The Big Squeeze
August 26, 2024 5:07 AM Subscribe
One reporter wipes away the mystery to reveal the truth, rolled up in a very thorough article that seeks to answer: Why toilet paper keeps getting smaller and smaller
Ocean Spray's plastic bottle has gone down to 1.7 litres and they look ridiculously malformed. Just about as ridiculous as the 650ml yogourt containers that are necked down versions of the 750ml containers, which are themselves necked down litre containers.
400g cheese bars haven't shrunk in the past 5 years but it's gotta be about time. Before they were 450, then 500. Now the price has just been going up; and the sale price, once regularly $4 now seems to bottom out at just under $5.
posted by seanmpuckett at 5:25 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
400g cheese bars haven't shrunk in the past 5 years but it's gotta be about time. Before they were 450, then 500. Now the price has just been going up; and the sale price, once regularly $4 now seems to bottom out at just under $5.
posted by seanmpuckett at 5:25 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
Wouldn't a bigger roll not fit in the roll niche? Do they just wind it looser?
posted by novalis_dt at 5:40 AM on August 26
posted by novalis_dt at 5:40 AM on August 26
I'm fairly certain that the large size Snickers (or the "sharing" size--as if) is what the regular size Snickers used to be.
posted by Halloween Jack at 5:48 AM on August 26 [8 favorites]
posted by Halloween Jack at 5:48 AM on August 26 [8 favorites]
If you count calories this shrinkage has been quite apparent for years now. Everything is dropping in KCals pretty dramatically. Most processed food has shrunk by 15-33%. Great for dieting. Not so great for budgeting.
Other weird things I've noticed: The twist ties on bread loves have gotten shorter by about a lot. Which I'm fine with. Less waste.
The wax paper that individual Halls cough drops come wrapped in has gotten way less waxy. I am not fine with this as the wrapper almost always sticks now which is un-great when you are having a coughing fit.
posted by srboisvert at 6:01 AM on August 26 [12 favorites]
Other weird things I've noticed: The twist ties on bread loves have gotten shorter by about a lot. Which I'm fine with. Less waste.
The wax paper that individual Halls cough drops come wrapped in has gotten way less waxy. I am not fine with this as the wrapper almost always sticks now which is un-great when you are having a coughing fit.
posted by srboisvert at 6:01 AM on August 26 [12 favorites]
Why toilet paper keeps getting smaller and smaller
...
If you count calories this shrinkage has been quite apparent for years now
??
posted by HearHere at 6:10 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
...
If you count calories this shrinkage has been quite apparent for years now
??
posted by HearHere at 6:10 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
The article makes surprisingly little mention of what was obviously a substantive change which kicked off this process: the move from widespread residential use of one-ply paper to two-ply. That's not relevant to the last few decades, but when they talk about the extraordinary decrease in sheet count since the 1960s and 1970s, it's one of the obvious factors: two-ply is thicker and heavier than one-ply, and a thousand sheets of it straight up will not fit in a residential TP receptacle.
It does seem like they're rolling them looser nowadays, though; seemingly comically oversized rolls have 300 or fewer sheets? I happen to have two budget brands side-by-side in my closet: Amazon's house brand Presto, a 2-ply with 308 sheets per roll, and Scott 1000, a one-ply which, as the name implies, has 1000 sheets per roll. The Presto rolls, with fewer than a third as many sheets, have rolls which are about a centimeter larger in radius.
posted by jackbishop at 6:18 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
It does seem like they're rolling them looser nowadays, though; seemingly comically oversized rolls have 300 or fewer sheets? I happen to have two budget brands side-by-side in my closet: Amazon's house brand Presto, a 2-ply with 308 sheets per roll, and Scott 1000, a one-ply which, as the name implies, has 1000 sheets per roll. The Presto rolls, with fewer than a third as many sheets, have rolls which are about a centimeter larger in radius.
posted by jackbishop at 6:18 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
They're not eating the TP. Obviously what srboisvert meant is the caloric energy for their belt-fed paper furnace.
posted by jy4m at 6:21 AM on August 26 [6 favorites]
posted by jy4m at 6:21 AM on August 26 [6 favorites]
Can someone please explain to me the thinking behind the new scalloped edges on Charmin?
posted by art.bikes at 6:21 AM on August 26 [1 favorite]
posted by art.bikes at 6:21 AM on August 26 [1 favorite]
They don't show any longitudinal graphs over time. Because I swear 10-15 years ago the rolls were comically large - especially Cottenelle which would sell so many sheets on a single roll - and would not fit on the holder. I had to look for more rolls with fewer sheets instead. And now things have swung way the other way.
posted by bluefly at 6:22 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
posted by bluefly at 6:22 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
I think even the author knows that most investigative pieces like this could all end with, "And so, as with most things under capitalism, it turns out to have been a perpetual grift that made things both worse and more expensive over time."
I appreciate them doing the work, and we all need to hear it many, many more times, clearly. But if you will pardon me slipping into my midsouthern accent for a second: we all know, we all been know.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:52 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
I appreciate them doing the work, and we all need to hear it many, many more times, clearly. But if you will pardon me slipping into my midsouthern accent for a second: we all know, we all been know.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:52 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
Can someone please explain to me the thinking behind the new scalloped edges on Charmin?
The ads seem to suggest that it's so that they tear easier, but your mileage may vary I'm sure.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:57 AM on August 26
The ads seem to suggest that it's so that they tear easier, but your mileage may vary I'm sure.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:57 AM on August 26
Can someone please explain to me the thinking behind the new scalloped edges on Charmin?
I think it's safe to take the explanation in the link at face value. But I do question how many people are calling into the P&G hotline about their toilet paper.
posted by AndrewInDC at 6:57 AM on August 26 [1 favorite]
I think it's safe to take the explanation in the link at face value. But I do question how many people are calling into the P&G hotline about their toilet paper.
posted by AndrewInDC at 6:57 AM on August 26 [1 favorite]
400g cheese bars haven't shrunk in the past 5 years but it's gotta be about time. Before they were 450, then 500. Now the price has just been going up; and the sale price, once regularly $4 now seems to bottom out at just under $5.
OH MY GOD. I HAVE SO MANY OPINIONS ABOUT FUCKING CHEESE BARS IN CANADA. SO MANY.
Those long bars that are now 400g were once either 1kg or 908g (2lb) bars, depending on who was making them. They were the same height and thickness as as the 500g / 1lb bars, but twice as long. But as they have shrunk, they are now *smaller* than the bars they were originally twice the size of, but they haven't gotten any shorter, probably because of how grocery stores allocate shelf space, so instead of being a useful shape, they are long, spindly things that won't even stand up on their own while you slice them, and covering a sandwich requires like 6 slices.
At the same time, the 500g / 1lb bars have shrunk, but in the other dimension, so now they have a squarish profile instead of a rectangular one. They're usually 300-350g, so not even much smaller than the 400g bars such that even having a separate product size for that is stupid, but because they aren't the thing that goes on sale, they sometimes cost *more* than the 400g bars.
I frequently think about starting a website and a change.org petition specifically to beg grocery stores and cheese producers to get together and make cheese bricks a reasonable and useful size again. This might be my roman empire.
posted by jacquilynne at 7:01 AM on August 26 [20 favorites]
OH MY GOD. I HAVE SO MANY OPINIONS ABOUT FUCKING CHEESE BARS IN CANADA. SO MANY.
Those long bars that are now 400g were once either 1kg or 908g (2lb) bars, depending on who was making them. They were the same height and thickness as as the 500g / 1lb bars, but twice as long. But as they have shrunk, they are now *smaller* than the bars they were originally twice the size of, but they haven't gotten any shorter, probably because of how grocery stores allocate shelf space, so instead of being a useful shape, they are long, spindly things that won't even stand up on their own while you slice them, and covering a sandwich requires like 6 slices.
At the same time, the 500g / 1lb bars have shrunk, but in the other dimension, so now they have a squarish profile instead of a rectangular one. They're usually 300-350g, so not even much smaller than the 400g bars such that even having a separate product size for that is stupid, but because they aren't the thing that goes on sale, they sometimes cost *more* than the 400g bars.
I frequently think about starting a website and a change.org petition specifically to beg grocery stores and cheese producers to get together and make cheese bricks a reasonable and useful size again. This might be my roman empire.
posted by jacquilynne at 7:01 AM on August 26 [20 favorites]
Sobeys/FreshCo keeps trying to convince me new 700g cheese bars are a great deal when they're more than 2x the price of the 400g bars.
Back to toilet paper, the sales on shit tickets (you can't shit without a ticket) just baffle me. They're almost constantly on sale. A 24 pack might be $20, $18, $12 or $10 depending on week. I don't understand this, though, you'd think people would just stock up at the low price. Who runs out of a 24 pack of loo roll without having another one on standby to justify buying it at $20?
And then I see people at costco buying multiples of their, what is that, a skid? (yeah let's call it a skid, Mark) of 96 rolls or whatever and do you go through that much? Try a bidet?
posted by seanmpuckett at 7:14 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
Back to toilet paper, the sales on shit tickets (you can't shit without a ticket) just baffle me. They're almost constantly on sale. A 24 pack might be $20, $18, $12 or $10 depending on week. I don't understand this, though, you'd think people would just stock up at the low price. Who runs out of a 24 pack of loo roll without having another one on standby to justify buying it at $20?
And then I see people at costco buying multiples of their, what is that, a skid? (yeah let's call it a skid, Mark) of 96 rolls or whatever and do you go through that much? Try a bidet?
posted by seanmpuckett at 7:14 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
I agree the two ply change is very important. I mean seriously, have you tried using single ply lately? It is terrible stuff. I think two ply paper contains less than twice the wood pulp per sheet of single ply, but it is definitely a bulkier and far preferable product. I wish the comparison accounted for that, perhaps by weighing the paper. I wonder if paper manufacturing techniques also let you get more useful paper out of the same amount of material. Origami for your hole.
Not trying to deny the general shrinkflation story. Mostly I just wanted to see more data about two ply.
posted by Nelson at 7:16 AM on August 26 [3 favorites]
Not trying to deny the general shrinkflation story. Mostly I just wanted to see more data about two ply.
posted by Nelson at 7:16 AM on August 26 [3 favorites]
And then I see people at costco buying multiples of their, what is that, a skid? (yeah let's call it a skid, Mark) of 96 rolls or whatever and do you go through that much? Try a bidet?
Try buying toilet paper or a bidet during a Pandemic!
posted by art.bikes at 7:16 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
Try buying toilet paper or a bidet during a Pandemic!
posted by art.bikes at 7:16 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
We've had to fall back on single-ply because of complications in our house's waste line. Some of the rapidly-dissolving stuff that's made for camper vans/RVs and the like isn't terrible.
posted by AndrewInDC at 7:18 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
posted by AndrewInDC at 7:18 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
I don't understand this, though, you'd think people would just stock up at the low price. Who runs out of a 24 pack of loo roll without having another one on standby to justify buying it at $20?
People with limited storage space. I have nowhere to put giant packages of anything.
posted by corey flood at 7:23 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
People with limited storage space. I have nowhere to put giant packages of anything.
posted by corey flood at 7:23 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
> And then I see people at costco buying multiples of their, what is that, a skid? (yeah let's call it a skid, Mark) of 96 rolls or whatever and do you go through that much?
Unlike most foods, it's not going to go bad as long as you keep it dry and packaged. Why not stock up since the price per-sheet will inevitably have gone up the next time you have to buy any.
Granted many people don't have the free space or means for a Costco-size package of toilet paper (or if they might, it's space or money better prioritized for other things), but for those who do the economics make it a no-brainer.
posted by at by at 7:24 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
Unlike most foods, it's not going to go bad as long as you keep it dry and packaged. Why not stock up since the price per-sheet will inevitably have gone up the next time you have to buy any.
Granted many people don't have the free space or means for a Costco-size package of toilet paper (or if they might, it's space or money better prioritized for other things), but for those who do the economics make it a no-brainer.
posted by at by at 7:24 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
The real question is how much paper do you use each time to get a good wipe with no poke through.
Also, given the trend, I now know how much nothing costs. Infinity dollars!
posted by njohnson23 at 7:24 AM on August 26
Also, given the trend, I now know how much nothing costs. Infinity dollars!
posted by njohnson23 at 7:24 AM on August 26
Granted many people don't have the free space or means for a Costco-size package of toilet paper (or if they might, it's space or money better prioritized for other things), but for those who do the economics make it a no-brainer.
Also, not everyone who goes to Costco actually lives near Costco. If Costco is a two hour drive, you might only go there twice a year and stock up on non-perishables because you get most of your groceries closer to home.
Even before we had Costco near(ish) us, perhaps especially before we had Costco, my Mom was a dedicated sale shopper for canned goods and paper products and anything that wouldn't go bad. One year, as we were headed out on a 2 week vacation without my brother who was staying home to work, my mother sent me back to the storage area where we kept extra toilet paper to check that there was enough to last him through when we got back. I counted all the packages and I determined that if he used a whole role of toilet paper each time he went to the bathroom, he would only be able to go to the bathroom 8 times a day while we were away. Now, with Costco sized packages, that would be like two of the big packages, but back then it was many, many little 8 or 12 rolls packages.
posted by jacquilynne at 7:31 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
Also, not everyone who goes to Costco actually lives near Costco. If Costco is a two hour drive, you might only go there twice a year and stock up on non-perishables because you get most of your groceries closer to home.
Even before we had Costco near(ish) us, perhaps especially before we had Costco, my Mom was a dedicated sale shopper for canned goods and paper products and anything that wouldn't go bad. One year, as we were headed out on a 2 week vacation without my brother who was staying home to work, my mother sent me back to the storage area where we kept extra toilet paper to check that there was enough to last him through when we got back. I counted all the packages and I determined that if he used a whole role of toilet paper each time he went to the bathroom, he would only be able to go to the bathroom 8 times a day while we were away. Now, with Costco sized packages, that would be like two of the big packages, but back then it was many, many little 8 or 12 rolls packages.
posted by jacquilynne at 7:31 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
The latest shrinkage I noticed was some brands’ half-gallon ice cream tubs becoming 1.5-quart tubs.
posted by mbrubeck at 7:31 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
Can someone please explain to me the thinking behind the new scalloped edges on Charmin?I’m sure part of the appeal is that it differentiates them from competitors and private-label/generic brands (whose smaller margins might not make it worth retooling to match, at least in the near term).
posted by mbrubeck at 7:31 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
Friends, have you heard the Good News of my personal Lord and Savior, Toto Washlet?
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 7:36 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 7:36 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
I use a washlet from Tushy that was $50 and required no professional installation. It's great, saves a ton of paper.
I heard about it from Kyle Kinane who told a story about his girlfriend bringing it up in their neighborhood group chat during COVID shortages. Thing was, she incorrectly gave the Tushy web address.
And so, she sent her neighbors a message that said, effectively, "You know what really helped us? [Gives hardcore anal sex site link]"
posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:07 AM on August 26 [13 favorites]
I heard about it from Kyle Kinane who told a story about his girlfriend bringing it up in their neighborhood group chat during COVID shortages. Thing was, she incorrectly gave the Tushy web address.
And so, she sent her neighbors a message that said, effectively, "You know what really helped us? [Gives hardcore anal sex site link]"
posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:07 AM on August 26 [13 favorites]
TIL Enshittification is reserved for online products and services
posted by achrise at 8:15 AM on August 26 [4 favorites]
posted by achrise at 8:15 AM on August 26 [4 favorites]
I honestly thought my arse was getting bigger
posted by Phanx at 8:21 AM on August 26 [3 favorites]
posted by Phanx at 8:21 AM on August 26 [3 favorites]
I keep wondering if there’s an untapped market niche for wagon-wheel-sized TP rolls. Still 4-ply lush whatever, just 5 feet in diameter. Buy two and you’re good for a whole year!
posted by slater at 8:35 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
posted by slater at 8:35 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
If you count calories this shrinkage has been quite apparent for years now
??
It almost as if there were comments in this thread above mine talking about food shrinkflation!
But thanks for the generous double question mark!
posted by srboisvert at 8:36 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
??
It almost as if there were comments in this thread above mine talking about food shrinkflation!
But thanks for the generous double question mark!
posted by srboisvert at 8:36 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
The real question is how much paper do you use each time to get a good wipe with no poke through.
I got in touch with my inner self yesterday.
That's the last time I buy single-ply.
posted by Greg_Ace at 8:43 AM on August 26 [10 favorites]
I got in touch with my inner self yesterday.
That's the last time I buy single-ply.
posted by Greg_Ace at 8:43 AM on August 26 [10 favorites]
Granted many people don't have the free space or means for a Costco-size package of toilet paper (or if they might, it's space or money better prioritized for other things), but for those who do the economics make it a no-brainer.
A couple of months before The Pandy I accidentally ordered a massive box of Scotts 1000-sheet rolls of toilet paper because I was too focused on the unit price and didn't really realize that 12 count was referring to 12 8 packs. Fortunately, we had room in our building's storage locker.
Then the pandemic hit and TP shortages happened and it became one of the best fuck-ups I have ever done. That TP lasted for about 8 months.
posted by srboisvert at 8:44 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
A couple of months before The Pandy I accidentally ordered a massive box of Scotts 1000-sheet rolls of toilet paper because I was too focused on the unit price and didn't really realize that 12 count was referring to 12 8 packs. Fortunately, we had room in our building's storage locker.
Then the pandemic hit and TP shortages happened and it became one of the best fuck-ups I have ever done. That TP lasted for about 8 months.
posted by srboisvert at 8:44 AM on August 26 [7 favorites]
A few years ago I had to basically throw a crying shit fit to get my apartment management to replace my constantly running toilet. I was instructed that if I wanted this and had to have it, they only sell low-flow, easily clogged toilets these days and I was going to have to switch to one ply TP if I really wanted this. I will say it's great to be able to get double/triple rolls of TP since I have basically no storage space here, but it's also harder to find one ply TP when you *have* to buy it.
posted by jenfullmoon at 8:51 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
posted by jenfullmoon at 8:51 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
What the fuck is a cheese bar and without knowing what it is I'm going to go on record as demanding an answer as to why we don't have them in the United States
posted by rhymedirective at 8:55 AM on August 26 [6 favorites]
posted by rhymedirective at 8:55 AM on August 26 [6 favorites]
omg wait are you just talking about blocks of cheese? duh we have those in the U.S. I was picturing, like, some sort of chocolate bar snack made of cheese instead of chocolate for all your savory snacking needs, and now I wanna know why this doesn't exist
posted by rhymedirective at 8:57 AM on August 26 [11 favorites]
posted by rhymedirective at 8:57 AM on August 26 [11 favorites]
The latest shrinkage I noticed was some brands’ half-gallon ice cream tubs becoming 1.5-quart tubs.
Back in the day, I used to remove the lid and scrape the ice cream off the top. Then I'd try not to sprain my wrist scooping out ice cream that was frozen hard as a rock. Now there's enough of a gap (up to an inch) that the product never touches the lid unless it's been melted, and there's enough air whipped in that it won't freeze enough to not slump on the scoop.
I swear there's air in the toilet paper. They've adjusted the factory rollers loosely enough that the cat barely has to paw the roll to spin off 12 feet.
He sent me a photo of the roll positioned next to a dollar bill standing upright. They were about the same width.
I'm sure there's a flip comment in there about wiping your ass with dollar bills, but I'm just too tired for it.
posted by BlueHorse at 8:57 AM on August 26 [3 favorites]
Back in the day, I used to remove the lid and scrape the ice cream off the top. Then I'd try not to sprain my wrist scooping out ice cream that was frozen hard as a rock. Now there's enough of a gap (up to an inch) that the product never touches the lid unless it's been melted, and there's enough air whipped in that it won't freeze enough to not slump on the scoop.
I swear there's air in the toilet paper. They've adjusted the factory rollers loosely enough that the cat barely has to paw the roll to spin off 12 feet.
He sent me a photo of the roll positioned next to a dollar bill standing upright. They were about the same width.
I'm sure there's a flip comment in there about wiping your ass with dollar bills, but I'm just too tired for it.
posted by BlueHorse at 8:57 AM on August 26 [3 favorites]
Oh man, I want a cheese bar/buffet
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 9:02 AM on August 26
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 9:02 AM on August 26
I was picturing, like, some sort of chocolate bar snack made of cheese instead of chocolate for all your savory snacking needs, and now I wanna know why this doesn't exist
They're morsels rather than bars, but Moon Cheese, Whisps, and Nothing But are probably the niche you are looking for.
posted by jacquilynne at 9:09 AM on August 26
They're morsels rather than bars, but Moon Cheese, Whisps, and Nothing But are probably the niche you are looking for.
posted by jacquilynne at 9:09 AM on August 26
What the fuck is a cheese bar
It's were you go to drink old fashioneds and watch the Packers.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 9:14 AM on August 26 [16 favorites]
It's were you go to drink old fashioneds and watch the Packers.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 9:14 AM on August 26 [16 favorites]
It's were you go to drink old fashioneds and watch the Packers.
But only the gross kind of Old Fashioned that somehow involves 7-Up
As someone who frequently buys OTC meds for our household the thing I've noticed recently is that the blister packs now often include an empty row. They didn't want the bother or cost of redesigning or remanufacturing their blister packs, so now they just taunt you with visible reminders of how much less you're now getting for your money.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 9:33 AM on August 26 [10 favorites]
But only the gross kind of Old Fashioned that somehow involves 7-Up
As someone who frequently buys OTC meds for our household the thing I've noticed recently is that the blister packs now often include an empty row. They didn't want the bother or cost of redesigning or remanufacturing their blister packs, so now they just taunt you with visible reminders of how much less you're now getting for your money.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 9:33 AM on August 26 [10 favorites]
I keep wondering if there’s an untapped market niche for wagon-wheel-sized TP rolls. Still 4-ply lush whatever, just 5 feet in diameter.
Institutional rolls are pretty fucking huge. Whenever I find myself poking around a janitorial closet*, I'm always a bit agog at those enormous Kimberly-Clark rolls meant for institutional dispensers. But they're also mostly one-ply, so, not your thing.
*Which, uh, seems to happen more that you would imagine.
posted by jackbishop at 10:52 AM on August 26
Institutional rolls are pretty fucking huge. Whenever I find myself poking around a janitorial closet*, I'm always a bit agog at those enormous Kimberly-Clark rolls meant for institutional dispensers. But they're also mostly one-ply, so, not your thing.
*Which, uh, seems to happen more that you would imagine.
posted by jackbishop at 10:52 AM on August 26
I have been aghast that we North Americans use drinking water and virgin wood pulp with each toilet flush. It feels like an parody of aristocratic decadence.
That thinking, according to Shelley Vinyard, a corporate campaign director for the National Resources Defense Council and leader of its Issue With Tissue reports, has also been brutal for forests where pulp is sourced. Many smaller North American brands, such as Who Gives A Crap and Seventh Generation, use bamboo or recycled paper instead of virgin pulp. But the report found legacy brands like Charmin, Scott 100, and Quilted Northern used few, if any, sustainable ingredients.posted by spamandkimchi at 10:59 AM on August 26 [5 favorites]
“What they’ll say is that they need this [wood pulp] fiber in order to provide the softness and strength that their consumers demand. But honestly I don’t buy it,” Vinyard says.
Why toilet paper keeps getting smaller and smaller
While assholes keep getting bigger and bigger.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:09 AM on August 26 [3 favorites]
While assholes keep getting bigger and bigger.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:09 AM on August 26 [3 favorites]
I love our bidet so much I'm reluctant to travel to bidetless places.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:13 AM on August 26 [3 favorites]
posted by kirkaracha at 11:13 AM on August 26 [3 favorites]
> I keep wondering if there’s an untapped market niche for wagon-wheel-sized TP rolls. Still 4-ply lush whatever, just 5 feet in diameter. Buy two and you’re good for a whole year!
sounds like a fun new variation of the Cooper's Hill Cheese-Rolling is due!
> I swear there's air in the toilet paper. They've adjusted the factory rollers loosely enough that the cat barely has to paw the roll to spin off 12 feet.
this is why many years ago i got a holder with a flap, which inconveniently cannot fit the mega rolls that are all i find in the market now.
posted by Clowder of bats at 11:20 AM on August 26 [1 favorite]
sounds like a fun new variation of the Cooper's Hill Cheese-Rolling is due!
> I swear there's air in the toilet paper. They've adjusted the factory rollers loosely enough that the cat barely has to paw the roll to spin off 12 feet.
this is why many years ago i got a holder with a flap, which inconveniently cannot fit the mega rolls that are all i find in the market now.
posted by Clowder of bats at 11:20 AM on August 26 [1 favorite]
Why toilet paper keeps getting smaller and smaller
...
If you count calories this shrinkage has been quite apparent for years now
??
A lot of people don't know this but toilet paper is rated in terms of calories. If you are eating 5000 calories a day you need a TP that is designed to handle that kind of mess.
posted by grog at 11:24 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
...
If you count calories this shrinkage has been quite apparent for years now
??
A lot of people don't know this but toilet paper is rated in terms of calories. If you are eating 5000 calories a day you need a TP that is designed to handle that kind of mess.
posted by grog at 11:24 AM on August 26 [2 favorites]
FWIW Charmin sells 'forever rolls', with 1700 squares on a roll. I just wish someone would come up with a cohesive explainer for toilet paper and paper towel math. Mega roll, double roll, super mega roll, etc etc and they all say they equal x number of regular rolls. I never know what I'm getting. I feel like Mr. Burns in the ketchup aisle saying 'ketchup? catsup?' over and over.
posted by msbutah at 12:19 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
posted by msbutah at 12:19 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
I was just in the Twin Cities and went to pick up some of my childhood favorite coffee to bring back home. I ordered two "pounds," knowing full well they would be 12-ounce bags. of beans.
MY DUDES DUNN BROTHERS STILL SELLS BEANS BY THE ACTUAL FACTUAL POUND.
https://dunnbrothers.com/
posted by wenestvedt at 12:30 PM on August 26 [7 favorites]
MY DUDES DUNN BROTHERS STILL SELLS BEANS BY THE ACTUAL FACTUAL POUND.
https://dunnbrothers.com/
posted by wenestvedt at 12:30 PM on August 26 [7 favorites]
Just as a general thing, it seems to be harder to find good cheese by the pound. It's sold in smaller pieces to avoid sticker shock.
posted by Nancy Lebovitz at 12:42 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
posted by Nancy Lebovitz at 12:42 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
I keep wondering if there’s an untapped market niche for wagon-wheel-sized TP rolls
You mean institutional buyers?
I very much DO NOT know any college kids who lifted rolls of toilet paper from stalls somewhere on campus for use in their suites which were easily 18" across, and thus never spent money on TP for like three solid semesters. NONE.
posted by wenestvedt at 12:56 PM on August 26 [3 favorites]
You mean institutional buyers?
I very much DO NOT know any college kids who lifted rolls of toilet paper from stalls somewhere on campus for use in their suites which were easily 18" across, and thus never spent money on TP for like three solid semesters. NONE.
posted by wenestvedt at 12:56 PM on August 26 [3 favorites]
I’m no fan of corporations but this in the article is way under-discussed:
>“They know consumers are not net weight conscious. They know they’re price conscious,” Dworsky says. “So if they can try to avoid raising the price by giving the consumer less, that’s what they do.”
A simple inflation calculator suggests that the $4.35 roll from 1966 should cost ~$45 in 2024. It’s an incomplete heuristic here but that’s way off the ~$11 the actual compared roll costs. Yes many parts of the operation will have gotten cheaper; yes corporate profits are obscene and we should be regulating and taxing them way way more. AND I don’t think this is just a story about greed.
posted by wemayfreeze at 1:20 PM on August 26 [3 favorites]
>“They know consumers are not net weight conscious. They know they’re price conscious,” Dworsky says. “So if they can try to avoid raising the price by giving the consumer less, that’s what they do.”
A simple inflation calculator suggests that the $4.35 roll from 1966 should cost ~$45 in 2024. It’s an incomplete heuristic here but that’s way off the ~$11 the actual compared roll costs. Yes many parts of the operation will have gotten cheaper; yes corporate profits are obscene and we should be regulating and taxing them way way more. AND I don’t think this is just a story about greed.
posted by wemayfreeze at 1:20 PM on August 26 [3 favorites]
Oh yes, capitalism. The first toilet paper factory in the USSR was built in 1969. 8 years after the first man in space.
posted by Ideefixe at 4:09 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
posted by Ideefixe at 4:09 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
I thankfully have storage space here in my fairly modest house, so costco is the answer for supplies like garbage bags, detergent, anything paper related (it takes me more than a year to go through one of their packs of lavatory tissue and a couple years to go through the pack of kitchen paper towels, though only six months to get through the smaller pack of blue shop towels for use in the workshop). I am getting to the bottom of my anti-cling dryer sheets box, too, which I can distinctly remember purchasing in early 2019.
It's a bummer to run out of costco staples and have to fill the gap via grocery store purchases until the next time I can be arsed to trek to the mainland costco. "Dishwasher soap costs HOW much?" "Pit stick is $10???" Etc.
posted by maxwelton at 4:46 PM on August 26 [3 favorites]
It's a bummer to run out of costco staples and have to fill the gap via grocery store purchases until the next time I can be arsed to trek to the mainland costco. "Dishwasher soap costs HOW much?" "Pit stick is $10???" Etc.
posted by maxwelton at 4:46 PM on August 26 [3 favorites]
"You know what really helped us? [Gives hardcore anal sex site link]"
The "pain in the ass" jokes make themselves.
And the thing about most institutional toilet paper, including those huge rolls, is that the quality is usually deliberately (speaking of jokes that make themselves) crappy. Kind of like how the liquid hand soap in public toilets is usually scented, not exactly unpleasant, but not really something you'd want to use on your face.
posted by Halloween Jack at 5:31 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
The "pain in the ass" jokes make themselves.
And the thing about most institutional toilet paper, including those huge rolls, is that the quality is usually deliberately (speaking of jokes that make themselves) crappy. Kind of like how the liquid hand soap in public toilets is usually scented, not exactly unpleasant, but not really something you'd want to use on your face.
posted by Halloween Jack at 5:31 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
This was helpful to me as I have been confused about toilet paper for awhile now. When I was still with my ex, he always picked up the huge Costco packages. When I left, almost two years ago now, I had to start buying supermarket toilet paper, and it is just too much for me. I felt really validated when the article pointed out that you can't actually buy the "regular" rolls that all these mega-rolls are being compared to.
That said, about a year ago I visited a friend in another state. He uses "family cloths," which are rags that you wipe yourself with. It seemed like a great way to overcome my toilet paper confusion, so I cut up some old t-shirts and started doing it myself. Clean rags in a small basket, used ones in a waterproof sack hung on the towel bar.
I don't know whether my friend uses his cloths for bowel movements; I don't, because it kind of squicks me. But I pee a lot more than I poop, so the cloths save me a lot of toilet-paper related stress.
Caveat: I used cloth menstrual pads for decades, and also used cloth diapers with two out of three of my babies (I was way to busy for cloth diapers when #3 came along), so I have a history with this kind of thing.
I don't have a bidet at the moment, but we had one before I left, and I loved it. I will have one again someday, when I get around to it.
posted by Well I never at 5:51 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
That said, about a year ago I visited a friend in another state. He uses "family cloths," which are rags that you wipe yourself with. It seemed like a great way to overcome my toilet paper confusion, so I cut up some old t-shirts and started doing it myself. Clean rags in a small basket, used ones in a waterproof sack hung on the towel bar.
I don't know whether my friend uses his cloths for bowel movements; I don't, because it kind of squicks me. But I pee a lot more than I poop, so the cloths save me a lot of toilet-paper related stress.
Caveat: I used cloth menstrual pads for decades, and also used cloth diapers with two out of three of my babies (I was way to busy for cloth diapers when #3 came along), so I have a history with this kind of thing.
I don't have a bidet at the moment, but we had one before I left, and I loved it. I will have one again someday, when I get around to it.
posted by Well I never at 5:51 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
I just got back to Japan from a trip to the US and what the fuck!
You guys are still walking around all day gradually sweating a super thin — I’m being generous here — film of shit into your underpants and down your inner thighs. Fucking barbarians.
Actually I’m looking forward to moving back there soon, but it took awhile to get used to smushing feces around on my skin after every poop. If I can’t get a washlet I’ll have to rig up some kind of water-pik for my tush.
posted by Ice Cream Socialist at 6:30 PM on August 26 [5 favorites]
You guys are still walking around all day gradually sweating a super thin — I’m being generous here — film of shit into your underpants and down your inner thighs. Fucking barbarians.
Actually I’m looking forward to moving back there soon, but it took awhile to get used to smushing feces around on my skin after every poop. If I can’t get a washlet I’ll have to rig up some kind of water-pik for my tush.
posted by Ice Cream Socialist at 6:30 PM on August 26 [5 favorites]
Metafilter: some kind of water-pic for my tush.
posted by whatevernot at 6:56 PM on August 26
posted by whatevernot at 6:56 PM on August 26
Metafilter: Confused about toilet paper
posted by Greg_Ace at 7:48 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
posted by Greg_Ace at 7:48 PM on August 26 [1 favorite]
In case you read my post about cheese and thought I was exaggerating about how much I care about the cheese issue, in Facebook's memories feed, here is my post from 12 years ago today:
Remember when cheese makers first came out with those really long bars of cheese? They were 1kg or 900g -- same width but about twice the length and weight of normal 1lb or 500g brick of cheese. But gradually, they have been made lighter and narrower, so that they are now a 500g super skinny brick of cheese. And normal bricks of cheese no longer exist.
Since we're back to the same damned weight as cheese was sold in before you made it super long, can we just have normal, length/width proportional bricks of cheese back, please? The super skinny ones fall over while you're trying to slice them and can't be grated for shit.
12 years later all that had happened is that the problem has gotten 100g worse!
posted by jacquilynne at 3:43 AM on August 27 [3 favorites]
Remember when cheese makers first came out with those really long bars of cheese? They were 1kg or 900g -- same width but about twice the length and weight of normal 1lb or 500g brick of cheese. But gradually, they have been made lighter and narrower, so that they are now a 500g super skinny brick of cheese. And normal bricks of cheese no longer exist.
Since we're back to the same damned weight as cheese was sold in before you made it super long, can we just have normal, length/width proportional bricks of cheese back, please? The super skinny ones fall over while you're trying to slice them and can't be grated for shit.
12 years later all that had happened is that the problem has gotten 100g worse!
posted by jacquilynne at 3:43 AM on August 27 [3 favorites]
I thankfully have storage space here in my fairly modest house, so costco is the answer for supplies like garbage bags, detergent, anything paper related (it takes me more than a year to go through one of their packs of lavatory tissue and a couple years to go through the pack of kitchen paper towels, though only six months to get through the smaller pack of blue shop towels for use in the workshop). I am getting to the bottom of my anti-cling dryer sheets box, too, which I can distinctly remember purchasing in early 2019.
In case you too enjoy a little bulk purchase low-key dopamine hit: I like to write the date received on my bulk purchase boxes with a sharpie because it gives me medium pleasure to see how long the purchases last. It can also help you time and coordinate future Amazon Prime subscribe and saves to unlock the 15% off (when available but it now isn't always because enshittification).
posted by srboisvert at 5:46 AM on August 27
In case you too enjoy a little bulk purchase low-key dopamine hit: I like to write the date received on my bulk purchase boxes with a sharpie because it gives me medium pleasure to see how long the purchases last. It can also help you time and coordinate future Amazon Prime subscribe and saves to unlock the 15% off (when available but it now isn't always because enshittification).
posted by srboisvert at 5:46 AM on August 27
1 ROLL = 4.34x108 ROLLS!*
*all comparisons of length and mass performed under simulated relativistic conditions.
posted by gelfin at 7:02 AM on August 27
*all comparisons of length and mass performed under simulated relativistic conditions.
posted by gelfin at 7:02 AM on August 27
Hello from a land of paper mills.
Bidets cost under $30 at your local American hypercapitalism planned economy center and will last years
Also TP is a consumer item that lends itself well to bulk subscription services. Generally, your rate of consumption, once you have outfitted your toliets with basic bidets, should not change much over time
Who Gives A Crap
posted by eustatic at 7:47 AM on August 27
Bidets cost under $30 at your local American hypercapitalism planned economy center and will last years
Also TP is a consumer item that lends itself well to bulk subscription services. Generally, your rate of consumption, once you have outfitted your toliets with basic bidets, should not change much over time
Who Gives A Crap
posted by eustatic at 7:47 AM on August 27
Also, I cannot believe that we are getting stupider to the degree that we have forgotten how to tear thin sheets of paper. Very DEVO.
What are they teaching in kindergarten nowadays
posted by eustatic at 7:49 AM on August 27
What are they teaching in kindergarten nowadays
posted by eustatic at 7:49 AM on August 27
Can someone please explain to me the thinking behind the new scalloped edges on Charmin?
Do they measure sheet length peak to valley (correct) or peak to peak (technically correct if you squint I suppose but deceptive)?
Who runs out of a 24 pack of loo roll without having another one on standby to justify buying it at $20?
Poor people.
I was picturing, like, some sort of chocolate bar snack made of cheese instead of chocolate for all your savory snacking needs, and now I wanna know why this doesn't exist
I've got good news. Some distributors even call them cheese bars. Sometimes paired with a little pepperoni in the same package.
And then I see people at costco buying multiples of their, what is that, a skid? (yeah let's call it a skid, Mark) of 96 rolls or whatever and do you go through that much? Try a bidet?
Because I moved around a lot for school/work I never bought toilet paper till I was in my mid 20s. I don't use a lot so I went from my parents buying it, to having it supplied by the land lord at a rooming house, to just using whatever left over rolls the previous tenant of my next 4 month rental left behind. So it was quite a shock the first time I shared a house with someone who, for whatever reason, went thru more than a 24 pack every month. A family of 4 with that usage doesn't get a month out of a 96.
posted by Mitheral at 11:46 AM on August 30
Do they measure sheet length peak to valley (correct) or peak to peak (technically correct if you squint I suppose but deceptive)?
Who runs out of a 24 pack of loo roll without having another one on standby to justify buying it at $20?
Poor people.
I was picturing, like, some sort of chocolate bar snack made of cheese instead of chocolate for all your savory snacking needs, and now I wanna know why this doesn't exist
I've got good news. Some distributors even call them cheese bars. Sometimes paired with a little pepperoni in the same package.
And then I see people at costco buying multiples of their, what is that, a skid? (yeah let's call it a skid, Mark) of 96 rolls or whatever and do you go through that much? Try a bidet?
Because I moved around a lot for school/work I never bought toilet paper till I was in my mid 20s. I don't use a lot so I went from my parents buying it, to having it supplied by the land lord at a rooming house, to just using whatever left over rolls the previous tenant of my next 4 month rental left behind. So it was quite a shock the first time I shared a house with someone who, for whatever reason, went thru more than a 24 pack every month. A family of 4 with that usage doesn't get a month out of a 96.
posted by Mitheral at 11:46 AM on August 30
If I can’t get a washlet ...
You know, I'm so so so into the civilized method of cleaning that is the bidet. Problem is, at home, my husband agrees, but he can't seem to get around to installing one. He doesn't want just cold-water sprayer, doesn't want to put together just the seat with a hot/cold attachment, wants to get a toilet because we really need to replace the old waterhog, but the $800 toilet/bidet is too expensive to buy right now....
So, I said piss on it and bought a nice portable bidet. I had bought the first one during covid, because I was really worried about the paper crisis, which never really went down here, but I Was Prepared. I tried it, I liked it, and eventually I bought one that was a bit more upscale and saved the first one as a travel item. Take it with you to a hotel. Take it in your personal bag when you visit friends. Take it on vacation. It's absolutely fabulous when you go camping!!! I used to hate that part where I had to deal with multiple days, in the heat and the dirt, and no shower. Not a problem now. Never run out of batteries!
Ice Cream Socialist, there is no reason to ever not have your personal bidet at hand!
posted by BlueHorse at 2:53 PM on August 31
You know, I'm so so so into the civilized method of cleaning that is the bidet. Problem is, at home, my husband agrees, but he can't seem to get around to installing one. He doesn't want just cold-water sprayer, doesn't want to put together just the seat with a hot/cold attachment, wants to get a toilet because we really need to replace the old waterhog, but the $800 toilet/bidet is too expensive to buy right now....
So, I said piss on it and bought a nice portable bidet. I had bought the first one during covid, because I was really worried about the paper crisis, which never really went down here, but I Was Prepared. I tried it, I liked it, and eventually I bought one that was a bit more upscale and saved the first one as a travel item. Take it with you to a hotel. Take it in your personal bag when you visit friends. Take it on vacation. It's absolutely fabulous when you go camping!!! I used to hate that part where I had to deal with multiple days, in the heat and the dirt, and no shower. Not a problem now. Never run out of batteries!
Ice Cream Socialist, there is no reason to ever not have your personal bidet at hand!
posted by BlueHorse at 2:53 PM on August 31
I am intrigued by the product demonstration video for your upscale portable bidet. Of course it does not show someone actually washing their anus. Instead it shows us cleansing chile pepper off of a lemon. And then rinsing off wasabi. I'm trying to imagine the sensation of chiles and wasabi needing to be cleaned off my sensitive anatomy...
posted by Nelson at 3:54 PM on August 31 [1 favorite]
posted by Nelson at 3:54 PM on August 31 [1 favorite]
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I bet it's corporate greed.
Reader, it was corporate greed all along.
posted by Paladin1138 at 5:11 AM on August 26 [31 favorites]