Communities founded on shared delusion: Prepper Edition
December 22, 2016 7:13 PM Subscribe
SHTF: Shit Hitting the Fan | "Preparation is something you do now that isn’t for now. It’s defined by what isn’t, yet... And for preppers that something is: disaster. A big one."
To Whelk's point, whenever this comes up I think about this comment on how (not actually at all) useful it was to have undertaken a lot of disaster preparedness prior to the siege of Sarajevo. It seems like it'd be a much better use of that mental effort to cultivate a network of people who care for and share with each other. Extra bonus: this is still an awesome thing to have in your life even when the world is not falling apart around you.
posted by invitapriore at 7:40 PM on December 22, 2016 [80 favorites]
posted by invitapriore at 7:40 PM on December 22, 2016 [80 favorites]
I visit Indonesia periodically, and whenever I switch on a TV and see an American program, it's always about these people. It makes me wonder, wow, what must they think of us?
posted by texorama at 7:46 PM on December 22, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by texorama at 7:46 PM on December 22, 2016 [1 favorite]
> To Whelk's point, whenever this comes up I think about this comment on how (not actually at all) useful it was to have undertaken a lot of disaster preparedness prior to the siege of Sarajevo.
I miss Dee. I hope she's doing okay.
As someone who lives in a place with a decent likelihood of experiencing some level of disaster, the preparedness is more about not putting unnecessary strain on rescue and recovery efforts, at least for a while. So we have various caches of earthquake supplies (water, snacks, batteries, lanterns, etc.), but it's not, like "Ha ha I have batteries and MREs and you don't!" levels of prepping.
One of my favorite photos remains one from the Super Storm Sandy thing, where someone in lower Manhattan who had electricity had hung an extension cord out their window so that people who need to charge their phones could do so. This seems to be a common kind of thing that people do in the aftermath of shitty happenings, and it makes me sad that the extreme prepper types think so little of other people.
posted by rtha at 7:50 PM on December 22, 2016 [66 favorites]
I miss Dee. I hope she's doing okay.
As someone who lives in a place with a decent likelihood of experiencing some level of disaster, the preparedness is more about not putting unnecessary strain on rescue and recovery efforts, at least for a while. So we have various caches of earthquake supplies (water, snacks, batteries, lanterns, etc.), but it's not, like "Ha ha I have batteries and MREs and you don't!" levels of prepping.
One of my favorite photos remains one from the Super Storm Sandy thing, where someone in lower Manhattan who had electricity had hung an extension cord out their window so that people who need to charge their phones could do so. This seems to be a common kind of thing that people do in the aftermath of shitty happenings, and it makes me sad that the extreme prepper types think so little of other people.
posted by rtha at 7:50 PM on December 22, 2016 [66 favorites]
I sometimes fall down this rabbit hole when feeling anxious. I've ended up with a multi-tool and an emergency blanket, hardly anything crazy. My house always has spare water and rice. Mormons certainly have me beat.
I am concerned about those who really get into this, though. Watching Doomsday Preppers and seeing how useless they are is fun in a way, but then I remember the man shooting up a pizzeria because of 'pizzagate'. Delusional people with lots of guns and few social connections is very concerning.
Serious preppers often try to hide (the grey man theory) so end up with even fewer social connections. What happens if there is a serious but not end of the world event? Do they start shooting the mailman out of fear that he's going to rob them?
posted by Trifling at 7:50 PM on December 22, 2016 [8 favorites]
I am concerned about those who really get into this, though. Watching Doomsday Preppers and seeing how useless they are is fun in a way, but then I remember the man shooting up a pizzeria because of 'pizzagate'. Delusional people with lots of guns and few social connections is very concerning.
Serious preppers often try to hide (the grey man theory) so end up with even fewer social connections. What happens if there is a serious but not end of the world event? Do they start shooting the mailman out of fear that he's going to rob them?
posted by Trifling at 7:50 PM on December 22, 2016 [8 favorites]
It's still a good idea to have a few supplies in case of a light sprinkle of pee hitting the fan. For example, the crushing snowstorms that the northeast occasionally experiences. Yeah, community is cool and all that, but someone in that community had better have a heater, spare food, water filter, etc.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 7:51 PM on December 22, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 7:51 PM on December 22, 2016 [20 favorites]
Who knows, maybe the preppers with bomb shelters will have the last laugh soon.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:55 PM on December 22, 2016
posted by tobascodagama at 7:55 PM on December 22, 2016
Nah, if there's a nuclear war then they have to live. They'll be jealous of the rest of us soon enough.
posted by Countess Elena at 7:59 PM on December 22, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by Countess Elena at 7:59 PM on December 22, 2016 [20 favorites]
Yeah, it's not gonna be one of those real hearty belly laughs, though. The last laugh in that case is a fuckin' booby prize.
posted by Sing Or Swim at 7:59 PM on December 22, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Sing Or Swim at 7:59 PM on December 22, 2016 [2 favorites]
The Vaults were never meant to save anyone.
posted by radwolf76 at 8:03 PM on December 22, 2016 [35 favorites]
posted by radwolf76 at 8:03 PM on December 22, 2016 [35 favorites]
One of my favorite photos remains one from the Super Storm Sandy thing, where someone in lower Manhattan who had electricity had hung an extension cord out their window so that people who need to charge their phones could do so.When Ike hit Houston in 2008, huge portions of the city were without power for days and days, and smaller portions for much longer. On the day we got power back (Tuesday, after the storm hit on Friday or Saturday), we had a brief window of "YAY!" before we got word, late in the evening, that our friend C. had passed away. He'd been ill with cancer for a while, so it wasn't a complete surprise.
There was a wake a few days later, in a part of town that had pockets of power restored. On the street where the wake was held, the north side was still offline, but the south side had power. And running from nearly every southern front door was a heavy-duty extension cord that reached all the way across the street and into the powerless northern house on the opposite side of the street.
To borrow a phrase, it was a small, good thing at exactly the right time. I have a vivid memory of dozens of orange cords against the black road surface, and the community and aid it represented. It was a lovely, lovely thing.
posted by uberchet at 8:06 PM on December 22, 2016 [100 favorites]
it makes me sad that the extreme prepper types think so little of other people.
It's usually a reflection of who they are, they assume people would be as selfish they would. They can imagine any number of disasters, but human kindness is beyond their ken.
posted by ghost phoneme at 8:25 PM on December 22, 2016 [20 favorites]
It's usually a reflection of who they are, they assume people would be as selfish they would. They can imagine any number of disasters, but human kindness is beyond their ken.
posted by ghost phoneme at 8:25 PM on December 22, 2016 [20 favorites]
"It's usually a reflection of who they are, they assume people would be as selfish they would."
Or as we say in corn country, "He measured her corn by his own bushel, and thus came up short."
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:47 PM on December 22, 2016 [44 favorites]
Or as we say in corn country, "He measured her corn by his own bushel, and thus came up short."
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:47 PM on December 22, 2016 [44 favorites]
> Nah, if there's a nuclear war then they have to live. They'll be jealous of the rest of us soon enough.
This is the lesson that Threads taught me as a teenager: stand on the big red X and be spared the horrors of survival.
posted by davelog at 8:54 PM on December 22, 2016 [14 favorites]
This is the lesson that Threads taught me as a teenager: stand on the big red X and be spared the horrors of survival.
posted by davelog at 8:54 PM on December 22, 2016 [14 favorites]
I'm a light prepper. It used to help with my anxiety- just in case, this way I can relax and not worry.
Now that we are facing a Trump presidency, I'm damn glad I have some supplies. I plan to be getting more. Ideally, I plan to stock so that I can host additional mouths for months without changing my shopping habits at the supermarket. Just in case. You never fucking know how bad it will get, or what people will need on their way.
posted by corb at 9:06 PM on December 22, 2016 [18 favorites]
Now that we are facing a Trump presidency, I'm damn glad I have some supplies. I plan to be getting more. Ideally, I plan to stock so that I can host additional mouths for months without changing my shopping habits at the supermarket. Just in case. You never fucking know how bad it will get, or what people will need on their way.
posted by corb at 9:06 PM on December 22, 2016 [18 favorites]
It's one thing to have to have a supply of things for a week or more, that makes sense, natural disasters are only going to become more common, but full on castle/bunker mentalities? Gun-filled fetishes? Fantasies that will backfire.
posted by The Whelk at 9:28 PM on December 22, 2016 [9 favorites]
posted by The Whelk at 9:28 PM on December 22, 2016 [9 favorites]
Vic Berger Presents Jim Bakker's Buckets
posted by My Dad at 9:43 PM on December 22, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by My Dad at 9:43 PM on December 22, 2016 [2 favorites]
> Nah, if there's a nuclear war then they have to live. They'll be jealous of the rest of us soon enough.
posted by Countess Elena
This is the lesson that Threads taught me as a teenager: stand on the big red X and be spared the horrors of survival.
posted by davelog
We live next to a likely primary target in a nuclear war (USAF base with A-10s, and I believe a SAC wing, with the added bonus of a power plant outside the base fence.) If the word ever comes that the missiles are inbound, I'm just gonna walk out to the back yard and wait for the boom.
posted by azpenguin at 9:45 PM on December 22, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Countess Elena
This is the lesson that Threads taught me as a teenager: stand on the big red X and be spared the horrors of survival.
posted by davelog
We live next to a likely primary target in a nuclear war (USAF base with A-10s, and I believe a SAC wing, with the added bonus of a power plant outside the base fence.) If the word ever comes that the missiles are inbound, I'm just gonna walk out to the back yard and wait for the boom.
posted by azpenguin at 9:45 PM on December 22, 2016 [6 favorites]
The thing that always strikes me when I watch Doomsday Preppers is how physically out-of-shape many (not all, but many) of them are. I don't mean this in a body shaming way, I don't care what they look like - I just mean that purely, if my goal was to survive an apocalyptic event indefinitely, my #1 priority would be lifting weights and running every single day and being in the best physical shape I possibly could. Being fast and strong and really accustomed to serious physical exertion/discomfort seems like it'd pay the biggest dividends in terms of survival, and it's something that isn't as easily stolen as food or guns.
posted by gloriouslyincandescent at 9:46 PM on December 22, 2016 [64 favorites]
posted by gloriouslyincandescent at 9:46 PM on December 22, 2016 [64 favorites]
I lost power for over a week after Ike plowed through Houston. Just how much preparation does that justify in order not to experience that particular hell again, generator, gas storage, ice chest? Same question for people who have survived floods, blizzards, earthquakes, you name it.
The truth is that some level of prep is simple common sense, but where does common sense end and paranoid begin? Guns is a clean line to not cross, but if you are theoretically wanting to get through two weeks of temporary societal breakdown, we're actually talking about a lot of stuff, and if you stack it all against a wall, the mass of it all is actually a little unsettling and weird, and that's the problem. Once you accept some level of prep into your life, it's not easy to know when to say stop. There is no clear line.
posted by Beholder at 10:04 PM on December 22, 2016 [10 favorites]
The truth is that some level of prep is simple common sense, but where does common sense end and paranoid begin? Guns is a clean line to not cross, but if you are theoretically wanting to get through two weeks of temporary societal breakdown, we're actually talking about a lot of stuff, and if you stack it all against a wall, the mass of it all is actually a little unsettling and weird, and that's the problem. Once you accept some level of prep into your life, it's not easy to know when to say stop. There is no clear line.
posted by Beholder at 10:04 PM on December 22, 2016 [10 favorites]
It's interesting that all post apocalyptic Hollywood fiction shows survivors killing each other and stealing each other's stuff. I'm having a hard time trying to remember a Hollywood movie or a TV show that shows a group wider than a Nuclear Family gathering together to survive disaster.
It's almost as if The Man wanted us to distrust society and abnegate the social contract. But then I tell myself: no one would be crazy enough and selfish enough to want that!
posted by monotreme at 10:09 PM on December 22, 2016 [32 favorites]
It's almost as if The Man wanted us to distrust society and abnegate the social contract. But then I tell myself: no one would be crazy enough and selfish enough to want that!
posted by monotreme at 10:09 PM on December 22, 2016 [32 favorites]
also none of the recent popular apocalyptic stuff really shows what a famine looks like
posted by The Whelk at 10:20 PM on December 22, 2016 [16 favorites]
posted by The Whelk at 10:20 PM on December 22, 2016 [16 favorites]
The article was waaaaay lite on prepping. It was an anti trump piece wrapped in prep tissue paper.
posted by davidmsc at 10:30 PM on December 22, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by davidmsc at 10:30 PM on December 22, 2016 [7 favorites]
So, the same media that showed you Maynard Krebs as a typical beatnick is earning some nice profits off of advertisement sales during even handed, totaly objective programs 1telling you ALL you need to know about EVERYONE who gives a bit of thought, resources and effort towards smoothing out trauma from natural or human generated bobbles in "just in time" inventory? Y'all are fully and completely informed, totally qualified for snarking at those poor idiots.
Fuck8ng variety in individuals backgrounds in our society is like variety in a fuck8ing species gene pool. The broader the available variety of responses to a "challenge", the greater chance that SOMETHING passes that filter, and maybe hauls your ass over the threshold along with themselves out of community spirit... Their tendency to think and plan that way may be a plus, so may your ability to discuss repercussions of materialism and knowledge of Sonoma county red wine grape varietals. Chill the fuck out, unless it breaks your leg or picks your pocket.
posted by bert2368 at 10:41 PM on December 22, 2016 [4 favorites]
Fuck8ng variety in individuals backgrounds in our society is like variety in a fuck8ing species gene pool. The broader the available variety of responses to a "challenge", the greater chance that SOMETHING passes that filter, and maybe hauls your ass over the threshold along with themselves out of community spirit... Their tendency to think and plan that way may be a plus, so may your ability to discuss repercussions of materialism and knowledge of Sonoma county red wine grape varietals. Chill the fuck out, unless it breaks your leg or picks your pocket.
posted by bert2368 at 10:41 PM on December 22, 2016 [4 favorites]
To borrow a phrase, it was a small, good thing
That is so apt, though sadly so. Generosity is most reliable along a person-to-person line. I'd prefer to think my neighbors regard their government - local, state, federal - an access to relief and security, and so support its functions out of at least a shared interest in the commonweal. But I think the best I can hope for is a neighborly degree of charity, which is something.
The Raymond Carver story that phase alludes to is a melancholy marvel: a baker who thought he was just doing business is reminded the hard way that a simple cake, and the bland dollars that pay for it, are part of a story with real people as the characters. To see beyond the mere transaction is hard and humbling, and a recognition that we may one day be on the other side.
posted by Caxton1476 at 11:36 PM on December 22, 2016 [3 favorites]
That is so apt, though sadly so. Generosity is most reliable along a person-to-person line. I'd prefer to think my neighbors regard their government - local, state, federal - an access to relief and security, and so support its functions out of at least a shared interest in the commonweal. But I think the best I can hope for is a neighborly degree of charity, which is something.
The Raymond Carver story that phase alludes to is a melancholy marvel: a baker who thought he was just doing business is reminded the hard way that a simple cake, and the bland dollars that pay for it, are part of a story with real people as the characters. To see beyond the mere transaction is hard and humbling, and a recognition that we may one day be on the other side.
posted by Caxton1476 at 11:36 PM on December 22, 2016 [3 favorites]
I live in LA, in the valley, so we do have to consider the possibility of earthquakes on a scale that might at least temporarily disrupt infrastructure. I figure the safest for us would be to stay and ride it out until infrastructure and supply lines are restored rather than try to get out of the valley or try and go shopping for food and water when everybody else is trying to do the same. So we have water, food and emergency supplies and a few comfort items to get us through almost a month with enough to spare to help out neighbors. Plus gear and tools to generate some power, charge stuff and deal with hazards such as fires and gas leaks and injuries typical for earthquakes. Even if the house is destroyed we can still camp out in the yard.
Not sure if that makes me a prepper or not but I do intend to help everybody around us and I'm not stockpiling weapons and ammo or anything like that.
During a recent water main break under our street, which happens to be a cul-de-sac, I realized just how oddly incapable people around here are in terms of responding to even mild disruptions of normal operations. The street flooded on a weekend so most of the neighbors were home and came outside. We quickly determined that it was a burst main around the corner and called the appropriate emergency numbers. Then people just stood there and watched. I had to go to each and everyone and tell them to move their damn cars b/c once the trucks come and they start digging up the street they'd be stuck in the cul-de-sac for however long it takes (these are tiny streets here). Which could be a day or maybe a week. Then I went to our garage and started filling every bucket and large pot I had with water from the hose and also filled our bath tub with water. Everybody stared at me like I was nuts and a few asked what I was doing and I explained that a bust water main means they'll have to turn off the water to fix it. Which means no working toilets and no tap water unless you get it right now. You buy it at a store you have to carry it all the way home since you can't drive in. For however long the work takes. Suddenly their eyes went wide and they all sprinted to do the same but by then city workers had arrived and turned off the water.
I guess I have these near automatic responses simply because I grew up in a family where we went camping a lot for many weeks (those awesome European 7-8 week summer vacations) and you quickly learn what's important, what's not and how to quickly act and make decisions when things go pear shaped and you're suddenly dealing with unexpected surprises and resource limitations. Plus my parents were teenagers during WWII and my mom in particular spent a long time hungry, scavenging and fleeing across the country as the Russians moved in from the East, so responding quickly and intuitively to stuff, being prepared and just dealing with things decisively without losing her calm was deeply ingrained in her psyche and some of that wore off on us kids I guess.
Anyhow, it's easy to laugh at preppers and there's a lot of dumb and selfish stuff going on in that crowd. But the opposite, to be utterly unprepared, is equally silly. I'd rather have the peace of mind that comes from knowing that if something happens that turns everything into a big PITA for a bit, we can hang back and roll with it until things settle down again. Plus by doing so we're also freeing ourselves up to assist and help those around us as needed.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 11:55 PM on December 22, 2016 [65 favorites]
Not sure if that makes me a prepper or not but I do intend to help everybody around us and I'm not stockpiling weapons and ammo or anything like that.
During a recent water main break under our street, which happens to be a cul-de-sac, I realized just how oddly incapable people around here are in terms of responding to even mild disruptions of normal operations. The street flooded on a weekend so most of the neighbors were home and came outside. We quickly determined that it was a burst main around the corner and called the appropriate emergency numbers. Then people just stood there and watched. I had to go to each and everyone and tell them to move their damn cars b/c once the trucks come and they start digging up the street they'd be stuck in the cul-de-sac for however long it takes (these are tiny streets here). Which could be a day or maybe a week. Then I went to our garage and started filling every bucket and large pot I had with water from the hose and also filled our bath tub with water. Everybody stared at me like I was nuts and a few asked what I was doing and I explained that a bust water main means they'll have to turn off the water to fix it. Which means no working toilets and no tap water unless you get it right now. You buy it at a store you have to carry it all the way home since you can't drive in. For however long the work takes. Suddenly their eyes went wide and they all sprinted to do the same but by then city workers had arrived and turned off the water.
I guess I have these near automatic responses simply because I grew up in a family where we went camping a lot for many weeks (those awesome European 7-8 week summer vacations) and you quickly learn what's important, what's not and how to quickly act and make decisions when things go pear shaped and you're suddenly dealing with unexpected surprises and resource limitations. Plus my parents were teenagers during WWII and my mom in particular spent a long time hungry, scavenging and fleeing across the country as the Russians moved in from the East, so responding quickly and intuitively to stuff, being prepared and just dealing with things decisively without losing her calm was deeply ingrained in her psyche and some of that wore off on us kids I guess.
Anyhow, it's easy to laugh at preppers and there's a lot of dumb and selfish stuff going on in that crowd. But the opposite, to be utterly unprepared, is equally silly. I'd rather have the peace of mind that comes from knowing that if something happens that turns everything into a big PITA for a bit, we can hang back and roll with it until things settle down again. Plus by doing so we're also freeing ourselves up to assist and help those around us as needed.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 11:55 PM on December 22, 2016 [65 favorites]
The defining feature of a "prepper" as opposed to someone who used to be an Eagle Scout and has a strong diligent streak is that the Eagle Scout types (such as you, Hairy Lobster) are preparing, or overpreparing, for actual likely disasters common to your area, but Preppers are preparing for TEOTWAWKI -- the end of the world as we know it. Including such scenarios as complete governmental collapse, invasion by China, the Zika killing so many people that society collapses, alien invasion, EMP pulses, etc. Their risk assessment is somewhere between terrible and fanciful, their scenarios unlikely, and their response prepping therefore pretty misguided in terms of either likely disasters or their fantasy disasters.
Which isn't to say I don't read prepper websites OBSESSIVELY and there's lots of interesting info. You just have to guard against falling down the crazy hole where their barbed wire hyper defended gun compound will never be found by ravening hoards but only polite merchants who wish to trade for gold because gold still has value in the post apocalyptic world apparently.
If you want to prep for actual disasters your state emergency agency or the local Red Cross will give you extensive resources on common disasters in your area, what to do, and what to keep on hand. (And YES! You can go buy bug out bags from the prepper websites! And MREs! The jambalaya is particularly sought after.) They'll even train you in disaster response. But it doesn't quite have the same LARPing the apocalypse cache.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 12:40 AM on December 23, 2016 [29 favorites]
Which isn't to say I don't read prepper websites OBSESSIVELY and there's lots of interesting info. You just have to guard against falling down the crazy hole where their barbed wire hyper defended gun compound will never be found by ravening hoards but only polite merchants who wish to trade for gold because gold still has value in the post apocalyptic world apparently.
If you want to prep for actual disasters your state emergency agency or the local Red Cross will give you extensive resources on common disasters in your area, what to do, and what to keep on hand. (And YES! You can go buy bug out bags from the prepper websites! And MREs! The jambalaya is particularly sought after.) They'll even train you in disaster response. But it doesn't quite have the same LARPing the apocalypse cache.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 12:40 AM on December 23, 2016 [29 favorites]
forget teotwawki or wtshtf
it's all the bags that keep me up at night
the bug out bag when you happen to be at home and have just enough time
the get home bag because you're most likely at work
the car kit because you hope you can make it to your bug out location
the bug in bag when you can't bug out because you're a sheeple
so many bags
posted by Foci for Analysis at 1:49 AM on December 23, 2016 [36 favorites]
it's all the bags that keep me up at night
the bug out bag when you happen to be at home and have just enough time
the get home bag because you're most likely at work
the car kit because you hope you can make it to your bug out location
the bug in bag when you can't bug out because you're a sheeple
so many bags
posted by Foci for Analysis at 1:49 AM on December 23, 2016 [36 favorites]
Yeah, to be precise: disaster preparedness and prepping are two entirely different things, and motivated by entirely different mindsets. A big part of disaster preparedness is reducing the burden on emergency services so that they can concentrate on those most in need. A big part of prepping is "fuck you."
posted by klanawa at 1:55 AM on December 23, 2016 [32 favorites]
posted by klanawa at 1:55 AM on December 23, 2016 [32 favorites]
I also was struck by the makeshift phone charging station after Sandy. One of my idle-daydream projects I think about building is a car-portable battery pack with several deep cycle batteries with some solar and 12V in so I could turn my car into a mobile cellphone charging station in the event of something like that.
I often have 'worst case scenario' sort of daydreams - they can be fun! They range from "well, how *would* I deal if the water was undrinkably full of bacteria for a few days here at home" and "if the power's out, what to do about the sump pump?" to "if I had to go on the run right now, what would I do?" and "is there a way to reasonably harden my house in the event of a zombie apocalypse?" On a practical level, I have a camping water filter that claims to be able to turn mud into potable water, enough shelf-stable food around to have really boring meals for at least a week, a small emergency kit in my car, and other similar practical things.
Of course, I suspect even the hardcore preppers think they're being practical, too.
posted by rmd1023 at 2:13 AM on December 23, 2016 [4 favorites]
I often have 'worst case scenario' sort of daydreams - they can be fun! They range from "well, how *would* I deal if the water was undrinkably full of bacteria for a few days here at home" and "if the power's out, what to do about the sump pump?" to "if I had to go on the run right now, what would I do?" and "is there a way to reasonably harden my house in the event of a zombie apocalypse?" On a practical level, I have a camping water filter that claims to be able to turn mud into potable water, enough shelf-stable food around to have really boring meals for at least a week, a small emergency kit in my car, and other similar practical things.
Of course, I suspect even the hardcore preppers think they're being practical, too.
posted by rmd1023 at 2:13 AM on December 23, 2016 [4 favorites]
List of causes of death by rate.
Prepare for diabetes, because meteor strike doesn't even make the list.
posted by adept256 at 2:58 AM on December 23, 2016 [11 favorites]
Prepare for diabetes, because meteor strike doesn't even make the list.
posted by adept256 at 2:58 AM on December 23, 2016 [11 favorites]
That article was writerly and introspective, but hardly informative about preppers. And still chock-full of the 'liberal' hubris that helped throw the election to Trump.
"Prepping" is relative. Do you shop once a week, or daily? If you got snowed in and lost power for a day or two, would you be cold and hungry in the dark? Ideally, everyone should be prepared enough to coast through the stuff that actually happens a few times a decade in their own area. The Eagle scout thing. I believe the current recommendation for most of us urban types is to have enough food and water to be able to go three days before hollering 'Uncle!'. No camo required.
Serious prepping seems like one of those immersive role-playing groups, like folks who'll go play Dungeons and Dragons all weekend, in costume. Except with a higher capital commitment. And guns.
I occasionally listen to shortwave. You can usually find Alex Jones' show ('Infowars'). In between all the fear-mongering you get the prepper ads. It's become a busy little industry.
posted by Artful Codger at 3:12 AM on December 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
"Prepping" is relative. Do you shop once a week, or daily? If you got snowed in and lost power for a day or two, would you be cold and hungry in the dark? Ideally, everyone should be prepared enough to coast through the stuff that actually happens a few times a decade in their own area. The Eagle scout thing. I believe the current recommendation for most of us urban types is to have enough food and water to be able to go three days before hollering 'Uncle!'. No camo required.
Serious prepping seems like one of those immersive role-playing groups, like folks who'll go play Dungeons and Dragons all weekend, in costume. Except with a higher capital commitment. And guns.
I occasionally listen to shortwave. You can usually find Alex Jones' show ('Infowars'). In between all the fear-mongering you get the prepper ads. It's become a busy little industry.
posted by Artful Codger at 3:12 AM on December 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
my father-in-law always keeps several weeks worth of dry goods - like if you finish the ketchup, there will be 2-3 bottles in his basement, and you need to put it on the shopping list.
We teased him about this, said his place is where we're coming in the event of the zombie apocalypse.
But finally I asked him: why? so he told me: he'd lived through the 1970s strikes in the UK and remembered when the shops were empty and how they had run out of toilet paper, etc. It happened then, he figures it could happen again.
posted by jb at 4:18 AM on December 23, 2016 [12 favorites]
We teased him about this, said his place is where we're coming in the event of the zombie apocalypse.
But finally I asked him: why? so he told me: he'd lived through the 1970s strikes in the UK and remembered when the shops were empty and how they had run out of toilet paper, etc. It happened then, he figures it could happen again.
posted by jb at 4:18 AM on December 23, 2016 [12 favorites]
I grew up with a prepper mentality father who was too disorganized for actual preparation. It still shows up as a manifestation of my anxiety. It always takes the same course, at the point when I imagine having retreated to the country and 50 gallon drums of rice the next scene is always an imaginary family showing up at the door hungry. I don't want to live in a world where I would turn someone away and I realize if I can't prep for everyone it won't work.
A really nice book to read is A paradise built in hell, by Rebecc Solnit. It refutes the mad max assumption and gives repeated examples of people's natural inclination to cooperate and function in a jam. It really helped me feel okay.
I remember an episode from This American Life (I think) about a couple who took dozens of people stranded on the highway into their home during a blizzard, for days. One of the stranded vehicles was a tractor trailor of food so they were not hungry. At the end I cried when the woman said "I have been waiting all my life to do something like this"
posted by InkaLomax at 4:23 AM on December 23, 2016 [29 favorites]
A really nice book to read is A paradise built in hell, by Rebecc Solnit. It refutes the mad max assumption and gives repeated examples of people's natural inclination to cooperate and function in a jam. It really helped me feel okay.
I remember an episode from This American Life (I think) about a couple who took dozens of people stranded on the highway into their home during a blizzard, for days. One of the stranded vehicles was a tractor trailor of food so they were not hungry. At the end I cried when the woman said "I have been waiting all my life to do something like this"
posted by InkaLomax at 4:23 AM on December 23, 2016 [29 favorites]
The thing that always strikes me when I watch Doomsday Preppers is how physically out-of-shape many (not all, but many) of them are.
They are a militia, not preppers, but I was struck by the photographs in this article about a DIY version of the Border Patrol -- those were the first photos of in-shape militia members I have ever seen.
Personally, while I'm as willing to laugh at extreme preppers as anyone, right now I am clearly underprepared in the basic sense of having a few days of water. I'm not worried about food; you could easily eat for days if not weeks out of our cupboards, even without cooking, as long as you are ok with unpalatable options like unheated canned chicken soup. But living in an earthquake area, I am foolish for not having water available other than what is in the hot water tank and I need to rectify that.
Where the line sits between basic, sensible preparedness and full-on prepping isn't always clear to me, though. Racially-charged fantasies about societal collapse definitely cross that line for me, but a lot more sits in the grey area in between.
posted by Dip Flash at 4:42 AM on December 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
They are a militia, not preppers, but I was struck by the photographs in this article about a DIY version of the Border Patrol -- those were the first photos of in-shape militia members I have ever seen.
Personally, while I'm as willing to laugh at extreme preppers as anyone, right now I am clearly underprepared in the basic sense of having a few days of water. I'm not worried about food; you could easily eat for days if not weeks out of our cupboards, even without cooking, as long as you are ok with unpalatable options like unheated canned chicken soup. But living in an earthquake area, I am foolish for not having water available other than what is in the hot water tank and I need to rectify that.
Where the line sits between basic, sensible preparedness and full-on prepping isn't always clear to me, though. Racially-charged fantasies about societal collapse definitely cross that line for me, but a lot more sits in the grey area in between.
posted by Dip Flash at 4:42 AM on December 23, 2016 [6 favorites]
I think the line is the reasoning behind it rather than the outcome.
We don't get much in the way of natural disasters where I live (biggest risk is being snowed in for a couple days and you usually see that coming) but I do keep jugs of water filled. My street has had not one but two water main breaks in the past week so that's come in handy. I've lived in some places where greater self-sufficiency was required, and been through a hurricane or two (no power for two weeks, no water for over a month, that was awesome) and decided really quickly that being without electricity is a pain but doable while being without running water is just THE WORST. So now I horde water.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:18 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
We don't get much in the way of natural disasters where I live (biggest risk is being snowed in for a couple days and you usually see that coming) but I do keep jugs of water filled. My street has had not one but two water main breaks in the past week so that's come in handy. I've lived in some places where greater self-sufficiency was required, and been through a hurricane or two (no power for two weeks, no water for over a month, that was awesome) and decided really quickly that being without electricity is a pain but doable while being without running water is just THE WORST. So now I horde water.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:18 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
Guns is a clean line to not cross, but if you are theoretically wanting to get through two weeks of temporary societal breakdown, we're actually talking about a lot of stuff, and if you stack it all against a wall, the mass of it all is actually a little unsettling and weird, and that's the problem.
This varies by situation, but for me and my kids, living in a house rather than small apartment, it's not really. In that situation we wouldn't be trying to maintain our typical standard of living. So we have sleeping bags and a propane stove (which are also used for camping), lots of rice and legumes which we eat on a regular basis, a Berkey water filter that is used daily because the kids prefer the taste of filtered water, a solar oven which I do 90% of my summer cooking in to keep the house cooler and as a hobby, a woodstove insert for the fireplace the house came with, and flashlights. Water or a way to obtain it, food, and a way to keep from freezing (90% of the time, sleeping bags and appropriate clothing are enough) are all you really need.
I do consider gathering the basic skills and supplies needed to survive a week-long emergency to be a component of being a competent adult. We do live in a society, so learning how to do battlefield surgeries or maintaining a year of food is overkill unless that's your hobby, but if you're able bodied and not destitute, your survival should not depend on a bodega or Wal-Mart being open and accessible 24/7. Take responsibility for your own basic needs, and let relief workers focus their efforts on those who can't... not those who chose not to. Doing this as part of a community is great! You can buy a water filter, your extreme couponing neighbor can provide the Spaghettios, and you can all crash with the neighbor with the woodstove! But work this stuff out in advance.
posted by metasarah at 5:34 AM on December 23, 2016 [7 favorites]
This varies by situation, but for me and my kids, living in a house rather than small apartment, it's not really. In that situation we wouldn't be trying to maintain our typical standard of living. So we have sleeping bags and a propane stove (which are also used for camping), lots of rice and legumes which we eat on a regular basis, a Berkey water filter that is used daily because the kids prefer the taste of filtered water, a solar oven which I do 90% of my summer cooking in to keep the house cooler and as a hobby, a woodstove insert for the fireplace the house came with, and flashlights. Water or a way to obtain it, food, and a way to keep from freezing (90% of the time, sleeping bags and appropriate clothing are enough) are all you really need.
I do consider gathering the basic skills and supplies needed to survive a week-long emergency to be a component of being a competent adult. We do live in a society, so learning how to do battlefield surgeries or maintaining a year of food is overkill unless that's your hobby, but if you're able bodied and not destitute, your survival should not depend on a bodega or Wal-Mart being open and accessible 24/7. Take responsibility for your own basic needs, and let relief workers focus their efforts on those who can't... not those who chose not to. Doing this as part of a community is great! You can buy a water filter, your extreme couponing neighbor can provide the Spaghettios, and you can all crash with the neighbor with the woodstove! But work this stuff out in advance.
posted by metasarah at 5:34 AM on December 23, 2016 [7 favorites]
I saw someone selling these at a fair once; it was so out-of-place that I will never forget it: prepper books for kids
posted by jenjenc at 5:37 AM on December 23, 2016
posted by jenjenc at 5:37 AM on December 23, 2016
Also, I come from a Mormon family. My grandma had food storage for a year not only for herself, but for all of her family, hoping we would come to her house in case of the apocalypse. When she died, among the usual food storage stuff, she had 36 jars of mini dill pickles. Not the little jars, either, quart size. The weird thing was that I know she preferred the bread and butter kind.
posted by jenjenc at 5:45 AM on December 23, 2016 [12 favorites]
posted by jenjenc at 5:45 AM on December 23, 2016 [12 favorites]
If the world ends, I don't want to keep going without it. It's possible that could change, if someday I have a family or something to stick around for, but right now, I'm not out to survive a nuclear disaster. I take some minor comfort from knowing that I probably have enough sedatives in my apartment to prevent things being too drawn-out in the event of radiation or plague or starvation. My dad was a ham radio operator and talked about this sort of thing a lot when I was a kid, and it still gives me nightmares.
But I'm coming to realize that there's other kinds of preparedness, too. Like choosing an apartment that has one more bedroom than I need, because I might be able to help someone with housing. Like having enough food around for more than just me if someone needed a couple days' worth of food. Things people are likely to need not because the world is ending, but because the world is going on but the lives of marginalized people are made even more difficult. Like getting my spending back under budget so I have the savings not to worry about my own comfort decades from now but to be able to send cash to friends who need it, and to weather unemployment myself if my workplace becomes unsafe.
And physical fitness is increasingly being something I'm trying to pay attention to, because I can't do much of anything if I don't have my health.
I'm less concerned with a word without electricity or grocery stores than I am with a world without decency. The former, if it seems likely to go on indefinitely, I feel like I can check out without guilt. The latter, I have responsibilities.
posted by Sequence at 5:50 AM on December 23, 2016 [19 favorites]
But I'm coming to realize that there's other kinds of preparedness, too. Like choosing an apartment that has one more bedroom than I need, because I might be able to help someone with housing. Like having enough food around for more than just me if someone needed a couple days' worth of food. Things people are likely to need not because the world is ending, but because the world is going on but the lives of marginalized people are made even more difficult. Like getting my spending back under budget so I have the savings not to worry about my own comfort decades from now but to be able to send cash to friends who need it, and to weather unemployment myself if my workplace becomes unsafe.
And physical fitness is increasingly being something I'm trying to pay attention to, because I can't do much of anything if I don't have my health.
I'm less concerned with a word without electricity or grocery stores than I am with a world without decency. The former, if it seems likely to go on indefinitely, I feel like I can check out without guilt. The latter, I have responsibilities.
posted by Sequence at 5:50 AM on December 23, 2016 [19 favorites]
The "end of the world" type prepping is sociopathic because it's wishful. It's not about preventing the end of the world; it's about wishing for it.
What's the Venn diagram of preppers and people who support public healthcare and policies and organizations that would prevent an epidemic? My state, Texas, just defunded Planned Parenthood, which does a lot to control STD spread. Republican policies led to an epidemic in Indiana under Pence. Etc.
posted by tofu_crouton at 6:01 AM on December 23, 2016 [36 favorites]
What's the Venn diagram of preppers and people who support public healthcare and policies and organizations that would prevent an epidemic? My state, Texas, just defunded Planned Parenthood, which does a lot to control STD spread. Republican policies led to an epidemic in Indiana under Pence. Etc.
posted by tofu_crouton at 6:01 AM on December 23, 2016 [36 favorites]
I've been reading Reinventing Collapse and it gives a different take on the prepper mentality. The context is post-glasnost era when money was worthless, and the proverb "Don't have hundred rubles, rather have hundred friends" features heavily. But this also implies that you can make yourself useful in a hundred different ways.
Also, I'm jealous of Russia's dacha gardens. They likely prevented famine during the 90s economic collapse.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 6:05 AM on December 23, 2016 [10 favorites]
Also, I'm jealous of Russia's dacha gardens. They likely prevented famine during the 90s economic collapse.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 6:05 AM on December 23, 2016 [10 favorites]
This comment, from Dee's previous comment invitapriore linked up top struck home with me (along with her whole commentary):
Within the domain of those trapped in the city, civility greatly increased.
posted by yoga at 6:11 AM on December 23, 2016 [5 favorites]
Within the domain of those trapped in the city, civility greatly increased.
posted by yoga at 6:11 AM on December 23, 2016 [5 favorites]
Well, you'll all be sorry when Leonard Bernstein returns.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 6:36 AM on December 23, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 6:36 AM on December 23, 2016 [4 favorites]
We did the power cord across the street thing during Sandy because we had a generator, and the neighbors did not. The same neighbors have a snowblower and will swing by to help us excavate when it snows. Before I moved to the house I live in now, my (present) housemates would sometimes tell me to come over sleep over in the guest room if there was bad weather coming because they did not want me to be alone without heat or power in my little apartment. We have a lot of shelf-stable staples because we have the storage space for it, and one of my housemates takes great pleasure in finding such things when they are on super-sale and stocking up then.
Turns out we're the house to run to in a crisis.
posted by Karmakaze at 6:37 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
Turns out we're the house to run to in a crisis.
posted by Karmakaze at 6:37 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'm an urban prepper. My 'Everyday Carry' is a mixture of guilt, anxiety, resignation and dismay and frankly I barely have room for those.
posted by srboisvert at 7:08 AM on December 23, 2016 [23 favorites]
posted by srboisvert at 7:08 AM on December 23, 2016 [23 favorites]
srboisvert EDC: The weight of choices long past. Every. Day.
posted by mrdaneri at 7:39 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by mrdaneri at 7:39 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
EDC: Every Day Catastrophizing.
Can't say I'm much different, I pack a space pen, iPhone, and pocket knife.
posted by oceanjesse at 7:43 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
Can't say I'm much different, I pack a space pen, iPhone, and pocket knife.
posted by oceanjesse at 7:43 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
My prepping is living in a dense urban setting within walking distance of my family, knowing that in case of an emergency I won't be out in the sticks having to depend on my own limited skills and supplies. This has worked so far through earthquakes, blackouts, floods, etc.
posted by signal at 7:51 AM on December 23, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by signal at 7:51 AM on December 23, 2016 [8 favorites]
like if you finish the ketchup, there will be 2-3 bottles in his basement, and you need to put it on the shopping list. ... We teased him about this, said his place is where we're coming in the event of the zombie apocalypse.
To be fair, have you tried human brains without ketchup?
posted by Candleman at 8:47 AM on December 23, 2016 [5 favorites]
To be fair, have you tried human brains without ketchup?
posted by Candleman at 8:47 AM on December 23, 2016 [5 favorites]
and a nice Chianti?
posted by Artful Codger at 9:12 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Artful Codger at 9:12 AM on December 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
TEOTWAWKI is about 50-100 years away. When Miami is swallowed by the sea and they start debating which parts of New York they can afford to lose, when droughts cause millions more to try to move to cooler areas, shit will have hit the fan. But it's not in their lifetime. And it would require concerted social action to actually deal with this issue. So they dream about the EMP blast that will never come (except, maybe, from someone in their ranks) and chalk up the real danger to a large conspiracy of socialists.
posted by Hactar at 9:17 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Hactar at 9:17 AM on December 23, 2016 [2 favorites]
Post election, the prepper mailing lists had to bend over backwards to convince people they needed to stock up on thier survival seeds and ammo cause Trump won't stop the plans Obama put into place eight years ago!
Like most things prepperism is a scam to sell garbage.
posted by The Whelk at 9:32 AM on December 23, 2016 [15 favorites]
Like most things prepperism is a scam to sell garbage.
posted by The Whelk at 9:32 AM on December 23, 2016 [15 favorites]
When I was a kid, the church we went to was also a fallout shelter (with the Civil Defense signs posted outside) and had two huge locked rooms downstairs that were full of dried food, medicine and water. Periodically someone came around and refreshed it all. It was more of a feel-good thing than anything else since we lived in a first-tier target and would have received a direct hit. Nobody thought any of this was weird. At that time "prepping" was regarded as a civic necessity that the government was directly involved in.
posted by lagomorphius at 10:06 AM on December 23, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by lagomorphius at 10:06 AM on December 23, 2016 [4 favorites]
When she died, among the usual food storage stuff, she had 36 jars of mini dill pickles. Not the little jars, either, quart size. The weird thing was that I know she preferred the bread and butter kind.
Speaking as a pickle fan, your grandma was a saint.
The item to stock up on in anticipation of Trump's inauguration: at least one box of OTC Plan B. I am not kidding. OTC availability of this drug is a creature of the FDA, and we can expect Republicans to go after it hard. You may not need it, but you may very well know a woman who does. The shelf life is about three years.
posted by praemunire at 10:08 AM on December 23, 2016 [24 favorites]
Speaking as a pickle fan, your grandma was a saint.
The item to stock up on in anticipation of Trump's inauguration: at least one box of OTC Plan B. I am not kidding. OTC availability of this drug is a creature of the FDA, and we can expect Republicans to go after it hard. You may not need it, but you may very well know a woman who does. The shelf life is about three years.
posted by praemunire at 10:08 AM on December 23, 2016 [24 favorites]
Years ago, my husband put together a bug out bag mostly for fun. He can handle his shit and there were MREs in there, first aid paraphernalia, water purifier, a hunting knife and so on. He thought it was hilarious that it lived in our spare closet just in case a hasty exit was needed.
He brought it up again last month and I asked him just how many diapers, formula cans, and bags of cat food it contained.
Turns out, having kids and pets and living things you care about make idle fantasies about survival sour real fucking quick. He'd never even thought of that, not really. Meanwhile, I am all out of patience for the state of the world so my default response is "use me as zombie bait, I'm out".
posted by lydhre at 12:20 PM on December 23, 2016 [14 favorites]
He brought it up again last month and I asked him just how many diapers, formula cans, and bags of cat food it contained.
Turns out, having kids and pets and living things you care about make idle fantasies about survival sour real fucking quick. He'd never even thought of that, not really. Meanwhile, I am all out of patience for the state of the world so my default response is "use me as zombie bait, I'm out".
posted by lydhre at 12:20 PM on December 23, 2016 [14 favorites]
I have a bug-out-bag in my Family Schlepper. It has:
- a complete change of clothes for the kid
- a thick pair of wool socks in mommy and daddy sizes
- one kingsize microfleece blanket, vacuum packed for smallness.
- Three each cheap and big beach towels and space-blankets
- A six-pack of bottled water, broken up into individual bottles for easy stowage.
- Two boxes worth of granola bars (the box itself is too bulky, take 'em out and salt 'em around the corners and pockets.)
- A 5000mah USB charger, swapped out once per month with the fully-charged one I keep in my laptop bag.
- A generic butane micro-torch.
- A cheap and big French butane lighter known for its capacity and reliability, in safety orange. (Yes, it's a Djeep.)
- An actual Leatherman multi-tool, obtained on the cheap a decade ago. One of the ones where you can open the knife from the outside and it has scissors. Wait, it may be a Gerber multi-tool, where you flick out the pliers, anyway, one of those, from a trusted and well reviewed brand, doused liberally with mineral oil before tucked into its case and forgotten in the bag.
- A soft-sided first-aid kit with a legit selection of supplies, replaced once every half-decade.
- A week's worth of our various prescriptions, replaced once every other year.
- A small waterproof notepad, and a space-pen.
- A roll of duct-tape.
- 2x 16x20' disposable dropcloths of thick, clear plastic.
- 100' of nylon parachute cord.
- A little roll of twine.
- Thick coloring/activity book and crayons.
- LED Mini MagLite
- AAA Batteries for LED Mini MagLite
- Hand-cranked LED flashlight/AM-FM/Weather-radio from a reputable manufacturer who makes stuff to last and operate in awful conditions (Sangean)
- Roll of paper towels
- Toll of TP
- Pack of wet wipes
I do not fear the Apocalypse or civil war, but I have been stranded on unplowed side-roads in a number of blizzards and stuck-in-the-same-place-for-hours traffic on major highways and broken down in someplace weird and remote by an otherwise reliable car situations, and this shit is the difference between tolerating in comfort a bad situation and suffering for a long while while society gets its shit together.
It all fits easily in a small gym bag.
Society will get its shit together. In the meantime, you have radio and warm socks and coloring books.
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:01 PM on December 23, 2016 [25 favorites]
- a complete change of clothes for the kid
- a thick pair of wool socks in mommy and daddy sizes
- one kingsize microfleece blanket, vacuum packed for smallness.
- Three each cheap and big beach towels and space-blankets
- A six-pack of bottled water, broken up into individual bottles for easy stowage.
- Two boxes worth of granola bars (the box itself is too bulky, take 'em out and salt 'em around the corners and pockets.)
- A 5000mah USB charger, swapped out once per month with the fully-charged one I keep in my laptop bag.
- A generic butane micro-torch.
- A cheap and big French butane lighter known for its capacity and reliability, in safety orange. (Yes, it's a Djeep.)
- An actual Leatherman multi-tool, obtained on the cheap a decade ago. One of the ones where you can open the knife from the outside and it has scissors. Wait, it may be a Gerber multi-tool, where you flick out the pliers, anyway, one of those, from a trusted and well reviewed brand, doused liberally with mineral oil before tucked into its case and forgotten in the bag.
- A soft-sided first-aid kit with a legit selection of supplies, replaced once every half-decade.
- A week's worth of our various prescriptions, replaced once every other year.
- A small waterproof notepad, and a space-pen.
- A roll of duct-tape.
- 2x 16x20' disposable dropcloths of thick, clear plastic.
- 100' of nylon parachute cord.
- A little roll of twine.
- Thick coloring/activity book and crayons.
- LED Mini MagLite
- AAA Batteries for LED Mini MagLite
- Hand-cranked LED flashlight/AM-FM/Weather-radio from a reputable manufacturer who makes stuff to last and operate in awful conditions (Sangean)
- Roll of paper towels
- Toll of TP
- Pack of wet wipes
I do not fear the Apocalypse or civil war, but I have been stranded on unplowed side-roads in a number of blizzards and stuck-in-the-same-place-for-hours traffic on major highways and broken down in someplace weird and remote by an otherwise reliable car situations, and this shit is the difference between tolerating in comfort a bad situation and suffering for a long while while society gets its shit together.
It all fits easily in a small gym bag.
Society will get its shit together. In the meantime, you have radio and warm socks and coloring books.
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:01 PM on December 23, 2016 [25 favorites]
I have a bug out bag for my cat! I keep a pet first aid kit, a small bag of his dry food, a old rabies vaccination certificate (the current one being in my file; and old one has his chip # and vet phone and the info of the county his registration is in and so on), a travel bowl, and three travel litter boxes all together stored by the cat carrier. The food expires but we pretty reliably replace it every winter when we get the flu and run low on food because we can't leave the house for a week. So we open the emergency food and get a new one.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:41 PM on December 23, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:41 PM on December 23, 2016 [5 favorites]
So I just ordered some mosquito bed nets and water filters. I will probably buy some magnesium fire starters too. (I'm not buying anything that requires fuel. If I can get the fuel, I can get the fire lighter.) I might even buy some seeds for garden crops and stuff them in a mason jar in my freezer, where I'm told by prepper commentors on the Amazon seed bank boxes that they could last for 10 years.
Because why not? This stuff is pretty cheap, and if I don't ever need it, what will I have lost? But if I do need it, and don't have it, I'll be wishing desperately that I had bought it when it was cheap and easy to get. And filtered water and seeds and sparks for a fire are somewhat renewable resources which can be shared with my community.
I am definitely of the personality type that could get tempted into serious prepping.
But.
I am self aware enough to recognize that this behavior as a symptom of anxiety. (The comments about peppers often being overweight are interesting to me. I have gained weight recently, and I think that is also a symptom of anxiety. Weight gain is like "prepping" on a subconscious, metabolic level.)
This kind of response to anxiety seems to me to be sort of instinctive, like squirrels gathering nuts for winter. It's probably relatviely normal and healthy to respond to anxiety by caching resources. I feel like this is likely an instinctive behavior for humans (like pregnant women really do seem to have a "nesting" instinct -- at least I felt it strongly when I was pregnant.) What's not normal and healthy is having this much anxiety all the time.
I think humans are just terrible at recognizing their own instinctive behaviors because we are so good at rationalizing. We think we have conscious, logical reasons for everything we do. But we are really justifying after the fact decisions that we make based on hormones and genes and childhood conditioning and whatever, a lot of the time. I think prepping is like that. People don't really do it because of their stated reasons, whatever those are. They come up with reasons to explain to themselves why they are doing it. And that includes me.
So it's like I have this instinct to "prep" because Trump's election has given me a lot of anxiety. What are the least harmful ways to channel that instinct?
Spending tens of thousands of dollars on a bunker would be harmful to my family. Buying a gun is dangerous in households with kids (and anxious people) so potentially very harmful to my family. Buying seeds and water filters and mosquito nets? Okay, I'll permit myself that. I'll indulge my anxiety to that extent. Because the cost is low (for me) the harm is minimal. And I can rationalize it pretty easily...
(In case you're wondering what scenario I'm "prepping" for, it's basically "US becomes a third world country." I can easily imagine that happening without zombies or EMPs or whatever. Economic collapse, an epidemic, war, and/or climate change could and probably eventually will do it. And then like people in other third world countries I'd presumably benefit greatly from bed nets and water filters. But I'm not quite delusional enough to think I'll be fine. No one will be fine, in these scenarios, whether they have water filters or not. And in my more rational moments I know these things are probably decades off it they were to happen at all, and there'd be plenty of signs they were, time to prepare... but then I think what if Trump getting elected IS a sign, and what if the more blatant signs yet to come make everyone start prepping and then there are shortages of water filters? And I wonder how far in advance the people of Aleppo could forsee what has happened to them... I think about Aleppo a lot, when I am feeling anxious. Anyway, this is the way my mind works right now, and it sucks.)
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:42 AM on December 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
Because why not? This stuff is pretty cheap, and if I don't ever need it, what will I have lost? But if I do need it, and don't have it, I'll be wishing desperately that I had bought it when it was cheap and easy to get. And filtered water and seeds and sparks for a fire are somewhat renewable resources which can be shared with my community.
I am definitely of the personality type that could get tempted into serious prepping.
But.
I am self aware enough to recognize that this behavior as a symptom of anxiety. (The comments about peppers often being overweight are interesting to me. I have gained weight recently, and I think that is also a symptom of anxiety. Weight gain is like "prepping" on a subconscious, metabolic level.)
This kind of response to anxiety seems to me to be sort of instinctive, like squirrels gathering nuts for winter. It's probably relatviely normal and healthy to respond to anxiety by caching resources. I feel like this is likely an instinctive behavior for humans (like pregnant women really do seem to have a "nesting" instinct -- at least I felt it strongly when I was pregnant.) What's not normal and healthy is having this much anxiety all the time.
I think humans are just terrible at recognizing their own instinctive behaviors because we are so good at rationalizing. We think we have conscious, logical reasons for everything we do. But we are really justifying after the fact decisions that we make based on hormones and genes and childhood conditioning and whatever, a lot of the time. I think prepping is like that. People don't really do it because of their stated reasons, whatever those are. They come up with reasons to explain to themselves why they are doing it. And that includes me.
So it's like I have this instinct to "prep" because Trump's election has given me a lot of anxiety. What are the least harmful ways to channel that instinct?
Spending tens of thousands of dollars on a bunker would be harmful to my family. Buying a gun is dangerous in households with kids (and anxious people) so potentially very harmful to my family. Buying seeds and water filters and mosquito nets? Okay, I'll permit myself that. I'll indulge my anxiety to that extent. Because the cost is low (for me) the harm is minimal. And I can rationalize it pretty easily...
(In case you're wondering what scenario I'm "prepping" for, it's basically "US becomes a third world country." I can easily imagine that happening without zombies or EMPs or whatever. Economic collapse, an epidemic, war, and/or climate change could and probably eventually will do it. And then like people in other third world countries I'd presumably benefit greatly from bed nets and water filters. But I'm not quite delusional enough to think I'll be fine. No one will be fine, in these scenarios, whether they have water filters or not. And in my more rational moments I know these things are probably decades off it they were to happen at all, and there'd be plenty of signs they were, time to prepare... but then I think what if Trump getting elected IS a sign, and what if the more blatant signs yet to come make everyone start prepping and then there are shortages of water filters? And I wonder how far in advance the people of Aleppo could forsee what has happened to them... I think about Aleppo a lot, when I am feeling anxious. Anyway, this is the way my mind works right now, and it sucks.)
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:42 AM on December 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
And then like people in other third world countries I'd presumably benefit greatly from bed nets and water filters.
There's no great harm in stockpiling some bed nets, but if your house has window screens now, it still will during a societal decline. And if it doesn't have window screens, those would be a better investment than stockpiling nets and provide immediate benefit.
But like you say, prepping is way more about feelings than it is actual risks. I just bought a new gun (though I also sold an old one, so at least the total isn't changing) which makes me feel better but, being realistic, in a practical sense it would give me much more use as a paper weight or a door stop.
posted by Dip Flash at 7:43 AM on December 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
There's no great harm in stockpiling some bed nets, but if your house has window screens now, it still will during a societal decline. And if it doesn't have window screens, those would be a better investment than stockpiling nets and provide immediate benefit.
But like you say, prepping is way more about feelings than it is actual risks. I just bought a new gun (though I also sold an old one, so at least the total isn't changing) which makes me feel better but, being realistic, in a practical sense it would give me much more use as a paper weight or a door stop.
posted by Dip Flash at 7:43 AM on December 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
I might even buy some seeds for garden crops and stuff them in a mason jar in my freezer, where I'm told by prepper commentors on the Amazon seed bank boxes that they could last for 10 years.
If the power stays on for 10 years, you won't need those seeds.
posted by dersins at 8:11 AM on December 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
If the power stays on for 10 years, you won't need those seeds.
posted by dersins at 8:11 AM on December 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
Yeah, I should probably replace the screens and buy some screen patches. But I feel like mosquitoes are just going to be more and more of a (potentially deadly) problem in my area as climate change proceeds, and I can either double up the protection or share with neighbors... Assuming I stay in possession of my house -- though who's to say we don't lose it in an economic collapse? I'm not assuming I'll keep my job and keep making mortgage payments.
And the point where the power goes out for long periods is probably the point where I'd plant the seeds...
(Though again, if I were a real prepper I'd plant a garden now and maintain it indefinitely. An already working garden and a lot of gardening experience are a lot more useful than a bunch of frozen seeds. But that would cost a lot more time and resources in the present than sticking some seeds in the freezer. So it doesn't pass my "low cost, no harm" test at the moment. Maybe if I had some other reason for starting a garden or felt like I had time to spare to maintain it.)
posted by OnceUponATime at 8:17 AM on December 24, 2016
And the point where the power goes out for long periods is probably the point where I'd plant the seeds...
(Though again, if I were a real prepper I'd plant a garden now and maintain it indefinitely. An already working garden and a lot of gardening experience are a lot more useful than a bunch of frozen seeds. But that would cost a lot more time and resources in the present than sticking some seeds in the freezer. So it doesn't pass my "low cost, no harm" test at the moment. Maybe if I had some other reason for starting a garden or felt like I had time to spare to maintain it.)
posted by OnceUponATime at 8:17 AM on December 24, 2016
I'm going to plant a veggie garden this year, on principle that I need a few years of failing at it to get any good and I should do that while there's no emergency. Growing food is tricky even if you have good soil/water/starter plants or seeds.
posted by emjaybee at 9:21 AM on December 24, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by emjaybee at 9:21 AM on December 24, 2016 [8 favorites]
I might even buy some seeds for garden crops and stuff them in a mason jar in my freezer, where I'm told by prepper commentors on the Amazon seed bank boxes that they could last for 10 years.
From author and experienced gardener Ursula Vernon:
From author and experienced gardener Ursula Vernon:
So there was a place awhile ago that was selling like–patriotism seed packs. They were literally plastic tubes full of seeds that you could store for when civilization collapses, and there was an American flag on them, and people were buying these and burying them for when Obama came to take their guns AND THEIR SEEDS and I burned a trail of fiery rage like a particularly annoyed comet across the blogosphere because OH MY GOD you cannot just sell people across North America one Genuine American Seed Tube that will grow in every climate and these bloody IDIOTS were thinking that what were probably leftovers from the Burpee display at Home Deopt were going to be all they needed to survive in the coming Obamapocalypse and what the hell is wrong with you people, do you even hardiness zone, should you be growing short or long day onions, I don’t know AND NEITHER DO THE PEOPLE SELLING YOU SEED TUBES and what’s your dirt like can you even GROW carrots there or should you have been amending the soil and building raised beds for the last ten years to get your fertility up and hey, when you can’t get phosphorus because the goddamn southeastern US never got plowed under by a glacier and so was crap to begin with and then somebody stripped the dirt for tobacco and cotton for twenty years, what are you going to do then? Point a gun at the dirt for being phosphorus deficient? And how about that lack of iron? Hey, maybe put your Confederate flag over it, I’m sure THAT will convince your poor miserable chlorosis-riddled plants to straighten up and fly right! If civilization collapses, by god, you will be begging to trade ammo for composted cow manure and landrace beans that can tolerate powdery mildew and you’ll be out there picking pickleworms off your squash by hand and hey, do you even known how to save squash seeds so you don’t get an inedible mess on the second generation? WHERE IS YOUR SEED TUBE NOW, PATRIOTS?!posted by Lexica at 3:27 PM on December 24, 2016 [30 favorites]
…ahem.
It is unwise.
Yeah, but that's comparing the utility of having a seed tube to the utility of having a working garden and experience tending it. But what's the utility of having a seed tube (and a book on gardening in your climate, ideally) compared to the utility having neither a seed tube nor a working garden?
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:58 PM on December 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:58 PM on December 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
About the same, except you'll have a little less cash. Your 'seed tube' is not going to actually turn into a garden, due to all the factors Vernon and others listed.
If you want to preserve seeds, set up a garden. Plant heritage seeds obtained from local growers, so that they will be workable in your local environment and fertile to allow you to save for the next year. Otherwise, it's just playing pretend.
posted by tavella at 7:43 PM on December 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
If you want to preserve seeds, set up a garden. Plant heritage seeds obtained from local growers, so that they will be workable in your local environment and fertile to allow you to save for the next year. Otherwise, it's just playing pretend.
posted by tavella at 7:43 PM on December 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
Eyebrows hit the nail on the head.
Their risk assessment is somewhere between terrible and fanciful,
These are people willing to gamble on going without health insurance to have additional funds to invest in prepping.
posted by notreally at 8:16 PM on December 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
Their risk assessment is somewhere between terrible and fanciful,
These are people willing to gamble on going without health insurance to have additional funds to invest in prepping.
posted by notreally at 8:16 PM on December 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
But what's the utility of having a seed tube (and a book on gardening in your climate, ideally) compared to the utility having neither a seed tube nor a working garden?
Unless you're doing it as a hobby, basically zero. Ursula has written elsewhere about how difficult gardening is, and how long it takes to come to understand one's local conditions, and how many total crop failures can be expected as a matter of course, and similar things. Most gardeners should expect to spend about ten years learning the basics of how things work before they start to feel confident that what they plant will (barring hailstorms, locusts, drought, or other uncontrollable factors) grow and yield the way they expect it to.
posted by Lexica at 8:17 PM on December 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
Unless you're doing it as a hobby, basically zero. Ursula has written elsewhere about how difficult gardening is, and how long it takes to come to understand one's local conditions, and how many total crop failures can be expected as a matter of course, and similar things. Most gardeners should expect to spend about ten years learning the basics of how things work before they start to feel confident that what they plant will (barring hailstorms, locusts, drought, or other uncontrollable factors) grow and yield the way they expect it to.
posted by Lexica at 8:17 PM on December 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
I can speak from running a novice, city-slicker farm project of my own, starting from no experience: natural random weather fluctuations including the never-static number of frost-free days, heat waves, heavy rains, etc. will destroy or lessen your yields no matter the amount of work or apparent preparedness. I've been doing this for three years now, and every summer, Fortune decided to allow significant vacillations that pretty much ruin my crops.
posted by constantinescharity at 7:06 AM on December 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by constantinescharity at 7:06 AM on December 25, 2016 [6 favorites]
Unless you're doing it as a hobby, basically zero.
An even then... subsistence farming is very different than gardening.
Most people who garden don't focus on staple crops; they grow tomatoes and cucumbers, not wheat. Many do grow corn, but not in big quantities and they have very little idea about how to preserve and use that corn over the year as a fundamental part of their diet.
Like, if you don't have a granary that you regularly fill, there is a huge amount of knowledge and experience you just aren't getting as a hobby gardener.
And it's worth pointing out that subsistence farmers alive now generally live in communities. They're not isolated, fuck-you-I've-got-mine, independent-minded patriots. Even for the most experienced, it's precarious, and there are times you rely on others. Even when things are going well, you often need help bringing in the harvest before it spoils.
posted by Kutsuwamushi at 1:00 AM on December 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
An even then... subsistence farming is very different than gardening.
Most people who garden don't focus on staple crops; they grow tomatoes and cucumbers, not wheat. Many do grow corn, but not in big quantities and they have very little idea about how to preserve and use that corn over the year as a fundamental part of their diet.
Like, if you don't have a granary that you regularly fill, there is a huge amount of knowledge and experience you just aren't getting as a hobby gardener.
And it's worth pointing out that subsistence farmers alive now generally live in communities. They're not isolated, fuck-you-I've-got-mine, independent-minded patriots. Even for the most experienced, it's precarious, and there are times you rely on others. Even when things are going well, you often need help bringing in the harvest before it spoils.
posted by Kutsuwamushi at 1:00 AM on December 26, 2016 [7 favorites]
"And it's worth pointing out that subsistence farmers alive now generally live in communities. They're not isolated, fuck-you-I've-got-mine, independent-minded patriots. "
There are a number of "homesteaders" in my general area, who attempt to live entirely independently as a family unit. They come from an Anabaptist religious group related to the Amish, but more urban and modern. So mostly they seem to highly romanticize their farming co-religionists (having grown up as urbanized Plain People), have read a LOT of Little House, and have turned a sort of "independent Christian farm family on the American ex-frontier but still living like it's 1800" into both a religious and cultural imperative, necessary to be both good Christians and good Americans. (They're distinct from preppers because they're not expecting the end of the world and as Plain People are pacifists who do not own guns (a few own simple ones, for vermin, but many do not)).
Anyway they turn up in the news every now and then, always for a child dying tragically by falling in a duck pond or having a farm equipment accident or similar old timey farm tragedies. Homesteading, even when 911 is nearby, sucks quite a bit. Prepping makes similar safety and health trade-offs, and preppers, even if they could subsistence farm, and totally unprepared for a world with no OSHA, but don't know enough to know it. If you read prepper fiction (oh God I have problems) there's always an object lesson who dies of some disease, but a stunning lack of simple fatal accidents. Always a smoothly running community of competent people who never make mistakes with sharp tools. (But again, it's LARPing, it may be an error to treat it as if it might be rooted enough in reality to argue against it or point out its flaws; the proper response might be to point out these are people who are no different than a guy who pretends to live full time in Westeros and walks around with a sword issuing challenges over his wounded honor. We don't pretend that guy has a worldview that needs refuting. It's an obvious fantasy.)
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 1:27 AM on December 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
There are a number of "homesteaders" in my general area, who attempt to live entirely independently as a family unit. They come from an Anabaptist religious group related to the Amish, but more urban and modern. So mostly they seem to highly romanticize their farming co-religionists (having grown up as urbanized Plain People), have read a LOT of Little House, and have turned a sort of "independent Christian farm family on the American ex-frontier but still living like it's 1800" into both a religious and cultural imperative, necessary to be both good Christians and good Americans. (They're distinct from preppers because they're not expecting the end of the world and as Plain People are pacifists who do not own guns (a few own simple ones, for vermin, but many do not)).
Anyway they turn up in the news every now and then, always for a child dying tragically by falling in a duck pond or having a farm equipment accident or similar old timey farm tragedies. Homesteading, even when 911 is nearby, sucks quite a bit. Prepping makes similar safety and health trade-offs, and preppers, even if they could subsistence farm, and totally unprepared for a world with no OSHA, but don't know enough to know it. If you read prepper fiction (oh God I have problems) there's always an object lesson who dies of some disease, but a stunning lack of simple fatal accidents. Always a smoothly running community of competent people who never make mistakes with sharp tools. (But again, it's LARPing, it may be an error to treat it as if it might be rooted enough in reality to argue against it or point out its flaws; the proper response might be to point out these are people who are no different than a guy who pretends to live full time in Westeros and walks around with a sword issuing challenges over his wounded honor. We don't pretend that guy has a worldview that needs refuting. It's an obvious fantasy.)
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 1:27 AM on December 26, 2016 [6 favorites]
I've talked up Book of Ages by Jill Lepore on Metafilter a couple of times. It's a biography of Ben Franklin's sister, Jane. But maybe the most interesting thing about Jane is how ordinary her life was, for that time and place. Too ordinary for anyone to have bothered making any record of, under normal circumstances. It's just because she was related to Ben that she learned to write, because she was related to him that her letters have been preserved, and we get a rare window into what life was like for a woman who was not super privileged in the late 18th century.
Spoilers -- she was married at 15. She had twelve kids. "One son, Benjamin, disappeared during the Battle of Trenton. Two of her sons struggled with mental illness. [She] made efforts to keep her children out of debtors' prison, the almshouse, and asylums. Several of them succumbed to an illness now believed to be tuberculosis."
Only one of her twelve children out lived her, and she didn't even know he was still alive. About 43% of children died before age 5 in in 1800. Jane was "lucky" that most of hers made it to young adulthood before dying. (One of Jane and Ben's other siblings -- their father had 17 kids -- drowned in the bath at the age of 3.)
I mean... This is the reality that the "Little House" books don't show you. And Jane wasn't living in a "post apocalyptic" world. She was living in the middle of The Enlightment! She lived in Boston, which was a functional and prosperous city for its time! And she was a soap maker, married to a tradesman and related to a successful and eventually very wealthy printer. She wasn't the poorest of the poor. (And she wasn't a slave. Jill Lepore also wrote New York Burning which gives a window into slave life in 1741 in Manhattan.)
So yeah, gardening is hard; farming is even harder. I can easily believe it takes 10 years to know what you're doing, and that even after you know what you're doing there will be years (just somewhat less frequent) when you basically have no crop. My grandpa was a farmer and my uncle still is. This is true even with generations of family experience and all our modern technology -- some years you just don't have a crop. I still think I would rather have some seeds in the freezer than not have them if the gas stations stop selling gas and the power goes out, and for me the cost of buying them is pretty trivial, so why not? But my expectations are pretty damn low.
Like I said, I don't think any of us are going to be fine in these scenarios. Not only will the crops most likely fail due to my lack of experience (or due to uncooperative weather or pests or fungal infections or...) but even if we can keep ourselves fed, we'll die of minor wounds that get infected... Women and babies will die in childbirth (here's a good "prepper" measure for fertile women -- get your IUD now. The copper kind has been tested to last at least 10 years, and probably lasts longer than that.) We'll die of heat stroke trying to work that garden/farm, or exposure when winter comes and we can't keep the fire lit. We'll die of tuberculosis, dyptheria, cholera, and all those other "Oregon Trail" diseases. We'll die of violence which arises over stupid shit. And nothing we or the "preppers" can do will make them safe from all of this. People in pre-industrial times died and died and died and died... and all their expertise and organizing and supplies, their whole civilization set up to operate without electricity or gasoline couldn't save their families. Their birth rate was much higher than ours. The reason the population was so much smaller back then was because the death rate was astronomical.
And what's more, a lot of the world isn't that much different now. There are plenty of places without access to gasoline and reliable electricity and modern medicine, and people die when the crops fail. And they die of preventable diseases and treatable infections. And they die in childbirth. No need to fantasize about the past. You can go live in poor countries right now, away from the major cities, and live (and die) much the way your ancestors did.
I actually feel like it's kind of inevitable that America and other western nations will slide at least partly back into that state, eventually. Modern civilization seems so complicated and fragile, and depends too much on unsustainable burning of fossil fuels. And too many people don't realize how complicated and fragile it is, and romanticize the past, and are actively trying to undermine efforts to make this economically, politically, and environmentally sustainable (We have anti-vaxxers, for God's sake!). While others are (rightfully) jealous of the advantages we hoard to ourselves, and also want to level the playing field... The wheel of fortune keeps turning. But when we (America and the "West") go down I believe we'll bring a lot the machinery of civilization down with us, as Rome did when it fell. It seems to me like we might be due for a new Dark Ages. History doesn't end. And our current western way of life isn't the inevitable end of human development. It may turn out to be just an anomaly. A temporary change in our circumstances (and not even all of us) which followed the discovery of how to extract and exploit fossil fuels, with a reset to "normal" human conditions once that extraction and exploitation reach their limits.
I don't know when it will happen. I hope it won't be in my lifetime or my kids'. But it might be. And I'll be screwed if it happens. We all will. There's nothing I can really do to change that. But I think of that version of myself, scrambling to survive in spite of the odds (and probably not succeeding) and I think, "What will that version of me wish that this version of me had done, when life was so easy, when Amazon just delivered stuff to your door?" What will I be desperate for in that world which is trivial for me right now? It kind of haunts me. Thinking about how easy we have it now, compared to all of human history and much of the rest of the world. How easy everything is. Clean water comes out of the tap. Waste vanishes down the plumbing. Food comes out of the refrigerator and gets heated in the microwave. Antibiotics from the drug store down the street. It's too good to be true. It can't last. I'm buying some frickin' pumpkin seeds.
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:36 AM on December 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
Spoilers -- she was married at 15. She had twelve kids. "One son, Benjamin, disappeared during the Battle of Trenton. Two of her sons struggled with mental illness. [She] made efforts to keep her children out of debtors' prison, the almshouse, and asylums. Several of them succumbed to an illness now believed to be tuberculosis."
Only one of her twelve children out lived her, and she didn't even know he was still alive. About 43% of children died before age 5 in in 1800. Jane was "lucky" that most of hers made it to young adulthood before dying. (One of Jane and Ben's other siblings -- their father had 17 kids -- drowned in the bath at the age of 3.)
I mean... This is the reality that the "Little House" books don't show you. And Jane wasn't living in a "post apocalyptic" world. She was living in the middle of The Enlightment! She lived in Boston, which was a functional and prosperous city for its time! And she was a soap maker, married to a tradesman and related to a successful and eventually very wealthy printer. She wasn't the poorest of the poor. (And she wasn't a slave. Jill Lepore also wrote New York Burning which gives a window into slave life in 1741 in Manhattan.)
So yeah, gardening is hard; farming is even harder. I can easily believe it takes 10 years to know what you're doing, and that even after you know what you're doing there will be years (just somewhat less frequent) when you basically have no crop. My grandpa was a farmer and my uncle still is. This is true even with generations of family experience and all our modern technology -- some years you just don't have a crop. I still think I would rather have some seeds in the freezer than not have them if the gas stations stop selling gas and the power goes out, and for me the cost of buying them is pretty trivial, so why not? But my expectations are pretty damn low.
Like I said, I don't think any of us are going to be fine in these scenarios. Not only will the crops most likely fail due to my lack of experience (or due to uncooperative weather or pests or fungal infections or...) but even if we can keep ourselves fed, we'll die of minor wounds that get infected... Women and babies will die in childbirth (here's a good "prepper" measure for fertile women -- get your IUD now. The copper kind has been tested to last at least 10 years, and probably lasts longer than that.) We'll die of heat stroke trying to work that garden/farm, or exposure when winter comes and we can't keep the fire lit. We'll die of tuberculosis, dyptheria, cholera, and all those other "Oregon Trail" diseases. We'll die of violence which arises over stupid shit. And nothing we or the "preppers" can do will make them safe from all of this. People in pre-industrial times died and died and died and died... and all their expertise and organizing and supplies, their whole civilization set up to operate without electricity or gasoline couldn't save their families. Their birth rate was much higher than ours. The reason the population was so much smaller back then was because the death rate was astronomical.
And what's more, a lot of the world isn't that much different now. There are plenty of places without access to gasoline and reliable electricity and modern medicine, and people die when the crops fail. And they die of preventable diseases and treatable infections. And they die in childbirth. No need to fantasize about the past. You can go live in poor countries right now, away from the major cities, and live (and die) much the way your ancestors did.
I actually feel like it's kind of inevitable that America and other western nations will slide at least partly back into that state, eventually. Modern civilization seems so complicated and fragile, and depends too much on unsustainable burning of fossil fuels. And too many people don't realize how complicated and fragile it is, and romanticize the past, and are actively trying to undermine efforts to make this economically, politically, and environmentally sustainable (We have anti-vaxxers, for God's sake!). While others are (rightfully) jealous of the advantages we hoard to ourselves, and also want to level the playing field... The wheel of fortune keeps turning. But when we (America and the "West") go down I believe we'll bring a lot the machinery of civilization down with us, as Rome did when it fell. It seems to me like we might be due for a new Dark Ages. History doesn't end. And our current western way of life isn't the inevitable end of human development. It may turn out to be just an anomaly. A temporary change in our circumstances (and not even all of us) which followed the discovery of how to extract and exploit fossil fuels, with a reset to "normal" human conditions once that extraction and exploitation reach their limits.
I don't know when it will happen. I hope it won't be in my lifetime or my kids'. But it might be. And I'll be screwed if it happens. We all will. There's nothing I can really do to change that. But I think of that version of myself, scrambling to survive in spite of the odds (and probably not succeeding) and I think, "What will that version of me wish that this version of me had done, when life was so easy, when Amazon just delivered stuff to your door?" What will I be desperate for in that world which is trivial for me right now? It kind of haunts me. Thinking about how easy we have it now, compared to all of human history and much of the rest of the world. How easy everything is. Clean water comes out of the tap. Waste vanishes down the plumbing. Food comes out of the refrigerator and gets heated in the microwave. Antibiotics from the drug store down the street. It's too good to be true. It can't last. I'm buying some frickin' pumpkin seeds.
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:36 AM on December 26, 2016 [8 favorites]
You can go live in poor countries right now, away from the major cities, and live (and die) much the way your ancestors did.
I forgot to point out that ironically this is where peoole really do have subsistence farming skills and heritage seeds and an infrastructure that doesn't depend on gasoline, so if any preppers are serious about surving some kind of apocalypse, they maybe really should go live in these places. Not just for the chance it would give them to really enact their survivalist fantasies (and experience a huge reality check) but because places that benefit least from modern conveniences are the places which are set up to survive best without them. So yeah, if I were a serious prepper, I would move to a place where whole communities are still doing subsistence farming, and can continue doing so indefinitely.
posted by OnceUponATime at 7:23 AM on December 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
I forgot to point out that ironically this is where peoole really do have subsistence farming skills and heritage seeds and an infrastructure that doesn't depend on gasoline, so if any preppers are serious about surving some kind of apocalypse, they maybe really should go live in these places. Not just for the chance it would give them to really enact their survivalist fantasies (and experience a huge reality check) but because places that benefit least from modern conveniences are the places which are set up to survive best without them. So yeah, if I were a serious prepper, I would move to a place where whole communities are still doing subsistence farming, and can continue doing so indefinitely.
posted by OnceUponATime at 7:23 AM on December 26, 2016 [3 favorites]
But finally I asked him: why? so he told me: he'd lived through the 1970s strikes in the UK and remembered when the shops were empty and how they had run out of toilet paper, etc. It happened then, he figures it could happen again.
If I ran out of TP, and this were the apocalypse, I'd honestly just end it right there. As is, I already keep extra tp fully stocked around my toilet with something like this, let ALONE running out completely. If I drop below a dozen roles I start freaking out.
If I were this guy from Reddit, I'd honestly just stock pile. That's all the prepping I need as you see.
posted by pizzakats708 at 1:48 PM on January 4, 2017 [1 favorite]
If I ran out of TP, and this were the apocalypse, I'd honestly just end it right there. As is, I already keep extra tp fully stocked around my toilet with something like this, let ALONE running out completely. If I drop below a dozen roles I start freaking out.
If I were this guy from Reddit, I'd honestly just stock pile. That's all the prepping I need as you see.
posted by pizzakats708 at 1:48 PM on January 4, 2017 [1 favorite]
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I am increasingly convinced that American style extreme individualism is a disease
posted by The Whelk at 7:26 PM on December 22, 2016 [129 favorites]