Coldplay Rip Off U2... Again
August 5, 2005 12:57 PM Subscribe
Sometimes You Can't Fix You On Your Own. (Quicktime and Windows Media.) If there has ever been doubt about Coldplay's burning ambition to be U2, let it be put to rest.
I take it you don't like Coldplay ?
People LIKE Coldplay??
posted by Robot Johnny at 1:15 PM on August 5, 2005
People LIKE Coldplay??
posted by Robot Johnny at 1:15 PM on August 5, 2005
A Coldplay video with Christ Martin walking? I think they're ripping themselves off, not U2.
posted by smackfu at 1:17 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by smackfu at 1:17 PM on August 5, 2005
If the implication is that U2 is original, you should know that everything they made from Rattle and Hum onwards was theivery of the usual pop and blues variety. Just sayin'
posted by Rothko at 1:17 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by Rothko at 1:17 PM on August 5, 2005
...and this is because U2 is the only band to ever have a video where the singer walks toward the camera whilest singing so Coldplay must be copying them?
posted by papercake at 1:17 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by papercake at 1:17 PM on August 5, 2005
Isn't it about fifteen years too late to want to be U2?
posted by bondcliff at 1:18 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by bondcliff at 1:18 PM on August 5, 2005
The first and lasts links are the same. You can get the video [url=http://www.u2.com/av/index.php?album_id=68&type=lp]here[/url], third song of course.
posted by abcde at 1:18 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by abcde at 1:18 PM on August 5, 2005
A Coldplay video with Christ Martin walking?
Hey, I thought Bono was Christ ?
posted by swordfishtrombones at 1:19 PM on August 5, 2005
Hey, I thought Bono was Christ ?
posted by swordfishtrombones at 1:19 PM on August 5, 2005
Whoops! Here's a WMP version of the first and last (same video) link.
posted by Saellys at 1:20 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by Saellys at 1:20 PM on August 5, 2005
Isn't it about fifteen years too late to want to be U2?
Unless you are U2. Judging by their last album, they're desperately trying to figure that out themselves.
/end derail of thread into ragging on U2
posted by papercake at 1:27 PM on August 5, 2005
Unless you are U2. Judging by their last album, they're desperately trying to figure that out themselves.
/end derail of thread into ragging on U2
posted by papercake at 1:27 PM on August 5, 2005
Funny, I can't stand U2 but can listen to ColdPlay without wanting to smash things, maybe its because I don't know enough about the band to hate them?
I thought it was far more laughable when people were calling Oasis the next Beatles even though they are absolutely awful and awful assholes.
posted by fenriq at 1:28 PM on August 5, 2005
I thought it was far more laughable when people were calling Oasis the next Beatles even though they are absolutely awful and awful assholes.
posted by fenriq at 1:28 PM on August 5, 2005
I thought it was far more laughable when people were calling Oasis the next Beatles even though they are absolutely awful and awful assholes.
What are you talking about? They're FANTASTIC assholes!
posted by Robot Johnny at 1:29 PM on August 5, 2005
What are you talking about? They're FANTASTIC assholes!
posted by Robot Johnny at 1:29 PM on August 5, 2005
who would want to be like U2? have you ever listened, and i mean really listened, to U2?
if anything Martin should be more careful picking video directors.
posted by garfield at 1:30 PM on August 5, 2005
if anything Martin should be more careful picking video directors.
posted by garfield at 1:30 PM on August 5, 2005
"I thought it was far more laughable when people were calling Oasis the next Beatles even though they are absolutely awful and awful assholes."
Wasn't it Oasis who was calling Oasis the next Beatles?
posted by btwillig at 1:31 PM on August 5, 2005
Wasn't it Oasis who was calling Oasis the next Beatles?
posted by btwillig at 1:31 PM on August 5, 2005
This video is nothing like the Coldplay video, actually. You're going to have to substantiate this claim a little ;)
posted by abcde at 1:32 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by abcde at 1:32 PM on August 5, 2005
Well, I like ColdPlay and U2, so put that in your musical snobbery pipe and smoke it.
posted by VelvetHellvis at 1:33 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by VelvetHellvis at 1:33 PM on August 5, 2005
btwillig, it could have been. I just remember hearing Howard Stern mention it awhile and he, as a huge Beatles fan, was pretty much in the same boat. I think he said something to the effect that the Gallagher's weren't fit to sniff Lennon's poop or something to that effect (it has been awhile).
posted by fenriq at 1:34 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by fenriq at 1:34 PM on August 5, 2005
Wasn't it Oasis who was calling Oasis the next Beatles?
Yeah, although I think they knew in their hearts that they were actually the next Slade.
posted by dodgygeezer at 1:36 PM on August 5, 2005
Yeah, although I think they knew in their hearts that they were actually the next Slade.
posted by dodgygeezer at 1:36 PM on August 5, 2005
If there has ever been doubt about Eric Clapton's burning ambition to be Robert Johnson, let it be put to rest.
If there has ever been doubt about The Beatles' burning ambition to be Chuck Berry, let it be put to rest.
If there has ever been doubt about Joss Stone's burning ambition to be Aretha Franklin, let it be put to rest.
posted by danb at 1:38 PM on August 5, 2005
If there has ever been doubt about The Beatles' burning ambition to be Chuck Berry, let it be put to rest.
If there has ever been doubt about Joss Stone's burning ambition to be Aretha Franklin, let it be put to rest.
posted by danb at 1:38 PM on August 5, 2005
Your favorite bad sucks, part 352. At least there are enough tags on this post that I'll be able to find it and remember the great times we had.
posted by yerfatma at 1:43 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by yerfatma at 1:43 PM on August 5, 2005
Metafilter: Sometimes You Can't Fix You On Your Own
On a scale from 1 to 10, I give this post a poke in the eye.
Poke!
posted by Outlawyr at 1:47 PM on August 5, 2005
On a scale from 1 to 10, I give this post a poke in the eye.
Poke!
posted by Outlawyr at 1:47 PM on August 5, 2005
Velvethellvis, I left my musical snobbery pipe in my car, is it okay to use my standard non-musical snobbery pipe and hum "Wonderwheel" or whatever Oasis' hit was ten years ago?
By the way, why is it snobbery to not like U2 and Oasis? I'd think it was more a matter of personal taste. I know there's plenty of music I listen to that would make you snicker but I really don't worry about other people liking my music so long as I do.
And pendragon, I dig on the Kaiser Chiefs as well!
posted by fenriq at 1:57 PM on August 5, 2005
By the way, why is it snobbery to not like U2 and Oasis? I'd think it was more a matter of personal taste. I know there's plenty of music I listen to that would make you snicker but I really don't worry about other people liking my music so long as I do.
And pendragon, I dig on the Kaiser Chiefs as well!
posted by fenriq at 1:57 PM on August 5, 2005
This video is nothing like the Coldplay video, actually. You're going to have to substantiate this claim a little ;)
Lead singer walks alone, facing camera, through deserted city streets, but just before the emotional climax of the song he arrives at a venue where the rest of the band is already playing. Other band members trade knowing glances; drummer mutters, "Nice of you to join us, you git." Song finishes triumphantly, amid applause (at least in Coldplay's case; U2 seem to be playing for an inexplicably empty Dublin theatre).
Yep. They're nothing alike.
have you ever listened, and i mean really listened, to U2?
Yes. Have you?
posted by Saellys at 1:58 PM on August 5, 2005
Lead singer walks alone, facing camera, through deserted city streets, but just before the emotional climax of the song he arrives at a venue where the rest of the band is already playing. Other band members trade knowing glances; drummer mutters, "Nice of you to join us, you git." Song finishes triumphantly, amid applause (at least in Coldplay's case; U2 seem to be playing for an inexplicably empty Dublin theatre).
Yep. They're nothing alike.
have you ever listened, and i mean really listened, to U2?
Yes. Have you?
posted by Saellys at 1:58 PM on August 5, 2005
By the way, why is it snobbery to not like U2 and Oasis?
It's not. It's snobbery to feel that you need to tell everyone you don't like [enter bandname here] when nobody asked your opinion. Re-read the post, it's asking you to comment on a ripped-off concept. Saellys doesn't even weigh in on whether s/he likes the bands in question.
But instead, some would rather play the "your favorite band sucks" game (as yerfatma pointed out). Nobody cares who you like or don't like.
posted by 27 at 2:03 PM on August 5, 2005
It's not. It's snobbery to feel that you need to tell everyone you don't like [enter bandname here] when nobody asked your opinion. Re-read the post, it's asking you to comment on a ripped-off concept. Saellys doesn't even weigh in on whether s/he likes the bands in question.
But instead, some would rather play the "your favorite band sucks" game (as yerfatma pointed out). Nobody cares who you like or don't like.
posted by 27 at 2:03 PM on August 5, 2005
have you ever listened, and i mean really listened, to U2?
How do you "really, i mean really" listen to something? I imagine putting on a monocle and placing my ear right up to the speaker.
I guess I just accidentally overhear most music I thought listened to.
posted by tpl1212 at 2:23 PM on August 5, 2005
How do you "really, i mean really" listen to something? I imagine putting on a monocle and placing my ear right up to the speaker.
I guess I just accidentally overhear most music I thought listened to.
posted by tpl1212 at 2:23 PM on August 5, 2005
Haven't there been many "singer begins walking alone during intimate quiet beginning of song and joins band for big rocking part" videos?
I can't think of any off the top of my head of course, but neither video strikes me as particularly original.
posted by frenetic at 2:24 PM on August 5, 2005
I can't think of any off the top of my head of course, but neither video strikes me as particularly original.
posted by frenetic at 2:24 PM on August 5, 2005
I feel bad for Coldplay. Everyone tried to call them Radiohead copycats at first. Now it's U2.
Here's an interesting fact: Coldplay recorded X&Y in the studio with U2 posters adorning the walls for motivation.
posted by Mach3avelli at 2:25 PM on August 5, 2005
Here's an interesting fact: Coldplay recorded X&Y in the studio with U2 posters adorning the walls for motivation.
posted by Mach3avelli at 2:25 PM on August 5, 2005
I find Coldplay really, really boring. I can deal with one song, but I can't imagine listening to an entire Coldplay album, unless it's deeply in the background. At least U2 is marginally interesting.
Achtung Baby was a great album. Just sayin'.
posted by Hildegarde at 2:25 PM on August 5, 2005
Achtung Baby was a great album. Just sayin'.
posted by Hildegarde at 2:25 PM on August 5, 2005
Coldplay? The TRL band from England? Holy teener boppers!
U2 has chunks of punks like them in their collective stool(s).
posted by mrblondemang at 2:28 PM on August 5, 2005
U2 has chunks of punks like them in their collective stool(s).
posted by mrblondemang at 2:28 PM on August 5, 2005
Invest in Q-tips....just kidding...and I don't want to come off as a music snob, i consider myself an ex-music snob, but U2 is one of the most over-rated bands of my life time. I like a tune or two, maybe five, but for the most part, I find the sound leaves something to be desired. the coordination of the bass and drums....not so much. [Metallica learned to correct this deficiecy when Newstead joined the band. I love all the old metallica, but this coordination was lacking on their early records] perhaps some musical training (apart from the man on the kit) before they took off would've helped. the Edge is more than a little dull, and bono is a mono-trick-pony.
Not sure how they managed all of their commercial success? More power to them I suppose. They can be catchy and political and romantic. But as a cohesive sound, what I consider the main aim of a band, Coldplay is on par or exceeds the sound of U2.
posted by garfield at 2:30 PM on August 5, 2005
Not sure how they managed all of their commercial success? More power to them I suppose. They can be catchy and political and romantic. But as a cohesive sound, what I consider the main aim of a band, Coldplay is on par or exceeds the sound of U2.
posted by garfield at 2:30 PM on August 5, 2005
27, I bet you don't care that I don't like you.
Have you been in any music threads before? Its natural to talk about music you like and don't like, so sorry to have offended your delicate sensibilities.
I read the post, its not asking you to come in and comment like a big hairy buzz kill curmudgeon and yet, here you are, a big hairy buzz kill curmudgeon dropping a steaming pile of self-righteousness right in the middle of the thread. Nice.
By the way, I'm glad you feel empowered to speak for the entire community. Not at all snobbish or pretentious.
posted by fenriq at 2:32 PM on August 5, 2005
Have you been in any music threads before? Its natural to talk about music you like and don't like, so sorry to have offended your delicate sensibilities.
I read the post, its not asking you to come in and comment like a big hairy buzz kill curmudgeon and yet, here you are, a big hairy buzz kill curmudgeon dropping a steaming pile of self-righteousness right in the middle of the thread. Nice.
By the way, I'm glad you feel empowered to speak for the entire community. Not at all snobbish or pretentious.
posted by fenriq at 2:32 PM on August 5, 2005
Lead singer walks alone, facing camera, through deserted city streets, but just before the emotional climax of the song he arrives at a venue where the rest of the band is already playing. Other band members trade knowing glances; drummer mutters, "Nice of you to join us, you git." Song finishes triumphantly, amid applause (at least in Coldplay's case; U2 seem to be playing for an inexplicably empty Dublin theatre).
Yup, they've RIPPED off that concept. Could have been they were playing homage to it. (Like how U2 played homage to Wings of Desire).
But you know, what I really think what you've uncovered is that both U2 and Coldplay use tired Music Video cliches. I can think of more then a few videos working on that same riff.
Actually if you just subtype the video as singleton performer meets group at end of video, you can include probably 20% of all music videos.
posted by jboy55 at 2:37 PM on August 5, 2005
If we all try real hard we can probably get a MetaTalk thread out of this.
posted by OmieWise at 2:41 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by OmieWise at 2:41 PM on August 5, 2005
I read the post, its not asking you to come in and comment like a big hairy buzz kill curmudgeon and yet, here you are, a big hairy buzz kill curmudgeon dropping a steaming pile of self-righteousness right in the middle of the thread. Nice.
By the way, I'm glad you feel empowered to speak for the entire community. Not at all snobbish or pretentious.
The thread also isn't asking anyone to insult each other, but hey, this is the Internet, after all. 27 happened to list a few aspects of most music threads I've seen that piss me off as well. Those views may not reflect those of the entire community, but they're not off-base either. I saw nothing in that comment that suggested overreaction or self-righteousness. Just someone tired of seeing people intentionally start and perpetuate meaningless feuds.
posted by Saellys at 2:48 PM on August 5, 2005
By the way, I'm glad you feel empowered to speak for the entire community. Not at all snobbish or pretentious.
The thread also isn't asking anyone to insult each other, but hey, this is the Internet, after all. 27 happened to list a few aspects of most music threads I've seen that piss me off as well. Those views may not reflect those of the entire community, but they're not off-base either. I saw nothing in that comment that suggested overreaction or self-righteousness. Just someone tired of seeing people intentionally start and perpetuate meaningless feuds.
posted by Saellys at 2:48 PM on August 5, 2005
Most music videos suck.
Most music sucks.
Coldplay is Diet U2.
So what?
posted by mosch at 2:49 PM on August 5, 2005
Most music sucks.
Coldplay is Diet U2.
So what?
posted by mosch at 2:49 PM on August 5, 2005
We must not forget, U2 lost all of their artistic "punk rock cred" when they destroyed Negativland. (or didn't stop their labels from doing it as they say now).
posted by jboy55 at 2:51 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by jboy55 at 2:51 PM on August 5, 2005
These videos have nothing in common. For instance, Bono wears a mall-rat hoodie, while Chris Martin is wearing some sort of ninja outfit. Completely different.
posted by fungible at 2:56 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by fungible at 2:56 PM on August 5, 2005
Well, I like ColdPlay and U2, so put that in your musical snobbery pipe and smoke it.
Snobbery ain't got nothing to do with it. It's about taste.
posted by psmealey at 3:11 PM on August 5, 2005
Snobbery ain't got nothing to do with it. It's about taste.
posted by psmealey at 3:11 PM on August 5, 2005
I know that U2 claims "Oh no, that was Island records! We couldn't stop them! Not us, just the little ol' Biggest Band On The Label!" but Mark Hosler of Negativland found out that it actually was U2 that started it -- when the case happened, they tracked down the offending single that started the case to an Athens, GA record shop.
Last year, at a conference, Mark was giving a speech and REM's manager mentioned that it was his fault they got sued (to which, Mark shouted "YOU MOTHERFUCKER!", which is a perfectly understandable exclamation). His story (whether or not it's true): U2 and REM were friends, and U2'd heard about the Negativland Single. They, through their manager, asked REM's manager to pick up a copy for them. He complied, thinking (or so he says) "Oh, they just want to have a copy for their collection, to laugh over and whatnot", and soon after, the lawyers came out.
... which, you know, I guess would explain why U2 never stopped "Island" from suing, nor came through on their offer to loan/give Negativland money to cover court costs. But it didn't stop them from basically ripping Negativland off wholesale for Zoo TV...
...so, you know, basically, fuck U2.
posted by Rev. Syung Myung Me at 3:12 PM on August 5, 2005
Last year, at a conference, Mark was giving a speech and REM's manager mentioned that it was his fault they got sued (to which, Mark shouted "YOU MOTHERFUCKER!", which is a perfectly understandable exclamation). His story (whether or not it's true): U2 and REM were friends, and U2'd heard about the Negativland Single. They, through their manager, asked REM's manager to pick up a copy for them. He complied, thinking (or so he says) "Oh, they just want to have a copy for their collection, to laugh over and whatnot", and soon after, the lawyers came out.
... which, you know, I guess would explain why U2 never stopped "Island" from suing, nor came through on their offer to loan/give Negativland money to cover court costs. But it didn't stop them from basically ripping Negativland off wholesale for Zoo TV...
...so, you know, basically, fuck U2.
posted by Rev. Syung Myung Me at 3:12 PM on August 5, 2005
(and for the record, even though I'd still disagree with them, I'd have way, way more respect for them had they just come out and said "We really do think Negativland was in the wrong to make their sleeve look like that and use the 30-second sample". Instead, they did this whole playing-both-sides-of-the-fence thing of secretly being the instigators of the lawsuit while publicly going "OH NO THIS IS HORRIBLE! SORRY THAT WE WON'T ACTUALLY DO ANYTHING TO STOP IT THOUGH!! OUR HANDS ARE TIED!! DON'T THINK THAT PART THROUGH AT ALL, THOUGH!!")
posted by Rev. Syung Myung Me at 3:14 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by Rev. Syung Myung Me at 3:14 PM on August 5, 2005
All U2 would have had to have said, is "Negativland, redesign your cover". Instead they went for the kill and they were VERY two faced about it.
The only legal reason they could have stopped Negativland was the cover, the musical portion was clear parody. But I guess U2 wanted to suck Casey Kasem's balls to get up the top 20 and destroy negativland.
posted by jboy55 at 3:22 PM on August 5, 2005
The only legal reason they could have stopped Negativland was the cover, the musical portion was clear parody. But I guess U2 wanted to suck Casey Kasem's balls to get up the top 20 and destroy negativland.
posted by jboy55 at 3:22 PM on August 5, 2005
Saellys, so you posted this knowing you were going to get a comment thread that pissed you and now you're pissed off about it? That seems totally sensible.
See, here's the thing about posting a post to MetaFilter, you can only post it, you can't control the thread that falls from it no matter how much you want to or try to by shepherding it towards whatever conversation you feel it deserves or should occur. And expecting people to do what you want them to do is an exercise in frustration.
I'll weigh in with my opinion on an FPP if it suits me. It suited me to comment that I think both U2 and ColdPlay suck balls. If there's a thread that's about a band that I actually like then I'll comment that I actually like them. The intarnets are kind of crazy like that.
posted by fenriq at 3:29 PM on August 5, 2005
See, here's the thing about posting a post to MetaFilter, you can only post it, you can't control the thread that falls from it no matter how much you want to or try to by shepherding it towards whatever conversation you feel it deserves or should occur. And expecting people to do what you want them to do is an exercise in frustration.
I'll weigh in with my opinion on an FPP if it suits me. It suited me to comment that I think both U2 and ColdPlay suck balls. If there's a thread that's about a band that I actually like then I'll comment that I actually like them. The intarnets are kind of crazy like that.
posted by fenriq at 3:29 PM on August 5, 2005
Aaagh. I had to run here to get the taste out of my ears. Maybe it will help you, too.
posted by 31d1 at 3:32 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by 31d1 at 3:32 PM on August 5, 2005
Snobbery ain't got nothing to do with it. It's about taste.
Ah. So you're saying you have better taste than everyone. Certainly not snobbery.
(For the record, I like Coldplay alright; their newest album is uninspired, though. And Oasis haven't aged well, but they were fucking amazingly fucking awesome when I was 13.)
posted by Tlogmer at 3:33 PM on August 5, 2005
Ah. So you're saying you have better taste than everyone. Certainly not snobbery.
(For the record, I like Coldplay alright; their newest album is uninspired, though. And Oasis haven't aged well, but they were fucking amazingly fucking awesome when I was 13.)
posted by Tlogmer at 3:33 PM on August 5, 2005
To relate this back to this thread.
So after being soley responsible for destroying Negativland financially. When it came time for U2's Zoo TV tour, U2 became all "edgy", commenting on media and its effect on society. Through pirate TV intercepts, sampling pop culture and rebroadcasting it to make pointed political commentary.
Which turns out is exactly what Negativland had been doing, did with their U2 single and with much effort they've manged to come back and continue doing.
So, to say Coldplay is Ripping off U2, what Coldplay aint doing is sueing U2 into non-existance then ripping off their ideas.
posted by jboy55 at 3:39 PM on August 5, 2005
So after being soley responsible for destroying Negativland financially. When it came time for U2's Zoo TV tour, U2 became all "edgy", commenting on media and its effect on society. Through pirate TV intercepts, sampling pop culture and rebroadcasting it to make pointed political commentary.
Which turns out is exactly what Negativland had been doing, did with their U2 single and with much effort they've manged to come back and continue doing.
So, to say Coldplay is Ripping off U2, what Coldplay aint doing is sueing U2 into non-existance then ripping off their ideas.
posted by jboy55 at 3:39 PM on August 5, 2005
Poor Negativeland. A shitty band gets national attention and immediate street cred as trod-upon underdog because a band they sampled without clearing sued them. I'm crying inside for them, really.
posted by eustacescrubb at 3:41 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by eustacescrubb at 3:41 PM on August 5, 2005
Wow corporate rock v. corporate rock, who shall prevail?
For the the record all music sucks, unless it's Billy Joel, except for that Lionel Richie album where he's wearing sweater on the cover.
posted by MiltonRandKalman at 3:52 PM on August 5, 2005
For the the record all music sucks, unless it's Billy Joel, except for that Lionel Richie album where he's wearing sweater on the cover.
posted by MiltonRandKalman at 3:52 PM on August 5, 2005
Hmm..
Ok, to set the record straight,
Negativland was a band that used sampling to create commentary about media and politics.
Negativland put out a single with a U2 spy plane on it, containing 2 songs. One had a casio keyboard playing one of U2's songs, while the "Weatherman" made fun of it. The other had a sample of Kasey Kasem swearing about U2 and what a stupid band they were from England, while the band hummed the tune. Later, a voice over comments on censorship.
If U2 had sued them about sampling (if there was any sampling from U2), they might have gotten half of the royalties. They sued about the cover of the album, SST caved forcing Negativland to buy back and destroy every album made and suing the members individulally for U2's and SST's legal costs to the tune of 200k. All for a band that probably made around $40k over their life time till that point.
Too bad negativland never sampled anything of U2's they mearly played a tune and made fun of it. If you refer to Mad Magazine, and the protection's under fair use for parody, U2 probably couldn't sue. Kasey Kasem might have had a suit, but probably not for the parody rule.
If U2 had said, "Screw em, They're a shitty underground band and we don't feel sorry, what we feel sorry for is that they'll get publicity about it", at least they would have been honest about it.
What U2 did was to say to the public, "We're not suing them, we support small artists, its the big bad labels", while behind the scenes they were suing the band out of existance.
Then U2 changes its focus, creating a tour, Zoo Tv, that used sampling to make commentary about media and politics.
SO you decide if U2 is an edgy, punkish band that deserved high-eye brow praise.
posted by jboy55 at 4:00 PM on August 5, 2005
Ok, to set the record straight,
Negativland was a band that used sampling to create commentary about media and politics.
Negativland put out a single with a U2 spy plane on it, containing 2 songs. One had a casio keyboard playing one of U2's songs, while the "Weatherman" made fun of it. The other had a sample of Kasey Kasem swearing about U2 and what a stupid band they were from England, while the band hummed the tune. Later, a voice over comments on censorship.
If U2 had sued them about sampling (if there was any sampling from U2), they might have gotten half of the royalties. They sued about the cover of the album, SST caved forcing Negativland to buy back and destroy every album made and suing the members individulally for U2's and SST's legal costs to the tune of 200k. All for a band that probably made around $40k over their life time till that point.
Too bad negativland never sampled anything of U2's they mearly played a tune and made fun of it. If you refer to Mad Magazine, and the protection's under fair use for parody, U2 probably couldn't sue. Kasey Kasem might have had a suit, but probably not for the parody rule.
If U2 had said, "Screw em, They're a shitty underground band and we don't feel sorry, what we feel sorry for is that they'll get publicity about it", at least they would have been honest about it.
What U2 did was to say to the public, "We're not suing them, we support small artists, its the big bad labels", while behind the scenes they were suing the band out of existance.
Then U2 changes its focus, creating a tour, Zoo Tv, that used sampling to make commentary about media and politics.
SO you decide if U2 is an edgy, punkish band that deserved high-eye brow praise.
posted by jboy55 at 4:00 PM on August 5, 2005
This is the best thread ever.
And Milton, that Lionel album kicks ASS!
posted by Kafkaesque at 4:00 PM on August 5, 2005
And Milton, that Lionel album kicks ASS!
posted by Kafkaesque at 4:00 PM on August 5, 2005
eustacescrubb: The question isn't whether Negativland deserves sympathy but whether U2 is evil.
posted by abcde at 4:02 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by abcde at 4:02 PM on August 5, 2005
Actually, U2 does contain an actual sample of "I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For", although the bulk of the case was about the sleeve design -- the argument being that someone could see that and think it was a new U2 single called "Negativland", rather than a Negativland single called "U2"... though what a new U2 single would be doing binned in "Miscellaneous N" is a mystery to me. The sample was just frosting.
(Otherwise, right on jboy, and, yeah -- though the sample exists, it is SO not the focal point of the single... as evidenced by you not even realizing there was one!)
posted by Rev. Syung Myung Me at 4:05 PM on August 5, 2005
(Otherwise, right on jboy, and, yeah -- though the sample exists, it is SO not the focal point of the single... as evidenced by you not even realizing there was one!)
posted by Rev. Syung Myung Me at 4:05 PM on August 5, 2005
I like Kaiser Chiefs and Franz Ferdinand.
So did I, like 6 months ago and 18 months ago respectively. They are so old to my ears now. I think I grow tired of bands too quickly these days.....
posted by FieldingGoodney at 4:12 PM on August 5, 2005
So did I, like 6 months ago and 18 months ago respectively. They are so old to my ears now. I think I grow tired of bands too quickly these days.....
posted by FieldingGoodney at 4:12 PM on August 5, 2005
Listening to it, the sample comes in at 0:22 on the "1991 A Capella Mix", and ends at about 0:52, crossfading into the hummed version.
Also, the original label actually DID give songwriting credit to U2; it's "officially" a cover version.
The version in the "Special Radio Edit", however, I think is a re-recording of the song -- the percussion sounds similar but not exact. And there's no Bono Vocals on that version, soooo...
(I'm just bummed because I just discovered that my copy of Dead Dog Records has a huge crack running across it...)
posted by Rev. Syung Myung Me at 4:12 PM on August 5, 2005
Also, the original label actually DID give songwriting credit to U2; it's "officially" a cover version.
The version in the "Special Radio Edit", however, I think is a re-recording of the song -- the percussion sounds similar but not exact. And there's no Bono Vocals on that version, soooo...
(I'm just bummed because I just discovered that my copy of Dead Dog Records has a huge crack running across it...)
posted by Rev. Syung Myung Me at 4:12 PM on August 5, 2005
jboy,
I'm well aware of the U2/Negativeland story; I heard the Negativeland single when it came out, and was subjected to many other Negativeland "songs" when they came out, and the fact is that:
A: they're not very good, and never were; they likely got as much benefit as they did grief out of the suit, because without it, it's doubtful most of us would even know who they are.
B: your entire argument about U2 "stealing" Negativeland's ideas about sampling pop culture is guilty of the post hoc fallacy - the ideas did not originate with Negativeland and many, many bands were playing around with those same ideas at the time or half a decade earlier, (Roger Waters, Talking Heads, Public Enemy, Michael Franti and Peter Gabriel all come to mind) so it's much more likely that all those bands were all influenced by the cultural climate at the time, rather than one band stealing the idea from another.
C: Negativeland's side of the story is, well Negativeland's side of the story. They've never struck me as charitable people in interviews, and like many in the "underground" of the music scene, they always seem to take the most cynical point of view about a given matter, so I'm not going to immediately trust second-hand stories about R.E.M.'s manager originating with them.
D: I suspect we'll never know the whole truth because both U2 and Negativeland want to be judged the virtuous party by the public, and so arre bound to be leaving pertinent facts out of the story.
posted by eustacescrubb at 4:25 PM on August 5, 2005
I'm well aware of the U2/Negativeland story; I heard the Negativeland single when it came out, and was subjected to many other Negativeland "songs" when they came out, and the fact is that:
A: they're not very good, and never were; they likely got as much benefit as they did grief out of the suit, because without it, it's doubtful most of us would even know who they are.
B: your entire argument about U2 "stealing" Negativeland's ideas about sampling pop culture is guilty of the post hoc fallacy - the ideas did not originate with Negativeland and many, many bands were playing around with those same ideas at the time or half a decade earlier, (Roger Waters, Talking Heads, Public Enemy, Michael Franti and Peter Gabriel all come to mind) so it's much more likely that all those bands were all influenced by the cultural climate at the time, rather than one band stealing the idea from another.
C: Negativeland's side of the story is, well Negativeland's side of the story. They've never struck me as charitable people in interviews, and like many in the "underground" of the music scene, they always seem to take the most cynical point of view about a given matter, so I'm not going to immediately trust second-hand stories about R.E.M.'s manager originating with them.
D: I suspect we'll never know the whole truth because both U2 and Negativeland want to be judged the virtuous party by the public, and so arre bound to be leaving pertinent facts out of the story.
posted by eustacescrubb at 4:25 PM on August 5, 2005
I don't feel the need to make a statement with the music I listen to--I like Tom Petty.
posted by ijoshua at 4:34 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by ijoshua at 4:34 PM on August 5, 2005
I also like Tom Petty. But he totally stole his ideas from the Travelling Wilburys.
posted by eustacescrubb at 4:35 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by eustacescrubb at 4:35 PM on August 5, 2005
The real shame about the Coldplay video is that Martin wasn't happy with his backwards singing on the video for "The Scientist," and tried to shoot in slow-motion for this one. I'm surprised they have so much money to spend on a video and settled for the crappy lip-synching that they did.
posted by kyleg at 4:44 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by kyleg at 4:44 PM on August 5, 2005
Saellys: Thanks.
Fenriq: I don't care if you like me or not. And if you want to engage in masturbation by keyboard and tell everybody who you think sucks and who you think doesn't when nobody asked you to begin with, then that's cool. Maybe you don't realize that people who dig U2, Coldplay, or any other band aren't going to be swayed by your criticism and your comment is just needless noise. Maybe you do realize it and you don't care - again, that's fine. Comment as you wish.
I'm not being self-righteous or pretentious - and I'm not speaking for the community. The fact is that nobody asked what you thought of the bands in question.
You and I aren't that different, actually. It's just that you're saying that these bands suck without anyone asking you, and I'm saying that you're comment sucks without anyone asking me. ;-)
posted by 27 at 4:51 PM on August 5, 2005
Fenriq: I don't care if you like me or not. And if you want to engage in masturbation by keyboard and tell everybody who you think sucks and who you think doesn't when nobody asked you to begin with, then that's cool. Maybe you don't realize that people who dig U2, Coldplay, or any other band aren't going to be swayed by your criticism and your comment is just needless noise. Maybe you do realize it and you don't care - again, that's fine. Comment as you wish.
I'm not being self-righteous or pretentious - and I'm not speaking for the community. The fact is that nobody asked what you thought of the bands in question.
You and I aren't that different, actually. It's just that you're saying that these bands suck without anyone asking you, and I'm saying that you're comment sucks without anyone asking me. ;-)
posted by 27 at 4:51 PM on August 5, 2005
Yeah, but one's about the thread and one's about me. Which one's more of a derail?
posted by fenriq at 4:55 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by fenriq at 4:55 PM on August 5, 2005
That's easy. Yours is.
It's not "about the thread", it's barely on-topic opinion meant to do nothing make people pick sides, get fired up, and NOT talk about the thread's topic (a ripped off topic). All I did was call you on it.
posted by 27 at 5:02 PM on August 5, 2005
It's not "about the thread", it's barely on-topic opinion meant to do nothing make people pick sides, get fired up, and NOT talk about the thread's topic (a ripped off topic). All I did was call you on it.
posted by 27 at 5:02 PM on August 5, 2005
its weird how, like, the more you know about music the less you like bands that make shit-buckets of money.
posted by hatchetjack at 5:34 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by hatchetjack at 5:34 PM on August 5, 2005
I liked Coldplay's previous albums pretty well, and I saw them live at a festival a few years ago. They're surprisingly good live. I gave a listen to their new album and was astoundingly unimpressed. U2 has some good stuff but I never really got "into" them. The stuff that both bands will make from this point will be like water.
posted by zardoz at 7:29 PM on August 5, 2005
posted by zardoz at 7:29 PM on August 5, 2005
I'd say posting the thread is sort of a tacit askance of opinion about either of the bands being mentioned. Bringing up the subject brings up the subject, it doesn't necessarily direct the course of the dialogue that follows.
To which, I'll say, I watched the middle video and I don't know who they're mimicking but it was bad. Bad, bad, bad.
posted by fenriq at 8:20 PM on August 5, 2005
To which, I'll say, I watched the middle video and I don't know who they're mimicking but it was bad. Bad, bad, bad.
posted by fenriq at 8:20 PM on August 5, 2005
its weird how, like, the more you know about music the less you like bands that make shit-buckets of money.
Not in all cases. And mostly recently. The Beatles made lots of money. But Beethoven never did. He got pretty famous though. But Bach didn't really. He was totally indie. So there.
posted by ludwig_van at 8:55 PM on August 5, 2005
Not in all cases. And mostly recently. The Beatles made lots of money. But Beethoven never did. He got pretty famous though. But Bach didn't really. He was totally indie. So there.
posted by ludwig_van at 8:55 PM on August 5, 2005
except for that Lionel Richie album where he's wearing sweater on the cover.
"Middle of the road, man it stank! Let's run over Lionel Richie with a tank!"
posted by straight at 9:08 PM on August 5, 2005
"Middle of the road, man it stank! Let's run over Lionel Richie with a tank!"
posted by straight at 9:08 PM on August 5, 2005
Middle of the road, man it stank! Let's run over Lionel Richie with a tank!"Ah! Billy And The Boingers.... best. fictional. band. ever.
posted by adactio at 5:36 AM on August 6, 2005
But Bach didn't really. He was totally indie. So there.
Dude, Bach had a patron. He was a total sellout, he just sucked at selling out.
posted by kenko at 9:03 AM on August 6, 2005
Dude, Bach had a patron. He was a total sellout, he just sucked at selling out.
posted by kenko at 9:03 AM on August 6, 2005
Mother of all that is holy, that has got to be the worst big-budget video ever made of the most insipid song. The best you can is not good enough in this case, Mr. Martin.
posted by jokeefe at 11:11 AM on August 6, 2005
posted by jokeefe at 11:11 AM on August 6, 2005
can someone please resolve this debate for me?
less annoying: fingernails on chalkboard or Chris Martin's falsetto?
posted by tu11ym0n at 11:46 AM on August 6, 2005
less annoying: fingernails on chalkboard or Chris Martin's falsetto?
posted by tu11ym0n at 11:46 AM on August 6, 2005
Dude, Bach had a patron. He was a total sellout, he just sucked at selling out.
Bach also had the Catholic Church, the biggest corporation of the day, sort of like the 17th century European Microsoft.
If MS could take you court for not buying its products, or burn you at the stake for using Linux, or torture you for saying bad things about Windows, or compel you to hand over ten percent of all you earned to their vastly swollen coffers and hugely wealthyCEO Pope.
Hmmmm.
posted by jokeefe at 12:35 PM on August 6, 2005
Bach also had the Catholic Church, the biggest corporation of the day, sort of like the 17th century European Microsoft.
If MS could take you court for not buying its products, or burn you at the stake for using Linux, or torture you for saying bad things about Windows, or compel you to hand over ten percent of all you earned to their vastly swollen coffers and hugely wealthy
Hmmmm.
posted by jokeefe at 12:35 PM on August 6, 2005
The thing that bugs me about all these "X band sucks" comments is that they're totally lacking in substance. Tell me why you think they suck. Talk about the music.
Am I the only person here who likes Coldplay?
posted by flotson at 10:05 PM on August 6, 2005
Am I the only person here who likes Coldplay?
posted by flotson at 10:05 PM on August 6, 2005
I'm sure you're not.
Coldplay suck because they've become very soft and easy with a very self-conscious and contrived vibe, especially with the lyrics, which are truly horrible (notice the lyrics on that song or any other on the album and you'll see).
posted by abcde at 8:43 AM on August 7, 2005
Coldplay suck because they've become very soft and easy with a very self-conscious and contrived vibe, especially with the lyrics, which are truly horrible (notice the lyrics on that song or any other on the album and you'll see).
posted by abcde at 8:43 AM on August 7, 2005
I find the words sincere, and the melodies very pretty.
posted by flotson at 9:14 AM on August 19, 2005
posted by flotson at 9:14 AM on August 19, 2005
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posted by null terminated at 1:08 PM on August 5, 2005