Béla Fleck and the Flecktones

January 18, 2008 11:03 PM

Béla Fleck and the Flecktones. He plays the banjo, but he isn't just some hick. He enjoys Chicks, jamming with friends, wide open spaces and fights.
posted by stavrogin (70 comments total)

Bela Fleck is great at the banjo and a totally sweet musician. I'm surprised to see this posted but I like it.
posted by psmith at 11:07 PM on January 18, 2008

I always thought that Fleck and Wooten were excellent musicians who... chose to play boring, weak, quasi-jammy music.

If you have any appreciation for jazz or bluegrass whatsoever, I suggest you give Tales from the Acoustic Planet a listen. It's got The Flecktones plus a gaggle of other fantastic musicians in supporting roles. All acoustic* (including Futureman) its' one of my favorite albums.

*Victor Wooten plays a bit of electric bass, but not as electric as he can sometimes get.
posted by lekvar at 11:29 PM on January 18, 2008

Also, with respect to your last link, I am not into DMB music but I lived in Charlottesville for a couple of years in grad school and three times ran into a DMB member while wearing a Master of Puppets shirt (which is bizarre because, no, I didn't wear it every day). Each time I got an approving smile and nod.

I have no idea what to make of that, but there it is. At least they knew there were good sandwiches to be had at that gas station/deli-type-thing.
posted by psmith at 11:29 PM on January 18, 2008

To be fair, there's no suggestion in lekvar's comment that the two styles meet mid-song or in a way similar to a "sushi milkshake". I can't recall the album right now but the "or" in lekvar's comment doesn't imply weird co-mingling. (Weird co-mingling might be awesome; I express or imply no comment as to that.)
posted by psmith at 11:40 PM on January 18, 2008

Fleck is certainly a fine player and by all accounts a really sweet guy. He gets a great sound. Personally, though, a lot of his aesthetic/stylistic choices leave me, well, not cold exactly, but... I guess when it comes to the banjo, I gotta say I prefer what the hicks* do with it. Hicks like this fellow, or this fellow, or this fellow. This is a fine post, though**, for those who dig what Béla does!

*To employ the terminology of the OP...

**Except for the "some hick" bit, which comes off as rather elitist and condescending...
posted by flapjax at midnite at 11:48 PM on January 18, 2008 [3 favorites]

Metafilter: Weird co-mingling might be awesome
posted by flapjax at midnite at 11:49 PM on January 18, 2008

chose to play boring, weak, quasi-jammy music.

One of your top 10 favorite bands sucks, too. Though, to be fair, you have to see them live to really appreciate them.
posted by pmbuko at 11:54 PM on January 18, 2008

Great great players, although I'm not really all that on the music, which for mine doesn't have enough, ah, blues in it. Or do I mean grease? Terrific fun live though, real barn-storming stuff.
posted by Wolof at 12:01 AM on January 19, 2008

**Except for the "some hick" bit, which comes off as rather elitist and condescending...

I didn't want to post any comments in my own thread, but I should clarify that my parents, grandparents and all sorts otherwise are from the hick ass eastern parts of Tennnesee and that I dearly love my memories of Dollywood. The "some" and "hicks" links were presented to showcase something about Mr. Fleck.
posted by stavrogin at 12:03 AM on January 19, 2008

Dry Branch Fire Squad.

Also, Winterhawk in New England before they messed everything up.

I hear what you're saying flapjax, but Bela is 75% of the Sonny Rollins of the banjo. With a little more development in the direction you'd desire he could get there and he's still young.
posted by psmith at 12:18 AM on January 19, 2008

jazz and bluegrass

I was always under the understanding that bluegrass arose out of Bill Monroe's background in mountain and gospel musics and appreciation of the melodic improvisation and soloing found in jazz. Which is to say that bluegrass wouldn't really exist without jazz. But who knows, maybe the two were just sorta contemporaneous -- can someone edify me on the connection, perceived or otherwise? The inclusion of Earl Scruggs in The Bluegrass Boys, however, can be directly attributed to Monroe's appreciation of shredding, but that's neither here nor there.
posted by JohnFredra at 12:31 AM on January 19, 2008

My brother-in-law told me about Bella Fleck over christmas and asked me to download some of his stuff and see what I thought. I did. And I thought "well, that's a banjo. Yup."
posted by puke & cry at 12:33 AM on January 19, 2008

Perhaps you should check out Perpetual Motion as well.
posted by absalom at 12:35 AM on January 19, 2008

I've seen Bela Fleck live, and clearly he's a skilled musician and all, but I just can't get all that excited about Bela Fleck right now, after watching a set of this gentleman doing things with a banjo.
posted by louche mustachio at 12:39 AM on January 19, 2008 [2 favorites]

The "some" and "hicks" links were presented to showcase something about Mr. Fleck.

Yeah, I reckon I got that. I mean, you meant to say that Fleck is, well, not "some hick", right? In other words, not like most other folks one could point to that play the banjo, right? Those folks would generally fall into the category of "some hick", right? I'm not sure how else to read it. But it's no big deal, really, and I certainly don't think this is a horse worth flogging. Please note, I was careful to say (in small print!) that that part of your FPP *comes off as* elitist, as opposed to accusing you directly of elitism or calling you an elitist. I don't imagine you are an elitist. See you at Dollywood! :)
posted by flapjax at midnite at 12:39 AM on January 19, 2008

Hey, absalom, you've linked to Metzger! Isn't he great? A very original, unique and musical voice on the banjo. Prepared banjo, even! Here's his MySpace page. I just discovered him a few months back and I was pretty knocked out by some of his stuff.
posted by flapjax at midnite at 12:44 AM on January 19, 2008

Woops. It was louche mustachio who linked to Metzger. Sorry.
posted by flapjax at midnite at 12:45 AM on January 19, 2008

Ugh! I think the point is is that the banjo is an instrument that can be used without regard to its stereotype. It can be used to play many different types of music. Bela Fleck likes to play different types of music on the banjo. I like that! You needn't be so sensitive! It's not like we're running in a primary, for God's sake.
posted by stavrogin at 12:53 AM on January 19, 2008

flapjax at midnight. Wrong on banjo players. And wrong for America.
posted by abcde at 1:43 AM on January 19, 2008

Who's this flapjax at midnight you're referring to?

I agree, though, he sounds dangerous... some kind of tax-and-spend type, no doubt.
posted by flapjax at midnite at 1:51 AM on January 19, 2008

You know, though, besides the fact that he is an excellent banjo player, I have great admiration for the fact that his is a band that has black guys in it. I mean, it sounds kind of stupid to have to mention it, but when you consider how, to this day, there are still so very few "multi-racial" bands in existence, well, it's worth pointing out, I think, and celebrating. I wish it weren't so remarkable, but it is, and good on Béla Fleck for it!
posted by flapjax at midnite at 1:58 AM on January 19, 2008

I've always loved Bela Fleck and never had an issue with their unusual style.

But the thing is if you are from Charlottesville every band you hear is fusion-folk: folk/jazz, folk/rock, rock/folk, jazz/folk, folk/punk, etc. Mark Rock, who plays rock cello comes to mind, as does BC which doesn't have much of a folky feel but features an acoustic guitar and cello.

Once in the heady days of Napster, I came across the song "A Shu Dekio" [which was Bela Fleck plus a throatsinger] which was directly responsible for me deciding to jump on a plane, fly to Moscow, take a train for four days and then a tiny car 6 hours to drive to Kyzyl, the capital of Tuva, the home of throatsinging in general and Kongar ol Ondar (the throatsinger featured in the song). I was lucky enough to actually meet him. I have a picture of us standing side by side, both holding the traditional Tuvan fiddle. Tuvans are awesomely friendly and I highly recommend going there if you have a couple of weeks to kill. Don't make the mistake I made, though -- don't go to the Tuvan throatsinging center on the last day---go there as soon as you get in.


The indirect results of all this was meeting my last ex-girlfriend, thus visiting London, thus deciding to study in London, getting my Masters, taking Arabic on the side, and so deciding to spend this year in Egypt. Another wonderful indirect result was meeting my current girlfriend, who I've been with for nearly 3 years now and who I will probably eventually marry.

Never underestimate the power of music.
posted by Deathalicious at 2:07 AM on January 19, 2008 [4 favorites]

flapjax: Damn it, I even thought to myself "I did spell that 'midnite,' right?" but didn't check for some reason. Takes the sting out of my ad hominem propaganda a little bit.
posted by abcde at 2:38 AM on January 19, 2008

Bela, if you're reading this, please do not let Futureman sing. Terrible, that.
posted by toastchee at 3:33 AM on January 19, 2008

Thirding the meh opinions here. I love bluegrass, like jazz OK, and country is my main thing and has been for 20+ years.

While (as a musician) I appreciate Fleck's enormous talent, his music leaves me utterly stone-cold bored most of the time. That's true of lots of musicians in lots of styles, but I *want* to like what he does and I do like his source traditions a great deal, so it's more frustrating.

I'm not saying "your favorite music sucks," and I have a lot of musician friends who dig Bela's thing. I'm sure it's me, but there are a surprising number of people who feel this way about Bela's trip, as evidenced by this thread. After a while, it all sounds pretty much the same to me, and too clever by half but not very feelingful. I can't put my finger on it, but sometimes (as in a lot of jazz, actually) there is an emphasis on virtuosity for its own sake, and that does little for me.

Still, I appreciate the post and learned some cool stuff about Bela's operation from it, so thanks.
posted by fourcheesemac at 4:51 AM on January 19, 2008

Also, I likes me "some hicks" just fine. I once knew a very wealthy scion of Nashville high society (the Athens of the South crowd) who crowed to me how she had become a patroness of "country music" and joined the little people of Nashville (I was a professional country musician at the time, and in Nashville fairly regularly). She wouldn't have known George Jones from George Morgan, but she had been approached by a friend who was seeking investors in a new country music project.

This woman had donated 10K to Bela Fleck's band project after being pitched by a friend that this was country music someone who liked classical music could enjoy. I kid you not. He has patrons. Or he did.
posted by fourcheesemac at 4:54 AM on January 19, 2008

(and my "hick" country music friends found that the most amusing thing they had ever heard about Nashville's class divide)
posted by fourcheesemac at 4:55 AM on January 19, 2008

flapjax, check out Muzik Mafia.
posted by fourcheesemac at 4:56 AM on January 19, 2008

Huh. I heard so much about Bela Fleck when I lived back in Houston that I had always assumed he was a local musician. This is the first time I hear him, though, and I concur with some of the folks above: doesn't do anything for me. I'm not saying it's bad (taste is subjective), I just don't like it much. Still, this is a great post, as I've finally heard music by this guy I've heard so much about, AND found out that Steve Martin doesn't just play the banjo, he plays the banjo, and been introduced to Metzger, who I really dug.

Also, what kind of genre/playing style do you call what his saxophonist does? I have a hard time explaining to people what sounds/genres I do and don't like unless I know the genre in depth. I like some jazz and hate some jazz, but I'm not a jazz guy, so I don't know the subgenres to help me explain myself. That saxophonist's composition is pretty much exactly the jazz I hate. What's it called?
posted by Bugbread at 5:38 AM on January 19, 2008

JohnFredra, it's more complicated than that. Jazz had been influencing southern working-class musics (and "country") more generally since the beginning. Jimmie Rodgers recorded with Louis Armstrong and certainly admired Mamie Smith, among other blues singers. Milton Brown and Bob Dunn were electrifying guitars and adding hot solos on horns, fiddles, and the new electric steel guitar by the 1930s. Monroe undoubtedly was familiar with the jazz influence on country styles by the time his sound started to coalesce, and the emphasis on soloing is certainly a jazz influence, but likely mediated through other country music sources. One thing is for certain, though: bluegrass is *urban* music that refers -- nostalgically, ironically, and genuinely -- to "folk" styles familiar to the urban audiences (made up hugely of Appalachian migrants) Monroe and the Stanleys were courting in the industrial cities of Ohio and the broader midwest and mid-Atlantic region. Separating the histories of "jazz" and "country" styles in the 20th century is an exercise in futility. In a fundamental sense, what Fleck is doing is evolutionary, not revolutionary (and I don't think he'd see it any other way). Though of course, "jazz" itself has become many, many different things these days.

I find the country/hip-hop fusions we're now hearing so much of more interesting on many levels. But there have been hot jazz soloists playing country music since the 1930s.
posted by fourcheesemac at 6:02 AM on January 19, 2008 [1 favorite]

He's still around? interesting....

As for his sound, it always seemed just a little too pretty. I like a little more edge. He's still fun and is nice to see him here on MeFi.
posted by caddis at 6:12 AM on January 19, 2008

an emphasis on virtuosity for its own sake

I think fourcheesemac pinpointed the root cause of the problem. Fleck reminds me of a lot of the Leo Kottke/Michael Hedges disciples on acoustic steel-string guitar who pull off the speed and technique but ultimately leave you flat.
posted by umbú at 6:16 AM on January 19, 2008

Also, Charlie Parker always said his favorite music to listen to was country, and he drove his band mates crazy with it.

Bob Marley too.
posted by fourcheesemac at 6:22 AM on January 19, 2008

Because, I meant to say above, inarguably, jazz was a southern, working-class music for a good part of the 20th century.
posted by fourcheesemac at 6:25 AM on January 19, 2008

Good stuff! I've heard of Bela Fleck for years, but never heard him. Then I inherited a CD (Flight Of The Cosmic Hippo) from my brother, and really liked it. I guess I'm not "educated" enough, music-wise, to get behind all the hate and "Bela's not as good as X". I probably couldn't tell the difference between "true jazz" and "jazz bluegrass fusion". But I like it. Thanks, tavrogin.

Also, now I now what else to play during Game Night tonight...
posted by ObscureReferenceMan at 6:30 AM on January 19, 2008

Speaking on behalf of hicks everywhere, let me be the first to suggest that you go fuck yourself.
posted by chuckdarwin at 6:44 AM on January 19, 2008

I understand people who are less than amazed by Bela Fleck. I agree with Wolof that the Flecktones need a little more grease, or dirt, or whatever you call it. The first time I saw him was with the flecktones and my favorite part was futureman's drumatar. the second time was a traditional solo show at merlefest, WOW. He was also the banjo player for their all star house band of the weekend. He was by far the best banjo player there, including Earl. So not only is he the multi-genre Miles Davis like frontier explorer, but he is currently the best banjo player in traditional stylee. At least to my ear.
posted by MNDZ at 6:45 AM on January 19, 2008

Also, Charlie Parker always said his favorite music to listen to was country, and he drove his band mates crazy with it.

Bob Marley too.

I spent about 6 months in Benin City Nigeria back in 1980, and country music (from the US) was very popular there at that time. Used to hear it blaring out of loudspeakers in front of record (cassette) stores pretty much every day.
posted by flapjax at midnite at 7:04 AM on January 19, 2008

Dangit, dangit, dangit...I really wanted to see Bela fight, so I visited the last link. I tried, I really did, but that violinist is SO FREAKING BAD. How in god's name do you get away with playing your most popular song (Ants Marching) so screechingly-earraping out of tune??? No, Boyd Tinsley, your admittedly-rippling muscles do not distract me that much.

So...does Bela Fleck kick his arse? Goodness, I hope so. If that's the case, I'll go back and watch it with the sound off.
posted by nosila at 7:58 AM on January 19, 2008

Goddamn I loves me some music argument comment threads between smart people. The youtube comment thread in the last link was strangely identical, but between dumb people.
posted by M.C. Lo-Carb! at 8:38 AM on January 19, 2008

Huh. I just assumed that violin was supposed to sound like that. Too much listening to avant garde stuff has killed my ability to differentiate between "dissonant because it's supposed to be" and "accidentally dissonant".
posted by Bugbread at 8:55 AM on January 19, 2008

Here's the tune that got me into Bela Fleck and the Flecktones. Surprised that I didn't see it mentioned here so far.
posted by milnak at 9:05 AM on January 19, 2008

I guess I'm not "educated" enough, music-wise, to get behind all the hate and "Bela's not as good as X".

I'm really not seeing much hate in this thread, I think it's been a good discussion so far.
posted by oneirodynia at 9:12 AM on January 19, 2008

I saw the Flecktones about 12 times in 3-4 years about 10 years ago before being driven a bit cold by Victor Wooten's playing (this, coming from a bass player). I still go see Bela play with others, especially Edgar Meyer, whenever I can. The coolest thing I saw Bela do with the Flecktones was during a show encore. He was playing the electric banjo with the synth pickup, and switched on the synth. It seemed that each string was set to a random patch, and Bela had to figure out what the sounds were and make something musical out of it super quick, which he did. I like that he, like Yo Yo Ma, throws himself into many different musical situations when he could easily coast on the reputation he's built so far. I'd recommend checking out Music For Two, an album he did with Edgar Meyer. The included DVD has a brief documentary of their tour which includes them rehearsing frantically on a wickedly difficult piece that Edgar wrote (a round in 15/8). They rehearse before shows, during intermission, and after shows. It's clear that some things don't come easy to Bela, but that doesn't stop him. That alone makes him influential to me.
posted by dr. fresh at 9:24 AM on January 19, 2008

Other people's opinions suck.
posted by Area Control at 9:26 AM on January 19, 2008

i like bela fleck, and i like bela's music. i had the pleasure of meeting him once, and he's the most down-to-earth guy you could ever hope to have a chat with. happy as can be to be doing what he's doing and getting paid for it. on another occasion i met victor wooten, and he's a nice guy, too. i was a little surprised that such larger-than-life (to me) musicians barely clear 5'6".

and is that howard levy playing keys on milnak's link? howard was hooked up with the early flecktones and left to make his fortune elsewhere. he's pretty much a force in his own right.

i think the thing about bela and the musicians he works with is that they're not content to ... color within the lines, if you will. banjo players play bluegrass, right? harp players blow the blues, right? bass is a supporting instrument, naturally. but these guys built a name for themselves in the traditional genres, and then started stretching it. they might not always be the best or the most innovative, but they've certainly helped bring banjo jazz and harmonica tribal to a much larger audience than it would have reached otherwise.
posted by msconduct at 9:39 AM on January 19, 2008

Yeah, I wanna emphasize that there's no hating going on here. I admire Bela's playing a lot. It's his music I find boring, and de gustibus non disputandans est.

flapjax, right on. Country is huge in Africa, though less so than it was in 1980. There are black country traditions in Zimbabwe and South Africa especially, but also in Nigeria, Cameroon, etc. And certain American artists -- most especially the deep-voiced male baritone singers, like Jim Reeves and Don Williams, or high, sparrow-voiced women singers (Dolly Parton most of all) have had huge followings in Africa and have toured and recorded there.

All fitting then, in light of the known African origins of the modern banjo.
posted by fourcheesemac at 9:42 AM on January 19, 2008

This is me, not shitting in the Bela Fleck thread.
posted by BitterOldPunk at 10:31 AM on January 19, 2008 [2 favorites]

I'm really not seeing much hate in this thread, I think it's been a good discussion so far.

Sorry. I guess "hate" was a bad word. I'm just thankful for the FPP.
posted by ObscureReferenceMan at 10:51 AM on January 19, 2008

Heard Bela live with the New Grass Revival shortly before their demise and with Edgar Meyer. Wonderful experiences both were, he said in Yodish.

Another favorite is an episode of BET's Studio Jams in which Bela interacts with my idol, Pat Martino. Worth tracking down. Bela also wrote liner notes for Pat's wonderful CD, Think Tank.

All in all I'd say BF is a master musical chef who prefers gumbo to meringue.
posted by aiq at 11:43 AM on January 19, 2008

psmith: Also, with respect to your last link, I am not into DMB music but I lived in Charlottesville for a couple of years in grad school and three times ran into a DMB member while wearing a Master of Puppets shirt (which is bizarre because, no, I didn't wear it every day). Each time I got an approving smile and nod.

I have no idea what to make of that, but there it is. At least they knew there were good sandwiches to be had at that gas station/deli-type-thing.

bela has played on several DMB albums. they've toured together, both bela with DMB and just the 2 of them (or with one other guitarist). bela's work on "under the table and dreaming" is one of the reasons i (used to) like DMB. (i think things went downhill after that record).

DMB fans are pretty frickin' serious about their music. so, it makes perfect sense to me that they would recognize your tshirt and give you a knowing nod.

for all his pop superstardom, dave matthews actually has a keen ear for talented musicians and how they can contribute to DM's music in unusual ways.
posted by CitizenD at 12:53 PM on January 19, 2008

I don't hate him either. I don't like his music, but that doesn't mean I think it's bad. If it helps make sense of that, I don't like brussel sprouts, but I don't think they're bad, either. They just don't fit my tastes. Same with Bela Fleck: probably good music (I dunno) that I don't like.
posted by Bugbread at 1:20 PM on January 19, 2008

fyi, he fuckin sucked at bonnaroo
posted by synaesthetichaze at 2:35 PM on January 19, 2008

Bela Fleck is the bane of this banjo player's life. Every freakin' bakehead in SF says, "You play the banjo? You must love Bela Fleck!"
I don't. I think he can play the shit out of a banjo, but to me he's stiff and - well, let's just say that we have very different tastes in music. I like him best when he's playing anything but jazz. His classical album is beautiful, except for the perverse choice to include God Save The Queen - no, not that one - the one that sounds like My Country Tis of Thee to American ears.
He did an album called Tabula Rasa with a Chinese erh-hu player and an Indian mohan-vina player that's easily my favorite thing I've heard him do.
I very briefly crossed paths with him backstage at a festival this summer - he seemed like a genuinely nice guy.

The best banjo player currently breathing air is Danny Barnes.
posted by smartyboots at 3:17 PM on January 19, 2008

I've seen Bela play several times over the years, I was a New Grass Revival fan as a teenager, and got to say hi on a few occasions and such. The best story though comes from my father, who went with my stepmom to see Bela at the old Cockeyed Camel (I believe) in Nashville, which dates this somewhat- mid to late 80's, prior to Flecktones recordings. They got to the venue early, went to sit at a good table, and noticed a bottle of beer and a book aon one side of it. After a few minutes no one came back, so Pops sat down, and being curious, flipped to the cover and saw it was what appeared to be a calculus textbook of some sort. Time went on, no one claimed the book, until about 20 minutes before showtime, when Bela pops up, says 'I forgot where I left that', collects his math book, chats for a few minutes, and disappears backstage. To me that explains a lot about the man, he's friendly, but still reads math texts for fun.

this was also one of the earliest shows with Victor and Roy, and Dad tried to explain the drumitar, which at the time had a bundle of cables the size of a large rope coming out of it. It sounded crazy, and still does, but I've always liked it.
posted by pupdog at 3:32 PM on January 19, 2008

I love Bela, but he's not even close to being my favorite banjo player.

The same thing happens to many musicians who really nail down the technical aspects of playing-and become famous for that. They eventually begin to express, "Hey, look what I can do.", instead of, "Oh, shit, my heart is broken." or whatever feelings/emotions drive the tune.

Regarding jazz banjo, I think it's supposed to go something more like this.

*posted by a not easily offended banja-playin' Hick/Gentleman Farmer*
posted by snsranch at 4:19 PM on January 19, 2008

I forgot to say; a big, how de do, to flapjax. I do concur Sir.
posted by snsranch at 4:21 PM on January 19, 2008

Old Duke Davis has a BIG BANJO. Yessiree, 'at's a biggun! He needs more work on that spinning trick though...
posted by flapjax at midnite at 5:04 PM on January 19, 2008

Same BIG BANJO clip here, but followed by ANOTHER BIG BANJO! Then a banjo duo that brings "stiff" to a whole new level. And then some buck dancers, just for good measure...
posted by flapjax at midnite at 5:09 PM on January 19, 2008

Danny Barnes totally tears it up, smartyboots. Once heard him do an awesome BG version of "Dark Side of the Moon."

You know who else plays his ass off, old style? Ricky Skaggs.
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:22 PM on January 19, 2008

But where is Uncle Dave Macon when you really need him to show what the banjo is capable of?
posted by fourcheesemac at 5:22 PM on January 19, 2008

Ha, that was awesome. Did ya see the cloggin'/stompin' at the very end of the last link? Great stuff.
posted by snsranch at 5:26 PM on January 19, 2008

The Flecktones have been my favorite band for years now. Cool to see them on Metafilter!
posted by danb at 7:13 PM on January 19, 2008

Also:

bela's work on "under the table and dreaming" is one of the reasons i (used to) like DMB. (i think things went downhill after that record).

For what it's worth, Béla isn't on that album -- you're thinking of Before These Crowded Streets.
posted by danb at 7:16 PM on January 19, 2008

I saw him in Beijing as a member of what may be the only Mandarin-singing bluegrass band at this show.
posted by saysthis at 7:52 PM on January 19, 2008

"Also, Winterhawk in New England"

Bela will be with us again, this summer...though it's now called Grey Fox.
Actually, we'll be at a different place in 2008, but with the same GREAT eclectic lineup of music and magic that only happens at our festival
posted by GreyFoxVT at 4:20 AM on January 20, 2008

No big surprise here, but I have it on good authority (my gf and his interior designer) that he smokes a lot of herb.

BTW, Winterhawk rule.
posted by bloodniece at 9:37 AM on January 20, 2008

herb and calculus not mutually exclusive! defeat stoner stereotypes!
posted by aiq at 2:43 PM on January 20, 2008

...?

I thought "herb and calculus" was a stoner stereotype.
posted by Bugbread at 3:48 PM on January 20, 2008

No, Herb and Calculus were one of the (much) lesser known Motown teamups
posted by pupdog at 8:56 PM on January 20, 2008