sessions story.)
@realDonaldTrump:
A new INTELLIGENCE LEAK from the Amazon Washington Post,this time against A.G. Jeff Sessions.These illegal leaks, like Comey's, must stop!
@realDonaldTrump:
The Failing New York Times foiled U.S. attempt to kill the single most wanted terrorist,Al-Baghdadi.Their sick agenda over National Security
posted by chris24 at 4:04 AM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
@realDonaldTrump:
A new INTELLIGENCE LEAK from the Amazon Washington Post,this time against A.G. Jeff Sessions.These illegal leaks, like Comey's, must stop!
@realDonaldTrump:
The Failing New York Times foiled U.S. attempt to kill the single most wanted terrorist,Al-Baghdadi.Their sick agenda over National Security
posted by chris24 at 4:04 AM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
It bugged me all night but finally came to me: Scaramucci is a dead ringer for Mario Cantone. Pick up the phone, SNL casting office!
posted by apparently at 4:08 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by apparently at 4:08 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
This from Fox News is apparently what Donny is referring to.
ISIS broken, but leader slipped away due to leak, says key general
posted by chris24 at 4:24 AM on July 22, 2017 [12 favorites]
ISIS broken, but leader slipped away due to leak, says key general
ISIS in Iraq and Syria has been “dismantled,” with tens of thousands of its jihadist fighters dead, but a promising lead on its leader “went dead” after a media leak, according to a key U.S. military official.So even assuming the general is correct, both Fox and Trump are framing it wrong (shocker). Baghdadi had already escaped and survived the raid. The reporting a week later supposedly dried up the source.
“We have absolutely dismantled his network,” Gen. Tony Thomas, speaking of Abu Bakr al Baghdadi, said at the Aspen Security Forum. “I mean everyone who worked for him initially is dead or gone. Everybody who stepped to the plate the next time [is] dead or gone. Down through a network where we have killed, in a conservative estimate, 60,000 to 70,000 of his followers, his army.”
In a wide-ranging interview moderated by Fox News' Catherine Herridge, Thomas, who leads the Special Operations Command, said his team was “particularly close” to Baghdadi after the 2015 raid that killed ISIS oil minister Abu Sayyaf. That raid also netted his wife, who provided a wealth of actionable information.
“That was a very good lead. Unfortunately, it was leaked in a prominent national newspaper about a week later and that lead went dead,” Thomas said. “The challenge we have [is] in terms of where and how our tactics and procedures are discussed openly. There's a great need to inform the American public about what we're up to. There's also great need to recognize things that will absolutely undercut our ability to do our job.”
Thomas appeared to be referring to a New York Times report in June 2015 that detailed how American intelligence agencies had “extracted valuable information.”
”New insights yielded by the seized trove – four to seven terabytes of data, according to one official – include how the organization’s shadowy leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, operates and tries to avoid being tracked by coalition forces," the Times reported.
posted by chris24 at 4:24 AM on July 22, 2017 [12 favorites]
Although some psychiatrists assert that he has narcissistic personality disorder, Trump shows no signs of the “distress” or “impairment” that such a diagnosis requires.I read a couple of the articles about Trump on the STAT website posted above and they always include this disclaimer (as well as one about diagnosing from afar). I don't understand what it means. He certainly shows signs of "impairment" to me. Not sure what they mean by no "distress" because we also have seen him plenty agitated. Can someone explain?
posted by TWinbrook8 at 4:39 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
And now he's broaching the topic of pardons. 6 months and 2 days in, the president himself is talking pardons. Over and under 'til the first and wagers on who it'll be?
@realDonaldTrump
While all agree the U. S. President has the complete power to pardon, why think of that when only crime so far is LEAKS against us.FAKE NEWS
---
And on that topic:
@nytopinion
Could Trump's potential pardon of his relatives and aides be a criminal abuse of power? http://nyti.ms/2uj3YbG
@tribelaw
Laurence Tribe Retweeted NYT Opinion
Like any other power, the power to pardon can be abused in order to bribe, obstruct justice, or commit other "high crimes and misdemeanors"
---
And of course a Saturday twitter rant wouldn't be complete without a But Her Emails.
@realDonaldTrump
So many people are asking why isn't the A.G. or Special Council looking at the many Hillary Clinton or Comey crimes. 33,000 e-mails deleted?
posted by chris24 at 4:44 AM on July 22, 2017 [16 favorites]
@realDonaldTrump
While all agree the U. S. President has the complete power to pardon, why think of that when only crime so far is LEAKS against us.FAKE NEWS
---
And on that topic:
@nytopinion
Could Trump's potential pardon of his relatives and aides be a criminal abuse of power? http://nyti.ms/2uj3YbG
@tribelaw
Laurence Tribe Retweeted NYT Opinion
Like any other power, the power to pardon can be abused in order to bribe, obstruct justice, or commit other "high crimes and misdemeanors"
---
And of course a Saturday twitter rant wouldn't be complete without a But Her Emails.
@realDonaldTrump
So many people are asking why isn't the A.G. or Special Council looking at the many Hillary Clinton or Comey crimes. 33,000 e-mails deleted?
posted by chris24 at 4:44 AM on July 22, 2017 [16 favorites]
Or complete without 'the real Russia colluder is Clinton.' His panic and desperation is a fantastic way to start a Saturday.
@realDonaldTrump
...What about all of the Clinton ties to Russia, including Podesta Company, Uranium deal, Russian Reset, big dollar speeches etc.
posted by chris24 at 4:52 AM on July 22, 2017 [12 favorites]
@realDonaldTrump
...What about all of the Clinton ties to Russia, including Podesta Company, Uranium deal, Russian Reset, big dollar speeches etc.
posted by chris24 at 4:52 AM on July 22, 2017 [12 favorites]
Did anyone watch Maddow last night? I think she's on to something with Trumo's brand new attorney!
This is the last call we’ll have’: Trump’s new lawyer sends cryptic message to Rachel Maddow
Mario Cantone
Ding! Ding! Ding! I think you nailed it, although adamgreenfield's answer is gold, Jerry! Gold!
posted by Room 641-A at 4:52 AM on July 22, 2017 [18 favorites]
This is the last call we’ll have’: Trump’s new lawyer sends cryptic message to Rachel Maddow
In tracking down aspects of the initial Bloomberg report about Mueller looking into the president’s finances, Maddow and her team ended up snagging a bizarre interaction with Dowd himself.[dramatic chipmunk.gif]
“‘Those transactions are in my view well beyond the mandate of the special counsel,” Dowd was quoted as saying in Bloomberg. “‘They’re unrelated to the election of 2016 or any alleged collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia and most importantly, they are well beyond any statute of limitations imposed by the U.S. Code.'”
Maddow was incredulous.
“Who said anything about statute of limitations? Why are you bringing that up? The statute of limitations for prosecuting what crimes exactly?” she mused.
To get to the bottom of it, her producer contacted Dowd — and got through to him.
“We have no evidence that any of these [Trump business] entities are under investigation,” Dowd told Maddow’s producer. “I’m beginning to think it’s not true. I’m beginning to wonder where the hell it came from.”
He then finished the call by telling the producer, “this is the last call we’ll ever have.”
Mario Cantone
Ding! Ding! Ding! I think you nailed it, although adamgreenfield's answer is gold, Jerry! Gold!
posted by Room 641-A at 4:52 AM on July 22, 2017 [18 favorites]
From Wikipedithingy:
posted by runcifex at 4:54 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
According to the DSM-5, "Many highly successful individuals display personality traits that might be considered narcissistic. Only when these traits are inflexible, maladaptive, and persisting and cause significant functional impairment or subjective distress do they constitute narcissistic personality disorder."Trump is enjoying it bigly instead of suffering from it, so there's no "distress". According to him, his distress is from failing fake media and the Democrats, not from himself. As for "functional impairment", there doesn't seem to be any, for he's doing a heckuva job of a president, and might be the greatest ever [real according to his men, but fake].
posted by runcifex at 4:54 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
“‘They’re unrelated to the election of 2016 or any alleged collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia and most importantly, they are well beyond any statute of limitations imposed by the U.S. Code.'”
Well that's quite the slip of the tounge. Oops. At least we have more confirmation that yes indeed there is something there. Unless this is just some standard boilerplate phrases that lawyers use pre-emptively regardless of what they know or don't know.
posted by Jalliah at 4:58 AM on July 22, 2017 [25 favorites]
Well that's quite the slip of the tounge. Oops. At least we have more confirmation that yes indeed there is something there. Unless this is just some standard boilerplate phrases that lawyers use pre-emptively regardless of what they know or don't know.
posted by Jalliah at 4:58 AM on July 22, 2017 [25 favorites]
They stopped all money laundering five years ago to the day, folks! Nothing to see here!
posted by lydhre at 5:06 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by lydhre at 5:06 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Thank you runcifex. I also belatedly consulted Dr Google and found these definitions The Narcissist vs Narcissistic Personality Disorder.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 5:07 AM on July 22, 2017
posted by TWinbrook8 at 5:07 AM on July 22, 2017
(thanks for highlighting that phrase, Jalliah. It's early here.)
posted by Room 641-A at 5:09 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Room 641-A at 5:09 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
@realDonaldTrump:
The Failing New York Times foiled U.S. attempt to kill the single most wanted terrorist,Al-Baghdadi.Their sick agenda over National Security
----
This from Fox News is apparently what Donny is referring to.
ISIS broken, but leader slipped away due to leak, says key general
Yes it is and he tweeted about it because Fox had this story on tv this morning, 25 min before he tweeted. The chyron read "NYT foils US attempt to take out Al-Baghdadi'
That's all he needed.
posted by Jalliah at 5:10 AM on July 22, 2017 [11 favorites]
The Failing New York Times foiled U.S. attempt to kill the single most wanted terrorist,Al-Baghdadi.Their sick agenda over National Security
----
This from Fox News is apparently what Donny is referring to.
ISIS broken, but leader slipped away due to leak, says key general
Yes it is and he tweeted about it because Fox had this story on tv this morning, 25 min before he tweeted. The chyron read "NYT foils US attempt to take out Al-Baghdadi'
That's all he needed.
posted by Jalliah at 5:10 AM on July 22, 2017 [11 favorites]
I'm sorry, I'm just not over the fact that their newest defense appears to be "the President doesn't CURRENTLY launder money for the Russians, geez".
posted by lydhre at 5:10 AM on July 22, 2017 [62 favorites]
posted by lydhre at 5:10 AM on July 22, 2017 [62 favorites]
I have no idea how accurate this quote from a well known quotation website I own is, but it seems appropriate here. If it's wrong, let's just say it's something the Navy Seals say.
posted by mmoncur at 5:19 AM on July 22, 2017 [30 favorites]
"Howard Hughes was able to afford the luxury of madness, like a man who not only thinks he is Napoleon but hires an army to prove it."Trump is able to afford the luxury of Narcissism. It doesn't cause him impairment or distress because the entire country is willing to pretend he's just as important as he thinks he is.
--Ted Morgan
posted by mmoncur at 5:19 AM on July 22, 2017 [30 favorites]
How beautiful would life be if Mueller proved that Bannon or Kushner or Trump himself leaked the intercepts about Jeff Sessions and Kislyak -- both validating the press and proving Trumpist hypocrisy, in the form of a felony indictment?
posted by msalt at 5:41 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by msalt at 5:41 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
Thank you runcifex. I also belatedly consulted Dr Google and found these definitions The Narcissist vs Narcissistic Personality Disorder.
Interesting.
I would like to add Narcissistic vs. Antisocial or Sociopathic Personality Disorders.
I am not sure if there is a clear distinction between Narcissism and Sociopathy, but one difference seems to be that deep down, a narcissist is really insecure and therefore needs the validation and admiration of others, whereas a sociopath truly believes to be superior to others. While I've heard the theory many Trump is very insecure deep down, I have yet to see any evidence that this is so, and I think his behavior is entirely consistent with someone who truly believes to be superior to others.
Then there's also this tidbit from the above link: However, narcissistic personalities are not impulsive, aggressive and deceitful as compared to those with antisocial personalities.
With regard to Trump, I think we have:
- impulsive (check)
- aggressive (check)
- deceitful (check)
(in addition to basically every other single item from the sociopathic disorder checklist.)
... which makes him more of a sociopath than a narcissist. Or possibly a narcissistic sociopath.
posted by sour cream at 5:45 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Interesting.
I would like to add Narcissistic vs. Antisocial or Sociopathic Personality Disorders.
I am not sure if there is a clear distinction between Narcissism and Sociopathy, but one difference seems to be that deep down, a narcissist is really insecure and therefore needs the validation and admiration of others, whereas a sociopath truly believes to be superior to others. While I've heard the theory many Trump is very insecure deep down, I have yet to see any evidence that this is so, and I think his behavior is entirely consistent with someone who truly believes to be superior to others.
Then there's also this tidbit from the above link: However, narcissistic personalities are not impulsive, aggressive and deceitful as compared to those with antisocial personalities.
With regard to Trump, I think we have:
- impulsive (check)
- aggressive (check)
- deceitful (check)
(in addition to basically every other single item from the sociopathic disorder checklist.)
... which makes him more of a sociopath than a narcissist. Or possibly a narcissistic sociopath.
posted by sour cream at 5:45 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Good chance this is the source of the SEALS eat an elephant quote. A minor bestseller of the GTD variety. Kind of a macho 7 Habits of Suck People without all the God stuff. I could see Scaramucci devouring this when it came out. He has that 'little guy picked last for dodgeball childhood' that grows into sharky adulthood.
posted by rc3spencer at 5:47 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by rc3spencer at 5:47 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
He has that 'little guy picked last for dodgeball childhood' that grows into sharky adulthood.
hey man some of us turned out able to resist trump's siren song ok
posted by vanar sena at 5:51 AM on July 22, 2017 [32 favorites]
hey man some of us turned out able to resist trump's siren song ok
posted by vanar sena at 5:51 AM on July 22, 2017 [32 favorites]
(in addition to basically every other single item from the sociopathic disorder checklist.)
Including the possible genetic predisposition. His grandfather and father were very similar.
posted by rc3spencer at 5:52 AM on July 22, 2017
Including the possible genetic predisposition. His grandfather and father were very similar.
posted by rc3spencer at 5:52 AM on July 22, 2017
He sure is leaning on the trigger on the old twitters this morning. A veritable greatest hits collection. Is it too rainy to play golf?
posted by Devonian at 5:57 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Devonian at 5:57 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
Per chris24, above, I thought there was an interesting tell in Trump's pardon tweet this morning:
While all agree the U. S. President has the complete power to pardon, why think of that when only crime so far [!] is LEAKS against us.FAKE NEWS
O.o
posted by Barack Spinoza at 6:02 AM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
While all agree the U. S. President has the complete power to pardon, why think of that when only crime so far [!] is LEAKS against us.FAKE NEWS
O.o
posted by Barack Spinoza at 6:02 AM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
@davidfrum: Things we learned from @realdonaldtrump twitter feed this AM
- US has tried & failed to kill ISIS al-Baghdadi. Trump’s need to find a scapegoat for the failure hints that in some way he was at fault
- President Trump is thinking hard about the pardon power and asking his lawyers about its scope -first reference to it in his timeline
- How Scaramucci excused his past attacks on Trump & support for D candidates: by successfully duping Trump that he supported him all along
- As Trump Russia deceptions unravel, his only plan for rallying Rs will be endless attacks on the receding memory of Hillary Clinton
- He’s done a fair job these past days of presenting a cool and calm public image. He could not sustain it. He’s cracking in public view.
@davidfrum: Things we learned from @realdonaldtrump twitter feed this AM
He still doesn't know the difference between Council and Counsel.
He still doesn't know the difference between Council and Counsel.
@realDonaldTrumpposted by chris24 at 6:09 AM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
So many people are asking why isn't the A.G. or Special Council looking at the many Hillary Clinton or Comey crimes. 33,000 e-mails deleted?
Scaramucci does sound like a fashion brand to me. Presumably specialising in pret-a-porter turncoats.
posted by Devonian at 6:10 AM on July 22, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by Devonian at 6:10 AM on July 22, 2017 [12 favorites]
So... he's going to use a politically motivated prosecution of Hillary Clinton as his insurance policy?
It's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it pays off for 'em.
posted by Talez at 6:13 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
It's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it pays off for 'em.
posted by Talez at 6:13 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
> He’s done a fair job these past days of presenting a cool and calm public image.
I suppose...by his standards...he "has."
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:16 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
I suppose...by his standards...he "has."
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:16 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
And an excellent reason for Hillz to continue to take a nice, long vacation and quietly collect some fat speaking fees. Not because I want her to stay away--I really grew to like and admire her--but because the longer it's been since she was anywhere in the news, the more ridiculous Trump and his minions look every time they bring her up.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:17 AM on July 22, 2017 [74 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:17 AM on July 22, 2017 [74 favorites]
So... he's going to use a politically motivated prosecution of Hillary Clinton as his insurance policy?
Yeah, and that's likely the source of his issues with Sessions.
@realDonaldTrump
So many people are asking why isn't the A.G. or Special Council looking at the many Hillary Clinton or Comey crimes. 33,000 e-mails deleted?
@HeerJeet Retweeted Donald J. Trump
So this is why Trump is mad at Sessions. He wants Sessions to arrest Clinton and Comey.
posted by chris24 at 6:17 AM on July 22, 2017 [25 favorites]
Yeah, and that's likely the source of his issues with Sessions.
@realDonaldTrump
So many people are asking why isn't the A.G. or Special Council looking at the many Hillary Clinton or Comey crimes. 33,000 e-mails deleted?
@HeerJeet Retweeted Donald J. Trump
So this is why Trump is mad at Sessions. He wants Sessions to arrest Clinton and Comey.
posted by chris24 at 6:17 AM on July 22, 2017 [25 favorites]
@realDonaldTrump
...What about all of the Clinton ties to Russia, including Podesta Company, Uranium deal, Russian Reset, big dollar speeches etc.
...SHE'S NOT THE PRESIDENT RIGHT NOW. CHRIST HELP US, YOU ARE, YOU GIBBERING SHITGIBBON OF A SPRAY-TAN DELIVERY SYSTEM, SO MAYBE FUCKING FOCUS ARRGGH ARRRGGHHH WHARRGARBLE....
Sorry. I couldn't hold that in any more or I was going to start bursting blood vessels in my eyes.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 6:21 AM on July 22, 2017 [41 favorites]
...What about all of the Clinton ties to Russia, including Podesta Company, Uranium deal, Russian Reset, big dollar speeches etc.
...SHE'S NOT THE PRESIDENT RIGHT NOW. CHRIST HELP US, YOU ARE, YOU GIBBERING SHITGIBBON OF A SPRAY-TAN DELIVERY SYSTEM, SO MAYBE FUCKING FOCUS ARRGGH ARRRGGHHH WHARRGARBLE....
Sorry. I couldn't hold that in any more or I was going to start bursting blood vessels in my eyes.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 6:21 AM on July 22, 2017 [41 favorites]
Sorry. I couldn't hold that in any more or I was going to start bursting blood vessels in my eyes.
Self care is very important in these trying times.
posted by chris24 at 6:23 AM on July 22, 2017 [28 favorites]
Self care is very important in these trying times.
posted by chris24 at 6:23 AM on July 22, 2017 [28 favorites]
I'm getting tired of all this winning.
Charles Bethea, The Newyorker; What the Layoffs Look Like at the Carrier Plant Trump Said He’d Save
Charles Bethea, The Newyorker; What the Layoffs Look Like at the Carrier Plant Trump Said He’d Save
Shortly after the election, Trump and Mike Pence, who was then the governor of Indiana, announced a headline-grabbing deal with Carrier that was said to keep about eight hundred jobs in the U.S. “So many people in that other—the big, beautiful plant behind us, which will be even more beautiful in about seven months from now, they’re so happy,” Trump said at a celebratory press conference.posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 6:25 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
In May of this year, Carrier announced its time line for eliminating what will ultimately be six hundred and thirty-two Indianapolis-based jobs. The first round of layoffs began on Thursday, with the departure of three hundred and thirty-eight employees. Watching with dismay was Brenda Darlene Battle, a fifty-five-year-old Indianapolis native who’d been working at Carrier for twenty-five years, most recently as a fabrication technician, or fab tech, before she decided to take a buyout this week*. She helped run the automatic press that makes steel doors, among other parts, for A90 furnaces. When the final furnace door was completed on the first day of mass layoffs, employees working the assembly line—some for the last time—autographed it.
While all agree the U. S. President has the complete power to pardon, why think of that when only crime so far is LEAKS against us.FAKE NEWS
This tweet is about as subtle as a 60 pound bag of drugs to the head.
posted by diogenes at 6:28 AM on July 22, 2017 [35 favorites]
This tweet is about as subtle as a 60 pound bag of drugs to the head.
posted by diogenes at 6:28 AM on July 22, 2017 [35 favorites]
He's totally going to try to pardon himself.
posted by chris24 at 6:29 AM on July 22, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by chris24 at 6:29 AM on July 22, 2017 [13 favorites]
Can he preemptively pardon himself? We may be about to find out!
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:31 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:31 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
He can't pardon himself. He has to let them invoke the 25th Amendment; then have Pence pardon him; and then he can resume the title [1] of President.
[1] I was going to say "duties" here, but he doesn't do any of those now.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 6:32 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
[1] I was going to say "duties" here, but he doesn't do any of those now.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 6:32 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
How beautiful would life be if Mueller proved that Bannon or Kushner or Trump himself leaked the intercepts about Jeff Sessions and Kislyak -- both validating the press and proving Trumpist hypocrisy, in the form of a felony indictment?
Reminder: the president can declassify anything. Now, if Bannon leaked it of his own accord and a prosecutor could prove beyond reasonable doubt that would be one thing … one pardonable thing. The obvious defenses are:
posted by fedward at 6:33 AM on July 22, 2017
Reminder: the president can declassify anything. Now, if Bannon leaked it of his own accord and a prosecutor could prove beyond reasonable doubt that would be one thing … one pardonable thing. The obvious defenses are:
- Trump did it and he can do whatever he wants;
- Bannon did it on an order from the president;
- Bannon did it but here's a pardon for it.
posted by fedward at 6:33 AM on July 22, 2017
I bet a lot of Trump's conversations with Sessions and Tillerson go kind of like this.
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:35 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:35 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
Citation: Presidential or Legislative Pardon of the President
Under the fundamental rule that no one may be a judge in his own case, the President cannot pardon himself.posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 6:35 AM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
If under the Twenty-Fifth Amendment the President declared that he was temporarily unable to perform the duties of the office, the Vice President would become Acting President and as such could pardon the President. Thereafter the President could either resign or resume the duties of his office.
Although as a general matter Congress cannot enact amnesty or pardoning legislation, because to do so would interfere with the pardoning power vested expressly in the President by the Constitution, it could be argued that a congressional pardon granted to the President would not interfere with the President’s pardoning power because that power does not extend to the President himself.
August 5, 1974
From Andy Wright, law professor and former White House & Congressional Committee lawyer working for Gore and Obama.
@AndyMcCanse
A few thoughts on Senate Judiciary's agreement to interview Paul Manafort & Don Trump Jr. next week instead of public hearing testimony 1/
- CNN reports on the deal here 2/ [Trump Jr. and Manafort reach deal with Senate panel to avoid public hearing]
- There is lots of appetite for Manafort & Trump Jr public testimony but private interviews are better from an investigative standpoint 3/
- It is unclear from reporting but these may be transcribed interviews. They were our bread & butter investigative tools in the House. 4/
- The Committee extracted interviews under subpoena threat; gets documents, interviews, avoids Fifth assertions & keeps subpoena leverage 5/
- Manafort & Don Jr nonpublic interviews are still regulated by false statements & congressional obstruction statutes, ie, a crime to lie 6/
- In my experience on the Hill, one thing Chuck Grassley will not tolerate is challenge to his oversight prerogatives. 7/
- Also, it is telling that Sen. Feinstein signed on to the agreement. Dems on staff see this agreement as a benefit rather than snow job. 8/
- Senate Judiciary can/will still have a public hearing later on, but it will be informed by the info due to Manafort/Trump Jr. agreement 9/
- This creates perjury trap exposure for Trump Jr. & Manafort vis-a-vis the Mueller, Senate & House Intel investigations & future hearings 10/
- A (transcribed) interview is a MUCH better format for obtaining information than a hearing. No Member grandstanding, no 5-min rounds 11/
- Comey & Yates hearings were bombshell but Congressional hearings tend to be better at presenting information than ferreting it out. 12/
- In all, Senate Judiciary has a good deal on PM & DJTJr: trade time for info & voluntariness w/o sacrificing legal power or next moves 13/
posted by chris24 at 6:38 AM on July 22, 2017 [48 favorites]
@AndyMcCanse
A few thoughts on Senate Judiciary's agreement to interview Paul Manafort & Don Trump Jr. next week instead of public hearing testimony 1/
- CNN reports on the deal here 2/ [Trump Jr. and Manafort reach deal with Senate panel to avoid public hearing]
- There is lots of appetite for Manafort & Trump Jr public testimony but private interviews are better from an investigative standpoint 3/
- It is unclear from reporting but these may be transcribed interviews. They were our bread & butter investigative tools in the House. 4/
- The Committee extracted interviews under subpoena threat; gets documents, interviews, avoids Fifth assertions & keeps subpoena leverage 5/
- Manafort & Don Jr nonpublic interviews are still regulated by false statements & congressional obstruction statutes, ie, a crime to lie 6/
- In my experience on the Hill, one thing Chuck Grassley will not tolerate is challenge to his oversight prerogatives. 7/
- Also, it is telling that Sen. Feinstein signed on to the agreement. Dems on staff see this agreement as a benefit rather than snow job. 8/
- Senate Judiciary can/will still have a public hearing later on, but it will be informed by the info due to Manafort/Trump Jr. agreement 9/
- This creates perjury trap exposure for Trump Jr. & Manafort vis-a-vis the Mueller, Senate & House Intel investigations & future hearings 10/
- A (transcribed) interview is a MUCH better format for obtaining information than a hearing. No Member grandstanding, no 5-min rounds 11/
- Comey & Yates hearings were bombshell but Congressional hearings tend to be better at presenting information than ferreting it out. 12/
- In all, Senate Judiciary has a good deal on PM & DJTJr: trade time for info & voluntariness w/o sacrificing legal power or next moves 13/
posted by chris24 at 6:38 AM on July 22, 2017 [48 favorites]
He can't pardon himself.
Well, a quick search of Google shows there's a fair amount of uncertainty/disagreement on this since CNN, WaPo, NYTimes, LATimes, VOX, Politico and PBS all have recent articles on it. But regardless of the final legality, do you think there's any chance he won't try it? I definitely agree it quite likely to be shot down eventually by the Supreme Court, but I also think it's an absolute certainly he tries it. When has he ever not pushed or destroyed norms to benefit himself?
posted by chris24 at 6:42 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
Well, a quick search of Google shows there's a fair amount of uncertainty/disagreement on this since CNN, WaPo, NYTimes, LATimes, VOX, Politico and PBS all have recent articles on it. But regardless of the final legality, do you think there's any chance he won't try it? I definitely agree it quite likely to be shot down eventually by the Supreme Court, but I also think it's an absolute certainly he tries it. When has he ever not pushed or destroyed norms to benefit himself?
posted by chris24 at 6:42 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
Whether or not he actually succeeds, the only thing that might possibly stop him from trying would be an operational sense of shame and the ability to feel embarrassment. Base your predictions on that.
posted by vanar sena at 6:54 AM on July 22, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by vanar sena at 6:54 AM on July 22, 2017 [10 favorites]
But regardless of the final legality, do you think there's any chance he won't try it?
No, but silver lining: then New York gets a swing at him.
I confess that I want to see this asshole in Sing Sing. Very, very badly.
posted by schadenfrau at 7:01 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
No, but silver lining: then New York gets a swing at him.
I confess that I want to see this asshole in Sing Sing. Very, very badly.
posted by schadenfrau at 7:01 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
For the VOX article I linked above - President Trump is considering pardoning himself. I asked 15 experts if that's legal:
posted by chris24 at 7:03 AM on July 22, 2017 [26 favorites]
A president cannot use the pardon power to immunize himself from impeachment or from prosecution by one or more of the 50 states. Were a president to pardon himself, this would surely trigger prosecution in the states (e.g., for fraud or tax evasion). It would, therefore, be a very foolish decision. The pardon would be admissible evidence of guilt.So even if he does successfully pardon himself, he's just admitted guilt that he can prosecuted elsewhere for.
posted by chris24 at 7:03 AM on July 22, 2017 [26 favorites]
Do you think there's any chance he won't try it?If his (their) goal is maximal "deconstruction of the administrative state", maximal chaos, causing maximal distrust in the social institutions, or in other words, tremendous trolling, then yes, why not. It may be pretty close to the most cost-effective blow to the system.
Shock and awe people, shock and awe.
posted by runcifex at 7:06 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
I would bet every penny I have that one way or another Trump will never go to jail.
posted by The Card Cheat at 7:26 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 7:26 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
Is Trump accusing Comey of crimes new or did I miss when that started?
posted by cmfletcher at 7:26 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by cmfletcher at 7:26 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
So even if he does successfully pardon himself, he's just admitted guilt that he can prosecuted elsewhere for.
I'm pretty sure New York is ready to go with the Trump Foundation fraud that's been on ice since Trump became shitheel in chief.
posted by Talez at 7:27 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'm pretty sure New York is ready to go with the Trump Foundation fraud that's been on ice since Trump became shitheel in chief.
posted by Talez at 7:27 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'm sorry, I'm just not over the fact that their newest defense appears to be "the President doesn't CURRENTLY launder money for the Russians, geez".
Isn't it amazing? And it somehow fits with this:
I went to see what was on Fox & Friends this morning, just to know what Trump is (notably) not tweeting out this morning1, and saw this from KellyAnn Conway (1:35)
The President said to the New York Times less than two days ago: We don't make money in Russia. We don't have hotels in Russia. He had the Miss Universe Pageant there 8 or 9 years ago.
She's right, that is what he said to the NYTimes. But the Miss Universe Pageant was in November 2013! That's 3.7 years ago, for the mathematicians.
Wait, I think I get it now, hear me out: Trump was laundering huge amounts of money for the Russian mob (we all know that), Kremlin gathers the evidence: that is the kompromat. Say perhaps their proof can get him into jail for several years if they hand it over to the US authorities. At that point, they aren't even imagining he can run for president, but he is a famous figure and he can help with their primary goal: delegitimizing US institutions. Hence the whole birther campaign. Personally, I've always found the birther-thing out of character for Trump, he is a racist and an idiot who has deliberately discriminated against black people, but his whole career is built on pretending to be friends with politicians and other famous people, and he is not a person who has run several year long political campaigns making a fool of himself. I think Russia promised him documentation apart from making him go out with his lies, whether they imagined they could forge a Kenyan birth certificate or they just lied to him about it. His promises of producing documentation back then are an eerie echo of what happened last year when he promised compromising stuff on Hillary.
For Trump and the Russians, the birther campaign did two things: one, it made him an even bigger fool in polite society than he already was. Two, it brought him a new audience. Some of them were probably already watching The Apprentice and applying at Trump University, but most of them came through Fox News who aided and abetted him. Was Ailes a Russian agent too? Maybe, or maybe he could just see how money could be made from Trump's lunatic appearances. While Ailes and Trump probably couldn't care less whether the US president was black, millions of Americans did care.
There's a detail that fits in here: if this is right, everything Trump did or said in public after The Apprentice was scripted, either by the show's producers or by his Russian handlers, whoever they were. This can explain why he seems to some people to have lost it recently. Before his public appearances were limited in time and space and cut together by TV-producers to make some sense, he could manage to stay on script for that. Remember, he wasn't a successful businessman, he played a successful businessman. But no-one can stick to script 24/7, and the presidency demands almost constant presence.
Back to the main: Trump's complete loss of status and authority with the elite after he started the birther thing was an advantage for the Russians. It isolated him and made him more dependent on them. That Obama Correspondent's Dinner speech was a complete humiliation, yes, specially because it was part of a greater humiliation (if I am right), that the Russians owned him and made him to do the whole birther thing. In a way, it forced him to double down on the whole thing.
How the jump from being a Russian opinion agent to running for president came about I can't guess right now. Several people have suggested earlier that it might be a "The Producers"-style grift that ran amok. It may also have been a gamble on his side to get out of it all this way, which would explain the see-saw movements we are seeing all the time. Whatever it was, the Russians played along. Their project couldn't be doing better, even if Hillary won. By successfully exploiting the decades-long Republican racist tax-magic death-spiral and reusing the grotesquely overboard smear-tactics from the birther campaign on Hillary, they disrupted the two-party system. Flynn and Sessions and the Mercers were key here. When Trump actually won, they had succeeded beyond anyone's wildest imagination: now the USA was the laughing stock of the world, the Trump administration was not functional pr. design, and there was nothing anyone could do about it.
From Trump's perspective (which was keep the initial crimes secret and get rid of the Russian puppeteers), this was also an extraordinary success: Obama held back his knowledge about the Russian connection after threats from the Republican leadership. Sessions closed down Bharara's investigation. The House investigation is a clown-show. Trump's own perception is that now he is president, he can't be touched, and as we all know, he is right, as long as Republicans hold Congress. The only problem was that now he needed to pretend being a politician instead of a businessman, and there was no script and no one to help. He was clueless, and he couldn't hire the best people like he'd promised, because the best people were smart enough to stay far away from that sinking ship. (Remember how he asked Kasich to be Vice President and offered him full control?)
This is where that emotional dependency the Russians gained when he was humiliated at the Correspondent's Dinner came in handy — for the Russians. They could offer comfort, knowledge and experience (and also a bit of disruption on the side, since they are not pro-Trump but pro-Russia). They help him focus on the vitals: appointment of conservative judges, strengthening disenfranchisement, weakening NATO and EU, ending trade agreements, including the Paris Agreement.
Now who is in on this and who isn't? That will be interesting to see in the next few years. I think even if the Russians appointed Tillerson, he is not complicit or a Russian handler. He's just an oil-guy they like because he isn't afraid to stretch the rules. Sessions, Flynn and the Mercers are clearly and openly bad guys, each with their separate agendas. The Trump family are greedy, stupid and devoid of any morals and willing to do anything, including collude with Russian agents, but maybe not exactly in on the background story. An exception from this is Melania, till now I've laughed at the idea that she could be his handler and honey-pot, but looking at the timeline it's not entirely impossible. For now, I'm going to stick with greedy and devoid of morals.
Bannon and Pence have their own projects, again separate. I think they have both seen the idiot administration as a platform for personal power and are disappointed with the level of crazy. Pence even mentioned at some point that he saw himself as a Cheney-figure. Good luck with that.
Manafort is obviously a messenger/go-between, and it's really weird how shameless the whole set-up is, they must disregard US law enforcement completely. That said, there may well be someone behind the lines we have no clue about.
I'd better stop — conspiracy theories are never good for one's health. But it does fit nicely, doesn't it?
posted by mumimor at 7:27 AM on July 22, 2017 [128 favorites]
Isn't it amazing? And it somehow fits with this:
I went to see what was on Fox & Friends this morning, just to know what Trump is (notably) not tweeting out this morning1, and saw this from KellyAnn Conway (1:35)
The President said to the New York Times less than two days ago: We don't make money in Russia. We don't have hotels in Russia. He had the Miss Universe Pageant there 8 or 9 years ago.
She's right, that is what he said to the NYTimes. But the Miss Universe Pageant was in November 2013! That's 3.7 years ago, for the mathematicians.
Wait, I think I get it now, hear me out: Trump was laundering huge amounts of money for the Russian mob (we all know that), Kremlin gathers the evidence: that is the kompromat. Say perhaps their proof can get him into jail for several years if they hand it over to the US authorities. At that point, they aren't even imagining he can run for president, but he is a famous figure and he can help with their primary goal: delegitimizing US institutions. Hence the whole birther campaign. Personally, I've always found the birther-thing out of character for Trump, he is a racist and an idiot who has deliberately discriminated against black people, but his whole career is built on pretending to be friends with politicians and other famous people, and he is not a person who has run several year long political campaigns making a fool of himself. I think Russia promised him documentation apart from making him go out with his lies, whether they imagined they could forge a Kenyan birth certificate or they just lied to him about it. His promises of producing documentation back then are an eerie echo of what happened last year when he promised compromising stuff on Hillary.
For Trump and the Russians, the birther campaign did two things: one, it made him an even bigger fool in polite society than he already was. Two, it brought him a new audience. Some of them were probably already watching The Apprentice and applying at Trump University, but most of them came through Fox News who aided and abetted him. Was Ailes a Russian agent too? Maybe, or maybe he could just see how money could be made from Trump's lunatic appearances. While Ailes and Trump probably couldn't care less whether the US president was black, millions of Americans did care.
There's a detail that fits in here: if this is right, everything Trump did or said in public after The Apprentice was scripted, either by the show's producers or by his Russian handlers, whoever they were. This can explain why he seems to some people to have lost it recently. Before his public appearances were limited in time and space and cut together by TV-producers to make some sense, he could manage to stay on script for that. Remember, he wasn't a successful businessman, he played a successful businessman. But no-one can stick to script 24/7, and the presidency demands almost constant presence.
Back to the main: Trump's complete loss of status and authority with the elite after he started the birther thing was an advantage for the Russians. It isolated him and made him more dependent on them. That Obama Correspondent's Dinner speech was a complete humiliation, yes, specially because it was part of a greater humiliation (if I am right), that the Russians owned him and made him to do the whole birther thing. In a way, it forced him to double down on the whole thing.
How the jump from being a Russian opinion agent to running for president came about I can't guess right now. Several people have suggested earlier that it might be a "The Producers"-style grift that ran amok. It may also have been a gamble on his side to get out of it all this way, which would explain the see-saw movements we are seeing all the time. Whatever it was, the Russians played along. Their project couldn't be doing better, even if Hillary won. By successfully exploiting the decades-long Republican racist tax-magic death-spiral and reusing the grotesquely overboard smear-tactics from the birther campaign on Hillary, they disrupted the two-party system. Flynn and Sessions and the Mercers were key here. When Trump actually won, they had succeeded beyond anyone's wildest imagination: now the USA was the laughing stock of the world, the Trump administration was not functional pr. design, and there was nothing anyone could do about it.
From Trump's perspective (which was keep the initial crimes secret and get rid of the Russian puppeteers), this was also an extraordinary success: Obama held back his knowledge about the Russian connection after threats from the Republican leadership. Sessions closed down Bharara's investigation. The House investigation is a clown-show. Trump's own perception is that now he is president, he can't be touched, and as we all know, he is right, as long as Republicans hold Congress. The only problem was that now he needed to pretend being a politician instead of a businessman, and there was no script and no one to help. He was clueless, and he couldn't hire the best people like he'd promised, because the best people were smart enough to stay far away from that sinking ship. (Remember how he asked Kasich to be Vice President and offered him full control?)
This is where that emotional dependency the Russians gained when he was humiliated at the Correspondent's Dinner came in handy — for the Russians. They could offer comfort, knowledge and experience (and also a bit of disruption on the side, since they are not pro-Trump but pro-Russia). They help him focus on the vitals: appointment of conservative judges, strengthening disenfranchisement, weakening NATO and EU, ending trade agreements, including the Paris Agreement.
Now who is in on this and who isn't? That will be interesting to see in the next few years. I think even if the Russians appointed Tillerson, he is not complicit or a Russian handler. He's just an oil-guy they like because he isn't afraid to stretch the rules. Sessions, Flynn and the Mercers are clearly and openly bad guys, each with their separate agendas. The Trump family are greedy, stupid and devoid of any morals and willing to do anything, including collude with Russian agents, but maybe not exactly in on the background story. An exception from this is Melania, till now I've laughed at the idea that she could be his handler and honey-pot, but looking at the timeline it's not entirely impossible. For now, I'm going to stick with greedy and devoid of morals.
Bannon and Pence have their own projects, again separate. I think they have both seen the idiot administration as a platform for personal power and are disappointed with the level of crazy. Pence even mentioned at some point that he saw himself as a Cheney-figure. Good luck with that.
Manafort is obviously a messenger/go-between, and it's really weird how shameless the whole set-up is, they must disregard US law enforcement completely. That said, there may well be someone behind the lines we have no clue about.
I'd better stop — conspiracy theories are never good for one's health. But it does fit nicely, doesn't it?
posted by mumimor at 7:27 AM on July 22, 2017 [128 favorites]
Shock and awe people, shock and awe.
Republicans really fucking hate America.
posted by Artw at 7:27 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
Republicans really fucking hate America.
posted by Artw at 7:27 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
/em nominates mumimor for a Pulitzer for that right there. It all fits .
posted by tilde at 7:36 AM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by tilde at 7:36 AM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
blushes
posted by mumimor at 7:48 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by mumimor at 7:48 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
they all agreed there had been a deterioration, and some said it could reflect changes in the health of Trump’s brain.
I Googled a little and read that article before I posted, and I think the conclusions of the researchers supports my point: that it's just as likely that social factors are the only things that have changed. Trump used to feel he needed the imprimatur of people in power to succeed. Television taught him he did not need to be accepted by the smartest and most powerful people in the nation - he could simply appeal right to the masses, and to do that, it was better for him to speak simply and not try so hard to use multi-syllable words. But as I said, I grew up in the New York area and have been listening to him forever, and the broken, uncompleted sentences, the repetition of key words and phrases, and the circular reasoning have all always been there.
posted by Miko at 7:48 AM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
I Googled a little and read that article before I posted, and I think the conclusions of the researchers supports my point: that it's just as likely that social factors are the only things that have changed. Trump used to feel he needed the imprimatur of people in power to succeed. Television taught him he did not need to be accepted by the smartest and most powerful people in the nation - he could simply appeal right to the masses, and to do that, it was better for him to speak simply and not try so hard to use multi-syllable words. But as I said, I grew up in the New York area and have been listening to him forever, and the broken, uncompleted sentences, the repetition of key words and phrases, and the circular reasoning have all always been there.
posted by Miko at 7:48 AM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
In related news, Nigel Farage - a "bollock faced foghorn of ignorance". according to Philip Pullman - has been ordered to pay back £80k in expenses by the European parliament. Farage doesn't deny that he broke the rules, but sputters that in applying them the EU is being 'Stalinist'.
I guess we should add that word to the Presidential Responses To Being Found Out bingo card.
posted by Devonian at 7:50 AM on July 22, 2017 [18 favorites]
I guess we should add that word to the Presidential Responses To Being Found Out bingo card.
posted by Devonian at 7:50 AM on July 22, 2017 [18 favorites]
David Weigel, WaPo: Conservative state legislators plot ways to get Washington under control
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:50 AM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
Washington’s slide into quicksand has given Republican state legislators and governors new enthusiasm to restrict the federal government. Among the hundreds of legislators at the conference, there was a surge of interest in constitutional amendments, which could pass by getting two-thirds of states to call conventions under Article V of the Constitution. Republicans control 33 state legislatures; having 34 could light the match, reshaping federal power to make laws like the Affordable Care Act impossible.The members of fucking ALEC will be first against the wall.
“Do you trust Congress to reform itself, or do you trust the state legislatures to come in and do the right thing?” asked Rep. Ken Buck (R-Colo.) at another session. “Did the Founding Fathers foresee exactly what would happen in this situation, with Congress acting in its own self-interest and the president gladly accepting more and more power? Did they foresee this and say, this is why we are authorizing an Article V convention of the states? Absolutely!”
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:50 AM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
Charlie Savage, NYT: Can the President Be Indicted? A Long-Hidden Legal Memo Says Yes
A newfound memo from Kenneth W. Starr’s independent counsel investigation into President Bill Clinton sheds fresh light on a constitutional puzzle that is taking on mounting significance amid the Trump-Russia inquiry: Can a sitting president be indicted?posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:58 AM on July 22, 2017 [61 favorites]
The 56-page memo, locked in the National Archives for nearly two decades and obtained by The New York Times under the Freedom of Information Act, amounts to the most thorough government-commissioned analysis rejecting a generally held view that presidents are immune from prosecution while in office.
“It is proper, constitutional, and legal for a federal grand jury to indict a sitting president for serious criminal acts that are not part of, and are contrary to, the president’s official duties,” the Starr office memo concludes. “In this country, no one, even President Clinton, is above the law.”
... which makes him more of a sociopath than a narcissist. Or possibly a narcissistic sociopath.
He's the biggest kind of narcissist, the diagnosis that fits all those factors is "malignant narcissism," the most pathological and intractable form of the disorder.
posted by saulgoodman at 8:03 AM on July 22, 2017 [10 favorites]
He's the biggest kind of narcissist, the diagnosis that fits all those factors is "malignant narcissism," the most pathological and intractable form of the disorder.
posted by saulgoodman at 8:03 AM on July 22, 2017 [10 favorites]
A newfound memo from Kenneth W. Starr’s independent counsel investigation into President Bill Clinton
Ah see but that's different because reasons.
posted by Artw at 8:04 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
Ah see but that's different because reasons.
posted by Artw at 8:04 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
...SHE'S NOT THE PRESIDENT RIGHT NOW.
The WaPo pointed out that Trump has talked about Hillary Clinton in all 19 of his interviews since becoming president, the most recent NYTimes interview, "Hillary" was the 20th word that came out of his mouth, Trump can usually make it about a third of the way through an interview without mentioning Hillary Clinton:
The WaPo pointed out that Trump has talked about Hillary Clinton in all 19 of his interviews since becoming president, the most recent NYTimes interview, "Hillary" was the 20th word that came out of his mouth, Trump can usually make it about a third of the way through an interview without mentioning Hillary Clinton:
Clinton is Trump’s eternal foil, the person who, Trump seems to think, can always be identified as the unpopular yang to his yin, the looming reminder to his supporters of What Could Have Been. Whatever Trump does or doesn’t do, he’s always willing to point out what Clinton did or didn’t do that’s worse.The Atlantic has an article with the insight that Trump engages with every topic as a shallow comparison with somebody else. It's a clever bit of analysis that shows the Trump's policy boils down to "Trump is the best" and his defense any any critique is "Hillary is much worse":
So she comes up in his interviews a lot. In fact, in 19 interviews that he’s conducted since becoming president, we found that Clinton tended to be mentioned much earlier than a number of Trump’s other favorite topics: The 2016 election, the votes he received, the electoral college and Barack Obama.
Why the endless comparisons? First, they allow Trump to continually shift the definition of success. Did his effort at health-care reform fail? Not if the metric is speed; Clinton and Obama took longer. Did his top campaign officials do something wrong in welcoming Russian government dirt on Hillary Clinton? Not compared to Clinton, who deleted 33,000 emails and gave Russia America’s uranium.posted by peeedro at 8:07 AM on July 22, 2017 [52 favorites]
Second, by endlessly comparing himself to other people, Trump turns the conversation away from policy. What matters about health-care reform isn’t its impact on ordinary Americans. It’s what it says about which president is more successful. From the Russia scandal to the Syrian military strike to holding hands with Emmanuel Macron, Trump turns almost everything into a parable about who is superior to who.
Remember Trump’s technique during the primaries. He was more honest than Ted Cruz (“lying Ted”), more vigorous than Jeb Bush (“low energy”) and taller—yes, taller—than Marco Rubio (“little Marco”). The significance of the comparison is always secondary. What matters is that Trump comes out on top.
“Do you trust Congress to reform itself, or do you trust the state legislatures to come in and do the right thing?”
I have to pick one? Even stipulating arguendo the premise that the Constitution needs to be changed - this current troupe of clowns has a whisper of a chance to not fuck it up 1000x worse trying to get every petty dig at the other party enshrined in the Motherfucking Constitution? Yeah, no.
posted by ctmf at 8:08 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
I have to pick one? Even stipulating arguendo the premise that the Constitution needs to be changed - this current troupe of clowns has a whisper of a chance to not fuck it up 1000x worse trying to get every petty dig at the other party enshrined in the Motherfucking Constitution? Yeah, no.
posted by ctmf at 8:08 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
On the other hand, I give it just as much credence that somewhere in Moscow there is a huge whiteboard linking all the pieces of this conspiracy: Unrest across Europe. Chaos in the UK. Absorption of former USSR nation-states. Destabilization of American influence around the globe.
Putin looks at his handwriting, the flowchart detailing Russian ascendancy, and grins when he looks at the big circle at the top that all other arrows lead to:
THIS YEAR WE WIN EUROVISION.
posted by delfin at 8:09 AM on July 22, 2017 [58 favorites]
Putin looks at his handwriting, the flowchart detailing Russian ascendancy, and grins when he looks at the big circle at the top that all other arrows lead to:
THIS YEAR WE WIN EUROVISION.
posted by delfin at 8:09 AM on July 22, 2017 [58 favorites]
Johnny Wallflower, you cut that excerpt off before my favorite paragraph:
posted by fedward at 8:13 AM on July 22, 2017 [33 favorites]
Mr. Starr assigned Ronald Rotunda, a prominent conservative professor of constitutional law and ethics whom Mr. Starr hired as a consultant on his legal team, to write the memo in spring 1998 after deputies advised him that they had gathered enough evidence to ask a grand jury to indict Mr. Clinton, the memo shows.Ronald Rotunda. Ronald Rotunda. Ronald Rotunda. My God, we really are living in a Carl Hiassen novel.
posted by fedward at 8:13 AM on July 22, 2017 [33 favorites]
I'm probably leaving out an option or two, but anyway: a prosecutor probably isn't going to waste time on that charge unless there's literally nothing else they can make stick. (Scooter Libby would like a word).
Only if convictions are Mueller's only goal - and probably not even then.
Revealing that Trump or a top aide is behind these leaks will I believe seriously crack Trump's Republican support, which is the only way to make impeachment possible. An indictment is the only non-leak way to reveal that.
Breaking Republican ranks would also drastically reduce the odds of jury nullification by true believers, which has to be a serious concern for any prosecution.
Mueller may very reasonably decide that getting convictions - and preventing pardons from erasing them - requires he make sure any impeachment happens as quickly as possible.
posted by msalt at 8:17 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
Only if convictions are Mueller's only goal - and probably not even then.
Revealing that Trump or a top aide is behind these leaks will I believe seriously crack Trump's Republican support, which is the only way to make impeachment possible. An indictment is the only non-leak way to reveal that.
Breaking Republican ranks would also drastically reduce the odds of jury nullification by true believers, which has to be a serious concern for any prosecution.
Mueller may very reasonably decide that getting convictions - and preventing pardons from erasing them - requires he make sure any impeachment happens as quickly as possible.
posted by msalt at 8:17 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
Also I find it amusing that throughout the Obama years, the Constitution was the single most unerring document in the history of parchment, inspired by God and handed down by seraphim, permanent and infallible, sculpted by the Founding Fathers to create an eternal and unyielding vision for America's future, the rock on which America fended off Kenyan usurpers and radical Islamic terrorists and melanin smugglers because NOT ONE COMMA OF THIS DIVINELY INSPIRED FOUNDERS' INTENT MAY EVER CHANGE.
Oh we have a bunch of state legislatures now and could potentially control a convention? FUCK IT, THE YEAR IS ONE, ALL MEN AND 75% OF WOMEN ARE NOW NAMED 'REAGAN', JESUS IS PRESIDENT AND TAXES ONLY APPLY TO NON-REPUBLICANS.
posted by delfin at 8:20 AM on July 22, 2017 [40 favorites]
Oh we have a bunch of state legislatures now and could potentially control a convention? FUCK IT, THE YEAR IS ONE, ALL MEN AND 75% OF WOMEN ARE NOW NAMED 'REAGAN', JESUS IS PRESIDENT AND TAXES ONLY APPLY TO NON-REPUBLICANS.
posted by delfin at 8:20 AM on July 22, 2017 [40 favorites]
Possibly knowing this will help your Year Zero terror: amendments passed by an Article 5 convention (one called by two-thirds of the States) must still be ratified by three-fourths of the States, in order to make the cut....it's not like such a convention can just throw out the existing Constitution and start over......can you imagine the new, ALEC-written Preamble?
But still. Maybe something like a balanced budget amendment could get passed out of this process, or Congressional term limits. I don't know if 3/4 of the States would actually ratify an anti-abortion amendment, or an amendment affirming that We Are A Christian Nation, or whatever else is on the wish list, and honestly, I'd rather not find out, but I don't think so.
posted by thelonius at 8:36 AM on July 22, 2017 [10 favorites]
But still. Maybe something like a balanced budget amendment could get passed out of this process, or Congressional term limits. I don't know if 3/4 of the States would actually ratify an anti-abortion amendment, or an amendment affirming that We Are A Christian Nation, or whatever else is on the wish list, and honestly, I'd rather not find out, but I don't think so.
posted by thelonius at 8:36 AM on July 22, 2017 [10 favorites]
I feel that Trump's dallying with this "self-pardon" is very typical of an abusive boss. The boss breaks and bends the subordinates by acting in an absurd manner and showing off the fact that he can get away with it.
posted by runcifex at 8:41 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by runcifex at 8:41 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
Also, just because 2/3 of states agree to have a convention, doesn't mean that even 1/2 of them could ever agree on a specific agenda. Just look at the Obamacare Repeal fiasco, and remember that state legislatures are even bigger clown shows than Congress.
posted by Glibpaxman at 8:45 AM on July 22, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by Glibpaxman at 8:45 AM on July 22, 2017 [17 favorites]
My God, we really are living in a Carl Hiassen novel
If so, I can't wait for the second half, when the morality play kicks in.
posted by schadenfrau at 8:47 AM on July 22, 2017 [25 favorites]
If so, I can't wait for the second half, when the morality play kicks in.
posted by schadenfrau at 8:47 AM on July 22, 2017 [25 favorites]
Latest from Josh Marshall at TPM:
The Crisis Is Upon Us:
"I want to clarify and expand on something I noted yesterday. The President stands accused, now with a mounting of evidence, of conspiring with a hostile foreign power to win the Presidency. He has now made clear that he will not permit any investigation of those accusations."
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:58 AM on July 22, 2017 [57 favorites]
The Crisis Is Upon Us:
"I want to clarify and expand on something I noted yesterday. The President stands accused, now with a mounting of evidence, of conspiring with a hostile foreign power to win the Presidency. He has now made clear that he will not permit any investigation of those accusations."
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:58 AM on July 22, 2017 [57 favorites]
I can't wait until the Russia sanctions land on Trump's desk! He'll be in a no-win situation. He can veto the sanctions and further cement his position as Putin's bootlicker... and have his veto overridden... or he can sign them and piss off his Russian handlers to the point that maybe they drop the dime on him.
posted by Justinian at 9:04 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 9:04 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
Oh, terror fantasy time.
In the Former Republic Formerly Known as the Former USA, now you have this loose but extremely resourceful class, with Trump as its public figurehead, brandishing the regalia sword, speaking incoherent threats, abuses and tall tales just to intimidate with impunity. His role is that of a fool king, with a militant minority of cult following ready to hold the weaklings of this class hostage. The king can be worked quite well though, if you know how, where, and when to turn the knobs.
In the dark temples there are the priest class, e.g. Bannon and Miller &co, whose credential is the ability to go really really deep into the subconscious pain and suffering of the country and come up with some dark stuff, and fix it in ideological oracle before it evaporates. Trump doesn't necessarily have to turn to Russia for comfort. With his (self-brainwashed?) addiction to brain-damaging right-wing extremist propaganda, I think Bannon will do. Feed the king or oligarchy dies.
Of course, there is indeed a loose international coalition of authoritarians dominating the orthodoxy for decades, despite their petty and selfish differences including nationalities. This Russian thing has a pre-Westphalian touch to it, when ideologies and class were not so differentiated across the boarders. When the Former Republic creates this Trump fool with all the propaganda, unfettered power-seeking, ruthless corruption and greed, it's only a matter of time before all parties of this ruling coalition smell the ordure and get attracted to it. First we take Washington DC, and then we split up the swag among ourselves. When this ruling coalition of the Former Republic create incredibly ruthless (and euphoria-inducing) weapons such as "shock therapy", it's only a matter of time before they play with themselves using it.
Then there are the old inconveniences of this Senatus stuff, this Curia thing. They're not in good control yet but pretty good enough to use, as long as they remain useful now and then. Just as the fool king holds them hostage, the reverse is true too, for the king still needs a nominal majority to protect him (and themselves) from the inconveniences.
Dangerously, the rulers now appear to understand their technocratic potential. Computer-aided mass control. There are best brains to hire, for those brains tend to believe that as long as it's the best tech, it's going to be an intrinsic good. Just let one hundred flowers blossom, and people will make the best choices for themselves! Careful what you wish for... you may get it.
But in the dark world there are yet cracks to attack. The coalition can be weakened, perhaps by exploiting the unstable equilibrium among them. The technocrats can be persuaded. There's also the resistance, holding doggedly onto a truth. All dark times like this eventually passed. But how do we comfort each other so that we stand a better chance to endure this?
posted by runcifex at 9:17 AM on July 22, 2017
In the Former Republic Formerly Known as the Former USA, now you have this loose but extremely resourceful class, with Trump as its public figurehead, brandishing the regalia sword, speaking incoherent threats, abuses and tall tales just to intimidate with impunity. His role is that of a fool king, with a militant minority of cult following ready to hold the weaklings of this class hostage. The king can be worked quite well though, if you know how, where, and when to turn the knobs.
In the dark temples there are the priest class, e.g. Bannon and Miller &co, whose credential is the ability to go really really deep into the subconscious pain and suffering of the country and come up with some dark stuff, and fix it in ideological oracle before it evaporates. Trump doesn't necessarily have to turn to Russia for comfort. With his (self-brainwashed?) addiction to brain-damaging right-wing extremist propaganda, I think Bannon will do. Feed the king or oligarchy dies.
Of course, there is indeed a loose international coalition of authoritarians dominating the orthodoxy for decades, despite their petty and selfish differences including nationalities. This Russian thing has a pre-Westphalian touch to it, when ideologies and class were not so differentiated across the boarders. When the Former Republic creates this Trump fool with all the propaganda, unfettered power-seeking, ruthless corruption and greed, it's only a matter of time before all parties of this ruling coalition smell the ordure and get attracted to it. First we take Washington DC, and then we split up the swag among ourselves. When this ruling coalition of the Former Republic create incredibly ruthless (and euphoria-inducing) weapons such as "shock therapy", it's only a matter of time before they play with themselves using it.
Then there are the old inconveniences of this Senatus stuff, this Curia thing. They're not in good control yet but pretty good enough to use, as long as they remain useful now and then. Just as the fool king holds them hostage, the reverse is true too, for the king still needs a nominal majority to protect him (and themselves) from the inconveniences.
Dangerously, the rulers now appear to understand their technocratic potential. Computer-aided mass control. There are best brains to hire, for those brains tend to believe that as long as it's the best tech, it's going to be an intrinsic good. Just let one hundred flowers blossom, and people will make the best choices for themselves! Careful what you wish for... you may get it.
But in the dark world there are yet cracks to attack. The coalition can be weakened, perhaps by exploiting the unstable equilibrium among them. The technocrats can be persuaded. There's also the resistance, holding doggedly onto a truth. All dark times like this eventually passed. But how do we comfort each other so that we stand a better chance to endure this?
posted by runcifex at 9:17 AM on July 22, 2017
This Russian thing has a pre-Westphalian touch to it
I think it's like pre-Westphalian because it's post-Westphalian.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 9:26 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
I think it's like pre-Westphalian because it's post-Westphalian.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 9:26 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
The Crisis Is Upon Us
I know many of us read Josh Marshall regularly, but for those who don't, he isn't particularly prone to hyperbole or premature freaking out. If anything, he's overly cautious in declaring conclusions. If he says the crisis is upon us, it probably is.
posted by diogenes at 9:39 AM on July 22, 2017 [36 favorites]
I know many of us read Josh Marshall regularly, but for those who don't, he isn't particularly prone to hyperbole or premature freaking out. If anything, he's overly cautious in declaring conclusions. If he says the crisis is upon us, it probably is.
posted by diogenes at 9:39 AM on July 22, 2017 [36 favorites]
My God, we really are living in a Carl Hiassen novel
If so, I can't wait for the second half, when the morality play kicks in.
Yes! If the dozen or so Hiassen novels I've read are any indication, this will involve Donald Trump, Steve Bannon, Don Jr., Gorka, Mulvaney, Sessions, etc. all receiving severe physical trauma to their genitals and/or buttocks by baseball bat, piranha, vacuum cleaner, cement truck, curling iron, alligator, housecat, harpoon, and a variety of other animals, blunt and sharp instruments, and vehicles. And then some of them will drown in the Everglades.
posted by Cookiebastard at 9:40 AM on July 22, 2017 [29 favorites]
If so, I can't wait for the second half, when the morality play kicks in.
Yes! If the dozen or so Hiassen novels I've read are any indication, this will involve Donald Trump, Steve Bannon, Don Jr., Gorka, Mulvaney, Sessions, etc. all receiving severe physical trauma to their genitals and/or buttocks by baseball bat, piranha, vacuum cleaner, cement truck, curling iron, alligator, housecat, harpoon, and a variety of other animals, blunt and sharp instruments, and vehicles. And then some of them will drown in the Everglades.
posted by Cookiebastard at 9:40 AM on July 22, 2017 [29 favorites]
If he says the crisis is upon us, it probably is
Yeah this is by far the scariest thing I've ever read.
and a variety of other animals, blunt and sharp instruments
Personally I hope for the return of the guy with a skin condition and a weed whacker for an arm.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:43 AM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
Yeah this is by far the scariest thing I've ever read.
and a variety of other animals, blunt and sharp instruments
Personally I hope for the return of the guy with a skin condition and a weed whacker for an arm.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:43 AM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
I also want to point out that the fate of Zombie Trumpcare and the fate of the republic seem inextricably intertwined. If the Republicans think they can enact their agenda without personal consequences, they will permit the republic to fall into authoritarianism. They have been consistent at one thing only: putting party and personal fortune ahead of country. They are incapable of engaging with reality and they are utterly bereft of moral courage. The only way they can be induced to protect the republic is if they think it will also benefit them.
Because of this endemic delusion and moral cowardice on the right, every step forward for Trumpcare is a step towards authoritarianism.
We have to keep killing it until it stays dead.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:51 AM on July 22, 2017 [29 favorites]
Because of this endemic delusion and moral cowardice on the right, every step forward for Trumpcare is a step towards authoritarianism.
We have to keep killing it until it stays dead.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:51 AM on July 22, 2017 [29 favorites]
Personally I hope for the return of the guy with a skin condition and a weed whacker for an arm.
Bannon?
posted by Cookiebastard at 9:51 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Bannon?
posted by Cookiebastard at 9:51 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
it's not like such a convention can just throw out the existing Constitution and start over
Throwing out the existing constitution and starting over, even though they had no authority whatsoever to even propose doing that, has happened in exactly 100% of American constitutional conventions.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 9:55 AM on July 22, 2017 [22 favorites]
Throwing out the existing constitution and starting over, even though they had no authority whatsoever to even propose doing that, has happened in exactly 100% of American constitutional conventions.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 9:55 AM on July 22, 2017 [22 favorites]
What actor does Scaramucci look like? It's on the tip of my brain and driving me crazy.
Ray Liotta [via]
posted by mazola at 9:56 AM on July 22, 2017
Ray Liotta [via]
posted by mazola at 9:56 AM on July 22, 2017
“‘Those transactions are in my view well beyond the mandate of the special counsel,” Dowd was quoted as saying in Bloomberg. “‘They’re unrelated to the election of 2016 or any alleged collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia and most importantly, they are well beyond any statute of limitations imposed by the U.S. Code.'”
It seems to me that any statute of limitations has zero relevance to whether Mueller can state proof of a crime in his report, or whether Congress should impeach.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:00 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
It seems to me that any statute of limitations has zero relevance to whether Mueller can state proof of a crime in his report, or whether Congress should impeach.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:00 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
I can't wait until the Russia sanctions land on Trump's desk! He'll be in a no-win situation.
CNN says the House and Senate have a deal on moving it forward. Apparently it includes sanctions on Iran, which I'm not thrilled about, and also North Korea, but...oh man.
Oh please oh please oh please.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:03 AM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
CNN says the House and Senate have a deal on moving it forward. Apparently it includes sanctions on Iran, which I'm not thrilled about, and also North Korea, but...oh man.
Oh please oh please oh please.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:03 AM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
The Crisis Is Upon Us
"Trump seems to envision himself as the Churchill of obstruction"
posted by kirkaracha at 10:03 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
... which makes him more of a sociopath than a narcissist. Or possibly a narcissistic sociopath.
He's the biggest kind of narcissist, the diagnosis that fits all those factors is "malignant narcissism," the most pathological and intractable form of the disorder.
So he's better than everyone because he can break laws without getting caught, and because he can break laws without getting caught, he's superior to us all?
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:07 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
He's the biggest kind of narcissist, the diagnosis that fits all those factors is "malignant narcissism," the most pathological and intractable form of the disorder.
So he's better than everyone because he can break laws without getting caught, and because he can break laws without getting caught, he's superior to us all?
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:07 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
The sole legislative accomplishment of the Trump presidency will soon be having a veto overriden on Russia sanctions!
Actually I don't see how he could possibly veto such a bill. He'll cave and sign it.
posted by Justinian at 10:07 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
Actually I don't see how he could possibly veto such a bill. He'll cave and sign it.
posted by Justinian at 10:07 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
he can sign them and piss off his Russian handlers to the point that maybe they drop the dime on him.
If the Russian handlers are smart enough to realize that any veto would be overridden, as well as undermine Agent D's cover, perhaps they would not be pissed. No pun intended
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:09 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
If the Russian handlers are smart enough to realize that any veto would be overridden, as well as undermine Agent D's cover, perhaps they would not be pissed. No pun intended
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:09 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
I also want to point out that the fate of Zombie Trumpcare and the fate of the republic seem inextricably intertwined.Many have been unable to feel the existence of the fate of the republic, but in times of extreme danger, voices will be heard and hearts will be called.
The GOP has been operating in pure McConnellian nihilism. It's all about whipping 50 senators into a vote. No meaningful debate allowed. With a debate, there's a small chance that there will be soul-searching, that people may start thinking about their fate and the meaning of all these frustrations. This must be prevented at all costs.
posted by runcifex at 10:09 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
Phil McCausland, NBC News: Arizona Republican Says McCain Should Resign, Adds She’d Be Strong Replacement
She does sound like a great choice to replace McCain in the Senate. The total lack of empathy or sense of dignity, the arrogance in the face of her own ignorance, the aping of normal human sensibilities in the face of tragedy for her own self-promotion, those all sound like great qualifications for sitting as a Republican in the Senate.
posted by biogeo at 10:11 AM on July 22, 2017 [43 favorites]
Ghosts of elections past appeared in Arizona, as Sen. John McCain’s 2016 challenger urged him to resign because of his brain cancer diagnosis on Friday. She also took the opportunity to put her name forward as his replacement.Well, it didn't take long for the vultures to start circling, did it?
While speaking to an Indiana radio station, Dr. Kelli Ward — who failed to beat McCain in the Republican primary in 2016 and is running against Republican Sen. Jeff Flake in 2018 — said she'd be a strong choice to replace the senator.
“I hope that Sen. McCain is going to look long and hard at this, that his family and advisers are going to look at this and they’re going to advise him to step away as quickly as possible,” she said on WOWO 1190 AM. “So that the business of the country and the business of Arizona being represented at the federal level can move forward.”
"Senator McCain and his family have a lot of hard decisions to make," she added in the statement. "As a doctor, I’ve counseled patients in similar situations and these end-of-life choices are never easy. I usually advise terminal patients to reduce stress, relax, and spend time laughing with loved ones."(My emphasis.)
Ward is an osteopathic physician and former Arizona state senator. She said during the Indiana interview that she could not presume to understand McCain’s prognosis and added that she is a Christian who believes in miracles.
Ward admitted that she is not an oncologist, a doctor who specializes in diagnosing and treating tumors, during the KTAR interview. She also disclosed that she had not spoken to McCain's doctors or examined the senator.
Nevertheless, she concluded that McCain’s “full force” return to the Senate was unlikely.
She does sound like a great choice to replace McCain in the Senate. The total lack of empathy or sense of dignity, the arrogance in the face of her own ignorance, the aping of normal human sensibilities in the face of tragedy for her own self-promotion, those all sound like great qualifications for sitting as a Republican in the Senate.
posted by biogeo at 10:11 AM on July 22, 2017 [43 favorites]
Today the President is commissioning the USS Gerald Ford aircraft carrier, named after the man who famously pardoned his predecessor's felonious activities. There is as yet no USS Michael Pence.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:14 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:14 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
Exactly. And he's better than everyone else because he thinks of himself as above shame and social norms that constrain the rest of us. That's the antisocial dimension of the disorder. He sees everybody else as a slave to ethics and polite convention and has no respect for them for being "weak" like that.
posted by saulgoodman at 10:14 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by saulgoodman at 10:14 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
She also took the opportunity to put her name forward as his replacement.
JFC. Kelli Ward should not be allowed anywhere near the Senate chamber. She is batshit fucking insane.
posted by Talez at 10:18 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
JFC. Kelli Ward should not be allowed anywhere near the Senate chamber. She is batshit fucking insane.
posted by Talez at 10:18 AM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
JFC. Kelli Ward should not be allowed anywhere near the Senate chamber. She is batshit fucking insane.
Yes, I believe it's already been stated she's a Republican.
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 10:19 AM on July 22, 2017 [45 favorites]
Yes, I believe it's already been stated she's a Republican.
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 10:19 AM on July 22, 2017 [45 favorites]
Yes, I believe it's already been stated she's a Republican.
No. There's the "reluctantly following orders" and then there's "gleefully going along with the destruction of The Republic and the birth of the American Christian Dominionist Theocracy". I realize there isn't much distinction between the result but if the dust ever clears we can possibly depend on some of former these to be a moderating force inside the Republican party.
Mrs Ward is the latter in spades.
posted by Talez at 10:23 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
No. There's the "reluctantly following orders" and then there's "gleefully going along with the destruction of The Republic and the birth of the American Christian Dominionist Theocracy". I realize there isn't much distinction between the result but if the dust ever clears we can possibly depend on some of former these to be a moderating force inside the Republican party.
Mrs Ward is the latter in spades.
posted by Talez at 10:23 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
what is this red underline, how has this very real word not been added to Chrome's dictionary yet
right-clicking on the red-underlined word is your friend.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 10:26 AM on July 22, 2017
right-clicking on the red-underlined word is your friend.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 10:26 AM on July 22, 2017
Well, speaking personally as a Jew, I don't see any difference between gleefully destroying the country, and "just" following orders. They should all be removed from power, if not thrown in jail.
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 10:28 AM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 10:28 AM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
There's the "reluctantly following orders" and then there's "gleefully going along with the destruction of The Republic and the birth of the American Christian Dominionist Theocracy".
She'd fit right in with Mike Lee and Ted Cruz.
posted by fedward at 10:30 AM on July 22, 2017
She'd fit right in with Mike Lee and Ted Cruz.
posted by fedward at 10:30 AM on July 22, 2017
Kelli Ward is nutburger McLooney Tunes crazy, and she attacked McCain for being too old during a Senate race in Arizona, so she's also a moron. So, perfect for the GOP.
At this point I honestly don't know if moral cowardice is preferable to crazytown stupidity. It sort of feels like picking the method of your own torture.
I'm starting to think the only way to deal with all of this is with massive, sustained, and tragically costly civil protest / unrest.
posted by schadenfrau at 10:38 AM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
At this point I honestly don't know if moral cowardice is preferable to crazytown stupidity. It sort of feels like picking the method of your own torture.
I'm starting to think the only way to deal with all of this is with massive, sustained, and tragically costly civil protest / unrest.
posted by schadenfrau at 10:38 AM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
Here's a tweetstorm by Seth Abramson on the recent departures from 45's legal team. tl;dr - remaining team preparing for criminal charges and strategising around the removal of Mueller.
(I would excerpt, but am on a bad machine for editing)
posted by Devonian at 10:50 AM on July 22, 2017 [10 favorites]
(I would excerpt, but am on a bad machine for editing)
posted by Devonian at 10:50 AM on July 22, 2017 [10 favorites]
The Hill has Spicer on Hannity saying his SNL portrayal is "malicious" and "not funny", which is worth half a dozen Emmys by itself
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:51 AM on July 22, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:51 AM on July 22, 2017 [12 favorites]
"For adults with more aggressive glioblastoma, treated with concurrent temozolamide and radiation therapy, median survival is about 14.6 months and two-year survival is 30%." (American Brain Tumor Association)
I posted a pretty extensive description of how my dad's high grade glioma was diagnosed and treated over in the "lying to ourselves about mortality" thread. He was 79 at diagnosis and didn't quite make it to 14 months.
For McCain's own sake I hope he does consider retirement, and soon, because the odds aren't good for him. His loss will be disruptive to the senate, but I don't think that consideration should stop him. I'm guessing there's already a lot of lobbying going on, though:
posted by fedward at 10:54 AM on July 22, 2017
I posted a pretty extensive description of how my dad's high grade glioma was diagnosed and treated over in the "lying to ourselves about mortality" thread. He was 79 at diagnosis and didn't quite make it to 14 months.
For McCain's own sake I hope he does consider retirement, and soon, because the odds aren't good for him. His loss will be disruptive to the senate, but I don't think that consideration should stop him. I'm guessing there's already a lot of lobbying going on, though:
But were circumstances to require that McCain be replaced, that person would have to be a Republican, as McCain is, and would serve until the next general election, which happens every two years in Arizona. Whoever was elected would then fill out the rest of McCain's term, according to state law.Ward may be the first out of the gate with a public statement, but she can't be the only one angling for the job.
That means if McCain were to resign within the year, Arizona could have two U.S. Senate races on the 2018 ballot, according to attorney Joe Kanefield, who served as state elections director last decade.
"The person seeking the so-called McCain seat would serve out the rest of the term," which ends in 2022, said Eric Spencer, the current state elections director. (azcentral.com)
posted by fedward at 10:54 AM on July 22, 2017
Appointing Ward would be a massive insult to McCain. Further, IIRC, the Arizona governor is not super psyched about gutting healthcare. I don't know enough about AZ politics to say who it might be, but I would bet against Kelli Ward.
I mean, coming out and calling for his retirement when it's inevitable anyway? How fucking dumb do you have to be to do that?
posted by schadenfrau at 11:03 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
I mean, coming out and calling for his retirement when it's inevitable anyway? How fucking dumb do you have to be to do that?
posted by schadenfrau at 11:03 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Ward can't be the only one interested, no. And retirement & replacement has to be a big concern right now. None of that makes Ward's statements or her opportunism any less ghoulish. They're obviously going to appoint a Republican (in accordance with Arizona state law, even), but the people making that choice sure as hell ought to take her out of the conversation entirely.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:05 AM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:05 AM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
I predict the "I'm just saying what everyone's already thinking" defense. Somehow in the Republican playbook, that makes you brave and no-bullshit, not tone-deaf and shameless. (There's a a reason people thinking it are not saying it.)
posted by ctmf at 11:09 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by ctmf at 11:09 AM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
Maybe if there's just too much controversy over the replacement, they should retire him now and worry about the replacement later. You know, kick the can down the road, let the next administration take care of it. It's good solid policy.
posted by biogeo at 11:11 AM on July 22, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by biogeo at 11:11 AM on July 22, 2017 [11 favorites]
Jill Stein looped into widening investigation of Russia and Trump Jr. connections (The Hill)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 11:12 AM on July 22, 2017 [50 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 11:12 AM on July 22, 2017 [50 favorites]
I know many of us read Josh Marshall regularly, but for those who don't, he isn't particularly prone to hyperbole or premature freaking out.
the fact that he states matter-of-factly at the end of the piece that trump will fire mueller is the bit that has me freaking out. he doesn't make statements like that unless he's thought through all the angles.
posted by murphy slaw at 11:14 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
the fact that he states matter-of-factly at the end of the piece that trump will fire mueller is the bit that has me freaking out. he doesn't make statements like that unless he's thought through all the angles.
posted by murphy slaw at 11:14 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
"Trump seems to envision himself as the Churchill of obstruction"
That's where he's a Viking!
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 11:16 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
That's where he's a Viking!
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 11:16 AM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
A newfound memo from Kenneth W. Starr’s independent counsel investigation
I said in the previous thread that having to GoFundMe these assholes out of power was just over-the-top that it would probably happen but doing it on the back of a Starr memo would be... god it's just so fucking much I can't find the words.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 11:16 AM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
I said in the previous thread that having to GoFundMe these assholes out of power was just over-the-top that it would probably happen but doing it on the back of a Starr memo would be... god it's just so fucking much I can't find the words.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 11:16 AM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
If Jill Stein ends up in prison for this along with the Trumpists, it will bring me great joy.
Even if she only took a fraction of the campaign funds, homeopathically that's actually much more powerful.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:20 AM on July 22, 2017 [106 favorites]
Even if she only took a fraction of the campaign funds, homeopathically that's actually much more powerful.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:20 AM on July 22, 2017 [106 favorites]
That Twitter thread by Seth Abramson linked above is well-worth your time. There have been some departures from Trump's legal team, and a shift from PR-based specialists to criminal law specialists.
Abramson points out that Kasowitz's claim that he was behind Preet Bharara's firing makes it look like the firing of all the US Attorneys was another attempt to obstruct justice, and makes Kasowitz himself a witness in Mueller's investigation. Which is the likely the primary reason why Kasowitz has left, rather than that business with threatening a guy over email.
posted by suelac at 11:23 AM on July 22, 2017 [25 favorites]
Abramson points out that Kasowitz's claim that he was behind Preet Bharara's firing makes it look like the firing of all the US Attorneys was another attempt to obstruct justice, and makes Kasowitz himself a witness in Mueller's investigation. Which is the likely the primary reason why Kasowitz has left, rather than that business with threatening a guy over email.
posted by suelac at 11:23 AM on July 22, 2017 [25 favorites]
If there's one thing I've learned during my years as a member of the workforce, it's that publically putting yourself forward as a potential replacement for someone who has just fallen ill is a fantastic way to ingratiate yourself with them and their professional colleagues.
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:24 AM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:24 AM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
Shouldn't we be reaching the point where Trump, via the Mueller investigation, has become a liability to Putin? I'm sure he relishes our current political chaos and all, but the growing general awareness of the US public of Russian Oligarch Money Laundering and admitted collusion coupled with a real possibility of actual charges/indictments can't be good for any Russian's situation, can it? Maybe the recent Sessions leak was from Putin himself because oh shit am I actually placing hope in Putin that he is going to be the one to take Trump down and wtf I'm still at the bargaining stage I hate this timeline.
posted by klarck at 11:27 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by klarck at 11:27 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
Shouldn't we be reaching the point where Trump, via the Mueller investigation, has become a liability to Putin?
It all depends what happens after Trump fires Mueller, and I for one am completely unable to see past that event horizon. We all know what should happen, we all know a variety of might happens, but it will have a dynamic all its own, including in the shadow universe in Moscow.
posted by Devonian at 11:39 AM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
klarck, I'm not sure there IS a downside for Putin.
They kill journalists and political opponents on the regular. Hell, Russia shot down a passenger plane in 2014 then vetoed the creation of an international security tribunal to prosecute those responsible and the rest of the world shrugged and moved on.
What are we gonna do, impose more sanctions while we deal with our domestic chaos?
posted by lydhre at 11:39 AM on July 22, 2017 [22 favorites]
They kill journalists and political opponents on the regular. Hell, Russia shot down a passenger plane in 2014 then vetoed the creation of an international security tribunal to prosecute those responsible and the rest of the world shrugged and moved on.
What are we gonna do, impose more sanctions while we deal with our domestic chaos?
posted by lydhre at 11:39 AM on July 22, 2017 [22 favorites]
Trump's HHS disappearing Obamacare down the Memory Hole?
posted by T.D. Strange at 11:40 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 11:40 AM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
I don't know what Putin has to fear, I'm sure he's an old hand at rolling up networks of operatives. There are no Jason Bournes in this on our side.
posted by rhizome at 11:44 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by rhizome at 11:44 AM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
What are we gonna do, impose more sanctions while we deal with our domestic chaos?
Getting rid of this regime (as much as possible) should be priority one, but the next thing on the agenda after that should be facing up to the fact that we're in Cold War 2 now.
And yes. We should impose more sanctions now. All the sanctions we can. Any punitive action short of military, we should go for it.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:49 AM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
Getting rid of this regime (as much as possible) should be priority one, but the next thing on the agenda after that should be facing up to the fact that we're in Cold War 2 now.
And yes. We should impose more sanctions now. All the sanctions we can. Any punitive action short of military, we should go for it.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:49 AM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
Per the pool report, the president is having lunch with Chief of Staff Reince Priebus, Stephen Miller, and Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin and his wife.
posted by salix at 12:00 PM on July 22, 2017
posted by salix at 12:00 PM on July 22, 2017
Say a prayer for Steven Mnuchin's wife
posted by theodolite at 12:03 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 12:03 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
We should impose more sanctions now. All the sanctions we can.
Oh, come on. We can't even tell the Russians that they can't have their SIGINT compounds in Maryland back.
NYT; Russia Issues New Threats in Dispute Over Diplomatic Compounds
Oh, come on. We can't even tell the Russians that they can't have their SIGINT compounds in Maryland back.
NYT; Russia Issues New Threats in Dispute Over Diplomatic Compounds
After a new round of talks failed to resolve the issue, Russia’s Foreign Ministry reiterated on Tuesday that it reserved the right to retaliate against the United States for its seizure of diplomatic property as punishment for Moscow’s meddling in last year’s presidential election.posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 12:04 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
I'm not understanding your objection; one of the points of the sanctions bill coming up Tuesday is to prevent those compounds from being returned without congressional approval... which would not be forthcoming.
posted by Justinian at 12:08 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 12:08 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Justinian: I'll believe it when I see it. This entire administration keeps rolling over for the Russians.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 12:11 PM on July 22, 2017
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 12:11 PM on July 22, 2017
But... that's the point. The sanctions bill bypasses the administration. It removes the power to lift sanctions from the President.
posted by Justinian at 12:12 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 12:12 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
I consider Congress to be part of this administration.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 12:13 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 12:13 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
Jill Stein is complicit in the Russia treason, has no power or leverage, and her job is finished. She perhaps did not think this through. I would not want to be Jill Stein.
posted by bongo_x at 12:13 PM on July 22, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 12:13 PM on July 22, 2017 [15 favorites]
Speaking of Sen. McCain, he tweeted this out yesterday afternoon:
posted by zachlipton at 12:13 PM on July 22, 2017 [19 favorites]
Talking healthcare w/ governors on call organized by @LindseyGrahamSC & @BillCassidy - it's vital we listen & heed advice of our governorsI know he always caves, but this does not sound like someone who is about to vote for Medicaid cuts. (Doug Ducey is the Governor of Arizona)
I remain firmly behind @dougducey & will support whatever healthcare plan he believes is best for the people of #Arizona
posted by zachlipton at 12:13 PM on July 22, 2017 [19 favorites]
OK, we're getting close enough now to start the pool;
Who flees the country, an who goes to jail? In what order?
posted by bongo_x at 12:15 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
Who flees the country, an who goes to jail? In what order?
posted by bongo_x at 12:15 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
I read a couple of the articles about Trump on the STAT website posted above and they always include this disclaimer (as well as one about diagnosing from afar). I don't understand what it means. He certainly shows signs of "impairment" to me. Not sure what they mean by no "distress" because we also have seen him plenty agitated. Can someone explain?
Honestly I see that as a CYA more than anything. It just means that it's only appropriate for a professional to diagnose someone with a disorder when they present themselves to you as suffering distress or impairment, not if they're just going about their business and are doing fine. I mean, in some ways that applies to all psychiatric disorders: they're only a problem if it's causing a problem. Personality traits are only symptoms when they are maladaptive.
However, in practice, since narcissists by definition rarely are willing to admit there's anything wrong with them or seek help, most NPD diagnoses are sort of second hand due to the person getting into some kind of trouble.
posted by threeturtles at 12:15 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
Honestly I see that as a CYA more than anything. It just means that it's only appropriate for a professional to diagnose someone with a disorder when they present themselves to you as suffering distress or impairment, not if they're just going about their business and are doing fine. I mean, in some ways that applies to all psychiatric disorders: they're only a problem if it's causing a problem. Personality traits are only symptoms when they are maladaptive.
However, in practice, since narcissists by definition rarely are willing to admit there's anything wrong with them or seek help, most NPD diagnoses are sort of second hand due to the person getting into some kind of trouble.
posted by threeturtles at 12:15 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
Jill Stein is complicit in the Russia treason, has no power or leverage, and her job is finished. She perhaps did not think this through. I would not want to be Jill Stein.
+1. Just like I was surprised but not shocked that Donny Jr almost literally had an email saying "Hey, totally cool with colluding with the Russian government, bring on the hacked emails", I am totally expecting emails/Mueller to reveal Stein as colluding with the Russians and Trump camp as well.
posted by chris24 at 12:19 PM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
+1. Just like I was surprised but not shocked that Donny Jr almost literally had an email saying "Hey, totally cool with colluding with the Russian government, bring on the hacked emails", I am totally expecting emails/Mueller to reveal Stein as colluding with the Russians and Trump camp as well.
posted by chris24 at 12:19 PM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
I think it's McMaster on the chopping block. Dude obviously hates Trump and thinks he is a moron, but as active duty military he can't quit.
I guess he could resign his commission and THEN quit.
posted by Justinian at 12:26 PM on July 22, 2017
I guess he could resign his commission and THEN quit.
posted by Justinian at 12:26 PM on July 22, 2017
I'm sticking by my call from months ago that Bannon takes himself out. Donnie is such an ignorant stubborn ass he'll go to jail thinking he's about to get away with it.
posted by bongo_x at 12:28 PM on July 22, 2017
posted by bongo_x at 12:28 PM on July 22, 2017
Here's a tweetstorm by Seth Abramson
Hard pass.
posted by schoolgirl report at 12:30 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Hard pass.
posted by schoolgirl report at 12:30 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
I actually think it will Don or Eric, first. There will be direct evidence, and they'll fall into the scapegoat roles they've played their entire lives. 45 hates his sons, I think.
And with this crowd, in this timeline, I always go with the possibility that most feels like Shakespeare as retold by President Camacho.
posted by schadenfrau at 12:48 PM on July 22, 2017 [19 favorites]
And with this crowd, in this timeline, I always go with the possibility that most feels like Shakespeare as retold by President Camacho.
posted by schadenfrau at 12:48 PM on July 22, 2017 [19 favorites]
We're all thinking jail vs exile. But isn't polonium nap a solid choice too?
posted by Glibpaxman at 12:56 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Glibpaxman at 12:56 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Yes, a polonium meatloaf for Trump would totally fuck everything up right now, for everyone
posted by yesster at 1:00 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by yesster at 1:00 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
So, when Jill Stein crowdfunded that recount, was the entire recount effort done at Jill Stein's direction, or was it out of her hands once it started? I mean that was the biggest role she played in the election, and if she's being investigated it's hard not to get skeptical about the recount.
posted by jason_steakums at 1:03 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by jason_steakums at 1:03 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
She wasn't sabotaging a recount she was grifting donations. She and Trump have a lot in common.
posted by Justinian at 1:05 PM on July 22, 2017 [31 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 1:05 PM on July 22, 2017 [31 favorites]
I will bet a cake -eatin' that nobody goes to jail or gets exiled or gets prosecuted due to Trump's big Russian adventure. I think the republicans are down with letting Trump and Company destroy our entire system of government if tax cuts can happen and brown people can be oppressed.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:14 PM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:14 PM on July 22, 2017 [14 favorites]
So, when Jill Stein crowdfunded that recount, was the entire recount effort done at Jill Stein's direction, or was it out of her hands once it started?
The latter. Michigan Dems were running it on the ground.
posted by Etrigan at 1:17 PM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
The latter. Michigan Dems were running it on the ground.
posted by Etrigan at 1:17 PM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
I will bet a cake -eatin' that nobody goes to jail or gets exiled or gets prosecuted due to Trump's big Russian adventure.
Agreed. Everything since last summer has been what I imagined would be worse-case scenario and every day I wake up surprised at how much worse it can get. There is no bottom. Best to hunker down because the shit-show-that-is-now-our-country is just getting started.
posted by photoslob at 1:21 PM on July 22, 2017
Agreed. Everything since last summer has been what I imagined would be worse-case scenario and every day I wake up surprised at how much worse it can get. There is no bottom. Best to hunker down because the shit-show-that-is-now-our-country is just getting started.
posted by photoslob at 1:21 PM on July 22, 2017
Mod note: One deleted; let's not get into suicide stuff please.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 1:21 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 1:21 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
I will bet a cake -eatin' that nobody goes to jail or gets exiled or gets prosecuted due to Trump's big Russian adventure
This hangs in the back of my head, but I'm not willing to break out the cake recipe and dictionary just yet.
posted by rhizome at 1:22 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
This hangs in the back of my head, but I'm not willing to break out the cake recipe and dictionary just yet.
posted by rhizome at 1:22 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
I will bet a cake -eatin' that nobody goes to jail or gets exiled or gets prosecuted due to Trump's big Russian adventure.
I'm about 97% sure they are going down at this point, and I'm not 100% sure the sun is coming up tomorrow.
posted by bongo_x at 1:30 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
I'm about 97% sure they are going down at this point, and I'm not 100% sure the sun is coming up tomorrow.
posted by bongo_x at 1:30 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
All this optimism seems wildly misplaced while Republicans are still in charge of both houses.
posted by T.D. Strange at 1:32 PM on July 22, 2017 [26 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 1:32 PM on July 22, 2017 [26 favorites]
On the McCain subject, I'm curious about the Arizona law that limits the governor to appointing a person who is a member of the same party as the Senator who needed replacing.
It's a law that makes a lot of sense, but I'm wondering about the abuse potential since we've learned that norms are now a thing of the past and even observance purely of the letter of the law is iffy.
Just to pick the most extreme possible example, if Hillary Clinton had been resident in Arizona long enough to qualify for being a Senator, could she switch her party affiliation and become McCain's replacement, then once appointed switch back to Democratic if the governor was malicious enough to go along with such a scheme?
What other states have similar laws and how has enforcement worked in the past?
Or, to pick a different example, if the Governor of Arizona was a Democrat could he maliciously pick a meth addicted high school dropout who happened to be registered as a Republican to replace McCain? Or an active Klansman or something equally awful? Would the Republicans be forced basically just to make the best of it, or is there some way they could reject the Governor's replacement?
Obviously in this case it's going to be a fairly normal Republican governor replacing a Republican Senator so I doubt we'd see anything particularly odd happening. But I do wonder about edge cases.
posted by sotonohito at 1:39 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
It's a law that makes a lot of sense, but I'm wondering about the abuse potential since we've learned that norms are now a thing of the past and even observance purely of the letter of the law is iffy.
Just to pick the most extreme possible example, if Hillary Clinton had been resident in Arizona long enough to qualify for being a Senator, could she switch her party affiliation and become McCain's replacement, then once appointed switch back to Democratic if the governor was malicious enough to go along with such a scheme?
What other states have similar laws and how has enforcement worked in the past?
Or, to pick a different example, if the Governor of Arizona was a Democrat could he maliciously pick a meth addicted high school dropout who happened to be registered as a Republican to replace McCain? Or an active Klansman or something equally awful? Would the Republicans be forced basically just to make the best of it, or is there some way they could reject the Governor's replacement?
Obviously in this case it's going to be a fairly normal Republican governor replacing a Republican Senator so I doubt we'd see anything particularly odd happening. But I do wonder about edge cases.
posted by sotonohito at 1:39 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
OK, we're getting close enough now to start the pool;
Who flees the country, an who goes to jail? In what order?
So, I don't really know anything about the various ways to bet on horse racing but I think they should all be applied here.
posted by VTX at 1:42 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
Who flees the country, an who goes to jail? In what order?
So, I don't really know anything about the various ways to bet on horse racing but I think they should all be applied here.
posted by VTX at 1:42 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
I think the republicans are down with letting Trump and Company destroy our entire system of government if tax cuts can happen and brown people can be oppressed.
So far, Trump's been a strong negative towards getting legislation passed. He's making people pay more attention, fired up the opposition and strengthened normally weak backbones, and his corrupt and stupid antics are making very distasteful legislation seem even more distasteful. The shit sandwiches are getting smothered in Trump-brand arsenic.
Who knows what they'll do when the Mueller event horizon is crossed, but I personally believe they'll take the first real opportunity to ditch Trump. They're not going to get much done with him in charge, and many of the GOP politicians hate him as much as we do, though for different reasons. And by "first opportunity", I mean when something so bad happens (or is revealed) that there's no cover left. Mueller's firing would be that opportunity.
I feel as certain of this as I feel about anything in these uncertain times. What's a big question mark for me is how people will respond. If the firing happens, I'm hoping for marches that will dwarf the Women's March. I kinda think it will. There's enormous anger out there.
posted by honestcoyote at 1:51 PM on July 22, 2017 [11 favorites]
So far, Trump's been a strong negative towards getting legislation passed. He's making people pay more attention, fired up the opposition and strengthened normally weak backbones, and his corrupt and stupid antics are making very distasteful legislation seem even more distasteful. The shit sandwiches are getting smothered in Trump-brand arsenic.
Who knows what they'll do when the Mueller event horizon is crossed, but I personally believe they'll take the first real opportunity to ditch Trump. They're not going to get much done with him in charge, and many of the GOP politicians hate him as much as we do, though for different reasons. And by "first opportunity", I mean when something so bad happens (or is revealed) that there's no cover left. Mueller's firing would be that opportunity.
I feel as certain of this as I feel about anything in these uncertain times. What's a big question mark for me is how people will respond. If the firing happens, I'm hoping for marches that will dwarf the Women's March. I kinda think it will. There's enormous anger out there.
posted by honestcoyote at 1:51 PM on July 22, 2017 [11 favorites]
Assassinating American public figures is a line Putin has yet to cross. It's possible, but it seems very far-fetched. That's a level of escalation I doubt he wants. He got lucky in that Obama was more focused on maintaining norms and striving for unity before moving against him (too little too late), but I really doubt he wants to rouse the US to the point of retaliating for assassinations.
This is all great fun for him while he gets to use lots of "soft" power and cyber tricks and make a buffoon of Americans for voting for racism and craziness over common sense. If American political leaders start dropping, it goes from fun to scary fast. Even for Putin.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:54 PM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
This is all great fun for him while he gets to use lots of "soft" power and cyber tricks and make a buffoon of Americans for voting for racism and craziness over common sense. If American political leaders start dropping, it goes from fun to scary fast. Even for Putin.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:54 PM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
and none of the comfy, namby-pamby federal "prisons" for this bunch. send the fuckers to Gitmo.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 1:56 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 1:56 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
All this optimism seems wildly misplaced while Republicans are still in charge of both houses.
Nobody said it was going to be pretty.
posted by bongo_x at 2:01 PM on July 22, 2017
Nobody said it was going to be pretty.
posted by bongo_x at 2:01 PM on July 22, 2017
On the McCain subject, I'm curious about the Arizona law that limits the governor to appointing a person who is a member of the same party as the Senator who needed replacing.
I have a dream that McCain discoverers his conscience and changes his registration or whatever to Democrat, just as one last Mavericky FU to Trump.
posted by Glibpaxman at 2:06 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
I have a dream that McCain discoverers his conscience and changes his registration or whatever to Democrat, just as one last Mavericky FU to Trump.
posted by Glibpaxman at 2:06 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
The law stipulates that if the Senator changes parties in office the replacement must be of the party the Senator was when elected.
But it doesn't appear to address the situation where someone switch *to* the Senators party solely for the purpose of being appointed. I have no idea what would happen in that case.
posted by Justinian at 2:09 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
But it doesn't appear to address the situation where someone switch *to* the Senators party solely for the purpose of being appointed. I have no idea what would happen in that case.
posted by Justinian at 2:09 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
Some of you may not be familiar with Doug Ducey. A horrible person with an extremely punchable face. He's going to do whatever the worst choice is.
posted by bongo_x at 2:13 PM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by bongo_x at 2:13 PM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
Can you join a party without permission/being accepted? I imagine you can't just start saying "I'm a Republican now" without the Republican Party getting a say.
posted by ctmf at 2:14 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by ctmf at 2:14 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
...a meth addicted high school dropout who happened to be registered as a Republican...
You mean Trump?
posted by Mental Wimp at 2:21 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
You mean Trump?
posted by Mental Wimp at 2:21 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
All this optimism seems wildly misplaced while Republicans are still in charge of both houses.
I don't think Trump is getting impeached this year, but I think we're headed for a different sort of constitutional crisis when they have to pass a budget and raise the debt ceiling. I think some of the "moderate" Republicans in the senate are going to have a hard time with the very real threat of a default on the credit of the United States, but the hardliners who are still pushing for repeal of Obamacare clearly aren't likely to stop at, well, anything. They also want tax reform, and it's a safe bet they'll hold the budget hostage and not be willing to compromise on it.
What I don't know is what will actually happen when we hit the crisis point. Repeatedly failing to repeal Obamacare is one thing, and it's been clear that while McConnell could strong-arm the Republican caucus into voting unilaterally against passage in the first place (knowing it would pass anyway and be good for their states), it's also been clear this year that "moderates" (such as they are) still don't have the stomachs to destroy everything.
The last shutdown and debt ceiling fight was bad enough. It's remarkable (and appalling) that Republicans took the blame for it and still kept control of congress. With even less of a moderating impulse in the current congress, who's going to break with the caucus in order to prevent a default?
posted by fedward at 2:38 PM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
I don't think Trump is getting impeached this year, but I think we're headed for a different sort of constitutional crisis when they have to pass a budget and raise the debt ceiling. I think some of the "moderate" Republicans in the senate are going to have a hard time with the very real threat of a default on the credit of the United States, but the hardliners who are still pushing for repeal of Obamacare clearly aren't likely to stop at, well, anything. They also want tax reform, and it's a safe bet they'll hold the budget hostage and not be willing to compromise on it.
What I don't know is what will actually happen when we hit the crisis point. Repeatedly failing to repeal Obamacare is one thing, and it's been clear that while McConnell could strong-arm the Republican caucus into voting unilaterally against passage in the first place (knowing it would pass anyway and be good for their states), it's also been clear this year that "moderates" (such as they are) still don't have the stomachs to destroy everything.
The last shutdown and debt ceiling fight was bad enough. It's remarkable (and appalling) that Republicans took the blame for it and still kept control of congress. With even less of a moderating impulse in the current congress, who's going to break with the caucus in order to prevent a default?
posted by fedward at 2:38 PM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
Breitbart says "Trump's Pentagon Plans to Regularly Challenge China in the South China Sea."
posted by Coventry at 2:48 PM on July 22, 2017
posted by Coventry at 2:48 PM on July 22, 2017
Trump seems to be laying the groundwork for military action in Iran, so I wouldn't count on impeachment being an easier option a year from now. He's going to try to grab some of that sweet, sweet "unitary executive" power for himself like Bush II did.
posted by saulgoodman at 2:55 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by saulgoodman at 2:55 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
We're all thinking jail vs exile.
I was running through my head the various hurdles we would have to jump over to put Trump in prison.
First I will just set aside any State charges aside. They may find something serious to charge him with but it will take years and I can easily imagine his lawyers delaying any trial or punishment for reasons of health for forever. They'll have several doctors swearing that his heart can't take the strain or some other sort of nonsense. Plus if he is found guilty they will immediately claim biased jury and demand a retrial.
So that leaves us with Federal charges.
The Impeachment process would have to start before he issues himself a pardon. Is that likely? I think there's a chance here because DJT does not like admitting mistakes or wrongdoing. If you recall his "Locker Room Talk" apology is the only example during his campaign of him admitting he did anything wrong and it was a very brief "Anyone who knows me knows these words don't reflect who I am. I said it, I was wrong and I apologize" Most of the speech was about how Clinton was worse.
The other chance for an apology during the campaign was when he admitted Obama was a US citizen. That was a remarkable moment because he never apologized. In fact he patted himself on the back for "ending" the controversy and he blamed Hillary Clinton for starting it.
So let's say he just can't bring himself to pardon himself or he does pardon himself and the SC rules his powers to self-pardon are unconstitutional. Then the Impeachment process begins at which point it is too late to pardon himself. It's possible that the Dems take the House and they vote to send him to the Senate for a trial. There is a very, very tiny chance that the Senators will be tired of his shenanigans and think themselves well rid of him and vote to impeach.
Now at this point if Pence does not pardon him, he can actually be brought up on criminal charges. If they can find an unbiased jury and they can prove his guilt, he could actually face some real prison time.
So is it likely that Pence will issue a Presidential pardon? Always provided that Pence does not get sucked into the Russian investigation himself. I think not. At that point Pence will owe him nothing and pardoning DJT will be a bad way to start his Presidency. It will make it appear that he was fine with whatever crime that DJT committed. I suppose he could pretend to be a forgiving Christian but I really see no value for Pence in the act. He would have to have received some sort of deal and the GOP having participated in Trump's impeachment would have nothing invested in saving him.
In my estimation the greatest hurdle is the 63 votes in the Senate. I completely agree with honestcoyote that he has been a burden to the Republican members of congress, shining a spotlight on everything they do, clogging up their voice mail, dogging them at every turn. I predicted early on that congress would find it all distasteful but they will have to weigh what their big donors want vs. what their base wants. It is all about re-election, remember.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 2:57 PM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
I was running through my head the various hurdles we would have to jump over to put Trump in prison.
First I will just set aside any State charges aside. They may find something serious to charge him with but it will take years and I can easily imagine his lawyers delaying any trial or punishment for reasons of health for forever. They'll have several doctors swearing that his heart can't take the strain or some other sort of nonsense. Plus if he is found guilty they will immediately claim biased jury and demand a retrial.
So that leaves us with Federal charges.
The Impeachment process would have to start before he issues himself a pardon. Is that likely? I think there's a chance here because DJT does not like admitting mistakes or wrongdoing. If you recall his "Locker Room Talk" apology is the only example during his campaign of him admitting he did anything wrong and it was a very brief "Anyone who knows me knows these words don't reflect who I am. I said it, I was wrong and I apologize" Most of the speech was about how Clinton was worse.
The other chance for an apology during the campaign was when he admitted Obama was a US citizen. That was a remarkable moment because he never apologized. In fact he patted himself on the back for "ending" the controversy and he blamed Hillary Clinton for starting it.
So let's say he just can't bring himself to pardon himself or he does pardon himself and the SC rules his powers to self-pardon are unconstitutional. Then the Impeachment process begins at which point it is too late to pardon himself. It's possible that the Dems take the House and they vote to send him to the Senate for a trial. There is a very, very tiny chance that the Senators will be tired of his shenanigans and think themselves well rid of him and vote to impeach.
Now at this point if Pence does not pardon him, he can actually be brought up on criminal charges. If they can find an unbiased jury and they can prove his guilt, he could actually face some real prison time.
So is it likely that Pence will issue a Presidential pardon? Always provided that Pence does not get sucked into the Russian investigation himself. I think not. At that point Pence will owe him nothing and pardoning DJT will be a bad way to start his Presidency. It will make it appear that he was fine with whatever crime that DJT committed. I suppose he could pretend to be a forgiving Christian but I really see no value for Pence in the act. He would have to have received some sort of deal and the GOP having participated in Trump's impeachment would have nothing invested in saving him.
In my estimation the greatest hurdle is the 63 votes in the Senate. I completely agree with honestcoyote that he has been a burden to the Republican members of congress, shining a spotlight on everything they do, clogging up their voice mail, dogging them at every turn. I predicted early on that congress would find it all distasteful but they will have to weigh what their big donors want vs. what their base wants. It is all about re-election, remember.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 2:57 PM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
Can you join a party without permission/being accepted? I imagine you can't just start saying "I'm a Republican now" without the Republican Party getting a say.
posted by ctmf at 5:14 PM on July 22 [−] Favorite added! [!]
Actually you can. Which is exactly what Trump did. All you have to do is register as a member of your chosen party.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:01 PM on July 22, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by ctmf at 5:14 PM on July 22 [−] Favorite added! [!]
Actually you can. Which is exactly what Trump did. All you have to do is register as a member of your chosen party.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:01 PM on July 22, 2017 [16 favorites]
I think the republicans have a real opportunity to recast themselves as the "saviors of the republic." Once they decide that all the attention Trump brings is preventing them from passing their odious laws, they can seize on the Mueller firing as the proverbial straw.
Pence comes in as a relatively bland rubber stamp and they get to forget the last 6 months of failure and reset.
posted by Eddie Mars at 3:11 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
Pence comes in as a relatively bland rubber stamp and they get to forget the last 6 months of failure and reset.
posted by Eddie Mars at 3:11 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
SNL should bring Spicer on to play Huckabee Sanders. It would be magnificent.
posted by qxntpqbbbqxl at 3:12 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by qxntpqbbbqxl at 3:12 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
When Nixon was brought down, and pardoned, there was a sense that the country needed to avoid the humiliation of keeping him in the spotlight. The idea that the President of the United States could commit such crimes was itself damaging to the United States.
With Trump, the damage is already done.
Nearly everyone, including most Trump supporters, are aware that this man is "a crook". Nearly everyone is aware that the election of this man to the presidency is an aberration which sweeps away the previous order of thought regarding what is possible in our democracy. For some Trump voters, this is the point; this is why they support him. Others may be reluctant to acknowledge the damage their protest vote has wrought.
But fundamentally, because the nature of our President is clear, and because there is no longer any use in pretending the flaws in our democracy do not exist, there is no reason to let Trump fade into obscurity, to save us from a painful national reckoning.
The downfall of Nixon was a national trauma. The downfall of Trump will be, for many, the greatest national celebration since World War II.
If he receives a federal pardon, there are likely to be state crimes uncovered which he cannot escape. If not, there are likely to be civil cases which will wreck his family empire.
Trump is not a man who will accept a jail sentence. Nor will he give up his riches when presented with an alternative. Escape and exile seems a very real possibility.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:19 PM on July 22, 2017 [27 favorites]
With Trump, the damage is already done.
Nearly everyone, including most Trump supporters, are aware that this man is "a crook". Nearly everyone is aware that the election of this man to the presidency is an aberration which sweeps away the previous order of thought regarding what is possible in our democracy. For some Trump voters, this is the point; this is why they support him. Others may be reluctant to acknowledge the damage their protest vote has wrought.
But fundamentally, because the nature of our President is clear, and because there is no longer any use in pretending the flaws in our democracy do not exist, there is no reason to let Trump fade into obscurity, to save us from a painful national reckoning.
The downfall of Nixon was a national trauma. The downfall of Trump will be, for many, the greatest national celebration since World War II.
If he receives a federal pardon, there are likely to be state crimes uncovered which he cannot escape. If not, there are likely to be civil cases which will wreck his family empire.
Trump is not a man who will accept a jail sentence. Nor will he give up his riches when presented with an alternative. Escape and exile seems a very real possibility.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:19 PM on July 22, 2017 [27 favorites]
So is it likely that Pence will issue a Presidential pardon?
I mostly agree with you. But think there's a decent chance Trump offers Pence a deal. Resign in exchange for an immediate pardon. As in that's the first thing Pence does when taking office. This might even be pushed on Trump by GOP leaders who think they'll have better luck with their legislation under a mostly normal politician like Pence. And that gets them around the question of whether or not self-pardons would work.
posted by honestcoyote at 3:20 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
I mostly agree with you. But think there's a decent chance Trump offers Pence a deal. Resign in exchange for an immediate pardon. As in that's the first thing Pence does when taking office. This might even be pushed on Trump by GOP leaders who think they'll have better luck with their legislation under a mostly normal politician like Pence. And that gets them around the question of whether or not self-pardons would work.
posted by honestcoyote at 3:20 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Wait til he tries to finance his border wall using a reverse mortgage on the white house.
posted by cmfletcher at 3:20 PM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by cmfletcher at 3:20 PM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
Even back in 1999 the Gerber Grow-Up Plan was $3.19/month, so perhaps he's actually recalling life insurance ads from the 80s, the last time his brain formed new memories
posted by theodolite at 3:26 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 3:26 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
SNL should bring Spicer on to play Huckabee Sanders. It would be magnificent
If he can't take it he shouldn't dish it out.
We're all thinking jail vs exile. But isn't polonium nap a solid choice too?
Don't forget the flipper. Manafort?
posted by Room 641-A at 3:29 PM on July 22, 2017
If he can't take it he shouldn't dish it out.
We're all thinking jail vs exile. But isn't polonium nap a solid choice too?
Don't forget the flipper. Manafort?
posted by Room 641-A at 3:29 PM on July 22, 2017
OK, we're getting close enough now to start the pool;
Who flees the country, an who goes to jail? In what order?
I don't see anyone fleeing, or anyone going to jail. But we might have a President Pence/Ryan/Hatch/Rubio/Cotton/Kasich in a few years.
posted by rc3spencer at 3:30 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Who flees the country, an who goes to jail? In what order?
I don't see anyone fleeing, or anyone going to jail. But we might have a President Pence/Ryan/Hatch/Rubio/Cotton/Kasich in a few years.
posted by rc3spencer at 3:30 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Nearly everyone, including most Trump supporters, are aware that this man is "a crook".
And that's why impeachment and removal is still such a stretch, even if he fires Mueller and pardons himself. Republicans care more about reelection than anything else. Their first priority is staying in power. And as long as their own voters don't give a fuck about treason or criminal behavior or shredding the Constitution, Republicans will kowtow to that.
Many Democrats risked their seats to get the ACA passed, and many of them lost their seats for it. Republicans have thus far not shown those sorts of principles. Even if these stakes are far higher.
Trump is not a man who will accept a jail sentence. Nor will he give up his riches when presented with an alternative. Escape and exile seems a very real possibility.
I don't see this playing out in reality, but damn. "The President plans to defect to Russia during the summit and only the Secret Service can stop him" is a hell of a set-up for an espionage thriller.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 3:32 PM on July 22, 2017 [11 favorites]
And that's why impeachment and removal is still such a stretch, even if he fires Mueller and pardons himself. Republicans care more about reelection than anything else. Their first priority is staying in power. And as long as their own voters don't give a fuck about treason or criminal behavior or shredding the Constitution, Republicans will kowtow to that.
Many Democrats risked their seats to get the ACA passed, and many of them lost their seats for it. Republicans have thus far not shown those sorts of principles. Even if these stakes are far higher.
Trump is not a man who will accept a jail sentence. Nor will he give up his riches when presented with an alternative. Escape and exile seems a very real possibility.
I don't see this playing out in reality, but damn. "The President plans to defect to Russia during the summit and only the Secret Service can stop him" is a hell of a set-up for an espionage thriller.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 3:32 PM on July 22, 2017 [11 favorites]
There is no bottom
Until the midterms. If we don't get back the house...then I think Civil War 2: Act 2 begins.
posted by schadenfrau at 3:33 PM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
Until the midterms. If we don't get back the house...then I think Civil War 2: Act 2 begins.
posted by schadenfrau at 3:33 PM on July 22, 2017 [6 favorites]
The Mothers Being Deported by Trump (Sarah Stillman for the New Yorker, July 22, 2017)
posted by filthy light thief at 3:34 PM on July 22, 2017 [39 favorites]
We’ll be rolling out the results of related investigations in the coming months. But here, we’re sharing one trend that conflicts with Trump’s rhetorical focus on immigrants who “are criminal and have criminal records, gang members, drug dealers.” In fact, his Administration’s agents are targeting, in large numbers, individuals for whom public-safety justifications for removal don’t apply. This includes a considerable number of women who have no criminal records and who are either the primary caretakers of young children, or the primary family breadwinners, or both. Four such cases are presented here.Thank god for ICE and those other brave defenders of the American Way, splitting up families to make us all safer.
posted by filthy light thief at 3:34 PM on July 22, 2017 [39 favorites]
The President plans to defect to Russia during the summit and only the Secret Service can stop him
Paging Gerard Butler
posted by mubba at 3:45 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
Paging Gerard Butler
posted by mubba at 3:45 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
What The Heck? Man Who Runs Firm Behind Trump-Russia Dossier to Plead the Fifth (Law Newz, Rachel Stockman)
Here’s a story that has gone completely under the radar, and raises some serious questions that the mainstream media largely seems to have ignored. Glenn Simpson, the co-founder of Fusion GPS, whose firm commissioned the salacious and mostly unsubstantiated Russia Trump dossier, plans to plead the Fifth after being subpoenaed by U.S. Senate Committee on the Judiciary.posted by Room 641-A at 3:53 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
According to documents obtained by LawNewz, attorneys for Fusion GPS’ Simpson sent a letter to Chairman Chuck Grassley expressing concern over the direction that the hearing was taking. The letter stated that Simpson would not voluntarily show up at the hearing due to a pre-planned vacation, and if subpoenaed he would exercise his First and Fifth Amendment rights not to testify before the committee examining the influence of foreign lobbying in the 2016 election.
Thank god for ICE and those other brave defenders of the American Way
...the vast majority of whom had jobs there during the Obama Administration and were only 'restained' from 'doing their jobs the way they wanted'. Barack's wishy-washy handling of these would-be stormtroopers should not have been policy; this would be happening under any Republican president.
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:54 PM on July 22, 2017
...the vast majority of whom had jobs there during the Obama Administration and were only 'restained' from 'doing their jobs the way they wanted'. Barack's wishy-washy handling of these would-be stormtroopers should not have been policy; this would be happening under any Republican president.
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:54 PM on July 22, 2017
Metafilter: All this optimism seems wildly misplaced
posted by mrjohnmuller at 3:57 PM on July 22, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by mrjohnmuller at 3:57 PM on July 22, 2017 [11 favorites]
Trump intel chief: No agencies dispute Russian election meddling
Director of National Intelligence Dan Coats said Friday that U.S. intelligence agencies uniformly believe the Kremlin meddled in the 2016 presidential election, despite President Trump’s earlier claim there was a misunderstanding between the agencies.
“There is no dissent, and I have stated that publicly and I have stated that to the president,” Coats told NBC News’ Lester Holt at the Aspen Security Forum.
posted by PenDevil at 3:57 PM on July 22, 2017 [35 favorites]
Director of National Intelligence Dan Coats said Friday that U.S. intelligence agencies uniformly believe the Kremlin meddled in the 2016 presidential election, despite President Trump’s earlier claim there was a misunderstanding between the agencies.
“There is no dissent, and I have stated that publicly and I have stated that to the president,” Coats told NBC News’ Lester Holt at the Aspen Security Forum.
posted by PenDevil at 3:57 PM on July 22, 2017 [35 favorites]
the salacious and mostly unsubstantiated Russia Trump dossier
Outside of the pee-tape is their any aspect of it that hasn't since turned out to be suprisingly solid?
posted by Artw at 4:11 PM on July 22, 2017 [18 favorites]
Outside of the pee-tape is their any aspect of it that hasn't since turned out to be suprisingly solid?
posted by Artw at 4:11 PM on July 22, 2017 [18 favorites]
...vast majority of whom had jobs there during the Obama Administration and were only 'restained' from 'doing their jobs the way they wanted'. Barack's wishy-washy handling of these would-be stormtroopers should not have been policy; this would be happening under any Republican president.
Actually not - and that's one of the more bizarro world aspects of this whole toilet mess. Traditionally Dem presidents talk a good immigrant-friendly game but step up enforcement because they are pro-labor and want that upward pressure on wages; Republican presidents back off enforcement because their business buddies want that sweet sweet illegal labor. If there's a reason ICE wasn't deporting moms it's bc it was perceived as bad publicity then (as opposed to good publicity now, for certain values of good) and because people who are full-time caregivers aren't competing for union jobs.
posted by bq at 4:47 PM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
Actually not - and that's one of the more bizarro world aspects of this whole toilet mess. Traditionally Dem presidents talk a good immigrant-friendly game but step up enforcement because they are pro-labor and want that upward pressure on wages; Republican presidents back off enforcement because their business buddies want that sweet sweet illegal labor. If there's a reason ICE wasn't deporting moms it's bc it was perceived as bad publicity then (as opposed to good publicity now, for certain values of good) and because people who are full-time caregivers aren't competing for union jobs.
posted by bq at 4:47 PM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
Despot refuses to visit nation in crisis, calls it "lousy". The nation, not the crisis.
posted by vrakatar at 4:49 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by vrakatar at 4:49 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
The feeling is mutual, Duterte.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:07 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:07 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
Today the President is commissioning the USS Gerald Ford aircraft carrier
Someone in the Navy needs to commission a new set of Garbage barges. Totally for environmental purposes. Not at all to allow one to be named the USS Donald J Trump, and then mysteriously for it to burst into flames on its maiden voyage.
posted by inflatablekiwi at 5:08 PM on July 22, 2017 [15 favorites]
Someone in the Navy needs to commission a new set of Garbage barges. Totally for environmental purposes. Not at all to allow one to be named the USS Donald J Trump, and then mysteriously for it to burst into flames on its maiden voyage.
posted by inflatablekiwi at 5:08 PM on July 22, 2017 [15 favorites]
Can you join a party without permission/being accepted? I imagine you can't just start saying "I'm a Republican now" without the Republican Party getting a say.You absolutely can. Bernie Sanders joined the Democratic Party to run on their ticket, then went back to being an Independent after the campaign season was over.
posted by xyzzy at 5:12 PM on July 22, 2017 [17 favorites]
Even back in 1999 the Gerber Grow-Up Plan was $3.19/month , so perhaps he's actually recalling life insurance ads from the 80s, the last time his brain formed new memories
The 2016 version says $1/week. I can easily see Trump getting that mangled into month instead of week.
posted by scalefree at 5:47 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
The 2016 version says $1/week. I can easily see Trump getting that mangled into month instead of week.
posted by scalefree at 5:47 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
People should run as "Republicans", pander like no pandering has ever been pandered, and then "RINO" themselves into liberals as soon as they win. Probably only works with relatively unknown people, though, or playing the longer game.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 5:57 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 5:57 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
Do your jobs.
Haberman is doing the job shes paid to do. Let Trump say crazy shit to her without risking access by questioning him on anything, ever. She's his good friend Maggie, not a journalist. The NYT is selling hundreds of thousands of subscriptions pretending she is.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:05 PM on July 22, 2017 [17 favorites]
Haberman is doing the job shes paid to do. Let Trump say crazy shit to her without risking access by questioning him on anything, ever. She's his good friend Maggie, not a journalist. The NYT is selling hundreds of thousands of subscriptions pretending she is.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:05 PM on July 22, 2017 [17 favorites]
People should run as "Republicans", pander like no pandering has ever been pandered, and then "RINO" themselves into liberals as soon as they win. Probably only works with relatively unknown people, though, or playing the longer game.
Or, how about our current democratic members of the HoR should go to Republican districts and hold town halls.
I'd love it if my congresslady went to Paul Ryan's district.
posted by ocschwar at 6:07 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
Someone did ask Sarah Sanders during the next day's press briefing:
posted by zachlipton at 6:09 PM on July 22, 2017 [72 favorites]
Q Thanks, Sarah. A question about healthcare. The President has repeatedly said that 21-year-olds can pay $12 a year for health insurance under the Republican plan. He said it again yesterday to the New York Times. What does he mean by that? Is the White House aware of a health insurance plan that charges only $12 per year? And if not, why does the President keep making that claim?Needless to say, she has not shown up with a health care plan that costs $12/year, and Sarah Sanders is ridiculously dishonest by pretending such a thing exists when she knows full well it cannot possibly.
MS. SANDERS: I'll have to check on the specifics.
Q Can you get back to me on that --
MS. SANDERS: Sure.
Q -- because the CBO estimates that it would be about $1,100 dollars a year, even for the lowest income 21-year-olds.
MS. SANDERS: Okay, I'll check on that.
posted by zachlipton at 6:09 PM on July 22, 2017 [72 favorites]
I really want this to all conclude with Trump tweeting "and I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for those meddling reds"
posted by srboisvert at 6:12 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by srboisvert at 6:12 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Not even in town.
posted by Joey Michaels at 6:37 PM on July 22, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by Joey Michaels at 6:37 PM on July 22, 2017 [17 favorites]
$12 won't get a life insurance policy for a rescue cat.
And they even get nine do-overs before they have to pay out.
posted by uncleozzy at 6:39 PM on July 22, 2017 [32 favorites]
And they even get nine do-overs before they have to pay out.
posted by uncleozzy at 6:39 PM on July 22, 2017 [32 favorites]
If the Trumps flee the country, I guarantee you there are members of the Intelligence Community who would be blissfully happy to extraordinary rendition them back to the states and deposit them bound and gagged at the nearest FBI field bureau.
That's if they make it back alive.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:00 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
That's if they make it back alive.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:00 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
Somewhat serious question. What would happen if Trump fled the country *but didn't resign*? I mean, is the presidency like a regular job where if you don't show up 3 days in a row you can be terminated for job abandonment?
posted by CoffeeHikeNapWine at 7:05 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by CoffeeHikeNapWine at 7:05 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
$12 won't get a life insurance policy for a rescue cat.
$12 won't get you an extended warranty on a ten dollar toaster.
posted by nathan_teske at 7:08 PM on July 22, 2017 [19 favorites]
$12 won't get you an extended warranty on a ten dollar toaster.
posted by nathan_teske at 7:08 PM on July 22, 2017 [19 favorites]
"The President has repeatedly promised $12/year health care. Why is this not proof of his total disconnection from reality?"
An 'I'll get back to you on that' wouldn't cut the mustard.
posted by Devonian at 7:17 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
An 'I'll get back to you on that' wouldn't cut the mustard.
posted by Devonian at 7:17 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
It isn't Maggie Haberman's fault that Donald Trump says and does insane shit and is not held to account.
I'm glad that she's there with the tape recorder... if there's one thing we've learned these six months it's that we'll get the most damning statements directly from his mouth.
posted by pjenks at 7:27 PM on July 22, 2017 [20 favorites]
I'm glad that she's there with the tape recorder... if there's one thing we've learned these six months it's that we'll get the most damning statements directly from his mouth.
posted by pjenks at 7:27 PM on July 22, 2017 [20 favorites]
What would happen if Trump fled the country *but didn't resign*?
he would have to be impeached and convicted - just about any scenario you can come up with, that's probably the answer
posted by pyramid termite at 7:30 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
he would have to be impeached and convicted - just about any scenario you can come up with, that's probably the answer
posted by pyramid termite at 7:30 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
Remember Trump’s technique during the primaries. He was more honest than Ted Cruz (“lying Ted”), more vigorous than Jeb Bush (“low energy”) and taller—yes, taller—than Marco Rubio (“little Marco”).
I just realized that Trump should resign immediately because he is much shorter than James Comey. If someone asserts this in an interview, that's the end of Trump presidency because he has nothing to counter. He'll have no choice but to voluntarily resign on that same day. Just to twist the knife, you could also say that Comey has larger hands, but that would really be an overkill.
posted by rainy at 7:30 PM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
I just realized that Trump should resign immediately because he is much shorter than James Comey. If someone asserts this in an interview, that's the end of Trump presidency because he has nothing to counter. He'll have no choice but to voluntarily resign on that same day. Just to twist the knife, you could also say that Comey has larger hands, but that would really be an overkill.
posted by rainy at 7:30 PM on July 22, 2017 [8 favorites]
we'll get the most damning statements directly from his mouth.
Which matters about as much as you can get for $12 if no one is going to hold him responsible for those statements.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 7:35 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
Which matters about as much as you can get for $12 if no one is going to hold him responsible for those statements.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 7:35 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
The "nothing matters, we're all screwed forever" isn't helpful with climate change and its even less helpful with Trump. It was understandable for, like, a couple weeks after the election but that was almost 9 months ago.
posted by Justinian at 7:39 PM on July 22, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 7:39 PM on July 22, 2017 [20 favorites]
I am against pretending fantasy land shit will happen.
posted by Artw at 7:45 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Artw at 7:45 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
rainy, I'd love to see someone try that interview strategy, just to see if he gets rattled enough to get mad and start incriminating himself. Just keep throwing in the juvenile little digs and non-sequiturs. Oh Comey did that? "Well, he said he didn't. He's taller than you, by the way." "Macron said - you know Macron, very strong handshake. Not like yours. He said..." The funny part is you know he cares.
posted by ctmf at 7:47 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by ctmf at 7:47 PM on July 22, 2017 [7 favorites]
Mod note: Please limit speculative slash-fic dystopian scenario-spinning. Thx.
posted by Eyebrows McGee (staff) at 7:52 PM on July 22, 2017 [46 favorites]
posted by Eyebrows McGee (staff) at 7:52 PM on July 22, 2017 [46 favorites]
Somewhat serious question. What would happen if Trump fled the country *but didn't resign*?
Well, I suppose if Republicans decided they still were not going to do anything about it, we would have a much more literal "Avignon Presidency" than any that pundits have imagined until this point.
posted by chaoticgood at 7:58 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
Well, I suppose if Republicans decided they still were not going to do anything about it, we would have a much more literal "Avignon Presidency" than any that pundits have imagined until this point.
posted by chaoticgood at 7:58 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
Can we declare Repeal-and-Go-Fuck-Yourself dead until after the august recess? I could use a short break from worrying about it. McCain doesn't look to be back in the next few weeks and without him they have 0% to pass, right?
posted by Justinian at 8:02 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Justinian at 8:02 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
If McConnell thought he had a chance to repeal Obamacare, he would wheel McCain in on a gurney if necessary.
posted by JackFlash at 8:07 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by JackFlash at 8:07 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
The president asking the military for their political support.
That's not autocratic or despotic at all. Nope nope nope nope nope.
posted by Talez at 8:09 PM on July 22, 2017 [50 favorites]
That's not autocratic or despotic at all. Nope nope nope nope nope.
posted by Talez at 8:09 PM on July 22, 2017 [50 favorites]
Somewhat serious question. What would happen if Trump fled the country *but didn't resign*?
I think that's one circumstance where Pence would feel compelled to invoke the 25th Amendment. Pretty soon laws would stack up waiting to be signed & more immediately the military needs a CinC to give them orders.
posted by scalefree at 8:13 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
I think that's one circumstance where Pence would feel compelled to invoke the 25th Amendment. Pretty soon laws would stack up waiting to be signed & more immediately the military needs a CinC to give them orders.
posted by scalefree at 8:13 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
From way upthread, and from Miko -
Citation?
There. Googled that for ya, ally. If you demand a scientific paper rather than a news article, lemme know. I'm good with the google.
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:35 PM on July 22, 2017
Citation?
There. Googled that for ya, ally. If you demand a scientific paper rather than a news article, lemme know. I'm good with the google.
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:35 PM on July 22, 2017
I've thought about this for the past few months: does Republican control of both houses really mean there's no hope until midterms, at all? And I've concluded, that's just paranoia speaking. We've seen that Sessions more or less recused himself, that Nunes also more or less recused himself, Flynn got fired, Sessions was forced to testify to the panel, Kushner and Don Jr. are now being forced to testify, there's the "don't touch sanctions" bill now from the house.
I feel that none of that would have happened if Trump had absolute support from Republican lawmakers. We don't know what kind of arguments are taking place behind the scenes in the Congress. If there is a real anti Trump coalition, it's hand is getting stronger with each wave of scandals. Yeah, you would really prefer and expect that hand to have been stronger during the primaries, but we don't live in an ideal world (or a non-screwed up world for that matter).
posted by rainy at 8:37 PM on July 22, 2017 [15 favorites]
I feel that none of that would have happened if Trump had absolute support from Republican lawmakers. We don't know what kind of arguments are taking place behind the scenes in the Congress. If there is a real anti Trump coalition, it's hand is getting stronger with each wave of scandals. Yeah, you would really prefer and expect that hand to have been stronger during the primaries, but we don't live in an ideal world (or a non-screwed up world for that matter).
posted by rainy at 8:37 PM on July 22, 2017 [15 favorites]
Googled that for ya, ally. If you demand a scientific paper rather than a news article, lemme know. I'm good with the google.
You are confusing absolute numbers and proportions. You said "white straight men, are dying in greater numbers and in greater proportion than gay men during the AIDS crisis."
Yes the absolute numbers are large because "straight white men" vastly outnumber gay men. But the proportions aren't even close, by a factor of 20 or more.
And even in absolute numbers it is not the same. By your own citation they say 500,000 deaths of straight white men compared to 650,000 gay men.
Geez, get a grip.
posted by JackFlash at 8:49 PM on July 22, 2017 [53 favorites]
You are confusing absolute numbers and proportions. You said "white straight men, are dying in greater numbers and in greater proportion than gay men during the AIDS crisis."
Yes the absolute numbers are large because "straight white men" vastly outnumber gay men. But the proportions aren't even close, by a factor of 20 or more.
And even in absolute numbers it is not the same. By your own citation they say 500,000 deaths of straight white men compared to 650,000 gay men.
Geez, get a grip.
posted by JackFlash at 8:49 PM on July 22, 2017 [53 favorites]
The Guardian article also doesn't say just men which is what was commented on in the first place. It is about the death rate of white Americans, men and woman. This isn't an unknown problem. I mean I'm not even American and I've heard about the general increase. Fairly certain there has been stuff on this site about some of the factors over the past few years. Suicide rising for middle aged folk and the opioid issues are a couple I recall.
posted by Jalliah at 9:06 PM on July 22, 2017 [4 favorites]
@NickRiccardi: Western Conservative Summit in Denver nearing conclusion for the evening w a videotaped msg from Paul Ryan, who's being booed.
@NickRiccardi: Jay Sekulow wraps his speech but now hops over to play drums w the band that's finishing the evening
posted by salix at 9:11 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
@NickRiccardi: Jay Sekulow wraps his speech but now hops over to play drums w the band that's finishing the evening
posted by salix at 9:11 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
Jay Sekulow wraps his speech but now hops over to play drums w the band that's finishing the evening
Play him off, Keyboard Cat.
posted by christopherious at 9:23 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
Play him off, Keyboard Cat.
posted by christopherious at 9:23 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
rainy, I think Trump and the slightly softer Republicans are at a Mexican standoff, holding each other hostage. This is not very stable and Trump needs them more than they need Trump. Trump's No.1 card has been "Repeal Obamacare!" and his threat is that if they don't fall in line, the MAGA candidates will kill them off in the elections by capturing the MAGA votes. However, the hard fact that Americans love healthcare is against Trump, so it will fall apart, and now even the MAGA voter base is losing its rabidity on the healthcare issue.
That's also why the Trumps are working relentlessly on voter intimidation. To continue the game both the MAGA and softer GOP factions rely on a paralysed opposition, which the Dems so far is handing them on a plate. The opposition, however, cannot be counted to stay fractured and weak this for too long, and the healthcare debacle has the signs of reinvigorating them. So they must get this voter intimidation thing really going. And on this, the whole GOP needs the MAGA Trumpists.
I still count on the Trumpists to implode sooner than the non-Trumpist GOP to take active measure. The latter will act against their slightly more rabid comrades only if there's an opportunity and a reason, and they must make sure they'll fill in the vacuum before anyone else does (it's always the Party before the State). They'd rather prefer being held ransom by Trumpists than actively detrumpifing and leaving an opening for the Dem opposition.
posted by runcifex at 9:36 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
That's also why the Trumps are working relentlessly on voter intimidation. To continue the game both the MAGA and softer GOP factions rely on a paralysed opposition, which the Dems so far is handing them on a plate. The opposition, however, cannot be counted to stay fractured and weak this for too long, and the healthcare debacle has the signs of reinvigorating them. So they must get this voter intimidation thing really going. And on this, the whole GOP needs the MAGA Trumpists.
I still count on the Trumpists to implode sooner than the non-Trumpist GOP to take active measure. The latter will act against their slightly more rabid comrades only if there's an opportunity and a reason, and they must make sure they'll fill in the vacuum before anyone else does (it's always the Party before the State). They'd rather prefer being held ransom by Trumpists than actively detrumpifing and leaving an opening for the Dem opposition.
posted by runcifex at 9:36 PM on July 22, 2017 [5 favorites]
What would happen if Trump fled the country *but didn't resign*?
I like how the Trump presidency is forcing us to speculate about all these totally insane hypothetical scenarios and their legal ramifications
I call it the Air Bud effect
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 9:54 PM on July 22, 2017 [15 favorites]
I like how the Trump presidency is forcing us to speculate about all these totally insane hypothetical scenarios and their legal ramifications
I call it the Air Bud effect
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 9:54 PM on July 22, 2017 [15 favorites]
Jeb!
Jeb Bush: Trump’s latest crazed tweet storm ‘jeopardizes his legal situation’
Jeb Bush: Trump’s latest crazed tweet storm ‘jeopardizes his legal situation’
Bush also slammed Republicans in Congress for not doing anything to hold Trump accountable, as he noted there would be nonstop outrage from the GOP if former President Barack Obama’s campaign had had the sort of contacts with Russian officials that the Trump campaign did in 2016.posted by Room 641-A at 9:59 PM on July 22, 2017 [107 favorites]
“If Barack Obama did something as it related to Russia and you say, ‘This is outrageous,’ then when your guy does the same thing, have the same passion to be critical,” Bush said. “Does everything have to be a political calculus? ‘Oh my god if I say something, there will be an opponent, and there will be a third-party interest group come and give money to my opponent. Oh my god, oh my god, oh my god.’ This is not what public services should be about.”
Well, that should put the final nail in the coffin of Jeb Bush's political career... at least as a Republican.
posted by oneswellfoop at 10:06 PM on July 22, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by oneswellfoop at 10:06 PM on July 22, 2017 [18 favorites]
It's almost human.
posted by Artw at 10:09 PM on July 22, 2017 [25 favorites]
posted by Artw at 10:09 PM on July 22, 2017 [25 favorites]
Who flees the country, an who goes to jail? In what order?
I see Gorka slipping off soon if not already, and setting up a haven in right-wing Poland.
Bannon will be the Ma Anand Sheela, trying to fly out in a private jet one step ahead of the Feds. He'll ditch Donnie though because the Secret Service would give him away.
posted by msalt at 10:12 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
I see Gorka slipping off soon if not already, and setting up a haven in right-wing Poland.
Bannon will be the Ma Anand Sheela, trying to fly out in a private jet one step ahead of the Feds. He'll ditch Donnie though because the Secret Service would give him away.
posted by msalt at 10:12 PM on July 22, 2017 [3 favorites]
Googled that for ya, ally. If you demand a scientific paper rather than a news article, lemme know. I'm good with the google.
Fortunately, ally, we don't need to be too good with the Google, since the article links to the original study in PNAS by Anne Case and Angus Deaton of Princeton University. Like the Guardian article, the original paper doesn't at all support your claim that straight white men are currently dying in greater proportion than gay men were during the AIDS crisis. In fact, the article doesn't even differentiate by sex or sexuality at all, comparing only non-Hispanic white to Hispanic white populations.
The actual claim is that while the overall mortality rate for the U.S. and other developed countries fell during the years of around 1990-2010, the mortality rate for non-Hispanic whites aged 45-55 didn't, instead actually increasing (albeit only very slightly), and that as a consequence there were a total of about 500,000 more deaths than would have occurred if the mortality rate had continued to drop. This number of deaths is around the same scale as the number of AIDS deaths in the U.S. since 1980 (650,000), but occurring within a much, much larger population.
However, the results in this paper are not undisputed. In particular, Andrew Gelman and Jonathan Auerbach at Columbia University wrote a response in PNAS in which they pointed out that the effect may be partially or totally explained by the fact that because of shifting demographics in the U.S., the average age of the 45-55 cohort has actually been increasing over time. Basically, in 1990, of all the people aged 45-55, more of them tended to be nearer 45, and in 2010, more of them tended to be nearer 55. Worse, this effect is larger among non-Hispanic whites than other groups. Normal practice is to correct for this, but Case and Deaton didn't do so, and at least on the surface their result looks like exactly what you would expect to see when failing to compensate for this shifting demographic.
Case and Deaton responded to this and other criticisms, but in my opinion their response indicates they didn't really understand Gelman and Auerbach's point. Now, all of these people are working outside my field of expertise, but I've followed some of Gelman's work in the past, and I'm inclined to think he knows what he's talking about in this case. In fact, if I were peer reviewing a paper in my field that included figures like the ones in Case and Deaton's paper, I would demand that they rescale the axes to provide a more honest sense of the size of the effects, and provide a better justification for why the time periods chosen seem to randomly change from one figure to another. But the important lesson here is, all scientific knowledge is provisional, and no single scientific study constitutes conclusive proof of a phenomenon[1].
Individual studies like this are great for identifying possible problems, and I think it's pretty clear from this and other sources that opioid abuse and suicide are major problems that affect working class white men more strongly than any other group in America, though they certainly affect other groups as well. But using individual studies as proof for your counterintuitive pet theory is just cherry picking. Remember, most published research findings are false. That doesn't mean we shouldn't be prepared to believe the research that's currently out there: it's still the best evidence we have in hand. But it does mean we should be more cautious when it seems to suggest to us something wildly counterintuitive, like the idea that there's an unrecognized epidemic on the same scale as the AIDS epidemic of the 80s-90s specifically targeting working class white men that no one has noticed or is talking about.
Sorry for the derail, everyone, but I thought it was important.
[1] With perhaps a few exceptions, like some of the mega-experiments in particle physics. But in that case it's because the publication model is very different than in most other sciences: each study has hundreds of collaborators, and there are intensive rounds of internal review before a result is published. So for mega-experiments coming out of major accelerator labs, a single study is more analogous to dozens of studies from smaller independent labs in other fields.
posted by biogeo at 10:15 PM on July 22, 2017 [68 favorites]
Fortunately, ally, we don't need to be too good with the Google, since the article links to the original study in PNAS by Anne Case and Angus Deaton of Princeton University. Like the Guardian article, the original paper doesn't at all support your claim that straight white men are currently dying in greater proportion than gay men were during the AIDS crisis. In fact, the article doesn't even differentiate by sex or sexuality at all, comparing only non-Hispanic white to Hispanic white populations.
The actual claim is that while the overall mortality rate for the U.S. and other developed countries fell during the years of around 1990-2010, the mortality rate for non-Hispanic whites aged 45-55 didn't, instead actually increasing (albeit only very slightly), and that as a consequence there were a total of about 500,000 more deaths than would have occurred if the mortality rate had continued to drop. This number of deaths is around the same scale as the number of AIDS deaths in the U.S. since 1980 (650,000), but occurring within a much, much larger population.
However, the results in this paper are not undisputed. In particular, Andrew Gelman and Jonathan Auerbach at Columbia University wrote a response in PNAS in which they pointed out that the effect may be partially or totally explained by the fact that because of shifting demographics in the U.S., the average age of the 45-55 cohort has actually been increasing over time. Basically, in 1990, of all the people aged 45-55, more of them tended to be nearer 45, and in 2010, more of them tended to be nearer 55. Worse, this effect is larger among non-Hispanic whites than other groups. Normal practice is to correct for this, but Case and Deaton didn't do so, and at least on the surface their result looks like exactly what you would expect to see when failing to compensate for this shifting demographic.
Case and Deaton responded to this and other criticisms, but in my opinion their response indicates they didn't really understand Gelman and Auerbach's point. Now, all of these people are working outside my field of expertise, but I've followed some of Gelman's work in the past, and I'm inclined to think he knows what he's talking about in this case. In fact, if I were peer reviewing a paper in my field that included figures like the ones in Case and Deaton's paper, I would demand that they rescale the axes to provide a more honest sense of the size of the effects, and provide a better justification for why the time periods chosen seem to randomly change from one figure to another. But the important lesson here is, all scientific knowledge is provisional, and no single scientific study constitutes conclusive proof of a phenomenon[1].
Individual studies like this are great for identifying possible problems, and I think it's pretty clear from this and other sources that opioid abuse and suicide are major problems that affect working class white men more strongly than any other group in America, though they certainly affect other groups as well. But using individual studies as proof for your counterintuitive pet theory is just cherry picking. Remember, most published research findings are false. That doesn't mean we shouldn't be prepared to believe the research that's currently out there: it's still the best evidence we have in hand. But it does mean we should be more cautious when it seems to suggest to us something wildly counterintuitive, like the idea that there's an unrecognized epidemic on the same scale as the AIDS epidemic of the 80s-90s specifically targeting working class white men that no one has noticed or is talking about.
Sorry for the derail, everyone, but I thought it was important.
[1] With perhaps a few exceptions, like some of the mega-experiments in particle physics. But in that case it's because the publication model is very different than in most other sciences: each study has hundreds of collaborators, and there are intensive rounds of internal review before a result is published. So for mega-experiments coming out of major accelerator labs, a single study is more analogous to dozens of studies from smaller independent labs in other fields.
posted by biogeo at 10:15 PM on July 22, 2017 [68 favorites]
Jeb!
Jeb?
Yes!
Him?
Way to plant, Jeb.
I think he is angling to be our Gerald Ford. May renege on pardons, though. But the first somewhat shout of naked Emperor. From a political person of once higher stature than I have seen so far.
Who is next? Or is he whistling in the wind with no one listening?
posted by tilde at 10:16 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
Jeb?
Yes!
Him?
Way to plant, Jeb.
I think he is angling to be our Gerald Ford. May renege on pardons, though. But the first somewhat shout of naked Emperor. From a political person of once higher stature than I have seen so far.
Who is next? Or is he whistling in the wind with no one listening?
posted by tilde at 10:16 PM on July 22, 2017 [2 favorites]
As someone noted in the comments in the jeb article, what happens if Trump decides he can sell pardons like papal indulgences? Sure, it's probably illegal, but then he can just pardon himself again.
posted by vanar sena at 10:24 PM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by vanar sena at 10:24 PM on July 22, 2017 [9 favorites]
“This is a man who needs to listen and learn,” Hagel told The World-Herald. “And, unfortunately, he’s doing just the opposite. And it’s not good for him. It’s not good for the country.
The last part yes, but the first part? By what evidence is there that this isn't good for Trump? Kinda disingenuous, Chuck.
posted by rhizome at 10:49 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
The last part yes, but the first part? By what evidence is there that this isn't good for Trump? Kinda disingenuous, Chuck.
posted by rhizome at 10:49 PM on July 22, 2017 [1 favorite]
Evidently the latest guy whose Dark Web drug marketplace got taken down by the authorities was a Québécois man who founded a company in Canada and became an expatriate in Thailand where he was running it from. He was arrested in Thailand and died in a Thai prison of apparent suicide earlier this month.
The Globe and Mail collected a few of his online identities and traced through the postings, and unsurprisingly he was a total dick who talked about "wife-hunting" in Thailand, Muslims "breeding like bedbugs" back in Quebec, and how he maintained a second residence to be able to be a "professional cheater" on the Thai wife he'd married later on, who is pregnant today.
But when his mother was interviewed by Ars Techica and shown The Globe and Mail piece, she responded with,
So Trump would seem to have succeeded in smearing the reputation of the entire press, not just on stories having to do with him, and even in the non-Anglophone world.
posted by XMLicious at 12:32 AM on July 23, 2017 [24 favorites]
The Globe and Mail collected a few of his online identities and traced through the postings, and unsurprisingly he was a total dick who talked about "wife-hunting" in Thailand, Muslims "breeding like bedbugs" back in Quebec, and how he maintained a second residence to be able to be a "professional cheater" on the Thai wife he'd married later on, who is pregnant today.
But when his mother was interviewed by Ars Techica and shown The Globe and Mail piece, she responded with,
With all the fake news today, I don't think that everything we see is the real thing, and how can we be sure about all this conversation!!?
So Trump would seem to have succeeded in smearing the reputation of the entire press, not just on stories having to do with him, and even in the non-Anglophone world.
posted by XMLicious at 12:32 AM on July 23, 2017 [24 favorites]
I'd love it if my congresslady went to Paul Ryan's district.
FYI, Ryan's Wisconsin colleague Mark Pocan of CD-2 (I'm in Ryan's district, but they had to gerrymander it into deeply-red Waukesha to give him a solid majority, and so the district boundary is only a mile from my house and two from Paul's ... I could literally walk over to Mark's district) held a town hall in Kenosha back in May. It got a limited amount of national coverage, and arguably only had symbolic value. It hasn't seemed to goad Ryan into scheduling one on his own. He used to, of course, and seemed to even enjoy the give-and-take with local Democrats, some he'd address by name, and he's definitely continued to be seen around town here.
(I had my own encounter with him a couple of years ago, at the hardware store -- he actually blocked me in to force a discussion and an "agree to disagree" handshake; I told him I had no respect for him and thought his pretense to be an expert on poverty -- his kick then after the 2012 general -- was fraudulent. But this isn't about me.)
Locals held a big rally after the inauguration, and an outside group (nurses' union?) even marched up to his house -- locals mostly don't violate his personal space that way -- but I admit that enthusiasm has flagged. There is a regular contingent of peace protesters, but they aren't specifically against Ryan's agenda. Despite this rather sedate level of dissent (compare to town halls that have descended into near-chaos, and protesters who have invaded and occupied offices), he's whined about a loss of civility. We were proud to ensure in 2012 that he lost the county, the city, and even his ward, but most years he still wins comfortably thanks to rural Walworth County and the notorious Waukesha, both areas countering the cities in his district where he struggles at best. The rural parts of Pocan's district aren't even that Republican (he has Madison, but the farming areas still elect Democrats to the State Assembly), and I'd love to know what would turn things around.
But yeah, it's sort of pointless if he won't even talk to his own constituents outside of carefully chosen private venues or engineered personal encounters.
posted by dhartung at 1:08 AM on July 23, 2017 [18 favorites]
FYI, Ryan's Wisconsin colleague Mark Pocan of CD-2 (I'm in Ryan's district, but they had to gerrymander it into deeply-red Waukesha to give him a solid majority, and so the district boundary is only a mile from my house and two from Paul's ... I could literally walk over to Mark's district) held a town hall in Kenosha back in May. It got a limited amount of national coverage, and arguably only had symbolic value. It hasn't seemed to goad Ryan into scheduling one on his own. He used to, of course, and seemed to even enjoy the give-and-take with local Democrats, some he'd address by name, and he's definitely continued to be seen around town here.
(I had my own encounter with him a couple of years ago, at the hardware store -- he actually blocked me in to force a discussion and an "agree to disagree" handshake; I told him I had no respect for him and thought his pretense to be an expert on poverty -- his kick then after the 2012 general -- was fraudulent. But this isn't about me.)
Locals held a big rally after the inauguration, and an outside group (nurses' union?) even marched up to his house -- locals mostly don't violate his personal space that way -- but I admit that enthusiasm has flagged. There is a regular contingent of peace protesters, but they aren't specifically against Ryan's agenda. Despite this rather sedate level of dissent (compare to town halls that have descended into near-chaos, and protesters who have invaded and occupied offices), he's whined about a loss of civility. We were proud to ensure in 2012 that he lost the county, the city, and even his ward, but most years he still wins comfortably thanks to rural Walworth County and the notorious Waukesha, both areas countering the cities in his district where he struggles at best. The rural parts of Pocan's district aren't even that Republican (he has Madison, but the farming areas still elect Democrats to the State Assembly), and I'd love to know what would turn things around.
But yeah, it's sort of pointless if he won't even talk to his own constituents outside of carefully chosen private venues or engineered personal encounters.
posted by dhartung at 1:08 AM on July 23, 2017 [18 favorites]
I think that Trump's claim of absolute power in pardoning is his signal to his team that they can commit perjury.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 3:43 AM on July 23, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 3:43 AM on July 23, 2017 [17 favorites]
How Anthony Scaramucci Went From A Wall Street Carnival Barker To White House Comms Director, Ben Walsh/Daily Beast
It seems it was inevitable. My question is, what is it with the hair on these guys??
posted by mumimor at 3:47 AM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
It seems it was inevitable. My question is, what is it with the hair on these guys??
posted by mumimor at 3:47 AM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
In all of the fawning over Trump's slick new communications director, I missed this connection
posted by pjenks at 5:25 AM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
How Anthony Scaramucci Went From A Wall Street Carnival Barker To White House Comms Director (Buzzfeed)He was the subject of that story? The story that was retracted due to sourcing concerns? The one that he seems to admit to the key details? (FoxNews)
Trump reportedly loved him on T.V., and was smitten that Scaramucci forced CNN to retract a story that said Scaramucci was being investigated for a meeting with an official at a Russian investment fund.
Three journalists resigned in the wake of that retraction.
CNN has since backed away from the report that Scaramucci met with investors tied to the Russian Direct Investment Fund.Well, that settles that, then!
"That was not a 'meeting,' 'plan meeting,' 'strategic meeting,' anything like that. It was really an interaction with him in a restaurant," Scaramucci told "Fox & Friends" in his first interview since the dust-up with CNN.
posted by pjenks at 5:25 AM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
How health care works around the world
Some talking points for those of you writing postcards and going to town halls.
posted by mumimor at 5:27 AM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
Some talking points for those of you writing postcards and going to town halls.
posted by mumimor at 5:27 AM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
Dhartung, what do you think of Randy Bryce?Not Dhartung, but I don't quite get the affection for Randy Bryce. I can appreciate the slickly produced populism employed in the ad so clearly designed to appeal to the WWC, but I chafed at the cringey "works hard to provide health insurance for my family" ad text. I really, really want Democratic hopefuls to move towards talking about health care being a basic, universal right and not a privilege available only to those who have the physical, mental, and emotional capacity to "work hard" for their health care at the types of jobs where it is provided as a benefit. The ACA is a decent start, but it's quite obviously a bandaid that's peeling off before the wound has scarred over.
I think what bothers me the most is that I never worked harder in my life than when I worked retail at a big box store doing truck and inventory. It was hard, physical labor, and I frequently had shifts that ended well after midnight during the Christmas season. And I had no health insurance, and I ended up not being able to ever have children because I couldn't get treatment I needed when I needed it. It wasn't an "emergency," per se, so I ended up sterile. Less than a year later I was making almost 70 grand a year as a unix sysadmin and had health insurance. I was the same goddamn person, but somehow stacking 50 lb. boxes for $7.65 an hour made me less worthy of health care than surfing the internet 6 hours a day did. (I was of the automation school of unix sysadmining.) So this whole narrative of "working hard" for your health care doesn't belong in any Democratic political ad, imho. Even if it's red meat for the WWC. Maybe especially because it's red meat for the WWC.
posted by xyzzy at 5:28 AM on July 23, 2017 [113 favorites]
oops, that should say "(Daily Beast)" not "(Buzzfeed)", just as it does in the previous comment by mumimor!
posted by pjenks at 5:48 AM on July 23, 2017
posted by pjenks at 5:48 AM on July 23, 2017
Bit of a stab in the dark but it may be something to watch for. Via Scaramucci the WH may add attempts to exploit and leverage the faction battles that are big time flaming in center to left wing circles right now. From reading about him I think he's capable of seeing this as something he could use divisively. He potentially is going to have some clue of what is going on (and it's really not pretty) because over the past few days he's been following people on Twitter that are involved in one way or another. The reason I know is that many of them have noted, with surprise, that he's started following them.
It doesn't look like it's just more mainstream figures either. Put together, it's a diverse group both political spectrum wise, faction wise and identity wise. I do know he follows a lot of people before he got the job. The question I have is would he be able to keep up with that quantity of tweets in any way that's useful. Likely depends on whether he's smart enough to have other people involved. Regardless, over the past week it does look like he has enough smarts to understand who these people are and the role they're playing in social media on the Left.
posted by Jalliah at 5:52 AM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
Chuck Hagel did.
I see articles like this where some respected member of the Republican Party comes out with "it's eroding the trust of Americans" and two responses come to mind:
1) "Only liberals and reasonable people. The MAGAhats will cheer on anything the President does because it pisses us off."
2) "That's by design. It erases hope, disillusions, and disinterests people in politics when all you can resort to is cynicism."
posted by Talez at 5:57 AM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
I see articles like this where some respected member of the Republican Party comes out with "it's eroding the trust of Americans" and two responses come to mind:
1) "Only liberals and reasonable people. The MAGAhats will cheer on anything the President does because it pisses us off."
2) "That's by design. It erases hope, disillusions, and disinterests people in politics when all you can resort to is cynicism."
posted by Talez at 5:57 AM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
Yeah, Talez, the comments on that Hagel article pretty much affirm your point.
I don't know why I read those either.
posted by Rykey at 6:01 AM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
I don't know why I read those either.
posted by Rykey at 6:01 AM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
Anderson Cooper calls Gorka "the Hungarian Don Rickles." (The Hill).
More ridicule less both sides do it FTW.
Wait, that wasn't a compliment?
posted by Room 641-A at 6:25 AM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
More ridicule less both sides do it FTW.
Wait, that wasn't a compliment?
posted by Room 641-A at 6:25 AM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
Well here's another reason Trump is in love with this guy. Saramucci, just talked about Sanders hair and makeup and pretty much said she needs to worry about it if she wants to stay on.
This guy is a fucking opportunistic sociopath who is all over Trumps ID.
posted by Jalliah at 6:34 AM on July 23, 2017 [23 favorites]
My mom is lamenting how cynical and angry politics is these days, the lack of principles and idealism. She voted for Trump and buys into Bannon style nationalism. I told her that idealistic and inspiring politicians still exist, she is just looking on the wrong side of the aisle. Anybody got any good YouTube clips I could send her to prove my point? I could use a dose if inspiration myself right now too.
posted by OnceUponATime at 6:34 AM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by OnceUponATime at 6:34 AM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
Americans deserve the same quality health insurance that the Congress has. We do more.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 6:40 AM on July 23, 2017 [33 favorites]
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 6:40 AM on July 23, 2017 [33 favorites]
It's sounding like Scaramucci is the Patrick Bateman he wishes his sons would have been.
posted by cmfletcher at 6:56 AM on July 23, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by cmfletcher at 6:56 AM on July 23, 2017 [19 favorites]
The administration warfare on Obamacare begins in earnest:
Trump administration scraps Obamacare signup assistance in 18 cities
They're not planning on it going past the end of 2017.
posted by Talez at 7:01 AM on July 23, 2017 [22 favorites]
Trump administration scraps Obamacare signup assistance in 18 cities
They're not planning on it going past the end of 2017.
posted by Talez at 7:01 AM on July 23, 2017 [22 favorites]
Schumer and Pelosi should announce a new non-profit organization called "Affordable Care Justice" or something, with the specific mission of doing the job that the Trump administration should be doing in promoting the exchanges and helping people access the affordable healthcare they are legally entitled to access. The money will flood in.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:31 AM on July 23, 2017 [30 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:31 AM on July 23, 2017 [30 favorites]
They could call it "Democrats Against Sabotage" but it might alienate the consumer
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:34 AM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:34 AM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
One of their aims should be to extend Medicaid in states that haven't. "Here is healthcare you should have, but don't, because your state government is a bunch of asshats."
In the absence of Schumer and Pelosi doing something useful though, what organizations exist to do this work? Are there local indivisibles or ..?
posted by nat at 7:34 AM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
In the absence of Schumer and Pelosi doing something useful though, what organizations exist to do this work? Are there local indivisibles or ..?
posted by nat at 7:34 AM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
Every damn time we have to use workarounds to route around the nihilists and greed heads, we make the whole system more failure prone. It's basic engineering that we can't keep capitulating and using hacks to make up for the failures in governance at the state/federal level without creating more mess that's going to cost us down the line.
posted by saulgoodman at 7:36 AM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by saulgoodman at 7:36 AM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
I believe that offering workarounds to help people in the Trump era is a noble cause which politically strengthens the anti-Trump forces and hastens the day when they wield the political power necessary to make stronger and more permanent improvements to the system. If one party is seen to be helping the country while the other party is seen to be sabotaging the country, that's exactly as it should be.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:39 AM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:39 AM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
I don't think I agree. I think building up secondary structures makes the system more robust. Especially if it isn't one single secondary structure, but a series of state/regional ones. And it provides a place for training grounds for young lefties who may not be able to get elected on local/state level due to the politics of their region. It builds the back bench for the future.
posted by nat at 7:54 AM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by nat at 7:54 AM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
called "Affordable Care Justice" or something, with the specific mission of doing the job that the Trump administration should be doing in promoting the exchanges and helping people access the affordable healthcare they are legally entitled to access.
Justice in Health Care: It's yours by law.
posted by Rykey at 7:54 AM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
Justice in Health Care: It's yours by law.
posted by Rykey at 7:54 AM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
You know you're doing so much winning when six months into your term you; a) have outside defense counsel, and b) this is what he's talking about on TV.
@ABC:
Jay Sekulow: Whether president can pardon himself "is a question that would ultimately...have to be adjudicated by the Supreme Court." [video]
posted by chris24 at 7:56 AM on July 23, 2017 [15 favorites]
@ABC:
Jay Sekulow: Whether president can pardon himself "is a question that would ultimately...have to be adjudicated by the Supreme Court." [video]
posted by chris24 at 7:56 AM on July 23, 2017 [15 favorites]
"Why does someone lifting boxes at Big Box Mart or changing diapers at a day care not *deserve* the same health care options as someone writing code or parsing spreadsheets?" is a hell of a frame. Someone needs to get THAT into slogan form.
Another important point is that quite probably the single best thing the U.S. could do to support genuine entrepreneurship and small business is to implement healthcare that is free at the point of service.
posted by Buntix at 8:12 AM on July 23, 2017 [50 favorites]
Another important point is that quite probably the single best thing the U.S. could do to support genuine entrepreneurship and small business is to implement healthcare that is free at the point of service.
posted by Buntix at 8:12 AM on July 23, 2017 [50 favorites]
A nonprofit should promote Obamacare signups in the Matthew Lesko/"one weird trick" kind of "the government is trying to hide money that belongs to you!" way, complete with amateur looking ads and over the top rhetoric. Seriously, that would drive signups from a whole new market that doesn't trust slick, polished government programs.
posted by jason_steakums at 8:22 AM on July 23, 2017 [52 favorites]
posted by jason_steakums at 8:22 AM on July 23, 2017 [52 favorites]
Are there local indivisibles or ..?Indivisible is organized differently in different states. In my state, there's a state-wide umbrella organization and then there are local organizations in each state senate district. We're really trying to shift some of members' focus to the local organizations, which has been a bit of a challenge. But signing people up for Obamacare isn't really what Indivisible is designed to do. It's possible that people involved in Indivisible could create spin-off groups, but I think it would be a poor fit for Indivisible itself.
Incidentally, if you're not following your local Indivisible group or some other resistance-related group on Facebook or elsewhere, now would be a good time to start. We're going to need to mobilize quickly if and when the Trump administration fires Mueller, and you're going to want to know where local demonstrations are happening. You might also make preliminary plans for childcare and/or transportation, so you can get to wherever people are protesting ASAP after it's announced. At that point, the ball is going to be completely in the Republicans' court, and we need to show them that lots of people all over the country really care about this.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:32 AM on July 23, 2017 [12 favorites]
I believe that offering workarounds to help people in the Trump era is a noble cause which politically strengthens the anti-Trump forces and hastens the day when they wield the political power necessary to make stronger and more permanent improvements to the system.
I get this and mostly agree, but over my 30+ years in the U.S., it seems like the trend toward workarounds and make-do fixes and privatisation of public functions has been a one way street and we *never* actually manage to make headway on fixing the underlying failures in governance and come to rely more and more on private sector and volunteer based workarounds, which are themselves flawed and insufficiently uniform and accessible to everyone in need because they're not democratically accountable.
posted by saulgoodman at 8:38 AM on July 23, 2017 [15 favorites]
I get this and mostly agree, but over my 30+ years in the U.S., it seems like the trend toward workarounds and make-do fixes and privatisation of public functions has been a one way street and we *never* actually manage to make headway on fixing the underlying failures in governance and come to rely more and more on private sector and volunteer based workarounds, which are themselves flawed and insufficiently uniform and accessible to everyone in need because they're not democratically accountable.
posted by saulgoodman at 8:38 AM on July 23, 2017 [15 favorites]
I've been working on Trump palindromes. First problem. The name/word Trump does not easily give in to reversal. Even if I use p.m. as a common abbreviation, I am left with words starting with urt. If I go with p murt, there is one word that starts with murt, murther, an older form murder. According to the MIT Shakespeare Concordance, Shakespeare used "murther" 21 times in his plays, including the phrasing, "Murther most foul."
So, with murther in mind:
No-o! (Gasp!) Murther, eh? Trump's a goon.
Not actually using the name Trump opens other possibilities.
Sage, mos def Fuhrer, huffed some gas.
Finally, this one morphed into something like Trump porn fan-fic.
Me, barging in, ebb or I flow.
Amoral, an alley duolog.
Relative vagina is sure,
sleek. I leer, toss DNA. Hot pussy-bag
of fog abyss. Up to hands so treelike, else
Russian. I gave vital, ergo, loud, yell, anal aroma.
Wolf, I rob. Benign, I grab 'em.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:55 AM on July 23, 2017 [41 favorites]
So, with murther in mind:
No-o! (Gasp!) Murther, eh? Trump's a goon.
Not actually using the name Trump opens other possibilities.
Sage, mos def Fuhrer, huffed some gas.
Finally, this one morphed into something like Trump porn fan-fic.
Me, barging in, ebb or I flow.
Amoral, an alley duolog.
Relative vagina is sure,
sleek. I leer, toss DNA. Hot pussy-bag
of fog abyss. Up to hands so treelike, else
Russian. I gave vital, ergo, loud, yell, anal aroma.
Wolf, I rob. Benign, I grab 'em.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:55 AM on July 23, 2017 [41 favorites]
Stand Up America has set up text message alerts to help people find a Mueller firing protest site if they aren't already involved with a local organization.
posted by OnceUponATime at 8:59 AM on July 23, 2017 [29 favorites]
We must protect Mueller's investigation of Trump and his cronies. We know from Comey's firing that Trump is willing to blatantly obstruct justice, so we have to be ready to fight back. Text STAND to 21333 now to be the first to know when your voice is needed.March For Truth, MoveOn, and Public Citizen are trying to put together a national map and training people to host the protests. There is a training call tomorrow. MeMail me if you want more info.
posted by OnceUponATime at 8:59 AM on July 23, 2017 [29 favorites]
I don't know whether to be in awe or worried about your mental health, dances_with_sneetches.
posted by SPrintF at 9:01 AM on July 23, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by SPrintF at 9:01 AM on July 23, 2017 [15 favorites]
Can't you do both?
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:05 AM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:05 AM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
I don't know whether to be in awe or worried about your mental health, dances_with_sneetches.
What's even more amazing is that those palindromes TOTALLY fit in as the lyrics of Bohemian Rhapsody.
posted by Talez at 9:08 AM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
What's even more amazing is that those palindromes TOTALLY fit in as the lyrics of Bohemian Rhapsody.
posted by Talez at 9:08 AM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
One advantage to writing palindromes about Trump is that his tweets make about as much sense as palindromes.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:21 AM on July 23, 2017
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:21 AM on July 23, 2017
So, another incredibly informative thread(thanks!), and another Trump drawing for said thread.
This would be Trump Attempting To Pardon Himself.
posted by Phlegmco(tm) at 9:32 AM on July 23, 2017 [33 favorites]
This would be Trump Attempting To Pardon Himself.
posted by Phlegmco(tm) at 9:32 AM on July 23, 2017 [33 favorites]
Kushner always looks like he just farted and everyone thinks the dog did it
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 10:23 AM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 10:23 AM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
Kushner always looks like he sees mummy bringing him his crumpets.
posted by Rust Moranis at 10:31 AM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Rust Moranis at 10:31 AM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
Kushner looks like a fucking asshole.
posted by Cookiebastard at 10:37 AM on July 23, 2017 [53 favorites]
posted by Cookiebastard at 10:37 AM on July 23, 2017 [53 favorites]
This comment is probably behind a link or two here, but I wanted to call this out explicitly:
Former US Spy Chiefs Blast Trump, Question If He Is Trying To Make "Russia Great Again"
"You know, sometimes I wonder if he's out making Russia great again." (BuzzFeed News, Salvatore Hernandez)
On preview, Kushner is a CASTOR clone.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:41 AM on July 23, 2017 [33 favorites]
Former US Spy Chiefs Blast Trump, Question If He Is Trying To Make "Russia Great Again"
"You know, sometimes I wonder if he's out making Russia great again." (BuzzFeed News, Salvatore Hernandez)
Asked about a meeting during the campaign between Donald Trump Jr., the president's son-in-law Jared Kushner, and former campaign manager Paul Manafort with a Russian attorney linked to the Kremlin and Russian intelligence agency, Clapper said the meeting appeared like "standard tradecraft" employed by Russian agents.And this:
Brennan called the decision for the campaign's top players to attend the meeting "profoundly baffling."
"They should have known better," Brennan said. "If they didn't, they shouldn't have been in those positions."
"If President Obama had said to me after a congressional hearing, 'You choked,' I would have been devastated. But this one [president] I didn't care."All this said at the Aspen Security Forum, on the dias, while being interviewed by Wolf Blitzer. They wanted everyone to hear that. (Hour-long video at the link or YouTube.)
On preview, Kushner is a CASTOR clone.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:41 AM on July 23, 2017 [33 favorites]
When I was just out of college in the 80s I worked at the Kinko's on Dunster St. in Harvard Square. One winter evening I was asked to make a couple of copies of a five-page paper by an extremely snooty, extremely preppy freshman boy. When I didn't move fast enough for this customer's taste, he made a comment about not being able to get good help these days. Needless to say few people in history have waited longer for two copies of their five-page paper to be made.
Anyway, every time I see Kushner I remember that kid.
posted by Lyme Drop at 10:44 AM on July 23, 2017 [44 favorites]
Anyway, every time I see Kushner I remember that kid.
posted by Lyme Drop at 10:44 AM on July 23, 2017 [44 favorites]
So Joy Ann Reid brought on an expert to display Trump's language skills:
so awesome.
(It's Ron Perlman.)
posted by suelac at 10:44 AM on July 23, 2017 [28 favorites]
so awesome.
(It's Ron Perlman.)
posted by suelac at 10:44 AM on July 23, 2017 [28 favorites]
Phlegmco(tm), your drawings are a highlight of these threads for me. The style reflects the present horror very effectively. Thank you for sharing them here.
posted by otsebyatina at 11:09 AM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by otsebyatina at 11:09 AM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
Well here's another reason Trump is in love with this guy. Saramucci, just talked about Sanders hair and makeup and pretty much said she needs to worry about it if she wants to stay on.
I had to go pull the tape on this, because wait, what? WaPo: Anthony Scaramucci said he wants Sarah Sanders ‘to continue to use the hair and makeup person’
posted by zachlipton at 11:11 AM on July 23, 2017 [16 favorites]
I had to go pull the tape on this, because wait, what? WaPo: Anthony Scaramucci said he wants Sarah Sanders ‘to continue to use the hair and makeup person’
“I think Sarah does a great job. She's an incredibly warm person. She's incredibly authentic,” the new White House communications director told Jake Tapper on CNN's “State of the Union,” even adding that he's letting Sanders take the bigger office while he settles on a smaller one because she has the tough job of taking hits from the press.After outrage ensued, Scaramucci claimed in a tweet:
Then, at the end of the lengthy and, at times, heated interview, Scaramucci said there's only one thing he's asking of Sanders.
“Sarah, if you're watching,” he said. “I love the hair and makeup person that we had on Friday, so I'd like to continue to use the hair and makeup person.”
For the record, I was referring to my hair and make up and the fact that I like the make up artist. I need all the help I can get! #humorYou can watch the video, in which he also tells Jake Tapper he has "a lot [of makeup] on" and looks "very tan." It's so cringy, and it's addressed specifically to Sanders.
posted by zachlipton at 11:11 AM on July 23, 2017 [16 favorites]
Reminder Clapper and Brennan are absolute filth, avatars of secret police, surveillance, drone murder, and torture.
This sort of thing is where that alienation, that lack of trust, comes in.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 11:16 AM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
This sort of thing is where that alienation, that lack of trust, comes in.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 11:16 AM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
Yeah, it's a bit rich that they find their conscience now, and only in a safe space. There's probably a case to be made that both of them belong in jail, but some people think that about Hillary too, so :shrug:.
posted by rhizome at 11:19 AM on July 23, 2017
posted by rhizome at 11:19 AM on July 23, 2017
I despise Paul Ryan immensely and would love to be an out-of-town donor to anyone who can unseat him. Dhartung, what do you think of Randy Bryce? I loved the ad, but this Washington Post article gives me a little pause.
Well, I was a bit uncomfortable bringing this up unasked, but I hope it's OK to mention that my friend (and Paul's neighbor by one block! Cathy Myers is also running for the Democratic nomination. Obviously Bryce has come out of the gate with a strong ad and social media presence, but Cathy is a graduate of the Emerge Wisconsin "bootcamp" to get more women into politics and while I can't claim to be a perfect feminist type person I can get behind that -- we have plenty of white males in Congress already. In contrast to both Bryce (and the would-be carpetbagger David Yankovich), she's trying to build her base organically and locally. She's a teacher, a union leader, a school board member, rides a motorcycle -- she's not any elite out of touch stereotype (okay, she and her husband are partial to electric cars). We all wish that she would at least get a mention in some of the other guy's coverage!
So this whole narrative of "working hard" for your health care doesn't belong in any Democratic political ad, imho. Even if it's red meat for the WWC. Maybe especially because it's red meat for the WWC.
I'll be passing these sentiments on to Cathy. I do wish she had more on her website, but she has talked about stuff like healthcare on videos posted to her candidate Facebook.
posted by dhartung at 11:33 AM on July 23, 2017 [37 favorites]
Well, I was a bit uncomfortable bringing this up unasked, but I hope it's OK to mention that my friend (and Paul's neighbor by one block! Cathy Myers is also running for the Democratic nomination. Obviously Bryce has come out of the gate with a strong ad and social media presence, but Cathy is a graduate of the Emerge Wisconsin "bootcamp" to get more women into politics and while I can't claim to be a perfect feminist type person I can get behind that -- we have plenty of white males in Congress already. In contrast to both Bryce (and the would-be carpetbagger David Yankovich), she's trying to build her base organically and locally. She's a teacher, a union leader, a school board member, rides a motorcycle -- she's not any elite out of touch stereotype (okay, she and her husband are partial to electric cars). We all wish that she would at least get a mention in some of the other guy's coverage!
So this whole narrative of "working hard" for your health care doesn't belong in any Democratic political ad, imho. Even if it's red meat for the WWC. Maybe especially because it's red meat for the WWC.
I'll be passing these sentiments on to Cathy. I do wish she had more on her website, but she has talked about stuff like healthcare on videos posted to her candidate Facebook.
posted by dhartung at 11:33 AM on July 23, 2017 [37 favorites]
It's also worth watching Scaramucci on Russia hacking. He claims he has a secret anonymous source that told him that if Russia hacked the DNC and Podesta emails, they're so good that we would have never seen any evidence. Then Jake Tapper pushes back a little and Scaramucci just admits his source was Trump himself.
And the New York Times would like you to know they didn't run interference for an ISIS leader: How Trump Got It Wrong in Saying The Times ‘Foiled’ Killing of ISIS Leader
posted by zachlipton at 12:02 PM on July 23, 2017 [20 favorites]
And the New York Times would like you to know they didn't run interference for an ISIS leader: How Trump Got It Wrong in Saying The Times ‘Foiled’ Killing of ISIS Leader
posted by zachlipton at 12:02 PM on July 23, 2017 [20 favorites]
CNN @CNN
"All I'm doing by deleting the tweets is sending people a message," @Scaramucci tells @jaketapper in fiery exchangesnpy.tv/2eFpV0Z
Ted Lieu @tedlieu
Dear @Scaramucci: Got your message. You are a hypocrite. And dumb as a rock for thinking you can actually delete posts from the internet.
Scaramucci makes liar out of Trump lawyer: I talked pardons ‘in the Oval Office with the president last week’ (Raw Story, David Edwards)
"All I'm doing by deleting the tweets is sending people a message," @Scaramucci tells @jaketapper in fiery exchangesnpy.tv/2eFpV0Z
Ted Lieu @tedlieu
Dear @Scaramucci: Got your message. You are a hypocrite. And dumb as a rock for thinking you can actually delete posts from the internet.
Scaramucci makes liar out of Trump lawyer: I talked pardons ‘in the Oval Office with the president last week’ (Raw Story, David Edwards)
“This is one of those things about Washington, the convolution and the nature of things,” Scaramucci explained. “I’m in the Oval Office with the president last week and we were talking about that, he says he brought that up, but he doesn’t have to be pardoned, there’s nobody around him that has to be pardoned. He was just making the statement about the power of the pardon.”posted by Room 641-A at 12:03 PM on July 23, 2017 [38 favorites]
“Now, all of the speculation and all of the spin is he’s going to pardon himself,” he added. “The president does not need to pardon himself. And the reason he doesn’t need to pardon himself is he hasn’t done anything wrong.”
Scaramucci’s remarks seemed to be in conflict with the president’s lawyer, Jay Sekulow, who was speaking to ABC News at the same time.
“I want to be clear on this, we have not, and continue to have not, conversations with the President of the United States regarding pardons,” Sekulow said. “Pardons have not been discussed and pardons are not on the table.”
I feel that Scaramucci is another Carter Page. Effective ass kisser to dear leader, dumb as a bag of hammers, and very likely to just blab about incriminating shit without a care in the world.
It'll be hard for Trump to pretend not to know him when he's personally hired him as communications director and put him on any Sunday show that'll have him.
posted by lydhre at 12:13 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
It'll be hard for Trump to pretend not to know him when he's personally hired him as communications director and put him on any Sunday show that'll have him.
posted by lydhre at 12:13 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
Looks like Scaramucci is doing a heck of a job streamlining communications already!
I mean, this kind of thing is inevitable from the org chart. As I understand it, they've got at least Scaramucci, Sekulow, Conway, Scavino, and Trump himself all speaking for Trump and all reporting directly to him. Nobody knows who Sarah Sanders reports to now, and the Chief of Staff does not appear to have any control over communications. Nobody appears to coordinate any kind of message, and why should they bother when Trump will undo it with a tweet the next morning? I'm just surprised they have it together enough that they haven't declared the same week to be two different theme weeks.
posted by zachlipton at 12:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [12 favorites]
I mean, this kind of thing is inevitable from the org chart. As I understand it, they've got at least Scaramucci, Sekulow, Conway, Scavino, and Trump himself all speaking for Trump and all reporting directly to him. Nobody knows who Sarah Sanders reports to now, and the Chief of Staff does not appear to have any control over communications. Nobody appears to coordinate any kind of message, and why should they bother when Trump will undo it with a tweet the next morning? I'm just surprised they have it together enough that they haven't declared the same week to be two different theme weeks.
posted by zachlipton at 12:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [12 favorites]
Scaramucci makes liar out of Trump lawyer: I talked pardons ‘in the Oval Office with the president
They're not sending their best.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 12:17 PM on July 23, 2017 [13 favorites]
They're not sending their best.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 12:17 PM on July 23, 2017 [13 favorites]
>He claims he has a secret anonymous source that told him that if Russia hacked the DNC and Podesta emails, they're so good that we would have never seen any evidence. Then Jake Tapper pushes back a little and Scaramucci just admits his source was Trump himself.
That explains a lot of Trump's behavior if he thinks Russian Intelligence is that powerful.
posted by lumnar at 12:18 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
That explains a lot of Trump's behavior if he thinks Russian Intelligence is that powerful.
posted by lumnar at 12:18 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
Wow, that Mooch guy has just about the deadest eyes I've ever seen.
(too bad he doesn't have the puckered-asshole mouth to "tie the room together", as it were...)
posted by notsnot at 12:19 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
(too bad he doesn't have the puckered-asshole mouth to "tie the room together", as it were...)
posted by notsnot at 12:19 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
That explains a lot of Trump's behavior if he thinks Russian Intelligence is that powerful.
Well, they *did* turn Trump into a Russian asset by just laundering dirty money through his real estate...
posted by mikelieman at 12:24 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
Well, they *did* turn Trump into a Russian asset by just laundering dirty money through his real estate...
posted by mikelieman at 12:24 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
Wow, that Mooch guy has just about the deadest eyes I've ever seen.
lifeless eyes, black eyes, like a doll's eyes
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:25 PM on July 23, 2017 [18 favorites]
lifeless eyes, black eyes, like a doll's eyes
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:25 PM on July 23, 2017 [18 favorites]
I like how when Tapper is like, what anonymous source and Mooch is like "Well how about the PRESIDENT," like the arbiter of reality has decreed it, there can therefore be no questioning of it.
posted by angrycat at 12:27 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 12:27 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
lifeless eyes, black eyes, like a doll's eyes
When he comes after ya, he doesn’t seem to be livin’ until he starts the press briefing, and those black eyes roll over white, and then – aww, then you hear that terrible Scaramuccin’, the briefing room turns gross, and in spite of all the questionin’ and the reportin’, the administration all comes in and trolls ya to pieces…in that first dawn, we lost a hundred men. I don’t know how many republicans, maybe a thousand. I don’t know how many journalists. They averaged six an hour… I’ll never put on a slightly rumpled jacket again. So, eleven hundred journalists went in the briefing room, three hundred and sixteen come out, and Sarah Huckabee Sanders took the rest, July the 24th, 2017. Anyway, we kept press access.
posted by Rust Moranis at 12:35 PM on July 23, 2017 [35 favorites]
When he comes after ya, he doesn’t seem to be livin’ until he starts the press briefing, and those black eyes roll over white, and then – aww, then you hear that terrible Scaramuccin’, the briefing room turns gross, and in spite of all the questionin’ and the reportin’, the administration all comes in and trolls ya to pieces…in that first dawn, we lost a hundred men. I don’t know how many republicans, maybe a thousand. I don’t know how many journalists. They averaged six an hour… I’ll never put on a slightly rumpled jacket again. So, eleven hundred journalists went in the briefing room, three hundred and sixteen come out, and Sarah Huckabee Sanders took the rest, July the 24th, 2017. Anyway, we kept press access.
posted by Rust Moranis at 12:35 PM on July 23, 2017 [35 favorites]
Wow, that Mooch guy has just about the deadest eyes I've ever seen.
I see your Mooch and raise you a Miller.
posted by mmascolino at 12:46 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
I see your Mooch and raise you a Miller.
posted by mmascolino at 12:46 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
and the Chief of Staff does not appear to have any control over communications
When Trump names Arthur Kade the new CoS, that's gonna change
posted by thelonius at 12:47 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
When Trump names Arthur Kade the new CoS, that's gonna change
posted by thelonius at 12:47 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
Some voter fraud in Palm Beach County, somewhat home grown?
Add in some serious reform with my selective service/ voter registration thing. Lotta petty shit that we gotta kill off without making it also harder for people. These efforts at fraud are gonna be around and have been, been hearing shit about it around here for years. :-/
posted by tilde at 12:50 PM on July 23, 2017
Add in some serious reform with my selective service/ voter registration thing. Lotta petty shit that we gotta kill off without making it also harder for people. These efforts at fraud are gonna be around and have been, been hearing shit about it around here for years. :-/
posted by tilde at 12:50 PM on July 23, 2017
Clearly, Trump and his coterie don't know about Burdick v. US. Here's the good bit:
There are substantial differences between legislative immunity and a pardon; the latter carries an imputation of guilt and acceptance of a confession of it, while the former is noncommittal, and tantamount to silence of the witness.posted by Mental Wimp at 12:53 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
They're not sending their best.
Have they got anyone better? They're anti-intellectual, nepotist, cronyist, and loyalty-demanding. It's not really a brain trust. Spicer probably was the best of the lot in terms of experience, and even he can't stand to deal with them anymore.
posted by fedward at 1:14 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
Have they got anyone better? They're anti-intellectual, nepotist, cronyist, and loyalty-demanding. It's not really a brain trust. Spicer probably was the best of the lot in terms of experience, and even he can't stand to deal with them anymore.
posted by fedward at 1:14 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
I propose we do not accept calling Scaramucci "the Mooch."
Scary Moocher, then?
posted by Rykey at 1:14 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
Scary Moocher, then?
posted by Rykey at 1:14 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
Wow, that Mooch guy has just about the deadest eyes I've ever seen.
Look, I know he's an asshole, but boneitis is a serious medical condition, one that nobody deserves to have, and making fun of him for the unavoidable results of his illness is just not funny.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 1:14 PM on July 23, 2017 [27 favorites]
Look, I know he's an asshole, but boneitis is a serious medical condition, one that nobody deserves to have, and making fun of him for the unavoidable results of his illness is just not funny.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 1:14 PM on July 23, 2017 [27 favorites]
I do like calling them by their gangster names, the way it's going to look in the press when they're indicted. Anthony "the Mooch" Scaramucci.
posted by ctmf at 1:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by ctmf at 1:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
I see your Mooch and raise you a Miller yt .
Don't even have to click. The deadest eyes of all.
posted by Room 641-A at 1:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
Don't even have to click. The deadest eyes of all.
posted by Room 641-A at 1:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
I propose we do not accept calling Scaramucci "the Mooch."
How about "Scaramanga"?
posted by Faint of Butt at 1:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
How about "Scaramanga"?
posted by Faint of Butt at 1:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
“A Better Deal: Better Jobs, Better Wages, Better Future” is the new slogan hatched after months of strategy sessions on Capitol Hill and late-night dinners at Washington restaurants hosted by Schumer, Pelosi, Jeffries and other rank-and-file House and Senate lawmakers.
Hey, is the Washington Post reading these threads?
Grumblings about the “Better Deal” plan began late last week when a reporter for the news website Vox tweeted that Democrats’ messaging would include some focus-group language — “better skills, better jobs, better wages” — first used by Sen. Tim Kaine (D-Va.). The reporter later deleted the tweet, but the news tweaked left-wing critics who began tearing apart the alleged slogan, suggesting that “better skills” was an insult to workers — and that the “better” formulation itself evoked the corporate slogan of Papa John’s Pizza.
posted by Bella Donna at 1:17 PM on July 23, 2017 [19 favorites]
Hey, is the Washington Post reading these threads?
Grumblings about the “Better Deal” plan began late last week when a reporter for the news website Vox tweeted that Democrats’ messaging would include some focus-group language — “better skills, better jobs, better wages” — first used by Sen. Tim Kaine (D-Va.). The reporter later deleted the tweet, but the news tweaked left-wing critics who began tearing apart the alleged slogan, suggesting that “better skills” was an insult to workers — and that the “better” formulation itself evoked the corporate slogan of Papa John’s Pizza.
posted by Bella Donna at 1:17 PM on July 23, 2017 [19 favorites]
How about Scary Spice?
posted by wobumingbai at 1:21 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by wobumingbai at 1:21 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
This just in:
Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump
It's very sad that Republicans, even some that were carried over the line on my back, do very little to protect their President.
posted by Room 641-A at 1:22 PM on July 23, 2017 [20 favorites]
Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump
It's very sad that Republicans, even some that were carried over the line on my back, do very little to protect their President.
posted by Room 641-A at 1:22 PM on July 23, 2017 [20 favorites]
Five minutes earlier: "As the phony Russian Witch Hunt continues, two groups are laughing at this excuse for a lost election taking hold, Democrats and Russians!"
posted by christopherious at 1:25 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by christopherious at 1:25 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'm sure that Republicans who spend all day defending Trump's stupidity will be thrilled to learn he doesn't think they're doing a good enough job.
posted by zachlipton at 1:26 PM on July 23, 2017 [25 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 1:26 PM on July 23, 2017 [25 favorites]
That voice is starting to echo pretty hollow.
posted by Mei's lost sandal at 1:27 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Mei's lost sandal at 1:27 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
I love that Trump's lawyers are in continuing non-talks with him about pardons.
"Hey you guys talking about pardons?"
"Nope. We have been not-talking about pardons all morning. All week in fact. We may have been not-talking about pardons for most of our lives. In the grand scheme of things we have barely talked about pardons at all. Pardon talk has only been a small of fraction of this administration's talk. We are currently compiling a list of all the people we need to pardon. Would you like to be on the list?" [fake]
posted by srboisvert at 1:30 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
"Hey you guys talking about pardons?"
"Nope. We have been not-talking about pardons all morning. All week in fact. We may have been not-talking about pardons for most of our lives. In the grand scheme of things we have barely talked about pardons at all. Pardon talk has only been a small of fraction of this administration's talk. We are currently compiling a list of all the people we need to pardon. Would you like to be on the list?" [fake]
posted by srboisvert at 1:30 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
Hey, is the Washington Post reading these threads?
First rule of Fight Club...
posted by mikelieman at 1:33 PM on July 23, 2017 [16 favorites]
First rule of Fight Club...
posted by mikelieman at 1:33 PM on July 23, 2017 [16 favorites]
It's very sad that Republicans, even some that were carried over the line on my back, do very little to protect their President.
When Trump asks the Republicans why, they reply "it is our nature to do so."
posted by SPrintF at 1:40 PM on July 23, 2017 [42 favorites]
When Trump asks the Republicans why, they reply "it is our nature to do so."
posted by SPrintF at 1:40 PM on July 23, 2017 [42 favorites]
Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump
It's very sad that Republicans, even some that were carried over the line on my back, do very little to protect their President.
This poor guy. On the campaign trail he's all "Nobody knows more about the system than me," "I alone can solve our problems," "I have a secret plan to defeat ISIS," and here he finds out the big mean newspapers and Supreme Court justices and Congresspeople and other world leaders are just so unfair and unprotecting. It's almost like taking the job of President means accepting the myriad "unfairnesses" that come your way.
Not that I ever thought Trump was being genuine when he said those stupid things during the campaign... but seriously man, powerful effective asskickers usually don't cry quite so much about how unfair their lot is over public channels. Pick a persona!
posted by Rykey at 1:48 PM on July 23, 2017 [27 favorites]
It's very sad that Republicans, even some that were carried over the line on my back, do very little to protect their President.
This poor guy. On the campaign trail he's all "Nobody knows more about the system than me," "I alone can solve our problems," "I have a secret plan to defeat ISIS," and here he finds out the big mean newspapers and Supreme Court justices and Congresspeople and other world leaders are just so unfair and unprotecting. It's almost like taking the job of President means accepting the myriad "unfairnesses" that come your way.
Not that I ever thought Trump was being genuine when he said those stupid things during the campaign... but seriously man, powerful effective asskickers usually don't cry quite so much about how unfair their lot is over public channels. Pick a persona!
posted by Rykey at 1:48 PM on July 23, 2017 [27 favorites]
Stopped Clock Jennifer Rubin, WaPo: Sessions may be Trump’s Achilles’ heel
One wonders how the brand-new communications director Anthony Scaramucci thinks the White House messaging is going. In the space of 24 hours, the president has managed to convince a great number of Americans that there is something so terrible out there that Trump will never allow the Russian investigation to run its course. (The message here is also: The president is panicking.) Scaramucci might want to keep one thing in mind: At this point in the administration knowingly conveying Trump’s lies or constructing a web of lies to shield the president may land one in a heap of trouble for obstruction of justice, witness intimidation or numerous other charges. He might want to keep contemporaneous notes of his conversations with the president. Just saying.posted by Johnny Wallflower at 2:11 PM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
what is it with the hair on these guys??
it covers the scars from the cranial implants.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 2:19 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
it covers the scars from the cranial implants.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 2:19 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
ICE is using prostitution diversion courts to stalk immigrants
posted by angrycat at 2:32 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 2:32 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
It's very sad that Republicans, even some that were carried over the line on my back, do very little to protect their President.
There are two legislative things happening this weekend: negotiations on the health care bill and the Russia sanctions bill getting reconciled so it gets a House vote on Tuesday.
There's certainly a reading of "protect their President" of Trump not really giving a shit what health care bill gets passed, just that a bill does get passed so he doesn't look like a loser. But the other reading is that forcing Trump to sign or veto a Russia sanctions bill doesn't protect him. From what? Putin's wrath? Kompromat? Giving the Russia scandal even more legs? This seems like one of those pure id tweets that reveals much more than intended.
posted by bluecore at 2:33 PM on July 23, 2017 [18 favorites]
There are two legislative things happening this weekend: negotiations on the health care bill and the Russia sanctions bill getting reconciled so it gets a House vote on Tuesday.
There's certainly a reading of "protect their President" of Trump not really giving a shit what health care bill gets passed, just that a bill does get passed so he doesn't look like a loser. But the other reading is that forcing Trump to sign or veto a Russia sanctions bill doesn't protect him. From what? Putin's wrath? Kompromat? Giving the Russia scandal even more legs? This seems like one of those pure id tweets that reveals much more than intended.
posted by bluecore at 2:33 PM on July 23, 2017 [18 favorites]
Can Congress compel Kislyak to testify? It looks as though he will be going back to Russia soon.
posted by Coventry at 2:42 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Coventry at 2:42 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
ICE is using prostitution diversion courts to stalk immigrants
They really don't know how to endear themselves to popular opinion, do they? No because the big boss has their back. So fuck the proles. They'll deport an American if they want if they look brown and big boss will applaud them for it.
posted by Talez at 2:47 PM on July 23, 2017
They really don't know how to endear themselves to popular opinion, do they? No because the big boss has their back. So fuck the proles. They'll deport an American if they want if they look brown and big boss will applaud them for it.
posted by Talez at 2:47 PM on July 23, 2017
Also, in light of the police shooting in MPLS, these have been popping up.
This in reference to "Harrity indicated that he was startled by a loud sound near the car," as a justification for the shooting.
posted by Talez at 2:50 PM on July 23, 2017 [56 favorites]
This in reference to "Harrity indicated that he was startled by a loud sound near the car," as a justification for the shooting.
posted by Talez at 2:50 PM on July 23, 2017 [56 favorites]
Because, you know, this is where we are as a country right now.
posted by Talez at 2:50 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Talez at 2:50 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
From NYU journalism professor and media critic Jay Rosen.
@jayrosen_nyu
1/ About that “interview” he gave to three Times reporters I have not stopped thinking. A thread to explain why.
2/ After reading the transcript I wanted to locate the horizon and stare at it for an hour or so. Get my bearings. Alas, I was in Manhattan!
3/ The brokenness. The ruin. Hot fracture. His interruptions that he interrupts. It's more than incoherence, it's the obliteration of sense.
4/ What I'm still piecing together, four days after, is how trying to interview him exposes premises under the practice that have gone bust.
5/ Simple example. One might ask: why didn't the reporters follow up and press him on...? But this makes no sense when interviewing Trump.
6/ For the most likely outcome of seeking clarification by way of a follow-up is that he will introduce some new and further confusion.
7/ But the problems go deeper. One premise of interviewing a public official is that the official is more "in the know" than the journalist.
8/ Everything the Times reporters asked about health care shredded that premise. He knows far less than the people seeking answers from him!
9/ If a man who can't grasp the difference between health and life insurance is a source, we need to ask... of what?
10/ It gets worse. An even more basic premise to an interview is that press and politician are separate entities: one questioning the other.
11/ With Trump, this elemental division cannot be assumed. Because he's unsure of his existence outside of being talked about by the media.
12/ At one point Trump can't recall if he's president or pundit, as he sketches his plan to 'blame the Democrats' when Obamacare collapses.
13/ You're not supposed to SAY that. You simply DO it, and let the announcers call the play. But he knows not where he ends and they begin.
14/ Message, argument, position, call: sifting the wreckage of the text, reporters can make from his words a simulacrum of such things, but—
15/ You don't get a sense that he's explaining what existed prior to its being asked about in the interview— or that it will persist after.
16/ Reading the transcript, you see desperation everywhere: a hunger for validation, a dim rage to appear before the judges of appearance.
17/ "Enemies of mine are saying it was the greatest speech ever made on foreign soil by a president... You saw the reviews I got on that."
18/ True: every interview is a performance, a shaping of self for public consumption. And the interviewer joins in that. But in journalism—
19/ — there are no instructions for interviewing the holder of power who lacks a self. "You saw the reviews I got." By letting that pass...
20/ By not saying, "Mr. President, no one we respect thinks that was the greatest speech ever by a US president on foreign soil..."
21/ They were letting him talk, and possibly hang himself. All the cliches apply. But this is not a cliched moment. It's a civic emergency.
22/ The Times reporters were collapsing categories that permit the interview form to make sense at all. This is why I needed my horizon. END
posted by chris24 at 3:12 PM on July 23, 2017 [103 favorites]
@jayrosen_nyu
1/ About that “interview” he gave to three Times reporters I have not stopped thinking. A thread to explain why.
2/ After reading the transcript I wanted to locate the horizon and stare at it for an hour or so. Get my bearings. Alas, I was in Manhattan!
3/ The brokenness. The ruin. Hot fracture. His interruptions that he interrupts. It's more than incoherence, it's the obliteration of sense.
4/ What I'm still piecing together, four days after, is how trying to interview him exposes premises under the practice that have gone bust.
5/ Simple example. One might ask: why didn't the reporters follow up and press him on...? But this makes no sense when interviewing Trump.
6/ For the most likely outcome of seeking clarification by way of a follow-up is that he will introduce some new and further confusion.
7/ But the problems go deeper. One premise of interviewing a public official is that the official is more "in the know" than the journalist.
8/ Everything the Times reporters asked about health care shredded that premise. He knows far less than the people seeking answers from him!
9/ If a man who can't grasp the difference between health and life insurance is a source, we need to ask... of what?
10/ It gets worse. An even more basic premise to an interview is that press and politician are separate entities: one questioning the other.
11/ With Trump, this elemental division cannot be assumed. Because he's unsure of his existence outside of being talked about by the media.
12/ At one point Trump can't recall if he's president or pundit, as he sketches his plan to 'blame the Democrats' when Obamacare collapses.
13/ You're not supposed to SAY that. You simply DO it, and let the announcers call the play. But he knows not where he ends and they begin.
14/ Message, argument, position, call: sifting the wreckage of the text, reporters can make from his words a simulacrum of such things, but—
15/ You don't get a sense that he's explaining what existed prior to its being asked about in the interview— or that it will persist after.
16/ Reading the transcript, you see desperation everywhere: a hunger for validation, a dim rage to appear before the judges of appearance.
17/ "Enemies of mine are saying it was the greatest speech ever made on foreign soil by a president... You saw the reviews I got on that."
18/ True: every interview is a performance, a shaping of self for public consumption. And the interviewer joins in that. But in journalism—
19/ — there are no instructions for interviewing the holder of power who lacks a self. "You saw the reviews I got." By letting that pass...
20/ By not saying, "Mr. President, no one we respect thinks that was the greatest speech ever by a US president on foreign soil..."
21/ They were letting him talk, and possibly hang himself. All the cliches apply. But this is not a cliched moment. It's a civic emergency.
22/ The Times reporters were collapsing categories that permit the interview form to make sense at all. This is why I needed my horizon. END
posted by chris24 at 3:12 PM on July 23, 2017 [103 favorites]
*deletes the chunk of this comment in which I post Jay Rosen's tweets*
I think the problem I have is that this becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. Reporters don't press him on health care policy because his answers simply cause more confusion, which makes a certain amount of sense because why waste your time when there are so many things to ask about, and yet we wind up going six months without him ever having to defend or even express basic knowledge of a single element of his signature policy initiative. And the fact that we're in that situation now is a tremendous press failure. I'm not at all convinced that the inevitable uselessness of the answer absolves reporters of the responsibility for asking the question.
posted by zachlipton at 3:26 PM on July 23, 2017 [37 favorites]
I think the problem I have is that this becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. Reporters don't press him on health care policy because his answers simply cause more confusion, which makes a certain amount of sense because why waste your time when there are so many things to ask about, and yet we wind up going six months without him ever having to defend or even express basic knowledge of a single element of his signature policy initiative. And the fact that we're in that situation now is a tremendous press failure. I'm not at all convinced that the inevitable uselessness of the answer absolves reporters of the responsibility for asking the question.
posted by zachlipton at 3:26 PM on July 23, 2017 [37 favorites]
It's very sad that Republicans, even some that were carried over the line on my back, do very little to protect their President.
and when i asked the donald why there were places on the beach where there were only one set of footprints he said ...
oh, god, no, i just can't
posted by pyramid termite at 3:29 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
and when i asked the donald why there were places on the beach where there were only one set of footprints he said ...
oh, god, no, i just can't
posted by pyramid termite at 3:29 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
yup, turns out the President is a complete dumbass
posted by tivalasvegas at 3:33 PM on July 23, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 3:33 PM on July 23, 2017 [10 favorites]
They haven't even brought impeachment charges against him, nevermind tried or convicted, despite many, many impeachable offenses being on record. They are literally doing everything in their power to protect the president.
posted by mrgoat at 3:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by mrgoat at 3:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
Daily Mail via The Hill: Trump will have a "dummy visit" [sic] to the UK this year, to see if he can behave himself, before he earns an official state visit and gets to ride in the golden carriage and meet the Queen. And maybe they'll let him pretend to drive a double-decker bus!
In 2026 this is going to make a great episode of Netflix's "The Crown". Alec Baldwin will really look the part.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:37 PM on July 23, 2017 [10 favorites]
In 2026 this is going to make a great episode of Netflix's "The Crown". Alec Baldwin will really look the part.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:37 PM on July 23, 2017 [10 favorites]
Reporters don't press him on health care policy because his answers simply cause more confusion
And that's fine as far as it goes, but whether they let him stream his consciousness by padding him along, "Yeah totally, Mr. President," like in the published NYT interview, or stream his consciousness by needling him for details. It's going to be a mess either way, but if the journos press him, they can at least say they tried, and even better if they start to discover a productive means of interacting with him (even if it's against his better judgement). That is, figuring out how to trick him into being honest.
posted by rhizome at 3:39 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
And that's fine as far as it goes, but whether they let him stream his consciousness by padding him along, "Yeah totally, Mr. President," like in the published NYT interview, or stream his consciousness by needling him for details. It's going to be a mess either way, but if the journos press him, they can at least say they tried, and even better if they start to discover a productive means of interacting with him (even if it's against his better judgement). That is, figuring out how to trick him into being honest.
posted by rhizome at 3:39 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
I'm sure there are plenty of journalists who would love to press him. He does not agree to interviews with those journalists. If Maggie Haberman were to press him, he would not do interviews with her either. We'd see him interviewed only by Fox and Breitbart.
posted by OnceUponATime at 3:45 PM on July 23, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by OnceUponATime at 3:45 PM on July 23, 2017 [12 favorites]
I am glad that he's still foolish enough to agree to revealing interviews with legitimate news sources, even if they earn those interviews with a strong dose of fluff and pandering. Pandafluffing.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:47 PM on July 23, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:47 PM on July 23, 2017 [11 favorites]
"Scary Spice" is perfect, and brilliant. For extra points combine it with ctmf's Mafia name idea:
Anthony "Scary Spice" Scaramucci
posted by msalt at 3:53 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
Anthony "Scary Spice" Scaramucci
posted by msalt at 3:53 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
Trump is actually Fox's propaganda wing.
Worse, he's their Ops Section Chief. They've moved from talking shit to making it happen, and he's in charge of that.
(McConnell is Planning and Putin is Logistics. But who's the Incident Commander? Probably also Putin)
posted by ctmf at 3:56 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
Worse, he's their Ops Section Chief. They've moved from talking shit to making it happen, and he's in charge of that.
(McConnell is Planning and Putin is Logistics. But who's the Incident Commander? Probably also Putin)
posted by ctmf at 3:56 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
It's very sad that Republicans, even some that were carried over the line on my back, do very little to protect their President.
Sarah Binder to the rescue. With an assist from Nolan McCarty.
Sarah pointed out that around 90\% of Republicans outperformed Trump in their districts, which makes it unlikely that they were "carried over" by Trump. Nolan pointed out that you can only be carried over the line if you just barely squeak out the win, which narrows the number of people Trump carried over the line to the intersection of people who underperformed Trump and who just barely won. All three of them.
But you should still look at the pretty pitcher Sarah made, because she maded it for you.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 3:58 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
Sarah Binder to the rescue. With an assist from Nolan McCarty.
Sarah pointed out that around 90\% of Republicans outperformed Trump in their districts, which makes it unlikely that they were "carried over" by Trump. Nolan pointed out that you can only be carried over the line if you just barely squeak out the win, which narrows the number of people Trump carried over the line to the intersection of people who underperformed Trump and who just barely won. All three of them.
But you should still look at the pretty pitcher Sarah made, because she maded it for you.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 3:58 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
Apparently, before the election, Rupert Murdoch instructed Roger Ailes to promote Clinton over Trump. Ailes ignored him.
Good News: Ailes is... no longer in charge...
Bad news: Trump is now President of the United States. This may have modified Rupert Murdoch's political calculus.
But it's not impossible to imagine future events precipitating a scenario where the network abandons the man its owner so obviously detests.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:03 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
Good News: Ailes is... no longer in charge...
Bad news: Trump is now President of the United States. This may have modified Rupert Murdoch's political calculus.
But it's not impossible to imagine future events precipitating a scenario where the network abandons the man its owner so obviously detests.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:03 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
Sarah pointed out that around 90\% of Republicans outperformed Trump in their districts, which makes it unlikely that they were "carried over" by Trump.
Then why the assumption (one I make myself) that the Rs in Congress won't stand up to him because they're afraid his supporters will vote them out? Serious question.
posted by Rykey at 4:03 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
Then why the assumption (one I make myself) that the Rs in Congress won't stand up to him because they're afraid his supporters will vote them out? Serious question.
posted by Rykey at 4:03 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
Then why the assumption (one I make myself) that the Rs in Congress won't stand up to him because they're afraid his supporters will vote them out? Serious question.
I think many of these folks are not worried about losing the general election (which would probably go to anyone with R after their name), but rather losing the Republican primaries to diehard Trumpists.
posted by dhens at 4:07 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
I think many of these folks are not worried about losing the general election (which would probably go to anyone with R after their name), but rather losing the Republican primaries to diehard Trumpists.
posted by dhens at 4:07 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
I'll be damned if I can find a Safety Officer anywhere in this administration though.
posted by zachlipton at 4:09 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 4:09 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
Finally, this one morphed into something like Trump porn fan-fic
I'll be in my bunker
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 4:10 PM on July 23, 2017 [10 favorites]
I'll be in my bunker
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 4:10 PM on July 23, 2017 [10 favorites]
Kushner is a CASTOR clone
OMG, yes. Has the glitching started yet?
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 4:13 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
OMG, yes. Has the glitching started yet?
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 4:13 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
Mark Zuckerberg is broadcasting live from his backyard and talking about the benefits of universal basic income. Leaving aside his qualifications for office, I think he is a charismatic person in this context.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:25 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:25 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
Reporters don't press him on health care policy because his answers simply cause more confusion, which makes a certain amount of sense because why waste your time when there are so many things to ask about,
One of the reporters was asked why they didn't follow up (maybe by Rachel?) and he said you can't. The conversation moves too fast and in too many directions. He looked shell shocked, really.
posted by Room 641-A at 4:27 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
One of the reporters was asked why they didn't follow up (maybe by Rachel?) and he said you can't. The conversation moves too fast and in too many directions. He looked shell shocked, really.
posted by Room 641-A at 4:27 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
He talks like he is borked out of his mind on amphetamines while simultaneously suffering cognitive defects. You can't pin that down. I have no idea how they should handle it.
posted by Justinian at 4:30 PM on July 23, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 4:30 PM on July 23, 2017 [11 favorites]
i... i think that is the first time the words "mark zuckerberg" and "charismatic" have ever appeared in proximity to each other without the phrase "is not" between them.
posted by entropicamericana at 4:32 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 4:32 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
Mark Zuckerberg is broadcasting live
posted by Room 641-A at 4:33 PM on July 23, 2017 [26 favorites]
You must log in to continueOh god, President Zuckerberg is going to force me to have a Facebook page, isn't he?
posted by Room 641-A at 4:33 PM on July 23, 2017 [26 favorites]
I've had this experience talking to certain people - you get overwhelmed making "mental notes" to get back to something and trying to structure the conversation in a logical order. But there's just too many things. The only thing you can do is latch onto one thing per sentence to ask about and let the other ones go. If you waste time thinking about which thing would be most important or try to set up a logical argument like a debate, you're behind and lost your chance. You just have to let 90% of it get away and follow the spaghetti structure.
And I think more people need to go in with a short list of questions they actually want an answer to and refuse to move on - keep asking the same question. Trump's the master at saying something so attractive to follow (usually by being spectacularly dumb) that you forget what you asked.
posted by ctmf at 4:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
And I think more people need to go in with a short list of questions they actually want an answer to and refuse to move on - keep asking the same question. Trump's the master at saying something so attractive to follow (usually by being spectacularly dumb) that you forget what you asked.
posted by ctmf at 4:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
'Oh my God!' he cried as the phone fell from his fingers. 'Do you know what he wants? He wants us to click Like. He wants everybody to click Like!'”
posted by delfin at 4:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by delfin at 4:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
Charlie Warzel, Infowarzel: "Journalistic Integrity Is Dead." Is The Mainstream Media Next?
For outlets like Breitbart and Gateway Pundit every editorial decision and headline and pull-quote is in service of the ultimate destruction of the legacy press. Journalism, in the pro-Trump media ecosystem, is less a craft to inform a readership or get at some greater truth than it is a convenient tool to wage an ideological war — one that, if won, means that they stand to profit and gain influence. Here's Boyle in his own words:posted by Johnny Wallflower at 4:43 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
"The media is an industry in crisis that refuses to admit that it’s an industry in crisis. It’s almost like an alcoholic refusing to admit that they have a problem...Journalistic integrity is dead. There is no such thing anymore. So, everything is about weaponization of information."
Those last three sentences are incredibly important. Boyle's statement that "journalistic integrity is dead" isn't just a criticism of the MSM — it's an admission of the pro-Trump media's tactics. In Boyle's eyes, the days of Cronkite-style 'fair and balanced' reporting without ideology are done so just get over it and realize that we're in an information war without rules. The only goal is to win at all costs.
'Oh my God!' he cried as the phone fell from his fingers. 'Do you know what he wants? He wants us to click Like. He wants everybody to click Like!'”
'But it was all right, everything was all right, the struggle was finished. He had won the victory over himself. He had Liked Mark Zuckerberg's posts.'
posted by mordax at 4:44 PM on July 23, 2017 [49 favorites]
'But it was all right, everything was all right, the struggle was finished. He had won the victory over himself. He had Liked Mark Zuckerberg's posts.'
posted by mordax at 4:44 PM on July 23, 2017 [49 favorites]
Someone on Twitter asked some media person (I forget who) why they keep inviting Kellyanne Conway on the interview shows when they know she's just going to lie and specious-reason her ass off. I've been thinking about that, and I don't think it's just for spectacle.
1) If the administration offers to send someone to talk to you, that's a tricky situation. You're accusing the admin of being uncommunicative, while you're simultaneously refusing to listen?
2) I honestly think many of the show hosts think they're going to be the one to break her. (they're not)
posted by ctmf at 4:57 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
1) If the administration offers to send someone to talk to you, that's a tricky situation. You're accusing the admin of being uncommunicative, while you're simultaneously refusing to listen?
2) I honestly think many of the show hosts think they're going to be the one to break her. (they're not)
posted by ctmf at 4:57 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
Then why the assumption (one I make myself) that the Rs in Congress won't stand up to him because they're afraid his supporters will vote them out? Serious question.
In addition to what dhens said, the situation is probably more complicated than that.
Say you're an R MC and you've won your last few elections with 60-65% of the vote, but that includes 25% of voters who are stereotypical racist fuckwits. They've been voting for you since 1998 or whenever, so they're not Trump supporters in the sense of people that Trump brought to the polls. But racist fuckwits lurrrrrve Trump. So if you aren't trumpy enough, these people might get annoyed and stay home. And if that happens bubba you are fucked, because you can't win without that racist-jackwagon slice of the voters.
But Trump still didn't help you -- these people had been reliable R voters for decades. In the absence of Trump, they were going to vote for you. If Trump hadn't happened, you wouldn't need to worry about them. But Trump did happen, and activated the trumpiness of the racist fuckwits, so now if you stand up to Trump they'll doubt your commitment to Sparkle Motion and maybe just stay home in 2018, or vote for a *really* crazypants person with Trump's seal of approval.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 4:59 PM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
In addition to what dhens said, the situation is probably more complicated than that.
Say you're an R MC and you've won your last few elections with 60-65% of the vote, but that includes 25% of voters who are stereotypical racist fuckwits. They've been voting for you since 1998 or whenever, so they're not Trump supporters in the sense of people that Trump brought to the polls. But racist fuckwits lurrrrrve Trump. So if you aren't trumpy enough, these people might get annoyed and stay home. And if that happens bubba you are fucked, because you can't win without that racist-jackwagon slice of the voters.
But Trump still didn't help you -- these people had been reliable R voters for decades. In the absence of Trump, they were going to vote for you. If Trump hadn't happened, you wouldn't need to worry about them. But Trump did happen, and activated the trumpiness of the racist fuckwits, so now if you stand up to Trump they'll doubt your commitment to Sparkle Motion and maybe just stay home in 2018, or vote for a *really* crazypants person with Trump's seal of approval.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 4:59 PM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
Mentioned in the Infowarzel issue I posted above: This Twitter Bot Will Tell You Every Time The Trumps Unfollow Somebody On Twitter
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 4:59 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
The bot — @TrumpsAlert — claims to track "Trump family follow and unfollows" with the aim of trying to "figure out what is going on inside the White House." It was created by James O'Malley, a freelance writer currently serving as GizmodoUK's editor. O'Malley got the idea after seeing a tweet claiming Donald Trump had unfollowed Kellyanne Conway, which triggered a rash of speculation about trouble in the West Wing.
"It reminded me of how North Korea is tracked by the west - by observing photos and messages coming from state television, analysts try to figure out who is in and out of favor," O'Malley told BuzzFeed News over Twitter. "Given that the Trump Administration is essentially the same thing - Royal Court politics - I figured that watching the inner circle’s Twitter accounts could help us understand the Kremlinology of what is going on in the White House."
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 4:59 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
3) Attractive blonde women are more visually appealing than puffy guys in poorly-fitting suits
Those aren't my standards, but even the interview shows are subject to market forces...
posted by Rykey at 5:02 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
Those aren't my standards, but even the interview shows are subject to market forces...
posted by Rykey at 5:02 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
So, apparently, the Internet has now picked up the other incredulous thing from Mooch's interview where he makes a Freudian slip where he calls Trump "President Chump".
So yeah, that also happened.
posted by Talez at 5:05 PM on July 23, 2017 [13 favorites]
So yeah, that also happened.
posted by Talez at 5:05 PM on July 23, 2017 [13 favorites]
Journalism, in the pro-Trump media ecosystem, is less a craft to inform a readership or get at some greater truth than it is a convenient tool to wage an ideological war — one that, if won, means that they stand to profit and gain influence
This is nothing new. Ever hear of the era of "yellow journalism"? Journalistic integrity is a very young concept, and it's less on its deathbed than being smothered in its crib.
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:07 PM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
This is nothing new. Ever hear of the era of "yellow journalism"? Journalistic integrity is a very young concept, and it's less on its deathbed than being smothered in its crib.
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:07 PM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
yup, turns out the President is a complete dumbass
"THE BEST DUMBASS EVER. EVERYONE SAYS SO. AND I'M A WAY BETTER DUMBASS THAN HILARY, THAT I CAN TELL YOU."
[fake]
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:23 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
"THE BEST DUMBASS EVER. EVERYONE SAYS SO. AND I'M A WAY BETTER DUMBASS THAN HILARY, THAT I CAN TELL YOU."
[fake]
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:23 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
He talks like he is borked out of his mind on amphetamines while simultaneously suffering cognitive defects. You can't pin that down. I have no idea how they should handle it.
sedatives, handcuffs and leg irons.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:35 PM on July 23, 2017 [12 favorites]
sedatives, handcuffs and leg irons.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 5:35 PM on July 23, 2017 [12 favorites]
Scaramucci is the guy in the infomercial at 3am telling you how to get rich buying houses for no money down.
posted by Room 641-A at 5:52 PM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by Room 641-A at 5:52 PM on July 23, 2017 [14 favorites]
Can A Super PAC And Its New Billionaire Donors Help Set The Republican Party's Future? - "Corry Bliss, the 35-year-old executive director of the House GOP-approved super PAC Congressional Leadership Fund and nonprofit American Action Network, a related organization, is on a mission to preserve the House majority in the 2018 midterm elections. The incumbent president's party historically loses seats during midterms, but Bliss says he has a strategy to defy history, and he is trying to woo some of the nation's richest to bankroll it."
posted by kliuless at 5:59 PM on July 23, 2017 [33 favorites]
The PAC’s message resounded thanks to a simple yet effective pitch: hyper-targeted local efforts in congressional races. “There are a lot of parallels between the business world and the campaign world,” Bliss says. He tells investors to move away from spending millions on TV ads, which he describes as the old super PAC model, and bet their money on localized data and groundwork efforts with an emphasis on congressional candidates’ local agendas. CLF still spends most of its money on ads against Democratic candidates, particularly House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, but Bliss sees the money spent on groundwork as the key to its success...The Sinclair Revolution Will Be Televised. It'll Just Have Low Production Values - "To left-leaning viewers only just becoming aware of the company's reach, Sinclair is positioned to flip a switch and turn those 173 stations' newscasts—currently delivering bulletins on weather, school closings, and local affairs—into a cohesive network that pushes a Fox News-esque worldview of outrage and conflict into individual cities, counties, and towns."
It bet $2.3 million on opposing Rob Quist, the Democratic candidate in the Montana special election to fill U.S. Secretary of Interior Ryan Zinke’s seat on June 20. Quist lost. In special elections in Kansas and South Carolina, for the vacated seats of the new CIA director Mike Pompeo and Mick Mulvaney, now director of the Office of Management and Budget, respectively, CLF had success in supporting Republican candidates.
The Congressional Leadership Fund was also at the center of Georgia’s hotly contested June 20 special election to fill the seat vacated by now Secretary of Health and Human Services, Tom Price. CLF spent more than $2 million on groundwork and $6.2 million on ads against the Democratic candidate Jon Ossoff. Even though Ossoff, who had a slight advantage in the polls ahead of the election, significantly outspent Republican Karen Handel (he raised $23.6 million to Handel’s $4.6 million), the super PAC was able to help sway the results with its targeted groundwork efforts.
While Ossoff held a small lead in the polls in April, the PAC made a list of 75,000 reluctant Republican voters who it believed needed some persuasion to get out and vote in the special election. CLF delivered voters’ absentee ballots to their houses, asked them every day to turn in their ballot, and urged them to vote early. The PAC knocked on over 90,000 doors just in Georgia, according to the director. “I’m not sure [Handel] would have won without CLF and our ground game,” Bliss says, “I think it just proves again that a smart campaign, a data driven campaign and an organized field program can make a difference.”
The real difference with CLF is its approach to local field offices. “CLF is proud to be the first super PAC to execute a national field program,” Bliss said in a statement on July 10. The PAC’s field program now has a total of twelve offices in California, Florida, Georgia, Montana, Arizona, New York, and Nebraska. Bliss and his team are hoping to open eight more by the end of the year.
With the midterm elections looming on the horizon, the Congressional Leadership Fund is on a roll. Just exactly who is cheering on election day, however, won’t necessarily be clear. While CLF is required by the IRS to list its donors, the money it receives from its sister arm, the American Action Network, is more opaque. The network donated $7 million to the CLF in 2017, but there is no way to know if those funds come from individual billionaires or elsewhere, according to Brent Ferguson of the Brennan Center. These types of nonprofits, also known as social welfare organizations, are not allowed to participate in partisan politics. Yet they get to do so through lump sum donations to super PACs like CLF. “That’s what we call the Russian doll problem,” Ferguson says, explaining that the system hides the identity of the actual donors since nonprofits make the contributions to the PACs.
posted by kliuless at 5:59 PM on July 23, 2017 [33 favorites]
BuzzFeed: Anthony Scaramucci On Hot Mic: I Called On CNN To Send A Message To Jeff Zucker
posted by zachlipton at 6:07 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
After his interview with CNN’s Jake Tapper, Scaramucci confirmed that he spoke on the phone with Sam Feist, CNN’s Washington bureau chief.This once again contradicts Sekulow's "pardons have not been discussed." I also want to know what is fundamentally wrong in someone's head that would cause them to believe Breitbart represents the right and CNN the left or why he would think calling on a White House reporter from one of the country's largest news outlets would be a special symbol of deescalation rather than perfectly normal business.
According to the transcript, Scaramucci offered pleasantries about when the two could get together before moving on to business.
“I called on Sara on Friday for a reason. I want to make sure you know that,” Scaramucci said, referring to CNN White House correspondent Sara Murray, according to the transcript. “But then I went on Breitbart after that for a reason,” he added, referring to a Saturday interview on Breitbart’s radio broadcast where he praised the right-wing site.
“I’m trying to deescalate the tension across the entire media spectrum,” Scaramucci told BuzzFeed News in an interview on Sunday night. “Breitbart would be on the right and CNN would be on the left. I intentionally sought out both to send a symbolic message that we are trying to deescalate.”
“The president feels that 97% of [CNN’s] coverage is about him, and 93% of the 97% is decidedly negative. We’re hoping that we can change it,” Scaramucci told BuzzFeed News.
...
Scaramucci also told Feist that he wants to have an “honest conversation” and adds a characteristic “I love you, man.” He noted that there a lot of attractive people around him, then joked that he’s probably not allowed to say that on a hot mic.
...
While Scaramucci has an ease with the press, per the transcript, he also made clear his frustrations over media coverage, saying that the president only talked about the presidential pardon for “two minutes in the Oval Office” and it was “nonsense” that “everyone” is saying he’s going to pardon himself.
posted by zachlipton at 6:07 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
The Congressional Leadership Fund is doing for the Republicans EXACTLY what I feel the Democrats SHOULD be doing. And in the Georgia election, "$2 million on groundwork... a list of 75,000 reluctant Republican voters who it believed needed some persuasion to get out and vote in the special election. CLF delivered voters’ absentee ballots to their houses, asked them every day to turn in their ballot, and urged them to vote early. The PAC knocked on over 90,000 doors just in Georgia". Wow.
“Breitbart would be on the right and CNN would be on the left."
Actually CNN would be on the "give both sides their say", like these Centrists.
And that is NOT journalistic integrity; it's trying to avoid alienating anyone by only telling the truth...
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:30 PM on July 23, 2017 [12 favorites]
“Breitbart would be on the right and CNN would be on the left."
Actually CNN would be on the "give both sides their say", like these Centrists.
And that is NOT journalistic integrity; it's trying to avoid alienating anyone by only telling the truth...
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:30 PM on July 23, 2017 [12 favorites]
Mother Jones strikes me as a solidly leftist, non-crazy publication.
posted by jackbishop at 6:37 PM on July 23, 2017 [37 favorites]
posted by jackbishop at 6:37 PM on July 23, 2017 [37 favorites]
When the dude says "left" individuals frequenting Metafilter should probably read "liberal."
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 6:38 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 6:38 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
From the mild diversion files, one of our local interviewers (the incomparable Kim Hill) chews up the US ambassador to NZ, Scott Brown:
"We're talking about a president who says on record, he clutches woman by the pussy."posted by Paragon at 6:47 PM on July 23, 2017 [61 favorites]
And then there’s the most genius moment, where Kim Hill appears to channel Ursula the Sea Witch at her most violent and deadly. Scott Brown says that Donald Trump paid a price for saying that and Kim Hill replies, “What was the price?”
She repeats, suddenly channeling Eartha Kitt at her most lethal and dangerous, “What was the price?” (The emphasis is my own, but I guarantee you that Kim Hill is perfectly fluent in spoken italics.)
“He was criticised for it, and that was the price he paid? … Can you apologise for a basic attitude of misogyny?”
Funfact: Mother Jones is buried in the town next to the one I grew up in.
If Mother Jones is dead and buried then who the hell am I paying a subscription to?
posted by Talez at 6:51 PM on July 23, 2017 [10 favorites]
If Mother Jones is dead and buried then who the hell am I paying a subscription to?
posted by Talez at 6:51 PM on July 23, 2017 [10 favorites]
If Mother Jones is dead and buried then who the hell am I paying a subscription to?
Pay for the dead. Fight like hell for the living.
posted by MonkeyToes at 6:52 PM on July 23, 2017 [31 favorites]
Pay for the dead. Fight like hell for the living.
posted by MonkeyToes at 6:52 PM on July 23, 2017 [31 favorites]
Alternet is wingnuts.
ALL the "right" media entities are wingnuts, so that's the equivalent. "Reality has a Liberal bias" isn't totally true, but is closer to the truth.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:58 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
ALL the "right" media entities are wingnuts, so that's the equivalent. "Reality has a Liberal bias" isn't totally true, but is closer to the truth.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:58 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
FYI, the leftist alternative to wingnut is actually "moonbat".
posted by Talez at 7:01 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by Talez at 7:01 PM on July 23, 2017 [7 favorites]
ADAPT continues to put themselves on the line to save us all from the GOP's efforts to take away healthcare. Tonight they are starting a campout in DC.
They've been working tirelessly to fight the GOP, getting arrested across the country and doing their best to educate people about what Trumpcare means.
Please call, fax, email and visit your senators to ask them to vote no on Trumpcare.
posted by mcduff at 7:03 PM on July 23, 2017 [35 favorites]
They've been working tirelessly to fight the GOP, getting arrested across the country and doing their best to educate people about what Trumpcare means.
Please call, fax, email and visit your senators to ask them to vote no on Trumpcare.
posted by mcduff at 7:03 PM on July 23, 2017 [35 favorites]
Trump's DOJ gears up for crackdown on marijuana
The raids are coming
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
The raids are coming
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
Who's going to pay for them? They can't use federal money to raid dispensaries in states that have legal recreational and medical marijuana.
posted by Talez at 7:25 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Talez at 7:25 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/449698/civil-asset-forfeiture-law-enforcement-scam-expanded-jeff-sessions
posted by Heywood Mogroot III at 7:33 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Heywood Mogroot III at 7:33 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
They can't use federal money ...
Haha, rules are for losers man, losers!
They'll just raid anyway.
posted by aramaic at 7:34 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
Haha, rules are for losers man, losers!
They'll just raid anyway.
posted by aramaic at 7:34 PM on July 23, 2017 [3 favorites]
Yes the absolute numbers are large because...
Because the absolute numbers are large.
Can you cannot count votes? Solve White Cis Male Problems, with a clearly defined agenda, and WE WIN. ALSO, at the same time! We solve the problems of being a woman, the problems of being trans, the problems of being queer, the problems of being a Born Here minority, the problems of decent undocumented Americans living the American Dream, employing people and increasing capital. The problems of the desperate because they read the poem at the base of the statue of Liberty, the problems of the middle class who are now poor... Put us all together, and we can shove over the Trumpist monarchy, topple it into oblivion.
PUT. US. ALL. TOGETHER.
Make your struggle mine, and I will go down swinging for you and yours.
Nitpick away.
If Metafilter does not understand that... I dunno where to turn to next.
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:34 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
Because the absolute numbers are large.
Can you cannot count votes? Solve White Cis Male Problems, with a clearly defined agenda, and WE WIN. ALSO, at the same time! We solve the problems of being a woman, the problems of being trans, the problems of being queer, the problems of being a Born Here minority, the problems of decent undocumented Americans living the American Dream, employing people and increasing capital. The problems of the desperate because they read the poem at the base of the statue of Liberty, the problems of the middle class who are now poor... Put us all together, and we can shove over the Trumpist monarchy, topple it into oblivion.
PUT. US. ALL. TOGETHER.
Make your struggle mine, and I will go down swinging for you and yours.
Nitpick away.
If Metafilter does not understand that... I dunno where to turn to next.
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:34 PM on July 23, 2017 [9 favorites]
Who is reliably, coherently leftist? Democracy Now? Alternet is wingnuts. NPR and MSNBC are center. Huffpo is clickbait.
Who gives a fuck? The 'leftist' media repeatedly ignored, downplayed, and flat out denied the Russia story. That alone should make them wirth ignoring.
posted by steady-state strawberry at 7:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
Who gives a fuck? The 'leftist' media repeatedly ignored, downplayed, and flat out denied the Russia story. That alone should make them wirth ignoring.
posted by steady-state strawberry at 7:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
Trump is giving a prepared statement on healthcare tomorrow. I think this is the pivot, guys! It's gonna be a reasonable bipartisan solution!
posted by Justinian at 7:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 7:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [11 favorites]
Well played Justinian, you got me to say "For fucks sake" out loud, when I didn't know I could still muster the eloquence.
posted by gofargogo at 7:42 PM on July 23, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by gofargogo at 7:42 PM on July 23, 2017 [11 favorites]
NYT: Anthony Scaramucci, New Communications Chief, Woos Trump on TV
posted by zachlipton at 7:45 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
On the talk shows, there was little by way of detailed discussion of Mr. Trump’s agenda, perhaps a product of Mr. Scaramucci’s recent arrival in the role — which perhaps also explained a contradictory message aired on Sunday. Regarding the new Russian sanctions legislation agreed to by House and Senate conferees, Mr. Scaramucci said the president had not yet made up his mind about signing them, a statement that was at odds with one by the new press secretary, Sarah Huckabee Sanders.So that's at least twice in his first weekend on the job that he's contradicted other members of the communications team.
“My bad,” Mr. Scaramucci told a New York Times reporter, taking ownership of his remark and apparently rejecting a round of on-background quotes from other White House aides insisting that he had said the same thing as Ms. Sanders.
posted by zachlipton at 7:45 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
Trump is giving a prepared statement on healthcare tomorrow. I think this is the pivot, guys! It's gonna be a reasonable bipartisan solution!
It will be the latest Senate plan but with solar panels on top of it.
posted by peeedro at 7:48 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
It will be the latest Senate plan but with solar panels on top of it.
posted by peeedro at 7:48 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
You're an optimist. I'm expecting "We must repeal Obamacare because it is collapsing! And to ensure it is collapsing here are the list of things I'm about to do to make it collapse!" Followed by a bunch of sabotage like stopping the payments to insurance companies and such.
posted by Justinian at 7:51 PM on July 23, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 7:51 PM on July 23, 2017 [10 favorites]
Fluttering Helfire, Talking Points Memo is very left, but they do some extremely solid journalism nowadays, and Josh Marshall has been spot-on with how big the Russia thing was going to get.
posted by rockindata at 7:51 PM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by rockindata at 7:51 PM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
I agree with Slap*Happy's point that we can win by joining all the issues together. Whether or not the statistics about nondecreasing death rates are correct (my professional opinion is that they're not; Gelman's analysis seems correct) , addressing the problems of rural whites need not conflict with addressing other neglected populations. A better deal for everyone.
posted by Mental Wimp at 7:55 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Mental Wimp at 7:55 PM on July 23, 2017 [2 favorites]
Not only has Josh Marshall done a great job of exploring the possible magnitude of the scandal, he's also tried to be as skeptical as possible regarding that magnitude. It turns out, that skepticism was unnecessary.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:56 PM on July 23, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:56 PM on July 23, 2017 [13 favorites]
If Trump intends to have Mueller fired, and to open a new portal to hell, it occurs to me that now is the time.
It would be unwise to wait until Congress is under the scrutiny of election season. Indeed, every additional day the President waits to act may bring new evidence of illegality to light, making it harder for Congress to turn a willfully blind eye to the new constitutional order of Presidential Infallability. It would, of course, be potentially catastrophic to wait until Congress might be partially or wholly controlled by Democrats.
The reason behind a termination of Mueller is to prevent an investigation of the Trump Empire. What benefit is there in temporarily allowing the investigation to proceed? If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done quickly.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:08 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
It would be unwise to wait until Congress is under the scrutiny of election season. Indeed, every additional day the President waits to act may bring new evidence of illegality to light, making it harder for Congress to turn a willfully blind eye to the new constitutional order of Presidential Infallability. It would, of course, be potentially catastrophic to wait until Congress might be partially or wholly controlled by Democrats.
The reason behind a termination of Mueller is to prevent an investigation of the Trump Empire. What benefit is there in temporarily allowing the investigation to proceed? If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done quickly.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:08 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
I would hardly characterize TPM as "very left" myself.
I wouldn't characterize it as "left" at all.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:11 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
I wouldn't characterize it as "left" at all.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:11 PM on July 23, 2017 [4 favorites]
TPM is firmly on the left end of the mainstream. I don't know what you guys are on about. Sure they're not full-on socialist or whatever but saying they aren't even left is disconnected from political reality in the US.
posted by Justinian at 8:32 PM on July 23, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 8:32 PM on July 23, 2017 [17 favorites]
Mod note: HARD PASS on you guys fighting over whether something qualifies as left.
posted by Eyebrows McGee (staff) at 8:37 PM on July 23, 2017 [70 favorites]
posted by Eyebrows McGee (staff) at 8:37 PM on July 23, 2017 [70 favorites]
I'm going to highlight Murmimor's comment because I previously overlooked it due to its nature as a huge fucking wall of text, but. oh boy.
Trump started his birther crusade in 2011, a couple of years before the now-infamous 2013 Miss Universe Pageant in Moscow. That doesn't necessarily rule out that he had received notice of his kompromat prior to 2011 and had begun to act in towards the benefit of the Russian nation state prior to that time. I certainly agree that no fabled piss-tape would be as effective a motivational tool as evidence of Trump's dealings with organized crime, Russian or otherwise. Trump may dislike being humiliated, but he really dislikes the prospect of a jail sentence.
If Trump really was working for Putin from 2011 or earlier (something for which I admit we lack evidence), it explains a lot of things. We have all wondered how this reality television buffoon, born into easy riches, frequently an actor within bankruptcies and frauds, became such a potent geopolitical force. If he had a potent geopolitical force behind him from the start of his political career, it is easy to understand.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:39 PM on July 23, 2017 [16 favorites]
Trump started his birther crusade in 2011, a couple of years before the now-infamous 2013 Miss Universe Pageant in Moscow. That doesn't necessarily rule out that he had received notice of his kompromat prior to 2011 and had begun to act in towards the benefit of the Russian nation state prior to that time. I certainly agree that no fabled piss-tape would be as effective a motivational tool as evidence of Trump's dealings with organized crime, Russian or otherwise. Trump may dislike being humiliated, but he really dislikes the prospect of a jail sentence.
If Trump really was working for Putin from 2011 or earlier (something for which I admit we lack evidence), it explains a lot of things. We have all wondered how this reality television buffoon, born into easy riches, frequently an actor within bankruptcies and frauds, became such a potent geopolitical force. If he had a potent geopolitical force behind him from the start of his political career, it is easy to understand.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:39 PM on July 23, 2017 [16 favorites]
Scaramucci: "I want to aid and abet the President", near the 8 minute mark:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzwKET7IuvM
Wow, his first day is going super duper.
abetting
encourage or assist (someone) to do something wrong, in particular, to commit a crime or other offense.
posted by rainy at 9:10 PM on July 23, 2017 [49 favorites]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzwKET7IuvM
Wow, his first day is going super duper.
abetting
encourage or assist (someone) to do something wrong, in particular, to commit a crime or other offense.
posted by rainy at 9:10 PM on July 23, 2017 [49 favorites]
Scaramucci is the perfect frame for Trump's Mirror.
posted by perhapses at 9:12 PM on July 23, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by perhapses at 9:12 PM on July 23, 2017 [16 favorites]
Scaramooch: "There is no need for a pardon because the President has done nothing wrong, and I will encourage or assist him to do something wrong, to commit a crime or other offence, and then perhaps we can look into pardons, hmm?"
posted by rainy at 9:15 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by rainy at 9:15 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
I agree with Slap*Happy's point that we can win by joining all the issues together.
I agree too. But this was very explicitly the Democratic party platform in 2016, and they still lost. They had a whole convention about it, in which the opioid epidemic and access to mental health care were given time and emphasis alongside Black Lives Matter, police violence, trans issues, immigrant civil rights, and more. We did join all the issues together, more than I think has ever been done by either major political parties in the U.S. But we still lost.
So if we can win by joining our struggles, why did we lose despite doing so more than ever before? (This question is rhetorical; for the love of god and the mods please don't take it as an invitation to relitigate anything.) Obviously there are many, many reasons, but among them I think are 1) that people have very distorted views of the kinds and magnitudes of problems facing communities that aren't their own, and 2) no one other than dedicated news junkies actually got the message from the Democratic National Convention, because reporting on policy proposals is harder and less profitable than reporting on an obviously specious email scandal and an insane racist clown running for president.
Nitpick away.
The reason I took issue with your original argument, Slap*Happy, is that you made a questionable claim about the comparability of the opioid and suicide crises among straight white men to the peak of the AIDS epidemic for gay men, and used it to justify an attack on "allies" for not acknowledging the severity of the problem that (presumably poor) straight white men face and helping work towards solutions. Considering that most [liberals/leftists/progressives/your own favorite shibboleth here] seem to agree that there's a problem and have a variety of (sometimes contradictory) policy proposals for addressing it, this attack seems unwarranted to me, and I hardly think examining its merits constitutes nitpicking.
The fact is, last year Democrats laid out a set of detailed policy proposals for addressing the problems that straight white men, among other people, face, and Republicans responded with "immigrants are taking your jobs, we gotta bring back coal and steel and Law And Order," and straight white men essentially completely ignored the nerds who were trying to help them in favor of the loudmouthed bully without any ideas.
Speaking as a straight white man myself, the idea that the total political breakdown we're now experiencing is because people from other demographics failed to adequately understand the problems facing my peers is ludicrous and offensive. So when you say "Solve White Cis Male Problems, with a clearly defined agenda, and WE WIN," I can only respond that the biggest, perhaps only serious barrier to doing so is the White Cis Males. The people who need to be convinced of this is the White Cis Males, not the "allies."
posted by biogeo at 9:27 PM on July 23, 2017 [81 favorites]
I agree too. But this was very explicitly the Democratic party platform in 2016, and they still lost. They had a whole convention about it, in which the opioid epidemic and access to mental health care were given time and emphasis alongside Black Lives Matter, police violence, trans issues, immigrant civil rights, and more. We did join all the issues together, more than I think has ever been done by either major political parties in the U.S. But we still lost.
So if we can win by joining our struggles, why did we lose despite doing so more than ever before? (This question is rhetorical; for the love of god and the mods please don't take it as an invitation to relitigate anything.) Obviously there are many, many reasons, but among them I think are 1) that people have very distorted views of the kinds and magnitudes of problems facing communities that aren't their own, and 2) no one other than dedicated news junkies actually got the message from the Democratic National Convention, because reporting on policy proposals is harder and less profitable than reporting on an obviously specious email scandal and an insane racist clown running for president.
Nitpick away.
The reason I took issue with your original argument, Slap*Happy, is that you made a questionable claim about the comparability of the opioid and suicide crises among straight white men to the peak of the AIDS epidemic for gay men, and used it to justify an attack on "allies" for not acknowledging the severity of the problem that (presumably poor) straight white men face and helping work towards solutions. Considering that most [liberals/leftists/progressives/your own favorite shibboleth here] seem to agree that there's a problem and have a variety of (sometimes contradictory) policy proposals for addressing it, this attack seems unwarranted to me, and I hardly think examining its merits constitutes nitpicking.
The fact is, last year Democrats laid out a set of detailed policy proposals for addressing the problems that straight white men, among other people, face, and Republicans responded with "immigrants are taking your jobs, we gotta bring back coal and steel and Law And Order," and straight white men essentially completely ignored the nerds who were trying to help them in favor of the loudmouthed bully without any ideas.
Speaking as a straight white man myself, the idea that the total political breakdown we're now experiencing is because people from other demographics failed to adequately understand the problems facing my peers is ludicrous and offensive. So when you say "Solve White Cis Male Problems, with a clearly defined agenda, and WE WIN," I can only respond that the biggest, perhaps only serious barrier to doing so is the White Cis Males. The people who need to be convinced of this is the White Cis Males, not the "allies."
posted by biogeo at 9:27 PM on July 23, 2017 [81 favorites]
So if we can win by joining our struggles, why did we lose despite doing so more than ever before
We need to do everything we did last tone plus we need to do what the republicans did - work the system. We need calls and follow up to every leans-D voter, we need to get voters registered, we need to get them ballots, get them to vote and fight for every last elected position in every state.
posted by Joey Michaels at 9:34 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
We need to do everything we did last tone plus we need to do what the republicans did - work the system. We need calls and follow up to every leans-D voter, we need to get voters registered, we need to get them ballots, get them to vote and fight for every last elected position in every state.
posted by Joey Michaels at 9:34 PM on July 23, 2017 [6 favorites]
And we need a foreign power to intervene on our behalf.
posted by perhapses at 9:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by perhapses at 9:36 PM on July 23, 2017 [8 favorites]
BuzzFeed: "We Just Don’t Really Matter" — How To Break Through in the Trump Era: "In the age of Trump, global players — from tech companies to governments — have to shout. " In which Trump and Trump-related crises consume so much attention that nobody is paying attention to anything from app launches to famines, but it's a great time if you're not Trump and don't want people paying attention to you anyway.
Jennifer Rubin: Kobach is a ‘useful idiot’ for Russia
Jonathan Capehart, WaPo op-ed: Hey, Trump country! Stop being so smug. He is unlikely to soothe your anger.
posted by zachlipton at 10:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [57 favorites]
Jennifer Rubin: Kobach is a ‘useful idiot’ for Russia
Trump, and now Kobach, do Putin’s handiwork far more effectively than he ever dreamed. Along with the Trump flunkies at Fox News, they take Russia’s side in its assault on Western democracies’ free and fair elections. Frankly, if the members of the commission had backbone and principles they’d denounce Kobach’s comments and do their best to demonstrate that there is no systematic fraud in our electoral system.Olivia Nuzzi brings us a long profile of Joe Scarborough, Mika Brzezinski, and their relationship with Trump: Donald Trump Is Not Invited to the Wedding [warning: incredibly cringy pictures of the two of them inside]. There's a lot in here (including frisky rabbits named after the first couple), but this bit from Trump's first week in office is significant:
Whatever the case, their meetings were consolidated into a single lunch with Kushner, Ivanka, and the president on Sunday afternoon in the Blue Room. “When I spoke to Ivanka that morning, she was like, ‘We’re really going to talk to him about some of these things that I want to do,’ ” Brzezinski told me. “And I was all about supporting anything that’s good for empowering women, whether it’s a Republican as president or a Democrat. I’m open to hearing it all.” With books and a constellation of related content under the banner “Know Your Value,” she is something of an aspiring guru for career women. (“She has Joe so pussy-whipped that he left the Republican Party. If that isn’t knowing your value, I don’t know what is,” Rothstein joked.)Another profile, this one from Rosie Gray of Ezra Cohen-Watnick, the guy overseeing intelligence on the NSC who nobody knows anything about: The Man McMaster Couldn't Fire. There's an offhand comment in here that's worth flagging: apparently, Trump didn't visit the Situation Room until sometime in February. Two Americans were killed during a raid in January.
But things quickly veered off course when the president asked Scarborough how he thought his first week in office had gone. “I go, ‘Not really well,’ ” Scarborough remembered, adding that he mentioned the protests breaking out across the city and the world and that he thought Steve Bannon and Stephen Miller, two key advisers, had failed him. “And he spent the next hour saying to anybody who’d walk in, ‘Hey, can you believe this? This guy doesn’t think we had a great week!’ And it was shocking; it was the first time anybody had told him that the first week didn’t go really well.”
Afterward, Scarborough said, they toured the White House. “He was going around trying to show us all the Andrew Jackson paraphernalia. He asked Mika, ‘Hey, is this the first time you’ve ever been to the White House?’ She said, ‘No.’ He said, ‘Well, when was the first time?’ She goes, ‘When I was 9, when my dad was national-security adviser.’ He said, ‘Well, I bet it was your first time, Joe.’ I said, ‘Well, I was actually in Congress 20 years ago.’ ”
The visit was “disturbing,” according to Brzezinski, because he was “way too into it” — it being the fact that he’s president. When Ivanka attempted to broach the subject of women, “he was like, ‘What?’ ” she remembered. “And she goes, ‘Women?’ And he goes, ‘What?’ ” Irritated, Brzezinski said she shouted, “Women!,” moving her hands in a motion that suggested the shape of a woman’s figure, “Woah-men!” With that, he said to Ivanka, “ ‘Oh, women. Yeah, honey. Yeah, honey. We can do that.’ ”
“That was pretty much it for both of us,” Scarborough said. They never did have the conversation about women’s issues.
Jonathan Capehart, WaPo op-ed: Hey, Trump country! Stop being so smug. He is unlikely to soothe your anger.
What I can no longer abide is Trump supporters’ insistence that the problems they face are unique or deserve special consideration now that they are in the bull’s-eye. As if those who live on the coasts, nestled inside what they deride as the elite northeast corridor bubble, say, have never chafed at being disregarded and dismissed. For instance, fanfare over a Dollar Store opening that Abernathy writes about so passionately today was preceded by a Pathmark supermarket opening in Harlem nearly 20 years ago. The first major chain to locate there since the riots in the 1960s that left the community known as the capital of black America an economic no-go zone. Let’s not forget that the town elders in Detroit; Newark, N.J.; Oakland, Calif.; and Washington, D.C., have been working for decades to dig out of the social and economic holes left by the unrest then and the federal inattention that followed.WaPo, Sean Sullivan and Robert Costa: Republicans are in full control of government — but losing control of their party. This bit stands out:
Instead of focusing on the “negativity that permeates Trump coverage,” Abernathy wrote in another piece, “We talk about the heroin overdose epidemic ravaging our community.” This uproar and garment-rending concern was preceded by the crack and AIDS epidemics in the 1980s and 1990s. Largely absent from the national debate today is the moralizing and up-by-the-bootstraps lecturing that greeted African Americans and gay men. That’s an advancement, if you ask me. People in pain and desperate for help need a helping hand and solutions, not a kick in the teeth and derision.
Amid the discord, there are some signs of collaboration. The Republican National Committee has worked to build ties to Trump and his family. In recent weeks, Trump’s son Eric, his wife Lara, and RNC chair Ronna Romney McDaniel, among other RNC officials, met at the Trump International Hotel in Washington to discuss upcoming races and strategy.Isn't Eric supposed to be off running the business—correction, being the only member of an "advisory board" for the business because he can't be trusted to be a trustee apparently—and having nothing to do with politics?
That meeting followed a similar gathering weeks earlier at the RNC where Trump family members were welcomed to share their suggestions, according two people familiar with the sessions who were not authorized to speak publicly.
posted by zachlipton at 10:16 PM on July 23, 2017 [57 favorites]
Trump's DOJ gears up for crackdown on marijuana
The raids are coming
This may be Jeff Sessions' wet dream, but, like many endeavors advanced by this administration, I question how much traction this will get. While Sessions may like to parrot antiquated lines about the horrors of the demon weed (and the *those people* who use it, wink wink), societal trendlines are decidedly advancing in the opposite direction. It may be gasp-inducing to many in this so-called administration, but I've known actual Republicans who indulge in the practice from time to time, and the old stereotypes of hippies followed perpetually by a Pig Pen-like cloud of smoke are no longer relevant, if they ever were.
Not to mention the issue of states' rights, which is probably the best legal standpoint from which to fight this nonsense. I wouldn't be surprised to see Oregon, Colorado, Washington and the other states that are bringing in millions of pot-related tax revenue start lawyering up to defend their ability to continue doing so. And that could very well be a bipartisan effort. Given the administration's legal team's questionable track record of defending the boss' ridiculous pronouncements, I don't see them deftly swatting away and quashing appeal efforts.
Here in Oregon, I am all but certain that our police force does not want to go back to wasting their time booking kids for dime bags. I imagine this is true in the other states that have legalized. I honestly wonder if your average DEA agent is really going to want to head down to the local boutique pot shop and haul out all that Grön chocolate.
On second thought, I take that back.
From the article: "President Trump’s Task Force on Crime Reduction and Public Safety, led by Sessions, is expected to release a report next week that criminal justice reform advocates fear will link marijuana to violent crime and recommend tougher sentences for those caught growing, selling and smoking the plant."
I'd be surprised if there's an eighth of an ounce of truth to a single word of that report.
posted by vverse23 at 10:17 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
The raids are coming
This may be Jeff Sessions' wet dream, but, like many endeavors advanced by this administration, I question how much traction this will get. While Sessions may like to parrot antiquated lines about the horrors of the demon weed (and the *those people* who use it, wink wink), societal trendlines are decidedly advancing in the opposite direction. It may be gasp-inducing to many in this so-called administration, but I've known actual Republicans who indulge in the practice from time to time, and the old stereotypes of hippies followed perpetually by a Pig Pen-like cloud of smoke are no longer relevant, if they ever were.
Not to mention the issue of states' rights, which is probably the best legal standpoint from which to fight this nonsense. I wouldn't be surprised to see Oregon, Colorado, Washington and the other states that are bringing in millions of pot-related tax revenue start lawyering up to defend their ability to continue doing so. And that could very well be a bipartisan effort. Given the administration's legal team's questionable track record of defending the boss' ridiculous pronouncements, I don't see them deftly swatting away and quashing appeal efforts.
Here in Oregon, I am all but certain that our police force does not want to go back to wasting their time booking kids for dime bags. I imagine this is true in the other states that have legalized. I honestly wonder if your average DEA agent is really going to want to head down to the local boutique pot shop and haul out all that Grön chocolate.
On second thought, I take that back.
From the article: "President Trump’s Task Force on Crime Reduction and Public Safety, led by Sessions, is expected to release a report next week that criminal justice reform advocates fear will link marijuana to violent crime and recommend tougher sentences for those caught growing, selling and smoking the plant."
I'd be surprised if there's an eighth of an ounce of truth to a single word of that report.
posted by vverse23 at 10:17 PM on July 23, 2017 [5 favorites]
Y'all, in all this "what we need to do to win" discussion what's missing is.. We did win. Dems got the most votes for Congress and the presidency.
It's gerrymandering we have to address. And the press is barely touching it and there's no strong organized movement to fix it. We already have the majority of the vote, our votes just don't count as much and that is the problem.
posted by antinomia at 10:31 PM on July 23, 2017 [69 favorites]
It's gerrymandering we have to address. And the press is barely touching it and there's no strong organized movement to fix it. We already have the majority of the vote, our votes just don't count as much and that is the problem.
posted by antinomia at 10:31 PM on July 23, 2017 [69 favorites]
When Ivanka attempted to broach the subject of women, “he was like, ‘What?’ ” she remembered. “And she goes, ‘Women?’ And he goes, ‘What?’ ” Irritated, Brzezinski said she shouted, “Women!,” moving her hands in a motion that suggested the shape of a woman’s figure, “Woah-men!” With that, he said to Ivanka, “ ‘Oh, women. Yeah, honey. Yeah, honey. We can do that.’ ”
people have such trouble coming up with non-sexist analogies or explanations for what the fuck is wrong with Ivanka Trump besides the basic thing that she said herself, that she is the most like her dad of any of the kids. so I will do it.
she is just exactly like one of your Newts Gingrich or Benjamins Carson. JUST like. her undying belief that because she is close to him, she has a shot at convincing Donald Trump, who has almost certainly been a rapist longer than she has been alive, to respect women and do something useful about the political issues affecting them, is like Newt's thing of deciding to build moon colonies on the moon to start outbreeding the moonmen. that is: it sounds cool and she has no idea how the fuck it could be done and nobody she talks to about it thinks it is a serious idea and also, they don't care, so they don't bother trying to talk her out of it. sure, Newt, we'll draw up plans for getting Amazon Moon Prime so we can lord it over the moonmen with our one-day moon shipping. sure, Ivanka, we'll get your dad to class women as humans instead of as all-in-one goods and services.
the other thing is that just like her dad she will never admit that she not only failed but failed because she failed to understand the first thing about the scope and history of the problem. getting Donald Trump to not be a misogynist is a fucking dumb goal to have. dumb like building a wall at the southern border. it is so dumb that to admit it and quit would be admitting that she should have known better from the very beginning, and this, a Trump will never do.
the sincerity of her devotion to the rights of any women besides herself doesn't even enter into it. in fact the more you believe in that possibility the worse and more stupid it is.
posted by queenofbithynia at 10:46 PM on July 23, 2017 [46 favorites]
people have such trouble coming up with non-sexist analogies or explanations for what the fuck is wrong with Ivanka Trump besides the basic thing that she said herself, that she is the most like her dad of any of the kids. so I will do it.
she is just exactly like one of your Newts Gingrich or Benjamins Carson. JUST like. her undying belief that because she is close to him, she has a shot at convincing Donald Trump, who has almost certainly been a rapist longer than she has been alive, to respect women and do something useful about the political issues affecting them, is like Newt's thing of deciding to build moon colonies on the moon to start outbreeding the moonmen. that is: it sounds cool and she has no idea how the fuck it could be done and nobody she talks to about it thinks it is a serious idea and also, they don't care, so they don't bother trying to talk her out of it. sure, Newt, we'll draw up plans for getting Amazon Moon Prime so we can lord it over the moonmen with our one-day moon shipping. sure, Ivanka, we'll get your dad to class women as humans instead of as all-in-one goods and services.
the other thing is that just like her dad she will never admit that she not only failed but failed because she failed to understand the first thing about the scope and history of the problem. getting Donald Trump to not be a misogynist is a fucking dumb goal to have. dumb like building a wall at the southern border. it is so dumb that to admit it and quit would be admitting that she should have known better from the very beginning, and this, a Trump will never do.
the sincerity of her devotion to the rights of any women besides herself doesn't even enter into it. in fact the more you believe in that possibility the worse and more stupid it is.
posted by queenofbithynia at 10:46 PM on July 23, 2017 [46 favorites]
Failure is an orphan.
posted by rhizome at 10:54 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by rhizome at 10:54 PM on July 23, 2017 [1 favorite]
It's also worth watching Scaramucci on Russia hacking. He claims he has a secret anonymous source that told him that if Russia hacked the DNC and Podesta emails, they're so good that we would have never seen any evidence. Then Jake Tapper pushes back a little and Scaramucci just admits his source was Trump himself.
Laura Rozen has a really good point here: where did Donald Trump get the idea that Russia is so good at hacking that we wouldn't know it was them? From Putin. I am not kidding:
I honestly don't know how to end this comment besides mashing my hands on the keyboard in incoherent confusion and rage, so just assume I'm doing that now I guess.
posted by zachlipton at 10:59 PM on July 23, 2017 [89 favorites]
Laura Rozen has a really good point here: where did Donald Trump get the idea that Russia is so good at hacking that we wouldn't know it was them? From Putin. I am not kidding:
But when Mr. Trump met Mr. Putin in Hamburg, Germany, two weeks ago, he did not utter similar suspicions, at least in public. In fact, he emerged to tell his aides that the Russian president had offered a compelling rejoinder: Moscow’s cyberoperators are so good at covert computer-network operations that if they had dipped into the Democratic National Committee’s systems, they would not have been caught.This is a talking point that went from Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump to Scaramucci to everyone watching CNN. Scaramucci's real secret anonymous source wasn't Trump after all, it was just Putin.
And on Sunday, Mr. Trump made it clear again that regardless of statements by Mr. Pompeo and Mr. Coats, the entire issue is a political concoction.
I honestly don't know how to end this comment besides mashing my hands on the keyboard in incoherent confusion and rage, so just assume I'm doing that now I guess.
posted by zachlipton at 10:59 PM on July 23, 2017 [89 favorites]
Trump repeats what we sees on Fox & FriendsI have this feeling like he's going to send out a 3am tweet raging about how
"Hillary gave up the "Hawaii 7" for DEAD
Didn't lift a finger to save them!!"
and it will be some hours before we realize he sat on his remote and watched an episode of Gilligan's Island.
posted by blueberry at 11:13 PM on July 23, 2017 [32 favorites]
I've been thinking about three threats that have been building steam for a while now. Any one of these threats would be serious on its own, but all three are now acting in tandem to undermine American democracy. We have lots of other problems, to be sure, but these three have been on my mind because I can't think of any realistic countermeasures, nor have I seen any convincing solutions deployed yet. The three problems are:
-- "choose your own reality" propaganda filters that have diverged further and further over the last ~30 years -- starting with the end of the Fairness Doctrine, ramping up with Fox News and culminating with the endless geyser of horseshit that now spews forth from social media (with extra help from state-sponsored Russian agitprop)
-- bespoke partisan gerrymandering abetted by ever-increasing availability of voter data and ever-increasing capacity for sophisticated data analysis
-- the spiraling consequences of the Citizens United ruling
The content of kliuless's post scared me because it confirms that the first and third items on my list are in full swing and gathering even more force. Meanwhile, the states have mostly resisted Kobach's attempt to pull the lever even harder on number 2, but that was just one skirmish in a continuing campaign.
I don't think a healthy democracy can exist without these problems being solved, but I don't know where the solutions are going to come from.
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 11:28 PM on July 23, 2017 [15 favorites]
-- "choose your own reality" propaganda filters that have diverged further and further over the last ~30 years -- starting with the end of the Fairness Doctrine, ramping up with Fox News and culminating with the endless geyser of horseshit that now spews forth from social media (with extra help from state-sponsored Russian agitprop)
-- bespoke partisan gerrymandering abetted by ever-increasing availability of voter data and ever-increasing capacity for sophisticated data analysis
-- the spiraling consequences of the Citizens United ruling
The content of kliuless's post scared me because it confirms that the first and third items on my list are in full swing and gathering even more force. Meanwhile, the states have mostly resisted Kobach's attempt to pull the lever even harder on number 2, but that was just one skirmish in a continuing campaign.
I don't think a healthy democracy can exist without these problems being solved, but I don't know where the solutions are going to come from.
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 11:28 PM on July 23, 2017 [15 favorites]
Here in Oregon, I am all but certain that our police force does not want to go back to wasting their time booking kids for dime bags.
Santa Monica voted passed Measure Y a few years ago:
There was just that article about how miserable the boys are, and how Eric can't do anything because it will attract attention. 🎻
posted by Room 641-A at 12:25 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Santa Monica voted passed Measure Y a few years ago:
Shall the Municipal Code be amended to: state that City police shall make law enforcement related to adult, personal use of marijuana the lowest enforcement priority, unless the use occurs on public property or in conjunction with driving under the influence; require the City Council to effectuate the priority through reporting, grievance and oversight procedures; and require the City Clerk to send annual notice of the priority to federal and state representatives?Isn't Eric supposed to be off running the business—correction, being the only member of an "advisory board" for the business because he can't be trusted to be a trustee apparently—and having nothing to do with politics?
There was just that article about how miserable the boys are, and how Eric can't do anything because it will attract attention. 🎻
posted by Room 641-A at 12:25 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
WaPo: Republicans are in full control of government — but losing control of their party
I.e. issuing casually nasty threats, the way he does.
But tell me, who are the people that support Trump's plan to primary Republicans that refuse to eat the meatloaf?
OK, the scriptwriters are just phoning it in now.
posted by Joe in Australia at 1:49 AM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
Trump issued a casual threat at the Wednesday lunch against Sen. Dean Heller (R-Nev.), who has not embraced McConnell’s health-care bill. “Look, he wants to remain a senator, doesn’t he?” Trump said in front of a pack of reporters as Heller, sitting directly to his right, grinned through the uncomfortable moment.
Heller is up for reelection in a state that Trump lost to Hillary Clinton and where Gov. Brian Sandoval (R) was the first Republican to expanded Medicaid under the ACA. Heller later brushed the moment off as “President Trump being President Trump.”
I.e. issuing casually nasty threats, the way he does.
But tell me, who are the people that support Trump's plan to primary Republicans that refuse to eat the meatloaf?
“Absolutely we should be thinking about that,” said Frank VanderSloot, a billionaire chief executive of an Idaho nutritional-supplement company.
OK, the scriptwriters are just phoning it in now.
posted by Joe in Australia at 1:49 AM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
Chuck Schumer: Democrats' Better Deal [NYT]
" Old New New Deal" already on the table:
- "We’ve already proposed creating jobs with a $1 trillion infrastructure plan; increasing workers’ incomes by lifting the minimum wage to $15; and lowering household costs by providing paid family and sick leave."
"New New New Deal" to be proposed:
- Regulate prescription drug prices
- Push Medicare to negotiate lower drug prices
- Stronger antitrust, anti-competition law; break up megacorps if they abuse monopoly
- Give employers a "large tax credit" to train workers for unfilled jobs
According to Schumer:
posted by runcifex at 2:33 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Democrats have too often hesitated from taking on those misguided policies directly and unflinchingly — so much so that many Americans don’t know what we stand for. Not after today. Democrats will show the country that we’re the party on the side of working people — and that we stand for three simple things.Summary of the deal:
First, we’re going to increase people’s pay. Second, we’re going to reduce their everyday expenses. And third, we’re going to provide workers with the tools they need for the 21st-century economy.
" Old New New Deal" already on the table:
- "We’ve already proposed creating jobs with a $1 trillion infrastructure plan; increasing workers’ incomes by lifting the minimum wage to $15; and lowering household costs by providing paid family and sick leave."
"New New New Deal" to be proposed:
- Regulate prescription drug prices
- Push Medicare to negotiate lower drug prices
- Stronger antitrust, anti-competition law; break up megacorps if they abuse monopoly
- Give employers a "large tax credit" to train workers for unfilled jobs
According to Schumer:
Our better deal is not about expanding the government, or moving our party in one direction or another along the political spectrum. Nor is it about tearing down government agencies that work, that effectively protect consumers and promote the health and well-being of the country. It’s about reorienting government to work on behalf of people and families.Emphasis mine. How?
posted by runcifex at 2:33 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
In a surprise move, President of Poland will veto controversial judiciary reform bill. [Reuters] [Guardian]
posted by runcifex at 2:51 AM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by runcifex at 2:51 AM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
Nice for him: Jared Kushner sealed Manhattan real estate deal with oligarch's firm cited in money-laundering case
posted by Joe in Australia at 3:03 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by Joe in Australia at 3:03 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
Complaints about the slogan and its colon aside, I'm really surprised and intrigued that bringing back the concept of antitrust law is a major part of the agenda. It would be super easy to leave that out: it's not particularly easy to explain to voters; will be deeply unpopular with certain businesses, including donors; and there isn't some great big movement clamoring for it. But there it is, and I'm really curious exactly how that bit got in there, because it's a pretty obviously not like the others on the list, and it represents some pretty perceptive thinking about the country, the party, and where the conversation is headed.
I've been chewing a bunch on Elizabeth Bruenig's definitions of liberalism and the left, and while parts are super imperfect and will not satisfy everyone (anyone?), especially because it's a tiny post on Medium trying to figure something out that people somehow took to be a grand unified political theory, this bit is important to me:
It's just a plank in a slogan to be sure, but it's one that could have easily been omitted, and its presence intrigues me.
posted by zachlipton at 3:07 AM on July 24, 2017 [38 favorites]
I've been chewing a bunch on Elizabeth Bruenig's definitions of liberalism and the left, and while parts are super imperfect and will not satisfy everyone (anyone?), especially because it's a tiny post on Medium trying to figure something out that people somehow took to be a grand unified political theory, this bit is important to me:
But we shouldn’t assume that today’s American socialists — the likes of DSA or Jacobin, or to put a finer point on it, the people Chait is generally arguing with— are anti-liberal in the sense of some of those socialists listed above. Rather, today’s socialists tend to approve entirely of the norms of liberalism — like liberty, rational inquiry, egalitarianism, and so forth — they just feel that the economic aspects of liberalism (free or freeish market capitalism) create material conditions that actually make people less free. Their argument is not, generally, that liberalism’s aims are bad; it’s that the economic application of liberalism prevents people from actually being free persons expressing and developing their capacities.People throw the label neoliberalism around to mean just about anything, usually while relitigating the primaries, but if I had to personally put an overall gloss on it, it means an overarching devotion to the idea that freer markets make freer people. A return to antitrust (and just look at what AT&T has turned back into for a clear sign of how things have changed in that era since the 80s) reads to me as a real sign the party is talking about seriously addressing some negative impacts of large corporations and unrestrained free market capitalism.
It's just a plank in a slogan to be sure, but it's one that could have easily been omitted, and its presence intrigues me.
posted by zachlipton at 3:07 AM on July 24, 2017 [38 favorites]
I think that Schumer Op Ed is great! They've been listening!
"W e are not moving one way or the other on the political spectrum" is just good messaging when people at opposite ends is the political spectrum hate each other right now, and anyway have completely different ideas of what the political spectrum even is. Leftists try to distinguish themselves from liberals, and meanwhile In the right they call each other RINOs. Both sides think the end of the spectrum opposite themselves is Darth Vader. And nobody can agree about whether the primary political divide in our country is about racial or economic issues.
If the 50% of eligible voters who didn't vote last November had been willing and able,
They probably would have voted approximately the same way as they people in their areas who DID vote. I don't knew where Democrats get this idea that all non-voters are Democrats -- or socialists! In fact, since non - voters are on average less educated and engaged, they probably include proportionally more Trump supporters.
In California and New York we could get a lot more votes but turning out non-voters. But guess what? Running up the score on our wins in California and New York does not win us control in government. Republicans are already controlling the presidency, House, Senate, and majority of state legislatures and governorship WITHOUT having won a majority of the votes for the House, Senate, or presidency. We don't need more votes. We need more votes in rural and suburban areas!
This attitude that we don't need to appeal to Trump voters because they are undeserving of our sympathy (because they are racist) or that we will simply wait for them to die off as a demographic force (white people will be a minority soon.... rural peple barely exist anymore...) that's the one real grievance I think right wingers have. I hear us dismissing them and saying we don't need their votes all the time.
But we do. Because they will destroy democracy if we keep ignoring them. And because if our current system survives intact, their voices will continue to be be amplified within it. (If they manage to destroy our current system altogether, our voices will be altogether silenced.)
And also because it is the right thing to do. Even if they are racists (And many of them are, but don't know it) they are still human and suffering in many ways. Ignoring that humanity and suffering is gross..
And we do have ideas to help them! They are basically thrvsame ideas that worked in the 1930s, to help exactly these same demographics.
I think Schumer is sounding just the right note here. I love it.
posted by OnceUponATime at 3:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
"W e are not moving one way or the other on the political spectrum" is just good messaging when people at opposite ends is the political spectrum hate each other right now, and anyway have completely different ideas of what the political spectrum even is. Leftists try to distinguish themselves from liberals, and meanwhile In the right they call each other RINOs. Both sides think the end of the spectrum opposite themselves is Darth Vader. And nobody can agree about whether the primary political divide in our country is about racial or economic issues.
If the 50% of eligible voters who didn't vote last November had been willing and able,
They probably would have voted approximately the same way as they people in their areas who DID vote. I don't knew where Democrats get this idea that all non-voters are Democrats -- or socialists! In fact, since non - voters are on average less educated and engaged, they probably include proportionally more Trump supporters.
In California and New York we could get a lot more votes but turning out non-voters. But guess what? Running up the score on our wins in California and New York does not win us control in government. Republicans are already controlling the presidency, House, Senate, and majority of state legislatures and governorship WITHOUT having won a majority of the votes for the House, Senate, or presidency. We don't need more votes. We need more votes in rural and suburban areas!
This attitude that we don't need to appeal to Trump voters because they are undeserving of our sympathy (because they are racist) or that we will simply wait for them to die off as a demographic force (white people will be a minority soon.... rural peple barely exist anymore...) that's the one real grievance I think right wingers have. I hear us dismissing them and saying we don't need their votes all the time.
But we do. Because they will destroy democracy if we keep ignoring them. And because if our current system survives intact, their voices will continue to be be amplified within it. (If they manage to destroy our current system altogether, our voices will be altogether silenced.)
And also because it is the right thing to do. Even if they are racists (And many of them are, but don't know it) they are still human and suffering in many ways. Ignoring that humanity and suffering is gross..
And we do have ideas to help them! They are basically thrvsame ideas that worked in the 1930s, to help exactly these same demographics.
I think Schumer is sounding just the right note here. I love it.
posted by OnceUponATime at 3:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
I read that Guardian article Joe in Australia. It's stunning how clear the financial trail is becoming.
posted by michswiss at 3:17 AM on July 24, 2017
posted by michswiss at 3:17 AM on July 24, 2017
I don't knew where Democrats get this idea that all non-voters are Democrats
The idea comes from various liberal / leftish policies which routinely poll well, or the regressive Republican ideas which usually poll poorly. There's also very occasional polls which ask about support for presidential candidates, without any registered or likely voter filter, will often show significant majorities for the Democrats. I still remember the one from 2004 which showed Kerry with almost 60 percent support from all the people asked, including non-voters.
All this can give the impression there's a hidden majority that just doesn't show up.
And that might be true. Or maybe there's a lot of non-voting people who like Obamacare, want abortion to remain safe and legal, want something done about climate change, and yet will still vote for someone like Trump if they finally showed up at the polls because of some inane reason or another.
posted by honestcoyote at 3:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
The idea comes from various liberal / leftish policies which routinely poll well, or the regressive Republican ideas which usually poll poorly. There's also very occasional polls which ask about support for presidential candidates, without any registered or likely voter filter, will often show significant majorities for the Democrats. I still remember the one from 2004 which showed Kerry with almost 60 percent support from all the people asked, including non-voters.
All this can give the impression there's a hidden majority that just doesn't show up.
And that might be true. Or maybe there's a lot of non-voting people who like Obamacare, want abortion to remain safe and legal, want something done about climate change, and yet will still vote for someone like Trump if they finally showed up at the polls because of some inane reason or another.
posted by honestcoyote at 3:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
I mean, many Democratic policies do poll well among people who end up voting Republican.
Those people do not understand that the policies they like really are Democratic policies. They have a charicature of Democrats in their minds.
posted by OnceUponATime at 3:48 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
Those people do not understand that the policies they like really are Democratic policies. They have a charicature of Democrats in their minds.
posted by OnceUponATime at 3:48 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
I did not collude with Russia, says Jared Kushner
Statement by Trump’s son-in-law to congressional committees says there were no ‘improper contacts’
posted by michswiss at 4:07 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Statement by Trump’s son-in-law to congressional committees says there were no ‘improper contacts’
Kushner said in his statement that Trump Jr. invited him to the meeting. He says he arrived late and when he heard the lawyer discussing the issue of adoptions, he texted his assistant to call him out.I chuckled aghast through the whole thing.
“No part of the meeting I attended included anything about the campaign, there was no follow up to the meeting that I am aware of, I do not recall how many people were there (or their names), and I have no knowledge of any documents being offered or accepted,” Kushner’s statement says.
posted by michswiss at 4:07 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Give Kushner a chance to clarify, he knows he's allowed at least thirty-nine revisions of that statement.
posted by Rykey at 4:22 AM on July 24, 2017 [49 favorites]
posted by Rykey at 4:22 AM on July 24, 2017 [49 favorites]
"Because I am a shambling fetus," Mr Kushner continued, "I have neither intelligence nor curiosity, and I did not realise that the foreign delegation was using 'adoptions' as a euphemism for 'lifting US sanctions'. Even though Russian money laundering is literally what my family does, I had not heard of the sanctions, nor would it have occurred to me that Russian oligarchs would be so obsessed with them."
Mr Kushner then left, as he had an appointment that afternoon to bring yet more peace to the Middle East. [fake]
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:28 AM on July 24, 2017 [37 favorites]
Mr Kushner then left, as he had an appointment that afternoon to bring yet more peace to the Middle East. [fake]
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:28 AM on July 24, 2017 [37 favorites]
51% dem/lean dem to 30% republican/ lean republican.
How many of those Democratic leaners are in districts we already win handily, though? We need to win in new places. Or we will continue to have popular vote majorities and no control of government.
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:43 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
How many of those Democratic leaners are in districts we already win handily, though? We need to win in new places. Or we will continue to have popular vote majorities and no control of government.
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:43 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
OnceUponATime, it's so strange because I woke up today, before reading your comment or Schumer's OP-ED, thinking this whole imagined White (Rural) Working Class problem has been a huge distraction from the really important questions: why is the suburban middle class voting against their own interests? And how can they stop doing that in 2018?
I'm strongly on the "it's the racism"-side, maybe because I live in a country where it is completely evident and non-disputable that it is the racism. But given that, how does one connect with these people without pandering to their racism? We take it for granted that a doctor in a small rural community or or a bank manager in an ex-urb will vote Republican, but they are losing their jobs because of R policies and big corporations as fast as or faster than those coal miners. I once visited an idyllic and deeply religious small village in VA where everyone voted R as a given, but at the same time everyone was very worried about environmental issues and most were exploring renewable energy.
The only route is to get them to accept that the world is different from what they imagined it was in the fifties, and that the world we have now is in so many ways much better than what it was in the real fifties, even for their demographic. The other day, I was doing some business with a lady who was clearly a racist voter, and somehow we had a long but friendly talk about politics. She was a little older than me, but I could remind her of the squalor and poor health that existed in our community when we were young — people living in shacks without bathrooms, kids who were never washed and left school at 14. She had to admit that something had improved, regardless of those scary immigrants and that her own sister had built a new company which provides jobs that replace those of the former shipyard. I'm sure I didn't change her vote. But it was also clear that she liked me in spite of my scary socialist views and that the conversation will continue.
I think that among some people on the Right, there is a strong perception that society is a zero-sum game at all levels. Back in the day that was what led conservatives to have the political ownership of fiscal responsibility (and we all really need to remind everyone all the time that they have lost that way back in the 80's). It's what leads some to think that universal welfare and prosperity are mutually exclusive, against all facts. It's also what drives the current fantasy/panic that robots are about to steal our jobs. And obviously, identity politics can only thrive if a large part of the population can be made to believe that they are threatened by societal change.
posted by mumimor at 4:44 AM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
I'm strongly on the "it's the racism"-side, maybe because I live in a country where it is completely evident and non-disputable that it is the racism. But given that, how does one connect with these people without pandering to their racism? We take it for granted that a doctor in a small rural community or or a bank manager in an ex-urb will vote Republican, but they are losing their jobs because of R policies and big corporations as fast as or faster than those coal miners. I once visited an idyllic and deeply religious small village in VA where everyone voted R as a given, but at the same time everyone was very worried about environmental issues and most were exploring renewable energy.
The only route is to get them to accept that the world is different from what they imagined it was in the fifties, and that the world we have now is in so many ways much better than what it was in the real fifties, even for their demographic. The other day, I was doing some business with a lady who was clearly a racist voter, and somehow we had a long but friendly talk about politics. She was a little older than me, but I could remind her of the squalor and poor health that existed in our community when we were young — people living in shacks without bathrooms, kids who were never washed and left school at 14. She had to admit that something had improved, regardless of those scary immigrants and that her own sister had built a new company which provides jobs that replace those of the former shipyard. I'm sure I didn't change her vote. But it was also clear that she liked me in spite of my scary socialist views and that the conversation will continue.
I think that among some people on the Right, there is a strong perception that society is a zero-sum game at all levels. Back in the day that was what led conservatives to have the political ownership of fiscal responsibility (and we all really need to remind everyone all the time that they have lost that way back in the 80's). It's what leads some to think that universal welfare and prosperity are mutually exclusive, against all facts. It's also what drives the current fantasy/panic that robots are about to steal our jobs. And obviously, identity politics can only thrive if a large part of the population can be made to believe that they are threatened by societal change.
posted by mumimor at 4:44 AM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
Even if they are racists (And many of them are, but don't know it) they are still human and suffering in many ways. Ignoring that humanity and suffering is gross.
We don't ignore them and their suffering. We've created and proposed and implemented a metric shit-ton of policies and legislation to benefit them. And continue to do so. They are the ones who have ignored that because of their racism/partisanship/whatever. And not just ignored, actively worked to harm the members of our coalition.
IMO what's gross is prioritizing the selfish feelings of whites -- not needs, because in reality our policies address their economic and other issues -- at the expense of the actual problems facing the country and the real needs of people. Outreach almost inevitably ends up being about favoring white people's anger over minorities' -- and the countries' -- real issues. Minorities who are by far the best and most loyal part of our coalition.
posted by chris24 at 5:00 AM on July 24, 2017 [59 favorites]
We don't ignore them and their suffering. We've created and proposed and implemented a metric shit-ton of policies and legislation to benefit them. And continue to do so. They are the ones who have ignored that because of their racism/partisanship/whatever. And not just ignored, actively worked to harm the members of our coalition.
IMO what's gross is prioritizing the selfish feelings of whites -- not needs, because in reality our policies address their economic and other issues -- at the expense of the actual problems facing the country and the real needs of people. Outreach almost inevitably ends up being about favoring white people's anger over minorities' -- and the countries' -- real issues. Minorities who are by far the best and most loyal part of our coalition.
posted by chris24 at 5:00 AM on July 24, 2017 [59 favorites]
fantasy/panic that robots are about to steal our jobs
mumimor, I agree with all your comments except this. I think robots (combine harvesters, automated factories) already have stolen all the rural jobs. And driven those people not the suburbs somewhat against their wills.
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:04 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
mumimor, I agree with all your comments except this. I think robots (combine harvesters, automated factories) already have stolen all the rural jobs. And driven those people not the suburbs somewhat against their wills.
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:04 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Except in the most egregious cases, I think white people have a social responsibility not to shun the racists but not to pander to them either. It might not be easy or emotionally comfortable, but we still have to engage with and challenge the racism in our own community. We expect no less from other identity groups in America. Even Obama spoke frequently about the black community taking responsibility for its own internal problems. White people have similar social responsibilities to engage with other whites who become belligerent rather than just dodging that difficult work and cutting them off, which only convinces them more of their rightness and undeserved martyrdom.
posted by saulgoodman at 5:06 AM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by saulgoodman at 5:06 AM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
I found this article from Timothy Lee at Vox which explains why anti-trust enforcements are so important: Is Ronald Reagan to blame for the decline of St. Louis?
"The growing economic gap between prosperous coastal cities and struggling cities in Middle America is often blamed on impersonal forces like globalization and technological progress. But some thinkers have started pointing to another culprit: little-noticed shifts in antitrust enforcement, beginning in the 1980s, that allowed a string of mega-mergers. "
One (but only one) of the things that propelled Trump into the White House was the economic decline of smaller cities, small towns and rural areas. Again from Timothy Lee at Vox on what he calls the Pokemon Go economy. More and more economic gain is being realized by fewer and fewer large cities. Trump, and Republicans (especially the Tea Party branch) are making hay out of Those People Are Tekking Our Jerbs instead of tackling the true culprits.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 5:08 AM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
"The growing economic gap between prosperous coastal cities and struggling cities in Middle America is often blamed on impersonal forces like globalization and technological progress. But some thinkers have started pointing to another culprit: little-noticed shifts in antitrust enforcement, beginning in the 1980s, that allowed a string of mega-mergers. "
One (but only one) of the things that propelled Trump into the White House was the economic decline of smaller cities, small towns and rural areas. Again from Timothy Lee at Vox on what he calls the Pokemon Go economy. More and more economic gain is being realized by fewer and fewer large cities. Trump, and Republicans (especially the Tea Party branch) are making hay out of Those People Are Tekking Our Jerbs instead of tackling the true culprits.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 5:08 AM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
I appreaciate the wording on the headline of theUSA Today article
"Jared Kushner says he had four contacts with Russians during campaign, denies collusion"
Framing there is "Despite evidence that I colluded, I totally didn't you guys. "
Compare to the Fox News headline:
"Kushner will call Russia meeting a 'waste of our time' in Congressional testimony"
posted by Twain Device at 5:24 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
"Jared Kushner says he had four contacts with Russians during campaign, denies collusion"
Framing there is "Despite evidence that I colluded, I totally didn't you guys. "
Compare to the Fox News headline:
"Kushner will call Russia meeting a 'waste of our time' in Congressional testimony"
posted by Twain Device at 5:24 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
"Kushner will call Russia meeting a 'waste of our time' in Congressional testimony"
Well, given his credibility on security and financial disclosures, that wraps up the entire issue, doesn't it?
posted by mikelieman at 5:31 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Well, given his credibility on security and financial disclosures, that wraps up the entire issue, doesn't it?
posted by mikelieman at 5:31 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
I like to believe that I'm a nice person but I also really want to see Jared cry on live TV
posted by theodolite at 5:31 AM on July 24, 2017 [59 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 5:31 AM on July 24, 2017 [59 favorites]
mumimor, I agree with all your comments except this. I think robots (combine harvesters, automated factories) already have stolen all the rural jobs. And driven those people not the suburbs somewhat against their wills.
I have to run into town now, so this is a quick reply without links (the thread will be hundreds of comments down before I get back ;-))
The industrialization of agriculture happened right after WW2 - two generations ago. And all of those farm-hands and small farm-owners found work in industries, in the cities, but also in small towns. Mechanization led to growth, to more jobs. The small towns and villages that died out back then, and some did, were those that refused to change.
Now we have a second, or perhaps actually a third level of automatization, and again it is leading to new types of jobs and we have some people and communities insisting that they want coal mines back, and others who adapt.
Small communities have something to offer contemporary manufacturing: cheap land and dependable workers with a high quality of life, if they invest in education and healthcare. Because those fully automated factories still need someone manning the computers and maintaining the gears and the spaces. They need infrastructure too, but it seems everyone agrees on that, and if the infrastructure works, there is no reason one can't make a chair or a printer just as well in a small town in Wisconsin as one can in a Chengdu.
Look at Germany: their factories are all fully automated and they still manage to have a very high level of employment and take in 1 million refugees.
posted by mumimor at 5:46 AM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
I have to run into town now, so this is a quick reply without links (the thread will be hundreds of comments down before I get back ;-))
The industrialization of agriculture happened right after WW2 - two generations ago. And all of those farm-hands and small farm-owners found work in industries, in the cities, but also in small towns. Mechanization led to growth, to more jobs. The small towns and villages that died out back then, and some did, were those that refused to change.
Now we have a second, or perhaps actually a third level of automatization, and again it is leading to new types of jobs and we have some people and communities insisting that they want coal mines back, and others who adapt.
Small communities have something to offer contemporary manufacturing: cheap land and dependable workers with a high quality of life, if they invest in education and healthcare. Because those fully automated factories still need someone manning the computers and maintaining the gears and the spaces. They need infrastructure too, but it seems everyone agrees on that, and if the infrastructure works, there is no reason one can't make a chair or a printer just as well in a small town in Wisconsin as one can in a Chengdu.
Look at Germany: their factories are all fully automated and they still manage to have a very high level of employment and take in 1 million refugees.
posted by mumimor at 5:46 AM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
It's gerrymandering we have to address. And the press is barely touching it and there's no strong organized movement to fix it. We already have the majority of the vote, our votes just don't count as much and that is the problem.
I second this, but how do we stop it?
posted by jenfullmoon at 5:58 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
I second this, but how do we stop it?
posted by jenfullmoon at 5:58 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Complaints about the slogan and its colon aside, I'm really surprised and intrigued that bringing back the concept of antitrust law is a major part of the agenda.
Given how much of the internet basically depends on the largesse of five companies, I'd say a renewed focus on antitrust is long overdue.
I read something recently that a lot of the voters people are concerned about around this level of the thread - voters who approve of Democratic policies, but vote against their interests for Republicans - often reason about the world in a "on the one hand, on the other hand" kind of fashion, which is relatively easy and gives you the appearance of being in the sensible centre, but breaks down when one side is just completely wrong.
In Australia, some of the left wing are starting to point out that most of the big liberal advances came about not by finding that sensible centre, but redefining the centre.
posted by Merus at 6:17 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Given how much of the internet basically depends on the largesse of five companies, I'd say a renewed focus on antitrust is long overdue.
I read something recently that a lot of the voters people are concerned about around this level of the thread - voters who approve of Democratic policies, but vote against their interests for Republicans - often reason about the world in a "on the one hand, on the other hand" kind of fashion, which is relatively easy and gives you the appearance of being in the sensible centre, but breaks down when one side is just completely wrong.
In Australia, some of the left wing are starting to point out that most of the big liberal advances came about not by finding that sensible centre, but redefining the centre.
posted by Merus at 6:17 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
It's gerrymandering we have to address. And the press is barely touching it and there's no strong organized movement to fix it.
There are two groups, one led by Jason Kander and the other by Barack Obama and Eric Holder.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [34 favorites]
There are two groups, one led by Jason Kander and the other by Barack Obama and Eric Holder.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [34 favorites]
It's gerrymandering we have to address. And the press is barely touching it and there's no strong organized movement to fix it. We already have the majority of the vote, our votes just don't count as much and that is the problem.
I second this, but how do we stop it?
Volunteer for one of those weak movements and make it stronger. Volunteer for local candidates who are better than their gerrymandered opponents. Make them work even in districts they think are safe. And when you lose, keep in touch with the people you lost with. Some of them will give up. Some of them won't. Keep working at it. Maybe it doesn't happen in 2018 or 2020, but keep working at it.
In 1992, when the GOP lost the White House for the first time since 1976 (and the first genuinely competitive election since 1964), they didn't give up. They used the loss to fuel a takeover of Congress. When they lost in 2008, they used the loss to fuel a re-takeover of Congress. The current gerrymandering effort isn't the result of a single wave election, it's the result of decades of effort, and a lot of losses.
Make them work for it.
posted by Etrigan at 6:21 AM on July 24, 2017 [34 favorites]
I second this, but how do we stop it?
Volunteer for one of those weak movements and make it stronger. Volunteer for local candidates who are better than their gerrymandered opponents. Make them work even in districts they think are safe. And when you lose, keep in touch with the people you lost with. Some of them will give up. Some of them won't. Keep working at it. Maybe it doesn't happen in 2018 or 2020, but keep working at it.
In 1992, when the GOP lost the White House for the first time since 1976 (and the first genuinely competitive election since 1964), they didn't give up. They used the loss to fuel a takeover of Congress. When they lost in 2008, they used the loss to fuel a re-takeover of Congress. The current gerrymandering effort isn't the result of a single wave election, it's the result of decades of effort, and a lot of losses.
Make them work for it.
posted by Etrigan at 6:21 AM on July 24, 2017 [34 favorites]
It's gerrymandering we have to address. And the press is barely touching it and there's no strong organized movement to fix it.
There are two groups, one led by Jason Kander and the other by Barack Obama and Eric Holder.
There are also local groups -- google "[your state] redistricting reform".
posted by Etrigan at 6:37 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
There are two groups, one led by Jason Kander and the other by Barack Obama and Eric Holder.
There are also local groups -- google "[your state] redistricting reform".
posted by Etrigan at 6:37 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Pope Francis allies accuse Trump White House of 'apocalyptic geopolitics' (Stephanie Kirchgaessner, The Guardian)
posted by Room 641-A at 6:38 AM on July 24, 2017 [45 favorites]
An explosive article written by two close associates of Pope Francis has accused Steve Bannon, the chief White House strategist, of espousing an “apocalyptic geopolitics” whose roots are “not too far apart” from that of Islamist extremism.Related: the other day I learned of the acrynom CHINO -- Christian In Name Only
The article in La Civiltà Cattolica, which is vetted by the Vatican before publication, lays out a scathing critique of “evangelical fundamentalism” in the US, arguing that, on issues ranging from climate change to “migrants and Muslims”, proponents of the ideology have adopted a twisted reading of scripture and the Old Testament that promotes conflict and war above all else.
The piece was published just days after evangelical leaders met US president Donald Trump in the Oval Office of the White House and “laid hands” on him in prayer following discussions about religious freedom, support for Israel and healthcare reform.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:38 AM on July 24, 2017 [45 favorites]
A group doing great work fighting gerrymandering in Pennsylvania is Fair Districts PA. PA has some of the worst gerrymandering in the country and the group is making headway in fixing it.
posted by mcduff at 6:42 AM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by mcduff at 6:42 AM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
Was the original intent of the budget reconciliation process to allow parties to shoehorn in enormous policy changes with minimal debate and without any exposure to possible filibusters?
posted by thelonius at 6:43 AM on July 24, 2017
posted by thelonius at 6:43 AM on July 24, 2017
I thought the Schumer op-ed was terrible: it condescends to the people it is pretending to care about (low-wage workers) while offering little or nothing to the people it is actually addressing (middle-class professionals). Who is the person who sees "a tax cut to my boss to retrain me" as the solution to any of their problems? Far from "they've been listening" the Schumer op-ed definitely makes it look to me like Democrats are going to try to run the same play they always run and hope Trump's unpopularity makes it work.
posted by gerryblog at 6:49 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by gerryblog at 6:49 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
I hope Kushner's closed-door testimony is kept brief because he needs to focus on achieving a union of Hamas and the Palestinian Authority
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:51 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:51 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Related: the other day I learned of the acrynom CHINO -- Christian In Name Only
I'm a fan of Crooked Media's upcoming t-shirt "Jesus loved the poor, assholes."
posted by leotrotsky at 6:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
I'm a fan of Crooked Media's upcoming t-shirt "Jesus loved the poor, assholes."
posted by leotrotsky at 6:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
Trump wants to replace Sessions with Giuliani
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 6:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 6:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
Do it. He won't get confirmed. Rosenstein will be in charge, a major improvement on Ku Klux Keebler
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:55 AM on July 24, 2017 [98 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:55 AM on July 24, 2017 [98 favorites]
Trump wants to replace Sessions with Giuliani
This is the least surprising thing I've heard in days.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:55 AM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
Related: the other day I learned of the acrynom CHINO -- Christian In Name Only
I've just been using Fake Christian. They want to turn a word that was accurately used against rightwing bullshit propaganda sites and use it against reality, I'm going to turn around and use it against them. Bonus that they know immediately the implication.
posted by chris24 at 6:57 AM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
I've just been using Fake Christian. They want to turn a word that was accurately used against rightwing bullshit propaganda sites and use it against reality, I'm going to turn around and use it against them. Bonus that they know immediately the implication.
posted by chris24 at 6:57 AM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
Ku Klux Keebler
If anyone owes me a favorite, please give it to this instead.
posted by Etrigan at 6:58 AM on July 24, 2017 [23 favorites]
If anyone owes me a favorite, please give it to this instead.
posted by Etrigan at 6:58 AM on July 24, 2017 [23 favorites]
It's an insult to Keebler
I like their little-man-cookies (I don't know what they're actually called. They've always been little-man-cookies to me).
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:00 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
I like their little-man-cookies (I don't know what they're actually called. They've always been little-man-cookies to me).
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:00 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Well, this certainly casts Trump in a same light
posted by mikepop at 7:01 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by mikepop at 7:01 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Do it. He won't get confirmed. Rosenstein will be in charge, a major improvement on Ku Klux Keebler
I'd like this to be true. We think enough Republican senators are sufficiently far along on the Russia stuff to kill this in the crib? Who are you counting besides Collins?
posted by leotrotsky at 7:02 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'd like this to be true. We think enough Republican senators are sufficiently far along on the Russia stuff to kill this in the crib? Who are you counting besides Collins?
posted by leotrotsky at 7:02 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
a scathing critique of “evangelical fundamentalism” in the US
So many of Trump's inner circle are Catholics, or former Catholics. The call is coming from inside house, Holy Father. Come and get your boys.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:03 AM on July 24, 2017 [22 favorites]
So many of Trump's inner circle are Catholics, or former Catholics. The call is coming from inside house, Holy Father. Come and get your boys.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:03 AM on July 24, 2017 [22 favorites]
Trump wants to replace Sessions with Giuliani
....I have on occasion read of something described as "a full-body dry heave" but I have never actually experienced that phenomenon until today.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:04 AM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
....I have on occasion read of something described as "a full-body dry heave" but I have never actually experienced that phenomenon until today.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:04 AM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
Which republican senators do you think would vote against Giuliani?
posted by cmfletcher at 7:05 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by cmfletcher at 7:05 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Joe in Australia: Nice for him: Jared Kushner sealed Manhattan real estate deal with oligarch's firm cited in money-laundering case
Two days before it was due to open in court in May, the Prevezon case was settled for $6m with no admission of guilt on the part of the defendants. But since details of the Trump Tower meeting emerged, the abrupt settlement of the Prevezon case has come under renewed scrutiny from congressional investigators.
Four Russians attended the meeting, led by Natalia Veselnitskaya, a lawyer with known Kremlin connections who acted as legal counsel for Prevezon in the money laundering case and who called the $6m settlement so slight that “it seemed almost an apology from the government”. Sixteen Democratic members of the House judiciary committee have now written to the justice department in light of the Trump Tower meeting demanding to know whether there was any interference behind the decision to avoid trial.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:12 AM on July 24, 2017 [45 favorites]
Two days before it was due to open in court in May, the Prevezon case was settled for $6m with no admission of guilt on the part of the defendants. But since details of the Trump Tower meeting emerged, the abrupt settlement of the Prevezon case has come under renewed scrutiny from congressional investigators.
Four Russians attended the meeting, led by Natalia Veselnitskaya, a lawyer with known Kremlin connections who acted as legal counsel for Prevezon in the money laundering case and who called the $6m settlement so slight that “it seemed almost an apology from the government”. Sixteen Democratic members of the House judiciary committee have now written to the justice department in light of the Trump Tower meeting demanding to know whether there was any interference behind the decision to avoid trial.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:12 AM on July 24, 2017 [45 favorites]
Far from "they've been listening" the Schumer op-ed definitely makes it look to me like Democrats are going to try to run the same play they always run
It is almost entirely an economic message. That is a different emphasis than recent years which have been more focused on issues of discrimination (both issues were still and presumably will still be part of the platform), and it is what the left has been demanding.
And listen to this fire-breathing...
-The wealthiest special interests can spend an unlimited, undisclosed amount of money to influence elections and protect their special deals in Washington.
-And for far too long, government has gone along, tilting the economic playing field in favor of the wealthy and powerful while putting new burdens on the backs of hard-working Americans.
-We’ve already proposed creating jobs with a $1 trillion infrastructure plan; increasing workers’ incomes by lifting the minimum wage to $15; and lowering household costs by providing paid family and sick leave.
-Right now, there is nothing to stop vulture capitalists from egregiously raising the price of lifesaving drugs without justification. We’re going to fight for rules to stop prescription drug price gouging
-We are going to fight to allow regulators to break up big companies if they’re hurting consumers and to make it harder for companies to merge if it reduces competition.
You really think a $15 minimum wage, huge public works project, and talking about "vulture capitalists" and "breaking up big companies" is business as usual for the Democrats?
The tax credit you don't like is explicitly described as having "particular resonance in smaller cities and rural areas, which have experienced an exodus of young people who aren’t trained for the jobs in those areas." Just because it's not for YOU doesn't mean it won't help people.
This is a winning message, I think.
posted by OnceUponATime at 7:13 AM on July 24, 2017 [37 favorites]
It is almost entirely an economic message. That is a different emphasis than recent years which have been more focused on issues of discrimination (both issues were still and presumably will still be part of the platform), and it is what the left has been demanding.
And listen to this fire-breathing...
-The wealthiest special interests can spend an unlimited, undisclosed amount of money to influence elections and protect their special deals in Washington.
-And for far too long, government has gone along, tilting the economic playing field in favor of the wealthy and powerful while putting new burdens on the backs of hard-working Americans.
-We’ve already proposed creating jobs with a $1 trillion infrastructure plan; increasing workers’ incomes by lifting the minimum wage to $15; and lowering household costs by providing paid family and sick leave.
-Right now, there is nothing to stop vulture capitalists from egregiously raising the price of lifesaving drugs without justification. We’re going to fight for rules to stop prescription drug price gouging
-We are going to fight to allow regulators to break up big companies if they’re hurting consumers and to make it harder for companies to merge if it reduces competition.
You really think a $15 minimum wage, huge public works project, and talking about "vulture capitalists" and "breaking up big companies" is business as usual for the Democrats?
The tax credit you don't like is explicitly described as having "particular resonance in smaller cities and rural areas, which have experienced an exodus of young people who aren’t trained for the jobs in those areas." Just because it's not for YOU doesn't mean it won't help people.
This is a winning message, I think.
posted by OnceUponATime at 7:13 AM on July 24, 2017 [37 favorites]
Confirming Giuliani wouldn't be saying "I support our President", it would be saying "I want to ensure our president can never be investigated, even by a Special Counsel appointed by the President's hand-picked Deputy Attorney General, whose investigation has barely started. My job as a Senator is to oversee the Executive Branch, but I will instead dismantle an ongoing investigation into the President by a widely-praised former FBI Director."
Remember when's Betsy DeVos was confirmed with Pence being the tie-breaker? Voting for Betsy DeVos did not require the Senators to arguably conspire to commit felony obstruction of justice. I predict a significant portion of the Republican Caucus would refuse to confirm Giuliani on the basis of conflict of interest.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:14 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Remember when's Betsy DeVos was confirmed with Pence being the tie-breaker? Voting for Betsy DeVos did not require the Senators to arguably conspire to commit felony obstruction of justice. I predict a significant portion of the Republican Caucus would refuse to confirm Giuliani on the basis of conflict of interest.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:14 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Aren't all Republicam Christians fake?
posted by Artw at 7:14 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by Artw at 7:14 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Sixteen Democratic members of the House judiciary committee have now written to the justice department in light of the Trump Tower meeting demanding to know whether there was any interference behind the decision to avoid trial.
I wish they'd just start asking "How much interference was there?"
posted by Etrigan at 7:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
I wish they'd just start asking "How much interference was there?"
posted by Etrigan at 7:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
I predict a significant portion of the Republican Caucus would refuse to confirm Giuliani on the basis of conflict of interest.
I have no idea why anything we've seen in the last year and a half could possibly lead you to that conclusion.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:18 AM on July 24, 2017 [27 favorites]
I have no idea why anything we've seen in the last year and a half could possibly lead you to that conclusion.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:18 AM on July 24, 2017 [27 favorites]
Which republican senators do you think would vote against Giuliani?
That's a question.
I suspect they would wheel McCain in, on his deathbed, to express concern then vote for Giuliani, then applaud him on his way out for his bravery and service.
posted by Artw at 7:19 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
That's a question.
I suspect they would wheel McCain in, on his deathbed, to express concern then vote for Giuliani, then applaud him on his way out for his bravery and service.
posted by Artw at 7:19 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
Remember that if and when Trump goes down, which may be a sudden and precipitous decline, his replacement is not Hillary Clinton, but a man every Republican senator wishes had been on the top of the 2016 ticket, instead of the flaming bag of maleficent shit we are stuck with.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:19 AM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:19 AM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
Confirming Giuliani wouldn't be saying "I support our President", it would be saying "I want to ensure our president can never be investigated, even by a Special Counsel appointed by the President's hand-picked Deputy Attorney General, whose investigation has barely started. My job as a Senator is to oversee the Executive Branch, but I will instead dismantle an ongoing investigation into the President by a widely-praised former FBI Director."
It would be also saying "I vote to politicize the DOJ to persecute the president's opponents" because no way the second thing Rudy does after stuffing the Mueller investigation is not investigate/arrest Clinton.
posted by chris24 at 7:19 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
It would be also saying "I vote to politicize the DOJ to persecute the president's opponents" because no way the second thing Rudy does after stuffing the Mueller investigation is not investigate/arrest Clinton.
posted by chris24 at 7:19 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
My job as a Senator is to oversee the Executive Branch, but I will instead dismantle an ongoing investigation into the President by a widely-praised former FBI Director.
I guess I could see Iowa senator and human/goat hybrid Chuck Grassley taking this line. He loves his oversight and guarding the power of the legislative branch.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
I guess I could see Iowa senator and human/goat hybrid Chuck Grassley taking this line. He loves his oversight and guarding the power of the legislative branch.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
I don't knew where Democrats get this idea that all non-voters are Democrats -- or socialists!
Well I know here in Texas we have a fair amount of people who have voted Democratic in the past but don't turn out often enough when we need them. Our GOTV is mostly to get those folks; we aren't trying to get Never Voted types (unless they are just now old enough) or Trumpers.
posted by emjaybee at 7:26 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Well I know here in Texas we have a fair amount of people who have voted Democratic in the past but don't turn out often enough when we need them. Our GOTV is mostly to get those folks; we aren't trying to get Never Voted types (unless they are just now old enough) or Trumpers.
posted by emjaybee at 7:26 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
The part I found interesting in the Joe in Australia link is this:
A Guardian investigation has established a series of overlapping ties and relationships involving alleged Russian money laundering, New York real estate deals and members of Trump’s inner circle. They include a 2015 sale of part of the old New York Times building in Manhattan involving Kushner and a billionaire real estate tycoon and diamond mogul, Lev Leviev. [...] Among the overlapping connections is the 2015 deal in which Kushner paid $295m to acquire several floors of the old New York Times building at 43rd street in Manhattan from the US branch of Leviev’s company, Africa Israel Investments (AFI), and its partner Five Mile Capital. The sale has been identified as of possible interest to the Mueller investigation as Kushner later went on to borrow $285m in refinancing from Deutsche Bank, the German financial house that itself has been embroiled in Russian money laundering scandals and whose loans to Trump are coming under intensifying scrutiny.
posted by Dr. Send at 7:31 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
A Guardian investigation has established a series of overlapping ties and relationships involving alleged Russian money laundering, New York real estate deals and members of Trump’s inner circle. They include a 2015 sale of part of the old New York Times building in Manhattan involving Kushner and a billionaire real estate tycoon and diamond mogul, Lev Leviev. [...] Among the overlapping connections is the 2015 deal in which Kushner paid $295m to acquire several floors of the old New York Times building at 43rd street in Manhattan from the US branch of Leviev’s company, Africa Israel Investments (AFI), and its partner Five Mile Capital. The sale has been identified as of possible interest to the Mueller investigation as Kushner later went on to borrow $285m in refinancing from Deutsche Bank, the German financial house that itself has been embroiled in Russian money laundering scandals and whose loans to Trump are coming under intensifying scrutiny.
posted by Dr. Send at 7:31 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
I hope somebody asks Kushner what he knows about Prevezon
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:33 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:33 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
@Mediaite
Kellyanne Conway Disses Special Counsel: ‘Mr. Mueller and His Band of Democratic Donors’ http://bit.ly/2uVKc9B (VIDEO)
@justinhendrix Retweeted Mediaite
Hey @KellyannePolls better check @Scaramucci's donation history- $115,000 to Democrats, more than anyone on Mueller's team combined.
posted by chris24 at 7:36 AM on July 24, 2017 [84 favorites]
Kellyanne Conway Disses Special Counsel: ‘Mr. Mueller and His Band of Democratic Donors’ http://bit.ly/2uVKc9B (VIDEO)
@justinhendrix Retweeted Mediaite
Hey @KellyannePolls better check @Scaramucci's donation history- $115,000 to Democrats, more than anyone on Mueller's team combined.
posted by chris24 at 7:36 AM on July 24, 2017 [84 favorites]
And then there is all the money Trump himself has donated to Democrats over the years.
But really, it is absurd to think that only Trump supporters are allowed to investigate Trump.
posted by OnceUponATime at 7:38 AM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
But really, it is absurd to think that only Trump supporters are allowed to investigate Trump.
posted by OnceUponATime at 7:38 AM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
Innuendo. It's all they've got.
posted by Devonian at 7:44 AM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by Devonian at 7:44 AM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
Kushner says this in his statement about all his meetings with Russians that he recently remembered:
He writes that he arrived at the meeting late, and when he got there the Russian lawyer was talking about a ban on U.S. adoptions of Russian children.
Fuck you Kushner. We all know that adoptions = Magnitsky Act = Russians oligarchs worried about losing access to the money they looted and laundered out of the country.
posted by diogenes at 7:54 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
He writes that he arrived at the meeting late, and when he got there the Russian lawyer was talking about a ban on U.S. adoptions of Russian children.
Fuck you Kushner. We all know that adoptions = Magnitsky Act = Russians oligarchs worried about losing access to the money they looted and laundered out of the country.
posted by diogenes at 7:54 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
From the Daily Caller, so they don't get no link.
Ryan: We Weren’t Elected To Defend Trump From Investigations
Speaker of the House Paul Ryan said Monday that it isn’t congressional Republicans’ role to defend President Trump from the investigations into Russian election interference and pushed back against the notion that special counsel Robert Mueller is biased against the president. [huh.]
The radio host Jay Weber mentioned the Democratic donors hired, and in his response Ryan said, “Bob Mueller is a Republican who was appointed by a Republican.” The House Speaker added, “I don’t think many people are saying that Mueller is a biased partisan…he really is anything but.” [...huh.]
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:55 AM on July 24, 2017 [47 favorites]
Ryan: We Weren’t Elected To Defend Trump From Investigations
Speaker of the House Paul Ryan said Monday that it isn’t congressional Republicans’ role to defend President Trump from the investigations into Russian election interference and pushed back against the notion that special counsel Robert Mueller is biased against the president. [huh.]
The radio host Jay Weber mentioned the Democratic donors hired, and in his response Ryan said, “Bob Mueller is a Republican who was appointed by a Republican.” The House Speaker added, “I don’t think many people are saying that Mueller is a biased partisan…he really is anything but.” [...huh.]
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:55 AM on July 24, 2017 [47 favorites]
Innuendo. It's all they've got.It's gotten them pretty far so far, though.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:56 AM on July 24, 2017
Wow, that may be the most spine/country-over-party Ryan has shown in... ever.
Not that it's that much, low bar, etc. etc. but still surprising.
posted by chris24 at 7:57 AM on July 24, 2017 [27 favorites]
Not that it's that much, low bar, etc. etc. but still surprising.
posted by chris24 at 7:57 AM on July 24, 2017 [27 favorites]
Wow, that may be the most spine/country-over-party Ryan has shown in... ever.
No, it's the most spine/country-over-party Ryan has talked about in... ever. Let's start calling it "mccaining" and get it into the dictionaries, just so he gets to see his legacy.
posted by Etrigan at 8:01 AM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
No, it's the most spine/country-over-party Ryan has talked about in... ever. Let's start calling it "mccaining" and get it into the dictionaries, just so he gets to see his legacy.
posted by Etrigan at 8:01 AM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
The investigators = Democrats smear is about as convincing as the Mexican judge thing, just less racist
posted by theodolite at 8:03 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 8:03 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
"POLICE! COME OUT WITH YOUR HANDS UP!"
"Are you Democrats or Republicans?"
"WH... WHAT?"
"I'm asking which political party you identify with. I'm concerned this might be a partisan witch-hunt."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:05 AM on July 24, 2017 [22 favorites]
"Are you Democrats or Republicans?"
"WH... WHAT?"
"I'm asking which political party you identify with. I'm concerned this might be a partisan witch-hunt."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:05 AM on July 24, 2017 [22 favorites]
Innuendo. It's all they've got.
Don't forget lies. Lies and innuendo.
posted by He Is Only The Imposter at 8:05 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Don't forget lies. Lies and innuendo.
posted by He Is Only The Imposter at 8:05 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Maybe we could also use:
AMINO: American in name only.
WINO: Marc Kasowitz
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:06 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
AMINO: American in name only.
WINO: Marc Kasowitz
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:06 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
PALOMINO: my horse who is a friend in name only :(
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:08 AM on July 24, 2017 [25 favorites]
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:08 AM on July 24, 2017 [25 favorites]
No, it's the most spine/country-over-party Ryan has talked about in... ever. Let's start calling it "mccaining" and get it into the dictionaries, just so he gets to see his legacy.
I agree, but right now words ARE important regarding Mueller. Because for every R that stands up for Mueller now and pushes back on the bullshit, it becomes harder for Trump to justify firing him. It also gets them on the record for when he does fire him. Most have been talking off the record about how unacceptable firing him would be. I'd obviously love to Ryan and other Rs to go on the record saying if fired they'll hire him as congressional Independent Counsel, but I'll take the Speaker pushing back on the lies and innuendo. It's a small crack in the thin red wall.
posted by chris24 at 8:09 AM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
I agree, but right now words ARE important regarding Mueller. Because for every R that stands up for Mueller now and pushes back on the bullshit, it becomes harder for Trump to justify firing him. It also gets them on the record for when he does fire him. Most have been talking off the record about how unacceptable firing him would be. I'd obviously love to Ryan and other Rs to go on the record saying if fired they'll hire him as congressional Independent Counsel, but I'll take the Speaker pushing back on the lies and innuendo. It's a small crack in the thin red wall.
posted by chris24 at 8:09 AM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
It's even sillier to blame the investigators for partisanship because in the end it's Mueller -- who is (a) a Republican, and (b) emphatically not a partisan hack -- who crafts the narrative. If he's hiring Democrats, it's not because he wants their unique political perspective on things, it's because they happen to be the best people he can find at untangling some particular sort of evidence. The reports generated by the Democrats (or anyone else) on the team will never see the light of day unedited: Mueller is going to build the case, and together with what is probably a very small subset of the team build it from the most salient pieces of the investigation put into their contexts. If one of his guys comes back with a transparent partisan hitjob, that's not actually going to end up shown to anybody.
posted by jackbishop at 8:10 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by jackbishop at 8:10 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Innuendo. It's all they've got.
Don't forget lies. Lies and innuendo.
Their two major weapons are lies, innuendo, and an embrace of intellectual dishonesty.
Their three major weapons are...
posted by Gelatin at 8:11 AM on July 24, 2017 [32 favorites]
Don't forget lies. Lies and innuendo.
Their two major weapons are lies, innuendo, and an embrace of intellectual dishonesty.
Their three major weapons are...
posted by Gelatin at 8:11 AM on July 24, 2017 [32 favorites]
From the end of Kushner's statement:
"I did not collude, nor know of anyone else in the campaign who colluded, with any foreign government."
Even this seemingly sweeping denial is a hedge, akin to the ones his father-in-law uses. Kushner and Trump can (for now, conceivably) say they did not collude with any foreign government, in that perhaps they did not get on the phone with Putin himself or email some Ministry chief of bureaucrat and plan collusion. (Though I'd still bet that happened...) Because they almost certainly coordinated with some private business that was running the bot farms or hacking the emails. And hey, it's a private business, it's not the Russian government! (wink-wink, nudge-nudge, know what I mean?)
That makes stories like this one (recalling from a past thread), because it's important and because everyone should be following the McClatchy DC investigative team, which has done the consistently best work on this abomination:
Investigators look for ties between Trump, Russia cyber operations
This is how you collude with Russia without (technically, verbal-loophole-exploiting) colluding with a foreign government. I suspect Mueller won't see much of a distinction, however, and I think that's the avenue he will use to make his case.
posted by martin q blank at 8:11 AM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
"I did not collude, nor know of anyone else in the campaign who colluded, with any foreign government."
Even this seemingly sweeping denial is a hedge, akin to the ones his father-in-law uses. Kushner and Trump can (for now, conceivably) say they did not collude with any foreign government, in that perhaps they did not get on the phone with Putin himself or email some Ministry chief of bureaucrat and plan collusion. (Though I'd still bet that happened...) Because they almost certainly coordinated with some private business that was running the bot farms or hacking the emails. And hey, it's a private business, it's not the Russian government! (wink-wink, nudge-nudge, know what I mean?)
That makes stories like this one (recalling from a past thread), because it's important and because everyone should be following the McClatchy DC investigative team, which has done the consistently best work on this abomination:
Investigators look for ties between Trump, Russia cyber operations
This is how you collude with Russia without (technically, verbal-loophole-exploiting) colluding with a foreign government. I suspect Mueller won't see much of a distinction, however, and I think that's the avenue he will use to make his case.
posted by martin q blank at 8:11 AM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
where Trump family members were welcomed to share their suggestions
HAHAHAHAHAHOHOHOHEEHEE
Lies and innuendo.
Innuendo and lies.
posted by Melismata at 8:11 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
HAHAHAHAHAHOHOHOHEEHEE
Lies and innuendo.
Innuendo and lies.
posted by Melismata at 8:11 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Kushner and Trump can (for now, conceivably) say they did not collude with any foreign government, in that perhaps they did not get on the phone with Putin himself or email some Ministry chief of bureaucrat and plan collusion.
Yup, the fact that the Russian government is smart enough to use cutouts doesn't absolve him.
posted by diogenes at 8:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Yup, the fact that the Russian government is smart enough to use cutouts doesn't absolve him.
posted by diogenes at 8:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
"It depends on your definition of 'did'." -- Kushner [fake]
posted by runcifex at 8:22 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by runcifex at 8:22 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
I believe many congressional Republicans will not lift a finger to help Trump shut down Mueller, not because they are paragons of virtue but out of political self-interest. It's one thing to turn a blind eye to the President's crimes; it's another thing to participate in dismantling an ongoing criminal investigation in full view of the public. The appointment of a special counsel and the public knowledge of the criminal investigation into the President himself have made this dangerous territory for any Republican senator who might actively obstruct justice. They are standing next to a White House on fire, and while they will readily try to distract onlookers by talking about unmasking and Susan Rice, many will be unwilling to run toward the flames.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:24 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:24 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Starting to think of Trump as McConnell's President.
posted by ZeusHumms at 8:26 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by ZeusHumms at 8:26 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
@axios Exclusive: Trump ponders Rudy Giuliani for attorney general
@yashar
Giuliani couldn't get 50 votes in the Senate.
@mmurraypolitics
If Sessions had to recuse himself from Russia investigation due to work on Trump '16 campaign, then Rudy would, too...
@BraddJaffy
—Trump "ponders" a lotta things that don't happen
—Tough to get confirmed
—Hard to see how Rudy can't recuse from Russia given campaign role
posted by chris24 at 8:26 AM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
@yashar
Giuliani couldn't get 50 votes in the Senate.
@mmurraypolitics
If Sessions had to recuse himself from Russia investigation due to work on Trump '16 campaign, then Rudy would, too...
@BraddJaffy
—Trump "ponders" a lotta things that don't happen
—Tough to get confirmed
—Hard to see how Rudy can't recuse from Russia given campaign role
posted by chris24 at 8:26 AM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
The Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court (our highest) ruled today that local police and courts can't hold people not facing criminal charges on ICE detainers. In the ruling, which involved a guy who was ordered held in a lockup on an ICE detainer after he had a larceny charge dismissed, the court basically says it'll be damned if it will let local police arrest somebody on what is a federal civil matter when they can't do so on state civil matters. Ruling | Amicus briefs (scroll down a page or two).
posted by adamg at 8:27 AM on July 24, 2017 [54 favorites]
posted by adamg at 8:27 AM on July 24, 2017 [54 favorites]
Kushner's legal strategy:
1. perjure self like crazy
2. to Trump through limo window: "pardon me, do you have any Grey Poupon?"
3. receive pardon, mustard
posted by gurple at 8:29 AM on July 24, 2017 [68 favorites]
1. perjure self like crazy
2. to Trump through limo window: "pardon me, do you have any Grey Poupon?"
3. receive pardon, mustard
posted by gurple at 8:29 AM on July 24, 2017 [68 favorites]
CNBC: Investor confidence and America's status as the world's economic leader are at risk under Trump
During his final term as Federal Reserve chairman, Alan Greenspan noted an impediment stifling economies in the former Soviet Union: "legal chaos, rampant criminality, and widespread corruption" reminiscent of the American Wild West. "Market economies," Greenspan concluded, "require a rule of law."posted by chris24 at 8:30 AM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
Suddenly, the words and actions of President Donald Trump are raising questions about that principle here. After attacking the judiciary over his travel ban earlier this year and firing the FBI director investigating his campaign, the president has warned Special Counsel Robert Mueller about his inquiry, ripped his own attorney general and mused about issuing pre-emptive pardons. There's no sign of direct economic consequences yet, but as he strains the justice system at home and upends American commitments abroad, Trump poses two kinds of risks.
One is to investor confidence in the United States. So far, booming markets have shrugged off momentary sensations, such as the disclosure that his son and campaign chairman sought information to damage Hillary Clinton from a Russian lawyer and Russian spy. "The right trade has been to ignore political developments," said Mohamed El-Erian, chief economist for Allianz. But El-Erian warns that "a major shock" could rattle that trade.
Whether Trump himself could administer that shock — say, by firing Mueller and ending the Russia investigation altogether — would depend on how the Republican-controlled Congress reacts. Lawmakers could accept those actions, or challenge a president of their party.
The other risk is to benefits America derives from its status as the world's economic leader. Trump has already unsettled leaders of other advanced economies by casting doubt on the nation's international commitments.
The steadiness of the American political system is what has kept the dollar the world's reserve currency throughout the post World War II era and kept the U.S. the most consistent safe haven for global investment. That, in turn, has assured American businesses ready access to capital, and the federal government an entree to inexpensive financing of budget deficits.
Rudy won't recuse himself. Come on.
posted by dirigibleman at 8:32 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by dirigibleman at 8:32 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Rudy won't recuse himself. Come on.
He wouldn't volunteer it, but it would come up at confirmation hearings and his chance of being confirmed would be much less unless he agreed to.
posted by chris24 at 8:34 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
He wouldn't volunteer it, but it would come up at confirmation hearings and his chance of being confirmed would be much less unless he agreed to.
posted by chris24 at 8:34 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Kushner and Trump can (for now, conceivably) say they did not collude with any foreign government
They tried. We have the emails. It's the thought that counts.
It's too bad we won't get to see Kushner using this defense in Congress. "I did not collude; I mean, I tried but it didn't work out. Please do not revoke my binky, I mean my security clearance."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:34 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
They tried. We have the emails. It's the thought that counts.
It's too bad we won't get to see Kushner using this defense in Congress. "I did not collude; I mean, I tried but it didn't work out. Please do not revoke my binky, I mean my security clearance."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:34 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
It's one thing to turn a blind eye to the President's crimes; it's another thing to participate in dismantling an ongoing criminal investigation in full view of the public.
I thought of this last night, and I realized that it's the difference between lies and bullshit. A bullshitter knows that you don't believe the bullshit, because it doesn't matter to either of you. But a liar wants something from you. So people voted for the bullshitter, because they were going to vote against Shrillary Killton anyway, and Congresspersons mostly vote for the bullshitter's bills, because they were going to vote for lower taxes on millionaires and dismantling Obama's legacy anyway.
For instance, a guy down at the American Legion hall always talks about how he should have got the Medal of Honor back in the day, but his CO didn't like him. You nod, and commiserate about how that sucks, and you both drink your beer. But then, one day, he turns to you and he says, "Hey, you work for the DoD, right? Can you help me with my appeal to get my retirement upgraded because of that Medal of Honor I shoulda got back in the day?" And now you have to decide whether you're going to help escalate this guy's bullshit -- which never cost you anything -- into a lie -- which will cost you something, even if it's just that your name is on some stupid document that won't really do anything, or a little of your time and energy.
So yeah, maybe they will resist voting for AG Giuliani when it's obvious that he's only there to dump the investigation. But I don't have a lot of faith in today's Republican party seeing the line between the bullshit and the lies.
posted by Etrigan at 8:39 AM on July 24, 2017 [63 favorites]
I thought of this last night, and I realized that it's the difference between lies and bullshit. A bullshitter knows that you don't believe the bullshit, because it doesn't matter to either of you. But a liar wants something from you. So people voted for the bullshitter, because they were going to vote against Shrillary Killton anyway, and Congresspersons mostly vote for the bullshitter's bills, because they were going to vote for lower taxes on millionaires and dismantling Obama's legacy anyway.
For instance, a guy down at the American Legion hall always talks about how he should have got the Medal of Honor back in the day, but his CO didn't like him. You nod, and commiserate about how that sucks, and you both drink your beer. But then, one day, he turns to you and he says, "Hey, you work for the DoD, right? Can you help me with my appeal to get my retirement upgraded because of that Medal of Honor I shoulda got back in the day?" And now you have to decide whether you're going to help escalate this guy's bullshit -- which never cost you anything -- into a lie -- which will cost you something, even if it's just that your name is on some stupid document that won't really do anything, or a little of your time and energy.
So yeah, maybe they will resist voting for AG Giuliani when it's obvious that he's only there to dump the investigation. But I don't have a lot of faith in today's Republican party seeing the line between the bullshit and the lies.
posted by Etrigan at 8:39 AM on July 24, 2017 [63 favorites]
A ruthless inefficiency, and an almost fanatical devotion to the Donald... I'll come in again
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:40 AM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:40 AM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
So Kushner is really going with the "I didn't read the email with Hillary/Russia in the subject line and I missed the part of the meeting where my brother in law did the colluding" defense?
posted by TwoWordReview at 8:40 AM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by TwoWordReview at 8:40 AM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
This whole thing reminds me of that great quote in the movie Casino: "But in the end, we fucked it all up. It should have been so sweet, too. But it turned out to be the last time that street guys like us were ever given anything that fuckin' valuable again."
posted by Melismata at 8:43 AM on July 24, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by Melismata at 8:43 AM on July 24, 2017 [20 favorites]
Your Honor, I was asked to show up at the bank with the gun and the comically large sack with a dollar sign on it, and that's what I did. Yes, I got an email inviting me to rob the bank, but I barely skimmed it.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:43 AM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:43 AM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
So Kushner is really going with the "I didn't read the email with Hillary/Russia in the subject line and I missed the part of the meeting where my brother in law did the colluding" defense
I just happened to be out front in a running car wearing a mask while my friends tried to rob the bank.
posted by chris24 at 8:44 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
I just happened to be out front in a running car wearing a mask while my friends tried to rob the bank.
posted by chris24 at 8:44 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
"But it turned out to be the last time that street guys like us were ever given anything that fuckin' valuable again."
I guess we need a Casino: Special Edition
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:44 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
I guess we need a Casino: Special Edition
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:44 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Goddammit EMRJKC94!
posted by chris24 at 8:45 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by chris24 at 8:45 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Your Honor, I was asked to show up at the bank with the gun and the comically large sack with a dollar sign on it, and that's what I did. Yes, I got an email inviting me to rob the bank, but I barely skimmed it.
"I know a lot of people, and getting an email with the subject 'ROB BANK TOMORROW?' might have meant that Donald Jr. was asking whether I'd met with Robert Banks and Thomas Morrow. We're pretty 'cazh' about names, as the kids say these days."
posted by Etrigan at 8:49 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
"I know a lot of people, and getting an email with the subject 'ROB BANK TOMORROW?' might have meant that Donald Jr. was asking whether I'd met with Robert Banks and Thomas Morrow. We're pretty 'cazh' about names, as the kids say these days."
posted by Etrigan at 8:49 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Some more highly germane quotes from Casino:
This guy could fuck up a cup of coffee.
You fucking mo-mo, what's the matter with you?
Back home, they would have put me in jail for what I'm doing. But out here, they're givin' me awards.
and finally...
Ol' Don's as useless as tits on a boar.
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:57 AM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
This guy could fuck up a cup of coffee.
You fucking mo-mo, what's the matter with you?
Back home, they would have put me in jail for what I'm doing. But out here, they're givin' me awards.
and finally...
Ol' Don's as useless as tits on a boar.
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:57 AM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
twowordreview: So Kushner is really going with the "I didn't read the email with Hillary/Russia in the subject line and I missed the part of the meeting where my brother in law did the colluding" defense?
Yeah, I was just about to mention the subject line in the email and Kushner's ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ response. Recall, it was:
Reminds me of the "Bin Laden determined to strike within the United States" title.
posted by pjenks at 8:59 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Yeah, I was just about to mention the subject line in the email and Kushner's ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ response. Recall, it was:
FW: Russia - Clinton - private and confidentialKushner's evasion:
[Don Jr] eventually sent me his own email changing the time of the meeting to 4:00 p.m. That email was on top of a long back and forth that I did not read at the time. As I did with most emails when I was working remotely, I quickly reviewed on my iPhone the relevant message that the meeting would occur at 4:00 PM at his office.isn't even mentioned in the WaPost's new analysis of the Kushner statement.
Reminds me of the "Bin Laden determined to strike within the United States" title.
posted by pjenks at 8:59 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
I'm honestly surprised Kushner isn't simply pleading the Fifth Amendment. I wonder what his lawyer advised? Maybe Jared has sufficient self-regard that he thinks he can transform the investigations and his fate by flashing his winning smile. Maybe he thinks pleading the Fifth would jeopardize his future presidential campaign.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:01 AM on July 24, 2017
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:01 AM on July 24, 2017
Talking Points Memo: ‘We Have To Get It Together’: GOP Panics Over Imploding Agenda
“As Republicans, we are wired the same way on tax reform,” House Speaker Paul Ryan (R-WI) told reporters on Friday, according to the Boston Globe. “Obviously, we’ve seen in the Senate there are a difference of opinions on how to do health care reform. We are so much more unified on tax reform, on what it looks like, and how to do it, and the need to do it.”
But members of his own caucus strongly disagree, warning things will only get worse.
“Nope. I think potentially it’s even harder,” Rep. Mario Diaz Balart (R-FL) told TPM when asked if he thought tax reform would be easier than health care to shepherd through Congress. “I believe it to be more difficult, equally if not more complex and with a lot more landmines than health care.”
“Anyone who thinks this is going to be a simple task hasn’t been around tax legislation,” said former Rep. Tom Reynolds (R-NY), who served both as chairman of House Republicans’ campaign committee and as a senior member of the House Ways and Means Committee while in Congress. “The House, Senate and president need to put some points on the board ahead of the 2018 election. … The House could be in play if they’re not careful.”
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:02 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
“As Republicans, we are wired the same way on tax reform,” House Speaker Paul Ryan (R-WI) told reporters on Friday, according to the Boston Globe. “Obviously, we’ve seen in the Senate there are a difference of opinions on how to do health care reform. We are so much more unified on tax reform, on what it looks like, and how to do it, and the need to do it.”
But members of his own caucus strongly disagree, warning things will only get worse.
“Nope. I think potentially it’s even harder,” Rep. Mario Diaz Balart (R-FL) told TPM when asked if he thought tax reform would be easier than health care to shepherd through Congress. “I believe it to be more difficult, equally if not more complex and with a lot more landmines than health care.”
“Anyone who thinks this is going to be a simple task hasn’t been around tax legislation,” said former Rep. Tom Reynolds (R-NY), who served both as chairman of House Republicans’ campaign committee and as a senior member of the House Ways and Means Committee while in Congress. “The House, Senate and president need to put some points on the board ahead of the 2018 election. … The House could be in play if they’re not careful.”
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:02 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
On the one hand, I would love nothing more than for the Senate to stick a fork in Repeal and Go Fuck Yourself and move on to tax cuts. On the other hand, I find discussion of taxes in public discourse to be so. fucking. annoying. People seriously want something for nothing and it enrages me. Democrats aren't the freeloading moochers here, it's Republicans who gripe nonstop about taxes and then drive away across bridges that aren't falling down to take their kids to schools that are free and spend all their time praising a military that isn't just doing that job for their health and WHY DOES NO ONE SEE THE PROBLEM HERE???
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:07 AM on July 24, 2017 [65 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:07 AM on July 24, 2017 [65 favorites]
A ruthless inefficiency, and an almost fanatical devotion to the Donald... I'll come in again
Seether, one on't cross beams STILL gone owt askew on treddle, innit?
posted by pyramid termite at 9:13 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Seether, one on't cross beams STILL gone owt askew on treddle, innit?
posted by pyramid termite at 9:13 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Tax the Super-Rich. Help the Middle Class. A Better Deal. Papa Johns.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:14 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:14 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Ol' Don's as useless as tits on a boar.
I would have said "as nuts on a truck" but apparently I know nothing.
posted by freecellwizard at 9:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
I would have said "as nuts on a truck" but apparently I know nothing.
posted by freecellwizard at 9:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Tax the Super-Rich. Help the Middle Class. A Better Deal.
First we need to educate people on the fact that no, you will never been super rich. You probably won't ever be merely rich. You are not a temporarily embarrassed millionaire. The actual millionaires do not give a shit about you. Their wealth does not mean they are good, or hard-working, or nice, or smart. They are not the Elect. They are not Capitalist Jesus's Chosen People. Tax the fuck out of them.
Democrats: Tax the fuck out of them.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:21 AM on July 24, 2017 [35 favorites]
First we need to educate people on the fact that no, you will never been super rich. You probably won't ever be merely rich. You are not a temporarily embarrassed millionaire. The actual millionaires do not give a shit about you. Their wealth does not mean they are good, or hard-working, or nice, or smart. They are not the Elect. They are not Capitalist Jesus's Chosen People. Tax the fuck out of them.
Democrats: Tax the fuck out of them.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:21 AM on July 24, 2017 [35 favorites]
Ol' Don's as useless as tits on a boar.
I would have said "as nuts on a truck" but apparently I know nothing.
Nah, someone's making money off those.
posted by Etrigan at 9:23 AM on July 24, 2017
I would have said "as nuts on a truck" but apparently I know nothing.
Nah, someone's making money off those.
posted by Etrigan at 9:23 AM on July 24, 2017
The first tweet combined with also refusing to investigate Clinton is 100% what I think his problem with Sessions is.
@jbarro:
It's gotta be that Trump has already told Sessions to unrecuse / fire Mueller / stop the probe and Sessions told him no.
@jbarro:
Tough to be a Lawful Evil in a Chaotic Evil organization.
posted by chris24 at 9:25 AM on July 24, 2017 [78 favorites]
@jbarro:
It's gotta be that Trump has already told Sessions to unrecuse / fire Mueller / stop the probe and Sessions told him no.
@jbarro:
Tough to be a Lawful Evil in a Chaotic Evil organization.
posted by chris24 at 9:25 AM on July 24, 2017 [78 favorites]
Just adding to the "What Dems need to different in 2018" conversation:
What I don't think has been mentioned, at least not recently, are the massive changes to the media landscape over the last few decades. There are two parts to this:
- Beginning around when Craigslist came out, newspapers have been losing revenue, laying off staff, and consolidating to the point where a lot of important stuff never gets covered. Quality seriously suffers.
- The conservative media, aided by pushes to deregulate, billions of donor dollars, and a general lack of journalistic integrity, has firmly established itself such that many tens of millions of people watch/listen to only it. This same conservative media also does its best to tear down the so-called "main-stream media".
Has any Democrat pushed for undoing the massive media monopolies that have formed? Someone like a media trust-buster?
posted by cman at 9:25 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
What I don't think has been mentioned, at least not recently, are the massive changes to the media landscape over the last few decades. There are two parts to this:
- Beginning around when Craigslist came out, newspapers have been losing revenue, laying off staff, and consolidating to the point where a lot of important stuff never gets covered. Quality seriously suffers.
- The conservative media, aided by pushes to deregulate, billions of donor dollars, and a general lack of journalistic integrity, has firmly established itself such that many tens of millions of people watch/listen to only it. This same conservative media also does its best to tear down the so-called "main-stream media".
Has any Democrat pushed for undoing the massive media monopolies that have formed? Someone like a media trust-buster?
posted by cman at 9:25 AM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
I'm doubtful that Trump will fire Sessions.
But, even if his replacement is Giuliani, I think it'd be the best possible event.
If you just take "Attorney General Giuliani" in isolation, sure it sounds horrible. But in context it looks like an improvement to me. That means we would have gotten Sessions out of the Senate to be AG, then replaced his unreconstructed Confederate laser focus on hurting as many black people as possible with the more diffuse harm done by Giuliani.
Further, it'd doubtless enrage the Senate Republicans who will see it as their good friend Jeff, who sacrificed the awesomeness of a Senate seat to help out Trump, being ratfucked by Trump. It won't be a surely this moment, there will never be a surely this moment, but it'll be one more reason for the Senate Republicans to hate Trump and one more wedge between them.
At this point our hope for the future relies on the Executive being as chaotic, disorganized, and generally incompetent as possible, and the Congressional Republicans being stymied by infighting and factionalism to the extent that they can do very little until the 2018 election season starts and that distracts them all.
The ratfucking of Sessions by Trump sounds like an ideal sort of shiny object to distract Congressional Republicans with so they have less time to focus on hurting us.
And yes, Attorney General Giuliani would immediately start as many attacks on the Clintons as he could possibly manage.
Good.
Yes, it's awful to see a genuine partisan witch hunt, and no the Clintons don't deserve this.
But from a sheer cold blooded political standpoint Giuliani going after the Clintons is an excellent shiny object to district not just Trump and the Congressional Republicans, **BUT ALSO** the Republican base with. And the Clintons can afford all the attack dog lawyers in the world to tie everything up in court forever, all it'll cost them is some money.
An Attorney General distracted by a futile anti-Clinton campaign is an Attorney General who is not focusing their attention on denying voting rights to minorities, abusing black people, and waging the War on Drugs.
We can't hope for good. What we have to hope for is less bad, or bad that's less capable. And Attorney General Giuliani is less horrible, less focused, and less capable than Attorney General Jeff Sessions.
And, if Trump fires Sessions then can't get Giuliani through the Senate so much the better! We'd still be rid of Sessions, the Republicans would still hate Trump for dumping Sessions, and the Justice Department would have months, possibly longer, without a Trump appointee to aim it at American voters and abuse them.
It's just a pipe dream, Trump won't fire Sessions. But if he did I can't really see a downside except the Clintons having to spend some money on lawyers, and they've got too much money anyway.
posted by sotonohito at 9:29 AM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
But, even if his replacement is Giuliani, I think it'd be the best possible event.
If you just take "Attorney General Giuliani" in isolation, sure it sounds horrible. But in context it looks like an improvement to me. That means we would have gotten Sessions out of the Senate to be AG, then replaced his unreconstructed Confederate laser focus on hurting as many black people as possible with the more diffuse harm done by Giuliani.
Further, it'd doubtless enrage the Senate Republicans who will see it as their good friend Jeff, who sacrificed the awesomeness of a Senate seat to help out Trump, being ratfucked by Trump. It won't be a surely this moment, there will never be a surely this moment, but it'll be one more reason for the Senate Republicans to hate Trump and one more wedge between them.
At this point our hope for the future relies on the Executive being as chaotic, disorganized, and generally incompetent as possible, and the Congressional Republicans being stymied by infighting and factionalism to the extent that they can do very little until the 2018 election season starts and that distracts them all.
The ratfucking of Sessions by Trump sounds like an ideal sort of shiny object to distract Congressional Republicans with so they have less time to focus on hurting us.
And yes, Attorney General Giuliani would immediately start as many attacks on the Clintons as he could possibly manage.
Good.
Yes, it's awful to see a genuine partisan witch hunt, and no the Clintons don't deserve this.
But from a sheer cold blooded political standpoint Giuliani going after the Clintons is an excellent shiny object to district not just Trump and the Congressional Republicans, **BUT ALSO** the Republican base with. And the Clintons can afford all the attack dog lawyers in the world to tie everything up in court forever, all it'll cost them is some money.
An Attorney General distracted by a futile anti-Clinton campaign is an Attorney General who is not focusing their attention on denying voting rights to minorities, abusing black people, and waging the War on Drugs.
We can't hope for good. What we have to hope for is less bad, or bad that's less capable. And Attorney General Giuliani is less horrible, less focused, and less capable than Attorney General Jeff Sessions.
And, if Trump fires Sessions then can't get Giuliani through the Senate so much the better! We'd still be rid of Sessions, the Republicans would still hate Trump for dumping Sessions, and the Justice Department would have months, possibly longer, without a Trump appointee to aim it at American voters and abuse them.
It's just a pipe dream, Trump won't fire Sessions. But if he did I can't really see a downside except the Clintons having to spend some money on lawyers, and they've got too much money anyway.
posted by sotonohito at 9:29 AM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
RE: Criticizing political donations
IIRC, campaign donations are Speech. Why do Trump Supporters hate Free Speech?
posted by mikelieman at 9:33 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
IIRC, campaign donations are Speech. Why do Trump Supporters hate Free Speech?
posted by mikelieman at 9:33 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
But Giuliani is also racist as fuck.
posted by Cookiebastard at 9:34 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Cookiebastard at 9:34 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
I really cannot get enthused about any side benefits of Hillary Clinton yet again being made the focus of a viciously idiotic hate campaign, now with extra legal force behind it. I mean Jesus Christ.
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:36 AM on July 24, 2017 [57 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:36 AM on July 24, 2017 [57 favorites]
Someone like a media trust-buster?
If only there were some sort of commission charged with overseeing communications regulation at a federal level
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:38 AM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
If only there were some sort of commission charged with overseeing communications regulation at a federal level
posted by tivalasvegas at 9:38 AM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
I'm not enthused, I just see it as an improvement over the KKK agenda of Sessions. It sucks for Clinton, and I feel sympathy for her. I'm just trying to see silver linings here.
posted by sotonohito at 9:38 AM on July 24, 2017
posted by sotonohito at 9:38 AM on July 24, 2017
But from a sheer cold blooded political standpoint Giuliani going after the Clintons is an excellent shiny object to district not just Trump and the Congressional Republicans, **BUT ALSO** the Republican base with. And the Clintons can afford all the attack dog lawyers in the world to tie everything up in court forever, all it'll cost them is some money.
I don't know why you like to fantasize about conflicts involving people who don't deserve it who aren't you but please stop. It's bad form as a human being with empathy.
posted by Talez at 9:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
I don't know why you like to fantasize about conflicts involving people who don't deserve it who aren't you but please stop. It's bad form as a human being with empathy.
posted by Talez at 9:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
But if he did I can't really see a downside except the Clintons having to spend some money on lawyers, and they've got too much money anyway.
Heh.... this is money plus a ton of wasted time and media attention (and we know how that goes with Hillary), no biggy.... not so sure.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 9:41 AM on July 24, 2017
Heh.... this is money plus a ton of wasted time and media attention (and we know how that goes with Hillary), no biggy.... not so sure.
posted by WaterAndPixels at 9:41 AM on July 24, 2017
lol yes a DOJ retooled to persecute the president's political enemies will definitely stop with Hillary Clinton
posted by theodolite at 9:42 AM on July 24, 2017 [51 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 9:42 AM on July 24, 2017 [51 favorites]
Chaffitz on Fox News: So every time a Democrat says ‘I gotta talk to Donald Trump Jr.,’ then go up and bring Chelsea Clinton in there,” the congressman continued, arguing that the former first daughter was “involved in the Benghazi situation” and the Clinton Foundation.
JFC.
posted by Room 641-A at 9:50 AM on July 24, 2017 [24 favorites]
JFC.
posted by Room 641-A at 9:50 AM on July 24, 2017 [24 favorites]
I look forward to Aidan Mezvinsky having to decide whether to reschedule his MCATs in 2038 because he's being called to testify before Congress again over Benghazi.
posted by Etrigan at 9:54 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by Etrigan at 9:54 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
But from a sheer cold blooded political standpoint Giuliani going after the Clintons is an excellent shiny object to district not just Trump and the Congressional Republicans, **BUT ALSO** the Republican base with.
Which will immediately and for years to come blow back onto any and all Democratic candidates for office from Senate down to dog catcher who has ever breathed the same air as any of the Clintons. The hatred of Hillary Clinton amongst all walks of Americans is irrational, violent, freely and openly manipulated to great effect by the power brokers in the GOP, and was just a mere 6 months ago used to devastating effect to elect the single most unqualified, unfit, hateful, criminal President in the history of the Republic. Let's not do that again, shall we?
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:54 AM on July 24, 2017 [48 favorites]
Which will immediately and for years to come blow back onto any and all Democratic candidates for office from Senate down to dog catcher who has ever breathed the same air as any of the Clintons. The hatred of Hillary Clinton amongst all walks of Americans is irrational, violent, freely and openly manipulated to great effect by the power brokers in the GOP, and was just a mere 6 months ago used to devastating effect to elect the single most unqualified, unfit, hateful, criminal President in the history of the Republic. Let's not do that again, shall we?
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:54 AM on July 24, 2017 [48 favorites]
ratfucked by Trump
Got a nice ring to it. This is the future of the death of the Rep. party and T administration. You can only ratfuck so many before you literally run out of people to ratfuck and then when you need someone to just hold back one little detail in that subpoenaed testimony, they will instead give it up gladly and then... and then... (be still my heart!)
But this, seriously, will probably be Trump's downfall, his inability not to be a total fucking dickhead All The Time. Also his unfamiliarity with how to operate in a lawful manner.
Giuliani as AG would suck because he, Rudy G, appears to be suffering from some form of dementia. And I don't mean this snarkily - he seems to be genuinely ill. So, it would be great if he didn't get in a position of power - we already have the one noodle-headed dummy in the executive.
posted by From Bklyn at 9:58 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Got a nice ring to it. This is the future of the death of the Rep. party and T administration. You can only ratfuck so many before you literally run out of people to ratfuck and then when you need someone to just hold back one little detail in that subpoenaed testimony, they will instead give it up gladly and then... and then... (be still my heart!)
But this, seriously, will probably be Trump's downfall, his inability not to be a total fucking dickhead All The Time. Also his unfamiliarity with how to operate in a lawful manner.
Giuliani as AG would suck because he, Rudy G, appears to be suffering from some form of dementia. And I don't mean this snarkily - he seems to be genuinely ill. So, it would be great if he didn't get in a position of power - we already have the one noodle-headed dummy in the executive.
posted by From Bklyn at 9:58 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
But Giuliani is also racist as fuck.
In the spectrum of racism, there's prejudiced against black people and there's can't-get-it-up-until-he's-tossed-another-black-person-in-prison.
So Giuliani would be an improvement.
posted by ocschwar at 9:59 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
In the spectrum of racism, there's prejudiced against black people and there's can't-get-it-up-until-he's-tossed-another-black-person-in-prison.
So Giuliani would be an improvement.
posted by ocschwar at 9:59 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Worth reading the whole of Speaker Ryan's response on Mueller. The host says outright it's a witch-hunt, and Ryan contradicts him.
“Remember, Bob Mueller is a Republican who was appointed by a Republican who served in a Republican administration and stayed on until his term ended,” Ryan responded. “But I don’t think many people are saying Bob Mueller is a person who is a biased partisan. He’s really sort of anything but.”
“The point is, we have an investigation in the House, an investigation in the Senate, and a special counsel, which sort of depoliticizes this stuff, and gets it out of the political theater,” Ryan continued. “That is, I think, better, to get this off to the side. I think the facts will vindicate themselves. And then, let’s just go do our jobs.”
“So what we’re not focused on doing is spending all of our time on Russia, spending all of our time on this intrigue,” Ryan concluded. “We want to spend our time focusing on solving people’s problems.”
Not only is he refusing to call it a partisan witch-hunt, he's refusing to imply that the investigation is groundless. He doesn't say the President will vindicate himself. He says the facts will vindicate themselves. He directly contradicts the President regarding Mueller's credentials. The political calculus has changed. Even on conservative talk radio, Speaker Ryan has no desire to chain himself to this sinking ship. He is eyeing the lifeboats.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:00 AM on July 24, 2017 [73 favorites]
“Remember, Bob Mueller is a Republican who was appointed by a Republican who served in a Republican administration and stayed on until his term ended,” Ryan responded. “But I don’t think many people are saying Bob Mueller is a person who is a biased partisan. He’s really sort of anything but.”
“The point is, we have an investigation in the House, an investigation in the Senate, and a special counsel, which sort of depoliticizes this stuff, and gets it out of the political theater,” Ryan continued. “That is, I think, better, to get this off to the side. I think the facts will vindicate themselves. And then, let’s just go do our jobs.”
“So what we’re not focused on doing is spending all of our time on Russia, spending all of our time on this intrigue,” Ryan concluded. “We want to spend our time focusing on solving people’s problems.”
Not only is he refusing to call it a partisan witch-hunt, he's refusing to imply that the investigation is groundless. He doesn't say the President will vindicate himself. He says the facts will vindicate themselves. He directly contradicts the President regarding Mueller's credentials. The political calculus has changed. Even on conservative talk radio, Speaker Ryan has no desire to chain himself to this sinking ship. He is eyeing the lifeboats.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:00 AM on July 24, 2017 [73 favorites]
> So Giuliani would be an improvement.
"2017, ladies and gentlemen!"
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:01 AM on July 24, 2017 [32 favorites]
"2017, ladies and gentlemen!"
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:01 AM on July 24, 2017 [32 favorites]
From the New York Times: "If tougher sanctions against Russia are approved by Congress this week, President Trump has little choice, his aides acknowledge, but to sign the legislation."
He's totally going to veto it.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:09 AM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
He's totally going to veto it.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:09 AM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
He is eyeing the lifeboats Presidency.
posted by soundguy99 at 10:11 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by soundguy99 at 10:11 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
He's totally going to veto it.
That would require him to actually think about it.
posted by Melismata at 10:12 AM on July 24, 2017
That would require him to actually think about it.
posted by Melismata at 10:12 AM on July 24, 2017
But, even if his replacement is Giuliani, I think it'd be the best possible event.
I lived in New York during his administrations. Suggest you read up on that time period.
Especially the way minority groups and the homeless were treated. As well as his blatant disregard for civil rights. Giuliani is not just a run of the mill racist. He pursued policies that persecuted African Americans and Latinos in this city, decades after the Civil Rights Act, then tried to muzzle the press for reporting it. His administration isolated, separated and targeted those groups and subjected them to unequal treatment by the police and the criminal justice system. This led to extensive racial profiling, the abuse of NYPD prisoners and the murder of unarmed minorities by police officers.
He recently referred to Black Lives Matter as "inherently racist." To Giuliani, the very act of protesting that African Americans have been murdered by the police is a problem.
Giuliani's negligence also contributed to what I believe is the largest massacre of first responders in American history.
He's out of power and should never, ever again be allowed to wield it against anyone.
posted by zarq at 10:13 AM on July 24, 2017 [64 favorites]
I lived in New York during his administrations. Suggest you read up on that time period.
Especially the way minority groups and the homeless were treated. As well as his blatant disregard for civil rights. Giuliani is not just a run of the mill racist. He pursued policies that persecuted African Americans and Latinos in this city, decades after the Civil Rights Act, then tried to muzzle the press for reporting it. His administration isolated, separated and targeted those groups and subjected them to unequal treatment by the police and the criminal justice system. This led to extensive racial profiling, the abuse of NYPD prisoners and the murder of unarmed minorities by police officers.
He recently referred to Black Lives Matter as "inherently racist." To Giuliani, the very act of protesting that African Americans have been murdered by the police is a problem.
Giuliani's negligence also contributed to what I believe is the largest massacre of first responders in American history.
He's out of power and should never, ever again be allowed to wield it against anyone.
posted by zarq at 10:13 AM on July 24, 2017 [64 favorites]
More than 7,000 Sisters Sign NETWORK Lobby ‘Nuns’ Letter’ Against ACA Repeal (press release). Nuns are protesting on The Hill today as well.
The plan is still for a vote tomorrow. A vote on what? Nobody knows. Call your Senators. Oppose the Motion to Proceed. I thank you, the nuns thank you.
posted by zachlipton at 10:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
The plan is still for a vote tomorrow. A vote on what? Nobody knows. Call your Senators. Oppose the Motion to Proceed. I thank you, the nuns thank you.
posted by zachlipton at 10:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
I missed the beginning of Kushner's public statement, he basically said nothing there, right?
posted by TwoWordReview at 10:17 AM on July 24, 2017
posted by TwoWordReview at 10:17 AM on July 24, 2017
Kushner: "I did not rely on Russian money in any of my business dealings."
This is lawyerese for "I did business with Russians all the time" isn't it? He just didn't RELY on them. He could have found that money somewhere else, but why bother?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:18 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
This is lawyerese for "I did business with Russians all the time" isn't it? He just didn't RELY on them. He could have found that money somewhere else, but why bother?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:18 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
I've been on vacation so haven't been able to follow things very closely. Does anyone know why Kushner won't be under oath when he talks to Congress? That seems like an obvious invitation for him to continue obfuscating and forgetting things before suddenly remembering them in time to update his false statements.
posted by tonycpsu at 10:18 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by tonycpsu at 10:18 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
Kusner's statement was worthless, but the visuals, oh man. Could not have been any more "Thanks for joining me here w the White House behind me and its seal in front of me. Bound together w the WH and the President, that's me." unless he was holding a miniature White House souvenir as he spoke.
posted by zachlipton at 10:18 AM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 10:18 AM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
Maybe he forgot about tomorrow.
posted by rc3spencer at 10:18 AM on July 24, 2017
posted by rc3spencer at 10:18 AM on July 24, 2017
After hearing Kushner speak, no wonder donald never lets him talk. Dude has no public speaking ability; I hate his father-in-law more than any being on this planet but at least he conveys some charisma at a media appearance. Hopefully this performance gets low marks from the media and gets the kush canned
posted by andruwjones26 at 10:19 AM on July 24, 2017
posted by andruwjones26 at 10:19 AM on July 24, 2017
Clearly, Trump and his coterie don't know about Burdick v. US. Here's the good bit:
Apologies, MeFi friends. I didn't realize this was obiter dicta, and has no force of law.
posted by Mental Wimp at 10:19 AM on July 24, 2017
Apologies, MeFi friends. I didn't realize this was obiter dicta, and has no force of law.
posted by Mental Wimp at 10:19 AM on July 24, 2017
I really don't think Guiliani would be confirmed.
1) He'd have to explain in more detail how and why he had the inside scoop on Clinton from the FBI.
1) He'd have to explain in more detail how and why he had the inside scoop on Clinton from the FBI.
A week ago, FBI Director James Comey sent a letter to Congress that effectively intervened in the presidential campaign. Two days earlier, Rudy Giuliani, one of Donald Trump’s surrogates, told Fox News that the Republican ticket had “a surprise or two that you’re going to hear about in the next few days.”2) He and his company have a ton of questionable ties to sketchy foreign governments and companies. Including...drum roll... Russia.
Giuliani added that he was “talking about some pretty big surprises” that “should turn [the presidential campaign] around.” He added, “I think it will be enormously effective.”
With the benefit of hindsight, we now know, of course, what the former mayor was referring to. But it raises a fairly obvious question: how’d the Trump campaign know what the FBI intended to do and when the bureau would do it?
As the Huffington Post noted this morning, Giuliani appeared on Fox and explained what happened. Rudy Giuliani said Friday that he knew the FBI planned to review more emails tied to Hillary Clinton before a public announcement about the investigation last week, confirming that the agency leaked information to Donald Trump’s presidential campaign. […]
“I did nothing to get it out, I had no role in it,” he said. “Did I hear about it? You’re darn right I heard about it, and I can’t even repeat the language that I heard from the former FBI agents.”
TriGlobal Strategic Ventures, a company that aims to “assist Western clients in furthering their business interests in the emerging economies of the former Soviet Union,” according to its website, is among the more obscure clients.posted by chris24 at 10:19 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Records show Mr. Giuliani has had ties dating to at least 2004 to TriGlobal, a company that has provided image consulting to Russian oligarchs and clients with deep Kremlin ties. They have included Transneft, Russia’s state-owned oil pipeline giant, which is the target of Western sanctions imposed after President Vladimir V. Putin annexed Crimea and began meddling in Ukraine.
TriGlobal’s advisory board includes Ara Abramyan, listed on the company’s website as a “very close Advisor to the Russian Government’s inner circle including the President and the Prime Minister.” The company’s founding partners are Andrey Drobyshev, who claims to have strong relations with regional and municipal governments in Russia, and Vitaly Pruss, whose website profile says that he has focused on “international image development and PR for Russian & Ukrainian companies” and that from 2008 to 2011, he worked “closely with Giuliani Partners LLC.”
Jeffrey Berman, one of TriGlobal’s managing partners, is also vice president of Berman Enterprises, a family-run company that worked with Giuliani Partners in 2008 to form a commercial and residential real estate investment vehicle called the Berman Opportunity Fund. Its purpose was to target foreign investors looking to take advantage of the weak dollar through real estate investments in New York and Washington.
Paraphrasing Kushner: Donald Trump won the presidency because he had a better message and a better campaign than Hillary Clinton, and to suggest otherwise is an insult to the people who voted for him.
... the electoral college might have helped a bit though
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:19 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
... the electoral college might have helped a bit though
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:19 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Does anyone know why Kushner won't be under oath when he talks to Congress?
Presumably Congress doesn't want to present too confrontational, but I saw a note the other day that, regardless, it's a crime to lie to Congress. So if he lies, he's subject to the same sanctions as if he had taken the oath and then lied.
... but he's totally lying, I'm sure.
posted by suelac at 10:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Presumably Congress doesn't want to present too confrontational, but I saw a note the other day that, regardless, it's a crime to lie to Congress. So if he lies, he's subject to the same sanctions as if he had taken the oath and then lied.
... but he's totally lying, I'm sure.
posted by suelac at 10:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
He said nothing substantial, and it might be wishful thinking, but he sounded scared.
posted by theodolite at 10:21 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 10:21 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
I saw a note the other day that, regardless, it's a crime to lie to Congress.
Thanks for sharing this. Here's a summary.
If you are testifying in front of Congress sometime soon, and are wondering how far you can bend the truth, there are a two key statutes governing perjury you need to be aware of: U.S. Code sections 1621 and 1001 of Title 18.
Section 1621 covers general perjury, and stipulates that anyone who "willfully and contrary to such oath states or subscribes any material matter which he does not believe to be true" is guilty of perjury and shall be fined or imprisoned up to five years, or both. Section 1001 covers false statements more generally, without requiring an oath. The section stipulates that "whoever, in any matter within the jurisdiction of the executive, legislative, or judicial branch of the government of the United States, knowingly and willfully" falsifies or conceals information, including before a congressional committee's inquiry, may also be fined or imprisoned up to five years.
Of course, I'm sure there's an exception for members of Congress themselves...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:23 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Thanks for sharing this. Here's a summary.
If you are testifying in front of Congress sometime soon, and are wondering how far you can bend the truth, there are a two key statutes governing perjury you need to be aware of: U.S. Code sections 1621 and 1001 of Title 18.
Section 1621 covers general perjury, and stipulates that anyone who "willfully and contrary to such oath states or subscribes any material matter which he does not believe to be true" is guilty of perjury and shall be fined or imprisoned up to five years, or both. Section 1001 covers false statements more generally, without requiring an oath. The section stipulates that "whoever, in any matter within the jurisdiction of the executive, legislative, or judicial branch of the government of the United States, knowingly and willfully" falsifies or conceals information, including before a congressional committee's inquiry, may also be fined or imprisoned up to five years.
Of course, I'm sure there's an exception for members of Congress themselves...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:23 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
zarq: Giuliani's negligence also contributed to what I believe is the largest massacre of first responders in American history.
Everyone should read the comment zarq linked to.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:24 AM on July 24, 2017 [30 favorites]
Everyone should read the comment zarq linked to.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:24 AM on July 24, 2017 [30 favorites]
To be fair I'm not sure I've ever seen him speak before and maybe he just always sounds like that
posted by theodolite at 10:24 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by theodolite at 10:24 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
I guess it's the "knowingly and willfully" part that's going to be the problem. Also, the fact that Trump will just pardon him, because he's his fucking son-in-law.
posted by tonycpsu at 10:25 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 10:25 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Summary of Obnoxious Twerp Jared Kushner's statement:
Kushner starts with an introduction and claims he served the campaign as best he could, that he believed in Trump's ideas and message. Claims it is an honor to serve the American people and talks about how he is working on ME peace. Acknowledges that he dodges the spotlight in business and politics. Says that he has been consistent with his statements since the beginning. He claims the information and documents he has shared will show that all his actions were proper.
He says, "I did not collude with Russia, nor know of any in the campaign who did". Claims he took Russian no money. Says that T ran a better campaign and questioning his legitimacy ridiculous those who voted for him. Says that he looks forward to testifying tomorrow and leaves without answering any questions.
A few of my own thoughts:
Kushner starts with an introduction and claims he served the campaign as best he could, that he believed in Trump's ideas and message. Claims it is an honor to serve the American people and talks about how he is working on ME peace. Acknowledges that he dodges the spotlight in business and politics. Says that he has been consistent with his statements since the beginning. He claims the information and documents he has shared will show that all his actions were proper.
He says, "I did not collude with Russia, nor know of any in the campaign who did". Claims he took Russian no money. Says that T ran a better campaign and questioning his legitimacy ridiculous those who voted for him. Says that he looks forward to testifying tomorrow and leaves without answering any questions.
A few of my own thoughts:
- This dude is such a bullshitter. He has been anything but consistent and straightforward with regard to his statements in forms, to Congress, and to the People.
- He claims T ran a better campaign, which is a total joke, seeing as no one in their pigshit pool thought they would win.
- The little crack about questioning the legitimacy of T's "victory" ridiculing those who voted for him is intended only to delegitimize any criticism that the free press has of the regime. This statement was a Fox soundbyte.
- His statement about not colluding with Russia are hollow AF. Dude has been trying to get money from the post-Soviet criminal world for years, repeatedly lied about contacts with Russian officials, and has tried to gain access to Moscow's secure comms infrastructure to dodge US surveillance.
- I think his strategy is more of the same New York tabloidism that infects the regime--thinking that media statements that double down on whatever lies or bullshit will be enough to slow the crushing flow of a federal investigation.
- I want this man, his father-in-law, wife, brothers-in-law, and all their enablers to time in a maximum security federal prison.
Giuliani states that homicides went down during his tenure as NYC mayor. He does this because he does not include the World Trade Center (2001) deaths as homicides. He does include the World Trade Center (1993) deaths as homicides under Dinkins last year.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 10:28 AM on July 24, 2017 [51 favorites]
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 10:28 AM on July 24, 2017 [51 favorites]
"Immediately Forget"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:29 AM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:29 AM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
He said nothing substantial, and it might be wishful thinking, but he sounded scared.
Good. Hope today's little sit down with Congress makes him lose sleep every night til his father resigns/is impeached/flees the country
posted by andruwjones26 at 10:31 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Good. Hope today's little sit down with Congress makes him lose sleep every night til his father resigns/is impeached/flees the country
posted by andruwjones26 at 10:31 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Vox: "Jared Kushner’s Russia defense raises more questions than it answers... There’s a lot for investigators to go on here."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:33 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:33 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Maybe the President has expressly forbidden his people from pleading the Fifth Amendment? Maybe he has promised them pardons if they toe the line?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:34 AM on July 24, 2017
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:34 AM on July 24, 2017
Vox: "Jared Kushner’s Russia defense raises more questions than it answers... There’s a lot for investigators to go on here."
State the obvious much? (Not you EMRJKC94)
posted by Melismata at 10:36 AM on July 24, 2017
State the obvious much? (Not you EMRJKC94)
posted by Melismata at 10:36 AM on July 24, 2017
Also, the fact that Trump will just pardon him, because he's his fucking son-in-law.
IANAL but Laurence Tribe is.
@tribelaw
Like any other power, the power to pardon can be abused in order to bribe, obstruct justice, or commit other "high crimes and misdemeanors" NYT: If Trump Pardons, It Could Be a Crime
@tribelaw
Jared, Paul, etc: Trump's promises to bail you out if you commit perjury may fail: courts could well toss out pardons by a co-conspirator!
---
And about Guiliani as AG...
@NormEisen
Mr. Pres: ok, but Giuliani too must recuse from Russia under 28 CFR 45.2, You can run but you cannot hide: https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/45.2 …
posted by chris24 at 10:36 AM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
IANAL but Laurence Tribe is.
@tribelaw
Like any other power, the power to pardon can be abused in order to bribe, obstruct justice, or commit other "high crimes and misdemeanors" NYT: If Trump Pardons, It Could Be a Crime
@tribelaw
Jared, Paul, etc: Trump's promises to bail you out if you commit perjury may fail: courts could well toss out pardons by a co-conspirator!
---
And about Guiliani as AG...
@NormEisen
Mr. Pres: ok, but Giuliani too must recuse from Russia under 28 CFR 45.2, You can run but you cannot hide: https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/28/45.2 …
posted by chris24 at 10:36 AM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
Go ahead and lie, the president will pardon you is a really incompetent strategy. You will have various individuals saying lots of things that will be readily exposed as lies and losing all credibility of even truthful denials.
Which means they are going to do it.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 10:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Which means they are going to do it.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 10:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Esme Cribb at Talking Points Memo: Wyden Calls For Kushner To Testify In Open Session Of Senate Intel Committee
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 10:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [56 favorites]
“It is imperative that the public hear Jared Kushner testify in an open session of the Senate Intelligence Committee, under oath, and support his claims with full transparency in the form of emails, documents and financial records,” Wyden said in a statement.[...]Sounds like his Senate Intelligence Committee testimony was a load of horseshit too.
“His description of his financial relationships with individuals and businesses tied to Russia appears incomplete, at best,” Wyden said.[...]
“Kushner has repeatedly concealed information about his personal finances and meetings with foreign officials,” Wyden said. “There should be no presumption that he is telling the whole truth in this statement.”
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 10:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [56 favorites]
[Don Jr] eventually sent me his own email changing the time of the meeting to 4:00 p.m. That email was on top of a long back and forth that I did not read at the time. As I did with most emails when I was working remotely, I quickly reviewed on my iPhone the relevant message that the meeting would occur at 4:00 PM at his office.
It is fascinating to me that this is clearly positioning Don Jr. to take the fall on collusion. So what is Senior going to do, support his son or his son-in-law? Obviously where he thinks his advantage lies, but if I were Don Jr I'd be looking to take ol' J down with me because I wouldn't go alone.
posted by winna at 10:44 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
It is fascinating to me that this is clearly positioning Don Jr. to take the fall on collusion. So what is Senior going to do, support his son or his son-in-law? Obviously where he thinks his advantage lies, but if I were Don Jr I'd be looking to take ol' J down with me because I wouldn't go alone.
posted by winna at 10:44 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Giuliani states that homicides went down during his tenure as NYC mayor. He does this because he does not include the World Trade Center (2001) deaths as homicides. He does include the World Trade Center (1993) deaths as homicides under Dinkins last year.It's basically true that the homicide rate went down in New York during Giuliani's tenure as mayor. It's equally true that, for reasons that aren't entirely clear, the homicide rate went down throughout the United States during Giuliani's tenure as mayor of New York. Is he claiming credit for the entire nationwide reduction? Is he claiming that, were it not for his policies, New York would have been an exception to the nationwide trend? Because I honestly don't see how the reduction in homicides is relevant to his record, unless he has some evidence that he's responsible for it.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 10:45 AM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
Good God, that Wyden statement is damning in its bareness, and it's speed. Whoa.
posted by rc3spencer at 10:49 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by rc3spencer at 10:49 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Jared Kushner reading that statement to the press: The Middle East peace guy
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 10:51 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 10:51 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Good God, that Wyden statement is damning in its bareness, and it's speed. Whoa.
In fairness, anyone here coulda written that like two weeks ago in anticipation of what Kushner would(n't) say.
posted by Etrigan at 10:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
In fairness, anyone here coulda written that like two weeks ago in anticipation of what Kushner would(n't) say.
posted by Etrigan at 10:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
I think Hillary Clinton would be a formidable opponent (again) for this bunch of chucklefucks. She would stand her ground with grace and fire. I hope it doesn't happen.
However. Every time her name gets dredged up again to cover for their ineptitude, I want to send her a case of good Chardonnay and another thank you card. In fact, I think I may create an app just to make it easier to send Hillary Clinton an apology. Maybe even an Amazon dash button.
SELECT FROM THE FOLLOWING OPTIONS:
"Sorry they are such awful pieces of shit."
"Sorry, I hope you're enjoying your walks."
"Sorry, would you rather a case of red or white?"
"Sorry they are trying to frame you for bogus crimes for propaganda purposes"
"Sorry, come back to us at the turn of the tide."
etc.
posted by lydhre at 10:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [43 favorites]
However. Every time her name gets dredged up again to cover for their ineptitude, I want to send her a case of good Chardonnay and another thank you card. In fact, I think I may create an app just to make it easier to send Hillary Clinton an apology. Maybe even an Amazon dash button.
SELECT FROM THE FOLLOWING OPTIONS:
"Sorry they are such awful pieces of shit."
"Sorry, I hope you're enjoying your walks."
"Sorry, would you rather a case of red or white?"
"Sorry they are trying to frame you for bogus crimes for propaganda purposes"
"Sorry, come back to us at the turn of the tide."
etc.
posted by lydhre at 10:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [43 favorites]
Trump is the first president in the history of the Gallup poll to never reach 50% approval in his first 6 months.
So. Much. Winning.
posted by chris24 at 10:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [77 favorites]
So. Much. Winning.
posted by chris24 at 10:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [77 favorites]
The House Freedom Caucus has a new genius plan. They want to cut the CBO staff by 89 people, then turn it into an "aggregator" where instead of analyzing legislation to determine their costs and effects, they'll just bundle together a bunch of reports from some think-tanks and declare it a job well done. They want this added to the appropriations bill.
This really is the stupidest timeline.
Speaking of the stupidest timeline, Dylan Scott brings us an update on where we are with heath care: The wild Senate health care debate is hurtling toward an unpredictable finish
posted by zachlipton at 10:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
This really is the stupidest timeline.
Speaking of the stupidest timeline, Dylan Scott brings us an update on where we are with heath care: The wild Senate health care debate is hurtling toward an unpredictable finish
In the next day or so, Senate Republicans are expected to take their first vote in a health care crusade that has consumed Congress for the past six months.Note the bit at #3 about the BCRA being a death spiral machine without a waiting period, and the Senate Parliamentarian says you can't pass a waiting period under reconciliation.
Nobody knows what they’re voting on. Nobody knows if it can pass. Nobody is even sure if the Senate’s plan to repeal and replace Obamacare, as a policy, can even work.
It is a bewildering state of affairs — and health insurance for millions of poor and middle-class Americans hangs in the balance.
posted by zachlipton at 10:52 AM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
"[Kushner] Says that he looks forward to testifying tomorrow..."
In my time in the law biz, I have never, ever heard anyone say "I am looking forward to testifying / my day in Court / setting the record straight / clearing my good name" who wasn't guilty as Sin. It's a universal truth, or as close as we get to one in this messy business.
Testifying is not a pleasant experience. It's that way by design. No-one looks forward to it -- unless they see it as an opportunity for further truth manipulation.
posted by Capt. Renault at 10:53 AM on July 24, 2017 [45 favorites]
In my time in the law biz, I have never, ever heard anyone say "I am looking forward to testifying / my day in Court / setting the record straight / clearing my good name" who wasn't guilty as Sin. It's a universal truth, or as close as we get to one in this messy business.
Testifying is not a pleasant experience. It's that way by design. No-one looks forward to it -- unless they see it as an opportunity for further truth manipulation.
posted by Capt. Renault at 10:53 AM on July 24, 2017 [45 favorites]
This is just the beginning. Mueller is looking at the data operation. Somehow the Russians were able to micro target "fake news" to swing voters on the precinct level. That wasn't just Don Jr., and Kushner was in charge of the data stuff. Kushner is trying to position Jr. as the fall man, but more is undoubtedly coming.
This is why his testimony today should have been under oath. Grassley tried to say lying to Congress is still a crime, oath or no, but there's a massive difference between contempt of congress, which requires a committee vote and referral to the US Attorney, and 18 U.S. Code § 1621, which makes simply lying under oath "before a competent tribunal, officer, or person, in any case in which a law of the United States authorizes an oath to be administered" a felony prosecutor by the DOJ, and probably by Mueller unilaterally later on. Grassley and the intel committee gave Kushner free reign to lie to them, again, knowing they would never get the votes for contempt.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:53 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
This is why his testimony today should have been under oath. Grassley tried to say lying to Congress is still a crime, oath or no, but there's a massive difference between contempt of congress, which requires a committee vote and referral to the US Attorney, and 18 U.S. Code § 1621, which makes simply lying under oath "before a competent tribunal, officer, or person, in any case in which a law of the United States authorizes an oath to be administered" a felony prosecutor by the DOJ, and probably by Mueller unilaterally later on. Grassley and the intel committee gave Kushner free reign to lie to them, again, knowing they would never get the votes for contempt.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:53 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Testifying is not a pleasant experience. It's that way by design. No-one looks forward to it
Kind of like when Trumo said he always wanted a Purple Heart.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:59 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Kind of like when Trumo said he always wanted a Purple Heart.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:59 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Paraphrasing Kushner: Donald Trump won the presidency because he had a better message and a better campaign than Hillary Clinton, and to suggest otherwise is an insult to the people who voted for him.
I am 100% okay with insulting literally all of them.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:02 AM on July 24, 2017 [48 favorites]
I am 100% okay with insulting literally all of them.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:02 AM on July 24, 2017 [48 favorites]
Grassley and the intel committee gave Kushner free reign to lie to them
How does Grassley factor into this? He isn't even on the Senate Intelligence Committee.
posted by diogenes at 11:04 AM on July 24, 2017
How does Grassley factor into this? He isn't even on the Senate Intelligence Committee.
posted by diogenes at 11:04 AM on July 24, 2017
AP: The Latest: Lawmaker blames female senators for failed bill
posted by zachlipton at 11:08 AM on July 24, 2017 [63 favorites]
A Texas Republican congressman says it’s “absolutely repugnant” that the GOP-led Senate hasn’t acted on repealing the health care law and he singled out “some female senators from the Northeast.”*breaks glass, grabs hold of emergency reserve even, can't*
In a radio interview with “1440 Keys,” Rep. Blake Farenthold said the Senate has failed to show the courage to dismantle the health care law. The Senate is expected to vote Tuesday on whether to move ahead on legislation.
Farenthold complained about some female lawmakers and said, “If it was a guy from south Texas, I might ask him to step outside and settle this Aaron Burr-style.”
posted by zachlipton at 11:08 AM on July 24, 2017 [63 favorites]
“As Republicans, we are wired the same way on tax reform,” House Speaker Paul Ryan (R-WI) told reporters on Friday...
One thing that drives me nuts is the slimy Republican tactic of calling tax cuts for the wealthy "reform," thereby coöopting the word that everyone else uses to refer to simplifying the tax code and making it more fair. And they never seem to get pushback from the press. I mean, isn't that what the question period at a press conference is for?
posted by Mental Wimp at 11:12 AM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
One thing that drives me nuts is the slimy Republican tactic of calling tax cuts for the wealthy "reform," thereby coöopting the word that everyone else uses to refer to simplifying the tax code and making it more fair. And they never seem to get pushback from the press. I mean, isn't that what the question period at a press conference is for?
posted by Mental Wimp at 11:12 AM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
[Rep. Blake] Farenthold complained about some female lawmakers and said, “If it was a guy from south Texas, I might ask him to step outside and settle this Aaron Burr-style.”
Hold on ... did he just suggest the outright murder of his political opponents?
It's times like these -- that is, every day since November of last year -- that I recall with sour amusement that Jonah Goldberg wrote a book trying to claim that it's actually liberals who are the real fascists.
posted by Gelatin at 11:14 AM on July 24, 2017 [46 favorites]
Hold on ... did he just suggest the outright murder of his political opponents?
It's times like these -- that is, every day since November of last year -- that I recall with sour amusement that Jonah Goldberg wrote a book trying to claim that it's actually liberals who are the real fascists.
posted by Gelatin at 11:14 AM on July 24, 2017 [46 favorites]
Farenthold complained about some female lawmakers and said, “If it was a guy from south Texas, I might ask him to step outside and settle this Aaron Burr-style.”
I would pay cash to see this dude wet himself the moment someone offers to take him up on this duel.
posted by Existential Dread at 11:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [22 favorites]
I would pay cash to see this dude wet himself the moment someone offers to take him up on this duel.
posted by Existential Dread at 11:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [22 favorites]
[Rep. Blake] Farenthold complained about some female lawmakers and said, “If it was a guy from south Texas, I might ask him to step outside and settle this Aaron Burr-style.”
Hold on ... did he just suggest the outright murder of his political opponents?
In point of fact, he just suggested the outright murder of his political allies.
posted by Etrigan at 11:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [106 favorites]
Hold on ... did he just suggest the outright murder of his political opponents?
In point of fact, he just suggested the outright murder of his political allies.
posted by Etrigan at 11:15 AM on July 24, 2017 [106 favorites]
I would pay cash to see this dude wet himself the moment someone offers to take him up on this duel.
Now I'm waiting on Tammy Duckworth to call him on his bluff.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:18 AM on July 24, 2017 [35 favorites]
Now I'm waiting on Tammy Duckworth to call him on his bluff.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:18 AM on July 24, 2017 [35 favorites]
One thing that drives me nuts is the slimy Republican tactic of calling tax cuts for the wealthy "reform," thereby coöopting the word that everyone else uses to refer to simplifying the tax code and making it more fair. And they never seem to get pushback from the press.
Darn that liberal media anyway!
posted by Gelatin at 11:19 AM on July 24, 2017
Darn that liberal media anyway!
posted by Gelatin at 11:19 AM on July 24, 2017
I would pay cash to see this dude wet himself the moment someone offers to take him up on this duel.
I'd settle for just a challenge to a fist fight.
posted by Gelatin at 11:20 AM on July 24, 2017
I'd settle for just a challenge to a fist fight.
posted by Gelatin at 11:20 AM on July 24, 2017
This is why his testimony today should have been under oath.
When the hearings were announced last week, someone (on MSNBC, probably) noted that after conferring with Mueller about calling Kushner and Jr, Mueller said it wouldn't conflict with his investigation, but he had two conditions: they had to be under oath, and they had to testify publicly. I'm sure they wouldn't have just ignored that so I assume this detour is part of a bigger plan.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
When the hearings were announced last week, someone (on MSNBC, probably) noted that after conferring with Mueller about calling Kushner and Jr, Mueller said it wouldn't conflict with his investigation, but he had two conditions: they had to be under oath, and they had to testify publicly. I'm sure they wouldn't have just ignored that so I assume this detour is part of a bigger plan.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
No no, you've both got it wrong. He suggested he would outright murder his political allies if they were men.
This message brought to you by the Coalition for Awareness of Sexism in Death Threats.
posted by zachlipton at 11:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [28 favorites]
This message brought to you by the Coalition for Awareness of Sexism in Death Threats.
posted by zachlipton at 11:20 AM on July 24, 2017 [28 favorites]
I love subtext: 'If they were fully fledged human beings, I'd try to murder them, but as they're ladies, political correctness puts them out of reach of my murderous impulses.'
posted by angrycat at 11:26 AM on July 24, 2017 [40 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 11:26 AM on July 24, 2017 [40 favorites]
I love subtext: 'If they were fully fledged human beings, I'd try to murder them, but as they're ladies, political correctness puts them out of reach of my murderous impulses.'
I, personally, have never felt safer!
posted by lydhre at 11:28 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
I, personally, have never felt safer!
posted by lydhre at 11:28 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
2017 is already stale, let's look ahead! The Parties Are Already Preparing For The 2018 Midterms (NPR, July 23, 2017)
Republican strategist Kevin McLaughlin:
I really look forward to those 2018 campaign messages from the GOP: "We said it for years, and we did it! We voted to repeal and replace Obamacare! Well, we almost voted, but Hillary foiled us all, with her Benghazi and her emails. Vote GOP again, we'll really vote this time!"
And anyway, what are y'all voting on? NO ONE KNOWS, AND IT DOESN'T MATTER, BECAUSE YOU'LL CHANGE THE TEXT LATER.
posted by filthy light thief at 11:28 AM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
Republican strategist Kevin McLaughlin:
You know, I think the bigger deal here for Republicans is if they don't have a vote. We have promised for seven years - we won a lot of elections based on repealing Obamacare. So if we don't do that - if we can't even hold a vote, we're going to lose our base. And as I believe Guy would agree with me, if you don't have a base going into an election, you have - you are dead in the water. So the number one most important thing to do is to hold the vote, to me.Democratic strategist Guy Cecil:
... you're hearing the Republicans continue to lower the bar on what success means. Remember, Mitch McConnell said the number one goal for Republicans was to rip Obamacare out by root and branch. Now the goal is to have a vote. And so I think as we move forward, what voters are going to find is that the promises that Republicans have been making for seven years really are empty promises.Emphasis mine, and Good job Guy Cecil on calling Kevin and the GOP on their bullshit.
I really look forward to those 2018 campaign messages from the GOP: "We said it for years, and we did it! We voted to repeal and replace Obamacare! Well, we almost voted, but Hillary foiled us all, with her Benghazi and her emails. Vote GOP again, we'll really vote this time!"
And anyway, what are y'all voting on? NO ONE KNOWS, AND IT DOESN'T MATTER, BECAUSE YOU'LL CHANGE THE TEXT LATER.
posted by filthy light thief at 11:28 AM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
Those people do not understand that the policies they like really are Democratic policies. They have a caricature of Democrats in their minds.
A lot of people identify as Republicans. Being Republicans is part of how they see themselves, part of how they understand themselves to be who they are. (And the same goes for every other ideology and party.) You cannot merely propose policies they like. You have to wear away at that element of their identity.
posted by Pope Guilty at 11:28 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
A lot of people identify as Republicans. Being Republicans is part of how they see themselves, part of how they understand themselves to be who they are. (And the same goes for every other ideology and party.) You cannot merely propose policies they like. You have to wear away at that element of their identity.
posted by Pope Guilty at 11:28 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
"My guns don't have the range to reach the pedestal upon which my party chivalrously places women."
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:30 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:30 AM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Here's the obligatory picture of Blake Farenthold in pajamas, being creepy.
posted by mcdoublewide at 11:31 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by mcdoublewide at 11:31 AM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
So do they learn what they are voting on immediately upon the vote being called on Tuesday? Is this really any way to run a democracy?
posted by Justinian at 11:32 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 11:32 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
to suggest otherwise is an insult to the people who voted for him
But then you're insulting the millions more who voted for her.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:35 AM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
One more piece from the NPR interview: McLaughlin noted that "[Trump's] already spent money, actually, in his super PAC against Dean Heller. He's already said he will spend up to $10 million against Jeff Flake."
Pro-Trump Super PAC to Run Ads Against GOP Senator Opposing Health Bill (NewsMax, 23 June 2017), focusing on Dean Heller (R-Nev), and White House squeezes Jeff Flake (Alex Isenstadt for Politico, July 17, 2017) - The Arizona senator's potential GOP primary foes have been in talks with the president and top administration officials.
It's weird to root for Trump and his cronies, but please, please continue to fracture your own party ahead of the 2018 elections. If the GOP doesn't impeach you, the Dems should be more than happy to do so, and might even send you gift baskets (with handcuffs) to you, to thank you for your service to democracy.
posted by filthy light thief at 11:39 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Pro-Trump Super PAC to Run Ads Against GOP Senator Opposing Health Bill (NewsMax, 23 June 2017), focusing on Dean Heller (R-Nev), and White House squeezes Jeff Flake (Alex Isenstadt for Politico, July 17, 2017) - The Arizona senator's potential GOP primary foes have been in talks with the president and top administration officials.
It's weird to root for Trump and his cronies, but please, please continue to fracture your own party ahead of the 2018 elections. If the GOP doesn't impeach you, the Dems should be more than happy to do so, and might even send you gift baskets (with handcuffs) to you, to thank you for your service to democracy.
posted by filthy light thief at 11:39 AM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Their minds have been poisoned entirely by places like Fox News, and outside of burning out the infection, there's really nothing left. The cure is probably just as bad as the disease.
What does this mean in concrete terms? What do we mean by "burning out the infection", and what would "the cure" be?
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 11:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
What does this mean in concrete terms? What do we mean by "burning out the infection", and what would "the cure" be?
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 11:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
I want President Pelosi! I know it's a long shot. But I dream.
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:41 AM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
What does this mean in concrete terms?
Curious Yellow (Glasshouse reference), if I were to take a guess based on the scale, target, and problem.
posted by Slackermagee at 11:43 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Curious Yellow (Glasshouse reference), if I were to take a guess based on the scale, target, and problem.
posted by Slackermagee at 11:43 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
So do they learn what they are voting on immediately upon the vote being called on Tuesday? Is this really any way to run a democracy
Worse. They learn what they are voting on immediately after the vote being called. First they vote on a Motion to Proceed. That's on the AHCA the House passed. Then the amendments start. Some of those amendments can be "strike out everything and replace it with X." X could be the 2015 repeal-lite bill, BCRA, or a bill requiring orphans personally hand over all their money to the 400 richest Americans. They can even conflict, so they could vote yes on an amendment to replace it with the 2015 bill, then vote yes again on an amendment to replace that with BCRA.
It's the "let's just do it and be legends, man" of legislating, except millions of people's health care are at risk.
Honestly, even if they lose the vote, I don't think it's over. If they do have a vote and it fails, outside groups are going to have a handy list of targets. The pressure on them will be insane. We already have members of Congress threatening duels, and that's before there is a vote on record. Or they'll move on and start adding more provisions to sabotage Obamacare into the CHIP (children's health insurance) re-authorization that's coming up and Trump will declare open enrollment is now only available in person during a seven minute window in Barrow, Alaska in December. It's not going to stop.
posted by zachlipton at 11:43 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Worse. They learn what they are voting on immediately after the vote being called. First they vote on a Motion to Proceed. That's on the AHCA the House passed. Then the amendments start. Some of those amendments can be "strike out everything and replace it with X." X could be the 2015 repeal-lite bill, BCRA, or a bill requiring orphans personally hand over all their money to the 400 richest Americans. They can even conflict, so they could vote yes on an amendment to replace it with the 2015 bill, then vote yes again on an amendment to replace that with BCRA.
It's the "let's just do it and be legends, man" of legislating, except millions of people's health care are at risk.
Honestly, even if they lose the vote, I don't think it's over. If they do have a vote and it fails, outside groups are going to have a handy list of targets. The pressure on them will be insane. We already have members of Congress threatening duels, and that's before there is a vote on record. Or they'll move on and start adding more provisions to sabotage Obamacare into the CHIP (children's health insurance) re-authorization that's coming up and Trump will declare open enrollment is now only available in person during a seven minute window in Barrow, Alaska in December. It's not going to stop.
posted by zachlipton at 11:43 AM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Emmy Rae: "I want President Pelosi! I know it's a long shot. But I dream."
She'd be almost 90 by the end of two terms.
posted by octothorpe at 11:45 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
She'd be almost 90 by the end of two terms.
posted by octothorpe at 11:45 AM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
You cannot merely propose policies they like. You have to wear away at that element of their identity.
Which is why Democrats must be relentless in their scorn at Republican tolerance of treason. Republicans waged a successful decades-long campaign to make "liberal" a dirty word and shame Democrats for everything from the Vietnam War to solar panels on the White House roof. Much of the fecklessness of today's Democratic politicians -- and the underlying admiration of the so-called "liberal media," which *still* presumes that Republicans are "strong on defense" regardless of evidence -- comes from this war of words.
Democrats must not "extend an olive branch," "let bygones be bygones," or "look forward, not back" once they regain power. Obama tried -- giving Bush a pass for lying us into a disastrous war -- and was rewarded with obstructionism and the theft of a SCOTUS seat. Republicans must be reminded for generations that they voted for this clown, and he was obviously a clown and hey, sold us out to the Russians to boot.
If Republicans are to be forgiven, they must earn it, not be handed it in the name of a quixotic "unity" they have no intention of honoring.
posted by Gelatin at 11:46 AM on July 24, 2017 [45 favorites]
Which is why Democrats must be relentless in their scorn at Republican tolerance of treason. Republicans waged a successful decades-long campaign to make "liberal" a dirty word and shame Democrats for everything from the Vietnam War to solar panels on the White House roof. Much of the fecklessness of today's Democratic politicians -- and the underlying admiration of the so-called "liberal media," which *still* presumes that Republicans are "strong on defense" regardless of evidence -- comes from this war of words.
Democrats must not "extend an olive branch," "let bygones be bygones," or "look forward, not back" once they regain power. Obama tried -- giving Bush a pass for lying us into a disastrous war -- and was rewarded with obstructionism and the theft of a SCOTUS seat. Republicans must be reminded for generations that they voted for this clown, and he was obviously a clown and hey, sold us out to the Russians to boot.
If Republicans are to be forgiven, they must earn it, not be handed it in the name of a quixotic "unity" they have no intention of honoring.
posted by Gelatin at 11:46 AM on July 24, 2017 [45 favorites]
Octothorpe: Shoulda clarified. I want her as the placeholder president after the Trump people are impeached to usher in an era of democratic enlightenment.
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:48 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:48 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
This repeal nonsense won't be truly dead until Jan 2019, when Speaker Pelosi takes the gavel back. But if Republicans want to repeatedly show off how despicable and incapable they are in the same motion, I feel like zombie trumpcare is probably their best bet.
posted by Glibpaxman at 11:48 AM on July 24, 2017
posted by Glibpaxman at 11:48 AM on July 24, 2017
Erik Loomis, LGM: The Better Deal: How Far the Democrats Have Moved and How Far They Need to Go
As the Democrats move forward to articulate a set of policies for the Trump era, Chuck Schumer’s initial op-ed demonstrates both how far to the left the Democratic Party has moved and how far it still has to go. While “A Better Deal” is a pretty uninspiring slogan, there’s a lot in here that would have been unimaginable in 2004. What I don’t get about the reaction to Chait’s neoliberalism piece is how people could deny the power neoliberals held in the Democratic Party a decade ago and how far they have had to retreat today. I think you see that in some of these policy points. [...]posted by tonycpsu at 11:53 AM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
The employment stuff is more problematic. Giving employers huge tax breaks for doing basic job training is a bad idea. This is the sort of pro-employer tweaks that have defined the Democratic Party for a long time. Like the health care stuff, there is a better way to go here: “Employment is a fundamental right. We propose a federally guaranteed jobs program that would put every American to work who wants a job.” Schumer is right in recognizing that something has to be done for the hundreds of millions of Americans who do not have a college degree. A giant giveaway to companies for doing what they should be doing anyway is not going to solve that problem. [...]
I will also note that there is not word one about unions or organizing in any of this.
To say the least, getting Democrats to move toward embracing a $15 wage is a sign of how far the rejuvenated left has pushed the party. But the rest of this platform demonstrates that it’s not only policy where Democrats need a push, but, perhaps even more importantly, messaging.
Since lying to Congress is a crime anyway, not requiring an oath could actually be seen as a trap -- an attempt to lure him into breaking the law by giving him the chance to ignorantly misunderstand the situation (and perhaps be lulled by the ollie ollie oxen free prospect of a pardon.)
Liberal senators saying it was all worthless without an oath could be seen as an extension of this strategy.
posted by msalt at 11:56 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Liberal senators saying it was all worthless without an oath could be seen as an extension of this strategy.
posted by msalt at 11:56 AM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Controversial new CDC director may reconsider Big Soda’s health funding (Beth Mole for Ars Technica, July 24, 2017) - because, why the fuck not.
Brenda Fitzgerald, the newly appointed director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, will consider allowing Coca-Cola to once again help fund the agency’s anti-obesity campaigns, according to e-mailed comments reported by the New York Times over the weekend.posted by filthy light thief at 11:59 AM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
Though it would be a turnabout for the agency—which ditched Coke funding in 2013—Fitzgerald's position shouldn't be surprising, as she has a controversial history of accepting funding from Coca-Cola. As health commissioner of Georgia from 2011 to this year, she accepted $1 million from the soda giant to fund an exercise program aimed at cutting the state’s childhood obesity rate—one of the highest in the country.
The exercise-based campaign seemed to fit well with Coca-Cola’s interests. The company has long appeared interested in shifting anti-obesity efforts toward improving physical activity levels rather than focusing on the role of diet, particularly sugary beverages. That’s despite many studies, including those by the CDC, that have found that sugar-loaded drinks are a prominent factor in childhood obesity, as well as the development of associated health conditions such as Type II diabetes, heart disease, and kidney disease. Nevertheless, in 2015, a Times investigation revealed that Coke had been secretly funding and orchestrating a network of academic nutrition researchers, which had a suspiciously keen focus on combating obesity with exercise while downplaying the role of sweetened beverages and excess calories.
Since lying to Congress is a crime anyway, not requiring an oath could actually be seen as a trap
This last six months has reinforced to me just how much our government is made up of desperate, ignorant people asking questions about things they're not smart enough to know they don't understand and generally clawing hopelessly towards selfish goals. On the positive side, every now and then somebody intelligent gets to speak before being drowned out by the clarion call of idiocy.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:02 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
This last six months has reinforced to me just how much our government is made up of desperate, ignorant people asking questions about things they're not smart enough to know they don't understand and generally clawing hopelessly towards selfish goals. On the positive side, every now and then somebody intelligent gets to speak before being drowned out by the clarion call of idiocy.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:02 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Which is to say I don't think there is a trap or a plan.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:03 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:03 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Congressional Republicans need a win. If all else fails, they should repeal and replace the President.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Break up the cable monopolies? Democrats propose new competition laws (Jon Brodkin for Ars Technica, July 24, 2017, filed under "Good luck with that")
posted by filthy light thief at 12:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
Senate and House Democratic leaders today proposed new antitrust laws that could prevent many of the biggest mergers and break up monopolies in broadband and other industries.Looks like the Dems are going with Better Deal branding already. I'll take it. Also noted in that article:
"Right now our antitrust laws are designed to allow huge corporations to merge, padding the pockets of investors but sending costs skyrocketing for everything from cable bills and airline tickets to food and health care," US Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-NY) wrote in a New York Times opinion piece. "We are going to fight to allow regulators to break up big companies if they’re hurting consumers and to make it harder for companies to merge if it reduces competition."
The "Better Deal" unveiled by Schumer and House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) was described in several documents that can be found in an Axios story. The plan for "cracking down on corporate monopolies" (PDF) lists five industries that Democrats say are in particular need of change, specifically airlines, cable and telecom, the beer industry, food, and eyeglasses. The Democrats' plan for lowering the cost of prescription drugs is detailed in a separate document (PDF).
Although President Trump pledged to block the AT&T/Time Warner deal when he campaigned for president, AT&T is now in "early talks" with US antitrust officials regarding "possible conditions that could secure approval" of the merger, according to Bloomberg.Again, why the fuck not. Say one thing during the election run-up, then go with business interests when you're in office.
posted by filthy light thief at 12:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
Welp. Even Rudy is bucking Trump.
CNN: Former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani on Monday swatted away a report that he is a contender to replace Attorney General Jeff Sessions, and said Sessions made the right decision to recuse himself from the Russia investigation.
posted by chris24 at 12:08 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
CNN: Former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani on Monday swatted away a report that he is a contender to replace Attorney General Jeff Sessions, and said Sessions made the right decision to recuse himself from the Russia investigation.
posted by chris24 at 12:08 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
Who's up next? Christie?
Sekulow. Why not.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Sekulow. Why not.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
airlines, cable and telecom, the beer industry, food, and eyeglasses
As much as I like beer, maybe there are other monopolies on this list that should be higher priority?
posted by Faint of Butt at 12:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
As much as I like beer, maybe there are other monopolies on this list that should be higher priority?
posted by Faint of Butt at 12:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Even Rudy is bucking Trump.
Giuliani is 100 percent willing to lie his ass off to get into the Cabinet and then suddenly "discover" huge conflicts of interest by Mueller and "regretfully" have to shut his investigation down. There's plenty of dumb people in the administration, but Giuliani is evil.
posted by Etrigan at 12:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
Giuliani is 100 percent willing to lie his ass off to get into the Cabinet and then suddenly "discover" huge conflicts of interest by Mueller and "regretfully" have to shut his investigation down. There's plenty of dumb people in the administration, but Giuliani is evil.
posted by Etrigan at 12:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
A Veteran ICE Agent, Disillusioned with the Trump Era, Speaks Out (Jonathan Blitzer, The New Yorker) (Emphasis mine)
posted by Room 641-A at 12:12 PM on July 24, 2017 [46 favorites]
“We used to look at things through the totality of the circumstances when it came to a removal order—that’s out the window,” the agent told me the other day. “I don’t know that there’s that appreciation of the entire realm of what we’re doing. It’s not just the person we’re removing. It’s their entire family. People say, ‘Well, they put themselves in this position because they came illegally.’ I totally understand that. But you have to remember that our job is not to judge. The problem is that now there are lots of people who feel free to feel contempt.”Also, five minutes ago: reporter on MSNBC: "The chairman has barred all members from discussing the Kushner meeting."
Like many ice employees, the agent was a critic of President Barack Obama, whose push to standardize enforcement practice and micromanage agents, particularly during his second term, was a source of frustration at the agency. Yet with Obama gone, and the era of micromanagement over, the agent sees long-standing standards being discarded and basic protocols questioned. “I have officers who are more likely now to push back,” the agent said. “I’d never have someone say, ‘Why do I have to call an interpreter? Why don’t they speak English?’ Now I get it frequently. I get this from people who are younger. That’s one group. And I also get it from people who are ethnocentric: ‘Our way is the right way—I shouldn’t have to speak in your language. This is America.’ ” It all adds up, the agent said, “to contempt that I’ve never seen so rampant towards the aliens.”
The agent’s decision to allow me to write about our conversations came after learning that ice was making a push, beginning this week, to arrest young undocumented immigrants who were part of a large wave of unaccompanied minors who crossed the border in recent years and who, until now, had been allowed to live in the U.S.
posted by Room 641-A at 12:12 PM on July 24, 2017 [46 favorites]
It all adds up, the agent said, “to contempt that I’ve never seen so rampant towards the aliens.”
The word choice here means a lot.
posted by teleri025 at 12:13 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
The word choice here means a lot.
posted by teleri025 at 12:13 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Giuliani should've got life in prison for floating that trial balloon post-9/11 about postponing elections until the crisis had passed.
posted by Pope Guilty at 12:14 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by Pope Guilty at 12:14 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Senate to vote tomorrow at 2:15 on the motion to proceed. Not a drill people, (202) 224-3121.
posted by zachlipton at 12:16 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 12:16 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
“Employment is a fundamental right. We propose a federally guaranteed jobs program that would put every American to work who wants a job.”
I've said it before, but I'll say it again, because hey, somebody far up the food chain might be reading this thread, who knows?: If Democrats could implement a Works Progress Administration type program, focusing on infrastructure (plenty of jobs for working-class men!), health care/social services, education, and addiction treatment - we'd have jobs coming out our ears. There really could be a job for everyone who wants one!
Dems could be known as the A Job For Everyone party. Sure, there will be people who will still want to cut their noses off to spite their faces while drinking mugs of liberal tears, but much of the anger and resentment would probably be quelled if those who want work, have it. (And I can't help but think - a lot of the shitposters who pollute comment sites, Reddit, etc., won't have time to spew their bile all over the interwebs if they had to work eight hours a day!)
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 12:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [23 favorites]
I've said it before, but I'll say it again, because hey, somebody far up the food chain might be reading this thread, who knows?: If Democrats could implement a Works Progress Administration type program, focusing on infrastructure (plenty of jobs for working-class men!), health care/social services, education, and addiction treatment - we'd have jobs coming out our ears. There really could be a job for everyone who wants one!
Dems could be known as the A Job For Everyone party. Sure, there will be people who will still want to cut their noses off to spite their faces while drinking mugs of liberal tears, but much of the anger and resentment would probably be quelled if those who want work, have it. (And I can't help but think - a lot of the shitposters who pollute comment sites, Reddit, etc., won't have time to spew their bile all over the interwebs if they had to work eight hours a day!)
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 12:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [23 favorites]
CNN implies that Tillerson is sticking around pretty much so he can say he stuck with the job for a year, and pretend he wasn't marginalized and humiliated by a manifestly unfit president. I've seen exactly the same rumor about Priebus.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
If Democrats could implement a Works Progress Administration type program, focusing on infrastructure (plenty of jobs for working-class men!), health care/social services, education, and addiction treatment - we'd have jobs coming out our ears.
Schumer: "We’ve already proposed creating jobs with a $1 trillion infrastructure plan; increasing workers’ incomes by lifting the minimum wage to $15; and lowering household costs by providing paid family and sick leave."
posted by OnceUponATime at 12:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
Schumer: "We’ve already proposed creating jobs with a $1 trillion infrastructure plan; increasing workers’ incomes by lifting the minimum wage to $15; and lowering household costs by providing paid family and sick leave."
posted by OnceUponATime at 12:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
Like many ice employees, the agent was a critic of President Barack Obama, whose push to standardize enforcement practice and micromanage agents, particularly during his second term, was a source of frustration at the agency.
I've worked at a few places that had deep, pervasive micromanagement practices. People complained, but never connected that the micromanagement was due to their demonstrated inability to do their jobs correctly without it.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 12:27 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
I've worked at a few places that had deep, pervasive micromanagement practices. People complained, but never connected that the micromanagement was due to their demonstrated inability to do their jobs correctly without it.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 12:27 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
They helped to make that shit sandwich. It's theirs to eat.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 12:27 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 12:27 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Schumer: "We’ve already proposed creating jobs with a $1 trillion infrastructure plan; increasing workers’ incomes by lifting the minimum wage to $15; and lowering household costs by providing paid family and sick leave."
Uuuugh, but why don't Democrats ever have proposals or a plan? It's like they only ever run on not being the Republicans. Why don't they ever give me something to vote for?
Ooh, look, a dank meme about the DNC! Now that's worth sharing on Facebook!
posted by scaryblackdeath at 12:28 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
Uuuugh, but why don't Democrats ever have proposals or a plan? It's like they only ever run on not being the Republicans. Why don't they ever give me something to vote for?
Ooh, look, a dank meme about the DNC! Now that's worth sharing on Facebook!
posted by scaryblackdeath at 12:28 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
Sorry, one more ICE story:
Massachusetts top court: State can’t comply with immigration detainers (Scott Malone, Raw Story)
Massachusetts top court: State can’t comply with immigration detainers (Scott Malone, Raw Story)
Massachusetts police do not have the authority to detain illegal immigrants solely to buy time for federal law enforcement officials to take them into custody, the state’s top court ruled on Monday.posted by Room 641-A at 12:31 PM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
The decision amounts to a rejection of requests by the federal Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency for courts and law enforcement agencies to hold illegal immigrants facing civil deportation orders in custody for up to 48 hours after their cases are resolved.
The Supreme Judicial Court ruled that doing so amounts to a fresh arrest of the person that is not authorized by state law.
As much as I like beer, maybe there are other monopolies on this list that should be higher priority?
With this administration, I'd say go after hard liquor first. We all need it now.
posted by Mental Wimp at 12:34 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
With this administration, I'd say go after hard liquor first. We all need it now.
posted by Mental Wimp at 12:34 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
I just do not get the logic here. "I don't want anyone to think that I can't eat an entire shit sandwich! I'm no quitter!"
If you quit "early", then the problem is that you weren't smart enough to see that Trump is a shitty boss. If you last to some arbitrary deadline that you set, then you get to claim success under some arbitrary metric ("I did what I set out to do, and I never intended to be the Secretary of State for four years.").
posted by Etrigan at 12:35 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
If you quit "early", then the problem is that you weren't smart enough to see that Trump is a shitty boss. If you last to some arbitrary deadline that you set, then you get to claim success under some arbitrary metric ("I did what I set out to do, and I never intended to be the Secretary of State for four years.").
posted by Etrigan at 12:35 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Re: the Kushner statement of "no collusion, no improper contacts"
"Well that's not for YOU to decide, you [expletive expletive]" was my first reaction. "Your honor, ladies and gentlemen of the jury: my client insists he didn't commit the murder, so we rest our case."
In legal writing classes, you get docked points for inappropriately stating a legal conclusion. In courtrooms, counsel can make objections if a question calls for a legal conclusion. However you feel about Comey and the hearings, he responded to the "Was this obstruction of justice?" questions with "That's for Mueller to investigate and conclude" (paraphrased). Not only is it improper--you lose cred for trying to make a call that isn't yours to make.
I know legal rules don't dictate all situations but the idea is that there are people specifically put in charge to make certain conclusions in certain proceedings--and one of the accused malfeasors isn't one of them!
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 12:36 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
"Well that's not for YOU to decide, you [expletive expletive]" was my first reaction. "Your honor, ladies and gentlemen of the jury: my client insists he didn't commit the murder, so we rest our case."
In legal writing classes, you get docked points for inappropriately stating a legal conclusion. In courtrooms, counsel can make objections if a question calls for a legal conclusion. However you feel about Comey and the hearings, he responded to the "Was this obstruction of justice?" questions with "That's for Mueller to investigate and conclude" (paraphrased). Not only is it improper--you lose cred for trying to make a call that isn't yours to make.
I know legal rules don't dictate all situations but the idea is that there are people specifically put in charge to make certain conclusions in certain proceedings--and one of the accused malfeasors isn't one of them!
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 12:36 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Faint of Butt: "As much as I like beer, maybe there are other monopolies on this list that should be higher priority?"
Beer is a consumer product, so the impact of this is easily visible to voters.
posted by Chrysostom at 12:36 PM on July 24, 2017
Beer is a consumer product, so the impact of this is easily visible to voters.
posted by Chrysostom at 12:36 PM on July 24, 2017
Trump's first sentence claimed that Obamacare wreaked havoc for the past 17 years, unless I misheard.
posted by Justinian at 12:38 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 12:38 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
Trump just started by saying Obamacare has been with us 17 years.
posted by rc3spencer at 12:39 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by rc3spencer at 12:39 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Obamacare killed Archduke Franz Ferdinand.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 12:40 PM on July 24, 2017 [72 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 12:40 PM on July 24, 2017 [72 favorites]
And he's not in the mood for crying babies again.
posted by rc3spencer at 12:40 PM on July 24, 2017
posted by rc3spencer at 12:40 PM on July 24, 2017
Obamacare killed Archduke Franz Ferdinand.
Obamacare assassinated Lincoln.
posted by Talez at 12:41 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Obamacare assassinated Lincoln.
posted by Talez at 12:41 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
well they found a bunch of white people to stand behind Trump.
posted by angrycat at 12:41 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 12:41 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Obamacare allowed a Kenyan to get a birth certificate in Hawaii.
posted by Etrigan at 12:42 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Etrigan at 12:42 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
One of the families he's talking about "were forced to go on Medicaid." Want to bet nobody will ask him to explain how that family will be better off if their Medicaid is taken away too?
posted by zachlipton at 12:42 PM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 12:42 PM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
He's doing great work not talking about any single detail of Trumpcare
posted by angrycat at 12:43 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by angrycat at 12:43 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
Kali Holloway, Alternet / Salon: 5 reasons Trump is a health calamity waiting to happen
1. He eats a lot of mostly overcooked garbage.posted by ZeusHumms at 12:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
...
2. He doesn’t exercise and frequently seems winded.
...
3. He’s a stress case.
...
4. He’s chronically sleep-deprived.
...
5. He’s overweight, which matters in the context of all the other factors.
Trump: "Obamacare is death."
Outside the 27% crazification factor, does a quote like that even resonate? Here in Indiana, the Republican delegation put up a Web site soliciting "Obamacare horror stories" and instead was famously flooded with testimonials.
posted by Gelatin at 12:48 PM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
Outside the 27% crazification factor, does a quote like that even resonate? Here in Indiana, the Republican delegation put up a Web site soliciting "Obamacare horror stories" and instead was famously flooded with testimonials.
posted by Gelatin at 12:48 PM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
well they found a bunch of white people to stand behind Trump.
Oh wow look at the concerned mother look on the blonde woman standing behind Trump.
If that's not pro status subliminal messaging I don't know what is.
posted by Talez at 12:48 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Oh wow look at the concerned mother look on the blonde woman standing behind Trump.
If that's not pro status subliminal messaging I don't know what is.
posted by Talez at 12:48 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
One of the families he's talking about "were forced to go on Medicaid."
That's right folks. This family of great Americans was bravely paying their own money for shitty coverage. Obama comes along and cruelly changes the market conditions so they are tragically forced to receive health insurance for free. End The Madness Now
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:49 PM on July 24, 2017 [85 favorites]
That's right folks. This family of great Americans was bravely paying their own money for shitty coverage. Obama comes along and cruelly changes the market conditions so they are tragically forced to receive health insurance for free. End The Madness Now
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:49 PM on July 24, 2017 [85 favorites]
One of the examples of victims Trump has listed is a mother who has to frantically check her health insurance network listings once a year to see if her child's doctor is on the list. He didn't mention whether the doctor is on the list. I'm going to assume yes?
Really Makes You Think...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:50 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Really Makes You Think...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:50 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Blake Farenthold is a fucking nutjob. I was going to link to some of his past douchebaggery, but there's a long list. From sexual harassment to saying he'd support Trump even if he was an admitted rapist, to promoting Alex Jones conspiracy theories...this guy is the worst of the worst of the Tea Party. He won his last election with 50.3% of the vote, against two opponents, if that tells you anything. (Like that the Democratic party can't get it's shit together to fight for Texas seats.)
posted by threeturtles at 12:51 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by threeturtles at 12:51 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Obama comes along and cruelly changes the market conditions so they are tragically forced to receive health insurance for free that their taxes had already paid for.
Offered as a friendly amendment.
posted by Gelatin at 12:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
Offered as a friendly amendment.
posted by Gelatin at 12:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
That's right folks. This family of great Americans was bravely paying their own money for shitty coverage. Obama comes along and cruelly changes the market conditions so they are tragically forced to receive health insurance for free. End The Madness Now
And to fix it, we're going to trash Medicaid. That'll definitely make it better for them.
posted by Justinian at 12:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
And to fix it, we're going to trash Medicaid. That'll definitely make it better for them.
posted by Justinian at 12:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
That's right folks. This family of great Americans was bravely paying their own money for shitty coverage. Obama comes along and cruelly changes the market conditions so they are tragically forced to receive health insurance for free. End The Madness Now
Fear not, Republicans are here to ensure that no American never endure the trauma of finding out they're poor enough to be eligible for government assistance.
posted by Talez at 12:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
Fear not, Republicans are here to ensure that no American never endure the trauma of finding out they're poor enough to be eligible for government assistance.
posted by Talez at 12:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
Newsweek's Graham Lanktree reporting that Rex Tillerson Debates Quitting After ‘Unprofessional’ Trump Bashes Jeff Sessions
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:53 PM on July 24, 2017 [26 favorites]
Secretary of State Rex Tillerson is growing increasingly frustrated with the Trump administration and could quit before the year is through, according to reports.*facepalm* Man, when you can't even keep your top cabinet members from contemplating leaving because you can't shut the fuck up on Twitter for five minutes... This regime is the utter definition of political omnishambles. Everything about it is fucked up and lacks cohesion; there's no plan beyond whatever comes out of the Popular Vote Loser's mouth at any given moment.
Two sources familiar with Tillerson’s conversations with friends told CNN over the weekend that he has grown so frustrated with President Donald Trump and his administration that there may soon be a “Rexit.”[...]
Tillerson, the sources said, viewed Trump’s comments [attacking Confederate Jefferson Sessions] as unprofessional. [...]
Both sources said that Tillerson’s frustrations with these situations, and many other tug-of-wars between the White House and Cabinet members, are increasing noticeably and that he has come to realize things won’t change anytime soon.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:53 PM on July 24, 2017 [26 favorites]
We need higher wages and lower rents.
posted by chaz at 12:54 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by chaz at 12:54 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
One of the examples of victims Trump has listed is a mother who has to frantically check her health insurance network listings once a year to see if her child's doctor is on the list
Even is this is true (my base assumption is that anything they claim is a lie), it's nothing new. My kid had to change doctors three times under employer-proved insurance pre-ACA and I didn't even change employers.
posted by mikepop at 12:54 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
Even is this is true (my base assumption is that anything they claim is a lie), it's nothing new. My kid had to change doctors three times under employer-proved insurance pre-ACA and I didn't even change employers.
posted by mikepop at 12:54 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
there may soon be a “Rexit.”
Killllllllllll meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
posted by Existential Dread at 12:55 PM on July 24, 2017 [39 favorites]
Killllllllllll meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
posted by Existential Dread at 12:55 PM on July 24, 2017 [39 favorites]
*facepalm* Man, when you can't even keep your top cabinet members from contemplating leaving because you can't shut the fuck up on Twitter for five minutes... This regime is the utter definition of political omnishambles. Everything about it is fucked up and lacks cohesion; there's no plan beyond whatever comes out of the Popular Vote Loser's mouth at any given moment.
The WWC couldn't get the political soda they wanted and instead decided to pour the contents of the drip tray into their glass.
posted by Talez at 12:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
The WWC couldn't get the political soda they wanted and instead decided to pour the contents of the drip tray into their glass.
posted by Talez at 12:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
One of the examples of victims Trump has listed is a mother who has to frantically check her health insurance network listings once a year to see if her child's doctor is on the list
Indeed. Democrats don't make clear enough that many of the flaws of the ACA have to do with the very fact that it's market-based health insurance.
And anyway, isn't "shopping around" and "being a responsible consumer" the kinds of things Republicans say is our responsibility in order to enjoy the privilege of healthcare? Even as Senate Republicans are having difficulty squaring their grandiose promises for "repeal and replace" with reality, here comes Trump once again attacking it from the left, which puts the Republican solution in an even worse light.
Sheesh.
posted by Gelatin at 12:58 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
Indeed. Democrats don't make clear enough that many of the flaws of the ACA have to do with the very fact that it's market-based health insurance.
And anyway, isn't "shopping around" and "being a responsible consumer" the kinds of things Republicans say is our responsibility in order to enjoy the privilege of healthcare? Even as Senate Republicans are having difficulty squaring their grandiose promises for "repeal and replace" with reality, here comes Trump once again attacking it from the left, which puts the Republican solution in an even worse light.
Sheesh.
posted by Gelatin at 12:58 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
He's doing great work not talking about any single detail of Trumpcare
There have actually been few details released about the new Senate healthcare bill, but Sen. Murkowski (R-AK) described it as "non-Euclidean" before collapsing into a gibbering wreck, shrieking omens of the black goat of the woods with a thousand young
Still waiting on the CBO score
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:02 PM on July 24, 2017 [20 favorites]
There have actually been few details released about the new Senate healthcare bill, but Sen. Murkowski (R-AK) described it as "non-Euclidean" before collapsing into a gibbering wreck, shrieking omens of the black goat of the woods with a thousand young
Still waiting on the CBO score
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:02 PM on July 24, 2017 [20 favorites]
Bill Moyers has an updated interactive Russia/Trump timeline -- starting with Trump meeting Roger Stone in 1979 -- and it's a doozy. (It took at least 25 swipes on my iphone to get to the bottom!)
posted by Room 641-A at 1:04 PM on July 24, 2017 [33 favorites]
posted by Room 641-A at 1:04 PM on July 24, 2017 [33 favorites]
There have actually been few details released about the new Senate healthcare bill, but Sen. Murkowski (R-AK) described it as "non-Euclidean" before collapsing into a gibbering wreck, shrieking omens of the black goat of the woods with a thousand young
Still waiting on the CBO score
"The CBO score is six."
"Six? Six... six what?"
"Five..."
posted by Etrigan at 1:05 PM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
Still waiting on the CBO score
"The CBO score is six."
"Six? Six... six what?"
"Five..."
posted by Etrigan at 1:05 PM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
Four...
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Still waiting on the CBO score
How can they even score the thing when McConnell is explicitly saying they will accept amendments up to and including stripping out everything and replacing it whatever cockamamie gibberish the ALEC hands them?
posted by Gelatin at 1:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
How can they even score the thing when McConnell is explicitly saying they will accept amendments up to and including stripping out everything and replacing it whatever cockamamie gibberish the ALEC hands them?
posted by Gelatin at 1:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
My kid had to change doctors three times under employer-proved insurance pre-ACA and I didn't even change employers.
I have excellent health insurance due to working at a medical device company, and I just got five emails in a row, from 3 o'clock this morning, informing me about five completely random service dates that I already knew about. We can blame the politicians, sure, but it's awfully late in the game.
posted by Melismata at 1:07 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
I have excellent health insurance due to working at a medical device company, and I just got five emails in a row, from 3 o'clock this morning, informing me about five completely random service dates that I already knew about. We can blame the politicians, sure, but it's awfully late in the game.
posted by Melismata at 1:07 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
I can't think of any bigger waste of news than this Farenhold thing. A powerless schlub tries to surf the AP wires, big whoop.
posted by rhizome at 1:07 PM on July 24, 2017
posted by rhizome at 1:07 PM on July 24, 2017
One of fundamental rules of Trump is that he always exaggerates by 50-70%. It's not just a vague instinct to self-promote, it's an explicit, strategic and unethical decision not to leave something on the ground when you can get it "for free". Whenever people talk about some achievement or measurement, there's always a bit of fuzzyness unless it's literally a math calculation. Take the crowd sizes for an example. When do you measure the crowd size and how do you do that? Before the event, at the start, a bit into an event, in the middle, at the end? Do you count a group that listened for a few seconds and left? What about someone who came by to use the restroom? To Trump that's an obvious opportunity: exaggerate by 50% or more and than, if questioned, exploit the fuzzyness. To him, not to exaggerate is mere foolishness -- like leaving money on the table in a deal. Dealing with contractors is similar. If you pay someone 100k as promised, but could have gotten away with paying 75k, effectively means you lost 25k through lazyness and/or business naivete.
posted by rainy at 1:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by rainy at 1:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
Still waiting on the CBO score
$TEXAS
posted by entropicamericana at 1:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
$TEXAS
posted by entropicamericana at 1:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
How can they even score the thing when McConnell is explicitly saying they will accept amendments up to and including stripping out everything and replacing it whatever cockamamie gibberish the ALEC hands them?
That's the beauty of it- you get it scored and then you amend and immediately pass it and insist that the CBO said good things about it. And when it bombs, you point at the CBO and say "They approved it! Off with their heads!"
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
That's the beauty of it- you get it scored and then you amend and immediately pass it and insist that the CBO said good things about it. And when it bombs, you point at the CBO and say "They approved it! Off with their heads!"
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
How can they even score the thing when McConnell is explicitly saying they will accept amendments up to and including stripping out everything and replacing it whatever cockamamie gibberish the ALEC hands them?
See, but that's 2 points for technical difficulty, right there. If they can just stick the landing, they're guaranteed to at least metal.
Of course the metal is lead, and it's now being re-classified as a vitamin supplement, but hey, free vitamin supplements for everyone!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:13 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
See, but that's 2 points for technical difficulty, right there. If they can just stick the landing, they're guaranteed to at least metal.
Of course the metal is lead, and it's now being re-classified as a vitamin supplement, but hey, free vitamin supplements for everyone!
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:13 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
See, but that's 2 points for technical difficulty, right there. If they can just stick the landing, they're guaranteed to at least metal.
Do you mean "medal"?
posted by thelonius at 1:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Do you mean "medal"?
posted by thelonius at 1:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
No
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [22 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [22 favorites]
I've known too many rage-filled assholes, with terrible eating habits and addictions, that should have been dead years ago, who still lived long, miserable lives to get my hopes up that Trump will croak. I've come to believe that spite is actually an effective life extender, so long as you don't mind being miserable and hated.
posted by emjaybee at 1:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [38 favorites]
posted by emjaybee at 1:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [38 favorites]
Yeah, that's totally working for me.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:20 PM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 1:20 PM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
Still waiting on the CBO score
As I understand it, they will be basing the motion to proceed on the House bill, which does have a CBO score. Somewhere in the neighborhood of 25 million people thrown off their health plans, give or take.
posted by Mental Wimp at 1:32 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
As I understand it, they will be basing the motion to proceed on the House bill, which does have a CBO score. Somewhere in the neighborhood of 25 million people thrown off their health plans, give or take.
posted by Mental Wimp at 1:32 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
One of fundamental rules of Trump is that he always exaggerates by 50-70%. It's not just a vague instinct to self-promote, it's an explicit, strategic and unethical decision not to leave something on the ground when you can get it "for free."
Whenever I listen to Donnie's bullshit I think of Cohn's line in Angels In America:
posted by octobersurprise at 1:37 PM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
Whenever I listen to Donnie's bullshit I think of Cohn's line in Angels In America:
"You only think you know all I know. I don't even know what all I know. Half the time I just make it up and it still turns out to be true! We learned that trick in the fifties."And I actually wonder if he learned that from Cohn.
posted by octobersurprise at 1:37 PM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
More and more each day, American Idiot becomes more and more apt.
posted by Talez at 1:53 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Talez at 1:53 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
There have actually been few details released about the new Senate healthcare bill, but Sen. Murkowski (R-AK) described it as "non-Euclidean" before collapsing into a gibbering wreck, shrieking omens of the black goat of the woods with a thousand young
security needed in aisle 186323, a MeFite failed to use [real][fake] tags and other users are confused and worried
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:54 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
security needed in aisle 186323, a MeFite failed to use [real][fake] tags and other users are confused and worried
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:54 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
Anyway, given that nothing has apparently been heard from the good Alaskan senator since meeting with known poors-hater Seema Verma of CMS the other day, I presume her soul has been fully eaten.
seriously, the bulletin/updates I get from CMS now are gross poor-shaming right-wing talking points and I don't like it at all
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
seriously, the bulletin/updates I get from CMS now are gross poor-shaming right-wing talking points and I don't like it at all
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
"Half the time I just make it up and it still turns out to be true! We learned that trick in the fifties."
This also reminds me of Trump's childhood pastor and father of "postitive thinking", Norman Vincent Peale.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:59 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
This also reminds me of Trump's childhood pastor and father of "postitive thinking", Norman Vincent Peale.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:59 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
seriously, the bulletin/updates I get from CMS now are gross poor-shaming right-wing talking points and I don't like it at all
I'm guessing half of federal civil servants have some variation of this on their wall
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:07 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
I'm guessing half of federal civil servants have some variation of this on their wall
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:07 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
GOP seeks McCain’s return for tight Obamacare vote (Politico)
You guys know the drill: contact your Senators. Please don't take its failure for granted. (The bill, not the Senate. Heh.)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 2:15 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
You guys know the drill: contact your Senators. Please don't take its failure for granted. (The bill, not the Senate. Heh.)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 2:15 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
If the writers want to fix this season they should have McCain arrive to rapturous applause only to filibuster the bill.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
Slightly off-topic, but this article claims that IC veterans don't believe that the DNC hack was a Russian job, but rather two inside jobs, the second of which was done to try to implicate the Russians. Their primary argument is that 1.9GB of data could not be downloaded over the Internet in 87 seconds. But this table shows that approximately 1GB could be downloaded in that amount of time. If multiple lines were used, couldn't the download have happened much faster than 87 seconds? Anyone here know whether their reasoning is faulty or sound?
posted by Mental Wimp at 2:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Mental Wimp at 2:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Their primary argument is that 1.9GB of data could not be downloaded over the Internet in 87 seconds.
I just checked, and on my current connection I can download 1.9GiB of data in 18 seconds. So.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:21 PM on July 24, 2017 [34 favorites]
I just checked, and on my current connection I can download 1.9GiB of data in 18 seconds. So.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:21 PM on July 24, 2017 [34 favorites]
yes I am a wizard
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:22 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:22 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Depends on your internet connection. If the DNC was paying for a fat pipe and so were you then sure, you could download 1.9GB in 87 seconds.
If you're going off a dinky little 10mbps DSL connection, then no.
Basically I think they're full of shit.
posted by sotonohito at 2:22 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
If you're going off a dinky little 10mbps DSL connection, then no.
Basically I think they're full of shit.
posted by sotonohito at 2:22 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
consortiumnews.com is where I go whenever I am looking for hard-hitting well sourced journalism.
posted by Justinian at 2:24 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 2:24 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
Slightly off-topic, but this article claims that IC veterans don't believe that the DNC hack was a Russian job, but rather two inside jobs, the second of which was done to try to implicate the Russians.
[ctrl-F "pizzagate" not found]
posted by Rust Moranis at 2:24 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
[ctrl-F "pizzagate" not found]
posted by Rust Moranis at 2:24 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Ruh-roh!
CNN: Russia says talk of further US sanctions 'counterproductive'
CNN: Russia says talk of further US sanctions 'counterproductive'
Peskov said Monday that Russia is treating the issue of sanctions “extremely negatively,” especially those currently being pursued in the House and Senate but added that Moscow will “patiently wait for this position to be finalized,” before taking any “retaliatory measures.”posted by Room 641-A at 2:31 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
“Talking about some retaliatory measures without even having clear information about the decisions, passed or rejected, would be counterproductive,” he said. “We are not going to do this.’
Haha, from the ConsortiumNews article: In the early evening, Eastern Daylight Time, someone working in the EDT time zone with a computer directly connected to the DNC server or DNC Local Area Network, copied 1,976 MegaBytes of data in 87 seconds onto an external storage device. That speed is many times faster than what is physically possible with a hack.
Downloading from a Local Area Network does not involve the Internet, and external drives routinely achieve 300 MiB/s. I suggest we stop talking about this article.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:36 PM on July 24, 2017 [24 favorites]
Downloading from a Local Area Network does not involve the Internet, and external drives routinely achieve 300 MiB/s. I suggest we stop talking about this article.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:36 PM on July 24, 2017 [24 favorites]
CNN: Russia says talk of further US sanctions 'counterproductive'
Well Russia sure as shit didn't meddle in elections to get sanctions strengthened.
posted by pwnguin at 2:37 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
Well Russia sure as shit didn't meddle in elections to get sanctions strengthened.
posted by pwnguin at 2:37 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
security needed in aisle 186323
We got too many damn aisles, these threads are out of control
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 2:40 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
We got too many damn aisles, these threads are out of control
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 2:40 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Representative Lamar Smith (R-TX), Chair of the House Science Committee, for the Heritage Foundation: Don’t Believe the Hysteria Over Carbon Dioxide
Our climate is too complex and the consequences of misguided policies too harsh to discount the positive effects of carbon enrichment.
A higher concentration of carbon dioxide in our atmosphere would aid photosynthesis, which in turn contributes to increased plant growth. This correlates to a greater volume of food production and better quality food. Studies indicate that crops would utilize water more efficiently, requiring less water. And colder areas along the farm belt will experience longer growing seasons.
[real]
"There's no anthropogenic climate change" : "Anthropogenic climate change is great" :: "There's no Russian collusion" : "Russian collusion is great"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [43 favorites]
Our climate is too complex and the consequences of misguided policies too harsh to discount the positive effects of carbon enrichment.
A higher concentration of carbon dioxide in our atmosphere would aid photosynthesis, which in turn contributes to increased plant growth. This correlates to a greater volume of food production and better quality food. Studies indicate that crops would utilize water more efficiently, requiring less water. And colder areas along the farm belt will experience longer growing seasons.
[real]
"There's no anthropogenic climate change" : "Anthropogenic climate change is great" :: "There's no Russian collusion" : "Russian collusion is great"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [43 favorites]
Their primary argument is that 1.9GB of data could not be downloaded over the Internet in 87 seconds.
I just checked, and on my current connection I can download 1.9GiB of data in 18 seconds. So.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:21 PM on July 24 [7 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]
Thanks. As I suspected. And yes, you are a wizard.
consortiumnews.com is where I go whenever I am looking for hard-hitting well sourced journalism.
posted by Justinian at 2:24 PM on July 24 [4 favorites +] [!]
Apparently not. I hadn't run across them before, but a local reporter I know posted the article on FB, and I'm trying to knock it down without ad hominem.
...so take from that what you will, trust it if you want,...
I asked because I don't trust them or the sources they cite. I'm trying to convince others to do the same.
posted by Mental Wimp at 2:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
I just checked, and on my current connection I can download 1.9GiB of data in 18 seconds. So.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:21 PM on July 24 [7 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]
Thanks. As I suspected. And yes, you are a wizard.
consortiumnews.com is where I go whenever I am looking for hard-hitting well sourced journalism.
posted by Justinian at 2:24 PM on July 24 [4 favorites +] [!]
Apparently not. I hadn't run across them before, but a local reporter I know posted the article on FB, and I'm trying to knock it down without ad hominem.
...so take from that what you will, trust it if you want,...
I asked because I don't trust them or the sources they cite. I'm trying to convince others to do the same.
posted by Mental Wimp at 2:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
I try not to throw words like these around, but there's something giving me an uneasy quasi-fascist vibe from the optics of Trump's speech to 30,000 scouts in WV right now, a sea of red hat-clad kids awaiting a campaign (!) speech six months in, it's just ... pinging something creepy and authoritarian to me.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 2:48 PM on July 24, 2017 [29 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 2:48 PM on July 24, 2017 [29 favorites]
It's probably the uneasy quasi-fascist President
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:49 PM on July 24, 2017 [57 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:49 PM on July 24, 2017 [57 favorites]
sung, ironically, to the tune of "peaceful easy feeling," yes
posted by Barack Spinoza at 2:50 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 2:50 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Apparently not. I hadn't run across them before, but a local reporter I know posted the article on FB, and I'm trying to knock it down without ad hominem.
godspeed with that. I would have a hard time not going hell of ad hominem on any site where the comments on the article hit "gooblegarbleZIONISTS" in three comments or less
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:53 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
godspeed with that. I would have a hard time not going hell of ad hominem on any site where the comments on the article hit "gooblegarbleZIONISTS" in three comments or less
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:53 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
the optics of Trump's speech to 30,000 scouts in WV right now
. . and here comes the Wagner.
posted by rc3spencer at 2:56 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
. . and here comes the Wagner.
posted by rc3spencer at 2:56 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
ELECTIONS NEWS
** NJ gov: Marist poll has Murphy up 54-33 on Guadagno. Christie approval is -57.
** VA gov: Monmouth poll has Northam and Gillespie tied 44-44. I remain skeptical.
** 2018 Senate:
** Odds & ends:
posted by Chrysostom at 2:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [64 favorites]
** NJ gov: Marist poll has Murphy up 54-33 on Guadagno. Christie approval is -57.
** VA gov: Monmouth poll has Northam and Gillespie tied 44-44. I remain skeptical.
** 2018 Senate:
-- OH Republicans have been unhappy at not getting anyone other than Josh Mandel to take a shot at Sherrod Brown, and are probably even more unhappy after Mandel climbed on board with Mike "Pizzagate" Cernovich in accusing the Anti-Defamation League of targeting Cernovich for murder.** 2018 House:
-- Rep. Mo Brooks is using the actual audio from the Scalise shooting in an ad for his AL senate run. The Scalise staff is not super happy about this.
-- Still no major GOP candidates in IN, MO, MT, or ND.
-- Sabato: House GOP shouldn't get complacent based on 2016 margins - historical data shows those often evaporate in midterms when you are the WH party.** Election integrity: The DC District Court has rejected EPIC's request for a temporary restraining order blocking the Kobach commision's voter data request.
-- Similar analysis from 538.
-- Brookings: More declared Dem candidates at this point than in the past four cycles combined.
-- House Dem freshman outraising GOP counterparts. [Roll Call]
** Odds & ends:
-- A MA court has found that the state's requirement to register to vote at least 20 days prior to the election violates the state constitution. No remedy issued yet, but this could mean election day registration would be required. There's a separate legislative effort going on as well.Fun fact of the day: Take a gander at this map of who lives where in the U.S.
-- Gallup poll only has Trump at positive approval in 17 states.
--iMediaEthics poll has support for impeachment tied at 42%.
-- NC gov Cooper raising money to try and swing the legislature back to the Dems. [Politico]
-- NY gov Cuomo pushing efforts to increase voter registration. [NYDN]
-- VA gov candidate Northam has pledged that he will not agree to a redistricting map that doesn't come out of a non-partisan committee. VA gerrymandering is pretty bad, this would have a significant impact, especially on the state legislature.
-- Jennifer Carroll Foy has finally been declared the nominee in Virginia HD-02. You might remember this as the race that was tied most of the primary night; Foy ended up winning by 14 votes.
-- The Virginia House has been a big focus for Dem gains this fall, and so far, fundraising is going quite well for the Dems.
-- Tomorrow is another big special election night, as we'll have results from specials in Massachusetts, Mississippi, and New Hampshire, the last one of particular interest.
posted by Chrysostom at 2:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [64 favorites]
a local reporter I know posted the article on FB, and I'm trying to knock it down without ad hominem.
I admire your optimism, but remember that people can spew bullshit faster than you can knock it down.
posted by Justinian at 3:00 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
I admire your optimism, but remember that people can spew bullshit faster than you can knock it down.
posted by Justinian at 3:00 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
We need higher wages and lower rents.
Sounds like someone wants.... #abetterdeal
posted by cell divide at 3:03 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Sounds like someone wants.... #abetterdeal
posted by cell divide at 3:03 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
A good analysis of the breakdown of regular order in Washington. I think much of the media coverage is missing this bigger picture view of the overall actions/scandals of the President.
posted by herda05 at 3:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by herda05 at 3:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [9 favorites]
Our climate is too complex and the consequences of misguided policies too harsh to discount the positive effects of carbon enrichment.
This has been a thing for decades. I have a VHS tape from 1992 called The Greening of Planet Earth produced by the "Institute for Biospheric Research" (aka these guys) that makes the same bullshit argument.
posted by theodolite at 3:14 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
This has been a thing for decades. I have a VHS tape from 1992 called The Greening of Planet Earth produced by the "Institute for Biospheric Research" (aka these guys) that makes the same bullshit argument.
posted by theodolite at 3:14 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
I admire your optimism, but remember that people can spew bullshit faster than you can knock it down.
posted by Justinian at 3:00 PM on July 24 [+] [!]
The reporter is a good guy himself, but way too eager to give a balanced hearing to evidence like this. He was swayed mainly by the idea that they are former IC members who should be experts. On the other hand, I am confident that simply showing him that what they claim to be true is objectively false will quickly persuade him. I've already prepared the table by telling him that to my eye their main point was incorrect on the surface. I appreciate MeFites like East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 confirming my suspicions.
posted by Mental Wimp at 3:15 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Justinian at 3:00 PM on July 24 [+] [!]
The reporter is a good guy himself, but way too eager to give a balanced hearing to evidence like this. He was swayed mainly by the idea that they are former IC members who should be experts. On the other hand, I am confident that simply showing him that what they claim to be true is objectively false will quickly persuade him. I've already prepared the table by telling him that to my eye their main point was incorrect on the surface. I appreciate MeFites like East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 confirming my suspicions.
posted by Mental Wimp at 3:15 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
A higher concentration of carbon dioxide in our atmosphere would aid photosynthesis, which in turn contributes to increased plant growth. This correlates to a greater volume of food production and better quality food. Studies indicate that crops would utilize water more efficiently, requiring less water. And colder areas along the farm belt will experience longer growing seasons.
This, of course, explains why Venus is covered in a thriving and vibrant rainforest.
posted by ultranos at 3:22 PM on July 24, 2017 [54 favorites]
This, of course, explains why Venus is covered in a thriving and vibrant rainforest.
posted by ultranos at 3:22 PM on July 24, 2017 [54 favorites]
Well Russia sure as shit didn't meddle in elections to get sanctions strengthened.
Oh god it's so good. They engineer a totally successful coup using fucking spycraft and a Manchurian candidate, but the guy they've installed is such an incompetent moron that they're getting more sanctions.
A better deal
Serious question: are the Dems aware that you can hire branding consultants and advertising firms
Like ones that aren't terrible
posted by schadenfrau at 3:24 PM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
Oh god it's so good. They engineer a totally successful coup using fucking spycraft and a Manchurian candidate, but the guy they've installed is such an incompetent moron that they're getting more sanctions.
A better deal
Serious question: are the Dems aware that you can hire branding consultants and advertising firms
Like ones that aren't terrible
posted by schadenfrau at 3:24 PM on July 24, 2017 [14 favorites]
Well, here's a fun fact - I think "A Better Deal" is good branding. Maybe, just maybe, your personal reaction to a tagline isn't universal?
posted by Chrysostom at 3:28 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by Chrysostom at 3:28 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
Abet turd eel?
Nude eel? (It would get Troy McClure's vote)
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 3:34 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Nude eel? (It would get Troy McClure's vote)
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 3:34 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
I'd rather re-litigate the primaries than talk about the damn slogan again.
posted by diogenes at 3:38 PM on July 24, 2017 [50 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 3:38 PM on July 24, 2017 [50 favorites]
Can we just cool it with the slogans thing again fer crying out loud?
-Republicans run with policies that no slogan should be able to paper over and yet here we are. I don't think a slogan is the "make or break" power play that gets someone elected.
-Someone's already said previously: if you can think of a better one, be the change! Start a grassroots campaign, spread bumper stickers, talk to people, etc etc.
-the recent MetaTalk re: signal vs noise ad nauseum over and over
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 3:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
-Republicans run with policies that no slogan should be able to paper over and yet here we are. I don't think a slogan is the "make or break" power play that gets someone elected.
-Someone's already said previously: if you can think of a better one, be the change! Start a grassroots campaign, spread bumper stickers, talk to people, etc etc.
-the recent MetaTalk re: signal vs noise ad nauseum over and over
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 3:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
room 641a Ruh-roh! CNN: Russia says talk of further US sanctions 'counterproductive'
Don't worry, Putin, Sarah Huckabee Sanders is already walking back her statement that Trump supports the sanctions bill.
posted by pjenks at 3:51 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
Don't worry, Putin, Sarah Huckabee Sanders is already walking back her statement that Trump supports the sanctions bill.
posted by pjenks at 3:51 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
I can't wait for the first major legislation out of this administration to be a Russia sanctions bill, possibly passed over a veto! (I doubt it, Trump knows that would reveal him for the weak bully that he is.)
posted by Justinian at 3:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 3:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
So Trump is busy lecturing Boy Scouts about the Lugenpress.
posted by PenDevil at 3:59 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by PenDevil at 3:59 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Donald Trump: everything the Scout Oath and Law is not.
posted by jazon at 4:03 PM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by jazon at 4:03 PM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
So Trump is busy lecturing Boy Scouts about the Lugenpress.
That authentically makes me sad.
posted by mazola at 4:04 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
That authentically makes me sad.
posted by mazola at 4:04 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
"Trump now telling kids at the Boy Scouts Jamboree about “fake polls” and “fake news” and his “tremendous crowds”
President Trump to the Boy Scouts: "Under a Trump Administration, you'll be saying 'Merry Christmas' again as you go shopping."
"Trump tells the Boy Scouts he's going to kill Obamacare; Boy Scouts respond with chants of "U-S-A! U-S-A!""
[all real]
posted by bluecore at 4:11 PM on July 24, 2017 [46 favorites]
President Trump to the Boy Scouts: "Under a Trump Administration, you'll be saying 'Merry Christmas' again as you go shopping."
"Trump tells the Boy Scouts he's going to kill Obamacare; Boy Scouts respond with chants of "U-S-A! U-S-A!""
[all real]
posted by bluecore at 4:11 PM on July 24, 2017 [46 favorites]
Hitler youth rally speech - Nuremberg 1935
posted by kirkaracha at 4:13 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 4:13 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
From the CBS News write up of the speech: "By the way, just a question," Mr. Trump asked. "Did President Obama ever come to a Jamboree?"
Which earned him both the Non-Sequitor badge and the Boastful Taunt ribbon.
posted by notyou at 4:14 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Which earned him both the Non-Sequitor badge and the Boastful Taunt ribbon.
posted by notyou at 4:14 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
This is sick.
posted by pjenks at 4:14 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by pjenks at 4:14 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
Trumpjugend
posted by uosuaq at 4:15 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by uosuaq at 4:15 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
He totally took away their Merrick badges.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [20 favorites]
Normal is whatever you grew up with.
posted by theodolite at 4:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 4:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
"Trump tells the Boy Scouts he's going to kill Obamacare; Boy Scouts respond with chants of "U-S-A! U-S-A!""
@ChrisLHayes: Everything is culture war. Everything.
.
posted by pjenks at 4:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
@ChrisLHayes: Everything is culture war. Everything.
.
posted by pjenks at 4:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
Wonder what the Boy Scouts think about the speech? When I was their age, I went with my school to see Reagan speak. He was genial and funny, but I think we all tuned out pretty quickly. The only thing I could remember to tell my friends later was his "missed me!" quip when one of the balloons popped.
posted by honestcoyote at 4:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by honestcoyote at 4:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
The last time someone said "Merry Christmas" to me it had been so long since I'd heard it I was all like "Merry WHATmas???" and a bald eagle fell from the sky and an American flag across the street spontaneously burst into flame. Well, Trump's gonna put a stop to all that.
posted by The Card Cheat at 4:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 4:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
Christmas displays and sales didn't go up in the stores last year until August. Trump will get us back to year-round Christmas sales.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:25 PM on July 24, 2017
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:25 PM on July 24, 2017
It's scary to contemplate all the dangerous and repulsive things that previous administrations might have done, but refrained because they and those around them had more sense and dignity. Now the US has a President with no such restaints, and it's terrifying, but what's more terrifying is the idea that this may be the new normal. Turning a Jamboree into a political youth rally? Sure. Selling access to the levers of foreign policy? Undoubtedly. Appointing cronies and lickspittles to every level of government? This administration is doing the best it can and it's only hamstrung by its own incompetence. If Trump doesn't leave soon (or worse, if he's succeeded by another Republican administration) the US experiment with democracy will be over.
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:26 PM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:26 PM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
Ugh, I remember when my class in 3rd grade went to see Bush I during the 92 campaign. All of us kids were chanting "Four more years!" along with all the actual supporters. That was bad enough. I can't imagine what it'll be like when these kids grow older and look back at themselves chanting for Trump.
posted by downtohisturtles at 4:28 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by downtohisturtles at 4:28 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Hello.
I just got back from the city that is playing host to the Boy Scout jamboree, where Trump is currently speaking, deep inside West Virginia (population, ~2,800).
About 2/3 of the businesses in town were flying Pride flags to welcome a small LGBT event that took place in the town over the weekend. By contrast, there were only one or two who displayed signs to welcome the 40,000 scouts who were also in town at the same time. There were zero signs welcoming the president to this tiny town, apart from the occasional lawn sign along the highway.
I guess what I'm saying is.... look for the helpers. Even when we're surrounded by a sea of horribleness, we're not alone. We're not even outnumbered. Even in the unlikeliest of places, there are pockets of kind, caring people, who are doing their damndest to turn this thing around.
I love you all. Look for signs of hope where you can find them. Even where there seem to be none. In a town that went 2/3 for Trump, 1 in 3 people dared to go against the grain. Seek out these people. We can get through this.
posted by schmod at 4:31 PM on July 24, 2017 [183 favorites]
I just got back from the city that is playing host to the Boy Scout jamboree, where Trump is currently speaking, deep inside West Virginia (population, ~2,800).
About 2/3 of the businesses in town were flying Pride flags to welcome a small LGBT event that took place in the town over the weekend. By contrast, there were only one or two who displayed signs to welcome the 40,000 scouts who were also in town at the same time. There were zero signs welcoming the president to this tiny town, apart from the occasional lawn sign along the highway.
I guess what I'm saying is.... look for the helpers. Even when we're surrounded by a sea of horribleness, we're not alone. We're not even outnumbered. Even in the unlikeliest of places, there are pockets of kind, caring people, who are doing their damndest to turn this thing around.
I love you all. Look for signs of hope where you can find them. Even where there seem to be none. In a town that went 2/3 for Trump, 1 in 3 people dared to go against the grain. Seek out these people. We can get through this.
posted by schmod at 4:31 PM on July 24, 2017 [183 favorites]
Our climate is too complex and the consequences of misguided policies too harsh to discount the positive effects of carbon enrichment.
A higher concentration of carbon dioxide in our atmosphere would aid photosynthesis, which in turn contributes to increased plant growth. This correlates to a greater volume of food production and better quality food. Studies indicate that crops would utilize water more efficiently, requiring less water. And colder areas along the farm belt will experience longer growing seasons.
Spend some time in a greenhouse and then tell me if that is how you want to live 24/7/365. Great for plants. Crap for humans.
posted by srboisvert at 4:33 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
A higher concentration of carbon dioxide in our atmosphere would aid photosynthesis, which in turn contributes to increased plant growth. This correlates to a greater volume of food production and better quality food. Studies indicate that crops would utilize water more efficiently, requiring less water. And colder areas along the farm belt will experience longer growing seasons.
Spend some time in a greenhouse and then tell me if that is how you want to live 24/7/365. Great for plants. Crap for humans.
posted by srboisvert at 4:33 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
If every late night host doesn't intercut panning shots of the boy scout crowd with Trump's most insane, outrageous dumbshit utterances, then comedy is dead
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:33 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:33 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Turning a Jamboree into a political youth rally? Sure. Selling access to the levers of foreign policy? Undoubtedly. Appointing cronies and lickspittles to every level of government?
All of this has happened before and will happen again. Trump's incompetence and lack of vision mean he himself isn't the threat to democracy, but imagine if someone with his instincts who also knew how to operate the bureaucracy could bring. Trump has revealed that U.S. institutions are fragile, but also that he is a moron.
posted by cell divide at 4:35 PM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
All of this has happened before and will happen again. Trump's incompetence and lack of vision mean he himself isn't the threat to democracy, but imagine if someone with his instincts who also knew how to operate the bureaucracy could bring. Trump has revealed that U.S. institutions are fragile, but also that he is a moron.
posted by cell divide at 4:35 PM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
If every late night host doesn't intercut panning shots of the boy scout crowd with Trump's most insane, outrageous dumbshit utterances, then comedy is dead
/panning shot of crowd
[Garbled]
/stifled laughter
posted by Existential Dread at 4:35 PM on July 24, 2017
/panning shot of crowd
[Garbled]
/stifled laughter
posted by Existential Dread at 4:35 PM on July 24, 2017
Price: White House Expects A ‘Positive Outcome’ On Obamacare Repeal Vote (Esme Cribb, TPM 6:37pm)
Health and Human Services Secretary Tom Price on Monday said the White House is optimistic about the outcome of tomorrow’s Senate vote on a measure to repeal Obamacare — though senators remain unsure what that measure is.Trump: If Price Doesn’t Get Votes For O’Care Repeal, ‘Tom, You’re Fired’ (VIDEO) (Esme Cribb, TPM 6:59pm)
“We look forward to having at least 50 votes in the Senate tomorrow, and the vice president will be there tomorrow to break a tie if there is a tie,” Price told reporters on Air Force One, according to a pool report.
President Donald Trump on Monday night appeared to joke about firing Health and Human Service Secretary Tom Price if he does not corral enough votes to get an Obamacare repeal bill through the Senate tomorrow.posted by Room 641-A at 4:36 PM on July 24, 2017 [20 favorites]
“By the way, you’re going to get the votes?” Trump said to Price, who stood beside him onstage at a national Boy Scout event in West Virginia.
“He better get ’em. He better get ’em. Oh, he better,” Trump said, turning back to the crowd. “Otherwise I’ll say, Tom, you’re fired. I’ll get somebody.”
He turned to Price, smiling, then continued.
“He better get Senator Capito to vote for it,” Trump said, referring to Sen. Shelley Moore Capito (R-WV). “You’ve got to get the other senators to vote for it. It’s time.”
In a later aside, Trump added: “We could use some more loyalty, I will tell you that.”
It was not clear what or who he was referring to.
Trump will get us back to year-round Christmas sales
He's like the anti-Scrooge. Instead of keeping the goodwill -to- men Christmas spirit in his heart all year around, he just wants the "fuck you non- Christians" part of Christmas to be present from Christmas - past to Christmas - future.
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:39 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
He's like the anti-Scrooge. Instead of keeping the goodwill -to- men Christmas spirit in his heart all year around, he just wants the "fuck you non- Christians" part of Christmas to be present from Christmas - past to Christmas - future.
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:39 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
For everyone horrified at the Boy Scout thing, this twitter search might make you feel better (via the LA Times' Matt Pearce). A lot of people saying they don't want their sons associated with such an organization. Parents are not happy.
posted by yasaman at 4:39 PM on July 24, 2017 [41 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 4:39 PM on July 24, 2017 [41 favorites]
Children of the Corn, yes.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:40 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:40 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
“He better get Senator Capito to vote for it,” Trump said, referring to Sen. Shelley Moore Capito (R-WV). “You’ve got to get the other senators to vote for it. It’s time.”
In a later aside, Trump added: “We could use some more loyalty, I will tell you that.”
It was not clear what or who he was referring to.
Uh, I can tell you what he was not referring to: keeping partisan politics out of a nonprofit organization's event. Even as a Boy Scout way back when, my reaction would have been "What the fuck?"
posted by Rykey at 4:41 PM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
In a later aside, Trump added: “We could use some more loyalty, I will tell you that.”
It was not clear what or who he was referring to.
Uh, I can tell you what he was not referring to: keeping partisan politics out of a nonprofit organization's event. Even as a Boy Scout way back when, my reaction would have been "What the fuck?"
posted by Rykey at 4:41 PM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
Wait was this Boy Scout "speech" made to an audience of actual children?
Actual current children, probable future paramilitaries.
posted by Rust Moranis at 4:43 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
Actual current children, probable future paramilitaries.
posted by Rust Moranis at 4:43 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
My troop generally stayed away from jamborees for this exact reason.
They're the clearest reflection of the overt right-wing politics that dominate the national Scouting organization. (We weren't exactly a left-wing troop either. But the blatant politicization and military boosterism rubbed pretty much everyone the wrong way)
Also, as a former Eagle Scout: Do not put your children in scouts. Do not support their fundraisers.
Burn the whole organization to the ground.
posted by schmod at 4:46 PM on July 24, 2017 [54 favorites]
They're the clearest reflection of the overt right-wing politics that dominate the national Scouting organization. (We weren't exactly a left-wing troop either. But the blatant politicization and military boosterism rubbed pretty much everyone the wrong way)
Also, as a former Eagle Scout: Do not put your children in scouts. Do not support their fundraisers.
Burn the whole organization to the ground.
posted by schmod at 4:46 PM on July 24, 2017 [54 favorites]
Serious question: are the Dems aware that you can hire branding consultants and advertising firms
Like ones that aren't terrible
This slogan first came to our attention from a fellow mefite in the last thread. It was then enthusiastically endorsed by several others.
posted by VTX at 4:47 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Like ones that aren't terrible
This slogan first came to our attention from a fellow mefite in the last thread. It was then enthusiastically endorsed by several others.
posted by VTX at 4:47 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Trump also told the Boy Scouts that he had a friend who bought a yacht and then had a very interesting life. He wouldn't go into it any more than that because they were Boy Scouts, he said.
He said this in front of an audience of thousands of young boys and their parents.
posted by winna at 4:55 PM on July 24, 2017 [46 favorites]
He said this in front of an audience of thousands of young boys and their parents.
posted by winna at 4:55 PM on July 24, 2017 [46 favorites]
Was his friend named... Jim?
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:56 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:56 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Bob Casey (D-PA) up. He has noted that many of these folks aren't highly engaged in public policy debates cause they have many other obligations. Casey talking about rural families being concerned about how Medicaid cuts would affect their children, many who have disabilities. He notes that Medicaid/Medicare are part of coming together as a community and country to help folks who need that assistance, even if we don't need it ourselves. He notes that it's only been recently that people have been actively worried that these programs might not be here when they need it.
Casey reporting that the CBO has estimated 15 million people would lose coverage in 2018, with another 10 million people losing it in by 2026. He notes that the losses would undo all of the progress of the ACA and then some. "That alone makes no sense."
Casey conveying how remarkable it is that folks will talk about their innermost fears about their healthcare, because they are worried about a "direct threat to their children, a direct threat to the healthcare their families have" that have never had to deal with before. He recounts a story about how her own insurance can't cover her severely disability child's treatment and that Medicaid does cover it. He quotes her, "Its not negotiable--these are necessities; these aren't just add-ons". He says that the idea that a mother such as her should have to come to a meeting to preserve those benefits for her child in the United States of America is an insult to our country. "She shouldn't have to worry for a minute--she should not have to worry if her child should have Medicaid."
Now Casey's getting fiiiired up! He's saying that because we're the USA, we can and should take care of our population. He says that gutting Medicaid for a tax cut is "obscene". Casey making the case that "not 1 person" should have to worry about their healthcare being stolen for tax cuts. He says that "this is a pivotal moment", not just for the Senate but for the country. He's taking the smart route of framing these programs as protections.
I'm actually pretty moved by Casey being so strident. He started out kinda softly, but as he's drawn connections between taking healthcare away from people to pay for bullshit tax cuts, he's gotten quite passionate.
Hope someone can summarize Senator Cantwell's speech.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [71 favorites]
Casey reporting that the CBO has estimated 15 million people would lose coverage in 2018, with another 10 million people losing it in by 2026. He notes that the losses would undo all of the progress of the ACA and then some. "That alone makes no sense."
Casey conveying how remarkable it is that folks will talk about their innermost fears about their healthcare, because they are worried about a "direct threat to their children, a direct threat to the healthcare their families have" that have never had to deal with before. He recounts a story about how her own insurance can't cover her severely disability child's treatment and that Medicaid does cover it. He quotes her, "Its not negotiable--these are necessities; these aren't just add-ons". He says that the idea that a mother such as her should have to come to a meeting to preserve those benefits for her child in the United States of America is an insult to our country. "She shouldn't have to worry for a minute--she should not have to worry if her child should have Medicaid."
Now Casey's getting fiiiired up! He's saying that because we're the USA, we can and should take care of our population. He says that gutting Medicaid for a tax cut is "obscene". Casey making the case that "not 1 person" should have to worry about their healthcare being stolen for tax cuts. He says that "this is a pivotal moment", not just for the Senate but for the country. He's taking the smart route of framing these programs as protections.
I'm actually pretty moved by Casey being so strident. He started out kinda softly, but as he's drawn connections between taking healthcare away from people to pay for bullshit tax cuts, he's gotten quite passionate.
Hope someone can summarize Senator Cantwell's speech.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [71 favorites]
Nah, the Boysprouts are not a unified organization by any means or measures. They went through a period of overt right-wing partisanship as the Ultra Fundie Mormons plotted and executed a takeover of the upper levels of the National organization, but the local councils mostly ignored them unless they were demanding more money for camp improvements. The Ultra Fundie Mormons announced earlier in the summer they are leaving for organizations where "Basic Human Decency" and "Continual Education and Self Improvement" isn't as baked in.
I've got a POC trans nephew in Scouting, and his Pack, leaders and parents, are super accepting, to the point where they largely don't care unless there's a situation where they need to care, and then they care kindly. He's a Webelo that wobbles and don't fall down!
posted by Slap*Happy at 4:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [27 favorites]
I've got a POC trans nephew in Scouting, and his Pack, leaders and parents, are super accepting, to the point where they largely don't care unless there's a situation where they need to care, and then they care kindly. He's a Webelo that wobbles and don't fall down!
posted by Slap*Happy at 4:57 PM on July 24, 2017 [27 favorites]
Trump also told the Boy Scouts that he had a friend who bought a yacht and then had a very interesting life.
I'm gonna get blackout drunk when it turns out this entire mess of Trump and his Russian collusion was simply so Trump could get a yacht and go "vroom vroom".
posted by Mister Fabulous at 5:01 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
I'm gonna get blackout drunk when it turns out this entire mess of Trump and his Russian collusion was simply so Trump could get a yacht and go "vroom vroom".
posted by Mister Fabulous at 5:01 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Casey was very milquetoast before Trump (he took after his dad, who was a pain in the ass to the party in the 80s). But since the election, he has been kicking ass. I'm proud to have him as my senator at this point.
posted by Chrysostom at 5:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by Chrysostom at 5:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
Video: Trump tells Boy Scouts he hopes GOP can kill Obamacare (stripping 22M+ of health coverage) Boy Scouts respond by cheering "USA USA USA"
posted by zachlipton at 5:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 5:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
I can't believe he's doing a cleaned-up version of the pussy grab story in front of Boy Scouts. The man is an absolute ogre.
posted by valkane at 5:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by valkane at 5:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [12 favorites]
This is basically a Hitler Youth rally, right? Fucking hell.
posted by Artw at 5:11 PM on July 24, 2017 [22 favorites]
posted by Artw at 5:11 PM on July 24, 2017 [22 favorites]
I guess what I'm saying is.... look for the helpers. Even when we're surrounded by a sea of horribleness, we're not alone. We're not even outnumbered. Even in the unlikeliest of places, there are pockets of kind, caring people, who are doing their damndest to turn this thing around.
I love you all. Look for signs of hope where you can find them. Even where there seem to be none. In a town that went 2/3 for Trump, 1 in 3 people dared to go against the grain. Seek out these people. We can get through this.
posted by schmod at 4:31 PM on July 24
Thanks for this reminder, schmod.
If I may, I have my own little anecdote to share:
Since the publication of Trump voter demographics and an uptick in hate crimes in the area, I haven't really felt safe interacting with strangers and especially those who are statistically likely to have voted Trump. I resent this reaction on my own part, but it's a defensive thought process like Schroedinger's rapist scenario only with potential hate criminals.
Last night I attended a dinner reception and was seated next to a guy who was big, white, and loud (I point his appearance out only to describe how the situation looked at first). My defenses went up even more when he mentioned he was from Anaheim, home to a big KKK presence...but over the course of the evening, we chatted about the terribleness of the administration, issues with racist law enforcement and prosecutions (he seemed especially angry with racist DAs in his area), workers' rights (anecdote of when he and a coworker sued his former employer for violating wage laws/contracts and sexual harassment), cultural diversity in art/music, the need for more progressive politics, and a bunch of things that generally reminded me that we can have a lot in common despite appearances.
We're not starting this fight from zero--we already have a lot of folks on our team. As schmod says, we need to find them.
(PS: He also talked at length about how he was a former Boy Scout, and I kinda wish I had his contact info just to ask him his thoughts about this Jamboree event.)
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 5:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [35 favorites]
I love you all. Look for signs of hope where you can find them. Even where there seem to be none. In a town that went 2/3 for Trump, 1 in 3 people dared to go against the grain. Seek out these people. We can get through this.
posted by schmod at 4:31 PM on July 24
Thanks for this reminder, schmod.
If I may, I have my own little anecdote to share:
Since the publication of Trump voter demographics and an uptick in hate crimes in the area, I haven't really felt safe interacting with strangers and especially those who are statistically likely to have voted Trump. I resent this reaction on my own part, but it's a defensive thought process like Schroedinger's rapist scenario only with potential hate criminals.
Last night I attended a dinner reception and was seated next to a guy who was big, white, and loud (I point his appearance out only to describe how the situation looked at first). My defenses went up even more when he mentioned he was from Anaheim, home to a big KKK presence...but over the course of the evening, we chatted about the terribleness of the administration, issues with racist law enforcement and prosecutions (he seemed especially angry with racist DAs in his area), workers' rights (anecdote of when he and a coworker sued his former employer for violating wage laws/contracts and sexual harassment), cultural diversity in art/music, the need for more progressive politics, and a bunch of things that generally reminded me that we can have a lot in common despite appearances.
We're not starting this fight from zero--we already have a lot of folks on our team. As schmod says, we need to find them.
(PS: He also talked at length about how he was a former Boy Scout, and I kinda wish I had his contact info just to ask him his thoughts about this Jamboree event.)
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 5:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [35 favorites]
Casey was very milquetoast before Trump (he took after his dad, who was a pain in the ass to the party in the 80s). But since the election, he has been kicking ass. I'm proud to have him as my senator at this point.
I think I've said it before in the thread, but I'll say it again: I never fucking thought I'd be so proud of my pro-life, mildly pro-gun, political dynasty senator from PA. I mean, for fuck's sake, his dad is the Casey in Planned Parenthood v. Casey.
But here I am, adding a "Call Senator Casey's office to tell them that I'm proud and thankful," along with my last minute FUCK YOU PAT TOOMEY morning call.
posted by joyceanmachine at 5:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
I think I've said it before in the thread, but I'll say it again: I never fucking thought I'd be so proud of my pro-life, mildly pro-gun, political dynasty senator from PA. I mean, for fuck's sake, his dad is the Casey in Planned Parenthood v. Casey.
But here I am, adding a "Call Senator Casey's office to tell them that I'm proud and thankful," along with my last minute FUCK YOU PAT TOOMEY morning call.
posted by joyceanmachine at 5:18 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
Referring to regular mainstream Mormons as "Ultra Fundie Mormons" when they're doing bad stuff is letting them off the hook.
True. The local Mormons that I know and love are kind of nice an left-leaning tho, and I didn't want to tar the religion with too broad a brush.
posted by Slap*Happy at 5:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
True. The local Mormons that I know and love are kind of nice an left-leaning tho, and I didn't want to tar the religion with too broad a brush.
posted by Slap*Happy at 5:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
I love how Sheldon Whitehous (D-RI) keeps calling this legislative terrorism the work of "creepy billionaires" and how the Republican party keep following those "creepy billionaires" over a cliff.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 5:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [38 favorites]
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 5:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [38 favorites]
Casey has found his inner fire since the election. I get the impression that he was legit shook by it in the same way we all were, and he's not trying to hide it.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
Catherine Rampell, WaPo: Jared Kushner ‘forgets’ to disclose his assets? Seize them.
[…] we need the banana republic rule (named for the lawless state, not the store).posted by Johnny Wallflower at 5:24 PM on July 24, 2017 [100 favorites]
It might push Kushner — and other ultra-wealthy people serving the president — to be excruciatingly thorough on these forms. Here’s how it would work.
Above a certain value — let’s say $1 million — any assets that are “forgotten” on federal disclosures can be seized by Uncle Sam. If they weren’t memorable enough for these forms, then clearly you’re rich enough that you don’t really need them.
Treasury gets to take them, without compensating you.
“That’s socialism!” you might protest. But really, it’s not so different from another policy that the definitely-not-socialist Trump administration already backs enthusiastically: civil asset forfeiture.
Elizabeth Warren (D-MA). She notes how the CBO noted that they couldn't get a vote to the floor after the CBO reported 22 million would lose insurance. Next bill had 22 million losing coverage. CBO said the full repeal bill would knock 32 million of their care. Mentions how the Cruz amendment doesn't have a CBO score.
She wants to know why the Republicans have such trouble coming up with a real plan for healthcare improvement--she explicitly calls that the goal is big tax cuts, not to improve healthcare. The Republican healthcare plans have gone from bad to worse to embarrassing. Now she's talking about how many family with children have severe disabilities are terrified at the thought of this bill passing. She notes how all of these severely disabled children need help from Medicaid, so they can get the care they need and that they can live it homes. It makes that their families won't go bankrupt. Without Medicaid, "these families would be destroyed". She notes that even though these parents have their own insurance, there was no way they could cover their children's massive costs.
She says that the Republican plan is both "cruel" and "immoral" and that "we should not even be holding this vote tomorrow", since citizens, healthcare groups, healthcare workers, and other advocacy groups are forcefully opposed to this bill. She's demanding that Republicans listen to the people who would be most affected by this bill. Warren calls on Republicans to work in a bipartisan manner to fix the problems with healthcare.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 5:31 PM on July 24, 2017 [51 favorites]
She wants to know why the Republicans have such trouble coming up with a real plan for healthcare improvement--she explicitly calls that the goal is big tax cuts, not to improve healthcare. The Republican healthcare plans have gone from bad to worse to embarrassing. Now she's talking about how many family with children have severe disabilities are terrified at the thought of this bill passing. She notes how all of these severely disabled children need help from Medicaid, so they can get the care they need and that they can live it homes. It makes that their families won't go bankrupt. Without Medicaid, "these families would be destroyed". She notes that even though these parents have their own insurance, there was no way they could cover their children's massive costs.
She says that the Republican plan is both "cruel" and "immoral" and that "we should not even be holding this vote tomorrow", since citizens, healthcare groups, healthcare workers, and other advocacy groups are forcefully opposed to this bill. She's demanding that Republicans listen to the people who would be most affected by this bill. Warren calls on Republicans to work in a bipartisan manner to fix the problems with healthcare.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 5:31 PM on July 24, 2017 [51 favorites]
Obligatory periodic reminder that while "children with disabilities" is a popular group to reference, adults with disabilities are also hard hit by this. That's all I have the energy to write here. >_<
posted by spaceman_spiff at 5:38 PM on July 24, 2017 [45 favorites]
posted by spaceman_spiff at 5:38 PM on July 24, 2017 [45 favorites]
We need higher wages and lower rents.
"The rent is too damn high!"
posted by Mental Wimp at 5:38 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
"The rent is too damn high!"
posted by Mental Wimp at 5:38 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
As much as I like beer, maybe there are other monopolies on this list that should be higher priority?
I think they need to go after Silicon Valley (and whatever the Seattle equivalent is), but I'd be surprised if they had the spine since a lot of those people are their donors, and probably also because the harm of having a tech industry dominated by a few titans isn't as immediately apparent to people because their products are largely free or low-price. But I was happy just to hear any anti-trust language coming out of Congress.
posted by en forme de poire at 5:44 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
I think they need to go after Silicon Valley (and whatever the Seattle equivalent is), but I'd be surprised if they had the spine since a lot of those people are their donors, and probably also because the harm of having a tech industry dominated by a few titans isn't as immediately apparent to people because their products are largely free or low-price. But I was happy just to hear any anti-trust language coming out of Congress.
posted by en forme de poire at 5:44 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
@Jenna Johnson The Boy Scouts of America are now booing Hillary Clinton as President Trump recounts his Michigan strategy and the election results.
Of all the shitty things that DJT has done, this must be high on the list. To speak in front of tens of thousands of boys and young men and encourage them to boo a former First Lady is unbelievably low. This is not what scouting is about-- it is in fact the opposite. Service to community and country and good manners are the main tent poles of the BSA. What were the leaders thinking? I know he is President (and therefore an honorary BS) but this one is different and they should have figured that out. Someone at least should have vetted his speech before hand.
As a former Scout I am both appalled and saddened that this tool is allowed to speak as he likes to children just because he won the Presidency.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:46 PM on July 24, 2017 [117 favorites]
Of all the shitty things that DJT has done, this must be high on the list. To speak in front of tens of thousands of boys and young men and encourage them to boo a former First Lady is unbelievably low. This is not what scouting is about-- it is in fact the opposite. Service to community and country and good manners are the main tent poles of the BSA. What were the leaders thinking? I know he is President (and therefore an honorary BS) but this one is different and they should have figured that out. Someone at least should have vetted his speech before hand.
As a former Scout I am both appalled and saddened that this tool is allowed to speak as he likes to children just because he won the Presidency.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:46 PM on July 24, 2017 [117 favorites]
I am loving the shit out of this play by play of Democratic Senators breathing fire at the podium. It's encouraging.
posted by schadenfrau at 5:46 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 5:46 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
It's not surprising coming from Trump (and just his usual bullshit campaign rally riff), but that Boy Scout jamboree footage is still fucking outrageous. Who at the BSA could possibly have thought that was a good idea that would end well?
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:47 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:47 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Of all the shitty things that DJT has done, this must be high on the list. To speak in front of tens of thousands of boys and young men and encourage them to boo a former First Lady is unbelievably low.
The booing Obama part was pretty bad as well, especially since he was an actual, you know, Cub Scout in Indonesia, as opposed to the utter moral shitstain onstage.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:49 PM on July 24, 2017 [32 favorites]
The booing Obama part was pretty bad as well, especially since he was an actual, you know, Cub Scout in Indonesia, as opposed to the utter moral shitstain onstage.
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:49 PM on July 24, 2017 [32 favorites]
and that slogan is really fucking funny. Because "a better deal" is weak writing in the exact same way people perceive the Democrats to be weak; it's literally saying "we're a marginal improvement on the other thing." "Better" is possibly the weakest positive adjective you can find, to the point where it's almost advertising for the other guy. It reads like the first draft of a parody. Because 2017, I guess.
posted by schadenfrau at 5:54 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by schadenfrau at 5:54 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
From the Thank God for Pete Souza file: "I can assure you, POTUS was not telling this Cub Scout and the Boy Scouts who followed about his electoral college victory."
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:55 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:55 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
@KristenClarkeJD Proud of young people who pursue public interest. But this #WhiteHouse intern photo is shocking & does not reflect diversity of US today.
Context: Obama WH Interns 2015
posted by pjenks at 5:55 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
Context: Obama WH Interns 2015
posted by pjenks at 5:55 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
Schumer: "We’ve already proposed creating jobs with a $1 trillion infrastructure plan; increasing workers’ incomes by lifting the minimum wage to $15; and lowering household costs by providing paid family and sick leave."
That all sounds really indirect. Most other wealthy nations have federal/state offices that will provide you with guaranteed work and training if you want them. In Germany, that allowed my sister to change careers from architect to police officer when she found the culture in her previous field too full of sexism. Other countries have programs that directly do things instead of giving money to private parties several steps removed from the thing they're trying to accomplish and counting on luck, the integrity and moral superiority of the wealthy and successful, and invisible forces to allocate the resources and make it all work as if by magic. Why can't we at least sometimes do that--you know, at least for the problems we claim to believe are really serious and urgent?
posted by saulgoodman at 5:58 PM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
That all sounds really indirect. Most other wealthy nations have federal/state offices that will provide you with guaranteed work and training if you want them. In Germany, that allowed my sister to change careers from architect to police officer when she found the culture in her previous field too full of sexism. Other countries have programs that directly do things instead of giving money to private parties several steps removed from the thing they're trying to accomplish and counting on luck, the integrity and moral superiority of the wealthy and successful, and invisible forces to allocate the resources and make it all work as if by magic. Why can't we at least sometimes do that--you know, at least for the problems we claim to believe are really serious and urgent?
posted by saulgoodman at 5:58 PM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
Nobody knows what they’re voting on. Nobody knows if it can pass. Nobody is even sure if the Senate’s plan to repeal and replace Obamacare, as a policy, can even work.
I know if it can work. It can't work. The ones they've carefully slaved over can't work because - who could have guessed? - the shit is complicated and they don't know fuck all about healthcare. So the plan is "fuck it, we'll wing it and whatever we throw at the wall in two-minute amendments will be it?" Fucking whiteboard brainstorming, that's the plan? It can't work. Period.
posted by ctmf at 6:02 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
I know if it can work. It can't work. The ones they've carefully slaved over can't work because - who could have guessed? - the shit is complicated and they don't know fuck all about healthcare. So the plan is "fuck it, we'll wing it and whatever we throw at the wall in two-minute amendments will be it?" Fucking whiteboard brainstorming, that's the plan? It can't work. Period.
posted by ctmf at 6:02 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
The plan is to pay for the repeal of the ACA tax hikes on the wealthy by slashing care for the poor and establishing a lower baseline for revenues so that it's easier for them to cut more taxes on the wealthy.
that plan is gonna work pretty well if they can manage to pass it
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:04 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
that plan is gonna work pretty well if they can manage to pass it
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:04 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
Sen. McCain says he's coming back to Washington tomorrow. This is really happening people.
posted by zachlipton at 6:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 6:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
The Democrats should start wearing *blue* "Make America Great Again" hats. Probably a bad idea, but I love imagining how full of rage Trumpists would be over their own middle finger being stolen and shoved right back in their faces.
I realize it probably feels good to think about the utter shitfit that redhats would have but never in my 34 years on this earth has anyone ever said that the answer to sectarian division is more sectarian division.
posted by Talez at 6:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
I realize it probably feels good to think about the utter shitfit that redhats would have but never in my 34 years on this earth has anyone ever said that the answer to sectarian division is more sectarian division.
posted by Talez at 6:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
Sorry I can't get all of these wonderful speeches summarized--I'm doing them between making dinner and other various chores. I see these speeches and fantasize about giving an inspiring, firebrand speech in defense of healthcare and human rights on the Senate floor...which is of course why I'll never be able to, seeing as how emotional women's thoughts and voices aren't really welcome in patriarchal discourse, especially not if you're trans.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 6:07 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 6:07 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Yeah why not just draft a healthcare system by the reddit comments with the most up-votes. Glad this is getting all the deliberation it deserves.
posted by ctmf at 6:09 PM on July 24, 2017
posted by ctmf at 6:09 PM on July 24, 2017
No new slogans until you finish the first one.
posted by Johann Georg Faust at 6:12 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Johann Georg Faust at 6:12 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
if you're a part of the trump administration you're legally obligated to make this face at all times
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:12 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:12 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
I don't see McCain dragging himself back to DC if they didn't have the votes on the MTP. So, yeah, this is happening.
posted by Justinian at 6:15 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 6:15 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Sen. McCain says he's coming back to Washington tomorrow. This is really happening people.
So if you wished him well he's going to thank you by coming to take your healthcare.
posted by Artw at 6:16 PM on July 24, 2017 [56 favorites]
So if you wished him well he's going to thank you by coming to take your healthcare.
posted by Artw at 6:16 PM on July 24, 2017 [56 favorites]
glad i didn't wish him well
posted by entropicamericana at 6:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 6:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [11 favorites]
Does anybody remember what a huge controversy it was when the last president told kids to stay in school, set goals for themselves, and study hard.
posted by peeedro at 6:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by peeedro at 6:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
Guys, I'm worried about this healthcare vote. But I'm glad to see the AARP is pushing hard on it too (emphasis mine).
Tomorrow's health care vote is an accountability vote for AARP. We urge all Senators to #VoteNo.
What does that mean? Our members care deeply about health care & have said they want to know how their elected officials vote on key bills.
Accordingly, we will report to all 38 million AARP members how their Senators vote, via ads, our print publications, social media and more.
This includes printing each Senator's health care vote in the AARP Bulletin, which is read by 30.4 million Americans.
That means @SenDeanHeller's health care vote will be published in the AARP Bulletin & mailed to all 330,000 AARP members in Nevada. #VoteNo
.@senrobportman's health care vote will be published in the AARP Bulletin and mailed to all 1,500,000 AARP members in Ohio. #VoteNo
.@lisamurkowski's health care vote will be published in the AARP Bulletin and mailed to all 83,000 AARP members in Alaska. #VoteNo
.@SenCapito's health care vote will be published in the AARP Bulletin and mailed to all 271,000 AARP members in West Virginia. #VoteNo
To be clear, that means if the Senator votes no, we will thank them & let our 38 million members know they voted the right way.
We urge all Senators to do right by their constituents + vote NO on any health care bill that raises costs & lowers coverage.
posted by triggerfinger at 6:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [89 favorites]
Tomorrow's health care vote is an accountability vote for AARP. We urge all Senators to #VoteNo.
What does that mean? Our members care deeply about health care & have said they want to know how their elected officials vote on key bills.
Accordingly, we will report to all 38 million AARP members how their Senators vote, via ads, our print publications, social media and more.
This includes printing each Senator's health care vote in the AARP Bulletin, which is read by 30.4 million Americans.
That means @SenDeanHeller's health care vote will be published in the AARP Bulletin & mailed to all 330,000 AARP members in Nevada. #VoteNo
.@senrobportman's health care vote will be published in the AARP Bulletin and mailed to all 1,500,000 AARP members in Ohio. #VoteNo
.@lisamurkowski's health care vote will be published in the AARP Bulletin and mailed to all 83,000 AARP members in Alaska. #VoteNo
.@SenCapito's health care vote will be published in the AARP Bulletin and mailed to all 271,000 AARP members in West Virginia. #VoteNo
To be clear, that means if the Senator votes no, we will thank them & let our 38 million members know they voted the right way.
We urge all Senators to do right by their constituents + vote NO on any health care bill that raises costs & lowers coverage.
posted by triggerfinger at 6:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [89 favorites]
I don't want to be glib, because whatever they pass is going to be horrible for millions of people, and some of those people will die from it. But we assumed this would be done on Day 1 of them having total control. Delaying it 6 months and forcing millions of Trump voters to confront what they actually voted for isn't really a win, but it's not nothing. They really are going to own it when the health insurance market implodes, half the insurance industry lays off white collar workers, and stories of pain and suffering caused by Republicans lead the news every single day. They're never going to have an answer for what they're going to do to the country tomorrow. If it happens, the next job will be making sure no one ever, ever, forgets who took away health care. And hopefully to eventually give it back through single payer.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [13 favorites]
Maggie Hassan (D-NH) is up and characterizing the BCRA as dangerous. She is laying out the deadly consequences of this bill. She is highlighting the secrecy of McConnell's appalling process and how each bill is worse than the last. She notes that each version would lead to higher costs for worse coverage, decimate Medicaid, end the expansion, and cause premiums to rise. She cites the 22-32 million people would lose coverage.
The Senator says that she is willing to work with anyone serious about lowering costs. She notes that people all across NH are terrified of the consequences this bill. She is talking about how the emergency meeting last month at 2pm on a Friday drew hundreds of people with only a day's notice. She notes how people have benefited from maternity care, prescription drug coverage, and substance abuse treatment. She notes how a constituent paid 750 dollars less per month in premiums so they could pay for other necessities. Hassan notes how Medicaid helps her constituents live independently and continue to work. She is now talking about how Medicaid has been so helpful for helping people who are getting substance abuse treatment, and how Medicaid is essential for recovery. Senator Hassan has committed to fighting this legislation until it's dead and encourages everyone all across this nation to speak out!
Senator Hassan really brought it hard, and I love it.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 6:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [48 favorites]
The Senator says that she is willing to work with anyone serious about lowering costs. She notes that people all across NH are terrified of the consequences this bill. She is talking about how the emergency meeting last month at 2pm on a Friday drew hundreds of people with only a day's notice. She notes how people have benefited from maternity care, prescription drug coverage, and substance abuse treatment. She notes how a constituent paid 750 dollars less per month in premiums so they could pay for other necessities. Hassan notes how Medicaid helps her constituents live independently and continue to work. She is now talking about how Medicaid has been so helpful for helping people who are getting substance abuse treatment, and how Medicaid is essential for recovery. Senator Hassan has committed to fighting this legislation until it's dead and encourages everyone all across this nation to speak out!
Senator Hassan really brought it hard, and I love it.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 6:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [48 favorites]
Justice Dept. Nominee Says He Once Represented Russian Bank (NYT, Charles Savage and Adam Goldberg)
posted by Room 641-A at 6:22 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
WASHINGTON — President Trump’s nominee to lead the Justice Department’s criminal division, Brian A. Benczkowski, has disclosed to Congress that he previously represented Alfa Bank, one of Russia’s largest financial institutions, whose owners have ties to President Vladimir V. Putin.(Alfa Bank is the bank with servers talking to TrumpCo.)
Mr. Trump nominated Mr. Benczkowski, a partner at the Kirkland & Ellis law firm and a former Bush administration Justice Department official, in June, and he is scheduled to appear before the Senate Judiciary Committee for a confirmation hearing on Tuesday.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:22 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
I am as concerned for McCain's health as he is for mine.
posted by benzenedream at 6:25 PM on July 24, 2017 [65 favorites]
posted by benzenedream at 6:25 PM on July 24, 2017 [65 favorites]
I feel like this is a good time to mention that time when Trump apparently used Trump Foundation funds to pay his son's Boy Scout registration fee of $7.
posted by zachlipton at 6:29 PM on July 24, 2017 [66 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 6:29 PM on July 24, 2017 [66 favorites]
I bet he would have paid them more if he'd have known they would go full Nazi.
posted by Artw at 6:31 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Artw at 6:31 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Here come the Trump jets!
(Technically actually a small prop plane)
posted by Artw at 6:33 PM on July 24, 2017
(Technically actually a small prop plane)
posted by Artw at 6:33 PM on July 24, 2017
Bernie Sanders (I-VT) is up! He used the phrase "so-called healthcare" bill. He characterizes the legislation as the cruelest bill that has ever been brought to the Senate. He criticized the media's focus on the play-by-play of who votes for what, but not what the bill will do. He is highlighting how the USA is the only industrialized country not to guarantee healthcare for all people. Sanders notes that we are better off after the ACA, but that we still have 28 million uninsured people, and that the Republican plan is to toss at least 22 million people off it.
He implores anyone watching to imagine what it would be like to have cancer, heart disease, diabetes or other chronic illness. He says to imagine what it would be like to be thinking, will this legislation pass and will I live or die.
Bernie is really in his element here--and he is PISSED that this bill is up. He's bringing the fire and furious that he might have to tell anyone that their child might die if this bill passes. He is now citing how this bill will take $800,000,000,000 of billions from Medicaid. He says this bill will have "a severe and dramatic effect" on anyone in a nursing because Medicaid pays almost 2/3rds the cost of such care.
He states how this legislation will decrease funding for opiate treatment in places like VT, OH, NH, and WV. He wonders what will happen when massive cuts to these programs. Sanders now calling out the Douche Canoe for saying during the campaign he was a friend of the working class and how he would protect medicare and medicaid. He says to all the working class people that this bill cause people's premiums will skyrocket.
He's furious about how defunding Planned Parenthood is contradicting Republicans hand-wringing about choice, because 2 million women choose to get healthcare from Planned Parenthood. He notes now how before the ACA, the insurance would discriminate against people with pre-existing conditions. He specifically says that insurance are in the business of making money, not covering people--he characterizes that discrimination as an "obscenity".
Sanders is citing a Politifact article examining the consequences of this legislation. Politifact said that a Harvard study found 217,000 people over the decade would die prematurely.
Now I remember why when I was crying when Bernie started winning some primaries.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 6:33 PM on July 24, 2017 [65 favorites]
He implores anyone watching to imagine what it would be like to have cancer, heart disease, diabetes or other chronic illness. He says to imagine what it would be like to be thinking, will this legislation pass and will I live or die.
Bernie is really in his element here--and he is PISSED that this bill is up. He's bringing the fire and furious that he might have to tell anyone that their child might die if this bill passes. He is now citing how this bill will take $800,000,000,000 of billions from Medicaid. He says this bill will have "a severe and dramatic effect" on anyone in a nursing because Medicaid pays almost 2/3rds the cost of such care.
He states how this legislation will decrease funding for opiate treatment in places like VT, OH, NH, and WV. He wonders what will happen when massive cuts to these programs. Sanders now calling out the Douche Canoe for saying during the campaign he was a friend of the working class and how he would protect medicare and medicaid. He says to all the working class people that this bill cause people's premiums will skyrocket.
He's furious about how defunding Planned Parenthood is contradicting Republicans hand-wringing about choice, because 2 million women choose to get healthcare from Planned Parenthood. He notes now how before the ACA, the insurance would discriminate against people with pre-existing conditions. He specifically says that insurance are in the business of making money, not covering people--he characterizes that discrimination as an "obscenity".
Sanders is citing a Politifact article examining the consequences of this legislation. Politifact said that a Harvard study found 217,000 people over the decade would die prematurely.
Now I remember why when I was crying when Bernie started winning some primaries.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 6:33 PM on July 24, 2017 [65 favorites]
I generally don't feel sorry for Barron Trump, because there's a significantly-less-than-zero percent chance he won't land on his feet, regardless of what happens to the rest of family. But if Trump's jamboree speech is any indication of his capacity to relate to kids in some human way, I feel sorry for Barron Trump.
posted by emelenjr at 6:35 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by emelenjr at 6:35 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Senator Hassan really brought it hard, and I love it.
Good to see it was worth the effort of putting her into office. A+++ would volunteer for again.
I generally don't feel sorry for Barron Trump, because there's a significantly-less-than-zero percent chance he won't land on his feet, regardless of what happens to the rest of family. But if Trump's jamboree speech is any indication of his capacity to relate to kids in some human way, I feel sorry for Barron Trump.
Or, we can leave Barron alone as was the consensus of the last shitfight we had on this.
posted by Talez at 6:38 PM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
Good to see it was worth the effort of putting her into office. A+++ would volunteer for again.
I generally don't feel sorry for Barron Trump, because there's a significantly-less-than-zero percent chance he won't land on his feet, regardless of what happens to the rest of family. But if Trump's jamboree speech is any indication of his capacity to relate to kids in some human way, I feel sorry for Barron Trump.
Or, we can leave Barron alone as was the consensus of the last shitfight we had on this.
posted by Talez at 6:38 PM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
Happy to just kinda forgets the kid exists, like Trump does.
posted by Artw at 6:41 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by Artw at 6:41 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
Sheldon Whitehous (D-RI)
I don't like him as my Senator on a local level because of his history in-state, which is kinda shady. I love him as my Senator on the national stage, as he has this mild and calm nerdy sort of name and demeanor, and he is a fire-breathing axe-wielder with a deep and abiding hate of anything Republican and a trial-lawyer's bombast.
UNLEASH THE SHELDON!
posted by Slap*Happy at 6:41 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
I don't like him as my Senator on a local level because of his history in-state, which is kinda shady. I love him as my Senator on the national stage, as he has this mild and calm nerdy sort of name and demeanor, and he is a fire-breathing axe-wielder with a deep and abiding hate of anything Republican and a trial-lawyer's bombast.
UNLEASH THE SHELDON!
posted by Slap*Happy at 6:41 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Could they accidentally amend themselves into something the Parliamentarian requires 60 votes for and shoot themselves in the foot? Or would they get to just amend it some more?
posted by ctmf at 6:42 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by ctmf at 6:42 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Could they accidentally amend themselves into something the Parliamentarian requires 60 votes for and shoot themselves in the foot? Or would they get to just amend it some more?
They're already in that spot, depending on what piece of shit they actually put up. As zachlipton noted upthread:
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:49 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
They're already in that spot, depending on what piece of shit they actually put up. As zachlipton noted upthread:
The Senate Parliamentarian has determined, unsurprisingly enough, that various BCRA provisions violate the Byrd Rule and would require 60 votes to be enacted. These include defunding Planned Parenthood and the abortion restrictions, the six month waiting period for noncontinuous coverage, and the removal of the essential health benefits for Medicaid.All of those are dealbreakers for one Republican subgroup or another.
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:49 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
Tammy Baldwin of WI told a bunch of constituent stories; I hope one of them featured gerstle, MeFi's own healthcare anecdote hero!
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:53 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:53 PM on July 24, 2017 [8 favorites]
The last rundown of procedure I saw suggested that things would go into Amendment-O-Rama as everyone tried to load it up with poisoned pills designed to make it unpalatable for any given target. Ultimately, though, McConnell gets a last throw at amendments, and he could just throw in one to wipe away all the others right before voting.
If this passes the vote tomorrow this will be a shitshow no matter what happens. And I kind of expect it will, because everything comes down to dragged-out awfulness these days.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 7:01 PM on July 24, 2017
If this passes the vote tomorrow this will be a shitshow no matter what happens. And I kind of expect it will, because everything comes down to dragged-out awfulness these days.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 7:01 PM on July 24, 2017
Does anyone have a whip count specifically on the motion-to-proceed? WaPo have a whip count that was current as of a few hours ago suggesting that Collins, Lee, Moran, and Paul are still No.
How likely does anyone think that this MTP is just trying to get folks on the record one way or other?
Definitely keep calling, writing, and faxing.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 7:03 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
How likely does anyone think that this MTP is just trying to get folks on the record one way or other?
Definitely keep calling, writing, and faxing.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 7:03 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
I hereby offer up to the Writers my very last can't.
I just can't with this stupid horrible bill that won't die.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:08 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
I just can't with this stupid horrible bill that won't die.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:08 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
Benjy Sarlin of NBC News, via Twitter: About speculation R's vote yes because McCain's there: I watched them walk past Bob Dole in a wheelchair to vote down a disability treaty
posted by scaryblackdeath at 7:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [39 favorites]
posted by scaryblackdeath at 7:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [39 favorites]
Excommunicated Cardinal: that whip count assumes McCain is out (he's coming back, says his office), and Paul has said he'd vote yes on an MTP in exchange for his amendment (IIRC, the 2015 attempted Obamacare repeal) getting a fair vote. So that's Lee (UT), Collins (ME) and Moran (KS) who've said they oppose the bill "in its current form".
The GOP can afford two no votes (the WaPo whip count says one, but again, they're discounting McCain), which means only one of those three needs to vote yes ("I oppose it in its current form, but won't block the MTP because amendments" is one possibility; another is being promised specific amendments).
posted by spaceman_spiff at 7:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
The GOP can afford two no votes (the WaPo whip count says one, but again, they're discounting McCain), which means only one of those three needs to vote yes ("I oppose it in its current form, but won't block the MTP because amendments" is one possibility; another is being promised specific amendments).
posted by spaceman_spiff at 7:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
WaPo have a whip count that was current as of a few hours ago suggesting that Collins, Lee, Moran, and Paul are still No.
Paul said he would vote for the MTP if he gets a vote on his amendment, which is straight repeal. He's a yes. He was always going to be a yes, he was just doing his standard primadonna routine first.
Capito has been signaling all today and yesterday she would be a yes on MTP too.
I think the only firm No on MTP is Collins. Lee has been quiet but he's going to fold like Paul, he won't be the Republican who allowed Obamacare to live. Moran is interesting, because he tried to throw in with the Paul/Lee "it's not mean enough" camp, but he didn't find that excuse until after he was the only Republican Senator to hold a townhall and got absolutely flayed by his constituents. But he's a backbench cardboard cutout from Kansas, he's also not going to be the one to stop anything.
If one of them jumps, I think 8-10 will join and the MTP will die, but we're still waiting on someone to lead the charge, and if McCain is really flying in with brain cancer, it's hard to think that it's because he wants to do the right thing before he dies. More likely McConnell has his MTP votes, and we're going to be off to the WTF races with the amendment apocalypse.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:34 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Paul said he would vote for the MTP if he gets a vote on his amendment, which is straight repeal. He's a yes. He was always going to be a yes, he was just doing his standard primadonna routine first.
Capito has been signaling all today and yesterday she would be a yes on MTP too.
I think the only firm No on MTP is Collins. Lee has been quiet but he's going to fold like Paul, he won't be the Republican who allowed Obamacare to live. Moran is interesting, because he tried to throw in with the Paul/Lee "it's not mean enough" camp, but he didn't find that excuse until after he was the only Republican Senator to hold a townhall and got absolutely flayed by his constituents. But he's a backbench cardboard cutout from Kansas, he's also not going to be the one to stop anything.
If one of them jumps, I think 8-10 will join and the MTP will die, but we're still waiting on someone to lead the charge, and if McCain is really flying in with brain cancer, it's hard to think that it's because he wants to do the right thing before he dies. More likely McConnell has his MTP votes, and we're going to be off to the WTF races with the amendment apocalypse.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:34 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
I don't know what will come of this, but I think this is a historic, visceral moment. The President of the United States has stood at a nominally non-political event, and encouraged a massive group of young children to denounce his political rival and their most recent former President. If reasonable observers wish to make a moral distinction between Trump's America and a fascist state, they may no longer base their claim on the President's actions. With a somewhat different national political environment, such a leader's rejection of the possibility of national unity would lead to just the scale of factional slaughter or systemic killings we have seen in history from similar political strongmen eager to indoctrinate a cult of personality. Just as Jared Kushner's defense is that he did not succeed in colluding with Russia, his father in law's defense is that he has not yet succeeded in instigating civil conflict against his political rivals. Let us hope his ongoing deterioration is swift and painless.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:44 PM on July 24, 2017 [99 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:44 PM on July 24, 2017 [99 favorites]
Why is @realdonaldtrump ranting about the WaPo right now? Do they have a story coming out?
posted by lalex at 10:34 PM on 7/24
[+] [!]
He's helpfully declassifying the info for a WaPo story. Live. On the internet.
posted by tilde at 7:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
I can't link now, but about 30 minutes ago Lawrence O'Donell had a WaPo writer on, talking about firing Jefferson Beauregard Sessions. I think it's the "twisting in the wind" story linked earlier.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:50 PM on July 24, 2017
posted by Room 641-A at 7:50 PM on July 24, 2017
I bet Bezos is really happy about having gone to those tech summits right about now.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 7:59 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 7:59 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
Maybe he snuck a rogue Echo in there?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:00 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:00 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
Looks like BSA official policy is political non-involvement.
posted by Chrysostom at 8:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Chrysostom at 8:06 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
I expect that will extend to not complaining about the President placing them on the front lines of political conflict.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [5 favorites]
I just can't get over this Scout speech. I can't. I have so many comments I'd need a running log with timestamps. Watching the toadies shuffle and wince behind him is just the start.
I really hope anyone who was/is a Scout , or has a kid in Scouts, writes the organization right away.
posted by Miko at 8:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [35 favorites]
I really hope anyone who was/is a Scout , or has a kid in Scouts, writes the organization right away.
posted by Miko at 8:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [35 favorites]
Bradd Jaffy (Twitter) has the full transcript of the speech; the video clips are only skimming the surface of its lunacy and inappropriateness.
Trump also managed not to mention that Jeff Sessions was an Eagle Scout -- purely coincidental, I'm sure.
posted by FelliniBlank at 8:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [20 favorites]
Trump also managed not to mention that Jeff Sessions was an Eagle Scout -- purely coincidental, I'm sure.
posted by FelliniBlank at 8:19 PM on July 24, 2017 [20 favorites]
I thought I reached peak WTF several months ago. This scout speech, though. WHAT THE FUCK?
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 8:24 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 8:24 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Does anyone know of a good, comprehensive timeline of Russiagate? I'm reading the Bill Moyers one, which is pretty good.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:27 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:27 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Sessions should resign and turn state's evidence before donnie fires him. This administration is already barely functioning, many positions not filled, if Sessions bugs out you've got a shattered DOJ. ITMFA.
posted by vrakatar at 8:31 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by vrakatar at 8:31 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
Sorry I'm late to the thread. I was out picking up the nails, sawdust, a little scraps of wood from a construction site down the road so I can have a yacht one day and do things that Boy Scouts can't hear about.
posted by perhapses at 8:33 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by perhapses at 8:33 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
That guy with the yacht? William Levitt
Levitt refused to integrate his developments. The Jewish Levitt barred Jews from Strathmore, his first pre-Levittown development on Long Island in New York, and he refused to sell his homes to blacks. His sales contracts also forbade the resale of properties to blacks through restrictive covenants, although in 1957 a white couple resold their house to the first black family to live in a Levitt home. Levitt's all-white policies also led to civil rights protests in Bowie, Maryland in 1963.[8][9] The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People and the American Civil Liberties Union opposed Levitt’s racist policies, and the Federal Housing Administration prepared to refuse mortgages on his next Levittown.posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 8:36 PM on July 24, 2017 [24 favorites]
lalex, your link is to the BSA facebook page, not to any comments. I don't facebook. What's up?
posted by yesster at 8:41 PM on July 24, 2017
posted by yesster at 8:41 PM on July 24, 2017
In addition to the racism, the rest of the William Levitt story is ideal Trump hero mythology: multiple marriages, business failures, etc.
posted by perhapses at 8:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by perhapses at 8:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Thank you. The BSA comments are refreshing.
posted by yesster at 8:49 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by yesster at 8:49 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Just think of the speech he would give to the Girl Scouts of America!
posted by perhapses at 8:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by perhapses at 8:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
Waiting for him to turn up at a Girl Scout Jamboree and try that shit (especially that crap about Clinton). Queue mass confusion from the secret service as Trump gets chased off the stage by a few thousand teenage girls, who also give him a few kicks in the old Samoas for his trouble.
posted by inflatablekiwi at 8:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [37 favorites]
posted by inflatablekiwi at 8:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [37 favorites]
I'm late to the thread (I was actually at a Boy Scout Troop meeting, and we have a "no electronics policy") but I have some thoughts about Trump's speech at the National Jamboree.
I've was a Scout in my youth, earned Eagle, worked as a camp staffer; I returned as an adult when my son was of scouting age. I've been a Cubmaster, Scoutmaster, Roundtable Commissioner, Unit Commissioner, and District Commissioner. I've served on various committees, helped run unit, District, and Council events. I earned my Wood Badge beads, and have staffed additional Wood Badge courses. I'm also left-leaning politically and support Scouts for Equity. The Boy Scouts can teach a lot of good skills and values, and I've felt it important I continue with the program as an example - anyone can be a Scout, regardless of political leaning, religious belief (or non-belief), race, color, creed, or other philosophy.
I did not attend the 2005 Jamboree, where Pres. George W. Bush spoke. Security was very tight, with limited entry-points to the arena. Scouts and Scouters had to wait in line for hours to get wanded and checked through security. Any water in water bottles had to be dumped out. Once in the arena, scouts weren't allowed to leave, but there was no water stations to refill bottles. It was hot, humid, and kids and adults were going down with heat stroke. People I know who attended said it was miserable, and they barely remember what W said.
I did attend the 2010 Jamboree. Pres. Obama chose to send video greetings, which was met with riticule in the press and at Jambo, but anyone who had been to 2005 Jamboree said it was a blessing - no security, no dehydration, no heat stroke.
I preach and promote the BSA policy on non-political participation; we encourage patriotism, but not politics. But, the US President is the honorary president of the Boy Scouts so it makes sense to have him (or, one day, her) attend.
The speech Trump gave was absolutely inappropriate for the event. Every effort should have been made - by the Boy Scouts, by the administration, by Rex Tillerson for god's sake - to get him to give a nice, basic "Yay, scouts - tie those knots, do your best. Have fun!" speech. His comments had no place in that arena.
I will be writing Chief Scout Executive Michael Surbaugh, and other executive leadership, expressing my dismay and disappointment, and call on leadership to recommit to "non political" promotion within the program with the hopes the BSA will distance themselves from Trump and his appearance at the Jamboree. The Boy Scouts are working to change their image, but this speech his a huge step back and is causing many to rethink their relationship with the Scouts. I hope they can, and will, do the right thing.
posted by jazon at 9:01 PM on July 24, 2017 [99 favorites]
I've was a Scout in my youth, earned Eagle, worked as a camp staffer; I returned as an adult when my son was of scouting age. I've been a Cubmaster, Scoutmaster, Roundtable Commissioner, Unit Commissioner, and District Commissioner. I've served on various committees, helped run unit, District, and Council events. I earned my Wood Badge beads, and have staffed additional Wood Badge courses. I'm also left-leaning politically and support Scouts for Equity. The Boy Scouts can teach a lot of good skills and values, and I've felt it important I continue with the program as an example - anyone can be a Scout, regardless of political leaning, religious belief (or non-belief), race, color, creed, or other philosophy.
I did not attend the 2005 Jamboree, where Pres. George W. Bush spoke. Security was very tight, with limited entry-points to the arena. Scouts and Scouters had to wait in line for hours to get wanded and checked through security. Any water in water bottles had to be dumped out. Once in the arena, scouts weren't allowed to leave, but there was no water stations to refill bottles. It was hot, humid, and kids and adults were going down with heat stroke. People I know who attended said it was miserable, and they barely remember what W said.
I did attend the 2010 Jamboree. Pres. Obama chose to send video greetings, which was met with riticule in the press and at Jambo, but anyone who had been to 2005 Jamboree said it was a blessing - no security, no dehydration, no heat stroke.
I preach and promote the BSA policy on non-political participation; we encourage patriotism, but not politics. But, the US President is the honorary president of the Boy Scouts so it makes sense to have him (or, one day, her) attend.
The speech Trump gave was absolutely inappropriate for the event. Every effort should have been made - by the Boy Scouts, by the administration, by Rex Tillerson for god's sake - to get him to give a nice, basic "Yay, scouts - tie those knots, do your best. Have fun!" speech. His comments had no place in that arena.
I will be writing Chief Scout Executive Michael Surbaugh, and other executive leadership, expressing my dismay and disappointment, and call on leadership to recommit to "non political" promotion within the program with the hopes the BSA will distance themselves from Trump and his appearance at the Jamboree. The Boy Scouts are working to change their image, but this speech his a huge step back and is causing many to rethink their relationship with the Scouts. I hope they can, and will, do the right thing.
posted by jazon at 9:01 PM on July 24, 2017 [99 favorites]
I've got a POC trans nephew in Scouting, and his Pack, leaders and parents, are super accepting, to the point where they largely don't care unless there's a situation where they need to care, and then they care kindly. He's a Webelo that wobbles and don't fall down!I'm not going to tell you what to do, but the worst bullying I've ever experienced was at a council-led event (and was largely instigated by the fact that several older/larger scouts saw me as non-conforming). I'm not going to describe what happened here, because it would likely be triggering to many in this thread.
Suffice it to say, being a larger event, the leadership of my troop was not present to help me, and I had no real escape. Once the event was done with, I talked to my own troop's leadership about it, and their reaction was a mixture of not believing me, and "It's too late to do anything now."
My experience with scouting was largely a positive one. However, these bullying experiences distanced me from my peers, and scouting provided me with my first real experiences of purportedly-responsible adults who were negligent and untrustworthy in practice.
Maybe things have gotten better, but from what I've seen lately, I sincerely doubt that they have. Individual troops can be great (mine mostly was!), but the leadership structure can really leave certain boys especially vulnerable, especially once they start interacting with other troops.
posted by schmod at 9:09 PM on July 24, 2017 [19 favorites]
I made Eagle Scout at the liberal mega church troop in Kentucky. We went to camp every year with more than one troop that wore full body camo with BSA patches instead of the standard uniform. Which do you think made it a point to go to National Jamboree every year.
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:15 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:15 PM on July 24, 2017 [7 favorites]
The Boy Scout twitter feed is also getting a lot of blowback in every tweet, including the pinned one at the top.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 9:25 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by TWinbrook8 at 9:25 PM on July 24, 2017 [6 favorites]
Sorry, Jamboree isn't every year. I do distinctly remember the camo troop kids bragging about going later that summer, I guess that would've been 2001, summer before 9/11.
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:30 PM on July 24, 2017
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:30 PM on July 24, 2017
I'm on my phone so I can't post the whole thread, but this tweetstorm about the Scout speech is really good.
@TedGenoways:
I've got a few words to offer about what Trump did at the National Jamboree today, but first let me establish some bona fides...
posted by chris24 at 9:48 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
@TedGenoways:
I've got a few words to offer about what Trump did at the National Jamboree today, but first let me establish some bona fides...
posted by chris24 at 9:48 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Welp, sure this will end well.
Breaking: Videos suggest Russian government may be arming Taliban
posted by chris24 at 9:53 PM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
Breaking: Videos suggest Russian government may be arming Taliban
posted by chris24 at 9:53 PM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
CNN has since changed the headline on their website, but their original headline for reporting on the Jamboree was "Trump holds Trump-style rally at Boy Scouts event" which really speaks for itself.
After the recent Trump NYT interview, after Trump at the Boy Scouts, basically at least 2-3 times a week, I am literally this guy from The Onion. ("'Nothing Would Surprise Me At This Point,' Says Man Who Will Be Shocked By 8 Separate News Items Today")
posted by dhens at 10:04 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
After the recent Trump NYT interview, after Trump at the Boy Scouts, basically at least 2-3 times a week, I am literally this guy from The Onion. ("'Nothing Would Surprise Me At This Point,' Says Man Who Will Be Shocked By 8 Separate News Items Today")
posted by dhens at 10:04 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
It's horrible yet almost cartoonish how everything and everyone that embraces Trump comes away with a taint on them that just lingers, like foul grease that scrubbing can't get rid of, that you still smell on you days later.
posted by Candleman at 10:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by Candleman at 10:10 PM on July 24, 2017 [10 favorites]
Yeah we're gonna have scrub down the whole country with borax after he's gone.
posted by notyou at 10:16 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by notyou at 10:16 PM on July 24, 2017 [16 favorites]
Senior GOP strategist John Weaver.
@JWGOP:
Trump is a stain on the country & the party. But a vote tomorrow to move forward on denying health coverage will stain these members forever
posted by chris24 at 10:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
@JWGOP:
Trump is a stain on the country & the party. But a vote tomorrow to move forward on denying health coverage will stain these members forever
posted by chris24 at 10:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [21 favorites]
Breaking: Videos suggest Russian government may be arming Taliban
Yep. Cold War 2. The sooner we start treating it as such, the better. Granted, the first order of business is the treasonous fuckwad the Russians got into the Oval Office, but still. We are definitely in another cold war.
Anyone trying to deny it is...well. They're just in denial.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
Yep. Cold War 2. The sooner we start treating it as such, the better. Granted, the first order of business is the treasonous fuckwad the Russians got into the Oval Office, but still. We are definitely in another cold war.
Anyone trying to deny it is...well. They're just in denial.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:17 PM on July 24, 2017 [3 favorites]
i'll give them this - the russians know a thing or two about how a foreign power arming the afghan mujahideen can complicate your military presence there
posted by murphy slaw at 10:20 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 10:20 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
> The speech Trump gave was absolutely inappropriate for the event. Every effort should have been made - by the Boy Scouts, by the administration, by Rex Tillerson for god's sake - to get him to give a nice, basic "Yay, scouts - tie those knots, do your best. Have fun!" speech. His comments had no place in that arena.
I get what you're saying, but here's the amount of effort I can imagine being put toward such a task.
[BSA LEADERSHIP] "So, we booked the President to speak at the Jamboree."
[BSA RANK AND FILE] "Uh, wait, Donald Trump is still President, right?"
[BSA LEADERSHIP] "Yes."
[BSA RANK AND FILE] "Yeah, let's cancel that. I mean, that guy is is 0 for 12 on the values in the Scout Law. He has one speech, and it's 'fake news' and 'crooked media' and 'lock her up'. How could this possibly end well?"
posted by tonycpsu at 10:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
I get what you're saying, but here's the amount of effort I can imagine being put toward such a task.
[BSA LEADERSHIP] "So, we booked the President to speak at the Jamboree."
[BSA RANK AND FILE] "Uh, wait, Donald Trump is still President, right?"
[BSA LEADERSHIP] "Yes."
[BSA RANK AND FILE] "Yeah, let's cancel that. I mean, that guy is is 0 for 12 on the values in the Scout Law. He has one speech, and it's 'fake news' and 'crooked media' and 'lock her up'. How could this possibly end well?"
posted by tonycpsu at 10:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [15 favorites]
This BSA thing, there was a film about it. Directed by a very talented German lady.
posted by runcifex at 10:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by runcifex at 10:23 PM on July 24, 2017 [17 favorites]
moar like triumph of the swill amirite
posted by murphy slaw at 10:26 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 10:26 PM on July 24, 2017 [18 favorites]
Since Tillerson is already about at the end of his rope over Trump's bullshit and currently super-pissed about the anti-Sessions remarks, I wonder if the Boy Scouts thing will tip him over the edge. This is not a trivial organization to him.
posted by FelliniBlank at 10:32 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 10:32 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
That speech, and maybe all his speeches go this way I dunno I avoid them, he had a perfectly fine staff written speech on the TelePrompTer, but he'd veer away when it seemed like he felt like he wanted some adoration or applause. Then he'd go with the usual winners (Hillary, Obama, His Victory), and that shit is tired and played and wholly inappropriate for settings like this. WTF dude. Do the job once in a while. Good on Scouting vets and families to call Trump and the BSA out on it.
posted by notyou at 10:44 PM on July 24, 2017
posted by notyou at 10:44 PM on July 24, 2017
We really ought to have some sort of pool on which member of the Trump clan will be the first to go to jail: Cheeto, Don Jr., Eric, Jared, or Ivanka.
I can't decide if it'll be Don Jr. or Jared, myself.
posted by orange swan at 10:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
I can't decide if it'll be Don Jr. or Jared, myself.
posted by orange swan at 10:45 PM on July 24, 2017 [2 favorites]
Didn't Eric steal money from his cancer charity?
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 10:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 10:52 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
We should have ever-changing rankings on who's the worst.
1. The Donald, forever.
2. Don Jr, shooting up in the rankings from his usual, which is around Eric
3. Jared, for the same shit as Don Jr. except he didn't blab about it.
4. Ivanka, for complicity
5. Eric, for stupidity but not as stupid as Don Jr.
6. Melania: used to be more complicit in the past, but in the last year barely moved into the WH, shows up at a few events, hand swats.
7. Tiffany (who thank god does nothing so far)
8. Barron (ditto, let's hope he never moves up)
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:55 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
1. The Donald, forever.
2. Don Jr, shooting up in the rankings from his usual, which is around Eric
3. Jared, for the same shit as Don Jr. except he didn't blab about it.
4. Ivanka, for complicity
5. Eric, for stupidity but not as stupid as Don Jr.
6. Melania: used to be more complicit in the past, but in the last year barely moved into the WH, shows up at a few events, hand swats.
7. Tiffany (who thank god does nothing so far)
8. Barron (ditto, let's hope he never moves up)
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:55 PM on July 24, 2017 [1 favorite]
I set up a poll on my Twitter page. So far Jared's the favourite.
posted by orange swan at 10:59 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by orange swan at 10:59 PM on July 24, 2017 [4 favorites]
Before I fall asleep from Eritrean food coma, some non-health care reading for the night.
Daily Beast Swin/Ackerman: $700 Billion and 16 Years at War is a ‘Modest Amount,’ U.S. Officers Say: "It’s already America’s longest conflict. But if we can hold on just a little—okay, a lot—longer, a new military study insists, victory will be at hand."
This ties in nicely with the BSA Jamboree, from Racked: MAGA Hats Are the Newest Form of Pre-Teen Rebellion
Brookings Institution: Does the opening predict a wave?. An astonishing number of Democratic House challengers have filed and raised at least $5,000. There's 209 such candidates (running against 105 Republican incumbents); nearly as many as every election from 2007-2015 combined.
Emily Nussbaum, New Yorker: The TV That Created Donald Trump, looking back at The Apprentice now. A taste:
The Baffler: We’re Living in The Thick of It: Anticipating the government-as-PR-crisis:
Daily Beast Swin/Ackerman: $700 Billion and 16 Years at War is a ‘Modest Amount,’ U.S. Officers Say: "It’s already America’s longest conflict. But if we can hold on just a little—okay, a lot—longer, a new military study insists, victory will be at hand."
This ties in nicely with the BSA Jamboree, from Racked: MAGA Hats Are the Newest Form of Pre-Teen Rebellion
There's only one item that's flown off the shelves of DC souvenir shop Washington Welcome Center at the same velocity as fidget spinners this year: Donald Trump's signature "Make America Great Again" caps. And like the meme-able plastic toy, the headwear has found an unlikely market with the middle-school crowd.WaPo Rucker/Parker: New communications director moves toward possible staff purge at White House
"The kids on class trips, they come in and buy them up," says manager Dexter Morse. "Those are our two most popular items.”
The result? Roving packs of red-hat-wearing teens — mostly male and almost all white — from the Lincoln Memorial to the Library of Congress.
The potential shake-up has exacerbated long-simmering tensions between Scaramucci and chief of staff Reince Priebus, according to people familiar with the dynamic, despite the outward, if forced, public displays of unity between the two men.Bob Bauer, former White House Counsel, writing at Lawfare: A "Beleaguered" Justice Department Under the Trump Presidency. There's a noteworthy section in here about Trump personally interviewing the US Attorney nominee for DC, who happens to be the one who receives referrals for criminal contempt from Congress and decides whether to prosecute.
Scaramucci has long complained to associates that some White House staffers have been more focused on managing the image of Priebus than on defending Trump and promoting his agenda. An informal list of names, including several officials who previously worked under Priebus and Spicer at the Republican National Committee, has been circulating among Scaramucci allies as those whose jobs may be in jeopardy.
Brookings Institution: Does the opening predict a wave?. An astonishing number of Democratic House challengers have filed and raised at least $5,000. There's 209 such candidates (running against 105 Republican incumbents); nearly as many as every election from 2007-2015 combined.
Emily Nussbaum, New Yorker: The TV That Created Donald Trump, looking back at The Apprentice now. A taste:
n the fifth season of “The Apprentice,” Ivanka Trump chastises a contestant for bearing grudges. Trump cuts her off: “Who doesn’t! I do. Nobody takes things more personally than me. When somebody says something personal about me, I hate them for the rest of my life. It’s probably wrong, but I hate people.” He pauses. “Do you understand that? I hate ’em. . . . I never recover from it.”Do you think he actually watched the Angles in America miniseries? Because I can't watch Pachino's Roy Cohn obsessing over telephones and lecturing Joe Pitt on the meaning of treason without thinking of Trump.
It’s a villain’s speech—and a glimpse of a darker Trump. In response, everybody laughs. Those are the boardroom rules. The same Trump shows up on the 2004 Paley panel, fuming over his loss at the Emmys, which he argues hurt the credibility of the awards. “The Amazing Race,” he says, “wasn’t a threat, it was nothing,” and then he makes fun of the winner’s speech: “Some guy with a piece of paper, who conceived of this piece of crap.” He also complains, repeatedly, that HBO’s “Angels in America” got too many prizes, a tangent that likely won him points with the ghost of Roy Cohn, if not the ghost of Ethel Rosenberg.
The Baffler: We’re Living in The Thick of It: Anticipating the government-as-PR-crisis:
It might seem odd that a show that began its life as a satire of Blairism could say much about the politics of the Trump years; after all, Tony Blair’s smooth, post-ideological technocracy, we are led to believe, could not be further from Donald Trump’s hormonal right-wing populism. But The Thick of It remains relevant because it focused in on a social pathology that haunts us now more than ever: the capture of government by public relations.posted by zachlipton at 11:01 PM on July 24, 2017 [31 favorites]
In the universe of The Thick of It, public policy has real stakes, but those stakes are largely invisible to the people who enact it. Instead, the show’s main characters obsess over their own careers and avoiding public embarrassment in the media as much as possible. A typical episode revolves around the frantic exertions of spin doctor Malcolm Tucker (Doctor Who’s Peter Capaldi) as he tries to cut off a burgeoning public relations crisis. The characters around him mostly pursue their own short-term agendas, unencumbered by convictions, morals, meaningful relationships with other human beings, or basic competence.
Though power changes hands a couple of times in The Thick of It, government always remains adrift in a perpetual PR crisis, unable to formulate (much less execute) coherent policy objectives, and staffed by an ever-shifting roster of dullards and two-bit sociopaths. Maybe that sounds a little bit familiar. Even the prime minister—whether it’s the unnamed Blair stand-in, “Tom” (the show’s version of Gordon Brown), or “J.B.” (its David Cameron equivalent)—has a certain Trumpian remove from the action. His presence is felt but never seen on camera; he is a centrifugal force around which the other characters scramble to orient themselves. Trump has taken a similarly aloof approach to governance, leaving different, warring factions within the administration to interpret his moods however it suits them.
And of course, the constant leaks and insults flying between those warring factions feel like classic Iannucci. While no Trump administration official can match Malcolm Tucker’s wit (he’s first introduced in the pilot episode calling someone “as useless as marzipan dildo”), they can certainly equal his vulgarity. (Case in point, Steve Bannon has reportedly described Paul Ryan as “a limp-dick motherfucker who was born in a petri dish at the Heritage Foundation.”)
I don't know what will come of this, but I think this is a historic, visceral moment.
Toss it on the pile.
posted by um at 12:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
Toss it on the pile.
posted by um at 12:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
A couple of headlines related to news sources, both from The New York Times:
Snopes, in Heated Legal Battle, Asks Readers for Money to Survive
New York Times Asks Fox for Apology After ‘Inaccurate Segment’ [and, surprise surprise, receives no such apology]
Snopes, in Heated Legal Battle, Asks Readers for Money to Survive
The site, which gets all of its revenue from advertising, created a crowdfunding page on Monday, seeking $500,000 from readers to remain operational indefinitely. It says that Proper Media, the vendor that runs its advertising services, has withheld the site’s revenue and has refused to relinquish control of the site...Tbh I don't feel I have a grasp of what's going on in that article but thought it may be relevant as Snopes has been cited here and in other politics discussions...
Proper Media and its lawyers tell a starkly different story. They say that Snopes employees will continue to be paid from the advertising revenue, and that [one of the site founders] Mr. Mikkelson should be removed from the company because of wasteful spending...
The two sides, which have sued each other in separate claims, present entirely conflicting descriptions of who owns the company and what is being withheld from whom. The earliest chance for resolution appears to be a court hearing scheduled for next week.
New York Times Asks Fox for Apology After ‘Inaccurate Segment’ [and, surprise surprise, receives no such apology]
The New York Times has asked that the television show “Fox & Friends” apologize for what a Times spokeswoman described as a “malicious and inaccurate segment” that aired last week accusing the paper of publishing a story in 2015 that had hindered the United States military’s attempt to kill Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, the leader of ISIS.posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 12:36 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
The Baffler: We’re Living in The Thick of It: Anticipating the government-as-PR-crisis:
I get a distinctly different qualitative feel of the situation. In TTOI, public opinion (along with Malcolm Tucker's fury at ministers who mishandle it) is a real force to be reckoned with. You get the sense that it's the only thing that affects the characters' lives and that the characters genuinely fear. Even the characters with no conscience or scruples strive to please public opinion and the media.
In contrast, one needs to look only at the unpopularity of the ongoing GOP healthcare repeal effort--or, really, any one of the bajillllion gaffes or actions made by the Trump administration and campaign--to realize that this party really doesn't give a fuck. For them, it's not public opinion but rather a racist billionaire's utopia that is the object of their all-consuming worship.
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 12:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [16 favorites]
I get a distinctly different qualitative feel of the situation. In TTOI, public opinion (along with Malcolm Tucker's fury at ministers who mishandle it) is a real force to be reckoned with. You get the sense that it's the only thing that affects the characters' lives and that the characters genuinely fear. Even the characters with no conscience or scruples strive to please public opinion and the media.
In contrast, one needs to look only at the unpopularity of the ongoing GOP healthcare repeal effort--or, really, any one of the bajillllion gaffes or actions made by the Trump administration and campaign--to realize that this party really doesn't give a fuck. For them, it's not public opinion but rather a racist billionaire's utopia that is the object of their all-consuming worship.
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 12:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [16 favorites]
I was a Boy Scout from cub scout through around my junior year in high school. I never advanced beyond Tenderfoot because I really only liked the camping and canraderie. As a result, I've always figured I was about the worst scout ever. After watching those lads boo Obama and Clinton and cheer for the end of health care, I'm pleased to discover there are several thousand scouts worse than me.
posted by Joey Michaels at 2:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
posted by Joey Michaels at 2:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
By "pleased" I mean surprisingly depressed.
posted by Joey Michaels at 2:16 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Joey Michaels at 2:16 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
That Snopes situation is nuts. One of the antagonists is a TVTropes founder!
posted by rhizome at 2:23 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by rhizome at 2:23 AM on July 25, 2017
It's slightly ironic that we can't get an accurate and realistic picture of what's happening with Snopes.
posted by Grangousier at 3:08 AM on July 25, 2017 [26 favorites]
posted by Grangousier at 3:08 AM on July 25, 2017 [26 favorites]
Mod note: As a quick note, if someone wants to do a Snopes FPP, that would be fine. We had one, but it linked to the main fundraising page (with an additional article link), which is a problem, but one that avoids that issue would be okay.
posted by taz (staff) at 3:17 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by taz (staff) at 3:17 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Jesus Christ, rabidly attacking your own Justice Department and trying to sic it on your political enemies! It's only 7:00 am, and I already need to invoke Barack Spinoza's evening benediction:
I say this everyday, and everyday I also say I won't say this again, but todayposted by FelliniBlank at 4:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]wasIS fuckin' bonkers.
Beyond the Sessions attacks, he's now added accusing the acting FBI head of corruption in conspiracy with Clinton. Yeah, Donny really can't handle the pressure. God forbid something bad not of his making happens.
posted by chris24 at 4:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by chris24 at 4:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
christ, the ny times says everything that needs to be said about the gop "healthcare" bills in one simple graph.
we should print it on a postcard and mail it to every household in america
posted by murphy slaw at 4:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
we should print it on a postcard and mail it to every household in america
posted by murphy slaw at 4:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
My brother is actually working at the Jamboree as a member of the Order of the Arrow Service Corps. He's a "but I'm more of a Libertarian" Republican and we don't speak much, but his FB feed has been unusually quiet since yesterday's post about setting up the teleprompter (ha) for 45's speech. I'd like to believe he's appalled but he's got a lot of #MAGA friends in Scouts, at least one of whom I know is at Jambo with him, and like the kids shouting "USA" last night he can be easily influenced by what everyone else is doing/saying. I'm just glad that his kids are still Cub Scouts and too young to be there -- it would make me even sadder to imagine my nephews in that crowd.
posted by camyram at 4:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by camyram at 4:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
I like the NY graph, but it might confuse people who think up is good. Up is not good.
posted by AlexiaSky at 4:35 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by AlexiaSky at 4:35 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I wish I had his confidence.
---
Boehner says GOP plans for full "repeal and replace" are a fantasy, "people have gotten accustomed to" ACA. Predicts Republicans will "never" repeal and replace Obamacare.
posted by chris24 at 4:35 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
---
Boehner says GOP plans for full "repeal and replace" are a fantasy, "people have gotten accustomed to" ACA. Predicts Republicans will "never" repeal and replace Obamacare.
posted by chris24 at 4:35 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
I like the NY graph, but it might confuse people who think up is good. Up is not good.
Are you telling me that conservatives might have a problem with the visual representation of data?
Among the many turds that dropped out of Trump's twitterhole this morning was this:
Jared Kushner did very well yesterday in proving he did not collude with the Russians. Witch Hunt. Next up, 11 year old Barron Trump!
Indeed, because questioning your adult son-in-law to whom you have specifically given several campaign and then governmental responsibilities is exactly like an unfounded persecution of a minor.
Also, as of now, the cover photo for Trump's twitter account is him giving the Jamboree Speech. He must see this as a bunch of cheering supporters (and not, you know, mostly non-voting-age people who where there primarily for other reasons and not to see him).
What a time to be alive.
posted by dhens at 4:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Are you telling me that conservatives might have a problem with the visual representation of data?
Among the many turds that dropped out of Trump's twitterhole this morning was this:
Jared Kushner did very well yesterday in proving he did not collude with the Russians. Witch Hunt. Next up, 11 year old Barron Trump!
Indeed, because questioning your adult son-in-law to whom you have specifically given several campaign and then governmental responsibilities is exactly like an unfounded persecution of a minor.
Also, as of now, the cover photo for Trump's twitter account is him giving the Jamboree Speech. He must see this as a bunch of cheering supporters (and not, you know, mostly non-voting-age people who where there primarily for other reasons and not to see him).
What a time to be alive.
posted by dhens at 4:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
@realDonaldTrump: So many stories about me in the @washingtonpost are Fake News. They are as bad as ratings challenged @CNN. Lobbyist for Amazon and taxes?
@RWPUSA:
Another threat to freedom of the press. He is nuts. If Congress does not care, we have to boot them all in 2018 or its all over.
---
Richard Painter, GWB's White House ethics lawyer.
posted by chris24 at 4:55 AM on July 25, 2017 [57 favorites]
@RWPUSA:
Another threat to freedom of the press. He is nuts. If Congress does not care, we have to boot them all in 2018 or its all over.
---
Richard Painter, GWB's White House ethics lawyer.
posted by chris24 at 4:55 AM on July 25, 2017 [57 favorites]
Indeed, because questioning your adult son-in-law to whom you have specifically given several campaign and then governmental responsibilities is exactly like an unfounded persecution of a minor.
It's part of a coordinated strategy, many people around Trump keep calling Don Jr. and Jared, both of whom are in their late 30's and run international businesses valued in the billions, "kid".
posted by cell divide at 4:56 AM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
It's part of a coordinated strategy, many people around Trump keep calling Don Jr. and Jared, both of whom are in their late 30's and run international businesses valued in the billions, "kid".
posted by cell divide at 4:56 AM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
-They don’t believe they are racist at all. They judge people by how they act, not how they look. If all blacks dressed and acted like the ones in the Olive Garden commercials, they would be totally fine with them. But the saggy pants and all the jewelry and bright colors and filthy rap music and whatnot – that isn’t normal. If they want to be accepted, why don’t they just act normal? They don’t know any black people, beyond maybe someone they say “hi” to at work.
-They know some people are gay, but it isn’t normal. It’s fine if they want to do that, but they shouldn’t flaunt it in public and make everyone uncomfortable. And they shouldn’t be putting it on tv or movies like it is normal and just as good as regular relationships, because it isn’t. They know some gays, but they aren’t invited to the bbq this weekend because there are going to be kids there.
-They think the whole trans “debate” is the silliest thing they have ever heard. What, boys are girls now, or vice versa, or whatever they want? And that’s supposed to be normal? And my daughter is going to see some weirdo’s dick waggling out in the bathroom because he feels like he is a girl? Not normal. Not fucking ok.
If I thought this represented people, I'd want them to be better or die off. As it is, that seems like the most patronising type of bullshit.
posted by jaduncan at 4:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
-They know some people are gay, but it isn’t normal. It’s fine if they want to do that, but they shouldn’t flaunt it in public and make everyone uncomfortable. And they shouldn’t be putting it on tv or movies like it is normal and just as good as regular relationships, because it isn’t. They know some gays, but they aren’t invited to the bbq this weekend because there are going to be kids there.
-They think the whole trans “debate” is the silliest thing they have ever heard. What, boys are girls now, or vice versa, or whatever they want? And that’s supposed to be normal? And my daughter is going to see some weirdo’s dick waggling out in the bathroom because he feels like he is a girl? Not normal. Not fucking ok.
If I thought this represented people, I'd want them to be better or die off. As it is, that seems like the most patronising type of bullshit.
posted by jaduncan at 4:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
The Democratic Party’s Billion-Dollar Mistake
posted by mumimor at 5:04 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by mumimor at 5:04 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Good read, mumimor. Some key graffs:
The Democratic Party is at risk of repeating the billion-dollar blunder that helped create its devastating losses of 2016. With its obsessive focus on wooing voters who supported Donald Trump, it is neglecting the cornerstone of its coalition and failing to take the steps necessary to win back the House of Representatives and state houses in 2018.
In spring 2016, when the progressive independent expenditure groups first outlined their plans for $200 million in spending, they did not allocate any money at all for mobilizing black voters (some money was slotted for radio and digital advertising aimed at blacks, but none for hiring human beings to get out the vote).
Predictably, African-American turnout plummeted. According to new census data, 59.6 percent of eligible black voters cast ballots last year, down from the 66 percent who voted in 2012. The problem cannot simply be attributed to the absence of Mr. Obama on the ticket: A slightly higher percentage of black voters, 60 percent, turned out for John Kerry in 2004, than cast ballots last year. In Wisconsin and Pennsylvania, the tens of thousands of African-Americans who voted in 2012 but didn’t vote in 2016 far exceeded the minuscule losing margins for Hillary Clinton.
Nonetheless, Democrats seem to be doubling down on their 2016 strategy. In January, the Senate Democratic Caucus trooped to West Virginia for its annual retreat. According to published reports, the senators heard from panels of voters who had once voted for Mr. Obama but then chose Donald Trump.
Without knowing much about the specific plans for 2018, it definitely feels like most of what I hear from Democratic pols is a desire to woo Trump voters back. That may or may not be a good strategy but I'd like to hear more about plans to get other voters energized as well.
posted by cell divide at 5:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
The Democratic Party is at risk of repeating the billion-dollar blunder that helped create its devastating losses of 2016. With its obsessive focus on wooing voters who supported Donald Trump, it is neglecting the cornerstone of its coalition and failing to take the steps necessary to win back the House of Representatives and state houses in 2018.
In spring 2016, when the progressive independent expenditure groups first outlined their plans for $200 million in spending, they did not allocate any money at all for mobilizing black voters (some money was slotted for radio and digital advertising aimed at blacks, but none for hiring human beings to get out the vote).
Predictably, African-American turnout plummeted. According to new census data, 59.6 percent of eligible black voters cast ballots last year, down from the 66 percent who voted in 2012. The problem cannot simply be attributed to the absence of Mr. Obama on the ticket: A slightly higher percentage of black voters, 60 percent, turned out for John Kerry in 2004, than cast ballots last year. In Wisconsin and Pennsylvania, the tens of thousands of African-Americans who voted in 2012 but didn’t vote in 2016 far exceeded the minuscule losing margins for Hillary Clinton.
Nonetheless, Democrats seem to be doubling down on their 2016 strategy. In January, the Senate Democratic Caucus trooped to West Virginia for its annual retreat. According to published reports, the senators heard from panels of voters who had once voted for Mr. Obama but then chose Donald Trump.
Without knowing much about the specific plans for 2018, it definitely feels like most of what I hear from Democratic pols is a desire to woo Trump voters back. That may or may not be a good strategy but I'd like to hear more about plans to get other voters energized as well.
posted by cell divide at 5:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
@realDonaldTrump: So many stories about me in the @washingtonpost are Fake News.
OK, name one. If there are "so many", that should be easy.
posted by thelonius at 5:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
OK, name one. If there are "so many", that should be easy.
posted by thelonius at 5:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
It's Mafia kid. The implication is that he was born into the crimes acknowledges the criminal enterprise that led to what's going on now.
So yes, it is annoying and minimizing but at the same time it is one step closer to guilt.
posted by AlexiaSky at 5:34 AM on July 25, 2017
So yes, it is annoying and minimizing but at the same time it is one step closer to guilt.
posted by AlexiaSky at 5:34 AM on July 25, 2017
Krugman: Health Care Is Still in Danger
In short, the Senate bill is every bit as cruel and grotesque as its critics say. But we need to keep reminding wavering senators and their constituents of that fact, lest they be snowed by a blizzard of lies.posted by mumimor at 5:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
I’m not saying that everyone should ignore Trump-Putin-treason and all its ramifications: Clearly, the fate of our democracy is on the line. But we mustn’t let this mother of all scandals take up all our mental bandwidth: Health care for millions is also on the line.
And while ordinary citizens can’t yet do much about the looming constitutional crisis, their calls, letters, and protests can still make all the difference on health care. Don’t let the bad guys in the Senate do terrible things because you weren’t paying attention!
Every day I wake up and think, are the Republicans still trying to kill me?
And every day the answer is "fuck yeah."
The one thing I can say about the GOP is that they seem to really believe in killing people.
posted by schadenfrau at 5:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
And every day the answer is "fuck yeah."
The one thing I can say about the GOP is that they seem to really believe in killing people.
posted by schadenfrau at 5:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
"That may or may not be a good strategy but I'd like to hear more about plans to get other voters energized as well."
It's just one part of those "other voters," but I think they're doing their best to not interfere with the Indivisible and generalized "resistance." I don't know if that's a good plan or not, but I think there's a real sense of not wanting to do anything to upset that movement with any tinkering or middle management.
posted by Tevin at 5:49 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
It's just one part of those "other voters," but I think they're doing their best to not interfere with the Indivisible and generalized "resistance." I don't know if that's a good plan or not, but I think there's a real sense of not wanting to do anything to upset that movement with any tinkering or middle management.
posted by Tevin at 5:49 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Bush's WH ethics lawyer Richard Painter has long been anti-Trump, but after the latest twitter rant, he seems to have run out of evens and is talking impeachment.
@RWPUSA
Pressuring AG to prosecute the person who lost the election is an impeachable offense if we value free elections.
posted by chris24 at 5:55 AM on July 25, 2017 [89 favorites]
@RWPUSA
Pressuring AG to prosecute the person who lost the election is an impeachable offense if we value free elections.
posted by chris24 at 5:55 AM on July 25, 2017 [89 favorites]
If I thought this represented people, I'd want them to be better or die off.
What, seriously? I could drive five miles outside of my smallish Midwestern city right now and find people *exactly* like this all day long. I grew up around them, I've been in the rooms where those sentiments are the spoken, acknowledged norm. And those would be considered measured, tempered-with-the-worldly-education-cable-television-offers, teetering-on-liberal sentiments.
Sure, there are exceptions, and no, these people don't deserve much of my concern or compassion, but this is the default position of so, so many people in the suburbs, in small towns, and in rural areas. It's why they choose to live there in the first place in many cases.
And for the record: yes, absolutely I want those people to be better or die off. They're the fucking problem.
posted by Rykey at 5:56 AM on July 25, 2017 [37 favorites]
What, seriously? I could drive five miles outside of my smallish Midwestern city right now and find people *exactly* like this all day long. I grew up around them, I've been in the rooms where those sentiments are the spoken, acknowledged norm. And those would be considered measured, tempered-with-the-worldly-education-cable-television-offers, teetering-on-liberal sentiments.
Sure, there are exceptions, and no, these people don't deserve much of my concern or compassion, but this is the default position of so, so many people in the suburbs, in small towns, and in rural areas. It's why they choose to live there in the first place in many cases.
And for the record: yes, absolutely I want those people to be better or die off. They're the fucking problem.
posted by Rykey at 5:56 AM on July 25, 2017 [37 favorites]
Now he's made me feel icky about sending my kid to Boy Scout camp next week.
This fuckin' guy.
posted by whuppy at 6:06 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
This fuckin' guy.
posted by whuppy at 6:06 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
It seems to me Sessions must know a great deal of the dirt on the Trump campaign and he doesn't seem like the sort who'd quietly accept a humiliating dismissal without taking some revenge
Good point spitball, firing Sessions is going to be a major deal regardless, but Sessions is an evil crooked person who can do a lot of harm. I'd better get out and get me some popcorn right away!
posted by mumimor at 6:09 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Good point spitball, firing Sessions is going to be a major deal regardless, but Sessions is an evil crooked person who can do a lot of harm. I'd better get out and get me some popcorn right away!
posted by mumimor at 6:09 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
From my friends Slack last night:
[friend] this fucking scouting thing.
[etrigan] Ugh, tell me about it. But honestly, the Mormons killed the BSA; Trump's just fucking the corpse.
[other friend] That's a helluva "just."
posted by Etrigan at 6:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [32 favorites]
[friend] this fucking scouting thing.
[etrigan] Ugh, tell me about it. But honestly, the Mormons killed the BSA; Trump's just fucking the corpse.
[other friend] That's a helluva "just."
posted by Etrigan at 6:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [32 favorites]
Scaramucci: Trump ‘Probably’ Wants Sessions Gone Given The ‘Tension’ (Caitlin MacNeal, TPM)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 6:18 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 6:18 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Perhaps Trump is playing with fire?
Or perhaps Trump's railing against Sessions is all kabuki. Authoritarian regime–watcher and independent journalist Sarah Kendzior has cautioned us against reading too much into public shows of palace intrigue (this current one is being peddled by Roger Stone). Only once someone resigns or is fired are the stakes real.
The subtext of what Trump is doing right now is far more troubling— attacking the DoJ for being an impartial institution instead of the executive branch's legal attack dogs.
posted by Doktor Zed at 6:21 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
Or perhaps Trump's railing against Sessions is all kabuki. Authoritarian regime–watcher and independent journalist Sarah Kendzior has cautioned us against reading too much into public shows of palace intrigue (this current one is being peddled by Roger Stone). Only once someone resigns or is fired are the stakes real.
The subtext of what Trump is doing right now is far more troubling— attacking the DoJ for being an impartial institution instead of the executive branch's legal attack dogs.
posted by Doktor Zed at 6:21 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
BSA's still hell and gone from perfect, but they've made strides. Accepting gender identity regardless of birth assignment was a big break from the Mormons, and a welcome one.
In principle, I appreciate them wanting to maintain an apolitical stance, but scouts being encouraged to boo a former president (and scout himself, though not BSA) goes well beyond partisanship. As do orgy boat stories. If a scout leader got up there and gave that speech, you bet your ass he'd be loudly condemned by the organization and possibly stripped of rank.
posted by middleclasstool at 6:23 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
In principle, I appreciate them wanting to maintain an apolitical stance, but scouts being encouraged to boo a former president (and scout himself, though not BSA) goes well beyond partisanship. As do orgy boat stories. If a scout leader got up there and gave that speech, you bet your ass he'd be loudly condemned by the organization and possibly stripped of rank.
posted by middleclasstool at 6:23 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
It seems to me Sessions must know a great deal of the dirt on the Trump campaign and he doesn't seem like the sort who'd quietly accept a humiliating dismissal without taking some revenge
Now that he's hook-line-and-sinker perjured himself, making a deal in exchange for avoiding prosecution might be his only way out if he's fired? At any rate, I think that is the best explanation for why he hasn't resigned yet despite his boss publicly humiliating him.
Or perhaps Trump's railing against Sessions is all kabuki
I guess? Maybe Sessions really is ready, fork in hand, to eat the plate of shit for some vague bonus earned for the distraction?
posted by dis_integration at 6:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Now that he's hook-line-and-sinker perjured himself, making a deal in exchange for avoiding prosecution might be his only way out if he's fired? At any rate, I think that is the best explanation for why he hasn't resigned yet despite his boss publicly humiliating him.
Or perhaps Trump's railing against Sessions is all kabuki
I guess? Maybe Sessions really is ready, fork in hand, to eat the plate of shit for some vague bonus earned for the distraction?
posted by dis_integration at 6:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Maggie Harberman tweeted earlier that her sources in the WH say that the reason Trump is tormenting Sessions rather than just firing him is "because he can."
*turns on sociopath-o-meter* Yep, checks out.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [42 favorites]
*turns on sociopath-o-meter* Yep, checks out.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [42 favorites]
How Obamacare saved Detroit
The city’s uninsured rate has fallen from 22 percent to 7.4 over the past three years. (Sarah Kliff, Vox)
President Trump owns this Republican health care bill (Jeff Stein, Vox)
Senate Republicans don't know what's in their health bill or what it would do. They're voting anyway. (Dylan Scott, Vox)
Jam their phones/faxes today. It's on.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 6:26 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
The city’s uninsured rate has fallen from 22 percent to 7.4 over the past three years. (Sarah Kliff, Vox)
President Trump owns this Republican health care bill (Jeff Stein, Vox)
Senate Republicans don't know what's in their health bill or what it would do. They're voting anyway. (Dylan Scott, Vox)
Jam their phones/faxes today. It's on.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 6:26 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
Or perhaps Trump's railing against Sessions is all kabuki.
"It's a distraction" or "It's a head-fake" has historically been just as accurate as "He's going to pivot." There has not been any evidence in the last two years that Trump is anything but a toxic boss who mistreats people when he sees them as getting out of line (or getting too big for their britches).
posted by Etrigan at 6:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
"It's a distraction" or "It's a head-fake" has historically been just as accurate as "He's going to pivot." There has not been any evidence in the last two years that Trump is anything but a toxic boss who mistreats people when he sees them as getting out of line (or getting too big for their britches).
posted by Etrigan at 6:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
Wow.
Psychiatry group tells members they can defy ‘Goldwater rule’ and comment on Trump’s mental health
Psychiatry group tells members they can defy ‘Goldwater rule’ and comment on Trump’s mental health
A leading psychiatry group has told its members they should not feel bound by a longstanding rule against commenting publicly on the mental state of public figures — even the president.posted by chris24 at 6:29 AM on July 25, 2017 [58 favorites]
The statement, an email this month from the executive committee of the American Psychoanalytic Association to its 3,500 members, represents the first significant crack in the profession’s decades-old united front aimed at preventing experts from discussing the psychiatric aspects of politicians’ behavior. It will likely make many of its members feel more comfortable speaking openly about President Trump’s mental health.
The impetus for the email was “belief in the value of psychoanalytic knowledge in explaining human behavior,” said psychoanalytic association past president Dr. Prudence Gourguechon, a psychiatrist in Chicago. “We don’t want to prohibit our members from using their knowledge responsibly.” That responsibility is especially great today, she told STAT, “since Trump’s behavior is so different from anything we’ve seen before” in a commander in chief.
An increasing number of psychologists and psychiatrists have denounced the restriction as a “gag rule” and flouted it, with some arguing they have a “duty to warn” the public about what they see as Trump’s narcissism, impulsivity, poor attention span, paranoia, and other traits that, they believe, impair his ability to lead.
Reporters, pundits, and government officials “have been stumbling around trying to explain Trump’s unusual behavior,” from his seemingly compulsive tweeting to his grandiosity, said Dr. Leonard Glass, a psychiatrist at Harvard Medical School. The rule against psychiatrists offering their analysis of the emotions, thought patterns, and beliefs underlying such behaviors, Glass said, robs the public “of our professional judgment and prevents us from communicating our understanding” of the president’s mental state.
Maggie Harberman tweeted earlier that her sources in the WH say that the reason Trump is tormenting Sessions rather than just firing him is "because he can."
"Several researchers have suggested expanding the dark triad to contain a fourth dark trait. Everyday sadism, defined as the enjoyment of cruelty, is the most common addition. While sadism is highly correlated with the dark triad, researchers have shown that sadism predicts anti-social behavior beyond the dark triad."
posted by Rust Moranis at 6:29 AM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
"Several researchers have suggested expanding the dark triad to contain a fourth dark trait. Everyday sadism, defined as the enjoyment of cruelty, is the most common addition. While sadism is highly correlated with the dark triad, researchers have shown that sadism predicts anti-social behavior beyond the dark triad."
posted by Rust Moranis at 6:29 AM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
"It's a distraction" or "It's a head-fake" has historically been just as accurate as "He's going to pivot."
It's 11 dimensional stop-hitting-yourself
posted by thelonius at 6:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
It's 11 dimensional stop-hitting-yourself
posted by thelonius at 6:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
I called my senators' DC offices (since the vote is today) and said:
- Please vote no on motion to proceed on the American Health Care Act because the Congressional Budget Office found that it would cause millions of people to lose coverage.
- Please vote no on any bill that has been scored by the Congressional Budget Office and found to cause millions of people to lose coverage.
- Please vote no on any bill that has not been scored by the Congressional Budget Office in its entirely.
- To do otherwise would be incredibly irresponsible and dangerous, and I would hold the Senator personally responsible for any deaths of American people who lose access to affordable care.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
- Please vote no on motion to proceed on the American Health Care Act because the Congressional Budget Office found that it would cause millions of people to lose coverage.
- Please vote no on any bill that has been scored by the Congressional Budget Office and found to cause millions of people to lose coverage.
- Please vote no on any bill that has not been scored by the Congressional Budget Office in its entirely.
- To do otherwise would be incredibly irresponsible and dangerous, and I would hold the Senator personally responsible for any deaths of American people who lose access to affordable care.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
The Boy Scouts issued a statement. Pretty fucking weak sauce in my opinion.
The Boy Scouts of America is wholly non-partisan and does not promote any one position, product, service, political candidate or philosophy. The invitation for the sitting U.S. President to visit the National Jamboree is a long-standing tradition and is in no way an endorsement of any political party or specific policies.posted by chris24 at 6:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
The sitting U.S. President serves as the BSA's honorary president. It is our long-standing custom to invite the U.S. President to the National Jamboree.
The Sessions chatter and the BSA rally really proved to be effective distractions from the totally bonkers Healthcare vote taking place today. MSNBC/CNN seemed to focus only on Sessions last night, making it seem like 24-hr news can't handle news that isn't in a single package.
posted by armacy at 6:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by armacy at 6:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
"It's a distraction" or "It's a head-fake" has historically been just as accurate as "He's going to pivot."
It may or may not be a head fake. But I think (in agreement with Kendzior, I think) that we shouldn't care. Let's imagine I had true knowledge of whether Sessions would be fired or quit, and when. What would I do with this knowledge? Nothing. It's not actionable. Given that it's not going to matter, how much effort should I expend reading various tea leaves to try to figure out this information? Only as much effort as I would otherwise expend to be entertained.
Now, when Sessions does leave, the method of his departure might be cause for protest. But until that time, the palace intrigue is entertainment. It's "Britney leaves Justin!" (or whoever) for the politically interested set.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 6:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
It may or may not be a head fake. But I think (in agreement with Kendzior, I think) that we shouldn't care. Let's imagine I had true knowledge of whether Sessions would be fired or quit, and when. What would I do with this knowledge? Nothing. It's not actionable. Given that it's not going to matter, how much effort should I expend reading various tea leaves to try to figure out this information? Only as much effort as I would otherwise expend to be entertained.
Now, when Sessions does leave, the method of his departure might be cause for protest. But until that time, the palace intrigue is entertainment. It's "Britney leaves Justin!" (or whoever) for the politically interested set.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 6:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
At any rate, I think that is the best explanation for why he hasn't resigned yet despite his boss publicly humiliating him.
As one of the MSNBC pundits said earlier, "He's waited his whole life to harm all these people, he's not just going to give that up now."
posted by Room 641-A at 6:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
As one of the MSNBC pundits said earlier, "He's waited his whole life to harm all these people, he's not just going to give that up now."
posted by Room 641-A at 6:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
The BSA is staying out of politics by allowing a corrupt politician to co-opt their movement. That earns the Demagogue Enabler badge for sure.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [55 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [55 favorites]
Yeah, that BSA statement does not give me confidence that they are up to the task of shaping the values and moral reasoning of young people.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:39 AM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:39 AM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
@ddiamond
EIGHT YEARS AGO TODAY — Obama does 2-hour health care town hall in Ohio, takes questions and defends his plan.
VIDEO
tweet is from 23rd, not today.
posted by chris24 at 6:41 AM on July 25, 2017 [24 favorites]
EIGHT YEARS AGO TODAY — Obama does 2-hour health care town hall in Ohio, takes questions and defends his plan.
VIDEO
tweet is from 23rd, not today.
posted by chris24 at 6:41 AM on July 25, 2017 [24 favorites]
A leading psychiatry group has told its members
Well . . a leading psychoanalytic group.
posted by rc3spencer at 6:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Well . . a leading psychoanalytic group.
posted by rc3spencer at 6:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
The Boy Scouts of America is wholly non-partisan and does not promote any one position, product, service, political candidate or philosophy. The invitation for the sitting U.S. President to visit the National Jamboree is a long-standing tradition and is in no way an endorsement , any political party or specific policies.
"Which is why it is difficult for us to point out that the president's speech did not, for reasons wholly independent of partisan politics and ideology, exemplify the ethics and principles of good scouting. Nor was it appropriate for children to hear. Nevertheless, we feel obligated to underscore this issue so that our scouts will not confuse some of what they heard at the Jamboree as being emblematic of our organization's principles.
"Our Scout Law says that a scout is, among other things, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, cheerful, and reverent. We believe that being called upon to boo a former president of the United States contradicts all of the above principles. As does alluding to sexually explicit stories in front of young children, particularly when those stories are framed as life goals our scouts should pursue above the higher callings of good leadership, citizenship, and service to others.
"The BSA has the utmost respect for the office of the president, but we cannot in good conscience condone some of what our scouts heard at this year's jamboree. We would like to formally apologize to our scouts, scout leaders, and parents that make this organization a wonderful place where boys learn how to become good men."
They could have gone on to say.
posted by middleclasstool at 6:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [71 favorites]
"Which is why it is difficult for us to point out that the president's speech did not, for reasons wholly independent of partisan politics and ideology, exemplify the ethics and principles of good scouting. Nor was it appropriate for children to hear. Nevertheless, we feel obligated to underscore this issue so that our scouts will not confuse some of what they heard at the Jamboree as being emblematic of our organization's principles.
"Our Scout Law says that a scout is, among other things, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, cheerful, and reverent. We believe that being called upon to boo a former president of the United States contradicts all of the above principles. As does alluding to sexually explicit stories in front of young children, particularly when those stories are framed as life goals our scouts should pursue above the higher callings of good leadership, citizenship, and service to others.
"The BSA has the utmost respect for the office of the president, but we cannot in good conscience condone some of what our scouts heard at this year's jamboree. We would like to formally apologize to our scouts, scout leaders, and parents that make this organization a wonderful place where boys learn how to become good men."
They could have gone on to say.
posted by middleclasstool at 6:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [71 favorites]
The Boy Scouts of America is wholly non-partisan and does not promote any one position, product, service, political candidate or philosophy. The invitation for the sitting U.S. President to visit the National Jamboree is a long-standing tradition and is in no way an endorsement of any political party or specific policies.
The sitting U.S. President serves as the BSA's honorary president. It is our long-standing custom to invite the U.S. President to the National Jamboree.
...And if you don't condemn the fact that DJT pissed all over that position yesterday, you ARE being partisan and promoting a position, political candidate, and philosophy. Enablers, cowards, weaklings, etc.
posted by Rykey at 6:46 AM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
The sitting U.S. President serves as the BSA's honorary president. It is our long-standing custom to invite the U.S. President to the National Jamboree.
...And if you don't condemn the fact that DJT pissed all over that position yesterday, you ARE being partisan and promoting a position, political candidate, and philosophy. Enablers, cowards, weaklings, etc.
posted by Rykey at 6:46 AM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
The Daily Showput together a video showing Scaramucci mimicking Trumo's body language. (Link to tweet w/video)
God, he's so gross.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
God, he's so gross.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
At any rate, I think that is the best explanation for why he hasn't resigned yet despite his boss publicly humiliating him.
As one of the MSNBC pundits said earlier, "He's waited his whole life to harm all these people, he's not just going to give that up now."
Really. Why should Sessions care if Trump talks shit about him? Trump can try to provoke him into leaving (or just enjoy abusing him), and Sessions can do his smirky pixie grin and act oblivious and do his thing. Like the GOP Congress, these people have no shame, compunction,scruples, dignity, self-respect, respect for others, or sense of decorum. Doesn't make it any less shocking?
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:48 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
As one of the MSNBC pundits said earlier, "He's waited his whole life to harm all these people, he's not just going to give that up now."
Really. Why should Sessions care if Trump talks shit about him? Trump can try to provoke him into leaving (or just enjoy abusing him), and Sessions can do his smirky pixie grin and act oblivious and do his thing. Like the GOP Congress, these people have no shame, compunction,scruples, dignity, self-respect, respect for others, or sense of decorum. Doesn't make it any less shocking?
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:48 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
"By the way, just a question," Mr. Trump asked. "Did President Obama ever come to a Jamboree?"
By the way, just an answer. Obama never visited a Jamboree in person but he did speak to them in 2010.
posted by scalefree at 6:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
By the way, just an answer. Obama never visited a Jamboree in person but he did speak to them in 2010.
posted by scalefree at 6:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Trump reminds me of Yertle The Turtle, except that all of the turtles below him are the people who have chosen to enable his behaviour.
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Yeah, but Putin is our friend.
@JuliaDavisNews
#Russia's state TV: State Duma Committee Chairman, Vyacheslav Nikonov:
"Yes, Russia is harming U.S. interests and we'll continue to do so." [VIDEO]
---
Interesting side note, Nikonov is Molotov's grandson.
posted by chris24 at 6:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
@JuliaDavisNews
#Russia's state TV: State Duma Committee Chairman, Vyacheslav Nikonov:
"Yes, Russia is harming U.S. interests and we'll continue to do so." [VIDEO]
---
Interesting side note, Nikonov is Molotov's grandson.
posted by chris24 at 6:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
@RWPUSA
Pressuring AG to prosecute the person who lost the election is an impeachable offense if we value free elections.
It should be obvious by now that the Republican Party doesn't.
posted by Gelatin at 6:55 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Pressuring AG to prosecute the person who lost the election is an impeachable offense if we value free elections.
It should be obvious by now that the Republican Party doesn't.
posted by Gelatin at 6:55 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Trump reminds me of Yertle The Turtle, except that all of the turtles below him are the people who have chosen to enable his behaviour.
Therefore explaining Mitch McConnell.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:02 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Therefore explaining Mitch McConnell.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:02 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
National Treasure Alexandra Petri, WaPo: Jared Kushner: Boy wizard or total ignoramus?
Does Jared Kushner know anything about anything?posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:03 AM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
A) Yes. Of course.
He is a wunderkind. (You get to be a wunderkind well into your 30s when you look like him.)
He has a hand in All Things That Are Good. From opiates to peace in the Middle East to running government like a business, no subject, no matter its complexity, eludes him. He touches and transcends it all. Anything good that happens, happens by his command.
His mind is like a steel trap, but much better because a steel trap is an oldfangled technology of a bygone age. Kushner’s mind is something better, like a driverless car. Not in the sense that he lacks direction and does not know where he is going at such a high rate of speed, just in the sense that he is probably worth millions and many people overseas have great hopes for his future.
[…]
B) No, of course not.
He is but a tiny, beardless youth! Look how young he is! Barely out of short pants! What can he know of life in this world? What can he know of business?
He takes all meetings. Of course he does. He doesn’t know better. He can’t help it. He doesn’t know how the government works, or how communications work or what forms espionage might take. He is but a simple soul, young and trusting and open to the world. Life has not scarred him yet. He is a mere butterfly, crushed on the wheel. Ah, the poor young butterfly! Ah, the cruel wheel!
He is still learning. And he doesn’t know what he doesn’t know! But who does?
CNN says Grassley and the Senate Judiciary Committee have subpoenaed Manafort to give public testimony tomorrow. I can't imagine why Manafort wouldn't plead the Fifth Amendment.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:05 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:05 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
Even Brit Hume, who is awful in most ways, seems to be even losing it with Trump over Sessions. And yes, he's losing it because he wants to keep Sessions in doing awful things, but the split in the party over this is going to be interesting. He's posted several things attacking Trump about it, including this which suggests impeachment:
@brithume
How to Deal With a Kamikaze President
@brithume
How to Deal With a Kamikaze President
Donald Trump’s angry morning tweet storm reached another new low with attacks on his Attorney General for not investigating his former presidential opponent, and on his acting FBI Director’s integrity. This and other attacks on key law enforcement figures in his own Executive branch goes far beyond breaking norms of investigatory independence. They bring us clearly into the territory, where we may have been for a while, of a president bent on destroying the authority of the Justice Department that he worries, perhaps for reasons only he knows, may destroy him. At no time in modern history (and perhaps ever) has a President been so openly at odds, and bent on discrediting, his senior law enforcement and intelligence officials.posted by chris24 at 7:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
I know how disheartening it is for senior leadership and beyond in the Justice Department and FBI to wake up every morning to read the latest vicious attacks on their integrity by the man they ostensibly serve. There is a natural tendency to think: What can we do to fight back, to tell the President he is wrong, to stop him from attacking us? The problem is that there is nothing anyone can to do stop the President short of impeachment. Attorney General Sessions could and should speak out sharply against the President and in defense of the integrity of his Department. That would hasten Sessions’ departure and not stop the shameless President. And resignations in protest of Sessions' departure would only make matters worse, especially since there are so very few political appointees in DOJ at the moment.
I think, as I suggested the other day, that the only thing for the men and women of the Justice Department to do is to keep doing their jobs well until they get fired. That is the way to serve the American people in upholding the rule of law in the face of a president bent on trying to destroy it. It is a remarkable fact that despite Trump’s relentless attacks on DOJ independence, DOJ continues to function with extraordinary independence, which every single Trump DOJ nominee has underscored before the Senate and—with the possible exception of Rosenstein’s shenanigans with the Comey firing—in practice. The President can fire Sessions and Rosenstein and McCabe if he likes, but he cannot fire everyone, and he cannot stop an investigation that now has a relentless logic that is only reinforced every time he attacks DOJ independence. In this regard, Trump’s unhinged tweets display weakness, not strength.
The crazier Trump gets with law enforcement, the more the pressure will rise on Congress to do something more about it. Congress has shown more backbone on the Russia matter than it gets credit for (witness the upcoming sanctions that limits Trump’s room for maneuver, and the robust Senate Intelligence Committee investigation). I continue to think that if Trump acts (as opposed to talks) to try to halt a robust Russia investigation, Congress will respond in kind. As I have said before, I know that sounds naïve to some, and I hope but am not sure I am right.
Inside the Purge
I mentioned yesterday that Anthony Scaramucci’s brief – as evidenced by his actions in a few days on the job – looked a lot more like chief advisor or even chief of staff than communications director, which is, paradoxically, a not terribly visible role. Sure enough, according to an overnight story in the Post, Scaramucci has a brief to purge ‘disloyal’ staffers and bring in more people from Fox News.
...
It seems likely that that even if Scaramucci remains Communications Director and doesn’t become chief of staff himself – which I would not rule out – that the White House will now be run from the communications office, with a new chief of staff effectively, if not formally, reporting to Scaramucci.
AG Sean Hannity is a real possibility.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I mentioned yesterday that Anthony Scaramucci’s brief – as evidenced by his actions in a few days on the job – looked a lot more like chief advisor or even chief of staff than communications director, which is, paradoxically, a not terribly visible role. Sure enough, according to an overnight story in the Post, Scaramucci has a brief to purge ‘disloyal’ staffers and bring in more people from Fox News.
...
It seems likely that that even if Scaramucci remains Communications Director and doesn’t become chief of staff himself – which I would not rule out – that the White House will now be run from the communications office, with a new chief of staff effectively, if not formally, reporting to Scaramucci.
AG Sean Hannity is a real possibility.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
The near total lack of health care news suggests, to me, that the motion to proceed today has a good chance of passing. :(
posted by Coventry at 7:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Coventry at 7:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
If Manafort feels sure that he is going to be convicted of a federal crime, perhaps he would decline the Fifth Amendment and act as a fall guy in exchange for a presidential pardon. I suppose.
But why would anyone believe Trump if he promised them a pardon?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:12 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
But why would anyone believe Trump if he promised them a pardon?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:12 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Ah, there are very few things as soothing to me as calling Pat Toomey's DC office and having it be too overloaded for me to even leave a voicemail.
Granted, we're not going to do much to change that disgusting coward's mind, but I'll take what I can get. I also called Bob Casey's DC office and let him know how much I appreciated his speech last night, as recapped by Excommunicated Cardinal.
posted by joyceanmachine at 7:12 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Granted, we're not going to do much to change that disgusting coward's mind, but I'll take what I can get. I also called Bob Casey's DC office and let him know how much I appreciated his speech last night, as recapped by Excommunicated Cardinal.
posted by joyceanmachine at 7:12 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
And FYI, once again Trump's rants this morning were him live-tweeting Fox & Friends.
posted by chris24 at 7:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by chris24 at 7:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
@igorvolsky
Everyone w/ a phone must call key senators this AM. Hearing McConnell isn't sure he has votes for MTP this AM. Let's make sure he doesn't 1/
Politics Twitter (or at least my follows) this AM is wall-to-wall healthcare. My state Dems, local Dems, journalists, everyone.
I've faxed this morning (Toomey is a hard YES on anything that is terrible and morally bankrupt and was one of the Secret Cabal of Thirteen, and Casey is a hard NO on this whole morass, so really no one here is swinging either way, but they've both been steady hearing from me via mail and fax throughout this whole thing.)
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
@LindsayGrahamSC: President Trump’s tweet today suggesting Attorney General Sessions pursue prosecution of a former political rival is highly inappropriate.
Prosecutorial decisions should be based on applying facts to the law without hint of political motivation.
To do otherwise is to run away from the long-standing American tradition of separating the law from politics regardless of party.
Congressional Republicans are beginning to say the right words. It won't lead to the right actions. But it might lead to a refusal to proactively commit obstruction of justice by condemning Mueller or by confirming someone who will fire Mueller.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:18 AM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
Prosecutorial decisions should be based on applying facts to the law without hint of political motivation.
To do otherwise is to run away from the long-standing American tradition of separating the law from politics regardless of party.
Congressional Republicans are beginning to say the right words. It won't lead to the right actions. But it might lead to a refusal to proactively commit obstruction of justice by condemning Mueller or by confirming someone who will fire Mueller.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:18 AM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
to run away from the long-standing American tradition of separating the law from politics regardless of party
Trust them to apply American exceptionalism to, you know, the basic principles of justice.
posted by lydhre at 7:20 AM on July 25, 2017
Trust them to apply American exceptionalism to, you know, the basic principles of justice.
posted by lydhre at 7:20 AM on July 25, 2017
The sitting U.S. President serves as the BSA's honorary president. It is our long-standing custom to invite the U.S. President to the National Jamboree.
It's also long-standing custom for the sitting president not to turn that address into a campaign rally, and long since obvious that Trump cares nothing for long standing traditions or norms of any kind, so yeah, the BSA owns last night's debacle and needs to make a stronger statement than this piffle.
posted by Gelatin at 7:21 AM on July 25, 2017 [32 favorites]
It's also long-standing custom for the sitting president not to turn that address into a campaign rally, and long since obvious that Trump cares nothing for long standing traditions or norms of any kind, so yeah, the BSA owns last night's debacle and needs to make a stronger statement than this piffle.
posted by Gelatin at 7:21 AM on July 25, 2017 [32 favorites]
The Daily Showput together a video showing Scaramucci mimicking Trumo's body language. (Link to tweet w/video)
It's the mirroring and matching tactic used by car salesmen and pick up artists. It shows he doesn't see himself accountable to the press or the American people, but that he's putting on a performance to please Trump.
posted by peeedro at 7:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
It's the mirroring and matching tactic used by car salesmen and pick up artists. It shows he doesn't see himself accountable to the press or the American people, but that he's putting on a performance to please Trump.
posted by peeedro at 7:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
God I hope we defeat the MTP today. Because as Trump gets even more unhinged, even reluctant Rs are beginning to speak. In the last 24 hours Brit fucking Hume tweets an article suggesting impeachment and Paul Ryan defends Mueller. If they lose today, Trump will get even crazier, attack Congress, they'll be even more fed up with him and realize he's hurting their agenda and re-election prospects. And I think/hope/pray some will decide it's time to get off the train.
posted by chris24 at 7:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by chris24 at 7:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Congressional Republicans are beginning to say the right words.
That's Lindsey Graham. He took lessons in McCaining from McCain himself, and now he's surpassed even his master in levels of McCaining.
Lindsey Graham saying something means less than nothing. He's certainly not speaking for "Congressional Republicans", much less for Mitch McConnell, and he's even less likely to back up his words with actual actions than McCain, who will never vote against the party line either.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
That's Lindsey Graham. He took lessons in McCaining from McCain himself, and now he's surpassed even his master in levels of McCaining.
Lindsey Graham saying something means less than nothing. He's certainly not speaking for "Congressional Republicans", much less for Mitch McConnell, and he's even less likely to back up his words with actual actions than McCain, who will never vote against the party line either.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Thanks for the link, soren_lorenson. I called those six Senators and left a message with all of them. In case anyone else wants to, here are the numbers.
Heller: 202-224-6244
Capito: 224-6472
Portman: 224-3353
Murkowski: 224-6665
Lee: 224-5444
Paul: 224-4343
posted by Coventry at 7:29 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Heller: 202-224-6244
Capito: 224-6472
Portman: 224-3353
Murkowski: 224-6665
Lee: 224-5444
Paul: 224-4343
posted by Coventry at 7:29 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
I know how disheartening it is for senior leadership and beyond in the Justice Department and FBI to wake up every morning to read the latest vicious attacks on their integrity by the man they ostensibly serve.
No. Wrong. It's insane that anyone in America with pretensions of punditry could write this, but it seems to be becoming increasingly common and needs to be called out every time it happens.
Civil. Servants. Serve. The. American. People. Not. The. President.
The President is supposed to serve the civil servants through his leadership.
Elected officials work for us. I refuse to allow the fascists and authoritarians any ground on this.
posted by biogeo at 7:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [113 favorites]
No. Wrong. It's insane that anyone in America with pretensions of punditry could write this, but it seems to be becoming increasingly common and needs to be called out every time it happens.
Civil. Servants. Serve. The. American. People. Not. The. President.
The President is supposed to serve the civil servants through his leadership.
Elected officials work for us. I refuse to allow the fascists and authoritarians any ground on this.
posted by biogeo at 7:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [113 favorites]
I don't think this is "Kabuki" (the idiom is a bit problematic actually, why not call it "opera?").
I thought we had settled for calling it what it is - kayfabe, which is a much better descriptor.
I think that the appeal of using kabuki is that the audience sees exactly what (the scenery/prop handling) is going on in the background but are culturally educated to ignore it.
posted by porpoise at 7:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
I thought we had settled for calling it what it is - kayfabe, which is a much better descriptor.
I think that the appeal of using kabuki is that the audience sees exactly what (the scenery/prop handling) is going on in the background but are culturally educated to ignore it.
posted by porpoise at 7:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Toomey is a hard YES on anything that is terrible and morally bankrupt and was one of the Secret Cabal of Thirteen
Small steps, I know. Baby steps, I understand. 2018 first, then 2020.
But I swear to God, there are some fucking days when the only thing that keeps me calling and yelling and fighting is the idea of being at home on Election Night 2022, and getting to put my feet up while watching Pat Toomey's pathetic :[ face giving a concession speech.
posted by joyceanmachine at 7:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Small steps, I know. Baby steps, I understand. 2018 first, then 2020.
But I swear to God, there are some fucking days when the only thing that keeps me calling and yelling and fighting is the idea of being at home on Election Night 2022, and getting to put my feet up while watching Pat Toomey's pathetic :[ face giving a concession speech.
posted by joyceanmachine at 7:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Someone just asked Speaker Ryan about whether Trump could make a recess appointment of a new Attorney General who would fire Mueller. Ryan said that the President is in charge of staffing decisions and eh, it's none of my business.
I... may have forgotten about recess appointments. A recess is coming up at the end of the month.
If Trump succeeds in getting the Special Counsel fired, that's it. There would be no reasonable argument in favor of waiting to excise this malignant presidency. The Queen of England is above the law and unimpeachable. The President of the United States is not. There would be a moral obligation to put a brake on the wheels of government until impeachment or an invocation of the 25th Amendment.
The Senate could prevent recess appointments with pro forma sessions. I suppose we should start asking them to do that.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
I... may have forgotten about recess appointments. A recess is coming up at the end of the month.
If Trump succeeds in getting the Special Counsel fired, that's it. There would be no reasonable argument in favor of waiting to excise this malignant presidency. The Queen of England is above the law and unimpeachable. The President of the United States is not. There would be a moral obligation to put a brake on the wheels of government until impeachment or an invocation of the 25th Amendment.
The Senate could prevent recess appointments with pro forma sessions. I suppose we should start asking them to do that.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
If Trump succeeds in getting the Special Counsel fired, that's it. There would be no reasonable argument in favor of waiting to excise this malignant presidency. The Queen of England is above the law and unimpeachable. The President of the United States is not. There would be a moral obligation to put a brake on the wheels of government until impeachment or an invocation of the 25th Amendment.
This requires the participating parties to be moral and reasonable; qualities not seen as much as they used to be.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:40 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
This requires the participating parties to be moral and reasonable; qualities not seen as much as they used to be.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:40 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
"It's a distraction" or "It's a head-fake" has historically been just as accurate as "He's going to pivot."
Quite so. My calling Trump's behavior "kabuki" implied too much art and artifice. Chimpanzee dominance displays would be a better metaphor for all the thought Trump's putting into them. The other factor is that Trump thrives on pure humiliation, both as a political tactic and a psychological salve. At the moment, he's under pressure on any number of fronts, so he's lashing out at his minions for not protecting him (over the weekend, it was the turn for Hill Rump Republicans to get a ticking-off on Twitter). If Sessions has learned anything from dealing with Trump, he'll take his lumps and lie low until Trump's attention wanders to another target. It worked for Steve Bannon.
I thought we had settled for calling it what it is - kayfabe, which is a much better descriptor.
Arguably, but there will never be a heel-face turn.
posted by Doktor Zed at 7:46 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Quite so. My calling Trump's behavior "kabuki" implied too much art and artifice. Chimpanzee dominance displays would be a better metaphor for all the thought Trump's putting into them. The other factor is that Trump thrives on pure humiliation, both as a political tactic and a psychological salve. At the moment, he's under pressure on any number of fronts, so he's lashing out at his minions for not protecting him (over the weekend, it was the turn for Hill Rump Republicans to get a ticking-off on Twitter). If Sessions has learned anything from dealing with Trump, he'll take his lumps and lie low until Trump's attention wanders to another target. It worked for Steve Bannon.
I thought we had settled for calling it what it is - kayfabe, which is a much better descriptor.
Arguably, but there will never be a heel-face turn.
posted by Doktor Zed at 7:46 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
If Trump truly fires Mueller through a recess appointment of a new complicit AG the only thing that will save us is not Congress, it's mass demonstrations in the streets to dwarf the Women's Marches.
Sustained mass demonstration. Shut the country down.
posted by lydhre at 7:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
Sustained mass demonstration. Shut the country down.
posted by lydhre at 7:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
It really has started to feel like things are going faster, and grosser. Alexandra Erin really put a lot of words to it, and it makes a lot of sense. I'd summarize more but this thread is making it difficult to type.
posted by Brainy at 7:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Brainy at 7:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
GQ's Jay Willis: I Will Duel The Shit Out Of Blake Farenthold.
I'd challenge that of shape fucker to fisticuffs, myself...
posted by TwoStride at 7:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'd challenge that of shape fucker to fisticuffs, myself...
posted by TwoStride at 7:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
"If you fire Mueller, we'll fire you." is the only acceptable form of words from the GOP.
Which is about as likely to be uttered as the second law of thermodynamics in Sanskrit, but just in case they're reading this and wondering.
posted by Devonian at 7:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Which is about as likely to be uttered as the second law of thermodynamics in Sanskrit, but just in case they're reading this and wondering.
posted by Devonian at 7:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
If Trump truly fires Mueller through a recess appointment of a new complicit AG the only thing that will save us is not Congress, it's mass demonstrations in the streets
This isn't hyperbole. Paul Ryan just confirmed that he doesn't care if Trump fires Mueller.
posted by diogenes at 7:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
This isn't hyperbole. Paul Ryan just confirmed that he doesn't care if Trump fires Mueller.
posted by diogenes at 7:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Not sure if it was at a Jamboree but here's Obama meeting some Boy Scouts.
posted by scalefree at 7:55 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by scalefree at 7:55 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
If Trump truly fires Mueller through a recess appointment of a new complicit AG the only thing that will save us is not Congress, it's mass demonstrations in the streets
This isn't hyperbole. Paul Ryan just confirmed that he doesn't care if Trump fires Mueller.
And it won't be hyperbolic. The demonstrations will dwarf any this country has ever seen. I expect that the only people that will be left in these threads will be those who are unable to be at the marches due to disability. Otherwise, every one of us should be on the street.
posted by Sophie1 at 7:57 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
This isn't hyperbole. Paul Ryan just confirmed that he doesn't care if Trump fires Mueller.
And it won't be hyperbolic. The demonstrations will dwarf any this country has ever seen. I expect that the only people that will be left in these threads will be those who are unable to be at the marches due to disability. Otherwise, every one of us should be on the street.
posted by Sophie1 at 7:57 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
> This isn't hyperbole. Paul Ryan just confirmed that he doesn't care if Trump fires Mueller.
Did he literally say "It's Okay If You're A Republican"?
posted by The Card Cheat at 7:58 AM on July 25, 2017
Did he literally say "It's Okay If You're A Republican"?
posted by The Card Cheat at 7:58 AM on July 25, 2017
Congressional Republicans are beginning to say the right words.
I think a lot of them assumed that having Trump plus a majority would equal power, and the temptation of power was enough for them. Now some are realizing how toxic he is and that his continued unpopularity will come back to bite then in the ass, possibly losing both houses and the executive by 2020.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 7:59 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I think a lot of them assumed that having Trump plus a majority would equal power, and the temptation of power was enough for them. Now some are realizing how toxic he is and that his continued unpopularity will come back to bite then in the ass, possibly losing both houses and the executive by 2020.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 7:59 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
The Senate could prevent recess appointments with pro forma sessions. I suppose we should start asking them to do that.
I'm sure McConnell will be happy to do this, just as he did when Obama was president so he couldn't make any recess appointments.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:00 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
I'm sure McConnell will be happy to do this, just as he did when Obama was president so he couldn't make any recess appointments.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:00 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Hey now, I would make every effort to post in these threads while on the streets. Of course, the cell/data signal probably wouldn't be up to it.
posted by yasaman at 8:00 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 8:00 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
I really recommend buying sign-making supplies today, so you're ready when we need to demonstrate. The fate of the world kind of does hang in the balance, and literally everyone needs to be out on the streets if Mueller gets fired.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:02 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:02 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
And it won't be hyperbolic. The demonstrations will dwarf any this country has ever seen. I expect that the only people that will be left in these threads will be those who are unable to be at the marches due to disability. Otherwise, every one of us should be on the street.
If it comes to this, should I got to the nearest major city (Boston), or should I go to DC? Obviously the logistics of going to DC are far more complicated, but the impact of big numbers in DC would be greater.
posted by diogenes at 8:04 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
If it comes to this, should I got to the nearest major city (Boston), or should I go to DC? Obviously the logistics of going to DC are far more complicated, but the impact of big numbers in DC would be greater.
posted by diogenes at 8:04 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Nearest city. This needs to be instantaneous and nationwide.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:05 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:05 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
This escalating Trump-on-Sessions abuse is something to behold.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:05 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:05 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
The fate of the world kind of does hang in the balance
I'm glad you wrote "the world", because it is. We are counting on you guys to handle this now
posted by mumimor at 8:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
I'm glad you wrote "the world", because it is. We are counting on you guys to handle this now
posted by mumimor at 8:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Shorter Paul Ryan: Let's wait to see the crazy shit Trump does and then figure out if we can possibly do nothing about it.
posted by pjenks at 8:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by pjenks at 8:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [21 favorites]
Also, prepare for the long haul. Probably not a one-time thing.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:08 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:08 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
We are counting on you guys to handle this now
If some foreign governments wanted to, you know, give us a hand we wouldn't turn them down. There is precedent.
posted by LarsC at 8:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
If some foreign governments wanted to, you know, give us a hand we wouldn't turn them down. There is precedent.
posted by LarsC at 8:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Nationwide?
Scottish Mefites might like to bookmark this in GMaps
US Consulate Edinburgh, Scotland
3 Regent Terrace
Edinburgh EH7 5BW
Other US Embassy sites in the UK
posted by Devonian at 8:13 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
Scottish Mefites might like to bookmark this in GMaps
US Consulate Edinburgh, Scotland
3 Regent Terrace
Edinburgh EH7 5BW
Other US Embassy sites in the UK
posted by Devonian at 8:13 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
If it comes to this, should I got to the nearest major city (Boston), or should I go to DC?
Go to your Representative's district office until they affirm that they will vote for nothing before impeachment, then the nearest major city.
posted by Etrigan at 8:13 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Go to your Representative's district office until they affirm that they will vote for nothing before impeachment, then the nearest major city.
posted by Etrigan at 8:13 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Re the Boy Scouts: I don't know who's in charge these days, but they can't be living in such an isolated cave that they didn't know T would be a problem. It's almost as though our beloved institutions (not just BSA) keep thinking, "ok, maybe THIS time he won't act like an idiot, in front of OUR group, maybe he'll FINALLY start acting like the president he's supposed to be." I sure wish they'd stop doing that; it's like an abused spouse who keeps thinking "ok, maybe TODAY they'll suddenly change and stop hitting me..."
Oh, and: it has been _0_ days since the last Trump disaster.
posted by Melismata at 8:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
Oh, and: it has been _0_ days since the last Trump disaster.
posted by Melismata at 8:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
Re Scouts, my son really liked it when he was little, and I got some weekends off when Man and Boy would go camping. After watching yesterday's demonstration of how easy it is to turn a group of theoretical patriots into a staggering Hitleresque youth rally, he is sending his badges back to the national headquarters.
Re recess appointments, I think that is our most likely scenario. If that happens, I agree that we must rally everyone into the equivalent of a national strike. Shut the whole system down. I'm going today to buy cases of water for marchers, because I can fit a lot of water and signs in a mini van. This shit is about to get really ugly if 45 tries to play banana republican.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 8:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Re recess appointments, I think that is our most likely scenario. If that happens, I agree that we must rally everyone into the equivalent of a national strike. Shut the whole system down. I'm going today to buy cases of water for marchers, because I can fit a lot of water and signs in a mini van. This shit is about to get really ugly if 45 tries to play banana republican.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 8:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Re the Boy Scouts: I don't know who's in charge these days, but they can't be living in such an isolated cave that they didn't know T would be a problem. It's almost as though our beloved institutions (not just BSA) keep thinking, "ok, maybe THIS time he won't act like an idiot, in front of OUR group, maybe he'll FINALLY start acting like the president he's supposed to be."
This is exactly like what living with my mother was like. The endless hoping that somehow THIS time things would be different.
It is deeply unfortunate that the whole country is getting a crash course on the futility of hoping abusive people can change.
posted by winna at 8:17 AM on July 25, 2017 [40 favorites]
This is exactly like what living with my mother was like. The endless hoping that somehow THIS time things would be different.
It is deeply unfortunate that the whole country is getting a crash course on the futility of hoping abusive people can change.
posted by winna at 8:17 AM on July 25, 2017 [40 favorites]
GQ's Jay Willis: I Will Duel The Shit Out Of Blake Farenthold.
Manchin on Farenthold’s Duel Remark: ‘I’d Be OK to Step Outside With Him’
Manchin on Farenthold’s Duel Remark: ‘I’d Be OK to Step Outside With Him’
"I'd be OK to step outside with him, if he wants to take all my people in West Virginia and throw them out in the cold," Manchin said. "I'm glad that Shelly understands our constituent base the same as I do."posted by chris24 at 8:18 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
I'm actually not sure about a general strike, because a lot of people can't strike. I would stick with massive demonstrations, and it's fine to come after work if you can't afford to miss work.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:19 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:19 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
Oh, and: it has been _0_ days since the last Trump disaster.
I cannot imagine what the white house's workmans' comp premiums must be.
posted by srboisvert at 8:19 AM on July 25, 2017
I cannot imagine what the white house's workmans' comp premiums must be.
posted by srboisvert at 8:19 AM on July 25, 2017
Don't worry, guys. Fortunately nobody at the White House knows about recess appointments.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 8:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Huffy Puffy at 8:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
And it won't be hyperbolic. The demonstrations will dwarf any this country has ever seen
Right. Congress potentially taking healthcare away from 22+ million people and by and large it's business as usual. But firing the Attorney General--ho, ho, that'll finally get people off their asses.
We're only 6 months in and it's been a war of attrition and fatigue already. It'd take something monumental to drum up a few million in the streets. Not saying it can't happen, but firing the AG isn't anywhere near the top of that list.
posted by splen at 8:21 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Right. Congress potentially taking healthcare away from 22+ million people and by and large it's business as usual. But firing the Attorney General--ho, ho, that'll finally get people off their asses.
We're only 6 months in and it's been a war of attrition and fatigue already. It'd take something monumental to drum up a few million in the streets. Not saying it can't happen, but firing the AG isn't anywhere near the top of that list.
posted by splen at 8:21 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Rand Paul a Yes on Key Healthcare Hurdle (The Hill)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:21 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:21 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Fortunately nobody at the White House knows about recess appointments.
Of course they do. Those are the meetings you take while the President is driving big trucks on the lawn.
posted by Etrigan at 8:21 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Of course they do. Those are the meetings you take while the President is driving big trucks on the lawn.
posted by Etrigan at 8:21 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
A brief look at politics elsewhere in the world: Why Poland's Government Is Being Accused of Destroying Democracy (Tara John for Time Magazine, July 21, 2017)
posted by filthy light thief at 8:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Despite growing unrest and threats from the E.U., the government of Poland is on the brink of adopting a contentious law that critics say will unravel the country's democratic institutions by giving politicians influence over the courts.Good news! Polish President Vetoes Two Proposed Laws To Change Judicial System (Kelly McEvers talks with Justyna Pawlak of Reuters on NPR, July 24, 2017)
Weeks after U.S. President Donald Trump hailed Poland for its democratic values during a foreign policy speech in Warsaw, tens of thousands protested across the country against the ruling Law and Justice (PiS) party’s erosion of the judiciary's independence.
It follows a Thursday vote where lawmakers in the lower house of parliament passed a draft bill that would dismiss all member's of the country's Supreme Court and let the president— on the request of the justice minister— make new appointments and influence their work.
...
Why is this happening now?
It is part of a wider campaign to dismantle the country's democratic checks and balances on the government by the populist Law and Justice party (PiS), co-founded and chaired by former Prime Minister Jarosław Kaczyński. Since winning a majority in 2015, PiS deputies have effectively turned the country's state media into a propaganda arm, purged the army's leadership, placed loyalists in the civil service and weakened the Constitutional Tribunal which rules on whether legislation violates Poland's constitution.
The rightwing PiS says it is only following through election promises to reform the judiciary. PiS supporters have criticized Polish courts for taking too long to hear cases. In a speech to the lower house on Thursday, Prime Minister Beata Szydlo said the new legislation was a reaction to the courts' alleged inefficiency while insisting that the government will not bow to pressure "from Polish or from foreign defenders of the interest of the elites."
For the last week, tens of thousands of Polish people went to the streets to protest the bills.Good luck, Poland!
...
And they demanded that President Andrzej Duda veto the bills. And today, in an unexpected turn, he did. He vetoed two out of the three.
MCEVERS: Can you tell us just a little more about the legislation that President Duda vetoed?
PAWLAK: Yes. There are quite a lot of - there are quite a lot of details in it. But essentially the legislation was going to give either the government or Parliament, which is controlled by the same party, a say in appointing - the appointment of judges just about across the spectrum. The most controversial, that was an overhaul of rules dealing with the Supreme Court in which the - if the law - if the drafted legislation actually became law, all the Supreme Court judges would have to retire the next day except for those picked by the justice minister. And then Parliament would have the say in appointing their replacements.
...
MCEVERS: And along with these huge protests that I mentioned, the European Union threatened Poland with sanctions if these bills were signed, the U.S. State Department weighed in saying judicial reform shouldn't violate Poland's Constitution or international legal obligations. What made the difference, though? Why did Duda say he vetoed these bills?
...
PAWLAK: Duda is a - you know, is a president who is a very close ally of the ruling - of the ruling Conservative Party. So this is - you know, the main question is whether - you know, to what extent did he break away from the party? And is this a big loss for the government in terms of losing a dependable ally in any kind of future policymaking? Some observers say that this is related to - that this is a political - you know, political calculation on his part because of the - ahead of the next presidential election in 2020, where he perhaps felt that vetoing laws that so many people believe are unconstitutional would actually help him.
... the one that he didn't veto does actually give the government some say in appointment - in appointing lower level judges. So there is definitely a lot of concern about that. But I think broadly speaking, you know, it's unclear as to where Poland will go from now. The government said that they do want the judiciary to be reformed. Duda said he does as well, just under different conditions. So there will be more proposals.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Sustained mass demonstration. Shut the country down.
Which is where this country has been headed for the last 30 years. Somehow stop production on a few US based industry giants for a few months, and he'll be gone pronto. And the precedent will jog everyone's memory on where power can be found.
posted by rc3spencer at 8:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Which is where this country has been headed for the last 30 years. Somehow stop production on a few US based industry giants for a few months, and he'll be gone pronto. And the precedent will jog everyone's memory on where power can be found.
posted by rc3spencer at 8:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Prosecutorial decisions should be based on applying facts to the law without hint of political motivation. To do otherwise is to run away from the long-standing American tradition of separating the law from politics regardless of party.
Says the impeachment manager in United States v. Blowjob.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:23 AM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
firing the AG isn't anywhere near the top of that list
Maybe not firing the AG, but firing Mueller and killing a publicly-known criminal investigation into the President could be and should be.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:23 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
Maybe not firing the AG, but firing Mueller and killing a publicly-known criminal investigation into the President could be and should be.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:23 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
Here's text of Hitler's Speech to German Youth, 1939. Note that he spoke to them directly about themselves. The speech was all about the important role they would play in the new Reich. Reference to Germany were made in terms of "We" not "I". Which makes sense, because Hitler is telling them they are the successors to German greatness and not trying to inflate his own ego.
posted by zarq at 8:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [59 favorites]
"Germany looks at you with pride. Everyone's heart runs over with joy when we see you. We see in you the promise that our work was not in vain and we realize that it bears fruit for our country. We are all gripped with a proud happiness to see in you the fulfillment of our work. With that we have the assurance that the millions who died in World War I — the great numbers of our comrades — have not made the sacrifice for Germany in vain, so that in the end a one-spirited, free, proud and honor-loving people will emerge.The actual speech last night really wasn't reminiscent of a Hitler Youth Rally beyond the optics of a bunch of teenagers listening raptly to the rants of a fascistic leader. It wasn't aimed at inspiring boy scouts to service or making them feel like they are part of a larger whole. And I suppose it's worth noting that Trump isn't Hitler. He isn't even Hitler-lite. He's just a sad, childish narcissist desperately trying to inflate his sense of self-worth at the expense of others.
And I know it cannot be any other way because you are flesh from our flesh and blood from our blood, and in your young minds burns the same spirit that drives us."
posted by zarq at 8:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [59 favorites]
It would basically be like the Saturday Night Massacre, but with democratic norms so eroded that nobody is going to do anything about it unless we make them. And yes, that is a huge deal. It's a fundamental existential crisis, in a way that the horrific healthcare bill isn't.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Which is where this country has been headed for the last 30 years. Somehow stop production on a few US based industry giants for a few months, and he'll be gone pronto. And the precedent will jog everyone's memory on where power can be found.
Most Americans are one missed paycheck away from financial ruin. I don't think there is even a whiff of a hint of a chance of even a dozen people participating in a general strike.
Financial noncomplaince, though...
posted by FakeFreyja at 8:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Most Americans are one missed paycheck away from financial ruin. I don't think there is even a whiff of a hint of a chance of even a dozen people participating in a general strike.
Financial noncomplaince, though...
posted by FakeFreyja at 8:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Trump isn't Hitler, but he is Attempted Hitler which is still a felony of moral turpitude
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:29 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:29 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
Maybe not firing the AG, but firing Mueller and killing a publicly-known criminal investigation into the President could be and should be.
Typed AG, meant AG and Mueller. And IMO, it would just be a blip on the radar. Unless Republicans got on board (they wouldn't) it would be 'it was all fake news, nothing to see here'. A few sit ins, a few demonstrations, maybe a half million in DC. That's it and they're onto the next news cycle 24-48 hours later.
Seriously, who would lead the charge? Who would rally the troops? Pelosi? Sanders? Hillary? Warren? please....
There's only one person in this country who could muster that type of outrage and he's taking a rightful break after 8 years of hell.
posted by splen at 8:29 AM on July 25, 2017
Typed AG, meant AG and Mueller. And IMO, it would just be a blip on the radar. Unless Republicans got on board (they wouldn't) it would be 'it was all fake news, nothing to see here'. A few sit ins, a few demonstrations, maybe a half million in DC. That's it and they're onto the next news cycle 24-48 hours later.
Seriously, who would lead the charge? Who would rally the troops? Pelosi? Sanders? Hillary? Warren? please....
There's only one person in this country who could muster that type of outrage and he's taking a rightful break after 8 years of hell.
posted by splen at 8:29 AM on July 25, 2017
I'm actually not sure about a general strike, because a lot of people can't strike. I would stick with massive demonstrations, and it's fine to come after work if you can't afford to miss work.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 10:19 AM on July 25 [6 favorites +] [!]
I get the sentiment, obviously. Nobody wants to lose their jobs.
But, like, yeah, a general strike is a risk and a battle. A general strike is serious business. But that people who can't not go to work don't go to work is the thing that makes a general strike effective.
But with labor neutered how we get from here to there, I dunno man.
posted by TheProfessor at 8:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 10:19 AM on July 25 [6 favorites +] [!]
I get the sentiment, obviously. Nobody wants to lose their jobs.
But, like, yeah, a general strike is a risk and a battle. A general strike is serious business. But that people who can't not go to work don't go to work is the thing that makes a general strike effective.
But with labor neutered how we get from here to there, I dunno man.
posted by TheProfessor at 8:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
The actual speech last night really wasn't reminiscent of a Hitler Youth Rally beyond the optics of a bunch of teenagers listening raptly to the rants of a fascistic leader. It wasn't aimed at inspiring boy scouts to service or making them feel like they are part of a larger whole. And I suppose it's worth noting that Trump isn't Hitler. He isn't even Hitler-lite. He's just a sad, childish narcissist desperately trying to inflate his sense of self-worth at the expense of others.
This.
Hitler was good at making speeches and was able to make many Germans feel as if they were part of something much greater. Trump's word salad is always about him and belief that he is great. The BSA Jamboree fiasco is more like a bunch of impressionable, peer pressured kids mocking the target of a bully's ire.
posted by dazed_one at 8:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
This.
Hitler was good at making speeches and was able to make many Germans feel as if they were part of something much greater. Trump's word salad is always about him and belief that he is great. The BSA Jamboree fiasco is more like a bunch of impressionable, peer pressured kids mocking the target of a bully's ire.
posted by dazed_one at 8:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
If Barack Obama did not speak out forcefully after the President of the United States killed a criminal investigation into himself, I would be furious. I still have Hope that he would Change his policy of non-engagement under such circumstances.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
Hey speaking of mergers, guess who the president of the Boy Scouts of America, who recently wrote the most enabling statement about someone who barely represents any of their values, is?
Go on and google it.
The results won't surprise you.
posted by Yowser at 8:36 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Go on and google it.
The results won't surprise you.
posted by Yowser at 8:36 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
> I'm going today to buy cases of water for marchers, because I can fit a lot of water and signs in a mini van.
Please, everyone, if you have the means to do this, do this. The folks who bring flats of water to demos are genuine heroes, second only to the folks who bring pizza.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:36 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
Please, everyone, if you have the means to do this, do this. The folks who bring flats of water to demos are genuine heroes, second only to the folks who bring pizza.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:36 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
Trump isn't Hitler, but he is Attempted Hitler which is still a felony of moral turpitude
I guess? I honestly think he's more of a Ceausescu, Ghaddafi or Stroessner. Incessantly vain, self-promoting yet in some ways oddly incompetent dictators who lied to and stole from their people while relentlessly trying to create 'successful leader narratives' for themselves.
posted by zarq at 8:37 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
I guess? I honestly think he's more of a Ceausescu, Ghaddafi or Stroessner. Incessantly vain, self-promoting yet in some ways oddly incompetent dictators who lied to and stole from their people while relentlessly trying to create 'successful leader narratives' for themselves.
posted by zarq at 8:37 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Go on and google it.
It's Randall Lynn Stephenson, the chairman, chief executive officer and president of AT&T who is currently trying to get the Trump administration to approve his purchase of Time Warner.
Yay.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:37 AM on July 25, 2017 [35 favorites]
It's Randall Lynn Stephenson, the chairman, chief executive officer and president of AT&T who is currently trying to get the Trump administration to approve his purchase of Time Warner.
Yay.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:37 AM on July 25, 2017 [35 favorites]
he reminds me most of that dude who ran Turkmenistan. whose name I'm going to make a point of not remembering or looking up bc that's just what he wants
posted by prize bull octorok at 8:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by prize bull octorok at 8:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I still have Hope that he would Change his policy of non-engagement under such circumstances.
I have wondered for quite some time what his tipping point may be. I would hope putting the kibosh on the Russia investigation would be enough, but I'm not entirely sold on it.
posted by splen at 8:40 AM on July 25, 2017
I have wondered for quite some time what his tipping point may be. I would hope putting the kibosh on the Russia investigation would be enough, but I'm not entirely sold on it.
posted by splen at 8:40 AM on July 25, 2017
Meanwhile Senator Collins makes jokes about beating up other senators while on the floor.
Whew what a lovely bunch.
posted by Yowser at 8:41 AM on July 25, 2017
Whew what a lovely bunch.
posted by Yowser at 8:41 AM on July 25, 2017
Here, have a last minute letter for your Senator:
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [25 favorites]
Senator,If we make it through this shitfest, I'll have enough letters to Congress to publish a book, I swear...
[For Democrats: Thank you for your commitment to protecting the ACA, and I know you will not vote for the Motion-to-Proceed tomorrow. As I watched the Senate Democrats last night holding the floor of this venerable institution, I was again heartened to keep fighting.]
[For Republicans: Over the last weeks, as Mitch McConnell has repeatedly revived this cruel legislation, I have repeatedly seen every major healthcare organization, associations representing seniors, disability rights groups, people from all across the political spectrum, as well as Senate Republicans and Democrats condemn it as irresponsible, terrifying, and appalling.]
This [vomit-inducing] piece of undead legislation must never pass, and I expect you to vote No on the Motion-to-Proceed.[For Democrats: On account of these issues, I expect that you will continue to put pressure on Capito, Heller, Murkowski, Collins, Portman, and any of the so-called "moderates" who have made noises about resisting this horrible, homicidal legislation. Anyone who would vote to proceed on this travesty would show complete, shocking, and unforgivable depraved indifference to human life.]
- There have been no public hearings about the consequences of this bill.
- The bill has been drafted entirely in secret.
- McConnell's final bill will have no CBO score
- Neither the Congress nor We the People will know what is actually in the final bill if McConnell allows a Vote-a-Rama.
- To enact any legislation, especially of this magnitude, under these circumstances would be cruel, irresponsible, and utterly stupid.
[For Republicans: If you vote Yes on any aspect of this legislation, I will campaign against you, donate to your Democratic opponents, and personally blame you, [Senator's full name] for the hundreds of thousands of premature deaths that this legislation will cause. You, [Senator's full name] will be soaked in the blood of dead and suffering Americans because your depraved indifference to human life. I will never rest until you lose your seat in the Senate because [State] cannot afford to be represented by someone who does not listen to or care about the needs of the people who live here.]
Sincerely,
[Your name]
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [25 favorites]
Meanwhile Senator Collins makes jokes about beating up other senators while on the floor.
To be fair, she was just challenged to a duel. [real]
posted by anastasiav at 8:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
To be fair, she was just challenged to a duel. [real]
posted by anastasiav at 8:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Correction, ANOTHER Senator made the joke, and Collins made a joke back.
posted by Yowser at 8:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Yowser at 8:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Democrats with dreams of impeachment should consider how Iran-Contra turned out
For opponents of the Trump administration who pin their hopes on impeachment or resignation, Iran-Contra should be a sobering precedent. Stonewalling, destruction of evidence, conveniently muddied memories — all worked to shield the Reagan administration from the consequences of its bad acts.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:43 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
For opponents of the Trump administration who pin their hopes on impeachment or resignation, Iran-Contra should be a sobering precedent. Stonewalling, destruction of evidence, conveniently muddied memories — all worked to shield the Reagan administration from the consequences of its bad acts.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:43 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
I've been having trouble keeping up with this thread. Is the sort-of health care vote going to work? Did they wheel in Boxer... I mean McCain in for one last indignity?
posted by Yowser at 8:44 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by Yowser at 8:44 AM on July 25, 2017
Democrats with dreams of impeachment should consider how Iran-Contra turned out and make sure we do the job properly this time
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
Excommunicated Cardinal:
Begging for our Lives: Letters I Wrote During the Trump Administration
posted by Emmy Rae at 8:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [57 favorites]
Begging for our Lives: Letters I Wrote During the Trump Administration
posted by Emmy Rae at 8:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [57 favorites]
I agree that Trump doesn't have the charisma and the "idealism" of Hitler, but he is viewed as an unimpeachable god by 35-40% of the US population, and most of that adoration is because of his personality.
In these first six months, I haven't seen any evidence of a change in the views of anyone in the US, except perhaps a hardening of positions. And Republicans realize that the Trump Core is an overwhelming majority of their voters. They (rightly) see no benefit in opposing Trump. The Trump Core is having the time of their lives.
It seems to me that the only change will come with another national election. Perhaps this time, despite gerrymandering and apathy, the non-Trump majority can prevail. If I were Trump, I'd be figuring how to avoid such a referendum.
posted by pjenks at 8:46 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
In these first six months, I haven't seen any evidence of a change in the views of anyone in the US, except perhaps a hardening of positions. And Republicans realize that the Trump Core is an overwhelming majority of their voters. They (rightly) see no benefit in opposing Trump. The Trump Core is having the time of their lives.
It seems to me that the only change will come with another national election. Perhaps this time, despite gerrymandering and apathy, the non-Trump majority can prevail. If I were Trump, I'd be figuring how to avoid such a referendum.
posted by pjenks at 8:46 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Emmy Rae, so...uhh, mind if I actually use that title, if I do compile them like that? You pretty much summed up the whole enterprise right there.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
Excommunicated Cardinal It's all yours. Thanks for all the letters you write for us.
posted by Emmy Rae at 8:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [24 favorites]
posted by Emmy Rae at 8:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [24 favorites]
National Treasure Alexandra Petri, WaPo: A guide to Boy Scout ranks and badges, revised for Trump Scouts
“A scout is trustworthy, loyal. We could use some more loyalty, I will tell you that.”posted by Johnny Wallflower at 8:57 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
— Donald Trump, addressing the National Scout Jamboree
Here are a few more suggested tweaks to the Boy Scout system that can Make the Boy Scouts Great Again.
Ranks (from lowest to highest):
Tiffany Scout: The most forgettable of the scouts. Emblem might have a fleur-de-lis, but no one can be sure, as this rank of scout has never been photographed or detected by the human eye.
Sessions Scout: Emblem is a picture of a Make America Great Again hat. You must learn how to tie yourself in knots (half-hitch, double hitch, sheet bend, trucker line, bow line) in the course of your testimony before the Senate.
Son Scout: Emblem is 1980s hair slicked back to give it the appearance of having been painted on. Ostensibly attaining this rank requires you to show leadership, but you don’t have to if you are a family member. Complete at least two fitness challenges.
The Queen of England is above the law and unimpeachable.
I expect that at some point in her long life Liz has heard of Li'l Chuckie Stuart And His Terrible Awful No-Good Day When Parliament Chopped His Head Off For Being Such A Dick.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:57 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
I expect that at some point in her long life Liz has heard of Li'l Chuckie Stuart And His Terrible Awful No-Good Day When Parliament Chopped His Head Off For Being Such A Dick.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:57 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
I agree that Trump doesn't have the charisma and the "idealism" of Hitler, but he is viewed as an unimpeachable god by 35-40% of the US population
This is an overstatement. Trump's approval is around 85% among Republicans, but Republicans make up something like 30% of the population, so it's more like 25% of the US population that's still strongly behind him. I say this not to quibble about math but because I think it's important to have a sense of the problem here. We don't need to topple a beast supported by nearly half of the population, we need to disempower a relatively small minority that has been given unfair weight.
posted by Copronymus at 9:00 AM on July 25, 2017 [34 favorites]
This is an overstatement. Trump's approval is around 85% among Republicans, but Republicans make up something like 30% of the population, so it's more like 25% of the US population that's still strongly behind him. I say this not to quibble about math but because I think it's important to have a sense of the problem here. We don't need to topple a beast supported by nearly half of the population, we need to disempower a relatively small minority that has been given unfair weight.
posted by Copronymus at 9:00 AM on July 25, 2017 [34 favorites]
If the President sees that he is being criminally investigated and responds by shutting down the investigation under false pretenses, and if he is not removed by the Executive or Legislative branches, that is a coup d'état. It is a usurpation of the Constitution. If the President is incapable of being investigated, if he is incapable of being impeached and removed, the Constitution is no longer the supreme law of the land: it has been superseded by the whims of Donald Trump. There would be no clear limits to his power to flout the law or the courts. We would have returned to monarchy.
Under such circumstances, extreme measures would seem appropriate, until the principle of the rule of law is restored.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:02 AM on July 25, 2017 [72 favorites]
Under such circumstances, extreme measures would seem appropriate, until the principle of the rule of law is restored.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:02 AM on July 25, 2017 [72 favorites]
I expect that at some point in her long life Liz has heard of Li'l Chuckie Stuart And His Terrible Awful No-Good Day When Parliament Chopped His Head Off For Being Such A Dick.
Been thinking a lot lately of his "how can a king commit treason?? against himself??? that doesn't even make sense" defense
posted by theodolite at 9:02 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Been thinking a lot lately of his "how can a king commit treason?? against himself??? that doesn't even make sense" defense
posted by theodolite at 9:02 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Reminder, when you're contacting your Congress people, this vote is also happening today:
posted by Room 641-A at 9:04 AM on July 25, 2017 [48 favorites]
Justice Dept. Nominee Says He Once Represented Russian Bank (NYT, Charles Savage and Adam Goldberg)MSNBC just reporting that he worked directly on the server issue and has said he will not recuse himself from any conflicts. Robert Mueller used to head this division, it's a big deal.
WASHINGTON — President Trump’s nominee to lead the Justice Department’s criminal division, Brian A. Benczkowski, has disclosed to Congress that he previously represented Alfa Bank, one of Russia’s largest financial institutions, whose owners have ties to President Vladimir V. Putin.
Mr. Trump nominated Mr. Benczkowski, a partner at the Kirkland & Ellis law firm and a former Bush administration Justice Department official, in June, and he is scheduled to appear before the Senate Judiciary Committee for a confirmation hearing on Tuesday.
(Alfa Bank is the bank with servers talking to TrumpCo.)
posted by Room 641-A at 9:04 AM on July 25, 2017 [48 favorites]
Guys, I'm scared.
posted by angrycat at 9:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [47 favorites]
posted by angrycat at 9:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [47 favorites]
We don't need to topple a beast supported by nearly half of the population
I appreciate these subtleties, but so far they have been pretty meaningless. Trump won with just less than half of the population, so saying that "Republicans make up something like 30% of the population" is misleading.
The thing that has surprised me most over this past year is that the Trump Core is not a powerless minority. They are an extremely powerful minority, and they are abetted by the rest of the Republicans, bringing them to nearly half the voting public.
For the months preceding November 2016 I was eagerly awaiting the moment that the vile masses at the Trump rallies would be "disempowered" simply by the mathematics of the voting public. But they won and I lost.
I think it's important to have a sense of the problem here.
posted by pjenks at 9:08 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
I appreciate these subtleties, but so far they have been pretty meaningless. Trump won with just less than half of the population, so saying that "Republicans make up something like 30% of the population" is misleading.
The thing that has surprised me most over this past year is that the Trump Core is not a powerless minority. They are an extremely powerful minority, and they are abetted by the rest of the Republicans, bringing them to nearly half the voting public.
For the months preceding November 2016 I was eagerly awaiting the moment that the vile masses at the Trump rallies would be "disempowered" simply by the mathematics of the voting public. But they won and I lost.
I think it's important to have a sense of the problem here.
posted by pjenks at 9:08 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
I appreciate these subtleties, but so far they have been pretty meaningless. Trump won with just less than half of the population, so saying that "Republicans make up something like 30% of the population" is misleading.
No, Trump won with just less than half of the -voting- population, which is a big distinction.
posted by jferg at 9:11 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
No, Trump won with just less than half of the -voting- population, which is a big distinction.
posted by jferg at 9:11 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
If it comes to this, should I got to the nearest major city (Boston), or should I go to DC? Obviously the logistics of going to DC are far more complicated, but the impact of big numbers in DC would be greater.
In general, it's better to protest local, unless DC is your local, because DC marches mostly turn into Giant Groups of People Standing Still and Chanting pretty quickly. Because you can't march when there are that many people. Or at least not very far.
Also it makes better headlines. Marches in DC aren't news. Marches in every state/around the world are.
posted by emjaybee at 9:11 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
In general, it's better to protest local, unless DC is your local, because DC marches mostly turn into Giant Groups of People Standing Still and Chanting pretty quickly. Because you can't march when there are that many people. Or at least not very far.
Also it makes better headlines. Marches in DC aren't news. Marches in every state/around the world are.
posted by emjaybee at 9:11 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
No, Trump won with just less than half of the -voting- population, which is a big distinction.
Agreed. But as we can see from the popular vote, even the "voting population" is not enough to stop Trump.
posted by pjenks at 9:14 AM on July 25, 2017
Agreed. But as we can see from the popular vote, even the "voting population" is not enough to stop Trump.
posted by pjenks at 9:14 AM on July 25, 2017
This is what should have been happening at all those town halls:
posted by Room 641-A at 9:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Awful congressperson: ok, by a show of hands, who here voted for me to appeal Obamacare?But of course, this was always about tax cuts and never about health care.
Audience: (all raise hands)
Awful congressperson: And who here has since changed there mind, and want me to work on improving what we have?
Audience: (all raise hands)
Awful congressperson: Okay then!
posted by Room 641-A at 9:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Been thinking a lot lately of his "how can a king commit treason?? against himself??? that doesn't even make sense" defense
See also: Ceaușescu, Nicolae. "You don't have the authority to try me! This Court has no legal basis in law" "Umm, OK, we'll consider your argument, but in the meantime, would you mind standing over here by this wall?"
posted by Capt. Renault at 9:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
See also: Ceaușescu, Nicolae. "You don't have the authority to try me! This Court has no legal basis in law" "Umm, OK, we'll consider your argument, but in the meantime, would you mind standing over here by this wall?"
posted by Capt. Renault at 9:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Guys, I'm scared.
In about 72 hours I am leaving my safe blue enclave to go to deepest red Butler, Pa to go play medieval dress up for two weeks. Ordinarily, this trip is the highlight of my year - the one time we can really get a way and disconnect and be in a tight knit community of our friends and really relax.
This year, I'm scared of the trip. I'm a little scared of what we'll find on the ground in Butler - the locals only lightly put up with us, and I have a LOT of gender nonconfirming and other generally at risk friends who probably won't want to actually go into town. I'm also scared that when we get back, the country will have somehow radically changed. I feel like the gravel at the edge of the cliff is eroding faster and faster, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if it all suddenly falls away sooner rather than later. And possibly not in a good way.
On the upside, there are ten thousand of us there. And we're armed.
posted by anastasiav at 9:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [47 favorites]
In about 72 hours I am leaving my safe blue enclave to go to deepest red Butler, Pa to go play medieval dress up for two weeks. Ordinarily, this trip is the highlight of my year - the one time we can really get a way and disconnect and be in a tight knit community of our friends and really relax.
This year, I'm scared of the trip. I'm a little scared of what we'll find on the ground in Butler - the locals only lightly put up with us, and I have a LOT of gender nonconfirming and other generally at risk friends who probably won't want to actually go into town. I'm also scared that when we get back, the country will have somehow radically changed. I feel like the gravel at the edge of the cliff is eroding faster and faster, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if it all suddenly falls away sooner rather than later. And possibly not in a good way.
On the upside, there are ten thousand of us there. And we're armed.
posted by anastasiav at 9:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [47 favorites]
> On the upside, there are ten thousand of us there. And we're armed.
2016: look for the helpers
2017: look for the larpers
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [111 favorites]
2016: look for the helpers
2017: look for the larpers
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [111 favorites]
Schumer bringing the fire on the Senate floor right now. I'll look for a transcript.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Fun thought: if Trump decides to fire Mueller via a recess-appointed Attorney General, and he has free rein to appoint anyone he chooses, who will he pick? It's got to be Jared, right?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:23 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:23 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Schumer bringing fire to... an entirely empty Senate chamber. It's always so disheartening when the camera pulls back to reveal that.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Charles Schumer (D-NY) speaking on the floor of the Senate. He's noted that everyone knows exactly what is going on [presumably with the attempt to shove the healthcare bill through].
Now he's talking about how T is publicly upbraiding and undermining his own AG. He says that we should all be concerned about how he's selling out the first person to stick his neck out to stand up for T. Schumer is furious that on a human level, T would criticize and ridicule his friend and supporter like that. Schumer says that it is clear T is trying to bully Sessions out as AG. He's laying out the danger--that T will fire Sessions and replace him with someone who will fire Mueller. He says that Democrats will go to the mat to prevent a recess appointment and use every tool possible to stop it. He says that he cannot imagine McConnell and Ryan would be complicit in allowing a Constitutional to happen.
He's now moved on to the sanctions bill--he says that it is critical that Senate pass the sanctions bill promptly to get it to the Oval Office before the August recess.
This is only a partial summary.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
Now he's talking about how T is publicly upbraiding and undermining his own AG. He says that we should all be concerned about how he's selling out the first person to stick his neck out to stand up for T. Schumer is furious that on a human level, T would criticize and ridicule his friend and supporter like that. Schumer says that it is clear T is trying to bully Sessions out as AG. He's laying out the danger--that T will fire Sessions and replace him with someone who will fire Mueller. He says that Democrats will go to the mat to prevent a recess appointment and use every tool possible to stop it. He says that he cannot imagine McConnell and Ryan would be complicit in allowing a Constitutional to happen.
He's now moved on to the sanctions bill--he says that it is critical that Senate pass the sanctions bill promptly to get it to the Oval Office before the August recess.
This is only a partial summary.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
Schumer bringing fire to... an entirely empty Senate chamber.
Which is why the Senate's undeserved reputation as "the world's greatest deliberative body" needs to die. It isn't about debate, as few are even listening.
posted by Gelatin at 9:26 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Which is why the Senate's undeserved reputation as "the world's greatest deliberative body" needs to die. It isn't about debate, as few are even listening.
posted by Gelatin at 9:26 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
You think they'd actually sit around and listen to what their colleagues have to say when there's fundraising to do?
posted by ultraviolet catastrophe at 9:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by ultraviolet catastrophe at 9:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
> This isn't hyperbole. Paul Ryan just confirmed that he doesn't care if Trump fires Mueller.
Ryan's spokesman has now clarified that he meant Sessions only, not Mueller. Though hardly reassuring since Trump will take it as do whatever.
@BrendanBuck
His statement was only a reference to Sessions. Spoken plenty recently on Mueller.
posted by chris24 at 9:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Ryan's spokesman has now clarified that he meant Sessions only, not Mueller. Though hardly reassuring since Trump will take it as do whatever.
@BrendanBuck
His statement was only a reference to Sessions. Spoken plenty recently on Mueller.
posted by chris24 at 9:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94: The Queen of England is above the law and unimpeachable. The President of the United States is not.
King Donnie the invincible! Hey camera man! Watch this. Donnie opens the trunk and is disintegrated [Click "next clip" a few times to see the rest of the scene]
posted by filthy light thief at 9:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
King Donnie the invincible! Hey camera man! Watch this. Donnie opens the trunk and is disintegrated [Click "next clip" a few times to see the rest of the scene]
posted by filthy light thief at 9:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
McCain rising from his sickbed to cast the decisive healthcare vote in favour of the Republicans would be the political equivalent of Willis Reed returning to the floor at Madison Square Gardens...if a victory by the Knicks had meant that everyone in the arena had to pay thousands of dollars to the owner of the Knicks.
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Sure, there are exceptions, and no, these people don't deserve much of my concern or compassion, but this is the default position of so, so many people in the suburbs, in small towns, and in rural areas. It's why they choose to live there in the first place in many cases.
And for the record: yes, absolutely I want those people to be better or die off. They're the fucking problem.
Wow. That's really quite depressing yet inspiring. Lots of work to do!
posted by jaduncan at 9:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
And for the record: yes, absolutely I want those people to be better or die off. They're the fucking problem.
Wow. That's really quite depressing yet inspiring. Lots of work to do!
posted by jaduncan at 9:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Schumer bringing fire to... an entirely empty Senate chamber. It's always so disheartening when the camera pulls back to reveal that.
Don't discount it. He's not talking to the Senate, and he knows it. This is the same thing Gingrich etc. did in the '90s, and it worked out pretty well for them.
posted by Etrigan at 9:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Don't discount it. He's not talking to the Senate, and he knows it. This is the same thing Gingrich etc. did in the '90s, and it worked out pretty well for them.
posted by Etrigan at 9:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
spitbull: Counterpoint: we have made it 1/8th of the way through Trump's term
It seems too soon to talk about what percent of Trump's term we have survived. All references to Trump's term should be footnoted, stating "assuming that he isn't impeached and/or imprisoned before the end of his first four years, and [knocks on wood] doesn't get elected to a second term."
posted by filthy light thief at 9:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
It seems too soon to talk about what percent of Trump's term we have survived. All references to Trump's term should be footnoted, stating "assuming that he isn't impeached and/or imprisoned before the end of his first four years, and [knocks on wood] doesn't get elected to a second term."
posted by filthy light thief at 9:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Schumer is furious that on a human level, T would criticize and ridicule his friend and supporter like that. Schumer says that it is clear T is trying to bully Sessions out as AG.
You would think his senate colleagues would realize that caving to vote for this tragic bill doesn't mean that Trump won't come after them. Trump betrays his allies and supporters every chance he gets if it benefits him in any way. There is no reward for being on his team.
posted by gladly at 9:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
You would think his senate colleagues would realize that caving to vote for this tragic bill doesn't mean that Trump won't come after them. Trump betrays his allies and supporters every chance he gets if it benefits him in any way. There is no reward for being on his team.
posted by gladly at 9:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
Don't discount it.
Oh, I know, it's a thing. The activities on the floor are televised via CC around the various chambers, it's read into the record, etc... It's just so weird to see the tight close up on the speaker at the podium and then when it's over the camera pulls back and no one is there.
Anyway, Senate adjourned until 2:15. May god have mercy on their souls.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Oh, I know, it's a thing. The activities on the floor are televised via CC around the various chambers, it's read into the record, etc... It's just so weird to see the tight close up on the speaker at the podium and then when it's over the camera pulls back and no one is there.
Anyway, Senate adjourned until 2:15. May god have mercy on their souls.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
McCain coming back to vote to revoke/repeal the healthcare of millions of people when has just had surgery paid for by the American public - that's some chutzpah there. Murderous, sociopathic chutzpah.
posted by From Bklyn at 9:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [56 favorites]
posted by From Bklyn at 9:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [56 favorites]
mavericky murderous sociopathic chutzpah
posted by entropicamericana at 9:35 AM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 9:35 AM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
@maggieNYT 8m
Mooch signaling a new era of "let Trump be Trump," where the comms shop filter pretense is tossed aside, inside part said out loud.
Translation: I have no idea how to do this job, it sounds hard, and I don't want to learn, so, eh, fuck it, #YOLO
Like, you're the communications director but you don't actually want to direct any communications? THESE FUCKING PEOPLE ARE THE LAZIEST SONS OF BITCHES OF ALL TIME
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:36 AM on July 25, 2017 [39 favorites]
Mooch signaling a new era of "let Trump be Trump," where the comms shop filter pretense is tossed aside, inside part said out loud.
Translation: I have no idea how to do this job, it sounds hard, and I don't want to learn, so, eh, fuck it, #YOLO
Like, you're the communications director but you don't actually want to direct any communications? THESE FUCKING PEOPLE ARE THE LAZIEST SONS OF BITCHES OF ALL TIME
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:36 AM on July 25, 2017 [39 favorites]
THESE FUCKING PEOPLE ARE THE LAZIEST SONS OF BITCHES OF ALL TIME
And yet, they're all probably going to get very rich(er) from this. Remember that the main goal for all of them is to loot the US Government, enrich themselves and their friends, and there is very little being done to stop that side of it as we are working to save healthcare etc.
posted by cell divide at 9:40 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
And yet, they're all probably going to get very rich(er) from this. Remember that the main goal for all of them is to loot the US Government, enrich themselves and their friends, and there is very little being done to stop that side of it as we are working to save healthcare etc.
posted by cell divide at 9:40 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
‘I won't stop’: Jailed activist blasts US crackdown on anti-Trump protesters.
When Yvette Felarca exited her flight in Los Angeles, there were a dozen police officers waiting for her. The 47-year-old teacher was handcuffed, jailed, and later, to her shock, charged with assault, inciting a riot and participating in a riot over her involvement in an anti-fascist demonstration at the California capitol more than a year ago.
posted by adamvasco at 9:41 AM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
When Yvette Felarca exited her flight in Los Angeles, there were a dozen police officers waiting for her. The 47-year-old teacher was handcuffed, jailed, and later, to her shock, charged with assault, inciting a riot and participating in a riot over her involvement in an anti-fascist demonstration at the California capitol more than a year ago.
posted by adamvasco at 9:41 AM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
It's becoming clear that the best way to keep your job in the Trump administration is to let Donnie do whatever the fuck he wants and bet that nobody else has the spine to do anything about it.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 9:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 9:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
As a resident of MA, should I call? If so, whom?
posted by AwkwardPause at 9:42 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by AwkwardPause at 9:42 AM on July 25, 2017
As a resident of MA, should I call? If so, whom?
Call Senators Warren and Markey, then call Governor Baker's office and urge him to make some furious, public statements against the Senate's shit sandwich of a bill.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Call Senators Warren and Markey, then call Governor Baker's office and urge him to make some furious, public statements against the Senate's shit sandwich of a bill.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
As the Republicans head to their caucus lunch before the vote, Margot Sanger-Katz has a helpful guide to what's next: Watching C-Span? Here’s How to Follow the Senate Health Care Debate. There are a lot more steps after a motion to proceed.
The latest plan might be to do the motion to proceed. If that passes, first vote on the 2015 repeal-lite, which will probably fail. Then BCRA with the Cruz and Portman amendments plus another $100B for Medicaid, which hasn't been scored by the CBO, so it's expected to take 60 votes, so that fails. Then they'll just start shotgunning amendments for a "skinny repeal": individual mandate, employer mandate, medical device tax. Making up a health care policy on the fly? YOLO, I guess. Then they'll to to conference with the House to actually figure out what they want.
The crazy part about all of this is that they've given up on most all of the tax cuts. This used to be about curtting health care for the poor to give a tax cut to the rich; now it's about blowing the health care system just because. At this point, they are so desperate to pass anything, they've completely given up on what that something even is.
Sen. Susan Collins on a hot mic:
The latest plan might be to do the motion to proceed. If that passes, first vote on the 2015 repeal-lite, which will probably fail. Then BCRA with the Cruz and Portman amendments plus another $100B for Medicaid, which hasn't been scored by the CBO, so it's expected to take 60 votes, so that fails. Then they'll just start shotgunning amendments for a "skinny repeal": individual mandate, employer mandate, medical device tax. Making up a health care policy on the fly? YOLO, I guess. Then they'll to to conference with the House to actually figure out what they want.
The crazy part about all of this is that they've given up on most all of the tax cuts. This used to be about curtting health care for the poor to give a tax cut to the rich; now it's about blowing the health care system just because. At this point, they are so desperate to pass anything, they've completely given up on what that something even is.
Sen. Susan Collins on a hot mic:
MALE SENATOR on FARENTHOLD: "You could beat the shit out of him." SUSAN COLLINS: "He's huge ... he's so unattractive, it's unbelievable."posted by zachlipton at 9:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
Guys, I'm scared.
Give yourself permission to do what you need to do to get through this. Step away from everything if you have to, including this thread and the news. Us watching 24/7 won't alter the events. And driving yourself into a panic won't either. Self-care is necessary when doing hard work.
If you need to talk to someone, call a crisis hotline or text 741-741. They will listen without judgment and try to get you to remember your coping strategies to get through this.
Please take care of yourselves. Don't burn out today. We need you in this fight long-term. (Also regardless of the fight, we like you and want you to be well.)
Please be kind to yourself and others today and everyday.
posted by greermahoney at 9:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [35 favorites]
Give yourself permission to do what you need to do to get through this. Step away from everything if you have to, including this thread and the news. Us watching 24/7 won't alter the events. And driving yourself into a panic won't either. Self-care is necessary when doing hard work.
If you need to talk to someone, call a crisis hotline or text 741-741. They will listen without judgment and try to get you to remember your coping strategies to get through this.
Please take care of yourselves. Don't burn out today. We need you in this fight long-term. (Also regardless of the fight, we like you and want you to be well.)
Please be kind to yourself and others today and everyday.
posted by greermahoney at 9:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [35 favorites]
The Hugh Hewitt Show via Mediaite: “You and I might be at odds with Eric Holder politically,” Scaramucci told Hewitt. “But one of the things I would give him a lot of credit for is that he was a pretty good hockey goalie for the president. He was also willing to help the president inside the bounds of the law. I’m not saying these guys did anything illegal. But when you think about the relationship John Kennedy had with his brother as Attorney General, or you think about the relationship the president had with Eric Holder — President Obama — [Trump and Sessions] probably don’t have that sort of relationship. And I think the president, when he thinks about the architecture of his Cabinet, I think he needs that sort of a relationship there.”
The White House Communications Director says the role of the Attorney General of the United States is to protect the President from legal trouble. He is mistaken. That would be the White House Counsel. The Attorney General has the role of upholding the Constitution, including where necessary protecting the country from the President's criminal actions.
Looking forward to a correction for that whoopsie!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:46 AM on July 25, 2017 [25 favorites]
The White House Communications Director says the role of the Attorney General of the United States is to protect the President from legal trouble. He is mistaken. That would be the White House Counsel. The Attorney General has the role of upholding the Constitution, including where necessary protecting the country from the President's criminal actions.
Looking forward to a correction for that whoopsie!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:46 AM on July 25, 2017 [25 favorites]
Call Senators Warren and Markey, then call Governor Baker's office and urge him to make some furious, public statements against the Senate's shit sandwich of a bill.
All three of those have already done so... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
posted by Talez at 9:46 AM on July 25, 2017
All three of those have already done so... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
posted by Talez at 9:46 AM on July 25, 2017
The 14 Most Inappropriate Moments From Trump’s Speech at the Boy Scout Jamboree
It seems the president had prepared a speech about letting “your scouting oath guide your path,” but his trademark asides and non sequiturs dominated the address. Here are Trump’s weird comments to his largely underage audience.posted by kirkaracha at 9:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
It seems the president had prepared a speech about letting “your scouting oath guide your path,” but his trademark asides and non sequiturs dominated the address. Here are Trump’s weird comments to his largely underage audience.
If he wants to look presidential the media and pundits have lowered the bar so low all he'd have to do is show up and not dribble shit out of his mouth like a fucking four year old.
HE CAN'T EVEN DO THAT.
posted by Talez at 9:48 AM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
If he wants to look presidential the media and pundits have lowered the bar so low all he'd have to do is show up and not dribble shit out of his mouth like a fucking four year old.
HE CAN'T EVEN DO THAT.
posted by Talez at 9:48 AM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
I feel like this gives some insight into Scaramucci's management style (Michael Short was Senior Assistant White House Press Secretary):
Tara Palmeri, Politico, 9:23am: SCOOP: Scaramucci to oust White House press aide Michael Short, offers ‘amnesty’ to others (story)
Dan Diamond, 10:05am: Michael Short: "No one has told me anything and the entire premise is false." Looks like Scaramucci is firing ppl without telling them first
Jonathan Swan, 12:43am: Text message just now from Michael Short: "I have resigned."
posted by zachlipton at 9:49 AM on July 25, 2017 [46 favorites]
Tara Palmeri, Politico, 9:23am: SCOOP: Scaramucci to oust White House press aide Michael Short, offers ‘amnesty’ to others (story)
Dan Diamond, 10:05am: Michael Short: "No one has told me anything and the entire premise is false." Looks like Scaramucci is firing ppl without telling them first
Jonathan Swan, 12:43am: Text message just now from Michael Short: "I have resigned."
posted by zachlipton at 9:49 AM on July 25, 2017 [46 favorites]
fine. tuned. machine.
posted by entropicamericana at 9:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [16 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 9:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [16 favorites]
> ‘I won't stop’: Jailed activist blasts US crackdown on anti-Trump protesters.
When Yvette Felarca exited her flight in Los Angeles, there were a dozen police officers waiting for her. The 47-year-old teacher was handcuffed, jailed, and later, to her shock, charged with assault, inciting a riot and participating in a riot over her involvement in an anti-fascist demonstration at the California capitol more than a year ago.
This is both terrifying and bizarre. Yvette Felarca and her little organization (By Any Means Necessary, or BAMN) are at like practically every Bay Area demonstration — but their roles in those demonstrations are:
So, it's terrifying that they're targeting leaders. But it's straight-up weird that they're targeting this particular leader, since her group is so marginal/silly.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
When Yvette Felarca exited her flight in Los Angeles, there were a dozen police officers waiting for her. The 47-year-old teacher was handcuffed, jailed, and later, to her shock, charged with assault, inciting a riot and participating in a riot over her involvement in an anti-fascist demonstration at the California capitol more than a year ago.
This is both terrifying and bizarre. Yvette Felarca and her little organization (By Any Means Necessary, or BAMN) are at like practically every Bay Area demonstration — but their roles in those demonstrations are:
- Running out in front of the group to make it seem like they're the organizers.
- Taking any opportunity to grab megaphones and then ramble at length through them.
So, it's terrifying that they're targeting leaders. But it's straight-up weird that they're targeting this particular leader, since her group is so marginal/silly.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
this Scaramucci guy has shown us that a person with a lengthy tweeted record of being a liberal democrat could probably get a job in the white house with enormous power to fuck things up and give Donald lots of rope to hang himself with just by kissing his ass really enthusiastically on TV
dear liberal pundits on TV: please try that. I hear there's an opening for AG coming up soon
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
dear liberal pundits on TV: please try that. I hear there's an opening for AG coming up soon
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
My only hope right now is that Trump eventually gets up on stage and says "Shame on you Red America for putting up with this for so long. My behavior should have had me impeached somewhere around day negative 100 but you're all so wrapped up in sports team politics you were willing to put The Republic in such obvious jeopardy and blindly support this behavior until the fall of it. Shame on all of you."
Chaos Theory says it's not technically impossible but fuck, right now it's about all the hope I have.
posted by Talez at 9:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Chaos Theory says it's not technically impossible but fuck, right now it's about all the hope I have.
posted by Talez at 9:52 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
They would cheer that, too.
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:54 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:54 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
(if you've ever been at a Bay Area demo and seen the real organizers take a megaphone away from someone while saying "okay, BAMN, that's enough BAMN for today, BAMN off the stage please, get off the stage, BAMN, get off the stage NOW." that's Felarca being given a talking-to.)
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:54 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:54 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Cameron Joseph at TPM: McConnell’s Emerging O’care Repeal Plan: Pass Anything, Punt To House!
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:54 AM on July 25, 2017 [33 favorites]
Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell’s (R-KY) big plan to keep his Obamacare repeal efforts alive on Tuesday might come down to passing a narrowly tailored bill with provisions that are broadly popular with Republicans, letting them get to a conference committee with House Republicans without having to make any hard decisions.McConnell has no plan. He does not know what he can really pass. This move is transparently, appallingly cynical. I don't understand how any elected Democrat can seriously call anyone who votes to proceed on this bill a "friend" or have any respect for them. How could one have enough respect for someone to be "friends" when pushing this homicidal travesty?
The plan being discussed among senators would be to get through a motion to proceed to full debate on the House-passed American Health Care Act. Then after every amendment fails — both a straight repeal of the law and the Senate-crafted replacement plan that have failed to get 50 Republicans onboard as well as any Democrats offer to put GOP senators on the spot — the Senate would vote for a “skinny” plan to effectively repeal the employer and individual health care mandates, as well as the unpopular medical device tax, GOP aides tell TPM. [...]
That’s far from a full repeal of the law, might not be workable policy in the real world, and doesn’t offer any clarity on what a final bill would look like. But it would buy Republican leadership time by getting into a full conference with the House and try to craft a repeal bill that could pass both chambers, taking the immediate pressure off of them to pass or fail on a bill on Tuesday.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:54 AM on July 25, 2017 [33 favorites]
Senate won't let Trump make recess appointments
While Republicans control the Senate now, the only way they can formally adjourn -- which would set up a period when recess appointments are allowable -- is to pass an adjournment resolution. The problem is that Democrats can filibuster that resolution, which they would do to prevent Trump from making recess appointments.
No recess replacement for Sessions may be the only good news of the day.
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [24 favorites]
While Republicans control the Senate now, the only way they can formally adjourn -- which would set up a period when recess appointments are allowable -- is to pass an adjournment resolution. The problem is that Democrats can filibuster that resolution, which they would do to prevent Trump from making recess appointments.
No recess replacement for Sessions may be the only good news of the day.
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [24 favorites]
.. So this is the "pass something and say they've repealed Obamacare" move, huh?
posted by suelac at 9:59 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by suelac at 9:59 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
T.D. Strange, I thought they tried that when Obama wanted to nominate a SCOTUS candidate during the "recess," but it didn't work.
posted by Melismata at 10:01 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by Melismata at 10:01 AM on July 25, 2017
a repeal bill that could pass both chambers
1. Barely pass House
2. Pass the Senate by 1 vote
3. ?????
4. Repeal Obamacare!
The whole thing with the House is that they knew they had a garbage bill but they decided the best they could do was punt that to the Senate to sort it out. The Senate has been unable to produce non-garbage. So the solution here is to combine all of these rabid weasels in one bag and that's going to be the thing that produces non-garbage? Do they hear themselves talk?
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:01 AM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
1. Barely pass House
2. Pass the Senate by 1 vote
3. ?????
4. Repeal Obamacare!
The whole thing with the House is that they knew they had a garbage bill but they decided the best they could do was punt that to the Senate to sort it out. The Senate has been unable to produce non-garbage. So the solution here is to combine all of these rabid weasels in one bag and that's going to be the thing that produces non-garbage? Do they hear themselves talk?
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:01 AM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Here's the fundamental problem with that plan if you're a Republican moderate in the Senate: how do you possibly believe that the bill will get better after it's been negotiated with a House run by Freedom Caucus crazies?
In any case, all of this is to remind you that this vote is the next step in a process, not the end of everything in and of itself. Whatever happens, we pick up the phones and start calling again after.
posted by zachlipton at 10:02 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
In any case, all of this is to remind you that this vote is the next step in a process, not the end of everything in and of itself. Whatever happens, we pick up the phones and start calling again after.
posted by zachlipton at 10:02 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
Now I'm wondering if the play here isn't to just ping-pong bills between the Senate and House forever, with each one voting over and over to "repeal Obamacare" but never actually agreeing with each other on what that means, and thus never sending anything to the president's desk that could be enacted into law and thus bite them in the ass by affecting reality.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 10:04 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 10:04 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Or Paul Ryan and Trump just bully the House into directly passing whatever steaming pile of shit the Senate passes, even though everyone agreed they would get a do over in conference. Why? Cause fuck america that's why.
posted by Glibpaxman at 10:06 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Glibpaxman at 10:06 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Senators on hot mic: Trump is ‘crazy,’ ‘I’m worried’
“I swear, [the Office of Management and Budget] just went through and whenever there was ‘grant,’ they just X it out,” Collins says. “With no measurement, no thinking about it, no metrics, no nothing. It’s just incredibly irresponsible.”posted by Talez at 10:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [66 favorites]
“Yes,” Reed replies. “I think — I think he’s crazy,” apparently referring to the president. “I mean, I don’t say that lightly and as a kind of a goofy guy.”
“I’m worried,” Collins replies.
“Sessions is totally pissed off about it,” said a Sessions ally familiar with his thinking. “It’s beyond insane. It’s cruel and it’s insane and it’s stupid.”
I legitimately cannot tell what the antecedent of any of the "it"s in the second part of that quote might be.
posted by Etrigan at 10:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I legitimately cannot tell what the antecedent of any of the "it"s in the second part of that quote might be.
posted by Etrigan at 10:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Senate won't let Trump make recess appointments
Thanks so much for sharing this! The Democrats are going to force it by filibustering any adjournment resolution. This makes Mueller's job a lot safer.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Thanks so much for sharing this! The Democrats are going to force it by filibustering any adjournment resolution. This makes Mueller's job a lot safer.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
I wish Susan Collins would sit as an Independent. I mean Jesus her party has effing left her, and Maine's known for being supportive of independents.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:09 AM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:09 AM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
2017 WRITERS: Plot twist! You're kinda rooting for Jeff Sessions now
PBO: come the fuck on
2017 WRITERS: I know, right? You still hate him but if he's mad at Trump, he might just have the leverage to take him down! He runs the justice department! It's like if Ramsay Bolton was the only guy who could defeat the Night King! Cool, right?
PBO: no just fuck Westeros entirely in that scenario. you can go straight to hell you know that
2017 WRITERS: so you're saying you want the Night King to take away everybody's health care, that's what you're saying
PBO: I am so tired of this enemy of my enemy shit, I had like 500% of my fill of it when I was happy about Ted Cruz's speech at the Republican convention and LOOK HOW THAT TURNED OUT
2017 WRITERS: just wait til you see what surprises we have in store for August!
PBO: NO
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [104 favorites]
PBO: come the fuck on
2017 WRITERS: I know, right? You still hate him but if he's mad at Trump, he might just have the leverage to take him down! He runs the justice department! It's like if Ramsay Bolton was the only guy who could defeat the Night King! Cool, right?
PBO: no just fuck Westeros entirely in that scenario. you can go straight to hell you know that
2017 WRITERS: so you're saying you want the Night King to take away everybody's health care, that's what you're saying
PBO: I am so tired of this enemy of my enemy shit, I had like 500% of my fill of it when I was happy about Ted Cruz's speech at the Republican convention and LOOK HOW THAT TURNED OUT
2017 WRITERS: just wait til you see what surprises we have in store for August!
PBO: NO
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [104 favorites]
She would get kicked off of all her committees.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 10:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Huffy Puffy at 10:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
“I think — I think he’s crazy,”
YA THINK??????
Every time someone is like, "Gosh guys, I don't want to talk out of turn here, and I'm no expert, but I think Trump might be [whispers] a little bit nuts" I want to go capslock freakout bonkers. WHO KNEW THIS GUY WHO HAS BEEN ACTING ERRATIC AND UNSTABLE AND GROSS FOR DECADES IS ACTUALLY ERRATIC, UNSTABLE AND GROSS???
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:12 AM on July 25, 2017 [50 favorites]
YA THINK??????
Every time someone is like, "Gosh guys, I don't want to talk out of turn here, and I'm no expert, but I think Trump might be [whispers] a little bit nuts" I want to go capslock freakout bonkers. WHO KNEW THIS GUY WHO HAS BEEN ACTING ERRATIC AND UNSTABLE AND GROSS FOR DECADES IS ACTUALLY ERRATIC, UNSTABLE AND GROSS???
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:12 AM on July 25, 2017 [50 favorites]
Or Paul Ryan and Trump just bully the House into directly passing whatever steaming pile of shit the Senate passes, even though everyone agreed they would get a do over in conference. Why? Cause fuck america that's why.
They've said once or twice they want to skip conference and ask the House to vote on whatever the Senate does (although this was back when "whatever the Senate does" = BCRA), and maybe they'll go with that still.
posted by notyou at 10:12 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
They've said once or twice they want to skip conference and ask the House to vote on whatever the Senate does (although this was back when "whatever the Senate does" = BCRA), and maybe they'll go with that still.
posted by notyou at 10:12 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
OK well hopefully those committee chairs are still comfortable when the republic blows itself up
I think they're going to need more padding.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:13 AM on July 25, 2017
I think they're going to need more padding.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:13 AM on July 25, 2017
David Fahrenthold on Twitter:
Just heard @TexasTribune has filed FOIAs asking if TX elected officials have spent state $ at @realDonaldTrump's DC hotel. Anybody else?
David Fahrenthold/other journos going after every Republican held state legislature is good news.
posted by Sophie1 at 10:13 AM on July 25, 2017 [51 favorites]
Just heard @TexasTribune has filed FOIAs asking if TX elected officials have spent state $ at @realDonaldTrump's DC hotel. Anybody else?
David Fahrenthold/other journos going after every Republican held state legislature is good news.
posted by Sophie1 at 10:13 AM on July 25, 2017 [51 favorites]
Trump Just Revealed Covert CIA Program Over Twitter
A chessmaster of kayfabe-ing this guy ain't. Making a nice X in a tic-tac-toe box is beyond his capabilities at this point.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 10:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [28 favorites]
A chessmaster of kayfabe-ing this guy ain't. Making a nice X in a tic-tac-toe box is beyond his capabilities at this point.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 10:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [28 favorites]
I legitimately cannot tell what the antecedent of any of the "it"s in the second part of that quote might be.
Sessions is angry that Trump is publicly criticizing him to the point of saying that he should never have nominated him.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Sessions is angry that Trump is publicly criticizing him to the point of saying that he should never have nominated him.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
So, it's terrifying that they're targeting leaders. But it's straight-up weird that they're targeting this particular leader, since her group is so marginal/silly.
It kind of sounds like you just made the case as to why other organizations might not jump up and come to their aid.
First they came for the organizers no one liked.
Does it still seem weird to you? That's a genuine question. I think I've got a decent hypothesis here but I think you're in a better position to tell me if it holds any water.
posted by VTX at 10:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
It kind of sounds like you just made the case as to why other organizations might not jump up and come to their aid.
First they came for the organizers no one liked.
Does it still seem weird to you? That's a genuine question. I think I've got a decent hypothesis here but I think you're in a better position to tell me if it holds any water.
posted by VTX at 10:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
They really are going to own it when the health insurance market implodes, half the insurance industry lays off white collar workers, and stories of pain and suffering caused by Republicans lead the news every single day.
I think the calculus is that the pendulum will have swung back by that point, so it can be blamed on the Democrats in the House/Senate/White House.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 10:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I think the calculus is that the pendulum will have swung back by that point, so it can be blamed on the Democrats in the House/Senate/White House.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 10:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
T.D. Strange, I thought they tried that when Obama wanted to nominate a SCOTUS candidate during the "recess," but it didn't work.
Opposite situations, Democrats had a minority then too, they could not force a recess, but they can force pro forma sessions by filibustering adornment. They can prevent a Republican President from making recess appointments, but not create a recess to allow a Democratic one to make recess appointments. In any case, a SCOTUS recess appointment makes little sense then or now, as they would not be permanent but only through the next Senate session. It'd barely be enough time to hear any cases.
Obama tried appointing some NLRB members during a pro forma session, arguing that a pro forma session was not a real session, and the Senate was really in recess. He lost that argument at the Supreme Court.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:19 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Opposite situations, Democrats had a minority then too, they could not force a recess, but they can force pro forma sessions by filibustering adornment. They can prevent a Republican President from making recess appointments, but not create a recess to allow a Democratic one to make recess appointments. In any case, a SCOTUS recess appointment makes little sense then or now, as they would not be permanent but only through the next Senate session. It'd barely be enough time to hear any cases.
Obama tried appointing some NLRB members during a pro forma session, arguing that a pro forma session was not a real session, and the Senate was really in recess. He lost that argument at the Supreme Court.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:19 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Trump Just Revealed Covert CIA Program Over Twitter
Again: gee, maybe tomorrow will be the day he'll stop hitting me.
posted by Melismata at 10:19 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Again: gee, maybe tomorrow will be the day he'll stop hitting me.
posted by Melismata at 10:19 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Y'all, I seriously tore a tendon trying to keep up with a teenager during cave exploration a few days ago. Which made for a scary two hours to get back out, I can tell you. I should be downing painkillers and elevating my foot while eating brownies and playing wow. Instead, like the old gymnast I am, I'm taping that shit up and taking the kids to the gym. I have so much rage and anxiety right now that I cannot sit down. The Republicans really want me to die. They expect me to lie down, and accept that I'm too expensive to be a valuable American.
But, since the revolutionary war, when my ancestor got on her horse, and rounded up 100 other women and children, and barricaded and held the family farm against the British soldiers, and the women in my family who have been in every war spot where nurses were needed, and the sheer volume of flags I own that graced the caskets of the men who laid down their lives protecting all that is good and just in our country, the republicans have another think coming if they think the last standing matriarch of my people is going down easily or quietly. This country has named forts after women in my family and battleships after the men.
Injuries be damned. I will fight them to my last breath. This is my country. This is your country. To Hell with anyone who would deliberately hurt her, and that includes treasonous traitors like the current regime. Prepare the barricades, I will not live and die in fear.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 10:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [91 favorites]
But, since the revolutionary war, when my ancestor got on her horse, and rounded up 100 other women and children, and barricaded and held the family farm against the British soldiers, and the women in my family who have been in every war spot where nurses were needed, and the sheer volume of flags I own that graced the caskets of the men who laid down their lives protecting all that is good and just in our country, the republicans have another think coming if they think the last standing matriarch of my people is going down easily or quietly. This country has named forts after women in my family and battleships after the men.
Injuries be damned. I will fight them to my last breath. This is my country. This is your country. To Hell with anyone who would deliberately hurt her, and that includes treasonous traitors like the current regime. Prepare the barricades, I will not live and die in fear.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 10:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [91 favorites]
Dara Lind/Vox: The real reason Jeff Sessions is putting up with Trump’s crap
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
At some point, Sessions might decide enough is enough. But the weeks of increasingly public rebukes he’s suffered raise questions about why he hasn’t already left. After all, it’s hard to imagine why someone would continue to serve a president who so openly demeans him and his running of his department.Meanwhile, Trump is trying to get Sessions to just quit on his own, even though Sessions is responsible for most of Trumps accomplishments to date, such as they are.
The answer is that Sessions isn’t in the Trump administration primarily to serve Donald Trump. He’s there to enact a robust — even aggressive — policy agenda, aimed at protecting police officers, cracking down on unauthorized immigrants, and using criminal justice policy to send a “tough on crime” message.
It’s an agenda that falls in line with the law-and-order populism Trump espoused before arriving in office (and, less frequently, during his presidency). But before it was “Trumpism,” it was Sessions-ism. And Sessions’s commitment to the policies that first attracted him to Donald Trump’s presidential campaign certainly appears to outstrip his commitment to President Donald Trump.
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
Has Sessions been fired for perjury yet? (No, and he won't be. Sorry, not a joke this time.)
posted by Yowser at 10:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Yowser at 10:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
So, it's terrifying that they're targeting leaders. But it's straight-up weird that they're targeting this particular leader, since her group is so marginal/silly.
It kind of sounds like you just made the case as to why other organizations might not jump up and come to their aid.
First they came for the organizers no one liked.
Also, it may just be that they're not very good at identifying actual leaders, so they take a look at a few pics and see this BAMN person at the front yelling loudest, and hey, there's your leader, go get her.
2017: The Grand "Malice vs. Incompetence vs. whynotboth.gif" Triple Threat Match
posted by Etrigan at 10:23 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
It kind of sounds like you just made the case as to why other organizations might not jump up and come to their aid.
First they came for the organizers no one liked.
Also, it may just be that they're not very good at identifying actual leaders, so they take a look at a few pics and see this BAMN person at the front yelling loudest, and hey, there's your leader, go get her.
2017: The Grand "Malice vs. Incompetence vs. whynotboth.gif" Triple Threat Match
posted by Etrigan at 10:23 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
congressional republicans don't want you to die; they want a tax cut for the rich and they just don't care if you die. you're collateral damage, acceptable losses.... you're not a real person to them unless you have a net-worth of at least 7 figures
posted by entropicamericana at 10:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 10:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
>> So, it's terrifying that they're targeting leaders. But it's straight-up weird that they're targeting this particular leader, since her group is so marginal/silly.
> It kind of sounds like you just made the case as to why other organizations might not jump up and come to their aid.
First they came for the organizers no one liked.
Does it still seem weird to you? That's a genuine question. I think I've got a decent hypothesis here but I think you're in a better position to tell me if it holds any water.
So I've been torn between two or three different thoughts:
1) Maybe the cops are so inept that they think BAMN's leadership is really important.
or
2) What you said — they do in fact know how to read activist communities, and think that BAMN can be fucked with with impunity.
or
3) (and this is where I get extra paranoid) They know that Felarca's people are kind of loons, they know that arresting her will elevate BAMN's status, and so they're trying to sabotage the movement by actively working to make a loony organization seem more important than it actually is.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
> It kind of sounds like you just made the case as to why other organizations might not jump up and come to their aid.
First they came for the organizers no one liked.
Does it still seem weird to you? That's a genuine question. I think I've got a decent hypothesis here but I think you're in a better position to tell me if it holds any water.
So I've been torn between two or three different thoughts:
1) Maybe the cops are so inept that they think BAMN's leadership is really important.
or
2) What you said — they do in fact know how to read activist communities, and think that BAMN can be fucked with with impunity.
or
3) (and this is where I get extra paranoid) They know that Felarca's people are kind of loons, they know that arresting her will elevate BAMN's status, and so they're trying to sabotage the movement by actively working to make a loony organization seem more important than it actually is.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
Regarding the Sessions and Trump "feud", the following also seems like a plausible explanation (from tweet by Sarah Kendzior):This is what I think is going on. Mueller is a real problem for both Sessions and Trump, but "feud" is to avoid appearance of consolidation.
posted by StrawberryPie at 10:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by StrawberryPie at 10:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
2300+ comments, 45 minutes to the first vote. Anybody working on a new thread? (I would but I'm on mobile rn.)
posted by Rhaomi at 10:28 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by Rhaomi at 10:28 AM on July 25, 2017
Maybe Trump thinks that if Sessions quits on his own that he won't have to pay unemployment.
posted by azpenguin at 10:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by azpenguin at 10:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
This is what I think is going on. Mueller is a real problem for both Sessions and Trump, but "feud" is to avoid appearance of consolidation.
Except thanks to his recusal, Sessions can't do shit about Mueller. So what sort of conspiracy/plan to get rid of him can Sessions be a part? I guess he could help Trump find a DAG or DOJ person who Trump could eventually fire enough people to reach to fire Mueller. But not sure that requires this level of supposed deception.
posted by chris24 at 10:29 AM on July 25, 2017
Except thanks to his recusal, Sessions can't do shit about Mueller. So what sort of conspiracy/plan to get rid of him can Sessions be a part? I guess he could help Trump find a DAG or DOJ person who Trump could eventually fire enough people to reach to fire Mueller. But not sure that requires this level of supposed deception.
posted by chris24 at 10:29 AM on July 25, 2017
For those of you like me who have (semi) sentient bags of slime as Senators who have approximately 0% chance of changing their minds, this encouragement: you are calling them to protest so that they do not mistake your silence for consent.
posted by emjaybee at 10:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [49 favorites]
posted by emjaybee at 10:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [49 favorites]
This is what I think is going on. Mueller is a real problem for both Sessions and Trump, but "feud" is to avoid appearance of consolidation
It is highly implausible that Trump is capable of a deception like that.
posted by Ella Fynoe at 10:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
It is highly implausible that Trump is capable of a deception like that.
posted by Ella Fynoe at 10:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
fwiw at this point I'm pretty sure every cop in the east bay has beaten the shit out of every member of BAMN at least once or twice. Maybe cops think one becomes a movement leader by taking a nightstick to the face; if so, BAMN and the cops are in full agreement about one thing, at least.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
The idea as I understand it is that since the only part of Sessions' recusal that isn't squishy is that he can't hire or fire the Russia prosecutor, he drops out in favor of somebody who doesn't have any known conflicts on the investigation so that person can fire Mueller. But he fakes a feud with Trump to justify resigning, avoiding a situation where the only apparent reason for Sessions to quit is to kill the Russia inquiry.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 10:32 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 10:32 AM on July 25, 2017
Senators on hot mic: Trump is ‘crazy,’ ‘I’m worried’
In the days of yore, this would have dominated the news cycle for days. Today it's just a bit of flotsam flowing by.
posted by diogenes at 10:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [52 favorites]
In the days of yore, this would have dominated the news cycle for days. Today it's just a bit of flotsam flowing by.
posted by diogenes at 10:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [52 favorites]
If Trump does fire Sessions, since reality is so unreal of late, I am hoping that it plays out like this:
Sessions receives a telegram at his house
SESSIONS:This better be something good, I don't have time to waste, I've got minorities to oppress and people's assets to seize.
He opens and reads the telegram
SESSIONS: "Dear Mr Snoisses Ffej, This telegram is to inform you that you're bigly fired. Sad! Your friend, DJT."
SESSIONS (glowering): Wow, that's real classy, firing me by tele-- wait, he didn't fire me, this is for some loser named Snoisses Ffej! Ha Ha Ha! I...oh no. I've been tricked into saying my name backwards, forcing me to return to my home dimension of racist Keebler elves! Curse you, Trump! Iiiiiiiiii'lllllll beeeee baaaaaack..."
He disappears into a dimensional portal...
Please, FSM, let it happen this way so that we at least get some entertainment out of this madness.
posted by lord_wolf at 10:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [27 favorites]
Sessions receives a telegram at his house
SESSIONS:This better be something good, I don't have time to waste, I've got minorities to oppress and people's assets to seize.
He opens and reads the telegram
SESSIONS: "Dear Mr Snoisses Ffej, This telegram is to inform you that you're bigly fired. Sad! Your friend, DJT."
SESSIONS (glowering): Wow, that's real classy, firing me by tele-- wait, he didn't fire me, this is for some loser named Snoisses Ffej! Ha Ha Ha! I...oh no. I've been tricked into saying my name backwards, forcing me to return to my home dimension of racist Keebler elves! Curse you, Trump! Iiiiiiiiii'lllllll beeeee baaaaaack..."
He disappears into a dimensional portal...
Please, FSM, let it happen this way so that we at least get some entertainment out of this madness.
posted by lord_wolf at 10:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [27 favorites]
But he fakes a feud with Trump to justify resigning, avoiding a situation where the only apparent reason for Sessions to quit is to kill the Russia inquiry.
There is no way in hell that Trump doesn't brag about that and/or some intermediary doesn't squeal about it during the obstruction trials, and Sessions would know that.
posted by Etrigan at 10:37 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
There is no way in hell that Trump doesn't brag about that and/or some intermediary doesn't squeal about it during the obstruction trials, and Sessions would know that.
posted by Etrigan at 10:37 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
The idea of Sessions and Trump making this feud up doesn't quite get past Occam's Razor for me.
posted by azpenguin at 10:41 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by azpenguin at 10:41 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
This is what I think is going on. Mueller is a real problem for both Sessions and Trump, but "feud" is to avoid appearance of consolidation.
I really think you're massively overestimating the Mad Plotting Skillz and Super Ability to Keep Sekritz of the ongoing trainwreck that is our Commander in Chief.
posted by zarq at 10:41 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
I really think you're massively overestimating the Mad Plotting Skillz and Super Ability to Keep Sekritz of the ongoing trainwreck that is our Commander in Chief.
posted by zarq at 10:41 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
Mueller is a real problem for both Sessions and Trump, but "feud" is to avoid appearance of consolidation.
I'm dubious about any theory which suggests strategy on Trump's part. Seriously, he is that bizarre, grotesque rarity: a dishonest person utterly devoid of guile. He lies and bullshits constantly, but he honestly never seems to be thinking past the next 2 minutes or building any sort of useful scaffolding of lies to achieve aims. He says whatever either (a) makes him feel good to say, or (b) he thinks will earn the admiration of those to whom he's talking, thus making him feel good. It's why he tells mutually contradictory lies: they're for different audiences and he doesn't bother to think about how they build a cohesive whole. He's always been like this: it's not like he relied on any sort of clever bafflegab back when he was stiffing contractors, he just did whatever seemed most convenient in the moment both when he hired them and when he decided not to pay them. It's irritating how well it works, but don't mistake it for any sort of cleverness.
posted by jackbishop at 10:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
I'm dubious about any theory which suggests strategy on Trump's part. Seriously, he is that bizarre, grotesque rarity: a dishonest person utterly devoid of guile. He lies and bullshits constantly, but he honestly never seems to be thinking past the next 2 minutes or building any sort of useful scaffolding of lies to achieve aims. He says whatever either (a) makes him feel good to say, or (b) he thinks will earn the admiration of those to whom he's talking, thus making him feel good. It's why he tells mutually contradictory lies: they're for different audiences and he doesn't bother to think about how they build a cohesive whole. He's always been like this: it's not like he relied on any sort of clever bafflegab back when he was stiffing contractors, he just did whatever seemed most convenient in the moment both when he hired them and when he decided not to pay them. It's irritating how well it works, but don't mistake it for any sort of cleverness.
posted by jackbishop at 10:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
Politico: House Democrats sank two key bills on the House floor Monday, embarrassing Republican leaders who were banking on the noncontroversial legislation sailing through.
posted by Chrysostom at 10:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [50 favorites]
posted by Chrysostom at 10:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [50 favorites]
lord_wolf: unfortunately, I think Sessions is far closer to the "Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomrrow?" Mxyzptlk.
[spoiler for 31-year-old comic] Nalbar unir n fcner Cunagbz Mbar cebwrpgbe unaql?[/spolier]
posted by hanov3r at 10:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
[spoiler for 31-year-old comic] Nalbar unir n fcner Cunagbz Mbar cebwrpgbe unaql?[/spolier]
posted by hanov3r at 10:42 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Ivanka lawyers up.
That's kind of a weird way to frame Ivanka and her husband getting a lawyer when the husband just testified to a Senate committee.
posted by Etrigan at 10:43 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
That's kind of a weird way to frame Ivanka and her husband getting a lawyer when the husband just testified to a Senate committee.
posted by Etrigan at 10:43 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Ivanka lawyers up
Swear to god I was just going to (facetiously) ask what Ivanka's been up to. So was that the first phone call Jared made? "Hey babe, we wrapped up here. Lawyer up."
posted by Room 641-A at 10:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Swear to god I was just going to (facetiously) ask what Ivanka's been up to. So was that the first phone call Jared made? "Hey babe, we wrapped up here. Lawyer up."
posted by Room 641-A at 10:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
How's Melania's anti-cyberbullying campaign going?
posted by kirkaracha at 10:48 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 10:48 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
This is not a drill.
Senator Warren sounding the alarm about the imminent vote from what appears to be an underground passage.
posted by diogenes at 10:49 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Senator Warren sounding the alarm about the imminent vote from what appears to be an underground passage.
posted by diogenes at 10:49 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Of 570 key positions requiring Senate confirmation…
No nominee: 357
Awaiting nomination: 18
Formally nominated: 145
Confirmed: 50
posted by kirkaracha at 10:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
No nominee: 357
Awaiting nomination: 18
Formally nominated: 145
Confirmed: 50
posted by kirkaracha at 10:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
maybe we should start a pool on which one of king donnie's people is going to stick the knife in his back first
posted by pyramid termite at 10:51 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by pyramid termite at 10:51 AM on July 25, 2017
Report that Heller will vote yes on the MTP.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:53 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:53 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
That's kind of a weird way to frame Ivanka and her husband getting a lawyer when the husband just testified to a Senate committee.
IANAL but doesn't it matter as to privilege and other things whether someone is officially a client of an attorney? Jared's had a lawyer. This lawyer is the first time we've officially had someone - with Jared or not - representing Ivanka regarding Russia.
posted by chris24 at 10:53 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
IANAL but doesn't it matter as to privilege and other things whether someone is officially a client of an attorney? Jared's had a lawyer. This lawyer is the first time we've officially had someone - with Jared or not - representing Ivanka regarding Russia.
posted by chris24 at 10:53 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
North Korea could cross ICBM threshold next year, U.S. officials warn in new assessment
posted by kirkaracha at 10:55 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
North Korea will be able to field a reliable, nuclear-capable intercontinental ballistic missile as early as next year, U.S. officials have concluded in a confidential assessment that dramatically shrinks the timeline for when Pyongyang could strike North American cities with atomic weapons.Mein Führer! I can walk!
posted by kirkaracha at 10:55 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
maybe we should start a pool on which one of king donnie's people is going to stick the knife in his back first
et tu priebus
posted by entropicamericana at 10:57 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
et tu priebus
posted by entropicamericana at 10:57 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
That's kind of a weird way to frame Ivanka and her husband getting a lawyer when the husband just testified to a Senate committee.
Obligatory:
You can't try a husband and wife for the same crime.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 10:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Didn't Gorelick quit last...week?
posted by TWinbrook8 at 10:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by TWinbrook8 at 10:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
538 is live blogging the healthcare votes(s).
posted by Chrysostom at 10:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Chrysostom at 10:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
> I thought Jamie Gorelick was representing her.
Gorelick noped out of representing the Kushners a little while back... I want to say it was about a week ago, but the time dilation effect of living through a fascist coup makes making time estimates difficult.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:59 AM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Gorelick noped out of representing the Kushners a little while back... I want to say it was about a week ago, but the time dilation effect of living through a fascist coup makes making time estimates difficult.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:59 AM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Ivanka and her husband getting a lawyer
I would have gone for counsel separate and independent from my maybe-in-trouble spouse. Maybe their interests are one and the same, but chances are they're not, and you would need independent counsel just to tell you even that. But hey, what do I know?
posted by Capt. Renault at 11:00 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
I would have gone for counsel separate and independent from my maybe-in-trouble spouse. Maybe their interests are one and the same, but chances are they're not, and you would need independent counsel just to tell you even that. But hey, what do I know?
posted by Capt. Renault at 11:00 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Maggie Harberman tweeted earlier that her sources in the WH say that the reason Trump is tormenting Sessions rather than just firing him is "because he can."
*turns on sociopath-o-meter* Yep, checks out.
Trump is a wimp. He doesn't fire people because he doesn't like the confrontation.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 11:01 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
*turns on sociopath-o-meter* Yep, checks out.
Trump is a wimp. He doesn't fire people because he doesn't like the confrontation.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 11:01 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
The "skinny repeal" option (just repealing the mandates and med device tax) might not pass reconciliation rules.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:02 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by Chrysostom at 11:02 AM on July 25, 2017
If Paul and Heller are both YES, then the MTP passes.
posted by Justinian at 11:04 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by Justinian at 11:04 AM on July 25, 2017
Portman is also a yes. Strap in.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:06 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:06 AM on July 25, 2017
I'm actually not sure about a general strike, because a lot of people can't strike.
What the...
If you can strike, then it's not actually a strike, it's like... an unpaid vacation or something. Strikes are things people literally put their lives on the line for. They were beaten and murdered. If a fundamental undermining of democracy isn't enough to be worth a real strike I don't know what would be.
posted by Justinian at 11:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
What the...
If you can strike, then it's not actually a strike, it's like... an unpaid vacation or something. Strikes are things people literally put their lives on the line for. They were beaten and murdered. If a fundamental undermining of democracy isn't enough to be worth a real strike I don't know what would be.
posted by Justinian at 11:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
Portman's a yes as well. Motion to proceed murdering Americans quicker is all but confirmed.
posted by zombieflanders at 11:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 11:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Like there's something not quite legal about that situation.
Not quite legal... about changing a vote? There is nothing here that isn't explained by political cowardice and Josh Marshall's mantra of "Republican moderates always cave."
posted by Justinian at 11:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Not quite legal... about changing a vote? There is nothing here that isn't explained by political cowardice and Josh Marshall's mantra of "Republican moderates always cave."
posted by Justinian at 11:07 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
It's definitely happening. I'm just very unclear on what "it" is.
posted by diogenes at 11:08 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 11:08 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Having a win is more important than what's being won to these monsters
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:09 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:09 AM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
You're in the same boat as everyone that's going to be voting on it, diogenes.
posted by zombieflanders at 11:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 11:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Axios: Scaramucci: Trump "probably" wants Sessions gone
posted by zachlipton at 11:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Anthony Scaramucci, the new White House communications director, shared his thoughts on the Trump-Jeff Sessions drama during an interview with Hugh Hewitt this morning. When asked if it's clear that Trump wants Sessions out of the White House, he told Hewitt "you're probably right," ultimately confirming the tension between the two is not getting any better.This removes pretty much any doubt that Scaramucci is not going to be doing the job of a Communications Director; he's going to be mini-Trump.
"I have an enormous amount of respect for the Attorney General, but I do know the president pretty well," Scaramucci said, "and if there's this level of tension in the relationship that, that's public, you're probably right."
Although he added he didn't want to speak for the President on this, his next question to Hewitt was telling: "Are you available to be the Attorney General?"
posted by zachlipton at 11:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
It's definitely happening. I'm just very unclear on what "it" is.
I love roller-coasters, personally, but I think I finally understand the plight of someone who hates them but got pressured into going on the biggest one and now they're almost to the top and the weight of the cars in front is starting to make the train accelerate and
oh god oh god it's happening
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
I love roller-coasters, personally, but I think I finally understand the plight of someone who hates them but got pressured into going on the biggest one and now they're almost to the top and the weight of the cars in front is starting to make the train accelerate and
oh god oh god it's happening
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:10 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
For those of you like me who have (semi) sentient bags of slime as Senators who have approximately 0% chance of changing their minds, this encouragement: you are calling them to protest so that they do not mistake your silence for consent.
This is a good reason but at this point I am doing it just to troll them and make sure they know that I think they are trash with no redeeming features.
posted by winna at 11:11 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
This is a good reason but at this point I am doing it just to troll them and make sure they know that I think they are trash with no redeeming features.
posted by winna at 11:11 AM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Senator Warren sounding the alarm about the imminent vote from what appears to be an underground passage.
Come on, Dems. Optics! The "video from her cave in Afghanistan" jokes practically write themselves. I think it's maybe a corridor to the (neat-o) Capitol subway, though?
posted by Sys Rq at 11:11 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Come on, Dems. Optics! The "video from her cave in Afghanistan" jokes practically write themselves. I think it's maybe a corridor to the (neat-o) Capitol subway, though?
posted by Sys Rq at 11:11 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
diogenes: "It's definitely happening. I'm just very unclear on what "it" is."
A horrifyingly sadistic and yet strangely clownish monster that's responsible for the deaths of countless innocents.
Alternatively, a 1986 novel by Stephen King.
posted by Rhaomi at 11:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [27 favorites]
A horrifyingly sadistic and yet strangely clownish monster that's responsible for the deaths of countless innocents.
Alternatively, a 1986 novel by Stephen King.
posted by Rhaomi at 11:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [27 favorites]
My opinion is that senators issuing panicked phone livestream videos from underground cinderblock hallways is a pretty fair assessment of where our political situation is at
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:14 AM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
About the only thing I see to feel better about today is that the full-on Repeal-And-Go-Fuck-Yourself semi-repeal appears DOA. I don't know when "most of you are going to die!" became a bright side when compared to "all of you are going to die!" but here we are.
posted by Justinian at 11:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Justinian at 11:15 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
This removes pretty much any doubt that Scaramucci is not going to be doing the job of a Communications Director; he's going to be mini-Trump.
Since "The White House" ceased to exist as a coherent entity six months ago, this might actually be a improvement in terms of communicating useful information about the administration's policies and goals, such as they are.
posted by theodolite at 11:16 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Since "The White House" ceased to exist as a coherent entity six months ago, this might actually be a improvement in terms of communicating useful information about the administration's policies and goals, such as they are.
posted by theodolite at 11:16 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I would have gone for counsel separate and independent from my maybe-in-trouble spouse. Maybe their interests are one and the same, but chances are they're not, and you would need independent counsel just to tell you even that. But hey, what do I know?
There is nothing more beautiful, sentimental, and heart-tugging than that tender moment when people who were certain that as friends, lovers, relatives, co-conspirators, etc. they were of one mind, twin halves of a sundered soul, 100% on the same page realize belatedly that their other half sold (or will soon sell) them the fuck out, and they'd better get their own attorney posthaste. I'm so, so looking forward to Ivanka and Jared getting to experience this joy firsthand.
It's almost as cute as the "surely we can get through this divorce settlement without representation" scenario.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:19 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
There is nothing more beautiful, sentimental, and heart-tugging than that tender moment when people who were certain that as friends, lovers, relatives, co-conspirators, etc. they were of one mind, twin halves of a sundered soul, 100% on the same page realize belatedly that their other half sold (or will soon sell) them the fuck out, and they'd better get their own attorney posthaste. I'm so, so looking forward to Ivanka and Jared getting to experience this joy firsthand.
It's almost as cute as the "surely we can get through this divorce settlement without representation" scenario.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:19 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
About the only thing I see to feel better about today is that the full-on Repeal-And-Go-Fuck-Yourself semi-repeal appears DOA. I don't know when "most of you are going to die!" became a bright side when compared to "all of you are going to die!" but here we are.
I still don't really understand how anything can meet reconciliation rules if there's no actual independent cost estimates for any of the amendments (let alone, of course, estimates on how theywill won't work together).
Is that just a thing we're all pretending to ignore now? Or do I just not understand how any of this works?
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:19 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
I still don't really understand how anything can meet reconciliation rules if there's no actual independent cost estimates for any of the amendments (let alone, of course, estimates on how they
Is that just a thing we're all pretending to ignore now? Or do I just not understand how any of this works?
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:19 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
If Heller is really a yes I hope he sells his soul and gets voted out next election. Fuck. I might even move to Nevada to help do it myself.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Room 641-A at 11:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
The Senate is returning to the floor.
C-SPAN feed
WSJ liveblog
NYT live vote tracker
538 liveblog
My health care twitter list
posted by zachlipton at 11:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
C-SPAN feed
WSJ liveblog
NYT live vote tracker
538 liveblog
My health care twitter list
posted by zachlipton at 11:20 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
They Know Exactly What They're Voting On
But of course they know what they’re voting on. If the Senate can muster the 50-member majority necessary to proceed, there is no scenario in which any bill that’s debated or passed will do anything other than reduce the number of people with access to decent health insurance that actually covers necessary care in this country. They are voting to take something vitally necessary away from millions of people. The suffering is a given—the only mystery is in the margins: How many people, precisely, will be harmed.posted by tonycpsu at 11:22 AM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
> The suffering is a given—the only mystery is in the margins: How many people, precisely, will be harmed.
"A million here, a million there, pretty soon you're talking *real* suffering!"
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
"A million here, a million there, pretty soon you're talking *real* suffering!"
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Schumer is up--says that the American people have not been treated to a high minded debate or any debate all. He says that the Reconciliation process has locked out Democrats and that Healthcare would be a partisan process undertaken only by Republicans. He notes that McConnell has by-passed the committee process, inhibiting the minority for amend or read the bill that was written in secret. The whole plan was to keep the bill secret and jam the bill through on a party line. He inotes that 1/6th of the economy and 10s of millions of lives without any idea of what theyre debating. The best McConnell's been able to come up with has been a vague promise to pass anything to get to a House and Senate conference. Schumer says that the most likely consequence of a conference would be a full repeal of the ACA, and a reversal of all the progress.
He now appealing to those who care about not cutting Medicaid. He's demanding t that they not go along because the result WILL be the decimation our healthcare and that those so-called moderates know exactly what will happen if the MTP passes. He is laying the responsibility on those who vote for the MTP. He says that the Democrats want to work through regular order. He says that we can work together. He is demanding that they turn back now. He says that millions of Americans will be irreversibly harmed.
I will not summarize that traitor McConnell's verbal diarrhea.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [44 favorites]
He now appealing to those who care about not cutting Medicaid. He's demanding t that they not go along because the result WILL be the decimation our healthcare and that those so-called moderates know exactly what will happen if the MTP passes. He is laying the responsibility on those who vote for the MTP. He says that the Democrats want to work through regular order. He says that we can work together. He is demanding that they turn back now. He says that millions of Americans will be irreversibly harmed.
I will not summarize that traitor McConnell's verbal diarrhea.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:24 AM on July 25, 2017 [44 favorites]
Per 538: Capito, Johnson, Moran, Murkowski, Lee are uncommitted.
On preview, fuck Capito.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
On preview, fuck Capito.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
McConnell: "Having been given the responsibility to govern, we have a duty to act."
posted by Rykey at 11:25 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by Rykey at 11:25 AM on July 25, 2017
In my fantasy land, when it's McCain's turn to vote, he tears his shirt off to reveal a Stronger Together T-shirt underneath, then cold-cocks Mitch McConnell and spray-paints "DNC" on his back.
posted by uncleozzy at 11:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by uncleozzy at 11:25 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Man, I couldn't be a senator and listen to McConnell give this speech (encouraging a YES vote on the MTP) and not shout 'That's Bullshit and you know it' at him every other sentence.
posted by TwoWordReview at 11:26 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by TwoWordReview at 11:26 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
An 80 year old white man receiving life - saving health care on the government's dime then rushing back to DC to vote that other people won't be able to receive the same help he did is as perfect a metaphor for Republican ideology as I can imagine.
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [108 favorites]
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:27 AM on July 25, 2017 [108 favorites]
In my fantasy land, when it's McCain's turn to vote, he tears his shirt off to reveal a Stronger Together T-shirt underneath, then cold-cocks Mitch McConnell and spray-paints "DNC" on his back.
I'll never understand the urge to mythologize John McCain. The man is a piece of shit.
posted by Existential Dread at 11:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [51 favorites]
I'll never understand the urge to mythologize John McCain. The man is a piece of shit.
posted by Existential Dread at 11:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [51 favorites]
McCain’s return sets stage for big Senate health bill vote
Dying bitter old man vows not to go alone, to take thousands of innocents with him.
posted by JackFlash at 11:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [36 favorites]
Dying bitter old man vows not to go alone, to take thousands of innocents with him.
posted by JackFlash at 11:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [36 favorites]
I believe Collins and Murkowski will vote no, all others yes. So it'll pass.
posted by Justinian at 11:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Justinian at 11:28 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
If they vote to proceed, and the Democrats can concoct an amendment so fiendish that three Republican senators are compelled to vote for it... that would be something.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:29 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:29 AM on July 25, 2017
Protestors in the Senate: "Kill the Bill! Don't kill us!"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
Oh Christ, and after the MTP vote, they're going to give Brave Cancer Hero McCain 15 minutes to talk, so he can milk his sad diagnosis in favor of passing some bullshit.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
chants of "kill the bill, don't kill us" erupt from the gallery as MTP vote is called
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 11:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 11:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
As I said before, I cannot understand how Schumer can call any one of them "friend", especially after this vote. How can one be friends with such morally bankrupt people.
Loving the shouts of courageous protestors shouting "Kill the Bill!" and "Shame!"
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
Loving the shouts of courageous protestors shouting "Kill the Bill!" and "Shame!"
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:30 AM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
The proceedings being interrupted by protesters is glorious.
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 11:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [31 favorites]
posted by joseph conrad is fully awesome at 11:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [31 favorites]
It's been going on for about a minute. They've switched to "Shame! Shame!".
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
I'll never understand the urge to mythologize John McCain. The man is a piece of shit.
To be clear: I know what he's going to do, I have zero sympathy for him, even as a fellow human, and it is inappropriate to express, in public, the things I wish for him.
But he's the only one who makes sense as Hulk Hogan, here.
posted by uncleozzy at 11:31 AM on July 25, 2017
To be clear: I know what he's going to do, I have zero sympathy for him, even as a fellow human, and it is inappropriate to express, in public, the things I wish for him.
But he's the only one who makes sense as Hulk Hogan, here.
posted by uncleozzy at 11:31 AM on July 25, 2017
They've cleared the protestors out of the gallery, but you can still hear them shouting outside the chamber, loud and clear.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
An 80 year old white man receiving life - saving health care on the government's dime then rushing back to DC to vote that other people won't be able to receive the same help he did is as perfect a metaphor for Republican ideology as I can imagine.
It's a stunning metaphor for sure and the fact that it's McCain makes it even more perfect, but let's not confuse things. It's not life saving. The man has glioblastoma and that's a death sentence. So he's using his last days to fuck over the entire nation.
What a goddamn hero.
posted by elsietheeel at 11:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [60 favorites]
It's a stunning metaphor for sure and the fact that it's McCain makes it even more perfect, but let's not confuse things. It's not life saving. The man has glioblastoma and that's a death sentence. So he's using his last days to fuck over the entire nation.
What a goddamn hero.
posted by elsietheeel at 11:31 AM on July 25, 2017 [60 favorites]
In my fantasy land, when it's McCain's turn to vote, he tears his shirt off to reveal a Stronger Together T-shirt underneath, then cold-cocks Mitch McConnell and spray-paints "DNC" on his back.
I'll never understand the urge to mythologize John McCain. The man is a piece of shit.
Well, yeah, but so's Hulk Hogan.
posted by Etrigan at 11:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
I'll never understand the urge to mythologize John McCain. The man is a piece of shit.
Well, yeah, but so's Hulk Hogan.
posted by Etrigan at 11:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Yeah, McCain deserves to be called nothing but a murderer if he votes for whatever monstrosity comes out of this mess. Anybody who bleats about his time as a POW or how we should still honor his service is just helping him get away with it.
posted by zombieflanders at 11:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by zombieflanders at 11:32 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Is there any chance he would pull a real maverick and vote "no", though?
posted by mefireader at 11:33 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by mefireader at 11:33 AM on July 25, 2017
"no."
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 11:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 11:33 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Is there any chance he would pull a real maverick and vote "no", though?
No
posted by Existential Dread at 11:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
No
posted by Existential Dread at 11:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Is there any chance he would pull a real maverick and vote "no", though?
*peals of laughter*
posted by entropicamericana at 11:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
*peals of laughter*
posted by entropicamericana at 11:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
If you're religious then McCain getting a diagnosis of terminal fucking brain cancer right before this vote should have been as strong a sign as you could possibly expect that God would like the Republican Party to kindly knock this shit off, and yet.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [31 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [31 favorites]
Is there any chance he would pull a real maverick and vote "no", though?
He could suffer a neurological event and do so by mistake, I guess.
posted by jedicus at 11:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
He could suffer a neurological event and do so by mistake, I guess.
posted by jedicus at 11:34 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
There's going to be some ugly footage of whatever it took to get those protestors out of there.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 11:35 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by A Terrible Llama at 11:35 AM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Anyone who brings up how great of a patriot McCain is due to his Vietnam service can plainly stuff it. He's voting to kill tens of thousands of his countrymen. John McCain is no patriot.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 11:35 AM on July 25, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by Mister Fabulous at 11:35 AM on July 25, 2017 [21 favorites]
Did they kick out the protesters? They stopped chanting.
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:36 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:36 AM on July 25, 2017
Lee is a yes, Murkowski a no.
posted by zachlipton at 11:36 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by zachlipton at 11:36 AM on July 25, 2017
Looks like some shouting is going on.
posted by rc3spencer at 11:36 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by rc3spencer at 11:36 AM on July 25, 2017
He could suffer a neurological event and do so by mistake, I guess.
The Republicans wouldn't stand for it. They would blame the cancer and change his vote. I can see it.
posted by greermahoney at 11:36 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
The Republicans wouldn't stand for it. They would blame the cancer and change his vote. I can see it.
posted by greermahoney at 11:36 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
But he's the only one who makes sense as Hulk Hogan, here.
YEAH BUT WHOSE SIDE IS HE ON?
posted by The Notorious SRD at 11:37 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
YEAH BUT WHOSE SIDE IS HE ON?
posted by The Notorious SRD at 11:37 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Since we're probably getting a motion to proceed, would McTurtle push a vote on the bill through today as well?
posted by pxe2000 at 11:38 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by pxe2000 at 11:38 AM on July 25, 2017
If they vote to proceed, and the Democrats can concoct an amendment so fiendish that three Republican senators are compelled to vote for it... that would be something.
I bet Collins, Murkowski, and possibly Capito would go for an "all Congresspersons must be covered by (and ONLY by) the least comprehensive option in whatever healthcare plan they pass" amendment.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I bet Collins, Murkowski, and possibly Capito would go for an "all Congresspersons must be covered by (and ONLY by) the least comprehensive option in whatever healthcare plan they pass" amendment.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
If you ever, ever, for a single second think a Republican politician will do the courageous, moral thing that benefits more people than it harms, remember: you will always be wrong. I don't know why we keep extending them the benefit of the doubt, I don't know why we keep hoping they'll demonstrate some shred of moral courage, when they have failed to do so at every single fucking turn. To expect them to be better is the dynamics of abuse talking. "He'll do better, I know he will! It's just that he was drunk/upset/got a lot of calls from his donors. Next time he won't hurt me!" No. They will always hurt you. Stop expecting otherwise.
posted by yasaman at 11:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [55 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 11:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [55 favorites]
Collins and Murkowski the only R nos.
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:38 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Pretty much comes down to RonJohn and McCain at this point.
Since we're probably getting a motion to proceed, would McTurtle push a vote on the bill through today as well?
No. They can't do that. There's also no bill, it's a wide range of proposals at this point. Here's a good summary to the process after a motion to proceed.
posted by zachlipton at 11:39 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Since we're probably getting a motion to proceed, would McTurtle push a vote on the bill through today as well?
No. They can't do that. There's also no bill, it's a wide range of proposals at this point. Here's a good summary to the process after a motion to proceed.
posted by zachlipton at 11:39 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
How long does voting stay open?
posted by He Is Only The Imposter at 11:40 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by He Is Only The Imposter at 11:40 AM on July 25, 2017
fuck these fucking craven evil selfish fucks
posted by localhuman at 11:41 AM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by localhuman at 11:41 AM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
Republicans yet to vote: Inhofe (OK), McCain (AZ), Sullivan (AK), Johnson (WI)
edit abuse: Sullivan is a yes
posted by pjenks at 11:41 AM on July 25, 2017
edit abuse: Sullivan is a yes
posted by pjenks at 11:41 AM on July 25, 2017
No. They can't do that. There's also no bill, it's a wide range of proposals at this point. Here's a good summary to the process after a motion to proceed.
What I can't tell from this link is, does the '20 hours of debate' portion start right after the ‘motion to proceed’ part, or at some later date?
posted by showbiz_liz at 11:42 AM on July 25, 2017
What I can't tell from this link is, does the '20 hours of debate' portion start right after the ‘motion to proceed’ part, or at some later date?
posted by showbiz_liz at 11:42 AM on July 25, 2017
Much as I'm furious with the people who continually send these evil morlocks to the Congress and White House, I really want us and those folks to all have good healthcare, schools, public services, and a strong social safety net because we're all are human.
Tragedy unfolding before mine eyes today.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:43 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Tragedy unfolding before mine eyes today.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:43 AM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
McCain's waiting to be the final AYE vote, isnt' he?
posted by TwoWordReview at 11:43 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by TwoWordReview at 11:43 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I fucking DO NOT CARE ONE BIT about what the fuck John McCain has to say. This entire public circus show is such a goddamn scam-Jason Chaffetz pulled the same exact shit, popping back in last second to vote to fuck the rest of the country over. Anything honorable McCain has ever done in his life has been completely obliterated by his voting record over the last 8 years.
posted by hollygoheavy at 11:43 AM on July 25, 2017 [36 favorites]
posted by hollygoheavy at 11:43 AM on July 25, 2017 [36 favorites]
YEAH BUT WHOSE SIDE IS HE ON?
Fun fact (because we're desperately in need of fun): Bobby Heenan almost got fired for that line. They hadn't told him what was going to happen (which was standard WCW practice), so he naturally figured that Hogan would Save The Day and was being a good heel commentator. Bischoff was pissed that Heenan maybe almost blew the swerve.
posted by Etrigan at 11:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Fun fact (because we're desperately in need of fun): Bobby Heenan almost got fired for that line. They hadn't told him what was going to happen (which was standard WCW practice), so he naturally figured that Hogan would Save The Day and was being a good heel commentator. Bischoff was pissed that Heenan maybe almost blew the swerve.
posted by Etrigan at 11:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Mod note: Several comments deleted. Stop it with the deathwish stuff, and in general anything graphically gory, competing to say the worst thing you can think of, etc.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 11:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 11:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
There's going to be some ugly footage of whatever it took to get those protestors out of there.
If, heaven forfend, they get some piece of shit together that they actually have votes to pass, I expect to see the Capitol surrounded by riot police and/or National Guard.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
If, heaven forfend, they get some piece of shit together that they actually have votes to pass, I expect to see the Capitol surrounded by riot police and/or National Guard.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
NYC Mefites: Trump is coming to Long Island on Friday to demagogue the recent arrests of MS13 gang members for the murder of four people in March in Suffolk County. Likely location to be in Brentwood, where killings occurred. It was a terrible crime but Sessions has already visited to exploit the arrests for politics and now Trump wants in on it so he can boast about rounding up bad hombres. Can we get a few thousand NYC folks out there? No word yet on planned protests.
Brentwood is over 50% Latino. Many families there have been begging the police to take action against the gang, saying that members are terrorizing their neighborhoods. It's been on the local news here for months.
The bodies of those four young men were so severely hacked by machetes that the authorities refused to show their families the bodies. Their parents and grandparents were asked to identify the victims by watching a video the police took at the scene. And from all reports, the bodies themselves were completely unrecognizable.
More than 15 gang members have been arrested and charged for quadruple homicide, including 6 juveniles.
Your own mileage on this may vary, but personally I don't think visiting the hometown of those murdered children to stage a political protest against Trump is the right thing to do, even if he himself is using their deaths for political purposes. It feels wrong to take advantage of the tragedy in any way. That's what he does. But I damn well won't stoop to his level.
posted by zarq at 11:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Brentwood is over 50% Latino. Many families there have been begging the police to take action against the gang, saying that members are terrorizing their neighborhoods. It's been on the local news here for months.
The bodies of those four young men were so severely hacked by machetes that the authorities refused to show their families the bodies. Their parents and grandparents were asked to identify the victims by watching a video the police took at the scene. And from all reports, the bodies themselves were completely unrecognizable.
More than 15 gang members have been arrested and charged for quadruple homicide, including 6 juveniles.
Your own mileage on this may vary, but personally I don't think visiting the hometown of those murdered children to stage a political protest against Trump is the right thing to do, even if he himself is using their deaths for political purposes. It feels wrong to take advantage of the tragedy in any way. That's what he does. But I damn well won't stoop to his level.
posted by zarq at 11:44 AM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Republicans yet to vote: Inhofe (OK), McCain (AZ), Sullivan (AK), Johnson (WI)
posted by pjenks at 11:45 AM on July 25, 2017
posted by pjenks at 11:45 AM on July 25, 2017
does the '20 hours of debate' portion start right after the ‘motion to proceed’ part, or at some later date?
McConnell explicitly asked for 15 minutes for McCain following the vote that not be charged to the bill, so presumably the time begins immediately.
posted by uncleozzy at 11:45 AM on July 25, 2017
McConnell explicitly asked for 15 minutes for McCain following the vote that not be charged to the bill, so presumably the time begins immediately.
posted by uncleozzy at 11:45 AM on July 25, 2017
Fucking murderers.
posted by Talez at 11:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Talez at 11:45 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
The most depressing part of watching this is the futility of resistance. If the Republicans couldn't get 50 votes this time, it would just go to another vote. And another. And another. The threat will live on like antibiotic-resistant gonorrhea.
posted by FakeFreyja at 11:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by FakeFreyja at 11:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
If, heaven forfend, they get some piece of shit together that they actually have votes to pass, I expect to see the Capitol surrounded by riot police and/or National Guard.
Yes. People are very angry. I've been to a lot of protests that seemed sort of self-conscious and mechanical; that was rage in those voices, you didn't even need to see them.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 11:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Yes. People are very angry. I've been to a lot of protests that seemed sort of self-conscious and mechanical; that was rage in those voices, you didn't even need to see them.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 11:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Is McCain getting to be the final vote a last fuck-you to Obama for beating his ass in 2008?
posted by The Notorious SRD at 11:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by The Notorious SRD at 11:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
There's going to be some ugly footage of whatever it took to get those protestors out of there.
Yeah, about that... @gabriellahope_: Capitol Hill staffer now telling reporters "no photography, no videos" of protestors
Staffers who attempt to restrict press freedom should be identified by name.
posted by zachlipton at 11:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [54 favorites]
Yeah, about that... @gabriellahope_: Capitol Hill staffer now telling reporters "no photography, no videos" of protestors
Staffers who attempt to restrict press freedom should be identified by name.
posted by zachlipton at 11:47 AM on July 25, 2017 [54 favorites]
My false optimism is that McCain votes no on the MTP (which I think I heard he has a standing policy to always vote YES to start debate) as a protest to the violation of the norms of the senate by writing a bill with no hearings or markup and forcing votes on a set of bills/amendments that no-one has seen.
posted by TwoWordReview at 11:49 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by TwoWordReview at 11:49 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
fingers crossed for Johnson and McCain going out together on a blameless No.
posted by rc3spencer at 11:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by rc3spencer at 11:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Is McCain getting to be the final vote a last fuck-you to Obama for beating his ass in 2008?
McCain is going to go out the way he started in the Senate: always failing to do the right thing when it really mattered.
posted by dis_integration at 11:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [45 favorites]
McCain is going to go out the way he started in the Senate: always failing to do the right thing when it really mattered.
posted by dis_integration at 11:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [45 favorites]
Staffers who attempt to restrict press freedom should be identified by name.
And filmed as they shit on the 1st Amendment, then put on the news, so their names, faces, and voices will be forever associated with their cowardice and betrayal of our most sacred of recognized rights.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
And filmed as they shit on the 1st Amendment, then put on the news, so their names, faces, and voices will be forever associated with their cowardice and betrayal of our most sacred of recognized rights.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:50 AM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
McCain saw all the laudatory comments after he announced his illness, and he was like "wait, there are still people who don't think I'm a craven asshole? How can I change that?" And then he realized he could be the final yes on taking away people's healthcare, and he knew he could finally achieve his lifelong goal of being universally loathed.
posted by diogenes at 11:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 11:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Do they have Johnson getting worked over in a back room somewhere?
posted by He Is Only The Imposter at 11:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by He Is Only The Imposter at 11:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I'm being told McCain will be another 15 minutes or so, in case you're wondering how long this is going to take.
posted by zachlipton at 11:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 11:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
The only way McCain doesn't vote yes is if he falls unconscious or dies because of his ongoing terminal medical condition that is being managed by publicly funded healthcare.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
Is McCain getting to be the final vote a last fuck-you to Obama for beating his ass in 2008?
Probably more of a boo-hoo hankie-wringing dead-man-walking "I crawled off my sickbed to do the 'right' thing" deal. They're really out-trumping Trump in the How Low Can You Go contest.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Probably more of a boo-hoo hankie-wringing dead-man-walking "I crawled off my sickbed to do the 'right' thing" deal. They're really out-trumping Trump in the How Low Can You Go contest.
posted by FelliniBlank at 11:51 AM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Apparently Mitch McConnell and Ron Johnson are having a heated argument on the floor of the Senate right now. You can watch them live (first row) on your C-Span stream or cable news.
posted by pjenks at 11:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by pjenks at 11:58 AM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
BAH GAWD, THAT'S MAVERICK MCCAIN'S MUSIC!
posted by tonycpsu at 12:00 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by tonycpsu at 12:00 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
RonJohn having not voted and still talking to McConnell and Cornyn is an interesting sign. He's furious at leadership. Maybe some hope there? I don't know.
And, uh, this happened: Capitol Police made me delete the video I recorded. (Andrew Desiderio, Daily Beast, photography isn't allowed outside the galleries)
Why do we all beat up on Spicer for off-camera briefings but thugs who actually force reporters to delete source material are allowed to be anonymous?
posted by zachlipton at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
And, uh, this happened: Capitol Police made me delete the video I recorded. (Andrew Desiderio, Daily Beast, photography isn't allowed outside the galleries)
Why do we all beat up on Spicer for off-camera briefings but thugs who actually force reporters to delete source material are allowed to be anonymous?
posted by zachlipton at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Fucking fuck. Johnson and McCain are both ayes.
posted by punchtothehead at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by punchtothehead at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
OH OF COURSE MCCAIN IS VOTING FOR IT. AND JOHNSON. FUCKERS.
posted by zachlipton at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
The Ayes have it
posted by TwoWordReview at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by TwoWordReview at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017
McCain is a Yes.
Johnson is a Yes.
Fuck all of these ghouls.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
Johnson is a Yes.
Fuck all of these ghouls.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
Well that was anti-climatic.
Mr. McCain YES
Mr. Johnson YES
posted by pjenks at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017
Mr. McCain YES
Mr. Johnson YES
posted by pjenks at 12:01 PM on July 25, 2017
The Democrats are doing the Nos by voice vote.
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
government of the people, by the (rich) people, for the (rich) people
posted by entropicamericana at 12:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 12:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Hearing the long string of "no"s is slightly comforting. But not really.
posted by mynameisluka at 12:03 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by mynameisluka at 12:03 PM on July 25, 2017
Did Democrats really give him a standing ovation? Good job, assholes.
posted by OverlappingElvis at 12:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by OverlappingElvis at 12:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Murderers. The fucking lot of them. The blood of hundreds of thousands of Americans a year on their hands. I hope there is a god because vengeance will be fucking his to repayeth.
posted by Talez at 12:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Talez at 12:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Well that's it. No matter what happens from here on out, it's going to be worse than what we have now.
posted by FakeFreyja at 12:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by FakeFreyja at 12:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
What I can't tell from this link is, does the '20 hours of debate' portion start right after the ‘motion to proceed’ part, or at some later date?
My understanding is that the clock starts right after McCain's 15 minute speech, which happens after the vote.
posted by zachlipton at 12:04 PM on July 25, 2017
My understanding is that the clock starts right after McCain's 15 minute speech, which happens after the vote.
posted by zachlipton at 12:04 PM on July 25, 2017
Mr. Johnson YES
My senator :/
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 12:04 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
My senator :/
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 12:04 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Are they allowed to say HELL NO?
posted by TWinbrook8 at 12:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by TWinbrook8 at 12:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Well, so the bill is on the floor. Nobody knows what comes out of it. Maybe nothing will get 50 votes to pass? Don't worry, I've turned 3 times and spat.
posted by dis_integration at 12:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by dis_integration at 12:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
What's the expert opinion on what happens next? This is so confusing & moving so fast. I didn't even know what a motion to proceed was a month ago.
posted by Mavri at 12:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Mavri at 12:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I want to see one goddamn Democrat refrain from going over there and hugging McCain after voting no. This is not a game, you fuckers.
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:06 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:06 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
No matter what happens from here on out, it's going to be worse than what we have now.
It's still very possible they fail to get 50 votes for a final bill. It's even theoretically possible the Democrats could cut a deal with Collins, Murkowski and Capito.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
It's still very possible they fail to get 50 votes for a final bill. It's even theoretically possible the Democrats could cut a deal with Collins, Murkowski and Capito.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
The Pod Save America guys will be doing a Q&A on what happens next at 4 EST
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
What was that little thing between Johnson and McConnell, I wonder?
posted by Chrysostom at 12:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Chrysostom at 12:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
John McCain is in the position of potentially being responsible for orders of magnitude more American deaths than the people who captured and tortured him as a POW.
posted by OverlappingElvis at 12:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [34 favorites]
posted by OverlappingElvis at 12:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [34 favorites]
Mr. Johnson YES
My senator :/
Nah, you don't have the receipt.
posted by Etrigan at 12:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
My senator :/
Nah, you don't have the receipt.
posted by Etrigan at 12:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
What was that little thing between Johnson and McConnell, I wonder?
Theater.
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:09 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Theater.
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:09 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
And of course, Pence gets to break the tie. I hate him and wish him ill.
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:09 PM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:09 PM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
What was that little thing between Johnson and McConnell, I wonder?
I would not be surprised if Johnson were giving him a piece of his mind for all but writing him off in 2016 and putting him in a bad position in WI. If I were Johnson, I'd be trying to wring concessions and let him know how furiously and reluctantly I'd be in voting for this one.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:10 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I would not be surprised if Johnson were giving him a piece of his mind for all but writing him off in 2016 and putting him in a bad position in WI. If I were Johnson, I'd be trying to wring concessions and let him know how furiously and reluctantly I'd be in voting for this one.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:10 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Honestly, I don't know how they actually proceed after this. They barely, by the skin of their teeth, got 50 to agree they should do "something." They have also, demonstrably, not had 50 votes to agree on doing anything specific, let alone having 50 votes to do something that can also pass the House.
Honestly, if the best they have a prayer of passing is "repeal the mandates, the medical device tax, and kick it all back to the House," that's still a real mess, but it's a far cry from "repeal Obamacare," and the Freedom Caucus types are going to scream bloody murder.
Murkowski voting no on the MTP is a decent signal she's not on board with voting for any of the actual proposals either.
Anyhoo, this is another step. There are a lot more. What's next? Call your Senators and thank or admonish them for their votes, as appropriate. Call your Governor and ask him or her to speak up.
posted by zachlipton at 12:11 PM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
Honestly, if the best they have a prayer of passing is "repeal the mandates, the medical device tax, and kick it all back to the House," that's still a real mess, but it's a far cry from "repeal Obamacare," and the Freedom Caucus types are going to scream bloody murder.
Murkowski voting no on the MTP is a decent signal she's not on board with voting for any of the actual proposals either.
Anyhoo, this is another step. There are a lot more. What's next? Call your Senators and thank or admonish them for their votes, as appropriate. Call your Governor and ask him or her to speak up.
posted by zachlipton at 12:11 PM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
This is the way the world ends, not with a bang but a bunch of mysteriously-un-spat-upon assholes.
posted by delfin at 12:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by delfin at 12:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
What the fuck are you even talking about, John. You just voted for everything you're currently disparaging. This is nauseating.
posted by Rhaomi at 12:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
posted by Rhaomi at 12:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
Oh fuck McCain and his "both sides are responsible for this mess" bullshit.
posted by hollygoheavy at 12:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by hollygoheavy at 12:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [21 favorites]
So McCain's speech is basically to say this process isn't what the Senate should be up to. So he voted yes and then shakes his finger at Congress.
posted by Emmy Rae at 12:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Emmy Rae at 12:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
I don't want to read anyone even hinting that John McCain is or ever was anything other than an evil motherfucker ever again, cancer or not.
posted by T.D. Strange at 12:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [52 favorites]
posted by T.D. Strange at 12:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [52 favorites]
In his speech, John McCain just admitted that he has been part of the decline of the Senate. Seems weird to come with a prepared apology for a vote you haven't taken yet.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
This is a switch for McCain. He's voicing his concerns about the process AFTER voting.
posted by diogenes at 12:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 12:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
McCain decrying the incivility of the Senate lately, after dangerously flying across the country so he could vote for a bill under the cover of unprecedented secrecy, haste, and confusion.
Fuck this guy.
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [23 favorites]
Fuck this guy.
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [23 favorites]
Worst group of people ever assembled
posted by dagosto at 12:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by dagosto at 12:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I hate everything.
posted by elsietheeel at 12:15 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by elsietheeel at 12:15 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
How do you have surgery for brain cancer and come back to work expressly to vote for healthcare repeal?
posted by bardophile at 12:15 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
posted by bardophile at 12:15 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
McCain (just now): Let's return to regular order!
um...
posted by pjenks at 12:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
um...
posted by pjenks at 12:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
The Distinguished Senator is glitching. They (captital-T They) need to check the install before the stitches heal more.
If he indeed is still him, McCain can go fuck himself in the worst way. Indeed sir, in the way of a stopped clock, you are correct that the Senate is NOT (and possibly haven't been for some time) the greatest deliberative body of all time. I vomit on your shoes.
posted by carsonb at 12:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
If he indeed is still him, McCain can go fuck himself in the worst way. Indeed sir, in the way of a stopped clock, you are correct that the Senate is NOT (and possibly haven't been for some time) the greatest deliberative body of all time. I vomit on your shoes.
posted by carsonb at 12:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
He did not. He did not just say "Let's return to regular order" after voting to avoid that.
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
I've been sitting in a hospital emergency room looking at Twitter compulsively to see how the vote is going. I'm beyond feelings. The only words I have are too profane. (I'm with my 95 year old friend who fell last night. Luckily she has good health insurance, and it appears to only be a very bad UTI with nothing broken. But so many, far too many don't. Frack the GOP and their SuperPACs and ALEC and gerrymandering.)
posted by LeftMyHeartInSanFrancisco at 12:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by LeftMyHeartInSanFrancisco at 12:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
McCain now talking about our need to cooperate and demanding a return to regular order and complaining about parliamentary tricks. After he just voted to do EXACTLY THE THINGS HE IS COMPLAINING ABOUT.
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
Well, he does say he won't vote for this bill. So that's... something.
posted by Justinian at 12:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 12:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
This speech is like watching a man who just pissed on a grave speechify about the awfulness of grave pissing.
posted by diogenes at 12:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 12:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
Apparently McCain voted yes so he could hear himself give another speech on the Senate floor about decorum and process and the great traditions of the Senate etc. What a self-absorbed ass.
posted by dis_integration at 12:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by dis_integration at 12:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Shorter John McCain: I will not vote for this bill I just voted for!
posted by Justinian at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Well, he does say he won't vote for this bill. So that's... something.
Would you say he has concerns about the current state of the bill?
posted by diogenes at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
Would you say he has concerns about the current state of the bill?
posted by diogenes at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
Well, he does say he won't vote for this bill.
The House bill never stood a chance in the Senate without amendment. It doesn't mean much.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017
The House bill never stood a chance in the Senate without amendment. It doesn't mean much.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017
Well, he does say he won't vote for this bill. So that's... something.
This bill. The House ACHA used to open debate, which is not what they will be voting on in 20 hours. He will vote for that bill though.
posted by T.D. Strange at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
This bill. The House ACHA used to open debate, which is not what they will be voting on in 20 hours. He will vote for that bill though.
posted by T.D. Strange at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
He did not. He did not just say "Let's return to regular order" after voting to avoid that.
Yup, and he just repeated it again. With details and suggestions...
posted by pjenks at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Yup, and he just repeated it again. With details and suggestions...
posted by pjenks at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Jesus fucking Christ. He could have voted the other way and said all this shit afterward to illustrate why he refused to support the MTP. What the actual fuck?
Oh great, as usual, talking like a big statesman and acting just the opposite. Classic fucking McCain.
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017 [23 favorites]
Oh great, as usual, talking like a big statesman and acting just the opposite. Classic fucking McCain.
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:18 PM on July 25, 2017 [23 favorites]
John McCain is a real scumbag
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
McCain complaining about the lack of "opposition support" that the ACA passed with.
Go chew on a brick, McCain. Democrats bent backward with dozens of compromises in the ACA. The fact that the GOP didn't care about those concessions doesn't mean they didn't work with you. They actually talked to the opposition, which is more than we can say about this bill.
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
Go chew on a brick, McCain. Democrats bent backward with dozens of compromises in the ACA. The fact that the GOP didn't care about those concessions doesn't mean they didn't work with you. They actually talked to the opposition, which is more than we can say about this bill.
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
I don't understand, and I'm sorry this is rudimentary, but what is so broken about the current system? People keep saying 'broken'. What's broken? I know I shouldn't be this ignorant.
I mean, there are huge problems with the insurance industry, but I'm going to guess 'insurance industry regulation' isn't anywhere in the solutions mix.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I mean, there are huge problems with the insurance industry, but I'm going to guess 'insurance industry regulation' isn't anywhere in the solutions mix.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Lil Trimpy is going to have a joint presser with the Prime Minister of Lebanon. Live video feed (Facebook) here.
I expect Trimpy to crow about the Motion to Proceed and brush off the PM.
I just heard a voice on the video say that they are waiting for McCain's remarks to finish before Trump and PM Hariri come out.
posted by dhens at 12:20 PM on July 25, 2017
I expect Trimpy to crow about the Motion to Proceed and brush off the PM.
I just heard a voice on the video say that they are waiting for McCain's remarks to finish before Trump and PM Hariri come out.
posted by dhens at 12:20 PM on July 25, 2017
I loath this obnoxious little piss-ant of an "adult" man. McCain's whole shtick is hypocrisy. I mean, he just exhorted the Senate to return to Regular Order, AFTER HE FUCKING VOTED FOR THIS TRAVESTY, even knowing that the bill is a "shell of a bill"!. This guy has literally made a career of being called a "war hero" for surviving torture and using that fact to excuse his almost continual betray of the best principles of this country since the early 1970s. He's a disgusting liar, seeing as the Democratic Congress of 9 years ago did hold hearings and went through Regular Order.
John McCain is a disgrace to the United States. He's no hero--not in any sense, sorry.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [47 favorites]
John McCain is a disgrace to the United States. He's no hero--not in any sense, sorry.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [47 favorites]
If John McCain was sincere about what he was saying, the importance of the Senate coming together and making a compromise to improve our country, he would have voted against the Motion to Proceed and demanded a non-reconciliation bill requiring Democratic votes to rich the required total of 60.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:21 PM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:21 PM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
John McCain is not a maverick. But he does play one on TV.
posted by Grangousier at 12:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by Grangousier at 12:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
A few people were holding out hope this would be some sort of dramatic West Wing moment where McCain bursts in, delivers an inspiring speech about democracy and doing the right thing, and then votes no.
Turned out McCain really wanted to deliver that inspiring speech, but failed to take the action needed to back that up first. What a joke.
posted by zachlipton at 12:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
Turned out McCain really wanted to deliver that inspiring speech, but failed to take the action needed to back that up first. What a joke.
posted by zachlipton at 12:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
I don't understand, and I'm sorry this is rudimentary, but what is so broken about the current system? People keep saying 'broken'. What's broken?
Remember before Obamacare passed we had "the greatest healthcare system in the world". Now it's broken. You do the math.
posted by peeedro at 12:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Remember before Obamacare passed we had "the greatest healthcare system in the world". Now it's broken. You do the math.
posted by peeedro at 12:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Democrats bent backward with dozens of compromises in the ACA.
Such as allowing amendments from Republicans!
posted by Emmy Rae at 12:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Such as allowing amendments from Republicans!
posted by Emmy Rae at 12:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
cjelli *less Murkowski/Collins
I'd disagree with that footnote. The entire thing was as choreographed as a ballet. They were the two who had permission to symbolically vote no and prove their "independence" this time. McConnell needed exactly 50 votes, that means two Republicans get to be all "independent" and vote no when it doesn't mater.
They won the independence lottery this time, that's all. If the coin flip had gone the other way Johnson would have voted no and either Murkowski or Collins would have voted yes. They are exactly as culpable as the other Republicans and deserve as much scorn, hate, and work against their re-election as all the others.
posted by sotonohito at 12:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [32 favorites]
I'd disagree with that footnote. The entire thing was as choreographed as a ballet. They were the two who had permission to symbolically vote no and prove their "independence" this time. McConnell needed exactly 50 votes, that means two Republicans get to be all "independent" and vote no when it doesn't mater.
They won the independence lottery this time, that's all. If the coin flip had gone the other way Johnson would have voted no and either Murkowski or Collins would have voted yes. They are exactly as culpable as the other Republicans and deserve as much scorn, hate, and work against their re-election as all the others.
posted by sotonohito at 12:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [32 favorites]
I really am having a difficult time looking at this old man bloviating on and on ad nauseum, lecturing the Senate and doing the whole "the other side did it too!" and reconciling him with the man who refused to leave his POW camp until everyone else was released as well. What happened to him between then and now? How did he get to be this person?
posted by hollygoheavy at 12:23 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by hollygoheavy at 12:23 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
Shorter John McCain: "I come to bury this bill, not to praise it."
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:24 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:24 PM on July 25, 2017
he's coming to bury much more than the bill
posted by flatluigi at 12:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by flatluigi at 12:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
"Who first stole hamburgers? We should let the historians decide", the Hamburglar opined. "But the thing we must do now is stop stealing hamburgers. The bag of hamburgers I'm holding now, we can't say where they came from, but hamburgers belong to their owners and we cannot allow them to be stolen or burgled".
The Hamburglar then threw a smoke grenade and escaped through a trap door.
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [37 favorites]
The Hamburglar then threw a smoke grenade and escaped through a trap door.
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [37 favorites]
Again, just to make sure I understand: are they voting on the actual bill tomorrow?
posted by pxe2000 at 12:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by pxe2000 at 12:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
What's broken?
It's broken in that people keep thinking that a for-profit company can do the exact same work as a non-profit.
It's broken in that there are people saying hey, there's nothing that prevents me from charging $9 for this single aspirin.
It's broken in that many other western countries have fine health care that do not bankrupt people.
posted by Melismata at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
It's broken in that people keep thinking that a for-profit company can do the exact same work as a non-profit.
It's broken in that there are people saying hey, there's nothing that prevents me from charging $9 for this single aspirin.
It's broken in that many other western countries have fine health care that do not bankrupt people.
posted by Melismata at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
I was offered a job over lunch today. The offer came from a close friend in the same general line of work, and somebody who I admire a lot on a personal and professional level. This past year, she started her own shop, and because she is great at her job, clients are coming out of the woodwork.
She told me that I am her no. 1 choice, period. They would make it work for me.
I told her that this was a bad day, of all days, because with my cancer survivor husband, we need health care. They don't have group health insurance, and I don't know if the individual market will exist for families like mine in a year, where one of us has a history of coming down with something that looks like a flu, feels like a heart attack, and turns out to be cancer.
And we're the lucky ones out of today. I'm so angry, guys.
posted by joyceanmachine at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [83 favorites]
She told me that I am her no. 1 choice, period. They would make it work for me.
I told her that this was a bad day, of all days, because with my cancer survivor husband, we need health care. They don't have group health insurance, and I don't know if the individual market will exist for families like mine in a year, where one of us has a history of coming down with something that looks like a flu, feels like a heart attack, and turns out to be cancer.
And we're the lucky ones out of today. I'm so angry, guys.
posted by joyceanmachine at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [83 favorites]
Remember before Obamacare passed we had "the greatest healthcare system in the world". Now it's broken. You do the math.
I know that when someone says some abstract thing is 'broken' without any specifications as to what is broken, they are extremely likely to be full of shit...but I just don't understand how they're getting away without being held to explaining what's broken. Like people keep saying 'We all know Obamacare is broken'. WTF?
I couldn't get away with that level of bullshit with my nine-year-old.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
I know that when someone says some abstract thing is 'broken' without any specifications as to what is broken, they are extremely likely to be full of shit...but I just don't understand how they're getting away without being held to explaining what's broken. Like people keep saying 'We all know Obamacare is broken'. WTF?
I couldn't get away with that level of bullshit with my nine-year-old.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
John McCain is not a maverick. But he does play one on TV.
Only if you don't count C-SPAN as TV.
posted by Etrigan at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Only if you don't count C-SPAN as TV.
posted by Etrigan at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I hope we can all agree to use McCain as a verb, meaning "to express deep concerns with the thing you're about to go ahead and do anyway," at every opportunity, forever, so that his legacy lives on as a reminder that he is the biggest hypocrite in the history of humankind.
posted by Dr. Send at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by Dr. Send at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
What happened to him between then and now? How did he get to be this person?
Maybe he was always this person, and he was more afraid of embarrassing then facing his father Admiral McCain than of leaving people to be tortured. Most of his public actions since this suggest that John S. McCain III is just a terrible person.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Maybe he was always this person, and he was more afraid of embarrassing then facing his father Admiral McCain than of leaving people to be tortured. Most of his public actions since this suggest that John S. McCain III is just a terrible person.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
First amendment to come up for debate is Rand Paul's partial-repeal-after-two-years-with-no-preplanned-replacement, the Obamacare Repeal and Reconciliation Act.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:27 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:27 PM on July 25, 2017
First amendment to be heard is the "full" repeal from 2015. They're going to read the entire thing into the record.
posted by zrail at 12:27 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by zrail at 12:27 PM on July 25, 2017
Again, just to make sure I understand: are they voting on the actual bill tomorrow?
They are voting on an actual bill when the 20 hours of debate closes, probably tomorrow.
What that bill is, nobody knows. They will start with the House bill (which will fail) then people will start adding amendments. Literally nobody knows what it will look like at the end.
posted by anastasiav at 12:28 PM on July 25, 2017
They are voting on an actual bill when the 20 hours of debate closes, probably tomorrow.
What that bill is, nobody knows. They will start with the House bill (which will fail) then people will start adding amendments. Literally nobody knows what it will look like at the end.
posted by anastasiav at 12:28 PM on July 25, 2017
What happens next? Julie Rovner is going to tell you. Who Knew Senate Health Bill Debate Could Be So Complicated?. If there are enough amendments, the vote-a-rama could drag on for quite a while.
posted by zachlipton at 12:28 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 12:28 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Oh boy. They're going to keep denying consent to force the amendments to be read in their entirety. This is going to go on until 6am tomorrow.
posted by dis_integration at 12:28 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by dis_integration at 12:28 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Yeah, they probably aren't voting on final passage tomorrow. This will take awhile.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 12:29 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by Huffy Puffy at 12:29 PM on July 25, 2017
It's broken in that people keep thinking that a for-profit company can do the exact same work as a non-profit.
It's broken in that there are people saying hey, there's nothing that prevents me from charging $9 for this single aspirin.
It's broken in that many other western countries have fine health care that do not bankrupt people.
That's what I was trying to get at in my original question. The answer to that is regulation. There is no way they're going to regulate anything in the insurance industry. Corporate bodies are more profitable than human ones.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:29 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
It's broken in that there are people saying hey, there's nothing that prevents me from charging $9 for this single aspirin.
It's broken in that many other western countries have fine health care that do not bankrupt people.
That's what I was trying to get at in my original question. The answer to that is regulation. There is no way they're going to regulate anything in the insurance industry. Corporate bodies are more profitable than human ones.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:29 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Welcome to The Price in Human Lives is Not Right! How many people will lose coverage under this amendment?
32 million is CORRECT COME ON DOWN THIS IS YOUR CHANCE TO DENY LIFE OR FINANCIAL STABILITY TO YOUR PEERS
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:30 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
32 million is CORRECT COME ON DOWN THIS IS YOUR CHANCE TO DENY LIFE OR FINANCIAL STABILITY TO YOUR PEERS
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:30 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Chrysostom: Politico: House Democrats sank two key bills on the House floor Monday, embarrassing Republican leaders who were banking on the noncontroversial legislation sailing through.
Not that the Dems (mostly!?!) banding together isn't big and something to applaud, but REMEMBER THAT THE GOP HAS THE MAJORITY TO LOSE. If they can't keep their own party together on noncontroversial bills, THIS IS A GOOD SIGN FOR DEMOCRACY AND HUMANITY.
(Sorry for the caps and bold, but that's where I am at the moment.)
posted by filthy light thief at 12:31 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
House Democrats sank two key bills on the House floor Monday, embarrassing Republican leaders who were banking on the noncontroversial legislation sailing through — in a new sign of the opposition party's frustration with the majority's approach.Emphasis mine, because 1. who were the Dems who went to the dark side, and 2. THIS NEEDED GOP DEFECTORS, THIS IS THE STORY.
Kicking off a busy week in the House, most Democrats and a handful of Republicans joined forces to deny GOP leaders big-enough majorities to pass an annual intelligence policy bill and legislation to restore funding for a key veterans health care program.
Both bills came to the House floor Monday under suspension of the rules, an expedited process that allows for less than an hour of debate and no amendments but also requires a two-thirds majority for passage.
The suspension process is typically used for noncontroversial bills that have broad bipartisan support. One suspension bill failing on the House floor is a rarity, but two back to back is extremely rare.
Not that the Dems (mostly!?!) banding together isn't big and something to applaud, but REMEMBER THAT THE GOP HAS THE MAJORITY TO LOSE. If they can't keep their own party together on noncontroversial bills, THIS IS A GOOD SIGN FOR DEMOCRACY AND HUMANITY.
(Sorry for the caps and bold, but that's where I am at the moment.)
posted by filthy light thief at 12:31 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
This is where the "filibuster by amendment" starts, except that the delay is a side effect of them desperately seeking 51.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 12:31 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Huffy Puffy at 12:31 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Ah, new and improved protestors.
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:33 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 12:33 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Trump just told the crowd at the press conference that the US is helping refugees in Lebanon with the provision of food, clean water, and health care. lol barf
posted by dhens at 12:33 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by dhens at 12:33 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
On the plus side, if Pence has to stick around the Senate voting on amendments then he can't be causing evil somewhere else. So... hooray for democracy I guess.
posted by Glibpaxman at 12:34 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by Glibpaxman at 12:34 PM on July 25, 2017
if Pence has to stick around the Senate voting on amendments then he can't be causing evil somewhere else.
Probably has a litter of puppies in his desk to snack on when he's hungry. Multitasking!
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:36 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Probably has a litter of puppies in his desk to snack on when he's hungry. Multitasking!
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:36 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
I can't really stoop to the level of anti-choicers with their fetus posters, but absolutely every one of these fuckers should be showered with pictures of gravestones and obituaries of everyone who dies without healthcare whenever they show their face in public.
posted by nakedmolerats at 12:36 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by nakedmolerats at 12:36 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
First amendment to come up for debate is Rand Paul's partial-repeal-after-two-years-with-no-preplanned-replacement, the Obamacare Repeal and Reconciliation Act.
The constant attempts to make the worst of it hit after the midterms are some of the most sickening parts, there is never going to be a plan, they don't care about a plan, they are incapable of looking even five minutes past their "win" and frankly I could see them being so craven as to be planning for a Democratic legislature to fix the clusterfuck so they can campaign against that down the road to get the House and Senate back again, and rinse and repeat.
posted by jason_steakums at 12:39 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
The constant attempts to make the worst of it hit after the midterms are some of the most sickening parts, there is never going to be a plan, they don't care about a plan, they are incapable of looking even five minutes past their "win" and frankly I could see them being so craven as to be planning for a Democratic legislature to fix the clusterfuck so they can campaign against that down the road to get the House and Senate back again, and rinse and repeat.
posted by jason_steakums at 12:39 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Onion: Senator Struggling To Weigh Interests Of Entire Constituency Against Nothing
posted by Chrysostom at 12:39 PM on July 25, 2017 [73 favorites]
posted by Chrysostom at 12:39 PM on July 25, 2017 [73 favorites]
Humor break: After personally telling a news outlet he planned to fire assistant press secretary Michael Short, new White House communications director Anthony Scaramucci blasted reporters over the “leak” of Short’s firing, telling them “the fact that you guys know about it before he does really upsets me as a human being and as a Roman Catholic." (The Hill, [real])
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:40 PM on July 25, 2017 [38 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:40 PM on July 25, 2017 [38 favorites]
I think I can guess what's going to come up at Confession.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:42 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:42 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Gee, Tony, same. I'm really disappointed in y'all over there at the White House, speaking as a human being and eponymous star of my kindergarten class's production of Captain Christmas.
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
“the fact that you guys know about it before he does really upsets me as a human being and as a Roman Catholic."
[citations needed]
posted by Etrigan at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
[citations needed]
posted by Etrigan at 12:43 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
It seems clear Trump has no earthly idea what Hezbollah is and that he thinks Lebanon is fighting it. Video.
posted by zachlipton at 12:44 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 12:44 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
I have a decent job that allows me to work from home and pays me a good wage, but my employer is based in England and so I get my insurance from the individual market. My insurance provider has already said that they're pulling out of the individual market for 2018 (due to "instability" HAHAHAHAHA kill me) so I probably have to find a new job with health insurance now so I'm not without health insurance next year. Of course the only thing I'll be able to find in ratfuck Indiana is something that pays me half, if that, of what I've been earning.
I hate everything and also want to burn things, but I will settle for throwing tennis balls for my dog because at least she'll be happy that way.
posted by minsies at 12:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
I hate everything and also want to burn things, but I will settle for throwing tennis balls for my dog because at least she'll be happy that way.
posted by minsies at 12:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
the fact that you guys know about it before he does really upsets me as a human being and as a Roman Catholic.
Remember the first of the Ten Commandments
I. THOU SHALT NOT LEAK
II. MAKE ISRAEL GREAT AGAIN
III. I TALK TO GOD A LOT, BELIEVE ME
IV. YOU'RE FIRED
V. REMEMBER THE TWEETS AND KEEP THEM COVFEFE
...
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
Remember the first of the Ten Commandments
I. THOU SHALT NOT LEAK
II. MAKE ISRAEL GREAT AGAIN
III. I TALK TO GOD A LOT, BELIEVE ME
IV. YOU'RE FIRED
V. REMEMBER THE TWEETS AND KEEP THEM COVFEFE
...
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
I don't understand, and I'm sorry this is rudimentary, but what is so broken about the current system? People keep saying 'broken'. What's broken?
Rich white people are paying 3.8% on investment profits to insure poor brown people.
posted by chris24 at 12:48 PM on July 25, 2017 [37 favorites]
Rich white people are paying 3.8% on investment profits to insure poor brown people.
posted by chris24 at 12:48 PM on July 25, 2017 [37 favorites]
@tobiaschneider: In press conference, Trump says Lebanon at the "front line of fighting [...] Hezbollah".
Hezbollah is part of Lebanon's current government.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
Hezbollah is part of Lebanon's current government.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
Wait, Dolt 45 was interviewed by the frickin' Wall Street Journal and he doubled down on Sessions? I mean, the NYT interview could be brushed off, fake news and all, and reports of behind-the-scenes truculence could be exaggerated for effect but THIS. Will Sessions even make it to the weekend?
posted by TWinbrook8 at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by TWinbrook8 at 12:51 PM on July 25, 2017
okay though if anyone knows how to establish workers' councils seize all productive property in the name of those councils establish a condition of dual power wherein nothing can be done without the approval of both the legislature and also the councils and to then transfer all power to the councils and thereby dismantle the institutions of bourgeois electoral "democracy," now's the time. it'd be great if you could get on that.
if anyone needs me I'll be watching this fractal lenin gif.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
if anyone needs me I'll be watching this fractal lenin gif.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Rich white people are paying 3.8% on investment profits to insure poor brown people.
Okay; just wanted to make sure they didn't have an actual argument anywhere that I missed, maybe just some bloviating corporate-speak, but it turns out all they have is the single word, "broken".
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Okay; just wanted to make sure they didn't have an actual argument anywhere that I missed, maybe just some bloviating corporate-speak, but it turns out all they have is the single word, "broken".
posted by A Terrible Llama at 12:54 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
I don't understand, and I'm sorry this is rudimentary, but what is so broken about the current system? People keep saying 'broken'. What's broken?
The ACA as written relies in large part on states to participate in the process – operate exchanges, expand Medicaid, etc. Red states have decided not to do that, because fuck the poor, fuck liberals and fuck the first black POTUS in particular. In particular, the absence of a Medicaid expansion puts more poor people on the private insurance market, which drives up costs and leads to insurers raising premiums/deductibles or just leaving the exchanges. Deeper dive by The Atlantic's Olga Khazan.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:56 PM on July 25, 2017 [44 favorites]
The ACA as written relies in large part on states to participate in the process – operate exchanges, expand Medicaid, etc. Red states have decided not to do that, because fuck the poor, fuck liberals and fuck the first black POTUS in particular. In particular, the absence of a Medicaid expansion puts more poor people on the private insurance market, which drives up costs and leads to insurers raising premiums/deductibles or just leaving the exchanges. Deeper dive by The Atlantic's Olga Khazan.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:56 PM on July 25, 2017 [44 favorites]
I want to see one goddamn Democrat refrain from going over there and hugging McCain after voting no.
If I was seeing a colleague who was just diagnosed with brain cancer for the first time since their diagnosis and I might not ever see them again I might give them a hug no matter how much I disagreed with them about politics.
posted by kirkaracha at 12:56 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Will Sessions even make it to the weekend?
Donnie really wants him gone but he doesn't want to say "You're fired." I take my pleasures where I find them. I admit I'd even chuckle to watch Donnie try to fire Sessions while Sessions refused to be fired.
posted by octobersurprise at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Donnie really wants him gone but he doesn't want to say "You're fired." I take my pleasures where I find them. I admit I'd even chuckle to watch Donnie try to fire Sessions while Sessions refused to be fired.
posted by octobersurprise at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
(So there's an element of truth to Republicans' complaints that the ACA isn't working, you just have to append "because we've done everything we can to break it.")
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
MEDICAID FOR ALL AND GTFO.
posted by aspersioncast at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by aspersioncast at 12:57 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
If I was seeing a colleague who was just diagnosed with brain cancer for the first time since their diagnosis and I might not ever see them again I might give them a hug no matter how much I disagreed with them about politics.
What if that colleague had just voted to effectively murder millions of people?
posted by codacorolla at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2017 [33 favorites]
What if that colleague had just voted to effectively murder millions of people?
posted by codacorolla at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2017 [33 favorites]
Actually, Donnie probably doesn't really much care if Sessions is AG or not; he just wants to grumble and blame.
posted by octobersurprise at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by octobersurprise at 12:59 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
So now the plan is to pass literally anything, it doesn't really matter. It's likely the so-called "skinny repeal". The actual bill doesn't matter because it isn't what will become law. All they need is a Senate placeholder of any kind so that they can go to a conference committee with the House where the real bill will be crafted. Just moving the football down the field three yards at a time.
Perhaps all the people who have been proclaiming for months, over and over, that Obamacare repeal is dead will see reality. "Moderate Republicans" in the House aren't going to stop it. "Moderate Republicans" in the Senate aren't going to stop it.
posted by JackFlash at 1:00 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Perhaps all the people who have been proclaiming for months, over and over, that Obamacare repeal is dead will see reality. "Moderate Republicans" in the House aren't going to stop it. "Moderate Republicans" in the Senate aren't going to stop it.
posted by JackFlash at 1:00 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
If I was seeing a colleague who was just diagnosed with brain cancer for the first time since their diagnosis and I might not ever see them again I might give them a hug no matter how much I disagreed with them about politics.
There isn't a person on earth I'd hug for doing what McCain just did. I'd disown my own DOG for doing what McCain just did.
posted by winna at 1:00 PM on July 25, 2017 [25 favorites]
There isn't a person on earth I'd hug for doing what McCain just did. I'd disown my own DOG for doing what McCain just did.
posted by winna at 1:00 PM on July 25, 2017 [25 favorites]
Al Franken makes an extended argument for civility and comity among senators in his new book (tl;dr: It makes actually getting anything done easier. Look at the House for the counter-example). I didn't entirely buy it, but I see where he is coming from.
posted by Chrysostom at 1:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Chrysostom at 1:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
I was fully on team "go ahead and get rid of Sessions, because I don't see how it's actually possible to replace him with anyone worse unless it's literally a human centipede made out of David Duke, Kislyak, Wayne LaPierre and Fred Phelps's corpse but oh god that is probably exactly who Trump will pick oh god.
posted by aspersioncast at 1:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by aspersioncast at 1:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
(So there's an element of truth to Republicans' complaints that the ACA isn't working, you just have to append "because we've done everything we can to break it.")
This was all very helpful; thank you.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 1:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
This was all very helpful; thank you.
posted by A Terrible Llama at 1:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Just moving the football down the field three yards at a time.
WOO! GO TEAM REPUBLICAN! SHOW THOSE LIBERALS WHO'S BOSS BY TAKING AWAY MY HEALTHCARE!
That's how fucking stupid this country's football team style politics is.
posted by Talez at 1:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
WOO! GO TEAM REPUBLICAN! SHOW THOSE LIBERALS WHO'S BOSS BY TAKING AWAY MY HEALTHCARE!
That's how fucking stupid this country's football team style politics is.
posted by Talez at 1:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
"One woof for AYE, two woofs for NAY"
"woof"
"BAD DOG!"
posted by notsnot at 1:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
"woof"
"BAD DOG!"
posted by notsnot at 1:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I like Nate Silver's take here:
posted by zachlipton at 1:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [67 favorites]
Part of why McCain does what he does: There’s a generational and philosophical divide in how he’s covered by the press.Watching pundits line up to praise McCain's speech as if they didn't just watch what came before it has been disgusting.
Among younger and less traditional reporters on Twitter — especially on the left but by no means exclusively so — a lot of people are pointing out McCain’s inconsistency in scolding McConnell’s process but nevertheless voting for the motion to proceed.
On CNN, however, the commentary about McCain’s speech was glowing. And the commentary has also been very warm in Twitter comments we’ve seen from older reporters at the major news networks and at newspapers like The Washington Post.
Longtime readers of FiveThirtyEight know that I have a lot of beefs with the establishment media. Moments like these, where they elevate style over substance, are a big part of why.
posted by zachlipton at 1:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [67 favorites]
WOO! GO TEAM REPUBLICAN! SHOW THOSE LIBERALS WHO'S BOSS BY TAKING AWAY MY HEALTHCARE!
Honestly, that could be my protest sign. Thank you, Talez.
posted by tilde at 1:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Honestly, that could be my protest sign. Thank you, Talez.
posted by tilde at 1:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
You Can't Tip a Buick: "okay though if anyone knows how to establish workers' councils [...]"
Wait wait wait. You never had a PLAN for how this is going to happen?!?
posted by Chrysostom at 1:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Wait wait wait. You never had a PLAN for how this is going to happen?!?
posted by Chrysostom at 1:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
I can't really stoop to the level of anti-choicers with their fetus posters, but absolutely every one of these fuckers should be showered with pictures of gravestones and obituaries of everyone who dies without healthcare whenever they show their face in public.
I'd be fine with using the actual gravestones themselves, TBH.
posted by CommonSense at 1:04 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
I'd be fine with using the actual gravestones themselves, TBH.
posted by CommonSense at 1:04 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Oddly, the football metaphor also works in terms of how the lawmaking process has actually worked -- in football if you gain three yards per play, every play, then you will keep facing fourth-down situations where you must make forward progress or you fail. But every time you end up in one of these do-or-die situations you get another short gain and the drive continues. Just like the other team in this hypothetical never manages a stop, the moderate Republicans never grow a spine.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I guess the silver lining to 2/3 of the national media lining up to tell us how strong and brave McCain is would be that fewer people care about the national political media than ever before and their power to convince people that he is what they say he is dwindles by the minute.
It's still disgusting, though.
posted by Copronymus at 1:05 PM on July 25, 2017
It's still disgusting, though.
posted by Copronymus at 1:05 PM on July 25, 2017
I know there are a million fires burning at once, but Trump's comments that he wants Sessions to crack down on leaks are pretty disturbing. It's being described as "the path out of the doghouse for Sessions."
The President of the United States should not be publicly bullying the Attorney General into prosecuting people to please his personal and political whims. This is not normal.
posted by zachlipton at 1:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
The President of the United States should not be publicly bullying the Attorney General into prosecuting people to please his personal and political whims. This is not normal.
posted by zachlipton at 1:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
CNN just pointed out that Trump has been harassing Sessions about not warning him that he was going to recuse himself from the Russia investigation... but Sessions repeatedly promised to recuse himself from the Russian investigation under sworn testimony at his confirmation hearings. Ah well.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [24 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [24 favorites]
WHO WOULD WIN?
------------------------------------------------------------
HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS |
OF SICK AND | 50 REPUBLICAN SENATORS
POOR AMERICANS |
posted by Talez at 1:10 PM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
Nancy Pelosi just said all Americans have the right to healthcare. Thanks for the note about the C-SPAN livestream.
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:11 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
I know there are a million fires burning at once, but Trump's comments that he wants Sessions to crack down on leaks are pretty disturbing. It's being described as "the path out of the doghouse for Sessions."
Isn't the president ordering the AG to inbestigate anything against...Something? Unconstitutional, impeachable, something? Not that the Rs will really do anything, but it would give Mueller YAObstrustruction charge to add to the pile.
posted by Room 641-A at 1:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Isn't the president ordering the AG to inbestigate anything against...Something? Unconstitutional, impeachable, something? Not that the Rs will really do anything, but it would give Mueller YAObstrustruction charge to add to the pile.
posted by Room 641-A at 1:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
kirkaracha: If I was seeing a colleague who was just diagnosed with brain cancer for the first time since their diagnosis and I might not ever see them again I might give them a hug no matter how much I disagreed with them about politics.
I hope they then make time for a lot more hugs, what with 217,000 additional deaths over the next decade if something close to the "old" House bill passes.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
I hope they then make time for a lot more hugs, what with 217,000 additional deaths over the next decade if something close to the "old" House bill passes.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Part of why McCain does what he does: There’s a generational and philosophical divide in how he’s covered by the press.
Kind of like how Whole Foods decided that their traditional stores would cater to the wealthy boomers, but their 365 stores would cater to the poorer millennials.
The trouble with that strategy, of course, is that everyone notices the discrepancy, especially us Xers who are caught between the two...
posted by Melismata at 1:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Kind of like how Whole Foods decided that their traditional stores would cater to the wealthy boomers, but their 365 stores would cater to the poorer millennials.
The trouble with that strategy, of course, is that everyone notices the discrepancy, especially us Xers who are caught between the two...
posted by Melismata at 1:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
> Wait wait wait. You never had a PLAN for how this is going to happen?!?
Shruggie! People seem to think that it starts with going to protests and trying to sell newspapers that no one reads, but I'm a little skeptical of that. The Lenin gif is pretty fun, though.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Shruggie! People seem to think that it starts with going to protests and trying to sell newspapers that no one reads, but I'm a little skeptical of that. The Lenin gif is pretty fun, though.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Isn't the president ordering the AG to inbestigate anything against...Something? Unconstitutional, impeachable, something? Not that the Rs will really do anything, but it would give Mueller YAObstrustruction charge to add to the pile.
Remember how when you were 11 you had that cousin that said "it ain't illegal if you don't get caught"?
Turns out he was wrong. It ain't illegal if your congress doesn't want to prosecute you.
I've lost hope that anything sane will happen over the next 16 months. I can only hope at mid terms that Americans come to their senses and we start to claw our way back from the brink. I don't have much hope right now.
posted by Talez at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Remember how when you were 11 you had that cousin that said "it ain't illegal if you don't get caught"?
Turns out he was wrong. It ain't illegal if your congress doesn't want to prosecute you.
I've lost hope that anything sane will happen over the next 16 months. I can only hope at mid terms that Americans come to their senses and we start to claw our way back from the brink. I don't have much hope right now.
posted by Talez at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
I get the desire for more civility in politics, but there are certain things that should cross the line. This anti-health debacle is one of those bright red lines.
Reminder: as Obama pointed out, the GOP proposed bills are tax cut for the rich at health care’s expense. Health care is an unnecessary government expense, unlike a bloated defense budget, especially if Trump is successful in replacing troops in Afghanistan with mercenaries, making the war an even bigger money-maker for war profiteers
posted by filthy light thief at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
Reminder: as Obama pointed out, the GOP proposed bills are tax cut for the rich at health care’s expense. Health care is an unnecessary government expense, unlike a bloated defense budget, especially if Trump is successful in replacing troops in Afghanistan with mercenaries, making the war an even bigger money-maker for war profiteers
posted by filthy light thief at 1:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
So the takeaway is that republican politicians are OK with public transit if they get to make the trolley switch tracks to hit the most people possible.
posted by srboisvert at 1:23 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by srboisvert at 1:23 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
The idea that civility in politics is needed to allow legislators to work together on important or noncontroversial topics holds water as long as you believe both sides are acting in good faith.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [42 favorites]
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:26 PM on July 25, 2017 [42 favorites]
Turns out he was wrong. It ain't illegal if your congress doesn't want to prosecute you
I understand, but I'm curious if it is, actually, impeachable or unconstitutional for the president to give orders to the AG.
posted by Room 641-A at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2017
I understand, but I'm curious if it is, actually, impeachable or unconstitutional for the president to give orders to the AG.
posted by Room 641-A at 1:27 PM on July 25, 2017
I understand, but I'm curious if it is, actually, impeachable or unconstitutional for the president to give orders to the AG.
We don't really know because nobody has been that fucking stupid, corrupt, or just plain evil before. Nixon was going to get impeached for trying to get the AG off his own tail but this Congress? I'm pretty sure so long as Trump keeps signing anything that they send his way they'll keep him around.
posted by Talez at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
We don't really know because nobody has been that fucking stupid, corrupt, or just plain evil before. Nixon was going to get impeached for trying to get the AG off his own tail but this Congress? I'm pretty sure so long as Trump keeps signing anything that they send his way they'll keep him around.
posted by Talez at 1:29 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
CSPAN: @Statedeptspox says Secretary of State Tillerson is "taking a little time off."
posted by PenDevil at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2017 [23 favorites]
posted by PenDevil at 1:31 PM on July 25, 2017 [23 favorites]
CSPAN: @Statedeptspox says Secretary of State Tillerson is "taking a little time off."
He sent his Article 50 letter to begin his Rexit?
posted by Talez at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
He sent his Article 50 letter to begin his Rexit?
posted by Talez at 1:33 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
A little time off??? There's no taking a little time off!
Do your damn job for chrissakes.
posted by notyou at 1:34 PM on July 25, 2017 [16 favorites]
Do your damn job for chrissakes.
posted by notyou at 1:34 PM on July 25, 2017 [16 favorites]
Cornyn saying first vote will be BCRA+Cruz amend. I believe they had promised Paul that first vote would be 2015 straight repeal, so that's interesting. OTOH, Cornyn has been caught out not knowing WTF was going on a couple of times so far.
posted by Chrysostom at 1:34 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Chrysostom at 1:34 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Daily Beast daily gripe session: Anthony Scaramucci’s ‘Purge’ Begins and It’s ‘Kill the First Guy You See’ Time at White House, which nicely explains how Scaramucci blamed leaks for the reporting that Short would be fired, after he told Politico that himself, on the record, this morning.
Another aide compared Scaramucci’s axing of Short to when a new inmate gets to a maximum-security prison and you “kill the first guy you see” to gain respect and credibility internally.Swin, who co-wrote this and receives a daily barrage of unflattering leaks from the White House, had this to say:
Officials and staffers spoke to The Daily Beast on the condition of anonymity because leaks are now evidently frowned upon in this White House. Scaramucci did not respond to requests for comment on this story.
No one in the White House knows exactly how Scaramucci will continue to flex his muscles. Some speculate that he could go for more expansive “checks” on smartphones or other devices, or routine interrogations of other staffers. (Phone checks for less senior level staffers was an early feature of the bygone Sean Spicer era.) Many, however, view Scaramucci’s talk of a big purge as nothing more than being “all a show for Trump” to project a sense of “toughness” and decisive action, as one White House official described it.
Still, among the staffers who could be in Scaramucci’s crosshairs, there is some bewilderment as to why they are being targeted when there are much bigger fish to fry.
“If you’re concerned about leaks that are actually doing the most harm to this [White House], leaks from [mid-level] members of the press and comms team aren’t your problem,” one aide vented. “You’d have a better shot with looking at staff that has people whose names rhyme with ‘Rannon’ or ‘Meibus’ or ‘Wushner’ or ‘Mellyanne’ or ‘Tone,’ [and so on].”
@charliespiering: Kellyanne Conway: "The West Wing’s a very small place. I think it’s easy to figure out who the leakers are."posted by zachlipton at 1:35 PM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
@swin24: If you define "leaker" as someone who talks to press anonymously I got some bad news for senior staff...
"Tone"?
posted by yhbc at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by yhbc at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Guys I think Scaramucci might be a dick.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 1:41 PM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
Anthony Scaramucci’s ‘Purge’ Begins and It’s ‘Kill the First Guy You See’ Time at White House
"This is the problem with the leaking," he said on Tuesday, bizarrely responding to his own on-the-record leaking to Politico. "Let's say I'm firing Michael Short today. The fact that you guys know about it before he does really upsets me as a human being and as a Roman Catholic. You got that?"posted by kirkaracha at 1:42 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
If they get rid of all the "leakers" they can't blame their own leaks on junior staff.
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:44 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
this is gonna be hilarious when scaramucci realizes that if he wants to stop the leaks, he has to fire trump
posted by murphy slaw at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 1:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
Officials and staffers spoke to The Daily Beast on the condition of anonymity because leaks are now evidently frowned upon in this White House.
posted by theodolite at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
I think this is Tone: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Cohn_(investment_banker)
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
If I was seeing a colleague who was just diagnosed with brain cancer for the first time since their diagnosis and I might not ever see them again I might give them a hug no matter how much I disagreed with them about politics.
"politics" being what you call it when people who aren't John McCain die of cancer. all those corpses are just politics, except for John McCain's, which will be real. what a lonely and special feeling it must be, to be the only man in the whole world who is real.
I do think it very strange to see everybody so aggravated that he would give a big speech in favor of something and then vote against it, or the other way around, in any order. sure, he's a moral monster all his life, but he also has BRAIN CANCER. it's just barely possible he doesn't know what the fuck he's doing, you know
posted by queenofbithynia at 1:46 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
Does "leak" even have a meaning anymore or is just it pure connotation with no denotative center left remaining?
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:47 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I think this is Tone: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Cohn_(investment_banker)
Yep. Confirmed on twitter after the article came out (rhymes with Tary Tone).
posted by zachlipton at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2017
Yep. Confirmed on twitter after the article came out (rhymes with Tary Tone).
posted by zachlipton at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2017
Well, well, well, Sam Thielman from Talking Points Memo reporting on some very interesting relationships in T's orbit: Trump’s Conduits For Capital From The Former Soviet Bloc Are Actually Old Pals
Two very different men have been instrumental in introducing financiers and clients from Russia and the former Soviet bloc to the Trump Organization’s real estate machine: Felix Sater, Donald Trump’s former business partner and a convicted felon, and Michael Cohen, Trump’s brash, longtime personal attorney.posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:48 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
And TPM now has learned from conversations with both Sater and Cohen that the two men know each other dating back to their teenage years, when they were acquaintances from nearby towns on Long Island. Both went on to make their fortunes in real estate, eventually working with the same big-name businessman—although they insist that neither helped the other land his gig with the Trump Organization. [...]
Sater said he most clearly remembers the beginning of his relationship with Cohen from the time the former Trump Organization attorney began dating his now-wife, whom Sater describes as a girl from his neighborhood of Jewish Soviet expatriates. Cohen told TPM the pair had known each other before then, in their teenage years, and that he hadn’t yet begun dating his wife, reportedly a Ukrainian émigré, when he was in his teens.
“He wasn’t one of my close friends, just a guy dating a girl in the neighborhood and we had a bunch of mutual friends,” Sater said. “We eventually both started working at Trump Org. Prior to that, again, lots of mutual acquaintances.”
sure, he's a moral monster all his life, but he also has BRAIN CANCER. it's just barely possible he doesn't know what the fuck he's doing, you know
Occam's razor suggests that he's doing what he's always done because that's who he is. What are the odds that he was going to do the right thing, but then brain cancer confused him into doing what he always does?
posted by diogenes at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Occam's razor suggests that he's doing what he's always done because that's who he is. What are the odds that he was going to do the right thing, but then brain cancer confused him into doing what he always does?
posted by diogenes at 1:49 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Axios: More Senate health bill provisions violate budget rules
posted by zachlipton at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
The Senate parliamentarian has ruled that more provisions of the Better Care Reconciliation Act — the Senate's Affordable Care Act replacement bill — don't comply with budget rules, meaning they'd need 60 votes to pass. These include a provision allowing insurers to charge older people more in premiums than under current law — the provision AARP has called an "age tax" — and the provision allowing small businesses to sell "association health plans," an important GOP priority.At this point, I think they'll just take a 60-vote BCRA bill just to watch it fail, then move on to votes on individual bits like repealing the mandates just to pass something, anything, without regard for whether there's any policy there.
However, the provision allowing states to choose to receive a Medicaid block grant, rather than a per-person funding cap, does comply with budget rules, meaning it only needs 50 votes like the rest of the bill. A provision broadening the ACA's state innovation waivers to include more of the law's regulations is still pending review.
Why it matters: The Senate bill was already struggling to win support among enough Republicans, and shedding more big pieces isn't going to help.
posted by zachlipton at 1:50 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Another aide compared Scaramucci’s axing of Short to when a new inmate gets to a maximum-security prison and you “kill the first guy you see” to gain respect and credibility internally.
(Gary Cohn carefully chips away at the tunnel behind his yellowing poster of Lloyd Blankfein)
posted by Rust Moranis at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
(Gary Cohn carefully chips away at the tunnel behind his yellowing poster of Lloyd Blankfein)
posted by Rust Moranis at 1:51 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
PenDevil: CSPAN: @Statedeptspox says Secretary of State Tillerson is "taking a little time off."
While likely retaining his full salary for however long it takes him to recuperate. I've heard he gets sleepy (or maybe he doesn't, but doesn't actually have the usual and appropriate news folks covering his overseas trips, so the narrative is shaped by other countries -- TIL).
posted by filthy light thief at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
While likely retaining his full salary for however long it takes him to recuperate. I've heard he gets sleepy (or maybe he doesn't, but doesn't actually have the usual and appropriate news folks covering his overseas trips, so the narrative is shaped by other countries -- TIL).
posted by filthy light thief at 1:52 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
sure, he's a moral monster all his life, but he also has BRAIN CANCER. it's just barely possible he doesn't know what the fuck he's doing, you know
Who cares? If he doesn't know what he's doing he has no business voting and should immediately resign.
posted by dilaudid at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2017 [24 favorites]
Who cares? If he doesn't know what he's doing he has no business voting and should immediately resign.
posted by dilaudid at 1:54 PM on July 25, 2017 [24 favorites]
This has been bugging me for days and I finally figured it out, but it turns out only one other person has made this connection on the ol twitz:
Scaramucci is Chris Sarandon in Fright Night
You're so cool, Brewster!
posted by Existential Dread at 1:55 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Scaramucci is Chris Sarandon in Fright Night
You're so cool, Brewster!
posted by Existential Dread at 1:55 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
The astounding procedural abuses of the Republican Congress
Someday soon Democrats will get another bite at the health-care apple. Pressure to pass Medicare for all, or something approximating it, will be intense. When that debate happens, Republicans will have forfeited the right to any input, attention, or political respect of any kind.
posted by T.D. Strange at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2017 [53 favorites]
Someday soon Democrats will get another bite at the health-care apple. Pressure to pass Medicare for all, or something approximating it, will be intense. When that debate happens, Republicans will have forfeited the right to any input, attention, or political respect of any kind.
posted by T.D. Strange at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2017 [53 favorites]
Helpful flowchart detailing the next steps in the healthcare charade/debacle.
posted by lydhre at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by lydhre at 1:56 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Who cares? If he doesn't know what he's doing he has no business voting and should immediately resign.
Yes, that is "the point." I have seen up close what cancer treatment does to a previously totally functional and lucid individual of nearly his age, and a person in that condition has no business voting on anything or holding any office no matter how extremely competent they were up until then. the very act of attempting to carry out his duties under the present circumstances is proof that he is not fit to do it; it would be reckless irresponsibility if he were capable of that (and if he is, then it is.)
posted by queenofbithynia at 1:57 PM on July 25, 2017
I was actually thinking that Scaramucci was Deep Space Nine Chris Sarandon.
posted by hanov3r at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by hanov3r at 1:58 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
I understand, but I'm curious if it is, actually, impeachable or unconstitutional for the president to give orders to the AG.
Giving orders is fine, it's part of the job description of the President to tell the AG what to do. It's what Trump orders the AG to do that might be impeachable.
Does "leak" even have a meaning anymore or is just it pure connotation with no denotative center left remaining?
It's just further proof that this government is postmodern literary theory applied to running a country. I hear the Republicans will be introducing a health reform bill generated with the cut up method and the budget will be entirely lacking the letter e (as well as heart).
posted by Candleman at 2:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Giving orders is fine, it's part of the job description of the President to tell the AG what to do. It's what Trump orders the AG to do that might be impeachable.
Does "leak" even have a meaning anymore or is just it pure connotation with no denotative center left remaining?
It's just further proof that this government is postmodern literary theory applied to running a country. I hear the Republicans will be introducing a health reform bill generated with the cut up method and the budget will be entirely lacking the letter e (as well as heart).
posted by Candleman at 2:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
deep space nine sarandon is close… close enough to make me realize that he's actually morden from babylon 5
posted by murphy slaw at 2:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 2:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
deep space nine sarandon is close… close enough to make me realize that he's actually morden from babylon 5
And the sooner we can all wave bye-bye to him, the better.
posted by Faint of Butt at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
And the sooner we can all wave bye-bye to him, the better.
posted by Faint of Butt at 2:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
NYC people: emergency health care rally tonight at Union Square.
posted by zachlipton at 2:10 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 2:10 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
If folks want to talk more about cancer language and fight/war metaphors, etc there's a thread about that.
posted by LobsterMitten at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by LobsterMitten at 2:11 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
AP: BREAKING: House votes overwhelmingly to slap additional sanctions on Russia, curb Trump's authority to waive the penalties.
posted by PenDevil at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [34 favorites]
posted by PenDevil at 2:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [34 favorites]
CSPAN: @Statedeptspox says Secretary of State Tillerson is "taking a little time off."
Toldja Rex was not going to react well to that Boy Scout shit.
posted by FelliniBlank at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
Toldja Rex was not going to react well to that Boy Scout shit.
posted by FelliniBlank at 2:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [18 favorites]
They were just roto-rootering in McCain's noggin on the 17th. I don't want anyone who had noodle surgery eight days ago making major decisions.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 2:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 2:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
McCain did what he always does, and there were 49 other Republican senators voting for the motion, with no shame. Go call them all, the fight isn't over.
posted by mumimor at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by mumimor at 2:35 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Welcoming McCain back to the Senate, wishing him a full recovery and giving him a big hug are all fine things to do.
I think doing those things on the Senate floor, on television, just before and right after his vote on that bill is problematic.
posted by orange ball at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
I think doing those things on the Senate floor, on television, just before and right after his vote on that bill is problematic.
posted by orange ball at 2:36 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Republican Senators up for re-election in 2018:
Arizona - Jeff Flake
Mississippi - Roger Wicker
Nebraska - Deb Fischer
Nevada - Dean Heller
Tennessee - Bob Corker
Texas - Ted Cruz
Utah - Orrin Hatch
Wyoming - John Barrasso
posted by elsietheeel at 2:40 PM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
Arizona - Jeff Flake
Mississippi - Roger Wicker
Nebraska - Deb Fischer
Nevada - Dean Heller
Tennessee - Bob Corker
Texas - Ted Cruz
Utah - Orrin Hatch
Wyoming - John Barrasso
posted by elsietheeel at 2:40 PM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
California Mefites: I know we can generally trust our senators to, like, not vote to kill us, but we should still call them. Call Feinstein and Harris and tell them to filibuster via amendment for as long as this takes. I got straight through to their LA offices when I called on my lunch break.
posted by yasaman at 2:46 PM on July 25, 2017 [25 favorites]
posted by yasaman at 2:46 PM on July 25, 2017 [25 favorites]
The subpoena for Manafort to testify tomorrow before the Judiciary Committee has been withdrawn. Apparently, they'll keep talking in private, or something.
posted by zachlipton at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 2:47 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
It looks to me like Trump is trying to turn Sessions in to the new Reek but Sessions isn't cooperating. I guess they can't all fold like Christie.
posted by Justinian at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Justinian at 2:51 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Welcoming McCain back to the Senate, wishing him a full recovery and giving him a big hug are all fine things to do.
I think doing those things on the Senate floor, on television, just before and right after his vote on that bill is problematic.
Particularly since the whole little oh-so-heartfelt pageant was cynically orchestrated to give tearjerking cover to the vote. That was a calculated photo-op on the part of the Republicans.
posted by FelliniBlank at 2:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
I think doing those things on the Senate floor, on television, just before and right after his vote on that bill is problematic.
Particularly since the whole little oh-so-heartfelt pageant was cynically orchestrated to give tearjerking cover to the vote. That was a calculated photo-op on the part of the Republicans.
posted by FelliniBlank at 2:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
Flake has a target on his back... from both sides, apparently, although our resident State Vulture Kelli Ward seems to have shifted her sights to McCain's probably-soon-to-be-available seat.
There is not a chance in hell he will shift from the conservative party line, though. He is in the pocket of the Koch brothers, and will do whatever they want so they'll keep funding his career.
posted by Superplin at 2:54 PM on July 25, 2017
There is not a chance in hell he will shift from the conservative party line, though. He is in the pocket of the Koch brothers, and will do whatever they want so they'll keep funding his career.
posted by Superplin at 2:54 PM on July 25, 2017
orange ball Welcoming McCain back to the Senate, wishing him a full recovery and giving him a big hug are all fine things to do.
I disagree.
Perhaps once, back in the mythic past of bipartisanship and comity I keep hearing people talk about, those were fine things to do.
Today?
In a Senate where McConnell, with the cooperation of **EVERY SINGLE REPUBLICAN SENATOR** stole a Supreme Court seat from Obama?
In the context of a Republican Senate giving Obama the finger when he reached out in that spirit of bipartisanship and comity?
In the context of a Republican Senate voting in lockstep to approve the most incompetent, thieving, conniving, bunch of aristocratic scumbags Trump could get to help drive the Executive branch into the ground?
In the context of their "colleagues" on the Republican side working to steal healthcare from America and doing so by breaking every norm, every rule, and shitting on the very concept of bipartisanship and comity by shutting Democrats out from everything and ramming votes through with no debate?
No.
That, right there, was the time for the Democrats to turn their backs on McCain when he entered and drown out his vile, hypocritical, speech with boos, jeers, hisses, and shrieks of laughter at inappropriate moments.
That, right there, was the time for the Democrats to wonder, loudly, why a man getting top notch government healthcare had risen from his deathbead to take that same healthcare away from Americans.
That, right there, was the time for the Democrats to point out that "war hero" John McCain was voting to kill more Americans than the Vietcong ever dreamed of killing and to wonder when exactly he decided to turn traitor.
I am finished with this bipartisan nicey nicey shit, and I am utterly disgusted that our Democratic Senators still display weak, submissive, behavior to the Republicans by pretending that chumming around with them is tolerable or laudable.
With respect to his accomplishments, fuck Al Franken if he thinks playing nice with Republicans is good, valuable, important, or justifiable. He started strong then got pulled into the Senate bullshit machine that rips the spine from Democrats but stiffens the spines of Republicans.
And, for good measure, fuck John McCain.
posted by sotonohito at 2:55 PM on July 25, 2017 [67 favorites]
I disagree.
Perhaps once, back in the mythic past of bipartisanship and comity I keep hearing people talk about, those were fine things to do.
Today?
In a Senate where McConnell, with the cooperation of **EVERY SINGLE REPUBLICAN SENATOR** stole a Supreme Court seat from Obama?
In the context of a Republican Senate giving Obama the finger when he reached out in that spirit of bipartisanship and comity?
In the context of a Republican Senate voting in lockstep to approve the most incompetent, thieving, conniving, bunch of aristocratic scumbags Trump could get to help drive the Executive branch into the ground?
In the context of their "colleagues" on the Republican side working to steal healthcare from America and doing so by breaking every norm, every rule, and shitting on the very concept of bipartisanship and comity by shutting Democrats out from everything and ramming votes through with no debate?
No.
That, right there, was the time for the Democrats to turn their backs on McCain when he entered and drown out his vile, hypocritical, speech with boos, jeers, hisses, and shrieks of laughter at inappropriate moments.
That, right there, was the time for the Democrats to wonder, loudly, why a man getting top notch government healthcare had risen from his deathbead to take that same healthcare away from Americans.
That, right there, was the time for the Democrats to point out that "war hero" John McCain was voting to kill more Americans than the Vietcong ever dreamed of killing and to wonder when exactly he decided to turn traitor.
I am finished with this bipartisan nicey nicey shit, and I am utterly disgusted that our Democratic Senators still display weak, submissive, behavior to the Republicans by pretending that chumming around with them is tolerable or laudable.
With respect to his accomplishments, fuck Al Franken if he thinks playing nice with Republicans is good, valuable, important, or justifiable. He started strong then got pulled into the Senate bullshit machine that rips the spine from Democrats but stiffens the spines of Republicans.
And, for good measure, fuck John McCain.
posted by sotonohito at 2:55 PM on July 25, 2017 [67 favorites]
while i agree with the sentiment, there is the matter of optics to think of:
"SENATE DEMS BOO DYING WAR HERO"
posted by entropicamericana at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
"SENATE DEMS BOO DYING WAR HERO"
posted by entropicamericana at 2:59 PM on July 25, 2017 [15 favorites]
"SENATE DEMS BOO DYING WAR HERO"
Former War Hero Votes to Kill 210K Americans, End 800K Jobs [fake]
- Headline from the alternate timeline where there actually is a liberal media.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 3:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [27 favorites]
Former War Hero Votes to Kill 210K Americans, End 800K Jobs [fake]
- Headline from the alternate timeline where there actually is a liberal media.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 3:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [27 favorites]
We prefer Senators who don't get brain cancer.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
I want to start a Bipartisan Advice Column.
Dear Mr. Bothsides: Every day, my neighbor takes his dog for a walk. Once the dog does his business, my neighbor picks up the poo and smears it on the handle of my front door, as well as an occasional poop swastika on my living room window. The police are working on it, but my question is - do I have to invite him to the neighborhood cookout?
- Thanks, Sick Of Poop Hands
Dear SOPH: Have you really never done the same to your neighbor? It's likely that you've been part of this escalation. Shunning him now will make things worse. You need to reach across the fence and find a compromise solution - would it be acceptable for him to poopsmear the window of your car instead, for example, which would accomplish the same goals but be easier for you to clean? Refusing to engage in constructive debate only justifies his actions.
- HTH, Mr. Bothsides
posted by 0xFCAF at 3:09 PM on July 25, 2017 [63 favorites]
Dear Mr. Bothsides: Every day, my neighbor takes his dog for a walk. Once the dog does his business, my neighbor picks up the poo and smears it on the handle of my front door, as well as an occasional poop swastika on my living room window. The police are working on it, but my question is - do I have to invite him to the neighborhood cookout?
- Thanks, Sick Of Poop Hands
Dear SOPH: Have you really never done the same to your neighbor? It's likely that you've been part of this escalation. Shunning him now will make things worse. You need to reach across the fence and find a compromise solution - would it be acceptable for him to poopsmear the window of your car instead, for example, which would accomplish the same goals but be easier for you to clean? Refusing to engage in constructive debate only justifies his actions.
- HTH, Mr. Bothsides
posted by 0xFCAF at 3:09 PM on July 25, 2017 [63 favorites]
God-damned bougy shit-smearers.
posted by Yowser at 3:12 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Yowser at 3:12 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Sarah Huckabee Sanders says Trump wants to ‘level playing field’ by opening investigation of Clinton (Travis Gettys, Raw Story)
“That frustration certainly hasn’t gone away and, you know, I don’t think it will,” Sanders said. “But given the fact that the president is being attacked unnecessarily and, certainly, for no reason on something he and, I think, most of America feel is a complete hoax and that the media has gotten so spun up on Russia fever, we’re looking to move on.”posted by Room 641-A at 3:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [16 favorites]
Trump has made clear that Sessions must launch an investigation of Hillary Clinton if he wants to stay on as attorney general — which Sanders justified as proper.
“I don’t think the president has ever sent mixed messages on how he feels about all of the improper actions that the Clintons took and certainly were involved in over the course of the last several years,” Sanders said, “and I think he is getting hit every single day on a ridiculous witch hunt that has proved nothing. People have been investigating for over a year and have found nothing. But there’s actually some real, I think, hard facts to look at when it comes to the Clintons, and I think that’s been completely ignored. The president’s looking for a fair playing field on that front.”
John McCain is one of the bravest fighters I've ever known. Basic access to health care doesn't know what it's up against. Give it hell John
posted by gwint at 3:15 PM on July 25, 2017 [40 favorites]
posted by gwint at 3:15 PM on July 25, 2017 [40 favorites]
It just never ends. Jesus was full of shit when he said the meek would inherit the Earth.
posted by Talez at 3:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by Talez at 3:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Relying on Jeff Sessions to be a bulwark against political weaponization of the DoJ. This is 2017.
O!@#HQ)(R%HFWI
posted by Talez at 3:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
O!@#HQ)(R%HFWI
posted by Talez at 3:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Attorney General Smeagol will do anything to get his Precious (segregated South) back.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 3:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
John McCain is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life.
posted by kirkaracha at 3:23 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 3:23 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
HRC needs to start growing out her hair so it's long enough to braid in order for the allegory to be more accurate.
posted by Talez at 3:24 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Talez at 3:24 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
"John McCain is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life."
Are you serious or have you never met human people.
posted by winna at 3:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Are you serious or have you never met human people.
posted by winna at 3:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
> "Sarah Huckabee Sanders says Trump wants to ‘level playing field’ by opening investigation of Clinton"
Who buys this horseshit?
I mean, seriously. I can understand people pretending to buy it because they don't actually give a shit about law or justice or anything but winning. They're scum, but at least they make logical sense to me as people that might exist.
But surely that can't be almost half the United States. Which means there must be people, a sizable number of people, who hear that kind of utter nonsense and think, "Makes sense to me!"
Who are these people?
posted by kyrademon at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Who buys this horseshit?
I mean, seriously. I can understand people pretending to buy it because they don't actually give a shit about law or justice or anything but winning. They're scum, but at least they make logical sense to me as people that might exist.
But surely that can't be almost half the United States. Which means there must be people, a sizable number of people, who hear that kind of utter nonsense and think, "Makes sense to me!"
Who are these people?
posted by kyrademon at 3:27 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
"John McCain is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life."
See: The Manchurian Candidate (YT). This is...not a compliment.
posted by MonkeyToes at 3:28 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
See: The Manchurian Candidate (YT). This is...not a compliment.
posted by MonkeyToes at 3:28 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
I am literally stunned. I've seen "evil" in the world, people doing the worst thing to children possible, and I can't imagine the hate you must have in your bones to vote against health care. What has the world come to?
Well, Trump needed a W and McConnell needed to get rid of an investment tax.
posted by Talez at 3:28 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Well, Trump needed a W and McConnell needed to get rid of an investment tax.
posted by Talez at 3:28 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
If the GOP somehow succeeds in passing a partial ACA repeal bill into law, I believe they are going to pay a heavy political price from the people they will harm, whether those people currently recognize the benefits of the ACA reforms or not. I honestly think the Republican Party would be best served by getting a handful of "moderate" senators to block a final bill; as would the the rest of the country.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:29 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:29 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Well, Trump needed a W and McConnell needed to get rid of an investment tax.
Also, this whole healthcare thing was put in place by a guy who...well, I don't want to blow anyone's mind, but he was black. Like Americans actually voted for a black president and then he accomplished stuff that helped people.
Turns out a lot of people aren't cool with that. Hell, they aren't cool with it even if it helped them personally.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 3:30 PM on July 25, 2017 [25 favorites]
Also, this whole healthcare thing was put in place by a guy who...well, I don't want to blow anyone's mind, but he was black. Like Americans actually voted for a black president and then he accomplished stuff that helped people.
Turns out a lot of people aren't cool with that. Hell, they aren't cool with it even if it helped them personally.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 3:30 PM on July 25, 2017 [25 favorites]
Drew Magary, GQ: John McCain Is the Perfect American Lie. This is spitting fire.
NYT fact check: For Trump’s ‘Victims’ of Obamacare, Senate Bill May Be Worse
Daily Beast, Woodruff: It’s Official: Attorney General Jeff Sessions Takes On Sanctuary Cities
I was duped when I gave McCain my pitiable little sum all those years ago, but I know better today. Everyone should know better. Everyone should realize that John McCain is the perfect American lie, a man who professes to be noble and fair and just while being none of those things. He served his country honorably in combat, but in no other fashion. And he serves out his time in the Senate, and here on planet Earth, as a pathetic enabler. Never the lion; always the sheep. For seventeen years, gullible people have been waiting for him to make his face turn, to make some grand defiant move for the sake of God and country. But that was always just clever branding on his part, and today should serve as a cold slap in the face to anyone who still thought he might have that kind of political courage left in him. He's a fucking disgrace.Brian Beutler: There Is No End to the Lies: Republican senators vowed not to consider Obamacare repeal without a satisfactory replacement, and yet, that is exactly what they're doing now. It's all lies, whip counts are meaningless because everyone lies, "lying as a strategic virtue has spread from Trump to the Capitol and begun to subsume the entire Republican Party."
NYT fact check: For Trump’s ‘Victims’ of Obamacare, Senate Bill May Be Worse
Daily Beast, Woodruff: It’s Official: Attorney General Jeff Sessions Takes On Sanctuary Cities
Cities that don’t let Immigration Customs and Enforcement agents into their prisons and jails will lose significant federal funding, according to an announcement Attorney General Jeff Sessions made on Tuesday afternoon.Reuters: Trump administration moves closer to undoing overtime pay rule
This is the first time the Justice Department has officially put immigration-related limits on which cities can get lucrative federal funds that many cities rely on for law enforcement, known as Byrne Justice Assistance Grants. It means the Justice Department is keeping one of President Donald Trump’s key campaign promises to crack down on sanctuary cities, in the middle of a series of verbal assaults on the Attorney General.
The announcement stipulates three new qualifications for cities to be eligible for the grants: First, they must let ICE officers have access to their detention centers. Second, they must not block their law enforcement officers from sharing information with ICE about the immigration status of people they arrest. And third, they must give ICE forty-eight hours’ notice before releasing anyone who ICE has a detainer on.
The Trump administration on Tuesday pushed forward with its bid to undo an Obama administration rule to extend mandatory overtime pay to 4.2 million workers and said it was considering treating workers differently based on location and industry.Dave Weigel: House conservatives push for a probe of Comey and Clinton campaign
The rule, which was supposed to take effect in December 2016 but was blocked by a federal judge, is a top target for business groups that say it would force employers to convert many salaried employees into hourly workers.
The U.S. Department of Labor on Tuesday called for public comments on the rule, which is the first step in revoking or revising it.
A group of conservative House Republicans has filed an amendment that would stymie one Democratic effort to investigate the firing of FBI Director James B. Comey by transforming it into an effort to probe Comey’s handling of the Hillary Clinton email scandal.posted by zachlipton at 3:31 PM on July 25, 2017 [39 favorites]
Reps. Andy Biggs (R-Ariz.), Matt Gaetz (R-Fla.), Jim Jordan (R-Ohio) and Mike Johnson (R-La.) have co-sponsored an amendment, a draft version of which was obtained by The Washington Post, that would hollow out a bill from Rep. Pramila Jayapal (D-Wash.) demanding documents related to the Comey firing. Jayapal’s legislation, which is not expected to pass, demands information sets related to issues such as “the scope or application of Attorney General Sessions’ recusal” and “any system used by the White House to secretly record conversations between President Trump and Director Comey.”
The conservative amendment would remove all of those requests and replace them with demands for information on “leaks by James B. Comey,” on “the propriety and consequence of immunity deals given to possible Hillary Clinton co-conspirators” and “James B. Comey’s knowledge of the purchase of a majority stake in the company Uranium One by the company Rosatom,” a story revealed in 2015 that has continued to rage in conservative media. Other supporters of the president have sounded similar notes, arguing that the Trump administration could do much more than it has to probe Clinton.
@studiesincrap: on this day let us remember another war hero turned senator who cast a historic vote
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:33 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:33 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
"John McCain is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life."
See: The Manchurian Candidate (YT). This is...not a compliment.
Okay so these are probably not the threads for contextless references to old Frank Sinatra movies.
posted by winna at 3:34 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
See: The Manchurian Candidate (YT). This is...not a compliment.
Okay so these are probably not the threads for contextless references to old Frank Sinatra movies.
posted by winna at 3:34 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Oh, ok. As an outsider I didn't realize all is good as long as Trump feels good. I'm going back to my misandrist queer disabled revolution fantasies for awhile. Sorry, any random white man that tries to talk to me today.
OK. Our bad. We're being facetious because we can do absolutely nothing and if we don't go with gallows humor we're probably going to need new livers. We weren't being serious.
posted by Talez at 3:35 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
OK. Our bad. We're being facetious because we can do absolutely nothing and if we don't go with gallows humor we're probably going to need new livers. We weren't being serious.
posted by Talez at 3:35 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
so how many weeks until house republicans announce plans to repeal the fair labor standards act and its onerous regulations? i say about one and a half
posted by entropicamericana at 3:37 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by entropicamericana at 3:37 PM on July 25, 2017
"Jeff Sessions Is Growing ‘Pissed’ at Trump, His Allies Say. And He Doesn’t Plan to Quit."
Hey, Jeff, you shoulda known he was . . . oh fuck it. At least I can hope we get a photo spread of these two pricks having an Oval Office slap fight.
posted by FelliniBlank at 3:37 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Hey, Jeff, you shoulda known he was . . . oh fuck it. At least I can hope we get a photo spread of these two pricks having an Oval Office slap fight.
posted by FelliniBlank at 3:37 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
s'ok. so was I because otherwise I think all of us would drown in the despair of this evil motherfucking shit
Yes. Treading water in the political equivalent of an unflushed toilet is not fun.
posted by Talez at 3:40 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Yes. Treading water in the political equivalent of an unflushed toilet is not fun.
posted by Talez at 3:40 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
because otherwise I think all of us would drown in the despair of this evil motherfucking shit
We'd all best be growing shit-gills.
posted by Rust Moranis at 3:40 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
We'd all best be growing shit-gills.
posted by Rust Moranis at 3:40 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
I haven't seen this linked here, so apologies if I've missed it (and for, well, the link source), but Vox is reporting that the president* inadvertently disclosed yet another highly-classified covert operation in his late-night tweetblurst Monday.
This is where we are now.
posted by adamgreenfield at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
This is where we are now.
posted by adamgreenfield at 3:42 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
It just keeps getting worse. I can't believe it, but somehow, it just keeps getting worse.
posted by Space Kitty at 3:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
posted by Space Kitty at 3:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [19 favorites]
Big if true: The Hill is saying that any bill lacking a full CBO score is invalid under reconciliation and will require 60 votes.
Senate Republicans offered an amendment that includes the Senate GOP proposal, known as the Better Care Reconciliation Act (BCRA), on Tuesday evening.
The amendment will also include Sen. Ted Cruz's (Texas) proposal to give insurance companies more flexibility on what kinds of health insurance plans it offers, and a Medicaid proposal from Sen. Rob Portman (Ohio).
Because the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) has analyzed neither the Cruz nor Portman proposals, the entire repeal-and-replace amendment may be required to meet a 60-vote threshold, according to guidance from Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell's (R-Ky.) office.
please oh please let this whole thing be nightmarish political kabuki rather than nightmarish actual attempts to pass laws, that would be lovely
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2017 [45 favorites]
Senate Republicans offered an amendment that includes the Senate GOP proposal, known as the Better Care Reconciliation Act (BCRA), on Tuesday evening.
The amendment will also include Sen. Ted Cruz's (Texas) proposal to give insurance companies more flexibility on what kinds of health insurance plans it offers, and a Medicaid proposal from Sen. Rob Portman (Ohio).
Because the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) has analyzed neither the Cruz nor Portman proposals, the entire repeal-and-replace amendment may be required to meet a 60-vote threshold, according to guidance from Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell's (R-Ky.) office.
please oh please let this whole thing be nightmarish political kabuki rather than nightmarish actual attempts to pass laws, that would be lovely
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:51 PM on July 25, 2017 [45 favorites]
Wow that sanctuary city announcement. Man.
Cruel, mean, and counter-productive. There's a winning GOP slogan.
posted by notyou at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
Cruel, mean, and counter-productive. There's a winning GOP slogan.
posted by notyou at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
He served his country honorably in combat, but in no other fashion.
he didn't serve humanity well by bombing the shit out of 3rd world PoC in service to the imperial aims of his country
he's not serving humanity well today
i try not to dwell on it or say much about it but as a literal child of the 60s i can't bow my head to this veneration of those who were on the side of evil and haven't learned a damned thing
posted by pyramid termite at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [33 favorites]
he didn't serve humanity well by bombing the shit out of 3rd world PoC in service to the imperial aims of his country
he's not serving humanity well today
i try not to dwell on it or say much about it but as a literal child of the 60s i can't bow my head to this veneration of those who were on the side of evil and haven't learned a damned thing
posted by pyramid termite at 3:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [33 favorites]
Nobody knew not confirming the existence of secret covert operations could be so complicated.
posted by Justinian at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 3:55 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
The Pod Save America Q&A is worth reading through. For anyone looking for a nice little summary to push back against anyone who says the Democrats "rammed" Obamacare through in a similar fashion, here it is:
posted by triggerfinger at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2017 [94 favorites]
The process of passing the Affordable Care Act began in February of 2009, and ended in March of 2010 - more than a full year. A bipartisan Gang of Six was formed - 3 Dems/3 GOP Senators - to negotiate a bill. The bill that was ultimately approved included 161 amendments authored by Republicans. The Senate health committee spent nearly 60 hours over 13 days marking up the bill. The Senate Finance Committee worked on the legislation for 8 days - the longest markup in two decades. The full Senate debated the bill for 25 straight days. There were public hearings. There was public debate. The President of the United States debated the bill on live television with Republican members of the House of Representatives. Despite all this, at the end of the day, we couldn't get a single Republican vote. So yeah, that's the process they describe as "ramming it through." -FavsFucking barbarians.
posted by triggerfinger at 3:58 PM on July 25, 2017 [94 favorites]
I didn't want to believe in a "burn it all down" future. The way was to fix it from the inside. We should have had reasoned debate and made things right. We should have sat down and discussed things fairly, like adults do in democratic countries.
That choice is no longer left to us. May the Republican blood harvest nourish the seeds of a fairer, bigger, saner government tomorrow, and may the pawns of the rich, greedy, ideologues reap what they sow. May the screams of pain they inflict be made deafening, until everyone rises up to make it stop and create a world where these monstrous people can never take power again. They have decreed blood must spill, so let it stain them forever.
posted by saysthis at 3:59 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
That choice is no longer left to us. May the Republican blood harvest nourish the seeds of a fairer, bigger, saner government tomorrow, and may the pawns of the rich, greedy, ideologues reap what they sow. May the screams of pain they inflict be made deafening, until everyone rises up to make it stop and create a world where these monstrous people can never take power again. They have decreed blood must spill, so let it stain them forever.
posted by saysthis at 3:59 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Okay so these are probably not the threads for contextless references to old Frank Sinatra movies.
Are you new here
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [38 favorites]
Are you new here
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [38 favorites]
argh, i am supposed to be on vacation, can y'all get twice as angry so i can look away for a couple of days
posted by murphy slaw at 4:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 4:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
I'm sure it will turn out that the US government scrupulously never, ever, ever gave any money to al-Qaeda offshoots and affiliates like Jabhat al-Nusra or Ahrar al-Sham, so what do they have to worry about a FOIA request?
posted by Copronymus at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Copronymus at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
He served his country honorably in combat, but in no other fashion.
I would say more that he served his country honorably in captivity. In combat, AFAIK he shamelessly relied on nepotism and favoritism from others who stood to benefit from his father the admiral to keep from being drummed out of flying on account of his several mishaps. But I could misremember.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
I would say more that he served his country honorably in captivity. In combat, AFAIK he shamelessly relied on nepotism and favoritism from others who stood to benefit from his father the admiral to keep from being drummed out of flying on account of his several mishaps. But I could misremember.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 4:03 PM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
Reuters: Trump administration moves to repeal second law of thermodynamics
The Trump administration on Tuesday pushed forward with its bid to undo the second law of thermodynamics, which they referred to as "a Liberal conspiracy to prop up the lie of global warming with junk science."posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:04 PM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
The law, which considers the flow of natural processes in terms of entropy, has come under increasing fire from the Trump administration, who consider the second law to be the enemy of conservation of energy.
"The first law was good enough for the founding fathers, it was good enough for Moses, and it's good enough for me," said Secretary of Energy Rick Perry.
The U.S. Department of Energy on Tuesday called for public comments on the law, which is the first step in revoking or revising it.
Sarah Huckabee Sanders denied rumors that revoking the second law of thermodynamics would mean the end of life as we know it. "How can something we don't understand ever mean the end of what we know, when what we know is already so plagued with misunderstanding?"
Real and fake tags people, real and fake tags.
posted by zachlipton at 4:06 PM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 4:06 PM on July 25, 2017 [29 favorites]
In reminding myself that this goddamn president and this goddamn GOP is only the latest (if also the worst) in health care bullshit, I just cracked open Jill Quadagno’s 2006 book One Nation Uninsured: Why the U.S. Has No National Health Insurance. The problem is capitalism and corporate sponsorship of politicans.
Covering the entire twentieth century, Jill Quadagno shows how each attempt to enact national health insurance was met with fierce attacks by powerful stakeholders, who mobilized their considerable resources to keep the financing of health care out of the government’s hands. Quadagno describes how at first physicians led the anti-reform coalition, fearful that government entry would mean government control of the lucrative private health care market. Doctors lobbied legislators, influenced elections by giving large campaign contributions to sympathetic candidates, and organized “grassroots” protests, conspiring with other like-minded groups to defeat reform efforts. As the success of Medicare and Medicaid in the mid-century led physicians and the AMA to start scaling back their attacks, the insurance industry began assuming a leading role against reform that continues to this day.posted by spamandkimchi at 4:09 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Real and fake tags people, real and fake tags.
I tried to use the fake tags, but the Trump Administration didn't disappear.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
I tried to use the fake tags, but the Trump Administration didn't disappear.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:12 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
History never repeats exactly but sometimes it really rhymes. From 2009, here's how conservatives reacted to Sen. Ted Kennedy's dying before passage of ObamaCare: "Bury ObamaCare with Kennedy".
posted by scalefree at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by scalefree at 4:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [7 favorites]
Washington Post has more info on the House bill for the Russia sanctions. It passed at 419-3.
Politico says the three dissenters were GOP Reps. Justin Amash of Michigan, John Duncan of Tennessee and Thomas Massie of Kentucky. Turns out the North Korea sanctions even got Rohrabacher on board.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Politico says the three dissenters were GOP Reps. Justin Amash of Michigan, John Duncan of Tennessee and Thomas Massie of Kentucky. Turns out the North Korea sanctions even got Rohrabacher on board.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Re the Benczkowski nomination for head of the DOJ. Criminal division, I found the transcript of Feinstein's statement today, but nothing at all about the vote or hearing?
(FWIW, The Manchurian Candidate was remade in 2004 with Denzel Washington.)
posted by Room 641-A at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
(FWIW, The Manchurian Candidate was remade in 2004 with Denzel Washington.)
posted by Room 641-A at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
No one considers it a great work of art
hey, you knock it off. That is pure Sinatra cinema gold right there, and has the first ever martial arts fight scene in an american film, I am reasonably certain.
posted by vrakatar at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
hey, you knock it off. That is pure Sinatra cinema gold right there, and has the first ever martial arts fight scene in an american film, I am reasonably certain.
posted by vrakatar at 4:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
Guys, I'm doing a new post right now.
posted by triggerfinger at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [21 favorites]
posted by triggerfinger at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [21 favorites]
This Ohio rally is nuts. Chants of "CNN sucks," there was a bunch of "lock her up" earlier apparently, protester being grabbed and dragged out as Trump asks "where the hell did he come from?"
posted by zachlipton at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by zachlipton at 4:22 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Chris Hedges: Donald Trump’s ideological vacuum, the more he is isolated and attacked, is being filled by the Christian right.
These believers, like all fascists, detest the reality-based world. They condemn it as contaminated, decayed and immoral. This world took their jobs. It destroyed their future. It ruined their communities. It doomed their children. It flooded their lives with alcohol, opioids, pornography, sexual abuse, jail sentences, domestic violence, deprivation and despair. And then, from the depths of suicidal despair, they suddenly discovered that God has a plan for them. God will save them. God will intervene in their lives to promote and protect them. God has called them to carry out his holy mission in the world and to be rich, powerful and happy.
posted by adamvasco at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
These believers, like all fascists, detest the reality-based world. They condemn it as contaminated, decayed and immoral. This world took their jobs. It destroyed their future. It ruined their communities. It doomed their children. It flooded their lives with alcohol, opioids, pornography, sexual abuse, jail sentences, domestic violence, deprivation and despair. And then, from the depths of suicidal despair, they suddenly discovered that God has a plan for them. God will save them. God will intervene in their lives to promote and protect them. God has called them to carry out his holy mission in the world and to be rich, powerful and happy.
posted by adamvasco at 4:24 PM on July 25, 2017 [9 favorites]
Big if true: The Hill is saying that any bill lacking a full CBO score is invalid under reconciliation and will require 60 votes.
Regarding that, TPM says "That leaves only the “skinny” option that Republicans are still formulating that is rumored to repeal the individual and employer mandates (and essentially kick the bill to a conference committee with the assumption that this bill is unlikely to become law)."
So the current plan seems to be "we didn't repeal or replace the ACA, but damn we really broke it good."
posted by diogenes at 4:29 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
Regarding that, TPM says "That leaves only the “skinny” option that Republicans are still formulating that is rumored to repeal the individual and employer mandates (and essentially kick the bill to a conference committee with the assumption that this bill is unlikely to become law)."
So the current plan seems to be "we didn't repeal or replace the ACA, but damn we really broke it good."
posted by diogenes at 4:29 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
John McCain has been amazingly successful in cultivating his false hagiography. This article in Rolling Stone prior to the 2008 election outlines what a despicable and cowardly human being he truly is.
posted by nikitabot at 4:29 PM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
posted by nikitabot at 4:29 PM on July 25, 2017 [30 favorites]
Gee, Anthony Scaramucci’s Hand Gestures Sure Look a Lot Like Trump’s
posted by kirkaracha at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by kirkaracha at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Sending a bullshit placeholder to conference committee is how you let bills die without having to be seen voting against it. This is not nearly as good as if it gets voted down in the Senate but it is infinitely better than the Senate passing something bulky enough that the House might be tempted to pass it lock, stock, and barrel.
posted by Justinian at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Justinian at 4:32 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
From that Ohio rally liveblog:
posted by Rykey at 4:34 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
"Our second amendment is very, very sound again. That would have been gonzo," Trump says.M'yeah, thanks so much for your work doing... whatever it was you did there, the Second Amendment was getting so unsound
posted by Rykey at 4:34 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
...and unfury, signifying... something.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:35 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
it would have been gonzo you guys
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Trump to crowd: "I can be more presidential than anybody who's ever held this office, that I can tell you. It's easy."
posted by Rykey at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Rykey at 4:38 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
In this moment's episode of fractally stupid: gonzo or gone-zo?
posted by feloniousmonk at 4:39 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by feloniousmonk at 4:39 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
it would have been gonzo you guys
As your attorney, I recommend you take a drop out of the brown bottle in my kit. Just a tiny taste.
posted by Existential Dread at 4:40 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
As your attorney, I recommend you take a drop out of the brown bottle in my kit. Just a tiny taste.
posted by Existential Dread at 4:40 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
I think he meant Gonzo.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:41 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:41 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Let's get down to brass tacks, Heller, Capito, Johnson. How much for the dignity?
posted by delfin at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by delfin at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
The funny thing is that he pulled that "I can be more presidential than anybody" stuff during the campaign to try to convince voters he'd settle down if he won. Now he's been President for six months and he's still running around promising he can be presidential.
posted by zachlipton at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by zachlipton at 4:42 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I think maybe he thinks he's president of his fraternity?
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:44 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 4:44 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Trump: Are my methods unsound?
Scaramucci: I don't see any method at all, sir.
This is a reference to the 1979 Francis Ford Coppola film Apocalypse Now. I changed the character names from (Colonel Walter E.) Kurtz to (President Donald J.) Trump and (Captain Benjamin L.) Willard to (White House Communications Director Anthony) Scaramucci to draw a parallel between the insanity of the Trump administration and the insanity on view in the film. This does not represent an actual quote, but a parody through deliberate misattribution of dialog from the film.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [94 favorites]
Scaramucci: I don't see any method at all, sir.
This is a reference to the 1979 Francis Ford Coppola film Apocalypse Now. I changed the character names from (Colonel Walter E.) Kurtz to (President Donald J.) Trump and (Captain Benjamin L.) Willard to (White House Communications Director Anthony) Scaramucci to draw a parallel between the insanity of the Trump administration and the insanity on view in the film. This does not represent an actual quote, but a parody through deliberate misattribution of dialog from the film.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [94 favorites]
Man, I've purposely avoided listening to this jackasses' rallies lately, but he's back in fine form, bragging and lying his ass off. He just claimed that with very few exceptions, no other president has accomplished anything close to what he has in his first six months. The crowd, of course, is eating it up.
Here's hoping our reward for listening to him go on is that he'll cause even more problems for himself and his administration.
posted by Rykey at 4:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Here's hoping our reward for listening to him go on is that he'll cause even more problems for himself and his administration.
posted by Rykey at 4:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
Is this really a 2020 campaign rally? I'm so confused.
posted by diogenes at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Please stop, Rykey.
They'll kick me out of the library if I throw any more of their computers at the wall.
posted by notyou at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
They'll kick me out of the library if I throw any more of their computers at the wall.
posted by notyou at 4:47 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
> I didn't want to believe in a "burn it all down" future. The way was to fix it from the inside. We should have had reasoned debate and made things right. We should have sat down and discussed things fairly, like adults do in democratic countries. That choice is no longer left to us. May the Republican blood harvest nourish the seeds of a fairer, bigger, saner government tomorrow, and may the pawns of the rich, greedy, ideologues reap what they sow. May the screams of pain they inflict be made deafening, until everyone rises up to make it stop and create a world where these monstrous people can never take power again. They have decreed blood must spill, so let it stain them forever.
2017: the year You Can't Tip a Buick had to start telling other people to dial it back a bit.
but yeah. The sooner everyone can become comfortable with the knowledge that politics is about power and material interests, not reason and debate, the better it will be for everyone.
The thing is, though, we have never resolved political disputes through reason and debate. This isn't a thing Trump has done to us, or that the Tea Party has done to us; it's a pre-existing thing that the presence of Trumpists and other Republicans has simply forced us to acknowledge. The Enlightenment ideal of reasoned debate as a means of decision-making, or even as a means of determining truth, is itself a mirage; not only is it not possible, but pretending that that's how things are done (or even pretending that it could be possible) is a way to get your literal and metaphorical lunch eaten by people with more realistic takes on how power operates in the world. Winning doesn't mean coming up with the most soundly reasoned and most eloquently defended scheme for achieving maximal utility for all; winning means gaining power for our side and stripping power from their side. And it means finding the clarity of mind to acknowledge that we're not trying to set up a "fair" system that allows for decisionmaking through reason and debate — instead, we're just trying to get power for our side using whatever tactics are most effective.
The question I have to ask, though, and the question I don't have an answer to, is by what specific means, and through what specific organizations, is it possible for everyone to rise up and make it stop and create a world where these monstrous people can never take power again? This isn't a question of theory answerable by reason; it's a question of practice, requiring referents to extant things in the world.
The organizations that most clearly express a desire to see everyone rising up to make it stop by creating a world where these monstrous people can never take power again are the revolutionary socialist organizations; unfortunately, these groups tend to be flaky, silly, or flatly insane, and what successes they have tend to come despite their revolutionary line, rather than because of it. (see: Kshama Sawant winning a city council seat in Seattle as a member ofMilitant Tendency Socialist Alternative)
Like many people here I see more revolutionary potential in mass, organized fiscal non-compliance than in conventional workers' movements or a conventional general strike or whatever. This is because of the weakness of organized labor in the post-Reagan U.S. But mass fiscal noncompliance is at this moment just an idea, not something with the sort of organizational backing needed to make it something real in the world.
this is where I maybe ask others to write a sales pitch for DSA, cause it seems like of all the organizations on the left, they're currently the ones best suited for (or, rather, least unsuited for) sparking off the type of serious nationwide mass action that we'll need to dislodge the motherfuckers.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2017 [26 favorites]
2017: the year You Can't Tip a Buick had to start telling other people to dial it back a bit.
but yeah. The sooner everyone can become comfortable with the knowledge that politics is about power and material interests, not reason and debate, the better it will be for everyone.
The thing is, though, we have never resolved political disputes through reason and debate. This isn't a thing Trump has done to us, or that the Tea Party has done to us; it's a pre-existing thing that the presence of Trumpists and other Republicans has simply forced us to acknowledge. The Enlightenment ideal of reasoned debate as a means of decision-making, or even as a means of determining truth, is itself a mirage; not only is it not possible, but pretending that that's how things are done (or even pretending that it could be possible) is a way to get your literal and metaphorical lunch eaten by people with more realistic takes on how power operates in the world. Winning doesn't mean coming up with the most soundly reasoned and most eloquently defended scheme for achieving maximal utility for all; winning means gaining power for our side and stripping power from their side. And it means finding the clarity of mind to acknowledge that we're not trying to set up a "fair" system that allows for decisionmaking through reason and debate — instead, we're just trying to get power for our side using whatever tactics are most effective.
The question I have to ask, though, and the question I don't have an answer to, is by what specific means, and through what specific organizations, is it possible for everyone to rise up and make it stop and create a world where these monstrous people can never take power again? This isn't a question of theory answerable by reason; it's a question of practice, requiring referents to extant things in the world.
The organizations that most clearly express a desire to see everyone rising up to make it stop by creating a world where these monstrous people can never take power again are the revolutionary socialist organizations; unfortunately, these groups tend to be flaky, silly, or flatly insane, and what successes they have tend to come despite their revolutionary line, rather than because of it. (see: Kshama Sawant winning a city council seat in Seattle as a member of
Like many people here I see more revolutionary potential in mass, organized fiscal non-compliance than in conventional workers' movements or a conventional general strike or whatever. This is because of the weakness of organized labor in the post-Reagan U.S. But mass fiscal noncompliance is at this moment just an idea, not something with the sort of organizational backing needed to make it something real in the world.
this is where I maybe ask others to write a sales pitch for DSA, cause it seems like of all the organizations on the left, they're currently the ones best suited for (or, rather, least unsuited for) sparking off the type of serious nationwide mass action that we'll need to dislodge the motherfuckers.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 4:48 PM on July 25, 2017 [26 favorites]
Is this really a 2020 campaign rally? I'm so confused.
Yes. Trump filed for re-election on Inauguration Day.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:49 PM on July 25, 2017 [11 favorites]
"Our second amendment is very, very sound again. That would have been gonzo," Trump says.
To paraphrase my sister: Anyone who sees guns as a right but healthcare as a privilege is screwed up beyond measure.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [54 favorites]
To paraphrase my sister: Anyone who sees guns as a right but healthcare as a privilege is screwed up beyond measure.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [54 favorites]
Scaramucci to the BBC in January 2016:
posted by zachlipton at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
For now, Mr Scaramucci is backing Florida's Jeb Bush, and is confident that someone other than Mr Trump will become the next US president.If I had to guess when this all falls apart, it's the instant Time puts Scaramucci on the cover.
But, what if his worst nightmares come true?
"If Donald Trump becomes the next president, I'm looking forward to the BBC helping me find a flat somewhere in London," he jokes.
posted by zachlipton at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
Rep. Ted Lieu (D-Calif.) introduced two amendments Monday that put focus on President Trump’s family and businesses, including one that would strip funding from senior White House adviser Jared Kushner’s office.
posted by Room 641-A at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [72 favorites]
The first amendment to the Make America Safe Appropriations Act for Fiscal 2018 would block anyone who has resubmitted a SF-86 security clearance form more than twice to add previously undisclosed contact with Russian officials from receiving a salary or the expenses for an office space or support staff. Such a person would also not be able to receive classified information.Ted Lieu \o/
[...]
The second amendment is the same one Lieu offered to the fiscal 2018 National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) earlier this month, blocking defense funds from being used to “conduct business, including the purchase of hotel rooms or conference space, with any entity owned by or significantly controlled by the President or a member of the President’s immediate family.”
posted by Room 641-A at 4:53 PM on July 25, 2017 [72 favorites]
winning means gaining power for our side and stripping power from their side. And it means finding the clarity of mind to acknowledge that we're not trying to set up a "fair" system that allows for decisionmaking through reason and debate — instead, we're just trying to get power for our side using whatever tactics are most effective.
There's a limit, though, is there not? I assume you wouldn't support the literal disenfranchisement of Republican voters? How about preemptive political violence? That's pretty effective in gaining power.
I think "get the power by whatever tactics work" is too reductive.
posted by Justinian at 4:54 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
There's a limit, though, is there not? I assume you wouldn't support the literal disenfranchisement of Republican voters? How about preemptive political violence? That's pretty effective in gaining power.
I think "get the power by whatever tactics work" is too reductive.
posted by Justinian at 4:54 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Trump says "We are liberating towns and cities. People are screaming from their windows 'Thank you! Thank you!" [real]
posted by diogenes at 4:54 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 4:54 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
I completely understand Tillerson needing to take some time off. I've said it before but men simply lack the stamina need to do a difficult job.
posted by misterpatrick at 4:57 PM on July 25, 2017 [23 favorites]
posted by misterpatrick at 4:57 PM on July 25, 2017 [23 favorites]
He just did a riff about "the animals" in this country who use knives to slice and dice beautiful 15 and 16 year old girls so they suffer more than if they used a gun.
I'm gonna turn this off now...
posted by diogenes at 4:59 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
I'm gonna turn this off now...
posted by diogenes at 4:59 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
When did he start saying "hell" this much? This is a pretty profane speech
posted by scrowdid at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by scrowdid at 5:00 PM on July 25, 2017
Politico: How the GOP brought Obamacare repeal back from the dead, in which Sen. Lee is caught sending text messages about the bill by someone who sat next to him on a flight and relayed the contents to Politico [real]
posted by zachlipton at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
One of the final holdouts was Sen. Mike Lee, a conservative Utah senator who believed GOP leaders had listened to his ideas for weeks only to ignore them in the end.Then he voted for it anyway.
On a Delta flight from Salt Lake City to Washington Monday afternoon, Lee sat in the middle seat, furiously texting about his latest thinking in the health care debate, according to an eyewitness who sat next to Lee and described the messages to POLITICO.
In one text, Lee told a recipient that he might still vote to proceed to the repeal debate, but that it was “still too early to do so in good conscience because we’re not being told anything.”
“This leadership line of pass something, anything, is dangerous and potent,” Lee typed out in another message, written in large enough font that fellow passengers could easily read his words, according to the eyewitness. In another text, Lee wrote: “This bill is nothing more than bailing out insurance companies with a few minor reforms thrown in for good measure.”
Lee’s office did not dispute the messages when asked about them by POLITICO. He has aired similar complaints publicly, though in milder language.
“We are not going to authenticate any of these statements; doing so would only encourage the most boorish, voyeuristic behavior in an already too-uncivil town,” a spokesman for Lee said. “Sen. Lee has been having honest discussions with people in the White House and Senate about health care. If one narrow part of one of those conversations was observed by a third party, it would only show how thorough the senator has been in his deliberations."
posted by zachlipton at 5:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
Is "fiscal non-compliance" the tax strike?
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 5:02 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 5:02 PM on July 25, 2017
I'll quit threadsitting, but seriously, this rally is some straight-up fascist tent revival stuff if anybody can watch. Led by a total fucking lunatic whipping a crowd of foaming-at-the-mouth knuckle draggers. He's going point by point, hitting all the hot buttons (roving Hispanic gangs slicing up young girls, building the wall, RADICAL ISLAMIC TERROR).
I'm from northeast Ohio, and I'm still astonished. This is scary.
posted by Rykey at 5:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
I'm from northeast Ohio, and I'm still astonished. This is scary.
posted by Rykey at 5:02 PM on July 25, 2017 [22 favorites]
I think if their ever come see a time that republicants aren't disproportionately represented up and down the political scale THEN we can MAYBE worry about the money getting disenfranchised, and until that remains a concern for dimbulb delusional types with massive arsenals hidden in their basements.
posted by Artw at 5:04 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by Artw at 5:04 PM on July 25, 2017
> Is "fiscal non-compliance" the tax strike?
Tax strikes are a strategy for fiscal non-compliance, as are rent strikes, student loan strikes, and other similar organized refusals to pay odious debts.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Tax strikes are a strategy for fiscal non-compliance, as are rent strikes, student loan strikes, and other similar organized refusals to pay odious debts.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
i wish i could tell the difference between trump getting really worked up by a lively rally crowd and him having a psychotic break on live tv due to the snapping jaws of a federal investigation
posted by murphy slaw at 5:06 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by murphy slaw at 5:06 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
The live stream comments on this Youtube stream, though.
There's something *so* chilling about them.
We all know you don't read the comments.
But these comments are flying in & scrolling out of view so quickly. It's just so overwhelming. You imagine that the awfulness of a standard comment thread has to aggregate over time, but this is an unending torrent of vitriol and it's flowing realtime.
The hatred, ignorance, & glee at the prospect of violence against minorities & dems. I just can't..
posted by narwhal at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
There's something *so* chilling about them.
We all know you don't read the comments.
But these comments are flying in & scrolling out of view so quickly. It's just so overwhelming. You imagine that the awfulness of a standard comment thread has to aggregate over time, but this is an unending torrent of vitriol and it's flowing realtime.
The hatred, ignorance, & glee at the prospect of violence against minorities & dems. I just can't..
posted by narwhal at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
I always took fiscal non-compliance as "Don't pay any of your bills to a major corporation". Which includes power bills if you can score enough solar panels to power your fridge, but I might be stretching it there.
posted by eclectist at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by eclectist at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
I wish I could tell the difference between the President of the United States and a fascist madman.
posted by diogenes at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by diogenes at 5:08 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
I wish I could tell the difference between the President of the United States and a fascist madman.
Time.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
Time.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [5 favorites]
He's still riding the high of yesterday's speech, not realizing that he could have gone up there and belched the alphabet and that crowd was so amped on lack of sleep, adrenaline, and teenageness they would have gotten just as excited. Maybe more if he'd belched some swears.
posted by camyram at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by camyram at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
There's a limit, though, is there not? I assume you wouldn't support the literal disenfranchisement of Republican voters?
Not the voters, the candidates. The Republican Party should be banned. Their views are extremely dangerous not just for the people of this country, but for the entire world. If they aren't stopped, millions will die.
posted by chaz at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Not the voters, the candidates. The Republican Party should be banned. Their views are extremely dangerous not just for the people of this country, but for the entire world. If they aren't stopped, millions will die.
posted by chaz at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Remember, avoid dystopian fantasies such as any description of current events.
posted by Artw at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
posted by Artw at 5:13 PM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
Anybody have a link to good rally follow-up commentary video?
posted by Rykey at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by Rykey at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2017
Uhhhhh. So the administration has been fighting about what to do about Afghanistan, and it seems like they've found a new angle, per Mark Landler and James Risen at the Times: Trump Finds Reason for the U.S. to Remain in Afghanistan: Minerals
President Trump, searching for a reason to keep the United States in Afghanistan after 16 years of war, has latched on to a prospect that tantalized previous administrations: Afghanistan’s vast mineral wealth, which his advisers and Afghan officials have told him could be profitably extracted by Western companies.This bit nicely sums up why this is horrible:
Mr. Trump has discussed the country’s mineral deposits with President Ashraf Ghani, who promoted mining as an economic opportunity in one of their first conversations. Mr. Trump, who is deeply skeptical about sending more American troops to Afghanistan, has suggested that this could be one justification for the United States to stay engaged in the country.
To explore the possibilities, the White House is considering sending an envoy to Afghanistan to meet with mining officials. Last week, as the White House fell into an increasingly fractious debate over Afghanistan policy, three of Mr. Trump’s senior aides met with a chemical executive, Michael N. Silver, to discuss the potential for extracting rare-earth minerals. Mr. Silver’s firm, American Elements, specializes in these minerals, which are used in a range of high-tech products.
Stephen A. Feinberg, a billionaire financier who is informally advising Mr. Trump on Afghanistan, is also looking into ways to exploit the country’s minerals, according to a person who has briefed him. Mr. Feinberg owns a large military contracting firm, DynCorp International, which could play a role in guarding mines — a major concern, given that some of Afghanistan’s richest deposits are in areas controlled by the Taliban.
“It would be dangerous to use the potential for resource exploitation as a selling point for military engagement,” said Laurel Miller, a senior analyst at RAND who served until last month as the State Department’s special representative for Afghanistan and Pakistan. “The barriers to entry are really quite considerable, and that kind of argument could fuel suspicion about America’s real intentions in Afghanistan.”posted by zachlipton at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
The Enlightenment ideal of reasoned debate as a means of decision-making, or even as a means of determining truth, is itself a mirage; not only is it not possible, but pretending that that's how things are done (or even pretending that it could be possible) is a way to get your literal and metaphorical lunch eaten by people with more realistic takes on how power operates in the world
I realize that this is neither the time (this historical moment) nor the place (a 2000 comment internet thread) for nuance, but I'll write it anyway. Civilization can't exist without both reason and power. Rely only on sweet reason and you will get your metaphorical lunch eaten; rely only on power and you get not so metaphorical killing fields.
(More than that it's just dumb to run in a rhetorical medium about the helplessnesd of rhetoric. Pardon me, I just have this bug up my ass.)
posted by octobersurprise at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
I realize that this is neither the time (this historical moment) nor the place (a 2000 comment internet thread) for nuance, but I'll write it anyway. Civilization can't exist without both reason and power. Rely only on sweet reason and you will get your metaphorical lunch eaten; rely only on power and you get not so metaphorical killing fields.
(More than that it's just dumb to run in a rhetorical medium about the helplessnesd of rhetoric. Pardon me, I just have this bug up my ass.)
posted by octobersurprise at 5:14 PM on July 25, 2017 [17 favorites]
> There's a limit, though, is there not? I assume you wouldn't support the literal disenfranchisement of Republican voters?
I mean, I don't know? I do know that we can't understand democracy as simply being the universal franchise, or as participation in electoral politics generally.
> (More than that it's just dumb to run in a rhetorical medium about the helplessnesd of rhetoric. Pardon me, I just have this bug up my ass.)
Hah, yes, that is precisely how I'm an idiot.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
I mean, I don't know? I do know that we can't understand democracy as simply being the universal franchise, or as participation in electoral politics generally.
> (More than that it's just dumb to run in a rhetorical medium about the helplessnesd of rhetoric. Pardon me, I just have this bug up my ass.)
Hah, yes, that is precisely how I'm an idiot.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:16 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
I for one refuse to scream thank you from my window until my town is safe from the knife wielding gangs.
posted by diogenes at 5:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by diogenes at 5:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
“Sometimes they say, ‘He doesn’t act presidential.’ And I say, with the exception of the late, great Abraham Lincoln, I can be more presidential than any president that’s held this office. That I can tell you. It’s real easy.” [real]
posted by AFABulous at 5:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
posted by AFABulous at 5:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
“It would be dangerous to use the potential for resource exploitation as a selling point for military engagement,” said Laurel Miller, a senior analyst at RAND who served until last month as the State Department’s special representative for Afghanistan and Pakistan. “The barriers to entry are really quite considerable, and that kind of argument could fuel suspicion about America’s real intentions in Afghanistan.”
Did anyone actually think the "we should have taken Iraq's oil" thing was a one-off?
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:24 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
Did anyone actually think the "we should have taken Iraq's oil" thing was a one-off?
posted by FelliniBlank at 5:24 PM on July 25, 2017 [4 favorites]
“Sometimes they say, ‘He doesn’t act presidential.’ And I say, with the exception of the late, great Abraham Lincoln, I can be more presidential than any president that’s held this office. That I can tell you. It’s real easy.”
I propose a new term: tsarcasm.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
I propose a new term: tsarcasm.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 5:25 PM on July 25, 2017 [20 favorites]
The gym has tv's at most bikes and treadmills. As I was teaching boy how to use the rowing machine, two white men, 60ish, were watching Fox and talking about how the Mueller investigation should be shut down, since it's all democrats just trying to poison the country with this silly Russian talk. Because I am a bad person, I used my Boris and Natasha accent, and starting talking to Boy, who responded in the same accent, and we proceeded to talk about how happy we were about comrade trumpski and how winning the cold war was so easy, we just had to wait for everyone to love moneys more than they loved their country.
One of the men turned and gave me a filthy look and Boy said, what, it's only stupid peasants who will die, celebrate your victory comrade, This is what you have been fighting for. Celebrate. Be proud. It's just end of democracy, why you so mad?
The dude turned purple. And I about fell off my rowing machine laughing, which seriously sent this dude scurrying off like my crazy was contagious.
And then I came home and read the votes, and I stood in the kitchen making dinner and crying. This is so fucked up. And I'm going to take some time to be sad, and realize that I have never been as disillusioned as I am right now.
But fuck them if they think they've won. We have not even begun to fight. I will reenter this battle, sadder, less forgiving, and certainly with the veils of bipartisanship ripped from my view, but right on we will. They can't have this country. It's mine. It's yours. It's my son's and your daughter's. We built this country, and we will not let them tear it down to build palaces to keep us out.
We resist. We fight. We will never give in.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 5:28 PM on July 25, 2017 [138 favorites]
One of the men turned and gave me a filthy look and Boy said, what, it's only stupid peasants who will die, celebrate your victory comrade, This is what you have been fighting for. Celebrate. Be proud. It's just end of democracy, why you so mad?
The dude turned purple. And I about fell off my rowing machine laughing, which seriously sent this dude scurrying off like my crazy was contagious.
And then I came home and read the votes, and I stood in the kitchen making dinner and crying. This is so fucked up. And I'm going to take some time to be sad, and realize that I have never been as disillusioned as I am right now.
But fuck them if they think they've won. We have not even begun to fight. I will reenter this battle, sadder, less forgiving, and certainly with the veils of bipartisanship ripped from my view, but right on we will. They can't have this country. It's mine. It's yours. It's my son's and your daughter's. We built this country, and we will not let them tear it down to build palaces to keep us out.
We resist. We fight. We will never give in.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 5:28 PM on July 25, 2017 [138 favorites]
Historian Kate Antonova has now taken her epic tweetstorm on why the GOP is no longer a 'conservative' party but a radical right movement and turned it into an essay.
posted by Numenius at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by Numenius at 5:37 PM on July 25, 2017 [14 favorites]
SecretAgentSockpuppet, you're a good parent.
posted by AFABulous at 5:38 PM on July 25, 2017 [31 favorites]
posted by AFABulous at 5:38 PM on July 25, 2017 [31 favorites]
In 2016 Clinton won the district by 0.3%, and (now deceased) Democratic State Senator Scott McGilvray won the district by 2%.
Lalex, this seems like a very good sign, unless I'm missing some redistricting or something that would explain this away.
posted by greermahoney at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Lalex, this seems like a very good sign, unless I'm missing some redistricting or something that would explain this away.
posted by greermahoney at 5:45 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
So I guess insurance companies are excited - a spam email directed me to this site: Trump Health Care
posted by obliquity of the ecliptic at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by obliquity of the ecliptic at 5:53 PM on July 25, 2017
I don't understand this stuff about "Why not investigate Hillary?" She is being investigated by the House Oversight Committee and there is also an investigation into her private server by the committee on Technology or something that threatened to prosecute the company that set up the server. I last heard about these investigations three months or so ago; have they folded? And, IIRC, these two were not the only investigations going on -- in fact, I think there was one still talking about Benghazi. I mean, I know "What about Hillary?" is only noise, but it seems to me there is an answer: she is being investigated, just like the President, and all the investigations should proceed.
posted by CCBC at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by CCBC at 6:07 PM on July 25, 2017 [3 favorites]
Sen. Chris Murphy of CT just said on Maddow that he's personally planning to offer over 100 amendments.
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:10 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:10 PM on July 25, 2017 [12 favorites]
Yeah, no re-districting in the NH Senate race, just the same Dem overperformance we've generally been seeing in the specials.
The GOP was taking a keen interest in this one, too - I know gov Sununu was campaigning for the Rep candidate.
posted by Chrysostom at 6:11 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
The GOP was taking a keen interest in this one, too - I know gov Sununu was campaigning for the Rep candidate.
posted by Chrysostom at 6:11 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Hah, yes, that is precisely how I'm an idiot.
I feel like a dick when I write things like that but I do believe it's true and at this moment I'm clinging to Enlightenment values as tightly as I can. Namaste.
posted by octobersurprise at 6:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I feel like a dick when I write things like that but I do believe it's true and at this moment I'm clinging to Enlightenment values as tightly as I can. Namaste.
posted by octobersurprise at 6:17 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
Everyone is giving McCain shit for voting for the motion to proceed, but he seems 100% positive that the debate is going to be a dumpster fire and nothing will pass.
What possible reason is there to believe any word or phrase that ever comes out of this lying craven party hack lickspittle's mouth?
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
What possible reason is there to believe any word or phrase that ever comes out of this lying craven party hack lickspittle's mouth?
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2017 [13 favorites]
(Whoops, old thread by mistake.)
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2017
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:19 PM on July 25, 2017
I thought Jamie Gorelick was representing her.
Kenny Gorelick. The Trumps don't really do background checks very well.
posted by ctmf at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Kenny Gorelick. The Trumps don't really do background checks very well.
posted by ctmf at 6:30 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
Sending a bullshit placeholder to conference committee is how you let bills die without having to be seen voting against it. This is not nearly as good as if it gets voted down in the Senate but it is infinitely better than the Senate passing something bulky enough that the House might be tempted to pass it lock, stock, and barrel.
But they might just do that.
posted by ctmf at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
But they might just do that.
posted by ctmf at 6:56 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
I don't understand this stuff about 'Why not investigate Hillary?' She is being investigated by the House Oversight Committee and there is also an investigation into her private server by the committee on Technology or something that threatened to prosecute the company that set up the server.
As of October 2015 there had been eight Republican-led congressional investigations into Hillary Clinton and Benghazi:
- The House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform
- The Senate Committee On Homeland Security And Governmental Affairs
- The Senate Select Committee on Intelligence
- The House Committee on Foreign Affairs
- The House Committee on the Judiciary
- The House Committee on Armed Services
- The House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence
- The House Select Committee on Benghazi (ongoing in October 2015)
posted by kirkaracha at 7:20 PM on July 25, 2017 [8 favorites]
I believe the line is seriously that since there is an investigation into Russia's efforts to sway the election for Trump their should, for the sake of fairness, be an additional investigation into non-existent Russian efforts to sway the election for Clinton .
posted by Artw at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Artw at 7:24 PM on July 25, 2017 [1 favorite]
No. I'm not leaving until there's milk and cookies.
posted by petebest at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by petebest at 8:05 PM on July 25, 2017 [2 favorites]
🍕 🍺
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 8:09 PM on July 25, 2017 [10 favorites]
but what about the Russian efforts to sway the vote for Meee
posted by aspersioncast at 9:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by aspersioncast at 9:01 PM on July 25, 2017 [6 favorites]
winning means gaining power for our side and stripping power from their side
This is the kind of zero-sum thinking that fulfills its own dark prophecy. It subsumes all of human activity until nothing is true and everything is permitted. At that point you'd best be one of the winners.
posted by dmh at 7:52 AM on July 26, 2017 [1 favorite]
This is the kind of zero-sum thinking that fulfills its own dark prophecy. It subsumes all of human activity until nothing is true and everything is permitted. At that point you'd best be one of the winners.
posted by dmh at 7:52 AM on July 26, 2017 [1 favorite]
Yes, we'd best become the winners. Fuckers aren't be going to dismantle their own zero sum game.
posted by Artw at 7:57 AM on July 26, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Artw at 7:57 AM on July 26, 2017 [1 favorite]
"After consultation with my Generals and military experts, please be advised that the United States Government will not accept or allow Transgender individuals to serve in any capacity in the U.S. Military. Our military must be focused on decisive and overwhelming victory and cannot be burdened with the tremendous medical costs and disruption that transgender in the military would entail. Thank you"
http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/26/politics/trump-military-transgender/index.html
"I really think we would want transgender people in our military, because if these are not brave as hell individuals, then I just don't know who is." - a friend
"Executive Order 9981 was an executive order issued on July 26, 1948, by President Harry S. Truman. It abolished racial discrimination in the United States Armed Forces and eventually led to the end of segregation in the services."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_9981
posted by Evilspork at 8:30 AM on July 26, 2017
http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/26/politics/trump-military-transgender/index.html
"I really think we would want transgender people in our military, because if these are not brave as hell individuals, then I just don't know who is." - a friend
"Executive Order 9981 was an executive order issued on July 26, 1948, by President Harry S. Truman. It abolished racial discrimination in the United States Armed Forces and eventually led to the end of segregation in the services."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_9981
posted by Evilspork at 8:30 AM on July 26, 2017
I prefer this thread. That new thread loads too fast.
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 9:47 AM on July 26, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by It's Raining Florence Henderson at 9:47 AM on July 26, 2017 [14 favorites]
And such small portions!
posted by Room 641-A at 10:05 AM on July 26, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by Room 641-A at 10:05 AM on July 26, 2017 [14 favorites]
« Older The South Will Rise Again On HBO | When even the upside lets you down Newer »
This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
posted by wittgenstein at 6:45 AM on July 20, 2017 [8 favorites]