Sober Nation
June 7, 2024 5:10 AM Subscribe
Why it's never been cooler (or easier) to go alcohol-free
CW: Just do what I did and ignore anything from Andrew Huberman's podcast mentioned ever so briefly in the article.
Also, I am one of many MeFites in alcohol recovery so be kind.
CW: Just do what I did and ignore anything from Andrew Huberman's podcast mentioned ever so briefly in the article.
Also, I am one of many MeFites in alcohol recovery so be kind.
I'm about a year and a half into my new regimen of mostly not-drinking. It's going well. I tend to chafe at hard rules, so I still have a drink here and there on special occasions, but even on those I find myself not wanting to drink nearly as much as I used to.
Interestingly, the thing that helped me transition away from habitual beer drinking has been those unsweetened fruit soda drinks. I find that they nicely occupy the beer-shaped niche in terms of oral fixation.
posted by mrjohnmuller at 5:19 AM on June 7 [7 favorites]
Interestingly, the thing that helped me transition away from habitual beer drinking has been those unsweetened fruit soda drinks. I find that they nicely occupy the beer-shaped niche in terms of oral fixation.
posted by mrjohnmuller at 5:19 AM on June 7 [7 favorites]
My non-alc go-to is always seltzer/club soda but I do love having a mocktail option when I go out to dinner! It makes me feel fancy. And I deeply appreciate that restaurants and bars (I still have trouble going to bars so this is a me issue there) are offering more non-alc options for patrons.
posted by Kitteh at 5:21 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
posted by Kitteh at 5:21 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
I'm enjoying alcohol free beers but did not like the sobour bourbon-analogue. Anyone got any recommendations for a zero Old Fashioned with a bit of a bite?
posted by aesop at 5:38 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
posted by aesop at 5:38 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
I have been alcohol free for 12 years for a variety of personal reasons. For the first half I didn't drink any NA beer as I assumed it was all O'Doul's-level quality. Then I got introduced to a couple great craft brands including Athletic Brewing Company which I have gladly knocked back after road races. These craft brands are really, really good, and if even you still drink they're very sensible alternatives if you want to avoid hangovers / have to drive.
I tried the official nonalcoholic Guinness stout for the first time last week. I do miss having a Guinness from time to time so very happy there is now an NA alternative that is (mostly) decent.
posted by fortitude25 at 5:41 AM on June 7 [14 favorites]
I tried the official nonalcoholic Guinness stout for the first time last week. I do miss having a Guinness from time to time so very happy there is now an NA alternative that is (mostly) decent.
posted by fortitude25 at 5:41 AM on June 7 [14 favorites]
As someone who is drinking less fit health reasons, I've tried a number of them. My reaction is that the hard alcohol substitutes area mixed bag. They don't really taste like what they're replacing, but some of them do have interesting flavors and make excellent mocktails.
Alcohol free wines are mostly terrible. A few lighter white are passable, but not the reds.
Beer is where the industry really gets close. Guinness Zero is surprisingly like the real thing, Heineken 0.0 is also great if you like that style.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 5:42 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Alcohol free wines are mostly terrible. A few lighter white are passable, but not the reds.
Beer is where the industry really gets close. Guinness Zero is surprisingly like the real thing, Heineken 0.0 is also great if you like that style.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 5:42 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
5.5 years dry here. Nearly dead at age 48! Anyway, I tend to reject these faux cocktails because of price. I'm at the point where I have zero problem avoiding booze, which is pricey. So why do I need to add a $12 drink to my dinner tab? I'm fine with fizzy water. Or just water or iced tea.
posted by SoberHighland at 5:42 AM on June 7 [14 favorites]
posted by SoberHighland at 5:42 AM on June 7 [14 favorites]
I used to drink, not heavily, but regularly. I even enrolled in bartending school and learned some mixology. But then I had to lay off the stuff for a period for medical reasons, and I just...never started again. Now I'll have maybe a beer if I'm at a brewery and they have an interesting sour, but I don't keep it in the house anymore. I can't say it's improved my health, and it certainly hasn't made me any happier, but it's saved me a little bit of money.
posted by Faint of Butt at 5:44 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
posted by Faint of Butt at 5:44 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Count me in the 'don't drink' category. My go-to line is, "I used to drink, but I didn't do it well, so I stopped." It gets a curious look from people who haven't been there and a knowing, compassionate smile from those who do.
I lived in the (U.S.) Pacific Northwest in the early 90s, and because of the high rate of people in recovery, there were a couple of used bookstores that stayed open until midnight on Friday and Saturday nights. You could bring your coffee in, browse and read, and generally socialize. It seemed like such a no-brainer to me: any place that turns itself into a Public House on weekends for the crowds that don't like alcohol-culture establishments quickly builds a loyal clientele. I wish more places would consider doing it.
posted by Silvery Fish at 5:45 AM on June 7 [28 favorites]
I lived in the (U.S.) Pacific Northwest in the early 90s, and because of the high rate of people in recovery, there were a couple of used bookstores that stayed open until midnight on Friday and Saturday nights. You could bring your coffee in, browse and read, and generally socialize. It seemed like such a no-brainer to me: any place that turns itself into a Public House on weekends for the crowds that don't like alcohol-culture establishments quickly builds a loyal clientele. I wish more places would consider doing it.
posted by Silvery Fish at 5:45 AM on June 7 [28 favorites]
To me the question is how are hangouts funded without alcohol? Most pubs don't have an income stream without booze sales. Maybe this explains the rise of food courts and axe throwing. In some areas there are coffee shops that stay open at night, but where I am currently, not so much.
As a recovering boozer I avoid "nonalcoholic" drinks. Why tease the beast?
posted by Ansible at 5:48 AM on June 7 [9 favorites]
As a recovering boozer I avoid "nonalcoholic" drinks. Why tease the beast?
posted by Ansible at 5:48 AM on June 7 [9 favorites]
I never really did drink very much; I've learned that I'm a bit of a lightweight, but I also never got over that childhood phase where you think alcohol tastes icky so I usually end up with maybe one drink that I nurse for most of an evening and then switch to something non-alcoholic because "I'm thirsty and I don't want to just sip at something, dammit".
A couple years back I was one of the recipe testers for a line of pre-made craft mocktails. The plan was was that they would be rolled out within a couple years, but COVID and a couple other things threw a wrench into those works; I think that the creators still plan to roll them out in the future, though. The recipes are available, though, and I remember the couple I tested were fairly decent, if a bit ornate. (One recipe I tested walked me through making my own orgeat syrup, and I offered a gentle note that I had no problem with that, but other people might like having the option of buying that ready-made instead.)
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 5:49 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
A couple years back I was one of the recipe testers for a line of pre-made craft mocktails. The plan was was that they would be rolled out within a couple years, but COVID and a couple other things threw a wrench into those works; I think that the creators still plan to roll them out in the future, though. The recipes are available, though, and I remember the couple I tested were fairly decent, if a bit ornate. (One recipe I tested walked me through making my own orgeat syrup, and I offered a gentle note that I had no problem with that, but other people might like having the option of buying that ready-made instead.)
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 5:49 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Oh yeah I love Diet Coke so have an easy choice when I go out. The Bellini was good as my parents drink wine sometimes at dinner and I wanted an alternative to Diet Coke.
posted by ellieBOA at 6:02 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
posted by ellieBOA at 6:02 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
I've been really excited about this trend, especially living in DC which is a very happy hour- and drinking-centric city. I drink alcohol, but I like to do a dry month from time to time and other days I'm just not feeling it; I have a low tolerance. I'm not all that into the zero-proof liquor but there are a lot of creative ways to put fruit juices and simple syrups together that make really pleasant things to drink.
Moreover, though, I have several close friends and family members who don't drink, and in almost all cases it's because they don't like the taste. It used to feel like you had to have some 'reason' for not drinking, like being in recovery, pregnancy or a medical condition, or a religious proscription on drinking, and I think it's been a weight off the shoulders of all of those people to not have to explain themselves and have their preferences treated as completely unremarkable.
posted by capricorn at 6:02 AM on June 7 [5 favorites]
Moreover, though, I have several close friends and family members who don't drink, and in almost all cases it's because they don't like the taste. It used to feel like you had to have some 'reason' for not drinking, like being in recovery, pregnancy or a medical condition, or a religious proscription on drinking, and I think it's been a weight off the shoulders of all of those people to not have to explain themselves and have their preferences treated as completely unremarkable.
posted by capricorn at 6:02 AM on June 7 [5 favorites]
Just because it's relevant and has some links to resources people here might like, here's a link to an AskMe comment I did a few years back. Life is just better, and feels better to me, without alcohol.
posted by Miko at 6:12 AM on June 7 [6 favorites]
posted by Miko at 6:12 AM on June 7 [6 favorites]
I have abstained for a few years at this point, but one thing I really missed was a beer pairing with food. Chili, a good hot dog, or a nice hamburger, grilled chicken, steaks… mmmm!
I saw an article about zero alcohol beers a few months back, and recently gave a few a try - and have been enjoying them. I have always had a bend towards what I referred to as “green” beers - those that come in green bottles - Heineken or Becks. In my opinion, they did very well in capturing the flavor.
Now I can have my food pairings again!
posted by kabong the wiser at 6:15 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
I saw an article about zero alcohol beers a few months back, and recently gave a few a try - and have been enjoying them. I have always had a bend towards what I referred to as “green” beers - those that come in green bottles - Heineken or Becks. In my opinion, they did very well in capturing the flavor.
Now I can have my food pairings again!
posted by kabong the wiser at 6:15 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
I was never a big drinker, and as I got older I felt less and less obligated to drink at events and such. I never really liked who I was when drinking, so why keep going to that well? On special occasions I'll have one, but rarely two. Like, I was at a screening of Blazing Saddles last Tuesday where the theater had a bar available, and I briefly considered that having a little buzz while watching Blazing Saddles might be fun, but then again it didn't sound that fun so I was fine with my popcorn and Mountain Dew.
Also, as someone who genuinely hates the taste of beer, that makes it easier; also even a couple drinks gives me a bad hangover, so the 'plusses' to drinking get smaller and smaller.
I can't even imagine being part of a culture where drinking is a big thing; it seems like the UK and Japan tie drinking to even the most casual of hangouts. Like, going and having several drinks with coworkers (not friend-coworkers) or especially my bosses is almost terrifying, why would I do that?
posted by AzraelBrown at 6:18 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
Also, as someone who genuinely hates the taste of beer, that makes it easier; also even a couple drinks gives me a bad hangover, so the 'plusses' to drinking get smaller and smaller.
I can't even imagine being part of a culture where drinking is a big thing; it seems like the UK and Japan tie drinking to even the most casual of hangouts. Like, going and having several drinks with coworkers (not friend-coworkers) or especially my bosses is almost terrifying, why would I do that?
posted by AzraelBrown at 6:18 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
I would really like to explore mocktails more, but the price stops me. I'm sure it's great for someone's palate, but what if I don't like it? Unlike a real cocktail, it won't deliver the punch anyway; I'll just be thirsty and out $11+. Cranberry, lime, and seltzer may not be exciting, but I can depend on it.
I'm glad this shift is going on. I used to drink too much, although I did not realize that -- or let myself realize it, anyway. My tolerance suddenly fell off in my thirties. Most importantly, I don't enjoy drinking alone at home anymore. There's a moment's lift, and then I get sad and sleepy and feel worse about things, all before the glass is half empty. Still, it would be nice to have something classy to drink of an evening aside from Polar's latest seasonal flavor.
posted by Countess Elena at 6:38 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
I'm glad this shift is going on. I used to drink too much, although I did not realize that -- or let myself realize it, anyway. My tolerance suddenly fell off in my thirties. Most importantly, I don't enjoy drinking alone at home anymore. There's a moment's lift, and then I get sad and sleepy and feel worse about things, all before the glass is half empty. Still, it would be nice to have something classy to drink of an evening aside from Polar's latest seasonal flavor.
posted by Countess Elena at 6:38 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
(addendum: I wonder if the high prices are also to encourage bartenders not to treat them as a waste of time, since they rely on tips)
posted by Countess Elena at 6:39 AM on June 7 [5 favorites]
posted by Countess Elena at 6:39 AM on June 7 [5 favorites]
Sorely tempted to say "I was sober before it was cool," but honestly, keeping out of jail was my main motivation. (Since then, I've reaped any number of personal benefits from sobriety, though.) It's nice to have more NA options, although, like Ansible, I tend to stay away from NA beers because that's dangerously close to putting my finger back on the trigger. I probably wouldn't say no to a Guinness Zero, but I've found that a nice nitro cold brew coffee is a more than adequate substitute for stout.
posted by Halloween Jack at 6:43 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
posted by Halloween Jack at 6:43 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
I am okay with paying $12 for a mocktail if I am out with Shepherd (who also doesn't drink) because it's nice to feel fancy! But then, we don't go out very often.
posted by Kitteh at 6:47 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
posted by Kitteh at 6:47 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
We were at the National Ballet School's annual block party last Saturday and this company called Grüvi was giving out zero alcohol beverages. I guess figuring that the people who can afford to send their kids to a full time ballet school are probably the kind of people who can spend five bucks on a short can of simulated alcoholic beverage. (Correct: the number of upscale like Maserati and Porsche SUVs that pull into the place on weekends is astonishing.)
Anyway I tried the "Dry Red Blend" and it was ... rubs eyes ... it was just wrong. It was made of de-alcoholized red wine plus reisling grape juice concentrate and "flavours." It didn't really taste like wine. It wasn't dry. And it was, here's a new word, slurmy. I don't mind drinking good flavours with alcohol in them, and I don't mind good flavours without achohol, but this was bad like vegetable protein that is trying too hard to be meat is bad. So this is not a recommendation for this product!
Anyway I feel like there is a lot of space occupied by "craft soda makers" that has perhaps been overlooked by this trend, perhaps in an effort to get people to pay $15CAD for a mock that excuses the existence of a bartender? There are some incredible flavours out there, like Ting, and Jones Rootbeer, and actual god damn Mr Pibb.
Just my thoughts, no one's doing anything wrong, bartenders gotta eat too.
posted by seanmpuckett at 6:49 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
Anyway I tried the "Dry Red Blend" and it was ... rubs eyes ... it was just wrong. It was made of de-alcoholized red wine plus reisling grape juice concentrate and "flavours." It didn't really taste like wine. It wasn't dry. And it was, here's a new word, slurmy. I don't mind drinking good flavours with alcohol in them, and I don't mind good flavours without achohol, but this was bad like vegetable protein that is trying too hard to be meat is bad. So this is not a recommendation for this product!
Anyway I feel like there is a lot of space occupied by "craft soda makers" that has perhaps been overlooked by this trend, perhaps in an effort to get people to pay $15CAD for a mock that excuses the existence of a bartender? There are some incredible flavours out there, like Ting, and Jones Rootbeer, and actual god damn Mr Pibb.
Just my thoughts, no one's doing anything wrong, bartenders gotta eat too.
posted by seanmpuckett at 6:49 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
To me the question is how are hangouts funded without alcohol? Most pubs don't have an income stream without booze sales. Maybe this explains the rise of food courts and axe throwing. In some areas there are coffee shops that stay open at night, but where I am currently, not so much.
This is the only reason I buy mocktails. I don't want to lose third places given that all non-commercial ones have been destroyed by capitalism and car culture.
My after work drink is a CBD seltzer. Some taste like juice, which I don't like. My favorite is Recess. I also like Vybes which is a (non-sparkling) CBD tea.
posted by tofu_crouton at 6:53 AM on June 7 [10 favorites]
This is the only reason I buy mocktails. I don't want to lose third places given that all non-commercial ones have been destroyed by capitalism and car culture.
My after work drink is a CBD seltzer. Some taste like juice, which I don't like. My favorite is Recess. I also like Vybes which is a (non-sparkling) CBD tea.
posted by tofu_crouton at 6:53 AM on June 7 [10 favorites]
There was a stretch last month where I was very... kind to myself about the definition of weekend, but for the last year I've been drinking only on weekends and it's been easy. The purpose of switching was not really to be sober but to reach for something different in the refrigerator most of the time. I enjoyed the variety of 0.0% beers in the Netherlands last year, so I've added the 0.0% beers from Athletic and Brooklyn to my shopping list.
posted by emelenjr at 6:56 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
posted by emelenjr at 6:56 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
I'd have to do a search but when the question was posed as to why a mocktail that contains no alcohol costs as much as a cocktail had to do with less price-gouging (as supposed) and more like having the same quality standards as the booze. Good ones are fairly elaborate and are time-consuming to make....like the fancy cocktails. Bartenders aren't dumping fruit juice into a glass, adding soda water, and calling it a day. Some of the ones I've seen on menus--I am a serial online menu lurker--are very ornate, especially if they are trying to mimic the vibe of booze without the booze.
No one is forcing any sober people to buy them. But it is nice to have them if someone wants them. You can even buy canned mocktails at Costco these days!
posted by Kitteh at 7:09 AM on June 7 [8 favorites]
No one is forcing any sober people to buy them. But it is nice to have them if someone wants them. You can even buy canned mocktails at Costco these days!
posted by Kitteh at 7:09 AM on June 7 [8 favorites]
I'm not quite California sober, but I've largely replaced alcohol with THC, and truthfully I don't consume very much of either. I do still usually drink beer at bars (I like beer! a lot!) but basically never at home. But having non-alcoholic options that actually taste like beer -- the Athletic beers are surprisingly great -- is a real game-changer for times when I would rather be sober (or buzzed on THC instead). It's nice to be able to ask a bartender what NA beers they have and not have the only answer be "a dusty bottle of O'Doul's from the Clinton era."
posted by uncleozzy at 7:24 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
posted by uncleozzy at 7:24 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
thank you Kitteh!
I recently cut back on beer consumption, the NHL season brings out the beer in me, but I want my pants to not be so tight at the waist. also, cost, also, health.
timing of this thread is very good (for me), I'm appreciating all the great comments
posted by elkevelvet at 7:28 AM on June 7
I recently cut back on beer consumption, the NHL season brings out the beer in me, but I want my pants to not be so tight at the waist. also, cost, also, health.
timing of this thread is very good (for me), I'm appreciating all the great comments
posted by elkevelvet at 7:28 AM on June 7
is there a term like "california sober" but for amphetamines?
posted by AlbertCalavicci at 7:32 AM on June 7 [10 favorites]
posted by AlbertCalavicci at 7:32 AM on June 7 [10 favorites]
if there isn't, I nominate "trucker sober"
posted by mrjohnmuller at 7:35 AM on June 7 [20 favorites]
posted by mrjohnmuller at 7:35 AM on June 7 [20 favorites]
my favourite mocktail, for many years, has been apple juice and a maraschino cherry served in a manhattan glass. simple, classy, and usually cheap. goes well with wearing a fascinator and heels.
posted by Aya Hirano on the Astral Plane at 7:36 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
posted by Aya Hirano on the Astral Plane at 7:36 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
I"m all for staying off alcohol if that's your thing but paying as much for a non alcoholic cocktail as a regular one is insane. Part of the appeal of not drinking would be saving money when I go out.
posted by Liquidwolf at 7:36 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
posted by Liquidwolf at 7:36 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Currently off alcohol after a couple of iffy liver function readings. So far, AF beers and Guinness 0.0 have been surprisingly adequate substitutes.
Also - this stuff is quite nice: Sentia (although I don't think they ship to US). It attempts to hit the 'sociability' receptors in your brain*.
And I think...it works...? I can't perceive any difference in how I 'feel', but I definitely seem to be more chatty after a couple of drinks.
* Sentia is also developed by David Nutt, who was sacked as UK govt drugs adviser in 2009 for saying that some recreational drugs were less harmful than alcohol & tobacco. And currently looking into psychedelic therapies. He seems like one of the good guys.
posted by moonface at 7:38 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
Also - this stuff is quite nice: Sentia (although I don't think they ship to US). It attempts to hit the 'sociability' receptors in your brain*.
And I think...it works...? I can't perceive any difference in how I 'feel', but I definitely seem to be more chatty after a couple of drinks.
* Sentia is also developed by David Nutt, who was sacked as UK govt drugs adviser in 2009 for saying that some recreational drugs were less harmful than alcohol & tobacco. And currently looking into psychedelic therapies. He seems like one of the good guys.
posted by moonface at 7:38 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
Seconding Heineken 0.0 here. I'm not comfortable with the ABV of what is labelled non-alcoholic beers (NA) for myself so I avoid them
posted by lescour at 7:38 AM on June 7
posted by lescour at 7:38 AM on June 7
One of my favourite non-alc products out there right now is Bellwoods Brewery's* non-alcoholic version of Jelly King as I used to love sours in my beer drinking/journalism days. IMHO, it tastes like an even upscale version of kombucha. It is becoming more available for purchase at live music shows here in my town and that is freaking great.
Honestly, big ups to any brewery that makes a really good non-alc beer for folks. Again, I don't drink them often but I def buy them at live music shows when I can.
*Bellwoods Brewery makes some legit good beers for those of you who can drink like a normal person
posted by Kitteh at 7:38 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Honestly, big ups to any brewery that makes a really good non-alc beer for folks. Again, I don't drink them often but I def buy them at live music shows when I can.
*Bellwoods Brewery makes some legit good beers for those of you who can drink like a normal person
posted by Kitteh at 7:38 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
I buy mocktails when I'm out to support having the option. Voting with my dollars or something. I want bars to know it's not a waste of time.
But really, my preferred drink if I'm not having alcohol is tonic water and lime. It's sweet, but the bitterness of the quinine plays a lovely balance against it.
Some NA beers are great, and I never really drank for the buzz, so given a good NA sour or kolsch, why not?
posted by advicepig at 7:42 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
But really, my preferred drink if I'm not having alcohol is tonic water and lime. It's sweet, but the bitterness of the quinine plays a lovely balance against it.
Some NA beers are great, and I never really drank for the buzz, so given a good NA sour or kolsch, why not?
posted by advicepig at 7:42 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
paying as much for a non alcoholic cocktail as a regular one is insane.
Concur, and: that's what desserts are for. (Or savory appetizers would work, too.) If everybody else in your party is drinking and you don't want to, why not get a coffee or a club soda and spend the real money on a slice of cheesecake? Anecdatum: we tried to have a birthday night on the town with a mocktails pub crawl, and that failed utterly, but just as we were agreeing to pack it in, we ran across the fancy popsicle place and the night was saved. The fancy popsicle place is ideal if most people in the group don't want to drink but one or two do in that the ratio is like in a bar but reversed: 95%+ of items are non-alcoholic, a few are alcoholic.
posted by Don Pepino at 7:47 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
Concur, and: that's what desserts are for. (Or savory appetizers would work, too.) If everybody else in your party is drinking and you don't want to, why not get a coffee or a club soda and spend the real money on a slice of cheesecake? Anecdatum: we tried to have a birthday night on the town with a mocktails pub crawl, and that failed utterly, but just as we were agreeing to pack it in, we ran across the fancy popsicle place and the night was saved. The fancy popsicle place is ideal if most people in the group don't want to drink but one or two do in that the ratio is like in a bar but reversed: 95%+ of items are non-alcoholic, a few are alcoholic.
posted by Don Pepino at 7:47 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
The only thing I missed from my drinking days was the taste of IPA on a warm summer afternoon. Now there are quite a few good NA stuff. Especially the hazy IPA's. They go really well with the spicy foods I cook and eat.
I was skeptical of my reasons for trying them, thinking I will be triggered. Thankfully, that has not happened. I am happy with just one or two when I do consume. If I start pounding 6 or 12 packs of these too; I will stop. But this combined with my Sodastream gives me enough of the fizzy taste that I do enjoy.
Athletic Brewing has made NA their whole niche product. I don't believe they even make any other kind. That and Sam Adams are my go to. I have tried others like Sierra Nevada and Lagunitas, but they don't do it for me.
Also, Sierra Nevada and Lagunitas make just hoppy carbonated drink; that is 0 ABV.
posted by indianbadger1 at 7:48 AM on June 7
November, 1986. My first year at college. My Dad flies out on business. I bus down to Manhattan to meet him. We have dinner, then go to a bar. I'm 18. The bartender takes our order. Dad asks for a Miller lite, I ask for ... Moosehead. The bartender hears "Moussy." I get a Moussy. I do not know what Moussy is, but my Dad is laughing.
It's grand to live in a world where they make non-alcoholic beer that isn't Moussy.
posted by chavenet at 7:48 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
It's grand to live in a world where they make non-alcoholic beer that isn't Moussy.
posted by chavenet at 7:48 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
Athletic Brewing has made NA their whole niche product. I don't believe they even make any other kind.
Yeah they only make NA beers. So do numerous other companies now. I stock them at our local food coop.
posted by Liquidwolf at 7:50 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
Yeah they only make NA beers. So do numerous other companies now. I stock them at our local food coop.
posted by Liquidwolf at 7:50 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
paying as much for a non alcoholic cocktail as a regular one is insane
It's not to this non-drinker. When I pay as much for a NA drink as a conventional cocktail, I'm properly compensating the bar/restaurant/bartender for the service, the environment, the building of a mocktail, the cost of ingredients, the additional ingredients they need to keep on hand...and also, I'm making sure that the bartender isn't losing out because I don't drink. Making a 14 ingredient NA drink takes just as much time and attentional as a 14 ingredient cocktail.
It also means that it's more like the bar/restaurant/bartender will keep that item on the menu. I want to reward them for catering to and including me.
It's important to me to be able to have a special occasion drink when other people are having one, something similar in concept to what others are having. No one cares what I'm drinking, but I want to have a fun cool experience too.
Things I've been super enjoying lately
Eins Zwei Zero Rose Sparkling Rose - I'd written off NA wines prior to this. It's not a sophisticated replica, but it's good enough for a summer of Fridays on the back porch.
Athletic Brewing is always in my fridge, I have a subscription to it and we still supplement with a sixer or two when we run out between shipments.
Homemade sorrel - it's a little bit of a project but I like being able to customize the level of ginger and sugar
Shrubs, both homemade and storebought
A fake paper plan made with Abstinence Epilogue, Abstinence Blood Orange apertif, lemon juice, and a cinnamon simple syrup (4:3:2:1)
posted by punchtothehead at 7:53 AM on June 7 [21 favorites]
It's not to this non-drinker. When I pay as much for a NA drink as a conventional cocktail, I'm properly compensating the bar/restaurant/bartender for the service, the environment, the building of a mocktail, the cost of ingredients, the additional ingredients they need to keep on hand...and also, I'm making sure that the bartender isn't losing out because I don't drink. Making a 14 ingredient NA drink takes just as much time and attentional as a 14 ingredient cocktail.
It also means that it's more like the bar/restaurant/bartender will keep that item on the menu. I want to reward them for catering to and including me.
It's important to me to be able to have a special occasion drink when other people are having one, something similar in concept to what others are having. No one cares what I'm drinking, but I want to have a fun cool experience too.
Things I've been super enjoying lately
Eins Zwei Zero Rose Sparkling Rose - I'd written off NA wines prior to this. It's not a sophisticated replica, but it's good enough for a summer of Fridays on the back porch.
Athletic Brewing is always in my fridge, I have a subscription to it and we still supplement with a sixer or two when we run out between shipments.
Homemade sorrel - it's a little bit of a project but I like being able to customize the level of ginger and sugar
Shrubs, both homemade and storebought
A fake paper plan made with Abstinence Epilogue, Abstinence Blood Orange apertif, lemon juice, and a cinnamon simple syrup (4:3:2:1)
posted by punchtothehead at 7:53 AM on June 7 [21 favorites]
I for one am always happy to go to a fancy cocktail place and get a fancy mocktail (or one fancy cocktail and then fancy mocktails for the rest of the night). It's a rare enough thing that I don't mind spending the money, and not that steep a price to pay for the pleasure of sipping my pineapple juice, orange juice, and ginger beer while watching other people get drunk.
posted by Jeanne at 7:54 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
posted by Jeanne at 7:54 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
And punchtothehead, that fake paper plane sounds absolutely delicious (except that "peated" is far from my favorite flavor descriptor) and I might have to try making my own variation.
posted by Jeanne at 7:56 AM on June 7
posted by Jeanne at 7:56 AM on June 7
Also, Sierra Nevada and Lagunitas make just hoppy carbonated drink; that is 0 ABV.
I really like hop seltzers like that. They don't seem to be as widely-available as NA beers, though.
posted by uncleozzy at 7:59 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
I really like hop seltzers like that. They don't seem to be as widely-available as NA beers, though.
posted by uncleozzy at 7:59 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
I was skeptical of my reasons for trying them, thinking I will be triggered. Thankfully, that has not happened. I am happy with just one or two when I do consume. If I start pounding 6 or 12 packs of these too; I will stop. But this combined with my Sodastream gives me enough of the fizzy taste that I do enjoy.
This was my concern when I quit drinking, but I soon realized that as much as I loved the taste of really good craft beers, I certainly wasn't drinking them for that taste. I was drinking them for the effect. For me, having one non-alc beer wasn't triggering because I definitely felt that if I wasn't getting the effect I wanted from boozy beer, then why have another can of non-alc beer? But sober people are not a monolith, so YMMV.
posted by Kitteh at 8:06 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
This was my concern when I quit drinking, but I soon realized that as much as I loved the taste of really good craft beers, I certainly wasn't drinking them for that taste. I was drinking them for the effect. For me, having one non-alc beer wasn't triggering because I definitely felt that if I wasn't getting the effect I wanted from boozy beer, then why have another can of non-alc beer? But sober people are not a monolith, so YMMV.
posted by Kitteh at 8:06 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
Paulaner Weissbier 0,0% is my summer go-to. Flavourful but mild enough to be a thirst-quencher rather than a sipper.
posted by saturday_morning at 8:06 AM on June 7
posted by saturday_morning at 8:06 AM on June 7
I really like hop seltzers like that. They don't seem to be as widely-available as NA beers, though
uncleozzy, I know you're not in Canada (probably) but I treat myself to this hop seltzer from a local brewery as part of my regular seltzer rotation. It is fucking dope.
posted by Kitteh at 8:07 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
uncleozzy, I know you're not in Canada (probably) but I treat myself to this hop seltzer from a local brewery as part of my regular seltzer rotation. It is fucking dope.
posted by Kitteh at 8:07 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
If you live near Nashville TN, hop over to KillJoy to shop and sample the wide array of alcohol free stuff now out there. I quit in the last year for liver health reasons and enjoy mostly the NA beer variety out there, but there is so much interesting stuff to try! I admit that NA Guinness is my go to as well for convenience and 1:1 replacement of what I was drinking a lot of before. I’m mid 40s and a bunch of my friends have gone sober for one reason or another, so I’m glad there is a non-drinking cultural change happening to make not drinking easier in social situations for those of us who basically never socialized without drinking before. Still haven’t tried dating without alcohol yet…
posted by oomny at 8:08 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
posted by oomny at 8:08 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
Oh yeah, if you're in Pittsburgh and not drinking, try The Open Road in Allentown (the one near Mount Washington, not the one on the opposite side of the state. It has a great variety and I always find something interesting to try.
posted by punchtothehead at 8:13 AM on June 7
posted by punchtothehead at 8:13 AM on June 7
I gave up booze twenty years ago and holy hell, what a vast improvement. I can see why the temperance folks wanted to ban it. Too bad it didn't stick. Cancel that shit!
Up next: sugar.
posted by CynicalKnight at 8:13 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
Up next: sugar.
posted by CynicalKnight at 8:13 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
paying as much for a non alcoholic cocktail as a regular one is insane
Well unless the cocktail has something ridiculous in it, the cost of the alcohol isn't going to be a lot more than $2. And you're not replacing the spirits and liqueurs with water, so there's not much reason for non-alcoholic drinks to be much cheaper.
I do enjoy an alcohol cocktail, but I've been thrilled about the recently increased prevalence and quality of non-alcoholic cocktails, because I can drink and even savor tasty drinks significantly faster than my body can process alcohol. My biggest complaint is, just like is true with alcoholic cocktails, non-alcoholic cocktails are often too sweet.
posted by aubilenon at 8:14 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Well unless the cocktail has something ridiculous in it, the cost of the alcohol isn't going to be a lot more than $2. And you're not replacing the spirits and liqueurs with water, so there's not much reason for non-alcoholic drinks to be much cheaper.
I do enjoy an alcohol cocktail, but I've been thrilled about the recently increased prevalence and quality of non-alcoholic cocktails, because I can drink and even savor tasty drinks significantly faster than my body can process alcohol. My biggest complaint is, just like is true with alcoholic cocktails, non-alcoholic cocktails are often too sweet.
posted by aubilenon at 8:14 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
The pandemic both exacerbated my drinking and made it easier to quit. Waking up hungover on a Thursday after an evening I'd started out by telling myself, "It's the middle of the week. I will only have one or two drinks" really drove home for me how much I was not able to trust my tipsy self not to become my drunk self and my drunk self to become my VERY drunk self, all the more true when dealing with the stress of a pandemic we still knew so little about in June of 2020. That Friday morning I woke with a clear head and the realization that I was very far down a road I've watched both my parents travel, and I didn't like where it ended. So I decided to quit indefinitely - for at least a year, at which point I would check in, but probably forever. It was easier to do so because we couldn't go hang out at the bars and breweries that had so recently been the natural centers for social activity in my friend groups; I think if I'd been going to those on the regular while at that point, I'd have talked myself around pretty quickly to "just one tonight will be fine," and then "I've been doing just one for a while, and that's gone well, so on weekends I can do two" and so on. Now I'm grateful to be at a point where I can hang out at those places and not even be particularly tempted.
I'd tried taking a month off here and there before, but that always just ended with me getting to the end of the month desperate for what I'd been missing. Deciding it was really quitting, not pausing, really shifted how it felt and in my case actually made it easier, because I was no longer looking at a drink thinking "Soon we will be together again..." Instead, I was looking at it thinking "We had our good times, thanks for that. But we had our bad ones, too."
After about 18 months, I decided I could allow myself twice a year: my birthday and New Year's. And that's where I'm at these days, after trying it to make sure it didn't disrupt how I felt about drinking the rest of the year, and it doesn't. In fact, I don't even always drink on those days, if circumstances make it at all inconvenient to do so. I won't ever consider adding more allowances, because that way trouble lies.
I almost always have some NA beer in the house. After gosh, 20+ years of drinking most days, even now four years after that decision I get some small psychosomatic relaxation when I take that first sip; work is done, time to relax and enjoy myself! During that first quitting phase in the early pandemic, my partner and I lived with a roommate who was big into making cocktails, and he seamlessly and unasked started adding mocktails to his repertoire when I quit, so I've also had some good stuff that way, and although we don't live with him anymore, I keep some stuff on hand to make those occasionally, too.
So all that said, my thoughts on actual options...
Beer:
Mocktails:
I'm enjoying alcohol free beers but did not like the sobour bourbon-analogue. Anyone got any recommendations for a zero Old Fashioned with a bit of a bite?
No Old Fashioned recommendation, because those rely too much on the bourbon. But take Pathfinder and any of the (bad) zero whiskeys and some bitters and you've got a reliably fantastic Black Manhattan.
Happy (non)drinking!
posted by solotoro at 8:15 AM on June 7 [11 favorites]
I'd tried taking a month off here and there before, but that always just ended with me getting to the end of the month desperate for what I'd been missing. Deciding it was really quitting, not pausing, really shifted how it felt and in my case actually made it easier, because I was no longer looking at a drink thinking "Soon we will be together again..." Instead, I was looking at it thinking "We had our good times, thanks for that. But we had our bad ones, too."
After about 18 months, I decided I could allow myself twice a year: my birthday and New Year's. And that's where I'm at these days, after trying it to make sure it didn't disrupt how I felt about drinking the rest of the year, and it doesn't. In fact, I don't even always drink on those days, if circumstances make it at all inconvenient to do so. I won't ever consider adding more allowances, because that way trouble lies.
I almost always have some NA beer in the house. After gosh, 20+ years of drinking most days, even now four years after that decision I get some small psychosomatic relaxation when I take that first sip; work is done, time to relax and enjoy myself! During that first quitting phase in the early pandemic, my partner and I lived with a roommate who was big into making cocktails, and he seamlessly and unasked started adding mocktails to his repertoire when I quit, so I've also had some good stuff that way, and although we don't live with him anymore, I keep some stuff on hand to make those occasionally, too.
So all that said, my thoughts on actual options...
Beer:
- Athletic brewing distributes some of their regular brews to liquor stores, but to really get the good stuff, place an order and get some of their seasonal/pilot program stuff.
- Wellbeing brewing is the other major NA craft-brew producer I know of that you can ship directly from. I find they tend to be a bit sweeter than Athletic, so I don't order from them as much because of my personal taste.
- Heineken, Guinness, Sam Adams, Lagunitas and Corona all have good zeroes that are a little tougher to find and pricier.
- Bud Zero is weirdly perfectly like a Bud, easily the closest any of them come to tasting exactly like what they are replacing. Of course, what it's replacing is a Bud, not a craft brew, but if you just want a cold American style lager, this is your best choice by far. And it's not as expensive as many of the other options, either.
- For another American style lager, Penn's Best NA is the cheapest I've seen, and while not quite as exactly on point as Bud Zero, it's still a cut or three above the O'Douls/Clausthaler/Erlinger bracket.
Mocktails:
- Take the cheap NA beer of your choice (even O'Douls) and make a michelada!!
- Seedlip's stuff is consistently good. Of the ones I've had, Garden 108 is best.
- Ritual's stuff is pretty good, too, with the exception of their whisky. Because...
- There are no good whisky/whiskey/bourbon/scotch alternatives. Sorry. The closest you'll get is with zero cinnamon whisky, because at least you get a faceful of cinnamon.
- Pathfinder is EXCELLENT. Kind of like Seedlip, it doesn't quite claim to replace any specific thing, but it's closest to an amaro.
I'm enjoying alcohol free beers but did not like the sobour bourbon-analogue. Anyone got any recommendations for a zero Old Fashioned with a bit of a bite?
No Old Fashioned recommendation, because those rely too much on the bourbon. But take Pathfinder and any of the (bad) zero whiskeys and some bitters and you've got a reliably fantastic Black Manhattan.
Happy (non)drinking!
posted by solotoro at 8:15 AM on June 7 [11 favorites]
Checking in at just over a year and a half sober here; had been drinking "unhealthily" for a while and cutting back wasn't working (I found it far too easily to start calling Thursday and Sunday part of the weekend, and at that point you're drinking four nights out of seven, so why not make it five? or six? or, well, seven) - but weirdly found just going cold turkey was fine. I mean, it wasn't fun - I had a few weeks of messed up sleep and that, but dropping the booze was nowhere like as hard as I'd thought it would be.
This has been in no small part due to the range of decent "grown-up" alcohol-free* drinks now - beers, wines, ciders, things that aren't easy to categorise but are interestingly-flavoured and not just a soda/seltzer in expensive packaging. I totally understand that these substitute drinks aren't for everyone (and for many in recovery are actively harmful) but the fact I could stop drinking alcohol but still crack open a beer at the end of the week (or day) made the change so much easier.
I'm in the UK, and the AF beer scene in particular has exploded lately - like the craft beer scene did a decade or two ago, there's a proliferation of brewers who only do alcohol-free now (Lowtide, Mash Gang, Big Drop, Drop Bear to name but a few favourites) - all in a very craft-brewery style - lots of hazy pale ales and ludicrous stouts, as well as a decent number of just very drinkable light beers and lagers. And the craft breweries themselves are getting in on things, too. Time will tell if this is a sustainable thing or just a fad, but I hope they stick around.
*alcohol-free is a tricky thing. A lot of these drinks are 0.5% ABV (or lower), which counts as alcohol-free in some markets and only as low alcohol in others. Personally, I'm comfortable with this - that low level of alcohol gets processed and eliminated by the body before it has a chance to have any effect, and it's about the save level you'd find in, say, bread or bananas - but again, completely understand if others aren't. The Guinness and Heineken 0.0% are better than they really have any right to be - in fact, I'd argue the Heineken one is better than their "normal" beer, but that's not exactly a high bar.
posted by parm at 8:22 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
This has been in no small part due to the range of decent "grown-up" alcohol-free* drinks now - beers, wines, ciders, things that aren't easy to categorise but are interestingly-flavoured and not just a soda/seltzer in expensive packaging. I totally understand that these substitute drinks aren't for everyone (and for many in recovery are actively harmful) but the fact I could stop drinking alcohol but still crack open a beer at the end of the week (or day) made the change so much easier.
I'm in the UK, and the AF beer scene in particular has exploded lately - like the craft beer scene did a decade or two ago, there's a proliferation of brewers who only do alcohol-free now (Lowtide, Mash Gang, Big Drop, Drop Bear to name but a few favourites) - all in a very craft-brewery style - lots of hazy pale ales and ludicrous stouts, as well as a decent number of just very drinkable light beers and lagers. And the craft breweries themselves are getting in on things, too. Time will tell if this is a sustainable thing or just a fad, but I hope they stick around.
*alcohol-free is a tricky thing. A lot of these drinks are 0.5% ABV (or lower), which counts as alcohol-free in some markets and only as low alcohol in others. Personally, I'm comfortable with this - that low level of alcohol gets processed and eliminated by the body before it has a chance to have any effect, and it's about the save level you'd find in, say, bread or bananas - but again, completely understand if others aren't. The Guinness and Heineken 0.0% are better than they really have any right to be - in fact, I'd argue the Heineken one is better than their "normal" beer, but that's not exactly a high bar.
posted by parm at 8:22 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Don't want to abuse the edit window and forgot to preview, so:
> Deciding it was really quitting, not pausing, really shifted how it felt and in my case actually made it easier, because I was no longer looking at a drink thinking "Soon we will be together again..." Instead, I was looking at it thinking "We had our good times, thanks for that. But we had our bad ones, too."
@solotoro - this really, really resonates with me, too.
posted by parm at 8:25 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
> Deciding it was really quitting, not pausing, really shifted how it felt and in my case actually made it easier, because I was no longer looking at a drink thinking "Soon we will be together again..." Instead, I was looking at it thinking "We had our good times, thanks for that. But we had our bad ones, too."
@solotoro - this really, really resonates with me, too.
posted by parm at 8:25 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
As tofu_crouton points out, we're gonna have to find different ways to pay for and manage our third spaces. Goin' out for live music on two iced teas and an appetizer plate, and a twenty in the tip jar for the band, is great for my wallet, but sucks for the venue. And I'm okay with NA beers and whatnot, it's great to have something non-alcoholic to drink that isn't sweet, but I haven't found a mocktail that works, especially not at full cocktail prices.
I think Covid has put us on our way to reinventing the third space, I've been to far more gatherings in parks or wherever outdoors since, but living in a suburban town that's struggling with the "how do we get our climate impacts down" is leading to a lot of discussion about how we create more social interaction in walkable distances from homes, and that's going to involve reinventing our cities.
(Mostly stopped drinking back in the early naughts 'cause my now wife said "why don't you take a month off", learned how to hang out in bars without it and I never really started again, and then we got into wine brewing with neighborhood excess fruit and took a carboy of mediocre stuff to a New Year's Day party this year and turned it into spiced wine, and I ... really don't need to see alcohol again.)
posted by straw at 8:29 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
I think Covid has put us on our way to reinventing the third space, I've been to far more gatherings in parks or wherever outdoors since, but living in a suburban town that's struggling with the "how do we get our climate impacts down" is leading to a lot of discussion about how we create more social interaction in walkable distances from homes, and that's going to involve reinventing our cities.
(Mostly stopped drinking back in the early naughts 'cause my now wife said "why don't you take a month off", learned how to hang out in bars without it and I never really started again, and then we got into wine brewing with neighborhood excess fruit and took a carboy of mediocre stuff to a New Year's Day party this year and turned it into spiced wine, and I ... really don't need to see alcohol again.)
posted by straw at 8:29 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
nthing the Athletic beers, especially the Run Wild. I tried the Sam Adams one after reading some raves online, and it really didn't do the trick for me. Too oddly creamy.
There is news on the NA wine front. I found about a brand called NON, out of Australia. Has anyone tried it? It has generated some enthusiastic reviews from outlets such as Food & Wine, and I'm intrigued, especially as it doesn't try to mimic regular wine in its flavors, but looks to replicate mouthfeel, tannins, etc. But it's also not cheap.
I hope this trend catches on, as I'd love for there to be some good NA wines out there. I drink alcohol maybe once a week, always wine, but it'd be nice to have something for during the week that won't make me sleepy.
posted by the sobsister at 8:32 AM on June 7
There is news on the NA wine front. I found about a brand called NON, out of Australia. Has anyone tried it? It has generated some enthusiastic reviews from outlets such as Food & Wine, and I'm intrigued, especially as it doesn't try to mimic regular wine in its flavors, but looks to replicate mouthfeel, tannins, etc. But it's also not cheap.
I hope this trend catches on, as I'd love for there to be some good NA wines out there. I drink alcohol maybe once a week, always wine, but it'd be nice to have something for during the week that won't make me sleepy.
posted by the sobsister at 8:32 AM on June 7
I'm about two weeks shy of seventh months alcohol free. It's been a hell of a ride to this point and there are many things I miss about drinking, but I can miss something while acknowledging it as destructive and better left in my past. I miss the easy access to relaxation, disinhibition, a refuge from my feelings in a little glass of tipple. Many glasses of tipple followed the end of my marriage five years ago. Far too many. I came to you all to ask for help on how to support myself when I couldn't handle my feelings then, and it took me those five years to tearfully understand that I was in need of letting go rather than holding on, To so much, but especially to drinking. I'm still waiting for clarity and peace and rejuvenation, should they come, but to my surprise I feel better in the agony that still creeps up on me in small moments to myself. I feel better in it as myself, I mean, instead of drugged and glazed in the face of that darkness. That's miraculous in a way that I find as hard to communicate as how justified it feels to take an expensive class to learn how to make alcohol-free cocktails with a handful of other strangers. I'm glad it's there. I'm glad they're there. I moved to an even drunker country a few years ago, and this is one where no one drinks alone. That helped me stop drinking. I hated the feeling of drinking with a table full of cheerful, gossiping faces when all I wanted was to be left alone with my whiskey at the back garden of my old neighborhood dive bar a few thousand miles away. And so I stopped. I wanted to retreat into this feeling alone, with or without alcohol, and I'm happy that there are nice things apart from selzter that I can treat myself with on the occasions when I muster the nerve and courage to stop being alone in this feeling. A toast, to seven months and however many days and weeks and years you have!
posted by late afternoon dreaming hotel at 8:34 AM on June 7 [18 favorites]
posted by late afternoon dreaming hotel at 8:34 AM on June 7 [18 favorites]
The NA beer landscape is great. I really like the Heineken 0.0. I haven't tried faux bourbon etc, but since there's no inherent mouthfeel to hard liquor it seems like a less compelling value proposition. Seltzer and some juice and maybe a little Torani syrup or grenadine and I'm good to go!
posted by grumpybear69 at 8:41 AM on June 7
posted by grumpybear69 at 8:41 AM on June 7
The mouthfeel thing from hard liquor (and even less strong alcoholic drinks) is hard to replicate - as is the fact that alcohol is really volatile - which is why you get a big burst of flavour right up your nose when you lift the glass, and from body-heat evaporation in your mouth when you take a sip.
Mouthfeel, people seem to be trying to fix by, well, adding sugar: a lot of the craft brewers took to adding lactose or similar to their AF brews to give it a richer mouthfeel - and it works, to an extent, but it also means some AF beers can have upwards of 10g of sugar in a 330ml bottle.
Volatility is harder to replicate - but I think this is maybe why sparkling AF drinks (beer, sparkling wine) are more successful than still in recreating the sensory experience of alcohol - the bubbles do a bit of the job of creating a vapour of aromatic/flavourful compounds as part of the experience of drinking.
One of the interesting things I've seen is folks adding tea extracts to AF wine-a-likes, to replicate the dry mouthfeel you get from tannins in wines. It works! The Kylie (yes, the Australian pop singer) brand pink fizz uses this, and is really good, FWIW.
posted by parm at 8:49 AM on June 7 [9 favorites]
Mouthfeel, people seem to be trying to fix by, well, adding sugar: a lot of the craft brewers took to adding lactose or similar to their AF brews to give it a richer mouthfeel - and it works, to an extent, but it also means some AF beers can have upwards of 10g of sugar in a 330ml bottle.
Volatility is harder to replicate - but I think this is maybe why sparkling AF drinks (beer, sparkling wine) are more successful than still in recreating the sensory experience of alcohol - the bubbles do a bit of the job of creating a vapour of aromatic/flavourful compounds as part of the experience of drinking.
One of the interesting things I've seen is folks adding tea extracts to AF wine-a-likes, to replicate the dry mouthfeel you get from tannins in wines. It works! The Kylie (yes, the Australian pop singer) brand pink fizz uses this, and is really good, FWIW.
posted by parm at 8:49 AM on June 7 [9 favorites]
I don't drink much alcohol, nor do my adult kids, because it just wasn't a thing in my family. I'm just realizing that's because my dad, and later my wife, both broke the generational pattern of alcoholism in their families.
It's one of the greatest quiet gifts I've ever been given.
posted by SunSnork at 8:51 AM on June 7 [17 favorites]
It's one of the greatest quiet gifts I've ever been given.
posted by SunSnork at 8:51 AM on June 7 [17 favorites]
My SO usually has some Brewdog AF tins in, they have at least 4 flavours. I find them a nice substitute to go with curry in the week to keep my units down. Not a big fan of the company but since the tins are sitting there...
There are an increasing number of AF ales around that are pretty decent.
There is a UK specialist in AF that you can find out more about different AF options: dry drinker. (NB UK defines anything under 0.5% as AF.)
posted by biffa at 8:57 AM on June 7
There are an increasing number of AF ales around that are pretty decent.
There is a UK specialist in AF that you can find out more about different AF options: dry drinker. (NB UK defines anything under 0.5% as AF.)
posted by biffa at 8:57 AM on June 7
late afternoon dreaming hotel, you're doing great! Hooray!
I hit my five year mark this past February. Getting sober was the best thing that could have ever happened to me.
posted by Kitteh at 9:11 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
I hit my five year mark this past February. Getting sober was the best thing that could have ever happened to me.
posted by Kitteh at 9:11 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Just hit seven years a couple months ago.
I don't know if I have the motivation to do a NA bar crawl, sounds like everything I hated about the bar "scene" just with a metric ton of self-importance. As someone said upthread, the best part of going to the bar these days is not spending a ton of money on wildly overpriced alcoholic drinks, followed closely by getting to drive other peoples' cars.
I can't speak for anywhere else, but here in the great state of recovery*, the general acceptance of people not drinking in social situations is pretty high.
Nthing the Athletic NA beer selection. I was having an out of the blue beer craving a couple years ago, and a friend knowing my past tastes, recommended their IPA and it was surprisingly good. Killed that craving dead.
OMFG, Moussy. I've been trying to remember the name of the beer my friend's alcoholic dad had a half pallet of in his garage for decades now. Thank you.
*Minnesota, lol.
posted by Sphinx at 9:31 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
I don't know if I have the motivation to do a NA bar crawl, sounds like everything I hated about the bar "scene" just with a metric ton of self-importance. As someone said upthread, the best part of going to the bar these days is not spending a ton of money on wildly overpriced alcoholic drinks, followed closely by getting to drive other peoples' cars.
I can't speak for anywhere else, but here in the great state of recovery*, the general acceptance of people not drinking in social situations is pretty high.
Nthing the Athletic NA beer selection. I was having an out of the blue beer craving a couple years ago, and a friend knowing my past tastes, recommended their IPA and it was surprisingly good. Killed that craving dead.
OMFG, Moussy. I've been trying to remember the name of the beer my friend's alcoholic dad had a half pallet of in his garage for decades now. Thank you.
*Minnesota, lol.
posted by Sphinx at 9:31 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
As the beer guy all I can say is I had a long run of too much during COVID and then quit for 3 months before slowly easing back in and now a days I'll drink at functions and otherwise have a couple of beers on a Friday. I'm not perfect, but who is?
Its definitely forced me to explore more fermentation spaces because fermentation is my jame (er... pickle?)
Athletic is definitely the best of the bunch of the "craft" NA beer breweries. It was just in the news that Ballast Point, which at the height of insanity (2015) was bought by Constellation Wines for $1B and then sold a few years later (2019) to a small Chicago outfit for $41M, sold and closed their huge main production facility switching to contract only. The buyer? Athletic. That's a move I don't think anyone would have called 5 years ago.
And for my NA $$, the two best of the NA styled drinks are still the Lagunitas Hoppy Refresher and my go to when I bartended - tonic, lime and bitters - no gin.
posted by drewbage1847 at 9:37 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Its definitely forced me to explore more fermentation spaces because fermentation is my jame (er... pickle?)
Athletic is definitely the best of the bunch of the "craft" NA beer breweries. It was just in the news that Ballast Point, which at the height of insanity (2015) was bought by Constellation Wines for $1B and then sold a few years later (2019) to a small Chicago outfit for $41M, sold and closed their huge main production facility switching to contract only. The buyer? Athletic. That's a move I don't think anyone would have called 5 years ago.
And for my NA $$, the two best of the NA styled drinks are still the Lagunitas Hoppy Refresher and my go to when I bartended - tonic, lime and bitters - no gin.
posted by drewbage1847 at 9:37 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
I'm on about 9 million medications and alcohol mixes badly with some of them, so I am also in the "bring me the NA beer/mocktails" crowd. I miss the buzz for karaoke purposes, but I do not miss the hangovers I had when I had something alcoholic with my meds.
We ate at a local brewpub Wednesday night and they had NA beer, so I had it with my dinner (wings). It felt and tasted right. I was pretty happy with it. I've also been having mocktails with my fancy dinners and that has been nice. Ice water is good and I generally want that with my meal, but the NA drinks are good for drinking with other grownups. Topo Chico gets boring and that's what most places here have had for a long time.
posted by gentlyepigrams at 9:49 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
We ate at a local brewpub Wednesday night and they had NA beer, so I had it with my dinner (wings). It felt and tasted right. I was pretty happy with it. I've also been having mocktails with my fancy dinners and that has been nice. Ice water is good and I generally want that with my meal, but the NA drinks are good for drinking with other grownups. Topo Chico gets boring and that's what most places here have had for a long time.
posted by gentlyepigrams at 9:49 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
We have just dramatically modified our consumption habits and it is in part now because the options are so much better. I still sometimes have to beg bartenders to put some sugar/sour in my fake drinks - just because I don't want booze in it doesn't mean I don't want BALANCE in it. And flavor. And salt on the rim.
For people who still drink bitters: Fee's makes a rhubarb flavor that is top-notch for making something taste more grown-up if you're not an herbal kind of person. Bars never have it, though, so it's mostly an at-home thing for my ginger ale or Arnold Palmers.
I haven't yet really experimented with the 0% spirits, as it feels like a weird thing to spend money on.
posted by Lyn Never at 10:04 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
For people who still drink bitters: Fee's makes a rhubarb flavor that is top-notch for making something taste more grown-up if you're not an herbal kind of person. Bars never have it, though, so it's mostly an at-home thing for my ginger ale or Arnold Palmers.
I haven't yet really experimented with the 0% spirits, as it feels like a weird thing to spend money on.
posted by Lyn Never at 10:04 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
Haven't clicked the link yet, but at 15 years alcohol free this last year has been great for new (to me) options.
I really like Pathfinder (from Portland Or area)
My go to drink from way back is as follows:
Wee Ginger Pinky (discovered whilst living in Scotland)
Ginger beer
Fresh lime
Bitters
Over ice
Yum!
Thanks for sharing
posted by PistachioRoux at 10:07 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
I really like Pathfinder (from Portland Or area)
My go to drink from way back is as follows:
Wee Ginger Pinky (discovered whilst living in Scotland)
Ginger beer
Fresh lime
Bitters
Over ice
Yum!
Thanks for sharing
posted by PistachioRoux at 10:07 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
To me the question is how are hangouts funded without alcohol? Most pubs don't have an income stream without booze sales.
My partner bartends at a place where they sell a number of NA drinks (or low ABV drinks like kombucha) and they have also made a point to do events like D&D, art classes, etc. that provide income whether or not people drink. I generally think there is a real opportunity for bars to be nighttime activity venues for everyone.
I drink, but I have greatly cut back from my 20s, and I appreciate that craft breweries are increasingly putting out session beers that are 2.5-4% ABV - everyone is different and I respect people who need to keep it at 0%, but I really appreciate this growing option.
posted by coffeecat at 10:31 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
My partner bartends at a place where they sell a number of NA drinks (or low ABV drinks like kombucha) and they have also made a point to do events like D&D, art classes, etc. that provide income whether or not people drink. I generally think there is a real opportunity for bars to be nighttime activity venues for everyone.
I drink, but I have greatly cut back from my 20s, and I appreciate that craft breweries are increasingly putting out session beers that are 2.5-4% ABV - everyone is different and I respect people who need to keep it at 0%, but I really appreciate this growing option.
posted by coffeecat at 10:31 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
I've been teetotal all my life due to a medical condition and I mostly just prefer tea. I really wish bars weren't so reluctant to serve it.
posted by HypotheticalWoman at 10:41 AM on June 7
posted by HypotheticalWoman at 10:41 AM on June 7
My go-to line is, "I used to drink, but I didn't do it well, so I stopped."
Where mine is, "I used to drink, but I'm too good at it - it wasn't fair to the other drinkers."
I've been drinking Athletic for ages now; there are a few other good brands out there but most aren't nearly as easy to find. I have to say that the best name for an NA brewery that I've come across is Minnesota's Hairless Dog Brewing. That's just really excellent. (Their products run a little sweet for my taste, because they don't do what most NA beer producers do: rather than make a beer and then remove the alcohol, they produce a relatively low-sugar wort and don't ferment it. That totally works, but there's always a certain amount of sugar that's unavoidable. It's not bad, especially in really dark styles, but for me it makes them mostly "sometimes beers" rather than a staple.)
posted by nickmark at 10:47 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
Where mine is, "I used to drink, but I'm too good at it - it wasn't fair to the other drinkers."
I've been drinking Athletic for ages now; there are a few other good brands out there but most aren't nearly as easy to find. I have to say that the best name for an NA brewery that I've come across is Minnesota's Hairless Dog Brewing. That's just really excellent. (Their products run a little sweet for my taste, because they don't do what most NA beer producers do: rather than make a beer and then remove the alcohol, they produce a relatively low-sugar wort and don't ferment it. That totally works, but there's always a certain amount of sugar that's unavoidable. It's not bad, especially in really dark styles, but for me it makes them mostly "sometimes beers" rather than a staple.)
posted by nickmark at 10:47 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
It's not to this non-drinker. When I pay as much for a NA drink as a conventional cocktail, I'm properly compensating the bar/restaurant/bartender for the service, the environment, the building of a mocktail, the cost of ingredients, the additional ingredients they need to keep on hand...and also, I'm making sure that the bartender isn't losing out because I don't drink
You could just order something simple and tip the bartender more.
posted by Liquidwolf at 10:47 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
You could just order something simple and tip the bartender more.
posted by Liquidwolf at 10:47 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
I drank a bunch of mocktails-- and some THC selzers-- on a recent vacation in New Orleans. Some of them were really good! Funny how often a bartender or server will give you a big smile and/or wink when ordering something alcohol-free. But yes, those things are expensive and I'm going to save them for places that have a drink minimum.
I do like an alcohol-free aperitif at home but I started imagining the conversation my dentist might have with me if I made that a regular thing. ("How did you turn your teeth that color?")
posted by BibiRose at 10:50 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
I do like an alcohol-free aperitif at home but I started imagining the conversation my dentist might have with me if I made that a regular thing. ("How did you turn your teeth that color?")
posted by BibiRose at 10:50 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
I went to Ireland recently to visit family and was quite surprised to see most bars I went to had a section for low and no ABV drinks; when I got back to the states I really missed it. If only that were a standard part of US cocktail menus!
posted by catcafe at 10:54 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
posted by catcafe at 10:54 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
I've realized that one of the things that makes a drink feel like a treat to me is fresh lime. I could shove a lime wedge into a glass of room temperature tap water and probably feel fancy. The amount of lime is directly proportional to how fancy the drink feels.
Which reminds me that it's summer, and therefore time to start buying as many limes as possible. I sort of resent paying $0.40 apiece for them, but you gotta stay hydrated.
posted by uncleozzy at 10:58 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
Which reminds me that it's summer, and therefore time to start buying as many limes as possible. I sort of resent paying $0.40 apiece for them, but you gotta stay hydrated.
posted by uncleozzy at 10:58 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
Nice timing, I've got 38 years sober today. I'm not really interested in Mocktails, or near beers n such. However, a couple of things I found I like; A shot of apple cider vinegar, a sippin drink, the other is Ginger Beer. Both have a kick that's enjoyable. Neither will get you drunk.
posted by evilDoug at 10:58 AM on June 7 [6 favorites]
posted by evilDoug at 10:58 AM on June 7 [6 favorites]
I have been very, very unimpressed with even the most beloved NA beers. Without that alcohol tang, I'm sorry, it's just beer flavored soda. Same with NA wines, they all just taste like grape juice too me. But we like the Recess canned cocktails around here, especially the mule.
If you think you might be the sort of person to pay wine prices for an NA beverage that's got the complexity and subtlety of a wine, may I introduce you to Muri's Passing Clouds. I've never had anything like it. I tried it at a fancy restaurant a few weeks ago and I've been thinking about it ever since.
It's so amazing how much better mocktails have gotten in the last decade. I was pregnant in 2013 and nobody had anything compelling to offer me.
posted by potrzebie at 11:00 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
If you think you might be the sort of person to pay wine prices for an NA beverage that's got the complexity and subtlety of a wine, may I introduce you to Muri's Passing Clouds. I've never had anything like it. I tried it at a fancy restaurant a few weeks ago and I've been thinking about it ever since.
It's so amazing how much better mocktails have gotten in the last decade. I was pregnant in 2013 and nobody had anything compelling to offer me.
posted by potrzebie at 11:00 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
My partner bartends at a place where they sell a number of NA drinks
And the NA drinks are usually just as expensive as alcoholic counterparts. They probably do lose some money and tips as the night goes on though as the non-alcoholic beverage consumers are less likely to lose control of their consumption and spending.
posted by srboisvert at 11:14 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
And the NA drinks are usually just as expensive as alcoholic counterparts. They probably do lose some money and tips as the night goes on though as the non-alcoholic beverage consumers are less likely to lose control of their consumption and spending.
posted by srboisvert at 11:14 AM on June 7 [1 favorite]
A shot of apple cider vinegar, a sippin drink
Also a way to avoid a couple of types of kidney stones if you imbibe it daily and believe me avoiding kidney stones is 100% worthwhile.
posted by srboisvert at 11:17 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Also a way to avoid a couple of types of kidney stones if you imbibe it daily and believe me avoiding kidney stones is 100% worthwhile.
posted by srboisvert at 11:17 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Oh, another recommendation, echoing punchtothehead: drinking shrubs! A fun project to make at home with no special equipment or supplies, can be drunk straight, or mixed with seltzer and just a little something extra to add to the complexity, like a citrus twist, or a sprig of some herb, or a dash of bitters, you have another drink that feels very adult without having any alcohol.
That recipe calls for berries, but it works fine with just about any juicy fruit, you might just have to adjust the amounts a bit, or if the sugar alone isn't drawing out enough moisture, let it sit in the vinegar to extract before straining.
posted by solotoro at 11:18 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
That recipe calls for berries, but it works fine with just about any juicy fruit, you might just have to adjust the amounts a bit, or if the sugar alone isn't drawing out enough moisture, let it sit in the vinegar to extract before straining.
posted by solotoro at 11:18 AM on June 7 [3 favorites]
I'm enjoying alcohol free beers but did not like the sobour bourbon-analogue. Anyone got any recommendations for a zero Old Fashioned with a bit of a bite?
I mix these for my mom -- it's closer to a manhattan than an old fashioned but I think if you added some simple syrup and an orange peel you could get within shooting distance of an old fashioned!
-2 oz Seedlip Spice 94
-1 oz St Agrestis Amaro Falso
- tiny sploosh of grenadine
-Angostura bitters (if your sobriety permits this); if not, maybe kick up the Amaro a touch, or if you have an herbal syrup to hand, a touch of that.
The grenadine adds a little bit of the mouthfeel I associate with alcohol and which the non-alc boozes don't really quite nail -- they feel thin, watery.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 11:47 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
I mix these for my mom -- it's closer to a manhattan than an old fashioned but I think if you added some simple syrup and an orange peel you could get within shooting distance of an old fashioned!
-2 oz Seedlip Spice 94
-1 oz St Agrestis Amaro Falso
- tiny sploosh of grenadine
-Angostura bitters (if your sobriety permits this); if not, maybe kick up the Amaro a touch, or if you have an herbal syrup to hand, a touch of that.
The grenadine adds a little bit of the mouthfeel I associate with alcohol and which the non-alc boozes don't really quite nail -- they feel thin, watery.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 11:47 AM on June 7 [4 favorites]
Oh actually, just thought of this -- if you really want to get the Old Fashioned feel I would actually suggest candied orange peels and a spoonful of their syrup.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 11:48 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 11:48 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
I've become sober curious after years of hard partying, and it's been wayyy more fun to go out sober than it was when I was drunk and/or high.
I think there's an inevitable point after college age when the social dynamics of intoxication invert, and instead of connecting and bringing one closer to people socially (or feeling like it does) it becomes alienating. Being fully present for the people close to you is a game changer.
I'm grateful and very fortunate that I don't have to abstain completely, but I seldom drink these days and I don't much miss or crave drink. $14 for a mocktail, though... Ok sure whatever makes you happy lol, do you
posted by tovarisch at 11:55 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
I think there's an inevitable point after college age when the social dynamics of intoxication invert, and instead of connecting and bringing one closer to people socially (or feeling like it does) it becomes alienating. Being fully present for the people close to you is a game changer.
I'm grateful and very fortunate that I don't have to abstain completely, but I seldom drink these days and I don't much miss or crave drink. $14 for a mocktail, though... Ok sure whatever makes you happy lol, do you
posted by tovarisch at 11:55 AM on June 7 [2 favorites]
You could just order something simple and tip the bartender more.
It's hard not to be sarcastic here - do you think that didn't occur to me? But, first, the bartender doesn't know if I'm going to tip 20% on a three dollar drink or 5 dollars. Sure, no tip is ever known prior to it being made, but common American tipping culture would tell most bartenders to expect a not great tip on a 3 dollar drink. And secondly, all the other reasons I listed. I don't want a simple drink; I want an experience, a delight, a novelty.
I appreciate your concern for my wallet or waistline or whatever, but maybe trust the non-drinkers when they say they want this as an option. If NA drinks aren't for you, cool! Great! But they are for me, and they have made not-drinking a much more pleasant experience.
posted by punchtothehead at 12:10 PM on June 7 [8 favorites]
It's hard not to be sarcastic here - do you think that didn't occur to me? But, first, the bartender doesn't know if I'm going to tip 20% on a three dollar drink or 5 dollars. Sure, no tip is ever known prior to it being made, but common American tipping culture would tell most bartenders to expect a not great tip on a 3 dollar drink. And secondly, all the other reasons I listed. I don't want a simple drink; I want an experience, a delight, a novelty.
I appreciate your concern for my wallet or waistline or whatever, but maybe trust the non-drinkers when they say they want this as an option. If NA drinks aren't for you, cool! Great! But they are for me, and they have made not-drinking a much more pleasant experience.
posted by punchtothehead at 12:10 PM on June 7 [8 favorites]
Yeah, let's not do the "LULZ SOME OF YALL ARE DOING SOBRIETY WRONG"
posted by Kitteh at 12:11 PM on June 7 [9 favorites]
posted by Kitteh at 12:11 PM on June 7 [9 favorites]
@parm I just read about NA drinks being made with glycerin to replicate the mouthfeel and I really want to try that out. Also aquafaba.
posted by punchtothehead at 12:13 PM on June 7 [2 favorites]
posted by punchtothehead at 12:13 PM on June 7 [2 favorites]
Just to shout out another good NA beer, the NA version of Weihenstephaner is pretty tasty.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 12:15 PM on June 7 [1 favorite]
posted by paper chromatographologist at 12:15 PM on June 7 [1 favorite]
I'll go against the grain and say that I'm not sober and don't plan to be, and I love the taste and experience of alcohol. But I am so happy about this development!!
It feels on par with the moment cigarette smoking indoors ceased in public spaces. Nights out were more pleasant, felt safer, and it seems like the social contract is a bit stronger when we're not all harming each other with our vices. And it's way less stinky.
I think about the comparative rate of drunk driving now, during the sober-is-alright era, versus the early 2000s when MADD had to beg and plead teens not to overdo it because too many of their kids had been hit/killed by a drunk driver (I feel like everyone knows someone affected by that? it is (or was) so commonplace). I'm much less concerned about my friends getting home safely if half of us are happily--not begrudgingly DD-style--drinking seltzers and shrubs. And while I used to feel some pressure to drive drunk when I was younger (because uber didn't exist, "everyone was doing it") it's unanimous that nobody wants to take a chance. Alternative, safe rides are plentiful and abundant.
And we haven't arrived there quite yet, but I like to think fondly ahead to where it might be less likely to get roofied at a bar or a show or a party. The social ill of alcohol where people try to take advantage and make a slight buzz (from a normal alc drink) into an obliterative sick state (from a roofied one) cannot go away fast enough. But it feels like we're on a good track towards it.
posted by knotty knots at 12:19 PM on June 7 [8 favorites]
It feels on par with the moment cigarette smoking indoors ceased in public spaces. Nights out were more pleasant, felt safer, and it seems like the social contract is a bit stronger when we're not all harming each other with our vices. And it's way less stinky.
I think about the comparative rate of drunk driving now, during the sober-is-alright era, versus the early 2000s when MADD had to beg and plead teens not to overdo it because too many of their kids had been hit/killed by a drunk driver (I feel like everyone knows someone affected by that? it is (or was) so commonplace). I'm much less concerned about my friends getting home safely if half of us are happily--not begrudgingly DD-style--drinking seltzers and shrubs. And while I used to feel some pressure to drive drunk when I was younger (because uber didn't exist, "everyone was doing it") it's unanimous that nobody wants to take a chance. Alternative, safe rides are plentiful and abundant.
And we haven't arrived there quite yet, but I like to think fondly ahead to where it might be less likely to get roofied at a bar or a show or a party. The social ill of alcohol where people try to take advantage and make a slight buzz (from a normal alc drink) into an obliterative sick state (from a roofied one) cannot go away fast enough. But it feels like we're on a good track towards it.
posted by knotty knots at 12:19 PM on June 7 [8 favorites]
I’m delighted for people to not spend money on fancy drinks if that’s not what they want, but I’m always confused by resistance to paying for fancy drinks that don’t contain alcohol because they somehow are a waste of money.
The spirits in your drink cost very little of the final price, my friends - make a Manhattan with Four Roses Single Barrel (2oz, $1.60, retail price $40 for about 25oz, taking into account slightly overfull pours), Punt e Mes (.5oz, $0.44, $20 for about 25oz), and Angostura bitters (.049oz, $0.09, $30 for 16.2oz), and we haven’t even broken the $2.50 mark. Plenty of the cocktails that are most easily adapted for non-drinkers - with juices, muddled ingredients, soda/ginger beer - are made with 1.5-2oz of spirits, often also a combination of higher-proof (and usually more-expensive) spirits and lower-proof (and either equally- or less-expensive) liqueurs/apéritifs/etc, and so contain even less of the stuff that supposedly makes the drink worth paying for.
I'm pretty sure that bars that sell mocktails for $11 aren't selling top-shelf Manhattans for $11 - probably more like $14-$15, which not only makes up for but adds healthy profit margins on top of the cost of the spirits.
One of my best friends shot to superstar fame in the cocktail revival of the aughts, and when I stopped drinking a few years ago to take pressure off my insomnia, anxiety, and depression, I really mourned the loss of what a lovely cocktail in a lovely bar can be: an intoxication in its own right, an utterly absorbing aesthetic and hedonic experience. It makes me really happy that more bars are offering that to NA folks these days.
posted by rrrrrrrrrt at 12:47 PM on June 7 [7 favorites]
The spirits in your drink cost very little of the final price, my friends - make a Manhattan with Four Roses Single Barrel (2oz, $1.60, retail price $40 for about 25oz, taking into account slightly overfull pours), Punt e Mes (.5oz, $0.44, $20 for about 25oz), and Angostura bitters (.049oz, $0.09, $30 for 16.2oz), and we haven’t even broken the $2.50 mark. Plenty of the cocktails that are most easily adapted for non-drinkers - with juices, muddled ingredients, soda/ginger beer - are made with 1.5-2oz of spirits, often also a combination of higher-proof (and usually more-expensive) spirits and lower-proof (and either equally- or less-expensive) liqueurs/apéritifs/etc, and so contain even less of the stuff that supposedly makes the drink worth paying for.
I'm pretty sure that bars that sell mocktails for $11 aren't selling top-shelf Manhattans for $11 - probably more like $14-$15, which not only makes up for but adds healthy profit margins on top of the cost of the spirits.
One of my best friends shot to superstar fame in the cocktail revival of the aughts, and when I stopped drinking a few years ago to take pressure off my insomnia, anxiety, and depression, I really mourned the loss of what a lovely cocktail in a lovely bar can be: an intoxication in its own right, an utterly absorbing aesthetic and hedonic experience. It makes me really happy that more bars are offering that to NA folks these days.
posted by rrrrrrrrrt at 12:47 PM on June 7 [7 favorites]
on something like 14 years not drinking & mostly fine with fizzy water, soda, or a Shirley Temple, but sometimes in the interest of being social you just wind up in a cocktails situation & the occasional overpriced mocktail is fun imo
the past two out of three times I've gotten a mocktail the bartender has been like "ok don't tell me ingredients just give me a Vibe," has anyone else encountered this? like they say, if I had a nickel I'd have two nickels but it's weird that it happened twice
posted by taquito sunrise at 1:06 PM on June 7 [2 favorites]
the past two out of three times I've gotten a mocktail the bartender has been like "ok don't tell me ingredients just give me a Vibe," has anyone else encountered this? like they say, if I had a nickel I'd have two nickels but it's weird that it happened twice
posted by taquito sunrise at 1:06 PM on June 7 [2 favorites]
the past two out of three times I've gotten a mocktail the bartender has been like "ok don't tell me ingredients just give me a Vibe," has anyone else encountered this?
no but now i really really want to
the spirits in your drink cost very little of the final price, my friends -
The Venn diagram of this and people who look at menus and go, "$x amount for Y?!? Pffft, I can make that at home!" is probably pretty significant
posted by Kitteh at 1:35 PM on June 7 [5 favorites]
no but now i really really want to
the spirits in your drink cost very little of the final price, my friends -
The Venn diagram of this and people who look at menus and go, "$x amount for Y?!? Pffft, I can make that at home!" is probably pretty significant
posted by Kitteh at 1:35 PM on June 7 [5 favorites]
To me the question is how are hangouts funded without alcohol? Most pubs don't have an income stream without booze sales.
....Uh...by serving other things? I'm genuinely confused why this is a question.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:56 PM on June 7
....Uh...by serving other things? I'm genuinely confused why this is a question.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:56 PM on June 7
the past two out of three times I've gotten a mocktail the bartender has been like "ok don't tell me ingredients just give me a Vibe," has anyone else encountered this?…
posted by taquito sunrise at 1:06 PM on June 7
Next time I hope you answer this question eponysterically and see what happens.
posted by doift at 2:08 PM on June 7 [7 favorites]
posted by taquito sunrise at 1:06 PM on June 7
Next time I hope you answer this question eponysterically and see what happens.
posted by doift at 2:08 PM on June 7 [7 favorites]
"Hey, we saw you across the bar and really liked your vibe. Would you like a mocktail based on that?"*
*me: are they good-looking because yes, if so
posted by Kitteh at 2:12 PM on June 7 [2 favorites]
*me: are they good-looking because yes, if so
posted by Kitteh at 2:12 PM on June 7 [2 favorites]
the past two out of three times I've gotten a mocktail the bartender has been like "ok don't tell me ingredients just give me a Vibe," has anyone else encountered this?
Yes! I run into this a lot with both mocktails and cocktails actually. I love it -- my mom got one of her favorite mocktails ever when she answered with "Joan from Mad Men."
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 2:20 PM on June 7 [3 favorites]
Yes! I run into this a lot with both mocktails and cocktails actually. I love it -- my mom got one of her favorite mocktails ever when she answered with "Joan from Mad Men."
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 2:20 PM on June 7 [3 favorites]
One trick I use when I go out is to ask for selzer with grapefruit juice and lime. It's pink, fizzy, refreshing and feels fancy! Also not nearly so expensive as mocktails. Most bartenders charge just a couple bucks.
posted by lloquat at 2:24 PM on June 7 [1 favorite]
posted by lloquat at 2:24 PM on June 7 [1 favorite]
Next time I hope you answer this question eponysterically and see what happens.
well in a few days I'll be back in Wisconsin where they serve full bacon cheeseburgers as garnish for your bloody mary so I'm sure they'll think nothing of running down to the Kwik Trip & grabbing various cylindrical objects off the hot plate
posted by taquito sunrise at 2:26 PM on June 7 [3 favorites]
well in a few days I'll be back in Wisconsin where they serve full bacon cheeseburgers as garnish for your bloody mary so I'm sure they'll think nothing of running down to the Kwik Trip & grabbing various cylindrical objects off the hot plate
posted by taquito sunrise at 2:26 PM on June 7 [3 favorites]
50 years sober and it honestly never occurred to me that I would ever want to drink something that tastes alcoholic but isn’t. I didn’t like the taste of beer when I was drinking six quarts of it a day, whether it was the cheap stuff I could afford or whether someone else was buying. I get that people are into it and more power to them but it never tempted me.
However, I go through a lot of Fresca and also cold water. Now those taste good to me.
Yes they still make Fresca.
posted by Peach at 2:26 PM on June 7 [4 favorites]
However, I go through a lot of Fresca and also cold water. Now those taste good to me.
Yes they still make Fresca.
posted by Peach at 2:26 PM on June 7 [4 favorites]
The Kylie (yes, the Australian pop singer) brand pink fizz uses this, and is really good, FWIW.
Seconding this one, and Nozeco and Nozeco rosé in the UK.
posted by ellieBOA at 2:26 PM on June 7 [1 favorite]
Seconding this one, and Nozeco and Nozeco rosé in the UK.
posted by ellieBOA at 2:26 PM on June 7 [1 favorite]
....Uh...by serving other things? I'm genuinely confused why this is a question.
My understanding is that the markup on alcohol is generally huge, making up an outsize proportion of the profit margin at most establishments that serve it. So yeah, it's a concern, which is why the restaurant and bar industries are working so hard right now to normalize paying roughly the same for an NA cocktail as a traditional one.
posted by potrzebie at 4:04 PM on June 7 [5 favorites]
My understanding is that the markup on alcohol is generally huge, making up an outsize proportion of the profit margin at most establishments that serve it. So yeah, it's a concern, which is why the restaurant and bar industries are working so hard right now to normalize paying roughly the same for an NA cocktail as a traditional one.
posted by potrzebie at 4:04 PM on June 7 [5 favorites]
I'll have a Shirley Temple on the rocks, and pour it like you don't own it.
Seriously, I'd never had a problem asking for non alcoholic drinks. Being effectively a non drinker, I honestly don't understand the taste appeal of alcohol, and the only real reason to partake at all is the intoxicating effect as far as I can understand. Which I also find to have very limited appeal.
I do have to say, I'm quite happy to see drinking and intoxication increasingly considered risky and even undesirable. My own family has been heavily affected by alcohol across generations. My youngest sister drank herself to death at the ripe old age of 33, my other sister is just now realizing the box wine is doing her no favors, and I suspect one of my brothers is beginning to spiral. And it spreads out in every direction, cousins, aunts, uncles, etc. It was always treated affectionately, even like a necessary part of life. The tears, misery, suffering, even death were accepted as some kind of tradeoff for buzz to be had. But it's changing for the better. Get togethers go fine when people forget to bring booze. Drinking isn't the rite of passage for the youngsters like it was in the past. Attitudes about intoxication are changing. I think this is real progress.
posted by 2N2222 at 4:14 PM on June 7 [4 favorites]
Seriously, I'd never had a problem asking for non alcoholic drinks. Being effectively a non drinker, I honestly don't understand the taste appeal of alcohol, and the only real reason to partake at all is the intoxicating effect as far as I can understand. Which I also find to have very limited appeal.
I do have to say, I'm quite happy to see drinking and intoxication increasingly considered risky and even undesirable. My own family has been heavily affected by alcohol across generations. My youngest sister drank herself to death at the ripe old age of 33, my other sister is just now realizing the box wine is doing her no favors, and I suspect one of my brothers is beginning to spiral. And it spreads out in every direction, cousins, aunts, uncles, etc. It was always treated affectionately, even like a necessary part of life. The tears, misery, suffering, even death were accepted as some kind of tradeoff for buzz to be had. But it's changing for the better. Get togethers go fine when people forget to bring booze. Drinking isn't the rite of passage for the youngsters like it was in the past. Attitudes about intoxication are changing. I think this is real progress.
posted by 2N2222 at 4:14 PM on June 7 [4 favorites]
I've realized that one of the things that makes a drink feel like a treat to me is fresh lime. I could shove a lime wedge into a glass of room temperature tap water and probably feel fancy. The amount of lime is directly proportional to how fancy the drink feels. Which reminds me that it's summer, and therefore time to start buying as many limes as possible
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limeonaire June 7, 2024 6:55 PM
posted by limeonaire at 4:46 PM on June 7 [16 favorites]
1 user marked this as a favorite:
limeonaire June 7, 2024 6:55 PM
posted by limeonaire at 4:46 PM on June 7 [16 favorites]
While I obviously can't speak to all bartenders, I do think some of ya'll are worrying a bit too much when it comes to assuming bartenders are judging you about you ordering a low-cost NA drink (I mean, I'm sure this is a thing at some haughty cocktail bars, but....). As long as you're pleasant, not disruptive/disorderly, and tip at least $1 per drink, you're doing fine at existing in a bar. The customers my partner complains to me about are never the teetotalers, it's the people who assume he's their therapist, the bad drunks, the people who want endless free samples (even when there is a clear line forming behind them), etc.
posted by coffeecat at 5:47 PM on June 7 [2 favorites]
posted by coffeecat at 5:47 PM on June 7 [2 favorites]
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limeonaire June 7, 2024 6:55 PM
posted by limeonaire at 6:46 PM on June 7
Time travel!
posted by srboisvert at 5:47 PM on June 7 [1 favorite]
limeonaire June 7, 2024 6:55 PM
posted by limeonaire at 6:46 PM on June 7
Time travel!
posted by srboisvert at 5:47 PM on June 7 [1 favorite]
So, to what extent is availability of NA stuff in bars regional in the US? Rural/urban?
I ask because I'm an urban Sconnie (hi, taquito sunrise!) and NA culture is quite strong where I live... but I went down to Stillwater OK (small college town) for a sidegig thing this week and nary a NA anything to be found.
(I was totally fine, I don't go to bars on work trips -- pubs to eat, maybe, if their food is extra-well-reputed and they're capable of feeding a vegetarian -- and I don't at all mind tea or soda with dinner. I'm just curious.)
posted by humbug at 8:14 PM on June 7 [2 favorites]
I ask because I'm an urban Sconnie (hi, taquito sunrise!) and NA culture is quite strong where I live... but I went down to Stillwater OK (small college town) for a sidegig thing this week and nary a NA anything to be found.
(I was totally fine, I don't go to bars on work trips -- pubs to eat, maybe, if their food is extra-well-reputed and they're capable of feeding a vegetarian -- and I don't at all mind tea or soda with dinner. I'm just curious.)
posted by humbug at 8:14 PM on June 7 [2 favorites]
Mod note: One deleted. Yeah, people know water is a non-alcoholic liquid one can drink.
posted by taz (staff) at 12:04 AM on June 9 [8 favorites]
posted by taz (staff) at 12:04 AM on June 9 [8 favorites]
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posted by ellieBOA at 5:15 AM on June 7 [7 favorites]