You Can't Take It With You
October 27, 2024 8:00 AM Subscribe
Much has been made of the impending "great wealth transfer" as baby boomers and the Silent Generation pass on a combined $84.4 trillion in wealth to younger generations. Getting less attention is the "great stuff transfer," where everybody has to decipher what to do with the older generations' things. "What we're finding unilaterally across the board, pretty much without exception — you'll get a random exception — but the millennials are saying, 'No, I don't want your stuff. I barely want my stuff.'" [...] In short, boomers love stuff, and not just their stuff. They held on to their parents' stuff when they inherited it, and a lot of them are sitting with their kids' stuff in their attics now, too. [...] "The children are looking around at this volume of possessions and are completely overwhelmed," Godding said. "Their parents are also overwhelmed by the stuff, and it's almost like an avoidance strategy of like, 'Oh, I'll just have my kids deal with it.' Nobody wants to take this on."The Boomer Stuff Avalanche [Business Insider, un-gated]
The market for antiques, or good quality vintage, is still in favor of a the seller if comparing to new items of similar use, including decorative items and useful items. This boomer stuff must be beanie babies or Precious Moments, which were mass produced but marketed as collector’s items. There was a moment about 10 years ago where one could get deals on items that had retaining value, but not right now.
posted by waving at 8:17 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
posted by waving at 8:17 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
I knew this was going to have a lot to do with dinnerware. I am also going to get more than I or the market can handle, but what I really want—my grandmother’s Tupperware, heavy tumblers, and old Pyrex dishes—was donated or thrown out long ago. It was useful, after all, so it got used up or passed on.
The article really elides some problems by saying that “Millennials are more mobile than their parents” and prefer “millennial gray.” It’s because they’re renters! They want to buy houses! They want colors and maximalism—plenty of them do! But when you’re going to move, you have to live lighter and only paint what a landlord lets you.
A lot of us don’t have enough local friends with matching schedules to have a dinner party. When they do, they make simpler dishes, get takeout, or go to a restaurant—unless it’s a holiday, twice or three times a year. Back in the day, dinner parties were more common ways of entertaining friends, and they could be more elegant than local restaurants. Now we don’t live that way, in part because of the above but also because even women who stay at home with the kids don’t have that kind of time. And nobody has cooks or serving maids unless they’re rich.
posted by Countess Elena at 8:18 AM on October 27 [58 favorites]
The article really elides some problems by saying that “Millennials are more mobile than their parents” and prefer “millennial gray.” It’s because they’re renters! They want to buy houses! They want colors and maximalism—plenty of them do! But when you’re going to move, you have to live lighter and only paint what a landlord lets you.
A lot of us don’t have enough local friends with matching schedules to have a dinner party. When they do, they make simpler dishes, get takeout, or go to a restaurant—unless it’s a holiday, twice or three times a year. Back in the day, dinner parties were more common ways of entertaining friends, and they could be more elegant than local restaurants. Now we don’t live that way, in part because of the above but also because even women who stay at home with the kids don’t have that kind of time. And nobody has cooks or serving maids unless they’re rich.
posted by Countess Elena at 8:18 AM on October 27 [58 favorites]
Bicycles. So ... many ... bicycles.
posted by chavenet at 8:21 AM on October 27 [13 favorites]
posted by chavenet at 8:21 AM on October 27 [13 favorites]
(Also, fashions have just plain changed. If you laid a full table of china and flatware with three courses, and it wasn’t a murder mystery dinner or some other obvious occasion, your friends might think you’d become a pod person. Nobody wants to wonder which fork to use in their free time.)
posted by Countess Elena at 8:22 AM on October 27 [13 favorites]
posted by Countess Elena at 8:22 AM on October 27 [13 favorites]
"Who has time to use silver? You have to actually polish it," she told me. "I'm like, 'Mom, I would really love to take it, but what am I going to do with it?' So she's dejected. She puts it back in her car."
Silver plate probably. No one wants that for a reason. Sterling silver is something else. Not saying everyone should love sterling but is very valuable right now.
posted by waving at 8:33 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
Silver plate probably. No one wants that for a reason. Sterling silver is something else. Not saying everyone should love sterling but is very valuable right now.
posted by waving at 8:33 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
My parents have done a really good job paring down their stuff. My mom, incredibly anxious, has periodically made comments about how they need to go back to their basement and do more, needling my dad. So I’ve really tried to reassure them they’ve done a good job, they don’t need to worry about it, they have done enough. I want them to enjoy their retirement not worry about something they’ve already taken care of.
My grandmother was not like them. Piles everywhere, stuff everywhere. She showed them what they didn’t want to be.
I’m lucky. Friends parents are not like this.
posted by glaucon at 8:36 AM on October 27 [15 favorites]
My grandmother was not like them. Piles everywhere, stuff everywhere. She showed them what they didn’t want to be.
I’m lucky. Friends parents are not like this.
posted by glaucon at 8:36 AM on October 27 [15 favorites]
I had to let go of a lot of stuff I would have liked to keep when my mom died, because everything I took from the house had to fit into my apartment. I'll probably never own a house. If I died tomorrow, most of what I own would probably go into a dumpster. It's quite a world we've made, lol.
posted by kittens for breakfast at 8:36 AM on October 27 [12 favorites]
posted by kittens for breakfast at 8:36 AM on October 27 [12 favorites]
As is often the case with this kind of reporting, the article wants to make this about the taste of Millennials (not that that isn’t also a factor) rather than the economic conditions of Millennials.
I am pretty ruthlessly unsentimental about stuff and I don’t have any children. Our nephew can have whatever he wants when we go into a home, but unless my personality changes pretty dramatically as I near death, which I suppose would do it if anything, I will encourage him to take anything that’s still financially valuable to sell and ditch the rest of it.
I work in acquisitions in special collections librarianship, so if I am doing my job responsibly for everything I let in the door I am doing my best to calculate if the use it will provide for the people of the future is in balance with not just its cost today but the cost of keeping it for decades or even centuries to come.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 8:36 AM on October 27 [37 favorites]
I am pretty ruthlessly unsentimental about stuff and I don’t have any children. Our nephew can have whatever he wants when we go into a home, but unless my personality changes pretty dramatically as I near death, which I suppose would do it if anything, I will encourage him to take anything that’s still financially valuable to sell and ditch the rest of it.
I work in acquisitions in special collections librarianship, so if I am doing my job responsibly for everything I let in the door I am doing my best to calculate if the use it will provide for the people of the future is in balance with not just its cost today but the cost of keeping it for decades or even centuries to come.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 8:36 AM on October 27 [37 favorites]
Ouch. You don't own stuff; stuff owns you.
This hits close to home. I have too much stuff (chavenet, you see me...also, I'm a sucker for tools and old electronics), but Mrs C has set some limits and leans on me to get rid of what I'll never use. My Mom (90) has been pretty good about cutting down but there's still reams of stuff that won't likely have a future. Dated furniture, silver and china that will just be cashed in where possible. Trash that was once deemed collectable (Cherish Teddies, Mom? wtf..)
One friend is a hoarder. -sigh- His wife left him because of it.
An elderly couple next door without heirs - husband died, wife went downhill - and one day a 40 yd bin is in the driveway, and all their worldly stuff is being marched into it. I can't stop thinking about that, when I look at my own stash, or consider my friend's midden.
posted by Artful Codger at 8:41 AM on October 27 [11 favorites]
This hits close to home. I have too much stuff (chavenet, you see me...also, I'm a sucker for tools and old electronics), but Mrs C has set some limits and leans on me to get rid of what I'll never use. My Mom (90) has been pretty good about cutting down but there's still reams of stuff that won't likely have a future. Dated furniture, silver and china that will just be cashed in where possible. Trash that was once deemed collectable (Cherish Teddies, Mom? wtf..)
One friend is a hoarder. -sigh- His wife left him because of it.
An elderly couple next door without heirs - husband died, wife went downhill - and one day a 40 yd bin is in the driveway, and all their worldly stuff is being marched into it. I can't stop thinking about that, when I look at my own stash, or consider my friend's midden.
posted by Artful Codger at 8:41 AM on October 27 [11 favorites]
Yeah, I can afford to say that I won’t get rid of xyz furniture when my parents die because it comes with their house. But if it didn’t? If I had to fit everything into an apartment? It would be a really different story.
I had to kind of face a version of this though as I tried to refurnish after a divorce, and my kid was like “uh, no mom, like….don’t bother replacing that, I don’t care if I don’t have one of those.”
posted by corb at 8:44 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
I had to kind of face a version of this though as I tried to refurnish after a divorce, and my kid was like “uh, no mom, like….don’t bother replacing that, I don’t care if I don’t have one of those.”
posted by corb at 8:44 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
And 1,000,000 baby grand pianos.
posted by atomicstone at 8:44 AM on October 27 [16 favorites]
posted by atomicstone at 8:44 AM on October 27 [16 favorites]
My problem is that I hang onto things because I imagine I will eventually find a use for them. And I do! Just two weeks ago, I dug some decades-old bamboo skewers out of the back of my kitchen junk drawer. I bought them decades ago, back when I used to barbecue a lot. Held on to them for no particular reason. Then recently, I had a need for some plant stakes in my garden. Wait! What about those old skewers? Perfect! These occasional successes just reinforce my pack rat sensibilities.
posted by SPrintF at 8:46 AM on October 27 [44 favorites]
posted by SPrintF at 8:46 AM on October 27 [44 favorites]
maybe private equity firms can buy up and consolidate thrift shops and swap meets, and siphon off a significant percentage of our boomers' junk the way they've done with healthcare and nursing homes.
posted by Jon_Evil at 8:52 AM on October 27 [60 favorites]
posted by Jon_Evil at 8:52 AM on October 27 [60 favorites]
I have a 2 bdrm apartment, 3 kids, and 2 cats - space for stuff is at a huge premium, and acquiring new things already makes me somewhat anxious. At a rough guess going through the stuff we already have and sorting out what we should keep, donate or trash is a task that would take several hundreds of hours, which factoring in the spare time we have to do that, means a timespan of months, even if attacked regularly and diligently. If we had to deal with the stuff the parents have - I can’t imagine a realistic solution other than junking most of it.
posted by Jon Mitchell at 8:52 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
posted by Jon Mitchell at 8:52 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
... and all the books that nobody wants. This makes me sad.
posted by Termite at 8:59 AM on October 27 [25 favorites]
posted by Termite at 8:59 AM on October 27 [25 favorites]
I have my grandmother's China that my dad kept. I really have no use for it and it is taking up space in my basement. I also have like a bajillion pieces of railroad "silver" that my dad bought us off of eBay, along with a ton of model train stuff. The things I actually care about, like the wooden sculpture of a crying woman that my Mom made in college, I already have. And I have like 1800 CDs of my own music that I have to decide what to do with, because for sure nobody is buying them unless I become famous, which hopefully I will not.
I did go through all of my dad's vinyl and picked out what I wanted. And I now have custody of all of the family 8mm film and photographs, which are very precious. Thankfully nobody collected tchotchkes. My mom had some very valuable family silver but it got stolen during a burglary many years ago.
I also want her vintage cast iron potato masher.
The only thing I will gladly collect are books and tools.
posted by grumpybear69 at 9:04 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
I did go through all of my dad's vinyl and picked out what I wanted. And I now have custody of all of the family 8mm film and photographs, which are very precious. Thankfully nobody collected tchotchkes. My mom had some very valuable family silver but it got stolen during a burglary many years ago.
I also want her vintage cast iron potato masher.
The only thing I will gladly collect are books and tools.
posted by grumpybear69 at 9:04 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
Not saying everyone should love sterling but is very valuable right now.
It’s true that the commodity price of silver is high right now, but I recently investigated selling my sterling and found that it would cost over $10,000 to buy it new but I would get only $700 for selling it. The good news is that you can indeed put it in the dishwasher, as long as it’s not touching anything stainless. I’ve been doing it for the past month and am finally enjoying using it after 35 years of it sitting in a closet, unused due to the supposed need to polish it. It’s really beautiful too.
posted by HotToddy at 9:12 AM on October 27 [31 favorites]
It’s true that the commodity price of silver is high right now, but I recently investigated selling my sterling and found that it would cost over $10,000 to buy it new but I would get only $700 for selling it. The good news is that you can indeed put it in the dishwasher, as long as it’s not touching anything stainless. I’ve been doing it for the past month and am finally enjoying using it after 35 years of it sitting in a closet, unused due to the supposed need to polish it. It’s really beautiful too.
posted by HotToddy at 9:12 AM on October 27 [31 favorites]
A few years ago my mom got really into Swedish Death Cleaning, which seems like a more Scandinavian stark honesty Marie Kondo kind of thing. Anyway, I'm really glad she did - I know she got rid of all sorts of stuff.
Re: Houses and places to put things, right. Mrs. Smedly's folks have a little cash tucked away, and we've talked about them helping us get set up with a down payment on a house, but (laughs in Seattle house prices) even if that down payment was totally taken care of, there's no way we could afford the mortgage. I guess we just rent forever. I never cared that much about owning property but, yeesh. It seems a funny kind of way for a world to be set up.
maybe private equity firms can buy up and consolidate thrift shops and swap meets, and siphon off a significant percentage of our boomers' junk the way they've done with healthcare and nursing homes
Damn, that's evil.
posted by Jon_Evil at 8:52 AM on October 27
Oh, OK. Fair enough, then.
posted by Smedly, Butlerian jihadi at 9:13 AM on October 27 [23 favorites]
Re: Houses and places to put things, right. Mrs. Smedly's folks have a little cash tucked away, and we've talked about them helping us get set up with a down payment on a house, but (laughs in Seattle house prices) even if that down payment was totally taken care of, there's no way we could afford the mortgage. I guess we just rent forever. I never cared that much about owning property but, yeesh. It seems a funny kind of way for a world to be set up.
maybe private equity firms can buy up and consolidate thrift shops and swap meets, and siphon off a significant percentage of our boomers' junk the way they've done with healthcare and nursing homes
Damn, that's evil.
posted by Jon_Evil at 8:52 AM on October 27
Oh, OK. Fair enough, then.
posted by Smedly, Butlerian jihadi at 9:13 AM on October 27 [23 favorites]
Mom passed almost five years ago, and I'm finally down to the worst: her paintings. Half a dozen oils that she worked on in her vanishing spare time, each one in turn sitting on the kitchen window sill while she chased three kids. Turpentine still makes me cry.
They're in the basement for now, but will eventually need to go. Maybe in a few more months.
posted by SunSnork at 9:14 AM on October 27 [22 favorites]
They're in the basement for now, but will eventually need to go. Maybe in a few more months.
posted by SunSnork at 9:14 AM on October 27 [22 favorites]
My father turns 96 in about a month. He lives in a 4000 sq ft house filled with all the surpassingly beautiful handmade reproductions of Colonial Williamsburg era furniture he has made since I was a child. It's far too beautiful to trash, none of it fits physically or aesthetically in the 1200 sq ft condo I share with my wife and two kids, and I have No Idea what the fuck I'm going to do with it.
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 9:15 AM on October 27 [25 favorites]
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 9:15 AM on October 27 [25 favorites]
Mother-in-law passed away 8 years ago and we're still staring at a tower of boxes in the garage.. and that was after a year of cleaning out the house where she lived and accumulated Things for fifty years. And she wasn't a hoarder by any means.
And Hummel figurines. Don't get me started. MIL adored her collection but would always show us the latest price guide and tell us how much this stuff was going to be worth after she was gone. It's not. Nobody wants them.
To all of you colllecting Funko Pops and leaving them in boxes on your living room shelf... you're repeating our mistakes. Cut it out.
posted by JoeZydeco at 9:16 AM on October 27 [54 favorites]
And Hummel figurines. Don't get me started. MIL adored her collection but would always show us the latest price guide and tell us how much this stuff was going to be worth after she was gone. It's not. Nobody wants them.
To all of you colllecting Funko Pops and leaving them in boxes on your living room shelf... you're repeating our mistakes. Cut it out.
posted by JoeZydeco at 9:16 AM on October 27 [54 favorites]
My parents are hoarders. A newspaper can’t be recycled without going through it to see if any articles need to be clipped and saved. Boxes in the attic still contain their college textbooks. The novelty of a geology text that talks about plate tectonics as an unproven theory fades fast when you’re surrounded by so much stuff. I’ve come to peace with the fact that it’s not worth fighting about and so many items do bring genuine joy still to my parents despite it all. I’m already practicing being stoic about the fact that a vast majority will go straight to a dumpster when they pass, because it’s far too much to sort through while I still have a career. My sister and I have let them know that, but we don’t rub it in.
It’s nice to dream that things can find new homes, but the reality is that a lot of stuff, whether old books or toasters from the 80’s that could probably work right again if someone spent an afternoon to fix it, would have been trash before and there’s little reason to feel bad when it is in the future. Dishes and silverware are indeed some of the more emotionally fraught items because they are associated with a lifetime of special occasions - but what does it mean if they won’t see that use again? I’m still pre-grappling with that.
posted by meinvt at 9:17 AM on October 27 [11 favorites]
It’s nice to dream that things can find new homes, but the reality is that a lot of stuff, whether old books or toasters from the 80’s that could probably work right again if someone spent an afternoon to fix it, would have been trash before and there’s little reason to feel bad when it is in the future. Dishes and silverware are indeed some of the more emotionally fraught items because they are associated with a lifetime of special occasions - but what does it mean if they won’t see that use again? I’m still pre-grappling with that.
posted by meinvt at 9:17 AM on October 27 [11 favorites]
By now I guess it's clear that the "reverse mortgage" idea was a play to turn elderly people's real estate over to private equity instead of their kids en-masse.
posted by mhoye at 9:20 AM on October 27 [17 favorites]
posted by mhoye at 9:20 AM on October 27 [17 favorites]
My father turns 96 in about a month. He lives in a 4000 sq ft house filled with all the surpassingly beautiful handmade reproductions of Colonial Williamsburg era furniture he has made since I was a child. It's far too beautiful to trash, none of it fits physically or aesthetically in the 1200 sq ft condo I share with my wife and two kids, and I have No Idea what the fuck I'm going to do with it.
I would be delighted to redo my house in Colonial Williamsburg for the right price. I am seriously hoping this great sell off will liberate a lot of quality wood furniture at reasonable prices.
posted by HotToddy at 9:22 AM on October 27 [29 favorites]
Silver plate probably. No one wants that for a reason. Sterling silver is something else. Not saying everyone should love sterling but is very valuable right now.
And yet, m unless the market's changed though I suspect it's gotten even more meh, it will likely be bought and melted down for the ounces of precious metal. That's what we were informed a few years ago when my mom passed and all her silver, table settings, plates and platters, tea sets, gravy bowls were seen by the auctioneer.
We went thought this - every bit of it - from the years of begging us to take things home from every visit, to the left-with-it-all when she passed unexpectedly, to the agonizing days of pouring though it all and needing to make snap decisions because everyone had to get back to their work and lives in a matter of days, to the still have boxes of photos and documents and arcane assorted stuff in the basement and spare room closets eight years later.
And now we're facing it ourselves, with no kids to awkwardly refuse it or for us to rudely dump it all on - and no nieces or nephews within 300-500 miles who we'd dare to invite to choose a few things. We've never bought a lot, but what we've bought has mostly been select and we've been mostly selective about what we've kept or collected - which is to say some nice and desirable artwork, some very nice glasswork, a decent collection of folk art and an eclectic array of ephemera and architectural salvage which litter both rooms and our gardens and porches. I've long fantasized about taking a short-term lease on a space where I could go for a few hours a day to actually speak with the people who might like to take these beloved items for their next decade or three, just to have the conversations, to know someone might actually have some sense of where they came from and the stories behind them - but I imagine most of it all will end up in an auction, in-person or online, in which no one will ever hear a whisper of any item's backstory, making every piece of it more stuff and less possession.
posted by thecincinnatikid at 9:23 AM on October 27 [11 favorites]
And yet, m unless the market's changed though I suspect it's gotten even more meh, it will likely be bought and melted down for the ounces of precious metal. That's what we were informed a few years ago when my mom passed and all her silver, table settings, plates and platters, tea sets, gravy bowls were seen by the auctioneer.
We went thought this - every bit of it - from the years of begging us to take things home from every visit, to the left-with-it-all when she passed unexpectedly, to the agonizing days of pouring though it all and needing to make snap decisions because everyone had to get back to their work and lives in a matter of days, to the still have boxes of photos and documents and arcane assorted stuff in the basement and spare room closets eight years later.
And now we're facing it ourselves, with no kids to awkwardly refuse it or for us to rudely dump it all on - and no nieces or nephews within 300-500 miles who we'd dare to invite to choose a few things. We've never bought a lot, but what we've bought has mostly been select and we've been mostly selective about what we've kept or collected - which is to say some nice and desirable artwork, some very nice glasswork, a decent collection of folk art and an eclectic array of ephemera and architectural salvage which litter both rooms and our gardens and porches. I've long fantasized about taking a short-term lease on a space where I could go for a few hours a day to actually speak with the people who might like to take these beloved items for their next decade or three, just to have the conversations, to know someone might actually have some sense of where they came from and the stories behind them - but I imagine most of it all will end up in an auction, in-person or online, in which no one will ever hear a whisper of any item's backstory, making every piece of it more stuff and less possession.
posted by thecincinnatikid at 9:23 AM on October 27 [11 favorites]
Oh man do I feel this article. I have so much stuff cluttering my house, much of which came from my mom or, through her, my grandparents. It would feel so amazing to magically have it all gone but I can’t bring myself to do it. The really painful part of getting rid of these things is confronting how little they’re worth to other people. Even for non-sentimental things… e.g., I’ve been trying to get rid of a perfectly good lawn mower on Facebook Marketplace, and I keep getting lowballed: “would you take $20 for it?” Sigh. Rationally I should just accept that this is the market, but it’s offensive.
posted by qxntpqbbbqxl at 9:23 AM on October 27 [13 favorites]
posted by qxntpqbbbqxl at 9:23 AM on October 27 [13 favorites]
By now I guess it's clear that the "reverse mortgage" idea was a play to turn elderly people's real estate over to private equity instead of their kids en-masse.
My folks have a reverse mortgage on their condo and frankly it is great. My mom doesn't have a mortgage payment and can't be kicked out. When she passes we can either sell the house if it is worth more than the balance on the mortgage or just give it to the bank. They got a bunch of cash from the bank since it is reverse and that helped make the last 10 years of their life more enjoyable. The only house I really cared about, the one I grew up in, was sold in 1999 because my alcoholic grandfather kept falling down the stairs. So I gave up on "inheriting a house" many years ago and, frankly, I'm better off for it. Because I wouldn't want to live where I grew up and I definitely wouldn't want to have to deal with the drama of trying to sell the house from afar, especially if I cared about it. I have no emotional attachment to their condo.
posted by grumpybear69 at 9:26 AM on October 27 [14 favorites]
My folks have a reverse mortgage on their condo and frankly it is great. My mom doesn't have a mortgage payment and can't be kicked out. When she passes we can either sell the house if it is worth more than the balance on the mortgage or just give it to the bank. They got a bunch of cash from the bank since it is reverse and that helped make the last 10 years of their life more enjoyable. The only house I really cared about, the one I grew up in, was sold in 1999 because my alcoholic grandfather kept falling down the stairs. So I gave up on "inheriting a house" many years ago and, frankly, I'm better off for it. Because I wouldn't want to live where I grew up and I definitely wouldn't want to have to deal with the drama of trying to sell the house from afar, especially if I cared about it. I have no emotional attachment to their condo.
posted by grumpybear69 at 9:26 AM on October 27 [14 favorites]
I'm in a similar bind. I am not a hoarder, though do have some of those tendencies. But I am a boardgamer, and a thrifter, and have thousands of games. Enough that they have gone from providing joy, to becoming a burden.
When I nearly died in the fall of 2022, and didn't, it hit me what a burden this was going to be on my family to deal with. I need to run some BGG auctions or hit the bay...
posted by Windopaene at 9:28 AM on October 27 [5 favorites]
When I nearly died in the fall of 2022, and didn't, it hit me what a burden this was going to be on my family to deal with. I need to run some BGG auctions or hit the bay...
posted by Windopaene at 9:28 AM on October 27 [5 favorites]
We are right now figuring out what to do with my mother-in-law's stuff as she moves from a one-bedroom retirement apartment into a room in a memory care unit (sigh). You wouldn't think a one-bedroom apartment could hold so much stuff, but there's a lot of stuff. My parents built their house with the intention of aging in place and so far so good, but they consequently have so much stuff and I don't want any of it. The collection of hundreds of prized Christmas ornaments, every one with a happy memory attached, and I don't celebrate Christmas. I think one of my cousins will get those.
posted by Daily Alice at 9:30 AM on October 27 [2 favorites]
posted by Daily Alice at 9:30 AM on October 27 [2 favorites]
I've told my parents that if they give me their wedding china, it's going to get used daily and put in the dishwasher until it's all broken. Same with the silver and crystal. These were only brought out on holidays as a kid.
I bought a set of Waterford crystal claret
glasses a few years ago for cheap. They are my daily wine glasses and it makes me feel very fancy.
posted by nestor_makhno at 9:31 AM on October 27 [22 favorites]
I bought a set of Waterford crystal claret
glasses a few years ago for cheap. They are my daily wine glasses and it makes me feel very fancy.
posted by nestor_makhno at 9:31 AM on October 27 [22 favorites]
Don't get me started. MIL adored her collection but would always show us the latest price guide and tell us how much this stuff was going to be worth after she was gone. It's not. Nobody wants them.
As much as Antiques Roadshow is a contributor to this problem, they offer a bracing antidote as well: their “Vintage” episodes take a show from 20 years ago and add in current estimates for the item in question. For everything that’s gone up in the ensuing time (midcentury modern furniture, anything by Tiffany) there’s something where the value has plunged (antique furniture, art pottery).
posted by Horace Rumpole at 9:32 AM on October 27 [17 favorites]
As much as Antiques Roadshow is a contributor to this problem, they offer a bracing antidote as well: their “Vintage” episodes take a show from 20 years ago and add in current estimates for the item in question. For everything that’s gone up in the ensuing time (midcentury modern furniture, anything by Tiffany) there’s something where the value has plunged (antique furniture, art pottery).
posted by Horace Rumpole at 9:32 AM on October 27 [17 favorites]
I would be delighted to redo my house in Colonial Williamsburg for the right price. I am seriously hoping this great sell off will liberate a lot of quality wood furniture at reasonable prices.
Seriously, hit me up. If you're going to cherish it, I'll give you a more than fair price.
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 9:33 AM on October 27 [31 favorites]
Seriously, hit me up. If you're going to cherish it, I'll give you a more than fair price.
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 9:33 AM on October 27 [31 favorites]
The smartest thing I ever did, stuffwise, was move across the country. After my parents died, I was the sentimental one and the one with the garage . My brothers were ruthless, lived in small apartments, wanted nothing and so almost everything was sold. My parents had good taste and the money to indulge in antiques and art and stuff did sell. I mourn some of it still, I’ve slowly been rebuilding my mother’s cookbook collection. I don’t know why I thought I wouldn’t want them. But whatever wasn’t sold ended up in that garage. It would still be moldering away there (well, actually, Helene might have taken care of that) if I hadn’t decided to leave and had to clear it all out and pare it down, down, down.
The art, though. We’re all artists. There is so much, so many sketchbooks and portfolios and paintings and photos, work by relatives, work by friends, oh, it goes on and it all takes up space. Work by my aunt, my mother, a few pieces by my grandmother. A sampler by an ancestor. An unsettling painting of an ancestor as a child. I can’t part with any of it, most of it has no value, but it’s our art. My daughter is doomed.
posted by mygothlaundry at 9:34 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
The art, though. We’re all artists. There is so much, so many sketchbooks and portfolios and paintings and photos, work by relatives, work by friends, oh, it goes on and it all takes up space. Work by my aunt, my mother, a few pieces by my grandmother. A sampler by an ancestor. An unsettling painting of an ancestor as a child. I can’t part with any of it, most of it has no value, but it’s our art. My daughter is doomed.
posted by mygothlaundry at 9:34 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
The older I get, the less I want stuff. Even sentimental stuff. The only reason to have stuff is to prevent me from needing to buy more stuff. I'd rather borrow a tool than own it, unless I use it multiple times a year. I don't want my parents' stuff. If I were smart I'd get into the dumpster business.
posted by rikschell at 9:35 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
posted by rikschell at 9:35 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
Buddha had to preach against attachment for *reasons*.
posted by aleph at 9:38 AM on October 27 [20 favorites]
posted by aleph at 9:38 AM on October 27 [20 favorites]
I am 1) the child of serious antique collectors who 2) is currently cataloging the collection for sale at an auction house you have heard of.
The different between what they paid and what we can reasonably expect to make on the sale is brutal. A bloodbath. But! It is slightly less brutal than it was a few years ago. The market is changing, as it always does, and “old brown furniture” is juuuust beginning to be in fashion again, here and there, especially pieces that are useful and sturdy. I have a theory that folks are tired of disposable mass-produced objects like tables when you can get something made from hardwood that’s already lasted 200 years for less than what Pottery Barn is charging.
posted by minervous at 9:39 AM on October 27 [27 favorites]
The different between what they paid and what we can reasonably expect to make on the sale is brutal. A bloodbath. But! It is slightly less brutal than it was a few years ago. The market is changing, as it always does, and “old brown furniture” is juuuust beginning to be in fashion again, here and there, especially pieces that are useful and sturdy. I have a theory that folks are tired of disposable mass-produced objects like tables when you can get something made from hardwood that’s already lasted 200 years for less than what Pottery Barn is charging.
posted by minervous at 9:39 AM on October 27 [27 favorites]
The last time I participated in a thread on this subject, I made a comment that I was going to pare down the items that I thought my heirs (my nephews) should keep to a small, manageable storage box, that anything else in the house was fair game to keep, sell or throw away as they see fit. But, I was going to see insistent that the small set of items were important. That was followed up by a couple of comments that I was a bad person and I should feel bad--that nobody wants your stuff, no matter how small. There's some, how should I put it, "maximalism" around this topic from time to time.
posted by gimonca at 9:41 AM on October 27 [14 favorites]
posted by gimonca at 9:41 AM on October 27 [14 favorites]
We bought a church building three years ago for office space and were informed the house directly north of it would likely go on sale because the occupant was ailing. Indeed, it eventually went on the market. We toured it before we bought it -- she had been a hoarder and even with the kids going through the house and taking what they actually wanted, there was so much stuff left behind, none of it in good repair or worth salvaging or giving away. This included the house itself; it was so poorly maintained that when I stood on the porch the first time it started to give way under me.
We tore it down with the remaining stuff inside and had it all carted away; it was all that could be done. The parcel it was on is now resting as the dirt settles from the removal, and will soon be a garden with local plants. A much more minimal and pleasant use of the space.
posted by jscalzi at 9:41 AM on October 27 [46 favorites]
We tore it down with the remaining stuff inside and had it all carted away; it was all that could be done. The parcel it was on is now resting as the dirt settles from the removal, and will soon be a garden with local plants. A much more minimal and pleasant use of the space.
posted by jscalzi at 9:41 AM on October 27 [46 favorites]
I love stuff. It *hurt* when my parents sold their house and moved into a condo and I had to get ride of 99% of my childhood stuff as it wouldn't fit into my apartment. But I can't afford a house. I really think most of this hatred of stuff is just us living in smaller spaces then our parents. By my age, my parents had a large house in the suburbs, and I'm in a 1.5 bedroom apartment. I dream of someday having the space to do glassblowing again, to rebuild my old RPG collection, to collect dragon statues, but I just don't have the space.
posted by Canageek at 9:43 AM on October 27 [21 favorites]
posted by Canageek at 9:43 AM on October 27 [21 favorites]
Hahaha, my dad is thrice divorced in his 70s and now newly moved to Florida after a disastrous move to a new house in suburb Oklahoma. Everything he used to own that I'd want is already gone. Nothing from my childhood remains.
posted by downtohisturtles at 9:45 AM on October 27 [2 favorites]
posted by downtohisturtles at 9:45 AM on October 27 [2 favorites]
That was followed up by a couple of comments that I was a bad person and I should feel bad--that nobody wants your stuff, no matter how small.
The thriving estate sale economy says otherwise. Don't feel bad.
posted by grumpybear69 at 9:49 AM on October 27 [8 favorites]
The thriving estate sale economy says otherwise. Don't feel bad.
posted by grumpybear69 at 9:49 AM on October 27 [8 favorites]
I love stuff. It *hurt* when my parents sold their house and moved into a condo and I had to get ride of 99% of my childhood stuff as it wouldn't fit into my apartment. But I can't afford a house. I really think most of this hatred of stuff is just us living in smaller spaces then our parents. By my age, my parents had a large house in the suburbs, and I'm in a 1.5 bedroom apartment. I dream of someday having the space to do glassblowing again, to rebuild my old RPG collection, to collect dragon statues, but I just don't have the space.
At least some of it is! I grew up in a very small house by contemporary standards, but we had two built-in cabinets in the (small) dining room and a full basement and a pantry closet and a linen closet plus bedroom closets and a coat closet. So of course we had the good china for family gatherings - it was nice, it was fun, Christmas is time for the pretty china and grandmother's sterling service, etc.
Also, I think people are having fewer children. I live in a large, terrible house that I cannot afford to fix and am hoping to sell up and move to a condo. I've inherited...all the stuff. My great aunts' travel mementos, my great grandparents' antiques, my parents' wedding stuff, the dresser my great uncle or possibly third cousin built because he was a woodworker, etc. My great aunt the artist's art and art she was given and bought from fellow artists. I have a cabinet that my great aunt bought unfinished in the sixties and painted and finished with her own hands. I have things from Sweden from my great grandfather's second wife. And that's before you start on anything I bought! Frankly I'm lucky I didn't have to take the piano, speaking of white elephants.
And I love most of this stuff. It is powerfully imbued with memories for me. But I don't have a kid. My partner's sibling has a kid, my partner's cousin has a kid. I'll probably leave them (should the world not collapse, should I not be struck down with something before adjusting the will) anything really valuable so they can sell it and some of the cool small stuff (we have these antique dala pigs from the old country, for instance, and they're about the size of a pop can) but the rest will all get sold for a pittance or given away.
I just think that some people really like stuff in a way that other people just don't get. Being in a room with my family's stuff, knowing that here is the same chair my grandmother sat in and the same mirror my aunt looked in makes me feel happy and secure. I like to look at these things and touch them and remember, and I know from countless conversations about minimalism that for a very large percentage of people, a photo on their phone would be just as good as the thing itself.
posted by Frowner at 9:57 AM on October 27 [29 favorites]
At least some of it is! I grew up in a very small house by contemporary standards, but we had two built-in cabinets in the (small) dining room and a full basement and a pantry closet and a linen closet plus bedroom closets and a coat closet. So of course we had the good china for family gatherings - it was nice, it was fun, Christmas is time for the pretty china and grandmother's sterling service, etc.
Also, I think people are having fewer children. I live in a large, terrible house that I cannot afford to fix and am hoping to sell up and move to a condo. I've inherited...all the stuff. My great aunts' travel mementos, my great grandparents' antiques, my parents' wedding stuff, the dresser my great uncle or possibly third cousin built because he was a woodworker, etc. My great aunt the artist's art and art she was given and bought from fellow artists. I have a cabinet that my great aunt bought unfinished in the sixties and painted and finished with her own hands. I have things from Sweden from my great grandfather's second wife. And that's before you start on anything I bought! Frankly I'm lucky I didn't have to take the piano, speaking of white elephants.
And I love most of this stuff. It is powerfully imbued with memories for me. But I don't have a kid. My partner's sibling has a kid, my partner's cousin has a kid. I'll probably leave them (should the world not collapse, should I not be struck down with something before adjusting the will) anything really valuable so they can sell it and some of the cool small stuff (we have these antique dala pigs from the old country, for instance, and they're about the size of a pop can) but the rest will all get sold for a pittance or given away.
I just think that some people really like stuff in a way that other people just don't get. Being in a room with my family's stuff, knowing that here is the same chair my grandmother sat in and the same mirror my aunt looked in makes me feel happy and secure. I like to look at these things and touch them and remember, and I know from countless conversations about minimalism that for a very large percentage of people, a photo on their phone would be just as good as the thing itself.
posted by Frowner at 9:57 AM on October 27 [29 favorites]
It was kind of cute to discover that one of the things my parents had in common was that they’d both become hoarders in their old age, but it did cost 5k to get it even sort of managed - by a crew with a giant dumpster like on the show. My mother had passed (her dying intention was to get rid of it all, but I couldn’t do that) and it was an emotionally difficult process to go through her things afterwards even as the sheer amount made it grueling and physically difficult. My feeling of safe middle classness does in part mean being surrounded by stuff because it was the way I was raised but hopefully culling periods and becoming more discerning and skeptical of consumerism can keep me from “going the other way”
posted by Selena777 at 10:05 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
posted by Selena777 at 10:05 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
My great-grandmother kept an old steamer trunk full of papers, photos and mementoes. In the family, we cherish that trunk. One of my retirement projects is to go through and do digitizing and commentary on items in there, it's an absolute treasure trove of information about that branch of the family and the world they lived in. The oldest items date to the 1870, the newest items are of me and my siblings as toddlers.
On the other hand, I can do the math. If all eight of my ancestors of that generation had done the same thing, we'd be burdened with a roomful of steamer trunks. Finding a balance between what should stay--or even what people are capable of hanging onto--versus what needs to be let go of, is a challenge, but it's a challenge worth facing.
I had an event two years ago where I had to think about what to keep versus what to throw away. I had to have my furnace replaced along with a lot of the ductwork, and instructions were that the entire basement had to be cleaned out. I threw away a lot of stuff by myself, which was empowering and calming in a way. I was also struck by how little I have from being a young adult in the 1980s. So many memories in my head, so few physical artifacts remaining. It did focus my attention towards getting my "estate", such as it is, ready for the next generation to deal with.
I don't have a lot of "stuff" to leave behind. Tons of books....maybe 1 or 2 percent are "must keeps", but my nephews might want to pick one or two out based on their interests. The vast majority can go.
There's a big category of "nice stuff" that I hope gets appreciated, but doesn't need to be kept. I have a set of well-seasoned carbon steel pans that would be perfect for one of my nephews who has shown some talent for cooking. But if they end up in a garage sale, my ghost won't be bent out of shape about it.
So much in my house, the books, the decor, the framed photos, and yes, the kitchen stuff, is an expression and extension of me. If I'm not here, there's no reason for it to be collected together anymore in the manner that it is.
But it's legit to want to be remembered for a while. I enjoy going back and seeing where my ancestors came from and what they did, and I'd like to offer something to the next couple of generations to enrich their experience, too.
posted by gimonca at 10:06 AM on October 27 [17 favorites]
On the other hand, I can do the math. If all eight of my ancestors of that generation had done the same thing, we'd be burdened with a roomful of steamer trunks. Finding a balance between what should stay--or even what people are capable of hanging onto--versus what needs to be let go of, is a challenge, but it's a challenge worth facing.
I had an event two years ago where I had to think about what to keep versus what to throw away. I had to have my furnace replaced along with a lot of the ductwork, and instructions were that the entire basement had to be cleaned out. I threw away a lot of stuff by myself, which was empowering and calming in a way. I was also struck by how little I have from being a young adult in the 1980s. So many memories in my head, so few physical artifacts remaining. It did focus my attention towards getting my "estate", such as it is, ready for the next generation to deal with.
I don't have a lot of "stuff" to leave behind. Tons of books....maybe 1 or 2 percent are "must keeps", but my nephews might want to pick one or two out based on their interests. The vast majority can go.
There's a big category of "nice stuff" that I hope gets appreciated, but doesn't need to be kept. I have a set of well-seasoned carbon steel pans that would be perfect for one of my nephews who has shown some talent for cooking. But if they end up in a garage sale, my ghost won't be bent out of shape about it.
So much in my house, the books, the decor, the framed photos, and yes, the kitchen stuff, is an expression and extension of me. If I'm not here, there's no reason for it to be collected together anymore in the manner that it is.
But it's legit to want to be remembered for a while. I enjoy going back and seeing where my ancestors came from and what they did, and I'd like to offer something to the next couple of generations to enrich their experience, too.
posted by gimonca at 10:06 AM on October 27 [17 favorites]
Welcome to my family right now. And its' especially complicated because my grandmother was an antique dealer and my little sisters and only first cousin are, in fact, millennial gray people for aesthetic reasons (they own 3000+ square foot houses, but respectively embrace styles that are, respectively fancy minimalist and "coastal chic" or to put another way, they own only white furniture, and all seem faintly disturbed by the concept of owning something used, even/especially if the used thing is an 18th century sideboard). I am a Gen Xer and a maximalist and spent most of my childhood half raised by the very same antique dealer grandmother,a and spent more time than most kids wandering around fancy flea markets and rich people's attics and dusty barns* in the US and the UK, concocting elaborate stories around weird shaped spoons or the drawer pulls on a lowboy (self-link). I learned to love all of that stuff and I probably have too much attachment to it and I'm worried about the avalanche coming my way (my house is less than half the size of my siblings') because I do genuinely love the things, even the things that aren't valuable to anyone but me. And I genuinely love the history angle as well.
But I'm facing an onslaught and I don't really know what to do about it. There's not a lot of existing free space in my house as it currently exists. So we'll see. I'm sure my siblings will be in favor of selling everything that might have any value. I know members of my family have been in touch with various museums and historical societies about the interesting stuff, so that's an option.
*In case you're wondering my biggest takeaway from all the buying trips with Nana was that 1) George Washington sat in a lot of chairs and 2) Peacocks are assholes and should be avoided at all costs, especially if they're feral, and let's be honest, all peacocks are kind of feral.
posted by thivaia at 10:07 AM on October 27 [27 favorites]
But I'm facing an onslaught and I don't really know what to do about it. There's not a lot of existing free space in my house as it currently exists. So we'll see. I'm sure my siblings will be in favor of selling everything that might have any value. I know members of my family have been in touch with various museums and historical societies about the interesting stuff, so that's an option.
*In case you're wondering my biggest takeaway from all the buying trips with Nana was that 1) George Washington sat in a lot of chairs and 2) Peacocks are assholes and should be avoided at all costs, especially if they're feral, and let's be honest, all peacocks are kind of feral.
posted by thivaia at 10:07 AM on October 27 [27 favorites]
When my grandma moved to a retirement community I was pressured to take anything my mom didn’t, because she couldn’t bear the idea that cherished possessions would be given away or sold. These were not family heirlooms, my grandma grew up poor but later collected items she thought made her look like she’d inherited them.
I lived in a studio apartment at the time which gave me a good excuse not to take the larger furniture but I still have boxes of dishes and cutlery and some lamps, most of which has never been unpacked. I’m honestly kind of waiting until my mom goes to get rid of it, I’m afraid she’ll ask where it went. She’s already got a house and garage full of her parent’s stuff that she can’t bear to let go of and gets very emotional about. I do not even want to talk about the boxes and boxes of photographs.
The only things I really want to keep are the handmade ones: my grandpa’s bookshelves, grandma’s quilts, my great-grandma’s crochet work.
posted by cali at 10:12 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
I lived in a studio apartment at the time which gave me a good excuse not to take the larger furniture but I still have boxes of dishes and cutlery and some lamps, most of which has never been unpacked. I’m honestly kind of waiting until my mom goes to get rid of it, I’m afraid she’ll ask where it went. She’s already got a house and garage full of her parent’s stuff that she can’t bear to let go of and gets very emotional about. I do not even want to talk about the boxes and boxes of photographs.
The only things I really want to keep are the handmade ones: my grandpa’s bookshelves, grandma’s quilts, my great-grandma’s crochet work.
posted by cali at 10:12 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
BTW, there's a thriving eco-system of junk guys and estate liquidators. It's not much, but even if you think your stuff is mostly junk, there's probably someone willing to give a token amount of money ($100) to clear it all out. The nice thing is they'll likely put most of it up for auction and cull a handful of valuable things, and they'll scrap the metal. Feels better than dumping it in a landfill.
There's a hierarchy of estate liquidators. If the person you call isn't interested, they probably know someone who is, and will refer the job over to them.
posted by constraint at 10:14 AM on October 27 [14 favorites]
There's a hierarchy of estate liquidators. If the person you call isn't interested, they probably know someone who is, and will refer the job over to them.
posted by constraint at 10:14 AM on October 27 [14 favorites]
The different between what they paid and what we can reasonably expect to make on the sale is brutal. A bloodbath. But! It is slightly less brutal than it was a few years ago.
This is absolutely true. The portion of Nana's collection that got sold was sold at "she would have rolled over in her grave" prices even via one of the fancy auction houses.
posted by thivaia at 10:16 AM on October 27 [5 favorites]
This is absolutely true. The portion of Nana's collection that got sold was sold at "she would have rolled over in her grave" prices even via one of the fancy auction houses.
posted by thivaia at 10:16 AM on October 27 [5 favorites]
We moved my mother-in-law into independent living last year. She’s 96 and saved everything - everything! My wife’s baby clothes, magazines, everything from her mother. It took us two years and multiple dumpsters to clear that house out. People raised during the depression were super hoarders.
posted by misterpatrick at 10:17 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
posted by misterpatrick at 10:17 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
Yeah, I think the article misses a really key point here which is that while boomers grew up in a land of plenty, their parents basically invented hoarding because so many of them went hungry in their younger years. Plenty of the stuff my parents want to give me is stuff they got from their folks. And whenever "do I really need this" crosses their minds they think of their mom's stuffed basement and shrug. "At least it's not as bad as my parents' place! Those stacks of canned goods nobody was ever gonna eat, that I had to clean out when they passed!"
I'm the only sibling with a house so I have a lot of my parents' stuff, and my husband's parents' too. I'm writing this right now at my grandparents' Formica-top dining table, in fact. This furniture isn't what we would have picked out ourselves, but the price was right at the time. We have kids and pets, and it's nice to have furniture that's already pretty worn out. I'm fine with it.
On the other hand, my mom keeps bringing up boxes I think of as "sentiment bombs" - a mix of stuff she kept from my childhood and items from my ancestors. It's cool and meaningful to see and have these things and I know so many people don't have anything from their great grandparents and I should be grateful, but I do worry the only thing I'll ever end up doing with them is somehow ruining them. It feels bad to know I'm the generation that throws the family heirlooms in the garbage because I left them in the back of a closet and moths got in and ate them or something.
posted by potrzebie at 10:24 AM on October 27 [23 favorites]
I'm the only sibling with a house so I have a lot of my parents' stuff, and my husband's parents' too. I'm writing this right now at my grandparents' Formica-top dining table, in fact. This furniture isn't what we would have picked out ourselves, but the price was right at the time. We have kids and pets, and it's nice to have furniture that's already pretty worn out. I'm fine with it.
On the other hand, my mom keeps bringing up boxes I think of as "sentiment bombs" - a mix of stuff she kept from my childhood and items from my ancestors. It's cool and meaningful to see and have these things and I know so many people don't have anything from their great grandparents and I should be grateful, but I do worry the only thing I'll ever end up doing with them is somehow ruining them. It feels bad to know I'm the generation that throws the family heirlooms in the garbage because I left them in the back of a closet and moths got in and ate them or something.
posted by potrzebie at 10:24 AM on October 27 [23 favorites]
My parents love their stuff - mostly a collection of books - but last time I was at home I had a near-emotional breakdown at them, pleading for them to clear out some of their stuff before they have a fall, or worse, and I have to come and do it for them. Not because I can’t, but because they’d hate it, absolutely hate it, and i don’t want to cause them emotional turmoil at a difficult time.
posted by The River Ivel at 10:29 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
posted by The River Ivel at 10:29 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
maybe private equity firms can buy up and consolidate thrift shops and swap meets
As someone who used to flip stuff on Amazon FBA as a side hustle/hobby, I have bad news for you. This is why you don't see much cool stuff in thrift stores anymore.
posted by credulous at 10:33 AM on October 27 [10 favorites]
As someone who used to flip stuff on Amazon FBA as a side hustle/hobby, I have bad news for you. This is why you don't see much cool stuff in thrift stores anymore.
posted by credulous at 10:33 AM on October 27 [10 favorites]
Fortunately a lot of the complete crap that accretes around decades of life in a house got trashed several years ago when my mother moved from the DC area to New York. She still has lots of stuff, but the winnowing out of all the not-worth-moving-at-all stuff (which, yes, included a piano), as well as a good deal of the useful and valuable stuff with absolutely no sentimental value has at least been done.
When she dies (hopefully no time soon), what we will mostly have to reach decisions on is books and art. Books we've coveted for years, or have a sentimental fondness for, we'll take (my wife is unmistakably getting the Audubon "Baby Elephant" folio) and we'll give away the rest. The art ranges from "goofy crafts mom and dad liked" (there is a fish carved out of a stop sign she adores, whose street value is probably its scrap metal worth) up to "museum-quality pieces" (there's some high-quality provenanced First Nations woodworking, by artists who you'll have heard of if you're familiar with Pacific Northwest folk crafts). Some of this stuff absolutely needs to go to institutional recipients. Some of it has sentimental value to me, my brother, or my nephews. Some of it will end up junked and some of it trickled down to weird little shops that like this stuff, and, eh, I think everyone involved is OK with that, including mom, who's reasonably philosophical about the disposition of her stuff and considers the pleasure she received from all these things a fair exchange for their purchase price.
posted by jackbishop at 10:36 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
When she dies (hopefully no time soon), what we will mostly have to reach decisions on is books and art. Books we've coveted for years, or have a sentimental fondness for, we'll take (my wife is unmistakably getting the Audubon "Baby Elephant" folio) and we'll give away the rest. The art ranges from "goofy crafts mom and dad liked" (there is a fish carved out of a stop sign she adores, whose street value is probably its scrap metal worth) up to "museum-quality pieces" (there's some high-quality provenanced First Nations woodworking, by artists who you'll have heard of if you're familiar with Pacific Northwest folk crafts). Some of this stuff absolutely needs to go to institutional recipients. Some of it has sentimental value to me, my brother, or my nephews. Some of it will end up junked and some of it trickled down to weird little shops that like this stuff, and, eh, I think everyone involved is OK with that, including mom, who's reasonably philosophical about the disposition of her stuff and considers the pleasure she received from all these things a fair exchange for their purchase price.
posted by jackbishop at 10:36 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
I will say that there will be some cool stuff. My father-in-law was n engineer and audio nerd so I have inherited his mod 50’s and 60’s consoles which I’ve been restoring. They’ve been in a basement since the 70’s but all still work great.
So that’s one plus side.
Also I shouldn’t criticize anyone. Just last week I finally got rid of all my old Syquest, Zip and Jaz disks realizing I probably wasn’t going to need them. Same with the two shoe boxes of floppy installers.
posted by misterpatrick at 10:37 AM on October 27 [5 favorites]
So that’s one plus side.
Also I shouldn’t criticize anyone. Just last week I finally got rid of all my old Syquest, Zip and Jaz disks realizing I probably wasn’t going to need them. Same with the two shoe boxes of floppy installers.
posted by misterpatrick at 10:37 AM on October 27 [5 favorites]
The nostalgic kipple and sentiment bombs belong to another time. It's often hard to face that that time is gone gone gone.
posted by whuppy at 10:37 AM on October 27 [1 favorite]
posted by whuppy at 10:37 AM on October 27 [1 favorite]
As one more Gen Xer with parents in their late 80s, this topic is relevant to my interests. We've been going through this in fits and starts over the past few years as it's become obvious they need to downsize, and as an only child with my own family and home and stuff and tastes I have little or no interest in almost any of it.
It's always my mom's incredibly strong emotional attachment to objects that's the hurdle. I can appreciate the sentiment, to a certain extent: in many ways this is it, your life, in things. The thought of just tossing it all out is terrifying.
Combine that with a type A personality and it means you can't just Get Rid of Stuff--that's Wasteful. It's not hoarder junk, thank god, but every single object has a story, and I've learned that nothing moves until she can tell that story--to me, my dad, maybe just herself--before it's ok to let it go. But then only to someone who will Really Appreciate It. Which means endless rounds of explaining and re-explaining how to list things on Craiglist and Facebook Marketplace on her iPhone X, sorting out the scammers, negotiating, coordinating pickups. Luckily (I think?) we live 10 minutes apart. At least it's happening. Slowly.
I recently discovered they'd saved almost every single piece of paper I generated in school up through junior high. That meant a few hours of sorting through boxes at home, reliving many not-great memories of those times in my life, and throwing 98% of it away while feeling guilty and unsentimental. My own kids, in contrast, stopped bringing things home from school around grade 3. Digital education means less stuff, for better or worse.
When it comes to the next round of this dance, I realize if I died today, in terms of Things That Matter to Me I'd leave my kids a few guitars, some Navajo rugs and jewelry, and a garage full of outdoor gear. I don't foresee the list growing much longer.
"Sentiment bombs" is great, btw. Fire in the hole!
posted by gottabefunky at 10:40 AM on October 27 [10 favorites]
It's always my mom's incredibly strong emotional attachment to objects that's the hurdle. I can appreciate the sentiment, to a certain extent: in many ways this is it, your life, in things. The thought of just tossing it all out is terrifying.
Combine that with a type A personality and it means you can't just Get Rid of Stuff--that's Wasteful. It's not hoarder junk, thank god, but every single object has a story, and I've learned that nothing moves until she can tell that story--to me, my dad, maybe just herself--before it's ok to let it go. But then only to someone who will Really Appreciate It. Which means endless rounds of explaining and re-explaining how to list things on Craiglist and Facebook Marketplace on her iPhone X, sorting out the scammers, negotiating, coordinating pickups. Luckily (I think?) we live 10 minutes apart. At least it's happening. Slowly.
I recently discovered they'd saved almost every single piece of paper I generated in school up through junior high. That meant a few hours of sorting through boxes at home, reliving many not-great memories of those times in my life, and throwing 98% of it away while feeling guilty and unsentimental. My own kids, in contrast, stopped bringing things home from school around grade 3. Digital education means less stuff, for better or worse.
When it comes to the next round of this dance, I realize if I died today, in terms of Things That Matter to Me I'd leave my kids a few guitars, some Navajo rugs and jewelry, and a garage full of outdoor gear. I don't foresee the list growing much longer.
"Sentiment bombs" is great, btw. Fire in the hole!
posted by gottabefunky at 10:40 AM on October 27 [10 favorites]
Silver plate probably. No one wants that for a reason. Sterling silver is something else.
The article is pretty direct that it has nothing to do with the value of it; it's that silver platters aren't of any use to most people these days.
And dealing with stuff after a death is very different from the current owner dropping it by on your doorstep. The latter has a very strong expectation of "THIS STUFF IS CONGEALED PRECIOUS MEMORIES AND YOU WILL KEEP IT AND DISPLAY IT OR I SHALL BECOME CROSS." Otherwise, they'd probably have just sold it themselves and maybe taken you for a schmancy dindins.
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 10:40 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
The article is pretty direct that it has nothing to do with the value of it; it's that silver platters aren't of any use to most people these days.
And dealing with stuff after a death is very different from the current owner dropping it by on your doorstep. The latter has a very strong expectation of "THIS STUFF IS CONGEALED PRECIOUS MEMORIES AND YOU WILL KEEP IT AND DISPLAY IT OR I SHALL BECOME CROSS." Otherwise, they'd probably have just sold it themselves and maybe taken you for a schmancy dindins.
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 10:40 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
I'm just the opposite. And my friends also. Were boomers but travel light. I've never owned a couch. Never bought a set of dishes. I live alone, am an artist/jeweler and semi retired. But even in my prime years I never had much stuff. Maybe living in one bedroom apts. contributed to that. I also think it was our parents generation that bought tons of stuff. The prosperous years after WW2. Owned homes with cellars and Attics...lots of space to store stuff.
posted by Czjewel at 10:41 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
posted by Czjewel at 10:41 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
oh boy. I am super super thankful that my mom has been purging and organizing since she retired. her place is small and now that my dad is gone, she may be moving, so more opportunity to get rid of stuff.
but my husband...omfg, each of his parents, while not hoarders, are just people with so much stuff, that they are not dealing with, they are both well into their 80s (this is two separate homes btw). its going to be a nightmare.
and of course my husband is like his parents! more stuff is better!!! we have a 980 square foot house we have been in for 21 years. in theory, when/if we retire in 3-5 years we will either rent the house out or sell it. LOOOOOOL. the tiny one car garage alone is a nightmare of bicycles and camping gear and tools and cans of paint and beekeeping equipment (but we don't have bees anymore!) ahhhhhhhh! (and we have no kids, natch) there are empty cardboard boxes in there, and in the tiny basement, that my husband will not only not let me get rid of, he won't even let me break them down, just in case...
posted by supermedusa at 10:42 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
but my husband...omfg, each of his parents, while not hoarders, are just people with so much stuff, that they are not dealing with, they are both well into their 80s (this is two separate homes btw). its going to be a nightmare.
and of course my husband is like his parents! more stuff is better!!! we have a 980 square foot house we have been in for 21 years. in theory, when/if we retire in 3-5 years we will either rent the house out or sell it. LOOOOOOL. the tiny one car garage alone is a nightmare of bicycles and camping gear and tools and cans of paint and beekeeping equipment (but we don't have bees anymore!) ahhhhhhhh! (and we have no kids, natch) there are empty cardboard boxes in there, and in the tiny basement, that my husband will not only not let me get rid of, he won't even let me break them down, just in case...
posted by supermedusa at 10:42 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
My mom and dad have made a beautiful home full of family antiques and art. My family would DESTROY that furniture through daily use. Sometimes I fantasize that I can just preserve their home as is and then move into it when all the kids are grown. Presumably my own furniture will be broken sticks by then. (Ok but I also don’t want any of my in-laws stuff so that’s a problem too…)
posted by CMcG at 10:56 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
posted by CMcG at 10:56 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
That makes me thinking of something else too. I wonder if drastically smaller family sizes is impacting this. My mom had six siblings so her parents’ stuff got divided up seven ways. That’s way less overwhelming than being the only inheritor on my in-law side and one of three on my parents’ side.
posted by CMcG at 11:01 AM on October 27 [26 favorites]
posted by CMcG at 11:01 AM on October 27 [26 favorites]
At some point a few years ago, I realized how much of the middle-class life I grew up in was formerly poor people emulating the lives of the rich. Nobody in the family before my mom had "good china" or silver or fancy candelabra. There were no family heirlooms. I think a lot of people in my parents' generation (they were older than boomers; my mom was born during the Great Depression, and, while my brother is among the very youngest of the boomers, I am among the eldest of the Gen Xers) who were able to acquire things in a way that had never been possible in their families were aspiring not just to be able to set a really nice table on Christmas Day, but also to begin a legacy.
When I was 10 or so, my parents bought me a really nice bedroom set. This was circa 1975, and colonial styles were in because of the upcoming Bicentennial, and they got me a queen sized bed with an immense carved headboard, a nightstand, and a huge dresser, also carved and with many drawers and doors that opened to reveal more draws and an ornate mirror and this fancy curved front. I've never again owned such high quality furniture
My mom told me that they bought it with the intention that I could use it for the rest of my life.
I imagine she also thought I could pass it on to my children.
I was freed from having to deal with my parents' accumulations because my father disowned me in 2012, a few weeks after my mother died, and when he died 18 months ago I had no responsibilities. I'm very grateful. I love my things, but none of them are particularly valuable to anyone but me, and I don't own a lot (I lost everything two years ago and have been re-acquiring very carefully and mostly from Facebook Marketplace), so I don't expect it to burden my children much.
posted by Well I never at 11:06 AM on October 27 [14 favorites]
When I was 10 or so, my parents bought me a really nice bedroom set. This was circa 1975, and colonial styles were in because of the upcoming Bicentennial, and they got me a queen sized bed with an immense carved headboard, a nightstand, and a huge dresser, also carved and with many drawers and doors that opened to reveal more draws and an ornate mirror and this fancy curved front. I've never again owned such high quality furniture
My mom told me that they bought it with the intention that I could use it for the rest of my life.
I imagine she also thought I could pass it on to my children.
I was freed from having to deal with my parents' accumulations because my father disowned me in 2012, a few weeks after my mother died, and when he died 18 months ago I had no responsibilities. I'm very grateful. I love my things, but none of them are particularly valuable to anyone but me, and I don't own a lot (I lost everything two years ago and have been re-acquiring very carefully and mostly from Facebook Marketplace), so I don't expect it to burden my children much.
posted by Well I never at 11:06 AM on October 27 [14 favorites]
that silver platters aren't of any use to most people these days.
Silver isn’t necessary to serve food, but a platter of some sort is. Hopefully not plastic you paid $70 for on Amazon. My point is that there are platters galore, whether they are silver or not, that can be repurposed from our parents. Silver is always a nice touch if you can get it.
posted by waving at 11:11 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
Silver isn’t necessary to serve food, but a platter of some sort is. Hopefully not plastic you paid $70 for on Amazon. My point is that there are platters galore, whether they are silver or not, that can be repurposed from our parents. Silver is always a nice touch if you can get it.
posted by waving at 11:11 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
A relative started collecting 19th century American seascapes in the mid 70s when they were being auctioned off at quite reasonable prices. They went from being somewhat out of fashion among art collectors in the 70s, to highly sought after in the 90s and early 2000s, and now they are somewhat out of fashion again.
Their house is much larger than mine and is hung floor to ceiling with museum-quality paintings. Whatever we do with them once the house is gone, it will cost energy, space, money, and/or history.
posted by pernoctalian at 11:14 AM on October 27 [9 favorites]
Their house is much larger than mine and is hung floor to ceiling with museum-quality paintings. Whatever we do with them once the house is gone, it will cost energy, space, money, and/or history.
posted by pernoctalian at 11:14 AM on October 27 [9 favorites]
1. When I first moved to DC in 1999, my mom kept trying to send me one of the two full sets of china she had (the one I had helped her pick out; her wedding china was earmarked for my sister). I kept having to tell her I had a small apartment and nowhere to store it, and then a couple years after I moved into that apartment the kitchen cabinets in that apartment literally fell off the wall, so she finally took that hint and mostly stopped asking.
2. When we got engaged, my wife’s aunt offered to send us HER mother’s wedding china, and we had to say, no, my own mom had already been trying for too long. But we also had to continue telling my mom no, because we’d moved from one small apartment to another one with even less storage, even though nothing fell off the wall there.
3. After we bought a house (the week we closed, in fact), some friends listed a china cabinet and hutch on Facebook, and when we said “perfect, we just bought a house,” they said “would you also like this other cabinet we have in storage?” So I told my mom she could ship the china, finally. Our house was absurd. We had a tiny apartment’s worth of furniture, no coffee table, no dining room table or chairs, and two china cabinets, one filled with my mom’s china and one filled with our own barware.
4. About 18 months after we’d moved in, we randomly ran into my wife’s aunt on vacation. She again offered her mom’s china, and we again said no. Two weeks later it showed up on our porch. We called. “Do whatever you want with it. You can give it away or throw it away, but I can’t. You’re the only one I could give it to.” The two dish barrel boxes are still in our basement.
Meanwhile, my mom has eBay alerts for her wedding china pattern and she’s bought so many pieces (to replace broken ones, to get the serving pieces she never had in the first place, and because she can’t stop herself once she starts), that she shipped off one place setting for 16 to my sister (who lives overseas, mind you) and still has a second place setting (possibly for 20) that she says she’ll send my niece. My niece just got her Ph.D and is buying a house, but it’s a tiny rowhouse and I’m guessing she won’t have anywhere to store any china there.
This is just the china. She has so much other stuff nobody wants.
posted by fedward at 11:19 AM on October 27 [8 favorites]
2. When we got engaged, my wife’s aunt offered to send us HER mother’s wedding china, and we had to say, no, my own mom had already been trying for too long. But we also had to continue telling my mom no, because we’d moved from one small apartment to another one with even less storage, even though nothing fell off the wall there.
3. After we bought a house (the week we closed, in fact), some friends listed a china cabinet and hutch on Facebook, and when we said “perfect, we just bought a house,” they said “would you also like this other cabinet we have in storage?” So I told my mom she could ship the china, finally. Our house was absurd. We had a tiny apartment’s worth of furniture, no coffee table, no dining room table or chairs, and two china cabinets, one filled with my mom’s china and one filled with our own barware.
4. About 18 months after we’d moved in, we randomly ran into my wife’s aunt on vacation. She again offered her mom’s china, and we again said no. Two weeks later it showed up on our porch. We called. “Do whatever you want with it. You can give it away or throw it away, but I can’t. You’re the only one I could give it to.” The two dish barrel boxes are still in our basement.
Meanwhile, my mom has eBay alerts for her wedding china pattern and she’s bought so many pieces (to replace broken ones, to get the serving pieces she never had in the first place, and because she can’t stop herself once she starts), that she shipped off one place setting for 16 to my sister (who lives overseas, mind you) and still has a second place setting (possibly for 20) that she says she’ll send my niece. My niece just got her Ph.D and is buying a house, but it’s a tiny rowhouse and I’m guessing she won’t have anywhere to store any china there.
This is just the china. She has so much other stuff nobody wants.
posted by fedward at 11:19 AM on October 27 [8 favorites]
damn, fedward so how annoyed were you at your wife's aunt just dumping her stuff at your house when you'd said no?
posted by supermedusa at 11:23 AM on October 27 [2 favorites]
posted by supermedusa at 11:23 AM on October 27 [2 favorites]
Thank God my mom has felt the urge to purge a few times over the last few years. My aesthetic isn't millennial grey but it sure doesn't coincide with hers.
A small apartment keeps the pressure on me, but, to be honest, I don't keep stuff for its resale value after my death. If I enjoy it while it exists, that's enough for me. Trash after. The big trick is making sure I do enjoy it and don't just pile it up.
posted by praemunire at 11:27 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
A small apartment keeps the pressure on me, but, to be honest, I don't keep stuff for its resale value after my death. If I enjoy it while it exists, that's enough for me. Trash after. The big trick is making sure I do enjoy it and don't just pile it up.
posted by praemunire at 11:27 AM on October 27 [4 favorites]
The art, though. We’re all artists. There is so much, so many sketchbooks and portfolios and paintings and photos, work by relatives, work by friends, oh, it goes on and it all takes up space. Work by my aunt, my mother, a few pieces by my grandmother. A sampler by an ancestor. An unsettling painting of an ancestor as a child. I can’t part with any of it, most of it has no value, but it’s our art. My daughter is doomed.
I am a writer. A very prolific writer. This is the only thing I worry about my kids having to deal with, but I have a friend who is an archivist and she's talking to me about how to prepare my things for a library archive. I had never thought I was "archive worthy" but I was in Special Collections at a nearby university and the librarians were showing us some archives of local writers, and I was like, "Wow, if they have archives here, I probably should, too."
I have no idea how that might work for art. But it might be worth looking into. A local family of generations of artists might be of interest to a university library.
posted by Well I never at 11:32 AM on October 27 [9 favorites]
I am a writer. A very prolific writer. This is the only thing I worry about my kids having to deal with, but I have a friend who is an archivist and she's talking to me about how to prepare my things for a library archive. I had never thought I was "archive worthy" but I was in Special Collections at a nearby university and the librarians were showing us some archives of local writers, and I was like, "Wow, if they have archives here, I probably should, too."
I have no idea how that might work for art. But it might be worth looking into. A local family of generations of artists might be of interest to a university library.
posted by Well I never at 11:32 AM on October 27 [9 favorites]
I already have 2 sets of China in my attic. I won't get rid of them until my mom dies, because she asks about them still and I don't want to lie. So far that's the only stuff I've been forced to aquire. There is however generations and generations of very high quality furniture that has all been saved by my aging relatives that will need to find homes in the next decade. This might be easier since most of it is in rural Idaho, and there still seems to be a desire for this kind of stuff from younger generations there.
posted by Dr. Twist at 11:34 AM on October 27 [1 favorite]
posted by Dr. Twist at 11:34 AM on October 27 [1 favorite]
My parents are hoarders and own a rental with a three car garage that is full of their things, plus two homes. These things were inherited, found, renters left behind, and my mother's hobbies plus a shopping network addiction (she still buys things off broadcast television, I dunno what to say. Better than Temu I guess?)
My sister and I are agreed that we are going to go through the homes together, pull whatever we know we want, and then hire people to deal with the rest - probably one auction person and then a junk hauling company. We are not sorting through it all.
I want one keepsake for each of my kids, one art object, and one piece of jewelry from my mother (not particularly picky about which one). I will negotiate with my sister for one other item from my maternal grandfather who was an inventor. So that is...5 things.
I am (as is perhaps obvious) kind of the opposite of people who find belongings from their childhood sentimental. I do not want to own any of the rest of it, and what I do want to own I largely already do. I also own an upright formerly player piano, as do my parents, so - yikes on the piano bit.
That said, my home is full of my kids' pottery and art, and my own steampunk-type garage sale and friend-gifts finds, plus books and art supplies. So in a couple decades I'll try to start getting rid of that.
posted by warriorqueen at 11:34 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
My sister and I are agreed that we are going to go through the homes together, pull whatever we know we want, and then hire people to deal with the rest - probably one auction person and then a junk hauling company. We are not sorting through it all.
I want one keepsake for each of my kids, one art object, and one piece of jewelry from my mother (not particularly picky about which one). I will negotiate with my sister for one other item from my maternal grandfather who was an inventor. So that is...5 things.
I am (as is perhaps obvious) kind of the opposite of people who find belongings from their childhood sentimental. I do not want to own any of the rest of it, and what I do want to own I largely already do. I also own an upright formerly player piano, as do my parents, so - yikes on the piano bit.
That said, my home is full of my kids' pottery and art, and my own steampunk-type garage sale and friend-gifts finds, plus books and art supplies. So in a couple decades I'll try to start getting rid of that.
posted by warriorqueen at 11:34 AM on October 27 [3 favorites]
My mom and dad have made a beautiful home full of family antiques and art. My family would DESTROY that furniture through daily use.
Oh yeah. We already went through the first round of stuff-distribution when my father-in-law died and my mother-in-law sold their house. They had a pristine "formal living room" that included two original Barcelona chairs which we promptly put in front of our TV and sat in. After two weeks of supporting heavy people for evening TV watching, the leather straps on both gave out completely. We realized that the reason the chairs had lasted so well for sixty years was that nobody ever sat in them.
posted by Daily Alice at 11:38 AM on October 27 [11 favorites]
Oh yeah. We already went through the first round of stuff-distribution when my father-in-law died and my mother-in-law sold their house. They had a pristine "formal living room" that included two original Barcelona chairs which we promptly put in front of our TV and sat in. After two weeks of supporting heavy people for evening TV watching, the leather straps on both gave out completely. We realized that the reason the chairs had lasted so well for sixty years was that nobody ever sat in them.
posted by Daily Alice at 11:38 AM on October 27 [11 favorites]
I just think that some people really like stuff in a way that other people just don't get. Being in a room with my family's stuff, knowing that here is the same chair my grandmother sat in and the same mirror my aunt looked in makes me feel happy and secure. I like to look at these things and touch them and remember, and I know from countless conversations about minimalism that for a very large percentage of people, a photo on their phone would be just as good as the thing itself.
I think it's important to remember that the value of things we have is not just what they might be worth to our heirs, if we have them, but the value of them to us, now. In the past two years of rebuilding my life, I have really enjoyed buying things I absolutely love without compromise. My space is very colorful and whimsical. It gives me pleasure just to look around my room. I won't be passing on a great burden of things to my children, so it's not the same as your house, Frowner, but I don't think it matters whether they're going to care about my furniture and decor so long as I take satisfaction in living among it. I do have a very characteristic style, so I could imagine my kids wanting to choose one or two particular things, perhaps, that remind them of me or that they have happy memories of.
The flip side of that is that, when we're judging our parents for the Hummel figurines, it might be well to remember that they enjoyed that collection. Even if it feels like an unwanted burden to us.
posted by Well I never at 11:39 AM on October 27 [15 favorites]
I think it's important to remember that the value of things we have is not just what they might be worth to our heirs, if we have them, but the value of them to us, now. In the past two years of rebuilding my life, I have really enjoyed buying things I absolutely love without compromise. My space is very colorful and whimsical. It gives me pleasure just to look around my room. I won't be passing on a great burden of things to my children, so it's not the same as your house, Frowner, but I don't think it matters whether they're going to care about my furniture and decor so long as I take satisfaction in living among it. I do have a very characteristic style, so I could imagine my kids wanting to choose one or two particular things, perhaps, that remind them of me or that they have happy memories of.
The flip side of that is that, when we're judging our parents for the Hummel figurines, it might be well to remember that they enjoyed that collection. Even if it feels like an unwanted burden to us.
posted by Well I never at 11:39 AM on October 27 [15 favorites]
In my family each of the last three generations had a bigger house than the last - until me.
I had to say to my mother that every time I get something new, I have to think carefully about where it will go, and probably discard something old to make room. There was no way on earth I could take the packed contents of her two garages and three lofts, never mind what was in the house itself.
She was very unhappy. ‘You might as well just say you don’t want it,’ she said. ‘What I’m trying to say gently is: I don’t want it.’ I said.
Not happy at all. I was calling the lives of three generations of the family worthless, in her eyes.
posted by Phanx at 11:41 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
I had to say to my mother that every time I get something new, I have to think carefully about where it will go, and probably discard something old to make room. There was no way on earth I could take the packed contents of her two garages and three lofts, never mind what was in the house itself.
She was very unhappy. ‘You might as well just say you don’t want it,’ she said. ‘What I’m trying to say gently is: I don’t want it.’ I said.
Not happy at all. I was calling the lives of three generations of the family worthless, in her eyes.
posted by Phanx at 11:41 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
Observing the 'handmade colonial wood furniture" exchange above, I think a way to connect people who might want stuff to ALL THIS STUFF would be really interesting. My husband's parents were both remarried a billion years ago, and everyone at that age is thinking about "what do we do with the silver and the china and whatever" and I LOVE those things. Yes, it will be my turn to deal with it all in 30 years or so, but for NOW? I use it and love it. I easily yoinked all the old quilts away from my grandma and great-grandma, because they saw them as a reflection of a time when they had to make do, and they placed higher value on a matching comforter and dust ruffle and pillow sham and curtain set from the store.
posted by ersatzkat at 11:49 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
posted by ersatzkat at 11:49 AM on October 27 [7 favorites]
damn, fedward so how annoyed were you
TBH I was impressed by her exercise of will. She was apologetic about using us in that way, and I believed her when she said we could just throw it away, but SHE couldn’t. She had to give it to a family member because it was her mother’s, but she also knew the sentiment would end with us.
I was also already kind of mentally prepared for it, not just because I’d been going through it for so long with my mom. For a wedding gift she had sent us some really lovely cocktail glassware, but it was off registry and came drop shipped by the glassmaker without a gift card identifying the sender. But at the time of our engagement and wedding we were living in a small apartment with very poor storage (the kitchen cabinets were narrower than a dinner plate, so we had to store our dishes in the pantry), and the lovely pair of martini glasses she’d ordered were so wide that they would have taken an entire shelf in those narrow cabinets. I basically made a very tactful phone call to the glassmaker and said, “can I exchange these glasses without the sender knowing, and BTW who was the sender?” So we sent her a thank you note, kept the cocktail pitcher (we still use it), and exchanged the two oversized martini glasses for a water pitcher that gets more use than the glasses ever would have. And I learned not to pick battles with Aunt Shirley.
posted by fedward at 11:53 AM on October 27 [19 favorites]
TBH I was impressed by her exercise of will. She was apologetic about using us in that way, and I believed her when she said we could just throw it away, but SHE couldn’t. She had to give it to a family member because it was her mother’s, but she also knew the sentiment would end with us.
I was also already kind of mentally prepared for it, not just because I’d been going through it for so long with my mom. For a wedding gift she had sent us some really lovely cocktail glassware, but it was off registry and came drop shipped by the glassmaker without a gift card identifying the sender. But at the time of our engagement and wedding we were living in a small apartment with very poor storage (the kitchen cabinets were narrower than a dinner plate, so we had to store our dishes in the pantry), and the lovely pair of martini glasses she’d ordered were so wide that they would have taken an entire shelf in those narrow cabinets. I basically made a very tactful phone call to the glassmaker and said, “can I exchange these glasses without the sender knowing, and BTW who was the sender?” So we sent her a thank you note, kept the cocktail pitcher (we still use it), and exchanged the two oversized martini glasses for a water pitcher that gets more use than the glasses ever would have. And I learned not to pick battles with Aunt Shirley.
posted by fedward at 11:53 AM on October 27 [19 favorites]
I was calling the lives of three generations of the family worthless, in her eyes.
This is it, I guess. if it was a possession of Winston Churchill or Tutankhamun, you'd keep it, right? Your own family isn't as important, I guess?
I just had to move offices at work several months ago, and even THAT has me side-eyeing all the "stuff' in my house for actual utility. And I sure don't want anything from my parents other than maybe one small keepsake. Pocket watch or something, not furniture, photos, papers, and dishes. I HAVE a good sized house, and I just don't WANT anything.
posted by ctmf at 12:04 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
This is it, I guess. if it was a possession of Winston Churchill or Tutankhamun, you'd keep it, right? Your own family isn't as important, I guess?
I just had to move offices at work several months ago, and even THAT has me side-eyeing all the "stuff' in my house for actual utility. And I sure don't want anything from my parents other than maybe one small keepsake. Pocket watch or something, not furniture, photos, papers, and dishes. I HAVE a good sized house, and I just don't WANT anything.
posted by ctmf at 12:04 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
As is often the case with this kind of reporting, the article wants to make this about the taste of Millennials (not that that isn’t also a factor) rather than the economic conditions of Millennials.
Yes. I am doing much worse financially than my parents ever did. In part because they've always felt they shouldn't have to lift a finger (or spend a dime) to help me. When my mother dies I will be burdened with her burial, funeral, and house disposal costs, because of course she has no interest in making arrangements herself - she doesn't even have a will. She's a hoarder and has allowed her house to fall into deep disrepair (it's so bad that people won't even step inside). I'm considering just ignoring the ordeal entirely. I have no idea what will happen and I kind of don't care anymore. She'd be mortified, because she thinks all of the garbage she's amassed over the decades is "worth something" and my labour isn't. Even if it weren't all soaked in cat piss and cigarette smoke, it would still be difficult and extremely time consuming to offload that much crap. My only real concern are my private documents she's refused to send me over the years. But facilitating identity theft would be an appropriate final gift from her.
posted by Stoof at 12:05 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
Yes. I am doing much worse financially than my parents ever did. In part because they've always felt they shouldn't have to lift a finger (or spend a dime) to help me. When my mother dies I will be burdened with her burial, funeral, and house disposal costs, because of course she has no interest in making arrangements herself - she doesn't even have a will. She's a hoarder and has allowed her house to fall into deep disrepair (it's so bad that people won't even step inside). I'm considering just ignoring the ordeal entirely. I have no idea what will happen and I kind of don't care anymore. She'd be mortified, because she thinks all of the garbage she's amassed over the decades is "worth something" and my labour isn't. Even if it weren't all soaked in cat piss and cigarette smoke, it would still be difficult and extremely time consuming to offload that much crap. My only real concern are my private documents she's refused to send me over the years. But facilitating identity theft would be an appropriate final gift from her.
posted by Stoof at 12:05 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
To take a leaf from a couple of utopian SF novels, it would be neat if we could just bring unwanted stuff (after sorting out the truly broken things, the stuff that smells fatally of cigarette smoke, the old paperwork, etc) to a depot, and people could go there and just pick furniture and stuff for free. For every ten people who look at seventies and eighties cabinetry with dismay, for instance, there's one or two who either like it or can think of a way to repurpose or repaint it. (Granted, after about the mid nineties furniture gets so low quality that a lot of it is just scrap anyway.) There are plenty of things that I have that are really too good to toss but that are too big or not really right for Goodwill, and if someone could just rove the aisles of a big warehouse and pick them off the shelf, I'd be happy.
My father, for instance, wished a couple of bookcases on me that he feels are simply terrific quality, and for eighties wood-plus-particleboard they sure are, but they cannot come with if I manage to sell this house and get out - they're huge, I already need to dispose of many books, etc. I don't think friends will want them. But out of this big old city I'm sure there are some people who could use them, and it would be nice if I didn't have to dink around with freecycle and Facebook to find those people.
It is absolutely true that one person's trash is another person's treasure, as regular reading of Apartment Therapy will tell you.
posted by Frowner at 12:21 PM on October 27 [13 favorites]
My father, for instance, wished a couple of bookcases on me that he feels are simply terrific quality, and for eighties wood-plus-particleboard they sure are, but they cannot come with if I manage to sell this house and get out - they're huge, I already need to dispose of many books, etc. I don't think friends will want them. But out of this big old city I'm sure there are some people who could use them, and it would be nice if I didn't have to dink around with freecycle and Facebook to find those people.
It is absolutely true that one person's trash is another person's treasure, as regular reading of Apartment Therapy will tell you.
posted by Frowner at 12:21 PM on October 27 [13 favorites]
Recently a carpenter doing some work at my house accidentally broke a pair of Waterford crystal candleholders I'd been given as a wedding present. He felt so bad, but I was grateful. I'd never had the courage to do it myself.
posted by The corpse in the library at 12:23 PM on October 27 [46 favorites]
posted by The corpse in the library at 12:23 PM on October 27 [46 favorites]
When I finally upgraded from a tiny condo to a bigger than expected house, my parents shipped me a half of a semi trailer full of their old furniture and Knick knacks.
An odd mix of things that they couldn’t sell and didn’t still want in their small apartment after they sold their house.
A case of adult diapers leftover from my grandmother’s final days, two sets of fine china, a handful of special occasions dishes I remember from childhood. And a pair of concrete testicles in a small wooden box.
My cat likes the couch in the basement.
posted by funkaspuck at 12:25 PM on October 27 [9 favorites]
An odd mix of things that they couldn’t sell and didn’t still want in their small apartment after they sold their house.
A case of adult diapers leftover from my grandmother’s final days, two sets of fine china, a handful of special occasions dishes I remember from childhood. And a pair of concrete testicles in a small wooden box.
My cat likes the couch in the basement.
posted by funkaspuck at 12:25 PM on October 27 [9 favorites]
My mom retired 25 years ago and started volunteering at a Goodwill-type store.
If anyone needs 43 decorative bird houses or 23 creches (I counted), I will be happy to send them to you when the time comes.
Since I am an only child who didn't have kids and already have too much of own crap, pretty much everything in her house will be put in a dumpster, given to charities (the furniture) or given back to Goodwill.
I have told the executor of my estate that she is to have no guilt over whatever she decides to do with my stuff. And since she inherits my house, she's going to have to deal with it or live in my different taste.
posted by ITravelMontana at 12:27 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
If anyone needs 43 decorative bird houses or 23 creches (I counted), I will be happy to send them to you when the time comes.
Since I am an only child who didn't have kids and already have too much of own crap, pretty much everything in her house will be put in a dumpster, given to charities (the furniture) or given back to Goodwill.
I have told the executor of my estate that she is to have no guilt over whatever she decides to do with my stuff. And since she inherits my house, she's going to have to deal with it or live in my different taste.
posted by ITravelMontana at 12:27 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
I do think it's a little funny how quickly "oh I just wish my parents' stuff would go to someone, anyone who would appreciate it" becomes "well actually I'd like to make money off it". I volunteer to take and use someone's wedding china (as long as it's an attractive pattern). But probably not if I have to pay for it.
posted by umwelt at 12:30 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
posted by umwelt at 12:30 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
Oh, hey, in re china: there are countless sets of china floating around in my family, dating back to like 1900. I have been resolving this by keeping a piece or two from each (I like china - I wouldn't do this if it bugged me or I thought it was hideous). So I have a butter bell and a soup tureen and a platter from my great grandfather's set, and I have a couple of teacups from another couple of sets and a big chop plate from a third, and I drink tea from the teacups from time to time and use the rest of a couple of times a year when I have people over - the chop plate and the platter are for cheeses and fancy crackers and so on, the butter bell is for butter and I can fill the tureen (it's rather small - not the giant thing you picture when you hear "tureen") with something like peanut butter pretzels or fun little rice crackers.
Come to think of it, I've also got a creamer that I use to hold pens and pencils.
Obviously these can't go in the dishwasher, but if I'm having people over I can wash a few things up.
I just couldn't really keep the rest, but it's nice haul out a few pieces on occasion and they don't really take up much space.
posted by Frowner at 12:32 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
Come to think of it, I've also got a creamer that I use to hold pens and pencils.
Obviously these can't go in the dishwasher, but if I'm having people over I can wash a few things up.
I just couldn't really keep the rest, but it's nice haul out a few pieces on occasion and they don't really take up much space.
posted by Frowner at 12:32 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
And a pair of concrete testicles in a small wooden box.
Can you say more about that?
posted by Horace Rumpole at 12:35 PM on October 27 [16 favorites]
Can you say more about that?
posted by Horace Rumpole at 12:35 PM on October 27 [16 favorites]
Well, you have all convinced me to part with my collectors unopened box of Iditarod dogs cards.
posted by jadepearl at 12:43 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
posted by jadepearl at 12:43 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
I write on Medium and wrote an article that suggested three guidelines for dealing with Stuff.
1) You are not your Stuff. I bet a bunch of people my age bought aspirationally (maybe they still do). I wanted to think of myself as a "serious collector" with all the social cachet that brings: people will see that I have exquisite taste, discerning intellect, and great wealth. But really the only things I've been able afford to collect are small items that might fetch 10% of the value I bought them (luckily, I avoided mass market "collectibles"). Stuff rarely gives you what you hope for. For most people—who by definition are not part of the 10% or 5% or 1% who can truly afford to be serious collectors—their collections are worthless to anyone else.
2) Your kids don't want your Stuff. Mine certainly don't, and in fact, I didn't want my parents' stuff when it came to me 20 years ago. But here we are: handmade quilts that must have taken hundreds of hours of painstaking labour and don't fit anyone's taste or decor, and don't have any real historic or artistic merit. My dad made me a desk about 60 years ago, built well before the information age, and almost useless in a modern home office. How do I throw that in the landfill? One of my sons heard a quip about handmade furniture: will last even when sitting on the curb in front of your grandkids' apartment.
3) No one else wants your Stuff either. See my comment about the Good Stuff fetching perhaps 10% of its original price at auction, if that. I will donate the quilts and handmade furniture in case someone with absolutely nothing might make some use of them, but I wouldn't be surprised if they're refused at the donation centres. You can't even give this stuff away.
Maybe some enterprising soul will find a way to recycle or upcycle all the worthless and/or unwanted silverplate, quilts, desks, and Beanie Babies and a major new industry will emerge.
posted by angiep at 12:44 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
1) You are not your Stuff. I bet a bunch of people my age bought aspirationally (maybe they still do). I wanted to think of myself as a "serious collector" with all the social cachet that brings: people will see that I have exquisite taste, discerning intellect, and great wealth. But really the only things I've been able afford to collect are small items that might fetch 10% of the value I bought them (luckily, I avoided mass market "collectibles"). Stuff rarely gives you what you hope for. For most people—who by definition are not part of the 10% or 5% or 1% who can truly afford to be serious collectors—their collections are worthless to anyone else.
2) Your kids don't want your Stuff. Mine certainly don't, and in fact, I didn't want my parents' stuff when it came to me 20 years ago. But here we are: handmade quilts that must have taken hundreds of hours of painstaking labour and don't fit anyone's taste or decor, and don't have any real historic or artistic merit. My dad made me a desk about 60 years ago, built well before the information age, and almost useless in a modern home office. How do I throw that in the landfill? One of my sons heard a quip about handmade furniture: will last even when sitting on the curb in front of your grandkids' apartment.
3) No one else wants your Stuff either. See my comment about the Good Stuff fetching perhaps 10% of its original price at auction, if that. I will donate the quilts and handmade furniture in case someone with absolutely nothing might make some use of them, but I wouldn't be surprised if they're refused at the donation centres. You can't even give this stuff away.
Maybe some enterprising soul will find a way to recycle or upcycle all the worthless and/or unwanted silverplate, quilts, desks, and Beanie Babies and a major new industry will emerge.
posted by angiep at 12:44 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
SPrintF: My problem is that I hang onto things because I imagine I will eventually find a use for them. And I do! Just two weeks ago, I dug some decades-old bamboo skewers out of the back of my kitchen junk drawer. I bought them decades ago, back when I used to barbecue a lot. Held on to them for no particular reason. Then recently, I had a need for some plant stakes in my garden. Wait! What about those old skewers? Perfect! These occasional successes just reinforce my pack rat sensibilities.
There is nothing quite like the feeling of “having just the thing”. Someone needs a SATA cable, a new-ish mouse, network card, mini usb cable, etc, there is something deeply satisfying about reaching into the trusty junkbox and being able to pull out the right thing. Like being Father Christmas for crap.
posted by dr_dank at 12:45 PM on October 27 [26 favorites]
There is nothing quite like the feeling of “having just the thing”. Someone needs a SATA cable, a new-ish mouse, network card, mini usb cable, etc, there is something deeply satisfying about reaching into the trusty junkbox and being able to pull out the right thing. Like being Father Christmas for crap.
posted by dr_dank at 12:45 PM on October 27 [26 favorites]
I recently went on a Goodwill/Etsy/eBay secondhand binge (it's a fairly cheap way to do some shopping therapy). I've discovered that it's still possible to get quality used musical instruments for cheap if you're patient. What's expensive are good quilts, which are in huge demand. The stainless silverware I got as wedding gifts in a past life also turns out to be very expensive now (I decided I wanted more salad forks, which are really all I use, and it turns out they go for as much as $60 each).
So some things definitely hold their value. A lot of other things end up in thrift stores because families don't see the value or don't have time to go through it all. Someone will find and enjoy them. What's sad to me is when objects someone could find value in end up in landfills. But that probably also has to do with not having a lot growing up.
I'm a millennial maximalist and I also store memories in my objects, even though you'd think I'd have learned my lesson from the year of weekends and the storage spaces I'm still paying for from clearing out my father's house. There are still more boomer storage spaces and houses to clean up in my family. It's a process! But I respect that these things have meaning to them and probably value to others.
posted by limeonaire at 12:57 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
So some things definitely hold their value. A lot of other things end up in thrift stores because families don't see the value or don't have time to go through it all. Someone will find and enjoy them. What's sad to me is when objects someone could find value in end up in landfills. But that probably also has to do with not having a lot growing up.
I'm a millennial maximalist and I also store memories in my objects, even though you'd think I'd have learned my lesson from the year of weekends and the storage spaces I'm still paying for from clearing out my father's house. There are still more boomer storage spaces and houses to clean up in my family. It's a process! But I respect that these things have meaning to them and probably value to others.
posted by limeonaire at 12:57 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
Recently a carpenter doing some work at my house accidentally broke a pair of Waterford crystal candleholders I'd been given as a wedding present. He felt so bad, but I was grateful. I'd never had the courage to do it myself.
Nearly 20 years ago I was presented with a terrible little garden gnome that my niece had painted. Throwing it away seemed like inviting bad karma, so I have put it in the outdoor space connected to every place I’ve lived, but I have tried to put it in places where it is likely to meet with an accidental end that won’t be my fault. Has anybody done me the favor of knocking it off whatever narrow, awkward spot it happens to be sitting in? Reader, they have not.
The niece who painted it is now doing a master’s program, and most of the paint has faded. I’m sure if I asked her if I could just throw the thing away she’d be horrified I ever kept it, but I can’t ask and I still feel like it would be bad juju to cause it harm myself. Because: gnome.
posted by fedward at 1:00 PM on October 27 [34 favorites]
Nearly 20 years ago I was presented with a terrible little garden gnome that my niece had painted. Throwing it away seemed like inviting bad karma, so I have put it in the outdoor space connected to every place I’ve lived, but I have tried to put it in places where it is likely to meet with an accidental end that won’t be my fault. Has anybody done me the favor of knocking it off whatever narrow, awkward spot it happens to be sitting in? Reader, they have not.
The niece who painted it is now doing a master’s program, and most of the paint has faded. I’m sure if I asked her if I could just throw the thing away she’d be horrified I ever kept it, but I can’t ask and I still feel like it would be bad juju to cause it harm myself. Because: gnome.
posted by fedward at 1:00 PM on October 27 [34 favorites]
I recently had to clear out four separate apartments and it's amazing what people will take if you tell them it's free. No, you won't make money on it (except bigger sturdy furniture which goes for a pittance and popular Ikea items which hold value surprisingly well), but it'll find use and not end up in landfill, which is enough for me to feel better about it. I kept the jewelry, they had good taste, and thankfully I knew people with connections to refugees, poor seniors and homeless shelters who were overjoyed at quality clothes and toiletries. Freecycle too, it's called "attention the garbage truck is about to arrive" here. My family's stuff has done a lot of good.
I'm still drowning in linens though. One branch of the family lived near the premiere linen production town and I'm fairly certain a lot of the excellent unused tablecloths and kitchen towels in those two giant suitcases were never paid for. I suspect I should finally learn to quilt!
posted by I claim sanctuary at 1:00 PM on October 27 [8 favorites]
I'm still drowning in linens though. One branch of the family lived near the premiere linen production town and I'm fairly certain a lot of the excellent unused tablecloths and kitchen towels in those two giant suitcases were never paid for. I suspect I should finally learn to quilt!
posted by I claim sanctuary at 1:00 PM on October 27 [8 favorites]
This is it, I guess. if it was a possession of Winston Churchill or Tutankhamun, you'd keep it, right?
If I had to keep it in my apartment: no.
posted by Jon Mitchell at 1:04 PM on October 27 [13 favorites]
If I had to keep it in my apartment: no.
posted by Jon Mitchell at 1:04 PM on October 27 [13 favorites]
Yeah, that is the thing. I just sold my house this spring, and getting another one is way more expensive where I currently live. I'd have to have a house to be able to take on more family furniture, collections, etc.
posted by limeonaire at 1:11 PM on October 27 [1 favorite]
posted by limeonaire at 1:11 PM on October 27 [1 favorite]
What a coup for billionaires calling this "the great wealth transfer" when it is neither great nor wealth, mostly we re talking about a bunch of junk instead of the finances
Stuff does not mean wealth in 2024, our command economy is much much stupider than that
posted by eustatic at 1:11 PM on October 27 [13 favorites]
Stuff does not mean wealth in 2024, our command economy is much much stupider than that
posted by eustatic at 1:11 PM on October 27 [13 favorites]
Big benefit of living in a condo is the swap room. Drop your shit off and one of the other 400 families that live here will take it. And if they don’t it was really garbage anyway; staff clears the room out regularly.
So there is a bit of that “depot” thing going on. Like today there’s a huge cat tree barely a scratched. A nespresso machine. Few usable pans. Misc toiletries. Nice chrome stools. Shitty books that’ll get recycled. A DVD player that will go to ewaste no doubt.
posted by seanmpuckett at 1:23 PM on October 27 [17 favorites]
So there is a bit of that “depot” thing going on. Like today there’s a huge cat tree barely a scratched. A nespresso machine. Few usable pans. Misc toiletries. Nice chrome stools. Shitty books that’ll get recycled. A DVD player that will go to ewaste no doubt.
posted by seanmpuckett at 1:23 PM on October 27 [17 favorites]
huge cat tree barely a scratched
For sale: cat tree, barely scratched
--E. Hemingway
posted by chavenet at 1:26 PM on October 27 [28 favorites]
For sale: cat tree, barely scratched
--E. Hemingway
posted by chavenet at 1:26 PM on October 27 [28 favorites]
She's a hoarder and has allowed her house to fall into deep disrepair (it's so bad that people won't even step inside). I'm considering just ignoring the ordeal entirely.
My aunt and uncle had this house, a large detached garage, and a yard full of dead vehicles. They're both dead now, and when I reconnected with a cousin's wife on Facebook she told me that their one surviving child, a man now in his 60s, has simply chosen not to deal with it. It's all just sitting there and will continue to do so. I imagine that at some future point when the land is of interested to someone it will all be torn down and trashed, as jscalzi described happening with the house next door to his offices. I'm kind of inspired by this: it's possible to just not take on the burden your parents leave you with. But it's not really something you could do with a house in good shape in a desirable neighborhood—though I suppose you could cut the price and sell it "as is" with everything you didn't want to take, from the toilet paper in the linen closet to half a box of baking sode, included.
posted by Well I never at 1:27 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
My aunt and uncle had this house, a large detached garage, and a yard full of dead vehicles. They're both dead now, and when I reconnected with a cousin's wife on Facebook she told me that their one surviving child, a man now in his 60s, has simply chosen not to deal with it. It's all just sitting there and will continue to do so. I imagine that at some future point when the land is of interested to someone it will all be torn down and trashed, as jscalzi described happening with the house next door to his offices. I'm kind of inspired by this: it's possible to just not take on the burden your parents leave you with. But it's not really something you could do with a house in good shape in a desirable neighborhood—though I suppose you could cut the price and sell it "as is" with everything you didn't want to take, from the toilet paper in the linen closet to half a box of baking sode, included.
posted by Well I never at 1:27 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
What a coup for billionaires calling this "the great wealth transfer" when it is neither great nor wealth, mostly we re talking about a bunch of junk instead of the finances
Maybe the real wealth was the knick-knacks we bought along the way?
Hm... no. Nope, it's still the unfathomable monetary value hoarded by a handful of people.
posted by howbigisthistextfield at 1:30 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
Maybe the real wealth was the knick-knacks we bought along the way?
Hm... no. Nope, it's still the unfathomable monetary value hoarded by a handful of people.
posted by howbigisthistextfield at 1:30 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
As someone with one Boomer parents who already died and one who will shortly:
The wealth transfer part does not exist. My father owned his house outright and when all was said and done we were lucky to break after the sale. He did not spend a day in hospital or an SNF. Everything is stacked against lower middle class transfer of any scrap of wealth.
At least he decomposed for so long in his house the we had no option but to get rid of literally everything in the house.
posted by Ardnamurchan at 1:31 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
The wealth transfer part does not exist. My father owned his house outright and when all was said and done we were lucky to break after the sale. He did not spend a day in hospital or an SNF. Everything is stacked against lower middle class transfer of any scrap of wealth.
At least he decomposed for so long in his house the we had no option but to get rid of literally everything in the house.
posted by Ardnamurchan at 1:31 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
The boomers in my life have no intention of giving away anything of use, they only want to give away chores and problems. They do not intend to be outlived by the generations they created and hate, if they have to face death (kicking and screaming) then they intend us fail and collapse soon afterward. They would rather see it all burn that imagine a party that they can't attended. The casino, the scammer, the bank and the church and the party will get it all and their progeny will get ashes.
posted by No Climate - No Food, No Food - No Future. at 1:31 PM on October 27 [8 favorites]
posted by No Climate - No Food, No Food - No Future. at 1:31 PM on October 27 [8 favorites]
I wouldn't use Facebook Marketplace if you paid me but my neighborhood recycle page gets a LOT of use. You just post a picture of whatever you're getting rid of (from furniture to cookbooks to opened dog food your dog hated), tell everyone it's going on the porch first come first served, and forget about it until someone posts that they picked it up. No money exchanges hands, so if the item is potentially valuable you have to be okay with that but by golly it works. I've only once had to bring something back in the house at the end of the day and I am surprised, every day, by what things people will take.
I just picked up a lovely pair of what seem to be brand-new lamps off the page. I'm guessing they were a gift or something and the owners didn't like them because they really look like they just came out of the store. And now they're sitting at either end of my couch being used and enjoyed.
I get gifts from my mother that literally have me thinking she's never met me in her entire life, so it should come as no surprise that I don't want ANY of her things and she is so very put out by that. Oh well. We'll use an estate sale broker when its time and whatever doesn't sell will go to Goodwill or any other org that wants it, and then I'll probably put the rest of it on my neighborhood recycle page and watch it disappear off my porch.
posted by cooker girl at 1:34 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
I just picked up a lovely pair of what seem to be brand-new lamps off the page. I'm guessing they were a gift or something and the owners didn't like them because they really look like they just came out of the store. And now they're sitting at either end of my couch being used and enjoyed.
I get gifts from my mother that literally have me thinking she's never met me in her entire life, so it should come as no surprise that I don't want ANY of her things and she is so very put out by that. Oh well. We'll use an estate sale broker when its time and whatever doesn't sell will go to Goodwill or any other org that wants it, and then I'll probably put the rest of it on my neighborhood recycle page and watch it disappear off my porch.
posted by cooker girl at 1:34 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
Oh, hey, in re china: there are countless sets of china floating around in my family, dating back to like 1900. I have been resolving this by keeping a piece or two from each
I volunteer to take and use someone's wedding china (as long as it's an attractive pattern). But probably not if I have to pay for it.
I've been enjoying buying dishes of Facebook Marketplace. I like having an eclectic mix, and it's very cheap to pick up the remains of someone's set—three plates, four cups, and the like. Today I saw a really nice set of autumn gold dishes with a wheat stalk motif. An old lover and I stocked our first kitchen with the remants of both our mothers' autumn gold dishes, and I really like them. But it was a nearly complete set with place settings for seven. I was like, "Eh, if it was just a few plates and bowls I'd get it, but I don't want a whole set."
When I was starting over two years ago, an old friend gave me a lovely set of creamy butter yellow dishes. Maybe five or six each of plates, bowls, cups, and saucers. Her mother, who died a couple of years ago, collected dishes. Entire sets of dishes! My friend also likes dishes and is keeping some, but it was nice to get this set from her.
I didn't know, before this new stage of life, that I liked dishes. I've had a bad habit my whole adult life of living with people who are messy and don't take care of things, including 29 years with my ex, and I've always had to spend too much time and energy holding back the tide of chaos as best I could to think about aesthetics. Now I love it. I even have a tiny three-shelf cabinet with glass in the door that I arrange things inside in pleasing ways.
But it's also left me with absolutely no patience for dealing with other people's shit. I only want to have to deal with my own. Unfortunately, I won't be in a position to live alone for another year, but I'm really looking forward to it. I want to have people over for tea and cake.
posted by Well I never at 1:36 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
I volunteer to take and use someone's wedding china (as long as it's an attractive pattern). But probably not if I have to pay for it.
I've been enjoying buying dishes of Facebook Marketplace. I like having an eclectic mix, and it's very cheap to pick up the remains of someone's set—three plates, four cups, and the like. Today I saw a really nice set of autumn gold dishes with a wheat stalk motif. An old lover and I stocked our first kitchen with the remants of both our mothers' autumn gold dishes, and I really like them. But it was a nearly complete set with place settings for seven. I was like, "Eh, if it was just a few plates and bowls I'd get it, but I don't want a whole set."
When I was starting over two years ago, an old friend gave me a lovely set of creamy butter yellow dishes. Maybe five or six each of plates, bowls, cups, and saucers. Her mother, who died a couple of years ago, collected dishes. Entire sets of dishes! My friend also likes dishes and is keeping some, but it was nice to get this set from her.
I didn't know, before this new stage of life, that I liked dishes. I've had a bad habit my whole adult life of living with people who are messy and don't take care of things, including 29 years with my ex, and I've always had to spend too much time and energy holding back the tide of chaos as best I could to think about aesthetics. Now I love it. I even have a tiny three-shelf cabinet with glass in the door that I arrange things inside in pleasing ways.
But it's also left me with absolutely no patience for dealing with other people's shit. I only want to have to deal with my own. Unfortunately, I won't be in a position to live alone for another year, but I'm really looking forward to it. I want to have people over for tea and cake.
posted by Well I never at 1:36 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
We bought a house 2 years ago. The owners built it in 1968, and he died there the year before we bought it. She has gone to live with her daughter in a neighboring town. They did some fairly cheap flipper stuff to the inside (lvp floors, painting the original stained solid wood trim in white semi-gloss, etc.) but they did not touch the outbuildings. We acquired a very nice wooden children's placehouse, a falling-down Rubbermaid greenhouse, and a shed absolutely full of junk, so full that we couldn't open the door when we toured the house, and of course we assumed that they would clean it out before we moved in. They did not.
That junk turned out to be made of 1) 50 years worth of Playboys with assorted other pornography mixed in, 2) Christmas decorations, 3) straw bales in various stages of decomposition, and 4) rodent droppings. I can imagine that after one's father dies, dealing with his porn collection is not one's favorite thing to do. But it is unkind to leave it for an unsuspecting buyer.
My parents came to visit a few months after we moved in, and we spent 2 entire days pulling junk out and putting Playboys in the recycling bins, except for those that were so chewed and rat droppinged that they had to go straight in the garbage. My poor parents. We did also find a fully functional shopvac (which really came in handy) and a number of pretty nice tools. But my poor parents.
posted by hydropsyche at 1:37 PM on October 27 [9 favorites]
That junk turned out to be made of 1) 50 years worth of Playboys with assorted other pornography mixed in, 2) Christmas decorations, 3) straw bales in various stages of decomposition, and 4) rodent droppings. I can imagine that after one's father dies, dealing with his porn collection is not one's favorite thing to do. But it is unkind to leave it for an unsuspecting buyer.
My parents came to visit a few months after we moved in, and we spent 2 entire days pulling junk out and putting Playboys in the recycling bins, except for those that were so chewed and rat droppinged that they had to go straight in the garbage. My poor parents. We did also find a fully functional shopvac (which really came in handy) and a number of pretty nice tools. But my poor parents.
posted by hydropsyche at 1:37 PM on October 27 [9 favorites]
if it was a possession of Winston Churchill or Tutankhamun, you'd keep it, right?
Somewhere around here I think I still have a jagged chunk of mortar that’s actually a piece of the Berlin Wall. There was a short section of the Wall that was left standing near the southern extent of the old border, a few concrete panels standing in an empty field that paralleled a nearby road. Its continued existence seemed be credited to something between “we don’t want this, nobody wants this” and “nothing is happening on this land anyway” with some awkward “maybe people need the reminder of what this was” mixed in for good measure. I didn’t want to be the one breaking anything off in case they really meant to keep it there, and I didn’t want to pay for a piece somebody else had maybe looted, but I figured if I found something that had broken off already I wasn’t hastening the decay of a … monument?
Nobody would recognize it as a piece of the Berlin Wall if they saw it. It’s trash. It’s literal trash. But I know what it is because I picked it up myself from the dirt at the base of the Wall, and I know what it means. When somebody goes through my stuff after I die they’ll have to reckon with it and they probably won’t know what it is or what it meant to me or anybody else. At least it’s small.
posted by fedward at 1:37 PM on October 27 [19 favorites]
Somewhere around here I think I still have a jagged chunk of mortar that’s actually a piece of the Berlin Wall. There was a short section of the Wall that was left standing near the southern extent of the old border, a few concrete panels standing in an empty field that paralleled a nearby road. Its continued existence seemed be credited to something between “we don’t want this, nobody wants this” and “nothing is happening on this land anyway” with some awkward “maybe people need the reminder of what this was” mixed in for good measure. I didn’t want to be the one breaking anything off in case they really meant to keep it there, and I didn’t want to pay for a piece somebody else had maybe looted, but I figured if I found something that had broken off already I wasn’t hastening the decay of a … monument?
Nobody would recognize it as a piece of the Berlin Wall if they saw it. It’s trash. It’s literal trash. But I know what it is because I picked it up myself from the dirt at the base of the Wall, and I know what it means. When somebody goes through my stuff after I die they’ll have to reckon with it and they probably won’t know what it is or what it meant to me or anybody else. At least it’s small.
posted by fedward at 1:37 PM on October 27 [19 favorites]
of the 83 to 84 trillion dollars, I suggest 34 trillion allocated to pay off the national debt.
world's largest garage sale.
posted by clavdivs at 1:40 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
world's largest garage sale.
posted by clavdivs at 1:40 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
We'll use an estate sale broker when its time and whatever doesn't sell will go to Goodwill or any other org that wants it, and then I'll probably put the rest of it on my neighborhood recycle page and watch it disappear off my porch.
I used an estate sale service to get rid of a ton of stuff from my ex's parents and grandparents. They sold everything they could, and then at the end of the day some organization that deals with lower-end stuff took whatever was left. It was a whole trickle-down ecosystem that took everything off of my hands and paid me some hundreds of dollars at the end of it. I loved it.
posted by Well I never at 1:42 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
I used an estate sale service to get rid of a ton of stuff from my ex's parents and grandparents. They sold everything they could, and then at the end of the day some organization that deals with lower-end stuff took whatever was left. It was a whole trickle-down ecosystem that took everything off of my hands and paid me some hundreds of dollars at the end of it. I loved it.
posted by Well I never at 1:42 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
I do think it's a little funny how quickly "oh I just wish my parents' stuff would go to someone, anyone who would appreciate it" becomes "well actually I'd like to make money off it".
Yeah, like, if you put things on Craigslist free, I guarantee people will show up within a day or two to take them, almost no matter what they are. Times are hard enough that people need everything. But I think a lot of folks do want money, or what they mean by “appreciate it” is like “appreciate the specific high quality of the thing”; they want to curate the giftee, and that becomes complicated.
posted by corb at 1:46 PM on October 27 [11 favorites]
Yeah, like, if you put things on Craigslist free, I guarantee people will show up within a day or two to take them, almost no matter what they are. Times are hard enough that people need everything. But I think a lot of folks do want money, or what they mean by “appreciate it” is like “appreciate the specific high quality of the thing”; they want to curate the giftee, and that becomes complicated.
posted by corb at 1:46 PM on October 27 [11 favorites]
I blame capitalism and advertising. At some point in the past, it was perfectly ok and even expected for people to continue to use clothing, furniture, appliances, toys, cars, and other things no longer needed by the prior generation. At some point we transitioned to shopping for new shit seeming like an exciting experience - maybe because I'm an introvert, having to buy new things almost always seems like a PITA and a bummer to me, but I fell into that trap for a while. Ooh an "Ultra" HD TV! Who gives a fuck?
Now I'm slowly unloading stuff to charities and have mostly sworn off buying things that don't seem to have a long useful life, like pop culture figurines and aspirational yard tools like pressure washers and shit. I'm an unconventional white dude and I've always hated anything that deliberately makes old stuff obsolete: fashion trends, thing-of-the-year, everyone's-doing-it hobbies, movie and IP-tied toys, new electronics that are 1% better, all that. We were better off when we were darning socks and using the same deck of cards for 20 years. So I don't think it's a boomer problem - it's getting worse every generation. The solution is to stop buying shit and start using the old crap in the boomer storage spaces - at least it doesn't have annual subscription fees. Let's make length of service a point of pride again.
posted by caviar2d2 at 1:50 PM on October 27 [14 favorites]
Now I'm slowly unloading stuff to charities and have mostly sworn off buying things that don't seem to have a long useful life, like pop culture figurines and aspirational yard tools like pressure washers and shit. I'm an unconventional white dude and I've always hated anything that deliberately makes old stuff obsolete: fashion trends, thing-of-the-year, everyone's-doing-it hobbies, movie and IP-tied toys, new electronics that are 1% better, all that. We were better off when we were darning socks and using the same deck of cards for 20 years. So I don't think it's a boomer problem - it's getting worse every generation. The solution is to stop buying shit and start using the old crap in the boomer storage spaces - at least it doesn't have annual subscription fees. Let's make length of service a point of pride again.
posted by caviar2d2 at 1:50 PM on October 27 [14 favorites]
My family has run a small self storage place for 30+ years. Somewhere around 30 of the units are ours. I have no fucking idea what I’m going to do when my folks pass. Probably what they did and shovel most of the stuff into a unit at the storage and deal with it later. My dad tells me he’s sorting through stuff but again, more than 30 units.
posted by Uncle at 1:52 PM on October 27 [11 favorites]
posted by Uncle at 1:52 PM on October 27 [11 favorites]
Nobody would recognize it as a piece of the Berlin Wall if they saw it. It’s trash. It’s literal trash. But I know what it is because I picked it up myself from the dirt at the base of the Wall, and I know what it means.
So much of surviving history is not just the objects themselves but the provenance that comes with them. There are pieces of the Berlin Wall on display that have documented this, documented that, etc. Someone took video when it came from the wall. Someone else had witnesses. It lived in a museum since the wall fell. Etc.
So you can have a literal piece of the Berlin Wall, an actual piece of history, and its value still more or less dies with you unless there's someone also interested in that particular era of history that you know well and believes you.
It's part of the issue in a nutshell. The actual value of this and so much other "stuff" is the time and the people that were there for it. Once they're all gone, it's just... stuff. It doesn't retain any of the intrinsic value of that time or those people.
A person can inherit their grandparent's pocket watch or whatever. And enjoy the connection to their grandparent. If the opportunity arises they can pass it down to their kids, who may still appreciate the familial connection to a person they've never met. But eventually that line ends. And then it's just a pocket watch.
posted by howbigisthistextfield at 1:53 PM on October 27 [12 favorites]
So much of surviving history is not just the objects themselves but the provenance that comes with them. There are pieces of the Berlin Wall on display that have documented this, documented that, etc. Someone took video when it came from the wall. Someone else had witnesses. It lived in a museum since the wall fell. Etc.
So you can have a literal piece of the Berlin Wall, an actual piece of history, and its value still more or less dies with you unless there's someone also interested in that particular era of history that you know well and believes you.
It's part of the issue in a nutshell. The actual value of this and so much other "stuff" is the time and the people that were there for it. Once they're all gone, it's just... stuff. It doesn't retain any of the intrinsic value of that time or those people.
A person can inherit their grandparent's pocket watch or whatever. And enjoy the connection to their grandparent. If the opportunity arises they can pass it down to their kids, who may still appreciate the familial connection to a person they've never met. But eventually that line ends. And then it's just a pocket watch.
posted by howbigisthistextfield at 1:53 PM on October 27 [12 favorites]
Big benefit of living in a condo is the swap room.
I've lived in multiple apartment buildings that had this and I really wish my current one did.
posted by praemunire at 2:08 PM on October 27 [1 favorite]
I've lived in multiple apartment buildings that had this and I really wish my current one did.
posted by praemunire at 2:08 PM on October 27 [1 favorite]
A nespresso machine.
If it's "classic Nespresso", snap it up, those are awesome.
If it's "vertuo", I'd pass, the pods have less availability and are more expensive, due to Nespresso still owning the patent and controlling or preventing other producers from making them.
Sorry, brief derail.
posted by gimonca at 2:11 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
If it's "classic Nespresso", snap it up, those are awesome.
If it's "vertuo", I'd pass, the pods have less availability and are more expensive, due to Nespresso still owning the patent and controlling or preventing other producers from making them.
Sorry, brief derail.
posted by gimonca at 2:11 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
I live 1300 miles from where I grew up, ten minutes from where my wife was born; I have very few physical items from the first 18 years of my life, and she is surrounded by hers.
Unsurprisingly, I have a near-irrational attachment to everything, which bugs her. But it's much easier for her to feel connected and safe because she hasn't had this disruption with her past.
And she's not really aware of it because she never had to "start over" the same way.
posted by wenestvedt at 2:28 PM on October 27 [10 favorites]
Unsurprisingly, I have a near-irrational attachment to everything, which bugs her. But it's much easier for her to feel connected and safe because she hasn't had this disruption with her past.
And she's not really aware of it because she never had to "start over" the same way.
posted by wenestvedt at 2:28 PM on October 27 [10 favorites]
I'll let someone else have the nespresso, we do Real Coffee here
posted by seanmpuckett at 2:37 PM on October 27
posted by seanmpuckett at 2:37 PM on October 27
My mom moved out of my childhood home more than 10 years ago and that involved getting rid of a lot of stuff. She's hanging onto a few things from my childhood for me but even much of that we pretty ruthlessly culled. She's now in a two-bedroom townhouse and there's really not that much left to pass down (there are a few family heirlooms that will stay in the family, though, but neither my brother nor I have children and we don't have any plans for them).
I've been trying to get out from under the mountain of stuff that I felt the need to acquire during the pandemic (mostly clothes and books). It's rough.
I used to feel like my "stuff" is what had value because I had so little money for so long. I still have too much stuff -- what can I say? I'm a fan of physical media -- but I've been much more selective in what I buy. A couple of years ago I made the decision that if I could buy something second-hand first, I would (especially when it came to things like housewares & accessories but I tend to make an exception for "soft" goods -- so not too many clothes/etc.). That's worked out pretty well.
I have my grandma's Fiestaware collection, all of vintage (which I inherited at my request) and I do use some of it but I'm just one person so much of it is still in the boxes it was when it was shipped to me (it was well packed so I'm fine with just leaving it in storage for now). It's probably worth something since much of it is old but I figure it was made to be used so I'm going to use it (she had the same philosophy).
All my friends who have older parents already have a plan and if they haven't downsized already, they've actively gotten rid of the "excess." I'm glad that they're not going to have to deal with this.
posted by edencosmic at 2:44 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
I've been trying to get out from under the mountain of stuff that I felt the need to acquire during the pandemic (mostly clothes and books). It's rough.
I used to feel like my "stuff" is what had value because I had so little money for so long. I still have too much stuff -- what can I say? I'm a fan of physical media -- but I've been much more selective in what I buy. A couple of years ago I made the decision that if I could buy something second-hand first, I would (especially when it came to things like housewares & accessories but I tend to make an exception for "soft" goods -- so not too many clothes/etc.). That's worked out pretty well.
I have my grandma's Fiestaware collection, all of vintage (which I inherited at my request) and I do use some of it but I'm just one person so much of it is still in the boxes it was when it was shipped to me (it was well packed so I'm fine with just leaving it in storage for now). It's probably worth something since much of it is old but I figure it was made to be used so I'm going to use it (she had the same philosophy).
All my friends who have older parents already have a plan and if they haven't downsized already, they've actively gotten rid of the "excess." I'm glad that they're not going to have to deal with this.
posted by edencosmic at 2:44 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
When my mom moved from her (rental) house to her first retirement home, there was the Stuff to deal with. Even though they had moved frequently, there was still so much stuff. My brother and his wife were brutal about paring it down, but I'm far too sentimental about things and ended up with a few things that have me going WTF?
For example, when I was a kid my father built a grandfather clock. I'm sure it was from a kit (which I cannot say), but he did a decent job on it and it's always been around. I think it stopped working about five moves ago, but now it sites in a corner here.
I have the skills to get it working again, but then thought: I have NO desire to listen to the thing chime every fifteen minutes, or worry about keeping the counterweights raised. And it's not the type of piece I admire from an aesthetic perspective, but it still sits in a corner here. If it didn't have the plaque on it which says "built by My Dad's Name" would I have cared? Maybe I should just pull the plaque and be done with it.
We have a local email list with for sale items, and it largely is full of junk with a very rare item of interest. Mostly primary source sellers rather then inheritors, and it's shocking how much people want their stuff to be worth, or conversely, how petty they are compared to just donating it to the thrift store or throwing it away. Guess that's why they're wealthy and I'm not.
We drive all of my mom's too-nice-to-actually-use furniture to the goodwill, they were thrilled to have it, believe it or not (I like to think there is a family out there eating meals off of the dining set and watching TV from the sofas that they got for an affordable price). A matching set came up on the local email thingy with someone trying to get $$$ for it, and it stayed on there for months. No one wants your fancy furniture, alas--with the sometimes exception of noted collector pieces from very famous designers.
posted by maxwelton at 2:45 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
For example, when I was a kid my father built a grandfather clock. I'm sure it was from a kit (which I cannot say), but he did a decent job on it and it's always been around. I think it stopped working about five moves ago, but now it sites in a corner here.
I have the skills to get it working again, but then thought: I have NO desire to listen to the thing chime every fifteen minutes, or worry about keeping the counterweights raised. And it's not the type of piece I admire from an aesthetic perspective, but it still sits in a corner here. If it didn't have the plaque on it which says "built by My Dad's Name" would I have cared? Maybe I should just pull the plaque and be done with it.
We have a local email list with for sale items, and it largely is full of junk with a very rare item of interest. Mostly primary source sellers rather then inheritors, and it's shocking how much people want their stuff to be worth, or conversely, how petty they are compared to just donating it to the thrift store or throwing it away. Guess that's why they're wealthy and I'm not.
We drive all of my mom's too-nice-to-actually-use furniture to the goodwill, they were thrilled to have it, believe it or not (I like to think there is a family out there eating meals off of the dining set and watching TV from the sofas that they got for an affordable price). A matching set came up on the local email thingy with someone trying to get $$$ for it, and it stayed on there for months. No one wants your fancy furniture, alas--with the sometimes exception of noted collector pieces from very famous designers.
posted by maxwelton at 2:45 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
Let's make length of service a point of pride again.
I guess that would mean passing the things to the grandchildren, since the kids of Boomers are going to be empty nesters as the Boomers pass (I had my youngest at 40, and he is a teenager) and have needed plates and furniture and things. But Gen Z and Gen Alpha are even less likely to have homes for these things.
posted by warriorqueen at 3:20 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
I guess that would mean passing the things to the grandchildren, since the kids of Boomers are going to be empty nesters as the Boomers pass (I had my youngest at 40, and he is a teenager) and have needed plates and furniture and things. But Gen Z and Gen Alpha are even less likely to have homes for these things.
posted by warriorqueen at 3:20 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
"[Plastic] could be the answer to our age-old philosophical question: Why are we here?
Plastic, assholes!
So the plastic is here our job is done we can be phased out now."
- George Carlin
posted by jeffburdges at 3:24 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
Plastic, assholes!
So the plastic is here our job is done we can be phased out now."
- George Carlin
posted by jeffburdges at 3:24 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
We moved my parents out of their house of 57 years to an apartment nearby, because someone needs to be nearby if something happens to one of them, and the closest relative was my 80 year old aunt, who lived 6 hours away. Over the summer, everyone came down and took what they wanted. My kid got a set of silverware, as well as both my cousins. The big thing to get rid of was all the Cash pottery that my mom had collected. When the house sells, they should get a decent chunk of cash. Assuming that nothing happens to them, that'll be our inheritance.
We'd recently moved, and in the process gotten rid of a bunch of stuff, so we absorbed the China cabinet, to go with my Grandmother's China cabinet, the dining room table, and random other furniture.
As for the next generation, my big item's 12 long boxes of comics. At least some of them are worth something, but to get them evaluated/sold, first I need to inventory them, which will be a pain. I got started, but sorting through them takes a fair amount of space, so that's been put on hold. Hopefully next year I can finish that up, sell what I can, and recycle the rest. (We had a collector come by and look at them. He paid $250 for what he wanted, and said that he knew people who'd be interested in other books, once I got it all sorted.)
posted by Spike Glee at 3:40 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
We'd recently moved, and in the process gotten rid of a bunch of stuff, so we absorbed the China cabinet, to go with my Grandmother's China cabinet, the dining room table, and random other furniture.
As for the next generation, my big item's 12 long boxes of comics. At least some of them are worth something, but to get them evaluated/sold, first I need to inventory them, which will be a pain. I got started, but sorting through them takes a fair amount of space, so that's been put on hold. Hopefully next year I can finish that up, sell what I can, and recycle the rest. (We had a collector come by and look at them. He paid $250 for what he wanted, and said that he knew people who'd be interested in other books, once I got it all sorted.)
posted by Spike Glee at 3:40 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
My wife and I are in our 60s and have so much stuff.
Sorry kids.
posted by LarryC at 4:40 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
Sorry kids.
posted by LarryC at 4:40 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
I just want Uncle Ralph’s Jarts.
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 4:52 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 4:52 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
In other news, if the kids aren't still into vinyl when I buy the farm, nephews and friends, I am quite sorry,
posted by thivaia at 4:52 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
posted by thivaia at 4:52 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
My wife and I are determined not to perpetuate this mess.
I have some stuff that was my Grandfathers that I can't bear to part with (mostly tools and a collection of maritime and lighthouse reference books and manuals) but only one of my kids even met my grandfather and none of them care about his junk. We went through several years of paying for storage to keep almost all my Mother's possessions in a storage shed because keeping it all was a condition of her agreeing to be moved to an aged care facility. My sister and I kept getting asked whether all her stuff was safe and we couldn't lie to her, so just kept paying the monthly bill for storage until she died. 90% of her most precious belongings went straight in the bin, because nobody wanted them and they had absolutely no value. My Mother, a lifelong obsessive with being organised and labelling everything, as she began to lose her faculties, changed into someone that stashed things away in random places so every single box, bag and suitcase had to be carefully sorted to locate the few actually precious or valuable things hidden in them.
We're not going to put our kids through this mess and, as we get older, our possessions will gradually diminish. All of our kids have been clear they don't want our stuff. Well, they want our house, our vintage car and our boat, but that's about it ;-)
One of the things that I've really noticed is that people these days have no regard to retaining documents of any sort. Everyone assumes that everything is on the Internet and the Internet will always be there, so why bother? I'm not sure how accurate this is, but I suspect not very. Anyway, I guess all my collected books will go straight in the bin at some point, which makes me sad. Everything else I couldn't care less about and plan to have well and truly disposed of long before I start losing my marbles.
posted by dg at 5:20 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
I have some stuff that was my Grandfathers that I can't bear to part with (mostly tools and a collection of maritime and lighthouse reference books and manuals) but only one of my kids even met my grandfather and none of them care about his junk. We went through several years of paying for storage to keep almost all my Mother's possessions in a storage shed because keeping it all was a condition of her agreeing to be moved to an aged care facility. My sister and I kept getting asked whether all her stuff was safe and we couldn't lie to her, so just kept paying the monthly bill for storage until she died. 90% of her most precious belongings went straight in the bin, because nobody wanted them and they had absolutely no value. My Mother, a lifelong obsessive with being organised and labelling everything, as she began to lose her faculties, changed into someone that stashed things away in random places so every single box, bag and suitcase had to be carefully sorted to locate the few actually precious or valuable things hidden in them.
We're not going to put our kids through this mess and, as we get older, our possessions will gradually diminish. All of our kids have been clear they don't want our stuff. Well, they want our house, our vintage car and our boat, but that's about it ;-)
One of the things that I've really noticed is that people these days have no regard to retaining documents of any sort. Everyone assumes that everything is on the Internet and the Internet will always be there, so why bother? I'm not sure how accurate this is, but I suspect not very. Anyway, I guess all my collected books will go straight in the bin at some point, which makes me sad. Everything else I couldn't care less about and plan to have well and truly disposed of long before I start losing my marbles.
posted by dg at 5:20 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
Fedward, maybe you could take the juju off the gnome by creating a new tradition where a young family member gets to repaint it. Or repaint it yourself in a more pleasing way. You wouldn't be removing anything that way. Or it could become one of those roaming holiday gifts that a different person gets every year.
posted by emjaybee at 5:21 PM on October 27 [9 favorites]
posted by emjaybee at 5:21 PM on October 27 [9 favorites]
Also Habitat for Humanity ReStore can take big but usable stuff like light fixtures and cabinets
posted by emjaybee at 5:27 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
posted by emjaybee at 5:27 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
Well, this is one positive aspect of being estranged from my parents for reasons that are completely opaque to me.
posted by Ickster at 5:35 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
posted by Ickster at 5:35 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
My dad declared bankruptcy in the mid 90s when I was in graduate school and my parents downsized from a large house to a 3br to a 2br to a 1br to a smaller 1br retirement apartment. So a lot of the culling has been done for me. As the only child this has been something of a relief.
That said, my dad had a huge stamp collection. It eventually went away via a long story, I have written about it elsewhere on the blue and will spare all y'all.
My wife's dad died a few years back and her and her two sibs had to make a bunch of decisions. My BIL the stoic wanted literally two things. My SIL wanted to litigate every. single. book and dishtowel and tchotchke. It was kind of brutal, to the extent that she'd re open and search through boxes of stuff we'd agreed could go.
Meanwhile I now sit in a 4 br house with two kids moved out, and its full of books and tools books and art and books and a baby grand and oh shit, we're going to have to deal with this at some point. But I feel like we have consciously been buying less, accumulating less. I used to absolutely fetishize buying books, I envisioned a house full of bookshelves. Having moved once with thousands of books I now know this is insane. I don't buy books anymore.
On the fourth hand: DVDs of favorite movies, since so much digital content gets memory holed these days; and my personal cutout for all frettings financial and environmental: board games.
as others here have said: sorry, kids. Maybe at least one of them will want to live here after we go.
posted by hearthpig at 5:58 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
That said, my dad had a huge stamp collection. It eventually went away via a long story, I have written about it elsewhere on the blue and will spare all y'all.
My wife's dad died a few years back and her and her two sibs had to make a bunch of decisions. My BIL the stoic wanted literally two things. My SIL wanted to litigate every. single. book and dishtowel and tchotchke. It was kind of brutal, to the extent that she'd re open and search through boxes of stuff we'd agreed could go.
Meanwhile I now sit in a 4 br house with two kids moved out, and its full of books and tools books and art and books and a baby grand and oh shit, we're going to have to deal with this at some point. But I feel like we have consciously been buying less, accumulating less. I used to absolutely fetishize buying books, I envisioned a house full of bookshelves. Having moved once with thousands of books I now know this is insane. I don't buy books anymore.
On the fourth hand: DVDs of favorite movies, since so much digital content gets memory holed these days; and my personal cutout for all frettings financial and environmental: board games.
as others here have said: sorry, kids. Maybe at least one of them will want to live here after we go.
posted by hearthpig at 5:58 PM on October 27 [3 favorites]
When my mom passed away I inherited all her stuff and my grandparents stuff that they all collectively had spent a lifetime gathering, sometimes at considerable expense. A lot of it had to be tossed, the books got donated to the local prison and the jewelry, dishes and silverware and some other things sold for about a penny on the dollar.
I learned that jewelry is basically scrap. Literally, jewelers will buy old jewelry dirt cheap, toss the gems in a jar with all the other gems and melt the rest, if it's pure enough. I learned that the Royal Dalton dinnerware, some of which cost $100 a piece, went for about $250, in its entirety, because it was pretty complete. Some other things sold, but ...
All that stuff might have sentimental value but that's all it's got, for the most part. Which is fine if that's your thing.
I got an embarrassingly small amount of money out of the deal and that was that. I think my cousins got a bit more, but they had room to store it, so ... yeah.
posted by JustSayNoDawg at 6:14 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
I learned that jewelry is basically scrap. Literally, jewelers will buy old jewelry dirt cheap, toss the gems in a jar with all the other gems and melt the rest, if it's pure enough. I learned that the Royal Dalton dinnerware, some of which cost $100 a piece, went for about $250, in its entirety, because it was pretty complete. Some other things sold, but ...
All that stuff might have sentimental value but that's all it's got, for the most part. Which is fine if that's your thing.
I got an embarrassingly small amount of money out of the deal and that was that. I think my cousins got a bit more, but they had room to store it, so ... yeah.
posted by JustSayNoDawg at 6:14 PM on October 27 [4 favorites]
You can put my wife and I on the "Sorry kids" list also.
posted by freakazoid at 6:21 PM on October 27
posted by freakazoid at 6:21 PM on October 27
Oh yeah, I learned about jewelry when I tried to sell my engagement ring. Jewelers offered me I want to say 200$ on a 3000$ ring when valued 10 years ago. I actually got the most cash from walking into a pawn shop near a military base, because they knew they could sell that thing to some sucker wanting a quick engagement ring for his girlfriend for real money without blinking twice or re-setting the stone. Still only got about 400$. The jewelry that our parents and grandparents thought was going to be our nest eggs and protection against poverty is basically worthless in a world with cubic zirconia and lab grown diamonds.
posted by corb at 6:58 PM on October 27 [11 favorites]
posted by corb at 6:58 PM on October 27 [11 favorites]
My wife's dad made a crib with his brother for his daughters. It's modular, and converts into a twin bed.
Now my daughters have grown up using it.
Good stuff.
posted by eustatic at 7:19 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
Now my daughters have grown up using it.
Good stuff.
posted by eustatic at 7:19 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
One overlooked reason for this is real advances in material science and technology. You can get nice shiny plates and utensils for a variety of prices that need little care.
posted by hermanubis at 7:32 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
posted by hermanubis at 7:32 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
I inherited my mom's place in 2021. Every year for the city's curbside sodaigomi pickup day I've wheeled a few boxes of stuff out into the street for the pickers to go through and recycle what they can – I think I have one more year of that.
Just last week when going through a kitchen cabinet I fond one of these cute guys; as a low-key hipster I like finding stuff that is useful but nobody else has LOL.
posted by torokunai at 7:52 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
Just last week when going through a kitchen cabinet I fond one of these cute guys; as a low-key hipster I like finding stuff that is useful but nobody else has LOL.
posted by torokunai at 7:52 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
The great thing about being the grandchildren of Depression-era folks is that you find out quickly that everything that was kept for "good" was worthless. The wedding china, "a full set of Limoges" ... actually a luncheon set of something serviceable with the pattern stencilled on by a workman-like company near Limoges. The silver service? A half set, plated; not even worth the melt. But so many weird-ass serving forks (pickle forks, olive forks, rollmop forks), and from the midwestern side of the family, every grandkid got at least one pickled egg plate.
posted by scruss at 8:12 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
posted by scruss at 8:12 PM on October 27 [5 favorites]
Nobody would recognize it as a piece of the Berlin Wall if they saw it. It’s trash. It’s literal trash.
You could have this crafted, I've learned, into a pair of concrete testicles for putting in a small wooden box.
posted by away for regrooving at 8:20 PM on October 27 [30 favorites]
You could have this crafted, I've learned, into a pair of concrete testicles for putting in a small wooden box.
posted by away for regrooving at 8:20 PM on October 27 [30 favorites]
The article, and none of the commenters, got to the topic where a stepparent joins the family from another city, and is the sole custodian of 10 boxes or so of photos of their relatives from half a century ago whom no one knows the names of. It hurts to think of the history that gets lost when those boxes eventually end up in a 1-800-GOT-JUNK truck, but only a bit. My mother, still alive and thriving, has curated a small album of her relatives, many slaughtered in Europe 80 years ago, with their names, year of photo, and location on the back. I don't usually get bossy here, but please get your parents and grandparents to do that while they're able. At most 2-4 photos of the direct line relatives (grandparents, great-, and if you're lucky the great-greats), fewer the uncles and aunts and cousins, in a single album. Write stuff on the back, because auxiliary pages get lost. That's how we preserve their memories.
I'll save those 50K-plus digital photo collections for a future rant.
posted by morspin at 8:39 PM on October 27 [10 favorites]
I'll save those 50K-plus digital photo collections for a future rant.
posted by morspin at 8:39 PM on October 27 [10 favorites]
I'm a Certified Professional organizer; I've been doing this for 23 years. angiep, above, is correct about all three of her main points, but it's hard to convince people of the second and third points (that their kids don't want their stuff and nobody else wants their stuff) because they're still struggling to embrace the first point: "you are not your stuff."
Most people are satisfied with their legacies as human beings; most people don't look at the work they did and the children they raised and the interactions they had and think, "Yup, I had a good enough life." Unfortunately, it's all too common that people end up feeling forgotten — by the companies they gave their waking hours to serve, by the children they sacrificed for (or, they realize too late, failed to sacrificed even a few moments for), or by the world they felt never gave them the attention they were promised, either by well-meaning adults when they were children or by themselves to soothe their inner children.
If you are not entirely satisfied by the life you lived, then the things you own, that you acquire, that you build or display or wear all become the symbols of your life's value -- but only to you, and never to the people whom you imagine (incorrectly) are thinking about your value.
The sooner in life you can absorb the lesson that "you are not your stuff" and that you have value as a human being that both exceeds, and is entirely unrelated to, your "stuff," and the sooner you and I and everyone can convey this meaning to others, the better.
About one-third to one-half of my client base at any given time is facing the unenviable task of either downsizing their own possessions (for their safety or to enable them to move to a smaller living space) or downsizing everything that has been "bestowed" on them by family members who didn't get the message. It can be agonizing for them to do on their own; I try to make the experience more emotionally satisfying and somewhat lightened. With them, as with the seniors who attend my speaking engagements as part of the process of beginning to think about downsizing both possessions and homesteads, the recognition that stuff is just stuff, no matter how nice, and that we can't take it with us, is the key to making any true progress.
The kindest lesson I can impart is that whatever you fear about letting go of possessions, know that it will be far less painful to make the decisions now, on your own terms, than to have the decisions foisted on you when you are too ill to make any decisions about where to live or what can stay with you
(Bonus lesson: don't mistake thinking you should have a sentimental attachment to something for actually having a sentimental attachment to something. If you're not using it, displaying it, wearing it, or somehow making it a part of your active life, it almost certainly doesn't have a heartfelt value to you. Just as your stuff is not you, your Grandma's stuff is not your Grandma.)
posted by The Wrong Kind of Cheese at 8:51 PM on October 27 [53 favorites]
Most people are satisfied with their legacies as human beings; most people don't look at the work they did and the children they raised and the interactions they had and think, "Yup, I had a good enough life." Unfortunately, it's all too common that people end up feeling forgotten — by the companies they gave their waking hours to serve, by the children they sacrificed for (or, they realize too late, failed to sacrificed even a few moments for), or by the world they felt never gave them the attention they were promised, either by well-meaning adults when they were children or by themselves to soothe their inner children.
If you are not entirely satisfied by the life you lived, then the things you own, that you acquire, that you build or display or wear all become the symbols of your life's value -- but only to you, and never to the people whom you imagine (incorrectly) are thinking about your value.
The sooner in life you can absorb the lesson that "you are not your stuff" and that you have value as a human being that both exceeds, and is entirely unrelated to, your "stuff," and the sooner you and I and everyone can convey this meaning to others, the better.
About one-third to one-half of my client base at any given time is facing the unenviable task of either downsizing their own possessions (for their safety or to enable them to move to a smaller living space) or downsizing everything that has been "bestowed" on them by family members who didn't get the message. It can be agonizing for them to do on their own; I try to make the experience more emotionally satisfying and somewhat lightened. With them, as with the seniors who attend my speaking engagements as part of the process of beginning to think about downsizing both possessions and homesteads, the recognition that stuff is just stuff, no matter how nice, and that we can't take it with us, is the key to making any true progress.
The kindest lesson I can impart is that whatever you fear about letting go of possessions, know that it will be far less painful to make the decisions now, on your own terms, than to have the decisions foisted on you when you are too ill to make any decisions about where to live or what can stay with you
(Bonus lesson: don't mistake thinking you should have a sentimental attachment to something for actually having a sentimental attachment to something. If you're not using it, displaying it, wearing it, or somehow making it a part of your active life, it almost certainly doesn't have a heartfelt value to you. Just as your stuff is not you, your Grandma's stuff is not your Grandma.)
posted by The Wrong Kind of Cheese at 8:51 PM on October 27 [53 favorites]
A number of years ago my parents decided to move out of the rambling old farmhouse I'd grown up in, to a retirement community in town. So rtha and I, and my sister and her partner, converged for a long xmas holiday to help go through soooooo much stuff. An attic, a basement, a garage, a very large house. I ended up shipping a number of boxes to myself here -- none of which, I should acknowledge, I have opened in all those years -- with school memorabilia and a few childhood things. Since then, rtha died, my sister died, my dad died, and now it's just my mom and me, but every time I go visit her and look around the apartment in the retirement community, I get a sense of dread of going through what they moved there, and get mad at my sister for leaving me to do that by myself.
The counterpoint story, which I think I've shared on here before, is that my grandfather died the fall after I graduated from college. The aunts and cousins convened to clear out the house, and I had zero interest in the fancy china and linens but I happily took a bunch of my grandmother's kitchen stuff for my new place. I still use her pie tins and wooden spoons and measuring cups and stock pot and corningware casserole dishes and the stuff is as sturdy and bombproof as it gets.
posted by gingerbeer at 9:23 PM on October 27 [21 favorites]
The counterpoint story, which I think I've shared on here before, is that my grandfather died the fall after I graduated from college. The aunts and cousins convened to clear out the house, and I had zero interest in the fancy china and linens but I happily took a bunch of my grandmother's kitchen stuff for my new place. I still use her pie tins and wooden spoons and measuring cups and stock pot and corningware casserole dishes and the stuff is as sturdy and bombproof as it gets.
posted by gingerbeer at 9:23 PM on October 27 [21 favorites]
By now I guess it's clear that the "reverse mortgage" idea was a play to turn elderly people's real estate over to private equity instead of their kids en-masse.
Medicare effectively forces children to sell their parent's home before nursing home costs will be paid for. Same outcome, more or less, in the end. Over time, you can see the trend in wealth redistribution upwards.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 9:50 PM on October 27 [11 favorites]
Medicare effectively forces children to sell their parent's home before nursing home costs will be paid for. Same outcome, more or less, in the end. Over time, you can see the trend in wealth redistribution upwards.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 9:50 PM on October 27 [11 favorites]
I've talked here about the honestly traumatizing work of having to go through each of my parents' things (a whole, largely abandoned house with a lifetime of possessions, and later, a whole storage unit that had been untouched for five years, with a surprise of tons of things from my own childhood and adolescence mixed in). This article, though, makes me think of my cousin. His parents had already become the unofficial keepers of all the stuff. In their (large) house, they had multiple hutches, one from my uncle's parents, one from my aunt's parents, and, just for fun, one or two they'd bought themselves.
When they moved into a condo, they pretty much didn't downsize. They managed to fit all of their stuff in the (cramped) condo. When they passed away, and my cousin moved into a house, one of his priorities was having enough space for all the generations of stuff his parents had passed on to him. Just moving into his house, he had five hutches. When I visited, I was kind of stunned at how much of the house is just storage for his parents' things. He and his wife have one son, and probably won't have any more kids. It's hard to look at it as anything other than delaying the inevitable, and passing the trauma of divesting down to the latest possible generation.
A couple years back, when my mother was still alive, she told me that she wanted to give me one of the two sets of silver she had, and I had to tell her no. I pointed out that I live in a foreign country, and the only way to get it back would be by shipping (outrageously expensive) or through checked luggage (where it would almost certainly disappear, at best, or take up tons of space for things I could actually want to bring back), and that I would almost certainly *never* use it.
I struggle with my own pile of useless stuff. I like it. It's why I have it. It has meaning to me, and I want, dearly, to believe that something the importance I place on it gives it some intrinsic meaning to others as well, but that's just the same thing that ended with me finding out how to rent a dumpster to be set next to my father's house. Mrs. Ghidorah doesn't deserve to have to go through my piles of crap wondering why I kept all this stuff that, as far as she'll be able to tell, has no meaning or value whatsoever. Maybe it's tied into some sort of hope that I'll continue on, while knowing that there's nothing I've done that will live after me, so maybe it's the things I had that will remind people of me?
The only problem, from personal experience, is being left with the detritus of a life definitely makes you think of the person whose crap you're sifting through, just not in any positive way.
posted by Ghidorah at 10:24 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
When they moved into a condo, they pretty much didn't downsize. They managed to fit all of their stuff in the (cramped) condo. When they passed away, and my cousin moved into a house, one of his priorities was having enough space for all the generations of stuff his parents had passed on to him. Just moving into his house, he had five hutches. When I visited, I was kind of stunned at how much of the house is just storage for his parents' things. He and his wife have one son, and probably won't have any more kids. It's hard to look at it as anything other than delaying the inevitable, and passing the trauma of divesting down to the latest possible generation.
A couple years back, when my mother was still alive, she told me that she wanted to give me one of the two sets of silver she had, and I had to tell her no. I pointed out that I live in a foreign country, and the only way to get it back would be by shipping (outrageously expensive) or through checked luggage (where it would almost certainly disappear, at best, or take up tons of space for things I could actually want to bring back), and that I would almost certainly *never* use it.
I struggle with my own pile of useless stuff. I like it. It's why I have it. It has meaning to me, and I want, dearly, to believe that something the importance I place on it gives it some intrinsic meaning to others as well, but that's just the same thing that ended with me finding out how to rent a dumpster to be set next to my father's house. Mrs. Ghidorah doesn't deserve to have to go through my piles of crap wondering why I kept all this stuff that, as far as she'll be able to tell, has no meaning or value whatsoever. Maybe it's tied into some sort of hope that I'll continue on, while knowing that there's nothing I've done that will live after me, so maybe it's the things I had that will remind people of me?
The only problem, from personal experience, is being left with the detritus of a life definitely makes you think of the person whose crap you're sifting through, just not in any positive way.
posted by Ghidorah at 10:24 PM on October 27 [6 favorites]
My parents had five kids, 22 living grand children, and 23 great grandchildren when they died. They lived in the same house for over 60 years. They had lots and lots of stuff, but we had lots and lots of people to share it. We still had plenty of to get rid if, but it was less of a burden and more of a binding experience.
It was interesting what people really wanted. Lots of times it wasn’t actually valuable. I wanted the yellow Tupperware strainer and mom’s electric skillet for example.
My husband is an only child; his parents have two houses full of “valuable” stuff. I dread thinking about how different an experience it will be.
posted by dpx.mfx at 10:28 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
It was interesting what people really wanted. Lots of times it wasn’t actually valuable. I wanted the yellow Tupperware strainer and mom’s electric skillet for example.
My husband is an only child; his parents have two houses full of “valuable” stuff. I dread thinking about how different an experience it will be.
posted by dpx.mfx at 10:28 PM on October 27 [2 favorites]
My parents moved to Canada from England, bringing very little in the way of memorabilia and heirlooms. Over the next fifty years, they moved house frequently, including moving back to England in 1990, and back to Canada in 2004. They have twice TransAtlatically transported thousands of paperback books, hundreds of warped, scratched and worn records in tattered faded sleeves, boxes full of stuffed animals, all of our school records and report cards, broken tobacco pipes, and chipped mismatched china of no specific provenance. Conversely, they have given away or thrown away hundreds of beautiful pieces of art and a huge collection of Canadian Native handicrafts including some spectacular beadwork and many pairs of slippers, mukluks, and gloves as well as traditional parkas and buckskin jackets.
After coming back to Canada to retire, my mother discovered the joys of auction houses. Her already large collections of teapots and fairy statues grew exponentially. At last count she had over 140 teapots on display in the too-large home they bought when they moved back as well as two large cabinets full of cheaply made resin fairy statues and an entire floor to ceiling built in display cabinet full of Spode china which she thinks is worth far more than she could ever get for it. Every closet in her house is full of linens, china, crystal, silverware, etc. She has every kitchen gadget known to man ( eg, a quesadilla maker, she has never made a quesadilla). My father died about six years ago and her entire house is full of things, her double garage is full of things, she's a single person in a five-bedroom home. There are dozens of boxes of Christmas decorations (she has not put up a tree in 12 years, but she has a Santa collection, a Nutcracker collection, and two themed tree collections). She spends an insane amount of time cleaning and organizing her stuff. Her house is neat, just really full.
Mum is 83 this year. I regularly beg her to consider downsizing to a condo, to get rid of stuff and she always agrees, but despite my brother hauling off dozens of boxes of things to the auction house, somehow it's still always full at her house and she somehow still keeps buying things despite rarely going out. She bids on things online, shops at clothing stores online (she literally owns over a hundred of pairs of pants, all very similar in style, dozens of pairs of shoes, hundreds of pieces of inexpensive jewelry that she thinks are worth money, and so on) Neither I, nor my two siblings, want any of her stuff. I've explained to her that it will only be a burden to us to have to get rid of when we're all mourning her death, that most of it has no sentimental value to us, that none of us have a big house or storage room for it all. Nothing helps. Her estate is to be split between us equally, but really all the estate is is her home, which although large is in a city with low real estate prices and is not particularly desirable, either, being rather dated.
My sister is profoundly disabled, my brother has mental health issues that will make it hard to impossible for him to deal with anything after her death. I will have to travel 1200 miles to spend months dealing with it all, and anticipate a lot of arguments with my brother while I do it. I wish nothing more than that my mother would give up her stuff, put it in storage, sell it, donate it, throw it out, I don't care, and move into a condo so that she can live a relatively peaceful life in her final years. It's not going to happen. Her stuff owns her, she is her stuff. When I've tried seriously discussing with her the mess it's going to leave us to deal with she cheerfully says "I won't care, I'll be dead". So I will have to deal with the hundreds of Dean Koontz and Stephen King novels, the New Christy Minstrel albums and 150 teapots while I'm wracked with grief. It seems really unfair, but that's how it's going to go.
posted by alltomorrowsparties at 10:59 PM on October 27 [18 favorites]
After coming back to Canada to retire, my mother discovered the joys of auction houses. Her already large collections of teapots and fairy statues grew exponentially. At last count she had over 140 teapots on display in the too-large home they bought when they moved back as well as two large cabinets full of cheaply made resin fairy statues and an entire floor to ceiling built in display cabinet full of Spode china which she thinks is worth far more than she could ever get for it. Every closet in her house is full of linens, china, crystal, silverware, etc. She has every kitchen gadget known to man ( eg, a quesadilla maker, she has never made a quesadilla). My father died about six years ago and her entire house is full of things, her double garage is full of things, she's a single person in a five-bedroom home. There are dozens of boxes of Christmas decorations (she has not put up a tree in 12 years, but she has a Santa collection, a Nutcracker collection, and two themed tree collections). She spends an insane amount of time cleaning and organizing her stuff. Her house is neat, just really full.
Mum is 83 this year. I regularly beg her to consider downsizing to a condo, to get rid of stuff and she always agrees, but despite my brother hauling off dozens of boxes of things to the auction house, somehow it's still always full at her house and she somehow still keeps buying things despite rarely going out. She bids on things online, shops at clothing stores online (she literally owns over a hundred of pairs of pants, all very similar in style, dozens of pairs of shoes, hundreds of pieces of inexpensive jewelry that she thinks are worth money, and so on) Neither I, nor my two siblings, want any of her stuff. I've explained to her that it will only be a burden to us to have to get rid of when we're all mourning her death, that most of it has no sentimental value to us, that none of us have a big house or storage room for it all. Nothing helps. Her estate is to be split between us equally, but really all the estate is is her home, which although large is in a city with low real estate prices and is not particularly desirable, either, being rather dated.
My sister is profoundly disabled, my brother has mental health issues that will make it hard to impossible for him to deal with anything after her death. I will have to travel 1200 miles to spend months dealing with it all, and anticipate a lot of arguments with my brother while I do it. I wish nothing more than that my mother would give up her stuff, put it in storage, sell it, donate it, throw it out, I don't care, and move into a condo so that she can live a relatively peaceful life in her final years. It's not going to happen. Her stuff owns her, she is her stuff. When I've tried seriously discussing with her the mess it's going to leave us to deal with she cheerfully says "I won't care, I'll be dead". So I will have to deal with the hundreds of Dean Koontz and Stephen King novels, the New Christy Minstrel albums and 150 teapots while I'm wracked with grief. It seems really unfair, but that's how it's going to go.
posted by alltomorrowsparties at 10:59 PM on October 27 [18 favorites]
After Mr. Peach died, I (boomer) took a year and got rid of almost everything, so now I'm living in a three-story row house in a city, with the top floor mostly empty and the rest of the house pretty darn spare. I have never owned much, anyway. My (Greatest Generation) mother had to sell most of her valuable possessions and property in order to move into a life care community and I was glad she had something to sell because that meant she could be cared for. My sister, I think, took whatever was left over that was valuable when my mom died; she always cared more about such things.
My mom (who had Parkinson's) used to apologize that she wouldn't be able to leave me any money, and I used to tell her that having enough money for her care was worth every penny. I would have been destroyed emotionally and financially if I had had to provide care for her.
Mr. Peach and I were never actually financially comfortable until late in our long marriage, but we avoided debt, and so in later years we were able to buy a small house for our kid. Unfortunately, now our kid's house is full of stuff. We raised our kid thrifty and ethical, and so they have a terrible time getting rid of anything, even if it's mostly stuff they got thrifting.
At least they won't have to deal with much of my stuff when the time comes. But they will have to do something with those damn millennial plastic bins full of memorabilia that they're still storing in my basement.
posted by Peach at 12:37 AM on October 28 [12 favorites]
My mom (who had Parkinson's) used to apologize that she wouldn't be able to leave me any money, and I used to tell her that having enough money for her care was worth every penny. I would have been destroyed emotionally and financially if I had had to provide care for her.
Mr. Peach and I were never actually financially comfortable until late in our long marriage, but we avoided debt, and so in later years we were able to buy a small house for our kid. Unfortunately, now our kid's house is full of stuff. We raised our kid thrifty and ethical, and so they have a terrible time getting rid of anything, even if it's mostly stuff they got thrifting.
At least they won't have to deal with much of my stuff when the time comes. But they will have to do something with those damn millennial plastic bins full of memorabilia that they're still storing in my basement.
posted by Peach at 12:37 AM on October 28 [12 favorites]
They hoarded so much wealth from their successors that we can’t afford to inherit their cubic miles of possessions. May their wasted money be incinerated in effigy of their greed.
posted by Callisto Prime at 1:15 AM on October 28 [4 favorites]
posted by Callisto Prime at 1:15 AM on October 28 [4 favorites]
A friend offered to help me sift through and downsize a large storage unit filled with stuff, claiming she would not be hindered by sentimentality or whatever other reasons I was keeping said stuff. Her perspective would be objective and pragmatic. "I will be brutal," she said.
So she enters the space and picks up an item. "What's this?" she asks. I explain what it is, its uniqueness, its history, its beauty, despite its lack of monetary value. "Oh, that's cool! You can't get rid of that" she says and returns it to its dusty place. "That's the problem!" I yell, "everything I have is cool!" Indeed, by her brutal judgement, nothing was worth disposing that day.
It took me a while to realize that maybe it's not my responsibility to collect and keep cool stuff. I do not have the means to maintain a massive collection of relatively worthless yet interesting items. "I am not in the museum business" is the mantra I tell myself now whenever a cool item crosses my path. I just take a photo of it instead.
posted by bonefish at 2:17 AM on October 28 [14 favorites]
So she enters the space and picks up an item. "What's this?" she asks. I explain what it is, its uniqueness, its history, its beauty, despite its lack of monetary value. "Oh, that's cool! You can't get rid of that" she says and returns it to its dusty place. "That's the problem!" I yell, "everything I have is cool!" Indeed, by her brutal judgement, nothing was worth disposing that day.
It took me a while to realize that maybe it's not my responsibility to collect and keep cool stuff. I do not have the means to maintain a massive collection of relatively worthless yet interesting items. "I am not in the museum business" is the mantra I tell myself now whenever a cool item crosses my path. I just take a photo of it instead.
posted by bonefish at 2:17 AM on October 28 [14 favorites]
Honestly, the first sentence in the pull quote made me raise my eyebrows:
Much has been made of the impending "great wealth transfer" as baby boomers and the Silent Generation pass on a combined $84.4 trillion in wealth to younger generations.
If my parents' observations are anything to go by, that $84.4 trillion in wealth is going to elder care and health insurnace companies, leaving the younger generations with just the stuff.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 3:31 AM on October 28 [31 favorites]
Much has been made of the impending "great wealth transfer" as baby boomers and the Silent Generation pass on a combined $84.4 trillion in wealth to younger generations.
If my parents' observations are anything to go by, that $84.4 trillion in wealth is going to elder care and health insurnace companies, leaving the younger generations with just the stuff.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 3:31 AM on October 28 [31 favorites]
Counterpoint: I can imagine there were ignorant, nagging, ungrateful children at Sutton Hoo back in the day complaining: Why are we having to do all this? Nobody wants this old, stupid armor!
The vast, vast majority of stuff doesn't survive. But some of it does, in spite of the entropy of the ages. And if you don't leave at least a little something, there won't be anything in the record. It's a collective responsibility. We're trying to have a civilization here.
The way we tell the difference between animal fossils and human burials in the distant past is by the stone tools and amulets that were buried intentionally with the deceased. I don't intend to burden my heirs, but I do intend to be a human.
posted by gimonca at 4:14 AM on October 28 [7 favorites]
The vast, vast majority of stuff doesn't survive. But some of it does, in spite of the entropy of the ages. And if you don't leave at least a little something, there won't be anything in the record. It's a collective responsibility. We're trying to have a civilization here.
The way we tell the difference between animal fossils and human burials in the distant past is by the stone tools and amulets that were buried intentionally with the deceased. I don't intend to burden my heirs, but I do intend to be a human.
posted by gimonca at 4:14 AM on October 28 [7 favorites]
Medicare effectively forces children to sell their parent's home before nursing home costs will be paid for.
That’s Medicaid, not Medicare. Medicare does not pay for long-term living in a nursing home. Short-term rehab, skilled care, and therapy, yes. Living in a nursing home, no.
posted by Thorzdad at 4:40 AM on October 28 [8 favorites]
That’s Medicaid, not Medicare. Medicare does not pay for long-term living in a nursing home. Short-term rehab, skilled care, and therapy, yes. Living in a nursing home, no.
posted by Thorzdad at 4:40 AM on October 28 [8 favorites]
We paid a charity that provides furniture/stuff to women escaping domestic violence to take my parents' stuff away after my mom died and my dad went into long term care. Small fee for the 'moving' and good vibes about it not ending up in a landfill and helping someone in need. Win-win.
posted by srboisvert at 5:28 AM on October 28 [11 favorites]
posted by srboisvert at 5:28 AM on October 28 [11 favorites]
Tolkein invented the perfect word for this stuff: "mathom", useless stuff that you weren't willing to discard. I often think of that when I consider acquiring something, will this become another mathom lurking around my house collecting dust?
I have become much less sentimental about stuff as the years have gone by. My side of the family has very little of value and almost no heirlooms due to the historical turbulence of the 20th century, fires, tornadoes, floods, moves, and poverty. When one set of my grandparents passed, I got two photos and two rings. When the other set went, my dad gave me a box containing various cheap crockery and whatnot from my grandmothers house. It sat in the basement for a couple months, then was donated to a thrift store. My parents have a big, old farmhouse filled to the rafters with stuff, but there is nothing of value in any of it. The house itself is falling apart. Beyond a few family photos, may as well just seal it up and bring in the bulldozers for the whole lot when they are gone. Only the land it sits on, which is in a lovely spot, has any value.
My wife's family, on the other hand, has been in Ontario for about 200 years and has amassed two centuries worth of family stuff. Her aunt lived in the family farmhouse. She never married because she was caring for her parents and the farm, and ended up alone in that house surrounded by 200 years worth of junk. When she turned 70 ten years ago she decided she had had enough of it. She bought herself a small condo in the city and told everyone to come and take whatever they wanted because it was all going. She is much, much happier and more relaxed now. I swear she looks younger and healthier now, too. My in-laws, however, couldn't bear to see so many family treasures going into the skip, so now their houses are over stuffed with all those mathoms. My wife dislikes stuff, so only took a few pieces of crockery and an old concrete birdbath, which fell apart after a couple winters.
My wife's parents have a giant house stuffed to the gills with not only the family mathoms, but their own collections they have have amassed over the last 80 years. We have no idea what to do with it all. They insist a lot of it is highly valuable, which I'm sure it was to someone at some point, but who the hell wants a giant library of mass-produced books, a couple thousand dusty model trains, vast quantities of porcelain teacups, dusty geegaws, 50 antique bicycles, etc. etc.?
I am under no illusion about my own modest collections -- 1980's computers, board games, antique cameras and campstoves, typewriters -- but our house is so small that I only have a small and carefully curated number of each. I bought it all very cheap before people were collecting it, and some of it goes for quite a bit of money to people of my vintage, but I know damn well it will all be so much worthless scrap when my generation starts offloading their junk. My kids won't want it, and that is fine with me. It is stuff that I enjoy at this moment, and afterwards I don't care where it goes. I am not running a museum. It always astounds me when people show off their collections on the specialist websites I frequent and they have dozens of each model, basements and rooms and garages stuffed with their collections. What they hell are they even thinking? How can you enjoy that much crap without feeling overwhelmed?
posted by fimbulvetr at 6:04 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
I have become much less sentimental about stuff as the years have gone by. My side of the family has very little of value and almost no heirlooms due to the historical turbulence of the 20th century, fires, tornadoes, floods, moves, and poverty. When one set of my grandparents passed, I got two photos and two rings. When the other set went, my dad gave me a box containing various cheap crockery and whatnot from my grandmothers house. It sat in the basement for a couple months, then was donated to a thrift store. My parents have a big, old farmhouse filled to the rafters with stuff, but there is nothing of value in any of it. The house itself is falling apart. Beyond a few family photos, may as well just seal it up and bring in the bulldozers for the whole lot when they are gone. Only the land it sits on, which is in a lovely spot, has any value.
My wife's family, on the other hand, has been in Ontario for about 200 years and has amassed two centuries worth of family stuff. Her aunt lived in the family farmhouse. She never married because she was caring for her parents and the farm, and ended up alone in that house surrounded by 200 years worth of junk. When she turned 70 ten years ago she decided she had had enough of it. She bought herself a small condo in the city and told everyone to come and take whatever they wanted because it was all going. She is much, much happier and more relaxed now. I swear she looks younger and healthier now, too. My in-laws, however, couldn't bear to see so many family treasures going into the skip, so now their houses are over stuffed with all those mathoms. My wife dislikes stuff, so only took a few pieces of crockery and an old concrete birdbath, which fell apart after a couple winters.
My wife's parents have a giant house stuffed to the gills with not only the family mathoms, but their own collections they have have amassed over the last 80 years. We have no idea what to do with it all. They insist a lot of it is highly valuable, which I'm sure it was to someone at some point, but who the hell wants a giant library of mass-produced books, a couple thousand dusty model trains, vast quantities of porcelain teacups, dusty geegaws, 50 antique bicycles, etc. etc.?
I am under no illusion about my own modest collections -- 1980's computers, board games, antique cameras and campstoves, typewriters -- but our house is so small that I only have a small and carefully curated number of each. I bought it all very cheap before people were collecting it, and some of it goes for quite a bit of money to people of my vintage, but I know damn well it will all be so much worthless scrap when my generation starts offloading their junk. My kids won't want it, and that is fine with me. It is stuff that I enjoy at this moment, and afterwards I don't care where it goes. I am not running a museum. It always astounds me when people show off their collections on the specialist websites I frequent and they have dozens of each model, basements and rooms and garages stuffed with their collections. What they hell are they even thinking? How can you enjoy that much crap without feeling overwhelmed?
posted by fimbulvetr at 6:04 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
And books . . . there are too many books in the world. I love books and we have shelves of them, but very very few books have any value. We give away lots of them, and I feel no guilt about recycling the ones no one wants. We are not running an archive. I've been involved in too many rummage sales where people dumped boxes and boxes of books that had to be pulped at the end because they didn't sell and there is nowhere to store them. I almost exclusively read ebooks now, unless the only way I can get the book is hard copy. When my office moved we had to figure out what to do with 70 years worth of scientific books that we no longer had room for. Probably 99% of them hadn't been opened in the 20 years I've been here. None of it was unique, most of it was obsolete, and all of that information is now easily accessible online. I suggested that we tell everyone to take home anything they wanted, then recycle the rest. People were at first horrified by the idea, but in the end that is what happened. Maybe 5% of the library was taken home, the rest went into the recycling bin.
posted by fimbulvetr at 6:09 AM on October 28 [5 favorites]
posted by fimbulvetr at 6:09 AM on October 28 [5 favorites]
Every museum I've been to with artifacts from the Roman era seems to be chock-a-block with little household gods, lares and penates. No proper household was without one, or several. They were the Hummel figurines of their day, I'm sure.
posted by gimonca at 6:23 AM on October 28 [4 favorites]
posted by gimonca at 6:23 AM on October 28 [4 favorites]
My parents (born in the 1930s) were not hoarders by any means; they had perfectly normal amounts of stuff. Cleaning out the house was still a nightmare for me and my sisters (my brother refused to help). So I really feel for those of you telling the true hoarder horror stories.
I was in an antique mall in Florida (my people come from there), and I found some old records with my cousin's name in them. I had trouble sorting out my feelings about that.
I have been trying to de-stuffify ever since those two incidents (I am 60 with no children if you want to classify me). Some of the problems -- gifts people have given me that I don't want but feel bad about getting rid of because they'd probably notice. Also books -- that's all on me, I love books, I have a house with a lot of built-in bookshelves, and I really have a hard time keeping the book numbers down. I have a small typewriter collection but am slowly giving those away, if you live anywhere near me and want one send me an email. And I have a piano, which everybody seems to think is a thing nobody will ever want. That's probably the only item where I have the How Could You Not Want This Wonderful Thing attitude, because, it's music, music is wonderful. So if you live near me and want a piano . . . .
Obligatory: MetaFilter: It’s trash. It’s literal trash.
posted by JanetLand at 6:28 AM on October 28 [8 favorites]
I was in an antique mall in Florida (my people come from there), and I found some old records with my cousin's name in them. I had trouble sorting out my feelings about that.
I have been trying to de-stuffify ever since those two incidents (I am 60 with no children if you want to classify me). Some of the problems -- gifts people have given me that I don't want but feel bad about getting rid of because they'd probably notice. Also books -- that's all on me, I love books, I have a house with a lot of built-in bookshelves, and I really have a hard time keeping the book numbers down. I have a small typewriter collection but am slowly giving those away, if you live anywhere near me and want one send me an email. And I have a piano, which everybody seems to think is a thing nobody will ever want. That's probably the only item where I have the How Could You Not Want This Wonderful Thing attitude, because, it's music, music is wonderful. So if you live near me and want a piano . . . .
Obligatory: MetaFilter: It’s trash. It’s literal trash.
posted by JanetLand at 6:28 AM on October 28 [8 favorites]
Every museum I've been to with artifacts from the Roman era seems to be chock-a-block with little household gods, lares and penates. No proper household was without one, or several. They were the Hummel figurines of their day, I'm sure.
It's interesting to think about. The world population was somewhere between 150 to 300 million (estimated, although I am guessing there's an undercount of Indigenous populations in that estimate) around 1 AD which is less than the current US.
I don't think future civilizations, human or otherwise, will have trouble finding our landfill items, sadly.
posted by warriorqueen at 6:48 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
It's interesting to think about. The world population was somewhere between 150 to 300 million (estimated, although I am guessing there's an undercount of Indigenous populations in that estimate) around 1 AD which is less than the current US.
I don't think future civilizations, human or otherwise, will have trouble finding our landfill items, sadly.
posted by warriorqueen at 6:48 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
The way we tell the difference between animal fossils and human burials in the distant past is by the stone tools and amulets that were buried intentionally with the deceased. I don't intend to burden my heirs, but I do intend to be a human.
Consider, though, that archeologists have also studied "trash middens" with similar results. So archeologists of the future will likely be finding evidence of our humanity in trash dumps as well as on our remains.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:59 AM on October 28 [6 favorites]
Consider, though, that archeologists have also studied "trash middens" with similar results. So archeologists of the future will likely be finding evidence of our humanity in trash dumps as well as on our remains.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 6:59 AM on October 28 [6 favorites]
This is rather timely as my wife and I recently visited both sets of parents for the first time in just over a year (we do not live in the US, visiting is not cheap or easy) and it became painfully obvious that this barreling down on us soon, much quicker than we anticipated.
My MIL is developing dementia and really should be in assisted living, and might eventually need memory care. So gotta find her a new place to live, figuring out how the hell it'll get paid for because she has almost zero assets outside the house, hoping she can keep her pets because it'll get REAL bad for her mental health if she can't have her critters, and try to convince her to do all this in the first place because she refuses to even consider it. Cleaning out her very hoarded place is not even on the radar for us right now. Only upshot is that her place isn't huge (3br duplex) but yeah not looking forward to it.
I am somewhat fortunate that my mother at least (who is a bit of a clean freak and definitely not a hoarder) is cognizant that they will need to downsize eventually and is trying to work towards cleaning stuff out. Even with that, they still have a giant 3000 SQ ft house with 40 yrs of accumulated stuff - I wouldn't even know where to start. Hoping to work with them to at least clean it out a bit over the next year or so to make things easier.
As for my wife and I, this is one case where I'm kind of glad we have moved around a ton over the last 10-15 years. The constant churn has forced us to purge and re-think what we have every few years and definitely discourages accumulation. I have maybe two bags of rather expensive photography gear (wouldn't be photo guy without it), a few boxes worth of momentos from travels and that's about it. My wife collects pottery, but otherwise is pretty reasonable - and even the pottery is down to a few boxes' worth. It feels like a lot but compared to most people we know we are practically minimalists.
posted by photo guy at 7:09 AM on October 28 [1 favorite]
My MIL is developing dementia and really should be in assisted living, and might eventually need memory care. So gotta find her a new place to live, figuring out how the hell it'll get paid for because she has almost zero assets outside the house, hoping she can keep her pets because it'll get REAL bad for her mental health if she can't have her critters, and try to convince her to do all this in the first place because she refuses to even consider it. Cleaning out her very hoarded place is not even on the radar for us right now. Only upshot is that her place isn't huge (3br duplex) but yeah not looking forward to it.
I am somewhat fortunate that my mother at least (who is a bit of a clean freak and definitely not a hoarder) is cognizant that they will need to downsize eventually and is trying to work towards cleaning stuff out. Even with that, they still have a giant 3000 SQ ft house with 40 yrs of accumulated stuff - I wouldn't even know where to start. Hoping to work with them to at least clean it out a bit over the next year or so to make things easier.
As for my wife and I, this is one case where I'm kind of glad we have moved around a ton over the last 10-15 years. The constant churn has forced us to purge and re-think what we have every few years and definitely discourages accumulation. I have maybe two bags of rather expensive photography gear (wouldn't be photo guy without it), a few boxes worth of momentos from travels and that's about it. My wife collects pottery, but otherwise is pretty reasonable - and even the pottery is down to a few boxes' worth. It feels like a lot but compared to most people we know we are practically minimalists.
posted by photo guy at 7:09 AM on October 28 [1 favorite]
So much familiar here ... Hummel figurines (and train sets) were a big grudge match in my Boomer parents' generation. They're gone by now, thank god. My own parents moved across the country after retiring and that came with a lot of downsizing, thank goodness.
China: it makes me sad that my parents have had, and displayed in a cabinet, a beautiful set of high-end wedding china (Waterford I think) that was only ever used at holidays, and now never. I would love to use that china for our daily dishes, just to look at it every day. I wish my parents would use it, but they stick to the Corelle. The idea of things that are kept stored away because they're theoretically valuable is just deeply sad to me. That's what index funds are for.
I remember that both of my grandparents had china of their own, but I don't know or remember what happened to it amid the house cleanings-out during nursing home moves.
A relative did collect two sets of things that ended up in the Smithsonian after his death, so there's that.
posted by Dashy at 7:13 AM on October 28 [4 favorites]
China: it makes me sad that my parents have had, and displayed in a cabinet, a beautiful set of high-end wedding china (Waterford I think) that was only ever used at holidays, and now never. I would love to use that china for our daily dishes, just to look at it every day. I wish my parents would use it, but they stick to the Corelle. The idea of things that are kept stored away because they're theoretically valuable is just deeply sad to me. That's what index funds are for.
I remember that both of my grandparents had china of their own, but I don't know or remember what happened to it amid the house cleanings-out during nursing home moves.
A relative did collect two sets of things that ended up in the Smithsonian after his death, so there's that.
posted by Dashy at 7:13 AM on October 28 [4 favorites]
The idea of things that are kept stored away because they're theoretically valuable is just deeply sad to me.
I am cheap, so I rarely buy new, still in shrink wrap, or never used items to add to my collections, but on the rare occasions that I have, the first thing I do is open it up and use it. I would probably horrify hard-core collectors and I'm sure my habits destroy the "value", but I don't care. It is just stuff, it is mine, and I will use it in the manner that gives me the most enjoyment. I won't get any enjoyment with a weird dragon's hoard of unopened packages to gaze at.
posted by fimbulvetr at 7:36 AM on October 28 [5 favorites]
I am cheap, so I rarely buy new, still in shrink wrap, or never used items to add to my collections, but on the rare occasions that I have, the first thing I do is open it up and use it. I would probably horrify hard-core collectors and I'm sure my habits destroy the "value", but I don't care. It is just stuff, it is mine, and I will use it in the manner that gives me the most enjoyment. I won't get any enjoyment with a weird dragon's hoard of unopened packages to gaze at.
posted by fimbulvetr at 7:36 AM on October 28 [5 favorites]
I think nearly everyone has a hoarding tendency. My boomer parents aren't too bad, but that's mainly because they have moved often enough that they have experience getting rid of stuff. Even then, if they stay in one place 5+ years, stuff really accumulates.
I will say -- the stuff I keep in my immediate surroundings tends to be used heavily, to the point where I don't feel bad about tossing and replacing it as necessary. Out-of-the-way closets and attic space is where my really pointless stuff accumulates. Usually it is stuff I think I'll need or want, and in that sense putting it out of the way for a few years brings clarity. When I see it again, I either think "I forgot I had that!" with great delight (5% of the time), "oh thank God, I'll need to keep that" (10% of the time), or "why is that still here?!" (85% of the time). The trick is that it's very hard to categorize these goods without the couple years of exile. But here is where I am not a natural hoarder: when I know I don't want something anymore, I get the most incredible high letting it go. I wonder if that's the secret sauce behind the death cleaning. It is very liberating!
posted by grandiloquiet at 7:49 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
I will say -- the stuff I keep in my immediate surroundings tends to be used heavily, to the point where I don't feel bad about tossing and replacing it as necessary. Out-of-the-way closets and attic space is where my really pointless stuff accumulates. Usually it is stuff I think I'll need or want, and in that sense putting it out of the way for a few years brings clarity. When I see it again, I either think "I forgot I had that!" with great delight (5% of the time), "oh thank God, I'll need to keep that" (10% of the time), or "why is that still here?!" (85% of the time). The trick is that it's very hard to categorize these goods without the couple years of exile. But here is where I am not a natural hoarder: when I know I don't want something anymore, I get the most incredible high letting it go. I wonder if that's the secret sauce behind the death cleaning. It is very liberating!
posted by grandiloquiet at 7:49 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
A daughter's journey through her late father's record collection
posted by box at 8:52 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
posted by box at 8:52 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
Based solely on my own limited experience, we Boomers were the first generation to be (relatively) solvent while at the same time being subjected to an increasingly intense barrage of exhortations to buy increasingly available stuff. The generation before me hoarded things of value that they couldn’t afford during the Depression They passed on the idea to us that we should be accumulating too. Our parents had survived a war as well, and were offered a possible future in which we could actually have adult lives. We Boomers got television advertisements starting in the late 50s, and Green Stamps and “free with purchase,” and I remember my mother assembling a set of everyday china with offers from the grocery store. The later generations after us began the process of accumulating intangible junk and now a lot of the accumulation is of streaming services, subscriptions, and fees-for-existing like health insurance, mortgages, and AppleCare. And lots and lots of cheap crud made available through supply chain tricks and the labor of poor people. All these hoarders have been told all their lives that he who dies with the most toys wins, and now that agreement is coming due but we aren’t winning. We are just dying.
Capitalism is a wonderful thing and it is based on eternal growth of the market.
posted by Peach at 8:58 AM on October 28 [7 favorites]
Capitalism is a wonderful thing and it is based on eternal growth of the market.
posted by Peach at 8:58 AM on October 28 [7 favorites]
When my father-in-law went into assisted living he didn't immediately sell his house. Of course, he was secretly in the process of selling it but told no one. One week before closing he finally told his kids that they had to clean the house out because it was being sold. Cleaning it out was not fun, especially given the amount of things still in it and the various "home repairs" he had done (e.g. directly connect the washing machine to the water lines without a shutoff). Some of the contents went to charity, some was taken by family, and the rest was thrown out.
Most of what we own is worthless to anyone but us.
posted by tommasz at 8:59 AM on October 28 [1 favorite]
Most of what we own is worthless to anyone but us.
posted by tommasz at 8:59 AM on October 28 [1 favorite]
Thinking about this, I'm going to identify some little things and label them, with a view to leaving my niece no more than, eg, a small storage tub of the most interesting stuff - obviously she can have more things if she wants them, but there are some legit neat things like the dala pigs and my artist aunt's near-antique (if I don't drop over prematurely it will be antique by the time my niece gets it) posable wood artist's mannequin, which is nicer than the ones made today. Since I'll be dead, there's nothing to keep her from throwing the lot in the trash, but my hope is that she'd at least be interested in them enough to keep a few, or else give them to friends. I've given some family stuff to friends (good stuff!) and will probably give away more. I think I'm also going to label the art - none of it is valuable-valuable but there are a couple of mid-century Chicago area artists and some other antique stuff, and even if it doesn't stay in the family, I think it would be neat if the purchaser knew where it came from.
The sad thing is that almost everyone in the older generations had died by the time my niece was born so they never knew her - and despite being totally not genetically related to me, she would have fit into our family so well. Everyone would have adored her, and not just because they would love any niece. I'd like her to have a few family things for this reason in particular, even though it doesn't make a lot of sense. I wouldn't want to lumber her up with a moving van of stuff, but it would be nice if she could have a few things of my great aunt's in particular, since my aunt was a professional artist and my niece, though too young to really have sorted out professional ambitions, loves drawing and assemblage art. No one in my immediate generation has kids in my birth family - we never really wanted them - but I'm not sad that someone in our extended family who is similar to us will be carrying on.
posted by Frowner at 9:05 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
The sad thing is that almost everyone in the older generations had died by the time my niece was born so they never knew her - and despite being totally not genetically related to me, she would have fit into our family so well. Everyone would have adored her, and not just because they would love any niece. I'd like her to have a few family things for this reason in particular, even though it doesn't make a lot of sense. I wouldn't want to lumber her up with a moving van of stuff, but it would be nice if she could have a few things of my great aunt's in particular, since my aunt was a professional artist and my niece, though too young to really have sorted out professional ambitions, loves drawing and assemblage art. No one in my immediate generation has kids in my birth family - we never really wanted them - but I'm not sad that someone in our extended family who is similar to us will be carrying on.
posted by Frowner at 9:05 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
About ten years ago - every so often, when I was home visiting my parents, my mother would drag me into her room to show me where she was hiding one or another very specific piece of jewelry, so I would be able to differentiate it from other jewelry, so that I would know it was valuable and could handle it accordingly when she passed. It always seemed to be different each time, and I cannot for the life of me remember any distinguishing characteristics about the jewelry pieces, and I asked her to write this information down for me instead at some point; I suspect she hasn't, and we're going to have to bring the lot to some expert to go through.
Making a bid - if something is valuable, write that information down for your kids instead of telling them.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:10 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
Making a bid - if something is valuable, write that information down for your kids instead of telling them.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:10 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
>I remember my mother assembling a set of everyday china with offers from the grocery store.
Earlier this month I wheeled out to the curb a full set of mid-70s Funk & Wagnalls acquired (volume by volume) from the grocery store . . . The box'd been sitting in the garage for 45 years.
posted by torokunai at 9:10 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
Earlier this month I wheeled out to the curb a full set of mid-70s Funk & Wagnalls acquired (volume by volume) from the grocery store . . . The box'd been sitting in the garage for 45 years.
posted by torokunai at 9:10 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
I'm going to identify some little things and label them, with a view to leaving my niece no more than, eg, a small storage tub of the most interesting stuff
This is my plan, almost word for word.
posted by gimonca at 9:15 AM on October 28 [1 favorite]
This is my plan, almost word for word.
posted by gimonca at 9:15 AM on October 28 [1 favorite]
I would love to use that china for our daily dishes, just to look at it every day.
I think the thing that amuses me most about the china my mom sent me is that the soup bowls are the PERFECT size for tossing homemade bagels in toppings before baking them, resulting in a nice coating around the edge and not just on the top and bottom. I bake bagels more often than we have "nice" dinners with the china, so the top couple bowls in that stack get used regularly, and the rest of the china just sits there looking nice.
Every now and then I think we should use it more often. The manufacturer (Wedgwood) says it's dishwasher safe, but it's gold trimmed and I'm paranoid about the abrasives in our detergent eroding the trim even though the actual china part is certainly hardy enough to stand up to daily use. TBH it's probably hardier than our daily porcelain, but it's difficult to change the habit.
1980's computers, board games, antique cameras
Earlier this year we helped my mother-in-law clear out of her house and move into an apartment. My late father-in-law had worked for IBM, and the joke is that it stands for "I've Been Moved." The regular relocations meant they had accumulated very little crap before they retired to Arizona, but they still had a bunch of vinyl records (almost all terrible), decades worth of Christmas decorations she insisted on keeping, and a collection of nutcrackers she displays year round. But as we made a last walk through of the house, I noticed a Brownie camera left on a shelf. "Oooh, is that a Brownie?" "You want it?" "No, I don't have anywhere to put it. I've just never realized it was there." I left it on the shelf for the realtor and her staging crew to deal with.
And I have a piano, which everybody seems to think is a thing nobody will ever want.
When I moved to DC my mom was so excited to be rid of the family piano that she paid for piano movers to put it on my rental truck and for different movers to unload it from the truck on this end. When I moved into a new apartment a year later, she paid for the piano movers that time, too. When I moved out of the second place a decade later, the guy who signed the lease after me was so excited about the piano when he toured the apartment that I just gave it to him. At least that way I didn't have to pay to have it hauled away.
Then that guy backed out of the lease after dithering for a month or so, and my old landlord tried to come after me to get rid of the piano. I said, "it's his now, go after him." "I tried. He said he still wants it, but he doesn't have space for it." "Sorry, that's not my problem. You were there when I gave it to him and he agreed to take it."
posted by fedward at 9:17 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
I think the thing that amuses me most about the china my mom sent me is that the soup bowls are the PERFECT size for tossing homemade bagels in toppings before baking them, resulting in a nice coating around the edge and not just on the top and bottom. I bake bagels more often than we have "nice" dinners with the china, so the top couple bowls in that stack get used regularly, and the rest of the china just sits there looking nice.
Every now and then I think we should use it more often. The manufacturer (Wedgwood) says it's dishwasher safe, but it's gold trimmed and I'm paranoid about the abrasives in our detergent eroding the trim even though the actual china part is certainly hardy enough to stand up to daily use. TBH it's probably hardier than our daily porcelain, but it's difficult to change the habit.
1980's computers, board games, antique cameras
Earlier this year we helped my mother-in-law clear out of her house and move into an apartment. My late father-in-law had worked for IBM, and the joke is that it stands for "I've Been Moved." The regular relocations meant they had accumulated very little crap before they retired to Arizona, but they still had a bunch of vinyl records (almost all terrible), decades worth of Christmas decorations she insisted on keeping, and a collection of nutcrackers she displays year round. But as we made a last walk through of the house, I noticed a Brownie camera left on a shelf. "Oooh, is that a Brownie?" "You want it?" "No, I don't have anywhere to put it. I've just never realized it was there." I left it on the shelf for the realtor and her staging crew to deal with.
And I have a piano, which everybody seems to think is a thing nobody will ever want.
When I moved to DC my mom was so excited to be rid of the family piano that she paid for piano movers to put it on my rental truck and for different movers to unload it from the truck on this end. When I moved into a new apartment a year later, she paid for the piano movers that time, too. When I moved out of the second place a decade later, the guy who signed the lease after me was so excited about the piano when he toured the apartment that I just gave it to him. At least that way I didn't have to pay to have it hauled away.
Then that guy backed out of the lease after dithering for a month or so, and my old landlord tried to come after me to get rid of the piano. I said, "it's his now, go after him." "I tried. He said he still wants it, but he doesn't have space for it." "Sorry, that's not my problem. You were there when I gave it to him and he agreed to take it."
posted by fedward at 9:17 AM on October 28 [3 favorites]
It always seemed to be different each time, and I cannot for the life of me remember any distinguishing characteristics about the jewelry pieces, and I asked her to write this information down for me instead at some point; I suspect she hasn't, and we're going to have to bring the lot to some expert to go through.
My maternal grandmother, one of the least sentimental women ever birthed I think, inherited an entire room, not a closet, full of my great-grandmother's largely costume jewelry, which probably had a few good pieces in there.
She picked out a few things "from the top" for each child/in-law and grandchild and then donated the rest without letting anyone know. When my aunt protested, she said "I've been poor and treating myself to something at a thrift shop. It would have been nice to get something good."
That's kind of where I hope to land. My parents have mostly disinherited my sister and I, bypassing us for our kids when it comes to money/houses.* We only get the stuff and the paperwork.
* Please don't do this. My youngest is 13 and my mother is 79, so kind of worried this is going to go to partying although we're doing our best to raise him right without actually letting him know this windfall may arrive just as he hits adulthood.
posted by warriorqueen at 9:30 AM on October 28 [6 favorites]
My maternal grandmother, one of the least sentimental women ever birthed I think, inherited an entire room, not a closet, full of my great-grandmother's largely costume jewelry, which probably had a few good pieces in there.
She picked out a few things "from the top" for each child/in-law and grandchild and then donated the rest without letting anyone know. When my aunt protested, she said "I've been poor and treating myself to something at a thrift shop. It would have been nice to get something good."
That's kind of where I hope to land. My parents have mostly disinherited my sister and I, bypassing us for our kids when it comes to money/houses.* We only get the stuff and the paperwork.
* Please don't do this. My youngest is 13 and my mother is 79, so kind of worried this is going to go to partying although we're doing our best to raise him right without actually letting him know this windfall may arrive just as he hits adulthood.
posted by warriorqueen at 9:30 AM on October 28 [6 favorites]
we Boomers were the first generation to be (relatively) solvent while at the same time being subjected to an increasingly intense barrage of exhortations to buy increasingly available stuff
Not the first! There’s a long generation from the consumer Industrial Revolution. All those “overstuffed Victorian interiors”? Full of “Brummagem ware” and Leavers lace and other mass copies of what had been rare? Newly available to the middle class, and then a marker of the middle class, and then an embarrassment to their grandchildren? Same thing.
posted by clew at 9:51 AM on October 28 [11 favorites]
Not the first! There’s a long generation from the consumer Industrial Revolution. All those “overstuffed Victorian interiors”? Full of “Brummagem ware” and Leavers lace and other mass copies of what had been rare? Newly available to the middle class, and then a marker of the middle class, and then an embarrassment to their grandchildren? Same thing.
posted by clew at 9:51 AM on October 28 [11 favorites]
This is slightly only slightly tangential, but since there's just so much talk specifically of 'the good china' and other dish-ware.
Test your 'good china' (and glasses! Lots of decoration on older glassware contains An Amount) for lead. It is uncomfortably common, even in 'nice' stuff that was purchased when most boomers would have been purchasing such items. The FDA only started regulating lead in dishes in the 70s, and didn't call for a complete ban until 200-fucking-5. Enforcement even since then has been pretty dang spotty.
This can be a concrete reason that can lead to a very firm "No thank you, that won't be possible" when folks are trying to give these items to you.
Oh, and don't donate those items for further purchase; contact your local authorities to dispose of them as hazardous waste.
posted by furnace.heart at 10:06 AM on October 28 [7 favorites]
Test your 'good china' (and glasses! Lots of decoration on older glassware contains An Amount) for lead. It is uncomfortably common, even in 'nice' stuff that was purchased when most boomers would have been purchasing such items. The FDA only started regulating lead in dishes in the 70s, and didn't call for a complete ban until 200-fucking-5. Enforcement even since then has been pretty dang spotty.
This can be a concrete reason that can lead to a very firm "No thank you, that won't be possible" when folks are trying to give these items to you.
Oh, and don't donate those items for further purchase; contact your local authorities to dispose of them as hazardous waste.
posted by furnace.heart at 10:06 AM on October 28 [7 favorites]
Agreed warriorqueen.
Getting giant amounts of inheritance, especially at a young age, seems to lead to bad outcomes...
I was 50 or so when my mom divested of her estate. Twice as much money as I had earned in 20 years of working my ass off for shitty employers. In an instant. Hard to deal with. Hard to go looking for a new job at that point, because what is the point? Would have gone much worse if I had been 21 at the time...
posted by Windopaene at 10:10 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
Getting giant amounts of inheritance, especially at a young age, seems to lead to bad outcomes...
I was 50 or so when my mom divested of her estate. Twice as much money as I had earned in 20 years of working my ass off for shitty employers. In an instant. Hard to deal with. Hard to go looking for a new job at that point, because what is the point? Would have gone much worse if I had been 21 at the time...
posted by Windopaene at 10:10 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
I have a bunch of childhood and college mementos that I have trouble letting go of. It occurs to me that a nice bonfire would take care of them in a respectful way, especially if other people brought their own things and we made an evening of it. But all I know is this would require some permits.
posted by Countess Elena at 11:13 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
posted by Countess Elena at 11:13 AM on October 28 [2 favorites]
My advice for people who have sentimental attachments to stuff is to photograph it and put it in a scrapbook with a blurb about why you are attached to it and then move the item on
posted by srboisvert at 11:44 AM on October 28 [5 favorites]
posted by srboisvert at 11:44 AM on October 28 [5 favorites]
> To all of you colllecting Funko Pops and leaving them in boxes on your living room shelf... you're repeating our mistakes. Cut it out
I hate those Funko Pops so much that I don't understand how the company exists. How can there be enough fans of them to cancel out my hate?
I've ended up owning several because people gave them to me. They've moved on to the next stage of their life cycle -- the thrift store -- where I hope at least they'll stop someone from buying a new one.
posted by The corpse in the library at 11:44 AM on October 28 [5 favorites]
I hate those Funko Pops so much that I don't understand how the company exists. How can there be enough fans of them to cancel out my hate?
I've ended up owning several because people gave them to me. They've moved on to the next stage of their life cycle -- the thrift store -- where I hope at least they'll stop someone from buying a new one.
posted by The corpse in the library at 11:44 AM on October 28 [5 favorites]
Growing up I thought my parents would end up hoarders like my grand parents, but thankfully these particular boomers are incapable of the level of fiscal responsibility that entails. Twenty-five years after the divorce neither owns a home, so they can't fill it with junk for me to dispose of.
For my part, I've never owned a home. My physical possessions are mostly fancy bits of cardboard, some furniture, and some electronics, half of which are waiting on me to find an economical and environmentally safe disposal path. And heck, the same is probably true for the fancy cardboard.
posted by pwnguin at 11:55 AM on October 28
For my part, I've never owned a home. My physical possessions are mostly fancy bits of cardboard, some furniture, and some electronics, half of which are waiting on me to find an economical and environmentally safe disposal path. And heck, the same is probably true for the fancy cardboard.
posted by pwnguin at 11:55 AM on October 28
Twice as much money as I had earned in 20 years of working my ass off for shitty employers. In an instant. Hard to deal with. Hard to go looking for a new job at that point, because what is the point?
5 million is a nightmare; it'll drive you poco loco my friend.
posted by pwnguin at 11:58 AM on October 28 [4 favorites]
5 million is a nightmare; it'll drive you poco loco my friend.
posted by pwnguin at 11:58 AM on October 28 [4 favorites]
When cleaning out a storage unit recently, I used an app to scan all the book barcodes and identify all the LPs and put them in a spreadsheet before I gave them away. Then I can look back someday and either say "wasn't it cool to own this?" or else I could amuse myself trying to buy it all back. Win-win.
posted by credulous at 11:59 AM on October 28
posted by credulous at 11:59 AM on October 28
If ever there was a thread guaranteed to speak to the median Mefite...
Gen X gets forgotten again, though. "Millennials are about to be crushed." Just confining this to the US, where life expectancy is currently 77.5 years and does align now with the first Boomers: the first Boomers will have had their kids, on the whole, well before the first Millennials were born in 1981. The average age of first-time mothers in 1981 was 25.7, so that's a decade's worth of Boomer mothers whose kids weren't Millennials. The ones going through all of this over the next ten years will be largely Gen Xers. At least they mention us in the page title.
It's certainly the case in my home country of Australia, where life expectancy is currently 83.5 years, a full six years higher than in the US. My Dad turns 84 in a couple of months and Mum turned 83 a few months ago—they were war babies, not Boomers, with two Gen X sons. One of whom—me—lives on the other side of the world, and the other on the other side of the country.
This has loomed large in my thoughts and life for a long time. I helped my parents move out of the big house I grew up in twenty years ago, and they got rid of a lot of stuff then, but of course the stuff that remained was the most meaningful to them (and a good amount of it is to me and my brother). A decade ago we almost lost them to a car accident, and since that scare they've been whittling down further. But there will still be a lot to deal with after they're gone, and every day that day gets closer.
Meanwhile, I've been going through a messy separation and having to deal not only with my own stuff but some of my ex's (at a certain point she washed her hands of what she hadn't taken already), and with our joint stuff that she hasn't wanted to deal with; instead, I get to pay her over the odds for her half of it in settlement just so I can deal with it myself with a clear conscience.
I don't really have time to do any of it; I'm still ten years from our statutory retirement age and need to keep working to see the kids through university and into young adulthood. And that's just our stuff, and we haven't even had a garage or a shed to fill up.
Some of Mum and Dad's stuff would be helpful, no doubt, in setting young adults up for life on their own, if only my kids weren't on the wrong side of the world—their cousin might do a bit better, but it all depends on the timing. My partner and I scored some useful items from my grandma's estate in the 1990s, and the timing was good for us then. It was still just a carload of smallish items: some linen, some of Grandpa's tools and Grandma's old standing lamp. I can't see it working out so well this time round—my youngest will still be in high school, and on the wrong side of the world.
At some point I'm going to have to take a few months of leave without pay just to deal with it all.
This is going to be such a heartache for families all over the West, with our falling birthrates, populations set to peak in coming decades, and having lived through post-war prosperity and peak consumerism. So much is going to go to waste. Like all of the ancient leftovers filling the shelves of our elders' huge freezers.
posted by rory at 12:01 PM on October 28 [5 favorites]
Gen X gets forgotten again, though. "Millennials are about to be crushed." Just confining this to the US, where life expectancy is currently 77.5 years and does align now with the first Boomers: the first Boomers will have had their kids, on the whole, well before the first Millennials were born in 1981. The average age of first-time mothers in 1981 was 25.7, so that's a decade's worth of Boomer mothers whose kids weren't Millennials. The ones going through all of this over the next ten years will be largely Gen Xers. At least they mention us in the page title.
It's certainly the case in my home country of Australia, where life expectancy is currently 83.5 years, a full six years higher than in the US. My Dad turns 84 in a couple of months and Mum turned 83 a few months ago—they were war babies, not Boomers, with two Gen X sons. One of whom—me—lives on the other side of the world, and the other on the other side of the country.
This has loomed large in my thoughts and life for a long time. I helped my parents move out of the big house I grew up in twenty years ago, and they got rid of a lot of stuff then, but of course the stuff that remained was the most meaningful to them (and a good amount of it is to me and my brother). A decade ago we almost lost them to a car accident, and since that scare they've been whittling down further. But there will still be a lot to deal with after they're gone, and every day that day gets closer.
Meanwhile, I've been going through a messy separation and having to deal not only with my own stuff but some of my ex's (at a certain point she washed her hands of what she hadn't taken already), and with our joint stuff that she hasn't wanted to deal with; instead, I get to pay her over the odds for her half of it in settlement just so I can deal with it myself with a clear conscience.
I don't really have time to do any of it; I'm still ten years from our statutory retirement age and need to keep working to see the kids through university and into young adulthood. And that's just our stuff, and we haven't even had a garage or a shed to fill up.
Some of Mum and Dad's stuff would be helpful, no doubt, in setting young adults up for life on their own, if only my kids weren't on the wrong side of the world—their cousin might do a bit better, but it all depends on the timing. My partner and I scored some useful items from my grandma's estate in the 1990s, and the timing was good for us then. It was still just a carload of smallish items: some linen, some of Grandpa's tools and Grandma's old standing lamp. I can't see it working out so well this time round—my youngest will still be in high school, and on the wrong side of the world.
At some point I'm going to have to take a few months of leave without pay just to deal with it all.
This is going to be such a heartache for families all over the West, with our falling birthrates, populations set to peak in coming decades, and having lived through post-war prosperity and peak consumerism. So much is going to go to waste. Like all of the ancient leftovers filling the shelves of our elders' huge freezers.
posted by rory at 12:01 PM on October 28 [5 favorites]
To all of you collecting Funko Pops and leaving them in boxes on your living room shelf... you're repeating our mistakes. Cut it out
Man, those things. My youngest is in peak Comic Con phase, so I've been to about five in the past year. Every time it feels as if hardly any stalls are selling actual comics. It's all merch: Funko Pops, manga figures, posters, T-shirts, badges, dice trays. Don't do it, guys...
I'm so glad I let my childhood collecting habits fizzle out in my 20s. Still have a multi-generational stamp collection to get rid of, though, which I haven't looked at in a decade. That's going to be hard. That, and helping the kids winnow down their old Lego.
posted by rory at 12:10 PM on October 28 [4 favorites]
Man, those things. My youngest is in peak Comic Con phase, so I've been to about five in the past year. Every time it feels as if hardly any stalls are selling actual comics. It's all merch: Funko Pops, manga figures, posters, T-shirts, badges, dice trays. Don't do it, guys...
I'm so glad I let my childhood collecting habits fizzle out in my 20s. Still have a multi-generational stamp collection to get rid of, though, which I haven't looked at in a decade. That's going to be hard. That, and helping the kids winnow down their old Lego.
posted by rory at 12:10 PM on October 28 [4 favorites]
I have some Funko Pops, but if I still have them when I die I fully expect them to go in the trash. The Strange-Possessing-Zombie-Strange and dog Zero I have for Halloween decorations are not a pair likely to appeal to anyone in my family and BBC Sherlock Mycroft + Judi Dench M I don't think anyone will even be able to identify. (I don't keep them in boxes.)
posted by praemunire at 12:39 PM on October 28
posted by praemunire at 12:39 PM on October 28
My parents have mostly disinherited my sister and I, bypassing us for our kids when it comes to money/houses.* We only get the stuff and the paperwork.
tbh if you're disinherited, fuck dealing with the stuff and the paperwork too, you know? Tell them they need to make arrangements in their will for it to be handled because you're not going to deal with it. Why should people who don't love you enough to leave you anything get to dump their unwanted junk on you?
posted by adrienneleigh at 1:30 PM on October 28 [10 favorites]
tbh if you're disinherited, fuck dealing with the stuff and the paperwork too, you know? Tell them they need to make arrangements in their will for it to be handled because you're not going to deal with it. Why should people who don't love you enough to leave you anything get to dump their unwanted junk on you?
posted by adrienneleigh at 1:30 PM on October 28 [10 favorites]
I have heard the term but I don't know what a funko pop is and no I won't google it or look if you link it.
posted by ctmf at 1:39 PM on October 28 [3 favorites]
posted by ctmf at 1:39 PM on October 28 [3 favorites]
CW: abuse
tbh if you're disinherited, fuck dealing with the stuff and the paperwork too, you know? Tell them they need to make arrangements in their will for it to be handled because you're not going to deal with it. Why should people who don't love you enough to leave you anything get to dump their unwanted junk on you?
Thanks. I agree in theory -- added bonus is the wealth that let them grow their wealth in real estate was that my grandfather contributed to the down payments and also left them a lot of money, but the price of that good relationship was for them to ignore that he was abusing my sister and I (which my father has admitted to knowing), if you need 'shitty Boomers to be mad at today.' My parents, particularly my mother who makes these decisions, have some pretty interesting issues and concepts around money and power and relationships.
(I have told this story before but when my grandfather died, my parents brought the chair + ottoman he raped me on to their house. I told them that and that I wouldn't be able to come in their house while it was there. For almost four years they kept it in their living room and we had any interactions on their porch or at restaurants. My therapist really helped me keep this boundary up. Finally they got rid of the chair, but here is the amazing part - they still have the matching ottoman. I have so many plans for that ottoman that involve sharp objects.)
Anyways - to the degree I can, I have worked through it and I don't really want the paperwork and stuff dumped on my kids and niece, so I'm going to take it as an opportunity for closure and to draw a generational line in the sand and end the "control family via inheritance and money" cycle. And probably be petty and dispose of some things in ways my mother would not appreciate, but I will. (I will be mindful of landfill and try to get useful things into people's hands to use.)
I mention all this I guess, because it was at the time they brought that chair into their house that I realized I do not have to carry the family legacy either in things or in actions. I absolutely refuse to be the dumping ground for other people's lives. Sometimes that makes me irreverent about objects, but there it is.
posted by warriorqueen at 1:43 PM on October 28 [21 favorites]
tbh if you're disinherited, fuck dealing with the stuff and the paperwork too, you know? Tell them they need to make arrangements in their will for it to be handled because you're not going to deal with it. Why should people who don't love you enough to leave you anything get to dump their unwanted junk on you?
Thanks. I agree in theory -- added bonus is the wealth that let them grow their wealth in real estate was that my grandfather contributed to the down payments and also left them a lot of money, but the price of that good relationship was for them to ignore that he was abusing my sister and I (which my father has admitted to knowing), if you need 'shitty Boomers to be mad at today.' My parents, particularly my mother who makes these decisions, have some pretty interesting issues and concepts around money and power and relationships.
(I have told this story before but when my grandfather died, my parents brought the chair + ottoman he raped me on to their house. I told them that and that I wouldn't be able to come in their house while it was there. For almost four years they kept it in their living room and we had any interactions on their porch or at restaurants. My therapist really helped me keep this boundary up. Finally they got rid of the chair, but here is the amazing part - they still have the matching ottoman. I have so many plans for that ottoman that involve sharp objects.)
Anyways - to the degree I can, I have worked through it and I don't really want the paperwork and stuff dumped on my kids and niece, so I'm going to take it as an opportunity for closure and to draw a generational line in the sand and end the "control family via inheritance and money" cycle. And probably be petty and dispose of some things in ways my mother would not appreciate, but I will. (I will be mindful of landfill and try to get useful things into people's hands to use.)
I mention all this I guess, because it was at the time they brought that chair into their house that I realized I do not have to carry the family legacy either in things or in actions. I absolutely refuse to be the dumping ground for other people's lives. Sometimes that makes me irreverent about objects, but there it is.
posted by warriorqueen at 1:43 PM on October 28 [21 favorites]
All of you thinking you can give this stuff away on craigslist are wrong. It's an expense. you will be paying someone to take it. If you can't afford that, you'll be slowly taking piles to the normal trash, and doing that for years. I guess if you have all the time in the world, to take photos and post stuff and hopefully you've got some scrap metal for the scrap metal guy, and then it's less of a chore.
None of it is worth anything other than fees to the dump.
It's kind of hilarious - they talk about a $84 trillion in wealth being handed down, but in the end, the vast majority will get nothing but another bill from their parents. They squandered their money (potentially on storing stuff) and didn't care for their home or their vehicles, their only real assets.
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:44 PM on October 28 [1 favorite]
None of it is worth anything other than fees to the dump.
It's kind of hilarious - they talk about a $84 trillion in wealth being handed down, but in the end, the vast majority will get nothing but another bill from their parents. They squandered their money (potentially on storing stuff) and didn't care for their home or their vehicles, their only real assets.
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:44 PM on October 28 [1 favorite]
(Finally they got rid of the chair, but here is the amazing part - they still have the matching ottoman. I have so many plans for that ottoman that involve sharp objects...
JFC, it's a miracle you didn't burn the entire house down, with or without them in it.)
posted by praemunire at 3:00 PM on October 28 [9 favorites]
JFC, it's a miracle you didn't burn the entire house down, with or without them in it.)
posted by praemunire at 3:00 PM on October 28 [9 favorites]
I have literally said these words: 'No, I don't want your stuff. I barely want my stuff.' In fact I think I muttered them to myself this morning.
I can’t even read this thread properly, I’m getting secondhand panic. Never have I been so displeased to learn that my stresses are so widely shared. Where do you people find the time to actually sell your excess stuff or even give it away productively?
When my mom moved to assisted living we managed to dispose of her things in a week, which were only an apartment’s worth, my parents having downsized significantly about ten years back; we sold nothing, we gave most of it away and paid like $1000 to bring the photos, tax returns, and other keepsakes home, plus the cost of a week’s leave for two adults. We got off pretty easy I think. I am tempted to hope that I predecease my in-laws, who have not reduced their footprint At All, but I know that I owe Mr. eirias big time for all the help he gave me this spring and there is no suitable payback save returning the favor some day. Let’s hope we’ve at least reduced our own pile of trash before we get there.
posted by eirias at 3:08 PM on October 28 [4 favorites]
I can’t even read this thread properly, I’m getting secondhand panic. Never have I been so displeased to learn that my stresses are so widely shared. Where do you people find the time to actually sell your excess stuff or even give it away productively?
When my mom moved to assisted living we managed to dispose of her things in a week, which were only an apartment’s worth, my parents having downsized significantly about ten years back; we sold nothing, we gave most of it away and paid like $1000 to bring the photos, tax returns, and other keepsakes home, plus the cost of a week’s leave for two adults. We got off pretty easy I think. I am tempted to hope that I predecease my in-laws, who have not reduced their footprint At All, but I know that I owe Mr. eirias big time for all the help he gave me this spring and there is no suitable payback save returning the favor some day. Let’s hope we’ve at least reduced our own pile of trash before we get there.
posted by eirias at 3:08 PM on October 28 [4 favorites]
My brother and I have been working through our father’s stuff after he passed unexpectedly in early September. There is sooooo much stuff and the really sad thing is that most of it is not even his stuff…it’s our late mother’s stuff she was given by her family…she’s been dead more than 30 years.
Then he added a bunch of his mother’s stuff when she died 20 years ago. There are 4+ sets of good china. There are countless glasses and vases and serving platters. There was sooooooo much stationary….not nice, cute stuff but dozens of notepads…including an invoice pad from the tradesman he apprenticed with in the late 1950s/early 1960s. That business has not existed in 50+ years.
This accumulation of random stuff resulted in a small apartment so full of things that it was difficult to keep tidy and clean and was not a nice place to spend time in. Which is a shame because it is a nice, light apartment.
My brother decided to take over the lease and I told him I’d gladly pay for people to take away alll the things he doesn’t want and need. He doesn’t have any money and no car so if I don’t do that he’ll be sat there in five or ten years with the same stuff he has no use for and the idea depresses me no end. Our father kept talking about getting rid off things but he never got round to it.
posted by koahiatamadl at 4:29 PM on October 28 [5 favorites]
Then he added a bunch of his mother’s stuff when she died 20 years ago. There are 4+ sets of good china. There are countless glasses and vases and serving platters. There was sooooooo much stationary….not nice, cute stuff but dozens of notepads…including an invoice pad from the tradesman he apprenticed with in the late 1950s/early 1960s. That business has not existed in 50+ years.
This accumulation of random stuff resulted in a small apartment so full of things that it was difficult to keep tidy and clean and was not a nice place to spend time in. Which is a shame because it is a nice, light apartment.
My brother decided to take over the lease and I told him I’d gladly pay for people to take away alll the things he doesn’t want and need. He doesn’t have any money and no car so if I don’t do that he’ll be sat there in five or ten years with the same stuff he has no use for and the idea depresses me no end. Our father kept talking about getting rid off things but he never got round to it.
posted by koahiatamadl at 4:29 PM on October 28 [5 favorites]
Dear AskMe,
I told my husband about this discussion and for some reason he started talking about my two enormous plastic tubs of Lego. I don't understand what the connection is. Should I be concerned about him?
posted by The corpse in the library at 4:56 PM on October 28 [17 favorites]
I told my husband about this discussion and for some reason he started talking about my two enormous plastic tubs of Lego. I don't understand what the connection is. Should I be concerned about him?
posted by The corpse in the library at 4:56 PM on October 28 [17 favorites]
Oh, my, this is soooo heart rending.
My wife and I are boomers. We live in a 900 square foot apartment with our two adult children. My wife is a Collector. Matchbox cars and HotWheels. GI Joes. 1/24 scale NASCAR. Pez. Funko Pops. Marbles, for heaven's sake. Pokemon cards. The list goes on. Obviously, we have a big storage unit.
I used to join her, to some extent, in her collecting. I have a few Star Wars and LOTR character sets in the storage unit, but years ago I decided that, as fun as this stuff it, it's useless. As far as I'm concerned 90% of the stuff in the storage unit could be hauled to the dump. I would pay to get rid of it. She is shocked and appalled when I suggest this, just to get out from under the storage unit rent. I got rid of all but my most beloved books years ago (I use an ereader now). We still have an appalling number of DVDs, but you can't see everything on streaming yet!
My mom, who was born during the Depression and came of age in the 1950s, died a couple of months ago in memory care. My dad passed away in 1997, so she'd been on her own for a long time. In 2015 she sold her house and got rid of a lot of stuff, all on her own. In 2019 she moved from an independent living apartment in to a smaller assisted living apartment at a different facility. There was still a lot of stuff to pare down. Less than a year later she moved into memory care, and basically had nothing be a few pieces of furniture, a few mementos, and her clothing. We got a small storage unit for the stuff we couldn't get rid of (there was literally no room in our unit).
As soon as her estate is out of probate, the remaining books will go to Goodwill or the library, the rocking chair to Habitat, the cookie jar I grew up with to my kitchen counter, and I'll keep the one piece of her crystal collection I've lusted after for decades (a lovely spiny little hedgehog). She had one end table my grandfather built (veneer inlay), and it will join the other three already in our apartment. My sister doesn't want anything. Then we can close off that storage unit. Especially considering when she grew up, she was very good a not leaving a lot of stuff for her kids, which I'm grateful for. I still don't know what to do with all the stuff we have to deal with.
posted by lhauser at 7:23 PM on October 28 [1 favorite]
My wife and I are boomers. We live in a 900 square foot apartment with our two adult children. My wife is a Collector. Matchbox cars and HotWheels. GI Joes. 1/24 scale NASCAR. Pez. Funko Pops. Marbles, for heaven's sake. Pokemon cards. The list goes on. Obviously, we have a big storage unit.
I used to join her, to some extent, in her collecting. I have a few Star Wars and LOTR character sets in the storage unit, but years ago I decided that, as fun as this stuff it, it's useless. As far as I'm concerned 90% of the stuff in the storage unit could be hauled to the dump. I would pay to get rid of it. She is shocked and appalled when I suggest this, just to get out from under the storage unit rent. I got rid of all but my most beloved books years ago (I use an ereader now). We still have an appalling number of DVDs, but you can't see everything on streaming yet!
My mom, who was born during the Depression and came of age in the 1950s, died a couple of months ago in memory care. My dad passed away in 1997, so she'd been on her own for a long time. In 2015 she sold her house and got rid of a lot of stuff, all on her own. In 2019 she moved from an independent living apartment in to a smaller assisted living apartment at a different facility. There was still a lot of stuff to pare down. Less than a year later she moved into memory care, and basically had nothing be a few pieces of furniture, a few mementos, and her clothing. We got a small storage unit for the stuff we couldn't get rid of (there was literally no room in our unit).
As soon as her estate is out of probate, the remaining books will go to Goodwill or the library, the rocking chair to Habitat, the cookie jar I grew up with to my kitchen counter, and I'll keep the one piece of her crystal collection I've lusted after for decades (a lovely spiny little hedgehog). She had one end table my grandfather built (veneer inlay), and it will join the other three already in our apartment. My sister doesn't want anything. Then we can close off that storage unit. Especially considering when she grew up, she was very good a not leaving a lot of stuff for her kids, which I'm grateful for. I still don't know what to do with all the stuff we have to deal with.
posted by lhauser at 7:23 PM on October 28 [1 favorite]
On my last cross-country move, I finally faced the fact that my 1500 volume book collection was a liability. I asked myself if I needed those books and what was the purpose of having them and for me, I had to admit that part of it was performative. Look at my books! I have read these books! Marvel at my sophisticated taste in books! I took a bunch to a second hand book dealer (and got more for them than I thought I would), donated several boxes, gave some to a friend and kept about thirty for myself- mostly those that I use for reference and which would be hard or costly to replace, a couple that I find myself rereading every few years, and the Proust collection I still mean to read...someday. I mean, thirty books was considered a large collection at one time! They fit in one medium sized box. Apart from that, there's a library system that fulfills all my needs for reading material and online resources for academic texts. Sometimes I miss seeing them -- all lined up on shelves, showing me what I've spent so much time on over the last twenty years, but nobody was going to have to deal with them if I died last year. You can fit all of my personal items (give my clothes back to the Goodwill they came from!) in one good-sized trunk. I am free to pick up and change locations at any time. If I die, there's no mess to clean up. It's a good feeling, really.
posted by alltomorrowsparties at 9:51 PM on October 28 [6 favorites]
posted by alltomorrowsparties at 9:51 PM on October 28 [6 favorites]
My folks have been good about whittling down and getting rid of stuff they don't need or use anymore (e.g. they sold off their golf clubs, cart, etc, when they accepted that health concerns meant their golfing days were now behind them). So I don't anticipate too much hair-pulling when it comes time to deal with their stuff. (Not that I've put that much thought into it, but some things I can probably use or keep for the memories (tools, photos, etc.), some I can either donate to the local none-too-picky thrift store or list on Nextdoor as "free stuff", etc.). My partner's mom lives in her small condo with one of her sons and his wife, so they'll probably be the ones to deal with her stuff when the time comes.
I've gotten rid some of my own stuff here and there, but I've really made a concentrated effort to go through the collections in the past year or two and ask myself if I'll ever read/watch/listen to this again. (Selling off some of the punk zines actually helped pay for some hefty dental bills). As mentioned in an earlier thread, I don't have any kids to burden with, er, pass my musicbookzine collections to, so chances are my partner will grab what she wants from my stuff before the rest is taken to the college radio station I DJ at (the records and CDs will be donated to the station library, while my fellow DJs rummage through the dupes and the books/zines). Fortunately I never invested in Funko Pops or built up a China collection, so there won't be much else to be dealt with.
posted by gtrwolf at 9:57 PM on October 28 [1 favorite]
I've gotten rid some of my own stuff here and there, but I've really made a concentrated effort to go through the collections in the past year or two and ask myself if I'll ever read/watch/listen to this again. (Selling off some of the punk zines actually helped pay for some hefty dental bills). As mentioned in an earlier thread, I don't have any kids to burden with, er, pass my musicbookzine collections to, so chances are my partner will grab what she wants from my stuff before the rest is taken to the college radio station I DJ at (the records and CDs will be donated to the station library, while my fellow DJs rummage through the dupes and the books/zines). Fortunately I never invested in Funko Pops or built up a China collection, so there won't be much else to be dealt with.
posted by gtrwolf at 9:57 PM on October 28 [1 favorite]
I watched 6 dumpsters get filled, over $150K made from the 4 auctions, then 15 "1/3 sized" dumpsters that got filled with the leftover from auction stuff/concrete blocks.
The bicycle of my mother who had opinions about that bike and where it was to go was at the bottom of the scrap metal dumpster and watched the truck dad bought from the forest department back from when they all had a unique green color get picked up and placed on the top.
This was AFTER my parents "paired down" when they moved from the childhood home.
I will always have opinions about my sister and uncle and what they tied to do. (hint - sell the property to her kids at over 10X under the value when it was sold per the will)
posted by rough ashlar at 3:17 AM on October 29 [2 favorites]
The bicycle of my mother who had opinions about that bike and where it was to go was at the bottom of the scrap metal dumpster and watched the truck dad bought from the forest department back from when they all had a unique green color get picked up and placed on the top.
This was AFTER my parents "paired down" when they moved from the childhood home.
I will always have opinions about my sister and uncle and what they tied to do. (hint - sell the property to her kids at over 10X under the value when it was sold per the will)
posted by rough ashlar at 3:17 AM on October 29 [2 favorites]
An honest question - these things being burdens makes more sense when a lot of folks are talking about selling houses, or closing out houses. It seems so much easier to not worry about this stuff or to do it at a slower timeline when you simply keep the house intact - this is how it has generally been done in my family. Can those whose families have done it differently explain why those choices were made? It seems from my perspective to make things harder and kind of force these situations and the lack of time to deal with stuff.
posted by corb at 5:35 AM on October 29 [1 favorite]
posted by corb at 5:35 AM on October 29 [1 favorite]
Corb: my family has done a mix of both, actually.
1. My parents did the bulk of the work cleaning out my grandparent's house after grandpa moved into an assisted living facility. A lot of the things in the house were things that my grandparents saved and brought with them when they moved, but some of the things had been dumped in a basement and were no longer in any good shape.
2. Grandpa had hoped (and the rest of the family let him believe) that my single and unmarried aunt was eventually going to move into the house - but she didn't because she had already found a house that she was happy in, in a community she was happy in. (My brother eventually moved into the house, but they had to do renovations to make it big enough for a growing family anyway, and they got furniture second-hand from my SIL's mother who was an interior decorator.)
3. When my parents pass, my brother and I will need to figure out what to do with their house. Neither one of us is likely to move into it because a) my brother already has his house and he's happy there, and b) I already have an apartment in New York City and I'm happy here and the idea of giving that up to move to rural Massachusetts doesn't interest me.
So to answer your question - sometimes the stuff inside the house isn't in good condition, and sometimes there's no one who wants to move into the house anyway because it's in West Left Overshoe, Kansas, and the adult kids have had to settle in North Pensahuckey, Georgia and Chicago because that's where their jobs are, and moving back to Kansas would upset things too much.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 5:50 AM on October 29 [5 favorites]
1. My parents did the bulk of the work cleaning out my grandparent's house after grandpa moved into an assisted living facility. A lot of the things in the house were things that my grandparents saved and brought with them when they moved, but some of the things had been dumped in a basement and were no longer in any good shape.
2. Grandpa had hoped (and the rest of the family let him believe) that my single and unmarried aunt was eventually going to move into the house - but she didn't because she had already found a house that she was happy in, in a community she was happy in. (My brother eventually moved into the house, but they had to do renovations to make it big enough for a growing family anyway, and they got furniture second-hand from my SIL's mother who was an interior decorator.)
3. When my parents pass, my brother and I will need to figure out what to do with their house. Neither one of us is likely to move into it because a) my brother already has his house and he's happy there, and b) I already have an apartment in New York City and I'm happy here and the idea of giving that up to move to rural Massachusetts doesn't interest me.
So to answer your question - sometimes the stuff inside the house isn't in good condition, and sometimes there's no one who wants to move into the house anyway because it's in West Left Overshoe, Kansas, and the adult kids have had to settle in North Pensahuckey, Georgia and Chicago because that's where their jobs are, and moving back to Kansas would upset things too much.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 5:50 AM on October 29 [5 favorites]
Corb: nobody wants the houses, either.
My parents moved into a retirement community ten years ago because of (1) disability (2) no friends or family closer than two states away. Being in a detached 3000sf home with stairs just wasn’t smart or useful, and moving to a continuing care community made a ton of sense. I wish they’d picked one closer to me instead of doubling the distance between us, but neither of them wanted to spend their retirement years near me. They actually did the lion’s share of the work at the time of that move and despite the strain of liquidating the apartment this year, it was so, so much less burdensome than it could have been.
It’s just like the article says — I wanted very little of their stuff. I would have wanted even less to dismantle my entire life in the service of keeping those unwanted things together.
posted by eirias at 6:21 AM on October 29 [1 favorite]
My parents moved into a retirement community ten years ago because of (1) disability (2) no friends or family closer than two states away. Being in a detached 3000sf home with stairs just wasn’t smart or useful, and moving to a continuing care community made a ton of sense. I wish they’d picked one closer to me instead of doubling the distance between us, but neither of them wanted to spend their retirement years near me. They actually did the lion’s share of the work at the time of that move and despite the strain of liquidating the apartment this year, it was so, so much less burdensome than it could have been.
It’s just like the article says — I wanted very little of their stuff. I would have wanted even less to dismantle my entire life in the service of keeping those unwanted things together.
posted by eirias at 6:21 AM on October 29 [1 favorite]
Corb, one suggestion: in a family where one child (probably the oldest, probably a woman) has to do a lot of the work of cleaning out the family house, much of the Stuff will have to be gotten rid of promptly. There's the emotional burden of paying respects to the dearly departed by being thoughtful and considering things carefully -- all while being the focus and bearer of a LOT of emotional stress.
Think of an oldest daughter who has always been a caretaker of the parents and younger siblings, who has heard all the family stories and remembers most of them firsthand, and who leads everyone through the death and grieving and cleaning. The know where these things came from and why the person valued them, and they are in the spotlight of explaining why any/all of them were important -- whether or not they personally feel the things are worth keeping.
In other words, the person with the most to do, in the least time, is expected to do it perfectly...and to haul home all the Good Stuff that no one else will take.
posted by wenestvedt at 6:28 AM on October 29 [4 favorites]
Think of an oldest daughter who has always been a caretaker of the parents and younger siblings, who has heard all the family stories and remembers most of them firsthand, and who leads everyone through the death and grieving and cleaning. The know where these things came from and why the person valued them, and they are in the spotlight of explaining why any/all of them were important -- whether or not they personally feel the things are worth keeping.
In other words, the person with the most to do, in the least time, is expected to do it perfectly...and to haul home all the Good Stuff that no one else will take.
posted by wenestvedt at 6:28 AM on October 29 [4 favorites]
It seems so much easier to not worry about this stuff or to do it at a slower timeline when you simply keep the house intact - this is how it has generally been done in my family. Can those whose families have done it differently explain why those choices were made?
I live 1200 miles from my mom's house, but at least I'm on the same continent. My sister lives in Europe. If mom dies in the house (she's 85, and it seems increasingly likely she'll die there because she refuses to do any real planning otherwise), we're both going to have to put our lives on hold for as long as it takes to get the house cleaned out and listed for sale. We're both financially stable enough that it's not like either one of us will have any urgent need to liquidate it for that reason, but neither one of us wants the property or the majority of the stuff in it. We will probably pay more to have junk hauled away than we'll make in any estate sale, but at least the house itself is paid for.
Maybe I'm wrong and when the time comes neither one of us will be in much of a hurry, but I doubt it. Right now the house and its contents just seem like a burden.
posted by fedward at 7:59 AM on October 29 [3 favorites]
I live 1200 miles from my mom's house, but at least I'm on the same continent. My sister lives in Europe. If mom dies in the house (she's 85, and it seems increasingly likely she'll die there because she refuses to do any real planning otherwise), we're both going to have to put our lives on hold for as long as it takes to get the house cleaned out and listed for sale. We're both financially stable enough that it's not like either one of us will have any urgent need to liquidate it for that reason, but neither one of us wants the property or the majority of the stuff in it. We will probably pay more to have junk hauled away than we'll make in any estate sale, but at least the house itself is paid for.
Maybe I'm wrong and when the time comes neither one of us will be in much of a hurry, but I doubt it. Right now the house and its contents just seem like a burden.
posted by fedward at 7:59 AM on October 29 [3 favorites]
I have heard the term but I don't know what a funko pop is and no I won't google it or look if you link it.
Congratulations?
posted by praemunire at 8:06 AM on October 29 [5 favorites]
Congratulations?
posted by praemunire at 8:06 AM on October 29 [5 favorites]
Pretty sure corb is familiar with systems in which the oldest daughter does massive emotional and physical family labor. From my observation, she’s correct that if the person responsible for the stuff inherits the house and lives in it after, less stress and rush (at least one person describes this above). The house is less likely to have fallen into decay; that’s part of the physical labor.
Economists talk about the ability of employees to move quickly from job to job as an accelerant of the economy as a whole. Ditto disposable income spent on consumer goods! No free lunch, though, and as is usual for freshwater economists a lot of the cost is in what gets destroyed; rust belts, collections.
posted by clew at 8:45 AM on October 29 [1 favorite]
Economists talk about the ability of employees to move quickly from job to job as an accelerant of the economy as a whole. Ditto disposable income spent on consumer goods! No free lunch, though, and as is usual for freshwater economists a lot of the cost is in what gets destroyed; rust belts, collections.
posted by clew at 8:45 AM on October 29 [1 favorite]
clew, how is it less stressful for the responsible daughter to have to completely abandon their adult life in service of preserving the trappings of someone else’s? What you suggest devalues the existence of women to a degree I find shocking and repulsive.
posted by eirias at 8:55 AM on October 29
posted by eirias at 8:55 AM on October 29
clew, how is it less stressful for the responsible daughter to have to completely abandon their adult life in service of preserving the trappings of someone else’s? What you suggest devalues the existence of women to a degree I find shocking and repulsive.
This is why we shouldn't jump to the most ungenerous reading of people's comments here.
I'm not going to put words in anyone's mouths but the way I was reading what corb and clew are saying is corb was pointing out that some families keep the house in the family, as they do in her family, so how are people who make different choices (i.e., someone in the family not staying in the inherited house) making those choices. other people chimed in with stories about not living in the inherited house. clew merely backed up what corb was saying: if the inheritor chooses to live in the inherited house, that person by definition then doesn't really have a timeline other than their own personal timeline on when the deceased's things are disposed of. in this very particular situation, no one is abandoning their adult life to take care of a dead loved one's things. they have moved into the house they inherited and can dispose of the things in it (or not! they might choose to keep it all! or some of it!) at their leisure and in a manner they have time and energy for.
posted by cooker girl at 9:06 AM on October 29 [7 favorites]
This is why we shouldn't jump to the most ungenerous reading of people's comments here.
I'm not going to put words in anyone's mouths but the way I was reading what corb and clew are saying is corb was pointing out that some families keep the house in the family, as they do in her family, so how are people who make different choices (i.e., someone in the family not staying in the inherited house) making those choices. other people chimed in with stories about not living in the inherited house. clew merely backed up what corb was saying: if the inheritor chooses to live in the inherited house, that person by definition then doesn't really have a timeline other than their own personal timeline on when the deceased's things are disposed of. in this very particular situation, no one is abandoning their adult life to take care of a dead loved one's things. they have moved into the house they inherited and can dispose of the things in it (or not! they might choose to keep it all! or some of it!) at their leisure and in a manner they have time and energy for.
posted by cooker girl at 9:06 AM on October 29 [7 favorites]
If the inheritance is split between two or more siblings, the house is getting sold unless one of them can buy the other(s) out. Two-child families were still the norm for the folks who are nearing the end today.
I like the house my parents moved to in retirement, and the kids know it as Grandma and Grandad’s place, but it’s their retirement dream home, not mine.
I may yet end up living there for a while, caring for one of them when the other’s gone and clearing it out after they both are.
posted by rory at 9:26 AM on October 29
I like the house my parents moved to in retirement, and the kids know it as Grandma and Grandad’s place, but it’s their retirement dream home, not mine.
I may yet end up living there for a while, caring for one of them when the other’s gone and clearing it out after they both are.
posted by rory at 9:26 AM on October 29
There isn't any family home for us to.move into anymore. My parents cleaned out and sold the house I grew up in 2015 when they moved in with my grandfather to care for him. And grandpa's house was sold a few years later to pay for his long term care when Mom couldn't lift him anymore.
Grandpa and Dad (who had Parkinsons) are now gone and Mom is in a one bedroom apartment, which in theory would make things easy for my brother and I at the end. Except she has it overstuffed with thrift store finds and there is more in there every time I visit. (I empathize with the teapot obsession alltomorrowsparties she says they makes her happy. Sigh). The one bedroom apartment doesn't worry me so much, but my brother has a house, and he's turning into a bit of a hoarder. He has no kids. It has dawned on me that my daughter may be stuck with his shit as well as mine and her dad's. Time to start purging.
posted by weathergal at 10:05 AM on October 29 [1 favorite]
Grandpa and Dad (who had Parkinsons) are now gone and Mom is in a one bedroom apartment, which in theory would make things easy for my brother and I at the end. Except she has it overstuffed with thrift store finds and there is more in there every time I visit. (I empathize with the teapot obsession alltomorrowsparties she says they makes her happy. Sigh). The one bedroom apartment doesn't worry me so much, but my brother has a house, and he's turning into a bit of a hoarder. He has no kids. It has dawned on me that my daughter may be stuck with his shit as well as mine and her dad's. Time to start purging.
posted by weathergal at 10:05 AM on October 29 [1 favorite]
how is it less stressful for the responsible daughter to have to completely abandon their adult life in service of preserving the trappings of someone else’s? What you suggest devalues the existence of women to a degree I find shocking and repulsive
So, I think it may be different in a family where this is kind of part of an expected and coherent collective whole? In such cases, it's less 'the responsible daughter has to completely abandon their adult life' and more 'the responsible individual has spent their adult life either expecting to inherit the home and planning their life accordingly, or choosing to do something else and let another individual become The Responsible Individual.' Like, The Responsible Individual is kind of a role, that usually, but doesn't always, fall on the eldest, and comes with both responsibilities and privileges.
So for example, rory above speaks of houses being split between siblings - this would be unusual in my family, unless it was a multi level house where multiple families could live or the siblings were young or didn't have families. Even if it happened, say from someone dying without a will, anyone pushing for a sale in such cases would be virtually ostracized from the family and completely cut off from all aid. The norm would be that one person would get the house completely, but the unspoken expectation would be that the person who gains the house is responsible for making sure everyone else is taken care of and okay - and is always able to stay in the house if they need to. It is considered more important that the house remain intact than that things be scrupulously 'fair'. But also, as I write this, it occurs to me to note that selling houses is deeply taboo at all in my family/cultural background - I'm trying to think if I even know anyone in my family, even my extended family who has sold a house. It may be different for people from different cultural backgrounds.
posted by corb at 10:35 AM on October 29 [3 favorites]
So, I think it may be different in a family where this is kind of part of an expected and coherent collective whole? In such cases, it's less 'the responsible daughter has to completely abandon their adult life' and more 'the responsible individual has spent their adult life either expecting to inherit the home and planning their life accordingly, or choosing to do something else and let another individual become The Responsible Individual.' Like, The Responsible Individual is kind of a role, that usually, but doesn't always, fall on the eldest, and comes with both responsibilities and privileges.
So for example, rory above speaks of houses being split between siblings - this would be unusual in my family, unless it was a multi level house where multiple families could live or the siblings were young or didn't have families. Even if it happened, say from someone dying without a will, anyone pushing for a sale in such cases would be virtually ostracized from the family and completely cut off from all aid. The norm would be that one person would get the house completely, but the unspoken expectation would be that the person who gains the house is responsible for making sure everyone else is taken care of and okay - and is always able to stay in the house if they need to. It is considered more important that the house remain intact than that things be scrupulously 'fair'. But also, as I write this, it occurs to me to note that selling houses is deeply taboo at all in my family/cultural background - I'm trying to think if I even know anyone in my family, even my extended family who has sold a house. It may be different for people from different cultural backgrounds.
posted by corb at 10:35 AM on October 29 [3 favorites]
I would say it's a relatively common phenomenon for one child to live with/near/care for an aging parent and for that person to "get the house" after the parent is gone, even if that means the child gets a disproportionate amount of the estate as against their other sibling(s). If nothing else, it helps compensate for the earnings lost to caregiving. The accumulated Beanie Babies therein may be more curse than blessing, though.
posted by praemunire at 11:30 AM on October 29 [4 favorites]
posted by praemunire at 11:30 AM on October 29 [4 favorites]
My mother in law has a decorators eye and her house is very classy and tasteful. It’s just not me and my husbands taste (aside from a painting and a set of art deco plates). She used to love going to estate sales and then one day she realized HER house was going to be an estate sale and stopped cold. I just felt so sad because decorating is her thing. And she’s good at it, really.
My mom has pared down to a small apartment and a couple of boxes; her will is done and she’s practically dug her own grave already; she’s just an organized person thank goodness. I know I’ll be the same.
My big complaint is the tables. Old tables are so sturdy and well constructed and yet fugly as sin. I just can’t with the ornate French style or European or whatever and I’m not mid century either those skinny legs. The environmentalist in me says reuse! They’re such good quality! And yet if I took those tables I would stare every day at this hideous table and hate everyone and everything.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 12:39 PM on October 29 [4 favorites]
My mom has pared down to a small apartment and a couple of boxes; her will is done and she’s practically dug her own grave already; she’s just an organized person thank goodness. I know I’ll be the same.
My big complaint is the tables. Old tables are so sturdy and well constructed and yet fugly as sin. I just can’t with the ornate French style or European or whatever and I’m not mid century either those skinny legs. The environmentalist in me says reuse! They’re such good quality! And yet if I took those tables I would stare every day at this hideous table and hate everyone and everything.
posted by St. Peepsburg at 12:39 PM on October 29 [4 favorites]
I'm sorry, I mis-read corb's question -- and I shouldn't have, knowing her fairly well from her years of posting here! Sorry, corb!
But it remains true that the house often has to be sold, because the estate isn't large enough for everyone else's share to offset their portion of the house's value -- so there is a countdown on selling the house. The probate process might allow some extra time for the kids to clean out the place before it has to be settled (sold, assigned, whatever), but I don't think many families find a way to keep the house.
I have to think that it would be a luxury to have that extra time -- but it would be maybe even more emotionally draining to be coming home to the empty house, going through the left-behind possessions, without the ability to ask questions about them.
(I do NOT look forward to this process...)
posted by wenestvedt at 1:59 PM on October 29 [2 favorites]
But it remains true that the house often has to be sold, because the estate isn't large enough for everyone else's share to offset their portion of the house's value -- so there is a countdown on selling the house. The probate process might allow some extra time for the kids to clean out the place before it has to be settled (sold, assigned, whatever), but I don't think many families find a way to keep the house.
I have to think that it would be a luxury to have that extra time -- but it would be maybe even more emotionally draining to be coming home to the empty house, going through the left-behind possessions, without the ability to ask questions about them.
(I do NOT look forward to this process...)
posted by wenestvedt at 1:59 PM on October 29 [2 favorites]
My mom has carefully curated a museum's worth of family heirlooms, and I have no idea what I'm going to do with them all.
But some people definitely have it worse. WaPo: He spent his life building a $1 million stereo. The real cost was unfathomable.
Since I've got a feeling lots of people have dropped their WaPo subscriptions I'll just go ahead and share some excerpts (my subscription was pre-paid through May.)
posted by OnceUponATime at 3:14 PM on October 29 [5 favorites]
But some people definitely have it worse. WaPo: He spent his life building a $1 million stereo. The real cost was unfathomable.
Since I've got a feeling lots of people have dropped their WaPo subscriptions I'll just go ahead and share some excerpts (my subscription was pre-paid through May.)
Ken Fritz was years into his quest to build the world’s greatest stereo when he realized it would take more than just gear. It would take more than the Krell amplifiers and the Ampex reel-to-reel. More than the trio of 10-foot speakers he envisioned crafting by hand. And it would take more than what would come to be the crown jewel of his entire system: the $50,000 custom record player, his “Frankentable,” nestled in a 1,500-pound base designed to thwart any needle-jarring vibrations and equipped with three different tone arms [...] No, building the world’s greatest stereo would mean transforming the very space that surrounded it — and the lives of the people who dwelt there.I've been thinking about that story a lot since I read it. What a parable. I really, really, don't want to be Fritz.
[...]
He later estimated he spent $1 million on his mission, a number that did not begin to reflect the wear and tear on the household, the hidden costs of his children’s unpaid labor.
[...]
The big blowup with [his adult son] Kurt came in 2018, about two years after Fritz had declared that, at last, the world’s greatest stereo and listening room was complete. [...] It was past 1 a.m. when Kurt, with a few drinks in him, told his father he was going to stay up later and listen to some more music. All the work he had put into building that stereo system — pouring concrete, painting the walls — now Kurt wanted to enjoy it. But Fritz hit the off switch on the Krells. And Kurt delivered the words the two of them could never come back from. “I need you to die slow, m-----f-----,” he told his father. “Die slow.” His meaning was coldly clear to both of them.
That was it. Fritz called his attorney and disinherited Kurt.
[...]
Fritz had talked frankly about his condition [ALS], the limited number of years that remained for him and his hope that the world’s greatest stereo system would live on without him.
“I’d hate like heck to see this room parted out,” he had said. “That’s just like breaking up a dream.” [...] Fritz’s stereo system may as well have been a load-bearing wall. His dream had been woven into the actual structure of his home. They were virtually inseparable. And who would want to buy a stereo that cost more than the house?
“Anybody that’s got that kind of money,” Mieckowski said, “doesn’t want to live here.”
[...]
On April 21, 2022, Fritz died. And then it fell to [his daughter] Betsy to try to fulfill her father’s last, greatest wish. [...] Late last summer, Betsy realized she had to let go. Another couple wanted to buy the house — but not the stereo. She made a deal with a local online auction site, eBid Local, to catalogue and sell her father’s life’s work. [...] The total take for the million-dollar stereo system, including the speakers, the turntable, the dozens of other components from detached cones to the reel-to-reel decks? $156,800.
posted by OnceUponATime at 3:14 PM on October 29 [5 favorites]
To OnceUponATime, I've thought about that story a lot, as well. Fritz' record collection came at a great cost, mostly to his relationship with his children but also in terms of sheer dollars and a lack of sense. And in the end? After Fritz ended up just listening to albums on a plugged-in iPad? In the end, after his death, the collection was broken up and sold off.
We are not our stuff. But Fritz sure thought he was, and look where that left him.
posted by fuzzy.little.sock at 3:32 PM on October 29 [3 favorites]
We are not our stuff. But Fritz sure thought he was, and look where that left him.
posted by fuzzy.little.sock at 3:32 PM on October 29 [3 favorites]
Boomer here. We cleaned up after two Depression kids after they died, my mom and my MiL. It was a nightmare in each case. Now I look around the house, thinking about moving in a couple years, and it puts me into a panic mode. We've been somewhat paring back, it is time to kick it up a notch.
On an even more serious note, three weeks ago we had a wildfire sweep through our immediate area. 89000 acres of farm and pasture land got swept up on this. Our family farm, which was started with my grandparents' homestead 120 years ago, got caught in the inferno. No one had lived there for decades, there was no loss of life. Still, we lost the shop, the grain elevator my dad and uncle built in the 50s, some small wooden granaries, and a small barn. The only things that survived was some machinery that sat between a couple tree rows, two metal grain bins, and a large metal Quonset that housed the most valuable machinery. We had plans (my cousins, brother, and I) to get the entire farmstead ready for an eventual sale. Now we just have an enormous pile of twisted metal siding, burnt timbers, and tons of scrap metal.
Because we are in such a rural location, resources for cleanup are limited. One of the family, sitting 600 miles away, thinks a thorough cleanup should be easy to organize. They are dead wrong. No one is interested in the scrap. We're just shelving it all until next spring and hope we can get a heavy equipment operator to push this wreckage into a few piles. There's enough scrap to fill several skid dumpsters, what with a plethora of old vehicles and combines from the 40s through the 70s that the family parked north of the farm. I walk the farmyard, think of what that farm had been, and it's not the ashes that choke me up.
posted by Ber at 8:45 PM on October 29 [9 favorites]
On an even more serious note, three weeks ago we had a wildfire sweep through our immediate area. 89000 acres of farm and pasture land got swept up on this. Our family farm, which was started with my grandparents' homestead 120 years ago, got caught in the inferno. No one had lived there for decades, there was no loss of life. Still, we lost the shop, the grain elevator my dad and uncle built in the 50s, some small wooden granaries, and a small barn. The only things that survived was some machinery that sat between a couple tree rows, two metal grain bins, and a large metal Quonset that housed the most valuable machinery. We had plans (my cousins, brother, and I) to get the entire farmstead ready for an eventual sale. Now we just have an enormous pile of twisted metal siding, burnt timbers, and tons of scrap metal.
Because we are in such a rural location, resources for cleanup are limited. One of the family, sitting 600 miles away, thinks a thorough cleanup should be easy to organize. They are dead wrong. No one is interested in the scrap. We're just shelving it all until next spring and hope we can get a heavy equipment operator to push this wreckage into a few piles. There's enough scrap to fill several skid dumpsters, what with a plethora of old vehicles and combines from the 40s through the 70s that the family parked north of the farm. I walk the farmyard, think of what that farm had been, and it's not the ashes that choke me up.
posted by Ber at 8:45 PM on October 29 [9 favorites]
In terms of the house being split, I was thinking of it in terms of an asset rather than as a place the siblings would both or all move into together. Their parents die, having left everything to the kids equally, or die intestate and that's the default result, and a 1/n share is large enough for the kids to want or need quickly in order to resolve their own financial issues and too large for them to buy each other out. But some families will have different arrangements.
In the UK an added complication is that house prices have grown enough that it's pushed many people into inheritance tax territory, which can force a sale by itself. The tax-free threshold is £325,000 and you pay 40% on anything above that. The average house price in the UK is just shy of £300K, but in London it's almost £800K for a semi-detached or terraced property. If you inherit that as a sole heir you'll have to come up with almost £200K to keep it. Even if there are two of you, you're looking at having to find £30K each. There's a budget today, and the word is that inheritance tax is going to be increased.
That's why so many stately homes have ended up with the National Trust or have gradually had their paintings sold off. But the elderly middle and working classes don't have old masters hanging on the walls, they've got cabinets full of Royal Doulton, at best.
posted by rory at 1:00 AM on October 30 [2 favorites]
In the UK an added complication is that house prices have grown enough that it's pushed many people into inheritance tax territory, which can force a sale by itself. The tax-free threshold is £325,000 and you pay 40% on anything above that. The average house price in the UK is just shy of £300K, but in London it's almost £800K for a semi-detached or terraced property. If you inherit that as a sole heir you'll have to come up with almost £200K to keep it. Even if there are two of you, you're looking at having to find £30K each. There's a budget today, and the word is that inheritance tax is going to be increased.
That's why so many stately homes have ended up with the National Trust or have gradually had their paintings sold off. But the elderly middle and working classes don't have old masters hanging on the walls, they've got cabinets full of Royal Doulton, at best.
posted by rory at 1:00 AM on October 30 [2 favorites]
Just pausing on that for a moment... Britain's elderly voted in the Tories for three terms, bringing us austerity and Brexit, so the UK economy is fucked. The elderly have invested all of their retained wealth in property and in piles of crap that will mostly end up in a skip. Governments haven't built enough new homes over the years, and many older people became buy-to-let landlords to invest all of the extra wealth they retained by not sharing it with younger workers, meaning that property prices are dizzyingly high. Now the new Labour government has to find billions of pounds of extra revenue to keep funding the NHS (which disproportionately treats the elderly), and working people will end up paying higher taxes, including inheritance tax. They're less able than their parents were to buy their own homes today, and they'll have to sell their parents' homes when they die just to cover inheritance tax. The piles of crap will cost them money to get rid of, not be worth anything in its own right.
People love their kids, on average, on the whole. How did generations of voters fuck things up for their own kids so comprehensively?
posted by rory at 1:13 AM on October 30 [5 favorites]
People love their kids, on average, on the whole. How did generations of voters fuck things up for their own kids so comprehensively?
posted by rory at 1:13 AM on October 30 [5 favorites]
I suppose those people whose parents did become buy-to-let landlords will at least have a second home they can sell to cover the inheritance tax. But inevitably that will only be a minority of families, with some doing okay and the rest not.
posted by rory at 1:17 AM on October 30 [1 favorite]
posted by rory at 1:17 AM on October 30 [1 favorite]
Britain's elderly voted in the Tories for three terms
(Four terms! I do include the coalition. Though it was the equivalent of three full terms in duration, thanks to two early elections.)
posted by rory at 1:30 AM on October 30 [1 favorite]
(Four terms! I do include the coalition. Though it was the equivalent of three full terms in duration, thanks to two early elections.)
posted by rory at 1:30 AM on October 30 [1 favorite]
There are also legal frameworks, where you cannot disinherit your children with a will. For example in Germany, the best you can do is reduce their share of the inheritance. So whenever you have two or more children and a family home is part of the estate, they have to sell the home or one has to buy the other(s) out. Even if they were not to hand over the cash, the 'inheritance' may even trigger tax burden (I am not a German tax advisor but my mother had to pay income tax on assumed rent paid by our great grandmother when ownership of the house the great grandmother was still living in passed to her).
And with the kind of money tied up in family homes, people may be willing to wait a bit for their share but not indefinitely. Even people who intend to do right by their siblings get married, have children, enter cognitive decline etc. That does not even consider the fact that many people do not live close to their family of origin so the safe harbour/theoretical place to stay is a lot less useful than it was when everyone lived local. Cash on the other hand is of use wherever you are.
posted by koahiatamadl at 4:14 AM on October 30 [4 favorites]
And with the kind of money tied up in family homes, people may be willing to wait a bit for their share but not indefinitely. Even people who intend to do right by their siblings get married, have children, enter cognitive decline etc. That does not even consider the fact that many people do not live close to their family of origin so the safe harbour/theoretical place to stay is a lot less useful than it was when everyone lived local. Cash on the other hand is of use wherever you are.
posted by koahiatamadl at 4:14 AM on October 30 [4 favorites]
The tax-free threshold is £325,000 and you pay 40% on anything above that.
Watching Rachel Reeves' budget tells me that I overlooked that if an estate includes a residential property it raises the threshold to £500K.
posted by rory at 6:19 AM on October 30 [1 favorite]
Watching Rachel Reeves' budget tells me that I overlooked that if an estate includes a residential property it raises the threshold to £500K.
posted by rory at 6:19 AM on October 30 [1 favorite]
Until a house is emptied and handled - whether by sale, rental or someone moving in and foregoing the costs or , all those usually requiring expensive renovations of old housing - maintenance and costs pile up too. We were fortunate enough to afford going a year after my grandmother's death to slowly empty her apartment, but it was a significant expense in condo fees.
(And with multiple family deaths last year, I have the routine down pat. You go in with trash bags, empty the fridge and freezer, remove all pantry items that can host pests, turn off the water, and take at least a week to recover before the next pass....)
posted by I claim sanctuary at 6:57 AM on October 30 [9 favorites]
(And with multiple family deaths last year, I have the routine down pat. You go in with trash bags, empty the fridge and freezer, remove all pantry items that can host pests, turn off the water, and take at least a week to recover before the next pass....)
posted by I claim sanctuary at 6:57 AM on October 30 [9 favorites]
The Ken Fritz/monster stereo story is a cautionary tale for sure, but i don't know that it exactly fits the theme of boomer hoarding/collecting here. I view his story as an obsession - he wanted to have the best music reproduction system possible, and by many accounts, he got there. He obviously enjoyed the pursuit, - he worked at it, he wasn't just acquiring stuff - and was able to use and enjoy the system to some extent. The sad part is the toll his obsession took on his personal life and his family.
By contrast, the average stuff-collecting person usually acquires in the moment, but can't bring themself to edit and winnow their hoard, and they have little thought for the future, when someone else will have to deal with it all. And the hoarders I know have the problem of obtaining stuff because of potential future use... but never getting around to seriously using any of it, particularly when the mental and real costs of retaining all that stuff prevent them from doing much of anything else.
posted by Artful Codger at 6:52 AM on October 31 [2 favorites]
By contrast, the average stuff-collecting person usually acquires in the moment, but can't bring themself to edit and winnow their hoard, and they have little thought for the future, when someone else will have to deal with it all. And the hoarders I know have the problem of obtaining stuff because of potential future use... but never getting around to seriously using any of it, particularly when the mental and real costs of retaining all that stuff prevent them from doing much of anything else.
posted by Artful Codger at 6:52 AM on October 31 [2 favorites]
I just got a new 2 channel audio system for my extensive CD/LP collection. As the youngs say, I feel seen.
The one good thing, my niece's long term boyfriend is a vinyl enthusiast. So I know where it will all eventually go.
posted by Ber at 8:49 AM on October 31 [2 favorites]
The one good thing, my niece's long term boyfriend is a vinyl enthusiast. So I know where it will all eventually go.
posted by Ber at 8:49 AM on October 31 [2 favorites]
I would say it's a relatively common phenomenon for one child to live with/near/care for an aging parent and for that person to "get the house" after the parent is gone, even if that means the child gets a disproportionate amount of the estate as against their other sibling(s).
Sure, but also very common for that person to have their own house, and what do they need with two houses close to one another?
Also, common for family members to fight over the inheritance, even more so if the biological children have passed and it's distant cousins.
Also common for the daughter who took care of the parents to get jack squat, and the son gets the house.
Of these, corb's case where someone gets the house, and it's only a blessing is probably least common.
posted by The_Vegetables at 9:45 AM on October 31 [3 favorites]
Sure, but also very common for that person to have their own house, and what do they need with two houses close to one another?
Also, common for family members to fight over the inheritance, even more so if the biological children have passed and it's distant cousins.
Also common for the daughter who took care of the parents to get jack squat, and the son gets the house.
Of these, corb's case where someone gets the house, and it's only a blessing is probably least common.
posted by The_Vegetables at 9:45 AM on October 31 [3 favorites]
Even if it happened, say from someone dying without a will, anyone pushing for a sale in such cases would be virtually ostracized from the family and completely cut off from all aid
Lots of people don't even care about this one bit, like I said especially if the parent has passed and it's some distant cousin. Many people often get ornery as they get old, whether by medical condition or collection of aches and pains and built up discontent, or political lean, or whatever, and are perfectly fine ostracizeing their siblings.
posted by The_Vegetables at 9:58 AM on October 31 [1 favorite]
Lots of people don't even care about this one bit, like I said especially if the parent has passed and it's some distant cousin. Many people often get ornery as they get old, whether by medical condition or collection of aches and pains and built up discontent, or political lean, or whatever, and are perfectly fine ostracizeing their siblings.
posted by The_Vegetables at 9:58 AM on October 31 [1 favorite]
People love their kids, on average, on the whole. How did generations of voters fuck things up for their own kids so comprehensively?
A shift in the definition for what "loving your kids" actually looks like. Consumer goods have not always been as available as they are now, so a young family needing to furnish their home and have enough plates/cups/spoons for everyone would have greatly valued inheriting them from elders. They had the house, they just needed the stuff to put in it. And now it's flipped - we can get the stuff cheap from Ikea, what we need is the house. But the elders grew up with "stuff is valuable so we can hand it down to our kids" and that's a disconnect.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:39 AM on October 31 [5 favorites]
A shift in the definition for what "loving your kids" actually looks like. Consumer goods have not always been as available as they are now, so a young family needing to furnish their home and have enough plates/cups/spoons for everyone would have greatly valued inheriting them from elders. They had the house, they just needed the stuff to put in it. And now it's flipped - we can get the stuff cheap from Ikea, what we need is the house. But the elders grew up with "stuff is valuable so we can hand it down to our kids" and that's a disconnect.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:39 AM on October 31 [5 favorites]
And books . . . there are too many books in the world. I love books and we have shelves of them, but very very few books have any value. We give away lots of them, and I feel no guilt about recycling the ones no one wants.
A shout out to artist Dave Shrigley who, as a reaction to a charity shop's plea "You could give us another Da Vinci Code … but we would rather have your vinyl!" - collected 6,000 unwanted copies of Dan Brown's book, pulped them, and turn them into a limited edition of a freshly out of copyright "1984" - retail cost £500 to £800 per copy - to the original charity cause.
I am also reminded of artist Grayson Perry's tapestry about British class "The Vanity of Small Differences" - a distinct marker of the upper class people he talked to here was their experience of stuff. People who have grown up in enourmous houses full of bespoke, valuable, crumbling supplies of stuff with centurys of sentiment attached to them - have a characteristic of retreating to live in a gatehouse furnished entirely from Ikea.
posted by rongorongo at 11:13 AM on October 31 [2 favorites]
A shout out to artist Dave Shrigley who, as a reaction to a charity shop's plea "You could give us another Da Vinci Code … but we would rather have your vinyl!" - collected 6,000 unwanted copies of Dan Brown's book, pulped them, and turn them into a limited edition of a freshly out of copyright "1984" - retail cost £500 to £800 per copy - to the original charity cause.
I am also reminded of artist Grayson Perry's tapestry about British class "The Vanity of Small Differences" - a distinct marker of the upper class people he talked to here was their experience of stuff. People who have grown up in enourmous houses full of bespoke, valuable, crumbling supplies of stuff with centurys of sentiment attached to them - have a characteristic of retreating to live in a gatehouse furnished entirely from Ikea.
posted by rongorongo at 11:13 AM on October 31 [2 favorites]
He obviously enjoyed the pursuit, - he worked at it, he wasn't just acquiring stuff - and was able to use and enjoy the system to some extent. The sad part is the toll his obsession took on his personal life and his family.
I think it shows that no matter how much you valued your stuff in life, it pretty much always becomes worthless upon your death.
He not only paid a million dollars for this stuff, he sacrificed his relationships for it.
And when he died, nobody wanted it.
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:06 PM on October 31 [2 favorites]
I think it shows that no matter how much you valued your stuff in life, it pretty much always becomes worthless upon your death.
He not only paid a million dollars for this stuff, he sacrificed his relationships for it.
And when he died, nobody wanted it.
posted by OnceUponATime at 4:06 PM on October 31 [2 favorites]
He not only paid a million dollars for this stuff, he sacrificed his relationships for it.
And when he died, nobody wanted it.
To be accurate, Fritz put a lot of that money into research and experiments, custom fabrication, and home alterations for acoustics (since the room is 50% of the equation for optimum sound reproduction). It wasn't simply $1 million blown on gear. It was his money; some well-off folks collect cars or guitars, some climb Everest, some gamble.
The "it" that nobody wanted was the whole house with the sound system intact. They still managed to get $150k for the removed equipment, as I understand it. And something for the house.
One of his kids did actually share the hobby, and later went into pro audio. But yes, on the whole, Fritz's obsession damaged his family.
I'm not debating the after-death worthlessness of most collected stuff, just trying to differentiate between the grand passions of a few obsessives, and the mindless accumulation of things without regard to their future disposal.
* * *
In honour of this thread, yesterday I pulled an old FM tuner off my pile, and stripped it down. Kept a few good bits, and am recycling the rest.
posted by Artful Codger at 7:39 AM on November 1 [2 favorites]
And when he died, nobody wanted it.
To be accurate, Fritz put a lot of that money into research and experiments, custom fabrication, and home alterations for acoustics (since the room is 50% of the equation for optimum sound reproduction). It wasn't simply $1 million blown on gear. It was his money; some well-off folks collect cars or guitars, some climb Everest, some gamble.
The "it" that nobody wanted was the whole house with the sound system intact. They still managed to get $150k for the removed equipment, as I understand it. And something for the house.
One of his kids did actually share the hobby, and later went into pro audio. But yes, on the whole, Fritz's obsession damaged his family.
I'm not debating the after-death worthlessness of most collected stuff, just trying to differentiate between the grand passions of a few obsessives, and the mindless accumulation of things without regard to their future disposal.
* * *
In honour of this thread, yesterday I pulled an old FM tuner off my pile, and stripped it down. Kept a few good bits, and am recycling the rest.
posted by Artful Codger at 7:39 AM on November 1 [2 favorites]
it remains true that the house often has to be sold, because the estate isn't large enough for everyone else's share to offset their portion of the house's value
I think kind of what's becoming clear is this is just really a collectivist/individualist worldview split - like, whether you think of your family as one large interdependent entity, in which case, the shares/value thing is not really a consideration and the idea is more to keep the most houses intact so that the overall family has the greatest benefit, or whether you think of families as a collection of small independent nuclear families that each have independent interests, in which case each independent family *will* want to preserve their share because they will have their own financial interests that will take precedence.
posted by corb at 10:28 AM on November 1 [3 favorites]
I think kind of what's becoming clear is this is just really a collectivist/individualist worldview split - like, whether you think of your family as one large interdependent entity, in which case, the shares/value thing is not really a consideration and the idea is more to keep the most houses intact so that the overall family has the greatest benefit, or whether you think of families as a collection of small independent nuclear families that each have independent interests, in which case each independent family *will* want to preserve their share because they will have their own financial interests that will take precedence.
posted by corb at 10:28 AM on November 1 [3 favorites]
Yes, what corb said. The tradition of leaving a house to one family member is common in Appalachia and the rural South in general. It makes total sense if the house is all the generational wealth you have or are likely to get. And it keeps a branch of the family out of sliding into homelessness. That's how poor people, by and large, own houses. The houses are left to one individual rather than to everyone for several very pragmatic reasons, including avoiding family conflict and the fact that it's more difficult for outsiders like the government to come after property that's owned by one person than it is for them to manage to gain a foothold through suborning one of many title holders. And no, you never sell the house.*
My family, as we descend the socioeconomic ladder, are moving from the "individual families each with their own priorities" to a much more multigenerational, inclusive, large interdependent entity view. I think more and more people will find themselves in this situation; it's just too impossible for any of us to own a house individually, so we have to work together.
*I met somebody here in the northwest corner of the US from Qualla Boundary, NC. Based on a brief conversation I thought, oooh, you sold the house and you had to leave and get as far away as you could because the family is pissed. I could well be wrong, but it wouldn't be unheard of.
Another part of this conversation keeps coming back to me in the shape of a visual memory of the New York Times from July 21, 1969 - the moon landing. My parents kept three copies, carefully preserved - one, I suspect, for each of us siblings. Nobody knew. They came to light when I started digging through the boxes in my garage, 9 years after my mother died. I pulled them out and thought, what now? Do I want these? Are they valuable by any crazy chance? I looked on eBay. Nope, nobody wants these. I took a picture and went to throw them out. A horrified friend said we should save them. So I gave them to him and I think he threw them out a few years later when he too moved on. It's just - no. This is why we have museums. I have an archivists' soul and I get wanting to save all the ephemera. But that way lies madness.
posted by mygothlaundry at 11:56 AM on November 1 [3 favorites]
My family, as we descend the socioeconomic ladder, are moving from the "individual families each with their own priorities" to a much more multigenerational, inclusive, large interdependent entity view. I think more and more people will find themselves in this situation; it's just too impossible for any of us to own a house individually, so we have to work together.
*I met somebody here in the northwest corner of the US from Qualla Boundary, NC. Based on a brief conversation I thought, oooh, you sold the house and you had to leave and get as far away as you could because the family is pissed. I could well be wrong, but it wouldn't be unheard of.
Another part of this conversation keeps coming back to me in the shape of a visual memory of the New York Times from July 21, 1969 - the moon landing. My parents kept three copies, carefully preserved - one, I suspect, for each of us siblings. Nobody knew. They came to light when I started digging through the boxes in my garage, 9 years after my mother died. I pulled them out and thought, what now? Do I want these? Are they valuable by any crazy chance? I looked on eBay. Nope, nobody wants these. I took a picture and went to throw them out. A horrified friend said we should save them. So I gave them to him and I think he threw them out a few years later when he too moved on. It's just - no. This is why we have museums. I have an archivists' soul and I get wanting to save all the ephemera. But that way lies madness.
posted by mygothlaundry at 11:56 AM on November 1 [3 favorites]
Pretty sure I saved a newspaper, (likely Minneapolis), from when the Challenger fell apart. Not too long before I had asked my roomate, "when do you think something bad will happen to the Space Shuttle?" Still feel that's on me.
posted by Windopaene at 2:10 PM on November 1
posted by Windopaene at 2:10 PM on November 1
It wasn't simply $1 million blown on gear. It was his money; some well-off folks collect cars or guitars, some climb Everest, some gamble.
The "it" that nobody wanted was the whole house with the sound system intact. They still managed to get $150k for the removed equipment, as I understand it. And something for the house.
The most extreme example of this I can think of was in the book Empty Mansions. The book is primarily about the heiress Huguette Clark, but out of necessity it is also kind of a history of her father, the copper baron and two-time senator William A. Clark. He built an enormous house on Fifth Ave, and was very proud of the pipe organ he had constructed into its walls.
After his death the house was sold, and the book mentions that there was an attempt to find a buyer for the organ, but the cost of removing it was greater than its worth. The house was razed to make way for an apartment building, and the organ within its walls was destroyed.
posted by fedward at 7:57 PM on November 1 [4 favorites]
The "it" that nobody wanted was the whole house with the sound system intact. They still managed to get $150k for the removed equipment, as I understand it. And something for the house.
The most extreme example of this I can think of was in the book Empty Mansions. The book is primarily about the heiress Huguette Clark, but out of necessity it is also kind of a history of her father, the copper baron and two-time senator William A. Clark. He built an enormous house on Fifth Ave, and was very proud of the pipe organ he had constructed into its walls.
After his death the house was sold, and the book mentions that there was an attempt to find a buyer for the organ, but the cost of removing it was greater than its worth. The house was razed to make way for an apartment building, and the organ within its walls was destroyed.
posted by fedward at 7:57 PM on November 1 [4 favorites]
That's harsh.
Pipe Organs are pretty damned awesome.
posted by Windopaene at 8:40 PM on November 1 [3 favorites]
Pipe Organs are pretty damned awesome.
posted by Windopaene at 8:40 PM on November 1 [3 favorites]
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I have an acre of stuff coming to me that I just don’t even know what to think of. Silverware? The “good” china? Seasonal dinnerware? All this stuff has the emotional heft of the wedding gifts you get from well-meaning people who go off-registry. That’s nice, great, thank you but… I only need so many gravy boats in my life. I just don’t need all these artifacts of ceremonies I don’t share, of a life I don’t live. What the hell am I going to do with all this, besides give it away?
So that’s what’s going to happen. Hopefully all this stuff can find a home in a family that needs it.
posted by mhoye at 8:16 AM on October 27 [19 favorites]