The Red Belt Moves On
January 29, 2009 1:38 PM Subscribe
Jiu-Jitsu legend Helio Gracie has died. From sickly child of a poor Brazilian family to a fighting legend, Helio Gracie (nicknamed Caxinguele or Squirrel by his family), inspired a paradigm shift in Martial Arts. He will be Missed.
Sure, make fun of his kids' names now when dad's no longer around to kick your ass!
posted by cjorgensen at 1:46 PM on January 29, 2009
posted by cjorgensen at 1:46 PM on January 29, 2009
A true legend and demigod, in a way that few people have been before or will be again. The architect of modern asskicking, a real-life version of the legendary warrior monks of old.
What's up with this? Gracie is survived by .....his sons Rickson, Royler, Rolker, Royce, Relson, Robin and Rorion; his daughters Rerika and Ricci
All the "R"s are pronounced "H", so the names are pronounced Hickson, Hoyce, etc. Go ahead, make fun of their names to their faces. Hope you don't need to use any of your joints for a while.
posted by DecemberBoy at 1:50 PM on January 29, 2009
What's up with this? Gracie is survived by .....his sons Rickson, Royler, Rolker, Royce, Relson, Robin and Rorion; his daughters Rerika and Ricci
All the "R"s are pronounced "H", so the names are pronounced Hickson, Hoyce, etc. Go ahead, make fun of their names to their faces. Hope you don't need to use any of your joints for a while.
posted by DecemberBoy at 1:50 PM on January 29, 2009
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Lanky little guys in martial arts everywhere owe this man for developing a style that uses skill over size and power. His is a truly beautiful art.
I have a feeling jiujitsu today will have a more somber note. The next tap-out is for Helio.
posted by sarcasman at 2:12 PM on January 29, 2009
Lanky little guys in martial arts everywhere owe this man for developing a style that uses skill over size and power. His is a truly beautiful art.
I have a feeling jiujitsu today will have a more somber note. The next tap-out is for Helio.
posted by sarcasman at 2:12 PM on January 29, 2009
All the "R"s are pronounced "H", so the names are pronounced Hickson, Hoyce, etc. Go ahead, make fun of their names to their faces. Hope you don't need to use any of your joints for a while.
There's a sort of spiritual reason for it as well, although I'm too crudely educated in the reasoning to explain it. I believe Renzo explained it in an interview long ago.
Either way, modern MMA owes this man -- and his family -- an eternal debt. Hell, his innovation of his own form of jiu-jitsu (now called BJJ for short) is something that will stand the test of time forever.
These days, you can't be a pro fighter of any note without versing yourself in the man's art. (Among many others, but BJJ first and foremost.)
I'm not a fan of the ".", but I hope the man rests in peace. I've been appreciating the fruits of his labour for over a decade.
posted by Dark Messiah at 2:16 PM on January 29, 2009
There's a sort of spiritual reason for it as well, although I'm too crudely educated in the reasoning to explain it. I believe Renzo explained it in an interview long ago.
Either way, modern MMA owes this man -- and his family -- an eternal debt. Hell, his innovation of his own form of jiu-jitsu (now called BJJ for short) is something that will stand the test of time forever.
These days, you can't be a pro fighter of any note without versing yourself in the man's art. (Among many others, but BJJ first and foremost.)
I'm not a fan of the ".", but I hope the man rests in peace. I've been appreciating the fruits of his labour for over a decade.
posted by Dark Messiah at 2:16 PM on January 29, 2009
I bought a Gracie jiu-jitsu dvd a few years ago, somehow thinking I'd practice from watching it, but instead I lost a day to being glued to the TV. It was the smartest, sexiest thing I'd seen in combination.
posted by birdie birdington at 2:20 PM on January 29, 2009
posted by birdie birdington at 2:20 PM on January 29, 2009
Either way, modern MMA owes this man -- and his family -- an eternal debt. Hell, his innovation of his own form of jiu-jitsu (now called BJJ for short) is something that will stand the test of time forever.
These days, you can't be a pro fighter of any note without versing yourself in the man's art. (Among many others, but BJJ first and foremost.)
Yeah, the term "Mixed Martial Arts" was actually coined by the Gracies, and originally meant just what it sounds like, as shown in the original mid-90s UFC: what if a Karate guy fought an amateur wrestler? Who wins in a judo vs. Sambo fight? The point was to put over BJJ and grappling in general as the best martial art and show that size and strength didn't matter as much as skill, and it pretty much worked: almost all the best fighters in the old UFC were BJJ guys or amateur wrestlers. Now, MMA fighters actually train in "Mixed Martial Arts", which is now its own style: a mix of mostly BJJ/wrestling grappling combined with striking. No artsy forms, no spiritual mumbo-jumbo, no wacky breathing exercises, just straight up practical, effective ass-kicking. Pretty much anyone who wants to learn an actual combat skill rather than a sport or a pastime for kids trains in BJJ now, it's by far the most popular martial art.
posted by DecemberBoy at 2:26 PM on January 29, 2009
These days, you can't be a pro fighter of any note without versing yourself in the man's art. (Among many others, but BJJ first and foremost.)
Yeah, the term "Mixed Martial Arts" was actually coined by the Gracies, and originally meant just what it sounds like, as shown in the original mid-90s UFC: what if a Karate guy fought an amateur wrestler? Who wins in a judo vs. Sambo fight? The point was to put over BJJ and grappling in general as the best martial art and show that size and strength didn't matter as much as skill, and it pretty much worked: almost all the best fighters in the old UFC were BJJ guys or amateur wrestlers. Now, MMA fighters actually train in "Mixed Martial Arts", which is now its own style: a mix of mostly BJJ/wrestling grappling combined with striking. No artsy forms, no spiritual mumbo-jumbo, no wacky breathing exercises, just straight up practical, effective ass-kicking. Pretty much anyone who wants to learn an actual combat skill rather than a sport or a pastime for kids trains in BJJ now, it's by far the most popular martial art.
posted by DecemberBoy at 2:26 PM on January 29, 2009
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This family fascinates me. I, for one, would be interested in reading/watching more.
posted by ferdydurke at 2:29 PM on January 29, 2009
This family fascinates me. I, for one, would be interested in reading/watching more.
posted by ferdydurke at 2:29 PM on January 29, 2009
The opening chapters of Total MMA by Jonathan Snowden have a good bit on the history of the Gracie family.
posted by maurice at 2:36 PM on January 29, 2009
posted by maurice at 2:36 PM on January 29, 2009
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This family fascinates me. I, for one, would be interested in reading/watching more.
Seconded. Is there a good book on the family?
posted by Bookhouse at 2:36 PM on January 29, 2009
This family fascinates me. I, for one, would be interested in reading/watching more.
Seconded. Is there a good book on the family?
posted by Bookhouse at 2:36 PM on January 29, 2009
RIP. The man truly revolutionized martial arts. For the better.
posted by wuwei at 2:55 PM on January 29, 2009
posted by wuwei at 2:55 PM on January 29, 2009
I stayed wit a bunch of Brazilian immigrants in London once. They would do some capoeria in the basement when drunk and practice BJJ when sober. They had a framed newspaper clipping from when Helio had disarmed and disabled 7 cops by himself. They even had this video from 1951 on a VHS.
He was a hero and a demigod in that house.
posted by dirty lies at 3:01 PM on January 29, 2009 [1 favorite]
He was a hero and a demigod in that house.
posted by dirty lies at 3:01 PM on January 29, 2009 [1 favorite]
Choke - A Rickson Gracie Documentary is an older, low budget, documentary on one of the Gracie brothers.
That said I think it's worth watching as an introduction to the Gracie family.
Rickson gets time to talk about the family, Jiu-Jitsu as a lifestyle and what makes him tick - he's a very sharp guy and explains things beautifully.
You also get to see having a great time rolling with his deceased father which is very poignant.
posted by fingerbang at 3:06 PM on January 29, 2009 [1 favorite]
That said I think it's worth watching as an introduction to the Gracie family.
Rickson gets time to talk about the family, Jiu-Jitsu as a lifestyle and what makes him tick - he's a very sharp guy and explains things beautifully.
You also get to see having a great time rolling with his deceased father which is very poignant.
posted by fingerbang at 3:06 PM on January 29, 2009 [1 favorite]
Hélio was a cool guy. And we should party, since he's publicly claimed that's what he wants his kids to do on this very day (no drinking or excesses of any kind, though).
All the "R"s are pronounced "H", so the names are pronounced Hickson, Hoyce, etc.
How sure are you of this? I've never heard of such a thing, and I know everybody in the Gracie academy in Lisbon (including people who trained with Hélio himself and some of his "R" sons), and this was never mentioned. I mean, in Portuguese, you don't even pronounce the "h". It's a silent letter. The "R" at the start of a word is a very strong alveolar [R], though, which could (?) be mistaken by non-speakers of Portuguese as an attempt for an aspired "h", like Spanish people saying "I rrrrrrabe to go rrrrrrrome now". Is that it?
posted by neblina_matinal at 3:08 PM on January 29, 2009
All the "R"s are pronounced "H", so the names are pronounced Hickson, Hoyce, etc.
How sure are you of this? I've never heard of such a thing, and I know everybody in the Gracie academy in Lisbon (including people who trained with Hélio himself and some of his "R" sons), and this was never mentioned. I mean, in Portuguese, you don't even pronounce the "h". It's a silent letter. The "R" at the start of a word is a very strong alveolar [R], though, which could (?) be mistaken by non-speakers of Portuguese as an attempt for an aspired "h", like Spanish people saying "I rrrrrrabe to go rrrrrrrome now". Is that it?
posted by neblina_matinal at 3:08 PM on January 29, 2009
i dunno about portugal, but everybody in brazil pronounces the R letter as an H sound (at least when the word starts with an R) rio = "hee-o", real (the brazilian form of $) = "hey-ow", etc...
posted by youthenrage at 3:16 PM on January 29, 2009
posted by youthenrage at 3:16 PM on January 29, 2009
At least his passing was how he wanted it: quick and fast.
posted by mr_crash_davis mark II: Jazz Odyssey at 3:27 PM on January 29, 2009 [1 favorite]
posted by mr_crash_davis mark II: Jazz Odyssey at 3:27 PM on January 29, 2009 [1 favorite]
youthenrage, that is positively not true. It's definitely an [R] (not as dragged out as in my "Spanish" example, it's much shorter and softer, but still). And again, in Portuguese (both Brazilian and European) there is no such thing as an "h" sound. We just don't have it. I've been watching novelas since I was born, believe you me, and I can fake a mean Carioca accent. Go to Rio and pronounce it "hy-wo" and they'll think you have a speech impediment.
Anyway, I'm sorry for the derail
posted by neblina_matinal at 3:27 PM on January 29, 2009
Anyway, I'm sorry for the derail
posted by neblina_matinal at 3:27 PM on January 29, 2009
Every English-speaking MMA follower I know pronounces the names as Hoyce, Hickson, etc. It may be another Gracie innovation.
posted by stammer at 3:37 PM on January 29, 2009
posted by stammer at 3:37 PM on January 29, 2009
.
(the Gracie kids' names are pronounced as if starting with an H in North America and they're allright with that)
posted by porpoise at 3:39 PM on January 29, 2009
(the Gracie kids' names are pronounced as if starting with an H in North America and they're allright with that)
posted by porpoise at 3:39 PM on January 29, 2009
in my limited experience with Brazilian Portugese, there is most definitely an 'h' sound, especially corresponding to 'r's at the beginning of words. roda is pronounced "ho-dah".
posted by gnutron at 3:39 PM on January 29, 2009
posted by gnutron at 3:39 PM on January 29, 2009
neblina_matinal: if an English speaker is trying to approximate the Brazilian Portuguese 'r', their 'h' is much closer than the English 'r'. Honest, when Brazilians teach Portuguese to English speakers, that's what they tell them to do. So yes, English "h" is not the correct sound, but it's closer, if you have English-attuned ears, anyway.
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 3:40 PM on January 29, 2009
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 3:40 PM on January 29, 2009
.
posted by Smedleyman at 3:46 PM on January 29, 2009
posted by Smedleyman at 3:46 PM on January 29, 2009
"capoeria in the basement when drunk and practice BJJ when sober"
Heh.
Also,
.
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 3:50 PM on January 29, 2009
Heh.
Also,
.
posted by i_am_joe's_spleen at 3:50 PM on January 29, 2009
"Are you afraid of death?
Death? [Laughter.] Why fear death? I don’t need anything, I don’t have anything, I don’t want anything. I think it’s silly for somebody to be scared of dying. One should be afraid of being born. I have already told my children when I die I want a party, with no alcohol, no hell raising [general laughter]. But I want a party with music, food… I don’t know if you guys believe in reincarnation, but we all go and come back until the day we no longer have to return. My brother [Carlos Gracie, already deceased] used to say the fellow only stops returning to Earth when he mingles with the Whole. Even when you’re thinking just a little bit wrongly, you come back to continue evolving. Hell, my friends, is right here on Earth."
posted by googly at 3:50 PM on January 29, 2009 [1 favorite]
Death? [Laughter.] Why fear death? I don’t need anything, I don’t have anything, I don’t want anything. I think it’s silly for somebody to be scared of dying. One should be afraid of being born. I have already told my children when I die I want a party, with no alcohol, no hell raising [general laughter]. But I want a party with music, food… I don’t know if you guys believe in reincarnation, but we all go and come back until the day we no longer have to return. My brother [Carlos Gracie, already deceased] used to say the fellow only stops returning to Earth when he mingles with the Whole. Even when you’re thinking just a little bit wrongly, you come back to continue evolving. Hell, my friends, is right here on Earth."
posted by googly at 3:50 PM on January 29, 2009 [1 favorite]
I saw a quote from John Danaher that sums up why I like Brazilian Jiu Jitsu so much: "[T]he deadly techniques favored by so many traditional martial arts have only a theoretical deadliness with little practical deadliness."
I've trained in a self-defense oriented mixed martial art for several years where everything is allowed and encouraged, including groin strikes, eye gouges, biting, etc. And while I do believe it's plenty effective, it's also impossible to train a form like that regularly against fully resisting opponents. So it's drill, drill, drill... then we spar like two weeks out of the year in full body armor... oops make that one week because everybody's too beat up after one week to continue training. You end up with little practical experience applying the "deadly" form.
The great thing about BJJ is in almost every gym you spar ("roll") with opponents at the end of EVERY SINGLE CLASS. And you can maintain it, month after month, because there's zero striking and you don't get all beat up in training. Joint locks and chokes are applied, but the subject always taps out before any real damage is done. But the upshot is you get to spar over and over and over again, against lightly- to fully-resisting opponents, which is the key to genuinely learning a martial art -- "aliveness", or so it's called. You end up getting very good at applying techniques that absolutely can break people's arms, choke them to death, etc.
Sure, you need to combine it with a striking form such as muay tai, then work with weapons, etc., to make an effective real-world self-defense, but sparring muay tai gets you waaay more beat up than BJJ... (Aaaaand don't go to the ground against multiple opponents!)
And, you hear it all the time, but BJJ really is like chess. You learn a new move and slap it on your opponent. But uh-oh.., your opponent knows a counter to that move; he applies it and gains a better position. But, not-so-fast, you know a great sweep from that position and reverse it. etc. etc. etc. It is just so mentally engaging -- that really surprised me about the sport.
I like to pretend that Hélio is rolling in his grave.
posted by LordSludge at 3:57 PM on January 29, 2009 [6 favorites]
I've trained in a self-defense oriented mixed martial art for several years where everything is allowed and encouraged, including groin strikes, eye gouges, biting, etc. And while I do believe it's plenty effective, it's also impossible to train a form like that regularly against fully resisting opponents. So it's drill, drill, drill... then we spar like two weeks out of the year in full body armor... oops make that one week because everybody's too beat up after one week to continue training. You end up with little practical experience applying the "deadly" form.
The great thing about BJJ is in almost every gym you spar ("roll") with opponents at the end of EVERY SINGLE CLASS. And you can maintain it, month after month, because there's zero striking and you don't get all beat up in training. Joint locks and chokes are applied, but the subject always taps out before any real damage is done. But the upshot is you get to spar over and over and over again, against lightly- to fully-resisting opponents, which is the key to genuinely learning a martial art -- "aliveness", or so it's called. You end up getting very good at applying techniques that absolutely can break people's arms, choke them to death, etc.
Sure, you need to combine it with a striking form such as muay tai, then work with weapons, etc., to make an effective real-world self-defense, but sparring muay tai gets you waaay more beat up than BJJ... (Aaaaand don't go to the ground against multiple opponents!)
And, you hear it all the time, but BJJ really is like chess. You learn a new move and slap it on your opponent. But uh-oh.., your opponent knows a counter to that move; he applies it and gains a better position. But, not-so-fast, you know a great sweep from that position and reverse it. etc. etc. etc. It is just so mentally engaging -- that really surprised me about the sport.
I like to pretend that Hélio is rolling in his grave.
posted by LordSludge at 3:57 PM on January 29, 2009 [6 favorites]
How sure are you of this? I've never heard of such a thing, and I know everybody in the Gracie academy in Lisbon (including people who trained with Hélio himself and some of his "R" sons), and this was never mentioned.
I've only ever heard their names pronounced with an "H", but only by English-speaking announcers, commentators and such. Every English-speaking MMA fan/commentator/etc. I've ever heard pronounces them with an "H". I just figured that's how they were pronounced and that it was a quirk, but the correct Portuguese sound not existing in English makes more sense.
posted by DecemberBoy at 4:04 PM on January 29, 2009
I've only ever heard their names pronounced with an "H", but only by English-speaking announcers, commentators and such. Every English-speaking MMA fan/commentator/etc. I've ever heard pronounces them with an "H". I just figured that's how they were pronounced and that it was a quirk, but the correct Portuguese sound not existing in English makes more sense.
posted by DecemberBoy at 4:04 PM on January 29, 2009
For a while, before athletes specialized their training explicitly and exclusively for "The Octagon" in what we call MMA, there was one question karate nerds posed to each other, "Which martial art style can beat any other, one on one, in a cage-match."
The answer was Gracie-Style Jujitsu.
.
posted by Slap*Happy at 4:08 PM on January 29, 2009
The answer was Gracie-Style Jujitsu.
.
posted by Slap*Happy at 4:08 PM on January 29, 2009
His ghostly floating head will surely appear from time to time to rolling grapplers to remind them: "Position before submission!"
.
posted by ignignokt at 4:34 PM on January 29, 2009
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posted by ignignokt at 4:34 PM on January 29, 2009
And it's the Grim Reaper with the takedown and submission hold ... and Gracie taps out.
In the end, everyone taps out.
posted by bwg at 5:08 PM on January 29, 2009
In the end, everyone taps out.
posted by bwg at 5:08 PM on January 29, 2009
There's an Asian tradition of creating styles based on animal movements. Whether true or no, I felt from the first time I saw the Gracie style that it was how an anaconda would fight if it had arms & legs.
posted by dragonsi55 at 5:54 PM on January 29, 2009
posted by dragonsi55 at 5:54 PM on January 29, 2009
And it's the Grim Reaper with the takedown and submission hold ... and Gracie taps out.
Nah man, he died so he could go up there and put the grim reaper in an omaplata.
posted by Dark Messiah at 6:24 PM on January 29, 2009 [1 favorite]
Nah man, he died so he could go up there and put the grim reaper in an omaplata.
posted by Dark Messiah at 6:24 PM on January 29, 2009 [1 favorite]
Effectiveness aside, BJJ is the most fun art I've ever practiced, so I owe Helio thanks for that.
(With regards to the pronunciation of names, I've met Renzo and Royce and it sure sounded to me like they pronounced their names Henzo and Hoyce, respectively. Perhaps there's some subtlety that I'm missing since I don't speak Portuguese.)
posted by tdismukes at 8:01 PM on January 29, 2009
(With regards to the pronunciation of names, I've met Renzo and Royce and it sure sounded to me like they pronounced their names Henzo and Hoyce, respectively. Perhaps there's some subtlety that I'm missing since I don't speak Portuguese.)
posted by tdismukes at 8:01 PM on January 29, 2009
Okay, I see your point now: since the Portuguese "R" doesn't exist in English, English speakers go to the closest thing available, which is the English "h". I can see how it sounds similar to you. In any case, the correct articulation is like an English "h" sound, but along with that you have to make your uvula roll just a bit, vibrating as the air comes out.
posted by neblina_matinal at 3:42 AM on January 30, 2009
posted by neblina_matinal at 3:42 AM on January 30, 2009
there was one question karate nerds posed to each other, "Which martial art style can beat any other, one on one, in a cage-match.
Oh geez, online style wars. I know that it's stupid of me to get so annoyed about such things (after all, martial arts is really about doing, not talking), but I'm eternally grateful that one of the side effects of Gracie's works has been that martial arts discussion is a little bit less pathetic now than it was years ago.
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posted by PsychoKick at 5:57 AM on January 30, 2009
Oh geez, online style wars. I know that it's stupid of me to get so annoyed about such things (after all, martial arts is really about doing, not talking), but I'm eternally grateful that one of the side effects of Gracie's works has been that martial arts discussion is a little bit less pathetic now than it was years ago.
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posted by PsychoKick at 5:57 AM on January 30, 2009
Funny timing. I was just watching UFC 88 this morning.
I didn't like MMA at first. Especially the slow parts on the ground, when the fighters seemed to be doing nothing. But I slowly realized the immense amount of skill at work. As mentioned above, skill can often beat brute strength in that sport. Example:
"Jean Jacques Machado is one of five brothers of the Machado Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu family ... He has a disfigured left hand only having a thumb and a little finger. Despite this, he is known for his grappling skills."
posted by wastelands at 6:18 AM on January 30, 2009
I didn't like MMA at first. Especially the slow parts on the ground, when the fighters seemed to be doing nothing. But I slowly realized the immense amount of skill at work. As mentioned above, skill can often beat brute strength in that sport. Example:
"Jean Jacques Machado is one of five brothers of the Machado Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu family ... He has a disfigured left hand only having a thumb and a little finger. Despite this, he is known for his grappling skills."
posted by wastelands at 6:18 AM on January 30, 2009
I read an article about the man in an issue of Playboy that I'd stolen from my older brother. (Yes, I actually did read some articles even if that was not the primary intent when I was 13.)
This was years before I ever heard about UFC or MMA, but it made a distinct impression on me.
Anyone know if there's a way to track down such articles? I think it must have been from an issue in 1989.
posted by utsutsu at 7:05 AM on January 30, 2009
This was years before I ever heard about UFC or MMA, but it made a distinct impression on me.
Anyone know if there's a way to track down such articles? I think it must have been from an issue in 1989.
posted by utsutsu at 7:05 AM on January 30, 2009
fingerbang -- Thanks for the link, that's a really excellent documentary. Anybody interested in the Gracies, BJJ, or MMA should check it out.
No lie: I blew off a booty-call just to watch that uninterrupted -- definitely the right choice.
posted by LordSludge at 8:03 AM on January 30, 2009
No lie: I blew off a booty-call just to watch that uninterrupted -- definitely the right choice.
posted by LordSludge at 8:03 AM on January 30, 2009
utsutsu: you'd probably have to find the actual issue -- I don't know if they offer the articles online or anything -- but I think your memory of the year is about right. It had a reddish-orange cover, with triplets (also from Brazil, I think). The article was "The Toughest Man in the World," and it frequently brought up the standing offer from the Gracies to Mike Tyson. It made quite an impression to my thirteen-year-old self.
posted by Amanojaku at 11:40 AM on January 30, 2009
posted by Amanojaku at 11:40 AM on January 30, 2009
the standing offer from the Gracies to Mike Tyson
Just hearing that makes me giggle, remembering the boxer in one of the early UFC events who tried to fight with 1 boxing glove on. Ah good times, between that and Jo Sann (aka Random Task from Austin Powers) getting punched in the balls a dozen times by Keith Hackney.
posted by Dark Messiah at 2:47 PM on January 30, 2009
Just hearing that makes me giggle, remembering the boxer in one of the early UFC events who tried to fight with 1 boxing glove on. Ah good times, between that and Jo Sann (aka Random Task from Austin Powers) getting punched in the balls a dozen times by Keith Hackney.
posted by Dark Messiah at 2:47 PM on January 30, 2009
The kids'll kick your ass, too.
Hell, the kid's kids'll kick your ass.
What it feels like to roll with a Gracie, by Chad Waterbury (fourth page in)
posted by P.o.B. at 4:36 PM on January 30, 2009
Hell, the kid's kids'll kick your ass.
What it feels like to roll with a Gracie, by Chad Waterbury (fourth page in)
posted by P.o.B. at 4:36 PM on January 30, 2009
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What's up with this? Gracie is survived by .....his sons Rickson, Royler, Rolker, Royce, Relson, Robin and Rorion; his daughters Rerika and Ricci
posted by lalochezia at 1:42 PM on January 29, 2009