Bin Laden (1) escaped and (2) is alive.
April 16, 2002 8:32 PM Subscribe
Bin Laden (1) escaped and (2) is alive. A 'significant defeat' for the U.S. and especially Gen. Franks, who 'ran the war from Tampa with no commander on the scene above the rank of lieutenant colonel'.
bin laden is a POS, but he's probably more useful to the war against terrorism on the lamb than he would be dead.
the press can label this a 'significant defeat' all they want, but as long as he's on the loose, we have a legitimate poster boy for our fight against the worldlwide terrorist infrastructure. kinda reminds me of Fritz Lang's "M"...
posted by nobody_knose at 8:58 PM on April 16, 2002
the press can label this a 'significant defeat' all they want, but as long as he's on the loose, we have a legitimate poster boy for our fight against the worldlwide terrorist infrastructure. kinda reminds me of Fritz Lang's "M"...
posted by nobody_knose at 8:58 PM on April 16, 2002
Molly Ivins writes in a recent column
"Someone suggested the other day if the Republicans were in the opposition, they'd have an "Osama calendar" updated daily: "It's now 254 days since Sept. 11 and still bin Laden eludes our clueless leaders." But that is precisely the sort of opposition we don't need."
posted by onegoodmove at 8:58 PM on April 16, 2002
"Someone suggested the other day if the Republicans were in the opposition, they'd have an "Osama calendar" updated daily: "It's now 254 days since Sept. 11 and still bin Laden eludes our clueless leaders." But that is precisely the sort of opposition we don't need."
posted by onegoodmove at 8:58 PM on April 16, 2002
Watch out, Osama. johnnydark's a certified media assasin.
posted by Optamystic at 9:36 PM on April 16, 2002
posted by Optamystic at 9:36 PM on April 16, 2002
The military screwed up, surprise!
Sweet, now we get to invade some more countries to find out where he's hiding. I'm so glad we get to keep getting our war on.
posted by insomnyuk at 9:44 PM on April 16, 2002
Sweet, now we get to invade some more countries to find out where he's hiding. I'm so glad we get to keep getting our war on.
posted by insomnyuk at 9:44 PM on April 16, 2002
Time to start bombing other places, there is a remote chance that Osama could be in Canada, I think we should bomb the shit out of them and kill as many innocent people as possible. After all, the Christian faith proclaims that we should do this, we are bringing glory to God. Revenge is ok, killing innocent people is fine, we are better than the terrorists. *heavy sarcasm*
posted by banished at 9:48 PM on April 16, 2002
posted by banished at 9:48 PM on April 16, 2002
"We [messed] up by not getting into Tora Bora sooner and letting the Afghans do all the work," said a senior official with direct responsibilities in counterterrorism. "Clearly a decision point came when we started bombing Tora Bora and we decided just to bomb, because that's when he escaped. . .,. We didn't put U.S. forces on the ground, despite all the brave talk, and that is what we have had to change since then."
Well at least the president wanted to 'smoke him out of his hole' (Or was it 'smoke them out out of their holes'?) It's a shame the military leadership 'in Tampa' didn't quite see it that capturing him was also its responsibility. I didn't think one 'messed up' in such endeavors. Poster boy indeed. Why stamp out a good thing when it's only just been lit?
posted by crasspastor at 9:53 PM on April 16, 2002
Well at least the president wanted to 'smoke him out of his hole' (Or was it 'smoke them out out of their holes'?) It's a shame the military leadership 'in Tampa' didn't quite see it that capturing him was also its responsibility. I didn't think one 'messed up' in such endeavors. Poster boy indeed. Why stamp out a good thing when it's only just been lit?
posted by crasspastor at 9:53 PM on April 16, 2002
As an unnamed "muckraker" whose booksigning i went to on Sunday said "what if FDR said 'okay boys, this hitler guy is getting out of hand. Let's smoke him out of his hole and take care of him. Let's Go!"
Doesn't quite take, does it?
posted by Ufez Jones at 10:07 PM on April 16, 2002
Doesn't quite take, does it?
posted by Ufez Jones at 10:07 PM on April 16, 2002
Possibly, but only with a thick accent. As in "let's roh-ill"
posted by Ufez Jones at 10:31 PM on April 16, 2002
posted by Ufez Jones at 10:31 PM on April 16, 2002
Hey, was that whole thing about Bin Laden needing dialysis just a rumor?
posted by darukaru at 10:46 PM on April 16, 2002
posted by darukaru at 10:46 PM on April 16, 2002
of course. now we have no excuse to send in more and more ground troops and escalate military action. score one for the prez + the military industrial complex.
posted by pinto at 10:46 PM on April 16, 2002
posted by pinto at 10:46 PM on April 16, 2002
"Franks has told subordinates that it was vital at the Tora Bora battle, among the first to include allies from Afghanistan's Pashtun majority, to take a supporting role and 'not just push them aside and take over because we were America,' according to Quigley."
So let me get this straight. We suspected at the time that Bin Laden was in Tora Bora and we knew that the locals were notoriously corrupt and many were sympathetic to Al Qaeda, but we didn't put troops on the ground to secure the area properly because we were afraid of offending our allies by acting unilaterally, and thus probably allowed Bin Laden to escape.
Priceless.
posted by homunculus at 10:52 PM on April 16, 2002
So let me get this straight. We suspected at the time that Bin Laden was in Tora Bora and we knew that the locals were notoriously corrupt and many were sympathetic to Al Qaeda, but we didn't put troops on the ground to secure the area properly because we were afraid of offending our allies by acting unilaterally, and thus probably allowed Bin Laden to escape.
Priceless.
posted by homunculus at 10:52 PM on April 16, 2002
How's that conspiracy theory working for you pinto? Do me a favor and close your shades; the eagle is in flight and the night is young.
posted by BlueTrain at 10:53 PM on April 16, 2002
posted by BlueTrain at 10:53 PM on April 16, 2002
Where did pinto go wrong with his assessment BlueTrain? Whichever side one may be on this fence both subjects "prez + the military industrial complex" stand to gain in some way. Their existences depend upon it.
posted by crasspastor at 11:15 PM on April 16, 2002
posted by crasspastor at 11:15 PM on April 16, 2002
Funny, if you owe the IRS $1.25 they'll track you to the ends of the earth, but if you're a maddog killer with Saudi oil connections you turn into the invisible man.
posted by Mack Twain at 11:18 PM on April 16, 2002
posted by Mack Twain at 11:18 PM on April 16, 2002
Yeah, I'm sure there's a 'grassy knowle' in tora borra somewhere. Let's call in the remaining members of the Warren commission to figure this one out, shall we?
Seriously, though, I do see noboy_knose's point...Osama's uncertain whereabouts have been nothing short of a catalist for our silly little 'war on terror' banterings of late...of course, with him 'missing', we've now turned Saddam into the proverbial boogy man of the moment, all the while making sure that our teleological end of 'evil' (buzz word of the moment, anybody?) remains in sight while having a new object to serve as catharsis for our endevours. It sure feels silly to be an American.
posted by tiger yang at 11:23 PM on April 16, 2002
Seriously, though, I do see noboy_knose's point...Osama's uncertain whereabouts have been nothing short of a catalist for our silly little 'war on terror' banterings of late...of course, with him 'missing', we've now turned Saddam into the proverbial boogy man of the moment, all the while making sure that our teleological end of 'evil' (buzz word of the moment, anybody?) remains in sight while having a new object to serve as catharsis for our endevours. It sure feels silly to be an American.
posted by tiger yang at 11:23 PM on April 16, 2002
Border guards and low-ranking military boys make nothing. Millionaires can always disappear.
If it's what he wants, Osama bin Laden is enjoying a cool drink and a detective novel on a beach somewhere nice, or he's getting a stimulating fur-and-feathers massage by teenage girls dressed, of course, in fur and feathers.
posted by pracowity at 11:25 PM on April 16, 2002
If it's what he wants, Osama bin Laden is enjoying a cool drink and a detective novel on a beach somewhere nice, or he's getting a stimulating fur-and-feathers massage by teenage girls dressed, of course, in fur and feathers.
posted by pracowity at 11:25 PM on April 16, 2002
(Midnight conversation from inside the heart of Dick Cheney's secret lair . . .)
Cheney: This can't go on! George's inability to deal with the situation in the middle east is causing his approval rating to drop! Quick, call the Washington Post and feed them some line about bin Laden -- that should get folks riled up again . . .
High-ranking security advisor: What should I tell them, sir?
Cheney: Tell them anything! Tell them something they already know . . . It doesn't matter. Just get their minds off Arafat and that weasel Sharon.
HRSA: Yes, sir!
Cheney: Oh, and if it has to make us look bad, make sure Franks is the fall guy. I never liked him.
posted by dogmatic at 11:47 PM on April 16, 2002
Cheney: This can't go on! George's inability to deal with the situation in the middle east is causing his approval rating to drop! Quick, call the Washington Post and feed them some line about bin Laden -- that should get folks riled up again . . .
High-ranking security advisor: What should I tell them, sir?
Cheney: Tell them anything! Tell them something they already know . . . It doesn't matter. Just get their minds off Arafat and that weasel Sharon.
HRSA: Yes, sir!
Cheney: Oh, and if it has to make us look bad, make sure Franks is the fall guy. I never liked him.
posted by dogmatic at 11:47 PM on April 16, 2002
dogmatic. nice. ..... creepy. but nice.
posted by specialk420 at 11:59 PM on April 16, 2002
posted by specialk420 at 11:59 PM on April 16, 2002
Now let's see. Enron, sluggish economy, continuing layoffs and unemployment, proven disregard for the environment, a foreign policy which makes waffling ol' Bill Clinton look like a straight arrow... Is it too soon to start talking about impeaching Shrub for incompetence? No wait, we only impeach a president for having a penis that works. I forgot.
You know what would save Shrub's presidency right now? An assassination attempt. Now, I'm not saying I wanna see Shrub dead. I mean, he's not as funny dead. When Reagan took a bullet back in the 80s, from that moment on he could do no wrong in the eyes of the American public. I think Shrub's own administration should secretly set up an assassination attempt, preferably in front of a lot of cameras, and make sure he gets winged but not hurt real bad. Well, he'll have to get hurt a little bit cuz if he doesn't actually get hit by a bullet the public may not sympathize as well. But then again, when he had that pretzel eating accident, you could just hear the American people sigh in concerned unison. So all the patsy - uh, I mean the sniper would need to do is graze his shoulder or shoot off a finger or something. Then they could have thirty secret service men swarm all over the patsy - uh, I mean the sniper and prove that they're really doing their job, the patsy -- SNIPER could ramble to the mikes something about wanting to get inside Jodi Foster's panic room and claim temporary insanity, and then NBC will make a TV movie about it and a whole lotta people will make a lotta money at Shrub's expense. After surviving an attempted assassination, he'll get reelected even if he makes nicey-nice with Bin Laden and makes him Postmaster General. There's still that whole "Tecumseh Curse" thing to consider. Based on recent decisions from the White House, it's like Shrub's just daring somebody to try and kick his ass.
posted by ZachsMind at 12:25 AM on April 17, 2002
You know what would save Shrub's presidency right now? An assassination attempt. Now, I'm not saying I wanna see Shrub dead. I mean, he's not as funny dead. When Reagan took a bullet back in the 80s, from that moment on he could do no wrong in the eyes of the American public. I think Shrub's own administration should secretly set up an assassination attempt, preferably in front of a lot of cameras, and make sure he gets winged but not hurt real bad. Well, he'll have to get hurt a little bit cuz if he doesn't actually get hit by a bullet the public may not sympathize as well. But then again, when he had that pretzel eating accident, you could just hear the American people sigh in concerned unison. So all the patsy - uh, I mean the sniper would need to do is graze his shoulder or shoot off a finger or something. Then they could have thirty secret service men swarm all over the patsy - uh, I mean the sniper and prove that they're really doing their job, the patsy -- SNIPER could ramble to the mikes something about wanting to get inside Jodi Foster's panic room and claim temporary insanity, and then NBC will make a TV movie about it and a whole lotta people will make a lotta money at Shrub's expense. After surviving an attempted assassination, he'll get reelected even if he makes nicey-nice with Bin Laden and makes him Postmaster General. There's still that whole "Tecumseh Curse" thing to consider. Based on recent decisions from the White House, it's like Shrub's just daring somebody to try and kick his ass.
posted by ZachsMind at 12:25 AM on April 17, 2002
Pinto: The fat man says the weasel is going bald. (wink wink)
Verso holds up her "JOKE!" sign.
posted by verso at 1:24 AM on April 17, 2002
Verso holds up her "JOKE!" sign.
posted by verso at 1:24 AM on April 17, 2002
What a turn-up for the books... we hated Saddam Hussein but didn't manage to assasinate him; we hated Osama bin Laden and didn't manage to get him either.
Obviously we wouldn't want to make martyrs out of them, but could it be that these people are more useful to us alive than dead? In Saddam's case I've yet to read of an alternative leader that the US would prefer to have in power.
posted by skylar at 3:20 AM on April 17, 2002
Obviously we wouldn't want to make martyrs out of them, but could it be that these people are more useful to us alive than dead? In Saddam's case I've yet to read of an alternative leader that the US would prefer to have in power.
posted by skylar at 3:20 AM on April 17, 2002
"...the patsy -- SNIPER could ramble ..."
comedy gold!
posted by jcterminal at 4:29 AM on April 17, 2002
comedy gold!
posted by jcterminal at 4:29 AM on April 17, 2002
Damn, Zachsmind, you really want a bunch of guys in suits to come visit you.
posted by piskycritters at 5:16 AM on April 17, 2002
posted by piskycritters at 5:16 AM on April 17, 2002
Zachsmind - don't say things like that out in the open, or there'll be midnight black Suburbans full of Feds looking for you.
posted by JaxJaggywires at 5:27 AM on April 17, 2002
posted by JaxJaggywires at 5:27 AM on April 17, 2002
I think Shrub's own administration should secretly set up an assassination attempt, preferably in front of a lot of cameras, and make sure he gets winged but not hurt real bad.
You say this like it's outside the realm of possibility?
posted by rushmc at 8:06 AM on April 17, 2002
You say this like it's outside the realm of possibility?
posted by rushmc at 8:06 AM on April 17, 2002
My God, we are a cynical bunch, aren't we? ;)
posted by solistrato at 8:16 AM on April 17, 2002
posted by solistrato at 8:16 AM on April 17, 2002
Here's how I look at it. The government is like a company. They have an implicit contract with the people to do certain things, in this case, get Osama Bin Laden. Now, for this taskt, they get lots of money. Lots and lots of money. So much money that failing to plan correctly may be equated with planning to fail. So, we aren't getting a return on our investment, and they are doing things behind our backs.
And yeah we're gonna invade a lot of countries. I new it the day troop landed in Afghanistan, and all my suspicions are coming true. Predictable really. Every damned one.
posted by Settle at 2:47 PM on April 17, 2002
And yeah we're gonna invade a lot of countries. I new it the day troop landed in Afghanistan, and all my suspicions are coming true. Predictable really. Every damned one.
posted by Settle at 2:47 PM on April 17, 2002
No wait, we only impeach a president for having a penis that works. I forgot.
Comedy gold part duex...Classic.
posted by Rastafari at 4:07 PM on April 17, 2002
Comedy gold part duex...Classic.
posted by Rastafari at 4:07 PM on April 17, 2002
I read Zach's post last night before bed. Needless to say I had nightmares. Zach!
posted by crasspastor at 4:42 PM on April 17, 2002
posted by crasspastor at 4:42 PM on April 17, 2002
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posted by johnnydark at 8:46 PM on April 16, 2002