Lengthy how-I-get-to-sleep notes
April 11, 2024 9:54 AM Subscribe
"Notes on sleep" by Jed Hartman: "For many years, I had various forms of insomnia, and I still occasionally have trouble falling asleep and/or wake up too early and can’t get back to sleep. This page covers some of the things that have and haven’t helped me with that." And: "2024 sleep masterpost" by Azure Jane Lunatic (Azz for short): "Occasionally people on the internet ask for the community's collected wisdom about sleep. This is what I can think of for my own sleep routines, tips, and tricks, plus what I do about various confounding factors.... I have Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome, primary insomnia, sleep maintenance insomnia, and ADHD." The latter has people sharing their experiences in the comments. (Disclaimer: I know both these people.)
Interesting! Thanks for posting.
I've been giving a lot of thought to sleep lately because mine had deteriorated, partly I think from anxiety and sadness (I've been going through a divorce) but mostly because one of my shoulders has started hurting when I sleep on it, but I'm a side-sleeper. I bought a crazy pillow with a hole in it for your shoulder and arm, which has helped a lot.
I really like what Jed says about having to decide if a given activity was or wasn’t appropriate for sleep hygiene would make him feel anxious, as I've often thought that. I'm a person who reads in bed.
On darkness, one of his other categories: I went through a couple months about 30 years ago when I couldn't go to sleep in the dark. I had to have the ceiling light turned on full-strength to be able to go to sleep, feeling as though otherwise somebody would creep up on me and attack me in my sleep - because I had in fact been attacked in my sleep and it took awhile to get over the idea that it could happen again at any time regardless that my living situation had completely changed. I haven't thought about that in years.
Also Azz's point about becoming habituated to an alarm... I have noticed that when I turn on the fan in my room now, it has a very faint whine that sounds a bit like my wake-up alarm at its lowest volume setting, and so it's been waking me up randomly in the night. I should probably do something about that...
posted by joannemerriam at 10:14 AM on April 11 [4 favorites]
I've been giving a lot of thought to sleep lately because mine had deteriorated, partly I think from anxiety and sadness (I've been going through a divorce) but mostly because one of my shoulders has started hurting when I sleep on it, but I'm a side-sleeper. I bought a crazy pillow with a hole in it for your shoulder and arm, which has helped a lot.
I really like what Jed says about having to decide if a given activity was or wasn’t appropriate for sleep hygiene would make him feel anxious, as I've often thought that. I'm a person who reads in bed.
On darkness, one of his other categories: I went through a couple months about 30 years ago when I couldn't go to sleep in the dark. I had to have the ceiling light turned on full-strength to be able to go to sleep, feeling as though otherwise somebody would creep up on me and attack me in my sleep - because I had in fact been attacked in my sleep and it took awhile to get over the idea that it could happen again at any time regardless that my living situation had completely changed. I haven't thought about that in years.
Also Azz's point about becoming habituated to an alarm... I have noticed that when I turn on the fan in my room now, it has a very faint whine that sounds a bit like my wake-up alarm at its lowest volume setting, and so it's been waking me up randomly in the night. I should probably do something about that...
posted by joannemerriam at 10:14 AM on April 11 [4 favorites]
Sleep, and how to get there, has always been very mysterious and unknowable to me. I know that it happens, clearly, and can sometimes witness it - thoughts become illogical, random associations, vivid imagery - but when that happens I usually wake back up, which is why I remember it. I liken it to being a child, when we would sometimes be on regular streets and other times on highways, and I never understood how we made that transition. Only when I got my license did I truly comprehend on- and off-ramps. Sadly, as an adult, I have had no such luck in making the equivalent discovery re: sleep.
Diphenhydramine is the most effective thing for me, but I take it sparingly due to the mind-fog effect. Most of the time I will just move to the couch, which for some reason is easier for me to fall asleep on than the bed.
posted by grumpybear69 at 10:30 AM on April 11 [5 favorites]
Diphenhydramine is the most effective thing for me, but I take it sparingly due to the mind-fog effect. Most of the time I will just move to the couch, which for some reason is easier for me to fall asleep on than the bed.
posted by grumpybear69 at 10:30 AM on April 11 [5 favorites]
This reddit comment by u/poopycakes may have saved my life:
posted by capricorn at 10:31 AM on April 11 [23 favorites]
The best one I've learned is called mental scrabble. For each letter of the alphabet pick 2 completely unrelated words. I never make it passed J before falling asleepI've tried every damn breathing and mindfulness and counting-backwards-from-100 and body scan exercise under the sun. NOTHING worked. This works.
posted by capricorn at 10:31 AM on April 11 [23 favorites]
- long charger cable that reaches from the plug well off the bed to any side of my pillow (there is a horrifying experience someone had with an extension cord and a half-unplugged charger and a necklace)
Wait, what? Did somebody get electrocuted by this collection of items?!
- dim light I can turn on if I'm too tired to plug in my phone in the dark (F you Mr. Sherlock Holmes)
Plz explain the Sherlock Holmes bit
posted by cnidaria at 10:45 AM on April 11 [1 favorite]
Wait, what? Did somebody get electrocuted by this collection of items?!
- dim light I can turn on if I'm too tired to plug in my phone in the dark (F you Mr. Sherlock Holmes)
Plz explain the Sherlock Holmes bit
posted by cnidaria at 10:45 AM on April 11 [1 favorite]
I've struggled with sleep for years and while NyQuil is a great and powerful sleep hammer when you need it, taking it every night until it's no longer effective is not going to be great for your liver. Don't do this.
Neither of these writeups talk about what they're eating/drinking prior to bedtime. Many people slowly become somewhat lactose intolerant as they age. I can still have ice cream or milk during the day, but if I have a glass at bedtime I'm going to be awake for the next four hours. (And it's not obvious it's my belly or anything; it took me months to figure that one out.)
posted by phooky at 10:50 AM on April 11 [3 favorites]
Neither of these writeups talk about what they're eating/drinking prior to bedtime. Many people slowly become somewhat lactose intolerant as they age. I can still have ice cream or milk during the day, but if I have a glass at bedtime I'm going to be awake for the next four hours. (And it's not obvious it's my belly or anything; it took me months to figure that one out.)
posted by phooky at 10:50 AM on April 11 [3 favorites]
I can fall asleep pretty easily but I wake up between 3-5 times per night and have done so for the past twenty years. My solution, which makes NO sense but it works 99% of the time, is to select a podcast downloaded to my phone. The podcasts are always political, Pod Save America, Fast Politics, The Enemies List, etc. For some reason, knowing that someone somewhere is on top of what is going on and talking about it in the most sarcastic way is very reassuring and it puts me right back to sleep. Sometimes it takes me a week to get through one episode. If I wake up at 5 AM, all bets are off; I listen to the whole thing because I am Up For The Day.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 10:54 AM on April 11 [6 favorites]
posted by TWinbrook8 at 10:54 AM on April 11 [6 favorites]
Plz explain the Sherlock Holmes bit
The BBC Sherlock show famously had a bit where Sherlock deduces that Watson's sister is an alcoholic because there are scratches around her cell phone's charging port. This continues to live rent-free in many of our heads, probably because it's such an infuriatingly dumb deduction. Many of us fumble with our charging cords for the simple reason that it is dark or we are sleepy, not that we're alcoholics.
posted by yasaman at 10:58 AM on April 11 [13 favorites]
The BBC Sherlock show famously had a bit where Sherlock deduces that Watson's sister is an alcoholic because there are scratches around her cell phone's charging port. This continues to live rent-free in many of our heads, probably because it's such an infuriatingly dumb deduction. Many of us fumble with our charging cords for the simple reason that it is dark or we are sleepy, not that we're alcoholics.
posted by yasaman at 10:58 AM on April 11 [13 favorites]
That mental scrabble technique mentioned by capricorn is a variation on the cognitive shuffle, and I agree, it's life-changing. Here's the technique I use:
Pick a letter of the alphabet
Start counting your heartbeats
Every eight beats, think of a word that begins with your letter
The heartbeat thing adds a neat positive feedback loop that works for me; the calmer I get, the slower my heart beats, the longer I have to think of a word, the calmer I get...
posted by MrVisible at 11:02 AM on April 11 [16 favorites]
Pick a letter of the alphabet
Start counting your heartbeats
Every eight beats, think of a word that begins with your letter
The heartbeat thing adds a neat positive feedback loop that works for me; the calmer I get, the slower my heart beats, the longer I have to think of a word, the calmer I get...
posted by MrVisible at 11:02 AM on April 11 [16 favorites]
I have zero trouble falling asleep; my problem is staying asleep. Starting occasionally around age 50 and over the next decade slowly becoming more frequent, I'll wake up somewhere between 2-4am. Interestingly, that increased frequency seems to have gone hand in hand with the progression from "waking up needing to pee once in a while" to "waking up needing to pee most nights" to "waking up every night needing to pee, sometimes twice". So I attribute the sleep issue to be related to some combination of age and overall health level.
Sometimes I can get back to sleep within 30 minutes or so, but sometime I toss and turn for a while before giving up and turning on the light to read. Usually after a couple hours of that I finally start feeling sleepy again and I can get a couple more hours in before the alarm goes off, but that still leaves me a couple hours short on sleep for the night and I definitely feel it the next day.
I discovered that taking half of a 3mg Melatonin pill helps me get back to sleep more quickly - a whole pill gives me weird dreams and leaves me feeling drugged the next morning. But the thing that has helps me even more is regular exercise: the night after I exercise and usually the next night or sometimes two, I manage to sleep straight through the night (apart from thankfully-short awakenings to pee). Now if I can just get better about exercising more than once a week...
posted by Greg_Ace at 11:03 AM on April 11 [8 favorites]
Sometimes I can get back to sleep within 30 minutes or so, but sometime I toss and turn for a while before giving up and turning on the light to read. Usually after a couple hours of that I finally start feeling sleepy again and I can get a couple more hours in before the alarm goes off, but that still leaves me a couple hours short on sleep for the night and I definitely feel it the next day.
I discovered that taking half of a 3mg Melatonin pill helps me get back to sleep more quickly - a whole pill gives me weird dreams and leaves me feeling drugged the next morning. But the thing that has helps me even more is regular exercise: the night after I exercise and usually the next night or sometimes two, I manage to sleep straight through the night (apart from thankfully-short awakenings to pee). Now if I can just get better about exercising more than once a week...
posted by Greg_Ace at 11:03 AM on April 11 [8 favorites]
I went from being the person who took hours to fall asleep pre-pandemic to "wakes up in the middle of the night for no good reason" person in 2020. Adding to that, having to work a 7-4 schedule (for four months!!!) has screwed me up for life because I start waking up around 3 hours before the alarm goes off and have for my entire post-college working life. I've slept through an alarm ONCE in my life and that was unusual circumstances, but really I'm just anxious AF. Most over the counter stuff kinda works for awhile... frankly, half a pot gummy worked the best for keeping me asleep all night long, but now I'm forced off of those for the rest of my life now, waaaaah. Then I had whopping insomnia for two weeks on Wellbutrin, so that was a blast. I went from about 48 hours of insomnia at my max to like, days on end.
I now have prescriptions for clonidine and trazodone. The first one would put me to sleep in 15 minutes but didn't help the middle of the night wakeup issue, the trazodone does better at it but not perfectly, sigh. I think I still wake up anxious about stuff enough that even meds can't help that. I'm not sure if I want to try anything else since I heard some scary stuff about putting me on antipsychotics that make you sleepy and I'm all nope, no thank you to that.
Beyond that, I hate sound machines, snoring, and lights, so my bedroom is as dark as possible, I have a sleep mask, and I have earplugs if anyone else is around.
posted by jenfullmoon at 11:04 AM on April 11 [1 favorite]
I now have prescriptions for clonidine and trazodone. The first one would put me to sleep in 15 minutes but didn't help the middle of the night wakeup issue, the trazodone does better at it but not perfectly, sigh. I think I still wake up anxious about stuff enough that even meds can't help that. I'm not sure if I want to try anything else since I heard some scary stuff about putting me on antipsychotics that make you sleepy and I'm all nope, no thank you to that.
Beyond that, I hate sound machines, snoring, and lights, so my bedroom is as dark as possible, I have a sleep mask, and I have earplugs if anyone else is around.
posted by jenfullmoon at 11:04 AM on April 11 [1 favorite]
The BBC Sherlock show famously had a bit where Sherlock deduces that Watson's sister is an alcoholic because there are scratches around her cell phone's charging port. This continues to live rent-free in many of our heads, probably because it's such an infuriatingly dumb deduction.
I think it's also an allusion to Conan-Doyle's "The Sign of the Four," where Sherlock performs a similar deduction on a watch Watson inherited from his older brother which had scratch marks around the hole for the winding key.
posted by fogovonslack at 11:12 AM on April 11 [8 favorites]
Like others above, I fall asleep easily, but have trouble waking and falling back to sleep. This tidbit from "Notes on Sleep" is absolutely the wrong advice for me:
Another drug approach: I hear that a smallish amount of alcohol can help with relaxation and sleepiness. I don’t drink alcohol under normal circumstances, but I have a few times tried a little bit of wine before bed as an attempted sleep aid. For me, it didn’t have clear/obvious effects.
Any alcohol at all completely wrecks my sleep. After about an hour and a half, I wake up and toss and turn for the rest of the night. A glass of wine or a single beer at 5pm? No sleep for me.
What has worked for me lately is hemp cannabutter, either CBD hemp or THC-A hemp (I live in a prohibition state, so my options are limited). I can use about 1/4 as much THC cannabutter to get a full night's sleep compared to CBD (which still has a minuscule amount of THC).
posted by fogovonslack at 11:27 AM on April 11 [2 favorites]
Another drug approach: I hear that a smallish amount of alcohol can help with relaxation and sleepiness. I don’t drink alcohol under normal circumstances, but I have a few times tried a little bit of wine before bed as an attempted sleep aid. For me, it didn’t have clear/obvious effects.
Any alcohol at all completely wrecks my sleep. After about an hour and a half, I wake up and toss and turn for the rest of the night. A glass of wine or a single beer at 5pm? No sleep for me.
What has worked for me lately is hemp cannabutter, either CBD hemp or THC-A hemp (I live in a prohibition state, so my options are limited). I can use about 1/4 as much THC cannabutter to get a full night's sleep compared to CBD (which still has a minuscule amount of THC).
posted by fogovonslack at 11:27 AM on April 11 [2 favorites]
If cannabis products helped me fall asleep and/or have a deep sleep the way they seem to for some people I'd pay $1000/ounce for that shit.
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:49 AM on April 11 [3 favorites]
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:49 AM on April 11 [3 favorites]
Starting occasionally around age 50 and over the next decade slowly becoming more frequent, I'll wake up somewhere between 2-4am. Interestingly, that increased frequency seems to have gone hand in hand with the progression from "waking up needing to pee once in a while" to "waking up needing to pee most nights" to "waking up every night needing to pee, sometimes twice". So I attribute the sleep issue to be related to some combination of age and overall health level.
Yep, this is me.
I had a year of wicked bad insomnia in 2010; bad enough that I talked to my doctor about it. We ultimately identified "unbelievably cataclysmic levels of stress" as the cause (I was still struggling with underemployment after the Recession and my cat was dying), and discussed how to handle both that and the sleep loss. I've used a lot of the same tricks we discussed to tackle various other anxiety-induced periods of sleep loss - apparently, this is a trait that runs in my whole family. (yay.....)
Ultimately for me, the really big things that have helped are:
* Magnesium. This was the big thing I tried back in 2010; my doctor warned me that it wouldn't be a thing that would "kick in" right away, but that it would take a couple weeks to "build up" in my system to the point that it would have an effect. It was what my doctor recommended when I said that waking up in the middle of the night was the bigger issue. And it did take a couple of weeks - but I noticed after only one week that while I was still waking up in the middle of the night, I was feeling a little more refreshed. So we chalked that up to an early sign the magnesium was kicking in. When the stress eased I fell off the magnesium wagon, but still start taking some when I'm in some high-pressure situations.
* I no longer have coffee after noon. Tea seems to be okay, but coffee, forget it.
* I also have cut back to only one cup of coffee per day.
* Menopause and hot flashes also did a number on things. Instead of having a big puffy comforter, I now have a thin sheet and a bedspread, and then anywhere between 3-5 different throw blankets piled at the end of my bed, strategically placed so I can adjust exactly how much warmer or colder I need to be. For whatever reason the hot flashes are starting to make an occasional comeback after about 3 years of leaving me alone, and I've been doing this again; sometimes I don't even wake all the way up before I'm folding down two of the three blankets because "yeah, I think this will be enough" and conking back out again.
* I also mainline the "sleep" section on the Headspace app. Sometimes it's the "sleep scapes", where someone talks to you in a calm and soothing voice about how you're sitting on a porch and watching eagles soar in a field in the distance, or you're chilling in a hot tub in a corner of a hammam, or you're hanging out at a marina with a bunch of cats. And sometimes it's the music. I set those things to run for about 45 minutes, but I'm usually asleep in like 15 minutes tops.
* Finally: I just sort of accepted that I will indeed wake up in the middle of the night sometimes and it will be okay. I think I heard on Adam Savage's old podcast that someone did a study about insomnia, and found that even if you are technically awake, if you're just sort of "resting" in your bed anyway (as in, you're just laying there and letting your mind wander and not fretting), it still has some of the same benefits. Knowing that was a big help; and my FitBit treats those occasional periods of wakeful resting AS light sleep so there's some truth to that. My FitBit also says that we actually experience a number of wake-ups in the middle of the night, but some are so short we don't even remember them. Apparently I was awake for an hour overall last night, but I only remember the 3 am bathroom run and the 5 am blanket juggle.
Incidentally, I heard a good explanation for "why do I always seem to wake up at the same time in the middle of the night", which always puzzled me. Like, why is it always 3 am? Why not 2 or 4 or 1? Well - I'm usually going to sleep at the same time each night. And my body goes through the same sleep-cycle pattern every night, so - if I'm going to sleep at the same time, I hit REM at the same time, and that increases the chance of my waking up at the same time. These days when I wake up at 3, I just get up and pee and then have some water, because I figure either one or the other is the issue, and I usually get back to sleep pretty quick after that.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:54 AM on April 11 [6 favorites]
Yep, this is me.
I had a year of wicked bad insomnia in 2010; bad enough that I talked to my doctor about it. We ultimately identified "unbelievably cataclysmic levels of stress" as the cause (I was still struggling with underemployment after the Recession and my cat was dying), and discussed how to handle both that and the sleep loss. I've used a lot of the same tricks we discussed to tackle various other anxiety-induced periods of sleep loss - apparently, this is a trait that runs in my whole family. (yay.....)
Ultimately for me, the really big things that have helped are:
* Magnesium. This was the big thing I tried back in 2010; my doctor warned me that it wouldn't be a thing that would "kick in" right away, but that it would take a couple weeks to "build up" in my system to the point that it would have an effect. It was what my doctor recommended when I said that waking up in the middle of the night was the bigger issue. And it did take a couple of weeks - but I noticed after only one week that while I was still waking up in the middle of the night, I was feeling a little more refreshed. So we chalked that up to an early sign the magnesium was kicking in. When the stress eased I fell off the magnesium wagon, but still start taking some when I'm in some high-pressure situations.
* I no longer have coffee after noon. Tea seems to be okay, but coffee, forget it.
* I also have cut back to only one cup of coffee per day.
* Menopause and hot flashes also did a number on things. Instead of having a big puffy comforter, I now have a thin sheet and a bedspread, and then anywhere between 3-5 different throw blankets piled at the end of my bed, strategically placed so I can adjust exactly how much warmer or colder I need to be. For whatever reason the hot flashes are starting to make an occasional comeback after about 3 years of leaving me alone, and I've been doing this again; sometimes I don't even wake all the way up before I'm folding down two of the three blankets because "yeah, I think this will be enough" and conking back out again.
* I also mainline the "sleep" section on the Headspace app. Sometimes it's the "sleep scapes", where someone talks to you in a calm and soothing voice about how you're sitting on a porch and watching eagles soar in a field in the distance, or you're chilling in a hot tub in a corner of a hammam, or you're hanging out at a marina with a bunch of cats. And sometimes it's the music. I set those things to run for about 45 minutes, but I'm usually asleep in like 15 minutes tops.
* Finally: I just sort of accepted that I will indeed wake up in the middle of the night sometimes and it will be okay. I think I heard on Adam Savage's old podcast that someone did a study about insomnia, and found that even if you are technically awake, if you're just sort of "resting" in your bed anyway (as in, you're just laying there and letting your mind wander and not fretting), it still has some of the same benefits. Knowing that was a big help; and my FitBit treats those occasional periods of wakeful resting AS light sleep so there's some truth to that. My FitBit also says that we actually experience a number of wake-ups in the middle of the night, but some are so short we don't even remember them. Apparently I was awake for an hour overall last night, but I only remember the 3 am bathroom run and the 5 am blanket juggle.
Incidentally, I heard a good explanation for "why do I always seem to wake up at the same time in the middle of the night", which always puzzled me. Like, why is it always 3 am? Why not 2 or 4 or 1? Well - I'm usually going to sleep at the same time each night. And my body goes through the same sleep-cycle pattern every night, so - if I'm going to sleep at the same time, I hit REM at the same time, and that increases the chance of my waking up at the same time. These days when I wake up at 3, I just get up and pee and then have some water, because I figure either one or the other is the issue, and I usually get back to sleep pretty quick after that.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:54 AM on April 11 [6 favorites]
trouble falling asleep and/or wake up too early and can’t get back to sleep
Boy do I get the later one and not like it, so thanks for this.
posted by Artw at 11:59 AM on April 11 [1 favorite]
Boy do I get the later one and not like it, so thanks for this.
posted by Artw at 11:59 AM on April 11 [1 favorite]
As someone who falls asleep within seconds of turning out the light, but who wakes up at 3:00 a.m. like clockwork, I've found re-listening to one of a few specific episodes from comedy podcasts is a very effective soporific. I figure it's basically just an adult version of kids conking out when they're read the same story every night. This puts me back to sleep very quickly.
posted by senor biggles at 12:25 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
posted by senor biggles at 12:25 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
I love sleep tips. Here's what works for me:
posted by a_curious_koala at 12:30 PM on April 11 [4 favorites]
- 22.5mg Remeron / Mirtazapine. I take it for anxiety / depression, but of all the drugs typically prescribed for those conditions, this one has been the best for me and as a side benefit good for sleep.
- Magnesium.
- Regular routine. Like the author, the "sleep and sex" thing doesn't work for me; I love my bed too much. What does work, though, is to follow a wind-down routine and be punctual about it.
- I start with half an hour of something mindless and neutral-- typically watching youtube videos where somebody friendly and funny casually plays a casual video game, or narrated videos where somebody friendly and knowledgable (and sometimes funny) builds something (like a dining room table).
- Then I floss, brush my teeth, wash my face, and wash my feet. For whatever reason, the feet washing REALLY helps me calm down and feel clean in my sheets.
- Then I read for a while, but only from a book or an e-book with zero backlight.
- During the reading phase, I have one of those "rising sun" alarm clocks that also has a "setting sun" option that gets dimmer over about 30 minutes. It also has natural background noise. The "windy hillside with occasional goat" sound is most calming to me. I imagine I'm in my little cozy hut.
- I naturally get sleepy during the previous phase, and when it's lights out I turn on my white noise machine.
- I don't stress too much about my routine. If I goof it up one night, no big deal, I'll return to it next night, or next week. The point isn't to create stress around sleep; it's to have pre-sleep be stress-reducing. I try not to stay up WAY past my bedtime multiple nights in a row, because I know that will eventually become more stressful, but I am not a cop about the routine.
- I sleep in total darkness. Zero light. This was a recent addition a year or so ago and has really helped.
- I wake up to a sunrise alarm with my phone as backup. My phone is across the room so I have to get up to turn that alarm off, but I'm usually awake due to the sunrise alarm already.
- I don't take long naps.
- I try not to eat too much near to bed, nor do anything exciting.
- I have a dog I love who sleeps in the room with me. This has been huge as loneliness and isolation have been huge sources of stress for me and I live alone.
- If I can't fall asleep or I wake up in the middle of the night and can't fall back asleep, I splash my chest with warm water at the sink. I used to take a quick warm shower, but I find the splash is enough. The slight chill of being wet makes returning to bed feel very cozy.
- I exercise, practice meditation, eat a healthy diet, spend time with people I love, set good boundaries, go to therapy, and do all the other stuff that is vital for maintaining mental health in the face of mental illness. Sleep is just one of a hundred connected processes that can reinforce each other for health or reinforce each other for illness. Fixing sleep can help greatly, but sometimes other processes need to be fixed to fix sleep. This is highly individual obv.
posted by a_curious_koala at 12:30 PM on April 11 [4 favorites]
Here I am at 4:30 a.m., up earlier than I wanted...
I discovered a gamechanger a few years ago. For those of you who snore and have sleep apnea, you can go the CPAP route. Or you can tape your mouth shut.
Virtually all snoring happens when your mouth is open. Close your mouth and you won't snore. So taping your mouth at night will stop your snoring. And for the guys who have to pee at night, there is an extra benefit. When your mouth is open at night, you lose moisture, and there is a rather counterintuitive reaction your body has to that: it makes you pee. Taping your mouth shut will also prevent the night pees.
I have been doing this for years now and it really helps. Mainly, my wife doesn't complain about my snoring so much anymore, and when she does it's because I didn't affix the tape right (it should cover about 80% of your lips) or I simply fell asleep before putting it on. It's not perfect, sometimes I snore and sometimes I get up to pee. But those are the exception to the rule.
There are mouth tape strips you can but, but they're overpriced and are too small for me anyway. I just buy a roll of sports tape and cut strips that can cover my lips. Experiment with a size/shape that works for you.
posted by zardoz at 1:00 PM on April 11 [5 favorites]
I discovered a gamechanger a few years ago. For those of you who snore and have sleep apnea, you can go the CPAP route. Or you can tape your mouth shut.
Virtually all snoring happens when your mouth is open. Close your mouth and you won't snore. So taping your mouth at night will stop your snoring. And for the guys who have to pee at night, there is an extra benefit. When your mouth is open at night, you lose moisture, and there is a rather counterintuitive reaction your body has to that: it makes you pee. Taping your mouth shut will also prevent the night pees.
I have been doing this for years now and it really helps. Mainly, my wife doesn't complain about my snoring so much anymore, and when she does it's because I didn't affix the tape right (it should cover about 80% of your lips) or I simply fell asleep before putting it on. It's not perfect, sometimes I snore and sometimes I get up to pee. But those are the exception to the rule.
There are mouth tape strips you can but, but they're overpriced and are too small for me anyway. I just buy a roll of sports tape and cut strips that can cover my lips. Experiment with a size/shape that works for you.
posted by zardoz at 1:00 PM on April 11 [5 favorites]
The BBC Sherlock show famously had a bit where Sherlock deduces that Watson's sister is an alcoholic because there are scratches around her cell phone's charging port. This continues to live rent-free in many of our heads, probably because it's such an infuriatingly dumb deduction. Many of us fumble with our charging cords for the simple reason that it is dark or we are sleepy, not that we're alcoholics.
Sherlock Is Garbage, and Here's Why [hbomberguy]
posted by hippybear at 1:20 PM on April 11 [3 favorites]
Sherlock Is Garbage, and Here's Why [hbomberguy]
posted by hippybear at 1:20 PM on April 11 [3 favorites]
Falling asleep is rarely a problem for me. It's suddenly waking at 3 or 4am as if an alarm went off that's the problem. It's almost become SOP here that Thorzdad will be up early. There is no hope of getting back to sleep, because as soon as I awake my brain starts working overtime mulling over every. damned. thing. and won't shut the fuck up. So, I might as well get up.
And it has nothing to do with having to pee. I can easily get up, pee, and get back to sleep. For whatever reason, though, my head seems to think 3 or 4 (sometimes 5, if I'm lucky) is time to get up, and it doesn't care how tired I am.
The joke here is that, once I'm up at 3 or 4, I will have breakfast. Then, around 7 or 8, second breakfast. Both are light, thankfully.
My doctor, whom I genuinely like, has been little help on this particular problem. Being an osteopath, he doesn't like to prescribe things like sleep aids. Instead, he sent me links for learning self-CBT for sleep, which is pretty useless. Then, he sent me a link to some doctor's podcast episode where they discuss strategies for good sleep. I couldn't get past the "learn to optimize yourself to become the best you possible" introduction. Ugh.
So, I still wake early. Though, Tuesday night I never fell asleep, which is a pretty odd occurrence. Most days, I'm fatigued all day, and my temper is pretty short. And, the frustration of it all bleeds over into my depression, and that's not a good thing (self harm, and all that.)
......
45 mg Mirtazapine aka Remeron
That shit made me insane.
posted by Thorzdad at 1:30 PM on April 11 [3 favorites]
And it has nothing to do with having to pee. I can easily get up, pee, and get back to sleep. For whatever reason, though, my head seems to think 3 or 4 (sometimes 5, if I'm lucky) is time to get up, and it doesn't care how tired I am.
The joke here is that, once I'm up at 3 or 4, I will have breakfast. Then, around 7 or 8, second breakfast. Both are light, thankfully.
My doctor, whom I genuinely like, has been little help on this particular problem. Being an osteopath, he doesn't like to prescribe things like sleep aids. Instead, he sent me links for learning self-CBT for sleep, which is pretty useless. Then, he sent me a link to some doctor's podcast episode where they discuss strategies for good sleep. I couldn't get past the "learn to optimize yourself to become the best you possible" introduction. Ugh.
So, I still wake early. Though, Tuesday night I never fell asleep, which is a pretty odd occurrence. Most days, I'm fatigued all day, and my temper is pretty short. And, the frustration of it all bleeds over into my depression, and that's not a good thing (self harm, and all that.)
......
45 mg Mirtazapine aka Remeron
That shit made me insane.
posted by Thorzdad at 1:30 PM on April 11 [3 favorites]
As someone with the exact opposite kind of sleep disorder (i have a hypersomnia), i have often wished there were some way they could extract some of the Magic Sleep Juice from my brain and give it to y'all insomniacs.
posted by adrienneleigh at 2:40 PM on April 11 [9 favorites]
posted by adrienneleigh at 2:40 PM on April 11 [9 favorites]
Oh, I almost forgot to add - Regardless of whether I go to bed at 10pm and sleep through the night, or go to bed at 1am and deal with insomnia, or any combination thereof...
I HATE BEING FORCED TO WAKE UP BEFORE 9AM.
That is all.
posted by Greg_Ace at 4:52 PM on April 11 [2 favorites]
I HATE BEING FORCED TO WAKE UP BEFORE 9AM.
That is all.
posted by Greg_Ace at 4:52 PM on April 11 [2 favorites]
Diphenhydramine is the most effective thing for me, but I take it sparingly due to the mind-fog effect.
I know I ran across a study at some point in the last year that even moderate amounts may be harmful to longterm cognitive health later in life. Might be worth looking into. I only ever used it once every few months but I stopped completely after reading that paper.
because mine had deteriorated, partly I think from anxiety and sadness (I've been going through a divorce)
Oof. Sorry to hear it. Two and a half years after my divorce I still haven’t found a new normal - my sleep was never good, but I had a sort of stable instability (meta-stable?) while married that was almost in the same timezone as healthy. All over the map ever since, though it might be remote work is hindering recovery.
posted by Ryvar at 5:04 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
I know I ran across a study at some point in the last year that even moderate amounts may be harmful to longterm cognitive health later in life. Might be worth looking into. I only ever used it once every few months but I stopped completely after reading that paper.
because mine had deteriorated, partly I think from anxiety and sadness (I've been going through a divorce)
Oof. Sorry to hear it. Two and a half years after my divorce I still haven’t found a new normal - my sleep was never good, but I had a sort of stable instability (meta-stable?) while married that was almost in the same timezone as healthy. All over the map ever since, though it might be remote work is hindering recovery.
posted by Ryvar at 5:04 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
Insomnia is a vicious plague. My own military-grade insomnia was caused by a slow but unrelenting growth of stress. None of the sleep advice was helpful - insomniacs should only take advice from similarly affected insomniacs. Otherwise, you will hear endless iterations of "No one can stay awake after drinking a mug of chamomile tea!".
I think that the long-term stress somehow deleted my ability to fall asleep. I was constantly exhausted but never sleepy.
The two things that mitigated the insomnia in my case were (1) complete change of scene - jettisoning the toxic job, toxic friends and toxic family, and moving across the continent. The literature calls that geo-therapy. It stops you from getting wound up each and every day. (2) Potent indicas and a vape machine. Some indicas act as a strong anti-anxiety in some people, luckily it does for me. Vaping lets you use a tiny dose, just enough to calm the mind to let you drift off. I understand that regular vaping is bad for your health, but sleeping only 20 hours a week is worse.
posted by SnowRottie at 6:34 PM on April 11 [5 favorites]
I think that the long-term stress somehow deleted my ability to fall asleep. I was constantly exhausted but never sleepy.
The two things that mitigated the insomnia in my case were (1) complete change of scene - jettisoning the toxic job, toxic friends and toxic family, and moving across the continent. The literature calls that geo-therapy. It stops you from getting wound up each and every day. (2) Potent indicas and a vape machine. Some indicas act as a strong anti-anxiety in some people, luckily it does for me. Vaping lets you use a tiny dose, just enough to calm the mind to let you drift off. I understand that regular vaping is bad for your health, but sleeping only 20 hours a week is worse.
posted by SnowRottie at 6:34 PM on April 11 [5 favorites]
Hydroxyzine is an antihistamine that I have been prescribed to take when I wake up at 2am to piss. It's a super-sleepy antihistamine, and while I can't really say it's a wonder drug I do find I'm falling back asleep more often after taking it than before. Nothing worse than lying in bed awake trying to get back to sleep.
posted by hippybear at 7:01 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
posted by hippybear at 7:01 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
I need some advice specifically on sleep maintenance insomnia (waking up in the early morning and being unable to fall back asleep).
Most advice on insomnia tends to address not being able to fall asleep at bedtime, or clubs all insomnia together, and it's very hard to find advice specifically addressing maintenance insomnia.
The azurelunatic article mentions they have maintenance insomnia but then it's hard to see what in the long list of practices is actually about maintenance insomnia. (Except the CPAP machine, which I have, and the references to peeing and temperature, which make sense but aren't quite my main problem. I think my main problem is anxiety and spinning-brain.)
If you have any experience or suggestions or resources re maintenance insomnia I would appreciate any pointers! Or even just solidarity or personal anecdotes.
posted by splitpeasoup at 7:40 PM on April 11
Most advice on insomnia tends to address not being able to fall asleep at bedtime, or clubs all insomnia together, and it's very hard to find advice specifically addressing maintenance insomnia.
The azurelunatic article mentions they have maintenance insomnia but then it's hard to see what in the long list of practices is actually about maintenance insomnia. (Except the CPAP machine, which I have, and the references to peeing and temperature, which make sense but aren't quite my main problem. I think my main problem is anxiety and spinning-brain.)
If you have any experience or suggestions or resources re maintenance insomnia I would appreciate any pointers! Or even just solidarity or personal anecdotes.
posted by splitpeasoup at 7:40 PM on April 11
Taping your mouth is like my nightmare, because my nasal passages are untrustworthy and frequently decide to clog for no fucking reason. So then I'd just wake up struggling for air.
(but I'm glad for whatever works for people)
I've made waking up at three part of my routine; I go pee, feed the cat an early breakfast and take my thyroid pill because I'm not supposed to eat for a while after I do that anyway. Then I can go back to sleep till official getty-uppy time. It's just One of the Morning Things I Do, so going back to bed feels like getting away with something.
posted by emjaybee at 7:47 PM on April 11 [2 favorites]
(but I'm glad for whatever works for people)
I've made waking up at three part of my routine; I go pee, feed the cat an early breakfast and take my thyroid pill because I'm not supposed to eat for a while after I do that anyway. Then I can go back to sleep till official getty-uppy time. It's just One of the Morning Things I Do, so going back to bed feels like getting away with something.
posted by emjaybee at 7:47 PM on April 11 [2 favorites]
A little off topic, but I'd really appreciate it if joannemerriam could tell me what pillow she has. Recently, my sleep has been regularly interrupted by shoulder pain.
posted by Scout405 at 7:57 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
posted by Scout405 at 7:57 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
My other half and I are devoted converts to sleep-phone headphones and gently informative audiobooks for Getting Back to Sleep.
It had never occurred to me that one would want to get through the night without peeing, I guess I drink a lot, but: notion sensing night lights that are faint and don’t beam directly into my eyes; and carpet/drugget/ bed socks/slippers as needed so my feet don’t get dreadfully cold doing it.
posted by clew at 9:16 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
It had never occurred to me that one would want to get through the night without peeing, I guess I drink a lot, but: notion sensing night lights that are faint and don’t beam directly into my eyes; and carpet/drugget/ bed socks/slippers as needed so my feet don’t get dreadfully cold doing it.
posted by clew at 9:16 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
Anti-snore devices I have tried:
Mouth tape: either I snore anyway, or I peel it off in my sleep
Chin tape: doesn't work, uncomfortable for beard
Jaw-adjusting mouthpiece, either the fixed kind (uncomfortable, doesn't work) or the boil and bite kind (better, muffles snore some)
A thing that's kind of like a suction cup that holds your tongue out (stick your tongue out, you can't make a snore noise-- apparently I made a choking noise instead which was worse)
A straw that makes you drink by kind of milking a rubber teat against the roof of your mouth to work the muscles??? (Hydrated, but didn't work)
What worked was a damn CPAP and now, a lot of nagging things went away and I never want to sleep without it again. If I didn't need it (and there are indications I started needing it in childhood) I think I would still use it.
posted by blnkfrnk at 10:40 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
Mouth tape: either I snore anyway, or I peel it off in my sleep
Chin tape: doesn't work, uncomfortable for beard
Jaw-adjusting mouthpiece, either the fixed kind (uncomfortable, doesn't work) or the boil and bite kind (better, muffles snore some)
A thing that's kind of like a suction cup that holds your tongue out (stick your tongue out, you can't make a snore noise-- apparently I made a choking noise instead which was worse)
A straw that makes you drink by kind of milking a rubber teat against the roof of your mouth to work the muscles??? (Hydrated, but didn't work)
What worked was a damn CPAP and now, a lot of nagging things went away and I never want to sleep without it again. If I didn't need it (and there are indications I started needing it in childhood) I think I would still use it.
posted by blnkfrnk at 10:40 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
Taping your mouth is like my nightmare, because my nasal passages are untrustworthy and frequently decide to clog for no fucking reason. So then I'd just wake up struggling for air.
You don't want to tape it 100% shut. I keep a small gap on either side of my lips, so that you can inhale with your mouth without a problem, especially while asleep. Sort of a failsafe. But the idea is that you just naturally won't.
It takes some experimentation to get it right. For me, I learned that having the tape contour over my lips in a neutral pose is best, but at the same time it should be pretty firm. And of course if you have a cold and your sinuses are are blocked, it's probably best to not even try it then.
posted by zardoz at 11:09 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
You don't want to tape it 100% shut. I keep a small gap on either side of my lips, so that you can inhale with your mouth without a problem, especially while asleep. Sort of a failsafe. But the idea is that you just naturally won't.
It takes some experimentation to get it right. For me, I learned that having the tape contour over my lips in a neutral pose is best, but at the same time it should be pretty firm. And of course if you have a cold and your sinuses are are blocked, it's probably best to not even try it then.
posted by zardoz at 11:09 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
I have had periods of terrible sleep... both difficulty getting to sleep, and difficulty staying asleep.
These have been highly correlated with caffeine intake, alcohol intake, and stress. And for me these things often go together! I drink a lot of coffee because I'm tired and there's so much to do and everything is awful and then I lie awake and think about all those things and then I'm tired in the morning and I have to drink more coffee and if I need to unwind and just stop thinking about all that shit I drink booze and then I wake at 3am and can't get back to sleep and when I finally get up I'll need a lot more coffee.... obviously shifting to better coping strategies helps, and I did learn that exercise and abstinence and meditation were better than substances, but at some point removing the root cause (stressors) is the only thing that can work for me.
Something that took me a while to figure out is that caffeine was hurting my ability to stay asleep... for quite a while I thought my intake was fine, because I had no trouble falling asleep, but it turned out that when I cut right back, my sleep duration and quality improved. Worth trying if you are a caffeine user who wakes in the night or wakes too early.
One thing I have learned recently is that despite what you might have read, sleeping 5 or 6 hours instead of 7 or 8 doesn't spell doom for you and your health. And there are significant benefits to just lying down and resting, even if you don't sleep. So if you can lie there and think some nice thoughts and remind yourself how much you actually sleep isn't that important, instead of fretting, your time in bed can still do you good.
This is a nice podcast episode by some very cool science communicators on sleep and health, aimed at fitness folks but generally applicable, which I hope will reassure some of our bad sleepers.
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 11:45 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
These have been highly correlated with caffeine intake, alcohol intake, and stress. And for me these things often go together! I drink a lot of coffee because I'm tired and there's so much to do and everything is awful and then I lie awake and think about all those things and then I'm tired in the morning and I have to drink more coffee and if I need to unwind and just stop thinking about all that shit I drink booze and then I wake at 3am and can't get back to sleep and when I finally get up I'll need a lot more coffee.... obviously shifting to better coping strategies helps, and I did learn that exercise and abstinence and meditation were better than substances, but at some point removing the root cause (stressors) is the only thing that can work for me.
Something that took me a while to figure out is that caffeine was hurting my ability to stay asleep... for quite a while I thought my intake was fine, because I had no trouble falling asleep, but it turned out that when I cut right back, my sleep duration and quality improved. Worth trying if you are a caffeine user who wakes in the night or wakes too early.
One thing I have learned recently is that despite what you might have read, sleeping 5 or 6 hours instead of 7 or 8 doesn't spell doom for you and your health. And there are significant benefits to just lying down and resting, even if you don't sleep. So if you can lie there and think some nice thoughts and remind yourself how much you actually sleep isn't that important, instead of fretting, your time in bed can still do you good.
This is a nice podcast episode by some very cool science communicators on sleep and health, aimed at fitness folks but generally applicable, which I hope will reassure some of our bad sleepers.
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 11:45 PM on April 11 [1 favorite]
Note that i_am_joe's_spleen's link sleeping 5 or 6 hours instead of 7 or 8 doesn't spell doom for you and your health points to a big take-down of Matthew "Sleep" Walker. MetaPrev by goingonit in 2021: "But Guzey's claims just sit there, un-rebutted, while Matthew Walker spends his time giving lectures and writing articles about how sleeping too little will kill you". Hard to (get work-ready data on) sleep when there's an elephant in the bedroom.
posted by BobTheScientist at 12:36 AM on April 12 [1 favorite]
posted by BobTheScientist at 12:36 AM on April 12 [1 favorite]
If you have any experience or suggestions or resources re maintenance insomnia I would appreciate any pointers!
I have trouble falling asleep and I wake up after about 5 hours which is usually around 3pm. Sometimes I wake earlier. Standard sleep hygiene makes absolutely no difference.
I also get rapidly repeating hypnic jerks, where just as I'm falling asleep, I jerk awake with fright, sometimes about 10 - 15 times in a row. (I don't have sleep apnea, I've investigated this possibility, apparently this is my anxiety doing this)
This is what helped me:
I learnt that waking up in the night at around 3 is normal. It happens to most people. It's not a sign that your sleep is disregulated.
The trick was to reduce the anxiety I have around waking up, so that I don't get into a "anxious & frustrated because I can't sleep, can't sleep because I'm anxious & frustrated" spiral.
1) I accepted that I would be tired, and gently and compassionately challenged my catastrophising thoughts about being tired. I can, actually, cope with being tired.
2) I realised that resting, even while awake, is still rest, and that I focused my efforts on improving my "waking rest" rather than railing against being awake. That way I'm much less tired.
For some people this means getting up and doing something soothing like reading. For me, I would play cognitive shuffle games I actually enjoy, like trying to remember the clothes worn by all the characters in a favourite show.
Or I imagine doing a routine and soothing task like doing a water change on my aquarium. Or I imagine that I'm in a favorite fictional place and try to conjure it into my mind's eye.
(this is how I learned that Rivendell has an extensive vegetable garden, chicken coops, and beehives).
Or trying to picture what it would be like if I floated up above my home and looked around. What would I see? Hear? Smell? Feel?
Visual imagination games work best for me but I have a very strong visual imagination, some people prefer doing math games or word games.
I would get to a point where I'm happy to wake up because it means I get to go visit Rivendel / fly around my neighbourhood /design the perfect tree house etc.
3)Realising that I probably sleep more than I think I do, because of the distorting effects on perception of time when you're awake /half awake /sleeping.
I also had custom ear plugs made, they're extremely comfortable and help me stay asleep.
Good luck figuring this out, struggling with poor sleep is the worst.
posted by Zumbador at 2:44 AM on April 12 [3 favorites]
I have trouble falling asleep and I wake up after about 5 hours which is usually around 3pm. Sometimes I wake earlier. Standard sleep hygiene makes absolutely no difference.
I also get rapidly repeating hypnic jerks, where just as I'm falling asleep, I jerk awake with fright, sometimes about 10 - 15 times in a row. (I don't have sleep apnea, I've investigated this possibility, apparently this is my anxiety doing this)
This is what helped me:
I learnt that waking up in the night at around 3 is normal. It happens to most people. It's not a sign that your sleep is disregulated.
The trick was to reduce the anxiety I have around waking up, so that I don't get into a "anxious & frustrated because I can't sleep, can't sleep because I'm anxious & frustrated" spiral.
1) I accepted that I would be tired, and gently and compassionately challenged my catastrophising thoughts about being tired. I can, actually, cope with being tired.
2) I realised that resting, even while awake, is still rest, and that I focused my efforts on improving my "waking rest" rather than railing against being awake. That way I'm much less tired.
For some people this means getting up and doing something soothing like reading. For me, I would play cognitive shuffle games I actually enjoy, like trying to remember the clothes worn by all the characters in a favourite show.
Or I imagine doing a routine and soothing task like doing a water change on my aquarium. Or I imagine that I'm in a favorite fictional place and try to conjure it into my mind's eye.
(this is how I learned that Rivendell has an extensive vegetable garden, chicken coops, and beehives).
Or trying to picture what it would be like if I floated up above my home and looked around. What would I see? Hear? Smell? Feel?
Visual imagination games work best for me but I have a very strong visual imagination, some people prefer doing math games or word games.
I would get to a point where I'm happy to wake up because it means I get to go visit Rivendel / fly around my neighbourhood /design the perfect tree house etc.
3)Realising that I probably sleep more than I think I do, because of the distorting effects on perception of time when you're awake /half awake /sleeping.
I also had custom ear plugs made, they're extremely comfortable and help me stay asleep.
Good luck figuring this out, struggling with poor sleep is the worst.
posted by Zumbador at 2:44 AM on April 12 [3 favorites]
Azz wrote a comment responding to many bits of the discussion here. Includes sleep maintenance tactics.
posted by brainwane at 3:52 AM on April 12 [2 favorites]
posted by brainwane at 3:52 AM on April 12 [2 favorites]
I take hydroxyzine every night for sleep, and propranolol for migraines/generalized anxiety, and it's helped my sleep so much. 2013-2014, I started getting migraines and only sleeping in four hour stretches a day. Really difficult when you have a 40-hour work week. I left the job (boo Walmart's work culture), stayed home (I was privileged enough to have another source of income aka I became a housewife, and husband's job paid the bills) and got on the above meds to help. Plus a dark bedroom and keeping it cool (around 64 is my usual temp, any colder and my husband acts like we're in the Arctic tundra).
If I have to be anywhere before noon, and it is not a usual event, I cannot sleep the night before, even when going at an appropriate time for 7 hours or so of sleep. 44 years old and I still get anxious about being late in the mornings.
posted by tlwright at 4:12 AM on April 12
If I have to be anywhere before noon, and it is not a usual event, I cannot sleep the night before, even when going at an appropriate time for 7 hours or so of sleep. 44 years old and I still get anxious about being late in the mornings.
posted by tlwright at 4:12 AM on April 12
There is a subreddit for Delayed Sleep Phase Disorder and they have a Discord as well, by the way.
posted by brainwane at 4:50 AM on April 12 [1 favorite]
posted by brainwane at 4:50 AM on April 12 [1 favorite]
@thorzdad Sorry to hear that. Everyone's body and head chemistry are different. After my neurosis was resolved in 2015 I slept better than I had in what seemed centuries. I lost my sense of smell and taste as part of my neurotic adventure. I Skyped with a phenomenal therapist for two years. I regained my sense of smell and taste! Then in late in 2019 I lost my sense of smell and taste due to a viral ear infection. I have been on mirtazapine since then for sleep.
posted by DJZouke at 5:43 AM on April 12
posted by DJZouke at 5:43 AM on April 12
I also find that plain ol' Tylenol PM knocks me right out. An entire pill is overkill and it's actually hard to get up the morning, and makes for a groggy morning. So I just bite a tiny piece off before bed (yes it's bitter--you get used to it) and that usually helps me sleep through the night. I can't imagine taking two full pills of that stuff--it's strong as hell and I'd need someone to push me out of bed in the morning.
posted by zardoz at 5:44 AM on April 12
posted by zardoz at 5:44 AM on April 12
I tried the "make two unrelated words from each letter of the alphabet" thing last night and I got all the way to Z feeling not the least bit sleepier and also mildly stressed out.
posted by grumpybear69 at 6:12 AM on April 12 [3 favorites]
posted by grumpybear69 at 6:12 AM on April 12 [3 favorites]
I used to drink a cocktail or two most nights and I slept like a baby. I know it's accepted that drinking makes your sleep worse, but man my head would hit the pillow and I would wake up 7-8 hours later feeling amazing. For a variety of reasons I stopped daily drinking about a decade ago and there's been a lot of positives but I miss that, it felt like a superpower.
posted by Carillon at 10:28 PM on April 12
posted by Carillon at 10:28 PM on April 12
Welp, couldn't fall asleep until 1 a.m. (after several days of full sleep), woke up irrevocably despite being sleepy at 3:30. Does anyone have any idea why "every other night of sleeping" is a thing? Like I'll get 8-10 hours of sleep and then go back to short sleeping again the next day.
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:49 AM on April 13
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:49 AM on April 13
My own sleep habits seem to pendulum pretty strongly. Whenever I have a really bad night I can pretty much count on the next night being a good night. I don't know what that's all about.
posted by hippybear at 8:55 AM on April 13 [1 favorite]
posted by hippybear at 8:55 AM on April 13 [1 favorite]
Mod note: Our routine is to drink a warm beverage and put a post, like this one, on the sidebar and Best Of Blog 💤 'Night, night!
posted by Brandon Blatcher (staff) at 5:16 AM on April 17
posted by Brandon Blatcher (staff) at 5:16 AM on April 17
Since I got my CPAP after a sleep study about 8 years ago, I now fall asleep within about 5 minutes of putting on the mask. It's totally trained my sleep routine. My wife is jealous but happy to not have to hear my snoring. It probably doesn't hurt that we have two 75+ pound dogs snoring along with us...
posted by schyler523 at 5:29 AM on April 18
posted by schyler523 at 5:29 AM on April 18
An few items around what I know/believe/do around sleep:
As we age, polyphasic sleep becomes more common.
I think many of us find sleep a mysterious experience. And like the other most basic/core/profound aspects of being human, we can get a little superstitious and/or mildly neurotic about the Meaning Of It – especially when it doesn't go smoothly. Not taking it too seriously (in a balanced way!) can be mentally, psychologically, and emotionally relieving.
Most strategies we use to solve problems are a blend of Art and Science (or maybe those are two points on a continuum, whatever). Sometimes a useful troubleshooting technique is consider whether an approach needs more/different Art or more/different Science. Often there are multiple variables, which can be frustrating.
During a period in my life when I was experiencing significant sleep maintenance insomnia, I found a recording (progressive relaxation) that I really liked. Every time I awoke and didn't easily fall back asleep, I sat in a glider chair and listened to this recording. I subvocalized what the narrator was saying. The focus on relaxing body parts, the lovely sound of the speaker's voice, my mumbling along all came together to lull me to sleep and eventually created a Pavlovian response to the 20-minute recording. I went from sometimes having to listen twice to not staying awake past the first 5 minutes. Bonus: I half-memorized the script and could often recreate enough of the experience without getting out of bed to ease myself back to sleep.
posted by concinnity at 6:30 AM on April 19 [1 favorite]
As we age, polyphasic sleep becomes more common.
I think many of us find sleep a mysterious experience. And like the other most basic/core/profound aspects of being human, we can get a little superstitious and/or mildly neurotic about the Meaning Of It – especially when it doesn't go smoothly. Not taking it too seriously (in a balanced way!) can be mentally, psychologically, and emotionally relieving.
Most strategies we use to solve problems are a blend of Art and Science (or maybe those are two points on a continuum, whatever). Sometimes a useful troubleshooting technique is consider whether an approach needs more/different Art or more/different Science. Often there are multiple variables, which can be frustrating.
During a period in my life when I was experiencing significant sleep maintenance insomnia, I found a recording (progressive relaxation) that I really liked. Every time I awoke and didn't easily fall back asleep, I sat in a glider chair and listened to this recording. I subvocalized what the narrator was saying. The focus on relaxing body parts, the lovely sound of the speaker's voice, my mumbling along all came together to lull me to sleep and eventually created a Pavlovian response to the 20-minute recording. I went from sometimes having to listen twice to not staying awake past the first 5 minutes. Bonus: I half-memorized the script and could often recreate enough of the experience without getting out of bed to ease myself back to sleep.
posted by concinnity at 6:30 AM on April 19 [1 favorite]
« Older Hey voter voter voter voter... SWING! | Region 9 has thrown up a detective story for... Newer »
Azz notes in their profile page: "You are the expert of your own situation. Advice given by others may be actively counterproductive, because they don't know your situation the way that you do. When you give advice, it's almost always appropriate to add qualifiers that make it explicitly okay to ignore your advice as needed."
Jed prefaces his writeup: "This page is not about telling you how you can get better sleep. It’s specifically about me, and my personal experiences; my approaches may not work for you at all. But I’m hoping that some of this page will be useful to some people."]
posted by brainwane at 9:57 AM on April 11 [9 favorites]