The Irish Unification of 2024*

June 18, 2024 8:26 AM

United Ireland Should Be Political Objective, Former PM Says [ungated] - "'What I hope we'll see happen in the next government, no matter which parties are in it, is that that we'll see what is a long standing political aspiration toward unification become a political objective,' [former Prime Minister Leo] Varadkar said at an event in Belfast on Saturday."

• The inevitability of a united Ireland - "As demographics keep shifting, the direction of travel seems fixed despite ongoing conflict."
• The prospect of a united Ireland emerges as a republican leader takes office in Belfast - "Until now, Northern Ireland's first minister has always come from a British unionist party, but Sinn Fein, which advocates for Northern Ireland to rejoin the Republic, won the most seats in the assembly for the first time in 2022... The elevation of a nationalist to the top seat at Stormont has sparked the question of whether Irish unity is on the horizon." (Is a United Ireland on the Horizon?)
• Tall order for Sinn Fein to revive suddenly flagging Irish election hopes - "Failing to enter government for the first time would be a major setback to its ambition of seeking a referendum on unifying with Northern Ireland, the British region where it is already the lead party."
• A united Ireland is closer than ever. Let's make it a paradise for all of us, not just corporate tax-dodgers - "Arguing over anthems and flags is a distraction. This is our one chance to create an inclusive society across our whole island."

-United Ireland
-A Republic for all
-A Decade of Opportunity - Towards The New Republic

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*You remember the Irish Unification of 2024, right? - "Like a lot of Star Trek episodes, the 1990 episode 'The High Ground,' features a scene in which the characters discuss a real-world issue in the context of the show. In this case, Data the android (Brent Spiner) cites historical examples of the use of violence to successfully achieve political aims. He refers to the very real Mexican independence from Spain and, typically for Star Trek, a fictional example, the 'Kenzie Rebellion.' But it's his third example, the 'Irish Unification of 2024,' that's really captured the internet's imagination in that very year."

• Star Trek predicts United Ireland in 2024 - "This clip is taken from an episode called 'The High Ground'. The result of this short conversation, and the general theme of the program being centred around insurgency as a means to achieve freedom, led to the BBC (The British Broadcasting Corporation- Britain's national broadcaster) and Sky TV (a Satellite Broadcaster) putting a ban on showing the episode. When Sky did show the episode they cut the part about Irish reunification in 2024. In Ireland on RTE (Raidió Teilifís Éireann-Ireland's national broadcaster) the showing of the full episode came with a warning describing the content as 'Fictional and Aspirational.'"
• Did Star Trek predict an Irish reunification in 2024? - "As you can imagine, the episode was mired in controversy because of the mention of the Irish unification. As a result, the episode wasn't broadcast in the UK or Ireland unedited until 2006. In addition, the actual episode was also disliked by the series writer Ronald D Moore who said in an interview in 1995: 'We didn't have anything interesting to say about terrorism except that it's bad and Beverly gets kidnapped – ho hum. They take her down to the caves and we get to have nice, big preachy speeches about terrorism and freedom, fighting and security forces versus society. It's a very unsatisfying episode and the staff wasn't really happy with it.'"
• Could Star Trek's prediction that Ireland and Northern Ireland will reunify come true? - "The writer of that episode, Melinda Snodgrass, joins News Breakfast to discuss why she wrote that line in the 1990s."
• @MMSnodgrass: "It wasn't just filler. It was to reference the fact that Earth had united and nation states had ended in the Federation."[1]
• Star Trek's Biggest Prediction For 2024: Irish Unification Explained - "The episode aired in 1990 when the Troubles were ongoing and topical. The line implies that the Troubles/armed struggle lasted into the 2020s until the IRA got the U.K. to concede the territory to the Republic of Ireland. However, reality was not so violent. In the 1980s, the Sinn Féin party (meaning We Ourselves, then led by Irish Republican leader Gerry Adams) refocused on electoral politics. This culminated in the Good Friday Agreement between the British and Irish governments, signed in 1998. Under the agreement, Northern Ireland was still part of the U.K., but citizens could claim dual citizenship and the North would be self-governed (the new Northern Irish Assembly required power-sharing to maintain this balance). Moreover, if Northern Ireland chooses to leave the U.K. by referendum, they are allowed to do so."
• Sanctuary Districts And Irish Unification: Star Trek’s Vision Of 2024 Comes Strikingly Close - "Despite living in a world of conflict, we have reason to be hopeful. We are growing as a people, but growth is painful. Star Trek gave us the confidence that war and social strife would push us to leave those injustices behind, but offscreen life offers no such reassurance. Science fiction predicted the future, but illustrated clearly that the path to get there would offer the same difficulties we’d always known. It’s going to be up to us to make sure that the sacrifices we make now will be seen as worthwhile by future generations."

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also btw...
The Spark - Rhyme Island (BANGER OF THE YEAR)

posted by kliuless (24 comments total)

Can Scotland come with?
posted by kyrademon at 8:39 AM on June 18 [19 favorites]

Can Scotland come with?

At this point I think the rest of the union is trying to quarantine England.

Mi godwn ni eto!
posted by Your Childhood Pet Rock at 9:34 AM on June 18 [13 favorites]

My maternal grandfather would be happy as a clam to see Ireland united as he got driven out of Belfast for being Catholic (and also apparently a prick - a habit he continued in the states enough that my grams divorced him in the 40's when, oh my.)

I can't speak to the realities of it on the ground, but it feels orderly and right from a satellite level view that the island be united, but that might just be a wistful candy coating on geographical OCD.
posted by drewbage1847 at 9:41 AM on June 18 [6 favorites]

MetaFilter: he got driven out of Belfast for being Catholic (and also apparently a prick
posted by elkevelvet at 9:44 AM on June 18 [13 favorites]

must it be one or the other? i have no idea if the north would be viable as a lone unit if they told both sides no.
posted by Clowder of bats at 9:45 AM on June 18

I am about to send my Irish BFF a very inquisitive email.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:03 AM on June 18 [1 favorite]

The only upside of Brexit.
posted by Farce_First at 10:05 AM on June 18 [1 favorite]

The only upside of Brexit.

The irony being the gammon boomer nincompoops voted for Brexit waxing nostalgic for the British Empire (which was never coming back with Canada, Australia, India and New Zealand being sovereign nations now) and getting a possible dissolution of the United Kingdom instead.
posted by Your Childhood Pet Rock at 10:09 AM on June 18 [15 favorites]

MetaBrexit
posted by kokaku at 10:35 AM on June 18 [3 favorites]

The political scientist Francis Fukuyama suggested in his 1992 book of the same title that we had reached "the end of history," which he defined as “the end-point of mankind's ideological evolution and the universalization of Western liberal democracy as the final form of human government."

There's a pretty strong rebuke of this in Star Trek VI which was released shortly after Fukurama's book:

Kirk: Some people think the future means the end of history. Well, we haven't run out of history quite yet.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 10:43 AM on June 18 [4 favorites]

Sometimes it seems as if Britain and the US have a drunken frenemies relationship: "I see you let the fascist assholes take over, hold my beer and watch this!"
Best wishes to Ireland on unification,. and Scotland on independence, and here's hoping both the US and Britain can toss out the criminal bastards and start fixing their very serious problems.
posted by evilDoug at 10:48 AM on June 18 [18 favorites]

Irish unity is hardly inevitable. The UK parliament would have to consent, and there are certainly many people who believe that the UK parliament should not consent at all, or at least without the concurrence of the loyalist/Protestant population of Northern Ireland, and the polls aren’t there yet.
posted by MattD at 12:28 PM on June 18 [1 favorite]

As long as we don't have to have World War III before First Contact with the Vulcans (or ever, really), I'm in.
posted by Halloween Jack at 1:07 PM on June 18 [1 favorite]

Concurrence of a majority of both Northern Ireland and Ireland is required, at which point the UK government is obligated to support legislation bringing about unification. The Belfast Agreement (PDF) is a mere 36 pages, most of which are appendixes -- it's a surprisingly easy read.

"affirm that if, in the future, the people of the island of Ireland exercise their right of self-determination on the basis set out in sections (i) and (ii) above to bring about a united Ireland, it will be a binding obligation on both Governments to introduce and support in their respective Parliaments legislation to give effect to that wish;"
posted by Bryant at 1:18 PM on June 18 [10 favorites]

Re The Belfast agreement: it is notable that the people of the island of Ireland get a clearly laid out path to self determination should they wish to follow it. They can have a poll to gauge opinion if they want, and if they want to have another one they can after seven years. Both Westminster and Dublin governments are duty bound to honour the results. The drafters of the agreement appear to have foreseen the a united Ireland might one be the democratic will of a majority.

This is in notable contrast to the situation in Scotland where we have blue and red unionist parties who appear to adhere to the notion that “now is not the right time” is a permanent answer to the question of a future independence referendum.
posted by rongorongo at 2:32 PM on June 18 [6 favorites]

As long as we don't have to have World War III before First Contact with the Vulcans (or ever, really), I'm in.

We're getting the Bell Riots on September 1st in the San Francisco Sanctuary Districts, so maybe Irish Unification after that. (Yes, the last article also mentioned it, but it bears repeating.)
posted by dannyboybell at 2:51 PM on June 18 [2 favorites]

From the perspective of the South, I would say that we're 20 years away. We would like an NHS-style health service (which we'd have to adopt if we joined with the North), but it would be eye-wateringly expensive to implement. The South is considerably richer than the North. And the sectarian politics that would make it happen in the first place is now in steep decline.

It's not really a West Germany / East Germany / Tear down that wall situation. Right now, there's no border, citizens from either state can work in the other one, the same EU laws apply and the UK/Irish ones vary only in the technicalities. What, exactly, is there to be gained from union that we don't have already. From the perspective of the south now, why would we want to do that? Ireland as an island has not really been a single independent nation since the Norman era, 400 years before the discovery of the Americas. I can see the North wanting to exit from the toxic Brexit wasteland (though I'm pretty sure they don't want our tax rates!) but I'm not sure there's appetite from the South, at least, not yet. There's still a lot of toxic sectarianism friction too, and loads here had a da or granda in the ra. I don't see it happening for another generation.
posted by BigCalm at 4:49 PM on June 18 [11 favorites]

Make it so.
posted by nofundy at 5:15 PM on June 18 [1 favorite]

Mod note: Couple of comments removed. Let's avoid bringing Trump and US Politics into a thread centered around Ireland, even if it's Star Trek related jokes.
posted by Brandon Blatcher (staff) at 7:48 PM on June 18 [3 favorites]

Concurrence of a majority of both Northern Ireland and Ireland is required, at which point the UK government is obligated to support legislation bringing about unification

Except, that it's the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland who gets to decide when Northern Ireland gets to have a vote on the matter, and it's only necessary when they feel it's likely that there's a majority.

I don't really think it's a vote where you want it to go 52%-48%, and would prefer a likely higher majority than that before a vote, but leaving it up to the Secretary of State does leave it a bit vague.
posted by scorbet at 12:16 AM on June 19

While it's a bit more likely now than it has been previously, unionists still matter both as a community and as individual people. Not everyone wants a united Ireland, and the people that want it the least don't live in London.
posted by plonkee at 9:13 AM on June 19

I don't have a dag in this fight.
posted by outgrown_hobnail at 9:20 AM on June 19

I'm just glad we survived the Eugenics Wars.
posted by lock robster at 1:13 PM on June 19

I read an opinion piece in probably the guardian a few years ago about how unification would be a disaster for the republic bc the north has daddy issues — generations of empty promises and neglect from Britain.

Not long after, on ac trip to Ireland, I rode a British Rail train from Dublin to Belfast, after taking Iarnród Éireann everywhere else, and that data point matched up anyway. I couldn’t say about the rest of it. But it’s interesting bc one reason partition happened in the first place and persisted as long as it did was because until like 1960, the republic was still primarily a last-century (or more) agricultural economy, whereas the north had industrial investment, jobs, and opportunity.

It will be interesting.
posted by toodleydoodley at 5:44 PM on June 19