The Sessions Sessions: The Confederate General Babbles Before Congress
June 13, 2017 8:32 AM Subscribe

At 2:30pm Eastern time today, Jefferson Beauregard Sessions III will testify under oath before the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence regarding his contacts with government officials of the Russian Federation prior to the January 20th inauguration, as well as his role in the firing of former FBI Director James Comey. Many burning questions remain for Sessions.

Special Prosecutor Robert Mueller has brought on money laundering experts, a veritable "murders' row" of prosecutors, while the right-wing world has turned on him in a transparent and vicious attempt to undermine the credibility of the investigation into the Trump campaign's alleged collusion with Russia and other filthy laundry the investigation turns up.

To complicate matters further for the embattled chief executive, there are reports that he is considering attempting to fire Robert Mueller. Jesse Eisinger and Justin Elliott of ProPublica have also reported that Trump's personal lawyer Marc Kasowitz has claimed to have been a catalyst in the firing of former US Attorney Preet Bharara.

In other news, a three-judge panel of the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals ruled against the administration in regards to Trump's self-proclaimed travel ban, unanimously upholding an injunction preventing the implementation of the policy.

Meanwhile, Mitch McConnell is trying desperately to pass another cruel ACA-repeal bill with no public text or CBO score.

posted by Excommunicated Cardinal (2954 comments total) 119 users marked this as a favorite

Thank you!!
posted by Room 641-A at 8:34 AM on June 13, 2017 [11 favorites]

Thanks for the new thread.

Trump has blocked VoteVets and Stephen King from his twitter feed today.

Video: Speaker Ryan: "The best advice would be to let Robert Mueller do his job" as special counsel in Russia investigation.

NBC News' Kasie Hunt (@kasie on Twitter) reports that "Reporters at Capitol have been told they are not allow to film interviews with senators in hallways, contrary to years of precedent. CONDITIONS for any interview: Previously granted permission from senator AND Rules Committee of Senate."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:35 AM on June 13, 2017 [68 favorites]

BBC: North Korea has released jailed US student Otto Warmbier, Secretary of State Rex Tillerson says.

Mr Warmbier's release comes hours after US basketball star Dennis Rodman arrived in North Korea, but it is not clear if the two events are linked.

It's 2017, do we really need to ask if they are linked? Dennis Rodman is a reality TV star utterly unqualified to conduct international diplomacy, particularly in one of the most dangerous conflict hot-spots in history. The year is 2017. Rodman supports Trump. Rodman was on Trump's show, repeatedly. Do we really need to ask if he has been appointed as Trump's unofficial emissary to North Korea? If truth no longer has meaning, is evidence still required? What is the difference between a duck? What is a mouse when it spins?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:36 AM on June 13, 2017 [82 favorites]

Thank you for this new post!

History question: Has any other Congress ever tried to pass such wide-sweeping legislation (that would affect many millions of Americans) through what is essentially a cover-up in which they are lying outright to the country?
posted by zarq at 8:37 AM on June 13, 2017 [20 favorites]

DO NOT VIDEOTAPE THE SWAMP.
posted by Artw at 8:37 AM on June 13, 2017 [20 favorites]

I think what bothers me the most (in this 60-second time period) is what utter, total, chicken shits these people are.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:38 AM on June 13, 2017 [48 favorites]

Trump has blocked VoteVets

They have half a million supporters.

This should end well.
posted by zarq at 8:38 AM on June 13, 2017 [50 favorites]

Brian Beutler: Nobody will consider the Republicans’ secret Trumpcare bill a scandal if Democrats don’t treat it like one.

It is understandably challenging to get news editors and producers to write splashy headlines and run breaking news alerts about a bill whose details are unknown. The key to making that story seem juicy is to underline the fact that the Republican health care reform process is a scandal—marked no less than the Trump-Russia scandal by secret meetings, violated norms, collusion, and deceit. On a day to day basis, it looks like “no news,” but that’s because the public interest is being brazenly subverted.

One way around this challenge is to seize the narrative. Headlines that say “Democrats Shut Down Sessions Hearing Over Secret Republican Health Care Bill” would shine a light, if not on what Republicans are planning to do, then on the scandalous way they are doing it. That would increase pressure on Republicans to conduct a more transparent process, and maybe even ferret out details of the secret plan.

posted by zombieflanders at 8:38 AM on June 13, 2017 [85 favorites]

Countdown until Trump tweets that freeing this American student was "a real slam-dunk"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:38 AM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Parents of man released from NK say he’s in coma: Fred and Cindy Warmbier said in a statement to The Associated Press that they have been told their son has been in a coma since March 2016, and they had learned of this only one week ago.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:39 AM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Trump has blocked Stephen King from his twitter feed today.

If King has taught us anything it's that shutting away uncomfortable thoughts and discussions is very effective and does not result in them manifesting into demonic clowns or what have you
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:41 AM on June 13, 2017 [186 favorites]

Trump has blocked VoteVets and Stephen King from his twitter feed today.

Didn't somebody have a thought experiment about Twitter-blocking as a First Amendment violation in these days of Trump's Twitter account being official communications? Maybe King should throw some It-bucks at that for the lulz.
posted by uncleozzy at 8:42 AM on June 13, 2017 [22 favorites]

If King has taught us anything it's that shutting away uncomfortable thoughts and discussions is very effective and does not result in them manifesting into demonic clowns or what have you

Right, but if you already are a demonic clown ...
posted by leotrotsky at 8:44 AM on June 13, 2017 [23 favorites]

If King has taught us anything it's that shutting away uncomfortable thoughts and discussions is very effective and does not result in them manifesting into demonic clowns or what have you

uh is trump the guy with the thoughts or the demonic clown in this scenario
posted by murphy slaw at 8:45 AM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

Stephen King 2020: We All Vote Down Here
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:45 AM on June 13, 2017 [147 favorites]

but also seems personally aghast at the possibility that Trump would order him to fire Mueller, indicating he won't follow such an order as long as he's in the job (which of course wouldn't be long, in that event).

So he probably just fired himself?
posted by Artw at 8:45 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Just going to offer my predictions now:

1.) Trump will fire Mueller, probably within the next two weeks,
and
2.) The GOP will do nothing about it.

Nothing, in a tactical political sense, has changed. Trump is obviously, hilariously guilty of something extremely bad, possibly involving Russia, definitely involving his own enrichment from the office of President or pursuit of same; we know this because he didn't start freaking out until Mueller started hiring money laundering experts. Oh, and because he's got a pattern of firing anybody who's investigating him or even looks like he's investigating him, we know he's guilty because of that too.

He's going to fire Mueller for the same reason he fired Bharara and Comey: because he's guilty and wants them to go away. And he's going to do it because the congressional GOP has done nothing to punish him for firing people investigating him. They're practically encouraged him.

As for the GOP re: Mueller, nothing is going to change there either. They can't do shit to Trump, because the moment they do, they lose that 25% of their base that adores Trump, and say goodbye to winning elections ever again. Really, you could set aside their wanting to achieve their horrible legislative goals via Trump's presidency, because even if they didn't think they could get thing one done with Trump they'd still enable him out of fear. That's why they won't do anything worse than mumble about how concerned they are.

Two weeks at the most. Count on it.
posted by mightygodking at 8:46 AM on June 13, 2017 [91 favorites]

It's 2017, do we really need to ask if they are linked? Dennis Rodman is a reality TV star utterly unqualified to conduct international diplomacy, particularly in one of the most dangerous conflict hot-spots in history. The year is 2017. Rodman supports Trump. Rodman was on Trump's show, repeatedly. Do we really need to ask if he has been appointed as Trump's unofficial emissary to North Korea? If truth no longer has meaning, is evidence still required? What is the difference between a duck? What is a mouse when it spins?

I know you want to be facetious and that it's a ridiculous situation but Dennis Rodman has been in North Korea for longer and more substantive visits than any other living American and adored by the ruling dynasty. If there's any one person you want to send to butter up KJU and ask a favor, he would be the guy.
posted by Talez at 8:46 AM on June 13, 2017 [20 favorites]

kind of stunning to see the admin float trial balloons about firing mueller, as if the lesson they took from watergate was that nixon stopped committing saturday night massacres too early
posted by murphy slaw at 8:46 AM on June 13, 2017 [72 favorites]

Nothing, in a tactical political sense, has changed. Trump is obviously, hilariously guilty of something extremely bad, possibly involving Russia

Possibly involving Russia?
posted by diogenes at 8:47 AM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Two weeks at the most. Count on it.

I can't tell if you are being meta or not.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:48 AM on June 13, 2017 [25 favorites]

Parents of man released from NK say he’s in coma: Fred and Cindy Warmbier said in a statement to The Associated Press that they have been told their son has been in a coma since March 2016, and they had learned of this only one week ago.

This was the kid who tried to steal a banner, who has apparently been in a coma pretty much from the time he was jailed. So presumably some people in the NK system beat him into a coma the minute the cameras were off, thereby providing one more in the long long list of proofs that as a species we are no damn good at all, not even at the most basic level.
posted by Frowner at 8:48 AM on June 13, 2017 [39 favorites]

Stephen King 2020: I kill with my heart
posted by Halloween Jack at 8:49 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

Tomorrow is Trump's birthday. Should we all be making wishes and writing them on cakes?
posted by Fiberoptic Zebroid and The Hypnagogic Jerks at 8:49 AM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Any Washingtonians out there! WA health care system also serves Idaho, Wyoming, Alaska, and Montana! Go contact these Senators! The AHCA will cost Harboriew Medical ctr alone, the major trauma center for all 5 states, $2 BILLION by 2026. This impacts you, too!

Copied from a frien's FB post. Five states feed into Harborview. If I get hurt real bad, they'll chopper me to Harborview. It is absolutely crucial not to do harm to major trauma centers.

So sick of these people. Maybe it has to start hurting them too. My Trump voting poor neighbors must know how I feel. They don't talk about him around me.
I have no idea if it's starting to sink in. Maybe they're too stupid for it to sink in.
posted by Katjusa Roquette at 8:52 AM on June 13, 2017 [42 favorites]

Melania Trump Drops Fake Cyber Bullying Campaign She Only Pretended to Care About
posted by zombieflanders at 8:52 AM on June 13, 2017 [22 favorites]

Some talking points for your Senators on the ACA repeal bill:

Completely, utterly opposed to McConnell's legislation
Republicans are obfuscating the contents of their cruel legislation and won't allow public debate, which is irresponsible and terrible governance
Gutting Medicare, reinstating lifetime benefit caps, eliminating mandated essential benefits, and allowing insurers to deny coverage based on pre-existing conditions will kill tens of millions of Americans
[insert your ACA/Medicare/Medicaid success story here]
[Note how denial based on pre-existing conditions will affect you and yours here]
Note how their vote will affect your votes in the future

Optional points for Democratic Senators

Demand that Democrats treat this travesty of a bill as the scandal that it is
Expect that every Democrat will use all possible means to stop this bill
Expect denial of unanimous consent to grind Senate to a halt

Optional points for "Moderate" Republicans

Note how advancing this bill at any stage of the process will affect your vote
Note how you will campaign against them (e.g., op-eds, telling friends and family about their cruelty)
Note how you will blame them personally and publicly for every American who dies due to this legislation

In case you couldn't tell, I'm PISSED about this shitshow.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:52 AM on June 13, 2017 [139 favorites]

"Reporters at Capitol have been told they are not allow to film interviews with senators in hallways, contrary to years of precedent. CONDITIONS for any interview: Previously granted permission from senator AND Rules Committee of Senate."

@kevcirilli (Bloomberg)
I was just told I cannot stand outside of the Budget Committee hearing room to interview lawmakers.
posted by melissasaurus at 8:54 AM on June 13, 2017 [31 favorites]

Tomorrow is Trump's birthday. Should we all be making wishes and writing them on cakes?
posted by Fiberoptic Zebroid and The Hypnagogic Jerks at 8:49 AM on June 13

1. Love the name. 2. I wouldn't desecrate good cake with it's name like that!
posted by Katjusa Roquette at 8:54 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

I have to admit Sessions has a cool name. In fact, I always wanted to get two bulldogs and name them Beauregard and Belvedere.
posted by jonmc at 8:54 AM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

> I have no idea if it's starting to sink in. Maybe they're too stupid for it to sink in.

Or mean. The last thought a lot of these people will ever have is "At least I took a lot of [group I don't like] down with me."
posted by The Card Cheat at 8:56 AM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Jefferson Beauregard Sessions is totally ruining the good names of those two villainous slaveholders.
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:57 AM on June 13, 2017 [60 favorites]

Referring to firing Mueller, this would mean his whole team, I presume??
What actually happens then? Does some security guard collect their badges and laptops and escort them from the building?
Is evidence saved someplace safe? Are they prohibited from sharing it?
posted by MtDewd at 8:57 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Here's what I'm looking for in a Presidential candidate. Someone who supports
1. Healthcare for all
2. Serious efforts to curb Climate Change
3. Putting Trump and his minions on trial.

DJT may escape the consequences of his actions for now but we MUST insist that eventually he is tried for his various crimes. No sweeping under the carpet this time however politically expedient that might be.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 9:00 AM on June 13, 2017 [17 favorites]

Referring to firing Mueller, this would mean his whole team, I presume??

and while he's at it, fire the whole FBI -- what have they ever done for America?
posted by philip-random at 9:00 AM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Ah, the Angry Leprechaun (his nickname in the Senate) finally gets his time in the hot seat...
posted by jim in austin at 9:00 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

What is a mouse when it spins?

A Tasmanian imp.
posted by y2karl at 9:00 AM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

You’re Probably Going to Need Medicaid a NYT opinion piece, authors David Grabowski is a professor of health care policy at Harvard Medical School. Jonathan Gruber is a professor of economics at M.I.T. Vincent Mor is a professor of health care policy at Brown.

Some talking points for those calls:

Imagine your mother needs to move into a nursing home. It’s going to cost her almost $100,000 a year. Very few people have private insurance to cover this. Your mother will most likely run out her savings until she qualifies for Medicaid.

Finally, these cuts would just shift costs to the rest of the government. Lower-quality nursing home care leads to more hospitalizations, and for Americans over 65, these are paid for by another government program, Medicare. One-quarter of nursing home residents are hospitalized each year, and the daily cost of caring for them more than quadruples when they move to the hospital. Research shows that a reduction in nursing home reimbursements of around 10 percent leads to a 5 percent rise in the odds that residents will be hospitalized. So care for seniors suffers, and the taxpayer pays.
posted by mumimor at 9:01 AM on June 13, 2017 [63 favorites]

He's going to fire Mueller for the same reason he fired Bharara and Comey: because he's guilty and wants them to go away. And he's going to do it because the congressional GOP has done nothing to punish him for firing people investigating him. They're practically encouraged him.

One of the worst aspects of the Trump presidency is how he distorts even his opponents. A lot of people on the left are being literally delusional about the situation and the prospects of what might happen. As long as the Republicans control Congress, nothing will ever happen to Trump no matter what comes out. Trump can fire Mueller and nothing will happen.

Comparisons to Watergate and the "Saturday Night Massacre" are part of the delusion because the fundamental political reality has changed. At the very least at that time all sides still agreed on a basic consensus reality and the very concept of political norms and the validity of rules and laws. The Republicans of today not only reject facts in favor of their own reality, they have outright contempt for every aspect of the political and judicial system.
posted by Sangermaine at 9:02 AM on June 13, 2017 [76 favorites]

3. Putting Trump and his minions on trial.

can't we just send them all to St. Helena? I hear they're hurting of late. Turn it into a sort of Survivor TV series, but with genuine life or death stakes wherein the food supply gets cut a little every episode ... cannibalism, the Trump administration and reality TV, what could be better?
posted by philip-random at 9:05 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

1.) Trump will fire Mueller, probably within the next two weeks,
and
2.) The GOP will do nothing about it.

I think you're right. The Republican party doesn't care about anything but holding onto power, and right now it's more dangerous for them to turn on Trump than to help him cover up his crimes.

It's unbelievable how craven and hypocritical they are. Given the slightest appearance of impropriety by a Democrat, they go nuclear, screaming fire and rage and "but her emails." Given the most blatantly corrupt, mendacious, and incompetent president ever, they'll contort themselves - and the government - into knots in order to defend him.

Meanwhile, they know that their agenda is so unpopular that they're passing it in secret. They've given up all pretense of representing their constituents.

I don't know what citizens are supposed to do when the ruling party refuses to enforce the law because the person breaking it is their buddy. They're all accomplices.
posted by Kutsuwamushi at 9:05 AM on June 13, 2017 [67 favorites]

One of the worst aspects of the Trump presidency is how he distorts even his opponents. A lot of people on the left are being literally delusional about the situation and the prospects of what might happen.

You can't be literally delusional about possible future events. You are literally delusional if you think you can predict the future with 100% certainty.
posted by diogenes at 9:06 AM on June 13, 2017 [12 favorites]

> Some talking points for your Senators on the ACA repeal bill:

Thanks much to Excommunicated Cardinal for this concise statement of principles against ACA repeal.

To my fellow Pennsylvanians: I was unable to even leave a message at Toomey's Pittsburgh office, but the DC number seemed to at least go to voice mail, so try that if your local office has the phones set to "fuck you all."
posted by tonycpsu at 9:06 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

And then this...it might be fake news, but if you inserted Uranium Mine, right between the Bears Ears, it would be absolute truth.
posted by Oyéah at 9:07 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

One of the worst aspects of the Trump presidency is how he distorts even his opponents. A lot of people on the left are being literally delusional about the situation and the prospects of what might happen. As long as the Republicans control Congress, nothing will ever happen to Trump no matter what comes out. Trump can fire Mueller and nothing will happen.

Being out of political solutions just means we have to use non-political solutions to achieve our goals, not give up on our goals because it's hard.

(but I don't think we're out of political solutions yet)
posted by melissasaurus at 9:08 AM on June 13, 2017 [19 favorites]

via OANN's Trey Yingst on Twitter

12:00PM: Sen. Collins and Sen. Cotton have lunch with POTUS, along with 13 other Senators
2:30PM: Collins and Cotton question AG Sessions

Like, in case you had any questions about what was going to happen this afternoon.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:09 AM on June 13, 2017 [88 favorites]

Trump's Twitter isn't considered official communication. In that it isn't covered by the Presidential Records Act and why Trump can delete tweets. There is a bill being crafted in the House called the Communications Over Various Feeds Electronically for Engagement (COVFEFE) Act that would close this loophole.
posted by phoque at 9:10 AM on June 13, 2017 [42 favorites]

> Like, in case you had any questions about what was going to happen this afternoon.

Meat loaf farts?
posted by tonycpsu at 9:13 AM on June 13, 2017 [8 favorites]

One deleted. Folks, please let's start this new thread off with: minimal noise, minimal bickering over exactly how much sympathy a person in a coma deserves, and minimal "we must be 100% pessimistic" vs. "let's keep trying" infinite back-and-forth.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 9:14 AM on June 13, 2017 [27 favorites]

My hat is off to any broadcast announcer who can pronounce the name "Jefferson Beauregard Sessions" without lapsing into a Cracker Sheriff voice.
posted by Flexagon at 9:16 AM on June 13, 2017 [25 favorites]

Or Foghorn Leghorn.
posted by Mayor West at 9:17 AM on June 13, 2017 [46 favorites]

Early in 2016, my choir director and her retired FBI husband weren't going to vote for Trump because he's crass, but then in the summer they said they would after all because of "endless killings of police." After the Women's March, a bunch of us altos and sopranos talked excitedly about the March (eg, a nice white lady in her 60s said, "I'd never been to a protest before! I didn't wear a pussy hat," (cue the rest of us gaping at the word "pussy" coming from her mouth; also, she used to be a registered Republican for most of her life) "but I was holding a sign and chanting slogans with my kids and grandkids oh cybercoitus interruptus you don't have to thank me for being there, we have to try to save democracy" and I could tell the choir director felt miffed and left out that we were trashing her (political) team...

so on Sunday I said to her husband, "You're retired FBI. What did you think of Comey's testimony?"

"I thought he was very credible," he said. He said Comey made a great point about why the need to clear the room before Trump talked with him, that Trump is wasting his time tweeting instead of governing, that there's no legal way to get Trump out of office, that he wishes Congress would accomplish bipartisan issue legislation like seizure of foreign assets.

"I'm real relieved, because I thought Comey was real credible too. I watched him and said, THAT's professionalism. Thanks for telling me your perspective. I'm really glad to hear it." I started walking toward my car.

He calls after me, "'Cause I'm not as crazy as you thought I was?"

"Uh, I didn't think you were craaaaazy....exactly..."

I didn't say much because it's a first conversation about a touchy subject and I didn't want to wreck the friendly tone. It's groundwork for later conversations where I'll try pushing a little bit about what actions he is or isn't taking. Baby steps.
posted by cybercoitus interruptus at 9:19 AM on June 13, 2017 [81 favorites]

Some talking points for your Senators on the ACA repeal bill:

Completely, utterly opposed to McConnell's legislation
Republicans are obfuscating the contents of their cruel legislation and won't allow public debate, which is irresponsible and terrible governance
Gutting Medicare, reinstating lifetime benefit caps, eliminating mandated essential benefits, and allowing insurers to deny coverage based on pre-existing conditions will kill tens of millions of Americans
[insert your ACA/Medicare/Medicaid success story here]
[Note how denial based on pre-existing conditions will affect you and yours here]
Note how their vote will affect your votes in the future

Fellow Pennsyltuckians, you can fax Toomey freely here.
posted by Dashy at 9:20 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

(and you may as well fax Casey while you're at it, just to remind him to stand the line with his fellow Dems)
posted by Dashy at 9:22 AM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

House Republicans, You Can Still Run Away From Trump, by Rick Wilson.
posted by growabrain at 9:24 AM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

One thing to look out for in the Senate version of the AHCA is to expect them to come up with a much better score from the CBO. They will do this by fudging the numbers. They are going to do the same thing as the awful House version, eliminating Medicaid for millions, but they will do this over something like 7 years instead of 3 years. By CBO rules, their scoring only looks out 10 years, so the same 24 million will lose insurance, but most of them won't be counted because of CBO rules restricting their scoring window.

So I expect the official CBO score on the Senate version to come in with something like 8 million losing insurance instead of 24 million. Everyone will declare this to be a great improvement and victory for moderate Republicans, and pass easily. It will all be an illusion and just as many will suffer and die.
posted by JackFlash at 9:25 AM on June 13, 2017 [28 favorites]

I've not seen anyone mention this yet, it seems like an increasingly big deal.

Russian Cyber Hacks on U.S. Electoral System Far Wider Than Previously Known

- In all, the Russian hackers hit systems in a total of 39 states, one of them said.

- The scope and sophistication so concerned Obama administration officials that they took an unprecedented step -- complaining directly to Moscow over a modern-day “red phone.” In October, two of the people said, the White House contacted the Kremlin on the back channel to offer detailed documents of what it said was Russia’s role in election meddling and to warn that the attacks risked setting off a broader conflict.

- In fact, the Obama administration believed that the Russians were possibly preparing to delete voter registration

- In Illinois, investigators also found evidence that the hackers tried but failed to alter or delete some information in the database, an attempt that wasn’t previously reported
posted by H. Roark at 9:26 AM on June 13, 2017 [74 favorites]

My understanding was that 14 million would be directly affected by the medicaid cuts as soon as it goes into effect, so wouldn't that still show up in the CBO score for year 8 + whoever gets kicked off their private insurance because of premium hikes/pre-existing conditions etc etc. I don't see them being able to fudge the CBO score on numbers uninsured by that much
posted by TwoWordReview at 9:28 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Two weeks at the most. Count on it.

Two weeks before Trump cans Mueller is very generous, especially in the context of previous firings.

—Time between James Comey's May 3rd Senate testimony and May 9th dismissal: One week.

—Time between Sally Yates's January 26th telephone call to the White House about Michael Flynn and January 30th dismissal: 5 days.

—Time between Preet Bharara's March 10th failure to pick up a telephone call from Trump and March 11th dismissal: 22 hours.

If Sessions' testimony today doesn't go exactly the way Trump wants, it'll be a week at most before Trump fires Mueller - or at the very least Rosenstein in preparation for Mueller. Wagering against Trump's impatience and/or stupidity is a sucker's bet.
posted by Doktor Zed at 9:31 AM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

I'm meetin' Kislyak (yeah!)
Them other boys don't know how to act (yeah!)
I think it's special what's behind your back (yeah!)
Derisive info known as "kompromat" (yeah, take it to the Caucasus!)

Sergey babe (ah-huh)
You got this video, baby, I'm your slave (ah-huh)
Cause you'll destroy me if I misbehave (ah-huh)
It's just that no one helps me win this way (yeah, take it to the caucus!)

Come here Trump
You're compromised
FSB
Tape's on me
Let me see who you're flirting with
Look at this piss
You make me smile
It goes in the file
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on

Yevgeny?

I'm meetin' Kislyak (yeah!)
My NATO allies know how you attack (yeah!)
They see that we'll no longer watch their back (yeah!)
I have one master now and that's a fact (yeah, Vladimirovich!)

Comey babe (ah-huh)
Investigating Michael Flynn is grave (ah-huh)
I might just fire you if you misbehave (ah-huh)
Obstructing justice is the thing I crave (yeah, take it to impeach!)

Come here, Flynn
To the West Wing
NSA
Report to Sergey
You can see these emoluments
Dollars and cents
They make me smile
Til I'm on trial
And get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on (go 'head, be gone with it)
Get your treason on
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:34 AM on June 13, 2017 [24 favorites]

It does my heart good to dial Toomey's office number and just get a busy signal. I mean, I assume it just means that they hit the unavailable/off-the-line button on their VOIP set, but hey, at least they had to do it.

So I called the DC line and left a voicemail on those awesome talking points that Excommunicated Cardinal posted above.

Toomey's DC office: (202) 224-4254
posted by joyceanmachine at 9:34 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

Video: Speaker Ryan: "The best advice would be to let Robert Mueller do his job" as special counsel in Russia investigation.

File Under: Faint Hopes Dept. But . . . .

One wonders if this might be a sign of the Red Wall starting to crack. Ryan's support of Trump seems pretty lukewarm as of late - there's this (and worth noting that the video link includes a hard-to-hear question about Ryan "standing by" the President* which he "answers" by just repeating his point about Mueller); Ryan had to know that his "he's new" defense was weak-sauce; there's some recent picture (which of course I can't find now) where Ryan's sitting at a table with Trump & Pence & several other muckity-mucks where Trump is doing his pursed-lips "SRS BZNS" frowny-face and everyone else is looking around and Ryan is looking directly at the photog with a big phony closed-mouth "smile" that could easily read as "Welp, this is my life now. . . ."

When the guy second in line of succession starts acting like it's not worth expending any real effort to support the President* I can't help but suspect that maybe (maaaaaaybe) he's seeing a real shot at winding up in the Oval Office his own self and is trying to thread the needle of "Republican but not Trumpian."
posted by soundguy99 at 9:35 AM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

House Republicans, You Can Still Run Away From Trump, by Rick Wilson.
posted by growabrain at 9:24 on June 13 [3 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]

This post is so completely and hilariously eponysterical.

I wish more of them would see running away from Trump as worth loosing their seat for. The Republicans in Congress need to take one for the team--for Team Our Country.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:36 AM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

Ryan is looking directly at the photog with a big phony closed-mouth "smile" that could easily read as "Welp, this is my life now. . . ."

Ryan so desperately wants to see himself as the Jim Halpert, and not the Dwight Schrute.
posted by xigxag at 9:39 AM on June 13, 2017 [32 favorites]

National Treasure Alexandra Petri, WaPo: 'I love you more, Mr. President": A Cabinet competition

President Trump responded to the news that the Public Theater was putting on a defiant production of “Julius Caesar” by staging his own production of “King Lear” during a very strange Cabinet meeting on Monday.

It went approximately as follows.

Trump: All right. Which of you shall we say doth love us most, that we our largest bounty may extend where nature doth with merit challenge? Go around, name your position, talk about your work. Start with Mike.

Mike Pence: I love you more than words can wield the matter. Dearer than eyesight, space and liberty. Beyond what can be valued, rich or rare. No less than life, with grace, health, beauty, honor; as much as child e’er loved, or father found. A love that makes breath poor and speech unable. Beyond all manner of so much I love you. Serving you has been “the greatest privilege of my life,” Mr. Lear.

Jeff Sessions: Sir, I am made of that self mettle as my sister, And prize me at her worth. In my true heart, I find she names my very deed of love — Only she comes too short, that I profess Myself an enemy to all other joys, Which the most precious square of sense possesses. And find I am alone felicitate in your dear highness’ love. “An honor to be here.”

Jim Mattis: I respect the troops a lot.

posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:44 AM on June 13, 2017 [104 favorites]

I see Ryan more as the idiot soldier who plucked the nickel crosses out of the walls of the keep
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:44 AM on June 13, 2017 [8 favorites]

Friendly reminder that if you live in Virginia, there is a primary today. Polls close at 7pm, y'all. Go vote!

And I think I'm okay to leave this WaPo article here.
posted by dogheart at 9:44 AM on June 13, 2017 [8 favorites]

I admit this is theoretical, but there could be a point in this timeline where Republicans hope a president Ryan would be better for the party's future than a president Pelosi. I'm guessing that when there is no doubt that Pence is complicit in whatever is going on, Ryan will be all for impeachment.
posted by mumimor at 9:45 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Automating Hate: Documenting the anatomy of an automated propaganda machine

From Idavox, the news and events site for the One People's Project (previously), an analysis published a few weeks ago of an operation called AgendaOfEvil.com which promotes and cross-propagates anti-Islam propaganda and fake news in an automated fashion through a network of social media accounts.
posted by XMLicious at 9:45 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

I honestly don't even understand why these chucklefucks even care so much about losing their jobs that they're willing to literally commit treason to keep them. It's just a job, guys. And honestly not even a particularly good one given you have to spend like 5 hours a day sitting at a cubicle calling donors. You couldn't pay me enough to do that, even without the part about how I'd also have to debase myself to a pathologically lying narcissist on the daily.

Take a cue from our friend Jason Chaffetz. Quit while you're ahead. Everyone who has already done so seems like they've got a song in their fucking hearts right now. I think they're on to something.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:47 AM on June 13, 2017 [34 favorites]

I like the title of this post, but I think "gibbers" might be better than "babbles". Sounds more eldritch-y.
posted by orrnyereg at 9:48 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Message to Megyn Kelly (And the Rest of the Media): Liars Like Interviews

The way you approach a liar like Jones is to compile and broadcast/publish a detailed dossier on him. Tell us who he is, what he's done, and why he's important. You don't really need to interview him -- what's the point? So he can give his side of the story? He's given his side of the story, in every broadcast, every day. Sure, ask him for a comment -- but new interview quotes should be a tiny portion of your story, not the bulk of it, which is the mistake it appears that Kelly is making (and that Scott Pelley of 60 Minutes made when he interviewed alt-right liar Mike Cernovich). If you make the interview the bulk of your story, unless you're Perry freaking Mason and you're going to make your subject break down on the witness stand, he's going to use every rhetorical trick he knows to justify himself, at least in his fans' eyes, and he's going to score some points. If your subject is a scumbag, tell us why he's a scumbag. Don't turn the majority of the segment over to him so he can tell us why he's really a swell guy. [...]

Raw interviews are bad journalism. Nearly every morning I hear NPR segments that are just raw interviews with skilled spin doctors. The better interviewers are sometimes armed with important details with which they can rebut the spin. But the usual result is that segments of this kind are 100% spin.

That's not journalism -- it's stenography. And it looks as if this Kelly segment will be pretty much the same, with an occasional Kelly harrumph, for balance. [...]

And if we're wondering whether Kelly got too close to her interview subject to look at him dispassionately, there's this:

posted by tonycpsu at 9:48 AM on June 13, 2017 [137 favorites]

I'm guessing that when there is no doubt that Pence is complicit in whatever is going on, Ryan will be all for impeachment.

I don't think Ryan wants to be President. Not if it means having to deal with all the Trumpists who don't care about starving grannies as much as they care about being really fucking mad about their boy getting stabbed.
posted by Etrigan at 9:48 AM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

I wish more of them would see running away from Trump as worth loosing their seat for.

Snowball's chance in hell of that. What we need to aim for is a bunch of them seeing that running away from Trump is the only way to keep their seats.
posted by soundguy99 at 9:50 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

I don't think Ryan wants to be President.

Are you joking? Everybody in Congress or the Governors office wants to be President. They have ever since they got elected elementary class rep. Not everybody wants to run for President, particularly because you might lose. Ryan would get to skip that part and jump right to the Oval Office.
posted by leotrotsky at 9:52 AM on June 13, 2017 [17 favorites]

Ryan was very reluctant to become Speaker; it's entirely possible that the chance of becoming President in future was the primary factor in his decision.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:54 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

The problem with all the congressmen giving up their seats for good of country is that they all went into Congress for what comes after... Cushy, Well paid lobbying jobs. And to secure those jobs they have to deliver horrible legislation to their corporate overlords.
posted by Glibpaxman at 9:56 AM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Ryan would get to skip that part and jump right to the Oval Office.

Gerald Ford: the lazy man's idol.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 9:56 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

As part of the context for the ban on interviewing in hallways, there are apparently more journalists than ever around the Capitol building.

Elise Viebeck and Ben Terris/WaPo (6/6): Inside the heaving, jostling Capitol media mob: ‘We are one tripped senator away’ from disaster.

“We want to make you aware the Capitol has reached its capacity for reporters,” the officials who oversee the Senate press gallery wrote in a letter to news organizations last month, as Republican infighting and the drama of the Trump presidency were suddenly ramping up the urgent need for scribes to “just get a quote” from some lawmaker, any lawmaker, on whatever crisis of whichever day.

The warning was dire: “Collectively, the press following Senators have become large and aggressive. We are concerned someone may get hurt.”

posted by ZeusHumms at 9:57 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

The California Democrat made the comments during a closed-door meeting Tuesday as part of a broader effort to discourage rank-and-file lawmakers from continuing to talk publicly about impeaching the president right now. "It's a big deal to talk about impeachment," Pelosi told her colleagues, according to multiple Democratic sources. "I think he's going to self-impeach."

The guy who has no sense of shame or self-decency is going to self-impeach.

Pull the other one it has bells on.
posted by Talez at 9:58 AM on June 13, 2017 [27 favorites]

Everybody in Congress or the Governors office wants to be President. They have ever since they got elected elementary class rep

Hence my next sentence -- he doesn't want to be President right now, under the current set of circumstances. I mean, you may be right. He may well be one of those "I can fix this!" types, even now. But I think he sees how much it would suck to be the President right after Trump got turfed out.
posted by Etrigan at 9:59 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

The warning was dire: “Collectively, the press following Senators have become large and aggressive. We are concerned someone may get hurt.”

Are they going to invite Gianforte over to give some pointers?
posted by OverlappingElvis at 9:59 AM on June 13, 2017 [11 favorites]

Paul Ryan did run for VP. Presumably he is interested in the big job.
posted by Emmy Rae at 10:00 AM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

Friendly reminder that if you live in Virginia, there is a primary today. Polls close at 7pm, y'all. Go vote!

Who has two thumbs and just voted? This guy! Here's some analysis before the returns come in:

From Mother Jones Everyone Keeps Saying Tuesday’s Virginia Election Is About Bernie and Hillary. It’s Not That Simple.

Let’s get this out of the way: Contrary to what you may have read on Twitter, neither Hillary Clinton nor Bernie Sanders is seeking the Democratic nomination for governor of Virginia. Tuesday’s primary between Lt. Gov. Ralph Northam and former Rep. Tom Perriello is less a referendum on what happened in last year’s presidential contest than it is the first in a long series of debates that will play out over the next two years.
...
From the perspective of progressives, both Northam and Perriello have blemishes on their records that make them imperfect fits for the roles that have been ascribed to them. Northam, ostensibly the party man, voted for George W. Bush twice and said at a debate ahead of his 2011 re-election to the state Senate that health care is a “privilege.” (Northam now calls it a “right.”) Perriello received an “A”-rating from the NRA as a congressman and voted for the anti-abortion “Stupak amendment” to the Affordable Care Act. (He has since renounced the Stupak vote and condemned the NRA.)

Finding deeper meaning in the Virginia Democratic primary is difficult because politics is complicated. The fact that Perriello caught fire after entering a race whose outcome seemed to pre-ordained speaks to the anxieties and unrest among Democrats. The fact that Northam might still hold on tell us something, too—about the strength of national mood swings in places where Democrats are already doing pretty well.

From the WaPo's Daily 202, Leftward lurch in Democratic gubernatorial primary reflects the transformation of Virginia:

With polls showing Northam and Perriello running neck-and-neck, what’s been most striking in the homestretch is how far left both have come. While some of the posturing is certainly about trying to ride the wave of resistance to Donald Trump and appeal to base voters in a low-turnout primary, the journeys both have taken over the past decade tell a larger story about how much the state of Virginia has transformed, from red to purple to maybe even slightly blue.
...
Politicians are going to pander. That’s what politicians do. But even if Perriello and Northam are putting their fingers in the wind, all these explicit expressions of liberalism show which way they think the wind is blowing in Virginia. Until very recently, serious Democrats who wanted to win statewide – even ones looking to get a leg up in competitive primaries – were hyper-cautious when answering questions about hot-buttons like guns, abortion, gay rights and drugs. They certainly didn’t bring those issues up – unless it was to break with the Democratic Party as a way of signaling cultural conservatism.

In 2013, Gov. Terry McAuliffe (D) foreshadowed the dynamic in this year’s primary by talking up his support for reproductive rights and gun control. He didn’t even have a challenger from his left, but he was trying to gin up the base and mobilize unmarried women who don’t typically vote in off-year elections. It worked.

This was a sea change from 2001, when Mark Warner won the governorship by focusing on red corners of the state as much as the D.C. ‘burbs. He ran as a “radical centrist,” sponsored a NASCAR team, used bluegrass music for his campaign theme song and expressed support for Bush in commercials that ran after Sept. 11.

From 538 What To Watch For In Virginia’s Gubernatorial Primaries:

Moreover, the main dividing line between Northam and Perriello isn’t really left vs. right. The polls generally show that very liberal and moderate Democrats are voting similarly. The Change Research poll had Clinton backers making up the vast majority of both Northam and Perriello supporters. That’s consistent with Clinton’s large win in the primary last year.
...
The bottom line is that the outcome in today’s Democratic primary will likely tell more about local Virginia politics than anything about the Trump administration or the nation as a whole.

posted by peeedro at 10:00 AM on June 13, 2017 [25 favorites]

Elise Viebeck and Ben Terris/WaPo (6/6): Inside the heaving, jostling Capitol media mob: ‘We are one tripped senator away’ from disaster.

If a senator trips, he can pull himself up by his own bootstraps.
posted by Faint of Butt at 10:02 AM on June 13, 2017 [54 favorites]

I expect we won't see McCain even being "concerned" all that much anymore: Cindy McCain to get role in Trump State Department
posted by zombieflanders at 10:03 AM on June 13, 2017 [18 favorites]

It's true that the Capitol was, by all accounts, approaching a safety hazard in some places. However, this was done by unilaterally imposing draconian restrictions (Sen. Klobuchar, the ranking member of the Rules Committee wasn't informed until she read about it online, she was in fact told this wouldn't happen) where there isn't even a contact at the Rules Committee to approve interview requests.

There are plenty of reasonable ways in which safety could have been addressed by restricting interviews in particular locations or otherwise taming the chaos. That's not what happened here. This is all about ensuring that there aren't camera shots of Senators running away from reporters so the Republicans can force through the AHCA in secret without looking cowardly.
posted by zachlipton at 10:04 AM on June 13, 2017 [31 favorites]

The warning was dire: “Collectively, the press following Senators have become large and aggressive. We are concerned someone may get hurt.”

That's funny, a large and aggressive press sounds great to me.
posted by The Gaffer at 10:04 AM on June 13, 2017 [37 favorites]

Rosenstein testified that he is the only one allowed to fire Mueller and he will not do it unless for actual cause, in writing, no matter who tells him to. He's told Graham that Mueller has not given him any reason as of today.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:06 AM on June 13, 2017 [19 favorites]

Sure, but they mean it more in the paparazzi sense. If we're going to have large groups chasing elected representatives around with no real end goal in mind, I'd really rather they have pitchforks and torches and be out for blood instead of just hunting sound bites.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 10:06 AM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Collectively, the press following Senators have become large and aggressive. We are concerned someone may get hurt.

I think he was talking about protecting the press, Montana and all.
posted by RolandOfEld at 10:07 AM on June 13, 2017

I faxed my Dem Senators to let them know I expect them to break the no-camera-interviews rule every day and that I will interpret adherence to the rule as approval of the rule, regardless of whatever statements they make to the contrary.
posted by melissasaurus at 10:08 AM on June 13, 2017 [53 favorites]

Assuming Trump abides by federal regulations and wants Rosenstein to fire Mueller (which could of course be obstruction of justice, but let's ignore that), and Rosenstein refuses, Lawfare explains what happens next:

If Rosenstein resigns, that raises a question of who becomes the acting attorney general. Succession in the Department is, to a point, outlined by statute: where the attorney general and deputy attorney general are unable, the associate attorney general “shall act” as attorney general. Otherwise the attorney general “may designate” the solicitor general and the assistant attorneys general, “in further order of succession,” to act as attorney general. That means it could go down the line until an assistant attorney general did not resign and instead carried out the President’s order. (Succession is complicated by the fact that, after Rosenstein, there are only two other confirmed officials in DOJ: Associate Attorney General Rachel Brand, and Acting Assistant Attorney General for the National Security Division Dana Boente, who was previously confirmed to be the U.S. Attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia. A tad more on this below.) If the officers after Brand also resign, then an executive order on DOJ succession recently promulgated by Trump would control. (This barely noticed executive order would potentially assume great significance if Trump fires Mueller.)
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:11 AM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Here's the Executive Order PROVIDING AN ORDER OF SUCCESSION WITHIN THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:12 AM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

I had no trouble getting through both to that troll Burr and his insipid co-conspirator Tillis this morning here in NC.

Let us tie up their phone lines telling them we oppose what they are trying to do.
posted by winna at 10:13 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

It's interesting to consider just how many DOJ attorneys Trump could fire before somebody stops him. Maybe we should start a betting pool.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:13 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Do you know how a swamp was traditionally drained? I mean, traditional as: in the USA, during the time since dynamite became a commonly available civil engineering tool.

You get as much 60% nitroglycerin straight dynamite as is needed to put half a stick about every 18" to 2' in a line wherever you need your drainage ditches. Then, walk through your desired ditch line, spud a hole and place a half stick of dynamite down into the muck at about the desired bottom level of your ditch at the selected interval.

You only need attach a blasting cap to the charge at the center of the line... The rest will detonate in a chain sympathetically, if the ground is saturated with water and you have chosen a sufficiently close spacing. A test shot is advisable, different soils and degrees of saturation will vary the effective interval.

It is great fun to watch a ditch being "shot" (at a safe distance), and far faster/cheaper/lower equipment costs than using heavy equipment. Just a guy in hip boots, a pointed stick, a case of dynamite and one blasting cap + fuse. No diesel, dump trucks, excavators, operators & etc.

Every time I hear the euphemisim "drain the swamp" for changes to our system of governance and the various denizens thereof, I think about some parallels to this civil engineering technique...

1: It will be really noisy.
2. All kinds of crap will be flying, and you better be ready to duck.
3. Everyone nearby WILL be disturbed.
4. Good chance for fatalities and other unintended consequences.
5. It's probably illegal under federal law as well as in any state even pretending to have environmental protection laws on the books.
6. If some inexperienced, enthusiastic greenhorns who has not measured the ground and thought things through carefully try a big project, it quite likely will be a failure.

Feel free to add to this list, all can play!

Let the flames (and quick assumptions regarding my personal politics) begin.
posted by bert2368 at 10:14 AM on June 13, 2017 [72 favorites]

I would swear that multiple people have semi-publicly stated that Ryan very definitely wants to be President.

My own personal Ryan suspicion is that, if you look at modern elections, it's very rare for someone to go directly from the House to the Presidency - the voters and/or the party apparatus seem to think that politicians need a little "seasoning" as a Senator or Governor or VP or Cabinet member before taking a shot at the highest office. So Ryan's plan was to serve some terms in the House, and right about now-ish, when he's in his late 40's/early 50's, depending on who's vulnerable and/or retiring, take a whack at a Senate seat or Governorship, serve a term or two there. Which would have set him up for Presidential runs in his late 50's/early 60's, pretty much in his prime (for white dude President definition of "prime.")

His reluctance to take the Speaker position was at least partly because it derailed this plan, because it makes him too visibly contentious a figure too "early." (As in, now he can't just coast on the narrative of "Brainy Republican wunderkind"; he's in the news daily as "guy who can't wrangle his own party members." Which is not a good look for someone shooting for a Senate seat or Governor.) Sliding into the Presidency via impeachment may well look to him like his best if not only shot at the office for the foreseeable future.
posted by soundguy99 at 10:15 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

The party who has no sense of shame or self-decency is going to impeach the guy who happily signs their agenda into law?

Exactly. The day Trump becomes an impediment to the Republicans is the day impeachment is even a possibility. Until then Trump could relocate the Oval Office to the Kremlin and livestream himself murdering prostitutes every day and all we'd hear from Republicans is how the liberal media is unfairly smearing the President.
posted by Sangermaine at 10:17 AM on June 13, 2017 [18 favorites]

In context, Pelosi clearly means 'will do something so flagrantly in violation of the Constitution and/or good governance that impeachment will become a bipartisan issue without the Democrats needing to fight terribly hard for it, and/or the Mueller investigation will reveal the same.'

Something like openly bragging about committing sexual assault, calling for Russia to hack into his opponent's email on national television, or firing the head of the FBI investigation into his own electoral malfeasance?

We need to stop treating the House GOP members like they are just flawed human beings with some atrophied sense of shame that will magically regrow if we just give them a chance. They'll happily support literally any crazy, immoral, criminal act the president commits, as long as they get their tax breaks passed. For any member of the public to believe otherwise is naive; for Nancy fricking Pelosi to argue that the GOP will suddenly find their missing conscience if Trump goes juuuuust a little bit further is enough for me to question her own cognitive function.
posted by Mayor West at 10:19 AM on June 13, 2017 [52 favorites]

From that executive order:

Section 1. Order of Succession. Subject to the provisions of section 2 of this order, the following officers, in the order listed, shall act as and perform the functions and duties of the office of Attorney General during any period in which the Attorney General, the Deputy Attorney General, the Associate Attorney General, and any officers designated by the Attorney General pursuant to 28 U.S.C. 508 to act as Attorney General, have died, resigned, or otherwise become unable to perform the functions and duties of the office of Attorney General [...]

(a) United States Attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia;

(b) United States Attorney for the Eastern District of North Carolina; and

(c) United States Attorney for the Northern District of Texas.

That seems weirdly specific. Why those three in particular?
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:20 AM on June 13, 2017 [12 favorites]

Threat of 'Bathroom Bill' Costs Texas Another Major Convention: The 7,000-member Professional Convention Management Association was scheduled to have their "Super Bowl of Convention" is Houston, but cited the debate over transgender bathroom use as a reason to cancel it. That's sparking fears of a downturn in future conventions.

"If the meeting planners are not coming here, that's likely to have an impact on the conventions that these people book," Smith explains.

posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:21 AM on June 13, 2017 [53 favorites]

Here's the Executive Order PROVIDING AN ORDER OF SUCCESSION WITHIN THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE

Hunh. That one has this tacked on at the end:

Sec. 3. Revocation of Executive Order. Executive Order 13775 of February 9, 2017, is revoked.

Which ordered the following Order of Succession at DOJ:

Attorney General
Deputy Attorney General
Associate Attorney General
United States Attorney for the District of Columbia
United States Attorney for the Northern District of Illinois
United States Attorney for the Western District of Missouri

And that's become:

Attorney General
Deputy Attorney General
Associate Attorney General
United States Attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia
United States Attorney for the Eastern District of North Carolina
United States Attorney for the Northern District of Texas

I suppose it's worth looking at who the US Attorneys in spots 4-6 are.
posted by notyou at 10:22 AM on June 13, 2017 [24 favorites]

> It is great fun to watch a ditch being "shot" (at a safe distance), and far faster/cheaper/lower equipment costs than using heavy equipment.

Yep, checks out.
posted by klarck at 10:24 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

Pelosi is right on not pushing full steam ahead with articles of impeachment from a Dem rep right now, but she doesn't really address the reasons clearly. It's the "you come at the king, you best not miss" principle, you file articles of impeachment that go nowhere and it vindicates him in the eyes of his supporters and reverses the slow bleeding off of his base as they rally around him. On top of that, a failed run at impeachment would leave him feeling bulletproof: goodbye investigation, goodbye remaining norms and laws constraining his behavior, the political capital to confront either would have been spent prematurely. That trigger can't be pulled until the votes are there in Congress, and it's going to take more investigation to get there. And even then, even after a great 2018, this will require some Republicans to do the right thing, so it's not something to hold your breath over... but that doesn't change the calculus for trying to impeach too early, it just means we're between a rock and a hard place in this moment. Still have to keep your powder dry on impeachment to have the option available when an opportunity to really do it right presents itself, politically you only get one shot.
posted by jason_steakums at 10:25 AM on June 13, 2017 [98 favorites]

Congress will not block Trump. The courts will, and are. The constitutional crisis will be when Trump/Congress ignore a SCOTUS decision. I would not be at all surprised if we don't see that within a year.
posted by jetsetsc at 10:27 AM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

That seems weirdly specific. Why those three in particular?

I assume it is basically a list of the biggest racists in order?
posted by Artw at 10:27 AM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

> Yep, checks out.

Kept waiting for Bugs Bunny to pop out at the end.
posted by brentajones at 10:28 AM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

notyou: "I suppose it's worth looking at who the US Attorneys in spots 4-6 are."

For your reference, here are the current DoJ pages for these US attorneys:

United States Attorney for the District of Columbia: Channing D. Phillips
United States Attorney for the Northern District of Illinois: Joel R. Levin
United States Attorney for the Central District of California: Sandra R. Brown

United States Attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia: Dana Boente
United States Attorney for the Eastern District of North Carolina: John Stuart Bruce
United States Attorney for the Northern District of Texas: John R. Parker
posted by mhum at 10:31 AM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

I see Ryan more as the idiot soldier who plucked the nickel crosses out of the walls of the keep

Deep cut, but you're right. It should have been perfectly obvious from the construction that the keep was built to keep evil in.
posted by maxsparber at 10:31 AM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

Who appointed each of those?
posted by Dashy at 10:31 AM on June 13, 2017

Also, if things really heat up with the investigation, I would not be surprised to see congressional Republicans making noises to bait the Democrats into a premature impeachment process that won't work, because there's a point where it's getting real bad behind the scenes but the investigation isn't completely ready for prime time where a move like that could easily work for the Republicans. I hope the congressional Dems are keeping their heads on a swivel about this.
posted by jason_steakums at 10:33 AM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

That seems weirdly specific. Why those three in particular?

I'm not sure.

VAED: Dana Boente, an Obama nominee who Trump kept on. He was Acting AG for 10 days after Trump fired Yates, then Acting Deputy AG for a couple of months until Rosenstein took over.

NCED: John Stuart Bruce, an Obama appointee serving as interim US attorney for the district.

TXND: John Parker, another Obama appointee.

I suppose it's worth looking at who the US Attorneys in spots 4-6 are.

DC (confirmation pending): Channing Phillips (Obama nominee)
ILND (acting): Joel Levin (Trump nominee)
CACD (acting): Sandra Brown (Trump nominee)

So I can't make heads or tails of it, not knowing anything about their personal politics or prosecutorial priorities. I suppose it's worth noting that the EO trades DC, IL, and CA for VA, NC, and TX, which generally seems like a rightward shift, but it also trades out two Trump nominees for Obama holdovers.
posted by jedicus at 10:33 AM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

NCED: John Stuart Bruce, an Obama appointee serving as interim US attorney for the district.

TXND: John Parker, another Obama appointee.

Are they? There's an ad-blocked Dallas News story that says

Lisa Slimak, spokeswoman for John Parker, the U.S. attorney for the Northern District of Texas, said Parker was not affected by the order because he is not a presidential appointee.

Parker took office as interim U.S. attorney in December 2014 after Sarah Saldaña left to head up the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency. A permanent replacement has yet to be selected, a process that can take years.

posted by Etrigan at 10:35 AM on June 13, 2017

FWIW:

>: Hunh. That one has this tacked on at the end:
Sec. 3. Revocation of Executive Order. Executive Order 13775 of February 9, 2017, is revoked

Feb 9, 2017: Federal Judges Refuse to Reinstate Trump's Immigration Ban -- A Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals panel unanimously upheld a restraining order blocking the federal government from enforcing the president’s controversial ban.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:35 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Omg! It's maxsparber! I'm happy to see you here again--your posts always rock :).
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 10:36 AM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

I was called back by somebody removing nickle from a cross.
posted by maxsparber at 10:40 AM on June 13, 2017 [76 favorites]

Are they? [Obama nominees]

That's a fair point. Bruce was appointed in January 2016 as the Acting US Attorney for that district.

Parker is a non-presidentially appointed US Attorney, but that was at least during the Obama administration.

And apparently I should have used the term appointee, not nominee. Not sure why they're called appointees if they have to be confirmed by the Senate, but there you have it.
posted by jedicus at 10:42 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

FYI, I called Sen Collins' office this morning about the ACA and got a particularly chatty staffer (also got right through, which is a problem).

Staffer wanted me to know:
- Collins has been "very vocal" that any replacement for the ACA should not deny people coverage
- Collins is not part of the group working on 'the bill the media is covering' but is working on an alternate bill
- No ACA bill has been sent from the Senate to be scored by the CBO yet
- When I asked, he admitted that Collins has not seen the other bill, but noted that "nobody has, because there isn't a bill yet"

I pushed back against every point, and made it clear I expect the ACA to stand as is (or Medicare for All would be fine as well) but I thought it was interesting that these are the talking points they're pushing. Her office apparently wants very much for her constits to see her as actively working on the problem. Not sure I buy that.
posted by anastasiav at 10:52 AM on June 13, 2017 [35 favorites]

Trump has now cracked 60% disapproval.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:00 AM on June 13, 2017 [47 favorites]

Collins knows Maine is purple enough that she's toast if she's seen as a hardcore Trumpite, but she's only a "moderate" inasmuch as it doesn't cost the GOP any votes. When it matters, e.g. the Gorsuch nomination or throwing bullshit at James Comey in the intelligence hearing, she toes the party line.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:01 AM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Is this "alternate bill" a common way for the senate to do business?
posted by R a c h e l at 11:02 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Collins is not part of the group working on 'the bill the media is covering' but is working on an alternate bill

Ah, so she's working on a different secret bill that we aren't allowed to know anything about. How silly of you to not know the details of her double secret bill!
posted by diogenes at 11:02 AM on June 13, 2017 [19 favorites]

Golden State Warriors unanimously decline White House visit, per reports
Less than 24 hours after winning the 2017 NBA Finals on Monday night, the Warriors unanimously voted to decline the expected White House invitation, according to several reports including one by CNBC analyst Josh Brown.
posted by Atom Eyes at 11:05 AM on June 13, 2017 [57 favorites]

I just sent a fax about the "health care plan" to my representatives using Resistbot on Facebook. It's so easy. You just send a message to it saying "resist" and it walks you through. I have a hard time making phone calls, but faxes are also effective, I understand. I need to add this to my routine.
posted by apricot at 11:05 AM on June 13, 2017 [16 favorites]

Small piece of good news dept.: Louisiana lawmakers have passed a package of bills to reduce criminal sentences, including removing mandatory minimums under some circumstances, expanding parole options, and providing alternatives to prison for nonviolent offenders.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:07 AM on June 13, 2017 [29 favorites]

High five to all the Senator Toomey callers in the thread. I'm glad you're all getting busy signals because I got right through to the staffers in the Pittsburgh office and that always makes me worry. The staffer actually argued with me about a few points instead of quietly talking down my information and I thought "Son, you must be new here."

I referred to the Toomey healthcare statement from the previous thread (thanks!) and played the 'small business owner card'. The person on the other line took pains to emphasize that the AHCA bill had nothing to do with the Senate bill. I pushed back that they will almost certainly be related and that I am livid at as a constituent that the text of the bill has not yet been released. He said that the bill would be out next week. I remarked that I'd heard that there would be a vote by the 30th and that would not leave much time for commentary. He replied that there was nothing that said the vote would be that soon, but I know how recess works.

"I'll pass your comments on to the Senator."

It was probably a waste of a conversation, but thanks for the talking points, Metafilter! I'm calling back again tomorrow!
posted by Alison at 11:07 AM on June 13, 2017 [35 favorites]

The administration has so thoroughly broken my brain that after I read that Trump wanted to fire Mueller after Mueller brought on a money laundering expert. My first thought was "well, that must have been what they were doing then." My second thought was "what if it's a feint to get them to really focus on money laundering and make the investigators ignore something else!?!"
posted by drezdn at 11:11 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

- Collins has been "very vocal" that any replacement for the ACA should not deny people coverage

They're going to cling to this dodge like a life preserver. It must be slapped down every time they say it.

Nobody is going to be "denied" coverage. Ordinary people with preexisting conditions will be completely priced out of it. That's functionally the same thing.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:13 AM on June 13, 2017 [73 favorites]

Esme Cribb/TPM has video and more reporting:

Rosenstein: I Wouldn’t Obey Trump Order To Fire Mueller Without ‘Good Cause’
posted by Room 641-A at 11:17 AM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

There's like 3 people in chat right now. Get in while the getting's good.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:19 AM on June 13, 2017

The C-SPAN feed of the Sessions hearing is up. Due to start in 10 minutes.
posted by zachlipton at 11:20 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Aw, maaan. Goodby productivity, hello DVT. CSPANman just predicted it would be three hours.
posted by Don Pepino at 11:20 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

My second thought was "what if it's a feint to get them to really focus on money laundering and make the investigators ignore something else!?!"

That would require a level of cognition that Trump has not yet displayed.

Trump's the little kid sitting at the table, looking nervous and sweating, who spontaneously shouts, "I didn't eat any cookies!"
posted by leotrotsky at 11:21 AM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Reminder, contextless livewatch reactions go in Chat, more substantive comments or contextful recaps here.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 11:21 AM on June 13, 2017 [8 favorites]

Sen. Pat Toomey (R-PA): 'Most of us are not paying any attention' to 'overblown' Trump, Russia investigation

"I have seen that (Sen.) Dianne Feinstein has stated to her credit -- liberal Democrat who has been on the intelligence committee for I don't know, for decades I think -- she has acknowledged that there is absolutely no evidence of any collusion anywhere," Toomey said on the Chris Stigall Show on WPHT radio. "(Sen.) Mark Warner has said, the Democrat from Virginia, has said the exact same thing. (Former FBI Director) James Comey told us at the hearing that the President himself is not the subject of investigation.

"That's because nobody has found any evidence that suggests that he should be the subject of an investigation. So, yeah, this is just wildly overblown and fortunately most of us are not paying any attention."

Here's the contact information for Senator Toomey's offices (or fax here).
posted by Doktor Zed at 11:23 AM on June 13, 2017 [17 favorites]

Christ, what an asshole.
posted by Old Kentucky Shark at 11:26 AM on June 13, 2017 [21 favorites]

I previously called you an apartheid regime....

I shared the sadness at the last speech of your former President/CiC which was magistral....educated.....hopeful

I JUST saw video of the circle jerk that was the cabinet meeting........

Apartheid SA has nothing on Trump, this is dictator level smarm..........

thank all the gods for Jim Matthis ..."Jim Mattis: I respect the troops a lot."

is he the ONLY one who will speak truth to power even indirectly?????

the frog boils....
posted by Wilder at 11:28 AM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

HOLY GOD WHAT A TOOLBAG
posted by joyceanmachine at 11:28 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Stephen King 2020: The Running Man
Stephen King 2020: Seal America's Fate Again
Stephen King 2020: Bringing America To Life, Whether You Like It or Not
Stephen King 2020: All Work and No Play Makes Jack a Dull Boy
Stephen King 2020: No, the Scary One is Spelled with a "V"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:29 AM on June 13, 2017 [17 favorites]

Respect to the Warriors but you know Trump is just going to say he wasn't going to invite them anyway.

You gotta let him extend the invitation first, then let the dis fly.
posted by elsietheeel at 11:30 AM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

This 1979 Stephen King novel is a chilling prediction of Donald Trump's rise

Who would Stephen King's running mate be? Anyone but Bachmann
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:31 AM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

Not to overly plug my own page, but the whole reason I made the 2016 Active Measures site was so that when someone says "There is no evidence..." I could say "Oh, yes there is." And hand them a whole stack of evidence with one URL.

I would be thrilled if other people use it that way too. Or copy and paste from it, or use it for talking points, or pull links from it, or whatever you want. I've been updating it as important pieces of the puzzle fall into place.

There is a LOT of evidence of a LOT of dangerous stuff.
posted by OnceUponATime at 11:31 AM on June 13, 2017 [93 favorites]

Just an update - the Senators are apparently delayed by a vote and the hearing has still not begun. Sessions is expected to testify for two and a half to three hours.
posted by winna at 11:32 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

CSPANman just predicted it would be three hours

Oh good lord. Is that human hours or elf hours?
posted by Room 641-A at 11:33 AM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

The Confederate General Babbles Before Congress . . .

Do you know how a swamp was traditionally drained? . . . dynamite . . .

If Sessions goes under, swapping one fake Confederate General for another, perhaps Trump will retain the services of General Augustus Mellon, who famously drained the swamp at Big Sur using a similar technique.

posted by Herodios at 11:36 AM on June 13, 2017

I don't expect much. I expect Session to lie and get caught. I expect more damaging revelations and equivocation which looks bad on TV.

What I don't expect is any immediate consequence. The GOP is now thoroughly entangled in the Russia matter from top to bottom. The white supremacist yearnings of the base make a Russia a beacon of hope. The lust for profits that lie just short of treason has made the careers for innumerable petty Manaforts and Flynns. The upper echelons of the party cannot allow politics to return to usual because the fictions which portrayed their depravity as virtue have been consumed in the passions that enervate Trumpism.

Sessions sits at the bizarre confluence of all these forces. He is an old school "the worst insult for a southern man is to be called racist" racist. He has dipped an dabbled in the deep well of opportunities that more patriotic citizens rejected as having smelled a bit too much of rope. Having been anointed in those waters, he was promoted from hick senator to Minority Hunter in Chief. Russia didn't even ask for anything from him (probably).

For Sessions, and the GOP as a whole, the cost is the mark of complicity. Spread so widely as it is, the weight is borne lightly.
posted by ethansr at 11:36 AM on June 13, 2017 [11 favorites]

Three human hours is going to be intolerable enough. Elf hours? It'll be the weekend before it's over.
posted by elsietheeel at 11:36 AM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

National Treasure Alexandra Petri, WaPo: 'I love you more, Mr. President": A Cabinet competition

In spite of seeing Lear at the Guthrie not four weeks ago, I didn't connect them to the Cabinet "meeting." This is brilliant.
posted by Mental Wimp at 11:39 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Just FYI - the Diamondbacks had an afternoon game yesterday, so McCain should be well rested.
posted by Elly Vortex at 11:40 AM on June 13, 2017 [28 favorites]

I personally feel blessed to be able to CHEW KEEBLER MINT COVFEFE (TM).

Also available in RACIST, OBSTRUCTIONIST, and YOU'RE LATE FOR YOUR TRASH FIRE JEFF.
posted by saysthis at 11:41 AM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

I don't mean to chatfilterize, but is it just me, or does McCain.... not look well at all? I wonder what's up with him, especially what with how he came off at the Comey hearing.
posted by un petit cadeau at 11:42 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

I haven't checked, but maybe the Executive Order regarding Attorney General order of succession is derived from seniority/duration of service, rather than nefarious political stuff?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:43 AM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

The Trump Disapproval Crocodile continues to grow teeth (SL Twitter image, worth your click, sorry)
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:44 AM on June 13, 2017 [31 favorites]

hoping to see kamala harris verbally suplex the evil, treasonous little racist man today
(or physically, im not picky)
posted by entropicamericana at 11:44 AM on June 13, 2017 [19 favorites]

sessions perjured himself at his confirmation hearing right? and there were no consequences. So it's hard to expect that he will do anything except lie or plead the 5th except to field softball questions from the republicans.
i fully expect this testimony to be theater in service of the"there's nothing to be seen here" narrative the trumpists are pushing.
The best we can hope for is sessions saying something that can later be used by Mueller to show the perjury.
posted by OHenryPacey at 11:44 AM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Streaming locations seem to be inconsistent. The hearing has started but I wasn't aware until I changed my feed source.
posted by elsietheeel at 11:45 AM on June 13, 2017

> Rosenstein testified that he is the only one allowed to fire Mueller and he will not do it unless for actual cause, in writing, no matter who tells him to. He's told Graham that Mueller has not given him any reason as of today.

"Good night, ~~Westley~~ Bob. Good work. Sleep well. I'll most likely fire you in the morning."
posted by Fiberoptic Zebroid and The Hypnagogic Jerks at 11:46 AM on June 13, 2017 [11 favorites]

Youtube streaming link from ABC News
posted by tonycpsu at 11:47 AM on June 13, 2017

Burr just said that he wants the questions to focus on the Russia investigation rather than taking partisan shots.

Pity I can't believe him.
posted by winna at 11:48 AM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Yep, checks out.

And now I'm watching too many videos of people blowing up ditches. And perhaps appropriately the linked video is possibly work for the Keystone Pipeline.

Also, I know I'm not quite right in the head when the first thing I think of when I see these videos if it would be possible to surf or dirtboard the wave of flying, heaving dirt.

Speaking of flying, heaving dirt - Burr just opened the hearing.
posted by loquacious at 11:48 AM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Warner informing Sessions that they expect his cooperation and availability going forward is a good sign. This isn't the kind of thing that's going to get cleared up in an hour of open testimony.
posted by tonycpsu at 11:51 AM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

So, I'm not sure I'm ready to throw Burr under the bus until he actually demonstrates complicity.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:51 AM on June 13, 2017

I can't believe nobody has built a giant Bugs Bunny to pop out of the ground at the end of one of those ditch blasting runs.
posted by contraption at 11:51 AM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

So, I'm not sure I'm ready to throw Burr under the bus until he actually demonstrates complicity.

DeVos paid for his re-election. Also, he's been my congressman and senator for nearly fifteen years and I know he's a snake.
posted by winna at 11:53 AM on June 13, 2017 [16 favorites]

HUGE PARTY IN CHAT IT'S LIKE 1999 IRC IN THERE.
posted by loquacious at 11:55 AM on June 13, 2017 [25 favorites]

Burr has called the panel int session--heh. Burr's opener thanks Session and outlines the purpose of the hearing--Russia investigation and budget concerns for intelligence methods. He notes that some of the content will be classified, but notes that the American people need to hear the contents of some of the Intelligence Committee hearings in open session.

Burr hopes that Sessions will clarify his role in the Trump campaign with regard to Russia, his role in firing Comey, his meetings with Russian agents, and his role in Trumps security policy team during the election. Burr hopes the Senators will ask questions regarding Russia, rather than taking "partisan or political" shots. He notes, though, that the committee is working as a bipartisan force.

Warner's opening statement is harder hitting. He is expressing concern at the process that has led Sessions to the committee. Warner also notes that Sessions should be in front of the Appropriations and Judiciary committees. Warner believes this hearing to just be a beginning. He expects a commitment from Session to cooperate with all future requests.

Warner is onto the subject. He is asking about the campaign, noting his early and fanatic support. He notes Sessions' role as a close advisor to Trump and the question regarding his role in the Trump campaign. Warner is noting Sessions false statements to Congress and how those statements have been shown to be false. Warner has brought up the alleged third meeting between Kislyak and Sessions. He expects Sessions to turn over relevant documents.

Warner is now talking about Comey's firing and the possible role of Sessions in the former Director's firing. He's noting Comey's documentation of the meetings and his concern's about the firing. Warner notes that Trump confirmed his rationale as a Russia related. He noted that apparently Sessions left Comey and Trump alone. Warner also wants to know about Session's recusal in the Russia investigation and why he apparently participated in Comey's firing. He wants to know why Sessions is doing to prevent another Russian cyber attack against our elections. He's noting that administration officials have been unwilling to answer unclassified questions in front of Congress.

Sessions has been sworn in.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:55 AM on June 13, 2017 [45 favorites]

Sessions is going under oath now.
posted by winna at 11:55 AM on June 13, 2017

Sessions is warning the committee right now that he's not going to say anything at all. And he doesn't recall any meetings or conversations at the Mayflower Hotel. This whole thing is a waste of time if he's going to lie.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:57 AM on June 13, 2017 [19 favorites]

fun fact, his accent gets more cartoonish when he lies
posted by palomar at 11:57 AM on June 13, 2017 [22 favorites]

Jeffrey Beauregard "Stonewall" Sessions
posted by OHenryPacey at 11:59 AM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

I don't want to accent shame but why do old racists all sound like that?
posted by OverlappingElvis at 11:59 AM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

I dunno, palomar, it's hard for me because he sounds like one of my favorite uncles so it's a homey sound to me.

Maybe we could focus on him being a traitor and not the fact he didn't scrub all regional dialect from his speech like it was a shameful thing.
posted by winna at 11:59 AM on June 13, 2017 [35 favorites]

I don't want to accent shame

Then don't.
posted by gatorae at 12:00 PM on June 13, 2017 [30 favorites]

Beauregard's gonna try to gut it out by boldly denying anything.
posted by Mental Wimp at 12:00 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Sessions: "The suggestion that I participated in any collusion, that I was aware of any collusion... is an appalling and detestable lie."

Is there a name for this rhetorical dodge? One can participate in collusion without being aware of it. Hell, Trump participates in a whole bunch of terrible shit and I have no sense that he's aware of anything he's doing. But the "participated in" and "aware of" clauses here are juxtaposed almost as if he wants to leave the door open for having unknowingly colluded without perjuring himself.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:01 PM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

Couple deleted. Accent discussion stops here.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 12:01 PM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

Sessions: I used to be one of you. I USED TO BE ONE OF YOU! We're pals! Buddies for life! BFFs, right? Right??!! Just want to remind you all that we go way back. Waaay back, amirite? Yeah? Remember that one time? That was so much fun? You and me, together, as friends? Anyway, what was your question?
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:01 PM on June 13, 2017 [18 favorites]

Here's a copy of Sessions' opening remarks, if you prefer reading to listening.

And here's the Lawfare liveblog for the hearing.
posted by zachlipton at 12:02 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

His intonation and indignation sounds like Bill Clinton. I did NOT have sex with THAT woman!

In the words of Special Agent Dale Cooper: You're lying.
posted by elsietheeel at 12:04 PM on June 13, 2017 [8 favorites]

Here's a copy of Sessions' opening remarks, if you prefer reading to listening.

Always.

Thank you.

posted by Herodios at 12:04 PM on June 13, 2017 [8 favorites]

@SethAbramson has a good live tweet thread here.
posted by sebastienbailard at 12:05 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Indignancy seems to point to duplicity.
posted by leotrotsky at 12:05 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

"that I was aware of any collusion"

This, plus his insistence that he knows nothing about the status of the investigation, and his introductory remarks about how terrible the Russian interference in our election is (we've come a long way from Republicans unanimously denying that Russia had anything to do with the DNC hacks!) and a couple of other little rhetorical flourishes along the way... It all makes me wonder if he's planning to throw someone else in the campaign -- maybe even Trump himself -- under the bus.
posted by OnceUponATime at 12:05 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

It all makes me wonder if he's planning to throw someone else in the campaign -- maybe even Trump himself -- under the bus.

That'd be smart.
posted by leotrotsky at 12:07 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Sessions is insisting that the decision to fire Comey had nothing to do with Russia and was just part of his general oversight of DOJ personnel -- meaning he now officially joins the list of GOP hacks who've decided that if they just pretend really hard that the Lester Holt interview never happened, it'll go away.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:08 PM on June 13, 2017 [49 favorites]

Sessions says that after Comey spoke to him about improper communications between the FBI and the White House, he encouraged Comey to follow the procedures. He noticeably doesn't say he encouraged Trump to follow the proper procedures or to stop creeping on Comey.
posted by zachlipton at 12:08 PM on June 13, 2017 [11 favorites]

Sessions is very indignant and is categorically denying any wrongdoing. He's now segued into a spirited defense of the President's agenda, which is bizarre. [real]

He, too, is determined to find the real killer. [fake]
posted by winna at 12:08 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

@emptywheel is live-tweeting the proceedings.

Sample: Shorter Jeff Sessions: It doesn't matter that I lied about meeting Russians because nothing improper happened in the ones I lied about.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:08 PM on June 13, 2017 [38 favorites]

So...did Sessions just un-recuse himself?!?! He said he recused himself from campaign investigations but not procedural DOJ stuff or something.

So did this happen?
posted by saysthis at 12:09 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Now he's citing overdose deaths and the murder rate. Chewbacca defense can't be too far off.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:09 PM on June 13, 2017 [18 favorites]

If only power plants could be fueled by indignation. This hearing alone would put us over the top of our Paris Agreement goals.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:10 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Sessions is making his opening statement. He claims to acknowledge the seriousness of Russian interference. He says he's going to address several issues. He notes he will invoke executive privilege.

He says He had no private meetings nor did he recall any meeting at the Mayflower Hotel. He noted that he attended an event, but says he does not recall any conversations with Kislyak. He's got a memory full of holes. He doesn't think him being in the room with Kislyak is important. He categorically denies having discussions with Russian officials about interfering in the campaign. He is offended that he might be accused of collusion or that he did anything to undermine the democratic process of the country.

He claims his response to Franken was to a "long rambling question". His responses are basically joke. He's claiming he was responding to allegations that surrogates had communicated with Russians, but that any meetings were part of his duties as a Senator. He claims that nothing improper happened in the meeting.

He's now explaining his recusal. He claims to have no knowledge of the Russian investigation and that he does not even read the public information on it. He notes that regs require him to recuse himself from investigation a campaign of which he was a part. He thinks that it is "absurd" that a single recusal from an issue would preclude him from managing the DoJ or otherwise cast doubt on his ability to be neutral in such matters.

Sessions is noting Comey's concern over proper communication between FBI and WH. Sessions claims to have noted Comey's concerns. LMAO, he's claiming he has a great reputation as a public service due to his racist actions as a US Attorney and Senator. He doesn't understand how shitty his reputation is with half the country.

He's throwing out stats about opiate overdoses, the "murder rate", and other Putanist talking points about the problems in our country.

It's quite difficult to follow his disjointed, unpolished, and rambling statement. He's coming across as very angry and defensive at the start of the hearing. He's really bad at this task, in comparison to Jim Comey. His statement is an insult to all the people of this country.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:10 PM on June 13, 2017 [76 favorites]

Sample: Shorter Jeff Sessions: It doesn't matter that I lied about meeting Russians because nothing improper happened in the ones I lied about.

Oddly enough, he doesn't say what was discussed. Probably what kind of gift to get for a wedding.
posted by Mental Wimp at 12:11 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Do you know why overdose deaths are up? Because people are miserable. They're using drugs to escape from the horrific world you and and the Trump administration have given us. They're also using illegal drugs because the government is making it harder to access pain medication.
posted by elsietheeel at 12:11 PM on June 13, 2017 [35 favorites]

The Senate's reporting restrictions have been lifted, for now, after widespread outrage.
posted by zachlipton at 12:13 PM on June 13, 2017 [79 favorites]

Here's a copy of Sessions' opening remarks, if you prefer reading to listening.

Done.

Vacuous.

I move that it be used to line a parrot's cage for a month, shredded, and then entered into the record.

posted by Herodios at 12:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Sessions is repeatedly saying now that he "does not remember" the meeting happening, which to me, is a lot different from his opening statement where he basically accused his former colleagues of being terrible devils for even suggesting it happened.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [18 favorites]

Do you know why overdose deaths are up?

Also because lack of government oversight meant that doctors massive over-prescribed addictive opiates and the response of the government has been to prosecute the people who became addicted.
posted by maxsparber at 12:15 PM on June 13, 2017 [41 favorites]

Which I think is Sessions' plan for addicts too.
posted by maxsparber at 12:15 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Seems to me someone with such a shitty memory is a pretty bad fit to be the chief law enforcement officer and chief lawyer of the United States government.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:16 PM on June 13, 2017 [82 favorites]

*shudders* why did the Senate invite someone in the throes of marijuana addiction to take the floor? this is ghoulish.
posted by acidic at 12:17 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Something tells me that Comey's waiting for this and has the bomb ready. The bit in his testimony about expecting that Sessions was going to recuse and the info that would make his continued involvement "problematic" looks like bait now.
posted by azpenguin at 12:17 PM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

Sessions says that he never received any information about the Russian investigation from day one.
posted by winna at 12:17 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

"I was aware of any collusion"

FLASH: Nation's Top Law Enforcement Official "Unaware" of Illegal Activity Going On Right Under His Nose

posted by Herodios at 12:18 PM on June 13, 2017 [8 favorites]

Sessions is repeatedly saying now that he "does not remember" the meeting happening

Perhaps he's going for the Vincent Gigante defense?
posted by Sophie1 at 12:18 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

> FLASH: Nation's Top Law Enforcement Official "Unaware" of Illegal Activity Going On Right Under His Nose

Actually, just a bit behind and above the nose.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:19 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Also because lack of government oversight meant that doctors massive over-prescribed addictive opiates and the response of the government has been to prosecute the people who became addicted.

Yes but when we start prosecuting doctors for every mistake they make involving opiates we get people in pain crying out for relief because no doctor wants to deal with the DEA. A better solution is to all agree that people need opiates and people need help if they get addicted to opiates and nobody involves politically motivated prosecution for what is effectively a public health problem from a quite necessary evil.

In short: Opiates are a land of contrasts.
posted by Talez at 12:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [50 favorites]

Sessions says that he never received any information about the Russian investigation from day one.

Yeah, he's totally setting up his "I am shocked- shocked- to find that collusion with Russia is going on in here!" moment.
posted by OnceUponATime at 12:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

The Chair and Vice-Chair get ten minutes--the committee members get 5 minutes.

Burr wants to know if Sessions remembers that Kislyak was there. He doesn't remember meeting with Kislyak. He does know that he was there now. Sessions notes that there was in fact, a small private room set off from the main event. Sessions is detailing the staff who accompanied. Burr wants to know how Sessions saw his role there--as a Senator or campaign member. Sessions dodged, saying he was an "interested person". Burr asked whether Session had another meeting in the capacity of the campaign. Sessions claims he did not. He again is claiming he has no recollection of meeting Kislyak at the Mayflower.

Burr asks for the specific reasons for recusal. Sessions cites 28 CFR 48.2, admitting that he had a political or personal interest in a particular case. He acknowledges his role as a Trump advisor. He denies that he is a subject of the Russia investigation.

Burn asks whether his staff knew from the beginning if he would have to recuse himself. I think he's getting at why it took a month for Sessions to recuse himself. Burr suggests that the reason Comey said he'd believe Comey knew about the regs. Burr asks Sessions to make emails regarding the recusal available to the committee.

Sessions claims not to have had contact with Rober Mueller. Burr whether Sessions was aware of further discomfort on the part of Comey in relation to communication with Trump. Sessions notes it would inappropriate for a DoJ official to share information with a sitting President about an on-going investigate.

Burr asks about Trump's foreign policy team. Sessions says they met a couple of times, but that they weren't a team. He claims he never met at least one person on the team he supposedly assembled.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:21 PM on June 13, 2017 [26 favorites]

Nothing about Sessions' explanation for his recusal makes sense. He cites 28 CFR 45.2 as the reason he, of course, would have had to recuse himself, but Sessions didn't recuse himself until weeks after he was sworn in. Specifically, he recused himself just after it was reported he lied about another meeting with Kislyak. If it was just a foregone conclusion because of the regulation, he would have been prepared to recuse himself from day 1, not waiting until it was revealed he lied. And it's in conflict with Comey's testimony that there was some kind of classified reason why he thought Sessions would have to recuse himself; the regulation sure as heck wasn't classified.
posted by zachlipton at 12:22 PM on June 13, 2017 [28 favorites]

Sessions just sidestepped that Comey/Trump question and then tried to drag Obama into it. Comey met with Obama twice in 8 years.

And he's already being openly hostile in response to questions he doesn't like.
posted by elsietheeel at 12:22 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Sessions just seriously said it's not unusual, per se, for a DOJ official to have a private meeting with the President -- citing Comey's meetings with Trump as evidence.

Are you kidding me.
posted by uncleozzy at 12:22 PM on June 13, 2017 [64 favorites]

I'm sure his indigant martyr-y, put-upon, wah-you-guys-used-to-be-my-friends attitude plays well on Fox News and for others already inclined to believe or at least defend this creature, but goddamn it comes off as a purposeful tactic rather than earnest.
posted by gatorae at 12:22 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Sessions is trying to refuse to say he would not take action to have Mueller removed. He finally said he 'wouldn't think it would be appropriate for him to do'.
posted by winna at 12:24 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Rosenstein testified that he is the only one allowed to fire Mueller and he will not do it unless for actual cause,

Keep in mind that when Trump asked Rosenstein for cause to fire Comey that Rosenstein said "Yes, sir! Right away, sir!" and handed Trump a letter the next morning.
posted by JackFlash at 12:24 PM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

Sessions appears to be taking the Vassbinder approach to eating up Warner's time for questions.
posted by uncleozzy at 12:24 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

I expect we won't see McCain even being "concerned" all that much anymore: Cindy McCain to get role in Trump State Department

I'm choosing to translate anything coming from the Trump White House as though it came from a medieval chronicler.

Thus:

"Now in the first year of the reign of Donald I his counselors brought him news that Lord McCain was fomenting dissent with his reign, expressing discontent in every public place. And so he was ordered to bring his wife to court, and Lady McCain remained as surety for his good behavior." [fake, for now]
posted by corb at 12:24 PM on June 13, 2017 [67 favorites]

And here we go. It's "claim executive privilege without using the words 'executive privilege' time.

Sessions has a bunch of mumbo-jumbo about how he won't talk about anything with the President because of the "co-equal branches," but he's not claiming executive privilege (because that privilege belongs to the President). It's just making up a reason to not answer questions out of thin air.
posted by zachlipton at 12:25 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Remember that old classic hit "I Don't Recall" by Ronnie Reagan & The Tone Deafs? Looks like it's getting a cover performance by Jefferson Beauregard Sessions.
posted by azpenguin at 12:25 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Sessions doesn't "believe in bringing cabinet members down for interminable hearings", he sez to the committee.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:26 PM on June 13, 2017 [67 favorites]

So Sessions has invoked a nonexistent privilege that is basically "The first rule of being Attorney General to the President is you don't talk about being Attorney General to the President."
posted by gatorae at 12:26 PM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

Warner: Are you denying that anyone else moved you into that ridiculous position overnight?
Sessions: I did it all on my own.
Warner: You had no help getting up there? Not even from the parents?
Sessions: If anyone touched me I would lose my magic.
posted by T.D. Strange at 12:28 PM on June 13, 2017 [30 favorites]

This is orthogonal and petty, but I can't be the only gen-x aged person enjoying watching Sessions twist because of all the stupid DARE ads on arcade games, forcing you to see his smarmy message and statement and signature every time you wanted to play Smash TV or something. I mean, above and beyond the whole Southern Strategy and drug war.
posted by loquacious at 12:32 PM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

See I would totally use the "i don't recall" defense if I were ever under oath.. but of course, I have a well-known history of having a terrible memory, and of being regularly under the influence of psychoactive substances, in amounts which would normally incapacitate mere mortals.

So my point is, I have an excuse, well documented. What's this guy's excuse for not remembering? it's convenient for him not to, is what I'm saying.
posted by some loser at 12:32 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Governance via whargarrbl
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:32 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

Warner asks whether they can count on Sessions to reappear before the Intel committee. Sessions claims it's not useful for cabinet members to be in front of committees repeatedly.

Warner ask about Sessions confidence in Mueller. Session claims to have confidence in Mueller, but refuses to discuss hypotheticals. Sessions does not know whether Trump has confidence in Mueller. Session claims he will not take actions tohave Mueller removed. Warner had to press him on it.

Warner asks whether there have been conversations about Presidential pardons regarding people involved in the Russia affair. He's invoking DoJ policy to dodge the question, but claims he is not invoking executive privilege. He claims there are DoJ policies that prevent him from disclosing discussions about pardons, even if they don't involve the President*.

Warner moves on to Session's agreement with Rosenstein's memo about Comey not running the FBI properly. Sessions claims not to have given Comey any feedback about his performance as FBI director. Sessions said he and Rosenstein agreed they wanted a fresh start at the FBI, but that a fresh start in the middle of an investigation is problematic.

Warner brings up the APril 27th meeting. He was at chair of Trump's foreign policy committee at the Mayflower. Sessions says he does not remember whether he or Kushner had any conversations with Kislyak. Every question about other meeting with Russian officials prompts Sessions to claim that he "can't recall" any other meetings. Sessions does remembering part of the small VIP meeting.

Warner references Comey's testimony regarding Sessions leaving him alone with Trump. Sessions remembers departing and seeing Comey and Trump talking. He says that Comey expressed concern the day after. Sessions says the FBI Director meeting with the President is not problematic per se. Sessions says he affirmed Comey's concerned, but noted that Comey did not give him details about the meeting.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:33 PM on June 13, 2017 [24 favorites]

Remember that old classic hit "I Don't Recall" by Ronnie Reagan & The Tone Deafs? Looks like it's getting a cover performance by Jefferson Beauregard Sessions.

My favorite version will always be Total Recall by Alberto Gonzales
posted by Room 641-A at 12:33 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

This is orthogonal and petty, but I can't be the only gen-x aged person enjoying watching Sessions twist because of all the stupid DARE ads on arcade games, forcing you to see his smarmy message and statement and signature every time you wanted to play Smash TV or something.

That's a different Sessions.
posted by mrnutty at 12:34 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

That's a different Sessions.

Derp. Corrected.
posted by loquacious at 12:36 PM on June 13, 2017

@derekarnold: I believe that Sessions didn't collude with Russia because you can read documents he prepares from space
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:36 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

He's making a lot of definitive statements. That's absolutely false. That's a lie. That did not happen. I can say that absolutely.

I hope to God that there's copious evidence to the contrary so that the world knows the Attorney General perjured himself in front of the nation in such a blatant manner.
posted by elsietheeel at 12:37 PM on June 13, 2017 [36 favorites]

Is anyone going to ask Sessions if he talked to the president and told him that talking alone with Comey could be problematic?
posted by Mister Bijou at 12:37 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Jim Risch (R-ID) is up now. He claims that the Russian hacking and interference is a real concern for him. He asks whether Sessions remembers of a NYT article, that Sessions only remembers a little bit. Sessions says that the Times article is false--he claims he did not have constant communications with the Russians. Risch is trying to provide cover by Sessions, but claiming that communicating with foreign government officials is common. Sessions claims he "absolutely" did not participate in any conversations regarding collusion with the Russian government.

Risch asks whether Sessions had heard any talk of collusion with Russia. He claims that if he had he would have "known it was improper" and that he would "maybe" have headed for the exit. Sessions that he has not been asked or ordered to anything illegal.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:38 PM on June 13, 2017 [16 favorites]

"if that actually occurred" ... like, casting doubt on the entire DNC hack?
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 12:38 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

> forcing you to see his smarmy message and statement and signature every time you wanted to play Smash TV or something.

I made this last month after a discussion with a coworker about the same dynamic.

Christ, it's only been a month? That feels like two years ago.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:39 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Senator Risch: Collusion is serious! If you'd heard anything about collusion with Russia while on the campaign, you would have left!
Sessions: ah, maybe.
[real]
posted by gatorae at 12:39 PM on June 13, 2017 [50 favorites]

Seriously, Excommunicated Cardinal, you're amazing. Thank you for transcribing and summarizing for those of us who can't watch. I would recommend you for sainthood, but...
posted by greermahoney at 12:40 PM on June 13, 2017 [89 favorites]

Yes, thank you!
posted by So You're Saying These Are Pants? at 12:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

DiFi is asking. Asks whether Sessions knew Trump intended to fire on May 9, when he wrote his memo supporting the firing of Comey. She notes that on May 11 on NBC, Trump said he intended to fire Comey irrespective of the recommendation. He claims to have felt comfortable providing post-hoc justification for firing Comey. He won't answer for the reasons for the firing of Comey. He won't discuss the contents of the conversations with Trump. Another administration official refusing to answer Congress for nebulous reasons.

Feinstein asks how Sessions exactly was involved in the firing in Comey, while quoting his letter. She wants to know whether he really believes that the firing was really due to performance (and not the Russia investigation). He's now saying Comey's actions in the Clinton investigation were a big problem [EC note: I call bullshit because Trump was cool with it at the time].
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:44 PM on June 13, 2017 [17 favorites]

Poor Jeff Beau. He can't know what's in the Predisent's mind when he says words.
posted by Mental Wimp at 12:46 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Poor Jeff Beau. He can't know what's in the Predisent's mind when he says words.

To be fair, in the case of Trump, that is an almost impossible task.
posted by Talez at 12:47 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

He did it again. "Six or more with Obama and Trump."

Two with Obama in 8 years.

I do like Rubio's tie. That's about the only thing I've ever liked about Rubio.
posted by elsietheeel at 12:47 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Geez what is this? Presidential Advisory Commission on Election Integrity

An executive order to set up a committee to investigate our electoral process, specifically to look at threats such as improper or fraudulent registration and voting. That, and weaknesses in the voting systems that allow same.

Absolutely zero mention of weaknesses that allow foreign nationals to delete lawful voters from the rolls or alter election results, but yeah sure let's focus on people "illegally" allowed to vote
posted by caution live frogs at 12:48 PM on June 13, 2017 [25 favorites]

D senators better figure out how to dance around this "I do not want to discuss that" tactic that's becoming increasingly prevalent.

Contempt is the only lever, and the GOP won't use it.
posted by Mental Wimp at 12:49 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Poor Jeff Beau. He can't know what's in the Predisent's mind when he says words.

[cutaway to a circus bear in a tutu riding a tricycle as the calliope merrily plays]
posted by entropicamericana at 12:49 PM on June 13, 2017 [16 favorites]

Rubio is up now. Sessions remembers that Comey stayed with Trump. He remembers lingering. He "does not know how it occurred" that he was near the last leave. Rubio asked whether Sessions felt he needed to stay. Sessions does not know how to characterize it, and that he did not see it was a problem inherently to meet with Trump. Sessions doesn't even know that Comey met 3 times with President Obama and two with President Bush.

Rubio asks if Sessions knows if Trump records conversations. Sessions is not sure whether any such recordings fall into Presidential records laws. [EC Note: WTF--he's the nation's top lawyer!!].

Sessions does not recall any interactions that might have seemed. Rubio asked in why the GOP platform was changed not to provide defensive weapons to Ukraine. Sessions claims that he probably did not have any influence and does not know who was involved.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:49 PM on June 13, 2017 [22 favorites]

"I don't think" "I'm not sure" "I don't recall"

Jeez! This guy is so evasive. This wouldn't pass at my job; I can't believe this is on display at the highest level of government.
posted by So You're Saying These Are Pants? at 12:49 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

One very important word from Sessions about Russia hacking the DNC: "Its likely that laws were violated, if that actually occurred."

Sessions won't acknowledge that it happened. That's suspicious as hell.
posted by zachlipton at 12:50 PM on June 13, 2017 [51 favorites]

Wyden is up. Opens blasting Sessions and letting Sessions know that Americans don't want Stonewalling and vague deflections about citing executive privileged. (poorly paraphrased by me)
posted by Twain Device at 12:51 PM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

Are we legally allowed to laugh at him? What is the current legal status of the women he had tried as witches for doing so?
posted by Artw at 12:52 PM on June 13, 2017 [11 favorites]

Sessions is losing his chill rapidly.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:53 PM on June 13, 2017 [20 favorites]

Holy shit he's indignant now.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:53 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Wyden is up! He notes we are all angry and sick of the stonewalling from the administration. He says that "stonewalling of any kind is unacceptable". Wyden is asking what information Sessions had in order to decide to recuse himself. Sessions claims that he is not stonewalling, citing "long-standing policies" of the DoJ. He's upset at being accused of stonewalling [EC note: He's totally stonewalling]. Sessions says he never learned names of subjects or investigators. He says that anything he knows was mostly published in the media.

Wyden is pressing hard. He wants to know what were the matters that were problematic in terms of leading such an investigation. Sessions is really angry with Wyden for asking specifically why it was problematic.

Wyden wants to know whether Session's involvement in the Comey firing was in contravention to his recusal. Sessions claims that his letter did not violate his recusal, even though Trump noted that he fired Comey because of the Russia investigation.

Wyden: "That answer does not pass the smell test."
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:55 PM on June 13, 2017 [87 favorites]

Heh. Wyden just said "I'll ask about that on the second round" and someone in the room said "second round?"
posted by tonycpsu at 12:56 PM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

If only power plants could be fueled by indignation.

This is the plot for the Pixar film, Monsters, Gov.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 12:57 PM on June 13, 2017 [29 favorites]

Heh. Wyden just said "I'll ask about that on the second round" and someone in the room said "second round?"

I assumed there had to be second and even third rounds if this thing is going to last up to three hours.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 12:59 PM on June 13, 2017

Jeez! This guy is so evasive. This wouldn't pass at my job; I can't believe this is on display at the highest level of government.

Don't read Bill Clinton's deposition in the Paula Jones case then.
posted by Talez at 1:00 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

Susan Collins is asking questions know. She is asking Sessions whether his rationale for helping to fire Comey were his violations of FBI/DoJ policy on the Clinton investigation. She is wanting to know why he was writing on the issue on May 9th, after the recusal. She wants to know why he believes the letter was not in violation of the recusal in the Russia investigation. He won't acknowledge that Trump has said he fired Comey for conducting the Russia investigation. She asks whether he would have felt uncomfortable if he had known Trump blab to Lester Holt regarding Russia. He dodged.

She wants to know if he thought Comey had an obligation to pass on the content of his conversations with someone else at the DoJ. He thinks that Comey should have spoken with Dana Boente about those conversation.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:01 PM on June 13, 2017 [12 favorites]

Don't get your hopes up for perjury for Sessions, he'll just correct his testimony later.
posted by drezdn at 1:03 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Wyden is gone for the moment. I bet he had to go take a walk. Sessions has been more and more hostile as this hearing goes on. Sadly Trumpists are just going to see this as a sign of strength rather than an obstruction of justice or an indication of falsehood.

I cannot wait for my state's junior senator, Ms. Kamala Harris.
posted by elsietheeel at 1:03 PM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

Jeff Bo: I'm claiming executive privilege without claiming executive privilege.
posted by Mental Wimp at 1:03 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Heinrich is going a great job going after sessions on there being no legal basis for him to avoid answering questions based on "appropriateness" of disclosures outside of executive privilege.

sessions says its a long standing doj policy which he isn't sure but may be written down and if it is could possibly be shared. . .
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 1:04 PM on June 13, 2017 [27 favorites]

Heinrich, "Appropriateness is not a legal definition."
posted by saysthis at 1:04 PM on June 13, 2017 [45 favorites]

Ah. Flailing hour!
posted by Namlit at 1:04 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Just dialed in, so Sessions hasn't been answering and has been giving non-reasons for why, eh? Color me surprised.
posted by RolandOfEld at 1:07 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Senator Heinrich has just made a huge step forward. Referencing that the portion of Mr. Sessions's oath to "tell the whole truth" is incompatible with refusing to answer questions, Heinrich has explicitly accused Sessions of "impeding this investigation". This seems like a pretty big shift in the tenor of the hearing.
posted by Uncle Ira at 1:07 PM on June 13, 2017 [117 favorites]

Heinrich is killing it!

Sessions is flailing trying to explain his calumny.
posted by Mental Wimp at 1:07 PM on June 13, 2017 [16 favorites]

Heinrich is up--he straight up says that Sessions' refusal to answer the question, invoke classification, or invoke executive privilege violates his oath of testimony. Heinrich asks specifically what regulations or policies in the DoJ that are preventing him from answering. Heinrich wants to know whether the regs are written down somewhere at the DoJ. Sessions that it is "[his own] judgement" not to answer because Trump hasn't reviewed the questions or approved the answers.

Heinrich straight up says that Sessions is obstructing the Congressional investigating. He specifically asks why Sessions asked why he answered "Maybe" when he was asked about whether or he'd have left the campaign if there were evidence of collusion.

Heinrich is disturbed that neither Rosenstein nor Sessions gave feedback to Comey on his job. Heinrich wants to know how Trump's statement to Holt and Session's testimony regarding Comey's performance can be reconciled, given that Trump specifically noted that he fired Comey because of the Russia investigation.

Burr wants to note for the record that Rogers testified in closed session last night for two hours.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:08 PM on June 13, 2017 [85 favorites]

in addition to saying it was "[his own] judgment" to not answer he did appeal to the authority of several senior members of the DOJ with whom he said he had discussed it.
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 1:10 PM on June 13, 2017

Rubio asks about change in party platform re Ukraine. Sessions: "I don't think I had any direct involvement."

So far this is one of the things that really jumped out at me. How could he not know if he had any direct involvement in changing the Party platform? It's such a weird way to answer. Was he interested in changing the policy? Did he discuss it with anyone?

Sessions that it is "[his own] judgement" not to answer because Trump hasn't reviewed the questions or approved the answers.

Holy Guacamole! That seems like a very problematic answer. Did Sessions not swear to uphold the Constitution by himself? Did he not just now swear to tell the truth? Why does he think he allowing the President to decided what he can and cannot say is appropriate at all?!
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:11 PM on June 13, 2017 [61 favorites]

From the transcription on the C-SPAN page, during the questioning by Jim Risch (R, Idaho):

RISCH. Based upon your experience and based upon your participation in the campaign, did you hear even a whisper or a suggestion or anyone making reference within that campaign that somehow the Russians were involved in that campaign?

SESSIONS. I did not.

RISCH. What would you have done if you had heard that?

SESSIONS. I would have been shocked and known it was improper.

RISCH. And headed for the exit, I suppose?

SESSIONS. Maybe. This was a serious—this is a serious matter. What you're talking about is hacking into a private person or DNC computer and obtaining information and spreading that out. That's just not right. And I believe it's likely that laws were violated if that actually occurred. So it's an improper thing.

So, he's saying here that the "whisper" of Trump on stage, on national television, calling upon Russia to "find" Clinton's emails, was an improper thing in which laws were likely violated. No wonder he had to say only "maybe" would he leave.
posted by XMLicious at 1:13 PM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

King is up now. He takes no prisoners.
posted by essexjan at 1:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Blunt is up and he's likely going to toss watermelons at Sessions. He's asking about the April 27th event at the Mayflower. He asks whether Sessions had a private rooms, but did attend an event with 2-3 dozen people, heard a speech, and may have possibly spoke with people. Sessions is "confident [he] had no formal meeting" with Kislyak. Sessions notes that Kislyak apparently has business in Alabama and that they may have had meetings about those affairs.

Blunt is not clear on whether Sessions responded to Comey's concerns about WH communications. Sessions says that he did. He's trying to say that Comey was responsible to shutdown inappropriate conversations with the WH. Sessions says that Comey did not give him any material facts regarding the Russia investigation.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Dahlia Lithwick at Slate:
Buried in a footnote in the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals’ unanimous opinion upholding the bulk of the injunction blocking Donald Trump’s travel ban, there is a moment of reckoning in which the panel addresses whether the president’s tweets constitute binding statements of executive intent.
...
What does it mean that courts may now begin to take the president’s tweets seriously? Beyond the implications for the travel ban, the notion that Trump’s Twitter feed is its own binding constitutional stream of consciousness invites all sorts of other delightful legal interventions. For one thing, the somewhat charming letter sent last week by the Knight First Amendment Institute at Columbia University now looks like a more serious complaint. The letter, which was sent by the Knight Institute’s Executive Director Jameel Jaffer, argues on behalf of a group of Twitter users that the First Amendment precludes him from blocking people on social media. The letter, which at least implies that it may be followed with a lawsuit, describes the Trump Twitter feed as a designated public forum and a curated series of official statements. Thanks to the 9th Circuit, that characterization now has more teeth.

posted by zarq at 1:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [19 favorites]

Please ask, "ARE YOU ASSERTING YOUR FIFTH AMENDMENT PRIVILEGE"
posted by goneill at 1:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [24 favorites]

For us older folks, Sessions Presents: The Greatest Hits Album!
posted by JanetLand at 1:18 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Wow, King is really trying to pin him down and, I think, doing a great job using his own words against him.
posted by Tevin at 1:18 PM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

Angus King is up! He asks whether Trump has asserted executive privilege and asks what Sessions legal justification for his refusal answer. Sessions says that he is trying to protect Trump's right to invoke executive privilege. [EC note: He has nothing]. King wants to know who asked for Session's opinion about firing Comey--Session noted that Trump asked for their opinions. Sessions says that Trump has waved EP, based on his public statements. King is trying to get him to admit he is being selective in his testifying to the content of the conversations with Trump. Sessions claims he has never been given information any information about the hacking, and Sessions never asked for a briefing nor sought more information about Russian hacking between the election and inauguration.

King asks about the May 9th letter. He asked about Session's evaluation. Sessions says that he did not do a written evaluation of Comey's performance and cites Rosenstein's memorandum as the written evaluation.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [26 favorites]

It sounds like Seymour Skinner is now questioning Sessions.
posted by essexjan at 1:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Is there no contempt of court or perjury laws that applies to this "possible future executive privilege" thingy?
posted by some loser at 1:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Sessions is successfully avoiding answering, and pre-asserting executive privilege in case Trump wants to invoke it later, and despite this insane bullshit, he knows no one will push contempt charges against him.

The US government has become a joke.
posted by StrawberryPie at 1:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [42 favorites]

from chat: "so under sessions' construction, nobody can ever talk about any conversations with the president, in case later on the president chooses to invoke executive privilege."
posted by leotrotsky at 1:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [52 favorites]

Sessions' body language and the sudden tremor in his voice suggests he's starting to understand that he's not going to be able to get away with this quantum theory of executive privilege for much longer.
posted by tonycpsu at 1:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [41 favorites]

some D needs to adopt an air of concern and ask, "mr. sessions, have you seen a doctor about your memory problems?"
posted by j_curiouser at 1:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [27 favorites]

Senator King is Maine's prize for having to put up with Susan Collins and Paul LePage.
posted by merocet at 1:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [33 favorites]

Schrodinger's Executive Privilege!!!
posted by some loser at 1:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [21 favorites]

Senator Lankford from Oklahoma thanks Sessions for being frank and open, leading me to wonder if perhaps he is watching a different hearing than I am.
posted by winna at 1:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [12 favorites]

So the story we're supposed to buy here is that Sessions is sitting around as a national security advisor to Trump, reads the DNI's statement about Russian interference in the election, gets nominated as the nation's top law enforcement official, and never says "hey, maybe someone can tell me more about this; this seems important?"

That demonstrates either collusion or a shocking lack of curiosity and concern.
posted by zachlipton at 1:23 PM on June 13, 2017 [66 favorites]

Is it possible we’re wrong about Donald Trump?

WARNING: Consult Betteridge's Law Of Headlines before reading article
CAUTION: Content of take extremely hot. If righteous anger lasts more than three hours, consult a doctor
posted by The Card Cheat at 1:24 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

This is the second time that Lankford has really harshed my King buzz.

Also I just saw a wide shot of the R side of the room and I saw McCain. They're not going to let him talk again, are they?
posted by elsietheeel at 1:24 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Lankford is up and is tossing off beach balls to Sessions. He's giving a bunch of handwringing about leaks and isn't asking about Sessions involvement in Comey's firing or the Russia investigation. Lankford is completely derelict in his duty as a United States Senator.

He wants Sessions to define the term "recuse". He reads a statement by the DoJ regarding Sessions' recusal. He claims that he maintained his non-involvment in the Russia investigation was due to that he might have to recuse himself?

Lankford said that the Center for National Interest that held the April 27th invited the attendees, not the Trump campaign. The reception had ~2 dozen attendees, as per an official statement, and that it would be difficult to hold a private converation. Sessions agrees with the whole statement
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:25 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

That demonstrates either collusion or a shocking lack of curiosity and concern.

He literally couldn't understand that the investigation being discussed was not about the Trump campaign.

And, I mean, if the Trump campaign was innocent of collusion, the investigation wasn't about the Trump Campaign.

Weird that that didn't occur to him. It's like he assumed this investigation was about Trump collusion and felt like he should stay out.

Weird.
posted by maxsparber at 1:27 PM on June 13, 2017 [35 favorites]

Also I just saw a wide shot of the R side of the room and I saw McCain. They're not going to let him talk again, are they?

He'll get to the bottom of the case of President Comey's emails yet!
posted by Artw at 1:27 PM on June 13, 2017 [23 favorites]

That demonstrates either collusion or a shocking lack of curiosity and concern.

No, no, no, he has had his hands full ginning up this war on drugs and civil rights and immigrants. He ain't got time for your Russian nonsense. PEOPLE ARE SMOKING Marajuana!!!!
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:28 PM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

I mean, how is this possible?

King: "Do you think Russians interfered with 2016 election?"
Sessions: "Appears so."
King: "But you never asked about it?"
Sessions: "No."

Is not giving a damn about national security an impeachable offense in an of itself?

Bonus bee update: The Swarm of Bees Outside Vox Media, Explained
posted by zachlipton at 1:28 PM on June 13, 2017 [54 favorites]

@emptywheel: Lankford is apparently not praying for Sessions, like he is for Comey, which is a pity bc Sessions needs the help.
posted by tonycpsu at 1:28 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Manchin asked if any of the following people met with Russians to Sessions' knowledge:
Manafort
Bannon
Michael Flynn
Pribieus
Steve Miller
Lewandowski
Carter Page

He of course said he doesn't recall. Notice who isn't on that list.
posted by winna at 1:30 PM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

Manchin asks hypothetical about if Sessions were on the other side, what would he ask. Sessions says: "I would be asking questions about the impact on this election, and a foreign power's influence.."

Or, you know, the thing he said ten minutes ago that he didn't know anything about and hadn't had any briefings about.
posted by tonycpsu at 1:31 PM on June 13, 2017 [11 favorites]

Joe Manchin just read Sessions a list of names asking if Sessions was aware of them meeting with Russians and the sheer number to which Sessions responded with "I don't recall" was sort of staggering. Because "I don't recall" in this context almost certainly means "yes."
posted by mightygodking at 1:31 PM on June 13, 2017 [20 favorites]

Manchin is up and invokes him and Sessions having a common background in knowing the Russian government to be hostile to the United States. Manchin notes that he is extremely concerned about the Russian interference. Manchin asked whether Sessions discussed the removal of Russian diplomats. Sessions does not recall whether were conversations about removing sanctions or any interest in the Russian hacking from the executive.

Sessions is not sure that his testimony would change, if the hearing were closed. He is "concerned" whether his answers would interfere with the ongoing investigation of Mueller. Manchin is trying to get Sessions on the record denying any other meeting Russian officials. Manchin wants to know if Sessions remembers if Manafort, Bannon, Flynn, Priebus, Miller, Lewandowski, or Page met with the Russians during the campaign. Sessions does not recall any of them having meetings with Russians. Sessions acknowledges possible "published accounts" of Carter Page meeting with them.

Manchin wants to know what Session would ask if he were on the committee. Session claims he would ask questions about whether the Russian government interfered in our election.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:31 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

Hmm, Jared? What does that suggest?
posted by yasaman at 1:32 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

I had to walk away for a meeting. Why is Tom Cotton asking about James Bond?
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 1:33 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Because her emails!
posted by elsietheeel at 1:33 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

WTF? AP sources: Trump tells senators House health bill ‘mean’

Congressional sources say President Donald Trump has told Republican senators that the House health care bill is “mean” and that the Senate version should be “more generous.”

He had a damn party in the Rose Garden to praise the House bill and now he declares it "mean?" Aw hell no.
posted by zachlipton at 1:33 PM on June 13, 2017 [61 favorites]

Tom Cotton and Sessions are having a nice little chat about light fiction. Apparently they both enjoy spy fiction and that is supposed to make us think Sessions isn't part of collusion because reading spy fiction means you know enough to be a master spy.
posted by winna at 1:34 PM on June 13, 2017 [8 favorites]

Cotton is up. He wants to know if Donald Trump or anyone in the campaign attempted to colluded with the Russian government to influence the election. Cotton is acting like a trumpeting butthole. Cotton is trying to make this out to be a partisan exercise, and yanno what? Fuck his bullshit. I'm not dignifying this shithead with a post on his non-questions.

Sessions is just *shocked* that anyone would think he was involved in this bullshit.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:34 PM on June 13, 2017 [18 favorites]

"I didn't participate, and I don't know anything about it."

DOES NOT EQUAL "it didn't happen"
posted by slipthought at 1:34 PM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

Why is Tom Cotton asking about James Bond?

It'll play great on Fox & Friends?
posted by Mister Bijou at 1:35 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Is not giving a damn about national security an impeachable offense in an of itself?

Dunno if it's an impeachable offense as such, but it's certainly enough to get him disbarred. Maybe he can be backdoored.
posted by Capt. Renault at 1:35 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

I had to walk away for a meeting. Why is Tom Cotton asking about James Bond?

He's trying to pretend that this whole Russian thing is just a work of fiction, a fantastical tale told by Dems signifying nuthin'
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:36 PM on June 13, 2017

Isn't Cotton one of the people who lunched with trump earlier today?
posted by Atom Eyes at 1:36 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

"I do not recall, for I have... AMNESIA!"
posted by Behemoth at 1:37 PM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

Harris is going to eviscerate him.
posted by essexjan at 1:37 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Cotton and Sessions are begging us to believe that it's all business as usual in DC these days and absolutely nothing about the Trump administration, or Trump's interactions with Comey are anything but normal run of the mill governance.
posted by OHenryPacey at 1:37 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Because "I don't recall" in this context almost certainly means "yes."

To be fair, it's possible that he would normally genuinely say "no", but is exercising appropriate caution, which I would do if I were under oath.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 1:37 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

This Cotton guy sounds like a total shill... is it normal to include shills for the defendant on the investigation committee ??
posted by some loser at 1:37 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

God in heaven the person typing behind Sessions has the fastest hunt-and-peck typing skills I have ever seen.
posted by RolandOfEld at 1:38 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Holy shit. Cotton just straight up lied about the Republican party platform re: arms to Ukraine. Claims it was strengthened on that point, not weakened.
posted by dnash at 1:38 PM on June 13, 2017 [22 favorites]

Tom Cotton doing a send off to stump for the GOP.

I hope he gets yelled at by kids again when he goes back home.
posted by Tevin at 1:38 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Sessions:But so much of this is in a wholescale campaign of an extraordinary nature--you don't keep notes.

Comey on line 5...
posted by azpenguin at 1:39 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Harris specifically asked for Sessions' notes if any and he has visibly started to sweat.

Maybe he should have read those spy novels a bit more carefully!
posted by winna at 1:39 PM on June 13, 2017 [38 favorites]

Oh man, she baited that trap and then hung him with his own rope.
posted by elsietheeel at 1:39 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

hehe. "I try to read my emails and my notes but otherwise my memory is a bit mushy-goin'"
posted by Namlit at 1:39 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Isn't Cotton one of the people who lunched with trump earlier today?

Yes, he and Sen. Collins.

Cotton: Are these leaks serious threats to our national security? Will you prosecute them to the fullest extent of our law?

Sessions affirms. "Some people will find they wish they hadn't leaked."

Ooo that sounds fierce. He's trying to frighten any potential leakers, I guess.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:40 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

I'm just dreading how, over the next few days, every important answer to which Sessions responded, "I don't recall" will be morphed into "no".
posted by VTX at 1:40 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

I like how his "rules of the department' supersede constitutional checks and balances. I think that's from the landmark SCOTUS case Calvin v. Ball.
posted by tonycpsu at 1:40 PM on June 13, 2017 [66 favorites]

Sorry for the one liner, it was so beautiful that I got excited. Someone mentioned earlier that they hoped some Dem would grill Sessions about his memory.

Harris asked if he bothered to refresh his memory, he said he might have checked his notes, she then asked for the notes. He said he'd supply them if it was appropriate. She wasn't interested in appropriate.

Also he just admitted she makes him nervous and I bet he hated that he just said that on live TV.
posted by elsietheeel at 1:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [61 favorites]

> Golden State Warriors unanimously decline White House visit, per reports

About That Warriors White House Visit
posted by The Card Cheat at 1:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

He had a damn party in the Rose Garden to praise the House bill and now he declares it "mean?" Aw hell no.

That's right, Donnie -- throw Paul Ryan right under that beer wagon, Clydesdales and all.
posted by FelliniBlank at 1:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Sessions just said that prior to January 20th he may have had conversations about how our country could have more harmonious relations with Russia. He tried to ramble on but Harris cut him off.
posted by winna at 1:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

It's worth noting here that Cotton is the one who wrote and organized the 2015 letter to Iran where he and 46 other Republican senators deliberately tried to undermine President Obama's nuclear deal with Iran.

Also, he's the dude who feels like the problem with Gitmo is that it isn't full. Also he blocked an ambassador's appointment merely to cause Obama pain, which he bluntly told said nominee in person.

It is very difficult to determine which member of the Senate is the most worthless, monstrous shitbag of a human being, but Tom Cotton is definitely in the running.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:44 PM on June 13, 2017 [68 favorites]

Honestly all Dems should cede their time to KH.
posted by goneill at 1:44 PM on June 13, 2017 [37 favorites]

I'm not watching, so I don't know if this has come up yet, but the rest of you all should know that it's pretty much an Arkansas drinking game that you have to do a shot every time Cotton mentions he was in the military. FYI.
posted by middleclasstool at 1:44 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

“the general strategic concept of the possibility of whether or not Russia and the United states could get on with a more harmonious relationship"
posted by So You're Saying These Are Pants? at 1:44 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

McCain [?] demanding that Sessions be allowed to talk whilst not answering the questions being asked. Harris's time runs out and Sessions giggles because his time-wasting dodging worked. Great.
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:44 PM on June 13, 2017 [18 favorites]

I mean, if Donnie wants to throw sand, monkey wrenches, and so on in the gears of the Senate "Kill 'em All, Let God Sort it Out" healthcare bill, I'm fine with that.
posted by emjaybee at 1:45 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Sessions just said that prior to January 20th he may have had conversations about how our country could have more harmonious relations with Russia.

The country that interfered with our election. This was public knowledge before January. Fuck him.
posted by chaoticgood at 1:45 PM on June 13, 2017 [18 favorites]

Kamala Harris is up. Hell yes!

She's hitting him on the "to best of my recollection" and other phrases of non-recollection. She wants to know if he refreshed his memory by consulting his written documents. Sessions says that he doesn't really keep notes on most of the interactions he had. She ask for his notes on these issues and asks him to define the word "appropriate". He says he has to consult DoJ lawyers.

She asks whether he consulted other lawyers in the DoJ about his testimony, given that he did not seem to know the laws governing his beahvior. She asks him point blank if had any conversations with Russians on any topics. He again says he can't recall. She asked if he had conversations with Russian nationals or business people. He doesn't like that she going prosecutor on him--complaining that pressing him makes him nervous. She asks about Trump officials having conversations about Russian issues within the team before the inauguration. He notes that he did have conversations about thawing relations with Moscow. She asked how prior to his swearing in, how did he communicate with Trump. Sessions says that he did not communicate with Trump in writing.

She wants to know what his longstanding DoJ policy is that is preventing him answering fully and truthfully. She wants to know if the DoJ showed him the specific regs he is invoking, knowing that he would have to answer questions about it. Sessions did not answer with a "yes" or "no" whether he had seen or reviewed the specific policy. He could not name the specific policy, nor what it said, nor where it was written down.

Of course, she's getting shutdown by these rich white male asshats again, because how dare an accomplished prosecutor, a woman of color, ask tough question of an unReconstructed Confederate.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:46 PM on June 13, 2017 [174 favorites]

Honestly all Dems should cede their time to KH.

That would have been a good idea. Let the prosecutor work.
posted by leotrotsky at 1:46 PM on June 13, 2017 [24 favorites]

I am so. angry. about the way McCain cut Harris off. AGAIN. #flamesonthesideofmyfaceparty
posted by solotoro at 1:46 PM on June 13, 2017 [54 favorites]

Just a coincidence that the first Senator-on-Senator conflict about the rules of engagement in this hearing was between one of the Republicans and the only woman of color on the Democratic side. How dare she not give Sessions all the time he needs to not answer her questions.
posted by tonycpsu at 1:47 PM on June 13, 2017 [69 favorites]

I'm not giving Cornyn the dignity of having his questions recorded, since he's derelict in his duty to investigate Russian interference in our electoral process. It's crap for Republicans to be bringing up the Clinton investigation, given that they were cheering on Comey's statements at the time. It's so transparently cynical and craven.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:49 PM on June 13, 2017 [20 favorites]

@AprilDRyan

" Has @jeffsessions offered these kinds of condescending smiles to other Senate questioners like he did with @SenKamalaHarris?"
posted by slipthought at 1:49 PM on June 13, 2017 [46 favorites]

Cornyn: TEAM #ButHerEmails 4 LYFE!
posted by tonycpsu at 1:49 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Sen. McCain interrupts Harris to argue she should let Sessions answer. Harris admonished.

This is the second time Harris has been cut off in a SSCI hearing in the last two weeks.

I'll be letting Burr know I see this sexism in action and it makes me see red. Fucking old white man's party.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:49 PM on June 13, 2017 [34 favorites]

All these Republicans whinging that Comey inappropriately said stuff about HER EMAILS would come off a lot more sincere if they hadn't only started caring about that exactly one month ago today.
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:50 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

He had a damn party in the Rose Garden to praise the House bill

He was in front of a group of Congressmen at the time so he said things that would make them happy & like him.

and now he declares it "mean?"

Now he's talking to millions of Americans who are scared they're going to lose their health insurance so this is a thing he can say to make them happy & like him, or at least not be mad at him.
posted by scalefree at 1:50 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

I think it was Sen. Burr (the chair) who interrupted Sen. Harris (at request of Sen. McCain). He did the same thing to her during the Coats /Rodgers hearing. She is awesome.
posted by phoque at 1:52 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

A ways back up the thread: "Sessions says that Trump has waved EP, based on his public statements."

Sessions admitting that Trump waived executive privilege but he's still pressing on with this Schrodinger's EP stuff?
posted by jason_steakums at 1:53 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Hearing that Trump is bad-mouthing the AHCA is the best news from this week.

In the words of Archer:

"Do you want Congress to turn against you?

Because that's how you get Congress to turn against you."
posted by Tevin at 1:53 PM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

McCain interrupted her to tell her she had to allow Sessions to answer (if answering means hemming and hawing about principles and running out the clock), then Burr said he must be allowed to run the hearing, then Harris, rockstar that she is, said to stop interrupting her.
posted by redfishbluefish at 1:54 PM on June 13, 2017 [31 favorites]

They hate her and I hope she fucking destroys them.
posted by Artw at 1:55 PM on June 13, 2017 [99 favorites]

Oh, hell, John McCovfefe is up now.
posted by essexjan at 1:55 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Senator Reed is up and asking for the DoJ rules to be submitted to the committee. He just asked whether the firing was based entirely on the handling of the Clinton investigation. Sessions said he agreed with Rosenstein's assessment. Senate said the discussion of Comey was "bipartisan" during the election. Reed notes that Session on July 7th on Fox News, that Sessions said it was Clinton's problem, not Comeys. Reed noted that Sessions found Comey's disclosure on November 6th was appropriate. Reed wants to know how Sessions could use the Clinton investigation as justification for firing Comey, after those statements. Sessions says that retroactively, it was clearer that it was not okay. [EC note: I again call bullshit--this is transparently, unequivocally stupid].

Reed asks whether Sessions felt mislead about the reasoning behind the firing, when Trump blabbed to both Holt, as well as Kislyak and Lavrov in the Oval Office. Session's refuses to characterize his own internal feelings about that. Reed notes that the Clinton justification comes across as flimsy, post-hoc garbage.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 1:56 PM on June 13, 2017 [27 favorites]

How many times now has Sessions said "I don't recall" or phrases to that effect? I'd love for one of the senators to have an assistant keep a running tally and then ask Sessions for a ballpark guess of how many times he's said that today.

Someone out there better make a supercut of "I don't recall."
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 1:56 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

All this lack of recollection is reminding this Gen Xer of the Gipper's Iran-Contra testimony...
posted by pammeke at 1:57 PM on June 13, 2017 [47 favorites]

Aha he recalls now. When he remembers pushing back on the Ruffians.
posted by Namlit at 1:58 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Well now McCain doesn't recall things either, and it's his goddamn line of questioning!
posted by elsietheeel at 1:58 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Aaand, *click* the recollection box is switched off again.
posted by Namlit at 1:58 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

I'll really becoming alarmed at Sessions's general feebleness now. He gets rattled by a woman asking him questions. He can't remember anything that's happened in the past 6 months. And he doesn't seem aware that there is a massive investigation into Russian interference in our election that is happening right under his nose. This is not a good look for United States Attorney General.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 2:00 PM on June 13, 2017 [65 favorites]

McCain is up. McCain wants to know if Sessions raised concerns about Ukraine. Sessions says that he does specifically remember these things--Sessions says that he does remember discussing Ukraine with Kislyak. Sessions does not recall if he raised concerns about Assad. Sessions does not remember raising concerns about Russian interference in our election. Sessions does not recall raising "Russia related security issue" with Kislyak. Sessions does not recall a whole lot about meeting with Kislyak.

McCain wants to know if Sessions had any contact with any Russian agents. Sessions does not recall. McCain wants to know what Sessions knows about Russian cyberwarfare capabilities and what the DoJ is going to do about it. Sessions says that he is concerned about these issues and that we need to do more to prevent it. Sessions says he is now more concerned with hacking than he was in the election. McCain asked about Russian weapons that could disrupt the US power grid. Sessions finds it very disturbing that the Russians continue to develop such weapons. Sessions does not think we have a sufficient strategy to deal with Russian intrusions into our cyber realms.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 2:02 PM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

The response to this claim of a vague (nonexistent) DoJ policy allowing him to weasel out of answers should be asking who at DoJ told him that and then immediately going to that person by phone or sending someone in person (they work just blocks from Congress) and settling it then and there instead of allowing Ku Klux Keebler to "get back to them" on it.
posted by jason_steakums at 2:02 PM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

McCain is.....asking good questions that call Sessions on his bullshit? Wha?

(Specifically, he's asking Sessions what international issues he wanted to discuss with Kislyak in those meetings he didn't mention at the confirmation hearing – was it Syria? Allegations of DNC hacking? Something else? The answer is.....Sessions can't recall! Everybody put on your shocked faces.)
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 2:03 PM on June 13, 2017 [26 favorites]

John McCain was sitting there clicking and tinkling something again just like last week. Did anyone see what the heck he was doing?
posted by winna at 2:03 PM on June 13, 2017

From the Law Blog live coverage:

To best of your knowledge, did following individuals meet w Russians?

Manafort? I don't have any information.

Bannon? No information.

Flynn? Don't recall.

Priebus? Don't recall.

Stephen Miller? Don't recall.

Lewandowski? Don't recall.

Carter Page? I don't know.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 2:03 PM on June 13, 2017 [19 favorites]

Well where the fuck was that John McCain last week?
posted by elsietheeel at 2:03 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Has anyone asked him whether it was him, or Trump who was lying about Comey's firing?

Sessions said, just now, under oath and penalty of perjury, that Comey's firing had nothing at all to do with Russia.

Trump said, a while back, told the Russians that firing Comey relieved pressure from the Russian investigation.

Clearly one of them must be lying, has any Senator reminded Sessions of the penalty for perjury and asked whether he was lying about Comey's firing or whether Trump was?
posted by sotonohito at 2:03 PM on June 13, 2017 [44 favorites]

Someone should ask him if he would wilfully prepare a memo to establish a false pretense for firing an employee. And if not, why Trump's doing so doesn't bother him.
posted by 0xFCAF at 2:04 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

John McCain was sitting there clicking and tinkling something again just like last week. Did anyone see what the heck he was doing?

Fidget spinner?
posted by elsietheeel at 2:04 PM on June 13, 2017 [17 favorites]

Here's Politico: Trump criticizes House health care bill

President Donald Trump directed Senate Republicans to pass a generous health care bill at a meeting with more than a dozen GOP senators on Tuesday, arguing that the House’s austere health care bill is difficult to defend, according to people familiar with the meeting.

The president also said Republicans risk getting savaged in the 2018 midterms if they fail to repeal Obamacare after a seven-year campaign against the law.
...
Trump has told associates that the news media coverage of the House health care bill was "terrible," in the words of one associate who has spoken to him.

So can we now campaign against every Republican House member by saying they voted for a health care bill that Trump thought was too cruel and mean?

I wonder how Paul Ryan feels about this. He busted his ass to get the House to pass a horrible bill, one that Trump publicly celebrated in a big ceremony, only to have Trump trash it in private to the Senate?
posted by zachlipton at 2:06 PM on June 13, 2017 [48 favorites]

McCain is.....asking good questions that call Sessions on his bullshit? Wha?

McCain continues to waffle on whether his duty is to his party over country. On the one hand, he suffered years of torture for the latter. On the other hand, all his friends are on the "party" side.
posted by Anonymous at 2:07 PM on June 13, 2017

Vice-Chair Warner is back up. He notes that Trump has not acknowledged the serious of the Russian interference in the election. Warner thinks its extremely important for the administration to develop such strategies. Warner is upset that the firing of Comey has impeded efforts to look into the Russian interference into our elections.

Warner says that the committee must know what the specific DoJ policies are that are being cited to refuse answering Congressional questions.

Sessions has one more comment, saying that a change at the top of the FBI should not alter the actions of the FBI investigative teams.

Burr notes that Sessions has answered some questions about Russia, the recusal, conversations with Comey, and meetings with Russian officials. Burr notes that there were several questions that Sessions would not answer--he wants Sessions to consult with the WH to see if they are cool with him answering and to submit them to the committee in writing. He also wants Sessions to consult his notes to refresh his memory on these issues.

Burr has adjourned the hearing.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 2:08 PM on June 13, 2017 [24 favorites]

Is someone who literally cannot recall a non-trivial amount of important events fit to be Attorney General? Asking for a friend.

In theory, no. In practice? Sure.
posted by Talez at 2:11 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Sessions does not think we have a sufficient strategy to deal with Russian intrusions into our cyber realms.

While it may be obvious, it's still a bit concerning that the AG said it balls out in a public hearing.

But I guess Trump has already has an open door policy for the Russians, so it doesn't really matter what our public officials say.
posted by elsietheeel at 2:11 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

At least once Republicans get dragged kicking and screaming from Congress they'll go back to being principled defenders of the Constitution and the Republic for which it stands.
posted by Talez at 2:12 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Sessions: Classic empty suit. But the suit was worn while doing a lot of bad business. The suit has racial bias memory, and the suit is scared, so he wants a lot of prisons for bad, brown, and black perpetrators of being brown and black. He is so a vacant slate, but grateful for questions that are party diatribes, and comforting agreement. Great, just, great.
posted by Oyéah at 2:15 PM on June 13, 2017 [12 favorites]

American Treasure Alexandra Petri: "look sessions is just protecting the bureau that is why they call him jeff bureauguard sessions"
posted by numaner at 2:17 PM on June 13, 2017 [68 favorites]

Hey, hey its my birthday.

For my. Birthday I want 1) Chuck to chuck the ACHA
2)Sessions to resign due to memory problems
3) impeachment( as a part of metas collective birthday bargaining agreement )
posted by AlexiaSky at 2:17 PM on June 13, 2017 [16 favorites]

President Donald Trump directed Senate Republicans to pass a generous health care bill at a meeting with more than a dozen GOP senators on Tuesday, arguing that the House’s austere health care bill is difficult to defend, according to people familiar with the meeting.

It's going to be real awkward when someone has to tell him about conference committees.
posted by jason_steakums at 2:19 PM on June 13, 2017 [12 favorites]

@Zoe Tillerman Spox for Trump lawyer Marc Kasowitz tells us that they may not submit complaint against Comey, letter to Senate Judiciary until next week

I forgot that was supposed to happen this week. Now it is happening next week which puts it into Donnie's favorite "two week" frame which means it will probably never happen.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 2:21 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Being out of political solutions just means we have to use non-political solutions to achieve our goals, not give up on our goals because it's hard.
(but I don't think we're out of political solutions yet)

what's the name of that one political solution involving angry mobs, torches and pitchforks?
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 2:24 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Every Senator has a legislative staffer who works for them on healthcare. This is a list of all of them by name, with contact information. Ask for them specifically when you call regarding the AHCA.
posted by zarq at 2:30 PM on June 13, 2017 [32 favorites]

All this lack of recollection is reminding this Gen Xer of the Gipper's Iran-Contra testimony...

It also reminds this millenniold of the political firings of US Attorneys under Former AG Alberto Gonzales and the Judiciary hearings on them. Here we have yet ANOTHER Republican Attorney General can't remember basic shit, crucial to the execution of his job, from the preceding year. This hearing demonstrates that Jefferson B. Sessions III is totally unfit for the office of Attorney General, just like Alberto Gonzales and for much the same reason.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 2:31 PM on June 13, 2017 [11 favorites]

Sessions mentioned in the hearing that there were leaks from the closed door Comey hearing. I hadn't heard anything about that, and googling just now only turns up conservative sites calling for Loretta Lynch to be investigated because Comey showed her documents about communications that suggested she wanted the email investigation shut down and she basically told him to get out of her office. I don't know how credible that is but is that what the "leak" is?
posted by numaner at 2:35 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Can you imagine what Harris would do to him if she had unlimited time? He would melt into a fetid pile of rancid goo and racist chunks.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 2:37 PM on June 13, 2017 [56 favorites]

ah, this The Hill article mentioned that Comey said in the closed hearing that there was a third meeting between Sessions and Kislyak, while Sessions recused himself citing only two meetings.
posted by numaner at 2:38 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Can you imagine what Harris would do to him if she had unlimited time?

This is possibly the greatest thing that could come from taking over congress in 2018.
posted by Glibpaxman at 2:39 PM on June 13, 2017 [27 favorites]

> Trump criticizes House health care bill

“He talked about the need to take care of people,” Portman said of the president.

"Take care...?" asked a reporter, miming pointing a pistol at his own head.

"No," replied Portman. "Just give them health care, show them a good bill, make sure they don't get sick."

{fake}
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:45 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Hang on. When Rosenstein testified previously (back in May, not today), he was extremely cagey about not saying who actually asked him to write the Comey diss memo. Has anyone asked Sessions straight-up whether or not he asked Rosenstein to write the memo? We've gotten some questions that show that Sessions agrees with the content of the memo but a pretty obvious answer to who ordered ~~the code red~~ the memo is maybe the memo-writer's immediate boss?
posted by mhum at 2:51 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Reed asking if Sessions felt misled when Trump revealed he fired Comey was very telling. The faux executive privilege can't really be invoked on your own feelings (but Sessions completely dodged and said something to the effect of 'we meant what we wrote' in case it wasn't clear that he knew damn well Comey was fired because of Russia.

Also watching Kamala Harris at work is a joy, and judging by her 'get a load of this guy' reaction at the end, I'm pretty sure she enjoyed it too.
posted by TwoWordReview at 2:53 PM on June 13, 2017 [23 favorites]

Yeah that was the question I wish had been asked and I'm not sure why it wasn't. "Who instructed Rosenstein to write his memo and what were the specific instructions given to him."
posted by TwoWordReview at 2:54 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Considering only two people can give those instructions, "I don't recall" would be a pretty strange thing to say.

It's such an obvious gotcha I can only hope it's being held in reserve.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 3:01 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

CNN headlines:
30 minutes ago: Sessions: I am not stonewalling
Now: Dems blast Sessions for stonewalling
posted by Hactar at 3:03 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

SESSIONS: I am not Stonewalling! (But I'm definitely Nathan Bedford Forresting.) [fake]
posted by Barack Spinoza at 3:05 PM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

CNN's got the "vulgar phrase" that the AP wouldn't use (which is absurd, but that's another topic):

There's more: source tells @Acosta that POTUS also called the bill a "son of a bitch"

As a reminder, these are all leaks from Trump's meeting with Republican Senators, though I'm sure he'll blame Democrats somehow.
posted by zachlipton at 3:07 PM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

Jesus Christ, I am sick of these assholes, and the craven committee that rolls over and lets them get away with their weaselly non-answers.

Listen, jerks, either the President asserts executive privilege, in advance, or you plead the 5th, or you answer the fucking question, or Congress cites you for contempt. I'm ready to scream over this "nope, not answering because I don't feel like it" shit.
posted by FelliniBlank at 3:08 PM on June 13, 2017 [67 favorites]

After Coats and Rogers spent so much time invoking but not exactly invoking executive privilege, I'm a bit disappointed the Dem Senators seemed to be left improvising when it came to Sessions' claims of "longstanding policy" against sharing communications with the pres. Shoulda seen that shit coming for the last week.
posted by klarck at 3:09 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Maybe Trump finally found out what was in the House bill? Seems like he should have done that before the Evil Rich White Guy Dance Party on the White House Lawn but, hey, baby steps.
posted by Justinian at 3:09 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

I really wish at least one senator had asked Sessions if he was invoking his 5th amendment rights. Then asking him why he was acting in contempt of congress.
posted by Hactar at 3:11 PM on June 13, 2017 [15 favorites]

Then asking him why he was acting in contempt of congress.

Then Sessions just answers "Because the executive can do whatever the fuck it wants while Republicans hold the balance of a supermajority in the Senate. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA"
posted by Talez at 3:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

It's already been my birthday, but if they pass Trumpcare and Trump vetoes it I'll give up my next several birthday wishes and make several flavors of cake.
posted by T.D. Strange at 3:15 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

@pdmcleod: Incredible defense of cracking down on TV cameras from Senator Tim Scott: cameras could catch the PIN numbers of senators at ATM machines.

Tim Scott is a Republican, who would have thought
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:17 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

There's more: source tells @Acosta that POTUS also called the bill a "son of a bitch"

Need I point out (Captain Obvious at your service) that this is really good for anti-Trumpers? The more he stabs congress in the back the quicker they will move to get rid of him. Maybe they are just now finding out what we have known all along-- Trump is a fucking son of a Bitch with no ethos other than "Me, myself, and I come first, second, and third." Congress may think they are using him but he really is just a snake.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:18 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

I'm honestly not convinced all this stuff about Trump trashing the House bill isn't sort of a fakeout. From Dylan Scott's latest VoxCare:

Based on the past week of talks, McConnell seems to be trying to sweep the middle — winning over centrists like Sen. Susan Collins rather than vying for the support of Sen. Rand Paul, the Republican most bent on full Obamacare repeal.

On two key points, per leaks to the press, McConnell seems to be willing to moderate the Senate's plan compared with the House bill:

He's proposed a three-year phaseout of Obamacare's Medicaid expansion, rather than the House's abrupt cutoff. Senators representing expansion states countered with a seven-year phaseout. I'll bet you a beer they end up at five.
He's proposed, contra the House bill, that states would not be allowed to waive Obamacare's prohibition on insurers charging sick people more than healthy people.

The impact of any such plan would likely still be millions fewer Americans having health insurance, billions of dollars cut from Medicaid, and the elimination of the essential health benefits requirement, which is crucial to making sure health insurance covers what people actually need.

But those concessions would probably soften the Senate bill compared with the House plan. That could give more moderate senators the cover they need to back the bill. I would note that President Trump reportedly told senators today that the House bill was "mean" and the Senate plan should be more generous.

So we get a public picture of a kinder, gentler bill from the Senate, but it's still an incredibly cruel law. It doesn't matter how many years you phaseout the Medicaid expansion: it's still going to be gone (unless Democrats retake Congress and switch it off, but then they have to pay for it again because Republicans gave away all the funding as tax cuts, and that's not so easy). But the public perception will be that the bill is merely incredibly awful instead of "mean" awful, and Paul Ryan gets thrown under a bus too.

The path to passing this thing goes right through "yeah, that House bill was bad, but what we're doing in secret now is totally going to be better." They're just dressing up a shit sandwich by offering it to us open face now. These comments just play right into that agenda.
posted by zachlipton at 3:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [28 favorites]

News Dump!

USAToday, can you spell "Emoluments"? I knew you could!

Nick Penzenstadler , Steve Reilly and John Kelly , USA TODAY; Trump property buyers make clear shift to secretive LLCs

Since President Trump won the Republican nomination, the majority of his companies’ real estate sales are to secretive shell companies that obscure the buyers’ identities, a USA TODAY investigation has found.

Over the last 12 months, about 70% of buyers of Trump properties were limited liability companies – corporate entities that allow people to purchase property without revealing all of the owners’ names. That compares with about 4% of buyers in the two years before.

USA TODAY journalists have spent six months cataloging every condo, penthouse or other property that Trump and his companies own – and tracking the buyers behind every transaction. The investigation found Trump’s companies owned more than 430 individual properties worth well over $250 million.

Since Election Day, Trump’s businesses have sold 28 of those U.S. properties for $33 million. The sales include luxury condos and penthouses in Las Vegas and New York and oceanfront lots near Los Angeles. The value of his companies' inventory of available real estate remains above a quarter-billion dollars.

posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 3:23 PM on June 13, 2017 [64 favorites]

So does anybody know why Manchin left Kushner off his list of people who met with Russians that Sessions apparently can't recall
posted by TwoWordReview at 3:23 PM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

I just called Kamala Harris' office to say how proud I am of her, and how glad I was to have voted for her in November, and to keep up the great work.

I live in an area where the worst I have to put up with is Senator Feinstein. Senator Harris and my own Rep (DeSaulnier) are great. So I'm mostly calling and saying "good job, keep it up!" I feel very lucky, because so many of you are having to call, fax, and tweet at unresponsive asshole Republicans.

In unrelated, but still very good news, the DeYoung Museum in San Francisco has switched to "all gender" bathrooms. Everyone is welcome! I think this is a great step forward! (and it also eliminates the well-known "ladies room crowding effect." No more waiting in line with crossed legs.)
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 3:25 PM on June 13, 2017 [56 favorites]

Charles Pierce: How Many Lies Did You Count During Jeff Sessions' Testimony?

You just don't get to refuse to answer questions before a Senate committee because you don't want to, or because you think you might get the president* in Dutch, or because you don't like the people asking the questions. The Bartleby defense—"I would prefer not to…"—has no basis in constitutional or criminal law. There is no, as Senator Martin Heinrich put it to JeffBo, "appropriateness bucket" in which the attorney general can hide himself. Yet, there he was at the end of things, being flattered by the committee's chairman, Richard Burr, Republican of North Carolina, for the immense sacrifice JeffBo had made in coming in and being transparently ridiculous on camera for a couple of hours.

posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:29 PM on June 13, 2017 [51 favorites]

I am stealing "bobble-throated slapdick" from Charles Pierce.
posted by middleclasstool at 3:38 PM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

He's proposed, contra the House bill, that states would not be allowed to waive Obamacare's prohibition on insurers charging sick people more than healthy people.

Has anyone explained how this could or would work? Insurers need either a highly risk-diversified customer base or the ability to scale price to risk. The main point of the individual mandate was to achieve the first possibility, and the state waivers are (presumably) the mechanism intended to allow the second. Does any version of the AHCA have a credible mechanism for compelling healthy people to get insurance? Last I checked we still had the discontinuous-coverage surcharge, which is simultaneously too strict (punishing people extraordinarily for a short lapse in coverage) and too lax (providing a fairly appealing gamble for a young healthy person to drop coverage for an extended time in exchange for a 30% premium bump when they return).
posted by jackbishop at 3:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Senator Wyden called him "General Sessions."
posted by kirkaracha at 3:53 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Maybe this should be in MetaTalk but I'd appreciate if people could use the full title of National Treasure Charles P. Pierce of Esquire, alongside National Treasure Alexandra Petri of The Washington Post. Thank you.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:54 PM on June 13, 2017 [17 favorites]

Are we suggesting that Trump has read a bill?
posted by Artw at 3:54 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Okay,<#include massive_ignorance.h>

Assuming Trump abides by federal regulations and wants Rosenstein to fire Mueller (which could of course be obstruction of justice, but let's ignore that), and Rosenstein refuses, Lawfare explains what happens next

Why do all these explanations start with "Rosenstein resigns". Why not "Rosenstein goes home to enjoy a nice cup of tea" or something similar. Why does - at this level of governement at least - it naturally follows that if your boss says "Do X" and you dont' want to do X, you resign? What happened to saying "No" and let your boss go throught the trouble of firing you if he so desires?
posted by DreamerFi at 3:58 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

Of course not. Someone probably made a one-page illustrated summary. I assume it looked something like a kids menu at a diner.
posted by Justinian at 3:59 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Are we suggesting that Trump has read a bill?

Well he's certainly never paid one.
posted by Atom Eyes at 4:00 PM on June 13, 2017 [20 favorites]

ＴＨＥＲＥＩＳＮＯＡＰＰＲＯＰＲＩＡＴＥＮＥＳＳＢＵＣＫＥＴ
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:00 PM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94: "Maybe this should be in MetaTalk but I'd appreciate if people could use the full title of National Treasure Charles P. Pierce of Esquire, alongside National Treasure Alexandra Petri of The Washington Post. Thank you."

HOT TAKE: I don't find either of them funny. *At all*.
posted by Chrysostom at 4:02 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

Has anyone explained how this could or would work? Insurers need either a highly risk-diversified customer base or the ability to scale price to risk.

CMS's Chief Actuary just explained today that it won't work:

The CMS report also cautions that its analysis doesn’t reflect the possibility that some states could obtain waivers under the AHCA that severely limit what benefits must be covered or allow insurers to charge higher premiums for people with expensive medical conditions.

“If such actions were implemented, we would expect that the individual market in these areas would destabilize such that the premiums for comprehensive coverage for a significant proportion of the population would become unaffordable and the coverage would cease to be offered,” the actuary states.

The catch here is that, under what the Senate is supposedly talking about, states would not be allowed to waive community rating (in other words, insurers can't charge sick people more), but they could seek waivers for required benefits. In other words, insurers could be allowed to drop mental health coverage or maternity coverage or whatever. This is arguably even worse, because at least really expensive coverage for sick people is something some of them will be able to pay for (if you have a serious chronic condition and desperate for care, you're going to shrink the rest of your household budget so you can afford even sky high premiums until it's just mathematically impossible to afford). If you make everyone pay the same premiums but cut back on the benefits, those benefits simply won't be offered; people will have coverage, but can't use it when they need care.

Senator Wyden called him "General Sessions."

This is a thing people, including Supreme Court Justices, do with Attorneys General (and Solicitors General). They're all completely wrong and it drives me up the wall because they're not generals and should not be called that and anybody who thinks otherwise should feel bad, but it's been happening for a long time and will not be stopped.
posted by zachlipton at 4:05 PM on June 13, 2017 [19 favorites]

The appropriate response is contempt of congress, which can be voted on by the Senate alone, which... yeah, wouldn't hold your breath on that
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:05 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

As Sessions just demonstrated, yes, you totally get to do that.

Not without a lot of stern disapproval you don't.
posted by contraption at 4:05 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

National Treasure Josh Marshall of Talking Points Memo has A Few Thoughts on the Sessions' Hearing:

It certainly seems like Comey was referring to a third meeting at the Mayflower Hotel. That appeared to be what he mentioned in the subsequent closed session. Sessions categorically denied anything more than perhaps a handshake and pleasantries that he forgot.

Based on published reports that the US picked up Russian discussions of such a meeting or conversation, it seems like there are intercepts with Russians saying there was some substantive conversation, maybe about a bad topic. But Sessions is flatly denying that. That is not impossible. People brag about things that aren’t true. More importantly, intelligence services will sometimes put disinformation into a channel they know may or is being monitored.[...]

What did jump out at me across the whole testimony is that Sessions claims he recused himself from the Russia probe simply and only because it involved a presidential campaign of which he could reasonably be viewed as a top advisor. This is almost certainly not true. Sessions recused himself the day after The Washington Post reported two meetings with Ambassador Kislyak which Sessions had failed to disclose at his confirmation hearing.

posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:06 PM on June 13, 2017 [44 favorites]

Trump calls up the mayor of Tangier Island (in the middle of the Chesapeake, largely of interest to linguists for their accents) because the mayor praised him on CNN last week during a report about how the island could become uninhabitable in 20 years due to sea level rise and erosion:

According to Eskridge, the president also addressed the issue of sea-level rise as it affects Tangier.

"He said not to worry about sea-level rise," Eskridge said. "He said, 'Your island has been there for hundreds of years, and I believe your island will be there for hundreds more.' "

posted by zachlipton at 4:10 PM on June 13, 2017 [40 favorites]

I very much like my Senator Harris.

My Senator Feinstein needs to resign and retire ASAP, though.
posted by Guy Smiley at 4:10 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Guess that island is fucked then.
posted by Artw at 4:11 PM on June 13, 2017 [17 favorites]

"He said not to worry about sea-level rise," Eskridge said. "He said, 'Your island has been there for hundreds of years, and I believe your island will be there for hundreds more.' "

He added, "With some SCUBA certification and a good dive captain, I'm sure you'll be able to visit it in calm weather and at low tide."
posted by mosk at 4:12 PM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

ELECTIONS NEWS -- Special bulldog edition

=> Early posting tonight, so I can update later on the Virginia primaries - polls are just closing there.

** GA-06:

-- New Survey USA poll has race tied, 47/47.
--62% of GA-06 residents disapprove of AHCA.
-- Yglesias: Ossoff seeming "moderate" shows how the Dems have moved left a good bit. Interesting comparison with Dem candidate ads of the not so distant past.

** Odds & ends:

-- Interesting Twitter thread on Trump hitting 60% disapprove, and what other post-war presidents did.

posted by Chrysostom at 4:13 PM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

Tangier and Smith Islands are cool, if really buggy. They speak an old fashioned dialect due to geographic isolation. They're also completely fucked.
posted by leotrotsky at 4:13 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

"He said not to worry about sea-level rise," Eskridge said. "He said, 'Your island has been there for hundreds of years, and I believe your island will be there for hundreds more.' "

Here the President is trying to make up for decimating federal funding for the arts by creating the most movingly poetic performance art of our time
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

Is that island from Beasts of the Southern Wild gone yet?
posted by Artw at 4:18 PM on June 13, 2017

-- New Survey USA poll has race tied, 47/47.

FWIW Survey USA is the best large pollster in country (and thus possibly the world) according to 538. So this race is almost certainly very close. GET OUT AND VOTE YOU BEAUTIFUL PEOPLE IN GA-06!
posted by Justinian at 4:19 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

"He said not to worry about sea-level rise," Eskridge said. "He said, 'Your island has been there for hundreds of years, and I believe your island will be there for hundreds more.' "

Donald Trump has expressed his full confidence in your island. Run.
posted by Glibpaxman at 4:19 PM on June 13, 2017 [43 favorites]

HOLY SHIT, NORTHAM HAS LEAPT OUT TO A 740 TO 330 LEAD.

I promise I won't do this again.
posted by Chrysostom at 4:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

I thought Wyden called him "General Sessions" because calling him "Colonel Sessions" would be too on the money.
posted by sotonohito at 4:20 PM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

High-Elfin Sessions is right out
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:25 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Senator Tim Scott: cameras could catch the PIN numbers of senators at ATM machines.
Senator Scott has RAS syndrome?
posted by MtDewd at 4:25 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Speaking of Ossof, here in LA I tried to rsvp for the one phone bank in the area and it was all booked up.

Ted Lieu @tedlieu
2 key takeaways: Attorney General Sessions (1) is in Contempt of Congress for stonewalling & (2) he did not contradict Comey's testimony.
posted by Room 641-A at 4:31 PM on June 13, 2017 [35 favorites]

murphy slaw: kind of stunning to see the admin float trial balloons about firing mueller, as if the lesson they took from watergate was that nixon stopped committing saturday night massacres too early

I get that this is partially a joke, but my takeaway is that this administration realized that the boiling frog parable can be applied to the public at large: keep adding on crazy, over-the-top activities, and they can get away with anything.

Also, they get bonus points for a House and Senate full of stooges, and general media coverage that has failed to scream "HOLY FUCKING SHIT, THIS IS NOT NORMAL" at the appropriate times, normalizing everything that has happened by presenting counter-points from trumpeters, even putting them on their payrolls, to ensure Trump is "fairly" portrayed.

Which is truly hilarious (by which I mean really depressing), because the Fairness Doctrine has been dead for more than 3 decades.
posted by filthy light thief at 4:33 PM on June 13, 2017 [11 favorites]

I have a few points/takeaways of my own on the Sessions hearing:

Sessions is an awful witness: He was disjointed, unprepared, angry, and defensive, when pressed even slightly hard.
Sessions has an disqualifyingly awful memory or is lying about what he remembers.
Sessions is a piss-poor lawyer. He did not know whether a President taping meetings would be required to be preserved. He could not cite specific DoJ policy as a legal justification for his refusal to answer questions.
Sessions an ineffective manager, since by his own admission, he never gave James Comey any feedback about his job performance.
Wyden Had Sessions on the ropes when he was asking about what specifically Comey referenced in terms of problematic conditions that led Sessions to his recuse himself. The angry and defensive Sessions refused to answer the question and stuck to the line that he had been involved in the campaign, even though his recusal came just after it was published that he had undisclosed meetings with Kislyak. This questioning seemed like a major trap for Sessions.
When asked if evidence of collusion had turned up and if he would have left the campaign, Sessions replied "Maybe," with a chuckle and a grin.
Sessions apparently assembled a foreign policy team during the campaign but claims that he had not met each person. He claimed that they did not work as a cohesive team. He's either incredibly incompetent or lying.
A repeated theme through out this hearing was the question of whether or not Sessions and Kislyak met in a private room at the Mayflower. Sessions is now on record, under oath, having categorically denied this charge. I am really curious as to why this line of inquiry kept coming up.
Administration officials are not consistently using any particular legal basis to refuse to answer questions in a public setting. Sessions, Rogers, and the others have weaved in and out of Executive Privilege, CFR and unspecified DoJ regulations.
When Sen. Manchin asked Sessions about campaign associates meetings with Russian officials or businessfolk, he did not ask specifically about Jared Kushner. Why is this? I hypothesize that to do so might reveal classified information or interfere with Robert Mueller's probe.
Sessions' understanding of the rationale for Comey's firing was tied to Comey's conduct in the Clinton investigation from last year--conduct of which he publicly approved at the time. He would not acknowledge Trump's statement to Lester Holt or his statements to Kislyak and Lavrov that Comey's firing was related to the Russia investigation.
Collins, McCain, Burr, and Rubio weren't completely useless. Lankford and Cornyn were.

posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:34 PM on June 13, 2017 [116 favorites]

Corey Stewart is leading the VA Republican primary right now. 5% reporting, but still.
posted by T.D. Strange at 4:36 PM on June 13, 2017

If I were Jared Kushner I would be very, very worried about why my name wasn't on that list with the others.
posted by winna at 4:36 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

Hey guys Mark Penn thinks Democrats might be overreacting to all this Russia hoopla
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:41 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

VA gov:

* Northam up 55 / 45 with about 10% in. NoVA looks very tight, Perriello maybe slightly underperformed in rural VA.

* Gillespie up 44 / 41 with about 16% in. Stewart seems to be overperforming expectations, doing very well in rural.
posted by Chrysostom at 4:41 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

A repeated theme through out this hearing was the question of whether or not Sessions and Kislyak met in a private room at the Mayflower. Sessions is now on record, under oath, having categorically denied this charge. I am really curious as to why this line of inquiry kept coming up.

I was also wondering if there was significance to the fact that he was asked by one of the republican senators (and specifically denied) if he had a 'private room' at the Mayflower, not whether he had a private meeting. The implication is that there was always a crowd around, but that doesn't rule out them stepping out of the ballroom or wherever they were to have a private discussion, right?
posted by TwoWordReview at 4:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Both primaries for Lt Gov are also tight:

* Fairfax up 48 / 40 with 18% in on Dem side.

* Vogel up 43 /41 with 15% in on GOP side.

=> If you're wondering, both AG candidates were unopposed. I'll mention any interesting results for the House of Delegates as well (the state Senate isn't up this year).
posted by Chrysostom at 4:45 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

I keep having this nagging doubt that any of these chucklefucks need to be worried about anything. Kushner? If they come for him, he'll be pardoned before they're done reading Miranda rights. Sessions? Perjured himself once for sure, probably several times and in contempt of Congress for his flagrant bullshit today, but nothing will happen. He still has his job, will still damage thousands of lives with his draconian, racist policies.
This is not meant to be a pessimistic 'let's do nothing because it's hopeless', it's meant to be 'We have to fight on every front until *we* remove these criminal from office'.
The rule of law, for those in power Does. Not. Exist. It was shaky at best for a long time (Nixon being the obvious exception...), but it is gone now and I feel like we are all still expecting some sort of institutional correction. I don't think that's going to happen.
Our best, most peaceful hope are the elections, but given how the first 5 months of this horror show have gone, I'm worried about those too. If we lose (or have lost) the ability to have untainted elections....I have no idea what happens next, but none of it is good.
posted by gofargogo at 4:46 PM on June 13, 2017 [12 favorites]

VA GOV:

* No AP call yet, but Cook Political has projected Northam wins the Dem nomination. Currently up 57 / 43 with 27% in.

* Still very tight on the GOP side - Gillespie up 43 /42 with 24% in.

Fun note - the VA GOP usually has a nominating convention, not a primary.
posted by Chrysostom at 4:51 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Politico: Trump’s move to deport Iraqi Christians stirs outcry

Immigration and Customs Enforcement agents over the weekend detained dozens of Iraqi Christians and others to send back to Iraq. Many of them were picked up in Michigan, a swing state that Trump barely won in 2016 and the home of a sizable number of Christians from Muslim-majority countries who backed Trump during the presidential campaign.

The deportation effort has alarmed lawmakers who have tried to raise awareness about the plight of Chaldean and other Christian communities in Iraq, Syria and elsewhere in the Middle East. Those communities have struggled to survive under the reign of the Islamic State terrorist group.

Why do I suspect there's going to be some different treatment coming here?
posted by zachlipton at 5:00 PM on June 13, 2017 [23 favorites]

If I were Jared Kushner I would ..

Squeal like a pig and hope it helped lessen the sentence.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 5:02 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

So what do we think Trump thought of Sessions' testimony?
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:06 PM on June 13, 2017

Elizabeth Warren goes on tweetstorm over Sessions testimony: "He should resign."
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:07 PM on June 13, 2017 [53 favorites]

Kushner? If they come for him, he'll be pardoned before they're done reading Miranda rights.

And if they pardon him, he can no longer take the 5th. He can be compelled to testify under the threat of contempt. A pardon will not cover contempt of Congress / Court.

Pardoning him would probably be quite stupid, since there's a chance he could maintain silence even in the face of jail time. But since it's stupid, that means Trump will do it.
posted by honestcoyote at 5:07 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

NYT has called for Northam, as well.

Dem Lt Gov looks like it will likely be Fairfax, up 9 points with 42% in.

Both GOP races remain tight as a drum: Gillespie up just under two points. On Lt Gov, Vogel's lead is now 0.3%! (you will recall this is the race where the candidates are suing each other).
posted by Chrysostom at 5:12 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Golden State Warriors unanimously decline White House visit, per reports

As The Card Cheat's link shows, the evidence behind that tweet is very thin. Bay Area sportwriters (including me) are skeptical.

I personally think the team should all go to the White House -- wearing matching Colin Kaepernick jerseys.
posted by msalt at 5:12 PM on June 13, 2017 [12 favorites]

Y'know...I'm going to miss Terry McAuliffe. Somehow he managed to lose pretty much every mannerism and political tendency I hate about him and be a fine governor. Better than fine most of the time, actually. The felon re-infranchisement alone was a brave (and very laudable) move in a state where most of the legislature doesn't think PoC deserve to vote at all.

2012 me would be looking at those words and would probably have fainted from the shock.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:15 PM on June 13, 2017 [20 favorites]

keep adding on crazy, over-the-top activities, and they can get away with anything.

In the long-range it's 'boil the frog', in the short-range it's a Gish Gallop. So many things to be outraged about; not enough time in the day to investigate and fight them all.

Ironically, it's like soviet military strategy. Fire a hundred missiles. If they shoot down 90 of them, eh. 10 get through.
posted by ctmf at 5:38 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

If the Russians have a big hack that takes down power grids, then couldn't they have a micro version that turns off the Oxygen in an F-35? Just a question.
posted by Oyéah at 5:44 PM on June 13, 2017

* Gillespie up less than half a point with 81% in. Fairfax County just coming in, should be favorable to him.

* Note that even if Gillespie hangs on, this is a stunner. He's the former RNC chair, had a ton of money and party support, and is barely beating a near-white supremacist.

* Northam, Perriello, and McAuliffe have a unity event planned tomorrow. As has been noted, the Dem gov race was NOT a Bernie vs HRC re-run.

* Dem turnout appears significantly higher than GOP, fwiw. Indicative for general?
posted by Chrysostom at 5:50 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

There was speculation that some Republicans might have pulled Democratic ballots (it's an open primary) to back Northam over Perriello. It's unclear how much this actually happened, but I'm curious whether we'll see any data on this later on.
posted by zachlipton at 5:55 PM on June 13, 2017

couldn't they have a micro version that turns off the Oxygen in an F-35?

No, no.. The F-35 wasn't supposed to be built. The F-35 is a honeypot, designed so that our enemies would steal it and bankrupt themselves trying to make it work.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 5:56 PM on June 13, 2017 [19 favorites]

TPM's Esme Cribb: McCain To Sessions: ‘I Don’t Recall You’ Being Interested In Russia As A Senator

Sessions testified before the Senate Intelligence Committee that he pressed Kislyak on Russia’s actions in Ukraine.

“I remember pushing back on it and it was testy on that subject,” Sessions said. [...]

“I don’t recall you as being particularly vocal on such issues,” McCain said. “In your capacity as the chairman of the Strategic Forces Subcommittee, what Russia-related security issues did you hold hearings on or otherwise demonstrate a keen interest in?”

“We may have discussed that,” Sessions said, apparently responding to McCain’s earlier question. “I just don’t have a real recall of the meeting. I was not making a report about it to anyone. I just was basically willing to meet and see what he discussed.”

What is very striking about this particular exchange is that Sessions did remember pushing back against Russian actions in Ukraine--after, I must note, he denied recalling being involved in weakening the party platform on US support for Ukraine at the RNC. However, when McCain asked what specifically he discussed in his capacity as an Armed Services Committee member, Sessions could not recall. Interesting juxtaposition, wouldn't you say?

Either McCain was trying to throw a lifeline to Sessions (who wasn't bright enough to grab hold) or McCain was setting a trap to make Sessions look bad. Either way, Sessions came across looking unbelievably stupid and/or corrupt and shady. I noticed McCain asked a lot of very blunt questions in rapid succession and seemed much less genial than most of his Republican colleagues.

So yeah, Senator McCain--today, you did okay in my book. Jury's still out on whether that will continue. I hope for all of our sakes, he can find it in him to unabashedly put country over party.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 5:56 PM on June 13, 2017 [57 favorites]

It's hard to overstate the significance of Stewart's challenge to Gillespie. The GOP really is the Party of Trump.

There was speculation that some Republicans might have pulled Democratic ballots (it's an open primary) to back Northam over Perriello. It's unclear how much this actually happened, but I'm curious whether we'll see any data on this later on.

Northam looks to win by around 45k votes so it doesn't seem likely to have been a big factor.
posted by Justinian at 5:59 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

It's hard to overstate the significance of Stewart's challenge to Gillespie. The GOP really is the Party of Trump.

Stewart is so nutballs that he was too much even for the Trump campaign.

Dem turnout appears significantly higher than GOP, fwiw. Indicative for general?

Dem turnout in the '09 #VAGOV primary was 319k. It's already at 431k, with most of Fairfax's votes still out. Can't deny the enthusiasm gap.
posted by zombieflanders at 6:00 PM on June 13, 2017 [8 favorites]

I think Gillespie is going to squeak it out. By the skin of his teeth.
posted by Justinian at 6:02 PM on June 13, 2017

Danica Roem won the Democratic primary for Bob Marshall's Virginia House of Delegates seat. He's a right-winger who has been around since 1992 and sponsors bathroom bills; she's a former journalist (and metal band singer) who could become the first transgender member of that body (and, I believe, the first out trans state legislator elected anywhere). Clinton won her district 55-40, as the demographics have changed quickly, so it's a race to watch. There's an interview with more of her positions here.

(My knowledge of this race is pretty limited, so anyone with local knowledge please chime in)
posted by zachlipton at 6:06 PM on June 13, 2017 [29 favorites]

Marshall is a waste of oxygen, just 100% pure human filth. Roem, however, looks fucking awesome.
posted by zombieflanders at 6:08 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

Marshall also said disabled kids are God's vengeance for abortions. Waste of oxygen seems overkind.
posted by Chrysostom at 6:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [22 favorites]

Note that even if Gillespie hangs on, this is a stunner. He's the former RNC chair, had a ton of money and party support, and is barely beating a near-white supremacist.

The GOP doesn't deserve better, but everyone else does. If he wins what are his chances in the election proper? Is this another chance for voters of America to horrify and disappoint?
posted by Artw at 6:17 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Dem LG called for Fairfax. He'd be the first black candidate elected statewide since Doug Wilder was governor. Looks like Northam also had a lot of black voter support.

LG could be important - GOP has a one seat lead in the Senate. If Dems can pick up a seat, Fairfax would break ties.
posted by Chrysostom at 6:18 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

President Trump Has Abdicated the Office of Commander-in-Chief: Adams argues that this week's announcement that the U.S. will arm Kurdish forces in Syria shows the imbalance between military and civilian experts is already affecting our international relationships. "As far as I know, there doesn't seem to be much input from the State department side about how that will affect our relationship with the Turks," he says. The decision, rather, is "largely based in McMaster and Mattis in their territory. Who cares what Rex Tillerson thinks?"

House Armed Services Committee member Rep. John Garamendi (D-CA) agrees. "It is equally important that non-military advisers also be involved in a decision about war," he says. "Right now, [Jared] Kushner is the outside advisor."

White House expected to grant Pentagon authority for Afghanistan troop levels: The Pentagon is expected to soon announce that Defense Secretary James Mattis will now have authority to make decisions about how many US troops are deployed to Afghanistan without first having to get formal agreement from the White House, according to a US official familiar with the plan.

While Mattis will decide under his new authority, he will have to keep President Donald Trump fully informed and briefed, the official said.

This is a change from the Bush and Obama administrations, where the White House approved troop levels, largely because tens of thousands of personnel were involved.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:21 PM on June 13, 2017 [24 favorites]

Politico: Trump’s move to deport Iraqi Christians stirs outcry

*wails* But we didn't think the Leopards Eating Brown Faces Party would eat brown Trinitarian faces!
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:22 PM on June 13, 2017 [25 favorites]

There was speculation that some Republicans might have pulled Democratic ballots (it's an open primary) to back Northam over Perriello.

It would be weird and unexpected for more than a small number of bonkers people to do that when they have their own contested primary. Crossover voting is something you expect when your own primary is either nonexistent or boring.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 6:23 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

If he wins what are his chances in the election proper? Is this another chance for voters of America to horrify and disappoint?

Possible but unlikely. VA has been fairly reliably D at the top of the ticket recently.
posted by zombieflanders at 6:25 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

This is a change from the Bush and Obama administrations, where the White House approved troop levels, largely because ~~tens of thousands of personnel were involved~~they cared about their responsibilities.
posted by Brak at 6:30 PM on June 13, 2017 [13 favorites]

AHCA news:

* Merkley suggests he's willing to withhold consent over AHCA.

* Politico: Dems exploring vote-o-rama, other slowdown tactics.
posted by Chrysostom at 6:33 PM on June 13, 2017 [27 favorites]

Normal 2016: A US ambassador becomes persona non grata because their host country is offended by US policy.

Normal 2017: A US Ambassador resigns because they are offended by US policy, as expressed by the President.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:33 PM on June 13, 2017 [27 favorites]

Possible but unlikely. VA has been fairly reliably D at the top of the ticket recently.

Do not fool yourself into relying on Virginia, it's still been very close. Gillispie very nearly upset Mark Warner when he was not projected anywhere close. Fucking lunatic Ken Cucinelli came disturbingly within 2.5% of winning the Gov race in 2013 even while the prior VA governor was in the midst of the scandal that put him in jail a year later. If fucking a lunatic Trumper wins, he probably won't win the general election. But we said that about Trump. Fact is if a lunatic wins a major party nomination, they have a very, very realistic probability of ultimately holding the office.

The VA Gov general will come down to turnout. And Republicans will always come home behind their guy, even if he's a fucking lunatic. Hopefully the Democrats will do the same.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:37 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

Decision Desk projects Vogel as GOP LG.

Cook projects Gillespie as GOP gov.

Vote disparity is about 59% Dem votes vs 41% GOP! 100k more.

Also => HD-02 Dem race has been stuck at a ONE VOTE margin for a while now.
posted by Chrysostom at 6:38 PM on June 13, 2017 [3 favorites]

Link round up:

How A Tiny City In Southeast L.A. County Became An Unlikely Battleground In The Sanctuary City Debate, Julia Wick/LAist

Your Rabbi? Probably a Democrat. Your Baptist Pastor? Probably a Republican. Your Priest? Who Knows., Kevin Quealy/NYT

Trump’s personal lawyer asked to testify at House panel September 5: Bloomberg, Raw Story
posted by Room 641-A at 6:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [7 favorites]

* Politico: Dems exploring vote-o-rama, other slowdown tactics.

Hmm. Maybe that twitter reference to an email from an unnamed Dem staffer yesterday claiming a deal had been made to acquiesce to the AHCA in exchange for Russia Sanctions was premature.
posted by notyou at 6:44 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

You can play it cool first and lobby behind the scenes, then shut it all down later if things look bad. You can't really do the other way around, though.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 6:46 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Do you guys think it would be okay if we started bandying about Fucking Lunatic as an honorarium on par with National Treasure?
posted by Brak at 6:50 PM on June 13, 2017 [12 favorites]

NYT: Trump Pondered Firing Mueller; His Aides Pushed Back: When asked by the pool of reporters covering a midday meeting with Republican lawmakers at the White House whether he supported Mr. Mueller, Mr. Trump gave no answer, even though he often uses such interactions to make headlines or shoot down stories he believes to be fake.

That may have been by design, according to a person who spoke to Mr. Trump on Tuesday. The president was pleased by the ambiguity of his position on Mr. Mueller, and thinks the possibility of being fired will focus the veteran prosecutor on delivering what the president desires most: a blanket public exoneration. [emphasis mine]
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:10 PM on June 13, 2017 [87 favorites]

Man, you think you've heard the statement that best sums up Trump's detachment from reality, and then you read something like that....

[chef kissing fingers]
posted by Chrysostom at 7:13 PM on June 13, 2017 [64 favorites]

Yeah. That seems to be an utter and complete misunderstanding of who Mueller is and what his job is here. Trump is literally incapable of comprehending that there might be people in the government who are willing to risk getting fired to do the right thing, because he's never considered someone who gave a darn about doing the right thing in his life.
posted by zachlipton at 7:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [28 favorites]

By the way, the HD-02 primary ended up as a 10 vote margin, Carroll Foy 2180 to King 2170. This one could be a recount, I suppose.
posted by Chrysostom at 7:15 PM on June 13, 2017

[Trump] thinks the possibility of being fired will focus the veteran prosecutor on delivering what the president desires most: a blanket public exoneration.

*jaw hangs open* Wow, pretty much an overt statement of premeditated obstruction of justice.

You just keep thinkin', Butch, that's what you're good at.
posted by FelliniBlank at 7:18 PM on June 13, 2017 [32 favorites]

Holy shit. Firing Mueller. I heard it on the radio first but, y'know, that's bonkers. When Comey was fired I described it as firing the cop who was searching your car, because you can. I have to come up with a lot of 'explain like I'm a 5yo' metaphors for my friends who don't have time for threads like this. I don't even know where to begin with this. If Trump gets Mueller fired, I'm just going to have to say 'wait for the movie'. And yes, whatever the outcome there will be movies. There's Russian spies, hackers, the pee tape, the impeachment, the coup, the bombing of DC, civil war II, world war III, the atmosphere evaporating into space making all surface life extinct, the mole people... It's a screenwriter's buffet.

Remember Game Change? I point people to that one when they ask about WTF happened in the '07 campaign. Now when I'm asked about US politics... Deep breath, long sigh and '...wait for the movie'.
posted by adept256 at 7:18 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

thinks the possibility of being fired will focus the veteran prosecutor on delivering what the president desires most: a blanket public exoneration

What a stupid, stupid man.
posted by chaoticgood at 7:19 PM on June 13, 2017 [44 favorites]

NYT: Trump Pondered Firing Mueller; His Aides Pushed Back:
“While the president has every right to” fire Mr. Mueller, “he has no intention to do so,” the White House spokeswoman Sarah Huckabee Sanders told reporters late Tuesday after a day of speculation over Mr. Mueller’s fate.
(emphasis mine)
Based on Rosenstein's sworn testimony today, that's a lie.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:19 PM on June 13, 2017 [16 favorites]

I mean, that is EXACTLY what he did, and denies doing, to Comey -- if I hang a firing over your head, it will motivate you to be loyal and swing things my way. Jesus, just tattoo "GUILTY TREASONOUS MORON" across your forehead and have done with it already.
posted by FelliniBlank at 7:21 PM on June 13, 2017 [16 favorites]

"Good night, Mr. Mueller. Good work. Sleep well. I'll most likely fire you in the morning."
posted by peeedro at 7:21 PM on June 13, 2017 [42 favorites]

So, I guess no one's sat him down to explain "obstruction of justice" to him in very small words yet, huh. Or if they have, it was all so much "wah wah wah FIRE wah wah wah wah wah MUELLER wah wah wah" to him.
posted by yasaman at 7:24 PM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

Veteran arch-G-Man Mueller sits at his desk, looking like Robert Stack crossed with a corned beef brisket, and a single bead of sweat forms and rolls down his temple: oh no oh no mister trump will fire me must exonerate mister trump ohh i'll be wearing a barrel and begging for nickels if I don't make him super innocent
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:24 PM on June 13, 2017 [59 favorites]

Trump has more bad ideas before 9 AM than all of us Mefites combined do all day.
posted by Fiberoptic Zebroid and The Hypnagogic Jerks at 7:31 PM on June 13, 2017 [59 favorites]

A lot of evidence suggests Trump has a fairly loose grasp of interpersonal relationships in general. I guess when you get famous for saying, "You're fired!" it becomes like the adage about when you have a hammer, everything begins to look nailish.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 7:33 PM on June 13, 2017 [11 favorites]

thinks the possibility of being fired will focus the veteran prosecutor on delivering what the president desires most: a blanket public exoneration

What? Bob Mueller does not give a fuck about being fired. He's been the most successful FBI director probably ever. He's one of one a few people genuinely respected by "both sides". He's not doing this because he needs the money, or has aspirations for higher office in this garbage administration. He's doing it because he's a fucking professional and it's the biggest case of his long and storied career, possibly the biggest case in US history, period. He doing this for history, full stop. He's absolutely immune to pressure or incentive from his "boss", the ultimate target of the prosecution.

I know this isn't new information, but Trump does not have any concept of professionalism or someone actually being good at and dedicated to their work, much less of civic duty or historical perspective. He's been a failson his entire existence, surrounded by failsons, sycophants and enablers. He only conceives of others' motivations in those terms, as either failsons like himself, or sycophants, or possibly in Putin's case, as godlike figures he's forever straining for their approval.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [125 favorites]

Trump owed Comey big for the Clinton digs. He fired him ignominiously.

Mueller will find cause to bring articles. The House GOP will quash them. Thus Trump will owe the House GOP big time.

We know what Trump does with his debts and how he dehumanizes his creditors. The only thing that seems to enrage him is the public perception that he has liabilities instead of assets--that he owes instead of owns.

When the House GOP makes their unholy bargain, you can bet I'll be reminding Trump just how much he owes to them, and I suggest everyone else--journalists, Senators, governors and all Dems with a soapbox--do so as well.
posted by infinitewindow at 7:47 PM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

Do not fool yourself into relying on Virginia, it's still been very close. Gillispie very nearly upset Mark Warner when he was not projected anywhere close. Fucking lunatic Ken Cucinelli came disturbingly within 2.5% of winning the Gov race in 2013 even while the prior VA governor was in the midst of the scandal that put him in jail a year later.

For perspective, those things happened during a pretty strong national republican wave. Warner held his seat in a year that democrats gave up nine seats in the senate. Warner is the only democratic senator to win an election in the South since 2014, he's one of three remaining (with Tim Kaine and Bill Nelson).

The Cucinelli/McAuliffe race is instructive because Gillespie has all the disadvantages that McAuliffe had to overcome. Like McAuliffe, Gillespie has never held public office, he has one failed campaign under his belt, and he's seen as an out of touch beltway insider / party moneyman. He doesn't have a natural constituency in Va besides people who vote for whatever name has an "R" next to it. McAuliffe was able to win in 2013 because the demographics of Va have shifted towards democratic voters. Gillespie has to swim upstream against that, plus the Trump-effect on swing voters. Gillespie won the nomination by winning in NoVa, Richmond, and Norfolk, while Stewart took the rest of the state. It will be very challenging for him get the votes he needs in these areas in a general election.

Of course anything can happen, but I'm quite optimistic for Northam and Fairfax.
posted by peeedro at 7:48 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

> Trump has more bad ideas before 9 AM than all of us Mefites combined do all day

i dunno i'm going to have to push back on this cause I feel personally insulted by it: if I have any value in the world it's as a device for the rapid production of interestingly bad ideas. The motherfucker in the white house has few ideas; the ones he has are all bad, certainly, but his failures as a human are less about him generating a multitude of new bad ideas and more about him applying his few old bad ideas from the 1950s and 1980s in the same way over and over again.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 7:52 PM on June 13, 2017 [48 favorites]

> The president was pleased by the ambiguity of his position on Mr. Mueller, and thinks the possibility of being fired will focus the veteran prosecutor on delivering what the president desires most: a blanket public exoneration.

I've put down my marker. Seven days.

Attorney General Jeff Sessions also declined to offer his support for Mr. Mueller during testimony before the Senate Intelligence Committee.

That's not quite accurate reporting from the NYT there. Sessions specifically said, "I have confidence in Mr. Mueller." If he had used the dread phrase "full confidence", I'd be predicting Mueller would fired by Friday.
posted by Doktor Zed at 8:04 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

So, I guess no one's sat him down to explain "obstruction of justice" to him in very small words yet

Prolly not enough pictures.
posted by chaoticgood at 8:04 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

Obstruction of Justice: A Pop-Up Book
posted by FelliniBlank at 8:06 PM on June 13, 2017 [14 favorites]

Brian Williams just did an "I don't recall" supercut and it is something to see
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:06 PM on June 13, 2017 [20 favorites]

Yes, the VA Dems should feel very good about Tim Kaine's seat in '18 and the gov/LG races this fall. They should feel pretty good about AG and the House of Delegates as well (they need 17 seats to flip, which won't be easy).
posted by Chrysostom at 8:08 PM on June 13, 2017

Here it is.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:15 PM on June 13, 2017 [67 favorites]

McAuliffe was able to win in 2013 because the demographics of Va have shifted towards democratic voters.

Also McAulliffe ran a very smart race - he focused on increasing turnout in areas he knew he could win (NoVA) and on energizing the base. Warner tried to do a repeat of his first election (trying to win rural voters) and barely won. Hopefully Warner and other Dems have learned the lesson. Your base will have your back if you run on issues they care about.
posted by longdaysjourney at 8:21 PM on June 13, 2017 [5 favorites]

a nice white lady in her 60s said, "I'd never been to a protest before! I didn't wear a pussy hat," (cue the rest of us gaping at the word "pussy" coming from her mouth

1. Phrasing.
2. I think you're primed to have your mind blown by the words that can come out of older women's mouths.
posted by bongo_x at 8:29 PM on June 13, 2017 [10 favorites]

Excommunicated Cardinal: So yeah, Senator McCain--today, you did okay in my book. Jury's still out on whether that will continue. I hope for all of our sakes, he can find it in him to unabashedly put country over party.

Oh, the delicious irony of hoping this meatpuppet would put Country First...
posted by hangashore at 8:29 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

Trump has more bad ideas before 9 AM than all of us Mefites combined do all day.

Uh, probably not true. I have plenty of bad ideas continuously. The difference is I listen to other people when they tell me why they're bad ideas.
posted by ctmf at 8:32 PM on June 13, 2017 [8 favorites]

Yea, it's dismay, folks maybe know by now that I share the accent and have dealt with the assumptions that come with it while working in a white collar field. But yea, fair enough, I'll mourn quietly.
posted by RolandOfEld at 8:35 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

I've just been informed that tomorrow is President Trump's 71st birthday. Since we like to do birthday wishes here, I wish for a nice 5pm bombshell story for his birthday. He's earned it.
posted by zachlipton at 8:51 PM on June 13, 2017 [21 favorites]

Brian Williams just did an "I don't recall" supercut and it is something to see

I was trying to find the new 311 single on the Yew Toob, and instead discovered they had a very good single in 2014, "Five of Everything" which somehow went unnoticed. Anyway, if you need a soundtrack for the Brian Williams Weasel Words Supercut, that would be the one.

Compare and contrast to Comey, who took copious notes, but didn't need notes at all to testify... Disgraced Keebler Elf and Shameful Monument Name "General Jeffery Beauregard Sessions" needed a lot of notes to note he didn't take notes. Also he found himself in contempt of Congress often. Director Comey? He answered every goddamn question put to him, apart from the ones that would either compromise and investigation or would violate his security clearance. Widdle Biddy Jeffy? Refused often, just 'cuz, knowing his tools on the R side of the aisle would protect him.

Not. A. Good. Look.
posted by Slap*Happy at 8:54 PM on June 13, 2017 [16 favorites]

Are we sure Sessions isn't just a big Peter Gabriel fan?
posted by kirkaracha at 8:55 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

> Bob Mueller does not give a fuck about being fired.

And if President Trump were a normal President, the possibility of threatening Mueller, his family, his personal fortune, his future, or his kneecaps would seem ludicrous.

But President Trump has made worse decisions before. Remember when he was goaded into sending a botched operation to the Middle East that reputedly killed an eight year old girl, on the basis that Obama didn't have the balls to do it?

Seems like such a long time ago.
posted by fragmede at 8:57 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

The supercut of Jeff Sessions (and his malleable memory) is a thing of beauty and should be set to music.
posted by Joe in Australia at 8:58 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

Just out of curiosity, is Special Prosecutor a paid gig? If so, how much of a pay cut did Mueller likely take? I have to assume no one's told Trump the numbers, because his inability to process the idea of someone forgoing excess wealth in the pursuit of impartial justice would pop his tiny little skull like the Gentlemen on Buffy.
posted by nonasuch at 9:00 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

I doubt money is a problem for Mueller, but if it were, I'm thinking he could crowdfund himself to a private island. I'd certainly be in for a few shekels.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:06 PM on June 13, 2017 [2 favorites]

WaPo Breaking: Congressional Democrats to file emoluments lawsuit against Trump - The Washington Post, Tom Hamburger and Karen Tumluty

Nearly 200 Democratic members of Congress agreed to file a lawsuit Wednesday against President Trump alleging that by retaining interests in a global business empire he has violated constitutional restrictions on taking gifts and benefits from foreign leaders.

posted by Room 641-A at 9:11 PM on June 13, 2017 [82 favorites]

Happy Birthday, Mr. President!
posted by Room 641-A at 9:12 PM on June 13, 2017 [40 favorites]

I assume he's getting paid, if nothing else to sastify the antideficiency act. Generally it's illegal to work for the government and NOT get paid. It's probably the same scale as a US attorney or very senior career DOJ leadership, something around 200k/yr. Chump change to Mueller who could make that in a week of speeches or expert consulting.
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:16 PM on June 13, 2017

I anxiously await the forthcoming Mueller Day in the future, a holiday to celebrate the restoration of our democracy.
posted by perhapses at 9:19 PM on June 13, 2017 [9 favorites]

I really don't think these emoluments lawsuits are going anywhere.
posted by Justinian at 9:40 PM on June 13, 2017 [1 favorite]

I foolishly went onto Facebook tonight and waded knee deep into fights with trolls who called Senator Harris rude, arrogant, and lacking in class (new racist speak for uppity) for what she did to poor AG Sessions.

It was mostly white women. Calling her racist to boot. I hacked and slashed for a few hours, knowing it was futile, but in the end it felt better than trying to explain to a bunch of white dudes why Bill Maher's apology was insufficient.

Muellermas cannot come soon enough.
posted by elsietheeel at 9:40 PM on June 13, 2017 [42 favorites]

Robert Mueller's middle name is Swan, which is not really relevant to anything but is cool as heck.
posted by jason_steakums at 9:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [28 favorites]

> I really don't think these emoluments lawsuits are going anywhere.

Probably not, but Democrats are the minority party -- publicity stunts like this to get and retain public attention are basically all they have, and are quite necessary when Trump and the administration are creating so many smokescreens.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:45 PM on June 13, 2017 [18 favorites]

I know Members of Congress have standing when it comes to things that affect their ability to perform their Constitutional role, but I can't see why individual members would have special standing generally to correct Presidential breaches of the Constitution.

That makes the Emoluments Clause mostly a dead letter, because the only body that could enforce it already has the power to impeach. I say "mostly " because I think it may still have some teeth: for instance, perhaps Congress (as a whole) would be able to sue the President for money he received in breach of the Emoluments Clause.
posted by Joe in Australia at 9:56 PM on June 13, 2017

Holy God, Northam won by twelve points. I was not expecting that margin to be so wide. I think I can say now that I am extremely pleased by this. Gillespie is going to be a real fight, however, and it's going to be closer than I would like. I remain cautiously optimistic, but please do recall that the legislative and the judicial branches of government in Virginia are controlled by Republicans. We're still a purple state.

I am just happy that I am probably going to be back with my team from Hillary for the next six months. Hopefully we get our old office back, too.
posted by dogheart at 9:58 PM on June 13, 2017 [26 favorites]

According to Angeles Arrien's Tarot Growth Chart methodology, when DJT turns 70 at 10:54am tomorrow he will end his Strength/Lust (11) year and will commence a new Hanged Man (12) year.
posted by christopherious at 10:33 PM on June 13, 2017 [18 favorites]

Seems legit.
posted by Joe in Australia at 10:39 PM on June 13, 2017 [20 favorites]

New Yorker: Where Trump Learned to Love Ritualized Flattery. Turns out the whole "make everyone praise him" thing is a Roy Cohn rip-off:

Donald Trump is not, by all accounts, a great reader. But he’s memorized the Roy Cohn playbook, and in his first Cabinet meeting, yesterday, he consulted a page from it: the one on ritualized flattery.

Trump was a regular at Cohn’s summer parties, held at his Greenwich, Connecticut, estate. I covered a couple of them, and they were amazing spectacles. They attracted a whole range of movers and shakers and fixers and scoundrels, along with assorted artists and moguls: Carmine DeSapio and Meade Esposito mixed and milled with Andy Warhol and Calvin Klein. But nothing about these gatherings was more fascinating than the peculiar ritual with which they concluded, in which speaker after speaker would get up and praise the host.

It ends on just a perfect note too.

Bonus New Yorker: Newly Discovered Very Illegal Thing Will Finally Bring Down Trump (or Be Another Cute Tile in the Mosaic of Democracy’s Demise, I Guess)

The latest Illegal Action, along with everything else the man has done, provides us with new reasons to suspect that Trump has, yet again, been scheming with the Russians. One of the most compelling pieces of evidence is that Trump was caught openly scheming with the Russians. We are waiting for more reasons to officially declare whether Trump was ever scheming with the Russians.

posted by zachlipton at 10:42 PM on June 13, 2017 [43 favorites]

I think we can now characterize Session's testimony as an example of the Sgt. Schulz Defense.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 10:52 PM on June 13, 2017 [6 favorites]

Dana Milbank. WaPo: What Republicans are doing while you’re distracted by Sessions and Comey

Monday was the first anniversary of the Pulse nightclub shooting in Orlando that left 49 dead. Saturday will be the second anniversary of the church shooting in Charleston, S.C., where nine were murdered at Bible study.

In between these two somber remembrances, House Republicans will be commemorating the occasion in their own way: They will begin work relaxing restrictions on firearm silencers — thereby making it easier for shooters to shoot without being noticed.

Classy.

posted by Johnny Wallflower at 10:53 PM on June 13, 2017 [25 favorites]

Ok, one thing I can really do without? The whole "while you're completely distracted with this meaningless thing, you're ignoring this awful thing."
Because honestly, if we were all paying attention to health care, gun laws, etc and NOT giving as much media time to the Russia thing, you can be damn sure the articles would be saying "While you're distracted with gun laws, Sessions just got away with lying to Congress, you political idiot."
It feels so disingenuous, it makes me not want to read the articles. It feels like clickbait when they frame it that way.

Yes, we're on overload. Yes, we're missing stuff. Please don't try to make us seem like naive fools because we can't keep up with everything equally.

I know this is mainly the articles doing this, not mefites themselves, and I'm spitting into the wind with my rant, but please. If you're tempted to phrase an issue this way, please don't.

Also, I think you're all really great, mefites.
posted by greermahoney at 11:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [131 favorites]

Trump was a regular at Cohn’s summer parties, held at his Greenwich, Connecticut,

BTW, I was googling other Cohn stories, and here's one of those summer parties, from '83, as covered by the NYT under the familiar theme of "loyalty":

LOYALTY IS THE THEME AS ROY COHN FEASTS FRIENDS

Ironic that this "loyalty" thing rubbed off on Trump, and yet Trump dropped their friendship like a hot potato once Cohn's AIDS diagnosis became public (touched on in this Politico piece from last year).

Also the reason I was reading up on Cohn was because of ridiculous claims of "McCarthyism" from the right I've been seeing lately regarding the Russia investigations. These people do know about Trump's history with Cohn, right? If there's anything like McCarthyism happening right now, it has to be Trump's loyalty oaths, their attempts and demonizing political dissent, and taking control of the media. We're just lucky he's pretty bad at it.
posted by p3t3 at 11:14 PM on June 13, 2017 [17 favorites]

Also, I should have read your link, zachlipton, before posting mine: the '83 NYT article I added is also by David Margolick, and explicitly referenced in his New Yorker article you posted above. The '83 article is brief but provides a bit more context for the New Yorker piece.
posted by p3t3 at 11:28 PM on June 13, 2017 [4 favorites]

I really don't think these emoluments lawsuits are going anywhere.

Court cases move slowly. But...

1) If these suits get to the "discovery" phase, I think the plaintiffs may get to see Trump's tax returns and other financial records.

2) A judge could order him to divest! If he refuses, in open contempt of court (it would eventually go to the Supreme Court), that's a constitutional crisis. That could literally destroy the American government by undermining all pretence of legitimacy. (Putin would love it.) Congressional Republicans probably aren't on board for that. I think they'd lean on him hard to at least appear to divest, under threat of impeachment if he didn't. I think he'd rather resign!

3) No matter what happens, every development in these cases is going to be bad press for Trump, helping to further erode his popularity. It is ONLY his popularity among the Republican base which keeps congressional Republicans from turning on him.

4) There have to be some Republicans in Congress who aren't sure they want to do this anymore (besides Chaffetz). Being in Congress right now can't be fun, and if Trump's approval keeps sinking, running again as a Republican will be even less fun. These guys don't like Trump anyway. We may be able to find some willing to say "fuck it, I'm out" and impeach out of spite at some point, as well as some who think "contempt of court/bribe taking" play badly enough with even the shrinking base that they are politically better off turning on him. We only need two dozen in each house, total.

5) By the time we are getting rulings in these suits, we may also be getting findings from Mueller. The "emoluments" stuff may just be icing on the impeachment cake. We also may be past the 2018 elections...

Unless Republicans want to declare him dictator and cancel elections, I think this could absolutely contribute to him being forced from office at some point. Though it will depend on how the judges rule.
posted by OnceUponATime at 12:24 AM on June 14, 2017 [38 favorites]

I keep thinking about an article I read several years ago about how activists got a coal plant shut down when the corporation wanted it to have its license extended for another 20 years. No-one knew who should take credit for the win - the lawyers suing for health reasons, the lawyers suing for worker protections, the activists protesting politicians and corporate offices, the activists who chained themselves to the plant gates, the group who pressured banks to refuse loans for the plant, etc. A while later someone read the company's annual report and it more or less said they'd cancelled the plant, not because of any single reason, but because all the difficulties across so many aspects of the project made it more trouble than it was worth. They could win on one or two problems, but not a dozen attacks at once, especially when they were all weary from fighting the last battle. I wish I could find the article again, it was much more interesting than I make it sound!

But in the same way that people here keep reminding us all that this is a marathon and not a sprint, I think it's important to attack Trump and the Republicans on all fronts rather than try to find the one perfect sniper shot to take them down. There should not be a single aspect of their working life where they can escape protests and delays and being overruled by courts and new lawsuits and bad publicity and stupid jokes about them and investigations into their affairs. Washington? Investigators and lawsuits. Home town on recess? Angry locals. Media? Questions about what they knew and when. Internet? Demands for healthcare and video compilations of them saying daft things.

It's not that one of those tactics is a silver bullet, it's that this is a war of attrition and every little bit of hassle is worth it. Every individual Republican congressperson should be dreading the sound of a phone or notification because it will be yet another fire they have to put out. They shouldn't have time to provide assistance to their colleagues or cover for Trump, or time out to refresh and regroup. There are more citizens than there are politicians - tag team until they break ranks.
posted by harriet vane at 1:17 AM on June 14, 2017 [189 favorites]

Two thoughts:

Nobody imagined Sessions would admit to anything. The questioning from the Democratic senators was all about making him contradict himself and maybe lie under oath for later use. Also to get video of Republican senators sending softball questions and accepting obvious obstruction. Democrats were highly successful at that, not least because Sessions is not very smart and he is guilty as hell. Someone once said that most criminals are stupid, not least those who think they are smart, and all of Trump's administration have at least one big failure of intelligence, and that is that they have joined Trump's administration, not understanding how that will lead to humiliation and failure. Sessions is one of the dumbest because he was one of the first who signed up.
This is a terribly slow process, but it is moving ahead.

The other thing is about Trump telling the Senate to soften the healthcare proposal. I've been waiting for this, because in my view he was running as more of a Euro-style fascist/clientelist, where everyone gets welfare as soon as the "others" have been run out of the country. He maybe thought he could get away with letting that promise go, but now that his disapproval rate is beginning to threaten the mid-term elections, he has to gear up. If you read those endless Trump-voter anthropologies, people are not so disappointed that he hasn't got the wall built yet or kicked out the Muslims, because they see his excuses as legitimate (wall takes time, liberal judges are evil), and anyway immigration is down. But with full control of congress, why can't he deliver on good cheap healthcare for everyone? Like he promised?
(Obviously the reason is that he could never care less, and the most important thing for Trump is that he delivers to the Russians on lifting sanctions while cashing in on the presidency but his voters don't want to believe this).
posted by mumimor at 1:28 AM on June 14, 2017 [22 favorites]

Sessions clearly thought he was very clever to come up with that non-Executive Privilege executive privilige argument, but I suspect it was clearly evasive and lawerly to anyone who wasn't rooting hard for Trump in the first place. Trump's support among Independents is down to 31% which is astonishing.

And that was before today. Sessions' played a clever game of cat and mouse with investigators pursuing his possibly criminal actions and perjury re: Russia, but he is literally in charge of justice for the entire U.S.!! He should be the cat pursuing criminals, not Raskolnikov in Crime and Punishment.
posted by msalt at 1:53 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

Ok, one thing I can really do without? The whole "while you're completely distracted with this meaningless thing, you're ignoring this awful thing."

I just refuse to click on them at all anymore. I see them at LEAST 2-3 times a day, each day new things that I HAVE in fact heard about, that I'm supposed to be missing. SIGH.
posted by threeturtles at 1:57 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Robert Fisk in The Independent: This is the real story behind the economic crisis unfolding in Qatar
To me, this seems like a valid theory. Sectarianism can't really explain any differences btw KSA and Qatar, and terrorism certainly can't (Fisk sums this up nicely) but this can:

But if we look a bit further down the road, it’s not difficult to see what really worries the Saudis. Qatar also maintains quiet links with the Assad regime. It helped secure the release of Syrian Christian nuns in Jabhat al-Nusrah hands and has helped release Lebanese soldiers from Isis hands in western Syria. When the nuns emerged from captivity, they thanked both Bashar al-Assad and Qatar.

And there are growing suspicions in the Gulf that Qatar has much larger ambitions: to fund the rebuilding of post-war Syria. Even if Assad remained as president, Syria’s debt to Qatar would place the nation under Qatari economic control.

This is all lesser of evils thinking, none of these guys are good guys at all. But I think it would be better for all involved if the Qataris control Syria than if the Saudis do. I don't know. But at the very least we (the West) should not support the Saudis in their imperialism and influence-peddling because it is clearly evil and it clearly leeds to terrorism.
posted by mumimor at 2:20 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

For me, one of the (few) pleasures of this era has been seeing tech sites I follow attack Trump. For example, yesterday Daring Fireball (John Gruber) combined a USA Today article and a David Frum tweet into a small post that connects Trump real estate sales to money laundering.
posted by kingless at 3:07 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

You know what is making me angry this morning? That there are actually competent honorable people in this country. People who have served this country with distinction and honor and have spent their lives in service of laudable goals. People who if in power could not only be sailing this ship of state through troubled waters but making the ship better, and other ships, and the sea itself, and we could sit back and say, to paraphrase Camus, 'we have loosened the chains of the prisoner next to us.'The sick prisoner, the prisoner in war, the prisoner of poverty, of racism. We could say, with reason, 'the human species is worthwhile, for look upon our good works.'

I guess I'd become somewhat nihilistic, pre James Comes testimony. 'Maybe this is the logical conclusion of the human species," said I. This bloated obscene administration lurching through history with the power to destroy the world in its fist.

Then Comey testified and I got all angry again.

And I'm not saying Comey is like, the avatar of goodness. Why he shat the bed the end of October, I don't know. But since then--and you can see this especially in the contrast between Sessions and Comey--Comey has been competent. He has acted with honor. He testified with a kind of righteousness that rang more true than any words of any other person connected with this administration.

Of course, then we have HRC. What would HRC have done, with her great competence and humanist ideals?

Being hopeful about humanity is not a very comfortable place to be these days. Because it accepting that non of this bullshit needs to be happening right now. That we could be doing so much better. And yet, for really stupid fucking reasons, aren't.
posted by angrycat at 4:21 AM on June 14, 2017 [68 favorites]

Angrycat, what I can't wrap my head around is this: we leep seeing a figure that around 25,000,000 people will lose their health insurance under Republican plans. Now, an average lifespan is about 25,000 days, one thousandth of that figure. That means, if retaining insurance would only lead to each of those 25,000,000 living one day longer it would be the equivalent of saving the lives of a thousand babies. But not only are Republicans reveling in these extra deaths, pretty much nobody else in public life seems to be taking it to heart. A lot of people are upset, sure, but this is literally distributed mass murder and it doesn't seem to be getting any more outrage than any of a dozen other issues.

Incidentally, if any clerk or senatorial aide can do anything to mess up the Trumpublican health plan - even for just one day, as I said - I would consider them a hero. One day! A thousand lives! People get monuments built to them for doing much less than that.
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:44 AM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

Virginia GOP baseball practice shooting: Multiple people shot: House Majority Whip Steve Scalise and aides were shot at a baseball practice in Virginia Wednesday, Fox News confirmed.

The story is still developing, but multiple reports say that up to 50 shots were heard.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 4:59 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

I'm not the only one here thinking "Please for the love of god don't let this be partisan", right?
posted by Talez at 5:03 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

Better pray it was right-wingers, everyone. If this was anyone else, we are all utterly, utterly fucked.
posted by Frowner at 5:03 AM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

Anyone know what this is all about?

US Republican politician and aide among several shot during baseball practice in Virginia, US reports say

That's the whole story, when you click the link.
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:06 AM on June 14, 2017

Context: GOP governatorial primary in VA last night in which a neo-Confederate came very close to winning. Ultimately, an establishment guy won. No idea what that suggests about who would shoot up Republican softball practice.

Fuck. Please let it be the right-wingers.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 5:08 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

Joe Scarborough saying that Scalise had spoken with the gunman before, so hopefully ("hopefully") this is something personal and not political.
posted by Room 641-A at 5:08 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Rep Mo Brooks on CNN giving witness account.
posted by apparently at 5:09 AM on June 14, 2017

Beware taking any reports at face value, this is all still breaking. I've already seen one report that the shooter is in custody and another that he was shot dead. Wait for confirmation on any details.
posted by Roommate at 5:11 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

It seems like maybe no one died? I would like a world where even people whose politics I hate are not shot, okay?
posted by Frowner at 5:13 AM on June 14, 2017 [38 favorites]

Totally unclear, Frowner. Reports are that people are being taken by helicopter to hospitals.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 5:16 AM on June 14, 2017

From Steve Scalise shot in Virginia, aide also hit:

Police tweeted they "believed" the gunman was in custody. Sen. Mike Lee told Fox News, however, the gunman was dead. He said a staffer used a belt as a tourniquet to stop Scalise's bleeding.

posted by scalefree at 5:17 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Rand Paul, who was there, was saying that if Scalise wasn't there they wouldn't have had any police security with them. They were there because Scalise is leadership, which probably saved a lot of lives.
posted by Room 641-A at 5:21 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Jennifer Bendery (HuffPo reporter) tweeted that the Dems on the team were at a separate practice, so if this was targeted, it may have been at Republicans specifically.
posted by Roommate at 5:21 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Folks, let's hold off speculation until there's definite news, please, and if we get reliable updates, avoid a pile of duplicate posts. Thanks.
posted by taz (staff) at 5:27 AM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

@AlexandriaVAPD: UPDATE: Suspect is in custody and not a threat. PIO will be onscene shortly to share updates.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:28 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

I'm already seeing lots of calls for a civil war against the Democrats. That the resistance movement has "radicalized" the left and the Julius Caesar production is to blame. I'm very afraid of the tweeter-in-chief fanning the flames.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:28 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

The president was pleased by the ambiguity of his position on Mr. Mueller, and thinks the possibility of being fired will focus the veteran prosecutor on delivering what the president desires most: a blanket public exoneration.

Trying to avoid charges of obstruction of justice by obstructing justice. Like trying to avoid charges of arson by burning down the police station. That's Our Donald!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:28 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

I'm already seeing lots of calls for a civil war against the Democrats. That the resistance movement has "radicalized" the left and the Julius Caesar production is to blame.

They've been threatening us physically long before there was a resistance or a recent Julius Caesar production. The Tea Party wallowed in open carry rallies against the left for daring to give people health care. Do not repeat their narrative on this.
posted by Candleman at 5:32 AM on June 14, 2017 [55 favorites]

Two words: Gabby Giffords
posted by zombieflanders at 5:32 AM on June 14, 2017 [52 favorites]

Well, in response, the GOP will certainly try to curtail all civil liberties except gun ownership.
posted by lydhre at 5:35 AM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

it is not normal for me to be cringing this much, waiting for the president of the united states to belch out a divisive, unconsidered hot take before any facts are in on a politicized shooting
posted by murphy slaw at 5:36 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

murphy slaw, MSNBC just read a statement that they said was from the POTUS, but was obviously not written by Trump, Pence, or anyone who knows them.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 5:37 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

"We" didn't do anything here. Use of violence is entirely on the perpetrator(s) and any future escalation will be the fault of those that turn to violence in response.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:38 AM on June 14, 2017 [27 favorites]

So it took minutes for him or his staff to comment officially on this shooting, weeks to even acknowledge Portland.
posted by michswiss at 5:40 AM on June 14, 2017 [19 favorites]

I find this incredibly disturbing. It's a relief that Steve Scalise was only wounded, and that he has excellent health insurance.
posted by Pater Aletheias at 5:41 AM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

I suspect Trump will declare today a national holiday. I'm just waiting to see if it's declared a holiday for life or just the one time like on his inauguration.
posted by jenfullmoon at 5:41 AM on June 14, 2017

There's a hearing at 10am in the House on deregulating silencers. Rep. Brooks is on CNN lamenting the fact that they didn't have more guns with which to return fire. What the hell is wrong with these people?
posted by melissasaurus at 5:42 AM on June 14, 2017 [37 favorites]

Just keep emphasizing the lefts long time support of gun control as deterrent to exactly this sort of situation and it'll at least be more difficult to push the blame too far. Especially if the officers on the field and potentially had weapons of their own and still couldn't prevent the shooting.

That won't prevent Trump and his pals from trying to place blame, but it at least isn't escalating the animosity.
posted by gusottertrout at 5:42 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Here's the POTUS statement.
posted by AwkwardPause at 5:43 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Well thanks, stupid asshole with gun, you've at the very least turned the narrative somewhat away from the fact that Sessions is a lying treasonous inept person who at best should be in charge of. Cinnabon
posted by angrycat at 5:44 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Rand Paul is not exactly a cool-headed leader, is he. Mo Brooks reported 10 to 20 shots fired. Rand Paul reported 50 shots fired and "everyone would be dead" if it were not for the fact that Capitol police were there because of Scalise's position in the government.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:46 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

hats off to whichever low-level staffer managed to put together that anodyne statement at this time.
posted by murphy slaw at 5:47 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Meanwhile, there was an inferno in London that looks like it will be dozens to hundreds dead last night, and no word from potus because he's in a twitter spat with the mayor?
posted by Dashy at 5:48 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

Speaking of Gabby Giffords, she has the empathy and compassion so many of her GOP Congressional colleagues did not.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:51 AM on June 14, 2017 [34 favorites]

Rep. Brooks is on CNN lamenting the fact that they didn't have more guns with which to return fire

He also said, "A pistol against a rifle is not a fair fight." Soo what the hell. Is the NRA going to suggest open carry for rifles everywhere now? Because every American needs to be ready for a "fair fight."

Meanwhile, there was an inferno in London that looks like it will be dozens to hundreds dead last night.

First thing I read this morning. Sounds like it was in a pretty nice neighborhood with lots of writers and actors living nearby? 27 stories high. Just heartbreaking reading the accounts.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:53 AM on June 14, 2017

And a dozen police cars just went screaming towards town where I'm at by the Watergate. What a crazy day.

To be fair, I'm new here. That might be what happens when the wrong kind of person gets stopped for speeding here.
posted by ctmf at 5:56 AM on June 14, 2017

Gun-loving lawmakers shot as they play baseball before resuming their assault on health care for millions. There is nothing more American than this.
posted by Rykey at 5:56 AM on June 14, 2017 [55 favorites]

First tweet is sane. How long will it last?

@realDonaldTrump
Rep. Steve Scalise of Louisiana, a true friend and patriot, was badly injured but will fully recover. Our thoughts and prayers are with him.
posted by chris24 at 5:58 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Meanwhile, in other heartbreaking news:

Bloomberg: America’s Health-Care Crisis Is a Gold Mine for Crowdfunding

Growth has been rapid. In a September 2015 LinkedIn post, Solomon wrote that the one million campaigns set up over the previous year had raised $1 billion from nearly 12 million donors. By February 2016, the total was $2 billion. In October 2016, it was $3 billion, from 25 million donors. A NerdWallet study of medical crowdfunding said GoFundMe had indicated that $930 million of the $2 billion raised in the period the study analyzed was from medical campaigns.[my bold]

We just experienced this recently. Old family friends of Mr. Gravy who went full-on GOP recently were crowdfunding the $40,000 in medical bills racked up by the Dad. Like on the one hand you want to throttle them for all the anti-Hillary memes and the cries about Dems raising their taxes! but on the other hand one can only feel sadness for their situation. Of course we donated money and gave no sermon but we bitched in private.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:00 AM on June 14, 2017 [22 favorites]

I remain against the legistrative and cultural failures that make shootings of this kind common in America.
posted by Artw at 6:01 AM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]

In news that will be completely overshadowed by other news, the head of the Michigan health department has been charged with involuntary manslaughter for the Flint water disaster.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:02 AM on June 14, 2017 [115 favorites]

Gun-loving lawmakers shot as they play baseball before resuming their assault on health care for millions. There is nothing more American than this.

And on FLAG DAY no less. (My husband had to remind me that this is a thing happening today. I had no idea.)
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Suspect is in custody and not a threat.

Pretty likely they are white then.
posted by Artw at 6:06 AM on June 14, 2017 [34 favorites]

Gun-loving lawmakers shot as they play baseball before resuming their assault on health care for millions. There is nothing more American than this.

There's this!
posted by octobersurprise at 6:09 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

brooks said the shooter was white, male, middle-aged.

presumably "disturbed" and "lone wolf" will come later, with "terrorist" notably absent
posted by murphy slaw at 6:11 AM on June 14, 2017 [19 favorites]

as per the Guardian, Brooks has said "He appeared to be a white male. But bear in mind I saw him for just a second or two, a fraction of a second.
If I had to guess, middle aged … he wasn’t skinny, but he did not appear to be obese either."
posted by progosk at 6:11 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Rand Paul reported 50 shots fired and "everyone would be dead" if it were not for the fact that Capitol police were there because of Scalise's position in the government.

Honestly? You don't know that's not true. Dude was just shot at, watched his colleague bleeding out on the field, watched other people get shot. This was a traumatizing event for anyone. 15 shots or 50, it doesn't matter. I don't care how reprehensible his political views may or may not be, nobody - no person - deserves to be shot at or be in a mass shooting situation like that. Nobody.

If we lose our empathy for others, what the hell is left?
posted by anastasiav at 6:12 AM on June 14, 2017 [63 favorites]

If we lose our empathy for others, what the hell is left?

You are right and I am wrong, but Rand Paul, the Libertarian who thinks everyone should live and die without any assistance from the government, makes it tough for me. Bad Secret Life of Gravy!

I just was surprised at how non-"Politician who chooses his words carefully" he sounded. But I'm sure he really was terrified. I wonder if these guys will end up with PTSD?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:19 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

I remain generally supportive of less people being shot and more people having healthcare.
posted by Artw at 6:21 AM on June 14, 2017 [48 favorites]

@realDonaldTrump
Rep. Steve Scalise of Louisiana, a true friend and patriot, was badly injured but will fully recover. Our thoughts and prayers are with him.

...until real Donald wakes up.
posted by leotrotsky at 6:23 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

Well, the "our" indicates that there are a number of real Trumps. The mind boggles.
posted by Namlit at 6:26 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

We don't even know if the shooter even knew they were congresspeople yet, yes? Could just be another (JFC, to have to say that) random mass shooting, until we know more.
posted by ctmf at 6:27 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

If we lose our empathy for others, what ~~the~~ hell is left?
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 6:27 AM on June 14, 2017

I have a bad feeling about this:

@Marc Lotter: The @VP has cancelled his speech to the Nat'l Association of Homebuilders this morning, he is heading directly to the White House instead.

If Obama was in office we would know what to expect: a measured speech broadcast to the nation about how gun control would be a great idea and there is no Right and Left today but we are all Americans, etc. etc. With Mr. Crazy Pants occupying the Oval Office, who knows? I assume there will be some attempt to a) show how he is the victim here and b) how all of America needs to stop criticizing him because otherwise the Democrats will destroy this country.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:27 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

This happened just a few blocks from my mother's house. Watching the scene on video is surreal.
posted by biogeo at 6:28 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

A couple deleted. Reminder: Please hold off on random speculation and doomsaying. We'll know more about the attacker when we know it. Filling this with hundreds of comments about their possible color, ethnicity, political orientation, residency status, etc., and how fucked we all are isn't helpful at this point.
posted by taz (staff) at 6:34 AM on June 14, 2017 [29 favorites]

Kellyannr Conway is already tweeting inflammatory rumor. Aren't Trump and his staffers' tweets legally considered official statements now?
posted by zombieflanders at 6:34 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

UPDATE: House Natural Resources Committee says the hearing on @RepJeffDuncan's bill to deregulate gun silencers has been canceled -- Kira Lerner, Think Progress
posted by murphy slaw at 6:37 AM on June 14, 2017 [38 favorites]

Because I need to focus on the good to avoid the adrenaline starting to kick in: it looks like Congressman Brad Wenstrup, a former Army surgeon in Iraq and recipient of the Bronze Star, provided aid to the wounded while they were awaiting medevac at today's shooting, which may also be why we (currently) have no fatalities.
posted by corb at 6:39 AM on June 14, 2017 [51 favorites]

Soooooo, according to an MSNBC reporter on Twitter, Jeff Duncan said that the man who asked him about the team's party affiliation was in running clothes, and Jeff Flake said that the shooter was wearing jeans. So it's likely that they weren't the same person, and we're back to the thing where people shouldn't breathlessly report every rumor without waiting to confirm it.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:41 AM on June 14, 2017 [25 favorites]

Be nice if Congress released a bipartisan statement denouncing this violence. It's in both their interests to de-escalate, because they're the ones getting shot.

Maybe propose a bill providing a security detail to all sitting Congresspeople?
posted by leotrotsky at 6:44 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Someone should do a corpus analysis of congressional testimony and see if Republicans are significantly more likely to report the loss of memory.
posted by srboisvert at 6:46 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

The player I saw on TV was wearing a "Republicans" jersey.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 6:46 AM on June 14, 2017

Maybe propose any bill that's not an obvious "fuck you" to the American people. Baby steps.
posted by ctmf at 6:47 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

That would be rushing to judgement - this may just be a normal everyday American shooting of the kind the GOP are in favour of.
posted by Artw at 6:50 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Some of the players (at least the one I saw on TV) were wearing "Republicans" jerseys.

I mean, I think it's entirely possible, and likely even, that they were targeted for being Republicans. But there was earlier reporting that seemed to confirm that, and that reporting is pretty suspect. And we know that people get things wrong in breaking news situations, and it's not going to kill anyone to wait for a few hours before we start speculating. The suspect is known and apparently still alive (or at least he was when he was transported to the hospital), so there's every reason to believe that we'll have something solid to go on in the not too distant future. And until then, I suggest taking all breaking news reports with a great big grain of salt.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:51 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

Some of the players (at least the one I saw on TV) were wearing "Republicans" jerseys.

They were practicing for the annual Ds vs Rs softball game. The Ds practice somewhere else.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:52 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

According to CNBC, Scalise is in stable condition and undergoing surgery now. The article also contains a great photo of all of the Democratic congresspeople at the corresponding practice praying for their Republican colleagues, if anyone wants to do some social media de escalation.
posted by corb at 6:56 AM on June 14, 2017 [27 favorites]

Maybe propose a bill providing a security detail to all sitting Congresspeople?
posted by leotrotsky at 9:44 AM on June 14 [+] [!]

Ah hell no. 538 plus 100 times 24 hrs a day? That would be....a fuck ton of money? Also who is providing security for the average Americans in nightclubs and at home and in their workplaces who are being gunned down?

Remember how the RNC was held in a place that did not allow people to carry firearms? Yet when I go to the grocery store in NC I have no idea who is carrying a weapon because we allow conceal carry everywhere now. Yeah we need all the Politicians to be living under the same circumstances that we do.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:59 AM on June 14, 2017 [67 favorites]

This badass [Noah Nathan, seen in this image on twitter being interviewed] was at the dog park near the baseball field, and had the presence of mind to take video the shooter, while keeping himself and his dog safe.

He also apparently has a two-headed dog.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:01 AM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

He also apparently has a two-headed dog.

This is, of course, Twitter's main hot take on the situation. I expect the two headed dog to turn up on @dogrates shortly.
posted by anastasiav at 7:03 AM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

That photo of the praying Democrats made me burst out laughing and then start crying. My first thought was "of course the Democrats are all wearing scraggly and unmatched practice outfits while the Republicans have REPUBLICAN jerseys. Even for charity baseball they're more united." Immediately followed by how awful it must be to know that your colleagues were attacked. Regardless of political affiliation, you see these guys every day and probably even like a bunch of them.
posted by xyzzy at 7:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

This badass [Noah Nathan, seen in this image on twitter being interviewed] was at the dog park near the baseball field, and had the presence of mind to take video the shooter, while keeping himself and his dog safe.

It's especially impressive because he appears to have a pair of either labradoodles or golden doodles, and handling those is often a heroic enterprise in and of itself even in non-crisis situations.
posted by FelliniBlank at 7:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [22 favorites]

Here's something everybody Left, Right, Centrist, Antifa & Nazi can get behind getting angry at. Like many of you I'm watching Twitter for the latest rumors when what appears in my search but this: Check out TENS unit 8 Mode Portable Electro Massage Therapy Device Pulse Impulse Massage Steve Scalise #MLBDraft. Talk about disaster capitalism. Apparently they pick the controversy of the day & include it in their spammy tweets. Scrolling back their feed I see "Senate Intelligence Committee", "Corbyn" & "Loretta Lynch" just in the past few days. As bad as the political hype is on this tragedy, this is positively sociopathic in its disregard for humanity.
posted by scalefree at 7:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Congressman Scalise's pro-gun stance has earned him an A+ rating from the National Rifle Association.
posted by Behemoth at 7:05 AM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

Congressman Scalise's pro-gun stance has earned him an A+ rating from the National Rifle Association.

Dollars to donuts he'll be doing an interview from his hospital bed where he thanks the WELL-ARMED capitol police and will lament that this TRAGEDY could have been avoided had more people been armed.....(while playing softball)
posted by splen at 7:08 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

Here is something else everyone can get behind, Quinnipiac Polls has Chris Christie with the worst Job Approval rate recorded for any sitting Governor in 20 years: 15% approve, 81% disapprove of his performance.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:09 AM on June 14, 2017 [51 favorites]

Per MSNBC, Trumo has cancelled whatever ego-stroking thing he had planned today.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:09 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Far-right blue checkmark Twitter is already claiming Shakespeare and Kathy Griffin are to blame.

Also, looks like the entire House is going into a briefing at 11:15.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 7:10 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

This is real bad, but so far I don't think (don't think) this event was quite bad enough to be the Reichstag event that we should all be afraid of. It could easily have put the foot heavier on the gas pedal to get us there, though.

Factors mitigating the immediate damage to the county: no fatalities (so far, fingers crossed that everyone recovers), suspect not a member of an obvious ethno-religious target group, attack not obviously co-ordinated and no apparent accomplices. Time will tell about the suspect's motivations and background but even if he isn't left-wing and didn't specifically target republicans, Duncan's story is what will stick with the R base and that's going to be their narrative, full stop.

Here's what to expect (if everyone survives; otherwise it's all out the window): base will say that the media, D officials, AntiFa, George Soros, and performances of Julius Caesar are to blame. Some R congressmen will side with them and make veiled or not-so-veiled threats against the left and even their D colleagues. Pence, Ryan, and other ranking sociopaths will come out with a lot of somber concerns about the tone of our political discourse, and about mainstream media hysteria, and how the solution to all of this is to calm down and let them finish cutting taxes for the uber-rich and dismantling the social safety net and destroying the biosphere. Trump's handlers will tweet reasonable things, then he will tweet and say crazy and scary things.

I don't think (not 100% but pretty sure) that this one event will lead to terrifying legislation or the outlawing of leftist groups. What it will do is tell a lot (like millions) of crazy people on the other side that now it's their turn. If there's a more violent, more competent and more coordinated attack on D politicians or on left-wing activists in the near future it will not be surprising.

It all feels like more political violence toothpaste out of the tube that can't be crammed back in. Violent event met by violent event in increasing severity until...I'm going to go outside now.
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:10 AM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]

Dollars to donuts he'll be doing an interview from his hospital bed where he thanks the WELL-ARMED capitol police and will lament that this TRAGEDY could have been avoided had more people been armed.....(while playing softball)

It's like that Chapelle routine where he talks about men's reluctance to acknowledge male rape: "Caught me slippin'!"
posted by PenDevil at 7:10 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Congressman Scalise's pro-gun stance has earned him an A+ rating from the National Rifle Association.

I can't tell you how to feel but please don't express schadenfreude to people getting shot. It's distasteful.
posted by Talez at 7:11 AM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

Far-right blue checkmark Twitter is already claiming Shakespeare and Kathy Griffin are to blame.

If you had told me two years ago that this statement would not be a joke, there is no way I would have believed you.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:12 AM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

Dollars to donuts he'll be doing an interview from his hospital bed where he thanks the WELL-ARMED capitol police and will lament that this TRAGEDY could have been avoided had more people been armed.....(while playing softball)

Oh yeah. The NRA needs to jump on this. How American it would be to buy and use baseball bats with rifles secreted inside. Or mitts with pockets for pistols.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:14 AM on June 14, 2017

Far-right blue checkmark Twitter is already claiming Shakespeare and Kathy Griffin are to blame.

Donald Trump Jr. being one of those. (not going to link.)
posted by chris24 at 7:14 AM on June 14, 2017

Per MSNBC, Trumo has cancelled whatever ego-stroking thing he had planned today.

What a birthday present.

It should be interesting to see the gun rights drama that comes from this, given the circumstances of who got shot this time rather than PoC, gay people, small children, etc.
posted by jenfullmoon at 7:15 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Jon Favreau‏ @jonfavs

When asked why they're not releasing a draft of the [Senate healthcare] bill, a Senate GOP aide actually said, "We're not stupid."

This is deeply cynical shit.

This fucking year. This is what politics has come down to.
posted by Talez at 7:15 AM on June 14, 2017 [61 favorites]

It does appear that Team Trump is scheduling him to make a statement/speech about the shooting. So hold on to your hats.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:16 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

It does appear that Team Trump is scheduling him to make a statement/speech about the shooting. So hold on to your hats.

Well I just felt that surge of adrenaline that accompanies a panic attack.
posted by Talez at 7:19 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

I'm praying someone will stop him from waving the bloody shirt on live TV, but I don't have a lot of faith those prayers will be answered.
posted by corb at 7:19 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

These are Republicans - they will do the most disgusting and inflammatory thing possible.
posted by Artw at 7:20 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

I'm praying someone will stop him from waving the bloody shirt on live TV, but I don't have a lot of faith those prayers will be answered.

He's probably just going to talk about winning the electoral college
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:21 AM on June 14, 2017 [22 favorites]

He's probably just going to talk about winning the electoral college

And his birthday, I'd guess.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:21 AM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

>>Congressman Scalise's pro-gun stance has earned him an A+ rating from the National Rifle Association.

I can't tell you how to feel but please don't express schadenfreude to people getting shot. It's distasteful.

Speaking for myself, I'm not feeling shadenfreude. I am figuratively banging my head on my desk, murmuring things about leopards and faces.
posted by Dashy at 7:22 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

Congressman Scalise's pro-gun stance has earned him an A+ rating from the National Rifle Association.

I can't tell you how to feel but please don't express schadenfreude to people getting shot. It's distasteful.

Schadenfreude is taking pleasure in someone's misfortune. I'm not taking pleasure in Scalise's misfortune, but I am going to point out that perhaps it isn't "misfortune" if one constantly takes actions to increase the likelihood of an event happening and then that event happens. "I removed the brakes, steering wheel, mirrors, and spedometer from cars and prohibited road signs and driver license exams....[gets hit by a car]....WHO COULD HAVE PREDICTED THIS???"

I don't want anyone to be shot, that's why I'm in favor of strong gun control. There is no pleasure in this event, just as there is no misfortune in this event. Treating this as just "bad luck" and not the predictable consequences of specific policies promoted by one of our political parties is part of the problem.
posted by melissasaurus at 7:23 AM on June 14, 2017 [165 favorites]

It makes me physically sick to my stomach that Team Trump is going to try to bag this as a presidential moment.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 7:23 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

I'm betting he's going to blame the divisive media and use it as an excuse to shut down the "witch hunt" into his administration. He might pay some lip service to safety and security and guns (more guns!) but the only thing he cares about is how he can use the situation to help himself.
posted by lydhre at 7:23 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

There have been other periods of political violence and assassination in American history - not particularly delightful periods, true, but not "and everyone went to jail and it was terrible", either.

I'm thinking in particular of anarchist and "anarchist" (Leon Czolgosz seems to have been a pretty typical white male shooter, for instance, even though nominally anarchist) violence in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. There were bad consequences for left movements - I'd say the Palmer Raids were an indirect consequence - but it was survivable.

Like now, those acts were in a climate of general social and state violence - Alexander Berkman's unsuccessful attempt to assassinate Henry Clay Frick was prompted by the deaths of workers at the Homestead Steel strike after Frick hired armed Pinkertons to break the picket line. Like now, some people had quasi-reasons* and some people just had violent impulses and trauma. Just like now, a lot of "everyday" violence by the state and social forces was happening, but what people talked about was the spikes of assassination. A lot of people cared way more about Frick than about the Homestead workers.

Those were bad times for working people and the left, but they were not the end.

*Like, Berkman is one of my favorite anarchists, but that was a really, really bad idea. Even leaving the question of violence aside, what could he have accomplished if he'd spent 14 years organizing on the outside? He did great work in prison and emerged a wiser man, but you've got to think, this was kind of the heyday of anarchism as a viable social movement, with schools and social centers and the IWW and other real social formations, and a lot more could have been accomplished.
posted by Frowner at 7:27 AM on June 14, 2017 [23 favorites]

If we lose our empathy for others, what the hell is Left?

posted by Herodios at 7:27 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Rep. Brooks . . . said, "A pistol against a rifle is not a fair fight."

That's what Ramon Rojo said to the Man With No Name and look what happened to him.

posted by Herodios at 7:31 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

Katie Mettler/WaPo: As a prosecutor, Kamala Harris’s doggedness was praised. As a senator, she’s deemed ‘hysterical.’

Harris’s treatment has not gone unnoticed.

The admonishments from men have in fact elevated Harris’s profile, prompting comparisons with her with fellow female Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass), who was censured during Sessions’s confirmation hearing earlier this year and inspired the rallying cry, “Nevertheless, she persisted.”

After a contentious exchange between Harris and Sessions during Tuesday’s intelligence hearing, Harris tweeted: “The women of the United States Senate will not be silenced when seeking the truth.”

posted by ZeusHumms at 7:31 AM on June 14, 2017 [114 favorites]

There have been other periods of political violence and assassination in American history

like the 60s? - and what springs to mind is that it was more a symptom of our society sliding off the rails than any particular ideology getting violent

and no matter how people spin this, it's just more rail-sliding
posted by pyramid termite at 7:32 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

NBC News' Kasie Hunt (@kasie on Twitter) reports that "Reporters at Capitol have been told they are not allow to film interviews with senators in hallways, contrary to years of precedent. CONDITIONS for any interview: Previously granted permission from senator AND Rules Committee of Senate."

Welcome to running government like a business. Those creeps need a reminder that they work for us.

Sorry for my absence from these threads, I was out of town. I look forward to catching up on the skullduggery.
posted by Gelatin at 7:32 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

I believe that was reversed yesterday. Unless they have reversed the reversal?
posted by asteria at 7:34 AM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

The changes to the interview rules were taken back yesterday, after criticism from many sides.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:36 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

An FBI agent told NYT's Glenn Thrush (twitter) that this was not an assassination attempt, nor did the shooter ask what party was practicing there.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:41 AM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

A few comments deleted. Please don't rush to say the worst possible things about the guy who got shot. Lay off the specifically this-guy-centric condemnations just for the moment; it's not necessary.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 7:42 AM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

@OnTheMedia has some good advice for situations like this.
posted by scalefree at 7:42 AM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

The descriptions of the person seen with the AK-47 do not at all match the description of the person who asked what party the people practicing were. (Also, kind of hard to hide an AK in jogging clothes.) Given they took the guy alive, I'm content to wait for an official statement rather than conjecture about every person seen within a half mile of the ball field.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:44 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

An FBI agent told NYT's Glenn Thrush (twitter) that this was not an assassination attempt, nor did the shooter ask what party was practicing there.

What was it if not an assassination attempt? Did the shooter mistake them for cans on fenceposts? I'm guessing the FBI agent was trying to say that Scalise or other members weren't specifically targeted and that this qualifies more as a mass shooting.
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:47 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

According to the Washington Post, the shooter has been identified as James T. Hodgkinson, a 66-year-old home inspector (and small business owner) from Belleville, Illinois. I have no idea what his motive was, but he doesn't sound like your stereotypical antifa person.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:50 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

WaPo has identified alleged shooter as James T. Hodgkinson, a home inspector from Illinois. (I'm having trouble getting to WaPo right now)
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 7:50 AM on June 14, 2017

Sorry: article.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:50 AM on June 14, 2017

Hopefully just a normal every day mass shooting
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:51 AM on June 14, 2017 [23 favorites]

Just a normal and regular part of American life.
posted by Artw at 7:51 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

It probably won't matter what the actual motive is for this, even if it turns out to be a botched robbery, the right wing will know deep in their hearts it was a crazy liberal trying to overthrow the government.
posted by PenDevil at 7:51 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

@OnTheMedia has some good advice for situations like this.

Yes.

s'Funny thing: I'd never seen photos of Brooke Gladstone and Bob Garfield before looking at that twit page, and I must say that Brooke Gladstone and Bob Garfield look exactly like I would have imagined Brooke Gladstone and Bob Garfield would look, if I'd thought about it at all.

As you were.

posted by Herodios at 7:51 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

James T. Hodgkinson, per his Facebook profile, is a Bernie Sanders supporter.
posted by AwkwardPause at 7:53 AM on June 14, 2017

Hodgkinson doesn't look to be AntiFa but his facebook page has him as a big Bernie supporter and democratic socialist. Not a worst-case scenario (right-wingers have difficulty demonizing a middle aged white male WASP) but not super good.
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:54 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Also to note: he is white.
posted by AwkwardPause at 7:55 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

James T. Hodgkinson, per his Facebook profile, is a Bernie Sanders supporter.

Well, fuck.
posted by corb at 7:56 AM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

Dude's Facebook is wiiiide open.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:57 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

What corb said. Now the efforts to condemn the left will be doubled, and people will fall for it. Argh.
posted by Melismata at 7:58 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

POTUS is making a statement at 11:30 AM.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 7:59 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

The efforts to condemn the left would be doubled no matter what happened. They want us all dead and will use whatever rhetoric from whatever events to make sure they can legislate our demise.

Do they want to control access to guns and increase gun safety features? No? Then they can STFU about anything else involving guns. I don't care who is doing the shooting, we need to restrict access to guns and reduce the number of guns in this country, full stop.

Don't want to talk about guns? Ok, let's talk about toxic masculinity.

Guns and toxic masculinity; guns and toxic masculinity; guns and toxic masculinity. Stay on message; don't accept the premise of a bad faith question.
posted by melissasaurus at 8:03 AM on June 14, 2017 [70 favorites]

Robert Costa, Washington Post:

Charles Orear, 50, a restaurant manager from St. Louis, said in an interview Wednesday that he became friendly with James T. Hodgkinson, whom law enforcement officials identified as the shooter, during their work in Iowa on Sen. Bernie Sanders’s presidential campaign. Orear said Hodgkinson was a passionate progressive and showed no signs of violence or malice toward others.

“You’ve got to be kidding me,” Orear said when told by phone. “I met him on the Bernie trail in Iowa, worked with him in the Quad Cities area.”

Orear described Hodgkinson as a “quiet guy” who was “very mellow, very reserved” when they stayed overnight at a Sanders’s supporter home in Rock Island, Ill., after canvassing for the senator.

“He was this union tradesman, pretty stocky, and we stayed up talking politics,” he said. “He was more on the really progressive side of things.”

The Post reached out to Orear after seeing that he liked one of Hodkinson’s Facebook posts.

This is bad.
posted by biogeo at 8:03 AM on June 14, 2017 [19 favorites]

I'm now checking the comment section of stltoday for the local dirt.
posted by fluttering hellfire

now there's some eponstyericality
posted by the phlegmatic king at 8:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Small things to be thankful for: not a Clinton supporter or campaign staff, which would have prompted a more direct resurgence of investigations/lock-her-up-ism.

This is still very, very bad.
posted by lydhre at 8:06 AM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

On the plus side, it sounds like everyone who was taken to the hospital is stable and expected to recover.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:08 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

What corb said. Now the efforts to condemn the left will be doubled, and people will fall for it. Argh.

It's bad for sure, but imagine if he were a strong Clinton supporter and a photo was floating around of him at a campaign event with Podesta or something: the attack from the right on Hillary would be deafening and you'd be amazed (but maybe not surprised) by how far up you'd see calls to investigate/arrest her as a probable conspirator. The amount of antipathy on the right toward Bernie is nonexistent compared to that toward Hillary and believe it or not, this still isn't nearly as bad as it could be.
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:08 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

To put this event in a different perspective: no one died; on average, three women in the US will die in childbirth today. But instead of regulating guns, we're cutting maternal healthcare.
posted by melissasaurus at 8:10 AM on June 14, 2017 [108 favorites]

I'm grateful to the law enforcement officers who were able to subdue this guy before he was able to do any more damage, and to the medical professionals whose skill has saved the victims' lives. Look for the helpers.
posted by biogeo at 8:11 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

Or if it had been a Muslim...
posted by AwkwardPause at 8:11 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Dude is an overweight senior citizen. Do we really think he would have even gotten close enough to the victims to stab them if he had to rely on a knife? This is about gun control and that's what the left needs to repeat ad nauseum.
posted by asteria at 8:12 AM on June 14, 2017 [21 favorites]

I can already feel the burning heat of the scorching hot takes about What This Means and Who's Really to Blame (Spoiler: It's Who I Always Thought Was to Blame Before This Happened!)

Maybe best to just take a day or two off from the Internet today, perhaps even this thread.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:12 AM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]

I completely agree with melissasaurus--there's an ~~easy~~ answer here, and it involves much more stringent regulation of access to firearms and addressing the kind of toxic masculinity that leads to someone being unable to cope with their emotions.

From a legislative perspective, passing protective regulations makes a great deal of sense. Let's add universal background checks for all firearm purchases. It should be harder to get a weapon to open fire on anyone.

From a larger societal stand point, we must start educating our children about emotional recognition and regulation and how to cope with unpleasant emotions like anger/rage and feeling powerless. Our society's children are failed terribly in this regard--especially boys who are often discouraged from learning to recognize/express emotions other than anger and who do not learn healthy coping skills.

No one should be shot--even those guys who have been working against these goals. They are fellow human beings who do not deserve violence to be direct at them. I hope for their speedy recovery.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:16 AM on June 14, 2017 [58 favorites]

Just found this Facebook page called "Gun Owners in Support of James T. Hodgkinson."

Don't know whether it's parody or support, but what the fuck is wrong with people in either case.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 8:19 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

CBS is reporting that the gun used was a M4 Assault rifle. He also had a handgun.
posted by Jalliah at 8:20 AM on June 14, 2017

What corb said. Now the efforts to condemn the left will be doubled

But the crazy right wingers I know? They already believe that Hilary Clinton had Seth Rich killed (along with a whole bunch of other people, apparently.) They refer to the Portland stabber as a "Bernie bro" as if that were more relevant than his anti-Muslim ranting. They think black bloc and antifa people are some kind of paramilitary, along with Black Lives Matter. They think Muslims have already imposed Sharia law on some American towns. They think that Democrats are somehow big fans of terrorism and that Obama and Hillary helped found ISIS.

So this? In the context of all that? Would just be more of the same. Not an escalation at all.

I'm not sure what they'll make of it. Will they admit to themselves that it is different, that the rest of that is just a product of their fevered imaginations? You would think they would have to, if they are going to make a big deal out of this at all.

Or will they NOT make a big deal out of it? I mean will the seriously deluded base just shrug and say "Yeah, that's how liberals are" and go on as they were before, delusional, but no more so than they already were?
posted by OnceUponATime at 8:22 AM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

Unsure where the excerpt is from originally but this came across my Twitter: Tillerson won't begin staffing State Dept till next year. This is insane.
posted by scalefree at 8:24 AM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]

Isn't that a military rifle? Not that the AR-15 that is beloved of militia members and mass shooters is functionally all that different.
posted by Artw at 8:25 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

It makes me physically sick to my stomach that Team Trump is going to try to bag this as a presidential moment.

Anyone know which cable news face is next in line to declare he just became president of the United States?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 8:27 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Laura Benanti’s Melania Trump Is Back on The Late Show and Just So, So Happy to Be Moving to D.C.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:27 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

One tiny bright spot for me in this tragedy is that no one in our space is latching on to the idea that the alleged shooter is "mentally ill". As someone coping with mental illness, I get really steamed when people immediately jump to that hypothesis. The vast majority of people managing a mental illness do not commit violent crimes and in fact, are much more likely to be the targets of violence than the general population.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:28 AM on June 14, 2017 [19 favorites]

So this? In the context of all that? Would just be more of the same. Not an escalation at all.

Exactly. No change (apart from the dead and injured).

What This Means and Who's Really to Blame (Spoiler: It's Who I Always Thought Was to Blame Before This Happened!)

I actually know someone who became a 'gun-nut' because a specific politician, hated for other 'reasons', favoured gun control. The logic was: "if So-And-So is against guns, I must be for them."

Regrettably, I know of no examples of the reverse.

posted by Herodios at 8:28 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

What corb said. Now the efforts to condemn the left will be doubled
---
So this? In the context of all that? Would just be more of the same. Not an escalation at all.

Exactly. The people who are going to be awful about this were already awful. The hypocrites who would ignore Gabby Giffords and Charleston and Quebec City to think this damns the left as violent already think it and are beyond reach. Not to say this isn't tragic or not bad, but it's not catastrophic and our energy is better spent speaking truth about gun control and mental health and fighting for healthcare than worrying if this is a Reichstag fire.
posted by chris24 at 8:29 AM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

One tiny bright spot for me in this tragedy is that no one in our space is latching on to the idea that the alleged shooter is "mentally ill". As someone coping with mental illness, I get really steamed when people immediately jump to that hypothesis. The vast majority of people managing a mental illness do not commit violent crimes and in fact, are much more likely to be the targets of violence than the general population.

Literally the only reason is because "mental illness" is literally nothing but an excuse to ignore decades of escalating right-wing terrorism. This guy isn't right-wing, therefore the excuse is unneeded.
posted by Pope Guilty at 8:30 AM on June 14, 2017 [21 favorites]

Isn't that a military rifle? Not that the AR-15 that is beloved of militia members and mass shooters is functionally all that different.

Wikipedia says it's used by the military. Others here probably know more about it which is one of the reasons I posted it. The comments I've been reading right now are divided on whether a non military person could even get one. There are suggestions that CBS has to be wrong and that it's must be something else. Others are saying no you can get one quite easily.
posted by Jalliah at 8:32 AM on June 14, 2017

I mean is this going to be a "boy who cried wolf" situation for right-wing media figures, where they can't get their base riled up about this, because they've lied to their followers so much before now, and convinced them that this sort of thing happens all the time?

We can hope, but a lot of the base is on the lookout for a reason to get more riled up (do yourself a favor and don't google "clinton obama sanders shooting targets").

Be careful out there, folks.
posted by Etrigan at 8:32 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Isn't that a military rifle?

Yes. It's the replacement for the M16.
It apparently has Problems in Dessert Environments.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:32 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Unsure where the excerpt is from originally but this came across my Twitter: Tillerson won't begin staffing State Dept till next year. This is insane.

It's from a NYT article: Will cuts hurt diplomacy? Tillerson tries to ease Senate's worries
posted by photo guy at 8:33 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Others are saying no you can get one quite easily.

The M4 carbine assault rifle is a military weapon but legal for civilians to own in semi-auto configurations with 16 inch barrels. M4 replicas made just for civilian use have 16 inch barrels already but the military weapon is a short-barreled configuration (14.5 inches.)
posted by xyzzy at 8:35 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

It apparently has Problems in Dessert Environments.

On what seems a bleak morning all around, this typo (which is in the article linked) has given me a smile and a chuckle. So thanks for that.
posted by nubs at 8:35 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

It apparently has Problems in Dessert Environments.

What, like Dairy Queen?
posted by Fleebnork at 8:36 AM on June 14, 2017 [30 favorites]

Fox News already has a story up blaming criticism of Trump/Republicans for the attack and referring to such speech as "rhetorical terrorism."
posted by contraption at 8:36 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Exactly. The people who are going to be awful about this were already awful.

I dunno, maybe. Members of Congress, now having faced AN ACTUAL SHOOTER IN PERSON, in the flesh, not just some vague idea 3,000 miles away, might be just a little more fearful than before. Perhaps they will be more aware that there are constituents out there, real people, whom they are suppose to serve. Maybe now they will learn that Congress is not just a navel-gazing club. Maybe. If being shot at can't make someone more cautious, especially when you are as sheltered from reality as they are, I don't know what can.
posted by Melismata at 8:37 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

but the military weapon is a short-barreled configuration (14.5 inches.)

which is also legal for a civilian to own with a $200 tax stamp. (in both semi-automatic and automatic versions; although you're talking the difference between a $2000 rifle and a $20,000 rifle.)
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 8:38 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

I am watching the livestream of Trump for some reason. Why do I do this to myself? I hate seeing his face and hearing his voice. He says the shooter is dead.
posted by prefpara at 8:38 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Fox News already has a story up blaming criticism of Trump/Republicans for the attack and referring to such speech as "rhetorical terrorism."

Fascism 101.
posted by diogenes at 8:40 AM on June 14, 2017 [31 favorites]

Trump speaking now but coming across as almost ghoulish. He's mouthing the typical platitudes but his delivery has a weird sinister aspect. I think he thinks it's his "serious" voice?
posted by Barack Spinoza at 8:40 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

Sadly I think the effect it'll have on Congress will be the opposite effect of responsiveness to constituents. If you thought they were hard to reach because of TrumpCare, just watch them use this to retreat even further into hiding.
posted by scalefree at 8:41 AM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

which is also legal for a civilian to own with a $200 tax stamp.

Yes, but I was focusing on the "easy to get" version that might be readily available to an unemployed person who probably has a permit. The tax stamp and cost of the military configuration would be prohibitive for casual owners.
posted by xyzzy at 8:41 AM on June 14, 2017

Legit wonder if he's going to try and make a grab for martial law or some kind retribution against democrats or protesters.

Not because it makes any sense at all but because he'd love to use any excuse to flex his muscles.
posted by Tevin at 8:41 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

but the military weapon is a short-barreled configuration (14.5 inches.)

which is also legal for a civilian to own with a $200 tax stamp. (in both semi-automatic and automatic versions; although you're talking the difference between a $2000 rifle and a $20,000 rifle.

And a whole lot more paperwork and oversight, to include an in person interview if this link is to be believed, and, perhaps obliviously, more time (both per transaction and for the initial approval). But I'll step away because I honestly think the diving into nuance here is both misleading and derail-ish when compared to the actual discussion.
posted by RolandOfEld at 8:41 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

From what I can tell, you can open carry pretty much anything in VA.
posted by emjaybee at 8:42 AM on June 14, 2017

"rhetorical terrorism."

Fascism 101.

I mean we've been talking about "stochastic terrorism" for years, and it is possible this is that kind of thing. We don't know what sorts of propaganda this guy has been listening to -- there are extremists on "our" side too.

We need to be better about condemning them that the right wing is about condemning theirs.
posted by OnceUponATime at 8:42 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Trump's statement was completely normal. Which was weird in and of itself.
posted by prefpara at 8:42 AM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]

Members of Congress, now having faced AN ACTUAL SHOOTER IN PERSON, in the flesh, not just some vague idea 3,000 miles away, might be just a little more fearful than before.

Alternately, very few of them were part of this. There's a good chance the rest will view this as a challenge to their masculinity (being overwhelmingly male, white, and toxic and all), which will only make them double down on all their bullshit. And their partisanship. "We won't back down," "Won't bend in the face of intimidation," etc.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 8:42 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

I mean, not normal for him. What a normal politician would say.
posted by prefpara at 8:43 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

I think he thinks it's his "serious" voice

His "I am srs candidate/presnidet, this is my srs voice" is terrible, creepy and weird. I think he practices in front of a mirror.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:44 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Isn't that a military rifle? Not that the AR-15 that is beloved of militia members and mass shooters is functionally all that different.

I expect they meant "an M4 style rifle," which is to say an AR with an M4-looking stock and handguard instead of a M16-looking.

in both semi-automatic and automatic versions

It's illegal for an ordinary civilian to own any full-auto firearm that wasn't already ordinary-civilian-owned in 1986. It would be impossible for an actual M4 to be legally owned by an ordinary civilian (as opposed to a class-whatever-licensed firearms dealer).
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:44 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

The fact that he gave a reasonable speech urging calm and restraint - meaning it probably wasn't written by him - is the only reason I can actually believe him when he says the shooter is dead.
posted by TwoWordReview at 8:45 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

Here's a very short letter to send to your Congresscritters. We on the left must push back vigorously on the idea that we approve of these actions, while also continuing to advocate for protective firearm regulations.

Please convey my deepest sympathies to your colleagues who were targetted in a mass shooting this morning. It is an unequivocal tragedy, and I hope for their speedy recovery. I am a human being and American first--politics be damned. No one should *ever* have to feel the sort of terror inherent to being the target of a mass shooting. No one.

I believe this incident underscore our country's urgent need for more stringent protective regulations on firearms. I support universal background checks and large magazine bans. These are common sense measures that would reduce firearm deaths. Thank you for your work on this issue.

posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:45 AM on June 14, 2017 [25 favorites]

When we say that Bernie wanted to start a revolution and calls his group "OurRevolution" it's commonly understood that this is metaphorical- Bernie's revolution was supposed to occur within certain bounds of acceptable behavior. Not like an actual shooting-war capital-R Revolution. But that common understanding may not have been shared among everyone.

I understand the left's desire to keep up unrelenting, intense political pressure to achieve their goals. And using metaphorical language can be helpful for that. But we should note for the record that hyperbolic or metaphorical language can, with a large enough population of people that might misunderstand it, produce results like this. The degree to which we consider our own rhetoric to have contributed to this incident should be related to the degree to which we consider Jo Cox's murder to be the result of stochastic terrorism.

The idea that this will have no real impact is foreign to me. I understand that people think that political opinion is inelastic, but opinions do change. When you see a fluctuating graph of approval ratings, not all of that variation is just sampling error. Events matter.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 8:46 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

If being shot at can't make someone more cautious, especially when you are as sheltered from reality as they are, I don't know what can.

Perhaps. Congress has certainly become less collegial, more partisan, and more combative as a diminishing number of members have had the experience of actually being shot at.

posted by Herodios at 8:47 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

Fox News already has a story up blaming criticism of Trump/Republicans for the attack and referring to such speech as "rhetorical terrorism."

Fuck them and their hypocrisy. They had no problem with their former VP candidate putting crosshairs on congressional targets in a mailer or their president calling for second amendment folks to take out his opponent. Or the two times Caesar was Obama in the damn play, or 8 years of burning Obama in effigy/fake lynchings.
posted by chris24 at 8:47 AM on June 14, 2017 [54 favorites]

Hmm...
posted by Artw at 8:49 AM on June 14, 2017 [46 favorites]

I mean, that was as good as Trump gets. It's not great, but he did fine. That's so strange to say.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:51 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

I understand the left's desire to keep up unrelenting, intense political pressure to achieve their goals. And using metaphorical language can be helpful for that. But we should note for the record that hyperbolic or metaphorical language can, with a large enough population of people that might misunderstand it, produce results like this. The degree to which we consider our own rhetoric to have contributed to this incident should be related to the degree to which we consider Jo Cox's murder to be the result of stochastic terrorism.

We want to regulate guns through electing pro-gun-regulation representatives. The other side says the second amendment right to bear arms is our most precious one because it allows us to violently overthrow a tyrannical government when needed. Whose rhetoric is the problem here?
posted by melissasaurus at 8:52 AM on June 14, 2017 [46 favorites]

Yes, but I was focusing on the "easy to get" version that might be readily available to an unemployed person who probably has a permit.

Since the shooter is from Illinois, it's very likely to be more along the lines of the 16" barrel version, which puts this rifle in the $800-$1200 range. I'll also amend that with the observation that SBR's are prohibited entirely in Illinois, even with the tax stamp, unless they fall under the Curio & Relic classification, which an AR-15 platform rifle does not.

This rifle, in any format,would be banned in Chicago (Cook County?) entirely, as an "Assault Weapon", but would be legal in the rest of the state.

Looks like an entirely unexceptional weapon for a United States citizen. There are millions of these out there.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 8:52 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Paul Ryan announced on the floor that tomorrow's game will still happen, which received a standing ovation from Congress. I think they are now adjourning for the rest of the day.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:53 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

Meanwhile, a group of protesters have set the Venezuelan Supreme Tribunal of Justice building on fire after it rejected a motion to stop President Nicolas Maduro from rewriting the constitution. The Tribunal is their equivalent of our Supreme Court.

This has been an ongoing saga. At the end of March, the Court annulled the powers of the legislative branch, the Assembly, to allow judges to write laws. There were demonstrations and protests. The President's staff condemned the decision -- see below for why this is significant. The Court backed down.

Until that point, Court had supported President Maduro against the legislature and the opposition party, which was calling for his removal. Then they went too far. The President criticized them and they seem to have turned on him. The result has been an ongoing battle for control, and a series of protests against the government which have left dozens dead and thousands injured.
posted by zarq at 8:54 AM on June 14, 2017 [20 favorites]

When we say that Bernie wanted to start a revolution and calls his group "OurRevolution" it's commonly understood that this is metaphorical- Bernie's revolution was supposed to occur within certain bounds of acceptable behavior.

It would be an understatement to say that I'm not a fan of Bernie or his movement, but he has always been 100% clear that he is interested in a *political* revolution. He wants a fundamental change in the way politics works. It would be a real stretch to get from that language to shooting people.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:55 AM on June 14, 2017 [44 favorites]

Members of Congress, now having faced AN ACTUAL SHOOTER IN PERSON, in the flesh, not just some vague idea 3,000 miles away, might be just a little more fearful than before.

And yet if they do become fearful, the most likely response will be that they, personally and specifically, need to have armed bodyguards at all times to protect them from the risks and threats they face, while the rest of us will be just as likely as ever to get randomly gunned down at church/work/shopping/movies/anywhere and everywhere.

Just like Congress has outstanding taxpayer-funded healthcare, while the majority of its members work relentlessly to make sure the rest of us don't.
posted by the turtle's teeth at 8:58 AM on June 14, 2017 [29 favorites]

If we're going to tone-police calls for political revolution then we all might as well put on MAGA hats and start laying bricks for the border wall. Removing the language of desperate hope would leave us with only the despair.
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:59 AM on June 14, 2017 [21 favorites]

It would be a real stretch to get from that language to shooting people.

We need to acknowlege that the left has just as many moonbats as the right does. The whole "Bernie Bro" thing clearly exposes that there is an overlap in mentality among many of the Left's moonbats and the Right's moonbats (Tea Party, etc). There exist a minority of people that are fed up to the point of violence on both sides of the political aisle, and their rhetoric is shockingly similar.

This is going to get much worse before it gets better.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 8:59 AM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

Yeah, if you want to point to language from Democrats as being incendiary and easily interpreted as a call to violence, you're gonna need to cite your sources.

Conversely, there's a dude who ran for president on the Republican ticket last year who made references to "Second Amendment people" taking care of Hillary Clinton. And he's in the White House now. Oh, and a dude literally body slammed a reporter in Montana not too long ago and he also got elected. Turns out he's a Republican.

This country is awash in guns and toxic masculinity. Sometimes Democrats own guns, too, and some small subset of them will do awful shit with those guns. But this flatly not a case of Democratic leaders, politicians, or activists needing a moment of introspection.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 9:01 AM on June 14, 2017 [120 favorites]

We need to acknowlege that the left has just as many moonbats as the right does

Technically, the Left has moonbats, while the Right has wingnuts.

posted by Herodios at 9:02 AM on June 14, 2017 [66 favorites]

> We need to acknowlege that the left has just as many moonbats as the right does.

No. "Just as many"? No way, [Citation Needed].
posted by RedOrGreen at 9:03 AM on June 14, 2017 [41 favorites]

After decades of right-wing violence going steadily ignored, this incident will be used to argue that everybody left of, well, Steve Scalise needs to be jailed.
posted by Pope Guilty at 9:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

It is not much of a leap from "We must punch Nazis" and "Republicans are Nazis" for someone to figure shooting is stronger than punching, and act accordingly.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 9:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

When we say that Bernie wanted to start a revolution and calls his group "OurRevolution" it's commonly understood that this is metaphorical- Bernie's revolution was supposed to occur within certain bounds of acceptable behavior. Not like an actual shooting-war capital-R Revolution. But that common understanding may not have been shared among everyone.

Blaming Sanders for this is ridiculous. He wasn't calling for an armed conflict. Trump's language throughout the campaign was inflammatory, racist and othering toward a whole bunch of marginalized groups. He's been trying to ban an entire religious group from entry into the country. Nothing Bernie has ever said or done in his long political career can come close to what Trump has over the last two years.

I suspect that many people (not just me) feel threatened by Republicans. They are worried that their healthcare will be taken away. That their most basic civil liberties are in danger. That a deregulated economy is more likely to crash and harm millions. Republicans do not appear to be acting in the best interests of this country and its people.

Fear is a powerful motivator.
posted by zarq at 9:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [45 favorites]

Good reason to heavily regulate guns and provide easy access to fists.
posted by melissasaurus at 9:05 AM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

Thank you scaryblackdeath. I was just about to say the same thing. Republicans have been using this language forever, and are never called out on it. Where was Trump's outrage against Ted Nugent's inflammatory political rhetoric? Nowhere to be found.
posted by greermahoney at 9:05 AM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

NBC (twitter link) says the shooter has a domestic violence record.

So, while we're definitely never gong to have a conversation about common sense gun control, there's continued evidence that people who are arrested for violence shouldn't have access to a gun.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:05 AM on June 14, 2017 [96 favorites]

> There exist a minority of people that are fed up to the point of violence on both sides of the political aisle, and their rhetoric is shockingly similar.

This is false equivalence bullshit of the highest order. Show me anything like this detailed report from the SPLC that shows the kind of sustained, escalating campaign of harassment and violence coming from the left side of the spectrum.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:06 AM on June 14, 2017 [50 favorites]

I think while there is an overlap, it doesn't stretch to the whole of "the left" but rather a section of, frankly, white male misogynists (that DV arrest is STRONGLY indicative) who are equally as angry about their disappearing privilege as the MAGAhats, but who are largely Democrats by identity and expect people to always be talking to them. This is the group I expect to see violence from, just as it is their counterpart on the right I expect to see if it comes from there. People who expect the world will always go their way and with no tools to accept it will not any longer.

We waste our time arguing about which party this subset belongs to rather than worrying about this subset creating violence that will spill onto all of us.
posted by corb at 9:07 AM on June 14, 2017 [48 favorites]

> We waste our time arguing about which party this subset belongs to rather than worrying about this subset creating violence that will spill onto all of us.

When one party is explicitly fostering and embracing this toxic masculinity and violent rhetoric at the highest levels -- the highest level in fact -- we can and must do both.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:08 AM on June 14, 2017 [27 favorites]

Sanders Statement on Alexandria Shooter
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:08 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

It's being reported the shooter had a history of domestic violence, which is so frequently true of mass shooters as to almost be a cliche, and yet somehow nobody seems to discuss it in the same way that violence toward animals is generally treated as a predictor of psychopathology.

Probably because we live in a horrible goddamn fucking world in which cruelty to animals is correctly seen as being unspeakable awful but domestic violence is just sort of part of the background noise, something we may not like but just see as part and parcel of living in a violent world.

It isn't. I know there won't be any gun control as a result of this, but, as far as I am concerned, if a person is convicted of domestic violence, it should automatically prevent them from accessing guns.
posted by maxsparber at 9:09 AM on June 14, 2017 [108 favorites]

I think we're letting the right-wing drive the narrative with the debate we're having on the shooter's political motivations. We should give the same simple response we have to all mass shootings: we need gun control. I don't care what side of the aisle they're on, no one should be getting easy access to guns.
posted by Emily's Fist at 9:09 AM on June 14, 2017 [25 favorites]

165 days have passed in 2017.

We've had 154 mass shootings since the beginning of the year.

We need to acknowlege that the left has just as many moonbats as the right does.

We need to focus on what matters and acknowledge that Americans are being slaughtered by guns on a daily basis. This is our reality. The sooner we do something about it, the safer we'll all be.
posted by zarq at 9:11 AM on June 14, 2017 [55 favorites]

there's continued evidence that people who are arrested for violence shouldn't have access to a gun.

I don't disagree but I take this more as evidence that men who assault women should be treated as though they've assaulted real living important people, like let's say we write a law that defines a wife as one-tenth of a congressman, human-value-wise. and the legal consequences should reflect that. meaning, there should be some lasting ones. completely apart from whether they get to buy some fun-guns ten years later. to which I agree, no.
posted by queenofbithynia at 9:13 AM on June 14, 2017 [35 favorites]

While the far right has a more organized ideology of political violence, they aren't the sole owners of it, and certainly domestic violence is beholden to no party.

I'll repeat what others have said here: The biggest problem is guns.
posted by maxsparber at 9:13 AM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]

The left might have some eccentrics, but it has nothing like the kind of violence advocacy and issues that the right does. Meanwhile we have a right-winger, or at least a useful idiot for the right, who is in the highest office of the land and has advocated violence against his opponents.

There is really no "both sides-ism" to see here. There are certainly a toxic set of "Bernie Bros" who, as I recall, actually switched to Trump, voted third-party, or not at all. As Corb and Maxsparber pointed out, the issue seems to be violence, and white male violence and entitlement in particular, rather than "See? Both Sides Do It!" The shooter had a history of domestic violence, and he was old enough that cognitive impairment or even dementia might have had a hand in the shooting.

The thing I worry about is not so much a "Reichstag Fire" incident as a whole lot of Democrats deciding they have to meekly roll over and not push back against any possibility that the Moist Pustule and the GOP will use this to boost their popularity (a soft Reichstag fire if you will).
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 9:13 AM on June 14, 2017 [19 favorites]

I do think it's worth taking this opportunity to remind ourselves, though, that while we can and should criticize Republicans and disagree with them, we need to make sure we don't dehumanize them.

Because when you start dehumanizing people, you make it okay to kill them. We need to say "You're wrong" and "You've gone to far" without saying stuff like "You're worthless" "You're disgusting."

The fact that right wing figures do this all the time (along with calling for "second amendment solutions" etc) does not make it okay for us to do it. It makes us hypocrites if we do it.

It's true that there are many more violent extremists on their side, but as polarization gets worse, there are going to be at least a few on our side, and we cannot make excuses for them, or else "both sides" arguments are going to come true.
posted by OnceUponATime at 9:14 AM on June 14, 2017 [24 favorites]

> Rep. Brooks is on CNN lamenting the fact that they didn't have more guns with which to return fire

> He also said, "A pistol against a rifle is not a fair fight." Soo what the hell. Is the NRA going to suggest open carry for rifles everywhere now? Because every American needs to be ready for a "fair fight."

Gandhi: "An eye for an eye only ends up making the whole world blind"
NRA: "Kill 'em all and let our White, Christian god sort 'em out"
posted by filthy light thief at 9:15 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

Blaming Sanders for this is ridiculous. He wasn't calling for an armed conflict.

I understand this. You understand this. Maybe not everyone understands this. Actual revolutions involve violence.

Conversely, there's a dude who ran for president on the Republican ticket...
Republicans have been using this language forever...
Trump's language throughout...

Guys... you're not technically wrong, but this is whataboutism. It's okay to think about what we're doing for at least a couple seconds without exculpating ourselves by comparing to something worse. I am not saying "hey, maybe we should be Republicans because their language doesn't get people shot"; that's plainly false as the history of right-wing terrorism attests.

There exist a minority of people that are fed up to the point of violence on both sides of the political aisle, and their rhetoric is shockingly similar.

Eh, the right's had a worse problem with terrorism than we have. Saying "maybe this is a problem" doesn't mean we have to agree with "the left is just as bad as the right".
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 9:15 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Yeah, if you want to point to language from Democrats as being incendiary and easily interpreted as a call to violence, you're gonna need to cite your sources.

There's always going to be somebody willing to say the stupid thing for the other side to latch on to & triumphantly wave as proof that everyone on that side of politics is evil scum. The difference is it's usually someone at the top of the food chain for Republicans & some random unknown who has 3 followers on Twitter for Democrats.
posted by scalefree at 9:15 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Mark Knoeller reports (twitter, sorry) that one of the victims taken to GWU has died.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:17 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

2014:

Majority Whip Steve Scalise says he abhors hate groups, but acknowledged on Monday that he may have spoken at a white supremacist conference led by the notorious former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke in 2002.

“I didn’t know who all of these groups were and I detest any kind of hate group,” Scalise, the third highest-ranking Republican leader in the House, told the New Orleans Times-Picayune. “For anyone to suggest that I was involved with a group like that is insulting and ludicrous.”

The interview came hours after Scalise’s office acknowledged that a report claiming that the Louisiana congressman spoke at a gathering of the Duke-run European-American Unity and Rights Organization (EURO) as a state legislator in 2002 could be accurate. The Southern Poverty Law Center, which tracks extremist organizations, has listed EURO as a “white nationalist” hate group.
posted by gucci mane at 9:18 AM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

Members of Congress, now having faced AN ACTUAL SHOOTER IN PERSON, in the flesh, not just some vague idea 3,000 miles away, might be just a little more fearful than before.

My first thought reading this was to think of Rep Jackie Speier , who started her political career as an aide to Rep Leo Ryan, and was with him when he flew down to Guyana to investigate Jonestown. During his assassination, she was shot, and waited nearly a day for help.
posted by ZeusHumms at 9:18 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

The more the culture on both sides talks in violent terms and jokes in violent terms, or in terms of hatred, the more we normalize actual violence for people who are unstable. It's a zeitgeist thing and I see it these days in the unapologetic racism/sexism/homophobia/anti-trans behavior of lots of unstable people in my community.

It is a tragedy that this happened and though I'm no fan of the victims politically, I'm as appalled this happened to them as I am at the Giffords shooting, the most comparable event I can think of in the U.S.
posted by bearwife at 9:19 AM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

It is not much of a leap from "We must punch Nazis" and "Republicans are Nazis" for someone to figure shooting is stronger than punching, and act accordingly.

No, this is something that is transparently false on the ground if you spend time around the Nazi-punching left. It's a cultural thing. The Nazi-punching left thinks fighting - punching, etc - is sort of macho and cool. That's the worst that can be said - that if no one gets killed violence is kind of cool as long as you win. People on the anti-Nazi left are not, culturally, people who are into guns. I'm not saying this can never change, or that there is 100% never any overlap, but in general, this is not a slippery slope.

It's like there are cultural differences between green anarchists and anarcho syndicalists. You might think "they are both anarchists!!!" but they don't agree on end goals, tactics, priorities or how humans tend to work. The differences are obscured if you are not there, but they are very real on the ground, and you do not generally just drift from one to the other.
posted by Frowner at 9:19 AM on June 14, 2017 [32 favorites]

I'll repeat what others have said here: The biggest problem is guns.

It's being reported the shooter had a history of domestic violence, which is so frequently true of mass shooters as to almost be a cliche...

I would counter that the biggest problem here is toxic masculinity combined with guns.
posted by Sophie1 at 9:21 AM on June 14, 2017 [33 favorites]

@jdawsey1: President Trump has canceled his events today, per White House pool, after this morning's shooting. He is monitoring developments.

Ah, so he has the whole day to watch FOX and tweet. Great.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 9:22 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Mark Knoeller reports (twitter, sorry) that one of the victims taken to GWU has died.

It's the shooter.

posted by Herodios at 9:22 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

"Republicans are Nazis"

There's currently two neo-Nazis as senior advisors to the president. So maybe that line isn't such a leap.
posted by chris24 at 9:22 AM on June 14, 2017 [52 favorites]

165 days have passed in 2017.

We've had 154 mass shootings since the beginning of the year.

The most disgusting thing about today has been how overtly different this is being treated by politicians and media because it's happening to them, for once. It happens every day, but now it's happening to them, so it matters. They're all talking about how quiet and suburban they're used to their environment being, and now it's disrupted by a mass shooting. Welcome to America.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:23 AM on June 14, 2017 [82 favorites]

The more the culture on both sides talks in violent terms and jokes in violent terms, or in terms of hatred, the more we normalize actual violence for people who are unstable.

Angela Davis on "violence."
posted by melissasaurus at 9:24 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Conversely, there's a dude who ran for president on the Republican ticket...
Republicans have been using this language forever...
Trump's language throughout...

Guys... you're not technically wrong, but this is whataboutism.

I'm sorry, no. I'm generally big on "Hey, did I make a mistake somewhere?" and I wish more people were, but if there's any "whataboutism" going on, it's the attempt to draw any parallel between Sanders and his campaign's "revolution" talk and the body slamming, passive-aggressive calls to assassination, and "carry that guy out on a stretcher" talk of the Republicans.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 9:24 AM on June 14, 2017 [34 favorites]

Not to diminish the important Alexandria & gun control discussion, but I wanted to circle back to the interim elections discussion:

And I don't want to be Negative Nancy on this either, but I keep thinking about the Bloomberg article on 39 states affected by the Russian hacking of the US Electoral system, and the voting results coming in left & right with current local elections.

If the systems were hacked, were they healed? Is anyone monitoring their security? How do we even know if the results are accurate? (I'm serious.)
posted by yoga at 9:24 AM on June 14, 2017 [23 favorites]

That's the worst that can be said - that if no one gets killed violence is kind of cool as long as you win

Your 'Nazi-Punching' lefty circles are dramatically different from mine. In my experience, there is a WHOLE LOT of overlap between "Nazi Punching" and "Fetch The Guillotine" rhetorical use.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 9:26 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

I left for one hour. I cannot believe that I came back to someone trying to implicate Bernie Sanders in this tragedy in any way. Gross.
posted by Room 641-A at 9:28 AM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

There's currently two neo-Nazis as senior advisors to the president. So maybe that line isn't such a leap.

They share a lot of ideology with Nazis. This is true.

But this is not WWII. We don't shoot people for their ideology at this moment in history. We have much better solutions available to us right now.

Still, I have no doubt that there are some confused and angry people who think the only thing you can do with Nazis is shoot them, because history. I personally am going to be more careful how I deploy that language when I don't know who might be listening. I think it's very accurate in some ways, but the possibility that some people are going to draw the wrong conclusions from it is frighteningly real.
posted by OnceUponATime at 9:30 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

A year ago Rand Paul tweeted that the reason we have the Second Amendment is to shoot at the government when it becomes tyrannical. (Of course, Obama was president, then.) It's hard to address this elephant in the room without sounding like we're blaming the victim, but I don't think the answer to that dilemma is to blame Bernie Sanders for using the word "revolution."
posted by the turtle's teeth at 9:30 AM on June 14, 2017 [103 favorites]

According to Angeles Arrien's Tarot Growth Chart methodology, when DJT turns 70 at 10:54am tomorrow he will end his Strength/Lust (11) year and will commence a new Hanged Man (12) year.

I dunno if anyone reads tarot cards besides me, but this basically indicates a trial of character and principle that could go either way in pretty radical fashion. That's not a good card for the rest of us, seeing as how Trump's narcissism and desire to be admired basically results in chaos and escalation. It can also indicate his being set up as a fall guy for whoever wants to use his leadership as a platform for forwarding their own agenda.

Not that we need tarot cards to see any of that being likely to happen, but that card isn't a reason to get comfortable. Just the opposite.
posted by Autumnheart at 9:30 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

The Rand Paul Twitter ArtW has posted,is from June 2016, not this June. There are no recent comments in that twitter thread.
posted by Oyéah at 9:31 AM on June 14, 2017

Sanders has zero responsibility for this. He has done nothing to encourage violence. He refers specifically to a "political revolution".
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:34 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

The most disgusting thing about today has been how overtly different this is being treated by politicians and media because it's happening to them, for once. It happens every day, but now it's happening to them, so it matters.

See also white people and Sandy Hook.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 9:34 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

Oof, do we have to talk about Sandy Hook this way?
posted by all about eevee at 9:37 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

People are being pulled off the streets, separated from their families, and deported to violent ends or detained in horrible conditions. Children are being murdered for playing in parks while black. Black children were systematically poisoned in Flint, to the extent that it warranted involuntary manslaughter charges. Let's not act like this is some "new" level of political violence.
posted by melissasaurus at 9:38 AM on June 14, 2017 [78 favorites]

FWIW, apparently stuff at the Capitol is proceeding as normal. Increased security, but tourists milling around, etc.
posted by Chrysostom at 9:38 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

It happens every day, but now it's happening to them, so it matters.

There is, in fact, an active shooter situation going on in San Francisco as we speak.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:38 AM on June 14, 2017 [21 favorites]

To be clearer, when I mentioned Bernie's "revolution" talk, I meant it to stand in as just one example of a very broad spectrum of political talk that has potentially violent or dehumanizing shades, but it turns out that my sacrificing clarity for rhetorical flow was the wrong choice. I think my comments in this thread have poorly served my objective of encouraging the productive use of language.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 9:39 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Black children were systematically poisoned in Flint, to the extent that it warranted involuntary manslaughter charges.

To correct my comment: Black children ARE STILL BEING systematically poised in Flint.
posted by melissasaurus at 9:43 AM on June 14, 2017 [39 favorites]

There are clearly ways to use political language irresponsibly in a way that encourages violence, but in American politics I think it's only prevalent on the right. We can't expect politicians to avoid valuable metaphors like "revolution", particularly "political revolution", or "battle" or any number of terms that could in theory be interpreted as violent, just as we can't condemn The Beatles for the interpretative work of Charlie Manson.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:44 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

From the shooter's local paper: Belleville suspect killed in congressional shootout belonged to anti-GOP groups
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:45 AM on June 14, 2017

If there's an instance of a prominent Democrat speaking in his or her official capacity and encouraging supporters to go out and commit acts of physical violence against "the opposition", I don't remember seeing anything about it, and surely that would have made the news. There are, however, many instances of prominent Republicans speaking in their official capacity and encouraging supporters to go out and commit acts of physical violence. Sarah Palin, Donald Trump, just to name two, with immediate and public results.

To me, this is nothing like Sandy Hook. This is "Play Nazi games, win Nazi prizes." What I'm worried about is the Trump administration using this as a reason to equate liberal thought with terrorism, now that there's "proof" that liberals are dangerous.
posted by Autumnheart at 9:45 AM on June 14, 2017 [22 favorites]

Looks like we have a winner for the "both sides do it" press, from NBC's Chuck Todd:

@chucktodd: Hope most folks realize we have a toxic political culture and that attempting to exploit today for political gain will only poison us more

Thankfully, people are calling him on his shit:

@Rob_Flaherty: NBC's running an interview with a guy who says Sandy Hook didn't happen on Sunday.

posted by zombieflanders at 9:47 AM on June 14, 2017 [99 favorites]

What I'm worried about is the Trump administration using this as a reason to equate liberal thought with terrorism, now that there's "proof" that liberals are dangerous.

They've already been doing that for a long time and they've always had tons of "proof." Black Lives Matter is considered a terrorist organization by half of self-identified republicans, for chrissakes. It's nothing new and it's hard to say how much this will convince the already-convinced.
posted by Rust Moranis at 9:49 AM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]

I wouldn't be surprised if most Republicans thought ACORN was a terrorist group.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:50 AM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

Bernie's path is a strange and difficult one.
posted by elsietheeel at 9:51 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Yes, but those same people were willing to excuse any number of crazy white men for their violence, and basically not do anything about their own rhetoric or cowboy attitude about having guns in the public arena, because they figured those men voted GOP. But now we have crazy white men shooting Republicans, which isn't supposed to happen! Now how do they tell them apart?!
posted by Autumnheart at 9:52 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

(Not to mention validating their paranoia and oppressor-as-victim mentality.)
posted by Autumnheart at 9:53 AM on June 14, 2017

There are, however, many instances of prominent Republicans speaking in their official capacity and encouraging supporters to go out and commit acts of physical violence. Sarah Palin, Donald Trump, just to name two, with immediate and public results.

Like a week ago a GOP Representative from Louisiana was calling for the genocide of all "radical muslims"
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:54 AM on June 14, 2017 [26 favorites]

Like a week ago a GOP Representative from Louisiana was calling for the genocide of all "radical muslims"

Minor correction: Rep Higgins was encouraging the murder of suspected radical muslims.
posted by Rust Moranis at 9:58 AM on June 14, 2017 [35 favorites]

According to Angeles Arrien's Tarot Growth Chart methodology, when DJT turns 70 at 10:54am tomorrow he will end his Strength/Lust (11) year and will commence a new Hanged Man (12) year.

It's silly of me to fact check a tarot-based assertion, but this doesn't even get his age right. This is his 71st birthday, 70 was last year.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 9:59 AM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]

> Minor correction: Rep Higgins was encouraging the murder of suspected radical muslims.

On the other hand, Bernie Sanders failed to preface his talk of a political revolution with a disclaimer that nothing he said should be taken as a call to violence. In conclusion, both sides are lands of contrasts.
posted by tonycpsu at 10:00 AM on June 14, 2017 [22 favorites]

His 'I am srs candidate/presnidet, this is my srs voice' is terrible, creepy and weird.

I Am Serious (Orange)
posted by kirkaracha at 10:00 AM on June 14, 2017 [21 favorites]

It's sad, but I'm surprised this sort of direct political violence is not more prevalent in the US. We are awash in guns, and politics is as ugly and divisive as it's been in decades. The silver lining for me is that it is still a rare event when there is a direct violent attack on a politician.

US politicians have more protection than most other countries. I was almost run over by the Obama admin's commerce secretary's security detail blowing through stop signs on back streets in Chicago a few years back. It was 4 or 5 SUVs full of men with suits and mirrored sunglasses. Do you even know who the commerce secretary was? (Penny Pritzker). So if that is the security level of a non-election non-public facing political appointee gets you can see how the gun nuts would be deterred.

For the most part the gun nuts are cowards and that's why they are gun nuts. Cowards will shoot unarmed people.
posted by srboisvert at 10:02 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

The reason I moved on from the revolutionary left was that people I knew were taking terrorism courses in Berlin. Not joking, no links because this was way before the internet. Much later I was told that people in my family were targeted because they were "prominent Jews". All along, this has been a strong part of my skepticism about Sanders (yes I know he is Jewish) and also about Corbyn in the UK. It's also why I'm aware of a significant part of the far left having turned to the far right — they are former friends and acquaintances . I'm certain that Bernie Sanders is a good person who is standing up for the right thing. But he is not good at policing his fringes and to someone like me, that appears cynical. I'm not 25, and neither is Sanders and we both know these people are out there. We grew up with them. Sanders played to a specific form of white male rage that I see on my Facebook every day. Toxic masculinity is the same on both sides.

When I quit the far left I turned to Popper, as so many other Social Democrats, and I have met a lot of ridicule from friends. But IMO the open society is the only alternative to fascism. If we become our enemies they will win.

(Not at all imagining anyone here supports Hodgkinson, just thinking out loud about the struggles we are all facing, both sides of the Atlantic)
posted by mumimor at 10:06 AM on June 14, 2017 [20 favorites]

As a sign of how little I trust the current administration, I didn't believe the shooter was dead until it was independently verified. I never had that with any other President.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 10:07 AM on June 14, 2017 [32 favorites]

So now one of the Republican Congressmen on the scene is sticking to his story that it was the gunman who asked if they were Republicans or Democrats.

From Virginia shooting: Gunman 'asked Congressmen if they were Republicans or Democrats'

“I’m told Rep Jeff Duncan plans to give a statement to police regarding a conversation he had with the shooter before leaving practice early,” CNN reporter Rebecca Berg wrote on Twitter.

“The man was wearing running clothes, asked Duncan: “Are those Republicans or Democrats out there practicing?” Per source familiar.

posted by scalefree at 10:08 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

CNN: House hearing on gun legislation canceled after shooting

The panel had been due to debate the "Sportsmen's Heritage and Recreational Enhancement Act," which includes 18 provisions related to guns and hunting, as well as other recreational sporting and outdoors provisions. The measure would make it easier to purchase silencers, transport guns across state lines and ease restrictions on armor-piercing bullets.

Are there... are there are lot of armored deer in this country?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:08 AM on June 14, 2017 [60 favorites]

Meanwhile, as lost of people will be sending out thoughts and prayers, Chaos As The Southern Baptist Convention Fails to Condemn White Supremacy At Its Annual Meeting, much to Richard Spencer's delight.

On the "curse of Ham" mythology which the Atlantic article describes as the fig leaf used as the reason why "the wording" of the initial resolution condemning white supremacy was rejected, this article by a former Brigham Young University professor: “These House-Negroes Still Think We’re Cursed: Struggling Against Racism In The Classroom” by Darron Smith, Journal of Culture Studies published Vol. 19, No. 4 July 2005 pp. 439-454, doi 10.1080/09502380500219456 (found via this deadlinked MeFi comment by long haired child) said that the myth would often be immediately presented to him by students as the valid rationale for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints' prohibition against black clergy which lasted until 1978.

Making me skeptical that it would actually be so obscure among the SBC membership and clergy that there's no need to mention it specifically...
posted by XMLicious at 10:09 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

Are there... are there are lot of armored deer in this country?

You need to buy the DLC from Bethesda.
posted by Talez at 10:10 AM on June 14, 2017 [39 favorites]

Are there... are there are lot of armored deer in this country?

Hunters provide a strong evolutionary pressure against unarmored deer.
posted by Pope Guilty at 10:11 AM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

The panel had been due to debate the "Sportsmen's Heritage and Recreational Enhancement Act," which includes 18 provisions related to guns and hunting, as well as other recreational sporting and outdoors provisions. The measure would make it easier to purchase silencers, transport guns across state lines and ease restrictions on armor-piercing bullets.

Are there... are there are lot of armored deer in this country?

More importantly, did they seriously name an act intending to make it easier to buy silencers and armor piercing bullets SHAREA?

They can't even spell their (manufactured) object of hate properly.
posted by tocts at 10:12 AM on June 14, 2017 [20 favorites]

According to Angeles Arrien's Tarot Growth Chart methodology, when DJT turns 70 at 10:54am tomorrow he will end his Strength/Lust (11) year and will commence a new Hanged Man (12) year.

> It's silly of me to fact check a tarot-based assertion, but this doesn't even get his age right. This is his 71st birthday, 70 was last year.

Shoot, you're right, my addled brain told me he'd be turning 70, but he actually turned 71 today, which means ending a Hanged Man (12) year and beginning a Death/Rebirth (13) year.
posted by christopherious at 10:12 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Sportsmen's Heritage and Recreational Enhancement Act

Republicans To Impose SHAREA Law
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:13 AM on June 14, 2017 [45 favorites]

Chaos As The Southern Baptist Convention Fails to Condemn White Supremacy At Its Annual Meeting

No big surprise considering that white supremacy is what put the Southern in Southern Baptist.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:14 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

I want to condemn in the strongest terms possible this latest shooter. In our society, if you have an unquenchable thirst to murder people, there are socially acceptable outlets: you work hard and get elected to Congress and vote to take away the health insurance of 24 million, just like everyone else had to. No shortcuts.
posted by indubitable at 10:15 AM on June 14, 2017 [80 favorites]

I went to high school in a small, private Christian (charismatic) school. We were taught that black people were descended from Ham, white people were descended from Japheth, and all other races were descended from Shem. In social studies class. It was the first and only time I ever got a question marked wrong on a history quiz.
posted by EarBucket at 10:15 AM on June 14, 2017 [21 favorites]

Every day, hundreds of sportsmen go hungry and/or un-entertained when their puny, non-armor-piercing bullets ricochet harmlessly off antlers. Stop the madness. Join with the Republican Party in flooding our streets with armor-piercing heritage sporting bullets TODAY. For our children's children, let's make sure The Bucks Stop Here.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:17 AM on June 14, 2017 [21 favorites]

If a deer comes at me in a Sherman tank (again, I learned my lesson) I have the right to defend myself with projectile ordinance, armor piercing rounds, and my God-given American resourcefulness.

It's what George Washington would have wanted.
posted by Tevin at 10:19 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

While not disturbing the neighbors.
posted by ctmf at 10:22 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

well, it's obvious what the problem is - deer don't know how to gas up their sherman tanks and run out of gas

this is why i see so many dead deer on i-94

someone must be towing the tanks away
posted by pyramid termite at 10:23 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

If a deer comes at me in a Sherman tank

A tactic known as Blitzenkrieg
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:23 AM on June 14, 2017 [132 favorites]

Shoot, you're right, my addled brain told me he'd be turning 70, but he actually turned 71 today

Well, the Hanged Man one certainly turned out accurately.

which means ending a Hanged Man (12) year and beginning a Death/Rebirth (13) year.

Christ! That's even worse.
posted by Autumnheart at 10:25 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

My Freedom Caucus congressman, Bill Posey, has already been sending out emails calling Indivisible a "hate group." He was also a birther deep in the NRA's pockets who nonetheless refuses to hold in-person town Hall meetings (since 2008!) citing security concerns & Gabrielle Giffords as his excuse. Let's not try to make false equivalences here.
posted by Kitty Stardust at 10:26 AM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

Apparently I can accidentally join a "hate group" on Facebook. My primary target of hatred is lack of access to affordable healthcare, which may or may not count.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:29 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

Maybe let's leave it at that, with the armored deer riffs; we've said too much already.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 10:29 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

Another mass shooting on this shitty day.
posted by maxsparber at 10:33 AM on June 14, 2017

[quietly shelves draft of 2,000-word epic MechaBambi fanfic comment]
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:33 AM on June 14, 2017 [76 favorites]

First, some facts: the murder rate is at at a 50 year low; the violent crime rate is at a 40 year low (both as of 2015 numbers which are the latest I was able to find from the FBI).

Why are people so afraid?

Part of it is certainly that while the murder rate is at a historic low it is still quite high compared to other countries (at the very least nearly all of the other OECD) but I have to wonder if the push for gun control leads people to feeling less safe and colors their perception of how dangerous the United States actually is. Every time there is a shooting, there are similar comments flooding social media (and MetaFilter as well) about how many mass shootings there are or how many days it had been from the last one. These statements are accurate but lack any sort context: e.g. plummeting crimes rates over the past 15 years. I know so many people who are so terribly afraid of being victims of crimes and these are people who live in idyllic suburbs not "bad" neighborhoods.

Feelings of safety matter because they drive behavior. Some examples are the war on drugs, minimum mandatory sentencing and the like. It can also cause people to purchase guns. According to this somewhat old poll, 60% of gun owners have guns to protect themselves against crime. If people think that crime is increasing or that they are less safe, it follows that they are more likely to purchase guns. I believe that there were even some comments in one of the politics threads about buying guns due to the increased risk of not being a white man under the Trump regime.

So can pushing for gun control actually be counterproductive? If reiterating the stories of shootings and focusing on those tragedies does not lead to actual legislation, it may just cause more people to purchase guns and support draconian anti-crime policies. I hope that is not the case, but I fear that it is.

This is not an argument against gun control, by the way. It is more my musing on how to approach the topic. I'd be interested to hear what others think.
posted by nolnacs at 10:35 AM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

In my experience, there is a WHOLE LOT of overlap between "Nazi Punching" and "Fetch The Guillotine" rhetorical use.

Remind me, how many public executions via guillotine have we had recently? There's a real motivation to punch left this week, it seems, which is getting kind of tiring. Wake me when there's an organized communist militia movement taking over state and federal government buildings, assassinating people in churches, and organizing campaigns of terror across the states. Otherwise, this false appeal to "both sides do it" is breathtakingly disingenuous at best.
posted by Existential Dread at 10:39 AM on June 14, 2017 [63 favorites]

If people think that crime is increasing or that they are less safe, it follows that they are more likely to purchase guns.

I'm not sure how the recent election affected things, but I thought it was the case that it's mostly the same folks that go out and keep buying guns. So, while there are more guns "out there", they're mostly owned by the same people.
posted by FJT at 10:41 AM on June 14, 2017

The link from above:
We've had 154 mass shootings since the beginning of the year.

This is a large enough sample. I think sorting out how many have been right wing/left wing, apolitical and foreign terrorist should answer the question of where such shootings come from. I realize that there will be arguments over how wing-y someone is.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 10:41 AM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

Countries with gun control have all the fun you have in the US, without the fear. All of my cousins go hunting, some of them go to shooting ranges as well. (I'm half blind so not for me). There is a shooting range 1/ 2 a mile from where I am sitting right now.
However, access to arms for criminals is very difficult, and it is easy to convict criminals just for owning or keeping arms. That means crimes involving arms, let alone shootings are really, really rare.
There is really no meaningful excuse for civilians owning military grade arms. At all.
posted by mumimor at 10:45 AM on June 14, 2017 [50 favorites]

Can you explain why/how? I'm v. curious.

Okay, well...let me start with the disclaimer that I'm going by this single card and have never read the book that this growth chart is based on, etc. etc. And tarot can also be pretty subjective, especially if you are very familiar with the subject and have context that necessarily flavor what you're seeing, yadda yadda.

Okay, anyway, the Death card rarely refers to "someone's gonna die" and can even be a positive card in a certain sense. It can convey a need to let a situation reach its logical conclusion and to turn over a new page, get a fresh start, etc. But a Death card situation is rarely the result of a happy circumstance, it's more like a "make lemonade out of lemons" concept. IF someone has the self-awareness and insight to do that.

But this is Donald Trump. He is currently the president. He just underwent, or at least began, a radical change of his previous incarnation as billionaire and real estate mogul who marries supermodels. Now he is in a position of extreme power, without ANY of the reflection and character and consideration needed to make wise decisions on that level. And the decisions he has already begun to make are decidedly cruel, antagonistic, openly criminal, blatantly destructive, personally profitable, you name it. So the Hanged Man followed by Death means he is reinventing himself as......this man, who cares for nothing and no one, who happily fucks over millions of people and other sovereign nations to soothe his own ego, and who is validated in doing so *every* single time Congress enables his decisions. And this is going to result in a scenario from which a "end of the old way, birth of the new" is a necessary outcome?

Yeah. That's terrible. Sure, maybe he'll have a crisis of conscience and become a changed man AFTER he does God only knows what, but the whole world is captive to his identity crisis, and he has an abysmal track record *right now*, so what the hell else is he going to come up with? I shudder to think.
posted by Autumnheart at 10:50 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

Another mass shooting on this shitty day.

Can big, important links like this please have a little more information than the usual mystery meat? This is the same shooting mentioned above and not, as I worried, a third shooting so far this morning.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:52 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

Why are people so afraid?

How many years of Fox news drumming up contempt for the Other and contempt for our own government?
posted by sebastienbailard at 10:52 AM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

Holy God, Northam won by twelve points. I was not expecting that margin to be so wide. I think I can say now that I am extremely pleased by this. Gillespie is going to be a real fight, however, and it's going to be closer than I would like.

Don't lose sight of turnout numbers.

Ralph S. Northam, 303,463
Tom S. Perriello, 239,412

Edward W. "Ed" Gillespie, 160,082
Corey A. Stewart, 155,774
Frank W. Wagner, 50,341

If the three R candidates had pooled their votes they could beat Northam... by 62,734 votes, a 10% spread.

If every single R primary voter shows up at the general and only 70% of the D primary voters do, Northam would still win by 13,815, just shy of 2% and above the 1% recount threshold.

That's a pretty facile analysis, but having half again as many D votes show up is a huge and wonderful thing. The most cynical analyses I have seen have been two takes:

1: Since we're an open primary state, this D wave is a bunch of usually-vote-R folks who pulled a D ballot instead. To which I say, okay. So? If they found Stewart scary (which he is) but would still be willing to vote Gillespie then why wouldn't they have pulled the R ballot and voted against Stewart? Crossing the aisle in the primaries, despite being this big source of paranoia on both sides, doesn't happen a lot. People don't want to go outside their identity and they don't want the subsequent flurry of political messaging they get after picking a party in the primary. It's why I decided not to pull a R ballot and vote for anyone who wasn't Stewart.

If people crossed their usual line to pull a D ballot I think that's more likely a sign that they're gonna continue to vote D in the fall, not that they're suddenly gonna jump back and go Gillespie.

2: Turnout was based on expectations that the D race was going to be close and the R race wasn't, so folks stayed home on the R side where it was expected to be Gillespie but D side folks showed up to pick between the dude with all the machinery and advocacy groups behind him - Northam - and the supposedly more Bernie/leftie bona fides person, Perillo.

I don't buy this as enough to energize that many people because the second you looked at the platforms and comparisons from leftie operations like Blue Virginia you quickly found that there was so little distance between them that they could have been doing the lambada. Maybe the most naive voter wouldn't take the two seconds to figure that out, but I don't think the intersection between "folks who pay enough attention to know how the polls are doing" and "doesn't bother to look at summary sheets" is very big. Certainly not enough to account for 20% of the voter turnout.

I see some other blah blah that maybe Perillo's more lefty followers might just stay home but again, I just don't buy that as true for the over half of them that would have to do that in the face of an anti-choice nut like Gillespie.

This is not grounds for complacency, but I think it's justified as a reason to feel good about the chance of an energized D turnout in Virginia this fall.
posted by phearlez at 10:54 AM on June 14, 2017 [20 favorites]

Robert Mueller Chooses His Investigatory Dream Team (Garrett M. Graff, published by Wired on June 14, 2017)

Meet Mueller's Roster
As Mueller begins investigating Russia’s interference in last year’s election and its possible links to Donald Trump’s campaign, he is quietly recruiting lawyers and staff to the team. And in recent days, Trump associates have stepped up criticism of Mueller and his team—including a report, quickly rejected by the White House, that Trump is considering firing Mueller before he even gets started.
...
From the list of hires, it’s clear, in fact, that Mueller is recruiting perhaps the most high-powered and experienced team of investigators ever assembled by the Justice Department. His team began with three lawyers who also quickly left WilmerHale, the law firm where Mueller has also worked since he left the FBI in 2013—[Aaron] Zebley, James Quarles III, and Jeannie Rhee.
...
A famed litigator who was an assistant special prosecutor for the Watergate investigation, Quarles specialized in campaign finance research for the Watergate task force, which surely will be an area of focus for Mueller’s investigation.
...
More recently, Mueller has recruited Andrew Weissmann, his one-time general counsel at the FBI and a long-time adviser who once led the Justice Department’s fraud unit. In the early 2000s, Weissmann also oversaw the Enron Task Force, the storied Justice Department unit that investigated the complex machinations of the failed energy giant.

And that article opens with a more personal anecdote of how dogged Zebley was as an FBI agent, tracking down Ali Mandela, the fugitive terrorist suspected of helping execute the bombings of US embassies in East Africa in 1998. The article doesn't include any references for Rhee, but this Washington Post article, written by Sari Horwitz, notes that Rhee is "a former deputy assistant attorney general and a partner in the investigations practice at WilmerHale". A less reputable source, "Hidden Americans," says these are "partisan hack swamp creatures," and that "Jeannie Rhee a former Clinton Foundation attorney. For years she worked tirelessly to shield the Clinton Foundation from lawsuits and investigations."

Various news sources have reported that three of the experts on Mueller's team have donated to Democratic causes in the past, so don't expect Trumpeters to say that the independent investigation unbiased when they announce their findings.
posted by filthy light thief at 10:55 AM on June 14, 2017 [37 favorites]

There is nothing we can say or do to change the far right from being hypocritical, awful people. In the wake of the shooting, my Trump-supporter mom is retweeting all the usual suspects railing on Democrats and condemning the toxic, violent environment we supposedly created.

Meanwhile, she retweeted this yesterday.

@chuckwoolery
The #DemocratParty has a Hate for this country that I have never witnessed before. They are doing more damage than all out enemies combined

---

They have no shame, no morals, no honesty. They need to be defeated, not reasoned with.
posted by chris24 at 10:55 AM on June 14, 2017 [56 favorites]

As National Treasure Alexandra Petri (WaPo) points out, this is very yesterday, but: The Sessions session, in brief

I watched Attorney General Jeff Sessions testify before the Senate Intelligence Committee so that you would not have to, or maybe in addition to you! I don’t control your life. Watch what you like!

It went approximately as follows:

Sessions: Hello. I have come here to challenge the Senate to a duel for impugning my HONOR! Here is my rapier! Where may I toss this gauntlet? Whom may I strike with a cane? Indeed, throwing a gauntlet would be too good for you.

Mark Warner: What year were you born? It says 1946, but that literally cannot be right. You just announced that your honor had been impugned scurrilously.

Sessions: Sir, sir, I must protest! You dishonor this elegant marble hall. You call yourself a Virginian? Fiddle-dee-dee! I do not think you have earned the name.

posted by Johnny Wallflower at 10:55 AM on June 14, 2017 [28 favorites]

Fortune Teller [to Lisa]: Now we'll see what the future holds. [turns over a card from what looks like a Tarot deck]
Lisa: [gulps] The "Death" card?
Fortune Teller: No, that's good: it means transition, change.
Lisa: [relieved] Oh. [the fortune teller turns over another card] Oh, that's cute.
Fortune Teller: [gasps] "The Happy Squirrel"!
Lisa: That's bad?
Fortune Teller: Possibly. The cards are vague and mysterious.
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:56 AM on June 14, 2017 [27 favorites]

Couple comments deleted. FFS don't take this in the direction of speculating who will be (could be/maybe if/etc) shot next.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 10:58 AM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

chuckwoolery?? The (better) Wheel of Fortune guy?? *goes to internet* Huh.
posted by Melismata at 10:59 AM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

In light of the real safety numbers, then the whole gun discussion is a huge red herring, that is leading the fears of people away from the real threats to their existences. They are being robbed of their future security and the security of their children by bloodless number crunchers without guns, who control how much of the income they work for, they will get. The air is leaking out of the middle class bounce house, and they are hitting the ground now, and on the ground is everyone else who is used to being there on their last buck, in the groove they walk to get a few, and the threats outnumber the potentials. While well to do Americans now legislate how much wilderness we can view, if we can even afford to drive there, how much food we can afford, how many square feet we can live in, how well outfitted the schools are that our children attend, how long we can survive without medical care, and still get out families safely grown.

Because this whole picture is a daily nightmare, angry men incapable of changing the dynamic, worry about their ability to purchase and use guns. People worry if they are going to endure violence, and as the poor are shoved into tighter and tighter quarters, and then leak out onto the streets, alleys, byways, and abandoned townscapes, this is what the poor fear, when will it happen to them that they can no longer live inside?

They are less safe because the ongoing robbery is a big, big picture, it is hard to get a whole view of it, so the robbers use the media to name an enemy whether it is guns, people with guns, liberals, government overreach. Our immediate world is less safe because that is the current plan, there is nothing they do not threaten, not one thread of the "safety net" is free from verbal threats, and real threats.

The economic system is changing, the threat is that our cars will be robots, our trucks, and trains, buses, our teachers. Our workers will service robots, and create robotic scripts, and there is no room for those who used to struggle to survive, otherwise called working. The threat is, our children will find no welcome, our elders will know no rest, the constant drumbeat of threats and deliberately crafted social unrest, threat of unholy war like in Syria, show us what humans will do to have the control they want.

We had best get some economic control, create the nation we can all live in. It has nothing to do with guns, because as in the case of the Dakota Pipeline Protesters, the corporations can hire all they guns they need to do business. They are not going to let that option go willingly. We have to work to make our nation free, on a daily basis. We have to hold our public land, or else it will sell to foreign oligarchs and corporations. Meanwhile there is plenty of money floating around to keep everyone outraged and frightened and threatened.
posted by Oyéah at 11:01 AM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

Johnny Wallflower: As National Treasure Alexandra Petri (WaPo) points out, this is very yesterday, but: The Sessions session, in brief....

Is this the first time we've mentioned Sessions today?
posted by slipthought at 11:03 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Chuck Woolery has always been a kook and anti-Semite.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:03 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

phearlez: "If people crossed their usual line to pull a D ballot I think that's more likely a sign that they're gonna continue to vote D in the fall, not that they're suddenly gonna jump back and go Gillespie."

Yeah, I've seen a fair amount of discussion of this. We've got way higher D turnout than R, and we've got overall Trump approval falling, while at the same time his support among Rs is relatively steady. Put them together, it equals people moving from R to D. I know I've seen at least one study showing R party ID is on the decline.

I'll have more on this tonight, but I think Northam is really sitting pretty here. My hope is that we can turn this into major gains in the House of Delegates - there are 17 R delegates from HRC districts.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:04 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Chuck Woolery has always been a kook and anti-Semite.

And is hugely popular among right-wingers. Which is why Trump winning wasn't a takeover of the party, but an unveiling.
posted by chris24 at 11:05 AM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

In Refusal To Answer Questions, Sessions Denies Claiming Executive Privilege (NPR, June 13, 2017) NPR's Ari Shapiro talks to Steve Vladeck, a law professor at the University of Texas, about Jeff Sessions' justification for refusing to answer certain questions in his Senate testimony on Tuesday.

A good interview, which also pulled in NSA Director Mike Rogers and Director of National Intelligence Dan Coats and their similar vague refusal to answer questions, that can be boiled down with this section:

Vladeck: I think the important point and what the attorney general is surely banking on is that all of those maneuvers require the acquiescence of the Republican majority on the intelligence committee. And so I think he's basically daring the Republicans on the Senate intelligence committee to not let him off the hook and to actually have to agree with the Democrats, many of whom have already pushed and will be pushing for more compelled answers.

Emphasis all mine. So we'll get nothing from Sessions, Rogers, Coats, or any Trump lackeys until the Republicans literally make them, and that's not going to happen. So now we look forward to the special elections and 2018, with the hope and desire for this non-governance to finally bite the GOP hard enough that they lose enough seats to lose the House and Senate.
posted by filthy light thief at 11:07 AM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

Why are people so afraid?

with a lot of people, i think it's guilt - guilt for what our country has done in the past, here and overseas

they think what goes around comes around and all the time while they deny that guilt, they are secretly terrified that we're going to get what's coming to us
posted by pyramid termite at 11:09 AM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

Chuck Woolery has always been a kook and anti-Semite.
posted by Room 641-A

Which just makes it weird that he helped the Beastie Boys get women on TV
posted by the phlegmatic king at 11:12 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

Sounds like this guy was a kook. 55 tax brackets? What?

Still, if he were a right-winger attacking Democratic House members we'd call it terrorism so....
posted by Justinian at 11:12 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Chris24: Trump winning wasn't a takeover, but an unveiling.

THIS. This this this. Trump did not spring like a moist, pustulant, curdy Athena, full-blown from Republican foreheads. Sean Illing from Vox wrote a very interesting interview with Seth Stephens Davidowitz about what Stephens-Davidowitz uncovered by analyzing Google Trends, and It. Was. Not. Pretty. Trump is a symptom more than a cause, though bigots feel more permission to openly express their hatreds.

This means, as the saying has it, we have a marathon, not a sprint, ahead of us. We can, and should, have Trump thrown out of office as a criminal, the Russian hacking investigated, and health care retained as much as we can. But, like the Lernaean Hydra, there will just be more heads appearing to take the place of Trump and the current Congress unless issues can be solved at a deeper level.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 11:14 AM on June 14, 2017 [74 favorites]

Senators Aim To Make It Harder For Trump Administration To Ease Russia Sanctions (NPR, June 13, 2017)

A bipartisan group of senators* has taken a step to limit the Trump administration's ability to ease sanctions on Russia, adding an amendment to a widely supported Iran sanctions bill to make sure Congress has a say in future Russia policy. The Senate is considering the bill this week.

* The Foreign.Senate.GOV press release [the link in the pullquote] states "U.S. Senate Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs Chairman Mike Crapo (R-Idaho), Ranking Member Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio), Foreign Relations Committee Chairman Bob Corker (R-Tennessee) and Ranking Member Ben Cardin (D-Maryland) today announced a bipartisan agreement on legislation to strengthen and expand current U.S. sanctions on Russia."

As reported by Karoun Demirjian in the Washington Post on June 7, 2017, there are actually a number of bills that aim to increase and strengthen sanctions on Russia, and some have bipartisan support.
posted by filthy light thief at 11:17 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Congressional baseball game is ON for tomorrow, won't be canceled/postponed.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:20 AM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

> Our political system functions on good faith. That good faith has been increasingly abandoned in pursuit of power. There's a disturbing progression at play.
posted by leotrotsky

eponyhorrifying.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:22 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Note to self: when angry and upset, do not go fight trolls on Facebook. You may end up saying something that seems rude and ill-advised at the time, but in the cold light of day after someone shoots a Republican, probably got you put on a number of government watch lists.

(Dear The Government, I am a pacifist. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I own no firearms besides a pellet gun that I use to put poisoned wildlife out of their misery. I may not like the current regime, but I have no plans to violently overthrow it. Love, Elsie)
posted by elsietheeel at 11:25 AM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Apropos of nothing and seen on Twitter yesterday, Rick Wilson has coined the name "KIm Jong Don"
posted by epo at 11:25 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

All those tweets about a history of domestic violence in the congress-shooter seem to have been disappeared. Anyone have any other links? I'm curious to figure out how this is true yet he didn't run afoul of the Lautenberg amendment.
posted by phearlez at 11:27 AM on June 14, 2017

Foreign Policy: Trump White House Stays Quiet as Russia Flouts North Korea Sanctions

Trump administration officials and lawmakers are increasingly concerned that Russia is stepping up trade with North Korea in defiance of international sanctions, jeopardizing a U.S. effort to pressure Pyongyang over its nuclear and missile programs.

The White House, however, has yet to call out Russia publicly for its dealings with North Korea.

This is my shocked face.

A group of Democrats in Congress have written the GAO to request an investigation into why HHS keeps using social media to lobby for the AHCA, when government agencies aren't allowed to run grassroots lobbying campaigns.

All those tweets about a history of domestic violence in the congress-shooter seem to have been disappeared. Anyone have any other links? I'm curious to figure out how this is true yet he didn't run afoul of the Lautenberg amendment.

The reports I saw say that he was charged but the case was dismissed, though the description of the police report sounds pretty darn awful [cw: child and domestic abuse]. If he was never convicted, the ban generally wouldn't apply.
posted by zachlipton at 11:31 AM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]

Apropos of nothing and seen on Twitter yesterday, Rick Wilson has coined the name "KIm Jong Don"

I had a dream where he was called Kim Jong Trump! (Yes I know that's not how the name would work but it sounds better and I was asleep anyway!).
posted by Justinian at 11:32 AM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

The Fed has just hiked the federal funds rate bv 0.25%.

This seems ill-considered, as there does not seem to be any sign of the economy overheating, and inflation remains below the 2% target.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:34 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

The hospital says Scalise is in critical condition. It sounds like the injury was more serious than previously believed.
posted by Justinian at 11:36 AM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Various news sources have reported that three of the experts on Mueller's team have donated to Democratic causes in the past, so don't expect Trumpeters to say that the independent investigation unbiased when they announce their findings.

This is absolutely Team Trump's party line against Mueller. Just yesterday evening Kellyanne Conway‏ tweeted, "FEC report: Mueller's team includes big Democrat donors. Some maxed out, none wanted Trump to be POTUS. @CNNPolitics". On Monday, Newt Grinch had tweeted, "Republicans are delusional if they think the special counsel is going to be fair. Look who he is hiring.check fec reports. Time to rethink." ‏

Meanwhile, Mueller met with leaders of the Senate intelligence committee yesterday afternoon. Privately. In a secure room.
posted by Doktor Zed at 11:43 AM on June 14, 2017 [31 favorites]

I really don't like Scalise; I hope he pulls through.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:44 AM on June 14, 2017 [26 favorites]

IIRC previous reports said he was "stable," which is a term hospitals don't like to use (and MedStar doesn't use it in that announcement, saying instead "Rep. Scalise was critically injured and remains in critical condition") because it only means that the patient's condition isn't getting worse and says nothing about how injured they actually are.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 11:44 AM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

This Schmuck Shot Five People and Now You and I Are Going to be Called Terrorists

I don't care that these people were Republican politicians and staffers (and, according to The Washington Post, at least one lobbyist, who was among the injured). This was meant to be as horrifying as the Pulse shooting in Orlando or the Bataclan massacre. I don't care if I agreed with the shooter on most issues. This was an evil act. This was a terrorist act.

It should be noted that in a sane society, Hodgkinson wouldn't have been able to obtain a gun. [...]

Domestic violence? Resisting a peace officer? Eluding police? And yet in Illinois his gun paperwork was in order:
It appears that James Hodgkinson was recently taking target practice with a rifle in the lightly populated neighborhood where he lived, in the unincorporated area outside of Belleville. Police encountered Hodgkinson on March 24, records from the St. Clair County Sheriff show. The sheriff received a phone call reporting about 50 shots “in the pine trees” at the end of the short street where Hodgkinson lived. [...] Hodgkinson apparently complied and the deputy left without taking any further action

Nothing to see here -- Hodgkinson was just another gun-toting American, until he snapped. [...]

The right already has a simple, meme-ified, widely shared opinion on Black Lives Matter: It's a terrorist group. Rush Limbaugh says this. So does Milwaukee County sheriff and possible Trump homeland security appointee David Clarke.

Well, that's what's coming for the Resistance. You'll hear it in the future: The Resistance is a terrorist group. The key piece of evidence will be today's shooting.

posted by tonycpsu at 11:46 AM on June 14, 2017 [62 favorites]

Teen Vogue: What I’m Doing to Keep Birth Control Free in the Face of Trump's and the GOP's Health Care Rollback (by NY AG Eric Schneiderman): If you care about women’s autonomy, if you care about preventing unplanned pregnancies, protecting cost-free access to birth control is a no-brainer.

I won’t sugarcoat it — these rights are under attack. But we can fight back.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:51 AM on June 14, 2017 [52 favorites]

Various news sources have reported that three of the experts on Mueller's team have donated to Democratic causes in the past, so don't expect Trumpeters to say that the independent investigation unbiased when they announce their findings.

Has anyone done the legwork to find out how many people on Mueller's team have donated to Republicans? These stupid attacks still need to be answered. (Even the article from the Hill quoted above notes that one of the three also gave to Republicans including Chaffetz.)

Not to mention that Mueller himself is a Republican, as was Comey, and that Republicans larded the Clinton special prosecutors office with the most partisan Republicans possible, even firing one for not being partisan enough before they settled on Starr IIRC.
posted by msalt at 11:54 AM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

Some days I wonder if 2007-me would believe or even understand the statement "You think it's bad under Bush? In ten years, state attorneys general will be taking potshots at an obviously-compromised, visibly-demented President Donald Trump. His medium of choice will be Teen Vogue."
posted by Mayor West at 11:54 AM on June 14, 2017 [80 favorites]

Jake Sherman at Politico reports that one of the others injured this morning is Matt Mika, who also remains in critical condition.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:59 AM on June 14, 2017

Second Amendment advocates, especially those in government, should have to answer the question of what constitutes unacceptable tyranny. If, as Rand Paul rightly points out, the purpose of the right to bear arms is to guarantee our ability to violently resist tyrannical government, then surely they should be able to explain how we can identify tyranny and when that resistance should be celebrated by champions of individual freedom and when it should be condemned. Can they identify some example historical situations in which it would have been okay for a person whose life wasn't immediately threatened to kill another person for the cause of liberty? If they think this right is so fundamental that it's worth thousands of preventable deaths every year, maybe they can tell us when it might be proper to exercise it.

As political theorists have argued for literally thousands of years, the problem with condoning violent resistance to tyranny is that defining what constitutes tyranny is inherently somewhat subjective. Unless Paul can do better than every major political theorist who's ever lived, his answer would probably consist of a few distinguishing characteristics of tyrants and an acknowledgment that it's ultimately a matter of individual conscience. So does he think that every person has the Constitutional right to violently resist government whenever their conscience compels them to? Does he think people should be punished for exercising that right? If so, does that mean that we're guaranteed the right to possess arms but not to use them for their intended purpose? That doesn't seem very conducive to the cause of liberty.

It's abhorrent that so many people endorse gun ownership on the grounds that it can enable violent resistance to tyranny without engaging seriously with these questions.
posted by vathek at 12:00 PM on June 14, 2017 [80 favorites]

You'll hear it in the future: The Resistance is a terrorist group.

I mean, I imagine we will hear from somebody(s). And as it's a ridiculous charge, the only dignified way to respond to it is with "Less terrorist than you are, dude."
posted by octobersurprise at 12:00 PM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

All the more reason to vote in 2018. You're not terrorists if you're the government, as the GOP has amply demonstrated.
posted by Autumnheart at 12:03 PM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

WSJ via Raw Story: Senate Judiciary Committee opens investigation into Trump for firing former FBI Director James Comey

The Judiciary Committee has an obligation to fully investigate any alleged improper partisan interference in law enforcement investigations,” Chairman Chuck Grassley (R-IA) said in a statement. “It is my view that fully investigating the facts, circumstances, and rationale for Mr. Comey’s removal will provide us the opportunity to do that on a cooperative, bipartisan basis.”

“The American people deserve a full accounting of attempts to meddle in both our democratic processes and the impartial administration of justice,” the chairman added.

posted by Room 641-A at 12:03 PM on June 14, 2017 [90 favorites]

I think that GOP politicians and their media allies will certainly use this to try and shut down investigations into Trump. It won't make any sense but they'll pretend it does and that'll be enough for the media. Othering the Resistance or other critics will be a part of that. I would not be surprised if it's already happening in the fringe talk-radio and internet spaces.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:05 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Two disturbing anecdotes from Kyle Cheney of Politico [expanded into something resembling a paragraph from tweets]:

Two weird things happened that were too small to mention in the moment, but still stuck with me while reporting from the scene this AM. I arrived less than an hour after the shooting + overheard a witness - maybe mid-20s - describing the incident in vivid detail by phone. So when he hung up, I approached him and asked if he'd share the same details with me, since the events were still murky. He immediately tensed up, and told me that because I was the media - and he hates all media - he wouldn't tell me a thing. Never mind that the info might have been valuable to the public at that moment, as I tried to explain. Didn't matter. He said we all "leak." Second strange encounter came at the nearby coffee shop. A woman working there on her laptop told me she was relieved when she found out the shooter was targeting members of Congress. Why? Because at least, she said, it wasn't random violence. It's a strange and unsettling time.

posted by zachlipton at 12:05 PM on June 14, 2017 [58 favorites]

New York Post has the video (content warning, obviously) from the man with the two headed dog. Lots and lots and lots of noises of shots. Really scary.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:06 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Government Accountability Office report from April: Of the 85 violent extremist incidents that resulted in death since September 12, 2001, far right wing violent extremist groups were responsible for 62 (73 percent) while radical Islamist violent extremists were responsible for 23 (27 percent). The total number of fatalities is about the same for far right wing violent extremists and radical Islamist violent extremists over the approximately 15-year period (106 and 119, respectively).

If anyone dies due to this left-wing terrorist attack, it will be the first such death in the US for a long time.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:07 PM on June 14, 2017 [58 favorites]

A woman working there on her laptop told me she was relieved when she found out the shooter was targeting members of Congress. Why? Because at least, she said, it wasn't random violence.

I'm gonna admit it, this got a bleak laugh out of me.

It sounds like the injury was more serious than previously believed.

Sounds like he was shot in the hip -- hip injuries can bleed a lot, and unpredictably.
posted by saturday_morning at 12:09 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

I recently watched the Frontline episode on the Bundys and Malheur and one of the things that struck me, not for the first time and which is frequently observed by others, is just how powerfully there is a double-standard in the US when it comes to this sort of armed violence.

Which is to say, it's almost as if there's this shared cultural assumption that white, armed, violent right-wing extremists are sort of inevitable in American culture, just something we have to live with and not that big of a deal, something that law enforcement mostly takes a "hands-off, wait them out" stance, while any other kind of armed violence in support of a non-rightwing ideology, especially by non-whites, is a fundamental threat to everything and everyone and any sort of extreme state violence and repression is not only acceptable, but required.

It's an amazing discrepancy, just astonishing in its implicit hypocrisy. But it's real. I can't really get my head around the profoundly ugly things this implies about American culture, but I can see that it's there.

This is what I was thinking earlier, before we knew anything about the shooter: if he's non-white and someone opposed to conservatives, then hysteria will ensue. If it's a white person with some sort of left-wing grudge against the GOP, a big brouhaha will be made about how the left has been radicalized. If it's someone farther to the right than the GOP who has some extreme right-wing grudge, it will be seen as a tragic, but sadly expected, example of those lone nutjobs that we can't control. The varying standards by which the US government, the media, and the American people assess these things is disturbing and deeply and sadly revealing.

It certainly is the case that the left includes people prone to violence and who consider and occasionally act on a desire for political violence. But this leftist call to violence is not normalized or tolerated in any way in American culture while, in contrast, explicitly violent rhetoric from the far right is exceedingly common. And the one common trait between almost all of these folk, left or right, is that they are white men.

There's a general problem of what we might think of as a male notion of violence as a kind of birthright, which in turn intersects with cultural/political messaging that leverages this. In the US, we get middle-aged conservative white men who feel that it's perfectly normal and reasonable to gather together carrying a large and varied arsenal in support of a white rancher in a dispute with the government ... and hardly any of them face any legal consequence for it.

And the lack of legal consequences for white conservative violence itself is a cultural message. The far right tends to see the Bundy ranch and Malheur confrontations as propaganda wins. To some degree, such incidents are. In contrast, any violent act by the left, especially by non-whites, is almost universally seen as deeply disreputable, immediately damaging their cause.

Violence, in deed and rhetoric, is partly normalized in American and other societies ... but very unevenly, and almost always in ways that benefit the privileged.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 12:10 PM on June 14, 2017 [114 favorites]

Has anyone done the legwork to find out how many people on Mueller's team have donated to Republicans? These stupid attacks still need to be answered.

"You should be fucking stoked that they're Democrats, if you think Trump is innocent. Because they will go to their Democrat masters in Congress and the shadowy halls of SorosCorp and say 'We could find nothing on this great man!' and rend their garments, and it will be over. If they make things up, then the Republicans in Congress will be able to see through it, right? I mean, since they're so interested in truth and getting to the bottom of things?"
posted by Etrigan at 12:10 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

To say that someone is in "stable" condition means that the patient has a pulse. Not kidding. That's pretty much it.
posted by raysmj at 12:11 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

Didn't somebody say that Scalise spoke to his wife by phone before going into surgery and that he was "in high spirits" at the time?
posted by all about eevee at 12:14 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Dog-walker's last line from the video linked above: "well, that was one hell of a way to start the f*cking morning".
posted by yhbc at 12:14 PM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]

Didn't somebody say that Scalise spoke to his wife by phone before going into surgery and that he was "in high spirits" at the time?

The kind of bullets that come out of those sort of rifles can do damage long after the initial impact. Plus, you can deal with infection post-surgery, and all sorts of other issues. It's possible he was able to speak before the surgery and has deteriorated. And it's also possible that press reports are wrong about anything.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:17 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Chuck Woolery has always been a kook and anti-Semite.

And a racist, homophobe. He has a popular podcast.

Most game show hosts are conservatives. Pat Sajak was a tea partier who was against Obamacare and thinks climate change is a hoax. Alex Trebek gives money to conservative candidates. Drew Carey does too. John O'Hurley supports Republican causes. Wink Martindale is a Republican. (In other news, Wink Martindale is still alive.) Merv Griffin was a Republican and raised a lot of money for them. (But is not still with us.)

Ben Stein has always been a crazy right winger. He now writes for the Spectator.
posted by zarq at 12:20 PM on June 14, 2017 [24 favorites]

(In other news, Wink Martindale is still alive.)

His hair isn't, I don't think.
posted by Melismata at 12:22 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Some days I wonder if 2007-me would believe or even understand the statement "You think it's bad under Bush? In ten years, state attorneys general will be taking potshots at an obviously-compromised, visibly-demented President Donald Trump. His medium of choice will be Teen Vogue."

And conversations with my father will be tempered by the fact that I know he has been brainwashed by the Russians.
posted by slipthought at 12:25 PM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]

Ben Stein has always been a crazy right winger.

if anything, that is an understatement. he wrote speeches for Nixon.
posted by murphy slaw at 12:26 PM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

Plus I don't think he cared much for that Bueller kid.
posted by Room 641-A at 12:27 PM on June 14, 2017 [19 favorites]

Steve Harvey met with Donald Trump in January.
posted by Faint of Butt at 12:28 PM on June 14, 2017

New York Post has the video (content warning, obviously) from the man with the two headed dog. Lots and lots and lots of noises of shots. Really scary.

Holy fucking shit that's a lot of shots. I have no doubt that everyone there thought they were going to die.
posted by anastasiav at 12:31 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

Drew Carey used to do an online video series for Reason when he was between TV gigs.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 12:31 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Ben Stein has rejected evolution, said Michael Brown deserved to die because he was so big, defended Dominique Strauss-Kahn against rape charges because he didn't believe people with that level of education committed rape, and opposed legal abortion. He is not just right wing, he is toxic, and is a classic example of someone who has convinced themselves that they are far smarter than they actually are.
posted by maxsparber at 12:34 PM on June 14, 2017 [73 favorites]

Hey can someone give me some knowledgeable commentary on the Senate Judiciary Committee opening the investigation into the Comey firing? Is this good? Was this expected?
Someone tell me what to feel!!
posted by greermahoney at 12:34 PM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

It's going to be weird next time there's a news making mass shooting and these guys pipe up to defend the confitions that lead to such shootings, knowing that they were actually in one.
posted by Artw at 12:35 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

You'll hear it in the future: The Resistance is a terrorist group.

There is a very simple rebuttal to have handy: if you don't believe the Tea Party should have been branded a terrorist organization based on Jared Lee Loughner's attempted assassination of Gabby Giffords, then the same logic must apply here.

I understand that people making the terrorist argument won't be interested in reasoned debate, but it may be a useful (and accurate!) rhetorical device.
posted by Existential Dread at 12:37 PM on June 14, 2017 [70 favorites]

Politico/Kim Zetter: Will the Georgia Special Election Get Hacked?. Georgia uses touchscreen voting machines with no paper-trail that run Windows 2000. This shouldn't be legal.

WaPo/Paul Waldman: Are Democrats in Congress not ‘fighting’ hard enough? Don’t believe it.

You can look at that and say “They aren’t fighting!” But it’s hard to make that argument unless you’re focused solely on symbolic actions. If they halted all Senate activity but didn’t actually impede this particular bill, it would mean the action was almost entirely symbolic. It might generate some news coverage that would focus the public and media back on health care, but it probably wouldn’t be much. You might claim that if Democrats ground the Senate to a halt, the public would rise up behind them, but I find that a little hard to believe.

Which means that while the Democrats can throw up some procedural roadblocks once the bill actually emerges, right now the biggest onus is on grass-roots activists to ramp up pressure on the Republican senators who might be persuaded to vote against the bill. And that’s the biggest problem at the moment: The grass-roots pressure on Congress has dissipated from where it was when the House bill was first proposed.

Members’ offices aren’t being flooded with the same volume of calls they were a couple of months ago, which means they may feel as though they can get away with voting for something as damaging as this bill. If they’re going to be persuaded otherwise, they need to be shown that there will be a high price to pay. Their Democratic colleagues can’t convince them of that; only citizens can.

Right now would be an excellent moment to help solve that problem and call your representatives (use Resistbot or send a free fax if you can't call) and tell them you oppose the AHCA and any cuts to Medicaid.
posted by zachlipton at 12:49 PM on June 14, 2017 [36 favorites]

It's going to be weird next time there's a news making mass shooting and these guys pipe up to defend the confitions that lead to such shootings, knowing that they were actually in one.

Why do I feel like "I was in a mass shooting, I think I know what I'm talking about when it comes to my ludicrous position on gun issue X" is gonna be the way they'll play that?
posted by Rykey at 12:49 PM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]

You can look at that and say “They aren’t fighting!” But it’s hard to make that argument unless you’re focused solely on symbolic actions.

This is how I've felt for some time. There's an awful lot of focus on purely symbolic action.
posted by Justinian at 12:52 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

METAFILTER: Someone tell me what to feel!!
posted by philip-random at 12:59 PM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Of the 85 violent extremist incidents that resulted in death since September 12, 2001,

Are there modern GAO reports that go back further, say 25 years, to include white terrorists incidents such as the Oklahoma City bombing?

Or am I going to have to use up today's Adderall (that my insurance no longer covers) computing those numbers myself?
posted by elsietheeel at 1:02 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

THANK YOU zachlipton for helping me shed light on the voting machine hacking & how it applies to elections going on RIGHT NOW.

Also TY to OnceUponATime for the MeMail
posted by yoga at 1:10 PM on June 14, 2017 [19 favorites]

Do I need to even check to see whether they were all committed by men? I don't, do I. I'll hedge: say 95% committed by men.

This is an even bigger discrepancy than the one between right wing extremists and everyone else, and uh...it does not get discussed much.

I don't think you can explain this phenomenon without exploring the connection these political identities have to toxic masculinity.
posted by schadenfrau at 1:10 PM on June 14, 2017 [38 favorites]

Most game show hosts are conservatives. Pat Sajak was a tea partier who was against Obamacare and thinks climate change is a hoax. Alex Trebek gives money to conservative candidates. Drew Carey does too. John O'Hurley supports Republican causes. Wink Martindale is a Republican. (In other news, Wink Martindale is still alive.) Merv Griffin was a Republican and raised a lot of money for them. (But is not still with us.)

They're folks with no discernible talent* or skills who can coast through life by being white guys in suits who can read words on a screen.

Is it a surprise they're conservative?

*except Drew. Anyway, he's a more of a libertarian.
posted by leotrotsky at 1:10 PM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

Also see above re: watch list. I dunno if making a list and crunching the numbers of terrorist incidents on American soil is the thing to be doing right now. Heh.
posted by elsietheeel at 1:11 PM on June 14, 2017

So today: a shooting in Virginia, a shooting in San Francisco, and a deadly fire in London. Think I'll go drink for a while.
posted by Melismata at 1:11 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

Politico/Kim Zetter: Will the Georgia Special Election Get Hacked?. Georgia uses touchscreen voting machines with no paper-trail that run Windows 2000. This shouldn't be legal.

The amount of abject ignorance about touchscreen voting is just stunning. The Virginia legislature, to its credit, banned the further purchase of touch screen voting machines about a decade ago. They stopped short of demanding they all stop being used, presumably for financial reasons.

I was a poll worker for the first time shortly after this. During training the director of elections said they couldn't buy any more but they would beyond question continue to use their existing ones until they all died or further legislation forced them to stop. She gave the sense of being irked by this, which she clearly felt was unreasonable.

The alternate system was optical scanning, which my compsci-educated cranky-by-nature self felt was The Right Way. We would run them concurrently, where there'd be about 5 touch-screen machines set up in the general (primaries with lower turnouts we'd set up fewer machines) and a stack of paper ballots for filling out and scanning with a machine that voters would feed the ballot into themselves. We always offered people the choice and most would pick the touch screens and even when there was a line to get to the touch screens folks would forgo using paper as an alternative.

The biggest challenge to my "don't get into shit while volunteering" challenge came the time I offered someone a paper ballot and she said does it give me a receipt showing what she voted? Nope, it does not. I am pretty sure, I said, that doing so would be illegal. Well then, she said, I'll wait for the touch screen since then I know it'll be counted right. I said that the scanner preserves the ballots for recounts. She waved this off; if it doesn't show me what it read off the ballot how do I know it counted my vote right? The touch screen shows me what I picked!

Internally I screamed how the fuck do you know that what the touchscreen records is what you chose? It can show you anything on that LCD and then write down a completely random vote! And if we ever want to go back and look at what you meant to do, we can't! Paper is the only fully reversible method! You're a fucking nutter! Externally I shrugged and pointed her to the long-ass line to go stand in.

We've stopped using touch screens here; I am pretty sure that was a state-wide initiative, as the director of elections for Arlington hasn't changed. I wonder whether that woman just gave up voting or thinks nothing is trustable anymore or if someone finally explained to her the difference. Sometimes I think about making a youtube video to communicate the issue with reversibility but I doubt anyone receptive to it would watch it.
posted by phearlez at 1:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [26 favorites]

In 2015, Time said 98% of mass shooters were male. My bid was low.
posted by schadenfrau at 1:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [19 favorites]

Also see above re: watch list. I dunno if making a list and crunching the numbers of terrorist incidents on American soil is the thing to be doing right now. Heh.

Fuck the watch lists. I'm not going to change an inch of my behavior out of fear of being put on a list that may or may not exist.
posted by dilaudid at 1:13 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Sometimes I think November 2016 was the worst possible time to become sober.
posted by elsietheeel at 1:13 PM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

Merv Griffin was a Republican and raised a lot of money for them.

MERV GRIFFIN!

I really love Milk & Cheese
posted by phearlez at 1:15 PM on June 14, 2017 [24 favorites]

The Democratic and Republican baseball teams will have dinner together tonight after Democrats invited the Republicans.
posted by zachlipton at 1:16 PM on June 14, 2017 [29 favorites]

It is never a bad time to become sober.
posted by Melismata at 1:16 PM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

They're folks with no discernible talent or skills who can coast through life by being white guys in suits who can read words on a screen.

Is it a surprise they're conservative?

Disregarding your basic premise, Drew Carey is a pretty damn good standup. John O'Hurley is a pretty good actor. Merc Griffin was an amazingly good producer of television shows across a wide breadth of styles and genres (as well as a composer of some note, so to speak). Don't jump too high for your rhetorical slam dunk.
posted by Etrigan at 1:16 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

> Sometimes I think November 2016 was the worst possible time to become sober.

I don't think there's ever a bad time to get sober, so congrats (!) if this is something you've achieved, but I will admit that the ability to check out of reality from time to time has been very welcome, even if the eventual re-immersion has been harsh.
posted by mosk at 1:17 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Disregarding your basic premise, Drew Carey is a pretty damn good standup. John O'Hurley is a pretty good actor. Merc Griffin was an amazingly good producer of television shows across a wide breadth of styles and genres (as well as a composer of some note, so to speak). Don't jump too high for your rhetorical slam dunk.

That joke wouldn't be nearly as funny, though.
posted by leotrotsky at 1:19 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Violence, in deed and rhetoric, is partly normalized in American and other societies ... but very unevenly, and almost always in ways that benefit the privileged.
posted by Ivan Fyodorovich at 4:10 AM on June 15 [21 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]

Most game show hosts are conservatives. Pat Sajak was a tea partier who was against Obamacare and thinks climate change is a hoax. Alex Trebek gives money to conservative candidates. Drew Carey does too. John O'Hurley supports Republican causes. Wink Martindale is a Republican. (In other news, Wink Martindale is still alive.) Merv Griffin was a Republican and raised a lot of money for them. (But is not still with us.)

Ben Stein has always been a crazy right winger. He now writes for the Spectator.

I'm putting these quotes together because...y'know how mechanic shops have that glass where you can watch the work being done? That.

If that sounds tenuous, here's my reasoning, and I speak from experience as someone who pretty much loved all those game show hosts, and who grew up among gun-loving Midwesterners, and who for more than a decade has lived in Asia, in China, and literally works in propaganda, because I'm the translator, and I get called on to mediate the message, straight up All The Messages, from pro CCP to anti-CCP and everything tangential, and my whole sales gambit is "We can make your message work, but we gotta have deep involvement, and it's expensive, so" -

1) Getting your attention is a business with established practices. The practitioners of this business are at work when they do that thing you love. Jon Oliver et al.

2) Watch everything for normalization of the status quo. It happens all the time, all around you, and you like the status quo don't you? You do. You like not starving, not putting up with the psychological stress of an ongoing game with your livelihood and life as the stakes. Well...you think you're not, but actually...like, healthcare...you know. You like thinking that, but you also enjoy participating in that game, but at a remove, the remove of Fox/MSNBC, or at a more realistic remove, Metafilter/Reddit/politics in general. Of course you have opinions, it's your livelihood. It's your life and death. That is politics. It's a selfish endeavor, it's about changing minds, and you are fighting for your share. There are systems that work well for everyone, there are systems that benefit individuals more, and they both work for their intended purposes, but people are greedy.

3) China, in this regard, has encoded control over the debate mentioned in (2) in their constitution and Party charter. Literally, they say they intend to control this, and people are ok with it, because the alternative is jail and a whole raft of fuck you by the state.

(4) The only effective opposition here is playing their game - you call down the specter of revolution and disorder to nudge the debate to the liberal side. It is generally effective where basic services are concerned. Now that China basically is developed, now that nobody is starving, that calculus is changing, and even the propaganda masters are adrift and turning to nationalism.

(5) Full-spectrum dominance is part of (3). "Flood the airwaves" is just Best Practices, and not being overt is also Best Practices. I know this because business strategy talks. And the usual message? "Everything is okay." "Don't worry." "Hysterical people are the worst." "Just have fun!" It's 2017, no it's not overt, it's inane, and has been for ages. It's not country-specific, China got the idea from the Soviets who got it from us. Propaganda theory being what it is, I'm not gonna try to back that up, and it doesn't matter.

(6) In China, you get to be blatant about your role as a propagandist, because that is a protected class in the constitution and Party charter. Good propagandists get profiled in magazines, get government awards, get high fives from the power structure, and it's a thing people actually aspire to be. In the US, not so much, but remember this - propaganda is propaganda. Free speech is a declaration of "may the best propagandist win". It's also the best way to fight propaganda, but...

(7) The only effective antidote to propaganda is reality, or (2). We are not okay. The fight is never over. Use the First Amendment or lose it, and damn the naysayers, damn the tinfoil hatters, they, we, ME, are all around you, but we are not monolithic, as Resistance (and Resistance infighting) shows. This is a war, it has always been a war.

(8) The stakes are the livelihood of yourself and everyone you know. Choose wisely, choose piecemeal, and do not get slack about it. You get to vote, you get to protest, you get to speak out, and the revolution is never over. That's another thing I learned from China, perpetual revolution.

(9) I voted for Hillary in the primaries and Hillary in the generals. And Al Franken, who I love so, so, so hard. But only until he inevitably becomes corrupt like the rest of 'em. There is the exceptional exception that proves the rule, but...the words I just said.

(10) Be well. Do not let these people with power over you dominate your soul. We do better as social animals, as a tribe, as big a tribe as we can form, as many people as we can include, as many rights as we can hand out, as many resources as we can pool, as many friends as we can make despite the differences. But remember there is greed. It is a natural force and it will eat you through every crack in your armor. Eventually we die, after we do Some Things here on earth. Do your thing, be well, and don't let it get ya. And fight for the right thing, do that for you, call your representatives etc., because you'll sleep better at night knowing you tried, and you didn't resort to violence, propaganda, or lies to do it.
posted by saysthis at 1:20 PM on June 14, 2017 [50 favorites]

Fun fact: Merv Griffin graduated from my high school. Class of '42. He was (and continues to be) well liked at the school, even after passing.
posted by mosk at 1:22 PM on June 14, 2017

Wow, talk about odd synchronicities - looking up the above link about Merv Griffin reminded me that he used to be involved in a number of properties, which lead me to this gem of an article from 1988, which explains how Griffin won control of Resorts International from none other than Donald J. Trump himself: http://www.nytimes.com/1988/04/15/business/griffin-wins-resorts-in-deal-with-trump.html

Methinks this fucking timeline is a bit too o'er packed with Easter eggs...
posted by mosk at 1:28 PM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

I don't want to derail, but why don't you guys use paper ballots?
There are tons of things in life where computers make sense, but I've yet to see how voting can be one of them. On of the things I like about voting is my long paper ballot and the pencil on a string in the booth. When I've made my cross(es), I can review my choice carefully and if I've made a mistake I can call for help and get a new one.
When all is over, I put it in the box and get a piece of candy for myself and for the child I brought along so she could learn voting is very important. We chat with all the people we know in the neighborhood. We go pet the animals in the community farm next door. And then all the officials have a great night counting and chatting, and with pork and beer or lamb and coke when they are finished. The rest of us have good food too at our voting dinners. Everyone is happy and safe. Our votes are counted and we vote for the left. I live in a happy place

This idyllic little anecdote is to say that while there are millions of voters in a state or country, the actual county or district is usually manageable even in a big city. There is really no excuse for voting machines.
posted by mumimor at 1:30 PM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

don't want to derail, but why don't you guys use paper ballots?

I'm gonna hazard a guess and say corporate bribery from Diebold etc.
posted by Rust Moranis at 1:31 PM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

Well we don't do things because they make sense, we do things because some politician's spouse has a large investment in a voting machine company and also they don't care if the votes might be altered in their favor.
posted by dilaudid at 1:32 PM on June 14, 2017 [27 favorites]

I don't want to derail, but why don't you guys use paper ballots?

The number of things we have to vote on in a lot of places is absurd. Dozens of choices to make on everything from local ordinances to state propositions to elected officials to judges (in some places) to anything else you can think of. So having the count automated makes sense as with the scantron ballots we use in Los Angeles... but electronic voting with no paper trail is stupid and not the correct response.
posted by Justinian at 1:33 PM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

Go look at a California sample ballot/voter guide from last year and you will understand why we use counting machines, one way or another. It's not just one or two races that you can mark with a pencil and have them quaintly counted by hand without issues.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 1:38 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

There's a lot of options in between "check box on paper" and "touch screen with no paper trail". The whole "hanging chad" situation spooked people momentarily into thinking that mechanical methods of tabulation (which you really have to have here because we vote on fucking everything, all on the same ballot) were too error-prone, so computers must be better (it was the early aughts, okay?).

Complicating the issue, elections aren't federally or even vaguely-centrally administered at all. It's localized to an absurd degree. So depending on where you live, you'll be using a totally different voting system.

Back when I lived in Maryland, we used optical scan far into the mid-aughts. It seemed to work well, though I suspect there's a chance of those machines somehow getting miscalibrated or malfunctioning in some way, but at least you've got paper back up in that instance.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:39 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

The number of things we have to vote on in a lot of places is absurd. Dozens of choices to make on everything from local ordinances to state propositions to elected officials to judges (in some places) to anything else you can think of. So having the count automated makes sense as with the scantron ballots we use in Los Angeles... but electronic voting with no paper trail is absurd and not the correct response.
posted by Justinian at 5:33 AM on June 15 [2 favorites +] [!]

(the correct response is Culture-style super-encrypted brain ballots with responsible systems who can override mass votes if they violate fundamental principles, plus machine brain backups and body cloning so we can take the specter of "no you're gonna die" out of democracy and governance)
posted by saysthis at 1:40 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

Last time I voted, the ballot was longer than I am tall(ish). But they usually divide the stuff up into several ballots in different colors and you can choose to not participate if you have no clue what the vote is about. IMO, it gives you a much better overview than any screen. They also make a big deal out of giving you all the time you need in the booth.
posted by mumimor at 1:42 PM on June 14, 2017

Just don't give them money. Or free votes or, worst comes to the worst, seats.
posted by Artw at 1:45 PM on June 14, 2017

why don't you guys use paper ballots?

Mostly it comes down to money; for a country that prides itself in democracy we've traditionally spent very little on our actual voting process. Doing paper ballots in a secure fashion has its own challenges and ways that fraud could be done, and while they're not insurmountable, it will cost money to do it right and we've not been willing to do that.

People have also underestimated the nature and likelihood of online attacks, not just in the case of voting but in general. As is often mentioned, things like the power grid are dangerously insecure against a nation state level attack.
posted by Candleman at 1:47 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

"I tried to tell the court that this guy’s crazy, that this is a big deal, but they didn't listen to me," she said. "

-- just some woman who got punched in the face.

there DEFINITELY could be more than one set of crimes in his past, maybe there is intimate partner violence in another news story. but everything I see in that description of his police report, contrary to earlier news about assaulting a girlfriend, was about violently abusing, threatening, shooting at, and punching his foster daughter and various of her friends. The quote above is from the 19 year old friend he punched in the face, according to the Daily Beast link from above. When the daughter tried to run away from him with the friend, he cut her out of her seatbelt with a knife and dragged her away.

CW, ok, sure. but the phrase "domestic violence" makes me sicker than any of the details, and most of the details are submerged somewhere in the friend's comment that his daughter told her "stories" about him. The milder stuff that's actually described, that's not domestic. He didn't do it in his fucking domicile. Some of it he did outside and in a car, and some of it he did in someone else's domicile, which is what is sometimes called a home invasion if the victims of it are not women who belong to you or friends of theirs.

not a word about his politics that I have seen reported so far makes any of it surprising. not any of it.
posted by queenofbithynia at 1:48 PM on June 14, 2017 [47 favorites]

Last time I voted, the ballot was longer than I am tall(ish).

We should get a paid half-day off every Friday afternoon to vote for whatever came up during that week. Subject to cancel if there's nothing to vote on. It's LEAN! Single-piece flow! Drum-buffer-rope! (more buzzwords available upon request)
posted by ctmf at 1:51 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

so computers must be better

"It sounded bad to me. Digital. They have digital. What is digital? And it’s very complicated, you have to be Albert Einstein to figure it out. And I said—and now they want to buy more voting machines. I said, 'What system are you going to be—' 'Sir, we’re staying with digital.' I said, 'No you’re not. You going to goddamned steam, the digital costs hundreds of millions of dollars more money and it’s no good.'"
posted by peeedro at 1:55 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

merv's darker side (to lighten up a shit day)
posted by j_curiouser at 1:55 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

So this morning, a man opened fire on Republican congressmembers playing baseball in my mother's neighborhood, only a few blocks from where I was born and raised. A few hours later, a man opened fire at a UPS facility in San Francisco in my brother's neighborhood, only a few blocks from where he lives and works today. Fortunately they're both fine.

I don't know what to say that others haven't already said, except to emphasize that there is a point at which anecdotes like this become so common, it's easier to ask the question "who among us has not been affected by gun violence" than the converse.
posted by biogeo at 1:56 PM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]

Pat Sajak was a tea partier who was against Obamacare and thinks climate change is a hoax. Alex Trebek gives money to conservative candidates. Drew Carey does too. John O'Hurley supports Republican causes. Wink Martindale is a Republican. (In other news, Wink Martindale is still alive.) Merv Griffin was a Republican and raised a lot of money for them

In defense of Drew Carey, he's a Gary Johnson Libertarian, so not great but really not in Woolery/Sajak territory. (But speaking of Merv, Trebek, and Sajak, Jeopardy! and Wheel of Fortune were created by Merv. He also wrote the Jeopardy! theme song!
posted by Room 641-A at 1:58 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

This is such a minor detail, but can I just say how weird it is to me that they posted the full video of a real-life mass shooting online but felt the need to beep out the curse words.
posted by TwoWordReview at 1:58 PM on June 14, 2017 [121 favorites]

the scantron ballots we use in Los Angeles

Can I just say how much I love those little scantron ballots? The ones I used to get in Chicago were huge and unwieldy as hell and I find the way LA separates bubbles and text elegant, relatively foolproof, and way easier to maneuver.
posted by Fish, fish, are you doing your duty? at 2:01 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Folks, all good, but let's call it good for now on the talk show hosts tangent.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 2:08 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

[but we're enjoying the scantron tangent]
posted by localhuman at 2:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

Biogeo, I'm so glad your family is ok!
posted by greermahoney at 2:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Virginia Shooting Suspect Was Distraught Over Trump’s Election, Brother Says NYT background
posted by mumimor at 2:14 PM on June 14, 2017

Virginia Shooting Suspect Was Distraught Over Trump’s Election, Brother Says NYT background

Come on, that describes half the American population.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:16 PM on June 14, 2017 [64 favorites]

Dem lawmakers receive phone calls saying, 'You guys are next'.
posted by Justinian at 2:22 PM on June 14, 2017

Congressional Shooter Loved Bernie, Hated ‘Racist’ Republicans, and Beat His Daughter

- On March 24, neighbor William Schaumleffel called the St. Clair County Sheriff’s Office to complain that Hodgkinson had fired approximately 15 shots outside.... Schaumleffel said had never met the Hodgkinson, and said that almost everyone in the neighborhood owned a gun. But no one starts shooting randomly, into the distance, like Hodgkinson did.

- Hodgkinson was the foster father of at least two girls. The first, Wanda Ashley Stock, 17, committed suicide in 1996 by pouring gasoline on herself and setting herself on fire after a few months of living with the Hodgkinsons.
The Hodgkinsons gave an interview to the paper after her suicide, calling her a “very practical, level-headed girl.”

- In 2002, Hodgkinson became the foster father of another girl whom he allegedly abused, according to police record.

- In 2006, he was arrested for domestic battery and discharge of a firearm after he stormed into a neighbor's home where his teenage foster daughter was visiting with a friend. In a skirmish, he punched his foster daughter's then 19-year-old friend Aimee Moreland “in the face with a closed fist." Hodgkinson was also “observed throwing” his daughter “around the bedroom,” the police report said. When Moreland tried escaping with Hodgkinson's daughter in a vehicle, Hodgkinson reached inside and “turned off the ignition,” the report said.

"We were panicked and when I tried to reverse, I hit neutral instead and he opened my car door and hit me, and then came to her car door and pulled out a knife and cut her seatbelt and dragged her out," Moreland said. "She was only 15 or 16, I think. She was so tiny."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:24 PM on June 14, 2017 [39 favorites]

Terrorist, freedom fighter, depends on the side you're on, apparently.

I know that's an old saying, but I was thinking about it recently, and I actually don't think it's as subjective as all that.

I think "terrorist" should be reserved for those who target civilians.

"Freedom fighters" fight those who are actually oppressing them -- the people wielding the guns.

If you want to know if you're on the side of the good guys or the bad guys, ask yourself, "Am I deliberately targeting civilians?" If yes, you're a terrorist.
posted by OnceUponATime at 2:29 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

Time to dust off the old "What is this I can't even" and "Wait. What?"

AV Club: Trump fans boycott The Goldbergs after creator criticizes president from Spaceballs

Proving that on Twitter, you’re always surrounded by assholes, Adam F. Goldberg, creator of ABC’s The Goldbergs, sparked controversy and spurred calls for a boycott after he criticized the president—specifically President Skroob, as played by Mel Brooks in Spaceballs. “My God, the President is completely and utterly broken! I can’t tell you how disappointed I am. This isn’t fixable, is it? #Skroob,” Goldberg wrote beneath a photo of a Dark Helmet action figure (presumably a custom job), its broken arm lying atop a prop can of Perri-Air.

The Twitter exchanges between Adam Goldberg and the trolls are gold.

In other news, Trump fans are watching a show called The Goldbergs.
posted by Room 641-A at 2:29 PM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

Domestic violence asshole--->mass shooting asshole, what a surprise.
posted by emjaybee at 2:31 PM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

If you want to know if you're on the side of the good guys or the bad guys, ask yourself, "Am I deliberately targeting civilians?" If yes, you're a terrorist.

Do politicians count as civilians in this context? Like, if your leader goes tyrannical you would be a terrorist if you went after him or her, but not if you went after random 18 year olds who signed up for the Army to get help with tuition?

I'm not being sarcastic, I think its a difficult question.
posted by Justinian at 2:32 PM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

The Senate easily voted Wednesday to advance a bipartisan agreement to slap new financial penalties on Russia and let Congress weigh in before President Trump can lift sanctions
posted by Artw at 2:34 PM on June 14, 2017 [34 favorites]

I don't want to derail, but why don't you guys use paper ballots?

I don't know how much people remember the HUGE deal with the Florida recount after the 2000 election. The question of trying to determine the INTENT of the voter when counting by hand. Hanging chad versus dimpled chad, etc.

A LOT of places decided they never wanted to have that problem again, and switched to voting machines with no paper trail. And it was successful, in that they (the people in power) never have to deal with a hand recount, because it's literally impossible.

I will say that I find the click-wheel voting machines we use now in Texas easier to use than the old punch-chad ones. The very first time I voted I went into the booth and got this punch ballot and no explanation of how to use it. I was looking for a pen to mark the boxes. Then once I located the punching tool and figured that part out the actual ballot was really cramped due to being all on one page and therefore confusing.

Obviously the machines have flaws and vulnerabilities. I'd like to see scantron ballots. But you still end up with the problem of improperly completed bubbles and recounts etc. Seems like properly secured machines with paper print-out receipts would be a good solution.
posted by threeturtles at 2:35 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Why are people so afraid?

Would you be if you had much much more than 90% of the people around you and you know deep down that your really didn't do all that much to deserve it?
posted by srboisvert at 2:39 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Seems like properly secured machines with paper print-out receipts would be a good solution.

Yeah - like a receipt you get at an ATM.
posted by yoga at 2:41 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

*waves at threeturtles*

Voting in TX, I never used a punch ballot, but Scantron (this was in DFW area), before the click-wheel system. The problem with receipts, of course, is that then your vote is no longer anonymous--for example, someone could pay or coerce you to vote one way and then demand the receipt as proof you did.

I have no idea what the Scantron error rate was, but I never saw anyone have trouble, and of course, it was re-countable. I would be greatly comforted if we went back to that.
posted by emjaybee at 2:41 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

I know it's fun to joke around about election machines and everything, but it is a SERIOUS problem in the process that needs to be addressed. Otherwise all the handwringing and race watching we do and - ultimately who gets in office - has no legitimacy whatsoever.
posted by yoga at 2:43 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

I would also like to mention that my local Dem party is already recruiting elections judges, and it's time-consuming but easy work that helps secure the voting process. If you are concerned about elections then contact your local party and volunteer to be one. The training is easy, and it's not hard work. Many places, you will get paid something, as well.
posted by emjaybee at 2:43 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

I'm not being sarcastic, I think its a difficult question.

True, that's a difficult question.

But I think the existence of gray areas doesn't change the fact that there are much larger areas of black and white.

You're not allowed to deliberately hurt people who pose no direct threat to you. You certainly can't do that, and then try to claim the moral high ground (no matter what you think of their morality or how you might think it indirectly harms you).

Contrariwise, whether the cause is just or not, violence against armed and prepared opponents isn't terrorism.

I think it's an important distinction to make.
posted by OnceUponATime at 2:44 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

> "The problem with receipts, of course, is that then your vote is no longer anonymous ..."

Only if you keep the receipt. The machine prints one out, you check it for errors, then the machine deposits it in a sealed box. Done.
posted by kyrademon at 2:45 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

I don't see why people using voting machines couldn't be given encrypted receipts that could display their vote only after being presented to a properly-secured machine at the electoral headquarters. That way you'd have a paper trail, but there'd still be some protection against the historic problem of people being forced to show their ballot to employers or whatever.
posted by Joe in Australia at 2:46 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Yeah it was Houston where I had the punch ballot. It may even have been the 2000 presidential election. I think that was the first time I was living in TX after I was 18.

And yeah I think scantron is good, but no system is free of errors. A badly designed ballot is going to be a badly designed ballot.
posted by threeturtles at 2:47 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

My inner trauma survivor really wants to freak out after reading all of that about Hodgkinson, but I keep reminding myself that even the best party, group, religion, ideology, community, whatever, has an asshole that managed to sneak in somehow. Hell, even families have them. Mine has several. Doesn't mean the rest of the group lacks merit. Just means an asshole snuck in.
posted by elsietheeel at 2:48 PM on June 14, 2017 [22 favorites]

Here is Patti LuPone from Sunday night on the Tonys red carpet, serving you some real tea. (video)
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 2:48 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

Metafilter: Just means an asshole snuck in.
posted by Melismata at 2:51 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Being right that Trump is an asshole and the R party is full of crooks does not exempt one from being a terrible human being.
posted by emjaybee at 2:53 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

And yeah I think scantron is good, but no system is free of errors. A badly designed ballot is going to be a badly designed ballot.

Yes. Our electoral system should take account of this fundamental fact. We should have an estimate of the error rate, and any election where the outcome falls within that uncertainty should be considered "too close to determine" and a second vote should be called.
posted by biogeo at 2:54 PM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

It seems crass even to bring this up, but this is definitely the end of town halls and other open in-person events with Republican representatives. They've been trying to find an excuse to get out of them, and this is it. I also think that those of us who have been contacting congressional reps should expect surveillance and possibly intimidation from law enforcement. There are reports that Hodgkinson contacted his congressional representative, Mike Bost, 10 times since June, 2016. Bost's office said he was opinionated but not threatening, which means that any opinionated but not threatening congressperson-contacter can now be considered a potential threat.

Anyway, I think we're going to have to regroup and find some new protest strategies, because some of the old ones just went away.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 2:55 PM on June 14, 2017 [46 favorites]

ELECTIONS NEWS:

** VA primary roundup:

-- Governor:
-- On the Dem side, Lt Gov Northam won by an unexpectedly wide margin of 56-44 over former Congressman Perriello. Perriello immediately pledged unity and support. Dem turnout was extremely high at 531k - so high that, if VA had a top two primary system, both Dems would have advanced. Pleasantly, the primary featured both candidates trying to run the further left.

-- The GOP side turned out to be an unexpected squeaker, as ex-DNC chair Gillespie edged crypto-white supremacist Stewart by 43.7-42.5 (the balance went to also-ran Wagner). Stewart pledged no unity whatsoever, and in fact, refused to concede until all absentee ballots are counted. This one is just outside the recount margin. Turnout was decent, but considerably below Dems at 362k.

-- Obviously, the Dems don't want to take this for granted, especially given the current GOP hold on the legislature. That said, the party seems united behind Northam and Trump is strongly disliked in the state. Gillespie is sharp, but has already lost a previous statewide race, faces a divided party, and has to sail between Scylla and Charybdis on Trump support.
-- Other races:
-- On the Lt Gov side (Virginia elects the Lt Gov separately), former federal prosecutor Fairfax won the Dem nom. Notable that Fairfax would be the first black statewide office holder since Governor Wilder in the early 90s (VA only has 3 statewide elected offices). On the GOP side, Vogel edged in another tight one. Unclear how this will affect her legal battle with candidate Reeves.

Lt Gov is of interest because they break ties in the state Senate, and that's currently held by the GOP 21-19. Any scenario that got the Dems one more seat, and they would take effective control. Regular elections for the Senate aren't until 2019, though, but this is where we can have fun speculating about special elections or party switching.

The House of Delegates is more tightly in GOP control, 66-34, meaning Dems would need to flip 17 seats (all 100 seats are up for election). This will be challenging. However, 17 GOP seats voted for Clinton (she won 51 of 100 overall). Also, recruitment was far stronger this time for Dems - of 100 seats, 87 have candidates - in 2015, it was just 56. GOP, by contrast, is contesting just 72.

Interesting Delegate races include HD-13, currently held by the odious Bob Marshall. The primary was won by Danica Roem (who would be VA's first transgender legislator). Clinton won this LD 55-40. More targeted districts here.

** NJ gov -- As mentioned upstream, a new Quinnipiac poll has gov Christie at record low approval. In the race proper, Dem Murphy is up on Lt Gov Guadagno by 55-26. Trump is very unpopular, and Guadagno is going to have a heck of a time running away from both him and Christie. Ironically, apparently Guadagno and Christie don't get along at all, but that's not enough to help her.

** GA-06:
-- Mentioned upstream, there is serious concern as to the vulnerability to hacking of the Georgia electoral system.

-- New Trafalgar poll has Ossoff up 47.5 - 43-4.
** Today's Fun Fact: Since 1938, the party controlling the White House has only won 39% of gubernatorial races.

posted by Chrysostom at 3:10 PM on June 14, 2017 [43 favorites]

Don't comply in advance, A&C. We should plan, for sure, in case that happens but let's not assume it already has.
posted by emjaybee at 3:10 PM on June 14, 2017 [28 favorites]

This is probably the first time I've ever said this; Trump didn't screw today up. Yet.
posted by Justinian at 3:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

I also think that those of us who have been contacting congressional reps should expect surveillance and possibly intimidation from law enforcement.

It is extremely important for people to continue contacting their representatives. I consider it highly unlikely that non-threatening callers will be subject to surveillance and intimidation from law enforcement, not least because of the immense resources that would be required for such a policy.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:13 PM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

this is definitely the end of town halls and other open in-person events with Republican representatives.

I'd love to see them have to explain why they can't meet with constituents passing through a metal detector but it's perfectly safe to wander around in public, particular in open/concealed carry states and from 2nd amendment assholes.

Here is Patti LuPone from Sunday night on the Tonys red carpet, serving you some real tea. (video)

She's amazing. Not a fan of Madonna either, but a big fan of Hillary. (Btw, clips are NSFW.)
posted by Room 641-A at 3:14 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

This is probably the first time I've ever said this; Trump didn't screw today up. Yet.

It's his birthday. TrumpDay. Today is all about how great he is and the 71st anniversary of the day the earth was graced with his presence. He's too busy marveling at his own awesomeness to care about anything else.
posted by elsietheeel at 3:17 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

NYT: Turkish Guards Will Be Charged in Embassy Protest, Officials Say

Law enforcement officials plan to announce charges Thursday against a dozen members of the Turkish president’s security detail for their involvement in a brutal attack on protesters outside the Turkish ambassador’s residence here last month, two American officials said on Wednesday.

Authorities have already charged several others, including two Americans and two Canadians, with taking part in the violent skirmish.

Many of them left the country with Erdogan and presumably won't be coming back anytime soon, but it's more than the "do absolutely nothing" I expected.
posted by zachlipton at 3:19 PM on June 14, 2017 [54 favorites]

I think there is a misunderstanding re: the paper copy of the ballot. Those would be checked by the voter and deposited in a secure ballot box at the voting site. The paper copies would be used in the event that there was a suspicion that they vote totals were compromised (remember, just because an individual ballot doesn't appear corrupted doesn't mean the totals couldn't be).

The paper ballot would be confirmed by the voter before being left as a second record. There should be no identifying information on the ballot.
posted by obliquity of the ecliptic at 3:20 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

The GOP side turned out to be an unexpected squeaker, ex-DNC chair Gillespie edged crypto-white supremacist Stewart by 43.7-42.5

That should read ex-RNC chair. Also notable, perhaps spooked by close polling, the Gillespie campaign embraced Stewart's signature issue at the last moment.
posted by peeedro at 3:22 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Yes, of course, major typo there! Thanks, peeedro.
posted by Chrysostom at 3:24 PM on June 14, 2017

Bringing you more light relief from the administration that can't manage do anything right:

@Josh Gerstein SG's office rushing on travel ban brief. Missing word(s).

It's an image so I'll transcribe a bit of it

Respondents contend that the government's appeal [...] becomes moot today [...] As a matter of both Executive Order [...] and common sense, a 90-day period that was never permitted to run is not now elapsing. Respondents' contrary argument is based on a misreading of the. As discussed more fully in [...]

I'm guessing someone was supposed to look something up and fill in that part?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:27 PM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

How to vote
posted by mumimor at 3:28 PM on June 14, 2017

Trump had received private assurances from former FBI Director James B. Comey starting in January that he was not personally under investigation. Officials say that changed shortly after Comey’s firing.

YA DUN GOOFED DONNY BOY
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:29 PM on June 14, 2017 [21 favorites]

who remember
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:31 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

WaPo: Special counsel is investigating Trump for possible obstruction of justice, officials say.

HAPPY BIRTHDAY
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 3:32 PM on June 14, 2017 [85 favorites]

Irish Central News Sean Spicer among the favorites to be US Ambassador to Ireland

You have to click on the link to see the glorious pants that Spicer is sporting. I don't even know where you buy those kinds of pants except maybe a tourist shop?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:33 PM on June 14, 2017 [21 favorites]

There's one thing I don't think y'all are quite getting.

Those paper ballots?

Count them by hand.

Don't use a scantron. No, I don't care how many things you're voting for.

Count them by hand, and you can trust the results.
posted by Yowser at 3:33 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Respondents' contrary argument is based on a misreading of the.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:33 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

VINDICATED
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:35 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Those pants are beyond belief. I forgive him for about 10% of his evil
posted by mumimor at 3:36 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

> There are reports that Hodgkinson contacted his congressional representative, Mike Bost, 10 times since June, 2016. Bost's office said he was opinionated but not threatening, which means that any opinionated but not threatening congressperson-contacter can now be considered a potential threat.

Anyway, I think we're going to have to regroup and find some new protest strategies, because some of the old ones just went away.

I am reminding myself that I need to be making more calls to my elected representatives — more "thank you for being the best possible representative" calls to Lee, more "uhhh I would very much like to vote for you for president in 2020 plz make that a thing" calls to Harris, and more "what the hell is wrong with you would you please get out of Ted Lieu's Senate seat?" calls to Feinstein.

The people who deserve to be yelled at still deserve to be yelled at, even if someone who deserved to be yelled at just got shot at. when they stifle dissent, that gives us grounds for more dissent and more organization. When we stifle our own dissent, we undermine our own organizational efforts.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 3:36 PM on June 14, 2017 [22 favorites]

Between those pants and when he was the Easter Bunny, the Things I Like About Sean Spicer Meter now reads at 2.
posted by Chrysostom at 3:37 PM on June 14, 2017 [23 favorites]

Is he actually qualified in any way to be an ambassador?
posted by Melismata at 3:39 PM on June 14, 2017

This is probably the first time I've ever said this; Trump didn't screw today up. Yet.

I'll say the same jinx-warding-off spell I say when people remark that no disasters have happened today at work: "...that you know of."
posted by ctmf at 3:39 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

Is he actually qualified in any way to be an ambassador?

Nobody is. It's a patronage position in a lot of cases. So long as you don't whip it out in public you get to attend all the schmoozy gatherings and your charge d’affaires career diplomat does all the real work.
posted by Talez at 3:40 PM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

I don't even know where you buy those kinds of pants except maybe a tourist shop?

Begorrah!
posted by kirkaracha at 3:42 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Is he actually qualified in any way to be an ambassador?

Ambassador to Ireland is generally a straight-up patronage position, often to reward a big donor. There are embassy staff who are actually qualified.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 3:43 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

You have to click on the link to see the glorious pants that Spicer is sporting.

Adults have pajamas to school day too?
posted by Artw at 3:44 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Secret Life of Gravy: "If the job was offered (and she accepted) would LePage get to choose her replacement or would there be a special election?"

According to Ballotpedia, Maine is one of the 36 states where Senate vacancies are filled by gubernatorial appointment and the appointment stands until the next regularly scheduled statewide general election.
posted by mhum at 3:45 PM on June 14, 2017

Count them by hand, and you can trust the results.

I do that. For my town. It's super hard (I mean, the counting is easy but making sure it's all accurate is very exacting and I'm only counting a few thousand along with maybe ten other people). And the results are only as trustworthy as someone like me is. That sort of trustworthiness is difficult to scale. What is less difficult is making good trustworthy voting machines. And they do scale. There's just very little incentive to do it and very much incentive not to.
posted by jessamyn at 3:45 PM on June 14, 2017 [24 favorites]

I mean you look at those pants and you think, "Aaaw, he has a fun side that just wants to get out and play." It is tragic that he has allowed himself to be Trump tainted.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:45 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

One of the other people mentioned as a possible choice for Ambassador to Ireland is Senator Susan Collins. That would be an interesting choice. I get the feeling as the most moderate of the Republican Senators she is often a thorn in their side. If the job was offered (and she accepted) would LePage get to choose her replacement or would there be a special election?

LePage could appoint, but the appointee would only serve until 2018 ("next regularly scheduled statewide election"). Appointing Collins ambassador to anywhere would get her out of the Maine Governor's race in 2018, which I see as a very good thing.
posted by anastasiav at 3:45 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

I feel like in the past, nations with whom we have extremely friendly relationships have received and sent patronage ambassadors.

Sure, but sending them obvious Baghdad Bob seems more like an insult.
posted by ctmf at 3:46 PM on June 14, 2017

This seems trivial in light of everything else going on, but:
NY Times: Fox News Drops ‘Fair and Balanced’ Motto

“The shift has nothing to do with programming or editorial decisions,” the network said in a statement. Instead, the slogan was dropped in part because of its close association with Roger Ailes, network’s co-founder, former chairman and the originator of the phrase, who was fired in August in a sexual harassment scandal.

The network said that “Fair and Balanced” was shelved as a marketing tool after Mr. Ailes’s departure. In its place is a new motto: “Most Watched, Most Trusted.”
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 3:47 PM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

You know that bit in the "Threw it On the Ground" video where he slams the cake down and says "happy birthday to the ground?" That's how I feel reading that article.
posted by zachlipton at 3:50 PM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]

Other candidates for the Irish Ambassador job include Christopher Ruddy and Rep. Peter King. I think I'd prefer either of them to be removed from the U.S. ahead of Spicey time, who does have a bit of a soulful tragic element to his personality. (And also kind of sucks at his job, which is good strategically.)
posted by msalt at 3:52 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

How to vote

That's barbaric. If you are qualified to vote, they mail you a polling card? How do they stop minorities from voting? Who would want a democracy like that? Communist savages.
posted by saysthis at 3:52 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Unfortunately there's no way the President can effectively run the country ~~at all, ever~~ with this criminal investigation looming over him; he should invoke the Twenty-Fifth Amendment to ~~permanently~~ temporarily hand over the reins to the Vice President ~~until he also gets charged with something, wow, this timeline~~

~~happy birthday mister president~~
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:52 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Jesus Christ, Trump can't be stupid enough to appoint Pete King ambassador to Ireland. I suspect that most people in Irish political life would rather spit in his face than shake his hand.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 3:53 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

I mean you look at those pants and you think, "Aaaw, he has a fun side that just wants to get out and play."

And then you think about how MEAN Trump was to him when he wouldn't let him meet the Pope and there's probably nobody in the world Spicey wants to meet more than the Pope except for MAYBE Jesus or Santa Claus and it's just... I feel bad for him sometimes.

And then I remember he kinda did this to himself and he hasn't done anything to extricate himself so...you made your bed and now you're going to lie in it...in your shamrock jammies.
posted by elsietheeel at 3:54 PM on June 14, 2017 [32 favorites]

Jesus Christ, Trump can't be stupid enough to

I got bad news for you
posted by Rust Moranis at 3:54 PM on June 14, 2017 [80 favorites]

Jesus Christ, Trump can't be stupid enough to

Let me stop you right there...
posted by Justinian at 3:54 PM on June 14, 2017 [56 favorites]

Jesus Christ, Trump can't be stupid enough to

Hold my beer!
posted by elsietheeel at 3:55 PM on June 14, 2017 [50 favorites]

(Just kidding, still sober.)
posted by elsietheeel at 3:56 PM on June 14, 2017 [18 favorites]

So theoretically if Susan Collins wanted to give up her seat-- which might not be likely but the Ambassador job might be more fun and less stress-- we would be saddled with a far Right Winger in her place. Ugh. Don't do it, Susan! Planned Parenthood depends on you.

I listened to a recording of the Sessions hearing today (lawfare podcast) and I noticed her voice was pretty quavery. Is she in good health?

Also noticed in the recording how maddening Sessions' drawl was, especially when he slowwwwwed way down to "answer" Sen. Harris. She would ask him a pointed question that could be answered yes or no and he would deliberately meander down the path and into the raspberry bushes as a way to avoid her questions. That's why she interrupted him so much; five minutes goes by fast. He would drive me crazy and I've lived in NC for 17 years now. I wonder if this was a strategy cooked up by him and his counsel knowing her reputation. He did the same thing with the other Democrats but not to as great an extent.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:56 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

Jinx! (burps at mirror)
posted by Rust Moranis at 3:56 PM on June 14, 2017

I don't care what Spicer is doing to himself, I care what he's doing to the country and the world at large with his endless malicious lying since before his first scheduled press conference (when he said Trump's inauguration was the biggest ever) in defense of an even more malicious and dangerous criminal.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:56 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

(WaPo) The Justice Department has long held that it would not be appropriate to indict a sitting president.

I know I could look up the precise reasoning behind this and I am sure it is long and elaborate. but it seems like it would be much more appropriate to indict a sitting president than to allow a suspected criminal to evade prosecution simply because he holds a high office and is extremely powerful. wouldn't it? if you value the rule of law or whatever?
posted by queenofbithynia at 3:57 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

anything charming about sean spicer makes him worse as a human being, since charm put to the service of fascism is a tool for normalization.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 4:00 PM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

Update on the Southern Baptist Convention resolution on alt-right white supremacy:

WaPo: Southern Baptists voted overwhelmingly to condemn ‘alt-right white supremacy’
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 4:01 PM on June 14, 2017 [38 favorites]

WaPo: Special counsel is investigating Trump for possible obstruction of justice, officials say.

Anyone else read that and think, "Wow, if that actually leaked, somebody REALLY wants Trump to fire Mueller?"
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:03 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Considering that Foreign Officers are supposed to be charismatic smooth talkers that can win over any crowd with lies, I'd say that Sean Spicer is totally unqualified.
posted by Yowser at 4:05 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

The Southern Baptists also commended "those leaders who choose not to meet privately with members of the opposite sex who are not their spouse."
posted by zachlipton at 4:05 PM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

In its place is a new motto: “Most Watched, Most Trusted.”

They opted for this over the more direct version, "Fox News: People Actually Believe This Stuff."
posted by p3t3 at 4:06 PM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

In [place of Fox News' earlier motto, "Fair and Balanced"] is a new motto: “Most Watched, Most Trusted.”

Yes, that's what I tell the kids: I'm watching them because I trust them not to cheat.
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:07 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Also: That sanctions attachment against Russia passed the Senate 97-2. It's on an Iran sanctions bill, which certainly doesn't thrill me, but... 97-2.

Can you imagine what'll happen if Congress passes further sanctions against Russia (and solidifies those in place) with a veto-proof majority? Or if they actually fall short of that, get vetoed, and then vote to override?

It's a lot to hope for because Republicans, but that 97-2 has my heart aflutter with the possibilities.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:08 PM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

"Fox News: We're Why Your Grandchildren Will Tell Legends Of The Surface-World"
posted by Rust Moranis at 4:08 PM on June 14, 2017 [59 favorites]

FOX NEWS: The party of 73 year old white racists!

Haha, just kidding, half of them are younger than 73.
posted by Justinian at 4:08 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

I don't see why Trump would be mad. I mean, he nagged Comey for months to make sure the public knew whether Trump was or wasn't a target of investigation. Mission accomplished.

AND IF YA DON'T KNOW, NOW YA KNOW, MR. PRESIDENT!
posted by FelliniBlank at 4:10 PM on June 14, 2017 [23 favorites]

anything charming about sean spicer makes him worse as a human being, since charm put to the service of fascism is a tool for normalization.

This is why I don't really like it when people use the cutesy "Spicey" nickname. And for the same reason, why I've always objected to people referring to trump as "The Donald" (don't read that thread if you don't want to feel super depressed, by the way).
posted by Atom Eyes at 4:11 PM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

FOX NEWS: We've made your children hate you. Now we'll make you hate them back.

(I miss those Letterman Top Tens)
posted by Devonian at 4:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

Am I totally off base about this potentially being some bizarre trap? If Trump fires Mueller now, after it being publicly reported that Trump is under investigation for obstruction of justice, isn't it just...more obstruction of justice? Like, even more obvious obstruction of justice. Obstruction of justice squared, perhaps. idk, real life is crazy, I've lost all ability to gauge what's a probable strategy and what's just one more part of horse-loose-in-the-hospital craziness.
posted by yasaman at 4:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

> (don't read that thread if you don't want to feel super depressed, by the way).

I dunno some of those comments seemed remarkably prescient (e.g. mazola's "TRUMP 2016: MAYBE IT'S TIME WE RECONSIDER COMMUNISM").
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 4:15 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

"The FBI leak of information regarding the President is outrageous, inexcusable and illegal." - statement by Marc Kasowitz's spokesperson (via OANN Twitter)
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 4:16 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

if he fires mueller now, we live in a consequence-free autocracy,
unless someone figures out a way to keep the investigation going like last time,
in which case we hold our breath to see if we live in a consequence-free autocracy,
until trump does the next thing that confirms we live in a consequence-free autocracy,
unless…
posted by murphy slaw at 4:16 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

can we all agree that if he cans mueller we refer to it as "the return of saturday night massacre II: staying alive"
posted by murphy slaw at 4:18 PM on June 14, 2017 [16 favorites]

"Go ahead, you big baby. Fire Mueller. I triple-dog-dare you! Bawk bawk bawk bawk bawk," said a source familiar with the investigation. [fake]
posted by FelliniBlank at 4:20 PM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

Am I totally off base about this potentially being some bizarre trap? If Trump fires Mueller now, after it being publicly reported that Trump is under investigation for obstruction of justice, isn't it just...more obstruction of justice?

It was certainly considered such in point 4 of Article I of Nixon's articles of impeachment.
posted by Justinian at 4:20 PM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Yeah, I totally read the leaks as a response to the rumors of Mueller's imminent unemployment. I think there's no way that Trump doesn't at least TRY to fire him now (and maybe he'll succeed. Who knows) but now it makes trump look extremely guilty when he does so. For whatever that's worth.
posted by sporkwort at 4:20 PM on June 14, 2017

those leaders who choose not to meet privately with members of the opposite sex who are not their spouse.

But same sex is ok.
posted by Melismata at 4:24 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

So here's a scenario:

1) Mueller is able to decide quite quickly that he can prove Trump committed felony obstruction of justice on at least one instance, perhaps just by using evidence which is already publicly available. (More evidence of other instances of the crime might arise later, but he's confident about at least one instance.)

2) Many months later, Mueller is able to issue a complete report regarding other allegations, such as the campaign's collusion with Russia.

My question is, how likely is it Mueller could make an official report of his belief that a crime can be proven, to Congress, immediately after item 1, instead of waiting many months for item 2?

We are talking about the most powerful man in the world, and I would hope that if Mueller can find him to be provably guilty of a serious felony sooner rather than later, he would be morally obliged to allow Congress to impeach the President sooner rather than later.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:25 PM on June 14, 2017

The Southern Baptists also commended "those leaders who choose not to meet privately with members of the opposite sex who are not their spouse."

Yeah, also from the WaPo link upthread:

Meeting in Phoenix this week, Southern Baptists voted Tuesday to condemn gambling and Planned Parenthood, and they adopted a statement on the importance of public officials who display “consistent moral character.” That resolution also commended “those leaders who choose not to meet privately with members of the opposite sex who are not their spouse,” referring to Vice President Pence, who drew attention when he said he doesn’t eat alone with a woman other than his wife.

I wanted to know what "overwhelmingly voted" meant in terms of vote count but didn't see it in the article.

Another quote to touch on race within the SBC:

The Southern Baptist resolution was written by Dwight McKissic, a black pastor from Cornerstone Baptist Church in Arlington, Tex., who said he wanted the denomination to make it clear that they had no sympathy for the alt-right...

He said black Southern Baptists were disappointed by how it was handled, but it became clear Tuesday that a large number of white Southern Baptists wanted to vote on the resolution. There was a vote, but it needed a two-thirds majority and received 57.53 percent. Then the committee decided to revisit the resolution.

“I don’t think they anticipated how white people would get upset about this and demanded something be done. I’m encouraged and heartened by this,” McKissic said. “It was the white people who said, no, we will not take this sitting down. We don’t want this association with the convention.”
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 4:32 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

I'm wondering why Mike Lee and Rand Paul voted against the Russia sanctions bill.

I'd imagine Rand did it for the same reason he does everything: he's a narcissistic contrarian in love with the smell of his own farts.
posted by jason_steakums at 4:33 PM on June 14, 2017 [33 favorites]

MetaFilter: Narcissistic contrarians in love with the smell of their own farts.
posted by mosk at 4:39 PM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

"Investigators have also been looking for any evidence of possible financial crimes among Trump associates, officials said."

I'd like to point them in the direction of the shadowy LLCs buying up Trump property. Seems like a good place to start.
posted by T.D. Strange at 4:42 PM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]

Trump, Jr. re-tweeted someone saying that Mueller should be "shut down immediately."

The nerve of these people, seriously.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 4:43 PM on June 14, 2017 [33 favorites]

Anyone else read that and think, "Wow, if that actually leaked, somebody REALLY wants Trump to fire Mueller?"

I thought it was a sure thing that Mueller's people orchestrated the leak in order to ensure that potentially firing him would be open-and-shut obstruction! which, now, it unquestionably would or will be. like even to the extent of leaking the investigation before the particular crime, because they can trust him to commit the crime.
posted by queenofbithynia at 4:44 PM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

There are reports that Travis Air Force Base is on lockdown due to an "active shooter situation at the shopping center on base."

There was also a mass shooting at the UPS facility in San Francisco today.

For some goddamn reason, everything in this country is a political issue from how retailer workers greet customers in the month of December to whether delicious tacos should be served from convenient trucks. But whenever anyone maybe mentions the slightest concept of gun control, we're all told not to politicize it.
posted by zachlipton at 4:44 PM on June 14, 2017 [58 favorites]

those leaders who choose not to meet privately with members of the opposite sex who are not their spouse.

But same sex is ok.

I believe in the family
With my ever loving wife beside me
But she don't know about my girlfriend
Or the man I met last night
posted by Fish, fish, are you doing your duty? at 4:44 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

CBS Travis Air Force Base reports "real world security incident"

When I first saw this half an hour ago on twitter, everyone was saying they had a planned training event today but now I'm seeing reports of an active shooter on base right now.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:45 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

My question is, how likely is it Mueller could make an official report of his belief that a crime can be proven, to Congress, immediately after item 1, instead of waiting many months for item 2?

Traditionally, I think this investigators try to be as thorough as possible, making sure they have every i dotted and t crossed before they reveal their findings. So I think waiting is far more likely. You want the evidence to be over-whelming as much as possible. As the saying goes, if you come for the king you best not miss.
posted by drezdn at 4:45 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

If Trump fires Mueller now

I keep hearing this from various pundits, but didn't Rosenstein establish (under sworn oath) that he is the only person who can legally fire Muller? When people talk about Trump firing Mueller, how would this happen?
posted by Room 641-A at 4:46 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Travis is near me. The local news is reporting a security incident and telling people on base to stay inside with their doors and windows locked.
posted by elsietheeel at 4:47 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

I think the exception would be if there was an active threat posed to the country by not going for the immediate prove-able charge.
posted by drezdn at 4:47 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

I keep hearing this from various pundits, but didn't Rosenstein establish (under sworn oath) that he is the only person who can legally fire Muller? When people talk about Trump firing Mueller, how would this happen?

Same as Nixon? Direct Rosenstein to fire the special council. When Rosenstein refuses fire him, bring up the next sap, request they fire Muller. Repeat until Mueller is fired.
posted by Talez at 4:47 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

@Jacob Martin there's an active shooter here at Travis Air Force base, the employees have us locked into an office for safety. please send ur prayers

So not a training exercise although there was one planned for today.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:48 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

I keep hearing this from various pundits, but didn't Rosenstein establish (under sworn oath) that he is the only person who can legally fire Muller? When people talk about Trump firing Mueller, how would this happen?

Neal Katyal has some information on this: Trump or Congress can still block Robert Mueller. I know. I wrote the rules.
posted by zachlipton at 4:48 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

When people talk about Trump firing Mueller, how would this happen

he tweets "you're fired" at 3 in the morning and is SO ANGRY that the mean eyebrows man is still there the next day. Disrespect! Sad.
posted by queenofbithynia at 4:48 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

how would this happen?

Could he fire Rosenstein and appoint someone who would fire Mueller?
posted by drezdn at 4:48 PM on June 14, 2017

I keep hearing this from various pundits, but didn't Rosenstein establish (under sworn oath) that he is the only person who can legally fire Muller? When people talk about Trump firing Mueller, how would this happen?

The same way Nixon did. Trump orders Rosenstein to fire Mueller. Rosenstein refuses, so Trump fires him. Then orders Rosenstein's next-in-command to do it, and they refuse.

Lather, rinse, repeat.
posted by FelliniBlank at 4:49 PM on June 14, 2017

If he does it on a Saturday night, we're going to have to make Wikipedia's "Saturday Night Massacre" article into a disambiguation page.
posted by zachlipton at 4:51 PM on June 14, 2017 [20 favorites]

They've lifted the shelter in place and people are going back into the BX, so who knows what's going on right now. Cars are going in and out of the base again. Live helicopter news feed.
posted by elsietheeel at 4:53 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Trump, Jr. re-tweeted someone

Ugh. He was especially nasty about that shooter this morning. He really is a poisonous pill.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

And the good news is that no one wants to be the Bork because you get Borked. In other words Nixon worked his way down the AG ladder to the fourth person, Robert Bork, who did fire Cox so he could keep his job. Years later when he was nominated by Ronald Reagan for the Supreme Court, the Democrats voted against him (for various reasons) and that's how we ended up with Justice Kennedy.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:56 PM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

sooo. we know trump can't directly fire mueller. and members of the trumpstaff know that trump can't directly fire mueller. but trump himself is a moron. is there any chance he's dumb enough to publicly announce that he's firing mueller, without realizing that he doesn't actually have that power?

cause that would be hilarious.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 4:59 PM on June 14, 2017 [33 favorites]

As Neal Katyal says, though, if Trump wanted to go nuclear he could unilaterally repeal the special counsel regulation (as it is not a piece of legislation but a regulation in the executive branch, of which Trump is the head) and then directly fire Mueller.

It never occurred to me that something like that might be considered. Apparently it never occurred to the people who wrote the regulation.

The firestorm if Trump tried such a thing would engulf the country.
posted by Justinian at 5:00 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

The Guardian reports that Donald Trump himself is now under investigation for obstruction of justice.

"This marks the first time that the ongoing investigation, which has hung over Trump since his inauguration, has potentially implicated the president himself."

/inserts heavy breathing gif
posted by Effigy2000 at 5:01 PM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]

"Oh, there are a lot of lousy people in the world. Also, a lot of terrific people. You've gotta remember that, and you've got to move in the right circles. I have days where I just want everyone to go fuck themselves or walk off a cliff, but I only say that to myself, and I smile and I walk home and I have some tea, I talk to Garson [Kanin, her husband], I might take a nap. Then I wake up and I write, and in writing, I wipe away all the unpleasantness of the day, of the people, of the city, whatever. We have it in our power to overcome assholes, and I think we have them thrown into our path to see if we have the chops to handle them."

- Ruth Gordon, age 87
posted by elsietheeel at 5:01 PM on June 14, 2017 [54 favorites]

Would Mueller have the power to get his tax returns as part of the collusion investigation, or not really because Trump is suspected of only obstruction?

I apologize for my English, I'm very excited.
posted by Tarumba at 5:05 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

If you're feeling overwhelmed & anxious today, remember that this is Leland Melvin's official NASA picture.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 5:05 PM on June 14, 2017 [78 favorites]

> As Neal Katyal says, though, if Trump wanted to go nuclear he could unilaterally repeal the special counsel regulation (as it is not a piece of legislation but a regulation in the executive branch, of which Trump is the head) and then directly fire Mueller.

so what happens is trump declares he's firing Mueller directly. Then he's informed (by Mueller, by Priebus, by the press, by who?) that he can't actually do that. So he fumes and rages and yells and throws shit — until Bannon or whoever tells him that he actually can directly fire Mueller, by unilaterally repealing the special counsel regulation. so he does that.

what comes next?
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:07 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Same as Nixon? Direct Rosenstein to fire the special council. When Rosenstein refuses fire him, bring up the next sap, request they fire Muller. Repeat until Mueller is fired.

Oh, okay, thanks. I wasn't sure if "fire Mueller" was shorthand for any scenario like this or if I was misunderstanding.

Ben Stein

Mueller? Mueller? Mueller?
posted by Room 641-A at 5:08 PM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

so what happens is trump declares he's firing Mueller directly. Then he's informed (by Mueller, by Priebus, by the press, by who?) that he can't actually do that. So he fumes and rages and yells and throws shit — until Bannon or whoever tells him that he actually can directly fire Mueller, by unilaterally repealing the special counsel regulation. so he does that.

what comes next?

Mid season hiatus?
posted by milarepa at 5:10 PM on June 14, 2017 [29 favorites]

Would Mueller have the power to get his tax returns as part of the collusion investigation

Mueller has the power to get literally almost anything he decides he needs, including Trump's tax returns.
posted by Justinian at 5:11 PM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

what comes next?

Honestly, I have no idea. I don't think the Republicans are going to do anything about anything. Trump could literally shoot a man on 5th Avenue and they would note that the man once donated to the Democrats before moving on to more-pressing business. So then the question is what the rest of us do. I found myself thinking today about whether I would participate in a general strike if it meant losing my job. I think I would, but fuck.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 5:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

Would Mueller have the power to get his tax returns

Don't worry about your English. It's perfectly fine. And the short answer is yes. And not only from the Special Counsel. The NY AG is pursuing an investigation into Trump's business dealings, which would probably lead to them getting the returns. And the emoluments lawsuits will get the returns, if any of the lawsuits are allowed to go ahead.

One of Trump's most closely held secrets will be passed along far and wide, to many different investigations, if everything works out. The returns are probably already in Mueller's hands, since that's an obvious first place to look.
posted by honestcoyote at 5:14 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Would Mueller have the power to get his tax returns as part of the collusion investigation, or not really because Trump is suspected of only obstruction?

The Clinton impeachment didn't start with someone saying "I bet that dude's gotten a hummer in the Oval from an intern...".
posted by Etrigan at 5:14 PM on June 14, 2017 [37 favorites]

There are now reports that the incident at Travis AFB was a false alarm.
posted by zachlipton at 5:14 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

> what comes next?

well, that's sort of the $64,000 question at the moment, and one I've been debating with a friend in a side chat. opinions range from "nothing happens, we're fucked" to "some Republican finds his or her conscience and spine and makes a stand against authoritarianism."

Put your money on the former if you're a realist, or the latter if you're an optimist.
posted by mosk at 5:14 PM on June 14, 2017

@DerekKCRA:

#BREAKING Travis Air Force Base releases a statement saying they responded to reports of gunfire but never found a shooter. Lockdown lifted.

posted by biogeo at 5:21 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

I literally 14 minutes ago texted my brother that The Trump Presidency is the best movie I've ever seen.

Really? Because I was going to ask the management for a refund.
posted by greermahoney at 5:25 PM on June 14, 2017 [26 favorites]

"Would Mueller have the power to get his tax returns as part of the collusion investigation

Mueller has the power to get literally almost anything he decides he needs, including Trump's tax returns.
posted by Justinian at 7:11 PM on June 14 [+] [!]"

@Justinian - I am curious as to how far "literally almost anything" goes. Launch codes?

Honest question.
posted by a non mouse, a cow herd at 5:27 PM on June 14, 2017

I literally 14 minutes ago texted my brother that The Trump Presidency is the best movie I've ever seen.

I see it as some hyperreal, political telenovella. Just glad they moved off the boring travel ban and ivanka subplots. Those were going nowhere.

But seriously, I rewatched two seasons of 24 recently and you'd be surprised at how plausible and almost understated it is now. What happens next indeed.
posted by milarepa at 5:30 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

An educated guess attempt to answer your question: Launch codes would fall into the category of classified information. While I strongly suspect that Mueller's office has made provision to examine classified evidence (given that we already know that communications intercepts of Russian officials are a key factor in this investigation), access would still be governed by the "need to know" standard. Since there's conceivably no argument by which Mueller needs to see launch codes to do his job, he has no need to know that information.

Just glad they moved off the boring travel ban and ivanka subplots. Those were going nowhere.

There are millions of people who are personally invested in the outcome of that travel ban subplot.
posted by zachlipton at 5:34 PM on June 14, 2017 [20 favorites]

mosk: opinions range from "nothing happens, we're fucked" to "some Republican finds his or her conscience and spine and makes a stand against authoritarianism."

a&c: I found myself thinking today about whether I would participate in a general strike if it meant losing my job. I think I would, but fuck.

needless to say I'm closer to a&c's point of view on this, half because I'm always fronting as a radical and half because I too am arbitrary and capricious.

but yeah I don't think we can look to federal-level elected officials for fuckall, particularly not the ones in the republican party — and the ones in the republican party are the only ones that matter right now. the democrats can stage holding actions to give people working on extraparliamentary methods time to work, but they can't take any positive action themselves. pretending, though, that the electeds are the only ones with genuine agency though — which is common to both of mosk's scenarios — is a luxury we don't have anymore.

I have no idea how we get from where we are to a general strike. but the threat of a general strike, or something tantamount to a general strike, must be in the air, especially once trump steps up the aggressiveness through firing mueller.

I'm going to put in a plug for a science fiction novel, because mefi is the space where I can get away with nutty moves like that. And, like, on the one hand, it's pretty dire when science fiction novels are our best hope. but on the other hand, there's prior art for science fiction novels as a particularly effective organizing tool in situations where coordinated mass action is necessary for survival. Anyway: plz, if you have free time, read Kim Stanley Robinson's New York 2140. On the surface it's a novel about life in nearish-future manhattan, but really it's a deeply politically/theoretically informed speculative handbook for pro-democracy insurrection in the present day. as one of the narrators of that novel puts it at a key turning point:

Strategic defaulting. Class-action suits. Mass rallies. Staying home from work. Staying out of private transport systems. Refusing consumer consumption beyond the necessities. Withdrawing deposits. Denouncing all forms of rent-seeking. Ignoring mass media. Withholding scheduled payments. Fiscal noncompliance. Loud public complaining.

the less zany/less fictional handbook we should also be consulting is Gene Sharp's From Dictatorship to Democracy, which I think I've read cover to cover four or five times since the start of the disaster. each time I appreciate it more, and each time the suggestions for resistance it gives seems more plausible.

and while we're waiting for the shit to properly hit the fan, plz prepare (and this is advice I'm giving to myself more than to anyone else) by going to meetings — whatever flavor of resistance meeting you're most comfortable with. Indivisible, SURJ, DSA, SA, ISO, antifa formations, bernie orgs, radical unions: wherever you fit in, start going to meetings. phone calls from home and solitary use of resistbot and bitching on metafilter aren't enough; we need to be working within organizations that can pivot toward and provide support for mass action when that becomes necessary.

conspire with your friends. and make new friends to conspire with. hatch some plots, y'all.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:36 PM on June 14, 2017 [33 favorites]

Since there's conceivably no argument by which Mueller needs to see launch codes to do his job, he has no need to know that information.

Unless he needs to check that they aren't covfefe
posted by dng at 5:36 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

folks i don't think it's a tv show i'm pretty sure it's real life
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:39 PM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Sure it's a TV show. It's a spin-off from The Apprentice. Except now Donald Trump is the apprentice, but nobody told him that.
posted by Autumnheart at 5:44 PM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]

I'm broke, up to my eyeballs in debt - medical and otherwise, and unemployed, with very little to lose...

Please do tell me more about fiscal noncompliance.
posted by elsietheeel at 5:44 PM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

People prone to worries about nuclear codes really don't need to watch Command and Control and see what the codes were set to back in the day.
posted by Artw at 5:44 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

folks i don't think it's a tv show i'm pretty sure it's real life

That nice, clear distinction gets blurred when you elect an insane, despotic reality TV star as president. Regrettably.
posted by milarepa at 5:45 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Pretty soon, people are going to start talking about how "statesmanlike" Richard Nixon was during Watergate. Seriously. He resigned before the House even voted on the articles of impeachment. Trump has made my love for GWB rise to levels I'd previously thought impossible - he's going to do the same thing for Nixon.
posted by selfmedicating at 5:48 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

People prone to worries about nuclear codes really don't need to watch Command and Control and see what the codes were set to back in the day.

hint: an asshole's luggage combination would be a big step up
posted by murphy slaw at 5:49 PM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

I don't know what to say that others haven't already said, except to emphasize that there is a point at which anecdotes like this become so common, it's easier to ask the question "who among us has not been affected by gun violence" than the converse.

Not yet, but I work in a field where people frequently get killed, so someday my turn will come.

Hodgkinson was the foster father of at least two girls. The first, Wanda Ashley Stock, 17, committed suicide in 1996 by pouring gasoline on herself and setting herself on fire after a few months of living with the Hodgkinsons.
The Hodgkinsons gave an interview to the paper after her suicide, calling her a “very practical, level-headed girl.”

Jesus H. Motherfucking Goddamned Christ.
posted by jenfullmoon at 5:51 PM on June 14, 2017 [44 favorites]

> Please do tell me more about fiscal noncompliance.

[edited slightly to strip out spoilers from what is a very enjoyable novel]:

“What I mean by a householders’ strike is you just stop paying your rents and mortgages … maybe also your student loans and insurance payments. Any private debt you’ve taken on just to make you and your family safe. The daily necessities of existence. The union is declaring all those to be odious debts, like some kind of blackmail on us, and we’re demanding they be renegotiated.

After we start this Jubilee, until there’s a restructuring that forgives a lot of our debt, we aren’t paying anything. You might think that not paying your mortgage would get you in trouble, and it’s true that if it was just you, that might happen. But when everyone does it, that makes it a strike. Civil disobedience. A revolution. So everyone needs to join in. Won’t be that hard. Just don’t pay your bills!

[..]

“I know this all might sound radical. A little extreme. But we have to do something, right? Or nothing will change. It will keep going on with them wrecking things. And this strike is the kind of revolution where they can’t shoot you down in the public square. It’s called fiscal noncompliance. It uses the power of money against money. In fact it’s a very neat trick, if you ask me.

The closest thing I've heard to anything like this in real life were some rumbles here in California of organized non-payment of federal taxes. we weren't ready for it april 15th of this year, but if the orange man and his lackeys and his puppetmasters continue on their current trajectory we may be ready for it next april.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:52 PM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

This seems horribly real, very much like the late fifties and early sixties, heavy handed, misogynistic, fatalistic, thugs, going off about how right they are. I have not had a television since 2006, so I am way behind on any similarities between that medium and real life. I tell you this is an aggravated whirlwind we have going on here, with the lobbyists coming and going with their identities protected, while they ask for big handouts, big chunks of our prosperity, security, environmental protections, life joy, potential, and our world's future. The fossil fuels industry will die, but they want us to die first, so they can live on their mildly radioactive estates, all watched over by machines of loving grace, since they are devoid of grace, personally, but need it in their lives. Even Trump said their ACHA bill was mean. That is amazing.
posted by Oyéah at 5:53 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Pretty soon, people are going to start talking about how "statesmanlike" Richard Nixon was during Watergate

There has never been anyone to match Trump for shamelessness and total narcissism. Nixon had some regard for the Office of the President, for his staff, for his family, & maybe for his country (or parts of it anyway.) Trump's only reason to care about the WH and its history and prominence and dignity is what it can do for him. If he gets ready to bail, he will shit on his administration, the GOP, the WH staff, and anything else he considers to have lead to his downfall. If he can walk away free while others go to jail he will sleep like a baby at night. If he has to sit on the sidelines and snipe at the Pence Presidency or the Ryan Presidency he won't hold back.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:55 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

>> folks i don't think it's a tv show i'm pretty sure it's real life

> That nice, clear distinction gets blurred when you elect an insane, despotic reality TV star as president. Regrettably.

Gonna push back on this. Although we're precessing through simulacra fast enough to make even Baudrillard's head spin, there is still a distinction between TV and real life. Even when manipulating the tropes of reality television becomes crucial to real-world action, we must remember that we are not the audience. we're actors, and we're writers, and we've got to devise and follow our own scripts instead of just gawking at the show.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 5:56 PM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

The WaPo Obstruction Blockbuster and the World of Hurt To Come (Josh Marshall, TPM)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:59 PM on June 14, 2017 [26 favorites]

@jenfullmoon The way that article paraphrased it, it almost looks as though they are morons or worse. Just to put the full context there:

His life was struck with tragedy in 1996. The Hodgkinsons’ foster daughter, Wanda Ashley Stock, killed herself at the age of 17 in a brutal manner: Ashley doused herself with gasoline and set herself on fire inside her car on a rural road south of Belleville.

The Hodgkinsons spoke to the News-Democrat at the time, saying they did not know what triggered a “very practical, level-headed girl” to kill herself. Later they discovered there had been a previous suicide attempt before Ashley came to live with them, and that hours before she completed her suicide, her boyfriend had broken up with her. Ashley was a senior at Belleville East High School at the time. She had only been living with the Hodgkinsons a few months, but had been a ward of the state since 1984.
posted by whorl at 6:00 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Gonna push back on this.

I'm only half serious but the fact the point can be argued or engaged in good faith discussion shows you how the clear distinction has been blurred. Erased? No, absolutely not. But there's a scary trend I see where many people ARE the audience.
posted by milarepa at 6:03 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

The Times has its version of the story: Pointing to an obstruction inquiry of President Trump, Robert Mueller is said to seek talks with 3 current or ex-intelligence officials. Mostly the same, but an interesting last paragraph:

A former senior official said Mr. Mueller’s investigation was looking at money laundering by Trump associates. The suspicion is that any cooperation with Russian officials would likely have been done in exchange for some kind of financial payoff, and there would have been an effort to hide the payoffs, most likely by routing them through offshore banking centers.

There's also an open question over all this (not in the article) as to whether Rosenstein ought to supervise Mueller given that there's a good argument that he's now a witness, if not an active participant, due to his role in Comey's firing and the prior conversations about Trump's inappropriate conversations with Comey.
posted by zachlipton at 6:10 PM on June 14, 2017 [13 favorites]

Politico: Trump huddled with donors on day of Comey testimony

On the same day last week that fired FBI Director James Comey delivered his damaging Senate testimony, President Donald Trump’s team summoned about a dozen top donors to the White House to rally support for Trump’s agenda.

The donors — including Ken Griffin, Doug DeVos, Tom Hicks, Jr., Bekah Mercer, Todd Ricketts, Tom Saunders, Paul Singer and Dick Uihlein — gathered in the Roosevelt Room on June 8 for a briefing from Trump’s legislative director Marc Short, according to a senior administration official and other people familiar with the event.

These people said that Trump himself stopped by the briefing to greet the donors, while Vice President Mike Pence, White House Chief of Staff Reince Priebus and presidential counselor Kellyanne Conway also spent time at the event.

thisisfine.gif
posted by zachlipton at 6:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

Really awful news about Rep. Scalise [link to tweet version as website is down]. Critical condition, requires additional surgeries, injuries to internal organs, severe bleeding.
posted by zachlipton at 6:25 PM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

Politico: Trump huddled with donors on day of Comey testimony

Am I alone in assuming he's starting to cadge for a legal defense fund?
posted by Fish, fish, are you doing your duty? at 6:33 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

China approves 9 Trump trademarks previously rejected

“The speed with which these appeals were decided is mind-blowing,” said Matthew Dresden, an intellectual property attorney at Harris Bricken in Seattle. “I have never seen any decisions made that quickly. That suggests special treatment. But that’s just procedural. Substantively, it’s impossible to say whether any of this is unusual.”
posted by a non mouse, a cow herd at 6:36 PM on June 14, 2017 [14 favorites]

In other news, birther is about to become a judge.
posted by _Synesthesia_ at 6:36 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

Am I alone in assuming he's starting to cadge for a legal defense fund?

Our billionaire President? But that makes no sense!
posted by Horace Rumpole at 6:37 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

That nice, clear distinction gets blurred when you elect an insane, despotic reality TV star as president. Regrettably.

Shit was already reduced to amateur hour reality TV, the thing is Trump came into the campaign as a reality TV professional. He culminated rather than initiated.

But oh yes it is a TV show - there's some reality happening in the White House, the Capitol, the Hoover Building, etc..., but you don't get to see that shit, you get to see a dramatization "based on actual events." Historical fiction for recent values of "historical." All news is fake. Even factual news. (Don't ask me, I didn't do it.)

I was discussing with a friend last month - the political topic ended with "but it's fun to watch," and shit, if this shitty, hollow, decadent empire is gonna produce a show for me as it spirals downwards, the least I can do is enjoy.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 6:38 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Our billionaire President? But that makes no sense!

It makes perfect sense. Why pay when the little guy is happy to throw himself on the proverbial tracks. Let the plebs pay for it. They're willing to open their wallets for you so long as you prop up the white male patriarch societal hegemony.
posted by Talez at 6:40 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

But Mx. Buick, I'm already not paying federal taxes (because I don't owe them, not because I'm evading them)!

I'm just going to go continue with my plan to go off grid and become a weirdo left-wing prepper.
posted by elsietheeel at 6:42 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

I always knew reality television would be the downfall of our society, but I didn't expect the causality to be quite so direct.
posted by Faint of Butt at 6:43 PM on June 14, 2017 [58 favorites]

Seth Abramson makes reference to several times when Sessions made one statement, followed later by a contradictory statement. Assuming the later statement is truthful, do people actually get charged with perjury for that? Or is that a relatively normal part of testimony?

(I know he's guilty as hell and am somewhat playing DevilsAdvocate here.)
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:45 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Re: the TV thing vs. real life thing.

I know we get in the habit of standing our ground here but do we have to argue the jokes, too? The mods have enough to do.
posted by greermahoney at 6:45 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

if we gotta pick one of the big name theorists of the 20th century for understanding this disaster, I'm gonna go with Walter Benjamin.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 6:53 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

> I was discussing with a friend last month - the political topic ended with "but it's fun to watch," and shit, if this shitty, hollow, decadent empire is gonna produce a show for me as it spirals downwards, the least I can do is enjoy.

and this is why I'm going with ol' Walter B. to understand this mess (and why I nope out of understanding this as a tv show). quote:

Mankind, which in Homer’s time was an object of contemplation for the Olympian gods, now is one for itself. Its self-alienation has reached such a degree that it can experience its own destruction as an aesthetic pleasure of the first order. This is the situation of politics which Fascism is rendering aesthetic. Communism responds by politicizing art.

posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 7:01 PM on June 14, 2017 [34 favorites]

GA-06 up to 120k ballots, but pace is definitely slackening - most frequent voters have already cast ballots, not enough infrequent to make up for it.
posted by Chrysostom at 7:05 PM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

I just listened to a podcast a few days ago about the Eric Frein trial. He shot a state trooper in the hip--the bullet went in one hip and out the other. The trooper had tremendous damage which required 17 surgeries and he was never the same afterwards. Among other things he ended up with a colostomy bag.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:07 PM on June 14, 2017

Philip Rucker, the Washington Post's White House Bureau Chief, has tweeted a list of RNC/Trump talking points for Repubs seeking to discredit tonight’s WaPo scoop on Mueller investigating Trump obstruction. Here are the main topics:

—If This Leaked Account Is True, It Means the Special Counsel Has Struck Out On Trying to Prove Collusion, and Is Shifting to Obstruction in an Effort to Save Face
—This Story Is Just Another Examples {sic} of More Illegal Leaks Coming Out of the FBI and the Investigative Process
—There Is No Case for Obstruction of Justice
—Why Is There No One Investigation {sic} the Obvious Case of Obstruction of Justice by Former Attorney General Loretta Lynch and the Clinton Campaign?

It will be instructive to see who's willing to go on record with these in defense of Trump in his current legal jeopardy.
posted by Doktor Zed at 7:09 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

Daily Beast: Even Trump’s Aides Blame Him for Obstruction Probe: ‘President Did This to Himself’

White House officials are still insisting to the president that he should leave Mueller in his post. “We are all advising him not to [get rid of] Mueller. That has not changed,” one Trump aide told The Daily Beast. “It would be an absolute nuclear explosion if he did.”
...
But some privately concede that Trump is so unpredictable—and so frustrated with the persistence of the investigation and its cost in political capital—that they’re not ruling it out. Another White House official conceded that it would be “suicide” if Trump sacked Mueller at this point, but “I’d be insincere if I said it wasn’t a concern that the president would try to do it anyway.”

For now, officials are simply concerned with limiting fallout from what is sure to be a thunderous reaction from the president to news that he is personally the target of the FBI’s probe.
Asked what the internal game plan should be, one senior Trump administration official replied,

“Keep him away from Twitter, dear God, keep him away from Twitter.”
“The president did this to himself,” the official added.
...
“Whoever leaked [news of the obstruction investigation] was obviously reading that he was thinking about giving Mueller the boot,” the official said. Trump “shot himself in the foot again with this cockamamie scheme to get Mueller to play ball.”

Sounds like things are going great over there. That last point is an interesting one, and is something I wondered when I first saw the Post story. There's a good argument we wouldn't have read this tonight if it weren't for all the talk about Trump thinking about firing Mueller.

There's a reason the Obama Administration knew what it was doing when it set up super clear rules about who was allowed to talk to the Justice Department. Trump blew all that away, and here we are.
posted by zachlipton at 7:21 PM on June 14, 2017 [42 favorites]

Trump sells Qatar $12 billion of U.S. weapons days after accusing it of funding terrorism
posted by Behemoth at 7:23 PM on June 14, 2017 [48 favorites]

And by the way that strategy -- "bring it on" -- defangs most versions of what-aboutism. It's simple: two wrongs don't make a right and of course we should look into any proven wrongdoing by anyone, but right now this is an emergency situation yo.

I've just been saying sure sounds like something the DOJ should do. Wonder why they aren't. They have the power.

Then there is some argle bargle about Mueller and I say nah Mueller has a specific assignment. They can just get someone else and give them a Lynch mandate. You should ask Sessions to do it or something.

And then it just fades out.
posted by Jalliah at 7:25 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Someone replied to the talking points tweet with what looks like a satire list of deflection points from the Watergate era and the similarities are uncanny.
posted by Tarumba at 7:27 PM on June 14, 2017 [12 favorites]

I grew up outside DC and live outside San Francisco now. I've been to that UPS location several times. It's been kind of a weird day.
It's almost as weird as when the Beltway Snipers killed a women with the same name as my mom.
posted by kirkaracha at 7:30 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

What about Chappaquiddick?
posted by kirkaracha at 7:32 PM on June 14, 2017 [17 favorites]

Also there are some obvious gaps in my knowledge of US history and I just realized Agnew was a real person and not just a character in Futurama.
posted by Tarumba at 7:32 PM on June 14, 2017 [29 favorites]

My favorite talking point:

How much longer is this investigation/fishing expedition going to go on?

I mean, we'd all like to know, right? And on a serious note, some of these things are really questions we need answers to immediately. "Did the President or members of his campaign collude with a foreign power to win the election?" is not a question that can forever be met with "that's classified; I'll tell you in closed session." We actually need an answer. Really soon.
posted by zachlipton at 7:32 PM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

Donald Trump Is Making Europe Liberal Again (charts only version)
posted by gwint at 7:33 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

> Seems like properly secured machines with paper print-out receipts would be a good solution.

Yeah - like a receipt you get at an ATM.

Like the ATMs made by ... Diebold.
posted by sebastienbailard at 7:34 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

(3) America saw its top law enforcement official act in Contempt of Congress solely to block revelation of inculpatory evidence about Trump.

Isn't it only officially Contempt of Congress if Congress says so? I'm not holding my breath about Sessions being held in contempt.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 7:50 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

In a couple of years I will watch the shit out of the Game of Thrones style series based on this dumpster fire that is sure to come.

HBO if you read this please start around the 90s and heavily focus on Trump and his mob ties and Manafort in Lebanon and Eastern Europe.
posted by Tarumba at 7:50 PM on June 14, 2017 [6 favorites]

I'd imagine Rand did it for the same reason he does everything: he's a narcissistic contrarian in love with the smell of his own farts.

...well that's not where I expected that sentence to go, but ok
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 7:52 PM on June 14, 2017 [9 favorites]

How much longer is this investigation/fishing expedition going to go on?

I figure 2 days for every 1 day that the Benghazi investigations lasted would be a place to start?
posted by Justinian at 7:52 PM on June 14, 2017 [10 favorites]

And definitely in season 3 include all the drama with white house aides begging Trump to see reason and Spicer at his desk trying to come up with responses to the press, I would like to add visuals to my schadenfreude.
posted by Tarumba at 7:58 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

White House officials are still insisting to the president that he should leave Mueller in his post. “We are all advising him not to [get rid of] Mueller. That has not changed,” one Trump aide told The Daily Beast. “It would be an absolute nuclear explosion if he did.”

Okay. I think using "Trumo fires Mueller" as shorthand in conversations like the ones we have here is fine, no problem. But I'm really not liking the press doing this. It's extremely misleading, and many, many, many people reading or hearing this will assume Trump can just fire Mueller the way they can fire their employee or phone company. Is it just me? It seems like yada yada'ing over some important steps and implications.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [8 favorites]

> This is probably the first time I've ever said this; Trump didn't screw today up. Yet.
posted by Justinian at 3:12 PM on June 14

Incredibly, hours later, this still appears to be the case. DJT tweeted again about an hour ago after the WaPo scoop about Rep. Steve Scalise's condition: "Just left hospital. Rep. Steve Scalise, one of the truly great people, is in very tough shape - but he is a real fighter. Pray for Steve!". This change is suspicious.
posted by christopherious at 8:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

WSJ: Mueller Probe Examining Whether Donald Trump Obstructed Justice

The special counsel also plans to interview Rick Ledgett, who recently retired as the deputy director of the NSA, the person added.

While Mr. Ledgett was still in office, he wrote a memo documenting a phone call that Mr. Rogers had with Mr. Trump, according to people familiar with the matter. During the call, the president questioned the veracity of the intelligence community’s judgment that Russia had interfered with the election and tried to persuade Mr. Rogers to say there was no evidence of collusion between his campaign and Russian officials, they said.

This sounds exactly like the reason Coats and Rogers refused to testify on anything Trump said to them.

Because twitter is going to twitter, you can read a good riff by Yoni Appelbaum on the history of memos in light of this: "The memorandum is how bureaucrats leverage institutional memory and power."

There's also a report that Trump brought the White House physician (to avoid confusion here, that's Dr. Ronny Jackson, who was also Obama's doctor, not the Dr. Bornstein who wrote the insane letter during the campaign) with him to the hospital. Which is a bit weird and doesn't show a ton of confidence in one of the region's leading trauma centers, I've got to say.
posted by zachlipton at 8:19 PM on June 14, 2017 [21 favorites]

Just wait until they get around to reading 28 CFR 600.8(a)(2):

This is the first time in my LIFE that I've been glad, rather than somewhere between annoyed and livid, that the Federal Fiscal Year starts on October 1.

Ex-civil servant in education. The FFY and the start of the school year are too close together. It's insanity.
posted by elsietheeel at 8:21 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

Talking points: The illegal leaks are the only crime here.

This is so stupid, and it's all they have left.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:32 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

christopherious: "Incredibly, hours later, this still appears to be the case."

Not only that, Ryan gave a nice speech. Even a stopped clock....
posted by Chrysostom at 8:41 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

What a good boy! You tweeted so well today! *Jimmy Fallon hair ruffle* You became president today, take 25!
posted by gatorae at 8:45 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Tarumba: what looks like a satire list of deflection points from the Watergate era

That's a column by the legendary Art Buchwald, a Washington, DC institution for many years. He is sorely missed.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 8:48 PM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

Great. Only took him six fucking months to not be an asshole for one whole day.
posted by Autumnheart at 8:50 PM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

Does ~~Lord Dimwit Flathead the Excessive~~DJT have a history of minimizing or avoiding negative narcissistic supply on his birthday?
posted by christopherious at 8:50 PM on June 14, 2017

Trump bringing the staff physician is probably typical for his mindset.
posted by ZeusHumms at 8:50 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

I agree about the press repeating the "Trump fires Mueller" formulation. Instead of them asking over and over "if Trump is going to fire Mueller" I want them to ask "Does Trump know he CAN'T fire Mueller?" I mean, ok yes, he's the president, he can probably exert enough pressure that it HAPPENS, but he doesn't actually have the authority to DO that.
posted by threeturtles at 8:53 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Because his doctor is the best doctor. If he wasn't the best doctor, he wouldn't be his doctor.
posted by Joey Michaels at 8:53 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

(WaPo) The Justice Department has long held that it would not be appropriate to indict a sitting president.

thus the phrase 'unindicted co-conspirator'.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 8:55 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

@WestWingReport: White House staff can't even get its story straight on a brief trip to hospital

Spicer says Trump met with Scalise, unnamed official says he never entered the room. JFC.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 8:58 PM on June 14, 2017 [27 favorites]

But Trump could fire Mueller. As Katyal explains:

First, most simply, Trump could order Mueller fired. Our Constitution gives the president the full prosecution power in Article II; accordingly, any federal prosecutor works ultimately for the president. That constitutional reality is not something we could write around with a regulation. Instead, we opted to try to focus accountability for any such activity. The regulations provide that Mueller can “be disciplined or removed from office only by the personal action of the Attorney General” (again, Rosenstein here, because Sessions is recused) and only for “good cause.” The president, therefore, would have to direct Rosenstein to fire Mueller — or, somewhat more extravagantly, Trump could order the special-counsel regulations repealed and then fire Mueller himself. Either of those actions was unthinkable to us back in 1999, for we understood that President Richard Nixon’s attempt in this regard ultimately led to his downfall. At the same time, after Trump’s firing of FBI Director James B. Comey this month, many things once thought beyond the realm of possibility look less so now.

He should not do so. There's a good argument that it could, depending on who you ask, constitute obstruction of justice for him to do so. It would certainly be extremely Nixonian for him to do so. But he could do it.
posted by zachlipton at 9:00 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

Mueller Seeks to Talk to Intelligence Officials, Hinting at Inquiry of Trump

While Mueller going after Dan Coats, the director of national intelligence; Adm. Michael S. Rogers, the head of the National Security Agency; and Richard Ledgett, the former N.S.A. deputy director, is interesting, it's the paragraph at the end I find the most intriguing: "A former senior official said Mr. Mueller’s investigation was looking at money laundering by Trump associates. The suspicion is that any cooperation with Russian officials would most likely have been in exchange for some kind of financial payoff, and that there would have been an effort to hide the payments, probably by routing them through offshore banking centers."
posted by Doktor Zed at 9:19 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

This is a long and interesting breakdown of Trump voters: The Five Types of Trump Voters: Who They Are and What They Believe by Emily Ekins of the Democracy Fund.

Key Findings:

This analysis finds five unique clusters of Trump voters: American Preservationists (20%), Staunch Conservatives (31%), Anti-Elites (19%), Free Marketeers (25%), and the Disengaged (5%)

There is no such thing as “one kind of Trump voter” who voted for him for one single reason. Many voted with enthusiasm for Trump while others held their noses and voted against Hillary Clinton.

Trump voters hold very different views on a wide variety of issues including immigration, race, American identity, moral traditionalism, trade, and economics.

Four issues distinguish Trump voters from non-Trump voters: attitudes toward Hillary Clinton, evaluations of the economy, views about illegal immigration, and views about and Muslim immigration.

She's not kidding about the "very different views". For instance, half of Trump voters favor raising taxes on the wealthy by a 3:1 margin, while the other half oppose it by a 3:1 margin.
posted by galaxy rise at 9:26 PM on June 14, 2017 [54 favorites]

A little from column A, a little from column B.
posted by Chrysostom at 9:30 PM on June 14, 2017 [2 favorites]

Jeff Sessions is hiding something.
posted by Oyéah at 9:47 PM on June 14, 2017 [15 favorites]

Meeting in Phoenix this week, Southern Baptists voted Tuesday to condemn gambling and Planned Parenthood, and they adopted a statement on the importance of public officials who display “consistent moral character.” That resolution also commended “those leaders who choose not to meet privately with members of the opposite sex who are not their spouse,” referring to Vice President Pence [and Osama bin Laden]
posted by XMLicious at 9:50 PM on June 14, 2017 [11 favorites]

As Sessions just demonstrated, yes, you totally get to do that.

And if it comes down to it, the fallback for white people:
"I didn't know you weren't supposed to do that."
posted by Meatbomb at 10:04 PM on June 14, 2017 [5 favorites]

biogeo: I don't know what to say that others haven't already said, except to emphasize that there is a point at which anecdotes like this become so common, it's easier to ask the question "who among us has not been affected by gun violence" than the converse

Turns out it's easier still to ask 'how many victims of gun violence do you know?'

What's your Number?
posted by carsonb at 10:12 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

Turns out it's easier still to ask 'how many victims of gun violence do you know?'

Unfortunately, it's did you know.

Too many.
posted by Candleman at 10:22 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

We need an estimate of how many victims of gun violence the Congressional victims of gun violence will be kicking off of health insurance if they enact the AHCA.

Maybe from a more positive angle, a bill should be put forward to guarantee all of the victims of Wednesday's attack health insurance in perpetuity, to make the same point.
posted by XMLicious at 10:32 PM on June 14, 2017

This is a long and interesting breakdown of Trump voters: The Five Types of Trump Voters: Who They Are and What They Believe by Emily Ekins of the Democracy Fund.

It is long and it is interesting, but I'm not certain it's any different from what we knew already. TLDR: it's the racism, but there are also those who will always vote R and those who will never vote D.
posted by mumimor at 10:34 PM on June 14, 2017 [7 favorites]

I don't know any victims of gun violence except, perhaps, friends and relatives from the USA.
posted by Joe in Australia at 10:41 PM on June 14, 2017 [3 favorites]

Me either, and I live here. There is far too much gun violence in the United States, but it is not distributed evenly. Most people won't be affected directly by it (we are all affected indirectly) while some people will have their lives saturated with it.
posted by Justinian at 10:47 PM on June 14, 2017 [28 favorites]

Australian prime minister Malcolm Turnbull impersonates Donald Trump in leaked audio.

In leaked audio, Mr Turnbull is heard making fun of his meeting with the president in New York last month.
"It was beautiful. It was the most beautiful putting-me-at-ease ever," he jokes.
He even does a Donald Trump impersonation.
"The Donald and I, we are winning and winning in the polls. We are winning so much, we are winning, we are winning like we have never won before," he says.
posted by moody cow at 10:57 PM on June 14, 2017 [38 favorites]

A little from column A, a little from column B.

So racism and misogynism, then.
posted by porpoise at 11:13 PM on June 14, 2017 [4 favorites]

I don't know any victims of gun violence except, perhaps, friends and relatives from the USA.

Not counting the numerous veterans I know?
I had a classmate shot in the chest by her brother while they were playing with a gun when I was in 2nd grade. (She lived.) This was the early '80s in Phoenix, AZ.
I moved to Glendale, CA for junior high & high school. During my sophomore year I think (1991), we had our first student shot in a drive-by. Off campus, didn't know him personally, but it's perspective. We also had at least one stabbing on campus every year, and overall I went to a pretty nice, safe high school.
My best friend & another buddy of his were sitting in his car at a Tommy's drive-in in Burbank, CA when a gang shootout erupted around them. Early/mid-'90s. They both got out okay, so I'm not sure if that qualifies them as "victims," but it was scary as shit for both.
I got my high school teaching certification in 2003. Within four months, I had a kid limp into class one morning. He'd been shot at a picnic that weekend. Long Beach, CA.
In 2008, teaching in Seattle, WA, I had a student whose house had been shot up in a drive-by. This was after her brother had been shot trying to break up a fight at a bus stop.

I could doubtlessly come up with several more examples if I sat here and really combed through my memories. Although to be honest, having taught in public schools for 12+ years seems to give me a distinct advantage (if you can call it that) in the "How many people do you know who are victims of gun violence?" question, and that's a truly sad statement.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:22 PM on June 14, 2017 [19 favorites]

How are we defining gun violence? Does it include accidents? Military operations? Death from depression by suicide? Not trying to nitpick or anything; honest question.

Wikipedia: Gun related violence is violence committed with the use of a gun (firearm or small arm). Gun related violence may or may not be considered criminal. Criminal, includes homicide (except when and where ruled justifiable), assault with a deadly weapon, and suicide, or attempted suicide, depending on jurisdiction. Non-criminal violence may include accidental or unintentional injury and death. Included in this subject are statistics regarding military or para-military activities, as well as the actions of civilians.
posted by elsietheeel at 11:44 PM on June 14, 2017 [1 favorite]

homicide ..., assault with a deadly weapon, and suicide, or attempted suicide, depending on jurisdiction. Non-criminal violence may include accidental or unintentional injury and death.

I'd say yeah, all those things.

2 - a suicide and a drive-by
posted by carsonb at 12:05 AM on June 15, 2017

I've known three people who were killed by guns. Two were murdered by (different) spree killers, and the other was killed when some people he was with got into a shoot-out with the cops. Another person I know was wounded (but not killed) by one of the spree killers.

Also worth mentioning is the fact that, on New Year's Eve in about 1998, my parents' neighbors had some friends in, got drunk, and somehow, everyone ended up shot to death. I don't remember how many people were involved. I think it was more than three and less than eight. I didn't know any of them, though.
posted by palmcorder_yajna at 12:38 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

he actually can directly fire Mueller, by unilaterally repealing the special counsel regulation. so he does that. what comes next?

As folks have noted several times, there's a solid article that Trump can not be indicted while sitting president, only impeached.

But firing Mueller might be so crazy that some Republicans finally jump ship. Dems don't need a huge number -- it's 50% plus one, so a small minority of Republican House members would be enough. That's why his own aides call it "suicidal."
posted by msalt at 12:44 AM on June 15, 2017

Turns out it's easier still to ask 'how many victims of gun violence do you know?'

Well, the actual question they asked was "how many people do you know who have been shot."

This seems like too simplistic an approach to me, because it doesn't count threats or stupid accidents that did not result in a shooting (but which are definitely a part of our gun culture and easily contribute to accidental shootings).

Bearing that in mind, and this is just off the top (and not counting incidents by veterans in their role as active duty):

Two suicides in the family.
Have had guns pointed at me twice (once with criminal intent, once by -very stupid- friend)
Younger brother's been mugged at gunpoint, not shot.
At least two classmates from school dead (that I know of, others that I lost track of possible)
One former family friend murdered
At least one family friend seriously shot in a barroom brawl (he survived)

Mind you, this is over just my years of personal experience, including some stories of incidents I'm too young to personally remember, but affected the family.

So the question of "how is this affecting the culture," again, just from one person's experience, feels like the answer is "rather a lot" from my perspective. I do not personally own (or wish to own) any guns, though there has been gun ownership in the family for most of my life.
posted by Archelaus at 1:04 AM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Yeah I was going to say if you include self-inflicted gun violence people's numbers are going to go way up. A large number of gun deaths are suicides.

Not counting people I knew only in a professional capacity (i.e. my clients who were living in poverty and/or with mental illness) I think the number is two. My brother was held up with a gun at an ATM and I knew someone who was shot through her apartment wall by a neighbor with PTSD.

Oh and there was the time I was nearly accidentally shot by my father who thought I was an intruder and really I just forgot something and came back to get it.
posted by threeturtles at 1:25 AM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

But Trump could fire Mueller. As Katyal explains:
The regulations provide that Mueller can “be disciplined or removed from office only by the personal action of the Attorney General” (again, Rosenstein here, because Sessions is recused) and only for “good cause.” The president, therefore, would have to direct Rosenstein to fire Mueller — or, somewhat more extravagantly, Trump could order the special-counsel regulations repealed and then fire Mueller himself. Either of those actions was unthinkable to us back in 1999,

No, this illustrates my point. It takes a full paragraph to explain how Trump could manipulate the systetm until he either found someone to do the job or took extraordinary measures by changing regulation. That's a very different message to send to readers and viewers than the image of Trumo telling Mueller, "You're fired!" like Mueller was a contestant on Trumps TV show and the next day *poof* it's over.

I think the press has a duty to be way more accurate and explain how extraordinary the situation would be. It's a bit like the Rs saying people with pre-exisiting conditions will still have access to health care. They're not wrong, Walter.
posted by Room 641-A at 3:41 AM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

Trump warned (campaign video clip) of a "constitutional crisis" if Hillary was elected because she would be under an investigation for many years that would conclude in a criminal trial, and that it would make it "impossible to govern."

Trump's Mirror, guys. He TOLD us this was going to happen.

Which is one reason why he was elected. Remember that, according to the Republican mantra, a paralyzed federal government is a VERY GOOD thing because Government Is Always The Problem and it gives more leeway for the locals to run everything Their Way. Trump is both a by-product and a pure representation of Reaganism.
posted by delfin at 3:41 AM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Not denying it.

@realDonaldTrump:
They made up a phony collusion with the Russians story, found zero proof, so now they go for obstruction of justice on the phony story. Nice
posted by chris24 at 4:06 AM on June 15, 2017 [16 favorites]

His carefully honed and sophisticated sarcasm will be his undoing.
posted by Namlit at 4:16 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

@realDonaldTrump:
They made up a phony collusion with the Russians story, found zero proof, so now they go for obstruction of justice on the phony story. Nice

...and Robert Muller just called down to IT to replace the monitor drenched in coffee due to the involuntary laughter...
posted by mikelieman at 4:19 AM on June 15, 2017 [14 favorites]

Why do they keep shouting there is zero proof when three of his advisers had to resign over funny smelling Russian links and his AG perjured himself covering up the fact that he met with Russian spies. Not to mention his own son boasting that Russians just keep buying his property.

At some point they'll return to the question, "The WH knew as soon as Yates told them that Flynn was compromised. Given the National Security implications what POSSIBLE REASON could DJT offer for taking 18 days to fire him?"
posted by mikelieman at 4:21 AM on June 15, 2017 [45 favorites]

The funny thing is that even if the whole Russian collusion thing proves to be utterly insubstantial, the subsequent stuff he did to discourage the investigation still stands. Now there's a plate of beans to ponder, Donny "Sad" Tantrump.
posted by Namlit at 4:27 AM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

There was actually one thing that was surprising about that survey of Trump voters, and that was that even the most educated, literate, news-following, well earning and not racist Trump-voters (Free Marketeers, 25%) tend to get their news from Fox News. So it'll still take a while before they realize that something really, really bad is going on.
posted by mumimor at 4:39 AM on June 15, 2017 [18 favorites]

In the alternate universe where justice actually prevails, prison officials have all of Trump's tweets painted onto the walls of his cell.
posted by Rykey at 4:51 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

On second thought, no way does he deserve a cell that big.
posted by Rykey at 4:55 AM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

@ZeddRebel
So is there an appropriate time to mention a Congressman who once called himself 'David Duke without the baggage' was saved by 2 black cops

---

And with gun violence, Megyn Kelly and Sandy Hook in the news, last year I had the honor of photographing saxophonist Jimmy Greene, who was nominated for two Grammy's for his jazz album Beautiful Life, an album that was dedicated to his daughter Ana who was killed at Sandy Hook. His wife called out Megyn Kelly earlier this week.

@Nelba_MG
Here you go @megynkelly - her name is Ana Grace Márquez-Greene. Say her name- stare at this & tell me it's worth it. @nbc #SandyHook [pic of Ana]
posted by chris24 at 4:57 AM on June 15, 2017 [57 favorites]

OH, NOW HE WANTS TO FIGHT.

@realdonaldtrump: You are witnessing the single greatest WITCH HUNT in American political history - led by some very bad and conflicted people! #MAGA

Is Robert Mueller "bad and conflicted"? Is he going to fire him today?
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 5:09 AM on June 15, 2017 [28 favorites]

And still, a stunning lack of concern over Russian interference and infiltration into his operation. To the point that the Senate almost unanimously agreed that someone had to step up because our leader clearly isn't concerned. Really, just stunning.
posted by Dashy at 5:11 AM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

Two black cops, one of whom is a woman who has a wife and the other of whom is described by friends as being proud of his Brazilian and Jamaican heritage.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 5:12 AM on June 15, 2017 [49 favorites]

[They] tend to get their news from Fox News. So it'll still take a while before they realize that something really, really bad is going on.

Yeah, you should have seen my face listening to my father praising Session's performance Tuesday.
posted by slipthought at 5:12 AM on June 15, 2017

Mike Lee says no evidence of Trump obstruction, wrongdoing, time to move on

Funny, I don't remember Mike Lee being appointed Special Counsel...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:13 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Well, somebody has connected all the dots - or the dotted lines, whatever...
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:23 AM on June 15, 2017 [18 favorites]

"And bear in mind, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, that my client has never been convicted of the bank robbery for which he now stands trial."
posted by Rykey at 5:25 AM on June 15, 2017 [20 favorites]

Well this is ̶c̶o̶n̶c̶e̶r̶n̶i̶n̶g̶ terrifying:

PBS Runs A Three-Hour Series Glorifying The DeVos Education Agenda
posted by Twain Device at 5:28 AM on June 15, 2017 [20 favorites]

@realDonaldTrump: They made up a phony collusion with the Russians story, found zero proof, so now they go for obstruction of justice on the phony story. Nice

@jk_rowling
.@StephenKing On a sliding scale of Annie Wilkes to Cujo, what level of delusion do you reckon we're at today?

---

What a time to be alive.
posted by chris24 at 5:29 AM on June 15, 2017 [69 favorites]

@jk_rowling
.@StephenKing On a sliding scale of Annie Wilkes to Cujo, what level of delusion do you reckon we're at today?

I'm so shipping this.
posted by Twain Device at 5:31 AM on June 15, 2017 [32 favorites]

But firing Mueller might be so crazy that some Republicans finally jump ship. Dems don't need a huge number -- it's 50% plus one, so a small minority of Republican House members would be enough. That's why his own aides call it "suicidal."

The discharge motion shitfight is going to be an epic one for the ages.
posted by Talez at 5:45 AM on June 15, 2017

Greg Stillson in dog form with rabies
posted by angrycat at 5:45 AM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

Regarding the voting systems in Georgia, Arstechnica has this article up: Georgia’s lax voting security exposed just in time for crucial special election.
posted by michswiss at 5:46 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

PBS Runs A Three-Hour Series Glorifying The DeVos Education Agenda

It's been running since April on my local PBS station. The host Andrew J. Coulson was the education guy at the Cato Institute before passing away from brain cancer in February last year, so it doesn't appear to have been coordinated with DeVos becoming Secretary of Education. Though they obviously lived in the same neighborhood of crazytown.
posted by XMLicious at 5:51 AM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

Think you're safe from Trumpcare because you're on an employer plan?

Trumpcare will impose lifetime/annual limits on 20-27 million in employer plans nationwide.
posted by chris24 at 5:56 AM on June 15, 2017 [56 favorites]

“PBS Runs A Three-Hour Series Glorifying The DeVos Education Agenda”

Seems like a good thing to run during pledge drives.
posted by ZeusHumms at 6:04 AM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

While Republican support of Trump is still around 80% (though there's hints the number is being propped up because some people no longer identify as Rs), this new poll from Gallup shows cracks in the facade.

Seventeen-Point Drop in US Satisfaction Among Republicans

Republicans' satisfaction with the way things are going in the U.S. took a hit since last month. Forty-one percent of Republicans say they are satisfied with the way things are going in the U.S., down 17 percentage points since May. At the same time, satisfaction among Democrats and independents has remained low.

posted by chris24 at 6:15 AM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

James Hohmann with Breanne Deppisch and Joanie Greve/WaPo: The Daily 202: Jeff Sessions’s grilling highlights tension between chumminess of Senate, seriousness of Russia probe

THE BIG IDEA: It is widely presumed on Capitol Hill that Jeff Sessions chose to testify before the Senate Intelligence committee, rather than the committees that have jurisdiction over his department, because he has more friends there who would run interference on his behalf. If that was indeed the attorney general’s strategy, [Tuesday's] hearing validated it.

It's not the first time that the Senate hasn't been unanimously behind one of its own, but these moments are not as rare as they used to be.

The New York Times’s Frank Bruni, widening the aperture in his column, calls Sessions “a flustered Gump in the headlights”: “The appearance … didn’t bring us much closer to understanding what did or didn’t happen … But as I watched him … I saw a broader story, a dark parable of bets misplaced and souls under siege. This is what happens when you draw too close to Trump. You’re diminished at best, mortified at worst. You’ve either done work dirtier than you meant to or told fibs bigger than you ought to or been sullied by contact or been thrown to the wolves. … For all Trump’s career and all his campaign, he played the part of Midas, claiming that everything he touched turned to gold. That was never true. This is: Almost everyone who touches him is tarnished, whether testifying or not.”

Emphasis and pull quotes are from the column(s).
posted by ZeusHumms at 6:16 AM on June 15, 2017 [35 favorites]

The National Conference of State Legislatures has a book (free online now) called Inside the Legislative Process that details the various procedures of state legislatures and the typical steps to getting a law enacted at the state level. For example, here's [pdf] the chapter on legislative leaders. I reference this book for work sometimes and thought it might be useful to folks here in your state and local organizing activities. Note that some of the sections haven't been updated since the 90s (neither have many of the referenced legislative processes). In any case, you'll want to verify the info for your particular state, but this can give you a starting point and vocabulary to use.
posted by melissasaurus at 6:24 AM on June 15, 2017 [16 favorites]

White House Correspondont for McClatchy @Anita Kumar .@POTUS celebrated his 71st birthday with a dinner at the White House with sons Eric, Donald Jr., daughter Ivanka, Jared Kushner, and kids.

Which has left people wondering about Melania, Barron, and Tiffany.

Chris24: @ZeddRebel
So is there an appropriate time to mention a Congressman who once called himself 'David Duke without the baggage' was saved by 2 black cops

I would add that David Dukes himself tweeted: Our prayers to Steve Scalise & family. The media poured vicious hatred on Steve for simply being at my meeting defending White civil rights.

"For simply being at my meeting defending white civil rights" is a hell of a statement. Racism has caused so much pain and damage to this country but by all means go on defending it so we know who you are.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:26 AM on June 15, 2017 [69 favorites]

ETA you can always tell by the guys who wear aviator shades indoors.

Firstest of first world problems but, what the hell: As a all-waking-hours-of-the-day wearer of prescription glasses who, for the first time in a long time, is blessed enough to finally have the luxury of owning a pair of prescription sunglasses and sometimes forgets his non-tinted glasses at home and feels stupid enough already when I have to continue rocking my aviators (because the FL sun is no joke) inside the library's kid section while managing our 9 month old and herding our 3 year old... I resent this remark.
posted by RolandOfEld at 6:28 AM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

Putin offers Comey political asylum (real)

I mean his country may be in an economic and demographic death spiral but at least he seems to be having a good time which is what really matters.

Maybe there is someone else who would benefit from his offer of asylum?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:31 AM on June 15, 2017 [28 favorites]

Four issues distinguish Trump voters from non-Trump voters: attitudes toward Hillary Clinton, evaluations of the economy, views about illegal immigration, and views about and Muslim immigration.

Two of the four are immigration-related. I've mentioned this This American Life Episode before, but in light of that report it seems worth linking took again.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 6:33 AM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

Two of the four are immigration-related.

And one other is typically blamed on immigration (incorrectly, but attention to facts and stats is not their strong suit)
posted by Twain Device at 6:34 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Also Nigel Farage, twit extraordinaire, sent a Birthday tweet with a picture of himself holding up a bottle of Trump wine.

And there is good news for those who love their doggos: @Alexandria Police: UPDATE: You may have heard abt Daphne, who ran from Alexandria shooting scene & was lost yesterday. She was FOUND early this morning.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:35 AM on June 15, 2017 [29 favorites]

Maybe there is someone else who would benefit from his offer of asylum?

Well, if you believe in the power of Trump's Mirror, Nostradumbass has already predicted he'll end up in Russia.

2013.

@realDonaldTrump
Snowden, if you’re such a hero then come back home and face justice. In reality, you are just another wiseguy traitor.

2014

@realDonaldTrump
Remember, Russia still has Snowden. When are we going to bring that piece of human garbage back home to stand trial? He caused great damage!

2014

@realDonaldTrump
Snowden is a traitor and a disgrace. Make no mistake, he is no hero. In fact he is a coward who should come back & face justice.
posted by chris24 at 6:37 AM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Which has left people wondering about Melania, Barron, and Tiffany.

Melania and Barron live with him, so it's maybe just assumed. And he doesn't know Tiffany exists.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:40 AM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

and a former mayor of the town even worried about him enough that he offered him a damn job rather than a ride in a squad car to the city limits. Whiteness ftw.

I hadn't heard about this, but while it clearly went astray, in this instance, I don't think the problem is people acting so charitable towards white people, instead I see the problem being that people don't tend to act just as charitable towards all people.
posted by bootlegpop at 6:46 AM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Qatar Buys U.S. F-15s Days After Trump Says Country Funds Terror:

Qatar said Wednesday it has signed a $12 billion deal to buy F-15 fighter jets from the United States — just days after President Donald Trump accused the country of being a "high-level" sponsor of terrorism.

The announcement came after the country's defense minister met with Defense Secretary Jim Mattis in Washington.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:46 AM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

I'm torn between wanting to laugh with glee at Putin's antics and wanting to tear Putin's head off and insert it somewhere else on his body. And I know I have two homunculi on my shoulders, one a cartoon devil, and one an angel. Which one is telling me which thing? I'm confused and titllated, in a creepy way. The whole of this, since last fall, has felt like watching porn.
posted by Don Pepino at 6:47 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

In reality, you are just another wiseguy traitor.

Wiseguys, Ryan's "we're family here" omerta transcript, developing Roman-style patron-client relationships, telling Comey "we had that thing." Cosa Nostra literally means "our thing."

Trump is a mob boss and the GOP leadership are his underboss, capo, consigliere etc. He had better watch out for his Barzini and his Fredo.
posted by Rust Moranis at 6:47 AM on June 15, 2017 [33 favorites]

Yeah, "wiseguy" really stands out.
posted by Don Pepino at 6:48 AM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Qatar said Wednesday it has signed a $12 billion deal to buy F-15 fighter jets from the United States — just days after President Donald Trump accused the country of being a "high-level" sponsor of terrorism.

Well that's $12 billion less dollars they'll have to fund terrorism. Checkmate libtards!
posted by PenDevil at 6:52 AM on June 15, 2017 [13 favorites]

‘They tried to make money off it’: Colorado GOP leader busted for fundraising off of baseball shooting: The blog Colorado Pols reported on Wednesday that Neville sent out a fundraising letter on behalf of Colorado Liberty PAC asking to donors to contribute to combat the “hate-inspired violent rhetoric against conservatives and Republicans.”

“The left is out of control,” Neville told donors. “Their violent actions are un-American, and it needs to stop!”

“Finally, if you can, please show us that you’re not backing down by chipping-in $50 or $25 to Colorado Liberty PAC today so we can retake the State House in 2018,” the lawmaker wrote. “Your contribution today will help us advance our conservative values through passionate and peaceful civil discourse that makes our country great.”
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:56 AM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

The Hill: GOP rep: Trump partially to blame for hostility that led to lawmaker shooting

(The GOP Rep in question is Mark Sanford, who, since returning from "The Appalachian Trail" seems to have many fewer fucks.)
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:56 AM on June 15, 2017 [81 favorites]

Sanford always struck me as a creep and a liar, but never as unintelligent. The only part he got wrong was the suggestion for "heavy soul-searching", as anyone who's been with Trump this long either never had one or sold it for a few pieces of silver.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:03 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

Two of the four are immigration-related.

And one other is typically blamed on immigration (incorrectly, but attention to facts and stats is not their strong suit)

Many Trump voters liked Hillary plenty when she was running against Obama, it was when she learnt from her failure and created a progressive rainbow coalition they suddenly began listening to the hate-talk. (it says in the article)
posted by mumimor at 7:05 AM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Greg Stillson in dog form with rabies

Is this the new "Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra"?
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 7:12 AM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

No. Not at all. And I am saying that the fact that he likely wouldn't have been is the problem.
posted by bootlegpop at 7:14 AM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

The Hill: GOP rep: Trump partially to blame for hostility that led to lawmaker shooting

I mean, that's blatantly true, but it's weird not seeing these fuckers not marching in lockstep under the "nothing is wrong" banner.
posted by Artw at 7:15 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

The GOP Rep in question is Mark Sanford, who, since returning from "The Appalachian Trail" seems to have many fewer fucks.

I don't agree with him on policy, but I can see why constituents reelected him. He may have screwed up in his personal life, and lied about it, but there's this strange authenticity to him.

Read this: "I'm a Dead Man Walking"

I ask Sanford, in our early February interview, whether it’s fair to say Trump doesn’t impress him. “Yeah, that's accurate,” he tells me. “Because at some level he represents the antithesis, or the undoing, of everything I thought I knew about politics, preparation and life.”

Sanford, an Eagle Scout, has long been renowned for a work ethic that straddles the line between tireless and maniacal. Famously brutal on staff members—his former speechwriter wrote a book documenting his workplace misery—Sanford recalls holding marathon meetings as a congressman and as governor to review every intricate detail of budgets, bills and other proposals that came across his desk.

“And all of a sudden a guy comes along where facts don’t matter?” Sanford asks aloud. “It’s somewhat befuddling. It’s the undoing of that which you base a large part of your life on.”
posted by leotrotsky at 7:16 AM on June 15, 2017 [34 favorites]

I mean, that's blatantly true, but it's weird not seeing these fuckers not marching in lockstep under the "nothing is wrong" banner.

Agreed. I'd like to think that if Ossoff pulls it off next week, self-preservation will cause a mini-outbreak of sanity among Rs, but who knows.
posted by chris24 at 7:20 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

But then the problem is not simply a surfeit of charity towards nonwhite people. It's discrimination straight up.

The ideal situation would be charitability towards all. Taking away the charitability offered towards one group of people would take us further away from that goal. A more ideal world would be the world where said mayor would be charitable towards anyone that he found in that situation.

Furthermore, I find the notion that a "ride in a squad car to the city limits" would be appropriate in any instance disturbing.
posted by bootlegpop at 7:22 AM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

(The GOP Rep in question is Mark Sanford, who, since returning from "The Appalachian Trail" seems to have many fewer fucks.)

Trump has personally threatened to support a primary opponent against Sanford by name, too.
posted by Etrigan at 7:29 AM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Not that it necessarily means anything but Bill Euille, former mayor of Alexandria, Virginia, is not white.
posted by XMLicious at 7:32 AM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

Trump has personally threatened to support a primary opponent against Sanford by name, too.

Dude, his constituents elected him after the AT debacle. What exactly do you think you're gonna do to knock him out? Stop making stupid threats.

Actually no, please keep doing that to demonstrate your impotence. You do you, Donny.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:38 AM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Now I understand why "hiking the Appalachian trail" was his go to euphemism for sex.

Any former scout knows it's all about Philmont.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:41 AM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

That Josh Marshall "World of Hurt" article makes me so happy. I don't think Trump can derail Mueller's investigation. And I don't think he can survive that investigation.

This leaves me feeling optimistic, which can't be right, so I'm sure I'm missing something.
posted by diogenes at 7:42 AM on June 15, 2017 [32 favorites]

So you're saying the former mayor, now proven to be a charitable guy with white mass killers, would have been equally charitable had Hodgkinson been a black guy on that bench watching the field with a duffel bag full of guns and a laptop for weeks on end?

I am not in any way going to dispute the point that the pattern of racist discrimination in the treatment of disturbed or unusual-seeming individuals is real and probably played a factor in this case. But the real world is complex, and speaking as a native son of Alexandria I think this is less clear than you're suggesting.

I didn't see the report about the former mayor offering the shooter a job, but in Alexandria, "former mayor" means almost certainly Bill Euille, Kerry Donley, or Patsy Ticer, and in this case I'm inclined to think Bill Euille is more likely. Bill Euille was the first Black mayor of Alexandria. He graduated from T.C. Williams High School in 1968, a couple of years before the other public high schools in the city, which while nominally integrated were practically still segregated, were closed, leading to the events portrayed in the movie "Remember the Titans." Euille's politics are consequently pretty conscious of racial discrimination, and I have to say I think he would have been at least as likely to offer a job to a person of color who seemed to be having a rough time. I can't say I have as much insight into Kerry Donley's background or politics, but he was known as a pretty liberal mayor. Maybe he would have been less likely to offer a job to a person of color, I don't know. Patsy Ticer is pretty old at this point and I'm not sure she gets out as much as she used to.

Also, regarding the neighborhood itself, while it is now a pretty heavily white, upper-middle-class neighborhood, when I was growing up there this was not the case; it was much more racially and socioeconomically diverse. There are some echoes of this history in the neighborhood, including a number of local "characters," of various races, who have clear problems with mental illness and/or substance abuse, who despite being in and out of jail, do odd jobs for many people in the neighborhood. While Hodgkinson would certainly stick out as unusual (and obviously did), he also wouldn't necessarily be outside the realm of daily life, and I wouldn't be too shocked that one of the neighborhoods kinder residents would have offered him a chance to earn some money doing some yard work or something, if that's the way it happened.

Alexandria, and Del Ray, are by no means utopias of racial equality, not by a long shot, and I'm certain Hodgkinson was treated differently (better) as a white man than he would have been as a black man. I'm just saying the difference in this particular case is probably less stark than you're suggesting.

On preview, tl;dr, what XMLicious said.
posted by biogeo at 7:48 AM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

My hunch now is that congressional Republicans are going to remain in lockstep support of Trump sticking around and not being impeached... right up until the moment Mueller recommends charges. Never forget: elected Republicans despise Donald Trump with the burning plasmic fury of ten-thousand suns. They just need an excuse to grasp on to before they can have him replaced by Pence. Felony charges, along with sub-35% approval ratings, would be a damn good excuse, and only those representing less-far-right constituencies need to come along for the ride.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:52 AM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

They just need to reverse the entire 20th century before Trump is kicked out of office, which they are trying to do in the equivalent of a really long weekend behind closed doors.
posted by maxsparber at 7:54 AM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

Mike Pence: "I can sign things too! I brought my own pen! You can call me Mike Pens!"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:55 AM on June 15, 2017 [47 favorites]

Bootlegpop, do you live in the US?

I do, and since I see this as one of the main divides of the left, my reply will be somewhat broader than just what we have already covered in this exchange.

I feel that some in the left want to rescind privileges held by anyone who has or who is perceived as having some form of privilege, and then when we all lack the privilege that some now hold, work from there to decide what privileges everyone should have. (I only tack on the bit about deciding what privileges we all should have because that is my assumption. That later point doesn't seem to be the focus when things come up that often, but I assume that the goal is a better future for everyone because that is how leftists tend to be. It may be the case that other people hearing this group of leftists speak do not see beyond the initial stripping and thus have an inordinately negative view of those leftists.)

Other leftists, like myself, feel that only the privileges that are predicated upon holding others down should be stripped. Regarding the others, we feel that it would be more just to elevate people in the group lacking privilege to the same level as those with it.

Additionally, I see this as both an easier task and an easier sell. In general, in many cases throughout history in both the US and elsewhere, rights have often been advanced by being extended to the out group. Many people will still resent this, but I think it is a much easier sell than telling people that they should have something taken from them. Plus, it is generally easier to extend a privilege that some have than it is to grant a completely new privilege towards everyone.

--------

Whether it does or does not transpire, and whether or not it does so on a de facto basis or otherwise, I think that it is horrible that we would respond to vagrancy and or mental illness by forcing people to move on to where they can be someone else's problem. We need to rebuild our safety net and come up with something better for everyone.

---------

Finding out that the former mayor in question is not white makes me feel somewhat bad for automatically agreeing that he was probably offering more charity towards an old white guy than he would have to someone else. Unfortunately, the world, and more specifically, the US, is ugly enough that most things that seem like they would be racist will turn out to be racist. It is very hard not to imagine the worst because, in many or most cases, the worst will turn out to be the case.
posted by bootlegpop at 7:56 AM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

I feel that some in the left want to rescind privileges held by anyone who has or who is perceived as having some form of privilege, and then when we all lack the privilege that some now hold, work from there to decide what privileges everyone should have.

Well if we'd ever had a discussion about privilege and you hadn't made that clear, we'd have spent the whole time talking at cross-purposes, because to me, and I'm confident I'm not alone in this, privilege is by its definition something that is held by some and not others. If everyone has it, it isn't a privilege.
posted by solotoro at 8:02 AM on June 15, 2017 [26 favorites]

The Hill: Republicans' satisfaction with the direction of the United States took its largest dive since President Trump took office between May and June, according to a Gallup poll out Thursday.

That satisfaction rate fell from 58 percent in May to 41 percent in June, according to the survey — a 17 point drop.

Overall is 24 percent. Seems like dangerous territory for a politician facing a felony investigation!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:07 AM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Well if we'd ever had a discussion about privilege and you hadn't made that clear, we'd have spent the whole time talking at cross-purposes, because to me, and I'm confident I'm not alone in this, privilege is by its definition something that is held by some and not others. If everyone has it, it isn't a privilege.

Understood. Yes. The terminology would change when the privilege is extended. What are privileges for some should become rights for all.

Thanks. You've given me a way to explain my broader position more effectively.

In general, I consider most privileges only extended towards some to be rights that are denied to the rest.
posted by bootlegpop at 8:08 AM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

Overall is 24 percent. Seems like dangerous territory for a politician facing a felony investigation!

He won with 25% of the total (elegible) electorate so I'm not too convinced.
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:09 AM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

My hunch now is that congressional Republicans are going to remain in lockstep support of Trump sticking around and not being impeached... right up until the moment Mueller recommends charges.

Maybe, but I think it depends on how much insight they have into the case that Mueller is building. If they can see what's coming, they might try to get in front of it. It isn't clear to me how this is going to play out though. Can Mueller keep everything secret until he formally recommends charges? We'll be able to discern a fair amount based on who gets subpoenas, right?

I guess what I'm saying is that I think the writing will be on the wall long before Mueller actually recommends charges, and I don't see why Republicans would wait until it's "official" before jumping ship.
posted by diogenes at 8:10 AM on June 15, 2017

Presidential elections are mainly binary choices. Trump isn't running against Hillary Clinton any more; he's running against Mike Pence.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:11 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Metafilter: This leaves me feeling optimistic, which can't be right, so I'm sure I'm missing something.
posted by whuppy at 8:11 AM on June 15, 2017 [60 favorites]

spitbull: "The relevant question is how are non-white vagrants living in vans and carrying guns treated in lovely Alexandria. I appreciate the detailed insights into the place, but hearing the press repeat yesterday over and over how "nice" and "family oriented" the community was made me suspect euphemism on steroids."

Which, fair enough, but now that you've heard from locals on the actual situation, maybe you can re-calibrate your suspicion.

FWIW, I used to live there, too, and would agree with the comments of others.
posted by Chrysostom at 8:11 AM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

Guess Texas doesn't really mind being messed with.

AP: Official: Russian hackers targeted Dallas voter registration
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:17 AM on June 15, 2017 [33 favorites]

Trump speaking live about new Apprentices
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:18 AM on June 15, 2017

Critics have said Trump isn’t putting his money where his mouth is, pointing out his budget calls for deep cuts to the Labor Department that includes a $168 million cut in career and technical education grants to states.

This is another executive order vaguely directing an executive department to work out how to do more with less money. These things are easy to write and easy to sign. It gives Donald the opportunity to get back to talking to his lawyer before he hits the links.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:26 AM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

Critics have said Trump isn’t putting his money where his mouth is

David Farenthold points at his entire 2016 output and makes an exaggerated "Mm HM" sound.
posted by Etrigan at 8:33 AM on June 15, 2017 [20 favorites]

WaPo reporter asked DJT if he thinks he is now under investigation. He ignored the question and walked out of the room, shaking folks' hands along the way.
posted by AwkwardPause at 8:33 AM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

WaPo reporter asked DJT if he thinks he is now under investigation. He ignored the question and walked out of the room, shaking folks' hands along the way.

someone buy that wapo reporter a beer and put it on npr's tab
posted by entropicamericana at 8:35 AM on June 15, 2017 [126 favorites]

Critics have said Trump isn’t putting his money where his mouth is

He never has.
posted by Melismata at 8:38 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

Critics have said Trump isn’t putting his money where his mouth is

He never has.
posted by Melismata at 12:38 AM on June 16 [+] [!]

If there's one celebrity I could think of likely to suck on quarters he finds on the ground, it's him.
posted by saysthis at 8:42 AM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

TRIVIA TIME:

What three sitting presidents testified before Congressional committees?

.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.

Lincoln (House Judiciary - leak of SOTU address)
Wilson (Senate Foreign Relations - League of Nations)
Ford (House Judiciary - Nixon pardon)
posted by Chrysostom at 8:43 AM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

Were those presidents compelled to do so? Did they do so under oath?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:46 AM on June 15, 2017

It either is or it isn't.

To be fair, Trump's expressed opinion on basic facts and the facts themselves have little-to-no correlation.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:46 AM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

According to Politico, Paul Manafort is still trading on a relationship with POTUS for foreign business deals.

"...Manafort indicated that he could convince the Trump administration to support any resulting deal, because he’s remained in contact with Trump’s team, and that he played a role in helping to soften Trump’s tough campaign rhetoric on China."

posted by xyzzy at 8:48 AM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

Mods, please delete if this adds to the potentially-derailing conversation about privilege, but Point of Inquiry had an interesting author on recently who discussed, among other things, talking past one another about privilege. NOT saying anybody here is doing that... just an interesting take on it, being such a complex topic and all.
posted by Rykey at 8:51 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

In the Washington Post: Gabrielle Giffords: We need courage to face our gun-safety problem now

I woke up Wednesday morning to images I have prayed I would never see again: a member of Congress and a congressional aide, shot. Children and bystanders scrambling for cover. Fear. Danger. Rage, apparently, from the shooter, at a quiet neighborhood field where my former colleagues were having baseball practice before Thursday night’s charity game. As my fellow lawmakers had been when I was shot outside a supermarket in Tucson six years ago, I was glued to the television, texting former colleagues and dear friends anxiously and offering my prayers as I awaited news. [...]

We know, as always, that no one law could prevent a shooting like this. But we also know that we must acknowledge a problem: an unacceptable rate of gun violence in this country. And we must acknowledge that a deadly problem like this brings a responsibility to find solutions. And that’s where we, as a nation, will need courage in abundance, as my former colleagues find the strength to recover from their wounds — and the bravery to try to make shootings like this one less likely in the future.

This piece is powerful and definitely worth reading.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:51 AM on June 15, 2017 [79 favorites]

So if we agree to call simple equal treatment under the law "privilege" then ol, we need more. But if we call special treatment for being white "privilege" and social treatment for being nonwhite "discrimination," we need less of it both morally in the name of justice, and pragmatically if the point is to spot actual threats in our midst like good old white working class salt of the earth male (abuser) James Hodgkinson.

My take on this may be coloured by the fact that I generally feel that law enforcement does too much. Provided no one spotted the big bag of guns, I don't think that there was anything applicable that should have been done to someone in JH's position, and I hold to this knowing the result.

I would rather have a somewhat elevated risk (that is far more elevated by our insane lack of gun regulations) than an elevated level of police action. I don't feel that anyone of any race or class should be punished for merely being around and seeming out of place, incoherent, or unspecifically threatening.

I feel that police tend to mess around with all people too much, and mess with some groups of people far more. I would prefer that they mess with all groups less. I am willing to take the risk of the occasional JH that is not stopped because of the police being more lax. The people who the police don't shoot and the innocent (whether legally or merely morally) people who don't get caught up in the system outweigh JH in my calculus.

I feel that the puritan spirit of the US being far too focused on punishment is the secondary great ill in our society, with racism being the foremost great ill. And, as we both would agree, the two often intertwine in a horrible way. I may be too focused on police reform, but I generally feel that they should lay off of everyone.

-----------

This has probably gone too far off of the beaten path, and we likely agree on 95% of things, so I will attempt to return to the regularly scheduled Apprentice marathon.
posted by bootlegpop at 8:53 AM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94: "Were those presidents compelled to do so? Did they do so under oath?"

This Senate report specifically says that Lincoln and Ford did so voluntarily; it doesn't state that categorically for Wilson, but it seems like his testimony was a sales job on the League of Nations treaty, so I'm thinking yes on that one, too.

Not clear on oath swearing. There are clips of the Ford testimony online, but I didn't see one that had the entire process.
posted by Chrysostom at 8:54 AM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

I imagine, should Trump go under oath, he'll spontaneously develop memory issues more severe than his buddy Jeff.

Doesn't exactly communicate strength.
posted by leotrotsky at 8:57 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

"I imagine, should Trump go under oath, he'll spontaneously develop memory issues more severe than his buddy Jeff"

That's why it's not as encouraging to me as it is to others that they will question him under oath. His word means nothing and "I don't recall" was his go-to response in the past.

I hope they don't count on his testimony to build a case.
posted by Tarumba at 9:02 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

"I imagine, should Trump go under oath, he'll spontaneously develop memory issues more severe than his buddy Jeff"

I think you can bait Trump more easily than Sessions. Trump might start off saying he doesn't remember (I don't think he'd ever use the word recall), but eventually, you're going to say something that makes him mad enough to respond.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:04 AM on June 15, 2017 [31 favorites]

chris24, I'm not sure how I missed the moniker Nostradumbass before, but thanks for giving me a chuckle.
posted by narwhal at 9:05 AM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

Here's the video of the WaPo question (at 24:45 min mark). Exact wording was "Mr. President, do you believe that you are under investigation now?"
posted by AwkwardPause at 9:06 AM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Not clear on oath swearing. There are clips of the Ford testimony online, but I didn't see one that had the entire process.

I was hoping to find the Congressional Record for Ford's testimony, but it looks like I'd have to actually go somewhere and read some microfiche...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:07 AM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

I want to see Michael Pence grilled under oath, as well. Pence led the transition team, at a time when Jared Kushner and Michael Flynn were attempting to have secret conversations with Russian government officials. He's also--wittingly or not--made multiple false statements regarding Michael Flynn and was apparently involved in the decision to fire James Comey

It is absolutely crucial to know what Pence knew and when he knew it. He should not be let off the hook for his complicity in these affairs--he either knows what is going on or is too stupid to be curious enough to find out--and does not have the internal moral compass to resign. Either way he is unfit for the office of Vice-President.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:09 AM on June 15, 2017 [68 favorites]

I hope they don't count on his testimony to build a case.

I don't think that he will let much out, but I think that he is cocky and confused enough that he may perjure himself out of pure stupidity. It may be something small and the lame media may still say he won the day, but it will be one more potential charge on the pile. I hope so, at least.
---
Also, Rykey: Thanks. I just now opted to order her book from the library.
posted by bootlegpop at 9:09 AM on June 15, 2017

This page says Ford's testimony was unsworn. So, I haven't seen any evidence that the legislative branch can compel the President to testify, let alone under oath.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:17 AM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

Looks like a couple of the compromises from the Senate's AHCA have come out.

Spoiler alert: they change nothing, the bill is trash, moderate Republicans who will pronounce this a good bill are trash.
posted by Copronymus at 9:19 AM on June 15, 2017 [34 favorites]

I hope they don't count on his testimony to build a case.

Mueller prosecuted John Gotti, so I'm cautiously optimistic that they won't need anything from 45.
posted by Fish, fish, are you doing your duty? at 9:29 AM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

I imagine, should Trump go under oath, he'll spontaneously develop memory issues more severe than his buddy Jeff

Maybe. He has a history of lying under oath. Or, perhaps better put, has no real grip on past events or his own memories, and just says whatever he feels to be true (or wants to be true) at the time.
posted by bonehead at 9:29 AM on June 15, 2017 [17 favorites]

Looks like a couple of the compromises from the Senate's AHCA have come out.

Spoiler alert: they change nothing, the bill is trash, moderate Republicans who will pronounce this a good bill are trash.

Looks like it's time to Make Senator Capito's Inbox Full Again.
posted by NoxAeternum at 9:31 AM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

I think you can bait Trump more easily than Sessions.

Totally. Trump is the poster boy for reverse psychology.
posted by Room 641-A at 9:35 AM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

Well, somebody has connected all the dots - or the dotted lines, whatever...

This is a thing of beauty
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:38 AM on June 15, 2017

Philip Bump, WaPo: The Republican response to reports of an investigation into Trump, annotated

Talking points shredded. Feel free to share this with the Trumpists in your life—it won't change their minds (nothing will, it seems) but it will give them something to be angry about, and anger at libruls is what seems to sustain them.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:39 AM on June 15, 2017 [19 favorites]

Josh Marshall, Talking Points Memo: The Russia Probe Is a Vast Lava Flow Moving Toward Trump

It certainly suggests to me what I would have expected, which is that investigators have quite quickly found illicit financial transactions (or prima facie evidence of the same) by those in Trump’s inner circle or those he hooked up with during the campaign. The question now is whether those transactions were part of collusion with Russia. Either way, they become a tool to break people with information about Trump and make them cooperate. Those are crimes either way.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:44 AM on June 15, 2017 [28 favorites]

Wondering what headline metaphors we can see in weeks to come.
The Russia Probe is a Mug of Mountain Dew Slowly Dissolving Donald the Misplaced Cheeto
The Russia Probe is a Hungry, Hungry Hippo Lusting After Donald's Balls
The Russia Probe is the Second Law of Thermodynamics Resulting in the Inevitable Heat-Death of the Trumpiverse
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:48 AM on June 15, 2017 [35 favorites]

In hindsight, as we look back I-Love-the-'80s-style on this era of human civilization, "but they can't lie, they swore an oath" seems to have been a fairly loamy, water-logged and unreliable bit of earth on which to lay the foundation of an entire justice system. Why was it unthinkable to our ancestors that liars would just lie twice? And then keep lying forever, without end, outliving their interrogators and the shadow of their crimes almost without exception?
posted by penduluum at 9:49 AM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

@Locs_n_Laughs: Crystal Griner risked her life to save @SteveScalise. She was comforted in the hospital by her wife. Scalise is against same sex marriage.

I hope that every time he makes a homophobic remark, or supports "religious freedom" laws, or votes to take away Crystal Griner's rights, he is loudly and publicly reminded of what she did for him.
posted by zombieflanders at 9:50 AM on June 15, 2017 [164 favorites]

Just called Senator Toomey's Philadelphia office and got through to a live person on the first call. For the first time, the person got into it with me, though! Like, they kept a polite tone of voice, but when you listened to the actual words, it was full of shit, like correcting me that MA'M IT'S NOT THE AHCA, and when I asked what their preferred terminology was, she told me that I could call it whatever I liked. When I pushed her, she finally said that I should call it the Senate health care bill.

Then, when I asked her whether Senator Toomey was going to push to make the text public or provide more information about the compromises being made, she gave me an evasive answer about it still being a draft. I pushed her again, and she said "I'm sorry if this escapes you, but [insert blather here about it not being public until next week]."

IT WAS BULLSHIT AND I GUESS MY PHONE IS PROBABLY NOW ON THE BLOCK LIST BUT I CAN'T BELIEVE I GOT THROUGH TO A LIVE HUMAN ON THE FIRST TRY
posted by joyceanmachine at 9:55 AM on June 15, 2017 [57 favorites]

For clarity, getting throught to a live human on the first try is NOT a good thing in my book. I want the line to be tied up from now until the sun envelopes the earth in fire.
posted by joyceanmachine at 9:57 AM on June 15, 2017 [36 favorites]

National treasure Ted Lieu on the witch-hunt:

Dear @realDonaldTrump: I will bet you a bottle of fine CA wine that America's professional & dedicated FBI agents find some witches. #MAGA
posted by Rust Moranis at 9:58 AM on June 15, 2017 [63 favorites]

So Senate intel leaders met with Mueller and agreed to stay clear of investigating obstruction, which certainly seems like a strong sign there's an investigation there.

Also, HuffPo: Voters Sue Pennsylvania Over Congressional Map, Saying It Unfairly Benefits GOP
posted by zachlipton at 10:08 AM on June 15, 2017 [36 favorites]

I think you can bait Trump more easily than Sessions.

Ha, seriously. That guy's going to go from "I don't recall" to "You're goddamn right I ordered the code red!" in like 30 seconds.

Another technique that talented lawyers use to good effect, and is TOTALLY going to work on him, is to just... silently stare at him. Ask a tough question, let him spew his 10 seconds of prepared bullshit, then just stay quiet and raise your eyebrows a bit, like "... and?" Even people with a decent amount of self control can get tripped up by that one, and Trump has like zero self control. AND he loves to hear himself talk, AND he thinks he's brilliant.

Really, they barely even need to question him.
posted by Joey Buttafoucault at 10:08 AM on June 15, 2017 [31 favorites]

AP: Official: Russian hackers targeted Dallas voter registration

Which makes total sense when you look at the final election results from Dallas county:
Hillary Clinton: 60.8%
Donald trump: 34.6%

Or, pretty much any TX county containing a major city:

Harris (Houston) — Clinton: 54.0% , trump: 41.6%
Bexar (San Antonio) — Clinton: 54.2%, trump: 40.8%
El Paso — Clinton: 69.1%, trump: 25.9%
Travis (Austin) — Clinton: 65.8%, trump: 27.1%
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:13 AM on June 15, 2017 [14 favorites]

A few comment nixed; if you find something that's lulzy and too good to be true, try and figure out if it actually is before choosing to comment and frame it appropriately if so.
posted by cortex (staff) at 10:24 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

Dear @realDonaldTrump: I will bet you a bottle of fine CA wine that America's professional & dedicated FBI agents find some witches. #MAGA

a year from now Donald will try to collect on the grounds that he & his underlings were indicted for obstruction of justice, money laundering, treason, etc and were completely exonerated of any charges of witchcraft
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:25 AM on June 15, 2017 [13 favorites]

"I'm not a witch. I'm yuge!"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:28 AM on June 15, 2017

actually I wouldn't be surprised if Bannon and Gorka have a fully outfitted Third Reich Occult Nonsense mancave somewhere so who knows, maybe Lieu is ahead of me on this one
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:34 AM on June 15, 2017 [18 favorites]

Gaggle rules for today's WH press briefing at 1:30 with Sarah Huckabee-Sanders: no cameras and no broadcast of the audio.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:35 AM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

Gaggle rules for today's WH press briefing at 1:30 with Sarah Huckabee-Sanders: no cameras and no broadcast of the audio.

Is the press allowed to attend?
posted by Behemoth at 10:39 AM on June 15, 2017 [93 favorites]

Dear @realDonaldTrump: I will bet you a bottle of fine CA wine that America's professional & dedicated FBI agents find some witches. #MAGA

a year from now Donald will try to collect on the grounds that he & his underlings were indicted for obstruction of justice, money laundering, treason, etc and were completely exonerated of any charges of witchcraft

One fine bottle of Three Buck Chuck coming right up.
posted by azpenguin at 10:40 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Is the press allowed to attend?

Yes, but only if they promise not to leak the contents of the briefing to the press.
posted by diogenes at 10:41 AM on June 15, 2017 [54 favorites]

Looks like we may get to see the Comey memos. CNN files lawsuit seeking Comey's Trump memos by Gregory Wallace.

Also, in The Guardian, Lobbyist for Russian interests says he attended dinners hosted by Sessions by Stephanie Kirchgaessner.

The meat of it is that Richard Burt, an American lobbyist for Russian interests, has confirmed he had contact with Sessions. McCain had asked Sessions if he had any contact "with any representative, including any American lobbyist or agent of any Russian company". The article does say that it's possible that Sessions had not known about Burt's lobbying work, although it was "well known".
posted by papercrane at 10:45 AM on June 15, 2017 [36 favorites]

Gaggle rules for today's WH press briefing at 1:30 with Sarah Huckabee-Sanders: no cameras and no broadcast of the audio.

If nobody is sneaking in tiny spy cameras, the Fourth Estate has truly abandoned us.
posted by Faint of Butt at 10:47 AM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

The Guardian: Lobbyist for Russian interests says he attended dinners hosted by Sessions

This seems like it could be an interesting development. Richard Burt, an American lobbyist, says he attended two dinners hosted by Sessions during the 2016 campaign. Which contradicts Sessions' testimony that he didn't believe he had any contacts with lobbyists working for Russian interests over the course of Trump’s campaign. But I'm sure that the racist Keebler elf will just claim he forgot or didn't know Burt was a lobbyist for Russian interests. Or some other bullshit excuse for seemingly committing perjury.
posted by friendlyjuan at 10:50 AM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

He's still finding the best minds, the greatest minds: Senators Grill Trump Judicial Nominees On Provocative Blog Posts (NPR, June 15, 2017)

Trump has more than 130 judicial vacancies to fill on the federal courts. The number is unusually large because Republicans blocked dozens of Obama appointees — including uncontroversial ones — in the final years of the Democratic administration. And now the new administration is moving to fill the same seats that were kept open, sometimes for two and three years.

At Wednesday's hearing, the two nominees found themselves trying to explain hundreds of their own blog posts, posts they admitted were "intemperate" and "political." The posts included material ranging from radical rants, to conspiracy theories and false allegations.

First, fuck the GOP for effectively stacking the deck by putting the game on hold for years. Second, can we finally put away the notion that people somehow magically lose their political interests when they go from lawyer to judge?

John Bush, a Kentucky lawyer nominated to the 6th Circuit Court of Appeals, said he regretted some of his 400-plus posts, all published under a fake name on the political website "Elephants in the Bluegrass."

Bush maintained that none of the beliefs he expressed in those posts would carry over to his conduct as a judge.

"Blogging is a political activity," he said. "It is not appropriate to bring politics to the bench, and if I am fortunate enough to be confirmed, I will not bring politics to the bench."

Among the posts Bush said he now regrets is one that equated the U.S. Supreme Court's 1857 Dred Scott decision, which upheld slavery, with the Court's 1973 Roe v. Wade decision legalizing abortion. Specifically, Bush called slavery and abortion "the two greatest tragedies in our country."
...
While Bush adopted an apologetic tone, a second nominee, Damien Schiff, was far more confrontational.

Schiff, a senior attorney with the conservative Pacific Legal Foundation in California, is nominated to sit on the U.S. Court of Federal Claims. He has a long record challenging everything from environmental regulations, to health and safety laws, to gay rights laws.

In one of his many blog posts, Schiff called Supreme Court Justice Anthony Kennedy a "judicial prostitute."

Schiff accused Kennedy, who often casts the fifth and deciding vote in closely divided cases, of "selling his vote ... to four other justices in exchange for the high that comes from the aggrandizement of power and influence, and the blandishments of the fawning media."

Schiff only marginally backed away from those words on Wednesday.

"The point of that blog post was not to impugn or malign any person," he insisted, "but rather to attack a certain style of judging that is frequently applauded in the media."
...
In the unlikely event that [Republican Sen. John Kennedy of Louisiana] does vote against either or both of the blogging nominees, that still would leave the committee's Democrats one vote shy of blocking the nominations. And that assumes the Democrats, outnumbered 11 to 9 on the committee, all vote the same way.

All. Elections. Matter. Hold all representatives accountable for all of their actions and inactions.
posted by filthy light thief at 10:52 AM on June 15, 2017 [58 favorites]

Damn you, papercrane! *shakes fist* I should have known to preview my first comment in these mega-threads (long time reader, first time poster...)
posted by friendlyjuan at 10:53 AM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

Maybe. He has a history of lying under oath. Or, perhaps better put, has no real grip on past events or his own memories, and just says whatever he feels to be true (or wants to be true) at the time.

Or he's secretly a huge fan of Assassin's Creed. Which.... come to think of it would explain a lot of the last 18 months.
posted by Mayor West at 10:56 AM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

Why would the Russian lobbyist be outing Sessions as a Russian lobbyist?
posted by Artw at 10:59 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

But I'm sure that the racist Keebler elf will just claim he forgot or didn't know Burt was a lobbyist for Russian interests. Or some other bullshit excuse for seemingly committing perjury.

Second verse, same as the first
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 10:59 AM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

Burt, who previously served on the advisory board of Alfa Capital Partners, a private equity fund where Russia’s Alfa Bank was an investor and last year was lobbying on behalf of a pipeline company that is now controlled by Gazprom...

Alfa Bank and Gazprom ring some bells for some reason...
posted by diogenes at 11:06 AM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

Notes from the press gaggle:

- Trump in Miami tomorrow will make an announcement on US-Cuba policy

- Asked why FBI director nomination not sent to Senate yet, Sarah Huckabee Sanders says there's a long paperwork process.

- There has been "quite a bit of attacking" against Trump and the country as a whole should "bring the temperature down a little bit."

- SHS says she believes that Trump has confidence in Mueller.

- confirms Bob Mueller was at White House for a job interview the day before he was named as special counsel.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:06 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Politico, back in October 2016: Lobbyist advised Trump campaign while promoting Russian pipeline by Ben Schreckinger and Julia Ioffe.

In addition to helping shape Trump’s speech, Burt attended two dinners this summer hosted by Alabama Sen. Jeff Sessions, who had been named chairman of Trump’s national security committee.

If Sessions was still unaware of Burt's lobbying more than 6 months after it had been widely reported, then he's either incompetent or willfully ignorant.
posted by papercrane at 11:07 AM on June 15, 2017 [20 favorites]

- There has been "quite a bit of attacking" against Trump and the country as a whole should "bring the temperature down a little bit."

LOL. It's only June. Wait and see what the temperature is like in July and August.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 11:08 AM on June 15, 2017 [27 favorites]

I hope they don't count on his testimony to build a case.

Would they need it, though? I realize House impeachments and Senate trials aren't the same as criminal courts of law, but "Gee golly, I forget" coming from a guy who's known to lie his ass off for any (or no) reason at all doesn't seem to be much of a defense against a squeaky-clean former FBI director's evidence, and Trump's approval ratings look to be dipping into the safe zone as far as pissing off voters goes.

And if Trump ever does find himself in an actual criminal court of law over any of this... Well, people with bad memories who insist they're innocent are convicted all the time, if the evidence against them is strong—even if it's circumstantial.

I mean, I'm sure dude will make a total ass out of himself in any venue, but surely they don't actually need him to, right...?
posted by Rykey at 11:08 AM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

And Burt is connected to Deutsche Bank. I'm gonna need a new roll of red string just for this guy!
posted by diogenes at 11:09 AM on June 15, 2017 [38 favorites]

My favorite bit from the secret press gaggle: "Because I'm not the president," says @SHSanders45, asked why Pres Trump can tweet about the Mueller investigation, but she can't comment.

I really hope the follow-up was to ask if they can get the President in there to answer questions himself then.

It's a glib answer, but I think it also really speaks to the staff's frustration that he's out there creating these disasters for them because he won't follow any rules.
posted by zachlipton at 11:11 AM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

538 (Clare Malone): Imagining President Pence
posted by Chrysostom at 11:11 AM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

Trump did such good job of pissing off zee Germans... and now a Mueller is going to grind Trump's bones to make his flour.
posted by elsietheeel at 11:12 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

- confirms Bob Mueller was at White House for a job interview the day before he was named as special counsel.

TFW you're so corrupt that people you offer jobs to say no and then start an investigation.
posted by dis_integration at 11:16 AM on June 15, 2017 [33 favorites]

Sessions ... [is] either incompetent or willfully ignorant.

Why not both?
posted by bonehead at 11:23 AM on June 15, 2017 [17 favorites]

even the most educated, literate, news-following, well earning and not racist Trump-voters (Free Marketeers, 25%) tend to get their news from Fox News.

This is oxymoronic. You can't say "educated, literate, news-following" and "get their news from Fox News" in the same sentence. I guess it's possible some people thought Fox was a real news network in the late 1990s, but no intelligent person has had any grounds for that notion in 20 years.

Even with an administration that loves them in power, they're still not breaking any news. Fox is just talk radio with pictures.
posted by msalt at 11:24 AM on June 15, 2017 [25 favorites]

TFW you offer a job to someone and then retroactively determine they aren't capable of being impartial in carrying out investigations.
posted by Green With You at 11:24 AM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

I'm gonna need a new roll of red string just for this guy!

I'm never going to get tired of this joke. The other day I was thinking about all the conspiracy theories on the right and imagining their version must be bonkers, like basically just a thick, red carpet made of criss-cross string.

John Bush, a Kentucky lawyer nominated to the 6th Circuit Court of Appeals, said he regretted some of his 400-plus posts, all published under a fake name on the political website "Elephants in the Bluegrass."

Fuck this guy, but I've got to admit, that's a great name for his blog.
posted by Room 641-A at 11:26 AM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

Our sweet and savory Marshmallows ’N’ Gravy Pizza

I just convulsed so hard I knocked one of my shoes off.
posted by Etrigan at 11:29 AM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

I'm still taken aback that Attorney Generals (attorneys general?) are allowed to hold dinners for lobbyists. How is this okay? (Let alone that they can hold dinners for lobbyists, and then claim they didn't know they were lobbyists.)
posted by Soliloquy at 11:30 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

In today's metaphorical news, a blimp caught fire and crashed near a U.S. Open golf course. [real] (The pilot was injured; no other casualties reported.)
posted by Faint of Butt at 11:33 AM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

I'm still taken aback that Attorney Generals (attorneys general?) are allowed to hold dinners for lobbyists.

That report is from before the election.
posted by no1hatchling at 11:33 AM on June 15, 2017

It's attorneys general, yes.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:34 AM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

I'm still taken aback that Attorney Generals (attorneys general?) are allowed to hold dinners for lobbyists.

That report is from before the election.

Back when he was just a sitting U.S. Senator... holding dinners for lobbyists.
posted by Etrigan at 11:36 AM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

Latest in wingnut land: Trump should demand Mueller's resignation (and Mueller should possibly be disbarred)

Looks like they're scared.
posted by en forme de poire at 11:38 AM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

It's worse then just a casual meeting at a dinner though. Burt helped write Trump's April 27, 2016 speech in which Trump called for a closer relationship with Russia. He also wrote policy whitepapers for Sessions. Were they seriously taking policy advice from someone without checking to see who was paying them for that influence?
posted by papercrane at 11:40 AM on June 15, 2017 [69 favorites]

Hell, it's a disgrace that senators can hold dinners for lobbyists
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 11:40 AM on June 15, 2017 [23 favorites]

I'm still taken aback that Attorney Generals (attorneys general?) are allowed to hold dinners for lobbyists. How is this okay? (Let alone that they can hold dinners for lobbyists, and then claim they didn't know they were lobbyists.)

Doonesbury from 2007. Nothing changes.
posted by Melismata at 11:41 AM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Artw: Why would the Russian lobbyist be outing Sessions as a Russian lobbyist?

Undermine US institutions? You know, the general Russian MO for the past few years.
posted by filthy light thief at 11:44 AM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

In today's metaphorical news, a blimp caught fire and crashed near a U.S. Open golf course. [real]

Oh the huge manbaby.
posted by octobersurprise at 11:45 AM on June 15, 2017 [28 favorites]

While y'all have your red string out:

- Trump in Miami tomorrow will make an announcement on US-Cuba policy

Politico: Trump to clamp down on Cuba travel and trade

Making good on a campaign pledge, President Donald Trump on Friday will announce a significant rollback of former President Barack Obama’s accord with Cuba by clearly banning tourist travel to the island, restating the importance of the 56-year-old trade embargo with the island and instituting a broad prohibition on financial transactions with companies significantly controlled by the Communist government’s military, according to a draft version of the directive obtained by POLITICO.

The administration says its goal is to put an end to business transactions that financially benefit the Castro regime while the Cuban people get little in return. (...)

Under a strict interpretation of the directive, an American probably can’t even stay in an Old Havana hotel or use a tour service because they’re run or controlled by Grupo de Administracion Empresarial S.A., or GAESA, the business arm of the Cuban military that controls a vast swath of the country’s economy, including most of Cuba’s foreign-run hotels. The prohibition includes any subsidiaries or affiliated companies, along with certain other state-controlled entities.(...)

For U.S.-based companies such as the Marriott-owned Starwood Hotels, the Trump policy could mean the cancellation of its special U.S. government license – obtained last year under the Obama administration – allowing it to sign a deal with GAESA giving it management over a historic Havana hotel.

Politico: Inside Marco Rubio’s campaign to shape Trump’s Cuba crackdown

In 1999, when he was considering an independent bid for president, Trump gave a stemwinder speech where he condemned the brutality of the Castro regime and pledged not to do business there. But the year before, according to a Newsweek report, Trump sent an emissary to examine casino opportunities on the island. And in 2015, Bloomberg Businessweek reported last year, Trump Organization officials scouted for a possible golf course deal in Cuba.

From that Bloomberg piece:

In January 2015, the Treasury Department broadened an exception for “professional research.” That’s viewed by attorneys to encompass all sorts of potential investment activity—short of signing deals. To finalize an investment in Cuba requires a specific license from Treasury’s Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC). Starwood Hotels & Resorts and Marriott each announced in March they’d received authorization. (A Treasury spokeswoman says it is agency policy not to confirm or deny whether specific licenses have been issued.) Russo says the Trump Organization hasn’t secured one.

posted by Fish, fish, are you doing your duty? at 11:49 AM on June 15, 2017 [19 favorites]

Latest in wingnut land: Trump should demand Mueller's resignation (and Mueller should possibly be disbarred)

Looks like they're scared.

Hannity is calling for Mueller AND Rosenstein to resign. Seems reasonable.
posted by diogenes at 11:49 AM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

It's worse then just a casual meeting at a dinner though. Burt helped write Trump's April 27, 2016 speech in which Trump called for a closer relationship with Russia.

And where did he give that speech? The Mayflower Hotel of course.
posted by diogenes at 11:51 AM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

About a million years ago (or last night), secret life of gravy asked "I listened to a recording of the Sessions hearing today (lawfare podcast) and I noticed her voice was pretty quavery. Is she in good health?"

You don't specify that you're talking about Senator Collins, but I know you are. She has spasmodic dysphonia. That's just the way she sounds.
posted by anastasiav at 11:51 AM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Has anybody compiled a list of places where Trump hasn't been able to open properties? I feel like that would be useful for anticipating the rest of his foreign policy.
posted by Fish, fish, are you doing your duty? at 11:57 AM on June 15, 2017 [34 favorites]

And, like, on the one hand, it's pretty dire when science fiction novels are our best hope. but on the other hand, there's prior art for science fiction novels as a particularly effective organizing tool in situations where coordinated mass action is necessary for survival. Anyway: plz, if you have free time, read Kim Stanley Robinson's New York 2140. On the surface it's a novel about life in nearish-future manhattan, but really it's a deeply politically/theoretically informed speculative handbook for pro-democracy insurrection in the present day

If you want a feel-good quick hit, KSR has a fantastic little short called Oral Argument that also imagines a massive resistance/jubilee. It does some violence to the reality of how the courts, particularly the Supremes, actually work. But if you can set that aside it's really fun and a pretty great vision of a utopia (though dystopian to financial systems).
posted by phearlez at 11:57 AM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Ezra Klein, Vox: Republicans Are About to Make Medicare-for-all Much More Likely

Obamacare was the test of the incrementalist theory, and, politically, at least, it’s failed. Democrats built a law to appeal to moderate Republicans that incorporated key ideas from Mitt Romney’s Massachusetts reforms, and it nevertheless became the single most polarizing initiative of Obama’s presidency. All the work Democrats did to build support from the health care industry has proven to be worth precious little as Republicans push their repeal plan forward. And the complex public-private design of the Affordable Care Act left the system dependent on the business decisions of private insurers and left Democrats trying to explain away premium increases they don’t control. The result is a Democratic Party moving left, and fast, on health care.

posted by Glibpaxman at 11:59 AM on June 15, 2017 [62 favorites]

Whenever you see Trump or another Trumpist accuse Mueller of being "conflicted" remember that a conflict of interest is one of the specific grounds under which the regulations allow the Special Counsel to be fired.

So the one good thing is that Rosenstein testified that as of Wednesday, Mueller had given him no cause to be fired.

Hannity is calling for Mueller AND Rosenstein to resign.

Please proceed, Governor.
posted by Room 641-A at 12:01 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Hannity is calling for Mueller AND Rosenstein to resign.

Agreed. And since Rosenstein was hand-picked by the President a few weeks ago, the President's judgement is in question, and he too must resign.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:06 PM on June 15, 2017 [22 favorites]

All the work Democrats did to build support from the health care industry has proven to be worth precious little as Republicans push their repeal plan forward. And the complex public-private design of the Affordable Care Act left the system dependent on the business decisions of private insurers and left Democrats trying to explain away premium increases they don’t control. The result is a Democratic Party moving left, and fast, on health care.

Republicans, with their Reagan-esque hatred of government, like to proclaim that "free market solutions" are superior.

The problems with the ACA are largely because they rely on free market solutions.

The problems for Republicans, as Bill Kristol indicated in his infamous memo on Bill Clinton's attempt at health care reform, is that it proves the fundamental Republican stance wrong and the Democratic one right. Even Republican voters object to having their health insurance taken away.
posted by Gelatin at 12:07 PM on June 15, 2017 [33 favorites]

Senate Intelligence Committee member James Lankford (R-OK) after the Comey testimony, re Trump: "Obviously he's not under investigation"

Whoops!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:17 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

The result is a Democratic Party moving left, and fast, on health care.

meanwhile, the republicans are moving towards their own solution
posted by pyramid termite at 12:19 PM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Has anybody compiled a list of places where Trump hasn't been able to open properties? I feel like that would be useful for anticipating the rest of his foreign policy.

Oh shit we're going to invade Atlantic City.
posted by Etrigan at 12:22 PM on June 15, 2017 [36 favorites]

Were they seriously taking policy advice from someone without checking to see who was paying them for that influence?

Have to bring up ALEC again if this seems like anything other than SOP for U.S. legislators, because that's how it all works now, basically.
posted by saulgoodman at 12:30 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

I've had it explained to me that at the state level it has to be that way because pols don't have the policy chops themselves and can't realistically be expected to.
posted by saulgoodman at 12:32 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

And since Hannity has spent at least the last year talking about how great Trump is, which means his judgment is also in question and he too should resign.
posted by biogeo at 12:32 PM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

I've had it explained to me that at the state level it has to be that way because pols don't have the policy chops themselves and can't realistically be expected to.

Not as long as the American electorate views actual policy experience as disqualifying for public office.
posted by biogeo at 12:35 PM on June 15, 2017 [25 favorites]

I've had it explained to me that at the state level it has to be that way because pols don't have the policy chops themselves and can't realistically be expected to.

From personal-adjacent experience, state level politicians can be heavily persuaded by a group of knowledgeable constituents coming to their office to walk them painstakingly through the actual implications of a piece of legislation, because they themselves are doofuses who don't read the shit that they vote on. The up side here is that if you can find like four folks near you who feel passionately about and are knowledgeable on a topic, you can get a lot of traction if you get noisy about wanting to meet with the legislator and talk about this stuff. Chances are everything you tell them will be brand new information.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:37 PM on June 15, 2017 [63 favorites]

Well I'm frankly a bit stunned. My Senator, Thom Tillis, has announced that "We should let Robert Mueller do his job." It makes me wonder if NC's other Senator, Burr, had a few words with him. I suspect Burr knows how bad things are for Trump since as head of the Senate Intelligence Committee he has heard all the closed door sessions.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 12:51 PM on June 15, 2017 [55 favorites]

Q: @realDonaldTrump

Why is that Hillary Clintons family and Dems dealings with Russia are not looked at, but my non-dealings are?
[real]

A: Because YOU ARE THE PRESIDENT.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:53 PM on June 15, 2017 [69 favorites]

Hillary really needs to tweet that "why are you so obsessed with me" gif from Mean Girls
posted by nakedmolerats at 12:58 PM on June 15, 2017 [59 favorites]

That's a particularly dumb tweet in both construction and intended meaning.
posted by diogenes at 12:59 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

follow up: Crooked H destroyed phones w/ hammer, 'bleached' emails, & had husband meet w/AG days before she was cleared- & they talk about obstruction? [real]

She destroyed phones with a hammer?
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:59 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

If he could start a "LOCK HER UP" chant over twitter he would totally be trying to right now
posted by yhbc at 1:00 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

Why is that Hillary Clintons family and Dems dealings with Russia are not looked at, but my non-dealings are?

Wtf are "non-dealings"? The nothing is not nothing, I guess. Trump and Buddhism.
posted by dis_integration at 1:00 PM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

Wtf are "non-dealings"?

And how does one look at them?
posted by diogenes at 1:01 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

Trump would be able to follow through on all the times he vowed to investigate Hillary Clinton and the massive voter fraud in her favor. If only he were president!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:03 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

Secret Life of Gravy: "I suspect Burr knows how bad things are for Trump since as head of the Senate Intelligence Committee he has heard all the closed door sessions."

Yeah. Burr is no prize, but it's been clear in the public hearings we've seen that he is actually taking his job seriously, as opposed to outright clowns like Cotton and Cornyn.
posted by Chrysostom at 1:03 PM on June 15, 2017 [20 favorites]

I have a feeling we're going to find out that some nutty website posted a story about Hillary Clinton and hammers like 15 minutes ago.
posted by diogenes at 1:04 PM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

That tweet sounded better in the original Pāli
posted by theodolite at 1:04 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Wtf are "non-dealings"?

And how does one look at them?

It's like Nietzsche said: "If you gaze long into non-dealings, the non-dealings also gaze into you."
posted by Barack Spinoza at 1:04 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

the hammers and bleach shit was from the Official Republican Talking Points thing that got posted last night and picked apart by WaPo earlier
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:05 PM on June 15, 2017 [23 favorites]

The really scary thing is that he's on message. This stuff is all off the talking points they put out last night.
posted by zachlipton at 1:06 PM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

The hammer thing was an out-of-context or misunderstood description about the procedure for destroying secures phones or something.
posted by Room 641-A at 1:06 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

(From before we moved to the Upside Down.)
posted by Room 641-A at 1:07 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

She destroyed phones with a hammer?
posted by roomthreeseventeen

Worse, she yelled "Stop! Hammer time!" each time she did it
posted by the phlegmatic king at 1:07 PM on June 15, 2017 [93 favorites]

He is starting to feel the pressure. I think the days ahead are going to be filled with temper tantrums. Think about it. He knows he got money from Russia and now he's starting to figure out that Mueller's team is going to find it. I don't know where we are headed but it's going to be a bumpy ride.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:08 PM on June 15, 2017 [30 favorites]

Hammer is a known accomplice of Clinton and her insatiable desire to destroy phones. Sadly, the law enforcement community regards him as untouchable.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:08 PM on June 15, 2017 [54 favorites]

She destroyed phones with a hammer?

I forget the specifics, but yeah, destruction of devices that can't for certain be securely erased is fairly standard practice.

For comparison, computers at the Guardian that may have handled Snowden's info had the GPU's physically sanded off the video cards with angle grinders by the feds "just in case" there was still classified data in them.

"BleachBit" was the name of a security program used to decommision the "private server"; again, secure-wiping hard drives that might contain confidential data is standard practice.

They are just trying to make mountains out of molehills here.
posted by CyberSlug Labs at 1:09 PM on June 15, 2017 [28 favorites]

In the last weeks of the campaign there was actually a Trump (or Trump-affiliated) TV ad that featured a Hillary Clinton impersonator cackling madly as she smashed cell phones with a sledgehammer.
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 1:10 PM on June 15, 2017

see the link in this comment. the hammers thing is explained
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:10 PM on June 15, 2017

She destroyed phones with a hammer?

This was a big talking point on the Right for a little while last year during the height of the buttery males¹ story. The actual correct way to permanently and securely clear out data from an obsolete device containing sensitive information is to physically destroy it, e.g., by smashing it. Clinton's aides apparently adhered to this procedure for some phones, and the blowhards on the Right decided that this was somehow evidence of wrongdoing.

¹ "But her emails!", h/t some other Mefite
posted by biogeo at 1:11 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

Question: Will the Mueller's team have access to Trump's tax returns?
posted by growabrain at 1:11 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

Okay, should have previewed. What everyone else said.
posted by biogeo at 1:11 PM on June 15, 2017

And here I thought he was getting HRC and Tom Brady mixed up
posted by aiglet at 1:11 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

and I would not even be a tiny bit surprised if, all the while these idiots have been shitclowning about Clinton following recommended data security procedures, they've got stuff like "STUFF THAT IMPLICATES US.doc" and "RUSSIA DEBTS - THE BAD STUFF.xls" just sitting in their Recycle Bin folder
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:13 PM on June 15, 2017 [51 favorites]

guys she personally murdered like 3000 people, why is it so hard to believe she whacked some phones too?
posted by entropicamericana at 1:14 PM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

Does anyone have any insights about whether the President can successfully pardon himself and his family and his campaign?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:16 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

and I would not even be a tiny bit surprised if, all the while these idiots have been shitclowning about Clinton following recommended data security procedures, they've got stuff like "STUFF THAT IMPLICATES US.doc" and "RUSSIA DEBTS - THE BAD STUFF.xls" just sitting in their Recycle Bin folder

Are you kidding? Once those stopped showing up in the Recently Opened Files list, they assumed they were deleted.
posted by biogeo at 1:16 PM on June 15, 2017 [20 favorites]

Wtf are "non-dealings"?

Some call them "alternative dealings."
posted by Behemoth at 1:17 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

I just got through to Senator Dianne Feinstein's office in Fresno. It probably won't be a surprise to MeFites that even if you get voice mail immediately at her other state offices, the Central Valley line is almost always free (sigh). A very nice staffer named Sara(h?) is waiting to hear you demand that Senator Feinstein commit to withholding consent on normal Senate business (there's a script) as well as prepare amendments to submit during the vote-o-rams (who knew?) in order to delay Trumpcare. The Fresno number is (559) 485-7430. Call now if you haven't. Seriously. Thank you. Now, off to call Senator Harris. Thank you zachlipton for inspiring me to get off my duff.
posted by Bella Donna at 1:17 PM on June 15, 2017 [27 favorites]

So BuzzFeed news just dropped an investigative article on 14 alleged Russian hits on British soil that the UK government is turning a blind eye to.

From Russia With Blood : Lavish London mansions. A hand-painted Rolls-Royce. And eight dead friends. For the British fixer Scot Young, working for Vladimir Putin's most vocal critic meant stunning perks – but also constant danger. His gruesome death is one of 14 that US spy agencies have linked to Russia – but the UK police shut down every last case. A bombshell cache of documents today reveals the full story of a ring of death on British soil that the government has ignored.

posted by PenDevil at 1:18 PM on June 15, 2017 [41 favorites]

Heh. Some Trump fan is earnestly trying to warn DJT against Ryan, saying Ryan is going to shiv him in the back so he can be President. I love the idea that the writer thinks he can warn POTUS through a tweet ( hell, maybe he can) and the writer thinks POTUS is not aware of Ryan's proximity to the throne (hell, maybe he isn't.)

Look out! He's inside the house!
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:19 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

Are you kidding? Once those stopped showing up in the Recently Opened Files list, they assumed they were deleted.

TRUMP: Are you ready?
FLYNN: Ready as I'll ever be, my friend.
FLYNN, HAND SHAKING, MOVES MOUSE TO CORNER OF WINDOW AND CLICKS. A POP-UP DIALOG ASKS "Do you want to save changes to STUFF THAT IMPLICATES US.doc?". HE CLICKS "No".
TRUMP: Let us never speak of this. Godspeed.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:20 PM on June 15, 2017 [13 favorites]

Does anyone have any insights about whether the President can successfully pardon himself and his family and his campaign?

This has been discussed some in the media, I think. My understanding is that there are few, if any, explicit limitations to the Presidential power of pardon in the Constitution, but there's still some question about whether a President can pardon himself. So far it's never come up in court, since even Nixon wasn't stupid enough to try.

Which means I guess we'll probably have a ruling from the Supremes on the issue later this year.
posted by biogeo at 1:20 PM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

Gaggle rules for today's WH press briefing at 1:30 with Sarah Huckabee-Sanders: no cameras and no broadcast of the audio.

Like, what do they think press meetings are for? I mean, the questions and answers are going to still going to get out, it just saves them from looking evasive and disingenuous. Oh, and they can always say "nuh uh" to anything that's reported.

Is there any way to defeat this without boycotting their meetings completely? (Which is what they want, because then they get to stop having them at all)
posted by ctmf at 1:24 PM on June 15, 2017

prepare amendments to submit during the vote-o-rams

This idea has been going around on twitter today (here's the thread from Ezra Levin). Basically, part of the reconciliation procedure is that Senators can introduce unlimited amendments (a "vote-o-rama") - each amendment gets a little opening statement and then a vote, so it can present Dems a quasi-filibuster opportunity (by introducing 1000s of amendments) even though it's a 50-vote threshold.
posted by melissasaurus at 1:24 PM on June 15, 2017 [14 favorites]

guys she personally murdered like 3000 people, why is it so hard to believe she whacked some phones too?

All those murders and yet Anthony Weiner is somehow still breathing.
posted by Talez at 1:25 PM on June 15, 2017 [31 favorites]

Clinton recklessly put emails on her private computer devices so someone might be able to access them; and even worse, she destroyed the devices so no-one could access them!!!!!!11
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:27 PM on June 15, 2017 [29 favorites]

It's hard to whack a guy who's always whacking himself.
posted by biogeo at 1:27 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Hil's hands-on approach to murder is the main reason I voted for her.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:29 PM on June 15, 2017 [63 favorites]

Governor Cuomo to Nominate Justice Paul G. Feinman as Associate Judge on New York State Court of Appeals: Justice Feinman has been nominated to fill the vacancy created earlier this year by the tragic death of the Honorable Sheila Abdus-Salaam. If confirmed, Justice Feinman would be the first openly gay person to serve on the Court of Appeals. He is a member of the Richard C. Failla LGBT Commission, which promotes fair treatment of LGBT issues and LGBT members of the court community. He was the President of the International Association of LGBT Judges between 2008 and 2011, and was President of the Association of Supreme Court Justices of the State of New York in 2015.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 1:32 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

Lawsuit claims White House hiding private prison link (Mirren Gidda, Newsweek)

Another lawsuit has been added to the slew of cases pending against the beleaguered Trump administration. On Thursday, the Campaign Legal Center, a non-partisan D.C. organization, filed suit against the Department of Justice (DOJ) over a $110 million private prison contract it awarded to pro-Trump company the GEO Group.

The story begins on August 18, 2016, when then-Deputy Attorney General Sally Yates ordered the phasing out of private correctional facilities. Whether in response or simply by coincidence, the next day the GEO Group, the U.S.’ second-largest private prisons company, donated $100,000 to Rebuilding America Now, a pro-Trump super political action committee (PAC.)

posted by Room 641-A at 1:33 PM on June 15, 2017 [31 favorites]

Senators can introduce unlimited amendments (a "vote-o-rama") - each amendment gets a little opening statement and then a vote, so it can present Dems a quasi-filibuster opportunity

As I said upthread, even one day of extra life for the 25,000,000 who will lose healthcare is equivalent to saving the lives of a thousand babies.
posted by Joe in Australia at 1:34 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

It's attorneys general, yes.

I was stunned during the Sessions testimony that the appropriate way to address an attorney general is, e.g. "General Sessions." But critical Democrats were doing it too, so I guess it is.
posted by msalt at 1:41 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

Does anyone have any insights about whether the President can successfully pardon himself and his family and his campaign?

Right we go through this about every two weeks or so. I, myself, started to take an interest in the subject as soon as he won the election because I figured impeachment proceedings would follow sooner or later. Trump has always been dirty.

He can issue a blanket pardon for anyone, for any crime, however a Presidential Pardon cannot stop them from being forced to testify in court or during the Senate trail for Impeachment nor can he pardon them for crimes committed in the future. The person pardoned cannot plead the fifth at that point (because they have been pardoned for all crimes) but they can be charged for perjury for lying under oath (a new crime.) Essentially anyone who was pardoned by him would then be forced to sing like a canary.

As for the President himself I have seen legal arguments saying yes, he can pardon himself and others saying no, he cannot. It depends on how you read the wording of the constitution on that point. Therefore if he did try to pardon himself the case would end up in the Supreme Court which would then be setting precedent.

With Nixon, VP Agnew was forced out first and he was replaced by the Congress with Gerald Ford. At some point there was an agreement made that when Nixon resigned, Ford would pardon him so we would not have the political spectacle of putting a former President on trial.

In my new favorite fantasy, I like to imagine Trump resigning during impeachment proceedings on the expectations that Pence will grant him a full pardon for all crimes committed both before and after the Presidency. And then President Pence just telling Trump, "Sorry. I think you are a very bad man and you deserve to go to jail. I will pray for you."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:43 PM on June 15, 2017 [23 favorites]

msalt: "I was stunned during the Sessions testimony that the appropriate way to address an attorney general is, e.g. "General Sessions." But critical Democrats were doing it too, so I guess it is."

It is NOT correct.
posted by Chrysostom at 1:46 PM on June 15, 2017 [24 favorites]

Does anyone have any insights about whether the President can successfully pardon himself and his family and his campaign?

Article 2, Section 2 of the Constitution:
"The President shall be commander in chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the militia of the several states, when called into the actual service of the United States; he may require the opinion, in writing, of the principal officer in each of the executive departments, upon any subject relating to the duties of their respective offices, and he shall have power to grant reprieves and pardons for offenses against the United States, except in cases of impeachment."

There are two clear limits there.
1) "offenses against the United States" (ie federal crimes but not state crimes.)
2) "except in cases of impeachment." So clearly he can't pardon himself from impeachment. But does that also mean that, once the process of filing a motion of impeachment has begun, he is no longer allowed to pardon himself or possibly anyone at all? Courts will decide but I think that's a very reasonable reading.
posted by msalt at 1:46 PM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

Thanks Secret Life of Gravy.

Might Trump also be permanently on the hook for any state crimes committed outside of DC, such as at Trump Tower or Mar-A-Lago?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:48 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

He should not have been addressed as General Sessions. The correct form of address would have been "Mr. Attorney General" or "Mr. Sessions" (well, Senator Sessions I guess as he is a retired Senator.) I understand they are sometimes addressed as General XXXX in a courtroom setting but I assume this was an error which has been propagated through time. And this was not a court setting.
posted by Justinian at 1:48 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Was Nixon forced to testify under oath after he was pardoned?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:49 PM on June 15, 2017

Chysostom: "It is NOT correct."

I'm not sure your source says that. It boils down to whether an Attorney General is a subset of Generals, ie the General of all the Attorneys, in which case General might work. Another example would be Inspectors General.
posted by msalt at 1:50 PM on June 15, 2017

his status in the Unseelie Court takes precedence over the trifling bureaucratic titles given him by short-sighted mortal men anyway
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:53 PM on June 15, 2017 [48 favorites]

The "General" in Attorney General is indeed the adjectival form and not the noun.
posted by Justinian at 1:53 PM on June 15, 2017 [28 favorites]

"BleachBit" was the name of a security program used to decommision the "private server"; again, secure-wiping hard drives that might contain confidential data is standard practice.

that he continues to blather about a free, open source cross-platform file cleaner and once at a rally told people that 'bleaching emails' was an expensive endeavor that would be undertaken only if there were something to hide amuses and enrages me. it reflects his level of understanding most anything.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 1:54 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

Yeah, it seemed pretty obvious to me that the Rs on the committee were ever-so-subtly trying to conflate the office of Attorney General with that of a military general for the mouthbreathers back home—why call somebody an attorney (ewwww!) when you can call him a general (USA! USA! USA!)?
posted by Rykey at 1:54 PM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

He knows he got money from Russia and now he's starting to figure out that Mueller's team is going to find it.

Something that puts a smile on my face is knowing how sloppy he has been with covering his tracks his entire life and imagining alllll the people who will line up to throw him under the bus.
posted by C'est la D.C. at 1:54 PM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

Attorney General just means a general attorney, the attorney who is responsible for everything... attorneyish. Not a General in the military sense.
posted by BungaDunga at 1:54 PM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

If Sessions were the General of all Attorneys then a meeting of people with similar titles would be a meeting of Attorney Generals, not Attorneys General.
posted by Joe in Australia at 1:55 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

Bill Clinton pardoned a bunch of people on December 24, 1998, a week or so after the House voted to impeach him.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 1:56 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Are you guys tired of winning yet

Do you think Donald is tired of winning

It must be very tiring. The winning
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:57 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

Trump's Puerto Rican resort crashed and burned a couple of years back and Trump blamed Puerto Rico. Maybe that's shaping his policy.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 1:57 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

Trump's Puerto Rican resort crashed and burned a couple of years back

You need to add a [metaphorical] tag to distinguish this event from today's blimp.
posted by Faint of Butt at 2:00 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

Sarah Kliff is so damn done with this: I’ve covered Obamacare since day one. I’ve never seen lying and obstruction like this

These are people like 6-year-old Timmy Morrison, who lives in a city halfway between Washington and Baltimore. He was born premature with a rare genetic condition and has racked up $3 million in medical bills during his short life. If the Senate follows the House’s path, it would pass a bill allowing companies to once again place lifetime limits on health benefits — which would mean Timmy could run out of care.

His parents don’t know what they would do if that happens. “We don’t really know what to do right now,” his mother, Michelle Morrison, told me in February. “Should we start pressuring his doctors to do a surgery now so he can get it in time? That doesn’t feel right. Insurance is supposed to cover things that you can’t anticipate — and for us, this is one of them.”

Voters can oust Republicans in the 2018 midterm elections if they don’t like the health care plan. But for people like Cliff and Timmy, the damage will already be done. The election is secondary to their ability to get health insurance coverage. This is the most damaging part of the lack of public discourse around the Republican repeal efforts: There are millions of real lives at stake that could be hurt. These people would suffer the consequences that will happen much faster and matter much more than any election.

posted by zachlipton at 2:00 PM on June 15, 2017 [61 favorites]

his status in the Unseelie Court takes precedence over the trifling bureaucratic titles given him by short-sighted mortal men anyway

Coming soon to Fox News, Fae and Balanced with General Sessions
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:00 PM on June 15, 2017 [14 favorites]

2) "except in cases of impeachment." So clearly he can't pardon himself from impeachment. But does that also mean that, once the process of filing a motion of impeachment has begun, he is no longer allowed to pardon himself or possibly anyone at all? Courts will decide but I think that's a very reasonable reading.

I am not a law-talking guy but it sounds like this means that the president can pardon anyone who isn't getting impeached (afaik impeachment isn't just for presidents).
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 2:01 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

Hil's hands-on approach to murder is the main reason I voted for her.

yaasss slay queen!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:05 PM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

The really scary thing is that he's on message. This stuff is all off the talking points they put out last night.

Doubly scary in light of this Twitter thread from Jared Yates Sexton:

In the past few days my reporting has had me around more than a few Trump supporters, and what I've found has been surprising. 1/
Trump's supporters are getting their talking points straight from his tweets. They repeat them almost verbatim, share them like cards 2/
Fox News has been made largely obsolete as they're no longer a middleman for Right Wing info. It's Trump and InfoWars and online sources 3/
They're plugged in and way more attebtitive. It's no longer low-information, it's alternative information. 4/
And Trump's tweets against Comey and Mueller have sunk in and perfectly undermined any doubt. The dissonance is unshakable 5/
It's a relationship that has nothing to do with politics anymore. It's fandom, a personal relationship with a mascot. 6/
Trump's base won't leave him. There's no crossover. We'll have a generation or two totally dedicated regardless of what happens. 7/7
posted by Fish, fish, are you doing your duty? at 2:05 PM on June 15, 2017 [85 favorites]

Clearly he can't pardon himself from impeachment. But does that also mean that, once the process of filing a motion of

Post hoc, ergo propter hoc.
posted by clavdivs at 2:06 PM on June 15, 2017

Pence is lawyering up for the Russia investigation
posted by PenDevil at 2:08 PM on June 15, 2017 [49 favorites]

Pretty much any federal official can be impeached. The House has impeached 2 Presidents, a Secretary of War, a Senator, and a bunch of judges.

The Senate refused to accept the impeachment of a Senator in 1797 (the first impeachment of anyone!), but then expelled the guy anyway.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 2:10 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

Should have added: impeachment solely carries political punishment (removal from office and potentially disqualifying them from future office). Any further punishment voted out from the impeachment process would be a bill of attainder and is flatly prohibited in the Constitution. You would have to go back and try them in court to send anybody to jail.

Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.

posted by Huffy Puffy at 2:14 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

The younger ones will find someone else to crowd around, and that person will undoubtedly be scarier, but we'll cross that bridge when we get to it.

Certainly scarier, but probably also smarter, and this is what worries me.
posted by eclectist at 2:16 PM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Pence is lawyering up

My prediction: Pence will be the first to flip. I think he will cut a deal where he resigns and promises not to run for office again, in exchange for no charges against him, and of course his testimony.

My basis for this prediction is that 1) he is the least culpable of all of them, while most definitely still being culpable, and 2) I kind of get the impression that out of all of them he actually has some idea of just how stupid he is, and therefore is more likely to listen to his lawyers' advice.
posted by 1970s Antihero at 2:16 PM on June 15, 2017 [60 favorites]

Trump's supporters are getting their talking points straight from his tweets. They repeat them almost verbatim, share them like cards

Well, yeah. This has been clear for a long time, across countless debates and arguments with Trump supporters. There's no foundation for exploring inconsistencies in these settings. They simply believe everything they hear—hearing it from their source of choice (Donald Trump) is enough evidence for full acceptance as fact.

We're not in a place where we can debate anymore. Debate requires a willingness on both sides to critically look at anything stated as fact, question it, verify or poke holes in its veracity. In almost all of the arguments I've seen with Trump supporters, their starting point is, "You're simply wrong. Because Trump said so." There's not a lot of room to move in that scenario, as far as winning the hearts and minds of your opponents.
posted by Brak at 2:18 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

A non-exhaustive list of people who are not generals and should not be called "General." Nobody would call a Court Martial a "martial" or the Astronomer Royal a "Royal."

- Attorneys General [they are a general kind of attorney]
- Solicitors General
- Postmasters General
- Consuls General
- Comptrollers General [but even actual elected Comptrollers don't know how to pronounce it]
- Inspectors General
- Governors General
- Surgeons General [but, and this is the fun one, the current Surgeon General is a Rear Admiral; permanent ones are Vice Admirals afaik]

From the department of better news (not really good news, since this happened at all, but I'll take it), the Department of Commerce is going to reissue its equal employment policy after David Mack of BuzzFeed caught them conveniently omitting protection for LGBT employees.
posted by zachlipton at 2:21 PM on June 15, 2017 [19 favorites]

I'm willing to stipulate that maybe this particular former mayor would perhaps have offered a job to a homeless black guy on a bench, and that Alexandria isn't Alabama. But Alexandria has plenty of racism in its past, including a very recent incident where the town was papered with racist fliers.

Let's not forget that Richard Spencer's offices are in the heart of downtown Alexandria, right on Duke St. And its Alexandria where he was working out and confronted by that hero prof. And you don't get that many well-off old white folks - the people who can afford to stay in the more monied parts of Alexandria - without a non-negligible amount of racists.
posted by phearlez at 2:23 PM on June 15, 2017

My prediction: Pence will be the first to flip.

He is the least "Trumpy" of all the inner circle. Almost everyone else is either personally connected to Trump or a comic book villain.
posted by Glibpaxman at 2:23 PM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

I think he will cut a deal where he resigns and promises not to run for office again

Has such a deal ever been made? Serious question.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:23 PM on June 15, 2017

Yeah the allowable stat allocations don't seem to allow for anyone to both fully buy into scary alt-right bullshit and also be smart in any sort of well-rounded way. Like you have your dark enlightened tech/engineer types with 3 Charisma and people like Trump who know how to make emotional/gut-level appeals to certain types of people but are complete dumbshits. I like to think that people with real solidly functioning brains have better options in life than to fuck around in the Kek swamp.
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:26 PM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

Pence will be the first to flip. I think he will cut a deal where he resigns

First to flip, maybe. Resigns, lol, not on your life. He's this far away from being President. Why would he give that up?

he is the least culpable of all of them, while most definitely still being culpable

Which is precisely why he won't be impeached.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 2:26 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

Pence is implicated in all of it, there's no deal that could leave him in place as the next in line.
posted by T.D. Strange at 2:28 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

He's this far away from being President. Why would he give that up?

Does none among these people have even the slightest bit of impostor's syndrom?
posted by Namlit at 2:30 PM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

Trump pardons Pence, Trump Resigns, Pence pardons Trump, Pence Resigns, Do-Si-Do, Ryan to the Middle, Grab a New Partner, Under New Investigation, Repeat
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:31 PM on June 15, 2017 [24 favorites]

Does none among these people have even the slightest bit of impostor's syndrom?

Trump's DNA is currently being studied as the basis for a gene therapy to completely eliminate impostor syndrome
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:32 PM on June 15, 2017 [41 favorites]

I am willing to bet up to the princely sum of TEN UNITED STATES DOLLARS if anybody thinks Pence leaves office before January 2021 in any direction other than upwards.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 2:33 PM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

Trump pardons Pence, Trump Resigns, Pence pardons Trump, Pence Resigns, Do-Si-Do, Ryan to the Middle, Grab a New Partner, Under New Investigation, Repeat

Mueller gets Trump's taxes for the last 30 years. NY AG indicts Trump for state tax evasion. The president can't pardon state laws.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 2:33 PM on June 15, 2017 [36 favorites]

Does none among these people have even the slightest bit of impostor's syndrom?

No. It's Dunning-Kruger all the way through.
posted by Uncle Ira at 2:37 PM on June 15, 2017 [26 favorites]

I think he will cut a deal where he resigns and promises not to run for office again

Has such a deal ever been made? Serious question.

Baltimore mayor Sheila Dixon stole a bunch of gift cards that were meant to be distributed to poor families. As part of a deal she cut in order to preserve her pension, she agreed not to seek office for the length of her probation.
posted by vathek at 2:38 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Stealing gift cards meant for the needy? That's extra evil for its sheer pettiness. At least Trump decided to Go Big with his evil.
posted by Justinian at 2:42 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

The depths of slimy sneakiness that the GOP will plumb to pass a "healthcare" bill that 92% of the US opposes is breathtaking.

Have you been procrastinating calling your senators? Well, now is the time to call them. Tell Republicans that you want them to show us the bill. Tell Dems that you expect them to do everything possible to stop it.
posted by mcduff at 2:44 PM on June 15, 2017 [19 favorites]

"Spicey, in the third drawer down in the Resolute Desk there's a Stolichnaya gift card. I want it burned. The Aeroflot one too."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:45 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

My prediction: Pence will be the first to flip. [...] My basis for this prediction is that 1) he is the least culpable of all of them, while most definitely still being culpable, and 2) I kind of get the impression that out of all of them he actually has some idea of just how stupid he is, and therefore is more likely to listen to his lawyers' advice.

Another factor: Pence is not rich. This whole thing is going to be super expensive for him.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 2:47 PM on June 15, 2017 [35 favorites]

Obama offered to lend money to Joe Biden, maybe Trump could... you know what, never mind
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:48 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

A bombshell cache of documents today reveals the full story of a ring of death on British soil that the government has ignored.

The article PenDevil linked earlier legit frightens me. It's a long read, but it's worth it...if you don't mind adding yet another tick to the column labeled "FSM, Please Get Me and Mine Off This Goddamned Planet To Any of What Must Be A Nigh-Infinite Number of Better Worlds" on your scorecard.
posted by lord_wolf at 2:53 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

with real solidly functioning brains have better options in life than to fuck around in the Kek swamp.

This is a good excuse to share this:

Listen Up, Progressives: Here’s How to Deal with a 4Chan (“Alt-Right”) Troll by Seth Abramson

White supremacists use /pol/, 4chan, and 8chan to recruit new members; they have a captive (because internet-addicted) audience of confused young people who really just want to belong to something, and that’s fertile soil for “actual” neo-Nazi and KKK recruiters. And they know it.

So why don’t the disaffected (generally) young people on /pol/, 4chan, and 8chan care that they’re projecting themselves “erroneously” into the public sphere? Several reasons: (a) they sincerely believe they’re saving America from losing its unique sociocultural and jurisprudential elements; (b) they are so socially isolated that /pol/, 4chan, and 8chan become their “real” homes, where their “real” friends are
[...]
From this standpoint, these slurs are like self-harm, underage drug use, truancy, bullying, or running away from home: anti-social behavior that doubles as an oppositional identity-formation device.
[...]
they’re fundamentally unhappy young people whose subtle indoctrination into a cult is explainable by virtue of their juvenile anxiety, confusion, and pathological inability to assimilate into normative human culture. And those very human frailties will nevertheless end up destroying their lives in the long run. What began as a sort of lark — a performance of political resistance by generally entitled young people— will turn into, for many of them, either a lifetime of anti-social behavior and ostracization and/or successful recruitment by hate groups like the KKK.

Brutal, huh? But yeah, people with better options stay out of the Kek swamps... or if not, they don't have better options for long.
posted by OnceUponATime at 2:54 PM on June 15, 2017 [44 favorites]

The vice president’s office said Thursday that Pence has retained Richard Culle

Of course, because he can't be alone with a lady lawyer.
posted by Room 641-A at 2:59 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

I traced the Hillary and the murders thing out on Facebook, back, back, back until I came to a guy named Strelich. Just something to do when you are bored, and some exceedingly stupid shit, along with stupid shitstormers, show up in your Facebook. I am sure he wasn't a Russian, probably a what? A popcorn stringer somewhere with time on his hands.
posted by Oyéah at 3:02 PM on June 15, 2017

he actually has some idea of just how stupid he is, and therefore is more likely to listen to his lawyers' advice.

he is dumber than a box of bibles but he still hired himself a real lawyer, which Trump couldn't can't and can never do, because they all hate him. that's delightful. that Cullen sounds like a dick of some sort but he is absolutely a top lawyer with lawyering skills who makes Kasowitz look like the joke he is. my hope is that he is not good enough to get Pence off without severe suffering, but still good enough to make Trump furiously resentful that his terrible VP has a better lawyer than he does. like so, so much better.
posted by queenofbithynia at 3:09 PM on June 15, 2017 [28 favorites]

Mueller's team already has everything. That is the reality. Trump can't fire him fast enough. Read that article about the oligarchs and the murders on British soil. Read how Britain turned to US intelligence agencies again and again for facts about the connections that precipitated the murders. They had everything. Everything. They have everything right now. Trump can't fire enough people to make that go away.
posted by Oyéah at 3:11 PM on June 15, 2017 [25 favorites]

OnceUponATime: I remember commenting in the thread about the former South Korean President (Park Jeun-hye), now impeached, who was under the sway of a cult. I noted that cults prey upon the lonely and isolated (one reason they often target college freshmen). The chan boards and whatnot are, in effect, cults, who target lonely young men.

I would add that the oldsters sucked in by talk radio (see The Brainwashing Of My Dad by Jen Senko) are more of the same - socially and perhaps physically (in a small town or rural area) isolated; except that talk radio/Hannity on Fox are more older-person media, and chan and Reddit lean younger. But the end result is the same - people sucked in by malevolent cults.

As I've noted before, I don't think Americans are essentially, biologically stupider than people in other countries. But I think our culture, specifically the rah-rah-free-market ethos, means that conniving hucksters have a much bigger market here, due to the intrusion of money into politics and media. Rush Limbaugh, Roger Ailes/Fox, the Giant Cheeto, to name three, can create their own horrid cults by exploiting bigotry, sexism, and economic insecurity.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 3:14 PM on June 15, 2017 [43 favorites]

the current Surgeon General is a Rear Admiral; permanent ones are Vice Admirals afaik.

What a great trivia question: "What's the proper honorific to address a Surgeon General?" "Admiral."
posted by msalt at 3:18 PM on June 15, 2017 [13 favorites]

I worry that every American kid, sitting alone in front of a computer is being hunted by future handlers. Whether it is military games, or You Tuber's channels I worry about what our kids are being taught, by the great unknown. With the gaming machines cameras and microphones, folks can listen for when kids are finally alone, and it is a huge corpus of potential for thought installers. I have a young family member who has a huge body of knowledge that came out of this nowhere. Occasionally he clues me in to what he already knows.
posted by Oyéah at 3:21 PM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

>>I think he will cut a deal where he resigns and promises not to run for office again
>Has such a deal ever been made? Serious question.

It's pretty standard for indictable politicians to agree to resign in return for not being indicted. There's not usually a need or a mechanism to enforce not running again, because they are already disgraced and the prosecutor generally keeps the right to file charges later, but the deal is implicit.

A counter example is Justice Roy Moore in Alabama, who was impeached but later ran again. And won, and was again suspended without pay for the remainder of his term, at which point he resigned (but AFAIK could run again.) He also ran for governor twice, and president once, and when he recently resigned, he simultaneously announced his candidacy for the Senate.
posted by msalt at 3:25 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

Where's Jared?
posted by Room 641-A at 3:28 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

When things get tough and prosecutors close in, Jared goes skiing.
posted by T.D. Strange at 3:34 PM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

Where's Jared?

Any chance he's already flipped? Because that would be *kisses fingers*
posted by Fish, fish, are you doing your duty? at 3:35 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

Let's not forget that Richard Spencer's offices are in the heart of downtown Alexandria, right on Duke St. And its Alexandria where he was working out and confronted by that hero prof. And you don't get that many well-off old white folks - the people who can afford to stay in the more monied parts of Alexandria - without a non-negligible amount of racists.

This is a weird thing to say. Alexandria is also the headquarters of NARAL, the National Society of Black Engineers, the International Wood Products Association, and several hundred other groups; it's one of the places that anyone with aspirations of political influence wants to set up shop. And there was a huge outcry when Spencer's group moved in from locals who wanted to make it clear this group's message was not compatible with the community's values.

But most importantly, every community in America has a non-negligible amount of racists. Of the various places I've lived in my life, Alexandria remains the most inclusive, but of course there are racists there. So the implication that Alexandria has a race problem that is somehow worse than the rest of America, or that it is somehow unusually tolerant of crazed white men with guns, is both bizarre and kind of offensive to me.

So much of the defense of my hometown, I'll leave the derail there.
posted by biogeo at 3:36 PM on June 15, 2017 [36 favorites]

Daily Beast: Team Trump: Oval Office Tapes? Talk to My Lawyer

In recent months, it has become a running joke in the Trump White House that the phrase most commonly uttered during press briefings is, “The tweet speaks for itself.” Now, it appears that “I would refer you to outside counsel” is giving the former phrase a run for its money.

The White House is now referring inquiries about the existence, or nonexistence, of recording devices in the Oval Office to President Donald Trump’s personal attorney—thus expanding the purview and portfolio of the embattled president’s outside legal team.

Why do we pay the Communications Office government salaries so they can questions about government business to private lawyers?
posted by zachlipton at 3:43 PM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

my hope is that he is not good enough to get Pence off without severe suffering

Phrasing!
posted by shponglespore at 3:46 PM on June 15, 2017 [49 favorites]

The Hill: "I'm at the point where we also have to be real careful from the standpoint that we have a president that's not from the political class," Rep. Schweikert (R-AZ) said on NPR's "Morning Edition."

"The learning of the disciplined use of language and what certain words mean in our context — if you're not from this world, you may not have developed that discipline," he added.

Guys you are all being very classist. Trump was not born into wealth and privilege. You cannot expect a regular guy from Queens to know that you aren't allowed to tell everyone else to leave the room and then order the FBI director to stop an investigation and then fire him when he says no on the explicit basis that you were unhappy with his continued investigating. That's not how it works "in da hood", as Mr Trump would say.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94

I've been out driving and there was a bit of Trump speaking on the radio, and suddenly it came to me that his folksy style of speaking makes no sense at all, it's as fake as the rest of him. A person with his background, going to private schools and to college would never speak like that. At the very least, his Mom wouldn't have let him, but neither would anyone at any of those schools.
When we have these endless discussions on wether he is demented, some people point to the (semi-) coherent speech one can see in old clips with him. You know, where he just looks and sounds like that insufferable jock who tormented you in high school, not like a demented evil old petty crook. While he may be suffering from dementia, another possibility that is very consistent with everything else Trump is that it is an act. Not like in that old SNL sketch where Reagan is actually a smart political mover, but like how con-men and street hustlers pretend to be folksy and a little dim while they empty your pockets and your bank account. Well it was just a thought.
But to test that thought, I went looking for videos of his siblings to get an idea of how they were actually speaking in his family. And I thought this example was fun in many ways: Trump's Sister, Judge Maryanne Trump Barry, Talks Criminal Trials

On afterthought. If he were demented, wouldn't he regress to his childhood upperclass sociolect?
posted by mumimor at 3:59 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

Jim Manley, who extremely knows what he's talking about when it comes to Senate procedure (even if he can't thread his tweets properly) predicts that we could see the Senate initially provide a CBO score on the budgetary effects of their health care bill, but not one that details the effects on coverage numbers and premiums. They'd wave around a piece of paper that says "yay, we saved $200 billion" or whatever, and pretend everyone will still be covered because they have no numbers.
posted by zachlipton at 4:01 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

Politico: White House aides fret over Trump’s Russia probe obsession

Trump, for months, has bristled almost daily at the ongoing probes. He has sometimes, without prompting, injected “I’m not under investigation” into conversations with associates and allies. He has watched hours of TV coverage every day — sometimes even storing morning news shows on his TiVo to watch in the evening — and complained nonstop.

thisisfine.gif

In other news, The Daily Show is opening a weekend exhibition of Trump's Presidential Library near Trump Tower. It features his tweets and predictions.
posted by zachlipton at 4:15 PM on June 15, 2017 [26 favorites]

a person with his background, going to private schools and to college would never speak like that.

See also GW Bush and his fake Texas rancher schtick.
posted by NorthernLite at 4:17 PM on June 15, 2017 [21 favorites]

Has anybody compiled a list of places where Trump hasn't been able to open properties? I feel like that would be useful for anticipating the rest of his foreign policy.

Oh shit we're going to invade Atlantic City.

Worse.

We are going to become Atlantic City.
posted by srboisvert at 4:17 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

This is a good excuse to share this:

Listen Up, Progressives: Here’s How to Deal with a 4Chan (“Alt-Right”) Troll by Seth Abramson

I hadn't seen this, but IMO it's one of the most insightful and lucid explanations of all this chan culture shit that I've read so far. Everybody should take a look at it. I'm not sure I fully buy into his prescriptive suggestions for how to engage with it, but up to that point it's great.
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:18 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Where's Jared?

Found him! WaPo: Special counsel is investigating Jared Kushner’s business dealings

Special Counsel Robert S. Mueller is investigating the finances and business dealings of Jared Kushner, President Trump’s son-in-law and adviser, as part of the probe into Russia’s interference in the 2016 presidential election, according to officials familiar with the matter.

FBI agents and federal prosecutors have also been examining the financial dealings of other Trump associates, including former national security adviser Michael Flynn, former campaign chairman Paul Manafort and Carter Page, who was listed as a foreign policy adviser for the campaign.

We regret the tardiness of scoop o'clock tonight, but hope the deliciousness of the scoop makes up for it.
posted by zachlipton at 4:19 PM on June 15, 2017 [62 favorites]

"The White House staff makes a beautiful meatloaf, and, by the way, I'm not under investigation, and you should try the soft baked chocolate cookies for desert"

[fake]
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:19 PM on June 15, 2017

Austrian Federal Chancellor Christian Kern (SPÖ) and German Foreign Minister Sigmar Gabriel (SPD) commented as follows today (15 June) on the approval by the United States Senate of legislation regarding sanctions against Russia:

...

It is in the common interest of the EU and the US to take resolute and unified action with a view to resolving the conflict in Ukraine.

We cannot, however, accept the threat of illegal extraterritorial sanctions being imposed on European companies that are participating in efforts to expand Europe’s energy supply network!

The draft bill of the US is surprisingly candid about what is actually at stake, namely selling American liquefied natural gas and ending the supply of Russian natural gas to the European market. The bill aims to protect US jobs in the natural gas and petroleum industries.

...

It would not only be highly regrettable, but would also diminish the effectiveness of our stance on the conflict in Ukraine, if we were to no longer take joint action, and if completely separate interests were to prevail, such as the US’s economic pursuits in the field of gas exports. Foreign policy interests must in no way be linked to economic interests! There is still enough time, and opportunity, to prevent this!

posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 4:19 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

He has sometimes, without prompting, injected “I’m not under investigation” into conversations with associates and allies.

my only satisfaction these days is that the sonofabitch is losing as much sleep as i am
posted by murphy slaw at 4:20 PM on June 15, 2017 [32 favorites]

Might Trump also be permanently on the hook for any state crimes committed outside of DC, such as at Trump Tower or Mar-A-Lago?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:48 PM on June 15

Was Nixon forced to testify under oath after he was pardoned?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:49 PM

I think he [Pence] will cut a deal where he resigns and promises not to run for office again

Has such a deal ever been made? Serious question.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:23 PM

Interesting questions all. I was dying to answer them at the gym but it is hard to type on an elliptical.

1) Trump can only pardon Federal crimes just as Governors can only pardon state crimes. So conceivably after all of the other stuff goes to court (or maybe instead of) Trump and no doubt Jared can be tried for crimes committed in NY State.

2) I don't know how much you know about Watergate but while Nixon was still in office a grand jury was convened to indict the "Watergate 7" and Nixon was named as a co-conspirator but not indicted because he was a sitting President. That was not a legal ruling, just a so-called norm. However once the White tapes were released and 18 minutes were missing from the tapes Nixon was forced to give secret testimony to the grand jury as to what the missing minutes consisted of.

After the tapes were released (an issue that was decided by the Supreme Court) everyone had transcripts and public opinon turned against him. Part of that may have been due to his vulgarity (shades of Trump.) Impeachment hearings were more or less forced on the House by the public's outrage but Congress allowed Nixon to walk away scott-free once he resigned. He was never tried for anything nor did he appear in court after leaving the Presidency.

By the way, 69 government officials were eventually charged with an array of crimes and 48 people were found guilty. G. Gordon Liddy ended up serving the longest sentence, 4.5 years in Federal prison, as he was considered the mastermind behind the original break-in at the DNC headquarters at the Watergate Hotel. He got out and became a D-list celebrity, writing books and appearing in TV shows.

The person who got off very lightly in my opinion was VP Agnew. He resigned before all this happened because it was discovered he had taken bribes while Governor of Maryland. He plead no contest to tax evasion on condition of resigning his office. He paid a small fine but essentially got away with the crime.

3.) I don't know who Pence could make such a deal with or how it would be enforced. The GOP? Paul Ryan? The American Public? It's been done before but only in the case of a condition attached as part of sentencing deal by a judge.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:23 PM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

The President of the United States is being investigated for a felony, and his primary defense seems to be to loudly claim that his former electoral opponent, who has never been President of the United States, also committed felonies, and to complain how unfair it is that she is no longer being investigated, by his own Department of Justice.

Year of our Lord Twenty-Seventeen!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:23 PM on June 15, 2017 [56 favorites]

"The White House staff makes a beautiful meatloaf, and, by the way, I'm not under investigation, and you should try the soft baked chocolate cookies for desert"

"But only one cookie. The President gets two."
posted by Etrigan at 4:23 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

I've been out driving and there was a bit of Trump speaking on the radio, and suddenly it came to me that his folksy style of speaking makes no sense at all, it's as fake as the rest of him. A person with his background, going to private schools and to college would never speak like that. At the very least, his Mom wouldn't have let him, but neither would anyone at any of those schools.

So, here's another theory. I am neither saying it's true or not. I definitely do not know.

Per Wikipedia, Trump's dad died in 1999 and mom died in 2000. Does his changing behavior and language map to around that time? Like mumimor said, his mother wouldn't let him talk that way. Maybe he finally felt free to act/talk the way he wanted to all his life, but couldn't because he still had to cow to his parents? Still had to please them?

I'm definitely not saying that his current political views are different than his parent's were. But, for some reason, he thought he had to show as a liberal while they were alive because his parent's said, "Yeah, we don't believe in this, but you say and do these things because that's how you make money in this day and age."

I am sure I could express this a lot better, but I hope y'all see the point I'm trying to make. I know someone who said the most liberating moment (once all the grieving was done, etc.) was when his dad passed away. He finally felt like "his own" man.

Food for thought.
posted by a non mouse, a cow herd at 4:29 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

hey folks, remember 300 years ago when intersectional traitor milo wharrgarbl was going to write a book? buzzfeed got a leaked draft!

in a shocking development, it is bad.
posted by murphy slaw at 4:30 PM on June 15, 2017 [20 favorites]

, and suddenly it came to me that his folksy style of speaking makes no sense at all, it's as fake as the rest of him

Surely it's a consequence of his association with Roy Cohn, the New York/New Jersey underworld, and his desire to be a Tough Guy from Queens (instead of a pampered rich kid from Jamaica Estates). I think it's gotten more exagerrated as he's gotten older but if you watch documentaries about Trump's early years he's got a similar, if more coherent, speaking style.
posted by dis_integration at 4:34 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

> his status in the Unseelie Court takes precedence over the trifling bureaucratic titles given him by short-sighted mortal men anyway

So, Mueller is going to turn up evidence that Sessions is an agent for the Gentleman with Thistle-Down Hair? Wait, is Kislyak the GwTDH?! That would explain why no one remembers meeting him.
posted by Fiberoptic Zebroid and The Hypnagogic Jerks at 4:36 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Every day the various members of the Trump clan sit down for dinner, and every time they first start to bring the golden fork to their mouth an aide rushes in to say they might want to check the Post or the Times or CNN. Or all three.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:36 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

I hadn't seen this, but IMO it's one of the most insightful and lucid explanations of all this chan culture shit that I've read so far. Everybody should take a look at it. I'm not sure I fully buy into his prescriptive suggestions for how to engage with it, but up to that point it's great.

It really is a great read - and like you, I'm lukewarm on the suggested tactics for engaging. Another thing that leapt out at me is the author extending a bit too much benefit of the doubt towards the alt-right's supposed view that they're fighting for America with this behavior, that it's about first amendment rights - really they're just throwing tantrums at the idea that any of their behavior could have consequences. But other than those two things it's a fascinating read.
posted by jason_steakums at 4:38 PM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

The "General" in Attorney General is indeed the adjectival form and not the noun.
So's the military rank. General [officer], Company-grade officer, Field-grade officer.
posted by ctmf at 4:39 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

By the way, why isn't the New York Observer getting any of these scoops? Lazy!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:40 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

i'm gonna have to drink more coffee if i want to scoop zachlipton
posted by murphy slaw at 4:41 PM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

From Buzzfeed's book review

The book draft is organized by sections named for groups of people Yiannopoulos claims hate him. They include “Why Other Gay People Hate Me,” “Why Feminists Hate Me,” “Why Muslims Hate Me,” “Why Black Lives Matter Hates Me,” “Why Ugly People Hate Me,” “Why the Media Hates Me,” “Why Twitter Hates Me,” and “Why Establishment Republicans Hate Me.” (An Instagram of a more recent draft shows that Yiannopoulos has removed the “Ugly People” section.) Each of these sections features enough arch name-calling to astonish a sorority and will shock precisely no one who has been on the internet in the past three years.

The draft features a set of arguments that are set on repeat, like a player piano: Women are dumber than men, black people and Muslims are more violent than whites, fat people have no willpower, Milo has a better sense of humor than the gay establishment, and so on

Or you could just read old Breitbart issues.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:41 PM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

I went looking for videos of his siblings to get an idea of how they were actually speaking in his family. And I thought this example was fun in many ways

this is kind of unfair. it is possible for a woman to be reasonably intelligent and considerably educated and still have a brother who's a fucking idiot. some would say it is common. it is also possible and even common for a woman to abandon her grotesque family culture and make a concerted and successful effort, with the aid of education and training, to come across like a person. just, you know, a person, like a person you might know.

not to personalize or anything. or to speak more highly of his sister than she deserves, I think her politics are pretty bad. but don't credit him with the capacity for any of her intelligence or nice manners or fancy pronunciation and diction by association, please. he hasn't earned it.

(but yes, it is a fun example)
posted by queenofbithynia at 4:41 PM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

From the WaPo article about Kushner

Kushner rarely speaks publicly about role in the White House, but he has become a major figure in the administration with a sprawling list of policy responsibilities that includes Canada and Mexico, China, and peace in the Middle East.

I still have yet to hear him speak. Has anyone? I'm hoping for a public hearing by the Senate Intel Com just so I can see how he responds to questions.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:45 PM on June 15, 2017 [17 favorites]

I'm sure it will be a great self publish success story and his legal case will go well too.
posted by Artw at 4:50 PM on June 15, 2017

I've been out driving and there was a bit of Trump speaking on the radio, and suddenly it came to me that his folksy style of speaking makes no sense at all, it's as fake as the rest of him. A person with his background, going to private schools and to college would never speak like that. At the very least, his Mom wouldn't have let him, but neither would anyone at any of those schools.

I grew up in (a middle- to upper-middle class mostly blue collar corner of) Northern NJ and his accent sounds *almost* plausible to me. I hear traces of that same accent in the video you posted; to my eyes and ears his sister is doing her level best to sand down her vowels and cadence to Standard American English (SAE), but it's there. (Listen for "you," "find," and "all" in the first minute.) And anecdatally, I attended a private high school and a fancy college and in spite of my best efforts still have a slight NJ accent which continues to drive my mom nuts.

But I say *almost* plausible because I suspect he used to engage in some code-switching back when he was splitting his time between trying to pass as a Manhattan socialite and doing business with mobsters. Pronunciation and cadence for the former would be closer to SAE; for the latter more like the way he talks now, clipped and cocky, with those "fuhgeddaboutit"-type elisions between phonemes. To my ear it sounds like he quit code-switching, but in a way that settled into some kind of linguistic uncanny valley between the socialite and mobster modes. Like he got lazy, settled into the mode that validated his delusions of tough-guy-ness, and the mask became his speech pattern. It kinda makes sense that it would work on a bunch of people conditioned to root for mobsters in entertainment.

Any real linguists here who would care to weigh in?
posted by Fish, fish, are you doing your duty? at 4:52 PM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

I still have yet to hear him speak. Has anyone? I'm hoping for a public hearing by the Senate Intel Com just so I can see how he responds to questions.

I would describe his speaking voice as Distilled New Jersey Millenial.
posted by dis_integration at 4:52 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

I still have yet to hear him speak. Has anyone?

And above the Beast I beheld aloft a pale youth clad in armor of green and a visor of black, and when I saw the mouth of the youth open there came a great screeching, and I was much afraid. (Revelation 4:12-18)
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 4:54 PM on June 15, 2017 [23 favorites]

A few minutes of Kushner talkin' NYC real estate. Generic (maybe northeast) millennial for sure, pronounces probably as "prolly" and really as "rilly" and says them a lot.
posted by Rust Moranis at 4:56 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

He's got enough vocal fry to cook Trump dinner, that's for sure.
posted by dis_integration at 4:59 PM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Should have added: impeachment solely carries political punishment (removal from office and potentially disqualifying them from future office).

He also loses all benefits he would otherwise get under the Former Presidents Act including his pension, health insurance & lifetime Secret Service protection. If he's removed from power under the 25th Amendment though, he gets to keep all that; the FPA specifies you have to be impeached & convicted to lose your FPA benefits:

(f) As used in this section, the term “former President” means a person--

(1) who shall have held the office of President of the United States of America;

(2) whose service in such office shall have terminated other than by removal pursuant to section 4 of article II of the Constitution of the United States of America; and

(3) who does not then currently hold such office.

posted by scalefree at 5:00 PM on June 15, 2017

in a shocking development, it is bad.

But it's offensively bad, which is free speech. Why do you hate free speech? So much for the tolerant left!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:00 PM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

The "General" in Attorney General is indeed the adjectival form and not the noun.
So's the military rank. General [officer], Company-grade officer, Field-grade officer.

It is a noun in the ranks themselves (in American military usage, at least):
Generals (four-star)
Lieutenant Generals (three-star)
Major Generals (two-star)
Brigadier Generals (one-star)

But they all come from adjectival roots in old British rank structures:
Generals were Captains-General
Lieutenant Generals were Lieutenants-General
Major Generals were Sergeants-Major-General (note: this is why Lieutenant Generals outrank Major Generals, while Majors outrank Lieutenants)
Brigadier Generals were Brigadiers (not -General)
posted by Etrigan at 5:01 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

I want to see someone make a trailer for "Hammer and Bleach," a 1980s TV detective show starring James "Hammer" Comey and Hillary "Bleach" Clinton, two hard-bitten detectives who don't get along, but work together to track down foreign influence and corruption in government.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 5:04 PM on June 15, 2017 [47 favorites]

It's a relationship that has nothing to do with politics anymore. It's fandom, a personal relationship with a mascot. Trump's base won't leave him.

While this is scary on a "how stupid can humans be" level, politically I dont think it's a huge issue. I'll bet there's a pretty high percentage overlap between that group and the "Obama is a Muslim" group and you just write them off. In practical terms, there's really only a few people in a small number of states that you need to swing. Remember, HRC won the popular vote. A slightly different distribution of those votes would have made all there difference.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 5:17 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

The book draft is organized by sections named for groups of people Yiannopoulos claims hate him. They include “Why Other Gay People Hate Me,” “Why Feminists Hate Me,” “Why Muslims Hate Me,”

and the list goes on.

He was completely off my radar until he got kicked off Twitter and the woe-is-me act. Someone did a profile of him around when that happened and around the RNC convention.

Why do people hate you, Milo? You are a jerk to everyone you come in contact with.

He's a troll.

I'll go out on a limb and say there is a good kind of troll. One that can be on twitter, say, and really get inside of another users argument/mindspace and make that user just.... explode and prove the trolled person is basing their conclusion on inaccurate facts, deceiving people, etc.

I'll admit to trolling myself. I have a friend who gets an e-card every day saying happy birthday and it's always from someone else. But, that's "we tease, because we love."

When one pretty much writes a book about all the people that hate them? That's the most ineffective kind of troll. The one that is literally hated by everyone, because he is a jerk.

I'm looking forward to next week when people say, "Milo who? Oh, yeah. Jerk who thought he could sell a book." And then next year, "Milo who? He did what? He tried to make a book out of being an ass? Surely, we have something better to talk about."
posted by a non mouse, a cow herd at 5:19 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

I want to see someone make a trailer for "Hammer and Bleach," a 1980s TV detective show starring James "Hammer" Comey and Hillary "Bleach" Clinton, two hard-bitten detectives who don't get along, but work together to track down foreign influence and corruption in government.

COMEY: What is the "Kingdom of Saudi Arabia"? ...
HILLARY: Whoops! Hey, we've worked hard enough! Why don't we call it a day and grab a drink?
posted by indubitable at 5:20 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

I want to see someone make a trailer for "Hammer and Bleach," a 1980s TV detective show starring James "Hammer" Comey and Hillary "Bleach" Clinton, two hard-bitten detectives who don't get along, but work together to track down foreign influence and corruption in government.

Hammer: (mildly nauseously) Don't you die on me, Bleach!
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:21 PM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Major Generals were Sergeants-Major-General

Adjectival double trouble!
posted by kirkaracha at 5:24 PM on June 15, 2017

I'm confused now. Which one is the major model of the modern Major General?
posted by biogeo at 5:25 PM on June 15, 2017 [25 favorites]

Just what this administration needs: to be set to the music of Gilbert and Sullivan.
posted by Sublimity at 5:27 PM on June 15, 2017 [14 favorites]

White House aides fret over Trump’s Russia probe obsession.

He has sometimes, without prompting, injected “I’m not under investigation” into conversations with associates and allies."

Me either. That's a duck molester there, that is.
posted by delfin at 5:35 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

COMEY: What is the "Kingdom of Saudi Arabia"? ...
HILLARY: Whoops! Hey, we've worked hard enough! Why don't we call it a day and grab a drink?

Don't leave me hanging 'dub. Do they bring in Jon Ossoff at the end of the show?
posted by octobersurprise at 5:40 PM on June 15, 2017

I would describe his speaking voice as Distilled New Jersey Millenial.

dang i was hoping he talked like the squeaky-voiced teen from the simpsons

that would be some riveting testimony

"they said if i didn't meet with the russian ambassador they were gonna deep-fry my hand!"
posted by murphy slaw at 5:46 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

“The tweet speaks for itself.”

Twit ipsa loquitur?
posted by notsnot at 5:49 PM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

Just what this administration needs: to be set to the music of Gilbert and Sullivan.

Three little assets of Russia are we
Corrupt as a lobbyist well can be
Filled to the brim with Russia financial ties
Three little assets of Russia
posted by Talez at 5:52 PM on June 15, 2017 [16 favorites]

I dunno about you guys but if somebody just randomly said to me, "I absolutely don't have sex with chickens" I totally wouldn't think they have sex with chickens.
posted by Justinian at 8:28 PM on June 15

Me either. That's a duck molester there, that is.
posted by delfin at 8:35 PM on June 15

OK, having just learned about the ghastly "delicacy" that is the Ortolan, these jokes are taking on an added air of creepiness for me.
posted by CommonSense at 5:53 PM on June 15, 2017

dang i was hoping he talked like the squeaky-voiced teen from the simpsons

!!!! that is exactly exactly exactly what I pictured with my ears but I couldn't think of what that voice was called or even remember whether it was a simpsons or a futurama character. but that is what Kushner sounds like no matter what the tapes may claim. it's a fact.
posted by queenofbithynia at 5:53 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

@Scott Dworkin Q: Why do u think gay parents aren't as legitimate as hetero parents? Karen Handel: Because I don't.

Link goes to video clip. That's Karen Handel, the Rep. opposition to Jon Ossoff in the Georgia 06 Race.

She's the dream Republican package: Hates the gays, doesn't think the minimum wage should be a living wage, and doesn't think government should ensure healthcare coverage for all Americans.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:56 PM on June 15, 2017 [16 favorites]

OK, having just learned about the ghastly "delicacy" that is the Ortolan, these jokes are taking on an added air of creepiness for me.

when you're makin love to a yard-bird you need something a lot bigger than a napkin to hide from the eyes of god
posted by murphy slaw at 5:57 PM on June 15, 2017 [29 favorites]

She's the dream Republican package: Hates the gays, doesn't think the minimum wage should be a living wage, and doesn't think government should ensure healthcare coverage for all Americans.

REPUBLICANS STAND FOR FREEDOM [to die in a ditch]!
posted by Talez at 5:58 PM on June 15, 2017

I dunno about you guys but if somebody just randomly said to me, "I absolutely don't have sex with chickens" I totally wouldn't think they have sex with chickens.

Hens! I only sleep with Hens!

And there is not a lot of sleeping involved, ifyouknowhatimean
posted by a non mouse, a cow herd at 6:09 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

I'm not really sure about Blue Dot Daily or Scott Dworkin but this might be of interest:

Blue Dot Daily 400 Trump Docs Leaked: Russian Money Tied to McConnell, Cruz, Rubio, McCain, and RNC

Democratic Coalition co-founder Scott Dworkin recently released over 400 legally obtained Trump documents. After sifting through them, Dworkin has put together a money trail using the documents that ties Russian money to several top Republican leaders.

The information therein is quite damning for the GOP stalwarts involved, and also further paints an incriminating picture of the Trump administration as related to possible Russian collusion.

Those who aren’t coming out of this looking good include the entire Republican National Committee, Senator Ted Cruz, Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker, Senator John McCain, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, among others.

It's mostly stuff like: "A Mitch McConnell super PAC took $2.5 million from a pro-Putin Ukrainian businessman last election cycle" and "Marco Rubio took $1,000,000 from pro-Putin Ukrainian businessman – last election cycle" with documentation. Too much of the information seems obscure to me. Is Chris Van Riet, a "Russian Real Estate Agent" born in Houston but with offices in Russia necessarily a "Russian tie"? Does that mean his money is dirty? Why is he donating to McCain and Cruz and the RNC?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:10 PM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

Well McCain certainly had ties to Russia and the Trump admin, and an office in Russia IS in Russia, so... yeah? They are all to some degree dirty?
posted by Artw at 6:17 PM on June 15, 2017

Curious to hear from somebody more knowledgeable about foreign affairs than I am on Bernie Sanders' vote against the russian sanctions.

He and Rand Paul were the only two to vote against. Sanders said the below, which seems to me like an outside concern, and one that is addressable through other means, but like I say-- interested to hear from people who know more about the matter:

"I am strongly supportive of the sanctions on Russia included in this bill. It is unacceptable for Russia to interfere in our elections here in the United States, or anywhere around the world. There must be consequences for such actions. I also have deep concerns about the policies and activities of the Iranian government, especially their support for the brutal Assad regime in Syria. I have voted for sanctions on Iran in the past, and I believe sanctions were an important tool for bringing Iran to the negotiating table. But I believe that these new sanctions could endanger the very important nuclear agreement that was signed between the United States, its partners and Iran in 2015. That is not a risk worth taking, particularly at a time of heightened tension between Iran and Saudi Arabia and its allies. I think the United States must play a more even-handed role in the Middle East, and find ways to address not only Iran's activities, but also Saudi Arabia's decades-long support for radical extremism."
posted by mrmurbles at 6:19 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

Those who aren’t coming out of this looking good include the entire Republican National Committee, Senator Ted Cruz, Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker,

Ohplease ohplease ohplease
posted by Room 641-A at 6:21 PM on June 15, 2017 [32 favorites]

Some more Gilbert and Sullivan ideas:

When a Trumper's not engaged in his collusion (a special counsel's lot is not a happy one)
With cat-like tread, upon our EPA we steal
"Mueller, unrequited, robs me of my rest"
When all night long a press secretary remains (in the bushes)
When Ryan really ruled the waves (it's a song about the House of Lords doing nothing, get it?)
"As some day it may happen that a scapegoat must be found, He's got a little list — I've got a little list. Of many White House staffers who trash talk on background, And who never would be missed — who never would be missed!"
"I hosted up that TV show so carefullee That now I am the Ruler of the GOP!"
"I am the monarch USA, The ruler of the GOP. Whose electoral votes America loudly chants. And we are his sons, and his daughter, and his finance!"
For he's gone and tweeted once more

I fear the irony of transforming a body of works about duty into the story about a man who has absolutely no sense of that concept may be too much to bear though.

And this Congressional baseball game tweet is amazing: Oh my god. Ted Cruz just came to shake hands with a group of HS interns, and one of them turned to his friend and said "the Zodiac killer!"
posted by zachlipton at 6:23 PM on June 15, 2017 [27 favorites]

I'm confused now. Which one is the major model of the modern Major General?

The venerated Virginian veteran whose men are all
Lining up, to put him up on a pedestal
Writin’ letters to relatives
Embellishin’ his elegance and eloquence
posted by entropicamericana at 6:25 PM on June 15, 2017 [16 favorites]

You guise, the Prez wants a word: YouTube

It's an intro to the ball game, but he's a bit over-emphatic. Blah blah showing the world that we will not be intimidated by threats, acts of violence, or assaults on our Democracy. THE GAME WILL GO ON. blah blah In Washington we have our disagreements but we all agree that we are here to serve this nation we love and the people who call it home* blah blah I leave you with three great AMERICAN words that for generations have torn down barriers, built bridges of unity, and defied those who have sought to pull us apart: LADIES AND GENTLEMEN LET"S PLAY BALL.

*Some exceptions may apply, consult your local ICE office.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:26 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

That feel when Trump wants a word, but you know what he did to the last guy that gave him their phone number.
posted by Yowser at 6:31 PM on June 15, 2017

Sarah Kendzior Trump is reportedly under investigation. Does that signal his end? Not so fast

But does this mean Mr. Trump’s reign is reaching its end? Not so fast. It is possible that the President will fire Mr. Mueller, much as he fired Mr. Comey, even though this will be perceived as further admission of guilt and possibly open up yet another obstruction of justice investigation.

Pundits who speculate that the optics of this decision will hold Mr. Trump back are still mired in the presumption that the President respects democratic norms and rule of law, which he does not. The optics Mr. Trump favours are those of an autocrat: blatant demonstrations of power that proclaim, “We know that you know what we did, and there’s nothing you can do about it.”

In other words, Mr. Trump does not care if firing Mr. Mueller makes him look guilty, as long as he continues to get away with his crimes.

And her closing sums up exactly what I've been thinking

He will never admit to destroying himself; he will destroy everything else in his path first to avoid recrimination. That shamelessness, that blatant disregard for either norms or laws, spells dark times ahead.

posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:35 PM on June 15, 2017 [29 favorites]

Remember Semyon Mogilevich and his ties to the Trump Organization that we've discussed on the Blue previously? It turns out the Mueller investigation's interested in him, particularly one team member.

What Does Robert Mueller's Team Tell Us about the Russia Investigation?

One of the more recent recruits is reported to be Lisa Page, a justice department trial attorney with a substantial record of investigating Russian and former Soviet organised crime and in particular its reputed godfather, Semion Mogilevich.

Mogilevich associates are reported to have owned condos in Trump Tower in New York, and the father of Trump’s business partner in the Trump Soho hotel, Felix Sater, was a Mogilevich lieutenant.

“This pick really shows that Mueller recognises that Russian organised crime and sophisticated financial transactions involving them are going to be right at the centre and Page is definitely a leading expert there,” said Scott Horton, a US lawyer with experience of working in eastern Europe and the former Soviet Union.

Wonder if she'll bring up assassinated mafiya figure Vyacheslav "Yaponchick" Ivankov, Mogilevich’s lieutenant in the US and one-time resident of Trump Tower (who reportedly had in his personal phone book the private telephone and fax numbers for the Trump Organization’s office in that building)?
posted by Doktor Zed at 6:35 PM on June 15, 2017 [17 favorites]

SESSIONS: I never had contacts with lobbyists working for the Russians.

Lobbyist for Russian interests says he attended dinners hosted by Sessions

An American lobbyist for Russian interests who helped craft an important foreign policy speech for Donald Trump has confirmed that he attended two dinners hosted by Jeff Sessions during the 2016 campaign, apparently contradicting the attorney general’s sworn testimony given this week.

posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 6:36 PM on June 15, 2017 [13 favorites]

Deputy Attorney Rosenstein just released a statement (twitter link) warning people not to accept as true any stories that are sourced by anonymous officials, particularly when they do not identify the country.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:39 PM on June 15, 2017 [16 favorites]

Well, this is a good omen. The Democrats just beat the Republicans 11-2 in the Congressional Baseball Game.

Deputy Attorney Rosenstein just released a statement (twitter link) warning people not to accept as true any stories that are sourced by anonymous officials, particularly when they do not identify the country.

This statement is so bananas, I have to assume it is the result of many angry phone calls from Trump. How does Rosenstein not recuse himself? He's a material witness to obstruction, if he's not implicated himself, thanks to the Comey memo.
posted by zachlipton at 6:42 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Did I miss something? I'm probably more informed on whats going on with these investigations than 99.5% of the country and I have no idea what Rosenstein is on about.
posted by Justinian at 6:42 PM on June 15, 2017 [14 favorites]

Uh oh, this sounds like a really bad idea:

Politico Rattled by shooting, lawmakers want more personal protection

The gamut of options includes new rules ramping up the law enforcement presence at big group events with lawmakers, equipping Capitol Police with more advanced weapons, and allowing individual members to spend taxpayer or campaign dollars on personal security measures.

And several GOP lawmakers want the green light to bring their personal firearms onto the Capitol grounds, a move that immediately alarmed Democrats who favor tougher gun restrictions.

posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:42 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

> Deputy Attorney Rosenstein just released a statement (twitter link) warning people not to accept as true any stories that are sourced by anonymous officials, particularly when they do not identify the country.

But it's okay if they're willing to use their real name, e.g. "Donald Trump is not under investigation, according to senior Justice Department official John Barron."
posted by tonycpsu at 6:44 PM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

Is Chris Van Riet, a "Russian Real Estate Agent" born in Houston but with offices in Russia necessarily a "Russian tie"? Does that mean his money is dirty? Why is he donating to McCain and Cruz and the RNC?

Presumably, in the same way that criminals use 'smurfs' to work with a large chunk of cash split up across many small runners, Putin can use a massive chunk of cash split up across many Russian or Russian-American businessmen.

And anonymize/launder it through them - "I'll give you 2M in your private Seychelles account. And then you bribe Ryan et. al. using 2M from your US account."
posted by sebastienbailard at 6:44 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

It seems like Trump's the master of badgering, threatening, or bribing people to do something a *little* sleazy, which they're uneasy about, but whatever. Then, using that to blackmail them into doing stuff a *lot* sleazy. I bet there are a LOT of Roskolnikovs walking around Washington right now KNOWING they've done something for Trump and friends that would END them if anyone found out.

And I'm imagining (on no evidence) Comey realized where that was heading after the Clinton email thing and said, nope. Stops here, and if I have to take what's coming to me for before, then so be it. He took it pretty stoically knowing he was going to get fired and smeared the whole time.
posted by ctmf at 6:46 PM on June 15, 2017 [10 favorites]

He will never admit to destroying himself; he will destroy everything else in his path first to avoid recrimination. That shamelessness, that blatant disregard for either norms or laws, spells dark times ahead.

But each destructive step he takes pushes Congress closer to taking action against him. Their souls are small & shriveled but they do have them.
posted by scalefree at 6:47 PM on June 15, 2017

[citation needed]
posted by entropicamericana at 6:50 PM on June 15, 2017 [35 favorites]

Ya'll that are talking about wanting to watch the future TV show about this, I don't get you.

Should I survive this mess, and the chaos it causes, I will resent every additional second that spend thinking about these assholes.

People are gonna die, you know, from all this. Already have, if you count the military fuckups and ICE detainees and probably people who got killed after being deported into danger. People who will have less protection from dangerous work, air, water, food. People caught in yet another shooting. People losing their healthcare.

It's not entertaining to me.
posted by emjaybee at 6:51 PM on June 15, 2017 [56 favorites]

Well, this is a good omen. The Democrats just beat the Republicans 11-2 in the Congressional Baseball Game.

Surpised they didn't find some way to bipartisan away their lead.
posted by Artw at 6:53 PM on June 15, 2017 [14 favorites]

Just what this administration needs: to be set to the music of Gilbert and Sullivan.

I am the very model of a man who shouldn't be President
The election went so badly, but yet here I am, still resident
Investigated by some guy whose name is Robert Mueller
I self-incriminate because I can't keep my head cooler...
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 6:54 PM on June 15, 2017 [24 favorites]

I leave you with three great AMERICAN words that for generations have torn down barriers, built bridges of unity, and defied those who have sought to pull us apart: LADIES AND GENTLEMEN LET'S PLAY BALL.

That's five words dude
posted by kirkaracha at 6:55 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

Surprised they didn't find some way to bipartisan away their lead.

Sal Hernandez at Buzzfeed says Dems gave R's their trophy to put in Scalise's room.
posted by emjaybee at 6:57 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

Shit, even Ted Nugent is stepping back? Trump is losing violent allies.

Ted Nugent says he’s seen the light after Virginia shooting: ‘We have got to be civil’

In a Thursday interview with 77WABC Radio, Nugent swore that he has “reevaluated” his language and would refrain from saying “anything that can be interpreted as condoning or referencing violence.”

“At the tender age of 69, my wife has convinced me I just can’t use those harsh terms,” he admitted. “I cannot and will not and I encourage even my friends/enemies on the left, in the Democrat and liberal world, that we have got to be civil to each other.”

(The only reason this seems credible enough to post here is that his wife did this.)

posted by Room 641-A at 7:00 PM on June 15, 2017 [6 favorites]

It's not entertaining to me.

Me either, but I understand gallows humor is a thing many use to cope.
posted by greermahoney at 7:01 PM on June 15, 2017 [18 favorites]

I cannot and will not and I encourage even my friends/enemies on the left, in the Democrat and liberal world, that we have got to be civil to each other.

Oh, now that someone who matters was affected...

I don't know if it's grosser to hear they've all had a sudden epiphany, or if they haven't.
posted by ctmf at 7:05 PM on June 15, 2017 [14 favorites]

The Democrats just beat the Republicans 11-2 in the Congressional Baseball Game.

Surprised they didn't bring in a Russian ringer in the last inning.
posted by octobersurprise at 7:05 PM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

That's five words dude

Uh, six.
posted by scalefree at 7:07 PM on June 15, 2017 [16 favorites]

I'm sure they tried to make sure the most-likely D's to get a hit couldn't play that day. I mean, why would you not?
posted by ctmf at 7:07 PM on June 15, 2017

I encourage even my friends/enemies on the left, in the Democrat and liberal world, that we have got to be civil to each other.

Buh-huh-huh-huh. *snort*
posted by Rykey at 7:08 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

On afterthought. If he were demented, wouldn't he regress to his childhood upperclass sociolect?

No, because that's not how dementia works. Dementia is caused by organic damage to the brain. In the case of language and speech being affected, it's due to damage to the parts of the brain that control speech. A typical symptom is a reduction in the number of words someone can call to mind and therefore use. (Paucity of speech.) So that would have the most likely effect of making someone seem less educated because they would tend to use a much, much smaller vocabulary.

The other thing to take into account is that just because Donald Trump grew up wealthy doesn't mean he ever had a certain accent or facility with language. Based on the fact that he doesn't read and can't focus for very many sentences at a time (assuming that isn't a recent symptom tied to age) I wouldn't be surprised to find out he had always suffered from a learning disability like dyslexia. It's completely possible for one child in a family to have reduced or delayed language skills while another child is extremely proficient.

I mean, so long as we're speculating, even something as simple as a family idea that "reading is for girls" could lead to him having a very well-spoken sister while he sounds like a New York construction worker.
posted by threeturtles at 7:11 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

I encourage even my friends/enemies on the left, in the Democrat and liberal world, that we have got to be civil to each other.

"You wouldn't hit a man with glasses now, would you?"
posted by octobersurprise at 7:11 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

If Ted Nugent keeps his trap shut I don't care what he says about liberals.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:12 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

hey folks, remember 300 years ago when intersectional traitor milo wharrgarbl was going to write a book? buzzfeed got a leaked draft!

This guy has always been confusing to me. Who is the fan base?

I'm looking forward to next week when people say, "Milo who? Oh, yeah. Jerk who thought he could sell a book." And then next year, "Milo who? He did what? He tried to make a book out of being an ass? Surely, we have something better to talk about."

Seriously, a high 90 something percent of people have never heard of him, and the rest are saying that now. I only know who he is because of MF.
posted by bongo_x at 7:22 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

Dems gave R's their trophy to put in Scalise's room.

That's so they can periodically ask how the R's "participation trophy" is.
posted by ctmf at 7:22 PM on June 15, 2017 [16 favorites]

I have some cheerful news to share: (background) my liberal as fuck deist mom married a centrist slightly right leaning Christian in 2012. In the five years since they've been married, he's become a centrist slightly left leaning Christian. For a 60 year old white man, I think that's an incredible improvement. He even voted for Hilary (the second time; we all went Bernie in the primary).

They just took a three week road trip from California to Charlottesville, NC. Before they left, I bought my stepdad a t-shirt that reads "CLEARLY WE'VE TAKEN THIS 'ANYONE CAN BE PRESIDENT THING' A BIT TOO FAR". He wore it proudly through the center of our great nation and got nothing but positive comments and smiles, even in the reddest of states.

So I have hope. Trump supporters may seem like they are legion but they're not. They're just like their bloviated orange god... they talk a lot and they say the same things over and over again.

Maybe the lack of health care will lead to a sudden rash of heart attacks since people won't be getting their statins?
posted by elsietheeel at 7:22 PM on June 15, 2017 [22 favorites]

DAPA (temporary relief from deportation for the undocumented parents of US Citizen children) is officially dead. It never went into effect after dozens of states with Republican governors sued to stop it.
posted by zachlipton at 7:23 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

I am looking forward to the day (assuming there ever is one) when I will never have to think about Donald Trump or see or hear him or hear about him, ever again.
posted by FelliniBlank at 7:24 PM on June 15, 2017 [27 favorites]

I can't even imagine the kind of superneonaziism we'd be under if people weren't comfortable mocking Trump. The mere fact that someone is evil and dangerous doesn't mean they're not funny (to many). Humor is most certainly a common response to horror and disgust!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:25 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

If any of it is sincere the shock was that an angry white guy took up arms against the state for real. Many of these right wing blowhards know just how close to coming unwound their own fans and constituents are. They're scared because this is more familiar to them than they expected.

This is a thing I've been expecting, and not understanding why Right Wingers haven't been. Why in the world have they thought that all this rhetoric was only going to inflame those on the Right? It's bizarre when they bullshit about civil war and such, and somehow ignore the part about the other side shooting back.
posted by bongo_x at 7:26 PM on June 15, 2017 [20 favorites]

This guy has always been confusing to me. Who is the fan base?

Nazis.

Nazis who post on image boards.

Nazis who play videogames.
posted by Artw at 7:29 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

In the five years since they've been married, he's become a centrist slightly left leaning Christian. For a 60 year old white man, I think that's an incredible improvement.

With all their prejudice and condescension. They don't learn very easily like the rest of us.
posted by bongo_x at 7:30 PM on June 15, 2017 [3 favorites]

Also ironic Nazis and I suppose some youtubers who hate women and but aren't really Nazis per se.

Just kidding, those are both actually just Nazis.
posted by Artw at 7:31 PM on June 15, 2017 [13 favorites]

I own the same t-shirt and I live in a conservative neighborhood of a liberal city in California.

No one has ever positively commented on my shirt. I've only ever gotten glared at.

That fact, added to my friend's "Not My President" bumpersticker getting vandalized yesterday (and she lives on the liberal side of the city), makes me nervous.

So I was glad to hear that my parents had positive reactions. It made me feel better. I guess it shouldn't have.
posted by elsietheeel at 7:32 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

This guy has always been confusing to me. Who is the fan base?

White 15-30 year old edgelords who hate women, liberals, POC, and anyone who thinks those in the previous groups are people (known as "cucks" in their idiom).
posted by chaoticgood at 7:32 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Sea-level rise maps for Tangier Island:
Surging Seas Risk Finder
NOAA Sea Level Rise Viewer

Spoiler: glug glug.
posted by kirkaracha at 7:40 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Did I miss something? I'm probably more informed on whats going on with these investigations than 99.5% of the country and I have no idea what Rosenstein is on about.

This is so weird. There must be something in the wind that the Trumpco knows is breaking or could break. The scenario I imagine is Donald freaking out and demanding someone somewhere do something about. I imagine him screaming and just calling people. I imagine him demanding the DOJ DO SOMETHING and someone going omg we'll get a thing written to make the screaming stop. And just doing it even though it's a totally stupid thing and a thing that makes whatever it might be referencing look even worse.

This imagining comes from at one time having a boss who would demand people do the most stupid things and people would just do said stupid thing or make up a less stupid thing that he found acceptable to make him shut up and leave us alone because trying to explain to the dude why it was stupid was futile.
posted by Jalliah at 7:40 PM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

I've been rocking the ITMFA hat and been getting some double takes I think because the mimicking of the color scheme.
posted by vrakatar at 7:40 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

That fact, added to my friend's "Not My President" bumpersticker getting vandalized yesterday (and she lives on the liberal side of the city), makes me nervous.

I saw a brave soul with a "FAKEPREZ" custom license plate in the red boonies of NYS a couple days ago.
posted by xyzzy at 7:40 PM on June 15, 2017 [12 favorites]

[Milo] has always been confusing to me. Who is the fan base?

I dumped my college boyfriend in 2002 because I realized he was basically not nice to me and was in general just a terrible person. He loved Holocaust jokes (he is Jewish, but loves to talk about how much he hates Jewish women), racist jokes, sexist jokes. He was a gaslighter and bully. Touted himself as an independent but I doubt he ever voted non-Republican. We are still Facebook friends for some reason, but I had to unfollow his posts because he was driving me nuts last year during the election with his "both sides suck but Hillary is even worse!" crap. Anyway, a couple months ago during the Bill Maher interview controversy, I looked at Milo's facebook page out of morbid curiosity, and sure enough my ex was listed in the "Friends who like Milo..." thing on the sidebar. I was not even slightly surprised, it was almost cartoonishly on-the-nose. Of course he is also a big Trumper now.
posted by gatorae at 7:47 PM on June 15, 2017 [16 favorites]

I'm so sorry, gatorae.
posted by Lyme Drop at 7:51 PM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

Re: The weirdly worded Rosenstein press release

I'm seeing a lot of people here and elsewhere hopping on the "Trumo pressuring him to get in front of a story" train, but I can't help but think it might be possible that there's incoming Russian active measures aimed at undercutting Mueller.
posted by Freon at 7:52 PM on June 15, 2017 [18 favorites]

I believe it's possible to think it's an objectively good thing if Ted Nugent stops with the violent speech without absolving him of past sins or forgiving violent speech. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
posted by Room 641-A at 7:52 PM on June 15, 2017 [18 favorites]

35-64, -29 net approval. And down to 75% with Republicans and 50% with whites with no college degree. Seems his base is starting to get sick of the winning.

The Associated Press-NORC survey also found Trump wasn't a particularly popular president. Just 35 percent of Americans approved of the job he's doing as president, the poll found. Sixty-four percent—and one-quarter of Republicans—disapproved of Trump's job performance. In March, the Associated Press-NORC poll found 42 percent of Americans approved of the job Trump was doing. Just one-in-five Republicans disapproved of the president in March.

posted by chris24 at 7:52 PM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

In totally unrelated news, Bill C16 has passed the Senate in Canada. This is a huge step forward for trans rights.

All of the most rational people on the internet are losing their minds.
posted by Yowser at 7:54 PM on June 15, 2017 [11 favorites]

I think it's great that Ted Nugent is going to tone down his rhetoric. I would encourage other dudes who use violent rhetoric to do the same. I have never wished violence on anyone, either verbally or actually even just in my own head, so I'm going to keep talking the same way I've been talking.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:55 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

mumimor: " that old SNL sketch where Reagan is actually a smart political mover yt"

One of the top ten skits they've ever done.
posted by Chrysostom at 7:56 PM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

but I can't help but think it might be possible that there's incoming Russian active measures aimed at undercutting Mueller.

Ugh, yeah that's quite plausible as well. They're going to screw around with what is going on one way or another. Or possibly several ways just to make it as messy as they can.
posted by Jalliah at 7:56 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

I am not glad that a domestic abuser shot that david duke fan republican house whip.

However, I am glad that ted nugent is scared.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:02 PM on June 15, 2017 [20 favorites]

I have actually known someone named Mueller who pronounced it Mule-er, though.
posted by threeturtles at 8:05 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

So this is what Hannity said tonight according to the netz. He was serious.

Hannity: "There is a 4th branch of government. It's called the Deep State...Thankfully, tonight President Trump is fighting back on Twitter"
posted by Jalliah at 8:06 PM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

WaPo: Pentagon to send 4,000 more troops to Afghanistan.

Remember when this war was supposed to end someday?
posted by zachlipton at 8:06 PM on June 15, 2017 [17 favorites]

zachlipton: "Well, this is a good omen. The Democrats just beat the Republicans 11-2 in the Congressional Baseball Game. "

The Dems have done well in recent years - I believe they have a rep who played college ball.
posted by Chrysostom at 8:07 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

Has Hannity always been that Alex Jones-ish, or is he going off the deep end?
posted by yhbc at 8:11 PM on June 15, 2017

ARGH Mueller doesn't rhyme with cooler.

That's right. The first "e" is silent.
posted by dirigibleman at 8:13 PM on June 15, 2017 [2 favorites]

California Deals Blow To Trump’s Plan To Expand Immigrant Detention Centers (Adolpho Flores, BuzzFeed News)
The provision inside the state’s budget bill stops the expansion of immigration detention centers and requires state oversight of existing facilities.

The provision, which is part of California's $125-billion budget, stops local jurisdictions from signing new contracts or expanding existing contracts with US Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) for detaining immigrants. It also requires the state attorney general to conduct reviews of all detention facilities holding immigrants. The budget plan now goes to the desk of Gov. Jerry Brown, who is expected to sign it.

posted by Room 641-A at 8:19 PM on June 15, 2017 [42 favorites]

Hannity got a huge boost in cultural relevancy after going full-Infowars and doubling down on the Seth Rich conspiracy. It bought him a whole new audience of younger alt-right-leaning men (a major coup among Fox News figures, since their viewership is literally dying off), and gave him a basis for the kind of martyr narrative that conservative pundits are always looking to create for themselves.
posted by prosopagnosia at 8:21 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Has Hannity always been that Alex Jones-ish, or is he going off the deep end?

This is what he has left once you subtract all of his Obama material.
posted by rhizome at 8:24 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

California Deals Blow To Trump’s Plan To Expand Immigrant Detention Centers (Adolpho Flores, BuzzFeed News)

This is great, but I sincerely hope it doesn't backfire because of this:

However, Virginia Kice, spokeswoman for ICE, said placing limitations on the agency’s detention options in California won't hinder their efforts.

“It will simply mean ICE will have to transfer individuals encountered in California to detention facilities outside the state, at a greater distance from their family, friends, and legal representatives,” Kice said in a statement to BuzzFeed News.

I know. I have, too. We all have. But HE doesn't. Same way my first name is not pronounced the assumed phonetic way it looks. (although eastern europeans get a pass from me). Sorry, I'm super sensitive about this.
posted by fluttering hellfire at 11:10 PM on June 15 [2 favorites +] [!]

So...is it pronounced "flute-ering"?
posted by Preserver at 8:34 PM on June 15, 2017 [31 favorites]

Okay, I have been out all afternoon so I know that means about eighteen years have passed, so forgive the coolness of this take:

Which has left people wondering about Melania, Barron, and Tiffany.

I suspect the reason is connected somehow to the way the professor and Mary Ann got reduced to "and the rest."
posted by ricochet biscuit at 8:37 PM on June 15, 2017 [14 favorites]

Hannity got a huge boost in cultural relevancy after going full-Infowars and doubling down on the Seth Rich conspiracy.

The old Hannity and Colmes days are almost quaint.

the professor and Mary Ann got reduced to "and the rest."

But they got promoted in later seasons to "the professor and Mary Ann" so let's no encourage that! I did just realize, however, that Lovey was always "and his wife." :(
posted by Room 641-A at 8:52 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

The only real thing which gives me hope these days, and it's not a lot, is that Republican officials, from the President on down, is to paraphrase some Hemingway:

“How did you ~~go bankrupt~~ get indicted?” ~~Bill~~ Joe Republican asked.
“Two ways,” ~~Mike~~ the special counsel said. “Gradually and then suddenly.”
posted by maxwelton at 9:07 PM on June 15, 2017 [7 favorites]

I'm confused now. Which one is the major model of the modern Major General?

My second thought was of Gilbert & Sullivan, but my first thought was of Major Major Major Major from Catch 22. Which, come to think of it, I might go reread to regain a sense of humor in the midst of terror and absurdity.
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 9:09 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

ELECTIONS NEWS

** GA-06 -- EV is at 128K, with one more day of in-person remaining.

** SC-05 -- Rep Tim Ryan (he made that run at Pelosi's job) heading down to campaign for Parnell.

** Odds & ends:

-- After losing the VA gov GOP nomination by a hair, cartoonishly evil Corey Stewart is exploring a Senate run in '18 against Tim Kaine. Chrysostom's analysis: HAHAHAHAHAHA

-- Party conventions are this weekend for the UT-03 (Chaffetz) special election. No one you recognize is involved, except for Danny Ainge's kid.

-- In a special election in the Tennessee House, the GOP held HD-95, 62-35. This is a heavily red area, and the Dems had not even put up a candidate in years, so this is a starting point.

-- Bills were introduced in Congress for national automatic voter registration. Obviously, these aren't going anywhere now, but they're good publicity, and will no doubt be on the "pass immediately" list in a Dem Congress.

-- NPR: Would we even be able to tell if vote results were changed by a hack?

-- WI Supreme Court justice Gableman not running again in 2018. Major opportunity for Dems to narrow the disparity on this court (currently 5-2 GOP).

-- Mentioned upstream - Lawsuit has been filed to overturn Pennsylvania's districts as illegally gerrymandered. This could be huge, as PA's districts are in the top 3 worst gerrymanders - neutral boundaries would likely result in a 1-4 seat Dem pickup. Of note - this is a STATE lawsuit, concerning the PA Constitution, and the Dems control the state SC. Gov is also a Dem, and could veto bad proposed maps.

posted by Chrysostom at 9:16 PM on June 15, 2017 [43 favorites]

Welp.

During the election I sometimes had a whistling-past-the-graveyard joke about how I used to have recurring nightmares about nuclear war in my teens and 20s, ones that left me sitting up in bed wide-eyed and terrified for hours after because I was literally too afraid to fall asleep. They started slowing down after Glasnost, and finally petered out as I trusted that the world was not going to end after all. One of the reasons I was voting for Hillary, I joked, is because I was concerned that a nation with Donald Trump as its helm would run the risk of scaring me to the point where I'd start having them again.

About ten minutes ago I just woke up out of a nightmare that an old work buddy and I were in a basement, preparing a stockpile of supplies against an attack we knew was coming; and then there came the blinding flash. We were protected enough in the basement, I dreamed, but I still started wailing, and my friend gathered me into a hug and then I dreamed that I heard him start praying, and I woke upright when his English was starting to lapse into his own native Serbian.

Damn you, Trump.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:23 PM on June 15, 2017 [66 favorites]

Pentagon to send 4,000 more troops to Afghanistan.

Senior Trump administration and military officials recommended sending several thousand additional American troops to Afghanistan in early May. That article says there are 8,400 troops in Afghanistan and the call is for an additional 3,000 to 5,000 troops.

This latest article says we're sending 4,000 more troops, to add to Obama's cap of 8,400 troops, plus "at least another 2,000 U.S. troops in Afghanistan not included in the official count." So that adds up to 14,400.

In 2009 Obama "authorized a surge of 30,000 troops" to Afghanistan, bringing the total to "more than 100,000."

The situation has deteriorated since then.

From January 1 through November 12 last year, 6,785 Afghan national security forces were killed...The numbers of the Afghan security forces are decreasing, while both casualties and the number of districts under insurgent control or influence are increasing."

If we couldn't win with over 100,000 troops, how can we with with less than 15,000?

Why More Troops Won’t Help Afghanistan

The plan calls for several thousand more American troops and an indefinite U.S. financial commitment, of more than twenty billion dollars per year, to strengthen the Afghan security forces and roll back Taliban gains. More troops, more training, more bombing, and more money might budge the front lines, but the main problems are not at the front but in the rear—in the political divisions in the Afghan government, in the sanctuary the Afghan Taliban have enjoyed in Pakistan, and in the hostility of many regional countries to the U.S. presence.

posted by kirkaracha at 9:38 PM on June 15, 2017 [8 favorites]

In other local news, the mayor of Detroit, Mike Duggan, hosted what his staff said was the first Iftar dinner to be held by a Detroit mayor. This was partly an attempt to allay the fears raised for refugees and people who are concerned about protecting immigrants by his January comment declaring Detroit wasn't a sanctuary city. I am informed by a Muslim attendee that the event was slightly surreal because the host was clearly experiencing things he had zero previous knowledge of, but had the good sense to delegate arrangements to competent staffers who made sure that all the arrangements were done in a sensitive way.
posted by bardophile at 9:53 PM on June 15, 2017 [16 favorites]

Trump Amends His Travel Ban—and Weakens His Legal Argument for It

President Donald Trump was forced to amend his travel ban on Wednesday over legal concerns that the executive order’s entry ban on nationals of six Muslim-majority countries would expire. But in doing so, he has damaged his own legal case to preserve the ban.

Two federal district courts and two appeals courts have blocked the main provision of the president’s executive order, which bans entry to the United States for people from Iran, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, and Yemen for 90 days. The 90-day clock was set to start ticking on the “the effective date of this order,” which the order designated as “12:01 a.m., eastern daylight time on March 16, 2017.” That implied that the ban would expire on June 14. With the ban on hold and its future in the hands of the Supreme Court, the president amended his order to clarify that the effective date of the ban is not March 16 but the date when the courts allow it to go into effect.

This is entirely within the president’s power and may have been a necessary remedy to the situation. But it also undermines the administration’s case that the ban is legal and constitutional. As Mother Jones has previously noted, the executive order’s main stated reason for an entry ban is to allow the federal government to conduct a review of worldwide visa vetting procedures. The ban, then, is in furtherance of the goal of revamping visa protocols, and once the review is complete and new review processes are put in place, the ban is, by the order’s own reasoning, no longer needed. So what is the point of a ban whose effective date is no longer tied to the review and could now continue long after the review is completed?

posted by kirkaracha at 9:54 PM on June 15, 2017 [24 favorites]

President Trump chooses inexperienced woman who planned his son Eric's wedding to run N.Y. federal housing programs

kakistocracy
posted by dhens at 9:59 PM on June 15, 2017 [5 favorites]

I have a theory.

Those troops aren't for Afghanistan. They're for the country next door.
posted by Yowser at 10:02 PM on June 15, 2017 [9 favorites]

Just to be clear, it'll be 4000 troops here, 10000 troops there, and eventually you'll have an army ready to invade.

It's probably not a great theory.
posted by Yowser at 10:07 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

Wait, which country next door?
posted by bardophile at 10:17 PM on June 15, 2017

Iran
posted by orange ball at 10:20 PM on June 15, 2017 [1 favorite]

Chrysostom, thank you for the nightly updates on elections. I look forward to them.
posted by greermahoney at 10:23 PM on June 15, 2017 [15 favorites]

spitbull: (What has the NRA had to say, oneaso wonders?)

That the incident "isn't about guns," but rather "the Left's dangerous ideology" that involves "fanning the flames of hate." (These headlines replaced "Left Calls for War," posted before the shooting.)

I hate it when my research intersects with current events.
posted by Superplin at 10:24 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Just to be clear, it'll be 4000 troops here, 10000 troops there, and eventually you'll have an army ready to invade.

It's probably not a great theory.

The thing is, you'd need a metric farkload of troops to invade Iran. We sent nearly 200,000 to Iraq in 2003 between all branches. For Desert Storm, we sent 700,000. Iran is well equipped and able to put up a good fight. The US would win the war (speaking strictly in a military sense there, the aftermath would be a complete clusterfuck) but Iran won't make it easy. We'd need hundreds of thousands of troops. You would need to build massive facilities to handle the troops, logistics, staging, etc and it would become obvious fairly quickly what the US was up to outbthere. Iran has the capability to fight off naval ships for a while and would probably block the Persian Gulf if they thought they had to do so to win a war.
posted by azpenguin at 10:37 PM on June 15, 2017 [4 favorites]

Making people spend more hours on a bus to Arizona to have to be farther from their families isn't an improvement (but more state oversight of conditions for in-state facilities sure as hell is). I hope this winds up being a net positive.

I don't know much about it, but I assume the spokesperson's job is to point out any potential issue with the bill to evoke your kind of response. I'd take a drowsy toddler's opinion of the bill over an ICE spokesperson's talking points any day.

I am sure the people who crafted the bill know better than me, and they apparently believe denying the jackboots more outposts will negatively impact their to ability slap armbands on innocent people. Will some people be sent to Arizona? Probably. But as is, people are disappearing and dying inside the "legal" labyrinth ICE has set up.

...

Christ, just stop and look. Step back from the flood of scandal, propaganda and social erosion; the sheer insanity of the last six months makes 2016 look so quaint. Did we really want 2016 to end? Did I really think the country felt like a powder keg during the summer of 2015? What's 2018 going to be like? This is what normalization feels like. It doesn't stop feeling crazy. It just keeps ratcheting up day by day until "normal" drops out of sight.

I find myself having to remind people how bad 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005 and so on were: Fallujah, Abu Ghraib, CIA Black Sites, "Rumsfeld Dinner Theatre," and all of it. This is different. It's destabilizing the world in a new way and domestically chaotic in a different way. And in some ways, there is much more public resistance to the evil now than 2003, so um, I guess there's that. For now. But at least it's not outright, imperialistic war yet. The healthcare bills, the tax cuts and the rest are completely evil and deadly, but at least it's not a father in Iran holding his burnt infant son out to a photographer because we have bombed his whole country into oblivion for no reason. At least it's not that. Yet. But I get despondent at the thought that a war, and another one after that one, is steadily approaching. And I get agitated when I picture the current public dissent slip away into the frenzy for war.

But I remind myself the future is nothing if not uncertain. If you told me during the Rumsfeld senate testimony in 2004 that four years later an African American man named Barack Hussein Obama would be president, and despite deep political faults and failures, he would manage to stabilize the world a bit from the horror of yet four more years of Cheney, I would have been completely incredulous. And if on the night of Obama's inauguration in 2009 you told me a demented Donald J-Fucking Trump would be president in 2017, I would have laughed. So I guess the thing to do is ask myself what nice future would make me laugh today? That in four years we have civilized healthcare system? Doesn't seem so impossible when I look back over the last 15 years. Of course the future's uncertainty means it can aways suddenly go south in unimaginable ways, too.

It's so bizarre and history is a nightmare and I am rambling and need a blog and I haven't had a drink since W's second term. But hopefully we, hopefully I, can remember that the wider future is uncertain and we never know what good follows this bad or what bad follows that good.

I suppose this is just a really long way of saying I hope it doesn't get much worse before we get some good because it feels really bad.
posted by milarepa at 11:02 PM on June 15, 2017 [62 favorites]

The US invaded Afghanistan 16 years ago and invaded Iraq 14 years ago. For over 14 years our adversaries have been conducting a clinic on how to use asymmetric warfare to either defeat the US or fight us to a draw.

In 2001 the population of Afghanistan was about 20 million. In 2003 the population of Iraq was about 25 million. Iran's population is about 80 million.

Iran is the 17th largest country in the world; Afghanistan is 40th and Iraq is 58th.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:30 PM on June 15, 2017 [27 favorites]

This is from a bit further upthread, but still:

While Republican support of Trump is still around 80% (though there's hints the number is being propped up because some people no longer identify as Rs), this new poll from Gallup shows cracks in the facade.

Seventeen-Point Drop in US Satisfaction Among Republicans
Republicans' satisfaction with the way things are going in the U.S. took a hit since last month. Forty-one percent of Republicans say they are satisfied with the way things are going in the U.S., down 17 percentage points since May. At the same time, satisfaction among Democrats and independents has remained low.

There's no contradiction there and no cracks in the facade.
They all support Trump. And they all are unsatisfied with the way things are going in the US. In fact, that's the reason why they voted for Trump in the first place.

Right now? Things are getting worse. It's a witchhunt! All Trump supporters (= basically all Republicans) are in agreement on that. And it's all Clinton and Obama's fault. No disagreement there, either.
posted by sour cream at 12:00 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

Trump will just continue his campaign to "bomb the shit out of them" as he is already engaged in at least seven countries.

I'm mortified to admit this, but it's really hard to keep track. Is there a website like oh... whoarewebombingnow.com to keep me up to date? (Sadly that URL is dead.)
posted by greermahoney at 12:24 AM on June 16, 2017

U.S. Troops in Besieged City of Marawi, Philippine Military Says

You can add The Phillipines to Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen, and Syria in terms of current military operations. I'm sure I'm forgetting some countries with recent activity. Pakistan?

In Marawi, advisors (or "advisors") on the ground, plus special operations in combat. Destroying the city to save it seems to be the current Phillipine strategy. That's something we have a lot of experience with.
posted by honestcoyote at 12:58 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

greermahoney: Global Conflict Tracker?

If it's too much info or not your style of info, maybe then start with this Wiki list or the links at the bottom?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts
posted by elsietheeel at 1:04 AM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

(I don't think I can provide you with something like whoarewebombingnow.com, because when we're sending military aid, weapons, funding, intel, etc. all over the planet for a myriad of Reasons, it just can't be broken down to we're at war with x, y, and z. Although if I am wrong, please someone give me the link too because I'm drowning in info myself.)
posted by elsietheeel at 1:11 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

dirigibleman: > ARGH Mueller doesn't rhyme with cooler.

That's right. The first "e" is silent.

If he uses his name the way it's used in the original German, then that is not exactly how it works:
the e is an alternative way to transcribe an Umlaut. In other words, ue equals ü. And the Umlaut is what makes the German letter u sound like the u in but, not the oo in boot.
So the e has a very clearly defined function here: it tells us that Mueller rhymes with 'duller', not with 'cooler'.

Of course, from an English-speaking point of view, 'muller' would already rhyme with 'duller'. So we could also say that the first e is silent.

*cough* ... Never mind.
posted by Too-Ticky at 2:17 AM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

So the e has a very clearly defined function here: it tells us that Mueller rhymes with 'duller', not with 'cooler'.

I've lived in Austria since 2000, speak German fluently and my wife's maiden name is Müller, and I can assure you that the correct German pronunciation of 'Müller' / 'Mueller' does not rhyme with the English pronunciation of 'duller'.

The Germans pronounce the 'ü' a little like English-speakers pronounce the vowel part of 'ew' in 'few', but without trailing off to a 'w' sound after the vowel. The correct pronunciation is actually closer to 'Miller' than it is to 'Muller'.
posted by syzygy at 2:30 AM on June 16, 2017 [32 favorites]

Clarification: 'ü' sounds like the vowel part of 'ew' in 'few' without the 'y' sound that proceeds the vowel or the 'w' sound that succeeds it. So, if 'few' is pronounced like f-y-e-w, chop off everything proceeding and succeeding the 'e' and you're close to the pronunciation of 'ü'.
posted by syzygy at 2:34 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

syzygy: I can assure you that the correct German pronunciation of 'Müller' / 'Mueller' does not rhyme with the English pronunciation of 'duller'.

Entschuldigung! You are ütterly correct, but I could not think of a way to describe the finer nuances and I figured this would at least be closer than having it rhyme with 'cooler'.
posted by Too-Ticky at 2:36 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Lets ask the internet ;-)
posted by mumimor at 2:37 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

A final note on the 'correct' pronunciation of 'Müller' / 'Mueller': In German, the 'er' is pronounced like a clipped 'ah'. If English is your native tongue, the way you'd likely read, 'MILL-ah' (accent on the first syllable, clip both vowels) would likely be a close approximation to the way German-speakers would pronounce 'Müller' / 'Mueller'.

mumimor: Thanks, good example!

Too-Ticky: No worries! It's not easy to explain a vowel sound to someone who hasn't heard it before. :)
posted by syzygy at 2:46 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

The correct pronunciation is actually closer to 'Miller' than it is to 'Muller'

Which should be easy to remember because that's what Müller means.

Now let's all learn how to pronounce Scheveningen!
posted by elsietheeel at 2:54 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

Another land war in Asia would be inconceivable.
posted by delfin at 3:24 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

My contribution to the linguistic derail:

Whenever people say ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, I simply read it as "tsu!" because ツ is one of the Japanese characters for "tsu." It always takes me a sec to realize that people mean it as a shrug face.

It's hard to un-read or un-hear a language you're familiar with. Kinda like how some German speakers find it hard to enjoy Downfall subtitle parodies.
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 3:25 AM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

Another land war in Asia would be inconceivable.

"I do not think it means what you think it means.”
(Were you being sarcastic? I can't tell anything anymore...)
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 3:28 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

When in doubt about name pronunciation, particularly of european origin, it's worth checking if there's a football player with the same name in TransferMarkt (relevant). During last years' European Football Championship they added a voice clip of the name said by a local right in the infobox.

Of course there's still local pronunciations and whatnot and it might get a bit tricky in countries like Belgium, but it's a start.
posted by lmfsilva at 3:28 AM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

i'm quite certain that when they line up the liberals for machine gunning, those who can correctly pronounce Mueller will be spared.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 3:36 AM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

Do we get to stand behind or in front of the guns?
posted by maxwelton at 4:21 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

Seriously guys, the fueller this thread gets with discussion about how Mueller's name is pronounced, the dueller my browser's response is. Please?
posted by Rykey at 4:41 AM on June 16, 2017 [38 favorites]

Last night I watched The Most Dangerous Man in America: Daniel Ellsberg and the Pentagon Papers. I felt overwhelmed by its relevance to our current situation, and it made me ponder the things that are going on now through a different lens.

It really made me think about this administration's fear and hatred of leaks, and the way that they've staffed positions of power with loyalists, or not staffed at all. Some people talk like Trump has failed to fill so many positions because everyone hates him, or they don't understand government, or care about much of its work--and I certainly don't believe that those things are irrelevant--but this made me think that they went into this knowingly planning to work against the will of the people for their own profit, and they've chosen to isolate themselves to try to reduce the chances of leaks.

It also made me think about what the fuck America is doing in the middle east right now and how many civilians are dying and this administration doesn't care. There's even audio of Nixon in this, explicitly saying that he doesn't give a damn about civilian casualties in Vietnam. And then expressing interest in using nukes.

But what had me on the verge of tears was Ellsberg's personal choices. He went to Vietnam because he wanted to see the truth for himself. And when he chose to leak the papers to the press, he did it clear-eyed, expecting to go to prison, and to be grateful to be able to make that sacrifice to help stop the war. Several newspapers helped him publish those papers because even though the government was trying to stop them, they thought it was worth the fight.

I'm sure the commonalities have been mentioned in these threads before, and I've simply forgotten because time is meaningless now. And no doubt some of you lived through this, so this is all beyond obvious to you. Yet it felt very meaningful to me, so I wanted to recommend it to everyone. It has a nice soundtrack by Blake Leyh, whose music you will remember from The Wire.
posted by heatvision at 4:46 AM on June 16, 2017 [34 favorites]

So I guess Alex Jones is about to go live and preemptively air his interview with Megyn Kelly? You know what they say about lying down with dogs...*

Who could've known that a raging egomaniac conspiracy theorist who tries to gaslight the public by claiming obviously his schtick isn't serious (except for his true fans, he assures them it's serious, it's all serious) would do something so unethical like secretly record phone conversations and air them on his show?

I mean I guess he still probably respects, you Megyn. Oh, wait ...

“Megyn Kelly is a puppet. She is a beautiful woman who the corporate structure uses to push their agenda,” the reputed Sandy Hook elementary massacre-denier tells his viewer, adding that his recording show “the anatomy of an NBC, CIA, globalist, George Soros-financed hit job.”

Aren't you so glad you're giving him a venue to put his side of these stories out there to a larger audience, Megyn? It's all worth it, right?

Right?
posted by tocts at 5:00 AM on June 16, 2017 [22 favorites]

“You just became fascinating to me,” says Kelly, who adds she was taken by Jones’ attempts to protect his children from media coverage. “(It) just reminded me that you’re just like anybody. You’re a dad and you go through the same things we do.”

Kelly admits that at the time she isn’t fully aware of every controversy surrounding Jones, but planned to research the debates and ask him about them.

Oh lord
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 5:06 AM on June 16, 2017 [33 favorites]

Should have known he was a snake before she let him in.
posted by Rust Moranis at 5:09 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

Just what this administration needs: to be set to the music of Gilbert and Sullivan.

My object all sublime,
I shall achieve in time,
To let the punishment fit the crime,
The punishment fit the crime.
posted by Gelatin at 5:20 AM on June 16, 2017 [11 favorites]

WSJ: For Trump, Signs of a Softening Base

"The latest Wall Street Journal/NBC News poll found that 4 out of 10 people who voted for Mr. Trump said they did so because they didn’t like Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton, not because they liked him or his policies. Among those reluctant Trump voters, approval of his job performance dropped to 76% in May from 95% in February."
posted by msalt at 5:23 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

I wonder why anyone would expect anything more from Megan Kelly. Yeah, she was perhaps a bit less -ist than the rest of her Fox News coworkers; thing is, she still worked at Fox News. This idea that she suddenly became someone trustworthy or credible just because she threw a non-softball question to Congressman (R) here and there and later moved to NBC is a headscratcher.
posted by lmfsilva at 5:27 AM on June 16, 2017 [26 favorites]

There are plenty of snakes all over the place these days. I don't think it's necessarily a binary... Intersectional snakism, maybe.
posted by saulgoodman at 5:38 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Some snakes are snakier than others, to quote Morehissy. The Snakerton Window keeps slithering.
posted by Rust Moranis at 5:40 AM on June 16, 2017 [18 favorites]

Trump: 'Fake News Media hates when I use' Twitter

Trump disapproval hits 64% in new AP poll
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:41 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

He's back on Twitter, practically goading folks into leaking more incriminating info:

Trump: 'Nobody has been able to show any proof' on Russia
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:43 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Kinda like how some German speakers find it hard to enjoy Downfall subtitle parodies.

To be fair, I think there might be one or two other reasons there as well.
posted by jammer at 5:45 AM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

Does he really think we hate it when he tweets? I love it when he tweets. He gives away information and glimpses into his psyche. And he provides evidence to strike down his Executive Orders and such.
posted by Twain Device at 5:52 AM on June 16, 2017 [22 favorites]

Does he really think

Not really, no.
posted by Rust Moranis at 5:53 AM on June 16, 2017 [20 favorites]

Has there been any sort of tally/chart of his retweets/likes vs time on the twitter front?
posted by RolandOfEld at 5:53 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

normally i think of general intelligence as a flawed concept that is used post-facto to explain success but donald trump keeps proving its usefulness by not having any of it.
posted by murphy slaw at 5:55 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

This is a thing I've been expecting, and not understanding why Right Wingers haven't been. Why in the world have they thought that all this rhetoric was only going to inflame those on the Right? It's bizarre when they bullshit about civil war and such, and somehow ignore the part about the other side shooting back.
...
That the incident "isn't about guns," but rather "the Left's dangerous ideology" that involves "fanning the flames of hate."

I still have a couple conservative voices on my FB timeline, and one of them has posted several things over the last few months about how "the left" is becoming more violent - and that's a justification for making sure the "good guys" have access to firearms. That the rhetoric of violence and fear inflames violence and fear from those considered the enemy is a feature, not a bug.
posted by solotoro at 5:59 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

Has this been posted yet?

The 332 People, Places and Things Donald
Trump Has Insulted on Twitter: A Complete List [NYT]
posted by slipthought at 6:00 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

To answer myself, yes, looks like 3 previous times, 1, 2, 3; but not since Nov 2016 and the list has been updated.
posted by slipthought at 6:04 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

The GOP is not feeling good about GA-06. From Politico:

The GOP is bracing for the prospect of a loss in Tuesday’s Georgia’s special election that could have far-reaching implications for President Donald Trump and his party’s fortunes in 2018.

As grim confidential polling data circulates among GOP strategists, interviews with nearly two dozen Republican operatives and officials reveal that they are preparing for the possibility of an unnerving defeat that could spur lawmakers to distance themselves from Trump and his already-troubled legislative agenda, and potentially encourage a wave of retirements.

While no one is willing to publicly write off Handel’s chances just yet — Republicans stress that she remains competitive and point to robust GOP early voting figures — several private surveys taken over the last few weeks show Republican nominee Karen Handel trending downward, with one private party poll showing 30-year-old Democrat Jon Ossoff opening up a more than five-point lead in the Republican-oriented, suburban Atlanta seat.

“If we’re losing upper middle class, suburban seats in the South to a 30-year-old progressive liberal, we would be foolish not to be deeply concerned about the possibility that would exist for a tidal wave election for Democrats in 2018,” said Chip Lake, a Georgia-based Republican strategist and former Capitol Hill chief of staff.

Some fear the catalytic effect a GOP loss would have on the Democratic opposition, which has been raising money and recruiting candidates at a breakneck pace since Trump’s inauguration. “If Ossoff wins, you’re going to see the floodgates open, with Democrats recruiting candidates in races from governor to county commission,” said Randy Evans, an influential Republican National Committeeman from Georgia.

And even Drudge is trolling them about it:

@DRUDGE
Don't Republicans deserve to lose GA race next week? Done so little to help new president; have spent most of time investigating him! BURN
posted by chris24 at 6:04 AM on June 16, 2017 [26 favorites]

The latest Wall Street Journal/NBC News poll found that 4 out of 10 people who voted for Mr. Trump said they did so because they ~~didn’t like Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton~~ would rather vote for literally any man over literally any woman, not because they liked him or his policies.
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:06 AM on June 16, 2017 [52 favorites]

After 7 months of investigations & committee hearings about my "collusion with the Russians," nobody has been able to show any proof. Sad!

Trump, your grievance is illegitimate
I stand by what I said, every bit of it
You stand only for yourself
It’s what you do
I can’t apologize because it’s true
posted by entropicamericana at 6:07 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

> As grim confidential polling data circulates among GOP strategists, interviews with nearly two dozen Republican operatives and officials reveal that they are preparing for the possibility of an unnerving defeat that could spur lawmakers to distance themselves from Trump and his already-troubled legislative agenda, and potentially encourage a wave of retirements.

Lie down with dogs and you get up with fleas. Lie down with Trump and you might not get up at all.
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:09 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Ken Starr(!): Firing Mueller would be an insult to the Founding Fathers
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:12 AM on June 16, 2017 [11 favorites]

@realDonaldTrump
I am being investigated for firing the FBI Director by the man who told me to fire the FBI Director! Witch Hunt

---

I assume he's talking about Rosenstein since he wrote the CYA Comey memo and hired Mueller. Setting it up to fire him so he can get to someone who will fire Mueller is my guess.
posted by chris24 at 6:12 AM on June 16, 2017 [49 favorites]

.. and that's a justification for making sure the "good guys" have access to firearms. That the rhetoric of violence and fear inflames violence and fear from those considered the enemy is a feature, not a bug.

I was thinking the same thing yesterday after hearing more of the NRA's BS about a world of good guys and bad guys to make their claim that background checks, permits, licenses, etc are all useless because the "bad guys" go through black market channels anyways.

But even in their imaginary good guy and bad guy world, why wouldn't they at least support more regulations so that law enforcement can more effectively crack down on the bad guys and black market firearms? Or is it just a thing where they secretly (subconsciously?) need armed bad guys around so the good guys have more reason to buy guns?
posted by p3t3 at 6:16 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

I am being investigated for firing the FBI Director by the man who told me to fire the FBI Director!

Too bad you told us on national TV (and the Russians privately) that you didn't fire Comey because of anything Rosenstein wrote.
posted by diogenes at 6:16 AM on June 16, 2017 [68 favorites]

He sounds increasingly desperate. Good! Use your aggressive feelings, boy. Let the tweets flow through you.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 6:18 AM on June 16, 2017 [66 favorites]

Trump: 'Nobody has been able to show any proof' on Russia

That's true. Investigators are generally not allowed to show the evidence to suspects before trial.
posted by msalt at 6:19 AM on June 16, 2017 [27 favorites]

I dunno about you guys but if somebody just randomly said to me, "I absolutely don't have sex with chickens" I totally wouldn't think they have sex with chickens.

If they did do this it would be confusion sowing propaganda because you can't have PIV sex with chickens because they have neither penis nor vagina.

Chicken Balls are #fakeFoods!
posted by srboisvert at 6:21 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

I hear you, EmpressCallipygos. I'm 33 and so didn't live in a time where the imminent threat of nuclear annihilation was front and center, but lo and behold, two weeks ago I began having nuclear holocaust nightmares. Not just that, but every time I am with loved ones, and the flash is so bright that I inform them that we are too close to even run, and I wake up right before we are disintegrated - so not just a fear of nuclear war, but also complete powerlessness and despair.

The zoloft I started 3 months ago wasn't doing much, so doc doubled the dosage. Hoping that will assist with all this terror somewhat. Ugh. What a world we live in.
posted by lazaruslong at 6:21 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

Ken Starr(!): Firing Mueller would be an insult to the Founding Fathers

Certainly, if Mueller wanders outside the bounds of professionalism and basic integrity, he can and should be fired. Concerns are already being raised — including about Mueller’s friendship with Comey and his staff-packing with anti-Trump partisans. He will be closely watched.

Fuck you, Mueller has more integrity in a fingernail than you.

Among other things, the Senate secured a public and unequivocal denial by the attorney general of campaign collusion. While the Democrats expressed frustration with the attorney general’s refusal to discuss his conversations with the president, Sessions was on entirely solid ground in safeguarding the president’s right to invoke executive privilege, a constitutionally based protection unanimously recognized by the Supreme Court as integral to our system of separation of powers.

Fuck you liar, he didn't invoke executive privilege, he refused to answer without invoking it.

Notwithstanding reports that the special counsel has launched an inquiry into whether the president obstructed justice, the early returns also suggest the absence of any Oval Office criminality, even with the unsettling use of Trump Tower business methods where they don’t belong. To “hope” that the director would abandon a line of inquiry is most naturally read as pleading and cajoling, but not as an order. In any event, at the time Comey didn’t treat the president’s words as a directive.

Fuck you again for another lie. Comey specifically said he took it as an order/directive. And there's plenty of indications of criminality.

Crawl back into to your hole you rape-facilitating/excusing piece of shit.
posted by chris24 at 6:21 AM on June 16, 2017 [49 favorites]

The 332 People, Places and Things Donald Trump Has Insulted on Twitter: A Complete List [NYT]

This is the levity I needed on a Friday morning. Thank you.
posted by uncleozzy at 6:24 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Too bad you told us on national TV (and the Russians privately) that you didn't fire Comey because of anything Rosenstein wrote.

And even beyond that, Rosenstein didn't "tell him" to do anything. He wrote a memorandum for the AG and proposed no concrete action.

Whatever Trump did with that information was his own decision.
posted by jammer at 6:25 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

Trump, your grievance is illegitimate
I stand by what I said, every bit of it
You stand only for yourself
It’s what you do
I can’t apologize because it’s true

That's the worst limerick I'ver ever heard.
posted by sour cream at 6:27 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Trump, for months, has bristled almost daily at the ongoing probes. He has sometimes, without prompting, injected “I’m not under investigation” into conversations with associates and allies. He has watched hours of TV coverage every day — sometimes even storing morning news shows on his TiVo to watch in the evening — and complained nonstop.

I had a friend who did some very bad white collar crime stuff, and the husband of the colleague she was in cahoots with started threatening to whistleblow as a bargaining chip to get their kids in a custody battle. My friend lost her mind. She started imagining that cop cars driving by her house were casing her house, was Google Earthing images to see if her house was surrounded at night, made fake suicide threats and was hospitalized to try and get sympathy, and on and on. She detached from reality and could not hold onto rationale thoughts that if she was actually accused of something by a colleague's husband, having her house surrounded by cops is not exactly the way it would have played out.

My point being, Trump's actions are the paranoia of the guilty.
posted by archimago at 6:30 AM on June 16, 2017 [43 favorites]

Among other things, the Senate secured a public and unequivocal denial by the attorney general of campaign collusion. While the Democrats expressed frustration with the attorney general’s refusal to discuss his conversations with the president, Sessions was on entirely solid ground in safeguarding the president’s right to invoke executive privilege, a constitutionally based protection unanimously recognized by the Supreme Court as integral to our system of separation of powers.
Fuck you liar, he didn't invoke executive privilege, he refused to answer without invoking it.

There was a piece on this in the NY Times that was informative to me - I didn't know much about the policies around his claim that he was protecting the President's right to later invoke privilege:

The other was a November 1982 White House directive to the heads of all executive branch departments and agencies, signed by President Ronald Reagan, which laid out procedures for “this administration” governing congressional requests for information. It said that if Congress requested information that might be subject to executive privilege, officials should “request the congressional body to hold its request in abeyance” pending a final presidential decision on whether to assert the privilege.

So while there's some question about whether Sessions was technically able to do what he did, there's precedent - and it seems like the way the committee could have avoided the probably MUCH longer conversation of calling the precedent itself into question would have been to say "Fine, you now have our questions on the record, go ask the President which ones he chooses to invoke privilege for, and come back. How's tomorrow look on your calendar?"
posted by solotoro at 6:34 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

It's not like Sessions (or the others) cited that White House directive as the basis for their refusal to answer, though.
posted by bardophile at 6:40 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Mueller is a competent Witch Hunter. He is going to come down on the Wicked Witch of the West Wing like a ton of bricks.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 6:40 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

Mueller is a competent Witch Hunter. He is going to come down on the Wicked Witch of the West Wing like ̶ ̶a̶ ̶t̶o̶n̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶b̶r̶i̶c̶k̶s̶ bucket of water.
posted by Twain Device at 6:54 AM on June 16, 2017 [11 favorites]

My teenage nuclear-war dreams haven't come back, I think because I am past the point of worrying about the literal end of the world. I worry about everything deteriorating into starvation/violence and my family suffering. Death by quick flash of light seems less frightening. Which is all very fucked up.

Re the wedding planner becoming HUD Region II head, the sad thing is that she's probably still more qualified than her boss, Ben Carson.
posted by emjaybee at 6:56 AM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

Re the wedding planner becoming HUD Region II head, the sad thing is that she's probably still more qualified than her boss, Ben Carson.

In Trump's racist mind, she's exactly as qualified for a HUD job as Carson, because she's also African-American.
posted by Etrigan at 6:59 AM on June 16, 2017 [24 favorites]

TIL that Mueller's name derives from the German for "miller."
Good one, 2017 Writers!

Grind 'em up fine, Wheels of Justice!
posted by obliviax at 7:00 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Michael D. Shear, NYT: Trump Will Allow 'Dreamers' to stay in U.S., Reversing Campaign Policy
posted by joyceanmachine at 7:01 AM on June 16, 2017 [28 favorites]

Michael D. Shear, NYT: Trump Will Allow 'Dreamers' to stay in U.S., Reversing Campaign Policy

Fantastic on two levels; a) Dreamers get to stay, b) a good way to lose some of his racist, nutjob base.
posted by chris24 at 7:09 AM on June 16, 2017 [14 favorites]

First on CNN: New TV ads target Senate Republicans over health care : New television and digital ads launching Friday target Nevada Sen. Dean Heller -- the Republican who is likely in the most danger of losing his seat in the 2018 midterms -- as well as Alaska Sen. Lisa Murkowski, Maine Sen. Susan Collins and West Virginia Sen. Shelley Moore Capito, three GOP lawmakers seen as potentially hesitant to back a plan that could reduce coverage.

The ads, a seven-figure buy by Save My Care, a group that has served as an umbrella for much of the Democratic effort to preserve the Affordable Care Act and oppose the GOP repeal-and-replace bid, cast the Republican senators as "a deciding vote."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:11 AM on June 16, 2017 [31 favorites]

Michael D. Shear, NYT: Trump Will Allow 'Dreamers' to stay in U.S., Reversing Campaign Policy

Good news out of the White House! I... almost... remember what this feels like.
posted by marshmallow peep at 7:17 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

Deputy attorney general privately acknowledges he may need to recuse himself from Russia probe: The senior Justice Department official with ultimate authority over the special counsel's probe of Russia's alleged meddling in the 2016 election has privately acknowledged to colleagues that he may have to recuse himself from the matter, which he took charge of only after Attorney General Jeff Sessions' own recusal, sources tell ABC News.

Those private remarks from Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein are significant because they reflect the widening nature of the federal probe, which now includes a preliminary inquiry into whether President Donald Trump attempted to obstruct justice when he allegedly tried to curtail the probe and then fired James Comey as FBI director.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:18 AM on June 16, 2017 [34 favorites]

I am the very model of a modern major Twitterer.
I've several tons of grudges and no one could be bitterer.
I see everywhere conspiracies, historical, hysterical.
I announce them with misspellings and blame those on my clerical.
The always-lying press won't proclaim my works victorious.
Forget that B.I.G., I am the new notorious.
And so I soldier on, forever predisential.
My words might make no sense, but still they are e-ssen-tial.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 7:19 AM on June 16, 2017 [82 favorites]

I've been playing a lot of Total War: Warhammer recently, so I'm imagining that he's being chased by Mueller looking like this, and I'm telling you, it really brightens up the day.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:20 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

President Trump chooses inexperienced woman who planned his son Eric's wedding to run N.Y. federal housing programs

Many of us have already had at least one moment where a Trump appointee's blatant lack of pertinent qualifications hits especially hard because it shows utter disdain for the professions to which we've devoted our careers. My friends in science have been apoplectic for months. This one gets under my skin, for in a previous life I ran a state-wide HUD-funded housing program during the first Bush administration.

The person holding the equivalent position for our district was hugely important, with enormous and difficult responsibilities that affected hundreds of thousands of people's lives and livelihoods. She had previously managed something in the corporate sector with many moving parts, tons of employees and lots of separate real estate holdings, so she wasn't flummoxed by the scale and could therefore master the housing policy content... and did, as a fundamentally responsible person. I can't imagine learning both on the job and at a very young age; no matter how marvelous this person may be, success is improbable.

But it's Trump's disrespect for the housing mission and the people HUD helps that just crushes me: first Ben Carson, now this appointment. And his assumption that Black Friend = Qualified HUD Executive disses all of the POCs who work in housing and community development. Is he still working through his feelings about Section 8 and HUD from his adventures in discrimination with Fred? It's all sickening.

I don't remember feeling similarly personally affronted under Obama or Clinton, but it's a hallmark of incompetent GOP administrations even when they aren't choosing people with the intent of having them destroy an agency from within, a la Reagan's appointment of David Stockdale to run the Small Business Administration. GWB appointed a recent college grad with politically connected parents and no transportation planning experience to devise a traffic plan for Baghdad, an incredibly complex task that would challenge seasoned professionals.

TL;DR This sucks.
posted by carmicha at 7:22 AM on June 16, 2017 [99 favorites]

Yup carmicha, and don't forget Brownie!!
posted by Melismata at 7:25 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Deputy attorney general privately acknowledges he may need to recuse himself from Russia probe

From the article:

Rosenstein is keenly aware that he could become a potential witness in the investigation.

"I understand there are serious allegations that have been raised," Rosenstein told a Senate panel earlier this week. "I recognize the importance of these questions, and I think that Director Mueller ought to review that and make a determination of whether or not he believes it is within the scope of his investigation."

Rep. Brian Schatz, D-Hawaii, asked Rosenstein specifically whether he might have a conflict of interest if he becomes a witness in the investigation.

"I'm not going to answer hypothetical questions," Rosenstein said. "[But] I am working with career professionals who know these rules and are responsible for enforcing these rules, and I can assure you that we're going to do the right thing, and we're going to defend the integrity of that investigation."

As Brian Buetler at TNR, Josh at TPM and others have pointed out, pretty much everything Rosenstein has done from the moment he appointed Mueller has been consistent with him believing he witnessed a crime. Recusing himself would be the latest indication.
posted by chris24 at 7:28 AM on June 16, 2017 [51 favorites]

Polemicists in Robes (Slate): On Wednesday, three of them had a turn before the Senate Judiciary Committee: 44-year-old Kevin Newsom, an 11th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals nominee from Alabama; 52-year-old John Bush, a 6th Circuit nominee from Kentucky; and 37-year-old Damien Schiff, a nominee for the U.S. Court of Federal Claims, which oversees environmental and agency suits.

Schiff, an attorney at the Pacific Legal Foundation, has a sideline as a blogger. In a 2007 post on his personal blog, he wrote, “It would seem that Justice [Anthony] Kennedy is (and please excuse the language) a judicial prostitute, ‘selling’ his vote as it were to four other Justices in exchange for the high that comes from aggrandizement of power and influence, and the blandishments of the fawning media and legal academy.” In 2009, Schiff railed against the anti-bullying program in a California school district: “I have not seen the proposed lesson, but … it seems to teach not only that bullying of homosexuals is wrong, but also that the homosexual lifestyle is … good, and that homosexual families are the moral equivalent of traditional heterosexual families.” Schiff then added: “Perhaps someone will respond: would you have objected to an anti-racism curriculum being taught in 1950s Arkansas? I guess my answer there would be a qualified yes, that I would have objected, not that I would approve of racism, but that, as a prudential matter, the best way to get people to drop their racist views would not be to force the teaching of their children.”
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:28 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Putin offers Comey political asylum (real)

I mean his country may be in an economic and demographic death spiral but at least he seems to be having a good time which is what really matters.

Maybe there is someone else who would benefit from his offer of asylum?

Boris Johnson comes to mind, for multiple reasons.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:29 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Where is Jared? Maybe bummed out that Kushner Firm Gives Up On Getting Tax Break For Jersey City Development (NPR, June 15, 2017)

The real estate company run by the family of Jared Kushner, President Trump's son-in-law and adviser, has dropped its quest for a major tax break for a skyscraper project in New Jersey.

The Kushner Companies had been seeking a 30-year tax abatement for One Journal Square, a proposed $821 million luxury residential development in Jersey City, N.J.

Last week, the project's developer informed Mayor Steve Fulop that it will no longer seek that tax abatement, a spokeswoman for Jersey City confirmed Thursday.

Fulop had already withdrawn his support for the tax break, after news reports appeared last month recounting how Jared Kushner's sister had mentioned his name and position at the White House while pitching the project to Chinese investors.

Jared Kushner stepped away from his role as CEO of the family business when his father-in-law, took office.

After the stories appeared about the investment pitch in China, the Kushner Companies apologized for the name dropping.

This is the latest hurdle for the developer's plan to build two skyscrapers on a long-vacant lot in the heart of the city's Journal Square neighborhood. The office space provider WeWork, which was originally pitched as an investor and anchor tenant, is no longer involved in the project.

No ridiculous tax-break and no major investor and anchor tenant? Here, let me tune up my tiny violin.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:30 AM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

The senior Justice Department official with ultimate authority over the special counsel's probe of Russia's alleged meddling in the 2016 election has privately acknowledged to colleagues that he may have to recuse himself from the matter,

So, um, does this mean Rosenstein would then be unable to fire Mueller?
posted by Devonian at 7:31 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

So, um, does this mean Rosenstein would then be unable to fire Mueller?

But that has to leave someone with authority to fire Mueller...who?
posted by saysthis at 7:32 AM on June 16, 2017

It's like Schrödinger's Cat. Rosenstein must be a good guy because Trump picked him a few weeks ago, and Trump doesn't make mistakes, so Trump hasn't fired him... but he must also be a bad guy because he appointed a Special Counsel for an investigation Trump was trying to obstruct, and Trump is on Twitter accusing him of a partisan witch-hunt... it's one of life's greatest mysteries! 🤔🤔🤔
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:33 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

So, um, does this mean Rosenstein would then be unable to fire Mueller?

But that has to leave someone with authority to fire Mueller...who?

Associate Attorney General Rachel Brand

"In the recent meeting with Brand, Rosenstein told her that if he were to recuse himself, she would have to step in and take over those responsibilities. She was sworn-in little more than a month ago."
posted by chris24 at 7:33 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

It's like Schrödinger's Cat.

We got the flip flop with Mueller as well. Sarah Huckabee Sanders admitted two days ago that Mueller was in the White House interviewing - presumably for FBI Director - the day before he took the SC role. So, he's good enough to head the FBI one day, a bad guy the next.
posted by chris24 at 7:36 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

So, um, does this mean Rosenstein would then be unable to fire Mueller?

Yes but the next in line would be Brand, then Boente, and after that we're down to US Attorney's appointed by Trump. The likelihood of Mueller being fired increases with each step closer to someone appointed by Trump. Rosenstien is on record not to interfere, no one else is yet. All things equal, you'd rather have the guy publicly committed to shielding the investigation and trying to rebuilt his wreckage of a career than another unknown, or worse still, than a Trump appointee.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:36 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Wikipedia: Rachel Lee Brand (born May 1, 1973) is an American lawyer, academic, and government official. She was sworn in as the United States Associate Attorney General on May 22, 2017, after being nominated to the position by President Donald Trump and confirmed by the United States Senate. Brand is the first woman to serve as Associate Attorney General.[1] She served as Assistant Attorney General for the Office of Legal Policy in the George W. Bush administration and was appointed by President Barack Obama to serve on the Privacy and Civil Liberties Oversight Board. Prior to becoming Associate Attorney General, Brand was an associate professor at Antonin Scalia Law School.

FWIW.
posted by saysthis at 7:36 AM on June 16, 2017

Welp. I didn't realize Brand was a Trump appointee herself. We want Rosenstien there.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:39 AM on June 16, 2017

lol Antonin Scalia Law school
posted by angrycat at 7:41 AM on June 16, 2017 [31 favorites]

Both Obama and Trump appointee, could be one of those hardboiled Constitutional literalist types, can't afford too dig too much tonight, but maybe someone more gracious with their time can.
posted by saysthis at 7:43 AM on June 16, 2017

Did she also attend the Jeffrey Dahmer Culinary Academy
posted by Rust Moranis at 7:43 AM on June 16, 2017 [37 favorites]

So, um, does this mean Rosenstein would then be unable to fire Mueller?

Yeah, but Donnie Two Scoops is already making noises that Rosenstein's head is on the block for "Investigating me for firing a man he told me to fire!" on Twitter. This is going to be in retaliation for ordering the Special Prosecutor, and in telling congress he wouldn't fire Mueller without good cause. He may want to back out of the line of fire just to keep some semblance of order in the DOJ as a whole, as Sessions is about as good at his job as Trump is at his.
posted by Slap*Happy at 7:43 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

Prior to becoming Associate Attorney General, Brand was an associate professor at Antonin Scalia Law School.

Is that last bit a figure of speech, like The School Of Hard Knocks, or a real place?

*clickety-click*

Holy cow.
posted by wenestvedt at 7:44 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Side note about the Antonin Scalia Law School - it had its name changed from the initial version, Antonin Scalia School of Law, due to an unfortunate acronym - ASSoL.
posted by marshmallow peep at 7:44 AM on June 16, 2017 [91 favorites]

"Investigating me for firing a man he told me to fire!"

You know, this is probably true. T really, really has no idea how any of this works.
posted by Melismata at 7:45 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

lol Antonin Scalia Law school

That's George Mason Law. They renamed it after Scalia died, I guess to make it even more clear that you go to that school not so much for a legal education, but as a finishing school for a career as a Republican apparatchik. It was obvious before that, but they must've felt the need to make it explicit.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:46 AM on June 16, 2017 [26 favorites]

Seems like Brand won't be a push over. Trump is probably worried about his Brand. But you can't rustle Brand.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:46 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

Vox: We asked 8 Senate Republicans to explain what their health bill is trying to do:

Jeff Stein: So you're saying [the bill] will lower the rates?
Chuck Grassley: Um, if you're talking about lowering the rates from now down, no. The rates could be way up here. [Points to sky] And if they — if we get a bill passed, it maybe wouldn't go up or would go up a heck of a lot less than they would without a bill.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:48 AM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

They renamed it after Scalia died, I guess to make it even more clear that

--that $30 million buys you a lot of law.
posted by Etrigan at 7:48 AM on June 16, 2017 [23 favorites]

George Mason is little more than a wholly owned subsidiary of Koch Industries at this point. The Kochs also bought the entire econ department.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:51 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Doesn't mean she'll do what 45 tells her to - she's a career lawyer across multiple administrations, and one presumes wouldn't fire Mueller without due cause. She won't be beholden to his grace and favour, but she would be very open to having her life destroyed by him if she buckles.

Here's hoping, anyhow.

(As for the Antonin Scalia School Of Law... I'm just sad that there's no city in the US called Christwater, because then there could be a branch of that school, the Christwater ASSoL.)
posted by Devonian at 7:52 AM on June 16, 2017 [25 favorites]

Hammer is a known accomplice of Clinton and her insatiable desire to destroy phones. Sadly, the law enforcement community regards him as untouchable.

Why do I hear this in Jon Snow's voice?
posted by jaruwaan at 7:55 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

The rates could be way up here. [Points to sky] And if they — if we get a bill passed, it maybe wouldn't go up or would go up a heck of a lot less

Trying to explain "bending the cost curve" to people who don't understand graphs?

(I really wonder what percentage of adults in the US can interpret a plot of an equation or a data series. And what the overlap is of people who can't do that, and climate deniers. I also wonder how many Republican members of congress can do that...)
posted by OnceUponATime at 7:56 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

We asked 8 Senate Republicans to explain what their health bill is trying to do

Jesus, these guys really never imagined they'd be put in the position to have to actually come up with something that replaces the thing they howled about replacing for eight years, did they? This would be hilarious if it weren't so goddamned dangerous.
posted by Rykey at 7:56 AM on June 16, 2017 [58 favorites]

It doesn't help that Obamacare is largely derived from Heritage Foundation concepts first put into practice by Mitt Romney. But it's also the worst kind of socialism!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:59 AM on June 16, 2017 [26 favorites]

Doesn't mean she'll do what 45 tells her to

At this point wouldn't any US attorney that fired Rosenstein be party to obstructing justice? (Or some other legally bad thingy?)
posted by Room 641-A at 8:02 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

I wouldn't be so sure that Rosenstein's enigmatic statement about "anonymous sources" is an attempt to cover for Trump and anonymously sourced stories against him, whether past or future.

If Rosenstein was actually in the tank for Trump, he wouldn't have appointed Mueller to investigate him -- it's always been clear that Mueller takes this very seriously and isn't playing around. Rosenstein could have appointed someone who would just pretend to do an investigation and then declare the the matter closed. Or, he could have not appointed anyone.

So, with regard to the latest memo, I think we should be prepared for the alternate scenario that a story is about to come out with damaging info against Comey or Mueller, it may be planted propaganda, and a lot of our mainstream media sources will fall for it.
posted by the turtle's teeth at 8:03 AM on June 16, 2017 [15 favorites]

You mean any US attorney that fired Mueller, I think.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:03 AM on June 16, 2017

Jesus, these guys really never imagined they'd be put in the position to have to actually come up with something that replaces the thing they howled about replacing for eight years, did they? This would be hilarious if it weren't so goddamned dangerous.

See also: Britain, a year after the Brexit referendum, with EU negotiations starting on Monday, with

- no allies (except an extremely reluctant Ireland putting on firefighter garb)
- no functioning government
- no functioning department in charge of Brexit
- no discernable plans
- no prepared teams of negotiators
- no discernable progress of any sort in twelve months, quite the opposite.

It appears to be a trademark of These People, that the ability to sustain a rhetorical position is in marked contrast to the ability to cope with the consequences of having their bluff called. As you say, hilarious if only...

Best that can be said: the consequences of populism are now only too plain. Even Those People's supporters are starting to notice. Some of them, anyway.
posted by Devonian at 8:04 AM on June 16, 2017 [70 favorites]

We asked 8 Senate Republicans to explain what their health bill is trying to do

Oh, god. That article would be hilarious if it wasn't so terrifying. They know that they have no answers and they don't give a shit.
posted by octothorpe at 8:04 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

If Putin wants to further destabilize American politics, harming Mueller in some semi-plausibly-deniable way would certainly achieve that.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:04 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Jesus, these guys really never imagined they'd be put in the position to have to actually come up with something that replaces the thing they howled about replacing for eight years, did they?

As East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 points out, Obama had already pretty much outflanked them on the right in his futile bid to craft a plan that might attract some Republican support. But they spent seven years with the so-called "liberal media" pretending that their criticisms were made in good faith, so they were encouraged to talk as much smack as possible. Now they're stuck holding the bag, and it would indeed be funny if the lives and health of millions of Americans weren't at stake.

It's also amazing how blatantly they're telegraphing that they know the voters will hate their health care law -- and what are they going to do, blame it all on Obama? Not that I'd put it past them -- and yet they seem bound and determined to pass it anyway.

It follows that tax cuts for the rich are so important to them that they're willing to sacrifice American lives to get them. Democrats simply must hammer them, especially phony "moderates" like Susan Collins, on this point from now til 2020 at least. The charge will stick, because it's true.
posted by Gelatin at 8:09 AM on June 16, 2017 [33 favorites]

> It doesn't help that Obamacare is largely derived from Heritage Foundation concepts first put into practice by Mitt Romney. But it's also the worst kind of socialism!

I get the joke here, but this is actually very close to the truth. The ACA isn't just the exchanges (RomneyCare-ish) and it isn't just Medicaid expansion (which the GOP would describe as the worst kind of socialism.) It's both, and I reckon if the GOP could get away with just killing the Medicaid expansion while retaining most of the ACA exchanges, they'd take that deal. The problem is that the Medicaid expansion is immensely popular, while the exchanges themselves have been kind of a PR nightmare, with the website troubles, insurers leaving the exchanges at politically inopportune times for Democrats, etc.

So yeah, it's both.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:10 AM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

At this point wouldn't any US attorney that fired Rosenstein be party to obstructing justice? (Or some other legally bad thingy?)

Who's going to prosecute them?

At this point I'm watching a prequel. I know how it ends (Mueller fired, investigation quashed), I'm just watching to see how it happens.
posted by dirigibleman at 8:10 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

You'd think that a right wing think tank would have come up with something in the last six years, though.
posted by drezdn at 8:11 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Obama's attempt to gain Republican support for the ACA may have been futile, but he did receive industry support and support from conservative-ish Democratic senators, and so he was able to just barely get something passed into law. But now, the total rejection of this political compromise by the Republicans, and their lack of willingness to participate in improving it, is surely making something closer to Single Payer seem more viable every day.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:13 AM on June 16, 2017 [23 favorites]

is surely making something closer to Single Payer seem more viable every day.

Which is what should have happened in the first place.
posted by Melismata at 8:14 AM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

Should, yes. But could it have survived the intensity of the campaign against it by industry, when Obamacare was barely able to pass despite their support? Unlikely, I think.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:16 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

It doesn't help that Obamacare is largely derived from Heritage Foundation concepts first put into practice by Mitt Romney.

This is just wrong, wildly crazy wrong, and everybody on the left who says this should stop saying this.

The Heritage Foundation plan did not require insurers to provide coverage for routine care and in fact only required them to provide minimal coverage for catastrophic care after huge deductibles were first paid by their customers. It barely regulated insurers where the ACA regulated them intensely. It eliminated employer-provided insurance where the ACA protected such. It gutted Medicaid and privatized Medicare, where the ACA expanded both. Its mandate was clumsier and much less enforceable than the ACA's.

As for Mitt Romney, he actually vetoed large chunks of the Massachusetts healthcare act, including - most importantly - the penalties for employers who did not comply with the law. The Democratic legislature overrode those vetoes. Much of what we consider "Romneycare" was in fact enacted against Romney's wishes.

The ACA is not "largely derived from Heritage Foundation concepts" unless you decide that the entire concept of an insurance mandate is a Heritage Foundation concept, and other countries had insurance mandates in place long before the Heritage Foundation started desperately trying to invent a conservative policy alternative to the Clinton healthcare plan in 1993 that, being a conservative plan, would do as little to help people as possible. The Heritage Foundation is a bunko scam collective composed of garbage people who advance dishonest policy; the ACA was a serious and credible attempt to improve American healthcare which managed to partially succeed despite being actively sabotaged by Republicans from day one. The two are not comparable, so stop comparing them.
posted by mightygodking at 8:17 AM on June 16, 2017 [104 favorites]

HA. Go ahead and convince Joe Lieberman to vote for Single Payer. He wouldn't even get behind the public option.
posted by notyou at 8:18 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

I will cheerfully replace "largely derived" with "partially derived". I still think the conservative distaste for the ACA derives entirely from the President who signed it into law, and if that president had been John McCain he would be heralded as a conservative hero.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:18 AM on June 16, 2017 [16 favorites]

You'd think that a right wing think tank would have come up with something in the last six years, though.
posted by drezdn at 12:11 AM on June 17 [+] [!]

Why would anyone think that? Rant-in-broad-strokes time - conservativism, itself, is about going backward. It is retrograde. These people, even the earnest ones, do not believe in progress. They believe in going backward, and that was their starting point before the current iteration of the GOP as the party of Skeksis, Cthulu's gaping maw, and Babadook.

They are okay with all the death, discrimination, and demon-summoning the systems of the past entail. They want to go back to that. They want to unravel progress.

No a right wing think tank would not have thought of something. All they think of is excuses to roll back progress and return to feudalism. That's all they got. That's their baseline. Don't expect better.
posted by saysthis at 8:18 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

I still think the conservative distaste for the ACA derives entirely from the President who signed it into law, and if that president had been John McCain he would be heralded as a conservative hero.

Certainly anti-Obama animus is a large part of conservative opposition to the ACA, but let's be clear: the Republican party would never, never have signed the ACA into law as it exists. Expanding Medicaid, strict insurer regulation and taxes on the wealthy to pay for it? No. All dealbreakers for the modern GOP.
posted by mightygodking at 8:21 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

Indeed, as I recall, not a single Republican voted for the ACA when it passed.
posted by rikschell at 8:24 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

The ACA was a market based alternative to single payer. It was necessarily compromised because it had to win (they thought) Republican votes, and also had to win Republicans-in-all-but-name like joe Lieberman. The original Heritage plan may have been designed as a scam, just like the current "replacement" alternatives, but the ACA was what a serious conservative alternative to single payer or a national health system would've had to look like. That's ultimately why Republicans can't replace it and achieve any of the same goals that Trump actually ran on and Americans actually want, coverage for everyone, affordable price, acceptable outcomes. The only way to do any of that and not be single payer, is essentially the ACA, subsidies and mandates, combined with expanded Medicaid.

That's what people mean, not necessarily "the ACA is literally the Heritage Foundation plan", but there is no way to do the same things to the right of the ACA, as it's already the right most plan that can actually make progress towards the ostensible goal of improving health policy.

(nevermind that improving health has never been a republican goal, ever, for the purposes of this discussion, you have to pretend like they ever actually wanted to solve the problem at all, instead of cut taxes. that's obviously bullshit, but to talk about health policy, like to talk about literally every policy in american life, you have to pretend like there are republicans that care about the policy details to even have the conversation about democratic policies. its a problem.)
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:28 AM on June 16, 2017 [33 favorites]

Certainly anti-Obama animus is a large part of conservative opposition to the ACA, but let's be clear: the Republican party would never, never have signed the ACA into law as it exists. Expanding Medicaid, strict insurer regulation and taxes on the wealthy to pay for it? No. All dealbreakers for the modern GOP.

Which are mostly because they just hated Obama.
posted by Melismata at 8:28 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

@realDonaldTrump
I am being investigated for firing the FBI Director by the man who told me to fire the FBI Director! Witch Hunt

Jesus fucking Christ. So Trump and Sessions strongarm Rosenstein into cooking up that ridiculous memo as a pretext to fire Comey and make him say publicly it was his idea, etc. Then Trump immediately throws him under the bus by admitting publicly that it was indeed a pretext, thus possibly implicating Rosenstein as part of a conspiracy to obstruct justice.

Then last night he induces Rosenstein to release that ludicrously weird Trump-sounding statement about anonymous sources . And gets up this morning and accuses Rosenstein of running the witchhunt? This is like the guys from Dumb and Dumber running a completely dysfunctional BDSM club. The astonishing chutzpah of this man -- he either does seriously think no one will turn on him no matter what he does, or he WANTS them to. How can I still be surprised by this shit?

And how are you feeling about your life choices at this point, Rod?
posted by FelliniBlank at 8:28 AM on June 16, 2017 [54 favorites]

It hadn't occurred to me before today that Rosenstein would need to recuse himself from an obstruction of justice investigation, but it's blatantly obvious. His memo recommending Comey's firing places him much too close to participating in the alleged crime, even if the President acknowledges that it didn't factor into his decision.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:29 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Jesus, these guys really never imagined they'd be put in the position to have to actually come up with something that replaces the thing they howled about replacing for eight years, did they?

they probably haven't imagined that they might have to defend this country against a major foreign threat, conduct a real war against a country that's actually able to put up a real fight or deal with a real honest to god financial crisis or a major natural disaster

god help us if they do have to deal with these things because they'll screw it up
posted by pyramid termite at 8:29 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

The thing I saw about the ACA was that it was going to expose people to the fact that the insurance model cannot cover America adequately, and that it's expensive for those who can afford it. Notice how much more popular single payer has gotten recently. That's partially because a lot of people have figured out that there is no way to make insurance truly affordable. As I said before, Obamacare is not in a death spiral. The insurance model of health care is what's spiraling down.
posted by azpenguin at 8:30 AM on June 16, 2017 [33 favorites]

Obamacare might not be exactly what the Heritage Foundation proposed but it's still a very conservative, market-driven solution that's probably as far right as any government healthcare system could be and still be viable. That's why the Republicans are having such a hard time coming up with a more conservative solution because there really is none possible that won't cause a massive loss of coverage. They've got a Venn diagram of two circles that don't touch and are desperately hoping that we won't notice that.
posted by octothorpe at 8:33 AM on June 16, 2017 [11 favorites]

Rod Rosenstein must recuse himself from any decision-making, and become Inanimate Carbon Rod Rosenstein.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:33 AM on June 16, 2017 [32 favorites]

god help us if they do have to deal with these things because they'll screw it up

Perhaps I'm missing your intention here, but George W. Bush already screwed up each of the items on your list, and he seems more competent than Trump.

(I'll note that Bush apparently never imagined he'd have to defend the country against terrorism even after the daily briefing that was the intelligence community's desperate attempt to warn him about Osama bin Laden's determination to attack America.)
posted by Gelatin at 8:35 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Perhaps I'm missing your intention here, but George W. Bush already screwed up each of the items on your list, and he seems more competent than Trump.

he was more competent

look at what we have now - this is scary - they're REALLY going to screw it up
posted by pyramid termite at 8:38 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

From the managing editor of the Blaze:

@LeonHWolf:
Right now Trump is in a position that if he fires Sessions, Rosenstein, or Mueller, that could already be the final straw for his admin 1/
- Meanwhile he clearly wants to put one or all of their heads on pikes pour encourager les autres. 2/
- All the mistakes Trump has made to this point are clearly survivable. He's on the verge of making one that won't be. 3/
- Obviously he can legally fire Sessions or Rosenstein if he wants. I'm talking politically here. Would be fatal to GOP defense of him 4/
- Firing people who are investigating you in the absence of obvious gross misconduct is just not politically defensible. 5/
- Which is to say nothing of the fact that the Senate would never confirm a replacement ever. 6/
posted by chris24 at 8:39 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

LeonHWolf is much more optimistic of the GOP reaction that I am.
posted by Twain Device at 8:41 AM on June 16, 2017 [39 favorites]

Firing people who are investigating you in the absence of obvious gross misconduct is just not politically defensible.

How about firing James Comey and admitting that his "gross misconduct" was merely that he was investigating your campaign? Is that politically defensible?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:42 AM on June 16, 2017 [39 favorites]

I am impressed by Trump's commitment to right wing libertarian influenced conservative individualism.

A bootstrapped single person circular firing squad is no easy thing to pull off.
posted by srboisvert at 8:42 AM on June 16, 2017 [34 favorites]

- Which is to say nothing of the fact that the Senate would never confirm a replacement ever. 6/

Oh, they'd surely vote to confirm appointees the Senate itself pushed upon the administration. The question is how long we'd have to go without those positions filled (or filled by non-appointed professionals in the interim) before the White House caved on that point.

Also I think this tweet storm still somewhat underestimates Republican unity in the face of turmoil (or anything, really). They'll hang together and at some point they'll think "We've got Trump actually working with us now!" and it'll be a little while before that falls apart, too. Maybe after that we'll see some movement against Trump from Republicans. But I don't think we've hit peak "bargaining phase" yet.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 8:45 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Jesus, these guys really never imagined they'd be put in the position to have to actually come up with something . . .

they probably haven't imagined that they might have to defend this country against a major foreign threat, conduct a real war against a country that's actually able to put up a real fight or deal with a real honest to god financial crisis or a major natural disaster

god help us if they do have to deal with these things because they'll screw it up

Currently there aren't even enough of 'these guys' in key positions in the Trump White House to even screw it up right.

I know a cat name Don with a golden throne
Spends the night sittin' there with his thumbs on his phone
Every time you see him, he's up to some ol' dirty trick
And he's got the nerve to think he's slick
But he ain't
He screws it up every time
To tell you the truth
The dude can't even do wrong right . . .

-- with apologies to Elvin Bishop

posted by Herodios at 8:45 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

I dunno, hasn't "just not politically defensible" pretty much been Trump's MO from the get-go, and Congress' failure to act been its lifeblood?

I mean, I definitely hope the orange fascist trips over his own dick one too many times and falls into a jail cell (or falls out of office, at least), but if there weren't political capital in blatantly trying to burn the system down, we'd all be talking about President Hillary's latest news items right now.
posted by Rykey at 8:47 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Brand was appointed to the Privacy and Civil Liberties Oversight Board by Obama, so that's somewhat promising.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:49 AM on June 16, 2017

You know, I (more or less) get why the craven cowardly opportunistic weasels of Congress are still, ever, eternally enabling Trump. And I get why the people also in it up to their necks (Sessions, Pence, Kushner, etc.) are sticking by him since they'll go down with him. And an asshole like Bannon who's just a shit-stirring tourist with an escape hatch has no reason to take off while he still might get to see DC burn.

But why is everybody else, like Rosenstein and assorted moderately capable staffers etc., still doing what this man says, knowing that he has no compunction whatsoever about tossing them into the meat-grinder? -- and not even to save his own ass, just out of general egomaniacal shittiness. It cannot possibly have any resumé building value to let yourself be seen as a hapless dupe and scapegoat in this way. What the hell are they getting out of this horror show that keeps them from fleeing the jurisdiction?

(On a personal note: it's a small comfort at least to know that my own toxic stressbomb of a work environment is a cakewalk in comparison to the Welcome to Hell Administration.)
posted by FelliniBlank at 8:52 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

We asked 8 Senate Republicans to explain what their health bill is trying to do

Lisa Murkowski seems to be the only one of this gang conscious of things like information, numbers and facts. Does she have a reputation as being one of the more moderate, or at least reality-based, Rs?
posted by Faint of Butt at 8:57 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

> What the hell are they getting out of this horror show that keeps them from fleeing the jurisdiction?

My theory is that Trump actually emits superpowered hypno-rays, but they don't work on everyone.
posted by The Card Cheat at 8:58 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Trying to imagine the breaking point of GOP support for Trump is morbidly amusing.

Maybe if he put dijon mustard on a hamburger?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:58 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

> Maybe if he put dijon mustard on a hamburger?

And also was black, yeah.

Actually, I'm thinking maybe it was never about the condiments at all.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:01 AM on June 16, 2017 [67 favorites]

I for one am glad that Rod Rosenstein was in the position to appoint a competent Special Counsel quite clearly against the President's wishes. Plenty of Trump stooges in such a position would not have done so. (*cough* Sessions *cough*). In that sense, I can't criticize Rosenstein merely for holding and continuing to occupy his position. But still, he definitely needs to recuse himself now the investigation has moved to obstruction of justice.

I'm not criticizing, really. I get the sense of duty -- that's part of why I'm doing a job I hate and never wanted, because somebody had to do it and the well-being of a bunch of people depends on it. I guess I'm just mystified or impressed or something? by these folks' ability to tolerate abuse and disrespect.

I do fault Rosenstein about that statement from last night, though. If you feel honor-bound to stay at your post and serve justice, more power to you, but then you need to refuse to do inappropriate fucked-up puppet-y stuff like that. What Would Sally Yates Do, motherfucker?
posted by FelliniBlank at 9:05 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Trying to imagine the breaking point of GOP support for Trump is morbidly amusing. Insulting the wartime imprisonment and torture of one of their own...nope. Attacking a Gold Star family...nope. Admitting to sexual assault on videotape...nope. Firing the director of the FBI for bullshit (and probably criminal) reasons...nope. And so forth.

If he really is getting cold feet about the "mean" healthcare bill and wants to throw his weight around and look like a big tough boss by vetoing it, that might do it. He can endlessly coast with his base on an unrealistic hypothetical healthcare bill that never comes and keep trashing the ones Congress passes for not meeting his campaign promises, and I don't know if he knows how badly that would trash his relationship with Congress since they've been yes men about everything else he's done.
posted by jason_steakums at 9:05 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

"Trump Turns on Rod - And Confirms Probe!" (Real HuffPost headline)

There are certainly other ways of phrasing that headline, but I'm happy they ran with this one.
posted by bstreep at 9:07 AM on June 16, 2017 [67 favorites]

If Rosenstein wrote that shit himself without being forced to by his masters, then he definitely needs to recuse himself posthaste. The Attorney General making unsolicited partisan political statements about the media coverage of an active investigation? That's pretty fucking problematic.
posted by FelliniBlank at 9:11 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Here's the instagram feed for the Daily Show library of tweets. People seem to be having a good time so far.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:12 AM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

Bush apparently never imagined he'd have to defend the country against terrorism even after the daily briefing that was the intelligence community's desperate attempt to warn him about Osama bin Laden's determination to attack America.

It wasn't just the one briefing. The incoming Bush administration blew off warnings in in-person meetings with their counterparts in the outgoing Clinton administration. Bush also blew off the dozens of warnings he got about al Qaeda in briefings before the notorious August 6 PDB.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:13 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

Fox News reporter Brooke Singman says on the Twitter that Trump was not confirming that he is under investigation.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:15 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

a source close to POTUS legal team says he was NOT confirming that he is under investigation, but referring to WaPo story

... the WaPo story that says he is under investigation. Which he didn't deny, but instead confirmed. That is to say, it was not a confirmation.

This may be the most convincing explanation of anything, ever.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:17 AM on June 16, 2017 [24 favorites]

Probably a witch.
posted by Artw at 9:18 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

I know I will be pilloried for this but do you think that there is some serious backroom discussion in the House and Senate now between Democrats and Republicans along the lines of "You impeach when the time is right and we won't get in the way of the ACHA/tax reform/pic a pet Republican project"? I have to wonder.
posted by extraheavymarcellus at 9:19 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

So yeah, just to remind everyone, we have this shitshow to look forward to: The Trump administration is at odds over how to keep the government from defaulting, and time is running short

Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin wants the debt ceiling to be increased with no strings attached, a “clean” vote that simply raises the government's borrowing limit without mandating spending cuts or other changes. Such a position is one often favored by Democrats and would likely get their votes.

Mulvaney is pushing for the debt ceiling vote to be combined with “fiscal reforms” that could include changes in the budget process that set in motion future spending cuts. This is an approach often favored by congressional Republicans. [...]

The White House and Congress are running out of time to reach a consensus. Mulvaney and Mnuchin have said the government will only be able to pay its bills into sometime in September if Congress doesn’t act because there is a legal cap on government borrowing, and Congress is planning to take a lengthy recess in the month of August.

If the debt ceiling is not increased, the stock market will probably crash and the full faith and credit of the United States would take a major hit. Our--and the global--economy would be seriously damaged. If the dollar loses its status as the global reserve currency, we'll all be hurting badly.

Also worth noting that Mnuchin, Mulvaney, and the Jackass have no practical experience leveraging the power of the executive to get support for a debt ceiling increase. Now is time to start demanding a clean debt increase bill from all Congressional Democrats and vulnerable Republicans. We must start using rhetoric that apportions responsibily/blame on anyone who opposes a completely clean debt ceiling increase as soon as possible.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:20 AM on June 16, 2017 [29 favorites]

Then: "When the President does it, that means it is not illegal."
Now: "When the President says it, that means the President didn't say it."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:21 AM on June 16, 2017 [11 favorites]

a source close to POTUS legal team says he was NOT confirming that he is under investigation, but referring to WaPo story

Listen i know the tweet is not the best medium for nuance but the president's tweet fucking speaks for itself here.
posted by dis_integration at 9:23 AM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

The President's tweet unspeaks for itself.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:24 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

[Murkowski] has at times faced accusations of playing up her perceived moderation in publicity and then voting more conservatively; I'm not really familiar enough with her career to say whether those accusations are fair

You said it yourself: "[S]he was one of two Republicans to vote against confirming Betsy DeVos...but she voted in favor of bringing DeVos's confirmation out of committee, passing up a chance to actually block the confirmation in favor of a somewhat symbolic vote against."

I agree that Murkowski is probably better than whatever Tea Party clown she defeated, but it's also worth noting that nearly always, she and Collins and McCain vote in lockstep with the likes of Mitch McConnell, Tom Cotton, and the rest. And when they don't, as with the DeVos confirmation, it's meaningless symbolism when McConnell knows he has the votes anyway.
posted by Gelatin at 9:24 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

a source close to POTUS legal team says he was NOT confirming that he is under investigation, but referring to WaPo story

Yes, I'm sure federal courts will buy that, since they have already done so exactly zero times out of like ten thus far about the Muslim Ban, No Ban, You're a Ban.
posted by FelliniBlank at 9:27 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

It depends upon what the meaning of the word "investigation" is.
posted by Copronymus at 9:28 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Art Depicting A Crucified Trump Submerged in Urine Will Be Unveiled In Portland

Kelsey has been working on Piss Trump for six months. He says that even if making people angry is not his primary goal, he understands that's likely to happen.

"I'm glad they're offended," says Kelsey. "Trump was [an] offensive man and is now an offensive President."

"We're trying to keep the unveiling arty and classy, but we keep regressing to pee jokes," adds Kelsey. "We do want yellow and orange to be the [clothing] color of choice of those attending."

posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:30 AM on June 16, 2017 [14 favorites]

do you think that there is some serious backroom discussion in the House and Senate now between Democrats and Republicans along the lines of "You impeach when the time is right and we won't get in the way of the ACHA/tax reform/pic a pet Republican project"?

Ford knows that 2016 proved everyone's political prognostication has limits, but I think both Democrats and Republicans are looking at their polling and seeing the House flip in 2018 at the very least. And with the committee gavels and subpoena power, the ability of Democrats to actually investigate Trump increases vastly. I don't see the value in Democrats making deals now when their bargaining position is about to get a lot stronger.

(And impeachment is basically moot unless 1) the Democrats manage to get 2/3 of the Senate, which isn't likely, or b) enough Republicans put country over party and vote to remove Trump, which is ... probably less likely.)
posted by Gelatin at 9:31 AM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

He says that even if making people angry is not his primary goal, he understands that's likely to happen.

I'm just depressed that protesting a recycled pseudo-celebrity from the 80s involves recycling other people's art from the 80s. it's appropriate, I guess. it's fine. but Piss Christ is actually a very beautiful piece.

also I think it would be better inflammatory art and a better title if he called it Piss Fred Christ.
posted by queenofbithynia at 9:33 AM on June 16, 2017 [20 favorites]

Art Depicting A Crucified Trump Submerged in Urine Will Be Unveiled In Portland

I had the idea for Piss Trump a while ago, but this guy actually went ahead and did it, so I have to concede.
posted by Faint of Butt at 9:34 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

There Are Many Russia Investigations. What Are They All Doing? (NPR, June 8, updated on June 12, 2017)

The work of the Senate Intelligence Committee is hard enough to keep track of — but it's still only one of three ongoing investigations into Russian meddling in the 2016 election.

Here's a primer to help you sort out which investigation is doing what.

The article summarizes what is going on with the Senate Intelligence Committee, the House Intelligence Committee, and the DOJ Special Counsel, with parting notes on five more efforts.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:35 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

It's lawyers all the way down..

Katy Tur, NBC News Exclusive: Trump personal lawyer, Michael Cohen, has hired his own counsel: Stephen Ryan, of McDermott, Will & Emery.- source w knowledge [SLTwitter]
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 9:36 AM on June 16, 2017 [68 favorites]

This feels like the animated Mandelbrot set of politics, there is no end of it.
posted by Mei's lost sandal at 9:40 AM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

Here's the instagram feed for the Daily Show library of tweets. People seem to be having a good time so far.

My wife works nearby and just walked past and said there's a block long line to get in.
posted by chris24 at 9:42 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

The Russian investigation is basically the WPA for fancy white-collar lawyers, isn't it?
posted by joyceanmachine at 9:44 AM on June 16, 2017 [51 favorites]

Piss Trump is like sixth grade art humor or whatever but you know what? I'm not surprised that people's outrage shapes creative decisions. I mean, how could it not? It's an outlet, and maybe it will inspire somebody to make something that is actually interesting as opposed as to just an a middle finger to whoever is unbelievably supporting Trump at this date.

That said, I will be very sorry if this results in some asshole with a knife or a gun threatening maybe somebody with a hijab. In the same breath, I can say, as much as that will be horrible, I don't think it's the Piss Trump that's responsible. It's the outrage done in Trump's name.
posted by angrycat at 9:46 AM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

This work is also a ripoff of a visual arts project I heard about in Moscow.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:49 AM on June 16, 2017 [23 favorites]

The Russian investigation is basically the WPA for fancy white-collar lawyers, isn't it?

This President is dedicated to job creation.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:57 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

If he wants people to think Piss Trump is meaningful Kelsey should claim the medium references kompromat.
posted by Lyme Drop at 9:57 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

I haven't seen this posted before; pardon me if I missed it. The Center for American Progress has an interactive world map of Trump's conflict of interests. But, NB, at the top of the page it has a quote from Lord Dampnut that negates the whole exercise. It's a quite nuanced argument couched in legalese, but it's so persuasive.

It's interesting to see one contributing reason he doesn't seem to care a whit about Europe's fate - he has no business there. (much like he has no business being in the White House - heyoh!)
posted by HE Amb. T. S. L. DuVal at 9:59 AM on June 16, 2017 [15 favorites]

I still don't buy that Rosenstein's "exercise caution" tweet was a directive from Trump. I suspect it is more self-protective. Would anyone be surprised if "Step One: fire Rosenstein" came with some kompromat on the acting attorney general to sweeten the media frenzy?

I havent read a lot of the reactions from the pundits, but my take was that he got super panicked by the Kushner leak. Then again, I'm rarely the only person who's right about stuff.
posted by Room 641-A at 10:00 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

What if we all agreed to call off the witch hunt if Trump can prove he doesn't float?
posted by uosuaq at 10:04 AM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

Pls back the kickstarter for my art installation, it appropriates and reimagines Bill Watterson's "Calvin" character as a timeless archetype of callow, id-driven American youth, expressing his displeasure and anomie at the current presidential administration (and slyly winking at rumors of the president's foreign scandals!) by urinating on Donald Trump's head. This daring, subversive piece will be displayed on a special mobile art gallery, which is the rear window of a Ford F-150
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:05 AM on June 16, 2017 [74 favorites]

I havent read a lot of the reactions from the pundits, but my take was that he got super panicked by the Kushner leak. Then again, I'm rarely the only person who's right about stuff.

Political Twitter is basically of the opinion that this was forced by Trump either in response to the Kushner WaPo story or one that's about to come out that more obviously references foreign sources.
posted by chris24 at 10:05 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

It's interesting to see one contributing reason he doesn't seem to care a whit about Europe's fate - he has no business there.

I seem to recall that during his recent trip--maybe in Taormina?--he was complaining about how regulations had prevented him from being able to open a golf course in continental Europe, which is why he's anti-EU.
posted by Superplin at 10:07 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

I seem to recall that during his recent trip--maybe in Taormina?--he was complaining about how regulations had prevented him from being able to open a golf course in continental Europe, which is why he's anti-EU.

Yep.

Belgian daily newspaper Le Soir reported Trump told Belgian Prime Minister he has mixed feelings about the European Union (EU) due to issues he has faced in the past setting up golf courses within its borders. Trump brought up his difficulties doing business in Ireland, which has influenced his view of how the EU functions.

“Every time we talk about a country, he remembered the things he had done. Scotland? He said he had opened a club. Ireland? He said it took him two and a half years to get a license and that did not give him a very good image of the European Union.,” a source told Le Soir. “One feels that he wants a system where everything can be realized very quickly and without formalities.”

posted by chris24 at 10:09 AM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

One feels that he wants a system where everything can be realized very quickly and without formalities
Thant's not how impeachment seems to work, alas.
posted by Namlit at 10:11 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

I realized very quickly that he's a fucking asshole.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:12 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Here's the instagram feed for the Daily Show library of tweets. People seem to be having a good time so far.

I would buy magnetic Trump Tweet poetry. (last image in that IG story)
posted by gladly at 10:16 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

The article summarizes what is going on with the Senate Intelligence Committee, the House Intelligence Committee, and the DOJ Special Counsel, with parting notes on five more efforts.

Looks to me like they missed one, the joint FBI/DOJ/CIA/NSA/ODNI/FinCEN task force. They've got both deep access & deep experts, a killer combo. I expect they're the original source for most of the money laundering info going around lately.
posted by scalefree at 10:17 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

Live: Little Marco introduces his personal bully who will roll-back Obama's improved relations with Cuba
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:17 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Late to the opera, as always:

For shame!
For shame!
For shame! (Sad!)

Poor slandering one
Thy mind hast surely frayed.
Lost in defeat, thy thoughts re-tweet
Poor slandering one

Poor slandering one
If such poor rhymes as mine
Can help thee find true peace of mind
You’re welcome! Please, resign!
posted by SPrintF at 10:18 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

We must not empower authoritarian regimes like Cuba. We must empower authoritarian regimes like Russia and the Philippines, because their leaders are polite to our leader, or otherwise have compromising videos of him.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:19 AM on June 16, 2017 [36 favorites]

I'm sure this is standard, but has there ever been a time it seemed more necessary? From the Times:

Just one month into the job, Mr. Mueller has not yet finished hiring staff members or installing a computer network — deliberately segregated from the main Justice Department — in the Patrick Henry Building in downtown Washington.

posted by chris24 at 10:19 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

Maybe there's onerous golf course regulations in Australia, too?
posted by HE Amb. T. S. L. DuVal at 10:21 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Looks to me like they missed one, the joint FBI/DOJ/CIA/NSA/ODNI/FinCEN task force. They've got both deep access & deep experts, a killer combo. I expect they're the original source for most of the money laundering info going around lately.

Fascinating. Any idea how this investigation was impacted by the appointment of a Special Counsel?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:22 AM on June 16, 2017

"The informal, inter-agency working group" - if it's informal, perhaps they've wrapped it up since Mueller was appointed?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:24 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

We must not empower authoritarian regimes like Cuba. We must empower authoritarian regimes like Russia and the Philippines.

This is from Director of White House Message Strategy and Special Advisor to the President Cliff Sims:

@CSims45
I look forward to the stories about @POTUS standing up for the Cuban people while others brag about palling around with their oppressors. [pic of Obama at baseball game in Havana with Pres. Castro]

---

So the whole thing is admittedly a fuck you to Obama. And really funny given Trump's affection for Putin and Duterte as you mention, plus meetings with Sisi and Erdogan. And pretty sure he was palling around that orb with oppressors in Saudi Arabia.
posted by chris24 at 10:27 AM on June 16, 2017 [22 favorites]

It wasn't just the one briefing. The incoming Bush administration blew off warnings in in-person meetings with their counterparts in the outgoing Clinton administration. Bush also blew off the dozens of warnings he got about al Qaeda in briefings before the notorious August 6 PDB.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:13 AM on June 17 [8 favorites +] [!]

Blow off or await.
posted by saysthis at 10:27 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

The Executive Order isn't signed yet; there's still time for Raúl to call Donald Jr and give him a couple of luxury hotels.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:29 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Jeff Stein, Vox: Mitch McConnell is crippling The Resistance with his secret health care bill

But McConnell’s condensed schedule is cutting the resistance’s legs out from under them.

Just compare the process for passing AHCA with that for passing Obamacare. As that bill was being drafted, the Senate HELP Committee held 14 bipartisan roundtables and 13 public hearings in 2008 and 2009. The Center for American Progress’ Topher Spiro detailed in the Washington Post that Democrats accepted more than 160 Republican amendments to the bill in June 2009.

The Senate Finance Committee held 17 public events and hearings. Democrats negotiated with Republicans for months. Then there were Congressional Budget Office scores that appeared before Congress voted on the bill. Vox’s Sarah Kliff Obama recalls just how extensive the debate was.

All of these procedural points (and others) created chokepoints that allowed the Republicans to stir up opposition to the law. This time, McConnell rewrote the normal rules of legislating to instead blow right past them.

Scott Lemieux, LGM: McConnell’s Nihilism Works

It’s worth noting here, however, that the media is making a choice, and a very bad one, by mostly going silent on this. It could be treating McConnell’s antidmeocratic behavior as a major scandal — and, let us be frank, had Obama announced that he was going to try to ram through a healthcare bill conceived in secret with no Republican input in a few weeks, Fredd Hiatt would have been calling for his impeachment on a daily basis — but it now treats this as if it was normal. It could be treating Donald Trump’s massive, unambiguous lies about health care as major scandal almost as serious as Hillary Clinton’s email server, but it’s not. Instead, when political reporters aren’t ignoring the story entirely they’re writing stories that treat Senate Republicans as if they have no agency and the antidemocratic process is just sort of happening to them. Again, I’m pretty confident that if most elite journalists thought their health coverage was being threatened, they’d be making very different choices.

posted by tonycpsu at 10:30 AM on June 16, 2017 [81 favorites]

Trump live from Miami
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:32 AM on June 16, 2017

Trump just said it's great to be in "Little Havana" in a comedy Hispanic accent. The crowd responded by shouting "WE LOVE YOU!"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:35 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

Trump has stepped away from the lectern to eat the world's largest taco bowl. (not real)
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:36 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

So the whole thing is admittedly a fuck you to Obama.

This is the common thread for Trump and Evangelicals and the GOP establishment. They loathe Obama and everything he stands for.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 10:36 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

Apparently Little Marco is "tough, and good, and he loves you."
posted by OverlappingElvis at 10:37 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

> in a comedy Hispanic accent

Like the fucking Bumblebee Man?
posted by tonycpsu at 10:37 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Man, those Cubans at Trump's speech. They hate Castro even more than they hate racism against Hispanic people.
posted by Rykey at 10:37 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Trump: "I'm not supposed to say this, but I hope Rick Scott runs for Senate." (In fact the Hatch Act apparently doesn't apply to the President.)
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:40 AM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

They loathe Obama and everything he stands for.

Like ending the Space Shuttle program?
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:40 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

"You have heard the cracks of firing squads through the ocean breeze. Not a good sound."

(real)
posted by Rust Moranis at 10:42 AM on June 16, 2017 [15 favorites]

If you want an un-fun way to freak yourself out, just imagine Trump as POTUS during the Cuban Missile Crisis. I'd avoided going there in my mind until just now, and, well, let's just say I guess there are darker timelines out there.
posted by angrycat at 10:42 AM on June 16, 2017 [14 favorites]

I was freaked out recently by thinking about whether Trump could impose martial law in response to a relatively minor threat such as a terrorist attack. So, um, you're welcome!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:43 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

They loathe Obama and everything he stands for.

Like ending the Space Shuttle program?

If they knew about it, they'd hate it.
posted by Etrigan at 10:44 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

Trump is speaking about someone who was imprisoned in Cuba for 20 years, stating, "I love that name," and then pronouncing the person's name with his fake accent.

WE LIVE IN FICTIONAL TIMES.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:45 AM on June 16, 2017 [23 favorites]

Katy Tur, NBC News Exclusive: Trump personal lawyer, Michael Cohen, has hired his own counsel: Stephen Ryan, of McDermott, Will & Emery.- source w knowledge [SLTwitter]

"It's such a quagmire that even the lawyers have lawyers!"
posted by ricochet biscuit at 10:50 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Now he's saying it's hard to imagine a worse deal than the Iran deal... the deal he has chosen to continue to abide by without renegotiation. Trump is comfortable being in perpetual political opposition even when it is his own policy he is opposing.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:50 AM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Trump: "I am cancelling the previous administration's completely one-sided deal with Cuba."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:51 AM on June 16, 2017

If I were Trump, I'd actually think firing Mueller would be the smart play.

Any serious investigation, but Mueller in particular, is going to find incriminating dealings with Russia and/or obstruction of justice. Congress then has to act upon those findings or justify their reasons not to.

Firing Rosenstein/Mueller forces Congress to maybe act in response to THAT, but without the incriminating evidence from the investigation. Given the GOP's track record of ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ he might be better off just blatantly obstructing the investigation and dealing with the fallout.

Which means that if he fires them we take to the streets in protest marches that make the women's marches pale in comparison.
posted by lydhre at 10:52 AM on June 16, 2017 [19 favorites]

Art Depicting A Crucified Trump Submerged in Urine Will Be Unveiled In Portland

I'll say it again ... ANY depiction of Trump as "victim" (being beheaded, crucified, assassinated) is WRONG WRONG WRONG... he is the VICTIMIZER. He is the xenomorph in Alien, he is the slasher in every 80s slasher movie, he is Batman's Joker without the sense of humor, Lex Luthor with half the IQ. To depict him as anything but almost-indestructible evil is giving him sympathy and is WRONG.
posted by oneswellfoop at 10:52 AM on June 16, 2017 [47 favorites]

It's lawyers all the way down.
posted by octothorpe at 10:56 AM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

...just imagine Trump as POTUS during the Cuban Missile Crisis.

President Trump: Women uh... women sense my power and they seek the life essence. I, uh... I do not avoid women, Jared.
Jared Kushner: No.
President Trump: But I... I do grab 'em by the pussy.
posted by Capt. Renault at 10:58 AM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

If I were Trump, I'd actually think firing Mueller would be the smart play.

I might agree, except Federal Regulations say that Rosenstein or someone he's delegated power to has to fire Mueller. Rosenstein has said he isn't currently willing to do that. His replacements would also be unlikely to be willing. How many people would Trump have to fire before he gets one to comply? Such a clusterfuck could lead to either a quick impeachment or invocation of the 25th amendment.

Alternately, Trump could claim the authority to ignore the regulation, possibly in breach of the  Administrative  Procedure  Act . In this scenario, perhaps Mueller would simply continue working until a judge ruled on whether his dismissal was legal. Would Trump order the military to escort Mueller from the premises? This action too could trigger the President's removal.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:58 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

They'll go a dozen layers deep and then accidentally form a lawyer-loop, that will then detach and float through law-space in a self-contained hellboil of referring journalists to each lawyer around and around forever
posted by BungaDunga at 10:59 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

Trump: "You know Santiago? Ja?" [real]
posted by OverlappingElvis at 11:00 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

I can't even imagine being so enamored with a politician's policies that I'd be willing to overlook their clearly disdainful and racist pandering towards my own people.
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:01 AM on June 16, 2017 [11 favorites]

Guys.

I have thing to say, and I've been drinking but we all know Cuba policy's gonna do exactly what Rubio wants (AND PUERTO RICO YOU ORANGE FUCK SAY A THING OR RESIGN BECAUSE FUCK YOU RIGHT IN YOUR EXISTENCE. YOU SHOULD NOT EVEN BE REAL. THE TIMELORDS FUCKED UP WITH YOU.).

This last election we had was about bots. "I am cancelling the previous administration's completely one-sided deal with Cuba." Oh is that so Mr. Deus Ex Machina?

Cause like, how many people were all about bots on Facebook? How many believe fake news? We're all RUSSIA INTERFERED which is true but how do we make that argument without saying, "A decisive proportion of you Real Humans failed the Turing test. You really honestly did. Robots played you."

A Turing test is a test of humanity, which is to say, if a machine, i.e. (at this point in history, because no strong AI yet) a computer program, something designed to do a repeated task, can trick you into thinking it's human and rational, it passes. As in if you retweeted that anti-Trump thing or pro-Trump thing from LibCuckEagle1984, you failed.

How in 2018 and 2020 is this thing not an election issue? We all know a bunch of people got pwned by the 'bots. How is personal subjectivity to repeated behavior not an issue in the next election??????? And how does that not mean calling out dogwhistles, calling people stupid for believing them, and arguing for their non-agency?
posted by saysthis at 11:02 AM on June 16, 2017 [14 favorites]

This action too could trigger the President's removal.

Trump unilaterally removing Mueller would merely send McCain to marginally higher levels of concern. The rest of them will announce how it was the right move, 10th-dimensional chess, and how they'd been hoping Trump would do it. Mueller, they will declare, was actually a deep-cover Obama/Clinton/Deep State plant.

The fundamental rule seems to be: can Trump do it? Then he probably will, eventually. He's an angry baby sat at a control panel of a nuclear submarine. Any controls it can reach and is strong enough to pull or push, it eventually will, though it's hard to predict when and in what order.
posted by BungaDunga at 11:05 AM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

...just imagine Trump as POTUS during the Cuban Missile Crisis.

Dan Carlin's latest episode of Hardcore History includes a deeeep dive into the Cuban Missile Crisis. What he says about how Kennedy pushed back against the Joint Chiefs and the military apparatus, who really really wanted to start a shooting war -- well, it made me think very highly of JFK.

And it scared the shit out of me w/rt 45. Because all any of the generals has to tell him is, "Obama was afraid to do this," and he'll sign right on.

If we don't end up in a new major military engagement before he's out of office, it will be only by the grace of God, and a passel of miracles.
posted by suelac at 11:05 AM on June 16, 2017 [21 favorites]

Trump unilaterally removing Mueller would merely send McCain to marginally higher levels of concern.

But it would also end up in court, and I'm no expert but it seems possible the dismissal would not be legal. Elected Republicans may be impressively pond-scum-like but they will obey the courts rather than Donald Trump.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:07 AM on June 16, 2017

Elected Republicans may be impressively pond-scum-like but they will obey the courts rather than Donald Trump.

What evidence do we have of this?
posted by Etrigan at 11:08 AM on June 16, 2017 [28 favorites]

Who will lawyer the lawyers of the lawyers' lawyers?

I think it looks something like this.
posted by gatorae at 11:09 AM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

You have heard the cracks of firing squads through the ocean breeze. Not a good sound.

Havana is 228 miles from Miami.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:13 AM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

I can ~~see~~ hear ~~Russia~~ Cuba from my house!
posted by gatorae at 11:16 AM on June 16, 2017 [28 favorites]

Crazy dreams? Have I got a crazy dream for you.

The dream started with me walking along the main road near my house. It is within a week of Labor Day; State Fair time for Minnesotans. The roads are virtually empty because something like martial law has been declared; the city was bombed by a devastating non-nuclear device and another attack is imminent. In this dream, a Republican was president, who had run on the reputation of being a "moderate" but was, in fact, a crazy nut job, and word was that he had known that the initial attack would occur, but chose not to prevent it because it would enable him to do whatever he wanted militarily, and because the Twin Cities is large enough to create a lot of "optics" to exploit but not strategically critical to the economy of the nation.

So here I was, roads deserted. An acquaintance drove up in a used pickup...what was he doing here? I live in the boonies, on the opposite side of the metro as him. He's really more of a friend of a friend, and in the dream, I "remembered" that this mutual friend had moved to the West Coast a few years prior. I got in the truck and we discussed what we might do. After several hours, we parted ways--he was going to try to head out of town and I went back to my house. I had pets and I felt like I couldn't just abandon them.

As I tried to corral the cats into the storage closet under my lower level stairs, I was listening to the news broadcast in the background, when the emergency tone came on. I couldn't hear the words, but suddenly an incredible flash of light lit the window and the whole room. I felt a wash of heat that got hotter...hotter...almost unbearable. Then I woke up.

Here's the kicker. I had that dream on April 9th, 2012, not long after Obama started his second term. I didn't even know MOABs were real until last October. My West coast-moving friend DID in fact move to the west coast a few months after that dream, in July--so now it HAS been a few years since his relocation. And now here we are.
posted by Autumnheart at 11:20 AM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

Firing Rosenstein/Mueller forces Congress to maybe act in response to THAT, but without the incriminating evidence from the investigation. Given the GOP's track record of ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ he might be better off just blatantly obstructing the investigation and dealing with the fallout.

Which means that if he fires them we take to the streets in protest marches that make the women's marches pale in comparison.

Trump firing them would be hands down the most stupid thing he did in his entire life. If this happens we will have to find a new word to describe a 'leak' because the faucet is just going to be turned on. The 'leaks' so far when you put them altogether have been like reading a story that has been unveiled bit by bit. They've come across like bombshells at times but mostly they have led to more questions and mostly been about pointing at issues and pointing towards evidence of said issues.
I think that Trumps and companies level of corruption and crap dwarfs anything that has been seen before and those investigating know it and have been piecing it together for months.

One thing the right sphere is right about is that the public has seen very little hard, hard evidence after months of investigation. What they're completely wrong about is that us not seeing it means none exists. This is wishful thinking on their part. I expect that if Trump is dumb enough to fire these folks and Congress doubles down on the stupidity and does nothing we're going to see the release of some serious shit. I also expect we'll see the release of some of the shit they have on people in Congress in a sort of 'fine, you wanna do it this way? We'll do it this way assholes.'

There have been Republican lawmakers that have come out with statements for Trump not to do it. I don't think it's only because of some sort of altruism. There are likely some of them who understand what will happen 'leak' wise if he does and it won't be pretty. They're in bind right now. At least with the investigation there is some control, some predictability of process and most importantly for those that may be guilty of something the opportunity to find ways to protect their ass's (immunity, deals for talking etc etc ). Without this process they don't have any of that. They are at the mercy of those who hold the info.
posted by Jalliah at 11:21 AM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

You have heard the cracks of firing squads through the ocean breeze. Not a good sound.

jesus, being a speechwriter for trump must be the most frustrating thing.

like, even if i think that line is bullshit, it was constructed with strong imagery, but the sumbitch just can't resist ad libbing his own sentence fragment on the end of it and it lands with a wet plop.
posted by murphy slaw at 11:24 AM on June 16, 2017 [65 favorites]

If you want an un-fun way to freak yourself out, just imagine Trump as POTUS during the Cuban Missile Crisis

North Korea is damn close to having a middle that can hit the US, and that would be extremely similar to the Cuban missile crisis in terms of the position it puts the US in.

Trump has already given hints about how he'd react if that happened during his term...

"Our policy has been one of patience and restraint, as befits a peaceful and powerful nation which leads a worldwide alliance. We have been determined not to be diverted from our central concerns by mere irritants and fanatics. But now further action is required, and it is under way; and these actions may only be the beginning. We will not prematurely or unnecessarily risk the costs of worldwide nuclear war in which even the fruits of victory would be ashes in our mouth; but neither will we shrink from that risk at any time it must be faced." -Kennedy

"I don't know. I mean, we'll see." -Trump
posted by OnceUponATime at 11:25 AM on June 16, 2017 [16 favorites]

does anyone else feel like we're trapped in Zeno's Constitutional Crisis?
every action trump takes edges us closer to a full-blown constitutional crisis but somehow we never get there.
posted by murphy slaw at 11:27 AM on June 16, 2017 [118 favorites]

Trump firing them would be hands down the most stupid thing he did in his entire life. If this happens we will have to find a new word to describe a 'leak' because the faucet is just going to be turned on. The 'leaks' so far when you put them altogether have been like reading a story that has been unveiled bit by bit.

The US Intelligence community does not play fair (there's no such thing in that business), and they (to put it mildly) do not like traitors. They are generally smart and capable and very good with their tradecraft.

They tend to treat stupid elected officials like senators and congresspeople with kid gloves out of a general sense of propriety and patriotism. ...and because they're generally steerable though the normal mechanisms of state.

But you do not want to get sideways with them. They can fuck you up with breathtaking thoroughness and alacrity.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:28 AM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Feinstein is fired up with the threats to Rosenstein and Mueller. Official statement:

"l'm growing increasingly concerned that the president will attempt to fire not only Robert Mueller, the special counsel investigating possible obstruction of justice, but also Deputy Attorney General Rosenstein who appointed Mueller.

"The message the president is sending through his tweets is that he believes the rule of law doesn't apply to him and that anyone who thinks otherwise will be fired. That's undemocratic on its face and a blatant violation of the president's oath of office.

"First of all, the president has no authority to fire Robert Mueller. That authority clearly lies with the attorney general-or in this case, because the attorney general has recused himself, with the deputy attorney general. Rosenstein testified under oath this week that he would not fire Mueller without good cause and that none exists.

"And second, if the president thinks he can fire Deputy Attorney General Rosenstein and replace him with someone who will shut down the investigation, he's in for a rude awakening. Even his staunchest supporters will balk at such a blatant effort to subvert the law.

"It's becoming clear to me that the president has embarked on an effort to undermine anyone with the ability to bring any misdeeds to light, be that Congress, the media or the Justice Department. The Senate should not let that happen. We're a nation of laws that apply equally to everyone, a lesson the president would be wise to learn."

posted by chris24 at 11:29 AM on June 16, 2017 [69 favorites]

Trump firing them would be hands down the most stupid thing he did in his entire life.

Oh god, it's definitely happening then.
posted by gatorae at 11:30 AM on June 16, 2017 [45 favorites]

> "every action trump takes edges us closer to a full-blown constitutional crisis but somehow we never get there."

I disagree. We're already there, and have been for some time now.
posted by kyrademon at 11:30 AM on June 16, 2017 [16 favorites]

a source close to POTUS legal team says he was NOT confirming that he is under investigation, but referring to WaPo story

Kind of like the way kidnappers used to compose notes from cut up newspapers?
posted by srboisvert at 11:31 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Even his staunchest supporters will balk at such a blatant effort to subvert the law.

oh Senator Feinstein
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:31 AM on June 16, 2017 [37 favorites]

> Rachel Brand is next in line if Rosenstein recuses.

What do we think about her? Is she in the tank for Trump, or is there a chance that she has a spine?

For what it's worth, people at Lawfare "admire her a lot": "Brand previously served as Assistant Attorney General for the Office of Legal Policy, in other lower-level Justice Department jobs, and in the George W. Bush White House Counsel’s Office. She has also served with real distinction on the Privacy and Civil Liberties Oversight Board (PCLOB), an independent federal agency that oversees and advises other agencies’ counterterrorism activities. Brand is a conservative lawyer and not everyone agreed with her opinions on the PCLOB, but there is no doubt that she made significant contributions there and was an important voice in the PCLOB’s public output. She thus has extensive Justice Department experience and extensive national security experience. She is also intelligent, fair, independent, and tough-minded."

They don't underestimate how tricky her position will be if/when Rosenstine recuses himself, however: "Without knowing the details of the investigation, what it is looking at, what it has found already, or what Mueller’s investigative plan looks like, it is impossible to suggest how Mueller should handle the possibility of his own removal, except to say this: He needs an active plan for what happens if and when Trump pulls the trigger. If she assumes the role of Acting Attorney General for purposes of this investigation, Brand and her staff need to work with him on developing that plan and making sure it can be implemented even without Mueller—and even without Brand herself."

Meanwhile, Mueller has hired a baker's dozen more lawyers for his investigative team.
posted by Doktor Zed at 11:34 AM on June 16, 2017 [19 favorites]

Oh god, it's definitely happening then.

I will bet that there is a metaphorical file or files somewhere titled 'Release Strategy-If Trump is really and truly that stupid and goes there'
posted by Jalliah at 11:35 AM on June 16, 2017

the sumbitch just can't resist ad libbing his own sentence fragment on the end of it and it lands with a wet plop.

"Four score and seven years ago; and that's a lot of years, believe me; our fathers brought forth on this continent, you know what I'm talking about. Don't you love it folks? Just the best continent. A new nation, conceived in Liberty. That's right. Lih-buh-tee. And don't forget it. Conceived in Liberty and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal, and that's something people don't know but it's true. People don't talk about that. You won't hear that in the fake news, am I right?"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:35 AM on June 16, 2017 [78 favorites]

I mean, it is June and look where we are. This is absolute madness. We are the proverbial frog in the pot of boiling constitutional crisis.
posted by gatorae at 11:35 AM on June 16, 2017 [24 favorites]

If there's anyone who speaks consistently for (hell, even carries water for) the Intelligence community in Washington it's Feinstein. Look at her statements on Snowden, for example.

This makes her tremendously irritating at times for us Democrats, but it also means that her words here carry more weight to folks that matter than they do for her just being the senior Senator from California.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:36 AM on June 16, 2017 [23 favorites]

Please don't share nuclear holocaust dreams or imaginings. Not in here. Please.
posted by agregoli at 11:38 AM on June 16, 2017 [33 favorites]

I'm not exactly clear about what's changing in US-Cuba policy. The WaPo writeup doesn't say much, but it does say this:

Trump’s change in policy prohibit [sic] any commercial dealings with its economically powerful military and, according to White House aides, was driven by the president’s concerns that the previous policy was enriching the Cuban military and intelligence services that contribute to repression on the island.

Through civilian-run holding companies, the Cuban military owns or controls much of the economy, particularly the tourism sector. Former president Barack Obama had allowed some transactions with the security services on grounds that money would trickle down to individual Cubans who gained employment and more contact with the outside world.

[...]

Significantly, a new directive signed by Trump will not affect those elements of the normalization begun by Obama in December 2014 that are popular with younger Cuban Americans and others who have taken full advantage of them. Unlimited “family” travel and money sent to private Cubans on the island will remain unchanged.

Administration officials who briefed reporters ahead of Trump’s address, on White House-imposed condition of anonymity, said no policy changes would go immediately into effect. Instead, the new presidential directive will order the Treasury and Commerce departments to begin within 30 days to write new regulations that reverse some of those Obama implemented to ease the U.S. embargo against Cuba that has remained in place for nearly 60 years. Only Congress can lift it.

Oh, something may change, but we aren't sure what yet because we haven't begun the process to make those changes, but we will sometime in the next 30 days.
posted by notyou at 11:43 AM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

Jonathan Turley, Law Professor at George Washington University, suggesting Mueller may have to recuse himself because of his friendship with Comey. Really? Comey isn't a suspect. Isn't there a difference between a prosecutor like Rosenstein and an investigator like Mueller?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:47 AM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Jonathan Turley, Law Professor at George Washington University, suggesting Mueller may have to recuse himself because of his friendship with Comey. Really? Comey isn't a suspect. Isn't there a difference between a prosecutor like Rosenstein and an investigator like Mueller?

From what I've seen, Political and Legal Twitter have been ripping new ones for Turley and Dershowitz for their specious arguments carrying water for Trump.
posted by chris24 at 11:49 AM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

The Daily Beast: Trump Declares War on Rosenstein: ‘He Has No Qualms About Throwing Him Under a Bus’

“He’s furious at Rosenstein, but the list of his people who enrage him is ever-growing,” a longtime Trump confidant, who recently spoke to the president, told The Daily Beast. “He has no qualms about throwing [Rosenstein] under a bus.”

That single tweet threatens to upend the administration’s legal and public-relations strategies surrounding an FBI probe into alleged Russian election-meddling that has expanded in recent months to include an obstruction investigation and a probe of the finances of Trump aides and associates.

A frustrated senior Trump administration official quipped in response to the tweet, “Has anyone read him his Miranda rights?” The implication being that Trump would do well to remain silent on the issue of his own criminal investigation.
...
“The president did this to himself,” one senior administration official told The Daily Beast on Wednesday.

In recent weeks, the president has become increasingly convinced that forces in the FBI and the “deep state” are “out for his scalp,” as one White House aide described it. This sentiment is shared by some of his closest advisers, including his chief strategist Steve Bannon.
One senior White House official told The Daily Beast that the Trump tweet was directed, of course, specifically at Rosenstein. The official noted that it reflects what the president has been venting privately for the past couple of days regarding the “irony” of Rosenstein having a role in the sacking of Comey and his current role in the investigations that have taken over as Trump’s main obsession.
...
Another White House official said Friday morning that they are not shocked anymore whenever the president goes off script during early-morning tweetstorms, and for “all the heartburn and misery” they might cause internally, senior aides and advisers should all have a tough callus at this stage in the presidency.

“If you haven’t made this a settled factor in your morning routine, why are you still here?” the official asked, rhetorically.

They also provide a nice summary of the present state of affairs, which is basically Oedipus Rex:

The escalation of the probe is packed with irony. Trump’s insistence that he was not personally under investigation led him to fire the man leading the probe, which ensured a special prosecutor, which ensured Trump came personally under investigation. Now, in raging against circumstances his actions brought about, Trump has given Mueller another building block for the investigation.

Some really strange words from Trump on Rep. Scalise:

Also my dear friend Steve Scalise took a bullet for all of us and because of him and all the tremendous pain and suffering he has endured, he is having a hard time, far worse than anyone thought, our country will perhaps become closer, more unified, so important. So we all owe Steve a big, big thank you.

I mean, Trump has done more than anything to divide us, and his campaign just sent out a fundraising pitch that said "Democrats have absolutely NOTHING to offer our country," so spare me the Christ metaphors here because it's not working.

HuffPo: After Rolling Back Transgender Student Protections, Here’s What Trump Is Doing Next

The instructions, issued to employees last week, say officials should rely on “Title IX and its implementing regulations ... in evaluating complaints of sex discrimination against individuals whether or not the individual is transgender.”

An employee familiar with the guidance ― which was obtained by HuffPost and can be read in full below ― says he interprets this to mean that officials should investigate issues of discrimination just as they would have before the Obama-era rules were implemented.

posted by zachlipton at 11:49 AM on June 16, 2017 [22 favorites]

This makes her tremendously irritating at times for us Democrats, but it also means that her words carry more weight here than just as the senior Senator from California.

You are absolutely right about this, leotrotsky. I am and always will be irritated by DiFi, but she was the ranking Democrat and the first woman chair of the Select committee on Intelligence for a number of years. She is also rarely first to be critical of republicans.
posted by Sophie1 at 11:50 AM on June 16, 2017 [11 favorites]

I disagree. We're already there, and have been for some time now.

oh, i'm with you on this. it's just that for the people who keep invoking the words "potential constitutional crisis", it never arrives - probably because it's not going to be "real" until some other branch of government pushes back hard. otherwise it's not a crisis, it's just a passively accepted degradation.
posted by murphy slaw at 11:50 AM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

Man, those Cubans at Trump's speech. They hate Castro even more than they hate racism against Hispanic people.

Cubans are no more a monolith than any other group, but there is a vein of absolutely batshit ones running through the South Florida community. There was a City of West Miami commissioner (and later mayor) who was missing an arm. Because he lost it while running around in the Everglades, war gaming with some other buddies and cooking up schemes for violent attacks on Cuba. [1] A little over a decade ago a large scale survey of Cuban refugees who'd been in the US for 2-5 decades showed that a quarter of them believed that if Castro fell they would a. leave the US and return to Cuba and b. expected to reclaim their old properties.

Show of hands - if someone shows up at your door and said this is still their place because they never intended it to be permanent when they left in 1967, how many of you will say "oh, okay" and pack? We'll put aside the question of whether you really think one in four Cuban refugees in the US would really pack up and move back and exactly what that would look like.

Overall, though, this is just standard Republican party defense of The Old Ways and trying to sop to their aged defenders. As has become a common refrain, the trends are not on their side.

1993:

87 percent favor increasing international economic pressure on Cuba.

85 percent favor the tightening of the trade embargo;

77 percent favor negotiations to improve the human rights conditions on the island.

80 percent favor maintaining the current policy of no diplomatic relations and no trade with Cuba.

77 percent favor U.S. support of an armed internal rebellion to overthrow the Cuban government;

73 percent favor military action by the exile community against the Cuban government.

Seriously, those last two?

2014:

Almost three-quarters of Cubans living in Miami Dade County believe the embargo has not worked.

Fifty-two percent of the respondents oppose the continuation of the embargo.
( among Cuban Americans ages 18-29, 62% of whom oppose continuing the embargo. Similarly, 58% of those arriving since 1995 oppose continuing the embargo.)

Most respondents favor increasing economic relations with the island.

But, dig into that 2014 report and you notice that the strongest divide is in post 90s arrivals and the young, both groups that don't register and don't vote. So long as the rational Cubans continue to sit things out we're going to continue to see this shit from folks who want the Cuban vote.

The upside here may be that, as notyou points out, this might be more of the same Trump nonsense where it's all signaling and no actual action. Which might work even better here than other places because the older Cuban refugee positions on Cuba are fantastically hypocritical to begin with. (Left as exercise for reader - find all the places where pre 70s refugees simultaneously want crackdowns and actions on Cuba while also getting special dispensations for new Cuban arrivals, visitation exemptions, and remittance allowances)

[1] What, you ask? Isn't civilian violent overthrow of foreign governments highly illegal? Well yes, but anti-communist paranoia is a hell of a drug. It leads you to looking away when folks engage in these shenanigans and lets you straight-face defend astonishingly racist policies.
posted by phearlez at 11:51 AM on June 16, 2017 [15 favorites]

Buzzfeed: Don Jr. Is Ready To Fight With You On The Internet: The RNC declined to give specifics on what officials have discussed with Trump Jr. in terms of political strategy, but Lindsay Jancek, a spokeswoman for the committee, said that “efforts between Donald Trump Jr. and the RNC have been incredibly successful in pushing back against the media.”

Top Republicans say Trump Jr. has been willing to travel to fundraise more and help campaign for Republicans around the country, especially in areas where Trump’s brand of populism brought former Obama voters to the Republican Party.

"Don has a big voice and one thing I was always impressed about with Don was that he understood the Trump movement and he had a good feel on it early early on," said Sam Nunberg, who previously served as a political adviser to Trump.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:51 AM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

“The president did this to himself,” one senior administration official told The Daily Beast on Wednesday.

WILL YOU MEDIA FOLKS PLEASE STOP STATING THE OBVIOUS
posted by Melismata at 11:53 AM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

In the meantime, Trump in Miami talked about the "casserole regime" or something really close to that.
posted by Namlit at 11:54 AM on June 16, 2017

“He’s furious at Rosenstein, but the list of his people who enrage him is ever-growing,” a longtime Trump confidant, who recently spoke to the president, told The Daily Beast. “He has no qualms about throwing [Rosenstein] under a bus.”

Think this person had the slightest moment of self-awareness as they leaked this observation about Trump?
posted by phearlez at 11:56 AM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

President Donald Trump woke up on Friday and decided to publicly confirm that he is under criminal investigation—and to put his deputy attorney general in the line of fire.

At times like this it's interesting to recognize that Trump not only has no political experience, he has no experience in large organizations. He has experience in a wealthy but small family business, employing deputies from whom he demands absolute loyalty, and hiring contractors whom he often fucks over completely. Despite being "hand-picked" by the President (who, let's face it, may not have been consciously aware of Rosenstein's existence before his confirmation), Rosenstein is clearly more of a contractor than he is a made man.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:57 AM on June 16, 2017 [20 favorites]

I think that right now the Republicans are scrambling to cut their losses. They know this will explode and they know it will cost them. I bet there is a lot of screaming and yelling going on somewhere as they try to figure out how to get out of this with just a fragment of leadership intact.
Either they will manage to devise a strategy in time and we will see some *very worried* R senators asking the president to step down in a semi-private setting (maybe following the Watergate example and replacing Pence first, depending on his level of complicity). Or they will spend their precious time bickering and hating on each other, and the whole thing will explode on them, and no one knows what will happen then.

As far as I can see, no one has suggested that Rosenstein's warning about overseas rumors could be because he is worried that these rumors might somehow impend the investigation. But that was my first thought, even though I can't exactly imagine how that would play out. The reason I thought this is that I have been dealing with corrupt officials on a very local level for a decade now, and one of the things that makes it almost impossible to cut them down is their talent for obfuscation. "overseas rumors" describes pretty neatly what my opponents are doing right now. (And yes, I'm getting the threats of lawsuits too, but I have a sense of humor). In that context I've also learnt a lot about when someone should recuse themselves, and people being former colleagues and good friends would rarely be a legal reason for recusal. In some contexts there might be a political reason, but I can't see how regarding Mueller and Comey.
posted by mumimor at 12:00 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

Think this person had the slightest moment of self-awareness as they leaked this observation about Trump?

As Samantha Bee's booker said to Milo Yiannopoulous' press agent, "No."
posted by Sophie1 at 12:00 PM on June 16, 2017 [30 favorites]

One senior White House official told The Daily Beast that the Trump tweet was directed, of course, specifically at Rosenstein.

Rosenstein serves at the pleasure of the President and should offer his resignation. If the resignation is accepted, he should see if he can beat Comey's TV ratings for his testimony as a private citizen.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:01 PM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

They can call the show "The Accomplice" and guess what, it can still star Donald Trump trying to fire people who are doing their jobs.
posted by Autumnheart at 12:03 PM on June 16, 2017 [54 favorites]

R senators asking the president to step down in a semi-private setting (maybe following the Watergate example and replacing Pence first, depending on his level of complicity). Or they will spend their precious time bickering and hating on each other, and the whole thing will explode on them, and no one knows what will happen then.

Column B, Alex.
posted by Melismata at 12:04 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Man, those Cubans at Trump's speech. They hate Castro even more than they hate racism against Hispanic people.

Demonstrating why "hate" is not a great metric to base either politics or policy upon.

posted by Herodios at 12:09 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

I think what we'll see happen eventually is that there's going to be some event in this investigation where the Trump-haters in Congress decide to go en masse against him. No one wants to be first. But there's going to come a point where there's no choice, and then one key figure will come out publicly against Trump, then the dam breaks. Their problem after that is figuring out what to do next. Pence looks to be dirtied by all this as well. Possibly Ryan too. I expect that the "OK, now what do we do?" phase is going to be a spectacle to behold.
posted by azpenguin at 12:09 PM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

Pence was head of the transition team and could conceivably be in trouble down the road. If the extent of Ryan's involvement is his ongoing support of Trump and the audio recording of the joke about payments from Putin, I think he's in the clear. Sadly. I'm sure Congressional Republicans would love nothing better than President Ryan.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:12 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

And Ivanka will get her very own spinoff,

"The Real Orange is the New Black"

I think it'll work because she's even more insufferable than Piper.
posted by leotrotsky at 12:13 PM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

Rosenstein serves at the pleasure of the President and should offer his resignation. If the resignation is accepted, he should see if he can beat Comey's TV ratings for his testimony as a private citizen.

This whole thing is so monumentally stupid that I miss some of the most obvious reasons why it's so stupid. It's like you have to put yourself into a headspace of someone who is this stupid in order to see some of these obvious consequences.

So yeah, here we would have Comey 2.0. Firing Comey in the first place was dumb not only from an obstructing justice perspective but because it freed up Comey to speak about a whole bunch of things that he would have kept to himself because he had too. Heck I could see that as soon as the news of the firing came out. It's the whole 'keep your enemies close' thing.

These folks are so, so bad at politics and understanding social dynamics beyond what works on his base. For the whole world's sake I'm glad they are of course. If they were good at it we really would be screwed.
posted by Jalliah at 12:14 PM on June 16, 2017 [11 favorites]

These folks are so, so bad at politics

Luckily for them, Vladimir Putin is really, really good at politics!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:16 PM on June 16, 2017 [18 favorites]

I think the Republicans are waiting to see if they can pass a ~~healthcare~~ tax cut bill. If not, and everything is going to shit for them anyway, then Donnie is toast by the end of summer. But if they can get something passed then the death march will continue for a little while longer.
posted by Glibpaxman at 12:18 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

Rosenstein serves at the pleasure of the President and should offer his resignation. If the resignation is accepted, he should see if he can beat Comey's TV ratings for his testimony as a private citizen.

Personally I don't want him to resign. First, because as all over the map as he's been, he did hire Mueller and testified under oath that he couldn't and wouldn't fire him without cause which he didn't have. Whoever we get next will probably not be as devoted to preserving the investigation.

Second, make the motherfucker fire you. It will be one more piece of evidence in the obstruction/abuse of power case. It might not be the thing that leads to resignation/impeachment, but it will help more than resigning.
posted by chris24 at 12:19 PM on June 16, 2017 [24 favorites]

I think the Republicans are waiting to see if they can pass a healthcare tax cut bill. If not, and everything is going to shit for them anyway, then Donnie is toast by the end of summer. But if they can get something passed then the death march will continue for a little while longer.

That's a big if. Nobody, but nobody wants it passed the way it is now.
posted by Melismata at 12:21 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

In recent weeks, the president has become increasingly convinced that forces in the FBI and the “deep state” are “out for his scalp,” as one White House aide described it.

That scalp? Probably not interesting to the FBI, but I could see the CIA locking it up in some stasis tube for study next to the Roswell alien and Bigfoot.
posted by jason_steakums at 12:21 PM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Man, those Cubans at Trump's speech. They hate Castro even more than they hate racism against Hispanic people.

Demonstrating why "hate" is not a great metric to base either politics or policy upon.

posted by Herodios 11 minutes ago [2 favorites +] [!]

Quasi-multi-lingually eponysterical? (Odio is hate in Spanish)
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 12:22 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

I think it'll work because she's even more insufferable than Piper.

Orange is the New Black Season 5 (in vague, hopefully non-spoilery tones): Piper randomly pops up in the leadership of a movement that was started and run by people of color because of her compulsive need to feel important, doesn't really offer much value or help, then checks out and hides after things get tough.

The White House, Season 45: Ivanka randomly pops up in the leadership of a government that was last run by a person of color because of her compulsive need to feel important, doesn't really offer much value or help, then checks out and hides after things get tough.

Yep, checks out.
posted by zachlipton at 12:23 PM on June 16, 2017 [16 favorites]

I think that right now the Republicans are scrambling to cut their losses. They know this will explode and they know it will cost them. I bet there is a lot of screaming and yelling going on somewhere as they try to figure out how to get out of this with just a fragment of leadership intact.

This is the thing, right. What does Trump actually cost them in terms of liberal engagement? Costs them what? A dozen house seats? Thirty house seats on a really bad day? Maybe one senate seat in 2018? Maybe two if the Democrats are super lucky? They have a Senate majority no matter what coming out of 2018 because the Democrats sure as shit aren't winning any of UT, NE, TN, MS or TX. So you can lose NV and AZ and still come out being able to shove through any piece of slime Trump wants to shove through the executive to loot the country with.

What does base disengagement cost? Well Nevada is probably gone no matter what. If the base doesn't show up you forget about flipping Florida. You forget about flipping Montana. You forget about flipping North Dakota, Virginia is out of play, Wisconsin is out of play, Michigan is out of play, Minnesota is out of play. These are all dead in the water if the base don't show up and punish Republicans out of spite. You'll probably still lose those thirty house seats to boot.

No. The smart money is riding this plane until it crashes into the mountain, pretending to the electorate in 2019 like they were always against it and relying on the neutrality of the media to de facto gaslight the electorate back to the pre-2016 status quo. McConnell and Ryan have to convince the Republicans that are going to fall on the swords that it's worth it to keep angry white racist males coming out to the polls.
posted by Talez at 12:23 PM on June 16, 2017 [16 favorites]

That's a big if. Nobody, but nobody wants it passed the way it is now.

I disagree. Republican lawmakers do want the tax cuts and benefit cuts; they just don't want the blame for it. If they can get voters to believe that the collapse of the health insurance system is Obama's fault, they'll laugh all the way to the bank.

Regarding both Trump and the secret health care bill, Democrats need to go on the Sunday gabfests with one message: "What are they hiding?" And they need to prepare the message that if Trump does fire Mueller, it's because Trump has something to hide.
posted by Gelatin at 12:25 PM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

I mean I'd also say there's a tipping point at where Cantoring engages some form of diminishing returns but Virginia's 7th keeps electing Brat despite him wanting to drive the country off a fucking cliff to spite liberals and return to our Christian agrarian roots.
posted by Talez at 12:28 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

I'm sure Congressional Republicans would love nothing better than President Ryan.

Two years of President Ryan getting nothing accomplished because Democrats control congress as of 2018 and the nation shouts him down with an unequivocal NOBODY ELECTED YOU TO DO THIS, MOTHERFUCKER any time he tries to do anything other than keep the seat in the Oval Office warm for some bright Democratic rising star to take over in 2020 is pretty much my ideal happy dream fantasy scenario at this point; it would be sort of poetically sweet for Ryan to get to be president but only in the saddest, most ineffectual, lamest way possible
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:35 PM on June 16, 2017 [64 favorites]

Sandy Hook family members send legal threat to NBC over Alex Jones interview : The lawyers said that airing Kelly's interview with Jones "implicitly endorses the notion that Mr. Jones' lies are actually 'claims' that are worthy of serious debate; and in doing so it exponentially enhances the suffering and distress of our clients."

"For that NBC is responsible," the letter said. "We urge you to consider the ethical and legal ramifications of broadcasting this interview to millions of Americans. By now, it should be clear to NBC that airing the interview will cause serious emotional distress to dozens of Sandy Hook families. NBC -- and NBC alone -- has the power to prevent that harm."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:37 PM on June 16, 2017 [62 favorites]

Speaking of Trump nightmares, I had one a few months ago.

In my dream Trump told me that he was actually my father and that he was very proud of me and gave me a hug. (In real life context: the company I'd started had just won a big cash award) The horrifying part was that dream me stopped to weigh the benefits of being a Trump sibling rather than yelling 'Nooooo!' Luke Skywalker style.

I learned that the real monster is me.
posted by Alison at 12:38 PM on June 16, 2017 [18 favorites]

Oh God, can you imagine how happy Jones will be if (hopefully when) NBC spikes that interview. What better validation of his persecution complex could he and his followers ask for. The best move is not to play, NBC, but now it's too late for that.
posted by The Card Cheat at 12:40 PM on June 16, 2017 [11 favorites]

Katy Tur, NBC News Exclusive: Trump personal lawyer, Michael Cohen, has hired his own counsel: Stephen Ryan, of McDermott, Will & Emery.- source w knowledge [SLTwitter]

Tur is burning up Twitter this afternoon:

Michael Caputo, brought on to Trump campaign by Manafort, has been contacted by the FBI - source with knowledge.
Caputo has hired Dennis Vacco as counsel. House Intel is trying to schedule him for mid-July. Source says Caputo wants open hearing.
Source adds FBI wanted to talk to Caputo BEFORE he speaks with House Intel.

A little background on how Caputo fits into the Trump campaign's Russia ties: "An adviser who helped run Trump’s efforts in the New York primary, Michael Caputo, lived in Russia in the 1990s. Caputo also had a contract for several months in 2000 with the Russian conglomerate Gazprom Media to improve Putin’s image in the United States. Caputo declined to comment but told the Buffalo News, his hometown paper, that he was ‘not proud of the work today. But at the time, Putin wasn’t such a bad guy.’"
posted by Doktor Zed at 12:43 PM on June 16, 2017 [35 favorites]

Recap of Scalise condition from MedStar trauma doc (via Mike DeBonis, who is reporting for WaPo on Twitter): Came in at brink of death, bleeding now under control, will be in hospital for weeks. The good news: "an excellent recovery is a good possibility" -- should be to walk, maybe run, and return to work at some point. High-power rifle bullet did "substantial" damage to bone, organ and blood vessels. "Hundreds" of bullet fragments will be left in place.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:43 PM on June 16, 2017 [13 favorites]

Talking Points Memo: “God, this is going to make me sound pathetic, but it feels a little bit like getting dumped by your girlfriend. It feels a little like that.” That’s “alt-right” leader Richard Spencer describing the experience of getting jilted by Trump when he went all Goldman Sachs and went low energy on mass deportation.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:44 PM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

In my dream Trump told me that he was actually my father and that he was very proud of me and gave me a hug. (In real life context: the company I'd started had just won a big cash award) The horrifying part was that dream me stopped to weigh the benefits of being a Trump sibling rather than yelling 'Nooooo!' Luke Skywalker style.

FRANTICALLY GOOGLING TO SEE IF THERE ARE ANY PARTIALLY-COMPLETED TRUMP ORG CONSTRUCTION PROJECTS WITH LARGE VENTILATION SHAFTS IN YOUR AREA
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:47 PM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

The situation with Megyn Kelly, Sean Hannity, and the rest gets me wondering if we--those opposed to their hateful, racist, conspiracy theorizing--could get enough critical mass together to get all Sleeping Giants on their asses. The only thing that is going to get them off the air is to make them totally unprofitable, so I think we have to start an unrelenting campaign to shame their advertisers into refusing to fund their shows. The method seems to have been quite successful against Breitbart and O'Reilly.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:47 PM on June 16, 2017 [15 favorites]

I strikes me how ridiculous it is to claim that Mueller needs to recuse himself from an obstruction of justice investigation. The alleged obstruction of justice was AGAINST THE FBI. Is everyone who works or has worked for the FBI supposed to recuse themselves from the investigation? They're awfully close to the witnesses to the alleged crime... many of whom are THEMSELVES. Are cops not allowed to testify that they have seen evidence of a crime? Is that a conflict of interest? What the fuck people
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:49 PM on June 16, 2017 [14 favorites]

Oh, something may change, but we aren't sure what yet because we haven't begun the process to make those changes, but we will sometime in the next 30 days.

Are those 'ISIS defeating days', 'Muslim Country Ban figuring out what is going on days' or 'replacing obamacare days'?

I am no longer sure I understand what a day is in Trumptopia.
posted by srboisvert at 12:49 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Half-Life 3 will be released tomorrow, or in the very near future, believe me.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:52 PM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

I'm going to rob the FBI headquarters. All the agents will have to recuse themselves. It's the perfect crime.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:53 PM on June 16, 2017 [29 favorites]

30 Donald Days = 2 X Donald Two Weeks
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 12:54 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Cut the guy a break, he's got like four days worth of Tivo'd Fox and Friends to catch up on.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:54 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

Donald Two Weeks

He follows the Total Recall school of promised deadlines.
posted by Rust Moranis at 12:58 PM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

> That’s “alt-right” leader Richard Spencer describing the experience of getting jilted by Trump when he went all Goldman Sachs and went low energy on mass deportation.

"Who could have foreseen that a man who has spent his entire life casting people aside when they were no longer of use to him would jilt us???"
posted by The Card Cheat at 1:00 PM on June 16, 2017 [21 favorites]

An adviser who helped run Trump’s efforts in the New York primary, Michael Caputo, lived in Russia in the 1990s. Caputo also had a contract for several months in 2000...

Just for some perspective, in the mid-late 1990s a lot of Westerners wound up in the former Soviet Union looking to strike it rich as the old moribund socialist economy was opened up. I worked for a man who had somehow secured Apple's license to sell computers there. He made it about 18 months before some mafia types (his characterization) persuaded him to give up the license and return home. Which he did. He wrote a book about it, but the publishers he approached told him his case was an outlier -- folks were still confident that Russia would morph into something recognizably law and (capitalistic) order based.
posted by notyou at 1:00 PM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

Half-Life 3 will be released tomorrow, or in the very near future, believe me.

DPRK? Nuke 'em forever!
posted by Behemoth at 1:00 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

“God, this is going to make me sound pathetic, but it feels a little bit like getting dumped by your girlfriend. It feels a little like that.” That’s “alt-right” leader Richard Spencer describing the experience of getting jilted by Trump when he went all Goldman Sachs and went low energy on mass deportation.

We already thought you were pathetic, Richie
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 1:02 PM on June 16, 2017 [15 favorites]

"So you're abhorrent to Jews, Muslims and Hispanic people?"
"Yes! I'm also abhorrent to anyone including Cauca..."
"You have our full support, thank you!" [click]
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:02 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

I'm going to rob the FBI headquarters. All the agents will have to recuse themselves. It's the perfect crime.

You'll get to meet what I find one of the more hilarious law enforcement agencies in the country (not as funny as the Government Publishing Office Police, whom I am sure are hardworking people securing valuable government facilities, but it's also still funny): the FBI Police. Yes, the FBI, which is, you know, the police, has its own police force.
posted by zachlipton at 1:05 PM on June 16, 2017 [14 favorites]

Anyone figure they scheduled this shitty appearance and rollout of Twitler's "fuck Obama, fuck Cuba, fuck common sense" policy so he'd have a moment in front of a cheering crowd on a Friday before he rolled into the weekend so he'd maybe stay off Twitter for a day or two?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:05 PM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

NYT: Minnesota Officer Acquitted in Killing of Philando Castile

The Minnesota police officer who fatally shot Philando Castile during a traffic stop last summer was acquitted Friday of all charges, a decision likely to be perceived by activists as more evidence that officers can kill black people with impunity.

What more evidence could you possibly need at this point? Fuck.
posted by zachlipton at 1:08 PM on June 16, 2017 [88 favorites]

"a decision likely to be perceived by activists as more evidence that officers can kill black people with impunity."

YA THINK?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 1:12 PM on June 16, 2017 [20 favorites]

He still hasn't even picked the week he was going to solve crime in Chicago yet, either.

I think that comes after he sues the 13 women who accused him of sexual assault.
As he promised in his Gettysburg Address.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:13 PM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

It's like the NYT wasn't satisfied with how outrageous the underlying events are, and just wanted to stick the knife in a little more by characterizing a factual description of what's happening as some kind of perception on the part of "activists."

You can't die soon enough, you old gray piece of shit.
posted by tonycpsu at 1:15 PM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

This is low-grade stuff, but telling. Karen Handel's team released some B-roll for SuperPACs to use on YouTube (they do this to skirt rules with campaigns coordinating directly with SuperPACs). At 26:33, Handel and another woman are framed up for some additional B-roll and have a conversation about how Handel saw someone on her deck and considered shooting them, until it turned out to be a local police officer. The other woman suggests that they would need to drag the body in the house, but Handel points out that it would be okay, because the guy was on the deck, so shooting on her own property is okay. The casualness of the conversation about how to cover for a murder is *McCain accent* disturbing.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 1:16 PM on June 16, 2017 [33 favorites]

Oops, I missed when he said he wouldn't be suing them after he won.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:17 PM on June 16, 2017

suelac: "Dan Carlin's latest episode of Hardcore History includes a deeeep dive into the Cuban Missile Crisis. What he says about how Kennedy pushed back against the Joint Chiefs and the military apparatus, who really really wanted to start a shooting war -- well, it made me think very highly of JFK."

If you haven't seen it, I recommend Thirteen Days. Obviously, it's lightly fictionalized, but it gives you a good idea of who was pushing for what. Very easily could have gone very sour.
posted by Chrysostom at 1:20 PM on June 16, 2017

Re: the Philando Castile murder, the flagship episode of this season of CNN's United Shades of America has host W. Kamau Bell buying a gun and taking introductory firearms classes tailored for black people, which he notes the NRA does not offer.
posted by XMLicious at 1:23 PM on June 16, 2017 [16 favorites]

Earl Gray, a lawyer for Officer Yanez, said his client had to react quickly to what he believed was an imminent threat.

The folks running the simulation are definitely just messing with us now.
posted by leotrotsky at 1:26 PM on June 16, 2017 [31 favorites]

Earl Gray?
Reality Winner?

Am I forgetting anyone?

I need to get out of here...

( Opens REALTICS terminal window )
posted by PROD_TPSL at 1:33 PM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

Trump Isn't So Naive When It Comes To Being Investigated (NPR, June 16, 2017)

Some Republicans have defended President Trump against accusations related to an FBI investigation by saying he's naive in the ways of Washington. But Trump himself has shown knowledge of the process.
....
David Cay Johnston, the author of "The Making of Donald Trump": "Since he was a young man, Donald has been the subject of a number of criminal investigations, including four federal grand jury investigations and a New York state investigation into sales tax cheating, which he acknowledged he did."

Mara Liasson: "In fact, in his interview with NBC's Lester Holt last month, President Trump seemed to display a sophisticated knowledge of how the process works, describing what it's like to get a target letter - an official notification that you're the subject of an investigation.
...
That the special counsel's investigation has now reached the Oval Office is not good news for the president. But his team seems to feel he is in more political than legal jeopardy. Their latest strategy to deal with the controversy has a lot of layers. First, they say, Comey is a liar and a leaker. Second, even if he isn't lying, what Comey says the president did was not obstruction.

Third, even if the special counsel decides it is obstruction, the Department of Justice has a long-standing legal opinion that it's not appropriate to indict a sitting president. That's a decision left to Congress, which has the power to impeach. And, at least as long as Republicans control the House of Representatives, that will not be happening. Mara Liasson, NPR News, Washington."

Emphasis mine.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:37 PM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

AP: Gianforte calls for civil politics after assaulting reporter. America: 2017

I would have put these two paragraphs next to each other though:

“I think you can never erase history,” Gianforte said. “I can’t erase it, but I did do everything in my power once the event was over to take responsibility.”
...
Gianforte refused to answer questions about the attack and why his campaign initially released a statement painting Jacobs as the instigator, which contradicted witness accounts, Gianforte’s own apology letter and the criminal charge to which he eventually pleaded guilty.

He lied his ass off until after the election was over, and the interview should have been over the moment he tried to claim he did did everything to take responsibility.
posted by zachlipton at 1:38 PM on June 16, 2017 [44 favorites]

If I were the GOP and my overall agenda were to pass a trillion-dollar tax cut for the wealthy and to gut health care for everyone else, I would rally my current officeholders, tell them to pass it and eat the bullet of bad opinion, promise them lucrative lobbyist positions or whatever the fuck politicians do when they get voted out, and start grooming Republicrazy Slate 2.0 that I could then sell to the public as Still Republican But A Fresh Start. Because my constituents are morons, they can feel good about having "done something" with their vote while remaining "true to conservative values", and I am assured of their support for my continuing liquidation of American resources because the new guys are exactly like the old guys. Repeat as needed because the Republican base has the memory span of an adult mayfly.
posted by Autumnheart at 1:39 PM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

Jinkies, NPR statted the obvious without walking it back somehow?
posted by Artw at 1:40 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Your moment of light relief - President Obama to Jay Z: "Let’s face it, we both have wives who are significantly more popular than we are."

OK, back to the waking nightmare
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:41 PM on June 16, 2017 [46 favorites]

Why the fuck did they put this out there? I get the "dump stuff for the use of whoever, because 'whoever' includes your superPACs" thing, but why dump stuff that makes you look violent and creepy?

Because for Trumpettes going all standyourgroundy is a plus?
posted by chris24 at 1:44 PM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

Doktor Zed: A little background on how Caputo fits into the Trump campaign's Russia ties: "An adviser who helped run Trump’s efforts in the New York primary, Michael Caputo, lived in Russia in the 1990s. Caputo also had a contract for several months in 2000 with the Russian conglomerate Gazprom Media to improve Putin’s image in the United States. Caputo declined to comment but told the Buffalo News, his hometown paper, that he was ‘not proud of the work today. But at the time, Putin wasn’t such a bad guy.’"

Oh, you mean during Putin's first presidential term? Wikipedia is pretty thin, but you can get a hint of Putin's neo-Soviet ambitions with his return to the Soviet national anthem.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:48 PM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Meanwhile, Trump’s personal lawyer is in professional trouble:

Kasowitz Hit With Ethics Complaints in NY, DC Over White House Advice

Marc Kasowitz, President Donald Trump’s personal lawyer, is facing two ethics complaints with the New York and Washington, D.C., bars over his reported advice to White House staffers.

Both complaints cite an article in The New York Times on Sunday reporting that Kasowitz advised White House staff that it was “not yet necessary” for the president’s aides to hire their own lawyers, amid investigations by Congress and special counsel Robert Mueller into whether members of the Trump campaign colluded with Russia.

The ethics complaints contend Kasowitz, managing partner of Kasowitz Benson Torres, violated attorney ethics rules in New York and Washington by giving such advice to unrepresented individuals.

(And in an amusing coincidence, Kasowitz is accusing a Trump ally/advisor of obstruction of justice in a separate civil case.)
posted by Doktor Zed at 1:59 PM on June 16, 2017 [34 favorites]

NPR: "After shooting, concerns rhetoric on the left has gotten too hostile."

Me: You have got to be fucking kidding me.
posted by leotrotsky at 2:02 PM on June 16, 2017 [56 favorites]

NPR back to being NPR I guess.
posted by Artw at 2:04 PM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

Friday 5pm news dump time:

OGE dumped the President's latest financial disclosure report. I have no analysis for you at this time other than the fact he signed the thing in Sharpie and he holds positions in 565 companies.

KHN: Exclusive: White House Task Force Echoes Pharma Proposals. They got documents from the drug price working group. Turns out all their plans are just exactly what drug company lobbyists want and some would increase drug prices.
posted by zachlipton at 2:12 PM on June 16, 2017 [15 favorites]

NPR could literally have a reporter in the field being shot at and they'd ask said reporter to try and get quote about the shooter's concerns.
posted by strange chain at 2:13 PM on June 16, 2017 [45 favorites]

OGE dumped the President's latest financial disclosure report."

Was that expected?
posted by Artw at 2:19 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

NYT: Minnesota Officer Acquitted in Killing of Philando Castile

The defense, on the other hand, maintained that Yanez acted in self-defense and argued that the shooting wouldn’t have happened if Castile wasn’t high on marijuana.

Negros high on reefer? Seriously? We're literally regressing back to the gilded age. When jazz starts becoming hip with white people again we're well and truly fucked.
posted by Talez at 2:20 PM on June 16, 2017 [65 favorites]

I'd had hopes that perhaps the murder of Castile was a turning point. There was actual video of the murder, it clearly showed he was no threat, he was (other than the marijuana use) a perfect victim.

But no. Even with all that a jury couldn't manage to convict a cop for killing a black man. It remains open season on black people in America.

Black lives self evidently do not matter.

I despair.
posted by sotonohito at 2:26 PM on June 16, 2017 [52 favorites]

One of the bullets hit the back seat 16 inches from the 4 year old and they couldn't even convict on reckless discharge. Where do we even go from here?
posted by Bacon Bit at 2:26 PM on June 16, 2017 [73 favorites]

The sense I'm getting, and I'm far from an expert and this is based on my quick glance, is that Trump has a pretty huge amount of his cash sitting in checking and savings accounts right now, which does not exactly reassure me about the future state of the stock market.
posted by zachlipton at 2:28 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

Where do we even go from here?

we are marching at the capitol at 7pm, then we'll figure out where the hell to go from there
posted by localhuman at 2:29 PM on June 16, 2017 [61 favorites]

Trump has a pretty huge amount of his cash sitting in checking and savings accounts right now, which does not exactly reassure me about the future state of the stock market.

but remember, donald trump is bad with money
posted by murphy slaw at 2:31 PM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

When jazz starts becoming hip with white people again we're well and truly fucked.

Uh oh.
posted by OverlappingElvis at 2:31 PM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

Thank you localhuman. Stay safe.
posted by zachlipton at 2:32 PM on June 16, 2017 [11 favorites]

donald trump is bad with other people's money
...which is his one of his greatest strengths with Republicans
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:33 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

AP: The Navy destroyer USS Fitzgerald has collided with a Philippines-flagged cargo ship. There is flooding in three compartments of the Fitzgerald and injuries.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 2:36 PM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

There is also an (unverified) picture of the damage.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 2:37 PM on June 16, 2017

“I think you can never erase history,” Gianforte said. “I can’t erase it, but I did do everything in my power once the event was over to take responsibility.”

"I did everything in my power to stop my aides from sending out that release saying that the liberal fake news cuck body-slammed himself, but their ropy-muscled arms were too strong! They held me back, laughing, as they sent the email! Oh God, now they're going to force me to do such terrible things as a GOP congressman!"
posted by Rust Moranis at 2:40 PM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

@AnnCoulter: I thought w/ Trump we'd finally have a president helping OUR country. So far: Syria, Saudi Arabia, Israel, Italy, China, N Kor. Today: Cuba!

It's always sad to see people after being victimized by a scam. Maybe Ann could organize a class-action lawsuit? It worked for the people who watched the Trump University infomercials.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:44 PM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

If Trump's financial disclosure report is to be believed, most of the books that ~~he's authored~~ paid peons have ghosted for him are non-income-generating literal dead trees (PDF).

"The Art of the Deal" and "Time to Get Tough" are still selling gangbusters, but the "Art of the Comeback," "Think Big and Kick Ass," and even one of his political screeds, "The America We Deserve" are in the "none or less than $201" zone for royalties, with the majority of surviving copies doing double duty as doorstops, outhouse toilet tissue, and rolling papers for desperate stoners.
posted by Gordion Knott at 2:47 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

"none or less than $201" zone for royalties,
...showing that there may be hope for America after all, no matter how much the New York Times Book Review promoted him (probably in exchange for kickbacks that were deducted from his royalties).
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:55 PM on June 16, 2017

Back in the 90s, when I was working at a Borders, we got in a huge lot of $1.99 remainders of a gilt-edged, hubbed-spined, signed, limited edition of Art of the Deal. I bought about ten of them, figuring they'd make awesome gag gifts, but I accidentally left the whole bag at the home of a friend in rural South Carolina. This friend's now-ex is an enormous pack-rat, so I have no doubt that he's still got them squirreled away somewhere.

I hope the dude finds them. People in South Carolina might actually be willing to buy the things, so he could conceivably net enough cash from them to make a back child support payment or two.
posted by palmcorder_yajna at 3:00 PM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

Dan Carlin's latest episode of Hardcore History includes a deeeep dive into the Cuban Missile Crisis.

That episode was Chilling As Fuck and I highly recommend it. I mean, I came out of it kinda giggling hysterically and saying "we're all gonna die, omg" over and over, but wow. But it really does illustrate why having military leaders in charge of the decisions over whether to go to war or not is a bad idea. The Presidency has a really valuable role as a sort of common sense moral check on the opinions of military experts. Which means we are currently extremely fucked.
posted by threeturtles at 3:36 PM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

FBI withholds Comey memos from FOIA release citing "pending or prospective law enforcement proceeding."
posted by Chrysostom at 3:37 PM on June 16, 2017 [25 favorites]

I extended my Gilbert & Sullivan piece (above) on my blog page.

I am the very model of a modern major Twitterer.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 3:39 PM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

AP: The Navy destroyer USS Fitzgerald has collided with a Philippines-flagged cargo ship. There is flooding in three compartments of the Fitzgerald and injuries.

Short article with gif showing damage from overhead. I kinda doubt this becomes politically sensitive news unless Trump is looking for a new and easy target on Twitter. Folks on the Fitzgerald are definitely having a shit day, though. Probably the same on the cargo ship, too.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 3:39 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

CNN: The House Intelligence Committee wants to hear from Brad Parscale, who was the digital director for President Donald Trump’s campaign, as part of its ongoing investigation into Russia’s interference in the 2016 election.
posted by Chrysostom at 3:42 PM on June 16, 2017 [36 favorites]

Dan Carlin's latest episode of Hardcore History includes a deeeep dive into the Cuban Missile Crisis.

That episode was Chilling As Fuck and I highly recommend it.

At one point a US Naval vessel was harassing/warning a Soviet submarine by dropping signal depth charges at them, and the crew of the sub didn't know if war had already broken out. Two out of the three chief officers on the sub wanted to launch a nuke-tipped torpedo at the US ship. The third, Vasili Arkhipov, refused to cast the final vote necessary to start World War 3, which is why we're all alive today.

All I know is that there better be a whole goddamned load of Arkhipovs out there.
posted by Rust Moranis at 3:50 PM on June 16, 2017 [24 favorites]

Man, this AP report: Trump acknowledges for first time he’s under investigation

Trump advisers and confidants describe the president as increasingly angry over the investigation, yelling at television sets in the White House carrying coverage and insisting he is the target of a conspiracy to discredit — and potentially end — his presidency. Some of his ire is aimed at Rosenstein and investigative special counsel Robert Mueller, both of whom the president believes are biased against him, associates say.
...
Aides have counseled the president to stay off Twitter and focus on other aspects of his job. They have tried to highlight the positive reviews he received Wednesday when he made a statesman-like appearance in the White House to address the nation after Rep. Steve Scalise was shot during a congressional baseball practice.

It does not appear that Melania's presence has been a calming influence on the President.
posted by zachlipton at 3:51 PM on June 16, 2017 [32 favorites]

The collision is very perplexing. While I'm sure Navy ships don't use the AIS System to broadcast their positions (that would be dumb!), commercial craft certainly do (here is the last position of the ACX Crystal, which hit the Fitzgerald), even Joe Weekend Boater can have a chartplotter that alarms when on a collision course with an AIS-equiped vessel. I'd think the navy would at least be monitoring, if not broadcasting!
posted by Mei's lost sandal at 3:51 PM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Handel and another woman are framed up for some additional B-roll and have a conversation about how Handel saw someone on her deck and considered shooting them, until it turned out to be a local police officer.

Why the fuck did they put this out there? I get the "dump stuff for the use of whoever, because 'whoever' includes your superPACs" thing, but why dump stuff that makes you look violent and creepy? Shouldn't all the odd stuff they put out there for whoever might want to use it reflect on them in a positive light?
posted by jackbishop at 4:35 PM on June 16

She's done a great job of posturing herself as the perfect Republican: doesn't believe in a living wage or healthcare for all and hate the guys. With this one clip she also proves she loves guns and she's tough on crime.

The Philando Castile ruling proved once again that only whites are legally allowed to carry no matter what the laws say. Notice the complete silence by the NRA? He had a license for the gun, warned the officer there was a gun in the car as he was trained to do in his safety class, and the officer took less than a minute to decide to shoot him 7 times.

Washington Examiner: Roger Stone: Trump should fire Robert Mueller, Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein

"I'd fire Mueller and Rosenstein for wasting the taxpayers' money. This is a witch hunt," Stone said, parroting a line from Trump.

Stone suggested Trump take such action during an interview with CNNMoney at the Cannabis World Congress and Business Exposition in New York.[...]Stone has been named as part of the investigations into Russian meddling in the 2016 elections, and he sent documents to the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence last month.

posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:15 PM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

The overhead view in the link I shared above looks like the superstructure got hammered, but the hull looks straight. Details from the article suggest hull damage, too, but I'm not seeing it. (Also the Fitzgerald looks like she's riding real low in the water, but for all I know that's normal?) Makes me think maybe they were side-by-side doing some sort of cargo/supply transfer or something. Again, the lack of visible damage to the hull at least suggests this wasn't a straight up T-bone collision, at least.

(But I'm almost 20 years away from being active duty Coast Guard and I wasn't an expert then, either, so IDK.)
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:17 PM on June 16, 2017

From Buzzfeed: Don Jr. Is Ready To Fight With You On The Internet link provided by roomthreeseventeen

He has started live-tweeting major congressional hearings. And wedged between occasional pictures of his dinner (soft-shell crab he cooked for his wife) or of his kids (his son chopping wood "under strict supervision" for a cookout), as well as promotions for Trump properties (“Get Dad the #FathersDay gift he deserves - a #Gift Card to #TrumpFerryPoint!”), Trump Jr.’s feed offers a steady stream of the president’s most ardent supporters, delivered directly to his 1.7 million followers.[my bold]

So not only fighting on the internet but also ready to flog the shitty Trump merch any time, anywhere. ABC* is the Trump Family motto, no doubt.

*Always Be Closing
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:23 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

/lighthouse joke
posted by Artw at 4:23 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

Here's the USS Fitzgerald's deployment history. It's part of the group of vessels tooling around the Korean Peninsula keeping an eye on NK missile launches and stuff.
posted by notyou at 4:29 PM on June 16, 2017

The overhead view in the link I shared above looks like the superstructure got hammered, but the hull looks straight. Details from the article suggest hull damage, too, but I'm not seeing it. (Also the Fitzgerald looks like she's riding real low in the water, but for all I know that's normal?) Makes me think maybe they were side-by-side doing some sort of cargo/supply transfer or something. Again, the lack of visible damage to the hull at least suggests this wasn't a straight up T-bone collision, at least.

They have to be punctured below the water line because they have at least 5 pumps going all out in the animated gif.

On Merchant vessels there is a usually a below water level part that sticks out further. So it likely got damaged both above and below if it was a t-boning.
posted by srboisvert at 4:33 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

KHN: Exclusive: White House Task Force Echoes Pharma Proposals. They got documents from the drug price working group. Turns out all their plans are just exactly what drug company lobbyists want and some would increase drug prices.

I'm starting to see some effects of this. One of my prescriptions I've been using (and for which there is no generic available) went from a $35.00 co-pay to a $75.00 co-pay to a $98.00 co-pay in the space of 2 years. However that, as it turned out, was nothing. I developed a new and very painful medical condition just about the time that DJT was sworn in. It's been debilitating and cost quite a bit in diagnostic tests. Thankfully this week my doctor finally proscribed a medication that solved the problem within 24 hours. A miracle cure! Unfortunately it is $1279.00 for a 20 day supply. When I asked about a generic, I was told that is the generic. Fingers crossed that I only need 20 days worth.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:33 PM on June 16, 2017 [26 favorites]

Gingrich: 'The President of the United States cannot obstruct justice'.

My thoughts:

1) What the fuck? Did I imagine Clinton's impeachment in the 90s? Did Gingrich suffer blunt head trauma and forget the 90s? Am I taking crazy pills?

2) What the fuck? Did I imagine Nixon's comments on illegal actions and the President? Did Gingrich suffer blunt head trauma and forget the 70s? Am I taking crazy pills?

3) I should get some crazy pills.
posted by Justinian at 4:40 PM on June 16, 2017 [87 favorites]

What bothers me most about Gingrich's comment is how even blatant, shameless, demonstrable hypocrisy like that won't cost him. He'll still get time on television. Journalists will still quote him like he's relevant. He can get up there and say two plus two is three and news channels will say ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ and keep putting him on. Just like all the other pundits.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:45 PM on June 16, 2017 [57 favorites]

Axios Trump released his 2016 financial disclosures

What we've gathered in a quick breakdown:

$115,865,590: Trump National Doral in Miami
$37,251,635: Mar-a-Lago "resort related revenue" — which is about $7.4 million more than what he reported on his candidate financial disclosure filing from May, 2016
$19,752,500: Trump National Golf Club in Bedminster, NJ "golf related revenue"
$19,666,129: Trump International Hotel in D.C. with "hotel related revenue" (which opened in September 2016)
$17,508,270: golf club in Potomac Falls, VA
Between $1,000,000 - $5,000,000 in royalties from his book "Great Again: How to Fix Our Crippled America" (published in 2015)
$84,000 pension from the Screen Actors Guild
Trump resigned from more than 500 positions shortly before his inauguration

posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:48 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

"When the _Republican President does it, it's not illegal."
posted by tonycpsu at 4:56 PM on June 16, 2017 [5 favorites]

Regarding the failure to convict Mr. Castile's killer...Not one person could be arsed to deny a unanimous verdict of acquital?!?! What the fuck, people. White supremacy is a travesty.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 4:59 PM on June 16, 2017 [32 favorites]

Guys, cut Newt some slack. He was closely involved with the Trump campaign. You can't expect him to be coherent if he's up all night remembering suspicious financial transactions.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:00 PM on June 16, 2017

One of the bullets hit the back seat 16 inches from the 4 year old and they couldn't even convict on reckless discharge. Where do we even go from here?

According to the jurors, that charge was one of the first things they threw out. : There were two black jurors, but Ploussard said neither of them were the two voting against acquittal. He said the reckless discharge counts were dismissed by the jury early on in deliberations. He declined to identify the holdouts.

The two holdout jurors changed their mind Friday afternoon. Ploussard said the group broke down the manslaughter charge in detail, listing 25 points on a whiteboard.

Ploussard was sure the jury would have been hung if they hadn’t come up with an acquittal on Friday afternoon. The judge had already told the jury if they didn’t come up with a verdict, he would bring them back to continue deliberations on Monday.

The jury attempted to get a verdict on the first day of deliberations, “but that wasn’t going to happen,” he said. Then the standoff started.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 5:06 PM on June 16, 2017

“I think you can never erase history,” Gianforte said. “I can’t erase it, but I did do everything in my power...

If you did everything in your power to help remove your shit stain on our history, you'd have removed yourself from public office already.
posted by p3t3 at 5:06 PM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

Trump resigned from more than 500 positions shortly before his inauguration

... I know it's kind of small potatoes, but seriously? 500 positions? What the hell? What kind of positions can you have that you have 500 of!
posted by suelac at 5:06 PM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

I don't think it's small potatoes. Trump's businesses are labyrinthine for a reason.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:10 PM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Conservative columnist Max Boot in Foreign Policy Magazine...

Donald Trump Is Proving Too Stupid to Be President

This is not just an insult. Boot is making a well constructed argument, and citing evidence to support it, that Trump is, in fact, stupid.
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:14 PM on June 16, 2017 [62 favorites]

Gingrich: 'The President of the United States cannot obstruct justice'.

In all of Gingrich's media appearances since the election I've found myself really, really glad that Gingrich doesn't have Priebus' job - Gingrich has still got the combination of cunning and zero morals and political experience that would make this administration terrifyingly effective in ways that we're lucky it hasn't been. He's had a lot of kind of backseat driver advice for this administration that would really work (in horrible, horrible ways) if he could get Trump to listen to him. We're all lucky that Trump listens to nobody and that Newt would likely be too proud to take a comparatively lowly position like WH chief of staff after being Speaker of the House.
posted by jason_steakums at 5:19 PM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

ELECTIONS NEWS

** GA-06:

-- New poll from Opinion Savvy: Ossoff 49.7 / Handel 49.4.

-- New Landmark poll: Ossoff 49.7 / Handel 48.0

-- Mentioned above: Politico has GOP internally thinking race looks bad for Handel. That's equal to zero actual votes, of course, but usually indicates things are not where they want them to be.

-- Basically, Ossoff has an average lead of about 2 points in recent polls. The probably puts him as a 60/40 or 66/33 favorite. The concern is that polls don't have a great history in specials. Range of probable outcomes ranges from Handel +7 to Ossoff +11.

** VA gov -- Two pollsters have Gillespie and Northam near tied. That's in stark contrast to earlier polling that had Northam with a healthy lead, and both pollsters are GOP shops, but still something to chew on.

** Odds & ends:

-- Further note on that Tennessee House special yesterday - it was yet another where the Dems overperformed vs Trump, and even Romney. Romney was +52, Trump +39, Vaughn +27. Obviously, it's very frustrating not to have come away with more wins in these specials, but a lot of them have been very red seats.

-- Schadenfreude vs fremdschämen Dept: Kris Hart was about to announce his candidacy for the GOP nom in the PA gov race. Then a reporter pointed out he was ineligible to run.

posted by Chrysostom at 5:25 PM on June 16, 2017 [36 favorites]

I don't think it's small potatoes. Trump's businesses are labyrinthine for a reason.

Okay there are a few more very reasonable items on this bill. $7500 to the VP of Twitter Relations, $3500 for our Corporate Insult Comic, $750 to our in house Steak Taster (that's a bargain folks), industry standard $8000 to our Fashion Consultant (tremendous deal, he does great work)
posted by ian1977 at 5:38 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Chrystosom: per your second link, I will confirm that NARAL tipped the balance between Periello and Northam for me. Of course, I always follow NARAL VA.

And also, the flippable your linked to pointed out that my district could flip to D for state rep. I previously signed signed up to volunteer for her, but now I'm seriously considering hosting a meeting. That's a big difference. Thanks for your daily postings.
posted by Measured Out my Life in Coffeespoons at 5:42 PM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

Politico Magazine (long read) Man on a Wire: Mike Pence’s Tightrope Act

ith the American Health Care Act breathing its last—that is, until Pence resuscitated it over the ensuing weeks—the vice president pleaded with his fellow tea partiers to reconsider their opposition. When they held their ground, the vice president let loose an uncharacteristic flash of anger. “I was the Freedom Caucus before the Freedom Caucus existed,” Pence told them, his voice rising, according to multiple people who were in the room. “Don’t try to tell me this bill isn’t conservative enough.”

It was the most animated they had ever seen him. And it worked: After Pence abruptly exited the meeting, and several grown men had broken into tears [my bold] because of the tension present in the room, a chorus of Freedom Caucus members informed Chairman Meadows that they would now support the legislation if a vote were held. It turned out to be too late—Ryan’s team had already hemorrhaged a huge number of moderates, and the AHCA never saw the floor that day—but Pence’s power play was not lost on a group of lawmakers who pride themselves on defying their party’s leadership. “There were a number of our people who would have voted with the vice president based on that meeting,” Meadows tells me. “There were House Freedom Caucus members willing to support the bill, despite great reservations, because of Vice President Pence.”

It's a very long in-depth profile. I"ll have to finish reading tomorrow when my eyes aren't so tired but I thought that passage was bizarre enough to be quoted. Also, fuck Mike Pence for his responsibility in taking away healthcare from millions of Americans and letting babies and pregnant moms die (among others.)
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:43 PM on June 16, 2017 [29 favorites]

McClatchy: Sources: Federal officials vetting Brownback for position in Trump administration. The rumor is somewhere in the State Department, but it could happen anytime in the next few months.

He vetoed the Medicaid expansion in Kansas, so there's a chance that getting him out could be a huge win in helping people get health care in the state.
posted by zachlipton at 5:46 PM on June 16, 2017 [10 favorites]

Just for fun:

@Gov. Mike Huckabee: Anonymous sources trashing @realDonaldTrump are as reliable as Tokyo Rose and a Ouija board.

@Bess Kalb: Hey again, Mike. I feel like this is almost there. Couple notes.
Tokyo Rose is a real reach back in time, but that's not the biggest misstep. You shouldn't crowd the payoff. Pick the strongest one.
Write w/ confidence. Don't let your audience decide where the laugh is. "Anonymous sources bashing Trump are as reliable as a Ouija board."
Don't be afraid to embellish with a specific reference. It's a bare-bones joke. "As reliable as my 9-year old granddaughter's Ouija board?"

I doubt that old braying ass is going to appreciate her lessons, but let's face it, he is the worst humorist on twitter. No, make that "humorist."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:01 PM on June 16, 2017 [15 favorites]

Gov. Sandoval has vetoed the MediCaid for all bill.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:06 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

Speaking of Kansas... Here's a brief account of the impact Kansas Democrats had on the repeal of Brownback's tax cuts, and how playing tough led to a much better law, especially in areas focusing on the poor & middle class, than the one Moderates were originally pushing.

“I know nothing passes without us.”: Moving past outdated assumptions about Kansas Democrats
posted by honestcoyote at 6:24 PM on June 16, 2017 [12 favorites]

Gov. Sandoval has vetoed the MediCaid for all bill.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 10:06 AM on June 17 [1 favorite +] [!]

Live from the Republic of Ofcourseovania...
posted by saysthis at 6:25 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

He's had a lot of kind of backseat driver advice for this administration that would really work (in horrible, horrible ways) if he could get Trump to listen to him

I think it was never a danger because Gingrich was the original man about whom it was said that he was a stupid person's idea of a smart person. and Trump is a stupid person. who hates smart people. sort of elegant in a way.
posted by queenofbithynia at 6:26 PM on June 16, 2017 [16 favorites]

Plus, regardless of what it was, if both Tokyo Rose and a Ouija board told me something, I'd be doing some serious pondering
posted by mubba at 6:27 PM on June 16, 2017 [15 favorites]

Gov. Sandoval has vetoed the MediCaid for all bill.

Of course he did. The fuckup is coming up against term limits and can be a spiteful little twat as much as he wants.

I don't know where Sandoval goes from here though. Heller is a dead man walking right now and a primary challenge from Governor "fuck you and your healthcare" seems to be as about as useful for keeping the Senate seat Republican as tits on a bull.
posted by Talez at 6:28 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Tokyo Rose in the conservatory with a Ouija board.
God damn his references are as out-of-date as Trump's. I'm 52 and I've read a lot of books about World War II so I know who ~~she was~~ they were, but how many millennials have?
posted by kirkaracha at 6:32 PM on June 16, 2017 [7 favorites]

Here's the incompetent fuckup's full statement on the veto.

I wish I could copy and paste this tripe into the thread because it's intellectually dishonest and comes down to "it makes insurance companies unsure if they can screw people out of more money and if they pull out people might be forced to stop being screwed by insurance companies".
posted by Talez at 6:33 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

He's literally afraid of the free market being shat on by paying for a government welfare plan.
posted by Talez at 6:34 PM on June 16, 2017

(except god, imagine if he'd made Gingrich his Steve Bannon. Instead of saying let's all be Nazis every day, he'd be busy building a space base on the moon. such a better way to spend his time.)
posted by queenofbithynia at 6:34 PM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

McClatchy: Sources: Federal officials vetting Brownback for position in Trump administration. The rumor is somewhere in the State Department, but it could happen anytime in the next few months.

Trump admin ambassadorships seem to be the hot new wingnut welfare, even fewer expectations than a Fox News gig.
posted by jason_steakums at 6:36 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

Who's next, Huckabee? Lord Haw-Haw?
posted by kirkaracha at 6:37 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

500 positions? What the hell? What kind of positions can you have that you have 500 of!

CEO of 500 different shadowy LLCs, trusts and foundations designed to launder Russian money into an untraceable labyrinth of "business interests".
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:40 PM on June 16, 2017 [9 favorites]

Who's next, Huckabee? Lord Haw-Haw?

Nah, Lord Haw-Haw's whole thing is basically his daughter's job these days.
posted by jason_steakums at 6:41 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

I really shouldn't have looked at Huckabee's Twitter to see more of his awful shtick but jfc is there a handy ritual to summon the ghost of Sandman Sims and his spectral hook to yank this hack offstage?
posted by jason_steakums at 6:50 PM on June 16, 2017 [4 favorites]

National Treasure Alexandra Petri, WaPo: Make Witch Hunts Great Again

Judge: Mr. Trump, who is this “Maga” whom ye invoke most continually? Is she a powerful sorceress? How may ye guarantee that the economy will grow at 3 percent without recourse to the dark arts? How can ye summon back a job which hath been taken by a machine? Why do ye cast the evil eye upon Theresa May and make her government for to sicken? What is this Cabinet meeting whereat thou didst make the men to go about and sign their names in blood in thy book?

Trump: That last thing is not correct.

Judge: Mr. Trump, is it true that you possess a perfect and wondrous health and vitality that is almost unnatural for a man of your age?

Trump: That is true.

Judge: Mr. Trump, is it true that you have two sons who run your business, see you frequently and yet have no contact with you? How can this be without sorcery?

Trump: (shrugs)

Judge: Newt Gingrich. Explain his state.

Trump: I did not do that to him.

posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:07 PM on June 16, 2017 [74 favorites]

Instead of saying let's all be Nazis every day, he'd be busy building a space base on the moon.

¿Porque no los dos?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:09 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

I should get some crazy pills.

A pill that drives one insane? I suppose that's one way to make it through 2017.
posted by Behemoth at 7:19 PM on June 16, 2017

Re Philando Castile:

I went to the protest of the verdict, although I had some household stuff and could not stay past about 7:45, so I don't know what has happened since, or if people are going to march.

It was a strange and harrowing thing that is not easy to describe.

The St Paul Capitol building is weirdly isolated from downtown. It is a big white classical domed thing, the civic mirror of the cathedral up the hill After hours it is dead and silent. The sky was yellow and it was still and windless. There were a couple of thousand people there, many white, mostly young. People from my union were there. Black Lives Matter organizers, friends and family were up the steps. Their mic kept cutting in and out, so if you were far out in the crowd you couldn't hear really well. There were silences between chants, like no one knew what to do. There was so much anger in the air. I've never been to a protest that felt the same way - like despair and hate and sorrow.

Two of Philando Castile's friends spoke, and they were crying and yelling, and the media kept pushing in in a really ghoulish way, and the organizers kept telling them to back off. There's some kind of history of shitty media stuff here that I don't know the details of. It was tense in a way I've never seen.

It just was horrible to see those two men crying and coming unglued. it was the worst. It made you want to burn everything down, like a world where this happens is a garbage world that doesn't even deserve to exist. There are not even words to convey how that pain and sorrow seemed. The second speaker, who was a chlldhood friend of Philando, started off saying something like "so you see that I have tattoos and you think I'm a thug so what I have to say is wrong, but whatever", and it just made me want to break the world because obviously people have used himself against him like he can't grieve or have feelings because of who he is.

I've been to a bunch of these kinds of protests over a lifetime - one of first ten or so protests I went to was twenty years ago and it was about a boy who was shot by the cops. This one felt different, like no one has any hope anymore. People are being pushed beyond what they can bear.

It's all a little run together in my mind now. There was a preacher who said that the cop might have escaped earthly justice but he would not escape god's justice. Sometime around then the mic cut out and people in the crowd started yelling "we are god's hands" and it got going pretty well. I'm an atheist, more or less, but I feel that's the right understanding - whatever rightness there is in the universe comes into the world through us and through our actions.

It's a gaping wound to the social body, that we have people who can be murdered and no justice done. It debases and degrades everything we try to do. It's horrible. Horrible enough to lose your child, but to have no justice at all and no hope of any.

I can't convey it right. It felt like something is changing, like people who didn't have a lot of illusions to start with have lost their last few.
posted by Frowner at 7:30 PM on June 16, 2017 [185 favorites]

McClatchy: Sources: Federal officials vetting Brownback for position in Trump administration. The rumor is somewhere in the State Department, but it could happen anytime in the next few months.

Shame we don't have an Ambassador to Somalia. Their government is the perfect size for him.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:36 PM on June 16, 2017 [3 favorites]

I do think Northam can win, but it's going to take a lot of phone calls, and a whole lot of door knocking. Odds are pretty good that I am going to be calling at least one of you this year to do one of those things. Don't hang up on me when I do, okay? Don't let up, and don't get complacent. Northam won because his field team was concentrated in heavily Democratic parts of the state, which means a bunch of people were knocking a bunch of doors in the northeast. Redistricting happens under the next governor. If Virginia loses this race, we won't see a Democratic victory here for at least ten years.

Hold the line, Virginia. Let's save the commonwealth. If we play this right, not only will we hold Richmond, but we might even flip the Virginia House of Delegates. Hell, in Virginia's 13th District, Danica Roem-- a transgender lady-- is running against Robert Marshall in Prince William. Dude introduced some kind of heinous bathroom bill, and I believe that district went 55-40 for Hillary last year. So it's pretty winnable, but not without help.

I continue to be profoundly grateful that I am in a place where we can start to fight back, where I don't have to wait for midterms. If you're in Virginia, I hope you'll join me.
posted by dogheart at 7:53 PM on June 16, 2017 [47 favorites]

Trump admin ambassadorships seem to be the hot new wingnut welfare, even fewer expectations than a Fox News gig.

Also they likely expire as soon as he leaves office or whenever he feels like yanking them back again. So unlike the pundit circuit, ambassadorships require loyalty.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 8:21 PM on June 16, 2017 [1 favorite]

So some folks interrupted Shakespeare in the Park tonight, including one someone who got on stage and Jack Posobiec who called the audience Nazis and compared them to Goebbels.

As Emily Nussbaum notes, we're now so far down the rabbit hole that one pro-Trump faction runs around referring to themselves positively as Nazis, while another runs around calling other people Nazis as an insult.
posted by zachlipton at 8:52 PM on June 16, 2017 [46 favorites]

This is still quite tame compared to previous Shakespeare-related violence in New York: the Astor Place Riot, which killed at least 25 people and injured more than 120, which started (amid significant cultural factors of nativism and a class struggle) over a dispute as to which of two actors (an American and an Englishman) were better at performing Shakespeare. It's quite the story.
posted by zachlipton at 9:01 PM on June 16, 2017 [16 favorites]

Shorter Michelle Cottle in The Atlantic: "Paul Ryan totally cares about poverty, you guys."
posted by tonycpsu at 9:11 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

I saw the list of Trumps income from the OEG financial disclosure was posted, but didn't see the other half:

Trump owes lenders at least $315 million — disclosure shows

President Donald Trump had personal liabilities of at least $315.6 million to German, U.S. and other lenders as of mid-2017, according to a federal financial disclosure form released late on Friday by the U.S. Office of Government Ethics.

Possibly of particular interest:

For example, Trump disclosed a liability to Deutsche exceeding $50 million for the Old Post Office, a landmark historic property in downtown Washington that he recently redeveloped into a hotel located near the White House.

Disclaimer: I know as much about money and finances as a fifth-grader.
posted by Room 641-A at 9:39 PM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

Senator Ben Sasse (R-Neb):

To whoever just subscribed my email accts (family, work, obsolete) to multiple @Nickelback promotional & fan newsletters:

It's. Not. Funny.

It's kinda funny!
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 10:54 PM on June 16, 2017 [129 favorites]

Of course he is. Half of Russia's land mass is under permafrost. Siberia is the new Ohio.
posted by msalt at 11:07 PM on June 16, 2017 [8 favorites]

Frozen Dreams: Russia's Arctic obsession
posted by XMLicious at 11:08 PM on June 16, 2017 [2 favorites]

What would worse is subscribing Nickelback to Sen. Sasse's promotional newsletter.
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:17 PM on June 16, 2017 [15 favorites]

Someone should subscribe Donald to Cat Facts.
posted by Glibpaxman at 11:43 PM on June 16, 2017 [6 favorites]

Of course he is. Half of Russia's land mass is under permafrost. Siberia is the new Ohio.

Toto, I don't think we're in Ohio anymore

Frozen permafrost soil is the perfect place for bacteria to remain alive for very long periods of time, perhaps as long as a million years. That means melting ice could potentially open a Pandora's box of diseases.
(...)
People and animals have been buried in permafrost for centuries, so it is conceivable that other infectious agents could be unleashed. For instance, scientists have discovered fragments of RNA from the 1918 Spanish flu virus in corpses buried in mass graves in Alaska's tundra. Smallpox and the bubonic plague are also likely buried in Siberia.

posted by Fish, fish, are you doing your duty? at 11:46 PM on June 16, 2017 [16 favorites]

THANKS. I was having so much trouble coming up with nightmare scenarios under the Trump/Putin/Erdrogan Axis of Asshole, but you solved that problem.
posted by msalt at 12:39 AM on June 17, 2017 [15 favorites]

Small chuckle from r/esist:

Aright but can we just agree if Trump goes through with a Saturday Night Massacre scenario, we're gonna call it the "Bowling Green Massacre"?
posted by rouftop at 12:48 AM on June 17, 2017 [41 favorites]

The way these people leak it was inevitable the keys to the White House time machine would start making the rounds. Here's Principal Deputy White House Press Secretary Sarah Huckabee‏ tweeting at us from last November: When you're attacking FBI agents because you're under criminal investigation, you're losing.
posted by scalefree at 1:26 AM on June 17, 2017 [8 favorites]

Trump disclosed a liability to Deutsche exceeding $50 million for the Old Post Office,

To Deutsche what?? Deutsche Post? Deutsche Bank? Deutsche Heringsfabrik?
posted by Namlit at 1:44 AM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

People and animals have been buried in permafrost for centuries[...] Smallpox and the bubonic plague are also likely buried in Siberia.

The third bubonic plague pandemic began in Southern China in the 1850s and had spread north to Manchuria and the Russian Empire by 1900. According to that Wikipedia article the WHO considered the plague active until 1959, so possibly less than a century old.

Maybe a silver lining is that any artisanal heirloom Siberian pathogens wouldn't initially be antibiotic-resistant?
posted by XMLicious at 1:55 AM on June 17, 2017 [9 favorites]

Could be Deutsche Grammophon for his recording of "Deutscheland Uber Alles". (They provide hefty penalties when you mangle their national anthem)
posted by oneswellfoop at 1:55 AM on June 17, 2017 [3 favorites]

Reuters: Al Jazeera says its Arabic channel Twitter account suspended

"The account of al Jazeera on twitter @ajarabic is currently suspended due to what seems to be an organised campaign and we are doing the necessary work to get the service back," al Jazeera said on another of its Twitter accounts for its breaking news service.
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 2:23 AM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

Kevin Baron - We're hours into the worst US Navy disaster in years - 7 missing - yet no word from @realDonaldTrump. Tweeting about himself and Hannity
posted by PenDevil at 2:27 AM on June 17, 2017 [34 favorites]

To Deutsche what?? Deutsche Post? Deutsche Bank? Deutsche Heringsfabrik?
Deutsche Bank were for years the only bank who would give Trump the time of day.
posted by PenDevil at 2:40 AM on June 17, 2017

"Deutscheland Uber Alles". (They provide hefty penalties when you mangle their national anthem)

And? Have they called you yet?
posted by Namlit at 3:05 AM on June 17, 2017 [3 favorites]

To Deutsche what?? Deutsche Post? Deutsche Bank? Deutsche Heringsfabrik?

Deutschebag.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 3:15 AM on June 17, 2017 [20 favorites]

We're hours into the worst US Navy disaster in years - 7 missing - yet no word from @realDonaldTrump. Tweeting about himself and Hannity

Made a bit more difficult because we have no Secretary of the Navy or Ambassador to Japan, neither nominee having been confirmed yet.
posted by scalefree at 3:53 AM on June 17, 2017 [24 favorites]

I'm sure the investment banker nominated to be SecNav would be a great asset.
posted by Justinian at 4:23 AM on June 17, 2017 [14 favorites]

wonder if it's enough.

It's not only enough, it's essential. We cannot give them their Reichstag fire.
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:22 AM on June 17, 2017 [8 favorites]

According to this NPR story on "left-wing" violence, that covered the rise of Antifa, 74% of politicized violence in the US over the past 10 years is right-wing.

If that gets closer to 50%, you'll see even more bipartisan support to tone down rhetoric. Like with Nugent. Many conservatives haven't cared that much about violence (see Gabby Giffords, for example) because it hasn't hurt folks on their side (and keeps the other side a little bit scared).
posted by leotrotsky at 5:36 AM on June 17, 2017 [9 favorites]

I think MLK and the principles of non-violence are what the left generally prefers, but I'm even starting to wonder if it's enough. I don't think violence is at all the answer, but I hope someone comes up with an idea beyond marching that works.

MLK worked because of the threat of Malcolm X and worse. MLK offered a nonviolent alternative.
posted by leotrotsky at 5:38 AM on June 17, 2017 [39 favorites]

Senator Ben Sasse (R-Neb):
To whoever just subscribed my email accts (family, work, obsolete) to multiple @Nickelback promotional & fan newsletters:

It's. Not. Funny.

No, it's hilarious. And inspiring.
posted by orange swan at 5:42 AM on June 17, 2017 [11 favorites]

Many conservatives haven't cared that much about violence (see Gabby Giffords, for example) because it hasn't hurt folks on their side

I they don't care about much about violence... because violence is a game they feel they can win.

These are people obsessed with the military, with the Old West idea of a "good guy with a gun"... This is the party of "we support our police." The party of toxic masculinity and authoritarianism.

Bureaucracy is a game only the "elite" can play. You have to be well educated and better yet, well connected to wield influence in a bureaucratic system. Bureaucracy is a game of relationships and of knowledge. But anyone can wield a gun.

I think the right wing is more violent because they fundamentally believe that a world where political disputes are resolved violently is somehow fairer to the average (non-elite) person than one where they are resolved by lawyers, lobbyists, and regulators.

They think violence is a game they can win. And I think they are right.
posted by OnceUponATime at 5:48 AM on June 17, 2017 [31 favorites]

> "I'm sure the investment banker nominated to be SecNav would be a great asset."

Stick close to your desks and never go to sea,
And you all may be rulers of the Queen's Navee!
posted by kyrademon at 5:51 AM on June 17, 2017 [10 favorites]

Senator Ben Sasse (R-Neb):
To whoever just subscribed my email accts (family, work, obsolete) to multiple @Nickelback promotional & fan newsletters:

*looks at senator's twitter*

what the hell is that on benny's head?
posted by pyramid termite at 5:51 AM on June 17, 2017 [1 favorite]

No worries, you're as qualified for office as Donnie Shortfingers.

This gave me a sudden vision of Donald Trump as the next Bond villain... Shortfinger.
posted by orange swan at 5:52 AM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

Bond villains are smart.
posted by leotrotsky at 5:54 AM on June 17, 2017 [8 favorites]

How can we continue to watch police murder people without any consequences? And congress attacking the vulnerable through removing healthcare? This is real violence against people and at some point there will be more of a response than a random angry shooter at a baseball game. Hodkingson didn't have radical ideas at all, anything he said on Facebook anyone I know might have said - we are angry and for some unhinged people that might make violence start to look good.

I am qualified to speak to this! (Not because of activism, because it's something I've thought of a lot.)

First: In the US (and pretty much everywhere, including in Columbia considering the right and the FARC) leftist violence is pretty consistently dwarfed by both social violence and rightest violence. Regardless of what you think of it as a tactic, it's not something that the left tends toward. What happens is that those incidents of left violence that do happen get treated like the most enormous thing ever, and either totally evil and mysterious ("why would someone who is very downtrodden do this? I just don't know!") or emblematic of the left and its goals, truer than anything anyone actually says or organizes for.

Second: The leftist violence of the seventies (in the US and Europe) did not, IMO, occur under conditions similar to the now. First, it was happening in a time of left success - it doesn't look that way if you say "we were at war in Viet Nam, and in Germany the right had control of the press plus ex-Nazis ran the banks", but if you take a longer view in terms of policy changes and popular culture, that was a much lefter time than now. IMO, the left violence of the seventies was an ill-advised escalation (because it could not work and had a high risk of harming innocents, not because ex-Nazi bankers are sacrosanct) by a fairly successful left. It was not a response by people who were being pushed and snapped. And then in Italy, actually, it was the result of the state "Strategy of Tension", which is a whole different story. I have a lot of political sympathy with many of those seventies activists, but they made choices that IMO were obviously wrong even at the time and IMO undercut the radical left. The shift in opinion in Germany was particularly clear and stark, going from sympathy when it was just "violence" against property to fear and anger as things escalated.

Third: There's "popular" violence like riots, which can be left or right, and I feel like these get left out of analysis a lot because they're hard to think about. They implicate a lot of people when they are right-wing, just as lynching does, and no one likes to admit that, and they seem almost useless when left-wing because they tend to inspire repression and destroy infrastructure which the city then refuses to rebuild.

I don't feel like I know whether "left" riots (eg, the LA Riots in response to the Rodney King verdict) are more useful than not. I suspect that they are sometimes useful in the long run because they force policy change at the city level, but that takes time.

Fourth: I think a better way to understand the present is the violence in the US in the late 19th/early 20th century, because there too you have great social violence, lone shooters both connected to the left and your typical resentment-filled-men and quasi-state violence by police and security. Also a lot of hysteria about immigrants and the kind of "great corporate men"-led inequality that we see today. There wasn't a Reichstag fire but it wasn't very helpful, I guess I'd say. But it was also hard to condemn, when you look at eg the way that private security murdered union organizers and strikers.

I have never really thought about the way that this violence, which seems like a more Northern/Northeastern thing, fits into Jim Crow, but I bet that there's some links- I bet the security companies involved, and the big men of capitalism, were also active in anti-Black violence, because that's how it always seems to go.

Fifth: I think violence will always be less popular with the non-state left and work less well for us for several reasons. First, we tend to have ideologies that valorize peace - even people who see violence as a tactic don't see it as an inevitable eternal part of the human condition which should be institutionalized and celebrated, as the right does. Second, we are ordinary people with less social power, and most people know or learn that violence works far more against us than for us. Third, when we commit violence against the right, the right has money and institutional structures and just replaces the people and things - shoot one Frick and another takes his place. We don't have that. If we lose a single person, we really lose that person. If we lose a thing, we really lose that thing. Violence is always more powerful against the poor and ordinary, because it's harder for us to recover.

But I'm not actually too worried about the media effect of "left" violence because the news cycle is so awful and there's so much violence in general. I mean, remember the guy who killed the cops last summer, right around now? I bet it took you a minute unless you live in that city. If there's a Reichstag fire moment, it will be because, like that fire, it is a put up job, and you can't do much about that.
posted by Frowner at 6:07 AM on June 17, 2017 [55 favorites]

DJT is at Camp David this weekend-- his first visit there. I don't think they have a golf course so he is going to be a very unhappy camper. Not to mention Camp David is most definitely not a marble palace, so not The Donald's type of place at all.

Kellyanne Conway tweeted that yesterday's first meeting of the Presidential Commission on opioid addiction was "a big step." Hilariously she links to a NYTimes article that says the opposite: As Opioid Panel Meets, Some Say Action, Not Study, Is Needed As many people have noted, more action, not more studies is what is needed.

Head of Senate Judiciary Committee, Chuck Grassley, has been a busy boy:

The Hill: GOP senator blocking Trump nominee until he gets answers from DOJ

Grassley said during a Judiciary Committee business meeting on Thursday that the panel would not vote on Stephen Boyd's nomination to be assistant attorney general for legislative affairs because the Justice Department hasn't responded to more than a dozen letters.

"The department needs to improve its communications with the committee members and staff. It needs to be more serious about answering the mail and questions from Congress," Grassley said, explaining why the committee wasn't going to vote on Boyd's nomination even though it was on the meeting's agenda.

The Hill: Grassley rankles GOP with new Comey investigation

Republicans are wary of Sen. Chuck Grassley's (R-Iowa) decision to launch a Senate Judiciary Committee investigation into the firing of former FBI Director James Comey. [...]A spokesperson for Grassley said the Judiciary Committee has a responsibility under the Constitution and Senate rules to consider the nomination for Comey’s successor as FBI director.

“The committee cannot do its duty responsibly without examining allegations of improper political influence,” said Taylor Foy. “This is crucial to maintain the American people’s trust in these institutions.”[...]While some Senate Republicans think it’s worth reviewing whether Lynch sought to influence the FBI’s Clinton investigation or soften its impact, several wonder whether it’s worth the price of also investigating Comey’s firing.

A third Republican senator said “if it’s opening up old Clinton stuff, the base loves it,” but warned that there’s a risk of the probe metastasizing into something that could embarrass the president.

I'm afraid that last part about finding something that could embarrass the President is pretty much guaranteed because he is such an embarrassing President.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:10 AM on June 17, 2017 [41 favorites]

They're not sending their best.

@KellyannePolls:
Today's first meeting of @POTUS Commission on #Opioids was big step forward toward reducing stigma, saving lives. https://nyti.ms/2tv6DxtJ

@jwharris: retweeted @kellyannepolls
Do they even read the article before Tweeting? Those interviewed are quite critical of Admin's all talk, lack of substantive action effort
posted by chris24 at 6:14 AM on June 17, 2017 [21 favorites]

I think the right wing is more violent because they fundamentally believe

The Authoritarian mindset starts with corporal punishment: children and even wives get physically punished, teachers paddle schoolchildren, and torture is used to keep prisoners in line. The guiding principal is Might makes Right and the father figure must keep order by using brute force.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:15 AM on June 17, 2017 [33 favorites]

I think the right wing is more violent because they fundamentally believe that a world where political disputes are resolved violently is somehow fairer to the average (non-elite) person than one where they are resolved by lawyers, lobbyists, and regulators.

Eh, I think maybe it's a bit more reptilian than that. Seems more like they fundamentally believe that a world where political disputes are resolved violently is viscerally more satisfying, costs fewer resources, and is more clearly a marker of tribal belonging—and it sidesteps that whole "Let's think this through for just a second" business that costs weaker species their survival in a fight. Which I guess brings us right back to toxic masculinity.

I don't disagree with either of these viewpoints, but I think there's another aspect to right wing violence. Right wingers believe so fervently in their own righteousness that they think they're justified in using force to get their way. Whereas those on the left are against force and violence on principle and will generally refuse to violate those principles even if it means that they have to live with other awful outcomes.
posted by orange swan at 6:26 AM on June 17, 2017 [21 favorites]

Has Trumo said anything about the USS Fitzgerald or the seven missing sailors?

Re authoritarianism, and on preview:

Right wingers believe so fervently in their own righteousness

It all seems very biblical.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:29 AM on June 17, 2017 [1 favorite]

That's exactly right, Secret Life--and unfortunately, even some who think of themselves as leftist or more liberal are susceptible to those cultural influences, particularly when it comes to contempt for thoughtfulness and collaborative discussion over forcefullness, idealized masculine projections of strength through emotional and physical indifference toward others' suffering and needs (cool) and aggression (unfiltered, decisive action over self reflection and restraint--i.e., that humbug about self-censorship). It's not so much a both sides do it argument as the argument that our society's few remaining popular cultural values mostly center on the virtues of self reliance, independence, and ruthless competition. It's dragging us all down to the level of idiots. So yeah, not healthy masculinity but the more toxic versions of those ideals that seem increasingly to be the norm, and those values have been internalized by a lot of women and more progressive/liberal/leftist/independent voters, too, in less obvious and self reflectively honest ways.
posted by saulgoodman at 6:34 AM on June 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

CALIBAN

You taught me language; and my profit on't
Is, I know how to curse. The red plague rid you
For learning me your language!

—Wm. Shakespeare, The Tempest, 1:2
posted by Faint of Butt at 6:44 AM on June 17, 2017 [7 favorites]

Has Trumo said anything about the USS Fitzgerald or the seven missing sailors?

Over 16 hours later, no. But Hillary has.

@HillaryClinton:
Let's all keep the brave sailors of the USS Fitzgerald in our thoughts & prayers this weekend.
http://ti.me/2rC660f
posted by chris24 at 6:46 AM on June 17, 2017 [46 favorites]

Connecticut NBC Station Won’t Air Megyn Kelly’s Interview With Alex Jones (Claudia Koerner/BuzzFeed News)
Parents of Sandy Hook victims have objected to the interview as giving a platform to a man who has denied the school shooting — and their children — existed.

Over 16 hours later, no.

So either an aide or aides suggested he say something and he said no, fuck those losers, or everyone just said fuck those losers. Okay then.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:55 AM on June 17, 2017 [17 favorites]

He must've heard us. Finally:

@realDonaldTrump:
Thoughts and prayers with the sailors of USS Fitzgerald and their families. Thank you to our Japanese allies for their assistance.
posted by chris24 at 7:10 AM on June 17, 2017 [1 favorite]

Those Shakespeare protesters couldn't interrupt the play in time to save Trump?
posted by EarBucket at 7:11 AM on June 17, 2017

trump likes his sailors not drowned or missing
posted by localhuman at 7:12 AM on June 17, 2017 [27 favorites]

a new youth-oriented (and feminist) political movement

I don't think it's just because I'm getting Old that this repels me but it could be. but let's say a new feminist-oriented (and youth) political movement instead. put the important things first.

because niche feminist political movement that is youth-focused is no less superficial and narrow and ultimately frustrated and frustrating than one that is middle-class- or white-focused. not because youth is a dominant force in the same way as those others, but because the concerns of others are completely invisible from the inside of it, in a very similar way. bad enough when it's by accident, unforgivable when it's on purpose. Feminism is a little unlike some other political ideologies in that it is one you grow into as much as or more than one you grow out of.

'take care of the young women and the old women will take care of themselves' is a very appealing idea on a conscious as well as an unconscious level. but it is not true, and the reasons why are all feminist ones. or rather, it is literally true, and that is a problem. Looking to young women as a supply of fresh faces and uncorrupted minds that will be smarter and better than their awful mothers is a way down, not up. one of the feminist reasons it's not a good idea is because women, as women, radicalize when they get old, not just when they're young.
posted by queenofbithynia at 7:17 AM on June 17, 2017 [46 favorites]

A youth and feminist movement exactly describes the Clinton campaign strategy. It failed because far too many suburban white women are still recoiled by the thought of themselves as feminist.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:22 AM on June 17, 2017 [19 favorites]

By " youth oriented" I mean with a much more forceful vision of the future.

well, ok. but I can't be the only one of those late-30s people without the gloomy expectation of being dead from disaster in 20 years, I like to think I and my generation have a bit of force left alive in our visions yet, and concern for our own futures. when we are not too busy reading our post-apocalyptic YA novels to do anything useful for our fellow woman, anyway.

youth-oriented as a political focus and messaging concern reads very "hello, fellow teens!" from anyone not herself a youth. Hillary Clinton must have said that the children are our future in those or other words about a billion times, and it made her sound as dorkily out of touch as anything ever did. I like to think that Youth loves passion and anger and good ideas and anger, but especially anger. in truth I suppose it mostly loves being pandered to like everybody else. but I wish that were not necessary. the kind of pandering that Youth loves most is being told "you're better than we are, with your force and drive and vigor," much more than this (perceived) drippy maternal concern for their hopes and dreams and material circumstances. but I feel like this state of things is a problem enough feminism could solve. along with more education and self respect.
posted by queenofbithynia at 7:30 AM on June 17, 2017 [17 favorites]

Trump & Co. actually seem to still be stuck in DC because of the weather. I'm amazed he isn't live tweeting his life right now.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:31 AM on June 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

FWIW my daughters who are both young women in the voting age were pretty excited about Hillary. We are in Europe, and at first they were listening more to what Sanders was saying, but then one of my eldest's friends from the US came over and pointed to how Hillary's message was misrepresented and they changed on a dime. We were even planning to go to Washington for the inauguration.
posted by mumimor at 7:56 AM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

But her campaign did not engage young people adequately, it seems obvious in hindsight.

Early on, her campaign dismissed women supporting Bernie as wanting to be where the boys are, and belonging in a special circle of hell. (Never mind that many were older and some were lesbians.) Neither she nor her campaign ever walked back those comments. Everyone I know who supported Bernie voted -- mostly happily -- for Hillary but still feel hurt by those comments.

I think a lot of young people liked and supported Hillary, but I do think the campaign took those votes for granted and assumed there would be no substantial opposition to her nomination. This backfired, and I think moving forward there needs to be a real concerted effort to reach out to young voters.
posted by Room 641-A at 8:04 AM on June 17, 2017 [7 favorites]

I think that the baseball game shooter guy can best be understood as an example of white male entitlement and rage, which isn't a politically-specific phenomenon. Often, it manifests in ways that aren't overtly political at all. Certain segments of the left have been pretty happy to tap into white male entitlement and rage, and I think that's a mistake both morally and tactically. White male entitlement and rage are certainly potent forces, but I don't think you're going to beat the right at that game, and you're going to drive away people who find white male entitlement and rage to be scary and destructive. I don't think you can build a genuinely inclusive left on that foundation, and I'm not willing to be part of any movement that tries. So yeah: I'm voting for a feminist, anti-racist, age-inclusive, inclusive-on-any-number-of-other-issues movement.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 11:21 PM on June 17 [4 favorites +] [!]

Random thought I've been chewing on the last few weeks, feel free to tell me to sit down and shut up, but I'm a straight white man and I know what white male rage and entitlement feels like, and I do think it has something productive to add to the conversation. It's this:

I know what it feels like to not be on the receiving end of microaggressions most of the time, and I know how much it puts me on edge when I'm in situations where I am subjected to that, and I rebound from such stress pretty quickly because my baseline is usually people assuming the best about me, going out of their way for me, and showing me respect. Now, how I got there is shitty, but...I was born in this skin and I change how other people choose to react to me. But I do know that the way I'm usually treated is how I want everyone else to be treated.

Harnessing my white rage and entitlement as a direct political weapon is absolutely a batshit idea, especially if we're trying to build a less stressful world for everyone else, but using my baseline comfort as the outline of a vision for how everyone should feel day to day, and be treated day to day...maybe there's something there. I don't know what, but I think the "straight white American male" experience does have something to contribute, and I think it's that. We got it good, and the goal should be to get everybody else close to as good as we got it. Nor am I implying that everyone should be treated just like straight white men, other genders/colors/orientations/religions/nationalities have different needs, but I find an awareness of the little ways people subconsciously go out of their way for me is instructive in how I treat other people, and it's something I wish I could share with people who experience the world differently.

Unfortunately, I don't talk so good.
posted by saysthis at 8:08 AM on June 17, 2017 [19 favorites]

Early on, her campaign dismissed women supporting Bernie as wanting to be where the boys are, and belonging in a special circle of hell.

This seems unlikely, and I do not remember any campaign position of the sort. Citation?
posted by Dashy at 8:09 AM on June 17, 2017 [13 favorites]

Good morning friends. Let's not refight the same "what one factor Explains why Hillary lost" thing for the millionth time, and even more so, please let's not reopen "were Hillary supporters or Bernie supporters the worst". Thank you.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 8:10 AM on June 17, 2017 [63 favorites]

This is what Trump said about Camp David last winter:

"Camp David is very rustic, it's nice, you'd like it," Trump said in an interview with a European journalist just before taking office. "You know how long you'd like it? For about 30 minutes."
posted by TWinbrook8 at 8:15 AM on June 17, 2017 [17 favorites]

I'll say it again ... ANY depiction of Trump as "victim" (being beheaded, crucified, assassinated) is WRONG WRONG WRONG... he is the VICTIMIZER. He is the xenomorph in Alien, he is the slasher in every 80s slasher movie, he is Batman's Joker without the sense of humor, Lex Luthor with half the IQ. To depict him as anything but almost-indestructible evil is giving him sympathy and is WRONG.

I'm a bit late, but I don't think it's trying to show him as a victim. It's showing him as false god, a urine soaked Jesus.
posted by kingjoeshmoe at 8:32 AM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

Trump & Co. actually seem to still be stuck in DC because of the weather. I'm amazed he isn't live tweeting his life right now.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 10:31 AM on June 17

Looks like they just left on Marine One 2 minutes ago.

It is very hot and sticky here in NC. Just got back from a walk in the woods and it was raining off and on-- that didn't make it cooler just more close. I hope Camp David is sticky and buggy and filled with snakes. I like to imagine him in misery.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:34 AM on June 17, 2017 [9 favorites]

No, I think you're right saysthis. There's a distinction we should make between "bad" privilege and "good" privilege*. On the one side are things like the ability to "go first", to expect and to experience your own perspective to be heard more loudly, to expect and to experience that you are looked to to make the final decision. That's been the prerogative of whites, males, upper-middle-class folks, straights, etc. for a long time and it's toxic.

There is another ~~basket~~ ~~bucket~~ group of expectations and experiences that also get put under the 'privilege' banner that aren't intrinsically wrong -- in fact, they're rights that we should demand be extended to everyone. The ability to access good schools and good jobs and good medical care, the expectation that if I need help I can call the police and trust that they will respond professionally and compassionately, the experience of being fairly listened to and being able to meaningfully participate in making decisions about my life, my family, my work, my community and my country.

It's understandable that we labeled all of these things 'privilege' since they are all things that people who have privilege have, expect and experience. But there's a danger of conflation between the two that we should keep in mind.

I don't love this terminology and I'm sure there's better phrasing out there, but we're anyway not doing phrasing anymore, right?
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:36 AM on June 17, 2017 [15 favorites]

I hope Camp David is sticky and buggy and filled with snakes. I like to imagine him in misery.

I feel bad for the snakes, but then again: they should have known he was a Trump before they let him in.
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:37 AM on June 17, 2017 [63 favorites]

Marlon James, post Castile verdict:

There are some Minnesotans who want to rebrand this state as North. It’s become something of a movement, and I can’t help but think how apt that is. Because we are the most northern of the north, especially in the many fucked up ways the state views and acts on issues of race, and not just in asserting that second amendment rights were only meant for white people.

posted by stopgap at 8:41 AM on June 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

I've just reached the description of the Reichstag fire moment in The Handmaid's Tale. And the Gleichschaltung too, technically, I guess. I gather that, for the 21st century Hulu video series, these events are described right at the beginning of the trailer, but in the book it was a much more gradual reveal and build-up to some more solid details on what happened (but with the caveat that no one really knows the full story of what happened):

It was after the catastrophe, when they shot the president and machine gunned the Congress and the army declared a state of emergency. They blamed it on the Islamic fanatics, at the time.

Keep calm, they said on television. Everything is under control.

I was stunned. Everyone was, I know that. It was hard to believe. The entire government, gone like that. How did they get in, how did it happen?

That was when they suspended the Constitution. They said it would be temporary. There wasn’t even any rioting in the streets. People stayed home at night, watching television, looking for some direction. There wasn’t even an enemy you could put your finger on.

Atwood was doing a fabulous job projecting forward from 1985 what the future might be like—her protagonist's last job was digitizing books at a library and practically could have been a Google employee or Internet Archive volunteer—but here and now I feel as though there is a major blindness towards the political effects which ubiquitous surveillance technology will have, when we talk about the future. The other day BBC World News was all about how British Aerospace (BAe) / BAE Systems may have violated munitions control laws in exporting to various North African and Middle Eastern countries standardized cyber-surveillance tools which were then used for political purposes against the populaces of those countries.

The commoditization of surveillance systems for both government and commercial use is going to mean that a certain amount of authoritarianism is baked into everything. And we must just be at the dawn of development and standardization of active surveillance systems that hack into devices or place their own physical sensors, rather than simply sifting through what passes by on the network.

It seems to me that the consequences of pervasive surveillance on political thought and political activism will be major, but aren't being properly envisaged when we discuss the future. Maybe because there isn't enough information on the current and near-future capabilities governments and other entities have, or because there aren't actually any successful strategies that will counteract its effects.

I'm a bit pharmaceutically fuzzy because I'm on my way to bed, so hopefully the above makes sense.
posted by XMLicious at 8:45 AM on June 17, 2017 [18 favorites]

Dont think anyone posted:

Random Shakespearean theaters are getting horrid death threats.

"There is no darkness but ignorance..." -12th Night
posted by NorthernLite at 8:46 AM on June 17, 2017 [32 favorites]

For my part, I feel like the fact our politics and society are being driven primarily by resentment for "others" hurts us all in the long run and isn't a sustainable basis for building any kind of enduring movement, but I'm also sympathetic to the fact a lot of the resentment is righteous. Unfortunately it often tends to exacerbate social division and lack of sustained long term progress because resentment and anger make strategic planning and discipline harder to maintain.

It's sad that it's come down to fighting endlessly over our favorite scraps of resentment, and I don't think it can work, whether anyone thinks it's righteous and there's good historical justification for it or not. Any relationship based in resentment and mistrust comes to ruin eventually. Separatism and tribalism are just less overtly religious and amoralistic forms of Puritanism.
posted by saulgoodman at 8:49 AM on June 17, 2017 [3 favorites]

NorthernLite, that makes me think of Trump as a twenty-first century Malvolio, not a twenty-first century Caesar. With a yellow toupee instead of yellow stockings.

Keeping my fingers crossed for "and thus the whirligig of time brings in his revenges."
posted by Chanther at 8:49 AM on June 17, 2017 [7 favorites]

Random Shakespearean theaters are getting horrid death threats.

Of all the ways I saw the post-Trump timeline playing out, "rightwingers revolt against the very concept of Shakespeare" was not on my radar
posted by dis_integration at 9:13 AM on June 17, 2017 [86 favorites]

Given the Shakespearean nature of the court of the orange king - I know William S liked his mad monarchs and perhaps revisited the theme to its fullest, but surely he couldn't have resisted giving 45 his own play - this seems exceedingly meta by even modern drama standards. I very much hope somebody's up to the challenge and chutzpah of attempting a drama along those lines.

ACT ONE
SCENE ONE
A wood, outside Moscow.
posted by Devonian at 9:21 AM on June 17, 2017 [7 favorites]

Kellyanne Conway: 'If I Were Shot And Killed Tomorrow, Half Of Twitter Would Explode In Applause And Excitement'
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:31 AM on June 17, 2017

"***** could push a wheelbarrow full of cocaine and Russian prostitutes down the middle of Pennsylvania Avenue at high noon, and there still wouldn’t be a single Republican House member who would dare vote for impeachment. As long as they’re in the majority, this guy is impeachment-proof. So why fight the investigation, if it’s ultimately toothless?"
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:34 AM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

Kellyanne Conway: 'If I Were Shot And Killed Tomorrow, Half Of Twitter Would Explode In Applause And Excitement'

i don't think she's giving herself enough credit, 50% seems low
posted by entropicamericana at 9:42 AM on June 17, 2017 [29 favorites]

Kellyanne Conway: 'If I Were Shot And Killed Tomorrow, Half Of Twitter Would Explode In Applause And Excitement'

Trump: 'I Could Shoot Somebody And Not Lose Voters'

Interesting times.
posted by Cookiebastard at 9:46 AM on June 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

At a time when Congress is trying under cover of night to take away healthcare from millions of people and unarmed black men can be shot for being "high on marijuana", let's take a moment to remember the real victim: Kellyanne Conway.
posted by tonycpsu at 10:04 AM on June 17, 2017 [70 favorites]

Kellyanne, I highly recommend staying away from Fifth Ave.
posted by rhizome at 10:10 AM on June 17, 2017 [9 favorites]

It should also be noted that Alaskans currently buying Marketplace coverage will face much, much higher premiums if the ACA is repealed and replaced with flat age-based premium tax credits rather than premium tax credits designed to keep premium costs below a certain percentage of one's income.

The current system is a kludgy way to approximate sliding-scale premium costs -- the assistance is tied to a local benchmark, so it takes into account the naturally higher costs in rural areas. No GOP replacement proposals that I know of do the same.

All we need is three Republican patriots in the Senate who refuse to allow thousands of people to die and hundreds of thousands of people to suffer, all for the sake of an idiotic, mindless campaign slogan.

Just three.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:10 AM on June 17, 2017 [17 favorites]

I graduated high school in 1994, so I am no longer a young person, but I remember when I was one being quite discomfited by "you youth are the hope of the future" rhetoric from adults. I can't have been the only one left wondering why the adults with authority and power were sort of shrugging and saying "it's on y'all to unfuck this giant mess we've made." I would like to make things as better as I can now so they are less grim for my children, not hand the entire thing off to them. I don't think anyone above was saying this, but the references to a youth movement or effective messaging to youth reminded me of attending a Catholic Youth assembly/rally in 1990 or so and wondering what was wrong with the grown-ups.
posted by danielleh at 10:11 AM on June 17, 2017 [39 favorites]

Kellyanne Conway: 'If I Were Shot And Killed Tomorrow, Half Of Twitter Would Explode In Applause And Excitement'

i don't think she's giving herself enough credit, 50% seems low
posted by entropicamericana at 11:42 AM on June 17 [2 favorites +] [!]

I disagree. Pardon the pun, but she has a trumped up sense of her importance. As for any other person, I hope she has a long and happy life and not shot and killed tomorrow. But, if what she suggests comes true, I don't think her quote is an accurate statement of what will happen.

To be fair, I'm not on Twitter, so that subset of the world may be close to 50% but I sincerely doubt it.
posted by a non mouse, a cow herd at 10:14 AM on June 17, 2017 [1 favorite]

HuffPo: Gay Teacher Of The Year Fans LGBTQ Pride In Viral Photo With Donald Trump

“When I met the president as Rhode Island’s state teacher of the year, I did not know what to expect,” he wrote in the Facebook post. “After a lengthy security process, we were welcomed into the Roosevelt Room where we each met Secretary of Education Betsy DeVos. Shortly thereafter, we walked into the Oval Office. The man seated at the desk read prepared remarks from a sheet of paper and made some comments about CEOs and which states he ‘loved,’ based on electoral votes that he had secured. He did not rise from his seat to present the national teacher of the year with her much-deserved award, nor did he allow her to speak.”

He wanted to speak to the president, but none of the teachers got the chance.

The teacher had wanted to tell Trump that “queer lives matter and anti-LGBTQ policies have a body count.” He also wanted to tell the president how the LGBTQ community is hurt by “politicians callously attacking our right to love or merely exist,” Giannopoulos added.

Lovely. What a classy guy our President is.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 10:40 AM on June 17, 2017 [68 favorites]

Axios Rural Americans are more worried about culture than economy

Shot: "Rural residents are nearly three times as likely (42 percent) as people in cities (16 percent) to say that immigrants are a burden on the country," WashPost notes.

Chaser: "Rural voters who lament their community's job prospects report supporting Trump by 14 percentage points more than Clinton, but Trump's support was about twice that margin — 30 points — among voters who say their community's job opportunities are excellent or good."

Why it matters: Many have thought that economic concerns among rural Americans with fewer job opportunities drove them to elect Trump. This poll challenges that, highlighting their deeper concerns are about accepting diversity, particularly immigrants, and feeling like the federal government favors urban Americans.
Keep reading 203 words

What they're saying: "They're not paying taxes like Americans are. They're getting stuff handed to them," said Larry E. Redding, a retired canning factory employee, to WashPost. "Free rent, and they're driving better vehicles than I'm driving and everything else."

Guise! It's not just ObamaPhones now, it's free rent and fancy cars. Next thing you'll be telling me that immigrants have refrigerators and cable TV.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 10:45 AM on June 17, 2017 [63 favorites]

To clarify, Twitter may be as bad as Facebook (for me), so I do not know what is going on in those realms of the web. But, I sincerely doubt 50% of Americans would cheer at her being shot and killed. I think there is a significant amount of people in America that would rather not see another person be shot and killed regardless of their politics.

My point was more that she is grandstanding and elevating herself to a level that many people would not give to her.

50% of people on Twitter would not give a shit if got hit by a car in an hour. 50% of the general population would say "Kelly, who?"

(okay, 99.9% of twitter wouldn't give a shit if I got hit by a car. I am okay with that.)
posted by a non mouse, a cow herd at 10:46 AM on June 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

Colour me surprised...

Mr. Trump’s dealings with the Saudis extend back to at least 1995, when he sold the Plaza Hotel to a partnership formed by a Saudi prince and an investor from Singapore. The deal, for $325 million, enabled Mr. Trump to escape a default on his loans. (The same prince had reportedly bought Mr. Trump’s yacht for $18 million four years earlier.)

The Saudis “buy apartments from me,” he said in August 2015 at a rally in Mobile, Ala. “They spend $40 million, $50 million. Am I supposed to dislike them? I like them very much.”

Trump’s Business Ties in Persian Gulf Raise Questions About His Allegiances
posted by Mister Bijou at 10:47 AM on June 17, 2017 [33 favorites]

50% of people on twitter cheer when a Kardashian has a bowel movement. It's a low bar.

80% of the 50% are not even people!
posted by srboisvert at 10:57 AM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

let's say a new feminist-oriented (and youth) political movement instead. put the important things first.

Forget the youth aspect entirely. I think a woman-led opposition movement is exactly what the nation needs -- it almost automatically sidesteps the toxic masculinity and tendency toward violence, which is the way the alt-right clearly wants to take this. (Besides, Antifa seems to have the muscle part covered).

Does anyone doubt for a second that the women's march has been the most successful bit of opposition to Trump so far?

There was a ton of misogynist opposition to Hillary as president and probably will be for any future female candidates, but that says nothing about the power of women's voices as the foundation of a mass oppositional movement.
posted by msalt at 11:08 AM on June 17, 2017 [18 favorites]

As long as it's an intersectional movement and not overwhelmed by white voices, as feminist movements (including the women's march) have so often been in the past.
posted by Faint of Butt at 11:11 AM on June 17, 2017 [12 favorites]

50% of people on Twitter would not give a shit if got hit by a car in an hour. 50% of the general population would say "Kelly, who?"

Exactly. She's already forgotten. The high point of her career was that sympathetic SNL skit about her trying to take a weekend off and Trump keeps saying ridiculous things. Predictably, it took 2 seconds for Trump to make it clear that he women he uses as human shields have no real power whatsoever (and that includes the one daughter he likes).

As for Twitter bashing, I dunno guise. I spend a lot of time on Twitter and see tons of intelligent, socially aware discussions.Philando Castile is the hottest topic right now, Kardashians non-existent. Even more than Facebook, it's a network of people you know and choose to follow. So if you're seeing a lot of shallow idiots on Twitter, learn how to use the tool, or look in the mirror.
posted by msalt at 11:15 AM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

Whoops. had a massive typo which I just saw.

50% of people on Twitter would not give a shit if got hit by a car in an hour.

That should read if *I* got hit by a car....
posted by a non mouse, a cow herd at 11:24 AM on June 17, 2017

I think a woman-led opposition movement is exactly what the nation needs -- it almost automatically sidesteps the toxic masculinity and tendency toward violence,

But women (at least the white ones) went for Trump. The ones that didn't are just going to see any attempt to put their identity as a class in the nominal driver's seat as manipulative pandering, won't they? That will push them further away. And it undercuts Democrats claims to value inclusivity. Why shouldn't the party be led by an intersectional coalition of humanists who don't hold double standards and put some identity groups on a moral pedestal? Men aren't exclusively capable of violence or domination, nor are all men equally privileged along every axis. The leadership should be an intersectionally focused coalition of every identity group as much as possible, shouldn't it? If not, why not?
posted by saulgoodman at 11:26 AM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

That's funny, msalt, because I saw my first mention of a Kardashian in months today-- it was a joke about Kim starting her own line of make up. But then I mostly subscribe to humorists, writers, and political journalists.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 11:27 AM on June 17, 2017

Brandon Carter for the Hill: Trump administration pushing to weaken Russia sanctions bill: report

President Trump’s White House is expected to push House Republicans to change the Senate’s Russia sanctions bill to make it more friendly to Russia, according to a new report.

A senior administration official said that the White House is concerned that the bill will hurt U.S.-Russia relations and the administration is hoping to work with Republicans in the House to soften the bill, Politico reported.

Sen. Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio) told Politico that he has heard the Trump administration is asking House members to “slow and block” the legislation.

posted by OnceUponATime at 11:34 AM on June 17, 2017 [26 favorites]

President Trump’s White House is expected to push House Republicans to change the Senate’s Russia sanctions bill to make it more friendly to Russia, according to a new report.

You go right ahead, dudes. It's the stupidest thing you could do so you might as well.
posted by lydhre at 11:37 AM on June 17, 2017 [24 favorites]

Trump administration pushing to weaken Russia sanctions bill: report

So he does know how to effectively lobby and pressure Congress, but only on topics he really, really cares about. Like helping Russia at all costs. America First!
posted by T.D. Strange at 11:38 AM on June 17, 2017 [15 favorites]

Trump administration pushing to weaken Russia sanctions bill

Of course. It's still all about the money. Don't forget about that Rosneft/Exxon-Mobil deal: $500 billion is a lot of money, even to people who are already really rich. My suspicion remains that this is the only thing Trump really cares about, and is the primary (external) reason that he ran for president. Everything else is just smokescreen and/or burn-it-down-erism
posted by LooseFilter at 11:41 AM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

Brandon Carter for the Hill: Trump administration pushing to weaken Russia sanctions bill: report

What took him so long? I've been waiting for a tweetstorm about this.

You go right ahead, dudes. It's the stupidest thing you could do so you might as well

He seems to not understand cause and effect.
posted by Room 641-A at 12:02 PM on June 17, 2017 [1 favorite]

He seems to not understand cause and effect.

But he's very well experienced in Quid Pro Quo, and has never experienced any consequences from it.
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:06 PM on June 17, 2017 [3 favorites]

But women (at least the white ones) went for Trump. The ones that didn't are just going to see any attempt to put their identity as a class in the nominal driver's seat as manipulative pandering, won't they? [...]Why shouldn't the party be led by an intersectional coalition of humanists who don't hold double standards and put some identity groups on a moral pedestal?

Do you see that the group attempting to -- and here encouraged to -- consolidate power and take positions of leadership is feminist women? The context was explicit.

read "get put on a moral pedestal" for "lead the movement" if you must. I get it: we're women.
posted by queenofbithynia at 12:17 PM on June 17, 2017 [8 favorites]

President Trump’s White House is expected to push House Republicans to change the Senate’s Russia sanctions bill to make it more friendly to Russia, according to a new report.

You go right ahead, dudes. It's the stupidest thing you could do so you might as well.
posted by lydhre at 3:37 AM on June 18 [5 favorites +] [!]

DOES THIS MEAN MIKE FLYNN GETS A NEW JOB
posted by saysthis at 12:18 PM on June 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

Kellyanne Conway: 'If I Were Shot And Killed Tomorrow, Half Of Twitter Would Explode In Applause And Excitement'

Oh shut up, Kellyanne Conway. 95% of the time, I don't remember you exist. And I don't wish anyone dead and would feel bad if you were shot and killed, after I took the time to remember who the fuck you are.

But women (at least the white ones) went for Trump.

Women did not go for Trump, and white women don't count more than other women.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 12:19 PM on June 17, 2017 [59 favorites]

Women did not go for Trump, and white women don't count more than other women.

Thank you. It gets tiring to be regarded as an afterthought.
posted by bardophile at 12:23 PM on June 17, 2017 [35 favorites]

So he does know how to effectively lobby and pressure Congress, but only on topics he really, really cares about.

Similarly, although Trump has a record number of unfilled positions in his administration, he's made sure his supporters' relatives have jobs. Sarah Huckabee Sanders becomes Principal Deputy White House Press Secretary, and her father now throws up smokescreens about Russian interference in the 2016 election. Callista Gingrich is nominated as Ambassador to Rome, and Newt doubles down on attacking Mueller. And Trump's "aggressively" courting Cindy McCain with a State Department position, so John been only expressing his deep concerns instead of resisting the Trump agenda.

Honestly, if Trump hadn't already broken all rules about nepotism with his daughter or son-in-law, people in the media would be talking about this scandal.
posted by Doktor Zed at 12:24 PM on June 17, 2017 [15 favorites]

Random Shakespearean theaters are getting horrid death threats.

I was going to go with "You blocks, you stones, you worse than senseless things", but you know what?

I'm just too done to tap into my Shakespeare right now. Every time I think "This shit can't get any stupider", these dumb motherfuckers find a way to knock out the bottom of the barrel and keep on scraping until they strike fucking magma.

These stupid, stupid, stupid assholes.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 12:42 PM on June 17, 2017 [49 favorites]

Similarly, although Trump has a record number of unfilled positions in his administration, he's made sure his supporters' relatives have jobs.

Excellent point. See also: Elaine Chao, Transportation Secretary and wife of obstruction turtle Mitch McConnell.
posted by donatella at 12:45 PM on June 17, 2017 [3 favorites]

Newtown NBC station refuses to air Megyn Kelly’s interview with Alex Jones

👍

Now we need to get other NBC affiliates to do the same. If you have a minute to contact your local affiliate, please do. Here's what I just sent them:

To whom it may concern,

I am writing to urge you not to air this weekend's edition of "Sunday Night with Megyn Kelly." The NBC affiliate in Connecticut has already said they will not be carrying the program[1] due to NBC's poor decision to give a platform to hateful conspiracy theorist Alex Jones, who has
called the Sandy Hook massacre a "hoax" and incited harassment of Newtown families who lost their loved ones. Jones has also accused the federal government of being behind 9/11 and the Oklahoma City bombing.

Standing with your colleagues at NBC Connecticut by refusing to air this program would show that WPXI is committed to reason over ratings. Western Pennsylvanians deserve better than what NBC is offering them this weekend. Please do the right thing and air something else on Sunday night.

Thank you.
-Tony

I doubt they'll listen, but it's worth a shot.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:50 PM on June 17, 2017 [37 favorites]

I was going to go with "You blocks, you stones, you worse than senseless things", but you know what?

I'm just too done to tap into my Shakespeare right now. Every time I think "This shit can't get any stupider", these dumb motherfuckers find a way to knock out the bottom of the barrel and keep on scraping until they strike fucking magma.

There are more corruptions in this administration and the republican party, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your criminal investigations.
posted by srboisvert at 12:56 PM on June 17, 2017 [10 favorites]

> Of all the things about the current administration to be outraged about, the possibility that she was appointed due to nepotism seems really, really low down on the list.

Perhaps if Chao's appointment had been an isolated case, the appropriate level of outrage would be at GW Bush levels. As it stands, it's part of a clear pattern in the Trump Administration (and I keep forgetting it whenever I fume at McConnell's blind support for Trump).
posted by Doktor Zed at 12:57 PM on June 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

tonycpu, i borrowed your script to send to NBC Bay Area. thank you.
posted by waitangi at 1:12 PM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

Yeah, since my general expectations of Trump appointees are around the level of the Marianas Trench, it's something of a relief that Chao is actually qualified, but I somehow still have it in me to be concerned about the nepotism both in her appointment and in the general trend. As someone with a transit/sustainable transportation background, I also don't find her too inspiring.
posted by ferret branca at 1:13 PM on June 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

I am just some chick on the internet, but I am 99.9 certain that Donald Trump didn't tweet earlier about the naval emergency because he was mad.

Mad at the AG and IG and/or
Mad at somebody in the military and/or
Mad in the sense of being a complete madman

God help us when something more dangerous, deadly, and impactful happens
posted by angrycat at 1:16 PM on June 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

Maybe I'm wrong here, but I can't tell you the number of people who've personally complained to me lately about how they think Democrats cynically calculate that voters will reflexively vote for their own identity group. Sure, that's partly conservative spin, but many people really deeply resent being stereotyped (even while doing it to others themselves).
posted by saulgoodman at 1:19 PM on June 17, 2017 [3 favorites]

I just realized the possessive form of Chao's name is chaos. Siegfried!
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 1:20 PM on June 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

I deeply resent a man telling me he doesn't think it's a good thing for women to lead movements because it's pandering to "Identity politics".
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 1:23 PM on June 17, 2017 [44 favorites]

Also, God* help the missing and dead sailors and their families. Didn't mean to be cavalier about their fates.

*for all agnostic senses of God
posted by angrycat at 1:24 PM on June 17, 2017 [3 favorites]

I can't tell you the number of people who've personally complained to me lately about how they think Democrats cynically calculate that voters will reflexively vote for their own identity group.

Because whites, and especially white males (many of whom control who their wives vote for) invented "Identity Politics".
posted by oneswellfoop at 1:25 PM on June 17, 2017 [27 favorites]

As someone with a transit/sustainable transportation background, I also don't find her too inspiring.

I'm not claiming that she's inspiring: she's a mainstream Republican, and I'm sure her views on transportation policy are awful. I would be floored if I agreed with the policy agenda of any Republican Secretary of Transportation. But she's qualified. In order to dismiss her as a nepotism hire, you have to care more about who she's married to than her actual qualifications, which are extensive.

Trump is going to appoint his family's personal wedding and party planner to oversee the New York office of HUD. That's a good example of the nepotism and cronyism that drives this administration. Elaine Chao is not.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 1:31 PM on June 17, 2017 [17 favorites]

Just to elaborate on this, a common complaint by the liberal white male is that any candidate who belongs to any minority or marginalized group is "cynical pandering". Like its so fucking transparent. We can't fucking win can we, we can find the most accomplished candidate ever but because she's a woman, or black, or latinx or not Christian, its "cynical pandering". Its brocialism at its fucking worst and I am sick of it.
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 1:33 PM on June 17, 2017 [52 favorites]

You know, Elaine Chao is completely qualified to be Secretary of Transportation. She's one of the very few members of Trump's administration who is qualified for her job. She was Deputy Secretary of Transportation and Chair of the Federal Maritime Commission before she married McConnell. Of all the things about the current administration to be outraged about, the possibility that she was appointed due to nepotism seems really, really low down on the list.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 12:50 PM on June 17 [2 favorites +] [!]

The atrocity of the appointment of Chao is that she knows what she is doing in her agency and will actually be able to help bundle and sell off our infrastructure -- and she was aware of that when she took the position - early on (seems like years - it's only been months) Hannity interviewed Secretary Chao and she slipped up and said "foreign investors" and then tried to back peddle it...at about 1:50 into the interview on youtube. The whole four minutes of the interview is both informative and infuriating (unless you like Hannity and want to sell off our infrastructure).
posted by W Grant at 1:35 PM on June 17, 2017 [18 favorites]

Of all the things about the current administration to be outraged about, the possibility that she was appointed due to nepotism seems really, really low down on the list.

No need to drag McConnell into it. Elaine Chao is a right-wing shit heel on her own merit.

Under her tenure as Labor Secretary, her goal was not to protect labor but to provide cheap labor to corporations. A GAO report showed that she failed to even investigate let alone enforce wide spread complaints of wage theft. She campaigned to bust unions and to reduce the "bothersome" regulations protecting workers. She changed overtime rules so that employers could classify even minimum wage workers as "white collar", "management" or "professional" and not be paid overtime for working long hours.
posted by JackFlash at 1:35 PM on June 17, 2017 [44 favorites]

On the upside, Internet nazis are having yet another internal tantrum over who is a true member of G.R.O.S.S.
posted by PenDevil at 1:37 PM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

Couple comments deleted. Please drop it saulgoodman; we've been around this block a bunch.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 1:38 PM on June 17, 2017 [3 favorites]

Elaine Chao is a right-wing shit heel on her own merit.

Yes, that's what happens when Republicans get elected president. They appoint people with terrible politics. But you can attack her on the basis of her terrible politics, rather than implying that she's an appendage of her husband.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 1:42 PM on June 17, 2017 [17 favorites]

On the upside, Internet nazis are having yet another internal tantrum over who is a true member of G.R.O.S.S.

I knew this was coming. Richard Spencer did not spend all this time building up his Nazi brand to have Posobiec running around calling the Shakespeare in the Park audience a bunch of Nazis. It's off-message.
posted by zachlipton at 1:42 PM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

Okay, so Elaine Chao is both a floor wax and a dessert topping! She is qualified to be the Secretary of Transportation while also being a shitty human being--who happens to be married to an even more powerful and, possibly, even more shitty human being. Got it!
posted by Bella Donna at 1:42 PM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

But women (at least the white ones) went for Trump. The ones that didn't are just going to see any attempt to put their identity as a class in the nominal driver's seat as manipulative pandering, won't they?

I'm not suggesting a movement labeled or branded as led by women. I'm suggesting a movement actually led by women. Call it whatever you want.
posted by msalt at 1:44 PM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

from farther upthread:

Senator Ben Sasse (R-Neb):
To whoever just subscribed my email accts (family, work, obsolete) to multiple @Nickelback promotional & fan newsletters:
It's. Not. Funny.

gee, if only Mr. Sasse cared as much about Russia's state-sponsored hacking of american democracy as he cares about not getting lolprnkd with nickelback
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 1:45 PM on June 17, 2017 [39 favorites]

I am not sure how the guys who claim that they're defenders of Western Civilization are going to explain why they're attacking Shakespeare.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 1:45 PM on June 17, 2017 [32 favorites]

I am not sure how the guys who claim that they're defenders of Western Civilization are going to explain why they're attacking Shakespeare.

Or that most have them have Twitter bios containing either 'Screw political correctness' or 'Free speech advocate'.
posted by PenDevil at 1:50 PM on June 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

Attacking people who produce Shakespeare is attacking intellectual elites. Western culture doesn't include art - just whiteness.
posted by Joey Michaels at 2:06 PM on June 17, 2017 [22 favorites]

Senator Ben Sasse (R-Neb):
To whoever just subscribed my email accts (family, work, obsolete) to multiple @Nickelback promotional & fan newsletters:
It's. Not. Funny.

It helps if you know that Ben Sasse just published a book extolling the character-building value of suffering and how we're all immature assholes because we don't suffer enough, including discussing forcing his kids to do farmwork and singing the praises of the suffering of polio survivors.

So, yeah, if suffering is so great, surely he can listen to some fucking Nickelback and build his own fucking character.
posted by hydropsyche at 2:13 PM on June 17, 2017 [54 favorites]

> I knew this was coming. Richard Spencer did not spend all this time building up his Nazi brand to have Posobiec running around calling the Shakespeare in the Park audience a bunch of Nazis. It's off-message.

He thinks too much: such men are dangerous

So, in summary:

1. A bunch of far-right agitators tried to shut down a play that represents Trump as a master military leader and politician, brought down by jealousy and fear, and whose murder ushers in dictatorial empire. Indeed, the first performance of Julius Caesar I ever saw had Marc Antony et al. switch to Nazi uniforms once the struggle following Caeser’s assasination gets underway. Subtle, I know.

2. One of those involved provides an analogy designed to demonstrate to liberals why he’s on the side of justice. What’s he do? He messes up the title of a rather famous American play—one that uses the Salem witch trials as a metaphor for McCarthyism. Even better, he suggests casting Hilary Clinton in the role of one of the characters falsely accused of being a witch. Because why not confirm every stereotype about Trumpistas?

Perhaps we are witnessing a performance art piece intended to showcase—in a negative light—the triumph of Trumpism over conservative intellectualism?

posted by tonycpsu at 2:13 PM on June 17, 2017 [11 favorites]

Well while I firmly believe that Shakespeare was written by Shakespeare- there is some evidence that the man could have been of Jewish descent, some of his prose seems to be heavily influenced by the Talmud. So that could be why the alt-right don't like the bard.
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 2:15 PM on June 17, 2017

On the upside, Internet nazis are having yet another internal tantrum over who is a true member of G.R.O.S.S.

See, the Right and the Left can find common ground, when they circle all the way around back.

I just saw an example of this on Twitter with someone I used to know. Crazy rants, anti Obama, anti Muslim, mixed with pro LGBTQ and other liberal messages, but most of them over the top. I kept trying to decipher it and I'm honestly don't know whether they are far Right or far Left, either in how they would classify themselves or I would.
posted by bongo_x at 2:21 PM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

If anyone is feeling nostalgic, it was two years ago today we had a fpp covering Trump's escalator moment, his announcement that he would seek the Republican nomination for President of the United States.
posted by peeedro at 3:03 PM on June 17, 2017 [13 favorites]

Oh, peeedro. Reading those comments. What sweet summer children we were.
posted by greermahoney at 3:14 PM on June 17, 2017 [24 favorites]

I'm not sure that nostalgia is really the appropriate word. How would you describe the emotions of a resident of Pompeii, buried to their chin in hot lumps of raining pumice, thinking back to earlier in the week when there was that tremor and the weird rumbling from Vesuvius and everyone shrugged and made a Hephaestus joke and went on with their day?
posted by Rust Moranis at 3:15 PM on June 17, 2017 [55 favorites]

What’s a good gift for a dad going to prison soon?’: Ivanka Trump mocked for offering Father’s Day advice

At the top of the page read the headline: "Celebrate your main man with a thoughtful gift that says, among other things, 'Thank you for putting up with my teen years.'"

Ivanka Trump HQ — the Twitter handle for her company — posted a link to the website on Twitter earlier this month with the note "Whether a football lover or a coffee aficionado, these picks will please every dad."

The Twitter roasting does not disappoint
posted by Room 641-A at 3:18 PM on June 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

Of course they hate Shakespeare. Sticking it to Shakespeare is sticking it to the eggheads. Anti-intellectuals have been sticking it Shakespeare for decades if not centuries. Racist Shakespeare haters. And I remarked on the Porky's movies just the other day.
posted by octobersurprise at 3:27 PM on June 17, 2017 [3 favorites]

See, the Right and the Left can find common ground, when they circle all the way around back.

I just saw an example of this on Twitter with someone I used to know. Crazy rants, anti Obama, anti Muslim, mixed with pro LGBTQ and other liberal messages, but most of them over the top. I kept trying to decipher it and I'm honestly don't know whether they are far Right or far Left, either in how they would classify themselves or I would.

Personally, I would classify such a person as both confused and scary. And would do my best to avoid them.
posted by Bella Donna at 3:33 PM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

Honestly: I think we're overblowing the "alt-right hates Shakespeare" thing. Shakespeare's quite appreciated by neoreactionaries and dark-enlightenment shitheels in their own miserable way. You haven't lived until you've watched an hour-long Stefan Molyneux youtube video about how King Lear is actually a Men's Rights anti-virtue-signaling manifesto.
posted by Rust Moranis at 3:34 PM on June 17, 2017 [7 favorites]

Looking back at my old posts makes me feel like I had a bad dream in Feb 2016 and then it came true.

"How a demagogic opportunist can exploit a divided country"

One of my comments on that post (from the very beginning of primary season.)

I don't like any of the Republicans. But Trump is a genuine threat to our democracy. We would survive President President Cruz or President Rubio, though I wouldn't agree with their policies. Trump is different. He could corrupt our democratic process irreparably. He and Putin are big fans of each other. Putin was democratically elected but has been unwilling to yield power. They are cut from the same cloth. Trump has said he will torture people. He has said he will discriminate against people based on their religion. He has invited his supporters to physically attack people at his rallies.

What put me in mind of Putin, waaay back in Feb 2016, was this interview with Masha of Pussy Riot, from December, 2015.

“If you want in your country to have your own Putin, you can vote for Donald Trump.”

I think about that interview all the time these days. She saw it. She knew what she was talking about.
posted by OnceUponATime at 3:35 PM on June 17, 2017 [78 favorites]

I mean in the 19th century they were mad enough at Shakespeare to change the end of King Lear because they thought the dismal ending was an affront to whatever, so it's not like there's not a precedent for attacking him.

I'm a little annoyed at WS right now because for reasons related to my teaching I have to examine in class closely the interactions with Hamlet and Ophelia and I have to explain what "country matters" means and hey wow there's a pun on female genitalia there and it's all cool but man Shakespeare invites controversy in several ways.

tldr; fuck their fucking Cultural Revolution bullshit
posted by angrycat at 3:35 PM on June 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

Good news:
Hospital: Scalise now in serious condition after surgery

"Medstar Washington Medical Center said House Majority Whip Steve Scalise's (R-La.) condition has improved from critical to serious and continues to show signs of improvement after undergoing surgery Saturday.

"Congressman Steve Scalise is in serious condition. He underwent another surgery today, but continues to show signs of improvement," the hospital said in a statement. "He is more responsive, and is speaking with his loved ones. The Scalise family greatly appreciates the outpouring of thoughts and prayers."
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 3:38 PM on June 17, 2017 [17 favorites]

Sticking it to Shakespeare is sticking it to the eggheads.

Further proof, if proof were needed, that irony, history and comprehension are not in their quiver.
posted by Devonian at 3:39 PM on June 17, 2017

Did we already know that Indiana is shelling out 100K to go through Mike Pence's old AOL email account looking for state-related emails? Sad. Like, genuinely sad. I'm pretty sure the state has better uses for that money.
posted by Bella Donna at 3:42 PM on June 17, 2017 [16 favorites]

WaPo: Milwaukee Sheriff David Clarke rescinds acceptance of Homeland Security post. Trump met him on Tuesday apparently, and they might find some other gig for him inside or outside the government.
posted by zachlipton at 3:45 PM on June 17, 2017 [25 favorites]

Indiana is shelling out 100K to go through Mike Pence's old AOL email account looking for state-related emails

Aw, it must be the most activity AOL's servers have experienced in decades. Maybe Pence did government business on other ancient internet services, too. That would be great news for The Source.
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:53 PM on June 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

they might find some other gig for him inside or outside the government.

Wedding Planner might still be available.
posted by rhizome at 4:04 PM on June 17, 2017 [9 favorites]

Last spring, Pence’s AOL account was compromised by a “phishing” scheme.

But his emails?

“Pence’s contacts were sent an email falsely claiming that the governor and his wife were stranded in the Philippines and needed money,” the AP recalled.

Okay, this is genuinely funny.
posted by Room 641-A at 4:05 PM on June 17, 2017 [45 favorites]

Fortunately, all of his contacts knew the email was fake because it didn't call his wife "mother." [truth-o-meter: this is fake, the email was real, the stranding was fake]
posted by zachlipton at 4:15 PM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

AP: Trump Has Been Yelling At The TV, Frustrated With Focus On Russia Probes

The Man Who Mistook His TV For A Cloud
posted by msalt at 4:26 PM on June 17, 2017 [13 favorites]

If Pence and Mother were stranded on an island together, he'd start calling her Lovey, right?
posted by Fiberoptic Zebroid and The Hypnagogic Jerks at 4:27 PM on June 17, 2017 [11 favorites]

Credit where credit's due -- this is a funny line.

"Camp David is very rustic, it's nice, you'd like it," Trump said in an interview with a European journalist just before taking office. "You know how long you'd like it? For about 30 minutes."
posted by msalt at 4:28 PM on June 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

Buzzfeed: Six People Have Resigned From Trump's HIV/AIDS Advisory Council Because He "Doesn't Care": Six members of the Presidential Advisory Council on HIV/AIDS (PACHA) have resigned, furious at what they say is the new administration's regressive health policies and a lack of care shown by President Trump.

Scott Schoettes, Lucy Bradley-Springer, Gina Brown, Ulysses Burley III, Michelle Ogle, and Grissel Granados announced their resignations publicly in a joint letter for Newsweek magazine.

Here's the letter
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 4:28 PM on June 17, 2017 [55 favorites]

Credit where credit's due -- this is a funny line.

I'm sure he heard someone else say it and stole it. Trump is not a man who comes up with his own witticisms.
posted by Faint of Butt at 4:31 PM on June 17, 2017 [9 favorites]

Did we already know that Indiana is shelling out 100K to go through Mike Pence's old AOL email account looking for state-related emails?

It's taking a long time, because Pence has a 9600-baud modem. His modem is so slow, he's still ordering groceries from Webvan.
posted by msalt at 4:32 PM on June 17, 2017 [9 favorites]

Caitlyn Jenner on congressional baseball tragedy: "Liberals can't even shoot straight"

"Nobody deserves what happened out there," Jenner began. "There's no justification. There are crazy people. We have to minimize that type of stuff," the Olympic champion added, reacting to the shooting that targeted a Republican practice for the annual congressional baseball game on Wednesday, hospitalizing five people, including House Majority Whip Steve Scalise who remains in critical condition.

"As far as the people that were injured, it's an absolute shame. You just want them to recover," Jenner continued. "Fortunately the guy was a really bad shot… liberals can't even shoot straight."
...
Jenner's remarks at the convention came in the form of a question and answer session where a moderator incorporated questions submitted by college students in the audience. Over the course of the dinner, Jenner spoke on a variety of topics, from Kanye West to the Paris climate agreement, which the track and field legend said was "just a way for the rest of the world to kind of ruin us economically."

posted by chris24 at 4:35 PM on June 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

Trump's contradictory coalition roils elections in Georgia, Virginia (Dan Balz, WaPo)

The Virginia and Georgia elections offer two angles from which to examine the impact of Trump’s presidency on the politics of both parties. In Virginia, it is the story of a GOP coalition at odds with itself. In Georgia, it is Trump’s capacity to unite otherwise fractious Democrats as he unnerves many of the well-educated Republican voters.

posted by Barack Spinoza at 4:43 PM on June 17, 2017 [1 favorite]

1. Fuck Caitlyn Jenner.
2. Crystal Griner, one of the Capitol Police who saved those folks, who is a queer Black woman, seems to have shot her weapon just fine. I don't want to assume she's a liberal, I guess.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 4:44 PM on June 17, 2017 [94 favorites]

Caitlyn Jenner seems like a terrible person.
posted by Justinian at 4:50 PM on June 17, 2017 [78 favorites]

Has Jenner resumed stanning for Trump and Republicans on LGBTQ rights after briefly being shocked into admitting they were terrible on those?
posted by Artw at 5:08 PM on June 17, 2017 [1 favorite]

"Four score and seven years ago; and that's a lot of years, believe me; our fathers brought forth on this continent, you know what I'm talking about. Don't you love it folks? Just the best continent. A new nation, conceived in Liberty. That's right. Lih-buh-tee. And don't forget it. Conceived in Liberty and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal, and that's something people don't know but it's true. People don't talk about that. You won't hear that in the fake news, am I right?"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:35 AM on June 16

You magnificent bastard. I demand this be printed on a cake and eaten.
posted by petebest at 5:15 PM on June 17, 2017 [21 favorites]

tonycpsu, thanks for the script, I used it for my local NBC affiliate as well.
posted by biogeo at 5:26 PM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

WaPo: Milwaukee Sheriff David Clarke rescinds acceptance of Homeland Security post. Trump met him on Tuesday apparently, and they might find some other gig for him inside or outside the government.

I feel like there's something off about this. Clarke is a terrible person, but none of the knocks against him seem like the type of thing that would turn off Trump to him.
posted by drezdn at 5:36 PM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

> Clarke is a terrible person, but none of the knocks against him seem like the type of thing that would turn off Trump to him.

Clarke was in Russia at the same time as Flynn. Depending on your POV, that could be considered "off".
posted by klarck at 5:49 PM on June 17, 2017 [31 favorites]

Jesus, it really is Russia all the way down with these people, isn't it?

Also: Motherfuck Caitlyn Jenner. She's clearly the poster child for people who climb the ladder, kick it down so no one else can climb up after her, then deny there was ever a ladder there, saying they scaled that wall with their bare hands and feet.

You know, a Republican.
posted by CommonSense at 5:54 PM on June 17, 2017 [86 favorites]

I feel like there's something off about this. Clarke is a terrible person, but none of the knocks against him seem like the type of thing that would turn off Trump to him.

Trump's probably grooming him for head of the FBI.
posted by happyroach at 5:56 PM on June 17, 2017 [7 favorites]

Wasnt there some denial from the WH that Clarke wasn't really -- or formally -- offered the job in the first place?

I learned last night that in the new Netflix/Brad Pitt movie, War Machine, Anthony Michael Hall plays a character based on Flynn. I'm not sure if that's just ruined John Hughs movies for me or the entire 80s.
posted by Room 641-A at 6:00 PM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

Secretary of Flare
posted by Room 641-A at 6:27 PM on June 17, 2017 [36 favorites]

Looks like Putin is doing his bit to shove Megyn Kelly in front of the bus: Unedited Putin Interview Reveals A Missed Opportunity For Megyn Kelly and America

The last question Kelly asked Putin, which was not aired, was startling in its pandering. “We have been here in St. Petersburg for about a week now. And virtually every person we have met on the street says what they respect about you is they feel that you have returned dignity to Russia, that you’ve returned Russia to a place of respect. You’ve been in the leadership of this country for 17 years now. Has it taken any sort of personal toll on you?”
posted by PenDevil at 6:37 PM on June 17, 2017 [18 favorites]

You all didn't mention today is the 45th anniversary of the Watergate break-in

Y'know cause. 45. WINK WINK. (Link goes to Robert Redford in WaPo giving his take. Including that Woodward & Bernstein thought he was a plant for Nixon at first.)
posted by petebest at 6:38 PM on June 17, 2017 [14 favorites]

petebest: You all didn't mention today is the 45th anniversary of the Watergate break-in

I was born that night, so happy birthday to me and the whole Watergate Thing.

I already had my cake and opened presents tonight, but I suuuure would like just one more gift -- maybe something that says "Twenty-fifth Amendment" on it....
posted by wenestvedt at 6:42 PM on June 17, 2017 [25 favorites]

Caitlyn Jenner on congressional baseball tragedy: "Liberals can't even shoot straight"

Oh, but if you'd been there with a javelin, you'd have staked the dude to the turf, right, Caitlyn? *snort*
posted by wenestvedt at 6:46 PM on June 17, 2017 [10 favorites]

Unedited Putin Interview Reveals A Missed Opportunity For Megyn Kelly and America

Megyn Kelly has never been a real journalist. She's been reading Republican propaganda off prompter her entire career, and just because shes the one faceless FOX blonde that made it out doesn't mean she suddenly discovered integrity or actual ability as a journalist. She did that interview not to hold Putin to the fire, but to use her new platform to support Trump's "Russia pivot" and sell the scandal to the FOX audience NBC is trying to poach. She's horrible. She's always been horrible. She hasn't suddenly changed. NBC is horrible for hiring her. They're all working to sell Trump's treason.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:54 PM on June 17, 2017 [63 favorites]

WSJ says the seven missing sailors from the Fitzgerald are confirmed dead. "The seven sailors were found in a berthing area of the vessel below the waterline, the official said."

.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 7:07 PM on June 17, 2017 [8 favorites]

A Russian billionaire's megayacht is blocking views of the Statue of Liberty

Suddenly I take back everything bad I ever said about people blowing money on things like personal submarines. Somebody torpedo that asshole.

I will never be able to re-read pre-election threads, but I invite all future historians to marvel at our naivete and blindness.

Also the only really pressing thing on my calendar Monday is to call motherfucking Cruz and Cornyn and tell them I see what they are up to and they'll have blood on their hands and frantic, angry constituents out for blood if they pass this shitbag Trumpcare bill.
posted by emjaybee at 7:12 PM on June 17, 2017 [17 favorites]

Turmoil compounds White House's struggles to fill out top ranks of government (Lisa Rein and Abby Phillip, WaPo)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 7:38 PM on June 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

Caitlyn Jenner on congressional baseball tragedy: "Liberals can't even shoot straight"

Truly intersectional feminism means acknowledging that Caitlyn Jenner needs to fuck the fuck off
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:54 PM on June 17, 2017 [107 favorites]

She hasn't suddenly changed. NBC is horrible for hiring her.

Does anyone else feel that NBC is the one that has suddenly changed, since they were purchased by the beloved Comcast Cable?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:58 PM on June 17, 2017 [7 favorites]

He did not rise from his seat to present the national teacher of the year with her much-deserved award, nor did he allow her to speak.

"The [National Teacher of the Year] award is traditionally presented by the President of the United States in the White House Rose Garden." Christ, what an asshole.
posted by kirkaracha at 7:59 PM on June 17, 2017 [23 favorites]

I was born that night, so happy birthday to me and the whole Watergate Thing.

By the time the investigations hit the news I was 7 or so and I remember leaning forward from the back seat of the car (no car seats back then, kids) and asking, basically, what's up with all this "Watergate" stuff. And my parents said that the President might've been very bad and he might've told his friends to do bad things and that now the government (the people my dad worked with) was trying to decide if that was so and if it was what punishment the President deserved. I remember being satisfied by that and thinking that my mom and dad had it all under control.
posted by octobersurprise at 8:06 PM on June 17, 2017 [56 favorites]

Other candidates told The Post they would eagerly serve but are simply waiting for offers.

what do you want to bet Chris Christie begged the Post to print his name along with the job-beg instead of treating him as an anonymous source?

and they said they would, they said they'd give him his own whole paragraph, but then they didn't

just for kicks
posted by queenofbithynia at 8:07 PM on June 17, 2017 [9 favorites]

Caitlyn Jenner on congressional baseball tragedy: "Liberals can't even shoot straight"

Caitlyn Jenner is a hot mess.
posted by octobersurprise at 8:10 PM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

Anything that Trump's incompetence can do to prevent his administration from filling positions to actually DO something will be a minor blessing compared to a competent Republican achieving the party's evil agenda.

And NBC has been horrible ever since they agreed with Mark Burnett that Trump would be perfect playing the mogul on The Apprentice... and when they dropped the tech shows from MSNBC. (Disclaimer: most of my internet writing income in the '00s was doing articles for the Media section of MSNBC's website, which was under the management of the MS part of the former partnership and has since moved to TodayShow.com. I never went near The Apprentice show but I did an 'interview' with Deal or No Deal's fictional Banker that shows he was a better business model than the Donald)

Meanwhile the Shakespeare kerfuffle has made me think of comics genius Ryan North, who in addition to his Dinosaur and Squirrel Girl achievements, has published two "choose your own Shakespeare" books based loosely on Hamlet and Romeo & Juliet. What he could do with a Trump-based Julius Caeser... only one of dozens of story threads would have been his assassination, with others depicting him declaring war on one of several counties or fleeing to one of several others. "President Caesar": get to work Ryan!!!
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:14 PM on June 17, 2017 [2 favorites]

Caitlyn Jenner is a hot mess.

Messica Simpson. Mess of the D'Urbervilles. Of course she'd say something like that.
posted by en forme de poire at 8:16 PM on June 17, 2017 [6 favorites]

Other candidates told The Post they would eagerly serve but are simply waiting for offers.

what do you want to bet Chris Christie begged the Post to print his name along with the job-beg instead of treating him as an anonymous source?

Keep eatin' that loaf, Chris
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:21 PM on June 17, 2017

NBC and Mark Burnett have thousands and thousands of hours of behind the scenes Trump footage. They intentionally didn't put any of it out there to help him get elected. NBC-Comcast (and Mark Burnett individually) should be considered a collaborating media company. Along with James Comey, they share as much responsibility for Trump and everything that happens because of him as Trump himself.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:23 PM on June 17, 2017 [51 favorites]

what do you want to bet Chris Christie begged the Post to print his name along with the job-beg

Y'know, after this week with Sessions being such a clueless shit during his hearing, I actually thought Trump made a real mistake in dropping Christie. Granted, Christie has zero public credibility anymore after the way he behaved during the campaign, but that hasn't been a problem for any other Trump appointee so far. And as much of a clown as Christie is, I'd bet he's at least a more competent lawyer than Sessions.

Kinda left me wondering how much Christie knows about the Russia stuff, though. 'cause either he was successfully kept in the dark all along, or he knows things and he's still keeping his mouth shut. Even after getting shafted during the transition.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 8:34 PM on June 17, 2017 [4 favorites]

I feel like it's a waiting game right now. The players are going to turn on each other, but in what order? Is Trump going to turn on Republicans first, or them on him? And my personal pick, Putin turns on Trump and/or the Republicans. Because he's the only one with half a brain playing this game, and the only one with a real plan.
posted by bongo_x at 9:16 PM on June 17, 2017 [3 favorites]

Meanwhile, in Florida, the governor is trying to hijack the Supreme Court.
posted by Chrysostom at 9:43 PM on June 17, 2017 [5 favorites]

Attention deficit as a tool of international diplomacy:

“We will continue this dialogue with [the Palestinian leadership],” Tillerson told the House Foreign Affairs Committee. He went on to say that US President Donald Trump has only a “certain window of patience” and “a certain window which he will remain engaged and be interested.”

posted by Joe in Australia at 10:10 PM on June 17, 2017 [15 favorites]

He went on to say that US President Donald Trump has only a “certain window of patience” and “a certain window which he will remain engaged and be interested.”

The period known as "pre-juice-and-nap" each afternoon.
posted by Rykey at 10:43 PM on June 17, 2017 [41 favorites]

Rykey, I bet his aides make the same joke.

Things like this make me abstractly sorry for Trump. I don't remember any of Reagan's aides implying that their President was less than competent, and I wonder whether Trump is aware that his appointees are so openly contemptuous. I mean, telling people that your boss can't focus? That's not the sort of thing you say about someone you view as your superior, or even as a colleague.
posted by Joe in Australia at 11:42 PM on June 17, 2017 [9 favorites]

I recall literally no stories ever about Reagan being shitty to his aides and staffers. Such stories about Trump are already widespread.

And here's the thing: Reagan was an absolute snake on many levels. Dubya teased people and gave them lame nicknames. I can also remember at least one well-researched piece about Bernie Sanders being an infuriating boss and generally being hell to work for. Yet on some level, they clearly have some sort of human touch that can inspire loyalty. They could make people feel like they were working toward something good (yes, even Reagan and Bush with their endless litanies of sins). That bit about Sanders being an unpleasant boss? It was generally about him being a workaholic, and in all fairness the dude cares about actual causes worth fighting for. Those guys are/were capable of genuine warmth and interest in people other than themselves.

Also endless evidence about Hillary Clinton being a warm, caring, thoughtful boss and showing great empathy for her fellow human beings but she's villified as a monster mutter mutter mutter what no I'm not bitter

But Trump? That guy? At this point, his primary point of inspiring loyalty is shared hate and common enemies. That, and within his inner circle there's probably the instinct to hang together and ride out the storm 'cause if they start coming apart they're all gonna drown. They're sticking together now because they have to. Does anyone honestly imagine people go home from a day at this White House feeling good about themselves?
posted by scaryblackdeath at 12:04 AM on June 18, 2017 [68 favorites]

I Was Hired as White House Senior Staff and All I Got Was This Lousy Indictment.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 12:08 AM on June 18, 2017 [25 favorites]

I was born that night, so happy birthday to me and the whole Watergate Thing.

By the time the investigations hit the news I was 7...

I remember hearing about Nixon resigning ands asking my father if the king had been notified. My understanding of government at that time apparently was still based on fairy tales.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:13 AM on June 18, 2017 [13 favorites]

Well, obviously it's because of a conspiracy of liberals and the deep state, but the Trump Trade is off
(SAXO group is owned by a libertarian who hands out Ayn Rand books)
posted by mumimor at 1:39 AM on June 18, 2017

Hands out Rand's books?! Quick, somebody, harness her withered corpse to a generator!
posted by Joe in Australia at 2:44 AM on June 18, 2017 [31 favorites]

If the economic advice in the books is bogus, he's serving his own rational self-interest by handing them out.
posted by Dr Dracator at 3:16 AM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

What has the NRA had to say, oneaso wonders?

The "cerebral" @NRA account has not tweeted for days. The "inciteful" @NRATV account is basically saying that you should shoot liberals because Madonna.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 5:38 AM on June 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

This Vanity Fair article on Trump features an excellent parody of Hieronymous Bosch
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 5:59 AM on June 18, 2017 [29 favorites]

Sandoval vetoes Medicaid-for-all bill at the last minute.
posted by Slothrup at 6:17 AM on June 18, 2017

Hands out Rand's books?! Quick, somebody, harness her withered corpse to a generator!

Hey, if that's the market rate for her books, she can't disagree.
posted by lmfsilva at 6:23 AM on June 18, 2017 [15 favorites]

Yeah, I know, just more Trump being awful, part 248. But this, along with everything else, is why I can't and won't forgive Trump supporters. He is such a manifestly vile person, American, Christian, father, husband that -- even ignoring his obvious unfitness as a businessman/politician and his stupidity -- supporting him clearly indicates to me something wrong and despicable about you.

@biannagolodryga:
The President has woken up to news that 7 US sailors have died. He has chosen to tweet about witch hunts and poll numbers.
posted by chris24 at 6:43 AM on June 18, 2017 [60 favorites]

@jaketapper:
.@marcorubio says in meeting on Friday @POTUS talked about Russia investigation -- "the same stuff you've seen him say on twitter."

@jaketapper:
.@marcorubio says he believes in the integrity of the investigation "because I believe in Bob Mueller’s record of serving our country."

@kailanikm:
Sen. Rubio on Russian interference: "Look, the president has said he doesn't believe it. I believe it. Not only do I believe it, I know it."
posted by chris24 at 6:59 AM on June 18, 2017 [47 favorites]

Education Dept. closes transgender student cases as it pushes to scale back civil rights investigations: The agency communicated its decision in a letter this week to lawyers representing the girl, an elementary school student in Highland, Ohio. The letter provided no reason or legal justification for withdrawing its 2016 conclusion that the girl’s school wrongly barred her from the girls’ bathroom and failed to address the harassment she endured from classmates and teachers, who repeatedly addressed her with male pronouns and the male name she was given at birth.

Officials withdrew the findings of discrimination, Jackson said, because those findings were based on guidance that directed schools to allow transgender students access to bathrooms matching their gender identity. The Trump administration rescinded that guidance in February.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:18 AM on June 18, 2017 [12 favorites]

CNN: A representative from President Donald Trump's legal team said Trump is not under investigation, despite the President tweeting "I am being investigated" this week.

Really? REALLY? THAT'S what you're going with??! "UHH MY CLIENT WAS EXPRESSING RAGE ON TWITTER ABOUT HIS OWN EMPLOYEE DOING SOMETHING THAT HE ACTUALLY ISN'T DOING, EXCEPT LITERALLY EVERYONE KNOWS THAT OF COURSE HE IS DOING IT EXCEPT POSSIBLY FOR MY CLIENT THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES" JESUS CHRIST PEOPLE
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:33 AM on June 18, 2017 [8 favorites]

So uh, if Trump is not under investigation, why is he hiring outside counsel? And why is that outside counsel all over the news shows?
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:40 AM on June 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

I wonder how many times Trump's legal team has called Mueller asking how much it'll cost to settle.
posted by benzenedream at 7:48 AM on June 18, 2017 [80 favorites]

Since 1993, one of my hobbies has been reading about Russian oligarchs. Trump was a name that came up from time to time, along with others. Id read about his deals or friends or whatever and think, of course Trump is in cahoots with the Russian mob. Hes a two-bit scam artist, and classless, to boot. Hes perfect for the Russian mafia, exactly the type to be wowed by a mink track suit.

I didnt care, because who the heck was Donald Trump, anyway? A loser reality TV guy that any serious person could see right through. But then he became the president of the United States, and I seriously lost my shit.

I read the amazing Buzzfeed article upthread about Scot Youngs death, and this sent me off down memory lane. I found some nice old articles of the type I used to read back when Russian oligarchs were more fun to think about, and a mention of Trump was just sort of a well, duh kind of joke.

International Russian Organized Crime Ring Does Old-School Gambling in a New Way - from 2013

“The main players include a notorious Russian thief-in-law (the equivalent of an Italian mafia don), a billionaire art mogul, a J.P. Morgan banker, a Hollywood poker hostess and the Russian-born ringleader -- poker pro Vadim Trincher, who lived in Trump Tower in a $5 million apartment directly beneath that of “The Donald” himself.

“From his apartment he oversaw what must have been the world's largest sports book,” Assistant US Attorney Harris Fischman said during a hearing at which a judge ordered Trincher, facing nearly a century behind bars if convicted, held for trial without bail.

The article below focuses more closely on a co-conspirator mentioned in the first article:

In Russia, Living the High Life; in America, a Wanted Man - from 2013

It doesnt mention Trump, but this is the guy Trump palled around with at the Miss Universe pageant in Moscow in 1993. He was on the red carpet even though he was a wanted man in the US at the time.

There is no possible way Trump is not somehow financially compromised by Russian mobsters, at the very least. And when the least of your worries is Russian mobsters, well, you got some worries.

*

I apologize for the lack of apostrophes and quotation marks in my post. That key on my computer has died. Its been very humbling.
posted by staggering termagant at 8:00 AM on June 18, 2017 [89 favorites]

CNN: A representative from President Donald Trump's legal team said Trump is not under investigation, despite the President tweeting "I am being investigated" this week.

NYMag National Affairs Editor Gabriel Sherman: "Source close to the WH told me other day that Bannon and Priebus have all but stopped trying to get Trump to stop tweeting insane things [1/2] Advisers stopped raising tweets with Trump because he lashes out when he's feeling controlled by staff. Legal team is pulling hair out [2/2]"
posted by Doktor Zed at 8:04 AM on June 18, 2017 [30 favorites]

Bannon and Priebus have all but stopped trying to

These words will always indicate good news.
posted by Rust Moranis at 8:08 AM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

‘The war after Isis’: has Trump opened the door to conflict with Iran?
posted by adamvasco at 8:10 AM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Donald Trump says avoiding STDs was his "personal Vietnam." Bob Mueller's personal Vietnam was ... Vietnam.

Not that this point will make a dent in the calcified brains of the right-wingers who voted for Alabama Air Guardian Dumbya and 5-Deferrment Dick over TWO DIFFERENT Prez candidates who served in Nam.
posted by NorthernLite at 8:11 AM on June 18, 2017 [10 favorites]

If Pence and Mother were stranded on an island together, he'd start calling her Lovey, right?

Man, can we maybe leave this "Mother" thing alone for a bit? I know it's weird to you guys but as a lifelong Midwesterner, it seems perfectly normal to me. My Michigan-farmer grandfather never referred to his wife as anything other than "Mom." My Illinois-suburban brother also calls his wife that. It's just a rural thing, I guess, and seems endearing to me.
posted by rocket at 8:13 AM on June 18, 2017 [17 favorites]

Man, can we maybe leave this "Mother" thing alone for a bit? I know it's weird to you guys but as a lifelong Midwesterner, it seems perfectly normal to me

The thing about living in a society that hates women is that often the things that seem "perfectly normal" are in fact misogynist AF, and in those cases it's maybe not great to tut tut at everybody who points that out because it makes you uncomfortable about reconciling warm memories of whatever with the fact that misogyny was also (ever) present in those memories. Like I get that that's not fun -- it's not fun for any of us! See also: realizations about racism -- but, you know, so what.
posted by schadenfrau at 8:36 AM on June 18, 2017 [79 favorites]

‘The war after Isis’: has Trump opened the door to conflict with Iran?

Wait till he finds out ISIS are our allies in that war.
posted by Talez at 8:40 AM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

Bannon and Priebus have all but stopped trying to

Remember when they told us that Trump would be surrounded by advisers who would keep him from doing anything stupid?
posted by octothorpe at 8:43 AM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

See also: realizations about racism -- but, you know, so what.

Or maybe I did spend some time analyzing it (and spend a lot of time analyzing my own racism) and felt like hearing my grandparents call each other "Mom" and "Dad" wasn't all that super misogynist, but rather kind of endearing family shorthand like "bubba" and "sissy" and hearing everyone else tut tut the use of it felt kinda classist. But you know, so what.
posted by rocket at 8:52 AM on June 18, 2017 [32 favorites]

Remember when they told us that Trump would be surrounded by advisers who would keep him from doing anything stupid?

Really, no? Pretty much from the get go it was apparent his advisors were all going to be crooks and Nazis. That they are all turning out to be ineffectual idiots as well has sort of softened that I guess? But I really don't remember the same hopes for Trump being an idiot surrounded by "good people" that we heard for Bush.
posted by Artw at 9:02 AM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

Artw: I definitely do remember people saying this. Mainly all the moderate Republicans around me who held their noses and voted for Trump because Hillary would have been so much worse.

Edited to fix html disaster brought on by attempting to use Russian-style quotation marks in above sentence.
posted by staggering termagant at 9:06 AM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

Apparently on one of the Sunday shows, Trump attorney's says Trump will reveal this week whether secret White House tapes exist and he will for sure testify under oath for Mueller if asked.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:10 AM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

hearing everyone else tut tut the use of it felt kinda classist

Sure, my spouse and I call each other "Mom" and "Dad" all the time when the kids are around. If we did it when we were at a formal business dinner with no kids around, that would be a funny goof that we laughed about, once. Do it again, and yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if someone noted it as weird, especially if I had political leanings that make me look like I think women are only useful as Mothers.
posted by Etrigan at 9:11 AM on June 18, 2017 [32 favorites]

Those people may have been crooks, Nazis and idiots also.

So anyway, have they stopped saying that shit?
posted by Artw at 9:11 AM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Yeah, I had people say that to me in person. "Oh, he may be a little wild but he'll have people to guide him."
posted by octothorpe at 9:11 AM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Man, can we maybe leave this "Mother" thing alone for a bit? I know it's weird to you guys but as a lifelong Midwesterner, it seems perfectly normal to me

My ex-husband is Japanese. My name has both an R and an L in it so he found it very difficult to pronounce it. Shortly after we were married he started calling me "Mother" in Japanese-- even before we had children. Looking back it bothered me yet I never called him out on it. I can to this day hear in my head: Okasan! in his exasperated tone because I made a mistake or was running late or dropped something. He was emotionally abusive to me and that was one of the ways he controlled me-- taking my name away and substituting my assigned role in his life.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 9:25 AM on June 18, 2017 [58 favorites]

people read pence's "mother" thing as misogynistic because pence is blatantly deeply misogynist, but maybe if we want to talk about mike pence's deep misogyny, we can just talk about the blatantly misogynistic policies and statements he's made and supports.

these people don't benefit from a deep reading - their awfulness is right there to see.
posted by murphy slaw at 9:29 AM on June 18, 2017 [26 favorites]

I don't think we need to take another lap around the "mother" thing.

I think we should all be able to agree that, in general, people calling their spouse "mother" is probably fine and not a big deal. But something about the way Mike Pence does it is different than what you're thinking of and is well over the line into creepy-town and it maybe sexist.

Can we just leave it there?

I mean, there isn't a "transitive property of creepiness" or anything. Just because Mike Pence is creepy about the way he uses a pet name for his spouse doesn't mean it's automatically creepy if someone else does the same thing.
posted by VTX at 9:33 AM on June 18, 2017 [13 favorites]

This Vanity Fair article on Trump features an excellent parody of Hieronymous Bosch
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 8:59 AM on June 18

That is indeed amazing! I can identify everybody except the very fat guy in the blue suit being jabbed by Satan's pitchfork. Is it Kislyak? I thought he had grey hair.

It took me a moment to identify Ben Carson standing next to Kellyanne Conway but then I figured out he was wearing surgical scrubs. Also, is there a reason why P. Ryan has a red bottom and Pence isn't wearing pants?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 9:34 AM on June 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

RE: Shakespeare in the Park.

@anonops_nato
That's interesting. http://Freelaura.com was created by Ezra Levant at 6pm UTC, 2pm EDT. Laura crashed the play at 6pm EDT. [screenshot of WhoIs info]
- How would you know that someone was going to be arrested 4 hours in advance?
- It's obviously a stunt, but Ezra Levant knew that Laura Loomis was going to be arrested. Probably instructed her to be arrested.
- Oh look, they had the graphics and the campaign all ready to go the minute she was arrested. Astroturf much, @JackPosobiec ?

@HeerJeet
So the http://freelaura.com domain created hours before she was arrested. Whole Caesar disruption clearly a staged provocation.
- Background to Julius Caesar stunt: the main shouter works for The Rebel, Canadian alt-right outfit short on cash because of lawsuits.
- The Rebel in deep financial hole & needs constant cash influx from rightist dupes via stunts like Caesar disruption http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/ezra-levant-supreme-court-denies-libel-appeal-1.4151925

@RVAwonk
So Rebel Media's Ezra Levant knew hours in advance that Laura Loomis would be arrested for her stunt at NY's Public Theater last night... 1/
- Certainly Levant isn't telling his employees to break the law so he can profit from the resulting video...right? 2/
- Oh, and look who else was planning ahead!--> Here's Cernovich talking about the production to Russian propaganda outlet RT on the 14th... [screenshot] 3/
- And the next day, he offered $1,000 to anyone who would disrupt the play. So that would make Posobiec and Loomis... paid protesters.
Mike Cernovich - $1,000 contest to disrupt Julius Caesar play in New York!
posted by chris24 at 9:45 AM on June 18, 2017 [68 favorites]

I can identify everybody except the very fat guy in the blue suit being jabbed by Satan's pitchfork. Is it Kislyak? I thought he had grey hair.

Could it be Chris Christie?
posted by Nat "King" Cole Porter Wagoner at 9:46 AM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Well it's not a proper Bosch homage without some bare bottoms. The guy in the blue suit might be Christie?
posted by Dr Dracator at 9:46 AM on June 18, 2017

Surely Chris Christie. The traffic cones seem to allude to bridgegate.
posted by stonepharisee at 9:52 AM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

Also, is there a reason why P. Ryan has a red bottom and Pence isn't wearing pants?

I enjoy this out of context but regardless, everything in Bosch is bare bottoms for days. AND YET that original figure in the painting is hunching to hide his shame, as in the magazine picture, but his bottom is as pale as could be. so I surmise that the VF artist was just being mean. Or else implying that Paul had to be spanked into submission before he got in line for the honor of climbing up into the great hollow husk of Trump's carcass, and in that case the artist is being much too kind.
posted by queenofbithynia at 9:53 AM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

Whole Caesar disruption clearly a staged provocation.

No shit?
posted by rhizome at 9:57 AM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

Couple comments removed, folks please drop the "Mother" thing at this point. We've been over it before and it's like the 100th worst thing about Mike Pence and intersects with non-fuckery regional/cultural stuff in a way that makes it a weird thing to keep coming back to the well on.
posted by cortex (staff) at 10:08 AM on June 18, 2017 [36 favorites]

“We just don't expect a very capable warship to be so badly damaged in a normal, peacetime environment,” said Patrick Cronin, head of the Asia-Pacific program at the Center for a New American Security. Did no one tell the Navy or these, no doubt, highly paid analysts, these are not normal times. If these times are an X-ray version of the normal shitshow, then these are hyper normal times, and more dangerous than anyone is copping to. It is as if the oiligarchs, and the oligarchs, and the rrrright, are so buzzed about their ascendance they are missing the basics of the ongoing danger. It is like jackals are feeding on he corpse of a wildebeest they stole from a single lioness, but another pride is on the way. They are out to lunch, there is nothing normal about this. In denying there was Russian influence on the election they are missing the physical manifestation of interference and the run up to war. A container ship doesn't 180 on a missile destroying ship in the age of North Korean testing over Japanese waters. There are all kinds of hacks, some change opinion, but some change physical manifestations.

We know, we know, they would like us to all be still until the robbery is over. Their rrright ideals will have won and we will be at war. Look to who profits from war, and who made the control systems for both ships. Is this the self driving car crash phenomenon? Big fun taking control of large vessels. I bet there are a lot of twenty something, chaos addicts who have the skills to do this, in their little office in Macedonia, in Prague.
posted by Oyéah at 10:11 AM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Surely Chris Christie. The traffic cones seem to allude to bridgegate.

how about the three floating at the bottom?
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:20 AM on June 18, 2017

We would love it if the law or even the US Constitution were about equality, fair treatment, equal opportunity. It is being interpreted that the opportunity is taken by the strongest man who can take it, and competitively make the most money. What trickles down to workers is the least he can let go of and still make money, on the slimmest continuity, least regulation, least responsibility for anything but his own pleasure, and bank accounts.

We would love it if Mr. Pence would not contribute to a climate of discrimination, but he is VP, to do exactly that. He is VP to make sure the rrreligious rrrright feels comfy in their discriminatory plans. Sessions is in place to make sure the rrright is once again comfortable in their legislated bigotry, their private prisons for millions of individuals who are too black, too brown.

The country club is open for business, and what goes on outside their grassy lawns and golf courses is irrelevant to them. Everyone is a mother or a whore with them.
posted by Oyéah at 10:20 AM on June 18, 2017 [10 favorites]

However, what I think we can all enjoy together is that the Oath Keepers and the alt-right seem to be continuing and escalating their messy, Texas-originated breakup.

For those who haven't been following this, the fault lines began to show as early as the Battle of Berkeley, where Stewart Rhodes, head honcho of Oathkeepers, publicly uttered:

I dislike the neo-Nazis more than Anti-fa, since they try to worm their way in and by doing so, they harm the cause of liberty far more than the radical leftists could ever do. Watch my speech. I made it very clear that this is about CIVIC nationalism, and not white nationalism, and the white nationalists want to destroy all my family fought to preserve, and to the Sam Houstion are as deadly to this Republic as any communist.

As the shouting continued, David Amad, of Open Carry Texas (OCT), stepped forward. “Son you are leaving here one way or another.”

Before Amad could finish the threat a member of his group sprang from behind the lone alt righter and put him into a chokehold. After a few seconds the two were separated and Amad escorted the victim away from the scene while This Is Texas/OCT members radioed to police.

As the member of OCT was Hispanic, this has predictably unleashed a host of horrible racist alt-righters saying all sorts of terrible things, and various members of Open Carry Texas/Oathkeepers being denounced on such platforms as Alt-Right and the Daily Stormer.

With relatively notable figures with in the 3%/Open-Carry movement joining in the fray - the most recent as of yesterday being retired first sergeant CJ Grisham, founder of OCT - it seems possible that we might be able to look forward to a day where the Oathkeepers and equivalents decide it is no longer in their interests to protect these fuckers.
posted by corb at 10:28 AM on June 18, 2017 [34 favorites]

And my personal pick, Putin turns on Trump and/or the Republicans. Because he's the only one with half a brain playing this game, and the only one with a real plan.

I think there's a non-zero chance that some of the things that the Russians and Chinese are pulling that look dirty as hell (the Rosneft sale, the Trump trademark being approved in China, the factory worker advocates that were investigating Ivanka's factories being disappeared) are Russia and China intentionally playing the game to make Trump look suspicious and undermine faith and trust in the United States, both domestically and internationally. Other than losing their temper over Taiwan, the Chinese have been dealing with the situation smart and well. If we're concerned about Russia blackmailing US politicians, don't forget the Chinese have a wealth of blackmail material from from various hacks as well.
posted by Candleman at 10:33 AM on June 18, 2017 [7 favorites]

Eric Trump has chosen Fathers Day to flog Trump merch on twitter (My #FathersDay gift from @LaraLeaTrump! #MakeAmericaGreatAgain
shop.donaldjtrump.com/products/maga-…) with a picture of a MAGA hat and golf club covers branded with the Trump logo. And if that's truly what his wife gave him for Fathers Day then I'm stunned.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 10:45 AM on June 18, 2017

I mean are we supposed to believe that Eric doesn't already own a thousand MAGA hats? Talk about coals to Newcastle.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 10:49 AM on June 18, 2017 [7 favorites]

The best people...

@markberman
Trump's lawyer: The president is not under investigation

@MeetThePress Trump lawyer Jay Sekulow: “The president has not been and is not under investigation.”

Also Trump's lawyer: The president is under investigation

@FoxNewsSunday .@JaySekulow on const'l threshold:@POTUS did what DOJ recommended,fired Comey & now is being investigated by agency that told him to do it.

@dandrezner
It wasn't just @FoxNewsSunday. Here, Sekulow also contradicts himself on whether Trump is under investigation. http://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2017/06/18/jay-sekulow-trump-obstruction-of-justice-sotu.cnn

@dandrezner
Wait, Jay Sekulow claims that Comey should've respected the attorney-client privilege re: his testimony about Trump? WTF does that mean?
posted by chris24 at 11:35 AM on June 18, 2017 [33 favorites]

Does Trump's lawyer think the FBI Director is somehow supposed to be the President's attorney? That's moon law stuff.

Here's the transcript. We jump right from "and now he's being investigated by the Department of Justice" to "No, he's not being investigated!"

Anyway, speaking of moon law, we now have confirmation that Sheriff Clarke really was offered the DHS job he turned down. DHS misspelled "Sheriff" twice.
posted by zachlipton at 11:54 AM on June 18, 2017 [35 favorites]

that sort of smells like an attorney throwing out phrases that, while making no sense in this context, would gain some purchase in the minds of the viewers who have been in the bullshit for so long they can't smell additional bullshit
posted by angrycat at 11:55 AM on June 18, 2017 [9 favorites]

And I'm again floored by their failure to spell-check. Does this administration look at the wavy red lines and think 'fuck you, wavy red lines are for Shakespeare-watching intellectuals'?
posted by angrycat at 11:58 AM on June 18, 2017 [51 favorites]

that sort of smells like an attorney throwing out phrases that, while making no sense in this context, would gain some purchase in the minds of the viewers

That's what I was thinking: muddying the waters by implying Trump was Comey's client.
posted by rhizome at 11:59 AM on June 18, 2017

This is good stuff from the NYT: How Michael Flynn’s Disdain for Limits Led to a Legal Quagmire, which digs into the "legal and political quagmire" his consulting business got himself into.

It describes his Turkish work, but fails to make the connection to basically his first act on the job being to scuttle the plan to arm the Kurds, adopting pro-Turkish military policy for the government just shortly after being paid to act as a foreign agent for Turkey. Why that's not a giant scandal on its own escapes me.
posted by zachlipton at 12:04 PM on June 18, 2017 [10 favorites]

knowing comey's penchant for CYA, he probably preceded every conversation with trump with "i am not your attorney. this is not legal advice"
posted by murphy slaw at 12:05 PM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

Gingrich suggests Comey is under investigation

Gingrich to me is like that clown from It; Pennywise horrified me in the nineties at one point, I forgot all about him, and now apparently he's back as a major motion picture.
posted by angrycat at 12:07 PM on June 18, 2017 [32 favorites]

Anyway, speaking of moon law, we now have confirmation that Sheriff Clarke really was offered the DHS job he turned down.

So we're in a timeline where the Executive Branch of the United States of America is judged to be too dysfunctional a workplace for David Fucking Clarke, the elected county Sheriff who wears a replica Secret Service badge on his uniform, and 'asserted that there were "hundreds of thousands" or "maybe a million" people who "have pledged allegiance or are supporting ISIS, giving aid and comfort," and stated that "our commander in chief ought to utilize Article I, Section 9" to imprison them at the Guantanamo Bay detention camp "and hold them indefinitely under a suspension of habeas corpus"'.

This is normal, let's give them a chance
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:07 PM on June 18, 2017 [34 favorites]

I learned last night that in the new Netflix/Brad Pitt movie, War Machine, Anthony Michael Hall plays a character based on Flynn. I'm not sure if that's just ruined John Hughs movies for me or the entire 80s.

If it's any consolation, it looks like it was filmed in 2015 before Flynn was much of a household name, he retired in 2014 and was just beginning to build his Fox News profile. In the movie that character is portrayed as an incoherent shouty guy, so it works out just fine.

The 2012 book it's based on, The Operators, is far superior, read that instead if you enjoyed Michael Hastings' article that sunk McChrystal, The Runaway General.
posted by peeedro at 12:09 PM on June 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

Oh, and let's jump back into the time machine for a message from the future President in 2013: "Happy Father's Day to all, even the haters and losers!"
posted by zachlipton at 12:13 PM on June 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

Politico: Democrats to step up attacks on GOP’s Obamacare repeal effort

Democratic senators are planning to hold the Senate floor until at least midnight on Monday to thrash Senate Republicans for refusing to hold committee hearings on their healthcare overhaul, according to several people familiar with the plan. The round of speeches is being organized by Sens. Patty Murray of Washington state and Brian Schatz of Hawaii.

But on the more weighty question of whether to object to the GOP’s committee hearings or refusing to allow routine business in the Senate regarding nomination votes or uncontroversial matters, the party has made no final decision. While the party’s liberal wing is demanding that Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer of New York and his team shut the Senate down, Schumer has made no decision and often tries to forge consensus in his caucus before executing party strategy.

is "holding the floor" just a short filibuster or is it taking advantage of some other rule?
posted by murphy slaw at 12:16 PM on June 18, 2017 [18 favorites]

A container ship doesn't 180 on a missile destroying ship in the age of North Korean testing over Japanese waters. There are all kinds of hacks, some change opinion, but some change physical manifestations.

Did I miss a development here? Is it understood now that the merchant ship deliberately attacked the US warship after being remotely hacked? That would be huge.
posted by msalt at 12:19 PM on June 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

No. It's blatantly irresponsible speculation to turn a naval accident into a tale of electronic warfare without the slightest bit of evidence.
posted by zachlipton at 12:25 PM on June 18, 2017 [46 favorites]

Just did a little bit of googling. Nothing in Navy Times suggesting anything untoward.

The "weaponized container ship" theory has at least one major flaw -- the ACX Crystal was 4 times the size of the Navy destroyer and moved slowly. The destroyer was much more maneuverable and its radar should have picked up the big boat long before collision with plenty of time to evade it.

Also, this was in a heavy traffic area, and the incident took place at 2:30am.
posted by msalt at 12:30 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

This has been covered but it's a truly spectacular video. Trump lawyer Jay Sekulow repeatedly tells Fox News's Chris Wallace that Trump IS NOT under investigation, repeatedly tells him that Trump IS under investigation, repeatedly tells him that HE DOESN'T KNOW if Trump is under investigation, and accuses Wallace of putting words in his mouth. Wallace's reaction: "Oh boy, this is weird."
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:31 PM on June 18, 2017 [75 favorites]

Yes
No
Maybe
I don't know
Can you repeat the question?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:44 PM on June 18, 2017 [14 favorites]

Comey showed a lack of respect for Attorney-Client privilege, likely because he was not an attorney and Trump wasn't his client
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:45 PM on June 18, 2017 [39 favorites]

A container ship doesn't 180 on a missile destroying ship in the age of North Korean testing over Japanese waters. There are all kinds of hacks, some change opinion, but some change physical manifestations.

I'm more inclined to see it as the container ship collided and then did a perfectly a reasonable 180 to GTFO. There is going to be a whole lot of misinformation about this going around particularly since the where and whens of US navy vessels isn't public. Not to mention the navy's desire to CYA and spread strategic FUD.
posted by srboisvert at 12:54 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

Good to see ole Jay's still in top form.
posted by Rykey at 12:58 PM on June 18, 2017

the ACX Crystal was 4 times the size of the Navy destroyer and moved slowly. The destroyer was much more maneuverable and its radar should have picked up the big boat long before collision with plenty of time to evade it.

That's my concern as well. As a former sailor, I hesitate to invent some conspiracy before the facts are known. Collisions have occurred before and will happen again. However, the few facts we do have don't seem to wash. A bridge team and combat watch just... didn't see a container ship? For what would have to be a really long time? This doesn't seem to be a Greeneville surfacing scenario, or an engineering casualty in a restricted maneuvering situation.

We'll just have to wait and see.
posted by ctmf at 1:00 PM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

Jay Sekulow's interview with Jake Tapper is also spectacular:

Tapper: So the President said "I am under investigation" even though he isn't under investigation?

Sekulow goes on to claim that Trump didn't have enough characters on Twitter to explain that he really isn't under investigation but was talking about the "fake report, a report with no documented sources" in the Washington Post that said he was under investigation.

This would be a far more convincing argument if Trump was seemingly unaware that he's allowed to post more than one tweet per day, but as he's seemingly mastered that concept, and, you know, is aware that the President has other forms of communication at his disposal besides Twitter.

You can also see how it went solely through Jake Tapper's facial expressions, which really tell the whole story.

Also, this was a good story on Medicaid work requirements, focusing on the county in Kentucky with the highest unemployment rate in the state:
Medicaid overhaul faces tough test in Trump country: "‘Around here, there ain’t no jobs,’ says one beneficiary about the prospect of having to work to qualify for benefits."
posted by zachlipton at 1:02 PM on June 18, 2017 [18 favorites]

The Navy does actually usually invite the NTSB out to investigate collisions.
posted by ctmf at 1:02 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

Sekulow goes on to claim that Trump didn't have enough characters on Twitter to explain

Well that's a polite way to put it.
posted by Rykey at 1:06 PM on June 18, 2017

metafilter: is there a reason why P. Ryan has a red bottom and Pence isn't wearing pants?
posted by wilko at 1:08 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

ctmf: As a former sailor, I hesitate to invent some conspiracy before the facts are known. Collisions have occurred before and will happen again. However, the few facts we do have don't seem to wash. A bridge team and combat watch just... didn't see a container ship? For what would have to be a really long time? This doesn't seem to be a Greeneville surfacing scenario, or an engineering casualty in a restricted maneuvering situation.

Informed opinion, yay!

Can you please elaborate on the Greeneville surfacing scenario? What was that? Google doesn't seem to know.

And also on this thought -- I saw a random internet commenter saying that the container ship in that collision is 750 feet long, has a top speed of 20 knots and was actually going about 12.5 knots at the time, and would take MILES to turn around. And that it had the right of way.

Does that sound about right? The Navy Times says that the ship "displaces nearly 40,000 tons and is roughly the size of an amphibious assault ship such as the Wasp or Iwo Jima. That's more than four times the size of Fitzgerald."
posted by msalt at 1:11 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Can you please elaborate on the Greeneville surfacing scenario?

Ehime Maru and USS Greeneville collision
posted by PenDevil at 1:13 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

is "holding the floor" just a short filibuster or is it taking advantage of some other rule?

It's how a filibuster is literally accomplished.
posted by Talez at 1:14 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Sekulow goes on to claim that Trump didn't have enough characters on Twitter to explain

You could say the President is a few symbols short of a declarative statement if you catch my drift
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:18 PM on June 18, 2017 [34 favorites]

>>is "holding the floor" just a short filibuster or is it taking advantage of some other rule?

>It's how a filibuster is literally accomplished

How do they grip it?
posted by Sys Rq at 1:18 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

As a former sailor, I hesitate to invent some conspiracy before the facts are known.

ctmf, I'm reminded of this.
posted by Xyanthilous P. Harrierstick at 1:18 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

with their lips
posted by pyramid termite at 1:19 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

Yes
No
Maybe
I don't know
Can you repeat the question?

You're not the boss of me!

posted by Tabitha Someday at 1:20 PM on June 18, 2017 [7 favorites]

Greeneville surfaced underneath Ehime Maru, resulting in a collision. A combination of factors contributed to that, as always, but most significantly, submarines rely on sonar while submerged. Sonar contacts can be ambiguous and rely on long-term observation and elimination of wrong solutions. (The ship can be driven in such a way as to solve the problem quicker). When surfacing, the ship is carefully taken to periscope depth to get a final look around. The big takeaway on Greeneville (I served onboard well after the accident) was there was a "don't question the Captain" culture. Bridge team members were uneasy about the solution on Ehime Maru, but afraid to speak up. Then the Captain personally said the look through the scope was clear.

Surface ships have surface radar with a 24 hour watch in the Combat Information Center and radio comms with other traffic. Crystal should not have been able to hit Fitz even if they were actively trying. UNLESS, they were in a known close passing situation, in comms, agreed on how they would pass, and then Crystal did something not agreed to at the last minute.

Which is why I say we can't really know until the facts come out.
posted by ctmf at 1:25 PM on June 18, 2017 [16 favorites]

Donald Trump, every day on Twitter: 🎵Life is unfair🎵
posted by zachlipton at 1:25 PM on June 18, 2017 [15 favorites]

It's how a filibuster is literally accomplished.

that's what i thought, but now i'm wondering why the democrats are only threatening to filibuster until midnight? wouldn't it be a stronger move to threaten to hold the floor indefinitely until public hearings are held?
posted by murphy slaw at 1:27 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

that's what i thought, but now i'm wondering why the democrats are only threatening to filibuster until midnight? wouldn't it be a stronger move to threaten to hold the floor indefinitely until public hearings are held?

Because while they physically hold the floor all other business in the Senate comes grinding to a halt and that's something you really don't want to do. But the base wants some showy piece of tangible besides "well we put a hold on it and they can't cloture soooooo...."
posted by Talez at 1:51 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

Even here in our own house we have a sizeable fraction of people who are pissed that Senate Dems have the nerve to act like adults instead of making cheap symbolic gestures of toddler like tantrums a'la our friends in R.
posted by Talez at 1:55 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

We shot down a Syrian warplane. I'm pretty confident the President has a handle on this. He really strikes me as a guy with a thoughtful, reasoned Syria policy.
posted by Justinian at 2:02 PM on June 18, 2017 [13 favorites]

*blinks SOS while staring straight into the camera*
posted by Justinian at 2:02 PM on June 18, 2017 [12 favorites]

And Iran's hit ISIS inside Syria with medium-range missiles, so everything is just fine.
posted by BungaDunga at 2:07 PM on June 18, 2017

Remember that time Congress authorized the use of military force in Syria? Oh wait. They didn't.
posted by zachlipton at 2:07 PM on June 18, 2017 [10 favorites]

So the regime plane was bombing US-supported Kurdish SDF advancing on Raqqa and US forces intentionally shot it down. Here comes the completely predictable clusterfuck.

Meanwhile realdonaldtrump just retweeted Diamond and Silk's video titled The Media Says: The President Should Stop Tweeting about Russia. Well, Why Don't the Media Take Their Own Advice & Stop Talking About It!
posted by Rust Moranis at 2:12 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

Axios has a good week ahead wrap-up:

The White House will declare it "Tech Week" with Jared's team holding meetings with CEOs, but no actual policies or actual action happening. Somebody leaked that Tim Cook plans to talk about the importance of immigration, defend encryption, veterans' affairs, and human rights, and it's interesting to me that Cook feels compelled to leak this kind of "I'm actually not horrible for going to this meeting" stuff in advance. "Energy Week" will be the week after.

On healthcare, McConnell remains determined to get a vote before the July 4th recess, which means they need some kind of a deal this week so they can get a CBO score. There remains speculation that he'll force a vote through even if he doesn't have 50 votes, just to get it over wtih.

And an ominous reminder that the debt ceiling has got to be addressed urgently and "nobody agrees on anything."
posted by zachlipton at 2:20 PM on June 18, 2017 [9 favorites]

Please tell me Barron is in charge of Tech Week. It would be nice to have a quiet, thoughtful week.
posted by a non mouse, a cow herd at 2:24 PM on June 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

I'm genuinely uncertain if that would qualify as shocking at this point.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:32 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

This has been covered but it's a truly spectacular video.

Wwwwwooooooooowwwwwww. That is totes bugfuck. They all but literally get in a slap fight and spill each other's milk.

Also, Donny Two Scoops' lawyer is green. Like kind of literally. What's that about?

NOT SNAKEIST
posted by petebest at 2:35 PM on June 18, 2017 [11 favorites]

Fast forward, of course, to the Sam Houston Monument rally - an alt-right individual created a fake antifa account and declared that they would be protesting and potentially defacing the monument because of Sam Houston's status as a slaveholder.

This is fascinating to me because as a Texan I have some friends who are big 2nd amendment people and this fake "the liberals want to tear down Sam Houston" story made it's way to my friends' social media and they got all upset about it in a "political correctness has truly gone too far" way. It didn't really pass a sniff test to me, but I didn't have the energy to research it at the time. I'm pretty happy that it turned into a pissing match among terrible people and the left had nothing to do with it.
posted by threeturtles at 2:37 PM on June 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

I thought we agreed that "alt-right" was just plain old Nazi. Is there a hair to split there? "Lazy, mamas-basement, stoner, my-buddy-Track-has-a-gun"-Nazi?
posted by petebest at 2:46 PM on June 18, 2017

Alt-Right are Nazis but without the gumption
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 2:48 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

I just call them Internet nazis.
posted by PenDevil at 2:55 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

The Syrian thing is really serious. Russia is an ally of Iran, and the rump state of Syria is pretty much an Iranian proxy. When the (US-led) coalition says they shot down a Syrian bomber it means they shot down a plane that was only in the air because of Iranian and/or Russian support. Similarly, when Iran says they fired missiles at terrorists in Syria, it means they've demonstrated their willingness and ability to use medium-range missiles across areas (like, e.g., Iraq) that are supported by the USA. We're basically an inch away from direct conflict between US/Coalition and Iranian forces, which would be only one step removed from conflict with Russian forces.
posted by Joe in Australia at 3:03 PM on June 18, 2017 [18 favorites]

I hate internet nazis.
posted by pxe2000 at 3:07 PM on June 18, 2017 [16 favorites]

Not to mention the navy's desire to CYA...
C Y A

trigger warning: body parts. explicit in the podcast.
posted by j_curiouser at 3:10 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

"Does Trump's lawyer think the FBI Director is somehow supposed to be the President's attorney? That's moon law stuff."

Excuse you, even moon lawyers understand how attorney-client privilege works. /huff
posted by Noted Moon Lawyer at 3:27 PM on June 18, 2017 [75 favorites]

hell, even unfrozen caveman lawyer knows that.
posted by j_curiouser at 3:35 PM on June 18, 2017 [12 favorites]

CHRIS WALLACE: [squinting, massaging forehead] *sigh*. Does. The President. Understand, that he is not now, nor was he ever, James Comey's client.

THE GREEN WEASEL: Chris, let me explain to you how words work, okay, this is the Constitution we're talking about and it's your stupid face that's liberal! The President! Has no idea we've ever had conversations and if we had I sure wouldn't tell you about them because Law Lives Matter. Chris. You haven't-

CHRIS WALLACE: Have you ever even met the-

THE GREEN WEASEL: -had any conversations with me because the President says so?! I mean, THINK McFly! Do you even know what a per diem is??

CHRIS WALLACE: [closing eyes, thinking of giant estate in the Hamptons] I'm only trying to kill twenty more seconds for the love of Je-

THE GREEN WEASEL: Yes! We've had conversations where he's told me he laundered billions for the Russian mafia, but that's not illegal, dammit! Look it up yourself. AND! And! I never said that which is contempt. If you'd read a damned book once you hippie bagpipe muncher!

CHRIS WALLACE: [punching booking agent]

[metaphorically true]
posted by petebest at 3:50 PM on June 18, 2017 [28 favorites]

Rebecca Solnit: Victories against Trump are mounting. Here's how we deal the final blow
posted by Joe in Australia at 3:54 PM on June 18, 2017 [25 favorites]

The main thing I got out of that Chris Wallace video is that Sekulow really really wishes he could read minds. Cause that'd be totally super cool. And he's frustrated his mutant powers haven't been activated yet.
posted by downtohisturtles at 3:56 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

What I wish Wallace, or anyone, would pin him on every single time:

"There is no investigation of the President."
"There IS NO investigation, or you are not aware of one? Which thing are you saying?"

They keep saying the first thing, and they know it isn't true. Come on, Sekulow. You're a lawyer. You damn well know the difference and we know you know. You also keep insisting, so we know you're not just "mis-speaking". Sigh. Another blatant obvious liar on the team. They think this is helping?
posted by ctmf at 4:09 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

Well, clearly Trump wants and even needs a war with Iran, the more spectacular the destruction involved the better. But Russia is a personal ally of his so he won't want a fight there, and possibly the whole WW3 being bad thing might be a factor for him. So I guess if you split the difference the policy of half declaring war on Syria may continue?

It depends how pissed off Putin is liable to get on behalf of Assad I guess.
posted by Artw at 4:20 PM on June 18, 2017

Those Navy sailors died a very unpleasant death, and Pres. Pants-On-Fire is more concerned with tweeting about his popularity rating than expressing condolences.
posted by theora55 at 4:23 PM on June 18, 2017 [32 favorites]

He's probably going to kill thousands of troops and millions of foreign citizens if he actually gets his war, and I fully expect moaning about his popularity and boasting about his EC win to remain his prime concerns.
posted by Artw at 4:29 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

Also, Donny Two Scoops' lawyer is green. Like kind of literally. What's that about?

Green is opposite orange on the color wheel. Trump has picked a lawyer of a complementary color, in the same spirit one would select a couch to set off the curtains.

except with considerably more restraint and taste than you would expect, seeing as he could have had his lawyer coated in gold like whichever James Bond movie that was, as is his usual choice in decor. that would not be good for the lawyer, though.

(edit: or blue is, I guess. but I assume he failed color theory in art school through not paying attention, same as I did.)
posted by queenofbithynia at 4:34 PM on June 18, 2017 [16 favorites]

Those Navy sailors died a very unpleasant death, and Pres. Pants-On-Fire is more concerned with tweeting about his popularity rating than expressing condolences

He will drag their wives out to one of his golf games or something and put them on the spot in front of the TV cameras, possibly while showing the ShipCam video of the soldiers' deaths for impact. Then he will give miniature American flags to each wife and up to a maximum of three children per wife.
posted by rhizome at 4:37 PM on June 18, 2017 [11 favorites]

He tweeted about it last night. Once.
posted by Justinian at 4:50 PM on June 18, 2017

And it was obviously written by aides.
posted by PenDevil at 4:50 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

And unless I'm mistaken, we didn't even know the sailors were dead at that time.
posted by Faint of Butt at 4:52 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

"Thoughts and prayers".
posted by The otter lady at 4:52 PM on June 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

Saudi Arabia, Russia, and Iran have suddenly become very important in this. And Turkey is hopped. Shit.
posted by stonepharisee at 4:53 PM on June 18, 2017

This has been covered but it's a truly spectacular video.

Ah, so Trump's lawyer is going with the Argle Bargle defense. Not a bad choice actually.
posted by diogenes at 4:56 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

That's true, he hasn't said anything since they were confirmed to be dead.
posted by Justinian at 4:56 PM on June 18, 2017

Another blatant obvious liar on the team. They think this is helping?

If it ain't broke? I mean, except for the money landering, espionage, obstruction, and run-of-the-mill treason, it's kind of been a cakewalk.
posted by petebest at 4:58 PM on June 18, 2017

What I wish Wallace, or anyone, would pin him on every single time:

Nobody is ever going to get an honest answer out of Sekulow. I think Wallace did as well as anyone could be expected, picked up on his blatant contradictions of his own words moments apart & exposed them to the audience at home in a clear & concise manner that none of Sekulow's dishonest rhetorical tricks could distract from.
posted by scalefree at 5:00 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

If the Trump administration can get WWIII started soon enough, all of these petty allegations will become so inconsequential.
posted by yesster at 5:05 PM on June 18, 2017

Foreign Policy Magazine: WH wants war in Syria, Pentagon doesn't. (archive.org link)

Ezra Cohen-Watnick, the senior director for intelligence on the National Security Council, and Derek Harvey, the NSC’s top Middle East advisor, want the United States to start going on the offensive in southern Syria, where, in recent weeks, the U.S. military has taken a handful of defensive actions against Iranian-backed forces fighting in support of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad.

Their plans are making even traditional Iran hawks nervous, including Defense Secretary James Mattis, who has personally shot down their proposals more than once, the two sources said.

Oh good the clown car has guns now.
posted by petebest at 5:10 PM on June 18, 2017 [13 favorites]

The White House will declare it "Tech Week" ... "Energy Week" will be the week after.

Let's just save time and call every week "[insert distraction] Instead of the Russian Treason Scandal Week". None of these declarations have any policy behind them, it's complete bullshit.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:11 PM on June 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

The city of Boston is posting EPA climate-change data and files the agency scrubbed after Jan. 20.
posted by adamg at 5:11 PM on June 18, 2017 [85 favorites]

And unless I'm mistaken, we didn't even know the sailors were dead at that time.

I've been away all day and popped in to see if it was possibly true that he Hadn't tweeted since they were missing last night. meanwhile, he's using this poor kid who was returned from North Korea for political gain. Disgusting.
posted by Room 641-A at 5:12 PM on June 18, 2017

A U.S. strike aircraft shot down a Syrian government fighter jet Sunday shortly after the Syrians bombed U.S.-backed fighters in northern Syria, the Pentagon said in a statement. This was the first time a U.S. jet has shot down a manned hostile aircraft in more than a decade.
Majd Fahd, a correspondent for website al-Masdar News, claimed the pilot was his cousin and a father-of-three. “You American bastards just shot down my cousin's aircraft (Ali) while taking out the scumbags of Isis in the area," he tweeted.
posted by adamvasco at 5:18 PM on June 18, 2017 [7 favorites]

That's true, he hasn't said anything since they were confirmed to be dead.

i don't think anyone should be surprised by this - remember how he treated the khans last summer?

the man has no respect for those who lay down their lives for him or his country

if we should go to war, and the draft comes back, for god's sake, remind our young people that our president will sent them off to die and won't even pretend to notice when they do
posted by pyramid termite at 5:25 PM on June 18, 2017 [8 favorites]

if we should go to war, and the draft comes back, for god's sake, remind our young people that our president will sent them off to die and won't even pretend to notice when they do

I plan to start driving local kids to Canada to declare asylum.
posted by Talez at 5:31 PM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

yeah, maybe i need that passport after all, cause i could do that too
posted by pyramid termite at 5:35 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

You won't need a passport card because you need to drop them off at the border but not near a border post. Canadian border authorities will turn you back if you try to cross but illegal crossing and then making an asylum claim means you stay in Canada.
posted by Talez at 5:38 PM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

And yes, I have thought about this contingency far too much.
posted by Talez at 5:39 PM on June 18, 2017 [14 favorites]

well, that's going to be real hard to do, seeing as detroit and port huron are the closest crossings
posted by pyramid termite at 5:41 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

well, that's going to be real hard to do, seeing as detroit and port huron are the closest crossings
posted by pyramid termite at 8:41 PM on June 18 [1 favorite −] Favorite added! [!]

You can get pretty close to Canada in a boat without checking in to customs as long as you don't drop anchor. Just sayin'.
posted by Preserver at 5:53 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

More idiocy:

@SopanDeb
Within five minutes of the Caesar production starting, someone just ran on stage and yelled "Liberal hate kills!" Escorted out by security.
- Another interruption. This time during the Caesar death scene. Protester yells: "We're sick of your bullshit!" Crowd boos.
- Some in the crowd are yelling "Lock him up." Security escorts him out. This was not the rom com I was expecting.
posted by chris24 at 6:35 PM on June 18, 2017 [16 favorites]

As someone who has been tangentially involved with various theatrical endeavors, it's hard to overstate how terrifying someone rushing the stage in the middle of a show is.
posted by zachlipton at 6:42 PM on June 18, 2017 [15 favorites]

I don't necessary care whether the pilot was a good guy or an evil scumbag, I don't think we have any place shooting down Syrian Air Force jets which are engaged in a civil war inside their own country.
posted by Justinian at 6:42 PM on June 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

at least without any sort of authorization for war from congress.
posted by Homo neanderthalensis at 6:44 PM on June 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

I think the talk of the draft coming back is a bit of a derail. The draft isn't coming back. Depressingly, the PR hit from a mandatory draft figures into their equations on how to sell a war, and with advances in technology they've made it so we can fight a great deal of a future war from the comfort of an air conditioned base in Nevada (where the drones are piloted). The larger danger is that if Trump ever did get in over his head with Iran or N. Korea, he'd love to be the second President in history to use nukes.
posted by bluecore at 6:45 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

Syria is pretty low on "good" sides to back. Right now WH seems to be drifting towards siding with ISIS and Saudi Arabia against Iran and Qatar.
posted by Artw at 7:17 PM on June 18, 2017 [7 favorites]

if we should go to war, and the draft comes back, for god's sake, remind our young people that our president will sent them off to die and won't even pretend to notice when they do

If it comes to it, remember that every draft refuser who occupies a jail cell represents resources diverted from war, as well as a prison bed not available for jailing immigrants or minorities held for nonviolent crimes. I don't think a draft is likely, but if it comes to pass that there is one for a war to serve the Trumpists' egos and political aims, I hope I'll have the courage to serve my community by going to prison rather than enlisting or fleeing the country. It's not going to be the right solution for everyone (particularly those with children), but I think choosing prison in the face of an unjust draft is a morally admirable option.
posted by biogeo at 7:20 PM on June 18, 2017 [9 favorites]

The Navy released the names on Sunday night of the seven sailors who were killed. The victims were all located in flooded berths, the Navy said.

They were identified as Dakota Kyle Rigsby, 19, of Palmyra, Va.; Shingo Alexander Douglass, 25, of San Diego; Ngoc T Truong Huynh, 25, of Oakville, Conn.; Noe Hernandez, 26, of Weslaco, Tex.; Carlos Victor Ganzon Sibayan, 23, of Chula Vista, Calif.; Xavier Alec Martin, 24, of Halethorpe, Md.; and Gary Leo Rehm Jr., 37, of Elyria, Ohio. In remembrance of these lost sailors. Fare forward.
posted by Oyéah at 7:28 PM on June 18, 2017 [67 favorites]

Buzzfeed: Get Ready To Start Hearing About The Travel Ban Again: While talk about the travel ban has taken a back seat to the special counsel’s investigation and the drama surrounding it, expect (at least some of) the focus now to quickly return to the travel ban as soon as this week when the justices consider on Thursday at their private conference what to do with the cases.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 7:28 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

No wonder Trump hasn't said anything; only two of the dead came from states he won.

Trump likes sailors who don't drown.
posted by Justinian at 7:32 PM on June 18, 2017 [6 favorites]

Can you even imagine how concerned John McCain is about this? He's just a flaming ball of concern
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:52 PM on June 18, 2017 [7 favorites]

if we should go to war, and the draft comes back, for god's sake, remind our young people that our president will sent them off to die and won't even pretend to notice when they do

The draft will never return as long as members of Congress have children.
posted by scalefree at 7:58 PM on June 18, 2017

remember that every draft refuser who occupies a jail cell represents resources diverted from war, as well as a prison bed not available for jailing immigrants or minorities held for nonviolent crimes.

I'm pretty sure this administration could find the money to build more jails if there were a shortage.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 8:00 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

The draft will never return as long as members of Congress have children.

This GOP is very much the party of the old eating the young though. If they'll deny their kids healthcare and a stable climate why not throw them in a meatgrinder as well?
posted by Artw at 8:02 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

I mean, Vietnam-era Congresspeople had kids.
posted by Chrysostom at 8:05 PM on June 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

I mean, Vietnam-era Congresspeople had kids.

They also structured the draft in such a way that their kids could get out of it if they wanted to. Given that we're an even more unequal society now, I assume that's what would happen if there were ever another draft.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:08 PM on June 18, 2017 [20 favorites]

AHCA news:

* More from The Hill on the Dem Monday night protest.

* LAT: Historians say there hasn't been this kind of secrecy on a major bill since the Wilson administration.

* $1.5M anti-AHCA ad buy up in states with possible wavering GOP sens (Capito, Murkowski, Heller, Flake, Collins)
posted by Chrysostom at 8:14 PM on June 18, 2017 [11 favorites]

Oh, are they actually going to say whats in it?
posted by Artw at 8:27 PM on June 18, 2017

When I was a kid, there was a pond in the back yard. In the pond, there was a little hollow by the shore, under a bush, where the snakes congregated. And I don't mean a couple of snakes, but all summer long, several solid cubic feet of roiling, fighting, fucking snakes. Sometimes you'd get one on the hook while you were fishing. Sometimes they'd come out onto the yard and chase you.

Whenever somebody brings up Syria, that's what I think of. Like, when I was a kid, looking down into that snake pit, in awe, and wonder, and disgust, if I'd somehow had the idiot notion of taking sides and jumping in. That's Syria.

I really get why people were upset that Obama couldn't fix it. I mean, it's really unfortunate that he couldn't. But... not smart to try to pick sides in a snake pit.

Yes, I get that there are real people trapped in there. Still, just because someone should do something, it doesn't necessarily follow that anyone actually can.
posted by dirge at 8:31 PM on June 18, 2017 [38 favorites]

Jack Shafer at Politico thinks telling NBC they shouldn't have let Megyn Kelly give Alex Jones a platform is a mistake:

The censorious powers of the heckler’s veto have evolved now to the point that people are willing to call for the banning and shunning of works of journalism not yet published. Former Fox News Channel and current NBC News anchor Megyn Kelly got the treatment this week as news of her Sunday Night With Megyn Kelly interview with InfoWars mainspring Alex Jones, well before it was scheduled to air July 18, made the rounds. At least the Ayatollah Khomeini waited for the publication of Satanic Verses before he issued a fatwa ordering the murder of its author, Salman Rushdie.

[...]

Maybe this is the way they did journalism in the former Soviet Union, but American journalism has never operated like that. We don’t avoid gnarly, complicated stories because they’ll hurt somebody’s feelings. We don’t abandon free thought and press freedom just because there’s an outside chance that a piece of journalism like Kelly’s might fall to the advantage of a sordid manipulator or a demagogue. Nor does the unspeakable pain the Sandy Hook parents have endured because of Jones mean we must cleanse the news sphere of coverage that might further upset them. Surely it makes more sense to deal straight on with tin-pots like Jones than cover our eyes and ears in hopes he’ll vanish by himself.

Christ, what an asshole. Who was saying Kelly shouldn't report on Jones? We're saying she should exercise a little journalistic integrity in how she approaches the subject, and report on him instead of interviewing him. But of course that wouldn't get so many eyeballs for NBC and as much controversy and attention for her brand.

I haven't seen the interview, so maybe as Shafer claims she did a great job painting Jones as a right-wing nutcase. But knowing Kelly's style, probably not; Shafer probably just saw it that way because that's how he already sees Jones. Jones probably came across great to those already inclined to support him, and to those unfamiliar with him I'd be surprised if there was a clear takeaway. But I hope I'm wrong.
posted by biogeo at 8:37 PM on June 18, 2017 [27 favorites]

Oh, are they actually going to say whats in it?

They aren't even telling each other what's in it. Senator Collins says she's been kept in the dark over it & she's a Republican.
posted by scalefree at 8:42 PM on June 18, 2017 [18 favorites]

Are tv interviews with dangerous nutcases journalism? Dateline is barely journalism. As to real journalism, there's plenty of it out there on who Alex Jones is and what he's up to, for those who want to read. You can report about someone without giving them a platform to multiply their following.

But I'm also not 100% sure all censorship is bad. So much for the tolerant left and all.
posted by dis_integration at 8:44 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

Christ, what an asshole

Seconded.

Excluding disruptive speakers from the conversation is a fundamental free speech right. Otherwise "free speech" is merely the right to shout obscenities at one another.
posted by dirge at 8:46 PM on June 18, 2017 [7 favorites]

So it looks like some motherfucker has been running over Muslims in a van in a revenge attack.

I'm sure our shitheel in chief will be all over this terrorist attack like a Rabbi on a ham and cheese sandwich.
posted by Talez at 8:46 PM on June 18, 2017 [14 favorites]

I think we need to review the difference between arguing that someone shouldn't be given a platform, on the one hand, and calling for someone to be murdered, on the other. Because those are actually not the same thing! There are crucial murder-related differences!

I truly don't understand why some people have such a hard time differentiating between criticism and violence.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 8:50 PM on June 18, 2017 [17 favorites]

Foreign Policy Magazine: WH wants war in Syria, Pentagon doesn't. (archive.org link)

Ezra Cohen-Watnick, the senior director for intelligence on the National Security Council, and Derek Harvey, the NSC’s top Middle East advisor, want the United States to start going on the offensive in southern Syria, where, in recent weeks, the U.S. military has taken a handful of defensive actions against Iranian-backed forces fighting in support of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad.

It's worth remembering that Cohen-Watnick is the dude who provided the classified intelligence that sparked Devin Nunes' wild ride back in March. He's a Flynn appointee that McMaster tried to fire when he took over as National Security Advisor but Cohen-Watnick's removal was overruled by Trump at the request of Bannon and Kushner. This is the guy pushing for war in Syria.
posted by GalaxieFiveHundred at 8:52 PM on June 18, 2017 [33 favorites]

Also, he's thirty years old. Even if he were some kind of foreign policy genius with a dozen tomes under his belt (he's not) he wouldn't have the life experience and contacts to credibly advocate for something as momentous as a war. This year. This year.
posted by Joe in Australia at 9:07 PM on June 18, 2017 [15 favorites]

The reason you don't interview Alex Jones and similar liars on major media platforms is because "elevating chicanery and those who propagate its—even to debunk the lie---only spreads their nonsense." (Wired) To whit, the act of providing coverage to Jones - any coverage - makes people more likely to believe him. Unless you're ignoring him or making it shameful for him and his gullible followers to speak their lies in public, you're helping spread the lies.

See also: coverage of Trump, 2015 - present

NBC and Kelly are incompetent but they're also not interested in the truth - just ratings and ad revenue. They only care about who they hurt so far as it impacts cash flow.
posted by Joey Michaels at 9:24 PM on June 18, 2017 [31 favorites]

Andrew Kaczynsky, CNN: A pro-Trump group is using Obama's voice out of context in radio ad for Georgia's special election

Great America Alliance, a pro-Trump non-profit group that previously ran ads attacking former FBI director James Comey during his testimony, is running an ad that quotes Obama narrating his autobiographical book "Dreams From My Father." The ad, however, does not mention that in the selected passage, Obama is actually quoting someone else who is speaking about the black community and Chicago politics before the early 1980s.

Par for the course, eh.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:40 PM on June 18, 2017 [12 favorites]

Exactly. Alex Jones is a lying liar who tells lies. It's not about differences in opinion or philosophy; he tells blatantly false lies to the extent that he picked a fight with yogurt and lost.

If you're a news network with the slightest commitment to accuracy and the truth, you don't put liars on your air, even with the intent of debunking them, because they will come in and tell lies to your audience. No matter how hard you press them on those lies, they're still telling hurtful and dangerous lies on your network air. You can still take on Jones without giving him a platform.

While we're on the subject, Megyn Kelly held back information about Trump until she put it in her book after the election. How is that possibly acceptable?
posted by zachlipton at 9:50 PM on June 18, 2017 [32 favorites]

WaPo: The State Department just broke a promise to minority and female recruits

Dozens of young minority and female State Department recruits received startling and unwelcome news last week: They would not be able to soon join the Foreign Service despite having been promised that opportunity. Their saga is just the latest sign that Secretary of State Rex Tillerson’s rush to slash the size of the State Department without a plan is harming diplomacy and having negative unintended effects.

The recruits, who are part of the State Department’s Rangel and Pickering fellowship programs, have already completed two years of graduate-level education at U.S. taxpayers’ expense plus an internship, often in a foreign country. The deal they struck with the federal government was that after completing their educations they would be given an inside track to become full-fledged U.S. diplomats abroad if they also satisfied medical and security requirements. In turn, they promised to commit at least five years to the Foreign Service.
...
Many were shocked when they received a letter telling them they had one week to decide if they wanted to take a much less appealing job — stamping passports in a foreign embassy for two years — with the prospect but no guarantee of becoming a Foreign Service officer even after that.

“This is no way to treat our next generation,” one Foreign Service officer serving overseas told me.

See, the thing about foreign officers is that they're spies. Who can freelance. This may, I don't know, have unintended consequences?
posted by Yowser at 10:04 PM on June 18, 2017 [4 favorites]

I have always been and always will be a proponent of letting folks tie their own nooses. I am ambivalent about the delivery. Jones is what he is and the MF audience has their opinions that are well sourced and knowledgeable and generally agreed upon within this bubble that is Metafilter.

The majority of folks that will watch the Frontline piece do not know who the fuck Alex Jones is. Let them find out. Let them say "holy shit, that guy is right" or "fuck me, do people really think that way?" That is freedom of the press. I agree Jones is insane and an idiot and poison but it isn't up to me to say that others can make or not make that same judgement.

I am in the rare camp that believes that Trump is the worst thing that has ever happened to contemporary western society BUT ALSO willing to stand in front of a bullet to let him say his shit. I cannot listen to his voice and I cringe when I see his words but I will continue to let him and his Trumpos say what they need to say. We need to or else we have no leg to stand on as they try and cut our voices.
posted by Johnny Hazard at 10:15 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

The majority of folks that will watch the Frontline piece do not know who the fuck Alex Jones is. Let them find out. Let them say "holy shit, that guy is right" or "fuck me, do people really think that way?" That is freedom of the press. I agree Jones is insane and an idiot and poison but it isn't up to me to say that others can make or not make that same judgement.

We just had a year of proof that more people are going to say, 'he's right' than 'he's a moron'. Freedom of the press used to come with some responsibility not to allow con artists to spew lies unchallenged, and not to give complete kooks a platform.

I am in the rare camp that believes that Trump is the worst thing that has ever happened to contemporary western society BUT ALSO willing to stand in front of a bullet to let him say his shit.

And this is how we got 30 minutes of an empty podium followed by 2 hours of raw feed from a Trump rally, every single day for 6 months. You're not the hero we need.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:25 PM on June 18, 2017 [64 favorites]

Let whoever wants to say it say what they want, but nobody owes anybody a microphone. Nobody gets a pass on the moderation rules, pathetic as they are in "main stream media" these days, but still, there are rules, and they exist for a reason.

I'm pretty cool with the idea that almost anybody should have an opportunity to be heard, but there's a line you cross with liars, prevaricators, and provocateurs where it's pretty clear that what they're doing is less speech than it is incitement or propaganda. There's a line you cross where no reasonable person ought to offer you a microphone.

We could have a deep, philosophical argument about where, precisely, one ought to draw that line, but I don't think there's much doubt which side Alex Jones falls on.
posted by dirge at 10:29 PM on June 18, 2017 [12 favorites]

Freedom of speech doesn't mean you are guaranteed a national platform for your views. No-one is obliged to listen to Alex Jones, or give him time on their soapbox.
posted by harriet vane at 10:30 PM on June 18, 2017 [47 favorites]

We could have a deep, philosophical argument about where, precisely one ought to draw that line, but I don't think there's much doubt which side Alex Jones falls on.

And Trump fell on the same side back in 2012. But Republicans hated Obama. So here we are.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:33 PM on June 18, 2017 [2 favorites]

I just want to observe that many of the reasons cited in this thread for why the draft won't come back strike me as "Because automation has eliminated the need for unskilled labor, even in war."
posted by OnceUponATime at 10:34 PM on June 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

The draft won't come back because Trump's base won't put their children where their mouth is.
posted by dirge at 10:38 PM on June 18, 2017 [1 favorite]

The majority of folks that will watch the Frontline piece do not know who the fuck Alex Jones is. Let them find out.

Even if it were the case that Alex Jones' deranged rants are worth curating, Megyn Kelly is not the person to let her audience know "who the fuck Alex Jones is". She famously, recently, interviewed Vladimir Putin and failed to land any serious questions on him. She's not a great interviewer: her questions are anodyne; her followup weak; and her judgment is questionable.
posted by Joe in Australia at 10:41 PM on June 18, 2017 [17 favorites]

Man I still can't believe Kelly didn't know Jones would be recording everything. The alt-right follows the MRA motto of Always Be Recording.
posted by Yowser at 10:44 PM on June 18, 2017

The majority of folks that will watch the Frontline piece do not know who the fuck Alex Jones is. Let them find out.

Anybody who by now does not know who Alex Jones is absolutely does not need to ever find out. Ever. Uninformed people are his bread and butter and for every ten people newly introduced to him, as least two will become fresh acolytes. No platform. Zero.
posted by Rust Moranis at 10:45 PM on June 18, 2017 [24 favorites]

She's not a great interviewer: her questions are anodyne; her followup weak; and her judgment is questionable.

Exactly. She's an untrusted moderator. And it's nearly impossible to imagine a trusted moderator who'd provide that subject with any platform.
posted by dirge at 10:46 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

I also want to observe that "Shut up, Alex Jones" and "You suck, NBC" ought to be sentiments our right to free speech entitles us to express.

We're not demanding that the government censor or arrest Jones. So I think his free speech rights are pretty safe. We are just exercising our own.

NBC declining to publish something based on feedback from their customers does not violate anyone's free speech rights. Because NBC is NOT an arm of the government.

In fact, "the media aren't an arm of the government" is kind of the whole point of the first ammendment.
posted by OnceUponATime at 10:48 PM on June 18, 2017 [79 favorites]

Jones already uses half a dozen different platforms to vomit his crap at the masses. Why should NBC be providing him another one?
posted by dirigibleman at 10:50 PM on June 18, 2017 [5 favorites]

And, as I linked above, repeating a lie, even to debunk it, reinforces the lie. Giving liars a larger audience makes more people believe their lies. If you value the truth, it stands to reason that you should enthusiastically object to lies being amplified.
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:56 PM on June 18, 2017 [22 favorites]

While it's true that the first amendment only applies to the government, I don't think that makes action with regard to speech by non-governmental entities inherently unproblematic... and I don't think most people here would either. Not deigning to give scum like Jones a national platform isn't one of those times, of course, but the argument needs to be "this isn't a problematic curtailing of free speech" not "it's not the government so its just fine to curtail speech!"

Because there are lots of times where curtailing of speech is a problem even when its not the government doing it.
posted by Justinian at 11:11 PM on June 18, 2017 [7 favorites]

The proper treatment of a scumbag like Jones over the last decade should have been NOT to "ignore him he's a dirty liar", it should have been EXPOSE HIM, ATTACK HIM and DISCREDIT HIM and do it before he could gain the following he has.

But then, if Donald Trump had been treated "fairly" by the Media - exposed, attacked and discredited - somebody in law enforcement might have taken his criminal career seriously early enough that he'd be spending his nights in a Federal Prison cell instead of the Lincoln Bedroom.
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:21 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

Andrew Kaczynsky, CNN: A pro-Trump group is using Obama's voice out of context in radio ad for Georgia's special election

From the link above. I went and RTFA wondering what an Obama quote about Chicago in the early 80's has to do with the current special election in Georgia. Apparently nothing. And it sounds like the ad doesn't even mention Georgia, Ossoff, or anything related to the election. Rather it's an attack on on the entire Democratic Party? From the same group that was running attack ads on Comey. Campaign advertising/spending is reaching new lows.

posted by p3t3 at 11:30 PM on June 18, 2017 [3 favorites]

While it's true that the first amendment only applies to the government, I don't think that makes action with regard to speech by non-governmental entities inherently unproblematic...

Imagine if NBC decided to run something pornographic or borderline pornographic in that timeslot. They would be absolutely flooded by complaints. Especially from conservatives!

Would we, in that case, be debating whether those complaints to NBC or in public forums violated anyone's first amendment rights? I don't think so.

We might get into some "the people vs Larry Flynt" type issues if there were law suits and complaints to the FCC involved. (Which there would be.)

But that's not what we're talking about in the case of the Jones interview. Nobody is suing, or trying to get NBC's license pulled. We are just complaining loudly and asking them to knock it off. Which, again, WE have a right to do. That is also speech.

I propose that Sandy Hook denialism is at least as obscene as your average low budget smut.

I am a parent, and I would actually be pretty grossed out if NBC were showing Debbie Does Dallas or whatever in primetime. I would probably complain.

I am even more grossed out by Alex Jones. I am allowed to complain.
posted by OnceUponATime at 12:20 AM on June 19, 2017 [58 favorites]

TL;DR... Republicans are masters of "no platforming" for stuff that's offensive to THEM. They should apply some "decency" standards to Alex Jones.
posted by OnceUponATime at 12:36 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

but the argument needs to be "this isn't a problematic curtailing of free speech" not "it's not the government so its just fine to curtail speech!"

I see literally no one here taking either side of that false dichotomy. I see people saying that Alex Jone's right to free speech in no way implies an obligation on anyone's part to listen to him, or, by extension, to broadcast him.
posted by dirge at 12:47 AM on June 19, 2017 [30 favorites]

Radio New Zealand yesterday—Ghassan Abu-Sitta: The ecology of war; 14 min. interview with a Palestinian plastic surgeon based in Beirut about the degradation of the health care systems in Iraq and Gaza due to war and trade embargoes, who organized a recent conference on the general subject
posted by XMLicious at 3:12 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

I'm okay with Eric Andre giving him a platform.
posted by whuppy at 3:51 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Kushner Is Said to Be Reconsidering His Legal Team.

Josh Marshall thinks Trump may be getting ready to pin everything on Jared.
posted by T.D. Strange at 4:43 AM on June 19, 2017 [26 favorites]

I was literally just about to wonder why we hadn't heard anything by/about Jared for so long. I'm sure Jared is guilty as sin, but good luck trying to make a case that he's the central figure.
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:48 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Ooh, I like this. Jared is a nasty piece of work, and he won't go down without dragging as many people—Trump included—as possible with him.
posted by Faint of Butt at 4:50 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Honestly I have been afraid of everything being pinned on Jared this whole time. Not because he's undeserving of being a fall guy, but because the alt-right will go even further down the rathole if they have a Jewish man to blame for everything.
posted by winna at 5:04 AM on June 19, 2017 [20 favorites]

Josh Marshall thinks Trump may be getting ready to pin everything on Jared.

That sounds, shall we say, awfully Shakespearean.
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:27 AM on June 19, 2017 [21 favorites]

Happy monday: Russia says it will treat US-led coalition planes in Syria, west of the Euphrates, as targets after US downed Syrian jet.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:31 AM on June 19, 2017 [19 favorites]

I was literally just about to wonder why we hadn't heard anything by/about Jared for so long.

I figured he'd be FBI Director by now
posted by thelonius at 5:33 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

Josh Marshall thinks Trump may be getting ready to pin everything on Jared.

Nah, not as long as Kusher is regarded as "family".
For Kushner to be thrown under the bus would require a divorce from Ivanka first, or estrangement between father and daughter, neither of which appears to be likely at this point.
posted by sour cream at 5:37 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

@BraddJaffy:

—Terrorist attack in London

—7 US sailors who died on USS Fitzgerald identified

—Russia threatens to target US warplanes

President Trump: [deleted tweet about Sekulow on Fox & Friends]

IIRC the President isn't supposed to delete tweets from either of his accounts, but it's too late now. When he gets called on it, he'll just say it was "fake news" and 35% of the country will believe him.
posted by zombieflanders at 5:38 AM on June 19, 2017 [16 favorites]

Happy monday: Russia says it will treat US-led coalition planes in Syria, west of the Euphrates, as targets after US downed Syrian jet.

Trump in October: "Now Hillary wants to start a shooting war in Syria, which could lead to World War III. I actually think she's unstable."
posted by zombieflanders at 5:40 AM on June 19, 2017 [42 favorites]

For Kushner to be thrown under the bus would require a divorce from Ivanka first, or estrangement between father and daughter, neither of which appears to be likely at this point.

You don't think Cheeto would sell out his kids in a heartbeat? I suspect the only thing stopping him from harvesting their organs to prolong his life is the fact that it's not actually a possibility at the current state of medical science.
posted by Behemoth at 5:51 AM on June 19, 2017 [10 favorites]

You don't think Cheeto would sell out his kids in a heartbeat?

Oh, he'd totally sell out some of them, like Tiffany or Barron. But not Ivanka, at this point.
posted by sour cream at 5:57 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Nah, not as long as Kusher is regarded as "family".
For Kushner to be thrown under the bus would require a divorce from Ivanka first, or estrangement between father and daughter, neither of which appears to be likely at this point.

You're assuming Ivanka would choose broke Jared over President Daddy + money. I am not sure it is clear which way this would work out. I am really curious though.
posted by srboisvert at 5:59 AM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

Looks like Republicans are ready to sacrifice their own to stay in power.

-- Some Republicans see political upside in the tragedy. Brad Carver is chairman of the Republican Party in the neighboring 11th Congressional District, which is represented by Barry Loudermilk, a member of the GOP baseball squad who was on the scene during last Wednesday’s shooting.

“I’ll tell you what: I think the shooting is going to win this election for us,” Carver said Saturday after a get-out-the-vote rally for Handel in Chamblee. “Because moderates and independents in this district are tired of left-wing extremism. I get that there’s extremists on both sides, but we are not seeing them. We’re seeing absolute resistance to everything this president does. Moderates and independents out there want to give him a chance. Democrats have never given this president a chance.”

So let me get this straight. The nazi fascist extremists are actually killing people and you're not seeing them? Did you throw acid in your own face in one of your spiteful rituals or are you that fucking obtuse?
posted by Talez at 6:04 AM on June 19, 2017 [33 favorites]

The draft won't be reinstated because a draft politicizes the population much more than a volunteer military does. It leads to things like the Vietnam Syndrome. Also, as I understand it, today's military depends on a better-educated and more specialized fighting force, so it's more effective to offer incentives for bright (especially bright and poor) high school kids to sign up than to try to force conscripts to perform well, or to care too much at all.

And yet as we learned from the height of the GWOT follies that such a volunteer army is insufficient and the state's weekend warrior National Guards were called up for repeated deployment. Additionally, recruiting standards were dropped to the point where the military was a practically a major work diversion for petty criminals.

I'm kind of curious how recruiting is going these days for both the National Guard and the regular military.
posted by srboisvert at 6:05 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Also, it's sickening that people showing up to protest their elected representatives, those same elected representatives who are effectively voting to sign these same people's death warrants, being called extremism and accused of not giving the President a chance. They gave Trump a chance. First chance he got he was willing to stab them in the back with a shit eating grin on his face at the signing ceremony.
posted by Talez at 6:07 AM on June 19, 2017 [17 favorites]

I'm confident someone is, but is anyone making snapshots of all tweets made on Lord Dampnut's Twitter? I'm sure Twitter can get to anything deleted, but it'd be a hell of a lot easier if there was a historical record made automatically. I get the feeling that will come in handy in a court of law at some point.

Preferably something automated so that even quickly deleted tweets would be captured.
posted by Twain Device at 6:09 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

We’re seeing absolute resistance to everything this president does.

Some of us just aren't that into golf.
posted by Devonian at 6:10 AM on June 19, 2017 [16 favorites]

Additionally, recruiting standards were dropped to the point where the military was a practically a major work diversion for petty criminals.

Not the case. Criminal conviction / accusation was never taken off the disqualifiers list. "Join the Army or go to jail" hasn't been a thing for decades. (Note: This does not mean that individual recruiters didn't hide such things.)

I'm kind of curious how recruiting is going these days for both the National Guard and the regular military.

They raised standards back up to pre-9/11 levels back in 2009 and haven't dropped them since, because they're hitting all their targets.
posted by Etrigan at 6:12 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

We really do live in two different Americas now.
posted by Talez at 6:12 AM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

NBC and Kelly are incompetent but they're also not interested in the truth - just ratings and ad revenue.

To be fair, The Most Important News show works the same way. Corporate news is not about uncovering unknown truths about the mechanisms of power as much as it is a proxy war between powerful factions like PepsiCo, Merck, Disney, or AT&T.

Ironically, Jones' own "InfoWars" brand name on its own is more truthful than "NBC News Dateline" or whatever it is.
posted by petebest at 6:14 AM on June 19, 2017

This is a weird tweet from Donald: The Dems want to stop tax cuts, good healthcare and Border Security.Their ObamaCare is dead with 100% increases in P's. Vote now for Karen H

Who or what is Karen H? Where can I vote for her now? Why doesn't he give more information?
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:20 AM on June 19, 2017 [3 favorites]

Karen Handel in the Georgia 6th. I'm not sure a direct Trump endorsement is what her campaign needs, tbh.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:22 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Their ObamaCare is dead with 100% increases in P's.

Weird, you'd think he'd be super happy about that second part.
posted by Rust Moranis at 6:25 AM on June 19, 2017 [3 favorites]

GOP Data Firm Accidentally Leaks Personal Details of Nearly 200 Million American Voters

It's easy to coordinate voter targeting with Russian intelligence when you leave the data unguarded and publicly accessible.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:25 AM on June 19, 2017 [59 favorites]

GOP Data Firm Accidentally Leaks Personal Details of Nearly 200 Million American Voters

"Run the government like a business" seems more like a suicide note all the time.
posted by Etrigan at 6:28 AM on June 19, 2017 [40 favorites]

GOP Data Firm Accidentally Leaks Personal Details of Nearly 200 Million American Voters

The data was amassed from a variety of sources—from the banned subreddit r/fatpeoplehate...

Ok now I want to see how they cross ref'd reddit usernames to voter registrations. I knew it was possible, but it should be non-trivial and not possible for all users.

Also I want to see how much they desire the vote of the sadistic racists in fatpeoplehate. Actually I don't. Gross. America.
posted by dis_integration at 6:32 AM on June 19, 2017 [9 favorites]

Only 28 weeks from today it'll be January 1st 2018 - Midterm election year.
posted by Wordshore at 6:34 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

Nearly 200 Million American Voters

So if each record in that total number represents a distinct voter, isn't that pretty much everyone?
posted by p3t3 at 6:35 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

If they're able to pinpoint voters down to whether they wrote on fatpeoplehate, we are all in deep, deep shit here. The leak isn't even the main story, it's what's in it.
posted by Yowser at 6:37 AM on June 19, 2017 [14 favorites]

(it also suggests that Trump knew what kind of total scumbags were going to be his base)
posted by Yowser at 6:38 AM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

So if each record in that total number represents a distinct voter, isn't that pretty much everyone?

According to the article, it's 61% of the US population, so yes. Assuming that they're sticking with registered voters, it's probably every registered voter.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:40 AM on June 19, 2017 [8 favorites]

The banning of /r/fatpeoplehate released the contagion into reddit's system like worm eggs from a popped hydatid cyst, leading to the ruination so many other subreddits and the proliferation of awful new ones, eventually culminating in the vile behemoth fascist mouthpiece /the_donald. Makes perfect sense to me that it's at the center of this.
posted by Rust Moranis at 6:40 AM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

Robert Barnes | WaPo: Supreme Court to hear potentially landmark case on partisan gerrymandering

"The court accepted a case from Wisconsin, where a divided panel of three federal judges last year ruled last year that the state’s Republican leadership in 2011 pushed through a plan so partisan that it violated the Constitution’s First Amendment and equal rights protections."

posted by xyzzy at 6:41 AM on June 19, 2017 [17 favorites]

Ok now I want to see how they cross ref'd reddit usernames to voter registrations.

It wouldn't be that difficult now, persistent tracking/advertising cookies, supercookie flash objects, and browser history. If they can tell whether you've searched for a pressure cooker on amazon, they can tell if you logged into reddit in the same session. Do that enough times and you can fingerprint a real identity. Cross reference with voter rolls.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:44 AM on June 19, 2017 [3 favorites]

The State Department says that they're slashing the budget and have a hiring freeze, and that offering the fellows even a temporary consular position was the best they could do. Except, you know, that they're blatantly breaking the promise they made to these people when they signed up for this.

This seems like an excellent way to end up paying legal settlements that amount to as much or more than the salaries these people would have been paid in exchange for zero state department work. Plus legal expenses of course.

Run government like a business!
posted by srboisvert at 6:46 AM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

Run government like a business!

Worked for Bush 43.
posted by ZeusHumms at 6:47 AM on June 19, 2017

I'm confident someone is, but is anyone making snapshots of all tweets made on Lord Dampnut's Twitter? I'm sure Twitter can get to anything deleted, but it'd be a hell of a lot easier if there was a historical record made automatically.

From Lifehacker's How to Follow Donald Trump's Tweets Without Following Donald Trump:
If you just don’t want to add to Trump’s follower count or show up in his “Followers you follow” section, follow IRetweetTrump instead. This account automatically retweets every Trump tweet—including his retweets, which might look a bit confusing in your timeline.

Upon some Googling: there also seems to be a Trump twitter archive.
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 6:48 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

Before people get too freaked out about the Republican data machine, you should know that the Democrats also track voters. I don't know how it works nationally, but in my state, they definitely have a record for every registered voter. For many voters, though, the record will only contain the information they can get directly from voter registration: things like name, gender, age, and address. So I think it's fair to assume that the Republicans have a record for you, but I wouldn't make the leap from that to thinking that they know what subreddits you're on. I'm pretty sure that they don't have sophisticated records on me, because I get Get Out the Vote robocalls from the Republicans, and they wouldn't be trying to get me out to vote if they knew anything about me beyond basic demographic info.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:52 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

GOP Data Firm Accidentally Leaks Personal Details of Nearly 200 Million American Voters

It's easy to coordinate voter targeting with Russian intelligence when you leave the data unguarded and publicly accessible.

People need to go to jail for this.
posted by winna at 6:53 AM on June 19, 2017 [13 favorites]

And yet as we learned from the height of the GWOT follies that such a volunteer army is insufficient and the state's weekend warrior National Guards were called up for repeated deployment. Additionally, recruiting standards were dropped to the point where the military was a practically a major work diversion for petty criminals.

Right, because they'd still rather do those things than to invite those pesky families of drafted soldiers into the conversation about military intervention. Also not a coincidence that soldiers have gone from "our boys" to "heroes" in political rhetoric, especially since 9/11.
posted by Rykey at 6:55 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

If you just don’t want to add to Trump’s follower count or show up in his “Followers you follow” section, follow IRetweetTrump instead.

Simpler yet, just read this thread.
posted by FelliniBlank at 6:55 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

Who or what is Karen H?

She's the Undersecretary for Covfefe.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 6:59 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

The RNC Files: Inside the Largest US Voter Data Leak: In the early evening of June 12th, UpGuard Cyber Risk Analyst Chris Vickery discovered an open cloud repository while searching for misconfigured data sources on behalf of the Cyber Risk Team, a research unit of UpGuard devoted to finding, securing, and raising public awareness of such exposures. The data repository, an Amazon Web Services S3 bucket, lacked any protection against access. As such, anyone with an internet connection could have accessed the Republican data operation used to power Donald Trump’s presidential victory, simply by navigating to a six-character Amazon subdomain: “dra-dw”.

Upon inspection of the contents, “dra-dw” is shown to stand for “Deep Root Analytics Data Warehouse.” The concept of a “data warehouse” is common in modern business— essentially, it is a massive collection of data prepared specifically for complex analysis. Deep Root Analytics confirmed they owned and operated the dra-dw bucket, which was subsequently secured against public access the night of June 14th, shortly after Vickery notified federal authorities.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 6:59 AM on June 19, 2017 [24 favorites]

With no power to affect legislation unilaterally, Senate Democrats have settled on a strategy of trolling Republicans. I approve.

Senate Dems have written to GOP leaders again calling for health care hearings—and list every available room to hold a formal Cmte hearing.
posted by scalefree at 7:01 AM on June 19, 2017 [37 favorites]

The data repository, an Amazon Web Services S3 bucket, lacked any protection against access. As such, anyone with an internet connection could have accessed the Republican data operation used to power Donald Trump’s presidential victory, simply by navigating to a six-character Amazon subdomain: “dra-dw”.

This is why you don't let fucking amateurs anywhere near your AWS control panel.
posted by Talez at 7:03 AM on June 19, 2017 [22 favorites]

I think the real question isn't whether or not Kelly should have interviewed Jones, but WTF MSNBC thought it was doing hiring a morally and intellectually bankrupt FOX refugee in the first place?

Seriously, what exactly does Kelly bring to the table other than being a conventionally attractive person who has read a teleprompter at FOX for a long time? Why did MSNBC decided to continue their policy of alienating liberal people by hiring obscene and vile conservative dirtbags?

Does MSNBC really think that now, with a huge upswell in anger and activism against the American right wing, the most reasonable course of action is to rush to the right?

Kelly should never have been hired, but at the very least MSNBC should admit their mistake and fire her.

Note to MSNBC executives: if Americans want a FOX "News" style program they can visit FOX and get the real thing. Trying to turn MSNBC into a faux FOX will piss off existing viewers and gain you nothing. It's WoW syndrome all over again. Moron MBA's see success, try to copy success, and then after squandering their money wonder why people won't buy their knockoff instead of the real thing.
posted by sotonohito at 7:04 AM on June 19, 2017 [20 favorites]

Keep in mind that S3 buckets by default are set to private. Some asshole had to go in and make the bucket world readable for this fuckup to occur.
posted by Talez at 7:05 AM on June 19, 2017 [50 favorites]

So the Republicans can't be accused of collusion with Russian state hackers, or any hackers, for releasing the voter registration records of every voter in America, because it was "an accident." But as we've seen it's far easier to hack into voter registration records than actual voting machines - and now all they need to do is delete 5 percent of Democratic voter registration records in key districts in the final few days before voting and they can swing every election and ensure the Dems never win again.

I know "largest data breach" in history is pretty fucking serious on its own but I think it might be more serious than that, even. This is a big fucking deal and we need to treat it as such.
posted by the turtle's teeth at 7:09 AM on June 19, 2017 [58 favorites]

Because it's so much easier just to turn access control off rather than go to the hassle of configuring it to add someone with a legitimate need to get the data. After all, who's going to know?

(and by legitimate, I probably mean 'your boss who wants to prove they're your boss, who really has absolutely no need to see it or any way to actually use it'.)
posted by Devonian at 7:10 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Nate Cohn, New York Times: List of Well-Educated Districts Explains Why Georgia's Election Is So Close

"Of the 15 best-educated districts in the country, this [Georgia's sixth] is the only one Mr. Trump won in November."
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 7:10 AM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

Because it's so much easier just to turn access control off rather than go to the hassle of configuring it to add someone with a legitimate need to get the data. After all, who's going to know?

This is the thing, right. There's not much difference between setting up world readable and setting up an ACL policy in AWS. Same procedure, slightly different variables. The only difference is that after you've finished setting up an ACL policy you need to add users to that policy through an AWS GUI. It's so ridiculously fucking lazy.
posted by Talez at 7:17 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

I think the real question isn't whether or not Kelly should have interviewed Jones, but WTF MSNBC thought it was doing hiring a morally and intellectually bankrupt FOX refugee in the first place?

I'm pretty sure that Kelly's show is on NBC, the flagship network channel, not MSNBC, the 24-hour cable news channel. They're owned by the same people, but they presumably have different audiences.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 7:18 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

It's so ridiculously fucking lazy that it doesn't reach the standard of plausible deniability.
posted by fullerine at 7:20 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

Meanwhile on the war front:
Russian defence ministry says planes flying west of Euphrates river will be targeted after US military downs Syrian air force jet.
posted by adamvasco at 7:25 AM on June 19, 2017

It's so ridiculously fucking lazy that it doesn't reach the standard of plausible deniability.

No. It does. I mean I can see the situation that probably led to it:

Data Guy: So you create an account here and...
Exec: Create an account? What the fuck? I don't have time for this bullshit! Just give me access!
DG: But the privacy implications of..
Exec: What the fuck are you talking about? You're fired! MEREDITH! Get me someone who can give me access to this shit!

2 Hours Later...

Data Guy #2: So you go to this bookmark and all your data is there.
Exec: Great! You're so much better than the last asshole who had your job!

posted by Talez at 7:26 AM on June 19, 2017 [45 favorites]

Anyone have any indication of which way the Supreme Court is going to swing re: gerrymandering? Any chance we could eke out a good ruling?
posted by lydhre at 7:29 AM on June 19, 2017

Exec: Create an account? What the fuck? I don't have time for this bullshit! Just give me access!

Yeah. My experience is that strong security will not exist unless you have some kind of Security Sheriff who has been blessed with some kind of independent authority and can't be bullied by higherups into weakening things. Either that or a culture of security but that's even harder to find.
posted by dis_integration at 7:31 AM on June 19, 2017 [28 favorites]

Given everything else there's no way that was an accident.

Also the IT person who did it needs to go to jail along with whomever told them to do it.
posted by winna at 7:32 AM on June 19, 2017 [16 favorites]

Keep in mind that S3 buckets by default are set to private. Some asshole had to go in and make the bucket world readable for this fuckup to occur.

I don't think we should start from the assumption of incompetence, rather than intentional exposure to aid Russian intelligence. Russia got voter targeting data from someplace associated with the Republican campaign. All it would take to "coordinate" would be changing the setting on this archive, and either relaying the url to Russia, or leaving the name of it elsewhere for them to find. How long was this data exposed? When was it first made public? That's the question.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:33 AM on June 19, 2017 [27 favorites]

My campus is currently moving to mandatory two-factor authentication for all users. You'd think that people have been asked to sacrifice an infant every time they want to log on to their email.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:33 AM on June 19, 2017 [11 favorites]

I think no decision in the Wisconsin gerrymandering case is expected before June 2018. I would put a pin in your hopes for that case, because even a best case scenario outcome will be too late to effect change in the near term, and will almost certainly be too late to affect the 2018 midterms (though I admit I am not sure how quickly lines have been re-drawn in the past).
posted by prefpara at 7:34 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

I'd forgotten this was happening today (quite topical in light of the RNC leak...): Tech CEOs descend on White House to talk fixing federal IT (Politico)

The official focus of the meeting has non-partisan appeal: upgrading federal systems that one senior White House official described as "in some cases 10 to 20 years out of date." And the tech giants could stand to benefit if the government moves to modernize with the help of their hardware, software and cloud-computing services.
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 7:38 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

The "loss" of the data by the Republicans is so utterly incompetent and requires so many people to have deliberately chosen to make the data vulnerable, I do think it is not even slightly unreasonable to ask if it was intentional.

Maybe they weren't giving the info specifically to the Russians, but they were clearly trying to "lose" it so that some outside agency could get it without the Republicans admitting they gave it to that agency, and they were willing to let it go to everyone (including Russia) to achieve that goal.

The question, therefore, is who exactly the Republicans were trying to get their "lost" information to?

Or, perhaps, given the who war on leaks, and the very fluid definition of leak used by Trump and the Republicans it's part of a PR thing to give Trump/Republicans a new angle for ranting about leaks?
posted by sotonohito at 7:38 AM on June 19, 2017 [11 favorites]

Data Guy: So you create an account here and...
Exec: Create an account? What the fuck? I don't have time for this bullshit! Just give me access!
DG: But the privacy implications of..
Exec: What the fuck are you talking about? You're fired! MEREDITH! Get me someone who can give me access to this shit!
2 Hours Later...
Data Guy #2: So you go to this bookmark and all your data is there.
Exec: Great! You're so much better than the last asshole who had your job!

agent: that's a hell of an act. whadda call it?
father: the efficiency of the free market!
posted by entropicamericana at 7:42 AM on June 19, 2017 [34 favorites]

Maybe they weren't giving the info specifically to the Russians, but they were clearly trying to "lose" it so that some outside agency could get it without the Republicans admitting they gave it to that agency, and they were willing to let it go to everyone (including Russia) to achieve that goal.

I think an easy way to answer this is to find out if GOP operatives and politicians were mysteriously not in the file.
posted by winna at 7:51 AM on June 19, 2017 [8 favorites]

This was published on WaPo at 6:00 AM EST, so in case anyone missed it (like me):

At height of Russia tensions, Trump campaign chairman Manafort met with business associate from Ukraine
posted by Barack Spinoza at 7:53 AM on June 19, 2017 [15 favorites]

You'd think that people have been asked to sacrifice an infant every time they want to log on to their email.

That's one way to cut down on internet usage. Also, some tired old rhetoric for today:

Rep. Chris Collins (NY-27), WaPo: I’m a member of Congress. I’m going to start carrying a gun.

As Americans in my district and across the country know well, responsible, legal gun owners have every right to protect themselves, and that applies to members of Congress as well. I’ve worked to make sure these core values, preserved in the Constitution, are upheld. For my own protection, and for the protection of those around me, I’m putting these values into practice. Now, more than ever, I truly believe that the best place to be, during a terrible episode like the one in Alexandria, is next to a good guy with a gun. The good guys this time were the officers who likely prevented a massacre.

posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:55 AM on June 19, 2017

Also the IT person who did it needs to go to jail along with whomever told them to do it.

Maaaybe but on balance the person who ordered it first and if only one just that one.
posted by Artw at 7:57 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

According to Gizmodo, Deep Root Analytics (the irresponsible party) claims the data was exposed on June 1 of this year.

These analytics firms and contractors think approximately 0% of the time about security, so the incompetence vs. malice equation tilts heavily toward the former. Also, foreign intel services probably have many many other sources of information from which to collate. I wouldn't shout conspiracy here unless there was other evidence.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 7:58 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Rep. Chris Collins (NY-27), WaPo: I’m a member of Congress. I’m going to start carrying a gun.

I look forward to hearing more from Rep. Chris "Nine Toes" Collins in the future.
posted by Etrigan at 8:00 AM on June 19, 2017 [22 favorites]

Well Collins is not entirely wrong. If you have to be where there's some asshole with a lead thrower trying to be A Good Guy, way better to be next to them than down range.

When confronted by the two officers, Johnson raised his weapon, but did not fire. The officers fired a total of 16 rounds, killing Johnson and injuring nine bystanders

That's kinda unfair I guess. Those officers nominally have some training. Self appointed cowboys will no doubt be sloppier and even MORE dangerous.
posted by phearlez at 8:02 AM on June 19, 2017 [8 favorites]

Also the IT person who did it needs to go to jail along with whomever told them to do it.

Maaaybe but on balance the person who ordered it first and if only one just that one.

Yeah, usually I am on the side of never punish the poor person who got stuck with it, but this is so egregious.
posted by winna at 8:03 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

In an active shooter situation the only person with a gun I'm going to feel safer being next to is one wearing a uniform. Anyone else carrying a weapon should be looking for someone in a uniform to hand their weapon to or be ready to get shot by the police. I don't want to be near them when that happens.
posted by VTX at 8:04 AM on June 19, 2017 [13 favorites]

The voter registration data is already publicly available. The interesting stuff is how the firm consolidated/smoothed it all and what additional data layers they applied to suss out voter preferences, etc.

I don't work with datasets that large (nor with this much sophistication). Is it common to work with 200 miliion lines spread out over a bunch of spreadsheets? Is this how they keep/store the data to share with clients and partners whereupon it gets dropped into a proper database for data analytics magic?
posted by notyou at 8:06 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Now, more than ever, I truly believe that the best place to be, during a terrible episode like the one in Alexandria, is next to a good guy with a gun.

Of course, Congressman. I'd just like to ask you a few brief questions first to prove that you are, in fact, a good guy. Imagine that you're walking in a desert, when you come across a tortoise...
posted by Faint of Butt at 8:07 AM on June 19, 2017 [21 favorites]

Is it common to work with 200 miliion lines spread out over a bunch of spreadsheets?

On the basis of my work experience, I'm going to guess 'yes'.
posted by thelonius at 8:08 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

Is it common to work with 200 miliion lines spread out over a bunch of spreadsheets?

It is when you're a data firm with no DBAs.
posted by Talez at 8:08 AM on June 19, 2017 [18 favorites]

More news on the Wisconsin gerrymandering case that SCOTUS has taken up. I suggest following Rick Hasen's Election Law Blog for breaking news and analysis, and it's his blog that I am quoting.

About an hour after the Court issued its order agreeing to hear this case, it issued a second order, on a 5-4 vote, granting a stay of the lower court order in this case. The four liberal Justices dissented.

The granting or denial of a stay requires the Court to weigh many factors, but one of the biggest factors is likelihood of success on the merits. In other words, granting of a stay is a good (but not necessarily great) indication that the Supreme Court would be likely to reverse. That means the stay is a good indication the partisan gerrymander finding of the lower court would be reversed.

So this stay order raises a big question mark for those who think Court will use the case to rein in partisan gerrymandering.

posted by prefpara at 8:11 AM on June 19, 2017 [14 favorites]

So, I'm slowly but surely unpacking stuff that was thrown in boxes by idiot contractors. And I've just opened a box that is clippings and art and layout boards and stuff from zines that I published in the 80s/90s. (I'm a bit of a packrat.) This quote fell out of the box.

Dmitri Z. Manuilsky, lecturing at Moscow's Lenin School of Political Warfare: (circa 1930ish)

"War to the hilt between Communism and Capitalism is inevitable. Today, of course, we are not strong enough to attack. Our time will come in 20 or 30 years. To win, we shall need the element of surprise, the bourgeoisie will have to be put to sleep.

"So we shall begin by launching the most spectacular peace movement on record. There will be electrifying overtures and unheard-of concessions. The capitalist countries, stupid and decadent, will rejoice to cooperate in their own destruction. They will leap at another chance to be friends. As soon as their guard is down, we shall smash them with our clenched fist..."
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 8:12 AM on June 19, 2017 [8 favorites]

Ok now I want to see how they cross ref'd reddit usernames to voter registrations.

It doesn't look like they did. The article makes this suggestion at the beginning but talks about different types of data and it's uses.

This looks like a whole dump of data and the article talks about the reddit data in relation to possibly being used for training AI and data used to extrapolate what voters would think.

Think of what can be gathered data wise from a place like reddit. Things like person that thinks X is 53% likely to think Y, or 23% likely to support W and Z.

It the same sort of thing that we do all the time though in a much more precise and massive way then are single brains are capable of. A simplistic example being 'person is hard line no abortion ever' likely to be GOP, likely to support gun control, likely to be religious.

You could do the same sort of thing with Metafilter.
posted by Jalliah at 8:14 AM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

Is it common to work with 200 miliion lines spread out over a bunch of spreadsheets?

It is when you're a data firm with no DBAs.

Or - shockingly - a large financial trading house with your entire live business in Excel. That's why MS did a version of Windows with supercomputer features, because recalc on those enormous mutants was taking too long. (I know, because I asked MS why it did this, and that's the explanation it gave me.)

Do not underestimate the perversions to which Excel is put.
posted by Devonian at 8:18 AM on June 19, 2017 [40 favorites]

Another "lone wolf", I suppose: Officials: 17-year-old Muslim girl assaulted and killed after leaving Virginia mosque

The death of a Virginia teenager who police say was assaulted and then disappeared after leaving a mosque in the Sterling area isn't being investigated as a hate crime, authorities said Monday.

On Sunday, police found the girl’s remains and a 22-year-old man has been charged with murder in connection with the case.

The mosque, the All Dulles Area Muslim Society (ADAMS) in Sterling, and relatives identified the girl as 17-year-old Nabra Hassanen of Reston.

Fairfax County police identified the man charged with murder in her death as Darwin Martinez Torres of Sterling. On Monday, they did not release any explanation as to why they weren’t investigating the murder as a hate crime.

posted by tonycpsu at 8:21 AM on June 19, 2017 [13 favorites]

Yeah, usually I am on the side of never punish the poor person who got stuck with it, but this is so egregious.

The only way I can think of that there would be an exception to this is if it's well known that the person in that position will be held criminally liable for that act and that person as well as everyone around them is very familiar with that fact.

Back when I was selling cars and Nissan introduced it's first full sized pickups, we had a bunch of training about towing and load capacities. It was made abundantly clear that if I told a customer that the truck would tow something it wasn't actually rated to tow, that customer would sue ME PERSONALLY in addition to the dealership. The message being that we should all make sure we're certain we know what we're talking about.

Had I been asked to lie to a customer and tell them that our truck would indeed pull their 11,000Lbs trailer just fine I would have been happy to refuse even if it cost me my job and make a big stink about why I was fired with the appropriate authorities.

But the dealership I worked for made it a priority to be honest and treat everyone fairly so I never actually worried about it. They were worried about me doing something shady on my own, not that I'd be asked to do something shady.

What are the odds that anything even close to that kind of conversation has ever happened at any Trump organization?

Yet another example of a Trump organization being shadier in it's business practices than a car dealer.
posted by VTX at 8:21 AM on June 19, 2017 [14 favorites]

In an active shooter situation the only person with a gun I'm going to feel safer being next to is one wearing a uniform.

oh I found a sentiment more depressing than the gun nut one, hooray.

there is a right-wing notion, along the lines of no atheists in foxholes, that liberals hate cops and their freedom to murder at will right up until those liberals are the victims of crimes or even at risk of it, and then the adoration starts. this is not true of all liberals, particularly those who are less safe the closer they get to a cop. even I, who am statistically less likely than some to get bludgeoned or worse by a cop who thinks I look like I need it, do not actually feel safer next to one. say behind one where he can't see me, then we're talking.
posted by queenofbithynia at 8:22 AM on June 19, 2017 [18 favorites]

Jared and Ivanka's Guide to a Mindful Marriage
posted by wittgenstein at 8:22 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

in response to the republican baseball team shooting, meat balloon eric erickson is calling for red states to secede because liberal violence shows that the left is becoming an "american ISIS" and the union is too divided to survive.

i would link the article but he claims nazi germany as an example of left-wing violence so i would prefer to deny his bullshit any more clicks.
posted by murphy slaw at 8:23 AM on June 19, 2017 [9 favorites]

The official focus of the meeting has non-partisan appeal: upgrading federal systems that one senior White House official described as "in some cases 10 to 20 years out of date."

Also, do not underestimate the perversions to which Lotus 1-2-3 is put.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 8:23 AM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

Hahahahaha. Oh please red states, secede. Run away and stop taking your sweet, sweet negative tax contributions. It would be so tragic. I would cry for like, literal nanoseconds.
posted by phearlez at 8:31 AM on June 19, 2017 [12 favorites]

Texas has its own money, but I can see it breaking off of that confederacy the moment it realizes it's the only one that does.
posted by Artw at 8:33 AM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

Yeah, screw those 40+% of reliable Democrat voters in the "red states," if they didn't want to be subject to tyrannical rule by the Republican majority with no checks by the federal government, they shouldn't have lived some place I think of as backward!

Seriously, can we not do this again?
posted by biogeo at 8:35 AM on June 19, 2017 [77 favorites]

in response to the republican baseball team shooting, meat balloon eric erickson is calling for red states to secede because liberal violence shows that the left is becoming an "american ISIS"

From "you lie" to secession threats, the right needs to clean their own damn house (and Senate) before they get any say in what's up on the left.

the union is too divided to survive.

Once again, r, l, or c, it all boils down to a WITT or YOYO worldview.

We will all go together when we go.

posted by Herodios at 8:37 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

Or - shockingly - a large financial trading house with your entire live business in Excel.

Could be worse; could be Access.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:38 AM on June 19, 2017 [10 favorites]

meat balloon eric erickson is calling for red states to secede because liberal violence shows that the left is becoming an "american ISIS" and the union is too divided to survive.

Some asshole punched up and now there's a problem. All the punching down that has been taking place is just the natural order of the world.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:44 AM on June 19, 2017 [12 favorites]

Opening up instances of Excel in hidden windows to perform calculations on an Access project that's actually bridging with MySQL.
posted by Yowser at 8:45 AM on June 19, 2017 [9 favorites]

Is it common to work with 200 miliion lines spread out over a bunch of spreadsheets?

Back when rocks were soft, dinosaurs operated manual adding machines that smelled like hot oil with their tiny forepaws, and my father worked for the federal government, he used to bring home Gantt charts that were hundreds of pages -- that's 8-1/2 x 14 inch paper pages -- in length (or thickness, if you prefer.).

This was the technical environment in which we landed people on the moon. If you want the job done, you just get down to it with the tools you have.

As you were.

posted by Herodios at 8:46 AM on June 19, 2017 [34 favorites]

So this stay order raises a big question mark for those who think Court will use the case to rein in partisan gerrymandering.

The partisan gerrymandering case will go as Anthony Kennedy goes. So, keep your hopes minuscule, and prepare for a sweeping ruling enshrining gerrymandering to benefit Republicans as not only constitutional, but a moral imperative.

For every good Kennedy ruling, there are 20 terrible ones, and we already got the gay marriage decision this decade.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:46 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

oh I found a sentiment more depressing than the gun nut one, hooray.

I hear you and I feel the same way.

While the racially bias nature of police shootings makes me furious even without that, it's scary how many people the police shoot and the kinds of situations in which it happens.

I'm reasonably confident that, in an active shooter/mass shooting situation, just about every cop is going to do the right thing no matter how racist they are in other situations. The situation is about as black and white as it gets. There is a bad guy shoot innocents. You're a good guy so you're going to do the good guy thing.

That said, emotions would be running high and saying that everyone would be tense is massive understatement. Pulling the trigger is easy and the bullets do come back once they're fired. Even well intentioned and well trained people can make mistakes.
posted by VTX at 8:47 AM on June 19, 2017

They are not exactly doing much to reduce the supply of angry people with guns who feel impotent.
posted by Artw at 8:47 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

I am, on balance, fully in favour of police actually doing their job.

THE JOB:
Protecting and serving, all that good stuff

NOT THE JOB:
Acting as a kind of social landline that may go off at any time and spray bullets at the nearest black civilian; protecting the same from reasonable consequence.
posted by Artw at 8:50 AM on June 19, 2017 [26 favorites]

Oh good lord. Kellyanne Conway: Trump’s tweet confirming he’s being investigated was meant to be ‘ironic’
posted by scalefree at 8:50 AM on June 19, 2017 [10 favorites]

Yowser: Opening up instances of Excel in hidden windows to perform calculations on an Access project that's actually bridging with MySQL.

Please stop this vuglar, hate speech derail.
posted by wenestvedt at 8:50 AM on June 19, 2017 [37 favorites]

So this stay order raises a big question mark for those who think Court will use the case to rein in partisan gerrymandering.

Oh goodie, maybe we'll get to find out that partisan gerrymandering is people too.
posted by C'est la D.C. at 8:51 AM on June 19, 2017 [8 favorites]

> Oh good lord. Kellyanne Conway: Trump’s tweet confirming he’s being investigated was meant to be ‘ironic’

A hack likes, then drinks Chardonnay.
posted by tonycpsu at 8:54 AM on June 19, 2017

> Dmitri Z. Manuilsky, lecturing at Moscow's Lenin School of Political Warfare: (circa 1930ish)

"War to the hilt between Communism and Capitalism is inevitable. Today, of course, we are not strong enough to attack. Our time will come in 20 or 30 years. To win, we shall need the element of surprise, the bourgeoisie will have to be put to sleep.

"So we shall begin by launching the most spectacular peace movement on record. There will be electrifying overtures and unheard-of concessions. The capitalist countries, stupid and decadent, will rejoice to cooperate in their own destruction. They will leap at another chance to be friends. As soon as their guard is down, we shall smash them with our clenched fist..."

So I'd argue that the important part of this isn't "war to the hilt between communism and capitalism is inevitable" or "we shall begin by launching the most spectacular peace movement on record. The important part is "our time will come in 20 or 30 years."

From the start the idea behind the October Revolution was that the accession to power of the soviets of workers' and soldiers' deputies in Russia would lead to a cascading series of revolutions across Europe and the world as more and more of the proletariat escaped from the twin tyrannies of nationalism and capitalism in order to replace them with internationalist socialism. The Russian Revolution, in most of Lenin's accounts, only made sense as the beginning of world revolution.

The failure of the revolution in Germany in 1919, and the sputtering-out of the revolutionary movements in Italy and the UK, was an existential threat to the revolution in Russia, one that ultimately led to its demise when Stalin replaced the internationalist project of world revolution with his idea of "socialism in one state," which is to say a nationalist Russian socialism. Nationalist socialism is a contradiction in terms; it's not a coincidence that the most murderous form of reaction the world has ever seen took "national socialist" as its party name.

The promise that "our time will come in 20 to 30 years" from a Stalinist state organ is, as such, a pretense; it's a way to keep up the cover-story that the Stalinist U.S.S.R. was still invested in the project of the revolution by pretending that the nationalist phase would just be a brief parenthesis, a way to stall while the forces of world revolution gathered steam and while the Russian government worked to undermined the bourgeois liberal states.

Really, though, once you get beyond the realm of pretense Stalin's interest was in a purely Russian nationalism and Russian imperialism, not Soviet internationalism or world conflict between communism and capitalism.

sidebar: the appendices to Orwell's Homage to Catalonia analyze the role played by the Communist Party in Spain in these terms; during the crucial moments of the Spanish Civil War, the Communists, following Moscow's orders, made common cause with liberals to undermine the revolutionary institutions established by the anarchists and Trotskyists. This happened because Stalinism, unlike anarchism or Trotskyism, was fundamentally compatible with the views of the liberal capitalist nations of Western Europe. Anarchists were a threat to those governments, Trotskyists were a (much smaller) threat to those governments — but capitalist nations and Stalinist nations can coexist just fine.

The reason why this isn't a total derail is that Putin and Putin's government are primarily Stalinist in orientation; the chief difference between Putin's ideology and Stalin's is that Putin doesn't have to pretend to be communist.

(this is all provisional; I'm glad to yield the floor on this to anyone who's actually seriously studied the Stalinist period or who has more than a layman's knowledge of Putin's government)
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:55 AM on June 19, 2017 [12 favorites]

he claims nazi germany as an example of left-wing violence

Let me guess - they have "socialist" right in their name?
posted by yhbc at 8:58 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

"Join the Army or go to jail" hasn't been a thing for decades.

It was widely reported that one of Sarah Palin's boys got this choice about ten years ago.
posted by msalt at 9:01 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Hahahahaha. Oh please red states, secede. Run away and stop taking your sweet, sweet negative tax contributions. It would be so tragic. I would cry for like, literal nanoseconds.

We treat politics like a national sport in this country. It's really rather cultish.

There are people on both sides of the political spectrum who have been indoctrinated from a young age to believe that politics is a battle which only one side can possibly win. They're manipulated to believe that one side is fighting the good fight against evil -- and that empathy is a dangerous weakness. This is not normal, and it isn't healthy for us or for this country.

Most political conflicts are cost-benefit decisions. Often they are based on a limited understanding of the facts, or on judgments about personal behavior.

Secession probably wouldn't happen. Civil War is far more likely. Because the answer to conflict usually isn't taking one's ball and going home, but rather fighting to win the best possible outcome based on a cost-benefit analysis.
posted by zarq at 9:06 AM on June 19, 2017 [12 favorites]

Let me guess - they have "socialist" right in their name?

i think it was asserted without justification but it's hard for me to say, because by that point in the article i was making jack-off gestures and rolling my eyes so hard that it was difficult to continue reading.
posted by murphy slaw at 9:07 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

I live in a Red State :( :(. Don't be mean.

You can have amnesty.
posted by Faint of Butt at 9:11 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Meanwhile on the war front:
Russian defence ministry says planes flying west of Euphrates river will be targeted after US military downs Syrian air force jet.

I would also recommend the podcast Iran in the Age of Trump if you're interested in taking a bit of a deeper dive into what the hell is going on right now with Iran, Russia, the US, Saudi Arabia and the Gulf States, and Syria. I don't make a habit of listening to national security podcasts but these guys seem informed and pretty even-handed.
posted by GalaxieFiveHundred at 9:12 AM on June 19, 2017 [11 favorites]

Thanks, Sockin'inthefreeworld! I'm now following Real Press Sec so I can get the tweets without having to look at his ugly mug.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:13 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

In 2016, a whole lot of formerly pretty reliably blue states went red by just a few thousand votes. Detroit is in a red state. Philadelphia is in a red state.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:13 AM on June 19, 2017 [16 favorites]

Yeah, if they secede, we're keeping the big cities. Let the commuters bust out their passport every time they wanna head into the office.
posted by Slap*Happy at 9:17 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

"Join the Army or go to jail" hasn't been a thing for decades.

It was widely reported that one of Sarah Palin's boys got this choice about ten years ago.

It was widely rumored that Track Palin got this choice, on message boards (e.g., here and here), and the closest thing to a source is a story at something called SpreadIt.org that no longer exists. People who were absolutely certain that it happened, with sources, soon retracted it.

Did he get into trouble resulting in his parents saying "The Army will straighten you out" after his juvenile record had been sealed or otherwise expunged, possibly due to the fact that his mother was the Governor of the state at the time? That is absolutely possible. But I am pretty certain that no judge told him "Army or jail, kid." It just ain't done anymore. And why would a high-profile person get that deal rather than someone just quietly making the case go away?
posted by Etrigan at 9:18 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

I have moments (many moments, actually) when I think "you go right ahead and secede! See how you ignorant fucks can get along without OUR pinko librul money! Not to mention our Apple products, Amazon Prime, Target, and Starbucks!" I feel like the parent of really ungrateful, disrespectful stepchildren, happy to take my money and treat me like crap while taking my money.

But then I think of all the decent, kind people fighting the good fight in red states, or even the decent, kind and apolitical people who might not have their fingers on the pulse of current events but still don't deserve to suffer. Secession would hurt them, and not touch the bad actors who are the ones making life difficult.

And there's the very vulnerable - rural African Americans in the Missippi Delta, Latinx Americans in the Southwest, and Native Americans on rural reservations. They don't deserve to be left behind either.

Stronger Together, people! We might not have Hillary Clinton in the White House but I think her campaign slogan still stands, more than ever.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 9:19 AM on June 19, 2017 [77 favorites]

Reminder:

There are many people in this country who are diametrically opposed to the policies of their state governments, yet who don't have the power to change things legislatively. Political parties across the US have gerrymandered their way into power, and then used a variety of tactics (such as the GOP's extensive attempts to suppress voting) to stay in office.

Many of us probably wouldn't like to be automatically lumped in with Trump supporters simply because he's now in power. To be called Islamophobes because of our President's attempted Muslim bans. We wouldn't want to be blamed for GOP policies that target minorities and women and strip civil rights or healthcare from millions.

We shouldn't be blaming Democrats stuck in red states for policies that are enacted despite how they probably voted. Don't be short-sighted: from a practical perspective, nothing will ever change those states to blue if they're not supported in their fight.
posted by zarq at 9:20 AM on June 19, 2017 [48 favorites]

> Yeah, if they secede, we're keeping the big cities. Let the commuters bust out their passport every time they wanna head into the office.
posted by Slap*Happy at 9:17 AM on June 19 [+] [!]

tell me again how well that worked out when Paris tried it.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:23 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Speaking as a Texas leftist who feels quite certain that secession would be a literal death sentence for me and my family, I'd rather my allies in sane states **NOT** abandon me to the wolves.
posted by sotonohito at 9:23 AM on June 19, 2017 [48 favorites]

Mueller team lawyer brings witness-flipping expertise to Trump probes (Reuters, Karen Freifeld)

A veteran federal prosecutor recruited onto special counsel Robert Mueller's team is known for a skill that may come in handy in the investigation of potential ties between Russia and U.S. President Donald Trump's 2016 campaign team: persuading witnesses to turn on friends, colleagues and superiors.

Andrew Weissmann, who headed the U.S. Justice Department's criminal fraud section before joining Mueller's team last month, is best known for two assignments - the investigation of now-defunct energy company Enron and organized crime cases in Brooklyn, New York - that depended heavily on gaining witness cooperation.

posted by Barack Spinoza at 9:24 AM on June 19, 2017 [51 favorites]

Danielle Kurtzleben / NPR: President Donald Trump, Unreliable Narrator

In literature, an "unreliable narrator" is someone who tells the story while layering a clearly distorting lens over that reality — there is a clear point of view (The Catcher in the Rye's angst-ridden teenager, Pale Fire's unhinged professor), and it shapes how the story is told. It doesn't necessarily imply malice (consider Huckleberry Finn or Tristram Shandy), but simply a point of view that clouds the story.

In The Art Of The Deal, Trump praised "truthful hyperbole" — a kind of purposeful truth-stretching to get people "excited." In other words, he has shown a willingness to distort the facts. With his regular usage of factual inaccuracies and disputes with the "fake media," Twitter Trump has given us a framework to figure out what exactly his lens on the world looks like.

Trump isn't entirely unique in this regard: Everyone is an unreliable narrator in some way. And Americans often regard politicians in general as unreliable narrators. When politicians explain their views of the world, we can easily guess at their basic motivations: advancing policies, winning for their party, protecting their legacies.

And that means we can easily determine for ourselves how big the gap is between what any given politician says and what we perceive to be factually true.

Over and over again, in this case.
posted by ZeusHumms at 9:25 AM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

The official focus of the meeting has non-partisan appeal: upgrading federal systems that one senior White House official described as "in some cases 10 to 20 years out of date."

Also, do not underestimate the perversions to which Lotus 1-2-3 is put.

You have 1-2-3? We have to use EDLIN.

relevant
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:30 AM on June 19, 2017

I don't know about you, but the roads sure seem smoother and the bridges solider and the tunnels tunnelier around here after Infrastructure Week.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:30 AM on June 19, 2017 [13 favorites]

Hahahahaha. Oh please red states, secede. Run away and stop taking your sweet, sweet negative tax contributions. It would be so tragic. I would cry for like, literal nanoseconds.

This is ridiculous when red states talk about it. It's ridiculous when blue states talk about it.

Sure, let's have states "secede." I'm sure literally nothing will change with regards to infrastructure, defense, or tax dollars. Everyone serving in the military will happily stay exactly where they are. Every power line and road and anything else crossing state lines will be funded exactly the way it is. Oh, wait! BLUE states can secede, and won't that be awesome? Because all those rural red voters in those states will be totally cool with going along with it. We won't have any problems at all with food supplies, because those are totally generated by urban voters.

More importantly, I'm sure every marginalized community in those red states will be just fine without the aid of pressure from people in blue states. All those same-sex marriages? All those people of color? Yeah. Totally fine.

And it's totally fine for people in blue states to look at people of color and queer people and women and non-Christians in red states and say, "Yeah, fuck 'em, as long as I don't have to live with Republican voters in my country, wherever that may be."

Because that's what you're saying when you advocate for secession.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 9:30 AM on June 19, 2017 [16 favorites]

Mueller team lawyer brings witness-flipping expertise to Trump probes

Jared, on the other hand, did one real estate deal with his daddy's money that turned into a complete clusterfuck. Don't worry Jared, after you solve middle east peace, you'll surely be more than a match for the lawyers that brought down the Gambino family, Enron and oversaw the FBI after 9/11.
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:31 AM on June 19, 2017 [34 favorites]

I'm reasonably confident that, in an active shooter/mass shooting situation, just about every cop is going to do the right thing no matter how racist they are in other situations. The situation is about as black and white as it gets. There is a bad guy shoot innocents. You're a good guy so you're going to do the good guy thing.

Don't be so confident. During an active shooter situation in NY the cops shot bystanders.
posted by srboisvert at 9:32 AM on June 19, 2017 [13 favorites]

Folks, just fuckin' drop the ha-ha-secession shit like yesterday, we've been around this loop a bunch of times and it's a shitty loop.
posted by cortex (staff) at 9:40 AM on June 19, 2017 [74 favorites]

Not the case. Criminal conviction / accusation was never taken off the disqualifiers list. "Join the Army or go to jail" hasn't been a thing for decades. (Note: This does not mean that individual recruiters didn't hide such things.)

During the war the military issued moral waivers, which allow convicted criminals to join, for 12% of recruits.

So that disqualifiers list? Not so much.
posted by srboisvert at 9:46 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

One reason why I bitterly oppose civilian carrying of guns as a solution to active shooter situations is because we know how badly people who are theoretically trained to deal with the situation handle things when the only guns other than theirs are in the hands of the bad guys.

Imagine every wannabe Rambo yanking out their gun, shooting at the crowd, at the shooter, at each other, and then the cops show up and have absolutely no idea who is the bad guy and who is just Rambo going berserk.

No thanks. I'll take my chances with only the shooter being armed.
posted by sotonohito at 9:52 AM on June 19, 2017 [30 favorites]

Well, you don't get a choice if you find yourself in that situation. Can we please get back to the current mess of a government we have?
posted by agregoli at 10:01 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

A long time ago I wrote a little web app called Twitter Fiction Reader to make reading DadBoner easier. Well, Karl Welzein got boring and I forgot about the whole project, but lo and behold it still works! I just added Trump.

Unfortunately it only scraped tweets back to last June. I'm not sure if I can collect more, but I'll work on it. In the mean time this will pull down new tweets every 5 minutes.
posted by zrail at 10:01 AM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

Megyn Kelly's Alex Jones interview a ratings flop

I yield the balance of my time to the right-honorable gentleman Mr. Muntz of Springfield.
posted by tonycpsu at 10:09 AM on June 19, 2017 [107 favorites]

During the war the military issued moral waivers, which allow convicted criminals to join, for 12% of recruits.

Sorry, I misspoke. Unresolved criminal convictions weren't taken off the list of disqualifiers. I was pushing back on your claim that "the military was... practically a major work diversion for petty criminals." Moral waivers are for people who have completed their sentences, not any kind of "diversion" program.

I was in a U.S. Army recruiting unit during Afghanistan and Iraq. My boss was a Vietnam vet who had led draftees and guys who had been given that "Join the Army or go to jail" choice. I saw all of the policy notes that came down. I kept up on them afterward because I was A) leading troops who came in under those policies and B) possibly going back to Recruiting at some point. Please take my word for it that more or less every one of these policy changes included specific language that "Join the Army or go to jail" was very much still not a thing and would not be allowed.
posted by Etrigan at 10:10 AM on June 19, 2017 [9 favorites]

A veteran federal prosecutor recruited onto special counsel Robert Mueller's team is known for a skill that may come in handy...: persuading witnesses to turn on friends, colleagues and superiors.

First thought on reading this: Imagine what this guy's job interviews are like:

Interviewer 1: Your résumé is impeccable and you have great references.

Weissman: Thank you.

Interviewer 2: Would you call yourself a team player?

Weissman: Absolutely.

Interviewer 1: What would you say is your greatest skill? Something that doesn't fit on your résumé?

Weissman: I'm an expert in getting people to turn on each other.

(Interviewers exchange nervous glances.)
posted by scaryblackdeath at 10:16 AM on June 19, 2017 [47 favorites]

Amy Goodman & Juan González / Democracy Now: Full Interview: Naomi Klein on "No Is Not Enough: Resisting Trump's Shock Politics"

NAOMI KLEIN: ... I think we need to understand that Trump is not playing by the rules of politics. He’s playing by the rules of branding. And, you know, there have been presidential conflicts of interest before. There have been presidents with business interests before. But there has never been a fully commercialized global brand as a sitting U.S. president. That is unprecedented.

Specifically 'brand' in the sense of ideas and identity, not physical products.

So, Trump was more of a traditional business in the 1980s. And Trump was just sort of like a guy who built buildings ... and had a flair for marketing. But the game changer for him was The Apprentice. That’s when he ... realized he could enter the stratosphere of the superbrands. And his business model changed. It no longer became about building the building or buying the building. That was for other people to do. He was about building up the Trump name and then selling it and leasing it in as many different ways as possible. So you’ve got the Trump water and Trump Steaks and Trump’s very so-called dodgy university. And so many of the towers, the Trump towers around the world, the Trump resorts around the world, those are not owned by the Trump Organization. The Trump Organization is paid millions of dollars by these developers for the privilege of putting the Trump name on those towers.

So, this has huge implications for how we understand the corruption at the heart of Trump’s decision to merge his global brand with the U.S. government, which is what is underway on so many different fronts, because, honestly, what it means is, every time we say the word "Trump," even when we’re saying it in a negative light, we’re doing his marketing for him.

posted by ZeusHumms at 10:18 AM on June 19, 2017 [26 favorites]

etrigan: Appreciate your expertise on this point. To play devil's advocate though, "Join the Army or go to jail" is something a judge would impose, without any need to inform the Army, right? Is there any reason you or your commanding officer would have been aware people were being given that choice? Especially since it would usually have been in the less formal and often sealed world of juvenile justice.
posted by msalt at 10:20 AM on June 19, 2017

TPM's Josh Marshall on Who Is the Hidden Hand at the NSC?

Mike Flynn has been out at the White House for more than four months. He is, we are told, in the most serious kind of legal trouble. Yet the political ghost of Mike Flynn still seems to be a hidden hand driving outcomes in the Trump White House. Maybe it’s even Flynn himself. [...]

My basic question is: why does Cohen-Watnick still have a job? Maybe McMaster couldn’t fire him on day one. But he’s had months to establish himself and place his stamp on the NSC. [...]

Indeed, if we look at the current NSC it seems to still be stocked in many cases by Mike Flynn’s people. Again, not entirely out of the norm. A new boss isn’t really in a position to fire everyone at once. But Mike Flynn isn’t any former NSC boss. He resigned in disgrace and is at the center of an investigation that is consuming the whole country. Copious reporting says that he has not been permitted to fire a number of Flynn people.

This situation is an enormous clusterfuck. Strung throughout the White House's National Security apparatus are a bunch of Michael Flynn loyalists who seem to have backing from the very top levels of the administration. Even noted Iran hawk James Mattis is pushing back on Ezra Cohen-Watnick's desire to heat shit up in Syria. Tense international relations between heavily armed, powerful nation-stations such as the USA and Russia require expertise and a delicate touch--of which exactly none of these Flynn jokers have.

I hate hate hate that so many of these fools seem to be acting in a way to ensure the great powers go to war again. No one I've ever met who saw the last conflict of that magnitude ever wanted a repeat.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 10:25 AM on June 19, 2017 [51 favorites]

persuading witnesses to turn on friends, colleagues and superiors

I'm a bit surprised that this is in any way remarkable. Back when I was interviewed (read: interrogated and threatened) by the FBI their entire MO was to get me to rat out an acquaintance in order to avoid my own special brand of legal jeopardy. And given the rate at which prosecutors seek and acquire plea bargains vs. verdicts, I assumed that socially engineering potential defendants into ratting out their co-conspirators would be a prosecutor's bread and butter.
posted by xyzzy at 10:26 AM on June 19, 2017

A judge would not impose an "or else" Join the Army sentence. For juveniles or anyone else. This is a bizarre derail.
posted by agregoli at 10:26 AM on June 19, 2017

To play devil's advocate though, "Join the Army or go to jail" is something a judge would impose, without any need to inform the Army, right? Is there any reason you or your commanding officer would have been aware people were being given that choice?

Recruiters run background checks, including police and court reports. If there's an unresolved arrest out there or if the person is still on some form of probation, they find out about it. If a judge were to say "Okay, I'm going to dismiss this case and declare you Not Guilty and let you walk out of here under your own power, but you have to promise that you're going to join the Army, and if you don't, then we'll know about it and we'll get you on some trumped-up charge," then sure, maybe the military wouldn't find out about it. I don't know whether any judge would take that chance.

Also, one of the major things in the paperwork that enlistees have to sign off on is a declaration that they are not doing it to avoid any punishment or any other sort of reward or benefit beyond what is in their contract. This is also asked of them, one on one, in a private room, by an officer at the entrance processing station before they leave home and by another officer at the reception station after they leave home but before they're officially in Basic Training. This is normally used to attempt to make sure that the recruiters aren't making wild-ass promises that aren't in people's contracts, but it also attempts to make sure that enlistees aren't running away from anything that may come back to bite them (or, more importantly, come back to bite the military).
posted by Etrigan at 10:33 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

Opening up instances of Excel in hidden windows to perform calculations on an Access project that's actually bridging with MySQL.

That's how you get nameless horrors from beyond space and time. Do you want nameless horrors from beyond space and time?
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 10:34 AM on June 19, 2017 [28 favorites]

Randy Bryce is a steelworker running for Congress against Paul Ryan. This is one of the best political ads I've ever seen.
posted by anastasiav at 10:36 AM on June 19, 2017 [81 favorites]

Kellyanne Conway: Trump’s tweet confirming he’s being investigated was meant to be ‘ironic’

Wait, I thought the tweets spoke for themselves unless they were in "quotes."
posted by kirkaracha at 10:37 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Randy Bryce is a steelworker running for Congress against Paul Ryan. This is one of the best political ads I've ever seen.

Paul Ryan's already an ironworker tho.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:41 AM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

Strung throughout the White House's National Security apparatus are a bunch of Michael Flynn loyalists

Copious reporting says that he (McMaster) has not been permitted to fire a number of Flynn people.

I'd definitely like more details on how and why McMaster has "not been permitted" to remove Flynn loyalists from the National Security Agency.
posted by diogenes at 10:41 AM on June 19, 2017 [18 favorites]

Randy Bryce is a steelworker running for Congress against Paul Ryan

Maybe he'll get some support from the DCCC this time, because they've never once supported a Democratic challenger against Ryan before. Republican leadership is off limits to the Democratic structure, although of course the Republicans have no corresponding trepidation about funding challengers to high ranking Democrats.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:43 AM on June 19, 2017 [23 favorites]

Ok, that Randy Bryce ad. I want that man to win.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 10:44 AM on June 19, 2017 [31 favorites]

Some AHCA updates:

A preview of the stand the Democrats will be taking. Vox has more in Democrats ready to gum up Senate agenda over GOP’s health care secrecy, including slowing down the Senate agenda and finally (why the hell has it taken this long?) making the secrecy of this process into a story.

But don't look to lobbyists to save you, because they don't care: The health care industry doesn't love Obamacare enough to save it:

The health care industry killed Hillarycare in the 1990s and cut deals to shape Obamacare more to its liking in 2009. But now, as Republicans push a sweeping and widely reviled health bill through Congress, the industry has often appeared declawed in the biggest health care fight of the decade.

It’s a deliberate strategy, interviews with nearly 20 lobbyists and other experts suggest. Health industry groups generally don’t love Obamacare enough to jeopardize their ability to shape the rest of the Republican agenda — including big corporate tax cuts. They also fear incurring White House retaliation.

The Senate is now looking at a bill that would make even deeper cuts than the "mean" House one, with the Medicaid cap tied to CPI-U instead of the medical inflation rate. You can compare the growth rates and get a pretty good idea of how devastating this would be.

With only 45 legislative days left until the end of the fiscal year, the GOP considers canceling August recess to salvage agenda. But with junkets already planned, it's going to be a tough sell.

One conservative House staffer describes this as: "It's a bit like the feeling of waiting on the Star Wars movie releases. You know it's probably gonna be poor quality (Senate = Disney), but it's Star Wars (Obamacare repeal), so you still hold out hope." What a joke these people are.

Call your Senators and let them know you oppose the AHCA and any cuts to Medicaid today!

Bonus update—President Trump with the President of Panama:

We have many things to discuss. Were going to spend quite a bit of time today, said the president. The Panama Canal is doing quite well. Then, looking toward his visitor who was seated in the chair to his right, the president added, I think we did a good job building it, right?

President Varela responded, Very good job.

posted by zachlipton at 10:47 AM on June 19, 2017 [31 favorites]

Not only is that a great ad, his Twitter handle is @ironstache which C'MON.
posted by marylynn at 10:47 AM on June 19, 2017 [50 favorites]

Ugh, I just noticed this part of that Kellyanne interview:

And that’s the President in his 140 characters, through his significant social media platform, Ainsley, telling everybody, ‘wow, look at the irony here.'

They keep using Twitter's character limit to justify Trump not making any sense or saying something stupid. Like the poor guy doesn't have access to any other means of communication where he could explain himself more clearly.
posted by diogenes at 10:49 AM on June 19, 2017 [20 favorites]

That Randy Bryce ad… If I had the resources to go and campaign for him (which is what is legal for non-Americans), I'd do it in a second. The Democratic party should go for the kill here.
posted by mumimor at 10:50 AM on June 19, 2017 [9 favorites]

The Panama Canal is doing quite well.

A man, a plan, a covfefe.
posted by Faint of Butt at 10:50 AM on June 19, 2017 [25 favorites]

They keep using Twitter's character limit to justify Trump not making any sense or saying something stupid. Like the poor guy doesn't have access to any other means of communication where he could explain himself more clearly.

For instance, ellipses to indicate that he's continuing the tweet in another tweet.
posted by Etrigan at 10:51 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

This is a bizarre derail.

It is, but it's also a pretty instructive example that often people's first reactions to a challenge of their internalized and unexamined assumptions (things we just have "picked up" or consider "common knowledge") include immediate skepticism of the challenger's expertise and creating post hoc justifications for why their own understanding might still be correct. As such, it's not really out of place in a thread on politics.
posted by solotoro at 10:55 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

Don't tell Trump the US turned the Panama Canal over to Panama in 1999. I would bet money he doesn't know that.
Plus if we did such a great job how come they need to expand it to keep it from going obsolete?
posted by kirkaracha at 10:56 AM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

The Disney Star Wars movies are good.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:58 AM on June 19, 2017 [10 favorites]

I see we have a new candidate for the title of "Most Hateable US House Staffer."
posted by scaryblackdeath at 11:00 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

Etrigan, thank you. Very illuminating.

A judge would not impose an "or else" Join the Army sentence. For juveniles or anyone else.

Maybe you missed the comment where Etrigan said this:

I was in a U.S. Army recruiting unit during Afghanistan and Iraq. My boss was a Vietnam vet who had led draftees and guys who had been given that "Join the Army or go to jail" choice.

posted by msalt at 11:01 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Disney's pro-gay, which is probably why a conservative staffer isn't a fan.
posted by dirigibleman at 11:01 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

And that’s the President in his 140 characters, through his significant social media platform, Ainsley, telling everybody, ‘wow, look at the irony here.'

This isnt even a proper "he only said he was under investigation ironically" defense, it's just saying that he is under investigation and something relating to it is ironic.
posted by Artw at 11:02 AM on June 19, 2017

The Disney Star Wars movies are good.

I know, right? When the Lucasfilm acquisition was announced, I was asked my opinion of Disney taking over Star Wars. I think my interrogator was expecting some sort of humorous nerd tantrum, and he was somewhat taken aback when I said I was cautiously optimistic, based on Disney's good track record as a holding company with Marvel Comics and the Muppets. And now Disney has released two full-scale Star Wars movies, and they've both been pretty good, and I'm looking forward to Episode VIII. What's this staffer's deal?

(Edit: I just realized he's probably one of those guys who doesn't like Star Wars now because it has too many women and PoC in it.)
posted by Faint of Butt at 11:02 AM on June 19, 2017 [24 favorites]

Holy crap that Randy Bryce ad is awesome - does anyone with more local knowledge than I have know how he and David Yankovich (a dem activist who moved from OH to WI to oppose ryan) might work together/against one another?
posted by Exceptional_Hubris at 11:04 AM on June 19, 2017

Disney's pro-gay, which is probably why a conservative staffer isn't a fan.

Based on my recent observation of certain sections of present-day Star Wars fandom, there's a pretty vocal contingent of SW fans (mostly male, mostly conservative) who didn't like The Force Awakens and Rogue One because the female main characters were "too competent" at doing hero stuff.
posted by Strange Interlude at 11:10 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

We probably don't need to dive to deep into the whole comparative Star Wars fandom aspect of this, fwiw. If it's a slow news day in US politics the thread can just actually be slow.
posted by cortex (staff) at 11:12 AM on June 19, 2017 [42 favorites]

May 29: Want Paul Ryan Gone? Draft Randy Bryce for Congress

Still, to beat him, any opposing candidate has to be much more than someone that repeatedly says, "I'm not Paul Ryan." We've learned that in the last three gubernatorial elections. It has to be something that any union worker knows, you can't get people to be with you by just opposing someone or something, you have to offer a better alternative. Instead of just opposing Ryancare, one has to have something better, hopefully one-payer health care, but even Obamacare would be better.

One cannot be just opposed to privatizing schools, but strengthening public schools. Supporting strengthening voters' rights and women's rights and more access to good health care providers instead of oppressing people more and more.

It would also have to be a person that could appeal to a wide range of people, from moderates to the very progressive. It would have to be someone willing to take baby steps while keeping their eye on the big prize. It would have to be someone able to raise money and relate to the grassroots at the same time, just like someone who can walk on a iron girder high in the sky without fear or without losing their balance.

That person, I believe, has to be Randy Bryce.

Draft Randy Bryce for Congress Facebook page. His mom just joined the page on Friday; that may have been what led him to kick off his campaign!

ActBlue donation page
posted by kirkaracha at 11:15 AM on June 19, 2017 [35 favorites]

Apparently, Spicey isn't allowing cameras today, but Adrian Carrasquillo is live-tweeting and reports that "Spicer asked if Mueller could be fired by Trump. Spicer goes into "org chart" convo, says ultimately everyone serves at pleasure of POTUS." Also, Spicer says the White House sends "thoughts and prayers" to victims of the London attack.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:15 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Maybe he'll get some support from the DCCC this time, because they've never once supported a Democratic challenger against Ryan before.

Who do we write to at the DCCC to tell them that if they don't support IronStache in this race they're being chickenshits, and their adherence to "gentlemen's agreements" and unwritten "collegiality" rules that their Republican counterparts frequently ignore keeps people who are hurting and marginalized hurting and marginalized?
posted by lord_wolf at 11:16 AM on June 19, 2017 [30 favorites]

Granted I've been very overwrought lately, but that Randy Bryce ad made me tear up. Off to Ac Blue on his behalf.
posted by TwoStride at 11:22 AM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

New Yorker: Trump Steaks, but For Hotels

A couple of weeks ago, at Trump Tower, on the same spot where Donald Trump announced his Presidential bid, Eric Danziger, the C.E.O. of Trump Hotels, formally launched a new line of three-star hotels, called American Idea, which will cater to lower-income, rural areas of the country. It was the most blatant instance yet of the Trump family’s profiting from its political power—in this case, by shifting from its long-standing focus on luxury markets in order to make money from the very demographic that put Trump in the White House. Within the hotel industry, the event raised eyebrows for another reason: it was unbelievably haphazard. Danziger, though a veteran of the industry, had almost nothing to show his audience. There was no Web site or marketing material, and the logo was just the brand name and a crudely drawn picture of a light bulb. (A company representative told me that she wasn’t sure if it was the final logo or a work in progress.)
...
Like many things in the world of Trump, the event was both corrupt and inept. Trump Hotels had nothing to offer but words, and nearly all of those words were about the President.

--
According to the official White House transcript, the President of Panama replied by reminding Trump that the canal was built 100 years ago, which is even more hilarious.
posted by zachlipton at 11:23 AM on June 19, 2017 [30 favorites]

Also, Spicer says the White House sends "thoughts and prayers" to victims of the London attack.

BRB. I just lost a bet and now I have to go cook a left shoe before I eat it.
posted by Talez at 11:29 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Steven Mufson, WaPo: Rick Perry just denied that humans are the main cause of climate change

Asked in an interview on CNBC’s “Squawk Box” whether he believed that carbon dioxide was “the primary control knob for the temperature of the Earth and for climate,” Perry said that “No, most likely the primary control knob is the ocean waters and this environment that we live in.”

Perry added that “the fact is this shouldn’t be a debate about, ‘Is the climate changing, is man having an effect on it?’ Yeah, we are. The question should be just how much, and what are the policy changes that we need to make to effect that?”

posted by Johnny Wallflower at 11:30 AM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

BRB. I just lost a bet and now I have to go cook a left shoe before I eat it.

Coincidentally I suspect that that's exactly what you'll get when you order "steak" at Trump's new American Idea hotels.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 11:31 AM on June 19, 2017 [14 favorites]

> Who do we write to at the DCCC to tell them that if they don't support IronStache in this race they're being chickenshits, and their adherence to "gentlemen's agreements" and unwritten "collegiality" rules that their Republican counterparts frequently ignore keeps people who are hurting and marginalized hurting and marginalized?

Show that you have a viable candidate who has name recognition, fundraising infrastructure, and the full support of the state party and I'm pretty sure no writing or phone calls will be necessary.

I don't know, I think the DCCC NEEDS to be hearing from us
A) to know we're watching them also, and
B) that we're on their side.

I echo the request of whom to contact at the DCCC to give them feedback, because *I* certainly don't know and I'm sure others don't either.
posted by yoga at 11:32 AM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

Current CNN White House correspondent Jim Acosta is positively furious (in a restrained newsman kinda way) right now and spitting fire about the ban on audio and video of the White House press briefing today. Basically calls it unamerican.

Record it anyway, Jim. Put a tape recorder in your pocket and then air the audio. Or are you worried you'll be missing something if they don't let you into Spicer Lie Time in the future?
posted by saturday_morning at 11:34 AM on June 19, 2017 [9 favorites]

americanidea.com...doesn't lead to Trump's hotel chain. magamotel.com is available tho
posted by kirkaracha at 11:34 AM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

Show that you have a viable candidate who has name recognition, fundraising infrastructure, and the full support of the state party and I'm pretty sure no writing or phone calls will be necessary.

This is horseshit and the problem. The DCCC won't enter races that aren't gift wrapped with a bow, even now ahead of what could potentially be a historic swing opportunity. Rob Zerban put up 43% against Ryan in 2014, with no help. Ryan's district is PVI R+5, 1 point less Republican leaning than Georgia-6th where Osseff is polling even or better. Ryan's district is exactly the type of district that should be winnable in a wave election, but has been declared off limits for over a decade by the Democrats policy of refusing to aid challengers to Republican leadership.
posted by T.D. Strange at 11:36 AM on June 19, 2017 [52 favorites]

DCCC contact page
posted by kirkaracha at 11:36 AM on June 19, 2017 [12 favorites]

kirkaracha: americanidea.com...doesn't lead to Trump's hotel chain

Is there any reason he can't make his hotels into churches? americanidea.church has a certain brand appeal, and think of the tax breaks!
posted by filthy light thief at 11:41 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

from the "this place is not a place of honor. no highly esteemed deed is commemorated here. nothing valued is here." dept.:

The Hill: Nugent unites with Maher on ‘no violence’ in political debates pledge

posted by murphy slaw at 11:42 AM on June 19, 2017 [3 favorites]

Preet Bharara‏ @PreetBharara
It's not just a problem from the right. People on the left saying utter nonsense too, Iike there are sealed indictments against Trump. B.S.

Louise Mensch‏ @LouiseMensch
Replying to @PreetBharara
I stand by my reporting. And if they were sealed how on earth would you legally know?

*slams head into wall repeatedly while whimpering*
posted by Talez at 11:42 AM on June 19, 2017 [10 favorites]

BuzzFeed with the scoop: This Is The Trump Administration's Plan For Dealing With Russia: "A new classified document by Secretary of State Rex Tillerson lays out a new path for Russia and the US. But does the president, weighed down by scandal and investigation, support it?" A taste:

Pifer said the framework is similar to a four-point strategy for dealing with Russia the Obama administration created in 2015 after the Ukraine crisis upended efforts to “reset” relations with the Kremlin. The difficulty, he said, is knowing whether Trump will adhere to it or pursue a more ambitious grand bargain with Russia that gives deference to Moscow’s sphere of influence in Eastern Europe. “We’re talking about a Tillerson document,” he said. “If we’ve learned anything over the last four months, it’s that the president could throw it out at any moment.”
...
A key difference from the Obama-era strategy is the Tillerson framework does not expressly commit to building up the "resilience" of Russian neighbors. Obama’s strategy, drafted by his White House senior director for Russia Celeste Wallander, pledged to make Eastern and Central European countries more “resilient against Russian tactics” through various democracy-building programs and the development of NATO’s Very High Readiness Joint Task Force, which first deployed in June 2015 for a NATO exercise in Poland.

When asked about the omission, a State Department spokesperson said US support for Eastern Europe will remain in place even if it isn’t explicitly stated in the framework.

posted by zachlipton at 11:43 AM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

Omg, of all the things these days I think Spicer's utter REFUSAL to take responsibility and ask Trump whether he believes in climate change is the one that gives me hives.

It shouldn't be an excuse in the fucking first place, but when you've been asked the same question for goddamn weeks you better have something better than "... I guess I still haven't asked him?"
posted by lydhre at 11:45 AM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

Nugent unites with Maher on ‘no violence’ in political debates pledge

It's like "two great tastes that taste great together" except with shit.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:47 AM on June 19, 2017 [18 favorites]

That's the one thing I find most believable, that Spicer can't get in to see Trump even to ask him a simple question.
posted by T.D. Strange at 11:47 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

The Federalist speaks out over Philando Castile's murder and subsequent acquittal of Jeronimo Yanez.

At least a few conservatives are actually still principled. The silence from the NRA has been quite deafening.
posted by Talez at 11:48 AM on June 19, 2017 [35 favorites]

Does the US President ... support it?

I'm starting to drift into that camp that wonders if he can even understand it.
posted by From Bklyn at 11:49 AM on June 19, 2017 [3 favorites]

That's the one thing I find most believable, that Spicer can't get in to see Trump even to ask him a simple question.

Which is why this whole fucking thing is a sham and the press needs to take a stand and just stop showing up. They don't get any info from Spicer that they can't get from twitter. Stop legitimizing it.
posted by lydhre at 11:49 AM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

There is nothing the Trump administration would like more than the press no longer showing up.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 11:51 AM on June 19, 2017 [12 favorites]

Is there anything preventing folks in the bullshit "gaggles" from secretly recording audio then dumping it anonymously? Seems like any journalists worth their salt should be trying to do just that.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:52 AM on June 19, 2017 [14 favorites]

There is a suppression of information going on at this WH that would not be tolerated at a city council mtg or press conf with a state gov.

Like there are sunshine laws and open meeting laws that require better public access to information than this. Gah, so frustrating!
posted by wenestvedt at 11:54 AM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Is there anything preventing folks in the bullshit "gaggles" from secretly recording audio then dumping it anonymously? Seems like any journalists worth their salt should be trying to do just that.

Because it wouldn't be just the journo's neck on the line. You would find your entire news organization persona non grata in the White House.
posted by Talez at 11:54 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

There is nothing the Trump administration would like more than the press no longer showing up.

Why, though? They are already not answering question. They are already blatantly bullshitting. They are already forbidding cameras. Why not take a stand? Aren't the press just normalizing this shitshow of a "press conference" at this point? Call them out at least. Print: WHITE HOUSE WON'T ANSWER every time Spicer evades.

The administration is getting away with it. Their press conferences are as fake as the stacks of papers on Trump's desk. Might as well replace Spicer with an animatronic robot from Disneyland.
posted by lydhre at 11:55 AM on June 19, 2017 [13 favorites]

Democrats policy of refusing to aid challengers to Republican leadership.

They're just worried that if they kick out Paul Ryan in 2018 they'll get a challenger in the form of up and coming Democrat star Raul Pyan in CA's 12th.

I mean it worked to get a Republican elected in CA's 17th.
posted by Talez at 11:57 AM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

T.D. Strange: This is horseshit and the problem. The DCCC won't enter races that aren't gift wrapped with a bow, even now ahead of what could potentially be a historic swing opportunity. Rob Zerban put up 43% against Ryan in 2014, with no help. Ryan's district is PVI R+5, 1 point less Republican leaning than Georgia-6th where Osseff is polling even or better. Ryan's district is exactly the type of district that should be winnable in a wave election, but has been declared off limits for over a decade by the Democrats policy of refusing to aid challengers to Republican leadership.

I regret that I have but one fantastic flag to give. In my more cynical moments, which have been more frequent since November, I think of the DCCC not so much as "helping Democrats get elected" but "feeding trough for consultants to gorge on wealthy donor money, and very little else."

We desperately need a rerun of Howard Dean's 50-state strategy and the DCCC is not going to give it to us. I would rather donate directly to candidates or at least to organizations that promote this.
posted by Rosie M. Banks at 11:58 AM on June 19, 2017 [18 favorites]

At least a few conservatives are actually still principled. The silence from the NRA has been quite deafening.

I was surprised this weekend when my visiting youngest, very conservative brother expressed outrage, not only at the Castile verdict, but also at several instances of police brutally killing innocent civilians in his home state of New Mexico. I was pleasantly surprised that we now have a political issue we can unite on.
posted by Mental Wimp at 12:00 PM on June 19, 2017 [14 favorites]

The silence from the NRA has been quite deafening.

When you accept that the NRA is an industry-run, hard-right white supremacist organization wrapped in 2A clothing, you'll understand why they are silent. They don't care about gun owners or gun rights. They only care about gun sales and, to a lesser extent, white people. That's it. That's all they have been since the 1977 Cincinnati Revolt.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 12:00 PM on June 19, 2017 [59 favorites]

The question is whether Spicer won't do briefings on-camera so his boss can't watch them on TV.
posted by zachlipton at 12:09 PM on June 19, 2017 [15 favorites]

I imagine more than one reporter is already secretly recording, but not releasing anything until something comes up that's explosive enough to warrant the likely punitive blowback from the administration.

And given where we are and how many explosions we've had already, I'm not sure where anyone could set their bar for "explosive enough to warrant the risk."
posted by scaryblackdeath at 12:14 PM on June 19, 2017 [9 favorites]

At least a few conservatives are actually still principled. The silence from the NRA has been quite deafening.

Trump is a forge. No force in American politics has more neatly cleaved the hacks and the power-hungry from the idealists who actually believe in what they argue. There aren't many of them, but there are a few, and my opinion of them has grown dramatically (while still strongly disagreeing with their policy proposals).

McMullin, Sasse, Flake, Amash, Romney, a few others. A few more pundits who don't need to worry about elections. Rick Wilson, Jennifer Rubin, George Will, even Bill Kristol (to my utter astonishment).

If there's another Republican president after the indictments and the prison terms, I bet it'll come from that small group (or someone that doesn't yet hold office).
posted by leotrotsky at 12:15 PM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

Could someone record & dump the audio? Probably, at some cost. But the bigger issue is that they shouldn't have to.

The so-called "liberal media" is far to accommodating of attempts to limit its power. For example, on NPR, one routinely hears "so-and-so declined an interview, but said in a statement ..." Hold on! A statement, which isn't able to be challenged by follow up questions, should not be given the same weight as the sources that are willing to go on record and be challenged by the reporter.

Let me put on my editor hat: "So-and-so declined to be interviewed for this story." NPR fulfilled their journalistic obligations by giving so-and-so the opportunity to respond, and if they decline, to report as such. News organizations are not obligated to air so-and-so's statement unchallenged.
posted by Gelatin at 12:19 PM on June 19, 2017 [25 favorites]

The Hill: White House declines to say directly that Trump has confidence in Rosenstein

"The president has confidence in everyone who serves in this administration,” press secretary Sean Spicer said when asked by a reporter if Trump has confidence in Rosenstein.

Spicer added that every political appointee “serves at the pleasure of the president.”
…
Spicer noted on Monday that while the authority lies with the deputy attorney general to fire Mueller, all political appointees in the government ultimately report to Trump.

“Is he reserving the right to fire everyone down the line?” a reporter asked.

“The way it works is that if you’re appointed to serve at the pleasure of the president, then you serve at the pleasure of the president,” Spicer said.

The reporter asked Spicer if Trump would keep firing Justice Department employees until he found someone willing to replace Mueller.

“That’s a hypothetical question,” Spicer responded. “The bottom line is I answered a question as to how the system is set up.”

holy shit, these clowns really think they can pull "nice investigation you got going on here, pity if if caught fire" on mueller.
posted by murphy slaw at 12:19 PM on June 19, 2017 [26 favorites]

Ok. So forget the DCCC since it seems like they are primarily focused on the House Unless I'm not understanding their site correctly.

That being said, it's really a receptive contact with the DNC: Democrats.org we need to find who will listen to suggestions, feedback and answer questions, and not just tell us to volunteer and network locally because how the hell do we know any info is actually travellling up & down the chain?

The secretary perhaps? (Jason Rae)

I shall send out a message in a bottle & let you guys know what I find.
posted by yoga at 12:20 PM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

I still think Jay Rosen has it right - send the interns. It's irresponsible not to show for briefings, however much they likely will be BS. But there's no reason to send seasoned professionals. Aim them at places with actual news.

As far as "just record and release it," an argument could potentially be made that you're violating wiretapping rules. It's a stupid argument, mind, but you can only lean on the fact that DC is a one party consent state if you're a party to the conversation. So if you record Reporter X and Spicey talking and you're not one of them you don't have that to lean on. So now the WH could start up their victim whining and threaten a suit that never happens (or happens and is likely tossed, but it's not exactly the same as a public place so who knows?) in order to make their conflict with you the story.

That's not really in any news media's interest. It's wrestling with the pig and doing something that you can reasonably assume would make you part of the story, which should be a no-no.
posted by phearlez at 12:21 PM on June 19, 2017 [11 favorites]

Don't tell Trump the US turned the Panama Canal over to Panama in 1999.

I'm anticipating an early-morning tweet, "America must be paid MORE for the beautiful canals it provides! Panama was a ONE-SIDED deal, maybe it's time to CLOSE the canal until Panama pays its FAIR SHARE?"
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:22 PM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

Rick Wilson, Jennifer Rubin, George Will, even Bill Kristol (to my utter astonishment).

...Jonah Goldberg, too. I don't think it's an accident that many of Trump's fiercest critics on the right happen to be Jewish.

They've seen this shtick before.
posted by leotrotsky at 12:22 PM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

holy shit, these clowns really think they can pull "nice investigation you got going on here, pity if if caught fire" on mueller.

...I hope it doesn't catch fire.

"...because if you say hope, they can't convict a husband and wife for the same crime!"
"Yeah, that's not true. At all."
posted by leotrotsky at 12:24 PM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

There aren't many of them, but there are a few, and my opinion of them has grown dramatically (while still strongly disagreeing with their policy proposals).

Sasse and Flake have voted more than 95% of the time with Trump, 100% when their votes could have been the difference in something or someone passing. That's a higher percentage than John "Quite Troubled" McCain and Lindsey "Very Concerned" Graham.
posted by Etrigan at 12:27 PM on June 19, 2017 [30 favorites]

Sass and Flake is a pretty accurate descriptor then
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:31 PM on June 19, 2017 [24 favorites]

roomthreeseventeen: "Who or what is Karen H? Where can I vote for her now? Why doesn't he give more information?"

HAS ALL MY WORK BEEN FOR NOTHING
posted by Chrysostom at 12:41 PM on June 19, 2017 [88 favorites]

Pittsburgh MeFi-ites: Pat Toomey's Pittsburgh office seems to have accidentally left the phones on today. Couldn't get a human being, but at least got voicemail. (412) 803-3501.
posted by tonycpsu at 12:47 PM on June 19, 2017 [17 favorites]

Maybe this doesn't belong here but yikes.

Syria conflict: Russia issues warning after US coalition downs jet
Russia has warned the US-led coalition fighting in Syria that it will view its aircraft as targets, after a Syrian military plane was shot down on Sunday.

The coalition said the Syrian Su-22 had bombed US-backed fighters battling so-called Islamic State in Raqqa province.

Russia, the Syrian government's main ally, also said it was halting communications with the US aimed at preventing such incidents.
Syria's army said the "flagrant attack" would have "dangerous repercussions".

It comes at a time when the US-led coalition and the fighters it is supporting on the ground attempt to oust IS militants from the city of Raqqa, the de facto capital of the "caliphate" they proclaimed in 2014.

From the BBC.
posted by Bella Donna at 12:58 PM on June 19, 2017 [3 favorites]

Megyn Kelly's Alex Jones interview a ratings flop

Even better, she lost to a rerun of America's Funniest Home Videos. Because who wouldn't rather watch someone's kid fall down for the second time.
posted by octobersurprise at 1:00 PM on June 19, 2017 [21 favorites]

Is anyone else worried that Jared Kushner's legal problems will undermine his ability to solve the Israel/Palestine conflict
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:03 PM on June 19, 2017 [43 favorites]

Agh, I just realised Trump assigned that job to Jared because someone briefed him on Israel and he thought "Hey, I know a Jew!". It's similar to what happened when someone briefed him on Urban Development. If anyone is aware that relevant qualifications are unnecessary to be assigned great power, it is our President.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:03 PM on June 19, 2017 [24 favorites]

Exceptional_Hubris: "Holy crap that Randy Bryce ad is awesome - does anyone with more local knowledge than I have know how he and David Yankovich (a dem activist who moved from OH to WI to oppose ryan) might work together/against one another?"

I can't claim special knowledge, but we saw a unity pledge in the VA governor race, and I believe we've already heard that from leading candidates for the FL governor race. I think in this environment, we're going to see a lot of, "Disappointed I didn't win the nomination, but I will do everything possible to help candidate X win!"
posted by Chrysostom at 1:05 PM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

This "searching for a new press secretary" story seems to come up about every two weeks. I'll believe it when I see it.
posted by zachlipton at 1:11 PM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

“No, most likely the primary control knob is the ocean waters and this environment that we live in.”

I wonder what he thinks the word environment means
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 1:13 PM on June 19, 2017 [12 favorites]

This "searching for a new press secretary" story seems to come up about every two weeks.

That's because it's a curse that must be willingly accepted by another before it can be lifted.
posted by octobersurprise at 1:16 PM on June 19, 2017 [18 favorites]

Martosko and Ingraham are the same names (along with Jason Miller) that were raised as possible press secretary candidates during the first week of December last year.
posted by zarq at 1:17 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

I am a broken person so I am watching a livestream of the Senate. Schumer is speaking. Go get em, Chuck!!!
posted by prefpara at 1:17 PM on June 19, 2017 [5 favorites]

Reminder: Dems going all in on withholding consent, starting tonight.
posted by Chrysostom at 1:18 PM on June 19, 2017 [55 favorites]

Martosko and Ingraham are the same names (along with Jason Miller) that were raised as possible press secretary candidates during the first week of December last year.

Being raised as possible press secretary candidates has to be a lot more traumatic than being raised as wolves, right?
posted by OverlappingElvis at 1:18 PM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

They keep using Twitter's character limit to justify Trump not making any sense or saying something stupid. Like the poor guy doesn't have access to any other means of communication where he could explain himself more clearly.

Trump's fans use a whole bunch of excuses to justify Trump not making any sense or saying something stupid, or, more generally, being an astonishingly incompetent leader. If you have the stomach for reading any more of those endless articles that try to *explore the feelz* of Trump voters, you'll see the inevitable narrative taking hold:

- Trump is an outsider
- dammit, he's new at this
- the DC insiders aren't giving him a chance to do his job
- why can't you cut him a break so he can do his job
- he was gonna clean this town up but they keep hitting him below the belt with crazy accusations

As evidence of Trump's incompetence and criminality becomes more and more obvious, his base has to double down and quadruple down and octuple down, moving farther away from the real world to maintain the MAGA fantasy. As far as the Russia investigation is concerned, it's an update of the same old question: Who will you choose to believe? Donald Trump, FOX News, Limbaugh, and Gingrich, or the CIA and the Department of Justice? You're gonna have to pick one version of reality or the other, because the two are now totally irreconcilable.
posted by Vic Morrow's Personal Vietnam at 1:19 PM on June 19, 2017 [44 favorites]

Re. the young Muslim killed in Virginia: Fairfax County police believe it was road rage.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 1:21 PM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Schumer not disappointing so far. He's repeatedly saying that Rs are hiding their bill from everyone because they're ashamed of it. And announcing that no more Mr. Nice Minority Party.
posted by prefpara at 1:22 PM on June 19, 2017 [30 favorites]

Trump's fans use a whole bunch of excuses to justify Trump not making any sense or saying something stupid, or, more generally, being an astonishingly incompetent leader.

See also the excuses made by every cult ever when the apocalypse doesn't arrive as prophesized.
posted by octobersurprise at 1:24 PM on June 19, 2017 [13 favorites]

his base has to double down and quadruple down and octuple down, moving farther away from the real world to maintain the MAGA fantasy

It's not obstruction of justice because the US flags in Comey's office were fringed, meaning he could technically only investigate crimes at sea.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:24 PM on June 19, 2017 [41 favorites]

That's because it's a curse that must be willingly accepted by another before it can be lifted.

Shit follows
posted by Existential Dread at 1:28 PM on June 19, 2017 [10 favorites]

The only people I can imagine wanting Sean Spicer's job are people who plan to stay a few months and then spin it into a publicity boost for their antique gold coin infomercials or suchlike. Maybe Sarah Huckabee Sanders could get her dad to interview?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:32 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

meaning he could technically only investigate crimes at sea.

Well there are still a lot of questions about that time Robert Mercer's yacht wound up next to Dmitri Rybolovlev's...
posted by zachlipton at 1:33 PM on June 19, 2017 [8 favorites]

um, Trump (or probably Scavino; Trump always takes like 10 minutes between tweets) tweeted and then deleted a plug for "Karen Handle." That's not how it's spelled.
posted by zachlipton at 1:37 PM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

Schumer not disappointing so far. He's repeatedly saying that Rs are hiding their bill from everyone because they're ashamed of it.

Republicans don't have shame. Republicans are hiding the bill because their own constituents will hate it. Which reveals their own vulnerability, and as long as they keep the secrecy, Democrats should make all kinds of claims about it taking away coverage, pre-existing condition protections, et freaking cetera, and when Republicans deny it, throw back that they could prove the Democrats wrong, and won't.

It's interesting that the Republicans still seem willing to risk that once the tax cuts are a fair accompli, it'll be worth their voters hating the changes to the law.
posted by Gelatin at 1:41 PM on June 19, 2017 [11 favorites]

Ingraham hangs out with Nazis and snaps Seig Heils on the regs, so I'm sure that would go well.
posted by Artw at 1:41 PM on June 19, 2017 [3 favorites]

I'm imagining Karen Handel's campaign manager right now trying desperately to locate some way to contact the White House to tell them to STOP ENDORSING HIS CANDIDATE
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:41 PM on June 19, 2017 [21 favorites]

I'm imagining Karen Handel's campaign manager right now trying desperately to locate some way to contact the White House to tell them to STOP ENDORSING HIS CANDIDATE

I'm hoping Ossoff's campaign manager is cutting ads about Trump's endorsement of Handel right now.
posted by Gelatin at 1:44 PM on June 19, 2017 [10 favorites]

It's interesting that the Republicans still seem willing to risk that once the tax cuts are a fair accompli, it'll be worth their voters hating the changes to the law.

The tax cuts are the point. Most of them don't care if they get voted out after that, because they will have accomplished what they were elected to do, cut taxes on their billionaire masters. Democrats go to Washington to bring people healthcare, or pass gun control, or save the environment, Republicans go only to cut taxes. That's all. And just like Democrats thought they'd done a job to be proud of even after many of them lost their seats over Obamacare, Republicans losing their seats over tax cuts will boast about it for the rest of their long careers as lobbyists and FOX news "consultants".

Only Mitch McConnell might feel the pain of losing his power, because he lives to amass control more than to cut taxes, and to him its probably a real struggle whether to burn his unexpected position for tax cuts rather than voter suppression to keep it for forever, although he's scheming for both.
posted by T.D. Strange at 1:48 PM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

BBC: Otto Warmbier, US student sent home from N Korea, dies
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 1:50 PM on June 19, 2017

Most of them don't care if they get voted out after that...

At which point, we'll fund medicare-for-all by levying new taxes. This is the thing that drives me batty - if you torpedo your party by giving the base what it wants, the next cycle will take it all away, assholes.
posted by eclectist at 1:54 PM on June 19, 2017

Otto Warmbier, US student sent home from N Korea, dies

.

Serious question: Can Warmbier's family e.g. sue the State Department for wrongful death under the argument that the dept. didn't do enough to bring him home?
posted by 0xFCAF at 1:54 PM on June 19, 2017

Serious question: Can Warmbier's family e.g. sue the State Department for wrongful death under the argument that the dept. didn't do enough to bring him home?

the State Department has a traveler warning on their website that pretty much discourages travel for the likelihood of exactly this type of thing. so, at first blush, i would say no, tragic as this may be, he went there, broke a law, and paid the consequence.
posted by OHenryPacey at 1:59 PM on June 19, 2017 [3 favorites]

WSJ: Senate GOP Plans Health-Care Vote Next Week
Politco: Sources: Senate GOP prepared for Obamacare repeal vote next week

its(maybe)happening.gif
posted by zachlipton at 2:07 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Such a timeline would mean Republicans would have about a week to review text of a bill to repeal the 2010 health care law.

Is there going to be a CBO score? I was told that was essentially required in the Senate...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:14 PM on June 19, 2017

The WSJ report says that there'll be a CBO score "early next week." Of course, they're still arguing about what will be in the bill, so it's not clear to me what will be scored, but there you go.
posted by zachlipton at 2:16 PM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

Is there going to be a CBO score? I was told that was essentially required in the Senate...

Yes, there's reports that a/the Senate bill has already been submitted to the CBO in secret. Republicans plan to put it on the floor as soon as the have the score, then vote it through 36 hours later. Although there was also talk of putting a dummy, blank, bill up for the 36 hours, then replacing the text entirely with McConnell's final amendment, and voting that into law with only minutes of public viewing for the actual text. So, who the fuck knows. Nothing about this is normal.
posted by T.D. Strange at 2:20 PM on June 19, 2017 [25 favorites]

Is the blank bill going to receive a CBO score? It can't be deficit neutral; someone has to pay for the paper.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:23 PM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

Serious question: Can Warmbier's family e.g. sue the State Department for wrongful death under the argument that the dept. didn't do enough to bring him home?

Maybe you recall the Clinton email "scandal" during the last election. One of the "scandals" Republicans uncovered in the email dump was when Bill Clinton asked the Hillary State Department for expedited passports to North Korea through an official of the Clinton Foundation. The request to the State Department was denied but nevertheless Bill Clinton managed to go to North Korea alone and successfully negotiate the release of two journalists.

And for his efforts, the Republicans managed to turn it into a campaign scandal because he asked for passports from the State Department run by Hillary.

So fuck the Republicans and their hand wringing about North Korea. No good deed goes unpunished.
posted by JackFlash at 2:28 PM on June 19, 2017 [60 favorites]

Although there was also talk of putting a dummy, blank, bill up for the 36 hours, then replacing the text entirely with McConnell's final amendment, and voting that into law with only minutes of public viewing for the actual text. So, who the fuck knows. Nothing about this is normal.

There is this tweet that is going around (its an image, so I can't easily copy/paste it) that lays out this process. Note they do say it will need a CBO score even if they do it as a last minute amendment. What that score will be is anyone's guess.

It reads like a conspiracy theory, but, yeah who the fuck knows.
posted by anastasiav at 2:34 PM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

Fellow New York State residents: please take a moment tomorrow to call your state Senator to ask them to support S6176, a bipartisan bill that ensures that women incarcerated in the state have access to menstrual supplies. The GOP leaders are dragging their feet and advocacy groups are asking people to contact the GOP bill sponsor Betty Little (518-455-2811) and Majority Leader John Flanagan (518-455-2071) to demand that it be voted on this session (which ends this week). If you have a moment, please make some calls!
posted by melissasaurus at 2:37 PM on June 19, 2017 [34 favorites]

My Texas senators, useless bags of sentient slime that they are, are apparently getting a high call volume. Along with my fellow Texans I know I'm basically just telling them I SEE YOU, ASSHOLES because I have zero hope they will cease be anything but useless bags of sentient slime. But hey, for what it's worth, they've been told.
posted by emjaybee at 2:38 PM on June 19, 2017 [30 favorites]

Yes, there's reports that a/the Senate bill has already been submitted to the CBO in secret. Republicans plan to put it on the floor as soon as the have the score, then vote it through 36 hours later. Although there was also talk of putting a dummy, blank, bill up for the 36 hours, then replacing the text entirely with McConnell's final amendment, and voting that into law with only minutes of public viewing for the actual text.

This is traducing representative democracy to a level far beyond farce. The GOP is an illegitimate organisation at every level. If this model is going to be repeated, then the only thing standing between the US and autocracy is how far the courts will defend the Constitution.
posted by Devonian at 2:41 PM on June 19, 2017 [50 favorites]

Yes, there's reports that a/the Senate bill has already been submitted to the CBO in secret. Republicans plan to put it on the floor as soon as the have the score, then vote it through 36 hours later. Although there was also talk of putting a dummy, blank, bill up for the 36 hours, then replacing the text entirely with McConnell's final amendment, and voting that into law with only minutes of public viewing for the actual text.

The best part will be when all the Republicans start saying that they never got a chance to read it once the backlash starts. It will turn out that no one is responsible for it and it is just one of those things that happen.
posted by srboisvert at 2:49 PM on June 19, 2017 [32 favorites]

So, it turns out the AHCA is terrible in eats I hadn't considered:
(ANGELA MITROPOULOS, The New Inquiry)
Seen in this light, the tax cut is not simply a billionaire giveaway. It is part of an evangelical campaign for the restoration of a conditional, paternal philanthropy that runs contrary to the principle of unqualified access to health care that is represented by the ACA’s inclusion of people with “pre-existing conditions” in the insurance markets it regulated.
posted by Kitty Stardust at 2:50 PM on June 19, 2017 [18 favorites]

anyone else watching cspan senate dems right now? i'm confused. they're asking for unanimous consent, then getting an objection from... mcconnell?

how long can they keep this up?
posted by waitangi at 3:11 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

I don't believe the Senate bill can be submitted to the CBO in secret. What has been happening is the Republicans have been getting input from the CBO piecemeal on various aspects they are considering, so their expectation is that it won't take the CBO the usual 2 weeks to score the whole thing as they have been looking at bits of it in dribs and drabs already.

The "put a blank bill up for 36 hours then vote the real text in as a final amendment" thing bothers me a hell of a lot more; that's so anti-democratic it is stunning. Anyone who goes along with such a tactic has proven themselves unfit to serve the country.
posted by Justinian at 3:14 PM on June 19, 2017 [51 favorites]

It was unanimous consent to send the bill to committee (according to my twitter feed) so McConnell is basically objecting and going to put that to a vote I guess which Rs will cheerfully vote NO on to continue writing the bill in secret.
posted by TwoWordReview at 3:18 PM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

Also, I'm so glad Preet Bharara went after Mensch. She is obviously either a kook or an agent provocateur intended to make the left look bad. Possibly both.
posted by Justinian at 3:19 PM on June 19, 2017 [14 favorites]

Rep. Jacky Rosen just declared to run against Dean Heller, who just polled at 39-46 vs Generic Democrat. Think about that Trumpcare vote Dean.
posted by T.D. Strange at 3:20 PM on June 19, 2017 [21 favorites]

thanks TWW and J, i just popped into cspan and went HUH?
posted by waitangi at 3:22 PM on June 19, 2017

I am tuning in and out of the Senate livestream. Cory Booker is speaking now... I want to like him, but find him profoundly unimpressive. Whatever, why am I being a negative Nancy? Keep it up, Dems!!!
posted by prefpara at 3:24 PM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Here's a fun video of McConnell refusing to give more than 10 hours to Senators to read and amend the bill. Am I using "fun" right?
posted by prefpara at 3:29 PM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

NPR fulfilled their journalistic obligations

*derisive snort*
Yeah around the time Pee Wee's Playhouse went off the air.
*returns to perusing Mudhoney liner notes*

If this model is going to be repeated, then the only thing standing between the US and autocracy is how far the courts will defend the Constitution.

So, kind of a good-news / bad-news thing there . . .
posted by petebest at 3:32 PM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

Turns out that Mark Corallo, one of Trump's lawyers, liked to take shots at Trump on Twitter and praised Mueller. In other Trump lawyer news, the Daily Beast did some hardhitting reporting: Trump’s Lawyer Jay Sekulow Has A Band. It's Terrible.

National Treasure Charlie Pierce: The White House Press, Like Other D.C. Institutions, Is Broken

For all its prestige, the White House beat is a thankless, merciless job. Russell Baker famously called it "strange and airless." And that's when the president is a relatively sane, relatively stable career politician. Now, it's like being a fireman in Hell. What I hear from the folks I know who have this job now is remarkably similar to what I heard from those poor wretches indentured to cover the New York Yankees during the Steinbrenner-Martin Era. You're never off-duty. Your life is wholly controlled by the whims and moods and temporary enthusiasms of a deeply unstable man—or, in the case of the Yankees, two deeply unstable men. Your primary sources are people who are either terrified or beaten into dull submission, and who are, in any case, even more tied to the instability at the center of things than you are. It's a beehive with a cannibal ruler at its heart.

A man wrote a letter to the editor of the Missoulian in which he says "Greg Gianforte emulated Jesus by assaulting Ben Jacobs," invoking Jesus throwing "the money changers out of the temple." It's almost like this guy is trying to say something about Ben Jacobs' religion, but I just can't quite put my finger on it. I'm sure he's sitting at home real proud of the subtlety of his anti-Semitism though.

how long can they keep this up?

They'll keep it up until late tonight as a protest, and video of Schumer battling with McConnell (worth watching!) is always a good thing. It's a good stunt, and it means they're finally trying to get some public attention for what's happening here, but there's frankly not a lot they can do to stop the train. If nothing else, it's a way for Dems to force Republicans to put their treachery on the record.
posted by zachlipton at 3:32 PM on June 19, 2017 [36 favorites]

From the Politico story:

“Spicer should be elevated, and if he’s not, I would not blame him for leaving,” said the White House official. “The president owes him this much for all he’s done for him. Sean is indispensable, and I think the president knows that.”

What does he do? --, I thought he simply says "no comment" or repeats stuff that the president told him to say -- doesn't sound super advanced work, hmmmmm.. If I were more cynical than I thankfully am, I would almost be tempted to think they are unequivocally referring to him lying so much!
posted by rainy at 3:50 PM on June 19, 2017

Is there a source or any support for that tweet that's going around? If it's true, this is a pitchforks-and-torches-level offense.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 3:52 PM on June 19, 2017

Well, y'see, Gianforte thought Jacobs might be a leper, so he was just trying to slam the demons out of him...
posted by delfin at 3:56 PM on June 19, 2017

Flynn didn’t disclose role in Saudi deal with Russians, congressional letter says
(Matthew Schofield / McClatchy)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 4:19 PM on June 19, 2017 [22 favorites]

selling nuclear tech to the saudis on behalf of the russians? what in the everlivin fuck is fucking wrong with him?

flynn is such a stupid stupid bad bad bad bad stupid person and trump just loves the shit out of him for some reason.
posted by localhuman at 4:30 PM on June 19, 2017 [9 favorites]

NYTimes Trolling Trump: The spokesperson for Trump's legal team said bad things about him on Twitter!
posted by pjenks at 4:32 PM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

trump just loves the shit out of him for some reason.

...because Flynn ~~was~~ is his KGB handler.
posted by T.D. Strange at 4:33 PM on June 19, 2017 [12 favorites]

I've been in the mood for carrot cake of late, so I'm preparing to reprise my earlier performance. The Republicans will ramrod through something, we have no idea what exactly, and it will be utterly awful.

Make no mistake, they will pass the Senate RepubliCare bill.

And if I'm wrong, I'll make a carrot cake, write those words on it, and eat them.
posted by sotonohito at 4:34 PM on June 19, 2017 [46 favorites]

Apropos of the comment above (forgive me, I'm on my phone so it'll remain unlinked) about Flynn possibly flipping on Trump:

Can anyone recommend any good sources/authors who have explored the different possible outcomes if that actually were to happen? That is, any informed takes out there on what's likely to happen if Flynn rats out Trump?
posted by Barack Spinoza at 4:39 PM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

(asking for a friend who, I assure you, is most definitely ... uh, not Trump's criminal lawyer?)
posted by Barack Spinoza at 4:45 PM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

We believe you. No way would Trump spring for the $5.
posted by leotrotsky at 4:51 PM on June 19, 2017 [30 favorites]

Trump’s Lawyer Jay Sekulow Has A Band. It's Terrible.

Not to get overly tangential, but it's a pretty solid classic rock cover band. Jim Dolan -- billionaire Cablevision heir, NY Knicks owner (argh this is hell for the longtime Knicks fan), union-buster, and POTUS supporter who pressured the Radio City Rockettes to perform as part of 45's inauguration -- funds the standard for cringeworthy vanity band projects, and these guys don't even come close to Dolan's level of awful.
posted by Lyme Drop at 4:52 PM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

I'm preparing myself for heartbreak in Georgia tomorrow.
posted by Justinian at 4:53 PM on June 19, 2017 [11 favorites]

Can anyone recommend any good sources/authors who have explored the different possible outcomes if that actually were to happen? That is, any informed takes out there on what's likely to happen if Flynn rats out Trump?

The problem is nobody knows, because it depends entirely on what exactly Flynn rats him out for, and exactly how much corroborating evidence he has to offer. There are going to be (there are!) a lot of hot takes ranging from conspiracy theory to educated guess, but the best you're going to get is still basically guesswork.
posted by Andrhia at 4:55 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Oh great. The JCPL is back in its new-and-more-pessimistic form: the Justinian Current Heartbreak Level.
posted by zachlipton at 4:57 PM on June 19, 2017 [52 favorites]

And if I'm wrong, I'll make a carrot cake, write those words on it, and eat them.

The courage of your convictions knows no bounds.
posted by Talez at 5:11 PM on June 19, 2017 [20 favorites]

Do the people responsible for authorising national security clearances not bother checking them? Because Flynn's omissions are pretty blatant and would have been obvious if his application had been cross-referenced with his tax returns. Is this normal?
posted by Joe in Australia at 5:40 PM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

There's never really been a National Security Adviser accused of collaboration with multiple other foreign intelligence services and undisclosed foreign lobbying, no. At the cabinet level, things are usually disclosed, and if something raises a flag, the nominee has enough decency to withdraw before the rank and file people who review regular security clearances for lower level appointees are put in the difficult position of denying clearance to the President's cabinet appointment and creating a national scandal.

But nothing matters now. Scandals are over. Republicans DGAF. Treason is fine. Everyone has a conflict. As long as tax cuts go through, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:46 PM on June 19, 2017 [31 favorites]

Fox News’ Bolling recommends ‘preemptive’ nuclear strike on North Korea before they hit LA

I know I'm a broken record on this, but it terrifies me that: A) people are allowed on TV that casually discuss the nuclear incineration of 25 million innocent people and B) our President listens to them.
posted by bluecore at 5:51 PM on June 19, 2017 [63 favorites]

I know I'm a broken record on this, but it terrifies me that: A) people are allowed on TV that casually discuss the nuclear incineration of 25 million innocent people and B) our President listens to them.

I personally also find it terrifying that C) a large minority of the population don't actually look at some of these statements and turn away from the sheer abhorrence of the whole bravado and accompanying spectacle.
posted by Talez at 6:00 PM on June 19, 2017 [13 favorites]

ELECTIONS NEWS

** GA-06

-- Perhaps you've heard this is tomorrow? The single most expensive House race in history? The one that's taken longer than the UK and France electing their entire governments? Lots of last minute stuff:

-- New Trafalgar poll: Handel 50.46 / Ossoff 48.59

-- New Landmark poll: Ossoff 49.0 / Handel 48.9

-- Poll averages are basically dead tied. Poll analysts basically saying *slight* edge to Ossoff, but really: toss-up.

-- Mentioned upstream - There are only 15 CDs where more than half of the adults have a college degree. Only two of them have GOP reps, GA-06 is one of them. Hillary voting was correlated with education level.

-- Mentioned upstream: GOP basically saying the Alexandria shooting is a good thing for them. Also, a PAC ran a really nasty Alexandria-themed ad, both campaigns disowned it.

-- Politco: All eyes on this race, Dems throwing everything at it.

-- The fact that Ossoff is within a hairsbreadth of winning a strong GOP district is really the story. But that said, he needs to win it, because of the impact on "the narrative" (recruitment, retirements, will people break from Trump etc.). So says Rothenberg and similar in this long 538 look. NYT says similar with focus on recruitment.

-- Ossoff pouring money into ground game.

-- Best analysis is from XKCD.

** SC-05 -- This special election is tomorrow, too! A new Change Research poll has Parnell down by 9. This district went GOP +20 in 2016, so it seems likely this is another special in a strong GOP district where Dems overperform, but can't quite pull it off.

** UT-03 -- Party conventions were this past weekend. The GOP nominated ex-state rep Chris Herrod in a bit of a surprise - he beat out state Sen and former Chaffetz campaign manager Deidre Henderson. He'll face off against Tanny Ainge and Provo mayor John Curtis in an August primary. The Dems nominated physician Kathryn Allen, who will go straight to the November general (along with a Libertarian and two independents).

** Odds & ends:

-- We actually have two MORE special elections tomorrow, both for SC State House seats. HD-48 is the seat Norman vacated to run for SC-05; went Trump +24. Also HD-70, which was Dem held, went Clinton +43.

-- New PPP poll: AHCA has minimal support in NV (31%), AK (29%), WV (35%).

-- Good writeup on Gill vs Whitford, the Wisconsin gerrymander case.

I'll be on tomorrow evening with updates on all four races!
posted by Chrysostom at 6:02 PM on June 19, 2017 [87 favorites]

Thank you, Chrysostom, and may the force be with Ossoff.
posted by lydhre at 6:08 PM on June 19, 2017 [18 favorites]

Do the people responsible for authorizing national security clearances not bother checking them? Because Flynn's omissions are pretty blatant and would have been obvious if his application had been cross-referenced with his tax returns. Is this normal?

I feel like our clearance process might need some tweaking.
posted by diogenes at 6:12 PM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

Spicey's out!
posted by leotrotsky at 6:16 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Out of what? Salsa? The window?

Forgive me, but I have looked for corroborating stories and found nothing. :(
posted by lydhre at 6:28 PM on June 19, 2017 [3 favorites]

All I see is the earlier report that he "might" resign and is interviewing toadies to replace him. So, "moving up", not fired.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 6:31 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Actually, US News and World Report is stating flatly that he's out, apparently with same facts that have others saying "looking for a replacement."
posted by msalt at 6:31 PM on June 19, 2017

From Gabrielle Levy, of the US News: Sean Spicer Out as Press Secretary

White House Press Secretary Sean Spicer will step back from giving reporters the daily press briefing and is searching for his replacement at the podium.

"We have sought input from many people as we look to expand our communications operation. As he did in the beginning, Sean Spicer is managing both the communications and press office," White House officials said in a statement Monday.

posted by vac2003 at 6:33 PM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

He's going to be deputy chief of staff. In a normal administration that would be a powerful position, but I think in this case it means Spicer is the new Meredith.
posted by EarBucket at 6:35 PM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

Trump needs a new Reek since Christie isn't in Washington. Spicer seems perfect.
posted by Justinian at 6:37 PM on June 19, 2017 [6 favorites]

I think it's safe to say that unless a position has specific statutory powers (e.g. National Security Advisor), titles mean nothing in the Trump White House.
posted by msalt at 6:38 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

So, they aren't giving the job to Huckabee Sanders?
posted by notyou at 6:42 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

I suspect Trump doesn't want to give her the job for horrible superficial reasons. I mean all his reasons tend to be horrible and superficial, but this would be additionally very misogynistic.
posted by Justinian at 6:45 PM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

What job? Has there been an on camera briefing since like last Wednesday? And that one was like 12mins of Sanders taking questions from Russia? They're just ending the press briefing entirely.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:46 PM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

Hang on, there's an important element to this news story that's gone largely unnoticed until now, specific to Trump’s Lawyer Jay Sekulow Has A Band. It's Terrible. which is that it has the former lead singer of Kansas in it. (No not that one, the one they wanted to take over as lead Christian songwriter, John Elefante.). And the guy from Petra I guess but good god - you realize they could tie this back to Livgren and then . . . It's, it's too terrible to contemplate.
posted by petebest at 6:50 PM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

But nothing matters now. Scandals are over. Republicans DGAF. Treason is fine. Everyone has a conflict. As long as tax cuts go through, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I don't even think tax cuts are the motive anymore. Putin and Trump have dirt that would ruin every one of them personally, and are using it. The J. Edgar Hoover playbook.
posted by ctmf at 7:08 PM on June 19, 2017 [8 favorites]

National Treasure Alexandra Petri, WaPo: My application to replace Sean Spicer

Sean Spicer is reportedly searching for candidates to replace himself for his daily Five Minutes of Acute Discomfort. He has, according to Politico, been reaching out to Laura Ingraham to handle the daily briefing and David Martosko of the Daily Mail to take over the job of communications director.

Before they do anything hasty, I would like to offer my application for the position. I am good at standing in an ill-fitting suit and getting indignant that people are asking me questions, as though it is somehow their fault that I am in this position.

Name: Alexandra

Are You Open To A Mean Nickname: Yes

Why Are You Seeking This Position? I want to be publicly humiliated every day by rumpled strangers for up to half an hour, but I do not want to have to go on Craigslist or explain this lifestyle to my mother.

posted by Johnny Wallflower at 7:11 PM on June 19, 2017 [66 favorites]

more time in the bushes for someone!
posted by possibly sean spicer at 7:22 PM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

Wait, Kansas is a Christian band?

no, but a couple of its front men have been notoriously so.
posted by quonsar II: smock fishpants and the temple of foon at 7:35 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

Wait, Kansas is a Christian band?

Only as retcon, but yes, Kerry Livgren has been making mostly Christian Rock since he left the band in the 80s.
posted by rhizome at 7:40 PM on June 19, 2017 [1 favorite]

In secret Obamacare repeal bill, Senate Republicans plan even harsher cuts to Medicaid than House GOP
The Senate’s idea is to allow Medicaid to grow at the rate of the overall consumer price index (specifically, the CPI for all urban consumers, the most commonly used variant).

That’s a much lower growth rate than the index in the American Health Care Act, which House Republicans passed in May as a measure to repeal the the Affordable Care Act. The House caps growth in the Medicaid budget at the CPI for medical care, which grows much faster.

This is effectively ending Medicaid.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:41 PM on June 19, 2017 [45 favorites]

Wait, Kansas is a Christian band?

No. Butt: founder and creative Öbergruppenfuhrer Kerry Livgren has a career-long track record of musing on spirituality and belief. From "He was more into black magic than me!" (Ronnie James Dio, RIP), to Bhuddism and ascetic practice (The Zarathustra years), to the Urantia-book-inspired Monolith album, and finally to an evangelical Christianity because sure why not. As Livgren began to write more explicitly about things Jesus, the original lead singer - the one you've heard on the radio, Steve Walsh - said Sayonara and the band found a plausible sound-alike in John Elefante. As a bonus, Elefante wrote songs too which proved timely as they decided his flair for synth-driven hard rock was just what the label ordered before his exit following the second album he made with them.

Livgren went on to found the band AD, and toured a lot of churches because CBS Records screwed him over, fearing his catchy rocking Jesus-inspired jamz would pilfer market share in the arenas Kansas was playing. He's an interesting fellow, and still riding the Jesus train so good for him.

On post: Crap! No derail, no derail, YOU'RE the derail!
posted by petebest at 7:43 PM on June 19, 2017 [20 favorites]

Rumaging around in some back issues of The New Yorker, I found this article from March 13, 2017: Donald Trump's Worst Deal which details his attempt in 2012 to help build the Trump Tower Baku in Azerbaijan, and his company's dealings with the son and brother of a "notoriously corrupt" Transport Minister. Ivanka was very involved with the project. (It never opened for *reasons* and their deal was terminated in December 2016.)

The article goes into great detail about the dodgy finances of the failed enterprise and mentions other Trump Organization projects around the world but what struck me was this paragraph:

Wrage pointed out that corrupt government leaders often use their children... to distance themselves from illicit projects. Such an official creates a company in the relative’s name which appears to be independent but is controlled by the official.

To lessen the likelihood of an F.C.P.A.* violation when working with a company that is owned by a child... of a government minister, Wrage told me, “you’d need to show that the child has real expertise, real ability to do the work.” Otherwise, Wrage said, “the assumption is that they are a partner entirely because of their ability to use their parent’s power.”

So the US Government has a law which inhibits our companies from doing business with the offspring of foreign government leaders but there's no corresponding law that prevents foreign businesses from doing deals with the offspring of questionable expertise and ability belonging to our leader.

*The Foreign Corrupt Practices Act, passed in 1977, forbade American companies from participating in a scheme to reward a foreign government official in exchange for material benefit or preferential treatment.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 7:47 PM on June 19, 2017 [17 favorites]

I've sort of had this notion, as a Rhode Island parochialist, that Gina Raimundo could have an actual shot at 2020.

Tonight, I sort of looked at her campaign commercial where she promised to bring back the beer, and she has gone beyond the "1,000" jobs into another zero now that she is Governor and the main brewery and bottling operation is in Pawtucket as of this year.

Then I watched her fending off a lion's den of rabid pro-business B-School attendees with an open mic eager to learn her secrets to eviscerating unions! She's like Obama, in that she can read the room without selling herself out, but with the added benefit of no "Umm..."

And her message was simple, well understood, and voted upon by Union members hereabouts - "It's Math, not Politics" which wouldn't have played so well if she didn't make her first point "Be honest above all else. There's not enough honesty in Politics." As State Treasurer she was painfully honest with her foes at the other end of the table. Also now as Gub'nah.

You know her entire PR team was telling her not to tweet this... well. We live in the Age of Trump! Gina Raimundo released this raw and unpolished tweet!

(The Car Tax is hard to explain, but the gist of it? Live in a poor city or mill-town? You have to pay thousands of dollars a year to keep your '04 PT Cruiser on the road. Rich suburbs? Pennies. Register your car at your Winter Home in FL (Old joke since the car-tax - What's Providence's largest southern suburb? (A is really Warwick) A - FLORIDA!

Also here's a home video at a blue-collar suburb of Providence on College Tuition, if you have not been feeling the Bern lately....

Note - She's from Nawf Smiffield, plus she's been to Oxford. The R has been hammered back in. At that Highschool Commencement? Where she kinda doesn't give a crap about diction? That's what Aquidneck Islanders sound like. We pronounce our "r's" all fancy-like.

So. Yeah. When they say the D bench is too shallow, when they say the Third Way cannot be reconciled with the Progressives. Know that it is baloney, and probably Russian agitprop.

I like Gina Raimundo. I know there are more like her. 2020 is ours, so long as we fight our way to the polls!

And it will be a fight.
posted by Slap*Happy at 9:15 PM on June 19, 2017 [24 favorites]

I don't know. She's only pulling a 48% approval rating in her own state. And Rhode Island's government is notoriously corrupt, which you prefer not to have tailing you, even if you are clean (not that that stopped Chris Christie from running).
posted by Chrysostom at 9:29 PM on June 19, 2017 [2 favorites]

At the desk
Drawing pictures
Of skyscrapers
With him on top
Golden toilets
Arms raised in a V
Dead lay in pools of maroon blood

Daddy didn't give attention
To the fact that mommy didn't care
King Donald the wicked
Ruled his world

Jared spoke in class today

This shit practically writes itself.
posted by jferg at 9:29 PM on June 19, 2017 [23 favorites]

I don't know. She's only pulling a 48% approval rating in her own state. And Rhode Island's government is notoriously corrupt

One of the reasons her rating is so low is that she is emphatically, provably incorruptible, and in addition to the ire of the local GOP, she is in low esteem with her own party because she just won't play ball, already. It will soar once the public gets a load of her primary opponents and the GOP contenders for '18.
posted by Slap*Happy at 9:35 PM on June 19, 2017 [7 favorites]

I'm really hoping Ossoff wins tomorrow or else I'll have to keep watching this uplifting Kansas video to provide some sense of meaning. It's probably the best music video ever created.
posted by perhapses at 9:58 PM on June 19, 2017 [4 favorites]

WTF? Sen. Joe Manchin is bragging about how he signed a pledge not to ever campaign against any of his Senate colleagues, not fundraise against them, etc... What an utterly stupid idea to just give up on the idea of taking back the Senate ever before the campaign even starts.

Also, WaPo: In Trump’s Washington, public business increasingly handled behind closed doors.
posted by zachlipton at 10:35 PM on June 19, 2017 [12 favorites]

A spot of good news from my city of Rockville, Maryland tonight (yes, that Rockville yt of song): after months of contentious public input, the mayor and council have voted 3-2 to adopt an ordinance that will prohibit city staff (including the police department) from asking about immigration status, discriminating on the basis of immigration or citizenship status, and honoring ICE detainer requests in most cases. I've been working on this for months with fellow activists, and in the large scheme of things it's a small win, but DAMN IT, it's a win.

A tip of the hat to you from just up the road in fellow sanctuary city Baltimore. No matter what goes on around us, Maryland's gonna Maryland. It's the least we can do in a country gone mad.
posted by CommonSense at 11:00 PM on June 19, 2017 [16 favorites]

Can anybody confirm whether true that tweet about the Senate's AHCA being blank paper until like two hours before the vote?

'Cause if true, that's all kinds of fucked up. And I'm using the 2017 scale of fucked-up-ness
posted by angrycat at 1:33 AM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

WTF? Sen. Joe Manchin is bragging about how he signed a pledge not to ever campaign against any of his Senate colleagues, not fundraise against them, etc... What an utterly stupid idea to just give up on the idea of taking back the Senate ever before the campaign even starts.

I'd say this is about David Yankovich starting to gather some word of mouth in going up against Paul Ryan next year, but that's the House. What could possibly motivate this?
posted by rhizome at 2:21 AM on June 20, 2017

He's one of the most endangered Democratic senators. He's not likely to be called upon to campaign for other Senators since he's not super popular, and signing the pledge makes it harder for Republican senators to campaign against him. It's just a cost/benefit analysis.
posted by Justinian at 3:20 AM on June 20, 2017 [17 favorites]

I'm very sorry fellow MeFi's, but I have been telling my other half for months that Ossoff will not win in GA. Our voting systems are hacked all the way down to dogcatcher races, to make them appear close, tease with a win for the Good Guys/Gals, and then yank it at the last second. It's the fucking election process that is systemically poisoned - technologically and mechanically.

I will eat cilantro if I am wrong. I really, really hate cilantro with the white hot heat of a trillion suns.

That is all.
posted by yoga at 4:56 AM on June 20, 2017 [8 favorites]

Manchin semi-openly threatened to flip parties in October when it looked like Hilary would win. He's all but a Republican already, of course he's not going to campaign against them.
posted by T.D. Strange at 4:59 AM on June 20, 2017 [6 favorites]

Here is 538's Tracking Congress In The Age Of Trump widget thingie, which is "an updating tally of how often every member of the House and the Senate votes with or against the president." You can rank senators based on various criteria, one of which is how often a senator votes in line with Trump's position, and another which is how often a senator would be expected to vote in line with Trump's position based on Trump's margin of loss/victory in his or her state.

You can judge for yourself whether Manchin is a net positive or negative for us in West Virginia. I'm done arguing about it, you can just look at the numbers and decide.
posted by Justinian at 5:09 AM on June 20, 2017 [21 favorites]

Oh, also check out Dianne Feinstein's numbers. Perhaps our mutual disgust with her can bring us all together.
posted by Justinian at 5:11 AM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

You can judge for yourself whether Manchin is a net positive or negative for us in West Virginia.

Yeah, that "Trump Plus-Minus" number is an interesting way of looking at it. Considering how West Virginia voted, Manchin's 58.1% Trump score is impressively low.
posted by Surely This at 5:22 AM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

This is part of how the party system ruins everything in our design. It lets opportunists trade on the brand associations each party has while we pretty much ignore their individual histories and have to keep voting them in to make their parties collectively stronger in theory, then the same opportunists scuttle the agendas we voted for their party for from the inside.
posted by saulgoodman at 5:26 AM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

We're creeping up on 3000 comments in here. Anybody feeling up to crafting a new post sometime today, especially in light of the GA special election results tonight?
posted by Barack Spinoza at 5:41 AM on June 20, 2017 [6 favorites]

We're creeping up on 3000 comments in here. Anybody feeling up to crafting a new post sometime today, especially in light of the GA special election results tonight?

+1

And a request for the author of the new thread: Could you please include our usual guidelines in your post, such as spitbull's news citation and linking guideline and a reminder for folks to think of the mods and self-moderate (per the discussion in MetaTalk--refrain from sharing super-dark doomsday nightmares, repetitive derails of hot-button issues, etc.).
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 6:00 AM on June 20, 2017 [17 favorites]

then the same opportunists scuttle the agendas we voted for their party for from the inside.

Leibermanism will be with us for always.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:01 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

That 538 chart really puts Bob Casey vs. Pat Toomey (Pennsylvania's two) in stark contrast. Toomey is a spineless opportunist who pinky swore not to rubber stamp Trump because that's what he needed to say to win suburban Philadelphia votes and now is voting 95% with Trump (which was the obvious outcome for anyone who knows jack shit about Pat Toomey or Republicans in general, but there you go). Bob Casey, on the other hand, previously known as kind of a milquetoast vaguely anti-choice Democrat seems to have been forged in the fires of Trump and come out voting 27% with Trump. Expected for both is 53%.

I will be fighting hard for Casey's re-election in 2018 and I'm for sure going to print this shit out and take it with me wherever I go.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:02 AM on June 20, 2017 [36 favorites]

And a request for the author of the new thread: Could you please include our usual guidelines in your post...

Oh! Forgot to mention "take context-less liveblogging to Chat" and "please avoid single-tweet links."
posted by Sockin'inthefreeworld at 6:10 AM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

I will eat cilantro if I am wrong. I really, really hate cilantro with the white hot heat of a trillion suns.

Historically, cake has worked out better for MeFites.
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 6:11 AM on June 20, 2017 [14 favorites]

Manchin semi-openly threatened to flip parties in October when it looked like Hilary would win. He's all but a Republican already, of course he's not going to campaign against them.

I understand and share in the frustration that people here have with blue dog Democrats, and they can be a real damn monkey wrench, I know. But I live in a state that had blue dogs in Congress for generations and then flipped full Republican, and I am here to tell you that it could be far worse. I used to absolutely fucking rage against Blanche Lincoln and Mark Pryor, used to fantasize about them being run out of town on a rail. Then one day I got my wish, and what I got was John Boozman and Tom "the bobble-throated slapdick from Arkansas" Cotton.

Your frustration is real, I don't want to minimize it in any way, but it can get so. Much. Worse.
posted by middleclasstool at 6:15 AM on June 20, 2017 [39 favorites]

Today is my birthday and I have Georgia on my mind. Will it help if I request a cilantro spice cake?
posted by carmicha at 6:16 AM on June 20, 2017 [11 favorites]

Our voting systems are hacked all the way down to dogcatcher races, to make them appear close, tease with a win for the Good Guys/Gals, and then yank it at the last second. It's the fucking election process that is systemically poisoned - technologically and mechanically.

I completely understand the frustration with the systems and concerns about hacking, Russian and otherwise. But this, for lack of a better word, defeatism, is self-fulfilling. It's exactly what fascists and autocrats want, for us to feel impotent and hopeless. Because then many people won't fight back because 'there's nothing they can do.' Even if the systems are hacked, we need to keep fighting so that our majority is so big it overcomes it, because the alternative is unacceptable and literally death for millions.

Jon Ossoff may lose, but it will much more likely be because he's in a very Republican district that went R for the regular House election by 16 points 7 months ago and sent Gingrich to the House for a decade before Price. Things are bad but they're not over. A women won the popular vote pretty handily last year despite decades of demonization and Russian and FBI interference. And the two presidential election before that, a black man with a Muslim name won landslides. There are definite obstacles, even ignoring possible hacking, with voter suppression and gerrymandering, but we are the majority and we need to fight to ensure we get our voice.
posted by chris24 at 6:18 AM on June 20, 2017 [61 favorites]

Are there any GOTV phonebanks set up for Georgia? I wouldn't mind making a few calls.
posted by Faint of Butt at 6:33 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

Historically, cake has worked out better for MeFites.

I'm on a low carb diet.
posted by yoga at 6:33 AM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

Your frustration is real, I don't want to minimize it in any way, but it can get so. Much. Worse.

Don't let the fear of things getting worse prevent you from demanding that they get better.
posted by melissasaurus at 6:34 AM on June 20, 2017 [20 favorites]

New CBS poll:

Trump's approval at lowest yet: 36%

His approval has dropped 11 points among Republicans, down to 72%. Historically, bad things happen at midterms to parties with presidential approval under 80% within the party.
posted by chris24 at 6:39 AM on June 20, 2017 [36 favorites]

Uh oh. Pence found the time machine. From 2010: It's simply wrong for legislation that'll affect 100% of the American people to be negotiated behind closed doors - http://ow.ly/W9gq #hcr
posted by scalefree at 6:43 AM on June 20, 2017 [30 favorites]

Huh. Either Pence took Cornyn along with him to 2010 or he just stowed away: The people have a right to know what is happening behind closed doors with secret HC negotiations
posted by scalefree at 6:59 AM on June 20, 2017 [16 favorites]

Paige Cunningham, Washington Post:

2. The Senate measure seems poised to enact deeper Medicaid cuts than the House bill. The Senate bill is shaping up not only to convert Medicaid to a leaner per-capita funding system, but also tie its growth rate to an even slower-growing index than under the House version (the Consumer Price Index for urban consumers, instead of what's known as CPI-Medical). Conservative senators, most prominently Sen. Patrick J. Toomey (R-Pa.), love this idea.

Welp, I know what I'm calling Toomey about this morning.
posted by joyceanmachine at 7:03 AM on June 20, 2017 [14 favorites]

It's starting to look like the phone booth from Bill & Ted. Tom Price & Orrin Hatch went along for the ride to 2010 & Mitch McConnell had them drop him off in 2009.
posted by scalefree at 7:05 AM on June 20, 2017 [12 favorites]

I Think Karen Handel's Going to Win

That's the way it usually goes, right? The most reprehensible Republican ads routinely work. The Willie Horton ad. The Jesse Helms "Hands" ad. So why wouldn't this work?

The bigger issue is that even though this is a district full of highly educated voters, the kind of district in which Donald Trump ran much worse than Mitt Romney, it's still a Republican district. That means it's full of white people who've listened to nearly forty years of Democrat-bashing from Ronald Reagan, the religious right, talk radio, Fox News, and GOP elected officials and admakers. These are voters who believe the worst stereotypes of Democrats. It's an uphill battle for any Democrat to overcome those stereotypes. That Ossoff has done so even temporarily is remarkable.

For decades, heartland whites have been conditioned to despise the Democratic Party, so they nearly always believe the lowest of negative ads about Democrats, and nearly always vote for the GOP in the end. Ossoff might win, but I'll be surprised.

And I hope the Ossoff campaign can prove me wrong.

posted by tonycpsu at 7:10 AM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

I Think Karen Handel's Going to Win

Someone print this out on a cake.
posted by pxe2000 at 7:14 AM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

Called Toomey's office just now and ran into a sleepy, confused-sounding aide who, when asked why the Senator supported an inflation index for Medicaid that was even lower than the AHCA, sounded confused, and said that the bill hadn't been released yet. I asked him whether this meant that the senator was denying the report in the Washington Post, and got some flim-flam about how the staffer hadn't talked to the senator.

So I reminded the staffer that Toomey represents all Pennsylvanians, not just people who live in cities, where doctors actually make less and health care costs are generally lower than in rural areas, and pushed him to take my zip code BECAUSE THIS ASSHOLE WASN'T EVEN AWAKE ENOUGH TO ASK FOR THAT BEFORE HE TRIED TO HANG UP ON ME.

On the other hand, I had to call the Philadelphia office, the Pittsburgh office, the Harrisburg office, the Erie office, and then back to the Philadelphia office again before getting said sleepy staffer.
posted by joyceanmachine at 7:17 AM on June 20, 2017 [56 favorites]

And in other news, the US Court for the Central District of California has issued a bench warrant for noted moon law guru, self-proclaimed psychic, and conspiracy nut, Sean David Morton, following his failure to appear yesterday for a sentencing hearing. Morton was convicted in April on multiple counts of tax fraud.
posted by octobersurprise at 7:17 AM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

I know I'm a broken record on this, but it terrifies me that: A) people are allowed on TV that casually discuss the nuclear incineration of 25 million innocent people and B) our President listens to them.

It's funny how quickly the "An armed society is a polite society" rhetoric vanishes when right wingers become potential victims in a system where they can't completely rig the game.
posted by srboisvert at 7:18 AM on June 20, 2017 [12 favorites]

@MikeScarcella:
Mueller recruits Elizabeth Prelogar—from DOJ solicitor general’s office—for Russia probe http://at.law.com/T8GGsb from @Tonymauro #SCOTUS

@matthewamiller:
Fascinating. Mueller adds another appellate lawyer to his team. Another sign he's thinking several steps down the road & getting ready.
posted by chris24 at 7:20 AM on June 20, 2017 [18 favorites]

They borrowed the time machine from Sessions, who has a summer home in 1858.
posted by delfin at 7:22 AM on June 20, 2017 [46 favorites]

He's just announcing his replacement is my guess. No questions allowed, it wouldn't be fair to whoever it is. Or maybe they're pulling the trigger & there is no replacement, he's just gone.
posted by scalefree at 7:23 AM on June 20, 2017

Are there any GOTV phonebanks set up for Georgia? I wouldn't mind making a few calls.

DCCC web phonebank tool for Ossoff calls.
posted by anastasiav at 7:27 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

If Liberals Voted ... #nextthread
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:30 AM on June 20, 2017 [6 favorites]

Since Jefferson Beauregard Sessions is the IIIrd, I decided to look up for information regarding Jefferson Beauregard Sessions the Ist. He was born in Alabama on April 13, 1861. The date seemed significant, stuck in my memory. So, I checked. April 12-13 was the siege of Fort Sumter, the beginning of the Civil War.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 7:33 AM on June 20, 2017 [15 favorites]

If Liberals Voted ... #nextthread

He forgot the (For Democrats) next to it. Seeing the razor thin margins HRC lost by and the numbers for Stein makes me want to repeatedly slam my head into the wall until I forget how stupid the left can be in this country.

Rightists vote for the R every time. A certain segment of Leftists will happily vote anything but D to prove they're the smartest person in the room. Hell, the only reason we have Baker here in MA is because 70,000 "progressives" thought it would be a fucking riot to vote for Evan Falchuk and then Coakley lost by 40,000 votes.
posted by Talez at 7:35 AM on June 20, 2017 [40 favorites]

Johnny Wallflower: Re. the young Muslim killed in Virginia: Fairfax County police believe it was road rage.

FUCK. THIS. SHIT. Here in New Mexico, a man shot a four year old girl and everyone called it "road rage".

Then Darwin Martinez Torres attacked Nabra Hassanen, and they call it "road rage," even when the report includes these details:

He caught up with them a short time later in a parking lot and chased them with a baseball bat, striking 17-year-old Nabra Hassanen and then abducting her in his car, police said.

Martinez Torres assaulted Nabra a second time, in Loudoun County, before dumping her body in a pond next to his apartment complex, where it was discovered about 3 p.m. on Sunday, police said. The medical examiner ruled Monday that the girl died of blunt-force trauma to the head and neck.

Shooting someone to death is a gun-related murder -- they were killed with a gun. Torres didn't abduct, assault and murder Hassanen because he was angry in a car. This is bullshit - stop normalizing violence by calling it "road rage." Call it murder.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:38 AM on June 20, 2017 [103 favorites]

David Brooks: Let's Not Get Carried Away

I was the op-ed editor at The Wall Street Journal at the peak of the Whitewater scandal. We ran a series of investigative pieces “raising serious questions” (as we say in the scandal business) about the nefarious things the Clintons were thought to have done back in Arkansas.

Now I confess I couldn’t follow all the actual allegations made in those essays. They were six jungles deep in the weeds. But I do remember the intense atmosphere that the scandal created. A series of bombshell revelations came out in the media, which seemed monumental at the time. A special prosecutor was appointed and indictments were expected. Speculation became the national sport.

In retrospect Whitewater seems overblown.

Deadspin: David Brooks: My Judgment Is Appallingly Bad, Therefore Listen To Me

The choice I object to is the choice not to begin the next sentence with, “For this reason, I resign my post, effective immediately, and resolve myself to a life of solitude in the desert.”

Hey Dave! Eat shit!

posted by tonycpsu at 7:38 AM on June 20, 2017 [40 favorites]

David Brooks: In retrospect Whitewater seems overblown.

You don't say.

Whereas Trump has basically admitted to obstructing justice, at the very least, in a national TV interview, because he can't resist bragging. Of course Brooks carries water for the Republicans by implying there is less to Trump's corruption than meets the eye, but no sale -- what does meet the eye is plenty condemning, far beyond the bogus "raises questions" standard (translation: We'd like to imply wrongdoing but can't back up the claim).
posted by Gelatin at 7:51 AM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

Trump May Have A Lot Of Money, But Documents Show He Owes A Lot, Too (NPR, June 20, 2017)

Records released Friday suggest that Trump holds mortgages of at least $50 million on Trump Tower, the office building known as 40 Wall Street and the luxury resort Trump National Doral Miami. He also owes millions of dollars on other properties in Chicago, Florida and Washington, D.C.
...
"The banks were lined up to loan him money, did not really do due diligence. A lot of this was unsecured loans to [Trump] directly. And the banks were extremely reckless," [says Gwenda Blair, author of The Trumps: Three Generations of Builders and a President].

Many of those banks would come to regret their ties to Trump. Within a few years, large parts of Trump's financial empire came crashing down, and Trump filed for bankruptcy for the first time in 1991.

During long, contentious negotiations with Trump, bondholders were forced to take big losses on their investments. They had no choice, Blair says. Although lenders could have seized Trump's properties, they needed the Trump brand name.

"They wanted his name on the buildings, because he still had this kind of allure. So he was too big to foreclose on," Blair says.

Kind of like the GOP now.

Deutsche Bank Trust Company Americas is in talks with the federal government over various financial irregularities and faces big potential fines over its handling of mortgage-backed securities. Like other big banks, it also will be affected by Trump's vow to overhaul bank regulations.

"Here you have one of the world's largest financial institutions, Mr. Trump's principal lender, whom he owes many, many millions of dollars to, that creates a conflict that cuts across Mr. Trump's job as president, " [says former White House ethics adviser Norman Eisen, currently a fellow at the Brookings Institution.]

So Trump became President to fix his troubles with money management? Hmm, sounds plausible.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:52 AM on June 20, 2017 [35 favorites]

In any other presidency, the President loudly and enthusiastically praising a landmark bill as "incredibly well-crafted", getting it passed in the House, and then calling it "mean" to the average American, and "cold-hearted" and "a son of a bitch", would be massive news. But we are talking about Trump, so it barely registers as unusual!
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:54 AM on June 20, 2017 [28 favorites]

And a bit more awful political news to keep you motivated: Collecting LGBT Census Data Is 'Essential' To Federal Agency, Document Shows (NPR, June 20, 2017)

The U.S. Census Bureau has never asked Americans about sexual orientation and gender identity. Last year, though, requests for that data came from more than 75 members of Congress and multiple federal agencies.

Still, the Census Bureau concluded "there was no federal data need" to collect this information, the bureau's outgoing director, John Thompson, wrote in March.

A document obtained by NPR through a Freedom of Information Act request, however, reveals that the Department of Housing and Urban Development told the bureau that there indeed was a need.

"Valid, reliable, and nationally representative data on sexual orientation and gender identity are essential to HUD fulfilling its mission," former HUD Secretary Julián Castro wrote in a letter to Thompson dated June 30, 2016.

posted by filthy light thief at 7:56 AM on June 20, 2017 [8 favorites]

David Brooks: My Judgment Is Appallingly Bad, Therefore Listen To Me

If, as David Brooks does, we start with the premise that both sides are equally bad, it makes perfect sense that both Whitewater and ＯＭＮＩＧＡＴＥ will amount to little.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 7:56 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

Trump May Have A Lot Of Money, But Documents Show He Owes A Lot, Too (NPR, June 20, 2017)

Which, of course, was one of the heavily speculated reasons as to why Trump never released his tax returns -- that, and who he owed the money to.
posted by Gelatin at 7:57 AM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

> ＯＭＮＩＧＡＴＥ

I thought we made a community decision to go with PANGHAZI.
posted by tonycpsu at 7:58 AM on June 20, 2017 [18 favorites]

For anybody keeping track of the lawyer prestige-o-meter, Prelogar is not just a Supreme Court clerk (i.e., generally agreed to be the most prestigious and sought after job that any young lawyer can have), but twice over, having done a first stint with Ginsburg, and another with Kagan.

It's petty as fuck, but in these dark times, I hold it close to my shriveled dry heart while cackling over reports of how Trump's admin can't hire fuck or all.

Bonus petty points: Prelogar is fluent in Russian.
posted by joyceanmachine at 8:00 AM on June 20, 2017 [47 favorites]

If we're re-opening the naming argument again, I have to throw "PeeTape Dome Scandal" into the mix.
posted by Freon at 8:00 AM on June 20, 2017 [15 favorites]

Panera voters still like Handel (anecdata)

"Progressivism? That's just another name for Maoism and communism, another sect of it," says Richard Decker, 69. His wife, Kay Decker, also 69, nodded in agreement as she tucked into a Fuji chicken apple salad. “I think she’s going to win: I think it’s going to be a surprise like Trump, because a lot of the people who like her are quieter,” Kay Decker said. “We’ve kept quiet about it.”

21-year-old Neek Amie and his friend “Q” also said they had no plans to vote. "I don’t partake in this government system,” Amie said. “I wish I could just secede from America.”

We're all fucked.
posted by Gaz Errant at 8:08 AM on June 20, 2017 [30 favorites]

from the "christ these people are the worst dept."

The Atlantic: The White House Press Briefing Is Slowly Dying

But instead of canceling them entirely, the White House has appeared to embrace a different strategy: simply downgrading them bit by bit, from “briefings” to “gaggles,” and from on-camera to off-camera. Guidance for the briefings have begun to include a note that audio from them cannot be used. Additionally, though Trump has held short press conferences when foreign leaders visit, he has not held a full press conference since February.
…
Neither Spicer nor deputy press secretary Sarah Sanders responded to queries about the changes to the briefings. Asked why the briefings are now routinely held off-camera, White House chief strategist Steve Bannon said in a text message “Sean got fatter,” and did not respond to a follow-up.

posted by murphy slaw at 8:11 AM on June 20, 2017 [24 favorites]

"I do, however, plan to continue complaining about how much I hate the government I made a point of not acting to shape or influence in any way."
posted by The Card Cheat at 8:13 AM on June 20, 2017 [33 favorites]

White House chief strategist Steve Bannon said in a text message “Sean got fatter,” and did not respond to a follow-up.

[real]?

Ah, who am I kidding, of course it's real.
posted by Gaz Errant at 8:13 AM on June 20, 2017 [13 favorites]

"Progressivism? That's just another name for Maoism and communism, another sect of it," says Richard Decker, 69. His wife, Kay Decker, also 69, nodded in agreement as she tucked into a Fuji chicken apple salad. “I think she’s going to win: I think it’s going to be a surprise like Trump, because a lot of the people who like her are quieter,” Kay Decker said. “We’ve kept quiet about it.”

Hey, Dick & Kay, how's Medicare working out for you? You enjoying your retirement? You like seeing grand-kids on the weekends? Or going on vacation with the kids during their two weeks off? You enjoying that salad not full of salmonella?

WHERE THE HECK DO YOU THINK ALL OF THAT CAME FROM?!
posted by leotrotsky at 8:18 AM on June 20, 2017 [66 favorites]

Couple deleted; I know folks are antsy to get results in Georgia, but there's gonna be a wait and we don't need to spend all morning trading "get a load of these assholes" barbs/outrage about individual voters there.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 8:19 AM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

"You don't have Spicey to kick around any more, because, gentlemen, this is my last press conference."
posted by kirkaracha at 8:24 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

i guess we're playing chicken with the Russians now in Syria:
Armed Russia jet comes within five feet of U.S. military plane
posted by localhuman at 8:25 AM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

Matt McDermott (@mattmfm) has collected a few choice tweets from the time machine: Back in 2010, this is what Republicans had to say about the need for transparent negotiations on health care. Just stunning hypocrisy.

And I propose a new word for the dictionary:

mcconnell, n., the stubborn, smelly layer of old bones and rotten fat at the bottom of a commercial grease trap.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 8:27 AM on June 20, 2017 [17 favorites]

21-year-old Neek Amie and his friend “Q” also said they had no plans to vote. "I don’t partake in this government system,” Amie said. “I wish I could just secede from America.”

Continued at Jeff Stein's twitter:

"'The problem with America is that we're so free we've actually enslaved ourselves,' Amie says. Tells me to order pecan waffles, which I did."

"Neek's quieter best friend, Q, sketches anime characters on back of waiter's pad every shift. It's for a book. Says politics is 2 violent."

Armed Russia jet comes within five feet of U.S. military plane

Watch the birdie!
posted by kirkaracha at 8:33 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

Ooh glitter. You're never going to get that completely off you. It's like the blood on Lady Macbeth. Well done, Democratic women, well done.

I really need to see some pics of them dressed as dinosaurs. Do they use those hilarious T-rex costumes?
posted by emjaybee at 8:34 AM on June 20, 2017 [20 favorites]

According to the source, Trump replied that he wants to see comprehensive immigration reform and urged the CEOs to call their senators and congressmen to push for it.

"Because, you know, I'm not gonna do it."
posted by The Card Cheat at 8:37 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

re: Randy Bryce - the donation page linked above is of dubious authenticity, but this donation page was linked from Bryce's Twitter account and appears to be the real deal.
posted by galaxy rise at 8:42 AM on June 20, 2017 [6 favorites]

Trump, in a private meeting, doubles down on criticism of the AHCA bill that he previously lauded

It would be incredible if he waited for the Senate to pass the bill, and then vetoed it because it turns out people hate it and he wants them to say nice things about him. (Yes, I know it is deeply sad to pin any hopes on his infantile revenge schemes and desperate need for validation.)
posted by a fiendish thingy at 8:49 AM on June 20, 2017 [20 favorites]

It's unclear at this time whether 'more heart' was meant literally, in that the ACHA should offer more generous coverage to people with heart conditions, or seriously, in that it shouldn't be a flaming pile of garbage, or ironically.

I think he may have meant it literally, like the Aztecs. We need to sacrifice more human hearts to appease the elder gods.
posted by scalefree at 8:49 AM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

Ooh glitter. You're never going to get that completely off you. It's like the blood on Lady Macbeth. Well done, Democratic women, well done.

The herpes of crafts.

It's also for women and little girls. No self-respecting misogynist asshole wants to get that all over them; someone might think they're gay!

Or, alternatively, their wife might suspect they've gone to the strip club for a lap dance again. That's another big glitter source.
posted by leotrotsky at 8:50 AM on June 20, 2017 [16 favorites]

I know it is deeply sad to pin any hopes on his infantile revenge schemes and desperate need for validation.

We're in a deeply sad situation, I'll take hope where I can find it.
posted by contraption at 9:02 AM on June 20, 2017 [6 favorites]

When historians of the future try to explain why the US fell into chaos, corruption, and tyranny, I think they're going to be all ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ "Maybe they were just too goddamned stupid. In their defense, however, their pecan waffles were to die for."

I dunno, if these kids actually are smart and have politics, I think they'll probably change over time. When you're 21, unless you have a very solid history of activism that involves policy, like doing really policy-based environmental stuff, you don't have a strong sense of how specific legal changes generate change that will be felt in society, and you don't have a strong sense of how society can change, because so much of the changes that have happened since you started to get to be an adult came in tandem with big changes in your life and personality. I think this is, in fact, part of the reason why some Sanders supporters were so shitty about Clinton after the primary - just not enough years of observing the world to see how even very middle of the road, boring, crappy policy plays out, so it's easier to believe that everything is either "sweeping change for the better" or "everything is equally terrible".

I look back on when GWB was elected, for instance, and I barely paid attention to legislative stuff at that time even though I was always going to protests and had plenty of opinions about trade agreements, war, etc. I mean, I did vote, but if there had been any kind of inconvenience about voting, I probably wouldn't have, and I had no real idea about either candidate's policies except that I figured Democrats were somewhat better. Or maybe that was the election where I didn't vote? I think that might have been the one where I was too radikewl to vote, actually.

I mean, I don't think I was a terrible young person. I think in many respects I was a pretty good young person, actually, and in the broad sense I think I was right about the world. It's just that because I had not lived long enough to see economic policy play out in my own social world, I didn't understand the difference between various sorta-meh policies.

It's a civic education problem, IMO. "I wish I could secede from the US" is a perfectly reasonable emotion to have - how many mefites are all "leaving for Crone Island now"? (I myself am waiting for the alien graduate students, a la "The Women Men Don't See", or possibly "Beam Us Home".) If you've had exposure to actual policy questions, you start to be able to make informed choices. Age brings some knowledge like this, but there's no reason that younger people couldn't have it as well through better education.
posted by Frowner at 9:06 AM on June 20, 2017 [55 favorites]

So. Cory Booker, Chris Murphy, and Brian Schatz are currently in a car driving over to the Congressional Budget Office to see if they can find out anything about the AHCA bill. And they're livestreaming their adventures on Facebook.
posted by anastasiav at 9:15 AM on June 20, 2017 [59 favorites]

"'The problem with America is that we're so free we've actually enslaved ourselves,' Amie says. Tells me to order pecan waffles, which I did."

During the Cold War, our own thinktanks started promoting a super extreme formulation of capitalist ideology (Objectivism) as an ideological inoculant against the spread of communist ideology. Like a lot of inoculations, if there's no underlying infection to fight, the dose can be harmful itself. We've also promoted the same hyper individualistic, consumer choice oriented dogma to destabilize authoritarian regimes by promoting unrealistic visions of personal choice uber alles. That was part of the softer psyops/propaganda warfare we used to destabilize the Soviet Union, too, so in a way, it's arguable this is all still Cold War blowback, with our own culturally/politically/socially subversive tactics being turned back on us. That's my own take from a million miles away from the centers of political power, anyway.
posted by saulgoodman at 9:15 AM on June 20, 2017 [13 favorites]

CNN: A Russian Su-27 fighter jet flew within 5 feet of a US Air Force RC-135 reconnaissance aircraft in the Baltic Sea area, according to a US official

those planes were pretty close, almost as close as we are to world war three, haha
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:16 AM on June 20, 2017 [14 favorites]

The source said the president told the CEOs on Monday that the Senate's health-care bill needs "more heart." That would be a second known instance of the president criticizing the GOP bill in private meetings.

Oh god I love this. Paul Ryan was just on the news this morning yammering about how the report about Trump's "the bill is mean" remark last week was a TOTAL MISINTERPRETATION of what Trump really said in a meeting. And here comes President Troll on cue to make Ryan look like an idiot and/or liar. Love. It.
posted by FelliniBlank at 9:22 AM on June 20, 2017 [38 favorites]

Frowner: "It's a civic education problem, IMO. "I wish I could secede from the US" is a perfectly reasonable emotion to have - how many mefites are all "leaving for Crone Island now"? (I myself am waiting for the alien graduate students, a la "The Women Men Don't See", or possibly "Beam Us Home".) If you've had exposure to actual policy questions, you start to be able to make informed choices. Age brings some knowledge like this, but there's no reason that younger people couldn't have it as well through better education."

I mean, we're not supposed to talk about it on this thread, but a lot of adults in the world have given up on the idea of America. Pretending like these kids' viewpoint is childlike is really patronizing.
posted by TypographicalError at 9:26 AM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

> I dunno, if these kids actually are smart and have politics, I think they'll probably change over time.

I know a few people my age (43) who were quite liberal when we were in university and who are now considerably more conservative than they were back then. I don't say this in anger or disappointment (except in the case of one guy who has gone full "fuck you, got mine"), just to point out that it's difficult to predict how people's personal politics will evolve over time. For my part, I was horrifically apolitical at that age; if I bothered to vote it was usually for joke candidates, because I was convinced that voting didn't matter and (more or less subconsciously; white male privilege, yo) figured that everything would just work itself out without me getting involved.
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:27 AM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

Continued at Jeff Stein's twitter:

this needed a [real] tag so bad. I clicked on it for more jokey riffs and and got dreadful realization instead of mordant chuckles 8(
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:31 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

During the Cold War, our own thinktanks started promoting a super extreme formulation of capitalist ideology (Objectivism) as an ideological inoculant against the spread of communist ideology.

I saw a Facebook comment to the effect that if people are unhappy with their health insurance, they should blame their health insurance company, and politicians need to stay out of it. I had this wave of realization that many people have forgotten that private business are supposed to work for themselves and their shareholders, and politicians are supposed to work for the voters, equally, and be judged by people with one vote each, regardless of how wealthy the voter is. The religion of unregulated free-markets is so strong that even when a market fails, the solution is not to fix it (i.e. regulate it) but to sigh and complain about the private companies involved. Electing representatives to fix the problem is out of the question.

In Britain, former Housing secretary (now Immigration secretary) Brandon Lewis said in 2014 "We believe that it is the responsibility of the fire industry, rather than the Government, to market fire sprinkler systems effectively and to encourage their wider installation.". As if private companies have some inherent fundamental moral drive to serve people other than themselves or their shareholders. The invisible helping hand. This kind of thinking led to London's Grenfell Tower fire, current death count 79. In America, the quasi-religious faith in private health insurance companies to aid the sick without regulation has killed many more, and will kill many more without political change.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:33 AM on June 20, 2017 [38 favorites]

Oh god I love this. Paul Ryan was just on the news this morning yammering about how the report about Trump's "the bill is mean" remark last week was a TOTAL MISINTERPRETATION

I really don't get why the messaging here isn't: "Listen folks, the President doesn't know what he's talking about. He doesn't read things or pay much attention, and he says crazy shit all the time. Who seems more reasonable, him, or me?"

It seems like that would win every time over bizarre lying.
posted by dis_integration at 9:35 AM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

From that Jeff Stein twitter feed, "Outside BK, 3 young men pass cigarette. None voting. "I hate congress & government -- h8 it all. And if I voted, wouldnt make a difference.""

OMG the race is 50/50 this is the ONE TIME you can be dead sure that your vote will make a difference!
posted by a snickering nuthatch at 9:37 AM on June 20, 2017 [37 favorites]

> I really don't get why the messaging here isn't: "Listen folks, the President doesn't know what he's talking about. He doesn't read things or pay much attention, and he says crazy shit all the time. Who seems more reasonable, him, or me?"

Because they're legitimately afraid that the President would veto their baby just to be vindictive.
posted by Tevin at 9:37 AM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

I mean, we're not supposed to talk about it on this thread, but a lot of adults in the world have given up on the idea of America. Pretending like these kids' viewpoint is childlike is really patronizing.

I dunno. I think that there's several ways to get an understanding of how social change happens, and the one that everyone can access is simply living through it. People who are lucky or have a particular kind of personality can access this understanding through education or their family/friends/community, but many people don't have this or (like me) didn't pay very much attention because of life and personality things.

If you want, you can live through social change and refuse to think about what causes it. Or you may live through social change and have so much on your plate that you don't have time and energy to think about it.

To me there's a moral difference between saying "I'm an adult, I refuse to engage with society" and saying "I'm at the beginning of my life as an adult, I have not had a chance to look around me very much and therefore I think I want to refuse to engage with society".

Different stages of life bring with them different potentials. Before we get all "young people have just as much knowledge and understanding as their elders, and it's not a different knowledge or understanding either", let's reason by analogy for a moment. Feminism - for instance - is something that many women come to as they get older. Some women are feminists from the first moment of social consciousness/the cradle; many women come to feminism as they move through many experiences, observe how women are treated in different situations, experience how they're treated as they attain knowledge/authority/self-awareness, experience how they're treated as they age or have children. That is, observing the world and experiencing it changes people's politics.

Some people understand the world immediately through their own thoughtfulness, experience, learning or community. Many people need some time to observe and think things through.
posted by Frowner at 9:38 AM on June 20, 2017 [16 favorites]

But if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao
You ain't going to make it with Rich Decker anyhow
posted by delfin at 9:39 AM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

We should get 77,000 Trump-hating non-voters together from Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin, to ceremonially show them that they really do matter and their voice is important to us all
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:40 AM on June 20, 2017 [14 favorites]

Many people need some time to observe and think things through.

This is so true. I cringe at what a dumbass I was in high school and college. Some of us take a while to grow up, and life has a way of educating you, sometimes the hard way.
posted by Fleebnork at 9:41 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

Maybe some of you are reading this thread? Hey you, you matter to me. Next time I want to hear your innermost desires at the ballot box.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:41 AM on June 20, 2017 [9 favorites]

Trump is the horse they backed. To go all "he's crazy and stupid!!!" now would be to a) cast doubt upon their own sterling, principled judgement, b) incur the wrath of the MAGA hats and c) as Tevin commented, probably inspire Trump to switch his party affiliation to Democratic.
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:42 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

DCCC web phonebank tool for Ossoff calls.

So I tried to register, and all it did was sign me up for DCCC text spam and redirect to a page asking for donations. Not helpful.
posted by Faint of Butt at 9:42 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

OMG the race is 50/50 this is the ONE TIME you can be dead sure that your vote will make a difference!

GA-6 is 13.5% african-american. i wonder how much that turnout will be depressed by the recent Philando Castile verdict? because if you were looking for evidence that the system doesn't work for you, there it is.
posted by murphy slaw at 9:43 AM on June 20, 2017 [14 favorites]

Voting to limit the number of Republican politicians and Republican-appointed judges is a good way to improve the system, in my opinion
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:45 AM on June 20, 2017 [6 favorites]

The only definitive tool anyone has for making the system work for them is to vote.

If you don't vote, "the system" doesn't care about your voice because you've told it that you don't have an opinion.
posted by VTX at 9:48 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

Depressing turnout is a primary goal of negative campaigning
posted by thelonius at 9:49 AM on June 20, 2017 [21 favorites]

Does anyone have a pointer to the current doom-and-gloom riffing and catastrophizing about GA-06? Because I'm getting a sinking feeling, like on Election day when they called Florida surprisingly early and didn't call Wisconsin. I don't think I can take it.

Actually, maybe I'll take a walk instead.
posted by RedOrGreen at 9:50 AM on June 20, 2017

it is possible that no matter how much it may be in everyone's interest to participate in electoral democracy — no matter how much a consequentialist take on the situation would demand voting rather than standing apart from the electoral system — that people with politics that are at their core decent will stand aside from the system.

It is the role of parties in electoral democracy (feel free to add bunny ears around that word democracy) to rally as many people as they can to their side. If it is not possible for rally people, that is the failure of the party — the party does not have the luxury of dissolving the electorate and selecting another.

If there is a longstanding reserve of people with decent politics standing aside from electoral democracy because they loathe the whole business, it may be time to organize for action through non-electoral means.

There are people who will never vote for someone who spends their time schmoozing the rich on the telephone, who may nevertheless join a debtor's union and participate in a general debt strike — an organized mass refusal to pay rents, mortgages, loans, credit card bills, and so forth. There are people who will never vote for a politician who identifies as "liberal" or even "progressive," but who spends their time brownnosing bosses, who may participate in mass occupations of government buildings. There are people who — and I'm not one of them, mind — will never vote for someone like Ossoff to represent them, but who will participate in organized mass direct action given the chance.

If the Democrats support the possibility of pitchforks and torches democracy, they will win. The reason they don't is they know that the pitchforks and torches people — the solid, decent Americans who say to hell with electoral methods — will come for them, too, and they know this because they know they deserve it.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:51 AM on June 20, 2017 [11 favorites]

Awful weather in GA-06 today.

The weather in Georgia is going to be awful until about October. Do you mean it's raining today?
posted by thelonius at 9:52 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

We've had scattered thunderstorms all week, but I don't think it will be constant enough to affect voting too terribly much, in my non-expert opinion.
posted by Fleebnork at 9:53 AM on June 20, 2017

Ford to move factory to China after Trump pressures company not to move to Mexico

That's technically a win, maybe? But if Trump keeps sending Mexican jobs to China, how will they afford to pay for the wall?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:54 AM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

no matter how much a consequentialist take on the situation would demand voting rather than standing apart from the electoral system — that people with politics that are at their core decent will stand aside from the system

Enabling evil by willfully withholding your vote is not compatible with "decent" politics.
posted by Gaz Errant at 9:55 AM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

I really don't get why the messaging here isn't: "Listen folks, the President doesn't know what he's talking about. He doesn't read things or pay much attention, and he says crazy shit all the time. Who seems more reasonable, him, or me?"

Most Republican politicians don't want to wake up and see a 4am Presidential tweet calling them a loser and a hater.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 9:57 AM on June 20, 2017

If there is a longstanding reserve of people with decent politics standing aside from electoral democracy because they loathe the whole business, it may be time to organize for action through non-electoral means.

Surely there's room for both suasion and pitchforks, though? I mean, a problem for me with the way we talk about politics is that we talk as if people's politics are fixed - if I'm too anarchist to vote in 2000, I will be too anarchist to vote in 2016, and if I vote loyally Democratic in 2016, I will vote, and vote main-line Democratic, in every election until I'm dead with my feet in the air like a little bird.

I mean, my politics are definitely fixed at "left of center", but that means differing things to me in different situations. Like, for instance, the only time I've been out on strike I thought was a really dumb strike, and I thought, and think, that the union should not have struck because it was obvious that we could not stay out long enough to win, and indeed we didn't win. (FTR, I stayed out til the end). And yet I'm not against strikes or striking, and would by no means vote against a strike should I think that conditions have changed enough for the union to have a shot at winning one.
posted by Frowner at 10:01 AM on June 20, 2017 [13 favorites]

>Surely there's room for both suasion and pitchforks, though? I mean, a problem for me with the way we talk about politics is that we talk as if people's politics are fixed - if I'm too anarchist to vote in 2000, I will be too anarchist to vote in 2016, and if I vote loyally Democratic in 2016, I will vote, and vote main-line Democratic, in every election until I'm dead with my feet in the air like a little bird.

absolutely — I know "diversity of tactics" has a very specific meaning, but what is necessary right now is diversity of tactics in the most straightforward, literalminded interpretation of the term.

What I am saying isn't pitchforks or electoral methods, but instead pitchforks and electoral methods. What I am saying is that it is the responsibility of the parties to persuade people toward electoral methods insofar as they are possible to deploy, and that if the parties fail to do that that is not therefore the fault of the people standing aside. By calling people who don't vote stupid, one alienates them — for what? To my eye the effect is to simply assign blame — to point it somewhere other than toward the party, to salve one's conscience by saying "it's not my fault, it's those idiots over there who don't vote."

If the party cannot mobilize people to participate in electoral democracy/"democracy," it is ineffective as a party. If it is in fact impossible for the party to mobilize people to participate in electoral democracy (add bunny ears as desired), then it is crucial that we organize to win power by other means — instead of taking the lazy person's strategy of calling others stupid and throwing up a shruggie.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:08 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

Sean Hannity tries to defend Trump by saying that the Russia investigation is based on an absurd conspiracy theory, and you can see him racking his brain to find an appropriate analogy, and the one he lands on is THE BIRTHER CONSPIRACY, NO SEAN THAT IS A BAD ANALOGY FOR DEFENDING DONALD TRUMP TRY AGAIN
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:10 AM on June 20, 2017 [71 favorites]

If you don't vote, "the system" doesn't care about your voice because you've told it that you don't have an opinion.

And there are constituencies -- senior citizens, for example -- whose concerns are more reliably addressed by politicians because they vote.
posted by Gelatin at 10:11 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

Roger Stone .... Cannabis World Congress and Business Exposition .... Wait what?

Yes. That Roger Stone of the Nixon era is starting a lobbying group for the legalization of Cannabis. Or so he claimed. (and Stone likes to take credit for helping get in Trump along with the claim he was poisoned with Polonium. Perhaps Cannabis cured his poisoning?)

Strange Days indeed. Or perhaps "May you live in interesting times."
posted by rough ashlar at 10:14 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

Awful weather in GA-06 today.

Not to mention an earthquake in east-central Georgia. I'm pretty sure it was too far from Atlanta for the voters to feel, but still, nature is giving us a sign.
posted by mittens at 10:15 AM on June 20, 2017

Awful weather in GA-06 today.

It is currently raining in the Democratic parts of GA-6, but not in the Republican parts lol
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:16 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

I'm definitely down for less voters. Especially if it would raise the percentage of voters who were informed about an election's issues and candidates. Voting just because, but not being aware of your impact is worse than not voting.
posted by rc3spencer at 10:17 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

Even if 100% of Americans voted, there would still be the problem of the hackable voting machines. You can "get out the vote" all you want-- if those votes aren't being counted correctly, then it doesn't matter. "Georgia uses touchscreen voting machines with no paper-trail that run Windows 2000. This shouldn't be legal." Prove me wrong, Georgia, prove me wrong!
posted by Fuzzy Monster at 10:18 AM on June 20, 2017 [19 favorites]

It is currently raining in the Democratic parts of GA-6, but not in the Republican parts lol

Why would our Lord do this? Is He Handel's Messiah?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:18 AM on June 20, 2017 [74 favorites]

> Is He Handel's Messiah?

EMRJKC'94, you deserve a timeout for that one.
posted by RedOrGreen at 10:21 AM on June 20, 2017 [25 favorites]

Roger Stone .... Cannabis World Congress and Business Exposition .... Wait what?

There's a gold rush blooming in the fields. I bet lots of shitheel opportunist self-aggrandizers are looking to grab it before the hippies do.
posted by notyou at 10:21 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

It is currently raining in the Democratic parts of GA-6, but not in the Republican parts lol

"How can this be? He IS the Kwisatz Haderach!"
posted by Strange Interlude at 10:22 AM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

I bet lots of shitheel opportunist self-aggrandizers are looking to grab it ~~before the hippies do.~~ from people of color.

Fixed.
posted by Sophie1 at 10:25 AM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

You should probably just tell us what the best pun was so we don't fill up the page trying to guess...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:26 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

I bet lots of shitheel opportunist self-aggrandizers are looking to grab it before the hippies do.

Hippies and the Hmong.
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:28 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

rough ashlar: "Yes. That Roger Stone of the Nixon era is starting a lobbying group for the legalization of Cannabis. Or so he claimed."

Sort of related: Grover Norquist is now in the pocket of Big Vape.
posted by mhum at 10:29 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

Sean Hannity tries to defend Trump by saying that the Russia investigation is based on an absurd conspiracy theory, and you can see him racking his brain to find an appropriate analogy, and the one he lands on is THE BIRTHER CONSPIRACY, NO SEAN THAT IS A BAD ANALOGY FOR DEFENDING DONALD TRUMP TRY AGAIN

yet again the crashing realization that I'm not dreaming and donald dang trump is president of my country hits me like a ton of ugly bricks.
posted by winna at 10:31 AM on June 20, 2017 [22 favorites]

Yet another terrible handshake from schoolyard-bully-in-chief, this time with the President of Panama. One day Trump is going to be shaking the hand of noted judo practitioner Vladimir Putin; is it too much to hope that he gets flipped onto his back?
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 10:36 AM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

Funny enough I trained with a Russian judo/sambo champion back in the day.. he taught us a few throws that started out from a friendly/sportsmanly handshake starting position. So it's def in his (Putin) repertoire.
posted by some loser at 10:46 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

In the comments someone speculated on whether heads of state have their own Slack channel to share handshake-prep tips. This is a fantastic idea and I expect mathowie to implement it immediately!
posted by orrnyereg at 10:47 AM on June 20, 2017 [9 favorites]

I kinda wish someone would just stop in the middle and point out what's happening.

Like, "Hey, would you knock it off with the macho handshake bullshit, you're not trying to sell me a used car in the '80s."

Here in the present, even used car salespeople are better than that nonsense. And that includes my father who sold cars in the '80s (and owns at least one plaid sport coat that I've seen) and still sells them today.
posted by VTX at 10:53 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

One day Trump is going to be shaking the hand of noted judo practitioner Vladimir Putin; is it too much to hope that he gets flipped onto his back?

Oh, he doesn't need a handshake to flip on his back for Putin. He'll do that unprompted.
posted by leotrotsky at 10:54 AM on June 20, 2017 [27 favorites]

Further update: I eventually received an email with a link on how to phonebank for Ossoff. It took me to another site that wanted me to create an account and log in. At that point I decided to give up. Ossoff has my thoughts and prayers.
posted by Faint of Butt at 10:54 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

Oh, he doesn't need a handshake to flip on his back for Putin. He'll do that unprompted.

Well, he does expect a belly rub and a treat for being such a very good boy.
posted by OverlappingElvis at 10:54 AM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

Pretending like these kids' viewpoint is childlike is really patronizing.

Their viewpoint is childish. But, as Frowner, says, they probably deserve a little slack, because 21 year olds in the US are still, in many ways and especially in political ways, children. I was pretty childish at 21. It's the adults—and I've encountered plenty of them on the right and the left—who believe the same things on whom my sympathy is exhausted.

it is the responsibility of the parties to persuade people toward electoral methods insofar as they are possible to deploy, and that if the parties fail to do that that is not therefore the fault of the people standing aside.

Ultimately? Yes, it's the responsibility of parties to persuade and if they fail to do that, then they fail. Full stop. But as Stein's reporting suggests and as we endlessly saw on display last year, some fraction of potential voters—it's hard to say how large that fraction is—seem frankly unwilling to be persuaded at any cost. This fraction seems to have already decided that they are too powerless or too pure or too indifferent or whatever story they tell themselves to excuse themselves from the responsibilities of acting like a citizen. Like the fabled Trump voters, they keep demanding to be engaged with without providing any clear idea of what it is they actually want. Chances are they don't know what they want. They just know they don't want what's being offered. And I don't know how you'd even begin to "organize people to win power by other means" if they don't even believe in the necessity of organizing themselves to go vote. I do find that blameworthy, for all the fucking good it does me.
posted by octobersurprise at 10:59 AM on June 20, 2017 [13 favorites]

Spicey time is live. He's agreeing that Trump wants a health care bill "that has heart" and downplaying expectations and the significance of GA-06.
posted by zachlipton at 11:00 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

Personally, my favorite remains vbfg's understated mention of Egg's ban edict.
posted by cortex at 11:01 AM on June 20, 2017 [18 favorites]

RedOrGreen: "Does anyone have a pointer to the current doom-and-gloom riffing and catastrophizing about GA-06? Because I'm getting a sinking feeling, like on Election day when they called Florida surprisingly early and didn't call Wisconsin. I don't think I can take it."

No one is going to know anything for hours. And even when results start coming in, it is almost certainly going to take a while to sort out. Go take your walk.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:01 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

downplaying expectations and the significance of GA-06

That's a bit of good news; it indicates Trump's people aren't confident of winning.
posted by Gelatin at 11:01 AM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

The Spiceman Cometh, no subscription required
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:01 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

538 writeup on the SC-05 special, also taking place tonight.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:05 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

That's a bit of good news; it indicates Trump's people aren't confident of winning.

They weren't confident of winning the White House either, and look how that turned out.
posted by anastasiav at 11:06 AM on June 20, 2017 [6 favorites]

Correcting the pronunciation of a non-native English speaker.

Christ, what an asshole.
posted by Tevin at 11:07 AM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

538: GA-06 comes down to the reluctant Trump voters.
posted by Chrysostom at 11:17 AM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

I mean, a problem for me with the way we talk about politics is that we talk as if people's politics are fixed - if I'm too anarchist to vote in 2000, I will be too anarchist to vote in 2016, and if I vote loyally Democratic in 2016, I will vote, and vote main-line Democratic, in every election until I'm dead with my feet in the air like a little bird.

Just want to second this. I was friends with Arun Chaudhary in college. He has worked on the Obama campaign, was Obama's (and the country's first ever) official White House videographer, and he was the Creative Director for Bernie's campaign. His wife Laura Moser just launched her campaign to run for Congress in Houston's 7th district. So, pretty damn involved in the political process. This same man, when we were both college kids around 20 years old, argued in debates with me that we SHOULD NOT vote, because it legitimizes an inherently corrupt system. Not just that it doesn't matter if you vote or not, but that the more correct/moral choice is to abstain.

So yeah, a lot of 20 year olds are likely to change their perspective as they get older, and I don't think it's patronizing to point that out. It's maybe even possible that the most disengaged, if they're disengaged for the "right" reasons, could become the most active given the right amount of time and engagement and life experience.

Now, I don't know what that means if we depend on those young folks now to vote to get progressive candidates in office and policies enacted, and how to reach them today rather than waiting until they are 30.
posted by misskaz at 11:17 AM on June 20, 2017 [24 favorites]

It would be incredible if he waited for the Senate to pass the bill, and then vetoed it because it turns out people hate it and he wants them to say nice things about him.

After the Senate the two versions will still need to be reconciled, presumably through conference, and then voted on again in each chamber.

What will happen after *that*, assuming it passes, is that Ryan and McConnell will deliver pretty solid verbal blowjobs to Trump and get the final version printed up so that Trump will reliably preen and gloat and sign the damn thing for no better reason than that Ryan and McConnell are making him feel good right then. Then he will learn that everyone hates it and feel betrayed again and start talking smack about his previous good idea.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 11:21 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

Megyn Kelly just helped some guy get thousands of new followers

Kelly and her supporters defended the interview by saying that it can “shine a light” on the “personally revolting” views of this person. [...]

Defense of the interview is predicated on the notion that by exposing the person, people would be turned off by his views. But his views are well-known, and it has not stopped him from gaining widespread attention and amassing a large number of supporters who agree with his easily disprovable claims.

And while some of the new people getting a daily, brain-rotting feed of paranoia, superstition and gay frogs will feel Kelly's intended disgust and desire for distance, some portion will believe them.

The numbers almost certainly understate the extent to which Kelly's interview has provided the man with a broader, more mainstream audience. They say nothing of the additional people who may now choose to tune into his radio show or check out the website where he peddles his theories.

Kelly did indeed succeed in “shining a light” on the man's disgusting views, but it's almost certain thousands of Americans liked what they saw.

posted by tonycpsu at 11:22 AM on June 20, 2017 [16 favorites]

Spicer just refused to say whether Trump believes that Russia interfered with the 2016 election. It's another topic Spicer has supposedly didn't talk to the President about, you know, the guy who randomly blurts stuff out about the investigation all the time.

And not one reporter asked him about Bannon saying he got fatter. Sad.

WaPo: New sanctions on Russia and Iran hit House roadblock

A bill that passed the Senate last week extending financial sanctions on Russia and Iran and making it more difficult for President Trump to ease Russian sanctions has encountered a major procedural snag, threatening its quick passage into law.

The sanctions bill, known as the Countering Iran’s Destabilizing Activities Act, passed the Thursday last week on a 98-2 vote. But this week, House staff flagged the bill for violating the constitutional provision that only the House can originate bills raising revenue for the government — creating what is known on Capitol Hill as a “blue slip” violation.

Have to ask whether this is incompetence or was intentional.

And it turns out the Trump University case isn't quite dead; there's an objector, and an appeal to allow some class members to opt-out of the settlement is going forward: Politico—Judge won’t make Trump University settlement objector post large bond

You guys had some of Jeff Stein's GA-06 tweets earlier, but not my favorite: UPDATE: I've been escorted out of Panera by 3 employees 4 violating policy amounting to "don't go around randomly interrupting ppls dinners"
posted by zachlipton at 11:25 AM on June 20, 2017 [16 favorites]

Awful weather in GA-06 today. Wonder how that will affect turnout.

In reading Nate Cohn and others about the projected composition and timing of the vote, there's a good chance reduced election day turnout would help Ossoff since Handel's R voters tend to be gameday voters and Ossoff's banked a bunch of early vote.
posted by chris24 at 11:26 AM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

Katy Tur is barely containing a rage rant after Spicer's drivel.

let the hate flow through you, katy. feel the power of the dark side!
posted by murphy slaw at 11:27 AM on June 20, 2017 [8 favorites]

What did Katy say?
posted by Dashy at 11:33 AM on June 20, 2017

Pro-Ossof dinosaurs
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 11:35 AM on June 20, 2017 [13 favorites]

Have we all not, like sheep, gone astray?

Only if he was despised and rejected.
posted by Melismata at 11:40 AM on June 20, 2017

YES THEY ARE THE T-REXES

Thank you, Johnny Wallflower.
posted by emjaybee at 11:41 AM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

Awful weather in GA-06 today.

It is currently raining in the Democratic parts of GA-6, but not in the Republican parts lol

This is funny. About 2 hours ago, I drove all the way from the southernmost part of the district to the northernmost and made the opposite observation. As soon as I crossed the Chattahoochee River into the Roswell/Alpharetta/older/whiter/richer part of the district, the bottom dropped out, cars were skidding all over the place, and I felt the wrath of God literally raining down on the Republicans.
posted by Fritzle at 11:41 AM on June 20, 2017 [12 favorites]

Their viewpoint is childish

I'm not sure that "childish" is the note I want to strike. "Because of lack of time observing things possibly not aware of how things that they find important are contoured by elections", maybe?

Like for instance, I have a younger friend who was saying that they felt current electoral politics was pretty remote for them and they weren't that interested. My friend is dependent on food stamps and is probably going to be eligible for disability if they can get through the horrible US process for getting onto it. They pretty much had the attitude that nothing could change, everything is terrible, etc. And in fact, yes, their life is very hard for unfair reasons, and the bullshit lack of a social safety net is a large part of that.

So I mean, I don't blame them for, like, not feeling it, politicians-wise. It's very obvious to anyone with a brain that society has decided to throw away people like my friend, and that goes for almost all Democrats as much as for Republicans.

But the more Republican victories there are, the less food stamps there will be. Benefits have already shrunk hugely - since the nineties, of course, but also in the past ten years. My perception is that because my friend has been accessing these extremely limited benefits only since the last round of cuts, they are not fully aware of the cut process and how political it is, even though they are acutely aware of how shitty the existing food stamp system (where they cut you off due to "errors" every few months in the hopes that you'll give up) really is.

It's not like my friend is childish. They've negotiated some things in life that give me the screaming fantods just to think about. And it's not like they don't have a realistic grasp on the nature of the mainstream Democratic party. It's simply that they haven't been through the mill enough to realize how grave an impact actual upcoming elections may have on their ability to access food. Whereas I, who have had a much easier life and much more food security, have seen all this happen several times and am really worried about it.

I mean, literally, the thing that living longer is going to do for them is give them experience of one of these cycles of cuts and crises.

On the one hand, yes, I am hugely disappointed in the Democratic party. On the other hand, I really, really do not want young leftish people of my acquaintance to be startled when they lose benefits when, had they fully understood what was on the table, they would have wanted to take action.
posted by Frowner at 11:46 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

Um. @realDonaldTrump: While I greatly appreciate the efforts of President Xi & China to help with North Korea, it has not worked out. At least I know China tried!

Since Trump's previous approach to North Korea was essentially "China's gonna take care of it," I'm rather concerned about what comes next now that he realizes that wasn't a winning strategy.
posted by zachlipton at 11:47 AM on June 20, 2017 [26 favorites]

There's a pretty enthusiastic contingent of Pakistani - American Atlantans campaigning for Ossoff. I hope their optimism and efforts are well - rewarded by today's result.
posted by bardophile at 11:49 AM on June 20, 2017 [8 favorites]

Disaffection with US electoral politics isn't something that just suddenly happened one day, it's been a long process of ramping up across all kinds of different fields, from outright disenfranchisement and the soft disenfranchisement of making it a pain in the ass to vote, to horserace media coverage of elections that minimize the actual effects on people's lives, the processes by which elections have been subsumed into fund-raising efforts, and the drive by elected officials themselves to make their job mysterious and distract from anything that might make them accountable to voters, just to name a few. In almost every area, anti-democratic forces are actively seeking to make voting seem tedious, excruciating, and seemingly pointless, so that fewer people do it. And this is by no means something limited to the Republican party. The screenshot of Ossoff fundraising e-mails that was floating around on Twitter is absolutely part and parcel of this problem. How on Earth is someone supposed to react when told in the space of an hour that the election is either ALREADY LOST or VICTORY IS INEVITABLE? I think a lot people see something like that, say "they can't even make up their mind, so this can't possibly be that important to them" and check out.

Young people in this country are certainly not constitutionally incapable of caring about politics. In fact, from the way people in the media talk about colleges, you'd get the impression that, if anything, they care too much (although I wouldn't overlook the difference in demographic profile between the young people who are derided for talking too much and too loudly vs. the young people who are derided for being too stupid to care about politics). I think getting them to vote is going to be easier the more pushback there is on both the absolute barriers like disenfranchisement and the more subtle ones that have turned so much of our politics into a situation where it seems like we have no control of politicians and politicians have no control of any of the forces controlling our lives so the whole thing is a mass of hopeless inevitability, in which case, why vote? Almost nothing is actually inevitable in politics, and people, with organized effort, do have the ability to change things for the better. I think helping them to see that would be a lot better strategy than yelling at them for not caring.
posted by Copronymus at 11:49 AM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

Please please please let him have missed that asshole on Fox calling for a preemptive nuclear strike on North Korea.
posted by strange chain at 11:49 AM on June 20, 2017 [14 favorites]

“Healthcare is such an important thing. I think we should have debated it in open, in committee hearings, have both sides bring in witnesses,” Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) said Tuesday.

Talking in the fucking past tense like he's incapable of voting to have open committee hearings before a final vote. Learning well from the John McCain School of Solving Problems.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:51 AM on June 20, 2017 [40 favorites]

@realdonaldtrump (2:38pm): "While I greatly appreciate the efforts of President Xi & China to help with North Korea, it has not worked out. At least I know China tried!"

My favorite new form of public relations: the ominous non-sequitur.

Maybe he should've given something to his Press Secretary, who was literally just taking press questions mere minutes ago, to read out and explain just what the hell he's talking about.
posted by dis_integration at 11:53 AM on June 20, 2017 [18 favorites]

Sorry, folks. The GOP’s devious strategy for ramming Trumpcare through is working. (Greg Sergeant, Washington Post) "A new CBS News poll finds that the public broadly wants a more open process. Americans say, 73 percent to 25 percent, that Senate Republicans should discuss their plans publicly rather than privately. More than three-quarters of independents agree. But here’s the really key finding from the CBS News poll: Americans are in the dark about the measure. The poll finds that Americans say by 76-23 that they haven’t heard enough yet about the GOP plan to have a good understanding of it. Independents say this by 76-22." [emphasis added]

{Anecdotal interlude to add some color: I just faxed my GOP senator and cc'ed four others about the mystery health care bill. They all went through on the first attempt instead. In the past, during hotter stories, getting through requiring multiple tries.}

"Multiple rank-and-file Republican senators also know this secrecy is indefensible — after all, they have lodged lots of public complaints about it. But they are not taking any steps to give those complaints any real force with GOP leaders. Why? The most convincing explanation is that they, too, know they are better off as long as voters — despite their disapproval of the process — don’t have a full understanding of what they will soon be voting on, and possibly, passing."
posted by Doktor Zed at 11:57 AM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

"While I greatly appreciate the efforts of President Xi & China to help with North Korea, it has not worked out. At least I know China tried!"

Diplomacy by getting bored and giving up and doing something else. If only we had a State Department capable of doing more than one thing...
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 11:58 AM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

Strikes me as possibly Trump paying lip service to bilateralism, topped off (of course) with a big dollop of fuck everybody, i.e. "Boy, it's a shame you wouldn't do what I wanted in this case, China, so I'm going to pursue some asinine course of action against North Korea without you, but no hard feelings, K?"

(I hope I'm wrong, because that course of action, and its aftermath, is likely to be terrifying for the Korean peninsula and the world.)

To the extent such a thing even exists, I think this could be called Trumpian foreign policy.
posted by Rykey at 12:01 PM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

I have a younger friend who was saying that they felt current electoral politics was pretty remote for them and they weren't that interested.

I don't want a big voter apathy derail, but young people don't have life experience yet! They don't see change because they haven't lived through it. Once you start paying taxes, seeing what you get, have those taxes and benefits change with a different administration, see how things get harder with certain people running things... You start realizing you should vote! Not everyone, of course, but for sure, there's a direct corrolation between life experience and voter turnout. To me, it's not a big mystery why 18-24yos don't care.
posted by greermahoney at 12:10 PM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

One deleted. At this moment, please no nuclear war jokes/jaded comments, even if they're well intended or otherwise.
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 12:11 PM on June 20, 2017 [9 favorites]

The Trump Doctrine:
Less Free Trade, More Free Trademarks
Less Nation-Building, More Golf-Course-Building
Less Realpolitik, More Saudi Riyalpolitik
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:11 PM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

Continued heavy storms making Atlanta traffic a mess.

"GA judge orders Dekalb County to leave 2 polling locations open till 730 pm et due to “technical issues” in GA6 special election."
posted by Chrysostom at 12:13 PM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

It's not like my friend is childish.

No, to be clear, I don't think your friend is childish. I think the statement "I wish I could secede from the United States" is childish. It might be a forgivable sentiment in a 21 year old (a 21 year old moreover who might've been just fucking with a reporter), but it's a sentiment that seems to inform a lot of 21st century fringe politics from the InfoWars nuts, to the sovereign citizens, to the Silicon Valley nerd-rapturers. And I don't think anyone's helped by a reluctance to call this kind of thing silly and even in some instances dangerous.
posted by octobersurprise at 12:17 PM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

Get ready for the AHCA to change even after the text is released Thursday, from Axios: This week's Senate health bill likely to change next week

The Senate health care bill, which Majority Leader Mitch McConnell has said will be released on Thursday, will contain optional state waivers of some Affordable Care Act insurance regulations, according to two senior GOP aides. But those waivers may not end up in the final bill — because they could get stripped out for violating Senate budget rules.

Here's why: The Congressional Budget Office has to give its cost estimates for the bill before Republicans can argue their case to the Senate parliamentarian that the waivers should be allowed. (The bill has to comply with Senate budget rules, and she decides whether it does.) And there's a good chance that she'll rule that the waivers, including essential health benefits, have to come out. One of the aides described the parliamentarian as "skeptical."

And some good news, at least for the moment: Senate panel to reject Trump’s air traffic control plan in aviation bill
posted by zachlipton at 12:18 PM on June 20, 2017 [14 favorites]

Talking in the fucking past tense like he's incapable of voting to have open committee hearings before a final vote. Learning well from the John McCain School of Solving Problems.

This is a technique that George W Bush & Karl Rove perfected in the build up to Iraq. Every attempt to debate an issue was met with "it's too early to discuss that now" all the way up to the point where they were ready to pull the trigger, at which point it became "too late, the decision has been made & we can't go back & revisit it".
posted by scalefree at 12:18 PM on June 20, 2017 [40 favorites]

> Welp. Buzzfeed: Secret Government Report: Chelsea Manning Leaks Caused No Real Harm

> I continue to be impressed by Buzzfeed's ability and willingness to chase down leads (they filed the FOIA request that resulted in this document being released) and annoyed by how they frame the stories they publish.

“No Americans Killed”

Oh, well, then. Just foreigners. No harm, no foul. Indeed, take a look at the redacted lists on page 3-4.

Overall, when assessing Leopold’s summary, keep in mind that entire pages of the report—and large sections on effects—are redacted; the single pull quotation, noting that the disclosure of the Iraq data set likely entailed “no direct personal impact on current and former U.S. leadership in Iraq” means exactly that. And the “serious” damage to HUMINT and SIGINT is actually kind of a big deal.

Last year, while in seventh grade, my daughter did some exercises designed to show how the very structure of news reports can generate bias. If this piece had been out, I would’ve suggested she use it for the project.

posted by tonycpsu at 12:26 PM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

I feel no shame or regret about patronizing feelings and statements about people like this. Patronizing's definition includes treat with an apparent kindness that betrays a feeling of superiority, and managing the appearance of kindness towards people who abdicate participation in this glib and unthoughtful way is no small feat. The nation is filled with people like Frowner's friend who are beaten down and physically challenged, and others who are faced with voter suppression.

This fucking clown? Who is physically together enough to hold that job, say to the reporter "I can survive w/o politics," and stand and smile for a grinning picture? Complete with two thumbs up, to indicate who doesn't give a fuck about the gay folks I know who Handel say are bad parents, the women I know who will have their reproductive choices limited? THIS GUY!

Patronizing such folks by thinking them childish in their outlooks represents a sizable step up from my gut reaction in both politeness level and hope for them to become less awful.
posted by phearlez at 12:32 PM on June 20, 2017 [15 favorites]

@ddale8: I believe Trump just Frederick Douglass'd Ukraine. [and called it "The Ukraine" to the president's face: WaPo—
Trump calls Ukraine the thing Ukrainians hate the most]

President Trump: Thank you very much. It's a great honor to be with President Poroshenko of the Ukraine -- a place that we've all been very much involved in. And you've been seeing it and everybody has been reading about it.

posted by zachlipton at 12:34 PM on June 20, 2017 [29 favorites]

The Congressional Budget Office has to give its cost estimates for the bill before Republicans can argue their case to the Senate parliamentarian that the waivers should be allowed.

The parliamentarian can be overruled with 51 votes, but that seems unlikely since the precedent would destroy the legislative filibuster, something many Republicans want to hold onto.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 12:39 PM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

> something many Republicans want to hold onto

More than they want to turn poor peoples' lives into tax cuts for millionaires, though?
posted by tonycpsu at 12:40 PM on June 20, 2017 [8 favorites]

a place that we've all been very much involved in. And you've been seeing it and everybody has been reading about it.

I'm just glad that our president isn't having increasing difficulty accessing concrete words...
posted by diogenes at 12:43 PM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

Sessions has lawyered up.
posted by Chrysostom at 12:46 PM on June 20, 2017 [35 favorites]

So does this make Chuck Cooper the Attorney General Attorney?
posted by Huffy Puffy at 12:49 PM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

The Attorney-Specific of the United States.
posted by Etrigan at 12:50 PM on June 20, 2017 [52 favorites]

Also, waiver motions for points of order under the Byrd rule in reconciliation are supposed to require 60 votes, as the law currently stands. It's not directly tied to filibuster rules, but it's the same number of votes as cloture.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 12:57 PM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

Sessions has lawyered up.

So the highest lawyer in the land needs a lawyer? My brain hurts.
posted by Melismata at 12:58 PM on June 20, 2017 [11 favorites]

ugh WHY didn't I save the childfree announcement for after my mother pulled the lever for Trump? It would have haunted her.

You could tell her "You know, right before the election I was reconsidering about kids. I even had some names picked out! But then, well..."
posted by emjaybee at 12:58 PM on June 20, 2017 [8 favorites]

Sessions has lawyered up.

Wait -- Sessions didn't lawyer up before testifying? To quote Gomez Addams, "They say a man who represents himself has a fool for a client. Well, with God as my witness, I am that fool!"
posted by Capt. Renault at 12:59 PM on June 20, 2017 [30 favorites]

In reference to Filthy Light Thief's post above regarding using census questions for the collection of gender data.

A document obtained by NPR through a Freedom of Information Act request, however, reveals that the Department of Housing and Urban Development told the bureau that there indeed was a need.

"Valid, reliable, and nationally representative data on sexual orientation and gender identity are essential to HUD fulfilling its mission," former HUD Secretary Julián Castro wrote in a letter to Thompson dated June 30, 2016.

I'm curious about exactly how anyone can justify this "essential to our mission" bullshit. HUD's stated mission is to:

"create strong, sustainable, inclusive communities and quality affordable homes for all. HUD is working to strengthen the housing market to bolster the economy and protect consumers; meet the need for quality affordable rental homes; utilize housing as a platform for improving quality of life; build inclusive and sustainable communities free from discrimination, and transform the way HUD does business" (emphasis added).

Are they claiming that they need to know everyone's gender preferences so that they can make sure somehow that communities aren't discriminating against gender-different individuals -- "we're doing this for your own good"? Who could possibly believe that?

Also, using census data to obtain gender information goes against the stated mission of the Census Bureau:

"The Census Bureau's mission is to serve as the leading source of quality data about the nation's people and economy. We honor privacy, protect confidentiality, share our expertise globally, and conduct our work openly. We are guided on this mission by scientific objectivity, our strong and capable workforce, our devotion to research-based innovation, and our abiding commitment to our customers", (again, emphasis added.)

Maybe, there's another mission we haven't been told about?
posted by TwoToneRow at 1:05 PM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

Are they claiming that they need to know everyone's gender preferences so that they can make sure somehow that communities aren't discriminating against gender-different individuals -- "we're doing this for your own good"? Who could possibly believe that?

Do I believe that Obama's HUD thought it would be useful to collect data to identify whether it's serving LGBT people equitably? Yeah I do.
posted by zachlipton at 1:12 PM on June 20, 2017 [17 favorites]

Charles J. Cooper is 100% on-brand for Sessions, by the way. Fellow Alabaman who did not graduate from Harvard/Yale/Stanford law school, with solid bonafides defending bigotry, such as defending Prop 8 before the Supreme Court.

Bonus bigotry: early in his career, Cooper helped the Reagan Administration argue that racially discriminatory schools were still entitled to tax exemptions.

Bonus bonus bigotry, family edition: Cooper's daughter is a lesbian and married to another woman.
posted by joyceanmachine at 1:12 PM on June 20, 2017 [12 favorites]

Also, using census data to obtain gender information goes against the stated mission of the Census Bureau:
"The Census Bureau's mission is to serve as the leading source of quality data about the nation's people and economy. We honor privacy, protect confidentiality,
Census data can include gender information and still protect confidentiality. The data is available only down to a minimum size (usually a city block, if I remember correctly), and in the case that the variable you are disaggregating by has few enough people of one demographic within that variable that you could conceivably identify individuals, the minimum size is expanded until enough people of that demographic are included that that is no longer the case.
posted by solotoro at 1:14 PM on June 20, 2017 [6 favorites]

The Attorney-Specific of the United States.

Attorney General Hires Specific Attorney
posted by Slap*Happy at 1:14 PM on June 20, 2017 [19 favorites]

Money gets distributed to programs based on census data. If we have no idea how many transgender Americans there are we can assume there aren't that many and they don't need protections, services, etc. So, yes. The census should absolutely include sexual orientation and gender identity.
posted by Sophie1 at 1:17 PM on June 20, 2017 [32 favorites]

Charlie Birdman, Buttorney at Law
posted by Existential Dread at 1:20 PM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

I'm sure the sexual orientation/gender identity data would still be helpful if it was optional. Then no-one's privacy is invaded.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:20 PM on June 20, 2017

Josh Marshall, Talking Points Memo: The McConnell Corrupt Bargain And The Fallacy of Policy Literalism

As a political matter, Democrats should be shouting from the rooftops about McConnell’s secrecy. But they should also be hitting what we know, what is really all but certain: that the net effect of this bill will be to deprive tens of millions of Americans of the coverage they currently have – whether that’s because of the loss of market subsidies, Medicaid expansion or because of the curtailment of regulations which allowed various classes of individuals to purchase coverage at realistic rates.

On the extremely notional off chance that Senate Republicans are inexplicably keeping secret a plan that does something different, it is really on them to let everyone know. Journalists should not let McConnell’s secrecy prevent them from providing clarity to readers about the impact of what is coming. Opponents of Trumpcare, who obviously operate from a very different set of priorities and equities, should also not hobble themselves.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:30 PM on June 20, 2017 [11 favorites]

I move that we call Sessions' lawyer the Attorney-Colonel.
posted by Archelaus at 1:32 PM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

BREAKING: US State Dept. says "mystified" by lack of details from Gulf states on claims against Qatar; questions motive for diplomatic row.

No worries folks just the Trump putting 10 000 troops in the crosshairs for no reason...
posted by PenDevil at 1:43 PM on June 20, 2017 [19 favorites]

We all know the reason: the Saudi royal family frequents his hotels and golf courses, is really nice to him, and threw a huge party when he came to visit. Do these things and the most powerful man in the world will say whatever you want him to say, evidence-free, regardless of consequence.

or it could be the glowing orb I suppose
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:51 PM on June 20, 2017 [16 favorites]

I am labelling Saudi Arabia an Idiocy Manipulator
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:52 PM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

Sessions has lawyered up.

I expect little from the world at large, but it would be nice if Metafilter didn't go down the same rabbit hole the rest of the nation has and we could not talk about getting legal counsel as some indicator of anything other than protecting one's own constitutional rights. Consulting a lawyer is smart. It's likely one of the few smart things Sessions will do this year. Can we just hate on him for all his shitty bigotry and lying and not be complicit in making it shameful to protect yourself in the face of the law?
posted by phearlez at 1:54 PM on June 20, 2017 [26 favorites]

I mean, yeah, but he did lawyer up. Context is important here. The context is he lawyered up [because he's involved in monstrous activities].
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 1:57 PM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

I just find it bitterly amusing that most of the jobs the "Job Creator in Chief" appears to be creating are for the nation's attorneys.
posted by thebrokedown at 1:58 PM on June 20, 2017 [11 favorites]

Sam Rosen of The Atlantic has a fascinating piece on Atlanta politics around the incorporation of new cities.

Atlanta's Controversial 'Cityhood' Movement

In the 1960s, the residents of Sandy Springs were clear about why they wanted to become a separate city: Atlanta had “forced Negroes” on them. These days, a corrupt county government makes the cityhood trend more understandable, but it may also give cover to those seeking segregation. In this way, the cityhood movement has become a kind of polarizing racial Rorschach test. Some see engaged citizens fighting distinct political battles with corrupt county governments; others see whites across metro Atlanta hell-bent on finishing the racial isolationism that previous generations started.

posted by bardophile at 1:58 PM on June 20, 2017 [8 favorites]

Sam Rosen of The Atlantic has a fascinating piece on Atlanta politics around the incorporation of new cities.

Fascinating, yes. New, no. This is a known thing to folks in that area, or mostly any metro area of the greater south. Honestly I'd be very surprised if it were not a thing in most cities, in the most general sense of the idea. Same shit, different day.
posted by RolandOfEld at 2:01 PM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

Sessions getting lawyered up NOW is interesting because it follows a disturbing trend of these idiots waiting far too long to do so. They are in a hole and just keep digging.
posted by fluffy battle kitten at 2:06 PM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

we could not talk about getting legal counsel as some indicator of anything other than protecting one's own constitutional rights

This. If I were anywhere in Trump's orbit right now, anyone who's done any sort of political or business work with him, or his organizations, or even closely tied to someone who has -- even if it were totally above-board and 100% defensible in front of god and man -- I would be lawyering up right now.

Not doing it seems almost criminally stupid to me.
posted by jammer at 2:07 PM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

What to watch for tonight in GA-06.
posted by Chrysostom at 2:08 PM on June 20, 2017

Shit, I kind of feel like I should maybe get a lawyer. I've only seen Trump talk on TV and read some of his tweets, but maybe that's enough to make me an accessory to something after the fact? Better to be safe than sorry.
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:09 PM on June 20, 2017 [22 favorites]

Do I believe that Obama's HUD thought it would be useful to collect data to identify whether it's serving LGBT people equitably? Yeah I do.

I agree with you completely. I worry, though, that Trump's HUD may have different priorities that Obama's did. Census data on gender preferences (or religious beliefs, for that matter) can be used in more than one way, obviously.

Also, noting that the requests for gender data came from "more that 75 members of Congress" -- I can't help but be suspicious that at least a few of those congressperson's motives for wanting that data might be less than magnanimous.
posted by TwoToneRow at 2:11 PM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

I think we can both (a) recognize and support Sessions' right to counsel and (b) note that his hiring of a lawyer is a noteworthy event.
posted by tonycpsu at 2:14 PM on June 20, 2017 [18 favorites]

Possibly some insight into today's tweet from Barbara Starr, CNN's Pentagon correspondent:

Spy satellites detect new activity at DPRK nuclear test site. Mil cmdrs HAVE updated options for Potus no indication he will order action

posted by zachlipton at 2:15 PM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

But here's the thing about the Census data, it's aggregated out at a level so you cannot identify individuals. Until 40 yrs after the census, you cannot access the individual level data. And to get at street level data, you have to fill out a metric ton of forms and promise to re-aggregate the data after you've processed it. I get that's it's a scary thought that They might know where all the gays live, but honestly, this isn't the method. In fact, historically the best way to suppress a people is to NOT count them on the census. If they don't get counted, they aren't real and real money, time, services, and support cannot be given to them.
posted by teleri025 at 2:18 PM on June 20, 2017 [41 favorites]

I mean, we're not supposed to talk about it on this thread, but a lot of adults in the world have given up on the idea of America.

And yet I still vote. Why wouldn't I?

I'm definitely down for less voters. Especially if it would raise the percentage of voters who were informed about an election's issues and candidates. Voting just because, but not being aware of your impact is worse than not voting.

Yes, this is most Republican voters.

Ultimately? Yes, it's the responsibility of parties to persuade and if they fail to do that, then they fail. Full stop.

Like most things that contain the phrase "full stop" I think this is wrong. The responsibility is with the voters, the citizens. They are not selling us a burger, but like most things in America the Capitalistic aspects are so entrenched we don't even see them.

I know a few people my age (43) who were quite liberal when we were in university and who are now considerably more conservative than they were back then.

I think most people will change. I'll bet money on people who are the loudest radicals completely reversing their position when they get older most of the time. I was more conservative when I was younger mostly because I felt the loudest Leftists were insincere. But I grew up. Just because some attention seekers are insincere doesn't mean their cause is wrong.
posted by bongo_x at 2:21 PM on June 20, 2017 [12 favorites]

I would like to walk back my earlier prediction about the rain in Atlanta being scattered thunderstorms like the past few days. Since lunch time it has really started pissing down rain.
posted by Fleebnork at 2:27 PM on June 20, 2017

There's a scene in the (really great) documentary Lambert & Stamp where Lambert is being interviewed at some swinging '60s London club, and he motions over to the crowd of hip young people dancing and says (I'm paraphrasing here) "I'm worried that if today's young revolutionaries don't find a productive way to channel their energies they'll become tomorrow's reactionaries." Those kids would be in their 60s and early 70s today and many of them probably voted for Brexit.
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:28 PM on June 20, 2017 [7 favorites]

There is a wide spectrum of reasons why people don't vote so this isn't meant to be a black and white statement but, if your issue is that politician's don't care about your needs or your vote won't change the system and you don't vote, it's your fault. If you do vote and still feel that way, it's the system's fault.

There are a lot of ways in which the system is broken and screwed up. I think it's ridiculous that I ever feel a need to pick up the phone and tell my reps how I feel. A competent government run by competent adults simply wouldn't need my input. I might prefer the other candidate but there shouldn't really be any "bad" options, just "good" and "better".

It's not and it might be impossible to fix just steadily make "less bad" but at least it's not my fucking fault. I did what I could, I voted. It's the absolute bare minimum obligation that comes with being a citizen, every November you vote. It might not change anything, but at least you did your part so you're not part of the problem.

I used to think that people should make an informed vote or no vote at all but it seems that I can't have that so I'll settle for getting just about everyone who can vote to get off their ass and do it regularly since that would be worlds better than what we're going now.
posted by VTX at 2:42 PM on June 20, 2017 [9 favorites]

Senator Lee, supposedly part of the working group writing the healthcare bill, complaining at length that he hasn't seen it.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 2:58 PM on June 20, 2017 [37 favorites]

Gosh, if only he'd do something about that complaint.
posted by Chrysostom at 3:01 PM on June 20, 2017 [17 favorites]

Spy satellites detect new activity at DPRK nuclear test site. Mil cmdrs HAVE updated options for Potus no indication he will order action

Our President is tweeting about hostile nuclear testing with the passive-aggressive vagueness of a 12-year-old tweeting about their crush.
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:05 PM on June 20, 2017 [11 favorites]

I am psyched as hell for when it turns out that a part of the AHCA drafted by one of McConnell's interns accidentally, like, makes it illegal to own toenail clippers or something.
posted by Copronymus at 3:07 PM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

Interesting guidance from Nate Cohn for results watching tonight:

Let's talk about what to expect, because I think there are a lot of misperceptions out there.

We expect a big turnout. I'd guess >250k, but it could go higher. We're starting high to be safe, but who knows.

I expect the results to be much more like a normal election, not something like Ossoff starting at 60% of the early vote like last time

Many Republicans who voted on election day turned out in early voting [in round 1]. And, Dems moved to *mail* which is reported separately and later

Fulton in-person early vote will be interesting to watch as a rough barometer. Big and ~representative. Pbly still biased D but not wildly

The mail vote is going to throw people off. It's quite D, reports late and it's tough to tell if it's in if you're not looking at right data

All of the analysis you've seen of the early vote lumps in person EV/Mail together! So the initial IPEV vote will not be as D as some expect

posted by Chrysostom at 3:13 PM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

Okay, I'm biting the bullet and throwing together a new post--I need suggestions for titles!
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 3:19 PM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

Georgia On My Mind?
posted by soren_lorensen at 3:21 PM on June 20, 2017 [11 favorites]

"All bets Ossoff"
posted by Existential Dread at 3:22 PM on June 20, 2017 [14 favorites]

We're waiting (waiting) on those midnight results from Georgia
posted by zachlipton at 3:22 PM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

"There Will Come Ossoff Rains"
posted by Rust Moranis at 3:23 PM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

Face/Ossoff
posted by Existential Dread at 3:24 PM on June 20, 2017 [24 favorites]

"i am not throwing away ossoff"
posted by entropicamericana at 3:27 PM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

The devil went down to Georgia, he was looking for some votes to steal.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 3:28 PM on June 20, 2017 [23 favorites]

(Can't) Look Away, Look Away, Look Away... Dixieland
posted by Atom Eyes at 3:31 PM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

538's GA/SC results liveblog is live.

David Graham/The Atlantic: What Is the Point of Sean Spicer's Briefings?

So either Spicer is lying and has talked to Trump; or else Spicer’s presence is totally pointless, because he’s not only unwilling but actually unable to respond to the most basic questions. How could any spokesman be so ineffective (or cowed by his boss) as to avoid such a topic, and why would anyone take his comments seriously if he is so badly out of the loop?

David Martosko says he's taken himself out of the running for Press Secretary or any other White House job. Even folks from the Daily Mail think they're too good for this sinking ship.
posted by zachlipton at 3:33 PM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

Polls close at 7pm ET in SC-05 and all but those two precincts of GA-06 (which will be 7:30)

Where to follow results:

* 538 liveblog
* NYT live results for GA-06.

*Additional Twitter commentary:

Harry Enten
Dave Wasserman
DKElections
Nate Cohn
Nate Silver
538
Jeff B/DDHQ
DecisionDesk HQ

posted by Chrysostom at 3:35 PM on June 20, 2017 [6 favorites]

I have a hard time looking at the NYT election results. I have flashbacks to November, not being able to believe what I was seeing, and telling my wife to calm down, there must be something wrong with it.
posted by bongo_x at 3:38 PM on June 20, 2017 [25 favorites]

Health Care (may) Die in Darkness

jinx

(h/t Washington Post)
posted by LeftMyHeartInSanFrancisco at 3:39 PM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

> I have a hard time looking at the NYT election results. I have flashbacks to November, not being able to believe what I was seeing

I just had an anxiety attack. That "Win Probability" meter, starting out at 98% pro-Hillary, then slowly wavering and twitching and crawling past 50% until it pegged the scale at 100% Trump. Aaaaaaugh.
posted by RedOrGreen at 3:40 PM on June 20, 2017 [17 favorites]

People Will Die in Darkness (Due to Healthcare)
posted by jferg at 3:42 PM on June 20, 2017

I guess Republican dissent about how the AHCA has been handled has had at least some small effect, because now they're saying they'll release a draft on Thursday.
posted by Copronymus at 3:42 PM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

You're a Mean One, Mr. Mitch

Jferg's take on Dieing in Darkness is good, too.
posted by LeftMyHeartInSanFrancisco at 3:42 PM on June 20, 2017 [8 favorites]

Consulting a lawyer is smart. It's likely one of the few smart things Sessions will do this year. Can we just hate on him for all his shitty bigotry and lying and not be complicit in making it shameful to protect yourself in the face of the law?

Except that Sessions is the Attorney General. At least theoretically, he is the nation's leading lawyer in both skill and ethics. So the fact that he needs defense counsel advice to avoid prison is incredibly -- and accurately -- damning. I mean, the guy perjured himself even before he started his job, at his confirmation hearing.
posted by msalt at 3:44 PM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

"Let us go in and dance once more
On the dream's glimmering floor"

Conrad Potter Aiken, famous Georgian
from Nocturne of Remembered Spring
posted by perspicio at 3:44 PM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

Except that Sessions is the Attorney General. At least theoretically, he is the nation's leading lawyer in both skill and ethics. So the fact that he needs defense counsel advice to avoid prison is incredibly -- and accurately -- damning.

Any attorney who represents himself has a fool for a client, no matter how skilled.

Sessions attorney also has a fool for a client but that's a separate matter.
posted by Justinian at 3:46 PM on June 20, 2017 [24 favorites]

Josh Marshall at TPM asks a good question: Do you think if Democrats were on the verge of passing a bill, the outlines and impact of which were clear, but were keeping the legislative text secret that Republicans would be finding themselves hamstrung about raising a public stink about the bill? Of course not. Indeed, they’d be death paneling it on top of whatever was actually true about the legislation.

That's a really good point. What's preventing the Democratic noise machine from yelling and screaming about "Death Panels" and "Taking away Grandma's Nursing Home" and "Freedom to Die in a Ditch"? Why not force Republicans to deny it constantly?
posted by RedOrGreen at 3:47 PM on June 20, 2017 [39 favorites]

at least some are making noises similar to that, unfortunately the media isn't screaming DEATH PANELS so no bigs
posted by localhuman at 3:49 PM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

Your evening scoop, from the NYT: C.I.A. Feared Flynn Could Be Blackmailed, but Its Director Told Him Secrets

Senior officials across the government became convinced in January that the incoming national security adviser, Michael T. Flynn, had become vulnerable to Russian blackmail.

At the F.B.I., the C.I.A., the Justice Department and the Office of the Director of National Intelligence — agencies responsible for keeping American secrets safe from foreign spies — career officials agreed that Mr. Flynn represented an urgent problem.

Yet nearly every day for three weeks, the new C.I.A. director, Mike Pompeo, sat in the Oval Office and briefed President Trump on the nation’s most sensitive intelligence — with Mr. Flynn listening. Mr. Pompeo has not said whether C.I.A. officials left him in the dark about their views of Mr. Flynn, but one administration official said Mr. Pompeo did not share any concerns about Mr. Flynn with the president.

Bonus WaPo: Trump seeks sharp cuts to housing aid, except for program that brings him millions

President Trump’s budget calls for sharply reducing funding to programs that shelter the poor and combat homelessness — with a notable exception: It leaves intact the type of federal housing subsidy that is paid directly to private landlords.

One of those landlords is Trump himself, who earns millions of dollars each year as a part-owner of Starrett City, the nation’s largest subsidized housing complex. Trump’s 4 percent stake in the Brooklyn housing complex earned him at least $5 million between January of last year and April 15, according to his recent financial disclosure.

posted by zachlipton at 3:49 PM on June 20, 2017 [33 favorites]

Vote Your Ossof
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 3:50 PM on June 20, 2017 [20 favorites]

Vote Your Ossof

I move that we have a winner
posted by Existential Dread at 3:54 PM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

Except that Sessions is the Attorney General. At least theoretically, he is the nation's leading lawyer in both skill and ethics. So the fact that he needs defense counsel advice to avoid prison is incredibly -- and accurately -- damning. I mean, the guy perjured himself even before he started his job, at his confirmation hearing.
posted by msalt at 7:44 AM on June 21 [+] [!]

Lawyers don't wander the land like Highlander, battling until one is acknowledged supreme, with dominance their ultimate goal. I'm a layman and I happily admit as much, but as I understand it hiring a lawyer is like hiring an auction house to sell your antiques. It's not just for the legal (artistic) expertise, it's also for avoiding conflicts of interest, understanding of particular procedures, saving your own time, etc. He's perfectly within his rights to do so, and there's a lot more to legitimately hate him for.
posted by saysthis at 3:54 PM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

New Post: Georgia on My Mind: All Bets are Ossoff.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 3:54 PM on June 20, 2017 [25 favorites]

Lawyers don't wander the land like Highlander, battling until one is acknowledged supreme, with dominance their ultimate goal.

Sure, everyone knows that, but what this comment pre-supposes is: what if they did?
posted by Chrysostom at 4:06 PM on June 20, 2017 [15 favorites]

Lawyers don't wander the land like Highlander, battling until one is acknowledged supreme, with dominance their ultimate goal.

I recognize the reference to one of Sam Shepard's lesser known plays, The Tooth of Jurisprudence
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:07 PM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

President Trump: Thank you very much. It's a great honor to be with President Poroshenko of the Ukraine -- a place that we've all been very much involved in. And you've been seeing it and everybody has been reading about it.

This reads like something a brain damaged Hitler would say.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:14 PM on June 20, 2017 [16 favorites]

we've all been very much involved in. And you've been seeing it and everybody has been reading about it.

IOW, Trump hadn't given one thought about Ukraine, couldn't locate it on the map, probably wasn't even sure it was a sovereign nation until he was given a nice show-and-tell presentation by the State Department complete with pictures and stuffed puppets.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:28 PM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

Ryan's district is exactly the type of district that should be winnable in a wave election, but has been declared off limits for over a decade by the Democrats policy of refusing to aid challengers to Republican leadership.

Meanwhile the Republicans run ads directly tying Jon Ossoff to Nancy Pelosi to shooting members of Congress.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:38 PM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

"When they go low, we fall to the floor because they punched us in the gut. Then we pat ourselves on the shoulder for not punching back."
posted by The Card Cheat at 4:49 PM on June 20, 2017 [16 favorites]

IOW, Trump hadn't given one thought about Ukraine,

He got language about arming the Ukrainians resisting the Russian invasion taken out of the Republican party platform. His campaign manager was Paul Manafort. His lawyer is Michael Cohen. Who helped hand deliver a "peace plan" for Ukraine from a pro-Russia Ukrainian politician to Flynn.

And that's just scratching the surface. Leaving out money and real estate and energy companies.

Trump knows about Ukraine.
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:51 PM on June 20, 2017 [6 favorites]

"While I greatly appreciate the efforts of President Xi & China to help with North Korea, it has not worked out. At least I know China tried!"

(real)

oh, god, now what's he going to do?
posted by pyramid termite at 5:11 PM on June 20, 2017 [1 favorite]

Trump's probably a Sinatra fan, so: somethin' stupid.
posted by box at 5:28 PM on June 20, 2017 [4 favorites]

This reads like something a brain damaged Hitler would say.

Trump's been listening to important people make speeches on important occasions for many years & so he tries to emulate what he's heard. The problem is that his brain just can't make sense of it all so what he ends up hearing is very much like the teacher in Peanuts: "Wah wah wah, wah wah wah wah." And so he thinks to himself "I can do that" & steps up to the mike & says "Wah wah wah, wah wah wah wah."
posted by scalefree at 5:41 PM on June 20, 2017 [5 favorites]

Trump's been listening to important people make speeches on important occasions for many years & so he tries to emulate what he's heard.

He also use to read a book of Hitler speeches.

Ivana Trump told her lawyer Michael Kennedy that from time to time her husband reads a book of Hitler’s collected speeches, My New Order, which he keeps in a cabinet by his bed.

Is Donald Trump Getting His Cues from Hitler? How the GOP Leader Is Following the Führer's Recipe

Adolf Hitler’s My New Order is not just any book. It came after Hitler’s two-volume Mein Kampf (German for My Struggle), and was published in 1925 and 1926 before the Nazi rise to national power and World War II. It is not just a collection of excerpts from speeches Hitler made between 1918 and 1941; it is profusely indexed and filled with details about the speeches’ impact on the media and political establishment.

posted by kirkaracha at 6:35 PM on June 20, 2017 [2 favorites]

I'm way behind on the thread. But I've got to say that I'm in GA 6th right now and I'm dying here. It's as bad as Nov 8, even though the stakes aren't quite as high. I feel like crap and I need to eat and Handel's doing way better than she has any right to.
posted by litlnemo at 6:56 PM on June 20, 2017

Multiple sites are calling it for Handel. Not enough spare votes left for Ossoff to gain back the lead.
posted by scalefree at 7:07 PM on June 20, 2017

I was prepared for Handel to win because this is the worst timeline. Oh well.
posted by Fleebnork at 7:19 PM on June 20, 2017 [3 favorites]

Marathon, not sprint, guys. Marathon, not sprint.
posted by emjaybee at 7:21 PM on June 20, 2017 [12 favorites]

My name is Tony C and I'm here to say
There's a new thread and it's right this way
posted by tonycpsu at 7:22 PM on June 20, 2017 [11 favorites]

Right. Keep in mind that both today's districts had easy R +21 & +25 wins not 7 months ago. This is a remarkable, very rapid shift.
posted by scalefree at 7:25 PM on June 20, 2017 [10 favorites]

I'm going to stay here and keep campaigning for Ossoff.
posted by bongo_x at 7:39 PM on June 20, 2017 [8 favorites]

Haha! I was so far behind I didn't know there was a new thread!
posted by litlnemo at 7:42 PM on June 20, 2017

Is Donald Trump Getting His Cues from Hitler? How the GOP Leader Is Following the Führer's Recipe

Didn't make that connection, OK. Never actually read any Hitler.
posted by scalefree at 11:24 PM on June 20, 2017

I'm more inclined to see it as the container ship collided and then did a perfectly a reasonable 180 to GTFO. There is going to be a whole lot of misinformation about this going around particularly since the where and whens of US navy vessels isn't public. Not to mention the navy's desire to CYA and spread strategic FUD.
posted by srboisvert at 2:54 PM on June 18 [2 favorites +] [!]

and the later reports are showing this to be what happened.

The Japanese coast guard also changed its assessment of when the collision happened. It had initially said that the Crystal reported the collision at 2:25 a.m. and said it had occurred five minutes earlier.

But after interviewing the container ship’s crew, the coast guard said the collision happened at 1:30 a.m.

Yoshihito Nakamura, a spokesman for the Japanese coast guard, said the change in timing was not necessarily suspicious. Crews often give priority to responding to the emergency, he said, adding that the exact timeline would become clear during the investigation.

Marine tracking data showed the Crystal steaming west toward Tokyo, but shortly after 1:30 a.m. it performed a sudden U-turn and returned to where it had been.
posted by srboisvert at 6:43 AM on June 21, 2017

David Brooks latest drivel came up in the last thread, but I missed that he said this:

And yet it has to be confessed that, at least so far, the Whitewater scandal was far more substantive than the Russia-collusion scandal now gripping Washington.

Thanks for giving him the platform for these gems of wisdom New York Times!
posted by diogenes at 10:32 AM on June 21, 2017 [2 favorites]

Oops, wrong thread!
posted by diogenes at 10:32 AM on June 21, 2017 [2 favorites]

The Hill: Australian journalist Chris Uhlmann has gone men viral with his scathing critique of President Trump
posted by East Manitoba Regional Junior Kabaddi Champion '94 at 3:34 PM on July 9, 2017

Unfortunately, Chris Uhlmann, according to everything I have ever read, is unremittingly awful. I am sure we can find someone who isn't a nightmare to say something bad about Trump.
posted by maxsparber at 7:11 PM on July 9, 2017 [1 favorite]

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